Volume XL . Tuesday Province of Newfoundland -FORTIETH GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF NEWFOUNDLAND Fourth Session VERBATIM REPORT {Hansard) Speaker: Honourable P.]. McNicholas Number 38 17 May 1988

Tha House met at 3:00p . m. MR. ~1PFAI<fR (McNtchoJ.as): Ol"dr,n·, pl~~i'lSA-! R(;d::-or·e c:all i.ng fol" s ta 1-.eiTlE!I'lt.s by rnj n:isters, I IAJould lJ.kE! to IAJelcorne to the gallery thirty --two Grade VII students and their thrE!E! l:.coH~che:1rs, Jan"i.cco1 Har·dy, Marv-i.n Rider, and EugE!rle Stagg, from St. Peter 1 s Junior High School, Catal].na. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear! Statements by Ministers PREMIER PECKFORD : Mr. Speaker . Ml~. SPF.AI<FR : ThE! h on . · L he P r· E:HnJ e r . PI~EMIFR Pf.CKFor-w: Mr. Speaker, I want to amend my sl:al :Arnenl: of Yf:!'>tHrday.

I mt:td(~ a J j t t 1 e e r r o r , a n d I . 1/J a n t t o am e n d my 1~1ay s. t sr.t id tht'!l"e IAJr.'\s abou 1-. 120 people working at the Sprung facility and that is inc:orrect. There are 200 people working at the Sprung facility. SOME HON. MEMBERS: H E!ar, hear! PREMIER PECKFORD: Two hundrE!d NE!IAJfoundJ.anders and Labradorians. There was an allegation yesterday that somehow we wsre not producing good cucumbers, so I want to - t'JR __ . _SIMMS: fico1ar, h~1dr! Unc:r"i.nkl.E!d . SOME HON. MEMBFRS : HE!ar, hE!ar! ' .. .. .... 1.200.?. May- 17, '1.9813 Vol XL.

PREMIER PECKFORD: - pr'F.!SC'!nl·. i:o U·w tiAJO LeadE!Y'S and anybody else who would like to have one - r have three here right now -- cucurnbE!rS, Mr. SpeakE!r, that ar~~ no 1.: s crtj\IAJ11Y. Th<.~t :i.s IAJha 1:: IAJas said yesterday. MR. SIMMS : Smctl.l, scratAmy, Cl"inkl.y cucumb~:!rs. MR. MATTHEWS : And onE! for thE! man IAJho rndd e th~= ! accusat.J.on. MR. S.UJ!MS: How do you like them cucumbers? Ml~. SPf::AKFR : Order, please! .I i: hi. n k l ~; 1·1 o 1.1 l. d i" 1.1l. f:! t. h d l:. o u 1·:. o I' Oi"der, if Lhe Spe:1akE!r i ::; not g:iven a C: 1.1 C U HI b f'! r• t'-'\ <; IAJ P. l.J . SOME HON.

MEMBERS: lirH~r, hoar! MR. FENW(CK: Mr. Speaker . MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the member for Menihel< . MR . FENWICK: Since the Premier is correcting his stat.ernE!nt. about the number of employees, maybe;! he wou1d care to correct a few other misconceptions he-?. put fortAJard at l:.he same l~ilnE!. We u n rl <-'! r s t a n cl , f r· om c h e c k t n g IAJi t. h Noua Scotia, that. t·_hE! priCE! of thE! cuct.lmbc;!rs bE!'ing sold t.h~~rE! is between fifty-five and seven~y-fi.ue cents ct pound. In fact, maybE! the PrE!rrliE!r should expl~ i n to us how, if the c·ucwnbE!rS - No. 1H R2002

MR. BAIRD : Why do you not go to Nova Scot.'"i.a and stay there? MR. FENWICK: are to br·eak even at. $1..09 a pound, he can possibly do it whE!n he is selling them for around fifty or sixty cents a pound? MR. SPEAI<ER: Order, ph~asP.! MR. SPEAI<i : R: The hon. the Minister of Career Dc:WE!l.opmenl·. and Advanc::EH~ ~)"1-.ud i.E!S. MR. MATTHEWS: Mr-.-Speaki!:H', t am announc i.ng as pE'!r appe:~ndix one, the approval of 103 nEHJJ proje:)cts uru:lc;!r thr,~ pri. vatc,~ sector employment programme.

These projects involve a Provincial corttribution of $803,810 employing 227 employees, and a total of $69,330 E!mploying 48 students. Thc~se 103 projects, Mr. Speaker, are allocatE!d to 51 different communities across the Province. I wanted to make that particular comment about this approval, because in the last announcemi!:Hlt made by the Prem'"i.er there was a comment made by someone f·rom the 0 p p o s i t. :l o n t h a t i..i: I Ala s s o r t of Avalon oriented.

So 1..11e 1..uanted to point out that of thesP. approvals, Sl are in different communities of t.he Prov.i.ncf~. lhi.s ·i.s lhP. sP.cond announc1~1ilont on th(:! programmE!. To date, Mr. Speaker, 175 projocts have been aj.>proved, for the creation of 430 netAJ jobs, incl.ud i.ng 69 si:.udc;!nl: positions. Of the $7.5 million allocated for the private sector employment programme, $1.39 mJll"ion hcls bc,1en sp,:!nt. l:o dat:.E!. L2003 May 17, 19 8 8 Vol XL As can be seen from appendix onE!, the s e pro j e c t s a r· e o n t. he a v e rage of 40 weeks duration.

This is again an indication that we are cornmi tt.E!d to brE!aking away frorn the ten and twenty week cycle. Applications are continuously bedng rE!CetVE!d and assessed by rny dE!part.trH:1nt., and appr·ovE:!d by governme!nt on a IJJE!ekJ.y basis. Onr:e agai.n, I I.•.JOI.tl.d li. kE! to encaurage ~rnpJ.oyers of this Prov·i.nce to take advantage of this very worth1..uhiJ.e and t.hi~> VE!r ~ y sur:r:essful. p;~og;narrnne. SOME HON. MEMBERS : Hear, hc,1ar! MR. DECKER: Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: ThE! hon. thE! me:~rnbr:·r· for· thE! Strcd.t. of Bc~.l.le IslE!. MR. DECKER: Mr.

Speaker, of cour'SE! it is only fair to compliment the hon. minister for dividing 430 jobs. I haVE! to s;,~y, tho1Jgh, that the minister must re!alize that ther·e i.s somethi.ng drastici'lJ.l.y 1..urong 1..11i th our socie!ty, 1..1.1i t.h our E!COnorny, whf:Hl i::hC::~ only IAJi:''Y cl young pE!rson in this ProvincE! can gE>t: a j o b J s f o r· i:: h F ~ g o v F:~ r n rn E! n 1:. !:. o c o rn e up with some sort of make work pi" 0 g r• ;'WlniC:~ .

The hon. rn:i. n i.s l·. r'!l" sa.:irl l.l·: has gonE! from ten [/IJE~l.J., big the fact l.l.JE!E! k S cfAi~\l! that y o u n g p f?. o p l e i. n can only get govc;!rl'liiiPnl.: rnakE!S young people. to Forty Lt.IPE!kS . T" hrc~I"Cc~ ·i.s still there are 20,000 th·:i.s Prov"inc(,~ IAiho work if thE! thOSE! Now, Mr·. SpE!aker, that is not SOITIE!t.h:i.ng l:he hon. rn - i.ni.sl~(,~r· shou1d be bragging about, that is No. 38 R2003

sornethj ng the hon . minister should be moaning aboul.:, !:".hal: hi.s govc,~rnment has br·ought ·this r.;!Conomy to such a pl.ar:f~ l".h<~i". private enterprise is no longer clo "i. ng IAlhdl:. J.t shouJ.d bn doi.nr~, pr·oviding work and a11owing govEH ' I'llrH:! n i·. t:.o r.\clm"inis l ·. e~l~ olhc,H' prog r·arnlfiE! s . The government is tak"i.ng money and putting people to work, and they have;! no ol:hc;!r cho:i.ce but do that.

I can only compliment the minister on do ·"i.ng that, but I ask the m 1 n i s t e r a n d h 1 s g o v E! r n rn e n t , ~d s colJ.e~agUE!S in CabinE!t, to consider u.Jhat is happE!ning to this sociE!t.y, to consider . 1.uhai: is happc;!n"ing to this economy. Let them put all their abilities together and see if WE! can- .§OM E H Q~-.:_..f1EM ~ E ~12 : This is good! Start worrying . MR. SPEAI<F.:R: Ordc,~l~, please! MR. DECKER : ~)ee lhe pr·obl.c ,' rn, Min. SpoRker·? They cannot recognize the probl.c -:> m. And uni .:·i.J. ti·H~y iner:ogni . ?.f~ the probJem, they will never solve i. 1: . MR.

BARRETT : You do not know what you are doing . MR. SPEAKFR: Order, please! .f1_13._:_...QJ C I< E R : I an1 making a good suggestion to the han. minister. MR. LUSH : And a good speech . MR. DECKER: I am making the suggestion surely t~H~ y IAli.ll i~eali7.E! government does not have that l:. ha ·l: the 1 .. 2004- \Jol XI. ability, nor is governmE!nt r e q 1.1 : i. r· r-:1 d , to j:>r' o 'J ·i. de lAior k for every young person, but it is t he · i. l" r· f:! s p o n s J b :i. 1 .i. 1: y to 1Tli3. k (,~ S I~ I~(;!"- MR. SPEAKER : OrdE!r, please! MH. SPEAKER: The hon . the member's t:i.rnE! has r,~ laps ~:!d.

MR. _DECK~R: My time is If I have soJ.uU .on. up. May I haVE! 1E!i.-lVE!? leave I can give a MR. LONG: Mr. Speaker. liR_:_._ S P E A ..!$J . .R : ThE! hon . the member for ~H:. John's Eas 1: . MB .. .:..._.k. o~g. : ThRnl< yo1~, Mr·. Spea.l<c;!r. Th-.is is just a VE!Y' Y br:l.ef cornrnent 'i. n l"Asponsf~ l·.o 1.uhat .Ls a br· .ic,~f statement, but one that is, nonF.!I··. hf~loss, IAJE!lr:ome . [ IMould say to the min-.ister that I have had sornF.! VC:~i~y posi . l-.:i.vr;! fE'!e~dback i. n lilY own district from people who are - SOME HON. MEMBERS : Hear, hE!ar! MR. LONG:

I) o n o t 1:. cl I< e u p rn y t i rn •"! n ow . I only have a f~w minutes . q 1.1 :i. i: E~ c o1np 1 :lme n t-.a r· y t:. OIAli"' rd thE! staff and the officials who are 1.uorki.ng on this progr·arnrne, and Lht"! pressure they are under to turn over applications quite quickly. I want to say to the minister that the staff are doing a good job. I do want. to point out that I t h :1. n k IAJ·i. 1:. h 1.: h is prog ramrnE! 1:: he training component of the R2004-

programme is very important, so that i.t i.s not simply a programme of first come first serued get the jobs, but therc-:1 are somE! larger objectives. I arn concernE!d that of the figures given us today, from my ca1culation 16 or 17 per cent of lhE:1 postt.:ions so far created are going to students.

In l "i.ght of th(:1 fact that t:.his yc,1ar the government has cut its own gover·nmE!nt. fundE!d job crc,1Clti.on Pl"ogramrrtE! from thE! different departrn(:~nl.:s for l:he Summerti.me as ~~tt~dents cont.:inue to come out of 5 c h o o l. , h ·:i. g h s c h o o l. s t·: u d r:! n 1.: s a n d university students who are looking for work, it ls rectlly Cl''jUcaJ that in thE! coming IA.JC:H;!ks 1-.ht=! progrr:\111111€~ addrnss i ... hr,1 ur,1r·y serious problems students have, t h E! p a r t. i. c u l. a r n (;! c:! d s s t u d E! n 1:. s h ;,~ u c,~ in find:i ng work. Ot:hl;!i" than l:haL, Mr·. ~3pc,~akE!r, IA.IE!

J.ook forward to SE!Edng thE! programme developed, and perhaps by thE! ' end of it, if all the money is not used up in the private sector, we can put sorne more money into public sector programmes . Thank you, Mr. · Speaker . MR. WINDSOR: Mr . Speaker . MR . SPEAKER : The hon . the MinistE!r of FinancE! . MR . WINDSOR: Mr. Spe<::ti<E!r, I cannot hE!lp observe that it is amazing how U . b c;! I" "' l s F J n d i. '1: p o s s i b l P Cl"iticize the creation of so jobs, but IAJ8 :i.nu,~nd l:o g "i. ve:1 lots to criticize. bllt thE:~ ·l: () many i:I'HHn Mr.

Speaker, J want to make a jo :i.nt sLat : emE!nl.: on bc-:~l'li~l.F oF my c o J J e a g u e , thE! h o n . tl't E:1 PrE! s ide n t of TrNl.sury Roai"d, t.hf;! hard-working minister. L2005 May 17, 1988 Vol XL. On behalf of the Government of NeiA.Jfoundland r.md Labrador, I take great pleasure in announcing the approval of a pension plan For p a r t -- t i me E!tfl p 1 o y e e s of g o v E! r n 1r1 E! n t as well as its Crown agencies, boards and corrunissions.

This plan may also bE! off~~r(=!d l'.:o c E! r t.a :in full-time employees of public scH·u'i.ce orgr.:tn·i.z(:~ttons IAJhtch arr:• not necessarily operated by g 0 l)E! r n ITl (,

H) t , b I I t IAI lri. C h r E! J. y substantially on provincial fundtng. Tlri .s plrHl wi.J.J. RffcH; t approximately 5,000 part - time employees, the major it y of whom are employed in the provincia] hE!dll :h c<'lre sysl ·:em dnd t:ho Pl"OVincE! 1 S school boar·ds. They IAJ:i. 1. J. r E!C: wi. u 0. l: h e I:HHHd:- ~i't: s of a pension programmE! which have not been available before. Mr. Speaker·, thE! provision of a pension plan for employees who work loss than full-time is a signtf i canL employment equity iniU .ative.

Access to a pension plan is an important consideration for employees for whom working less than full --time or job shar :i.ng is the best E!rnployment option. Both the Task Force on Employment Equity for women and thE! Task For·ce on ErnpJ.oyrnc:!nt:. Equ .ity For people with disabilitie s rE:~cogn"i.zed thi.s in i:.hc,,ir· 1neport .:s . We are very pleased to .demonstrate furUH:~i" . golH:!rnrnent 1 s cornmitrnr;!·nt t.o employment equity through this i'lnnol .ltlCr,1m8nt t:Odf.'IY .

Thn pAns i.on plan ror· pdl"t .. -tttfiE! ernpJ.oyees IAJ:i11 bE• SE!paral:E! and dJ.si:"i.nc ·t: fi"orn t.hn pE!I'lS"i.on pJ.c:~n offered full-time public employees <'lnd will adopi · r.. rnot·H:!y pt.lr'cha s p forrna·t:. In oth~:H' IA.Jords, E!rnpJ.oyE!~ conlr i but"i.ons together with matched amounts frorn government or othE!r par·t.i . cipat . i.ng C:!rnployer·s IAI"ill No . 38 R2005

be i."nvested tn a separ·ate pension fund until retirement, at which time a retiring annuity is purchased.

This is similar in c o n c e p L 1: o a R (,~ g i s t e r· e d R E!i:. i i~ ~Hn e n t Savings Plan and is the type of pl<HJ most r.ornmonly U!;P.d by E!llipJ.oyer·s in t.hl':~ pi":lvatl':~ SE!ctor. ~~e hr.1uP. boP.n assui~<'~d by our· pens:i on advtso1ns that. t.hj s typE! of pl.;1n is lhe rnos t Hppi~opri . a Lr,~ for ernpJ oyees IAJho have limited amounts of pensionable S(-:!rvi.ce dtH~ to t·.he nature of their employment, and will. provide benefits reasonably comparable to those benefits offered full-time employees .

Further, in order to facilitate those employees who may move between full-time and part-time employment status, provision will be madE! to transfer th~dr pt:!nsion credits . T h :i. s p l a n w :i. l J. b e o f f <-:! r· I':~ d t o a 1.1 eligible employers and it is anticipated it will bP.come operational later this year after I.UI':~ h<.·llH! conslil.LC:!d 1.u-i.th all of l:h<,~ parties jnvolued and finalized administratlue dAtails.

UP.ry shortJy, government will be releasing all t he ner.essdry jnformation and plan details to l:h(:~ E!l.i.•3"i.bl.F.! empJ.oyE:!InS and l·.hf:!:'i.i" employees, as 1.uel.J as to the r·eJ.evc.HJ'i.: E!lnpl.oyr.~e organ'i.:zr.d ::i.ons. Later in this session, I IAJ:ill be a S k :i. 1'1 g l. E! cllJ P 0 f . t h :i s h 0 n . H 0 U s C:! 1: 0 introduce the appropriate l. e g :i s 1 a t i. o n . In closing, Mr.

Spl':~ak<,~r. may I say that the introductJ.on of thts plan demonstrates the Peckford Administration 1 s continued concern for :its E:~mployees and its commitment to the irnplernentatton of employment equity within the public serutce of our Province. SOME HON. MEMBERS: L2006 May 17, 1988 Vol XL MR. BAKER: Mr. Speaker. Mr~. SPEAKER: ThA hon . U1C:! lflr,~mi:H'!r for GandE!r . MR. BAKER: l"hi:\nk you, Mr. Speai<E!r. Ftr·st of all, T. hr•tvr;• to !> ay on bE!ha,lf of the official Opposi ti on, 'i.l.: "i.s aboul.: t:.·i.mE! t".h~~ rni . n:lst.(~r · startt:!d considE!r:lng t:h:i s kind of a p(H1s:lon plan. fht':!

Y have beon pushing for it for years. The p e o p 1 e who p u s h H d H s p c~ c:i. a ll y h a r· d , and who have written u s innumerable letters, are the nursE!S of the ProvincE!, and they feel that i t has been For some years their r:lght to be able to participate in s uch a plan. So i t is about t:irnE!. We wE<l.cornE! it. and we arH happy to se e that the g9vernment is taking th:i s step. There are some problems with it i·.hi'\L maybe the,~ mi.n"i.st(;!r can straighten out. I understand that !·: he ad m:i. n :L s t I" i'l L "i. v e de 1.: a :i. l s h au e not been finalized YE!'l. First of a l.

J. • 'L n UH'! h <,H.'\ J. i: h c i'll'' r.:! s y s h '! rn I arn assuming Hlclt thE! E:~mpJ.oyer' s r.:ont ·. lnibu(ton :i.s go -L ng Lo coin(;! Fr·om neiAJ mont':'Y th<:tt th E! goVE!r'nrnenl :: :Ls pu 1: t ·i.ng i.n i't nd 'i. s no 1: t:o b•:! squeezed frorn an alrE!ady sqUE!E!ZE!d he~lth care sys~ e m. ·rhe plan will be offer e d to a l l eLigiblE! E!rnpJ.oyers. Do t.hE!Y haVE! Lo pal~tici.pa l.:e? Hcli>~J many of thorn arE! going to parU.cipatE!?

And if thE:~r~~ is a money pr·obl~Hn, l.i.i<t:' in the heaJ.t.h care system, then perhaps we have to prov:i.de the extra money to make sure that these people partic"i.pate. fhere is nothing def:i.nitive about that y E! L. No. 38 R2006

1 After IJJI'l hi.we consulted 1.~or.ith aJ.J. of the parties involved. 1 I arn surpr·i.sed that thE1re hi)IS not yc,1i:. been consultation with the parties :in v o l v e d . You would t hi. n k 1-.: h c,1 minister wouJ.d have consulted with the parties before he made the a n n o u n c E! rn E!tl t . T h E! ad rn i n i s t r a t i v e details: In addition to not consulting with the parties, thE! administrat.i.ve detaiJ.s hetve not yet been finalized.

All too often this government have brought in programmes without having the adm·i.nistrat"Lvt1 del .·.ails ·FinctJ.jzE:1d and have run into all kinds of snarls <.'ind pr•obl.c,1ms i·.: hr.lf: hi'\ve rn.:-~de thE:1 pr·ogr·arnmes impossibJ.e to properly adminislri'\ta. So, I l.~oJouJ.d SIJggr:1st dE:1ta:iJ.s should have pt"f~v:i.ousl.y. ~30ME l-ION. MI::MB F I'~S: Oh, oh! MR. SPEAKF~R: Or·de:1r, please1! MR. BAI<ER: l.:hal.: beE1n i:.ha s r~ done Mr. SpE:1al<er, l.c-:~gislation t.~.Jill come before the House. We arE! looking fortAJard to seei.ng the legislat-ion to see exactly what this is all about. MR.

SPEAKER: The han. the member for Menihek. _SOME HON. MEMB E_.R._§ : Hear, hear! MR. F EN~-JTCK: Mr·. SpE:1al<er, since IJJe have be1en ma k i.ng · reprf~ so n-l:.f\ I.: tons for· 1:1 pension plan for part-time go tH! I" n rn E! n t r;1 rn p 1. o y ~~a s , i l'. 1. ~; go :·i. n g to look something like har·ping notJJ t.o poi.ni: out somf'! Ll"NnfHH:Joi.IS deficenc:ies w:itb the::1 proposal that 'i.s b~:!il'lg pU 1·.: rOI"IAJC\i"d hf~I"E! -I:.Odf\y, L2007 May 17, 191!8 Vol. Xt. One of thr:1 t.hi.ngs t.o~JE! should realize is that the vast majority of these pa~t-t "i. me employees are women.

If one looks at thE! employment statistics, one realizes that of the 19,000 part--t'i.me people i.n the labour force in 1986, a fu11 14,000 werE! t.o~Jornc;!n mnd only 5,000 tJJore rnen. So it is thE!Tn we ar'E! addrE1ssing thJs to. But, _ Mr·. SpE!akr:1r, IAH:1 havc,1 a pub1:i.c servi.ce pe1nsion plan, a tE!aChE!I"S 1 pr,1ns:ion plan, our·s and l:.hE:1 un:ifor·rn one, which arE! guarantE1E!d benE1fits b y s f: a 1: u t E! , g u ;:u· r.ut b:1 E! d b y s t a t u t E! that if you work that: rnany YE!clrs you will. gEd·. ·i. t: .. Not.o~J L•Jn di"E!

