LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Thursday, 15 May, 1986. Time - 8:00 p.m. THRONE SPEECH DEBATE MADAM SPEAKER, Hon. M. Philli ps: The Honourable Minister of Education has three minutes remaining. HON. J. STORIE: Thank you, Madam Speaker, I won't be taking the full three minutes but a small portion thereof. I would like to just conclude by saying that the challenges that remain in the field of education are limitless. There is no limit to the improvements that need to be made. We all want essentially the same thing, not only now but in the future - simply stated, the best possible education for our children.

Madam Speaker , the challenge is not only for myself. The challenge is for the teachers, the school boards, those involved in education throughout this province to come to grips with some of the legitimate problems that we face, not the least of which is the financial situation, the need to create the wealth, to fund the programs, to meet the needs of children in education. What is being done at the present time? I have talked about the need for a high school review. That is a process that's already been announced by the previous Minister and which will be followed through on.

As well, for the information of members, in the last two years, the Province of Manitoba has seen some $37 million allocated to construction and upgrading of our schools, a tremendous financial commitment. Madam Speaker, there is a set of initiatives that was announced by the Minister of Education some months back dealing with the quality education initiatives. Foremost amongst those and perhaps fundamental to them is the intention, the commitment to joint planning interorganizational consultation.

For the first time, we have the Manitoba Association of School Tr ustees, Manitoba Teachers Society, superintendents committed in a very public way to consulting, to beginning the dialogue for improving education in Manitoba. Madam Speaker , I have already seen the fruits of some of that labour, and I can tell you that it's impressive. it's impressive in its frankness. lt is impressive In its joint understanding of some of the mutual problems that we share, and it's enlightening and encouraging in its desire to meet those problems in a cooperative way.

Madam Speak er, the cooperation that is going to be required to solve those fundamental problems is something that this government has always favoured, something that this government has always believed in. Consultation and cooperation is going to help us resolve those fundamental problems. As Minister of Education, I have already met with some of the key groups representing interests in education in the province: the Manitoba Teachers Socie ty, the superintendents, the presidents of the universities, the School Trustees Association, and many others.

Madam Speaker, there is only one way to solve 145 them, collectively and with a little bit of understanding of the special circumstances, the special needs that we all have. While those needs are different, they are nonetheless important and they will be met. MADAM SPEAKER : The Honourable Member for Virden. MR. G. FINDLAY: Thank you, Madam Speaker. lt is indeed an honour for me to rise in this House to give my first speech, and I thank everybody for the reception here.

I am indeed privileged to serve the residents of Virden constituency and I thank them very much for the honour of being able to represent them. lt is not only a humbling experience to be sitting in my first Session of the Manitoba Legislative Assemb ly, but also humbling to be following in the footsteps of Mr. Harry Graham, a man who served the Birtle-Russell and subsequently the Virden area for some 17 years; a man, Madam Speaker, who had the opportunity and the privilege to sit in your seat for a period of four years in the Sterling Lyon administration.

I believe one of the greatest testimonials an elected official can have is to have gone through his entire political career without losing an election. I might also remind the members of this House that because of boundary distribution, I am also following, in the southern end of my constitu ency, in the footsteps of Mr. Morris McGregor who served the Virden area for some 20 years, and he also had a very enviable record in terms of winning all his elections.

I know that both Harry and Morris have many fond memories of their Sessions in this House, and I wish them both good health and happiness in their retirement years. Virden is very definitely a rural riding, some 17 ,000 people. it's a healthy agricultural economy. lt has both economic stability and moral stability. As you travel through the constituency, one of the things that will strike you as you go is the number of yellow signs on the end of farm gates, century farm signs, a program initiated by the Minister of Agriculture in the Sterling Lyon era, Mr. Jim Downey.

I mention this because you see a lot of them around and the people who have them are very proud of them. I personally have one at the end of my gate because my great-grandfather homesteaded my farm in 18 79, which makes me the fourth generation and my son there now the fifth generation. it's something that I am personally very proud of. Virden constituency consists of a lot of commu nities. We have one large town - Virden - in the southern end, 3,000 people; we have three smaller villages, 800 to 1, 000 people - Hamiota, Shoal Lake, Birtle; two other villages around 500 - St.

Lazare and Elkhorn; and eight smaller centres - Strathclair, Oakburn, Elphinstone, Foxwarren, Miniota, Kola, Kenton, McAuley; and numerous other localities, about 10 or 12 in number, that are centres of social activity at various times of the year. So that gives me about 25 different

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 communities in that constituency , some more important than others at different times of the year. Within the boundaries of Virden constituency we have nine munic ipalities ; in other words , nine R.M. counc ils. We have six town or village councils. So that gives me 15 jurisdictions in the municipal area. I consider these people that are elected to municipal posit ions a very responsible group of people whom I hope to keep very good contac t with .

Within the constituency we have three school divisions : Fort La Bosse in the southern end , Birdtail in the northern end, and right in the very northeast corner, we have a portion of Pelly Trail School Division - again, another group of responsible elected officials carrying out their duties in my constituency . Another important element in the constitu ency are the hospitals. We have four of them in Virden, Hamiota, Shoal Lake and Birtle. We have elderly persons ' housing units in six towns : Virden, Elkhorn, Birtle, Shoal Lake, Strath, Hamiota . I'd like to make special comment on Hamiota .

If anybody wants to see a very excellent hospital, elderly persons' housing unit in rural Manitoba, I recommend that they visit Hamiota, and I'm sure the residents there someday are going to give a very big tribute to Dr. Ed Hudson and all the people that worked with him to make that complex possible. The occupations in my riding, predominantly farming, 47 percent of the families live on farms , but there are a lot of small businesses in my area that supply goods and services to the farm community .

We have hospi tals and elderly persons' housing units, schools, many professional occupations, the construction trades are there . We have in the southern end the oil drilling and extraction industry. Based on the 1981 census, the average family income in Virden constituency is less than $20,000 .00. With farming being the main industry , when the farm incomes are rolling along good, the constituency prospers; when farm incomes are low, like they are now , there is a general economic slowdown and the unemployment , especially of our younger people, tends to increase.

I have a number of constituency concerns I want to address here this evening . I will list them first and then talk about some of the more important ones individually .

