December 14, 2004 HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY

PROCEEDINGS Vol XLV No. 57

The House met at 1:30 p.m.

MR. SPEAKER (Hodder): Order, please!

Admit strangers.

Statements by Members

MR. SPEAKER: This afternoon we have members' statements as follows: the

hon. the Member for the Bay of Islands; the hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans;

and the hon. the Member for Carbonear-Harbour Grace.

The hon. the Member for the Bay of Islands.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. JOYCE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise in the House today to extend congratulations to an organization in my

district that has provided unwavering commitment and support to the community

for many years. On Friday, November 12, I had the honour of attending the

twenty-fifth anniversary of the Curling Lions Club. There are currently sixteen

members with the Club with one charter member, Mr. Roy Curtis, who has been with

the Club since its beginning in 1979.

This organization is very active in the community. They are continuously

raising funds through various weekly events such as card games, bingo, and every

winter there is an annual skidoo-a-thon for the Max Simms Lions Camp. Thousands

of dollars have been raised over the years, and funds raised are given back to

the community through donations to organizations such as the CNIB, Children's

Wish Foundation, Western Memorial Regional Hospital Foundation, as well as

sponsors for the Drug and Diabetes Awareness Programs, annual elementary school

speak-offs, sports groups and the annual seniors and children's Christmas

parties. In addition to this, the Club provides assistance, when required, to

individuals needing to travel outside the area for medical purposes.

The majority of the Curling Lions members have been recipients of Life

Membership in the Lions Foundation of Canada.

Since 1997, ladies have been accepted as members into the Lions Club

International, and the Curling Lions Club was no exception. In 2000-2001, the

top three positions of the Club - President, Secretary and Treasurer - were held

by ladies, and today the Club is chaired by President Brenda Hann.

I ask all members to join me in congratulating this group of men and women

for their continued dedication and service to their community.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans.

MS THISTLE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to rise today to advise all hon. colleagues, and

indeed all Newfoundlanders and Labradorians, that the Town of Grand

Falls-Windsor is about to celebrate "People, Power and Paper - 100 years in

the industrial heartland." The year-long celebration will get underway when

we ring in the New Year and will continue for all of 2005.

Mr. Speaker, the history of Grand Falls-Windsor and its economic importance

to the entire Province will be celebrated in this coming year. The area was

first settled in 1905, when representatives from the London Daily Mail

established the site for Newfoundland's first pulp and paper mill. Under the

leadership of the Harmsworth brothers, the Anglo-Newfoundland Development

Company attracted workers from all over the colony, the mainland of North

America and Europe.

In March of 2002, the Grand Falls-Windsor Centennial Committee was formed to

organize an appropriate commemoration of the town's one hundredth anniversary,

and what a celebration it will be. Committee Chair, Mr. Paul Hennessey, and his

ten-person team have put together a year of activities to which our entire

Province will be proud. From the official opening on January 7 to the closing in

December 2005, there will be carnivals, festivals, reunions of all kinds. We

will welcome visitors, celebrate with family and honour citizens, such as former

resident and patron of our centennial celebration, Mr. Gordon Pinsent, who will

celebrate his 75 th birthday in Grand Falls-Windsor in July, with

celebration and re-naming of the Arts and Culture Centre in his honour.

I encourage everyone to visit Grand Falls-Windsor during 2005 and share in

the exciting line-up of special events. Information on all of these activities

can be found on their Web site www.grandfallswindsor.com.

Mr. Speaker, I ask all Members of this hon. House of Assembly to join in

congratulating the Town of Grand Falls-Windsor on its 100 th

Anniversary. Grand Falls-Windsor is definitely the place to be in 2005 and I

hope you can all join us in this milestone celebration.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Carbonear-Harbour Grace.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SWEENEY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise today to recognize and congratulate a constituent of mine who recently

had tremendous success in the sport of wrestling at a tournament in my district.

Mr. Speaker, Ryan Wrice of Carbonear got involved with wrestling four years

ago. Since then, he has improved his abilities by practicing and competing in

tough competitions.

Ryan demonstrated how well he developed in the sport by using patience and

skill during last week's first invitational ranking wrestling tournament in

Carbonear. He defeated another athlete from Corner Brook with a second round pin

in a very tough match that earned him a gold medal in the eighty-one kilogram

weight class.

Growing on this success, Ryan is presently hoping for a placing with the

wrestling team to compete at the 2005 Canada Summer Games in Regina,

Saskatchewan. I am sure, Mr. Speaker, that after this most recent success and

with more work in the coming months, Ryan will have no trouble cracking the

roster and I know he will make all Newfoundlanders and Labradorians very proud.

Mr. Speaker, I ask all members of this hon. House to join me in

congratulating Mr. Ryan Wrice of Carbonear on his recent athletic achievements

and wish him the best of luck as he continues with his athletic work.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Statements by Ministers.

Statements by Ministers

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Transportation and Works, and

Aboriginal Affairs.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. RIDEOUT: Thank you.

Mr. Speaker, I rise in this hon. House today to provide members with an

update on the fuel situation in Rigolet.

As hon. members know, the Town of Rigolet has not had a commercial fuel

retailer for the last number of years. Subsequent to a fuel spill in the

community in 2002, the previous operator withdrew from the community, leaving

the town council to run the gas bar. While efforts have continued to identify a

private sector operator, none has been found to date. The community has

encountered a number of challenges, including fuel shortages, as it attempted to

deal with the situation.

In mid-August, the Premier visited the community and met with the town

council of Rigolet where he had a briefing on the fuel shortage and associated

difficulties. A week later, I visited Rigolet and held a similar meeting with

the town council and officials in Rigolet. Following these two meetings, the

Premier and myself directed our officials to continue working with the community

to resolve the issue.

Mr. Speaker, during the summer, the Town of Rigolet took on the

responsibility of retailing gasoline and fuel, and brought in product in 205

litre drums. Town officials dispensed the rationed fuel from the town council

garage. The Department of Transportation and Works responded to the situation by

providing free freight on all the shipments of fuel in drums to and from Rigolet.

This helped greatly in lessening the operating costs for the town.

Mr. Speaker, while this temporary fuel supply system was in place, provincial

officials were working to assist the mayor, councillors and town officials with

developing short and long-term plans to solve the problems. For the short-term,

and in order to get sufficient fuel into Rigolet before freeze up closed marine

navigation, the mayor and council approached the government for financial

assistance.

The Department of Labrador and Aboriginal Affairs provided $5,400 to the town

to purchase a replacement dispensing pump. My colleague, the Minister of

Municipal and Provincial Affairs, responded with a Special Assistance Grant of

$15,292 to purchase two new storage tanks, to ensure adequate capacity to

prevent a fuel shortage before new stock could be delivered after the spring

breakup. The purchase was cost-shared, with the grant covering 80 per cent of

the cost, and the town covering the remaining 20 per cent.

The Department of Transportation and Works also absorbed the transportation

charges for the tanks and the pump. Minister Byrne also gave approval for the

Town of Rigolet to borrow $250,000 to purchase gasoline and fuel product to

supply the community until marine shipping resumes in 2005.

Mr. Speaker, on November 16, 2004, the tanker, Sybil W , delivered

gasoline and fuel oil to the tanks in the town. There was a shortfall in the

amount of gasoline delivered. Over the next week, the town council, provincial

officials and the owners of the tanker worked out arrangements to send the

tanker back with the rest of the order.

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to inform this hon. House that the Sybil W

has delivered the last 30,000 litres of gasoline and the community is now out of

the gas crunch that they went through in late summer and fall. The two new

storage tanks and the gas pump have been successfully installed and are

operational.

The Department of Labrador and Aboriginal Affairs remains committed to

working with the town in the new year to achieve the goal of identifying a

private sector operator to take over retail fuel sales in Rigolet.

Mr. Speaker, reaching this stage of the project is clearly the result of an

excellent working relationship developed between the Province, the Town of

Rigolet and all other parties involved. I express gratitude to all those

involved for their hard work. We look forward to working with them in future as

we move forward toward a long-term solution for the people of Rigolet.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I thank the minister for a copy of his statement. My colleague, the Member

for Torngat Mountains, is unavailable to be here today as he is attending to

some business in his district, but I know he would be pleased to hear that the

fuel supply in Rigolet has been replenished for this year.

Mr. Speaker, I know, as a member who represents a rural district, that it is

getting harder and harder, I find, to be able to depend on the services that are

being provided by the private sector in a lot of these small communities. I

guess that, as we see a trend in the Province of moving towards urbanization, it

makes it even more difficult for rural communities, which are the backbone and

the fabric of Newfoundland and Labrador, to be able to maintain the services

that they have and provide good services to people.

Mr. Speaker, as I see it, government has no option in cases like this but to

intervene and to work with communities and to work with groups in the area to

ensure that services are maintained to these particular communities. This is a

problem that has existed in Rigolet for the past three years and, as we speak

today, there are other communities in Labrador that have a fuel shortage as

well. I am sure the minister is aware of that. The communities of Norman Bay and

Williams Harbour have also seen the suppliers of fuel pull out of those

communities. In fact, some of them this fall took their fuel storage tanks out

of those communities altogether, so this is a problem that is continuing to

exist in Labrador.

I think there has to be a permanent solution found to it. While I appreciate

the efforts of the minister this year again in putting a temporary system in

place to get fuel there, I do not think we can depend upon that year after year.

I know this year, through the summer and through the fall, there was a shortage

of fuel in these communities.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The member's allotted time has expired.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I will conclude my comments.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I thank the minister for an advanced copy of his statement. I would like to,

at this time, commend the Town of Rigolet and the people there for taking the

responsibility to make sure that their community has a much needed commodity as

they go into the winter months. Living in the northern isolated communities of

Labrador always presents special challenges. I am sure that the minister will

agree that there are other challenges in these communities that need action as

well. Hopefully, with everyone working together, long-term solutions will be

found to alleviate the problem.

I will say, Mr. Speaker, to the minister and the Premier, that their trip to

the coast this year did meet considerable discussions within Labrador, and I

commend them for taking the initiative to go to the North Coast of the Province,

an area of the Province that has significant needs that vary greatly from things

that we take for granted as we live our day-to-day lives in other parts of this

Province.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: Further statements by ministers?

The hon. the Minister of Human Resources, Labour and Employment.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS BURKE: Mr. Speaker, I rise today to give special recognition to the

Grand Falls-Windsor Committee Against Violence for their recent initiative to

raise awareness about violence among students in Central Newfoundland.

The Committee Against Violence is one of six regional co-ordinating

committees funded by the Violence Prevention Initiative, a government-community

partnership to develop and implement long-term solutions to the problem of

violence against those most at risk in our society.

