Alberta Hansard — 30 May 2012, Afternoon sitting (13:30) (Legislature 28, Session 1)

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Alberta — Debates (Hansard)

Province of Alberta The 28th Legislature First Session Alberta Hansard Wednesday, May 30, 2012 Issue 5 The Honourable Gene Zwozdesky, Speaker

Legislative Assembly of Alberta The 28th Legislature First Session Zwozdesky, Hon. Gene, Edmonton-Mill Creek (PC), Speaker Rogers, George, Leduc-Beaumont (PC), Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees Jablonski, Mary Anne, Red Deer-North (PC), Deputy Chair of Committees Allen, Mike, Fort McMurray-Wood Buffalo (PC) Amery, Moe, Calgary-East (PC) Anderson, Rob, Airdrie (W), Official Opposition House Leader Anglin, Joe, Rimbey-Rocky Mountain House-Sundre (

W) Barnes, Drew, Cypress-Medicine Hat (

W) Bhardwaj, Naresh, Edmonton-Ellerslie (PC) Bhullar, Hon. Manmeet Singh, Calgary-Greenway (PC) Bikman, Gary, Cardston-Taber-Warner (

W) Bilous, Deron, Edmonton-Beverly-Clareview (ND) Blakeman, Laurie, Edmonton-Centre (AL), Liberal Opposition House Leader Brown, Dr. Neil, QC, Calgary-Mackay-Nose Hill (PC) Calahasen, Pearl, Lesser Slave Lake (PC) Campbell, Hon. Robin, West Yellowhead (PC), Deputy Government House Leader Cao, Wayne C.N., Calgary-Fort (PC) Casey, Ron, Banff-Cochrane (PC) Cusanelli, Hon. Christine, Calgary-Currie (PC) Dallas, Hon. Cal, Red Deer-South (PC) DeLong, Alana, Calgary-Bow (PC) Denis, Hon. Jonathan, QC, Calgary-Acadia (PC), Deputy Government House Leader Donovan, Ian, Little Bow (

W) Dorward, David C., Edmonton-Gold Bar (PC) Drysdale, Hon. Wayne, Grande Prairie-Wapiti (PC) Eggen, David, Edmonton-Calder (ND), New Democrat Opposition Whip Fawcett, Hon. Kyle, Calgary-Klein (PC) Fenske, Jacquie, Fort Saskatchewan-Vegreville (PC) Forsyth, Heather, Calgary-Fish Creek (

W) Fox, Rodney M., Lacombe-Ponoka (

W) Fraser, Rick, Calgary-South East (PC) Fritz, Yvonne, Calgary-Cross (PC) Goudreau, Hector G., Dunvegan-Central Peace-Notley (PC) Griffiths, Hon. Doug, Battle River-Wainwright (PC) Hale, Jason W., Strathmore-Brooks (

W) Hancock, Hon. Dave, QC, Edmonton-Whitemud (PC), Government House Leader Hehr, Kent, Calgary-Buffalo (AL) Horne, Hon. Fred, Edmonton-Rutherford (PC) Horner, Hon. Doug, Spruce Grove-St. Albert (PC) Hughes, Hon. Ken, Calgary-West (PC) Jansen, Sandra, Calgary-North West (PC) Jeneroux, Matt, Edmonton-South West (PC) Johnson, Hon. Jeff, Athabasca-Sturgeon-Redwater (PC) Johnson, Linda, Calgary-Glenmore (PC) Kang, Darshan S., Calgary-McCall (AL), Liberal Opposition Whip Kennedy-Glans, Donna, Calgary-Varsity (PC) Khan, Hon. Stephen, St. Albert (PC) Klimchuk, Hon.

Heather, Edmonton-Glenora (PC) Kubinec, Maureen, Barrhead-Morinville-Westlock (PC) Lemke, Ken, Stony Plain (PC) Leskiw, Genia, Bonnyville-Cold Lake (PC) Luan, Jason, Calgary-Hawkwood (PC) Lukaszuk, Hon. Thomas A., Edmonton-Castle Downs (PC) Mason, Brian, Edmonton-Highlands-Norwood (ND), Leader of the New Democrat Opposition McAllister, Bruce, Chestermere-Rocky View (W), Official Opposition Deputy Whip McDonald, Everett, Grande Prairie-Smoky (PC) McIver, Hon. Ric, Calgary-Hays (PC), Deputy Government House Leader McQueen, Hon.

Diana, Drayton Valley-Devon (PC) Notley, Rachel, Edmonton-Strathcona (ND), New Democrat Opposition House Leader Oberle, Hon. Frank, Peace River (PC) Olesen, Cathy, Sherwood Park (PC) Olson, Hon. Verlyn, QC, Wetaskiwin-Camrose (PC) Pastoor, Bridget Brennan, Lethbridge-East (PC) Pedersen, Blake, Medicine Hat (

W) Quadri, Sohail, Edmonton-Mill Woods (PC) Quest, Dave, Strathcona-Sherwood Park (PC) Redford, Hon. Alison M., QC, Calgary-Elbow (PC), Premier Rodney, Hon. Dave, Calgary-Lougheed (PC) Rowe, Bruce, Olds-Didsbury-Three Hills (

W) Sandhu, Peter, Edmonton-Manning (PC) Sarich, Janice, Edmonton-Decore (PC) Saskiw, Shayne, Lac La Biche-St. Paul-Two Hills (W), Official Opposition Deputy House Leader Scott, Hon. Donald, QC, Fort McMurray-Conklin (PC) Sherman, Dr. Raj, Edmonton-Meadowlark (AL), Leader of the Liberal Opposition Smith, Danielle, Highwood (W), Leader of the Official Opposition Starke, Dr. Richard, Vermilion-Lloydminster (PC) Stier, Pat, Livingstone-Macleod (

W) Strankman, Rick, Drumheller-Stettler (

W) Swann, Dr. David, Calgary-Mountain View (AL) Towle, Kerry, Innisfail-Sylvan Lake (W), Official Opposition Whip VanderBurg, Hon. George, Whitecourt-Ste. Anne (PC) Weadick, Hon. Greg, Lethbridge-West (PC) Webber, Len, Calgary-Foothills (PC) Wilson, Jeff, Calgary-Shaw (

W) Woo-Paw, Hon. Teresa, Calgary-Northern Hills (PC) Xiao, David H., Edmonton-McClung (PC) Young, Steve, Edmonton-Riverview (PC), Government Whip Party standings: Progressive Conservative: 61 Wildrose: 17 Alberta Liberal: 5 New Democrat: 4 Officers and Officials of the Legislative Assembly W.J. David McNeil, Clerk Robert H. Reynolds, QC, Law Clerk/ Director of Interparliamentary Relations Shannon Dean, Senior Parliamentary Counsel/Director of House Services Stephanie LeBlanc, Parliamentary Counsel and Legal Research Officer Philip Massolin, Committee Research Co-ordinator Brian G.

Hodgson, Sergeant-at-Arms Chris Caughell, Assistant Sergeant-at-Arms Gordon H. Munk, Assistant Sergeant-at-Arms Liz Sim, Managing Editor of Alberta Hansard

Executive Council Alison Redford Premier, Pres ident of Executive Council Thomas Lukaszuk Deputy Premier Manmeet Singh Bhullar Minist er of Service Alberta Robin Campbell Minister of Aboriginal Relations Christine Cusanelli Minister of Tourism, Parks and Recreation Cal Dallas Minister of Internationa l and Intergovernmental Relations Jonathan Denis Minister of Justice and Solicitor General Wayne Drysdale Minister of Infrastructure Kyle Fawcett Associate Minister of Finance Doug Griffiths Minister of Municipal Affairs Dave Hancock Minister of Human Services Fred Horne Minister of Health Doug Horner President of Treasury Board and Minister of Finance Ken Hughes Minister of Energy Jeff Johnson Minister of Education Stephen Khan Minister of Enterprise and Advanced Education Heather Klimchuk Minister of Culture Ric McIver Minister of Transportation Diana McQueen Minister of Environment and Sustainable Resource Development Frank Oberle Associate Minister of Services for Persons with Disabilities Verlyn Olson Minister of Agri culture and Rural Development Dave Rodney Associate Minister of Wellness Donald Scott Associate Minister of Account ability, Transparency and Transformation George VanderBurg Associate Minister of Seniors Greg Weadick Associate Minister of Municipal Affairs Teresa Woo-Paw Associate Minister of Inte rnational and Intergovernmental Relations

STANDING AND SPECIAL COMMITTEES OF THE LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF ALBERTA Standing Committee on Alberta’s Economic Future Chair: Mr. Amery Deputy Chair: Mr. Bikman Bhardwaj Blakeman Donovan Dorward Eggen Fenske Goudreau Hehr Jansen Luan McDonald Olesen Quadri Quest Rogers Sandhu Sherman Smith Starke Strankman Towle Young Vacant Standing Committee on the Alberta Heritage Savings Trust Fund Chair: Mr. Quest Deputy Chair: Mrs. Jablonski Anderson Casey Dorward Eggen Kubinec Sandhu Sherman Standing Committee on Families and Communities Chair: Ms Pastoor Deputy Chair: Mrs.

Forsyth Allen DeLong Fox Fraser Fritz Jablonski Jansen Jeneroux Johnson, L. Kang Kubinec Lemke Leskiw Luan McAllister Notley Pedersen Sarich Saskiw Swann Wilson Young Vacant Standing Committee on Legislative Offices Chair: Mr. Xiao Deputy Chair: Mr. McDonald Bikman Blakeman Brown DeLong Eggen Leskiw Quadri Rogers Wilson Special Standing Committee on Members’ Services Chair: Mr. Zwozdesky Deputy Chair: Mr. Young Calahasen Dorward Forsyth Goudreau Jablonski Mason Quest Sherman Smith Standing Committee on Private Bills Chair: Mr. Cao Deputy Chair: Ms L.

Johnson Barnes Bhardwaj Brown DeLong Fox Fritz Goudreau Jeneroux Kennedy-Glans Luan Notley Olesen Pastoor Rowe Sarich Starke Strankman Swann Webber Standing Committee on Privileges and Elections, Standing Orders and Printing Chair: Dr. Starke Deputy Chair: Mr. Lemke Allen Amery Bhardwaj Casey Hehr Jansen Jeneroux Johnson, L. Kennedy-Glans Kubinec McAllister McDonald Notley Pedersen Sandhu Saskiw Towle Xiao Young Standing Committee on Public Accounts Chair: Mr. Anderson Deputy Chair: Mr.

Dorward Allen Amery Anglin Bilous Calahasen DeLong Donovan Fenske Fraser Fritz Hale Hehr Kang Pastoor Quadri Sarich Starke Stier Webber Standing Committee on Resource Stewardship Chair: Ms Kennedy-Glans Deputy Chair: Mr. Rowe Anderson Anglin Barnes Bilous Blakeman Brown Calahasen Cao Casey Fenske Fraser Hale Hehr Johnson, L. Kubinec Lemke Leskiw Sandhu Stier Webber Xiao Young Vacant

May 30, 2012 Alberta Hansard 81 Legislative Assembly of Alberta Title: Wednesday, May 30, 2012 1:30 p.m. 1:30 p.m. Wednesday, May 30, 2012 [The Speaker in the chair] head: Prayers The Speaker: Hon. members, let us pray. Almighty God and Creator of the Universe, grant that we the members of our province’s Legislative Assembly fulfill our duties with honesty and integrity. May our first concern always be for the good of all our people, and let us be guided by these principles in our deliberations this day and always. Amen. Please be seated. head: Introduction of Visitors The Speaker: The hon. Deputy Premier. Mr.

Lukaszuk: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It’s indeed an honour and a pleasure to introduce to this House a good friend of this Legislative Assembly, of this government, and definitely of the province of Alberta, Federal Republic of Germany Consul General Hermann Sitz, who is accompanied today by a well -known Edmontonian of German heritage, Mr. Bernd Reuscher, the honorary consul of the Federal Republic of Germany. As all members of this Assembly know, Germany is a very important partner not only to Canada but to Alberta economically, academically, and culturally.

