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September 26, 2018

42nd Parliament, 1st Session

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Hansard Transcripts

Votes and Proceedings

Orders and Notices

Hansard Transcript 2018-Sept-26 (PDF)

L028 - Wed 26 Sep 2018 / Mer 26 sep 2018

LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF ONTARIO

ASSEMBLÉE LÉGISLATIVE DE L’ONTARIO

Wednesday 26 September 2018 Mercredi 26 septembre 2018

Orders of the Day

Comité spécial sur la transparence financière / Select Committee on Financial Transparency

Introduction of Visitors

Wearing of jersey

Oral Questions

Privatization of public assets

Privatization of public assets

Privatization of public assets

Government accountability

Anti-racism activities

Government accountability

Anti-racism activities

Curriculum

Energy policies

Injured workers

Energy policies

Child care

Climate change

Child protection

Assistance to farmers

Horse racing industry

Notice of dissatisfaction

Visitor

Introduction of Visitors

Members’ Statements

Anti-racism activities

Canadian Police Memorial Ride to Remember

Hotel Dieu Shaver Health and Rehabilitation Centre

International Plowing Match

Curriculum

Sault Area Hospital

Emergency services

Home care

Ronald Dancey

Visitor

Introduction of Bills

Human Rights Code Amendment Act, 2018 / Loi de 2018 modifiant le Code des droits de la personne

Statements by the Ministry and Responses

Concussions

Petitions

Landfill

Curriculum

Soins de longue durée / Long-term care

Discrimination

Services for persons with disabilities

Northern health services

Curriculum

Affordable housing

Curriculum

Indigenous affairs

Gasoline prices

Orders of the Day

Select Committee on Financial Transparency

The House met at 0900.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Let us pray.

Prayers.

Orders of the Day

Comité spécial sur la transparence financière / Select Committee on Financial Transparency

Resuming the debate adjourned on September 25, 2018, on the amendment to the motion regarding the appointment of a Select Committee on Financial Transparency.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): When we last debated this matter, the member for Algoma–Manitoulin had the floor. I recognize the member for Algoma–Manitoulin.

M. Michael Mantha: C’est de valeur que je n’ai pas eu la chance de finir mon discours hier. Je voulais finir en reconnaissant tous les députés qui se sont joints à nous au lever du drapeau pour la journée de la francophonie.

Savez-vous les commentaires qu’on a reçus sur Twitter et puis sur Facebook? C’était un beau cadeau : les gens ont vu que les problèmes partisans avaient été mis de côté, et c’était tellement plaisant de voir tous les députés ensemble en train de sourire. Il y a eu plusieurs commentaires qui ont été mis sur l’Internet à cet égard. Je voulais juste dire aux gens : merci de nous avoir rejoint sur les terrains, et puis bonne journée de francophonie aux gens à travers de ma circonscription d’Algoma–Manitoulin.

Avec ça, je veux dire un beau gros bonjour à ma belle petite cousine, Chantal Mantha, qui est à Dubreuilville ce matin. Bonjour, ma belle Chantal. Je veux dire bonjour à M. et M me Desgagnes à Elliot Lake. Merci de nous joindre ce matin.

Bon, on commence où j’ai laissé hier : beaucoup de mes commentaires que j’ai faits hier étaient au regard de la relation entre nous comme l’opposition officielle et ce que que nous avons à offrir, notre devoir, et les voix qu’on doit emporter de tous les Ontariens envers ce gouvernement. Puis, le devoir du gouvernement—qui n’est pas seulement élu d’un groupe sélect à travers la province. Ils sont là pour être le gouvernement pour toute la province : non seulement un peu de la province, mais tous les gens qui ont participé à l’élection qu’on a eue.

Les commentaires qu’on a faits hier—on regardait les changements ou l’amendement que le député de Timmins et notre parti ont mis envers ce morceau de loi. On regarde à avoir une bonne représentation, une représentation équitable qui va avoir des points de vue de différentes façons.

Comme j’ai mentionné hier, c’est le devoir du gouvernement de non pas seulement écouter leurs voix et leurs messages. Un gouvernement qui se démontre comme un gouvernement chef et un gouvernement progressiste va regarder—et puis va admettre qu’ils n’ont pas toutes les réponses. Ils vont être capables de dire : « Sais-tu quoi? Je pense qu’on devrait ouvrir le panneau, retirer les rideaux pour faire certain qu’on peut avoir toutes les informations nécessaires. »

Parce que, il faut qu’on se rappelle. Quand il y a eu le scandale pour les « gas plants », quand il y a eu plusieurs autres projets questionnables qui avaient été portés de l’avant par le gouvernement libéral, je me rappelle que le membre de Nipissing, qui était le critique des finances dans ces temps-là—notre critique était le membre pour Timiskaming–Cochrane—mais aussi il y avait le membre pour Toronto–Danforth et puis il y avait le membre, de notre bord, de Kitchener–Waterloo. Ils ont tellement bien travaillé ensemble pour découvrir plusieurs problèmes, des affaires cachées. Ils ont découvert ensemble comment poser leurs questions à travers les ouvrages du comité.

C’est essentiellement ça qu’on demande à travers l’amendement : retirez les rideaux. Regardons ensemble ce qu’on peut poser et comment on peut travailler ensemble pour découvrir ce qui est arrivé avec les libéraux. Puis, on le dit, et on l’a tout le temps dit : « Coudonc, ce n’est rien de nouveau, là, ce que le ministre des Finances a sorti il y a deux, trois jours. » On a eu le rapport. Le rapport a été donné.

Coudonc, on était les deux sur le même bord de la Chambre. Je m’en rappelle; j’étais assis là, trois ou quatre sièges par là. Le ministre des Finances, qui est au gouvernement, était assis juste à côté de mon collègue de Timiskaming–Cochrane. Quand on a pris notre café le matin, on l’a tous vu, ce rapport. Ce n’est rien de nouveau.

Puis, avec les scandales, on se dit : « Oh, ma foi du bonyienne; on a découvert toutes sortes d’affaires. » Bien, non. On le savait. On le savait qu’il y avait au-dessus de 12 milliards de dollars en question. Ce n’est rien de nouveau.

Mais ce que le gouvernement est en train de faire, c’est de nous bouleverser avec une tellement grosse découverte pour qu’ils puissent faire exactement ce qui est leur objectif : de faire des coupures. Parce que si tu regardes leur message, ils ont des options. On a des options. Les revenus ont diminué. Ils ont déjà coupé plusieurs programmes qui contribuaient à notre économie, à des emplois. Ils l’ont coupé, ça. Ils ont retiré des investissements dans notre système de santé. Ils ont retiré des investissements dans nos écoles.

Ce qui fait que, c’est quoi qu’ils vont faire? C’est quoi qui va être la prochaine étape qu’ils vont prendre? Quand tu les regardes, il faut que tu regardes qu’ils vont couper des services. Ceci, c’est leur justification pour prendre les actions qui sont à venir. Et puis, guettez-vous, les gens. Guettez-vous, parce qu’on va souffrir. Ça va arriver et puis ça va faire mal. Ça va faire mal. Parce qu’il y en a déjà plusieurs qui commencent à les ressentir, ces coupures-là.

Ce qui fait que quand je regarde le gouvernement, je vous suggère fortement, quand le comité sélect est établi, de regarder et puis de donner le privilège à tous les membres du comité, non pas une seule majorité. Oui, vous êtes le gouvernement majoritaire. Vous allez avoir six personnes, plus une de ces personnes-là qui va être la chaise du comité. Nous, on va en avoir trois. Mais regardez à ouvrir les rideaux, partagez une bonne information, posez toutes les questions et puis donnez les privilèges à tous les membres du comité pour faire certain qu’on arrive aux réponses qu’on veut avoir pour faire certain de ce que les libéraux ont fait à l’Ontario.

Nous autres, on n’est pas en désaccord. On est sur la même page. Mais faites certain que ça n’arrive pas aux Ontariens et Ontariennes, et puis qu’on développe des stratégies et des politiques qui vont servir les gens de l’Ontario.

The Deputy Speaker (Mr. Rick Nicholls): Further debate?

Miss Monique Taylor: I’m shocked to see that the government isn’t standing to their own motion this morning. Actually, I guess we’re speaking on an amendment to the motion this morning but it’s unfortunate that the government has chosen not to take their time in this Legislature to speak to it, so here I am.

I am pleased, as always, to be able to rise in this House and to add my voice to the debates that happen here, and this morning it is on the Select Committee on Financial Transparency. Speaker, this comes hot on the heels of the minister’s shocking announcement last Friday that the deficit was substantially higher than the Liberals said it would be. In other words, Elvis has died. It’s new news—it’s new news.

I’m not going to stand here and defend the previous Liberal government because, Lord knows, they made serious mistakes and what I believe were serious errors in judgment that were made with a view of looking after their own fortunes rather than the people of Ontario. They cancelled gas plants in Mississauga and Oakville to save a couple of seats in an election. That cost Ontarians over $1 billion. eHealth was another scandal, another billion; and millions of waste in the absolutely inept handling of Ornge.

Whether it was scandals like the gas plants, eHealth or Ornge, or perhaps bad, self-serving policies like the sell-off of Hydro One—a plan which, of course, the Conservatives are carrying on with full gusto—the Liberals have a lot to answer for. On June 7, the public let them know, in no uncertain terms, what they thought of their actions.

But let’s be honest: The announcement wasn’t news to anyone. Actually, it’s a bit rich for the Minister of Finance to come out and pretend that it is. We knew what the Auditor General and the Financial Accountability Officer had to say about the Liberal government’s projections and their creative accounting practices. Both of those esteemed officers of the Legislature told us months ago that the deficit would be in the region of $12 billion rather than the $6.7 billion that the Liberals said it would be. We knew it, and the Minister of Finance knew it too.

In fact, just before the election, he raised it right here in this House—I believe from that seat just close in front of me here—that there were concerns. Just in case people don’t know, it is in Hansard forever. Everything we say in this House will stay in Hansard forever. We can dig out information on whatever is said. So, for the Minister of Finance to claim that this is a big shock really is more shocking than the actual news.

The information was there for all to see. We could have moved on with that knowledge. It’s not as if it’s an unusual turn of events for a new government. The Liberals made the same complaint when they took over from Ernie Eves and the Conservatives. Mike Harris did it when he took over from the NDP, and when the NDP formed government, it was David Peterson’s Liberals who were the culprits at that time.

But what’s a little different this time is that the government decided they would spend $1 million of public money paid to a former Liberal Premier of British Columbia to tell us what we already essentially knew. What a complete waste of money. Here we have an announcement that is setting the stage for deep cuts—cuts to hospitals, cuts to schools and cuts to transit systems—and they just throw away $1 million on a report that was completely unnecessary for information that everyone already knew.

And they have set aside another $30 million to take the federal government to court to challenge their carbon tax legislation. Let’s set aside, for a moment, the predictions from many legal experts that the challenge will most certainly lose. Instead, let’s think back to what just happened here in Ontario over the past few weeks. “How dare a judge make a ruling that goes against legislation passed by our government?” That was the Premier in one of his rages. Yet, this government sees no contradiction in going down the same road when the shoe is on the other foot.

So now, Speaker, we have a motion to appoint a Select Committee on Financial Transparency. I suppose we’re actually debating the amendment to the motion that was brought forward by my good friend the member from Timmins. It’s funny, Speaker; with the changes in all of our ridings, I want to say to the member from Timmins–James Bay, but he’s just an urban guy now with his new boundaries. I guess he has no more trips up the coast in his airplanes to see his constituents.

