2010 Legislative Session: Second Session, 39th Parliament

HANSARD

The following electronic version is for informational purposes only.

The printed version remains the official version.

official report of

Debates of the Legislative Assembly

(hansard)

Tuesday, April 20, 2010

Afternoon Sitting

Volume 15, Number 2

CONTENTS

Page

Routine Business

Introductions by Members

Tributes

Ian M c Taggart-Cowan

Hon. B. Penner

Introductions by Members

Introduction and First Reading of Bills

Bill M202 — Members Conflict of Interest Amendment Act, 2010

C. James

Statements (Standing Order 25B)

Tissue and organ donation and work of Eva Markvoort

D. Black

Site C power project

P. Pimm

Volunteer activities of Hilda Venables

B. Routley

Richmond Centre for Disability

R. Howard

Asian Heritage Month

J. Kwan

Sherry Bruce

D. McRae

Oral Questions

Conditions at Vernon Jubilee Hospital

C. James

Hon. K. Falcon

A. Dix

Conditions at Vancouver General Hospital

A. Dix

Hon. K. Falcon

Mental health services for children in Kootenays

K. Conroy

Hon. K. Falcon

Special adviser to Vancouver school district

R. Austin

Hon. M. MacDiarmid

D. Thorne

Delta school district costs and funding

V. Huntington

Hon. M. MacDiarmid

Richmond school district costs and funding

G. Gentner

Hon. M. MacDiarmid

Petitions

C. Trevena

L. Popham

S. Fraser

Orders of the Day

Second Reading of Bills

Bill 9 — Consumption Tax Rebate and Transition Act (continued)

On the amendment

(continued)

R. Howard

L. Popham

Hon. K. Krueger

M. Elmore

T. Lake

H. Lali

Hon. M. Stilwell

A. Dix

Hon. N. Yamamoto

Proceedings in the Douglas Fir Room

Committee of Supply

Estimates: Ministry of Transportation and Infrastructure

Hon. S. Bond

H. Bains

K. Corrigan

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TUESDAY, APRIL 20, 2010

The House met at 1:34 p.m.

[Mr. Speaker in the chair.]

Routine Business

Introductions by Members

C. James: I'm very pleased to introduce someone who is no stranger to this Legislature. He is here looking healthy, looking strong. I'd like to introduce the former MLA for New Westminster. Chuck Puchmayr joins us today.

Hon. G. Campbell: Today in the House there are 50 visitors from University Hill Secondary School in my constituency of Vancouver–Point Grey. They are grade 11 students travelling with some parents and their teacher, Mr. John Yetman.

They're here today to experience the history of the buildings. They're evidently going to take some pictures and go back and talk to their families and their friends about what they've discovered here in Victoria. I hope that everyone in the Legislature will make them welcome.

Hon. N. Yamamoto: Today in the members' gallery we have a very special visitor from New Zealand. I'm pleased to introduce His Excellency Andrew Needs. He is the High Commissioner of New Zealand to Canada and is accompanied by Claire Eeles, consul general of New Zealand at Vancouver.

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I look forward to meeting with the high commissioner later this afternoon. I know he's met with a few of my colleagues today already. I look forward to some very productive discussions on how we can continue to advance the positive relationship between our two jurisdictions. So please join me in giving His Excellency and the consul general of New Zealand a really warm welcome to British Columbia and to this House.

Hon. J. Yap: I'd like the House to join me in giving a warm welcome to a very special group of public servants. Today I had the opportunity to meet with members of the B.C. Public Service green teams. This is a group of hundreds of members of the public service who are helping transform British Columbia's public service to a carbon-neutral public service this year, in 2010.

We have a number of leaders in the green teams, which cut across all ministries of government, and I'd like to give a warm welcome to them. Some of them are joining us for the first time today in the Legislature, in the public gallery.

We have with us Aaron Brown, Michael Cormack, Claire Doherty, Rheannon Harriman, Craig Harris, Gillian Henuset, Natasha Horsman, Kristyn Kaitila, Bev Kallstrom, Kim King, Brooke McMurchy, Jane Price, David Stewart, Angela Weltz, Michael Westby, Jennifer Williams, Lindsay Wood and Sandra Henson.

These are public servants who serve with distinction and who are very enthusiastic and high-energy about helping the public service of British Columbia become carbon-neutral. I ask all members of the House to join me in welcoming them, especially this week, because Thursday is Earth Day in the province of British Columbia and around the world. These folks are helping members of the green teams around the public service recognize Earth Day this week.

Hon. S. Bond: I am absolutely delighted to have four very special guests to the Legislature today. They are from Prince George. Three of them are young people, and they are actually in Victoria to receive one of the highest honours in the scouting program. Chris Forseille, Stan Gordy and Dylan Adams are recipients of the Queen's Venturer Award from the Lieutenant-Governor today.

The award is based on a number of criteria, including volunteer service and demonstrating outstanding leadership in a peer environment. They are members of the 13th Carney Hill RCMP Venturers, led by Const. Davy Greenlees, and he is also in the gallery today. He is an incredible volunteer in our community. This is just another example of it. I know that every member in this House will congratulate these young people for doing a phenomenal job in reaching this achievement.

Welcome to the Legislature today, and on behalf of all of the members, congratulations on an exceptional job. We're very proud of you all.

E. Foster: In the House today is a longtime friend of mine from Lumby who moved here, to Sidney, a few years ago — Dave Carroll. Dave is a veteran, the past president of the Lumby Legion branch No. 167. He's also a past president of the army-navy. Dave's volunteer hours in Lumby, through the Legion and other community organizations, is a thing that legends are made of, so I would ask that the House please make this veteran and great volunteer welcome.

D. Barnett: Today in the House I am very pleased to introduce members of the Redstone Band from my riding of the Cariboo-Chilcotin. We have here today Chief Percy Guichon, Coun. Otis Guichon, Coun. Rocky Guichon, Coun. Clayton Charleyboy, Coun. Wanda Charleyboy, Coun. Terry Char, Coun. Agnes Case and Melanie Johnny. I ask the House to welcome them here today.

Hon. P. Bell: We're joined in the gallery today by a number of individuals who are here for the Wood Enterprise Coalition announcement. These are all

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members of B.C. Wood and include Grant McKinnon, Richard Kauffman, Colin Chornohus, Brent Comber, David Conway, Brian Hawrysh, Scott Thompson, Mike Pidlesecky, Jim Barker and Charlie Wicke.

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Also joining us in the gallery is Brian Menzies, who works very closely with B.C. Wood and used to be part of these halls in his day, a previous ministerial assistant to a previous Minister of Forests.

Would the House please make everyone very welcome.

Hon. B. Stewart: Also here today for the Wood Enterprise Coalition and in the precinct is one of the Gorman family, Mary Tracey of West Kelowna, who runs the wood innovation centre. I know that Mary and her family are a large part of British Columbia's forest industry and keep 325 people working in my community.

More importantly, Mary and her husband Doug were one of the unfortunate families that lost their home in the fires in West Kelowna last summer. I know that I saw it under construction when I was up in their neighbourhood just a few weeks ago. Please have the precinct welcome Mary Tracey.

Tributes

IAN M c TAGGART-COWAN

Hon. B. Penner: I rise in the House today to pay tribute to a remarkable man who devoted his lifetime to studying, teaching and conserving the natural resources of British Columbia. Dr. Ian McTaggart-Cowan, who was renowned as the father of conservation, died this past Sunday, just a few weeks shy of his 100th birthday.

I ask all members to join me in extending sincere condolences to his family and friends.

Introductions by Members

D. Hayer: I have two special guests here again today. One is Barbara Steele, city of Surrey councillor, my constituent and a very hard-working member and vice-president on UBCM. Also with her is Mary Sjostrom, the mayor of Quesnel, one of the hardest-working mayors in that area. They are holding a UBCM executive meeting. Would the House please make them very welcome.

Introduction and

First Reading of Bills

Bill M202 — Members Conflict of

interest amendment act, 2010

C. James presented a bill intituled Members Conflict of Interest Amendment Act, 2010.

C. James: I move introduction of the Members Conflict of Interest Amendment Act, 2010, for first reading now.

Motion approved.

C. James: I'm pleased to introduce the Members Conflict of Interest Amendment Act. British Columbians expect politicians and their appointees to conduct themselves by the highest ethical standard and to discharge their duties in the public interest. But far too often ordinary citizens feel that the public interest is crowded out by private interests. That perception has a corrosive effect on public confidence, undermining people's faith that the decisions made in this chamber or at a cabinet table result from no other consideration than what's best for British Columbia.

The Members Conflict of Interest Amendment Act seeks to address these concerns. This bill establishes more stringent conflict-of-interest laws to restore public confidence and promote greater accountability. This bill also expands the scope of conflict-of-interest rules to apply to public office appointees such as ministerial staff, former deputy ministers and advisers. Finally, this bill requires members of cabinet, parliamentary secretaries and deputy ministers to place their assets in a blind trust for as long as they hold that position.

The opposition has put forward similar legislation in the past. However, given recent events, it seems timely to introduce it again in hopes the government will finally take action to toughen up conflict-of-interest laws.

I move the bill be placed on the order paper for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today.

Bill M202, Members Conflict of Interest Amendment Act, 2010, introduced, read a first time and ordered to be placed on orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today.

Statements

(Standing Order 25B)

TISSUE AND ORGAN DONATION

AND WORK OF EVA MARKVOORT

D. Black: This week is National Organ and Tissue Donor Awareness Week. Right now there are 335 British Columbians on the wait-list for an organ transplant. For these British Columbians, each day is filled with uncertainty.

Since 1968 over 4,850 British Columbians have received a life-saving transplant, including former MLAs Ed Conroy, Sindi Hawkins and Chuck Puchmayr, my predecessor in New Westminster who is here with us today. But there are still too many people who never get that chance. Dr. Robert Levy, a transplant respirologist

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on the provincial lung transplant team, says a lack of donor organs means one out of three patients dies waiting for an organ transplant in Canada.

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I want to take a moment to tell you about a remarkable young woman in New Westminster. Eva Markvoort was on the wait-list for a second double-lung transplant for cystic fibrosis. Instead of letting her illness defeat her, she decided to reach out to raise awareness of cystic fibrosis and the importance of organ donation as the subject of an award-winning documentary and by creating a blog called 65 Red Roses, named after a mispronunciation by children of cystic fibrosis.

But last month, just days before her 26th birthday, Eva died. She was a talented actress who just a month earlier had received her bachelor's degree from the University of Victoria. It's heartbreaking that someone so young, so promising and so courageous had her life cut short waiting for a donor.

Eva's spirit reached millions around the world through her blog, and now it's up to us to ensure that the causes she championed are not forgotten. I urge all members of this House to ensure that their names are on organ donor registry and to take this message back to their communities so that we can make sure people waiting for a transplant do get a second chance at life.

SITE C POWER PROJECT

P. Pimm: I'd like to talk about a historic announcement in my area yesterday. I have been a resident of Fort St. John all my life, and as long as I can remember, Site C has been on the drawing board.

Yesterday our Premier and our Minister of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources announced that the Site C clean energy project would be moving forward to stage 3 of the consultation process. This means that the project will now undergo a rigorous environmental assessment, continued consultation with local communities, stakeholders and First Nations. Subject to a positive outcome from that process, B.C. Hydro will proceed with the design and construction of Site C.

In 1961 W.A.C. Bennett had a vision for the province, and that vision was the W.A.C. Bennett dam on the Peace River. This dam has been a cornerstone for our province. Along with the Peace Canyon dam, our area provides the backbone of the province's power system and supplies over 30 percent of the province's power needs.