We are proud to have an Alberta office in Munich, Germany, as well. So any visit by any member of the consular corps of Germany is very welcome in thi s province. I would like to ask both the consul general and the honorary consul to rise and receive our gratitude and the warm welcome of this Assembly. The Speaker: Herzlich willkommen in Alberta. Welcome. head: Introduction of Guests The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Agriculture and Rural Develop- ment. Mr. Olson: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

It’s my pleasure today to introduce to you and through you to all members of the Assembly 28 bright young grade 6 students from my constituency. That’s Norwood elementary school in Wetaskiwin. They’re accompanied today by their teacher, Marcie Hofbauer, and parents Laurie Dahl - Perras, Cindy Johnson, and Sherri Scorah. These young students are keenly interested in the operation of government. I’m very glad to have them here today, and I want to congratulate their teacher and parents for encouraging that interest.

I hope they continue to have a great time here, and I’d ask that they rise and receive the traditional warm welcome of the Assembly. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Fort Saskatchewan-Vegreville. Ms Fenske: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to introduce to you and through you 74 visitors from James Mowatt elementary school in Fort Saskatchewan. They are here as part of their grade 6 curriculum and have loved their experience here. They are accompanied tod ay by their teachers, Miss Kristin Scott, Mrs. Barb Percy, Mr. Chris Bartsch, and Mrs. Trista Masterson, as well as one of their parents, Mr. Jon Duval.

I would like to ask them to rise – they should be on both sides of the Assembly – and receive our greeting. The Speaker: The hon. President of Treasury Board and Minister of Finance. Mr. Horner: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It’s an honour to rise and introduce to you and through you to members of the Assembly Mr. Chris Bourdeau and Mr. Nolan Sawatzky. Chris is t he assistant director of communications in Treasury Board and Finance, and he is accompanied by Nolan Sawatzky, who is a student in Grant MacEwan ’s public relations program.

Nolan is currently serving as a communications intern in the Ministry of Treasury Board and Finance. They are seated in the members’ gallery this afternoon, and I would ask that they rise and that we give them the warm welcome of this Assembly. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Vermilion-Lloydminster. Dr. Starke: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This afternoon it’s my pleasure to introduce to you and through you to members of the Assembly a group of 23 very bright, energetic, and photogenic students from Viking school who are visiting with us today. They are accompanied by their teacher and vice-principal, Mr.

Philip Brick, teacher’s aide Mrs. Wanda Lefsrud, and Mrs. Kim Beaumont. I met these students just a few minutes ago. They’re enjoying their visit here to the Legislative Assembly. I would ask that other members of the Assembly join me and give them the traditional warm welcome of the Assembly. The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Tourism, Parks and Recrea - tion. Ms Cusanelli: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to introduce to you and through you to members of this House two women who have been involved in promoting innovative education and life-long learning in the province.

First, the president of the Public School Boards’ Association of Alberta and a member of the board of trustees of Clearview public schools, Ms Patty Dittrick. Also, with Ms Dittrick is the executive director of the Public School Boards’ Association of Alberta, Ms Mary Lynne Campbell. I would ask that Ms Dittrick and Ms Campbell rise and receive the traditional warm welcome of this House. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Olds-Didsbury-Three Hills. Mr. Rowe: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. To you and through you it is a great pleasure to introduce some very dear family friends.

In politics we all know it takes sacrifice, and this family has given a great amount. For 28 straight days they lent me their father and their husband to manage my campaign, my successful campaign. I am grateful to them for this gift. Please help me welcome to the House today Porter, five; Paxton, three; and their mom, Tanya Cooper. The Speaker: The hon. Associate Minister of Seniors. Mr. VanderBurg: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It’s a pleasure to introduce to you and through you to all members of the Assembly four guests that are seated here in the members’ gallery.

Neil Pierce, Julia Daniluck, Julie and Joshua Kelndorfer are here today in recognition of MS Awareness Month, which has occurred through the month of May. Neil serves as president of the MS Society of Alberta and is familiar to members of this Assembly for

82 Alberta Hansard May 30, 2012 his contributions to the voluntary sector throughout Alberta. Julia was diagnosed with MS in the spring of 2002, and her team has raised almost half a million dollars since 2006. Julie serves as director of government and community relations for the MS Society of Alberta. Diagnosed with MS eight years ago, she is an active volunteer with the organization. Joshua is a student at Parkallen school and started a team in the Edmonton MS Walk in 2008 to raise money to find a cure for his mom. Since 2008 this young man has raised $50,000.

I’d ask that these four great Albertans rise and receive the warm welcome of this Assembly. Mr. Fox: Mr. Speaker, it is my privilege and honour to introduce to you and through you two of my fellow Rotarians, Bob Huff and Jyl Talsma. Jyl is the mother of one of our brave Afghanistan veterans. With them today we have a very special guest, Helene Quedens, the Lacombe Rotary Club’s exchange student from Denmark. Please stand and be recognized and receive the warm welcome of this Assembly. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Calder. Mr. Eggen: Thanks, Mr. Speaker.

Today I’m very pleased to introduce to you and through you to the Assembly Marcel Seveny. Marcel is a student at MacEwan University completing a major in English. He’s very interested in politics and eager to learn more about the political process here in Alberta. I would ask Marcel to please rise and recei ve the warm traditional welcome of the Assembly. 1:40 The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Beverly-Clareview. Mr. Bilous: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today I’m pleased to introduce to you and through you to this Assembly a group of guests from the Candora Society.

The Candora Society is a nonprofit group which has worked with residents of northeast Edmonton for over 24 years. The society is based on a philosophy of participatory educa- tion, enabling people to give voice to their issues and to take a stand on what is important to them. By connecting people to each other, the Candora Society is promoting positive growth in the lives of women, children, and families in our community for free.

I would now like to ask my guests to rise as I call their names and receive the traditional warm welcome of the Assembly: Susan Catlin, Ian Daly, Michelle Ackland, Colin Daly, Katrina Ungarian. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Mountain View. Dr. Swann: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. Yesterday I introduced two members of the Farmworkers Union, and I neglected to mention that they’re here on a dual purpose.

The first indeed is the health and safety of farm workers in the province, with the absence of occupational health and safety, workers’ compensation, and child labour standards, but they’re really here also to highlight that farm operators are at tremendous risk, as has been highlighted by the federal minister through Bill C -45, the Westray bill, that places all farm operators at risk if they do not create the conditions for health and safety in their workplace. This is a mission that they have also shared with some in the House.

I look forward to hearing more from them in the next couple of days, Eric Musekamp and Darlene Dunlop. head: Members’ Statements The Speaker: The hon. Member for Airdrie. Prohibited Donations to Political Parties Mr. Anderson: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yesterday a point of privilege was brought against the Justice minister for allegedly misleading this Assembly when he made the outrageous claim that the former Chief Electoral Officer asked the government to muzzle him from reporting any findings of illegal donations. Obviously, this statement lacks any logic.

Honestly, why on earth would a person tasked with ensuring democratic transparency ask to be muzzled from disclosing publicly illegal deeds that undermine our democracy? That the minister’s statement is also flat-out untrue was made clear by none other than the current CEO, who, when asked by a reporter late yesterday if the former CEO had requested the law to be changed so that findings of illegal donations could be kept secret, said through his spokesperson: “that was not the recom - mendation of the CEO.” The facts are now very clear.

First, the former CEO, Lorne Gibson, did not recommend that findings of illegal donations be kept from the public. Untrue. Second, this Premier, while Justice minister, authored legislation that muzzles the CEO from reporting findings of illegal donations. Third, there have been dozens of findings of ill egal donations by Elections Alberta, and as far as anyone can find out, the PC Party is involved in every single one of them. On behalf of Albertans the Wildrose demands the following. First, the Minister of Justice and Premier should retract their past statements to this House that the CEO asked to be muzzled.

It wasn’t true. Second, the Minister of Justice should immediately table legislation this fall retracting this order and make it retroactive so all illegal donations found by the CEO thus far can be reported. Lastly, the PC Party must pay back every cent that was illegally donated to them and apologize to Albertans. Anything short of fulfilling these demands will show this Premier has no intention of changing the culture of corruption and secrecy that has existed for far too long in the halls of Alberta’s Legislature. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Highlands-Norwood.

Parliamentary Reform Mr. Mason: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. After swearing in her cabinet, the Premier remarked that she wanted to change the role of the Legislature and to craft more policy with all parties, saying: we’ll let everyone talk about policy and stop talking about politics. Well, the Premier declaring that she will let us talk about policy suggests that she hasn’t fully grasped the role of the opposition in our system. We believe strongly that effective opposition is a necessary safeguard for Albertans.

The work of the opposition in holding the government’s feet to the fire and demanding that they be accountable to the electorate is indispensable to a functioning democracy. Beauchesne’s Parliamentary Rules & Forms says that question period relies on the willingness of cabinet “to submit its conduct of public affairs to the scrutiny of the Opposition on a regular basis.” It also recommends that the “respect for the rights of the minority, which precludes a Government from using to excess the extensive powers that it has to limit debate,” is critical.

Question period is the most important opportunity for the opposition to speak directly to cabinet about their decisions. In Alberta, however, question period is often a venue for government private members to ask the cabinet to read a news release from the

May 30, 2012 Alberta Hansard 83 department in the Legislature. It’s a waste of the Assembly’s time, Mr. Speaker. I want to invite the Premier to think about the purpose of question period and to work with the opposition to craft a new role. As we saw las t week, the government has resisted working co - operatively with the opposition. Lack of communication with House leaders on Bill 1 and a refusal to allow an opposition presence in the media room for the Premier’s news conferences is troubling.

The Premier talks about a better relationship with the opposition while effectively ignoring the members on the other side of the floor. The Premier’s repeated decisions to hold news conferences in the cabinet room – and there’s another one later today, Mr. Speaker – blocks any opposition presence from those news conferences and prevents us from doing our job. While the Premier has talked about making changes about how the Legislature functions, so far she has not taken the opportunity to consult with the opposition. That needs to change. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Glenmore.

Multiple Sclerosis Awareness Month Ms L. Johnson: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today I wish to speak about Multiple Sclerosis Awareness Month. MS can occur at any age but is usually diagn osed between the ages of 15 and 40. It is an unpredictable, often disabling disease of the central nervous system. Symptoms can range from blurred vision, speech, bladder, and bowel problems to partial or complete paralysis. With about 11,000 Albertans li ving with MS, including my friends Jan and Larry, finding safe and effective treatments for this disease is a priority for the Alberta government.

This government will continue to support the work being done to find a cure for the disease. We are moving fo rward with Alberta’s three-year obser- vational study on CCSVI. That’s chronic cerebrospinal venous insufficiency. Currently there are close to 1,000 partici pants enrolled in the study. The information gathered will provide important data in the near term to support the efforts of other investigators working to find a cure. We also support the dynamic work of the MS Society as it continues to provide a wide variety of services and programs to Albertans affected by MS.

The society is also the largest funder of MS research in Canada. To support these programs there are several fundraising events each year. Recently there were walkathons in Grande Prairie, Red Deer, Fort McMurray, Drumheller, St. Paul -Lakeland, Medicine Hat, Edmonton, Lethbridge, Lloydminste r, and St. Albert. You can still participate in walkathons being held in Calgary and Brooks this upcoming weekend. During the weekend of June 9 to 10 MS bike tours will take place around the province. I encourage Albertans to learn about the many ways to get involved in helping to find a cure for MS.

Jan, Larry, and others say thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-South East. Emergency Services Workers Mr. Fraser: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to acknowledge the vital work of our emergency services personnel. This summer will be like many other summers we’ve all enjoyed over the years. Albertans will barbecue. They will gather at family functions. Our children will engage in summer activities like swimming, biking, and soc cer. For most of us it will be a typical glorious, sunny summer.

But for some Albertans it will be a trying summer, a summer that will test the human spirit, a summer that will challenge the strength of family support networks. Like all other summers, our forests will be at risk of wildfires, our farms will experience drought, and our homes may flood. All Albertans, whether we know it or not, rely on a network of emergency services personnel that is always keeping watch. We depend on these brave men and women to survey the risks, to make hard, split -second decisions, and to protect Albertans and our property from disaster.

