Manitoba Hansard — 9 October 2025 (Sitting 72A, 43rd Legislature, 2nd Session)

43-2-72a

Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)

Second Session – Forty-Third Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable Tom Lindsey Speaker Vol. LXXIX No. 72A - 10 a.m., Thursday, October 9, 2025 ISSN 0542-5492

MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Forty-Third Legislature Member Constituency Political Affiliation ASAGWARA, Uzoma, Hon. Union Station NDP BALCAEN, Wayne Brandon West PC BEREZA, Jeff Portage la Prairie PC BLASHKO, Tyler Lagimodière NDP BRAR, Diljeet Burrows NDP BUSHIE, Ian, Hon. Keewatinook NDP BYRAM, Jodie Agassiz PC CABLE, Renée, Hon. Southdale NDP CHEN, Jennifer Fort Richmond NDP COMPTON, Carla Tuxedo NDP COOK, Kathleen Roblin PC CORBETT, Shannon Transcona NDP CROSS, Billie Seine River NDP DELA CRUZ, Jelynn Radisson NDP DEVGAN, JD McPhillips NDP EWASKO, Wayne Lac du Bonnet PC FONTAINE, Nahanni, Hon. St.

Johns NDP GOERTZEN, Kelvin Steinbach PC GUENTER, Josh Borderland PC HIEBERT, Carrie Morden-Winkler PC JOHNSON, Derek Interlake-Gimli PC KENNEDY, Nellie, Hon. Assiniboia NDP KHAN, Obby Fort Whyte PC KINEW, Wab, Hon. Fort Rouge NDP KING, Trevor Lakeside PC KOSTYSHYN, Ron, Hon. Dauphin NDP LAGASSÉ, Bob Dawson Trail PC LAMOUREUX, Cindy Tyndall Park Lib. LATHLIN, Amanda The Pas-Kameesak NDP LINDSEY, Tom, Hon. Flin Flon NDP LOISELLE, Robert St. Boniface NDP MALOWAY, Jim Elmwood NDP MARCELINO, Malaya, Hon. Notre Dame NDP MOROZ, Mike, Hon. River Heights NDP MOSES, Jamie, Hon. St. Vital NDP MOYES, Mike, Hon.

Riel NDP NARTH, Konrad La Vérendrye PC NAYLOR, Lisa, Hon. Wolseley NDP NESBITT, Greg Riding Mountain PC OXENHAM, Logan Kirkfield Park NDP PANKRATZ, David Waverley NDP PERCHOTTE, Richard Selkirk PC PIWNIUK, Doyle Turtle Mountain PC REDHEAD, Eric Thompson NDP ROBBINS, Colleen Spruce Woods PC SALA, Adrien, Hon. St. James NDP SANDHU, Mintu, Hon. The Maples NDP SCHMIDT, Tracy, Hon. Rossmere NDP SCHOTT, Rachelle Kildonan-River East NDP SCHULER, Ron Springfield-Ritchot PC SIMARD, Glen, Hon. Brandon East NDP SMITH, Bernadette, Hon. Point Douglas NDP STONE, Lauren Midland PC WASYLIW, Mark Fort Garry Ind.

WHARTON, Jeff Red River North PC WIEBE, Matt, Hon. Concordia NDP WOWCHUK, Rick Swan River PC

2911 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Thursday, October 9, 2025 The House met at 10 a.m. The Speaker: O Eternal and Almighty God, from Whom all power and wisdom come, we are assembled here before Thee to frame such laws as may tend to the welfare and prosperity of our province. Grant, O merciful God, we pray Thee, that we may desire only that which is in accordance with Thy will, that we may seek it with wisdom and know it with certainty and accomplish it perfectly for the glory and honour of Thy name and for the welfare of all our people. Amen.

We acknowledge we are gathered on Treaty 1 territory and that Manitoba is located on the treaty territories and ancestral lands of the Anishinaabeg, Anishininewuk, Dakota Oyate, Denesuline and Nehethowuk nations. We acknowledge Manitoba is located on the Homeland of the Red River Métis. We acknowledge northern Manitoba includes lands that were and are the ancestral lands of the Inuit. We respect the spirit and intent of treaties and treaty making and remain committed to working in partnership with First Nations, Inuit and Métis people in the spirit of truth, reconciliation and collaboration. Please be seated.

Speaker's Statement The Speaker: Before we get to orders of the day, I have a short statement for the House. For the information of the House, yesterday, the minister of Health, Seniors and Active Living raised a point of order regarding a gesture made in the House by the Leader of the Official Op position (Mr. Khan). Later in the day, the Leader of the Official Opposition rose on a point of order to apologize for that incident. At that time, I indicated that I was still investi- gating the original complaint and would provide a further ruling if necessary.

I am still investigating that matter and I will return to the House with a formal ruling on this matter as soon as I am able. Accordingly, the matter remains under advise - ment and it is therefore out of order to reference it in debate until I have ruled on this matter. ORDERS OF THE DAY The Speaker: The hon ourable op position–private members' business. PRIVATE MEMBERS' BUSINESS House Business Mr.

Derek Johnson (Official Opposition House Leader): Pursuant to rule 34(8), I am announcing that the private member 's resolution to be considered on the next Thursday of private members ' business will be one previously put forward by the hon ourable member for Roblin (Mrs. Cook). The title of that reso- lution is School Tax and Education Property Tax Increases. And also, Honourable Speaker, I would like to call Bill 222, The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amendments to The Occupiers' Liability Act, brought forward by the member for Interlake-Gimli.

The Speaker: So it has been announced that, pursuant to rule 34(8), that the private member 's resolution to be considered on the next Thursday of private members' business will be one previously put forward by the honourable member for Roblin. The title of the resolution is School Tax and Education Property Tax Increases.

DEBATE ON SECOND READINGS– PUBLIC BILLS Bill 222–The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amendments to The Occupiers' Liability Act The Speaker: It has further been announced that we will now debate second reading of Bill 222, The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amendments to The Occupiers' Liability Act. The debate stands in the name of the honour able member for Waverley, who has seven minutes remaining. MLA David Pankratz (Waverley): It is an honour, as always, to rise and speak on this PMB this morning. You know, it's a beautiful morning here in Manitoba.

We had a wonderful com mittee last night, and I just want to quickly say thank you to the many, many Manitobans who came to exercise their freedoms and be a part of our democracy in those committee meetings last night.

2912 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 Also, I'd be remiss not to mention that the Jays are moving on to the ALCS and the Yankees lost. So, con- gratulations to the Toronto Blue Jays, very happy. You know, I want to begin today just by recog- nizing that every Manitoban deserves to feel safe, whether it's in their home, in their busi ness, in their community. Yesterday, we met with Beef Producers of Manitoba, so–on their farms. We want to make sure they're feeling safe as well.

You know, this bill speaks to that instinct for fairness and accountability, right, that says that if you break the law, if you trespass or try to take what someone else has worked hard for, then that owner shouldn't be held responsi ble for any injuries that occur to the trespasser. And I don't disagree with that principle entirely, right? But, Honourable Speaker, the truth is that laws like this don 't exist in a vacuum; they can 't.

They depend on the strength of the system around them, and that is what we have to debate here today, you know, our police services, our courts, our com munity supports, and when those systems are underfunded or neglected, no law –even this one, whether it's–you know, whether we're deciding that it's a good one or a bad one or whether we 're going to pass it or not –can fully make Manitobans feel safe in practice. And, you know, ultimately, under the former gov- ernment, for a number of years, they froze munici pal operating funding against inflation, and police forces fell behind, right?

We lost officers, we lost capacity, we lost staff. Response times grew. They cut the social programs that help people turn their lives around to avoid situations like the one that we 're discussing today, these trespassing issues or criminal activities, you know, programs that kept young people out of trouble, that give families sta bility and that reduce crime before it starts. Those were all cuts under the former government, unfortunately.

So, you know, while this bill spe cifically claims to be about protecting property and standing up for victims–which I ap preciate the intent–the reality is that the same members bringing it forward helped to create the conditions that made our communities less safe in the first place. You know, and our govern ment is taking a very different approach, and we take a whole-of-government approach. I do want to shout -out the Minister of Justice (Mr.

Wiebe), but it also goes into other depart- ments as well: Minister of Families (MLA Fontaine); even the minister of Sport, Culture, Heritage, which may not be the first thing that you think of. But all of these things come together in trying to avoid some of these situations from happening in the first place with trespassing and then having to worry about your liability as the owner of property, right? And so that whole-of-government approach, that proactive listening that we are trying to do as a gov- ernment–that's the difference between our govern - ment and the now-opposition and their former govern- ment.

You know, we believe in consequences–obviously, we've increased police staffing and supports –and in opportunity, right? We believe in holding people accountable and giving them a path to rebuild their lives when they decide to take that. The Premier (Mr. Kinew) has said that many times, right, when you' re ready to step up and put the work in, your gov ernment is going to be there to support you.

And that 's how you make com munities truly safe, you know, not just through punishment but through prevention and partnership and purpose, right? * (10:10) And as a first responder myself, I did have a num- ber of unfortunate opportunities to see first -hand the effects of what some of these cuts from the opposition ended up causing in our communities, right, and being there on site with these people. In fact, it was a big reason for why I decided to get involved in politics; you know, I wanted to serve my com munity in a different way.

So again, this bill spe cifically is designed to prevent property owners from being held legally responsible for injuries or deaths of individuals who are trespassing. But again, you know, if we're worried too much about that side of the discussion and not actually funding things in the first place, this bill doesn't do a ton to actually keep Manitobans safe in the first place, keeping them safe and healthy. You know, it kind of reminds me actually of this idea of –maybe it' s an imperfect metaphor, but I 'm thinking of locking the barn after the horse is already gone, right?

So you' re sort of reacting to a situation without actually doing the work in the first place. So, you know, I 'm really proud now to be a part of a team who actually proactively pushes against some of these crimes from happening in the first place. We increased funding by 28 per cent to all municipal police forces, which is record funding after years of austerity under the former PC govern ment.