Site C will continue that vision and supply an additional 900 megawatts capacity and produce about 4,600 gigawatt hours of electricity each year. That's enough electricity to power 410,000 homes. The Site C clean energy project will use the upstream storage from the Williston reservoir to generate one-third of the energy of the W.A.C. Bennett dam while using only 5 percent of the footprint.

Site C will contribute to the local and provincial economy by creating approximately 7,650 jobs throughout the construction period, with the possibility of up to 35,000 direct and indirect jobs during the entire project.

Like I said previously, I've lived in this area my entire life. I understand the beauty of the Peace Valley, and I also understand the concerns associated with this project. Site C clean energy project will build on the vision W.A.C. Bennett had in the early 1960s for the future of our children and our grandchildren for the clean, green, reasonably priced energy that we all so dearly need and desire.

VOLUNTEER ACTIVITIES

OF HILDA VENABLES

B. Routley: Hilda Venables recently won the Cowichan chamber's Black Tie Award for her volunteer activities. She will be 90 years young in May.

Hilda tells me that she started visiting seniors with her mom when she was just five years old. When she was in her 20s she remembers putting her children in the buggy to go and visit seniors at a care home, and she recalled how the seniors all loved seeing the children.

She volunteered at the Upper Room and for a suicide-prevention help line when she lived in Victoria. Living in Shawnigan, she volunteered for the white cane society. She explained that most of the people who were part of that group have now died.

About a year ago she saw an ad asking for volunteers for what became the 1to1help group in Mill Bay. Hilda went to the founding meeting of this new group. They talked about calling themselves "I was going that way anyway." However, they chose 1to1help.org. She loved the idea of helping one another and agreed immediately to volunteer. She drives people to the hospital, to the doctor, shopping, hairdressing or anywhere they need to go.

I asked her what she would want to teach others about being a volunteer. She says that a great volunteer would be someone with a heart full of love who enjoys helping others.

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Volunteering gives her lots of new friends and many great memories. She offers that the world is not reaching out to one another, and she is sad and concerned that all this electronic junk that people are sitting around staring at is making things much worse. She says: "Life is much fuller when we reach out to one another. Connecting with others gives you a joy for life you simply won't find in all that electronic junk."

We thank you, Hilda, for being a great volunteer, and we honour and thank all volunteers who, like Hilda, are reaching out and helping others.

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RICHMOND CENTRE FOR DISABILITY

Take, for example, the Canada Line and the various stations within this route, which are 100 percent accessible for all riders. A quick and easy way to board for everyone is something that only became a reality in the last decade, and it's thanks to partnerships with groups like RCD that these options are possible. Many of our buses are equipped to take wheelchair passengers, and our new schools contain elevators, wider doorways and desks to accommodate wheelchairs. The RCD has worked to ensure that bus stops in our city are all outfitted for wheelchairs, as well as the curbsides and our intersections.

There is always more to be done in terms of changing attitudes, and the RCD will be working to make these changes happen in our communities for as long as it takes. Richmond is one of the most accessible communities in the province, and it is Richmond residents such as Frances Clark and Vince Miele and their hard-working board that give tirelessly to this success. Let us all thank and congratulate RCD for their 25 years of creating awareness and for service to the city of Richmond.

ASIAN HERITAGE MONTH

J. Kwan: May is recognized as Asian Heritage Month across Canada. On May 29, 2001, Sen. Vivienne Poy introduced a motion in the Senate to recognize Asian Heritage Month in order to acknowledge the long and rich history of Asian Canadians and their contributions to Canada.

Quoting from her speech, the senator said: "While various cities in Canada hold events to celebrate Asian heritage, British Columbia is the only province to have officially declared May as Asian Heritage Month. It first declared it in 1996 and has since proclaimed it on an annual basis." Indeed, since 1996 the annual festival is called explorAsian.

The Vancouver Asian Heritage Month Society has organized diverse events that showcase the rich Asian cultures in British Columbia. The definition of "Asian" is inclusive and broad. It includes East Asia, South Asia, Central Asia and Southeast Asia. The art, cultural and educational programming organized by the society provides audiences with an opportunity to further their knowledge, awareness and appreciation of cultural expression through workshops, lectures, displays and exhibitions.

From building the railroad where B.C. joined Confederation to the development of Chinatown and Japantown, the history of Asians in B.C. can be tracked back to the 19th century. Decades of discrimination legislation such as being denied the right to vote, to attend professional schools or even to eat at certain restaurants were only some of the barriers to inclusion that Asian communities faced.

Our province has come a long way, and now we have a large and prosperous Asian community that contributes to B.C. economically, socially and culturally. From the B.C. Legislature, I would like to congratulate and thank the organizers and volunteers for their fine work in the celebration of Asian Heritage Month and encourage everyone to attend this year's explorAsian festivities.

SHERRY BRUCE

D. McRae: Today I wish to pay tribute to a truly amazing woman from the Comox Valley. Sherry Bruce, along with her mother, Deanna Gagnon, started making chocolates 25 years ago and decided to turn this passion into a full-time career. In 1986 the mother-daughter team opened Hot Chocolates in downtown Courtenay and have not looked back since. The company specializes in the crafting of handmade Belgian chocolate truffles and has outgrown three different store locations.

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In 1994 Jorden Marshall joined Sherry both as a partner in business and in life, and this partnership flourished. Now, Sherry Bruce was an enterprising woman who did not limit her success to just one business. Sherry, her mother and Jorden opened two more businesses — Pomegranate, which sold beautiful home décor, and Uranus Card and Gifts, which offered a variety of products for the young and young at heart.

With three successful businesses, you'd think that would be enough for Sherry. But no. In 2006 her dream for an artisan bakery began to take shape. Sherry opened Cakebread Artisan Bakery, and as a testament to her skills, she was able to successfully challenge the exam for the Red Seal baker qualification. Even more, she was later asked to sit on the board that reviews the Red Seal bakers program.

While Sherry's contribution to the business community in the Comox Valley is outstanding, her charity work goes even further. Donations to organizations that focus on children and community arts and culture were always a priority, and Hot Chocolates helped many local organizations achieve their goals.

However, Sherry did not limit herself to philanthropy in the Comox Valley. After her son Aaron volunteered in an orphanage in rural Uganda, Sherry saw a chance

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to make a difference in a global sense. Hot Chocolates and Sherry rallied support in the Comox Valley to provide clean drinking water, proper beds with malaria nets, a medical fund, school supplies and building improvements for the 150 students who live at or attend the New Hope Academy and orphanage. This current project has made, and continues to make, a positive impact on so many people, both in Africa and in the Comox Valley.

I am very sad to say that on March 18 Sherry passed away at home after a two-year journey with breast cancer. She was only 52, but she made every one of those 52 years count.

Thank you, Sherry.

Oral Questions

CONDITIONS AT

VERNON JUBILEE HOSPITAL

C. James: Doctors are speaking out against the dangerous levels of ER overcrowding at the Vernon Jubilee Hospital — the worst, they say, they've seen in ten years. Yesterday Dr. Mike Concannon said that far from being prepared for a serious incident, the hospital isn't even "prepared to deal with a Smart car crash."

To the Minister of Health. Doctors and health care professionals have raised these concerns for years, and for years the B.C. Liberals have ignored them. What does the minister plan to do today to deal with these serious concerns?

Hon. K. Falcon: First of all, we recognize and appreciate the exceptional work that emergency room physicians do every single day in this province of British Columbia. Like many emergency departments, the Vancouver General Hospital does experience periodic cases of severe crowding.

Interjections.

Hon. K. Falcon: I apologize. Vernon. Thank you, Member. Vernon.

See, there are many. I was honest about that fact. Vernon does see some of these challenges, too, and I think that's why it's important to note that actually at that exact site there is a $180 million investment underway, with construction underway, for a new hospital tower. It's one of the reasons why we've invested over $400 million in 30 emergency departments across the province.

It's why we're building a new hospital in Fort St. John and in Surrey. We built the new Abbotsford Hospital. We're building new hospitals from every end of the province to try and deal with some of these challenges. They are not issues that can be dealt with overnight, but we are absolutely making sure we deal with these issues.

Mr. Speaker: The Leader of the Opposition has a supplemental.

C. James: If this minister and this government want to show support for doctors, they can begin by listening to them and acting on their concerns. That's what they should be doing for those doctors.

These are issues that have been raised year after year after year. The doctors have said repeatedly that nothing short of additional space, more acute care beds and OR spaces will address these concerns. And yet, what have the doctors said? Physician Dr. Hwang says: "There's no plan to provide funding to increase the number of beds or operating rooms."

Again my question is to the minister. Will he stop pretending that he knows best? Will he listen to those professionals, and will he make sure the supports are in place now for Vernon?

Hon. K. Falcon: The Leader of the Opposition should know. Actually, the leader should go travel up there and see the construction underway on the new $180 million tower. I think that would be step No. 1.

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Step No. 2. It's a little hard to listen to the lecture from the members opposite with respect to the need for more acute care beds when, in the ten years that the NDP were in power at that hospital, they cut the beds by 23 percent. That is a little inconsistent with what I'm hearing here today.

The fact of the matter is that a $180 million investment is under construction and is to open in the spring of 2011 that will help address these very real shortages the doctors are dealing with. I can tell you that when I met with them last year, we had this discussion and we agreed to move that project forward and get it done as quickly as we possibly can.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members.

Leader of the Opposition has a further supplemental.

C. James: I'd again raise the voice of Dr. Hwang: "No plan to provide funding to increase the number of beds or operating rooms." These are concerns that have been going on for years.

Let's take a look at 2008 alone. This hospital, Vernon Jubilee Hospital, was forced to declare code purple over 50 times — 50 times. The doctors say that crowding is now at the worst level they've seen. It's running at 30 beds over capacity today.

Again, my question is to the minister. Will he be upfront with the public? No more words. Let's talk facts here. Will he admit that he's not prepared to take the action to help the people in Vernon today?

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Hon. K. Falcon: With the greatest of respect to the Leader of the Opposition, it takes time to build a brand-new critical care tower, which is exactly what is under construction in Vernon today.

The challenge would have been a lot easier if even some investment was made at Vernon Jubilee or in Salmon Arm or, indeed, in Kelowna by the NDP government. Sadly, there was no investment made in those facilities. That's why $180 million is in the ground. It's rising up out of the ground. It's being built for the benefit of patients in Vernon, and those emergency doctors will also benefit with a brand-new tower in Vernon.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members.

A. Dix: The minister clearly isn't listening to doctors in Vernon — clearly isn't listening. Two years ago in April they had 16 code purples in that emergency room in 21 days. The government has done nothing about it.

Oh no, I stand corrected. I want to be fair to the government. They stopped telling people how many code purples they had. That's what they did about it.

Their plan. The minister talks about the record on health care. In this hospital that's short of acute care beds, they transformed acute care beds into administrative offices. That was their plan. That's what they did at this very hospital.

What's the minister going to do now? They did nothing in 2006 when this issue was raised; they did nothing in 2008 when this issue was raised. Their plan doesn't include any new acute care beds in the foreseeable future. What is the minister going to do now to help doctors in Vernon deal with the crisis in their emergency room?

Hon. K. Falcon: The first thing I would hope the Health critic would know is that a crisis, as the member incorrectly describes it, actually doesn't happen overnight. It happens particularly when you've had ten years of zero investment of capital in the region. That does not help. So when you are faced….

