British Columbia Hansard — 4 March 2020, p.m., Issue 323 (41st Parliament, 5th Session)

20200304pm-Hansard-n323

British Columbia — Debates (Hansard)

Fifth Session, 41st Parliament OFFICIAL REPORT OF DEBATES (HANSARD) Wednesday, March 4, 2020 Afternoon Sitting Issue No. 323 THE HONOURABLE DARRYL PLECAS, SPEAKER ISSN 1499-2175

PROVINCE OF BRITISH COLUMBIA (Entered Confederation July 20, 1871) LIEUTENANT-GOVERNOR Her Honour the Honourable Janet Austin, OBC Fifth Session, 41st Parliament SPEAKER OF THE LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Honourable Darryl Plecas EXECUTIVE COUNCIL Premier and President of the Executive Council ............................................................................................................... Hon. John Horgan Deputy Premier and Minister of Finance ...........................................................................................................................Hon.

Carole James Minister of Advanced Education, Skills and Training..................................................................................................... Hon. Melanie Mark Minister of Agriculture.........................................................................................................................................................Hon. Lana Popham Attorney General.................................................................................................................................................................Hon.

David Eby, QC Minister of Children and Family Development ............................................................................................................ Hon. Katrine Conroy Minister of State for Child Care...................................................................................................................................... Hon. Katrina Chen Minister of Citizens’ Services...................................................................................................................................................Hon.

Anne Kang Minister of Education ............................................................................................................................................................ Hon. Rob Fleming Minister of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources ..................................................................................................... Hon. Bruce Ralston Minister of Environment and Climate Change Strategy............................................................................................. Hon.

George Heyman Minister of Forests, Lands, Natural Resource Operations and Rural Development ..............................................Hon. Doug Donaldson Minister of Health .....................................................................................................................................................................Hon. Adrian Dix Minister of Indigenous Relations and Reconciliation ......................................................................................................... Hon.

Scott Fraser Minister of Jobs, Economic Development and Competitiveness.............................................................................Hon. Michelle Mungall Minister of State for Trade...............................................................................................................................................Hon. George Chow Minister of Labour ...................................................................................................................................................................Hon.

Harry Bains Minister of Mental Health and Addictions............................................................................................................................ Hon. Judy Darcy Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing.................................................................................................................. Hon. Selina Robinson Minister of Public Safety and Solicitor General ........................................................................................................... Hon.

Mike Farnworth Minister of Social Development and Poverty Reduction..............................................................................................Hon. Shane Simpson Minister of Tourism, Arts and Culture.....................................................................................................................................Hon. Lisa Beare Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure................................................................................................................ Hon.

Claire Trevena LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Leader of the Official Opposition................................................................................................................................Andrew Wilkinson, QC Leader of the Third Party .................................................................................................................................................................Adam Olsen Deputy Speaker................................................................................................................................................................................

Raj Chouhan Assistant Deputy Speaker............................................................................................................................................................. Simon Gibson Deputy Chair, Committee of the Whole ................................................................................................................ Spencer Chandra Herbert Clerk of the Legislative Assembly ...........................................................................................................................................

Kate Ryan-Lloyd Clerk Assistant — Committees and Interparliamentary Relations ..........................................................................................Susan Sourial Associate Law Clerk ..............................................................................................................................................Loredana Catalli-Sonier, QC Law Clerk and Parliamentary Counsel............................................................................................................................................ S.

Suzie Seo Acting Sergeant-at-Arms..................................................................................................................................................................Greg Nelson

ALPHABETICAL LIST OF MEMBERS Ashton, Dan (BC Liberal) ......................................................................... Penticton Bains, Hon. Harry (NDP)................................................................ Surrey-Newton Barnett, Donna (BC Liberal) .....................................................Cariboo-Chilcotin Beare, Hon. Lisa (NDP)..............................................

Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows Begg, Garry (NDP) .......................................................................Surrey-Guildford Bernier, Mike (BC Liberal) .........................................................Peace River South Bond, Shirley (BC Liberal)...........................................Prince George–Valemount Brar, Jagrup (NDP).......................................................................Surrey-Fleetwood Cadieux, Stephanie (BC Liberal)........................................................

Surrey South Chandra Herbert, Spencer (NDP) .......................................Vancouver–West End Chen, Hon. Katrina (NDP)...................................................... Burnaby-Lougheed Chouhan, Raj (NDP) .................................................................Burnaby-Edmonds Chow, Hon. George (NDP).................................................Vancouver-Fraserview Clovechok, Doug (BC Liberal) ..................................Columbia River–Revelstoke Coleman, Rich (BC Liberal) ................................................................ Langley East Conroy, Hon.

Katrine (NDP)...........................................................Kootenay West Darcy, Hon. Judy (NDP) ............................................................. New Westminster Davies, Dan (BC Liberal) ........................................................... Peace River North de Jong, Michael, QC (BC Liberal) ..............................................Abbotsford West Dean, Mitzi (NDP)................................................................ Esquimalt-Metchosin D’Eith, Bob (NDP) ................................................................Maple Ridge–Mission Dix, Hon.

Adrian (NDP)....................................................... Vancouver-Kingsway Donaldson, Hon. Doug (NDP)...................................................................... Stikine Eby, Hon. David, QC (NDP).............................................. Vancouver–Point Grey Elmore, Mable (NDP).........................................................Vancouver-Kensington Farnworth, Hon. Mike (NDP) ........................................................Port Coquitlam Fleming, Hon. Rob (NDP) ......................................................

Victoria–Swan Lake Foster, Eric (BC Liberal).............................................................Vernon-Monashee Fraser, Hon. Scott (NDP) ..................................................Mid Island–Pacific Rim Furstenau, Sonia (BC Green Party) .............................................Cowichan Valley Gibson, Simon (BC Liberal) ...................................................Abbotsford-Mission Glumac, Rick (NDP).........................................................Port Moody–Coquitlam Heyman, Hon. George (NDP) ................................................Vancouver-Fairview Horgan, Hon.

John (NDP) ................................................ Langford–Juan de Fuca Hunt, Marvin (BC Liberal) ........................................................ Surrey-Cloverdale Isaacs, Joan (BC Liberal) .......................................... Coquitlam–Burke Mountain James, Hon. Carole (NDP).................................................... Victoria–Beacon Hill Johal, Jas (BC Liberal).................................................Richmond-Queensborough Kahlon, Ravi (NDP)............................................................................... Delta North Kang, Hon.

Anne (NDP)......................................................... Burnaby–Deer Lake Kyllo, Greg (BC Liberal)..............................................................................Shuswap Larson, Linda (BC Liberal) .............................................. Boundary-Similkameen Lee, Michael (BC Liberal) ........................................................Vancouver-Langara Leonard, Ronna-Rae (NDP) ..................................................... Courtenay-Comox Letnick, Norm (BC Liberal).............................................

Kelowna–Lake Country Ma, Bowinn (NDP) .....................................................North Vancouver–Lonsdale Malcolmson, Sheila (NDP) ........................................................................Nanaimo Mark, Hon. Melanie (NDP) .......................................Vancouver–Mount Pleasant Martin, John (BC Liberal)....................................................................... Chilliwack Milobar, Peter (BC Liberal)..................................... Kamloops–North Thompson Morris, Mike (BC Liberal) ........................................... Prince George–Mackenzie Mungall, Hon.

Michelle (NDP)......................................................Nelson-Creston Oakes, Coralee (BC Liberal) ............................................................ Cariboo North Olsen, Adam (BC Green Party)............................ Saanich North and the Islands Paton, Ian (BC Liberal).......................................................................... Delta South Plecas, Hon. Darryl (Ind.) ........................................................... Abbotsford South Polak, Mary (BC Liberal) ............................................................................. Langley Popham, Hon.

Lana (NDP)............................................................... Saanich South Ralston, Hon. Bruce (NDP) ............................................................Surrey-Whalley Redies, Tracy (BC Liberal) .......................................................Surrey–White Rock Reid, Linda (BC Liberal) ................................................. Richmond South Centre Rice, Jennifer (NDP) ............................................................................. North Coast Robinson, Hon.

Selina (NDP) .........................................Coquitlam-Maillardville Ross, Ellis (BC Liberal)................................................................................... Skeena Routledge, Janet (NDP) ....................................................................Burnaby North Routley, Doug (NDP) ................................................. Nanaimo–North Cowichan Rustad, John (BC Liberal) ................................................................Nechako Lakes Shypitka, Tom (BC Liberal) ..............................................................

Kootenay East Simons, Nicholas (NDP) ......................................... Powell River–Sunshine Coast Simpson, Hon. Shane (NDP)..................................................Vancouver-Hastings Sims, Jinny (NDP) ........................................................................ Surrey-Panorama Singh, Rachna (NDP) .........................................................Surrey–Green Timbers Stewart, Ben (BC Liberal) ................................................................. Kelowna West Stilwell, Michelle (BC Liberal)...............................................

Parksville-Qualicum Stone, Todd (BC Liberal)..........................................Kamloops–South Thompson Sturdy, Jordan (BC Liberal)........................................ West Vancouver–Sea to Sky Sullivan, Sam (BC Liberal)................................................ Vancouver–False Creek Sultan, Ralph (BC Liberal) ...........................................West Vancouver–Capilano Tegart, Jackie (BC Liberal) ................................................................. Fraser-Nicola Thomson, Steve (BC Liberal)......................................................

Kelowna-Mission Thornthwaite, Jane (BC Liberal) ...............................North Vancouver–Seymour Throness, Laurie (BC Liberal) .......................................................Chilliwack-Kent Trevena, Hon. Claire (NDP) ................................................................North Island Wat, Teresa (BC Liberal) ................................................. Richmond North Centre Weaver, Dr.

Andrew (Ind.)................................................Oak Bay–Gordon Head Wilkinson, Andrew, QC (BC Liberal) ................................Vancouver-Quilchena Y ap, John (BC Liberal)............................................................Richmond-Steveston LIST OF MEMBERS BY RIDING Abbotsford-Mission............................................................................Simon Gibson Abbotsford South....................................................................... Hon. Darryl Plecas Abbotsford West......................................................................

Michael de Jong, QC Boundary-Similkameen...................................................................... Linda Larson Burnaby–Deer Lake....................................................................... Hon. Anne Kang Burnaby-Edmonds................................................................................Raj Chouhan Burnaby-Lougheed .................................................................... Hon. Katrina Chen Burnaby North .................................................................................

Janet Routledge Cariboo-Chilcotin .............................................................................Donna Barnett Cariboo North.................................................................................... Coralee Oakes Chilliwack ............................................................................................... John Martin Chilliwack-Kent ...............................................................................Laurie Throness Columbia River–Revelstoke .........................................................

Doug Clovechok Coquitlam–Burke Mountain.................................................................. Joan Isaacs Coquitlam-Maillardville ...................................................... Hon. Selina Robinson Courtenay-Comox................................................................... Ronna-Rae Leonard Cowichan Valley .............................................................................

Sonia Furstenau Delta North.............................................................................................Ravi Kahlon Delta South ..................................................................................................Ian Paton Esquimalt-Metchosin ..............................................................................Mitzi Dean Fraser-Nicola .........................................................................................

