British Columbia Hansard — 23 March 2020, p.m., Issue 326 (41st Parliament, 5th Session)

20200323pm-Hansard-n326

British Columbia — Debates (Hansard)

Fifth Session, 41st Parliament OFFICIAL REPORT OF DEBATES (HANSARD) Monday, March 23, 2020 Afternoon Sitting Issue No. 326 THE HONOURABLE DARRYL PLECAS, SPEAKER ISSN 1499-2175

PROVINCE OF BRITISH COLUMBIA (Entered Confederation July 20, 1871) LIEUTENANT-GOVERNOR Her Honour the Honourable Janet Austin, OBC Fifth Session, 41st Parliament SPEAKER OF THE LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Honourable Darryl Plecas EXECUTIVE COUNCIL Premier and President of the Executive Council ............................................................................................................... Hon. John Horgan Deputy Premier and Minister of Finance............................................................................................................................Hon.

Carole James Minister of Advanced Education, Skills and Training..................................................................................................... Hon. Melanie Mark Minister of Agriculture.........................................................................................................................................................Hon. Lana Popham Attorney General.................................................................................................................................................................Hon.

David Eby, QC Minister of Children and Family Development ............................................................................................................ Hon. Katrine Conroy Minister of State for Child Care...................................................................................................................................... Hon. Katrina Chen Minister of Citizens’ Services...................................................................................................................................................Hon.

Anne Kang Minister of Education ............................................................................................................................................................ Hon. Rob Fleming Minister of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources ..................................................................................................... Hon. Bruce Ralston Minister of Environment and Climate Change Strategy............................................................................................. Hon.

George Heyman Minister of Forests, Lands, Natural Resource Operations and Rural Development ..............................................Hon. Doug Donaldson Minister of Health .....................................................................................................................................................................Hon. Adrian Dix Minister of Indigenous Relations and Reconciliation ......................................................................................................... Hon.

Scott Fraser Minister of Jobs, Economic Development and Competitiveness.............................................................................Hon. Michelle Mungall Minister of State for Trade...............................................................................................................................................Hon. George Chow Minister of Labour ...................................................................................................................................................................Hon.

Harry Bains Minister of Mental Health and Addictions............................................................................................................................ Hon. Judy Darcy Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing.................................................................................................................. Hon. Selina Robinson Minister of Public Safety and Solicitor General ........................................................................................................... Hon.

Mike Farnworth Minister of Social Development and Poverty Reduction..............................................................................................Hon. Shane Simpson Minister of Tourism, Arts and Culture.....................................................................................................................................Hon. Lisa Beare Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure................................................................................................................ Hon.

Claire Trevena LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Leader of the Official Opposition................................................................................................................................Andrew Wilkinson, QC Leader of the Third Party .................................................................................................................................................................Adam Olsen Deputy Speaker................................................................................................................................................................................

Raj Chouhan Assistant Deputy Speaker............................................................................................................................................................. Simon Gibson Deputy Chair, Committee of the Whole ................................................................................................................ Spencer Chandra Herbert Clerk of the Legislative Assembly ...........................................................................................................................................

Kate Ryan-Lloyd Clerk Assistant — Committees and Interparliamentary Relations ..........................................................................................Susan Sourial Associate Law Clerk ..............................................................................................................................................Loredana Catalli-Sonier, QC Law Clerk and Parliamentary Counsel............................................................................................................................................ S.

Suzie Seo Acting Sergeant-at-Arms..................................................................................................................................................................Greg Nelson

ALPHABETICAL LIST OF MEMBERS Ashton, Dan (BC Liberal) ......................................................................... Penticton Bains, Hon. Harry (NDP)................................................................ Surrey-Newton Barnett, Donna (BC Liberal) .....................................................Cariboo-Chilcotin Beare, Hon. Lisa (NDP)..............................................

Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows Begg, Garry (NDP) .......................................................................Surrey-Guildford Bernier, Mike (BC Liberal) .........................................................Peace River South Bond, Shirley (BC Liberal)...........................................Prince George–Valemount Brar, Jagrup (NDP).......................................................................Surrey-Fleetwood Cadieux, Stephanie (BC Liberal)........................................................

Surrey South Chandra Herbert, Spencer (NDP) .......................................Vancouver–West End Chen, Hon. Katrina (NDP)...................................................... Burnaby-Lougheed Chouhan, Raj (NDP) .................................................................Burnaby-Edmonds Chow, Hon. George (NDP).................................................Vancouver-Fraserview Clovechok, Doug (BC Liberal) ..................................Columbia River–Revelstoke Coleman, Rich (BC Liberal) ................................................................ Langley East Conroy, Hon.

Katrine (NDP)...........................................................Kootenay West Darcy, Hon. Judy (NDP) ............................................................. New Westminster Davies, Dan (BC Liberal) ........................................................... Peace River North de Jong, Michael, QC (BC Liberal) ..............................................Abbotsford West Dean, Mitzi (NDP)................................................................ Esquimalt-Metchosin D’Eith, Bob (NDP) ................................................................Maple Ridge–Mission Dix, Hon.

Adrian (NDP)....................................................... Vancouver-Kingsway Donaldson, Hon. Doug (NDP)...................................................................... Stikine Eby, Hon. David, QC (NDP).............................................. Vancouver–Point Grey Elmore, Mable (NDP).........................................................Vancouver-Kensington Farnworth, Hon. Mike (NDP) ........................................................Port Coquitlam Fleming, Hon. Rob (NDP) ......................................................

Victoria–Swan Lake Foster, Eric (BC Liberal).............................................................Vernon-Monashee Fraser, Hon. Scott (NDP) ..................................................Mid Island–Pacific Rim Furstenau, Sonia (BC Green Party) .............................................Cowichan Valley Gibson, Simon (BC Liberal) ...................................................Abbotsford-Mission Glumac, Rick (NDP).........................................................Port Moody–Coquitlam Heyman, Hon. George (NDP) ................................................Vancouver-Fairview Horgan, Hon.

John (NDP) ................................................ Langford–Juan de Fuca Hunt, Marvin (BC Liberal) ........................................................ Surrey-Cloverdale Isaacs, Joan (BC Liberal) .......................................... Coquitlam–Burke Mountain James, Hon. Carole (NDP).................................................... Victoria–Beacon Hill Johal, Jas (BC Liberal).................................................Richmond-Queensborough Kahlon, Ravi (NDP)............................................................................... Delta North Kang, Hon.

Anne (NDP)......................................................... Burnaby–Deer Lake Kyllo, Greg (BC Liberal)..............................................................................Shuswap Larson, Linda (BC Liberal) .............................................. Boundary-Similkameen Lee, Michael (BC Liberal) ........................................................Vancouver-Langara Leonard, Ronna-Rae (NDP) ..................................................... Courtenay-Comox Letnick, Norm (BC Liberal).............................................

Kelowna–Lake Country Ma, Bowinn (NDP) .....................................................North Vancouver–Lonsdale Malcolmson, Sheila (NDP) ........................................................................Nanaimo Mark, Hon. Melanie (NDP) .......................................Vancouver–Mount Pleasant Martin, John (BC Liberal)....................................................................... Chilliwack Milobar, Peter (BC Liberal)..................................... Kamloops–North Thompson Morris, Mike (BC Liberal) ........................................... Prince George–Mackenzie Mungall, Hon.

Michelle (NDP)......................................................Nelson-Creston Oakes, Coralee (BC Liberal) ............................................................ Cariboo North Olsen, Adam (BC Green Party)............................ Saanich North and the Islands Paton, Ian (BC Liberal).......................................................................... Delta South Plecas, Hon. Darryl (Ind.) ........................................................... Abbotsford South Polak, Mary (BC Liberal) ............................................................................. Langley Popham, Hon.

Lana (NDP)............................................................... Saanich South Ralston, Hon. Bruce (NDP) ............................................................Surrey-Whalley Redies, Tracy (BC Liberal) .......................................................Surrey–White Rock Reid, Linda (BC Liberal) ................................................. Richmond South Centre Rice, Jennifer (NDP) ............................................................................. North Coast Robinson, Hon.

Selina (NDP) .........................................Coquitlam-Maillardville Ross, Ellis (BC Liberal)................................................................................... Skeena Routledge, Janet (NDP) ....................................................................Burnaby North Routley, Doug (NDP) ................................................. Nanaimo–North Cowichan Rustad, John (BC Liberal) ................................................................Nechako Lakes Shypitka, Tom (BC Liberal) ..............................................................

Kootenay East Simons, Nicholas (NDP) ......................................... Powell River–Sunshine Coast Simpson, Hon. Shane (NDP)..................................................Vancouver-Hastings Sims, Jinny (NDP) ........................................................................ Surrey-Panorama Singh, Rachna (NDP) .........................................................Surrey–Green Timbers Stewart, Ben (BC Liberal) ................................................................. Kelowna West Stilwell, Michelle (BC Liberal)...............................................

Parksville-Qualicum Stone, Todd (BC Liberal)..........................................Kamloops–South Thompson Sturdy, Jordan (BC Liberal)........................................ West Vancouver–Sea to Sky Sullivan, Sam (BC Liberal)................................................ Vancouver–False Creek Sultan, Ralph (BC Liberal) ...........................................West Vancouver–Capilano Tegart, Jackie (BC Liberal) ................................................................. Fraser-Nicola Thomson, Steve (BC Liberal)......................................................

Kelowna-Mission Thornthwaite, Jane (BC Liberal) ...............................North Vancouver–Seymour Throness, Laurie (BC Liberal) .......................................................Chilliwack-Kent Trevena, Hon. Claire (NDP) ................................................................North Island Wat, Teresa (BC Liberal) ................................................. Richmond North Centre Weaver, Dr.

Andrew (Ind.)................................................Oak Bay–Gordon Head Wilkinson, Andrew, QC (BC Liberal) ................................Vancouver-Quilchena Y ap, John (BC Liberal)............................................................Richmond-Steveston LIST OF MEMBERS BY RIDING Abbotsford-Mission............................................................................Simon Gibson Abbotsford South....................................................................... Hon. Darryl Plecas Abbotsford West......................................................................

Michael de Jong, QC Boundary-Similkameen...................................................................... Linda Larson Burnaby–Deer Lake....................................................................... Hon. Anne Kang Burnaby-Edmonds................................................................................Raj Chouhan Burnaby-Lougheed .................................................................... Hon. Katrina Chen Burnaby North .................................................................................

Janet Routledge Cariboo-Chilcotin .............................................................................Donna Barnett Cariboo North.................................................................................... Coralee Oakes Chilliwack ............................................................................................... John Martin Chilliwack-Kent ...............................................................................Laurie Throness Columbia River–Revelstoke .........................................................

Doug Clovechok Coquitlam–Burke Mountain.................................................................. Joan Isaacs Coquitlam-Maillardville ...................................................... Hon. Selina Robinson Courtenay-Comox................................................................... Ronna-Rae Leonard Cowichan Valley .............................................................................

