Manitoba Hansard — Sitting 74B (40th Legislature, 4th Session)

40-4-74b

Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)

Fourth Session - Fortieth Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable Daryl Reid Speaker Vol. LXVII No. 74B - 1:30 p.m., Thursday, October 29, 2015 ISSN 0542-5492

MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Fortieth Legislature Member Constituency Political Affiliation ALLAN, Nancy St. Vital NDP ALLUM, James, Hon. Fort Garry-Riverview NDP ALTEMEYER, Rob Wolseley NDP ASHTON, Steve, Hon. Thompson NDP BLADY, Sharon, Hon. Kirkfield Park NDP BRAUN, Erna, Hon. Rossmere NDP BRIESE, Stuart Agassiz PC CALDWELL, Drew, Hon. Brandon East NDP CHIEF, Kevin, Hon. Point Douglas NDP CHOMIAK, Dave, Hon. Kildonan NDP CROTHERS, Deanne, Hon. St. James NDP CULLEN, Cliff Spruce Woods PC DEWAR, Greg, Hon.

Selkirk NDP DRIEDGER, Myrna Charleswood PC EICHLER, Ralph Lakeside PC EWASKO, Wayne Lac du Bonnet PC FRIESEN, Cameron Morden-Winkler PC GAUDREAU, Dave St. Norbert NDP GERRARD, Jon, Hon. River Heights Liberal GOERTZEN, Kelvin Steinbach PC GRAYDON, Cliff Emerson PC HELWER, Reg Brandon West PC HOWARD, Jennifer Fort Rouge NDP IRVIN-ROSS, Kerri, Hon. Fort Richmond NDP JHA, Bidhu Radisson NDP KOSTYSHYN, Ron, Hon. Swan River NDP LATHLIN, Amanda The Pas NDP LEMIEUX, Ron, Hon. Dawson Trail NDP MACKINTOSH, Gord, Hon. St. Johns NDP MALOWAY, Jim Elmwood NDP MARCELINO, Flor, Hon.

Logan NDP MARCELINO, Ted Tyndall Park NDP MARTIN, Shannon Morris PC MELNICK, Christine Riel NDP MITCHELSON, Bonnie River East PC NEVAKSHONOFF, Thomas, Hon. Interlake NDP OSWALD, Theresa Seine River NDP PALLISTER, Brian Fort Whyte PC PEDERSEN, Blaine Midland PC PETTERSEN, Clarence Flin Flon NDP PIWNIUK, Doyle Arthur-Virden PC REID, Daryl, Hon. Transcona NDP ROBINSON, Eric, Hon. Kewatinook NDP RONDEAU, Jim Assiniboia NDP ROWAT, Leanne Riding Mountain PC SARAN, Mohinder, Hon. The Maples NDP SCHULER, Ron St. Paul PC SELINGER, Greg, Hon. St.

Boniface NDP SMOOK, Dennis La Verendrye PC STEFANSON, Heather Tuxedo PC STRUTHERS, Stan Dauphin NDP SWAN, Andrew Minto NDP WIEBE, Matt Concordia NDP WIGHT, Melanie, Hon. Burrows NDP WISHART, Ian Portage la Prairie PC Vacant Gimli – Vacant Southdale –

2679 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Thursday, October 29, 2015 The House met at 1:30 p.m. Mr. Speaker: Good afternoon, everyone . Please be seated. ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS Mr. Speaker: Introduction of bills? COMMITTEE REPORTS Mr. Speaker: Seeing no bills, we'll move on to committee reports. Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development Eighth Report Mr. Dave Gaudreau (Chairperson): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the Eighth Report of the Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development. Clerk (Ms. Patricia Chaychuk): Your Standing Committee on Social and Economic– Some Honourable Members: Dispense. Mr.

Speaker: Dispense? Dispense. Your Standing Committee on SOCIAL AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT p resents the following as its Eighth Report. Meetings Your Committee met on the following occasions in the Legislative Building: • September 14, 2015 • October 28, 2015 Matters under Consideration • Bill (No. 19) – The Legal Profession Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la profession d'avocat • Bill (No. 27) – The Veterinary Medical Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la médecine vétérinaire • Bill (No. 37) – The Radiation Protection Act/Loi sur la radioprotection • Bill (No. 38) – The Intimate Image Protection Act/Loi sur la protection des images intimes • Bill (No. 41) – The Statutes Correction and Minor Amendments Act, 2015/Loi corrective de 2015 • Bill (No. 45) – The Elections Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la Loi électorale Committee Membership Committee Membership for the September 14, 2015 meeting: • Hon. Mr. CHOMIAK • Mr. EWASKO • Mr. GOERTZEN • Mr. HELWER • Mr. JHA • Hon. Mr. LEMIEUX • Hon. Mr. MACKINTOSH • Ms. OSWALD (Vice-Chairperson) • Mr. PEDERSEN • Mr.

STRUTHERS • Mr. SWAN Your Committee elected Mr. JHA as the Chairperson at the September 14, 2015 meeting Committee Membership for the October 28, 2015 meeting: • Hon. Ms. BLADY • Hon. Mr. CHOMIAK • Mr. GOERTZEN • Mr. GAUDREAU • Mr. HELWER • Hon. Mr. KOSTYSHYN • Hon. Mr. LEMIEUX • Hon. Mr. MACKINTOSH • Mr. MARCELINO • Mr. PIWNIUK • Mr. SCHULER Your Committee elected Mr. GAUDREAU as the Chairperson at the October 28, 2015 meeting Your Committee elected Mr.

MARCELINO as the Vice-Chairperson at the October 28, 2015 meeting Public Presentations Your Committee heard the followin g two presentations on Bill (No. 19) – The Legal

2680 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 Profession Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la profession d'avocat: September 14, 2015 meeting David Grant, Private Citizen October 28, 2015 meeting Kris Dangerfield, Law Society of Manitoba Your Committee heard the following seven presentations on Bill (No. 27) – The Veterinary Medical Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la médecine vétérinaire: Doraine Washniak, Private Citizen Dr. Roxane Neufeld, Manitoba Veterinary Medical Association Cindy Sontag, Manitoba Animal Health Technologist Association Melanie Browning, Private Citizen Trish Lobaton, Registered Veterinary Technologists and Technicians of Canada Dr. Suzanne Davidson, Private Citizen Dr. Michael Sheridan, Private Citizen Written Submissions Your Committee received the following written submission on Bill (No. 27) – The Veterinary Medical Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la médecine vétérinaire: Dr. James A. Broughton, Private Citizen Bills Considered and Reported • Bill (No. 19) – The Legal Profession Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la profession d'avocat Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 27) – The Veterinary Medical Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la médecine vétérinaire Your Committee agreed to report this Bill on a recorded vote of yeas, 6 nays 4, with the following amendment: THAT Clause 42(2) of the Bill be amended (

a) in the

section heading, by striking out "February 1, 2016" and substituting "section 7"; and (

b) in the section, by striking out "on February 1, 2016" and substituting "six months after the day this Act receives royal assent". • Bill (No. 37) – The Radiation Protection Act/Loi sur la radioprotection Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 38) – The Intimate Image Protection Act/Loi sur la protection des images intimes Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 41) – The Statutes Correction and Minor Amendments Act, 2015/Loi corrective de 2015 Your Commi ttee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 45) – The Elections Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la Loi électorale Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment.

Mr. Gaudreau : Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable member for Tyndall Park (Mr. Marcelino), that the report of the committee be received. Motion agreed to. Mr. Speaker: Any further committee reports? TABLING OF REPORTS Mr. Speaker: Seeing none, we'll move on to tabling of reports. Hon. Kerri Irvin-Ross (Minister responsible for the Civil Service): Mr. Speaker, it is my privilege to table the Public Service Group Insurance Fund for the year-end of April 30th, 2015. Mr. Speaker: Any further tabling of reports? Ms. Irvin -Ross: Mr.

Speaker, it's my pleasur e to table the Actuarial Valuation Report as of December 31st, 2014, for the Civil Service Superannuation Fund. Mr. Speaker: Any further tabling of reports? Seeing none, ministerial statements? MEMBERS' STATEMENTS Trinity United–50th Anniversary Hon. Kerri Irvin-Ross (Minister of Family Services): Mr. Speaker, one of my favourite things about being the MLA for Fort Richmond is celebrating big milestones with my community. I

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2681 recently joined parishioners of Trinity United Church to celebrate the church's 50th anniversary, and it was very special. Today we have the church's 50th anniversary committee joining us in the gallery. In the 1950s, Fort Richmond was a small com - munity. A few United Church families would get together to teach their children bas ic Christian concepts in a small one -room school. As the community grew, the families decided to found the St. Norbert church on Pembina Highway.

Eventually, the name was changed to Trinity United to reflect the three areas served at the time: St. Norbert , Fort Richmond and Waverley Heights. Throughout location changes and building upgrades, the church retained a focus on educating young people, and their Sunday school is still going strong today. The church has done a wonderful job of staying current an d has a very accepting and progressive outlook, which continues to attract new parishioners. When speaking with people at the 50th anni - versary celebration, I was struck by how connected the church staff and worshippers felt to each other.

Trinity United is clearly more than a place of worship for families, but a source of support and kindness. Mr. Speaker, I'd like to congratulate Trinity United Church and thank them again for 50 years of service to the community. Affordable Housing Mrs. Bonnie Mitchel son (River East): Mr. Speaker, every Manitoban deserves a place to call home. At a time when an increasing number of Manitobans are feeling the stress of the lack of affordable housing, we see an NDP government with misplaced priorities. This government is providing $35.3 million to Investors Group Field due to this Premier's (Mr.

Selinger) fast -tracking of the completion of the stadium for his own political gain just prior to the last election. After massive cost overruns, just two years later the roof is leaking and the cement is crumbling. That $35.3 million could have been spent reducing the wait -lists for affordable housing, which has increased from 400 to 3,000 in the last 10 years under this government's watch. How many Manitobans could have bee n removed from the wait-list with a $35.3-million investment? Mr. Speaker, rental costs in Winnipeg have increased by 65 per cent since the NDP took office.

A two -bedroom apartment that once cost a family $600 a month is now $1,000 a month. The shortage of decent low -income rental housing is driving up rates. How many Manitobans struggling to afford to pay their rents could have been helped? Manitobans are paying the price for this government's failure to provide low-income housing, just like they are paying the price for the incompetence and mismanagement of this NDP government that led to the cost overruns in repairs that are needed at Inves tors Group Field. This NDP government waste and mismanagement is hurting those who need support the most. Thank you, Mr.

Speaker. Excellence in Aboriginal Business Leadership Awards Mr. Bidhu Jha (Radisson): Mr. Speaker, two weeks ago I attended the e xcellence in Aboriginal leadership awards on behalf of the Premier of Manitoba, and it was also joined by the Minister of Jobs and the Economy (Mr. Chief). The amazing gala recognizes the success of Aboriginal businesses while raising money for Aboriginal students in entering into the business world.

The awards ceremony was established in 2005, and since then they have raised over $150,000 for Aboriginal students and become one of the most prestigious events honouring Manitoba's Aboriginal business leaders. The event was hosted by the University of Manitoba Aboriginal Business Education Partners, a community of First Nations, Metis and Inuit students pursuing honours degrees in commerce. Their graduates have gone to work for major corporations, and they ha ve built businesses in Manitoba and around the world. Connie's Corner Cafe received the excellence in Aboriginal small and medium enterprise award.

This community-oriented restaurant at 967 Main St. has been serving delicious food and providing a stage of local musicians since 1997, always with the willingness to give back to their community. Thank you to the Aboriginal Business Education Partners and thank you to Dr. Michael Benarroch, dean of the University of Manitoba business school. Your outstanding commitment to business education at Asper school and, in particular, to Aboriginal

2682 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 education gives entrepreneurs the freedom to supply their need to be–and to succeed. To all the Aboriginal students pursuing com - merce: The windfall of your pursuit is a strong economy of Manitoba and Canada. The investments you make in your own education today will bring inestimable returns to your own community and to our country, Canada. Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. Health-Care Crisis Mr. Cliff Cullen (Spruce Woods): I wish to speak today on the crisis in health care in Manitoba.