October 9, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2913 And we also ensured that Manitobans will have a 2 per cent escalator going forward so that law enforce- ment agencies have the resources they need in the future. And, you know, this year 's budget has a 30 per cent increase over any PC budget, which is unbelievable for a party that says that they want to be tough on crime and that they are all about law and order.

We saw this week, actually, and the member who brought this bill forward actually was implicated in an ethics report, a scathing ethics report, that called out the members opposite for unethical behaviour. And without that–and the point I'm trying to make here spe cifically, Honoura ble Speaker, and I know I will be called on relevance if I don 't get back to the point quickly, but we only get to discuss these bills if we have a democratic system– An Honourable Member: Relevance. MLA Pankratz: –in the first place.

And the member opposite who's heckling, and I know he'll own a–he'll owe a quarter to the heckle jar over there after today again. You know, he was part of this. And they joke about it, they laugh about it, but our democratic institutions cannot function unless our leaders actually follow the rules. And for us to have this discussion and pass a PMB like this one, we need to uphold those standards. And so, again, I thank you very much for the opportunity to speak to this bill today. French spoken MLA Robert Loiselle (St.

Boniface): Monsieur l'Honorable Président, c 'est toujours un honneur d'avoir la chance de parler au sujet de la sécurité des Manitobains et des Manitobaines. En tant qu'enseignant, j'ai travaillé pour plusieurs années pour s'assurer que nos familles, nos étudiants, ceux qui participent dans le système scolaire sont toujours en sécurité. Ayant travaillé au centre-ville de Winnipeg, en travaillant pour amener des jeunes de gangs, des jeunes de rue, de retour dans le système scolaire, on comprend que la sécurité est toujours une priorité pour les Manitobains et les Manitobaines.

Mais malheureusement ce projet de loi remet sur les épaules des Manitobains et des Manitobains leur propre sécurité. C 'est la police et la force policière et la Gendarmerie royale canadienne qui devraient s'occuper de garder nos communautés en pleine sécurité. Alors, de véritables investissements dans l' appli- cation de la loi et notre système judiciaire sont essentiels pour assurer la sécurité de nos collectivités, que ce soit au rural, au nord, dans nos villes : la sécurité est un besoin essentiel.

Notre gouvernement a augmenté le financement de l 'application de la loi, notamment hier, en annonçant deux millions de dollars pour agrandir le centre de communication opérationnel du Manitoba afin de renforcer la capacité des forces de l 'ordre à répondre aux crimes violents et aux incidents critiques. Mais l'ancien gouvernement conservateur a gelé le financement de la police au Manitoba à partir de 2017 et il ne l 'a jamais augmenté pendant toute la durée de son mandat. Ne l'a jamais augmenté pendant sept ans et demi. C 'est vraiment époustouflant.

Ils n'ont pas donné à la ville de Winnipeg, à la police de Brandon, ni à la Gendarmerie canadienne, les ressources nécessaires pour faire leur travail. Même si c'est leur devoir de garder nos communautés en sécurité, encore une fois les Conservateurs ont montré leurs vraies couleurs : on ne peut pas leur faire confiance, et on ne devrait jamais, jamais leur redonner les reines du pouvoir. Leurs actions ont eu des conséquences pour les Manitobains qui ont vu une augmentation spec - taculaire de la criminalité sous l'ancien gouvernement conservateur.

Alors je trouve ça hypocrite que les Conservateurs ce matin amènent sur le tableau, ici, un projet de loi de ce genre, quand pour sept ans et demi, ils n'ont pas agi, ils n' ont rien fait, ils ont manqué à leur devoir. Alors après des années de gel de financement sous les Conservateurs, nous avons augmenté le financement de 28 pour cent pour toutes les forces policières municipales, un financement record après des années d'austérité. Et on sait que l 'austérité ne fonctionne pas : les investissements stratégiques dans nos forces policières fonctionnent.

Nous avons aussi instauré un escalateur annuel de 2 pour cent afin que les services de police disposent de ressources nécessaires à long terme – 2 pour cent année après année. Quand la criminalité a explosé – a explosé – sous l'ancien gouvernement conservateur, ils ont choisi de rien faire. En 2017, ils ont aboli le programme de bracelet électronique, invoquant son inexactitude et son efficacité. En 2018, un gel de financement pour la police ici au Manitoba suivi d'un autre gel, suivi d'un autre gel. En 2019, ils ont estimé que les services de police municipaux n' avaient pas besoin d 'aide – en

2914 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 2019, incroyable. En 2020, aucune augmentation du financement pour les services de police municipale. Et en 2021, toujours rien. En 2022, alors que les forces de l 'ordre demandaient des ressources après des années de gel, toujours rien de la barre – de la part des membres d'en face. En 2023, à l 'approche d'élections, ils ont encore décidé que les forces policières ne méritaient pas leur intention. C'est un manque de respect. Et ce projet de loi est beaucoup trop moins, beaucoup trop tard.

Sous l'ancien gouvernement conservateur, la police de Winnipeg a perdu 55 agents de police. Cinquante-cinq agents de police de moins sur nos rues, ici à Winnipeg, pour protéger la population. Ce sont 55 agents de moins pour patrouiller les rues, aider les victime s et protéger les familles manitobaines. Lorsque notre gouvernement est arrivé, nous avons fait un investissement historique pour que les policiers et la Gendarmerie royale canadienne soient présents pour les Manitobains lorsqu'ils en ont besoin.

Notre gouvernement investit dans de vraies solutions pour améliorer la sécurité– Translation It is always an honour to have the opportunity to speak about the safety of Manitobans. As a teacher, I worked for many years to ensure that our families, our students and those involved in the school system were always safe. I have worked in downtown Winnipeg, worked to bring young people out of gangs and off the streets and back into the school system, and I understand that safety is always a priority for Manitobans.

Unfortunately, this bill places the responsibility for their own safety back on the shoulders of Manitobans. It is the police, law enforcement and the Royal Canadian Mounted Police who should be responsible for keeping our communities safe. Real investment in law enforcement and our justice system is essential to ensuring the safety of our communities, whether in rural areas, in the north or in our cities: safety is a basic need.

Our government has increased funding for law enforcement, including yesterday 's announcement of $2 million to expand Manitoba' s operational com - munications centre to strengthen law enforcement 's ability to respond to violent crimes and critical incidents. The former Conservative government, on the other hand, froze police funding in Manitoba starting in 2017 and never increased it during its entire term in office. It did not increase this funding for seven and a half years. It is truly mind-boggling.

They did not give the City of Winnipeg, the Brandon Police Service or the Royal Canadian Mounted Police the resources they needed to do their jobs. Even though it was their duty to keep our communities safe, once again the Conservatives showed their true colours: they cannot be trusted, and we should never, ever give them back the reins of power. Their actions had consequences for Manitobans, who saw a dramatic increase in crime under the former Conservative government.

Thus I find it hypocritical that the Conservatives are bringing a bill like this to the table here this morning, when for seven and a half years they did nothing–nothing. They failed in their duty. Meanwhile, after years of funding freezes under the Conservatives, we increased funding by 28 per cent for all municipal police forces, a record level of funding after years of austerity. We know that austerity does not work: strategic investments in our police forces do work.

We have also introduced a 2 per cent annual escalator so that police services have the resources they need in the long term–and that's 2 per cent year over year. When crime skyrocketed –skyrocketed–under the former Conservative government, they chose to do nothing. In 2017, they abolished the electronic bracelet monitoring programme, citing its inaccuracy and ineffectiveness. In 2018, there was a funding freeze for the police here in Manitoba, follow ed by another freeze, followed by another freeze. In 2019, they decided that municipal police services did not need help–in 2019, unbelievable.

In 2020, there was no increase in funding for municipal police services. And in 2021, still nothing. In 2022, when law enforcement agencies requested resources after years of freezes, still nothing from the members opposite. In 2023, with elections approaching, they again decided that police forces did not deserve their attention. That is disrespectful. And this bill is far too little, far too late. Under the former Conservative government, the Winnipeg Police Service lost 55 police officers. Fifty -five fewer police officers on our streets here in Winnipeg to protect the public.

That is 55 fewer officers to patrol the streets, help victims and protect Manitoba families. When our government came to power, we made a historic investment to ensure that police officers and the Royal Canadian Mounted Police are there for Manitobans when they need them. Our government is investing in real solutions to improve safety–

October 9, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2915 The Speaker: Order, please. The member is getting a little far afield from the piece of legislation we're actually discussing here this morning, so if he could bring his comments back to the criminal trespassers act, I would appreciate it. French spoken MLA Loiselle: Merci, l'Honorable Président, c'est un plaisir de savoir que vous êtes à l 'écoute, en français comme en anglais. Alors, pour revenir à ce projet de loi, la priorité de notre gouvernement est de garder les Manitobains et les Manitobaines en sécurité.

Ce projet de loi, essentiellement, veut remettre – veut remettre – la responsabilité aux Manitobains et aux Manitobaines d' avoir carte blanche pour protéger leurs biens sans répercussions. C'est à la police, à la Gendarmerie royale canadienne et aux forces policières de protéger les Manitobains et les Manitobains. Comme je l'ai dit, l'ancien gouverne- ment n'a rien fait pendant sept ans et demi. Nous investissons de façon stratégique.

Mais en tant que quelqu' un qui a travaillé dans plusieurs communautés, faut savoir que nous, les Manitobains et les Manitobaines, payons des taxes pour que ces taxes aillent aux forces policières, pour que les forces policières nous gardent en sécurité. * (10:20) Ce projet de loi voudrait donner carte blanche aux Manitobains et des Manitobaines de se défendre à un tel point où ce que on pourrait utiliser un nombre immesurable de forces sans répercussions. Ce n 'est pas la façon que nous opérons ici au Manitoba. Nous comptons sur nos forces policières pour être là quand nous en avons besoin.