C rr:1a ti ng IAJhat 1 IAJOUl d C a 11 a ser:ond ·· Cli:'l.S'> pl;:'tn for l::h1:~ part-timers, in l.~oJh:ich tl'lE! b 0 h a V J. 0 IH' 0 f:- L:i'lf~ F 1.1 1'1 d L•.Ji. J.J. detE1rrnine thE! i'HIIOUnt Of lTlOI'IPY dVi'I.J.li•\bla ''tl'ld l·.hc;!l1 SOITIC"! SOI"t·:. of i:~ll annuity w:i11 bE! bought r.~t thE:• E:1nd of i_l . . Mr. Speaker, that is not IAJhat. IAJE! are pushing fot".

W.:1 are pushj.ng for inclusion of part-tirne employees in the public service pension plan so they wiJ.l gE1t the statutory bE1nefi.ts on a pro ra l:a basis and be guaranteed it by law, not:' by the chancE1 of t:hE1 rnarl<~~t or· how good the money rnanagE!rS happE!n to be ~t any onE~ tin1e. On that basis, Mr. Speake1r, IAJE! ar'E! q11 -L l:~~ di.sappoi .nt.(,1d to SE!E:1 that there is a Jess hi.ghly qua1ifiE!d plan being produced for them.

The other thing that is a good q u e s t 'i. o n abo u t 1:: h "i. s ·i. s t.o~J h a L IAJ i 11 happt=:Hl tJJhE!I1 full--'l:.'itnE:1 E!HipJ.oyE!E!S bc~come pai"'i'.-··l.::i.tnf:! Prnp1oyc:~es? MR. SPEAKER: Ord("1r, pJ easE:1! Before caJ] i.ng for Or·al QUE1stJons, No . 3 8 R2007

there was a point of order raised by the hon. thE! mc;!mber for Mc,111'J.hc,1k YE!Sterday. He quoted BE!aucheSnE!, 11 Quest:i.ons should not. ,,~nticJ.pctL:f:! a debate scheduled for thE! day, but should be rc,1SE!rVE!d for l::hE1 deba'l:H. 11 J think thE:1 hon. m(:!ITibel~ was quite i. n o r cl C'! i~ d s f rH' r\ s l: h a t t s conc(.;!r'nE!d. The only po:i.nt I LIJould l"i.l<t:! L:o ini'lluc1 :i.s C:!Vl"!l'l t.I'JOII9h :i.t had be~w announced bE!fOrE!hand t.:hat +:.hts pi'lri:.J.c:ul.clr -i.l:nm IAJOII}d bl':! debatE:1d, there was no absolute i:'ISSUI"cHJcc-'! l: hc:ll·. :i.l: IAJOI.Il.d·.

A!> to the question of amendments that he brought-:. up, Hd.s is for +.:he;! hon. House to decide at the appropriate t:irne, and I wi.11 see thf:HTI and IAJE:1 will decide whether they are in order. Oral Questions MR. DECKER: Ml" . Speaker . MR. SPEAKER: The han. Lhe mE!ITiber for L-.h(.;! S t:r·ai t of Relh1 Isle. MR. rJECI<f.R: My quE!Sti on M :i. n J. s 1:. e r of and Youth (Mr. is for· Clll. 'Lilre, Butt). the hon. RC:!Cr(,1i'll.:i.on T h c,1 m1.rn s i:r:! r IALi. J.l. k n OllJ i:: h a l:. !;trychninE:1 is b(,dng usf~d to poison animals in the. Roddicki:.on area .

It is bfd.ng used on a scaJ.e neVE!r bE:1for·c,1 usf:!d tn Cr:lnr.~da. T l: app(;!Clrs that the intE:1nt is to destroy all t hE! IAJi 1 d a n i rna 1 s -i. n t. he i'H' 1:1 a , t he foxes, minks, bear, bE!aver, you namE! it. MR. BAIIW: I think a fox bit you . MR. SPEAKER : Order, pl.r:1asc.;!! L2008 May 17, 1988 Vol XL MR. DECKER: Mr. SpeakE!r, i.t nc-:wE:H' ceasr:1s to amaZ.E! me holAI frJ.vilous thE!Y arE! IAJi.1.:h this vc,n·y ser·i.ous lnr.\tb:!r. It. is not a joking matter in Roddi.ckton, Mr·. Spf~akf:!l~.

Can the minister guarantee the p(~opl.E! of L:he i:li"na that. this poison is being u~ed in a p0rfec:i:.l.y s~fe manner and that thE!rE! is no dangE!Y' that: thi~; p o :i. s _on lll"i.ll c;! n d 1.1 p !d l.l-L n g f :i. s h I pets and maybe E!Ven harrn:ing humans? MR. SPEAKER : "The hon. Lhc,~ M:i.nisl.:E:!l" of Cult:ur·e, Recreation, and Youth. f1~_!._[!Lli: Mr. SpE:1ai<E!r, I hi::.IVE:~ ev(?.ry confidE!nCE! i .n thE! pE!Op1E! llJhO al"E:! i .nvol.ved "in t.hE! progr·arnme on· thE• Northern Peninsula to eradicate t.h(;! rc:<tb:id r=-ox s·it:ual:. ··.i.on thel"e.

WE! h a v e , i n f a c t I h E! a d :i n g u p a t. b c.-nn of experts in the Wildlife D:i.viston of thE! DepartrriE!nt of Cull:ure, R(,1cr·eat"i.on <Hld Youth, a Doctor Johnson, who is a world r f:~ n OIAJI'l (:! d ex p f:' r 1: ·:i. n 1.: hi. s f i c;! l d . So, Ml". Speaker, to anstAJE!I~ Hw hon. g0nlle~an 1 s question, the answer is yes, an absolute yes. MR. DECKER: As.tJppl e"riH:Hl tal~ y I Mr. Spe a ioH' . M fL.__5 P 1: A iSJL~ : A supplementar·y, Uw hon . th~:· tnornbc;!r fot" tht':"! Sti"i:d 1: of=- Bc,~1lE• Isle. MR.

DECKER: I am IAJondc,H·-i.ng IAJoulcJ l:he rn:i.n:ist:er· be so conftdent whE!n I tE!11 hirn that a consL:ituent told me, as late as J.a s t night, thai: hE! satAJ thE:1 po:ison on a r:iVE!r bank last we e_k w h :i c h t h j_ s LIJ E! E! I< j_ s u n cJ e r IAla t E! r· cl s i'~ res ul t. of t.: he s p r -.in g run- ···off? Now is the rnin ::lsl:E!r advised that. it. -Ls per·fc'!Cl".:ly safE! No. 38 R2008

to hmve strychni.n(~ placed on banks? Can he guarantee no Lo · 1-.hL~ fish o~· +:o tho ~>al.rnon? MR. SPEAKf::R: ri. v er harm The hon. the Minis ·ter Recreation and Youth. of Culture, MR. BUTT: M-r-:--sp<.;!akc:'r, if the hon. mc:,rnber has some absolute proof or evidence that somebody is doing something that is not in accordance with all r·egular r·ules and regulations, then I suggest l:hal hE! br·ing ti'llc!ln for·ward l:.o me and I will certainly investigate i. 1'..

I do not haue I:: he li.rnE:~ or the liberty to go to every single l. o c <:\ l "i. o n "i. n R o cl d i. c k l:. o n I.•.J h ('' ;" e t. h :i. ~; HXE:~I"CiSt~ is und<~~riAlay to eradicate a tJ<:,ry, tH:!ry S(~l".ious p;"oblern, i'IS the member so d.ghtly poJnted ou l:, ono I:. hi'\ I.: L~le <'li"(~ put l.: .. i ng r.\ lot of IWHtE!Y :i.nlo to N'ad:icate <:J.ncl fll" I';!

IJ (~ 1'1 1.: 1·. h J ~; t (;! r• I" j_ b J. (~ d j_ S 0 d S f'! f i" 0 I'll spreading with fox on the Northern Po n i. n s 11 J. a . f:l <~~ c R u s 0 .i F i n fa c 1: ·i 1.: spJ"ead to the re,st of the Island, l: I·H~Hl I/JE:1 1/J() u l d be .i. n a s 'i. mi. J. r:\ r position to the Labrador portion of I: he Prov-i.nce, and Ontario and so on, where we 1/Jould be getting into some kind of a protective programme and maintenance programme every year that would cost millions of dollars.

So 1/Je are using every method at our disposal to E!radicate the rab:id fox .- WE! are do:ing :i.t u·n.d<H' controlled conditions 1/Jith the best expertise available in thts country, bar none. [f t.he hon. mf:,mbE!r finds i:<~ny th·i .ng IAil"ong, has p1noof that thE!rE! is s ornE! 1-'. hi. ng 'Alro ng got ng on, t'. h''' n t suggest . he should do the r·o s pons i b 1 o 1·. h·i ng r:<t ncl br•"i, ng .i. l: i·.o n1y attE~ntion, at IAJh:i.ch tiiTJ<'' :it IAli.l.l. bf~ l:akrHl Ci:'li"O off fOI" 'l-.1-liAJ:i.l:h. L2009 May 1. 7, 1. 988 Vol XI.. MR. DF.:CI<f.R: A final supplementary, Mr. Speaker. MR.

SPEAKER: A final supplementary, the member for Strait Isl.<.;!. MR. DECKER: th<;! of hon. BE!l]E:' The last report said only three foxes tested pos:i.tiue for rabiE!S. I ask the::~ m:inisl:<;,r, js this rabies outbreak as bad as the min:isLer prf:~vi.ously fe<H'<,1d? o·.id he not panic? Is it rE,a11y nE!CE!SSc~ry to !dlJ.? MfL.._BAIRD: What a 1/Jarped m:ind! PREMIER PECI<FORD: You l .•lt:!r<,~ l:he one boats · coming across MR. DECKER: tAl<:·\ n t od l:o thE! Gulf. sLop 'Is it really nec<~1ssar·y to k:i11 AV<~ry IAJild i'\nitnal. in the Roddickton area?

D:id the mJnister consider any other solution jnstead of the final solution? MR. SPEAKER: fhe han. l::h(~ M:ini.str,~r· of Cu1ture, Recreation and Youth. MR. BUTT : Mr. SpeakE!r, I did gitH! the hon. member mor'E:1 cr.c;,dit l':i'li"Hl t:o ask that kind of a stupid, absolut:E<I.y s+:upi .d qUE!S l:i.on. SOME HON. MEMBERS: ii<'!Hr, he<:lr! MR. BUTT: ----·-What question would you ask me toclr.1y · i . r~ tAJO Look no i'lct'"Lon IAJhE!I'l lAW had a rab:i.d fox on l:hE:! Northorn P r-~ n :i. n ~; 111 a ? T !·; 1.1 g g (! s l:. t hE~ h o n . member 1/Jould be up whistling No. 30 R2009

another tune. At great cost to the taxpayers of this Province, Mr. SpeakE!r, this mirbster and the department thRt I represent recognized the potential d i s a s i:: t1 r . I f y o u d o n o 1.: h i:llHl d SE!nsible qUE!St.ion to ask, I suggest the hon . rrJ(;!mb(:!r' rf.:1rTii'lj. n Jn his sE:1at. SOME HON. MEMBERS: II c,1 iH' , hear· ! MR. BAKEl(: MJ". Sp~:1ake1~ . MR. ~3PE(.)I<f.R : The hon. the member for Gi'lnder . MR. BAI<FR: ·---------I haVE:1 another samf~ alariTI:i,st . obviously hE! alar·rnE!d. question minish1r, has be corne SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, .o h! MR.

BAKER: to thE! because quite The minister•s approach to solve the problem is to IJ.dpe out alJ. of the animals :in a gt•H111 ar(,1a, i·:hE! scorched earth policy. The me!rnber for Lhe Strait of 8E:1lle Isle hi:ls not offered any specifics, so I 1Ad.1 J. g ·i. IJ e h i 1r1 a c o 1.1 p 1 r;! o F spf~cifics. Does the rnin:lster· not r't1i::t 1. -i_ z e the'\ 1: Fox r;! s IAI:i. '11 o<.·d·. good meat more readily than poisoned TnC:lr'li:? lid~; Lho rrr:i.nJstr=!i" con~~ider·ed. instead of this R ;:-un b o · s t: y l. e '" p f>r' o i:H: h • u s i. n g cag€>.s? Tt is not Funny! Hun d r· o cl s oF d n i.

ITii'l 1 ~; n r o b o-i. n 9 shot, many of t.hE!rrt for no reason. lias hE! consider'E:!d usj.ng r:i:·l9E!S, us:ing good mE!at, trapping t:.he animals and hold i ng them for a period of timE!? MR. SPEAKER : The han. the MinistE!r of Culture, Recreation and Youth. May 17, 1988 Uol XL MR. BUTT: Mr. Speaker, Dr. arisen again. SOME HON. MEMBERS: ii (~ f.-H', h (,1 iH' ! Mf~. BUTT : Thurlow has YE!S, Mr. SpeakE:1r, wo have indN•d, Lhr.·\1: and mor · r~1. In F<:·lc'l:., 1.1.JE! i'AI"e doing that. We arE! to a dE!gJ~N!, J. nd -i. ro c i: l y, ornplo y ·i. ng peop 1€~ on the .

Northorn Pc,1ninsu1a t::o go out i'lnd hunt i:-lnd l:.r'<'lP J"ab:i.d r::-ox(;!s in pdJ"ticular, and othE!r anima1s t.o sr,,,,, ·i.f :i.n fclCi: {:his d · is(~asc;! is spreading. To datE! I can se:1y, you l<noJJJ, IAdth somo conf ·i,d(HlCE!, t.hi:~t we have only had three cases thc.<tt tested posiLtue. Well, that is mar·velous, is it not·? l mee:1n, it would be better tf iL were one.

If we do not have anothE!I" ca SE! r· e p o r l:. (;! d IAri L h l:·. h E! (,1 ·.i q h l:. y -- o d d carcasSE!S v.1e arE! nOIAJ SE!nd:ing up, i.f those tesLs con1e back rwgat. i~u>., t he n i n s i x rn o n t h s t j HH'! tAle c a n say, baSE!d on sornE! sc:i.E>.nt:ific data, that we have accomplished what we have set out to do . SOME HON . MEMBERS: Hea_r, hE!ar! MR. BAKER: M1". ~)p(,1i:l.kE!r, a suppl.emr:!ntar·y . MR. SPEAKER: The han . the member for Gander.

MR. f!AKER: 1-1 i'l (; l: h P ITI i. n :i. s l: ~1 r· c o n s i. d (;! r· e d , i.nst(;!ad of using bu1J.et s to shoot: 1: h f:' ~; C:! f o x o ~; Fl n d IAJ h <.·\ 1:: r=! v E'! r· o t h E! r· animals that they are shooting, using tranqutltztng dart::s and, again, ho1d:lng and ·tE!St:ing the anirnctls while they are stiJ.l al:i.ve, instead of IJ.Iiping thE!rn c:d1 out? SOME HON . MEMBERS: Gr.:1t your shots! No. 38 R2010

MR. SPEAKF.:R: Order. please! Th(~ hon. ·l:ho M-i.ni.si·.c,~l" or CuJ.i'.:l.ll"0., I~E!Creati.on and Youth. MR. BUTT : Mr. Spl':~akE!r, IAJe looked at all methods to approAch l:lri.s vc.,~ry serious problem in a comprehensive way. I have confidence in the staff I have doing this, heading up this programme for me, along IAJith thE:~ best expertise we haVE! in t:his countr·y. NotAl, I suggest to the hon. member who was the expert on fenitrothion, and he got dn awf u 1 bath in that , that hE! i s probably go-ing cwt on a l.:i.rnb now.

Because of his friend from the NorHHH'n Peninsul.c1, hE:~ is go.ing to continue to ask stupid questions as the:1 han. ITI(.'!Iflbel~ ·for L:hc-:1 Sl:'.r·r.d.t of Belle Isle has done. Mf~. SIMM~3: You st.ay :i.n yo111~ sr: 1<.~t. l".oo! MR. BIJTT: Sit down! You are making a fool of yourself . MR. SPEAKF.R: A final supplementary . ' MR. BAKF.R: Mr. Speab:1r, J.l: i.s uer·y ni. ce, instead of answe1ring the quE1stion. to att.<:J:ck l:.he questioner, which is the only thing that this ministe1r knows hmAJ to do properly. SOME liON. MEMBERS : Hear. hear! MR.

BAI<ER : Are we to understand from what the min-ister says, that you ctre collecting thE! foXE!S that ar'E! br:~·i ng po i.son( :1d by strychn-i.nc~ i.·1nd the foxes, rabbits, bE:~ars, lynx and so on 1-Hld S(.~l1d"i. ng thern di~Jr.1y For· tesUng? Doc,1s he knotJJ 1AJher•c.,1 1_2.0 ll MHy 1.7, 1.91313 lJol. XL i:o go l:o find l:IH1rn? MR. SPEAKER: The hon. i.:h(~ Mi.n'isl·el" or Cult:ur·e, Recreation and Youth. MR. llUTT: I can tell hon. members in the House i:hi'l 1:. tAle hi;w c,1 ned: had one rabbit to date. PREMIER PECKFORD : I got them all snared. MR. BAI<ER: What about bears? What about lynx? MR.

WOODFORD: What about Liberals? Mli. BUTT: No. T~IE! hon. rnc~1rnber· rnadE:! a sl:.aternenl .. r.~bou'l: l:hr:! 1~c:1bbi !'.~; Ftnd Fox~~s dncl bc.,~at" and so on. w(~ hav(~ not: had i.'tny I"C.~bbi. l · .• br,~<:·11", Ol" lynx l:: o date. So, Mr·. SpE!akE!Y', lAH~ ai"C'! us ·in'!) l:h0 bosi.: approuc~!d rn"l'l':. hocls that we have at our disposaJ. to er·Mii . cai:El i:hJ~; pr·obl.c;!ln on t:he Northern Peninsula, and, go :ing i'l l o n g 1". h o p ~~ 1.: h 1.: h ;:~ 1: IAJ E:~ a r· e g o :i n g now, Mr. Spe1aker, there is a hjgh clegi~(H! of SUCC(!SS.

Whi.lE:! '.in t:he beginning I told hon. mE!ITibE!rS in thE:1 Hou~:(:1, just. a coupl.<'! of 1nonl':hs ago, that in fact. thE! rE! ~~Ja s t hr:1 possib-ility t:hal. lAJe might not. be successful, bu:t I can say today, tAdth more sur(~ty· and mor·e confidence, that in fact lAJe <H'e on the right track and could wipe out this dreadful disease. !nl e:1 c o ul. d IAJ 'i. p c,1 o u l: 1:: h :i. s d r· e ad f u 1 disease and it 1Ali11 cost l:.he taxpayers i .n this Province approximately $?00,000. To ITIE!, M r . ~) p e d k o i" , ·i 1:.

ITI <'t k t'! s q q o d s E.~ n s e from a biological point of view <'lnd fi"Orn an f:1c:onolni . c po .. ini~ of v:i. e!AJ that we should put a11 r'E!SOurcE:~~;, No. 313 R20 11

both financial and human at our dis p o sa 1 , into this pro g r· a mm e t. o eradicate the rabid fox on the Northern Peninsula. . MR. SPEAKI..!f: Order, please! T ask hon. ministers if thE::y would pl.~:!clSB ke:(;!p i':h~~J . r c~ln!;IAH~rs short . , as lhe questions should also be. MR. LONG : Mr. ~)PC'!c:·1ket" . Mr~. ~3PFAKFI~ : The,: hon . thE:: rnC::Hnbet" fol" St. John 1 s r: i'l !; L . MR. I..ONC: Mt".

Spf~aker, I IAJOUld like to ch<.·1nge · I ~ o p :i. c !> fi"Orrt t"ab :i. d fOXf~!; apd s E:: e if we can dE!al :in a more s ''' r i . o u s Fa s h "i. o n IAJ i 1: h a n o 1: h o , ~ IJ E'! r· y :irnpor·t .ant i.ssue. I would J.ikE:! to put a question to the Premier concerning negotiat-ions w:i.th the federal govc'!r · nmEHll, as hE! ·.i.s the person most responsible for putting forward this government 1s position, with respect to day care .

I IAJO u 1 d l. i k r:: to c:1 s k co u l. d the Premier give the House an update on the status of negotiations bettAJeen ·this Province and what !:his Prov t nce is E:~xpecting to r·r:: ceive frorn thE! fEH:ler·dl. goVE!rnm~~nt :in i:hr-:! t•.li'liJ of a cost-sharing formula so that the gover·n1rH:!nt ITii"tiJ bco' abl1 :;! to 9('! 1:. on · t.ii'ith taldng some of thE! ·i n t tid l·. i. v e s 1.~1 h ·.'i. c h 1 n"' n y p F.! o p 1. (~ :i. n the Province have been waiting for f o ;~ s ornc:! t j . rnc~ ? l'."J.Jl.!...__§. P [ AJS, E il : ThE! hon. t:.hc,: Prom-i.c,n· .

PREMIER PECKFORD : As I .undc:!r·stcflnd ·i. 1: 1 1-:.hE:! Pr·ov"i.nc~'!, through the Mjnister of Social Services (Mr. Tobin) and t:he Minister of IntergovernrnentaJ. L2012 May 17, 1988 VoJ. XL Affairs (Mr. Dawe), is now in negotii'ltions with the federal government on the day care pr•ogr·ammc-:1. I sur·e t.hc,: Minist :tH' of Social Services can gj VE! the hon . mc-::rnbf~r mor·e informa -t:ion on :i.t:. iF he so dE!StrE!S, but we ar'E! nolAJ into n c-:1 got :i.

C\ t 'ions wt l: h 1: h (.;! f (;! d l'' r· a 1 government as a result of their announcc ,:rnr:!n l': on dr.1y cdr'(,: thr.1 t: IAJaS approved by Cabinet ttAJO or·· thr'EH! bJr~ekG i:·1go. ~,Je hc11J('! gonE~ t.hr·ough thE:: whole pr·ogt"arnrne, haVE! gonE :! back to thr~ fc:!dfH'r.d govfH'nrrtcHlt., and at"E:1 :into nE:'go t:tations noiAJ IAJ·.it:h 1 : h:~ l"nln1J c1nt rn :i.n.i.s t:r'!r'i(:' S ·i n OLt:aiAJi:·l. MR. I..ONG : A supplementary, Mr . Speaker . MR. SPEAKER: A sup pl. e rnc~ n 1.: r.1 I" y I 1-. h f:! hon . l.: hE:! rnernber for· S ·t . John 1s Ea s t. MR.

