Volume 4 PROVINCE Of N-EWFOUNDLAND THIRTY-SIXTH GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF NEWFOUNDLAND 4th. Session VERBATIM REPORT MONDAY, JUNE 16, 1975 SPEAKER : THE HONOURABLE M. JAMES RUSSELL Number 51

June 16, 1975, Tape 2289, Page 1 -- aob The House met at 11:00 a.m. Mr. Soeaker in the Chair. MR. SPEAKER: Order, please! STATE}'ENTS ll'Y MINISTRR.<; MR. SPEAKER: The Honourable the Minister of ~ealth. ------ HON. R.WELLS _(Minister of Health): ~Ir. Sr,eaker. I should lil,e to make reference at this time to the mobile nental clinic which T!lemhers may have seen outside the Confederation Buildinp,. I am particnlarlv pleased to refer to it because the van hodv was suoolied as a c;ift to the Province by the Lion's Club of Weston, Ontario.

The cost of the van body was $19,000 which, as members will appreciate, is a verv significant gift and I should like at this time, formallv. to thank them. The unit was handed over on Saturdav past in a little ceremony out there. The total cost of the unit is $46,'10(), of whi.ch the Province provided $27,00n, namelv. the cab and chassis anrl the dental equipment which is goin~ to he installer! this week. As l sav _ the Lion's Club of Weston Ontarlo provided the bodv at a cost of $19,000.

A dentist has been found to provide services in this mobile clinic and the clin:Lc will be, as soon as it is made readv for use. going first to the area of the Codroy Valley to provide mobile ~ental services. And I certainly wis~ on behalf of the government and the department to express our sinc~re thanks and appreciation to the Lion's Club of Weston Ontario for this valuable gift. PRESENTING PETITIONS MR. SPEAKER: The honourahle the 'fember for Bonavista Sont:h. MR. MORGA."'i: Mr. Speaker.

I beg leave to oresent a peti.ti00 fr0m the residents of the community of Salvage, the ma.ioritv of t:l1p voters of that community. And they are quite upset in their netition anrl rightly so. They are protesting the actions of the Terra Nov~ Integrated School Board. The School ~oard,just recentlv, without consultation with the people of the coumunity of Salvage, without '1!V knowledge as the M.H.A. for the area, and without any consultation with departments of r,overnment deci ,1ed to chanp;e the school hus svstem nsecl 6748

June 16. 1g75, Tape 2289, Page 2 -- apb in that area. Thev decided to, without tender call, remove the two smaller type school huses on that route and to replaces the two buses by one large 72 passenv,er hus • Recause t~e road is .-i rou!!;h j!;ravel road, a dan!!;erous road, and because there are dangerous sections of the road, especially cl.uring the wi.nt:er months, a 72 passenger bus is not safe to tLqe on that road. The parents of the children in Salvage were not consulted, and in conversations with them and through this petition I fully sunport their protest over this action.

I am personally p;etting fed un with the attitude of school boards in not consultin!!: government, in not consulting the "!)E!ople, in taking action of this type. For example. in taking this kind of action without tender call to me leaves a hi.<? nuestion mark. And the fact that in the same area the same School Board has issued a school bus contract to a School Board member again learls me to believe that it is, in mv own nersonal view. a conflict of interest. That kind of action, to me, is unwarranted of any school hoard. So I stronglv am in favour of this petition.

I strongly support it and I am asking that the petitior, - maybe a !•it of a different format this time - maybe a copv can be made and also submitted to a different department than thP.

Tlepartment of Education, The Department of Erlncation, I think, can deal with J,forning the School Roard matter, hut also the fact that the Department of Trasnportation anc1 Communication.c: was not consulted nrior to the decision made hv the School Roarcl in putting on the 72 passenger bus and now endangering the lives of all the school children this winter, because that road is not going to be reconstructed this year, as far as I know now, because sufficient funds are not available.

And the fact that the road is the same d~np,~rous road now that it was last vear when the Department of Tran:;,portation and Communications felt then that the school bus systeM should not bP one large bus, the roarl was not wide enough, it was not upgraded and reconstructed arlequately enough to use a 72 passenger hus, and that two small buses should have heen used then, The road is the Rame now and the fact 6749

June 16, 1975, Tape 2289, Page 3 -- apb that the Transportation and Communications Department was not consulted, I would like to see a different format this time with this petition, ~ornin~ 6750

June Hi, 1975 Tape 22Q0 (~orning) PK - 1 that a copv of the petition, be also tabled and presented to the nenartment of Transportation and Communications so that two denartments can look at this matter.

And I would also like to see the minister consult with or to at least correspond with this school hoard, to question the fact about the issuing of contracts ,,ithout tender call, number one, and also question th e part of school board, executive members of the hoard ~,ho vote on different thinp.s in that school board being allowed to have school bus contracts, which I feel 1 in my view as a member of this T,er:islature,is a conflict of interest, and I am strongly opposed to it. So, !'r.

Speaker, I move that this petition be tabled in the House of Assembly and be passed along to, in this case, the department to which it relates. Mil. SPF.AKY.R: ~IR. F. II. ROWF.: The Hon. ~!ember for St. Barbe North. Mr.

Speaker, I rise on behalf of my colleagues to support the prayer of the petition presented by the Hember for Ronavista South, Sir, where the citizens of the Salvage area are protesttnp. the actions of the Terra Nova Integrated School lloard in changing the bus system to one large seventy-two na~senv,er bus. ~ir, I thin1: everybody in this House hns to agree with the Princj_ole that school boards should consult 1-'ith the government and these oeonle in most, if not all, actions they are going to take n ,gard i np; the administration of educat:f_on in their particular area. ~ir, I am C)Uite surprised with the member for Ilonavista South that he was so very harsh on the school board in question and stated that he was completely fed up with the actions of the school board.

Because the honourable member, Sir, should know that in ordter to have any school bus route changed or modified or instituted it has to be approved by the nirector of Hus Transportation in the nepartment of Education. So presumably, Sir, this has been done Pith the approval of the Department of Education and with the honourable member's very government that he is a oart of. l·'P • MC1RGAN: What about consultation with the people though? That is my problem. 6751

June 16, 1975 Tape 2290 (Morning) PK - 2 MR. F. ROWE: Well, Sir, the honourable member said that there was no consultation, and he was completely fed up. Now, Sir, with respect to consultation with the people I might add that the school boards of this Province are in a very difficult financial situation. And as a result of this, Sir, they are in an impossible situation and they are in a constant • state of turmoil and they cannot do everything everyday to please the - MR, SPEAKER: Order, please!

I certainly permit the honourable member to speak in support of the prayer of this petition but I have the feeling perhaps that he is now almost entering into a debate on the financial situation of school boards generally in the Province which is not the purpose of speaking specifically to the prayer of this petition. MR. F. ROWE: Sir, I appreciate your comments, but it costs, you know, finances obviously are related to the whole business of operating school buses or operating any other aspect of the administration of the school board.

And as a matter of fact, the running of school buses is a very expensive element, a financial element of the school boards operations. And I was simply stating that the very reason that this change has come ahout is probably a result of the financial situation of the school board. Sir, with - and I am replyint to some of the comments made by the honourable member in the presentation of his petition.

Sir, the obvious solution to improving the situation,if the member is concerned about the danger that exists with a seventy-two passenger bus on that road, the obvious solution is for the Department of Transportation and Communications and this P.C. Administration to improve the very road in question. Ifthat was done the problem would not exist. MR. MORGAN: Until it ia done you still need the two small buses. MR. F. ROWE: Sir, that is - okay - well it is the government who is responsible, Sir, for improving the roads.

It is the government who is responsible for approving this change in the school bus situation in this particular area, and cannot go ahead without approval. So it is up to the p,overnment, Sir, in these two 6752

June 16, 1975 Tape 2290 (Morning) approval. So it is up to the government, Sir, in these two instances to act. And, Sir, in closing, in support of this petition, 6758 PK-3

June 16, 1975 Tape no, 2291 Page 1 - mw theHon. Member for Bonavista South said that he was shocked and horrified over the fact that tenders were not called for this particular contract. Tenders were not called, Sir, about the only reaction that I can have to that is that the school board is probably following the exaaple of the governaent in this instance. MR. SPEAKER : The Hon. Minister of Education. HON, G. OTTEMHEIMER (Minister of Education): Mr. Speaker, I wish to speak briefly with respect to the petition.

I think honourable 1111!111bers know, and it is obviously true that the school boards and iode~d all groups, private and public in the Province, are in a very difficult position. That is true of school boards, it is true of hospital boards, and it is true of municipal boards and it is true of all. I think it should be realized as well, of course, that people on school boards throughout this Province, several hundred serve without any pay, without any remuneration, and they perform a very valuable public service.

Frequently they are criticized and that is obvious too because any, if you wish, decision making body, any group with responsibility sometimes and certainly sometimes have to do things which cannot meet with universal agreement, I think that is a fact of life, But I do wish to point out that there are soae provinces where school trustees, as they are called, are in fact paid. And ve have several hundred people in this Province who are contributing their time and their effort and their interest in a very necessary and important , function.

Nov vith respect to the specific mention, specific items referred to by the honourable member presenting the petition, the law does require that tenders be called for nev contracts.

Certainly any alleged conflict of interest would be quite inproper and the law does require approval and certain safety measures, And all I can say with respect to those particular items is that certainly I shall undertake to be sure that the lav bu been coaplied with, that the law and the policy of the departaent have been cmiplied with with respect to the safecty factor, vith respect to the calling of tenders and with respect to conflict of interest. Until I have done that obviously there would be nothing further I could say. 6754

June 16, 1975 MR. SPEAKER: MR. NEARY: Tape no. 2291 Are there any other petitions? The Hon. Member for Bell Island. Page 2 -- Mr. Speaker, I want to present a petition, Sir, on behalf of over 300 residents of Whitbourne who are complaining about the increase in the town service fee in that community, Sir, from $10 to $30 per ann1111.

The general theme of the petition, Sir, is that the residents are not complaining about the council trying to get revenue but they are pointing out that this does create a hardship for people who are on old age pensions and other people in the c~unity with low incomes,who have a limited income, especially the old age pensioners, and you might say that this petition is being presente4 solely on behalf of the old age pensioners in the c.,_nity who say that if they had to pay $30 a year it is going to create a severe hardship to them. Now, Sir, I have to be honest with the House.

This petition was given to the Minister of Rural Develot1ent several months ago to present in this honourable House. For some reason or other the minister has refused to present the petition. And the petition that I am presenting today, Sir, is a copy of the petition that should have been presented by the Minister of Rural Development - MR. SPEAKER: MR. NEARY: MR. SPEAKER : Order, please! - because he refused - Order, please! I shall permit the honourable member to continue, but he has just said that the petition he is presenting is really a copy and as such the Chair cannot accept a copy of a petition.

It has to be an original. MR. NEARY: Well, Sir, I do not know why the Minister of Rural Development has refused but the people have asked me, Sir, on their behalf to present the petition, and I am very pleased to do so, Sir. MR. CROSBIE: MR. SPEAKER: 6755 Point of order, Mr. Speaker. Order, please!

June 16, 1975 MR,RDllY: MR. SPEAKER: MR. NEARY: MR. SPEAKER: Tape no. 2291 If I do not present it - Order, please! Page 3 - mw - Mr. Speaker, it will never be presented. Order, please: The Chair is not prepared to accept a copy of a petition. It has to be the original. _!{R. NEAllY: Well I would like to table this copy, Sir. MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member cannot table a copy of a petition. It has to be the original. MR. NEARY: Well what can I do with it, Mr. Speaker? I will take Your Honour's guidance. I have the copy of the petition, Sir. I have been asked to table it and what can I do, Mr. Speaker? MR.

SPEAKER: The Chair has ruled that the honourable member cannot table a copy of a petition. It has to be the original, So I guess the honourable member cannot table - MR, ROBERTS: If the minister villnot, the people are cut off: MR, NEARY: Is there any way we can force the minister to present the petition~ Kr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: KR. NEARY: MR. CROSBIE: MR. SPEAKER: MR. CROSBIE: That, of course, is not for the Chair to decide on. All right, I thank Your Honour. Point of order, Hr. Speaker. The Ron. Minister of Fisheries. The Minister of Rural Development is not here, and I do not think, Mr.

Speaker, that these statements should be allowed to go unchallenged. The gentleman has adopted the cowardly tactic of making these statements and trying to present a copy of a petition when the Minister of Rural Development is not here. 6756

June H, 1975 Tape no. 2292 Page 1 - mw It is an unheard of breach of ethics,if a breach of nothing else. It is a breach of ethics of the members of this House for a member to do this when another member is not in his place. MR. ROBERTS: HR. SPEAKER: HR. ROBERTS: Hr. Speaker, to that point of order, if I might. The Hon. Leader of the Opposition. It is to be regretted that the Minister of Fisheries as usual is being inteaperate and so forth in raising his points of order.