Last month, the committee sponsored the play, Broken Hearts, Broken Homes ,

which focuses on five students and how violence has affected their lives.

Although the issues they face are difficult ones, their lives are turned around

through the intervention of a teacher. The play expresses positive messages of

hope, and both the characters in the play and those watching realize they do not

have to deal with violence on their own.

I would like to highlight the generosity of the Fry Family Foundation, which

provided funding for the project. In addition to paying for the fourteen shows,

which were seen by over 5,000 people, approximately 4,800 of them students, they

also paid for a co-ordinator for the event and the cost to bus those students to

the shows. Students from thirty-six schools as far away as Baie Verte,

Twillingate and Hare Bay attended the shows in Grand Falls-Windsor and Gander.

The Committee Against Violence was able to make sure no school was left out

because of the financial cost of attending, and opened the event free of charge

to others interested in attending, requiring food bank donations only. They are

now working towards bringing the play to other regions in the Province, and are

even considering creating a video.

The Committee Against Violence is a prime example of the positive work being

done to eliminate violence in this Province, and I congratulate them on their

efforts.

Thank you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I am pleased to respond to the statement, and I would like to ask the

minister for the courtesy of providing me a copy of her statement in the future

before we come to the House.

Mr. Speaker, I think anything that can be done in our society and in our

Province to work towards violence prevention needs to be commended. I am pleased

today to commend the people in Grand Falls and the Committee against Violence

for the work they have done in taking their play right to the schools and to the

community. I think, Mr. Speaker, all of us who work for safe and peaceful

communities in our Province need to do so, ensuring that the message we have to

preach is reaching those who need to hear it.

I commend the group in Grand Falls and I also, as this time, Mr. Speaker,

commend the work that is being done by the Violence Prevention Initiative in

Newfoundland and Labrador. They have done some great things over the past year,

and I am sure that they are happy to see groups like this one move forward and

also get involved with violence prevention in our communities and in our

society.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I would like to respond to the minister's statement. We didn't receive a

copy in advance either.

I think the topic of your statement addresses an important issue in our

society and one that certainly needs to be highlighted, violence against youth

and gender violence.

I want to ask the minister: Given the fact that she is concerned about this,

by issuing a statement today, what plans does she and her government have to

increase funding towards anti-bullying in our schools and gender violence in our

Province.

I would also like to point out, that violence with youth has certainly

increased, and if -

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The member's allotted time has expired.

MR. COLLINS: By leave, Mr. Speaker?

MR. SPEAKER: By leave?

AN HON. MEMBER: By leave.

MR. SPEAKER: By leave.

MR. COLLINS: If we follow the news in the country today, in the last few

days, we hear many stories about violence from house parties, new electronic

means to advise people that parties are taking place when the parents are gone,

and all of these issues, Mr. Speaker.

It is an important issue and I commend the people who took the time to put

this together and the students who attended.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I know my colleagues opposite are saying, this is about the second statement

we didn't get, but I just want to rise on a point of clarification, Mr.

Speaker.

The responsibility to get ministerial statements to members opposite comes

from my office, so I don't want anybody to think that there was an intention

on the minister's part not to give the statement. There obviously was a glitch

today. I do offer my apologies to members opposite. All of that is channeled

through my office as Government House Leader, so obviously there was a slight

problem. If there was, we will correct it, and certainly we will do our best to

see it doesn't happen again. I think members can attest to the fact that up

until this point every ministerial statement that has been given in this House

has been at their office at least a half hour beforehand.

I do offer that apology to members opposite, Mr. Speaker, and ensure that it

doesn't happen again.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: Further Statements by Ministers? Oral Questions.

Oral Questions

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. GRIMES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to commend the Government House Leader for his very

open and accountable approach to the issue he just addressed.

Mr. Speaker, yesterday in the House, I raised issues regarding the review of

the electoral boundaries and the work done to date. The Minister of Justice

confirmed that government unilaterally decided to postpone the mandatory ten

year review as stated in the Electoral Boundaries Act and not begin this review

process until 2006. The now disbanded Commission, Mr. Speaker, has already spent

over $100,000 reviewing the boundaries before their office was closed.

I ask the Premier, Mr. Speaker, what legal authority did his government have

to change this ten year time frame, and will the government change the law to

legitimize the new review period before a new Commission is appointed?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Justice and Attorney General.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. T. MARSHALL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I thank the hon. Leader of the Opposition for his question.

Mr. Speaker, the legislation that sets out the number of seats that are used

when we have a general election is not the Electoral Boundaries Act; it is the

House of Assembly Act. It sets out that there are forty-eight seats, it sets out

the names of those seats, and it sets out the boundaries.

The Electoral Boundaries Commission is something appointed under the

Electoral Boundaries Act. It reports every ten years to provide advice to the

government, advice which the government can either accept or reject.

Unfortunately, Mr. Speaker, the previous Electoral Boundaries Commission was not

appointed with sufficient time in order to complete their work and make their

recommendation to the government before the last election.

We will ensure that the legislation is indeed amended. We will appoint a new

Commission in 2006. We will amend the act then, and we are telling the people of

this Province what we are going to do. We are being open, we are being

transparent and we are being accountable.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. GRIMES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I appreciate the straight and direct answer, that the act will be amended

before the new Commission is appointed.

Mr. Speaker, the Premier is on the public record as saying, and these are his

words: In time we will attempt to reduce the size of the Legislature. His own

words. The Minister of Justice stated in the media today, and these are his

words: I think if we stuck with forty-eight seats there will not be much of a

change. A pretty self-evident statement.

Mr. Speaker, I ask the Premier: Which is the true position of the government?

Is it the intention to reduce the size of the Legislature before the next

election, or will there continue to be forty-eight seats?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, the Leader of the Opposition has indicated that my words were,

that there might be an attempt to try and reduce the number of seats. Now, an

attempt does not necessarily mean that is actually going to take place. If it

makes sense to reduce the number of seats in the Legislature, then that could

and will happen. If it does not make any sense for that to happen, then it will

not happen.

There is a process we have to go through, which we are going through and

which we will comply with, as has been indicated by the Minister of Justice, but

the statement that was made yesterday, which is another fabrication by the

Leader of the Opposition, was that we would reduce the number of seats by 25 per

cent, and that is just completely and totally inaccurate. I never said that,

never stated that, never indicated that would happen.

This is just the tactic of the hon. gentleman opposite. What he tries to do

is, he fabricates instances, he makes up a certain set of facts, and then he

tries to present them to this Legislature and to the people of Newfoundland and

Labrador as being something that is real, when they are not, so he is getting

nowhere with his games. As I told him yesterday, his credibility is diminished

right to zero, so he can continue on with his tactics but there certainly is no

plan whatsoever to reduce this Legislature, the number of seats in this

Legislature, by 25 per cent.

What you are trying to do is sort of instill in all of my own government

members that, in fact, there was some master plan to reduce their seats and to

take away the representation of the people they represent. There is nothing

further from the truth, so stop it please. You are doing an injustice to the

people of this Province.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. GRIMES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I appreciate the Premier making the speech for the purposes of his followers

on the other side, but he is certainly not going to impress anybody on this side

of the Legislature, and the people of Newfoundland and Labrador will decide who

is relevant in 2007, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, let me ask this question. Unless the government once again

ignores the legal provisions set out in the law, or makes the amendments that

the minister suggested are forthcoming, the changes that will come into effect

in 2006 will be in place until the general election of 2019. So, if it is done

in 2006, and there is a review ten years after that, there will not be any

changes until after 2016, which is three more elections. If the government

retains forty-eight seats in this next election, in 2007, will they now confirm

for the people of the Province that there will continue to be a forty-eight seat

Legislature until 2019?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Justice and Attorney General.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. T. MARSHALL: Mr. Speaker, I welcome the question from the Leader of

the Opposition. Whether or not there will be forty-eight seats, or there will be

a reduced number of seats, or an increase in the number of seats, that will be a

policy decision that the government will make as it gives consideration to

bringing forward the amendments to the legislation in 2006.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. GRIMES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

So, we look forward to the decision being taken in line with what the Premier

has said, that there is a 25 per cent reduction in the public service

justifiable, a 25 per cent reduction in the Cabinet, and therefore a smaller

House, when the time permits.

Mr. Speaker, let me move to this question. Population trends are seeing fewer

people living in the rural areas in Newfoundland and Labrador. Recent government

decisions have certainly accelerated this trend in places like Harbour Breton

and others. If this government does as it intends, and waits until 2006 to

complete the review, there will be fewer people living in the rural parts of

Newfoundland and Labrador and likely fewer seats representing those areas even

if there are forty-eight seats in this Legislature. I ask the minister: Is he

postponing this review process to legitimize the government's real intention,

which is to decrease the number of rural representatives in this Legislature?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Justice and Attorney General.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. T. MARSHALL: Mr. Speaker, this government feels very strongly and

very passionately about the people of rural Newfoundland.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. T. MARSHALL: We take what the hon. the Leader of the Opposition said

about making sure that rural Newfoundland is strongly represented in this House

very, very seriously. I am advised by the past Chairman of the Electoral

Boundaries Commission that, if forty-eight seats are maintained, there will be

very little effect on the existing boundaries, and rural Newfoundland will not

be prejudiced and will not be materially affected in an adverse way, if

forty-eight seats are maintained.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. GRIMES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I would suggest he should check again and get some information about

population trends in Newfoundland and Labrador in the last ten years and for the

next couple.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to touch on a couple of other issues regarding

discrepancies in government legislation and policy positions that are causing

concern in the Province. The Minister of Human Resources, Labour and Employment,

stated in this Legislature that the government that she is part of would very

much like to give the NAPE employees retroactive pay equity but the government

just could not afford it. However, when an amendment came forward in this

Legislature yesterday, that would have provided an opportunity to give equal

treatment to female past-presidents of the Nurses' Union at absolutely no cost

to government, they refused to implement this equitable policy with no cost

whatsoever to the government.

I ask the Premier: How can the government reconcile these two conflicting

statements and actions?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

There is no trouble to reconcile it because they are not contradictory, I say

to the Leader of the Opposition. Number one, it would be inequity if we did not

do it. Presidents of NAPE have been predominately male, presidents of NLTA have

been almost exclusively male, the President of the Newfoundland and Labrador

Nurses' Union have been predominately female. We wanted them to have the same

opportunity to have pensionable service as the President of NLNU as NAPE, as the

NLTA. By not doing that, it would be discriminatory in a female dominated

profession. That is one of the reasons and the other reason it is not

retroactive, Mr. Speaker, is because there was no benefit. His government, when

he sat as Premier in this Province, brought the same bill we brought to this

House without one word of change, endorsed by their Cabinet, ready to bring it

to the Legislature. We brought the same bill now and all of a sudden they shift

positions in the Legislature and they start to talk from both sides of their

mouths. Absolutely, hypocritical, Mr. Speaker! Absolutely hypocritical! We

endorsed that because it is the right thing to do.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. GRIMES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

We know who the hypocrite is when he stands and turns red in the face. It

happens every time, Mr. Speaker. I can tell you the issue is fair treatment,

which this government does not believe in and they demonstrate it in this

Legislature.