LONG: T IAJould l .ike to put·: rny supp]ernentary again to the Pt"C::Hni.E!r. WE:: . had som~:! d.iscuss ·.:i.on in the Social Services Estimates CommH .: tee about t: he nE:~got.:iations. I would likE! to ask thE! PrE!Tni.E!r, on Uw l.ong--awa:i t .. ed legislat.:ion from this gouE::rnmE!nl: to dE!aJ. lAJ·:it:h chi.J.dren undE!r thE:: age-?. of t.IAJO, i::.~nd the lack of day care licensing and regulations in this Prov"i.nce and other initiatives, such a s the n c;! c,~ d For f d mi. J. y d ;:·1 y cdr· c,: I j _ s L hE!

Province waiting to take J n :i. t '.i. c'l. t .i. 11 n !; :i. n t h ( ~ s C'! a I" f~ as u n t·.·. J, 1 it resolves negotiations w:i.·th l:he fr~c:ln;"al gouot"nrnP.nt ~;o +·.hc•1 L -L l: can SE~E:: what. k:ind of r.1 poo1 of r:·t.tnds :i. 1'. h d S [- 0 c:i e c:-1 J. IAJ'i. 1: h '? MR. SPEAKER : The h on . l': he ·prE! rni. E! r . PREMIER PECKFORD : You cc:~n t··.ha t: question, GJ.onn. MR. SPEAKER : No. 36 R201.2

The han . the Minister of Social Sf~r,Ji. cc~~; . MR. TOBTI\I : Ml". SpeclktH', as it r·oJ ates ·l:o the quc:'!s ti.on put fal"th by t:he Jn(~rntH~I" fo1" St. John's East, the issues that he raised have been addressed i r 1 the s t I" at r::~ g y pI" o g I" a rnm e as put Forth by the federRl gouernrnenl, one which could have some quite significant benefits for the day care programmes '.in l:his Province. As it relates to what he put forward they are hopefully going t:o be addr·essed.

T.l: ts the,~ intention of the federal gover·nrnent to try i':lnd conclude the negotiations and have the legislation introduced into the House of Commons by JunE!, which is only a few weeks away, Mr. Speaker. I think that looks after !'.he:' ur'gE!I'lCY of l::hE~ q1.1est:i.on of l:'.he han. gc:~n tlerni'Hl. MR. LONG: Mr . Spea.l<or. MR. SPF::AKFR: A foinal supplern~?.n'Lai"Y, l:he hon. l:h<':~ rnc,mlbOi" for· St:. John 1 !; [;:~~;t. MR. L.ONG : Mr . Spc.;!ai<E:~r. I would likE:1 to ask lhe Minister of SociAl Services, by way of a final supplernentai"Y, :i r· l h e p e o p 1.

H of 1:: h t-) P I" o 'J i n c e , r.-1 n d cer·tainly many of the working mothers who are still having to wait for· any initjatiVE! from this government l:'.o indicate its commitment to day care, can expect, before the House cl6ses this session, that this minjster and ULi.s goVE!Y'nmE!nt wi.ll bring in nE!W 1E:~g:is1ation tAJith rE!ferencE! to some of the areas that I have mentioned in earlier questions? MR. SPEI11<ER: "fi1·e-hol1:" .... -thE! Minister of Social S (;! r

I) i. C E! S , I .?.0 J 3 May 17, 198H Vol XI.. MR. TOBIN: M r . S p o ct k o r , I t: h i. n k J. '1: i. s t h i s gouernment that has led the way in d i'l y c i:-l i" o :i. n t lri. !; P 1" o 1J'i n r: c:! . W h J. c h administration and which 90Vf '!Y'I'lHIC'!nl: !Ali'\! :: il: t:hat i.nLi"Odl.IC(:!d the day-care programme? Which 90\JE!I"I'lHIC'!I'l'l: I.~JHS "i.t, pl""'iOi" to th'i.s adrninistr·ation, spent rrl'il1ions oF dol1Hrs, Mr. Speaker, as it relates to a day-care programme in this Province?

Wh i ch government was it that just opei'H:!d up one of l: he,~ mo s l:: modern clay·- c a l"e c E'! n tc~ r·s in this Province in the Confeder~tion Building in less than a year? It was thjs administration that has done it, Mr. Speaker. WE! haVE! rnoVE!d fcH'IAJdrd i.n •~1.'1 soc:i.i.-11. pr·ograrnmes, and, indeed, in aJJ. pr·ograrnrnE!S of the government, and we will c o n t i n u E! at: L he s arnE! p a c (;! ct ~; IAH~ h <.·1 'J F.! 1 n L h c~ p a s t . T h a t. s h o u l cl augur WE!ll, Ml". SpeakE:!Y', fo1" ddy · ·Ci'\Y'r~ pi"09Y'r:·1l'riiTIO~> i:-lnd E'!VC;!I"Y Lhinq else in this Province. MR. W.

CARTER: Mr. Spei.'lkor. MR. SPF.:AKF.R: The hon . thE! mernbG:~r TIAJi. J.l. in g r.ll:: e . MR. W. CARTER : My quE:,stion goes l:o the M'i.n:isb:!r of Fisheries (Mr. Rideout). I believe it 1.~1as the end of January last yectr, some eighteen rnonl:'.hs ago now, thE! rninistE1r, in conj unc l .. ion wi.th ~d s FE~deral counterpart, cornrnissionE!d i:l study by the Link Group into the fish processing plant licensing Rrocedures and policies. Mr.

Speaker·, at: thE! tirne I bE!lj eVE! th(! rn"i.ni.ste::,r· prorn:i.S(~d thc.~t t.hal: r·E~port. would be avaiJable by June of last y<:1ar, dppr·oxiiTii:-ll ::f'!l.y l:.IAJf!}V('! 1nont.hs ago. No . 3 8 R2013

he has received even a preliminary copy of that report, and, if so, lAJ h y t.-~.Ja s it not I"<~ l <0! as c,H~ , or do C:1 s . he intend to release it? MR. SPEAKER: The han. the Minist:E!r of Fisheries. MR. RIDEOUT: Mr. Speaker, we certainly do ·i.ni::E!nd t:o reJ.c,1asc,1 tho fi.nNl rE!por·t ·. once it :i.s made availab1e to us .

LE!t me tc,1l.l. l·:.he hon. geni·.l.c~rnHn C~nd tho House that we received the pre l. :i. m :i. n"' r· y r· c,1 pol" t 111 u c h J. i'l t or i: h i:l n had be e n i n d i c at e d f r· om t h E:1 consultc.~nl:·s. rhc.~ d(:!pi.~l"i'.lflf:!l"lt C.·lnd var·ious Cab:i net CornrnJ. u~ees, and C ;_'( b i. n o t , a s i'l t~J h o 1 e , h r.w e cl o e~ 1 l: t.o~.ri.th the prc~ljm:inar·y t"eport and h i'llJf~ s H n i:. ·i. L l::tt:H: k · l: o t h r~ consultc-nd:s, to thc:1 Link Gr·oup, for finc.d.:i.zed: i.on i':Hld fOI" presentation of the fina1 report +.:o us. li1Jc,1 (~XPC:!C'l:. l::o hr:-~vc.:! t:hc.'tl·.

J.n our· hands almos L arty day. MR. W. CAlHER : A supplementary, Mr . Speaker . MR. SPEAKER: A supplementary, the member for n~illingate . MR_. -~.SA RT~_E: hon. the Mr. Speaker, maybe the minister can tell. us whE!I'l h(,1 rE!Ce"i.vc ;! cl l::he report, and tJJas it sent back to l:he const~l.I::Jng gt"oup I"C;!quost.Jng that cer·ta:in revisions . be ITtc-~dE! in ·i.l·? Ml~. IUDF.:OUT : Ml" . Spc~r.lket" . Ml~. ~;PfAK[R: T h (~ h on . l: h r~ M"i. n -.i. s 1·. r~ r· o'f F ·i. ~; h P 1" ·i_ (.~ ~; . MR.

RTOF.OIJT: Mt". ~:>p~:!ai<E!I", I arn nol~. quite sur'(:1, so I tAI"i.JJ. hr:·lVC'! to dwck IAJhr'!n t.-~.Jo 1"<->.cetved it .. That is a factua] md i:: l.:E!r t: haL T jus i·: do not hi::t.v c,1 on L2014 May 17, 1988 VoJ. XL. l: he top of indicate to that IAH~ had rE!port -- my her.~d. the hon . r·ecc,dvEH:I a 'M R . W . C A R T E R : This year or last year? MR.

RIDEOUT: But I cEd gentleman Pl"e 1 :irni nary It was in the latter part of 1987 . that the department had dealt with . i.t, Lhett: gotJpr•ntnc ;! nl·:., t.·.hr·ough the v a r·i ou s Cornrni t teE! s of Ca b:i. nE! t ;:~ n d t h f~ IAJ h o J o C e1 b --j n (;! 1.: h a d d c;! cil 1. t t~i.th it, and lAJe r·esubm :it'l:-.E!d tl'lf::' d I" r.~ f '1: I" r;! poi" t , 1.: h P. pI" E:! T oi. rn:i. n i"t I" 1J r·E:~port, to thE! consuJ.Lant.

L~r:ith gotJr :!i"nmr ,1 n 1: 1 •; ob!>OI"lJi.~ t · to n ~; r:-~nd hi:'tVI::! askc~H~ them notAl to pt"oc ec~~ d to ·F--i.ndliz,:! ·1-hf~-i . r· 1- i. nr.~l doctllrtl::!nl-.: and present it to the department. MR. W. CARTER: Ml". Sp~~c;lk<'!r' . MR. SPEAKER : A f·i.n<:ll suppl.c~~rn(:!n-l:.r:1r·y, Mr·. ~3pE:!fiti<E~r . MR. W. CARTER: A f·i.na1 suppl.c,1m(:!nt.ary, Mr. Spc;!akE!r . A g i!t :i. n , Mr . ~> p (~a!< E~ r , l". h c~1 rrd. n :is -1: e r· is vague. He says he received the r c,1 p or· t s o rn (:! t. ·i. rn c;! i. n 1. 9 H 7 . We ll , this is 1988, six months have (:! l. i.~ p S (:' cJ . T.

IAJO n d C! r• C d rl 1:: h l:O rninistE!r tE!ll thE! HouSE!, then, Ml". S p o i'l I< C! r· , l~ o 1~.1 h i'l 1:: c-~ x I: (;• n t IAJ :i l. J. t. h e findings of t:hat study impact on his recontl.y announced restr·ucl:uring, a rc;!st.r·uctur·ing, of courso, wh i ch i ncl.udPd ~he processing sector?

WiJl not the f -.i. n d i. n g :; of I: h A ·I: I. ·i n k r· ~:! p o r· t.: , having to clo with licencing , pi·' ocnc:lui "O !> <:'Inc:! po'.l ·i c..-i.os, h.~tVE! something to do with the I" f;! !; 1: l" II C 1-: lll"..-i. 1'1 g FJI"Og i" i.·llrtlTIH ·:i.n general, for example, as it applies t o the procpssing soc~or? MR. RIDEOUT: No. 38 R2014 •.:

Mr . Speaker . MR. SPEAI<EI~ : Tl·w hon. i:.hE:1 M'.i nister· of Fisheries . .MR. RTDFOUT : Ml" . Speake!", I L.t.r:ill check the date IAJ h o n g o lJ c.~ I" n 111 ''! n t I" f'! c o i. 11 r:! d t h o r·c,1port·, but I clo ki'lOIJJ :lt. tJJas thE! 1. i'l 1: UH' par· t () r J. 9 8 7 0 H: l~li:~ !; n 0 1-. last January or February or Rnyl ::lring of 1: 1'11'1 '1·: natur·r~, Jt IAJOIIld have beE!rt sometimE~ thE:1 early par ·t of last Fi:ll.l. .

But, as l~o t:he ot:hE :!r pari: . of the hon. gentleman's qUE!Stion, ther·e is absolutely no connection lJJhatsoevE!r in tE!rms of the announced dE!bt restructuring of the inshore fishermen. There is no connection to the processing sector. MR. W. CARTER : I tJJi% tal.king about l:hE! $60 rni.l.l. i. on fed c,1 raJ. I p r· o u inc J i'll t n s hoI" E! Fisheries Agreement . MR. RIDEOUT: ·oh, the Inshore~ Fisheries Ag reE~mo nt. Thi'l i: ·i. !; a di. ff E:H'f:Hli' _matter, Mr. Speaker, a different rnt'l.LI:l"!r' al.togP.i·hc.~r·. Thdl'. I!; i'l d'.lffc~I"C-?.nt quinta] of fish, Mr. S p E~ r.\ k (~ i" .

T h f'! i" (:! r:~ I" r,1 f> I" 0 g l" i'l rnrnr:! !; "i. l'l the Inshore Fisheries Agreement 1: h c:l t i'\ r· 0 r:~ p p l i. c a b 1. f:! 1". () 1: h 8 processing sector. And all t.he L"i.nl< st:udy i. s do-ing is J.ook t ng <.'It tl:le li.CE!ncing procetiur·es clnd polic"i.es and requJrements of t he inshore processing sector. So I cannot see dny connection, any irupact., irnrnediatE!, short-term or long-t.er·m, uis·-a-v:i.s the the Inshore Fisheries Agreement, and whatever might come out of the Link study, Mr. SpeakE!r. Nom~ at all, as far· as I can seE!. Mf~. LUSH: Mr. Speaker· . Mc:~y 17, 1.9013 lJol XI..

MR. SPEf.IKF.:R : The hon . the member for Bonavi.sta North. MR. LUSH : T h (,ll) H i.•\ q 1,1 (,1 s 1: i. 0 n r 0 Y' 1.: h (! M:i n :is I ~(~ r· of Municipal Affairs (Ml". Br·ett . ). I. <:·\ :; 1·: y o i'\ r· , l 9 B '/ , o n A p i" ·i 1 l "i , 1·: h E'! then Mjnister of Municipal. Affairs ( Ml" 0 A i" (~ ·1·.

t) I" E:! l E:' d s ('! d i:'. h ('! department's Capital Work s Pr·ogr·awrnc,1 foi" l:: hr·d.: y~:~<H' . He d J d this by beating himself on the c:h(~s·/·. t:'lnd sli'lpp:ing hirnsE=!lF on t: h1:! back, by saying that this lJ.Ji':lS th~:! earl.i . C:!SL·. i:.iJOE! E!UEH' ·t.hr'.tt th(;!SS Capital Works Projects had been announced. Now, Mr. Speaker, it is May 17, a month later. MR. SPEAI<ER: Or·der, please! Tht:! hon. ITIE!mbE!r :is lri.Hl rnakin~J a speech. t would ctsk hjs question. Lo dj.r·o c t: r1 _~. LUSH: My qUE!St.ion, Mr·.

SpE!ak~1r, to the uri. rds'l:rH' i. s: :r. wondc,~r· Cdl'l thE! minister indicate, by rapping h -i. m s C:! ·1 f o n l: h c~ k n 11 c k l. e ~' , IAJ h 1J l·:. h .i s delay this year? MR. SPf:AI<ER: Thr,1 hon . Uw M"i. rri s I:!:! I" of MUI'l'.'.i.c:i.pi\\1 Affairs . MR. BRETT : M'" I • th~::1 ~1pr,1c~knr, Capital. soon . t'lJL_ L U ~.!:! : we wilJ. be announcing Works Projects very A supplementary, Mr. Speaker . MR. SPEAKER: A suppl.(~rnc,1ntar•y, the hon . LhE! member for Bonavista North . MR.

LUSH: T t :i !> the 1\Jo. 113 ;:~ l'fl() l'l +:. h rn·i nj s te r lc:'ll'.E:!r', Mr:·lY l. 7 . adrntt t:hc~t: W-:i.l.J. 'lh'.i.s

r·equtrement, of asking councils to s u brni. t: d f i

I) f ~ - y f~ a r p J. d n , 'i. s becoming a charade and a boondo<JgJ.e tA.Jhen they do not knoLu what monies they are going to gE!t in 191!8, l:.o say noth "i. ng of 19B9, 1990, 1991, and so on? Wjll thE! minis t er not admit that his requirement of requiring council to put in a five-year plan is becoming a bit of charade? MR. SPEAKER: Thn hon . the Minister of Municipal Affa ·i.r·s . Mf~. BRETT : No, Mr. Spf:~aker·, it. is not. Obv J. ou s 1 y "i. ·F IAJO dJ"O to k noiAJ 1~1h (H'r,~ t.ue iH'f~ going over the next four· or· fi.lJC! Yf'!dr's, I:l'lC!n 1.110. IAJHni'. l.o knOIAJ what the.;!

E!Xp<-'!ctat.ions of l:he V i:H' ·i. 0 II S I. 0 I I n C i. l. S <:·U" f:~ i.'1 C l" 0 S S 1·: h 0 Pr·ov :incn. That :i.s t.~Jhy tAlE'! havt'::~ f.·\!) !U! d f 0 r· t h n F "i l)f'! - y 0 r'\ I" p '1. ;:~ n ~; . T r.~n1 pJ E:!dSf!d to t:E!] 1 thf:' hon. lTI E!rnber 1·: h <.·\ 1: .T t h :i. n k < :~ l.l. of -1: h n co 1.1 n c i 1 s across thf~ Pr·.ovince rC::~qUE!Sting cF~pital works money or F~t least mos L of them anyway, have submitted their five-year plans, and they have been a great help to us. For exampl.e, IA.Je knetAJ t.his yc-:lar· thi'lt counc:i.ls wer·e looking for· appi"OxirnaLE!ly $160 rrd.l.l.-Lon.

Had WE! not had the fiVE!-yeal" plans we would not havf:~ tH~en able -l:.o pu L a figure on it. So it does help the department to plan. I do not think we can do without it, real.ly . MR. LUSH: ~r: j_ n i'1 j~- s Ll p p 1 ('!ff)(:~ n t H i" y I M r· . s p ~~ ;:~ k ~H' . MR. SPF.AI<F:r~ : A final supplementary, the hon. t.h(~ rnr-:!mbE!r' Fo1" llon.:-~wi. s l'.i:~ 1\Jor· Lh. Mf~. Ll.l~311 : Ml".

Spc,'akf~l", I tAJondc.;! r' :i f t he rn :i. n i s 1: f:! r c <:~ n '.i. n d :i. c "'I t·: c,~ ;:~ l :i. 1:. 1.: l r,~ 1..2016 May 17, 1988 Uol XL more pre!cisely whE:1n councils can ex pee 1.: ;:~nnoLincernE!nl.: oF l ~ he capt tal works projects. Will he inform 1 .: hc,~ l·lousE:! i'1S l:o IAih ·.ich t.•JHY he~ pJ.ans to make this announcement? Will ho do this Hous~::~ t:he court~:!SY of r~::1l10!asing thE! dE!tails of . l:hE! cmpi.l:al u.Jor·ks projE!Ct:s J.n this Chamber? MR. SPEAKER: ThE! hon. thE! MinistE!r of Munj cipaJ. AFfai.r·s . MR. Bf~ETT : Mr·.

Speai<E!r, the cap:itcll • fll" 0 j 0 C t S IAJl, 1 J. b f;! iHl 1'1 0 I I l'l C H d course and will be tablE!d li 01.1 !; (~ . MR. F.FFORD: Ml". Speai<E:H' . MR. SPEAI<F.R : IAIO I''k S -L n d l.ll:> in l.: he l"he hon . t·.h r:! rnolni:)(H' Fo r" f'Ol " ·L. ck! Gr·av E~. Ml~. EFFORD : Thank you, Mr. Speaker . M y q lH~ S t i. o 11 -i. s t o l: h e Mi. n :i s t. E! r o f Health (Dr. CoJ.lins) and it: again concerns bed closures at the hospitals. I would like to table this Tn(;!ITIOr•andurn, IAJh'i.ch doctOr ' S f:r'Oin l: hl;' hospital sent out l.ast year C 0 n C E! r'I'Li . n g · Li'H'!

C 1. 0 S 1.1 I" (;! 0 f thirty-seven bed s , stating they t~JouJ.d only be r.~bl . e l~. o P<"!r·For"m emergency operations. I ask the ITr:i. n J. !> i". ''! I" , :i. n l .. i. <] h t. o f' t. hat lTIE!mOr·andum sent out last YE!iH', to r~xpl.d " i n 1:o th'is House, s "i. ncf>. t:h <;!l"e are going to be sixty-five beds r:lo!;r,!d <:11·. :'ii:. Cl.r:H'C! 1 S, Sf~VI:Hl · l:y .. -t:IAJO at: the Grace General and 81 at the H c~ a .. , 1·. h ~; r: h Hl c (! s c Olflp ·1 r~ >< , 1·1 OIAJ <.H' t'::' t h 1::~ y g o :i. n g t o d o e v E! n c;! rrHH' g o n c y OfH:H'<:~t·iow; l : h"i.~; yr~1:'11"?

Tn fi~ct, has he not been rn:i.sleading this H 0 u s 0 IAJ"i. 1-. h 1: h f'! --i_ n r 0 r· rn d 1: i. 0 n L: h d i:. h (:'! No. 38 R2016

has been putting forth in the past two 1.ue e k s? MR. SPEAKFI~: The hon. thl'>. M:irr.i.stel" of Health. DR. COLLINS: M r· . S p c,~ ;:~ k n I" , .f. <WI s u r·· f'! l: h e h o n . mc-?.rnbE!r', if he gets up on a Sllpplr~mc,~nl:r:~I"IJ, 1~1ill. I~Ji. "l:hdr'ai~J {-:he;! IAIOI"d 'm:i~;]eading', becausE! it -.is 11 n P•H' 1. i ;:unr~ n ti:H' y . n u 1·. he~ q 110 l·.f;!d t-. he:! r·o a f·i. 91.11"0 for· t.h~~ HeaJ.th Sci~HIC~'!S CornpJ.ex of 81 b~Hls. T do not: knOIAJ 1~1hor·c~ he got that figuJ"e . That is a neu.J figure l: o me.