D'ailleurs, je suis fier de dire que, ici au Manitoba, ici à Winnipeg, c'est nous qui avons inventé le numéro 9-1-1, qui est maintenant très commun à travers l'Amérique du Nord, si pas à travers la planète, parce qu'on compte sur la Gendarmerie royale canadienne, nous comptons sur nos policiers dans nos différentes municipalités, dans nos différentes villes, pour nous garder en sécurité. Alors maintenant de voir un gouvernement, un ancien gouvernement conservateur qui n' a rien fait pendant sept ans et demi, présenter un tel projet de loi, je trouve ça absolument hypocrite. C'est trop tard.

On sait déjà qu'on ne peut pas leur faire confiance, et on sait que les Manitobains et les Manitobaines peuvent nous faire confiance puisque nous avons investi de façon stratégique dans nos forces de l 'ordre. Et c 'est sur cette chose-là que nous comptons. Merci, Monsieur l'Honorable Président. Translation It is a pleasure to know that you are listening, in both French and English. So, returning to this bill, our government's priority is to keep Manitobans safe. This bill essentially seeks–seeks–to give Manitobans the responsibility of having carte blanche to protect their property without repercussions.

It is up to the police, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police and the police forces to protect Manitobans. As I said, the former government did nothing for seven and a half years. We are investing strategically. As someone who has worked in several communities, I know that we Manitobans pay taxes so that those taxes go to the police, so that the police can keep us safe. * (10:20) This bill would give Manitobans carte blanche to defend themselves, to such an extent that they could use an immeasurable amount of force without repercussions. That is not how we operate here in Manitoba.

We rely on our police forces to be there when we need them. In fact, I am proud to say that it was here in Manitoba, here in Winnipeg in fact, that the 9- 1-1 number was invented–a number that is now very common through- out North America, if not throughout the world– because we rely on the Royal Canadian Mounted Police and our police officers in our various munici - palities and cities to keep us safe. I find it absolutely hypocritical to see a former Conservative government that did nothing for seven and a half years introduce such a bill. It is too late.

We already know that they cannot be trusted, and we know that Manitobans can trust us because we have invested strategically in our law enforcement agencies. That is what we are counting on. Thank you, Honourable Speaker. Hon. Nellie Kennedy (Minister of Sport, Culture, Heritage and Tourism): It's my pleasure to rise today to put some words on the record with regards to Bill 222, The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amend- ments to The Occupiers' Liability Act. So, certainly, while I was listening to my col - league speak, the member for Waverley (MLA Pankratz)

2916 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 put some really good points on the record that I 'd like to expand upon. We both worked in a helping profession before entering politics. I was a social worker and was really committed to supporting marginalized folks within our province. And a lot of times–if we're going to talk about this bill, the trespassers act, who is trespassing? Why are they trespassing? I want to put some words on the record about this. And a lot of times it may be people who are using drugs. We know that this is a real issue.

There's a lot of addictions issues that are going around our province. You know, meth has been such a huge scourge on our province and it 's something that our government is really working very hard on providing services–addictions services–for people who may be struggling with addictions issues.

Certainly, under the failed PC gov ernment, for seven and a half years, when I was working in social services, there were cuts to programs, social programs, that would likely have assisted people access services, be able to get the help that they need and the support they need in order to turn their life around and be able to manage without the use of drugs.

And certainly, with regards to my position in the Department of Families, you know, that 's part of the reason that I ran for office–similarly to my colleague from Waverley, is that we, my colleagues and the people within my de partment–we certainly saw that the failed PC govern ment–they didn' t care about people who are marginalized, who required addictions treatment. They slashed social programs and they didn't make it accessible for people to access services.

And so, like my colleague from Waverley, I decided that, you know, this was a way to be able to advocate and support people who really needed systemic change and a gov ernment who really cares about everyday Manitobans –every Manitoban, not just people members opposite –you know, let 's be serious; this week, we saw clearly– Introduction of Guests The Speaker: Order, please. If I could interrupt the member for a moment, there are some guests in the gallery that are going to be leaving before she's done her speech. So I want to acknowledge students in the public gallery.

We have seated there, from Argentina, 14 high school students under the direction of Dolores Kessel. We welcome you here today. * * * MLA Kennedy: Well that' s a great reason to be interrupted while I 'm speaking. Oh, wonderful. So, welcome, to all the students who are here from Argentina. Okay, I've got to get back on my path of thought here. So not a laughing matter is the fact that, you know, we see the lack of morality and ethics from across the way here with the folks who were in the failed PC Party.

And that –really, what we need are people on this side of the House who are committed to assisting all Manitobans. And so, what I would say is, you know, there really is–needs to be investment in our policing, in social programs. That is the way to be able to really protect the public –every Manitoban, right–is public safety really needs to be o n providing supports and funding for these programs. And so, really, like I 'd said, real invest ments in law enforcement and our justice system are the way to keep com munities safe. And our govern ment has really been doing a great job on that.

Our Minister of Justice (Mr. Wiebe) is just doing an excellent job. We've increased funding to law enforcement, and this includes $2 million that we have included to expand Manitoba's Operational Communications Centre. And that's to strengthen law enforce ment and their ability to respond to violent crimes, in critical incidents when they're happening, such as folks who may be trespassing on someone's property.

So really, the –in juxtaposition to that, the previous government–they froze funding to police in Manitoba from 2017, and they never increased it once during their time in govern ment, if you can believe that. They didn' t give the Winnipeg police, the Brandon police, or the RCMP the resources they needed to do their job. And their actions had real conse quences for Manitobans; we saw that. And we saw dramatic increases in crime under the former PC gov ernment. And now, you know, when we're in government, they sit across the Chamber and they ask questions, like: why? Why is this happening?

Well, that's the reason why. There's an increase in crime because social programs were cut. The police forces weren 't given the funds that they needed in order to do the jobs they needed to do to keep the

October 9, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2917 public safe. And now we're dealing with the fallout of that. So also, what I really want to talk about is the fact that, like my colleague from Waverley had said, we've increased funding by 28 per cent to all municipal police forces. That's an incredible increase, and this is record funding after years of austerity. We also had made sure that we–this year's budget, even, has a 30 per cent increase over any PC budget. And when the crime exploded under the former PC government, they didn't do anything.

So I'll bring it back, Honour able Speaker–I can see that you're moving in your chair–to Bill 222, The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amendments to The Occupiers' Liability Act. I recognize that this is some- thing where we 're–the crux of the bill, while I may 'ingree' in principle, you know, of course we want to ensure that victims of crime aren 't held liable, that if someone trespasses on their property, that they aren' t held liable for what may occur if it's not grossly over– a response that isn't grossly over-exaggerated.

But what I 'd like to also talk about, Hon ourable Speaker, is that, really, police officers really weren 't worth the time of the PC govern ment–the failed Heather Stefanson PC government. And during the time in govern ment–members opposite–they had a net loss of 55 officers in the Winnipeg police force. And this is really substantial. I mean, those officers are here; they weren't patrolling the streets; they weren 't helping victims and protect- ing Manitoban families– The Speaker: Order, please. I realize that sometimes it's tough to stay on track, but we are discussing a specific bill.

So if the member could keep her comments relevant to that bill, I would appreciate it. * (10:30) MLA Kennedy: I ap preciate your guidance in this matter. I will attempt to bring it back here. I just have so much to say about the incred ible work that our govern ment is doing in order to fight crime and keep–public safe, which really is what we're discussing within Bill 222, is ensuring that, you know, we are protecting people from the fact that someone may trespass on their property and ensure that they're not held liable. But why may someone be trespassing? These are questions that we need to ask.

And I would say that with my ex perience in supporting youth, supporting young adults and adults who may be affected by poverty and, you know, maybe wanting to find things that on a person's property–what would bring them to another person's property? And those are things that I can speak about, if I may, Honourable Speaker.

And I just think that with regards to what our government is doing in order to keep the public safe, a part of that is supporting programs in order to keep youth engaged in a good path to be able to have, like my colleague from Waverley had said, you know, you wouldn't necessarily think of the position that I have with Sport, Culture, Heritage and Tourism, but sport is an incredible way to keep youth engaged, to have them gain confidence and to be able to see their lives in a way that maybe they may not have otherwise. And so it's really important for people to be able to have those opportunities.

And it 's really such an honour to be in this portfolio and a part of our govern- ment where we can say that we are supporting initiatives that keep youth engaged, and give them a place to belong. Certainly, somewhere that I went yesterday, last night, was to Selkirk to the Gaynor family library. What an in credible space to keep youth involved. They've done such incredible work there and it's such a beautiful space for youth to come and feel like they belong. And so I 'll end my remarks there, Hon ourable Speaker. Thank you. Hon.

Renée Cable (Minister of Advanced Education and Training): It's a true pleasure to stand in the House today. I know that my colleague from Waverley gave thanks to everybody who stayed late last night, and I especially want to thank the commit- tee clerks and the technical folks, security, who were all here exceptionally late to help us get through the very important process of the public hearings for com- mittee. So I just want to extend my sincere gratitude. They did it with grace.

Honourable Speaker, I know that we are here today to discuss Bill 222, The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amendments to The Occupiers' Liability Act. And I just want to pick up where my colleague, the honourable minister of Sport, Culture and Heritage, left off, and talk about–a little bit about prevention. Often, when we talk about crime, we talk about things like additional police resources or ankle monitors, which are, of course, very, very im portant. Those address crime. But we know that we also have

2918 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 to address the root causes of crime in our society because prevention is so key to all of this. So, looking at expansions to youth program ming, finding places where young people feel like they fit in, after -school clubs, community centres, these are all incredibly im- portant to us not only keeping our young people healthy and safe but building a better society.

And I would also venture that small gestures like saying hello to your neighbour, moving in the garbage bins for your neighbours, making sure that you are – make eye contact with people on the street, they seem small but have a funda mental impact on how w e interact with one another in society. And, Honourable Speaker, Bill 222 talks about, you know, if –terribly–if somebody were to come to your property uninvited, perhaps to do some thing nefarious, and what, as a homeowner, your rights are.