Mr. Speaker, this question with respect to the new legislation involving

changes to the Public Tender Act, which effectively excludes companies from

outside this Province from bidding on government contracts because they are

going to go to Request for Proposals instead. However, in the meantime, Mr.

Speaker, the Minister of Tourism states that the agreement on internal trade,

the interprovincial agreement on internal trade, must be followed to ensure

guides from other provinces can be permitted to work in Newfoundland and

Labrador.

I ask the Premier again, why are the rules being changed to support one group

of Newfoundland and Labrador based businesses to get more work and to leave

guides in the Province in jeopardy of being competed against by people from

outside the Province?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

First of all, Mr. Speaker, the fundamental premise of what the Leader of the

Opposition's question is about are again, completely inaccurate, erroneous,

not based on fact, and basically, Mr. Speaker, it can be, if you want to stretch

it, can be a bit of a fabrication.

I do not know where he gets the point that we have changed the Public Tender

Act to RFPs so that we can circumvent work from people coming outside the

Province. No one has ever said that. This government has never said it. The

minister responsible for the bill has never said it, period.

Now, with respect to the changes to the agreements that he talked about in

internal trade, let me ask him this: If he had so much of a problem with those

agreements, why did he sign them or was he part of a government that signed them

in 1994, if he was so concerned about Newfoundland businesses and protecting the

interests of Newfoundlanders and Labradorians?

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans.

MS THISTLE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

My question is for the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury Board.

The cornerstone of the PC Blue Book was openness and accountability, yet this

government has quickly developed a reputation for ramming legislation through

this House of Assembly without proper consultation and public input.

In today's paper the minister stated that he is not worried about public

backlash, and he did not feel the need to do consultations. This morning he also

issued a news release assuming that Bill 61 will be passed and liquor will be

sold in retail outlets on Sunday, starting in January 2005.

In the true spirit of openness and accountability, will the minister now

delay the passage of this bill and provide an opportunity for public

consultation?

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

When the former government, about six years ago, brought in Sunday shopping,

they allowed -

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. SULLIVAN: Yes, and if she wants to ask me a question on that, I will

answer that too.

In fact, Mr. Speaker -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

I ask the minister to complete his answer, quickly.

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

That former government brought in, six year ago, the Shops' Closing Act.

Under that, with that change, it effectively made 3,000 establishments then - it

brought it up to the number 3,000 establishments that could dispense alcohol,

spirits, wines, beer, et cetera, except there are 132 establishments that cannot

and there are 3,000 that can on Sundays. We wanted to level the playing field

because that government did not have the gumption to complete what they started.

Contrary to what the Official Opposition said -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the member on a supplementary.

MS THISTLE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Talking about fabrication, you could write the book.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

This afternoon we have had the word fabrication used on a number of occasions

on both sides of the House. I ask members to be very careful. The word certainly

has connotations that would be unparliamentary. In the use of that word, I ask

members to be more cognizant of the potential implications it has and I ask

members if they would avoid usage of the word in the future.

The hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans.

MS THISTLE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, Bill 61 seems to have come out of nowhere. All members of the PC

caucus were on record as being against Sunday shopping when that legislation was

passed. Yesterday government introduced this bill and before debate has started

this morning, they announced to the House that the bill will pass this week.

This shows nothing but sheer arrogance of this government and their lack of

respect for the Legislature or public input.

I ask the minister: Who is pushing this legislation, and why is there sudden

change in your parties policy?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

First of all, it does not indicate that stores will open. It gives them the

option if they so decide; the 132 that now cannot, they may decide. We are not

going to, as a government, dictate to the 108 agency stores out there whether

they are going to open or not. That is their choice. Given the opportunity, the

twenty-four Newfoundland and Labrador Liquor controlled stores, the board and

the President will decide if that is in their best interest. They may or they

may not, that is their choice.

I will indicate, Mr. Speaker, that contrary to what the Opposition said, they

said most provinces now have it. In fact, Mr. Speaker, there is not one province

in this country that has Sunday shopping and does not have the right to sell

alcohol. All seven, by the way, all seven do. There are only two provinces,

besides ours, that do not even have Sunday shopping or the sale, Nova Scotia and

Prince Edward Island.

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. SULLIVAN: The member is absolutely wrong. He needs to do better

research again because it is incorrect, and no, Mr. Speaker -

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

This afternoon, again, we have had some exchanges that have gone well over a

minute in duration. I ask members to keep their questions and their answers

under one minute.

The hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans.

MS THISTLE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

First, I would like to ask the Minister of Finance, who does the President of

the Board of the Liquor Corporation report to anyway? Mr. Speaker, the Premier

is on record in this House of Assembly of saying -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans.

MS THISTLE: Mr. Speaker, the Premier is on record as saying: The House of

Assembly is a waste of time. The minister confirmed this by laying Bill 61 on

the table one day and expecting us to pass it the next day.

Will the minister guarantee that there will be a free vote in this House on

the issue, after members are given a chance to check with their own

constituents?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I will answer both questions. I was approached about a year ago by the former

Chair of the Board, Mr. Smith, and the former CEO, Mr. Glavine, who asked to

have this on the spring agenda. I met with them again last winter, and I

indicated that we had a very cramped agenda in the spring, about thirty-five

bills, and we had significant legislation that we could not get it in the spring

agenda. They were approached previously, well over a year ago. We were

approached by the Liquor Corporation, by the prior board, and I indicated -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. SULLIVAN: I indicated that we would get this in the fall session.

Unfortunately, I was out of the Province last week. I wanted to present the bill

in the House. I am here now. If it takes Wednesday, Thursday, whatever it takes

to do it, you want ample time to do it and we will certainly allow that. That is

where it came from. There will be ample time to do it, I can tell the hon.

member.

I will answer the other question too. Six years ago I opposed Sunday

shopping, period. This side of the House, when they were there, opposed Sunday

shopping. I still don't believe that we have gone six years. We don't intend

to turn the clock back or we are not going to -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

My question is for the Minister of Natural Resources.

Minister, yesterday you announced a news conference for yourself and the

Premier today, to release the request for expressions of interest and proposals

for the development of the Lower Churchill. This morning, this news conference

was postponed. Minister, might you tell us why?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

One fundamental reason that caused a number of consequences, I guess, in

terms of - you can almost compare it to throwing a pebble into a pond and it

causes a number of ripples. This is what happened.

Late yesterday, we encountered some difficulty. The team that is responsible

for putting together all the creative ad work encountered some difficulty. Could

we get over it? Yes. But we wouldn't have gotten over it in time to meet some

of the international publications, Mr. Speaker. As a result of that, we made a

decision that before we move forward with the EOI process that once we do all

the international publications, particularly the Economist and the

electricity review, when we went out that all people would get all the

information at the same time, in an effort to ensure that we are doing the right

thing at the right time for the right reason for all the people of the Province.

That is the fundamental reason why we didn't proceed. We would have missed the

deadline, and in order for us to do it properly, to get it out to the

international community, a decision was taken.

Now, with respect to on a go forward basis, I can say to the member opposite,

and any of those interested, particularly companies or individuals in the UI,

that will proceed in a timely manner early in the new year. There will be no

interruption after that.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. PARSONS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister, on May 20, in the Estimates Committee in this House, when I asked

you if there were any discussions ongoing regarding the Lower Churchill, you

answered no. Yet, on May 21, the very next day, you personally signed a

confidentiality agreement with the Sino group about the Lower Churchill. You

also confirmed in the House this past Thursday that you personally had meetings

in your office back in January when the Sino group came knocking on your door.

Why did you tell us on May 20 there was nothing happening on the Lower

Churchill, which you knew to be incorrect?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The insinuation, I take personal exception to, I say to the member. The

question that was asked -

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. E. BYRNE: If you would like to hear the answer, I say to the

Opposition member, I will provide it. If you do not want to hear the answer and

you have your mind made up, I can sit down, thank you very much.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. E. BYRNE: Mr. Speaker, the fact of the matter is this: When we were

here in the Estimates, the member opposite asked a question about were we into

discussions with respect to the development of the Lower Churchill. My answer

was that we haven't had any discussions, serious or otherwise. We entered into

an MOU with the Sino group to look at a potential link. It was not about

potential development. It was not about anything else, other than to share

information. So, my information and answer to you in this House, and to every

member in this House, was absolutely forthright and even confirmed, I say, by

the process that we have just enacted, which is an Expression of Interest.

To date, there have been no serious discussions or negotiations with anybody

with the development of the Lower Churchill. The process that we are putting in

place is an open one, it is a transparent one, and it will deal with anybody who

is interested, and that is the process, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, one of the companies in the Sino group was under investigation

in the United States for possible terrorist links. The Premier said this would

be investigated. Instead of telling us, Minister, what you did last week, that

you were perplexed, I trust you have had time now, and maybe you can tell us if

there was, indeed, an investigation and what the findings of that investigation

might have been?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I am going to tell the member opposite about the findings of two

investigations. The first one was the finding investigation where we found that

this crowd spent $57 million of the public money without telling anybody. That

was the first investigation.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: The second -

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. E. BYRNE: Oh, yes, it is true, absolutely, Mr. Speaker, and never

went to the Public Tender Act, did it outside of the Hydro Board of Directors.

That is one investigation.

Secondly, Mr. Speaker -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. E. BYRNE: Secondly, if you want to hear about the question that you

asked, we are going to deal with our record and yours in a timely manner, face

to face, when questions like that are asked, I say to members opposite. If you

cannot take it, don't ask the question.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Obviously, I struck a nerve here. I will try again. Minister, all these

dubious answers and evasive comments and postponements lead one to believe that

you either are not in the Premier's loop when it comes to the Lower Churchill

file, or you and your department are mishandling the file. Which is it,

Minister?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: The short answer to his question, Mr. Speaker, is neither.

The long answer to his question is simply this: Was an investigation conducted?

The Premier has answered that question publicly, before.

MR. GRIMES: (Inaudible).

