The House met at 10:04 a.m.

[The Speaker in the chair.]

Routine Business

Prayers and reflections: Tony Luck.

[10:05 a.m.]

Introductions by Members

Jennifer Blatherwick : I am very pleased today to welcome to this House members of the Butterfly Support

Network. I would like to have the House welcome Erin Sowerby Green, bereaved mother of Briar; Kimberly Lockhart, bereaved mother to Wilder; Nick and Laura Bordignon, with baby Marcus, who are bereaved parents to Makayla.

Thank you for the work you do to support bereaved parents across British Columbia.

I ask the House to welcome them.

Macklin McCall : I would like to welcome two constituents of mine visiting here today from the riding

of West Kelowna–Peachland: Thomas Hogge and Deborah Lynn MacGregor. It’s great to have them here to see the work we do in the House and the democratic

process in action.

Will this House please join me in welcoming them to the Legislature today.

The Speaker : Minister of Water, Land and…. Resource Stewardship. It’s a mouthful. It’s such a mouthful.

Hon. Randene Neill : Thank you, hon. Spuh-uh….

I’m so sorry. I’m a little bit punch drunk.

[Laughter.]

The Speaker : You can continue now.

Hon. Randene Neill : Okay. Not only is it Leg. Friday, but it is also an incredibly important day because

40 years ago today, the Minister of State for Local Government and Rural Communities

was born, and it has made this side of the House so, so much better.

I’m hoping everyone can help us wish her a very happy birthday.

Lynne Block : This coming Sunday is my wonderful grandson Fraser’s seventh birthday. He is such

a keener and an absolute duck to water with ice hockey. Passionate about it.

Will the House please help me wish him a very happy birthday on Sunday.

Darlene Rotchford : Bear with me. I have four introductions to make in the House today.

First and foremost, I would like to welcome Valerie Chamberlain, the interim lobby

coordinator for south Island for BCNU; and I would like to welcome Caitlin Jarvis,

the regional council member for BCNU. I had the privilege of spending a day at Victoria

General Hospital last week celebrating our nurses on south Vancouver Island.

Can everyone give them a warm welcome and welcome to the House.

Mandeep Dhaliwal : I would like to introduce members of the Sikh community who are here from the Lower

Mainland and are involved in community advocacy. Please join me in welcoming Raj Singh Bhanda, from Guru Nanak Jamaz Heritage Society; Jaymeets Singh Bal; Kanwar Sing Randhawa; Kushiar Singh; Aman Singh; Yadwinder Singh; Arsh Singh; Maninder Singh; Mehak Singh; Iqbal Singh.

Please join me in welcoming them in the Legislature.

Darlene Rotchford : Also in the House today, I have two BCGEU members in the House. It’s always an honour

when I can stand up and support union sisters from my union. First, we have Rebecca

Massey. She is a young worker from Local 1201, with our administrative professionals,

out of Prince George Courts. She is also on the

article 29 joint labour-management

committee.

Good luck. As a young worker who started when I was not as young as I am now, it’s

always great to have young workers in the House.

[10:10 a.m.]

Last but certainly not least, someone who is known to this side of the House, DJ Pohl,

who is the vice-president in BCGEU for admin services. DJ and I go way back. She is

a force to be reckoned with, to say the least. She represents admin professionals.

She has represented her local labour council. She is an environmental advocate who

kicks me in the butt regularly and reminds me of what’s important.

Personally, I would not be here. She is a union sister and a friend. And because it

wouldn’t be anything funny without it, DJ, I also like my fluff in the form of bunnies.

That is an internal joke, and you will forever take it with you.

Please welcome them both to the House.

David Williams : As everybody knows, when we’re here in the chamber and in Victoria, there are people

at home that do a lot of the work behind the scenes. I’d just like to wish a happy

birthday to my biggest supporter, and that would be my spouse, Denise. I am wishing

you a happy birthday.

Hon. Mike Farnworth : In the gallery today, we have four representatives from a great B.C. company, Terra

Remote Sensing. It is an aerial marine survey mapping company based in North Saanich,

B.C., that has been involved with a lot of infrastructure projects, disaster mitigation,

and environmental monitoring in our great province.

I’d like the House to welcome Dave Mostyn, Dean Johnson, Ted Roesch and Taylor Davis.

Kristina Loewen : Today it’s a pleasure to welcome Livvy McMahon and Brandon Castor to the House. I

met Livvy about a month ago at a conference in Kelowna, Inspired City Summit, and

we had a great connection. It turned out she lived nearby here and had never been.

We’re happy to welcome her and her colleague. They work with M3 Development, specializing

in affordable and supportive housing development projects in British Columbia. I know

she is looking forward to her tour today.

Would the House please join me in welcoming her and Brandon to the House.

Hon. Kelly Greene : It was such a pleasure to look up into the gallery today and see my cousin-in-law

Erin Greene, now Sowerby Greene. We met when we were much, much younger, and I am

so proud of the work that she has done, turning her grief into action to help others.

Trevor and I send you our love.

George Anderson : I rise today to congratulate a group of exceptional grade 12 students from Dover Bay

Secondary School in Nanaimo, Haitao Yuan, Thomas Grounds, Jack Bannister and Cody

Croft. At the 2026 Skills Canada British Columbia provincials in April, these students

won a gold medal in the mobile robotics competition for secondary students. On May

28 and 29, they will be in Toronto, along with over 500 competitors from across Canada,

competing in over 40 skilled trades and technology competitions.

Will the whole House please join me in congratulating Haitao, Thomas, Jack and Cody

on their provincial win and wish them the best of luck representing British Columbia

in Toronto.

Hon. Jessie Sunner : I’d like to welcome two members of our community that have done so much to build our

community. Mannu Sandhu is a community leader. She does so much work with the International

South Asian Film Festival. She’s an incredible international actress in her own right

and now is also a fitness icon.

I can’t wait to get some tips, in a few months, from you.

As well, her husband, Raj Aadmi, who is a fitness icon in his own right, as well as

a community builder, a philanthropist, a CEO. He has one of the coolest car washes

in our riding, SpeedWash, as well.

I just want to welcome them to the House. If the House will please join me in welcoming

them.

Rob Botterell : It’s my honour and pleasure to introduce to the chamber former MLA Adam Olsen and

SȾÁUTW̱ First Nation and chair of the W̱SÁNEĆ school board, Chief Pelkey.

I always appreciate their visits, and I hope the House will join me in making them

feel very welcome.

[10:15 a.m.]

Hon. Jagrup Brar : I would like to welcome and introduce my good friend Todd Stone. I’ve been told he

is here in the building. He is the president and CEO of the AME, known as the Association

for Mineral Exploration.

I just want to say that Mr. Stone, since he took this job, has been a very strong

advocate for the sector. Working together, we were able to deliver fixed permitting

timelines to the sector in the province of British Columbia. We are the first province

to do it. Similarly, working together, we were able to bring in, in the year 2025,

the highest amount of exploration expenditures, which is $751 million.