And, you know, for myself, I know that I have been in situations where we have had people come into our yard uninvited, a stolen lawn mower, a stolen leaf blower. I can 't even blame it on my in -laws; I know they didn' t take it home with them to Saskatoon. But these are real irritants and real things that happen to people when folks come in to take things that aren't theirs, et cetera, et cetera. But, Hon ourable Speaker, I am also from the school of–you know, as frustrating and aggravating and everything as it is, I wonder the situation of the individual who is in this –who has come to do this crime.

And, absolutely, criminals need to be held to account. But we as a society need to do all we can to support people to a place where they're not coming to steal my lawn mower in order to pawn it on Facebook Marketplace. Bill 222 highlights, for me, the need to invest in law en forcement even further –our govern ment has made incredible investments in law en forcement–but also to really think about what we value and how we respond to unfor tunate parts of our days and things that are happening in society. Honourable Speaker, our govern ment has invested $4 million for bail reform.

And so –and we have a five-point plan that's keeping Manitoba safer. We know that there is more to do, and we will continue to call upon our federal cousins to do the work of fixing bail. But we also know that reducing recidivism is rooted in ensuring that there are programs available in correctional facilities, ensuring that folks are well positioned to return to society so that the cycle of petty crimes and criminal activity –there's an interruption and a divergence so that folks can get on a better path.

And, Honourable Speaker, I understand the intent of Bill 222, and, you know, I commend the member opposite for putting it forward. But from my perspective, I sincerely hope that the members opposite also consider the impacts of some of the cuts that they made while they were in govern ment that have impacted our ability to keep young people on a good path, cuts to recreational program ming, reductions in services –social services, cuts in classrooms, really not consid ering the long- term implications of those cost -saving measures, because those costs are borne somewhere.

And, Honour able Speaker, many Manitobans have taken advantage of the Manitoba Security Rebate Program, which would, again, allow folks to add security to their home, to be able to have, in many cases, a video record if somebody were to come to the property uninvited and give a greater sense of security to Manitobans around their own property.

And I'm not sure if it' s the same in the con stit- uency of Flin Flon, but in my home constituency of Southdale, we have many active community Facebook groups that often share infor mation about what 's going on in the neighbourhood, who was seen on a camera; often it's a deer.

And, you know, that shared sense of community–we look after one another. * (10:40) And, Hon ourable Speaker, when I think about Bill 222 and–you know, I'm sincerely hopeful that the intent of this bill was not to go as far as we 've seen in United States, for example, where folks are meeting criminals with vigilante -type behaviour and really causing harm to other folks. Honourable Speaker, we know that every Manitoban wants to and deserves to be safe in their home. We all deserve to live safe, productive, constructive lives.

And I just don't believe that Bill 222 helps contribute to that goal–that shared goal that we have for a healthy province. Thank you, Honourable Speaker. Hon. Mike Moyes (Minister of Environment and Climate Change): I'm happy to rise today to speak about bill –or speak to Bill 222, The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amendments to The Occupiers' Liability Act. I know it's been mentioned a few times by a few different speakers today, but I think it 's worth reiter-

October 9, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2919 ating, and that 's that all Manitobans deserve to feel safe. That's ultimately, I believe, what this is all about. You know, I really want to believe that this act – that this bill comes from a good place. I think that all members, regardless of political stripe, wants that safety: wants that safety for themselves, wants that safety for their family and their friends. Many of us have young children. Mine may be not so young; they're now teenagers.

But regardless, we think about our com munities and we think about some of the different things that have taken place in those com munities, whether you're in an urban setting like Winnipeg, whether you're moving into the North or a rural com munity. And we think about some of these heinous acts that have taken place, and we' re trying to put different measures in place in order to regain that safety and to put some legal guardrails that you won't be held liable or this or that. But in my mind, this bill is putting the cart before the horse.

I think the first step in all of this is doing what our government is, which is being tough on crime and being tough on the causes of crime. And I think we need to really take a holistic approach to crime. It's not about one side or the other. Instead, we need to start by working with law enforcement. Those people that commit crimes should be held accountable; those people that commit crimes and are unlawfully on somebody's property should be taken care of. We should be engaging police officers; we should be engaging the different responses through law enforce- ment.

But at the same time, we also need to take care of the other side of it, which is being tough on the causes of crime. And I think this bill is almost jumping ahead to: okay, what happens if the crime happens here. And we're–instead, I think the focus needs to go back. So if we're focused on only the stuff that happens, the bad things that happen after a crime, then I think we're behind the eight ball, because the crime' s already happened. And now we 're worried about the homeowner that could be held criminally liable or – sorry, civilly liable with this. That's not where our focus should be.

We need to go back to the basics where we're working with police, where we're working with law enforcement and where we're working with the justice system. What we found over the last number of years , prior to our administration , is that the PCs weren 't tough on any part of it. They weren' t giving law enforcement what they need, and so there was less police around to respond when there are people causing crimes, when there are people entering people's properties, when there–when you would call– when you would make that call to 911 or to the RCMP, it was slower to get to and I think that 's a problem.

You know, we have met –a lot of the members opposite come from the rural areas where the police– there's not police stations necessarily nearby, and we're reinvesting in that,

whereas that 's not what we saw over their time in office. And we recognize just how important that is, working with law enforcement, working with the RCMP, working with the Winnipeg police department, working with the Brandon police department and all the other pieces. But it also goes beyond that, Honourable Speaker. It's important that we are funding our justice system holistically, and that includes things like the Crown prosecutors, which we are working to build up.

It includes things like ankle monitoring, which work was cut under the previous PC government, which we have reinstated to ensure that people aren't continuing down the path of crime, which leads to issues which this bill is, I believe, trying to address. But it also includes things like our court system. So there's the justice side, and that's critical. I have so much respect for people that work in justice, whether you are a police officer, whether you are working as a Crown prosecutor, whether you are working as a judge or any other member that contributes to our justice system.

It's an incredibly important role in our society, and holding people to account is important. But there's the other side of it as well, so that pre- vention side, so that we 're not having to have folks come onto people 's property, to hurt homeowners. Let's prevent some of these things. I was a teacher for 20 years before I was elected and I know, and I believe inherently, that people are good. I believe that all kids want to do well. I believe that all kids have dreams and sometimes they get off the path.

And sometimes those –that path is unfor- tunate and it can come from a whole variety of reasons, whether that's mental health issues, that can be from –you know, from getting on to–getting addicted to different substances, but it could also be from a lack of supports where they fall into the wrong crowd. And so I think it 's really impor tant that, if we 're talking about a bill like Bill 222, that we 're also

2920 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 talking about, how do we prevent it from even getting to that place, how do we get it –how do we prevent some of these actions from taking place at all so that there aren 't crimes being committed against homeowners, so that families can feel safe? So that seniors can walk down the street and go to their local store or take a –go catch a bus; that teenagers can go and ride over to their friends ' houses, play street hockey; that, you know, people can go for a jog in their neighbourhood and feel safe and not worry about what criminal activity is taking place.

And so I think that prevention side is critically im- portant. That' s a part of the discussion if we 're discussing something like Bill 222. That piece on pre- vention, I mentioned as an educator that–how impor- tant I believe edu cation is in reaching young people, for helping young people reach their full potential. But it goes beyond that as well. It's recreational opportun- ities.

And that's some of the things that our government is trying to invest in as well to prevent some of the things so that folks don' t end up going down the criminal path and hurting homeowners, things like we're investing in the community centre in the constit- uency of Dawson Trail, right in Lorette.

That 's a key investment for that commu nity so that young people can hopefully be physic ally active, be engaged with their commu nity rather than hurting someone in a home, rather than going down a dark path. * (10:50) And so I think that prevention piece, it's the edu- cation, it's the recreation, it's the social programs that are going to help prevent a lot of the things that this bill is trying to address after the fact. We can 't just forget about being tough on crime.

We can't just forget about the prevention piece and then just jump right to, okay, when bad things are happening, let's make sure that the homeowner isn't liable. That's impor tant for sure. I think it 's impor tant that–and I think most people would agree that Manitobans deserve to be safe in their homes. I don' t think there's anyone that would–that dispute that. I just also want to touch on one last thing, just as my time is coming up here. There's some really great organizations in our province that are working with some of those that do have a criminal record.

And I just want to give a quick shout-out to organi zations like BUILD. It's a social enterprise that primarily deals with folks that have criminal backgrounds and instead, they give them the economic tools to be successful, so that they can move on from their criminal back ground and into a pro- ductive way of life. And so I just want to shout those good folks out, something that our gov ernment is supporting and continues to fund in our budget. So let's take a holistic approach to– The Speaker: Member's time has expired.

Introduction of Guests The Speaker: Prior to recognizing the next speaker, we have some more guests in the gallery. We have, seated in the public gallery, from Shamrock School 50 students under the directions of Paul Figsby, and this group is located in the constituency of the honourable member for Southdale (MLA Cable). We welcome you all here today. * * * MLA Billie Cross (Seine River): I'd like to also welcome those guests from Shamrock School. It 's a school I had a chance to work in prior to being elected. And so I 'm so glad that you guys are here to learn a little bit about what we do.

Honourable Speaker, I am happy to rise today and speak to Bill 222, The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amendments to The Occupiers' Liability Act. I want to begin by saying that every day, before we start business in this House, we acknowledge that we're gathered on traditional territory of Indigenous peoples who have cared for these lands since time immemorial. That recognition is not symbolic. It 's a reminder that the laws that we make in this House affect com- munities whose voices and experiences have too often been ignored. Today I want to speak about a young man named Colten Boushie.

Colten was a 22 -year-old Cree man from Red Pheasant First Nation in Saskatchewan. In August of 2016, Colten' s life was cut short when he was shot on a farm in Saskatchewan. His death and the trial that followed shook this country. It forced Canadians to con front questions about systemic racism, about property rights, about rural crime and, most of all, about th e unequal ways our justice system treats Indigenous and non- Indigenous peoples.