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Continue, Minister.

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Hon. K. Falcon: I do think a reasonable person would recognize that when you have a growing population in an area like that, it would have been nice had a lot of these capital investments been made a lot earlier. Sadly, they weren't.

What did we do? We invested $2 million in the Vernon Jubilee emergency department to deal with the initial challenges they were facing a few years back and, at the same time, entered into the process of making sure we build a brand-new critical care tower — $180 million for a 181,000-square-foot facility — which will help deal with the very real challenges they face at Vernon Jubilee as a result of a complete ignoring of the problem for ten full years of NDP government.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Take your seat, Member. Just sit down.

The member has a supplemental.

CONDITIONS AT

VANCOUVER GENERAL HOSPITAL

A. Dix: The minister finally said something right. We have had ten years of zero on health care from this government. We all know that change is just around the corner. But this is the government at that hospital…

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members.

A. Dix: …that closed acute care beds and made them administrative offices. Is that what they call innovation? We know what the minister calls innovation. It's diverting funds from patient care to bureaucracy. That's what he calls innovation.

In Vancouver…. Let's bring the minister back to Vancouver, because he's apparently familiar with the situation there. Doctors at Vancouver General Hospital are directly talking to communities they serve about how they are unable to assess, admit and treat patients in a medically acceptable time frame.

Interjections.

A. Dix: Oh, I know that when anyone speaks out against this government, they get angry, but we're just going to keep talking. We're going to keep talking.

When doctors raised these issues yesterday, the minister criticized them. But doctors say that at Vancouver General Hospital there have been over 30 cases of near misses in the last 14 days.

Mr. Speaker: Could the member pose the question, please.

A. Dix: So 30 cases of near misses in the last 14 days. Does the minister find that circumstance acceptable in our public health care system?

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Take your seat.

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Hon. K. Falcon: The Health critic is always very good at rhetoric; he's very weak on facts. The fact of the matter is…. These are what I call uncomfortable NDP facts that they never will tell the public about, so I'm happy to share them.

One of them is that in the decade of the '90s in which, actually, the Health critic was chief of staff in the Premier's office and responsible for making these kinds of decisions, we saw the number of acute care beds at Vancouver General Hospital go from 913 to 720. That was a 21 percent drop in acute care beds.

That was your record, Mr. Health Critic.

The other thing we saw that was quite fascinating during the 1990s was that there was a building built by the Social Credit government called the Jimmy Pattison tower, and the Jimmy Pattison tower sat empty for the entire decade of the NDP government.

We filled it. We staffed it. It's serving patients today, along with the new $95 million Gordon and Leslie Diamond out-patient facility. That is a record we are proud of on this side of the House.

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MENTAL HEALTH SERVICES

FOR CHILDREN IN KOOTENAYS

K. Conroy: Emergency rooms across the province are also being left to deal with this government's decision to undercut mental health programs. In Castlegar the child mental health office is currently only able to respond to urgent referrals. What does that mean? To receive help, you either have to be suicidal or homicidal. Report after report signals that without prompt intervention, these issues get worse.

Why is the minister putting youth at risk? Why do problems have to escalate to dangerous levels for these children and youth to receive the help that they need?

Hon. K. Falcon: Well, in fact, that's entirely why you want to make sure you intervene as early as possible. It's one of the reasons why we've been working with the general practitioners service committee of the BCMA to actually bring together in GPs' offices, family practitioners' offices, a module that provides mental health training so that they can identify early on when some of these young people present with symptoms of mental illness. There are early indicators that we now allow the doctors to address early on so that we can get help and intervention early on in young people's lives.

That is a program the members opposite would certainly be unfamiliar with, because it didn't exist in the 1990s. It is something that is underway today in almost every single family practitioner's office right across the province of British Columbia.

Mr. Speaker: The member has a supplemental.

K. Conroy: That just isn't the reality in the Kootenays. The wait-list for Castlegar children and youth continues to grow, and it's growing rapidly. They do not have the capacity to deal with it. This is just not acceptable. It's not acceptable to the youth, to the children, to the families. The children that are being put at risk because of no one there to help them, to intervene for them when their needs are being needed…. It's increasing — the need for service. There's a rapid deterioration.

The minister needs to do something now. The minister needs to do something for children and youth in the Kootenays before the situation reaches a crisis.

Hon. K. Falcon: I apologize. I didn't quite get the question. The issue, and I think what the member should be comforted by, is the fact that since 2003, funding has more than doubled, from $42 million to $85 million, to deal with issues of community mental health services. What that means is that almost 20,000 children are receiving those services today in the province of British Columbia.

But I would agree with the member opposite on the fact that the job is hardly close to done. The fact of the matter is that what we have to do is make sure we intervene as early as possible with young children when they start to exhibit symptoms of mental illness.

That's why we are working with family practitioners to ensure that when they identify some of those early symptoms that present, they have the opportunity to immediately put them in touch with services. That can range — anything from the DVD, through the Bounce Back program, we created with the Canadian Mental Health to provide information for those young patients…. It can range from that to connecting with 811 HealthLink line to provide counselling services and, indeed, additional services.

SPECIAL ADVISER TO

VANCOUVER SCHOOL DISTRICT

R. Austin: Yesterday the Education Minister refused to explain why the terms of reference for the special adviser that she's appointed for the Vancouver school district didn't include a mandate to examine whether the funds being received by the district were adequate. It's no wonder, since even a cursory glance at the government's own numbers show the Vancouver district is drowning in unfunded costs.

My question to the Education Minister is this. Will she expand the mandate of the special adviser? Or will she admit that school districts are not getting the funding they need to deliver the education our children deserve?

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Hon. M. MacDiarmid: The Vancouver school board is anticipating this year 5 percent fewer students than

[ Page 4564 ]

they had ten years ago. In spite of that, they're receiving increasing funding this year, as they have every year. Their funding per pupil is up 33 percent.

I must ask the member opposite: when will they stop protecting and insisting on the status quo? When will they come along with us and look at a future where we're investing in early education, where we realize that the needs in the province have changed with 60,000 fewer students?

Mr. Speaker: The member has a supplemental.

R. Austin: You know what? It's an insult to the intelligence of parents around this province to believe that millions of dollars in extra costs in Vancouver can be offset by a hundred less students in a district of more than 55,000. Yesterday parent Tim Waring said this: "The government is pointing fingers at the Vancouver school board, saying that they're mismanaging their money. But that doesn't explain why Surrey is having a shortfall — Coquitlam, Richmond, Prince George, Victoria, and I could go on."

Again to the Minister of Education: is the real reason that she appointed a special adviser for the Vancouver school district because they were the source of too many embarrassing headlines?

Hon. M. MacDiarmid: The member opposite is well aware of the history of the Vancouver school board, where, in the last 17 years, every single year they have projected huge shortfalls. They predicted doom and gloom, and every single year they've ended up with a surplus — last year $16.7 million in the surplus of their operating funds.

Vancouver is facing significant declining enrolment. In Vancouver there are schools that are 60 or 70 percent empty. It's time for all of the school boards, the 52 that are facing declining enrolment, to start to do things differently. It's incumbent upon all of us to look for administrative savings where we can. To think about the 55,000 students that are attending school in Vancouver today — that needs to be our focus.

D. Thorne: Well, I take exception to what we've just been hearing from the Minister of Education. It is ridiculous. It is ridiculous to talk about one school board, like the Vancouver school board, as if it was different from almost every other school district in British Columbia, which are all facing the same kinds of issues.

Districts of every size are facing tough choices across British Columbia. My home district of Coquitlam is looking at a $4.1 million shortfall, despite the fact that the enrolment in Coquitlam grew by hundreds of students last year — grew. The district is holding a meeting tonight where they will be discussing making cuts to supports for special needs students, cutting school days, laying off three youth workers and nine specialist teachers. These are all options that are being contemplated by most other districts.

My question is again to the Education Minister. Why is she picking on Vancouver when districts across the province are all experiencing these massive shortfalls?

Hon. M. MacDiarmid: The decision was made to provide the special adviser in Vancouver because this school board did stand out from the others, in that they consistently made statements about their inability to manage. They made statements that they couldn't cope. They talked about the fact that they were making decisions that they thought were unacceptable.

[1420]

There are 55,000 students in Vancouver and their parents, and they are counting on us. They are counting on us to have the will to do things differently. Education funding….

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Continue, Minister.

Hon. M. MacDiarmid: I would remind the members opposite that education funding is at an all-time high, that we are investing more than we ever have before. Not only are we investing more than ever before, but we're investing in a new program next year — a full-day kindergarten, which is being welcomed by parents and by educators alike around the province.

DELTA SCHOOL DISTRICT

COSTS AND FUNDING

V. Huntington: The Minister of Education has repeatedly said that school boards must do things differently, and I'm proud to say that the school board in Delta does do things differently and is constantly searching for innovative ways to supplement its budget shortfall. But despite developing specialized academies and closing schools, despite heeding the minister's advice in untold ways, the Delta school board is still facing a $4 million deficit this year. It's laying off 34 full-time positions, depleting its reserves and cutting programs to vulnerable students.

What else does the minister expect Delta to do? Does she want us to go back to split shifts or two grades per classroom? Does she have any specific suggestions on how she wants things done differently in the system?

Hon. M. MacDiarmid: In Delta next year's enrolment is expected to be 10 percent lower than it was ten years ago — so a substantial decline in enrolment. In spite of this enrolment decline, the per-pupil funding is up 36 percent in Delta — a 36 percent increase in per-pupil funding.

[ Page 4565 ]

What we expect of this school district — and we know they are working hard — is what we expect of all the districts: to think about things differently; to pursue things like shared services, perhaps a common payroll system; to look at doing things with the municipalities. There are a number of ways that we can gain administrative savings and put these savings back into the classroom. That is what we expect.

Mr. Speaker: The member has a supplemental.

V. Huntington: If there is an increase in the funding, it's because of the innovations the Delta school board has put in place. In the face of government cuts, Delta school district has developed sports academies to draw additional students back into the system.

Since the minister has asked school districts to do things differently, what oversight and accountability measures is she putting in place to control these innovations, or will there be a free-for-all of creativity in this province, with no rules, guidelines or controls?

Hon. M. MacDiarmid: One thing that we know is that parents do want choice for their children, and Delta is responding to that request for innovation from parents.

But the member is mistaken when she talks about funding. This district is going to receive $2 million of additional funding next year above and beyond what they received previously, and this is in spite of their declining enrolment. Not only is their per-pupil funding up…

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members.

Interjection.

Mr. Speaker: Minister.

Continue, Minister.

Hon. M. MacDiarmid: …by 36 percent over the last ten years, but there's also been substantial capital investment in Delta. In spite of what the members opposite would try to lead the public to believe, we are investing record amounts in education in this province, and we will continue to do that.

[1425]

RICHMOND SCHOOL DISTRICT

COSTS AND FUNDING

G. Gentner: Let's move from the non-friendly Liberal territory called Delta to across the river, to Richmond. Enrolment is on the rise in the Richmond school district, yet just last night trustees unveiled a plan to cut almost a hundred staff.

Richmond school trustee Donna Sargent had this to say about the government's campaign of misinformation: "I think it's disgusting the minister says we're getting more funding than we have, ever, and yet in the last two years we've had to cut $13 million."

My question is to the Minister of Education. Given the fact that school trustees across the province are contradicting what this minister has said, will she appoint a special adviser to look at her own books in order to ascertain whether this government has kept their promises to the parents of B.C.?