I look forward to working with him in moving forward to make the mining sector more

strong. I would like to ask the House’s members to please make him feel welcome.

Dallas Brodie : It’s my very great honour today to introduce a group of young men who are seated

in the gallery. They are here with their teacher Tim Stevens, a social studies teacher.

His students are in grades 11 and 12.

They are from St. George’s School, which is a private day and boarding school for

boys in my riding of Vancouver-Quilchena. They are a mix of classes and are here today to watch question period and learn

about the B.C. provincial system in person as a year-end trip.

Please welcome them into the House.

Steve Kooner : I’d also like to welcome Raj Aadmi and Mannu Sandhu as well. I know them from the

community. So welcome, you guys.

Amna Shah : I am quite pleased to welcome Tim Stevens to the precinct here today along with his

classes. I had the pleasure of meeting Tim at the B.C. Teachers’ Institute on Parliamentary

Democracy last year. Tim is an incredible teacher who has such passion for education

all across this province and having his students involved in the democratic process

here.

Will the House also join me in welcoming an incredible teacher from Vancouver.

Introduction and

First Reading of Bills

Bill M245 — Young Workers

Income Tax Relief Act

Tara Armstrong presented a bill intituled Young Workers Income Tax Relief Act.

Tara Armstrong : I move that a bill intituled the Young Workers Tax Relief Act, of which notice has

been given in my name on the order paper, be introduced and read a first time now.

This bill seeks to rectify the neglect that our youth have suffered on the part of

our government’s reckless spending and excessive taxation. Today home ownership is

unattainable, unemployment is climbing, and wages are stagnating. And 77 percent of

British Columbians who have left the province have been under the age of 40 — millennials

and Gen Z.

The Young Workers Tax Relief Act will address this generational crisis. This bill,

firstly, will reduce the income tax burden of B.C. taxpayers that are under the age

of 40 by 50 percent. Older generations came of age in the most prosperous time of

western civilization, where success was the norm, not an exceptional story. Today

it is quite the opposite.

This bill will reinstate the norm that B.C. youth deserve and that a living wage is

not a luxury. It will make life affordable again for young British Columbians by letting

them keep more of what is theirs.

The second major component of this bill is a mandatory 50 percent reduction in public

spending over the next five years — the single biggest public spending cut in B.C.’s

history. The government has consistently been running the highest deficits in our

history, and they’ve been dropping this mounting debt on the laps of young people

to pay off for years. This bill will end the unsustainable loop of recklessly borrowing

on our children’s credit, and it’ll finally invest in their future.

It’s the duty of a civilization to preserve its achievements for future generations.

The Young Workers Income Tax Relief Act will give Gen Z and young millennials the

relief they need after years of neglect.

I submit this bill to the House.

[10:20 a.m.]

The Speaker : Members, the question is the first reading of the bill.

Motion approved.

Tara Armstrong : I move that the bill be placed on the orders of the day for a second reading at the

next sitting of the House after today.

Motion approved.

Members’ Statements

Peace River South

Area and Constituents

Larry Neufeld : I rise today to speak of something that’s quite dear to my heart, and that, of course,

is the community of Peace River South or the riding of Peace River South and, more importantly, the beautiful people that live in that region. This region

is not only a wonderful place to live, work and raise a family but also one of the

true economic engines of British Columbia, and I think that’s quite often forgotten.

Every single day, the hard-working people of Peace River South help drive the provincial

economy forward. Our region produces the energy that heats homes and powers industries.

Our farmers and ranchers help feed communities across Canada and beyond. Our forestry

sector supports jobs, manufacturing, while our tradespeople, truck drivers, contractors

and small businesses keep northern British Columbia moving.

From natural gas and forestry to agriculture, mining, tourism and transportation,

Peace River South plays a critical role in generating the wealth and economic activity that supports

services and infrastructure throughout this province.

Our riding is also home to critical infrastructure that connects northeast British

Columbia, including the Taylor Bridge — an important transportation link relied on

every day by residents, workers and industry — and, of course, in addition to the

very well-known Site C dam and the lesser-known, perhaps, Peace Canyon dam. As I’ve

said, the true strength of Peace River South is its people.

Northern British Columbia has always stepped up for this province. The people of Peace River South ask for very little in relation to what we provide. When Peace River South succeeds, British Columbia succeeds. Our region is more than a point on a map. It

is a major contributor to the prosperity of this province and a reminder that the

hard-working people of rural and northern British Columbia remain essential to our

collective future.

Reconciliation and

Meaning of Favourite Song

Debra Toporowski / Qwulti’stunaat : A member across the way recently shared that his favourite song is “Beds Are Burning”

by Midnight Oil. It happens to be mine as well. I wanted to speak about what this

song means to me.

It’s a song that has endured for a reason, not just because of its sound but because

of what it asks of us. At its core, it speaks to responsibility, particularly when

it comes to land, justice and consequences of looking the other way. The bigger message

of the song…. The lyrics point to disposition of Aboriginal land, broken promises,

inequality and the moral responsibility to fix it.

The line, “How can we sleep when our beds are burning?” continues to resonate because it captures something uncomfortable but true — that

awareness carries with it an obligation to act. Here in British Columbia, that message

is all too real. It connects directly to the work of reconciliation, to the question

of land and title and to the need for meaningful partnership with Indigenous Peoples.

These issues are present, ongoing and require our collective attention.

What I appreciate about what the member raised — that song — is that it reflects a

shared understanding, at least in part, of those responsibilities. It is worth recognizing

when there is common ground in principle, because progress often begins there.

I want to thank the member for raising it. It’s a reminder worth sharing that the

work before us is not just political but moral, and that we each have a role to play

in ensuring we respond to those words.

Sikh Community and

Remembrance of History

Mandeep Dhaliwal : Today I rise to recognize members of the Sikh community gathered at Sri Guru Nanak

Gurdwara Sahib in Surrey, including families connected to Tarn Taran Sahib and Baba

Bakala Sahib.

[10:25 a.m.]

The lives and sacrifices of Guru Arjan Dev Ji and Guru Tegh Bahadur Ji teach us to stand with truth, courage and justice even during hard times.

This week also marks the 112th anniversary of the Guru Nanak Jahaz, an important part

of British Columbia’s history. This story connected to Vancouver reminds us that it

is important to remember history honestly and respectfully.

As June starts, many Sikh families across British Columbia remember the painful event

of June 1984. For many people, this time brings memories of loss, pain and suffering

that still affect families today. Public institutions must remember history with honesty,

respect and dignity.

Sikh British Columbians have contributed greatly to this province through business,

farming, transportation, education, public service and community leadership. Moments

like this remind all members of this House of every political party about this importance

of truth, remembrance and respect for the democratic institution.

May this assembly continue to honour history with truth, remember the past with dignity

and support equality with honesty and integrity.