Hy colleague, the member for Bell Island, has three tilaes gone to see the Minister of Rural Development to ask h:IJI when he will be presenting the petition. The minister, each tine, has not answered. And I might point out that the minister has yet to be in the House this session. If there is any cowardice involved, Sir, it is on the part of the Minister of Rural Development who has consistently refused, over a period of two ~r three months, to present a petition in this House. And my colleague raised the matter here. Your Honour has ruled that he cannot present it. Well that is that.

But he raised it only because the minister had refused despite three, Sir, private requests over a period of weeks to the Minister of Rural nevelopment who apparently has not even got the courtesy to present the petition. If he feels that he could not support it, it is in order to present one and then indicate one's feelings on it. But the Hon. Minister of Rural Development would not even do that, Sir. So it is anvthin2 but coward]y of my honourable friend, he has followed the only course he could, and l submit that there is no point of order, Sir. MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The matter, of course, whether the Hon. Member for Bell Island has conferred privately with the Hon. Minister of Rural Development is a matter between these two honourable members and not really for the concern itself of the Chair. The matter of the hon. Member for Bell Island's remarks re the honourable minister not being in his place, the Chair can really see nothing in a sense procedurally wrong with it. I am not saying that it is not in order procedurally but it may have been better if the honourable member waited until the honourable minister was in his 6757

June 16, 1975 Tape no. 2292 Page 2 - mw seat. But that perhaps is not for the Chair to decide on either. So I do not particularly think that the Hon. Member for Bell Island's remarks were unparliamentary. ORAL QUESTIONS: MR. SPEAKER: The honourable the Member for Bell Island. MR. NEARY: Mr. Speaker, I wonder if the Minister of Mines and Energy, Sir, would tell the House if the Newfoundland and Labrador Power Corporation is going to rent additional space in Montreal and employ 150 or 300 Mainlanders in that office rather than establish the office here in Newfoundland and employ Newfoundlanders? MR.

SPEAKER: The Hon. Minister of Mines and Energy. HON. L. BARRY (Minister of Mines and Energy): Mr. Speaker, I am not aware of the rental of any additional space. I will take notice of that question and attempt to obtain information,if any such thing is happening. I think what the honourable member may be referring to is - I have 'llOticed a couple of items in the press over the last couple of weeks.

It may be to this that the honourable member is referring, iteaa to the effect that a n\Dllber of the consultants or employees of consultants who are involved with the Gull Island project may be operating out of Montreal. I will take a look at that and find out. It is a problem, Kr. Speaker, with this project because of the magnitude, the scope of the project. It is going to be a problem in ensuring that as many of the - and here I am. not talking about the nonaal skills or normal trades that are available in the Province.

I - talking about the specialist sk.ills, -the specialist trades as they are involved in a large hydro electric project. There are problems in ensuring that the policy of government is carried ~ut. And that policy is, of course, that every job, every single possible job flowing from the Lover Churchill Development that can be carried out within the Province by Newfoundlanders is carried out within the Province by Newfoundlanders.

But there is a difficulty in enforcing that policy when on fhe other side you have the suggestions being made that for the sake of efficiency\and that translates into for the sake of reducing the cost of the project,we get recommendations 6758

.Tune 16, 1975 Tape 2293 (Morning) PK - 1 that there be certain jobs placed in Montreal where the consultants are, where the head offices of the consulting companies are, where the people who are involved in some of the actual design are. And it is always a matter, Mr. Speaker, of reaching the proper balance hetween makinp: sure that every sip:nal possible job remains within the Province, and,ori the other hand, making sure that we get the ~axfmum efficency and the maximum cost saving on the project. '·!R. NEARY : i'lr. Speaker, a supplementary question.

Would it not make more sense to have the main office, both the engineering and the planninp, offices of the Newfoundland and and Labrador Hydro Develonment Corporation, here in the Province where the head office is rather than in '-!ontreal'i Has the minister given any consideration to closing <lo~m the office in Montreal altogether and instead of kowtowinr. to the engineerinp, firms and the constructing companies have them come to Newfoundland to our head office and set up their companies here in Newfoundland rather than kowtow to them and go up to nontreal and open up an office and rent space. J-P..

SPEAKEP: !>TTL BARRY: The Hon. ~inister of Mines and Energy. Mr. Speaker, I have to confess that the honourable member's sentiments are - they contain a certain merit, there is a certain element there that I can sympathize with. However, Mr. Speaker, there is the danger of engaging in a course of pravado. There is the danger of cutting off one's nose to spite one's face.

Tl1ere is the danger of taking certain steps which not being fully thought out or fully considered can lead to an unnecessary escalation in the cost of this r,roject, can lead possibly to unnecessary uncertainty with respect to the planning of the project, with respect to the delivery of essential supplies and so on. All I can say, Mr. Speaker, is that the honourable member is raising what, in my opinion, is a very serious question, a n11Pstion that merits very close attention by this government, by the 11eople of this Province.

And as I say there is a certain element contained in his statement t~at I can sympathize with. And I h,ive to confess that I Rm having some difficulty as minister and 6759

June 16, 1975 Tape 2293 (Morning) PK - 2 I do not mind admitting that I have some difficulty in reaching in my own mind satisfaction that we are reaching the proper balance between, on the one hand, getting every possible job within the Province and,on the other hand, ensuring proper planning, a proper reduction of uncertainty, and proper cost saving in the project. And it is reaching this balance that is not that easy a job.

I have to rely on,as honourable members well know.the best advice that I can find in this area, and that is not a matter of passing the buck, it is just a matter of quite frankly admitting that when it comes to questions, detailed questions relating to project management, the techniques of project manag ement, when it comes to the more involved questions of cost accounting and so on that I am no expert in this area. But we are doing our best, Mr.

Speaker, to reach the proper balance between, as I say, getting every possible job remaining within the Province and on the oth~r hand having the maximum amount of planning, the maximum degree of certainty and the maximum cost saving for the project. MR. SPEAKKR: The Hon. Member for Bell Island. MR. NEARY: }fr. Speaker, a supplementary question. Is the mivister saying that in the foreseeable future the head office of the Newfoundland and Labrador Hydro Corporation, the Churchill Falls part of it - SOME HOH. MEMBERS: Oh, oh: MR. SPEAKER: Order, please: MR. CROSBIE: This is not a question. MR. BARRY: Mr.

Speaker, apparently this is an area where there is some confusion. There are two different things that we are talking about now. On the one hand we have the fact that there are certain employees of Churchill Falls Labrador Corporation still in Montreal. Now that is - I believe the figures were given the other day as about what, sixty odd people out of some 250,I believe is the percentage there. And again, Mr. Speaker, this has been a matter of phasing out 6760

June 16, 1975 Tape 2293 (Morning) PK - 3 the Upper Churchill project which has only recently been completed, and where you still have a considerable a1110unt of work involved in tying up the loose ends of that project, and where you have the fact that the project 6761

June 16, 1975, Tape 2294, Page 1 -- apb MR. BARRY: was managed out of Montreal, so that it is not possible, Mr. Speaker, overnir,ht, just to say,that is it 1 that corporation's function is ended in Montreal and all the personnel must come to St. John's or anywhere else in the Province. Recause, Mr. Speaker, you are not dealing with inanimate objects, you are not dealing with robots, you are dealing with human beings. An~ we have made it clear, Mr. Speaker, this government has made it clear - MR. NEARY: ----- It is being paid for by this government: MR.

SPEAKER: ------ Order, plea se~ Order please~ MR._ MURPHY : Do you not remember the previous ga1rerument? MR. BARRY: ----- - that over a reasonable period of time we expect to see the phasing out of the Montreal operations and all - MR. NEARY: - ----- What period? MR. BARRY: ----- I said,over a reasonable period of time, Mr. Speak.er.

I am not prepared to give the honourable member hours, minutes or days even with respect to such a schedule, But I will say that with respect to a reasonable period of time we expect to see this office phased out and the entire operations of Churchill Falls Labrador Corporation carried out within the Province, But that is a separate thing, Mr. Speaker. That is Churchill Falls Labrador Corporation, and let that not be confused, as it was unfortunately done in the media some time ago, let that not be confused with respect to the planning and the carrying out of the LOliler Churchill project.

The two are not related. The two are not related, Mr. Speaker. The honourable member's first question related to; how much personnel is it going to be necessary to have operate out of Montreal in order to carry out the Lower Churchill project? That,as I say, is a very real question, a very serious question that we had to take a very hard look at. And I cannot say at the present time that I am satisfied that we have all the answers here, but we are actively involved in looking very closely at it. MR. NEARY: ------ Mr. Speaker, a supplementary question. Would the minister - 6762 Momin'(

June 16, 1975, Tape 2294, Page 2 -- apb Morning MR. NEARY: -and the intemperate Minister of Fisheries need not get jumpy, I will be in order - would the Minister of Mines and Energy tell us what fringe benefits Mr. Groom receives while he is in Montreal? Does he have a car, a Cadillac at his disposal? Does he have an aircraft at his disposal? Did we buy a house for him in Montreal? What fringe benefits does the President of the Corporation have for commuting between St. John's and Montreal? MR. SPEAKER: ------ MR. BARRY: MR. NF..ARY: The Honourable the Minister of Mines and Energy. Mr.

Speaker, I have no idea what fringe benefits. You should know. I do not knOW' what the honourable member is referring to, Mr. Speaker - MR. NEARY: ----- MR~ SPEAKER: MR. NEARY: ----- MR. SPEAKER: MR. BARRY: Did we buy him a house? Order, please: Did we buy him a car? Did we give him an aircraft? Order, please! No, Mr. Speaker, we did not buy him a house, we did not buy him a car, we did not give him an aircraft. The aircraft that the honourable member is referring to is the property of Churchill Falls Labrador Corporation.

The use to which that aircraft is put is subject to the supervision of the Board of Directors of Churchill Falls Labrador Corporation. MR. NEARY: Does the minister have any control over it . MR. BARRY: - ---- Yes, a certain amount, a certain element of control, Mr. Speaker, in that it - MR. NEARY: MR. HICKMAN: ------ MR. NEARY: MR. BARRY : MR. SPEAKER: - ----- MR. BARRY: It is the taxpayers' money! No. No. We do. Mr.

Speaker, if - Order, please! - the honourable member would like the answer to the question, I suggest that he sit back in his seat, attempt to close his mouth, which will reduce the volume of empty space in this room by - MR. NEARY: ----- MR. BARRY: ------ 6763 That is not going to shut me up! - about three-quarters -

June 16, 1975, Tape 2294, Page 3 -- apb MR. SPEAKER: Order, please! MR. BARRY: - then I will answer it. The aircraft that is - ----- being referred to is used in the normal carryin~ out of the business at Churchill Falls Labrador Corporation as supervised bv the directors of that Corporation. It has not been necessarv for government to intervene in any way with respect to the directing of that aircraft, because there has heen no reason brought to its attention why this should be done. With respect to other matters, Mr.

Speaker, I can take that as notice but obviously the honourable member is in his normal, mischievous, provocative way attempting to throw out a few red herrinv.s this morning. MR. NEARY: --·--- MR. SPEAKER: MR. NEARY: ----- It is the taxpayers' money I am - Order, please~ - so I would appreciate it if the ndnister would get me that information at as early a date as is possible. Sir, the honourable the Premier promised me some information concerning the cutbacks and the layoffs in various industries in Western Newfoundland. I believe the Premier has the information there with him today.

I wonder if the honourable the Premier would tell us now what is happeni.ng to the economy of Western Newfoundland? MR. SPEAKER: The honourable the Premier. ------ PREMIER 1'l>ORES : Well, it is very difficult, Mr. Speaker, to talk about what is happening to the economy of Western Newfoundland in total at a time like this. There were specific questions asked earlier by the Member for Bell Island and I will gladly, in as hrief a period of time as possible, reply to those. Mornin!" 6764

June 16, 1975 PREMIER MOORES: Tape no. 2295 Page 1 - mw The situation is that, as the gentle11an well knows, the representatives of business and labour, Canada Manpower and others on Kay 22 this year set up a task force which was to deal with the problem of loss of employment and production down-time being experienced by coapanies in the Corner Brook and West Coast areas in general. This is the same sort of operation, Mr. Speaker, that dealt with the Newfoundland Steel closing, the Whalesback mine closing and others whereby new jobs were necessary to be found and placing people in those jobs.

Special attention of that task force is to be paid to hiring of students for the Summer because this is of concern on the West Coast as it is throughout the Island and this is part of their criteria. It should be noted, Mr. Speaker, that lllOre than 350 jobs have been created in Corner Brook during the past year alone.

But that was primarily from the construction at Western Memorial Hospital and also the regional college that is being constructed there as well, A few years ago Bowaters were directly responsible for the eaployaent of some eighty-five per cent of the work force in the Corner Brook area, Now this number has been reduced to about fifteen per cent so the problem at Corner Brook, although the one we are dealing with is ce-rtainly not as serious as it would appear on the su-rface, at one tiae Corner Brook was eighty-five per cent virtually dependent on Bowaters, Today it is fifteen per cent, MR.

ROBERTS: That must have been forty or fifty years ago when it was eighty-five per cent. _!{R. MOORES: I do not know exactly what year it was, Mr, Speaker, The Leader of the Opposition says, forty or fifty years ago. He worked for the historian, I did not.