Certainly the first one is maintaining adequate farm incomes; secondly, maintaining our schools; thirdly , maintaining our hospitals and our medical services ; fourthly, maintaining and expanding our elderly person s' housing units; fifthly, maintaining and building our highways ; sixthly, maintaining and developing industry; and seventh , certainly maintaining all the jobs possible ; eighth, the quality of life is also important, therefore we need recreation, arts and culture centres. Last, but not least, the people of Virden riding want to maintain strong law and order.

Personally, my prime reason for entering the political life was to work for the economic improvement of the agricultural industry. The economic downturn of the agriculture of the economy in the western part of the province started in 1979 with a drought ; 1980 we had another drought; 1982 we had early frost; 1983 and 1984 we had two more droughts of moderate degrees . In 1985, we had a very wet harvest ; in 1986, here we are with a wet spring .

We always seem to have som e climatic problems to interfere with normal production. 146 Also during this time , the farm community has been hit by falling commodity prices, high interest rates especially in the 1981-84 period and rising fuel costs . As I travelled the constituency durin g my nomination period and in the election campaign , it was pers onally very depressing to continually hear stories of economic hardship . T he theme was very consistent .

In order to keep their operation s going , most were cutting back on expenditures , allowing their machinery to get older and older, spending less on personal living , having loans, falling into arrears , having difficulty getting their son started in farming , watching their equity continually erode . Last but not least, the financial stress in som e cases was leading to family and marital stress . What are the solutions? We are an exportin g nation , exporting about 80 percent of our wheat we grow.

The agricultural trade war between the United States and the European communi ty has seriously lowered the export price of wheat and ot her grains . These countrie s have been subsidizing their farmers through th is tra de war period. The farmers of Canada and Manitoba will not survive without some form of consumer support. Consumers have benefited tremendous ly from a cheap food policy in Canada for many years. Canadians and certainly Manitobans only spend about 15 percent of their disposable income on fo od. Only the residents of the United States spend less.

The consumer now must protect their food producer, the farmer, th rough this period of economic crisis . If we don't , that is if we allow the export grain industry to collapse , jobs of 15 to 20 percent of the labour force in Manitoba and Canada in general will certainly be in jeopardy.

The Federal Government has recently acted with announcements to remove the federal and excise tax from fuel, to freeze freight rates , to increase the price of domestically consumed wheat to get the Western Grain Stabilization payments into farmers' hands as quickly as possible and to convene a meeting on June 2, of the five major exporting nations, the U.S.A. European community , Australia , Argentina and Canada, where our important trade issues will certainly be discussed. The Provincial Governments of Saskatchewan and Alberta have each acted to reduce input costs of their farmers.

They've acted by putting in fuel rebates; they've brought in lower interest loans and many other measures. The Manitoba Government must now elevate the agriculture industry to a posi tion of high priority. In the Throne Speech there was mention of Farm Aid , Farm Start, funds for rural development, Fam ily Farm Protection Act and amendments to the MACC . To date , we have no details of these programs, no indication that there are meaningful support programs going to appear . Must I remind the members across the House there is a crisis here and we must have action and we must have it soon?

I very sincerely urge the Premier , the Minister of Agriculture and the Minister of Finance to put together meaningful programs for the agriculture industry of Manitoba and announce it very, very soon . Do not ever forget that the economic support of farmers will also give considerable support to the rural and urban communities of the Province of Manitoba . It maintains small business; it gives job secu rity and it will add to the overall economic prosperity of this provinc e.

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 Let me offer some suggestions for very serious consideration. The Operating Loan Program that the Saskatchewan Government put in place - $25 a cultivated acre, of money at 6 percent, has certainly been well received in that province and, with a riding that borders on Saskatchewan , many farmers have been saying, if they can get it, why not us? 1t certainly puts our farmers in the western part of this province at a considerable competitive disadvantage because we don't have those sorts of funds for operating available to us.

Our election promises were brought forward because we'd had discussions with farmers, task force meetings and whatnot, and we mentioned reducing education taxes on farmland, give the purple fuel rebate directly to the farmers and increase the MACC loan ceiling for the Young Farmer Interest Rebate Program to $10 0,000 from $50,000.00.

In the Throne Speech it says: "Strong rural communities and secure family farms are essential." I agree wholeheartedly with that statement, but where is there any evidence of action to reduce the input costs for our 10,000 to 15,000 full-time farmers who are caught in this incredible cost-price squeeze? Now I'd like to spend some time looking at some other issues in the agricultural area that affect constituents in Virden. First, I would like to mention some marketing board concerns.

The present policy to disallow the transfer of partial milk quotas is having a serious negative affect on the dairy industry. lt is very difficult for a family farmer to slowly expand his dairy herd to incorporate a son coming back to the farm. lt is also very difficult for a farmer who is reaching the age of retirement to scale down his herd. He can't just sell a few. He's got to sell the whole thing and get out - bang! - right there.

The Poultry Marketing Board policies of reducing the number of laying hens and the number of broilers that non-quota holders can have has seriously affected the ability of small, mixed family-farm operations to earn an adequate living. When the Manitoba Hog Plan was initiated, it was supposed to be actuarily sound. Therefore, many conscientious hog producers did not enter the plan on the basis that, if I receive the money, I'll have to pay it back some day. But what has happened?

Come July 1, when the province enters the tripartite plan, those farmers in the plan no longer have any liability to pay their money back. In effect, they have received a grant. Those conscientious farmers outside of the plan received nothing. Where is the fairness? The Manitoba Farmlands Ownership Act severely restricts the people who can purchase land. This certainly has reduced land values. lt is robbing the retiring farmer of his retirement policy. For the farmer with financial difficulties, he cannot sell a portion of his land to the highest bidder unless he lives within the boundaries of Manitoba.

This government can subsidize the sale of Flyer Industries to a foreign company , but Manitoba farmers cannot sell their land to the highest bidder if he lives outside the province. The three-year clause requiring credit institutions to sell land they hold could cause a serious decline in land values starting in September 1987, when the Act will start to force farmland on to the market. If it is not changed in this Session, there could be serious 147 repercussions regarding the value of farmers' assets starting in September '87 and beyond. Some of these concerns I have just raised make my constituents wonder.

Are we living in a democracy where the right to choose is protected, or are we in Manitoba now living in a highly restricted society where state control is replacing the right to choose? I'd like to make a few comments on the free-trade issue. We must always be in a position to negotiate trade agreements with our major trading partner. The countervailing duty on hogs last summer was a clear indication of what can happen if we do not sit down and discuss trade agreements with our most important trading partner. The impact of such duties is very serious for Manitoba.