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members.

Hon. M. MacDiarmid: We're investing $2.4 million more in Richmond next year than we did in the previous school year. Their per-pupil funding is up 27 percent since 2000-2001. In every school district around this province we are continuing to invest record amounts. We are embarking on new programming, which is valued by educators and parents alike — full-day kindergarten.

Let me remind all the members opposite of what former NDP Finance Minister and Education Minister Paul Ramsey said about this. "A shortfall is a fiction on paper. It's not a real deficit, but it's a wonderful game that school districts use to jam ministers of education."

[End of question period.]

B. Ralston: I seek leave to make an introduction.

Mr. Speaker: Proceed.

Introductions by Members

B. Ralston: I would like to introduce to the chamber the mayor of Surrey, Dianne Watts, who's in the gallery. May I ask members to make her welcome.

D. Hayer: I would also like to do an introduction. City of Surrey mayor Dianne Watts is a very hard-working mayor, and I think she's doing a good job overall. Would the House please make her very welcome.

[ Page 4566 ]

Petitions

C. Trevena: I have a petition to present. I have a petition with hundreds of signatures calling for the closure of logging of old growth on Vancouver Island in certain endangered areas and the phasing out of all old-growth logging in the rest of the Island by 2015.

L. Popham: I present a petition. I have hundreds of signatures to a petition to protect Vancouver Island's ancient forests and B.C. jobs.

S. Fraser: I have further petitions calling for the phase-out of old growth logging on Vancouver Island and the Lower Mainland and to protect B.C. jobs by ending raw log exports.

Orders of the Day

Hon. M. de Jong: In Committee A, Committee of Supply — for the information of members, the estimates of the Ministry of Transportation and Infrastructure — and, in this chamber, continued second reading debate on Bill 9.

Second Reading of Bills

Bill 9 — Consumption Tax Rebate

and Transition Act

(continued)

On the amendment (continued) .

[L. Reid in the chair.]

R. Howard: Prior to lunch, I had taken my place here with great pleasure to speak about Bill 9 before us and, more specifically, to speak in opposition to the referral motion that is before us.

I think that before lunch I closed with a statement that this government has the courage to do the right things and do them now. But I also want to talk about credibility, because I hear from the opposition lots of confusion on several fronts.

[1430]

One opposition member wants to remove this tax, another wants to leave it in place, and yet another wants to replace it with a different tax. It seems remarkable to me that they actually prefer the PST.

I'll tell you what, Madam Speaker. I hear this sitting in my seat here in the Legislature. I hear it every day. They want to increase taxes. Let there be no doubt about that. They want to increase the machinery and equipment tax. They want to bring back the corporate capital tax, and they want to increase taxes on banks.

I've heard this clearly on a weekly if not a daily basis in this House. It seems to me they want to tax all the businesses and job providers, and that's why the job providers left this province in the '90s. Taxes and red tape had gotten out of hand with the NDP in power, and now, remarkably, the NDP wants to take us back to the '90s.

Does the opposition believe the PST is a better tax? I ask them to clarify that for the people of this province. In this very important debate, both sides have agreed this is important. We in government have put our position on the table for all to see, backed up by significant professional opinion.

They have a website, or at least they did have a website, which contained incorrect information, it turns out. Their website linked to Bill V.'s website, which contained more incorrect information. Yes, Bill V. and the NDP. There's a partnership for the ages.

I see that the opposition has trouble formulating a vision, and I know their business sense comes into question from time to time. I saw it firsthand in the '90s. But when the member for Delta North puts out a brochure claiming that the price of a meal will go from $20 to $25.40 as a result of HST, that is taking even NDP math to new heights.

We may have to come up with a new name. Perhaps we can call it, as the AG so delicately expressed, crapola — crapola math. Even when they have a concern for the cost of meals, they can't get the math right. The twisted logic does not stop there, so I ask: where is the credibility?

We have the member for Columbia River–Revelstoke, who is the Forests critic. Now, let me frame this because this is something. The NDP Forests critic was supposed to offer up advice on how to improve conditions for our forest industry. Along comes the single most important thing government can do for the short-, mid- and long-term health of the forest industry, and he pans it, saying that it takes us in the wrong direction.

Let's look at the forest industry. Who supports the HST and moving forward now? Well, the B.C. Lumber Trade Council, Coast Forest Products Association, Council of Forest Industries, Truck Loggers Association, Canfor, West Fraser Timber and more.

These job creators support this. It sounds like strong support to me, and I think the opposition critic is going to have some explaining to do when the rhetoric stops, reality starts to sink in and the people of this province realize this is a good thing. So I ask: is the opposition credible when it comes to protecting jobs? I don't think so.

Other comments have been made as we debate in this House the merits of HST from the Leader of the Opposition, no less, and from the opposition member for Surrey-Whalley, who is also the Finance critic. We heard HST would be a job killer. Madam Speaker, 129 jurisdictions have a value-added tax system. Doesn't sound like a job killer to me. And 29 out of 30 OECD countries have a value-added tax system. Still doesn't

[ Page 4567 ]

sound like a job killer to me. These are countries like Australia, France, Germany, Korea, Japan, Mexico and others.

The vast majority of economists support a value-added tax system, so I guess I must ask: are all these economists and business groups conspiring to kill B.C.'s economy? Who has credibility on protecting jobs?

[1435]

Another economist, Dr. Jack Mintz, an internationally recognized expert in this field who studied and reported on the B.C. case specifically, concluded that the implementation of HST would result in an additional 113,000 jobs over the next ten years. A job killer? I ask British Columbians: who has credibility on the issue of protecting jobs and creating a strong economy? I do know of a job-killing tax. It's called the corporate capital tax. Now, there's a job killer, this interesting little item on the NDP's last platform. CCT, they called it. They didn't want to spell out its full name, and I think I know why.

I had the dubious pleasure of trying to explain to an international investor what this CCT, this corporate capital tax, was — the government taking back some of your capital each year, whether you made any money or not. He looked at me and said: "You mean I must give your government" — the NDP government, I should note — "money based on the value of my capital assets each year?" "Yes," I replied. "Even if I had lost money?" he asked, which I confirmed. He commented: "So the government will, over many years, take all my capital away via this tax."

Well, you can see where this conversation went. It went south real fast, as did the 35 jobs we were hoping to create with our proposal to him. There's a job-killing tax, the NDP's CCT, or corporate capital tax, which this B.C. Liberal government got rid of.

There is more on the HST and more on why it's important that we move forward now with certainty. In one of his more interesting moments, the member for Cowichan Valley claimed the HST would pick the pockets of the poor and the disabled. To that I say hogwash. If that isn't fearmongering, I don't know what is. The opposition member's comment is so bereft of fact that it's hard to deal with.

We have seen many real examples calculated by Finance Ministry officials of low-income British Columbians who, especially after HST credits, will be even or ahead financially once HST is implemented.

HST is a job-creating tax. We now have the lowest personal tax rates in the country, courtesy of this government, and over 325,000 British Columbians pay no provincial income tax at all. That represents money in taxpayer pockets.

Most British Columbians now pay between 30 and 75 percent less tax than in 2001. I must say that opposition members have voted against every tax-reducing measure that we have introduced as government. So I suggest that it is this government that has credibility when it comes to creating and protecting jobs. I think the evidence is clear.

I would like to talk about confidence. I referred to this earlier when I first talked about the referral motion and how difficult it would be to refer, creating further uncertainty and creating less confidence in this economy at just the wrong time. I have heard a few opposition members talk about this, and I'm very happy to talk about confidence.

We were elected in 2009 to keep B.C. strong, and that is what we are doing. We have made the tough governance decisions that will keep this province on a strong economic foundation for decades to come. This government has enjoyed seven consecutive credit-rating upgrades since coming into office.

I want to spend a minute on this, because this is where the rubber hits the road in many ways in the discussion on confidence. The public can be excused if they're confused somewhat, because there is a lot of misdirection going on here on behalf of the opposition and lots of misinformation when it comes to HST. It's a pattern that appears on many fronts. So I think British Columbians can be expected to say: "Show me proof."

Who has the high ground when it comes to claiming to know what is best for B.C.'s economy? Does the government know what it's doing? So let's look to the experts who spend their professional life evaluating and projecting economic performances — independent third-party judges, if you will. If you are a government or a corporation, they by and large get to decide what you have to pay for your debt.

When we do all this, all of a sudden the confusion falls away. All of a sudden there is clarity on the issue of confidence.

[1440]

This government has produced seven credit-rating upgrades for the provincial economy, which now has a triple-A rating. Over the last 20 years there have been seven credit-rating upgrades in total for this province, and this government has produced every one of them.

The score then is this government, seven; the opposition, none. Compare these seven credit upgrades to the accomplishments of the opposition when they were in power in the '90s. There is a contrasting vision for you to contemplate. Seven credit-rating upgrades since this government has been in power contrasted to no upgrades. I'm reminded by the member for Richmond-Steveston that there were some downgrades during the NDP's time in power.

Independent bond-rating agencies have confidence in this government's actions and have awarded us with the highest credit rating available. This is a statement that should cause pride for the citizens of the province, and when contrasted against the record of the opposition,

[ Page 4568 ]

they show a stark difference in how the most senior credit evaluators view our two different approaches.

The harmonized sales tax is an important tax policy, and it's important that we move forward with certainty and speed. It will make our economy more competitive. The numbers are as straightforward as they are compelling. First, $30 million comes out of the cost of operating the department for the province. Some $30 million gets pulled out of the cost of the provincial government. That's a savings of $30 million to the taxpayers of this province, and that's a lot of money.

Second, over $150 million comes out of compliance costs, comes out of the cost of doing business in this province. This is the cost represented by businesses across the province having to fill out forms and deal with the separate tax issue, the PST.

As a small business owner, few things made me more angry than having to deal with complex forms and reading the regulations associated with the government taxation department — phone calls to clarify, web searches to confirm. All this time spent on dealing with government. No revenue associated with that activity, just time.

As if the bond-rating agency's scoring wasn't conclusive enough, and the other 130 countries using a value-added system wasn't enough, and the 29 of 30 OECD countries wasn't enough, and pretty well every major economist who supports this wasn't enough. Then let's look to the internationally known expert who has studied the British Columbia case specifically, Dr. Jack Mintz.

Dr. Mintz has studied and reported on the B.C. case. He's a leading international authority on taxes, and he has concluded that British Columbia will gain 113,000 jobs as a result of harmonization. As I have said, the opposition Finance critic has called this a job killer.

I urge all British Columbians to think about this. Some 130 different countries and the vast majority of economists, including the Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives — which is a left-leaning, left-funded organization — have said that this is a positive thing for the economy. Many have said that it is important to the future success of the province and our ability to attract investment and create jobs.

So who do you place your confidence with? A government that has laid out a vision backed up by experts? Or an opposition who is simply opposing, making misleading statements and, by all accounts, led a disastrous government in the 1990s?

I'd like to talk briefly about two specific examples, because some of the fearmongering that is happening is damaging, especially to seniors. Seniors have been the subject of some misinformation.

A specific example of a senior couple with $30,000 of income was circulating on the Internet, claiming they'd have to pay an extra $2,100 in taxes, which is nonsense. The couple will pay approximately $1,000 under the new system versus approximately $750 that they paid under the PST system. An increase of about $250, when considered with the HST tax credit, will offset the increased costs, and they will likely be even or ahead of the game at the end of the day. This senior couple would pay less, not more.