Our paramedics, policemen, firefighters, emergency dispatch, and emergency management personnel never have a typical summer. They always remain committed and always put the safety of Albertans first, tirelessly working away in the background. I would like to acknowledge the search and rescue teams, emergency medical services, policemen, firefighters, emergency dispatch, and our Provincial Operations Centre. Thank you for ensuring our peace of mind, knowing that you’re there to protect our communities, save lives, and mitigate damage to our properties.

Know that the members of this Assembly and the citizens of Alberta appreciate the work th at you do for us. Thank you again for your commitment to Albertans. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 1:50 head: Oral Question Period The Speaker: The hon. Leader of Her Majesty’s Loyal Opposition. Premier’s Attendance at Bilderberg Conference Ms Smith: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Tomorrow federal NDP leader Thomas Mulcair will be in Alberta, a golden opportunity for the Premier to meet face to face with the man who’s appointed himself Alberta’s number one enemy and dispel the myths he believes about our oil sands.

But, instead, the Premier will be hobnobbing behind closed doors, away from the accountability of journalists and the public, at the invite -only Bilderberg conference in Virginia and sticking taxpayers with a $19,000 tab. Where are this Premier’s priorities? Is it to stand here in Alberta and defend our most important industry from bullies like Thomas Mulcair, or is it to attend secret cocktail parties on the taxpayer dime and let the bully have open season? To the Premier. The Speaker: The hon. Premier. Ms Redford: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I am very pleased to be able to be attending a conference in Washington made up of international leaders who are making decisions and are involved in decisions that affect the Canadian economy and the oil sands. Yo u know, what’s tremendously interesting to me is that this hon. member, before she was an hon. member, criticized the former Premier for rushing back to Alberta to try to convince someone who was never going to change their mind about the oil sands to change their mind.

My job and the job of our cabinet is to advance Alberta’s interests, to support the oil sands, and that’s what I and the Deputy Premier will be doing tomorrow. The Speaker: Thank you. Ms Smith: I hope the Premier knows that there’s a big dif ference between a movie director and the official leader of the federal opposition. Given the exclusive and secret nature of the Bilderberg confer - ence, given that no reporting of this conference is allowed, and given that Bilderberg’s own website states that “no resolutions are proposed, no votes [are] taken, and no policy statements [are]

84 Alberta Hansard May 30, 2012 issued” at the conferences, will the Premier tell us what possible justification or actual value there is for this $19,000 taxpayer - funded trip? Ms Redford: I’ll tell you that I have a pretty good sense of what the role of the Leader of the Opposition is, and I’ll tell you that I think it’s to support Alberta initiatives that matter for the future of this province in a constructive way.

One of the ways that we yesterday had tremendous opportunity to speak about advancing Alberta’s interests was through the Western Premiers’ Confer - ence, to get support from western Premiers with respect to a Canadian energy strategy, at the very moment that this Leader of the Opposition wa s standing in the House saying that it wouldn’t happen, it shouldn’t happen, and it couldn’t happen. And, Mr. Speaker, it did. The Speaker: The hon. opposition leader. Ms Smith: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Since she’s dodged the question a couple of times, I’m going to try it one more time. Given that B.C.

Premier Gordon Campbell attended Bilderberg in 2010 and the province’s Conflict of Interest Commissioner was called in to investigate and given the secretive nature of the Bilderberg meetings and the matters discussed and given that the only way to get into Bilderberg is by secret invitation, how can Alberta taxpayers know that they are getting something that actually advances our interests and not just personal networking opportunities for the Premier? Ms Redford: Mr. Speaker, I don’t understand what the Leader of the Opposition’s definition of secret is. At 4 o’clock yesterday we issued a press release.

We’re standing in the House today talking about this. I’ll tell you that we’re going to talk about Alberta’ s interests. I’m very happy to continue to talk about it after this conference is over because I’ll tell you that everything that we need to do as the government of Alberta is to ensure that opinion- makers around the world understand who we are, what we do, why, and how we do it to advance Alberta’s interests and our economy. The Speaker: The hon. opposition leader for her second main question. Committee Compensation Repayments Ms Smith: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

In the spirit of openness and transparency, only after Albertans expressed outrage about MLAs accepting cash for the no-meet committee did the Premier promise that all PC MLAs would pay back all the money they received or, I quote: any MLAs who do not will not have a place in my caucus. Wildrose MLAs have shown leadership by paying back the funds. Not the PCs. Unbelievably, MLAs are sitting in the PC caucus while still owing money to taxpayers for work they did not do. Will the Premier show that she’s kept her election promises and . . . The Speaker: Thank you. Ms Redford: Mr.

Speaker, we have been in extensive discussions with every member of this caucus with respect to this issue, and I can stand here and proudly say that every single member of our caucus has made arrangements and has already started to pay back that money. We know full well that it will be completed because it is the right thing to do. Ms Smith: Mr.

Speaker, given that the PCs have not made this information public – the Wildrose has demonstrated leadership by once again providing pr oof, which I’ll table also later today, that its members did the right thing and returned all funds owing – we challenge, no, we demand, on behalf of Albertans: will the PCs who sit here today in government give the money back before the Legislature rises for the summer? Ms Redford: Mr. Speaker, we made a commitment during the election. We are keeping our commitment during the election.

In fact, my understanding is that there are even people who were in this Progressive Conservative caucus who were not re-elected who paid back the money, which was not the case on the other side. Mr. Anderson: Point of order, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: Member for Airdrie, you’re rising on a point of order? Noted. Ms Smith: Mr. Speaker, as you know, the Premier is incorrect, and I’ll allow for my MLA to be able to correct her afterwards. The Premier promised accountability, and she promised Albertans that every MLA would repay the no -meet money or they would not sit in her caucus.

Voters have a right to know that that has happe ned. If the Premier will not table proof that all the funds have been repaid, will she keep her word and kick out the members of her caucus who have not repaid the money? Ms Redford: Mr. Speaker, if that is the case, I make that commit - ment. The Speaker: Just before we go to the third main question. The chair is having some difficulty hearing the debate and the questions. I wish we could just tone it down a little bit, please. Otherwise, I will bypass you and go to the next member. The hon. opposition leader.

Prohibited Donations to Political Parties Ms Smith: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. To the Premier: now that, and with much gratitude, we have the official confirmation from the Chief Electoral Officer’s office that the information about proven illegal donati ons should be made public, should not be kept secret, can we have an end to this shameless cover -up? Will the Premier give her blessing to the Chief Electoral Officer to release, number one, the names of the offenders; number two, the party that they have donated to; and, number three, the penalty that they’ve received?

Ms Redford: As we’ve said many times in this House, we have Elections Alberta that is run by a Chief Electoral Officer, who – I will use the word again – is “independent” from this Legislature. Mr. Speaker, I am not in a position to tell the Chief Electoral Officer what to do or to give my blessing to anything he may or may not choose to do. I think that shows incredible contempt for the office and the independence of the office of the Chief Electoral Officer. Ms Smith: Mr.

Speaker, given that, will the Premier at least then give her blessing to the Chief Electoral Officer to release the dollar figure amounts of those donations given to her own PC Party and give this Legislature and all Albertans her commitment to return every single last cent of illegal donations given to her PC Party?

May 30, 2012 Alberta Hansard 85 Ms Redford: Mr. Speaker, the first part of that question was the same as the first one. It is not for me to bless the Chief Electoral Officer, and I think it’s incredible that the Leader of the Opposition would think that as a politician she had a right to do that. In terms of whether or not the Progressive Conservative Party has received any illegal donations, the party has spoken to that matter. That is not the case. The investigations continue, as I understand it, for a number of political parties. The Speaker: Thank you.

Speaker’s Ruling Questions about Political Party Activity The Speaker: I will take this opportunity to again remind members that government is accountable for its own po licies, its own programs, its own services, and its budgets. It is not accountable for a party, and neither are you in that respect. So let’s move on, please. Prohibited Donations to Political Parties (continued) Ms Smith: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Pr emier felt it necessary in this new Legislature to introduce a new Associate Minister of Accountability, Transparency and Transformation.

Will she direct him to make it his first undertaking to review the report of former Chief Electoral Officer Lorne Gibs on and develop a plan to implement his recommendations to ensure fair and transparent elections for the future of this province? Ms Redford: Mr. Speaker, it was quite interesting for us – and the hon. Member for Airdrie was a part of the Progressive Conser va- tive caucus when we went through this – to undertake an extensive review of the recommendations from the Chief Electoral Officer the last time that we reviewed the Election Act.

What we have said is that as part of the work of the new associate minister of transparency he will be reviewing the suite of legislation that deals with conflict of interest, with political fundraising, and with elections. Now, on top of that, I believe that there was a letter tabled in this Legislature yesterday where the Minis ter of Justice went above and beyond and specifically solicited advice from the Chief Electoral Officer as to whether there were any changes he would like to see. The Speaker: Thank you. The hon. Member for Edmonton Centre. 2:00 Municipal Funding Ms Blakeman: Thanks very much, Mr.

Speaker. There are several issues around municipal funding that this government has failed to address. Now, this government rages against the feds for taking more of Albertans’ money than it gives back in equalization payments, yet it happily does exactly the same thing to Edmonton and Calgary. To the Premier: why do Edmonton and Calgary only get back pennies on the dollar for all the different taxes they pay? Calgary gets 8 cents back; Edmonton gets 6 cents back. [interjecti ons] Oh, that seems to have distressed her. I’m sorry. Mr. Griffiths: Mr.

Speaker, I’d be curious where the hon. member would be getting her information from. I have heard arguments presented by different members of the AUMA that they don’t get the same value for the dollar, but they’re talking about, specifically, dollars that go to municipalities. The same arguments have been made in rural Alberta. The argument we always make is that whether it’s a municipal government or a provincial govern - ment or a fed eral government, we all serve the same clients, and all the dollars go back to every community to provide the services that Albertans need.

Ms Blakeman: With respect, the point that they’re making is that they don’t get that money back. On to the next question. Why is the principle of stable, predicta- ble three-year funding available only when applied to the MSI, the municipal sustainability initiative, and not to the 22 other grants that come from the province to the municipalities? Mr. Griffiths: Mr. Spe aker, that’s not the case at all. We have said from day one that we wanted to secure stable funding for municipalities. It applies to all of the grant programs that we run through so that municipalities know what they have, what they can count on.

MSI is t he major portion of that funding because it makes up almost a billion of the $2 billion that goes to the municipalities, but the commitment is the same for all of those programs. The Speaker: The hon. member. Ms Blakeman: Thanks. Well, let’s stay on MSI, then. How is the government going to implement its new commitment to increase MSI grants to $1.6 billion a year by 2014 when it still hasn’t delivered on its two -year-old promise to increase MSI funding to $1.4 billion a year, especially given that all you managed to do last year was $896 million? How are you going to do this? Mr. Griffiths: Well, Mr.

Speaker, we’ve been very clear from the beginning that we plan on – for 10 years the program was $11.3 billion sent to municipalities. It was going to increase every year. Because of a global economic downturn it was difficult for the province to meet all of those obligations and targets. To get to the $11.3 billion by 2017, we would have to approach $1.6 billion. As we go through year-over-year fiscal plans, we’re going to continue to try and meet that obligation and that promise that we made to municipalities five years ago. The Speaker: The hon. leader of the NDP opposition.

Prohibited Donations to Political Parties (continued) Mr. Mason: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. Just yesterday the Solicitor General claimed that legislation which allows this government to hide illegal donations made to the PC Party was introduced on the recommendation of the previous Chief Electoral Officer, but t he Chief Electoral Officer says that only investiga - tions were to be in private, not conclusions. The Chief Electoral Officer says that the Justice minister isn’t telling the truth. To the Justice minister: are you telling the truth? The Speaker: Hon. minister, proceed if you wish. Mr. Denis: Mr.

Speaker, I’m not going to get into points of order here as I like this hon. member. The Speaker: Are you rising on a point of order, are you rising to answer the question, or both? Mr. Denis: I don’t want to get into a point of order, Mr. Speaker. I’m prepared to answer the question.