MR. E. BYRNE: One second, I say to the Leader of the Opposition. I am

sorry that my presence, in trying to answer your question, excites you so much,

but I will try to endeavour to answer the question anyway.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. E. BYRNE: Mr. Speaker, it is as simple as this: We have told Sino

Energy, we have told every other company, that there is an open process they

must go through. They were told that initially, when we had initial discussions

with them. They have been told it since, and any company who wants to do

business with respect to the Lower Churchill potential development will have to

go through the Expression of Interest process. All of that involves a due

diligence process, and all of it will be followed correctly.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

My question is for the Minister of Health and Community Services.

I want to say to the minister that it is really known throughout the Province

that there is a problem with wait times, for people to see doctors and in

getting services.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. COLLINS: On December 3, sixteen nurses graduated from the Primarily

Health Care Nurse Practitioner Program at MUN Centre for Nurses Studies, but

only four have yet to receive work in this Province as nurse practitioners.

During your campaign, in your Blue Book, the establishment of primary health

care clinics was a promise, with teams of professionals providing primary health

care twenty-four hours a day, seven days a weeks. These nurse practitioners have

invested their money and time in this program, anticipating they would be able

to use the skills they have developed.

I want to ask the minister: Will he use some of the $37 million in health

care funding to the Province this year to set up multi-disciplinary primary

health care centres, including the use of nurse practitioners, one way to reduce

wait times and improve the quality of health care in our Province?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. OTTENHEIMER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I thank the hon. member for his question. The whole issue of primary health

care in this Province is an important one.

I can refer specifically to the example that he has referenced, because I was

at that graduation that day and I spoke with a number of the nurse

practitioners. I might say, Mr. Speaker, that there were a number of them who

were present who had not heard, who were anticipating to hear some news in due

course, and many of them, if not all of them, were prepared to work, to return

to their traditional nursing jobs while waiting for the jobs that they had

studied for a few months earlier.

I say to the hon. member, there is work in progress. Many of these people are

anticipating work with the new health care authorities, and if they are not

successful immediately they are prepared to return to their traditional nursing

practices.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I say to the minister, if he had a full discussion with the nurse

practitioners he would also have found out that they have a fear about returning

to their former jobs, because if they do not use the knowledge that they have

gained by doing this program they will quickly lose it.

I say to the minister, the $37 million - and, by the way, there is not much

time left to spend any of that this year. Nova Scotia now, among a growing list

of provinces, has already indicated how they will use some of their funding in

their Province starting now.

I ask the minister: When can we expect the new funding to begin to provide

services to the people of the Province, and will the nurse practitioners be a

part of that new program?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. OTTENHEIMER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, this issue has been raised on a variety of occasions in the

House, and again I can reassure the hon. member that when the federal

legislation is passed, and when the flow through of funds is received, we will

address issues with respect to primary health care, issues surrounding wait

lists, wait time, Aboriginal health, the issue that is very passionate to the

hon. member, travel with respect to Labrador travel, the travel of the North.

These are the issues that will be given the attention that they so richly

deserve by this government. When we receive the funds, the necessary and

important decisions will be made.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Fortune Bay-Cape la Hune.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. LANGDON: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Yesterday was a very difficult day for me, but much more difficult for the

people of Harbour Breton and the Connaigre Peninsula. FPI has already written

the community off. The federal minister wrote off the community yesterday, when

he said he would not support the FPI quota that had traditionally and

historically been processed in Harbour Breton remaining with the town now that

FPI has left. The union leadership have done the same thing; they do not support

FPI's quota remaining in Harbour Breton.

My question is to the minister. Minister, that leaves the ball in your court.

You are the only group now that the people of Harbour Breton have any

opportunity for the survival of the town. Are you prepared to use the FPI Act

and have these quotas processing in Harbour Breton?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Fisheries and Aquaculture, and

Labrador Affairs.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. TAYLOR: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, as I have indicated previously when this matter was raised,

there is no authority in the FPI Act to force a company to process fish in a

specific community. That is an issue that falls under the authority of the

federal government and, Mr. Speaker, as much as the Member for Bellevue might

suggest that we can do it, there is no ability in provincial legislatures to

pass

an act that supersedes a federal jurisdiction. I would think that is a

basic constitutional fact, Mr. Speaker, just as there is no authority of the

federal government to pass legislation that imposes their views on our

processing sector.

Mr. Speaker, those are the facts, so let's talk about the facts. On that

matter, as I said to the member, as I said in this House yesterday and I said to

the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans, I think that he and everybody should keep

their powder dry and let's go through the process of identifying the problems

and the challenges and the opportunities in Harbour Breton. Then we will work

with the people to try to make sure that their solution comes to them.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The time for Question Period has expired.

Presenting Reports by Standing and Special Committees

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Government Services.

MS WHALEN: Mr. Speaker, I wish to table the Annual Report for 2003-2004

for the Department of Government Services. I also wish to table the Annual

Report for Public Accountants Licensing Board for the year ending December 31,

2003, and 2003-2004 the Annual Report of the Petroleum Products Pricing

Commission.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.

MR. OTTENHEIMER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I wish to table the following annual reports: the Department of Health and

Community Services, the Central East Health Care Institutions Board -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

There has been some shouting back and forth across the floor of the House

following Question Period. It results again in the fact that the Chair is unable

to hear the Minister of Health and Community Services.

The Chair recognizes the Minister of Health and Community Services.

MR. OTTENHEIMER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The other reports include the following: the Health and Community Services

Central Region, the Peninsula's Health Care Corporation, the Western Health

Care Corporation and the Central West Health Corporation.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Bay of Islands.

MR. JOYCE: Mr. Speaker, I wish to table the report of the Public Accounts

Committee on certain matters dealt with, with the Report of the Auditor General,

for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2001. I note, Mr. Speaker, that this report

is the work of the Public Accounts Committee of the Forty-Fourth General

Assembly. That committee had not finished its work at the time of this

dissolution.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: Further reports.

Answers to Questions for which Notice has been Given.

Petitions.

Petitions

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Bay of Islands.

MR. JOYCE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I stand here today to present a petition concerning the closing of the weigh

scales in Western Newfoundland and Labrador. I call upon the minister - I know

the minister said in the House that she has no proof that there are any

concerns, or if there is any evidence that there is a problem with trucks.

I say to the minister in all sincerity and honesty, and I will not repeat it

and I will say it very briefly: Check with your staff in Corner Brook, please.

Check with your staff. Your own staff in Corner Brook are complaining that there

is not enough staff at the Pynn's Brook weigh scales to inspect the trucks

that are coming through. I say to the Madam Minister, if you do not believe your

staff phone the RCMP who went out in the media and said that a truck was almost

5,000 pounds overweight leaving Corner Brook at 5:30 in the morning. Five

thousand pounds overweight the truck was, Mr. Speaker.

I say the winter months are coming on now and with the trucks hitting Corner

Brook in the nighttime - we all know some of the truckers are into the business

of making money and sometimes they may not know, or they may know, that when

they leave Corner Brook at 4:00 or 5:00 in the morning they can make it to

Stephenville, they can make it to Port aux Basques, they can make it to any area

outside with this extra weight on. For the minister to stand here in this House

and say she has no proof, and shout out across the House: I have checked with my

staff. Check with the RCMP, I say to the minister, or better still, check the Western

Star where you can see the truck actually beat up. Don't believe any of

us. Check the local picture. The picture is worth a thousand words, and you

would see the number of occurrences that are happening out in Western

Newfoundland because of the lack of weigh scales.

I say to the Member for Humber Valley, your people are being put at risk

because if they leave and then the weigh scales in Pynn's Brook is closed -

you should be concerned. You should not be laughing at this matter. This is a

very serious issue. I say to the minister, if you cannot find proof, I will

bring you to the RCMP stationed in Corner Brook, who will confirm that, yes,

there have been accidents in Corner Brook with vehicles unsafe and overweight.

That is my commitment to the minister, just to show the severity and the need

for you to personally get involved with this. Putting your head in the sand will

not solve the problem. You have to get involved. You have to stand up to your

government. You have to say that yes, this is a disaster waiting to happen and

there are accidents happening on our highways because of this lack of control

and lack of inspection.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise today to present a petition on behalf of residents in my district. Mr.

Speaker, this is to petition the government to relocate the marine services back

to Cartwright, and to increase the number of trips from last year. What we had,

basically, was one full round trip a week but they want to revert back to the

schedule which would have been three trips per week between Cartwright and

Goose Bay.

Mr. Speaker, I took great exception when government made this decision,

simply because I feel that the Sir Robert Bond is the ferry for Labrador

and therefore it should operate between Cartwright and Goose Bay on a regular

basis, providing a service to people in that area until the road connection is

completed. I was extremely disappointed - extremely disappointed - when the

Minister of Transportation and Works and the Premier of the Province made a

decision to move the Sir Robert Bond back to Lewisporte. They did it at

an additional cost to taxpayers in this Province, but, do you know something?

They did not flinch at that simply because the money to pay for the Sir

Robert Bond to go into Lewisporte is coming out of the Labrador

Transportation Fund, a fund that is administered by two ministers of the Crown,

neither of which is a representative of Labrador, but they are administering the

Labrador Fund. They are paying for the marine services out of this fund.

MR. RIDEOUT: A point of order, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

A point of order has been raised by the Minister of Transportation and Works,

and Aboriginal Affairs.

MR. RIDEOUT: Mr. Speaker, I am reluctant to interrupt the hon. member

presenting the petition, but I cannot allow incorrect information to go on the

public record without responding to it.

I just heard the hon. member clearly make this statement: that the Premier,

I, and the government, made a decision to put the Sir Robert Bond back to

Lewisporte at an additional cost to the taxpayers of this Province. Let me tell

the House the truth.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER : Order, please!

MR. RIDEOUT: The Liberals, depending upon which person was speaking and

which day of the week, said it would cost somewhere between $3 million and $5

million additional. The public policy group at MUN said it would cost $1.7

million additional. The officials in the department projected $600,000 and, Mr.

Speaker, the vessel is now tied up in Lewisporte for the winter and we operated

her at the same cost in 2003, despite the fact that fuel went up 15 per cent.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

There is no point of order.

The Chair recognizes the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

When the hon. the minister raised the point of order, the hon. member was

about halfway through her time allocation. The Chair will give her the balance

of that time now.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Before I was interrupted, in making my point, I will let the hon. minister

know, and the budget will show, Mr. Speaker, that the cost of keeping the port

of Lewisporte open is almost $700,000 a year to taxpayers in this Province; so

don't look at me and tell me there is no additional cost associated with this

service, Mr. Speaker, because that is not the truth.

Mr. Speaker, let me tell you this -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JONES: Let me tell you this, Mr. Speaker. Look at the statistics on

the Sir Robert Bond last year. The boat, Mr. Speaker, that the minister

wanted -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

I am asking members for their co-operation. I am asking members, as well, to

accept the fact that -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

I am asking members to accept the fact that, in this House, the sharing of

diverse opinions is encouraged. It is what the House of Assembly is all about.