Other jobs have opened up in the area, Officials of this department i~ conjunction with the Economic Development Council and representatives of the city have scheduled a meeting with representatives of the three manufacturing firms that are concerned in the Comer Brook area, Bowaters, North Star and Atlantic Gypsum, Lundrigans Limited, Canada Manpower, the Chamber of CoTaDerce and other interested people in the Corner Brook area. 676:i

June 16, 1975 Tape no. 2295 Page 2 - mw They will discuss the entire situation and hopefully find ways of overcoaing the problem with the help of any and all existing government progruaes, both federal and provincial, Regarding Atlantic Gypsum, Mr. Speaker, the general manager of Atlantic Gypsum advises that due to a down turn in the market place the company has scheduled a two week shut-down which c-e into effect on May 3. However continuing market problems forced the company to extend the shut-down period for an additional two weeks at that time.

Fifty of the eighty-five men work force were directly affected by the cutback. However the thirty-five maintenance and office staff continue to work. And full production resumed on June 6, a few weeks ago or a week ago, just over a week ago~and no further down-tiae is anticipated in gypsum. Atlantic Gypsum presently supplies ninety-five per cent of the wall board requirements of our Province and the other three Atlantic P~inces.

The fifty per cent decrease in the number of housing starts in this region to the end of March 1975 is the •ain contributing factor to the eighteen per cent decrease in the sales over the s-e period last year. I might point out here, Mr. Speaker, that this down turn in housing is in the Atlantic region and not specifically in Newfoundland, In addition,two other aajor Canadian producers are suffering from major marketing problems and are attempting to establish aarkets in the Atlantic region,providing new competition for the Corner Brook firm.

Company aanagement is optimistic that the last half of 1975 will shaw a significant :laproveaent over the first six months and indications are that housing starts will pick up during June and July and the COlll)any's sales will remain at the sa.e level as 1974. Regarding Bowaters Pulp and Paper Limited, the woods -nager of Bowaters Pulp and Paper Limited advises us that the Corner Brook mill will be scheduled for a minimum twelve week production cutback for 1975 as a result of the general softening of the newsprint markets. The first two week period was scheduled for the end of May with the remaining ten 6766

June 16, 1975 Tape no. 2295 Page 3 - - weeks spread over a five day work week for the rest of the year. In addition the company had scheduled a number of layoffs in the mill work force. However at the insistence of union officials the company has now revised its original

schedule and will remain on the seven day week

schedule and will not layoff any of its •ill tsployees. Instead the required production cutbacks will be achieved through down­ time spread over the entire work force and u a result aill production decreased on May 21.1975 and will remain down uatil June 24. And the remaining seven or eight weeks down-ti•e necessary in 1975 will be scheduled later in the Fall, In addition to the scheduled cutbacks in the Corner Brook operation Bowaters has planned shutdowns for its more efficient and modern mills in the Eastern Seaboard of the United States.

The Bowaters situation is similar to other paper mills in North Allerica,all of which are facing significant dovn-tiae to decrease production levels which are presently running at about ten per cent of production lev.els. 6767

June 16, 1975 Tape 2296 (Morning) PK - 1 . Mr. Speaker, we have been approached by the mill unions to set up an Iadustrial Board of Enquiry regarding Bowaters. There is some considerable concern aboutLthe fact that Corner Brook may be having considerably more doim-time than their other plants on the Eastern Seaboard, that was at the time when it was scheduled to have a five day operation in Corner Brook rather than a seven day operation. Since that time the five day has been changed to seven.

I met with the unions last week here in the City, representatives of the unions, and they are still asking that this be carried out. Our government will be in contact with Bowaters, and having a session with them before a final decision is made, but certainly the matter will be followed through with and not dropped. The North Star Cement Company - the company management has scheduled a four to six week shut-down in what they call a clinker production - I am not sure what that is, Mr.

Speaker, but I am sure it is meaningful to those in the trade - effective Kay 9, 1975, directly affecting about thirty people altogether. This cut back is the first of several designed to eliminate two or three months production capacity in the various companies operations. MR. NEARY: Are they producing too much. MR. MOORES: The fact is - no. The fact is, Mr.

Speaker, in the projected sales for 1975 are estimated to be about ten per cent below that of 1974, and this decrease again is because of the housing starts, and also because of the finishing of projections such as Atlantic Place and the Corner Brook Memorial Hospital and the college and so on. While the overall picture is not good for 1975 management is hopeful that the cut backs can be scheduled over the entire year's operation without undue hardship on the employees.

In the meantime markets for 1976 are expected to show significant improvements and the company should be back in full capacity in late 1975 or early 1976. Mr. Speaker, that is a very brief resume of how the situation is. The recession in the industrial situation in the world is one that is pretty serious right now. It is affecting us I suppose less 6768

.Janel(,, l'l75 Tape 2296 (Morning) PK - 2 thAn most places, hut still a very real affect, and one of major concern. And the ~overnment is keeping in contact with these people regarding this particular problem and we will do everything we can about it. MR. SPF.AKRR: The Hon. Memher for Bell Island. MR. NF.ARY: Mr. Sneaker, it reminds me of the latter years of the Smallwood era, tight - 'lR. SPF.AKF.R: ITTl . • NEARY: '~. SPF.AKER: MR. NEARY: Order, please! - tight money. Order, please! Sir, would the Ron. the Premier get me - MR. ROBERTS: The Vietnamese war! HR.

NF.ARY: I thank the Hon. the Premier for that information bv the way. I have been three weeks now or a month trying to get it. T do not think it was spontaneous. Would the Premier get me the same information on Price (Nfld) in Central Newfoundland, to find out wh11.t is happening with that'Z Mil.. SPEAKF.Jl : The Hon. the Premier. ?-111. MO()RES'. Again the Central Newfoundland area, I will gladly trv to accumulate the same sort of resume, Mr. Speaker. ~'TL NEARY: Okay. Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the Minister of Industrial Development, Sir, now that he is back from the delights of 1'rance.

Would the minister tell us what he was doing over in France? MR. SPF.AKER: 1"1'.. D0(1DY: The Hon. Minist!er of Industrial Development. Mr. Speaker, I was in France doing what the honourable ~ember for Bell Island should have been doing a long while ago,trying to find some utilization for the Bell Island abandoned mine workings. J\:,J JION. 1-'ElfJlER: }IR. DOODY: Rear! Hear! The comi,any with which we met expressed a great interest in the project. They have demonstrated that they certainly have the technical ability to out the project together.

However, there are a p;reat many other areas that have to be explored, and a great many other facets of the problem that have to be looked at and examined before we can reach any decision on it. Certainly as the thing moves 6769

June 16, 1975 Tape 2296 (Morning) PK - 3 along we will be informing the House, and informing the public, but the trip to France was a very worthwhile one, and I was delighted to have the opportunity to go. MR, NEARY: There is no doubt about that, Mr. Speaker, a supplementary question~ Would the minister care to tell the House whether he was invited by this company to go to France or if he invited himself over to France to look at this ooeration? MR. DOODY: Mr. Speaker, I fail to see the relevance of what the social niceties of the expedition were. I do not know what the protocol should be.

The fact remains that this company expressed an interest and we wanted to see if these things were possible. I might say that this is not the only company that is interested in this, Sir, nor am I - but I would like to give the House, Sir, the Province the indication that we have excluded other companies. MR. NEARY: The minister needed a holiday. MR. DOODY: The thing is that it was only a little while ago I heard the honourable member on the other side of the House caterwauling about the fact that we were not rushing around like the honourable ex-Premier, what i s his name? Smallwood. SOME BON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. DOODY: We used to chase around - he used to be perpetually running around and the honourable Member for Bell Island was saying what a wonderful man he was and how he used to be constantly trying to sell the resources of the Province and interest people in its development. Well I would not want to indicate to the House that I am following in the footsteps of - MR. NEARY: MR. SPEAKER: MR. DOODY: MR. NEARY: MR. SPEAKER: MR. NEARY: MR. DOODY: You invited yourself in other words for a holiday. Order, please! The former illustrious Premier. You invited yourself over for a holiday. Order, please!

The minister needed a holiday. The minister needed a holiday, Sir, yes, and most people in this administration have been working so hard that they 6770

.I une l,;, 197 5 Tape 2296 (Morning) PK - 4 n"?ed holidays. But, Sir, we have not taken holidays. We intend tn ~•ark just as hard in the future as we have in the past. MR. NEARY: Mr. Speaker, a supplementary question for the minister. Hould the minister care to identify the company that he went to visit in France? 6771

June 16, 1975 Tape no. 2297 Page 1 - mw MR. DOODY: MR. NEARY: MR, SPEAKER: MR. NEARY: No, Mr. Speaker, Well, I guess, we got that straightened out, Sir. Order, please! Mr. Speaker, seeing that I am going down to Burgeo on Wednesday, I wonder if the minister could give me some - HR. ROBERTS: That is where the young ladies of the night were, according to Time Magazine. MR. SPEAKER: Order, please! MR, NEARY: The inister was not in the churches where these young ladies were on strike T MR. DOODY: A supplementary? MR.

NEARY: No, I aa asking the inister if he has any information or any news for the people in Burgeo now concerning the fish plant in view of the fact that the Government of Canada has aade a comitment- MR. DOODY: If they have I have not seen it. MR. HEARY : - now will the Province be making a comitment in the forseeable future concerning the construction of this fish plant? MR. SPEADR: The Hon. Minister of Industrial Develo19ent. MR. DOODY: Kr. Speaker, I am absolutely delighted to hear the member for Bell Island make a c-itment on behalf of the Govenmient of Canada.

If you could get - a copy of that in writing showing the amount and the specifics of it we would be only too happy to award a contract as soon as tenders can be issued. We have already indicated that the Province of Newfoundland has -de its commitment. The estimates have deonstrated - MR. NEARY: What is the Province's comitment? MR. DOODY: The Province's comit111ent i11 to put a new fish plant in Burgeo !IS soon as we can get a comiaient from DREE to help us with it, MR. NEARY: Bow uch? Mr. Speaker - MR. DOODY: Just a minute now. MR. NEARY: Yes. MR. D80DY: Ju11t a minute now. MR. SPEAICER: Order, pleue! 6772

June 16 , 1975 Tape no. 2297 Page 2 - mv MR. DOODY: Just a minute. MR. SIMMONS: Another iffy. MR. NEARY: That is a bi~ iffy, yes. How much? MR. DOODY: Anyone else? MR. SPEAKER: Order, please: Order, please: The Hon. Member for Bell Island asked a question of the Hon. Minister of Industrial Development. The honourable minister is attempting, I assume, to answer the question, and he has the right to be heard in silence by all members. MR.

DOODY: Sir, we intend to take advantage of the OREE progr-e, the incentives progra11111e of the Department of Regional and Econ011ic Expansion to the greatest extent possible to help defray the cost of the facility that is necessary to ensure the survival of the town of Burgeo. Now we cannot say at this time how much the offer is going to be from OREE. We cannot even make a cmnitment to go ahead with the plant unless we first get DREE's offer.

A prior commitment negates DREE's responsibility and the way that they have been side-stepping and side-slipping on the thing for the past year and a half makes it painfully obvious that they are not that anxious or interested in getting ahead with it. We would hope that this is not so. And we look forward to being able to tell the people in Burgeo that the Government of Canada ia participating. The member for Bell Island has indicated that they will and this to me is quite satisfying, and I am quite pleased. MR. NEARY: Mr, Speaker, a supplementary question. I am only quoting what I read in the press, Sir.

Is the minister aware that the Government of Canada and Mr. Jamieson has already stated that the normal grants and incentives from the Department of Regional Development would be put into this plant and now it is up to the Province? What is the Province's c0111Ditment? How far is the Province prepared to go? We know what Ottawa's commitments are. MR. DOODY: Mr.

Speaker, the normal grants and conmit.-ants of the Department of Regional and Economic Expansion in terms of their Incentives offers are demonstrated by the bone yards and graveyards of ill-formed and ill-started ventures that were predicated on the assumption that they were going to get these so-called co1Ditments. ,, 77~ 0 ,.

June 16, 197S Tape no. 2297 Page 3 - mw We have looked no further than Bide Arm to see what can happen on a so-called comitment from Ottawa. We can walk through Stephenville and look at the various sad states of industrial so-called develol)lllent that started over there. No, Sir, we will not fool the people in Burgeo. We will not lead them down the garden path on a deal like that. When the Department of Regional Economic Expansion puts it on the line how much they are prepared to put into that plant under their own terms of reference then we will be in a position to say, yea, we are going ahead with it. MR..

SPEAKER: The Hon. Leader of the Opposition. MR.. ROBERTS: Kr. Speaker, a question for the Premier. Could he indicate to the House 1 Sir, what reply he has made to the letter which he recently had dated June 9, in fact, fro• the President of the Federation of M~cipalities, Kr. Hogan? MR. MOORES: KR. ROBERTS: I will take notice of the question, Mr. Speaker. Well, that is fine. Mr. Speaker 1 a couple of supplementaries vbicb may baYe to be taken as notice too. Could the Premier indicate to the House whether the government will accede to the Federation's request as put by Mr.