Almost every Manitoban is impacted in some way or another with this crisis. Mr. Speaker, over 20 emergency rooms are closed, and the number is growing. Doctor and nurse shortages hav e resulted in shared on -call services between facilities. This creates confusion and dan- gerous situations for those seeking service. Additionally, this government has closed emergency medical stations, which means longer wait times for ambulance services. There are currently over 30 family practice doctor vacancies in the Prairie Mountain Health region alone.

Now local communities such as Killarney are asking ratepayers to fund headhunting companies to find doctors. In Killarney's case, this amounts to $300,000 of local taxpayers' money. This NDP government has failed to offer any long-term solutions or to even engage in a discussion with stakeholders. Instead, it is management by crisis. I recently received an unsigned letter from what appears to be a staff member at a–from a health-care facility in southwestern Manitoba.

The letter speaks of, and I quote, too much management pushing paperwork, residents left to die alone as staff are doing paperwork and staff exhausted by the system. Clearly, the ND P waste is threatening front -line services, and, Mr. Speaker, Manitobans are looking for a change for the better. Women's History Month Mr. Ted Marcelino (Tyndall Park): Women's History Month is about celebrating the often overlooked accomplishments of our mothers, grandmothers, leaders and friends. It's easiest to overlook historical accomplishments when someone is fighting for something that other people already have.

A woman who taught at Brooklands School almost 100 years ago waged this battle and won. * (13:40) In 1918, Jessie Kirk, her teaching life and her political life collided when she decided that the best way to inspire her students was to fight for a better world, specifically fighting for equal pay, equal representation and equal rights for women. History isn't just about recovering lost memories; it's about how we measure progress in our lives. That's why our government commemorated the international day of the girl this year, by creating more opportunities for girls to pursue careers in sciences and trades.

We don't want outdated social values to prevent women from taking advantage of some of the best jobs Manitoba has to offer. Thank you to all the women whose accom - plishments we have not done enough to celebrate. We will continue to work with you as partners in our pursuit of justice. Thank you. Mr. Speaker: That concludes members' statements. Introduction of Guests Mr. Speaker: I have a number of guests I'd like to introduce just prior to oral questions. Seated in the public gallery today we have with us Ms.

Melanie Parent, who is the deputy reeve of the RM of Piney, who is the guest of the honourable Minister of Jobs and the Economy (Mr. Chief). And also seated in the public gallery we have with us today members of the Trinity Unit ed Church 50th Anniversary Committee including: Elizabeth Brown, Marilyn Loat, Carolyn Pierson, Jackie Snarr, Connie Fillion, Clair and Bernice Gregory and Don and Marion Schultz, who are the guests of the honourable Minister of Family Services (Ms. Irvin - Ross).

And also seated in the public gallery we have with us today from Kelvin High School we have 30 grade 9 students under the direction of Mr. Ben Carr, who are located in the constituency of the honourable member for River Heights (Mr. Gerrard). And also seated in the public gallery we have with us today from Steinbach Christian High School we have 35 grade 9 students under the direction of Mr. Curt Plett, and this group is located in the

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2683 constituency of the honourable member for Steinbach (Mr. Goertzen). On behalf of all honourable members, we welcome all of you here this afternoon. * * * Hon. Dave Chomiak (Government House Leader): On House business, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker: On House business. Mr. Chomiak: I wonder if I might seek leave of the House to deal with an extraordinary event that occurred yesterday on the –on behalf of an extraordinary gesture on your part , Mr. Speaker.

I wonder if we might have each group in the House speak very shortly to the extraordinary thing that occurred yesterday that you helped initiate. I wonder if I might have leave of the House. Mr. Speaker: Leave of the House? [Agreed] Ms. Theresa Oswald (Seine River): I thank our House leader and the Opposition House Leader for affording us this opportunity to pay tribut e to you, Sir, for the gesture that you led last evening in commemoration, of course, of this year being the 100th anniversary of women receiving the right to vote and indeed receiving the right to hold office.

There were some marvellous speeches given las t night by all members of the political spectrum and they were filled with important historical information about the battles that have been waged by the women that have come before us. But, Mr. Speaker, you, in particular, and indeed members of your staff and association–I would name specifically JoAnn McKerlie- Korol, and I have no doubt that our Clerk, Patricia Chaychuk, had–has her hands in everything like this.

I would say to you that it was an incredible honour to be part of that ceremony last night, to look carefully at those women that have come before us who attended last evening. What an incredible opportunity it was to be in the same room. I will say openly and transparently that you gave us each a gift. And in that gift there was, of course, photographs of the women that have held office in this last 100 years and a very jaunty picture of each one of us as well, I would say.

And I was struck by the beauty and the historical significance of this gift and I think, like all women in our Chamber t oday, I was struck by how few pictures there were for 100 years, and it is my hope that 100 years from now, Mr. Speaker, when a Speaker has the class and grace as you do to hold such a commemorative event, that we won't be able to get all the pictures into one frame. But, again, from the bottom of my heart, and I hope I can speak for the women in this Chamber today and for the women that have come before us, it was an extraordinary gesture on your part.

We were all honoured by it, and we thank you very much. Mrs. Myrna Driedger (Charleswood): It was, indeed, a very special occasion last night, and I was honoured to have an opportunity to put some comments forward, as well, on behalf of our leader. And we also would like to thank Mr. Speaker and JoAnn McKerlie -Korol from the Teachers' Institute for spending a lot of time over the last number of months looking back at the history of women in politics.

And the framed poster that was given to each of us–and there were a number of retired women MLAs that were there and current sitting MLAs, and it was a very, I think, emotional evening to think that we are part of that first 100 years of Manitoba women being allowed to run in the political arena. That is never going to happen again. We are on the eve of a very momentous occasion in Canada in that Manitoba women were the first in Canada to be given the right to vote. That is, indeed, a remarkable occasion, and that will happen on January 28th, 2016.

When women were given the right to vote, we were also given the right to hold office. And helping us along that journey was Nellie McClung, and it's certainly been amazing in the last number of years to have all -party support so that we could erect a monument on the grounds of the Manitoba Legislature honouring Nellie McClung. It was an honour a couple weeks ago for the Nellie McClung Foundation to put on the mock par - liament and to have Nellie McClung's granddaughter, Marcia McClung, actually play the role of her grandmother in this mock parliament.

Those kinds of things are incredibly significant, and I'm not sure we all realize the significance of the history that we are being allowed right now to celebrate. And I would also mention to everybody that there's an opportunity to nominate modern- day Nellies right now through the Winnipeg Free Press, modern-day women that are walking in Nellie's footsteps to fight for social justice, and I would urge

2684 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 everybody, if you know people that should be nominated, please do that. And I hope everybody will want to be part of the January 28th gala to celebrate 100 years of Manitoba women being given the right to vote. That gala is going to be very, very exciting for all of us, and it will happen on exactly the date that Manitoba women were given the right to vote. I suspect we're going to see some Nellie McClungs at the event, including some suffragettes, some of the early women–[interjection] Pardon me. I just did make a mistake.

It is suffragists, because in Canada we were suffragists. In other countries, they were suffragettes. And in Canada we did it with style and grace and we did it with satire through the mock parliament. Other countries did not do the same and it was a much more violent fight for women's right to vote. So I urge–I hope everybody will be there. We've got a significant event to celebrate, and I hope all of us can be there to be part of those celebrations, because this is a momentous occasion. Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Mr.

Speaker, I want, on my behalf and on behalf of our Liberal Leader, Rana Bokhari, who was there last night and spoke at your invitation, I want to say thank you for setting up the event, organizing it and making it a very special evening remembering, I think it is, 51 MLAs, women who have been elected over the years so far, and hopefully there will be many, many more in the years ahead. It is a historic moment when we're at 100 years after women received the ability to vote and to be elected, and we've made a lot of progress in that time that we need to be grateful for and we need to look back on.

At the same time, we need still to recognize that there's some things yet to do, and that's, you know, what we can dedicate ourselves to in the years ahead. * (13:50) Thank you for the opportunity to join others and say thank you, Mr. Speaker. This was very much appreciated. Mr. Speaker: I thank all honourable members for their kind words on this very special occasion.

It was very special for us in the Speaker's office, and I can tell you openly that the work, while I am the one here that are hearing your very kind words, there were a lot of folks that were behind the scenes that were doing all of the work, and I want to pay special mention and attention to their work too.

JoAnn McKerlie -Korol, who has been mentioned here, played a very significant and leading role in this process in this evening that we had last night, and of course Michele LaPointe -Dixon and Ellen Douglas, who also work in the Speaker's office, were also part of that group in putting together this evening–or this last evening, and their work made it the success that it was.

And I want to tell you, in my time here as the Speaker of the Assembly and also as a member of this Assembly, I've been very proud to work with many women who have been in this very special place that we call our workplace, and that you have made a significant difference. I can see and hear the difference that has happened in this place over the years that I have been here, and I want to thank you on behalf of all Manitobans and all members of the Assembly for your work, and may you continue to play a lead role in the development of policy in our province, and thank you for your efforts.

For all of those that went before us and all of those that continue to serve today and those that will continue to serve in the future, thank you for your efforts. * * * Mr. Speaker: So I think that concludes guests, but I'm a bit flustered here. ORAL QUESTIONS Mr. Speaker: We'll now move on to oral questions. Tiger Dam Contract Disclosure of Information Mr. Brian Pallister (Leader of the Official Opposition): Mr.

Speaker, the other day we were asking some questions specific to the untendered contracts given for these Tiger Dams products over the last number of years, and the Premier, in a gesture of magnanimity, had proclaimed his desire for transp arency and placed at my disposal some 300-plus pages of documents to, I guess, make the point that he was quite open and willing to divulge information on the topic. Yet what we found is that of those 300 pages, over 200 of them look like that.

They 're blacked out in whole or in part and they do not disclose information, particularly pertaining to the Tiger Dams themselves or the analysis that was supposed to have been done on the product some years ago.

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2685 So I 'd like to give the Premier the opportunity, in the spirit of transparency and openness, to share with me and with the House the non- blacked-out documents in respect of the Tiger Dams, please. Hon. Greg Selinger (Premier): Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and just quickly, thank you for preparing and organizing the ceremony that we had last night. It was very powerful and moving for all of us. On the question, Mr.

Speaker, I can say this: The information was provided, copious amounts of that information, following the standards that are encoded in law in M anitoba. Our professional freedom of information people redact information that is not pertinent to the question at hand, personal information with respect to third parties or nego- tiations, but they do provide everything else. And the member knows full well that at the bottom of every page, if they have a specific concern about the information they received, they have the full right of appeal to the Ombudsman on that.

And I'm not aware of them having made any appeal on that. They 've used it for politica l grandstanding, but they have not followed the procedure which will allow them the purview and review by an independent officer of the Legislature called the Ombudsman to correct any perceived errors or any transgressions that the Leader of the Oppositi on may believe would have occurred. Mr. Pallister: Faint applause, Mr. Speaker, and justifiably so, because, of course, the Premier knows under the act he has the right to release the information and I 've just appealed to him to do so. What higher authori ty should I go to?

Why is he delegating the responsibility to someone else that he is in possession of? This is one page that wasn't blacked out. It reads: A preliminary analysis of Tiger Dam flood tubes as a flood protection tool. Unfortunately, the entire report is blacked out. Not a comma, not a period, nothing left; just total blacked -out pages. That 's not trans - parency or openness; that's just hiding facts. Now, $3 million was given out in untendered contracts in the two years prior to this analysis being done, which is totally hidden from us.