Only through progressive discussions can we ever be in a position to keep our trade avenues open. The Manitoba Beef Commission: the recent survey questionnaire that was filled out by people attending Manitoba Beef Commission meetings had a question on it: should the Manitoba Beef Plan be expanded to include a feedlot program? The answers were: 62 percent said yes; 20 percent said no. There is a clear indication there that the cattle producers of Manitoba want a feedlot program. Now it is imperative on the government to act and put this program in place.

I have just mentioned some areas of concern to Virden constituents. The Minister of Agriculture has accepted the responsibilities of his office, and the Throne Speech states that secure family farms are essential. Now we have to have some action to make those words come true. In the area of schools, there is serious concern that the province is reducing its educational funding for rural school divisions and thereby putting more undue pressure on municipal governments to collect more education taxes via the Special Levy.

The rural councils in the Virden riding are very unhappy with the sharp rise in the Special Levy, and I call on the new Minister of Education to correct this inequity in the funding program. In hospitals and medical services - as I mentioned earlie r, we have four hospitals - some concerns that have been raised to me are that too many beds in our hospitals are being used as personal care beds. There is also a belief that more minor surgery should be done in these rural hospitals.

If this was done, it would reduce the congestion at places like the Brandon Hospital, and it would keep people closer to their homes and relatives during periods of hospitalization. Another area of serious concern in some hospitals, and maybe in some hospitals more outside my riding, is the ability to keep doctors in the rural hospitals. lt is always a battle, and I request the Minister of Health to work to keep doctors in the hospitals and address these other concerns in the area of health care.

In the area of highways, there is certainly a general feeling that there has been insufficient highway development and improvement over the last five years. Road restrictions that are on right now and come on every spring, they are a very serious impediment to nor mal business in rural communities. Villages in the Virden constituency that are not on No. 1 or No. 16 highway have an awful lot of difficulty moving freight in and out. Farmers have difficulty moving grain to market because quotas tend to come on at this time.

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 They have difficulty getting fertilizer to their farms, and other heavy pieces of machinery. Farmers and truckers are forced off the restricted provincial roads and they drive on municipal roads , and the councils are now out there starting to talk more and more about having to do the same with their roads, put restrictions on and keep the heavy traffic off. Where do we travel? Where do we carry out our commerce? What happens is that, when the municipal roads are driven on , there is always a certain degree of degradation of them and the local taxpayer has to pay the upkeep .

The local taxpayer doesn't mind paying upkeep on roads when local people are using them but when commercial trucks are coming off the provincial roads and using the municipal roads , they feel it is an unfair burden to have to fix the roads for the whole Province of Manitoba. I request the Minister of Highways to address these concerns of my constituents . Resource development: the oil industry is very important for the Town of Virden and the southwest portion of the Virden constituency .

Due to surface rights problems, there has been and continues to be a serious lack of harmony between some landowners and some oil companies . The Surface Rights Act was supposed to address these problems. For numerous reasons , the administration of the act has not been to the satisfaction of many landowners . Some of the concerns the constituents raise, they are unhappy with the fact that the administra tive offices have been moved from Virden to Winnipeg. There is a certain inconvenience for them any time they want to receive any information from this office.

They claim that there is a lack of regulations for guiding the board in decision making . There is a lack of consistency in board-awarded settlemen ts. They have concerns about site abandonment when wells stop producing . Most recently, a request by Chevron to have sites every 20 acres on farmers' land is going to seriously affect farm operations. At presen t, there are sites every 40 acres and now they want to have them every 20 acres. Anybody who has operate d a farm knows what it means to have a well and a road to every 20-acre site .

I request the Minister of Municipal Affairs and the Min ister of Agriculture to address these concerns of my constituents. Oil and agriculture are both valuable industries in my constituency . They should and must be able to operate in harmony. There must be a way. Jobs: if the economic problems of the agriculture industry are addressed; if adequa te funding is there for schools, hospitals, the elderly persons' housing units and highways; if incentives are put in place to allow industry and business to develop, grow and expand , then there will be lots of jobs in Virden constituency and elsewhere.

Madam Speaker, in my address to you today, I have briefly described Virden constituency and some of its prime concerns. I have been given a firm mandate to represent the Virden constituency in the Manitoba Legislature. I pledge to work sincerely for all my constituents and am more than willing to sit down with the Ministers on the other side of the House to address the questions I have raised today, and work together to find solutions.

For the economy of Manitob a to prosper in the coming years, it is imperative that the Ministers and this government act on the issues that affect the economic prosperity of Manitoba . 148 I thank you for the opportunity to speak to you this evening . NON-POLITICAL STATEMENT MADAM SPEAKER: The Honourable Member for Kildonan . MR. M. DOLIN: Madam Speaker, I would like to request leave of the House to make a non-political statement. MADAM SPEAKER: Leave has been requested. Is it the will of the House to grant leave to the honourable memb er to make a non-political statement? (Agreed) MR. M. DOLIN: Thank you.

On behalf of myself and my neighbour and colleague, the Honourable Ministe r and Honourable Membe r for Seven Oaks, I would like to offer congratulations on the 25th anniversary being celebrated tonight by Garden City Collegiate. I would also like to offer congratulations to the Maples Freshmen Socce r Team for hav ing won the championship this evening in the Kildonan Collegiate Athletic Association Conference and offer my condolences to River East. The Maples Freshmen Soccer Team is coached by Marcello Barraza and Benjam in Dolin. Thank you . THRONE SPEECH DEBATE (cont'

d) MADAM SPEAKER: The Honourable Minister of Labour. HON. A. MACKLING: Thank you very much, Madam Speaker . It is a pleasure for me to return to this House and to find you , Madam Speaker , now comfortably ensconced in the Speaker's Chair and I want to assure you that this member will give you every cooperation and certainly wishes you every success in your new role. Madam Speake r, it is an honour and privilege for me to represent the constituency of St. James . The last election was not the easiest one that I have entertained, but I have been a candidate on many occasions and a win is a win.

Madam Speaker, I want to acknowledge my appreciat ion for the comments of the Mover and Seco nder of the Speech from the Throne . I have had an oppor tunity now to spend just slightly over eight years in this Chamber and I say with sincerity, the speeches of the Mover and Seconder were second to none that I have heard in this Chamber - (Interjection) - Madam Speaker, methinks the opposition members are feisty th is evening.