Jackie Tegart Kamloops–North Thompson .............................................................Peter Milobar Kamloops–South Thompson..................................................................Todd Stone Kelowna–Lake Country .....................................................................Norm Letnick Kelowna-Mission ..............................................................................

Steve Thomson Kelowna West ..........................................................................................Ben Stewart Kootenay East.......................................................................................Tom Shypitka Kootenay West........................................................................ Hon. Katrine Conroy Langford–Juan de Fuca .............................................................. Hon. John Horgan Langley .....................................................................................................

Mary Polak Langley East.........................................................................................Rich Coleman Maple Ridge–Mission.............................................................................. Bob D’Eith Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows............................................................Hon. Lisa Beare Mid Island–Pacific Rim................................................................ Hon. Scott Fraser Nanaimo......................................................................................

Sheila Malcolmson Nanaimo–North Cowichan............................................................... Doug Routley Nechako Lakes........................................................................................ John Rustad Nelson-Creston ................................................................... Hon. Michelle Mungall New Westminster........................................................................... Hon. Judy Darcy North Coast ...........................................................................................

Jennifer Rice North Island.............................................................................. Hon. Claire Trevena North Vancouver–Lonsdale................................................................... Bowinn Ma North Vancouver–Seymour........................................................Jane Thornthwaite Oak Bay–Gordon Head............................................................Dr.

Andrew Weaver Parksville-Qualicum.......................................................................Michelle Stilwell Peace River North ................................................................................... Dan Davies Peace River South ................................................................................ Mike Bernier Penticton ................................................................................................. Dan Ashton Port Coquitlam...................................................................... Hon.

Mike Farnworth Port Moody–Coquitlam.......................................................................Rick Glumac Powell River–Sunshine Coast....................................................... Nicholas Simons Prince George–Mackenzie....................................................................Mike Morris Prince George–Valemount ..................................................................

Shirley Bond Richmond North Centre..........................................................................Teresa Wat Richmond-Queensborough.........................................................................Jas Johal Richmond South Centre ......................................................................... Linda Reid Richmond-Steveston ...................................................................................

John Y ap Saanich North and the Islands .............................................................Adam Olsen Saanich South .............................................................................Hon. Lana Popham Shuswap...................................................................................................... Greg Kyllo Skeena........................................................................................................... Ellis Ross Stikine....................................................................................Hon.

Doug Donaldson Surrey-Cloverdale ................................................................................ Marvin Hunt Surrey-Fleetwood.....................................................................................Jagrup Brar Surrey–Green Timbers........................................................................Rachna Singh Surrey-Guildford......................................................................................Garry Begg Surrey-Newton ..............................................................................Hon.

Harry Bains Surrey-Panorama ...................................................................................... Jinny Sims Surrey South ................................................................................ Stephanie Cadieux Surrey-Whalley ......................................................................... Hon. Bruce Ralston Surrey–White Rock .............................................................................. Tracy Redies Vancouver-Fairview.............................................................. Hon.

George Heyman Vancouver–False Creek........................................................................ Sam Sullivan Vancouver-Fraserview...............................................................Hon. George Chow Vancouver-Hastings ............................................................... Hon. Shane Simpson Vancouver-Kensington....................................................................... Mable Elmore Vancouver-Kingsway..................................................................... Hon.

Adrian Dix Vancouver-Langara................................................................................ Michael Lee Vancouver–Mount Pleasant..................................................... Hon. Melanie Mark Vancouver–Point Grey ............................................................Hon.

David Eby, QC Vancouver-Quilchena........................................................Andrew Wilkinson, QC Vancouver–West End .....................................................Spencer Chandra Herbert Vernon-Monashee ....................................................................................Eric Foster Victoria–Beacon Hill.................................................................. Hon. Carole James Victoria–Swan Lake.................................................................... Hon. Rob Fleming West Vancouver–Capilano...................................................................

Ralph Sultan West Vancouver–Sea to Sky................................................................Jordan Sturdy Party Standings: BC Liberal 42; NDP 41; Independent 2; BC Green Party 2

CONTENTS Wednesday, March 4, 2020 Afternoon Sitting Page Routine Business Introductions by Members................................................................................................................................................... 11501 Tributes ................................................................................................................................................................................... 11502 Britannia Secondary senior girls basketball team championship win Hon. M.

Mark Introductions by Members................................................................................................................................................... 11502 Introduction and First Reading of Bills.............................................................................................................................. 11503 Bill 11 — Attorney General Statutes (Vehicle Insurance) Amendment Act, 2020 Hon. D. Eby Bill 12 — Supply Act (No. 1), 2020 Hon. C. James Bill M203 — Name Amendment Act, 2020 M.

Polak Statements (Standing Order 25B) ....................................................................................................................................... 11504 Coronavirus preparedness J. Rice Boundary Musical and Theatre Society L. Larson Groundswell alternative business school J. Routledge Tractorgrease Cafe in Chilliwack J. Martin Lorne Frame A. Weaver Addiction recovery J.

Thornthwaite Oral Questions....................................................................................................................................................................... 11506 Coronavirus preparedness and response A. Wilkinson Hon. A. Dix N. Letnick Care standards at Retirement Concepts seniors care facilities A. Olsen Hon. A. Dix Property tax assessment increases and proposed legislation S. Bond Hon. S. Robinson J. Thornthwaite T.

Stone Tabling Documents............................................................................................................................................................... 11512 Liquor Distribution Branch, annual service plan, 2020-21–2022-23, February 2020 (revised) Orders of the Day Committee of the Whole House.......................................................................................................................................... 11512 Bill 3 — Environmental Management Amendment Act, 2020 P . Milobar Hon. G.

Heyman Report and Third Reading of Bills....................................................................................................................................... 11515 Bill 3 — Environmental Management Amendment Act, 2020

Committee of the Whole House.......................................................................................................................................... 11515 Bill 8 — Education Statutes Amendment Act, 2020 Hon. R. Fleming D.

Davies Report and Third Reading of Bills....................................................................................................................................... 11524 Bill 8 — Education Statutes Amendment Act, 2020 Second Reading of Bills ........................................................................................................................................................ 11524 Bill 13 — Miscellaneous Statutes Amendment Act, 2020 Hon. D. Eby M. Lee Hon. S. Fraser Hon. D. Eby Bill 9 — Evidence Amendment Act, 2020 Hon. D. Eby M. Lee J. Johal Hon. D.

Eby Proceedings in the Douglas Fir Room Committee of Supply ............................................................................................................................................................ 11539 Estimates: Ministry of Children and Family Development (continued) L. Throness J. Thornthwaite Hon. K. Chen Hon. K. Conroy S. Cadieux T. Shypitka D. Clovechok D. Barnett D. Davies S. Bond

WEDNESDAY , MARCH 4, 2020 The House met at 1:35 p.m. [Mr. Speaker in the chair.] Routine Business Prayers and reflections: T. Stone. Introductions by Members Hon. D. Eby: I’m pleased to introduce today some spe- cial guests that we have up in the gallery.

We’re joined by Justina Loh, executive director of Disability Alliance of B.C.; Tanya Fawkes-Kirby, managing director, Canadian Association of Occupational Therapists, B.C. branch; Katie Eichar, who is a student, also at the Canadian Association of Occupational Therapists, B.C. branch; Sarah Charles, as well, with the occupational therapists; Shawn Fehr, past president at the Insurance Brokers Association of B.C.; Jes- sica Asano of the IBABC board of directors; and David Black, president of MoveUP . Would the House please join me in making them feel very welcome. E.

Ross: Today we have in the House Caroline Moore. Caroline has worked in the area of Indigenous relations, consultation policy and negotiations for over 25 years. She holds a master of arts in conflict analysis and management, a Royal Roads University diploma in public sector man- agement and a bachelor of social work, University of Vic- toria. Would the House please make welcome Caroline Moore. N. Letnick: Today we have Dr. Larry Goldenberg, who is in the gallery.

I think everyone around here and in Brit- ish Columbia knows this famous urologist, researcher and educator, a pioneer in the treatment of prostate cancer and supportive care. Would the House please make Dr. Goldenberg feel very, very welcome. Hon. C. James:In the gallery today, we have B.C. Build- ing Trades president Phil Venoit, executive director Andrew Mercier and a number of other leaders in the B.C. Building Trades from across the province. The Building Trades, as people may know, are in Victor- ia to hold the annual conference over the next few days.

This afternoon they’ll be meeting with MLAs on both sides of the House — for good discussions, I’m sure. I know that everyone in this House will want to recognize the crucial front-line roles that the various trades play, the expertise that they apply in our building infrastructure, in our eco- nomy and in building our communities. Would the House please make them very welcome. L. Reid: I’ d ask the House to join me in welcoming Terra Munro to the chamber today. Terra is with Home Health Care. She’s a manager with responsibility for this part of Vancouver Island. We met under the auspices of B.C. Care Providers.

I’m ever so grateful for her tutelage, and I’ d ask the House to please make her very, very welcome. S. Thomson: Today I had a wonderful visit from two friends and constituents from Kelowna-Mission. Alan El- liot and Peggy Poole are here today visiting the Legislature. Alan is up in the gallery. It’s Peggy’s birthday today as well. I think she is out shopping for her birthday president. Alan is taking in question period. I’ d like the House to make them both very welcome to visit here and to wish Peggy a very happy birthday today. Hon. L.

Beare: Joining us today in the House are some of the outstanding citizens who serve my community of Pitt Meadows. Joining us today are Mayor Bill Dingwall and Coun. Bob Meachen as well as city staff Mark Roberts, Samantha Maki and Colin O’Byrne. The city of Pitt Mead- ows is an amazing partner to work with, and I have the absolute privilege and honour of serving the citizens of Pitt Meadows alongside these wonderful people. Would the House please make them feel very welcome. Hon. M. Mungall: Hon. Speaker, I’ d like to introduce the House to a very remarkable woman. Her name is Jill Tipping.

She’s the president and CEO of the B.C. Tech Association. [1:40 p.m.] One of the things that I really want to highlight about Jill, along with her amazing work for the tech sector in her role, is that she has been named as a finalist for the 2020 Connecting the Community Award at the YWCA Women of Distinction Awards because of her work ensuring that all youth, particularly young women, engage with techno- logy and all the opportunities that that sector has to bring. I also want to let the House know and say a special hello to Wilma, her mom, who is watching at home. Wilma, you have a lot to be proud of.

Y ou have a won- derful daughter, who I look forward to working with into the future. May the House please make her very welcome. I. Paton: I had the honour about an hour ago to speak to a grade 10 class from South Delta Secondary. They’re in the precinct today, and they’re with their teacher, who is no stranger to our side of the House, a young Gatlin Saip. I’ d like you to make the class from South Delta Secondary welcome here today. R. Glumac: I would also like to take this opportunity to introduce Dr. Larry Goldenberg, someone who has had a very important impact on my life. In fact, he saved my life.

He’s a leading urological surgeon and an internation- ally recognized clinical scientist, a member of the Order of 11501

Canada and named to the Order of British Columbia and one of the founders of the Vancouver Prostate Centre. I just want to say a few words about the Vancouver Pro- state Centre. It’s a large patient clinic, a clinical trials facil- ity, a patient supportive care and basic science research program dedicated to answering challenging questions of cancer biology and translating research discoveries into treatments. It’s the largest program of its kind in Canada. The impact of the Prostate Centre stretches far beyond helping those battling only prostate cancer.