86 Alberta Hansard May 30, 2012 The Speaker: The hon. leader, then. Mr. Mason: He says that he’s prepared to answer the question, but then he sits down. Mr. Speaker, it’s a simple question. This one to the Deputy Premier: when you said that changes to legislation that keep the results of investigations into illegal donations secret were introduced on the recommendation of the Chief Electoral Officer, were you telling the truth? Mr. Lukaszuk: Mr. Speaker, first of all, I take objection to anyone in this House suggesting th at I may not have been telling the truth at any point in time.

The member of the fourth party would be well served to research the legislation. Number one, there are two acts at play. One is the Election Act; the other one is the election finances act. Any monetary contributions to campaigns are made under the election finances act. I would invite him to read that act because there’s only one little

section on investigations. There’s nothing in that act, in my opinion, that precludes the Chief Electoral Officer from releasing information, and if he chooses to do so, he’s welcome to do it. He’s independe nt. He needs no permission from this government. Mr. Mason: He clearly believes otherwise, Mr. Speaker, and this government is involved in a premeditated cover-up.

To the Deputy Premier: will this government do the open and transparent thing, do the right thing, and write to the Progressive Conservative Party to demand that they voluntarily release details of the illegal donations that they have so willingly accepted in violation of the laws of this province? Speaker’s Ruling Questions about Political Party Activity The Speaker: Hon. member, I’ve just reminded a couple of previous speakers about that fine line. If you have a question that pertains to one of the officers that serve this Legislature independ- ently or otherwise, that’s a fair question.

But we’re treading on a very delicate piece of turf here. Deputy Premier, I’ll recognize you to respond if you wish. Prohibited Donations to Political Parties (continued) Mr. Lukaszuk: To restate the obvious, if the Chief Electoral Officer chooses to rele ase information, he’s privileged to do so as per the independence of his office. Nothing, in my opinion, in the legislation prevents him from doing that. But let me remind you, Mr.

Speaker, that, yes, the Progressive Conservative Party of Alberta has publicly stated that it has been investigated, that there were some irregularities, and that money has been paid back. But there are other parties in this Chamber that have been investigated, and I wonder who they are. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Lac La Biche-St. Paul-Two Hills. Mr. Saskiw: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have new information in my hand that shows that this government is allowing the PC Party to stuff their coffers with illega l donations, but there’s a twist.

This document shows the Premier’s own riding association took $1,800 in illegal donations from Mount Royal University in 2008, with the PC Party collecting $2 ,000 more. To the Minister of Justice: will the government commit today to amending the legislation to bring all violations to light? The Speaker: Well, again we’re treading on that fine line. This may be the last question that we allow in that vein. You might want to rephrase the next ones. Hon. Deputy Premier, if you wish. Mr. Lukaszuk: Well, Mr. Speaker, less than one week, and we’re racing to the bottom. But let me try to address that.

If this member feels that he has information, for the benefit of the fact that he’s a new member, first, table that information in this House, and (

b) file it with the Chief Electoral Officer, who will, again, investigate it and report it if he feels it’s appropriate to do so. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Saskiw: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will definitely table this document later. Given the Premier made a fu nding announcement to Mount Royal right before the election and then during the election the Premier’s picture appeared on the cover of their alumni magazine together with a puff piece, is it fa ir to say that Albertans should be concerned about this obvious unethical conflict of interest? The Speaker: The hon. Government House Leader. Mr.

Hancock: Point of order. The Speaker: On a point of order? Thank you. Hon. member, third question. Mr. Saskiw: Given that the Premier herself is at the core of the problem by passing a law that makes convicted political parties unaccountable to Albertans and now that her own riding has accepted illegal donati ons, how can Albertans believe that the Premier . . . The Speaker: The Government House Leader has risen on another point of order? Mr. Hancock: Yes, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: Noted. The Deputy Premier to answer. Mr. Lukaszuk: Mr. Speaker, I will speak to it.

As a member of this House and as a member of the bar, being a lawyer, this member should know two things. Number one, he is making suggestions that the Premier has done something illegal, yet he hasn’t even tabled the document, nor has he given the privilege to the Chief Electoral Officer to investigate it. Mr. Anderson: Point of order, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: Point of order noted. Mr. Lukaszuk: Second of all, the member knows very well, Mr. Speaker, that there is a process by which allegations can be investigated. He should utilize that process. This is not the way we resolve issues in this House.

The Speaker: Thank you. The hon. Member for Stony Plain. Highways 628 and 779 Mr. Lemke: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Secondary highways 628 and 779 are major arteries in Stony Plain and through Parkland

May 30, 2012 Alberta Hansard 87 county. For over 12 years the town has implored the Ministry of Transportation to make much-needed upgrades to these roads, but as of yet little has been done. In fact, some of my constituents refer to 628 as a goat trail. To the Minister of Transportation: what is the provincial standard for when secondary highways such as highways 628 and 779 should be upgraded? 2:10 The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Transportation. Mr. McIver: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. First of all, to the hon. member I would say that we don’t consider any highways secondary.

They’re all provincial highways, and upgrades are done according to overall provincial pri orities and available funding. Factors that determine that funding are traffic volumes, safety records, new developments, economic activity, and condi - tion of the infrastructure. All those are matters along with the priorities of the day. Mr. Lemke: My constituents will be delighted to hear that this is a primary highway.

First supplementary question to the same minister: given that the people of Stony Plain have seen irregular and inconsistent upgrades to these roads for over a decade with no date in sight, when will the government commit to making these repairs to ensure the safety of the people of my constituency? The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mr. McIver: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The initial construction work has actually begun on highway 779 by Alberta Transporta- tion. Utility work was completed by the town of Stony Plain in 2011.

My department is moving forward with the engineering, land acquisition, driveway relocations, and railway crossings for the reconstruction of highway 779, and this work will need to be completed before the construction begins. Although the construc - tion of highway 779 will take more time, we remain committed to completing the work. I’m out of time, unfortunately. I’ll talk to the member after on more details. Mr.

Lemke: Second supplementary question, again to the same minister: given that in 2009 Alberta Transportation added highway 779 upgrades to its three -year plan only to remove them again in 2012 after the town of Stony Plain had spent over $3 million in infrastructure to prepare for the new road, will Alberta Transportation add these important improvements back into the three-year plan and follow through with their commitment to the town of Stony Plain? The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mr. McIver: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. N o committed projects were cancelled, but they were moved back to meet our funding envelope.

Transportation’s overall budget for 2012- 2013 is $3.3 billion, of which $1.95 billion is for program expense, and $1.38 billion is for capital investment. As I said , some projects were deferred. Our total capital infrastructure program is still 38 per cent higher than the average of provinces in Canada at $1,493 as opposed to $1,081. To the hon. member: we understand it’s a priority, and as the funding becomes available, we will get that job done. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Strathmore-Brooks. National Energy Strategy Mr. Hale: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Wildrose stands for defending Alberta’s interests and standing up for our resource development. In contrast, the Premier prefers talking about her pet project, a vague national energy strategy, instead of getting results. Alberta needs concrete action to support the energy sector, not airy-fairy ideas that the Premier said that have little substance. We need pip elines to the west coast, to the U.S., and should support a west-to-east pipeline to diversify our markets, to get full value for our product, and to create jobs.

Why did this Premier not focus on pipelines rather than pipe dreams at the Western Premiers’ Conference? Mr. Lukaszuk: Mr. Speaker, to refer to a Canadian energy strategy as airy-fairy is really not understanding the importance of this industry to this province and to this country. As a matter of fact, this initiative is supported by four western Premiers and by territorial Premiers. I don’t think there is anything airy-fairy about it. As a matter of fact, this is leadership showing that as western provinces and, frankly, all of Canada we believe in responsible extraction of our natural resources. Mr.

Hale: The B.C. Premier wasn’t even there. Given that yesterday the Premier met with our western partners and once again touted this empty national energy strategy with no detail, no timeline, no deliveries, can the Premier tell us her national energy strategy with concrete details, or is she just going to keep having conversations? It’s time to put some meat on the bone. Mr. Dallas: Well, Mr. Speaker, the Premier commented yesterday that this is a discussion, and clearly there was consensus among western Premiers.

The Premier has a Canadian energy strategy on the agenda for the national discussion coming up, and there are plenty of opportunities to flesh out details on this, build consen- sus, make sure that all provinces understand and buy in to the benefits of a Canadian energy strategy. Mr. Hale: Given that we have seen federal leaders defame our resource development, pitting other provinces against us, will the Premier consider the Saskatchewan Premier for the job of Alberta’s new ambassador to Ottawa to defend our interests because our Premier is missing in action? Mr. Dallas: Mr.

Speaker, I think no Premier in Canada has done a better job of articulating and advancing and promoting the interests of Alberta as a place of tremendous opportunity, opportunity not just for Albertans but opportunity for all Canadians. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Barrhead-Morinville-Westlock. Postsecondary Tuition Fees Ms Kubinec: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This spring postsecondary students in Quebec have participated in a series of demonstrations, protests, and started a province -wide student strike about the cost of tuition. Government and student groups are at odds over the issue.

The unrest has even turned violent, and the Quebec govern - ment has created legislation to force an end to the strike. My first question is to the Minister of Enterprise and Advanced Education. Student groups in our province have staged protests in the past and

88 Alberta Hansard May 30, 2012 most recently supported Quebec’s students with a rally in Edmon- ton. What is preventing a full-scale student strike in Alberta? The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mr. Khan: Thank you, Mr. Speaker, for the opportunity to address my colleagues for the fir st time in this House. There are a number of reasons why this government has a strong relationship with Alberta students and postsecondary stakeholders overall.

Like my predecessors, I look forward to meeting with student groups and other stakeholders to hear directly from them on issues such as tuition or any other issues they wish to speak of. I believe most students understand that this government has ensured that postsecondaries have stable three- year funding and that the rates of tuition are capped at CPI. Alberta is a leader in Canada for scholarships and bursaries, and we will continue to provide this access to education for all Albertans. Ms Kubinec: Mr. Speaker, my second question is also to the Minister of Enterprise and Advanced Education.

Institutions talk about rising costs of their own and how those costs have been passed on down to the student. Is this minister planning to allow the postsecondaries to introduce more market modifiers to help institutions who are finding it hard to cover their costs? Mr. Khan: Mr. Speaker, Albertan tuition costs are in line with the national average, and tuition fee regulation is keeping tuition increases at a manageable level. As a one-time initiative market modifiers were introduced on a select number of program s because anomalies existed when the current tuition fee was implemented.

The six modifiers were necessary at the time and effective in making these programs more competitive with similar programs outside the province. We continually monitor the cost of delivery and the costs associated with being a student; however, there are no plans to reintroduce market modifiers at this time. Ms Kubinec: My final question is to the same minister. Tuition is only a part of the equation. What is this minister doing to co ntrol noninstructional fees, and is it the time now to develop a regulation around these fees? The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mr. Khan: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Students need to know that any new fees have to add value to their education. I do not believe that to achieve this, we need to make any regulation changes or develop entirely new sets of regulations. We’ve asked all Campus Alberta institutions to develop formal policies around these fees with formal consultation with student groups. My predecessors have done an excellent job in this area, including student groups as stakeholders in the purview of the provincial tuition rises.

Students and taxpayers and Albertans understand that the government of Alberta currently subsidizes 75 per cent of the cost of postsecondary education. The Speaker: Thank you. The hon. Member for Calgary-Buffalo, followed by the Member from Edmonton-Calder. Twinning of Highway 63 Mr. Hehr: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. We’ve been building roads for a hundred years in this province, so it should be fairly easy to complete the twinning of highway 63, but the trouble is that this government has now run five c onsecutive deficits, the heritage fund is worth less than it was in 1976, and the coffers are bare.

Today as it stands, we are spending all our resource revenues on things we use today. To the Minister of Transportation: can you please confirm with me that we’re not actually going to dip into the heritage savings trust fund to pay for this road? The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Transportation. 2:20 Mr. McIver: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I have made clear in the House the last two days in a row, in the next budget there’s $450 million over the next three years to build the first hundred kilometres of this road.

As the hon. member also knows, we’ll be coming forward with a report at about the end of June on plans to further that. We have committed that we wil l twin the entire road, and the financing for that will be announced in due course. I would say that there’s no plan to dip into the heritage fund at this time, that I’m aware of. We will make the announcement at the appropriate time. The Speaker: Thank you. Mr.