October 9, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2921 Before I continue, I want to be clear that I want every Manitoba citizen to feel safe in their homes and on their properties. I do not want to see people exper- ience violence, have their hard work taken from them through theft or vandalism. I am proud to be the mother-in-law to a Winnipeg police officer. I believe that we need to be just and do the right things.

Honour able Speaker, I raise Colten 's name today because the bill before us, Bill 222, The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amendments to The Occupiers' Liability Act, has everything to do with the issues I've mentioned in the beginning. What does Bill 222 do? Let 's put it out plainly. First, it bars trespassers age 12 and older from suing a landowner if they are injured or even killed while trespassing for the purpose of committing a crime. The only exception is if the landowner's conduct is so willful and grossly 'dishproportionate' that it results in a criminal conviction.

Second, it expands the circumstances under which landowners have no duty of care at all. Anyone twenty–12 years or older who sets foot on private land without permission would be stripped of the protec - tions that most of us assume exist within the frameworks of our laws. Third, it tilts the balance of justice firmly toward property owners while stripping away recourse from vulnerable people, families and Indigenous youth. On the surface, this may sound like a straightforward property rights measure. But, Honour able Speaker, the reality is far more troubling.

Bill 222 sends a dangerous message that property rights are more valuable than human rights. And we have seen in painful detail where that mindset leads. When Colten Boushie was killed, the public conver - sation quickly shifted. Instead of centring on the value of his life, too many voices, including official ones, began to centre on property rights, farm security and rural crime. And yes, we must address those issues, but I think we need to do so in a proactive manner; things like our school nutrition program, making sure that we have good jobs, making sure that children can read.

I listened to presenters talk last night about when children can read, they have confidence, they feel like they belong and they are so much more suc cessful. And they stay out of the criminal justice system. So because property rights were more im portant, Colten himself was painted as a trespasser and though justice–and that justice that was served was deserved. This bill, Honourable Speaker, risks entrenching that same logic into law.

It says to landowners, unless you are convicted of a crime, you will not be held civilly accountable for harm that comes to someone on your land, even if that person is a child, even if your actions were reckless, even if the family is left without justice. And we all know how rare criminal convictions are in cases where Indigenous peoples are victims. Honourable Speaker, the Civilian Review and Complaints Commis sion for the RCMP released a report in March 2021 on the RCMP 's conduct in the aftermath of Colten 's death.

And I don' t believe the member who brought this bill forward, Bill 222, The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amendments to The Occupiers' Liability Act, thought about this. The CRCC found that, while aspects of the investigation were carried out professionally, the way the RCMP treated Colten's mother, Debbie Baptiste, amounted to discrimination. Let us picture that night. Ms. Baptiste was grieving her son who had just been killed. Instead of compassion, she was surrounded by police cars. Instead of comfort, her home was searched unlawfully. Instead of sensitivity, she was treated with suspicion.

The CRCC concluded that this treatment was not just insensitive, it was discriminatory. Honourable Speaker, if the national police force could treat an Indigenous mother in this way, how can we possibly trust that this law, Bill 222, which strips away civil remedies for so -called trespassers, will be applied fairly? We know who will bear the brunt: Indigenous youth, Black youth, racialized and marginalized people. Those who are already labelled with suspicion will be the ones who are denied their day in court. Let's all think through this bill and what it would mean for families.

Let' s imagine for a moment: a 13-year-old child enters private property, perhaps by mistake, perhaps on a dare, perhaps following friends. We've all been 13 -year-olds; we know what it 's like. We know the silly things that we can do. If that child is injured while trespassing or even killed, their family has no civil remedy unless the landowner is convicted of a crime. And there –and if there's no conviction, that family has nothing, no way to hold the occupier accountable, no recog nition of their loss in law.

2922 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 Honourable Speaker, that is not justice. That is the state telling families, especially Indigenous families– * (11:00) The Speaker: Order, please. When this matter is again before the House, the honourable member for Seine River (MLA Cross) will have two minutes remaining. DEBATE ON RESOLUTIONS Res. 13–School Tax and Education Property Tax Increases The Speaker: The time being 11 o'clock, the time is now for private members' resolutions.

And the resolu- tion before us this morning is debate on resolu tion No. 13, the School Tax and Education Property Tax Increases. And the debate is standing in the name of the honourable member for Fort Richmond (MLA Chen), who has seven minutes remaining. MLA Jennifer Chen (Fort Richmond): It is my pleasure to rise today to–and continue to share some of my thoughts on this private member's resolution. We believe that Manitobans should not have to choose between paying their bills and ensuring their children receive a high -quality edu cation. They deserve both.

That balance, affordability today and strong schools for tomorrow, is the direction our gov- ernment is taking. Affordability–we froze hydro rates for one year to provide families with stability on their utility bills. Affordable hydro is essential for Manitobans, whether it is seniors heating their homes, families managing monthly budgets or school divisions paying to keep classrooms warm in the winter. By keeping hydro rates stable, we' re not only helping households directly, but we are also easing cost pressures on school divisions, which, in turn, reduces the pressure to raise education property taxes. Mrs.

Rachelle Schott, Acting Chairperson, in the Chair We also reduced the prov incial gas tax, saving Manitobans money every time they fuel their vehicles. We made child care just $10 a day, saving families thousands of dollars a year. And we made admission to provincial parks free, ensuring every Manitoban can enjoy the outdoors without worrying about extra costs. These are not abstract measures, hon ourable Speaker. They are making a difference every single day.

A parent in For Richmond told me recently that the child-care savings alone have allowed her to go back to school for further training, some thing that would not have been possible otherwise. A senior in my constituency said the property tax credit meant she could stay in her family home more comfortably. These are the kinds of results Manitobans expect from their government. But, honour able Speaker, affordability is only part of the story. Helping kids reach their full potential is at the heart of our work.

Instead of cuts, freezes and layoffs under the previous PC govern ment, our NDP government is provi ding stable, re liable funding so that schools can plan responsibly without turning to education property tax increases year after year. We are proud to be creating a brighter future for all students by making sure they have the resources and supports they need to thrive. That means investing in the next genera tion of Manitobans, not taking resources away from them Honourable Speaker, I want to stress that our investments are not just about buildings and budgets.

They are about giving every child the opportunity to succeed. We have intro duced the uni versal nutrition program so that no child has to sit in class hungry. We added financial literacy courses in grade 9 to prepare students for life skills they will need. We have imple- mented cellphone restrictions to keep class rooms focused on learning. And we esta blished a teacher registry to increase accountability and ensure students' safety. Now, honour able Speaker, members opposite have raised concerns about edu cation property tax increases. But we must be clear why families are seeing these changes.

Under the previous government, funding for schools was frozen year after year. Divisions had no choice but to cut teachers, cut programs and reduce support for students, all while leaning more heavily on education property tax levies. And at the same time, the former gov ernment introduced the bill 64, which would have stripped away local voices in education by eliminating elected school boards. As a former school trustee, I know first-hand how critical those local voices are.

Trustees work directly with parents, educators and communities to make sure school tax dollars are spent responsibly and that education property taxpayers have real accountability. That is why the community pushed back hard, because bill 64 would

October 9, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2923 have taken away that accountability and silenced the very people paying school taxes to support their local schools. Our government's approach is more balanced and more responsible. We are providing targeted relief to homeowners, to seniors, to families, while ensuring that schools are funded properly. We are making sure that tax credits go where they are needed most, rather than flowing to those who already have the greatest advantages. And I respect that members opposite have raised this private member 's reso lution to bring forward concerns.

Accountability–sorry, affordability matters to everyone in this Chamber. But the solution cannot be just simply cut taxes without looking at the conse- quences for our children, our classrooms and our future. We have a duty to be honest about that balance. And our govern ment is building a fairer Manitoba, one where families can thrive without financial stress, where seniors can live with dignity and security and where every child, no matter where they live, has the chance to succeed in a strong public school system. That is the vision we are working toward, and I am proud to stand behind it.

Thank you, honourable Speaker. Mr. Doyle Piwniuk (Turtle Mountain): –passed by my colleague from–the MLA from Roblin. And it's an important issue. You know, I was an MLA since the– came in when I was opposition for two years, with the Selinger government being in government. And I was paying a moment here to give a history lesson to the many new MLAs that we had in the last election to say that, you know, back in the day during the Selinger govern ment, there was a lot of money was spent. We actually had the highest amount of money put into education per capita, but we had the worst results.

We had the worst results when it came to testing of our students. The NDP –the previous NDP govern ment failed our students. And I felt it myself –my own kid going into school system and not even being equipped to take grade 9 math. It was deplorable. We had to get tutors and it 's like, again, you know, I have a lot of farmers in my con stituency who pay a lot of educa- tional taxes from farmland. They are asset rich but cash poor. And the thing is, it only takes one year, a bad year of crop failure, that impacts that farming operation.

And what these farmers had put into their education system, they could be sending their kids –and no, they're not having four kids like they used to do at one point. They' re having 1.5 kids just like the rest of Canadians out there. And for the amount of educa tion taxes that each farmer or business owner have to pay if they had a big factory or big building that they got taxed on, that money–they could have sent their kids to private school, probably in Europe.

And so this is why this system where you have, you know, multiple generational families who live in homes in Winnipeg, they pay a certain amount for the educational taxes, but the whole system, it 's unfair.

And so, when we came into govern ment, we wanted to give benefits to a lot of –to our–to make it fair for both rural and urban, to make sure that, again, a company could be making millions and millions of dollars but not have any assets. * (11:10) It could all be done but when it comes to nowadays, you can do a lot of busi ness through the Internet and be able to create a massive company, but the fact is because they don 't have any physical property, they're not paying the fair taxes that, let 's say, a farmer who has all this property, who only gets so much revenue from each of the sections of land they operate, and so this was an unfair process.

Why is it that every other de partment is funded exactly from their–when it comes to the fair tax treat- ment of our income tax treatments? From the general opportunities, the more we grow the economy, the more taxes are generated for govern- ment to run office–when it comes to the services, like education. So this is why it 's so im portant for me to put some records on the record here.