Butterfly Support Network

Jennifer Blatherwick : I welcome to the House members of the Butterfly Support Network, a B.C. non-profit

that wraps assistance, resources and community around families that are experiencing

pregnancy loss, infant loss and infertility.

Their work is so important because there is so little preparation and structure built

around the real and common challenges to having children. As we move from childhood

into adulthood, we learn about the hushed secrets that are often kept from us as we

grow inside our own families and the hidden losses that permeate the adult world.

As a society, we have become more open, but the loss still happens in shadow for many

families. Being able to reach out and receive support from others who have walked

that path is invaluable, because there are so many of us who walk it alone. One in

four pregnancies end in loss, and one in six couples will navigate fertility challenges

every year in British Columbia. These losses, the painful waiting and the grief are

real, even though so often there is nothing for the outside world to see.

Parents and families can feel so alone. The Butterfly Support Network is there to

help, and they do. The volunteers and members of the network have helped thousands

of people navigate infertility or perinatal loss by offering support programs throughout

B.C., including free counselling, support groups, peer support, bereavement resources

and community events, to ensure no one navigates this journey alone.

This work is done by volunteers who understand this from walking the paths themselves.

They have turned their experience into a shining light, making sure families across

B.C. can receive genuinely understanding support.

I thank them for their deeply human, important work, and I ask you to join me.

Biodiversity

Rob Botterell : Where do you look when you need clarity or calm? The top of a mountain, a forest trail,

the ocean at sunset. What did Emily Carr paint when she searched for inspiration?

Not the concrete jungle but rainforests. And where do scientists look for their next

discovery? To the stars, in the fungi beneath the tree bark, in the hidden systems

of the natural world.

Every scientific breakthrough, every budding idea is inspired by the things we find

in nature — by the buzzing bee gathering nectar from the petals of a flower, by the

salmon swimming upstream to return home, by the nurse logs beneath ancient Douglas

firs.

We often speak of nature as though it exists somewhere separate from us, as though

we are tourists amongst its wild petals, as though we are merely in its presence to

document or observe. But nature is not an exhibition in a museum, nor is it a barrier

to our aspirations. It is alive around us right now.

[10:30 a.m.]

As we know from watching Indigenous People and knowing of Indigenous Peoples’ stewardship

of the lands for millennia, everything is connected.

Tomorrow is World Biodiversity Day, a day established by the United Nations to raise

awareness and understanding of biodiversity issues and celebrate the rich variety

of life on earth.

In B.C., we have a lot to celebrate — salmon returning, the restoration of cultural

burning practices, the protection of endangered caribou — but there is still urgent

work to do. B.C. has more species at risk than anywhere else in Canada yet remains

one of the only provinces without stand-alone species-at-risk legislation.

We have a choice right now. When future generations look to us, will they read about

our choices in the caption at a museum or see it on a walk through the forests?

Elder Abuse

Susie Chant : Thank you for the opportunity to discuss an important topic, elder abuse.

Initially, I want to recognize I’m speaking on the lands of the lək̓ʷəŋən, specifically the Songhees and the xʷsepsəm, and, at home, the səlilwətaɬ and Squamish. The way the Indigenous People revere their elders sets a positive example

for all of us.

Elder abuse is defined as an action or inaction by someone in a position of trust,

such as family, friends or caregivers. It results in harm or distress to an older

person and can be physical, sexual, psychological, emotional, financial or just plain

neglect.

Often more than one type of elder abuse occurs at the same time. According to a new

Stats Canada report, the victimization of seniors by family members has reached a

record high. It has increased by 49 percent since 2018.

Financial abuse accounts for 62 percent of reported cases, which is consistent for

British Columbia. It can include misusing of seniors’ property and/or funds, bank

cards or power of attorney; theft or forgery; sharing the senior’s home without paying

a fair share of expenses; unexplained disappearance of personal belongings, such as

jewellery; undue pressure to move from, sell or relinquish their home or other personal

property; or legal documents that they don’t understand.

Protection for older adults in B.C. includes preventing isolation, taking action when

an older adult confides in you about a situation of abuse and helping them create

a safety plan if needed.

If you suspect or know of someone that is experiencing elder abuse, they can call

866-437-1940. There is an agency that is based out of New Westminster — they call

themselves SHINE; they started in 2018 — that has done amazing work to help adults

in finding housing if they’re at risk of losing housing or finding safe housing if

they need it.

I just want to say thank you to my friend Alison Silgardo for championing that cause.

Hon. Jessie Sunner : Mr. Speaker, I seek leave to make an introduction.

Leave granted.

Introductions by Members

Hon. Jessie Sunner : I’d like to welcome someone to this House that actually needs no introduction in this

House and spent nearly 20 years in this House. The Hon. Mr. Harry Bains is here, in

the House, today.

He has spent his life fighting for workers’ rights: first, 20 years with the IWA;

followed by 20 years in this House fighting for workers’ rights; and then as a Minister

of Labour, making so many advancements for workers across our province.

I’m truly grateful for all the work that he’s done. He’s a true mentor to me. I know

that he could be sitting in this seat still, if he wanted to, for the next 20 years.

But he is someone that creates space for others, makes sure that he mentors up the

next generation and really makes sure that we all are able to create this next generation

of people that will fight for working people, fight for solidarity and fight to make

sure that we are leaving British Columbians better tomorrow than they are today.

Thank you for being here.

Would everyone please make Harry Bains feel very welcome.

[10:35 a.m.]

Oral Questions

Government Process for

Title Agreement with Tāłtān Nation

Scott McInnis : Thank goodness for freedom of information.

The Public Land Use Society has obtained an FOI that reveals a foundation agreement

between the British Columbia government and the Tāłtān Central Government. This agreement involves land transfers, governance restructuring

and recognition of Tāłtān Aboriginal title and rights over 21 percent of British Columbia. The agreement was

supposed to be finalized in the fall of 2025 — all in secret, yet again.

My question to the Minister of Indigenous Relations is a very simple one. Is there

a completed final agreement which recognizes Tāłtān Aboriginal title in the northwest, yes or no?

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert : Well, I don’t know what the member’s definition of “secret” is. If you typed in Google,

“Tāłtān B.C. government,” you could find your way to one press release, two press releases,

three press releases, all around what the member is talking about.

This process has actually been underway for quite a number of years. There have been

public releases. There have been press conferences. There have been questions about

it. So I would encourage the member to try to use Google more than to use conspiracy theory when it is public.

Now, in terms of the actual substance of the member’s question, there has not been

a final agreement made. In fact, if the member wants to know why, it’s because we’ve

been working with the Tāłtān First Nations to unlock billions of dollars in mining opportunities…

Interjections.

The Speaker : Shhh.

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert : …in the northwest of this province, leading to thousands upon thousands of jobs. That’s

been our focus.

The Speaker : Member has supplemental.

Scott McInnis : I am sorry to upset the minister today. I asked a very simple question about that

foundation agreement, and yet again, and to no surprise, I didn’t get an answer for

British Columbians.

Interjections.