Speaker, just as a reminder to this House, and in case folks are just tuning in this morning, I want to read the motion:

“A Select Committee on Financial Transparency be appointed to consider and report to the House its observations and recommendations with respect to the report submitted by the Independent Financial Commission of Inquiry; and

“That the committee investigate and report on the accounting practices, decision-making and policy objectives of the previous government or any other aspect of the report that the committee deems relevant; and

“That the committee have the power to send for persons, papers and things; and

“That the committee be composed of six members of the party forming the government, three members of the official opposition, and that the Chair and Vice-Chair shall be members of the party forming the government; and

“That the committee be authorized to meet at the call of the Chair; and

“That the committee be given priority to use the Amethyst Room for its meetings; and

“That the committee shall present, or if the House is not meeting, release by depositing with the Clerk of the Assembly, its interim report by November 1, 2018, and its final report by December 13, 2018, or on a date to be determined by the committee.”

That’s the full text of the motion. And, as I said, the member from Timmins has moved an amendment to the motion, which reads as follows:

“In the second paragraph, insert the words ‘and the current government to date’ following the word ‘government’; and

“In the third paragraph, insert the words ‘and each member of the committee shall be authorized to independently call witnesses before the committee’ following the word ‘things.’”

I’m certainly not opposed to financial transparency; in fact, I’m all for it. The people we serve, the people of Hamilton Mountain, who sent me here to represent them, expect their government to be transparent in all of its actions. They deserve to know how decisions are made and how public money is spent.

I’ve also been hearing quite a bit lately from the government benches about wanting to work together; to work collaboratively in opposition. I have to say, so far I haven’t seen anything from the government to back that up. We’ve seen in several circumstances where debate in this Legislature has been stifled, and not only one bill but all bills that have been brought forward have not made it to committee. But I will live in hope.

Back to the two amendments that were brought forward by the member from Timmins: They serve to make the committee more effective and facilitate a collaborative approach to policy development. If the government says they want to work together, this is one of those measures that will help us work together. So I hope that the government will support these amendments.

Speaker, I’ve had the pleasure of working on various legislative committees here at Queen’s Park and I’m a big fan of what committees can accomplish. Admittedly, my experience in this regard was probably better during the minority government rather than in the majority years, but even then they had value.

During the last Parliament, when we had the Standing Committee on Justice Policy, we gave consideration to Bill 89. The members will remember that this bill replaced the Child and Family Services Act with the new Child, Youth and Family Services Act. There were around 300 amendments that were brought forward by the Liberals, the Conservatives and ourselves in the NDP. This was a significant result from input that was given to the committee from various members of the public, including different agencies, individuals who use those agencies, families and advocates.

We also received presentations from officers of the Legislature: the Information and Privacy Commissioner and the Provincial Advocate for Children and Youth.

As I said, the Liberals were in a majority situation and they were being—well, they were being Liberals, just as Conservatives are now being Conservatives, so I was disappointed that they basically ignored the amendments that we all put forward. As well, the Conservative Party put several amendments forward during that time which were pretty much turned down by the Liberal government. I think I was able to pass one amendment out of 130. It was very frustrating, I have to tell you, Speaker.

But they had heard the same presentations that I had heard, they’d received all the same written submissions that I had received, and many of their amendments were very similar to those that we proposed. Many didn’t go as far as I would have liked to address the issues that were raised by those presented, but that’s the way it goes. The final bill, by far, wasn’t perfect, by any means, but I think it greatly improved the lives of those it serves— and it was improved because of the work of the committee.

Those who presented certainly provided much more food for thought about what needs to be done for the people we serve and the people who need protection under acts such as the Child, Youth and Family Services Act.

I was also very fortunate to sit on the Select Committee on Developmental Services. That was during the minority of the 40th Parliament. We had a Liberal Chair, a Conservative Vice-Chair, three other Liberal members, two other Conservative members and two New Democrats. We were really able to work together during that time. We were able to hear from delegations across the province of our most vulnerable population: people with disabilities. There were so many tears and so many boxes of Kleenex floating around that we shared as Liberals, as Conservatives, as New Democrats. We shared those tears.

We shared the emotions that were brought before us. When we were working together to put amendments forward, we worked together. We traded off wording, because it made sense, because it was in the best interest of the people whom we were serving and whom we were talking about during that committee. That’s the work that should be done. That’s how we should be working together. We did come out with some really great recommendations. I mean, the Liberals, of course, stole the ball and ran with the recommendations before the report was even tabled, which, quite frankly, was shameful—but they did it.

The amendments should have actually changed lives. Instead, we see many folks who are still waiting for Passport funding. We still see a very difficult transition from special services at home as a young person into adulthood, into Passport funding. We still see many young people without supportive housing so that their aging parents can live the rest of their lives with some comfort knowing that their children—their young adults, their aging adults—have a safe place to call home.

I’m hoping that the government will look back to our days on this Select Committee on Developmental Services and remember those recommendations moving forward in their time in government, what can be done to ensure that people with developmental and physical disabilities actually have a chance in this life; and that because you’re disabled, it doesn’t give you an automatic ticket to poverty. Because that’s what we’ve seen existing under the Liberal government for many years.

Things didn’t change after the select committee, even though we came out with a really great report. The report, I’m sure, as the government has now noticed, is under a thick cloud of dust. Hopefully, they will dust that off and make sure that the work that was done in that committee is put to good use. There’s no sense in putting together a new committee if the reports are going to end up with dust, because that’s how we’ve seen many of the reports before this House.

Before my time, there was the Select Committee on Mental Health and Addictions, and yet mental health has probably one of the highest wait-lists. It costs us billions of dollars. It puts added costs on our health care. There were good recommendations that came out of that select committee, of which many of the members are still in this House. I believe that the Minister of Health was the Chair or Vice-Chair. I know she was very active on that committee. Like I said, it was before my time.

When she was in the official opposition, she raised that report several times, saying we need to get there, and yet still we have 12,000 kids on a wait-list for mental health services in the province of Ontario. We have families who are devastated by the lack of services that are available to them. We have children who are committing suicide on a regular basis. These are the types of things that happen when we don’t take care of our most fundamental issues. Mental health is no different than health care; it needs to be taken care of.

So another report sitting on a shelf with a lot of dust. I hope the government is going to wipe the dust off of that and look at those recommendations. Don’t do new committees to look at it again. Don’t do new research papers. The work is done. The people have spoken. The people have told us their needs. Yes, we have to have different ways of moving forward in how we’re going to tackle those issues, but we need to have the will to do it. We need to say that this is a priority and move it forward. Instead, we see other priorities that have come before this House recently that really don’t affect people very much.

A buck a beer? I’ve had hangovers that lasted longer than the thrill of the buck-a-beer announcement.

It’s a reality: The buck-a-beer isn’t going to do anything for anyone, for the people of this province. When I was knocking on doors, people did not say to me, “My beer is too expensive.” What they did say to me is: “My hydro is too expensive.” “I can’t afford my housing.” “I can’t afford my medication.” “My teeth are rotting; nothing I can do about it.” They didn’t tell me they needed a buck-a-beer. They didn’t talk about council being too big.

Hamilton is no different than Toronto. We have seen plenty of bills pass through city council that they fought on for years in Hamilton. It took 10-plus years to get the Red Hill Creek Expressway done. It took five years of—

Interjection.

Miss Monique Taylor: I’m not saying it’s a bad thing. You’ve got to listen to everything I’ve got to say. It took years to build the stadium and decide where the stadium was going to be built. But those kinds of discussions, when we have opposing ends, make for better decisions. Instead of having one heavy-handed end, you have a balance. You have to listen to both sides of the equation to be able to come together to make good decisions. If people don’t learn how to work together, we’re never going to be able to do that.

So if Toronto city council was not able to get to the decisions that they needed to do, then it’s because the decisions weren’t ready for everyone to agree with; that there had to be a side of it that just wasn’t working for the other side. You have to be able to work together to find the consensus. That is the job that we are given to do. Nobody sent me here with the thought that “Monique Taylor is going to change the world all by herself because she is my representative.” No. They sent me here as one of all of us to be able to put my two cents forward, to be able to have a voice, to be able to work with others to get the job done.

When we have majority governments who, quite frankly—they got 40% of the vote and they have 100% of the power. Maybe that’s a select committee we need: on how we’re looking at our elections moving forward so that all voices, all representatives—even the Liberals, who are in the penalty box currently, their constituents sent them here to have a voice to represent them. So we really have to look at our electoral process and how it’s working for the people of Ontario.

There’s so much to say and 27 seconds left to go on. It’s a good thing, having committees. I think we could find better use of time other than looking at information that we already know. We know that the Liberals did bad, but the Conservatives don’t need to do bad while they are there just because the Liberals did. Work together. Let’s actually do good things for the people of this province and move forward.

The Deputy Speaker (Mr. Rick Nicholls): Further debate?

Mr. John Fraser: I’d like to say it’s a pleasure to rise today, but it’s kind of odd because I’m actually debating a motion in which our party has no participation. It’s a bit odd, and it’s a bit odd to be debating whether the members of the committee can call their individual witnesses—again, not participating.

To the member from Hamilton Mountain, yes, we are in the penalty box. I understand that very clearly. The voters of this province sent us a message. What I would like to remind people, all the members in the Legislature, is that 1.1 million people voted for Ontario Liberals. Whether we’re the minivan party of seven or whether the Liberal Party—whatever the Premier wants to call us—we represent 1.1 million people and they are part of the people.

Our inability to participate in this committee and fully participate in this Legislature—there’s another motion going forward right now which I’m not going to debate at this point because we’re on this motion. What is right and just for those people is for their voices to be able to participate in the activities of this Legislature. In respect to us being in the penalty box, we need to go and take a look back at who we are, what brought us here as a government, and where we lost our way.

But that doesn’t mean that, in the current Legislature, we should not participate fully and that we should not be the voice of those 1.1 million people.

Our electoral system yields results that are somewhat distorted, and previous Parliaments have precedents in addressing that. Some 1.1 million people voted for Ontario Liberals in the last election. It yielded seven seats.

Hon. Victor Fedeli: Not quite enough.

Mr. John Fraser: That’s right, not quite enough.

In the last election, 2.3 million people voted for Conservatives and it yielded 76 seats. That’s a distortion, and in 1999 and 2003, the Legislature led by the government at the time, a Conservative government and a Liberal government, recognized that. So our participation, like the participation of the NDP in 1999 and in 2003, is important in this Legislature, because it’s not about the seven members. It’s not about us as members. It’s the people, as the Premier would say. I would add, all the people.

Hon. Victor Fedeli: For the people.

Mr. John Fraser: For all the people. Thank you very much, to the Minister of Finance.

I would like to say that it’s very, very interesting that we’re having this kind of three-act trilogy that the Minister of Finance is going through. Last Friday, the Premier and the finance minister, with language that I think they know they can’t use inside this House and they used outside this House in a way that they protect themselves—they know what they’re doing. So it’s interesting that we had a pre-election report that the auditor reviewed. We know the accounting dispute that existed inside there—except, last Friday, the Premier and the finance minister acted like it was news. They were shocked.

Here’s the interesting thing, Mr. Speaker: With this little three-act trilogy that they have got going, and the finance minister’s feigned shock and dismay, if you look at the financial inquiry—it’s interesting the language they use. They were calling yesterday’s document an audit until the auditors told them you can’t call it an audit because it’s not. What’s interesting to note is that inside that report, it says you should provisionally accept the pension treatment and negotiate with the auditor what it really should be. What that is saying is, “We don’t actually agree with this,” and the government is accepting that.