Tl·w oliH1r fi.gures hf~ mentioned for the other two hosp · i . t:r.~l.s, :if my fll(~mory -sc-?.ruc::1s me:~ correctly those wel"e the same::~ fig u r·e s, 1:: he-?. s cHnf'! nurnbe r of bc-?.d s that were:~ closed J.ast yE!ar . So there is no increase there. I hr.~ue already answered thr.~t question. We have information f r· o rn t.: 1·1 e . He a 1. t h Sci ~Hl c c,~ s Com p 1. <-l x that at the present time appr·ox:i.matt~l.y 55 percent of Uwir· adrniss:ions a1"c::1 emergencies. So that. mc-~ans {-. h;:~t. iJ.r:; pr,1r·cc;!nt ;,\1"(,1 not emel''gend.Hs, and that is the l.at.F.!Sl-: f:i.gl.ll"C:1 I hr'lue.

Mf~. r::FI7 0RD : A suppJ.ernentary, Mr. Speaker . MR. SPf.rli<FR: A Sllppl .c,1rnE:1n1.:iH'IJ, Lhf~ hon. t:hc,1 member for Port de Graue. MR. F.FFORD: Mr . Speaker, the hon. rntnisl :Hr' Js again not correct with his figur·r:1s. Last y<;!i::\r t:i·H:!I"<-:! t~J~H'<-l forty-one beds closed at St. Cl.ar·e 1 s and s:i.xty-fi.ve t·.:hi.s y(!ar·. At the Health ScienCE!S Complex there IAIE!re t:h-i.rl ·.:y ·-sc,wen bE!f~S closed last year, and a total of fi. fty--f"i.v~~- L2017 May 1. 7, 1. 9 88 Vol XI.. MR. SPEflKF.R: Order, please! Ml~. F.FFORO: Mr.

Speaker·, rny supplE!fflE!ntar·y qttHs i: ·i.on 'i.!; ·i.n Candc-~ r· l:hf~re a1"e f:ifty-six beds closed out of 1S6. [1\] 0 I 11 d 1 ·. h c·:! I n-i. 1"1 ·i. S l: (~ I" C;! X p 1. i'l i. 1'1 h 0 IAI 1·: hE! Gander hospital is going to o p P. r· a 1 ·. (! , n tJ r;! n · i n C'! rn c,1 r· CJ f:! n c y s i t u a t i o n s , tAl h c:1 n t h Co! o p E! r· r.H:: i n g r· o om!; .-~ r· ~~ r: l.o s r~ d .i n C r·"' n d Fa 11. s altogE:1ther, and fJ.fty---s:i.x · ~H:!ds iH'e b rd. n g c: l o s Co! d r'l 1". t-. h c~ C a n cl f:! I" hospital, and more to go? - MR. SPEAKER: Thc::1 hon. th(:! Mi.nist.f~r· of Heall:h . DR.

COLLINS: Mr. SpeakE!r, trying to kE!E!p up wi. l:. h t. he h on . m <-:1mb c;! r· j_ s 1 ·.i k e chasJ.ng a tJJi11--- o'-tiH:~----wisp. He I<E!~:!ps tr·ot.t.:lng out ·figur'(-?.S and making statements. I take his stc.·lLf:!mc,1nt·.s, I -i_nuesf·.tgatn LhC::!rn, I find thE!re is nothJ.ng to Uwrn clnd t have;! Lo respond :in l:: h:i.s House . The han. member J.s c"l b:i t of an alarmist ;:u1d I th:ink :i.t :i.s unfortiJnate because it is an arE!a 1·. h cl t. p f'! o pl. o n ;:~ 1·.: 1 1 i" r.~ 1 1. y h ~~~ ~J C:'! a concern about .

When he COITIE!S out IAJ i. i ·. h 1·. h c~ s c-;! i::\ l H r· rn ·i. ~• l: , s t.: a t: (~ rn t' n l:: s h ~~ does not do anyone any good, h j_ 1 n !> o l ·F

c) r· I: h r-~ p c~ o p l c:! o F t h 'i s Province.

As a rnatLer of fact, , .. _hf:! l1on. rnf~mbor· hd!> J.osl-- d considr:1rable amount of Cl"ed:ib:il.:i.t.y IAJ"i. t-. h rnd n y fHH) p l c~ I k n 01~1 of. b ~~ c r.l us<:' he comes out with these bald, ;:~J.;:~r·rn·lst: stdl-.E=!rn~~nl:!>. :r. do havc,1 t-.·.o reiterate that we are in touch !Ari.·l:h i ·.hr,~ hosp:i.l.:t.·1is on a da:il.y bas:is and thf:'Y a1"c,1 not corning out l.~d . t: h t. h (~ s r-:! i" f:1 p or· t: s l o u s t: h a t l:: he hon. mEHnber is trying to put i.~bout. lh(:1Y ;u·~~ not cl.os·ing al.l their operatJ.ng rooms; they are not hau ·i.ng di.fficul.l: .y d<:'iJil.:i.nq IAJil:h ernE!rgency cases . nwy arE! c1osing a cc,1r'l:i.·1:i. n nurnb<:!r' of bc;!cls, 1.4- point something per cent this year, 1\Jo . 3 B R20J.7

IJJherE:~as l 3 per CE:Hlt IJJerE! cJ osed J.c:\SL ync:H', a Slni.~l.l J.l'lCl"r;!<:\Sf~ bui: not a signjf:icant increase. The h o s p i. l: c:\ l s h a 'J c,l o n l. y r· E!! c o n t J. y b E! e n informed about their budget al.locati.ons for this year, just VE~l"Y rE:~Cf:Hltly, bE!CaUSE! thE! HousE:~ just passed the budget very recently. Graduations are going to occur· in June, vc;!r·y shor·t.J.y, i'lS they do every YE!t'lr, so thE!re wi11 be more gradur.lte nursc,ls avr.l""i.l.i:\bJ.e to has pi tals.

SomE! of t:he h o s pi. t.: a l. s h i.'IV E! t o l. d u s t h at i. t. t s not so much a rnonE!Y problem IJJith I:I'H::lln. MonE'!Y ·i.s al.t•JRYS ;:·\ prc)blE!!lll. Money is a problem for the han. t: h 1'::~ I. e ad c;! r of I. hE!! 0 p p o s t t·: i. on , <.~ particular money problem with h ··i m . I 1: ·i s a p r· o b l r,~ w to~. d . I: h rn e . Mo n <->. y :i. s a p l" o b J ern IAJ:i t. h t he h on . l.:hc:l M:i.rds t.r'!l" of Ftn.:lncr). MorH'!Y is a PI"Ob] ern 1..\J:i.th eVEH'yone, SO h o s p .. i t e1 1 ~; h a IJ r'! mo n

f) y p l" o b l r:! rn ~; ·[·• 00. ~JOITI("! of l: l·tE! ho S pj t a J. S hi'\ V (:1 l:.o-ld 11s Lh;:·\l: il·w big · i,~;~;tlf'! ~~rilh theru is not rnoney pl"ob1EWIS but the ;:\ IJ d :i. l c:·\ b J 1. I. y of g I" d d u i:'t 1: r~ n u r· s r:! !; , and 'i"..hC·H'E! IJJill be SOITIE! impr'OVE:HriE:~nt ·in that i.n June dS l:he grddll<.~1:i.ons occur. MR. F.FFORD: A supplementary, Mr. Speaker . MR. SPEAI<ER: A final supplementary . MR. EFFORD: Let me say to the Minister of Health that I have spoken to each one of the administrators in those hospitaJ.s as late as 12 o'clock today, and these are correct figurE!S.

I would likE! to as I< the mints l·:er IAJOt.ll.d ~~xpJ.;:-ci . n, gi.IH!! tJs lhco~ fjgiH'eS, based on yester·day 1 s PE~i"Cent:i:·19~:1S l:hdL ~;s per· r:c~nl: or f~O'IBl"9(olncy CclSC;!S IJJE:~r·co' bE,~:i.ng donE:! at·. l".h:is L"'i.1nr;! oF UlP. yni''ll'', t•JOii.ld hn give IJS a.rt E~st:irnat.E!d pE~l"C('!I'll:. agE! of 1~1 h a l: t~d. '1. 1. bE! cl o n r:! o IH! r· '1. h r'! ~) 11 rrnrH~ I" ntonths IAJJ t·:h ell] · ti·1E~ bE)d closur·co~S 1,_/.01.8 Mi'lY 1.7, 1.'-}BH lJo 1 X I. that are going to bE! dom~ in i:hE! h o s p .i. 'l: a 1. s ? SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hE!ar·! MR.

SPEAI<ER: The hon. the Minister of Health. DR. COLLINS: Mr·. SpeakE!r, thE! bon. rnE,rnbE!r' j s asking me to predict the future and I am afratd I cannot do that. F.ITI('!r91'::1nc"i.c:~S ;:~r·(:! by t.hE!J.r· VE!I"Y nature ernE!rgE,nci(!!S. I cannot teLl r.·. he hon. rnombc,'r how rnany ernergE!nc:i.E!S arE! gcd.ng to oc:cur· in J1 . 1n~~ <.·11·: the HE~i:·11Lh ~)cJ.(;!nces Complex. I just cannot do :it . I could buy r:-1 crys 1-.i:·ll bi'lll., I supposE?., and SE!e if I could gc;!l-.: r:lnyLh'Lng 011!·. of· t:h;:·\'1:. T ji,ISt. c a n not do i t .

A 11 I c CHl s a y :i s +·. h r.·d: ll·w h o ~; p ·i.i· ;:·l 1 :; h ;::t IJ C:! ~~ o '1. d us thc:lt. thE!Y ar·e I"E!SpondJ.ng t.o t.hE• pI" r~ ~; ~; Ill' ' H !> 1. h i't t-. 1·. h r:! y i:'l t" e Fa c H cl with. They are responding with !>Oiflt:! ,c:lirfi,:til1:y, p<:~r·t1 y bE'!Cdi.ISf'! oF the non-availabilty of graduate n11r•sr;!s, I~Jiri ch hopE~F11ll.y tAJi.ll improve next year, par·tly becausE!, 1 J. k E~ f~ IJ e r· y o n c1 e J. s ~~ , l: ·h ('! y h a v E!! t. o try to find cost containrnE!nts.

I Luoul.d rern:ind lhE~ hon. rnernber that we had a Royal Commission in this Province wh:ich carried out extensive investigat:ions, undertook extensive hearings and they carne up with the statement that has been echoed 1n many other provinces, that the health care system hRs a problem withtn itself in ter·rns of how it aL.I.occ:l't:E:!S :its fundi.ng. Tt 'is nol .: so 1nuch l::he total arnount of funding that is l:h!'!'! pr·oblc~rn, btll: hOIAJ th~;! hc,1alt:.h care,~ · system itsE,J.f a11ocatE!S that fiJnd ·i.ng.

A~; hon. rnorni:H=,r·s knoiAJ the health care system is very largely r.t sn ·l r ., .. ,.~gtilt.~ · I·."Lng sys ·Lc!!i'n. Mr~. TUI.I<: Mr·. SpE~c1I<E!r'. No. 31l R201.8

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the member for Fogo. MR. TU Ll<: Mr. Speaker, on May 3 1 the Mtn.isi":er· of C1Jl · ~111ne, R<;!cr·er.d:i .on and Youth (Mr. Butt) announced l.:hdl: ProtJ'i.nc.i.r.ll P<:·ll"ks tAJ'i.ll ht:ltJr,1 concessions oper·a ·Ling in them this y rHH' . 0 b tJ i. c)l.l s l. y , ti·H,' l" e <:·ll" c,1 cc-n· t: cd n questions a t1 d c e r· t: a in pI" (I b l ()Ins Ul d i: IAJi. ll. iH' i. s G .

T i'l ~;I< [ h~1 nd. n:i 5 tCc11n IAIOU] d h~1 IAIOU) d cons·i d<,1l" 1-ho pr' 'i. tJai·.n si:Oi"f'!!; ·in nearby commun:ities, some ten to ~.IAH~ n 1'. y rn"i.l. r~ s •!IIAJi:l y I ~;ell. ·i. n g g I"O c E! l"i <~ s <Hid o t hEH' s u ppl ie s notAl, r'\l'ld ~1l'ISLII"r'! 'L:hr:~l: l:.hC:!r'r,1 wi.l.l br,1 no conces!dons inter-FE!rJ.ng with t:hes~1 pr·-i.tJal':.E:1 store:1s i·hat <:·lr'f~ notAl extsting in near·by communities? Certain k"i.nds of items will not be found in concessions in the park. r...,R. SPEAKER: ThE! hon. tl'w MinistE!r of CulturE!, Recreation and Youth. MR. BUTT : Mr.

Speaker, I indicated when I announced this progri'lrnme to the House that we would receive a wide range of pr·oposi:'ll s . !tile 1 i.tJf:! tn '" competitive world and the market t s IAI.i. d E~ o p <'! 1'1 . I c iHl 1: P. l.l h o n . HIE!tnb~11"S notAl, wh:i1t:1 I <:lm on my rf:!('!t, i::hHt. l:.hE:!I"~1 "i.~> r:~ Ll"r~mendoi . IS aruount of enthusiasm towards this progr'dllltiiO. ~-.Jc;! iH'C'! l''OC:Wi.lri nl] i'l l.oi-. of good proposaJs and cl Jot of .i.nqu'iri .I'!S .· I IIINIJ l'ldtJn l:o cr:nnr-:! back dnd l7.r'y to E~xtend :it.

For· a IAlf.'!P.!<, b11i: , C:OI"I ... d·:i.n-ly, _ T do not Hl'i nl< IJJE:1 IAI:i.J 1 bE:~ doing any gtnave -i.nj us ·Li. c1:! i:o i:-lnyonn IAlho hi:-u; got ;;, store fifteen or twenty mil.es away fr'OIII C:'l pf.\l"k. Bf~Cdl.lsc,1, "i.n Fact:, the pd vatE?. sector· invoJ.vE:1111ent in Prov.i.nc-i.al Parks for concessions is cer·tainly going to dE~al IJ.d.th a lot. mon~ t.h'ings. I hopE:1 I Neu~oundl.and businesspeople, men and worrrc,Hr, got a lot. more on thE:d.r· L2019 May 17, 1988 UoJ. XL minds and are more imaginative and innovative than just deaJ.ing in groceries. MR. TULK: Mr . Speal<<"!r. Ml~ .

SPEAKER : This must be a finaJ. supplementary . MR. Tl.ILK: Ml". ~lpr~1i'lk1H', iho rni.ni. si·:1'H' tnd~cated in the media yesterddy ·t: h a i ·. h t;! h 1.·\ d 1" r:! c e ·i tJ o d , T t h ·i. n k , seven or eight proposals. Will -l:he~;c'! PI"Opo:;a 1.~; be;! llliHin publJ c, I ask the minister? Ani1 haVE! thE!r'"! ber:!l'l have dny Ci'ISI~ IMhC' !I"f~ been receiVE!d +:.IAIO pI" (I pO Sal S for· thE! salliE! pf.·\r•k? l-fC:'IVCc1 -i:hC'!I"f~ i".IAJO fH'Opo:;al.s, say, accepted for thE! sarnE! par·k in i:lny of l':hose i·.ht.'ll: t:he m'i.n"i.s l:.e r has received? He says that he is I" E:1 C (,1·i.

V 'i. 1'1 g n I.IITIE~ r 0 II S pI" 0 p 0 S d l. S . MR. SPEAKER: ThE! hon. t:hc,1 M'l.ns I:'.E=!r' · of Cul t:ur·e, Recreation and Youth. MR. BUTT : First of all., Mr. Speaker, proposals received and approved, or COIIr'SB, IAI:i.lJ become,~ publ'i.c l<nowl.edge. But i-F there is a p r i tJ r'l L E:1 b 1 1 s i. n E~ s s rn <:l n o I" busineSSIAlOITian OUt: thE!r'E'!

IAlhO is pti-1.: ;-,·i.ng .. in a pr·opo sdl , T c e r·t:c:t"i. n ly do not intend to make thdt flll b I. ·i r: . l r ·i 1·: J. s n 0 1:. d p p r· 0 u ('! d ' then it is just a t ransaction bei.:t~Jenn oFf.-i . c-iHls ·in L·.hr::~ Department of Culture, Recreatton .:-l n cl Y o u l.: h , F 'i. n 1:-1 n c to! a n rl Development, and IAJhatever j_ l'l c:f :i. l) :i_ d II i'\J. C 0 Ill(! S 'i. n d 1'1 d d (! d l. S IAJi. 1:: h them. I certainJ.y IAlould not want ·l ... o l. 1:-1 y t h ''t t k "i. n d o F :i. n f o t' 'n c:·l 1·.: J o n o n the table; there is no need of i ·l:. If l:hr::1y i:lr'('! not.

SUCCC:1SSfUJ. they are not going to be doing b u s :J. n c,~ s s 1~J'i. l: h 1.1 s . MR. SPEAKER: No. 38 R2019 •.

Ti'H~ 1.: i. rn (~ f o r· 0 r <~ 1 Q 1.1 e,, s I: 'i. o n ~; h d s (~l.i'ApSC:~d. Dul":i.ng qtH~sUon Per·iod I did nol: IAJ 61 n 'l:: t 0 -i. n 1:. e'! Y' f E! r f;! i~d, ·I: h 'l:.i·H~ t. "i.HI 0', but the hon. the m~Hnbor for Por·t. d e G r r.w e,~ rn e·Hl 1-. :i. o n (~ d abo u 1: t.: he h o n . the,~ Mird.shn· of Health misleading the House,~. Not.u, -i.f IAJE! look at BeauchesnE!, in onE! SE!ction it is a c c e p t (~ d a s a +: c;! r· m t. h c' t o n e c a n use, and in anothE!r part, just tlAJo or t:hr·ee pi:-lges lat.E!Y', it: is nol·: ac.cepted.

I do not think lt ·is the desirable term in the world, c m n n o t '" 1.1 J. c;l 1:: h a t i l: unpar·liarnE!n ·tar·y. rnost. but I :i.s MR. FFFOIW: M r· . s p (~ i'l k o r· , ':i. f unpal"l:iarnE~r,l·r.l.I"Y :r: IAJ"i I h IAJ-i. l: h c:il" r'IIAJ"i. n 9 d .i d lAIC!. S d S k thE! ll'li:•\ l: have no i 1· , bii'L quc"!sU on, I•JO r•c:i -i. S PI"Oblc:HII IAJhr.'' I J n o i: 1r1 J s J. r~ f.'\ d ·i. n g 1: h c:! flo 11 ~; c,~ I Is h(~ IM"i.', · h those,~ figur·E:~s?' AN HON. MEMBER : Y 0 1,1 C c'\ n 1'1 0 t S d lj -i_ n d -j I" e C '1:'. l. lj IAJ h i.~ '1·. lj 0 II cannot: say dJr·ectly. MR.

FFFORD: I ce;!r·+:ainl.y IAJ"i.thc:il"aiAJ l::hi•\t l"e,~lnar·k, M r· . S pea I< e I" . MR. SPEAKER : Or·der·, please! Petitions MR. SPFAI<FR_: rhe:~ hon. t.hE! mc'.!rrlbE!Y' for M(~n'i.h(~k. MR. FEN~HCK : Ml". Spe:~akE!Y', my pc,~t.:i.l::ion is fr·om /.j. B 4· I" E! ~;j, d f'!l'l i· !) 0 f I II y c:i "i. ~; 1'. i" "i. C t: 0 f Men:i hc,~k, pJ us my OIAJn signrlttH'e"! on ·i. l:, i'\S IJOI.I lAJOII .. i c:l.

L2020 Mi'.lY 17, 1988 Vol XL Mr·. · Spf:~i'l !< e,1 r·, 1: ho pe ·l:·i. i·. i.o n con c c;!r' n s double dayJ.ight savings tim(;! and a p ;:~ r· t ·i. c 1 1l r.~ r· p r· o b l. (~ m l': h a 1.: h d s occurrc"!d in rny distl~ict IAJhich I.~J('' hi'WH IAW"i.l.:i:c'!n l:he Jll"inistor· dnd informed him about, but the JndJutc:lual.s wi.sh l'.o prosenl:: the details of the problem in much rnor·c-:l det:<.·\.i.l. to th(~ mi.nist:e;!r and l:o the House itself.

It concerns the Pl"obl.e;!m t·.hi.·'t. tho L.abl"t'tdor· 111all in Labrador City has with its p a r· t_:i. c u 1. a r· ('! m p 1 o y ~~ ~'! s a n d l: h c,~ fa c t that under the double daylight s<:~v"i.ngs time regime l::hc;,y iH'e actuaJ ly losing morE! of t.hE!ir· c,1V(:!n"i.ng lf:!"i.sur·(~ hour·s l:.han l:hE!IJ ar·{;! ga:i.ning. I . (~ 1:'. HlC,~ c,~ x p J. i:·\i. n f: h a t , M r· . S p (':\ a k (~ r . Just South of Labrador· City is a I". OIAJI'l "i.n Q1 . 1obr~c cr:\J.J.(:!cl FEH'rnont .. Ferrnont is on Eastern Standard T:-.i.1nc;!, ned·. on AtliHll:. i. e t "i IIIE!.

A 1:'. l':.hC;! bE:~St of tiiTI(~S, IAJ("! i'll"e;! an hOUl" r:·\ h r~ r:·\ ci 0 r:· I: h I•:! lfl . LJ n ci C! i" l.. h f:! d 0 1.1 b 1. C'.! day l i g h t s a v i n g s 1:: :i.m E:! p o s :i t :1. o n , IAJ E:• r:~r·e l'lOIAJ i ".l~l!) hOllY'~; d~l!;!c:'ld of l::ht''lrl. Ml". SpeakE!Y', as a r'E!SUJ.t, ti"IC"!

I . ~~ b r· i'HI o r· C ·i '1: 1J 1 n ; ·~ l. l. , IAJ h ·i c h d o E:~ s <~ 1 o t of b u s i n E! s s w i t: h r e,~ s :i d E:! 1'1 1:: s fi"OIII for·rnc)ni'., IAihO COHH:~ to l:hr:! dl"'(,~Cl to shop, has mod:i.fiE:~d its hour·s on T h u r s d a y f.·\ n d F r i d '" y e'! v e n "i. n g s a n d instead of closing at n:ine o'cJ.oc:l<, ~~Jh:i . ch has bE:!e'!l'l "i.l::s noi"ITI for thE! last nurnbe!r of IJE!i:tr·s, jt ts now closing i'lt. ten o'clock.

