Fifth Session, 41st Parliament

(2020) OFFICIAL REPORT

OF DEBATES

(HANSARD)

Monday, March 23, 2020

Afternoon Sitting

Issue No. 326

ISSN 1499-2175

The HTML transcript is provided for informational purposes only.

The PDF transcript remains the official digital version.

CONTENTS

Routine Business

Motions Without Notice

Members may speak and vote from seat other than assigned place

Change to adjournment order

Changes to routine business

Hon. M. Farnworth

Ministerial Statements

Coronavirus outbreak and response

Hon. J. Horgan

M. de Jong

A. Olsen

Oral Questions

Government projections for coronavirus outbreak and response

M. de Jong

Hon. A. Dix

Testing for coronavirus

M. de Jong

Hon. A. Dix

Maintenance of supply chain during coronavirus outbreak

J. Johal

Hon. M. Farnworth

Economic support for individuals and businesses during outbreak

J. Johal

Hon. J. Horgan

Access to handwashing facilities for homeless persons

S. Furstenau

Hon. A. Dix

Domestic violence services during coronavirus outbreak

S. Furstenau

Hon. C. James

Support to rural communities during coronavirus outbreak

A. Olsen

Hon. A. Dix

Reports from Committees

Auditor General Appointment Committee, March

M. Dean

M. de Jong

Motions Without Notice

Appointment of Auditor General

M. Dean

Orders of the Day

Presentation of Estimates

Supplementary estimates for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2021

Committee of Supply

Supplementary Estimates: Other appropriations

Hon. C. James

J. Johal

S. Furstenau

A. Olsen

Supply Motions

Reports of resolutions from Committee of Supply

Funds granted for public service

Hon. C. James

Introduction and First Reading of Bills

Bill 15 — Supply Act (No. 2), 2020

Hon. C. James

Second Reading of Bills

Bill 15 — Supply Act (No. 2), 2020

Hon. C. James

M. de Jong

A. Olsen

S. Furstenau

Hon. C. James

Committee of the Whole House

Bill 15 — Supply Act (No. 2), 2020

Report and Third Reading of Bills

Bill 15 — Supply Act (No. 2), 2020

Motions Without Notice

Withdrawal of Bill 12

Hon. C. James

Introduction and First Reading of Bills

Bill 16 — Employment Standards Amendment Act (No. 2), 2020

Hon. M. Farnworth

Second Reading of Bills

Bill 16 — Employment Standards Amendment Act (No. 2), 2020

Hon. M. Farnworth

M. de Jong

S. Furstenau

Hon. M. Farnworth

Committee of the Whole House

Bill 16 — Employment Standards Amendment Act (No. 2), 2020

S. Furstenau

Hon. M. Farnworth

Report and Third Reading of Bills

Bill 16 — Employment Standards Amendment Act (No. 2), 2020

Royal Assent to Bills

Bill 16 — Employment Standards Amendment Act (No. 2), 2020

Bill 15 — Supply Act (No. 2), 2020

MONDAY, MARCH 23, 2020

The House met at 1:31 p.m.

Clerk of the Legislative Assembly: Hon. Members, pursuant to Standing Order 12, the House is advised of the

unavoidable absence of the Speaker and Deputy Speaker. Consequently, the Deputy

Chair, Committee of the Whole, will take the chair.

[S. Chandra Herbert in the chair.]

Deputy Speaker: Thank you, hon. Members. I just want to, first off, acknowledge we’re on

the official territories of the

Lək̓ʷəŋin̓əŋ-speaking people and thank them

for having us here on their territories.

I would also like to acknowledge and thank all members and the staff of

this place for making today’s sitting possible during this extraordinary

time.

I honour and thank everyone in British Columbia for doing their

part.

Routine Business

Prayers and reflections: S. Malcolmson.

Motions Without Notice

MEMBERS MAY SPEAK AND VOTE

FROM SEAT OTHER THAN

ASSIGNED PLACE

Hon. M. Farnworth: Before I move the motion, I just want to acknowledge that today’s

proceedings are unique, probably unique in the history of this chamber

and this province, and they reflect the seriousness of the circumstances

in which we find ourselves not just here in the province but across the

country. It’s taking place with the agreement and the cooperation of all

caucuses represented here in this place.

By leave, I move:

[That, notwithstanding Standing Order 36 and Standing Order 37,

Members be permitted to speak and vote from a seat other than their

assigned place for today’s sitting.]

Leave granted.

Motion approved.

CHANGE TO ADJOURNMENT ORDER

Hon. M. Farnworth: By leave, I move:

[That the order of adjournment of the House of March 5, 2020 be

rescinded, and that the House be deemed to have been adjourned until

1:30 p.m. on Monday, March 23, 2020.]

Leave granted.

Motion approved.

[1:35 p.m.]

CHANGES TO ROUTINE BUSINESS

Hon. M. Farnworth: We will now proceed to a ministerial statement led by the hon.

Premier, and following that, by agreement amongst all the House Leaders,

we will have an abbreviated question period.

With that, by leave, I move that notwithstanding Standing Order

25, the daily routine of business for today’s sitting be comprised of

oral question period and presenting of reports by committees only and

that notwithstanding Standing Order — God, that’s a tongue twister — and

Standing Order 47A, the proceeding of Oral Question Period be limited to

one question with one supplemental question from each opposition caucus

member.

[That, notwithstanding Standing Order 25, the daily routine of

business for today’s sitting be comprised of Oral Question Period and

Presenting Reports by Committees only, and

That, notwithstanding Standing Order 25 and Standing Order 47A, the

proceeding of Oral Question Period be limited to one question with one

supplemental question from each opposition caucus.]

Leave granted.

Motion approved.

Ministerial Statements

CORONAVIRUS OUTBREAK AND RESPONSE

Hon. J. Horgan: I thank my colleagues for joining us here in what could only be

described as an extraordinary sitting of the B.C.

Legislature.

I want to, at the outset, offer my deepest condolences to the

families of 13 British Columbians who have passed away since the arrival

of COVID-19, the first case being identified just 41 days ago here in

British Columbia.

When we think of what our lives were like six weeks ago, it’s hard

to imagine how far we have come as a society, how far we have come as a

community, as we’ve tried to grapple with a pandemic that is gripping

not just British Columbia, not just Canada, not just North America but

indeed the world.

It’s humbling to think that the 12 of us here today, representing

different political perspectives from around British Columbia, have

arrived to do something that I can’t recall, in my time as a member of

this place, coming on 15 years — nor as a student of history, going back

over the many, many decades, a century and a half of Canada’s existence

— where British Columbians have had their elected representatives meet

on such a dark and troubling occasion to talk about how we come out of

that darkness better off for the effort — better off because of the

cooperation; better off because of the spirit that I believe is in all

of us as British Columbians and Canadians, focused on helping each

other, being kind and being mindful that our actions are

important.

I’ve heard over the past six weeks, as we’ve seen health care

workers do over 21,000 tests for COVID-19, as the virus has swept around

the world…. British Columbians started early, and I give full credit to

the provincial health office, led by Dr. Bonnie Henry, and my colleague

from Vancouver-Kingsway, the Minister of Health, for putting us on the

right footing as we take on this significant challenge.

This challenge is one in which we are armed with a few tools. All

of us are armed with these tools. Dr. Henry has been reminding us daily,

for now many weeks: those tools are simple. Wash your hands frequently,

create physical distance between your colleagues here in the

Legislature; create physical distance between yourself and fellow

citizens; and if you are ill, self-isolate; if you’ve come from

somewhere else in the past number of days, self-isolate for 14 days.

These tools are available to all of us, and these tools must be used by

all of us if we’re going to flatten the curve to ensure that we are not

inundated in our acute care system by those who are afflicted by this

disease, this virus.

As British Columbians and as legislators, we know that this is an

extraordinary time. I want to thank the Leader of the Opposition, the

Opposition House Leader, members of the Green Party, members of the

Liberal Party, who have been overwhelmingly supportive of initiatives

that we’ve brought forward, briefings that are unusual in any normal

legislative session. To have members from both sides of the House

talking and working on solutions, taking advantage of the experience in

the opposition benches — many, many cabinet ministers who understand the

administrative challenges of running a department in normal

circumstances, fully understanding how running those departments in

extraordinary circumstance requires criticism, to be sure, if we

misstep, but criticism that’s focused on better outcomes

always.

The absence of partisanship I think all British Columbians should

celebrate. At this unique time, partisanship has left the building.

People are here to work together with one singular focus. That’s the

health and well-being of all British Columbians.

[1:40 p.m.]

I want to say, as we begin a debate about supply for $5 billion….

The Minister of Finance will be laying that out. Briefings have been

provided to all opposition members. I think the debate will be quick,

but the debate will take place.

I think it’s also important to remind British Columbians that this

is not something that’s being pushed through without consultation. It’s

not something that is not based and grounded on the science that we’ve

been provided by public health officials working in concert — working

with the private sector, working with not-for-profits, working with our

extraordinary public officials here in British Columbia and, indeed,

across the country.

I don’t know…. There’s a former Finance Minister here today. I

don’t believe that at any time has the Minister of Finance in British

Columbia given a briefing to the Minister of Finance in Alberta about

where we’re going, in the interest and hope that coming together will

get a better outcome for both jurisdictions.

These are signals and symbols to the community, signals and

symbols to British Columbians that we are indeed all in this together —

British Columbians, Albertans, Maritimers, Quebecers. All of us are in

this together as Canadians fighting the good fight, focused on making

sure that those that are so critical to our success, health care

workers, have the supports that they need.

That means we have to make sure that the truckers and the people

working at the ports and the people stocking the shelves in our grocery

stores…. They are all so critically important to the success of our

health care system, critically important to the well-being of all

British Columbians. Utility workers, child care workers caring for the

children of health care providers — that’s what we need to focus on.

That’s what we are focusing on.

I’m absolutely proud of the members of this Legislature who have

come with one voice today to debate and discuss a package that will

provide relief to citizens, provide relief to businesses — and, also,

legislation that will protect workers. We’ve done that in an

extraordinary way, in extraordinary circumstances.

With that, I cede the floor to the members on the other side.

Again, it’s with eternal thanks and gratitude to all British Columbians

that as we create the systems that will take us forward, you give us

your patience, you give us our well-being, and together we’ll come

through this stronger than when we went into it.

M. de Jong: I, too, would like to join with the Premier on behalf of my

colleagues in the opposition and extend condolences to the families of

those who have already succumbed to this virus, this COVID-19. It is a

difficult time for those families and others who have been

afflicted.

The Premier correctly pointed out that it’s an unprecedented time,

and like many public buildings in British Columbia, the halls and

corridors that connect the various parts of this Legislature building

are darkened and quiet.

I was thinking of that quaint tradition we have here where

government and opposition are seated two sword-lengths apart, because on

this day, when all of our citizens are being asked to abide by similar

social distancing, it is important that British Columbians know that the

institution of parliament is functioning cooperatively and

collaboratively to ensure that everything possible is being done to

protect the health and safety of our citizens.

To that end, a brief word about the members who cannot be here but

would like to be here. They, like many British Columbians, want to be at

their posts, but they recognize the need to abide by the advice and

directives of our public health officials. MLAs on all sides of this

House are continuing to discharge their duties and responsibilities to

constituents to the best of their abilities and in the safest way

possible through these difficult days.

If I might also offer a word of thanks from the opposition, from

the Leader of the Opposition to the government for the efforts that have

been made to maintain effective communications and information

exchanges. I believe and hope the regular exchanges between the Minister

of Health and the member for Kelowna–Lake Country, on behalf of the

official opposition, have been mutually beneficial in a variety of ways,

and I know this will continue.

