Manitoba Hansard — 27 April 2023 (Sitting 49B, 42nd Legislature, 5th Session)

42-5-49b

Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)

Fifth Session – Forty-Second Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable Myrna Driedger Speaker Vol. LXXVII No. 49B - 1:30 p.m., Thursday, April 27, 2023 ISSN 0542-5492

MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Forty-Second Legislature Member Constituency Political Affiliation ALTOMARE, Nello Transcona NDP ASAGWARA, Uzoma Union Station NDP BRAR, Diljeet Burrows NDP BUSHIE, Ian Keewatinook NDP CLARKE, Eileen, Hon. Agassiz PC COX, Cathy Kildonan-River East PC CULLEN, Cliff, Hon. Spruce Woods PC DRIEDGER, Myrna, Hon. Roblin PC EICHLER, Ralph Lakeside PC EWASKO, Wayne, Hon. Lac du Bonnet PC FONTAINE, Nahanni St. Johns NDP GERRARD, Jon, Hon. River Heights Lib. GOERTZEN, Kelvin, Hon. Steinbach PC GORDON, Audrey, Hon. Southdale PC GUENTER, Josh Borderland PC GUILLEMARD, Sarah, Hon.

Fort Richmond PC HELWER, Reg Brandon West PC ISLEIFSON, Len Brandon East PC JOHNSON, Derek, Hon. Interlake-Gimli PC JOHNSTON, Scott, Hon. Assiniboia PC KHAN, Obby, Hon. Fort Whyte PC KINEW, Wab Fort Rouge NDP KLEIN, Kevin E., Hon. Kirkfield Park PC LAGASSÉ, Bob Dawson Trail PC LAGIMODIERE, Alan Selkirk PC LAMONT, Dougald St. Boniface Lib. LAMOUREUX, Cindy Tyndall Park Lib. LATHLIN, Amanda The Pas-Kameesak NDP LINDSEY, Tom Flin Flon NDP MALOWAY, Jim Elmwood NDP MARCELINO, Malaya Notre Dame NDP MARTIN, Shannon McPhillips PC MICHALESKI, Brad Dauphin PC MICKLEFIELD, Andrew Rossmere PC MORLEY-LECOMTE, Janice, Hon.

Seine River PC MOSES, Jamie St. Vital NDP NAYLOR, Lisa Wolseley NDP NESBITT, Greg, Hon. Riding Mountain PC PEDERSEN, Blaine Midland PC PIWNIUK, Doyle, Hon. Turtle Mountain PC REDHEAD, Eric Thompson NDP REYES, Jon, Hon. Waverley PC SALA, Adrien St. James NDP SANDHU, Mintu The Maples NDP SCHULER, Ron Springfield-Ritchot PC SMITH, Andrew, Hon. Lagimodière PC SMITH, Bernadette Point Douglas NDP SMOOK, Dennis La Vérendrye PC SQUIRES, Rochelle, Hon. Riel PC STEFANSON, Heather, Hon. Tuxedo PC TEITSMA, James, Hon. Radisson PC WASYLIW, Mark Fort Garry NDP WHARTON, Jeff, Hon.

Red River North PC WIEBE, Matt Concordia NDP WISHART, Ian Portage la Prairie PC WOWCHUK, Rick Swan River PC Vacant Morden-Winkler

1975 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Thursday, April 27, 2023 The House met at 1:30 p.m. Madam Speaker: Good afternoon, Jets fans. Please be seated, and go, Jets, go. ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS INTRODUCTION OF BILLS Bill 39–The Residential Tenancies Amendment Act

(3) Hon. James Teitsma (Minister of Consumer Protection and Government Services): I move, seconded by the Minister for Justice, that Bill 39, The Residential Tenancies Amend ment Act (3); Loi no 3 modifiant la

Loi sur la location à usage d'habitation, be now read a first time. Motion presented. Mr. Teitsma: I'm pleased to introduce Bill 39, which will clarify evidentiary considerations, with respect to applications or orders of possession to evict tenants that are engaged in unlawful activities. This bill aligns with government priorities to improve community safety while addressing stakeholder feedback and promoting greater understandance–understanding and transparency. And I'm pleased to present this bill to the House for its consideration.

Madam Speaker: Is is the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion? [Agreed] COMMITTEE REPORTS Standing Committee on Justice Second Report Mr. Dennis Smook (Chairperson): I wish to present the second report of the Standing Com mittee on Justice. Clerk (Ms. Patricia Chaychuk): Your Standing Committee on– Madam Speaker: Dispense. Your Standing Committee on Justice presents the following as its Second Report. Meetings Your Committee met on April 26, 2023, at 6:00 p.m. in Room 255 of the Legislative Building.

Matters under Consideration • Bill (No. 11) – The Reducing Red Tape and Improving Services Act, 2023 / Loi de 2023 visant la réduction du fardeau administratif et l'amélioration des services • Bill (No. 17) – The Regulated Health Professions Amendment Act (2) / Loi n o 2 modifiant la

Loi sur les professions de la santé réglementées • Bill (No. 26) – The Limitations Amendment and Public Officers Amendment Act / Loi modifiant la

Loi sur les délais de prescription et la

Loi sur les officiers publics • Bill (No. 34) – The Police Services Amendment Act / Loi modifiant la

Loi sur les services de police Committee Membership • Hon. Mr. GOERTZEN • Hon. Ms. GORDON • MLA MARCELINO • Mr. MARTIN • Mr. SMOOK • Mr. WIEBE Your Committee elected Mr. SMOOK as the Chairperson. Your Committee elected Mr. MARTIN as the Vice - Chairperson. Public Presentations Your Committee heard the following two presentations on Bill (No. 34) – The Police Services Amendment Act / Loi modifiant la

Loi sur les services de police: Mike Sutherland, Manitoba Nurses Union Michael Anderson, Manitoba Keewatinowi Okimakanak Inc. Written Submissions Your Committee received the following written submission on Bill (No. 17) – The Regulated Health Professions Amendment Act (2) / Loi n o 2 modifiant la

Loi sur les professions de la santé réglementées: Pamela Gregoire, Remedial Massage Therapists Society of Manitoba

1976 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 Your Committee received the following three written submissions on Bill (No. 34) – The Police Services Amendment Act / Loi modifiant la

Loi sur les services de police: Kam Blight, Association of Manitoba Municipalities Cathy Merrick, Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs Crystal Brown, Southern Chiefs' Organization Inc. Bills Considered and Reported • Bill (No. 11) – The Reducing Red Tape and Improving Services Act, 2023 / Loi de 2023 visant la réduction du fardeau administratif et l'amélioration des services Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 17) – The Regulated Health Professions Amendment Act (2) / Loi n o 2 modifiant la

Loi sur les professions de la santé réglementées Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 26) – The Limitations Amendment a nd Public Officers Amendment Act / Loi modifiant la

Loi sur les délais de prescription et la

Loi sur les officiers publics Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 34) – The Police Services Amendment Act / Loi modifiant la

Loi sur les services de police Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. Mr. Smook: I move, seconded by the honour able member for McPhillips (Mr. Martin), that the report of the committee be received. Motion agreed to. Madam Speaker: Further committee reports? Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development Third Report Mr. Brad Michaleski (Chairperson): I wish to present the third report of the Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development. Clerk: Your Standing Com mittee on Social and Economic– An Honourable Member: Dispense. Madam Speaker: Dispense.

Your Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development presents the following as its Third Report. Meetings Your Committee met on the following occasions in the Legislative Building: • April 24, 2023, at 6:00 p.m. • April 25, 2023, at 6:00 p.m. • April 26, 2023, at 6:00 p.m. Matters under Consideration • Bill (No. 35) – The Education Administration Amendment Act (Teacher Certificatio n and Professional Conduct) / Loi modifiant la

Loi sur l'administration scolaire (brevets d'enseignement et conduite professionnelle) Committee Membership Committee Membership for the April 24, 2023 meeting: • Mr. A LTOMARE • Hon. Mr. EWASKO • Mr. ISLEIFSON • Mr. MICHALESKI (Vice-Chairperson) • Ms. NAYLOR • Hon. Mr. REYES Your Committee elected Mr. ISLEIFSON as the Chairperson. Committee Membership for the April 25, 2023, meeting: • Mr. ALTOMARE • Mr. BRAR • Hon. Mr. EWASKO • Hon. Mr. KHAN • Ms. NAYLOR • Hon. Mr. REYES Your Committee elected Mr. MICKLEFIELD as the Chairperson. Your Committee elected Mr. PEDERSEN as the Vice - Chairperson.

Committee Membership for the April 26, 2023, meeting: • Mr. ALTOMARE • Mr. BUSHIE • Hon. Mr. EWASKO • Mr. ISLEIFSON • Hon. Mr. JOHNSON • Mr. MICHALESKI Your Com mittee elected Mr. MICHALESKI as the Chairperson.

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1977 Your Committee elected Mr. ISLEIFSON as the Vice - Chairperson. Non-Committee Members Speaking on Record Non-Committee Members speaking on the record at the April 24, 2023, meeting: • Ms. LAMOUREUX Non-Committee Members speaking on the record at the April 25, 2023, meeting: • Hon. Mr. GERRARD Public Presentations Your Committee heard the following 46 presentations on Bill (No. 35) – The Education Administration Amendment Act (Teacher Certification and Professional Conduct) / Loi modifiant la

Loi sur l'administration scolaire (brevets d'enseignement et conduite professionnelle): April 24, 2023 meeting Desirée Pappel, L'Association des éducatrices et des éducateurs franco-manitobains Karine Rioux, Private Citizen Jim Parry-Hill, Private Citizen Katie Hurst, Private Citizen Jonathan Waite, Seine River Teachers' Association Tom Schioler, Private Citizen Vicky Isliefson, Private Citizen Brett Dow, Prairie Spirit Teachers' Association Lindsay Brown, Private Citizen Nathan Martindale, The Manitoba Teachers' Society Katie Hurst, Private Citizen Catherine Hart, Private Citizen Cynthia Taylor, Private Citizen Amber Lewicki, Private Citizen Tara Law, Private Citizen Chris Darazsi, Private Citizen Roland Stankevicius, Private Citizen Cari Satran, Private Citizen Tammy Tutkaluk, Brandon Teachers' Association Noni Classen, Canadian Centre for Child Protection Cathy Pellizzaro, Thompson Teachers' Association Cathy Pleskach, Interlake Teachers' Association Shawna Dobbelaere, Western Teachers' Association Marcela Cabezas, Louis Riel Teachers' Association Lise Legal, Pembina Trails Teachers' Association April 25, 2023 meeting Arianne Cloutier, Private Citizen Joy Smith, Joy Smith Foundation Joel Swaan, Garden Valley Teachers' Association Scott Durling, Private Citizen Amy Warriner, Private Citizen Gabriel Hurley, Private Citizen Sam Zurzolo, Private Citizen Augustine Watanabe, Private Citizen Rachelle Dunlop, Private Citizen Jay Ewert, Evergreen Teachers' Association Sean Giesbrecht, Private Citizen Elizabeth Bourbonniere, Private Citizen Gregory Walker, Private Citizen Cameron Watson, Private Citizen Sonja Blank, Private Citizen Nicole Bobick, Swan Valley Teachers' Association Karla Rootsaert, Private Citizen Mike Urichuk, Private Citizen Jon Bettner, Private Citizen Shelagh McGregor, Private Citizen Kevin Rebeck, Manitoba Federation of Labour Written Submissions Your Committee received the following 40 written submissions on Bill (No. 35) – The Education Administration Amendment Act (Teacher Certification and Professional Conduct) / Loi modifiant la

Loi sur l'administration scolaire (brevets d'enseignement et conduite professionnelle): April 24, 2023 meeting Andrew Dryden, Private Citizen Amanda Jonker, Private Citizen Carine Brandt, Private Citizen Sarah Coates, Private Citizen Norman Cable, Private Citizen Crystal Rachul, Private Citizen Lindsay Lepla, Private Citizen Leslie Singer, Private Citizen William Taylor, Private Citizen Russ Patterson, Private Citizen Sofiene Loumi, Private Citizen April Pulak, Private Citizen Heather Ladoski, Private Citizen Royce Murray, Private Citizen Sari Targowmik, Private Citizen Carla Bouchard, Private Citizen Anita Van Kits, Private Citizen John Hasenack, Private Citizen Shawna Stevenson, Private Citizen Jennifer Loewen, Private Citizen Lisa Siddall, Private Citizen Kevin Rogerts, Private Citizen Vanessa Lylyk, Private Citizen Kevin Kehler, Private Citizen Fiorella Lavergne, Private Citizen Lin Ruttan, Private Citizen Amanda Jonker, Private Citizen

1978 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 Pam Spitula, Private Citizen Jeff Hoeppner, River East Transcona School Division Nathanael Watt, Manitoba School Boards Association Kelli Wiebe, Private Citizen A.J.