Hehr: Well, given that this government is unwilling to ask citizens to pay for things they use, like roads, through taxation, will you commit to paying for highway 63 through a toll instead of on the backs of future generations? Mr. McIver: Mr. Spea ker, I thank the hon. member for the question. As we said, I am working with my ministerial staff and the hon. Member for Fort McMurray-Wood Buffalo. Between us we are getting a wide variety of opinions on ways to pay for this road, and amongst those discussions will be tolls.

There is no commitment to charge tolls or not to, and in the fullness of time we will bring that report to the House, and all will be revealed when the decision is made. I thank the hon. member for suggesting tolls as one of the options. Mr. Hehr: The reason I suggest tolls is because you have a fiscal deficit because you spend the oil money as soon as it comes in. So there’s only one way to do it, either raise taxation or build a toll. You won’t tax people. Will you commit to paying for building this road through a toll? Mr. McIver: Mr.

Speaker, despite the fact that I couldn’t hear a question there, I will do my best to respond anyway. As we’ve made very clear, our government is committed to looking at all of the options, and after we have that fulsome discussion and we get some informed advice, we will make the best decision that we can on behalf of all Albertans. When we make that decision, we will share it with all Albertans. I look forward to that, and I hope the hon. member will be paying attention when that happens. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Calder , followed by the hon. Member for Cypress-Medicine Hat.

Special-needs Education Funding Mr. Eggen: Thanks, Mr. Speaker. This PC government is sup- posed to be funding school boards so that they can properly support students with special needs. However, the Edmonton public school board recently reported that it has been forced to increase special-needs funding by $21.8 million, or about 31 per cent. Even with the modest pre -election announcement for special ed here the funding gap is huge. Why is the provincial government

May 30, 2012 Alberta Hansard 89 forcing school boards to carry this funding shortfall, which ultimately results in shortchanging every student in public educa - tion? Mr. Lukaszuk: Well, Mr. Speaker, this particular member wasn’t in this House when the budget was debated, so let me share some good news with him. For our first time in the history of this province we have passed a three -year budget for education, which is growing from $6.8 billion to $7.1 billion over three years, which roughly is at $34 million per school day.

Funding for inclusive education has grown by $68 million, which is equivalent to 22 per cent. Now, if my memory is correct, the funding for special education for the Edmonton public school board has grown from $36 million to $52 million, a very significant increase. Mr. Eggen: Mr. Speaker, the funding for special needs has been flat and has been increasing dramatically for not just Edmonton public but other school boards as well. You know, the question is whether we can fund or not fund moderate special-needs programs in our schools because of the discrepancy that was allocated for special ed.

What was spent in Edmonton public was between $45 million and $60 million in the last four years. So numbers are fine, but the facts on the ground speak differently. The Speaker: Thank you. Mr. Lukaszuk: I’m not sure if there was a question, so I will take the liberty of telling him, Mr. Speaker, that an increase of 22 per cent is hardly flat. It’s quite a significant increase. The Edmonton public school board is receiving additional funding. Their funding for special needs is growing from $36 million to that of $52 million, quite a significant increase. There is nothing flat about that.

So a 22 per cent increase for special funding and an increase of $6.8 billion to $7.2 billion: that’s a great investment in education. Mr. Eggen: Well, Mr. Speaker, I’d be glad to table the report that we have from Edmonton public that demonstr ates that we’re only getting about a third of the funding that is required to meet the special-needs education in Edmonton public schools. Will the minister commit and consult to ensure that special -needs students get the support that they need without jeo pardizing the quality of education for all Alberta students? The discrepancy is there. It’s on the paper. Mr.

Lukaszuk: Mr. Speaker, nothing needs to be tabled. The budget has been debated and passed in this House and is a public document. Spending on educ ation is growing, I say one more time, from $6.8 billion to $7.1 billion. That is very significant. It is predictable. It’s a three-year budget. It is good news for Alberta education. Alberta students are getting one of the best education systems in the wo rld, and that particular school board is getting a significant increase as well. Twinning of Highway 63 (continued) Mr. Barnes: Mr. Speaker, people are fearful to drive highway 63 to Fort McMurray.

Five years ago I was taking a group of baseball players t here from Medicine Hat. Unbelievably, it took several meetings with our parents to convince them to go. This was a trip in our own province, and parents felt their boys would be unsafe. This fear is keeping people away from Fort McMurray and costing thousands in economic opportunities in tourism. Wildrose stands for economic development. To the Minister of Transportation: how can he feel it’s appropriate to drag this project out when every day it’s risking lives and costing Fort McMurray thousands? Mr. McIver: Well, Mr.

Speaker, I would say to the hon. member that asked the question that he should do what I did and drive up that road right now, and he would see there is lots of equipment moving, lots of work under way, lots of road construction going on. This government is taking action. This government has in the next three years’ budget $450 million. There’s already been a hundred kilometres of trees and brush cleared. I would say to the hon. member: those trees didn’t cut themselves down; the workers under this government did.

We will continue to do that work until that highway is twinned because we are taking action on highway 63. Mr. Barnes: Mr. Speaker, I took this trip in 2007, and the promise was already a year old. It’s my understanding that only somewhere between 19 and 50 kilometres have been completed. Can you explain that in action, please? The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mr. McIver: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The actions taking place are that there’s already about a billion dollars in roads, bridges, and other construction in and around Fort McMurray, either complete or well under way today.

Again I would repeat for the hon. member: there’s another first hundred kilometres of road that will be completed three years from now. It’s already in the budget. Nothing else needs to be done. I would remind the hon. member that we are working with the hon. Member for Fort McMurray -Wood Buffalo to put together a plan to speed up the northern part of the road. That’s nothing but action. The hon. member asked for it. The hon. member actually already has it. Mr. Barnes: Mr.

Speaker, given that this government has a track record of cherry -picking recom mendations, why did you not just listen to the residents of Fort McMurray? Mr. McIver: Actually, Mr. Speaker, I think I just pointed out that I was up there listening to the residents, talking to the mayor of Fort McMurray and other people. I would remind the speaker that the hon. Member for Fort McMurray-Wood Buffalo is a resident. We’re certainly listening to him. Mr.

Speaker, I think Albertans and people from Fort McMurray-Wood Buffalo would be glad about who they chose in the election because the other party’s recommendation was to cut our expenditures on infrastructure back by 25 per cent for four years in a row. That would leave those people waiting a lot longer. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Fort Saskatchewan-Vegreville, followed by the hon. Member for Innisfail-Sylvan Lake. 2:30 Emergency Medical Services Ms Fenske: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. During the recent campaign there were many comments made to me about the EMS service.

Constituents provided a variety of comments about ways to improve that. My question is to the Minister of Health. I understand you have asked the Health Quality Council of Alberta to undertake a review of EMS services. This review comes nearly three years after EMS has transitioned under Alberta Health Services. With all these issues around ambulance response times why has it taken nearly three years to call this review? The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Health.

90 Alberta Hansard May 30, 2012 Mr. Horne: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, and thank you to the hon. member for the question. The government announc ed the review in February, following the receipt of the Health Quality Council of Alberta report that looked into a number of health care related issues. Emergency medical services was one of those issues. One thing I’d want to make very clear is that whil e this review will deal with a number of the issues the hon. member mentions, it will not change the government’s policy decision that EMS is health care and belongs as part of the health care system.

The Speaker: The hon. member. Ms Fenske: Thank you. To the same minister: could you provide us with a progress report or an update of some kind on this pro- ject? Mr. Horne: I’m very happy to do that, Mr. Speaker. The review is expected to be completed in October. It will be a public report. It w ill be issued by the Health Quality Council directly.

It will examine a number of the issues around transition that have been raised in this House and elsewhere, things such as dispatch consolidation, challenges specifically related to the integration of fire and EMS services in some parts of the province, and the availability and adequacy of data on EMS. The Speaker: The hon. member. Ms Fenske: Thank you. My question for the same minister: what are the remaining opportunities for the general public, for em er- gency response providers, and for municipalities to partici pate in this review? Mr. Horne: Mr.

Speaker, that question would be best directed to the Health Quality Council as they’re conducting the review. But I can inform the member and the House that a number of key stakeholders have been identified who, I believe, have approached the Health Quality Council and may have been in fact engaged. Those include Alberta Health Services, of course, the Firefighters Association, the Association of Chiefs of Police, the Alberta Urban Municipalities Association, and the Alberta Association of Municipal Districts and Counties.

Those organizations as well as community organizations and members of the general public are all welcome to contact the Health Quality Council in this regard. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Innisfail-Sylvan Lake. Family Care Clinics Mrs. Towle: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yesterday, when asked about the government’s big plan for family care clinics, the Minister of Health, not surprisingly, fa iled to answer the questions.

When asked how the government will pay to build and operate 140 of these new clinics, the Health minister shook off the question, saying that he does not “preoccupy himself with questions of infrastructure.” Well, Albertans wa nt to know where the money is coming from. Again to the Health minister: how are you going to pay to build, staff, and operate 140 new state -run clinics? Mr. Horne: Mr.

Speaker, the response I gave yesterday in answer to the question yesterday was a reflection of the fact that members opposite do not seem to understand that the commitment of this government is to offer primary health care teams to every Albertan in o r near their home community across the province. While others may wish to be preoccupied with discussions about buildings and budget – and those will be addressed in due course – I want to remind this House that both family care clinics and primary care networks are going to be the vehicles that we use to deliver on this commitment.

There’s $75 million that was earmarked in Budget 2012 for primary care. There are many, many clinics and organizations across the province that are already delivering primary care services, and many of those will have a role in delivering on this commitment. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mrs. Towle: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I find it hard to believe that with 140 new clinics there was no plan, no costing whatsoever. Nobody disputes that we need to add primary care for Albertans. The concern is that you won’t be adding capacity at all, only further centralizing the system, as you did with the superboard.

Again to the Health minister: can you explain how many of these state-run clin ics will be additional capacity and how many will merely replace what we already have, like what happened in Calgary with the Mosaic primary care network? Mr. Horne: Mr. Speaker, as I said yesterday, we are not going to take a cookie-cutter approach to thi s exercise. We have tremen - dous resources, a great portion of my budget invested in primary health care delivery currently across the province.

The question is how to use those resources and additional resources which we will allocate to them to expand the availability of care to all Albertans. That includes the services of family physicians, but as I said before, it includes the services of other professionals such as nurse practitioners, who have a greater role to play in delivering these critical services. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mrs. Towle: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Given that the Health minister doesn’t want to preoccupy himself with matters of infra - structure, I will ask the Minister of Infrastructure.

Minister, where are the other 137 state-run c linics going to be, and where are you going to find the money to build them? The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mr. Drysdale: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We’re working on that in consultation with Health. I don’t know about state run. There will be no state-run f acilities in this province. We’ll be discussing that with my colleagues in putting together the funding necessary to do this. Thank you. The Speaker: Thank you. I understand the hon. Member for Edmonton -Ellerslie is scheduled to go next, followed by the hon. Member for Lacombe- Ponoka.

Edmonton Folk Music Festival Mr. Bhardwaj: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. The Edmonton Folk Music Festival is one of the most successful folk music festivals in North America. From humble roots in 1980 this festival has grown to an annual attendance of approximately 85,000 and attracts some of the biggest and best local, national, and international musicians. Despite its proven success the government seems to undervalue the festival by not providing it

May 30, 2012 Alberta Hansard 91 with the financial support it needs and deserves. My first question to the Minister of Culture: what kind of financial support is available to the Edmonton Folk Music Festival? The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Culture. Mrs. Klimchuk: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you for that question. Indeed, the Edmonton folk festival is one of the most impressive festivals that takes place this summer in Festival City, in Edmonton.