Would the Premier verify that his government was responsible for giving out $3 million to a party pal in business without shopping prior to doing any analysis on the product itself? Mr. Selinger: Mr. Speaker, it 's very clear that the member doesn't follow the procedures of the House. We put in place an Ombudsman. We put in place a privacy commissioner. At the bottom of every page of every document that has been tabled in this House and made available to the opposition, if there 's a concern, they have the right to appeal to an independent officer of the Legislature. The member hasn 't done that.

That indicates to me that he 's playing politics with this instead of actually seeking information, infor mation that might answer any of the questions that he's had. And as the member well knows, and we talked about this extensively in Estimates, Mr. Speaker, if there's an imminent threat to a community, an imminent threat that a family or an individual or a farm or a rural municipality or, and indeed, any community is at risk, our flood officials have the right and the responsibility to ensure that they have the proper equipment in place to protect those communities. And sometimes time frames are very sho rt.

Sometimes it 's a matter of minutes, hours or days before those communities could be inundated with unprecedented flooding that had never been seen before in Manitoba. And what does the member opposite want to do? He wants to spend 40 days tendering out a contract, which would have put those communities under water, which would have put lives at risk. Our officials acted with alacrity. They acted– Mr. Speaker: Order, please. The honourable First Minister's time on this question has elapsed. Mr. Pall ister: So we 've established, Mr.

Speaker, that the government did no research on Tiger Dams and simply gave a contract to a friend for $3 million worth of the product, which they then subsequently analyzed and evaluated, but they want to cover up the evaluation. This makes no sense . The Premier refers to our floodfighters and hides behind our floodfighters and our sandbaggers and our volunteers, but he's sandbagging the House today. The reality is, of course, that they went ahead, Mr.

Speaker, after this analysis was done but has not ever been disclosed, they went ahead and added $6 million more of untendered contracts to the list, totalling $9 million. And they have not disclosed the analysis that they 've done, even today. They did not disclose the dat a on the contracts they gave out

2686 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 either, breaking the laws of this province in the process, which require them to disclose untendered contracts within 30 days of awarding them. This was hidden for years. Now, I ask the Premier (Mr. Selinger): This report which he is hiding, if this report was favourable, why is it totally blacked out? Mr. Selinger: Mr. Speaker, the member cherry-picks one page out of well over 300–250 pages of infor - mation that was provided to him. This is not unusual. We've seen this kin d of behaviour before. He 's had that page for a while now.

If he was concerned about it, he has the entire right to make an appeal to that to the Speaker–to the Ombudsman of the House. Yesterday, he said he went and had a meeting with the RCMP. Turns out that he had the option of doing that, Mr. Speaker. And then he implicated the RCMP in an investigation. If the RCMP want information, they can get that information. There 's never been any barrier to that. The member opposite is doing everything except following the established procedures, which would allow him to get accurate information.

He 's politically grandstanding, something we 've seen before in this House, something we 've seen in the community, Mr. Speaker, that does not serve the public interest. When communities, individuals and families are at risk, we support our floodfighting officials to put the proper equipment in place to protect those communities. We will always do that. We will continue to do that. In the meantime, the member opposite would see them under water when he followed the abstract procedure that he thinks is necessary when people are at imminent risk. That is irresponsible. Mr.

Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition (Mr. Pallister), on a new question. Mr. Pallister: What is irresponsible is to pretend that the Premier is transparent and then table –two thirds of 300 documents are blacked out. Two thirds of 300 documents are totally or partially blacked out. Two thirds of 300 pages is totally or partially blacked out, including the complete– Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Mr. Pallister: See I've struck a nerve, Mr. Speaker. I'll wait 'til it's relatively silent to respond, if I may. * (14:00) Mr. Speaker: Order, please.

Leader of the Official Opposition has the floor. Mr. Pallister: Thank you, Mr. Speaker, I appreciate that. A preliminary technical analysis of Tiger Dam flood tubes as a flood protection tool: Taxpayers paid for this report. It was completed in December of 2009. It is completely blacked out. Now, the only logical conclusion one could draw is that that report shows some problems with the Tiger D ams. Why else black it out? Yet the NDP government went ahead –went ahead –and purchased $6 million more Tiger Dam products from their party pal without a tender or without shopping. Mr.

Speaker, now the Premier is covering up the fact that he bought a problem product, and I need him to stop hiding today, stop pretending and please just table the analysis so that Manitobans can see that the Tiger D ams are or are not a good product to use to protect themselves in flood situations. Mr.

Selinger: I've made a–in a previous response I made it clear that when our professional officials who administer our information laws –freedom of information laws, they make exclusions based on personal information to protect privacy, third- party business information not relevant to the specifics at hand to protect commercial interests, and infor - mation that has not been requested and may not be relevant to the request at hand. There is extensive information that has been provided the member opposite. He knows the –well, maybe he doesn't know.

It 's written at the bottom of every single page: If you're not happy, here 's where you appeal, to the Ombudsman. He still hasn 't made that appeal. He wants to get up here and cherry -pick infor - mation and put it on the record as if there was a deliberate attempt to exclude information. The information is provided by our professional officials according to laws that we have passed in this Legislature, and all those laws were supported by members of those Legislature. He's now saying that he wants a different approach to that.

He 's now saying that he wants those laws to be broken so he can make a political point in the House, Mr. Speaker. That is disgraceful. Our officials use a variety of pieces of equip - ment. They use Tiger Dams; they use Aqua Dams; they use HESCO Barriers; they use super sandbags.

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2687 They use a variety of technologies to protect communities. They pick the technologies based on their professional judgment on what's the safest, best way to look after Manitobans. We've had no lives lost in Manitoba. W e've kept our communities– Mr. Speaker: Order, please. Honourable First Minister's time on this question has elapsed. Mr. Pallister: It hardly keeps our province safe to hide information that pertains to a most important area of concern, Mr. Speaker. That's exactly what the Premier is doing now.

The Financial Administration Act of our province is a law. It requires the government to put on that little computer up in the library within 30 days all untendered contracts. This government issued $9 million of untendered Tiger Dam contracts over a se ven-and-a-half-year period and didn' t on one instance–not one instance –did they put the information on the untendered contracts on that computer, and they broke the law of our province. Now, Mr. Speaker, the Premier (Mr. Selinger) gives me 200 pages of blacked -out information and talks about things like accountability in the sa me speech.

They broke the laws of the province. T hey're blacking out the analysis reports so we can 't even see the evaluation. Which minister under his government's authority is responsible for reporting untendered Tiger Dam contracts and putting them on that computer? Is he responsible for it, or is someone else? And who is responsible for not placing any of the data on untendered contracts, in obeyance of the law, on the computer in the Leg. l ibrary within 30 days as is required by the law? Mr. Selinger: Mr.

Speaker, the member deliberately avoids following the FIPPA laws in his demands in front of the Legislature and then tries to shift somewhere else the discussion. Not a surprise –not a surprise. The Auditor General , whom we gave additional powers to investigate value for the money efforts in Manitoba, including issues of –with respect to posting contracts, tendered and untendered contracts, reviewed that; they gave us recommendations. They said, you need a more robust system of reporting. That syst em has been input.

That system has been input in place and that –all that information is now posted on the Internet for any member of the public in Manitoba to see. That 's a step forward in transparency. That 's why we have the Auditor General review these matters, and when we get good recommendations we follow them. We also have legislation in front of this House right now for the budget implementation, which add– which would additional transparency on untendered contracts. All the members have to do is stop standing on their political high horse and pass the law, and we will have additional transparency in Manitoba.

I look forward to them voting on it. We 're ready to vote today on it, Mr. Speaker, are they? I think not. Mr. Pallister: Well, these are the types of answers that caused a rebellion within the Premier 's own caucus. This willingness–this willingness–to pretend that he is accountable and responsible on an issue which he clearly has demonstrated the opposite is clearly the cause of dissension within his own ranks, and yet he fails to address it given the opportunity. Now, the Auditor General said–the Auditor General said –that the government was breaking its own laws, in her report last year.

The government now, given the opportunity to make public the information, refuses to do so yet again, learning nothing from the report whatsoever. The fact of the matter is that the ministers in this government need to comply with the law, just as every Manitoban expects they have to. Now, which minister was responsible for failing to put the information on $9 million of untende red Tiger Dam contracts on the Leg. library computer, as is required by the laws of our province? Which minister was responsible for failing to comply with the laws of our province? Mr.

Selinger: What we have on display from the Leader of the Opposition is his usual double-standard approach. For his first several questions he's demanding we break the laws on freedom of information. For him, that's okay. He –when he wants something done his way, it's okay to break the laws. Then he shifts to another set of issues with respect to contracts, which have been reviewed by the Auditor General. And when the Auditor General gave recommendations, we fully complied with those

2688 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 recommendations, and we upped the game. We took the system we inherited, the legacy system of posting contracts and providing information on a computer in the Leg. library, and we put them a hundred per cent available on the Internet. We have a bill in front of the Legislature. We 're ready to vote on that bill today. Members opposite want to delay that as long as possible. No surprise, Mr. Speaker. D ouble standard: break the law when it suits his purposes, enforce the law or pretend to want to enforce the law when it suits his purposes.

Nothing new here, the same thing we've been discussing for the last several months, no surprise, no new information, no new ideas, no progress. We posted all the information on the Internet, Mr. Speaker. We 're willing to have greater transparency. All they have to do is stop posturing and vote for the bill. Let's do it today. Untendered Contracts Public Disclosure Mr. Reg Helwer (Brandon West): Well, Mr. Speaker, it 's clear the Premier (Mr. Selinger) is– understands the concept but not the practice of law. And, you know, Mr.

Speaker, it should come as no surprise to Manitobans that the NDP Minister of Finance (Mr. Dewar) has, yet again, broken the law. The Financial Administration Act requires that all contracts be published without delay. We have found millions of dollars in untendered contracts that have been hidden from Manitobans until we have brought them to the attention of the Finance Department. With the NDP, Manitobans are paying more and, indeed, getting less. Mr. Speaker, what else and how much more is the Finance Minister hiding? Hon. Dave Chomiak (Minister of Mineral Resources): Mr.

Speaker, a year and a half ago the provincial auditor did a review of the process with respect to contracts. He made recommendations to a committee of the Legislature of which the members opposite are C hair people. The recommendations called for a more robust system. Right now, today, as a result of the recommendations of the provincial auditor made a year and a half ago, all contracts, tendered or untendered, are on the Internet, available to anyone to review, which I believe is a first in the country.

In addition, there is legislation before the Legislature right now in BITSA in order to open up and provide more information. I think there's a little bit of politics being played here. Mr. Helwer: Well, it was disclosed in committee that this NDP Finance Minister is breaking the law by not disclosing untendered contracts. Manitobans can' t trust this NDP government. They are tired of the same NDP broken promises. Mr. Speaker, what else is this mini ster hiding from Manitobans? Mr. Chomiak: Mr.

Speaker, when the FIPPA legislation was put in, when the legislation of which we are–the legislation we 're functioning under was put in by members opposite. They had rules and regulations. We've expanded it. W e've expanded the breadth of FIPPA to schools, to hospitals and to other entities. * (14:10) In fact, Mr. Speaker, there were 2,800–2,800 – requests of FIPPA information last year. And you know what? One thousand seven hundred came from opposition parties. In other words, we 're doing the research.

We are providing the research to members who then take the research, stand up and criticize us for either –for not providing information because of the three standards t hat were put in place by members opposite: privacy, commercial or third - party interests, negotiations and the government. I think they're playing politics. Mr. Helwer: Mr. Speaker, this NDP government is not listening to Manitobans and continues to be i n contempt of Manitoba's laws.