Hrychuk, Private Citizen Kristen Fallis, Private Citizen Mathieu Nolett, Private Citizen Lindsay McDonald, Private Citizen April 25, 2023 meeting Beth Burrows, Private Citizen David Wall, Private Citizen Jennifer Engbrecht, Private Citizen April 26, 2023 meeting Kristy Frohwerk, Private Citizen Anne Marie Robinson, Stop Educator Child Exploitation Bills Considered and Reported • Bill (No. 35) – The Education Administration Amendment Act (Teacher Certification and Professional Conduct) / Loi modifiant la

Loi sur l'administration scolaire (brevets d'enseignement et conduite professionnelle) Your Committee agreed to report this Bill with the following amendments: That Clause 5 of the Bill be amended by renumbering it as Clause 5(1) and adding the following as Clause 5(2): 5(2) The following is added after subsection 4(1): Consultations re proposed competency regulations 4(1.0.1) The minister must consult with, and seek advice and recommendations from, representatives of teachers, employers of teachers, teachers, and any other persons the minister considers appropriate in respect of each proposed regulation under clause (1)(c.1). THAT Clause 8 of the Bill be amended in the proposed

section 8.22 as follows: (

a) by renumbering the

section as subsection (1) and replacing the

section heading with "Notice of decision"; (

b) by adding the following as subsection (2): Exception 8.22(2) Despite subsection (1), information provided to employers or posted on the registry must not include any information that has not been made public under

section 8.21. THAT Clause 8 of the Bill be amended by adding the following after the proposed subsection 8.25(2): Right to appear and be represented 8.25(3) The commissioner and the investigated teacher may appear and be represented by counsel or an agent at the hearing, and the panel may have counsel to assist it. THAT Clause 8 of the Bill be amended in the proposed

section 8.32 as follows: (

a) in subsection (2), by striking out "subsection (3) " and substituting "subsections (3) and (4)"; (

b) by adding the following after subsection (3): If disability affects capacity to teach 8.32(4) If a finding has been made under clause 8.29(1)(d), the commissioner, when making informa- tion available to the public under subsection (2), must not make available any personal health information (as defined in The Personal Health Information Act ) about the investigated teacher unless the com - missioner is satisfied that the public interest in making the information available substantially outweighs the teacher's privacy interests. THAT Clause 8 of the Bill be amended in the proposed

section 8.34 as follows: (

a) by renumbering the

section as subsection (1) and replacing the

section heading with "Notice of decision"; (

b) by adding the following as subsection (2): Exception 8.34(2) Despite subsection (1), information provided to employers or posted on the registry must not include any information (

a) that has not been made public under

section 8.32; or (

b) about which an order has been under

section 8.33 preventing public disclosure. Mr. Michaleski: I move, seconded by the honourable member for Brandon East (Mr. Isleifson), that the report of the committee be received. Motion agreed to. Madam Speaker: Tabling of reports? MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS Madam Speaker: The honourable Minister of Mental Health and Com munity Wellness–and I would indi - cate that the required 90 minutes' notice prior to routine proceedings was provided in accordance with rule 26(2). Would the honourable minister please proceed with her statement.

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1979 Mental Health Week Hon. Janice Morley-Lecomte (Minister of Mental Health and Community Wellness): This year, the Canadian Mental Health Association's Mental Health Week is May 1st to 7th, with Child & Youth Mental Health Day falling on May 7th. This week, and every day, I would like to commend mental-health-care providers and organizations for their dedication in supporting Manitobans impacted by mental health issues and for the valuable role they play in Manitoba's health-care system.

A strong mental health system with prevention and early intervention services is a key component of our health-care system. In honour of Mental Health Week, I encourage all Manitobans to speak openly about mental health and check in with family, friends and colleagues. For those of you struggling today, please know that you are not alone. Reach out to someone you trust and know that support and resources are available to everyone in Manitoba. Thank you. Mrs. Bernadette Smith (Point Douglas): Next week is Mental Health Week and Child & Youth Me ntal Health Day.

Sadly, we know that there is still a stigma against mental health issues and those –and accessing treat - ment for them. Mental health is a time to counter this stigma by remember though–by remembering those that –by remembering that we all have struggled at some point in our lives. It's important that we support one another in seeking the help that we need and that the resources are there for those who need them. As next week is also child and youth–Mental Health Week, it is also important to remember that many Indigenous children and youth on First Nations are struggling with mental health.

We saw the con sequences in Tataskweyak with the suicide epidemic a couple of years ago. I was fortunate enough to go out and support that community and work alongside and saw the amazing community come together to support, and I'd like to see that also in Manitoba here. It's crucial that we ensure young people in First Nations have the supports, as well as here in Winnipeg. Fortunately, there are many organizations in our com- munity are working every day to support those: Canadian mental health society, and the Manitoba NDP– Madam Speaker: The member's time has expired. Some Honourable Members: Leave.

Madam Speaker: Leave has been requested for th e member to conclude her statement. Is there leave? [Agreed] Leave has been granted. Mrs. Smith: Fortunately, there are many organi - zations and individuals in our community are–who are working every day to help those who are struggling. One of those is the Canadian Mental Health Association, which provides program ming, events, research and other supports to promote mental health and help those who are struggling. The Manitoba NDP also passed a bill to recognize Eating Disorders Awareness Week each y ear. This affects many children here in our province.

To everyone who works on the front lines provi - ding mental health care, I want to thank you all for the incredible life-saving work that you are doing. We see you, we recognize you, we stand with you and we acknowledge you and uplift you for all of your work. And for those struggling, know that you are not alone. Many of us struggle with you. Miigwech. Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Madam Speaker, I ask leave to speak to the minister's statement. Madam Speaker: Does the member have leave to respond to the ministerial statement? [Agreed] Mr.

Gerrard: Madam Speaker, I welcome the oppor- tunity to talk about mental health and, in parti cular, the mental health of children, and to thank all the professionals who provide care in these areas. Mental wellness is as important as physical well- ness. The absence of mental well -being can be associated with the development of physical illnesses. Indeed, this is one of the reasons that Manitoba Liberals have, for many years, advocated for putting psychological therapies under our medicare system so they can be publicly funded as are help for physical health issues.

The pandemic drastically increased the incidence of mental health conditions in childr en. Indeed, we need a task force to address backlogs and wait times in mental health areas as well as physical health,

1980 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 especially for things like addictions and eating disorders, where there are major shortfalls currently. Thank you. Madam Speaker: Further ministerial statements? The honourable Minister of Labour and Immigration–and I would indicate that the required 90 minutes' notice prior to routine proceedings was provided in accordance with rule 27(2). Would the honourable minister please proceed with his statement. National Day of Mourning Hon.

Jon Reyes (Minister of Labour and Immigration): The National Day of Mourning is held and recognized every April 28th by over 100 countries around the world and is an opportunity to pause and reflect while honouring those Manitobans who died while on the job and those workers who suffered workplace injuries or illnesses performing their duties. In 2022, 21 of our fellow Manitobans lost their lives as a result of work-related incidents and occupa- tional diseases. Many more Manitoba workers were hurt seriously enough to cause permanent injury or require time away from their jobs.

Those lost were much more than workers. They were also our family members, friends, colleagues and neighbours. * (13:40) Tomorrow, there will be many events occurring throughout the province in commemoration. I encourage my colleagues, and all Manitobans, to take

part in the SAFE Workers of Tomorrow Leaders' Walk, starting at 11:30 a.m. at the Union Centre on Broadway and proceed to Memorial Park, where'll be –where we gather for a commemoration ceremony organized by the Manitoba Federation of Labour. At that time, I will read a proclamation to recognize the Day of Mourning on behalf of the Province of Manitoba. Our government will continue to prioritize and be steadfast in our ongoing commitment to work with our partners in labour and management to improve occupational health and safety policies, procedures and conditions in the workplace.

And we want to ensure that when workers g o to work at the start of their day, they come home safely to their loved ones at the end of each day. Let's continue to work together to support workers in the workplace–including here at the Manitoba Legislature–and ensure that –and to ensure that no injury, illness or death occurs at our place of work or any workplace.

Madam Speaker, as we won't be in the–in this place tomorrow for the National Day of Mourning, I would like to ask that all members stand for a moment of silence to honour all Manitoba w orkers who suffered a workplace illness or injury or who were killed in the workplace. Thank you, Madam Speaker. MLA Malaya Marcelino (Notre Dame): Today, we take a moment to reflect and remember members of our community who we have lost as a result of injuries or illnesses related to their work. April 28 is National Day of Mourning, and it's time we dedicate to those who were killed, injured or made sick because of their work.

I would like to use this opportunity to say thank you to the unions and advocates for the significant progress that has been made over the years to protect workers. Continuous improvements to workplace health and safety laws are necessary as new issues are identified. Instead, the PCs have cut safety measures protect- ing apprentices. PCs have cut staffing levels and en - forcement activity at Work place Safety and Health. And workers are still waiting for the gov ernment to fulfill its duty to include a list of deadly diseases in The Workers Compensation Act we know to be occupational killers.

Health-care workers, our health -care heroes, are asking the gov ernment to commit to SAFE work certification programs. This would greatly reduce the very high number of injury rates happening to health- care aides, home- care workers and others in the health-care sector. I hope my colleagues across the Chamber will listen when I say we need to strengthen our resolve to establish safe and healthy conditions in the workplace. At this time, I'd like to recog nize the Barrion family from the Notre Dame constituency.

I'd like to give them my heartfelt condolences, because they lost their son, John Lloyd, in February 2022 due to a work- place homicide. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Ms. Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): Madam Speaker, I ask for leave to respond to the minister's statement. Madam Speaker: Does the member have leave to respond to the ministerial statement? [Agreed]

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1981 Ms. Lamoureux: I rise this afternoon to speak to the National Day of Mourning. Every year, we take this time to step back and reflect upon those who have lost their lives from being injured on the job. According to the Association of Workers' Compensation Boards of Canada, in 2021, there were 1,081 workplace fatalities recorded in Canada. Among these deaths were 18 workers between the ages of 15 and 24. Madam Speaker, we need to continue to strive for worker safety and ensure it is taken seriously in our workplaces.

This is something all levels of govern - ment can work towards improving. For example, our city government has a role to play with transit and bus driver safety. Our federal government has a role to play with air traffic–specifically, airport security, staff and pilots. They all deserve to be safe on the job. And lastly, Madam Speaker, provincially, we can look to the ratio apprenticeship programs being reinstated, and ways to alleviate burnout in our health- care system, as often accidents happen when we are not getting enough sleep or we are not doing well mentally.

With respect to mental health, we need to regulate psychotherapy in our province. Regulation would better ensure people can access mental health resources and would better ensure those providing these services are properly trained to do so. Madam Speaker, I want to thank the government for recent legislation that expands workplace injury claims for wildlife firefighters, as it is a positive step, but we need to do more.

Lastly, we want to extend our condolences to the many friends and family members who may have lost someone due to a workplace injury, and I'd like to ask this House for a moment of silence to recognize this day and all those we have lost. Madam Speaker: Is there leave for a moment of silence? [Agreed] Please rise. A moment of silence was observed. MEMBERS' STATEMENTS Bake Oven Mr. Andrew Micklefield (Rossmere): Madam Speaker, I rise to honour the legacy of the Bake Oven, which after 67 years, served its last customers on April 15th.