But, now with this increase in, you know, when it comes to Manitobans paying more, once group of people that I'm going to see that are going to be paying more are seniors, seniors living in rental properties, seniors living–our low-income earners living in apart- ments, where apartment block owners, landlords, are now being impacted. I've seen in places in my constituency, they' re paying up to 17 per cent more into the property taxes when it comes to buildings. And now those seniors, that money, that tax increase, you have to be passed on to the seniors.

And the fact is it 's going to be an impact to a lot of our seniors that are just trying to

2924 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 make ends meet, low income earners that are trying to make ends meet. Yes, you know, low income earners that have their own house, if they have a house. Nowadays it's young–hard for young families to buy a house. My son was just trying to buy a house in Brandon. The value of houses are so expensive, even if he buys the house in Brandon, the property taxes are so much higher right now.

And the fact is the sustain- ability of this system that we have and actually the education increases that we're paying–$300 million in the next two years–that's going to be passed on to a lot of consumers when it comes to people having their own houses. We're seeing that also with, you know, this–we're seeing a shortage of doctors in this province.

And the fact is there is competition of doctors going to other jurisdictions, like Alberta and Saskatchewan, where their property taxes, their system is not the same system as our system when it comes to, you know, when it comes to fair agree ment of how they charge for property taxes. Education taxes are not the same as here in Manitoba. So a doctor now built –having a house, making over $200,000, are going to be taxed heavier and having to pay more taxes on property taxes for their size of their home that they're having now. What is the advantage? They would probably want to move to Saskatchewan or Alberta.

That is the impact that is going to be moving forward here. So it's really very, very disappointing that they're rolling back this rebate that we were giving, and eventually going into the same funding as we–how we provide for health care, how we provide for the justice system, how we provide for many other de partments out there. So, the fact is yes, in rural Manitoba our farmers are being heavily taxed. So this gives me an opportun- ity to pass on to any other members who want to debate, but I 'd like–I'm glad I was able to put these few words on the record.

The Acting Speaker (Rachelle Schott): Before recognizing the next member, a gentle reminder to everyone participating virtually, for the purposes of Hansard, it's recommended–strongly recommended– to use the headsets provided. Hon. Glen Simard (Minister of Municipal and Northern Relations): When our gov ernment was elected we made a promise: to build Manitoba where every person can live the good life. A good life means more than just getting by. It means having a fair shot, a decent home, a strong education system and a gov- ernment that has your back when costs go up and times get tough.

French spoken Et après sept ans et demi de hausses constantes et des coûts et des coupes imprudentes sous le dernier gouvernement, le Manitoba mérite une pause et – Translation And after seven and a half long years of rising costs and reckless cuts under the previous government, Manitobans deserve a break, and– English –and after seven and a half long years of rising costs and reckless cuts under the last government, Manitobans deserve a break. That's why we've introduced 25 new ways to save–real relief for real people.

We're raising the Homeowners Affordability Tax Credit to $1,600, helping Manitobans save even more on their school taxes. French spoken Nous avons gelé les tarifs d 'Hydro pendant une année entière, réduit la taxe sur l 'essence de 10 pour cent de façon permanente, et rendu l'entrée de tous les parcs provinciaux gratuite pour toute l'année, parce que les Manitobains ne devaient pas avoir à choisir entre payer leurs factures et créer des souvenirs avec leur famille.

Translation We froze hydro rates for an entire year, permanently reduced the gas tax by 10 per cent, and made admission to all provincial parks free for the entire year, because Manitobans should not have to choose between paying their bills and creating memories with their families. English We extended $10-a-day child care, expanded univer- sal birth control to include Plan B and we 're helping first-time homebuyers afford their mortgage because this government believes in helping working families build a future, not just the wealthiest few. Contrast that with what we saw from the PCs.

Their edu cation 'prapertytox'–property tax model wasn't built for working Manitobans, it was built for the most affluent property owners.

October 9, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2925 French spoken N'oublions pas : ils ont envoyé un million de dollars de chèques à des milliardaires hors province comme Cadillac Fairview. Translation Let's not forget, they sent a million dollars in cheques to out-of-province billionaires like Cadillac Fairview. English They mailed out a millions and millions dollars ' of worth of cheques to out -of-province billionaires like Cadillac Fairview. That's not fairness. That's not leadership. That's a govern ment that lost touch with the people it was supposed to serve.

French spoken Notre gouvernement croit que l'équité commence chez nous. Translation Our government believes that fairness begins at home. English Our government believes fairness starts at home. So we eliminated school taxes altogether for thousands of Manitoba households through our $1,500 Homeowners Affordability Tax Credit and we're increasing the credit again next year because– [interjection]–yes, no kidding, that 's great –because building the good life means making sure Manitobans can afford to stay in their homes, raise their kids and plan for tomorrow.

So let's talk about some thing even more impor - tant, the foundation of our province: public education. Friends, for seven and a half years, our public schools were under attack. French spoken Les enseignants a – ont dû faire plus avec moins. Translation Teachers had to do more with less. English Programs were stripped away, school boards were silenced. French spoken Et le projet de loi 64, ce projet de loi tristement célèbre, a tenté de supprimer totalement la voix démo- cratique des communautés scolaires locales.

Translation And bill 64, that infamous bill, attempted to completely silence the democratic voice of local school communities. English Bill 64–I think it was called the worst bill in the history of Manitoba–tried to take away the democratic voice of local school communities altogether. This proposed bill feels of–this proposed bill here feels like an attempt to silence demo cratically elected boards. Sounds familiar. PCs gutted public education funding so badly that some school divisions had to take out bank loans just to keep the lights on.

They fired educators, slashed nutrition programs and forced divisions like Brandon, Seven Oaks and Pembina Trails to make painful cuts. French spoken Les enfants ont perdu des enseignants, des bibliothécaires et du personnel de soutien qui les aidaient à apprendre et à s'intégrer. Nous croyons que l'investissement dans l' éducation publique est un investissement dans l'avenir de notre province. Translation Children lost teachers, librarians and support staff who helped them learn and integrate. We believe that investing in public education is an investment in the future of our province.

English We believe that investing in public edu cation is investing in the future of our province. So we're turn- ing the page. We 've increased operating funding for kindergarten to grade 12 public schools by 3.4 per cent. We added $39 million more for smaller class sizes, school nutrition and capital im provements. And we are building schools again, not closing them. French spoken En fait, notre gouvernement construit 11 nouvelles écoles à travers le Manitoba pour répondre aux besoins des communautés en croissance.

Translation In fact, our government is building 11 new schools across Manitoba to meet the needs of growing communities.

2926 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 English From Devonshire Park to West St. Paul, from Waverley to Steinbach, we are opening the doors of opportunity for every child in this province. I look to my own community of Brandon where– building two new schools. And let 's talk about Maryland Park School, just a five-minute walk from my home and the expansion they so des perately needed. For my colleagues in the House, here's a brief history lesson on Maryland Park School. * (11:20) The sad thing is, this school was budgeted and announced by a previous NDP government.

When in power, the PC government of the time first delayed its construction. Then as a cost -cutting exercise, or by a sheer misunderstanding of census data, or not being able to see the dev elopment of the com munity surrounding the proposed school or because their heads were buried in the sand, or because they didn' t speak with the school board of the day they were– The Acting Speaker (Rachelle Schott): Order. Order. Order.

The debate of the day on the resolution isn't about schools themselves, per se, but the funding and the funding from the govern ment, rather the school tax increases and the effect on property tax cost of living, et cetera. Thank you. Mr. Simard: Thank you very much for that. They were ghosts, is the line I was told. It was built too small on the–and full the day it opened. An Honourable Member: Relevance? Mr. Simard: It's 'revelance' to school funding and school boards being able to do what they need to do. A new industrial arts suite was built, tool apparatus was set up and has never been used.

The warranty's expired. But thankfully because of Nello Altomare and the current Minister of Education, new walls are up, the project is on

schedule and the classrooms will be ready next school year. Ask yourself this, would this have happened under a PC govern ment? No. So our educa tion plan doesn't stop at bricks and mortar. We're also investing in what happens inside the classroom. We're investing in hiring more teachers, more than 1,600 new edu - cators across Manitoba. An Honourable Member: School tax. Mr. Simard: Of course it 's school tax. How do you think you build schools? Like, it 's relevant; I 'm confused by that line of heckling. We're feeding kids, every kid through the uni versal school nutrition program.

No child in Manitoba should ever go to school hungry. French spoken Nous avons même adopté la loi Nello pour garantir qu' aucun futur gouvernement ne puisse supprimer ce programme. Translation We even passed the Nello 's Law to ensure that no future government could eliminate this program. English We've passed Nello 's Law to make sure that no future govern ment can take that program away by freezing school taxes and operating funding for school divisions. So let's be honest. After seven and a half years of neglect, we can't rebuild everything overnight.

We are rebuilding steadily, deliberately and with heart and with the funds to match. I was in Thompson yesterday. As members know, they lost a school to a devastating fire in the summer of 2024. The new school to be rebuilt is designed, going to tender and will be there to service that com - munity. I think it 's a perfect metaphor of what Manitoba went through with the PC govern ment: scorched earth cuts to education, years of freezes and hand-tying. Then they were kicked out of power and left a pile of rubble behind.

We are left to clean up the mess of a $2 -billion deficit and we are the ones rebuilding with our partners in school boards across the province. But it takes time and solid relationships. We replaced the PCs with chaos–their chaos with our stability. We 've replace their cuts with our care. And we've place their slogans with our solutions. French spoken Parce que les Manitoba nous n 'ont pas élus pour gérer le déclin, ils ont nous élus pour construire la bonne vie.

Translation Because Manitobans didn't elect us to manage decline, they elected us to build a good life and where working families finally, finally feel that the gov ernment is on their side again.

October 9, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2927 English Because Manitobans didn' t elect us to manage decline, they elected us to build a good life and where working families finally, finally feel that the gov ern- ment is on their side again. The Acting Speaker (Rachelle Schott): Before recognizing the next speaker, we need to em phasize that there is nothing in the resolu tion about school funding. This is a tax issue and about tax school –or, school tax increases and how it affects those property tax and cost of living. So jus t remind all members to stay relevant to the resolution.