Discoveries there have made a difference in treating other cancers and tumours, including ovarian, bladder and kidney cancers, as well as Alzheimer’s and dementia. With more than 300 people working to improve lives for patients, the Prostate Centre has become one of the largest health research organizations in western Canada. Dr. Larry Goldenberg was there right from the begin- ning, and he’s still continuing to advocate for the great work that they’re doing today. Would the House make him feel welcome. Hon. M. Farnworth: I’m going to break my own rule about multiple introductions. Dr.

Goldenberg, Larry, is a very good friend of mine, and he does amazing work. I would like to personally welcome him to the House today. I think the words that have been said have been truly inspirational, and I want everyone to really welcome him. N. Simons: This is the first time that Bailey Lalonde is being introduced, and I’m asking the House to please help me in welcoming her. Bailey is an artist who grew up in Cobble Hill. She is currently residing in Memphis, Ten- nessee. She is an artist.

For those who recognize the name Lalonde, she is the daughter of Donny Lalonde, WBC light-heavyweight champion from the late ’80s — if you were following box- ing, as some of us were, the Golden Boy, named after the statue on the Winnipeg Legislature. Through her, we can ask her to let her dad know that we remember that fight against Sugar Ray Leonard, and although he might not have been victorious in that partic- ular fight, we did remember that he knocked him down. Only the second time in Sugar Ray’s career, right? Would the House please join me in welcoming Bailey Lalonde. M.

Elmore: I’m very pleased to welcome here grade 11 students from Sir Charles Tupper High School. They’re accompanied by Mr. Auton Lum, teachers Jas- mine Nann and Taylor Micacchi, retired teachers Gina Main and Sally Ringdahl and student teachers Aaron Weber and Nathan Cox. I want to mention that coming into this weekend, many members will know, we’ve got the provincial champion- ships, the boys basketball that’s going to be held in Langley. Looking forward to that. The Tupper Tigers are ranked in the top five of the boys’ rankings. I’ll be cheering for them.

I don’t know if any of the members want to take any bets on that as well. I’m up for it. [1:45 p.m.] As well, the Tupper Tigers have their rugby team. The boys rugby team was the provincial champion last year. The season is kicking off again this year. Mr. Auton Lum is the coach. And a great wrestling program that they’ve got. They’re sending a wrestler who won silver in the provincial championships to the national championships. I ask everybody to please give a very warm welcome to everyone from Sir Charles Tupper High School. R.

Leonard: Every day we come into this House and, particularly in the caucus rooms, we have a face that greets us. That’s what starts our day. We’ve had a lot of different changes over time, but I’ d like to welcome Cailin Tyrrell. She’s our new face in the east annex, and I really appreciate seeing her every morning and welcome her to the team. If everybody could please welcome her to this beautiful place. A. Weaver: I have two very special guests here in the gallery today. They are Adele and Lorne Frame, accom- panied by Perry Fainstein.

Lorne Frame was recently inducted as a member of the Order of the Legion of Hon- our, France’s highest decoration. I’ll expand upon that a little more in member’s statements. Would the House please make them feel very welcome here today. A. Wilkinson: Since the rule has already been broken, I should introduce someone who is my constituent, who taught me urology in 1985 at St. Paul’s Hospital and who has never been anywhere near my prostate. That’s Dr. Larry Goldenberg. Tributes BRITANNIA SECONDARY SENIOR GIRLS BASKETBALL TEAM CHAMPIONSHIP WIN Hon. M.

Mark: Joining my colleague from Vancouver- Kensington in her pride for her high school, I used to go to Sir Charles Tupper. I know that it’s a great east side school. Speaking of east side schools, I want to congratulate the girls AA team at Britannia, the only secondary school in my riding. They won the provincials on Sat- urday in Langley. Those east side teams punch well above their weight class. Will everyone in the House please join me in congratu- lating the senior girls. Introductions by Members G.

Kyllo: I’ d like to welcome all the B.C. building trades 11502 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, March 4, 2020

that are here today and thank them for their work in help- ing to build the infrastructure in our province. I’ d also like to recognize a good friend of mine, Doug Parton, with Ironworkers Local 97. Would the House please make them all feel very wel- come. Introduction and First Reading of Bills BILL 11 — ATTORNEY GENERAL STATUTES (VEHICLE INSURANCE) AMENDMENT ACT, 2020 Hon. D. Eby presented a message from Her Honour the Lieutenant-Governor: a bill intituled Attorney General Statutes (Vehicle Insurance) Amendment Act, 2020. Hon. D. Eby: I move the bill be introduced and read a first time now.

I’m pleased to introduce the Attorney General Statutes (Vehicle Insurance) Amendment Act, 2020. This bill amends the Insurance (Vehicle) Act to introduce en- hanced care coverage for bodily injury and a new type of first-party insurance coverage for vehicle damage, effective May 1, 2021. These changes will bring down the average cost of auto insurance in British Columbia by approxim- ately 20 percent, an average of $400 in savings per driver, helping reduce costs for British Columbians.

Enhanced care coverage for bodily injuries significantly increases the amount of care and recovery benefits and provides additional benefits available to anyone injured in an auto crash, providing enough care for a lifetime for those who need it, without the need for costly, stressful, uncertain and time-consuming litigation. The Insurance (Vehicle) Act is also amended to provide for pre-litigation payments with respect to accidents occurring before May 1, 2021, to increase the portion of an award that goes to an injured person rather than towards legal costs.

This bill also amends the Insurance Corporation Act, fulfilling this government’s commitment to ban the trans- fer of ICBC profits to government by eliminating the authority of government to direct the Insurance Corp. of British Columbia to make payments to government from profits from the corporation’s optional business. This bill also makes consequential and related amend- ments to the Civil Resolution Tribunal Act. Mr. Speaker: The question is first reading of the bill. Motion approved. Hon. D.

Eby: I move that the bill be placed on the orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today. Bill 11, Attorney General Statutes (Vehicle Insurance) Amendment Act, 2020, introduced, read a first time and ordered to be placed on orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today. [1:50 p.m.] BILL 12 — SUPPLY ACT (No. 1), 2020 Hon. C. James presented a message from Her Honour the Lieutenant-Governor: a bill intituled Supply Act (No. 1), 2020. Hon. C. James: I move that Bill 12, Supply Act (No. 1), 2020, be introduced and read a first time now.

Bill 12 provides interim supply for ministry operations and other appropriations for approximately the first three months of the 2020-21 fiscal year. Bill 12 also provides interim supply for a portion of government’s financing requirements for the ’20-21 fiscal year, including one-third of the year’s capital expenditures, loans, investments and other financing requirements and the full amount of the year’s disbursements for revenues collected on behalf of and transferred to specific programs and entities. Mr. Speaker: The question is first reading of the bill. Motion approved. Hon. C.

James: I move that Bill 12 be placed on the orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today. Bill 12, Supply Act (No. 1), 2020, introduced, read a first time and ordered to be placed on orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today. BILL M203 — NAME AMENDMENT ACT, 2020 M. Polak presented a bill intituled Name Amendment Act, 2020. M. Polak: I move that the bill intituled Name Amend- ment Act, 2020, of which notice has been given in my name on the order paper, be introduced and read a first time now.

Many people in British Columbia choose to adopt a hyphenated or combined surname when they marry. Unfortunately, the act, as it is currently worded, does not afford those individuals the ability to do so without a formal name change. While this does affect men, the impact is disproportionately felt by women, who must either struggle through difficulties with their identity doc- uments or face the time and expense of a formal name change. This amendment will mean that those who choose a Wednesday, March 4, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11503

hyphenated or combined surname will be treated in the same manner as those who adopt the surname of their spouse. Mr. Speaker: The question is first reading of the bill. Motion approved. M. Polak: I move that the bill be placed on orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting after today. Bill M203, Name Amendment Act, 2020, introduced, read a first time and ordered to be placed on orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today. Statements (Standing Order 25B) CORONAVIRUS PREPAREDNESS J.

Rice: As B.C. ’s Parliamentary Secretary for Emergency Preparedness, I encourage individuals to learn about the risks in your area, to make a plan and build or buy an emergency kit, to always have a minimum of three days — but preferably at least one week — of food and water and other essentials such as prescription medications on hand. This is good practice preparing for any type of haz- ard, whether that’s a power outage, fire, flood, earthquake or disease outbreak.

I find myself in a bit of a dilemma when I see British Columbians rush out in a flurry of fear-driven stockpiling because of anxiety around the coronavirus. It’s always wise to be prepared, but the most important measure people can take today to prevent the spread of coronavirus, or COVID-19, is to proactively prevent the transmission of respiratory illness, including COVID-19. This includes washing your hands regularly. Avoid touching your face, cough or sneeze into your elbow sleeve and dispose of tissues appropriately.

Besides health care professionals, masks should be only used by the sick to prevent transmission to other people. It may be less effect- ive to wear a mask in the community when a person is not sick themselves. Masks may give a person a false sense of security and are likely to increase the number of times a person will touch their own face — for example, to adjust the mask. It’s also very important to stay home and away from oth- ers if you or your family are sick. Travellers should monit- or the government of Canada travel site for the latest travel advisories.

While the risk of spread of COVID-19 with- in British Columbia remains low at this time, we continue widespread testing by screening British Columbians and travellers with symptoms, along with their close contacts, to identify cases. In B.C., we continue to be in active containment mode to detect cases and respond to prevent the virus from spreading in the community. The Ministry of Health and the B.C.

Centre for Disease Control, working with many partners, including EMBC, have plans in place and are prepared to respond to new illnesses of public health concern. [1:55 p.m.] I always encourage people to be prepared, but this should be done in a measured approach and not be panic driven. S. Sullivan: I seek leave to make another introduction. Leave granted. Introductions by Members S. Sullivan: I see Ruby Ng, the head of the Disability Foundation, is here.

She runs a network of quality-of-life groups for people with significant disabilities, whether it be kayaking in False Creek or going hiking in the forest near UBC or music or assistive devices. She’s got it all. I’ d like to please welcome Ruby to this House. Statements (Standing Order 25B) BOUNDARY MUSICAL AND THEATRE SOCIETY L. Larson: The Boundary Musical and Theatre Society in Grand Forks is a non-profit community theatre made up of volunteers who, for the last 14 years, have been pro- ducing top-notch musical theatre entertainment for the people of Boundary.

Previous productions have included Fiddler on the Roof, Mary Poppins and Mamma Mia!, just to name a few. This year’s production isJoseph and the Amazing Tech- nicolour Dreamcoat and is currently on stage at the Grand Forks Secondary School. The production is directed by Deborah Baker and stars Aaron Baker as Joseph, with over 80 cast and crew, including a live pit band under the direc- tion of Lorriane Barg. Community theatre involves local volunteers in many capacities, from sewing costumes, painting backdrops, building props and sound and lighting.