In othE!r WOI"ds, instE!ad of getting addt t.i.onaJ. t.ime,~ "i.n th,,~ evc~n:ings to spend IAdth their farnj J.i.es, · f.lS IAJaS l::he original intention of double daylight: savings tirnE!, lAJE! etrE· actually gE~t · t-.ing loss t:-Lrn~~ f=-or these individuaJ.s to spend with t:ho "i.r farn:i.J..i.os c:1nd ·l·:hE:!y ar·e qu·.i l':e upset about it.. are closE:~ to 500 s:igmd:UI"~:·s on 1·. h C:! p o 1-. "i. l'. ·i on , IAJh :i c h :i. s an incredibly large number cons·i d<:!l"'i_ng l·.hdi ·. thr:'tl'. IAJou"l d No. 38 R2020

p r o b a b 1 y i. n c l u d e v i. r· t. u a ll y a l 1. t.: h e staff of the Labrador mall and probably a thE! people Wabush. cons i. d c,1 r· ~~~ b l. e of Labrador nwnbc:!r' City of and One of the reasons I would like to hi~l~JE! t·.hl:1 min.istE:!r' l"(:!spons .. .i.bl.E~ For· t.his programmE! spc"!ak to thE! p 1:! t "i. t i. o n 'i. s 1:'. h C'! 1 1 n r· ~~ s o l. l) (~ d question, at this point, of how l:h(;! whole~ concepi : or . dol . lblr~ ddyJ:ight sav:ings t:-irnf:! wi11 be r-~v,~lljr.tl'.ed so UJ;,l[: I*~ IA.ri.lJ nol: cont:i nuE~ on IArith has pl"oven · to be ,:~ s ornr:11AJhi'l.l·. l C:! s '' I· h,'l n d n !> 1. r','l b I. r~ innovation this year.

T h t~ rni. n ·i. s i". r~ r· has 'i. n d i. r: ;:~ I' r:! d I' h ;:~ t··. h 1;! IAJ':i 1 J do 1:H1 t~vaJ uat :ion. I tAJr'Ot.C:1 h i. rn ;,~ s !d. n g f o r t h ; :~ I' . H r~ IAJI" o 1: 0. back saying that Cabinr:' ·t: has not (:·l g r' o r::! d on i. t. . 1· h J. s p c~ i.: t t ·i o n ~ I IJ.Iould suggest Lo hirn, :is onE! 1 n E! t h o d o f r c;! g "i. s ~~ ~~ r· 'i. n g d c o 1 n p l <:·1 'i. n 1'. about it:..

By the IAJay, thE! 484 s"ignat11rt~s :i.s, i.n my t~si:i.rnr.lh~. sornEd:hing lj ke ten t:irnE!S as many letters as he rc-?.cr:dvc-:'!d i.n favour· of it, so I hope that that will rebalance it at t:h:is point. M r . Speaker· , I would l. 'i. k e 1': he minister to tell t~s what thE! p r· o c C:1 d u r· (:1 1 s g o :i. n g t o b c,1 , 1..11 h o h c,1 is go:i. ng to l.i s tr:Hl to, hotAl thE! Cab i net will. ev~lual':s this pr·ocedu1"e. RE:1causc,1 although thE!

"i. ntE!nti:ons, T. th:i.nk, IAJC:'I"A pr·ob;:~bl y noblE~ on t:hc,1 gove:~r·nrnr:1nt. 1 s part, it "i.s t.ltrn·i .ng Ultt l':h,:~i: IAJE~ '''I"E:! rnuch rtiOI"e intC:191"ai.l:>.d IAI'.'i. t.h tht~ I"Cc!St of C i:Hl<:\ d f.~ f: h i'l 1'1 IAHc! r:!

l) C;!r' 1". h C)ll ;:) h i'. possible. Fven SflOI"tS fans, who Ht"e loo!ci .ng forl•liH ' r:i l:o dddiLi.on<~l dayl:ight: act]v:it::it~s to :induJ.gt~ in hockPy ''lnd bc:JsE:!br.tll. i'lnd !>oFt:ball i:\nd othEH' spor·l::s dur·ing thc-:1 Spr·:i.ng <.Hld SurnrncH', i.H'C'! f"i.nrLi.ng thdt Lhe y ar·E~ cornpensat:i.ng fo1" :it. bE!Cause "1". h E:! y C Fl 1'1 1'1 0 l: I< (:1 (~ p I I p W .i. 1.: h !-'. (;! J. (;! I) -j S (:1 d sports :in t:hE! way of baseball, and especially hockey.

As everybody L2021 May 17, 1988 Uol XL knows, the Stclnley Cup Playoffs are starting tomorrow night and I b~:!l."i.~:·ve .i.t "iS quar'l:E!i~ past t.IJJelve j n the morning whc"!n the gi.'l.TnE! is tr:1lc-?.u:i.sc,H~ ft"OIII Edmonton. So, Mr. SpeakE~r. I table this pe t·:.J. t'.i.on for· I:: he rn"'i.nJ s l·:E:! t" and ask h:irn to gE!t up in his place:' iHlcl .:~ d d r· t'! !> s 1.: h t:! s r.:!

I) E~ r· y r· r-:! ''I l c o n c E! I" n s and give us sorne indication of how 1~1::! arc,1 ~otng Lo dord. IAJi. i':h 1..11hat: may haVE! been a noble C'!XfH:H':i.ITIE!nt: but·:, 1 1 n d rH' H1 A r:-i. I" c 1.11'11 ~; l: r:Hl r: e s , h a s n o 1:. worked well at all. MR. SPEAKER: Thr:~ hon. thr:1 l...t~ader· of Oppo~;-i.l ... i.on . Ml~. WEI..I .. S: Mr·. Speaker, I arn happy to suppor·t t·.h(:1 p~:!l':ii': t on pt"E~s~:!rlr. c'!d by \:'.he:! member for Menihek.

I can confirm f ' 0 i" t: h C:! 1·1 0 USC'! t h H ·1-. 1 ... hE:! p (;! 0 p J. (:' "i. 1'1 LabnldOin WE!St:, gE!t'lE!t"Cllly, cH'E~ nto \; t upset. at the irnpos "'i. tLon th:is proposal has forced on the:ir lives. It has upset people throughout tl1is ProvinCE!, from one:! t:!nd of thE~ Tsland to t:hc:1 oi:hE!In, pariicularly the people the hon. ITIHmber• IAICIS just sper.1k"i.ng i:-1b011t IAJhO work in the malls in Labrador City dnd WabiJSh. l'hf:!Y <:·11"(;! afftH:t.EH:I Jn that way.

If you can imagine r:lc:!,~lling I'J"ith \jOllY' nn'i.ghbOIJY'S nextdoor· IAI'ith a tiJ.lO hour titTlE! d :i. f f c,1 r· '~ n 1 · i. ;:~ l. , 1:11) 1:! r· y L h 'i. n g ·i. s o u t o F tJJI1ack. And t~1at is LAJI1at. is hi:~p~Hnl·i ng ·in l.dbr·Hdor· llllos 1:. 1111 1'. ·i I' 1. ~; no I·. on"ly l.dbl"r:-HIOi" Wc"1~; 1 ... . The coastal pat"t of Lal:.lt"ador· hr.1.s I: h r'· !; ;·:, r11 '~ p r o b l1 ~ 1 n ~; , ... , 'i. l:: h .. i 1·: . I t: h a s upset euerything there as well.

T'hH rn-:i.n-i.s+·.,~r· I~JC:1nl· ·. off on d l:'.angt:!nl·.: with this proposal to bring in d o 11 b l f:1 d e\ 1J l :i g h l: s d 't ·i n g s 1". "i. rn e , i:'l n cl i t. i s d :i f f i c u l t t o u n d E! 1" s t: a n d 1·1 o 1..11 hE:! C:OII'l.d do J.l: IAlil::h l.h~:! SUppor·t, apparently, of thirty - two represent~l:'.ions thHI:: m~y have No. 38 R2021

i.n•Jol.lJed 1()0 or 1.70 pc-:!opll~. Thr:~t : :i:. a sr11al J fr·action of 1 pE:1r cent of i:hH populr:~'Lion of Hl"i.~; PI"OV:i I'ICE!' C] (-:!atnly pc~oplE~ i'!I"E~ not: i .n fr:WOIII" of l·.h is F>r'opo~;~ l rHld I ho ''':ir1:iste1" OtJght. to h~lVE~ adrnt'l:t:cc~d 'it r.~ n d o 1.1 g h t: no l: 1". o h ;·~

t) r:! p r· o c: I·~ n c:l o d . No1~1 cornE!~; thE! d'iffoicult par·t, Mr. ~)poakE~r·, undotng i.t. And t. hosE~ pE~t·.-LLJon<'!Y'S 1~1ho s .. i.gnr~d that pc~t:i.t.ion have a SE:1rious probl.~:!tn, <:lS do rnany pHopl.rc1 throughout this Province have a serious probl.E:!m. And we t~JOI.tl.d like the minister's indic~tion n o '"' , M r· . S p E:1 a k e r , t: h a t t I'Hc1 y l.l.l'i. 11. not proceed with such a foolish rnove ag<:dn 'i.n the event i:ha 1·: they do not have an election between notAl and next yE~ar. Thank you, Mr. SpE:1akc;!r. SOME HON. MEMBFRS: i · IE~ar·, hE~di"! MR.

BU TT: -------MI". ~3pc~akE11" . MR. SPF:AKFI~ : The'! hon. the M'inistE:H' o{ Culture, fU'!C:I"f~r:lt".i.on r:~nd YOIIl.:h. MR. AIJTT: Thank you, Min. SpeakE:11n. T n r·c;! s pond i.ng to I.: hr.:! pr,1 L "i.l·. -Lon let me say that I respect the views of p ~~ 0 p l. ('! IAI h 0 S 'i. 9 n E'! d ·f:. h E~ p Cc1 1'.·. i. ·I: ·i, 0 n d l'l cl who oppose double daylight savings ti.me. In fi:lct, I am on publ i.e 1necord c~s saying that onE! of fhE! l.~:!g'i.t · i.ma LE! concE'!r'ns I halJE:!

I"E!Cognized, in parU .cuJ.ar, has b<:H'!rl -Ln the L..abrmdor· West arE~a of the ProvinCE! bc,1cauSE:1 of their a'ffi.l.at..i.on mnd :i.n · Lc~gr·;~tt.:ion w"i.t.h the neighbouring community of Ferrnont in the ProlJince of Quebec. I recognize that. And t.hE~ other· ar<c1a of conCE!rn that J. s s o I" l.: o f b e i. n g f o c; 1.1 s c;! d -i. n o n d n cl I. 202?. Mi'ly 17, l. 9 8 8 Vol XL h d !; g o i: h;! n i'il l. o 1: o f <'1 t 1: c~ n U . o n · -,. ~; in the arc,1a of t:E!J.ev'is:ion pr·ogr'iWIHri ng dnd l;o on, i::l·l.:l'l-., For thE1 rnost.

part in '!:.hE! Pl"ov:incc;!, ha~; i. l:!; or· ·i.g·i n :L n r.~nd ot.l'l: of Tor·orll':o. T COII-I c:l, j 1.1!; 1'. by l~klY O·f l"r:!Spond"i.nq to thE! pec't'.i'l:ton, Ml". SpE!~.lkEH', and f ()In 1: h 1,1 b n n ('! F i.t 0 f 1:: he h 0 l'l ' gentleman who presented it, say l".hH L I :in f<'lc: L, 1-.l'w peoplE:! IAJho c:H'c;• opposed to doublE! dayltght sav:i.ngs i:."i.tflf'! r::lPP~'!citY' t:o b(;! vehc,1mt~nt.ly opposed to it, while those who suppot"t. "i.t. support: . i.t · not: t:o l:.hE! degree of those who oppose it.

And, of COUI"Se, th(:!l"(~ c\Y'C;! a lot of-" pE!OpJ.e, therE! in thE! middle, IAJho have not expressed any opini.on one way or the other. In the beginning, lAJhE!n t:h:'i.s doub1o di.·lyJ.tgh'i: Si'll)"i.l'lgS l:.J. Ifl(:' IAJClS i rn p 1 e rn E! n t E! d , t h E! p E1 o p 1 E! IAJ h o c arne · foi"I~Jr:'tl"d f -i. r•sl:. I•JHi"O ·1·: 1'105('! IAlhO oppoS E!cl it, and not:. on1y in t~Jl" ·i. ·l:'i n g 1. r;!'l·: l:rc r· s 'o : o 111 c;! I b 1.1 1:. c o p "i. e c1 1-:h~:!rn to thE:~ papc;!rS and so on to g t:d ·. \J' i. !) . i. b 'i. '1. . i. I: y r'l 1'1 d f" l)(." I" y 1··. h 'i. n g ~;!

J. ~;; E~ , Rut noiAJ I arn finding, par·t:iculal"]y "'s '~'c;! g ~,1 l: ·i. n 1 ... n a l-i H :. J. (;! tAii:'ll" 1n E! r· 1.ueather·, that there iH'E! a lot. of pr~op '1(" 1 Rl'l Hhif11J. l.o'i: of- flC.;!opl.e IAihO are very much in favour of th:i.s. So , M r· . ~3 p ~'! (:1 k f;! J" , J '~' n n 1-. L o I" (;! 11. all han. ITIE!Inbers, becauSE!

I haVE! r E.~ i'lll. y Jfl!'l :'i. n t: a 'i. n r:" d r:-1 v ~'! r· y n Co11.1 t. r· a 1 position on this and I have no axo to gr· i.nd wi. t.h anyonE~ on i. t, t:.hat this experiment IAJ:i.ll be carE!full.y assessed as we go down t:he road and thE! v:ielAJS of all oF our c o n s t -L 1·.: 1 1 c,1 n ~. s o u 1:: t h (:1 r· <-:'! '.i. n NetAJfoundland and Labrador wj 11 bE• l'.:<·lkE"n "i.nt.o consi.dE~Y'i'l·l ... '.'i.on. And aftE!r a very cai"E!ful and unbJ.aSE!d d r:! C .J. S ·i. 0 n , 1':. h (;! n lAIC'! IAI·i.].J add I"('! S S l:: hE! problE!ITI of ti'IE! tirn~'! zonE! ~wr·o in t. hE:!

PI" o lJ "i. n c c" d nd IAih (;! L h (;! r' I~.J( ' ! IAIJ. 11 continue to use doublo daylight s r.·l 'J -i. n g s t. "i. 111 E:! o r· I" E'! v o r· l: 1'.: o 1·: h u No . 3 8 R2022 ( :~ ....... -

traditional time zone . So, Mr. Speaker, I just simply want to say that I respect the opinions of those people who oppoSE! it, and I will be elabor·at."i.ng fur·t.h~:!r' on th-:i.s t:optc of double daylight savings time as IAH-:l 1 11 o IJ e f u r· t h (~~ r ·i n 1--. o t h i. s experimental stage. Thank you, Mr·. Spt::H•tker . Orders of the Day MR . S [MM~) : Moi-i on 5. T h~) MEH~ch Li'Jkc-~ debate . M R . ~3 P E A I< F R : T h ~) ME?. e c h I a k e d Ed:Hd.· E~ the dE!ba t.e 1~1as adjo11r'nr :u:l by l:hH hon . i·:hr) M-:i n:i.stet" of FishEH'iE:~s. Ml~.

RID[Ol.IT: ·-------M r· . ~) p o r~\ k o r· , y n s 1-. r:! I" d <.·1 y d ·F t () r· n o o n , with just a couple of minutes Y'(O!rrlcdn·Jng bE!for·E:~ adjour·nm(~ nl : , T rose to have a few words to say on the amendrnE:~nt to the resolul: ."i.on as proposed by the hon. gE!ntleman for St . Barbe. I tAdl1 say. nOIAi, Mr. Spedk<:~r. that I only intend to have a fetJJ tJJords to say on the arncH1drnent. I hi::td spoken ear·lier· on thE! main motion Jtself, and the subs t ant i uo remarks I wanted to make regarding . t:h(.;! M('!('!Ch l .. akr) ~ccord T lrldc:lt) during that time.

We ~H·WE) ·incli . r:co\'l'·.nr:l thdi: tAll-'! do nol: :i1T!-.end to c~1rd: er·ta i n r.lmE?.ndrnE:~nts to 1: h ~) M ('! 1':! r: h t. d k

c) r· n !> o 1. 11 1. -j on Ll·1 ,:, t 'i.l; notAl I:H:~foi"C~~ ·Hw Hou:.~~. That Js no s·e c r' E! L. Th;·~ 1: :i. !) no L n<-)1~1 i'H'!I~J!; . ~,Je do not :i n t. 10:~ n d as a go v E! r· rHTIE:~ n t L o suppori : l:hc:! dfnf:!ndrnen't · . . ~,Je do nol: 'i11'l't-'!nd t.o do that:, Ml". SpeakE:~r. f o r· '"' IJ

E) r· y s i. 1 n pl. f'! , 1 t p . f r· o n t l" E! r.~ s o l'l . :r F ME:~ E! c h L a k e s lH' v i v E:~ s , I suppos(~~ ·is l.:he Fi.r·sl' . pr·~:!nl .i. Sl~1 Lhdt 1.2023 May 17, 1988 Vol XL one has ~o address, and tAte do not have control over that, we only haVJ::! on~:! · -el.(;•vl:>.nLh of L'hal . control hE!re in this Legislature!, but if i~ survives and if there are to be aiTlE!ndmE!nts to the Accord, thE! A c cor·d, obviou s l.y, w"i. ll h,~w c~ to be amended in the same way ~hat it wr,1s arr·iv(o!d ;:q,l-. ; 'i.t. tAlJ.ll h<:lvc~~ t.o b(! amended in the same way that it lA) f.~ S C 0 J'l C E! i.

I)(~~ d ; i. t IAl i.ll. h r:~ U ~!! J: 0 b (.;! amended by the First MirltstE!l"S represent i ng all. of Lhe governments, the natJonal go IJ H nHn•~~ n 'I" ;:~ n d 1.: he I· C'! n p r· o v :i n ci.c;1l. govEH'I'liTJ('!nts. That is thE:~ tAJclY thc:d .: rJJ e c-H: h 1 "'~ k ,,~ bkl s c: rHl c r) -i 1.1 r:!(·l • d n d t. h a 1.: is the way that Meech Lake will h d IJ H to b a t:·\ rn C! n d r-:! d • :i. F i: hE! r' ~) d r· E:! <:1 Hit:! n d rn E:~ n t s . [l: ·i !; nuL 111 i. Lh-i.n l:hc.) ~ .; ole prerogative of this leg is laLur e , or· 'L h t:! l. ::! g 'i. ~ ; l. ;:~ t 1 1 r' H o F 1\1 <::!

IAJ Brunswick, or the legislature of i'lr'·il: ... ish Co .. l.lllnb· .i;'-', or· l·.hc'! legislature of Canada, un i l.aterctlly. IL i s not within any of our legislatJVE! competE!nCE! to unil.ateral.l .y c:urrcO!nd, 'i.t. :is not, Mr. Speaker, bE!Cause all the rE!St would haVE! i:o agr'E!(-?. tAd.l:. h i. t for this to become a reality . So we have an Accord, tJJe have an r~lgrf:!E)lfl(;!nt l::hHt is pr·r:!SC:!nt.ly surviving. It might bo pr'E!Cal":i.ous ·i. n ~; om

f) p <:1 r· t s o f 't:.i'H:! c o 11 n L r· y , b u t it is presently surviving and IAJe "':; a go v f.! r· I'll fiE) n t. p u 1". o 11 1" s ".i. g n e:1 t. u I"('! , our tJJord, our crE!cl'.ibility on thr.lt.: dOC:IIffl(~J'lt kl'lOIAJ"il'lg f11lJ lAlelJ. IAihC::d·. IAH'' Wf~r·r-) r:o\gl"PHing to. ~1\J 1101\l . MEMBF.R : HE:~al", h~~iH'! MR. RIDFOUT : Thf'!I"'O "i !; d 'lol·. -i.n Lhr-:! ME'!('!Ch l..akP Agrec~~rnE!nt that tAlE! th:inl<, Ml". Speaker, will. be benefic i dl. not only for· NetJJfoundland and L..abr·ador· b 1.1 1:. b r:! n (,1 F :i c "i. t:o1 l f o l" C i:•1 n c:·l r:l ''' . l t·. .J. s No . 3 8 R2023

a st.ej:> ,;~long the roc:~d of l'lat"i.on building, Mr. Speaker. Tt :i.s not l·:hP only s l:.c,~p, ~j.t: w'i.ll noi: be,~ +:ho Jast stc,1p, but it. :i!; a st.ep and, i. n 1: h (~ 0 p ~i . rd 0 n 0 r 1·: h 0 s (~ 0 F II s 1~1 h 0 !;uppol"t the:1 govc-:1rnment in t:.hts H o 11 s ~~ , 1.11H 1'. h i n !< -i 1'. "i, s ··~ ~; 1'. r:! p "i.n t h e I" :i. g h t d .i I" E:1 c t :i. o n . T l'lf'! r· f:1 lfli'l y be c:ll: h c,H' s i. n Uw 1-1 o II!> o , th~n"E:1 may bc,1 other·s J.n t ht' ProtJ " inr: f~ who do not ~~gr'f~r~ IAri.l:h us. That: 'is the:1'.ir d .ght.

That is t h ~'! ·'i. r p r· f~ r· o g c.~ -1:. i. 1; c,1 . H 11 1·. 'in o 1.1 r op:injon, as suppor·'l:er·s of the g o v E! r· n 111 E:1 n t. , IAH,1 b c;! l i. e v c.;! 1:·. h a 1.: j , ·I: 'i. s a step closer to the kind of Canadi~ thr:·ll~. wc-:1 IAIOul.d li.ko to s~:!e. We ·think it is an irnproverne:1nt on the Constitution Act of 1982 or 1983, whenevr::1r it is. We are:1 not sayi.ng t.hal: th(.;!Y'B cannot bc,1 oLhc;!r' improvE:1ments.