I have another example. I have a friend who is an electrical contractor. They are pleased with the elimination of the PST, and they don't want to wait. They don't want to wait and refer this to committee. They want some action now.

[1445]

The existing PST is a complicated system for them. They have to differ their accounting depending on if they're working in a manufacturing facility or not. At each and every month end they have to comb through their invoicing in order to determine if it's PST-able or not. If they install a fan on the ceiling, they have to double-check through their invoices and see if the struts and the screws and the fan components are PST-able, provide two different invoices, then remit and report. They are very happy that this government is moving to a harmonized system.

There are just two examples, and you have to know there are a thousand more success stories relating to HST. I think the opposition will have some answering to do later this year when the citizens of this province realize that they have been misled. They have been purposefully given incorrect information, all to try to scare individuals, seniors specifically, for political advantage. I think it's irresponsible.

In closing, this government has set out a vision for a certain kind of province. It is the kind of province that I want to live in and raise a family in. It's the kind of province I am proud to call home.

It's the kind of province where I'm sure that my son and his children will have a bright future, a secure future, a prosperous future; a government that truly respects choices for individuals; a government that looks after those who cannot look after themselves; a government that invests in the development of our young because they realize this is the best investment of all; a government that wants to set the table for responsible entrepreneurship and then, by and large, get out of the way for you to succeed; a government that recognizes the value of competition and partnerships; a government that recognizes the value in our natural setting; a government that is prepared to lead, not just to take the easy road to re-election but to do what is right in the longer term.

I want to create a province that when it is time to pass the leadership mantle onto the next generation and the next generation after that, both generations will look back at this time and feel strongly that we made the right decisions, that we set the table for them to succeed and that we have done many things.

[ Page 4569 ]

We have made it easier for low-income families by relieving their taxes to the point where over 325,000 British Columbians will pay no income tax at all. The NDP voted against all of our tax-reducing measures. We have cut corporate income tax by 39 percent and small business taxes by 44 percent. The NDP voted against those measures as well. By 2012 the small business tax rate will be zero.

For all these reasons, British Columbia can be sure that this government will lead them into the future with a plan that puts jobs and the economy at the forefront, which puts prosperity at the forefront.

I use the word "prosperity" on purpose, because it reflects more than just money. It speaks to a successful society; a balance between taxes, jobs, services and recreation; a balanced approach that respects the past, embraces the present and looks forward with confidence to the future. Prosperity — a little less worry, a little more peace of mind, a lot more confidence. Prosperity — people interacting with confidence about the future, because it is the economy that will allow our communities to prosper and remain the greatest place on earth.

I for one am not willing to take tax and economic advice from the NDP opposition. I lived through the '90s as a small business person, and that is part of the reason I got back into politics — to ensure we never go back to the days of big government, red tape and high taxes. The HST now helps us set up a sustainable province. It will make our tax structure and our economy more efficient and therefore more attractive to those who will create jobs we seek. That's good news for job creation, which is good news for me. It's good news for you, and it's good news for our families.

Madam Speaker, we were elected to keep B.C. strong, and that is what we're doing.

L. Popham: I stand today to present my argument against this government's version of a consumption tax rebate and transition act and to support the referral motion.

I would like to start by expressing my discontent with some of the arguments I'm hearing from the other side of this House. There are moments in this House when I feel excited by the debate, when I understand and am clear that two sides can have different passions and different ideologies that drive us all to fight hard for what we believe in. That's politics. That's why I'm here, and that's why I'm up for the fight.

[1450]

But I think this debate is quite different, and I find it quite hard to stomach. There is a tone of arrogance and haughtiness coming from the other side, and it's very upsetting to listen to.

I listened to the first throne speeches made in this House last September. I heard most MLAs from both sides thanking their voters who gave them this privileged seat in this chamber. There were words used in speeches like "privilege," "honour," "humbling" and "gratefulness." These words were used to express the gratitude we were each feeling, our thankfulness for such an opportunity to be here, and with these words came promises to never take what we had been given for granted.

We are all in this House because of democracy. We each presented ourselves to the voters of B.C. — what we believe in, what we stood for. We chose parties to run for, parties that reflected our political philosophies. I am sad to say, now that I have spent 11 months in this seat listening to this government, that I feel very confident that the voters of B.C. were bamboozled.

On May 12, 2009, this was a day that the voters took

part in a critical event called an election. They voted. They voted in safe surroundings. They voted because they felt it was their responsibility, and they voted because many people before us and even still today lost their lives for this privilege. In B.C. we have a democratic process, and we're proud of that. It's something to protect. But now I see how blasé an attitude the Liberal government takes towards the idea of democracy.

I am here to register my opposition to the Consumption Tax Rebate and Transition Act and to support the referral motion. I oppose it for many reasons, but I would like to have it put on the record that I oppose it because it's being shoved down the throats of B.C. in an undemocratic manner.

I am opposing this act because I was elected by the people of B.C., and they don't want it. That's clear. They would have liked a heads-up before the election, they would liked to have been part of the consultation process, and they would have liked to have been asked before this government decided to shift a $2 billion tax increase on to them.

Is that too much to ask? In fact, maybe the question should be: why didn't the government ask? Now we're here in this House exchanging insults and verbal attacks. This government didn't ask, and now we have a referral motion in front of us which, if supported by this House, would lead to the consultation with the people of B.C. That's what they deserve.

We on this side of the House are engaged because we respect democracy. The other side of the House keeps proving day in and day out that they don't believe in it and that they don't respect the people of B.C. They believe in hiking taxes more than they respect the voters. That didn't seem to be the case on May 11, when we were all making promises, and that leads me to this question. What has changed over the past 11 months? It's not even been a year, and what I have heard coming from the other side shocks me.

What happened to being humbled? What happened to the indebtedness to the people who voted for you? What happened to the honour in representing the people of B.C.? I have to tell you that I reached a point last week

[ Page 4570 ]

in which I felt miserable being in here. This point came when the member for Comox Valley stood and gave his 30-minute rendition of his support for the Consumption Tax Rebate and Transition Act.

I was shocked at what he had to say, and I felt like taking a drive up to Comox and personally apologizing to the people who put their faith in this member. Verbally attacking each other is a crazy but accepted part of this job, but what's not part of this job is attacking the voters.

Perhaps I feel attached to this member's constituency because I grew up in the neighbouring riding. I spent many, many hours on Mount Washington, with many weekends training with the Mount Washington ski racing team. I spent years climbing around Mount Albert Edward, hiking around Forbidden Plateau, field trips to observe the Comox Glacier. Most every summer, over 16 summers, I've gone to Hornby Island with my family. They have vacationed there for 45 years straight. The Comox Valley is an incredible area full of opportunity, with agriculture and recreation, and is home to many small businesses.

[1455]

The member began his debate last week by taking issue with what the member for North Island said. The record from Hansard shows that the member for Comox Valley thinks he knows what the economy is based on up there, and he definitely knows it's not built on coffee and haircuts. How insulting to those small business owners in the Comox Valley.

Let's start with the hair industry. How upsetting it must have been to those people who own hair salons, and to barbers, in the Comox Valley. How insulting to those who voted for this member during the election. About 30,000 people voted in the Comox Valley in the 2009 election. Approximately 14,000 voted for the member across the way.

We can also think of it as about 30,000 people getting haircuts every couple of months in the Comox Valley. I'm going to use the number 30,000 for this discussion. This, of course, doesn't take into account kids' haircuts or the haircuts of people who didn't vote during the last election, which was over 50 percent.

Let's use the number 30,000 for argument's sake, but keeping in mind that the actual population of the Comox Valley is about 62,000. Say 30,000 people need a haircut every two months, and the average cost is approximately $25. That's taking a low average of the cost of a woman's and a man's haircut — so 30,000 people, $25 every two months. That's $750,000 every two months going into the Comox Valley economy from this sector.

Looking at what it contributes per year, I would estimate the total is around $4.5 million. Remember, that number could actually be doubled if we used the population to work out that equation. That number could possibly be as high as $9 million per year.

That says to me that the local economy is partially built on this small business sector. It doesn't seem insignificant at all. It seems like part of a small business sector that should get respect and consultation. The member for Comox Valley gives them neither.

I suggest that the member for Comox Valley take a look at it for himself — at how much this sector contributes to the Comox riding. It's not insignificant, and as a small business owner, I would be insulted to hear such dismissal from an MLA who represents them.

Bill 9 affects these small businesses by adding 7 percent more onto the cost of doing business, a cost that they will have to pass on to their customers. Of the $2 billion tax shift onto customers that this government is trying to implement, the fact is this government is raising taxes on people in B.C.

As far as coffee shops go, another blatant affront from this member to business owners — which, if the member cared to notice, play an important role in the vibrancy of the downtown core in Comox. The Comox Valley attracts many visitors, as it's the home of many attractions in the recreational tourism business. These visitors arrive downtown to visit a vibrant, creative centre that hosts many coffee shops. There are places to gather, to make plans, to mingle and to be a part of the community, and the member for Comox Valley feels they are insignificant.

The economy is not built on these businesses? What a slap in the face. Perhaps the member didn't read his local paper, the Comox Valley Echo , when they reported:

"Restaurant and food service business owners in Courtenay's downtown core are almost unanimous in their opposition to a provincial HST. 'People are already having a hard time getting by as it is,' said Darla Curror, a co-owner of Mudsharks Coffee Bar, in the downtown area. 'This is one more reason why they won't be able to afford to dine out.'

"Ryan Liebert, owner of Bean Around the World, on 4th Street, noted that a cup of coffee will go up by 14 cents, lattes will go up 28 cents, and lunch will increase 50 cents to 60 cents. 'That's no profit to me. That's profit to a government that doesn't deserve it. If you think people aren't going to feel that, then you're insane,' he says, 'and that's certainly going to impact my business.'"

The member claims that he supports business, but as far as I can tell, small and medium-sized businesses don't fall under his area of interest. If they did, he would not be supporting Bill 9. It is clear that this government supports tax hikes and loves spending our money. Look out, folks, the tax-and-spend Liberal government is like a runaway coal-burning train.

I say coal-burning because they've also decided to abandon their environmental ethics with this tax. The HST is going to raise taxes on consumers across the tourism sector, from restaurants and meals to hotels and accommodation, and even green fees on rounds of golf.

[1500]

With this member being in a prime tourism destination for Vancouver Island and the Lower Mainland, how can this member support a bill that would devastate that industry?

[ Page 4571 ]

This area is well known for its amazing golf courses. Guess what. Golf resorts will have a triple whammy of HST on golf, accommodation and food. Thirty percent of golf resorts' customers in that area are from Vancouver Island. They've already been hit with the economy being in trouble and then adding the folding of Tourism B.C. The HST is another added burden.

What was this member thinking? There was no consultation. That's clear. I hope that this member will consider his community when he votes for the referral motion and will vote in favour of it.

Now, talking about the coal-burning train out of control, why on earth, after 30 years, would a government decide to take an exemption off bicycles? It's unbelievable that this government wouldn't fight for such an exemption while it was going down this path.

I attended the estimates last September with the Minister of Small Business, and the amount of e-mails I was getting in my office regarding the bicycle tax was so much that I decided to create a petition/survey and ask people around B.C. if they had any idea that this was happening and also if they had been consulted. I e-mailed every bike store in B.C.

I went into the estimates, and this is from Hansard . My question was:

"My questioning will be regarding the HST on bicycle purchases. I think there has been a real lack of communication to the public about moving them into transportation choices that are good for…climate change…."

Now we're going to be taxing a bicycle, which falls in line with our carbon emissions reduction plan.