Hundreds of millions of dollars in undisclosed contracts are being hidden from Manitobans by this NDP Minister of Finance, so we can 't even begin to see how much money they are wasting. Mr. Speaker, what else is this minis ter hiding from Manitobans, and when will he finally make these untendered contracts public for all Manitobans to see? Mr. Chomiak: Yes, Mr. Speaker, let me try a different approach. Will members opposite at least admit– will members opposite at least admit –that now in Manitoba all contracts, tendered or untendered ,

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2689 going forward, over $10,000 are available to anyone who looks on the Internet? And will they admit, Mr. Speaker, that there used to be a computer in the Legislature that was a old-style, old computer–sort of like the old Tory party–that cranked out information that wasn 't very effective? We admitted that. We changed the system. Will they not also admit that they–the opposition party has asked for 1,700 requests of FIPPA. Some of them are hun dreds and hundreds of pages, and they ask every single day. And when the Premier (Mr.

Selinger) tabled hundreds of pages the other day, there was hardly any information redacted, and the members opposite, I dare say, are being political. Manitoba's Credit Rating Budget Speech 2015 Mr. Cameron Friesen (Morden-Winkler): Mr. Speaker, in the spring budget the NDP government stated its commitment to achieve stable or improving credit ratings in the future. Well, just a few months after that statement in their budget, the opposite is true. Moody 's has downgraded Manitoba 's c redit rating, the first downgrade in 30 years.

Now, understand the Finance Minister promised Manitobans stable or better credit ratings, and then the credit rating gets downgraded. Now, Manitobans are tired of the same old NDP broken promises. Moody's war ned them the summer previous that it was coming and then it happened. So I ask the Finance Minister: When he was delivering the budget, was he already suspecting a credit downgrade? Hon. Greg Dewar (Minister of Finance): I do want to just thank the member for earlier on this week highlighting all the hard work I 'm doing on behalf of my constituents in Selkirk. Mr.

Speaker, I was hoping he could maybe table some more pictures of me representing my constituents in Selkirk. But when we brought down our budget this year, we focused on growing the economy. We focused on creating opportunities for Manitobans. We're focused on investing in health care, focusing on investing in education, focused on investing in infrastructure. We made a commitment this year to spend $1 billion; I can inform the House we, in fact, spent more than $1 billion this year, Mr. Speaker, on infrastructure. As I said, we want to grow our economy.

That 's why we had the second lowest unemployment rate in Canada. Our goal is to be No. 1. I ask members opposite to join with us to reach that target. Mr. Friesen: Mr. Speaker, there was no answer to my question. I would table for this House a Department of Finance briefing note that we received through a n information request. And like so many of the information requests we receive back, most of this is completely blacked out. But you can see the title, and the title says the Effects of a Possible Credit Downgrade by Moody's. Now, Mr. Speaker, there is an important issue of trust here.

The minister was promising stable or improving credit ratings in Manitoba, but –while at the same time his department was warning him about a coming credit downgrade. Most of it is blacked out, but that much is clear. Did th e Finance Minister deliberately mislead Manitobans and the financial community in his budget speech? Mr. Dewar: We did not. Mr. Speaker, I 'll remind the member yet again that we came into office, we had a, under the legacy of the Leader of the Oppositio n and his party, a Aa3 ranking from Moody 's. We 're now a Aa2 ranking. I remind the member that, in fact, is a higher ranking.

I had a chance, as I said earlier, to meet with investors in New York and met with investors in Toronto. They have confidence in the Manitoba economy. Even today, the Canadian Federation of Independent Business have reported that , on behalf of their members, the business confidence have–has risen here in the province. We had a tremendous debate earlier on in this House, Mr. Speaker, where the opposition brought forward a resolution full of gloom and doom about the Manitoba economy. You know, that is their vision.

Our vision on our side is to grow the economy, to highlight all the positive things that are happening here in the ci ty of Winnipeg, and we 're going to continue to do that. Mr. Friesen: Mr. Speaker, a year earlier, the government was warned to get their fiscal house in order. They did nothing. Moody 's downgraded the province's credit rating. As a result, Manitobans pay

2690 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 millions more to service the debt. That 's money that doesn't go to front-line services. One small part of this briefing note that was not redacted is the key message. The key message states: A downgrade could increase the Province 's cost of borrowing going forward. What was in this analysis that the Finance Minister didn 't want Manitobans to see? What made him redact the rest of the content? The briefing note shows that the Finance Minister 's misleading Manitobans in his budget speech.

Will the minister provide to the House, to members and to all Manitobans the background and analysis that is blacked out from this FIPPA request? This is an issue of confidence and competence, and he fails on both. Mr. Dewar: Mr. Speaker, you know, the –I want to remind the member that the –again, when we came into office, our ranking was a Aa3; now it 's a Aa2 with Moody's. It's higher than what it was when they came into office. So, you know, Mr. Speaker, he should perhaps direct some of his anger to the –to his seatmate there, the Leader of the Opposition, who left us in that sorry state.

We 're spending more now on–to service our debt, the –a ratio to our expenditures than we did when they were in power, from 13 down to 5.6 per cent. Mr. Speaker, I want to draw attention to the House, of the City of Winnipeg and the finance chair of the committee, Mr. Marty Morantz, who was a former candidate of the members opposite, who said in the paper that, in his opinion, now is the time to invest in the economy with record low interest rates. They're doing so at the federal level; they're doing so at the City of Winnipeg; we 're doing it here in Manitoba. Why don't they get on side?

Education System Government Record Mr. Wayne Ewasko (Lac du Bonnet): Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Education stated the other day that when he got into government, he found that the education system was a mess. I 'd have to agree with him, considering both of us was–were elected in 2011. When the NDP took over government in 1999, Manitoba was a leader in the country in education, and now we find ourselves, after 16 years of waste and mismanagement by this NDP government, we 're dead last in regards to math, science and literacy.

Why is this minister content in being dead last in the country when it comes to education? Hon. James Allum (Minister of Education and Advanced Learning): I think, whatever Hansard might have recorded, what I wanted to say, of course, is that when we came into government in 1999, four terms ago, we found the education system in an utter state of disrepair. And since that time, Mr.

Speaker, we've invested at the rate of economic growth every single year so that we can ensure that there are proper supports for students, proper supports for parents, proper supports to make sure that our students are successful every single day. Mr. Speaker, we have built 35 new schools since we came into government. We built new science labs, new gyms, new shops to ensure that our kids have the skills and the knowledge they need to go on into post-secondary education and then on from there to get a good job and continue to build this beautiful province together. Mr.

Ewasko: I know that the minister has every right to be angry with his predecessors within that NDP government. Mr. Speaker, with the minister going on his promise-and-spending-spree tour this fall, he is merely vote buying because, as we have seen in the Fraser report in September, we 've been dead last in Canada on education infrastructure spending and growth, which he just referenced to. Why doesn 't the minister just admit that he is just on a vote -buying campaign tour, making promises that he has no– not even going to be maintaining, Mr. Speaker? Can he answer that question? * (14:20) Mr. Allum: Well, Mr.

Sp eaker, I want to set the record straight for the member because he put so much misinformation on the table. It's important to remember exactly what we 've done since we've begun in government: that is a total of $1.4 billion in renovating and improving our public schools all across this province from north to south and east to west. Mr. Speaker, $22.9 million have gone into building new child-care centres at our schools because they didn 't exist when they were in

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2691 government; $26.5 million for new gyms al l across this province so that our children can be healthy in the body and then healthy in the mind; $24.1 million to build new science labs all across this province so that our children have the skills they need to go forward into college and university; and then new shop classrooms worth $30 million. We stand with students. We stand with parents– Mr. Speaker: Order, please. The honourable minister's time on this question has elapsed. Mr. Ewasko: Again, Mr.

Speaker, the minister has every right to stan d up and be very angry with his predecessors. He has to now catch up for 15 years of waste and mismanagement from his NDP Education ministers. Manitoba should be very concerned with this minister. We have gone from being a leader in the country to dead l ast in math, science and literacy. Capital spending and infrastructure spending, we 've gone dead last within education as well, Mr. Speaker. Manitobans need a change for the better. Will the Minister of Education admit that he has no plan and that he is simply going on a vote-buying, promise-and-spending spree? Mr.

Allum: Let's be clear, Mr. Speaker. I'm proud to be the Minister of Education. I 'm very proud of our public education system here in Manitoba. I 'm really sorry that the member opposite, who 's a teacher– who's a teacher –doesn't feel the same way about the very system that he's profited from as a teacher. But let 's review the record of the members opposite when they were in government: in 1993- 94, cut of Education by 2 per cent; in 1994- 95, cut to Education by 2.6 per cent; in 1995- 96, frozen at zero per cent; in 1996- 97, a cut of 2 per cent, Mr. Speaker; in 1997- 1998, frozen again at zero per cent.

And now the Leader of the Opposition, the Conservative Leader of the Opposition, wants to cut a half a billion dollars from the budget. Mr. Speaker, that won't be good for schools. It won 't be good for parents. It won 't be good for students. The only thing, the biggest threat to the education system and the economy of Manitoban is the leader of the– Mr. Speaker: Order, please. Order, please. The honourable minister 's time on this question has elapsed. River Point Centre Update Addiction Treatment Beds Mr. Ron Schuler (St.

Paul): In an NDP news release dated 2010, it clearly states that 10 new long-term treatment beds would be added to the River Point Centre on Magnus Avenue. Can the Minister of Housing please provide an update regarding these 10 long- term treatment beds? Are they presently being occupied? Hon. Deanne Crothers (Minister of Heal thy Living and Seniors): I appreciate the question from the member opposite on an addictions issue. It 's fantastic to talk about that issue in this room.

So we know that addictions have far -reaching effects on individuals and their families, and that 's why we take prevention and treatment very seriously. And that 's why we invested in River Point Centre, which is a very unique model. It 's a multi-agency addictions –excuse me–that provides – it's a facility in Point Douglas that provides outreach programming as well as 24 new treatment beds, with 10 additional beds expected to open in the coming months that will serve more than 700 Manitobans every year. Mr. Schuler: Well, Mr.

Speaker, in an April 2013 press release, the NDP corrected itself and released another release stating that the River Point Centre wouldn't open until winter of 2014. The release clearly states that an additional 10 new long -term treatment beds would be added to the centre 's capacity. Mr. Speaker, why has it taken five years and the beds are still not occupied? Ms. Crothers: Mr. Speaker, River Point Centre was completely renovated, and we have multiple agencies working in River Point Centre to provide these services. It 's not something that we 're going to be able to flip on just at 20 10. It is open.

It is functioning, and as I said, the 10 additional beds will be open very shortly. Mr. Speaker, we have no apologies to make on this side of the House in terms of our funding to addictions. In their time, their addictions funding was 14.4. What did we invest in the last year for addictions alone, $34.5 million. They 've got nothing to be snooty about.

2692 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 Mr. Schuler: The reason why the minister couldn' t flip on those 10 beds is she 's too busy flipping on all the press releases. In fact, a th ird NDP news release, dated June 3rd, 2014, r egarding the River Point Centre once again made the same promise. It's been five years, yet those 10 long- term treatment beds are still not being used. Manitobans are tired of paying more and getting less. Why doesn't the minister cut the news releases, save some trees and finally open those beds so Manitobans can receive the treatments that were promised five years ago?

Why doesn 't she do it for those men and women who need the treatments? Instead of having press releases, instead of having round tables and more discussions, open the 10 beds. Ms. Crothers: Mr. Speaker, we want to make sure that Manitobans who are struggling with addictions are getting the services they need at the appropriate time and in the appropriate manner , because not everyone that 's struggling with an addiction needs the same type of care.

I have every confidence that the organizations that are in River Point Centre are ensuring that those beds will be available, that all of the people that come to receive care at River Point Centre are going to get the care that they need. I 've already stated in my first response that these beds would be available at the–in the very near future. I have to say , though, Mr.