I won't spend a great deal of time, Madam Speaker , on the observations made thus far on our Thron e Speech by members oppo site - (Interjection) - One of the members says, because I haven't found anything. That's precisely the reason, Madam Speaker, I haven 't found much to comment on in their speeches . I must make one excep tion from that general critique and that is the Honourable Membe r for Lakeside , whom I felt delivered of himself what I consider to be one of the best speeches thus far in this Chamber .

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 MADAM SPEAKER: The Member for Lakeside on a point of order. MR. H. ENNS: Madam Speaker, I may require your assistance. I don't know precisely what my point of order is but intuitively I know that, if a socialist congratulates me, I have a point of order. HON. A. MACKLING: Madam Speaker, the honourable member will get my point shortly. The Member for Lakeside did make a good speech, that is, he presented a lot of statements that were well put together, well fashioned and created to present an image, a history of an attractive past for the Progressive Conservative Party of Manitoba.

Madam Speak er, that past is not all black. 1 must admit with the Honourable for Lakeside that there was good; no one in this society and no government is all bad. But when the Honourable Member for Lakeside paints a picture with words - and he is quite eloquent - he presents the picture as if everything they did was right.

When he talked, for example, and I'm only going to take one example, Madam Speaker - I could spend all of my speech dissecting the skill of the Honourable Member for Lakeside in painting word pictures that seemingly portray justice and fairness and rightness on the part of a Conservative Government in Manitoba - but let me just take one part of the honourable member's speech and dissect it for just a few moments. He said at Page 80 of Hansard, May 13, "We had the approach and we knew that those kind of developments had its costs. " He is referring to Hydro.

"We knew that there were social costs involved, " well, he was a latecomer to that realization, ". . . that there was disruption of communities. When you flood land you do some damage, but then the NDP viciously attacked that program and, Madam Speaker, made a promise to the people of Manitoba that if elected they would not flood South Indian Lake; that's what Mr. Schreyer said; that's what Mr. Gonick said; that's what the New Democrats said.

Of course, Madam Speaker, that, among other reasons they got elected and then they flooded South Indian Lake a few years later but only after finding the most expensive way of doing it." Madam Speaker, the honourable member knows that is false. He knows that during the course of the years 19 69-1 973 the difficult decision was made in respect to the development of Hydro in the North. He knows that under his direction a Conservative Government was going to flood South Indian Lake not with six inches of water, not with several feet of water, but 30-some­ odd feet of water eliminating two communities.

That isn't what, Madam Spea ker, a New Democratic Government did. They looked at the problems there, looked at the engineering statistics and, because of the regulation of Lake Winnipeg, they were able to maintain those hydrological benefits with a minimum elevation of South Indian Lake. Sure, with some disruption, with environmental damage, but the honourable member would have flooded the communities in Northern Manitoba - (Interjection) - off the map, that's right. Now the honourable member says oh, come on.

The honourable member does not present a picture of fact, Madam Speak er, now the honourable member wants to ... 149 MR. H. ENNS: Madam Speaker, I now rise on a point of order. Madam Speaker, it's not permitted for the member to put misinformation on the record. The truth of the matter is that he is quite correct. The Conservative plan for flooding South Indian Lake called for higher flooding ... MADAM SPEAKER: Order please, order please. it's not correct to use a point of order to dispute the accuracy of facts stated in debate. I believe the Honourable Member for Lakeside does not have a point of order. MR. H.

ENNS: Madam Speaker, the Minister just made the statement that the Conservative plan would have flooded out all Northern communities. We would have flooded out the non-existing . . . MADAM SPEAKER: Order please, order please. Order please! The Member for Lakeside does not have a point of order . A dispute over the facts is not a point of order. The Honourable Minister of Labour. HON. A. MACKLING: Madam Speak er, earlier I said I thought the Honourable Member for Lakeside would get the point. Obviously he's rather discomfited with the truth and that does trouble him.

I regret that he feels so uncomfortable with the truth, but that is the truth, Madam Speaker. Madam Spea ker, the Honourable Member for Lakeside also waxed a little eloquent talking about conditions in other parts of the world. He mentioned Chile. I guess they're very proud of Mr. Pinochet's administration in Chile. Just the other day, Madam Speaker, I had the opportunity to shop in one of the local supermarkets and I bought some bananas and I always look at the labels. The label said Guatemala.

For years, in this country, in this city one can buy bananas almost as cheap, in many instances cheaper, than you can buy turnips or broccoli or carrots, Madam Speake r. Why should that be, a slow-growing fruit that is transported thousands of miles selling in our supermarkets cheaper than produce produced in this country? Why, Madam Speaker?

Well, Madam Speaker, the Honourable Member for Lakeside and others over there should take a little time to understand what's happened in Latin American countries, take a little time to read and understand the overreach of multinational corporations that have taken control of the destinies of small countries in Latin America like Guatemala. They've heard the slogan "Banana Republic. " They don't know what it means, but the people of Guatemala know what it means, Madam Speaker.

The people of Guatemala elected democratically a government that was striving to produce for those people in Guatemala a better standard of living, democratically elected government. They were faced with the fact that multinational corporations headquartered in the United States of America controlled much of their land mass and were producing specialized crops, bananas, for export. The people in that country needed food for their consumption and their government sought to gain more control of their land, a democratically elected government.

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 What happened, Madam Spea ker? The United Fruit Company, the owner of much of the land in Guatemala complained to the American Government, and the American Government sent in the Marines. A dictatorial government is in Guatemala, to this day suppressing a democratically elected government . A dictatorial government rests in Chile today suppressing a dictatorial (sic) government. The CIA has open ly admitted its complicity in Chile , yet the Honourable Member for Lakeside says we have great faith that Chile will become a democracy one day.

Madam Speaker , I don't want to waste the time of honourable members on this side of the House with the kind of negative thinking that gives rise to my response this evening for a few moments to some of the eloquent words from the Member for Lakeside. He is an actor, Madam Speaker , an eloquent actor, but one who should know better about the facts in South America and Latin America . He should know bette r and tell of the fact in South Indian Lake . . . - (Interjection) - Madam Speaker , this evening I want to take a few moments to talk about labour relat ions .