The Bake Oven is a family -owned bakery, store and cafe which announced, to the sadnes s of area residents, its closure to facilitate the much -deserved retirement of its owner, Marty Posthumus Jr., who joins us with his wife, Judy, in the gallery today. The Bake Oven was started by Marty's father, Marten Posthumus Sr., and his wife, Sally, who immigrated to Canada from the Netherlands in 1951. Their first location opened in 1955 as a corner bakeshop in the North End. The Bake Oven then moved to Munroe Avenue in 1960, and in 1978 Marten sold the business to his son, Marty.

In 1986 they opened their Edison Avenue loca - tion, and in 1990 added a restaurant to this location called The Bruin Cafe. In 2000 they closed the Munroe Avenue location, leaving the Edison Avenue location as the Bake Oven's home in Rossmere these last 23 years. Madam Speaker, earlier this month I visited the Bake Oven one last time and met with Marty and his staff to congratulate them on 67 years of serving Winnipeg.

Over the years many have enjoyed the international flavours offered at this landmark North Kildonan bakery: various baked goods, cakes, cheeses, sausage rolls or meat pies, or just a cup of coffee and friendly conversation. The Bake Oven will be missed by many, especially in Rossmere's European community. We are joined today by Marty and his wife, Judy. And I invite all members to join me, not only in welcoming them to the Legislature, but thanking them for The Bake Oven's 67 years of service. Congratulations and all the best on your retirement. Indigenous Youth Leadership Mr.

Ian Bushie (Keewatinook): I'm honoured to welcome the Louis Riel School Division Indigenous youth leadership as our guests at the Manitoba Legislative Assembly today. Their group was created so that they had the opportunities to learn more about Indigenous cultures, enhance their sense of belonging and develop leadership abilities so they can become agents of change. As a leader, we are all responsible for creating a better life, a better future for all Manitobans. The consequences of colonization have impacted Indigenous communities and the effects are ongoing. This is why, in part, they are here today.

1982 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 I am pleased to present some of the requests from the Louis Riel School Division Indigenous youth leadership team. They write: We are here to ask you to consider our ideas for lasting changes and reforms that will permit true reconciliation and a better future for all, especially Indigenous peoples living within Manitoba. We ask that the gov ernment reform the justice system and work towards eliminating racism and seek to incorporate Indigenous solutions.

We ask the government to respect, commemorate, and honor residential school survivors by pronouncing September 30 as a mandatory holiday for all. We ask the government to authentically integrate Indigenous ways of knowing in all subject matter from kindergarten to grade 12. We ask the government to recruit and train more Indigenous educators and health-care providers. We ask the government to reform the health-care system by eliminating systemic racism and seek to incorporate Indigenous solutions. We ask the government to further respect and honor the treaties that were signed on this land.

Thank you for your time and consideration. And thank you to the Louis Riel School Division Indigenous youth leadership team. I ask all members to join me in thanking the students here today for including the Manitoba Legislature on their journey. Brian Chrupalo Hon. Kevin E.

Klein (Minister of Environment and Climate): Madam Speaker, I rise today to recognize an exceptional member of our community, a leader, a role model, a Winnipeg police officer, a father of three, a community volunteer, a Bear Clan volunteer, a sports hall of famer, and a person that I am proud to call a friend: Brian Chrupalo. * (13:50) Born and raised in Winnipeg's North End, Brian holds treaty status through the Pine Creek First Nation. He is married and a father of three adult boys.

Brian is a 29-year member of the Winnipeg Police Service at the rank of staff sergeant, and is a director with the Bear Clan Patrol. Brian is the first status Indigenous official in CFL history, having officiated 278 games and five Grey Cups throughout his 19- year career, and he's still going. He also participated in the league's official exchange program with the NFL, off iciating a Jacksonville Jaguars pre-season game in 2017.

On September 30th, 2022, Brian became the first CFL official to announce a penalty in an Indigenous language, making calls between the Saskatchewan Roughriders and the Winnipeg Blue Bombers in Ojibwe. On April 12th, Brian was inducted into the Manitoba Aboriginal Sports and Recreation Council hall of fame. On January 2nd, Brian was inducted into the North American Indigenous athletic association hall of fame for the 2023 class. Brian is the thir d official inducted, joining long- time NHL referee Danny McCourt and Minnesota basketball referee Michael Thomas.

He is the first CFL alumnus to be enshrined in any category. But more than all of that, the Brian that I know inspires many, many people, including myself. His dedication and his passion for helping the community, and his work with the Bear Clan, are remarkable and unmatched. But Brian will totally disagree with that statement. He will deny it and he will credit everyone else around him.

In recognition of Brian Chrupalo's outstanding contributions to the province, I ask all members of the House to join me in thanking him and his wife, Lori [phonetic], for their dedication, passion, vision and commitment to making the lives of others, including my own, better. Pay Discrimination MLA Malaya Marcelino (Notre Dame): Many women in this province continue to face pay discrimination by their employers. Women and racialized people are paid con sider- ably less for doing the same work as their co-workers. Women facing pay discrimination have described feeling humiliated and demoralized at work due to this.

The economic effects on yearly and lifetime income is also pronounced and contributes to the feminization of poverty in old age. This morning, the CCPA released a report called Tired of Waiting: Rectifying Manitoba's Pay Gap that focuses a statistical analysis of the pay gap in Manitoba across race, occupation, industries, education and age. Prior to this report, we could only point to federal statistics on pay discrimination, but now there is

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1983 evidence that pay discrimination in Manitoba is a lot worse than in other provinces. Within the CCPA report, it is shown that Manitoba women earned 71 cents to every dollar men earned. A discriminatory pay gap exists between men and women in every occupational grouping and in every industry, with women largely working the lowest paid jobs. Under the leadership of NDP –of the NDP in the 1980s, MLAs like Muriel Smith pioneered efforts to end pay discrimina tion for women working in the public sector.

In addition, many women and racialized folks working under union- negotiated collective agreements are also afforded protections. The federal government has also recently worked towards eliminating pay discrimination in federally regulated workplaces, but Manitoba has yet to update laws for workers who don't fall under these regulations. I've recently introduced bills multiple times in an attempt to end this discrimination, but this PC govern- ment consistently rejects them without offering any alternatives to advance women's economic rights.

In my work on this topic, I found broad consensus among all those consulted, from workers to employers, that pay discrimination exists in Manitoba. This con- sensus is now underscored by CCPA's research. I once again urge this PC government to take an im- portant step today and pass The Pay Transparency Act. Elaine Stevenson Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Madam Speaker, today I recognize Elaine Stevenson, who has played a major role in–to create awareness of eating disorders, spending thousands of hours meeting with people and appearing on many media shows advocating to improve treatment in Manitoba.

She's in the gallery with us today. Elaine says: I am personally aware of the carnage, pain and nightmare that many families and those with eating disorders go through. Her involvement started when her daughter Alyssa was diagnosed with an eating disorder. She was a bright girl who loved sports, particularly fastball, pla ying on teams for Sir John Franklin, River Heights, Smitty's Terminators and The Maples. She struggled for 12 years with her condition and sadly passed away in 2002. Elaine has continued her involvement in Alyssa's memory.

Her advocacy has been important in the develop- ment of new health services in Manitoba and an improved quality of life for many. Since the mortality rate for children with eating disorders is one of the highest of all mental health issues, it is likely her work has saved many lives. In the late 1990s, Elaine was a founding member of the Eating Disorders Association of Manitoba, EDAM. In May 2001, following her advocacy and that of EDAM, the provincial government established an eating disorders program and treatment centre.

But the wait times for help for those with eating disorders are still far too long–unacceptably long. As of April 4th, the Women's Health Clinic provincial Eating Disorder Prevention and Recovery Program had 145 clients waiting for 16 to 18 months. Waiting lists for all eating disorder programs need to be public, published on websites and accessible to Manitobans, and they need to be much shorter than now. A residential treatment program for eating disorders should also be established in Manitoba. I say thank you, Ela ine Stevenson, for all you have done for our province.

Introduction of Guests Madam Speaker: We have some guests in the gallery that I would like to introduce to you. Seated in the public gallery, we have Jade Vanderlinde, Darius Schriemer and Rylan Veenendaal, who are the guests of the hon- ourable member for Radisson (Mr. Teitsma). On behalf of all members here, we welcome you to the Manitoba Legislature. ORAL QUESTIONS Rural and Northern Manitoba Broadband and Cell Services Mr. Wab Kinew (Leader of the Official Opposition): People in rural and northern Manitoba deserve to have access to fast broadband Internet and cell service.

Now more than ever, it's essential for everyday life. That's why it's so disappointing that the PC gov - ernment and this Premier has failed to deliver on this file. For years, they've made an nouncement after announcement, and yet, nothing happens; nobody gets connected. Instead, what they do is priva tize our im- portant fibre optic assets while rural and northern Manitobans wait for service. So will the Premier explain why the gov ernment has failed to deliver broadband and cell service for people in rural Manitoba and the North? Hon.

Heather Stefanson (Premier): Madam Speaker, we want to ensure that all Manitobans have access to Internet services no matter where they live in the

1984 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 province, and that's certainly is a priority for our government. Madam Speaker, we take this issue very seriously. We have spoken to those out in various remote com - munities to see how we can help them make sure that they get access to those services. So we'll continue to take action in this manner, Madam Speaker, and continue to get things done for those who live in remote communities in our province. Madam Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a supplementary question. Mr.

Kinew: Unfortunately, that's not true; there's no action taking place. I'll read from a letter from Manitoba Hydro sent earlier this week that says: Fibre work associated with the rural broadband expansion program continues to remain on hold at the request of Xplore. End quote. Now, Xplore is, of course, the private company that this government tried to sell off our fibre optic assets to. I'll continue reading the quote here: Xplore is disputing payment of project costs and has directed Manitoba Hydro to cease fibre work until the dispute is resolved. End quote.

That's the situation right now, and it means that folks are not being connected to broadband Internet. * (14:00) So, jus t to review: a private company is telling Manitoba Hydro, our Crown cor poration, to cease work on an asset that the people of Manitoba own through Manitoba Hydro. Hydro says it's unknown when the situation will be resolved. Why has the government ceased all work on rural broadband in Manitoba? Mrs.

Stefanson: Manitobans know that when it comes to Manitoba Hydro, we continue to clean up the $4-billion boondoggle that was left to us by the Leader of the Opposi tion and other NDP members, Madam Speaker. We continue to clean up that mess. They left Manitoba Hydro riddled with debt. Very significant. We are taking action to make sure that life is more affordable for Manitobans through Manitoba Hydro, Madam Speaker. We'll continue to take those actions on behalf of Manitobans. Madam Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a final supplementary. Mr.

Kinew: Madam Speaker, this is a very serious issue for people in rural Manitoba, as well as in the North, so I'll share more infor mation from this very concerning letter. Again, this letter says that this private company, Xplore, has ordered Manitoba Hydro, which we all own collectively, to stop working on assets that we all own collectively, which were supposed to be connect- ing more people to broadband Internet. This letter goes on to say that Hydro says, quote: At this time, it's unknown when a resolu tion will be reached or when the project will resume. End quote.

So the government does not know when work is going to resu me to connect people to high -speed Internet. In fact, the letter also says that this Telecom staff have now been redeployed to work on other issues. No plan to resume service, no plan to connect Manitobans–and in the interim, these important public employees are being sent to work in other areas.

I'll table the letter so the Premier can see what's happening under her watch, but why has she failed to connect Manitobans to broadband and cell service? [interjection] Madam Speaker: I would just indicate to members in the public gallery that there is to be no participation in the proceedings on the floor, and that means that all members in the public gallery are not to applaud. Mrs.

Stefanson: Well, Madam Speaker, we, as well, take this issue very seriously on behalf of those who work in very remote com munities in Manitoba, and that's why we are taking action through Manitoba Hydro and other ways to ensure that they get the services that they need. What we won't do is take a

chapter out of the NDP book, w hich is to riddle the –Manitoba Hydro with record debt, with the boondoggle that they left us to clean up their mess, the $4 billion in cost overruns in Manitoba Hydro. That does nothing, costing, you know, charging the rates to go up–causing rates to go up for Manitobans, Madam Speaker. We don't believe that that's the right future for Manitoba Hydro. That's why we've taken action to make life more affordable for Manitobans, by ensuring that their hydro rates remain low. Madam Speaker: The honourable Lea der of the Official Opposition, on a new question.