Speaker, when the member opposite–when the Leader of the Opposition was in power , they cut funding to the Addictions Foundation of Manitoba not once, not twice, not thrice, but four times, and that would be –that's $1.5 million of reduced funding to one agency. They are in no position to be showing any kind of doubt about where our commitment is. Thank you. Land Transfer Tax Burden First-Time Homebuyers Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Mr. Speaker, in 1987, the NDP introduced a land transfer tax to pay for the Property Registry. In 2014, the government sold the Property Registry to Teranet.

Teranet now raises its own funds by selling the services that used to be paid for by the land transfer tax. Land transfers are now also taxed. This tax is an obstacle for many young pro- fessionals in Manitoba wanting to buy their first home. I ask the government: Why is the Premier and his government making it more difficult for our young professionals to buy their first home here in Manitoba? Hon. Greg Selinger (Premier): Mr. Speaker, the primary requirement for somebody to buy a home i s to have a good job with a good salary, and that's why we've made a record investment in Manitoba.

That 's why we 've got the best job creation record in the country–the best job creation record in the country – second lowest unemployment rate. When people have good jobs, they can afford to buy homes. And every time we put resources in the budget–I hesitate to mention this again –that member, among all the other me mbers in the opposition, have voted against measures that create employment and good jobs in Manitoba. We're the good-jobs party; they're the cuts party. Mr. Gerrard: Mr.

Speaker, over the last 16 years of NDP government , we have seen a net loss of 76,855 people out of Manitoba to other provinces, a net loss. One of the reasons has been that they continue to ignore our own young professionals with a system that provides the economic disincentive of a very high land transfer tax when purchasing a new home. Will the Premier now admit the error of his ways and adopt the Liberal position that the land transfer tax on sales of homes to first -time homebuyers should be eliminated? Mr. Selinger: Mr.

Speaker, we have a growing population in Manitoba; over 15,000 people came to the province last year. We have a younger population: average age, 37 years old. We have the lowest unemployment –one of the lowest unemployment rates in the country. We have more people participating in the economy than we've ever seen before. We have the No.1 record for job creation. * (14:30) We've seen very significant growth in wages in the province of Manitoba. We 've seen very significant increases in productivity, which allows us to be more competitive.

Those are the indicators of a healthy economy for good jobs for young people. When they have those jobs, they can buy homes.

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2693 And real estate sales have been very vigorous in this province. They 're doing very we ll. We just had many of them down here this week to see this piece of real estate called the Manitoba Legislature, and they reported to us that their industry has had a good run while we've been in office. We'd like to keep that run going, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Gerrard: Mr. Speaker, and the net loss last year was equivalent to half of the people who came here. Mr.

Speaker, someone buying an average -priced home in Manitoba for the first time has to pay more than $3,000 in land transfer tax. It 's no wonder that people who are looking at buying their first home are not staying in Manitoba. The Premier 's archaic land transfer tax policies remain a disincentive for people to stay and buy a home here in our province. Can the Premier see how the Liberal position of removing the land transfer tax on sal es of homes for first-time home buyers would encourage people to stay here in Manitoba instead of moving elsewhere? Mr.

Selinger: Any young person–and we've all been there–who wants to buy a home, first thing they 'd check: how reliable is my job? Will I be employed in Manitoba? Can I put some of my paycheque aside every week or every couple of weeks into a plan so I can afford to make a down payment? That's what we're focusing on: good quality jobs, good skills, good t raining, Mr. Speaker, a good education system so–and a good opportunity to have a trade or a skill or an occupation or a profession. That's where we're focused.

The member opposite votes against all those initiatives in the budget, and then when I look a t his platform, it's the same one he had before. He wants to cut $450 million in payroll taxes. That means there will be less resources to build social housing. That means there will be less resources to ensure that people get good jobs and training and skills in Manitoba. The Liberal platform will not help young people buy homes, because they'll be unemployed. Mr. Speaker: Time for oral questions has expired. PETITIONS Mr. Speaker: It is now time for petitions.

Provincial Trunk Highway 206 and Cedar Avenue in Oakbank–Pedestrian Safety Mr. Ron Schuler (St. Paul): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) Every day, hundreds of Manitoba children walk to school in Oakbank and must cross PTH 206 at the intersection with Cedar Avenue.

(2) There have been many dangerous incidents where drivers use the right shoulder to pass vehicles that have stopped at the traffic light waiting to turn left at this intersection.

(3) Law enforcement officials have identified this intersection as a hot spot of concern for the safety of schoolchildren, drivers and emergency responders. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge that the provincial gover nment improve the safety at the pedestrian corridor at the intersection of PTH 206 and Cedar Avenue in Oakbank by considering such steps as highlighting pavement markings to better indicate the location of the shoulders and crosswalk, as well as installing a lighted crosswalk structure. This is s igned by P. Raitt, E. McLeod, R.

McLeod and many, many other fine Manitoba ns. Thank you. Mr. Speaker: In keeping with our rule 132(6), when petitions are read they are deemed to have been received by the House. The honourable Official Opposition House Leader, on House business? House Business Mr. Kelvin Goertzen (Official Opposition House Leader): On House business, Mr. Speaker. In accordance with rule 31(9), I 'd like to announce that the private member 's resolution that'll be considered next Thursday is a resolution on Manitoba Hydro Rate Hikes Harming Manitoba Families, brought forward by the honourable member for Lakeside (Mr. Eichler).

Mr. Speaker: It has been announced that, in keeping with our rule 31(9) , that the private member 's resolution that we consider next Thursday is the resolution on Manitoba Hydro Rate Hikes Harming Manitoba Families, brought forward and sponsored by the honourable member for Lakeside. * * *

2694 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 Mr. Speaker: Further petitions? Beausejour District Hospital– Weekend and Holiday Physician Availability Mr. Wayne Ewasko (Lac du Bonnet): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. And these are the reasons for this petition:

(1) The Beausejour District Hospital is a 30 -bed, acute-care facility that serves the communities of Beausejour and Brokenhead.

(2) The hospital and primary -care centre have had no doctor available on weekends and holidays for many months, jeopardizing the health and livelihoods of t hose in the northeast region of the Interlake-Eastern Regional Health Authority.

(3) During the 2011 election, the provincial government promised to provide every Manitoban with access to a family doctor by 2015.

(4) This promise is far from being realized, and Manitobans are witnessing many emergency rooms limiting services or closing temporarily, with the majority of these reductions taking place in rural Manitoba.

(5) According to the Health Council of Canada, only 25 per cent of doctors in Manitoba reported that their patients had access to care on evenings and weekends. We petition the Legislative Assembly as follows: To urge the provincial government and the Minister of Health to ensure that the Beausejour District Hospital and primary -care centre have a primary-care physician available on weekends and holidays to better provide area residents with this essential service. This petition is signed by I. Mostowy, B. Moz el, E. Kleinsassen and many, many more fine Manitobans, Mr. Speaker. Mr.

Speaker: Are there any further petitions? Seeing none, we'll move on to grievances. ORDERS OF THE DAY (Continued) GOVERNMENT BUSINESS Mr. Speaker: Seeing no grievances, we 'll move on to orders of the day, government business. Hon. Dave Chomiak (Government House Leader): Mr. Speaker, would you please canvass the House to see if there is leave to set aside the Estimates of Executive Council and consider Education and Advanced Learning in the Chamber, with the change to apply for today only? Mr.

Speaker: Is there leave of the House to set aside the Estimates of the Executive Council and to consider Education and Advanced Learning in the Chamber, with the change to apply only for today? Is there leave? [Agreed] The honourable Government House Leader, on further House business. Mr. Chomiak: Yes, Mr. Speaker, I 'd like to call Committee of Supply. Mr. Speaker: We'll now resolve into the Committee of Supply. Madam Deputy Speaker, will you please take the Chair, and various Chairs to the committee rooms. COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY (Concurrent Sections) HEALTH, HEALTHY LIVING AND SENIORS * (14:40) Mr.

Chairperson (Rob Altemeyer): Will the Committee of Supply please come to some semblance of order. This

section of the Committee of Supply will now resume consideration of the Estimates for the Department of Health, Healthy Living and Seniors. Seeing that there are no more specific questions for the Minister of Health (Ms. Blady), we will now proceed with the questions for the Minister responsible for Healthy Living and Seniors. I'll put an open question out on the table. Do the minister and the critic wish to have opening state - ments or do you wish to proceed directly to questioning? It has already been established for this

section of the Committee of Supply that the conversation will be global. But if you have opening statements, we can do that or skip it. Hon. Deanne Crothers (Minister of Healthy Living and Seniors ): I would like to make an opening statement. Mr. Chairperson: Opening statement, okay. Well, please proceed, then.

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2695 Ms. Crothers: So I'm pleased to present the 2015-16 expenditure Estimates for Healthy Living and Seniors. This portfolio is committed to working with Manitobans to enga ge in healthy living for all ages. It's a diverse and important portfolio, and it's an honour to lead this department. Healthy Living and Seniors has a major role to play in the health and wellness of Manitobans and in contributing to the sustainability of the health system for the future.

And I certainly have to say that I appreciate the great assistance that I get from the fine department staff that are in Healthy Living and Seniors. We're responsible for a number of Healthy Living and Seniors policies, programs and initiatives, most of which will support Manitobans to avoid or delay the onset of chronic disease, addictions and mental health issues, to promote injury prevention and improve the overall health of Manitobans. Healthy Living strives to support Manitobans to maintain health and wellness through all stages and ages of life.

Close working relationships with colleagues in the department, other departments, regional health authorities, community and disease prevention and injury prevention groups , schools and school divisions, child -care centres, universities and work - places allow the department to support Manitobans to make healthier choices and to live healthier lives. In 2004, Manitoba was the first province in Canada to introduce a province-wide smoking ban in enclosed public places in indoor workplaces. And since then we've had many other achievements and remain committed and steadfast in our intention to reduce tobacco use.

Manitoba leads Canada in taxing tobacco products, making them less affordable, particularly for youth. Manitoba was one of the first provinces to introduce restrictions on the display, advertising and promotion of tobacco products in stores. In this province it is illegal to smoke in a private vehicle when someone under the age of 16 is present. And on May 31st, 2013, as a result of legislation changes, tobacco sales were banned in pharmacies, stores containing a pharmacy, health -care facilities and vending machines. And in July 2014, Manitoba prohibited smoking on playgrounds and beaches in provincial parks.

And just recently, legislative measures to address Manitobans' safe and appro- priate use of e -cigarettes and to protect children and youth have been introduced and discussed in this Legislature.

In this year's budget, we have committed an extra $2 million to increase our commitment to assisting Manitobans with smoking cessation and continue to work with our youth and their organ- izations, be it schools, workplaces and sports and recreational activities to remain smoke-free. * (14:50) Manitoba Health, Healthy Living and Seniors has dedicated funding to the development of initiatives in northern Manitoba to help reduce the cost of healthy foods that cannot be locally grown.

In September, seven remote communities have begun to see a remarkable price difference in their local stores as they purchase milk, fruits and vegetables for their families. A $6 reduction in a four -litre container of milk is one example of the differences this program will make to children and t heir families. And it was an announcement that was very exciting to be at, I have to say. Another important Healthy Living initiative is the Wellness Works campaign in partnership with the Manitoba Chambers of Commerce.

The campaign targets employers, rather than individuals, and invites them to make a public commitment to creating an environment that supports health and wellness. The goal of the campaign is to have a healthier, more engaged adult workforce, which has multiple economic and social benef its. And I'm pleased to say that we have over 50 employers, large and small, representing 42,000 employees signed up to Wellness Works. And we're not done yet. Through injury prevention partnerships, we have been able to distribute thousands of personal flotation devices and bicycle helmets across Manitoba.