As Minister of Labour , I am privileged to represent this government as Minister of Labour. In the last Session, we introduced some legislative reforms . They weren't radical , revolutionary . They were introduced after a study of labour relations provisions across this country . We saw what labour relations provisions were working in Ontario , and British Columbia, and Alberta, and Saskatchewan, and Quebec . We took the best of those and incorporated them in a legislative packag e to improve labour relations in this province, but what kind of a response did we have from the Opposit ion opposite?

They decried those changes . The Honourabl e Leader of the Opposition hopefully will read my remarks. I want to give him some constructive advice. The fact that he and his party lost an election on March 18 is in no small measure the result of the vicious anti-labour statements that he and colleagues made in this province. They talked, Madam Speaker , about elimina ting successor rights . Did they know what they were talking about? I hardly think so.

Successor rights in labour legislation that had existed through the tenure of a government under Sterling Lyon, but the Honourable Leader of the Opposition was going to wipe out successor rights . What kind of a message do you think he gave organized labour in Manitoba and in Canad a? Madam Speaker, I have a number of quotations from the Honourable Leader of the Opposition , all negative , to organized workers in this province .

On March 11, 1985 , Page 34 of Hansard he said: "Yet this administration, in the last two years, chose to bring in one-sided amendments to the labou r legislation and had some very negative provisions, not contained in similar legislation anywhere else in this country. " Where, Madam Speaker? He didn 't say. What were they? He didn't say. But that's the kind of message he was sending out to workers in Manitoba . We have had in this province one of the best labour relation s environments in the whole of this country - (Interjection) - honourable members catcall, they deride, but these are fact, Madam Speaker.

We live in an era when there is a growing realization - hopefu lly there will be a growing realization opposite - that 150 workers have a right to organize; workers have a right to be represented by a trade union of their choice; workers have a right to bargain collectively and to attain fairer rewards for the toil that they contribute to the productivity of the land . Madam Speaker , we live in an age - tha nk God we live in an age - where more and more people speak out and are counted in defence of human rights and the rights of workers .

I refer to the Interna tio nal Labou r Office in Geneva 's report of the statement of the bishops of the United States , the Catholic bishops, a marvellous statement in all respe cts, but I read a

section dealing with labour laws, and I quote, Madam Speaker, Page 24 of this document. SOME HONOURABLE MEMBERS: Oh, oh! HON. A. MACKLIN G: Well , Madam Speaker , if honourable members wish to chatter and do not wish to listen , I'm sure the lounge will accommodate them. "Labour laws should be reformed to give greater sub stance to the right to organ ize." Listen to that , Mad.am Speaker , ". . . greater substance to the right to organize to prevent intimidation of workers and to provide remedies in a more timely manner for unfair labour practices .

Unions should be entitled to strike in situations where this is the only means of pursuing justice for the workers . No one should be able to deny the right to organize for purposes of collective bargaining or coercibly suppress unions without attacking human dignity itself. Organized efforts to break existing unions or to prevent workers from organizing through intimi dation and threat must be resisted.

New forms of partnership between workers and managers such as cooperative ownership and employee participation in ownership and management should be initiated and the scope for harmonious labour relations should be broadened." Madam Speaker, a magn ificent statement by caring, concerned people in America . I would that more of that thinking could penetrate the minds opposite so that they could appreciate the rights of workers in Manitoba, but the rights of workers anywhere cannot be taken for granted .

Recently the United Auto Workers reported and filed a complaint with the organiz ation of Economic Co­ operation and Developme nt in respect to the ope rations of a multinational corporation now that has set up operations in the United States, a very familiar Japanese firm, Kawasaki. The United Auto Workers charges that Kawasaki have " ... breached the OECD Guidel ines numbers 1, 3, 6, 7 and 8. Respectively, these provisions state that multinationals should respect the right of their employees to be repre sented by trade unions. " Then it goes on, Madam Speaker. I won't read all of those provisions.

" The alleged violations by Kawaski date back to 1978, when the United Auto Workers announced that the Lincoln plant workers had asked to be represented by the union ." Madam Speaker, I'm sure the honourable members want to know and appreciate that the workers asked to be represented by the union. MADAM SPEAKER: Order please. Could I remind all memb ers of Rule 44(1), "No member shall engage in

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 private conversation in such a manner as to interrupt the Business of the House. " I would hope that the honourable members would give the same respect to the member who is speaking as they expect when they have their turn to debate on this issue. The Honourable Minister of Labour. HON. A. MACKLING: Thank you, Madam Speaker . The workers had asked to be represented by the union. "Kawasaki immediately sought the services of a union­ busting legal firm, Tate, Bruckner, Alaniz and Sykes, which advised the company over the entire period in which the alleged violations occurred.

"Prior to the first election organized by the National Labour Relations Board in June 1978, Kawasaki threatened its employees that it would close the plant or move its operations back to Japan or to other foreign plants if they voted in favour of a union. Since that time, such threats have remained the dominant theme in the company's anti-union campaign.

This campaign has been mounted despite the fact that Kawasaki apparently maintains satisfactory industrial relationships with trade unions in Japan." I cite that example of the problem of organized labour in North America to underline my concern, Madam Spea ker, about the effect of the multinational corporation on our society. Madam Speaker , there's another form of changing attack on workers' rights and trade unions.

There's the growing development of what was developed way back when, in the beginnings of the industrial age, cottage industry, where industry farms out to individual workers piecework to be done in their homes. I want to quote an

article from World Labour Report on this question, the "putting-out system," it's called. "There is a large workforce of women, men and children making products in their homes for outside markets. These workers are seldom organised, nor are conditions of work regulated. Where such workers are dependent on contractors working under the putting-out system for materials and markets, their employment conditions must be a subject of concern. "For example, rural women rolling beedies (cheap cigarettes) and crochetting lace in India, working a full day, receive a small fraction of the minimum wage.

Yet the industry's exports and its profits are flourishing. "Not only traditional items but modern products as well, such as electronics, are produced under this system. Women work in their homes (in villages or urban slums) assembling radio components and Western garments. They are integrated into the export trade and into the world economy without any company or state benefits. Children, especially girls, are kept at home to work, adding a meagre but important supplement to family income.

"The idyllic image of independent women working at home, in control of their time and labour, is far from the reality, where the contractor and his employer control the regularity and remuneration of labour, and the worker is virtually without a choice.

Sometimes workers' organisations have been formed and wage or piece rates raised, but more often attempts at organisation have led to a loss of even this unsatisfactory work, since other needy households can 151 be found to take it on, in the next village, city or country." Madam Speaker, I cite that to indicate the pervasiveness of multinational corporations to find ways to profit from cheap labour. Madam Speaker, recently I had an opportunity to see an advertisement that was published by the United Auto Workers of Canada.