Sonia Furstenau Delta North.............................................................................................Ravi Kahlon Delta South ..................................................................................................Ian Paton Esquimalt-Metchosin ..............................................................................Mitzi Dean Fraser-Nicola .........................................................................................

Jackie Tegart Kamloops–North Thompson .............................................................Peter Milobar Kamloops–South Thompson..................................................................Todd Stone Kelowna–Lake Country .....................................................................Norm Letnick Kelowna-Mission ..............................................................................

Steve Thomson Kelowna West ..........................................................................................Ben Stewart Kootenay East.......................................................................................Tom Shypitka Kootenay West........................................................................ Hon. Katrine Conroy Langford–Juan de Fuca .............................................................. Hon. John Horgan Langley .....................................................................................................

Mary Polak Langley East.........................................................................................Rich Coleman Maple Ridge–Mission.............................................................................. Bob D’Eith Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows............................................................Hon. Lisa Beare Mid Island–Pacific Rim................................................................ Hon. Scott Fraser Nanaimo......................................................................................

Sheila Malcolmson Nanaimo–North Cowichan............................................................... Doug Routley Nechako Lakes........................................................................................ John Rustad Nelson-Creston ................................................................... Hon. Michelle Mungall New Westminster........................................................................... Hon. Judy Darcy North Coast ...........................................................................................

Jennifer Rice North Island.............................................................................. Hon. Claire Trevena North Vancouver–Lonsdale................................................................... Bowinn Ma North Vancouver–Seymour........................................................Jane Thornthwaite Oak Bay–Gordon Head............................................................Dr.

Andrew Weaver Parksville-Qualicum.......................................................................Michelle Stilwell Peace River North ................................................................................... Dan Davies Peace River South ................................................................................ Mike Bernier Penticton ................................................................................................. Dan Ashton Port Coquitlam...................................................................... Hon.

Mike Farnworth Port Moody–Coquitlam.......................................................................Rick Glumac Powell River–Sunshine Coast....................................................... Nicholas Simons Prince George–Mackenzie....................................................................Mike Morris Prince George–Valemount ..................................................................

Shirley Bond Richmond North Centre..........................................................................Teresa Wat Richmond-Queensborough.........................................................................Jas Johal Richmond South Centre ......................................................................... Linda Reid Richmond-Steveston ...................................................................................

John Y ap Saanich North and the Islands .............................................................Adam Olsen Saanich South .............................................................................Hon. Lana Popham Shuswap...................................................................................................... Greg Kyllo Skeena........................................................................................................... Ellis Ross Stikine....................................................................................Hon.

Doug Donaldson Surrey-Cloverdale ................................................................................ Marvin Hunt Surrey-Fleetwood.....................................................................................Jagrup Brar Surrey–Green Timbers........................................................................Rachna Singh Surrey-Guildford......................................................................................Garry Begg Surrey-Newton ..............................................................................Hon.

Harry Bains Surrey-Panorama ...................................................................................... Jinny Sims Surrey South ................................................................................ Stephanie Cadieux Surrey-Whalley ......................................................................... Hon. Bruce Ralston Surrey–White Rock .............................................................................. Tracy Redies Vancouver-Fairview.............................................................. Hon.

George Heyman Vancouver–False Creek........................................................................ Sam Sullivan Vancouver-Fraserview...............................................................Hon. George Chow Vancouver-Hastings ............................................................... Hon. Shane Simpson Vancouver-Kensington....................................................................... Mable Elmore Vancouver-Kingsway..................................................................... Hon.

Adrian Dix Vancouver-Langara................................................................................ Michael Lee Vancouver–Mount Pleasant..................................................... Hon. Melanie Mark Vancouver–Point Grey ............................................................Hon.

David Eby, QC Vancouver-Quilchena........................................................Andrew Wilkinson, QC Vancouver–West End .....................................................Spencer Chandra Herbert Vernon-Monashee ....................................................................................Eric Foster Victoria–Beacon Hill.................................................................. Hon. Carole James Victoria–Swan Lake.................................................................... Hon. Rob Fleming West Vancouver–Capilano...................................................................

Ralph Sultan West Vancouver–Sea to Sky................................................................Jordan Sturdy Party Standings: BC Liberal 42; NDP 41; Independent 2; BC Green Party 2

CONTENTS Monday, March 23, 2020 Afternoon Sitting Page Routine Business Motions Without Notice....................................................................................................................................................... 11635 Members may speak and vote from seat other than assigned place Change to adjournment order Changes to routine business Hon. M. Farnworth Ministerial Statements .......................................................................................................................................................... 11635 Coronavirus outbreak and response Hon. J.

Horgan M. de Jong A. Olsen Oral Questions....................................................................................................................................................................... 11638 Government projections for coronavirus outbreak and response M. de Jong Hon. A. Dix Testing for coronavirus M. de Jong Hon. A. Dix Maintenance of supply chain during coronavirus outbreak J. Johal Hon. M. Farnworth Economic support for individuals and businesses during outbreak J. Johal Hon. J. Horgan Access to handwashing facilities for homeless persons S. Furstenau Hon. A.

Dix Domestic violence services during coronavirus outbreak S. Furstenau Hon. C. James Support to rural communities during coronavirus outbreak A. Olsen Hon. A. Dix Reports from Committees.................................................................................................................................................... 11642 Auditor General Appointment Committee, March 2020 M.

Dean M. de Jong Motions Without Notice....................................................................................................................................................... 11643 Appointment of Auditor General M.

Dean Orders of the Day Presentation of Estimates ..................................................................................................................................................... 11643 Supplementary estimates for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2021 Committee of Supply ............................................................................................................................................................ 11643 Supplementary Estimates: Other appropriations Hon. C. James J. Johal S. Furstenau A.

Olsen Supply Motions...................................................................................................................................................................... 11654 Reports of resolutions from Committee of Supply Funds granted for public service Hon. C. James

Introduction and First Reading of Bills.............................................................................................................................. 11654 Bill 15 — Supply Act (No. 2), 2020 Hon. C. James Second Reading of Bills ........................................................................................................................................................ 11655 Bill 15 — Supply Act (No. 2), 2020 Hon. C. James M. de Jong A. Olsen S. Furstenau Hon. C.

James Committee of the Whole House.......................................................................................................................................... 11659 Bill 15 — Supply Act (No. 2), 2020 Report and Third Reading of Bills....................................................................................................................................... 11659 Bill 15 — Supply Act (No. 2), 2020 Motions Without Notice....................................................................................................................................................... 11659 Withdrawal of Bill 12 Hon.

C. James Introduction and First Reading of Bills.............................................................................................................................. 11659 Bill 16 — Employment Standards Amendment Act (No. 2), 2020 Hon. M. Farnworth Second Reading of Bills ........................................................................................................................................................ 11660 Bill 16 — Employment Standards Amendment Act (No. 2), 2020 Hon. M. Farnworth M. de Jong S. Furstenau Hon. M.

Farnworth Committee of the Whole House.......................................................................................................................................... 11662 Bill 16 — Employment Standards Amendment Act (No. 2), 2020 S. Furstenau Hon. M.

Farnworth Report and Third Reading of Bills....................................................................................................................................... 11663 Bill 16 — Employment Standards Amendment Act (No. 2), 2020 Royal Assent to Bills.............................................................................................................................................................. 11663 Bill 16 — Employment Standards Amendment Act (No. 2), 2020 Bill 15 — Supply Act (No. 2), 2020

MONDAY , MARCH 23, 2020 The House met at 1:31 p.m. Clerk of the Legislative Assembly:Hon. Members, pursuant to Standing Order 12, the House is advised of the unavoidable absence of the Speaker and Deputy Speaker. Consequently, the Deputy Chair, Committee of the Whole, will take the chair. [S. Chandra Herbert in the chair.] Deputy Speaker:Thank you, hon. Members. I just want to, first off, acknowledge we’re on the official territories of theLək̓ ʷəŋin̓ əŋ-speaking people and thank them for hav- ing us here on their territories.

I would also like to acknowledge and thank all members and the staff of this place for making today’s sitting pos- sible during this extraordinary time. I honour and thank everyone in British Columbia for doing their part. Routine Business Prayers and reflections: S. Malcolmson. Motions Without Notice MEMBERS MAY SPEAK AND VOTE FROM SEAT OTHER THAN ASSIGNED PLACE Hon. M.

Farnworth:Before I move the motion, I just want to acknowledge that today’s proceedings are unique, probably unique in the history of this chamber and this province, and they reflect the seriousness of the circum- stances in which we find ourselves not just here in the province but across the country. It’s taking place with the agreement and the cooperation of all caucuses represented here in this place. By leave, I move: [That, notwithstanding Standing Order 36 and Standing Order 37, Members be permitted to speak and vote from a seat other than their assigned place for today’s sitting.] Leave granted.

Motion approved. CHANGE TO ADJOURNMENT ORDER Hon. M. Farnworth:By leave, I move: [That the order of adjournment of the House of March 5, 2020 be rescinded, and that the House be deemed to have been adjourned until 1:30 p.m. on Monday, March 23, 2020.] Leave granted. Motion approved. [1:35 p.m.] CHANGES TO ROUTINE BUSINESS Hon. M. Farnworth:We will now proceed to a min- isterial statement led by the hon. Premier, and following that, by agreement amongst all the House Leaders, we will have an abbreviated question period.

With that, by leave, I move that notwithstanding Stand- ing Order 25, the daily routine of business for today’s sit- ting be comprised of oral question period and presenting of reports by committees only and that notwithstanding Standing Order — God, that’s a tongue twister — and Standing Order 47A, the proceeding of Oral Question Period be limited to one question with one supplemental question from each opposition caucus member. [That, notwithstanding Standing Order 25, the daily routine of business for today’s sitting be comprised of Oral Question Period and Presenting Reports by Committees only, and That, notwithstanding Standing Order 25 and Standing Order 47A, the proceeding of Oral Question Period be limited to one question with one supplemental question from each opposition caucus.] Leave granted.

Motion approved. Ministerial Statements CORONAVIRUS OUTBREAK AND RESPONSE Hon. J. Horgan:I thank my colleagues for joining us here in what could only be described as an extraordinary sitting of the B.C. Legislature. I want to, at the outset, offer my deepest condolences to the families of 13 British Columbians who have passed away since the arrival of COVID-19, the first case being identified just 41 days ago here in British Columbia.

When we think of what our lives were like six weeks ago, it’s hard to imagine how far we have come as a society, how far we have come as a community, as we’ve tried to grapple with a pandemic that is gripping not just British Colum- bia, not just Canada, not just North America but indeed the world.