The Speaker : Shhh.

Scott McInnis : Is there a completed final agreement which recognizes Aboriginal title for the Tāłtān Nation in the northwest of B.C., yes or no?

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert : I recognize it’s hard to use Google, and I recognize it’s hard to pivot when I’ve

given you an answer. I was very clear.

Interjections.

The Speaker : Shhh. Members.

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert : I’m sorry the member’s colleagues scream so much. I know it’s hard for him to hear.

Interjections.

The Speaker : Members. Members.

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert : But we’ll put on our listening ears, and maybe we’ll hear the answer, which is…

Interjection.

The Speaker : Member.

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert : …that, no, there’s no final agreement made with Tāłtān. In fact, we’ve been working with them to unlock billions in opportunities in mining

right now.

We’ll continue the conversations, but I would encourage the member to use the internet

for research, or he can ask me. I’ve been very clear. If he has questions, he can

follow up with me.

Oh no, the member can actually check the Hansard record, and he can follow up, but instead he chooses to….

Interjections.

The Speaker : Members.

Member. Member for Columbia River–Revelstoke, enough.

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert : …throw out accusations instead of actually asking real questions to solve real problems.

Federal Government Tax Reduction

Program for Homebuyers

Linda Hepner : Almost two months ago 11 of B.C.’s leading industry groups asked the Premier to pursue

the same federal housing deal that Ontario got. Today an Ontario family buying a home

qualifies for up to $130,000 in combined tax relief. A B.C. family buying today gets

nothing. But this Premier has lots of time to fight Ottawa on pipelines.

Today will the minister tell British Columbians if this government will fight for

an equivalent deal for B.C. families, yes or no?

Hon. Christine Boyle : Thanks to the member for the question.

I’ve been very clear in the public and media that B.C. is working hard at negotiating

a bilateral deal with the federal government and that we are fighting hard for British

Columbians to ensure that B.C. gets a deal that is as good as Ontario’s.

[10:40 a.m.]

We are in those negotiations, and we look forward to having something to announce

soon as part of our ongoing work to reduce the cost of delivering housing that is

resulting in a stabilization of housing prices and that’s resulting in increased vacancy

rates and decreased rent prices.

I’ll note that members opposite have opposed nearly all of the actions that we have

taken on housing that are seeing progress for British Columbians. We will continue

that work, including negotiating with the federal government to ensure B.C. benefits

as much as Ontario has.

The Speaker : Member, supplemental.

Linda Hepner : Look, the market for first-time buyers has effectively frozen. Ontario has taken action

while B.C. does nothing. If the NDP believe they are good friends and good listeners,

they should now listen to British Columbians.

I want to ask the minister directly: can you commit….

The Speaker : Through the Chair.

Linda Hepner : …to getting an agreement with the federal government to get new homebuyers and activate

for a stalled industry the relief that they deserve?

Hon. Christine Boyle : Yes, we are working very hard at this, not in slogans but in detailed bilateral negotiations

with the federal government. That is the work of government, and we hope to have something

to announce soon.

As I said, that is one piece of a broad suite of actions that we have taken as a government

to address housing affordability. It is starting to make a difference. We know that

work needs to continue. And again, we will continue.

But members opposite have made it clear that they would take us far backwards to years

when housing prices were skyrocketing, when rents were skyrocketing out of control,

when whole buildings were sitting empty. We heard complaints all of the time from

communities.

We have been listening to residents. We have been working with industry. We have made

a substantial difference, and we will continue that work.

RCMP Critical Response Unit

Information-Gathering Activities

Jeremy Valeriote : The B.C. Greens have long called to disband the RCMP’s critical response unit, or

CRU. It’s timely, with former MLA Adam Olsen in the House.

CRU has faced hundreds of complaints and multiple court cases for systemic Charter

violations, but these government enforcers seem to be getting more powerful. A B.C.

RCMP media relations officer said that CRU “does not monitor treaty negotiations but

that it is briefed during secretariat meetings by other ministries that are directly

involved in those discussions.”

To the Minister of Public Safety: what information about treaty negotiations are government

ministries providing to the critical response unit and for what purpose?

Hon. Nina Krieger : Thanks to the member opposite for the question. The critical response unit supports

situational awareness and cross-government coordination on public safety, employee

safety and the protection of critical infrastructure. This work is coordinated through

the critical incident secretariat of government.

This group does not monitor lawful advocacy or political activity, does not monitor

specific groups, climate initiatives or treaty negotiations. The province fully respects

the right to peaceful, lawful protest and the constitutional independence of First

Nations in their negotiations with government.

I would be pleased to speak further with the member opposite about any further questions.

The Speaker : Member, supplemental.

Jeremy Valeriote : According to the same media relations officer: “CRU provides updates to the secretariat

regarding current enforcement actions in any anticipated protest activity.” I fail

to see how that’s not monitoring some of these protests. This is in exchange for the

information the ministry provides about treaty negotiations. The secretariat maintains,

as the minister said, situational awareness of treaty negotiations and climate action.

So to restate, CRU is a paramilitary group that polices protests. Why is CRU collecting

surveillance information about treaty negotiations? What use is that information to

the Ministry of Public Safety and Solicitor General?

Hon. Nina Krieger : Thank you for the follow-up question. I will reiterate that the secretariat really

advances situational awareness and cross-ministry coordination around public safety.

There is no monitoring of specific groups or treaty negotiations or specific initiatives.

[10:45 a.m.]

This is really sharing of information in this cross-ministry coordination group. Information

might be shared that may or may not have an impact on public safety, but it is shared

to monitor events, to monitor situational awareness and to really support any work

to advance public safety that sometimes does occur.

I will also say that there are proper channels and independent civilian oversight

of the critical response unit and a complaint process for anybody that should wish

to make any complaints or ask questions or concerns.

Taylor Bridge Conditions

and Replacement

Jordan Kealy : Imagine for a moment you are setting out on a midsummer drive, and you have never

been to my region before. You have heard about how beautiful the north is and want

to experience it for yourself on a new motorcycle.

As you are cruising along Highway 97, listening to your music and taking in the scenery, you get to the mighty Peace

River and proceed across the bridge, but you never saw the hole in the grading on the bridge. In that moment, one preventable moment, your life is changed forever.

To give context to the House, Taylor Bridge is not much smaller than the Port Mann

by span or height, but the deck is open grading that is always having to be repaired. This is now the third time in less than

a year that I have stood in this house raising concerns about the Taylor Bridge. I

was just sent two pictures a couple of days ago of four new holes in the bridge decking.

The four of the grouping of the holes are no smaller than the size of this podium.

The Speaker : Question, Member.

Jordan Kealy : This is on a regular basis.

The question is: is the government waiting for a preventable tragedy before it finally

acknowledges the patching of this bridge is not a plan and gives the North a ten-year

financial plan to commit to replacing the Taylor Bridge with a new one?