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1985 New School Construction Use of P3 Model Mr. Wab Kinew (Leader of the Official Opposition): Madam Speaker, according to the MLA for Steinbach, the PC gov ernment did their, quote, research, end quote, on P3s and found that they were a bad idea for building schools. In fact, he had the gov ernment pay some $300,000 to look into this and provide that research. But now, this gov ernment is throwing that all away.

The problems with P3 schools are well known across the country: Nova Scotia, Saskatchewan, Alberta; many provinces have had problems with these P3 schools. The Premier owes Manitobans an explanation. Why is her gov ernment ignoring the facts and pushing ahead with P3 schools in our province against the advice of the MLA for Steinbach? Hon. Heather Stefanson (Premier): Well, Madam Speaker, I ap preciate the Leader of the Op position's question, and all the new schools that we're going to be building across the province of Manitoba.

In fact, we have a sig nificant number of them, I think nine, that are in the process of being built. We've committed to more than 23, Madam Speaker, in com- munities right across this great province of ours. So, where they failed in building schools, we will get it done. Madam Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a supplementary question. Mr. Kinew: Well, it's clear that not many people on that side of the House have much credibility these days. In fact, the minister responsible for this file said he, quote, does not have much context on why the Province ruled out P3s in 2018. End quote.

I guess the minister responsible doesn't talk to the member for Steinbach (Mr. Goertzen) very often, but I guess that's a sign of how things ar e on the PC side of the House these days. Here is the context, Madam Speaker: Nova Scotia P3 schools cost–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mr. Kinew: –tens of millions of dollars more. Again, Conservatives in Alberta, of all places, have aban - doned P3 schools in that juris diction. And yet, the Premier is going in the opposite direction. Why is the Premier doubling down on this P3 approach, even though the MLA for Steinbach says they're a bad idea? Mrs.

Stefanson: Madam Speaker, when it comes to the credibility of our Cabinet minister, we certainly will–we support our Cabinet minister. While–I'm not sure how many of his own caucus colleagues of the Leader of the Op position actually support him, but I can tell you that we support our colleague, the member for Steinbach. And, Madam Speaker, what I will say, and what is important here, is the fact that we are building more schools in the province of Manitoba.

Unlike the Leader of the Opposition and members opposite, who have no plan whatsoever when it comes to educating our kids in our province, we are committed to building 23 more schools right across this great province of ours. Madam Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a final supplementary. Mr. Kinew: So, Madam Speaker, is this another flip- flop by the Premier? Because she now says that she supports the member for Steinbach, and he opposes P3 schools. So, Manitobans would be forgiven for not following the PC train of thought these days.

What we on this side of the House say is that these nine schools could be built through a public process. They would be built cheaper, they would be built more quickly and they would be built putting hard- working Manitobans to work on construction projects in our province. But, of course, the PCs want to contract it out, and they would like–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mr. Kinew: –to pay more money to pursue an approach of privatization.

So I'll ask the House again, for the Premier to tell all of us here today, w hy is she moving ahead with these P3 school construction projects, against the advice of the MLA for Steinbach? Mrs. Stefanson: Well, Madam Speaker, I know the Leader of the Op position and members opposite are so concerned about their own ideology, they'll let their own ideology get in the way of actually building schools in our province. We won't allow that to happen, Madam Speaker.

We will ensure that all 23 of those schools get built, unlike members opposite, who are so focused on their own ideology no school will ever get built in the province of Manitoba.

1986 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 Health Staff Working Conditions Status of Draft Report MLA Uzoma Asagwara (Union Station): Madam Speaker, at the start of this week, it was revealed that the PC government has been sitting o n a draft report showing that over half of Manitoba health- care workers considered quitting because of their working conditions. Incredibly, days after it's been made public, this Health Minister says she hasn't seen nor read the report, Madam Speaker.

Will the minister commit to Manitobans that she will actually read this report over the coming week, which is constituency break week? Hon. Audrey Gordon (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, what are the facts is that a report was commissioned by Shared Health, not by government. It was a draft report that the writers have said are confidential; they would not be releasing the draft report. It was never finalized. Somehow, the members opposite got their hands on it, Madam Speaker. Probably while they were lurking in the back lanes, someone opened a door and slipped them a draft report.

That is not how we operate on this side of the House. We wait for reports to be finalized, and a – properly presented to the entity that commissioned the report. * (14:10) Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Union Station, on a supplementary question. MLA Asagwara: Madam Speaker, it is really sad that this Health Minister continues to confirm that she doesn't think she needs to be accountable for the current state of health care in our province.

Given the terrible state of health care under this government, you'd think she might be even a little bit curious what health -care workers really think about the job her and her government are doing in regards to health care. Will this minister confirm that, after this report has sat on a shelf collecting dust for that past year, if she's actually even asked for this report to be finalized? Ms. Gordon: Madam Speaker, again, the facts are that the writer of the report said it was con fidential, something–a word that the members opposite don't understand.

It was confidential and not to be released, but it was leaked and the members opposite got their hands on it. But on this side of the House, we don't need reports–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Ms. Gordon: –Madam Speaker. What we did was go to the front lines and listen to workers, develop a health human resource action plan, implement incentives for nurses alone–$123 million. That is listening and responding, not lurking in back lanes. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Union Station, on a final supplementary.

MLA Asagwara: Madam Speaker, I suppose I shouldn't surprised at that kind of wildly outrageous accusation. The minister has a pattern of accusing me of all kinds of wildly outrageous things. Manitobans are correct in their assessment that this government and this minister cannot be trusted when it comes to health care. [interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. MLA Asagwara: They're keeping negative reports in draft form so that they can just simply pretend these reports don't exist. But while she hides in her office, she's ignoring the concerns of health -care workers across our pro - vince.

We are long past the point, Madam Speaker, of plausible deniability. When will this PC Health Minister listen to health-care workers regarding their working condi - tions and their very real concerns? Ms. Gordon: Madam Speaker, I did listen to front - line workers at Health Sciences Centre, St. Boniface Hospital, Grace, throughout the rural com munities. I did a tour last summer and listened to front -line health-care workers. You know what I heard, Madam Speaker?

In the 17 years they were in power, not one single time did any member of the NDP ever go to t he front lines to speak or to listen to health-care providers. I know that they don't want Manitobans–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Ms. Gordon: –to know of their failures, Madam Speaker–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order.

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1987 Ms. Gordon: –but we listened, we responded with our health human resources action plan, $200 million. We listened, not depending on someone to leak a report–a draft report to our government. Manitoba Student Aid Wait Time for Services Mr. Jamie Moses (St. Vital): For months, we've been calling on the PC gov ernment to take action and fix Manitoba Student Aid, and for months, they've done nothing. Students continue to wait far too long for aid, and when they try to call Manitoba Student Aid over the phone, they're waiting for far too long on hold.

The minister, in fact, shared in Estimates the average amount of time that a Manitoban waits is a whopping 34.7 minutes on hold before they even talk to anybody. Can the Premier (Mrs. Stefanson) explain why she has failed to fix Manistoba [phonetic] Student Aid? Hon.

Sarah Guillemard (Minister of Advanced Education and Training): Again, the member oppo- site and I had a great discussion during Estimates where we talked about the increased number of students that we have processed who are applying for Student Aid as well as the budget this year that increased Student Aid to help more students as they pursue post-secondary education. Madam Speaker, this is a process that we have hired more FTEs to help out with the increased demand, and the member opposite was actually quite impressed with the infor mation that was coming through Estimates, the answers that were given.

And coming from the member opposite and an NDP team who ignored the Student Aid and the struggles that students had, I don't think that today he's going to give us any lessons. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for St. Vital, on a supplementary question. Mr. Moses: Madam Speaker, 34.7 minutes on hold. That's the facts right now. And that's just the average, actually. Manitobans have to wait just that long to speak to anybody at Manitoba Student Aid. And once they pick up the phone, of course, it's going to take them longer. The reality is that students don't have that much time to wait.

They can't spend all day just to get the help that they need. The PCs clearly need to do more to fix Manitoba Student Aid. So I ask the minister today, can she explain to students why she has failed them when it comes to Manitoba Student Aid? Mrs. Guillemard: I do want to clari fy there are 24 hours in a day, not 34 minutes. But the member opposite is bringing a good point, that we will in creasingly improve our services to students in Manitoba, unlike what the NDP did by ignoring the student needs. Their wait times were much longer under the NDP. We are continuously improving our services.

And, Madam Speaker, I would like to take a moment to thank all of the departmental staff who are dealing with students who are calling in. They are assisting them. They are helping them ac cess student loans so that they can pursue excellent education right here in our beautiful province. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for St. Vital, on a final supplementary. Mr. Moses: In Estimates, the minister said that there are a record number of Manitobans applying for stu- dent aid: 19,341 applications to Manitoba Student Aid.

But what the minister fails to realize is that when more people require student aid, it means that tuition is unaffordable for Manitobans. And when they try to get the a id from Manitoba Student Aid, they have to wait on hold for 34.7 minutes on average just to talk to somebody. That's not an efficient use of student time and it creates ad ditional stresses and headaches for students in Manitoba. Can the minister explain to Manitoban students why she has failed to fix the–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mr. Moses: –problems at Manitoba Student Aid? Mrs.

Guillemard: I would counter those arguments that the member has brought forward in saying that Manitoba has the lowest tuition rates in western Canada. He knows this to be the truth. We've said it on the record multiple times. I know it's difficult for the members opposite to listen and to hear the good news of Manitoba's student fees. That's what attracts a number of students to our province. And I will say that it's the word of mouth and our government's ability to inform students of the sup- ports that are available to them, including the student bursary programs–that that has driven up applications.

That's wh y people are reaching out to receive this support.

1988 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 Where the NDP kept it secret and didn't tell any- one about the supports necessary, we are happy to share with all Manitobans. Thompson General Hospital Lab Technologist Shortage Mr. Eric Redhead (Thompson): The state of health care in Manitoba is outrageous. And too often, the North is completely ignored. Earlier this week, allied health-care professionals revealed that–a critical shortage in laboratory staffing at Thompson General Hospital which could threaten to shut down the emergency room services altogether.

My question is for the Health Minister: What spe- cifically is she doing today now that she knows of the vacancy crisis at TGH? Hon. Audrey Gordon (Minister of Health): I'm pleased to rise to answer the member for Thompson's question. It gives me an opportunity to share, again, the incredible work that is being done by the health human resources action plan task force to add 2,000 additional health-care professionals to the health system, Madam Speaker. * (14:20) There are three pillars: retain, train and recruit, Madam Speaker.

And we are seeing great results under that plan, and I look forward to sharing them very soon. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Thompson, on a supplementary question. Mr. Redhead: That does nothing to address the crisis today, right now. The staffing situation at the Thompson lab has steadily worsened in recent years. Since 2020, six medical laboratory technologists have left positions in Thompson. Currently, there are only three tech- nologists out of 12. That's a total of a 75 per cent vacancy rate.

Workload assessment data obtained by MAHCP show that laboratory technologists in Thompson have been forced to work 47 hours straight. [interjection] This is dangerous. We need these lab techs to provide services to patients and– Madam Speaker: The member's time has expired. [interjection] When I say a member's time has expired, that means you're supposed to sit down and not keep talking. And t here–and I would add, there really is no point in yelling in here, especially when we have students. I think they want to see professional behaviour on this floor, that we can demonstrate that democracy can work. Ms.

Gordon: Madam Speaker, the health h uman resources action plan aims to support health- care programs all across the province. There are several positions within that health human resources action plan that is being targeted for increases: physicians, nurses, allied health professionals, support workers. I look forward to sharing the results of the great work that has been done by the task force very soon. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Thompson, on a final supplementary. Mr. Redhead: Not even a mumble of Thompson in that answer.

Madam Speaker, these are basic health-care services necessary for a hospital to function. Access to lab services is necessary for rapid diagnosis and treatment of patients in car accidents, heart attacks, pregnancy complications and other emergencies. Will this PC minister apologize to health -care workers in the North for her gov ernment's failure to recruit and retain technologists in Thompson? Ms. Gordon: Madam Speaker, Thompson is a concern as well for our gov ernment in terms of the services they need.