Currently the festival is eligible for funding under the Alberta Fo undation for the Arts through the arts presenting grant and as well through the community spirit donation. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Bhardwaj: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. My next question to the same minister. Edmonton is not the only music festival in the province. Can the minister explain how Edmonton’s funding compares to funding provided to other festivals, including the Calgary Folk Music Festival? The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mrs. Klimchuk: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

As you well know, there are festivals that happen all over Alberta, from Slave Lake down to Pincher Creek. The Calgary and the Edmonton folk festivals receive the bulk of the funding because of the amount of people that attend those festivals. Also, the funding is not a cookie-cutter approach. We look at each individual application separately. We also look at the talent that comes from inter - national, national, and from wi thin Alberta when they come and perform. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Bhardwaj: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

My final question to the same minister: has funding for arts decreased in our province over the years? The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mrs. Klimchuk: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’m happy to answer this question. We know that funding to the Alberta Foundation for the Arts has increased approximately 59 per cent in the past seven years, from $16.9 million to $27.9 million in 2012-13. In March of 2012, just this last couple of months ago, an additional $1 million was provided through AFA to assist more artists and organizations with supplemental grants. The Speaker: The hon.

Member for Lacombe-Ponoka , followed by the hon. Member for Leduc-Beaumont. Veterans’ Licence Plates Mr. Fox: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Wildrose stands for fiscal responsibility and budgeting on clear priorities. The current government believes in squeezing Albertans to pay for corporate welfare and pet projects. In recent years the government has raised the tax burden on Albertans through service fee hikes across the board. One of the most offensive was the fee hike on the veteran’s licence plate.

To the minister: when will this government stop nickel and diming our heroes and scrap the fee hike on our veterans’ licence plates? Mr. Bhullar: Mr. Speaker, first of all, I’d like to congratulate the member for asking his first question in the House. Secondly, I’d like to say that his question was absolutely false. There was no ta x hike. There was no increase on the veterans. There was no increase on the veteran’s licence plate. In fact, veterans today can go in, exchange their Alberta licence plate, and get a veteran’s plate free of charge. Mr.

Fox: I do believe there was a 6 per cent hike on renewals that went from $64 to $71. Mr. Speaker, is the minister actually telling us that he thinks this excessive tax grab from veterans is justified to cover the skewed PC government priorities like spending nearly a million dollars on a patronage appointment in Ottawa? 2:40 The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mr. Bhullar: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I think the member is getting confused with respect to the way some items appear in the budget. However, hon. member, please take a review of that once again. There was no separate fee for veterans’ licence plates.

In fact, since we’ve introduced the veteran’s licence plate, last November I introduced the veteran’s licence plate for motorcycles. On this side of the House we respect our veterans, we honour them, and we will continue to do that. Mr. Fox: Mr. Speaker, I’m happy to hear that the other side of the Chamber here does respect our veterans, but given that the government has promised no new taxes for the next three years, can the minister opposite promise that Service Alberta will not bring in any more hidden taxes or fee hikes over the next three years? The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mr.

Bhullar: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. The fact remains that the cost of doing business does increase. For example, in the last 10 years for all motor vehicle products the cost of running these products went up by 109 per cent. Land title services increased by 71 per cent. From time to time fees must go up to account for the cost of providing those services. On this side of the House we have made a commitment to no new taxes and no tax increases.

We have been open and transparent about our agenda, and that’s why we’re on this side of the House and not that. head: Members’ Statements (continued) The Speaker: Hon. Member for Barrhead -Morinville-Westlock, you have a member’s statement. Alberta 4-H Program Ms Kubinec: Mr. Speaker, it is my pleasure to rise today and recognize an organization that is dedicated to the personal devel - opment of youth while providing a positive impact on volunteers and communities in Alberta, an organization whose vision is to develop leadership, communication, technical and life skills to all its members and leaders.

I am of course referring to the 4 -H program, a program that now has 35,000 members and 10,000 leaders across Canada. My own children belong to 4-H. In Alberta 4 -H first started in 1917, and over 180,000 people, approximately 7 per cent of our population, have gone through the program. Alberta 4-H is the largest in the country, with over 8,100 members and 2,600 volunteers in 442 clubs across the province. The key objective of 4 -H is to learn through hands -on experience

92 Alberta Hansard May 30, 2012 as all members are encouraged to gain knowledge and skills by actively participating in the projects that are offered. There are over 33 projects available in the Alber ta program, projects that range from teaching its members how to care for small animals to ones involving photography and others that incorporate veterinary science.

Members have the chance to develop self -confidence and improve self -esteem; learn communi cation and public speaking skills; make new friends across the province, the country, and the world; win awards, trips, scholarships, bursaries; and, most importantly, have fun. Projects are open to all youths aged nine to 21, whether they come from the ci ty, town, acreage, or a farm. There are also many activities for the whole family, and everyone is encouraged to attend meetings and social events. For those interested in gaining leadership experience, Alberta 4 -H has a volunteer program for all those over 18.

By organizing activities and helping 4-H members set and achieve goals, these volunteer leaders have the opportunity to gain new leadership skills. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Livingstone-Macleod. Flood Risk Management in Southern Alberta Mr. Stier: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The floods in 2005 devastated many Alberta families and communities throughout Alberta and especially in the southwest region near my riding of Livingstone- Macleod.

Communities banded together during t hose tough times and showed the great Alberta spirit of compassion, resilience, and hard work that many across Canada and the world have come to know this great province for. Shortly after these floods the Alberta flood management committee was asked to produce a report on flood prevention. The report was titled Alberta Flood Mitigation Report and began shortly after the 2005 floods had taken place but, unfortunately, was put on hold when the Premier at the time announced that he would be stepping down.

The report was all but finalized except for financial details, which were reported to be based upon federal assistance programs. Sadly, the report was mothballed before the federal government ever had a chance to see the figures as Alberta communities continued to be left in the dark. The following Premier had seen the report but failed to release it to the public despite the protests of the former MLA for Highwood, who chaired the committee.

I have to agree with the former Premier when he said that there were a number of good recommendations in the report that we have to implement, and if we don’t, we will see this recurring in the province. But now it’s clear that the government isn’t prepared to follow through on the report and doesn’t want to be tied dow n to making the necessary improvements for these communities, and that isn’t good enough. Mr.

Speaker, as we are now approaching the same season, where 64 communities in Alberta are vulnerable to flood risk, I would like to ask that this government release this study to the public and make efforts to immediately implement all recommendations made, to give Albertans the comfort of knowing that this government is prepared to respond if tragedy ever strikes again. Thank you. head: Introduction of Bills The Speaker: The hon. Member for Strathcona-Sherwood Park. Bill 201 Scrap Metal Dealers and Recyclers Identification Act Mr. Quest: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I request leave to introduce Bill 201, the Scrap Metal Dealers and Recyclers Identification Act. This bill addresses scrap metal theft, which is becoming a serious problem in our ever -growing province of Alberta, by requiring scrap metal dealers and recyclers to record information about the identity of individuals selling recycled metal. This infor - mation could then be used by peace officers during scrap metal theft investigations, thereby deterring this type of theft in the province. Thank you, Mr.

Speaker. [Motion carried; Bill 201 read a first time] head: Tabling Returns and Reports The Speaker: The hon. opposition leader. Ms Smith: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have four items to table today, with the appropriate number of copies. The first is a letter from Ken Kowalski indicating the members who were on the no- meet committee, the Committee on Privi leges and Elections, Standing Orders and Printing, that were re -elected on April 23, 2012: the hon. Member for Calgary -East, the hon. Member for Lesser Slave Lake, the hon. Member for Calgary -Bow, the hon. Member for Bonnyville-Cold Lake , the hon.

Member f or Lethbridge-East, the hon. Member for Strathcona, the hon. Member for Edmonton-Mill Creek , and the hon. Member for Athabasca-Redwater. I table the appropriate number of copies. I table the appropriate number of copies as well of a notice from the director of human resources and information technology to the former hon.

Member for Calgary -Glenmore indicating, and I quote: during the entire period of time that he was appointed to this particular committee he was also appointed to more than three Assembly c ommittees and thus was not eligible and did not receive any compensation for his service on the Standing Committee on Privileges and Elections, Standing Orders and Printing. I also table a similar document from this office regarding the hon. Member for Ca lgary-Fish Creek indicating the amount that she owes, which she read into the record yesterday, and that has been paid back in full.

The fourth tabling in the appropriate numbers is a Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Act request which we received May 10 from Mount Royal University regarding alleged illegal donations to the Calgary -Buffalo PC Association, the Calgary-Lougheed PC Association, the PC Alberta annual general meeting and convention, and two amounts in the amount of $900 each on N ovember 13, 2008, to the Calgary -Elbow PC Association dinner as well as November 27, 2008, to the Calgary- Elbow PC Association event. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 2:50 The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Centre.

Ms Blakeman: Thanks very much, Mr. Speaker. I have two tablings today. The first is a long letter from a constituent, Freda Bisset, who’s very concerned that the Alberta Dental Association stopped producing a fee

schedule in 1997. She details a number of the results o f that, which is making it very hard for a number of

May 30, 2012 Alberta Hansard 93 people to be able to cope with the new amounts and what they get back from any coverage on it. My second tabling today is a long series of e -mails between myself and a constituent, Chantele Theroux, who’s also written to a number of other members of this House, in that her condo was built with such shoddy practices that her condo association is now subject to a number of additional assessments and she is on the verge, if she hasn’t already, of losing her condominium despite being a very good homeowner and on good terms with her bank.

But it’s $34,000 worth of additional assessments, and she just can’t handle that. So thanks very much, government. That’s not keeping people in their homes. Thank you very much. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Airdrie. Mr. Anderson: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’m happy to table five copies of roughly 2,000 signatures, each gathered just over this weekend, in fact, Minister of Culture, from the Falun Dafa Association of Calgary.

They urge the Legislative Assembly of Alberta to • . . . invite Shen Yun Performing Arts back to the Southern Alberta Jubilee Auditorium . . . • Urge the Premier to see to it that the management at the Southern Alberta Jubilee Auditorium apologize to She n Yun for their unprofessional conduct • Urge the Premier to see to it that the net placed over the orchestra pit at the Southern Alberta Jubilee Auditorium is removed for Shen Yun performances to allow proper expression of the arts. I would note that that has been done in hundreds of other venues across North America without any problem.

With that, I’ll table these. head: Tablings to the Clerk The Clerk: I wish to advise the House that the following document was deposited with the office of the Clerk: on behalf of the hon. Mr. Lukaszuk, Deputy Premier, Globe and Mail website

article dated May 28, 2012, entitled Clark To Miss Western Premiers Meeting. The Speaker: Hon. members, before we get into a long stretch of points of order and a ruling on a point of privilege, might we briefly revert to Introduction of Guests? [Unanimous consent granted] head: Introduction of Guests (continued) The Speaker: Please, hon. Member for Vermilion-Lloydminster. Dr. Starke: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, and thank you to my hon. colleagues for allowing me to introduce a group of people that are very important to me and have travelled from across the province to be here today.

They’re members of my family. I’d like to intr oduce Dr. Carola Starke, my sister; along with her two daughters, my nieces, Angela and Lydia – they are residents of Edmonton-Riverview – my in-laws, my mother-in-law and father - in-law, from Lacombe, Alberta, residents of Lacombe -Ponoka, Al and Doris Chis well; my son, Roland Starke, who’s a resident of Edmonton-Highlands-Norwood and is a second-year seminary student at Concordia Lutheran Seminary; and my mom, who turned 90 two weeks before April 23. Because I was otherwise occupied, I was unable to celebrate her birthday with her on that day. Some Hon.

Members: Shame. Dr. Starke: That’s pretty much what she said, too. I’d also like to say that she is a resident of Edmonton-Calder . Last, but certainly not least, my partner and best friend, my wife, Alison, who is a resident of Vermilion -Lloydminster and actually got to vote for me. Please join in giving them the traditional warm greeting of the members of the Assembly. The Speaker: We’ll proceed with some points of order, then. The hon. Member for Airdrie. Mr. Anderson: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’d like to refer to our standing orders in Standing Order 23, particularly (h), (i), and (j).

Would you like me to proceed with both of them at the same time? The Speaker: Let’s do one first. Point of Order Factual Accuracy Mr. Anderson: One first. Okay. Well, the first one that I stood on was with regard to a statement made opposite by the Premier implying, of course, that the former member of this Legislature, Mr. Paul Hinman, who is no longer a member in this House, specifically did not pay back the money that he received from the illustrious no-meet committee. As you saw, Mr.