Hon. Mike Farnworth : I appreciate the question from the member. As the member is well aware, on a number of issues when it comes to the Taylor Bridge, work is underway within

my ministry in terms of a long-term replacement for the Taylor Bridge. We recognize….

Interjection.

Hon. Mike Farnworth : I was responding to the member who asked a question. He’s been very politely listening,

but I see that sometimes others seem to want to chirp in. It would be nice if they

just listened to the answer.

There’s $40 million that has been spent in terms of doing that planning work for around

the bridge. There is work that is underway in terms of the approaches to the bridge

and determining the geotechnical work that needs to be done. At the same time, I can

tell the member that we’re looking to advance the project so it can be part of the

infrastructure capital plan of the province.

At the same time, I want to assure the member that the bridge is regularly inspected

in terms of its safety. Repairs are made on a constant basis. I appreciate the continued

advocacy from the member and the member from Peace River South in terms of advancing the Taylor Bridge, but the government continues its work, and

that bridge is safe.

The Speaker : Member, supplemental.

Jordan Kealy : I mentioned the holes in the decking and the dangers they pose to drivers. In previous

questions, I mentioned the reports obtained by the ICBA after they waited nine months

for the FOI request regarding special imports from 2020 to 2025 on the bridge. Metal

fatigue does not reverse. When the steel is cracked, welded and cracked again, it

does not return to its original strength.

How many times does this minister expect northern residents to accept “we’re monitoring it” only to find ourselves back in the same line of questioning again

after another hole is discovered, after another critical structure repair is needed?

My question: can the minister tell this House today what the exact given lifespan is left in this

bridge? At what point is it critical to initiate that ten-year financial plan for the bridge

to be initiated? This has been talked about for the past 20 years.

Hon. Mike Farnworth : I appreciate the question from the member. In terms of the lifespan of the bridge,

it is inspected on a regular basis. At the same time, repairs are made as they are

needed. It is inspected by professional engineers, by professional experts, where

safety is the number one priority, not just for them but also for government.

[10:50 a.m.]

Report after report, that bridge is safe, hon. Member.

We know that it is coming to the end of its life. We know that it will have to be

replaced. That is why work is underway in determining: what are the structural things

on the north slope of the bridge? What are the geotechnical issues that need to be

addressed? That work is underway.

At the same time, we also do additional work, maintenance work and repair work, to

make sure that bridge stays safe. Independent inspections say that it is, and that

will continue.

Expansion of Provincial Sales Tax to

Services and Support for Business

Elenore Sturko : My office has been inundated with letters from business owners and constituents who

are struggling to make ends meet. Rising costs are forcing businesses to put plans

for new hiring and expansion on hold, as spending habits change and sales decline.

As financial pressures rise, this government is adding insult to injury by choosing

to add PST onto services that businesses are legally required to use. One constituent

said: “It seems like this government is punishing small businesses for hiring accountants.”

At a time when our economy is struggling, businesses and consumers need some good

news, and they need a helping hand.

My question is to the Premier. Will he do the right thing and pause his plan to expand

the PST on October 1?

Hon. Brenda Bailey : Thank you to the member opposite for the question.

Our PST program is one of the most narrow PST programs in Canada, and expanding the

PST program carefully is work that we undertook in Budget 2026.

It’s important to recognize how valuable small businesses are to British Columbia,

and we continue to support small businesses in a number of ways. We have one of the

lowest small business rates. In fact, it’s 25 percent lower than it was when we began

in government and changed the rate. We’ve reduced the EHT payments that small businesses

have to make.

We know that small businesses are feeling the impact of these tariffs and this challenging

economic time. That’s why we didn’t make those changes, even though they were attached

to the carbon tax credit. We’ll continue to work with the small business community.

They’re so important to us.

The Speaker : Member, supplemental.

Elenore Sturko : British Columbia relies on the revenues that are generated by small and medium businesses

to pay for the core services that we rely upon, like education and health care. In

2024, 32 percent of B.C.’s GDP was attributed to small business activities.

Due to rising costs, many businesses have shelved their plans to expand or hire new

employees. Worse, many are choosing to close or relocate out of B.C. But instead of

giving businesses a break, this government is piling on costs, expanding the PST on

October 1.

When the NDP’s disastrous 2026 budget dropped, the Finance Minister said: “This is

about protecting core services like health care and education.”

My question to the Premier is: how is he protecting core services when he is driving

the businesses needed to pay for those services out of this province?

Hon. Brenda Bailey : I think it’s important to recognize that when businesses are hiring folks into British

Columbia, one of the things that people consider is the quality of our health care

House continues to support.

Budget 2026 made sure we’re protecting health care, made sure we’re protecting education,

also while making small changes to the PST.

Bowser Island Encampment

in North Vancouver

Lynne Block : Two years ago I wrote to the Minister of Transportation to shut down a homeless encampment

in my riding, Bowser Island, which now has a mayor and is a gated community. An entire

year later, in March 2025, the minister stated: “It’s about finding them an alternative

place to go.” Garbage and waste are overflowing into the Capilano River, never mind

the crime increase.

Another year has gone by. There has been no relocation and no action. So I would appreciate

a straightforward answer from the minister, without equivocation or obfuscation. My

question: will the minister commit today to having Bowser Island cleaned up by June

30 of this year, yes or no?

[10:55 a.m.]

Hon. Christine Boyle : Thanks to the member opposite for the question.

We share the member’s concerns. We know that encampments are not a safe, long-term

option for people. It’s why we’ve been working closely with the district of North

Vancouver, as well as other local governments, to deliver both temporary shelter and

housing spaces, as well as delivering long-term, purpose-built supportive housing

that allows people to come indoors. That’s work we’re actively engaged in with the

district, and I’m grateful to the mayor and council there for their leadership.

I’m happy to follow up with the member on details.

Emergency Services and First

Responders in Downtown Eastside

Macklin McCall : The Downtown Eastside has gotten so bad that Vancouver fire rescue services are forced

to stop responding to calls involving life-threatening and serious injuries due to

staff burnouts. In the first three months of this year, there were almost 6,000 emergency

calls from Fire Hall No. 2 in the Downtown Eastside. More than half of these were medical calls.

The provincial director for Ambulance Paramedics of B.C. said: “Maybe that’ll shine

a spotlight on how many ambulances should actually be put into service.”

How does this government plan to address these emergencies on the Downtown Eastside

now that firefighters no longer have capacity to respond to calls?

Hon. Terry Yung : Thank you to the member for the question.

I spent four years down there. I know it’s a tough situation here. We’ve always been

working closely with the fire department, the union, and also EHS, which is the ambulance

services, to make sure that people in distress in the Downtown Eastside get the help

they need at the time they need it.

We’re going to continue to look at other means of lessening the burden on both the

fire department and EHS. I can assure you that EHS actually attends quite quickly.

If you have ever spent time.… I know you’ve spent time in the Downtown Eastside. Often

they are the ones that are well equipped for medical emergencies, a little more than

the fire department.