[1:45 p.m.]

Of course, a larger word of thanks to the thousands of front-line

health care workers and care providers who are doing everything humanly

possible to keep people safe. Notwithstanding the concerns they would

naturally feel for the safety of their own families, they are at their

posts each day, demonstrating their sense of duty and professionalism.

We thank them all.

These are, to be sure, worrisome and uncertain times. I see the

lines of worry, concern and fatigue etched on the faces of Premiers and

ministers and public health officers. The worry on their faces mirrors

the worry on the faces of parents, who are concerned about who will look

after the kids or the interruption to their education, or are concerned

about grandparents, who are amongst the most vulnerable, the

elderly.

The worry and the concern on the faces of employees who wonder

what will happen when that paycheque doesn’t arrive and the rent or the

mortgage payment is looming. Employers who have seen business and orders

dry up overnight, who are obliged to lay off staff for lack of work and

are not sure if the business will be around to welcome them back when we

eventually emerge out the other side of this. Tourism operators who are

suffering the effects of a world where travel has come to a standstill.

Food banks and other social agencies whose desperate attempts to support

our most vulnerable citizens are now so severely compromised.

In the difficult days ahead, no single segment of our society can

be asked to bear a disproportionate share of the burden, although some,

like our health care workers, have already done so.

In the economic dislocation that will follow in the wake of this

health crisis, employee and employer will require support, because an

employee without an employer is as helpless and vulnerable as an

employer without an employee.

From time to time in this place, we communicate the exploits of

previous generations who overcame adversity. This year we’ll honour the

sacrifices made 75 years ago by those who purged the world of an evil

virus called Nazism.

Today we are facing a different threat — an invisible, silent

invasion that randomly seeks its victims and at­tempts to enlist

each one of us as an unwitting collaborator in its infectious spread.

Today I believe we can honour the legacy of our parents, grandparents

and great-grandparents by demonstrating that we, too, possess the

strength, the fortitude and the discipline to successfully guide our

society through the challenge.

As someone once said, let us each brace ourselves to our duty.

Armed with the advice and the guidance of Dr. Henry and our public

health experts, let us all commit to the social behaviour that will

minimize the risks of transmission to the greatest extent possible.

While we’re washing our hands, social distancing and isolating

voluntarily, let us take comfort in the knowledge that all over the

world the brightest scientific minds are developing additional tools to

combat this menace we know as COVID-19.

Let us be kind. Let us be understanding of the anxieties many are

experiencing. Let us use the myriad technologies now available to us to

reach out to those for whom uncertainty and loneliness can overwhelm.

Let us forthrightly acknowledge the magnitude of the impact this will

have on the economic life of our province and our nation and accept that

it will take a herculean effort on all our parts to overcome that

dislocation.

Finally, on a day when phrases like hand in hand and arm in arm

seem strangely inappropriate, let us remember this. We are so much

stronger and so much better when we are working together.

A. Olsen: I’d like to thank the Premier and the member for Abbotsford West

for their words today.

On behalf of the B.C. Green caucus, I share our condo­lences

to the families who have lost a loved one to COVID-19.

[1:50 p.m.]

This is an unparalleled time in our local, provincial, national

and global communities. The depth of the disruption is unprecedented. As

each and every day passes, British Columbians are reaching out,

expressing their concerns and fears and sharing how this crisis is

impacting them.

Thank you to the health officials — Dr. Bonnie Henry, Minister

Adrian Dix and their staff — for their exemplary work making difficult

decisions under extraordinary circumstances.

Thank you to all the health care workers dedicated to caring for

those who are sick.

Thank you all the front-line service workers who continue to

deliver services to British Columbians who are needing to survive

ongoing isolation.

Thank you to British Columbians who have found creative ways to

support their neighbours and connect with each other to help each other

through this really difficult time.

We are still in a public health emergency, and we’re

com­mitted to working collaboratively with our colleagues, all the

members of this House, to ensure British Columbians get the support they

need as soon as possible.

As we get through this crisis, the B.C. Green caucus looks to

continue with a collaborative approach to the medium- and long-term

recovery of individuals and our business community to ensure that

British Columbia comes out of this stronger, more resilient and more

sustainable.

To all British Columbians, your health and well-being are a top

priority for us. Please continue to follow the advice of our health

professionals: wash your hands, self-isolate, and maintain safe physical

distance.

Much love to you all.

HÍSW̱ḴE

SIÁM.

Oral Questions

GOVERNMENT PROJECTIONS FOR

CORONAVIRUS OUTBREAK AND

RESPONSE

M. de Jong: Well, it will be a question period unlike any other, I expect. I

wasn’t certain the Health Minister was going to be in attendance. I am

pleased that he is. My question may be better offered to the Health

Minister.

In contemplating the nature of the questions to put to the

government today, I thought: “What are the questions that most people

are asking?” This is the forum that the government can perhaps offer

additional insight and enlightenment.

I thought of two, and the first one is this. Whether it’s the

Premier or the Health Minister, what is the trajectory? Where are we

going to be a week from now, a month from now?

I ask that recognizing that those are questions that experts the

world over have grappled with. But to the extent that the minister, the

Premier and members of the government are receiving up-to-the-minute

advice from experts, I’m sure British Columbians are interested in any

insight that can be offered about the trajectory we’re on and the

circumstances that we will be confronted by a week and a month from

now.

Hon. A. Dix: First of all, I wanted to express my appreciation to the member

from Cowichan and the member for Kelowna–Lake Country. They’re not only

colleagues in the Legislature; they’re important advisers of our joint

effort to address this situation. I want to express that appreciation

here.

I think sometimes it’s important to hear what we say, and

sometimes it’s important to hear what we do. In the last two weeks,

we’ve created 3,632 empty acute care hospital beds in British Columbia.

Generally speaking, this time of year, in flu season, we run at well

over 100 percent capacity. You can understand from that that we are

preparing for a much more serious situation in our acute care sector and

in the health of British Columbians. That makes it very

clear.

We are actively modelling on these questions of what people can

expect. In fact, those models guide these sorts of decisions — some of

the most difficult that I’ve ever been involved in and would ever be

involved in, and that’s true of everyone else in the health care system.

But that tells you what we’re facing in front of us, I think.

We’re going to be sharing those models, because we have taken the

view — it’s the reason there are briefings every single day — that

people need to know what we know. In the next week, some of those

models, the models that are guiding our approach to this issue, will be

shared and briefed with the members of the opposition parties, with

members on the government side of course, through­out the public

health care system and with British Columbians so that they’ll have

specific information.

[1:55 p.m.]

But I’ll say this. I don’t have any expectation of any relief from

the extraordinary measures that the provincial health officer has

imposed on British Columbians and the measures that we have to 100

percent comply with now to, as people say, bend the curve. But to ensure

that our resources are sufficient to manage the situation in British

Columbia, I don’t see any prospect before the end of April of those

orders changing.

TESTING FOR CORONAVIRUS

M. de Jong: Thank you to the minister. The second area, and I’m sure members

and ministers are confronted by the same inquiry, relates to the desire

that people have not to inadvertently contribute to the problem. I’m not

sure everyone knows how to apply the term — I didn’t, in this context —

“asymptomatic transmission.” This relates to the interest people have in

knowing whether they have the virus and the degree to which testing….

The World Health Organization has offered commentary of late about the

importance of testing as a fundamental part of the strategy for

combating COVID-19.

Does the minister foresee a significant increase in the level of

testing taking place in B.C.? Is that necessary, in the mind of the

minister and the government? And if he does see an increase, is he able

to offer British Columbians any additional details on what that will

look like?

Hon. A. Dix: British Columbians and the government…. The provincial health

officer has believed in testing, in some ways, before other

jurisdictions did. Part of the challenge in British Columbia is we’re

facing the consequences of a failure to do that in other jurisdictions,

it should be said. That’s part of the reality of it. It doesn’t change

the reality of where it came from or how it came here or what the

consequences are or what the causes are, but that’s

significant.

On February 27 — I’m rough on the date here — we had tested, I

think, a little over 1,000 people. We’d done more tests than that, over

1,000 people. The following week that more than doubled. The following

week, which was ten days ago now, we had done 6,200 tests. As of this

Friday, we have done approximately 18,000, just under 18,000 tests. And

we’re doing right now, in the last two days over the weekend,

approximately 3,500 tests a day. So doubled and then doubled and then

tripled and then more than doubled again, so we are expanding

testing.

The focus of our testing, for the sake of everyone, has to be in

priority areas to limit the spread of the disease. If people are sick at

home, sometimes…. I know they want to know. I understand it. I hear from

them every day, just as the hon. member has. But if people are sick at

home, it is so important to self-isolate. I come back to this. It is so

important to self-isolate.

We are expanding testing dramatically week unto week to ensure

that the right measures are taken to stop the spread of the disease. By

necessity, that involves a focus on health care workers, because in

other jurisdictions, that’s been a major source of spread. We have to,

to the maximum extent possible, not just keep health care workers safe

but, as we’ve seen at the Lynn Valley care home and other places, to

keep residents in long-term care safe — the most vulnerable people in

society.

We have to focus. We’ve done some what’s called surveillance

testing to look at particular areas of the province which might be

particularly vulnerable. We’ve systemically, for example, tested for

people who get tested for the flu. That gives us a surveillance testing

of a group of people that wasn’t associated by way of travel or other

circumstances with getting COVID-19. So we’re expanding our testing, but

all of it is going to be based on science.

As we plan, we have to target the testing we do all the time to

ensure that we give the maximum protection to the entire B.C. population

and we limit the growth of COVID-19 and cases of COVID-19 in British

Columbia.

[2:00 p.m.]

What you’re going to see — and I just want one step back — is a

reflection of work that’s happened in British Columbia over decades —

the development of BCCDC, which is the envy of the country, people who

developed a test for this prior to there being any cases in Canada and

started testing so that we could isolate and break chains as much as

possible in the months leading up to this period. They have been

increasing our capacity to do tests in combination with health

authorities around the province. And LifeLabs is now doing some of the

testing processes to increase our capacity.

What I can say to British Columbians is that we’re going to be

doing, of course, more and more testing, and we’re going to focus it

where it’s needed most, based on the science, so that all British

Columbians can be protected to the maximum possible degree.

MAINTENANCE OF SUPPLY CHAIN

DURING CORONAVIRUS

OUTBREAK

J. Johal: The COVID-19 outbreak has shown British Columbians acting with

great kindness. We’ve seen some of the best come out of British Columbia

but occasionally some of the worst.

Now, as parents we stay at home to take care of the kids, but of

course, when you do so, you also need essentials. Most British

Columbians have acted responsibly, purchasing enough goods for a short

period of time, knowing that supplies will be there when needed. Some

folks have taken to hoarding — not many — and in some cases even selling

the products that they’re purchasing on line.

My question is to the Minister of Public Safety. While most people

are acting appropriately and retailers are working ferociously to

maintain stock, will the province look at putting in place an order to

support the smooth operation of the supply chain?

Hon. M. Farnworth: I thank the member for this very important question. I can assure

the member that this is a top priority for us as government. In fact, I

had a call this morning with my provincial colleagues from across the

country and the federal minister, Minister Blair, dealing with key

issues that each province is facing and how we can work to deal with

this particular issue. This was raised across all provinces.

One of the things we want to see the federal government do is to

work, because they have the ability to do that, in terms of securing

supply chains. Second is what we’re doing here in British Columbia. I

had a conference call this morning with my colleague the Minister of

Municipal Affairs, with mayors from right across British Columbia

outlining what they can expect this week. There will be a series of

ministerial orders coming down under the emergency declaration that is

in place dealing with many of these issues — in particular, securing

supply chains for much-needed goods in the province of British

Columbia.