The list is endless, and community members with particular skills willingly share their knowledge and craftsmanship with others. Last year the society started a Broadway Junior Players group for youth from six to 12 under the direction of Shannon Wolf and Aaron Baker. The stage develops con- fidence and responsibility within young performers. In 2017, the Boundary Musical and Theatre Society was presented with the community accessibility award for their inclusion of special needs adults into their productions.

Whether you become involved as a director, a chorus member or a stage hand, volunteering with a community 11504 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, March 4, 2020

organization like this musical theatre society results in new friendships and a strong sense of community pride. Congratulations to the Boundary Musical and Theatre Society for their countless volunteer hours bringing great musical theatre to Boundary. GROUNDSWELL ALTERNATIVE BUSINESS SCHOOL J. Routledge: Climate change. Artificial intelligence. Globalization. The gig economy. These are trends that are transforming work as we know it. More and more people are employed as temporary independent contractors without prospect of benefits, job security or pensions. What are we going to do?

Well, Groundswell may have part of the answer. Groundswell is an innovative, alternative business school. It specializes in serving diverse populations who are squeezed out of the job market or working in marginal jobs and who are looking for agency and support in cre- ating their own self-employed livelihood and small busi- nesses. At Groundswell, students learn how to tap into their innate strengths, talents and passions and turn their ideas into something at which they can make a living while also addressing social problems.

I was introduced to Groundswell by one of my con- stituents, Gilad Babchuk, the executive director and co- founder of Groundswell. I met Irina, a graduate of Groundswell. She created Fabcycle, a business that collects textile waste before it goes into the landfill and sells it to artists, crafters and designers. I met Conlan Mansfield, who opened a gym. His clients knowingly pay a little extra so they can sponsor the training of Indigenous sports teams. Groundswell was established in 2013.

Since then, it has graduated more than 200 students, created 140 jobs and more than 100 small businesses with start-up capital of less than $5,000. Groundswell isn’t likely to produce the next Bill Gates, just ordinary people who want to make a living and a difference in a shrinking job market. The next pro- gram starts April 3. [2:00 p.m.] TRACTORGREASE CAFE IN CHILLIW ACK J. Martin: I would like to take a moment and talk about a venue that is putting Chilliwack literally on the interna- tional music map.

I’m referring to the Tractorgrease Cafe, a self-described folksy musical restaurant with a cool stu- dio next door. Located in the spectacular Chilliwack River Valley, Tractorgrease was founded by Jeff Bonner as a musical col- lective. It was Jeff ’s vision that Tractorgrease would be a place where like-minded people could come together to make and to share music. Artists such as Ridley Bent, Bill Bourne, 54-40, Steve Dawson and many others have all recorded in the Tract- orgrease studios.

In 2014, Tractorgrease expanded to a live music venue and hosts amazing solo acts, duos and bands from all over North America and beyond. Depending on the weather and the time of year, per- formances take place either inside the cozy café or on an outdoor beautiful stage that rivals anything I’ve ever seen in Austin, Texas. In fact, Tractorgrease has become one of the most talked about live music destinations in recent years. A little while back, over lunch, I had an opportunity to ask Jeff how he manages to book so many sought-after acts.

He explained that Tractorgrease has become such a popular and a respected establishment that the artists lit- erally call him seeking an opportunity to bring their show to the Chilliwack River Valley. In addition to rootsy-sounding blues, country, bluegrass, jazz and folk acts, Tractorgrease hosts regular open-mike sessions where musicians arrive from near and afar for the opportunity to be on the Tractorgrease stage. There’s local craft beer. There’s a spectacularly diverse menu. There’s one other thing, but I’m a little blurry. Can anyone help me out here? Interjections. J. Martin: That’s right.

There’s even an authentic wood- burning smoker for a real, real barbecue. I encourage any- one with a passion for live music to put Tractorgrease on their must-do list, support real people making real music. Thank you, Jeff, for creating such a special, multigener- ational, social and music community. Never forget: #livemusicisbetter. LORNE FRAME A. Weaver: It’s a profound honour for me to rise in the House today to pay tribute to Mr. Lorne Frame, a Cana- dian hero who resides in the riding of Oak Bay–Gordon Head and is seated in the gallery above there. In 1942, at the age of 18, Mr.

Frame joined the Royal Canadian Air Force. After further training in Britain, he became a pilot in the 419 Canadian bomber Squadron where he flew Lancaster bombers. At the age of 20 and on his 13th mission, his plane was attacked by German night fighters. His plane was shot down on the edge of the Fontainebleau forest, south of Paris. As he fought to control the descending plane, he ordered his crew to evacuate. He was the last person out of the plane. After walking all night, Mr. Frame found himself in the village of Barbizon. There, he came into contact with an American woman by the name of Drue Tartière. Mrs.

Tartière spent the war years assisting the French under- ground. As she spoke English, Mr. Frame was able to con- vince her that he was a member of the Allied Forces and Wednesday, March 4, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11505

not a German soldier. Mrs. Tartière hid Mr. Frame in the back of her house where he was eventually joined by mem- bers of his crew. They stayed hidden for seven weeks until Barbizon was liberated in August 1944. As befits a true hero, Mr. Frame minimizes his contri- butions and sacrifices. To this day, he praises the women and men of the French underground and, in particular, Drue Tartière. He marvelled at their bravery. In assisting Mr. Frame and his compatriots, they risked their lives and the lives of their families and friends. Drue Tartière doc- uments Mr.

Frame’s story, among others, in her book,The House Near Paris, that she published in 1946. I just recently ordered that from AbeBooks. I’m look- ing forward to its arrival so I can learn more about Mr. Frame’s remarkable story and the remarkable work of Drue Tartière. In recognition of his sacrifice and his service in helping liberate France from the Nazis, Mr. Frame has recently been selected to be a Member of the Order of the Legion of Honour. Originally established in 1802 by Napoleon Bonaparte, the Legion of Honour remains France’s highest decoration. We are privileged, hon. Speaker, to have Mr.

Frame with us here in the gallery tonight. [2:05 p.m.] I would like this House to join me in congratulating him on this latest distinction. [Applause.] ADDICTION RECOVERY J. Thornthwaite:Mental health and addictions are com- plex issues that drastically affect the way people live their lives, from work to one’s relationships to one’s overall qual- ity of life. These effects extend far beyond the individual. They affect our communities and society. Helping people out of addiction has obvious social and individual benefits, but less is known about the financial benefits.

Harm reduction keeps people alive, but alone, it does not help them address the root cause of their addic- tion or support them on the road to recovery. The recent overdose rates, which have not decreased, prove we are not getting to the root of the addiction, the why. Is it mental health? Trauma? Adverse childhood experiences? Pain? A repeated cycle of discharge and relapse is ultimately a greater cost to society and the people and the families affected.

A more comprehensive approach to treating addiction requires a continuum of care ranging from prevention and treatment to recovery and reintegration into society. Together We Can: Addiction Recovery and Education Society knows this better than anyone. I quote Tristan Elliott: “For every chronic addict you help recover and become a taxpayer again, there is a $500,000 to $720,000 savings if that individual remains sober for 20 years. ” Research suggests addiction costs Canadians between $20 billion and $40 billion a year in lost productivity, health care and the legal system.

A person struggling with addic- tion costs between $11,000 and $22,000 per year. This can easily be over $100,000 in some cases. Therefore, the success of addiction treatment should be measured not just on not being on welfare, not being in a hospital, not being in jail. What’s the contribution to soci- ety? The quality of life, reconnecting with family, building social responsibility and optimizing wellness. When we support people through a continuum of care, we save. B.C. needs to rise up and help people trying to overcome addic- tion and give them every opportunity to work through a full pathway to recovery.

Oral Questions CORONAVIRUS PREPAREDNESS AND RESPONSE A. Wilkinson: We’ve seen the rapid progression of the case count of the novel coronavirus that’s been now labelled as COVID-19. The obvious question that arises is the preparation level in our society and our government for a potential rapid expansion in that case count. We’ve seen the reports out most recently from Washing- ton state where the death count, unfortunately, amongst our friends and neighbours to the south is now up to ten.

They’ve recorded a total of 28 confirmed cases, but it’s widely known in the United States that the testing pro- gram was far too slow to get going. The actual case count in Washington state could be much higher. That will become clear in the weeks to come. The question for the Minister of Health is: can he tell us what the plan is in British Columbia in the event that our case count rapidly goes into the thousands? Hon. A. Dix: First of all, I want to acknowledge the role played by all members of the House in supporting pub- lic health during this time.

I particularly want to acknow- ledge the role the member for Kelowna–Lake Country, the Green Party Health critic and House Leader for their role, the Leader of the Opposition and many others who have spoken out publicly against fear and in favour of science and public health responses. I think that’s important. We are stronger together, and I wanted to express that appre- ciation right off the top. The Leader of the Opposition will know that because of preparations and our excellent record in dealing with issues such as SARS in the past, the B.C. Centre for Disease Control, our provincial health officer, Dr.

Bonnie Henry, and my deputy minister, Stephen Brown, have acted, from the beginning, ahead of many other jurisdictions. [2:10 p.m.] For example, we have been taking action — from the beginning, before there was even a case identified in Brit- ish Columbia — to test people. We’ve tested now — or we had tested as of the last time we announced the numbers, 11506 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, March 4, 2020

which was Friday — 1,425 samples and 1,012 people. This was significantly more testing — more than twice as much than had taken place in the entire United States of Amer- ica. This is our plan, which is to contain — and if not to contain, to slow down — the growth of the virus here in British Columbia. We are continuing to energetically pur- sue that plan. Clearly, we will need to prepare for other plans.

We do have, in British Columbia, a pandemic response plan, which has been updated, which we’ll be briefing all parties in the Legislature on before we go home for the spring break, and which is going to help respond to further devel- opments of COVID-19 in British Columbia. I think it’s important that we continue to support our institutions and support one another in these times. If I may be allowed one last thing to say, everyone needs to wash their hands regularly. This is important, and again, it’s something that all members of the House have been communicating. I’m very, very appreciative of that.

Not touching your face. And when you’re sick, stay home from school, from work and especially from visiting friends and loved ones in long-term care and in hospital. Mr. Speaker: The Leader of the Official Opposition on a supplemental. A. Wilkinson: Well, thank you to the Minister of Health for that outline, but I think the question is actually more pointed. He has set an example for all of us in practical, personal terms about cleanliness and hygiene. We thank him for that advice. The B.C. Centre for Disease Control is remarkably well ahead of the U.S.

Centers for Disease Control in test capacity and surveillance systems for new cases. The question remains. In the event that our case count goes, sadly, from half a dozen to 5,000, what will be the next step after the initial containment phase? Once we’ve now passed this point of saying that perhaps people arriv- ing from around parts of China should self-quarantine, what is the next phase in the unfortunate event that the events in Washington state carry over the border? Hon. A.

Dix: In January, prior to any cases coming to British Columbia — indeed, coming to Canada — we set up an emergency response team, co-chaired by Dr. Henry and Mr. Brown. Every health authority now has an emer- gency operation centre specifically devoted to addressing this question, which I think is important, because there are challenges at every level. As we ramp up, we are preparing, of course, for a governmentwide response. This, as it devel- ops, will have implications for all parts of B.C. life, not just the health care system. That work is being done.