If you look to the other piece of the trilogy, which is the public accounts—and the finance minister is straightening his tie there because he knows this—take a look at the bottom of the document and see who signed that document. You know who normally signs that document? It’s the controller. The controller is a certified public accountant, a public servant responsible for living by the laws of their profession and doing their job on behalf of the people of Ontario. You know what you are not going to find on the bottom of that public accounts document? A controller’s signature.

The finance minister should answer for why that is, but he hasn’t. It’s interesting, isn’t it, Mr. Finance Minister? It is very interesting.

The Deputy Speaker (Mr. Rick Nicholls): I just want to remind the member of the motion that we are actually addressing this morning pertaining to select committees and that you’re starting to wander somewhat. I would ask that you tighten it up and speak more specifically to the motion and the amendment to the motion. Thank you very much.

Mr. John Fraser: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, and I’m sorry that I was engaging here. The finance minister wanted me to engage, but he doesn’t want me to any longer. And yes, I’m being careful. I will try to—

Hon. Victor Fedeli: I’m right here.

Mr. John Fraser: I didn’t say you had gone anywhere. I just said you didn’t want to talk anymore.

Mr. Speaker, I will try my best. It’s just a challenge when you don’t have an opportunity to participate or debate this issue, as it’s going to be the solely the government and the opposition that are there.

The member from Hamilton Mountain talked about select committees on mental health services and developmental services, and many other things that we’ve done in the history of this province have travelled and have produced a cross-partisan product that has helped guide us as a Legislature.

You’ve heard me say this before, Mr. Speaker: People send us here to take care of the things that are most important to them, the things that they count on for them and their families, like hospitals, like schools, like public transit, like a clean, green electricity system, like support for the most vulnerable. That’s why they send us, and we have to keep our eye on that ball.

At this select committee, those are the things that should be debated there as well as they are here, because that select committee is looking into the choices and the decisions of the last government and what they chose to invest in. If you look at the line-by-line review—not an audit—what it will tell you is that the growth in expenditures was almost zero internally in government—zero—if you factor in inflation. Where expenditures went was health care and education. Why do people send us here, Mr. Speaker?

To take care of their schools, to take care of their hospitals, to make sure their children have opportunity and success and a shot at getting a good job and a shot at a good life, to make sure—two weeks ago, when my mother had a stroke—there were people there to make sure that she would get better. That’s why they send us here.

What I’m concerned about with this select committee is that we’re not going to talk about that. We’re not going to talk about those things that are most important to Ontarians. The fact that the voices of 1.1 million people are restricted in this Legislature, and therefore restricted in the select committee that the government has put forward, is wrong. It’s simply wrong, and it goes against democratic principles. In this Legislature, we’re all equal—not anymore.

Mr. Speaker, this select committee—

Interjection.

Mr. John Fraser: You can laugh. But it’s not about me, and it’s not about you.

Mr. Roman Baber: I didn’t laugh.

Mr. John Fraser: You did.

The basic fact of the matter is, there’s a voice here of 1.1 million people in this party, these seven members—actually, 1.4 million if you include the Green independent member. And those voices are important. You shouldn’t make light of it, because one day, you may be in a position where you have the responsibility of speaking for 1.1 million people—

Mr. Gilles Bisson: Twice.

Mr. John Fraser: The member has had it twice. The interesting thing is, when it happened to the member twice, the Parliament recognized the distortion of the electoral system but, more importantly, the fact that 550,000 people voted NDP in 1999, and in 2003 it was 600,000, yielding 12.7% in 1999 and 14.6% in 2003. But the Legislature understood the importance of balance and ensuring that those distortions were recognized.

Mr. Gilles Bisson: That’s not quite what happened.

Mr. John Fraser: Well, they changed the standing orders in 1999 and, from a participation perspective in 2003, an accommodation was made. That’s what happened. The member from Timmins–James Bay knows that.

My point is that this select committee is really just another representation of what’s happening here in this Legislature. What should be happening at that select committee is what happens at all select committees, and that’s that all the voices of all the people in Ontario are heard at those committees.

That select committee should also be talking about the investments that you make to build 26 new hospitals or reduce wait times or give vaccinations for kids or add money to mental health or build new schools. Those are the decisions that government makes, and at this select committee that’s not going to happen. And the voices of 1.4 or 1.1 million people, however you want to add it up, are not going to be there. That’s wrong.

I want to thank you for the time, Mr. Speaker.

The Deputy Speaker (Mr. Rick Nicholls): Further debate?

Mr. John Vanthof: It’s always an honour to stand in this House and speak on behalf of the people in Timiskaming–Cochrane and, today, to represent my NDP colleagues in discussing the creation of a Select Committee on Financial Transparency, proposed by the Minister of Finance.

I think most of the people here know what a select committee is, but for the 18 viewers at home, we have a lot of—and I think there’s more than 18 viewers at home now, because when you have a government that seems to be willing to play with the “notwithstanding” clause of the Canadian Constitution, people are looking. That’s what this government was willing to do. So at the very least, this government is increasing perhaps not voter confidence but voter interest.

Mr. Bill Walker: I think confidence.

Mr. John Vanthof: The government whip thinks that they’re increasing voter confidence; we would beg to disagree.

For the folks at home and for the folks here, what is a select committee? A select committee is, in very layman’s terms—and perhaps I don’t understand what a select committee is; it wouldn’t be the first time that I don’t actually understand what goes on here. A select committee is basically a special committee struck to deal with a pertinent issue of the day—an issue that is usually non-partisan and that affects many Ontarians. The member from Hamilton Mountain did a very good job of describing one of those past select committees, the Select Committee on Developmental Services, a huge issue in this province, and not something that you’re trying to score political points on.

As with many reports, unfortunately, often reports of select committees—they’re done in good faith; people come to present—gather dust. I’m sure we can list select committees that have been done in good faith. There are all kinds of recommendations that the government could act on and all kinds of recommendations that, in the last 15 years, the past government did not act on.

When you have a new government, there’s a good chance that they could look at those past reports and see where they could actually help people. People would be somewhat surprised because Conservative governments have this aura around them that they’re into cut and slash. Perhaps this is coming again. But if they had actually looked at some of the past select committees and said: “You know what? There are some huge issues here and we’re going to tackle a couple of them—things that the government missed.” But that’s not what they’re doing here, in our opinion, with this select committee.

From media reports and from the government’s speeches, this select committee is going to be struck to figure out what happened, that the deficit is bigger than the government reported. That’s basically what this select committee is for. Well, the problem with that is that we already know why the deficit is bigger than what the government reported, and so does the government. So you have to question what the true purpose is of a select committee on financial transparency to find out where the hole in the deficit was. The Auditor General over the past few years has made it very clear in several reports where these holes were and where they are.

The first issue is, there was a severe disagreement between the government of the day—the Liberals—and the Auditor General regarding their reporting of pension funds, because the government was using pension fund assets as an asset towards bringing down their deficit. In simple terms, from what I understand, the Auditor General—I can’t speak for the Auditor General, but the way I understood it, the government couldn’t use that, because they didn’t control those assets. Although they were named on them, they didn’t control them. That’s actually pretty straightforward.

The second issue the Auditor General brought forward is the fair hydro plan, which is actually a huge borrowing scheme to—

Interjections.

Mr. John Vanthof: Oh, I have to respond. I was talking about the fair hydro plan and the government House leader and also the Minister of Economic Development both commented that it was a brutal plan. I agree. It’s a brutal plan. That’s why we campaigned against it. That’s why we wanted to stop it, and yet they’re continuing with it. It’s a brutal plan, and they know it’s a brutal plan. They comment that it’s a brutal plan. It’s a huge borrowing scheme that artificially subsidizes hydro bills.

Interjections.

Mr. John Vanthof: And you’ve adopted it, and yet you know it’s brutal.

You can’t have it both ways. You can’t call the government that implemented it—you said it’s a brutal plan and we have to have a financial accountability select committee. You have a select committee to find out where the hole came from. You know where the hole came from. You know what it was largely caused by—in the government’s own words, a brutal plan, but they are going to keep using it.

Interjection: Not exactly.

Mr. John Vanthof: That’s exactly what you’re doing.

What the government is going to do—we don’t have a clue. No one’s got a clue, actually, including them. But what they’re doing right now is, they are using the Liberal fair hydro plan, which they call brutal—the government House leader is now on the record calling it a brutal plan, but he is happy to use it, as is the Minister of Economic Development.

So there’s a bit of a problem in financial transparency right there, Speaker. There are some issues we should look at. But you have to wonder why they’re so focused on—oh, I think I know why they’re so focused, but why they’re so focused on finding that hole—a big surprise, no one had ever heard of it, supposedly, but I’ve got a few quotes from the now Minister of Finance, who at that time was the Tory critic for finance. At that time, I was the NDP critic for finance, and I can add up to nine and a half.

From May 7, 2018, Speaker—

Mr. Gilles Bisson: Who said what?

Mr. John Vanthof: The member from Nipissing. The Conservative finance critic at the time, now the Minister of—

Interjection.

Mr. John Vanthof: I believe the Speaker is mocking my lack of a digit. Since I mock myself all the time, it doesn’t bother me, Speaker. We can share that laugh together.

Anyway, the Tory finance critic, who is now finance minister, seems completely surprised that there is a hole in the deficit, that they inherited a bigger deficit than they were planning. He is shell-shocked. That’s why this select committee has to be struck: because they are so shell-shocked by this hole in the deficit.

In the words of the member from Nipissing on May 7, 2018: “Speaker, here we have got the Auditor General telling us that the government has given us two sets of numbers that are wrong: one was all about pension numbers, where they added too much, and one was about the so-called fair hydro plan, where they didn’t add enough. Both stretched the credulity of the numbers. She said that it appears that there’s money when there isn’t—that’s our auditor. She is offering that she may give an adverse opinion.

That means: ‘I will not sign the government’s book.’ She’s given us what’s called in accounting a qualified opinion for two different years in a row. It’s the first time in the history of our province that we got a qualified opinion. What that means is, ‘I don’t really trust the books. You can get away with it, but I don’t really trust them. I’m going to show you what I think is wrong.’ She has done that.

This time, she said, ‘If you put that nonsense in your books again, one more time, I am giving an adverse opinion.’ That’s exactly what the auditor has told us.” So this wasn’t a surprise to the government despite their claims to be so.

What worries me is that this government—it’s a new government; they’re supposed to be new and fresh, but what they’re doing is, instead of governing responsibly, as people were hoping, they’re using committees as public relations exercises. They want to search for information, a de facto witch hunt—and there are lots of things to find for the government. They want to search for information that we’ve already got for public relations purposes, for messaging, so they can cut and slash. That’s basically what they want to do.

This select committee could have a purpose. It could have a much more valid purpose if we actually allowed the select committee to look at not just the past government, but the practices of governments, including the current government. Then the select committee would have a much broader view and could actually fix some of the problems that are happening.

One of the roots of the problems that are happening and that happened with the Liberals—I remember when I first got here, it was the Ornge scandal. Remember the Ornge scandal? And then the gas plants scandal? They had lots of scandals. One of the reasons that they had so many scandals is because they tried to hide things from the Legislature. They wanted to go around the Legislature, and that was after 15 years of being in government.

These guys, the present government, haven’t been in for—what, five months?

Interjection.

Mr. John Vanthof: Three months—and they’re doing exactly the same things.

Anyone who serves wants to lead. This is a hard job to get elected. It’s a hard job to stay elected, and I don’t believe that anyone runs for jobs like this for the wrong reasons. We all run because we want to help our fellow Ontarians.