The Chair recognizes the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair for about

another half-minute.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I want to indicate to the minister and the members opposite that the

statistics on the Sir Robert Bond for last year will show that the

numbers are down by over 600 passengers, Mr. Speaker. It will also show you that

only 30 per cent of the users on the Sir Robert Bond preferred to

use Lewisporte as a port last year,

whereas 70 per cent of the users, Mr.

Speaker, use Cartwright to Goose Bay. Those are the statistics that I have, Mr.

Speaker, that were obtained through the operator and through the department, and

that is what they indicate.

My question has to be, to the government, in light of the fact that only 30

per cent of the users on the service are using Lewisporte as a port, won't

they reconsider their decision? Won't they listen to the petitions I have

bringing forward from the people in Labrador, and put the service back

(inaudible)?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. COLLINS: A point of order, Mr. Speaker, to some of the comments made

in the petition just stated.

The Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair stated that 30 per cent of the

users last year on the ferry went to Lewisporte, and 70 per cent - I have seen

the statistics, but what you have to remember is that 66 per cent of the runs

went to Cartwright-Goose Bay when only 33 per cent went Goose Bay-Lewisporte, so

it all breaks down.

Mr. Speaker, I want to say, and I want to be on the record as saying, that I

have had more phone calls on the ferry service from my district than probably

any other single issue last year and the year before, and that residents of my

district are pleased to see one run a week going from Goose Bay to Lewisporte.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Speaking to the point of order, the hon. the Member for

Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

MS JONES: Mr. Speaker, I have here the statistics that show the travel

pattern of passengers using the Sir Robert Bond last year, and the

figures will indicate quite clearly that it was a 70 per cent, 30 per cent,

split, with the majority of the passengers using the Cartwright service.

Also, I have here petitions not yet presented to the House from members in

the Labrador West and Wabash area who would like to see the Sir Robert Bond do

three trips a week, Mr. Speaker, between Goose Bay and Cartwright, as opposed to

the one trip a week which they saw last year.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

There is no point of order. There is a difference of opinion, but there

certainly is not a point of order. Points of order relate to the procedures, the

Standing Orders of the House, and I remind members of that particular

qualification when they raise their points.

Further petitions.

The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise today to present of petition from a number of people in the Province

who are concerned with the use to video lottery terminals - for 155 adults, one

VLT machine, Mr. Speaker. That certainly is an alarming statistic that puts us

at the top of the country in terms of the number of VLTs that we have in this

Province.

Mr. Speaker, yesterday I pointed out to the House that there was one club for

sale in close proximity to St. John's, and one of the main selling features in

the advertisement was that they had in excess of $250,000 a year in profits from

fifteen VLTs in their establishment. I would suggest, Mr. Speaker, that should

not have been called a bar, club, pub for sale. It should have called a

mini-casino for sale because there was no reference as to their liquor sales or

anything else other than the fact that the VLTs made over $250,000 excess in

profits.

Mr. Speaker, if you want to break that down, that is $21,000 a month in

profits from fifteen VLT machines, or $700 a day. Mr. Speaker, that is a lot of

money but that represents only one establishment in this Province. All of the

information that I have read concerning VLTs shows that they are highly

addictive. Most experts in the field of addiction treatments refer to them as

the crack cocaine of gambling. That is the significance that the experts have

placed upon people becoming addicted to those machines. I think that it is a

terrible reflection, Mr. Speaker, on us as a society when we continue to bring

in new things to the Province, such as these VLTs.

I was quite alarmed yesterday, Mr. Speaker, to read the report from the

Atlantic Lotto Corporation where they talked about the tremendous amount of work

that they are doing. They brag a lot about the new products that they are

developing, the new games that they are putting online, the amount of profits

that they are turning over for this Province and the other Atlantic provinces.

But, guess what, Mr. Speaker? They did not take any responsibility at all for

people who are becoming addicted.

In this entire report that was tabled in the House yesterday, Mr. Speaker,

they mentioned the words: people who have problems with gambling, but that is as

far as it went to acknowledge that there are people. As to what they are

prepared to do about it, it is silent, Mr. Speaker. There is no reference to it

whatsoever. There is nothing there about their programs, nothing about the

amount of money that they are putting forward to help people who become addicted

and I think that is shameful on this Province, on the other Atlantic provinces,

and on the Lotto Corporation itself.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: Orders of the day.

Orders of the Day

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I want to resolve the House into Committee of the Whole to consider certain

matters related to Bill 43,

An Act To Provide For The Registration Of Lobbyists.

I believe the Minister of Justice and the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi

had some discussion last night with respect to a pertinent, particular clause. I

think there may be some answers provided to that, so we will move forward in

that, please.

MR. SPEAKER: It is moved and seconded that I do now leave the Chair for

the House to resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole on a certain bill.

Is it the pleasure of the House that I do now leave the Chair for the House

to resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole on this bill?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: Contra-minded?

Carried.

On motion, that the House resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole, Mr.

Speaker left the Chair.

Committee of the Whole

CHAIR (Fitzgerald): Order, please!

Bill 43,

An Act To Provide For the Registration Of Lobbyists.

The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I have just been informed by the Table and the minister that the amendment is

not quite ready. So what we will do is, we will move into the Committee debate

on Bill 41,

An Act Respecting The Government Purchasing Agency.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

CHAIR: Bill 41,

An Act Respecting The Government Purchasing Agency.

A bill, "An Act Respecting The Government Purchasing Agency." (Bill

41)

CHAIR: Shall clause 1 carry?

All those in favour, aye.'

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: Shall clauses 1 to 11 carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Nay.

CHAIR: Clauses 1 to 11 is carried.

On motion, clauses 1 through 11 carried.

CLERK:

Be it enacted by the Lieutenant-Governor in House of Assembly in

Legislative Session convened as follows:

CHAIR: Shall the enacting clause carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Nay.

CHAIR: The enacting clause is carried

On motion, enacting clause carried.

CLERK:

An Act Respecting The Government Purchasing Agency.

CHAIR: Shall the title carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

The title is carried.

Shall I report Bill 41,

An Act Respecting The Government Purchasing Agency,

carried without amendment?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

Bill 41 is carried.

Motion, that the Committee report having passed the bill without amendment,

carried.

CHAIR: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Chairman, I move that the Committee rise, report progress and ask leave

to sit again.

CHAIR: The motion is that the Committee rise, report progress and ask

leave to sit again.

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

On motion, that the Committee rise, report progress and ask leave to sit

again, Mr. Speaker returned to the Chair.

MR. SPEAKER (Hodder): Order, please!

The hon. the Member for Bonavista South and Deputy Speaker.

MR. FITZGERALD: Mr. Speaker, the Committee of the Whole have considered

the matters to them referred, have directed me to report Bill 41 passed without

amendment and ask leave to sit again.

MR. SPEAKER: The Chairperson of the Committee of the Whole reports that

the Committee have considered the matters to them referred, have directed him to

report Bill 41,

An Act Respecting The Government Purchasing Agency, passed

without amendment. When shall the report be received?

MR. E. BYRNE: Now, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: Now.

When shall the said bill be read a third time?

MR. E. BYRNE: Now, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: Now.

On motion, report received and adopted, bill ordered read a third time

presently, by leave. Committee ordered to sit again presently, by leave.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I move third reading of Bill 41,

An Act Respecting The Government Purchasing

Agency.

MR. SPEAKER: It is moved and seconded that Bill 41,

An Act Respecting The

Government Purchasing Agency, be now read a third time.

Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion that Bill 41 be now read

a third time?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

CLERK: A bill,

An Act Respecting The Government Purchasing Agency. (Bill

41)

MR. SPEAKER: This bill is now read a third time and it is ordered that

the bill do pass and its title be as on the Order Paper.

On motion, a bill, "An Act Respecting The Government Purchasing

Agency," read a third time, ordered passed and its title be as on the Order

Paper. (Bill 41)

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, Motion 1: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of

Treasury Board To Move that the House Resolve itself into Committee of the Whole

To Consider Certain Resolutions Relating To The Granting Of Supplementary Supply

To Her Majesty. (Bill 67)

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I have received a message from His Honour the Lieutenant-Governor.

MR. SPEAKER: All rise.

The message is dated 14 December 2004, and it reads as follows: As

Lieutenant-Governor of the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador, I transmit

Estimates of sums required for the Public Service of the Province for the year

ending 31 March 2005. By way of Supplementary Supply, and in accordance with the

provisions of sections 54 and 90 of the Constitution Act, 1867, I recommend

these Estimates to the House of Assembly.

Signed: Edward Roberts, Lieutenant-Governor.

The hon. the Minister of Finance.

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I move that the message, together with the amount, be referred to the

Committee of Supply.

MR. SPEAKER: It is moved and seconded that the message, together with the

bill, be referred to the Committee of Supply, and that I do now leave the Chair.

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: Contra-minded?

Carried..

On motion, that the House resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole on

Supply. Mr. Speaker left the Chair.

Committee of the Whole on Supply

CHAIR (Fitzgerald): Order, please!

Bill 67,

An Act For Granting To Her Majesty Certain Sums Of Money For

Defraying Certain Additional Expenses Of The Public Service For The Financial

Year Ending March 31, 2005 And For Other Purposes Relating To The Public

Service.

The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury Board.

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

This particular supplementary supply bill: while the House is in session it

is certainly appropriate to bring it to the House in a supply bill, rather than

have to do it with a special warrant. It is for $971,000. The federal

government, under its ten-year plan to strengthen health care, has committed in

excess of $2.68 million over this three-year period. It is 100 per cent

reimbursed by the federal government. By initiating it now, we can make the

necessary plans on the immunization of children over the next number of months.

For this fiscal year the amount would be $971,000, as indicated in the bill.

What we are asking is that this get expeditious passing. It is 100 per cent

recoverable. It is part of a federal government commitment. Other than that, it

is used in immunization for children. It is a series that is going to go on over

the next number of years with 100 per cent funding provided.

One of the aspects of this is that we are looking at ways to enhance,

basically, the health care, and the ten-year plan to strengthen and enhance

health care in the country. This is one particular example of appropriate

immunization. The money will go into an immunization trust basically. It is put

in there for that purpose, in which it would be expended solely for the purpose

for which it was intended.

I certainly move that this get expeditious passing here, so that we can deal

with it, so that the people in the department can move quickly to make sure that

the necessary orders are done, the necessary vaccines, and what is needed to

carry out this program.

CHAIR: The hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans.