We intend to fully brief the opposition on that work in the coming days and the Green Party in the coming 24 hours so that they’re as informed as anybody here in the Legislature and so that we can con- tinue to work together to respond adequately to what is a significant international health issue. I want to say, finally, to our friends in Washington state — and I know that the Leader of the Opposition would agree to that — that people in public health in Washington state are working very hard and are doing very diligent work.

It is absolutely tragic that COVID-19 hit, especially, a long-term care home in Washington, in the States. Our hearts go out to all the families affected and to the people working so hard now in Washington state to address this problem. N. Letnick: Thank you to the minister for his answer so far. If we can get some clarity on one point. Right now we are in a containment phase. We are trying to contain this. Hopefully, Washington state is able to do the same, so we don’t have to have the impact of people travelling back and forth. Obviously, the border is very thin between us and Washington state.

Over the last week, we heard the federal Health Min- ister, Patty Hajdu, recommend that Canadians stock up with enough supplies for a week or so in case their family member contracted the coronavirus and had to remain in self-isolation for 14 days. She said that it’s good to be pre- pared, because things can change quickly. Canada’s chief public health officer, Dr. Teresa Tam, echoed that message on Thursday in a tweet urging Canadians to keep extra food and medication on hand. We’ve seen the run on things at our stores. We’ d like to get some clarity from the government and the minister.

What can we do to ensure that British Columbians get the right message today, since we’re still in the containment phase? Hon. A. Dix: Again, thank you to the member for his question. I think people in British Columbia…. We have these preparations now. Many of us live in earthquake zones, so we are expected and do have preparations in our houses for those conditions now. [2:15 p.m.] I think the key, in this time, is to be prudent. I don’t think there’s any need to hoard goods.

But just like if someone in your home was sick with the flu or anything else, it’s important to have food and medication available, especially if you are in one of the categories that has a more serious impact of COVID-19 and, indeed, of influenza. For example, that people with chronic diseases, people who are more elderly, be more prepared for what might happen. That is true in all circumstances. I think it’s really important that we understand that so far, in British Columbia, the risk is low and continues to be low and that we continue to support one another in these times.

One of the things that I admire most about what’s happened, for example, in the Chinese-Canadian com- munity — and members, including the Leader of the Wednesday, March 4, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11507

Opposition, have spoken of this — is the willingness of people to help each other, especially in self-isolation. There are groups that spontaneously were created to support one another. This is true, I know, in the Iranian-Canadian community, as well, which has suffered — some now, and significantly — from the outbreak in British Columbia. I think it speaks well, and I want to express my appre- ciation to the people of B.C. for their response to date.

I think we have to continue to be prudent, to be prudent when we make decisions to travel, and to be prepared, but to be serene in our approach so that we support one anoth- er when we need to be supported. Mr. Speaker: The member for Kelowna–Lake Country on a supplemental. N. Letnick: I bring up the question because not only is the federal government saying one thing, but we’ve got leaders from across the country saying all kinds of things. We have all kinds of experts with differences of opinion. Look at Christine Elliot, the Health Minister for Ontario.

She said that she believes stockpiling is unneces- sary and people should continue to go about their lives while being cautious. So it’s very similar to what the Minis- ter of Health for B.C. has said. It’s obviously juxtaposed to what the Canadian Health Minister has said. People have to use their common sense. Given the current situation, I think it’s probably the best thing. To the minister, I only have one more question on this. I’ll save some of these other ones for, hopefully, never, because the virus will go away.

What preparations are the regional health authorities taking to help identify any out- breaks in their local areas — in particular, in the Northern Health regional health authority? I’m hearing stories that people who want to get tested are facing a gauntlet of barriers to getting the testing done, because they believe they have the virus.

If the minister could outline what people can do across British Columbia — especially up in the north, who are farther away from services than people down on the Lower Mainland — to ensure that we manage this outbreak and contain this out- break as much as possible so it doesn’t become a goal of stopping the spread versus stopping the outbreak itself. Hon. A. Dix: All of the regional health authorities have emergency operation centres now. People in all of the regional health authorities are being tested. The threshold for the test is lower than in other jurisdictions, but there is a threshold.

We believe that medical professionals are making the right decisions about when people should be tested and how they should be tested. In the last couple of weeks, we’ve changed our testing regimen so that people who are tested for influenza are also tested for COVID-19. I think that’s important. We are preparing in every single health authority. As you know, two health authorities, to date, have no cases of COVID-19. One of those is the Northern Health Author- ity, and we hope that continues. The other is Island Health.

But all of our health authorities are preparing equally and are fully evolved, including the First Nations Health Authority, whose activities are fully integrated with ours. With respect to the government of Canada, I would say this. They have been working very hard and are in touch with us on a regular basis. The federal Minister of Finance, Mr. Morneau, met with provincial Finance Ministers on some aspects of this issue today and other issues. The federal Health Minister has consistently reached out and done that. What we’re trying to be is, I think, supportive of this.

There will be lots of occasions to discuss what each of us might say or do better later. But right now we’re working with the federal government, with the Washington state government and other jurisdictions. If there is anything about it, including the seven cases that came from travel to Iran…. That tells us that this is an evolving situation and that what happens in one place in the world can profoundly affect us here. CARE STANDARDS AT RETIREMENT CONCEPTS SENIORS CARE FACILITIES A. Olsen: Last week the B.C. government took control of yet another seniors home owned by Retirement Con- cepts.

They were forced to do this because of neglect of seniors. [2:20 p.m.] This is the fourth Retirement Concepts facility that authorities have taken over, and there are serious con- cerns about others. One family just filed a class action lawsuit against another Retirement Concepts facility, cit- ing negligence, emotional and physical injuries and wrongful death. Retirement Concepts is the largest provider of long- term care in British Columbia, and it’s owned by a state- backed Chinese insurance company. A foreign-owned, for-profit company is repeatedly providing wholly inad- equate care to our seniors.

We are seeing a clear pattern here. It’s not enough to intervene in just the most egregious cases or to react to whistle-blowers. It seems that for-profit care homes are allowed to repeatedly put profit margins ahead of care. My question is to the Minister of Health. Beyond simply responding to these situations when they come to light, how is the minister holding this company account- able and ensuring that our elders are not facing inad- equate care and neglect? Hon. A. Dix: Indeed, the situation at Retirement Con- cepts is a serious situation, but I want to put this very much in context.

What has happened at Retirement Con- cepts in Comox, in Nanaimo, in Victoria and now in Sum- 11508 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, March 4, 2020

merland is a serious situation that comes through a very formal process led by medical officers of health. That process, and taking over a facility, has happened seven times since 1990. Six of those are by Retirement Concepts. It’s very important not to suggest that other care providers are in the same boat. This is, in this case, a Retirement Concepts problem. We need to address it, and they need to address it. Last week they were called to a meeting — including the new parent company, called Dajia — that was called with the Deputy Minister of Health.

We’ve clearly laid out our expectations that this situation cannot continue. Our administrators are doing, I think, an excellent job in bringing these facilities up to standard. I think we have to continue to do that work. It is unacceptable that the gov- ernment of British Columbia is running 511 of Retirement Concepts’ 1,641 beds. That’s 31 percent of their beds. It is not good enough, and we are going to continue to take action until they’re brought up to standard. Mr. Speaker: The Leader of the Third Party on a supple- mental. A.

Olsen: To be very clear, this question is about Retire- ment Concepts and Retirement Concepts alone. I’m glad to hear the response from the minister. I’m glad to hear that his staff are taking action. I’m really concerned about the situation that exists. There are still a number of rooms that are controlled by this company. I think that the concern continues to arise, knowing that there are seniors that are still under the care of this company. The minister said….

This was a few months ago: “Whenever there are changes in ownership in care homes, we have to review to see if there are changes required. ” As the minister just noted, the former company Anbang has been restructured, and now the company that controls Retirement Concepts is under a new state-backed insur- ance group. It could be argued that these are significant changes in ownership. My question is to the Minister of Health.

Will the gov- ernment take immediate steps to take control of the remainder of the Retirement Concepts homes to ensure that all seniors can rely on getting the care that they need in our province? Hon. A. Dix:Well, the takeover of Retirement Concepts occurred in 2016. The review of such takeovers is made by Investment Canada. Concerns were expressed, certainly by me and other British Columbians, about that takeover at that time. But the federal government approved the takeover. I don’t want anyone at Retirement Concepts or anyone else to think that people are going to take this respons- ibility away from them.

They have the responsibility to provide care. We have the responsibility to regulate, and we will. I think it’s an important consideration here, the com- pany in question. It is why, in this case — after Comox and after Nanaimo and after Victoria and now after Summer- land — we contacted and have met and will continue to meet not just with Retirement Concepts as a company or the operating company — which are the old owners, by the way — but the holding company to make sure that every- body is held accountable here. Seniors are in care right now.

They deserve our support, and they will have it. [2:25 p.m.] PROPERTY TAX ASSESSMENT INCREASES AND PROPOSED LEGISLATION S. Bond: Last fall Gordon Bohlmann of Marpole Physiotherapy Clinic came here to the Legislature because he was worried about the significant pressure on small businesses that was caused by dramatically increased property taxes. Here’s what the Minister of Housing said to Gordon and the other businesses that were here in the Legislature that day: “I want to say to all the business owners here: ‘We have been listening…. ’ We are taking action.

We will be ready for the 2020 tax year. ” The minister hasn’t delivered. Can she explain to Gor- don why she has not followed through on the promise she made to them in the Legislature that day? Hon. S. Robinson: My words are true today, as they were back then. Small businesses, non-profits and arts and culture organizations have been hurting for a significant amount of time. We vowed to take action, and we did. We worked with a number of local governments in the Metro region to look at what a permanent fix would look like, and in May, we were presented with a range of ideas.

We explored them over the summer to take a look at what would work for 2020. In looking at those ideas that are absolutely worthwhile exploring and doing some policy work on, it became really clear to us that it wouldn’t work for 2020. There was still a significant amount of work that needed to be done. So we brought in an interim program that would provide the relief that those businesses are desperately needing. Mr. Speaker: The member for Prince George– Valemount on a supplemental. S. Bond: Well, the minister knows full well what the reaction to the so-called action that she took has been.

In fact, this minister made a promise. She made a promise to Gordon and to other small business owners across the Lower Mainland. She said they would get relief this year, and she simply hasn’t delivered. It’s not the opposition, just the members on this side of Wednesday, March 4, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11509

the House, that are saying that. It is mayors from across the Lower Mainland. In fact, she knows that 11 mayors have written to this minister this week to tell her that her plan is simply unworkable. Here’s what Coquitlam mayor Richard Stewart says: “It’s not that we’re not going to do it. It’s that we just can’t. ” Will the minister admit that her plan is a mistake and that it doesn’t work for anyone? Hon. S. Robinson: It became really clear to us that doing nothing or doing something was really the choice that was before us. So we did do something for 2020.

We brought in some legislation that, of course, will work for municipalities. In fact, in developing the interim solution, we were working with municipalities. They were helping to give us some feedback about how to best proceed. We made sure that we were hearing their concerns. In fact, some of the feedback they gave to us said having a March 31 deadline to pass this bylaw was not reasonable. So we changed it based on their feedback. Staff have already been in contact with a number of municipalities interested in using this tool. And there is work for municipalities. I understand that.