But when the governing party starts out as arrogant as the last government ended, you know you’re in big problems. The government House leader and the government whip are hurt. They’re mortally wounded. Their pride has been hurt. But they themselves know that when you have emergency sessions to ram things through without using the Legislature, they should be hurt, because they know better, Speaker.

We are looking at this select committee. We have proposed a few changes to actually make it work. The government won the election. I may not like it, but that’s the reality. And because they won the election, they have the right to put forward their mandate.

But if they really stop and think about it and if they are really serious about getting to the bottom of what has happened to governments—why things have gone wrong in the past—and if they really want to make sure that things don’t go wrong in the future with their mandate, they should actually vote for our amendments to broaden the role of this committee, to actually look at the functioning of governments over time—not just a snapshot, but over time.

I’ll give you an example. There has just been a report. It was supposed to be an audit, but now it’s not an audit. It wasn’t a surprise. It’s, “Let’s sell more things off from the government; sell off the LCBO.” That’s a view. The last time we did this—let’s look at the 407 and see what would have been better. Then we can have a view: Is it a good idea or is it not a good idea?

Another thing that I hope this government takes to heart is that we have an Auditor General’s office—very credible, the Auditor General. We have a Financial Accountability Officer and office—very credible. I would hope that this government actually helps these independent officers and makes sure that they have enough staff to do their work adequately. Governments, after they’re in a while, don’t tend to like the Auditor General much, because the Auditor General and the Financial Accountability Officer point out problems. But it’s not to hurt the government, because, guess what? Every government is going to have problems. When you run a big show, you have problems.

But creating committees—it’s worth thinking about if we need to broaden the scope. But we have to make sure, and this government has to work with the independent officers that we have. The government House leader has a great relationship with the Auditor General. I hope that that relationship stays, and I hope that they respect her office enough to make sure that it’s adequately funded to do the job she needs to do. That will be the test. That’s a fine detail, but that will be the test.

It’s the same with the Financial Accountability Officer. They perform a vital role, an important role.

The Auditor General has already performed the role that this select committee is supposed to do under the narrow mandate, because the Auditor General has already identified where that fiscal hole is. She has already done that. Can she comment on how that happened, politically? No. That’s why we need to broaden the scope: to make sure that that doesn’t occur within our system regardless of who’s in power.

That’s why I strongly urge the government to vote for the amendments we’ve put forward to ensure that that Select Committee on Financial Transparency, I believe it’s called, actually does what people would hope it would do—that it would help the Legislature, in future, to correct problems that are happening in government.

If it’s just going to be a witch hunt for—and there are lots of things. You don’t have to try hard to do a witch hunt on the Liberals; there’s lots of stuff. But you won the election. It’s time to make sure—

Interjection.

Mr. Bill Walker: Speaking of—

Mr. John Vanthof: Where was that masked man?

It’s time that we actually look at how our system is working so those problems don’t happen again, because a lot of those things are going to—if Ontarians and your party think that they’re not going to happen with you, we’re all going to be sadly disappointed, and no one more than your government, because you’re not going to get the mandate that you think you deserve for the second time.

The Deputy Speaker (Mr. Rick Nicholls): Further debate?

Ms. Peggy Sattler: I am pleased to rise today to participate in the debate on the amendments to the motion that was moved by the government to establish a Select Committee on Financial Transparency. I want to begin by congratulating the government for finally talking about committees. This is the first time that this government has shown any kind of interest in moving anything to a committee process.

Based on my five years in this Legislature, I know how important committees can be. I know how valuable it is when you open up government policies and decisions and invite the public to come to express their views about what the government is doing, maybe propose some amendments to what the government is doing and bring new ideas to the table. That allows us, as MPPs who sit on these committees, to bring forward amendments, ideas and suggestions into this place during debate, and it improves the decisions that come out of this Legislature.

I want to be very clear that the amendments that we have proposed to the government’s motion on this establishment of a Select Committee on Financial Transparency are grounded in our experience, our awareness of how committee processes should work and the kinds of processes that improve decision-making in this place. That is why we believe very strongly that this committee should not just be looking backwards; this committee should also be looking forwards.

Currently, the motion that was brought forward by the government calls on the committee to investigate and report on the accounting practices, decision-making and policy objectives of the previous government. All that this government is proposing to do right now is to look backwards and to see the circumstances and the decisions that led to the $15-billion deficit that we heard about last week. We’re saying that instead of just looking backwards, we should also be looking forwards. We should be considering the decisions that have been made so far by the current government, because those decisions have been very much affected by the decisions that were made by the past government.

Mr. Gilles Bisson: Full transparency.

Ms. Peggy Sattler: Exactly, we need full transparency, both in what happened before but also in what is currently going on in this province.

The second amendment that we have moved is in terms of the people who will present to this committee, who will be called before the committee to make deputations. Currently the motion states, “That the committee have the power to send for persons, papers and things.” Now, it also states that the Conservatives have a majority of members on the committee. So when the motion says, “The committee shall have the power,” what it really means is that the Conservatives shall have this power.

We are saying that each member of the committee—including the three members of the official opposition who will be members of this committee—should be authorized to independently call witnesses before the committee. That’s because we may have different views on who would be important, who would bring an important perspective to the table, whose voices should be heard.

We’re really trying to help this government out, quite frankly, Speaker. They claim to be a government for the people. Well, they have shown that they are only interested in some people. When you allow the opposition members who are sitting on the committee to also participate in determining which witnesses would be really useful in bringing a new perspective, new ideas—we may have a different list of people than this government has in mind. That’s why our amendment is so important.

Speaker, I want to speak for a few minutes about my own experience on a select committee and why I feel so strongly that these amendments that we’ve proposed would be helpful in terms of the process of decision-making. I sat on the Select Committee on Sexual Violence and Harassment. That was a committee that was established by a motion of this House. It included members from all three parties. Now, there was some debate at the time of the establishment of that committee about the number of members. We felt very strongly that the role of a select committee is supposed to be non-partisan.

It’s not supposed to reflect the will of the government majority; it is supposed to be a collaborative process that involves equally all of the parties in this Legislature.

The government of the time, the Liberal government, insisted that its members have a majority on the committee, so what we ended up with was a committee that was composed of—I think there were five Liberal members, three Conservative members and two NDP members. So, Speaker, we had some concerns going into that process that it might end up reflecting the view of the majority of the Liberal members who were on the committee, but I have to say that that select committee process did in the end work well.

We were able—the Conservative members who sat on the committee and the NDP members who sat on the committee—to make decisions about what witnesses would be called, where we would travel, who we would reach out to, where we would advertise that this committee was in place in Ontario, so that people could have an opportunity to submit written submissions if they wanted. That was really important.

That committee, the Select Committee on Sexual Violence and Harassment, did not only look at the past policies and decisions of the government. It very much was looking forward to try to identify what government could do in the era of #MeToo. Yesterday we heard the charges laid against Bill Cosby. At that time, there were just the revelations about Jian Ghomeshi and Harvey Weinstein, so the context of that committee was very important.

But we wanted to ensure that the recommendations that would come out of that select committee would very much be looking forward, would very much be looking at how we can prevent women—mainly women—from being victims of sexual violence and sexual harassment. That is what a select committee should do: It should be looking forward. It should be developing recommendations that are going to help people in Ontario.

Frankly, Speaker, when I look at the parameters that the government has brought forward for this select committee, I’m not sure that they are that interested in looking forward and in trying to make things better for the people of this province. It seems to me, in many ways, that this very first effort of this government to take anything to committee is showboating. It really is. It’s just to create this political theatre so that they can beat up on the previous government without taking any responsibility for how they are going to move forward and fix things for Ontarians in the future.

The only people who seem to be surprised by the size of this deficit are this Premier and the members of his caucus. Everybody else in this province—certainly, us on this side, the official opposition—were very much aware that the deficit was not what the Liberals were reporting. In fact, the now Minister of Finance knew it himself. Just prior to the election, back in May 2018, he stood in this place—he was on this side at the time. Right from Hansard, this is what he said: “Another week, and another damning report is out on the government’s faulty fiscal record.

This time, we hear the truth from the Financial Accountability Office. The FAO agrees with the Auditor General. They, too, forecast a $12-billion deficit”—

Mr. Gilles Bisson: Surprise.

Ms. Peggy Sattler: Yes, exactly.

So, Speaker, this government knew from when the Auditor General first reported her findings, from when the Financial Accountability Officer confirmed the auditor’s findings. This government knew very well that the deficit that the Liberals were reporting was not exactly as it should have been.

What this government has not acknowledged is that part of the reason that the deficit was so much larger than what the Liberals were reporting was because of the fair hydro plan. My colleague the member for Timiskaming–Cochrane has already talked about that. We know that this government, during the campaign and still, has embraced the Liberals’ fair hydro plan, which is going to cost this province an extra $40 billion.

If we’re going to talk about financial transparency, we should be talking about that extra $40 billion that is going to be put on to taxpayers, to citizens in this province, to children who will grow up and inherit this debt—

Interjection: Including Conservative children.

Ms. Peggy Sattler: Exactly—including Conservative children.

The people of this province will be burdened with that policy decision of that government for generations.

Mr. Gilles Bisson: And they’ve adopted it.

Ms. Peggy Sattler: They’ve embraced it. They’re trumpeting it. They are championing it.

Mr. Gilles Bisson: Tories are Liberals in a hurry.

Ms. Peggy Sattler: Exactly.

Speaker, these are the kinds of things we should be talking about.

We also know that people had 15 years of Liberal government. What I heard repeatedly during the campaign was that people wanted to turn a corner. They wanted to move on. They wanted to fix health care. They wanted to get some affordable housing built. They wanted transit systems. They wanted solutions to be brought forward to deal with these very pressing issues. I’m really worried that this committee is not going to give us those solutions.

I’m going to wrap up my comments now because I see you’ve given me a signal.

The Deputy Speaker (Mr. Rick Nicholls): Thank you very much.

Debate deemed adjourned.

The Deputy Speaker (Mr. Rick Nicholls): When the debate does resume, you will have time left to continue, should you choose to do so.

It is now 10:15. This House will stand recessed until 10:30.

The House recessed from 1015 to 1030.

Introduction of Visitors

Hon. Sylvia Jones: Good morning, everyone. I would like to introduce Gordon Stringer, who has joined us in the gallery this morning. Mr. Stringer is, of course, Rowan’s dad. As we all know, today is Rowan’s Law Day. Rowan was a 17-year-old Ottawa varsity rugby player who died after sustaining multiple concussions in May 2013. Gordon joins us here at Queen’s Park on this very special day to honour Rowan’s memory, raise awareness and help improve concussion safety. I invite all of you to join us on the grand staircase immediately following question period for a group photo with Mr. Stringer to mark Rowan’s Law Day.

Mr. David Piccini: I’d like to welcome to the Legislature today a friend and constituent of mine from Newcastle, Clarington: Gerry Black, who’s sitting up in the gallery.

Mr. Michael Parsa: I would like to welcome to the House today members and representatives from Life Sciences Ontario. I would like to thank them for taking the time to be here today and I hope that my colleagues in this House will join them this evening at their reception in room 228 from 5 to 7 p.m.

Mr. Lorne Coe: It’s my pleasure to welcome to the Ontario Legislature Theresa and Michael Montagnese. Welcome to Queen’s Park.

M me Nathalie Des Rosiers: I’d like to welcome to the Legislature Janet Cameron, Cynthia Phillips, Wendy Showler and Monica Leask, who are girlfriends of Camille Therriault-Power, the mother of my EA, Mary-Liz Power, and a constituent of Ottawa–Vanier. Bienvenue à Queen’s Park. Welcome to Queen’s Park.