We are pleased to be around the table of solutions with many stakeholders in the North, Madam Speaker, looking at the challenges and the needs of the various northern communities. We will continue to work with those stakeholders on solutions, Madam Speaker. Some of those solutions are contained in the health human resources action plan, and I look forward to sharing the results of that plan very soon. Thank you. Drug Overdose Death Reporting Request to Pass Bill 221 Mrs.

Bernadette Smith (P oint Douglas): After months of the PCs refusing to release the numbers of overdose deaths in Manitoba in 2022, we finally received the preliminary data. And this data makes it clear that the addictions crisis in Manitoba continues to get worse under this PC government.

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1989 Madam Speaker, 418 Manitobans died from an overdose in 2022. That's 418 Manitobans too many. This is a crisis, Madam Speaker, yet this PC gov- ernment continues to do nothing. That's shameful. The PCs should do the right thing and commit to being transparent and pass Bill 221. Will they do so today? Hon.

Janice Morley-Lecomte (Minister of Mental Health and Community Wellness): I first want to begin by thanking all the front-line workers for all the work that they do, all the support they provide for all the individuals seeking support for their needs and for the families as well, and to say that individuals are able to see all numbers if they go onto the website. Preliminary numbers have been posted. And con- trary to her comment, the numbers posted for 2021 were higher than 2022. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Point Douglas–[interjection] Order.

The honourable member for Point Douglas, on a supplementary question. Safe Consumption Site Request for Facility Mrs. Bernadette Smith (Point Douglas): When we're pointing out numbers here, I want to remind that member that these are Manitobans. These are loved ones. These are people who have lost their lives, and this government continues to do nothing to support these families. They won't open a safe consumption site. They tried to bring a bill forward that would stop organizations who are doing life-saving work from doing their work. And now, you know, they take credit to sa y that, oh, the numbers are lower.

These are people's lives. So I'll ask the minister again: Will they do the right thing? Will they open a safe consump tion site today and help save Manitobans' lives and ensure that these numbers decrease and Manitobans' lives can be saved here in Manitoba? Hon. Janice Morley-Lecomte (Minister of Mental Health and Community Wellness): Madam Speaker, our condol ences go out to all flam –families, sorry– who have lost members to overdose.

That is why, in 2022, under the Mental Health and Community Wellness, a road map was created for im- proving mental health, substance use, addictions and programs throughout the province. Madam Speaker, $17 million was invested to help families and individuals who were seeking the sup - ports they need to ensure that their families were feeling and doing better. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Point Douglas, on a final supplementary. Mrs. Smith: If this gov ernment was doing better, these numbers would not continue to increase.

We wouldn't have more families joining, you know, Moms Stop the Harm, coming to this Manitoba Legislature, begging this government to do something to help save their lives because there's so many that are struggling in our province today. Thankfully, our NDP government was able to stop Bill 33. So many organi zations approached us and said what this government's doing was bad because it would stop the work of saving lives and Manitobans. So I'll ask the minister again: Will she do the right thing? Will she open a safe con sumption site here in Manitoba and help save Manitoban lives? Ms.

Morley-Lecomte: On this side of the House, we stand up for Manitobans and provide safety for them. Bill 33 was provi ding safety through provi ding sites that would assist individuals–vulnerable individ- uals–to seek the supports they need with medical profes- sions, pathway to recovery and a continuum of care to ensure that their recovery was long term. Health Workers Without Collective Agreement Back Pay and Resignation Timeline Concerns Mr. Dougald Lamont (St.

Boniface): We're more than concerned that the Health Minister says they haven't read a Manitoba Health report from a year ago that states in no uncertain terms that over half of all employees, two thirds of nurses and half of doctors, considered quitting due to burnout. The report spells it out. The current state of employee well -being poses a risk to employees, to patients and to the health system. Burnout isn't covered. And we've heard directly from people in the system: they want to do their work, but they're quitting as

an act of pro fessional and personal self -preservation, many after years of wage freezes. Are people who worked for years during this pandemic without a contract be ing denied their back pay by this gov ernment if they resigned before October 2022?

1990 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 Hon. James Teitsma (Minister of Consumer Protection and Government Services): I appreciate the member finally getting to the point of his question, and certainly we want to ensure that there's a fair deal reached for all Manitobans–or for all workers within our health-care system. We want to make sure that that deal is reached as quickly as possible, and our encouragement is for the employer, which is Shared Health, and for the unions to work together at the bargaining table to get that done. Madam Speaker: The honour able member for St.

Boniface, on a supplementary question. Mr. Lamont: This gov ernment dragged its feet on contracts and froze health wages for y ears on end–in law. The Deloitte report says it drove people to burn- out and to quitting. I table a Shared Health memo dated November 3rd, 2022, that makes it clear that retroactive salary increases don't apply to many people who worked in health care if they resigned, even if it were due to burnout. Under No. 3., who is eligible, it says, and I quote: Employees who are no longer employed with an employer or organi zation through designation or termination as of October 12th, 2022.

I heard from a worker today who said they were affected by this. The people who put in the work deserve their full back pay. * (14:30) Why is Shared Health and this gov ernment engaged in wage theft, and will they reverse it and make it right? Mr. Teitsma: I think the member is clearly confused. He seems to think the Clerk's table is the negotiating table, that he's somehow the union representative, and that I'm how–somehow Shared Health. None of those things are true. What we have here is a union negotiation, and it should be allowed to occur at the proper table, not in this Legislature.

So, appreciate that the member may have a parti- cular concern, and those particular concerns are things that, you know, the union that represents those workers should be repre senting and should be interested in, and surely they can work together and come up with reasonable plans for all the individuals concerned. That's what a negotiation table is for. That's where negotiation should happen. The member wants to it here in the Chamber; it's not appropriate. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Tyndall Park, on a final supplementary. Eating Disorders and Addictions Request for Treatment Facility Ms.

Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): The prov- incial gov ernment has not re leased any findings related to eating disorders and addictions here in Manitoba. We know the priority needs to be on reducing wait-lists and getting people into treatment. As of April 4th–just a few weeks ago–there were 145 clients waiting for an esti mated 16 to 18 months for the Women's Health Clinic. And to add to this, Manitoba is one of the few provinces without an eating disorders residential treatment centre.

Madam Speaker, when is this gov ernment going to bring forward some solutions to address these long wait times, and will the government consider creating a task force with a primary focus on eating disorders and addictions? Hon. Janice Morley-Lecomte (Minister of Mental Health and Community Wellness): On this side, we know that investments into eating disorders are very important. We need to provide areas for families to be able to go and seek support for themselves and for the individuals who are.

And in February, we invested money: $224,000 into the child, adolescent eating disorder program at Health Sciences Centre; $610,000 into the ongoing, annual funding expansion of the Adult Eating Disorders Program at Health Sciences Centre; and $300,000 into the continuing funding support for Provincial Eating Disorder Pre vention and Recovery Program. We are supporting family members. There is a lot more that we could do, but we are starting. Thank you. Early Learning and Child Care Wage Increases for Educators Mr.

Ian Wishart (Portage la Prairie): Child care has been a priority for our government, and I am proud to see real, meaningful change in the industry under the leadership of this Premier (Mrs. Stefanson) and this Minister of Education and Early Childhood Learning. This includes $10- a-day child care and many new

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1991 child-care spaces so that families can find acces sible and affordable child care. Well-trained, dedicated staff are the other part of the equation. Can the Minister of Education and Early Childhood Learning elaborate on how our government is helping support early childhood educators? Hon. Wayne Ewasko (Minister of Education and Early Childhood Learning): I'd like to thank my good friend and colleague from Portage La Prairie for that fantastic question, Madam Speaker. It is ECE week this week in Manitoba.

Early this afternoon, I was happy to announce increased wages for the early child hood education workforce and funded child-care facilities by $56.1 million, Madam Speaker, which will be –which will come into effect July 1st, 2023. This increase, on top of last year's increase, totals $93.1 million over two years. This PC team is increasing seats. We've made child care more affordable and now we are paying proper wages, Madam Speaker. We've got more work to do, but we're getting it done, as opposed to that team over there.

Pay Transparency Act Request for Support for Bill 228 MLA Malaya Marcelino (Notre Dame): As life gets more expensive for working families, we can't ignore gender discrimination on the pay scale, but a new CCPA report released just today suggests that the pro- vince lags behind other regions when it comes to legislation holding employers accountable. The data is alarming, and it's going in the wrong direction. Women in Manitoba are paid, on average, only 71 cents on the dollar when compared to men. Will this PC Premier (Mrs.

Stefanson) and her colleagues now join us in support of Bill 228, The Pay Transparency Act, today? Hon. Rochelle Squires (Minister responsible for the Status of Women): I do ap preciate the member opposite bringing forward a private member's bill, and I was disappointed that she didn't bring it to the Legislature for further debate this morning, especially this morning after receiving that report that shows that there is a widening gap and that we know that economic dev elopment for women needs to be a focus. So I look forward to that member bringing that bill back to the Legislature for debate.

Meanwhile, our government is committed to ad- vancing women's empowerment through many initia- tives. We are funding women in trades; we are funding other economic oppor tunities, entrepreneurs, in the province of Manitoba and ensuring that all women have the opportunity to achieve their full destiny and succeed in the workforce here in Manitoba. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Notre Dame, on a supplementary question. MLA Marcelino: Madam Speaker, I have brought this bill forward twice.

It's been rejected twice by that minister and the rest of her colleagues, and I brought this bill forward as early as three weeks ago. Madam Speaker, everyone deserves equal pay for equal work, but the pay gap increases even further when factoring other forms of discrimination based on race, age and ability. In Manitoba, racialized and Indigenous women earn 59 cents and 58 cents for every dollar men earn. Given the abundance of data and a continued lack of progress in closing this pay gap, will this PC gov - ernment act now and pass Bill 228? Ms.

Squires: It's very disappointing to see that that NDP caucus does not have unanimous support for that bill, because otherwise they would have brought it forward for discussion and a debate and a vote right here on the Manitoba Legislature floor. [interjection] But while the member for St. Johns (MLA Fontaine) continues to shout me down, I would like to tell the House about an im portant initiative that the Premier and I were at in terms of enhancing women's em - powerment earlier today.

We are ensuring that we've got oppor tunities for all women to achieve their destiny, and we're also making sure that our economy grows and that we're lifting women out of poverty by raising the basic personal exemption, expanding the workforce and creating new opportunities where none existed under the previous NDP government. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Notre Dame, on a final supplementary. MLA Marcelino: I'd love to kindly remind this minister that this does not have to be an us -and-them dynamic. This could be together that we work towards the econom ic advancement of all women in this province.

Madam Speaker, Manitoba used to be a leader in pay equity. Pioneering pay equity legis lation was passed right here in the 1980s, when it was revealed that

1992 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 women were paid 20 cents less than men in similar jobs. That was wrong then and it's wrong today. It's now time for Manitoba to be a leader again and address pay discrimination that exists in society, because everyone deserves a fair paycheque. Will the PC government support our bill today? Ms. Squires: I look forward to the time when all NDP caucus members can unanimously support pay equity, like on this side of the House. We all support better jobs, a better economy and no pay gap and gender discrimination in between women and men.

That is why we've worked very hard to ensure that women have a level playing field, including bringing in anti-harassment policy so that women could work free of discrimination, free of harassment, whether they're in the civil service and being a leader throughout this province–something the NDP never did. They never brought in anti-harassment when they were in gov ernment and they should have. Instead, they told women to shut up and suck it up. That's their [inaudible] Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: The time for oral questions has expired. * (14:40) PETITIONS Madam Speaker: Are there any petitions? Provincial Road 224 Ms. Amanda Lathlin (The Pas-Kameesak): I wish to present the following petition to the Legis lative Assembly. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) Prov incial Road 224 serves Peguis First Nation, Fisher River Cree Nation and surrounding communities. The road is in need of substan tial repairs.

(2) The road has been in poor condition for years and has numer ous potholes, uneven driving surfaces and extremely narrow shoulders.

(3) Due to recent popula tion growth in the area, there has been increased vehicle and pedestrian use of Provincial Road 224.

(4) Without repair, Provincial Road 224 will con- tinue to pose a hazard to the many Manitobans who use it on a regular basis.