MS THISTLE: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I would like to say to the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board, that I support this bill and the intent that is brought forward. It is a

good program, and I think all of us here in this House recognize the value of

the immunization program.

I would also like to ask the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board if this is part of the Health Accord money that he has already received,

which he denies that he has received.

There was an interesting question asked today in the House by the Member for

Labrador West, that he knows of people graduating with the nurse practitioners

degree and cannot find employment in this Province. I have also heard in the

past few days that people cannot get dialysis in Grand Falls-Windsor. Our

dialysis units are taxed to the max. We cannot accept any more patients and we

are currently sending them to Corner Brook.

These are the kinds of questions that you need to look at with regard to

health. Really, I would like to ask the Minister of Finance if he ever had the

opportunity, or will make the opportunity, to actually go through the cancer

clinic in Grand Falls-Windsor, because we need to make sure that our patients

who are getting treatment for cancer, have the same kind of surroundings that

they do in other cancer centres.

We also need to look after the people who are currently getting dialysis

treatment and are currently having to move out of Grand Falls-Windsor and go to

another location. You know, that is not really good enough when people are

elderly. I will not be specific today, but it all comes down to a matter of

funding.

The Central West Health Care Board, they need $300,000 right now to look

after the dialysis unit. They have people trained and ready to go to work in

that unit but they cannot extend or expand their capacity because they do not

have the funding to pay these salaries. It all comes down to money. Nobody

should have to, at an elderly age in our Province, particularly somebody from

the same community, get in an ambulance and go to another location for dialysis.

That is a sad situation as we approach Christmas.

So, I would like to ask the Minister of Finance, the money that is being

talked about here today, did you receive already the money from the Health Care

Accord, the $46 million that we are expecting? Can we see some of that put out

into the real needs, like I am expressing here today, Mr. Minister?

CHAIR: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury Board.

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

First of all, I will address the general question. No, we have not received

any of the money, the $34.4 million that we expect to get this year under the

have the legal authority to disperse that money until legislation passes in the

House of Commons. We cannot spend money, technically, that we do not have but

even if we did have it, I do want to mention that we have this year, I say to

the hon. member, given permission to utilize monies within the department from

money that would have normally been spent by those boards as a result of our

labour dispute, a strike savings to allocate that. We have allowed - hospital

boards in this Province currently are now spending $28 million more than they

received this year. We have already provided the hospital boards to catch up on

waiting lists, to reduce the waiting list, to spend money. We have already

spent, I will say to the member - even without any $34.4 million or allocated or

expected to be spent between now and the year - just $28 million on those areas

alone out in the different hospital boards around the Province.

This money we are talking about here is part of a commitment by the federal

government. It is a commitment of $6.46 million in total over a three-year

period that is estimated to be spent. Our Province has received - in that

amount, there is an amount to be spent over the next three years of $6.46

million, then subsequent to that, there was supposed to be $2.67 million spent

to be able to enhance the program.

Initially, money was put in when we had SARS outbreak and that. We wanted to

raise the public health level of people here in the country. That was one of the

efforts put forward by the federal government on that, and we are looking at

gearing up to do that because the money is there. We would have had to go to a

Special Warrant to get that money when it is needed. That could be over the next

period of months, before this year is over, January, February, as the money

would get expended. The House would not be sitting until, basically March, so I

did not feel, and my colleagues did not feel, that a Special Warrant was the way

to go. We should bring any bills we could humanly possible - we should put them

on the floor of this House, we should let the Legislature see what we are

looking for rather than do a Special Warrant and come back and pass that.

Last year, when we took over this government and we had to deal with

legislation last spring, I had to stand here in this House and present bills,

Supplementary Supply for 2001-02, 2002-03 and for 2003-04, basically, we did

last year in this House that were not passed in over two years. To go out and do

Special Warrants, come back two years later and get approval in this House to do

that is not in the spirit of transparency and accountability and is one that I

personally do not believe in. Wherever it is humanly possible that we can bring

bills to this House, to have the House debate these bills, we are going to do

that. If an emergency arises that we cannot deal with - there were two tabled

here in this House previously this year under our government. One is 100 per

cent reimbursement on a justice matter that we are getting reimbursed. The only

other one that we are not getting 100 per cent reimbursement, a decision was

made for $591,000 as our share of 70 per cent to hire seven RCMP officers to put

into Labrador where there was a strong perceived need to do that.

So, we want to be accountable. We have this bill before the House for this

purpose. It is for the immunization of young children and it is put there for

that purpose, and it is 100 per cent. We will spend any money to reach the

objectives that the Minister of Health indicated to reduce waiting lists, to be

able to enhance community health, to be able to deal with many of the concerns

addressed in the First Ministers' Meeting on September 13-15 on health care.

So, we are committed to that. The minister is committed and as a government we

are going to do what we can, even right now without that commitment, without

that money.

For the benefit of my colleagues and the members of the House here, already

we are aware that out in the hospital boards there is $28 million spent. Some of

this is to catch up on backlogs and reduce waiting lists. We have already put

over and above what was appropriated in this House. We did not have to come back

to the House for it because the boards have (inaudible) authority. It will show

up in our accrual statement when the boards file a statement.

Under the previous government what happened in cases, they had separate

entities out there that never showed up in our cash statements. We are going to

report these and we are going to be open and transparent. We are going to make

sure that the public is fully aware of what happens. Whether it is good news or

whether it is bad news, we are going to be transparent on it. We are going to be

accountable and we are going let them know and let the public draw their

decision. One thing they will get from us, they will get transparency and we

will do that every, single time we can. It has been mentioned by Auditor

Generals over the past number of years and that is why we are here in the House

doing it.

MR. JOYCE: (Inaudible).

MR. SULLIVAN: The Member for Bay of Islands is very disruptive and I just

cannot hear myself talking. I wish he would stop shouting.

CHAIR: Order, please!

The hon. Minister of Finance.

MR. SULLIVAN: I wish he would stop shouting. If he wants to stand on this

bill and speak, he is entitled to do it. That is why we have it here, instead of

doing what the former government did by introducing Special Warrants. We want -

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

CHAIR: Order, please!

MR. SULLIVAN: Mr. Chairman, I ask that you tame that individual there so

at least I could finish my comments here and sit down.

CHAIR: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the Minister of Finance.

MR. SULLIVAN: We are supportive of this because it is an immunization

program for children here in our Province. It is necessary. It is important that

the public health of people is there. It is 100 per cent money there. It would

be fully justifiable, when the need arises in January or February, to come here

to the House to do a Special Warrant and bring it back after but we felt we

wanted to be ahead of that. We wanted to be transparent in doing so. So, that is

the purpose of doing it here in Supplementary Supply. We want people here in the

House to have - Opposition, anybody who wants to comment on the particulars of

this, and we will justify the expenditure here because we think it is a

worthwhile one.

Thank you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

A bill, "An Act For Granting To Her Majesty Certain Sums Of Money For

Defraying Certain Additional Expenses Of The Public Service For The Financial

Year Ending March 31, 2005 And For Other Purposes relating To The Public Service

No. 2." (Bill 67)

Resolution

"That it is expedient to introduce a measure to provide for the granting

to Her Majesty for defraying certain additional expenses of the public service

for the financial year ending March 31, 2005, the sum of $971,000."

CHAIR: Shall the resolution carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

The resolution is carried.

On motion, resolution carried.

CLERK: Clauses 1 and 2.

CHAIR: Shall clauses 1 and 2 carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

Clauses 1 and 2 are carried.

On motion, clauses 1 and 2 carried.

CLERK: The schedule.

CHAIR: Shall the

schedule carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

The

schedule is carried.

On motion,

schedule carried.

CLERK: "WHEREAS it appears that the sums mentioned are required to

defray certain additional expenses of the Public Service of Newfoundland and

Labrador for the financial year ending March 31, 2005, and for other purposes

relating to the public service:"

CHAIR: Shall the

preamble carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

The

preamble is carried.

On motion,

preamble carried.

CLERK:

An Act For Granting To Her Majesty Certain Sums Of Money For

Defraying Certain Additional Expenses Of The Public Service For The Financial

Year Ending March 31, 2005 And For Other Purposes Relating To The Public Service

No. 2.

CHAIR: Shall the title carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

The title is carried.

On motion, title carried.

CHAIR: Shall I report Bill 67, along with the resolution, carried without

amendment?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

Bill 67 is carried.

Motion, that the Committee report having passed the bill without amendment,

carried.

CHAIR: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I thank members opposite for their participation, and the Member for Grand

Falls-Buchans, in the debate on this important issue.

With that, I move that the Committee rise, report progress and ask leave to

sit again.

CHAIR: The motion is that the Committee rise, report progress and ask

leave to sit again.

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

On motion, that the Committee rise, report progress and ask leave to sit

again, Mr. Speaker returned to the Chair.

MR. SPEAKER (Hodder): Order, please!

The hon. the Member for Bonavista South and Deputy Speaker.

MR. FITZGERALD: Mr. Speaker, the Committee of Supply have considered the

matters to them referred, have directed me to report that they have adopted a

certain resolution and recommend that a bill be introduced to give effect to

same.

MR. SPEAKER: The Chairperson of the Committee of Supply reports that the

Committee have considered the matters to them referred, have directed him to

report that the Committee have adopted a certain resolution and recommend that a

bill be introduced to give effect to same.

It is moved and seconded that this resolution be now read a first time.

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

Resolution

"That it is expedient to introduce a measure to provide for the granting

to Her Majesty for defraying certain additional expenses of the public service

for the financial year ending March 31, 2005, the sum of $971,000."

MR. SPEAKER: It is moved and seconded that this resolution be now read a

second time.

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

CLERK: Second reading of the resolution to Bill 67.

On motion, resolution read a second time.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I move that the Supplementary Supply Bill, Bill 67, be introduced and read a

first time.

MR. SPEAKER: It is moved and seconded that the hon. the Minister of

Finance shall have leave to introduce a bill entitled,

An Act For Granting To

Her Majesty Certain Sums Of Money For Defraying Certain Additional Expenses Of

The Public Service For The Financial Year Ending March 31, 2005 And For Other

Purposes Relating To The Public Service No. 2. (Bill 67)

Is it the pleasure of the House that the hon. the Minister of the Finance

shall have leave to introduce the said bill?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

Motion, the hon. the Minister of Finance to introduce a bill, "An Act

For Granting To Her Majesty Certain Sums Of Money For Defraying Certain

Additional Expenses Of The Public Service For The Financial Year Ending March

31, 2005 And For Other Purposes Relating To The Public Service No. 2,"

carried. (Bill 67)

MR. SPEAKER: It is moved and seconded that the said bill be now read a

first time.

Is it the pleasure of the House that the said bill be now read a first time?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I move that the Supplementary Supply bill, Bill 67, be now read a second

time.