Mr. Vincent Ke: I would like to recognize Derek Lin, a grade 8 student from my riding of Don Valley North. He attends Don Valley Middle School. He is serving a two-week term as a legislative page and is our page captain in the House today. Welcome to Queen’s Park and I hope you enjoy your time here.

Wearing of jersey

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): The Minister of Children, Community and Social Services has informed me she has a point of order.

Hon. Lisa MacLeod: Speaker, I am seeking unanimous consent in order to wear my Rowan’s Law jersey today. I’m hoping the House will indulge me.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Is there unanimous consent? Agreed.

Oral Questions

Privatization of public assets

Ms. Andrea Horwath: Speaker, my first question is to the Deputy Premier. The government spent weeks setting the table for deep cuts in our schools, hospitals and the services that families rely on, and yesterday we learned that they’re also revving up for a fire sale of public assets to their wealthy friends on Bay Street. The latest public relations exercise was unveiled yesterday by the chair of Treasury Board, a report calling for deep cuts to services and a massive sell-off of public assets.

Earlier this week I asked the Premier what he was going to cut, but now I have another question: What is his government going to sell?

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Deputy Premier?

Hon. Christine Elliott: President of the Treasury Board.

Hon. Peter Bethlenfalvy: Through you, Mr. Speaker, to the Leader of the Opposition: Our government is working day and night to restore trust and accountability to Ontario’s finances. While the new deficit party believes that the government can rack up unlimited amounts of debt without consequences, the reality is, it cannot.

In fact, the member for Hamilton West–Ancaster–Dundas earlier this month said, “Everyone knows the Liberals left us with a mess and a feud with our Auditor General.” We know the Liberals left us a mess and, unlike the NDP, we are fixing it for the people. We have fixed public accounts. We have fixed the feud with the Auditor General. Our government’s priority is to ensure that the fiscal stability of this province exists while protecting core public services now and into the future.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary.

Ms. Andrea Horwath: Speaker, what the people can’t trust is a government that doesn’t tell them what they’re about to do during an election but goes ahead and does it after an election.

The Premier did not run on selling public assets, and it wasn’t in the throne speech either, but yesterday the President of Treasury Board was happily telling reporters that he’s ready to get started. Where have I heard this before, Speaker?

Given the history of disastrous privatization in this province, does the Deputy Premier really believe that a fire sale of public assets makes a lick of sense?

Hon. Peter Bethlenfalvy: Our government has been working hard for the people of Ontario and has been restoring trust and accountability to government. EY had a mandate to consider all options and to present those to government. They did an excellent job and left no stone unturned. While the opposition has been breathlessly fear-mongering, we have been looking for solutions. The line-by-line audit presented some solutions to government. Just because an option was presented to the government doesn’t mean it will happen.

What I can say is this: We are not necessarily for or against privatization; we are for the people. Every choice we make will be to modernize and transform government for the people so that they can continue to receive high-quality public service now and into the future.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Final supplementary.

Ms. Andrea Horwath: Well, Speaker, I have to say that the opposition doesn’t have to fear-monger; the government is doing it themselves. The government is doing it themselves.

Families have seen this movie before. It never ends well for everyday people, but it ends well for well-connected insiders of governments. The last Conservative government never campaigned on selling the 407, but they did it anyway and stuck drivers with the bill—a bill they continue to pay today. In 2014, the Liberals ran an election campaign insisting that they were not going to privatize Hydro One, and within months they were doing exactly that.

Is Doug Ford pulling a Kathleen Wynne here—

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): We have to refer to the Premier by “the Premier.”

Ms. Andrea Horwath: Thank you, Speaker—springing a sell-off of public assets on voters mere weeks after an election where it was never mentioned once?

Hon. Peter Bethlenfalvy: The goal of the line-by-line audit was not just to fulfill a balance-sheet commitment but to ensure that vital services meet the needs and expectations of the people.

Ontario has accumulated the highest subnational debt of any jurisdiction in the world at $338 billion. On the current path, our shared prosperity is not assured. Action must be taken.

Our government is going to use the line-by-line audit as a guide as we move forward to transform programs and modernize services to ensure sustainability and value for money. We will transform government into a modern institution that serves the people and, by doing so, will create a more sustainable Ontario for this generation and future generations.

Privatization of public assets

Ms. Andrea Horwath: My next question is also for the Deputy Premier. The Conservatives shed crocodile tears when the previous government sold off Hydro One. Now they have the corner offices, and they’re keeping the Liberals’ privatization scheme in place.

Will the Deputy Premier rule out further sell-offs of shares of Hydro One and other electricity assets like Ontario Power Generation, or is that one of the many things this Premier is ready to sell?

Hon. Christine Elliott: As the President of the Treasury Board said, we are not pro-privatization; we are pro the people. We have been working since we became government to restore trust and accountability to Ontario’s finances. While the official opposition might believe they can rack up untended, unqualified amounts of money without consequences, the reality is, they cannot.

In fact, the member for Hamilton West–Ancaster–Dundas earlier this month said that everyone knows the Liberals left us with a mess and a feud with our Auditor General. Well, we know and the people of Ontario know that the Liberals left us with an enormous mess, and unlike the official opposition, we are working to fix it for the people. We’ve fixed the public accounts. We’ve fixed the feud with the Auditor General. Our government’s priority is to ensure the fiscal stability of this province while ensuring high-quality public services like health care, now and into the future.

Interjections.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Stop the clock.

Start the clock. Supplementary.

Ms. Andrea Horwath: Well, Speaker, the LCBO brings in $2 billion annually for the people and families of Ontario, yet the Conservatives’ high-priced consultants now say that they could sell it for a one-time cash payout.

Will the Deputy Premier rule out the sale of the LCBO, or is this yet another public asset that this Premier is ready to sell?

Hon. Christine Elliott: EY had a mandate to consider all options and present those options to the government, and they did an excellent job and left no stone unturned. That’s what we need to do in order to modernize government.

Just because we’ve been doing things the same old way year after year doesn’t mean it’s the right thing to do. But it also doesn’t mean that we are going to accept all of the options that have been presented. There are many options contained in the report, if you take the time to read it, and just because an option was presented to us doesn’t mean that we’re going to take them up on it.

Again, what I can say is that we are not pro-privatization; we are pro the people. We are going to make decisions that are in the best interests of the people of Ontario based on what we hear from them and to make sure that our system is going to be sustainable now and into the future, because we are on a cliff right now. We need to make sure that we can have a system that people can rely on. As Minister of Health and Long-Term Care, that is what my goal is.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Final supplementary.

Ms. Andrea Horwath: I’m glad the Deputy Premier knows what a mandate is. They don’t have one to sell off public assets. They do not have a mandate to sell off public assets.

Four years ago, an arrogant, out-of-touch government that didn’t campaign on selling public assets turned around and did just that. Four years later, an arrogant government that didn’t campaign on the sell-off of hydro, the LCBO or other public assets is floating the idea of public asset fire sales. From the 407 to Hydro One, we have seen this play out over and over and over again. With privatization, the government’s friends on Bay Street make a fortune and the families of this province pay the price, each and every time.

The Premier did not campaign on selling off private assets. Why is he considering it now?

Hon. Christine Elliott: Well, Mr. Speaker, I would say, through you to the leader of the official opposition, we certainly do know what our mandate is. That’s what got us elected on June 7. We are here for the people. We’re going to be making decisions to make life more affordable for people so they can find jobs, to lower their hydro rates, to lower their gas rates. That is what we are delivering on and that’s what we’re going to continue to do in the future. We are going to find efficiencies in government. That is what it’s all about: modernizing government, modernizing the way that we do things.

It’s all for the people to make sure we can have sustainable essential services now and into the future for our children and our grandchildren.

Privatization of public assets

Ms. Andrea Horwath: My next question is also for the government, Speaker, but I would start with a recommendation that they find a thesaurus, because “modernization” and “transformation” are the same words that that government used to privatize public assets. A thesaurus might be useful.

Yesterday the President of the Treasury Board said that the government—this is to the Deputy Premier—would be willing to sell off public assets if “it made sense.” Does the President of the Treasury Board think that it made sense—I’m sorry, this is actually to the Treasury Board president—to sell off Hydro One and the 407? Did that make sense?

Hon. Peter Bethlenfalvy: Well, Mr. Speaker, it might be a good idea for the Leader of the Opposition to actually read the EY report because there’s actually no mention of selling off the LCBO in the report—48 pages. It would help starting there. In fact, what the report did do is talk about ideas to transform government and savings, ongoing savings. In fact, there were 11 other categories, not just one-time savings.

It behooves us, for the people of Ontario, to look at all options. The third-party report has presented a range of ideas that other provinces have already looked at and executed to modernize and transform government, to provide services at a higher quality point and a lower price point. What a novel concept. So, Mr. Speaker, I encourage the official opposition to read the report. I’ll answer their questions then.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary.

Ms. Andrea Horwath: Families have been burned by these sell-offs time and time again. The Conservatives promised change and now they’re playing from Kathleen Wynne’s obfuscation and privatization playbook. Why—

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): I’m going to ask the member to withdraw.

Ms. Andrea Horwath: Withdraw, Speaker.

The Conservatives promised change and now they’re playing from the former government’s privatization playbook. Why does the chair of the Treasury Board think that his fire sale of assets will be any different than the fiasco around the Conservative 407 sell-off or the Liberal Hydro One sell-off?

Hon. Peter Bethlenfalvy: Again I recommend the official opposition read the report, because it’s a wealth of great ideas.

You know, Mr. Speaker, we don’t have a monopoly on good ideas just in this room. We reached out to all Ontarians, including our Ontario public service, and I’m pleased to report that we received over 26,000 ideas from Ontarians on how to modernize this government and move forward.

We don’t need the same old, same old. That’s not going to move us forward. That’s not going to allow us to find the efficiencies to provide the financial foundation to provide the core services that Ontarians expect from this government. We will act now, Mr. Speaker.

Government accountability

Mr. Michael Parsa: My question is to the President of the Treasury Board. Mr. Speaker, our government has taken unprecedented steps in recent months to restore trust and accountability in government finances. This is what we promised to the people of Ontario and this is what we’re delivering on. In fact, it is my understanding that the line-by-line review was the most thorough review of the province’s books ever undertaken in Ontario’s history, with more than half a million lines of government spending 15 years, which spanned 15 years.

Along the way, our government hasn’t forgotten how important it is to listen to the people and to have an open government. That is why the Planning for Prosperity consultations, which closed last Friday, also fed into the audit. Can the President of the Treasury Board please inform the House how the Planning for Prosperity consultations were taken into account during the line-by-line review?

Hon. Peter Bethlenfalvy: Thank you to the member for that very thoughtful question. Mr. Speaker, let me be clear: The financial issues facing this province are not problems solely impacting one party or government. This is a 14-million-person problem. Every woman, man and child in this province is impacted by government debt.

That is why we launched the Planning for Prosperity consultations and asked EY to integrate the results of the broad consultation with the people into their assessment. The consultation generated more than 15,000 survey results from Ontarians who are hungry for a government that governs differently. Our consultation with the people is central to what we were elected to do. Our government is not here just to fulfill a balance sheet commitment; we are here to ensure that vital services meet the needs and expectations of the people, now and into the future.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary.

Mr. Michael Parsa: I would like to thank the President of the Treasury Board for that informative answer.

Speaker, the government committed to changing how things work at Queen’s Park so that we could do better to serve the people of Ontario. The answers from the President of the Treasury Board make it clear that our government for the people is delivering on our promises.