Bogan.that the Bouse be given the opportunity to debate at this sitting. at this session, the approach of the Public Utilities Board with respect to the renewed applications from the phone coapany and the light company for increases? MR. ROBERTS: No answer? Hr. Speaker. silence is eloquent~ MR. MOORES: Mr. Speaker, regarding that, I mean I have just told the honourable meaber that I would take notice of the first question which obviously, as he 11aid hiaself 1 will also deal with the supplementary questions that he bad to ask.

Obviously what he is doing now is asking auppleaentary questiOIIS just to be on the record with the press rather than this House. MR. ROBERTS: Mr. Speaker 1 the Premier of all people should talk about being on record with the press~ Mil. SPEAKER: Order please! 6774

June 16, 1975 Tape no. 2297 Page 4 - 111W 'HR. ROBERTS: - in view of his record. Let ae ask a fµrther suppleiaentary. Ia the Premier willing to meet -with the Ftderation? And that is not a -tter w.e need notice of. la he willing to meet with •them to di,scuas this issue? MR. CROSBIE: MR. MOORES: HR. SPEAKER: HR .• ™1tY: 677':j To have tea or what? Always • Mr. Speaker. Orders of the Day. Ho• Mr. Speaker. There is still

Juae 16, 1975, Tape 2298, Page -- apb MR. NEARY: time left in the Question Period, Sir. Mr. Speaker, I woulc like to ~irect a question to the honourable the Premier and ask t,e Premier what time he intends to implement a promise made to the oeople of Bell Island to make the Bell Island ferry service a part of the Provincial highway system? PREMIER MOORES: MR. NEARY: ----- of - MR. ROBERTS : MR. SIMMONS: MR. SPEAKER: MR. NEARY: Order Paper, ~r. Speaker. Well, Mr. Spe~ker, a question to the Minister (Inaudible) 0·1 this ferry.

He does not know: Order, please'. - Sir, could the Premier tell us what time the Minister of Transportation and Conmunications is going to be back in Ms seat? Is he ill or out c,f the Province or what? PREMIER MOORES: wherever he is. HR. REARY: PREMIER MOORES: MR. NEARY: he be back - PREMIER MOORES: MR._NEARY: MR. SPEAKER: MR. NEARY: I do not kn- where he is today but he is busy He is busy? Yes. He has not been in the House since we met so will That is not quite true. No,that is trae - Order, please'. Mr. Speaker, ( want to find out about - let me see - oh yes: .

The Minister of Social S «rvices; would the minister care to indicate now what the government's policy is on providing social assistance to miners in St. Lawr,·nce who are locked out and what the overall government policy is on providing social assistance to peoole on strike, or people who refuse ro cross picket lines? Has there been a change in policy recently? What is the policy now? Would the minister tell the House? MR. MURPHY: No. MR. NEARY: No answer? MR. MURPHY: No change. You asked me there was a change and I said no. What do you want.me to ilo? Morning 6776

June 16, 1975, Tape 2298, Page 2 -- apb Morning MR. NEARY: Mr. Sneaker, I am ~issatisfied with that answer, Sir, SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh! MR. NEARY: I am dissatisfied with that answer, Sir, and I wish to debate that matter on Thursday. MR. MURPHY: I wish you were dissatisfied with the whole House on times. MR. NEARY: ~-·-- - -- No, Thursday I am going to be in Burgeo. I had hetter wait. '11!. MURPHY: Good! ··- - - -- '.1R. NEARY: Sir, I want to find out about potatoes. The Premier told the House that he would look into the possibility of government institutions huying the potatoes.

I understand that no potatoes have been sold to any ,i:overnment institutions. Would the Premier ca.re to look into that matter and see if these potatoes can he used in p.overnment institutions? PREMIER MOORES: t~~. MURPHY : '1R. NEARY: Put it on the Order Paper. Sit down, boy. No, but what about the spuds, the poor old spuds that are ~oing to be dumped? l--lR. SPEAKER: ·------- Order, please: Order, please: I will permit the honourable the Member for Hermitage a question, then the time will have expired for the Question Period. MR. SIMMONS: -- - - -- Mr.

Speaker, a question for the Minister of Provincial Affairs and the Environment. He undertook to check into the matter relating to Grand Falls, the Grand Falls mill. Has he anything to report to the House at this time? MR. SPEAKER: The honourable the Minister of Provincial Affairs and -- - --- the Environment. MR. DAl-IE: The problem in Grand Falls near by the Price mill, Mr. Speaker, is caused by the pilin,i: of chip wood1which has been going on now, I understand, for six to eight years.

It is only recently that sOl!le person out there decided to complain and kick up a fuss about the dust which is blowing around. 6777

June 16, 1975, Tape 2298, Page 3 -- apb The company has informed me that this will be taken care of through natural attrition, The pile of chips there at the present time is being used steadily, and it is their hope that in the near future they will not have any necessity at all to pile chips on the outside, that they will be depending on other means of obtaining the chips. And, of course, when this pile has been depleted and used uo there should be no dust problem. ORDERS OF THE DAY MR.

CROSBIE: Motion 5, Motion, the honourable the Minister of Mines and Energv to introduce a bill, "An Act To Provide For The Reversion To The Province Of Certain Mineral Lands In Labrador," carried. (No,86) On motion bill read a first time, ordered read a second time on tomorrow. MR. CROSBIE: Motion 6. - ---- - Motion, the honourable the Minister of Education to introduce a bill, "An Act Further To Aniend The Memorial University Act," carried. (Bill No. 87). On motion bill read a first time, ordered read a second time on tomorrow. MR. CROSBIE: Order No. 36.

On motion second reading of a bill, "An Act Further To Amend 'The Teacher (Collective Barg.dning) Act, 1!'73." (Bill No. 80) • MR. SPEAKER: The honourable the Minister of Education. Morning 6778

June 16, 1975, Tape 2299, Page 1 -- apb Morning !fR. OTTENllEIMER: Mr. Speaker, in introducing this bill I think honourable members are quite familiar with its purpose, and indeed, with its background, and there would hardly be any need for me to go into any great detail because the matter, of course, was referred to a week or ten days ago. As honourable members will recall, the collective bargaining, the negotiations with respect to teachers' salaries and working conditions went on for a number of months and came to a successful conclusion.

The meetings, of course. initially and for a period of rouP,hly two months were between the N.T.A. and the employers' group which,of course,is under Mr. Norris of Treasury Board, and also a representative from the Department of Education for the Newfoundland Federation of School Boards. Quite a large number of matters were settled at that stage and then, under the provisions of the Act, the services of a Conciliation Officer were requested and the matters were further narrowed down and quite a number of outstanding matters were settled there.

Then again, in provision with the Act, a Conciliation Board was established for the few, certainly compartivelv few, matters still to be settled and the Conciliation 'Boar·d made its report. There was one

section in that report which was, I think, called 1011, 1'ut there was one

section in that report which the Federation of School Boards did not agree with and an alternate wording was sur.g1>sted and on that wording there was no agreement. Then there were certain meetings and what was decided was to delete that

section completely,and indeed, I think that worked out very well hecause this was then no longer a matter, you know, within the ambit of collective bargaining and I think that is quite proper. So 304 was aRreed to by the Newfoundland Federation of School Boards, was agreed to by the Newfoundland Teachers' Association, that there would be an amendment to

section 19 of the Act, and this, in fact, is what I am introducing now, which would and will,if and when enacted, more precisely, if you wish, more precisely express the intention of the legislation by the amending of

section 19. The actual wording is there in the bill. There is no need for 6779

June 16, 1975, Tape 2299, Page 2 -- apb ~lorning me to refer to it. The Previous wording referred to the same matters . It was,however, the opinion of the Federation that while the intention of the legislation, with respect to the protection of / the rights of term 17 of the terms of Union, while the intention was quite clear, it felt that the wording did not as accurately or as precisely as desired, or as possible, convey that intention. And therefore a proposed wording, a new wording was agreed upon and it is indeed this proposed wording as an amendment to the Act that I am now asking the House to concur in.

I repeat that this has the agreement of the Newfoundland Federation of School Boards and the Newfoundland Teachers' Association. HR. SPEAKER: MR. 'P.B.ROWE: The honourable the Member for St. Barbe North. Mr. Speaker, my colleagues and I certainly endorse and agree with this particular amendment to the Act, which will be,I understand,

section 19 of the Act. Sir, we witnessed, as the minister referred to, we witnessed long, hard, reasonable negotiations between the teachers and the Treasury Board. And we had our little crisesand semi- crisesand then everything see111ed to be aoving along quite smoothly. Then we had the Conciliation Board appointed, Sir, which made a very reasonable and a very responsible report considering 6780

June 16, 1975 Tape no. 2300 Pqe 1-- the settlement made a number of years qo with regard to teachers' salaries, Sir, and then all of a sudden a major crisis developed, quite unexpected by the general public of Newfoundland. So suffice it to say, Sir, that this amendment is certainly the right thing at the right time, and I am glad to see it before the Bouse, and we intend to support it wholeheartedly.

Sir, before - I am only going to spend a very short period of time on this - before sitting dowa, however, Sir, I would like to avail myself of this opportunity to congratulate the teachers of this Province and in particular the negotiating te• for the responsible way in which they conducted negotiations and the whole procedure.

Sir, I guess everybody knows that there was a militant group amongst the teachers, a very militant group in the N.T.A., that is the total membership, and the way that the executive of the N.T.A. and the negotiating team handled the whole situation throughout is something for which they should be co11111ended, Sir. And the same thing goes too for the conciliation board. Sir, this bill would afford one an opportunity to get into the whole question, the whole controversial question of the so-called denominational educational system in this Province and the weaknasses thereof and the strengths thereof.

And we could spend hours and days and possibly months debating this thing, Sir, I would like to make one thing perfectly clear from my own point of view 1 and one does not speak personally in public office, but, Sir, we graduated in this Province, we evolved from a purely denominational educational system to what is now not a denominational educational system . We have a state denominational educational system or denominational state educational syatem. It is partnership between government and the various denominations in this Province.

Without the contributions over the hundreds of years of our history of the denominations we would not have had an educational system,period. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear! Hear! MR. F. ROWE: That is point number one, And point number two, Sir, 6781

June 16. 1975 Tape no. 2300 Page 2 - mw we have evolved a systea where a partnership exists,and a good partnership exiat ,betveen govenment and the denominations. Sure there are weaknesses. The govenment,whether it be Liberal or P.C., shows weaknesa froa tiae to tiae. The churches,no aatter what denoaination is bei.Dg repreaented, froa time to time to time show weaknesses. But in the total, Sir, when you look back at it all if you had to add up the Jlues and ainuaea in education and the pros and the cons and look. at the benefits and the disadvantages or the advantages and duadvantages I think you vill find.

Sir, that we have evovled a syatea of education in this Provillce where the advantages far outweigh the disadvantages, the plues far outweigh the negatives, the positives far outweigh the negatives. Aad, Sir, no matter what Ir.ind of a system of education you have anywhere in this world. there are states in the United States and province  in this nation of ours that clai that they do not baire a denoainational system. of education, but, Sir, do they have probleas! They have probleaa. They have denominational problems in a non-denoainational educational ayatea.

They have racial problems in a non-denoai-tional educational syatea. They have social problems and econoaic probleu. Sir, we got an evolTing 1 or ve have had an evolution froa pure denoainationali•,aa far as education is concerned,to a 6782

.Tune Hi, l'l75 Tape 2301 (Morning) PK - l a workable state denominational education system, And I say, Sir, as for those who criticize the denominational educational system they are only looking at the weaknesses of such a system, and they are not looking at the advantages of it.

And until we see the day, ~ir. where the disadvantages of the system that we have, the partnership that we have, until the time that where we see the disadvantages outweighing t.~e advantages it is foolish, it is silly, it is people trying to get publicity for the sake of publicity, People in some cases who are not native Newfoundlanders, who criticize the system without truthfully and sincerely and analytically looking at the advantages and disadvantages. And I say no matter what system we have, Sir, you will find faults and weaknesses and trouble spots.

The system that we have at the present time, Sir, is a workable partnersh:lp, and it is al.most like a business where you have two key men. We got two key components in our educational system and I do not think this Province at this present time can do without either partner in this particular educational svste111 that we have. So, Sir, I will just say then in closir.g and simply say further, that we think that obviously this amendment was a crucial amendment particularly with regards to the settlement and we certainly fully endorse it. The Minister of Social Services. '<II. t-'lTR.PHY: ------- - - ~r.

Speaker, if I may, and I do not wish to delay the House any length of time. But I would like to avail of a 110ment or t,.,o with this particular act - but first of all congratulate, and I t~inJ.- he is worthy of some conr;ratulations, the Mirister of Education for the prompt action that was taken in this matter, and to agree onP hundred per cent with the Hon. Member for St. Barbe North for the at.titude that was taken hy hoth sides in this agreement. And also, Sir, for those people ~,ho ne!!:otiated this agreement that we have readv to sign, 1 imagine if it is not signed already.