MR. SPEAKER: It is moved and seconded that Bill 67 be now read a second

time.

Is it the pleasure of the House that the said bill be now read a second time?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

CLERK: A bill,

An Act For Granting To Her Majesty Certain Sums Of Money

For Defraying Certain Additional Expenses Of The Public Service For The

Financial Year Ending March 31, 2005 And For Other Purposes Relating To The

Public Service No. 2. (Bill 67)

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I move that the Supplementary Supply Bill, Bill 67, be now read a third time.

MR. SPEAKER: It is moved and seconded that the said bill, Bill 67, be now

read a third time.

Is it the pleasure of the House that the said bill be now read a third time?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

CLERK: A bill,

An Act For Granting To Her Majesty Certain Sums Of Money

For Defraying Certain Additional Expenses Of The Public Service For The

Financial Year Ending March 31, 2005 And For Other Purposes Relating To The

Public Service No. 2. (Bill 67)

MR. SPEAKER: This bill is now read a third time and it is ordered that

the bill do pass and its title be as on the Order Paper.

On motion, a bill, "An Act For Granting To Her Majesty Certain Sums Of

Money For Defraying Certain Additional Expenses Of The Public Service For The

Financial Year Ending March 31, 2005 And For Other Purposes Relating To The

Public Service No 2," read a first, second and third time, ordered passed

and its title be as on the Order Paper. (Bill 67)

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Order 12, second reading of a bill,

An Act To Amend The Occupational Health

And Safety Act. (Bill 64)

MR. SPEAKER: It is moved and seconded that Bill 64,

An Act To Amend The

Occupational Health And Safety Act, be now read a second time.

Motion, second reading of a bill, "An Act To Amend The Occupational

Health and Safety Act." (Bill 64)

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Government Services.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS WHALEN: Mr. Speaker, I am pleased today to rise in this House to speak

to Bill 64. This bill provides flexibility to small businesses employing five

persons or less to participate in mandatory occupational health and safety

training.

The Occupational Health and Safety Act currently stipulates that the required

training must be taken by someone not associated with the owner or management of

a company. The amendments do not in any way change the ultimate responsibility

of the employer to provide a safe workplace. What these amendment will do is

ensure that in circumstances where it is a hardship on a employer to continually

pay for work representative training, the employer has the option of sending a

supervisor to take the training, or the employer can take the training.

All we are doing is adding the words, "workplace health and safety

designate" wherever worker health and safety representative appears. We

want to give the workplace health and safety designate the same responsibilities

as worker health and safety representative, where the designate is associated

with management.

The workers' compensation legislation on PRIME, which was just passed in

this House, provides the opportunity for financial rebates provided employers

comply with specific occupational health and safety legislative requirements.

The small business community has expressed concern that the requirements are

too onerous to meet without finance hardship and disruption to their operations.

With this bill, we have achieved a balance that preserves the objective of

healthy and safe workplaces without causing undue financial hardship on the

small business sector.

Mr. Speaker, the proposed amendment, under the Occupational Health and Safety

Act, will provide the flexibility for small business owners to be in compliance

and therefore eligible to receive a rebate on their workers' compensation

premiums.

The amendment stipulates that if a workplace employs five or less persons,

then either a workplace health and safety designate, or a worker health and

safety representative, in addition to the occupational health and safety policy,

will be required. This workplace health and safety designate can be a supervisor

or the employer; however, an occupational health and safety officer, or the

Assistant Deputy Minister, can intervene and order an employer to have a worker

health and safety representative if it deems to be in the best interest of the

workers. This will ensure that, where appropriate, a worker health and safety

representative can be still required in workplaces where five or less persons

are employed.

This amendment will be well-received by the small business sector and their

representatives. It strikes a balance that preserves the objective of health and

safe work places.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans.

MS THISTLE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I am delighted to stand and respond to Bill 64,

An Act To Amend The

Occupational Health And Safety Act.

I read through the bill and I do not see any problem with this act at all. In

fact, I support it. It has always been an issue, particularly for small

business, where lots of times it is almost a mom-and-pop operation. I know you

cannot compromise safety, but you also have to be flexible and provide a

balance. In a lot of cases, it is even difficult for someone working in a small

operation like that to find the time to actually do the training.

As a former Minister of Labour, I was glad to bring in changes in that

department where these courses could be taught when they were conducive to a

workers schedule. They could be done on weekends and they could actually be done

nighttime and so on.

I am glad to see that this is another step in fostering a safe environment

but also providing flexibility for businesses that are under six persons.

Government needs to look at whatever it can to encourage business and make sure

that rural Newfoundland and Labrador remain viable.

I think, where you look at the fact that small business is the cornerstone of

our economy in this Province, we have heard a lot of talk recently of IT. Of

course, we know how important oil is to our economy, and the backbone of our

economy, of course, is our fishing industry, but we have to support small

business because, if rural Newfoundland and Labrador is going to survive, it

will be the small business such as the minister is describing. For that very

reason, anything that will accommodate a small business and yet will not

compromise safety, I will definitely support. I support this bill, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I would just like to take this opportunity to say a few words on Bill 64, An

Act to Amend The Occupational Health and Safety Act.

Mr. Speaker, occupational health and safety is extremely important to workers

in this Province. We need to ensure that the workplaces that people work in to

make a living, which are required to make a living, are as safe as they can

possibly be.

One of the things that has advanced in the last number of years is the

requirement of safety training and safety committees being on all work sites as

part of doing two things, Mr. Speaker. Firstly, obviously, to make the workplace

safer and to reduce the number or injuries that occur to people in the Province.

We see far too much of that, and each year we recognize and acknowledge April 28

as a Day of Mourning for our workers who have been injured or have lost their

lives working on job sites in this Province.

Every year there are new people, unfortunately, added to the toll of people

who die in workplace accidents, so that is the primary focus of worker safety in

the Province; but, secondarily, and important to the function of businesses and

the workers' compensation, is that we have a more reasonable workplace health

safety and compensation regime so that we do not have high costs of accidents

that are required to pay for injured workers and their families benefits over a

long period of time. So, there is a double reason why we should improve

occupational health and safety.

It was us, in the New Democratic Party, who urged government a number of

years ago, when they cut back on benefits to workers under workers'

compensation, that the answer was not to cut back benefits but was to reduce

accidents by increasing the level of workplace safety.

Hopefully, Mr. Speaker, one of the consequences of reducing workplace

accidents will ultimately be the restoration of proper workers' compensation

benefits in this Province to a level that is required and that they were before

the cutbacks and reductions took place. Workers ought not to suffer because

their workplace has been so unsafe that they have suffered an injury on the job.

Having said that, Mr. Speaker, the legislation that is before the House now

to provide for a method of ensuring that there are trained workers on every job

site - that this legislation allows that to happen. We can have circumstances,

particularly in small enterprises or small construction projects, where you

might have two or three workers. A small owner-operated business with one or two

apprentices or hands would be required under the existing legislation to send

one of these workers off on a course, and next year might have two different

workers and be required to send one of those off on a course. This legislation

will allow the owner-operator or the manager to himself or herself receive the

training that will ensure that their workplace is safe.

Many people going to a job, and a job site that is unfamiliar to them - I am

thinking of young people who might have a summer job, or go to a job for the

first time - quite often they do not know what safe practices are. They do now

know that they have the right to refuse unsafe work. They do not know, unless

they are told by someone who does know, how to do a job safely and properly.

It is extremely important that this workplace and safety training be

available. I support the efforts by the minister's department, and by the

officials who are responsible for occupational health and safety, to ensure that

this is done in the most efficient way possible.

We support the amendments to Bill 64, and hope that it will seek to improve

the quality of our workplaces. In fact, it would not hurt at all to have the

owner-operators and owner-managers get the kind of occupational health and

safety training that is being provided here, as well as some of their workers,

because the more the owner-operators are aware of the potential for accidents,

of the safe practices, of the law, of the way of conducting their workplace in a

safe manner, that will be part of the culture of that operation as it follows

and, hopefully, works its way through to all the employees, even in a small

operation. That is the way that people learn, Mr. Speaker, by operating in a

safe environment, coming to expect a safe environment, knowing they have the

right to insist on a safe workplace and safe methods of operating. That can only

serve to improve the level of safety and decrease the number of accidents and

the cost of accidents to society.

Having said that, Mr. Speaker, we support the legislation and look for its

speedy passage.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Government Services, if she speaks

now, she will close debate at second reading.

MS WHALEN: Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my hon. colleagues for

their support on this bill. This bill will give us the flexibility to ensure

that the smaller workplaces are safe, that the employer, the worker, the

supervisor, all have the information and the training available to make the

small workplaces safer. It is very important that safety is in all of our

occupations in our daily lives.

I thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: Is it the pleasure of the House that Bill 64,

An Act To

Amend The Occupational Health And Safety Act, be now read a second time?

All those in favour, Aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

CLERK: A bill,

An Act To Amend The Occupational Health And Safety Act,

Bill 64.

MR. SPEAKER: This bill has now been read a second time. When shall the

bill be referred to a Committee of the Whole House?

MR. E. BYRNE: Later.

MR. SPEAKER: Later.

On motion, a bill, "An Act To Amend The Occupational Health And Safety

Act," read a second time, referred to a Committee of the Whole House

presently, by leave. (Bill 64)

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Order 9, Second Reading of a bill, "An Act To Amend The Public Tender

Act, Bill 53.

Motion, second reading of a bill,

An Act To Amend The Public Tender

Act." (Bill 53)

MR. SPEAKER: Order 9.

The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I am pleased to rise to make a few comments on Bill 53 with respect to

An Act

To Amend The Public Tender Act.

Mr. Speaker, what I would like to do, if we could - I am going to ask the

minister to conclude debate on second reading, because we do have an amendment

that we are going to make to the bill based on some discussions that have taken

place and representations that have been made to ourselves.

With that in mind, Mr. Speaker, I will ask the minister responsible, the

Minister of Government Services, just to conclude debate on second reading. Then

I am going to move the House into Committee to deal with matters on a variety of

bills at the Committee stage.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Government Services. If she speaks

now she will close debate at second reading.

The hon. the Minister.

MS WHALEN: Mr. Speaker, this Bill 53, for the Public Tender Act, is to

bring Newfoundland and Labrador Hydro inline with all other public-funded

bodies. It means that Hydro's tendering and purchasing requirements will now

be done in accordance with the Public Tender Act. I conclude debate on it.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: Is it the pleasure of the House that Bill 53,

An Act to

Amend The Public Tender Act, be now read a second time?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

CLERK: A bill,

An Act To Amend The Public Tender Act. (Bill 53)

MR. SPEAKER: This bill has now been read a second time. When shall this

bill be referred to a Committee of the Whole House?