Ongoing negotiation and arrangement are going to be in place to make sure that people

get the help they need when they need it. We also have to support the first responders

out there that are doing a really difficult job.

Supportive Housing Lease at

Downtown Eastside Hotel

Heather Maahs : This government has been keeping a 140-unit hotel, an SRO, open for just two tenants

over the past two months. One left, but the last remaining tenant, Robert, has been

offered multiple different housing options but is refusing to leave. Atira, the operator

of the Colonial Hotel, said the contract to operate expired at the end of April.

This is costing taxpayers $550,000 for two months. How can the Minister of Housing

justify spending over half a million dollars to house one person?

Hon. Christine Boyle : This is a private building. This lease was first signed in 2013. After many years

of not being able to get the private landlord to do adequate upkeep to the building,

it was the decision of B.C. Housing to relocate folks to end that lease.

We’ve been engaged in that work, tenant to tenant, finding good, stable alternative

housing for people and moving them out to close down that lease.

I can report that all of the tenants under the supportive housing agreement have now

been relocated. There is one remaining tenant who was a tenant of the private landlord

before the agreement and is not part of the Atira contract.

I can also say, as I’ve said here before, that we continue our work to build purpose-built,

dignified supportive housing in communities all over the province.

[11:00 a.m.]

As part of our Downtown Eastside provincial partnership plan, launched in 2023, we’ve

worked with partners to open approximately 1,100 new or renovated spaces for Downtown

Eastside residents, as of April. We continue to make sure people have places to go

and are partnering to open another 678 spaces for Downtown Eastside residents just

this year, building good solutions for people for the long term.

Carihi Secondary School

Fire Recovery and Restoration

Anna Kindy : Considering that this government’s running a $13.3 billion debt, they’d be concerned

about spending over half a million dollars for one room without bathrooms.

On that note, it’s been more than 540 days since the fire at Carihi Secondary School, and over 900 students in Campbell River continue to face significant disruption to their education. They are on a reduced

schedule, travelling to other schools for basic programs like PE and band and without

essential facilities such as athletics and culinary and theatre spaces. These are not extras but are foundational to a healthy, connected high school experience, especially when we are seeing the rate of mental health issues skyrocketing in our youth.

The community has called for action, yet there is still no clear timeline for reconstruction.

Can the minister provide a date for when Carihi Secondary will be fully restored?

Hon. Bowinn Ma : What happened at Carihi High is truly tragic. We have seen so many situations, so many examples, of where

fire has ravaged our valued school system across the province. On November 21, 2024, as the member said, a structural fire

led to the closure of two wings of Carihi High.

I can assure the member that the project to restore the school is supported in Budget 2026, and my ministry has been working with the school district on a business plan for this project.

I spoke with the school district chair, Craig Gillis, a couple of times in the last few weeks. I was very grateful to him

for giving me an update on the progress of this work. I agree that this kind of work,

often when it comes to structural fires, can be very frustrating and complex for school

districts.

I’ve committed to him that my ministry will expedite this. We expect to be able to

provide an update before the summer.

Action on Proposed Changes to DRIPA

Trevor Halford : Yesterday I asked two very direct questions to the Attorney General, and I want to follow up on that again today.

We are days away from the end of this legislative session, a session in which the

Premier got up and said that we would have legislation to deal with the fallout from DRIPA. This minister has said yesterday…. She touted, in her mind, the benefits

that they’ve seen from DRIPA, albeit while they’re in court dealing with the fallout

from DRIPA.

I am somewhat skeptical that this House will be back in the fall to deal with DRIPA. So my question is very specific to the Attorney General. Will

she have legislation ready to go for the fall session that will deal with DRIPA, yes

or no?

Hon. Niki Sharma : I think they ran out of questions over there. We’re recycling some from yesterday.

I’m really happy, actually, to give an update to the House on some news that we heard

this morning, that the Supreme Court of Canada granted our leave application. We were

successful in getting leave to appeal at the Supreme Court of Canada.

This is an avenue to address the legal challenges that is open to us now, along with

the discussions that we’re having with various stakeholders about solving DRIPA. We’re going to get there, and we’re working hard at doing that.

[11:05 a.m.]

[End of question period.]

Mandeep Dhaliwal : I rise to seek leave to move Motion M213 standing in my name on the order paper.

The Speaker : Members, the member has moved the motion. It would require unanimous consent to move

further. Is leave granted?

Leave not granted.

The Speaker : Thank you, Member. Leave is not granted.

Interjections.

The Speaker : Shhh, Members. Members. Shhh.

Interjection.

The Speaker : Member. Take your seat, Member.

Petitions

Jennifer Blatherwick : I rise to present a petition of 770 signatures asking the assembly to pass legislation

improving supports for individuals and families experiencing pregnancy or infant loss.

Interjections.

The Speaker : Shhh. Members.

Interjection.

The Speaker : Leader of the Official Opposition.

Orders of the Day

Hon. Mike Farnworth : I call the deferred vote on Bill 9, so I call committee on Bill 9.

The House in Committee,

Section B.

The committee met at 11:08 a.m.

[Lorne Doerkson in the chair.]

Committee of the Whole

Bill 9 — Freedom of Information

and Protection of Privacy

Amendment Act, 2026

The Chair : Members, we are in committee.

Members, yesterday a division was requested on the amendment by the Minister of Citizens’ Services to clause 2 of Bill 9, Freedom of Information and Protection and Privacy Amendment

Act, 2026. Pursuant to the motion adopted on May 19, 2026, with respect to Standing

Order 16(4), the division will take place now.

[11:10 a.m.-11:15 a.m.]

Members participating online, we would ask that you have your cameras on and microphones

ready.

Members, the question is on the amendment to clause 2 of Bill 9 on the standing orders

paper in the name of the Minister of Citizens’ Services.

[11:20 a.m.]

Amendment approved on the following division:

YEAS — 49

Lore

Blatherwick

Dhir

Routledge

Chant

Toporowski

B. Anderson

Neill

Osborne

Brar

Krieger

Davidson

Parmar

Sunner

Beare

Greene

Wickens

Kang

Begg

Arora

Higginson

Sandhu

Lajeunesse

Choi

Rotchford

Elmore

Phillip

Popham

Dix

Sharma

Farnworth

Eby

Bailey

Kahlon

Chandra Herbert

Whiteside

Boyle

Yung

Malcolmson

Gibson

Glumac

Shah

G. Anderson

Chow

Morissette

Boultbee

Sturko

Brodie

NAYS — 42

Loewen

Kindy

Milobar

Warbus

Halford

Rattée

Wat

Kooner

Banman

Hartwell

L. Neufeld

Van Popta

Dew

Clare

K. Neufeld

Rustad

Wilson

Valeriote

Botterell

McInnis

Paton

Day

Bhangu

Toor

Hepner

Giddens

Dhaliwal

McCall

Maahs

Block

Stamer

Gasper

Mok

Davis

Chan

Armstrong

Kealy

Williams

Chapman

Bird

Luck

Tepper

Hon. Diana Gibson : I move that the committee rise, report progress and ask leave to sit again.