We arE! not saying that at the end of a ten or a twelve or a fifteen or a twenty or a twenty-f i ve year proce&s there J.u:i1.1 not, in fact, bE:! other s i.gn:if'icc:~n-1:: i.lnpr'OlJP.IIHHllS i:o l::hH constttut:ion. Wear·~~ not saying l::hc:-~'1: l:h0 cons'f:itul : 'i.on hRs l:o bo wr·:i tt.en Jn st.onE! for·c-:1uer and a clay c'li'l d n o l: r: 1:1 a n g f~ cl . W c,~ '"'' r:! n o L saying that. . Whdt. we:~ cH'E:1 sr:~ytng i. S i·: h i'l-{: I~H:1 h a 1)(,~ rfll) I)('! d c'l 1. ·i_i · ·1'.1. !'! b -j 1: along the road and in the dil"r~CI:"iOn L:hdl". l~lf:! dS c:•l 90l)! ·:!r'l'lHH:!nt c:i:tl'l suppol"t .

Assurrdng rl1J the,~ ol:ht'!Y' jtH' i.sd·i.cl : 'i.ons l~lcH'f~ Lo approve this Accor·d, t.ue, as r:~ gou(H'nrn~H11 : , i:lr'c,~ noL going to approve any silly, foolish a ITif:! n d me;! n t-. s i. n 1:: h "i. s 1. E! g oi. s J. d l:. u r· f'! L.hat would be detr·imental to c~nd l::herefore make sure that the Accord was never implemented at all.. w~'! are jus t noi: go:i.ng t:o do it, Mr. Speaker. And we arE! not going to support the amendment. NOIAI, Mr·.

Sp~:!ai<fH', i.l-. i.s bas-i.caJ.J.y on the arnc:1r1dmN1t that I IAianted to say a fc,11AJ IAIOI"ds l:.oday. l wr:·u; really enthralled yesterday to 1 .. 202'1· rJJi'\ y 1. 7 , 1. 9 a 8 lJol XL. hocH' thf~ hon. genl :l.C.:!I'rii.H1 fr·om Fogo talk about the great nation b 11 ·i.l. d c,~ r• ~; , d n d h ~~ 1·. t.·l l. I< f'! d abo 1.1 I~ Ti"Udeau, LalondE:!, and Ma1nchand. 1\J !)1~1 ' rJJ I" . s p 0 i'\ I< !·'! r· ' L he s ( ~ a I" f'! 1·: h l'! nation busters. Thoy ar'E! not n.:-1l·."i. on b11·i.l.df:!l"!>. SOME HON.

MEMBERS: 1·1 f~ H Y' , h (! i'l Y' ! 1'-11~. fnDE.OUT : I ITIE!an, do you call a gl"oup of po l..i .·L'i. c c~ll. J. C:~ i.·HI CH' S 111h 0 :.i. nfl. "i. C 1:. E! cl 0 n this country the National Energ~ Progl"alfllriE~ Nat ·ion flu 'i. ldfH'S? Thr:! Foreign Investment Review Agency, Nat. Lon S1ri. J.d E'! I"S? The;! oFf s hor·(;! dispute that raged here in Atlanl::i .c Canada, and in Newfoundland and Labrador in p i:l r· 1·.·. :i. c 111. a r· , ,_., ll d u r· "i. n g t:. h c,1 1 :i. F ''! o F that goVE!rnrnE!nt, and thE! lack of n a t i o n ~' l r· c-~ c o n c -.i.l i. a t: i o n , M r .

SpeakE!r, that existE!d jn l:.h:ls COIII'll :l"lj in l9BII . , ;:~I"E! l'..hE'!Sf'! l:hr:• trademarks of Nation Bu:i.lders? Thc;!s~~ r·lr' l'! l·.he t:r·adf~l'lli:·\r'k~ :; oF Nat.·i.on Buster·s, Mr·. SpE!akE!r, and thE!Y had j11~;l: <~b011L b1.1SI".od Lh :.i. s counl::r·y bE!fore l:.he peopl~: ! of the count.:r·y sa1~1 F"i.l·. l.o biJ!;i: thr~rn. And l:hon ·t:hH hon . gPnt1 c:) i'fktn sr:,lys, 1 Thank God for· MI"S. Cai"S 'i":.ailns 1 T h oH1 k C.; o d f o r· h !'! r· , M r· . ~:; p e a k f'! r· . SOME HON. MEMBERS : Hear, hear! MR. RIDEOUT : Mr.

Speaker, when l::he hon. gentlemen singled out the people 1 just IIIE:!nt:'ioned as L. hc,~ Nat:i .on Builders, and say thank God fo1~ a Mr·s. Car·s t.a i.r·s, t.hey have ·l:.o, obviously then, bE! saying, WE!] 1, doiAin· IAI"Lth TUI"nc:!Y' . HE:! ·Ls For this . They havE! to bE:! saying dOIAJn 1~1 i. t h PC:! bH' son , d 01~11·1 IAri. 1': h B our· ass a , dotAirl with Ghiz. You cannot tal. k out of bol::h sJ. d~~ s of your· rnoui':h, Mr. SpE!aker . That is t:I·H:! pr·ob1ern 1\Jo . :3 13 R2024 ·

wJth the Opposjtion. They will get up and t.aJ.k al:lottl~ th~-:1 gr~-:1at: Nation B~ilders, Trudeau and Mar·chand, ~1nrl t.hc,1y ~~~·oi.J.l. gJlJC-?. thanks to the Cr·eator for Mrs. Car s t a :i. t' s , and HHHl the L c->. ad ~H' of the Opposi.l:.ion tAril.l be out on thE! p t.t b l. 'i. c <:t i. r'I.•Ja v E! s saying , 8 u t. I.'.IE! haue to suppor ·t the LeadE!rship of Mt'. Tur·nc;!r. Mr . Turner, Mr . Speakar, thJs. AN l-ION. MEMBER : f-1 ( ~ i.s nol: . . MR. fUDFOUT: i.s for Mr·. ~~pE:1ab:1r, hE:1 is on rc-:Jcor·d as hi·\lJ i.ng lJOI:nd for · l:hr-;! Mf'!Or:h I ."-\kr,1 Acc:ot"d, i~; he not? Mr·.

Spc->.aker, I sttspr'!Ct 1-.h;·,,L onr :! of l.hn pol'i.l·.·ir:. :ql, p I" 0 b ] NIH> fa c:i. n g M r• . T IJr' n E! r• '1:: 0 d a y ·is l:hP lJ:'!r'IJ fdr:l: i':hr'1l. i.he t. ·ibHr'a l Pat"ty i'lCI"OSS Canada, Jt1<c,1 l·: hE! 1.-.i.br:!l"r'll P•.'ll"l·:y hr=!r'r,1, "L !; Sr) c:l 'iiJi.Sillf:! on ::issues l::ikE! ME:1ech l..rlk€:1 and Fr(.H~ Tr·adn; worn thr:m ,,, ntdj or· ·i l:y of thc,1m wan ·t i I·_, but then yotJ have 1-. h f:1 l. i. t 1·. 1. e fa c t i on s , 1 i. k e h c:! r' r.~ ·i. n Newfou~dland, who do not want it. Mr.

Speaker, I IJ.Jas interE!StE!d to see in the Globe and Mail yesterday, in the Quotable Quote section, this particular quote. This is a quote frorn John Turm~r. He says, 11 I S(~E:1 a I'H:1adl.'i.n(~ !':hat. says that John Turner wins the count. r' y . li i. s c au c 1.1 s de rrti:\ n d s r3. r·ecount. 11 That is the problem. AN HON. MFMBER : He sald that hnre. Mf~. RIDEOUT: He->. ~;aid that hc,H'C,1, d:i.d he? They d'i.d noi : S;:~y I>Jht'!t'C'! hH Si'\ i.d ·j 1:, btl i: :it i ~ ; thE:H'C->. :in thE! Quotable Quotes. MR. SIMMS: I c,w said t. h~! sarn~~ thing . L20?.S Mr.1 y 1 'l , 1. 9 H 8 \Jol. XI. MR.

RIDEOUT: I i:lnl sur·c,1 there are other gentlemen, fVlr. Speaker, who know i:lbou l: thr!l L. ~:io you cannot hc1vc,1 it both ways.

Agatn. the hon. rn~~rnbE!Y' for Fogo. .i. n h "i. s r' c-?. rna r· k s y e s t c;! r' d a y J. n talking about thE! f:i.shE!ry and trying to dodge the very unfortunate situation thE!Y heW<:! c r' c-:1 a t. ~~ d f o r 1': h e tn s c->. 1. v e s o v e r' 1:: h E! last SE!Veral t.UE:'!E!ks, in par-ticular', r'f:!ferr·~:!d l·:o dn HrrtE!ndrn~=!nt. t.o r!l resolution they brought in iA this H o 1.1 s ('! l. a s ~~ y I'! r'l r' , a n d h (,1 i. n d J. c a 1:: ~ ~ d that the Opposjtion had proposed r.1 n i:HlHHl dHIC:! n 1: ~• a y .. i. n g l': 1·1 r:t t 1:: h ~:! appr·opd.at.E! - how tAla s t t t l·wy put -i.

I:? '"' rn o It n l: o F 1. ~~ q -:i. s l. at t v (,1 authot"ity should accr"UE! l·:o l:.hE:1 P r' o lJ :i. n c o . II r,1 r' r~ r:·\ d i. '1: t n 1 .. o i.: h t'! recor"d ye~>tE:1rdclY, ~•aying . 'T'ha l·: l:ho r'1PPi"opr•i .dl·r:! rUrtt)trnl ... of' J.egislatiue authority should ;:·1cr:r' tiC! l'.

l) l.hc! Pr" OlJ"i.ncc'! . 1 l'h:i s ·i ~> in Hansard fr"Om YE'S I·: ~H'day, Mt" . ~:)pr.~r'lkr'!t". The I..E:1<:tr:lr.~r of· i':hE:1 Oppos i t.:i.on, E!VfHl though he was in the gallE~ry J.ast y ~~ r:·l r IAJ h E! n t: h i. s p ;:-~ r' t. t c u l a r' amE!ndment was put dotAJn, by impl.icat'i.on, I suppose, the message the gentleman from Fogo tAklS t.:r· y:i.ng to g~:!l:: acr·oss tAJas that. the then Leader of the Liberal Pat "l-.y and notAl L(~etd ~=! r · of· l::hE.~ Oppositjon wanted to convey to the pr·~~ss, t.o l··.h(:! pttbl -i.c, and t:o us that thts 1.uas his arnondrnE!nt, that h ("!

I~JY' Cd: C'! '"i.t·. , -1-. h r'1 1:. 1:. h j ~; IAJi\1 S I•J"i. S creation, 'that the appropriate FllfiO u n I ~ of l. f.'! c_;r-i. '' J. ;:~ +· .. i lH~ d u 1:. h or·-; L y come to the Province through C 0 l'l S l'. "i. 1·: II l'. :i.

I) l'l c'll Chi:'\ 1'1 g I'! . 1 IJ'J r~ l l , M I" . ~) p r~ r'l k r=! r' , 1. h ·i ~ ; y H d i" oi. t·:. "i. ~; t.otally di.ffer'E:1n ·t:. This yE!mt" it.· hi'1S r : h.:~ngr:!r:l r.1g;:-J"i n. Tl'l'i !) yerH'. tl'lf'! official posttion of the Leader of Uw 0 p p o s i l:'i on .:Hl d 1.: h :'! I_ ·i. b ~H' a l. Party is that we have more Lhan No. 3 8

enough legislative jurisdiction · over Hu~ f"'i.s~H~r·y noiJ.J. W(:1 h<:<~Ut~ rno1"e than we can handle notAl. Why do yolJ ~~Jr:Hil: m<H'E:1 now? Do no 1·. br:! so fooJ:ish, you cannot handle IA.Jhat you hNlH1! So yr)ll C<HHIO 1·., Mr·. Sj:H~i-lkc,~J~, squar•e thcrse tiAIO cH'91111Jr,1 nt: ~;. T h .:-1 lJ u no l'. 'i. c: o d , M I" . ~) p e <:<~ k e t' , o l.J n t' t h ~~ 1 i'l s -1. s t'!V CH' a J d a y s a n d IAI c-?. c-?. k s i n l:h'is Hoii!>H, l:hr~t Lho O.pposil:'i .on hi'AVP bE:1come VE:'l"Y uncomfortable. The 1J h ''' u r:~ b r::! c o l'llf~ lJ ::! r· 1J , lJ o r· y uncornfol"ti:ilble.

If you gEd up and IJOII dr:~b<.·\'i':t·:1 a Fishr::!r·:-i.~'!S jurisdictional jssue, they trnrnc,1d-L<.~tel.y hNVt·:! to g<-?.1·: up and t-.r·y t:o put back on the r·ecord a position they say ~s thetr position, yet: it ts so flimsy, it i. s so c l. o u d y , i. t i. s so rnu d d y , l'-1r' . Speaker, you would not be able to :idr:1nt"i.fy i. t. as <:•lnybody 1 s position. That is what is hap p e n "i. n g 1·: o t h r::! of F :i. c :i. a l. Opposition in this House on a numbr:~r oF Hlajor· :i.SSIH~s OlH'r' thr:~ Jast several months. AN HON. MEMBER: F l :i. p ·- Fl. o p p :i. n 9 . Ml~.

RJDFOIJT: Just fl'.ip·-flopp:ing. L.i'.:tst IJE!ar, IAJh r~ n n (!I~ IS

I) r i-: h (·~ A c: r; 0 i"d lAid!; ar1nounc:c,1d to l: : h:i. ~; House->., t:hr:1 wc;nnb r:! t' r 0 r· Mn II n l·. ~1 ci. C) 11 (·~ ll Island (Mr. Rarry) welcomed the Mr::!c~ch l . r~!<f:! Accur·c:l on br::!half or hi. s p~rty, welcomed it here in Lhis i·lo1.1~;r!. ,,,)f! I'F'IUr~ soHn 1-.hc~ ~'~•'li'lSdr'd. He welcomed it on behalf of his piH'i ·:y. Hf! sa:i.d t:h<~ l: sou1c,1 pr·ogr'f'!S s tAJas mad(~ and hE! 1..1Jas plE:1ased with i. t . H e s p o I< r:.:1 ·1·: h <;! o t h f:! r· d a y i. n t h e debate, bastcalJ.y ar·ticulating thE! sarne th"i.ng. AN HON. MF.MRF::R: (Inaudible). MR.

RIDEOUT: 1 .. ?.0/.6 May 1.7, 1.988 Vol. XI ..

Fortune - Herrni tage, yes, but the member For Mount gcio spoke in the debate only a fE!W weEd<s ago and hE! s 1·. i. l.l. :L n d ·-L c d l·. t'! s h ·i s s 1.1 p p o , .. 1 ... , as he did prE!Viously, for· the ME:!E!Ch L.e1ke Ac:c:Oi"d . ~1 o , M l" . ~; p r~ r:·\ k t''! r· , lA I h .:~ t: ·1. !; h a p p f~ n ·.oi. n q here, obviously, is you are '3 f:! u ' i n 9 Fl. ·j p . r l 0 p :; ' . lj () II i:H' (! getting the Opposition trying to s <'I y n n n I: h 'i. n g i n h C'! r· t:! i:'l I'Hi 1J 01.1 r:H' E' g E:1 t t :i n g t h E! rn t r· y :i. n g t o s a y s Oi"rll'! t h .in g H l s r:~ o 1.1 l·: 1.: h r·:! r· c;! .

MR. STMMONS: A point of order, Mr. Speaker . MR. SPEAKER: A po.i.nt of or·dE!Y', t:hc;! hon. thE! member for Fortune- Hermitage. MR. SIMMONS: I am sure the member for Rate Verte WhitE! Bay ciE!Sper'cd:.ely IJ.Jl'l n t:. s !". o Hid k e • i'\ cas C'! , b u 1:: h r:! shouJ.d basE• it on facts. NotAl, hr::· jusl: l:.old l·.:hr:~ Hou!><->. t.:hdt. hE! h<:td a copy of Hansard where last year Lhr:1 l'fi(:1JOber· for· Mount ~3c:i . o Bc,!ll. Island, on behalf of the Of>f>OS ·i. l··i on, hdd 1'11<:-\de CE!Y't.a:i.n undertakJngs. Now, they ar'E! going 1: o ~li'·\ lJC~ ·1". o d ·i. 9 d (,' c,1 FH~ r , Mr· .

Spr:1aker, much dE!E!per. As thE! I'IH~IIII:)t'!l'' I~Ji.'l.l ki'IOIAI, l.hn rJ}r::!f'!Ch l. dkC:1 in :it i at i v E:1 IA.Jcl s 1': a k cHI lat.: e :in M <:~ y , ~:-~ :; T r· f~ c "' l. I. . A 1: 1: h ''' l: J··. -L Hlf'' , i': h e rriE!rnber· for· Mount: Sc:l.o BE:!11 J~;l,Hid I~IHS nol: l'.hr:~ l.t:!r:H:JE:!Y' of l:hC'! Opposition. I spokE:' on I:H:!hi'lJ.f of i • h o 0 p p o !; ·i l: ·i o n d n c:l b u r· p o s :i 1·. ·i. o n .. i s outlinE!d. As .I undei"sland :it, thE! rnc;HnbE:1r fol" B f'! J. J. I s J. a n d c:l :i. d n o t s p f'! a k i. n t. h a t. debate.

When he spoke two or Lhr·c,1e IAJee!<s ago, l·w spokE! i:'lS an individual and that IAJas rnaciE! UE!ry cl.E'!<;\r'. But.: my potnl~ on l"-Ls:i.ng, Ml". SpE!aker, is to ask Uw mr::'rnber not t:o rn:i.sl.c,1t.'td t-.ht'! House on this point. I want to hear h:i.s No . 18 r~2o26

ar·gument, but I plead IJJith him Lhc:'\1·: hi.!; c:\rgi .IIIIC"Hlt be bi:'\SC,~c:l on fc:tets and not IAI~lat he tJJould hope IAIOLJld be~ l:hc~ r<.~cl:s or Uw C:c!lSf'!. MR. SU.!JMS: To that po:int:. of or·der, Mr. ~3p(~ak(:~r. MR. SPEAKER: To that point of orde:~r, the hon. the liousc-?. Leader. MR. SIMMS: If thE! hon. the mE!mtier· for Fortune H c-H'ln:i. 1-: a g c,l I.~Ja rl'l-. s to d f~ a 1. "i. n facts, perl1aps he can te11. us whc,~thE!Y' or not: he;! l~la!; ;:~c:c:ur·ai::c-~l.y quotc,H:I on May 5, 1987, indicating !'hal: IAih'i.lt:! he~ Sllppor·t·:s l:hn Mc,lc~ch I c:tkc->.

Accor·d, hE:l doc,ls not agree thE! p r· o IJ i. n c f~ s s h o 111. d h.~ IJ e ;., s ;~ y i. n 1·: h t:l a p p o :i n t ru ~~ n t of !> e n <d. o I" s . ~) u , 1~Jiri l ::! I·H:! Sllppor·+·.!; l·_hH Monr:h I dk:=! AccoJ"d, quotE! MclY 1), :19B7, :if thE! hon. lilOifii:H'!r' f"oin Fnr·l · tll'll'! Hf~t··rn:i. t.age IAI<:ln-1':!> to l. alk about dc:ll:ai l !; , pc:!r'l-lap:; ho r:r'ln 1'.1:111. 11s whE!t:hE:11" that :is an e~ccur·ate qiiOtf:l. Is i . l.: c!lfl ar:c:tJr'i'I.I:O qiiOI'.("~? MR. SIMMOI\JS : What are you reading from? MR. SPFAI<ER: ThcoO!r'f~ i.s no po:-i.nt. of ordc;!r'.

The hun. the M"i. n ·i. s ter· of F"i. s heJ"·i.c:l s. MR. RTOEOUT: Thank you, Mr. Speaker . ObuJousJy, there is no point of or·dor, and T l:.hi.nk .it: jtJst po-i.nl~s out what. I lAIC'lS saying ear·lier. I do nol:. l<no1~1 i.r i'.:hf~ hon. gc;!n1-.l.f~lllr·1n tAla s i. n t he H o u s E! t. h tl n or not , and [: h 1:-1 l: i S 1·: h Co! S i". ·i. C: k \) IAJ'i. C: k C'! i'_ 1: h ('! Opposition haue gotten themseJues i. n t h o s f'! d .:-1 y s . lf,J h d 1·. c: ,., n n o 1: b <'! d C'! 1'1 :i f'!!i :i s t h r.d: a f Co~ IAI rn on t h s a g o , a \j c;! i'\ r· () r· ~;

C) c:·l g 0 ' lA) h I'! n C'! I) (,) r· i. I ' IAI c:-1 ! ; t~lclt Mef:!c:h l.i:.ti<E:l fit"st can1e on t:.hE! 1..:w27 ro~~ i::t y 1. 7 , l 9 n a lJol. XL scene, the official position of Uw I . i. b e r c:d. P .u· t. 1J ·i. n '1:. h 'i. s Pr·ovinCE:', and in this House, lAJctS 1-.hai·: -i.l·. tlJf'!lcotnf~d MfH~ch I.J·\b~. Nov..1 the!re is r~ new leader, a now faCE!, and l:hf~ offi. d .r.·l l po s i l::i.on of t: hE! Liberal Party is Meech Lal<o is not tAior·i:h l·. :hf~ pt:\pt~r it -:is IAit'.itl··.c::!n on. Now, Mr. SpeakE!r, what chclngE!d OUE!r' there?

Are there fifteen or sixteen nE:~IJJ pE!OplE! ouer thE!rE!? Is there a brand new Liberal Party that_ suddE!nly carnE! out of nowhe!rE!, IAri. t: h all n (:~lA) r d c (.;! s I s "i. t t. •i. n g 0 u (:1 r· thE!re, or is it thE! sarnE! pE!Ople, IA!i. I"_ h i'.: ~H:! f'! X C f~ fl l'. .i. <) l'l 0 f 0 I'H~ , IA.J h 0 were there a year or so ago? AN HON. MEMBER: TIAIO . MR. RTOEOUT: T-~1o. The samo pN,p1E!, IAJ.ith t:hE! f:!XC:Opt ·i.on of' 1·1410, l4lh0 IAI<-:!t'f'' l:hC'!I"[i! d YE:lal" or· so ago. AN HON. MF"MBFR: Th c,H' n r:'H' c:! go :i. n g i".O be:' 1·:. lri. r· 1: y - · F o IH' . Mf~.