On June 3rd, we celebrated the 10th anni - versary of the low -cost bicycle helmet program that has assisted hundreds of children to be injury-free. And this department pays attention to the needs of our aging population. Together the Seniors and Healthy Aging Secretariat, the Manitoba Council on Aging and the Manitoba Caregiver Advisory Committee support and strengthen the voice of older as well as caregiving Manitobans. As Manitoba's population ages, our government continues to respond to the needs of older Manitobans.

One innovation has been the implementation of the care - giver tax credit, which increased by 10 per cent this year. In the area of mental health, our department supports agencies commit ted to preventing and addressing the mental health issues that many

2696 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 Manitobans face. This year, we are pleased to be involved in the development of services and resources for children and youth at risk of mental health issues or who require mental health services. In the next few weeks, Minister Wight and I will be participating in an engagement in 10 communities across the province to discuss the mental health needs of our children and youth. Manitoba is committed to building a better addictions system. River Point Centre began to phase in services in 2014.

Its mandate is to–a continuum of services, including community -based outreach, new withdrawal management beds, new treatment prep - aration beds for those waiting for longer term treatment programs, prim ary residential treatment beds and temporary transitional housing units that will begin to receive tenants in January of 2016. This will increase services for Manitobans requiring addictions programs, alleviate pressure on existing addictions programs and promote increased co - ordination of services. In conclusion, I wish to point out that this is a very diverse but exciting portfolio.

We work with many partners in the delivery of many programs and services to support Manitobans to be healthy in many different aspects of their daily lives. We are committed to refining and adjusting our programs to meet the current economic climate, while still focusing on what matters most to the Manitobans we work with and partner with every day. In closing, I'd like to leave you with a few considerations that speak to the importance of the Healthy Living and Seniors portfolio. Every dollar invested in car and booster seats saves $40 in avoided medical costs.

Every dollar invested in workplace health and safety programs returns up to $6 in avoided illness, injury and fatality. Every dollar invested in tobacco prevention programs save up to $20 in future health -care costs. And every dollar spent on mental health and addictions saves $7 in health costs and $30 in lost produ ctivity and social costs. And, of course, I have to add that it's not just about the dollar value; it's also about the amount of grief and hardship that avoiding these kinds of things, the impact that that has on Manitobans, and that's really the focus that I have here. Thank you very much. Mr.

Chairperson: Thank you very much, Minister. Honourable opposition critic? Mr. Cliff Graydon (Emerson): I think I'd just as soon start with the questions. Mr. Chairperson: Okay, very good. The floor is now open for questions. Mr. Graydon: How many vacancies exist or are they being actively filled for a result of the lean management practices of the province by the 2013 budget? Ms. Crothers: So right now there are two vacancies in Healthy L iving and Healthy Populations; one is from retirement and another position opened after someone moved on. So we're currently recruiting right now. Mr.

Graydon: Were the staff in attendance hired through competition or by appointment? Ms. Crothers : One of –in both instances these positions were competitions to get into the ADM position, and then it was made an appointment to the DM position after that. * (15:00) Mr. Graydon: Would the minister be so kind as to provide a list of all political staff, includ ing names, positions and whether or not they're full time in the department? Would you do that going forward? Ms. Crothers: Would you like me to get that right now and give it to you? Mr. Graydon: Sorry, about that, Mr. Chair.

No, she can provide that at a later date, but certainly by the end of the week. Ms. Crothers : Yes, that's fine. Absolutely, we'll give that to you. Mr. Graydon: At the same time, would the minister provide me with a list of the total departmental staff? Ms. Crothers: Of course. Mr. Graydon: How many staff in the last year were hired on a contractual basis and, if so, for how long and for what projects? Ms. Crothers: In this year no one was hired through a contract. Mr. Graydon: How many positions have been relocated from northern Manitoba into Winnipeg and, if so, how many positions and what was the reasoning?

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2697 Ms. Crothers: We've moved no positions from the North. Mr. Graydon: How has the RHA amalgamation affected total travel budgets of the RHA executives? Ms. Crothers: We can get that information for you. It's not here with us at the moment, but if you would like, that's something we can certainly provide. Mr. Graydon: That would be fine. I would appreciate that very much, Madam Minister. How many hours has the minister spent out of the province while undertaking legislative duties? Ms. Crothers: None. Mr.

Graydon: How many untendered contracts exceeding $1,000 have been granted directly in the previous fiscal year, and what is the reasoning for the lack of tender? Ms. Crothers: So we record all untendered contracts through–according to provincial requirements so we can get that information for you. Mr. Graydon: If the m inister would get me that information of what the untendered contracts were and at the same time provide the reasonings for the lack of tender, I would appreciate that.

Also, could the minister provide a copy of the awarded contracts and any special operating agencies that fall under its jurisdiction? Ms. Crothers: We don't have any special operating agencies under Healthy Living and Seniors. Mr. Graydon: Then can the minister provide me a copy of the awarded contracts? Ms. Crothers : I've been asked fo r a little more guidance in terms of the specifics of what you are looking for, so we can get you exactly what you need. Mr. Graydon: I had asked a question about the untendered contracts.

There are tendered contracts as well, and I would like to have a c opy of the awarded contracts and what they were for. Ms. Crothers: We can get that for you, yes, thank you. Mr. Graydon: And, at the same time, perhaps the minister would tell me how many of the contracts over $1,000 are currently available. Ms. Crothers : It's not a problem; we can provide that as well. Mr. Graydon: Have there been any critical instances under the –this minister's watch since she became minister in her portfolio? * (15:10) Ms. Crothers: Thank you for your patience, sorry.

One of the issues that I have discovered being Minister of Healthy Living and Seniors is that frequently things that are part of my purview have implications in Health, so I was just determining a couple of things before I answered. So critical incident legislation requires reporting from facilities that are specific, like a very specific list of organizations –not organizations, but facilities like in -patient facilities when it comes to critical incidences.

So in terms of people that would be at a facility that falls within my department, we'll have to–the staff here will look into any mental health in - patient facilities to see if there were any critical incidences listed there. But we do have a –we do list on a website all of the critical incidences that take place. So we can get that information specifically for those that would seek services that fall under the Department of Healthy Living and Seniors. Mr.

Graydon: So these critical instances, when they do happen I assume that there is an investigation and there is some time prior to them being put up on the website. And then, do you then differentiate between your portfolio and Health's portfolio on the website? Ms. Crothers: So, yes, there is definitely some time that's taken as the system investigates a critical incident, and I would say, also, that it takes time to determine if an incident is a critical incident before it would be posted. Once it's determined that it is, it's reported in accordance with the legislation. When it's recorded, it's not split.

I think my comments that I made before are much more from my perspective of determining when something falls within my department, or Health, in terms of critical incidents. If they're identified, they're reported. That's not split in any way and then those are reported on a periodic basis with the minister. Mr. Graydon: If these are reported on a periodic time frame with the minister, then how do they ever get to be on the website? Ms. Crothers: In terms of periodic, I mean, there are dates, so I'm looking right now at the website where these reports are listed, and so they go from, for

2698 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 example, July 1st of 2014, is the one I'm looking at here, to September 30th, 2014, and the next one is April 1st, 2014, to June 30th, 2014. So they're collected over a period of time and posted as such. Mr. Graydon: So it would appear, then, that this is a quarterly report, and that if the public were, in most cases, would know of a criti cal incident, would find that out in the paper unless we checked every quarterly report, because that seems to be the time frame that the minister has put forward.

I would like to ask the minister what reasoning she might be able to give the seniors that have been misled for three straight years about having complete education property tax relief. Ms. Crothers: I'm not quite sure what you mean in terms of misleading. * (15:20) Mr. Graydon: Well, three years ago it was clear that that was the promise in the election that seniors would have a complete education property tax relief. Three years later that still has not taken place. It's been piecemeal, handed out, capped, and so how does the minister feel about misleading the seniors for such a long time? Ms.

Crothers: You know, I feel that seniors told us that they were looking for education tax rebate, and we have provided seniors the opportunity to do that. If you would like to take that up with the Minister of Finance (Mr. Dewar), which is a more appro priate place for that, I encourage you to do so. Mr. Graydon: So is the minister, then, suggesting that the Minister of Finance could tell me how the minister of seniors and healthy living feels about misleading the seniors for three years? Ms.

Crothers : No, what I am telling you is that I don't feel we've misled the seniors on the education tax rebate and I'm telling you that directly. So you don't need to ask him that question, but if you feel we've misled them, then maybe you can take that up with the Minister of Finance. Mr. Graydon: So, when the election promise was made, was that only made with the minister of Finance? Or was it everyone in the NDP government that agreed with that election promise to completely remove it –remove the education property t ax for seniors? I need to better understand how government works. I'm new at this. Ms.

Crothers : I'm not going to speak for anyone else, but I'll speak for myself when I tell you that I believe in what we've done to help seniors by accessing this rebate and there's nothing else I can tell you. If you don't understand that, I'm sorry. Mr. Chairperson: Just before recognizing the member for Emerson, I'll just remind everyone that questions and answers should go through the Chair rather than directly. Mr. Graydon: Thank you very much for that, Mr. Chairman, and I'll try my best to do that.

Perhaps, then, the minister can explain to me, through the Chair, why its seniors have been misled for three straight years about balancing the budget. Why should anyone be lieve anything that–and especially the seniors believe anything that they're being told today? Ms. Crothers: Mr. Chair, I'm going to tell you how I feel about seniors in Manitoba. Manitoba seniors have helped build this province. They deserve to live with dignity and know that the services they count on are there for them. We have invested much funding into programs that help seniors. We have an Aging in Place strategy.

We are committed to helping seniors stay in their homes longer and giving them options to continue to contribute to the social, civic and economic life of the community which benefits not only them, but the rest of us. We want them to be involved and engaged in their communities. We're investing over $9 million to provide approximately 140 new additional safe, affordable homes for seniors. This builds on our original commitment of more than 500 units that already were delivered over the past five years.

Through a variety of programs we provide support to over 15,500 units of seniors housing across the province, and since we formed government in 1999 we've gone from only 69 supportive housing units for seniors in the whole province under opposition to over 700 today. And that's more than a tenfold increase that this government has provided to seniors compared to the members opposite. And we've done more than that. We have invested in health care. Our long- term-care strategy includes $200 million to build hundreds more personal-care-home beds, which I know the Minister of Health (Ms.

Blady) has talked about as recently as today. We have a new, innovative rehabilitation program to quickly help seniors regain and maintain

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2699 their independence following an injury or surgery, and a new income protection benefit to make sup- portive housing an affordable alternative to a personal-care home for low-income seniors.

We've made additional commitments to help seniors improve their health and stay in their homes longer, including increasing home -care hours for clients who need the extra support, increasing the number of hospital home teams in Winnipeg which include health-care professionals making home visits to seniors in fragile health, expanding home care in Brandon with additional evening and weekend staffing to support seniors who are ready to go home from the hospital seven days per week, and continuing to expand prescription coverage under the Manitoba Pharmacare program, one of the most comprehensive drug programs in Canada.

And, in terms of affordability, we have also increased the Primary Caregiver Tax Credit, which is something that I feel very proud of. I wish more people knew about it. Maybe if some of the members opposite on the other side of the House would be happy to help us share that information with seniors, since they're so interested in providing them services. We also have the Seniors' School Tax Rebate, and I think that, combined with many of the things if not all of the things that I've just outlined, indicates that we're interested in providing supports to s eniors in helping them to enjoy their retirement years.

And while I hear what the MLA here is saying, I cannot speak to his frustration or what he thinks we aren't doing. When I look at the amount of investments and the way we've listened to seniors and communicated with them and contributed and collaborated on a variety of things, I have no concerns at all that I need to convince him of anything, and I think at this point, Mr. Chair, if he still has an issue with it, it will be his own. Mr.