I absolutely understand that. We’re there to support them. We have staff committed to working with them. We have B.C. Assessment available to generate the kind of data that they need in order to make their decision. We’ve given them advance notice of this legislation. This is an opportunity for municipalities to work with the provincial government in order, again, to give relief to the businesses and to the non-profits in their com- munities. It has been an issue for well over a decade.

I’m very proud of the fact that we got to work right away, and we’re continuing to deliver for those businesses and those non-profits. J. Thornthwaite:This issue is just another NDP broken promise. Also sitting in the gallery to hear directly from the min- ister last fall, right here in the Legislature, was Dr. Gianni Pisanu. He’s the owner of Granville Dental Wellness Group. He was reeling from a 60 percent increase in his taxes in just three years. The minister told Dr. Pisanu: “We’ve heard you loud and clear, and there will be a tax fix for the 2020 tax year. ” [2:30 p.m.] What does the minister say now to Dr.

Pisanu after she has failed to provide any of the promised assistance? Hon. S. Robinson: Well, I have to say that we passed third reading of a bill that I am sure will receive royal assent very shortly. That’s what I have to say. The other thing I have to say is that municipalities now have a tool that they can…. Interjections. Mr. Speaker: Members. Interjections. Mr. Speaker: Members. We shall hear the response. Hon. S. Robinson: Again, it will receive royal assent shortly, and it will be law. It will be an opportunity for local governments to deliver, with us, this tool to the businesses in their communities.

Y ou know what? Local governments have been saying for some time that these businesses are stretched, that they’re challenged. They know their communities really well. They know which businesses need it. Now they have the ability to identify those businesses. They have the abil- ity to identify those cultural groups so that they can get to work so that we can continue to work together to deliver for the people of this province, for the business people and the non-profits and the arts and cultural sector, because they deserve that. J. Thornthwaite: This is just part of the pattern of the NDP .

They’re just not listening to the experts. There are ten Metro mayors — ten — including the city of North Vancouver, plus the UBCM president, who have rejected her plan — including the mayor of her own com- munity, the mayor of Coquitlam. “We have some small businesses that are really hurting. I would do anything to help them, but this is really, really unworkable. ” That’s what the mayor of Coquitlam said about this minister’s bill. Why won’t this minister adopt our split assessment bill, which is exactly what the mayors want? Hon. S. Robinson: The mayors’ proposal is on the table for a permanent fix. It is.

We are considering it. But like I said, when it was presented to us in May…. We looked at it over the summer, and the analysis demonstrated that it wouldn’t be available for 2020. So that left us with a choice: continue to do the work, the important work…. We’re committed to continuing to do that. But what it meant is that it would not be ready for 2020. We made the commitment to do both at the same time, because we know how to do that. We can work on a per- manent fix and an interim fix at the same time. T.

Stone: Well, the problem is that the mayors of Metro Vancouver sent a letter to the minister just the other day, and in it, ten Metro mayors, plus the UCBM president, say very, very clearly that the solution the minister has brought forward is unworkable, and these municipalities have no intention whatsoever of using it. That’s the bottom line. In fact, in 2½ years, the NDP have perfected the art of putting together reviews and consultations only to not then follow the recommendations that flow from them. How did the caribou file go? Not very well. 11510 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, March 4, 2020

Interjections. Mr. Speaker: Members, we shall hear the question. T. Stone: They did it with the caribou file. They did it with the implementation of the employer health tax. Now they’re doing it again. They’re doing it again here by refusing to implement the proposed solution, the priority solution, of the intergovernmental working group and the Metro mayors in Vancouver. The mayors want split assessment classification. In their letter, they actually say: “Struggling businesses and organ- izations will end up paying higher taxes. ” That’s in refer- ence to the minister’s solution.

My question to the minister is this. Will she take the advice of the Metro mayors, scrap her plan and bring for- ward a solution that embodies what they’ve been asking for all along? That’s split assessment classification. [2:35 p.m.] Hon. S. Robinson: It’s amazing that they finally are listening to Metro mayors. They’ve never listened to Metro mayors. Wow. All the years that they fought them on investing in transit infrastructure, and they finally are recognizing that they have a role to play in the regional transportation network. I find it, actually, very enlight- ening.

I’m thrilled to hear that they’re finally listening to mayors, because they certainly ignored them when they were on this side of the House. In fact, we’ve been working with the mayors, and we have been working with them on the split assessment tool. We’re going to continue, because that’s how we roll. We’re going to continue to work with them on the permanent solution. The idea is a worthwhile idea, of the split assess- ment. It would be impossible to implement it in time for 2020. So we developed an interim solution.

It’s a solution that I do know and I do appreciate is going to take a bit of work for local governments. We’ve drafted a model bylaw for them. We have B.C. Assessment at the ready to generate the data that they need, because we know that that’s important in terms of the decision-making that they have to do. B.C. Assessment is certainly answering any calls that they have. They’re answering questions that they have about how to move forward. Also, we’ve put together a whole handbook on how to use this interim solution.

It’s a real opportunity for local governments and the provincial government to work together to make sure that the businesses and non-profits and art and culture organizations have the relief that they need. Mr. Speaker: The member for Kamloops–South Thompson on a supplemental. T. Stone: Well, the minister looked small businesses in the eyes last year. She looked the local governments in the eyes, and she said that she would bring forward a solution. And you know what? She has failed those local govern- ments and failed those small businesses.

The letter, which, by the way, is dated February 27 — so, literally, just a few days ago — says: “While the interim solution put forward by the province may satisfy the desire to put a mechanism in place for the 2020 tax year…the undersigned mayors do not support the inter- im permissive property tax exemption legislation.

Fur- ther, we respectfully request that the province continue to work with the Intergovernmental Working Group on implementing split assessment through a new commer- cial subclass. ” Because this minister has failed to act, countless small businesses have had to close their doors across Metro Van- couver. Sadly, more are making that painful decision as we speak. After 35 years in business, Bishop’s Restaurant in Vancouver just announced that it’s closing soon. Why? Because of soaring costs, including property taxes above their heads.

Owner and legendary chef John Bishop says: “I don’t want to retire, but I don’t want to get to the point where I would have to declare bankruptcy. ” The question is this. If an entrepreneur like John Bishop, who has worked his tail off for 35 years to build a renowned restaurant in Vancouver from scratch, can’t make it due to the skyrocketing taxes above his head, who the heck does the minister think has a fighting chance to start and grow a business in Metro Vancouver? Hon. S. Robinson:My father was a small business own- er.

I do understand how tough things can be for small businesses and for the families that are supported by the small business, and I do understand the hardships of being under a triple-net lease and having the burden of skyrock- eting property taxes. I also need to remind all of the mem- bers of this House that this has been going on for well over ten years. The CFIB identified it and said that no government has ever paid attention to it. Our government paid atten- tion. Our government heard. As I have mentioned before, to previous questions by the members opposite….

I explained how we work together with local government…. Interjections. [2:40 p.m.] Mr. Speaker: Members, we shall hear the response. Thank you. Hon. S. Robinson: It seems that they have lots to say, but their time at the microphone is over. I’ve explained in this House how it came to be that we needed to do the interim solution in order to have some- thing available for those businesses that have been strug- Wednesday, March 4, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11511

gling. This isn’t about the members opposite, it’s not about us, and it’s not about local governments. Interjections. Hon. S. Robinson: They continue to be very chippy. I think I’ll just sit down. Clearly, I can’t even hear myself speak. [End of question period.] Tabling Documents Hon. D. Eby: I stand to table a revised Crown agency annual service plan for the B.C. Liquor Distribution Branch to replace the version tabled on budget day 2020. This amended version corrects an entry error in the debt line of the financial

summary table on page 22. A note was added at the bottom of the financial

summary on page 22 explaining this correction from the originally tabled ver- sion on budget day. Orders of the Day Hon. M. Farnworth: In this chamber, I call committee on Bill 3, the Environmental Management Amendment Act. In Committee A, the Douglas Fir Room, I call contin- ued debate on the estimates for the Ministry of Children and Family Development. [2:45 p.m.] Committee of the Whole House BILL 3 — ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT AMENDMENT ACT, 2020 The House in Committee of the Whole (Section

B) on Bill 3; S. Gibson in the chair. The committee met at 2:47 p.m. On

section 1. P . Milobar:A couple questions for the minister, overall, on the bill in itself. I’m hoping, with a bit of his indulgence here…. I have one question around

section 1 that probably relates more to

section 8, but I just want to make sure that I cover that off. Then when we get to

section 2, I’ll have quite a few questions that might interrelate with some of the fur- ther sections, but I’m letting the minister know that once that they’re covered off, we can breeze through the remain- ing sections, if that’s all right with him as well. Anyway, I’ll jump into it.

Section 1 is just repealing the definition of “contamin- ated soil relocation agreement. ” I know it’s touched on in

section 8 as well, about transitional provisions. Does this mean that any…? It does not look like it in

section 8, but I’m just wanting reassurances that this does not change any existing soil relocation agreements that are out there and that it’s meant more as a move-forward piece. Hon. G. Heyman: Thank you to the member for the question. I’ d first of all like to introduce the staff that are with me today from the environmental protection divi- sion. On the far right is Kevin Butterworth, and next to me is Valentina Y etskalo. The answer to the member’s question is that those agreements that are currently in place, the soil location agreements, will continue until they terminate, and oth- er transition measures will be governed by transition regulations. The Chair: Any further comments on

section 1?

Section 1 approved. On

section 2. [2:50 p.m.] P . Milobar:This is section (1.2)(c). How far in advance will the notice be required to be given? The policy direc- tion paper was talking about two weeks, but we’re wonder- ing what the actual notice time frame will be. Hon. G. Heyman: The notice period will be two weeks, and it will be prescribed by regulation. P . Milobar: Thanks for that. Will there be any fees attached to the notice when that’s being provided? If so, will it be a cost recovery or a source of revenue? Hon. G. Heyman: We are not planning to impose any fee at this time.

In other areas where the ministry does have fees, the principle is cost recovery. P . Milobar:Local governments get notified. They raise concerns. What will be the process if there’s a concern raised about an application? Will it still proceed, or will local government objections automatically make the application not applicable? Hon. G. Heyman: It’s no longer an application. It’s a notification. But the two-week notification period is intended to give municipalities and local governments a chance to ensure that their bylaws are being applied appropriately.

If they had any additional concern that they believed was covered by the Environmental Man- agement Act or Environmental Management Act regula- tions, they would notify us, and environmental protec- tion division staff would attend. P . Milobar: I guess why I’m asking this line of ques- 11512 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, March 4, 2020

tioning is because typically, when local governments or First Nations hear of a change, the anticipation is usually that they will have more say into a matter or not. So is the minister saying, then, that if a municipality has objections, they’ll be taken under advisement, but it is not a stop to the soil relocation happening simply because a local government might have objections to what is being proposed? Hon. G. Heyman: To be clear about the process, muni- cipal or local government bylaws exist to control aspects of soil relocation.