RIDEOUT : That may IJJell bE:l. Just IAiait and IAJC:l IAJ':i.l.l s c:!O. A l... L hr:~ rnorne n1:, -i. t. :is one person who has taken what used 1-.o be-?. 'i:hcol pos·i.'l-.ion of HH~ par·t.y and turned it around completely. NotAl, t:hRI:·. can no 1,·_ bE~ dE!n'i.r::!cl, Mr. S p E! a k e r . I t c a n no t I:H:~ d o n :i E! d t h a·t 1:: h e L e i!l d ~:! r· o f 1·: h e 0 p p o s :i l:. i o n , representing thE! Opposition Party, has, on seueral. occasions, both inside and OUtsidE! thE! HOUSE!

OUE!r L h <oO! l ,:,, s 1:. .. n tt'rn b r::! r· o ·f IAJ r::! r::! k s a n d months, indicated that this l f:! g 1. s l ,., i: ·i. v c~ j 1.11" '.i. s d i c i ~ "i. on o u (-'! r· L h t=! fishE!Y'iE!S that Uw Pl"ouit'lCE! is ~lf~f~k"i.ng is SOHIC'!'i.:h-i.ng l:hd'i:. "i.s foolish, is something lhc.'lt. is for· i: h c,1 b "i. r· d ~; ; y <HI h ;:we lfi<H' C::l lc~g:isJatiue · jtu·isd:ictoi.on than you c "'n C:l x HI" c "I !; P n 01~1, ~; o 9 c:! 1-. o f f t h ':'t I~ fooJ:ish kick and get on to l> orne:! t·lri. ng ~~ l !; o. 1\Jo . :!8 R202'7

Before I finish, Mr. Speaker, just a word or two on the particular amendment itself. The amendment proposed by rny friend for St . Barbe says, 1 Newfoundland and Labrador be recognized as constituting a distinct society within Canada. 1 Now, Mr. Speaker, I have to say to the hon. gentleman, t~nd I l~<dll say it anywhere frorn hE!re to Nain, in any community, that I find the arnendrnent insulting, I find it patronizing, I find it useless . TherE! is absolutely no reason fol" d n y bod y i. n Ul"i. s P r· o v i n c "' to f (;, c-?.1. that we ar·e less than somebody in Nova Sco U .cl ·- SOME HON.

MEMBERS: Heal", hear! ·-- MR. RIDEOUT: - or somebody in Brit is h Columb i ~. absoJ.uteJ.y no rE!c~son! I 1·1ave no cl e s ·-i, r· e , M r . S p t~ ct I< r;, r , l o h ;:w"' :i t written into the Constitution. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear! · MR. RIDEOUT : If some other part of Canada has a desire to have it written into the Constitution, that dOE!S not snub rne one ~dt, Mr. Speaker. U:. does not make mE:~ fE,E!l any less a . Newfoundlander or a Labradorian. It does not rnake rne feel any prouder a Canadian.

If some other gr·oup, bE:~ it French Canadian or lJ I< r a i n :i. an o r s o rn ~~ b o cl y e 1 s (-?. , I Ali::\ n t s to be recognized as special and distinct in the Constitut io n and l.l.JE! dr::~cide to giVE! it to thE:Hn, it doc,~s not.: both(~l" rne in t:h('' ].(~ast, Mr. t)p~~akr::~r. I fEH~l comfor·tab1E! as t.·\ 1\Jc~I~Jfoundl.dnd Canc:u:l'i. Rn. T fE!E~l totally cornfor·tablE'. I fr::~E'l conJfol~tabl('' lAJ'.J.I·.: h 1ny culi'.:UI"E~, cornfor·tablE' with my hEH' i tage, co mf or 1:: a b 1 (;, 1:: h a 1:-.

I can con+·. r .i. but r;, anywherr::~, in any par-t of Canada, L2028 May 17, 19HB Vol XL the bit of talent that I may haVE! to contr·i.bute, a.nd I hav( ;, no desire to be patronized and insulted by proposing a useless, si.J.ly arnendrnE,nt to have' that r::~ n s h :i. r· n '"' d i n l: h e C o n s t. '.i. 1': u t. '.i o n , M r . SpE!aker. SOME HON. MEMBERS: H e a r· , h E! a r ! MR. WELLS : Mr. Speake,r. MR . SPEAKER: The hon. l::h<;, of Opposition. MR. WELLS: Thctnk you, Mr. Spc,H·\kr:'r. I r· :u;e, Ml". Speaker·, to spE!i'~k on thE' arnenrlrn0nt !'.:hat I said would not be, that. I said would not ex :ist.

Mr. Speaker, I acknowledge what t h e h o n . t hE! M i n '.i s t e r of F i s 1·1 E! r i E! s ha s just sa i d about the government 1 s position on Meech Lake. Everybody knOIAJS l':.hat.: this government entered into this arrangement with the other nine provincial governments and the federal. government to put before their respective legislatures the Me f~ c h L a k e r· c,~ s o 1 u t i o n , a n d i. t contemplated no amendment. I k new thE! r e was go]. n g to bE! no arn<''ndment.

I knoiJJ this r::-trnr:~ndmE:,nt cannot pass, could not b(~ acCE!pt.:E!d at the t i me that it was moved, and that is why, whE'n I spoke first, Mr·. ~:JP~'(:\I<~:,r, I sa .. i.d clf:,arly l:'.ha t. the Liberal Party would not be moving dny amendment bPcau se I knew that it could not be accepted. When we listened to the debate, p ;:; r· 1:. :i. r: ul. (·\ i"l y F r· o rn rn c,~ rn be r· s of t: he oppostte sidr::~. Ml".

SpE!akE!Y', :i.t b r~ c i'\ rn r:, c 1. f:! iii I" t h ;:·\ 1: t. h o y 1..11 (,~ I" ('' t: r· y J n g to make the argument that the Meoch 1 . <:\k(~ AccOl"d pr·ov'.i.cl(;!d for· Newfoundland to be a juridically No. 3 8 R2028

<->.qual pal"t of Canada; they t.aJ ked ab011i: l·.h:~ jllr··i.d·i.c:Al OCjllc'\l·i . l:lj Oi' t.hc->. pr·ov:ince~;. Well, the fr.lct l:hr:-1!-. l:hHIJ hrw:~ i:o r·l~jocl: 1-.hc.~ tJC'!r'IJ i:J.IIIE:~r1drn~~nt: that JJJould put it. on a t.ol :r'lll.y oqllr'11 Fool :-i.ng 1~ri . l : h thr~ Pr·ovj ncE' of Quebec m~~ans clE!i'lrly 1-. hat +: h (~ 1J <:1 r· (~ wr· on g "i. n t. ho-i_ r· l"l':~PI"Cc~S<->.ntat:i.on. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hc:~illl"! MR. WELLS: We knov.J thE!Y have to vote against "i.t.

W<-?. pul:. i.t LhE!r'c->. so t:.h<''Y co1Jl.d vote against it and say to all the IAJO r l. d , 1 W ~'' do not. r· E! a J.l y moan 1.1.1 h c:'l i:. IAJe arc:~ saying. 1 That is the p o s i. 1-: "i. o n l:: h (! y d r (~ i. n . T h (;, y r.·1 r· e not acknot.~.JJ.E,dging the equality, and t: hat is why 1: hc.~ i:-lrnl'! ndJrH~ nl: W<'l s IIIOV (~d. Ml". Spc,1a I< <:H', no ·l· t hr-.l t we l:!XFJOCh~d -i.i'. l·.u bf~ fli'ISSC~d Ot' IAJi:Hli"r~d :it- to bl~ pi'.tSSl~d. Qu:ite fr·ani<Jy, Mr·.

SfH:!dkc~r·, T i'ldlH! ·l·.o i'·U:IIn·i 1: I~JH tdouJd not·. vot.c->. fol" th~~ Mc-".(~ch l . i'!.kc,~ Accord f~lHHl tr -LI: l.lJCcH'l~ so c:•lii]C;!ndr~d b(~caus(~ :it :is ba~dca]Jy an 1 1 n rl c: c f;! p l:c:-1 b 1. ''' d o c: 11 rn r:' n '1: . 8 r~ for· r;, I go on 1-. o c:'' d d r· r,~ s !; a co 11 p 1 ,;, of po:i nts T want to deal with on l':l·ll'' <Hnc,~ndHHHl'i' : , T. j 11s 1...

IAJdni·. l:o addrc:1ss tJJhat: thE:~ han. the Min:ister· of F-i.shEH'i.~~s (Mr·. lhdf~out) j1.1sl: s cd d a' n d add r e s s , a g at n , hi s rn:i. s r· e p r· c,~ s H n tell: .i. on t. o t: h H H o 1.1 !>C'! • cannot say that it lJ.Jas dc-:~J.:ibl'!retU~. T.t. rnr.~y hiYIVE:~ bc:H!n innocent , but it t.1.Ja s nevE! r the 1 e s s , a total misrepresentation of the truth. So I haVE! to tE!J.l this to 1-.he House l·.o cor·r·ect !-.:hat. misrepresentation. He t" e j s t:. hE:~ r E! so 1 u t :ion pas s E! d in t:h"i.s House-~ Junr:! 1.7, l91l'7 IJ.Jh-Lch, M r· .

S p e a I< e r· , :i. n i t: s f :i n a 1 f o r· m , 1 <-:~ · i l:hf~r IAJt'ol:f:! or· hNd "' s"i.gn-i.f i.c1-1n·l·. hand :in IAtr··it.:ing. Ml{. TIJI .. K : I 70/.9 May 17, 1988 Vol · XI. You tJJrote it . MR. WELLS: T IAJrol·:r;, ·ii~, okay . H f'! r· r'' i. s members wh c:~ 1: i. i: s .:-1 y s . T. f' h o n . IAJOUJ.d listen they would h r·:! a r· so l:. h n 1J. lAJi. J. 1. no 1~. , a q a ·.i n , misrepresent, maybe innocently, b 1 1 t t·:. h E:' y 1.1.J"i. l. 1. n o 1:·. a g a J n misrepresent to th:is House or <ilnybody C'!l.S(?. I.~Jhat our· postt'i.on -Ls with respect to fisheries rnal:t.c->.r·s ..

Hc,,r·c,~ :is 1.1..1hai:: IAJas vot:c;!d on, and here is what they alJ v o b:' d For· , M r· . S p f~ i'll< <H' . T lri. s :i. s their pos:i.U.on, too, not just m :i. rH,~ . 1-1 (~ r· c;, :i s I;J h a +: ·i, ·r. s ;:.:t'i. d : i1 THF .. RFFOI~F r!F.

IT F~FSOI.UED 'l':.hat. thE! govE,rnment of NetAJfoundland and I . c:-1 b r· ,., d () r· a s s H r· i: -L l: s F d "i l: h :i. n t: h ('! :inshore fishery by conLinuing l o p11Y'!>IIt:' d cornpr'r'!hc:,ns:i.tJf'! pr·ogr'i'\lflllle of revitalization and developmenL s I I ( h r·1 ~; d n •i. n s h 0 I" n F i ~; h ('! r· 1 f:! s dgreement, debt restructuring, d n d !I I r'l n d h ('! t' (! "i s 1. h r;! !< H ':1 p d r· t I Mr.

Speaker, 11 an appr·opl"iatE! p r· o tJ "i. s ·i on For· p r· o tJ i. n c i. a l. involvement in the managemenL oF Uw F·i. s hni"IJ. 11 T h ''' ·l: J. s 1~1 h r.1 l: IAJ r,~ a r' ,.~ r:-1 s s c~ I" t. E! d , a n d that is what they approved! SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hf~ar, hear! MR.

WELLS: Tt_ha_s_ nothing to do lAJ· . .i.th J. (~ g "i. s J. a 1'. -i. tJ ~-~ j u r· .i. s d .. i. c t -i. o n . lrJ E! s a :i d then, and wr:~ say aga:in, th:i s rn i:·1 d c r.1 p s c h (~ 1 n ~~ 1 ... h 1•1 t. t: h ·i. s go v C::' r· n mE:! n t is off on SE!E!king lE!g'.'i.sl.atiVE! j u r· ·i. s d :i. c: i: "i. o n c an n (~ v c->. r· b f~ i:-1 c h .. i. ('' v c,~ d and can only cause harm in Lhe l o n g n1 n . AN HOI\J. MFMBER : (Inaudible) g:ive it all away . MR. IIIIFI..I.S: No . 3 8 R/.029

No, we seek a proper· role tn management of it. So, do misrepr~sent the position of official Opposition anymore. is there on the record, Lt endorsed by this whole House. MR. STMMS : thE:) not t h~~ It ( :r n au d i b J <'' ) j u r i s d :i c t J. o n IAJO u l d be tnHdnf~ss. Thai.: "i.s ~~Jh,:·\1.: you j11s+·. Si:J.:i d. MR. TUI. I<: 1\Jo, h~~ c:i ·i.c:l no 1·:. MR.

WFI..L.S: :r: :.a:id :it :is madi'IE:)SS for· Hds Pt"OtJi.ncH l:.o sr!ek l.og·i !;l.r.·l'l: ·i tH~ jtH'isd:ict:ion ovE:H' the fisherif~s rut c1 1v' I)('! 1-. o P i:IIJ :: h rc~ c o s t: o r- adndn:is-ter:ing ?.00,000 squar·e mi1~~s of 1\Jor·Ut At.l<Ht L "i c. 1\lOIAl, l-.1-t.:ll'. 1 ~; stupid! We cannot even keep hospital beds open! We cannot fEH~d our pc,'opJ e! SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hc,!ar·, hE!iH'! SOME HON. MEMBERS : Oh, .oh! MR. WELLS: We cannot provide adequate education t.r.lithout having chi1dren qo ou-t. <Htd I:H~g For monc,~y ·l ... o buy cha1k! No wonder it is madness. MR.

STI\1MS: So yotJ rH'e aga:i.ns 1': j t. SOI\1F. HOI\J. I\1FrJJRFI~~3 :­ Oh, oh! MR. WFI.l.S: 0 u r· p o s :i t j on has I:H'! f>.rt s t a tc~~ d c:l . c~dt"l.y lltr:-HliJ ·l."i.rnes, <Hlc:l .. i. l·. Cdl'll'lO 1" . . b ~~ rn :i s r· f~ FH' c,~ s <~~ n ted by t hE:' h on . rnetnb~:!I"S no rn;:-\ 1-: L1;!l" · hOIAl drc:!s:-i.r'c\bl tc'! th~~y f:ind that: m:isr·c~~Pl"E~SE!ntat:.Jon. Mr. Sp<,!akl::'r', back hand. I l.Js l::c~nc;!d Lo the dE!bclt~E! at to · l·:h~~ M'i.n:-i.s t~:!r L2030 May 17, 1988 Vol XL of Intergovermental Affairs (Mr.

Dawe) say that Meech Lake, and h (~1 r B iH' (~ ~l'i S IAICH' d S : 11 p r• 0 V i. d ('! S a n opportunity to recognJze P r· o v i. n c i. a 1. j tH' -;. d :i crd. e q u a 1. i t y . 11 That is a rd.ce rnouthfu1 of t.r.Jords, b11l·: "i.f hrc~ lAl(:!r'(~ hf~r··r=!, l I.•JOUl.d r:'1Sk h:irn to tell us ho1.11. It is clE•iH' l::hr:·\'1: 'i.t dons not <:'lnd i.t: cannot.. How does Meech Lake provide an o p p o r· -1': 1 1 n i I: y 1: o r· f;! c o g n ·J z E! pr·ov.:i ncial j tu·:i.dical E!qual:ity? It. don~; no Sllch i·:h -i.ng, ;:'ll'lc:l cannol-. do any such thing. It doc,)S, Ml".

Spf~abH', :in fact·, jlt~;i'. i·.l·w oppo!;il·.n. Tl: Sl·'!'i::!> C.·\boui·. immediately saying Quebec Js SOHlOl.h'i.ng spoci.cll.. l·lo1~1 clo I~JE! qet: p r· o v i n c i a l j u r 'i d :i c a 1 E! q u Cl l :i t y o u 1·. of 1:h~l·. ? Thrc~n hH I~JC'!I'lt on l:rJ S<'tY, 1 q1.1~:d:H:!C, of course, altAl<'.lYS had a v·E:d.:o. 1 f hi'~ t. -j_ S c::ll:) S 0 J.l.l t: (~! l. y IAJ r' 0 I' I g , Obviously, the minister d'id not krtOIAJ ·i. I:. I clo ned:. sugg~:!st l'l<'! IAJdS dE!libE!rateJ.y rnislE!ading thE! HousE:•, but 91JHbt:1C n~~ver HVCH' ht.~d a V\'?.t:O, That was the prob1E!m.

QuebE!C IJ.lant.~:!d a IJ<~1l:o, but. c\ Nat.:ion builder, lJke Pierre Trudeau -· and hon. rne1nbE!rS had be+·.l·.<,1r b<,1ar· :in m'.ind that thE! day wi.ll come tAlhen h ·:i. s t: o r· "i. r.-1 n s ~~l'i. l J. C.·\ c c o r· cl 1:. o o n 1:'! Pi~rre E11iot Trudeau the greatest c: on I: r· -L b 11 l: i on ''' n y Hk\ n h ;:'t s Hla cl E! 1·: o 1-: h r~ b 1 1 '.'i. 1. r1 :i. n 9 o r r·: h i !> N ;:;1 l:.-;, on . SOMF HON. MEMBERS: Hr;!ar, hPc'\r'! SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh! Mf~.

WFI..I..S: People will recognize thdt the man h ,.,, d p I" ·:i. n c i p l n rc=! n o 1 1 q h 1-: o s t a n d u p for l.llhcd~ tAJas r:i.ght tAI:i.thout r'~:!gcH'cl 1:0 i·Jt H l'l <H' r• OIAl j, l'l t: HI" E:! S 1:. of· h J. ~; OlAll'l pr·ovince, QuE~bec, tAJhE!n they l.llant.:E!d l.: hi. s k "i. n d of s p ~=! c i. a l S· t: a 1··. u s d n d No. 38 R2030

Vf:~l':o. He,~ wa~; '-" tn;~n of pr·i.nc'i.pl1~ and he->. undc,~rstood pr·incipJe. MR. RAIRO : H r~ I~J,:'l s iH' r· o g d 1'1 i: , j 11 ~; i: 1 ·L k c,~ y o 11 , ctt"r'ogant! Ml~. WFL.I..~:) : HH rnay tAJe]] have be,~ en arrogant: . I do nol·. quc;!si".i.on t:h;:~l:. 1 s'~'Y ·i ... o you hE:~ WclS a man of pr·:l.ncipJ E! and he knew what he was doing in leading the Nation. M R . J . CARTER : He lAJa s a snake . MR. PATTERSON: Tell us about UtE! gays, when hE! legalized the gays. MR. SPEAKER: Ord~H', plei:'lS(1! Ml~. WFI..I.~): 7 That~kyou, Ml". Spc,~akc,~, .. . Ml".

Spt~dkC'!I", i:hc~ COTillllf'!l'1i:s or 1·.1'1(! M:ird!;t.el" of HeaJt.h (Dr. CoJJ:ins) i)JI~rr->. !dnd of l.i.ghtl·1fhH' 1-r~d . , obw·i ou sly not s e:~r:J ou s, but th:i s is <'\

l) r:! r· y s c~ r· 'i.u 11 ~; 1nr:~ 1-:1': n r· . H c,1 :. tj g g c->. s t @. d t. h a ·1': I r· E:~ f e r r E:~ d on J y t. o l:hE~ IJni.i :o d Sl:dl:f~!; and UH'! IJnih~d ~H·atE:~s c->.xarnpJ E:1. That ·:is c] earJ.y nol~ so. T r· ~:! f e I" r· C'! d h : i. rrt 1-. o A 1 t !> t. r' i:\ ·1 "i. ,,, tAl ~Ji. c h is a s:i tuation that is very much l. ·ikc;! CdrJHdiil. 1·1~~ n~~gl.c,~cUHi t·.o mE:~ntion lhr.lt. It makes it c1ear, Mr·. S~H~akc;~r. · th~:!y do not: understand the fundamental pr·:i.nctpl.E!S of fc;!dc->.rali .srn.

Thai:·. applies whether we are dealing with a presidential mnrl congressional system, like. the United States, a presidential congr·c,~ssJonal r'E!publtc, or a pr·JrnE! rn:in:'l.st~1r' i.r:,\l par·l:.i . alrtf~ni ... ar·y f8clc-?.rat'.ion ltke Canada. The FH'inc; i. pl.C!S or f~~d~~rt'll. · i . Strt apply 1'10 rna.tl~>.r' tAJhat thc,1 bcts:ic system. 1../.031.

Mi:'l y 1.7, 1. 913 8 lJ o 1 X 1.. :r. r y !) I I h ·~ l) (~ ··~ r t:! d P. r· ·~ 1 s [·: d I: (:! y 0 1.1 must have institutions that c'lCi<I'IOI)Jl.t~dgr~ .:-1nd pt'O•Ji.dti! fOI" 1 - hc·~ proper functioning of a federal. s 1: ;:~ 1: (:! <·1 n rl p r· u lJ 'L d t·:! f o Y' I" f~ cog n :it .. i. on of thE! tu.Jo essential E:~qualJ.L:i.E:!S :i.n i'1 For:lc,~r·;~J sy~;l:otn ... l.hQI"H at"f:! t:IAJO, 1\11" . S p ~~a I< c,1 r . r-:

l) I"! r' y :i. n d ·i.

l) i. d u "' l. i n 1':. h -L s c o u n t. r· y is equal to every other i n d :i. wi. d 1.1 a 1 . H i. ~; or· h c;! r· v o +:c,~ HI u s t. have the same weight wherever they i:H'~~. MR. PATTERSON : What dbout:: l::he:~ ("i.naud'i.bl.

e) sc~lat"Y as gr·eat? SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh! MR. TOBIN : AnSIAJf!r' thf:! q11es l::ion 1 B'i.l.J. 1 • MR. PATTERSON: T h :~ i. t' 1. r,~ ,,, d C:! t' ' ~; s 1:-\ l. d Y' y :i. s g I" f:! H ·1". C.:! I" . ~-R. WELLS: r11 Y' . ~) fl 0. t'1 k C:' t' , 1 .:~ l'fl t: i~ 1 k "i_ 1'1 9 c:•l b () U '1': something important.. MR. PATTERSON: !3 o r11 c,~ 1·:1-ri. n g r:l t f f e r· e n L . 1\H~. WFL.LS: I am talking about someth:l.ng :i.111portan 1·. 1--o this Nation.