MLA Bob Lagassé (Dawson Trail): Good morning. I'd like to begin–I would like to begin by expressing how grateful I am to be part of the team that exemplifies values of col laboration, mutual respect and genuine commitment to the people we serve. It 's both inspiring and encouraging to work alongside colleagues who not only listen to one another but – with open minds but actively seek out solutions for the challenges faced in our province through thoughtful dialogue and constructive debate and meaningful legislative action.

Today I want to take a moment to extend thanks to my colleague, the member of Roblin, for bringing forward this important resolution. By doing so, they're taking a principled stand on an issue that 's deeply impacting families, homeowners and com munities right across Manitoba. Their call for the provincial government to put an end to the burdensome tax increase, and more spe - cifically, to eliminate the school taxes from property assessments is both timely and necessary. This is more than just a conver sation about tax poli cy.

It 's about fairness, affordability and ensuring that people are not being taxed out of their homes. It's about standing up for everyday Manitobans who deserve a govern ment that prioritizes economic responsibilities and supports its citizens rather than placing them in additional hardships. I have been contacted by numer ous constituents, friends and neighbours, many of them deeply frustrated and frankly shocked by the dramatic increase on their property tax bills this year. For most, the common denominator is clear: a significant rise in the school tax portion.

These hard- working families, seniors that are on a fixed income and young homeowners are trying to build a future in Dawson Trail. They 're doing their best to keep up with the rising costs across the board: groceries, fuel, utilities, and now they're being hit with an unexpected tax hike that many simply cannot afford. It's becoming increasingly clear that this gov ern- ment approach to taxation placing an unfair burden upon ordinary Manitobans. The people of Dawson Trail are telling me loud and clear they cannot afford this government's decision any longer.

It's time for the leadership that –for a leadership that prioritizes affordability and listens to real financial struggles facing our communities. This NDP govern ment must take this resolution seriously, listen to the voices of Manitobans and support the call to eliminate education property taxes and school taxes. It 's time they put the needs of families, homeowners and communities first by provi- ding real and lasting relief from these growing financial burdens. It's time we all worked together to make life more affordable, not just for some, but everyone. Eliminate edu cation property taxes and school taxes.

Thank you. Hon. Lisa Naylor (Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure): I am really pleased to get to stand today and put a few words on the record regarding this private member's resolution. You know, school divisions have an enormous amount of catching up to do. Under the previous gov- ernment–I mean, I actually, even before I was an MLA, I saw the previous government literally cutting school boards off at the knees. Not only did they reduce provincial funding for student education, they also reduced the ability that school boards had to raise property taxes. They put a cap on that.

They made it almost impossible for school divisions to pay for very important needs for students. And that is why now school divisions are catching up; they' re playing catch-up after seven and a half years of cuts and freezes. And I think that when ratepayers are listening to debate on things like the property taxes that they pay that go to support school divisions, it 's really impor- tant that they also have a full under standing on what do their taxes pay for.

You know, I think it's important for the members opposite to have some clue about that, as well, because these are im portant conversa- tions that they could be having on the doorstep, and they clearly don't really understand. * (11:30)

2928 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 So I think it's important to know that, you know, I'll just speak primarily about Winnipeg School Division. That is the constituents that I represent; that is where these ratepayers live, and the school division that I'm personally most familiar with. Within Winnipeg School Division, the ratepayers' education property taxes have gone to many, many different supports over the years. Some examples over the last decade: crossing guards, First Nations elders in the school.

And as I make this list, I'd love members opposite to really stop and think, which of these services and programs would they like to see eliminated. I mean, they have–they did eliminate a lot of this. But–and also for listeners at home, which of these programs aren't important for your students, for your kids, your grandkids? Think about that: crossing guards, First Nation elders. What about the summer programs teaching English as a second language for newcomers in Winnipeg School Division? What about the mental h ealth supports that were being covered by ratepayer taxes?

And what about –I know, what about the autism clinical psychologist that was dedicated to support the autism spectrum diagnostic services team? That was one service that seriously was contemplated being cut at an earlier time because of the PCs' cap on taxes. What about costs related to day pro gramming charges for access to St. Amant, New Directions and Can Do People Inc., for students who have excep- tional needs? Many of those costs are covered through ratepayers. Additional early child hood inclusive needs support to address the growing specialized needs of children with autism spectrum disorder.

Sound field systems in schools, that was really impor tant to improve accessibility for students with low to mod- erate difficulty hearing. This is a system that amplifies teachers' voices and distributes it evenly throughout the classroom, but Winnipeg School Division couldn't look to the PC govern ment when they were cutting funding to schools; they had to look to ratepayers to cover that impor tant service for hearing impaired students. Enhanced access to Wi-Fi, which is used for a lot of education.

And full -day kindergarten, some thing that was delivering really important educational and– yes, educational support and literacy support to young students in Winnipeg School Division. But without the support of ratepayers paying taxes, that service would not be able to be delivered. Intercultural support workers, very, very important in a school division where 35 per cent of the population is newcomers. Library technical assist ance, division computer technicians, school resource officers at one time, but that program was also cut. Off-campus programs.

These are programs that work with older students who are struggling to be in the regular high school system. And the importance of these programs are –these are kids who might otherwise end up in the justice system or even homeless because of the challenges that they face. But these small, specialized off -campus programs help them to stay in school, to get an education, to graduate from school, and to have op portunities in the future. But so much of our off -campus programs are in f act funded through the support of ratepayers who pay property taxes.

Home learning assistance for early school years, therapy services, nursery programs, art performances and special events and programs, and the milk subsidy which has been part of the Winnipeg School Division for decades, as well as some of the salaries o f attendance officers. That's just a snapshot of some of the things that ratepayers pay for. And, you know, mostly when I go door to door in my constituency, what I hear is that there is enormous support for education in this province.

A lot of voters fully understand that a well-funded education system that creates well- educated students who can thrive, who can enter the workforce, who can be able to eventually become in- dependent, pay rent, be parti cipants in the economic development of this province–that is what we want for our students. You know, when I talk to seniors, they under - stand.

Maybe they don' t have children in school anymore; maybe they don' t even have grandchildren in school anymore, but they know that the health-care provider at their bedside or the attendant who may be pushing their wheelchair–they know that it is impor - tant for these folks to have an education. And that is why mostly they like to support the education system and understand why it is important. There was so much failure under the previous government; so much failure to support the education system, provincial funding did not keep pace with inflation.

So we know that multiple school divisions really struggled, and although I gave specifics f rom Winnipeg school divisions, there were so many other

October 9, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2929 challenges. Interlake School Division had to cut addictions support workers as well as full -time teaching positions, and Seine River was facing potential cuts dependant upon ongoing contract negotiations. The PCs proposed a funding model that made massive cuts to multiple school divisions. And we've– I'm sure those numbers are already read into the record, but we 're talking about millions –$11 million from Seven Oaks and $8.5 million from St. James - Assiniboia; $10 million from Louis Riel.

But, you know, it 's also Pembina Trails, the Interlake–$3 million from the Interlake; $2 million was proposed to be cut from Border land and yet the PCs, you know, not only cut their own funding, but they put a cap in place that did not allow school divisions to raise any income or very, very limited income through ratepayers. So at this point, school divisions have a lot of making up to do after chronic, chronic underfunding under the members opposite. Our govern ment's playing catch -up, school divisions are playing catch-up, to make sure that young Manitobans are getting the education that they deserve.

Instead of cuts and freezes and firings, we 're getting the necessary funding to schools so they can support children across the province. We are very proud to continue to build a bright future for all students in Manitoba. We have one of the most passionate, intelligent, skilled Education Ministers that this province has seen in many years, following on the heels of our former colleague w ho put his lifeblood into this de partment and believed wholeheartedly in the importance of educating chil - dren in this province. After years of PC cuts and neglect of education in Manitoba, we have been rebuilding.

But this can' t happen overnight. It's going to take years to complete that rebuilding. But in the meantime , we support school divisions, we understand that they have a lot of making up to do, that they are in the busi ness of supporting the most vul nerable and most impor tant people in society. And thank you, Honour able Speaker. I can see that my time is up. Mr. Diljeet Brar (Burrows): Thank you, honourable deputy Speaker, for the op portunity to debate this resolution on school tax and education property taxes.

But before that , I wanted to just take a moment to speak to those Manitobans who along with me are grieving the loss of the shining star of Punjabi music industry, Rajvir Jawanda. The news came yesterday. He was dealing with critical injuries after a road accident and I send my thoughts and prayers to all Manitobans who love him, connected to him, and he had a special connection with Manitoba. He supported our arts economy with his concerts and he also recorded a song written by a Manitoban, a Winnipegger, Mr.

Sukhwant Kingra. * (11:40) Rajvir was a young and handsome, creative turbaned celebrity who influenced so many young people to wear their turbans with pride. I take a moment to send my condol ences to Rajvir's family. Alvida Veeray, malak teinu charna wich nivas bakhshey. [Dear Brother, may the Creator grant your soul a place to live close to Him.] Back to the PMR. Honourable deputy Speaker, I don't claim to be a tax expert. I have never handled education files as a lead or as a critic in this Chamber, in this Legislature.

But with a few years of ex perience working in this Chamber, I've tried to understand a little bit of how it works. When I was sitting where my opposite team is sitting now, we used to go to rural Manitoba. We used to go to our constituents and talk about education property tax. It is an issue of concern, and people wanted to talk about it, people wanted to underst and it, people wanted to educate their elected represen - tatives about it. Is the current system perfect? No, I don't say it is. Can it be better? Yes, it can be better if we work together and improve it, with kind inten tions and positive outcomes.