Motion approved.

The Chair : This committee sits adjourned.

The committee rose at 11:22 a.m.

The House resumed at 11:23 a.m.

[The Speaker in the chair.]

Lorne Doerkson : The committee on Bill 9 reports progress and asks leave to sit again.

Leave granted.

Point of Order

Mandeep Dhaliwal : Point of order, unparliamentary language from the Minister of Education and Child Care, calling my motion on Sikh genocide and human rights “gross,” which is racist.

I ask for an apology to all Sikh community in the gallery, and all the Sikh community,

and that the minister retract.

Hon. Lisa Beare : First off, absolutely, I want to clarify the comment. It was inappropriate that I

called the Leader of the Opposition gross. I do withdraw that comment.

Interjections.

The Speaker : Shhh, Members. Let’s hear.

Hon. Lisa Beare : I apologize to anyone in the gallery if there was any offence. But I do withdraw the

comment to the Leader of the Opposition, calling him gross. I apologize.

Trevor Halford : I take great exception to the comments.

The member for Surrey North stood in this House to put a motion forward on Sikh genocide, which the government had

a prerogative to nay, and they did. That is their right to do, to deny him that, which

they took. But the Minister of Education does not have a right to come into this House

and determine that motion to be gross.

I believe that she needs to apologize, not just in this House but outside to that

entire community, which….

The Speaker : Member, the minister stood up, and she has already apologized and withdrawn her remark.

[11:25 a.m.]

Hon. Mike Farnworth : In this chamber, I call Committee of Supply, estimates of the Ministry of Finance.

In

Section A, the Douglas Fir Room, I call committee stage on Bill 9, the Freedom

of Information and Privacy Act.

In

Section C, the Birch Room, I call committee stage on Bill 20, K’ómoks Treaty Act.

The House in Committee,

Section B.

The committee met at 11:29 p.m.

[Lorne Doerkson in the chair.]

Committee of Supply

Estimates: Ministry of Finance

On Vote 26: ministry operations, $381,863,000.

The Chair : We are beginning the estimates of Finance. Do you have any opening remarks or anything?

Hon. Brenda Bailey : I’d first like to begin by thanking my team for their support in our upcoming estimates.

I am joined by Jonathan Dube, our deputy minister; Jeremy Hewitt, ADM; Alexander Chandler,

ADM; Chris Skillings, senior executive director; and Steve Hawkins, ED.

I look forward to the questions from the member, discussing our future operations

in this budget. Thank you.

Peter Milobar : I’ll endeavour to have the minister still be looking forward to my questions as we

hit hour 15, but we’ll see where that goes.

In terms of the overall budget, I have been looking through and searching and searching,

and I’m unable to locate…. I’ve had many, many property owners and people in Richmond

with great interest asking where exactly the mortgage backing program the Premier

has promised for people in Richmond would be in this budget.

[11:30 a.m.]

Can the minister point to where in this budget the Premier’s commitment prebudget

that mortgages would be backstopped by the provincial government for people in Richmond

based on the Quw’utsun ruling resides?

Hon. Brenda Bailey : The Ministry of Finance is working on a guarantee of support of private property owners

seeking to renew or refinance a mortgage in the title area. This guarantee is a targeted

initiative only for the 46 properties in the title area, 20 of which currently have

a loan or mortgage registered on title.

The purpose of the guarantee initiative is to preserve the status quo with respect

to mortgage financing in the title area during the government’s appeal of the court

proceeding. Eligibility will be limited to registered property owners in the title

area and only if they are denied loans or loan renewals due to the Quw’utsun decision.

The member may have other questions. I can share more about this program and implications

in the budget on the next question.

Peter Milobar : Thank you for that. So where in the budget does that liability exposure of backstopping

mortgages come into play, and what’s the dollar value in this budget?

[11:35 a.m.]

Hon. Brenda Bailey : The work on this loan guarantee continues. In fact, the meetings on the implications

of the Quw’utsun decision are happening quite regularly. I attend them. We continue this work.

But I will share with the member that even when the loan guarantee is in place, there

won’t be any fiscal impact shown in the budget until the loan is, in fact, drawn upon,

until the guarantee is drawn upon. So it won’t actually have a number attached to

it until it’s, in fact, enacted by a user.

Peter Milobar : Is the intention, then, that this only gets triggered by the user if the bank requires

it, or can the user request it regardless of whether the bank is asking for that type

of backstop or not.

Hon. Brenda Bailey : The design of the program is such that it would be available should the borrower be

able to show that a bank had, in fact, denied their renewal or application because

of the Quw’utsun decision. Then they would be able to have the government backstop that guarantee

to the loan to the bank. The government would only be required to make a payment should

there be a default by that user.

Peter Milobar : I recognize the scope and scale might be different, but just for simplicity’s sake,

if the government had to backstop $100 million worth of loan value, would that have

to start showing up as a potential liability on the government’s books, and if so,

where?

Elenore Sturko : I seek leave to make an introduction.

Leave granted.

Introductions by Members

Elenore Sturko : I’m really excited to welcome to this place students from Don Christian Elementary

School in my riding, and their teacher Taylor Spence. So 40 people here — 38 grade

5s, two adults braving a field trip over here to Victoria.

I had an opportunity to meet these students, and I can tell you that they’re very

curious about how our provincial government works. They knew a lot, actually, about

taxation. They had a lot of questions for me about how money gets spent in this province

and why their parents are paying so much tax.

They would be curious, probably, to know that right now what’s being debated by my

colleagues here is actually the budget for British Columbia and the taxes that are

getting collected and how they’re being spent.

Will the House please join me in making students, adults and teachers from Don Christian

Elementary feel most welcome.

The Chair : Indeed, welcome to everyone. The gallery is full. It’s nice to see so many youth in

our gallery today.

[11:40 a.m.]

Debate Continued

Hon. Brenda Bailey : Before I respond, I too would like to welcome the students who the member has said

are learning about taxes. When you go to take your swimming lessons, that’s supported

by tax dollars. Your teachers’ salaries, your school are supported by tax dollars.

Things you touch every day are supported by tax dollars. Taxes aren’t always evil.

They help you, so let’s not forget that aspect as well.

Back to the issue at hand. We’re discussing loan guarantees and how they are expressed

in the budget.

The member asked a question: do the loan guarantees, before drawn on, show up in the

budget? The way that this will work is that the loan guarantees will be part of the

overall debt forecast report, and that is reported out on a program level at year-end.

So there would be a statement of loan guarantees that you would see in public accounts.

But I do want to highlight for the member an important point, which is that the ministry

is not aware of any lenders refusing to renew residential mortgages based on the Quw’utsun decision, but we are prepared if needed.

Peter Milobar : The reason I ask about where it would reside and the exposure in terms of having to

account for it as a liability is because this is predicated on one court ruling, and

we don’t know what future court rulings may or may not be.