Graydon: Just to set the record straight, when the minister spoke of providing all of these extra PCH beds that have been mentioned now a couple of different times, there's a net of 68 in the last five years. So just for her information, I know that it's not her department, but at the same time, that is public statistical information she might want to keep in the back of her mind. The question, Mr. Chair, is that the government conducted a –has the government conducted a study to analyze the detrimental effects to seniors regarding the recent broadening of the tax base and also the associated hiking of the PST?

How has that affected seniors? Ms. Crothers: If you're asking–sorry–if the MLA is asking if we've done a study, we have not. Mr. Graydon: Could I have the minister repeat that answer? I didn't quite get it. Ms. Crothers: We have not. Mr. Graydon: So the genuine concern, Mr. Chair, that the minister has for seniors is only limited to making announcements, not to find out what's really is an issue for them, what is costing them money, what is hurting them? That's not an issue for the minister. Just to make announcements. That seems to be what it is, then.

So why has the Manitoba government refused to index the age exempt ion on the MB428 since 2003? Ms. Crothers : You know, Mr. Chair, I'm not finished yet. You know, on Caregiver Recognition Day, we announced a 10 per cent increase to the Primary Caregiver Tax Credit for a maximum refundable credit eligibility for up to $4,200 per year. That's over 1,750 primary caregivers that have benefited as of August 2015, and that's something we do keep track of. We have doubled the Seniors' School Tax Rebate this year and senior homeowners can now save up to $1,570 off their propert y taxes.

This means that this year, nearly 24,000 senior households will no longer pay school taxes, and while this MLA may pooh- pooh that number and say that we don't really care about seniors, I think these numbers speak for themselves.

We are committed to eliminating the school tax portion from principal residence property taxes for those ages 65 and over by 2016, and I know a number of seniors in my own community and beyond that I've talked with that are very appreciative of these things, and I know that that is a meaningful thing for them, and it is meaningful for me as a result. * (15:30) We value the great work that seniors before us have done. We are happy to do these things and to continue to work with seniors.

I know I have advisory committees a nd other organizations and folks in the community that frequently give me advice on what they would like to see, and I'm happy to say that we have a very collaborative relationship and that they are key to helping this government

2700 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 invest in these kinds of t hings and develop these kinds of things, frankly. Mr. Graydon: I'm sure that the minister canvassed a lot of seniors, asking them if they wanted the sales tax broadened and, of course, the 14 per cent increase in the PST. I'm sure she canvassed a lot of them to get that type of information. But I –the question I have for the minister, Mr. Chair, is: Why has the Manitoba government refused to index their age exemption clawbacks since 2003 but the federal government has increased their allowance by $6,680 since then? Ms.

Crothers : You know, I have the opportunity, Mr. Chair, to deal with many issues in this depart - ment that have overlap with other departments, such as Housing, for example, and Health, as well as a number of other colleagues, and I frequently discuss the issues that seniors raise with me with those colleagues. So I have certainly had the opportunity to engage in discussions with other ministers on issues that impact both this department and theirs, and that has been very valuable.

So I su ggest that, as those conversations have taken place, that the MLA might wish to pursue that line of questioning with the Department of Finance in the Committee of Supply, and he might be able to get a specific response, based on information that I've sh ared with the Minister of Finance (Mr. Dewar), that will satisfy him. Mr. Graydon: That's about the best non-answer I've had all day. Would the minister agree that most of the patients or clients in the personal -care home are seniors? Ms.

Crothers : Yes, in personal -care homes the majority of folks that are in personal -care homes are seniors, but not all are. There are some individuals that might be in a personal -care home for other reasons, such as acquired brain injury, or maybe they've suffered some kind of catastrophic injury. So there are others that might be in a personal -home along with seniors. Mr. Graydon: The–I thank the minister for the answer because she's quite right, but the majority of the patients, clients, people in the PCHs are seniors and I think we can all agree that there is quite a waiting list for them as well.

But, as the minister pointed before, she was quick to point out that, oh, well, we've done this and we've done that and we've done this, but since the amalgamation of the RH As what we've noticed and seen is that not only are the residents, the seniors in Manitoba, been burdened with the broadening of the taxes, the raising of the PST by 14 per cent, but now they're burdened for user fees or rentals for essential equipment in the PCHs where they weren't charged for these items in the past. Can the minister explain why there's a user fee now? Ms. Crothers: I'd like some more clarity.

Can you provide a specific example? Mr. Graydon: I'm sorry, Mr. Chair, I just get so excited sometimes I forget myself. But one of them would be a lift sling. * (15:40) Ms. Crothers : Yes, so if there is a device or a product that's provided by a personal -care home, but a client has asked for a different brand, for example, the department is aw are that there have been examples of a personal -care home requesting that a client pay for that product if it's different than the one that's offered in the personal-care home.

However, if there is a specific casework or a concern that the family has, we' d be happy to look into it. Mr. Graydon: I would say to the minister that there has been some and they have been brought forward in the past, and the equipment was recommended by the physician to be changed in order to deal with the individuals. The relat ives were not only asked but forced to pay the additional costs. That didn't happen in the past, and so I would be happy to provide it again for the minister's department. It has been provided in the past.

However, going forward, does the government have any plans to institute a home renovation tax credit for retrofit catering to seniors' suites? Ms. Crothers: I am aware that there is a program in Housing to retrofit granny suites; however, I think that the question that's being asked is one that would be appropriate to raise with the correct department, which is Finance. Mr.

Graydon: And then, perhaps, the minister can explain to me the program, because she thought that I should be promoting a program that I haven't heard of about seniors and I don't know whether that's family care or –what was your terminology for the

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2701 program that I haven't heard of, so perhaps there's lots of people in the province that haven't heard of it either. Ms. Crothers: Well, I'm really happy that the MLA raised this again, because I think that the point that I was attempting to make was that we have many great programs in this province –many great programs in this province–that help seniors, and I'm not sure that all the MLAs in th e Legislature are keen to share some of the good programs that we have in place that will benefit their seniors.

In fact, I know –quite recently I went to a assisted living establishment and had a fantastic –I was invited by some seniors that lived there, and I had an excellent meeting with them. I sat with them for about an hour and a half, about 12 folks from Portsmouth living establishment.

And when we were discussing some of their concerns, I was happy to show them that we had programs in place that re sponded to many of the concerns that they have, and very surprisingly, one of them volunteered that they had talked to their MLA, asking for some advice and some guidance on where they could find information, and the MLA from that area responded that there was really nothing.

And so I asked if they had seen the Seniors' Guide and they had not seen the Seniors' Guide and I'm quite sure that every member of our Chamber has seen the Seniors' Guide, because I know my predecessor has talked about it in great detail. And, as they were surprised that their MLA didn't point them in that direction, I made sure that the very next day we had 30 copies hand delivered to that establishment and made sure that not only did each of the people I met with could have one, but I made sure that there were enough for them to share with other members of Portsmouth.

So, when I referenced earlier having programs in place that would be nice for this MLA and others to share, I think it's important to remember that we're here for all Manitobans and, in this case, we have information that would be very beneficial for seniors who sometimes don't have an interest or a comfort level to go on the internet and google something to see if it's available for them, which is why we print hard copies of the Seniors' Guide to make sure that they have access to not only the programs, but a toll-free number that they can call and get some guidance and help on.

I don't know about this MLA or any others on the other side of the House, but I do know that when someone comes to me and asks for help, I make sure I look into what we have available for them, because the most important thing is helping Manitobans. It's not important whether they are a supporter of mine, and it's certainly not important for me to get some kind of one -upmanship on a political party and deny people access to information that would actually benefit their lives. Mr. Graydon: Now, if the minister could answer the question.

The program that she specifically referred to–would be nice to have that answer. Ms. Crothers: Well, since I didn't just mention one, I mentioned many, I'll tell them to you all again because I think, clearly, you didn't hear it the first time. So we have, in terms of Aging in Place, we are investing over $9 mill ion to provide approximately 140 new, additional, safe, affordable homes for seniors. This builds on our original commitment of more than 500 units already delivered over the past five years.

Through a variety of programs, we provide supports to over 15,500 units of seniors housing across the province, and I'd be happy to get the Minister of Housing to provide that information to this MLA if he's not sure what those programs are. And we have increased supportive housing units for seniors in our time in government dramatically, more than tenfold from their 69 to our 700. As well, in terms of our long -term health -care strategy, we are investing $200 million to build more personal-care-home beds and facilities.

We have a new innovation –innovative rehabili- tation program to help seniors regain and maintain their independence following an injury or a surgery. We have a new income -protection benefit to make supportive housing an affordable alternative to a personal-care home for low-income seniors. We have increased homecare hours for clients; that's a good thing to be able to share with your constituents if they are in need of that.

We've increased the number of hospital home teams, and that includes health -care professionals making home visits to seniors who are in fragile health, and we continue to expand prescription coverage under the Manitoba Pharmacare program. As well, in case he didn't catch it the first time, the Primary Caregiver Tax Credit was increased, and we've doubled the senior school tax rebate.

2702 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 * (15:50) Now, if there's anything specific that he feels he hasn't received, I'd be happy to share that with him, and I can even put it on paper if that would make it any easier. Thank you. Mr. Graydon: We will have a specific question for her as we go forward, Mr. Chair, and it may not be today, but she'll like it. Does the government have any plans to place –in place to begin publicly funding, subsidizing, insulin pumps for all Manitobans? Ms.

Crothers : We do currently provide insulin pumps for children, and there are tax credits available for medical expenses, and at this point that is what we have in place. Mr. Graydon: Why has the rural Mobility Disadvantaged Transportation Program service not seen a funding increase since the inception in 2001? Ms. Crothers: So this department provides funding to something called Transportation Options Network for Seniors, or TONS, and that funding is meant to be–it's a grant for municipalities.

It's meant for municipalities so that they can plan their t rans- portation in their local area and they would work with stakeholders. So that funding is to help them with planning in terms of the specific company that the MLA stated. I can do some follow -up with the minister responsible for funding for those types of organizations. It's probably through municipalities, and I'm happy to share that information with the minister. * (16:00) Mr. Graydon: And I would appreciate if she woul d share the results of her conversation with me going forward.

At the same time I think the minister and I both agree that seniors –a lot of people volunteer to work with seniors, and that's great. The seniors appreciate that; they need a lot of volunteer s. They certainly cut the costs of health care, for certain, in all departments when people that are capable of helping do help and step up to the plate to do that. And it keeps some of the seniors that are active–it keeps them active and healthy, as well.

I'm wondering why the criminal record checks and vulnerable persons checks, essential documents required to promote volunteerism, are prohibitively expensive in the city of Winnipeg relative to the RCMP checks in rural communities. Has the govern- ment looked into addressing this discrepancy? Has the minister, in her department, looked into addressing that discrepancy? Ms. Crothers : This is something that I would be happy to look into with the Minister of Justice (Mr. Mackintosh) and to ask this questi on, and also to seek advice from the Minister of Justice , and then I'd be happy to circle back with the MLA.

Mr. Graydon: If I could give the minister some advice, I would ask her to mention to the Minister of Justice that it would be better to come down instead of go up in costs. It would be beneficial to her department; it would be beneficial to the health -care system and very, very beneficial to the seniors. My question–next question is how many calls did the seniors abuse helpline respond to over the last year. Ms. Crothers: Okay, so calls to the Seniors Abuse Support Line, this is between the dates of April 1st, 2014, and March 31st of 2015: 666 calls.

There's also the A & O support services for older adults elder abuse services line, and between t hose same dates they have 815 clients. Mr. Graydon: We've heard the minister claim that she is and her government have been very age friendly, and with these types of numbers of calls I'm quite sure that she's aware that there's a number of abuses that go unreported. We hear them as we tour a lot of the seniors' facilities, people say, well, what's the point or who do I trust.

And it's –I know in the seniors facility that my mother was in there was a number of thefts that went on, and finally a lady had lo st a brand new dress and it showed up at lunch the next day on another body. And they returned a ring the next day that belonged to my great -grandmother that was taken from my mother's suite. It was never reported, because what's the point, my mom said; wh y should I, because they aren't going to do anything anyway. And it took over a year for this to take place.