"…for almost 30 years bicycles have had an exemption to the…tax. It included the repairs…and helmets, and now we see the HST affecting bicycle purchases and the repairs. I don't think the cycling community, the small business community that sells bicycles, was consulted at all, because I don't think you would find anyone in support of that tax coming in."

The Minister of Small Business responded. He said that those questions were best directed to the Minister of Finance. I was then reminded that my question was relevant to the Minister of Finance, but I decided to try again. "I think that I would like to know whether the minister is hearing that sort of conversation" — from the cycling world — "on his consultation tours." The Minister of Small Business said: "I've heard nothing from the retailers of bicycles. I'm advised by my staff that they are similarly lacking in any direct correspondence with people who retail bicycles."

Well, that's completely untrue. I have letter after letter after letter in my office and copies of letters that were sent to the minister asking why this tax would come in on bikes after 30 years. So I'm not sure why the Minister of Small Business wouldn't just have admitted that there was no consultation process.

A constituent of mine who owns a bike shop wrote me and said: "It's kind of frustrating, especially with things like helmets. Helmets are already a chunk of change for some people. You have to wear them, or you'll get a fine, and now the cost of wearing them is going up. The cost is going up on other accessories too — oil, grease, patch kits, reflective stickers and locks. All of that was PST-exempt."

So what kind of message is this government sending to the people of B.C.? You want us to reduce our emissions, yet you're going to tax bicycles. It's unbelievable.

I had a rally here at the Legislature, and 500 people showed up — almost 600 people, actually — and the letters haven't stopped coming. This Squeaky Wheels site that I've created is really a site for people to vent their anger over this tax, but really, it's turning into a place to vent their anger over this government, its lack of consultation, its lack of caring and its lack of explanation for changing its message.

You don't want people to take green choices as far as transportation goes. You're going to exempt gasoline. First of all, you've got this carbon tax, which is going up, but you're going to exempt gasoline. So your message is falling apart. What do you want us to do? What do you want the people of B.C. to do? Nobody understands what you're up to anymore.

Deputy Speaker: Member. You need to….

L. Popham: Yes, sorry — the government. Sorry.

[1505]

I think the narrative is falling apart. I think that's really obvious, because the members across the way are getting very grumpy and chippy. I think that, for it being my first time elected…. I find the behaviour quite unsettling. It makes me feel embarrassed sometimes to be a politician. The balance of power is out of whack, and there doesn't seem to be very much honour in this job.

I would like to move on to agriculture. That's because the Minister of Finance tends to single me out when talking about how I should be supporting the HST because of the support from the agriculture industry. Well, you know, I think that's kind of making a big statement, again with not much proof.

A couple of weeks ago the Finance Minister said something that was really shocking. It shocked me, and when I sent it out to every single contact I have in the agricultural industry, it shocked them too.

I've been getting letters back, and I've got a really good letter to read to you. Maybe it'll add a little bit of reality about how the agriculture industry feels about the HST.

I hear from the other side of the House: "Oh well, farmers love it, because each year that they go out and buy a $40,000 new tractor, they're going to be thanking us."

Well, I don't know if anybody across the way knows the state of agriculture in B.C. It's not that good. There are not a lot of farmers I know that are going out and buying brand-new tractors. Some of them are, maybe the really big operations, but not small to medium-sized

[ Page 4572 ]

farms. They're going out, and they're buying used tractors, or they're trying to fix the one they have.

A couple of Thursdays ago the Finance Minister said that the B.C. Agriculture Council fully endorses the shift to the HST. "You know why? Because it's good for farmers and ranchers in British Columbia. It actually allows them to remove costs from their cost of doing business so…they can provide prices to the consumers in British Columbia that are cheaper."

I couldn't believe it when he said that. He must not understand anything about agriculture in B.C. Nobody who understands the finances of agriculture right now would insinuate that farmers could drop their prices as part of a business plan. So I don't know what school of economics the Finance Minister goes to, but it's not the school of real life when you're a farmer.

"…they can provide prices to the consumers of B.C. that are cheaper. That makes them more competitive. It means that there are going to be more British Columbians buying British Columbia agricultural products rather than imported products with which they're trying to compete." Well, you know what? That's absolutely false. They're going to be buying imported products because there won't be any more farmers left in B.C. if those are his expectations.

When I sent this out to my huge list, I can tell you that it was not well-received, and that included the Agriculture Council.

I got a very good letter back from somebody that explains the plight of the farmer and how the HST probably isn't what's going to be saving them in B.C.:

"Thank you for this most interesting update, Lana. I can't believe anyone would actually suggest that because of the HST benefit, we can somehow drop our prices and be more competitive, with product continually sourced from jurisdictions where labour and other costs are considerably lower and where governments push the limits on domestic support and direct subsidies.

"By our estimates, retail and wholesale consume, on average, 55 percent of the final selling price of apples. These margins would only increase if we dropped our prices. We're only realizing half our cost of production as it is. The HST will only affect one side of our production costs as labour. The largest direct cost component in the apple business will continue to be higher than that of our competitors.

"The government needs to realize that no farming sector in B.C. can compete on the basis of production costs versus other jurisdictions, which is why they need to invest more into agriculture, including extraordinary assistance measures and resurrecting and funding programs like Buy B.C.

"The Canadian dollar reaching par has already made our apples cheaper, and this factor easily erases any advantage, and more than that, that the apple industry might gain in HST tax credits.

[1510]

"Yes, we do support the HST from the perspective that it reforms the PST system and will, hopefully, include more items that previously provided either only GST rebate or were not PST-exempt. But the jury is out because farmers are going to have to put the faith in the government that this will be the case.

"We have received no explanation of what is eligible and non-eligible for the HST tax credit. We are only assuming that farm inputs that had either or both taxes or were exempt in the past will qualify. For example, do farm pickup purchases get the entire HST back? Do they qualify? Previously we received only the GST refund.

"If only it was as simple as waving a magic HST wand and making the financial issues of the apple industry go away. It is far more complex than that, and hopefully, I've illustrated this for you and for the government. The HST will not provide relief for the many farmers in my industry who desperately need the resources to purchase crop protection products and other farm supplies to grow the coming year's crops.

"It will clearly take years before we can assess what impact the HST would actually have. Hopefully, it will mean more than just paperwork, but we don't know."

So there you go. That's a farmer — a real, live farmer — who is out there trying to make a living. He doesn't even know if the HST is going to affect him in a positive way because the government hasn't actually explained it very well.

The way the HST was rolled out…. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to say the word "pathetic" or not, but I think it was quite pathetic. The information wasn't there at the beginning, and now we're almost at the end of this thing rolling in, and there's still a lack of information.

There's talk of a pamphlet going out. It's a little too late. If the government cared to notice, people are really ticked off. It's a marketing problem on the government's side, but — you know what? — I think unfortunately it's too little, too late. B.C. doesn't trust this government anymore. There's no reason to trust. Jamming something down the province's throat is what they're doing.

And you know what? On this side of the House we're trying to get information as best we can, but it's even hard for us to get information because the letters we've been writing, the questions we've been asking in this House, don't get answered by this government. It's a mockery. This government's making a mockery of the province.

"Figure it out yourself." I've also heard comments like: "The public is confused." Well, this government has confused the public.

You know, there is a list of things that are going to be going up, and I got this list from Bill Vander Zalm's website. I'm just going to list them off.

Maybe, if someone's watching this Hansard, it might be one of the first times that they've heard exactly what it's going to affect. They're not going to hear it when the other side talks because it's so vague coming from the other side.

Restaurant meals are going up, and we can actually talk about restaurant meals in regards to agriculture. On southern Vancouver Island there's a very critical relationship between restaurants and farmers, mostly small- to medium-lot farmers on this end of the Island. This relationship is based on the restaurant owners and staff valuing what's being grown locally on this end of the Island and supporting farmers.

The restaurant industry has been very outspoken as far as how much they think that this new tax will harm their industry. They have been crying out for consul-

[ Page 4573 ]

tation. They've been crying out for the government to make some changes, and I think the government has basically ignored them. Why? I have no idea. The restaurant industry in British Columbia is massive.

If the restaurants on the southern end of the Island, who support local farming, lose part of their purchasing power because they're not making as much money, they will not be purchasing agricultural goods from southern Vancouver Island. They won't be able to. They won't be able to afford it.

[1515]

You're killing two industries at once; the government's doing that. The government is killing two birds with one HST stone. So I think it's irresponsible.

I think there's a lot of talk of supporting business, and I don't think they do. I think they support large business, and they have handpicked a few businesses to support, but everybody else is just going to have to figure it out on their own, see how it affects them.

I'd like to know: what happens if it doesn't work? What happens after a year and people are like: "No, this isn't helping me at all"? What happens then? We're stuck with it, because we've signed on.

Restaurant meals, non-prescription medicine, hockey tickets, prepared foods. Prepared foods is interesting, because that's sort of a value-added product from the agricultural industry as well. I'm not sure where the support of agriculture…. I can see the input argument, but there's so much that hasn't been sorted out for the agricultural industry. It would be fantastic to see an explanation for all of these things about why they don't fit, what was important.

We've also got haircuts, as I've mentioned. There are so many people in the hair industry in B.C. They were not consulted. I've gone out and talked to quite a few hair salons and barber shops. The problem is that they don't have a well-organized group speaking for them, so there was no way to consult. Some of us don't need monthly haircuts, but some of us do.

They're ticked off, but they're working so hard that they don't have time to organize themselves to approach the government and say: "This is going to affect us. This is a cost that we're going to have to put onto our customers. We can't take that cost on ourselves."

We've got theatre tickets, magazines, newspapers. You know, newspapers are struggling right now, because of on-line access. Adding a disincentive, more cost, to buying a newspaper is another slap in the face to that industry. That industry is suffering, and they have with the Internet coming on line. I think that's a bad choice. I love newspapers. Nothing's better on a Saturday morning than to sit down with a couple of newspapers. But you know what? It comes out of your pocket. It's change, and some people won't be able to afford it.

Taxi fares, oh my goodness. How mad are the taxicab drivers? They're really angry. You know, we talk about taking people out of their cars, single-occupancy drivers. Some people use taxis now, and that's an added cost. So we're exempting fuel and making carpooling and car-sharing more expensive. It doesn't make sense to me.

Airline tickets, golf fees, skiing fees. You know, the member for Comox Valley has got a really successful ski mountain, ski resort in his riding. Skiing fees. It's amazing that he can stand up and support this bill. Spa services, massage therapy, parking, coffee shops.

The coffee shops are part of our culture here. A cup of coffee is not going to break the bank, but if you start adding more costs onto it, people are going to choose not to get that cup of coffee in the morning. It's cheaper to do it at home, and they have to think about that. I feel that this tax is really putting coffee shops in harm's way. I love coffee, so when somebody from Bean Around The World is telling me it's going to hurt their business, I don't like it, because I like to go there for coffee.

School supplies. Really, school supplies? How could that have a new tax on it? How could that have an added tax, school supplies? Aren't we supposed to be trying to educate our kids? It doesn't make sense. I don't understand. It's a lot of mixed messages.

I think the problem is that this government didn't really have a message, so they stuck a whole bunch of them together, and now the narrative's completely falling apart.

We've got home maintenance, consulting services. I've heard from the other side….

Deputy Speaker: Thank you, Member.

Hon. K. Krueger: I rise to speak against this amendment to Bill 9. For those watching from home, Bill 9 is a bill to end the provincial sales tax in British Columbia.