(5) Concerned Manitobans are requesting that Provincial Road 224 be assessed and repaired urgently to improve safety for its users. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the Minister of Infrastructure to complete an assessment of Provincial Road 224 and implement the appropriate repairs using public funds as quickly as possible. Madam Speaker, this petition has been signed by many, many fine Manitobans. Ekosi. Madam Speaker: In accordance with our rule 133(6), when petitions are read, they are deemed to be received by the House. Security System Incentive Program Mr.

Jim Maloway (Elmwood): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) Cities across Canada and the United States, including Chicago; Washington, DC; Salinas, California; and Orillia, Ontario are offering home security rebate programs that enhance public safety and allow for a more efficient use of their policing resources.

(2) Home security surveillance systems protect homes and businesses by potentially deterring burglaries, reducing homeowners' and business insurance costs.

(3) Home security surveillanc e systems can also be remotely monitored with per sonal electronic devices such as smartphones. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to work with municipalities to establish a provincial–a province-wide tax rebate or other incentive program to encourage residents and businesses to purchase approved home and business security protection systems. This petition's signed by many, many Manitobans. Drug Overdose Reporting Mrs. Bernadette Sm ith (Point Douglas): I wish to 'pesent'–present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. The background to this petition is as follows:

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1993

(1) Across the province, many Manitobans con- tinue to struggle with addictions, and t he pan demic has led to even more death and worsened the ongoing public health crisis of opioid overdose.

(2) Three hundred and seventy -two Manitobans died from an overdose in 2020; and that's over one a day, and an 87 per cent–and 87 per cent higher than in 2019.

(3) Manitoba is expected to exceed over 400 over- dose deaths in 2021, but the data is not publicly available since the last public reporting of opioid deaths was published in 2019.

(4) The data for drug overdose deaths from 2020 to–and 2021 was compiled through media inquiries, and this needs to change.

(5) Access to timely data on the harms of drugs helps to inform both government and stakeholders on where to take action and targeted resources needed in various communities.

(6) Manitoba is the only province not provi ding regular, timely data to the federal gov ernment opioid information portal.

(7) Manitobans deserve a gov ernment that takes the growing drug crisis seriously and will report the data publicly in a timely matter to target actions and allow for accountability. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the prov incial gov ernment to enact bill 217, The Fatality Inquiries Amendment Act (Overdose Death Reporting), to require the Province to publish the number of drug overdose deaths, as well as the type of drug, on a gov ernment website in a timely fashion. And this has been signed by Bernard Catchaway, Deanne Patrick and Tracy Berens. Foot-Care Services Mr.

Eric Redhead (Thompson): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. To the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba, the background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The population of those aged 55- plus has grown to approximately 2,500 in the city of Thompson.

(2) A large percentage of those in this age group require medical necessary foot care and treatment.

(3) A large percentage of those who are elderly and/or diabetic are also living on low incomes.

(4) The northern regional health author ity, N-R-H-A, previously provided essential medical foot- care services to seniors and those living with diabetes until 2019, then subsequently cut the program after the last two nurses filling those positions retired.

(5) The number of seniors and those with diabetes has only continued to grow in Thompson and the surrounding areas.

(6) There is no adequate medical care available in the city and the region,

whereas the city of Winnipeg has 14 medical foot-care centres.

(7) The implications of inadequate or lack of podiatric care can lead to amputations.

(8) The city of Thompson also serves as a regional health-care service provider, and the need of foot-care service extends beyond just those served in the capital city of the province. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to provide the services two nurses to restore essential medical foot-care treatment to the city of Thompson effective April 1st, 2022. This has been signed by many Manitobans. Madam Speaker: Any further petitions? If not, grievances?

ORDERS OF THE DAY (Continued) GOVERNMENT BUSINESS House Business Madam Speaker: The honourable Government House Leader (Mr. Goertzen)–[interjection] The honourable member for Elmwood first. Mr. Jim Maloway (Chairperson, Standing Committee on Public Accounts ): On House busi ness, in accor - dance with rule 111(3)–sub 3, I would like to an- nounce that the Standing Com mittee on Public Accounts will meet in the Chamber on the following days:

(1) Monday, June 5th, 2023, at 1 p.m. to consider the following reports: Province of Manitoba Annual Report and Public Accounts, dated March 31, 2022; the Auditor General's Report, Public Accounts and Other Financial Statement Audit, dated December 2022. The witness to be called is: the Deputy Minister of Finance.

1994 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023

(2) Tuesday, June 6, 2023, at 1 p.m. to consider the following reports: Auditor General's Report, Aging Information Systems, dated February 2022; and the Auditor General's Report, Audit of Infor mation Systems Privileged Access, dated October 2022. The witnesses to be called are: Deputy Minister of Consumer Protection and Government Services; and the Shared Health CEO.

(3) On Wednesday, June 7, 2023, at 1 p.m. to consider the following reports: Auditor General's Report, Quarry Rehabilitation Program Investigation, dated May 2020; the Auditor General's Report, Follow-Up of Previously Issued Recommendations, dated March 2023, Quarry Rehabilitation Investi - gation Program. The witness to be called is: the Deputy Minister of Economic Development, Invest ment and Trade.

Madam Speaker: It has been announced that the following committee on Public Accounts will meet in the Chamber on the following dates: Monday June 5th, 2023, at 1 p.m. to consider the following reports: Province of Manitoba Annual Report and Public Accounts, dated March 31st, 2022; Auditor General's Report, Public Accounts and Other Financial Statement Audit, dated December 2022. The witness to be called is: the Deputy Ministe r of Finance.

Tuesday June 6, 2023, at 1 p.m. to consider the following reports: Auditor General's Report, Aging Infor- mation Systems, dated February 2022; Auditor General's Report, Audit of Information Systems Privileged Access, dated October 2022. The witnesses to be called are: Deputy Minister of Consumer Protection and Govern- ment Services; Shared Health CEO.

And Wednesday, June 7th, 2022, at 1 p.m. to con- sider the following reports: Auditor General's Report, Quarry Rehabilitation Program Investi gation, dated May 2022; Auditor General's Report, Follow -Up of Previously Issued Recom mendations, dated March 2023, Quarry Rehabilitation Investi gation Program. And the witness to be called is: the Deputy Minister of Economic Development, Investment and Trade. * (14:50) Hon. Kelvin Goertzen (Government House Leader): I want to commend the member for Elmwood (Mr. Maloway) for his historic announcement.

I think it's the first time–I'm told by the Clerk's table–that the PAC chair has been able to call the actual PAC meetings as a result of rule changes and the enhancement of our PAC process here in the Legislature. So, congratulations to the member for Elmwood. * * * Mr. Goertzen : Could you please, Madam Speaker, resolve the House into Committee of Supply? Madam Speaker: It has been announced that the House will consider Estimates this afternoon. This House will now resolve into Committee of Supply. Mr. Deputy Speaker, please take the Chair.

COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY (Concurrent Sections) ROOM 254 NATURAL RESOURCES AND NORTHERN DEVELOPMENT Mr. Chairperson (Dennis Smook): Will the Committee of Supply please come to order. This

section of the Committee of Supply will now resume consideration of the Estimates for the Department of Nat ural Resources and Northern Dev elopment. Questioning for this de partment will continue in a global manner. The floor is now open for questions. MLA Tom Lindsey (Flin Flon): I think we ended off yesterday, I had asked the minister a question about forestry. So I think that's probably where we will pick up this year. Does the minister have infor mation on the number of trees that were planted last year? Hon.

Greg Nesbitt (Minister of Natural Resources and Northern Development): In the last planting season, which was last spring and summer, I guess, Manitoba planted 1,651,035 seedlings, and that's up from the previous year, where we planted one –just over 1.5 million. Now, that includes the trees planted by Manitoba and our contractors, which the Peguis First Nation was one of our contractors in terms of planting there. We also have industry planting trees, and we don't have the final numbers for 2022 yet, but CKP in The Pas and LP at Swan River, in 2021 they planted 3.6 million trees.

So we expec t those numbers to be relatively close for 2022. They're just compiling those numbers now and haven't sent them to us yet. * (15:00)

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1995 MLA Lindsey: Can the minister tell us how many trees were cut down or otherwise lost in, like, forest fires, things like that? Mr. Nesbitt: Our de partment doesn't report on number of trees; it's by area and volume harvested. So, these are preliminary numbers for '22-23. We think they're pretty close, but they're not completely final yet. We harvested trees over 7,976 hect ares of land across Manitoba, and the company's harvested 1,116,579 cubic metres.

MLA Lindsey: So, we keep track of the number of trees we plant, and we keep track of the area of trees that are lost, so can the minister explain how we know if we're keeping up with the number of trees lost as opposed to the number of trees planted? Mr. Nesbitt: I'm going to try to convey the infor ma- tion I was just told. Again, we set limits of harvest by geographical areas based on the ecological capacity of the forests in those areas. And that becomes annual allowable limits for forest companies to cut.

So, from 2016 to 2020, over 27 million trees were planted through out Manitoba and 80,000 hectares received certificates of forest renewal. That's ensuring that those fore sts have trees planted and in order to renew what they had harvested. So, we–I guess the bottom line is, we are planting more trees than we're harvesting but we don't have a number of trees we're harvesting, just cubic metres and volume. MLA Lindsey: I'll have to digest all that and then maybe come back to that for further clarification, and maybe the minister needs further clarification, too, as we go.

So, can the minister tell us if his de partment is currently in talks to sign more revenue sharing agree- ments with any of the Indigenous com munities, First Nations? Mr. Nesbitt: So, just for a little back ground here, in April of 2022, the De partment of Natural Resources and Northern Dev elopment began negotiations with First Nations in Manitoba here towards a pilot timber dues revenue sharing agree ment. The mandate our department had was to allow for up to 45 per cent of timber dues revenue to be shared under the agree - ments.

So, in–after year 1, we–well, in year 1, we focused on areas with large forestry operations, as well–or at the time, and with long-term licences pending. * (15:10) So, we–total of two, four, six, eight, 10, 12– we offered a revenue sharing agreement to 13 First Nations. And to date, we've signed six–seven MOUs. We've signed six agreements. So, the MOU precedes the memorandum of agreement . So, seven MOUs, six agreements. We've also had discussions with two other First Nations and we're looking forward to hearing back from them. Again, this is some thing that's certainl y not forced upon First Nations.

It's sharing timber dues with First Nations as a sign of recon ciliation, recog- nition that these trees were harvested on their tradi - tional territories. MLA Lindsey: Can the minister tell us what First Nations he's got si gned agreements with and which ones are still waiting? Or still in progress? Mr. Nesbitt: Certainly, I'd be happy to share the information of the ones we've signed agreements with. It's public information and I think they're very proud of the fact that they signed with us. Where possible, we were up at their First Nations and were welcomed with open arms.

Had some ceremonies and things like that. And treated to some good hospitality and food while we were up there. So, we're looking forward to signing more. So, agreements we've signed is with Chemawawin Cree Nation–do you want me to go slow so you can write? Opaskwayak Cree Nation; Minegoziibe Anishinabe; Mosakahiken Cree Nation–I know you'll know the spelling of all these, too, so; Sapotaweyak Cree Nation; Wuskwi Sipihk First Nation. That should be the six that we signed MOUs and MOAs with. We have an MOU signed with the Norway House Cree Nation.

MLA Lindsey: The minister said in his previous answer that you had seven signed MOUs. So far you've given us the name of one of them. Mr. Nesbitt: I just want to be clear that with the six that you wrote down there, the first six, we signed MOUs–memorandum of understanding. We did more discussions with them, hammered out the memorandum of agreement, which was the triggering document to send the timber dues to those First Nations.

1996 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 So there's six that have signed both. Norway House Cree Nation has just signed the MOU at this point. MLA Lindsey: Thank you for that. My mis under- standing. Which nations have you not got any kind of MOUs or signed agreements with? Mr. Nesbitt: As I indicated in one of my other answers, there was 13. And I think the member will appreciate, though, those 13 nations are basically in the North and west of Manitoba, wher e a lot of the work is being done on traditional lands.