They advertised this news item to bring to the attention of Canadians the plight of workers elsewhere, and I want to comment on the need for publications of this kind. The

article reads: "At $1. 72 an Hour, This Korean Autoworker Can't Afford to Buy the Car He Builds. So GM Plans to Sell lt Here. " I want to quote from this

article which is very instructive, Madam Speaker. "In South Korea, they pay workers $1.72 an hour, and send them to jail if they protest. "That means autoworkers get less than one-tenth of U.S. auto wages and benefits. Last year when they struck for better pay at the Daewoo Company, six union leaders were jailed for up to two years. "That's not all. Daewoo workers put in six-day weeks without overtime pay in 'unheated and dimly lit sourroundi ngs.' They get one 20-minute break.

And no Daewoo workers get more than three days' vacation." - and the quote comes - " 'People who want too much vacation are lazy,' explains Kim Woo-Choong, the Daewoo chairman who 'maintains unquestioned rule over the conglomerate's 85 ,000 employees. ' " That's a quotation from Business Week - it's not a socialist rag - Business Week Magazine. "At Daewoo, Hyundai, and other Korean companies, union rights are virtually unknown. Attempts to organize are suppressed. Workers have little chance of winning fair wages or fair treatment under the military dictatorship that works hand in hand with the corporations.

"But such firms are precisely the kind of company that General Motors and other U.S. corporations are keeping in South Korea these days. Attracted by the country's low wages and compliant government, GM has invested in a half-billion dollar joint venture with Daewoo capable of producing nearly 200,000 cars for sale in Korea and the U.S. These imports will result in the loss of about 20,000 U.S. jobs for UAW workers and other American workers, UAW President Owen Bieber told a Washington conference recently. " SOME HONOURABLE MEMB ERS: Oh, oh! HON. A.

MACKLING: Well, Madam Speaker, I reiterate that the honourable members don't care about the rights and the working conditions of workers elsewhere. They are indifferent to the plight of workers. Obviously by their chatter, they are indifferent, Madam Speaker . "U.A. ag-imp and aerospace firms are outsourcing to Korea too. Caterpillar has Daewoo building forklifts for worldwide sales. And General Dynamics plans to have Daewoo build fuselage sections for 100 F-16 jet fighters. Meanwhile, Hyundai has shipped its first cars to the U.S. for sale here.

"The U.S. companies call their Korean plans necessary to 'stay competitive.' We call it unfair trade." Madam Speaker, I want to say a few more words about South Korea and Hyundai. South Korea is one of those places in the world where our Prime Minister

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 has recently visited, and we know that Bob Coates became the leader for representing South Korea to the people of Canada. And mysteriously, this great public relations that South Korean companies, U.S. multinationals dressed in South Korean clothing , have financed junkets, members of Parliament being taken to South Korea, all expenses paid - why, Madam Speaker? Just good will? Hardly, Madam Speaker . We read with surprise the fact that a number of Tory M.P.'s in Ottawa, five exactly, mysteriously took this junket to South Korea, all expenses paid.

There has been an extensive South Korean lobby to ensure that the Hyundai automobile, the Pony, will be available for sale in Canada, no restriction - very very little restriction - on the importation of Pony cars, the Hyundai cars, to Canada. Now can one wonder, Madam Speaker, about the free trips for the M.P.'s and the concern of the Prime Minister to visit Seoul and visit with the President there? I want to talk about that visit there, Madam Speaker. Just the other day, on May 15, the Globe and Mail had a story about the Prime Minister's trip to South Korea, and the Free Press told that story.

I see that the Press isn't here now, but I have something to say about the Free Press. The Prime Minister went to South Korea, and he did talk to the President of South Korea who was there maintaining his position by armed force . I'm sure that he did indicate to President Chung that he should be a little bit more responsible in respect to the rights of the Koreans. Madam Speaker, I'm sure he expressed some concern about human rights. I'm sure he told them, look, you don't have to put people in jail to suppress the agitators, and he's great with a quip.

I'm sure that he told them that he should be able to do what I do in Canada. What you do is you don't attack the social net; you don't do those sorts of things. You talk about those being sacred trusts, and then you take the knife out later quietly and hope that no one is watching when you try to disembowel old age security in this country ; when you attack unemployment insurance in this country; when you attack family allowances in this country. That's how you do it, President Chung . You don't have to put people in jail. You cut off the funding for higher education and health care in your country .

I'm sure that the Honourable Prime Minister's words were very instructive to President Chung about how it can be done. Madam Speaker, I'm sure that our Prime Minister , when he was being told that North Korea is a communist state where they have no options, no freedom, was assured that, as he was in South Korea , everything is fine. Those people who are thrown in jail for organizing unions are breaking the law, because the law prevents workers from organizing in unions .

And when he was told that in North Korea there is only one television station - it belongs to the people of North Korea - he wasn't told that the two stations in South Korea were controlled to the nth degree by the government of that dictator in South Korea; that there was no freedom of the press in South Korea; that those who dared to oppose, to demonstrate, were put in jail. Now the honourable members opposite think this is a funny situation , Madam Speaker . They snicker , they sneer, they chortle. Madam Speaker, we're talking about the rights of workers.

We're talking about the rights 152 of brothers and sisters. But for the grace of God, we would be in that country and these members opposite, some of them, not all, snicker and laugh. Madam Speaker , the multinational corporations of this world seek to maximize profit , effectively enslave workers in other countries to maximize the profits of individual shareholders . The concerns of organized workers in Manitoba and Canada has to be reflected in the concerns for the plight of workers everywhere . Madam Speaker, what are the alternatives?

The alternatives, Madam Speaker, are for workers to be able to be organized in trade unions of their choice and , in enlightened industrial democracies , work with management to develop the skills of the plant and the skills of the workers for the common benefit of all. Honourable members should appreciate and realize that is becoming the reality in many parts of the wor ld. For many many years in the so-called - and that's rubbish, non-free world, beyond the Iron Curtain that they talk about - workers managed plant s, decide on holidays and benefits, decide on production.