MR. E. BYRNE: Now, Mr. Speaker.

On motion, a bill, "An Act To Amend The Public Tender Act," read a

second time, ordered referred to a Committee of the Whole House presently, by

leave. (Bill 53)

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I move that the House resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole to

consider certain matters at the committee stage of a variety of different bills,

Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: It is moved and seconded that I do now leave the Chair for

the House to resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole on a number of bills.

Is it the pleasure of the House that I do now leave the Chair for the House to

resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole on said bills?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

On motion, that the House resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole, Mr.

Speaker left the Chair.

CHAIR (Fitzgerald): The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I move that debate begin on Bill 53, amendments to the Public Tender Act.

CHAIR: Order, please!

Bill 53,

An Act To Amend the Public Tender Act.

A bill, "An Act To Amend the Public Tender Act." (Bill 53)

CHAIR: Shall clause 1 carry?

The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: I just want to point out, Mr. Chairman, that clause 1 deals

with ensuring that Newfoundland and Labrador Hydro comes into play under this

piece of legislation. So, I just want to be clear and point that out.

CHAIR: Shall clause 1 carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

Clause 1 is carried.

On motion, clause 1 carried.

CHAIR: Should clause 2 carry?

The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

This is where we have an amendment, and I move right now that clause 2 of the

bill be deleted in its entirety.

CHAIR: It is moved by the Government House Leader that clause 2 of Bill

53 be removed entirely. The amendment is certainly in order. Shall the amendment

carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

On motion, amendment carried.

CHAIR: Shall I report clause 2 deleted from Bill 53?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

Carried.

On motion, clause 2, as amended, carried.

CLERK:

Be it enacted by the Lieutenant-Governor and the House of Assembly

in Legislative Session convened, as follows:

CHAIR: Shall the enacting clause carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

The enacting clause is carried.

On motion, enacting clause carried.

CLERK:

An Act To Amend The Public Tender Act.

CHAIR: Shall the title carry?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

The title is carried.

On motion, title carried.

CHAIR: Shall I report Bill 53,

An Act To Amend The Public Tender Act,

carried with amendment?

All those in favour, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

Bill 53 is carried.

Motion, that the Committee report having passed the bill with amendment,

carried.

CHAIR: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I move now to Bill 43,

An Act To Provide For The Registration of Lobbyists,

and to continue debate in Committee that we left off at here last night.

CHAIR: It is the Chair's understanding that all clauses to this

particular piece of legislation, this bill, has been passed with the exception

of clause 4.

Shall clause 4 carry?

The hon. the Minister of Justice and Attorney General.

MR. HARRIS: On a point of order, Mr. Chairman.

CHAIR: The hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi, on a point of

order.

MR. HARRIS: I believe there is an amendment before the Committee on this

bill that was proposed by me and I understand that the minister is about to

introduce another amendment but I had some discussions with him and if we are

debating my amendment, maybe he can announce what he plans to do, and then,

based on what he has to say, I may be prepared to withdraw my amendment.

CHAIR: It is the Chair's understanding, with confirmation from the

Table, that the amendment as put forward by the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi

Vidi is certainly in order. So we will hear from the Member for Signal

Hill-Quidi Vidi first.

The hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MR. HARRIS: Yes, Mr. Chairman, if I may just explain the amendment that

is before the House for hon. members.

Clause 4 of the act is actually an exemption clause. It says, "This Act

does not apply to the following persons when acting in their official

capacity." Subparagraph (

o) of that excludes "volunteer unpaid members

of boards or councils." My concern was that this was too particular, in

that it only referred to boards and councils. My amendment was to expand that to

include voluntary organizations, trade unions and labour organizations. I

understand, since then, there has been some discussion amongst legislative

council with the Minister of Justice, who is responsible for the bill, and that

as a result of that, there is a new amendment - which I have received a copy of

- which deals with the same problem in a very different way. Perhaps if the

minister would like to speak to that - and, based again on what he has to say -

if the amendment that I have received a copy of is being proposed, then I would

certainly consider withdrawing my amendment.

CHAIR: The hon. the Minister of Justice and Attorney General.

MR. T. MARSHALL: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

As I said in my brief remarks yesterday, this bill, this legislation, is

aimed at regulating paid lobbyists, those people who receive remuneration and

other benefits for carrying out their lobbying activities. The structure of the

legislation, as cited in

Part I, is to capture the paid lobbyist, and in

particular what was defined as consultant lobbyists and in-house lobbyists, who

are essentially people who are hired by an organization for the purposes of

conducing lobbying activities, and that is who this bill is trying to capture.

I said yesterday that there was no legislation in this country that attempted

to regulate unpaid lobbying activities. I also said that neither would this

legislation. Our proposed legislation does not regulate the activities of unpaid

volunteers. Unpaid volunteers can continue to lobby for their chosen causes on a

voluntary basis as they have always done. Of course, individuals who make

representations on their own behalf would not be regulated as well.

The act, in

Part I, captures that, but there was in

section 4.(1) a list of

person who were excluded from the act, as the hon. Member for Signal Hill-Quidi

Vidi mentioned.

Section 4.(1) states that this act shall not apply to the

following persons when acting in their official capacity. There are a number of

people mentioned, most of whom are people who are, in fact, paid for the jobs

they do.

Section 4.(1) (

o) indicated, "...volunteer unpaid members of boards or

councils". While this, strictly speaking, was not necessary, the subsection

was put in the act just for clarification purposes. The intent was the clarify

and to make it clear that unpaid volunteers would not be covered by this act.

Unfortunately, our attempts at clarification did cause some confusion, and was

probably picked up by the hon. Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

It was my understanding that the hon. member had not moved the actual

amendment, and therefore I was proposing to amend paragraph 4.(1) (

o) of Bill 43

to delete it and to substitute, therefore, in subsection (o), the words: a

person acting as an unpaid volunteer.

The

section would read: The act does not apply to the following persons when

acting in their official capacity; and subsection (

o) would read: a person

acting as an unpaid volunteer.

The purpose of the amendment would be to affirm the exclusion from the act of

unpaid volunteers, to make it very clear and very certain that unpaid volunteers

are not covered by this legislation.

CHAIR: Order, please!

The Chair has had an opportunity to review the amendment as put forward by

the Minister of Justice and Attorney General, and the Chair rules that the

amendment is in order.

The hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Having looked at the amendment, and having listened to the minister, his

amendment certainly covers the areas of concern that I was dealing with and, in

fact, is even broader than I had moved it.

In light of that, I would certainly withdraw my amendment to allow the

minister an opportunity to move his and to allow us to vote on it.

CHAIR: The hon. the Minister of Justice and Attorney General.

MR. T. MARSHALL: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I thank the hon. member for his co-operation here.

I am pleased now to move, seconded by the hon. Member for Gander, that

paragraph 4.(1)(

o) of Bill 43 be deleted and the following substituted as

subsection (o): a person acting as an unpaid volunteer.

CHAIR: It is moved by the Minister of Justice and Attorney General that

paragraph 4(1)(

o) of Bill 43 be amended. The amendment would read: Paragraph

4(1)(

o) of Bill 43 is deleted and the following substituted: (

o) a person acting

as an unpaid volunteer.

All those in favour of the amendment, aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

CHAIR: All those against, nay'.

The amendment is carried.

On motion, amendment carried.

CHAIR: Shall I report clause 4 carried, with amendment?

All those in favour, aye'.

The hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Before voting on clause 4 as a whole. I have another amendment, of which I

have given a copy to the Table, to the Government House Leader, the minister,

and the Opposition House Leader. I wish to move an amendment to paragraph 4.(1)

of Bill 43 by adding, immediately after subparagraph 4.(1)(l), the following,

which would be (l.1), to add, the exclusion of an officer, executive board

member or employee of a trade union or labour organization.

Mr. Chairman, if that is ruled in order, I would like to address those points

once the Table has ruled on its acceptability as a motion.

CHAIR: The Chair has had an opportunity to review the amendment as put

forward by the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi, and rules that the amendment

is certainly in order.

The hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

That amendment was seconded by the Member for Labrador West.

The amendment is very important. It is a different policy point than we have

just discussed with respect to the volunteers. It is designed to exclude trade

unions and labour organizations from the operation of the Lobbyist Act in their

entirety. That is done for a very particular reason, Mr. Chairman, if you look

at: Who is the act attempting to regulate? It is attempting to regulate those

people, primarily and directly, who engage in lobbying activities for a profit,

for a fee, on behalf of clients.

If we look at the kind of activity that goes on nationally, government

consulting agents who charge a fee to act on behalf of a client in making

representations to government to attempt to gain support for their position, to

change legislation or whatever, that could include government consulting

agencies, it could include private individuals, it could include lawyers, it

could include any number of people who are acting in that capacity and charging

a fee to clients to attempt to influence government policy. That is a very

laudable goal, and one that we support and supported at second reading.

There are other organizations, and they could be companies that would hire

people. A drug company might hire someone to try to influence government policy

in terms of drug policy, or in terms of purchasing their products, or in terms

of advancing their interests one way or another through government policy. These

are the so-called in-house lobbyist that the act is designed to capture; but,

when we look at the exemptions - and we have a long list of them in clause 4 of

the bill - it is called the Non-application of the Act, it says that the act

does not apply to the following persons when acting in their official capacity.

It talks about MHAs, people who are involved in the government process.

Then down further they talk about people who are involved, employees,

officers and directors of the Newfoundland and Labrador Federation of

Municipalities; or the combined councils of Labrador; school board officers,

directors or employees; people involved in the health care corporations; a

member of an Indian band council under the Indian Act of Canada; officers or

directors or employees of Aboriginal governments; Aboriginal political

organizations; diplomatic agents; United Nations; and directors or employees of

organizations established and funded by government to provide information or

advise.

Mr. Speaker, in those broad categories of people and organizations that are

excluded are those that are set up or established for public purposes to advance

the cause of health care, in the case of health care organizations, and

Aboriginal communities in the case of the Aboriginal groups.

Mr. Speaker, the trade unions in our society are there sanctioned by the

legislation under the Labour Relations Act. The trade unions throughout the

Province are registered under the Labour Relations Act. They have, under that

act, a duty, a legislative duty, to represent and advocate on behalf of their

membership, and act on behalf of workers in general. They are primarily

supported by the work of volunteers. Often they have small staff and very

limited resources. They advocate on behalf of their members, members of the

trade unions and the general public at large, on issues that are related to the

general betterment of society as a whole. They do not - and this is the

important distinction, Mr. Speaker - they do not advocate on behalf of paid

clients for stated economic or other benefit.