Where the Liberals were secretive, we are open and transparent. Where the Liberals shunned consultations with people, we have embraced them. And as per the Auditor General’s report, where the Liberals manipulated the public accounts, we have corrected them.

Can the President of the Treasury Board please inform the House as to what other insights the line-by-line review offered into the Liberal spending spree?

Hon. Peter Bethlenfalvy: Thank you again to the member from Aurora–Oak Ridges–Richmond Hill for that excellent question.

We have a massive challenge ahead of us, but we also now have a blueprint for our path forward. What the audit shows is that we must acknowledge that reckless spending is the least compassionate path that any government can take, regardless of their intentions, because it jeopardizes the long-term sustainability of the core services of government. For instance, the review shows that if only the Liberals had showed some restraint and held expenditures to population growth, the government of Ontario would have spent $330 billion less over the last 15 years. That amount is almost exactly identical to the existing debt burden that we have today.

It is clear that we must now act to modernize government and make it more efficient so that we can create a more sustainable Ontario for today’s generation and, importantly, future generations.

Anti-racism activities

Ms. Laura Mae Lindo: My question is to the Minister of Community Safety. Yesterday, the Premier was asked to clearly and definitively repudiate the campaign of Faith Goldy. Unfortunately, the Premier refused to do so. We now have learned that Faith Goldy is robocalling voters across Toronto, claiming to be the Doug Ford candidate.

Does the Minister of Community Safety—the minister responsible for the Anti-Racism Directorate—believe that the Premier should unequivocally denounce Faith Goldy and apologize for appearing in a photo that is now being used as a de facto endorsement of her campaign by the Premier of our province?

Hon. Michael A. Tibollo: Thank you for the question. We’ve said it over and over again that there is no place for racism in the province of Ontario. I heard over and over again yesterday the Premier of the province repeat that, and I think he’s abundantly clear in his position with respect to racism.

We are actively pursuing policies, and we have an individual who has been put in place to assist in terms of the Anti-Racism Directorate, our member from Brampton South.

I would encourage you and I encourage anyone else interested in pursuing those issues—really pursuing the issues, not to try to gain political advantage in a situation where it’s not necessary—to work with us and find a solution that is good for the entire province. That’s what we should be doing.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary?

Ms. Laura Mae Lindo: Wow. This is back to the minister: We have to do better. The people need the government to do better.

There is a candidate, Ms. Goldy, who represents unvarnished hateful, polarizing views about race and diversity, who has appeared in at least two photos with the Premier. The Premier won’t denounce Faith Goldy specifically or apologize for taking these photos.

Will the minister responsible for anti-racism initiatives in this government denounce Ms. Goldy’s campaign and apologize on behalf of the government for this seeming endorsement, whether it was an intentional endorsement or not?

Hon. Michael A. Tibollo: As I’ve stated previously, as the Premier has stated previously, there is no place for racism in this province. We’ve been very, very clear that this is an inclusive province, and we will work as government to ensure that those policies are continued and they’re put into effect.

I invite the opposition to work with us to ensure that those policies are pursued and developed and put in place so that the government and the entire province is rid of racism. Thank you very much.

Government accountability

Mr. Stan Cho: Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Finance. Throughout this week, we have heard more about the shocking truth of the state of Ontario’s finances after 15 years of Liberal government. The minister’s speech last Friday, the findings of the Financial Commission of Inquiry and the debate surrounding our government’s motion to strike a Select Committee on Financial Transparency all point to a very clear message: We need action. We need to fix this. The public is depending on us.

Could the minister please explain why the Select Committee on Financial Transparency is so important in restoring accountability and trust in government?

Hon. Victor Fedeli: Thank you to the member for Willowdale for the question. The importance of the select committee cannot be understated. We are not just dealing with billions of dollars of wasteful spending. The Liberals were known for making promises that they couldn’t afford to keep, that taxpayers couldn’t afford to keep.

What we’re really dealing with is a system of accounting schemes that kept this spending off the government’s books. Rather than being up front with the people of Ontario about the real cost of their disastrous policy decisions, the previous Liberal government buried the debt so the public could not see its true extent.

That is why the select committee is so very important. The people of Ontario were not told the truth and they deserve answers.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary?

Mr. Stan Cho: Thank you, Minister. It’s truly worrying to hear what the Liberals got away with for so long, but I am very relieved to hear that the Select Committee on Financial Transparency will get those answers.

Our government campaigned on a commitment to restore accountability and trust, and now we fully understand why it is so important for us to keep that promise. The public’s confidence has been shaken. They deserve to know where and why their money has been wasted.

Could the minister please explain what steps the Select Committee on Financial Transparency will be able to take in order to ensure that accountability and trust can be restored?

Hon. Victor Fedeli: What the select committee will do is clear: They will find the answers. They will find out how the previous Liberal government made up its own accounting rules. They will find out how billions of dollars in deficits were buried in convoluted accounting schemes. They will find out how the Liberals ignored the warnings of the Auditor General, even after she called them out on their—and I’m quoting, Speaker—“bogus accounting.”

Most importantly, the select committee will discover who ordered this massive scheme and will hold those responsible accountable. They will call witnesses, compel documents and gather evidence. Speaker, they will get answers because the people of Ontario deserve an explanation.

Anti-racism activities

Ms. Marit Stiles: My question is to the Minister of Education. So far this week, the Premier has been given five separate opportunities in this very House to denounce the neo-Nazi-supporting Toronto mayoral candidate Faith Goldy after appearing in a photo with her and her supporters. He has refused each and every opportunity to do so.

I ask the Minister of Education, since you’re responsible for providing guidance to over 100,000 educators and setting the policies that impact over two million school-age children in this province, will you denounce Faith Goldy and her divisive campaign, or are you going to stick by the Premier in his refusal to do so?

Hon. Lisa M. Thompson: I’ll tell the member opposite exactly what I denounce: I denounce political games.

While I’m standing here in this House, though, I am pleased to share with you that the Premier, time and time again, has spoken about the importance of getting our students on the path to success. That’s why we’re focusing on math scores. We’re focusing on the EQAO to make sure that it’s delivered and facilitated properly. That’s why we’re standing up and making sure that our students are prepared for the jobs of the 21st century.

Our consultation will be inviting parents, families and people who want to exercise their voice across this province to have an opportunity to let us know what matters in terms of getting our students onto the path of success. Mr. Speaker, I can’t wait for the consultations to start, and we look forward to speaking about it more in the future.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary.

Ms. Marit Stiles: There are many issues that the Minister of Education and I might disagree on. I thought perhaps not this one; surely, not this one. This should be pretty easy. The Minister of Education represents all of the students in our province. To not speak out against this kind of hate and show that kind of leadership is deeply disturbing.

If the Premier or the Minister of Education won’t denounce Faith Goldy and her extreme racist views, surely she will denounce the man to the immediate left of the Premier in the same photo connected to the Goldy campaign who, after the photo was taken, tweeted—and I quote, very unfortunately—“Muslims go to hell.”

Will the minister denounce Faith Goldy’s intolerant views and apologize—on behalf of the Premier, if she must—to Ontarians for the Premier’s appearance in a photo with a known neo-Nazi sympathizer?

Hon. Lisa M. Thompson: Again, I absolutely denounce political games just for the hope of getting attention.

The fact of the matter is, we are embarking on a consultation that is placing every individual in Ontario on an equal basis—every individual, every parent, every student, every teacher. Every single individual who wants to exercise their voice in an equal manner has an opportunity to participate in our consultation that’s coming up and to help create a path to success for our students in the 21st century.

Again, Speaker, as I said before, I can’t wait for this consultation to start. We are treating people on an equal basis and we will be facilitating it in a manner that it doesn’t matter where you are in Ontario, you have a chance to contribute. We’re going to have written submissions, we’re going to have online consultations and, again, telephone town halls—

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Thank you. Next question.

Curriculum

Ms. Kathleen O. Wynne: Mr. Speaker, my question actually follows up in terms of a question that is dealing with the issue of racism, and my question is for the Premier.

As we all know in this House and beyond, the history of Ontario and Canada has been told for generations without acknowledgement of or focus on the accurate relationship between Indigenous and non-Indigenous peoples.

The fastest-growing segment of youth population in Ontario is Indigenous youth. These are young people, many—if not all—of whom have been affected by the trauma of the residential school experience forced on their parents and grandparents. We owe it to them and to all non-Indigenous students to make sure that we tell the truth about our history so that another generation does not grow up in ignorance of the travesties of the past.

Given that the curriculum writing on social studies, history, geography, careers and civics that was under way was stopped as soon as this government took office, can the Premier assure the nearly two million students in Ontario that their history and social studies courses will reflect the truth about our history?

Hon. Doug Ford: Minister of Education.

Hon. Lisa M. Thompson: I’m pleased to stand today and address the issue. We are going to be doing everything we can to ensure, as I mentioned earlier in this House, that our students are on the best path to success in terms of the skills they need for the jobs of the 21st century. That includes science, that includes technology, that includes engineering and that includes mathematics. We heard loud and clear during this last provincial campaign that parents are worried about their students with regard to math scores, so we’re respecting parents.

Again, we are encouraging every single member in this House to engage in the consultation that we will be kicking off, because there’s going to be an opportunity to exercise and validate what’s working in the classrooms and what’s not. That’s the important part right there: We have an opportunity to have everyone participate in a consultation so that we can get rid of what’s not working and make sure our—

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Thank you very much. Supplementary.

Ms. Kathleen O. Wynne: I have to say that a consultation on smart boards is cold comfort to a generation of kids who need to understand the truth of the past so that they can create a different future.

Back to the Premier: On a related issue, it has been a practice annually for the Premier to meet with Indigenous leaders—chiefs of First Nations, the Métis Nation of Ontario leadership, the Ontario Federation of Indigenous Friendship Centres’ leadership, the Ontario Native Women’s Association—to meet with each group separately to talk about issues like education, like health care, like economic development, like self-government, in Indigenous communities and in our urban centres. These are critical meetings that help to set and advance an agenda and progress in those communities.

My question is: Have those meetings already taken place or have they been scheduled, and when will they take place?

Hon. Lisa M. Thompson: Back to the member opposite: I want to assure her that we are engaging in the right avenues. Just yesterday, Chief RoseAnne had an interview that aired with Steve Paikin. On air, she said that we are in conversation, we are taking steps forward and we’re working forward in the sense of identifying what needs to be addressed in our curriculum. There’s no better way to do it. Chief RoseAnne was on Steve Paikin yesterday, stating the fact that we are in conversation and we are going to be working together.

Energy policies

Mr. Randy Pettapiece: My question is to the Minister of Energy. We all know in this House that the Liberal government left us in an incredible mess. They left a $15-billion deficit that was driven by a lack of respect for taxpayers’ dollars. Much of the debt was created through bad decisions and bad energy contracts.

Speaker, can the minister please explain why the Green Energy Act was the wrong decision for the province of Ontario?

Hon. Greg Rickford: I want to thank the member for Perth–Wellington for this question.

I like to generate my own talking points on these important matters, but I can’t beat this one. Here’s Rex Murphy again. He stated that the Green Energy Act “was a hydra-headed monster of regulations and fiat that bludgeoned Ontario’s rural communities, stripped Ontario’s municipalities of every right to the slightest participation in their own planning, placed a darkling pall over the manufacturing industry, and imposed the highest electricity costs in all North America on some of Ontario’s lowest-income citizens.”

The Green Energy Act, the 750 green energy projects—that helps explain. It takes us a long way down the road why we’re in a $15-billion sinkhole. We’re going to stand up for families, for small businesses and large employers, cut hydro rates and make life more affordable for this province.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary.