We have, in countries like Sweden and Germany, workers sitting down with management and deciding on the initiatives that are necessary to ensure that the product of their toil is meaningful , effective and marketable in a competitive society. That's not an unreal world; that's not dreaming , Madam Speaker, of something that is impossible . It's happening very slowly because we have so many voices of conservatism in this country saying, no, workers shou ld not be allowed to participate . I have said something wrong? MADAM SPEAKER: The honourable member 's time has expired . The Honourable Member for Brandon West.

MR. J. McCRAE: Madam Speaker, I sat here for the last 40-or- so minutes listening very patiently to the Minister of Labour . I think it is pretty fair to say that the Minister is definitely the greatest beneficiary of the tradition of this House that the Throne Speech Debate need not be very relevant. MADAM SPEAKER: The Minister of Labour on a point of order. HON. A. MACKLING: Did you indicate I had five minutes? MADAM SPEAKER: No, I indicated your time has expired . The Honourable Member for Brandon West. MR. J.

McCRAE: Madam Speaker, I am pleased to join with other honourable members in extending thanks to Her Honour the Lieutenant -Go vernor for so kindly attending this place and reading the Speech from the Throne. In my humble opinion, the Lieutenant-Governo r discharged that duty with distinction . As a new member of this honourable institution , Madam Speaker , I am already acutely aware that the duties you have been elected to undertake are onerous and demand ing and I wish you well in carrying them out . It is a pleasure for me to congratulate all honourable members on their election , especially those who are

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 new to the Legislature. I look forward to working with them and learning the ropes together with them. Congratulations also to all Ministers, Madam Speaker, new and otherwise on their appointments. Finally, a word of thanks to the thousands of Manitobans of all party affiliations for their efforts and contributions to the recent election campaign. Among those thousands were many candidates who ran unsuccessf ully. From some of those candidates, Madam Speaker, we will hear more and from others perhaps not. But all of them are deserving of the gratitude of the people of Manitoba.

Without them, the issues would not have been so well-aired and the people would have had little from which they could intelligently choose. Many honourable members have talked about the need for decorum and fair play in this House. They need not look any further for an example than to a former member for Brandon West, Mr. Ed McGill. Mr. McGill served in this place with notable distinction as a member, as a deputy-leader of his party, and as a member of the Executive Council. Mr. McGill still serves his community.

I have known him and his family for many years and I take pleasure and pride in claiming the seat that he so ably occupied. I believe it's to the credit of my predecessor, Mr. Henry Carroll, that he had the courage to stand by his principles which, Madam Speaker, I believe never were socialist. He had the courage to leave the New Democratic Party, as so many others have done, and he had the courage to represent the citizens of Brandon West as an independent member of this Assembly.

Last Friday, the Honourable Member for Ellice and the Honourable Member for Kildonan moved and seconded the motion for an Address in Reply to the Speech from the Throne. I congratulate them, and I envy them because I, too, would regard it an honour to be chosen to carry out those historic duties. I will be generous and say I suppose the Mover and Seconder spoke as graciously as they were capable of speaking, but I'm afraid that even their best efforts at non-partisanship did not meet the standards set by the traditions of this Assembly. They did better than the Member for Elmwood, however, who didn't even try.

The traditions of this and other Legislatures call for a less partisan approach in maiden speeches than the approach taken by those honourable gentlemen. They made it difficult for me to sit quietly and attentively in my seat but, Madam, I did my best to restrain myself, as no doubt you can attest. Respect for this Legislature and other Assemblies across the country has declined in recent years, from the point of view of the public and also from the point of view of some of the members of those Assemblies. The Liberal rat pack in Ottawa is an example of this.

If the Mover and Seconder of this motion and the Honourable Member for Elmwood have given us an indication of the attitude of all honourable members opposite toward the business to be conducted in this House, perhaps there's not enough reason to be hopeful that we will have a productive Session. But perhaps it's still not too late for us to try to restore in the public a sense of confidence in the effectiveness of the democratic process as we look to the future.

Much to my personal satisfaction, Madam Speaker, and to the satisfaction of the Progressive Conservatives of Brandon West, the electors there saw fit, on March 153 18, to send me here to speak for them. The election results in Brandon West indicate that I have a strong enough mandate to speak as forcefully as I am able, about the issues raised in the campaign; raised by me, as well as by the Honourable First Minister, the Leader of the Opposition, and many candidates and others province-wide. My leader has pointed out that the one redeeming feature of the Speech from the Throne is that it was short.

Although it was mercifully short, Madam Speaker, let me add that the Speech from the Throne did identify some of the concerns of Manitobans in the 19 80's. lt's unfortunate, however, that some very important areas of concern effectively were left out such as the deficit, our present labour laws, education funding, health care improvements, financial accountability, unemployment and business development, to name just a few.

The concerns of the people of Brandon have certainly not been addressed in the Speech from the Throne. lt's even more important that certain government proposals would deal with problems facing our province in the wrong way and do more harm than good. The rhetoric of the election campaign should have died down by now. The problems facing us are real; the people need those problems solved. I plead with honourable members to put the future well-being of our very special province into the proper perspective.

Regardless of our politics, our chief objective should be to make Manitoba a happy, healthy and productive place for us and our children and all those who come after us. In order to meet our objective, we must first understand the economy and the people of our province. lt's my responsibility, above all others, to represent my part of Manitoba, so I must let honourable members know about my constituency of Brandon West and about the City of Brandon. The City of Brandon developed quickly at first. lt was never a village or a town. Its first Charter in 1882 was the Charter of the City of Brandon.

The "Wheat City " immediately became the agricultural and economic centre of what we now know as Westman. A key figure in the development of the west was one Clifford Sifton, MLA for North Brandon from 1888 to 1896. Sir Clifford later, as a Member of Parliament for Brandon, also served as Minister of the Interior in the government of Sir Wilfred Laurier, and presided over the settlement of the Canadian west by immigrants chiefly from Europe, Western Asia and the USA, as well as by eastern Canadians, among whom were my paternal grandparents who homesteaded at Westlock, Alberta in 19 05.

I'm given to understand, Madam Speaker, you may be familiar with that part of the country. My maternal grandparents immigrated from Ohio to the Peace River area of Alberta some years later and by that time Sir Clifford and another prominent member of his family, Arthur Sifton, had undergone positive conversions and supported the Conservatives. Like many other western Canadian towns and cities, the Wheat City owes its creation to the Canadian Pacific Railway, the dream of Sir John A. Macdonald.

One year after the announcement that the Brandon townsite would be the location of a major CPR divisional point, Brandon became known as a city. That was in 1882, Madam Speaker. Much development has taken place in the 104 years since.