But, Sir, again I would like as the beneficiary perhaps of the educational system as it pertains today, and thankful for what I got for practically nothing because we had nothing to pay for, and 6783

.. l ; · _; June 16, 1975 Tape 2301 (Morning) PK - 2 I hear people talking about nationalizing - MR. NEARY: Did you get as far as Tom's dog? MR. MURPHY: - education now. As I say1 they were trying to nationalize everything else. You know, let us not lose sight of the fact, Sir, of the years that have gone and what contributions were ~de by ;all denominations, because as I think the honourable member again said,that without these people I think our education would have been practically nil if anything at all in the hard years and we can go back.

But it does give 111.e a chance, Sir, to refer to a tremendous event that is to take place beginning in the Fall of this year, is the celebration, Sir, of the hundredth 'anniversary of the arriving in Newfoundland of the Irish Christian Brothers.

That is going to be a gala occasion, Sir, and as a graduate of the Christian Brothers system I would like to offer my congratulations at this particular time, I am very actively connected with that celebration, and to say again how fortunate we have been to have had the denominational education with us for all the years - so many of us who perhaps today are not rpcipients of what we call the modern day of education. There have been many frills added. I do not think the denominational education solves all of the problems nor can government solve all of the problems.

But, I think, Sir, it is a matter of getting on the same tTack and do what we can to bhe best of our ability for those who need a good solid, at least, elementary and high school education. So again, Sir, I would like to say how happy I 111.'1 that this matter has been resolved, It was a very, very ticklish. matter, Sir, at the time. And when we thought that everything was underway with the Teachers 1 Association and those responsible for signing the agreement, this ugly matter reared its head, and for a few hours it was a very, very serious matter, Sir.

And I would like to again congratu1-,te all those concerned, and particularly, Sir, the Minister of Education who I think handled it in a very, very proper manner without becoming incensed or upset about the whole thing,and to all those who did arrive at this agreement, Sir, my congratualtions. 6784

June Hi, 1975 Tape 2301 (Morning) PK - 3 MR. SPF.AKF.R (STAGG): If the minister speaks now he closes the debate. HR. O'ITENHEIMER: Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his kind 6785

June 16, 1975, Tape 2302, Page 1 -- apb remarks and indeed to thank the honourable the Member for St. Barbe North for his and the Opposition's support of this hill. Certainly there is no doubt, and I think the puhlic of Newfoundland know,that the way in which the collective bargaining proceeded, the various stages through which it went is a credit to all involved. It is a credit to the Newfoundland Teache.rs' Association, it is a credit to the ROVernment bargainers, the Federation of School Boards representative, the Chairman of that group who is Mr. Norris of Treasury Board staff.

All of the negotiations which were lengthy, complex, very complex, were carried on in a mature, professional and resPonsihle manner, which indeed is a credit to all concerned, and is I think. an example for the way in which collective bargaining can be carried on,and hopefully, will be carried on. MR. NEARY: MR. OTTENHEIMER: Do not forget to thank the Conciliation Board. No. They did an excellent 1ob, the conciliation Officer and the Board.

Indeed, all who were involved in the lengthy, and complex, and difficult, and delicate negotiations did excellently, with a maturity and a professionalism and a sense of responsibility to their memberships, to their constituency. if you wish, and to the Province, to the general public,which it is a great pleasure to point out and to put foTI~ard as an example of how these negotiations, indeed, can and should be carried out, and the kind of attitudes and professional, and responsible attitude which should be brought to this important process. So, Mr. Speaker, I really do not wish to say anything else.

The main difference, actually, between the two •••ordings is that in the original wording the word"conferred"is used. There is the suggestion that term 17 - of the Terms of Union - conferred rights, '~orning or if you wish, you know, made them up, created them, conferred them

whereas, certainly, the spirit was and the fact is, that it"preserves" rights. So there is certainly a distinction there between the conferral and the preservation, and this, I think, was one of the main factors. But I thank honourable gentlemen for their comments and I am oleased to move second reading. 6786

.June 16. 1'!75. Tane 211l2, l'a!l:e 2 -- aY>b On motion. a bill, "An Act Further To Amend The Teacher (Collective !larp:ain1.np:) Act, 1973 1 " read a a second time, ordered referred to a Conmittee of the 1-lhole House presently by leave. 'fR. OTTENHF.I!"IF.R: Order 7. - - - - ~otion. second readinp: of a hill, "An Act Further To !l111encl The Workmen's Compensation Act.'' (Bill No. 44). '1R. SPEAJ~ER (Sta~g): The honourable the H:l.n1.ster of Manpower and lnd~trial Relations. Mr. Speaker, this bill is mainlv to up~ade the henefi~s uaid by the Workmen's Compensation Board to injured workmen or their dependents.

In various cases it is an exercise that is done nearl..,. everv vear or one that has been carried out "!{on,ing annually for the last two or three years at least. It is an attl!lllllt to trv to bring the benefits of t.'1.e "Workmen's Co111Densation Board, payable in Newfomtdland, up to more or less the national standard or as close as we can come to the national standard. I think with the present Act there vill urobably only he two provinces, I believe 8ritish Columbia and Ontario, that will be slightly ahead of Newfoundland in the benefits paid.

All the other provinces will be behind Newfoundland - less benefits than Newfoundland - but it is certainly something that is necessary because of the increase in the cost of living. It is something that we will have to do, no doubt, .nearlv everv year as we have in the vast two or three years. The bill also bas a counle 6787

June 16, 1975 Tape no, 2303 Page 1 - mw of other sections, one dealing with automatic coverage for employe~s in the pulpwood logging industry.

And 'we have found over the past few years that employers have assumed in lots of cases that they are autoaatically covered because the assessments in the pulpwood industry are based on cordage as opposed to hours of work or the amount per hour,and a lot of employers,especially the smaller ones,have not made an application to be covered under the Workaan's Compensation Act 1 but we have found that they do want to be covered so this will provide an automatic coverage so that when a workman is injured in the logging industry there will be automatic coverage for that workman.

The act also reflects the decision some time ago of government to restructure the composition of the Workmen's Compensation Board in the appointllent of two advisers to the board 1 one representing labour 1 one representing management, This new structure. I believe, will benefit the Board and help it to be ore representative of all segmente of society. The new people who have been ap~inted to the Board will certainly add a gr-t deal to the progress of workmen's compensation in the Province of Newfoundland.

There has been quite a review going on in the laet few months regarding benefits paid, the method of workmen's compensation in Newfoundland, to try to bring it up to a standard of all of Canada. The bill further rewords a

section in the act regarding the setting up of a committee of medical referees to look into various diseases, industrial diseases that are appendices scheduled to the act and to advise on which diseases ehould be included in the schedule. It also adds a couple of new diseaees to the schedule:or newly designated diseases to the

schedule in the case of the St. Lawrence miners,aainly silicosis and carcinoma which the Workmen's Compensation Board has found was necessary. This is for former employees of the St. Lawrence mines. I do not t.ow if there is much else I can say in relation to introducing the bill except to reiterate again that the main purpose of it is to upgrade the allowances paid and to bring 6788

June H,, 1975 Tape no. 2303 Page 2 - - them in line with most other jurisdictions in Canada and somewhat ahead of most of the jurisdictions. I, therefore, move second reading. MR. SPEAICER (Hr. Wells): The Bon. Member for Bell Island. ~- NEARY: Mr. Speaker, the minister pointed out in his few introductory remarks, Sir, that this bill is pr:IJlarily dasigned to increase the rate of coiapensation to those who are either on permanent or partial disability. Well, Mr. Speaker. this is, I suppose, to be expected in a time of galloping inflation.

I would have hoped myself, Sir, that the bill would go a step further and include in the bill a COLA clause, a clause based on the cost of living so that year after year the minister would not have to come into the Bouse, year in and year out• asking for an increase in the benefits to be paid to recipients of Workmen's Coapensation. I think it should be autc:aatic.

The increases should be based on the cost of living. and it would have been a very silllple matter, when the draftsmen were making this bill, to include a COLA clause the same as now we are seeing in agreements between labour, between employees and their employers. Unfortunately this particular group we are talking about here, Sir, have nobody to bargain for them. They have to take just whatever the government or the Workmen's Compensation Board passes on to them and in this case thev are going to up the maximum from $9,000 and bring it up to $10,500 which on the surface would appear to be an increase of $1,500.

This, I asst.DDe, and the minister can clarify this when he closes the debate, is a maximum. 6789

June 16, 1975 Tape 2304 (Morning) PK - 1 There are a lot of recipients of workmen's compensation who do not come near that amount because it is based on their income over - I do not know what period it is - over a certain period before they were injured or went off on workmen's compensation. So there are a lot of people drawing workmen's compensation who do not come near that $10,500 amount.

So I would - the point I am making here is, Sir, that a lot of recipients of workmen's compensation are still below the income that one is expected,or the head of the Louse is expected to have in order that his family may live in dignit y . Now, Mr, Speaker, there are two or three other aspects of the bill that I would like to touch on briefly. And I suppose - incidentally before I get off this matter, Sir, of benefits to recipients of workmen's compensation, Mr.

Speaker, it was always a source of annoyance to me that people who were injured,partically or totally disabled,received so little compensation from so wealthy an organization. I am told, Mr. Speaker, that the Worlanen's Compensation Board is one of the wealthiest institutions in Newfoundland 1. The Minister of Mines and Energy smiles~ MR. BARRY: Get serious! ------ MR. NEARY: No, ,but it is. It is true. MR. BARRY: Oh absolutely! MR. NEARY: It is true, Sir. It is a fact. MR. BARRY: What? MR. NEARY: They are one of the wealthiest institutions in Newfoundland, the Workmen's Compensation Board. MR.

BARRY: Who gets the profits then? MR. NEARY: That is exactly the point, who gets the profits? The injured party, the people who receive Workmen's Compensation do not get the profits. They are building up a huge fund, and they have tremendous, they have millions of dollars invested. As a matter of fact a few years ago they were talking about putting up their own building 1they were going to go in the real estate business. They buy government bonds. They buy a lot of the bonds that this government sell. 6790

June 16, 1975 Tape 2304 (Morning) "1t. MURPHY: The Opposition soppped that. That vas their fault. MR. NF.ARY: Stopped what? Stopped the building? MR. MURPHY: The people wanted us to put up a building - MR. RARRY: Get serious. MR. NEARY: The minister is confirming what I am saying, Sir. They are. The Minister of Mines and Energy can say, "Get serious", all he likes. They are a wealthy institution. MR. MURPHY: I do not know how wealthy they are. MR. BARRY: That is a misleading way of putting it, ''They went and built up a fund." MR. TJl'OMS: 'llhat is that if it is not wealth? MR.

NEARY: Sir, they are wealthier than some of the banks in this PTI>vince and that is saying something. MR. ~PHY: The Grand Banks. MR. THO~<;: I think you are right. MR. NEARY: And the - AN HON. MEMBER: He is laughing at you, Sir. MR. NEARY: - and the benefits of that, Sir, the benefits should be passed on to the recipients. SOME HON. p,!EJo'RERS: Hear! Hear! MR. BA'l!RY: Are you serious? MR. NEARY: The people who are - yes, the employees - it is the employer who contributes. I do not think the employee contributes anything. The employer is the one who is assessed. l-lR. RARRY: Where does the money come from? MR.

NEARY: Well I do not know how they get it, but I do know that they are very, very wealthy. And so I would not - SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh! }'ll. SPEAKER (STAGG) : Order, please! MR. NEARY: I would not boast about the fact that you are going to raise the ceiling and the dependents of these people who are on workmen's compensation are going to get increased benefits. It does not go far enough to my liking, because these are the people who should be getting the benefits, and not letting this huge fund build up while we have recipients of workmen's compensation living below 6791 PK-2

June 16, 1975 Tape 2304 (Morning) PK - 3 the poverty line, and that is the point that I am making. MR. AYLWARD: Hear: Hear! MR. NEARY: There you go. My friend agrees with me. But that is an absolute fact, Sir . An absolute fact. And- MR. MURPHY: What do you mean by poverty line? MR. NEARY: The poverty line? The Minister of Social Services does not know,does he? MR. MURPHY: Carry on! MR. AYLWARD: For the first time I think he is making eense- MR. NEARY: I beg your pardon? MR. AYLWARD: You are making sense. C',0 ahead. MR.

NEARY: That is right, It does make a great deal of sense, Sir, and as far as I am concerned the bill does not go far enough. I do not know what they are ever going to do with this huge fund, Sir, they are building up. Maybe some day they will put up their own building 1I do not know, and rent out space to the government rather than go outside. But they are a very wealthy organization, Sir. And as far as I am concerned more benefits should be passed on to the recipients of Workmen's Compensation. Now, Sir, as far as including the workmen in the St.

Lawrence Mines who suffered from silicosis or carcinoma 1covering them under this act, now I would say that is a good thing. I do not think that anybody would object to that. But again, Sir, the bill does not go far enough. MR. HICKMA!I: It did at the time. HR. NEARY: Oh no it did not, Sir 0 As it happened I was the minister who instituted a special fund in St. Lawrence. HR. MORGAN: Did not Mr. Hickman? Mil. NEARY: No, SirJ Mr. Hickman did not have a say, a finger, no input, none whatsoev~r. Be ties to get a little mileage for it dawn there, but the people of St.