Mr. Randy Pettapiece: Here’s a Minister of Energy who is showing great leadership on this important file. Lowering hydro costs for the people is one of our government’s most important promises. I am proud that our government is taking steps towards this goal.

Mr. Speaker, can the minister tell the members of this House why repealing the Green Energy Act is good for the people of Ontario and good for the economy of Ontario?

Hon. Greg Rickford: Repealing the Green Energy Act is just one important step in a series that we’ve made in an effort to cut hydro bills by 12%, driving efficiencies within Ontario’s energy sector, sending a strong message that families, small businesses and large employers have some relief in paying their bills so that we can hire more people, so that families don’t make choices between heating and eating or if they can enrol their children in a sports program.

This caused families to struggle. It is, without question, one of the biggest transfers of wealth in the history of this province. That act needed to be repealed. We’re repealing that act. That’s a promise made, colleagues, and that’s a promise kept.

Injured workers

Mr. Wayne Gates: My question is to the Minister of Labour. The announcement this morning of a 30% reduction in employer workers’ safety and insurance premiums due to the elimination of the unfunded liability is a kick in the teeth for workers of this province. This dramatic cut for injured workers is dragging Ontario backwards, not moving them forward.

Will the minister of employers—I mean, labour—explain to injured workers if they should be bracing for cuts or clawbacks of their benefits?

Hon. Laurie Scott: Thank you to the member opposite for the question.

Through you, Mr. Speaker, today’s announcement that WSIB has eliminated its unfunded liability means workers can be confident that benefits will be there in the future. This is good news for the province of Ontario.

Today’s rate reduction of nearly 30% for businesses across the province is a $1.45-billion injection into the economy. This is just one more example that Ontario is finally open for business. We can create good jobs for the people of Ontario.

Mr. Speaker, this has been a good-news announcement today, not only for businesses but for injured workers.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary.

Mr. Wayne Gates: Mr. Speaker, back to the minister: The undfunded liability was actually funded on the backs of injured workers. Under 15 years of a Liberal government, injured workers’ claims were increasingly denied, putting money back into the pockets of their bosses—not for workers.

These injured workers face barriers to having their claims accepted, resulting in billions in savings already for big employers.

Will this minister direct WSIB to undertake a massive reversal of how it assesses claims now that the unfunded liability is, with a sleight of hand, poof, magically gone? Or is this about making the Premier’s big business friends happy, not workers?

Hon. Laurie Scott: Mr. Speaker, through you to the member: Businesses did participate in bringing down the unfunded liability. They had increased premiums. The best thing that we could do was to get the unfunded liability gone, and we did. That helps injured workers, because if the unthinkable happens and an injury occurs at work, they need to be secure that there are services there for them. So this helps the future security of injured workers, but it also acknowledges that businesses have contributed greatly, and they have an average 30% rate reduction.

I don’t really know why the member opposite is upset. This is a good-news story for the province of Ontario. It’s not only open for business, but it’s protecting injured workers.

Energy policies

Mr. Sam Oosterhoff: My question is for the Minister of Energy, Northern Development and Mines.

Mr. Speaker, in my beautiful riding of Niagara West, numerous wind turbines scar the landscape. It angers the members of my community because they know that these turbines produce energy we simply don’t need. So I was excited when, last week, our government announced the repeal of the 2009 Green Energy Act.

I’m proud to be part of a government—

Applause.

Mr. Sam Oosterhoff: Yes, that is worth clapping for.

I’m proud to be part of a government that is taking real action to stop wasteful policy decisions.

Can the minister please explain how repealing the Green Energy Act will protect my constituents in Niagara West from more needless energy projects?

Hon. Greg Rickford: Once again, I want to thank the member from Niagara West for his question, and many of our caucus members who heard the same thing all over this province.

We wonder sometimes what would have happened if industrial wind turbines had been planned or proposed for the Danforth. Instead, they were put out to municipalities in other regions of the province. They cost us a lot of money. They were projects we didn’t need and projects that we didn’t want.

The Green Energy Act took power away from the municipalities and gave it firmly to the Liberal government of that time. Their ideological crusade forced projects into communities who didn’t want them. They ignored these people and their communities.

The energy sector, special interest groups and friends of the Liberals got rich from these bad contracts, and families got poor because of high bills. That’s why we’re repealing this act, Mr. Speaker. Promise made—

Interjections: Promise kept.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary.

Mr. Sam Oosterhoff: Thank you, Minister Rickford, for helping our government put the people of Ontario first.

Mr. Speaker, our promise to give power back to the people of Ontario is one of the key reasons our government was elected on June 7. We also promised Ontarians that we would make responsible policy decisions that will make a real difference in the lives of people. Repealing the Green Energy Act signals the end of irresponsible policy decisions over the past 15 years. Could the minister please tell the members of this House why repealing the Green Energy Act is a step towards better energy policy in Ontario?

Hon. Greg Rickford: In the time leading up to June 7, we heard loud and clear that the people of Ontario had no appetite for projects that they didn’t want or need, high taxes, big government, the largest carbon tax in the world. They got election indigestion when the opposition suggested perpetuating the Liberals’ tax-and-spend buffet. The bill turned out to be $5 billion more than it was intended; now we know it was $15 billion. Quickly, the opposition became the “non-digestible party.”

People of Ontario wanted the government to slim down, cut the fat. They placed their order with this government. They asked for a fair slice of our plan for prosperity, and that’s exactly what we’re delivering.

Child care

Ms. Doly Begum: My question is to the Minister of Education. Speaker, parents across Ontario need affordable, high-quality, public, not-for-profit child care. Public dollars should go into care for our kids, not private profit for multinational companies. But the Premier seems more interested in helping corporate child care shareholders than parents or children.

I want to share a message from a resident of Ontario with the minister. Lynn is a grandmother from Kenora. She said, “We need more reliable and affordable community child care in Kenora, not money going to foreign-owned corporations.”

What does the minister have to say to grandmas like Lynn?

Hon. Lisa M. Thompson: What I’d like to share with people from all over Ontario is that we’re looking to respect parents. Parents deserve to have choice. Parents deserve to have daycare, early-on years, in their own backyard. That’s what this government has pledged to do. We had a mandate to respect parents in this past election. Being elected with an overwhelming majority, we have heard the people loud and clear from this province.

Again, I don’t know what this party opposite has against choice and against expansion and easy access to daycare. That’s what this government is standing up for and that’s what we’re going to be fulfilling. It’s going to be a promise made, and it’s going to be a—

Interjections: Promise kept.

Hon. Lisa M. Thompson: Promise kept. Exactly.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary.

Ms. Doly Begum: You know, I really wish the minister would get out of her talking points and say something real.

Last week, the minister tried to pit parents against each other, suggesting anyone concerned about the privatization of child care just needed to get “out of the bubble of Toronto.” Maybe the minister should get out of the bubble of Toronto.

Laurie is a parent in Thunder Bay who said, “Non-profit child care provides support and education for lots of families in our area and we need more of it.” She also said, “Giving money to big corporations isn’t going to help parents in Thunder Bay,” while educators in Peterborough, for example, worry that rural areas will simply be left without child care if the Premier turns child care over to the private sector.

Can the minister explain to parents in rural communities, in big cities and everywhere in between why she thinks giving money to big corporations is more important than safe, high-quality, not-for-profit child care?

Hon. Lisa M. Thompson: To the member opposite, I drive in and out of a bubble every week, twice a week. With that said, I am very well connected not only within urban centres across this province but throughout rural Ontario as well, and I can tell you that parents that do not have cars and do not have a way to go 20 kilometres out of their way to turn around and get back to work 20 kilometres in the opposite direction need choice.

Our government is standing up to expand the spaces that the member opposite has questioned. What’s wrong with expanding spaces? What’s wrong with choice? What’s wrong with respecting parents? I’m telling you, this New Democratic propaganda really has to stop because they’re losing credibility, day in and day out, with this type of questioning. Again, our government is standing up—

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Thank you. New question.

Climate change

Mr. Sheref Sabawy: My question is to the Minister of the Environment, Conservation and Parks. The effects of climate change are undeniable and costly. That’s why this government stands firm to lead with a climate change plan. Ontarians know that this side of the House is committed to developing a made-in-Ontario plan, one that does not include a regressive program like the cap-and-trade carbon tax that made life harder for everyday Ontarians.

Mr. Speaker, when we were elected, it was with a mandate from the people of Ontario, a mandate to get rid of the cap-and-trade program. With that, we are fulfilling our mandate while leading with an effective strategy to fight climate change. Can the minister update us on the government’s plan to combat climate change?

Hon. Rod Phillips: Thank you to the member from Mississauga–Erin Mills. Mr. Speaker, through you to the member: A serious, man-made global problem, climate change is something that presents significant challenges to our air, to our land, to our water, to locally grown food, to our infrastructure. Ontario has an important role to play in fighting climate change, but we also know that families are stretched thin and can’t afford to pay more for expensive programs that don’t deliver results.

That’s why we’re committed to delivering a made-in-Ontario solution—a solution that protects our environment responsibly but also protects our economy so that it can create the opportunities we want for all of our citizens. Mr. Speaker, that plan will strike the right balance between a healthy economy and a healthy environment.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary?

Mr. Sheref Sabawy: I thank the minister for his response. Still to him: As the engine driving the Canadian economy, Ontario has an important role in fighting climate change and mitigating the threat it represents to our prosperity and way of life. We have made significant progress. It was actually a Progressive Conservative government that initially took action with the environment, and now this government is creating a strategy that encompasses the environmental and economic impacts associated with climate change and our collective need to take action.

Today, Ontario is in the enviable position of having one of the most effective electricity grid systems and best natural gas conservation programs in North America. However, that progress cannot come at the expense of families’ prosperity and overburdened taxpayers. Can the minister explain how he plans to balance the needs of Ontario families with that of the government?

Hon. Rod Phillips: Mr. Speaker, through you to the member: The member is correct. We do have one of the greenest electricity grids. This is as a result of the concerted efforts of individuals and communities across this province. Greenhouse gas emissions have dropped by 22% since 2005. I point out that Canada has seen its emissions rise 3% overall.

While Canada’s emissions have declined by just 1.5% since 2000, Ontario’s emissions have dropped by 20%. In fact, Ontario is well on its way to meeting the Paris 2020 targets for Ontario that relate to Ontario’s share. So, Mr. Speaker, Ontario has done a lot. But we will continue to do more.

Climate change calls on us to do two things. It calls on us to build resilience against the effects of climate change, the effects we are seeing today and tomorrow. It also calls on us to curb greenhouse gases. Our plan will do both of those things. We can protect the environment and protect the economy.

Child protection

Miss Monique Taylor: My question is to the Acting Premier. Yesterday, the coroner released the report of the expert panel on the deaths of 12 children and youth in residential placements. All were in the care of a children’s aid society or an Indigenous child well-being society. Eight of those 12 young people were Indigenous. All 12 struggled with mental health challenges. Despite their complexity and high risk, the panel found that intervention was minimal. They were let down in so many ways.

The time for talk is over. Action is necessary now. What specific resources will your minister provide to ensure children in care are put first and get the support that they and their families need?

Hon. Christine Elliott: I thank the member very much for the question. The deaths of these children are indeed a tragedy. Children and youth in the care of children’s aid societies are among the most vulnerable people in our province. We need to take special care to make sure that they are protected.

The Minister of Children, Community and Social Services and the Office of the Chief Coroner have a joint directive that is followed by services when a child dies who was receiving services from a society at the time of death, or who had received services in the previous 12 months. I know that the minister and the Office of the Chief Coroner follow that mandated process to help understand what happened and to identify opportunities where further deaths may be prevented.