Hinman asked the Legislative Assembly Office whether he had received any money for sitting on that no -meet committee, and he received a letter in return very clearly indicating – and that letter was tabled earlier – that he had not received a dime for sitting on that committee. So I would ask somebody over there to retract the Premier’s statement on that because it was just absolutely untrue. The Speaker: The hon. Government House Leader to respond. Mr. Hancock: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Well, there’s no point of order, obviously, because 23(h), as I read it, says: “makes allegations against another Member.” Unfortunately for the former Member for Calgary-Glenmore, he ’s no longer a member, so no allegation was made against a member. That would be a technicality, however.

The reality that we’ve seen over the course of this rather unfortunate discussion about a no-meet committee: all members who are in this House and th ose who aspired to the House should know the amount of work that every MLA on every side of the House has put in, fully deserving the compensation they get for the work that they do.

On this whole issue about a no-meet committee, particularly one like the Standing Committee on Privileges and Elections, Standing Orders and Printing, which should only meet in the rarest of circumstances – you don’t change your standing orders every day, and you certainly don’t want to meet in a court on questions of privilege every day – everybody knows that that committee is not supposed to meet, and everybody knows that people were being compensated for the work they did.

That aside, one can understand the confusion when in one day in the press the former Member for Calgary -Glenmore is quoted as saying that he’s not going to pay any money back because he worked very hard for every dollar he got, and quite frankly I agree with him, and then the very next day – it was a Friday and a Saturday, as I recall – somebody must have talked to him because he’s very quickly then saying he is going to pay all the money back. Then all of a sudden he discovered he was right in the first place, perhaps in accordance with what now is being tabled in the

94 Alberta Hansard May 30, 2012 House, that he didn’t have any money to pay back in the first place. You know, this stuff gets bandied around in the public by people who make statements and impugn the character of people without knowing the facts and then expect . . . Mr. Anderson: Just like the Premier just did. Mr. Hancock: No. With all due respect, the members opposite made this an issue for their own political gain when they didn’t have the facts, and they knew what they were talking about was inappropriate.

They knew what they were talking about was trying to besmirch the character of members who work hard on all sides of the House, and now they’re upset because that information that was public now may be, by the filings that they put in place, rendered to be something different than what was understood publicly. If tha t’s the case, that the hon. member didn’t owe any money . . . The Speaker: Hon. Government House Leader, thank you. I think this is a point of clarification. It has been sufficiently commented on and clarified. We’re going to move on. You had the second point of order, hon. Government House Leader.

Point of Order Allegations against a Member Mr. Hancock: Mr. Speaker, yes, under Standing Order 23(h), making allegations against another member; (i), imputing false or unavowed motives to another member; (j), using abusive or insulting language. In my view this is a point of order. The hon. Member for Lac La Biche-St. Paul -Two Hills raised during his question an allegation, as I recall the wording, that the Premier, who is a member of the House, accepted illegal donations. Mr.

Speaker, first of all, I think also under House of Commons Procedure and Practice, 2nd edition – I probably should be using the third edition now –

chapter 11, pages 501, 502, and 503, sets out some very clear rules relative to questions, and I think all members should be availing themselves of the opportunity to read and understand these . The allegation that the hon. member made, as I recall it, was in the supplementary, in which he shouldn’t have been making an allegation because there is n’t supposed to be a

preamble to supplementaries, created disorder, reflects on the character or conduct of members of the House, asks a question which is outside of the administrative responsibility of the government – and that was a question about party financing – but also presumes that there was, in fact, an illegal donation. Mr.

Speaker, we don’t know that. 3:00 Just because the hon. member presumably was referring to what has since been tabled, a statement released under a FOIP request, obviously, about something that Mount Royal may have done in the past, what they do not know is whether or not that was caught at the time and returned, as has been the situation in many circumstances that I’m personally aware of where a donor or somebody who was attending a function made a cheque on behalf of an organization that wasn’t supposed to.

You immediately catch that, and then you go back and say, “You can’t do it this way,” and the individual who is attending makes his own personal cheque. That might have h appened. There may be all sorts of explanations around that, but the hon. member didn’t give the Premier or any other member of the House an opportunity to deal with the issue in an appropriate way because they brought it to the House to malign the charact er of a member rather than sending it to the Chief Electoral Officer for a proper investigation, which he fully ought to know should be done. Mr.

Anderson: It’s good to be back in this House, seeing such passionate defences given. First off, in response t o the Government House Leader, the member did not at any time say that the Premier did anything illegal. The exact text of the question, which I’m sure he can look up after, was: “Given that the Premier herself is at the core of the problem by passing a law,” which we all know is true, “that makes convicted political parties unaccountable to Albertans and now that her own riding,” referring to her riding association, “has accepted illegal donations, how can Albertans believe . . .” and so forth.

Clearly, he was not saying that the Premier did anything illegal. He was saying that her riding association accepted illegal dona- tions. We stand by the document that was tabled. If that document is false, then I invite the government to prove that it’s false. It sure doesn’t look false on the face of it, but perhaps it is. An answer was not given. But clearly this member did not impugn the character of the Premier. It is the riding association that has accepted illegal donations. Secondly, with regard to

preambles we know that there is a long-standing tradition in this House – we’ve been using it for certainly as long as I’ve been here – that in your

preambles you can say at the beginning of a question “given that,” preface it that way, and then go on to the question so that there’s some context to the

preamble. Otherwise, people listening at home wouldn’t have a clue what we were talking about. So we’ve been using that. Clearly, in his question he said “given that,” so he did not abuse that privilege. Actually, it w as a very short question. When he read it, it was roughly 20 seconds long, which is about half as long as this minister’s answers to most questions in the House. I think it was a fair question, and I think clarification has been given. The Speaker: Are there others?

Hon. members, you will recall that the chair interjected on three or four occasions when this line of questioning was being pursued or different comments were being made with respect to the issue at hand. I want to just make a point here. I’ve been in this Assembly a long time. Some of you have been here as long as I have, and one person has been here even longer. It’s a very, very fine line we tread when we start making comments that might malign someone’s character or, as I stated in my credo speech, making comments that amount, perhaps, to character assassination or whatever.

Stating that a member is or has been or was engaged in some form of illegal activity certainly constitutes an allegation against a member under Standing Order 23(h). I understand that, and I’m sure you do as well. However, there has been no finding of illegality in this matter, at least not to the chair’s knowledge. If you find that there are issues like this and you want to do the proper research on it, there are offices of the Ethics Commis - sioner. There are offices of the Privacy Commissioner.

Anything concerning a possible conflict of interest: the chair would strongly advise you to avail yourselves of those independent officers. This issue, however, is of a serious enough nature that I’m going to actually take a day to read the actual Hansard. I haven’t had all the Blues provided to me yet. I’m not prepared to make a ruling on it, honestly, right now, but I will make a firm ruling on it

May 30, 2012 Alberta Hansard 95 tomorrow, and I hope it will bring the tone and the timbre of questions like this under greater focus for each of the members. Third point of order, the hon. Member for Airdrie. Point of Order Factual Accuracy Mr. Anderson: Well, Mr. Speaker, it go es to something that was said by the Deputy Premier – God bless his soul – when he said in his statement that the Member for Lac La Biche-St. Paul -Two Hills in his question had accused the Premier of doing something illegal.

When you review the Blues, if they are consistent with what this member was reading off , the paper that he was reading from when he asked the question, then you will see that, in fact, he was simply pointing out that the Premier’s riding had accepted illegal donations.

If we’re not able in this House to come forward and discuss an issue and question the government on whether their riding associa- tions or whether the Premier, the most powerful person in the province, or her constituency association is accepting illegal donations and why we can’t ask the Justice minister to change the law to keep that from happening or disclosing the information – as you eloquently put it, Mr. Speaker, we would like to know these things. We would like to know whether it was illegal or not, but we’ll never know because Elections Alberta is prohibited from telling us.

There’s nothing the Ethics Commissioner or anyone can do for us that will allow us to know if anything illegal was done as long as this cloak of secrecy is maintained by the government. I would say again that this member did not say that the Premier did anything illegal but did say that there were illegal donations accepted by her riding association, as was lined out by the documents tabled by the Leader of the Official Opposition. The Speaker: The hon. Government House Leader. Mr. Hancock: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Well, the hon. member failed to provide any citations, so I’m not exactly sure what he’s suggesting in here. However, let me say this. Really, the root of what we’re talking about here is the fact that every member who runs for office and every member that gets elected to this House brings with them one thing that’s exceedingly important, and that’s their integrity. One ought not, as we’ve seen rather much lately, including an overamount of it today, throw around words like “corruption” and “accepting illegal contributions” and that sort of language loosely. One should not do it loosely.

In fact, one would have been very tempted to raise a point of order during Members’ Statements, which, of course, we’re not allowed to do, when the hon. member who just raised this point of order accused a couple of people of being liars, absolutely inappropriate language for the House. One of the things that we have to have for respectful debate in the H ouse is respect for each other and respect for the processes that are necessary when things are perceived to be wrong.

One shouldn’t immediately jump to the observation that somebody has done something illegal if there’s an opportunity to have it fully, fa irly, impartially investigated by an officer of this House. As you’ve already mentioned, Mr. Speaker, we have an Ethics Commissioner and a Chief Electoral Officer, and there are appropriate ways to investigate. There has been a lot said about secrecy. What the hon. member ought to do is go back and read two acts, the Election Act and the Election Finances and Contributions Disclosure Act. The Election Act has

section 4.2, which was put in there, talking about the privacy of an investigation. I’ve heard him say in the House that it’s appropriate to keep investigations private, and I think it is. It’s not appropriate to be going out there and besmirching the character of individuals because there’s an investigation on. That’s exactly the root of what we’ve be en talking about here today. One shouldn’t jump to besmirching the character of individuals by throwing around allegations of corruption or of illegal contributions or of accepting illegal contributions.

They should put it into the appropriate place where an investigation can happen. Now, if the hon. member would read the Election Finances and Contributions Disclosure Act, there’s nothing in that act which prohibits the Chief Electoral Officer from disclosing the results of an investigation. Mr. Anderson: That’s not what he says, Dave. Mr. Hancock: That may not be what he says, but if he reads the act – you’re a lawyer; I’m a lawyer – the Election Act prohibits disclosure of certain information to certain circumstances.

The Chief Electoral Officer can put i n place fines, the Chief Electoral Officer can direct that contributions be returned, and the Chief Electoral Officer can provide information to the prosecution service to look into whether there should be a prosecution. There are options available for the Chief Electoral Officer. 3:10 I’d ask the hon. member to read that, to make representation, if he will, to the Chief Electoral Officer about what should be appropriately done.

But do not besmirch the character and integrity of any member of this House or, quite frankly, anybody else until appropriate investigations are done. There are all sorts of appropriate explanations for some of the things that have been thrown around in this House. People do things in our political organizations. It’s all volun - teers. These are all good people. In my organization they’re good people; I’m sure in his organization are good people. They don’t all read the rules all the time. But we do put in place – I hope he does; I know we do – appropriate ways to screen to make sure that the rules are followed.

So when a cheque comes from someone who’s not entitled to send you a cheque, you send it back. If you don’t catch it at that screen, you return the funds. If you look at the donations that were made to Calgary -Elbow, for exa mple, in 2008, all of which have to be reported if they’re over $300, I’m sure you would not find any illegal contributions disclosed there. What does that tell you? Well, it may tell you that somebody took care of it at the source.

One could make that as sumption if one was open and honest about the fact that we all come here with our integrity intact and that we intend to do the honourable thing for the people of Alberta. If you didn’t want to believe that or you thought something might be askew, there’s an appropriate way to go and have it investigated.

I’d encourage you to ask the hon. members opposite to understand that because it will make the House operate much better for the next four years if we don’t automatically assume that everybody comes here with foul motives and, instead, assume, as we ought to do, that everybody comes here with their integrity intact to do things in the best interests of Albertans. The Speaker: Thank you, hon. members. I was interested to allow this air-clearing to proceed.