Lawrence know that when I was Minister of Social Services and 6792

June 16, 1975, Tape 2305, Page 1 -- apb MR. NEARY: Gerrv Power the Director of Social Assistance, be spent two weeks in St. Lawrence, and the formula for that special , fund, Sir. was worked out hv none other than yours truly and the officials of my deparbnent. MR. RARRY: Did that not wipe out the fund there or some of the Workmen• s Compensation funds at the time? MR. NF..ARY: -- - - - No, Sir, the benefits of the special fund in St. Lawrence was stacked on top of Workmen's Compensation and stacked on top of Social Assistance. MR.

BARRY: Yes, but it could be the fund that had been built up, the Workmen's CO!lll)ensation Board had funding and - ~- NEARY: No. No, Mr. Speaker, the sepcial fund I am referring to, fifty per cent was contributed by the Province and fifty per cent by the company. It was supposed to be a three way deal hetween the company, the Government of Csnada and the Province of Newfoundland. The Government of Canada have not to this day put one cent, one red cent into that fund, and it is being paid out now throup,h contributions on behalf of the province and the company, Alcan. Even the fonner company in St.

Lawrence, Sir, - forget the name of that company now - MR. MURPHY: Newfoundland Fluorspar. Joffi.. NEARY: No, not Newfoundland Fluorspar, no. Yes, probahly it was but I do not remember the owner's name. MR. BARRY : MR. NEARY: "TR. BARRY: ~ -- ~- MR. NEARY: - --- -- MR. RARRY: ·--- -- -- 'fR. NEARY: --- -- . - ---~ MR. AYLWARD: MR. NEARY: - · --- Siebens Who? Siebens. Sieben? How do you spell it? S-i-e-b-e-n-s. Yes but anvway - Siebarts. Siebarts. That is it, Siebarts. I wrote the former owners of that company.

I wrote them several times and they did not Pven have the courtesy to acknowledge my letters. ~ ~RR_Y_: __ MR. NEARY: 6793 They probably could not read them. They could read them. Not only did I write, but Morning

Jtme 16, 1975, Tape 2305, Page 2 -- apb my predecessor also wrote. I do not know if they could read his letters or not. I think I had a pretty efficient and capable secretary who was able to type, But they did not even acknowledge the letters. So it ended up that the province and Alcan built up this fund and are now paying out benefits to the survivors and families of that dreaded disease in the St. Lawrence mine. Now I might say that it was a recommendation that was made by the Aylward Royal Commission.

We were merely following out one of the reco111111endations made by my friend, my learned friend from Placentia East. But, Sir, it is only now that the workmen in St. Lawrence are going to be included under the Workmen's Compensation Act. But, Mr.

Speaker, when all the disclosures, startling disclosures, I might say, shocking disclosures of the past couple of weeks, and I pres1DDe this bill was drafted before the Minister of Mines and Energy made his startling disclosures outside of the House of the number of cases of silicosis in Labrador City, twenty-five, I think, the minister said had been discovered - I think ten or eleven confirmed and research being done on the other eleven or twelve - _HR.. BAllllY: Fourteen. MR. REARY: Fourteen.

And then we hear - not only do we hear TID10urs, Sir, but the Minister of Health, the former Minister of Health confirmed for me in the House on a number of occasions that cases of silicosis bad been discovered in Buchana. MR. BAB.RY: MR. NEARY: MR. BARRY: working conditions MR. NEARY: ----- Under study. Not confirmed but they are - You know, these are cases that arose prior to the No, no, no, Sir. No. Mr. Speaker, - Morninp, MR. MURPHY: What was happening when we came in eh, with all this stuff? It did not happen in two years. HR. NEARY: I an coming to that.

I will tell the minister what happened prior to their coming in. MR. MURPHY: ------ Did it all happen overnight? 6794

June 16, 1975, Tape 2305, Page 3 -- apb MR. NEARY: Yes, Sir. One thing, Mr. Speaker, I am intellectually honest and I think members of the House - MR. DOODY: You got a heart of gold. MR. NEARY: I may not have leadership qualities but I certainly have a brilliant heart. 'iR. MURPHY: --- - - MR. NEARY: MR. STAGG: -- - - - MR. NEARY: - - ----- That is Tight. Never, ever made the top five because of my - You are the best leader over there "Steve". I got a brilliant heart but I do not have the leadership qualities. It is not much of a compliment but it is the best we have • MR.

NEARY, Yes, Sir, never ever made the to-p five, Mr. Speak.er, but certainly had a brilliant heart. Rut getting back to this matter, Sir, which I consider Morning to be a very, very serious matter, I do not think the bill has really gone far enough. I think in view of all the disclosures and the dust problems and the health hazards now that have been confirmed by both the former Minister of Health and by the present Minister of Mines and Energy and various other members of this House, that the bill should have included workmen in Buchans, and workmen in Labrador City. And, Sir - MR. MURPHY: Raie Verte? MR.

NEARY: Oh, I am coming to that. Now just take your time now~ 6795

June 16. 1975 Tape no, 2306 Page 1 - mw MR, NEARY: Send me over a candy, I am dying this mornin~ for saaething sweet, And.

Mr, Speaker, with the present controversy. confrontation in Long Harbour where we are told that despite the fact that on a number of occasions in this honourable House and outside of this House stepa have been taken to try to improve the health hazards and the working conditions at Long Harbour that one of the reasons given today by the men, and I understand they barred off the roads in Long Harbour this morning. that all the issues there are not monetary issues, One of the big issues worrying and tormenting the workers at Long Harbour and making them sick to their stomachs. not only literally either but they are getting sick on the job. being advised by physicians and their medical advisers to get out of that plant down there, to find a job somewhere else.

And the reports we hear eaaanating froa the university that did studies on Long Harbour and a report I saw last week in the newspaper that the trees. the countryside, the vegetation around Long Harbour and down in that general vicinity is all dying. MB.. MDllPIIY: You are not surprised at that are you? MR. IIEARY: No, I - not surprised, Sir. MR. MURPHY: We debated that in the House of Asseably before the bloOlling thing ever went there. MR. REARY: So what: So what: I 1B debating it now, I am trying to draw attention to it nov. Hr.

Speaker, because there is an industry in Long Barbour, a phosphorous plant does not necessarily mean that I was the one who danced fr<a the roof tops when they put it there. It does not necessarily ean that, It does not necessarily mean that. Sir. The honourable Preier looks at me rather quizzically and says, well why did you agree with it? Who said I agreed with it? MR. MDllPIIY: You did one hundred per cent. Hll. MOORES: Well, who was calling the tunes? MR. IIEARY: I was not calling the tunes. I was only a little messenger boy, a backbencher.

I was right down there where the Minister of Rural Development sits now. Half the t:lllle I did not know what was going on, I am like half the crowd over there now. I never ever 6796

June 16, 1975 Tape no. 2306 Page 2 - mw know it until I see the Premier on television or pick up a newspaper. MR. MOORES: We have another one now. MR. NEARY: There we go. I presume it is on Western Newfoundland. I gave you the opening this morning. You should give me ten per cent. Mr.

Speaker, the fact remains, Sir, that the industry is there and how it got there, how it landed down there in Long Harbour is of no real significance at this momene But the fact remains that there are people in this Province, experts, and the workers in the plant down there say that there are still health hazards,and conditions are not what they should be. Now, Sir, if this honourable crowd do not do anything about it, then they are equally as guilty as the ones that they are saying that went before them who did not do anything about it. MR. HUR.PHY: MR.

NEARY: Who wants to clean out the barn after a bunch of horses? But, Mr. Speaker, this is the crowd who were going to clean up everything, Sir. They were going to clean out all the manure. No favouritism, no patronage, no extravagance and no waste and no borrowing. They were going to do it all. MR. DOODY: No executive assistants. MR. NEARY: No executive assistants, nothing. MR. BARRY: No debts. MR.

NEARY: So I am merely reminding the House, Sir, and I hope the people of this Province, that this is the honourable group of gentlemen who were going to correct all the misdemeanors and all the illnesses and all the badness,if you want to put it that way,and all the - HR. DOODY: MR. NEARY: Ma. MURPHY: MR. NF.AI.Y: Slieveenary. - slieveenary and corruption of the past. (Inaudible). All attributed sometimes to mistakes of the heart. But, Sir, here it is, We still have that situation now, Here is a golden opportunity, Mr.

Speaker, for the administration to show their sincerity, Sir, They are bringing in a bill now, and it is only a matter of the Government House Leader making a minor amendment to this hill. The Minister of Manpower and Industrial Development cannot do it, because it is his bill. One of his colleagues can,and go a step further 6797

June 16, 1975 Tap e no . 2306 Page 3 - n:11,1 and provide not only the workmen in St, L.awrence but the workmen in Buchana , the workmen in Long Ha-rbour, the workmen iu Labrador City and tbe workmen in Baie Verte be included under this act for the purpose of determining silicosis and· carci.no111a, MR. MAYNARD: They already are, MR, NEARY: No, Sir! Well, the minister did not -make that clear. Maybe I am just tilting at windmills here. MR. MA'lllARD: They are now. MR. mwtY: They are •now? Well why are we making a special i,rori.aion for St. Lawrence workmen! MR. AYI.VARD-: Legal action - MR • . BAIUlY: They have a special arrange.ent, 6798

June 16, 1975, Tape 2307, Page 1 -- apb "Morning ~ .-_ NEARY: I am just gettin~ the min:Lster's - SOME BON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh! ~R. NEARY: Are thev included now under this

section that will provide for recognition of the workmen in St. Lawrence? 'IR. MAYNARD: They are recognized. 'TTl. NF.ARY: They have been.so it is not necessarv. MR. MAYNARD: St. Lawrence is a special case. MR. NEARY: The reason St. Lawrence is heing brought in is hPcause of the special fund, is that it? AN HON. MF.MBER: Yes. - - ---·- --- "'R. ~EARY : ···--· -- I see. So the Workmen's Compensation benefits, Social Assistance benefits are stacked on top of the special flllld. Now, Sir, Okay~ That is fine. So, Mr.

Speaker, my concern for havinr. these people included, Sir, under the Workmen's Compensation Act, then is really not as great. The only thing that I can say now, Sir, is this, and I think I have said it in this honourable Rouse before, is the fact - I know the honourable Member for Harbour Grace would not like to hear this because he may be trying to drum up a little business for himself - but, Sir - and the honourable member is not supposed to speak in the Rouse from other than his own seat - but, Mr. Speaker, we are going to have to keep a close watch on Buchans, Baie Verte, Long Harbour, Labrador City and St.

Lawrence. HR. DOODY: And Bell Island. MR. NF.ARY: Not, Bell Island, Sir, although the honourable the Minister of Social Services a few moments ago said, "Well, what hai,J)elled before? What happened before?'' Well, what happened before, Sir, that the medical people who are really the ones who determine, you know, whether you have a condition, a respiratory condition or not, the medical people - maybe they were quite justified at the time because we did not have the technology - said that it was very difficult, it was almost impossible, next to impossible to discover silicosis.

I was bortt and raised in a mining conmnmi ty, Sir, and I lived t here f.or the first - let me see - the first thirty-eight years of my life I lived in a mining cornmunitv. Sometimes I was undergrolllld, most of the time I was on the surface. But the dust on the surface was 6799

June 16, 1975, Tape 2307, Page 2 -- apb almost as bad, I would say that sometimes it was even worse - the dust from the stockpiles and the cars and the trucks, the ore cars dumping and the trucks dumping - HR. MURPHY: red sheep. MR. NEARY: ----- The only place in the world where they had That it right. We had red sheep, red bucks and red goats. I remember a story one time they told us, this Syrian Priest came down from Sydney and they used to have Mass there once a year in St. Peter's Church on the Green.

And the Syrian Priest would come down from Sydney to have Mass once a year and preach a :sermon, and all the Syrians and all the people of Beli Isalnd would go. But I remember this old Syrian guy was sitting up in the front seat - there was just props under the Momin!!! Church, it was a real old church like you see around various Newfoundland outports- and he was hard of hearing, this old gentleman, this old Syrian who was sitting up in the front. And the Priest started off by say.lng, "Hark!

I hear a voice~" And the old guv in the front seat said, "Father, that the bad boy drive the red goat under the Church." So, the minister is perfectly right. We did have red goats and red sheep on the Island. It is a wonder, Sir, that all the people of Bell Island did not have silicosis. But the doctors - MR. DOODY: Red goats and pink members. HR. NEARY: I was not a med>er at the time. There was a Tory -aed>er there at the ti.Jne, by the way. MR. YOUNG: c&111paign manager. HR. NEARY: MR.. DOODY: HR. NEARY: MR. JX>ODY: HR. NEARY: You were his campaign manager. You were his No, I was not his campaign manager.

You were Jim McGrath's CBlll1)aign 111anager. Who? Jim McGrath. I campaigned for Jim McGrath on a personal - that was a personal thing, because I met him when he was bellhop down at the Newfoundland Hotel.