We want to make sure that we work with service providers to make sure that all serious occurrences are reported, first of all, in a timely manner, and that corrective actions are taken as appropriate.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary.

Miss Monique Taylor: Sadly, we’ve heard many of the report’s findings before. The panel was struck by the lack of focus on family preservation and early intervention. Young people had minimal opportunity to have a voice in their own care. Many were placed far away from their home communities—a lack of inspection of residential facilities and inadequate training of staff.

Speaker, the Provincial Advocate for Children and Youth has called on this government to deliver an action plan within 100 days that will fundamentally change the way in which the province protects children and supports families. Will the Deputy Premier make that commitment today?

Hon. Christine Elliott: While the minister and the Chief Coroner are following the mandated process that they need to follow, based on the directive, it is certainly something that both the minister, the Minister of Indigenous Affairs and I, as Minister of Health, are taking a look at. We know that there is action that needs to be taken. We want to make sure that these children are protected, and so I can tell you that this is taken very seriously by our government.

We are going to be looking at the circumstances, as you have mentioned them. There are a number of circumstances that—you’re quite right—are issues that we need to take a look at. We will be doing that because we want to make sure that all children in the care of children’s aid societies are protected, but certainly in this case, the Indigenous youth need to be particularly protected because of the other issues that you have mentioned. I thank you for the question.

Assistance to farmers

Ms. Jill Dunlop: My question is for the Minister of Agriculture, Food and Rural Affairs. Farmers from my riding are struggling as they experience unpredictable losses in livestock due to predator damage. They are looking for assistance and fair compensation for losses outside of their control.

The Ontario Wildlife Damage Compensation Program is designed specifically to assist livestock farmers with economic losses due to conflicts with wildlife. However, farmers are feeling frustrated with the current Ontario Wildlife Damage Compensation Program due to changes made by the previous government. The previous Liberal government made it more difficult for farmers to submit legitimate claims to assist them with unnecessary regulations and pricing that did not reflect market value.

Mr. Speaker, what is the minister going to do to reduce regulatory burdens and red tape for livestock farmers and demonstrate that Ontario is open for business again?

Hon. Ernie Hardeman: I thank the member for the great question. Our government for the people is taking immediate action to ensure that the Ontario Wildlife Damage Compensation Program works as it was intended: to support farmers who experience losses due to predator damage.

I heard concerns from our farmers and stakeholders regarding red tape and regulatory burdens surrounding the current program, and we have taken action on this. This is why, effective September 4, 2018, we have made two changes to the program:

(1) The farm business registration number requirement has been updated to allow applicants to apply to the program using a valid registration number that is a current number, or the number from the previous year if they don’t have a current registration number.

(2) The standardized pricing method has been updated to include separate pricing for steers and heifers.

These two updates both provide clarity on pricing and reduce red tape and regulatory burdens on legitimate claims for compensation losses due to previous technicalities and unnecessary paperwork.

This government listened to the people and is committed to making—

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Thank you. Supplementary?

Ms. Jill Dunlop: Thank you, Minister, for standing up for farmers in Simcoe North and across Ontario.

Back to the minister: It is great to hear that the minister has taken immediate action towards helping livestock farmers with the two most recent changes to the Ontario Wildlife Damage Compensation Program. I know farmers across Ontario will be pleased to hear that the government is listening to and working for them.

Mr. Speaker, through you to the minister: How is the minister going to continue to engage stakeholders and the agriculture industry on improving the program in the future?

Hon. Ernie Hardeman: Thank you again, Mr. Speaker, and to the member. This is only the first step of many to ensure our programs work for the people and for our farmers. We are committed to addressing the concerns of our farmers and stakeholders so that programs continue to work as they are intended, or to make effective changes to ensure they work in the future going forward.

We will continue to seek input from our stakeholders on:

—introducing more ways to prove predator damage has occurred;

—ensuring municipal investigators are properly trained to address the predation;

—creating a separate appeals process that restores farmers’ confidence in the independence and transparency of the process; and

—refining more areas of the standardized pricing model to better reflect market prices.

I look forward to working with our organizations and shareholders to introduce more effective changes in the months to come.

Ontario is open for business, and I look forward to making life more affordable for our farmers so they can continue to provide the best quality food—

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Thank you very much. Next question.

Horse racing industry

Mr. Percy Hatfield: I think we’re on the Uncle Ernie hit parade today, because my question is also to the Minister of Agriculture, Food and Rural Affairs. Good morning, Minister.

Speaker, Ontario’s horse racing community is struggling. The Slots at Racetracks Program provided good jobs, as well as a heck of a lot of revenue for the taxpayers of Ontario. The Premier and some of his ministers promised during the summer election to get our tracks healthy again.

Speaker, will the minister give us a time frame today of when the government will live up to its election promises and reinstate the Slots at Racetracks Program?

Hon. Ernie Hardeman: I refer the question to the Minister of Finance.

Hon. Victor Fedeli: Sorry, you don’t get the Minister of Agriculture today. You’re stuck with me, member.

What we do know is that for 15 years the industry was neglected by the previous Liberal government and propped up by the NDP. Our government is committed to working with industry stakeholders and OLG to explore solutions for the issue you brought up.

Our government understands the importance of the horse racing industry all across Ontario. We support this important industry, which creates jobs that stimulate local economies. We look forward to working with representatives of the horse racing industry.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Supplementary?

Mr. Percy Hatfield: Speaker, 30,000 jobs were lost when the Liberals killed the Slots at Racetracks Program. My track in Windsor went out of business and was torn down. We lost more than 2,000 good-paying jobs in my area. The summer track in Leamington needs more race dates and an off-track betting facility. Other tracks, such as Fort Erie, are struggling to survive.

Promises have been made, Speaker. If this government is indeed for the people and open for business, when will horse people at our smaller tracks get what is owed to them?

Hon. Victor Fedeli: Thank you for the supplementary. Let’s all remember the devastation to the horse racing industry that you’re speaking about. It was the official opposition who helped pass the previous government’s 2012 budget with policies aimed at killing the horse racing industry in Ontario, so there’s a mirror that you should be looking in for that.

I’m proud to say, first of all, that members on this side of this House voted against that and actually stood up for the horse racing industry. Our government understands the importance of the horse racing industry, particularly in rural communities.

I look forward to continuing to meet with representatives of the horse racing industry, the Minister of Agriculture, Food and Rural Affairs and with OLG to help the horse racing sector grow and prosper in Ontario.

Notice of dissatisfaction

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Pursuant to standing order 38(a), the member for Kitchener Centre has given notice of her dissatisfaction with the answer to her question given by the Minister of Community Safety and Correctional Services concerning denouncing Faith Goldy. This matter will be debated today at 6 p.m.

Mr. Bill Walker: Point of order.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Point of order: the member for Bruce–Grey–Owen Sound.

Mr. Bill Walker: I’d just like to remind everyone in the House that there’s a photo on the staircase today at 12 noon for Rowan’s Law.

Visitor

Mrs. Jennifer (Jennie) Stevens: Point of order.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): Another point of order: the member for St. Catharines.

Mrs. Jennifer (Jennie) Stevens: I would like to welcome a constituent from my riding today: Willy Noiles. Willy is the president of the Ontario Network of Injured Workers and has been a long-time activist fighting for working people in St. Catharines. Welcome to the Legislature, Willy.

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): There being no deferred votes, this House stands in recess until 2 p.m. this afternoon.

The House recessed from 1137 to 1400.

Introduction of Visitors

The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott): As members are aware, the Legislative Assembly of Ontario has a long tradition of interparliamentary relations with other jurisdictions around the world.

Today in the Speaker’s gallery, it’s my pleasure to introduce a delegation of American legislators and officials representing the Council of State Governments, a forum that fosters the development of interparliamentary co-operation and provides participants with the opportunity to network with colleagues to share ideas on issues of common concern.

Please join me in warmly welcoming our guests to the Ontario Legislature.

Applause.

Mr. Mike Schreiner: I would like to welcome to Queen’s Park a lawyer I’ve worked with for many years on many issues, David Donnelly, as well as two of his articling students, Alexandra Whyte and Sara Gray, to Queen’s Park.

Members’ Statements

Anti-racism activities

Ms. Jill Andrew: Good afternoon, Mr. Speaker. Yesterday, I had a late show encouraging government to state clearly that they do not support Faith Goldy. They refused. Instead, the Ford government provided a canned speech denouncing hate, with just enough of the MPP from King–Vaughan’s familial immigrant story to deflect from the topic at hand.

Today, we asked the Minister of Education and the Minister of Community Safety and Correctional Services, two who are directly responsible for our most vulnerable Ontarians, to denounce Faith Goldy by name. They didn’t.

Very recently, however, our Premier has mentioned her name in a sentence. I personally say thank you. That is a good step. Now it’s time for the government to go a step further and state that they do not support her using our Premier’s name or likeness in any of her campaign communications. My residents, like Lyba Spring, Jeff Farrell and others, are receiving Faith’s robocalls which mention our Premier’s name.

Faith Goldy believes in bringing back TAVIS, carding and the school resource program. We need our Minister of Education and our Minister of Community Safety and Correctional Services to stop these sorts of actions before they even begin. It’s bad enough that the Minister of Labour’s senior policy adviser is allegedly married to Faith Goldy’s sister, who is a key player on her political campaign.

On behalf of the people in my riding, I say: Let’s disassociate our Premier completely from Faith Goldy.

Canadian Police Memorial Ride to Remember

Mr. Prabmeet Singh Sarkaria: I would like to take this opportunity today to talk about a great event that happens every year in Ontario. Today at 8 a.m. the 18th Canadian police and peace officers’ memorial ride began from the police college. Over the last 17 years, police and peace officers from around Ontario have participated in a 750-kilometre bike ride in honour of police and peace officers who have made the ultimate sacrifice.

Under the leadership of members of the Niagara regional police and with the support of the Ontario Provincial Police, Peel Regional Police, Ottawa Police Service, Toronto Police Service, Royal Canadian Mounted Police, Durham regional police, Hamilton Police Service, Kingston Police service, Waterloo Regional Police and York Regional Police, the Canadian Police Memorial Ride to Remember has grown to include 170 police and peace officer cyclists from 15 different law enforcement agencies.

This ride is also important because it gives us a unique opportunity of community engagement with the public and enhances the legitimacy of policing with the public.

Recently, the Attorney General also had a great opportunity to show her support for this at a recent barbecue held by York Regional Police.

Thanks to the generous support of Canadian Tire, Motorola Solutions and Bulk Barn Foods Ltd., over $25,000 will be donated to support the Canadian Police and Peace Officer’s Memorial fund.

Hotel Dieu Shaver Health and Rehabilitation Centre

Mr. Jeff Burch: I recently met with staff from the Hotel Dieu Shaver, a health and rehabilitation centre in my riding. Since 2007, they’ve been fighting for a planning grant to expand the facility with 65 additional beds. The Shaver works collaboratively with the Niagara Health System to optimize patient flow in order to alleviate pressure on the system, keeping patients out of long-term care. Rehabilitation services optimize a patient’s ability to live independently at home and reduce the length of stays in our hospitals.

Mr. Speaker, my father was a victim of hallway medicine. After suffering from a stroke, he was transferred to the wrong hospital and experienced inadequate care. His condition only began to improve once he was admitted to the Shaver. My father’s case is not an outlier; this is the experience of countless people across Niagara. The Shaver is the only rehab hospital in the region, despite having the third-largest aging population in Canada, and we must be prepared to meet their needs.

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