[1520]

Strangely, our NDP opposition is en masse speaking against and clearly intends to vote against Bill 9 and doesn't want us to rescind and end the provincial sales tax.

The harmonized sales tax — being the harmonization of the federal goods and services tax and the provincial sales tax — the HST, as it's called, has already been legislated. That is federal government legislation. It's complete, and it comes into effect — the HST does — on July 1 of this year.

If we didn't rescind provincial sales tax, in theory we'd still have a 7 percent provincial sales tax in addition to a 12 percent harmonized sales tax, or 19 percent. Surely nobody wants that.

What you see here is an opposition wasting time in this Legislature, wasting time resisting a bill to eliminate a provincial sales tax that obviously needs to be eliminated. I spoke to second reading, and before this amendment was moved, about the fact that small business hates the provincial sales tax, finds it tremendously

[ Page 4574 ]

burdensome with its long schedules of exemptions, with its onerous accounting responsibilities for small business — small business that always creates the most jobs of any sector of our economy.

Month after month, quarter after quarter, year after year, as our economy grows, small business leads the way. There are 380,000 small businesses in B.C., employing 1.05 million British Columbians. It really matters to them, by and large — most of them — that we harmonize the sales tax. They want it. They have asked for it. It will be good for retail. It will be good for most small businesses.

We're dealing with those who didn't have provincial sales tax up until now on their goods or services. For them it is more of a shock. I spoke with the Council of Tourism Associations this morning. We'll be working with them for the coming months to try and make sure that the negative effects are not what they fear that they would be.

What you see here this afternoon is the government and the opposition debating an amendment which the opposition has moved, essentially wanting to delay this whole matter, even though they know that the HST, by federal law, will come into effect on July 1 of this year. Such a bizarre outcome, should it happen…. It won't, because we have the majority, and although the Leader of the Opposition has said many times that she hopes to turn seven of our members to their side in such a vote, that won't happen. And if it did, things would be chaotic because it would disorganize everything.

The federal law would still be in effect, and we, instead of being the leading economy in Canada, which we've become under the leadership of our Premier and under the B.C. Liberal government in place since 2001 — nine years now, almost — would go from being the leading economy in Canada to becoming very disorganized. It's a bizarre and ridiculous thing for the opposition to be wasting the month of April on this initiative.

The global economy has been very tough for the last 18 months — going on two years, actually. We want to see the recovery that has started accelerate. We were one of the last jurisdictions in the world to be hauled into the whirlpool of this worldwide recession, and we are one of the first and strongest coming out of it.

We're hitting all of our financial targets. We had to budget for a $2.7 billion deficit last year, and that really goes against our grain. We don't believe in deficits. We don't believe in running up debt. We don't think it's fair that taxpayers of tomorrow and the indefinite future would have to spend their tax money overcoming the problems that governments of our day and previous have left them.

We worked hard to pay off debt all through our first seven years in office, and we've been absolutely dismayed to have to run a deficit last year and this year. But we'll get back to paying off debts, and the first ones we'll pay off will be those deficits we've had to run.

We want the private sector to flourish, and they told us time and again — job creators told us; investors told us — that harmonized sales tax would be a tremendous boon to them in terms of getting rid of the layers and layers of taxation that exist presently and have existed for many years in British Columbia, and in terms of saving them a tremendous amount of administrative burden doing government's books. We want the private sector to flourish because that's where the jobs are created that build the economy.

[1525]

We're working hard to support families in British Columbia, and our throne speech and our budget this year are all about that. We care very deeply about the less fortunate in our society. With the HST, as with everything we've done, we've ensured that lower-income people are protected against possible negative effects, and 1.1 million British Columbians will get HST rebate cheques.

Our government, with its fiscal prudence, has led Canada — one of the leaders in Canada in our economy — and Canada has led the world in resisting the effects of this worldwide recession. The fact that we have a sound fiscal plan in British Columbia, the fact that we exercise fiscal prudence, is the reason why people have so much confidence in British Columbia and why they've been moving here and creating jobs.

In spite of the worldwide recession, we're still hundreds of thousands of jobs better off in British Columbia than we were when the NDP lost power after the sad decade of the 1990s. So it truly is, in my mind, a waste of time — and I think in the mind of anybody who is really following this debate — for us to spend the month of April of the spring sitting of this Legislature in an attempt by the NDP opposition to somehow stop us from eliminating provincial sales tax. That's what this debate has been all about.

[C. Trevena in the chair.]

For most taxpayers, British Columbians' personal income taxes have been reduced by 37 percent or more since 2001. Some 325,000 low-income British Columbians pay no provincial income tax whatsoever. We've lowered the small business tax rate from 4.5 percent to 2.5 percent — the second lowest in Canada. And we're on track with all our financial targets so that by April 1, 2012, we're going to drop the small business income tax rate to zero — the lowest in Canada. That's a very good thing for a sector that employs 1.05 million British Columbians.

It was only since we became government that we passed the point where two million British Columbians are drawing paycheques. You think about that. That's an achievement that the previous government and any before them never reached. We're way past two million now, but 1.05 million work for small business.

[ Page 4575 ]

Just before this recession we were all facing a human resources shortage. The government was; the private sector was. Businesses big and small. It was really tough to get the number of employees that they needed.

Small business people would tell me, when I was responsible as minister for their sector, that they couldn't find anyone to purchase their businesses when they were ready to retire. Their children didn't want to because there were so many other things that they could be doing, and many of them didn't want to work as hard as their parents had, to put in the long hours building a business and so on. Small business people work very hard.

We're going to be back to that soon, and the HST is going to take a burden off those small businesses, and it's going to make us a more attractive place to investment. It's going to create hundreds of thousands of jobs in British Columbia.

In spite of the recession, we're presently at an average wage of over $21 for working British Columbians. We're at an average wage for youth of over $13, and that's quite an achievement. It makes small business and businesses of all sizes wonder why the NDP opposition continually harangues us about raising the minimum wage. The $13-an-hour average for young people is well above the minimum wage, well above any minimum wage in this country.

I listened to the member for Saanich South, and I quite like her. She's a very honest person, a good person and sincere. She said that she's been embarrassed by the debate in this House, and I would be embarrassed if I was her and on that side of the House and heard the things that people are saying.

What I'm sure they know is that they aren't accurate. They must know that. They've said that things will have HST applied to them when they surely know or should know that they won't. They have been relying on Bill Vander Zalm, of all people, with his website full of errors.

[1530]

He and Chris Delaney are mounting this petition campaign, going around spreading false news all around the province, and 18 NDP MLAs have signed up to go work for Bill Vander Zalm, of all things, as a canvasser.

They used to oppose him vehemently and say that he was the worst Premier that British Columbia ever had. I think they're right about that. The way he ended his career in provincial politics was an absolute disgrace — a paper bag full of cash in a parking lot on a real estate deal; a Conflict-of-Interest Commissioner's review, where the commissioner just couldn't believe the lack of understanding that Mr. Vander Zalm had, presumably still has, of the difference between right and wrong.

Deputy Speaker: Minister, if I might remind you, we're talking about the motion.

Hon. K. Krueger: We are indeed talking about an amendment to this bill, which attempts further to delay and derail the elimination of the provincial sales tax.

That whole caucus, throughout this debate, has been offering false news and misrepresentations and is in league with Mr. Vander Zalm, of all people, in these initiatives.

The member for Saanich South talked about farmers and farming, a subject near and dear to my heart. I used to be a farmer. My father was a farmer as he grew up and went off to the Second World War. He was in the army, went up the beach at D-Day. He didn't want to shoot people, so he was a stretcher-bearer. He saw terrible things, and he was determined that governments would never, never resort to that sort of violence if there was anything he could do about it.

He made me think about issues all my life. One of the issues we talked about, of course, was farming. We homesteaded 1,600 acres in the North Peace River. We started off with bush, trees and, regrettably, some muskeg and turned it into a productive farm — a thousand acres cleared over the course of my childhood. So the things that the member raised about the difficulties of our agriculture industry are things that I care about very deeply, and so do my colleagues on this side of the House.

The member for Saanich South made it clear she doesn't approve of people wanting to impute motives to other people and pigeonhole people and make generalizations about them. She'd like this place to be honourable, she said. I think it's dishonourable to take positions, to allege things about the government caucus and our intentions with the HST that the members know or should know are false.

The federal government put very substantial incentives….

Deputy Speaker: Minister, I'd ask you to be very careful about your language. I'll remind you that we're talking about the motion.

Hon. K. Krueger: Yes, Madam Speaker.

In negotiating with the province to implement a harmonized sales tax, the federal government put very substantial incentives on the table — $1.6 billion, for one. People on the other side talk as though that's money that somehow the government is putting in its own pocket, when the books are very clear.

The books are constantly audited by the Auditor General. Everybody knows what we spend on health care. Everybody knows what we spend on education. Everybody knows what we spend on social services, on the services of the Ministry of Children and Families.

That money is needed to meet the needs of British Columbians without going even deeper into deficit and debt. It's not money for the government. It's money for

[ Page 4576 ]

the services to British Columbians, and it was a very welcome bonus when the negotiations took place, a welcome bonus for British Columbia.

The HST had become the right thing to do regardless of a bonus, regardless of the fact that the federal government would take almost 400 people off of the provincial payroll, would become their employer for the rest of their working lives and take care of their pensions. That was part of the package.

The fact was that the largest economy in Canada, Ontario's economy, had moved to harmonized sales tax, and if we did not respond, we would be left in a position of not being able to compete with Ontario to attract investment, to attract job creation, to employ more British Columbians. It was the right thing to do.

The federal government, for the first time, offered us latitude, offered us the ability to charge a smaller HST than what had been required up until those negotiations. It always had to be 13 percent. It's only going to be 12 in British Columbia which, for almost everything, is just the sum of the existing 5 percent GST and 7 percent PST. So once again, we'll have the lowest taxes in Canada, with regard to HST, of all the provinces that use HST.

[1535]

Already we've got the lowest taxes in Canada for income tax up to $118,000 income. As a British Columbian, you keep more of that money in your pocket. If you're a British Columbian business, you keep more of that money in your bank account than you would anywhere else in the province — the money that you have earned.

The NDP decried our income tax cuts for years and said they were giveaways. I've never been able to understand that. Why would you call allowing someone to keep their own money a giveaway to that person? It's allowing them simply to keep their own money.

As I said, the member for Saanich South spoke fondly of farmers and agriculture. I feel the same way. My dad was a farmer. In the winters up in the Peace River country you couldn't do any farming. Everything was frozen solid, often deeply covered by snow. My dad would go to work on the W.A.C. Bennett dam. He was a great handyman. He built his own carpenter's carry boxes for his tools. I remember looking at him as a kid, and off he went to work, to the W.A.C. Bennett dam.

In those days the government ridiculed W.A.C. Bennett. They called him Wacky. They made fun of his initials. But he was a great man, and he did great things for British Columbia.

One of them — everyone speaks of it and thinks of it when they think of him — was the creation of the wonderful hydroelectric legacy that British Columbia has profited from ever since. That has led to huge numbers of jobs being created and still makes us a tremendously attractive jurisdiction.

The Silicon Valley talks about the reliable hydroelectricity that we have from here. Down there when you suffer brownouts, which they have had some problems with in the past, it's a very serious issue for those businesses in that mighty industry.

They love British Columbia's power, and they're willing to pay a premium for it when they need it. We're going to have more of that if the consultations with First Nations that are underway and the environmental review come to the conclusion that we hope for. We're going to have a third dam on the Peace River, and it's going to add 30 percent to what the big dam that was first built is able to generate. It's going to be enough to power 410,000 homes.