It’s humbling to think that the 12 of us here today, rep- resenting different political perspectives from around Brit- ish Columbia, have arrived to do something that I can’t recall, in my time as a member of this place, coming on 15 years — nor as a student of history, going back over the many, many decades, a century and a half of Canada’s existence — where British Columbians have had their elec- ted representatives meet on such a dark and troubling occasion to talk about how we come out of that darkness better off for the effort — better off because of the cooper- ation; better off because of the spirit that I believe is in all of us as British Columbians and Canadians, focused on 11635

helping each other, being kind and being mindful that our actions are important. I’ve heard over the past six weeks, as we’ve seen health care workers do over 21,000 tests for COVID-19, as the virus has swept around the world…. British Columbi- ans started early, and I give full credit to the provincial health office, led by Dr. Bonnie Henry, and my colleague from Vancouver-Kingsway, the Minister of Health, for putting us on the right footing as we take on this signi- ficant challenge. This challenge is one in which we are armed with a few tools. All of us are armed with these tools. Dr.

Henry has been reminding us daily, for now many weeks: those tools are simple. Wash your hands frequently, create physical distance between your colleagues here in the Legislature; create physical distance between yourself and fellow cit- izens; and if you are ill, self-isolate; if you’ve come from somewhere else in the past number of days, self-isolate for 14 days. These tools are available to all of us, and these tools must be used by all of us if we’re going to flatten the curve to ensure that we are not inundated in our acute care system by those who are afflicted by this disease, this virus.

As British Columbians and as legislators, we know that this is an extraordinary time. I want to thank the Leader of the Opposition, the Opposition House Leader, members of the Green Party, members of the Liberal Party, who have been overwhelmingly supportive of initiatives that we’ve brought forward, briefings that are unusual in any normal legislative session.

To have members from both sides of the House talking and working on solutions, taking advant- age of the experience in the opposition benches — many, many cabinet ministers who understand the administrat- ive challenges of running a department in normal circum- stances, fully understanding how running those depart- ments in extraordinary circumstance requires criticism, to be sure, if we misstep, but criticism that’s focused on better outcomes always. The absence of partisanship I think all British Columbi- ans should celebrate. At this unique time, partisanship has left the building.

People are here to work together with one singular focus. That’s the health and well-being of all Brit- ish Columbians. [1:40 p.m.] I want to say, as we begin a debate about supply for $5 billion…. The Minister of Finance will be laying that out. Briefings have been provided to all opposition members. I think the debate will be quick, but the debate will take place. I think it’s also important to remind British Columbians that this is not something that’s being pushed through without consultation.

It’s not something that is not based and grounded on the science that we’ve been provided by public health officials working in concert — working with the private sector, working with not-for-profits, working with our extraordinary public officials here in British Col- umbia and, indeed, across the country. I don’t know…. There’s a former Finance Minister here today.

I don’t believe that at any time has the Minister of Finance in British Columbia given a briefing to the Min- ister of Finance in Alberta about where we’re going, in the interest and hope that coming together will get a better outcome for both jurisdictions. These are signals and symbols to the community, signals and symbols to British Columbians that we are indeed all in this together — British Columbians, Albertans, Mari- timers, Quebecers.

All of us are in this together as Cana- dians fighting the good fight, focused on making sure that those that are so critical to our success, health care work- ers, have the supports that they need. That means we have to make sure that the truckers and the people working at the ports and the people stocking the shelves in our grocery stores…. They are all so crit- ically important to the success of our health care system, critically important to the well-being of all British Colum- bians. Utility workers, child care workers caring for the children of health care providers — that’s what we need to focus on.

That’s what we are focusing on. I’m absolutely proud of the members of this Legislature who have come with one voice today to debate and discuss a package that will provide relief to citizens, provide relief to businesses — and, also, legislation that will protect workers. We’ve done that in an extraordinary way, in extraordinary circumstances. With that, I cede the floor to the members on the other side.

Again, it’s with eternal thanks and gratitude to all British Columbians that as we create the systems that will take us forward, you give us your patience, you give us our well-being, and together we’ll come through this stronger than when we went into it. M. de Jong: I, too, would like to join with the Premier on behalf of my colleagues in the opposition and extend condolences to the families of those who have already suc- cumbed to this virus, this COVID-19. It is a difficult time for those families and others who have been afflicted.

The Premier correctly pointed out that it’s an unpreced- ented time, and like many public buildings in British Col- umbia, the halls and corridors that connect the various parts of this Legislature building are darkened and quiet.

I was thinking of that quaint tradition we have here where government and opposition are seated two sword- lengths apart, because on this day, when all of our citizens are being asked to abide by similar social distancing, it is important that British Columbians know that the institu- tion of parliament is functioning cooperatively and collab- oratively to ensure that everything possible is being done to protect the health and safety of our citizens. To that end, a brief word about the members who can- not be here but would like to be here.

They, like many Brit- ish Columbians, want to be at their posts, but they recog- nize the need to abide by the advice and directives of our public health officials. MLAs on all sides of this House are 11636 British Columbia Debates Monday, March 23, 2020

continuing to discharge their duties and responsibilities to constituents to the best of their abilities and in the safest way possible through these difficult days. If I might also offer a word of thanks from the opposi- tion, from the Leader of the Opposition to the government for the efforts that have been made to maintain effect- ive communications and information exchanges.

I believe and hope the regular exchanges between the Minister of Health and the member for Kelowna–Lake Country, on behalf of the official opposition, have been mutually bene- ficial in a variety of ways, and I know this will continue. [1:45 p.m.] Of course, a larger word of thanks to the thousands of front-line health care workers and care providers who are doing everything humanly possible to keep people safe. Notwithstanding the concerns they would naturally feel for the safety of their own families, they are at their posts each day, demonstrating their sense of duty and profes- sionalism. We thank them all.

These are, to be sure, worrisome and uncertain times. I see the lines of worry, concern and fatigue etched on the faces of Premiers and ministers and public health officers. The worry on their faces mirrors the worry on the faces of parents, who are concerned about who will look after the kids or the interruption to their education, or are con- cerned about grandparents, who are amongst the most vulnerable, the elderly. The worry and the concern on the faces of employees who wonder what will happen when that paycheque doesn’t arrive and the rent or the mortgage payment is looming.

Employers who have seen business and orders dry up overnight, who are obliged to lay off staff for lack of work and are not sure if the business will be around to welcome them back when we eventually emerge out the other side of this. Tourism operators who are suffering the effects of a world where travel has come to a standstill. Food banks and other social agencies whose desperate attempts to support our most vulnerable citizens are now so severely compromised.

In the difficult days ahead, no single segment of our society can be asked to bear a disproportionate share of the burden, although some, like our health care workers, have already done so. In the economic dislocation that will follow in the wake of this health crisis, employee and employer will require support, because an employee without an employer is as helpless and vulnerable as an employer without an employee. From time to time in this place, we communicate the exploits of previous generations who overcame adversity.

This year we’ll honour the sacrifices made 75 years ago by those who purged the world of an evil virus called Nazism. Today we are facing a different threat — an invisible, silent invasion that randomly seeks its victims and at- tempts to enlist each one of us as an unwitting collaborator in its infectious spread. Today I believe we can honour the legacy of our parents, grandparents and great-grandpar- ents by demonstrating that we, too, possess the strength, the fortitude and the discipline to successfully guide our society through the challenge. As someone once said, let us each brace ourselves to our duty.

Armed with the advice and the guidance of Dr. Henry and our public health experts, let us all commit to the social behaviour that will minimize the risks of trans- mission to the greatest extent possible. While we’re wash- ing our hands, social distancing and isolating voluntar- ily, let us take comfort in the knowledge that all over the world the brightest scientific minds are developing addi- tional tools to combat this menace we know as COVID-19. Let us be kind. Let us be understanding of the anxieties many are experiencing.

Let us use the myriad technologies now available to us to reach out to those for whom uncer- tainty and loneliness can overwhelm. Let us forthrightly acknowledge the magnitude of the impact this will have on the economic life of our province and our nation and accept that it will take a herculean effort on all our parts to overcome that dislocation. Finally, on a day when phrases like hand in hand and arm in arm seem strangely inappropriate, let us remember this. We are so much stronger and so much better when we are working together. A.

Olsen:I’ d like to thank the Premier and the member for Abbotsford West for their words today. On behalf of the B.C. Green caucus, I share our condo- lences to the families who have lost a loved one to COV- ID-19. [1:50 p.m.] This is an unparalleled time in our local, provincial, national and global communities. The depth of the dis- ruption is unprecedented. As each and every day passes, British Columbians are reaching out, expressing their concerns and fears and sharing how this crisis is impact- ing them. Thank you to the health officials — Dr.

Bonnie Henry, Minister Adrian Dix and their staff — for their exemplary work making difficult decisions under extraordinary cir- cumstances. Thank you to all the health care workers dedicated to caring for those who are sick. Thank you all the front-line service workers who con- tinue to deliver services to British Columbians who are needing to survive ongoing isolation. Thank you to British Columbians who have found cre- ative ways to support their neighbours and connect with each other to help each other through this really difficult time.

We are still in a public health emergency, and we’re committed to working collaboratively with our colleagues, all the members of this House, to ensure British Columbi- ans get the support they need as soon as possible. Monday, March 23, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11637

As we get through this crisis, the B.C. Green caucus looks to continue with a collaborative approach to the medium- and long-term recovery of individuals and our business community to ensure that British Columbia comes out of this stronger, more resilient and more sus- tainable. To all British Columbians, your health and well-being are a top priority for us. Please continue to follow the advice of our health professionals: wash your hands, self- isolate, and maintain safe physical distance. Much love to you all. HÍSW̱ ḴE SIÁM.

Oral Questions GOVERNMENT PROJECTIONS FOR CORONAVIRUS OUTBREAK AND RESPONSE M. de Jong:Well, it will be a question period unlike any other, I expect. I wasn’t certain the Health Minister was going to be in attendance. I am pleased that he is. My ques- tion may be better offered to the Health Minister. In contemplating the nature of the questions to put to the government today, I thought: “What are the questions that most people are asking?” This is the forum that the government can perhaps offer additional insight and enlightenment. I thought of two, and the first one is this.

Whether it’s the Premier or the Health Minister, what is the tra- jectory? Where are we going to be a week from now, a month from now? I ask that recognizing that those are questions that experts the world over have grappled with. But to the extent that the minister, the Premier and members of the government are receiving up-to-the-minute advice from experts, I’m sure British Columbians are interested in any insight that can be offered about the trajectory we’re on and the circumstances that we will be confronted by a week and a month from now. Hon. A.

Dix:First of all, I wanted to express my appre- ciation to the member from Cowichan and the member for Kelowna–Lake Country. They’re not only colleagues in the Legislature; they’re important advisers of our joint effort to address this situation. I want to express that appreciation here. I think sometimes it’s important to hear what we say, and sometimes it’s important to hear what we do. In the last two weeks, we’ve created 3,632 empty acute care hos- pital beds in British Columbia. Generally speaking, this time of year, in flu season, we run at well over 100 percent capacity.