The two-week notice period is there for the municipality or local government to ensure that their bylaws are being obeyed or adhered to, or potentially, a local government could introduce new bylaws if they felt the ones they had were insufficient. If they felt there was an issue of pollution or a violation of the Environmental Management Act or the Environ- mental Management Act regulations, or a potential one that they wanted us to closely monitor, they could notify the environmental protection division.

The environmental protection division, if there was a complaint that there was a potential violation of the act or regulations, would deter- mine if, in fact, that was the case and take appropriate action under the act and regulations. [2:55 p.m.] If there was a concern that that might happen and the environmental protection division thought the circum- stances indicated that that was a valid concern, we would monitor and take action if it was indicated. P . Milobar:I think it’s obvious why I’m asking questions around this.

I think it’s fairly safe to say that the House Leader for the Third Party has quite a community interest around soil movement and whether it’s appropriate or not appropriate and public input or not and municipal govern- ment input or not. Post Bill 41, what types of notifications will be needed, if any, once notice is given? Or will notice also have to include notification to area First Nations? Hon. G. Heyman: The member makes an important point.

It gives me the opportunity to distinguish this part of the Environmental Management Act from the part of the Environmental Management Act that specifically addresses contaminated soil — moving and dumping. That is covered under the act but under a different section. The regulations that cover that will apply. Part of the require- ments are when a permit to handle contaminated soil is applied for, which is under another

section of the act, then this one…. First Nations are consulted. With respect to this amendment, the purpose of this amendment is to ensure that there is notification when soil is being moved. The regulations will require the person moving the soil to notify local government, the provincial government and local First Nations. So that notification will take place. The movement of soil that could potentially be contam- inated from a commercial or industrial site will require that that soil be properly characterized.

So if it is in fact contaminated, that will be known, and then a proper con- sultation process around the handling of contaminated soil under other sections of the act would take place. P . Milobar: Just to be clear, then, on the notification provisions. In Kamloops’s case, I know that when we would have drainage works to be done, just in terms of storm sewers or drainage ditching, not even a pipe, we would have to send notification out to, I believe it was, 14 area First Nations around Kamloops to get sign-off on those works. They would usually defer to the TteS, as the overarching impacted First Nation.

Y ou would go through the steps. It would take quite a while to get notification back. Many bands, just out of sheer capacity issues, especially with the sheer volume of referrals that will start coming their way, especially on the heels of Bill 41, take some time to process the work that’s in front of them.

As I say, it’s simply because they’ve got a big stack of referrals to have to try to churn through and, essentially, a very small operation to deal with them. [3:00 p.m.] This is a two-week notification, and then it looks like once the two weeks’ notice has been given, the person can continue on with the soil movements. Is that the case? Regardless of whether they’ve heard back in that two-week window or not, if no one has gotten back, the person can then proceed with the soil relocations, under this bill? Hon. G. Heyman: It’s a good question, and it’s an opportunity to offer some clarity.

Currently these amendments replace the soil relocation agreements which exist now and do not require consulta- tion and, frankly, in many cases, don’t exist. The amend- ments to the act do two things. The first thing they require is notification of movement of clean soil below a certain quantity, which, in a sense, is no different than moving lumber or anything else. But it does ensure that local gov- ernment, First Nations and the provincial government are aware of the movement.

The other really important thing that the amendment does is to say that soil that comes from a commercial or an industrial site must be characterized properly, sci- entifically, in a technically sound manner. Or that if soil exceeds a certain volume, it is covered, as would soil that was found to be contaminated — through the characteriz- ation — would be covered by a different process under this act, different regulations, with a full consultation around what happens with it.

The process, if the soil is found to be contaminated or if the soil exceeds a certain volume, would be different than simply a two-week notification period. It would require review under regulations for contaminated soil, and a Wednesday, March 4, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11513

more robust consultation with everyone, including First Nations, would take place. P . Milobar: So 2(d), I guess it is. It’s bolded: “in sub- section (5) by striking out ‘from depositing soil from a contaminated site at another site’ and substituting ‘from depositing soil at a site. ’” I’m just wondering, given that this is to deal with con- taminated soils: why the need to remove “from a con- taminated site”? I would assume that’s where most of the soil being moved is coming from — a contaminated site to a different site. So does this mean it’s any soils? Or is it still strictly contaminated soils that this

section is talk- ing about? [3:05 p.m.] Hon. G. Heyman: For clarity, as I’ve stated, now the words “from a contaminated site” are struck because it is covering all soil. Soil from a commercial or industri- al site will be characterized to determine if it’s contam- inated — here’s the difference — and then if it is, it will be dealt with as contaminated soil has been dealt with in the past under the act. P . Milobar:So if it’s all soils that count, are agricultural operations part of these changes and have any impact with this bill at all? Hon. G.

Heyman: The definition of “commercial” and “industrial” will take place. It’ll be strictly defined in the regulation. The intent, to date, has not been to include agricultural operations in that. We believe that other acts and regulations cover what happens on agricultural soil, in the first place, because it’s used for growing food or feed- ing animals that become food. Therefore, there are a num- ber of other provisions that apply. It’s generally not the case that soil is moved from an agricultural operation.

In the course of consulting on the regulations, which we will do, if a gap is identified, we’ll certainly consider prescribing coverage of that gap, either here or in another appropriate act or regulation. P . Milobar: I’m curious about mining as well, if it’s already been contemplated or not. The reason I asked spe- cifically about agriculture — but the same would hold true with mining — is that most of those operations have sev- eral different parcel identifiers within the operation them- selves. Y ou can have several different titles that make up a ranch. Several different titles will make up a mine site.

Those types of scenarios. What’s envisioned here to be defined as “a site”? In other words, is the movement on the same legal parcel going to be considered the same? Or if it’s the same entity that owns both parcels side by side and they decide to drive it from one side of their operation to the other, is that now a movement of soil? In terms of that, there are even large gravel pit operations or anything like that that you could technically see where they would be going across property lines, but it’s all still one big corporate entity.

Could we get some clarification of how this envisions the classification of a site versus just internal operations for large-scale operators? [3:10 p.m.] Hon. G. Heyman: Firstly, much handling of soil or material on an industrial site — a mine, for instance — would be covered, in all likelihood, by the conditions on an environmental assessment certificate. To the member’s question, the site is defined by parcel identifier.

If you’re moving from like to like — for instance, if you’re moving from one part of an industrial operation to another part of the industrial operation — and they both have contaminated soil, both have poten- tial contaminants, then the answer would be no, you wouldn’t be required to.

If, however, it was one operation and part of the site was industrial and another part of the site was, say, for the sake of argument, residential or, I guess, residences for people who worked on a mine and you were moving soil from the industrial part of the potentially contaminated part to a part where people were living, then yes, a notification would be required. The fact that there is more than one parcel identifier on an industrial operation where you essentially have con- tiguous operation across a boundary and contamination in each, then no. P .

Milobar: Just a couple more questions, and then we’ll probably be able to breeze through the nine sec- tions pretty quickly. Just for some other clarity, then, around forestry. They go in. They build the roads. They have to start doing some remediation work and things after they’re done in their cutblocks. Will the forestry industry be required with this, as well, if they’re hauling in dirts and soils and that? Or are they part of their own separate area, and this is nothing for them to be worried about? Hon. G. Heyman: There will again, in the regulation, be a list of prescribed activities.

Forestry specifically isn’t one of them. But if it’s a site or a yard where there’s equipment and potential contamination from fuels or other materi- als used in a machine shop or somewhere else, then yes. It would be covered if they were moving the soil somewhere other than the site. [3:15 p.m.] P . Milobar:I recognize this has been ongoing since, I believe, 2014. We have the final policy direction paper as well, but there’s still a fair amount left for regulation once this bill gets passed. I’m just wondering: what’s the time- line for finalizing the necessary regulations?

Is there going 11514 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, March 4, 2020

to be any more consultation before the finalization of the regulations? Overall, what’s the way forward with regula- tion and timelines? Hon. G. Heyman: The intention is to work to finalize the regulations by fall 2021. There will be intentions papers published on the development of regulations, with lots of time for comment and extensive consultation on the regu- lation proposals. P . Milobar:I know existing permits will be held, as we talked about at the very beginning. Does that mean, then, that between now and whenever all the final regulation is brought in, all the existing processes stay in place?

It’s status quo until we see those final regulations in the fall of 2021? Hon. G. Heyman: That’s correct. Sections 2 to 10 inclusive approved. Title approved. Hon. G. Heyman: I move that the committee rise and report the bill complete without amendment. Motion approved. The committee rose at 3:17 p.m. The House resumed; Mr. Speaker in the chair. Report and Third Reading of Bills BILL 3 — ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT AMENDMENT ACT, 2020 Bill 3, Environmental Management Amendment Act, 2020, reported complete without amendment, read a third time and passed. [3:20 p.m.] Hon. G.

Heyman:I call Committee of the Whole on Bill 8, the Education Statutes Amendment Act, 2020. Committee of the Whole House BILL 8 — EDUCATION STATUTES AMENDMENT ACT, 2020 The House in Committee of the Whole (Section

B) on Bill 8; S. Gibson in the chair. The committee met at 3:21 p.m. The Chair: Hon. Members, I will call the meeting to order, but we will take a recess of approximately five minutes in order to be prepared. The committee recessed from 3:21 p.m. to 3:27 p.m. [S. Gibson in the chair.] Hon. R. Fleming: I’ll just begin by introducing some staff who will help me with committee stage of the debate this afternoon. To my right is Deputy Minister Scott Mac- Donald, to my left is Assistant Deputy Minister Keith Godin, and directly behind me is Assistant Deputy Minis- ter Reg Bawa.

We’ll certainly look forward to questions from the members on the various sections of the bill. With that, I’ll take my place. D. Davies: Ready to begin. We can go into the bill. I’m looking forward to asking a number of questions, as we raised in second reading yesterday. Sections 1 to 14 inclusive approved. On

section 15. D. Davies: I do have a number of questions around sec- tion 15. Of course, as I mentioned yesterday in second reading, most of our questions are going to come around the child care, the before- and after-school care piece of this legislation. [3:30 p.m.] Just wondering if this bill in any way limits a school board from continuing to enter into contracts with other providers for children under six on school grounds. Hon. R. Fleming: The answer is no. D. Davies: Thank you, Minister, for the answer.

Regarding impact with child care being provided in communities right now, the bill mandates boards to charge their own costs. There will be no profit allowed. Their costs will be basically rock bottom, as I mentioned in second reading yesterday. [R. Chouhan in the chair.] A lot of these subsidies will be borne by the taxpayer. Just wondering what the transparency piece is going to be around letting the public know the true costs that are going to be borne by the school district so that there is some transparency in place. Hon. R.

Fleming: As the member will know, this legis- lation enables school districts to pursue this. Some will; some will not. It will allow districts that do wish to directly Wednesday, March 4, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11515

provide child care to operate on a cost-even, a break-even, basis. We expect that their fees will recover the costs asso- ciated with providing new child care services that they will now directly administer, and therefore, the subsidies, if you will, that are already provided for the K-to-12 public education system will not be directly used to cross-sub- sidize the extracurricular programs of before- and after- school care. D. Davies: Will the costs around this…? And just to get on the record, will they include…? What are we looking at being included in the cost? Is it heating? Is it all those costs around that?