I t’s a coattail to the previous point of order, actually, which I will be considering, as I mentioned, through the night and reading Hansard carefully through before ruling on that. On this particular point of order I find there’s an issue of clarification here. I hope that the Member for Airdrie feels satisfied, having made his statements. The Government House

96 Alberta Hansard May 30, 2012 Leader has made his. I think we can move on to the final com- ment. We have one more point of order to deal with. I believe it’s the hon. Government House Leader’s. Mr. Hancock: Mr. Speaker, I think we’ve beat this to death, and I think we should let our members proceed with their maiden speeches in response to the Speech from the Throne. The Speaker: That point of order has been withdrawn, then. Privilege Misleading the House The Speaker: Before proceeding with that, I would like to rule on the issue of privilege.

Hon. members, the chair is prepared now to do so with respect to the purported question of privilege that was raised by the hon. Member for Lac La Biche-St. Paul-Two Hills in the Assembly yesterday afternoon. As I indicated yesterday at page 60 of Hansard, notice was provided by the member and received in the Speaker’s office at 11:18 a.m., so the requirements of Standing Order 15(2) with respect to notice have been met, although the chair will have a few words about the notice a bit later.

The basis of the member’s question of privilege concerned comments made by the Minister of Justice and Solicitor General on May 28 during question period a bout a former Chief Electoral Officer’s recommendations on am endments to legislation concerning improper contributions to political parties. The exchange giving rise to the question of privilege is found at page 17 of Hansard for that day. As was the case with the purporte d question of privilege that the chair ruled on yesterday, the allegation raised by the Member for Lac La Biche-St.

Paul-Two Hills actually falls into the category of a contempt of the Assembly, which is treated as a question of privilege. As the chair also explained yesterday at page 58 of Hansard, any act or omission which tends to impede the House in the performance of its functions or obstructs or impedes any member or officer in the discharge of their duties may be treated by the Assembly as a contempt. Hon. members, the test for fi nding a prima facie question of privilege on deliberately misleadi ng the Assembly is a very high bar. A question of privilege on this subject was brought forward last fall.

On November 24, 2011, Speaker Kowalski stated at page 1367 of Hansard: “Deliberately misleading the Assembly is an extremely serious allegation, which seldom satisfies the test for constituting a prima facie question of privilege.” As stated by the Member for Lac La Biche-St. Paul-Two Hills yesterday in his submission, the test is referred to at page 86 in House of Commons Pr ocedure and Practice , second edition.

The test was articulated by David McGee, a former Clerk of the New Zealand House of Representatives, and is found in the third edition of his book Parliamentary Practice in New Zealand, 2005, at pages 653 and 654, where he states: There are three elements to be established when it is alleged that a member is in contempt by reason of a statement that the member has made: the statement must, in fact, have been misleading; it must be established that the member making the statement knew at the time the statement was made that it was incorrect; and, in making it, the member must have intended to mislead the House.

This was, in fact, the test used by Speaker Kowalski in the purported question of privilege last fall and also in his ruling of November 7, 2007, which is recorded at pages 1860 and 1861 of Hansard for that day. In his submissions yesterday the Minister of Justice and Solicitor General was very clear that, in his view, his statements on this subject during Monday’ s question period were not misleading.

He stated at pages 59 and 60 of yesterday’s Hansard, “I stand by them completely .” Given the strength of his convictions on this point it could not be said that he intended to mislead the Assembly, and even if the minister was mistaken, there is no evidence that anyone was actually misled. At best, this is a disagreem ent about

interpretation between members, which occurs not infreque ntly in this Chamber. At best. Some might also say that this is even less infrequent between two lawyers. As Beauchesne’s, sixth edition, states at paragraph 494: It has been formally ruled by Speakers that statements by Members respecting themselves and particularly within their own knowledge must be accepted. It is not unparliamentary temperately to criticize statements . . . by Members as being contrary to the facts; but no im putation of intentional falsehood is permissible.

On rare occasions this may result in the House having to accept two contradictory accounts of the same incident. In short, this matter would not have given rise to a successful point of order, let alone a prim a facie question of privilege. Accordingly, the chair finds that there is no prima facie question of privilege, and the matter is thereby concluded. However, the chair would like to make a few additional brief comments. Questions of privilege are the most serious matters that can be considered by this Assembly and should not be taken lightly.

A charge of deliberately misleading the Assembly is very serious and could damage a person’s reputation forever.

The Speaker, this Speaker in particular, adopts the comment made by Speaker Kowalski in his November 24, 2011, ruling at page 1368 of Hansard. “However, the chair would ask members to carefully consider bringing forward matters that call into question the integrity of other members when the evidence is less than convincing.” Your chair wanted to grant the member bringing the purported question of privilege forward the greatest leeway, but frankly I was concerned when the notice for the serious charge did not actually contain the name of the member against whom the allegation was being brought.

In the interests of fairness and parliamentary tradition, members should please ensure that their notices contain sufficient information to allow for a proper response by the person against w hom they are brought. This is especially true where the issue is as serious as the allegation brought forward yesterday and on which I have just ruled today. 3:20 head: Orders of the Day head: Consideration of His Honour head: the Lieutenant Governor’s Speech Ms Olesen moved, seconded by Mr. Luan, that an humble address be presented to His Honour the Honourable the Lieutenant Governor as follows.

To His Honour the Honourable Colonel (Retired) Donald S. Ethell, OC, OMM, AOE, MSC, CD, LLD, the Lieutenant Gover- nor of the Province of Alberta: We, Her Majesty’s most dutiful and loyal subjects, the Legislative Assembly, now assemb led, beg leave to thank Your Honour for the gracious speech Your Honour has been pleased to address to us at the opening of the present session. [Adjourned debate May 29: Mr. Dorward] The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Mountain View.

May 30, 2012 Alberta Hansard 97 Dr. Swann: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. It’s a great honour to stand and speak to the throne speech for 2012 in this Assembly. Like many Albertans, I looked forward to the throne speech, looking for signs of a clear direction, a plan, a fiscal commitment, a clear sense of how we would balance our expenditures with our revenues, and like many Albertans, I was disappointed.

The Premier identified through the throne speech a global economic recovery under way, and that set the tone, to me, for a speech that lacked real groundedness, a real sense of the instability of our global economy, and the need to take very seriously an unstable future, an unstable resource revenue stream – that has always been the challenge for Alberta to deal with – the instability of our primary resource, our most valued commodity in this province and one of which we are all greatly proud and benefit from.

The government’s budget of the past couple of months clearly relies heavily on this quite uncertain assertion of recovery and continues decades of addiction to this nonrenewable resource wealth, 25 and sometimes 35 per cent of our budget on a year -to- year basis, holding hostage, I would say, our future, our children’s resource wealth, and living off an uncertain future to pay for today’s expenses, an indicator from many authors in the world of a petrostate, very consistent with how most states function in the world when they are so reliant on the hydrocarbon industry and fail to make judicious decisions in the long -term interests of the public, fail to enact tax policy that is realistic and deals with current needs and pays for what we do today but, rather, lives on a wing and a prayer that these resources will be there and that periodically we will accept going into deficits in spite of having the greatest wealth in the country.

Not leadership, not responsible governance. We will continue to ra ise very pressing questions on behalf of citizens, our children, our grandchildren, and the unborn genera - tions yet to come to this place that are looking for a more thoughtful approach, one that we, I think, on this side, in the Liberal caucus at least, f eel has been addressed to some extent through our platform for a fair and progressive tax system that would address the basic needs of our people, our primary service needs: education, health care, persons with disabilities.

Some of the unmet needs of cris is and emergency that we can anticipate every year – floods, fires, major disasters – we need to plan for. Again, that is part of a fair and responsible tax system. Our fiscal plan charts, of course, then, not just for this next couple of years but for the long term and would ensure that we are taking in as a government what we intend to spend this fiscal year.

It’s been a tradition since I got into this House that every year this government comes back for supplementary supply, millions and millions of dollars that are unbudgeted, and any talk of fair tax, a review of tax falls on deaf ears. This is not leadership. To quote from the Speech from the Throne, Albertans chose to “engage with the world around them and, through investment and innovation” we see opportunities.

I would love to see leadership in this province on an alternate energy future, on new technologies, a knowledge-based future, that we could be in the forefront of given the wealth and the wonderful postsecondary opportunities we have here. It has to do with planning. It has to do with investment.

It has to do with seeing education as an investment, not an expense to be cut, not on the backs of students and faculty and their support services, that have seen continued dwindling over the past decade to the point where not only are they constrained from a physical budget point of view, but they are constrained by an attitude of mean-spiritedness that they feel coming from this government and the lack of resources, the lack of a positive relation ship and a position of coming with real opportunity that these postsecondary institutions bring. That needs to change.

We are pressing again for a plan that sees a real honouring and a commitment to the long-term future of this province with alternate economies based on good postsecondary investment, research, development, and an embracing of the 21st century that has us moving beyond a resource economy that is extracting and exporting. We need leadership there. In addition, public services are continuing to be dependent on revenue from this nonrenewable resource side. People continue to suffer in Alberta, where we have something in the order of 15 per cent of children in poverty.

We have increasing numbers of people with mental illness, disability, on th e margins of society, ending up in health care services, ending up in addiction services, ending up in the criminal justice system because we’ve not seen fit to both bring in the resources we need to ensure that we deal with these issues early, preventivel y in schools and in disadvantaged families and in mental health services and health services, getting at the root of these issues in an early fashion by investing appro- priately and bringing in the dough to make sure that we can do that as opposed to nicke l and diming people, including our seniors, who are struggling, in some instances at least, to pay for their accommodation and some of the health care needs that are essential to them.

Our social supports in this province since the ’90s have continued to be 30 per cent less than they were in the ’90s. We are not supporting people on the margins of society, and therefore we are paying through the nose in some of these ways: in emergency departments, in addictions services, and the criminal justice system.

The decision was made to pay off the debt in the ’90s – there was some rationale for that – but it was made on the backs of some of our most vulnerable people, and we continue to do that: our most vulnerable people, children growing up in poverty and continuing the cycle of poverty, mental illness, learning problems, behaviour problems. Because of this decision and our unwillingness to take in resources adequate to the real needs of our citizens, we have among the highest rates of family violence, depression, addictions, suicide.

It’s understandable in some ways with a very wealthy economy but not acceptable and not something that we can at all be proud of when we know the answers lie in committing ourselves to investing in people and long -term well-being i n the province. The Premier through the speech promised greater openness, transparency, and accountability.

Hard to swallow on the heels of a Premier that just flip -flopped on a commitment to a public inquiry into serious problems in the health care syst em: intimidation, bullying, examples of financial mismanagement and spending, and evidence from the Auditor General in the past four years at least of serious problems in financial management in Alberta Health Services that have never been addressed.

It’s hard to swallow the words “more openness and accounta - bility” when we see a report from Ontario in these past six months identifying Alberta as the least open, the least accessible to information, the least accountable of the provinces in this examination of the provinces and their access to information and freedom of information. 3:30 We’ve long complained in the budget process about the lack of details on where our money is going. We’re talking millions of dollars in a line item without any details to be able to identify whether or not they are appropriate expenditures. We know,

98 Alberta Hansard May 30, 2012 indeed, of contracts without an open process. Bill 50 is a good example of that, where we see up to $16 billion planned to be spent on major power line structures, with no ident ification of any bidding process. We have the three big power producers taking their share. That’s all we see. This in not openness. It’s not accountability. It’s not transparency. We heard from the Auditor not too long ago about the lack of openness of the Energy department on what it is Albertans should be expecting from the returns on our production.

Understanding that the ERCB actually measures our production in fossil fuels and is mostly funded by the industry gives us pause and, I hope, pressure to m ove beyond industry -managed resource accounta- bility. We’ve seen that in the oil sands, where the industry has been monitoring itself. We also heard from the Auditor General that he is concerned that we don’t know how much of our resource accurately is being produced. Therefore, we do not know yet how much revenue we should be receiving from a publicly owned resource.

Critical public sectors – education, health, municipal services – with a tenuous relationship to this government, a fractious rela - tionship between unions and government and a perception, at least, that this governme

Document details

Collection	Alberta — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	20120530
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	L28 S1 20120530 1330 01 han.pdf
Language	en
Format	json
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Identifier	35612c0d7f12cd75d83a083cd5b8cd40e475759a

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