Y ou can understand from that that we are pre- paring for a much more serious situation in our acute care sector and in the health of British Columbians. That makes it very clear. We are actively modelling on these questions of what people can expect. In fact, those models guide these sorts of decisions — some of the most difficult that I’ve ever been involved in and would ever be involved in, and that’s true of everyone else in the health care system. But that tells you what we’re facing in front of us, I think.

We’re going to be sharing those models, because we have taken the view — it’s the reason there are briefings every single day — that people need to know what we know. In the next week, some of those models, the models that are guiding our approach to this issue, will be shared and briefed with the members of the opposition parties, with members on the government side of course, through- out the public health care system and with British Colum- bians so that they’ll have specific information. [1:55 p.m.] But I’ll say this.

I don’t have any expectation of any relief from the extraordinary measures that the provincial health officer has imposed on British Columbians and the measures that we have to 100 percent comply with now to, as people say, bend the curve. But to ensure that our resources are sufficient to manage the situation in British Columbia, I don’t see any prospect before the end of April of those orders changing. TESTING FOR CORONAVIRUS M. de Jong:Thank you to the minister.

The second area, and I’m sure members and ministers are confronted by the same inquiry, relates to the desire that people have not to inadvertently contribute to the problem. I’m not sure everyone knows how to apply the term — I didn’t, in this context — “asymptomatic transmission. ” This relates to the interest people have in knowing whether they have the vir- us and the degree to which testing…. The World Health Organization has offered commentary of late about the importance of testing as a fundamental part of the strategy for combating COVID-19.

Does the minister foresee a significant increase in the level of testing taking place in B.C.? Is that necessary, in the mind of the minister and the government? And if he does see an increase, is he able to offer British Columbians any additional details on what that will look like? Hon. A. Dix: British Columbians and the govern- ment…. The provincial health officer has believed in test- ing, in some ways, before other jurisdictions did. Part of the challenge in British Columbia is we’re facing the con- sequences of a failure to do that in other jurisdictions, it should be said. That’s part of the reality of it.

It doesn’t change the reality of where it came from or how it came here or what the consequences are or what the causes are, but that’s significant. On February 27 — I’m rough on the date here — we had tested, I think, a little over 1,000 people. We’ d done more tests than that, over 1,000 people. The following week that 11638 British Columbia Debates Monday, March 23, 2020

more than doubled. The following week, which was ten days ago now, we had done 6,200 tests. As of this Friday, we have done approximately 18,000, just under 18,000 tests. And we’re doing right now, in the last two days over the weekend, approximately 3,500 tests a day. So doubled and then doubled and then tripled and then more than doubled again, so we are expanding testing. The focus of our testing, for the sake of everyone, has to be in priority areas to limit the spread of the disease. If people are sick at home, sometimes…. I know they want to know. I understand it.

I hear from them every day, just as the hon. member has. But if people are sick at home, it is so important to self-isolate. I come back to this. It is so important to self-isolate. We are expanding testing dramatically week unto week to ensure that the right measures are taken to stop the spread of the disease. By necessity, that involves a focus on health care workers, because in other jurisdictions, that’s been a major source of spread.

We have to, to the maxim- um extent possible, not just keep health care workers safe but, as we’ve seen at the Lynn Valley care home and other places, to keep residents in long-term care safe — the most vulnerable people in society. We have to focus. We’ve done some what’s called sur- veillance testing to look at particular areas of the province which might be particularly vulnerable. We’ve systemic- ally, for example, tested for people who get tested for the flu. That gives us a surveillance testing of a group of people that wasn’t associated by way of travel or other circum- stances with getting COVID-19.

So we’re expanding our testing, but all of it is going to be based on science.

As we plan, we have to target the testing we do all the time to ensure that we give the maximum protection to the entire B.C. population and we limit the growth of COV- ID-19 and cases of COVID-19 in British Columbia. [2:00 p.m.] What you’re going to see — and I just want one step back — is a reflection of work that’s happened in British Columbia over decades — the development of BCCDC, which is the envy of the country, people who developed a test for this prior to there being any cases in Canada and started testing so that we could isolate and break chains as much as possible in the months leading up to this peri- od.

They have been increasing our capacity to do tests in combination with health authorities around the province. And LifeLabs is now doing some of the testing processes to increase our capacity. What I can say to British Columbians is that we’re going to be doing, of course, more and more testing, and we’re going to focus it where it’s needed most, based on the sci- ence, so that all British Columbians can be protected to the maximum possible degree. MAINTENANCE OF SUPPLY CHAIN DURING CORONAVIRUS OUTBREAK J. Johal:The COVID-19 outbreak has shown British Columbians acting with great kindness.

We’ve seen some of the best come out of British Columbia but occasionally some of the worst. Now, as parents we stay at home to take care of the kids, but of course, when you do so, you also need essentials. Most British Columbians have acted responsibly, purchas- ing enough goods for a short period of time, knowing that supplies will be there when needed. Some folks have taken to hoarding — not many — and in some cases even selling the products that they’re purchasing on line. My question is to the Minister of Public Safety.

While most people are acting appropriately and retailers are working ferociously to maintain stock, will the province look at putting in place an order to support the smooth operation of the supply chain? Hon. M. Farnworth:I thank the member for this very important question. I can assure the member that this is a top priority for us as government. In fact, I had a call this morning with my provincial colleagues from across the country and the federal minister, Minister Blair, deal- ing with key issues that each province is facing and how we can work to deal with this particular issue.

This was raised across all provinces. One of the things we want to see the federal government do is to work, because they have the ability to do that, in terms of securing supply chains. Second is what we’re doing here in British Columbia. I had a conference call this morning with my colleague the Minister of Municipal Affairs, with mayors from right across British Columbia outlining what they can expect this week.

There will be a series of ministerial orders coming down under the emer- gency declaration that is in place dealing with many of these issues — in particular, securing supply chains for much-needed goods in the province of British Columbia. I can also tell the member that we have had very good cooperation from the Retail Council in British Columbia. It is something that is very much of which we’re seized on.

Deputy Speaker:Before we proceed with the next ques- tion, I just wanted to ask the leave of the House to have two questions on the opposition side as opposed to one, which was in the motion that we passed earlier today. If that’s okay with the House, we’ll move on. So slight order change, but acknowledging the member for Richmond-Queensborough. ECONOMIC SUPPORT FOR INDIVIDUALS AND BUSINESSES DURING OUTBREAK J. Johal:Thank you. Y ou know I’m always enthusiastic in regard to my questions. Monday, March 23, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11639

I thank the minister for his response. Adding to that anxiety regarding the supply chain, of course, is the economic uncertainty. The Premier has alluded to some of that as well, as has the Finance Minister. Tens of thousands of people are facing potential layoffs. Small business owners are just really worried about meet- ing payroll, never mind keeping employees on staff. To the Premier, what steps should British Columbians be taking to ensure that evictions and bankruptcies don’t spiral out of control? Hon. J. Horgan:I thank the member for his question.

We have been working cooperatively with the federal government. The member will know that there was a signi- ficant federal stimulus package tabled last week — $82 bil- lion, in different components. We awaited the delivery of that package before the Minister of Finance and the cabin- et looked at how British Columbia could fill potential gaps in the programs that are being put forward by the federal government.

Some members on the other side will know that in the normal course of events, British Columbia’s government doesn’t have an ability to flow dollars to those who are not already in the system in one way or another. People with disabilities, people on income assistance and so on — seni- ors — are getting upgrades or dollars from the treasury. We had to create a new system to deliver to those gaps that we’ve identified in the federal program, and that has taken some time.

But as the Minister of Finance and I out- lined today, we put forward a $5 billion action plan, and we’ll be debating the substance of that later here in this chamber. [2:05 p.m.] But the message is quite clear, and I thank the member for focusing in on this. Workers are concerned that they may not see a paycheque for some period of time. Busi- nesses are concerned with cash flow, liquidity. When we talk to small business operators, when we talk to the cham- ber of commerce, the boards of trade, even the big indus- tries represented by the B.C. Business Council, cash flow seems to be the order of the day.

So we put in place a package to ensure that those busi- nesses, large and small, could have some relief on paying those fixed costs they had anticipated coming forward before COVID-19 became a reality for us here in British Columbia. We’ve put in place incremental steps to make sure we’re filling those gaps. It’s a first step; it’s not a last step. We’ll have to see. The member for Abbotsford West asked the Minister of Health: how long are we going to be here? We don’t know that. What we do know is that people need some help right now, and we’re going to deliver that help as quickly as we possibly can.

ACCESS TO HANDW ASHING FACILITIES FOR HOMELESS PERSONS S. Furstenau:I wanted to just start by acknowledging and appreciating government for making this time avail- able for these questions. The questions from the official opposition members have been, for me, very valuable, very informative, and I very much appreciate the responses that we are getting from government on these questions that are coming to us from our citizens and our constituents. I want to start with handwashing.

We’ve heard the mes- sage very loudly, very clearly that the most important thing we can do in this health crisis is to wash our hands regu- larly. I am worried. In a call with the service providers in the Cowichan Valley who are supporting homeless people, access to handwashing for people who are homeless is lim- ited, to say the least. My question is perhaps to the Health Minister or the Public Safety Minister.

What can be done to support increased access to handwashing or -sanitizing stations for British Columbians who currently do not have a home, and would it be possible to set up multiple handwashing stations or outdoor hand-sanitizing dispensers? Hon. A. Dix: Thank you to the member for Cowichan Valley for her question. This is a challenging time for everyone. I think we’ve given to the province and the media more than 30 or 40 briefings over the last month. At every one of those briefings, we cite the importance of handwashing.

Other than — let me repeat it again — staying home if you’re sick, staying home if you’re sick, some of these chal- lenges are equally challenging for people who are home- less, in terms of their ability to do that. These are the cent- ral messages that have been here from the beginning: wash your hands; stay home if you’re sick. Wash your hands; stay home if you’re sick. It’s challenging for everyone. Obvi- ously, the additional risks to people who are homeless, who may not have access — don’t have access — is an important one.

On Saturday, there was an update from my colleagues the Minister of Social Development and the Minister of Housing. That was an update on the work to support vul- nerable British Columbians. They included new isolation protocols for vulnerable people; sites available for social isolation in, so far, 16 communities; new centralized pro- curement for cleaning supplies and personal protective equipment for housing and shelter providers, to protect residents and staff. Handwashing is and will continue to be a significant challenge.

In Vancouver, for example, 11 new handwash- ing stations were set up last Tuesday throughout the Downtown Eastside, to help protect people in that com- munity. Outreach workers across B.C. are also working to share information and resources with those that they serve. We 11640 British Columbia Debates Monday, March 23, 2020

are passing out new materials with information on hand- washing for people experiencing homelessness, including how to set up a makeshift handwashing station. For those in shelters, B.C. Housing is sharing new handwashing pro- tocols with providers, including handwashing when guests arrive, before they leave, and before and after eating. The province is also supporting enhanced daily cleaning in a number of SROs and shelters. This is only a start.