I can also tell the member that we have had very good cooperation

from the Retail Council in British Columbia. It is something that is

very much of which we’re seized on.

Deputy Speaker: Before we proceed with the next question, I just wanted to ask the

leave of the House to have two questions on the opposition side as

opposed to one, which was in the motion that we passed earlier today. If

that’s okay with the House, we’ll move on.

So slight order change, but acknowledging the member for

Richmond-Queensborough.

ECONOMIC SUPPORT FOR INDIVIDUALS

AND BUSINESSES DURING

OUTBREAK

J. Johal: Thank you. You know I’m always enthusiastic in regard to my

questions.

I thank the minister for his response.

Adding to that anxiety regarding the supply chain, of course, is

the economic uncertainty. The Premier has alluded to some of that as

well, as has the Finance Minister. Tens of thousands of people are

facing potential layoffs. Small business owners are just really worried

about meeting payroll, never mind keeping employees on staff.

To the Premier, what steps should British Columbians be taking to

ensure that evictions and bankruptcies don’t spiral out of

control?

Hon. J. Horgan: I thank the member for his question.

We have been working cooperatively with the federal government.

The member will know that there was a significant federal stimulus

package tabled last week — $82 billion, in different components. We

awaited the delivery of that package before the Minister of Finance and

the cabinet looked at how British Columbia could fill potential gaps in

the programs that are being put forward by the federal

government.

Some members on the other side will know that in the normal course

of events, British Columbia’s government doesn’t have an ability to flow

dollars to those who are not already in the system in one way or

another. People with disabilities, people on income assistance and so on

— seniors — are getting upgrades or dollars from the

treasury.

We had to create a new system to deliver to those gaps that we’ve

identified in the federal program, and that has taken some time. But as

the Minister of Finance and I outlined today, we put forward a $5

billion action plan, and we’ll be debating the substance of that later

here in this chamber.

[2:05 p.m.]

But the message is quite clear, and I thank the member for

focusing in on this. Workers are concerned that they may not see a

paycheque for some period of time. Businesses are concerned with cash

flow, liquidity. When we talk to small business operators, when we talk

to the chamber of commerce, the boards of trade, even the big industries

represented by the B.C. Business Council, cash flow seems to be the

order of the day.

So we put in place a package to ensure that those businesses,

large and small, could have some relief on paying those fixed costs they

had anticipated coming forward before COVID-19 became a reality for us

here in British Columbia. We’ve put in place incremental steps to make

sure we’re filling those gaps.

It’s a first step; it’s not a last step. We’ll have to see. The

member for Abbotsford West asked the Minister of Health: how long are we

going to be here? We don’t know that. What we do know is that people

need some help right now, and we’re going to deliver that help as

quickly as we possibly can.

ACCESS TO HANDWASHING FACILITIES

FOR HOMELESS

PERSONS

S. Furstenau: I wanted to just start by acknowledging and appreciating

government for making this time available for these questions. The

questions from the official opposition members have been, for me, very

valuable, very informative, and I very much appreciate the responses

that we are getting from government on these questions that are coming

to us from our citizens and our constituents.

I want to start with handwashing. We’ve heard the message very

loudly, very clearly that the most important thing we can do in this

health crisis is to wash our hands regularly. I am worried. In a call

with the service providers in the Cowichan Valley who are supporting

homeless people, access to handwashing for people who are homeless is

limited, to say the least.

My question is perhaps to the Health Minister or the Public Safety

Minister. What can be done to support increased access to handwashing or

-sanitizing stations for British Columbians who currently do not have a

home, and would it be possible to set up multiple handwashing stations

or outdoor hand-sanitizing dispensers?

Hon. A. Dix: Thank you to the member for Cowichan Valley for her question. This

is a challenging time for everyone. I think we’ve given to the province

and the media more than 30 or 40 briefings over the last month. At every

one of those briefings, we cite the importance of

handwashing.

Other than — let me repeat it again — staying home if you’re sick,

staying home if you’re sick, some of these challenges are equally

challenging for people who are homeless, in terms of their ability to do

that. These are the central messages that have been here from the

beginning: wash your hands; stay home if you’re sick. Wash your hands;

stay home if you’re sick. It’s challenging for everyone. Obviously, the

additional risks to people who are homeless, who may not have access —

don’t have access — is an important one.

On Saturday, there was an update from my colleagues the Minister

of Social Development and the Minister of Housing. That was an update on

the work to support vulnerable British Columbians. They included new

isolation protocols for vulnerable people; sites available for social

isolation in, so far, 16 communities; new centralized procurement for

cleaning supplies and personal protective equipment for housing and

shelter providers, to protect residents and staff.

Handwashing is and will continue to be a significant challenge. In

Vancouver, for example, 11 new handwashing stations were set up last

Tuesday throughout the Downtown Eastside, to help protect people in that

community.

Outreach workers across B.C. are also working to share information

and resources with those that they serve. We are passing out new

materials with information on handwashing for people experiencing

homelessness, including how to set up a makeshift handwashing station.

For those in shelters, B.C. Housing is sharing new handwashing protocols

with providers, including handwashing when guests arrive, before they

leave, and before and after eating. The province is also supporting

enhanced daily cleaning in a number of SROs and shelters.

This is only a start. The funding that was announced today by the

Premier and the Minister of Finance will continue to support these kinds

of critical needs in the communities, and our Vulnerable Population

Working Group is working urgently with communities to identify those

needs.

I just want to say this in conclusion. We know that vulnerable

people are more vulnerable from COVID-19. We’ve seen this in long-term

care, and we know its significance. We’ve seen it in our own province,

and we’ve seen it elsewhere in the world. We’ve seen it for seniors;

we’ve seen it for people who deal with chronic diseases. We’ve seen it

for people who don’t have homes and are homeless and need our

supports.

[2:10 p.m.]

These are central areas of the government’s response — and they

have to be central areas — to ensure that the people who are most

vulnerable to getting the most sick receive the most effort that we can

give to support them. In this area, as in others, specific actions are

being taken that I know will be supported by the hon. members and

members of the House.

DOMESTIC VIOLENCE SERVICES

DURING CORONAVIRUS

OUTBREAK

S. Furstenau: I want to thank the minister for his response and thank him for

his ongoing and very proactive communication with our caucus. I have

been so deeply appreciative of the information that he’s provided and

being able to put questions to him that have come to me when he connects

with us. I, again, just really want to commend and thank the minister

and the government for their work over this time.

There is another vulnerable population that will be deeply

impacted by the situation that we’re all in. As we ask people to stay

home and social distance and quarantine, this does actually create

conditions for increased domestic violence. Isolation due to fear of

contracting or spreading the virus has distanced victims of abuse from

their support networks, and the stress on our health care system has

made it even less likely for those victims to seek out and receive

treatment for their injuries.

Current provincial services for victims of violence, like

VictimLink B.C. or Kids Help Phone, are largely offered over the phone.

However, when their abuser is also at home during quarantine, many

victims will not feel safe to reach out for help this way. Other

jurisdictions are addressing this concern by exploring options to expand

digital media services.

My question is to the Premier. During this state of emergency, how

can we better support victims of violence who are isolated with their

abusers at home?

Hon. C. James: Thank you to the member for the question. We were talking about

vulnerability in the previous question with the Health Minister, and

this is vulnerability as well. It’s another group that certainly is

facing vulnerability.

We all know that violence is never acceptable and that safety is a

top priority. But we also know, as the member has pointed out so well,

that those who are living with violence may not have a safe option. I

had a discussion last week with a service provider — and it stuck with

me — who said: “What do you do when home isn’t a safe place, when you’re

in this position and when you’re looking at self-isolation?”

We are working with B.C. Housing to look at alternative plans,

whether it’s hotels or other options, for people who are fleeing

violence or need to self-isolate and are in a situation where they can’t

be at home. We will work with the service providers in communities,

because again, often it’s the front line that provides that

support.

The member will know, as part of the package today, that we

confirmed that not-for-profits that contract with government will

continue to get those services, even if they’re having to change their

distribution of those services and how they provide them. That’s going

to be in place as well.

The federal government has allocated new funding to support sexual

assault centres and women’s shelters. We’re talking with the federal

government to look at how we can ensure that some of that funding is

allocated to our province and can go directly to these kinds of

supports.

Then just the last piece I’d mention is the $1.7 billion that we

put aside for critical services. That’s another piece — when we work

with B.C. Housing, when we work with the vulnerable populations’ groups

— that we will be looking to how we allocate that to ensure that the

safety is there for people when home isn’t a safe place.

Deputy Speaker: The member for Saanich North and the Islands.

I beg leave of the House for one final supplemental question. If

that’s okay with members of this House, we’ll proceed.

I saw general agreement. I would like to ask the member to

proceed.

SUPPORT TO RURAL COMMUNITIES

DURING CORONAVIRUS

OUTBREAK

A. Olsen: Thank you to the members of the government for answering these

questions.

One question that I’ve been receiving…. It’s kind of weird to be

standing representing the most isolated communities, I think, on the

opposition side. I know there are other communities. Rural and isolated

communities have been sending me — primarily, the Gulf Island

communities…. I think lots of rural and isolated, remote communities in

this province — their members are concerned about the impact that

COVID-19 could have if the outbreak went through those communities, just

due to the lack of health services in the communities.

I’ve received a number of emails from people asking to shut down

the Gulf Islands or to shut down access for people who are not

residents, to stop the flow of people coming in and out of the

communities.

[2:15 p.m.]

I just wanted the opportunity to ask the Minister of Health: has

the ministry considered restricting access to isolated, rural and

at-risk communities in a way that will allow them to continue to receive

goods that sustain themselves but also that may stop the spread into

those communities, and if an outbreak does happen in a small community

in British Columbia, do we have the adequate infrastructure in place to

address that?

Hon. A. Dix: Thank you to the member for the question. I think the first thing

to say is that every health authority — from the Northern Health

Authority, which represents many isolated communities, to the Vancouver

Coastal Health Authority — has an emergency operations centre.

Certainly, in the north and in the Interior and on Vancouver Island and

others, these issues of isolated communities are fundamental to the work

that we’re preparing and doing. It’s also true that the First Nations

Health Authority has its own emergency operations centre and is doing a

lot of work now with First Nations communities around British Columbia

to prepare.

A number of things are important. One, as the member suggests, is

we have to ensure and reinforce, if necessary, that if there is a case

of outbreak in a community, we can get staff and supports to that

community, to have rapid response in all health authorities to such a

situation should it develop. That’s very important.

I think, secondly, that we have community plans in those

communities and we work with community leaders to develop those plans is

very important. It is essential and fundamental to what we are trying to

do. Obviously, health care workers in those areas, in remote communities

are stepping up every day to be part of those efforts.

To date, and this has been our expectation up to now, the greatest

majority of the cases are in the Vancouver Coastal and Fraser Health

authorities and large metropolitan areas. But like other areas we’ve

talked of and communities of people we’ve talked of today, isolated

communities can be very vulnerable, and we are working and making sure,

through both the First Nations health authorities and the other health

authorities, that they’re supported in this period.

I think it brings us to the fundamental question that everyone in

British Columbia has to recognize right now. No matter where you live —

whether it’s in Alert Bay or it’s in Abbotsford, whether it’s in

Vanderhoof or Vancouver — you can catch COVID-19 wherever you are, no

matter what your age. If you’re a teenager or you’re 60, you can pass on

COVID-19.