Is it going to be looking at a square-footage piece? What is the cost that they’ll be looking at? When school districts need to be looking at trying to come up with a cost to charge the user, what are the costs that are being looked at in regards to coming up with this formula? Or what is the formula, I guess? [3:35 p.m.] Hon. R. Fleming: I imagine this won’t be the last ques- tion the member has on this, but just to begin, there is no formula that is prescribed.

Bearing in mind that if a new before- and after-school care service is being provided by a school district directly, what we’re actually talking about is incremental costs in addition to what is provided during the school’s regular operating hours. So one would ima- gine that would be additional staffing hours, additional facility costs that can truly be ascribed to that operation, to that program, cleaning costs and those sorts of things. The member will know that boards are already required to follow financial audit requirements that delineate expenses for various programs.

So it would be up to dis- tricts to fulfil the requirement to report and provide the transparency that he is asking about, whether it’s through annual reports or audits or those sorts of things. The district will recover the costs. So it won’t require an additional taxpayer subsidy. They will recover the cost of these programs through fees that are paid by the parents. D. Davies: Thank you, Minister. Presumably, there’s going to be extra wear and tear on the school itself — I mean, we have extra kids now; there are longer hours — ranging from just the building maintenance required to school playground equipment.

Just wondering if that’s going to be within the mandate, I guess, of the board to also be looking at coming up with charging out this wear and tear to the users? Hon. R. Fleming: The short answer is that boards may decide that. But I would remind the member that we’re talking about programs that are typically operating an hour before school already and a couple of hours after school. Many schools have third-party partnerships already. So this isn’t new terrain, new territory, to operate this kind of service. They’ll have their own arrangements. I suppose what this legislation enables, though, is….

Districts were seeking clarity on whether they can operate child care services, specifically before- and after-school care, which currently the School Act is silent on. These amendments are the answer to that question: yes, they can. I think what we heard from many in the early childhood education community and others who operate on a non- profit basis already, community-based services, was that this is something that they very much want to do. This is something where the school facility can more efficiently be used to help accommodate the needs of parents, many of whom sit on wait-lists.

We expect that what you’ll probably see is more diversity of programming and of models of delivering before- and after-school care. The member will know that while there are demands in many communities for addi- tional services, there are tens of thousands of kids who will be utilizing after-school care in about half an hour’s time, on our time zone, right across the province. D. Davies: Great. Thanks for that. In regards to transparency, of course school districts having to report revenues and such, what if there is a profit generated by the school board through whatever…?

Cer- tainly, early on in this program, it’s going to be new and such. Are those profits, then, going to have to be turned over to the ministry, or will the school board be able to decide where those funds go? Hon. R. Fleming: Just to be clear, the intent of the legis- lation is to ensure that boards are able to charge adequate fees to cover their costs and ensure that the provision of child care is, in fact, not a profit-making venture.

So they would have to report, as I mentioned earlier, what fees or revenues they collect and what expenditures are associated and offset the fees that they collect from the parents. [3:40 p.m.] D. Davies: Okay, just to clarify, then. If there is addi- tional revenue left over, the school boards then would be allowed to utilize those funds as they see fit? Hon. R. Fleming: I think the answer to the question that the member asked is in the legislation before him,

section 15, where the School Act amendment to

section 85.2(2) inserts new text into the act. It directly provides clarity in law to the point that I think the member is trying to make. I’ll just quote it. “If a board provides a child care program referred to in subsection (1), the board may charge fees to a student to whom the child care program is provided if the fees are not more than the direct costs incurred and to be incurred by the board in providing that child care program. ” D. Davies: Thank you, Minister. That does make sense, but it kind of opens up the question, then, if school boards 11516 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, March 4, 2020

deem appropriate. There is a best guess, I guess. When they look at the cost of heating the building and the cost of staff, those other costs, then they will come up with a fee. They’re not going to back-charge a year of fees. It’s obvi- ously going to be upfront. I’m just curious to see…. We could be in a situation where there could be profits made. I wouldn’t say signi- ficant, but…. I guess my question still remains. Deemed appropriate. Is there a limit on what’s deemed appropriate? If there is a show of profits in regards to delivering the before- and after-school care, what is done with those?

Is the school district then able to just utilize those as they see fit, within making the improvements around the school care program? I just want to get clarification on that. Hon. R. Fleming: Well, just a general comment. I think we have a long experience that gives us a lot of faith in school districts to follow the law. The School Act has a very sophisticated number of clauses that contemplate how a public expenditure is both used and reported. For example, the member will know that deficits are illegal in school districts, and districts rarely miss on that projec- tion.

What I would say, in the hypothetical situation that the member presents, is that if a district slightly overcharges its calculation of fees — for example, maybe it has more kids, and more fees are collected as it relates to the staff ratios or those sorts of things — those would become retained earnings, and they be would reinvested back into the program. [3:45 p.m.] The school district, as I mentioned earlier, has to report out on the program’s revenues and expenses, and trans- parently so, to parents and others. The expectation and, in fact, the law, should this bill pass, will oblige them to do just that. D.

Davies: Great. Thanks. That helps clarify the ques- tion. Previously, under the current system, boards would basically have a provider, a contract that would come in and provide a service that was licensed. I’m just wondering now if these new programs that are offered by school dis- tricts are now to be licensed under the regular licencing act through the Ministry of Health as well. Hon. R. Fleming: Y es. D. Davies: Thank you, Minister, for that.

With these now being recognized as child care programs that are run- ning within school districts, would they then be eligible to apply, through provincial care programs that right now providers can apply for, for grants and additional funding and programming? Hon. R. Fleming: Y eah. I think, if the member is refer- ring to things like the Ministry of Children and Family Development’s new spaces fund, the answer is yes. D. Davies: Does this not seem like a double subsidy, then, definitely, for school districts? I’m just wondering.

It seems like it’s already a provincial asset, and now the province can apply for a grant from the province. I’m just wondering if that has been taken into account and what the minister’s thoughts are on that. Hon. R. Fleming: I want to be discerning about oper- ating fund programs that the member may be referencing and capital funds that I referenced in my last answer to his question.

Where a school district may now want to apply as a licensed child care operator for an MCFD capital grant to buy a modular space or refit a classroom, the school district would be able to do that in exactly the same way that other providers currently can, and they would have to meet the same criteria. Then that would become an asset specifically for child care purposes.

Y ou could get the situation where that space, which would be used for an early childhood education or preschool program between the hours of 9 and 3 p.m., let’s say, could otherwise be available to a district-administered early and after-school care program. But that wouldn’t be double-dipping for an additional subsidy. That would be taking an asset paid for by the province and maximizing the hours of its use by having two programs in a space that was originally assigned for one program. So it would be an efficiency, if I can put it that way. [3:50 p.m.] D.

Davies: We’ve already established that the school boards will now be recognized and licensed under the Ministry of Health and the health authority. Now, this might be a loaded question. I assume it would be required to meet all the regular requirements. But will it be required to meet all the exact same requirements as the child care programs — staffing ratios and everything else? Would that be required? Hon. R. Fleming: Well, the answer to the member’s question is that the regulations that currently exist…. They have different staffing ratios depending on the age of the child. The ones that are issued….

The licensing would be the same regime for a school-based, district-administered before- and after-school care program as it would be cur- rently for a not-for-profit or community partner model. D. Davies: Has the minister taken into consideration, regarding…? This is now government competing in a free market, and it does run the risk…. I know in my riding, there already is a challenge to have spaces, a challenge to get ECE folks. With poaching already rampant in regard to taking employees and such, I see there being a problem Wednesday, March 4, 2020 British Columbia Debates 11517

with the private care providers. As you move over here into the school districts and you provide some seats, we run the jeopardy of having maybe private operators close. I’m just wondering if the minister and the ministry itself have taken that into consideration and what preventative measures have been put in place to stop this poaching of ECE workers and this direct competition with the private sector. Hon. R.

Fleming: I would say, as a general comment, we’ve consulted widely with the child care community, including a very well-attended early learning summit that was hosted by the Ministry of Education in part- nership with MCFD and, in fact, the Minister of State for Child Care, and we didn’t hear any such concerns. I don’t think that the boys and girls club is concerned that the member’s school district in Peace River North could be in competition with one another. I think what we’re seeing is that they’re complementary, not in competition with one another. Parents will be able to choose which service they want.

School districts will be able to choose whether they wish to offer these programs or not. We are not seeking to push a particular model on them. They may wish to continue the partnerships they have. They may wish to begin their own operations. They may wish to have both, depending on which part of the community they’re representing.

I think actually contrary to what the member has sug- gested, there are some school districts who may wish to enter into a relationship where they are the direct licence holder and provider of before- and after-school care, where they see this as an advantage to retaining their own staff currently. I’m speaking specifically to educational assistants, who often do not have full-time hours. They would obviously be the workforce they may wish to look to, to work a longer day, often with the same kids, it would be, either in a before- or after-school care setting.

We’ll let the field, the school districts, look at those things. What we’ve committed to as a government is to enable this to happen, to bring clarity to the School Act, to not have barriers and impediments to these kinds of organic developments that might be the right fit for their community. That’s what this legislation does. D. Davies: Thank you for that. Since this bill was intro- duced, I have reached out to some of the private daycares. There is some concern, I know, in some of the rural places I’ve reached out to, regarding feeling that there could be an unfair advantage with the private sector.

Y ou had mentioned a moment ago about consulting widely, the summit and such. Can the minister take a moment to explain what the consultation process did in fact look like, who it included? Was it urban versus rural? Both, I presume. Did they look at far north, northeast, northwest? If the minister could provide the House with kind of a snapshot of what that consultation looked like. [3:55 p.m.] Hon. R. Fleming: Maybe just to go back to the mem- ber’s previous question. He was concerned about competi- tion, I think he said, with private child care operators.

I think you need to understand that when we’re talking about before- and after-school care, we’re talking about five- to 12-year-olds. These are children who attend school between the school hours of a given district. I don’t know of many private operators that have businesses that operate for two or 2½ hours a day strictly as before- and after- school care providers, so I don’t think there is a situation where there’s any competition at all.

The member will know that the reality is that there’s significant demand for before- and after-school care and child care, more generally, in communities right around British Columbia. We need to be able to build capacity. The intent of this bill is to allow districts — not to force them — should they wish, to address the wait-lists and expand the child care opportunities that they may already be providing or to provide it for the first time. They can now do this.

They can, in fact, become the licence holder if they want to move beyond just having a landlord-tenant relationship with the community providers that they may currently house in their school or in facilities that are on the school ground. They can use the rest of the school or portions of the school facilities that already exist that generally lock their doors at 3:05 in the afternoon. They can use it for a longer period of the day to provide a different program for the convenience of families who are looking for this.

Speaking of the advantages of what we’re trying to do here, the points that the member for North Vancou- ver–Lonsdale made at second reading debate are not insig- nificant — to reduce some of the transportation and stress to families that comes with multiple drop-off and pi

Document details

Collection	British Columbia — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	20200304pm-Hansard-n323
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	20200304pm Hansard n323
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	3841857e112ce731fbcace4b39fe9bb25643220c

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