The funding that was announced today by the Premier and the Minister of Finance will con- tinue to support these kinds of critical needs in the com- munities, and our Vulnerable Population Working Group is working urgently with communities to identify those needs. I just want to say this in conclusion. We know that vulnerable people are more vulnerable from COVID-19. We’ve seen this in long-term care, and we know its signi- ficance. We’ve seen it in our own province, and we’ve seen it elsewhere in the world. We’ve seen it for seniors; we’ve seen it for people who deal with chronic diseases.

We’ve seen it for people who don’t have homes and are homeless and need our supports. [2:10 p.m.] These are central areas of the government’s response — and they have to be central areas — to ensure that the people who are most vulnerable to getting the most sick receive the most effort that we can give to support them. In this area, as in others, specific actions are being taken that I know will be supported by the hon. members and mem- bers of the House. DOMESTIC VIOLENCE SERVICES DURING CORONAVIRUS OUTBREAK S.

Furstenau:I want to thank the minister for his response and thank him for his ongoing and very pro- active communication with our caucus. I have been so deeply appreciative of the information that he’s provided and being able to put questions to him that have come to me when he connects with us. I, again, just really want to commend and thank the minister and the government for their work over this time. There is another vulnerable population that will be deeply impacted by the situation that we’re all in.

As we ask people to stay home and social distance and quarantine, this does actually create conditions for increased domestic violence. Isolation due to fear of contracting or spreading the virus has distanced victims of abuse from their sup- port networks, and the stress on our health care system has made it even less likely for those victims to seek out and receive treatment for their injuries. Current provincial services for victims of violence, like VictimLink B.C. or Kids Help Phone, are largely offered over the phone.

However, when their abuser is also at home during quarantine, many victims will not feel safe to reach out for help this way. Other jurisdictions are addressing this concern by exploring options to expand digital media services. My question is to the Premier. During this state of emer- gency, how can we better support victims of violence who are isolated with their abusers at home? Hon. C. James: Thank you to the member for the question. We were talking about vulnerability in the pre- vious question with the Health Minister, and this is vul- nerability as well.

It’s another group that certainly is facing vulnerability. We all know that violence is never acceptable and that safety is a top priority. But we also know, as the member has pointed out so well, that those who are living with violence may not have a safe option. I had a discussion last week with a service provider — and it stuck with me — who said: “What do you do when home isn’t a safe place, when you’re in this position and when you’re looking at self-isolation?” We are working with B.C.

Housing to look at alternative plans, whether it’s hotels or other options, for people who are fleeing violence or need to self-isolate and are in a situ- ation where they can’t be at home. We will work with the service providers in communities, because again, often it’s the front line that provides that support. The member will know, as part of the package today, that we confirmed that not-for-profits that contract with government will continue to get those services, even if they’re having to change their distribution of those ser- vices and how they provide them. That’s going to be in place as well.

The federal government has allocated new funding to support sexual assault centres and women’s shelters. We’re talking with the federal government to look at how we can ensure that some of that funding is allocated to our province and can go directly to these kinds of supports. Then just the last piece I’ d mention is the $1.7 billion that we put aside for critical services. That’s another piece — when we work with B.C. Housing, when we work with the vulnerable populations’ groups — that we will be look- ing to how we allocate that to ensure that the safety is there for people when home isn’t a safe place.

Deputy Speaker:The member for Saanich North and the Islands. I beg leave of the House for one final supplemental question. If that’s okay with members of this House, we’ll proceed. I saw general agreement. I would like to ask the member to proceed. SUPPORT TO RURAL COMMUNITIES DURING CORONAVIRUS OUTBREAK A. Olsen:Thank you to the members of the government for answering these questions. Monday, March 23, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11641

One question that I’ve been receiving…. It’s kind of weird to be standing representing the most isolated com- munities, I think, on the opposition side. I know there are other communities. Rural and isolated communities have been sending me — primarily, the Gulf Island com- munities…. I think lots of rural and isolated, remote com- munities in this province — their members are concerned about the impact that COVID-19 could have if the out- break went through those communities, just due to the lack of health services in the communities.

I’ve received a number of emails from people asking to shut down the Gulf Islands or to shut down access for people who are not residents, to stop the flow of people coming in and out of the communities. [2:15 p.m.] I just wanted the opportunity to ask the Minister of Health: has the ministry considered restricting access to isolated, rural and at-risk communities in a way that will allow them to continue to receive goods that sustain them- selves but also that may stop the spread into those com- munities, and if an outbreak does happen in a small com- munity in British Columbia, do we have the adequate infrastructure in place to address that?

Hon. A. Dix: Thank you to the member for the ques- tion. I think the first thing to say is that every health authority — from the Northern Health Authority, which represents many isolated communities, to the Vancouver Coastal Health Authority — has an emergency operations centre. Certainly, in the north and in the Interior and on Vancouver Island and others, these issues of isolated com- munities are fundamental to the work that we’re prepar- ing and doing.

It’s also true that the First Nations Health Authority has its own emergency operations centre and is doing a lot of work now with First Nations communities around British Columbia to prepare. A number of things are important. One, as the member suggests, is we have to ensure and reinforce, if necessary, that if there is a case of outbreak in a community, we can get staff and supports to that community, to have rapid response in all health authorities to such a situation should it develop. That’s very important.

I think, secondly, that we have community plans in those communities and we work with community leaders to develop those plans is very important. It is essential and fundamental to what we are trying to do. Obviously, health care workers in those areas, in remote communities are stepping up every day to be part of those efforts. To date, and this has been our expectation up to now, the greatest majority of the cases are in the Vancouver Coastal and Fraser Health authorities and large metropol- itan areas.

But like other areas we’ve talked of and com- munities of people we’ve talked of today, isolated com- munities can be very vulnerable, and we are working and making sure, through both the First Nations health authorities and the other health authorities, that they’re supported in this period. I think it brings us to the fundamental question that everyone in British Columbia has to recognize right now. No matter where you live — whether it’s in Alert Bay or it’s in Abbotsford, whether it’s in Vanderhoof or Vancouver — you can catch COVID-19 wherever you are, no matter what your age.

If you’re a teenager or you’re 60, you can pass on COVID-19. Let’s not make any mistake about it. We’re all involved in this fight. In every community, we’ve got to wash our hands. In every community, we’ve got to stay home if we’re sick — 100 percent. It’s 100 percent. When the provincial health officer makes an order or makes a proposal, it’s 100 percent right now. That’s where we have to be. Dr. Henry has asked us to do some extraordinary things — things that nobody in this Legislature would have imagined doing maybe a few weeks ago — in the last number of weeks.

And we need 100 percent com- pliance in every community, 100 percent of people 100 percent of the time, in this fight against COVID-19. The government, all of us here, but also every person in B.C. has to be 100 percent all in. [End of question period.] Reports from Committees AUDITOR GENERAL APPOINTMENT COMMITTEE M. Dean: On behalf of the Special Committee to Appoint an Auditor General, I’ve been designated by com- mittee members to present the report of that committee.

As such, I ask leave of the House to present the report of the Special Committee to Appoint an Auditor General and to move that the report be taken as read and received. Leave granted. M. Dean: I move that the report be taken as read and received. Motion approved. M. Dean:I ask leave of the House to move a motion to adopt the report. Leave granted. M. Dean: I move that the report be adopted, and in doing so, I would like to make some brief comments.

On behalf of the House, I extend sincere gratitude to the Chair of the committee, the member for Nanaimo–North Cowichan, and the Deputy Chair, the member for Rich- mond-Steveston, as well as to the member for Prince 11642 British Columbia Debates Monday, March 23, 2020

George–Valemount, the member for Burnaby North and the member for Oak Bay–Gordon Head for their collab- orative approach and diligent work on this important appointment process. On behalf of the Chair, I’ d like to thank all members and the vice-Chair for what was an exceptionally collegial effort. [2:20 p.m.] I would also like to extend committee members’ strong appreciation to Kate Ryan-Lloyd and her Clerk’s office staff for their thorough and excellent support to the committee.

This report constitutes the committee’s unanimous recommendation for the appointment of Michael Pickup as British Columbia’s next Auditor General. Mr. Pickup has been the Auditor General of Nova Scotia since 2014, after holding increasingly senior positions in the Office of the Auditor General of Canada from 1990 to 2014. Com- mittee members were impressed with his demonstrated ability to lead and motivate staff, his commitment to sup- porting and advancing reconciliation with Indigenous communities and his knowledge of Canadian and interna- tional auditing and accounting standards.

The committee also appreciated his understanding of the role of auditor general in the context of our parlia- mentary system, democracy and the need to contribute towards sustained public trust in democratic institutions. Members of the committee are confident that Mr. Pickup has the knowledge, skills and professional qualifications required to take on the important work of Auditor General of British Columbia. Members of the committee also thank Carol Bellringer for her leadership and dedication as Auditor General from 2014 to 2019 and wish her well in her future endeavours.

As well, on behalf of the committee, I want to acknow- ledge Russ Jones, who has served in the role of acting Aud- itor General since January 1 of this year. Mr. Jones took over the position during a time of transition for the office and has carried out his duties with professionalism and dedication. As Mr. Pickup will not begin his term until the end of July, all members of the Legislative Assembly express our sincere appreciation to him for his ongoing leadership in support of a smooth transition period. M. de Jong: I’ll keep this brief.

I, like the member for Esquimalt-Metchosin, was not a member of the com- mittee but am pleased to convey, on behalf of those that were from the official opposition, the member for Richmond-Steveston as Vice-Chair and the member for Prince George–Valemount, the wholehearted support of those members and the official opposition for the appointment that is being recommended in the report before the House. Mr.

Pickup comes to us with a myriad of experiences, most recently as the Auditor General in the Maritimes, in Nova Scotia, and prior to that as the Auditor General in the Auditor General’s office in Ottawa with the federal government. Like the previous speaker, the member for Esquimalt- Metchosin, I’ d like to commend and thank Carol Bell- ringer for her efforts and her work in the role of Auditor General, and Russ Jones, who has stepped up over the course of his career on several occasions to fill in during what the member correctly termed periods of transition. He has done so again with his usual professionalism.

The opposition is pleased to offer our support to the recommendation that has come before the House. Deputy Speaker:The question is the adoption of the report. Motion approved. M. Dean:I ask leave of the House to move a motion to appoint Michael Pickup as Auditor General of British Col- umbia. Leave granted. Motions Without Notice APPOINTMENT OF AUDITOR GENERAL M. Dean:I move: [That pursuant to theAuditor General Act (S.B.C. 2003, c. 2), Mi- chael A. Pickup be appointed as Auditor General of British Colum- bia, for one eight-year term commencing on July 27, 2020.] Motion approved.