Let’s not make any mistake about it. We’re all involved in this

fight. In every community, we’ve got to wash our hands. In every

community, we’ve got to stay home if we’re sick — 100 percent. It’s 100

percent. When the provincial health officer makes an order or makes a

proposal, it’s 100 percent right now. That’s where we have to

be.

Dr. Henry has asked us to do some extraordinary things — things

that nobody in this Legislature would have imagined doing maybe a few

weeks ago — in the last number of weeks. And we need 100 percent

compliance in every community, 100 percent of people 100 percent of the

time, in this fight against COVID-19. The government, all of us here,

but also every person in B.C. has to be 100 percent all in.

[End of question period.]

Reports from Committees

AUDITOR GENERAL

APPOINTMENT

COMMITTEE

M. Dean: On behalf of the Special Committee to Appoint an Auditor General,

I’ve been designated by committee members to present the report of that

committee. As such, I ask leave of the House to present the report of

the Special Committee to Appoint an Auditor General and to move that the

report be taken as read and received.

Leave granted.

M. Dean: I move that the report be taken as read and received.

Motion approved.

M. Dean: I ask leave of the House to move a motion to adopt the

report.

Leave granted.

M. Dean: I move that the report be adopted, and in doing so, I would like

to make some brief comments.

On behalf of the House, I extend sincere gratitude to the Chair of

the committee, the member for Nanaimo–North Cowichan, and the Deputy

Chair, the member for Richmond-Steveston, as well as to the member for

Prince George–​Valemount, the member for Burnaby North and the

member for Oak Bay–Gordon Head for their collaborative approach and

diligent work on this important appointment process.

On behalf of the Chair, I’d like to thank all members and the

vice-Chair for what was an exceptionally collegial effort.

[2:20 p.m.]

I would also like to extend committee members’ strong appreciation

to Kate Ryan-Lloyd and her Clerk’s office staff for their thorough and

excellent support to the committee.

This report constitutes the committee’s unanimous recommendation

for the appointment of Michael Pickup as British Columbia’s next Auditor

General. Mr. Pickup has been the Auditor General of Nova Scotia since

2014, after holding increasingly senior positions in the Office of the

Auditor General of Canada from 1990 to 2014. Committee members were

impressed with his demonstrated ability to lead and motivate staff, his

commitment to supporting and advancing reconciliation with Indigenous

communities and his knowledge of Canadian and international auditing and

accounting standards.

The committee also appreciated his understanding of the role of

auditor general in the context of our parliamentary system, democracy

and the need to contribute towards sustained public trust in democratic

institutions. Members of the committee are confident that Mr. Pickup has

the knowledge, skills and professional qualifications required to take

on the important work of Auditor General of British Columbia.

Members of the committee also thank Carol Bellringer for her

leadership and dedication as Auditor General from 2014 to 2019 and wish

her well in her future endeavours.

As well, on behalf of the committee, I want to acknowledge Russ

Jones, who has served in the role of acting Auditor General since

January 1 of this year. Mr. Jones took over the position during a time

of transition for the office and has carried out his duties with

professionalism and dedication. As Mr. Pickup will not begin his term

until the end of July, all members of the Legislative Assembly express

our sincere appreciation to him for his ongoing leadership in support of

a smooth transition period.

M. de Jong: I’ll keep this brief. I, like the member for Esquimalt-Metchosin,

was not a member of the committee but am pleased to convey, on behalf of

those that were from the official opposition, the member for

Richmond-Steveston as Vice-Chair and the member for Prince

George–Valemount, the wholehearted support of those members and the

official opposition for the appointment that is being recommended in the

report before the House.

Mr. Pickup comes to us with a myriad of experiences, most recently

as the Auditor General in the Maritimes, in Nova Scotia, and prior to

that as the Auditor General in the Auditor General’s office in Ottawa

with the federal government.

Like the previous speaker, the member for Esquimalt-Metchosin, I’d

like to commend and thank Carol Bellringer for her efforts and her work

in the role of Auditor General, and Russ Jones, who has stepped up over

the course of his career on several occasions to fill in during what the

member correctly termed periods of transition. He has done so again with

his usual professionalism.

The opposition is pleased to offer our support to the

recommendation that has come before the House.

Deputy Speaker: The question is the adoption of the report.

Motion approved.

M. Dean: I ask leave of the House to move a motion to appoint Michael

Pickup as Auditor General of British Columbia.

Leave granted.

Motions Without Notice

APPOINTMENT OF AUDITOR GENERAL

M. Dean: I move:

[That pursuant to the Auditor General Act (S.B.C. 2003, c.

2), Michael A. Pickup be appointed as Auditor General of British

Columbia, for one eight-year term commencing on July 27, 2020.]

Motion approved.

Orders of the Day

Presentation of Estimates

SUPPLEMENTARY ESTIMATES FOR THE

FISCAL YEAR ENDING

MARCH 31, 2021

Hon. C. James presented a message from Her Honour the

Lieutenant-Governor: supplementary estimates for the fiscal year ending

March 31, 2021.

Hon. C. James moved that the said message and the estimates

accompanying the same be referred to the Committee of Supply.

Motion approved.

[2:25 p.m.]

Hon. M. Farnworth: I call Committee of Supply to consider the supplementary

estimates.

Committee of Supply

SUPPLEMENTARY ESTIMATES:

OTHER

APPROPRIATIONS

The House in Committee of Supply (Section B); M. Dean in the

chair.

The committee met at 2:27 p.m.

The Chair: Members, we will take a five-minute recess just to organize

the committee.

The committee recessed from 2:27 p.m. to 2.32 p.m.

[M. Dean in the chair.]

On Vote 52: contingencies (all ministries), pandemic response and

economic recovery, $5,000,000,000.

The Chair: Minister, do you have an opening statement?

Hon. C. James: I do. Thank you very much, Chair.

I want to begin by recognizing that we’re on the traditional

territory of the Songhees and Esquimalt Nations and thank them for the

ability to meet on their land.

I think there is no question — you can certainly see it here in

the Legislature today, but I know communities are feeling it all across

the province — that these are unprecedented and difficult times.

Communities across the prov­ince are pulling together to keep one

another safe.

I think we’ve all seen, in the midst of the challenges, incredibly

heart-warming experiences, certainly in my community. We all received

from our Block Watch captain a week and a half ago a list of people who

are available for volunteering — to be able to go and pick up groceries

for people or prescriptions or help them out if they were

self-isolating. I think it has really been quite extraordinary to see —

no surprise in British Columbia — the communities pulling

together.

We know that if we want to overcome the challenges, we will need

to rely on the cooperation and the support of communities, of all levels

of government, of everyone in this Legislature, of individuals, of

families and businesses and workers. Certainly as government, we’re

committed to doing our part, and that’s what this estimate is

about.

I want to introduce the staff who are here today. People have

heard me today as well, when we an­nounced the package, talk about

the extraordinary work of the civil servants across government —

certainly in my ministry, but across government — providing support in

very short timelines to be able to put together these kinds of

packages.

I have Richard Purnell with me, Doug Foster and Fisnik Preniqi,

who are here to provide support as we go through committee stage on

these estimates.

Funding for contingencies — what have we included in this package?

This is a pandemic response and economic recovery that provides $5

billion to support a provincial response to the corona disease COVID-19.

and to help boost support where we think it’s needed.

Our response will be evidence-based, and there are three areas of

focus. Supporting services to protect the health and safety of British

Columbians has first priority; second, immediate relief to individuals

and businesses; and third, looking ahead to economic recovery in

partnership with the business and labour community.

[2:35 p.m.]

Our response is going to be phased, and we’ll need to be

responsive to the changing environment. To date, the federal response

has had three areas of focus: health care, short-term support for

individuals and short-term continuity of business, but as we know, there

are gaps. The federal response provides very modest support for health

care and critical services.

B.C. will only receive our portion based on per capita. That’s a

challenge. When you look at our health care system, when you look at the

per-capita number of cases, when you look at the demographics in British

Columbia, per capita creates some challenges. We will be working to

ensure that there are supports, as I said, to fill the gaps for the area

that’s there.

The federal response is focusing on liquidity through borrowing

and tax deferral. Again, we can balance those off and supplement those

measures by making sure there are tax deferral supports in place and by

providing tax relief for businesses as well.

Our strategy includes timely measures to be able to support

individuals and families who may be coping with potential illness. It

adds key funding to areas like health care and housing, supporting

vulnerable populations and making sure that the core social services

British Columbians rely on are there for them as well.

We know that British Columbia has a very strong economic

foundation, but we also know that COVID-19 is going to impact the entire

globe when it comes to the economy. Every aspect of our economy is going

to be touched by this pandemic.

The plan that we have put together, yes, looks at the immediate

but also looks ahead and provides support for future initiatives that

will be needed to make sure that we can look at recovery. That will be

put together with the business community and with the labour community

to make sure that we’re able to do what we can to look at, when we’re

ready, how we kick-start the economy. So $2.8 billion for individuals

and families, $2.2 billion for businesses and longer-term economic

recovery.

I just want to finish up my opening remarks by noting that this is

an ever-changing situation. The plan is the plan today, and we know that

it will need to be flexible. It will need to be responsive. It will need

to be able to address the pressures that we may see in the days and

weeks and months to come.

In the theme that really has fit today, I think we all are in this

together, and we all need to do our part. Certainly, as government,

we’re pleased to bring this forward.

I also want to recognize, again, the members from the opposition

parties, both the official opposition and the Green Party, who have come

forward and provided ideas and responses. I’ve had lots of emails from

individuals who weren’t able to be here today who have been providing

advice and giving ideas as well.

With that, I’ll take my place.

The Chair: I recognize the member for Richmond-Queensborough.

J. Johal: Thank you, Madam Chair. I thank yourself and my colleagues across

the way in regards to this extraordinary moment to talk on this

issue.

The business of supplementary supply generally is the process by

which a government asks the Legislature to appropriate the funds

required to meet its financial obligations and to implement programs

already approved by the Legislature. In other years, this would be

considered a matter of routine. Today is far from routine. It’s an

extraordinary day for an extraordinary time as this province, this

nation and the international community fight a global

pandemic.

It’s hard to imagine now, but just a few weeks ago we were

debating, inside and outside this House, about blockades and, to a

certain degree, even debating the issues around Brexit. Those issues are

distant today.

The needs of British Columbians are our priority, and those needs

are immediate. Those suffering from the effects of COVID-19 also deserve

to know the resources will be there for them in the weeks and months

ahead. Our front-line health workers — who have been doing tremendous

work in very challenging and, at times, gut-wrenching conditions — need

to know we are working to meet their needs.

This supply bill must also address the needs of parents who need

child care facilities to remain open so that they can go to work for our

many essential services.

This bill is not only about providing quick action but protecting

the health and safety of British Columbians and also protecting our

economy.

[2:40 p.m.]

What we’re seeing today is not just a health care crisis but an

economic crisis as well: 500,000 Canadians have already applied for

employment insurance, with that number expected to increase

significantly in the weeks ahead. In its most optimistic assessment, the

United Nations International Labour Organization says the impact of the

COVID-19 outbreak will cost 5.3 million jobs globally. In its bleakest

scenario, that number would rise to just shy of 25 million jobs, meaning

it would cause more unemployment than the global economic crisis in

What the government is seeking with this approval is nine months

of supply for a budget one can easily argue is out of date because of

circumstances. This great House is built on a foundation of checks and

balances. The approval of this bill and the supplementary conversation

that we’re having today comes in a climate where we do not know when

this House will sit next. We are forced to be absent for obvious

reasons. But when this conversation resumes in this great House, the

government should expect questions on its spending and priorities,

particularly around the consequences of COVID-19 on people’s health as

well as impacts on the economy, small businesses and their

employees.