Deputy Speaker: Minister. Minister, I would like to bring you back to the debate on the motion, the amendment to Bill 9. If I might just read in the amendment again to remind you.

It's: "Be it resolved that Bill 9 not be read a second time now but that the subject matter be forwarded to the Select Standing Committee on Finance and Government Services and further that the committee be empowered to invite witnesses to appear before it to assist in its deliberation."

To remind you that that's the issue we're debating, Minister.

Hon. K. Krueger: Thank you, Madam Speaker. I was just getting back to that.

The point is that when we create these hundreds of thousands of jobs as a result of the implementation of the HST, people will be very glad that this NDP opposition was not able to derail this legislation with this amendment. That would be an incredibly negative, disruptive, perverse result for us. It's not something that we want to see.

The restaurant industry and the tourism industry in British Columbia are part of my mandate, obviously, as Minister Responsible for Tourism, Culture and the Arts. It has been one of the industries that has been the most concerned about HST. But many people don't realize the benefits to the restaurant and the tourism industries of eliminating PST, which is built in at many levels of their business — into the products that they use in the course of providing goods and services.

Today for most products they purchase other than food, restaurants pay 5 percent GST and 7 percent PST but only get the 5 percent GST back. They'll get the full sum, the 12 percent, back when the HST is in effect. But if the opposition were successful with this amendment, this attempt to disrupt the operations of government, it would be a real issue. It'd interfere with our ability to deliver these benefits. As of July 1, 2010, with the HST, restaurants, tourism industries will get a full refund of the 12 percent HST.

As business entities, restaurants will derive the same benefits of the HST that any other business will — a

[ Page 4577 ]

reduction in costs — when the embedded PST comes out of the business inputs for things like linen, dishes, cutlery, cooking equipment, fridges, stoves, brochures, uniforms, signage, renovations, the construction of new businesses.

[1540]

Our economy is going to flourish again, and one of the reasons it'll flourish is the tremendously successful staging of the Olympics that British Columbia just completed — the best Winter Olympics in history, pretty much everyone is saying. It brought attention to this province that is going to bring tourists and investors here, who would very likely have to consider going to Ontario instead if this opposition were successful in its attempts to prevent us from implementing a harmonized sales tax when Ontario is doing so.

I've been concerned for the restaurant industry that they've been creating a self-fulfilling prophecy by frightening customers about the HST. Customers could easily think it was already in effect by the amount of noise that's been created and the illusion that the HST will cause huge price increases. It shouldn't, and it won't.

Competition will be an ameliorating factor to keep businesses from inflating prices with the excuse of the HST. The HST itself, when people really think about it….

I asked the lobbyist who came to me from McDonald's, lobbying against the HST: "What does your average customer pay for a meal in McDonald's?" He said it was $7. So the HST is only going to add 49 cents to the cost of an average meal for his customers. I said: "Do you honestly think anybody is not going to come to your McDonald's because it's going to cost them an average of 49 cents more?" He looked like it was the first time he'd realized that.

People talk about what they think the GST did to business back when it was first implemented. We're in a whole different world than we were then. The world has changed with this recession, and it's changed forever. It's not going back to the way it was before.

We're one of the strongest economies in Canada, which is one of the strongest economies in the world, and harmonized sales tax is a progressive way to go. Value-added taxes have been implemented right across Europe at substantially larger percentages than the HST will be charged here in British Columbia, at 12 percent. Many of them are up to 20 percent in economies that are considered very progressive around the world.

The HST is a shift to a consumption-based tax system with consumers deciding where and how they spend their hard-earned dollars. The member for Saanich South is very fond of bicycles, as am I, and very energetic in her work with bicycles. Well, a bicycle costs a whole lot less than a motorcycle. People who choose to buy bicycles and ride them will pay a fraction of what people pay for motorcycles.

You only pay HST on what you spend. People who have lots of money to spend will spend 12 percent of that on items that are taxable with the HST. People who have a little money to spend will only pay HST on that, commensurate with the amount of spending that they actually do. What could be more fair than a tax that a person has control over entirely, which is applied across the spectrum to the rich and to the poor but with HST credits for the low-income people?

The HST will enhance competitiveness, it will stimulate economic growth, and it will encourage investment and job creation. So this amendment, in my mind, is folly. It's preposterous, and it's hard to believe that anyone is serious about wanting to do it and that it isn't just a tactic for churning up the time of this House when we could be getting on with helping British Columbia accelerate out of the recession and get back in the black, which is where we're going to go.

If every British Columbian keeps more of his or her paycheque than any other Canadians up to $118,000 in income, if every British Columbian pays the lowest HST of any province with HST in Canada and if every British Columbian knows that this government has cut taxes over 120 times and has every intention of cutting them further — as we can — then why wouldn't everybody want to be a British Columbian? I think many people do. You'll only be paying HST on what you spend. If you have less to spend, you have less to pay.

It is difficult to see why this opposition pours its time into such an unproductive exercise as this. We want a strong economy in British Columbia again, which provides jobs and better incomes for more British Columbians and which benefits all sectors, including the tourism and restaurant industries, where all sectors reap the rewards of economic growth and rising incomes.

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We've seen a steady increase in people's income in British Columbia with this government. We saw the opposite under the NDP government of the '90s. There were 400,000 people on welfare in the '90s in British Columbia, and it was directly attributable to government policies of overtaxation and overregulation.

Restaurants, tourism venues and industries across the board will benefit from a more efficient and streamlined tax system, considerably lowering their administration costs and reducing their paperwork.

It's true. We didn't exempt lattes; we didn't exempt cappuccinos. We exempted home heating costs; we exempted the fuel to fill up your car or truck. We are creating a situation where businesses will be able to build new businesses and do renovations with substantially less taxation built in than they've had up until now. It'll be far less expensive to do those things with the HST.

Not only will the provincial tax portion of HST become reclaimable, but HST will lower the costs of goods

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and services. A $1 million renovation job, where today the business renovating that property could claim a $50,000 GST credit, will allow a $120,000 HST credit on July 1, 2010. It's $70,000 more to employ more people in British Columbia's economy.

To help support tourist communities and regional destination marketing organizations, the 2 percent AHRT, the additional hotel room tax that many tourist communities have in place — 50 of them now — will remain. The Finance Minister wrote an e-mail early on to assure people that until the end of June 2011, things would continue exactly as they are.

We have every intention of making sure that we continue with this three-tier marketing program — community destination marketing organizations, regional destination marketing organizations and the ministry itself, the Ministry of Tourism, Culture and the Arts — so that we can continue to market tourism in the progressive, successful and orderly way that we have.

Once again, we don't need the disadvantage of having a different sales tax system than the provinces of the country that we compete with. We want to be the leading economy in Canada — as we already are and have been for some years, since we eliminated the deficits we inherited from the NDP government of the '90s.

The province will have time to consult fully with stakeholders between now and the middle of 2011 to decide how we're going to go about continuing the AHRT-style arrangement.

Getting to the close of my remarks, I want to talk about the damage that is done in this place when false news is propagated, when seniors are frightened by things that people say are hanging over their heads and that aren't. I want to talk about the damage to civil servants and their reputation.

I want to talk about Rick Turner, a great man in British Columbia who does yeoman service for British Columbians chairing the Insurance Corporation of B.C. His term is coming to a conclusion, although he extended it for us. He chaired the B.C. Lottery Corporation. His reputation has been sullied by the members opposite when he did nothing untoward. His name has been mudslung by the NDP opposition throughout recent weeks, and it's just wrong.

Every time they frighten seniors about the HST….

Deputy Speaker: Minister. Minister. Please return to….

Hon. K. Krueger: Every time they frighten seniors about its effect on them, that is wrong. Fear makes people sick. Fear causes people's health to deteriorate, and those things should not be said.

Interjections.

Hon. K. Krueger: People who are living in poverty. The NDP member opposite raises poverty. People who live in poverty won't be paying HST. They'll have HST credits. They'll be protected, as they constantly are by this government.

I urge the members opposite to stop slurring a good man like Rick Turner, to stop frightening British Columbians and delivering false news, and to get out of bed with Bill Vander Zalm once and for all.

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M. Elmore: It's my privilege to stand here and take my place speaking in favour of the motion to refer Bill 9 to the Select Standing Committee on Finance and Government Services and to allow the committee to invite witnesses to appear before it to assist in its deliberations.

I'm going to talk about the main argument, in terms of the referral of this motion to allow an opportunity for Bill 9 to be considered and to have some discussion and debate. The main arguments I have around that reflect and are held by the majority of British Columbians in terms of their desire to have an opportunity to voice their concerns and have discussion about the proposed HST.

Bill 9 and the HST, the harmonized sales tax. We've heard a number of arguments from the government and, as well, arguments against the HST. That's part of the democratic process in terms of debating issues, public policy changes or legislation. But I think what is distinctive about the HST, and why I'm in favour of the motion to refer, is the public sentiment and the disappointment, I would say, of the public in terms of the process and how the HST was proposed by the government.

To start off, during the election the government, the Liberals, explicitly said — they made a promise in writing — that they weren't going to implement the HST. They were asked, and they put it in writing that they had no intentions and that it was not on the agenda to implement the HST.

We heard earlier this week, through documents obtained under freedom of information, that there were indeed discussions that were happening three days after the election in May between bureaucrats in the Ministry of Finance. Discussions were happening between British Columbia and Ottawa on the implementation of the HST.

Certainly, in my time in British Columbia and being involved in community issues, I haven't seen anything like it in terms of the visceral response from voters, from constituents, from businesses.

As reflected in the recent polling numbers, 82 percent of British Columbians are opposed to the HST. I think that fundamentally speaks to the perception in the public of the lack of a democratic process, the lack of an opportunity for people to voice their concerns one way

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or another about the HST, the lack of an opportunity to have the debate and discussion about arguments for and against the HST.

I think it fundamentally reflects that from the public. Certainly, when I was on the doorsteps last weekend — I often do that in Vancouver-Kensington, go door to door talking to people about their feedback on the HST — it was pretty much overwhelming in terms of people who were disappointed about the HST itself, in terms of their views that it's an unfair tax and an unfair tax shift onto consumers.

I also heard a very similar and consistent theme of the disappointment of voters and their disillusionment with the government. They felt that they were deceived by this government and the broken election promise on the HST.

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I think that is what we're seeing, fundamentally, right across the province from a broad spectrum of people from every walk of life, constituents of mine and also constituents I know from rural areas to urban areas and suburban areas on Vancouver Island. I think that's a theme that certainly is resonating.

I was reflecting on that in terms of getting a sense of the public disappointment in the government's decision to introduce the HST in this manner when they had explicitly said during the election that they weren't going to bring it.

The motion to refer to committee will be an opportunity to at least have some discussion around the merits and the criticisms of the legislation and also an opportunity to have witnesses present and organizations and individuals attend and have their say in terms of their feedback to the legislation. It's an opportunity to bring those voices out. The opposition that we're seeing and hearing, which is manifesting, reflects a desire to have a say in the democratic process.

In terms of the response and the opposition to the HST, I think it also shows a disappointment in the deception of the government in breaking their election promise. It also shows — unparalleled in terms of my years here, anyway — quite a resurgence of grass-roots democracy and of people spontaneously participating in their communities, in shopping malls, on street corners, talking to their neighbours.

There is a real desire for people to express their opposition to the HST. They're doing that on the streets, and they're ho