Coming from Kamloops, people are highly aware of a filing that was filed a year after

the Quw’utsun filing first started to go through court. At the time it was filed, it was pretty

boilerplate, a standard way to file claims and court actions by nations, so people

with private property really weren’t worried or had no concerns around how the filing

was made.

What has changed is the ruling in the Quw’utsun versus the filings that have been working their way through the courts for the last

seven to ten years. Now those same filings are suddenly being viewed in a completely

different lens based on the ruling in the Quw’utsun case. Because it’s an actual ruling, that has now changed how people are viewing

these existing actions in court.

It has led to a lot of concern around the province, which has led to even the Premier

saying: “Well, yeah, people should be concerned if they have private property.” At

times, he has said that. At times, he has said something completely different and

contradictory. At times, he has said there are no problems with banks. At other times,

he said that the province is going to backstop mortgages. So trying to figure out

the scale and the scope and the complexity of this….

Has the government modelled or taken into consideration the precedents a backstop

creates with the 46 properties — I believe it was 46 properties the minister mentioned

— and what that implication means, in terms of the approximately $2½ trillion of assessed

value of private property in this province, depending where future court rulings go?

They all have the same type of language filed in court that the Quw’utsun case had back in 2014 that will now be starting to be viewed through the same lens

that the ruling in the Quw’utsun has, until there is a change with appeal.

What is the government’s reaction or position or change and ability to pivot to cover

off mortgages in terms of backstopping in other areas, other than Richmond, if we

start to see those court rulings while we’re waiting for the appeal to work through

a lengthy process at the appeals court? It is a massive dollar figure of assessed

value, let alone market value, which would typically tie into the mortgages, both

commercial and residential, provincewide.

Has the government taken into account the full risk exposure that embarking on a plan

like this actually creates for government? Or does the government think that they

can simply silo this off, only deal with 46 or so properties in the Richmond area,

and the rest of the province is out of luck?

[11:45 a.m.]

Hon. Brenda Bailey : Our Premier has been clear. Government will protect private property rights and stand

behind home and business owners whose properties are in the declared title area, as

determined in the Quw’utsun decision. At the same time, government is pursuing a negotiated path forward with

Quw’utsun that respects these property rights.

The guarantee is a targeted initiative. It’s only for the 46 properties in the title

area, 20 of which currently have a loan or mortgage registered on title. It does not

set a binding legal precedent for similar support in respect of declared title area

anywhere else in the province.

Peter Milobar : Well, given that this process, as far as I’m aware, doesn’t exist for private property

backstops currently, will any such program have to come with any legislative change,

any legislative amendments, any new legislation? In other words, will it have to come

to this chamber to actually be debated, either in a miscellaneous stats bill or as

a stand-alone piece of legislation, given that we’re creating a potential liability

for the taxpayer?

We don’t know what the funding, actual exposure, could or couldn’t be. We don’t know

what the risks and the parameters will be, and we don’t know the scope, moving forward,

whether it’ll be limited to these 46 or not.

What is the process for the government to actually action this, should someone pick

up the phone and say: “My bank just told me I can’t get renewed”? Is it just simply

a brand-new risk-exposed piece, that the government can unilaterally decide through

Treasury Board discussions or cabinet discussions that we could potentially expose

the taxpayer based on a quick opinion that there is no precedent-setting, without

knowing what future court cases are?

Or is it actually going to be a process where this Legislature will actually be involved

and the broader public will then get a better sense of the true exposure, how this

program would actually work and the legislative mechanisms that are enabling government

to actually do this? Which changes have to be made to enable the government to do

that? Because if you can’t point to an actual dollar figure set aside in this budget

document, I can’t ask questions about that specific dollar exposure.

[11:50 a.m.]

I would think that that would mean that we would need to have some sort of legislative

change so that it is a bit of an open-ended program at any point in time but has been

at least through some process of scrutiny in this chamber before it can be actioned

by anyone from the public being able to tap on government’s shoulder and say: “We

need to action this.”

Hon. Brenda Bailey : This will not be a statutory program. The program, in its design, is capped at $150

million. The program is contained to the area from the Quw’utsun decision — as I’ve described, 46 properties in the title area, 20 of which have a loan or

mortgage registered on the title.

I will also share with the member that in my discussions…. As we’ve been exploring

this with a number of different banks in the province, they do not see this as a large

risk to them. They do not perceive that there will be a situation where a loan guarantee

will be necessary.

This program was committed to, and the work to stand it up has been an effort to ensure

that the people who are affected by this decision know that, should this happen, the

government would be there for them. But it’s considered quite low risk that they would

draw on this program. It’s contained by its very nature because it’s specific to the

outcomes of the Quw’utsun case.

Peter Milobar : Well, thank you to the minister for that.

Capping and everything else sounds wonderful, but there are many areas of the province,

in the Cariboo, the Tŝilhqot’in area, where ranchers and other owners are worried about what this court ruling may

have on the impact of how their area has now been viewed, moving forward, when they

go in for renewals.

So I guess the question to the government is: why…? The Quw’utsun ruling is based on a very specific geographic area, I get, but there has been great

concern around other large areas of our province with previous rulings of land mass

area, where it’s not inconceivable that a bank, based on the Quw’utsun ruling, would then rule that you cannot renew your mortgage in a completely different

area of the province not because of the court ruling specific to that area but because

of their concerns about where we’re headed in a general direction.

[11:55 a.m.]

So why is a mortgage backstopping program, if it’s not seen to be one that will likely

be actioned very much, if at all, being so constrained if it’s the parameter or the

reason for the backstop that should be the backstop, not the geography of the backstop?

What does the government say to all those other people in the rest of the province

that have concerns, to allay their concerns that if they did bump up against this,

they’re left on their own, but if their ranch happened to be in the affected area

of Richmond, the government would actually help them?

Hon. Brenda Bailey : Government has been clear that we will continue to protect the private property rights

of British Columbians and will stand behind home and business owners who are impacted

by the Quw’utsun decision. Our government is taking action in a number of ways, appealing the Quw’utsun decision and also direct negotiations with the Quw’utsun nations. This particular loan guarantee is in regards to an actual outcome from a

specific decision.

Noting the hour, I move that the committee rise and report progress and ask leave

to sit again.

Motion approved.

The committee rose at 11:57 a.m.

The House resumed at 11:58 a.m.

[The Speaker in the chair.]

Lorne Doerkson : Committee of Supply,

Section B, reports progress to the estimates of the Ministry

of Finance and asks leave to sit again.

Leave granted.

George Anderson :

Section A reports progress on Bill 9 and asks leave to sit again.

Leave granted.

Sunita Dhir :

Section C reports progress on Bill 20 and asks leave to sit again.

Leave granted.

Hon. Brenda Bailey moved adjournment of the House.

Motion approved.

The Speaker : This House stands adjourned until 1 p.m. today.

The House adjourned at 11:59 a.m.