When we are back in chambers, the opposition will want to know

what specific measures the government will introduce to help our

battered hospitality and tourism industry survive and thrive once again.

In its worst-case scenario, the B.C. Restaurant and Food Services

Association says the COVID-19 pandemic could result in up to 15 percent

of restaurants shutting for good in British Columbia.

Our hotel industry employs 60,000 people across British Columbia.

Two-thirds may lose their jobs because of the economic fallout

surrounding COVID-19. Those employees will want specific answers in

regards to their economic well-being.

In a recent survey of 8,000 small businesses by the B.C. Chamber

of Commerce, 90 percent of B.C.’s small businesses are already reporting

some hit in lost sales, cancelled contracts or layoffs due to the

COVID-19 response. The survey also found that of those impacted, 83

percent are seeing a drop in revenue, 91 percent anticipate a further

decrease in revenue in the near term, and 73 percent of businesses

expect their revenue will drop by 50 percent or more, with nearly a

quarter saying that revenues will drop by 100 percent.

The impact of COVID-19 is being felt throughout the economy, in

every sector, and with that, people’s pocketbooks. The opposition will

want to know how this government will help British Columbians pay their

monthly mortgage, rent and utility payments. The people of British

Columbia want to see a coordinated plan that is meaningful and

appropriate to the current crisis. That means economic relief programs

that will keep British Columbians employed and provide clarity to small

business owners when it comes to payroll and property, sales and income

taxes.

There’s no doubt that public safety and health is our primary

concern. But the opposition will want to know what this government will

do to provide resources to our social agencies, including groups like

the food banks, which are struggling to meet demand, at the same time

softening the economic impacts on individuals and businesses.

In closing, I want to remind those in this House that we are up to

the challenge presented by COVID-19. There may be those who feel scared

right now, but I would tell them to have faith in their fellow British

Columbians.

I want to thank our front-line health care workers, our doctors,

our nurses and caregivers. I want to thank our police, our paramedics

and firefighters, who will be leaned on even more in these challenging

times. I also want to thank our workers in grocery stores, retail

outlets and restaurants. I want to thank our truck drivers, warehouse

workers, child care workers and delivery drivers. They continue to keep

our supply chain moving and care for our children.

I want to say that we are a strong, resilient and empathetic

people. We have shown these traits many times in the past few weeks.

Volunteers are dropping off groceries at the homes of seniors. It’s

picking up the phone and calling your neighbour and saying: “How are you

doing?” It’s the care workers in Richmond walking out of the hospital to

go grab a cup of coffee at Starbucks and a patron buying a $500 gift

card to say thank you, thank you from all of us in this community of

ours — in Richmond, in my case, but throughout British

Columbia.

What I want to end with is to say we are a great province of five

million people, and we’ve responded to this challenge with five million

acts of kindness. We’ll need more acts of kindness in the weeks and

months ahead. In that spirit, I look forward to a constructive

conversation in and around the issues that British Columbians want us to

deal with here and now.

[2:45 p.m.]

The Chair: Do other members have any questions or comments on the

vote?

J. Johal: I listened to some of the comments from the Finance Minister and,

certainly, watched the press conference, some of the conversation in and

around this bill. Does the minister believe that the $5 billion is

sufficient to deal with the issues surrounding COVID-19?

Hon. C. James: I think this is an important question, because I think, given the

evolving situation…. I think the Health Minister described it well when

he said: “Could any of us have imagined a few weeks ago being in the

situation that we’re in?” I don’t think any of us could’ve imagined

that.

I think this is sufficient for now. But as we said in the press

conference when we delivered this plan, it is a first step. We will need

to be flexible. We will need to be responsive. We will need to see where

it goes over the next days and weeks and months ahead. So I cannot

commit to whether this would be sufficient for the next three months,

the next six months, the next two months, depending on what kind of

situation we’re facing.

We believe that this package is a fulsome package. I think the

member mentioned it as well. We’ve tried very hard to make sure that we

address both immediate needs for people and businesses and that we

coordinate with the federal response. That’s very important, again, so

that we can get the best bang for our buck. We can provide the best

support to families.

For example, you’ll see the federal government is bringing out a

GST credit in April. We hope to get our payment out to people in May.

There’ll be another payment in July. So again, looking at how that

coordination occurs to provide the best support for families and for

businesses.

Again, we’re looking at deferring a number of taxes until the end

of September, which will provide what many businesses have been calling

for, which is that cash flow pressure.

So we certainly feel that right now this is sufficient. But the

situation, as I said, will continue to evolve, and we expect that we

will need to be flexible to meet the needs as well.

J. Johal: I raise that question simply because of what we’ve been hearing in

the last few days. Here’s a quote from Dan Kelly from the Canadian

Federation of Independent Business. He says: “A wage-subsidy program is

our best protection against large-scale unemployment.”

Goldy Hyder, the president and CEO of the Business Council of

Canada, agreed. He says: “The way we’re thinking about stimulus is into

a job-preservation program.”

There seems to be an immediate need by small business — all

businesses, but particularly small business — in regards to seeking

help. I understand that we are a subnational economy. We’re not a

national economy. But when I look at some of the help that is being

provided to businesses…. In Britain, the government said that it will

provide government grants to cover 80 percent of furloughed workers’

salaries. The Danish government says that it will pay 75 percent of

worker salaries, up to a cap of $4,700 a month. In New Zealand, the

country is offering a flat-rate subsidy paid in one 12-week lump sum to

help businesses avoid layoffs.

I bring that question again to you because it seems like it isn’t

about two months from now. It’s literally seven days from now when you

have to meet payroll, potentially, or rent. Do you feel there’s any way

these programs, the help that is being provided, can be moved faster,

between the federal government and the provincial government, in regards

to meeting those needs? Because what we are hearing is that there are

immediate needs, not a need two or three months from now.

[2:50 p.m.]

Hon. C. James: Thank you for the question. I think, as the Premier said, every

jurisdiction is looking at what they can do and adjusting what they can

do over the next while.

I think this is an important piece to look at from both a

perspective of what we’re doing and the perspective of what the federal

government is doing because, in fact, some of those supports are being

taken on federally. We’ve certainly been clear that we believe the

federal government has to take a lead. We have to add and supplement and

support, but the federal government also needs to step up on this

situation.

The member probably knows some of the supports that have been put

in place from the federal end. It does include, in fact, temporary wage

subsidies for small employers. That’s a piece that the federal

government is looking at. They have a number of loan programs that have

been put in place as well.

The waiving or deferral of tax payments gives the immediate

support to businesses that built that in to their books. That’s, I

believe, one of the reasons…. We’ve had, of course, great discussions

over the last couple of weeks with the business community.

Almost every one of the communities that sent out their list of

the kinds of things that they think are important mentioned the

deferral, because that gives an immediate payment for people who

expected to make a payment at the end of March or expected to make a

payment in the middle of April. That gives them instant cash flow,

instant liquidity that they can address some of the pressures that

they’re facing and make the choice they’re making.

Do I believe that there’ll be further measures that we’ll have to

take a look at over the next six months? I think that’s likely, given

the situation we’re facing. But I think the measures we put in place

now, around the deferrals, around providing liquidity for businesses,

around the cash through the school tax, the 50 percent reduction — which

isn’t a paying-back; that’s an actual reduction for businesses — will

provide them some of that cash flow to address some of the pressures

that they need.

J. Johal: I appreciate the answer.

I want to talk about one individual. His name is Bill McKnight. He

owns a small clothing store in Ladner. He has laid off all of his

employees. He’s 73 years old, and rent is due the end of this month, or

the first of the month of April. He’ll have to pay $8,000. There is no

revenue coming in. May 1, the same.

How will Bill McKnight be helped by the provincial government and

the federal government, in your mind, in regards to holding on to his

business and moving forward? That’s $8,000 per month.

Hon. C. James: I’ve talked about the federal programs. Again, hypothetical,

because I don’t have the specifics around the individual, but he

certainly may be eligible for some of the programs that have been talked

about through the federal government. There are a number of discussions

with banks and credit unions — we’re having the discussions with credit

unions as well — about deferring mortgage payments or deferring rent

payments or deferring payments that may be in place. The federal

government has loan programs, as I mentioned already.

[2:55 p.m.]

Deferral of the property school tax will be a direct support,

again, if the individual is paying property tax. Deferral of tax

payments, which again, will be built in — most businesses build those

into their budgets. They will have six months where they don’t have to

look at making those payments, which, again, can be significant for some

businesses as well.

The individual, depending on the circumstances, could be eligible

for the $1,000 benefit, the one-time payment. Again, that’s going to

small business owners if they’re eligible. So that’s a possibility in

that as well.

Then depending on his income, he could be eligible as well for the

top-up to the climate action credit coming in July. That’s going to

impact 86 percent of people who will see a large amount. He could be

eligible for that amount as well.

J. Johal: I appreciate the Finance Minister’s response. It does speak to the

challenge of meeting the targets of rent at the beginning of the month

of $8,000, a hard target. With all these deferrals that you’ve talked

about, it does still speak to the challenge of meeting that deadline

every month. Every business and every sector is going to be impacted. It

is a daunting task for government to fill in those holes on a federal

level and a provincial level.

I appreciate the Finance Minister’s answer. But there are

literally thousands of businesses in the days ahead, never mind weeks or

months ahead, that are going to have to make those tough decisions. I

think there’s a lot of work ahead for not only government and opposition

but for all of us to make sure we meet the needs of British Columbians

in regards to that one example that I gave. There are many other Bill

McKnights out there in different sectors as well.

We’ve talked about the $5 billion that government is going to be

spending. There are impacts, of course, of businesses, like Mr.

McKnight’s, that have shut down. Has there been any modelling done on

the impact of COVID-19 on government revenue?

Hon. C. James: I would say that it has preoccupied and occupied the work of

people particularly, obviously, in the branch that looks at our

modelling around the economy each and every day. I would suggest that

that is their focus right now. I certainly have been getting

reports.

I think it would be no surprise to the member to know that every

area of our economy is being impacted right now by COVID — everything

from exports, imports and the challenges there, obviously the

hospitality industry, the tourism sector and arts and culture. You name

it. The impact is great.

Specifics on what that looks like in the economy are early yet.

There are a number of tax payments that come at the end of March and the

beginning of April, so again, we’ll take a look at those and see where

the drops are. We haven’t quite seen that impact yet because the numbers

don’t come on the immediate. So we’ll have to wait to look at those

numbers.

Certainly, first quarterly of this fiscal year that comes at the

end of the summer will be key. Public accounts will be key. We’ll be

looking at how we can do updates on a regular basis on how these dollars

are being spent, just to touch on the member’s points around

accountability, which I think is really critical. We’ve been talking

about how we can give updates to the members from all parties in the

Legislature around where the package is going, what dollars are being

spent and how we can provide those regular updates if the Legislature

isn’t sitting for a while as well.

So I couldn’t agree more that the accountability piece is going to

be important and the economic updates are going to be important. But

it’s early yet, because the numbers are still, really, coming in from

the last couple of months where the biggest impacts will have

occurred.

J. Johal: In these extraordinary times, I think the minister would agree

that we need to be forthright, open and available, almost as much as the

Health Minister, on a daily basis in regards to numbers. I think they do

matter, and I think British Columbians also want to hear exactly where

their dollars are going and the challenges that we have in regards to

revenue on the revenue side in government. I appreciate you

acknowledging that and wanting to share those numbers as much as

possible with the people of British Columbia.