So I'd be happy to give him the other –the names of the other six if he'd like to write them down. We've sent them letters. We've followed up with letters. We're having ongoing discussions with some of them. And, you know, we certainly –it's our intent to sign MOUs and MOAs with any First Nation that wants to sign with us. But, again, it's no pressure. It's tailoring the MOU and MOA to their liking as well. I mean, our offer is to share revenue dues if they have some other things in there that they –wording that they don't like or whatever.

We're always open to changing wording and things to ensure that our First Nations are satisfied with anything before they sign it, so. Are you ready to go? We got the Mathias Colomb Cree Nation. Misipawistik Cree Nation. Nisichawayasihk Cree Nation. Pimicikamak Cree Nation. Sagkeeng First Nation. And this is a tough one: Tootinaowaziibeeng treat reserve; TTR for short. MLA Lindsey: Thank you. Appreciate that. So, we've talked about some revenue sharing agreements in regards to forestry.

Has there been any discussion on revenue sharing agree ments with any other resource things particular to First Nations com- munities? Mineral, one thing and the other. Mr. Nesbitt: Well, we're certainly interested in expand- ing our revenue sharing on timber dues with, you know, First Nations in the Interlake, the eastern area of Manitoba here, moving forward. It's an encourage- ment to them, as well, to help support the forest industries that might want to establish in those areas, if they know that the–they're–they got some economic benefit coming back to them besides the jobs and things like that.

So, as the member will know, I'm–my department is not responsible for mining anymore, so I certainly can't speak to mining. I mean, I think it's–you know, I think this model has shown that it works. And it's certainly been appreciated by every First Nation that I've met and talked to about this. And, you know, I want to say that I have a great relationship with all these chiefs and councils now. And, you know, have their personal cellphones on speed dial.

It's kind of nice to be able to talk to them about common concerns as well. * (15:20) And, you know, a lot of these First Nations are considering how they're going to lose their–how they're going to use their timber to use money, whether it's for economic development or for the good of their citi - zens. I mean, they're always looking for jobs for their people, and a lot of them have thoughts of, you know, creating businesses and things like that to help support the forest industry. So we're really excited by this, and we think it's a model that, you know, is a–like I said to them, it's been a long time coming.

It should have happened before, but it's happening now. And I think that Manitoba's being recognized on the national stage here for what we're doing in terms of sharing with our First Nations. So I'm very proud of the work our forestry depart- ment's done, and our gov ernment's done in terms of recognizing the fact that we need to share reve nues with First Nations on their traditional lands.

MLA Lindsey: So, one of the things in the Estimates book for your department, under key initiatives, is to continue to s upport the drafting and dev elopment of mineral-development-consultation-protocol agreements with First Nations in Manitoba. So, is the minister now saying that that's not his department or is it just that that hasn't been done yet? Is someone doing it? Is it fallen off the map? What's happening with that? Mr. Nesbitt: So, when the reorganization happened in February of this year and mining moved over to Economic Development, Investment and Trade, parks came into Natural Resources.

But what was left with us was the con sultation unit that works with First Nations in terms of, you know, doing work on consul- tation and things with First Nations. So that unit, under our de partment, still works – does work for EDIT in terms of the mining indus try. But NRND does not have the mining industry under our portfolio. You would have to talk to Minister Wharton in Estimates about mining and what their plans are moving forward in terms of any type of

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1997 revenue sharing in mining, you know, when mines are eventually built here in Manitoba on traditional territories. So what I'm saying is, our consul tation unit sup- ports the work of NRND in terms of consultation with, you know, fish, wildlife, forestry, things like that, and also supports EDIT in terms of mining. MLA Lindsey: Well, that seems somewhat confusing. The consultation unit is part of your de partment, but you only consult on some things, not on others.

Is it that you don't consult on mineral revenue sharing agreements or anything to–somebody else does that? Is that what I'm understanding? Mr. Nesbitt: I guess the easiest way to explain it is the con sultation unit is shared between EDIT and NRND, but the consul tation unit falls under my purview. But they do work for the mining sector under EDIT, which is not under my control at all; nothing to do with mining is–I'm not responsible for anything. But if we need to consult with First Nations on forestry, wildlife, anything like that, we call on the consultation unit.

If EDIT needs to consult on mining, needs to have them consult with First Nations, that unit's at their disposal as well. That unit had to be put somewhere. It had to be under some minister. It was under my ministry; it stayed here. So, like I say, the mining branch moved over to EDIT in the February reorganization. MLA Lindsey: This question may be 'amov' –above the minister's pay grade, but why did mining go from the resource development portfolio to something else? Mr. Nesbitt: I think the member's likely co rrect. It was above my pay grade, but I think it certainly made sense, moving forward.

Mining is much more than just exploration and things, and it's going to need plenty of horsepower to develop mining in the North, and I think it's better suited under Economic Development. We worked hand in hand with Economic Development, anyways, when I had mining, and I think moving over there was a natural fit. And in return, you know, we receive parks, which I think was a natural fit into Natural Resources. So, it's–yes, it was, I guess, a marriage made in heaven. MLA Lindsey: Well, apparently it was a marriage made somewhere.

So, just one more question, I think, on the forestry end of things–no, maybe a couple. What about peatlands? Does that fall under thi s ministry or is that somewhere else? So, if peatlands is part of this min istry, how many consul tations have you had? And are there any MOUs in place, parti - cularly with First Nations on peatlands development? * (15:30) Mr. Nesbitt: Yes, we are r esponsible for peatlands here in Manitoba. The Peatlands Stewardship Act was recently proclaimed.

You know, as the member likely knows, you know, most of the peat production is in the Interlake or eastern Manitoba here, and there hasn't been a lot of in dustry expansion over the years. I mean, it's certainly a product that we do produce in Manitoba and we do export as well. You know, if there is any expansion on this, you know, we certainly have a duty to consult with our First Nations on any expansion of the industry there. What we have done is put in place a couple of prov - incially significant peatlands, protecting them, so that there's, you know, no harvesting of peatland in those areas.

We've worked with Wuskwi Sipihk First Nation on the one, which is called Moswa–'meadols'–Meadows. And the other one that we've protected recently, or deemed a provincially significant peatland, and it has protections, is Fish Lake Fen. So, these peatlands have the ability to store carbon and are a very important part of our ecological network here in Manitoba, I guess. MLA Lindsey: So, I assume from the minister's answer then, there's no plan to enter into any kind of discussion about revenue sharing with existing peatland opera - tions; only if there's some ex pansion of peatland operations? Mr.

Nesbitt: I'm certainly learning a lot about peat - lands in the last little while. I've focused, as you can see, I focused on forestry a lot and then mining in my first eight months as minister. So peatlands are kind of, you know, something that I'm getting familiar with here, and I hope to go out to some peatlands this spring and just see how they work. And it's kind of interesting; I've lived in Manitoba 65 years and I've never been to a peatland. So it's going to be an eye-opener for me, I think.

So I just want to tell you about a few companies we have here in Manitoba: we've got Sun Gro; we got Tetrault [phonetic]; we got Reimer; we got FPM; we got Jiffy; we got Berger; we got Sunterra; and we got Lambert. There ar e all those companies here in

1998 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 Manitoba and, you know, in 2022, I guess, total volume was 1,548,149 cubic metres of peat. And that would fill a lot of garden centres, I imagine, with bags of peat moss, right, as you can appreciate. I'm sure the member for Flin Flon's (MLA Lindsey) a gardener, like me, in his spare time up there, and likely buys some of this good Manitoba product from time to time, so. But, you know, Manitoba only got a total of $167,200 in royalties off of all that peat. So, I mean, we–you know, we're certainly not against sharing revenues moving forward.

I mean, I think that's some- thing that's open for discussion especially as the industry expands and First Nations may perhaps get more involved in this on their traditional territories and things like that. So, you know, again, it's–I mean it's–the volume is significant. The royalties Manitoba collects really isn't, at this point. So, in fact, I was talking to my staff and saying, you know, it likely just pays for our staff people, basically, these royalties. So, you know, we're looking at expanding the industry where possible, and I guess everything's on the table.

MLA Lindsey: So then the answer is there's no plan to have any kind of revenue sharing discussions with any First Nations upon whose land somebody's existing peat operations presently exist? Mr. Nesbitt: I think I just said that everything's on the table and I certainly –you know, that, certainly, that we'll consult with and decide what we're going to do. We've been–certainly, we got a good start in forestry here, and there's certainly–you know, there's certainly an opportunity here moving forward that we'll investi- gate, and we'll work with our First Nation partners and, like I say, everything's on the table.

MLA Lindsey: I do believe, let me just check–what's the current vacancy rate within the Forestry and Peatlands division of your department? Mr. Nesbitt: The current full-time equivalent vacancies is–sits at 14. MLA Lindsey: Well, there's currently 14 vacanci es. What's the total complement of full-time equivalents? Mr. Nesbitt: The '23-24 budget Estimates show that there's 46 full -time equivalents in Forestry and Peatlands. MLA Lindsey: Has that 46 number been constant over the last few years or has the budgeted number of workers in that department gone down, gone up? Mr.

Nesbitt: Year over year, the 46 number has re - mained consistent. MLA Lindsey: I thank the minister for that. So, just one quick question before we leave forestry: Where does the Province p rocure all the seedlings that it uses? * (15:40) Mr. Nesbitt: So, I'm told here that we put it out to open tender back in, I guess, 2022, and a company by the name of PRT won the tender –a five-year tender. A lot of their trees are grown in Saskatchewan, come here into Manitoba. I think it's important that we had a long-term con- tract for trees.

As you know, you know, we entered into an agreement with the federal gov ernment, too, as part of the 2 Billion Trees initiative here in Canada, where we'll be planting trees, working in conjunction with municipalities and hopefully the City of Winnipeg and things like that in terms of planting trees as well. So, we need a certainty of tree supply, because a lot of other jurisdictions in Canada want trees too. So, we thought it advisable to go out to tender. And I'm pleased that we have a five- year tender, and we'll have supplies until 2027.

MLA Lindsey: Once upon a time, the Manitoba gov- ernment owned a tree nursery that this gov ernment privatized into oblivion, because it no longer produces anything. Is there some reason why it was felt that getting rid of a provincially owned entity that grew trees when we have a commitment to plant more trees –why was it gotten rid of, and now we're forced to tender to other jurisdictions–supply employment, income and every- thing else to out-of-province entities? Mr.

Nesbitt: I think if the member wants to tart–start talking about privatizing here, maybe he could explain to me, as well, if I gave him an answ er on why he decided to priva tize the property registry under the previous NDP government. Houses are still being sold, land is still being transacted in Manitoba. Obviously, it was a busi ness decision at that point –I assume, unless the member wants to give me an answer for that.

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1999 MLA Lindsey: It's unfortunate that the minister takes exception to questions about priva tizing things. I get that previous governments also privatized things like the minister's alluded to; however, those jobs are still in Manitoba.

In this case, the minister's government privatized an entity that shut down, produces absolutely no revenue for Manitoba, provides absolutely no jobs for Manitoba and, instead, contracts out what could have been a very good busi ness in Man itoba; privatizes it, con - tracts it out to an out- of-province entity that hires workers not in this province, pays taxes not in this province, the workers pay taxes not in this province. How does that make a–business sense, looking at what the government wants to do–or, claims to want to do, around economic development? This seems to be completely the opposite. Mr.

Nesbitt: I think the member will know that I was not the minister when there was any decision to not continue to move forward with the Pineland nursery here in eastern Manitoba. It's my understanding that, you know, there was a lot of capital expenditures that would be needed to keep that operation going when we came into govern- ment in 2016. And, you know, I think that it was inefficient. And we decided that, you know, the right way would be to go to market, make sure we had a certainty of supply.

And, of course, the member knows that, you know, we can't just put out tenders here in Manitoba and give preference to Manitoba suppliers. We 're in a world - wide marketplace here. We're part of the New West Partnership, meaning it's required that tenders go out to any suppliers. And, you know, Manitoba suppliers could bid on this contract as well. So, the tendering doesn't preclude anybody f rom bidding. It was –so happened that PRT won the con- tract and uses trees from Saskatchewan.

Our de part- ment's very happy with the certainty of supply to ensure we have trees to fulfill our obligations to our First Nations and to the federal government as part of the $2-billion tree initiative. MLA Lindsey: To my way of thinking, and I under - stand the minister wasn't the minister at the time that some of these decisions got made, but would it not have made more sense to invest some in an existing resource that we had here?