So we know that there's lots of unreported different types of abuse, and it prompted me to bring in a bill, Bill 205, the seniors rights act, and it was voted against by this minister and her government. How can she claim to be age friendly when there's so

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2703 many reported cases and many, many more that aren't reported? * (16:10) Ms. Crothers : Absolutely any Manitoban that's experiencing physical, psy chological or financial abuse is something that we want to end, and we certainly want to encourage all Manitobans to be kind to our seniors.

But often, as the member indicated, when older Manitobans experience abuse, they don't talk about it because they c ould be afraid or embarrassed or they don't know where to go for help, and we certainly want to make sure that they're as well supported as possible and removed from abusive situations or find ways to end that abuse. In 2002 we established a comprehensiv e Provincial Elder Abuse Strategy and it helps support the Senior's Abuse Support Line which we've discussed already. We also have the Safe Suite Program, which provides emergency accommo - dations to older adults who are experiencing abuse.

We have Prevent Elder Abuse Manitoba, a provincial network that promotes information and awareness on how to prevent elder abuse, and it also helps us get the word out about where you can go and what number you can call to seek help if you yourself, as a senior, are experiencing abuse or if you have family members who are concerned that abuse is taking place. An A & O: Support Services for Older Adults that my department works with to provide elder abuse counselling services is another agency I'm happy to partner with.

Now, when we came into office we took action to make personal -care homes safer, and that's why we created the Protection for Persons in Care Office in 2001 and in 2005 put in place rigorous PCH standards to address the kinds of issues that the member has raised here. And we've also added over 1,000 PCH and supportive housing beds and have hundreds more in development right now to ensure our loved ones can age safely and closer to home, and we have hired hundreds more nurses and health- care aides to our personal -care homes to ensure that each resident gets more dedicated staff time.

Each and every PCH is visited every two years to be inspected against standards that include infection control and ensuring a safe and secure resident environment. We introduced unannounced inspections in 2004 and have since increased the frequency of these visits. Should a facility not meet a standard, they are required to develop an action plan within 60 days a nd implement it within another 60 days.

So we're committed to ensuring that the Protection for Persons in Care Office operates as intended to independently investigate any allegations of any kind of abuse of a person in care, be they between residents, involving family members or staff in any designated health facility.

So, in light of the example that the member has provided, I would say that if that situation wasn't resolved satisfactorily it should be brought to the attention of the minister responsible for PCHs or to me, as he has, and I'd be happy to share that with that department and that minister to follow up, because we want to make sure that our seniors, wherever they live, feel that if there is something that is making them uncomfortable or if t here is someone that's hurting them that we address it quickly and make sure that they can move on to enjoy the rest of their retirement years. Mr.

Graydon: Well, I thank the minister for that. There are a number of things that –making seniors uncomforta ble, and one of them was the broadening of the PST, the other was the raising of the PST. And it's nice to know that the minister is willing to address that going forward and I hope that she is–has good luck doing that and perhaps she can have something change very quickly. I would ask the minister, how many communities in Manitoba are now considered to be age-friendly? Ms. Crothers: One–over 100. Mr.

Graydon: Could the minister provide me with a list of them, not today, but going forward could she provide me with a list of those? Ms. Crothers: I'd be happy to. Mr. Graydon: Mr. Chairman, the –one of the big issues that we hear–and I've heard it from my family members, but also heard it from many members in seniors housing and especially in support of –and supportive living or assisted living facilities –but not necessarily just that.

But in the southeast after the amalgamation of the RHAs the south central and the south east RHA the ambulance fees rose dramatically, and what I'm hearing from a number of seniors is when there's an issue don't call an ambulance–don't call an ambulance, I can't afford it. I don't have the money, don't call them. That isn't

2704 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 helpful for seniors at all, ever, the stress that they can't afford this. So what is the minister doin g to combat that rising ambulance fee? Mr. Matt Wiebe, Acting Chairperson, in the Chair * (16:20) Ms. Crothers: Yes, I want to thank the member for raising this. This is something that concerns me as well, and I'm sure I'm not alone.

But I do want to hi ghlight that the provincial Manitoba EMS system report was released to the public in April 2013, and the purpose of the report was to examine emergency medical services system in Manitoba and develop recommendations for prehospital patient care and interfacility transport system that is integrated, responsive, reliable, equitable and sustainable for Manitobans. And we know that when you look at emergency services across the province, it becomes quite complex because depending on where this –the service is provided, it's provided by different groups.

So, for example, in the city of Winnipeg, it's the City that provides ambulatory services. In other areas, it's some RHAs. We know that there are some First Nations groups that have their own ambulatory service. So, if we're looking at implementing the recommendations, then we are changing and working with a variety of groups to change the fees. So the EMS report provided 54 recommen - dations which were accepted by then -minister of Health Theresa Oswald, and in June of 2013 a provincial EMS task force was struck, achieving the first recommendation of the EMS report, which was to do that.

And the review task force is chaired by the ADM, regional policy and programs, and membership includes the executive director, health emergency management; director of EMS branch; Manitoba Health comptroller; CEO, Prairie Mountain Health; associate EMS medical director; director, Medical Transportation Co- ordination Centre; Red River College; paramedic, northern RHA; paramedic, Winnipeg Fire Paramedic Service; rural EMS manager representative; and a Winnipeg RHA representative.

And of the 54 recommendations, implementation has been completed for 20 of those, 23 are in process and 11 have proposals either in the planning phase or approved but haven't been implemented. But I know that fees certainly was one of these recommendations that we will be moving on. The Acting Chairperson (Matt Wiebe): Before I recognize the member for Emerson (Mr. Graydon), just like to remind all members that when referring to other members of the Assembly, refer them –to them by their constituency name or portfolio. Mr.

Graydon: I thank the minister for acknow - ledging that the fees are all over the board and what– but people are being overcharged for them, there's no question about that. I look forward to her addressing that in the near future. Mr. Chairperson in the Chair I mean, after all, the seniors have–they have paid in advance with the broadening of the PST and the raising of the PST. They have –and not having the education tax rebate done as it was supposed to be done; it's only been done partially.

But I–moving on, I'd–the question I have for the minister is: There was an Alzheimer's framework that was put forward, a wonderful document. We on this side of the House agree that this document was one of the greatest documents that we have seen in a long time, and we wonder why the government fails so dismally to implement it. And what's the government's response to achieving a scathing grade on t he report card provided on behalf of the Alzheimer Society of Manitoba? * (16:30) Ms. Crothers : I would like to thank the member from Emerson for raising the –this Alzheimer's framework.

In Manitoba Health, Healthy Living and Seniors in partnership with Winnipeg Regional Health Authority and in consultation with various stakeholders, including the Alzheimer's Society of Manitoba, we developed the renewed strategy entitled, Manitoba's Framework for Alzheimer's Disease and Other Dementias which the member just referenced.

The framework is reflective of other existing provincial initiatives and will serve as a roadmap over the next five years to guide Manitoba's health system planning and investment to improve care and support for Manitobans with Alzheimer's disease and other dementias in their families. So the framework was released publically on June 13th, 2014, which was only last year, and it is a five -year plan. So we

October 29, 2015 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2705 are implementing things over the five years that the plan indicates; we'll be implementing them. And the framework outlines recommendations in five key areas that follow the responses to dementia, that people would experience in their dementia journey including raising awareness and understanding, early recognition, initial assessment and diagnosis, management, care and support, end-of-life care, and research and evaluation.

A number of opportunities for improvements in care and services for those affected by dementia have been identified through a collaborative process and validated throu gh focused consultations with care - givers and service providers. Excuse me. Healthy Living and Seniors will continue to work with the establish framework development and implemen - tation advisory committee to prioritize initiatives for implementation.

The framework also builds on investments made to provide information, education and supports to people and families affected by Alzheimer's disease or related dementia, and that includes training for people that are working in personal -care homes and other facilities. The Province has provided more than $630,000 over three years to the ASM to support the delivery of the First Link program.

After three years, an evaluation of the program was conducted and showed positive results which demonstrates evidence that the program is valuable and making a difference in the lives of those with dementia and for their caregivers. As a result, Manitoba Health, Healthy Living and Seniors has confirmed ongoing funding to support the program beyond 2015- 16. Five hundred and nineteen referrals to the program were received in 2014- 15, and this program links individuals and families with services and support as soon as possible after diagnosis.

Formal referral by physicians and health professionals allows for proactive support fr om ASM to help the family better cope with its situation. Supports available include information, support groups, education sessions and referral to other health resources as needed. While physicians and health- care providers can make referrals via First L ink, individuals and their families can also contact ASM directly for assistance. Since 2008, the government of Manitoba has supported the implementation of a comprehensive dementia-care education program.

The P.I.E.C.E.S. training program has been the pr eferred method of engaging PCH staff in dementia -care education. The program has been delivered through a partnership between the WRHA and the ASM. In 2011, the Province announced expansion of the P.I.E.C.E.S. dementia education to include workers in other care sectors, such as the home -care program. However, excuse me, prior to investing in expansion of the program, it was deemed necessary to conduct an assessment of its impact and effectiveness. I'm sorry, excuse me. I'm not done. Sorry. Overall, P.I.E.C.E.S. has been well received by participants.

Thank you very much. Manitoba Health, Healthy Living and Seniors continues to work with various stakeholders through the frameworks DIAC, the Continuing Care council and directly with the regional health author ities to problem solve around the delivery of dementia education. We are collaborating with stakeholders – thank you so much–to develop an approach that can reach a greater number of staff in a cost -effective, sustainable manner for the entire province.

The approach still continues to use P.I.E.C.E.S. training along with other methods and tools; funds have flowed to the RHAs to develop educational models that work best for them. Manitoba's been recognized as a leader in respect to its support of caregivers. Manitoba's Primary Caregiver Tax Credit provides a refundable credit of up to $1,400 a year to people who act as primary caregivers for spouses, relatives, neighbours or friends who live at home. Additionally, The Caregiver Recognition Act was proclaimed in 2011 with overall purpose to develop a framework to support caregivers.

Since its proclamation, the act has led to increased awareness and recognition of the needs of caregivers, the establishment of a caregiver advisory council, the development of an inter - departmental working group, the creation of a minister's report, and the completion of consultation on caregivers' needs. Advancing Continuing Care: A Blueprint to Suppor t System Change also includes many dementia-care-related initiatives. And I just would like to remind the member that this is a five -year plan and we're only in the first year.

We have worked with the Alzheimer Society of Manitoba in developing this plan and I'm sure that they would understand, as well, that as we continue to implement the recommendations from the framework, that it is going to take time to implement them, but we will get there.

2706 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 29, 2015 Mr. Graydon: I just want to respond to the minister and thank her very much for not answering the question, and she can explain that to the Alzheimer Society that she has got more five -year plans than anybody else. But thank her very much for participating today, and I'll turn it over to my colleague. Mr. Chairperson: Well, I have to give the minister an opportunity to respond if she would like. Ms. Crothers: There's no need. Mr. Chairperson: Okay. Mr. Kelvin Goertzen (Steinbach): We're ready to move to the appropriations on this department, Mr. Chairperson.

Mr. Chairperson: Very good. Hearing no further questions, we will now proceed to consideration of the resolutions relevant to this department. Resolution 21.2: RESOLVED that there be granted to Her Majesty a sum not exceeding $34,050,000 for Health, Healthy Living and Seniors, Provincial Policy and Programs, for the fiscal year ending March 31st, 2016. Resolution agreed to. Resolution 21.3: RESOLVED that there be granted to Her Majesty a sum not exceeding

Document details

Collection	Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	40-4-74b
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	40th 4th hansardpdf 74b.pdf
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	1b8b9630e65c6952a80f1996ed42b2778e98d860

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