June 16, 1975, Tape 2307, Page 3 - apb MR. SPEAKER: Order, please: The houourable aeaber vanders far afield but then he manages to get back to the topic. I suggest to the houourable IIK!lllber that he 111ight be an:e pertinent persisteiitly. MR. MURPUY: MR. NEARY: Be nice now, Mr. Speaker is not nasty today. But, Mr. Speaker• thi.s dust probleaa bas always been there, to answer the minister, but the X-rays would not show up silicosis. My answer to that b that I would say that there !Ire men walking around Bell Island today suffering from ches .t conditions, from respiratory conditi0118.

I would say tha.t if they do not have silicosis, by God! I tell you you could fool me. They are there now tod!IY walking around. I do not ko.ow but I got a bit of a chest condition iayself. I do 110t Slll8ke cigarettes 6801 Morning

June 16, 1975 Tape 2308 (Morning) PK - 1 but I got that hacking cough once in a while, and a little bronchitis and a little - :!:IR. BARRY: :!:IR. NEARY: It went to your head instead of your chest. No, Sir, it did not. No, Mr. - SOME HON. MEMBERS : Oh , oh ! MR. SPEAKER (STAGG): Order, please! MR. NEARY: But, Mr.

Speaker, there are a lot of men not only on Bell Island, you will find it in Buchans too because we heard recently that some of the residents in Buchans who live on the surface, who have never been underground,they have silicosis, and this is a very serious matter and I hope that the Minister of Manpower and Industrial Relations and my learned friend the Minister of Mines and Energy will laid special emphasis on this serious problem in the future, and the Minister of Health, the new Minister of Health,it is something that we are going to have to watch, Sir, very, very carefully. Now, Mr.

Speaker, there is not much else I can say about this bill except the increases in the rate, Sir, are due to come in force on, I think, paragraph (

a) Section 2 shall come into force on the 1st. day of January 1976, (There goes that backing cough again), and that is to bring the max1nann •1p to $10,500, Sir. Well, Mr. Speaker, I vould like to see the act amended to make that retroactive to the 1st. of January this year. The Workmen's Compensation Board has the money. It is not like they are a poor outfit. They have the money to do it. And then

Section 4 shall come into force on the 1st. day of July 1975. Let us see what

Section 4 is, Subsection (1) of

Section 18 of the said Act is amended by deleting from paragraph (

c) the vords "one hundred dollars" and substituting "ollf' hundred and fifty dollars". Not a very generous increase. But I think at fifty dollars a month-but I think it should be made retroactive to January 1st. 1975 ral:her than come into force on the 1st. day of July. And Sections 9 and 11 ~hall come into force on the 20th. day of July 1975. Let us see what Sections 9 and 11 are - 9 and 11, to increase the amount from three hundred dollars and one hundred and fifty dollars,these are all reference to the previous sections 6802

.June Hi, 1975 Tape 2308 (Morning) PK - 2 of the bill, i~1erever they appear wherein and substituting thereof five hundred dollars and two hundred and twenty-five dollars respectively. That is to come into effect on the 20th. day of July, and I think, Sir, that also should be retroactive to the 1st. of January 1975. No reason why it could not be, Mr. Speaker. The money is there. The workmen themselves have made a major contribution, the employers have paid, it does not cost the taxnavers of this Province one cent. A lot of recipients of Workmen's Compensation are living below the proverty line.

And I think that the humanitarian thing to do is for the minister and the administration, if they are sincere in this matter, to make all of these increases retroactive to the 1st. of January 1975. Now as far as the minister's reference to restructuring the ~orkmen's Compensation Board is concerned, well, Sir, we saw again what happened in this particular instance.

We heard a lot of criticism about political appointments and favouritism and political natronage, and the minister had the opportunity to get away from that, could not resist the temptation to appoint party supporters to the Workmen's Compensation Board, and then have the gall and the nerve to say that they were the representatives of management and labour, when in actual fact, Sir, labour was not consulted, One of the gentlemen appointed to that Board as a matter of fact is a supporter and partv worker for my honourable friend the junior Member for Harbour Hain. :MR. DOODY: lfR. DOODY: }IR.

NEARY: ·--··- He is very sensible. And I would - That sounds like a great qualification. - I would say , Sir, that - to me, the minister may think it is a great qualification. Too much of a coincidence, Sir. MR. DOYLE: He is also the business a~ent for the Iron Workers. -~· NF:ARY: But not the :me that was recollll!lended by the Newfoundland Federation of Labour. 6803

June lr, i975 Tape 23()8 (Momin~) l:'K - 3 ~ -_!l:9_0DY: Who did they recollllllend? ~N]YIRY: They did not reco111111e'Dd anyh ody hecause they we,e not asked. MR., DOOD'Y : Ob I see. MR. NEARY: They were not asked. And yet the iidnister st-ands in his place in this honourable Bouse and has [the gall and the nerve and the face to tell us that these people and the advisot-s who are going to be- appointed represent management and labour. MR.. imRPHY: A confit:med Liberal. MR.. NEARY: Who is a confirmed Liberal? 6804

Jm1e 16, 1975, Tape 2309, Pagel -- apb MR. NEARY: MR. DOYLE: "ffi. NEARY: Who? You should know. Mr. Sneaker, these representatives that have been appointed to the Board are political appoinbnents. It is just as well to la:y it on the line and face the facts. But it does not make any difference, Sir, what I say in this honoourable House about political appointments, about political patronage or favouritism, it is not going to change the situation one bit, because we have too many people in this honourable House, Sir, Morning who will stand up and tell you right to your face, stand up and tell you that.

"Oh,political patronage has been going on ever since we have had democratic govenunent and is going to continue to go on immaterial of what government you have." So when you hear, Sir, responsible people, influential ministers - you hear the Minister of Fisheries.for instance,making a statement of that sort - what would ex,,ect from the juniors,like the Minister of Manpower and Industrial Relations,who have no influence at all in the cabinet? Just sitting there like a stick of furniture on the eighth floor, what else would you expect?

The Minister of Fisheries says, "Oh political patronage is a thing you must accept." I say it is not a thing you must accept, Sir. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear! Hear! MR. DOODY: ----- - You fought against it long and hard. t-\R. NEARY: -·- --- I certainly have, All my life I have fought. All my adult life, Sir, I have fought against it. MR. MURPHY: ---- - He put a member on the Workmen's Compensation Board. He did not even know the chap at all. Right? MR. NEARY: If the honourable minister is referring to a former member of the Workmen's Compensation Board, then I can tell him now - MR. MURPHY: '!R. NEARY: A good man.

Straight to his face, that if he got the job it was on his qualifications,not on my recommendation. 6805

June 16, 1975, Tape 2307, Page 2 -- apb Korninr; MR. MURPHY: No: MR. NEARY: No. No. And the Minister of Fisheries can sit over there and make his snide remarks and his - MR. MURPHY: MR. SPEAKER: MR. NEARY: AN HON. MEMBER: MR. NEARY: ----- MR. PICKFORD: MR. NEARY: whatsoever. HJt. BllE'l'T: MR. NEARY: Any others? Carry on. Order, please! - silly grin on his face. Onward. That appointment was not made on my rec011111endation. It was against your recommendation. Against it? No, Sir, I had no say in it. None But you fought against it, you say. Mr.

Speaker, I am not prepared to accept that principle, that political patronage is here to stay. MR. MURPHY: To the victor belongs the spoils. MR. NEARY: I am not prepared to accept it. I think that people should be appointed to a position on their merits, on their qualifications - AN HOIJOURABLE MEMBER: Rear: Rear! MR. NEARY: - and not because they are brown nosin~ with the miniater or hobnobbing with the family compact, or supporting one party or the other. This is what is causing half the trouble in the world today, political corruption. SOME HON. MEMBERS : Hurray! Hurray! MR.

NEARY: ----- And ministers can laugh in this honourable House if they like, but this is where it all begins. The corruption starts with the 11.ttle thing. We saw it in Southeast Asia, we see it now in India - MR. CROSBIE: the window. MR. NEARY: ----- KR.. YOURG: MR. NEARY: I expect to see a bolt of lb;htening come through No. No, Ur. Speaker - Want a glass of water? Mr.

Speaker, I would hope that the Minister of Manpower and Industrial Relations would cease to appoint, make political appointments to such an important board as the Worlcmen's Compeneation Board, where people have to make decisions on whether or 68()6

June 16, 1975, Tape 2309, Page 3 -- apb not a workman is, first of all, entitled to Workmen's Compensation and then the amount that he should get. Are they going to make Morni.ng a decision on whether or not he is a P.C.? Whether or not he can afford a lawyer? Whether or not he has pull with one minister or another? Whether he has political pull with the administration in power? All these decisions should be completely made impartially Sir, by members of the Workmen's Compensation Board.

I am not saying that they are not, but there is that danger, that weakness in what the minister is doing, the policy he is following. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh! MR. SPEAKER: Order, please: MR. NEARY: The policy he is following is a very dangerous one. MR. SPEAKER: ------ - Order, please! Order, please! I just want to interrupt, if the honourable member will permit, before the group leaves the galleries. I have just been informed that we have in the galleries a group of Young Voyaguers from the Province of Saskatchewan who are here on an exchange visit.

On behalf of all the members of our legislature I certainly welcome vou to the Province and specifically to our House of Assembly, and hope that your visit here is most interesting and informative. MR. NEARY : You know, Mr. Speaker, I am very happy that these young students are here today from the Province of Saskatchewan because our \forkmen' s Co111T>ensation Act that we are amending here today and our Labour 6807

June 16, 1975 Tape 2310 (Morning) PK - 1 Relations Act, and most of our labour legislation was copied from legislation that was introduced into the T.egislature and passed by an ~.D.P. Government in Saskatchewan. And I want to offer my congratulations to Premier Blakney who was recently returned to the Legislature of Sask~tchewan, maybe with a smaller majority,hut the people still have faith, Sir, in the N.D.P. Government which in my opinion, which in my opinion, Sir, is the only party in Canada today that has a social conscience. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, o'I-., MR. BARRY: MR. NEARY: Your party?

But your party? - has a social conscience. AN HON. MEMBER: What your party? MR. NEARY: My party is the closest that you can get to having a social conscience. MR. YOUNG: AN HON. MEMBER: They have no conscience. They have no conscience. The N.D.P. MR. oon.E: The N.D.P. are all at the university. MR. NEARY: But until we get away from - MR. oon.E: They are headquartered over there. MR. NEARY: Until, Mr. Speaker, unless and until we get away from going with out hand out for contributions to run our campaigns and our elections.~hen I am afraid that we are going to have a corrupt system. MR. SPEAICER.: Order, please!

MR. NEARY: They are changing that in Saskatchewan. MR. SPEAKER: Order, please! has gone·on for sometime now, of this bill. The honourable Member for Bell Island being very irrelevant to the principle MR. NEARY: However, Sir, I am sure that out in the Province of Saskatchewan you will find today that they do not lll3ke political appointments to their Workmen's Compensation Board. They think too highly of it. They think too much about that Board.

But here in Newfoundland, here in Newfoundland, Sir, the Minister of Manpower and Industrial Relations is following a procedure and a technique tl1at was used by a man, a former Premier of this Province who was much 6808

June 16, 1975 Tape 2310 (Morn.1.ng) PK - 2 maligned and criticized, but they must think that that technique was all right because now they are doing it themselves. They were going to change all of that. MR. MOORES: 'Who was that? )'1R. NEARY: No I do not have to mention the name, Sir, of the former gentleman who occupied - 't-lP. MURPHY: Ile is back in Town.I was talking to him a day or so ago. No he is not, he is gone to Ottawa. AN HON. MEMBER: Be is gone again. MR. NEARY: ------- He is up seeing if he can get some assistance to build that fish plant down in Burgeo. MR. MURPHY: Gone to see non Jamie•on?

"tR".__NF.ARY: So, Mr. Speaker, here you have a situation where in ~ provincial elections the Minister of Manpower and Industrial Relations went down in St. Barbe South and probably in other districts all around this Province and said that if we are elected, and this has to do with advisors and appointments to the Workmen's Compensation Board, the Minister of Manpower and Industrial Relations said if we are elected we will not make political appointments to boards or agents, government agencies or crown corporations. smlE HON . MEMBERS: Oh ' oh! ~~-_1'!,EA_'!l-Y: Now how can the minister explain that now? ~R.

YOUNr.: Sit down and listen to him! ~TR. NEARY: That he has fallen right into the trap. rill. . THOMS: Went with the old ways. MR. NF.ARY: Yes 1 followed the old tradition, the old routine tllllt has gone on down through the years that has been so highly criticized and made political appointments to that Board. Why did the minister not go to the Newfoundland Federation of Labour and say to the Federation of Labour will you make a recommendation or go to the Board of Trade or the Chamber of Commerce,whoever represents the employers .• and ask t'he.m to make a recommendation.