Is it better than what it was in 2021, 2022, 2023? Of course it is. So this reso lution is requesting the Manitoba Legislative Assembly to eliminate school taxes. It doesn't say a few things that I hear, that I understand. For example, to me, it seems like it' s saying, hey, if you eliminate the property taxes 100 per cent, Mr. Pallister would save $14,000- plus for a single property that he and his family owns. It says that, hey, eliminate property taxes so that Cadillac Fairview can get $2-million-plus tax rebate. What we did –we are working on improving the system, what we did. We brought in a progressive tax

2930 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 policy to improve it, to send the money to the people who deserve to get that support. The people who get to be uplifted, the people who are struggling with their affordability issues. Me and my team were knocking doors this summer. We do every summer. And this summer, we knocked 200-plus doors. Nobody in my constituency complained about the NDP school tax policy. I didn't hear one.

Well, if Heather Stefanson lived in Burrows, she would complain, because if we eliminate 100 per cent of the school education property taxes, she would be able to use that big cheque to pay her fine. That's what this reso lution talks about. But because they' re not allowed to write that in the resolution, that's why they didn't. So PCs ' record–I remember 2019, they were putting those yellow -green stickers on their lawn signs, saying cut taxes, cut taxes as Pierre Poilievre said and lost his seat, the same way they were saying axe the tax kind of stuff. But I invite them to be careful here.

It's not a good road to follow. We have to have a plan to make things better. There has to be some studies. This team opposite to ours, they had this election promises to cut taxes. So did they eliminate the property tax? They did not. So what this reso lution is saying, hey, can you please do what we could not do and promised to do? How's that? Like, if that was a great policy, why didn' t you eliminate when you were in charge? You did not eliminate it. They did not eliminate it. I know they like me. So, the–NDP policy shows leadership; PC policy on education property tax is self-serving.

Just imagine somebody who is voting for a policy that brings home a bigger cheque to them. How is that fair? How is that fair? Leadership is: I'm ready to pay taxes more than I do today to make our schools better. That 's leader- ship. And many, many people in this Chamber stand by that approach. They stand by that approach. They want to make our school system better. Honourable deputy Speaker, I have worked in three continents and I have seen a bit of the world. I have seen various kinds of education systems. I have seen schools where there is no classroom. Teachers are teaching kids under a tree.

I have seen that. We should be thankful to each other. We should be thankful to Canada to be able to provide this wonderful public education system to our kids. I am thankful. I represent new Canadians from Philippines, from Pakistan, from Nepal, from Bangladesh, from India, Sri Lanka, Europe, all parts of the world–South America, Guyana. What attracts them to Canada is public education system, public health system. That's why they make Canada their new home. And we should work together to improve this education system, and progressive tax policies are one of the tools that we can use.

When PCs were in power, they got a few million dollars–I can 't remember the figure, though–to be invested in education. I invite them to ask themselves when they go back home tonight, look into the mirror: did they invest that money meant for educa tion, comma, in edu cation? Did they? If not, how they claim to be sincere about improving our public educa- tion system? They try to inter fere in the autonomy of our school divisions. I remember carrying fight bill 64 lawn signs door to door and people liked them. Thank you. Hon.

Malaya Marcelino (Minister of Labour and Immigration): It's my pleasure in the House to stand up today to debate this resolution. The Speaker in the Chair As the MLA for Notre Dame for six years now, I have done my best to regularly connect with my constituents directly. My children, when they see NDP flyers on our kitchen table like they did during the past election with the Premier's (Mr. Kinew) face on it, then the member for Fort Rouge, they asked me if the member for Fort Rouge is my boss, and I say no, he is my leader. But my boss is Kuya Xander, Ate Scarlett and other neighbours that they know.

And, in fact, I have over 20,000 bosses and I have to check in on them regularly because they are my bosses and they tell me what their priorities are, and my job is to go and work on them. * (11:50) And the com munities that make up Notre Dame have told me clearly that their priorities are cleanliness, safety and free recreational opportunities. And more recently, food security became my priority, so now we work directly with the community on that. And none of my constituents have ever raised with me the topic of today' s private members ' resolution

October 9, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2931 regarding the Province's role on school taxes or edu- cation property taxes. And that's because my constituents are among the many thousands of low-income households across the province for whom our NDP gov ernment has com - pletely eliminated school taxes altogether. Our $1,600 Homeowners Affordability Tax Credit is making it easier to afford to buy their first home or to pay their mortgage. And moreover, my constituents understood that it was the City that raised the property taxes by 5.95 per cent in 2025.

The City made changes through their property reassessment process, that had the direct effect of raising property tax costs, and that it was the Winnipeg School Division that raised its school board tax after seven and a half years of PC cuts to education and the PC failed bill 64. Winnipeg School Division approved a 5 per cent mill rate increase for its 2025-26 budget, leading to a projected 13.7 per cent total gross party –tax increase for homeowners, largely due to the City of Winnipeg property reassessment.

And our gov ernment knows that many families and individuals are hurting, and that 's why we are continuing to focus on affordability for Manitobans and to help offset or eliminate these WSD and City of Winnipeg increases. Again, our government has raised the amount for the Homeowners Affordability Tax Credit to $1,600. Again, this particular measure has eliminated school taxes altogether for many low-income households, for thousands of Manitobans across the province. This is making it easier to afford to buy that first home or to pay your monthly mortgage.

I regularly connect with my constituents on Fridays in our Notre Dame constituency office. We go door to door. Sometimes I can just do 10 houses, but I try to do that at least. We go to our schools, seniors' homes, child- care centres.

Through various engagements, such as: our Saturday monthly commu- nity clean -ups; en gagements through our volunteer food security donations; Mondays at Seafood City, the fresh produce donations; Tuesdays it 's Harris meats, fresh ground beef donations; and Thursdays it' s milk donations to 24 child- care centres in Notre Dame through the generosity of Walter and Maria Schroeder; as well as en gagements through the Notre Dame Powerline; we respond to illegal dumping and garbage concerns of con stituents as well as their concerns about suspected drug dealing properties.

I meet with my con stituents regularly, and not once has school tax and education property tax increases come up. Instead, my constituents ' top concerns are cleanliness, safety and free recreational opportunities. In 2024, our govern ment did an affordability – Homeowners Affordability Tax Credit to $1,500. And in 2026, we raised it –this credit to $1,600. And this focus on affordability is greatly appreciated by many Manitobans, including the permanent gas tax cut and additional gas tax cut relief that was done at the height of inflation. This helped my constituents.

So this PC reso lution is attempting to put blame on the Province for the recent City property tax increases and the rising cost due to City property reassessment processes and the school board tax in- creases, and that 's another underhanded but wholly expected move by the PCs. But under this Finance Minister, under our Premier (Mr. Kinew), a focus on affordability for all Manitobans has been greatly appreciated by my con- stituents, and all Manitobans.

Just yesterday at lunch, at the Beef Producers meeting, a rancher in the northern Interlake and the director of Beef Producers told all of us MLAs gathered–his name is Arvid Nottveit; he told me you can remember his name if you remember the words no vet, which is also his plea to get more big animal vets in rural Manitoba, which is also a priority for our gov- ernment. Arvid Nottveit thanked the Premier (Mr. Kinew) for the extension of the Crown lands rate freeze announcement, which will help many ranchers with their costs of production and rising cost of living.

Under the leadership of our Premier and our Agri- culture Minister, our gov ernment focused on afford - ability for beef producers by first putting a stop to the heartless PC sale of Crown lands and by lowering the pricing structure, by freezing Crown land rates and extending that Crown land rate freeze. Is that good? Can I stop now? Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. The Speaker: Order, please. When this matter is again before the House, the honourable Minister of Labour and Immigration (MLA Marcelino) will have four minutes remaining.

2932 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 9, 2025 DEBATE ON SECOND READINGS– PUBLIC BILLS (Continued) Bill 210–The Indigenous Veterans Day Act (Commemoration of Days, Weeks and Months Act Amended) The Speaker: The time being 11:55, in accordance with rule 24(7), I 'm interrupting proceedings to proceed with a deferred division that was requested during the last Tuesday of private members' business. Recorded Vote The Speaker: So this–now I will call for a recorded vote on Bill 210, The Indigenous Veterans Day Act (Commemoration of Days, Weeks and Months Act Amended). Call in the members.

I request the bells be shut off. The question before the House is second reading of Bill 210, The Indigenous Veterans Day Act (Com- memoration of Days, Weeks and Months Act Amended).

Division A RECORDED VOTE was taken, the result being as follows: Ayes Asagwara, Balcaen, Bereza, Blashko, Brar, Bushie, Byram, Cable, Chen, Compton, Cook, Corbett, Cross, Dela Cruz, Devgan, Ewasko, Fontaine, Guenter, Johnson, Kennedy, Khan, Kinew, King, Kostyshyn, Lagassé, Lamoureux, Lathlin, Loiselle, Maloway, Marcelino, Moroz, Moses, Moyes, Narth, Naylor, Nesbitt, Oxenham, Pankratz, Perchotte, Piwniuk, Robbins, Sandhu, Schmidt, Schott, Schuler, Simard, Smith, Stone, Wiebe, Wowchuk. Deputy Clerk (Mr. Tim Abbott): Ayes 50, Nays 0.

The Speaker: The motion is accordingly passed. * * * The Speaker: The hour being past 12 o' clock, this House is recessed and stands recessed until 1:30 this afternoon.

LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Thursday, October 9, 2025 CONTENTS Speaker's Statement Lindsey 2911 ORDERS OF THE DAY PRIVATE MEMBERS' BUSINESS Debate on Second Readings– Public Bills Bill 222–The Criminal Trespassers Act and Amendments to The Occupiers' Liability Act Pankratz 2911 Loiselle 2913 Kennedy 2915 Cable 2917 Moyes 2918 Cross 2920 Debate on Resolutions Res. 13–School Tax and Education Property Tax Increases Chen 2922 Piwniuk 2923 Simard 2924 Lagassé 2927 Naylor 2927 Brar 2929 Marcelino 2930 Debate on Second Readings– Public Bills (Continued) Bill 210–The Indigenous Veterans Day Act (Commemoration of Days, Weeks and Months Act Amended) 2932

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