Orders of the Day Presentation of Estimates SUPPLEMENTARY ESTIMATES FOR THE FISCAL YEAR ENDING MARCH 31, 2021 Hon. C. James presented a message from Her Honour the Lieutenant-Governor: supplementary estimates for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2021. Hon. C. James moved that the said message and the estimates accompanying the same be referred to the Committee of Supply. Motion approved. [2:25 p.m.] Hon. M. Farnworth:I call Committee of Supply to con- sider the supplementary estimates. Monday, March 23, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11643

Committee of Supply SUPPLEMENTARY ESTIMATES: OTHER APPROPRIATIONS The House in Committee of Supply (Section B); M. Dean in the chair. The committee met at 2:27 p.m. The Chair:Members, we will take a five-minute recess just to organize the committee. The committee recessed from 2:27 p.m. to 2.32 p.m. [M. Dean in the chair.] On Vote 52: contingencies (all ministries), pandemic response and economic recovery, $5,000,000,000. The Chair:Minister, do you have an opening state- ment? Hon. C. James:I do. Thank you very much, Chair.

I want to begin by recognizing that we’re on the tra- ditional territory of the Songhees and Esquimalt Nations and thank them for the ability to meet on their land. I think there is no question — you can certainly see it here in the Legislature today, but I know communities are feeling it all across the province — that these are unpreced- ented and difficult times. Communities across the prov- ince are pulling together to keep one another safe. I think we’ve all seen, in the midst of the challenges, incredibly heart-warming experiences, certainly in my community.

We all received from our Block Watch captain a week and a half ago a list of people who are available for volunteering — to be able to go and pick up groceries for people or prescriptions or help them out if they were self- isolating. I think it has really been quite extraordinary to see — no surprise in British Columbia — the communities pulling together. We know that if we want to overcome the challenges, we will need to rely on the cooperation and the support of communities, of all levels of government, of everyone in this Legislature, of individuals, of families and businesses and workers.

Certainly as government, we’re committed to doing our part, and that’s what this estimate is about. I want to introduce the staff who are here today. People have heard me today as well, when we announced the package, talk about the extraordinary work of the civil servants across government — certainly in my min- istry, but across government — providing support in very short timelines to be able to put together these kinds of packages. I have Richard Purnell with me, Doug Foster and Fisnik Preniqi, who are here to provide support as we go through committee stage on these estimates.

Funding for contingencies — what have we included in this package? This is a pandemic response and econom- ic recovery that provides $5 billion to support a provincial response to the corona disease COVID-19. Our response is built to coordinate with the government of Canada’s plan and to help boost support where we think it’s needed. Our response will be evidence-based, and there are three areas of focus.

Supporting services to protect the health and safety of British Columbians has first priority; second, immediate relief to individuals and businesses; and third, looking ahead to economic recovery in partner- ship with the business and labour community. [2:35 p.m.] Our response is going to be phased, and we’ll need to be responsive to the changing environment. To date, the federal response has had three areas of focus: health care, short-term support for individuals and short-term con- tinuity of business, but as we know, there are gaps.

The fed- eral response provides very modest support for health care and critical services. B.C. will only receive our portion based on per capita. That’s a challenge. When you look at our health care sys- tem, when you look at the per-capita number of cases, when you look at the demographics in British Columbia, per capita creates some challenges. We will be working to ensure that there are supports, as I said, to fill the gaps for the area that’s there. The federal response is focusing on liquidity through borrowing and tax deferral.

Again, we can balance those off and supplement those measures by making sure there are tax deferral supports in place and by providing tax relief for businesses as well. Our strategy includes timely measures to be able to sup- port individuals and families who may be coping with potential illness. It adds key funding to areas like health care and housing, supporting vulnerable populations and making sure that the core social services British Columbi- ans rely on are there for them as well.

We know that British Columbia has a very strong eco- nomic foundation, but we also know that COVID-19 is going to impact the entire globe when it comes to the eco- nomy. Every aspect of our economy is going to be touched by this pandemic. The plan that we have put together, yes, looks at the immediate but also looks ahead and provides support for future initiatives that will be needed to make sure that we can look at recovery.

That will be put together with the business community and with the labour community to make sure that we’re able to do what we can to look at, when we’re ready, how we kick-start the economy. So $2.8 billion for individuals and families, $2.2 billion for busi- nesses and longer-term economic recovery. I just want to finish up my opening remarks by noting that this is an ever-changing situation. The plan is the plan 11644 British Columbia Debates Monday, March 23, 2020

today, and we know that it will need to be flexible. It will need to be responsive. It will need to be able to address the pressures that we may see in the days and weeks and months to come. In the theme that really has fit today, I think we all are in this together, and we all need to do our part. Certainly, as government, we’re pleased to bring this forward. I also want to recognize, again, the members from the opposition parties, both the official opposition and the Green Party, who have come forward and provided ideas and responses.

I’ve had lots of emails from individuals who weren’t able to be here today who have been providing advice and giving ideas as well. With that, I’ll take my place. The Chair:I recognize the member for Richmond- Queensborough. J. Johal:Thank you, Madam Chair. I thank yourself and my colleagues across the way in regards to this extraordin- ary moment to talk on this issue. The business of supplementary supply generally is the process by which a government asks the Legislature to appropriate the funds required to meet its financial obliga- tions and to implement programs already approved by the Legislature.

In other years, this would be considered a mat- ter of routine. Today is far from routine. It’s an extraordin- ary day for an extraordinary time as this province, this nation and the international community fight a global pandemic. It’s hard to imagine now, but just a few weeks ago we were debating, inside and outside this House, about block- ades and, to a certain degree, even debating the issues around Brexit. Those issues are distant today. The needs of British Columbians are our priority, and those needs are immediate.

Those suffering from the effects of COVID-19 also deserve to know the resources will be there for them in the weeks and months ahead. Our front-line health workers — who have been doing tremendous work in very challenging and, at times, gut- wrenching conditions — need to know we are working to meet their needs. This supply bill must also address the needs of parents who need child care facilities to remain open so that they can go to work for our many essential services.

This bill is not only about providing quick action but protecting the health and safety of British Columbians and also protecting our economy. [2:40 p.m.] What we’re seeing today is not just a health care crisis but an economic crisis as well: 500,000 Canadians have already applied for employment insurance, with that num- ber expected to increase significantly in the weeks ahead. In its most optimistic assessment, the United Nations International Labour Organization says the impact of the COVID-19 outbreak will cost 5.3 million jobs globally.

In its bleakest scenario, that number would rise to just shy of 25 million jobs, meaning it would cause more unemploy- ment than the global economic crisis in 2008. What the government is seeking with this approval is nine months of supply for a budget one can easily argue is out of date because of circumstances. This great House is built on a foundation of checks and balances. The approval of this bill and the supplementary conversation that we’re having today comes in a climate where we do not know when this House will sit next. We are forced to be absent for obvious reasons.

But when this conversation resumes in this great House, the government should expect ques- tions on its spending and priorities, particularly around the consequences of COVID-19 on people’s health as well as impacts on the economy, small businesses and their employees. When we are back in chambers, the opposition will want to know what specific measures the government will introduce to help our battered hospitality and tourism industry survive and thrive once again. In its worst-case scenario, the B.C.

Restaurant and Food Services Associ- ation says the COVID-19 pandemic could result in up to 15 percent of restaurants shutting for good in British Col- umbia. Our hotel industry employs 60,000 people across British Columbia. Two-thirds may lose their jobs because of the economic fallout surrounding COVID-19. Those employ- ees will want specific answers in regards to their economic well-being. In a recent survey of 8,000 small businesses by the B.C.

Chamber of Commerce, 90 percent of B.C. ’s small busi- nesses are already reporting some hit in lost sales, can- celled contracts or layoffs due to the COVID-19 response. The survey also found that of those impacted, 83 percent are seeing a drop in revenue, 91 percent anticipate a fur- ther decrease in revenue in the near term, and 73 percent of businesses expect their revenue will drop by 50 percent or more, with nearly a quarter saying that revenues will drop by 100 percent. The impact of COVID-19 is being felt throughout the economy, in every sector, and with that, people’s pocket- books.

The opposition will want to know how this gov- ernment will help British Columbians pay their monthly mortgage, rent and utility payments. The people of Brit- ish Columbia want to see a coordinated plan that is meaningful and appropriate to the current crisis. That means economic relief programs that will keep British Columbians employed and provide clarity to small busi- ness owners when it comes to payroll and property, sales and income taxes. There’s no doubt that public safety and health is our primary concern.

But the opposition will want to know what this government will do to provide resources to our social agencies, including groups like the food banks, which are struggling to meet demand, at the same time Monday, March 23, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11645

softening the economic impacts on individuals and busi- nesses. In closing, I want to remind those in this House that we are up to the challenge presented by COVID-19. There may be those who feel scared right now, but I would tell them to have faith in their fellow British Columbians. I want to thank our front-line health care workers, our doctors, our nurses and caregivers. I want to thank our police, our paramedics and firefighters, who will be leaned on even more in these challenging times. I also want to thank our workers in grocery stores, retail outlets and res- taurants.

I want to thank our truck drivers, warehouse workers, child care workers and delivery drivers. They continue to keep our supply chain moving and care for our children. I want to say that we are a strong, resilient and empath- etic people. We have shown these traits many times in the past few weeks. Volunteers are dropping off groceries at the homes of seniors.

It’s picking up the phone and calling your neighbour and saying: “How are you doing?” It’s the care workers in Richmond walking out of the hospital to go grab a cup of coffee at Starbucks and a patron buying a $500 gift card to say thank you, thank you from all of us in this community of ours — in Richmond, in my case, but throughout British Columbia. What I want to end with is to say we are a great province of five million people, and we’ve responded to this chal- lenge with five million acts of kindness. We’ll need more acts of kindness in the weeks and months ahead.

In that spirit, I look forward to a constructive conversation in and around the issues that British Columbians want us to deal with here and now. [2:45 p.m.] The Chair:Do other members have any questions or comments on the vote? J. Johal:I listened to some of the comments from the Finance Minister and, certainly, watched the press con- ference, some of the conversation in and around this bill. Does the minister believe that the $5 billion is sufficient to deal with the issues surrounding COVID-19? Hon. C. James: I think this is an important question, because I think, given the evolving situation….

I think the Health Minister described it well when he said: “Could any of us have imagined a few weeks ago being in the situation that we’re in?” I don’t think any of us could’ve imagined that. I think this is sufficient for now. But as we said in the press conference when we delivered this plan, it is a first step. We will need to be flexible. We will need to be responsive. We will need to see where it goes over the next days and weeks and months ahead.

So I cannot commit to whether this would be sufficient for the next three months, the next six months, the next two months, depending on what kind of situation we’re facing. We believe that this package is a fulsome package. I think the member mentioned it as well. We’ve tried very hard to make sure that we address both immediate needs for people and businesses and that we coordinate with the federal response. That’s very important, again, so that we can get the best bang for our buck. We can provide the best support to families.