This is a moving target, as you have said. The modelling that is

being done and will be done — is there any sort of chance that modelling

will be done where you have a two-month scenario, a six-month scenario

and a year scenario?

[3:00 p.m.]

I think this is a moving target. This is going to continue. I just

wanted to see if the minister can acknowledge that we would get

different scenarios, because I think the people of British Columbia

would want that.

Hon. C. James: Certainly, I think the easiest way to put it is…. This, again,

will be looked at each and every month. We will have better information

and more up-to-date statistics coming in over the next couple of months

as we start to see corporate income tax and all those kinds of

things.

We can certainly estimate the numbers and the drops that, I think,

every jurisdiction will see. This won’t be unique to British Columbia.

We’ll be watching other jurisdictions as well. I think, certainly, each

month we’re going to have to take a look.

We’ll also get an idea, then, of applications that will come in,

of program pressures that will be put in place and of what we see for

people with disabilities or on income assistance. Will there be

pressures there? What will you be seeing with applications for the

additional payment through EI? If you look at the EI numbers the member

mentioned — jumping from 22,000 to 500,000 — we know that that kind of

caseload pressure will need additional resources, obviously, from the

federal end. We could be sitting in the same kind of situation as

well.

This will be a month-to-month estimation of a program. We believe

these dollars, as I said, will hold. We’ve been conservative in our

estimates around the spending of these dollars. So we believe there is

room to get us through. But again, in these unprecedented times, is

there a chance that we will need to look at more resources to be able to

support the economy? I think none of us could imagine the situation we

might be in.

J. Johal: We are talking about people losing their jobs or who have already

lost their jobs and small business owners wanting to stay afloat.

Government needs to work towards that.

Has there been any conversation or a push to move infrastructure

programs — move them quicker, build them quicker — so we can get people

to work? That could be, potentially, the Pattullo Bridge, SkyTrain

projects. Is there any conversation, in and around large public sector

infrastructure projects, on moving the timelines earlier so we can get

them up and going?

Hon. C. James: Thank you very much to the member. That’s the reason, in fact,

that we’re putting together the recovery team and the economic advisers,

people from the business community and from the labour community — to

have exactly those discussions. So we’re ready to go, when the

opportunity is out there, and to put stimulus into the economy when we

have the chance to build the projects.

Obviously, right now people are being told to stay home. We have

to follow the health and safety rules and the orders that have been put

in place by Dr. Bonnie Henry. But we know, as Dr. Henry says, this is

not forever. We will be at a place where there’s the

opportunity.

That’s where British Columbia certainly is very well situated. We

have had that reinforced by some of the rating agencies as well. British

Columbia will be very well positioned because of the large capital spend

that we have in the budget. We, in fact, have one of the largest capital

spends, which has been in place, in British Columbia. So we’ll be well

positioned to move those along.

Whether there’s the opportunity to speed those up, again, will

depend on the situation of the economy and of employees to be able to do

those projects. But it’s not off the table. As I said, that’s part of

the reason we want to have this recovery team in place: to look at

exactly those kinds of questions so we’re ready when things turn

around.

[3:05 p.m.]

Although the $1.5 billion probably won’t be spent for the next few

months as they determine a workplan, the work will start, and that will

get going. That’s exactly the kind of question that will be part of that

discussion.

J. Johal: The minister, in her opening remarks and, certainly, I know

earlier today in her press conference talked about tax deferral around

EHT and carbon tax. If the concerns around COVID last many months, could

deferral be pushed further?

Hon. C. James: Yes, no question.

J. Johal: What does the minister say to the persistent conversation, which

is in the public sphere, that these tax deferrals don’t work? People

need wage subsidies. Business owners need wage subsidies now, today.

That’s a better way to keep people working and keep people solvent, and

liquidity stays in the system, rather than these tax deferrals. What

would you say to that argument?

Hon. C. James: In fact, deferral of the taxes was probably the most common

request from all of the business communities that have written in,

businesses large and small: B.C. Business Council, Victoria Chamber of

Commerce, Surrey Board of Trade. The requests that came in, in fact, did

focus on deferrals, because that provides the support for businesses

that, again, have those dollars written into their books and now can

take those out of their books for the next six months and know that they

can use those resources in another way.

I don’t think it’s either/or. That’s why, I think, you see the

federal government plan does have a portion around wages. I think,

again, this will be a changing, ever-evolving situation that we’re going

to have to watch.

J. Johal: A couple more questions. The minister talked about, I think,

setting aside $1.7 billion, focusing on health and social services.

Obviously, housing is a very important part of anybody’s life. A roof

over your head is so very important in regards to dignity and the

day-to-day living.

The comments from the Premier, I think during question period,

were that no one will get evicted due to COVID. Can the Finance Minister

confirm that that is the case?

Hon. C. James: I can’t talk about the specifics around housing because they’re

coming this week. The member may know that there’s already been a

decision around evictions being banned for B.C. Housing, and there’ll be

further information coming around the evictions piece as well. I’ll hold

that until Wednesday. I believe that information will be coming out on

Wednesday.

When it comes to people not being able to afford rent, a number of

the measures I’ve talked about — the $1,000 and the other supports that

we’ve put in place — obviously help towards that.

We’re also looking at — and, again, this is the Minister of

Housing who will be working on this — whether we can use existing

structures and retool the requirements in place. An example would be the

SAFER program, the seniors rental supplement program, or the RAP program

for people who are working and are low income but are holding a job.

Those rent supplement programs could be expanded so that…. There are

people who are at risk of not being able to pay their rent who could

then access them through the program.

Again, I talked earlier about the work of the civil servants and

making sure that we had both the accountability mechanisms and the

flexibility and the speed to get these supports out. That’s exactly the

kind of thing that’s being looked at right now.

J. Johal: I think that’s wonderful, especially helping those on low income

in regards to keeping a roof over their head.

Now, if you’re in downtown Vancouver and you’re a young person

starting out your career, you’re probably paying $2,000 a month for

rent, if not more. In fact, it’s $2,500 to $2,700 a month in certain

neighbourhoods in downtown Vancouver.

I’m glad that there are programs available for those on the

low-income side, but there are those who are just starting out their

careers. One of the things I’ve seen in the introduction of this bill is

that there’s a lot of emphasis put on those that are most vulnerable. I

don’t see a lot for those that I could describe as working class, middle

class — those making $40,000, $50,000, $60,000, $70,000 a year. They’re

also going to be hurting. That may be layoffs, the inability to pay your

rent.

Will we see more specific programs geared towards the middle

class, the working class — those that, you know, may be making more than

lower-income salaries but still will need help? Will we see more

programs geared towards the middle class?

Hon. C. James: Thank you for the question.

[3:10 p.m.]

A couple of pieces. The $1,000 is not income-tested, so that, in

fact, will go to middle-income earners. People who are on employment

insurance — who are accessing employment insurance, so who have lost

their work — will have the ability to access that $1,000 as well. That’s

part of the program.

Student loans. Those go to people who’ve finished and graduated.

Many of those young people, as the member talks about, would be people

carrying student loans. They will, again, have a deferral on those

loans, both federally and provincially, which will make a

difference.

Then when I talked about expanding the low-income supplements,

that’s exactly the kind of situation that I’m talking about: “Could you

expand the criteria? Could you adjust where people can access that so

that people who are struggling — who may not be in the very low income

but are still struggling — will have an ability to access supports?”

Those are the kinds of things that are being explored with those

supplement programs.

J. Johal: My final question, and I thank the minister for her

response.

You see the challenges there, whether it’s $1,000 an individual

may receive as a one-time payment, not having to pay student loans for

many months…. That may cover one month’s rent on April 1. You’re in

trouble again the next month. So you can see the financial challenges

and the anxiety that people are going to have to deal with in the very

near future, literally weeks away, and the challenges that are before us

as legislators.

My final question is also focusing on the social programs, but

that is food banks, which I think every community relies upon to help

those who are in need. In grocery stores, as we’ve seen, some of the

shelves are bare because of hoarding and just everyday British

Columbians stocking up as well. In the past, there would be excess that

could be donated to those food banks. People who weren’t afraid of

losing their jobs were donating to those very food banks.

Today there’s a tremendous challenge — a tremendous, tremendous

challenge. Food banks today are in trouble here in British Columbia,

from Richmond to Prince George, from Cranbrook to Kitimat.

Can the minister address — particularly for that part of our

society, the food bank — what will be done to help immediately, and any

other social agency and sector that does the front-line work in our

communities? It’s so valuable. They’re the most vulnerable members of

our community, and they need our help as well. So if can the minister

could address that.

Hon. C. James: Thank you to the member for asking the question and recognizing

the critical…. I call it the fabric of British Columbia.

Not-for-profits, our social service agencies and the people on the front

line really are the fabric of our communities and fill in those supports

that need to be there. There are a whole number of pieces that are being

put in place right now.

I mentioned, as part of our package, that we are continuing the

contracts with agencies who may be retooling how they’re providing

services. They may need to do it in a different way to ensure that they

are following the orders of the public health officer — have reduced

down staff, perhaps, because some staff may be working from home or not

be in the office. They will continue to get their contract money. They

will continue to get those funds because we need those not-for-profits

and social service agencies to be in place in the community. They will

continue to receive supports.

I have to give huge credit to a number of groups and organizations

that are looking at how they can utilize their staff who may not be

working — they may have closed their business — to provide supports.

B.C. Housing, for example, is looking at food service delivery, starting

this week, for tenants in subsidized and affordable housing in the Lower

Mainland. They’re looking at whether they replicate that in other

agencies.

Seniors. I mentioned — perhaps I didn’t mention it in the House —

the $50 million that will be going to the United Way for the Better at

Home program. That’s, again, a program…. I give credit to the members

from the Green Party and from the official opposition who are involved

in looking at how we could expand that program, who worked with the

Minister of Health’s staff. That will help seniors stay in their own

homes. That will provide support so that they can live independently and

give them the little extra that they need to be able to provide that

support.

Then the Health Minister mentioned the Vulnerable Population

Working Group. That, again, is a group that’s in place, that’s working

with communities. I know they’ve been doing some work in the Lower

Mainland and on the Island. That, again, is looking at exactly the kinds

of needs that the member is talking about and how we ensure that the

supports are there.

We recognize that it’s critical to have those supports in the

community from the not-for-profit sector. We’re looking at how we

continue to both utilize them — because they have the expertise, and

they’re in the communities now — but also provide them with the support

that they need.

[3:15 p.m.]

Through this centralized Vulnerable Population Working Group,

there’s an ability to access resources that are needed, like handwashing

stations, as the Minister of Health mentioned, or other priorities that

they may have.

J. Johal: I just want to close this with a comment.

I thank the Minister of Finance and staff today for coming out.

It’s a valuable conversation. I have many more questions; I could be

here all month. But we know we need to move quickly to help British

Columbians.

I think that on behalf of the opposition, what I would like to say

is that the help is immediate and now. I brought up the issue of the

food bank, but there are many other questions and many more vulnerable

groups that need our help.

I hope we can work collectively and constructively, moving

forward, for the people of British Columbia. We have many more specific

questions on how those programs will be implemented, how we handle our

valuable taxpayer dollars, but at the end of the day, making sure this

is still about public service and making sure we get those dollars out

to the people of British Columbia as fast as possible.

I thank you, Madam Chair, and I thank the Finance Minister and all

of you here today.

S. Furstenau: Following up on some of the questions from the member opposite,

more specific to government services. We’re wondering if the minister

can provide us some information about the actual mechanics of how people

will be receiving services they need — for example, Ministry of Children

and Family services, support services for families. What are the

mechanics of continuing that level of government service to people that

are vulnerable and in need of help?