Potentially even create a business opportunity for some First Nations to expand what was there pre - viously so that a made -in-Manitoba solution could have been found, even within the confines of the New West Partnership that–I'll point out to the minister – that was his gov ernment that signed on to the New West Part nership, which is one of the things that previous gov ernment was concerned about was the loss of jobs that would come along with that. And now, here's a prime example of that.

Would it not have made more sense to do the economic development in Manitoba, for Manitobans, to create jobs, to create wealth, to create every thing that we need in Manitoba? Mr. Nesbitt: It's good to hear the member recognize the New West Partnership because I remember–I don't know if it was him, but a lot of his colleagues back there in '16 or '17 were indicating that it didn't even exist. Now the member has said today the previous government was concerned about signing on to it. So, obviously, it did exist, so I'm pleased that he's acknowledged it today.

I think the New West Partnership works all three ways here in the prairies because, you know, Manitoba firms can bid on contracts in Saskatchewan. There's no preference giving t o certain provinces. I think it's a wide open, you know, western Canadian market now for products. And we're helping each other as neighbours in terms of, you know, the contracts that are won in each province. So–and again, you know, I wasn't privy to discus- sions on the nursery at the time and, you know, I just know that I'm sure a lot of due diligence went into that decision before it was made and a lot of things were considered.

So, I mean, we're talking history now. That's five or six years ago. Our forestry service has moved on and signed contracts here that ensure that we have trees today, tomorrow and into the future. MLA Lindsey: Can the minister tell us what all other private entities put in for this tendered position of planting–or supplying trees? Was there any Manitoba entities that were part of that process? * (15:50) Mr. Nesbitt: I think that, you know, when bids are put out here in Manitoba, they go out through our procure- ment arm, through Consumer Protection and Govern- ment Services.

That might be a better question to ask them at Estimates, in terms of, you know, if you want

2000 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 to know the bidders on certain contracts. I think it's a question for Minister Teitsma when you have Estimates in–with CPGS. Mr. Chairperson: I would just like to remind all members that we must refer to members by their title or their constituency. MLA Lindsey: I can't says that I'm exactly satisfied with that answer, that the minister seems to know that a company from Saskatchewan won the tender, but can't tell me if there was any Manitoba companies actually in the process; can't tell me if there were any other companies in the process.

I mean, that's –it's somewhat lacking, that answer, sorry to say. I had hoped that maybe the minister, maybe another day, can provide more clarity on that parti - cular question, but for now I think we'll shift over and talk some about parks. So, my first question is: Does the minister plan to raise park fees? Mr. Nesbitt: I certainly had an easy answer for that, but I wanted to remind the member of the December 22nd news release that was issued by our gov ernment. I don't know if he has a copy of that there. If so, he can go back in like we just did and find it.

The fourth paragraph, this is talking about the Travel Manitoba report that we commissioned MNP to do on prov incial parks with–it comes with lots of recommendations and things, but the previous minister has a basic–I guess you can quote him here in the fourth paragraph. He says: The Manitoba government is not consid ering any changes to park entry and camping fees at this time. Further to that, I'm going to say, to be clear, parks fees are not going up this year. The parks evaluation study was received by gov ernment but hasn't been endorsed or promoted as pol icy yet.

And, you know, we've certainly been con sistent all along that there's no changes to camping or park entry fees. But what the Travel Manitoba study does show is that Manitobans enjoy less expensive access to parks than in many other jurisdictions here across Canada. MLA Lindsey: So, the minister talked about things like entry and camping fees. Will there be any increase in other fees or will there be fees charged for other things that are presently free in the parks? Mr. Len Isleifson, Acting Chairperson, in the Chair Mr.

Nesbitt: So, I don't know what the member's getting at by any other rates or things like that. I mean, we have park entry fees, we have camping fees, we have commercial lease fees for our operators there. There's no changes to commercial lease rates. I think the member will note that last week we signed a very im portant MOU with the Manitoba provincial parks cottage owners association, which represents 6,200 members here across Canada.

Certainly exciting to sign that MO U with them that will take a look at working in col laboration with them in terms of figuring out fair and transparent lease fees, service fees, things like that moving forward. And again, I say in collaboration; this isn't a top-down approach, this is working together with them. That's what that MOU signifies. The current lease deal, I guess, expired a couple years ago, and in the interim, we did increase their fees by 2 per cent a year in '21 and '22.

This year, with the signing of the MOUs, we've frozen the rates so that we can certainly discuss with them in good faith, moving forward, what should be done in terms of lease fees for properties in provincial parks and for service fees like garbage collection, you know, water, sewer, things like that. So, very excited to work with this fine group of individuals at MPPCOA. They're always–they're open to discussions and they understand that, you know – they love the park, obviously. They have their, you know, seasonal residence, sometimes full-time residences in the park.

And so, like I say, we look forward to working with them over the next little while to come to an agreement that's satisfactory to both parties. MLA Lindsey: One of the things that I know, parti - cularly in the North, we've seen in the last couple years is firewood used to be supplied free of charge in the parks in the North. Now there's a fee attached; you have to pay for firewood. So, are there other things like that that the minis- ter's department is contemplating charging fees for?

And is there any sense that that is spread through out the entire province, or is that specific to northern Manitoba? * (16:00) Mr. Chairperson in the Chair Mr. Nesbitt: You know, our park fees, like I said, are certainly amongst the lowest in Cana da. I think that

April 27, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2001 so-called FIPPA document you gave me the other day reflected that. I think that the FIPPA of the public document showed that these fees were pretty low and, you know, I think for–I think the member was maybe misleading the House a little bit there in terms of say- ing we were going to do increases to park fees and things where all it was showing was a differential between the average in Canada and what we charge.

So, you know, we certainly want to keep our park fees as low as possible to encourage more Manitobans to visit our provincial parks, and, you know, that's our goal moving forward. We're looking forward to, you know, to budgeting more money for repairs and infra- structures–our infrastructure in parks–to provide more opportunities for Manitobans to get out and enjoy the parks, moving forward.

MLA Lindsey: I guess one of the other things that was in that freedom of information that I tabled in the House the other day and in the actual report itself that I read when it was publicly available was –and don't quote me; this is not a direct quote–but it talked about fees being competitive with private parks, which the minister would probably agree that private parks, private entities, are there specifically to make money, so they charge more.

Is it the intent of this government, of this depart- ment, to change fees for various things, whether it's park entry, campsites, yurts rentals, cabin rentals, any of those other things we've talked of? Is it the intent, as was alluded t o in that report, to make those fees competitive, in quotation marks, with the private system? Mr. Nesbitt: I think, you know, any good government would be remiss if they didn't do their due diligence and, you know, take a look at other juris dictions across Canada, look at private entities and things to see what they're doing in the private space compared to the public space.

And I think that's what that report from Travel Manitoba indicates, is that, you know, Manitoba's camping fees, various fees in there, are much lower than some jurisdictions and I guess lower than the Canadian average. And that's why you com - mission reports, to take a look at things like that. And there's much more in the report, though, than just talking about fees. There's certainly–it talks about opportunities and things moving forward. So, you know, we're going to digest that report and take a look at it.

I think you're going to see some, you know, a lot of good news here over the next few weeks coming into parks, and I think that what our goal is, is to ensure that we have the best possible ex- perience for Manitobans and, indeed, Canadians or US visitors that come to Manitoba, that they can explore our beautiful parks and ensure we have the infrastructure–campsites, yurts and things like that – available when people want them. Because I think the member knows that, you know, there's a huge demand, especially for certain commodities within our parks, like yurts and service campsites and things like that.

And I think that, moving forward, we're going to consider–we're going to continue to expand those services for the good of the province so we can serve our citizens to the best of our ability. MLA Lindsey: The reason I'm asking this line of questions, and certainly the minister and I have had conversations about such things, is I want to ensure that Manitobans have the best possible experience for camping. But it can't be just for those people that have money. It has to be the best possible experience for all Manitobans, which is the whole basis of these questions.

And I know already, I alluded to the fact that you have to pay for firewood now. Are there other things within the parks that presently are provided at no charge that the minister is contemplating charging a fee for? Mr. Nesbitt: Well, I completely agree with the member that we want to keep our parks cost effective so any Manitoban can visit a park and not feel like they, you know, they're having money ripped out of their wallets and things like that. And to that end, our park fees are amongst the lowest in Canada right now, and we want to continue keeping them low.

There's certainly no indication here that, you know, we're going to start charging for anything else at this point. I mean there's–no, I would say no, there's nothing else. I mean, firewood, you talked about fire- wood; but I mean, I guess–but our–again, I just think that Manitobans want the ability to enjoy our parks, like you say; it shouldn't be something for the elite. It should be the average Manitoban that can go out and enjoy their park, and we want to continue to create better experiences in parks for Manitobans, whether that be interpretive programs or more campsites and more yurts, things like that.

The demand is there, and we wa nt to satisfy that demand.

2002 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 27, 2023 MLA Lindsey: Does the minister have any plans to sell off any of our publicly owned parks? Mr. Nesbitt: I think the previous minister must've answered this question a dozen times in the House, likely, last year, before I became minister. And the answer was always parks are not for sale. I've kind of added a tagline to that. I said, parks are not for sale, but they're open for business.

MLA Lindsey: Well, we know that this government, and prior to this minister being the minister responsi- ble, did lease a park to a private entity, which then immediately cost people more money to go and tend to–[interjection] Campground? I stand corrected, it was a campground. Campground. So we know that that's already taken place. Does the minister contemplate leasing any other services – entities within a park, such as a campground, to any private entity? * (16:10) Mr. Nesbitt: We certainly have no plans to enter into any commercial leases for campgrounds.

MLA Lindsey: What about services or entities within the campgrounds? Does the minister have any plans to lease out or contract out things like boat docks, or anything like that? Mr. Nesbitt: Sorry for taking so much time on that answer; I wanted to be clear on it, that we do have partnerships in place with certain, you know, private entities here in Manitoba for certain things like a campground, like you say. There's no plans to further that at this point. I mean, we're always open to looking at the possibility of, you know, expandi ng services for Manitobans at places where it makes sense.

So, I mean, there's no plans at this point, but I think any of the partnerships we've created so far have made sense in terms of, you know, whether the campground be isolated and better operated by a private operator, things like that. I mean, it's–there's no great grandiose plan here to privatize anything –any major portions of Manitoba parks at all. We want to keep them public. We want to expand our parks in terms of infrastructure expansion and improvements and ensure that the public has a great experience when they're in these parks.

MLA Lindsey: So, I know that in at least one park in Manitoba, a boat launch where local citizens used to go and launch their boat, was free access. Then the lessee of the area put a chain across. And then you had to go and pay the lessee to launch your boat at a boat launch that was built and paid for by the people of Manitoba. Does the minister see that as problematic? And is there a plan to do more of tha t leasing that costs Manitobans more money when it didn't cost the lessee any money because the infrastructure was already there? Mr.

Nesbitt: Can the member maybe provide more detail on what lake or what campground or park he's referring to at this point ? So I can, you know, try to find some details for you today or get back to you with an answer. MLA Lindsey: Yes, I certainly can. It's Bakers Narrows park, Lake Athapap. And the chain went up a couple of years ago. A goodly portion of people refused to pay, and rightfully so. * (16:20) Mr.

Nesbitt: So, you know, certainly we want parks to be accessible here in Manitoba and, you know, my staff's trying to find out specifics about the one park you're talking about out of our 92 here, where you say this incident is happening. I'm not sure. I can't give you an answer at this point, but I don't know if you want to move on at this point and we'll see what we can find before 5 o'clock.

MLA Lindsey: The minister can take it as an under - taking and get back to me whenever, but while he's in that process, perhaps he could have his staff look and see if there's any other instances of something similar to that taking place. And then, so, then my next question would be, are there any plans to allow lessees to limit access to things within a park like that, other than what's already there? Is it the in tention to allow a lessee to make money off of infra structure that was put in plac

Document details

Collection	Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	42-5-49b
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	42nd 5th hansardpdf 49b.pdf
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	314e74b47cdf06cfdfe3fd0297d3ca2bbbff7f17

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