For example, you’ll see the federal government is bring- ing out a GST credit in April. We hope to get our payment out to people in May. There’ll be another payment in July. So again, looking at how that coordination occurs to provide the best support for families and for businesses. Again, we’re looking at deferring a number of taxes until the end of September, which will provide what many businesses have been calling for, which is that cash flow pressure. So we certainly feel that right now this is sufficient.

But the situation, as I said, will continue to evolve, and we expect that we will need to be flexible to meet the needs as well. J. Johal:I raise that question simply because of what we’ve been hearing in the last few days. Here’s a quote from Dan Kelly from the Canadian Federation of Independent Business. He says: “ A wage-subsidy program is our best protection against large-scale unemployment. ” Goldy Hyder, the president and CEO of the Business Council of Canada, agreed.

He says: “The way we’re think- ing about stimulus is into a job-preservation program. ” There seems to be an immediate need by small business — all businesses, but particularly small business — in regards to seeking help. I understand that we are a subna- tional economy. We’re not a national economy. But when I look at some of the help that is being provided to busi- nesses…. In Britain, the government said that it will provide government grants to cover 80 percent of fur- loughed workers’ salaries. The Danish government says that it will pay 75 percent of worker salaries, up to a cap of $4,700 a month.

In New Zealand, the country is offering a flat-rate subsidy paid in one 12-week lump sum to help businesses avoid layoffs. I bring that question again to you because it seems like it isn’t about two months from now. It’s literally seven days from now when you have to meet payroll, potentially, or rent. Do you feel there’s any way these programs, the help that is being provided, can be moved faster, between the federal government and the provincial government, in regards to meeting those needs?

Because what we are hear- ing is that there are immediate needs, not a need two or three months from now. [2:50 p.m.] Hon. C. James:Thank you for the question. I think, as 11646 British Columbia Debates Monday, March 23, 2020

the Premier said, every jurisdiction is looking at what they can do and adjusting what they can do over the next while. I think this is an important piece to look at from both a perspective of what we’re doing and the perspective of what the federal government is doing because, in fact, some of those supports are being taken on federally. We’ve certainly been clear that we believe the federal government has to take a lead. We have to add and supplement and support, but the federal government also needs to step up on this situation.

The member probably knows some of the supports that have been put in place from the federal end. It does include, in fact, temporary wage subsidies for small employers. That’s a piece that the federal government is looking at. They have a number of loan programs that have been put in place as well. The waiving or deferral of tax payments gives the imme- diate support to businesses that built that in to their books. That’s, I believe, one of the reasons…. We’ve had, of course, great discussions over the last couple of weeks with the business community.

Almost every one of the communities that sent out their list of the kinds of things that they think are important mentioned the deferral, because that gives an immediate payment for people who expected to make a payment at the end of March or expected to make a payment in the middle of April. That gives them instant cash flow, instant liquidity that they can address some of the pressures that they’re facing and make the choice they’re making. Do I believe that there’ll be further measures that we’ll have to take a look at over the next six months? I think that’s likely, given the situation we’re facing.

But I think the measures we put in place now, around the deferrals, around providing liquidity for businesses, around the cash through the school tax, the 50 percent reduction — which isn’t a paying-back; that’s an actual reduction for busi- nesses — will provide them some of that cash flow to address some of the pressures that they need. J. Johal:I appreciate the answer. I want to talk about one individual. His name is Bill McKnight. He owns a small clothing store in Ladner. He has laid off all of his employees. He’s 73 years old, and rent is due the end of this month, or the first of the month of April.

He’ll have to pay $8,000. There is no revenue coming in. May 1, the same. How will Bill McKnight be helped by the provincial gov- ernment and the federal government, in your mind, in regards to holding on to his business and moving forward? That’s $8,000 per month. Hon. C. James:I’ve talked about the federal programs. Again, hypothetical, because I don’t have the specifics around the individual, but he certainly may be eligible for some of the programs that have been talked about through the federal government.

There are a number of discussions with banks and credit unions — we’re having the discus- sions with credit unions as well — about deferring mort- gage payments or deferring rent payments or deferring payments that may be in place. The federal government has loan programs, as I mentioned already. [2:55 p.m.] Deferral of the property school tax will be a direct sup- port, again, if the individual is paying property tax. Defer- ral of tax payments, which again, will be built in — most businesses build those into their budgets.

They will have six months where they don’t have to look at making those payments, which, again, can be significant for some busi- nesses as well. The individual, depending on the circumstances, could be eligible for the $1,000 benefit, the one-time payment. Again, that’s going to small business owners if they’re eli- gible. So that’s a possibility in that as well. Then depending on his income, he could be eligible as well for the top-up to the climate action credit coming in July. That’s going to impact 86 percent of people who will see a large amount. He could be eligible for that amount as well. J.

Johal:I appreciate the Finance Minister’s response. It does speak to the challenge of meeting the targets of rent at the beginning of the month of $8,000, a hard target. With all these deferrals that you’ve talked about, it does still speak to the challenge of meeting that deadline every month. Every business and every sector is going to be impacted. It is a daunting task for government to fill in those holes on a federal level and a provincial level. I appreciate the Finance Minister’s answer.

But there are literally thousands of businesses in the days ahead, never mind weeks or months ahead, that are going to have to make those tough decisions. I think there’s a lot of work ahead for not only government and opposition but for all of us to make sure we meet the needs of Brit- ish Columbians in regards to that one example that I gave. There are many other Bill McKnights out there in different sectors as well. We’ve talked about the $5 billion that government is going to be spending. There are impacts, of course, of businesses, like Mr. McKnight’s, that have shut down.

Has there been any modelling done on the impact of COV- ID-19 on government revenue? Hon. C. James:I would say that it has preoccupied and occupied the work of people particularly, obviously, in the branch that looks at our modelling around the economy each and every day. I would suggest that that is their focus right now. I certainly have been getting reports.

I think it would be no surprise to the member to know that every area of our economy is being impacted right now by COVID — everything from exports, imports and the challenges there, obviously the hospitality industry, Monday, March 23, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11647

the tourism sector and arts and culture. Y ou name it. The impact is great. Specifics on what that looks like in the economy are early yet. There are a number of tax payments that come at the end of March and the beginning of April, so again, we’ll take a look at those and see where the drops are. We haven’t quite seen that impact yet because the numbers don’t come on the immediate. So we’ll have to wait to look at those numbers. Certainly, first quarterly of this fiscal year that comes at the end of the summer will be key. Public accounts will be key.

We’ll be looking at how we can do updates on a regular basis on how these dollars are being spent, just to touch on the member’s points around accountab- ility, which I think is really critical. We’ve been talking about how we can give updates to the members from all parties in the Legislature around where the package is going, what dollars are being spent and how we can provide those regular updates if the Legislature isn’t sit- ting for a while as well. So I couldn’t agree more that the accountability piece is going to be important and the economic updates are going to be important.

But it’s early yet, because the numbers are still, really, coming in from the last couple of months where the biggest impacts will have occurred. J. Johal:In these extraordinary times, I think the min- ister would agree that we need to be forthright, open and available, almost as much as the Health Minister, on a daily basis in regards to numbers. I think they do matter, and I think British Columbians also want to hear exactly where their dollars are going and the challenges that we have in regards to revenue on the revenue side in government.

I appreciate you acknowledging that and wanting to share those numbers as much as possible with the people of Brit- ish Columbia. This is a moving target, as you have said. The modelling that is being done and will be done — is there any sort of chance that modelling will be done where you have a two- month scenario, a six-month scenario and a year scenario? [3:00 p.m.] I think this is a moving target. This is going to continue. I just wanted to see if the minister can acknowledge that we would get different scenarios, because I think the people of British Columbia would want that. Hon. C.

James:Certainly, I think the easiest way to put it is…. This, again, will be looked at each and every month. We will have better information and more up-to-date stat- istics coming in over the next couple of months as we start to see corporate income tax and all those kinds of things. We can certainly estimate the numbers and the drops that, I think, every jurisdiction will see. This won’t be unique to British Columbia. We’ll be watching other juris- dictions as well. I think, certainly, each month we’re going to have to take a look.

We’ll also get an idea, then, of applications that will come in, of program pressures that will be put in place and of what we see for people with disabilities or on income assistance. Will there be pressures there? What will you be seeing with applications for the additional payment through EI? If you look at the EI numbers the member mentioned — jumping from 22,000 to 500,000 — we know that that kind of caseload pressure will need additional resources, obviously, from the federal end. We could be sit- ting in the same kind of situation as well. This will be a month-to-month estimation of a program.

We believe these dollars, as I said, will hold. We’ve been conservative in our estimates around the spending of these dollars. So we believe there is room to get us through. But again, in these unprecedented times, is there a chance that we will need to look at more resources to be able to sup- port the economy? I think none of us could imagine the situation we might be in. J. Johal:We are talking about people losing their jobs or who have already lost their jobs and small business owners wanting to stay afloat. Government needs to work towards that.

Has there been any conversation or a push to move infrastructure programs — move them quicker, build them quicker — so we can get people to work? That could be, potentially, the Pattullo Bridge, SkyTrain projects. Is there any conversation, in and around large public sector infrastructure projects, on moving the timelines earlier so we can get them up and going? Hon. C. James:Thank you very much to the member. That’s the reason, in fact, that we’re putting together the recovery team and the economic advisers, people from the business community and from the labour com- munity — to have exactly those discussions.

So we’re ready to go, when the opportunity is out there, and to put stimulus into the economy when we have the chance to build the projects. Obviously, right now people are being told to stay home. We have to follow the health and safety rules and the orders that have been put in place by Dr. Bonnie Henry. But we know, as Dr. Henry says, this is not forever. We will be at a place where there’s the opportunity. That’s where British Columbia certainly is very well situ- ated. We have had that reinforced by some of the rating agencies as well.

British Columbia will be very well posi- tioned because of the large capital spend that we have in the budget. We, in fact, have one of the largest capital spends, which has been in place, in British Columbia. So we’ll be well positioned to move those along. Whether there’s the opportunity to speed those up, again, will depend on the situation of the economy and of employees to be able to do those projects. But it’s not off the table. As I said, that’s part of the reason we want to have 11648 British Columbia Debates Monday, March 23, 2020

this recovery team in place: to look at exactly those kinds of questions so we’re ready when things turn around. [3:05 p.m.] Although the $1.5 billion probably won’t be spent for the next few months as they determine a workplan, the work will start, and that will get going. That’s exactly the kind of question that will be part of that discussion. J. Johal:The minister, in her opening remarks and, cer- tainly, I know earlier today in her press conference talked about tax deferral around EHT and carbon tax. If the con- cerns around COVID last many months, could deferral be pushed further? Hon. C.