Hon. C. James: Each of the ministries is involved in their own emergency plans,

so each individual minister and ministry will be putting in place how

they provide those critical services and supports, what resources they

need to be able to do that.

That’s why the $1.7 billion is put aside, because we know there

will be pressures. We know there will be pressures on a variety of

services that I talked about earlier to the previous member, everything

from income assistance to disabilities to areas where people are

vulnerable. We talked earlier about violence against women and some of

the challenges that self-isolation, in particular, can cause.

Those ministries will be able to look at the programs and services

they’re providing through their emergency programs and through the work

that they’re doing and be able to access those dollars as they need

them. That’s why we’ve left the flexibility, because we know that those

are going to go up and down, just in the same way that we talked about

how businesses may need more support or employees may need more support.

Agencies and ministries will need different kinds of supports at

different kinds of times, depending on what situation we’re

in.

It will be done, as you will see, so there’s accountability. It

will be done through Treasury Board submissions and an opportunity for

people to say: “This is where the need is greatest. These are the kinds

of supports that we need to put in place.” So the accountability is

there. There will be accountability around the dollars but also

flexibility to make sure that we can provide them where the need is

greatest and where the pressure is greatest as well.

S. Furstenau: Thank you to the minister for the answer there.

The member opposite asked about food banks and other services. I

think one of the criticisms that has been raised about the federal

response has been somewhat of a lack of support for NGOs and the

important role that NGOs are going to play as we weather this health and

economic crisis.

Could the minister elaborate a little bit more on how the province

is working to fill in the gaps that have been identified in the federal

response and what’s being done to support non-profits?

Hon. C. James: The Minister of Social Development has been working closely with

the not-for-profit sector, has already held a round table this past week

and I know is back in touch, again, with his colleagues in the social

services field to make sure that he’s hearing firsthand from where the

pressures are and talking to us about those pressures. Obviously, Social

Development, as well, will be providing support and looking at programs

that will assist their clients.

But they also, whether it’s Social Development or Ministry of

Children and Families, contract with a number of these not-for-profit

agencies. And as I mentioned, I think the member will have seen the

release around child care as a very good example, where child care

centres may be staying open to provide supports for emergency personnel.

That could be everyone from nurses and doctors and first responders to

grocery clerks and people that we need to keep our system

running.

[3:20 p.m.]

Normally, if they would only have six children, for example, in a

20-child centre, they would have that money taken back. They would be

able to only get support for the children that are there. That’s not

going to happen.

We’re going to make sure that that support and more is provided,

covering off the parent fees so that those centres can stay open, that

they can operate, that they can provide support for people who need

child care to be able to provide all the services that all of us rely on

in communities. Even centres that close down, that aren’t able to stay

open because parents are keeping their kids at home, which is encouraged

if they’re able to do that…. Those centres that close down will still

receive a portion of their funding that they utilize to be able to pay

their rent or their lease, so we don’t lose those child care

spots.

That’s a really good example of the kind of work that we’re doing

with the not-for-profit sector and with the social services sector to

make sure that those critical services that, yes, will be needed through

this difficult time…. But also, we need them there in good times. We

need them there to provide that support. So we’re working very closely

with those sectors as well.

S. Furstenau: On the more fiscal front, could the minister give some insight…?

With the deferment of tax payments that we’re looking at as part of this

larger package, is that going to limit the revenue that government will

be able to bring to bear to address the crisis with all of these

initiatives, and what is the approach that’s going to be taken on

that?

Hon. C. James: I think one of the important pieces I want to start with is that

this $5 billion is additional spending to the regular government budget.

So this is not counting existing government spending. I think that’s

important to note — that these are additional dollars that will be spent

on the COVID-19 action plan.

The deferral of taxes has an impact on government, has an impact

on our debt. We will have to borrow for over that time period to be able

to cover off the resources. Because it’s a deferral, it isn’t lost

revenue, but we will have to borrow for that time period to be able to

cover off those resources. That’s the strategy that we have for

government.

A. Olsen: I also would like to raise my hands to the Finance Minister and

the people working in the Finance Ministry for being able to work in

these really difficult…. I think it’s difficult to work from home and

remotely, just a small office like a constituency office. It must be

incredibly difficult to work in a large ministry under these

circumstances and with the pressure. So I just want to raise up and

thank you all.

I want to circle back around to a few questions that were asked

around small businesses and, particularly, the approach to defer taxes

rather than provide some direct support. I think the tax deferrals help

much larger businesses more than they assist the small

businesses.

I have a number of small businesses in my riding that are reaching

out, and they’re right on the precipice of just not existing any longer.

They are really looking at how they can pay their rent, as was raised

with an example that I think I could raise, as well, in my community, of

rent being due in just about a week and nothing there to pay it, and the

business will likely not exist.

I’m just wondering if maybe the minister can highlight the

difference between how this tax deferral approach will impact a large

business as compared to what I’m really hearing — that that’s not what

the small business owner in my riding is looking for. Perhaps you can

shed some light on that.

[3:25 p.m.]

Hon. C. James: We’re certainly hearing those stories. I think we’re going to hear

those stories for a while. I think it’s going to be a very difficult

time. And I think it’s going to be a very difficult time for all of us,

as was said earlier, for all legislators across the country, across the

globe, to make a determination around the supports that need to be out

there for various sectors.

We know there are a number of sectors that are immediately hard

hit, including tourism, including the arts and culture sector as well.

So again, we’re looking at those particular areas. The hospitality

industry, as the member raised, is another area that we’re taking a look

at. We certainly have heard…. I recognize that the member sees that big

businesses will benefit from the deferral, and there’s no question about

that. But small businesses do often have those pieces built into their

budget, so those will be pieces they’ll be able to take out of their

budget and utilize for some of the other services and

programs.

The federal government, as well, has put in place a wage subsidy

for small employers. So that’s, again, when we looked at how we balanced

off what the federal government was doing with the provincial

government. Does that mean we may need to still look at doing more for

businesses? I think all of this, as I said, is evolving, so I don’t rule

anything out over the next while.

A. Olsen: A question with respect to how the tax deferment process works at

the six-month mark. Maybe I’ll just have a couple of questions, and you

can respond to them, around what’s expected at that six-month date. Is

the full amount due? I’ll just leave it at that.

Hon. C. James: We’ve given the six-month date to make sure there’s a date so

people know that there’s a review that will go on. The deferral of the

payments, the deferral of the increases in the carbon tax or the

deferral of the increase in the e-commerce piece and the sugary

carbonated drinks, again, will all be reviewed before we get to the

six-month mark, so we’ll be able to give a clear direction.

We know that businesses need that advance. You can’t just spring

it on them and say that all these pieces need to be in place. We need to

see what the situation is like, quite frankly, to see whether you’re

seeing the economy start to turn around or whether you’re still seeing

great challenges and we’ll have to look at an extension or some other

issues that will need to be addressed. Again, ever changing as the

situation evolves but confident that we will do the work that needs to

be done before we get to the six-month mark for businesses.

A. Olsen: Serves me right for trying to package up a bunch of questions into

one. It doesn’t work. So with respect to how the province expects the

businesses to be able to handle six months of backlog, has there been

some thought into whether or not a business would be required to pay for

the entire six months? How does a business who defers their tax payments

catch up? What is the expectation of the government?

Hon. C. James: Again, that’s got to be part of the discussion with businesses. We

have to be having that discussion as we’re going along, not at the

six-month mark or not to give them notice, as we get closer to the end

of September, to say: “Now you’re going to have to pay the whole

amount.”

There will be discussions around what’s the best or what will be

the most-needed strategy. Will it be a further extension on the

deferrals? Will it be a payment plan around how they add that to monthly

payments that will be in place? There’s a whole variety of ways it could

be looked at. We’ll make sure we’re working closely with business to

address the situation in the time and place that we’ll be in, probably

by the summer, I would expect, to see where things are at and make a

determination.

A. Olsen: Just one final question around this for now, and again, I need to

highlight what the member for Richmond-Queensborough said. There are

many, many questions to be asked here, and I think, recognizing the

steep slope that we’re climbing up here, there’s no way that we’re going

to be able to get to them all.

[3:30 p.m.]

I do have a concern that has been raised in our community — I

think it’s probably been raised in many communities across the province

— where a commercial landlord is not being flexible in terms of their

tenants getting some relief from rent in the short term.

I know that this question has been asked, but I’d just like to ask

it again here in this forum. What is the provincial government able to

do or willing to do for those small business owners who are facing

landlords where there is no relief coming? They’re expected to pay rent

at the beginning of next month.

Hon. C. James: I think as much as we hear the great stories — and there are some

amazing stories of landlords who have been flexible, who have been

generous in these kinds of difficult times and who are working well with

their tenants — I expect that there will be some of these stories as

well, where there are difficulties.

That’s why the federal government put in place their loan program

for businesses. So they can have some liquidity. So they can deal with

the cash flow. That is available to businesses who may be struggling

around the rent piece.

Certainly, if it’s a triple-net lease example or they’re in the

situation of a triple-net lease…. Again, the reduction of the property

school tax by 50 percent is expected to be provided to the business that

is in that lease so that they can get that break. That is the

expectation of government in providing that 50 percent cut.

We’ll be watching that piece very closely as well.

S. Furstenau: We’ve spoken a lot today about the most vulnerable people in the

province. Some of the points that have been raised by some economists,

in light of both the federal and provincial packages, are the people

that are currently, today, living below the poverty line. So people who

are collecting welfare, disability, guaranteed income

supplement.

My question for the minister around this is: for, particularly,

people who are receiving social assistance, will the work search and

training requirements be relaxed during this crisis, and will there be a

look at increasing those payments while we are enduring this

crisis?

Hon. C. James: This is, again, a piece that the member and others will hear about

shortly. It’s work that’s going on with Social Development right now.

It’s how those supports can be in place. That’s really why…. Again, as I

mentioned earlier, the $1.7 billion is there to provide those supports.

I know the minister will have something more to say about that

shortly.

S. Furstenau: Another question that’s come up very regularly is around a rent

bank. Is there work being done to implement a rent bank?

Hon. C. James: Rent banks are in place in a number of areas, but a very small

number of areas. Rent banks were certainly one of the discussion points

and are not off the table. They still continue to be one of the

discussion areas.

Again, the challenge with rent banks is they’re not in every

community so couldn’t be accessed by everyone. That’s why I mentioned

earlier the existing rent supplement program. Perhaps expanding the

criteria might be another option as well as supporting the rent banks

that are in place in communities. I think we’re going to need as many

opportunities and as many examples as we can to meet the needs of all

British Columbians.

S. Furstenau: Could the minister just give us some insight into how the hydro

deferment will work?

[3:35 p.m.]

Hon. C. James: There are two pieces to the hydro piece. These will be pieces

that…. People will be able to apply through Hydro and talk directly to

Hydro. One is a deferral of bills, of payments. They have the

opportunity to do that. There’s a crisis grant that people can access

through Hydro as well.

So it’s a two-part piece. People will have the opportunity,

through Hydro, to be able to apply for those supports.

S. Furstenau: Just the last one on our most vulnerable population members. For

those who are concerned with just meeting their basic needs, the Finance

Minister has indicated that there will be a $1,000 tax-free cheque, but

it won’t be available until May. What are the measures right now, as

people face looking at how to pay for their groceries and other

essential needs?

Hon. C. James: A couple of pieces. There’s no question. I think this is a piece

that not-for-profits…. We mentioned food banks earlier, mentioned the

social services agencies. They will be coming forward and having that

discussion around their needs with the committee that’s in

place.