Tf l ... hos~~ hon. l'flf~mb(~r·s opposoi.L·.E! have so little regard for the f u t u r· (:! o f t. h "i. s P r· o v i. n c e , a s t h E! y appear to have when they make t: h l:~ S (,~ S .i l.l.y , S 1::1.1 pi d Y' (~ ITid Y' I< S , l:'. hE:! 1j do not car·e about the pE!OplE!! It J. s o b v 'i. o u s by +: h c,1 p E! r· F o r· rna n c c,~ of this government that thE!Y do not car·r,~ dbout i:hf~ pc-?.op'l.P. The:~y jusl: . care about their own s P 1 f .. fll" f~ s (~ r· v a L "i. o n 1~1 h r-:! n +: h ~:· y rn d k e those silly remarks. If lhey had any ~egarc:J for the 1\Jo. 3B I~ :?.03 l

country as a whole - SOMF. HON. MEMBEf~S: Oh, oh! MR. SPEAKER: Or·dE!r, pl.~~as(;!! MR. WEI I_S: or· for this Province, or· its p(->.Opl . (,~, l::h(;!y IAIOI.IJ.d nol: ll'li:lk~~ thf'!Sf:! remarks. They would treat these cl (-'! b i'l t. f~ S S (;! I" i. 0 I I S '1. y , c:l S [·. h C'! y 0 I I g h i·: to, Mr. S~eaker .. MR. J. CAIHfR : Would 1-.hc,~ hon. IIH:!IIIbc~r· pHr'lrri 1·. 1:·1 SEH·tous CjlHo~!;Li on? MR. WFI .. l S: ------- 1\Jo I T I~)

C) lll.d rl () 1-. flC:! r'tll"i. '1'. r:~ ~; c:! I" ·i ()II!) qtH'!st-.'.ion, b(,~cauSE! I have not hE:~ard i'l sor··i Oil!; quns 1- i.on co1r11:! Ft"orn UH'! hon. l'llF.:~mbE!r' s:inc(->. I have b(,~en in 1- h f~ C 1·1 ;,wii:H'! r" . SOMf HON. MEMBERS: HE~ar·, hf~dt'! MR. WELLS : M r· . S p (,~a I«·H' , a f' e d e t' a 1 s ·t--. a t: (->. m u s t. , if it is to be a true federal state and be a fatr federal state, tJ..Jor·king fairly, pr·ovtde fE!deral .i. n s t .i. l: u t. "i. o n s l-. h a t f;! F f (->. c t i. v E~ 1. y g i. lJ c,~ voice to the two equalities in the s l:: a 1: e .

T h (:! f .i. r· s 1·: L~ q u a l -i_ t: y j_ s t: h c:! indiv'iduaJ. citizen. Every i n d i. v ·i. d u ~~ J. c :i. i:. ·i 1.. E~ n J. s E~ q 1.1 r:-l l i·: o every other individual citizen and ~d s <H' h E~ r· v o t: ~-~ s h o 11 'l. d h ''''H1 "!': /·w Sclme weight no matter what pr'OlJ"i.ncc;! or· ~;c~c · i·. "i. on oF 1-.hn C:OIIl'li ".I"'J they 1:-it.JE:~ :in. Ml~. J. CAfnTR : What i'.lbou -t Chu r c h:-i J 1 F aJ 1 !> pOIAJEH'? MR. WF.I..I.5: T IJ..Ji.J.l d(:!i:l] IAl:i [·:h that a l: Ml~. DINN : '1_2032 May 17, 1988 Uol. XL He already dealt with it. M R . ·w F.:l.. 1..

S : ThE! second esSE!nU .al equr.ll:iLy, Mr. Spe;:~l<c,1t', -i.s l::hc->. (,1qual.tl : y :in l:: he status and rights of E!ach of the c o n s +:. -L t_ u ('! n t p a r· 1.: s . W h ('! t h <->. r· y o u call them states or cantons or pI" o lJ inc e s o l" IAI h a+: e v e r· , yo ll 1r1 u s t recognize that essential equality. The members on the government side f·.<'l lk ~~bo11t -i,i-..

T h~:!y rnoui.·.h l.:hE! appropriate words, but they r: l N'l i" 1. y c:l o n eli·_ /:) lo! l. '"L c-~ lH! -i_ n J. t IAI/'Ho! n thE!Y suppor·-t: Me~H: h Lal<o , b E'!CaUS E! ·LI-_ 'i.TiliiiC!d'i.;:~l· :c: !l.'j :;l;!l·~; i"tbOIIi: Si:lytng t: hat: Quebec has a sp(:!col.aJ. st.~'lt-..us. The Con!; 1-_-i_ i:u L: -i.on -i s

h) I:H'! int: E!t~pr' E:1t ed in sl1ch a lTli'li'HlE:!r as to g ·i lJ n , .. n c: o g n-i. I-_ ·i_ o n I. n i l·w s p o c -L a J. role of the government and l..f~ gisl.r:·1i:t/l"f' ! o F Qtll ~ bi-: !C . T hai: is the bas:ic pr·oblE!IT/ tAri.th MeE!Ch Lak~=·, 1'-11". Spf'!i:·lkHi". MR. DAWE : Wh<'lt d ::i. d Mr·. Tur·nf~l" say? MR . WELLS: Mr·. Speakc:H', rJJr· . Tur·ner· said exactly the same thing. The d Jf f (,1rf'! nco bf~ I:_IA/E~ (;! n Mr·.

Tu r· nE! r· iii nd me, with respect to Meech Lake, is ITE'! -i_~; pr·epar'f'!d l·:o S<'IY, 1 For· .l::he sake of gE!tting Quebec 1 s approva], J r\\Hl pr·epar'E!d i·:o vot:o For· ME:~ech Lake, even though I d:isagr'E!E! IAioi l:h "i_i .. _, 1 1\JC)I~I, l:hi'li: ·.'i.S IAJhdt hE~ ~;ai.d. T c:IJ.~;;:-lgr·,~~-~ !~Ji . l : h !:ha t df>f.li" Oach. I have to protect the Jnt.er'E:!st.s of I· h n p f~ 0 p '1 (:! 0 j- 1\J f"IAJ ('

C) II l'l d J i'l l'l cl d l'l d L a brad or·, <:1nd t:hat : :i.s IAJha·l I i:'l.Jn do ·Lt'Jl:!J. Thai- ·i, !; :"xr.1cl·.l y l~lhdt C am d oi. ng. MR. TOI:UN : f'hH 1~1.:-11) 1)011 offshore, f\Jf: !I~Jfol . lndlHncl, MR. SPEAI<Eii: No. 38 ( :i. i l i·\ I I c/ -:i. b l f;! ) 0 l'l l:: h E:! you protected rl:id you no I·_ ? R2032

OnJer, please! MR. WFLI~S: Yes, I most certainly did . SOME HON. MEMAFRS: 011, oh! MR . TOB 1:1\J : Th~H'8 t.hous and s 1\]C-'! IAJf OU nd l. i'll1d 0 Y' ~ ; IJ l'lfWifl l. 0 '!} f~d bf:'!Cause of your actions. MR. WELLS: of tod;'ly One'! of l·:hosc,~ d.HYS t.ho lflf~rnbc~I"S IAJ:i.ll. r'E!Cogni.ze ti"Uth t/Jh~Hl it j urnps up and hits them right between the eyes on election day, then they wilJ recognize the truth. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear! MR. TOBTN: (Tnaud:i.b1c,~) and now 'it ·is MR . ~>PFAKU'? : sell out Ne~~oundland okay ( i nawrliblo). Ordc->.r, pJ ~1ase! Ml~. I,~FI..I..S: M r· .

S p E'! a k c->. r , T Jistened to the s p f:! t~ c h fro 111 UH:~ h o n . lfiC:Hn b c'! r· f o t' Mount f:ic.1o Bell Island (Mr. Rr:u•r·

y) and I .:-\lfl thE~ Chc-.lmbel" at so r• r·y he i. :; no 1-. ·i. n · thE~ ITIOITIE~nt ·J··o hE~cun MR. 011\JI\J: You IAJould not havE:~ Uw gu Ls to say .. i. i·: i F h f:! 11Ji'l :; h c,~ r· C'! • SOME HON. MFMAFRS: Hc,1ar·, hc;!ar! MR. WELLS: Silly babbling over there again. li <->. sa :i. d h ·i. s or :i g "i. n a l. p o s i. I: 'i. on IAJi'.l s essentially lhe same as mine. 1..?.033 May 17, 1.91ll3 lJol XI.. MR. WELLS : 'As a smaJJ Provinu~, it is "i. Hlp 0 f"'~. iHJ1: f 0 t' II!; MR. TOBIN : Do yo11 hHiH' l:h<·d:? MR . Wf:l..1.~3: T .:1rn jiJ !; i·. CJitoi·. Jng I~Jhc:<t-1: hr:! ~''''i.d :i.n Hansard.

I checked it: in II i:Hl s r:H' d ' 1\J ' ' !I)(~ Y' rn-i. n d ' 1.:1-w lfl"i. n 'i ~ ; t (;! r· can babble on if he t.r.Jants Lo, but:. lnl: lri.n1 sdy ~;ornPI:hoi.ng :-i.ntr::!Jl.~i.qE!nl::, tf he can, IAJhc,~n hE! stands up to s p(~i,o\ k' Mr·. Spr:~r:-lk<,~r·, T lis t.(;!n~~d to thE! hon. mennber For Mount Scto ~-- 8(!].1 I s J. <"- n d . H E~ s <'l .i. d h -i_ s o r· ·i. g i n a 1 position was that it was important l·:o 1\Jf~IAI'Found'l.and that t.hE:11"<.;! bt'! a strong federal government to protect the 'inter e sts of 1\Jc,~I~Jfol.tndl.;·\nd t:ilnd l .. abr·ador·. MR.

TOBIN: He said your position is Frozen in l:i'w p <:·\ s i : . MR. SIMMONS: Hr~ i.s nol : :in hi. ~ ; 01~111 Sf:!at .. MR . WEI..I.S: H Cc1 s i'l :1 d it 1/Ja s :1 m p o 1~ tan t . T h :i s lAir'\ s l·n !) wi. 1;!1~J . J"'·w n l 'l f'! . s ;~~ y s J·w changE:!d h:is m:i.nd as he pdr'l :·i.c'i.pdl · ed """ d par·l ... of government, as a membe r of the Cdbi. n:~l: rUld FUIII'ld l::h;::~i : hc.~ could not. mal<c,~ any hec1ci1Alay against thE! Ff~df:!r'i'\l go•Jt'!Y'I11flf'!l'11~. Ul" -:i.1npr·ov':! Net.ufound1and' s position. That IAJas his d:i.fF'i.cltlt~.y.

NH1Arfound1;;lnd only has seven votes and Newfoundland IAJclS not:. l. ist·.fHH:~d t.:o. t hear·d l:: he Premier say the samE! thing, I haVE! hE:!c\r'd othc->.r·s ~;t:·\Y the ~;amc;! th'i.ng, and I sa:id thE! same thing rnysE•lf. That i s a mdjor problem . Newfoundland has only seven uoi ... E:!S. Wc.:! do not.: and cannot hr:i1Ve the kind of impact on the national 1\Jo . 18 1~?031

institutions that lAIH should have . T h t:l 1: i. s d. m ~.~ j o r p r o b 1. ern . H ~~ s H y s he chang~1d as a r~1sul t of that and f~:!l.t t.:h,;\t h~~ should l·:r·y and :increaSE! the influence and power· s of Nc,,wfoundl.and. He suppor·t. s Meech Lake becausE!, hE! said, it increases the power s of Newfoundland and diminishes ·Furt.hc;!r th~?. pot.~Jc-?.t's of l::hE:1 fc-~dEH'cill gover·nmEHlt . I agree with the major problem. I s h a r E~ 1': h c,1 v .. i. ~~ IAJ o F L h ~:! P r· c,~ m ·i c-:! I" ·i. n thr.lt n1gar·d. It :is a major fll"obl.c, ~ m.

T s h,•H'f ~ L~H: ! wi. c·~'~' of Lhc-~ hon. memb~H' fcH' Mount Scio ·- B~1ll T s 1. r:-l n d J n 1-. h "' 1: I" t·:! g d r· d . ii>J f~ h d lJ P SE!VE~ n votc,1s jn thE~ Hous ~1 of COITlHICHlS, bill: I!Jh~lt I d "i. ~;dgt ' c-~: : ! I~Jil-:h oi~: thc,~oir' solut:ion. T ~; u g g c,1 s t t h e 'i r· solut.:icHI, lAJhat l:ht:!y pi"Opo so , Lhc- ~ r"lc-~u c h I i>\ k:~ l:ypc, 1 ~ ~oJu t'j . or1 1 -:is or1ly go:-i ng to make'! Ilk\ 1: 1.: t'! r• S IAIO I "~)::! . l 1: :ii'IIFJI"OV~ ~ :i.l at a]J . "i. s n o!". go "i. ng i·.o Ml~. TOflT.I\J: Stop att~cking your colleague when he :i s no l·: h E:1 r· ''' . MR.

WF.:LLS : Mr. Speaker·, tJ.Jould you please ask that hon. member' t.o l<eE:1p cpri. et. so that .we can speak in the HousE:' . MR. TUI.K : And go to his own seat . r.IIR. WE LLS: Ml". Spc,~akc-?.1", 1.: h f:! y p r· o p o s o the;! major pr·oblem is 1.: h H lAW o n q s o l u ·t: i. o n . The·~ r·nnJ. flf'obl.~~~~~ tha l·. 1\Jc-~IAifoundl o:tnd hi\lS tn ConfE!derat ion :l.s that J t:. h A s s c:! u r:! n lJ o ·1 ... ~~ s . 0 n i·. ,.,, 1" .. i. o h H s 1d nc->.ty ..... f:i ve, Quc-?. bec has ~ ; f;!lJr- ' !tl'l' ·. y ... f ·i l)r~, i:Hld l·:ogc :! l·:hHt' I· he· ~

I) hdVC-'! 60 FJE'!I" CE~I'I t of 1':! · 1~1 VO'LE~S :-in 1: h e H 0 I I ~ ; (~ !) r NeiAifoundJC~nd :is as h·'!l"l'rlS of lJoi: i.ng poiAJor· I 2034 · Mi:lY 17, 1988 Cornmons. noth:i ng j n "i. n 1·. h-t'! H o 11 s 1:! VoJ. XL of Commons and we are unable to Hklkf:1 hc,1d.dl!li.'lY dnd unable t:o make impact because tAle do not have thE! Voi: -i.ng pOIAIEH' . No1.1.1, ME!c,,ch l..akc,1 IAri.l l. ·i.ncr·pase the'! powers of the provinces, it is t.r·uE:!, and d :i.m"i.ni.s h Lhe pOIAJE!I"S oF the federal governmen t . That i s t.r'IH~.

What t.l'lC'! rnHrnbc,:!r's fr.c-.i. l. to take tnto a c count, includo:i.ng Uw rn c, ~ rn b H r for· M o 1.1 n l: ;.) c-i. o B E! 1 1 Isla.nd, is that :in :i.ncrE!d Sinq NE'!IAJfol.lnrllAnd 1 s pOtAH:!r's vJS -· i~l - - vis the federal government, you are Als o increa sl ng On~ar i o 1 s and Quebec 1 s.

We will be worse off as c:·l r·r;! sIll L. ltdhd i· 1~1 8 0 I I 9 h ·1•: I. 0 l : lf ~ l: I" y ·i. n 9 to thc,:• ach:iev c,1 ·i.nFluc '! l'l CC! v ::i s -· a- v :i s p 1.1 1· l'i ng IAJh'.i.ch is Lo do . i s dimin:i s hing dl'l d pol~l! ' !l" o r:- NetAJf o und 1 c'lnd , QIIHbE '!C no L 1·. l·w rr1 tAJhat. 11p PI"OpO i" l·. -i. onc'll ... c:!l. y thE! govc::!l" nTTIE:!I'll~ IMcll'l'i..S The way you achieve t hat .i s a i. s hoLAJ T r' "i. p l. e 1 F 1 ~) e n iii t: H . T h r:~ l·. you achieve that.

PREMIER PECKFORD: H 01.1.1 a r· ~~ you go ·i. n g 1-:. o g (;! l:. 1:. hat IAJi t h the power of Ontario and Queb e c? Do not be unrealtsLic . MR . WELLS : I am n o t. b e :i. n g u r~r· e a l i. s t "i. c . We were well on th e way to getting l: hdl : , I1JC,1"J. l. on l : :h~~ Wi:·lY 1":0 I"PC(,1 'i. Ving that, working t oward it, in the c'! n cl , <"HH:I 1,~.,-i I: h I Jw p I" o FHH' a rrH'! n d ·i_ n g for·mula, I fE:'e l IAJC~ ! can ach:iE!VE! it. -i. n i · : hr~ t'!l'ld . PREMIER PECKFORD: ·----·--·-·----You are Jiving in a dr e am b!) 1j , 1j 0 I I i:H' H J ·j lJ i l'l g ·j l'l IAJor·ld.

QuebEH: and ( "i. n ,., 11 d "i. b I r:!) 1·. h ,:, 1: c·'! lJ c ~ t' y c:l i'·l y . No. 38 wor·Jd my i'·1 d r• (;! d ITI On l .. al"·.io R203 4.

We need only Ontario. We need only the approval of Ontario to a c h i_ ~~ v c.;! i. 1·. , 1:\ n c:l i I: i. s b r,~ c d 11 s ~~ o f' that ·t-.hat Qu~~bec IAJantecl thE:1 chdngc,~s i :h<:ll-. ~~H: !I"O 1nr:~c:lc,~ 'i. n Mf;!C'!Ch letke. AJl :it. doc.;!S :is FW~~ serves 1.. h C'! p 0 S ·i. 1·. ·j 0 1'1 S 0 f 0 1'1 1·. rH' i. (I r'll'l d Quc-:!bE~c age1:inst ouJ" 01.un -.inl:: c,1r'l':~sts r•lrld l.:hr•l·i: i!; I~Jhr:·\1· ·i.s riiJ'ldHI'flf~nl.d·l·ly wr·ong 1~r.:i l. h :i.t.

ThE:1 gouE!r'nlTIE!nt 1 s ~; o l. 11 t·: i. o n i. s b a s ·i u~ "I ·1 y 1~w o n g . ()I I r• p () S j i: ·j 0 n i. 1'1 C ril n d d i'l j !) dE~ j:HHI d c-~ n t upon h a ~J :i n g a T r· :i p J e 1 F 1 SC'!nai:r:! l:o pr·oi:'.E'!Ct ·UJC:! ·1 . nh~r·nsl:s of l:hE:1 small E!Y' pl"ou:i .nces becaUSE! IAJhat Meech l.~ke does is gi uo proportionately more power to Onl-.dr·Lo and qur:~bec . Thr:d: i.s ol.lr' fundamental problem. Our pro6lem · i s not NE!WfoundJ.and v'i.s --A--v.i .s the federal government, it is NeJAJfoundland vis--a-v "i. s Onti:tr·i .o and Quebec and the level of '.influence that we have nationally.

PREMIER PECKFORD: By rno r· <~ p OIAI<:1 r· in t h (:1 fish <-i! r· 1J dons not necessar·ily mean rnore pot.uer to 0 n t. a r i. o . T 1·1 ''' t. -i. s IAJ I'HH' n y o 11 1~w o n g . MR. WF.I..I..S: I d:i sagr·eE:~, Mr· . SpE:1aker·. What we h"' lJE! go 1: on f "i s ~w r -i. c.~ s 'i. s 1-. h o r i. g h 1-. to ti:ilk i~nd not.-.h:i ng else. What we Ol.lgh-1: l:o l:l1~ ~; l:r··i tri ng l:oi,Jr:-ll''d, Ml". Sp~~ak<-?.r', j s men'<"' vo t-:i ng pOIAIE:H' and cl ot1l: for· 1\JPI~ii-oiJndl.dl' ld . A II s -1: I".:~ l. ·i. c:-1 1~10 r· k s IAH~ 1.1. r:•\ !) d pclrJ:iamentctry monctrchy, a federal !> 1J ~; L-.

H m , ,., n c:l s o c:l o f7! s ~·it~J ·i ·1·. 7. f~ I" l."' n d . Wes t Germany works a little di.ffc->.rc;!ni :ly. Wf~St c~~r'Jildny has(>\ fc,~deral pal"l:iamEHlt that passc.;!s thE! laws and stales that administer Lh~'rn, but. do not makE! thE:HTJ. So it i. s a different k'i.nd of federal systE!m. W hE! r• E7! IAJ('!

J egislat:iVE! her'E:1, 1-:hE!I'l h m v f~ d d 'i. v ·i. s "i. o n o f poiAJers, as IAJe have t h L s PI" o v 'inc <:1 rnu s t r:t t. 1..?035 May 17, 1988 Vol XL some point have some means of having an equal say with every o1:h,~r· pt•ot.J:i.nc:f~ :i.n the c'!xer·ci.sc,1 of federal legislatiVE! j urisd:ict'ion H n d i. n 1 ·. h n f'! x p f7! n d i l~ 1.1 I" e o f F (;! d e r· a 1. funds. Unless and until IJJE1 do, lAIC:! IMi.l.'l. notJ:'!Y' h.:~t.Jo our· pr· opf:!r' place;! :in th~ Canadian Confederat-:ion. That.

Mt'!l''! 1: h fundamenLal flaw r: i·. -j_ n C I" f~ i'·l S C:1 ~; of thE:! powers of Ontario and Quebe c ·i . n~; · l-._,.~,,,d of c:I ·LHJ:i.nish ·i ng l':hC!fll. Th<:•tl· is where our rea] problem is. You havE:~ only t:.o look r:d:. l:hE! J.a !d: F.edfH'•'l l I:J1.1dgo I· . J 1.1 s t look EL ~ I:: he last federal budget and a great Fl.Lir·r·y of announcl':1rrJE:!n l::s dbout: ACOA. The Pl"'.irne M:inister LAJas g o i. n g t o .i. n f l. "i. c 1-'. p r· o s p E! r· :i 1·.: y o n AtlantJ .c Canada, against its uJi].l, of COI.II"S(-'!. 1-iC'! IAklS go.i.nq l:.O inflict