James:Y es, no question. J. Johal:What does the minister say to the persistent conversation, which is in the public sphere, that these tax deferrals don’t work? People need wage subsidies. Business owners need wage subsidies now, today. That’s a better way to keep people working and keep people solvent, and liquidity stays in the system, rather than these tax defer- rals. What would you say to that argument? Hon. C. James:In fact, deferral of the taxes was prob- ably the most common request from all of the business communities that have written in, businesses large and small: B.C.

Business Council, Victoria Chamber of Com- merce, Surrey Board of Trade. The requests that came in, in fact, did focus on deferrals, because that provides the support for businesses that, again, have those dollars writ- ten into their books and now can take those out of their books for the next six months and know that they can use those resources in another way. I don’t think it’s either/or. That’s why, I think, you see the federal government plan does have a portion around wages. I think, again, this will be a changing, ever-evolving situation that we’re going to have to watch. J. Johal:A couple more questions.

The minister talked about, I think, setting aside $1.7 billion, focusing on health and social services. Obviously, housing is a very important part of anybody’s life. A roof over your head is so very important in regards to dignity and the day- to-day living. The comments from the Premier, I think during ques- tion period, were that no one will get evicted due to COVID. Can the Finance Minister confirm that that is the case? Hon. C. James: I can’t talk about the specifics around housing because they’re coming this week.

The member may know that there’s already been a decision around evic- tions being banned for B.C. Housing, and there’ll be fur- ther information coming around the evictions piece as well. I’ll hold that until Wednesday. I believe that informa- tion will be coming out on Wednesday. When it comes to people not being able to afford rent, a number of the measures I’ve talked about — the $1,000 and the other supports that we’ve put in place — obviously help towards that.

We’re also looking at — and, again, this is the Minister of Housing who will be working on this — whether we can use existing structures and retool the requirements in place. An example would be the SAFER program, the seniors rental supplement program, or the RAP program for people who are working and are low income but are holding a job. Those rent supplement programs could be expanded so that…. There are people who are at risk of not being able to pay their rent who could then access them through the program.

Again, I talked earlier about the work of the civil ser- vants and making sure that we had both the accountability mechanisms and the flexibility and the speed to get these supports out. That’s exactly the kind of thing that’s being looked at right now. J. Johal:I think that’s wonderful, especially helping those on low income in regards to keeping a roof over their head. Now, if you’re in downtown Vancouver and you’re a young person starting out your career, you’re probably paying $2,000 a month for rent, if not more. In fact, it’s $2,500 to $2,700 a month in certain neighbourhoods in downtown Vancouver.

I’m glad that there are programs available for those on the low-income side, but there are those who are just start- ing out their careers. One of the things I’ve seen in the introduction of this bill is that there’s a lot of emphasis put on those that are most vulnerable. I don’t see a lot for those that I could describe as working class, middle class — those making $40,000, $50,000, $60,000, $70,000 a year. They’re also going to be hurting. That may be layoffs, the inability to pay your rent.

Will we see more specific programs geared towards the middle class, the working class — those that, you know, may be making more than lower-income salaries but still will need help? Will we see more programs geared towards the middle class? Hon. C. James:Thank you for the question. [3:10 p.m.] A couple of pieces. The $1,000 is not income-tested, so that, in fact, will go to middle-income earners. People who are on employment insurance — who are accessing employment insurance, so who have lost their work — will have the ability to access that $1,000 as well. That’s part of the program. Student loans.

Those go to people who’ve finished and graduated. Many of those young people, as the member talks about, would be people carrying student loans. They Monday, March 23, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11649

will, again, have a deferral on those loans, both federally and provincially, which will make a difference. Then when I talked about expanding the low-income supplements, that’s exactly the kind of situation that I’m talking about: “Could you expand the criteria? Could you adjust where people can access that so that people who are struggling — who may not be in the very low income but are still struggling — will have an ability to access supports?” Those are the kinds of things that are being explored with those supplement programs. J. Johal:My final question, and I thank the minister for her response.

Y ou see the challenges there, whether it’s $1,000 an indi- vidual may receive as a one-time payment, not having to pay student loans for many months…. That may cover one month’s rent on April 1. Y ou’re in trouble again the next month. So you can see the financial challenges and the anxiety that people are going to have to deal with in the very near future, literally weeks away, and the challenges that are before us as legislators. My final question is also focusing on the social pro- grams, but that is food banks, which I think every com- munity relies upon to help those who are in need.

In gro- cery stores, as we’ve seen, some of the shelves are bare because of hoarding and just everyday British Colum- bians stocking up as well. In the past, there would be excess that could be donated to those food banks. People who weren’t afraid of losing their jobs were donating to those very food banks. Today there’s a tremendous challenge — a tremendous, tremendous challenge. Food banks today are in trouble here in British Columbia, from Richmond to Prince George, from Cranbrook to Kitimat.

Can the minister address — particularly for that part of our society, the food bank — what will be done to help immediately, and any other social agency and sector that does the front-line work in our communities? It’s so valu- able. They’re the most vulnerable members of our com- munity, and they need our help as well. So if can the min- ister could address that. Hon. C. James:Thank you to the member for asking the question and recognizing the critical…. I call it the fab- ric of British Columbia.

Not-for-profits, our social service agencies and the people on the front line really are the fab- ric of our communities and fill in those supports that need to be there. There are a whole number of pieces that are being put in place right now. I mentioned, as part of our package, that we are con- tinuing the contracts with agencies who may be retooling how they’re providing services. They may need to do it in a different way to ensure that they are following the orders of the public health officer — have reduced down staff, per- haps, because some staff may be working from home or not be in the office.

They will continue to get their contract money. They will continue to get those funds because we need those not-for-profits and social service agencies to be in place in the community. They will continue to receive supports. I have to give huge credit to a number of groups and organizations that are looking at how they can utilize their staff who may not be working — they may have closed their business — to provide supports. B.C. Housing, for example, is looking at food service delivery, starting this week, for tenants in subsidized and affordable housing in the Lower Mainland.

They’re looking at whether they rep- licate that in other agencies. Seniors. I mentioned — perhaps I didn’t mention it in the House — the $50 million that will be going to the United Way for the Better at Home program. That’s, again, a program…. I give credit to the members from the Green Party and from the official opposition who are involved in looking at how we could expand that program, who worked with the Minister of Health’s staff. That will help seniors stay in their own homes.

That will provide support so that they can live independently and give them the little extra that they need to be able to provide that support. Then the Health Minister mentioned the Vulnerable Population Working Group. That, again, is a group that’s in place, that’s working with communities. I know they’ve been doing some work in the Lower Mainland and on the Island. That, again, is looking at exactly the kinds of needs that the member is talking about and how we ensure that the supports are there. We recognize that it’s critical to have those supports in the community from the not-for-profit sector.

We’re looking at how we continue to both utilize them — because they have the expertise, and they’re in the com- munities now — but also provide them with the support that they need. [3:15 p.m.] Through this centralized Vulnerable Population Work- ing Group, there’s an ability to access resources that are needed, like handwashing stations, as the Minister of Health mentioned, or other priorities that they may have. J. Johal:I just want to close this with a comment. I thank the Minister of Finance and staff today for com- ing out. It’s a valuable conversation. I have many more questions; I could be here all month.

But we know we need to move quickly to help British Columbians. I think that on behalf of the opposition, what I would like to say is that the help is immediate and now. I brought up the issue of the food bank, but there are many other questions and many more vulnerable groups that need our help. I hope we can work collectively and constructively, moving forward, for the people of British Columbia.

We have many more specific questions on how those pro- grams will be implemented, how we handle our valuable taxpayer dollars, but at the end of the day, making sure 11650 British Columbia Debates Monday, March 23, 2020

this is still about public service and making sure we get those dollars out to the people of British Columbia as fast as possible. I thank you, Madam Chair, and I thank the Finance Minister and all of you here today. S. Furstenau:Following up on some of the questions from the member opposite, more specific to government services. We’re wondering if the minister can provide us some information about the actual mechanics of how people will be receiving services they need — for example, Ministry of Children and Family services, support services for families.

What are the mechanics of continuing that level of government service to people that are vulnerable and in need of help? Hon. C. James: Each of the ministries is involved in their own emergency plans, so each individual minister and ministry will be putting in place how they provide those critical services and supports, what resources they need to be able to do that. That’s why the $1.7 billion is put aside, because we know there will be pressures.

We know there will be pressures on a variety of services that I talked about earlier to the pre- vious member, everything from income assistance to dis- abilities to areas where people are vulnerable. We talked earlier about violence against women and some of the challenges that self-isolation, in particular, can cause. Those ministries will be able to look at the programs and services they’re providing through their emergency programs and through the work that they’re doing and be able to access those dollars as they need them.

That’s why we’ve left the flexibility, because we know that those are going to go up and down, just in the same way that we talked about how businesses may need more support or employees may need more support. Agencies and minis- tries will need different kinds of supports at different kinds of times, depending on what situation we’re in. It will be done, as you will see, so there’s accountability. It will be done through Treasury Board submissions and an opportunity for people to say: “This is where the need is greatest.

These are the kinds of supports that we need to put in place. ” So the accountability is there. There will be accountability around the dollars but also flexibility to make sure that we can provide them where the need is greatest and where the pressure is greatest as well. S. Furstenau:Thank you to the minister for the answer there. The member opposite asked about food banks and other services.

I think one of the criticisms that has been raised about the federal response has been somewhat of a lack of support for NGOs and the important role that NGOs are going to play as we weather this health and economic crisis. Could the minister elaborate a little bit more on how the province is working to fill in the gaps that have been iden- tified in the federal response and what’s being done to sup- port non-profits? Hon. C.

James:The Minister of Social Development has been working closely with the not-for-profit sector, has already held a round table this past week and I know is back in touch, again, with his colleagues in the social ser- vices field to make sure that he’s hearing firsthand from where the pressures are and talking to us about those pres- sures. Obviously, Social Development, as well, will be providing support and looking at programs that will assist their clients. But they also, whether it’s Social Development or Min- istry of Children and Families, contract with a number of these not-for-profit agencies.

And as I mentioned, I think the member will have seen the release around child care as a very good example, where child care centres may be staying open to provide supports for emergency person- nel. That could be everyone from nurses and doctors and first responders to grocery clerks and people that we need to keep our system running. [3:20 p.m.] Normally, if they would only have six children, for example, in a 20-child centre, they would have that money taken back. They would be able to only get support for the children that are there. That’s not going to happen.

We’re going to make sure that that support and more is provided, covering off the parent fees so that those centres can stay open, that they can operate, that they can provide support for people who need child care to be able to provide all the services that all of us rely on in communit- ies. Even centres that close down, that aren’t able to stay open because parents are keeping their kids at home, which is encouraged if they’re able to do that…. Those centres that close down will still receive a portion of

Document details

Collection	British Columbia — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	20200323pm-Hansard-n326
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	20200323pm Hansard n326
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	2e2b38fedc28e8c0aabbce7edc5abd1bb5b61cba

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