I think it’s important to note again, just for those who may be

listening, that this doesn’t take away any of the supports that are

already in place for people on income assistance and disability — things

like crisis grants and those kinds of things, where people are very

stretched and they have the opportunity to be able to apply for those.

None of that changes. All of that structure is still in place for people

who are in need.

Then I think the other piece has been talked about. We will do

everything we can to move along the payments that are in place, as well,

because we recognize the pressure that people are in. But I think there

are opportunities for people who are in very difficult situations,

through the crisis grants or through not-for-profits and other agencies

that are coming forward and talking about their request to look at how

we provide support for those individuals.

A. Olsen: Just a couple of other questions…. I recognize that this House is

not built to be answering questions from down this end. It’s very

difficult for you.

Just a couple of questions around the economic recovery. We’ve

canvassed the immediate support. I just want to, I think, maybe plant a

flag here more than anything that there’s also a $1.5 billion allocation

for the economic recovery. This is an area which our caucus is very much

interested in. The government has mentioned that there will be a

committee that’s formed. I’m just wondering if maybe there has been some

thought about what the composition of that committee is and how it

operates.

Hon. C. James: Thank you for the question. We will focus, as we need to, on the

health and safety. We will focus on the immediate right now. But the

purpose of putting those dollars in place, and the purpose of having it

as a third leg in the plan, was to make sure that we didn’t forget about

the economic recovery.

As I said earlier, you know, this is the situation today, but it’s

not going to be the situation in the future. We haven’t gotten into

those discussions as yet. I look forward to hearing advice and ideas

from everyone in the Legislature around the makeup of that

committee.

Certainly a number of business leaders have stepped up and said

that they’re interested. The Federation of Labour is interested. But I

expect it will be broad based. It’ll be a challenge to make sure that

it’s small enough to be workable and able to be nimble, but I think

there are a number of pieces that will be critical. We haven’t talked

yet about ministers that the Premier will appoint or involve as well. So

that’s to come. I’d encourage you to get your ideas forward and into my

office so that we’ll be ready.

Vote 52: contingencies (all ministries), pandemic response and

economic recovery, $5,000,000,000 — approved.

Hon. C. James: I move that the committee rise and report completion and

resolution and ask leave to sit again.

Motion approved.

The committee rose at 3:40 p.m.

The House resumed; S. Chandra Herbert in the chair.

Committee of Supply (Section B), having reported resolution, was

granted leave to sit again.

Hon. M. Farnworth: I call for the consideration of the reports of resolution from

the Committee of Supply.

Supply Motions

REPORTS OF RESOLUTIONS FROM

COMMITTEE OF

SUPPLY

Hon. C. James: I move:

[That the reports of resolutions from the Committee of Supply on

March 23 be now received, taken as read and agreed to.]

Motion approved.

FUNDS GRANTED FOR PUBLIC SERVICE

Hon. C. James: I move:

[That there be granted to Her Majesty, from and out of the

Consolidated Revenue Fund, the sum of 5 billion dollars towards

defraying the charges and expenses of the public service of the province

for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2021.]

Motion approved.

Introduction and

First Reading of Bills

BILL 15 — SUPPLY ACT (N o . 2),

Hon. C. James presented a message from Her Honour the

Lieutenant-Governor: a bill intituled Supply Act (No. 2), 2020.

Hon. C. James: I move that Bill 15, Supply Act (No. 2), 2020, be introduced and

read a first time now.

Bill 15 provides interim supply for ministry operations and other

appropriations for approximately the first nine months of the main

estimates for the ’20-21 fiscal year and the full amount of the

supplementary estimates for the ’20-21 fiscal year as laid out before

the Legislative Assembly in the present session.

Bill 15 also provides interim supply for government’s financing

requirements for the ’20-21 fiscal year, including the full amount of

the year’s capital expenditures, loans, investments and other financing

requirements and the full amount of the year’s disbursements for

revenues collected on behalf of and transferred to specific programs and

entities.

Deputy Speaker: The question is first reading of Bill 15.

Motion approved.

Hon. C. James: Hon. Speaker, I ask leave that the House proceed with all stages

of the supply bill this day.

Leave granted.

Bill 15, Supply Act (No. 2), 2020, introduced, read a first time and

ordered to proceed to second reading forthwith.

Deputy Speaker: Hon. Members, we will pause for a moment for the distribution of

the bill.

Please, we’ll take a brief recess of no more than five minutes, if

that’s acceptable.

The House recessed from 3:44 p.m. to 3:52 p.m.

[S. Chandra Herbert in the chair.]

Second Reading of Bills

BILL 15 — SUPPLY ACT (N o . 2),

Hon. C. James: I move that Bill 15, Supply Act (No. 2), 2020, be read a second

time now.

Existing voted appropriations will expire on March 31, 2020. Bill

15 provides interim supply for ministry operations and other

appropriations for approximately the first nine months of the 2021

fiscal year, as presented in the 2021 main estimates. Interim supply for

ministry operations and other appropriations is required to ensure

continuation of government services until the final supply bill comes

into force.

Due to the coronavirus pandemic, it is unknown when the House will

complete the debate of the appropriations presented in the 2021

estimates. Therefore, Bill 15 provides for an additional supply compared

to what would normally be a very typical year. Bill 15 also provides the

full amount of the 2021 supplementary estimates to support services to

protect the health and safety of people exposed to or impacted by the

coronavirus disease, COVID-19, which will bring relief to the people and

businesses affected by COVID-19, and to build and implement the

province’s plan for economic recovery related to the impacts of

COVID-19.

Hon. Speaker, Bill 15 also provides the full amount of combined

voted amounts in schedules C and D of the 2021 main estimates for

disbursements related to capital expenditures, loans, investments and

other financing requirements. The full authorization provided for in

relation to these disbursements is again higher than that authorized in

relation to ministry operations, as the disbursements described in

schedules C and D are not evenly distributed throughout the year. As

with interim supply for ministry operations and other appropriations,

due to the pandemic, Bill 15 provides for an additional supply compared

to a typical year.

Bill 15 also authorizes the full amount of disbursements referred

to in

schedule E of the 2021 main estimates.

Schedule E of the main

estimates outlines the revenue collected on behalf of and transferred to

specific programs or entities. There is no impact on the operating

results, borrowing or debt resulting from the collection and transfer of

this revenue. These interim supply appropriations are based on the

accountabilities and allocations outlined in the 2021 main estimates and

the 2021 supplementary estimates.

[3:55 p.m.]

The final supply bill for the 2021 fiscal year will incorporate

these amounts to ensure that it reflects the sum of all voted

appropriations to be given to government in that fiscal year.

M. de Jong: Again, I won’t be long, except I think it bears emphasizing that

the concept of a supply bill or what we generally refer to around here

as an interim supply bill is not unusual. It is standard fare that

between the introduction of the budget in February and the passage of

the final supply act, usually towards the end of May, government

operations need to continue and the House provides for a portion of the

budgeted amount to flow to the Crown.

What is unusual here is the length and the amount. That, as the

Minister of Finance has indicated, is attributable to the fact that we

simply do not know when the estimates process will resume and complete.

But to those who might say to all members of the House, “Haven’t you

virtually passed the budget…?”

The minister will, I’m sure, agree that that is not the case.

There is a scrutinizing process that will eventually occur, and the

minister and her colleagues understand that the opportunity will exist

to pose questions about decisions that are being made, will be made and

decisions that will be made in the interim, including decisions around

the allocation of the sizeable contingency amount that the House has

approved for the minister and the government today.

The official opposition, I think, along with all members of the

House, appreciates the urgency and the necessity for ensuring that there

is reliable supply, which is, I suppose, a technical way of saying that

the Crown has to have money to pay for government, and the people need

to know that that funding is there for all of the services and more that

will be called upon particularly during the difficult days

ahead.

It is on that basis, of course, that the opposition is lending its

support to the much larger amount, three-quarters of the budgeted amount

that is referred to in the Supply Act, Bill 15.

A. Olsen: Just in recognition of the extraordinary measures that are being

taken here today, I’d just like to take a few minutes to outline and to

provide some comment with this.

Every British Columbian owes a debt of gratitude to the

professionals that are working on the front lines and in hospitals, care

homes and all those helping in immeasurable ways to ensure people get

the care and support that they need.

I want to extend some special recognition to the chief medical

officer in our province, Bonnie Henry. Dr. Henry has become a household

name and a trusted voice for countless British Columbians, and I echo

the many British Columbians who have reached out on line to say that I

hope that she is well and to thank her for the service that she is doing

for our province.

This is an unprecedented moment in time. The best medical advice

here and around the world is that physical distancing remains the best

way that we can limit the spread of the virus to save lives. For many,

this means businesses are closing down and workers are being laid

off.

I think it’s critical to understand that the supply act in front

of this House today isn’t a traditional economic response. It’s part of

our immediate health response. What legislators must do is make sure it

is economically possible for people to physically distance themselves

from each other. If we fail to provide the support necessary for workers

and business owners to survive a period of economic shutdown, then we

risk losing one of the most important health policy responses that we

have, physical distancing.

The federal government led the way last week when they rolled out

their phase 1 of the federal COVID-19 economic response plan. Today the

province responds with some additional measures. We’re happy to support

those measures. Governments at every level have a role to play.

Sometimes that will mean developing coordinated programs and approaches.

In others, it will mean filling the gaps in our policy

responses.

[4:00 p.m.]

My colleague and I stand in full support of the need to address

this crisis with rapidly rolled out and coordinated health and economic

policies. All parties have made an incredible effort to meet this crisis

united, putting partisanship aside in favour of what is necessary in

this initial response.

Let’s be clear. This is the provincial government’s first

response. There may very well need to be additional policies as we get

more information about the trajectory we’re on or as we identify gaps in

this policy response. Where the speed of money getting to people and in

small businesses’ hands is most important is in this immediate response.

We must be more deliberate and targeted in subsequent policies to ensure

that we’re not leaving people behind or failing to think about how our

policies will affect the long-term recovery of our economy.

In response, we’ve seen so far that there are at least three areas

where more support looks to be warranted. First, for renters, we heard

that more is coming this week. We expect that policies will be rolled

out to ensure that people are not being evicted and that renters have

access to additional support, should they need it. This cannot simply be

passing the cost on to landlords, many of whom are renting out suites in

homes or single units. This must be a thoughtful approach to supporting

the rental ecosystem.

Second, we need to think about the NGOs, the non-governmental

organizations that already take so much responsibility across countless

communities in supporting those most at risk. COVID-19 increases those

risks. It is NGOs that already have support programs in place that, in

many cases, can be our strongest ally in ensuring that we don’t leave

people behind.

Finally, we should take a hard look at how our response supports

small business owners and their ability to maintain payrolls and keep

the doors to their businesses from closing permanently. The fewer

businesses that are forced to take these drastic steps, the better shape

our economy will be in on the other side. These businesses hold

communities together, employing more people than any other sector of our

economy. We do not want to emerge on the other side of this and have

businesses unable to reopen and struggling to return to the jobs that

they once had. This will slow down the recovery and increase the cost

government will pay.

This bill provides nine months of funding to implement the 2020

provincial budget, which was introduced just over a month ago. It feels

like a completely different time. It also adds room to spend an

additional $5 billion to respond to the emergency before us as a result

of COVID-19. This includes $1.7 billion to address immediate health care

and social services needs created by this pandemic: funding for housing,

income assistance, Community Living B.C. and other social supports,

shelter programs and corrections. It includes ongoing funding for

contracted services that deliver crucial programs on behalf of, or in

partnership with, the province.

There’s $1.8 billion allocated for the supports for individuals

and businesses. The province will be topping