And these advisors now that the minister is making provision to set up, will they be party flunkies and party hacks or will the minister, as ne said t:nere a few moment• 6809

June lli, 1975 Tape 2310 (Morning) PK - 3 ago, in his introductory remarks, that these will represent management and labour. Will they be truly representative of management and labour? Or will they be political appointments? I think the minister, Sir, owes it to this House and owes it to the people of this Province to clarify that situation. No , They said there is going to be no witchhunt. MR. MURPHY: Carried. MR. NEARY: There is going to be nobody fired. But the minister himself went about it in a roundabout way. There were times when he was away down off Australia. He did not go straight for the jugular.

He did not steer a straight course, and man-fashion throw out the people who were appointed by the former administration he went about it in another way as we saw happen in the case too of the Public Service Commission and the Newfoundland Power Corporation. Instead of going for the jugular in man-fashion and saying,look your political appointments - no they had to get consultants and studies and they had to go out and try and find out - MR. DOODY: Who was doing a good job? MR. NEARY: No, Sir, they had to try and do a smear job, that is what they tried to do on some of the members of that Board.

And they pensioned some, and they did not pension others. One, I think the Chairman, got a pension, 6810

June 16. 1975 Tape no. 2311 Page 1 - - One of the gentleman was sick and probably would not have coae back to vork anyway,vho vas entitled to go off on peuion. The chairman vas pensioned. But oae gentleman vas not pensioned. I would like for the •inister to axt,lain that. So. Kr, Speaker, it really does not llake any difference what I say because soaet:IJles I wonder, Sir, if there is anything you say in this Bouse taken seriously any aore.

People are beCCllling cynical and disillusioned and disenchanted and discouraged and it is hardly worth your while to get up to say anything any 111>re in this honourable House. I do not think anybody pays any attent:lno to you, Not me nov. I aa not talking about ae personally. I - talking about meabers of the House and the Pr-ier and the •inistera. Vbo pays attention to vhat the Minister of Fisheriea says any aore'l Bobody in this Province. It is a vaste of tiae.

And i:- get-up and I spend ten or fifteen •inutes criticizing political appoint.eats and extravagance and vaste in connection vith the Worbl-'s Coapensation Board and vhat use is it, Mr. Speaker? What use is it~I aak. you? Because they are going to go on doing it anyway as if I never said a vord about it. The press rill accept it. Newspapers, radio, television rill accept it as just a matter of fact. It is something you cannot change, 'fR. MURPHY: Go all day for $150. MR. NEAllY: And they let her go on and on and on, let her lurch from one political appointaent to the other and nobody seems to care, ~r. Speaker.

Have people g:tven up? Sir, it is tille• Kr. Speaker. that we got an administration in this Province that had a social conscience like the one just elected out in Saskatchewan. And the nearest that you can get to that in Newfoundland, in Canada, the nearest you can get is the Liberal Party. And my colleague the Leader of the Opposition, who is sincere, conscientious, has a social conscience - SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh! MR. YOUNG: Tell the truth now. MR. NEARY: I am telling the truth, Sir. MR. DOODY You do not mean it. You know, you do not mean it. 6811

June 16, 1975 Tape no. 2311 Page 2 - aw MR. SPEAD!R: Order• please! MR. REARY: Kr. Speaker, the polls that have been done recently indicate that. Kr. Speaker, payment for these advisers that are to be appointed, I would like for the minister to clarify that. I have been going through the bill with a fine-toothed c011b trying to find out - Nil. DOODY: Hll, REAllY: Mil. DOODY: KR.. SPBilEll: Mil. IIEAR.Y : You are lousy enough. 1 beg your pardon? . You are lousy enough. OTder, please!

According to the reports that I heard davn in Conception Bay South the other day the minister will find out how lousy we are, It is all firsthand. Order• please! Mil. DOODY: -~ SPEADll Mil. 1'UllY : It is all firsthand, that is right. And I hear• it firsthand. You should have heard the c-ts ont in the audience. That is the place to be,wut with the , ordinary oeople. Kr. Speaker, I would like to t- what these aclv:laers are going to be paid. Bow much will they be paid per aeeting? 11111 they be paid a salary?

When they are being reiJlbursed for their travel, what travel allowances will there be, the sa.e as the Civil Servants? Give us a fev ore details, Sir. Then after we hear the minister -ybe he can persuade us, he can convince us that everything is rosy, no probleas with the Vorl:en 's Cc.penaation Board since this honourable crowd took over, no political appointments, no favouriti-, no political patronage, everything is going along fine and everybody is happy, including the recipients who are getting enough inc- to live on.

The Vorl:en 's Compensation Board is building up a huge f&md, richer than any bank in Rewfo&mdland and :,et the poor old recipients are not getting enough to live on. MR. KDBPBY: That is bow they did it three years ago. Hll. REAllY: !lot how ldley did three years ago, Sir. T:lJlea have changed. 6812

June l6, 1975 Tape no. 2311 Page 3 - - Oh. if they keep provoking me I vill - the Prea:f.er should silence some of these. You know there are a few people over there ~ like but there are. some that I cannot stand. And when I get an ioternq,tion and an interjection from one that I cannot stand I just have to plow on. But anyway• Sir, I vill be looking fonrard to what the ainiat;er has to aay in reply to some of .., questions. Hit. MURPHY: Will ve go through the di~er hour like this, Sir? MR. SPEAKER: If the honour11ble minister speaks now he closest~ debaie. MR. AYLWARD: Mr.

Speaker, if I could hoe a moment to reply to the gentleaan? MR. SPEAD:ll: Onler, please! I was about to say that it is difficult to see the clock from here but it appears as if it is one of the clock, t shall adjourn now until three o'clock this afternoon. 6813

June 16, 1975. The House resumerl at 3:00 p.m. Mr. Speaker in the Chair. Tape 2312 RH - 1 MR. SPEAKER: Order, please! When I left the Chair at one of the clock I think the honourable t~ember for Placentia East was about to speak on bill number (44). So I recognize the honourable Member for Placentia East. MR. AYLWARD: Mr. Speaker, I had just a few brief remarks on this and I would certainly like to compliment the Minister of Manpower and Industrial Relations for bringing in this piece of progressive legislation.

I think that an increase in the amount due either disabled miners or people receiving compensation or the widows or deceased individuals is very, very important. I listened with interest to the remarks from my honourable friend from Bell Island this morning who was Minister of Labour in the previous administration. 'While I do agree that he certainly nlayed a prominent part fn the establishnent of that special fund at St. Lawrence, but, 1'1.r. Speaker, that fund,as far as I was concerned,created more problems than it solved at that particular time. The fund was good but what the disabled miners of St:.

Lawrence and the widows and orphans of deceased miners at: that: time, what: they wanted was :hnplementation of the recmamendat:ions of the royal coanission which reported in 1968 to extend the coverage to miners who were suffering fr<D cronic obstructive pulmonary diseases. U~ until 1972 the only industrial diseases were covered were silicosis and carcinoma of the lung. But what the cODDission found was that a large number of individuals in St. ~ence had been suffering from cronic obstructive pulmonary disability and they were not entitled to Work:nan's Collpensat:ion.

So what: the commission rec0111aende4 in 1968 was that the Workaen's Compensation Act be amended, the schedule, to make that: one of the industrial diseases which should be covered by the act. My honourable friend knows full well that that: was not brought in until 1972 and I think the Prenier of the Province is to be really complimented for this progressive piece of legislation back in 1972.

June 16, 1975 Tape No. 2312 RH - 2 I understand on his first visit to St. Lawrence the Attorney Genera1 told me he took him to the hospital and he was very, very concerned as so well he should be as was anybody who was close to that. Re made a commitment that the recommendations of that commission would be one of the first items of legislation brought in if he should win the government. Obviously, Mr.

Speaker, that is one promise that certainly was fulfilled because in 1972 the Workmen's Compensation Act was amended and it was a11ended to provide that any workman who had cronic obstructive pulmonary disease and who work~d in the mine, they would be entitled to compensation. That was a great, great step because that covered a large number of miners and widows and orphans who were not, before that time, entitled to compensation. MR.NEARY: That was done in 1971. MR. AYLWARD: That was done in 1972. MR. NEARY: No. - If the member will - MR. SPEAKER: Order, please! HR. AYLWARD: Rere is the act, Mr. Speaker.

No, that was done in 1972. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh! MR. SPEAKER: Order, please: MR. AYLWARD: No, Mr. Speaker, the legislation is "An Act Further To Amend The Workmen's Compensation Act" and this was passed in 1972. This is the amendment I am referring to. MR. NEARY: We included the St. Lawrence group as recommended by the Royal Co11111ission, MR. SPEAKER: Order, please! MR. AYLWARD: But also, Mr. Speaker, in addition we set up what we felt were our own, what the act should provide and who under our recommendations Ehould be entitled to compensation.

At the same time, the legislature in 1972 included a provision in the act that said, "Every workman or dependents of deceased workmen in St. Lawrence who were recommended for compensation would receive it." This was brought in by this government in 1972, 6815

June 16, 1975. Tape 2312 RH - 3 MB.. NEARY: That was a 4ifferent one. MR. AYLWARD: No, that is the same act I am referring to, 1972, ~. Speaker.. So as far as the social conscience is concerned I tMnk that this gove:rnment,and it is too bad the Member for Burin is not here, Mr. Speaker, because 1 know he is ve1;y, vecy close to that situation and he did a great deal for trying to get this legislation before the House, and I am very, very proud and pleased to see that this government took that step immediately after its election.

Then it went further, Mr, Speaker, because in 1973 it was f•elt that there were a large nmnber of individuals in St. Lawrence ltbo bad never worked in the mines who had contracted diseases which were related to the industry. So in 1973 the act was amended to provide for any workman, whether he worked underground or whe.tber he hand.led the fluorsvar. That meaat 6816

June 16, 1975 Tape no. 2313 Page 1 - - that the individuals in St. Lawrence, who had never vorlted underground hut vho had contracted the diseases mentioned in the

schedule to the Workmen's Compensation Act, vould be entitled and should receive compensation. HR. NEARY: And industrial accidents, too. MR. AYLWARD: Yes. And not only that, Hr. Speaker, hut it even vent further than that because what this legislation did in 1972 and 1973 was it gave the injured vorbtan and the orphans and vidovs of deceased workmen rights that no other group in Newfoundland bad received,because ve did not have II Worbaen's Ccmpenaation Act until, I think it vu, 1951. The mines in St.

Lavrence bad started before 1951 and thia legislation in 1973 ade it retroactive to the date when the aines started. So anyone vbo contracted these diae1111ea even before 1951 vere entitled to compensation. MR. KF.AllY: No. That is not so, they say. HR. SPEADlt: Order, please! MR. NEARY: There are iners today vho - HR. SPEAKER: Order, please! MR. NEARY: - have been refused - HR.. SPEAKER.: Order, please! HR. AYLWARD: Hr. Speaker, what altes e disagree - MR. SPEAICER: Order, please! MR. AYLWARD: - with my honourable friend is that perhaps he does not realize - _AN HON. MafBER: Sit down, "Fint". MR.

AYLWARD: Oh, I • sorry. MR. SPEAICER: On two or three occasions the Ron. Member for Bel.l Island has seen fit to interject when he certainly does not have the procedural right to do so. And if he continues to do so, the Chair vill have no choice but to nAme him. MR. NEARY: Mr. Speaker, I know of two or three cases myself, so I would like to ask the member if he would tell us whether there is any miner now, because I had a couple of cases recently - 681"7

Jutle 16, 1975 Tape no. 2313 Page 2 - mw MR. SPEADR.: Order, please! MR. HUI.Y: MR.. SPEAKER.: - where - no, the meaber ia permitting a question, Sir. Order, please! MR. NEAR.Y: MR. SPIADR.: MR. HIAJlY: The meaber ia permitting a question, Hr. Speaker, The member may have very vell - Do you vant a dart in the chops; MR.. SPEADll.: Order, please: The Bon. Heaber for Placentia East may well have acceded to the honourable llellber's request for a question. The Chair was not avare of it - Ma. DAKY: The llellber took his seat. MR. SP!AIER.: - vhen the Speaker stood up to aake a ruling. MR. lUWlY: Kr.

Speaker• I just want to ask the aember if he is avare that there are acae cases vbere they contracted the diaeaae before 1951, and they have been rejected by the Vorkaen's Coapensation loardt I had a couple of cases recently. Ma. All.WAID: I do not bow vbat the deciaion of the Vorlmen 'a ea.penaation loard hu been with respect to any application before it. lut vbat I c:an aay ia that the legialation on the boob of tbia Province -• and tbia vu brought in by this administration first in 1972 and •ended in 1973 vbich gives these people the right, and I will read the

section for the honourable llellber • that they never bad nor does any other group of vorkaen in Revfoundland have. And here ia vbat it says:

Section 93 (

b) of the said act, as enacted by 91 (

b) in 1972 is aended by deleting certain sections, etc., the espreasion, 'such workaan worked underground in the llines at St. Lavrence at any tfae during the period frca January 1, 1951 to Dec:eaber 31, 1960,' ad substituting therefore the words, 'such vorlman vu a.ployed at any tfae whether before or after l January,1951 in the flaorspar mtt~action or handling or both at St. Lawrence. ' So vbat this aeans is