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 Brandon now has a population of over 38,000 and serves a trading area comprising 200,000 people, with a combined annual income of some $2.5 billion. Retail trade amounts to over $200 million per year. There are over 50 industrial plants, manufacturing goods valued annually at nearly $200 million. My city is served by railways, highways, and an airport, and that's a very good thing because, in addition to all the retail, manufacturing and industrial activity in Brandon, tourism is also a major generator of economic activity and jobs.

Tourism is worth over $40 million to the Brandon economy every year and puts about 3,5 00 people to work. There are ample cultural and recreational facilities for our people and their visitors. On behalf of the people of Brandon, I invite all honourable members to attend this year's Provincial Exhibition of Manitoba. Our very fine summer fair has been operating annually since 1882. During the last week in March each year, Madam Speaker , our Keystone Centre is the home of the Royal Manitoba Winter Fair and honourable members have a standing invitation to attend MLA night at the fair every year.

I was pleased to meet some of them this year at the Royal. In the fall, producers and others from far and wide meet at Ag-Ex, again at the Keystone Centre. Many concerts and other cultural events are staged at the Western Manitoba Centennial Auditorium. The Brandon Allied Arts Council provides ongoing artistic and cultural opportunities for artists and patrons alike. We are proud of our libraries and museums and we're proud of the wonderful job done by the people who operate those facilities. As a centre of learning, Brand on takes second place to no other Canadian city of comparable size or location.

Brandon University and the Agricultural Extension Centre have histories that are bound up with the history of the city. They continue to provide quality education and training. Brandon University is also a major player in our local economy. As the MLA for Brandon West, I represent all those who are involved at Brandon University and I can tell honourable members that I will be aggressive and tenacious in my support for the institution. Even if the Throne Speech is silent about education, I will be urging the government to act on its commitments to Brandon University on a priority basis.

Since 1966 Assiniboine Community College has been providing vocational training to prepare Manitobans for a changing future. Here again, I consider it my duty to see that the residents of Westman continue to be served well at ACC. The fact that there is nothing about education in the Throne Speech is disgraceful, Madam Speaker , and a significant and telling oversight on the part of the government. There are 23 public schools in Brandon. Funding for public schools has been, is now, and I'm sure will continue to be a concern for all Manitobans.

I ask honourable members to look upon the education of our children as a crucial ly important investment in our future, and to join with me in tackling the problems we face with a view to improving our educational facilities, and doing so in a way that is fair to all Manitoba taxpayers and students. I mentioned the Keystone Centre in Brandon as the home of the Provincial Exhibition of Manitoba, the 154 Winter Fair and Ag-Ex. The Keystone Centre is also home to the Brandon Wheat Kings, the only WHL team in Manitoba. Since 194 7, the Wheat Kings have been excellent ambassadors for the City of Brandon.

Let's hope they continue in that role well into the future. The Wheat Kings also provide an opportunity for the fine young hockey play ers that Brandon tradition ally produces. I have already spoken to the Minister of Culture, Heritage and Recreation, who is also the Minister respo nsible for the Manitoba Lotteries Foundation, about the situation in which the Wheat Kings presently find themselves. The Minister seems to project a co-operative attitude, which is something new. No doubt, I'll be speaking to her about the Wheat Kings again.

The Canada Games Sportsplex on Brandon 's North Hill provides a recreational opportunity to all Brandonites and visitors to Brandon. The Sportsplex is a community asset which began at the time of the Canada Games, which Brandon hosted in 1979. There are many parks, swimming pools, golf courses and other recreational facilities located all across and around the city, making Brandon a prairie oasis that our pioneers could only have dreamed of.

While at one time, we in Brandon could be proud and secure in the knowledge that our hospital facilities could take care of us if we needed medical care, we must now take a serious look at what we have and build on it so that we can bring medical care in Brandon back to the levels required, because with just 430 beds at Brandon General Hospital our 800 staff and 80 doctors are just not able to meet the needs of Westman in the 19 80's. The Governmen t has made commitments to health care and it will be my duty to see that those are carried out too.

The Brandon Mental Health Centre has 580 beds and provides training for psychiatric nurses. This is another institution whose history is closely tied with the history of the development of the city. Brandon Mental Health Centre provides a very important service to Manitobans as well as jobs and training for the people of Brandon. As a regional government centre, the Wheat City is home to many government offices and government workers.

As one of the representatives here for the City of Brandon and as a public servant, Madam Speaker , up until the date that the election writ was issued, I will be urging the government to look upon decentralization as a key to the orderly development of our province in the future. Just as there would have been no beginning without the railroad, Madam Speaker , there would have been no carrying on without agriculture, the raison d'etre of the Wheat City. Members of this Assembly would do well to keep that fact foremost in their minds.

Although Brandon West is almost totally urban in its demography, it's a matter of pride to me that so many of my coll eagues on this side of the House are from rural constituencies and represent rural concerns. I share their concerns and look forward to working with them and honourable members opposite so that together we can improve opportunities for agricultural producers. Let's remember, Madam Speaker , that when we do that, we improve opportunities for our constituents in urban centres too. So, Madam Speaker, we residents of Brandon have very much indeed. We have a lot to protect and a lot

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 of potential to build on. My task will be to represent Brandon West residents, remembering always on their behalf just what it is that keeps our community going. Of course, there wouldn't be any community at all if it weren't for the people who live there. I like to think of the City of Brandon as the brightest jewel in the Manitoba crown. What makes it so brilliant, Madam Spe aker , is the people who live there. Our province is known as "Friendly Manitoba. " Whoever it was who gave Manitoba that appellation must have been visiting Brandon at the time.

I've lived in Alberta, British Columbia, California, Winnipeg and Ottawa and I found much to recommend in all those places, but the wisest move I ever made was to return with my family to my home town of Brandon three-and-a-half years ago. I wonder how many candidates in the election campaign can say that no doors were slammed in their faces. Well I knocked on many doors, Madam Speaker , but not one was closed in anger.

That might say something about me but, I daresay, it is more likely that it says something about the nature of the people of my electoral district, whether they were Progressive Conservatives, New Democrats or Liberals. Madam Speaker, I would like again to thank the electors of Brandon West for putting their confidence in me. As the Honourable Member for Ellice and others in this debate have done, I restate my commitment to work diligently on behalf of all the people of Brandon West. The people I represent are hard working, those who are fortunate enough to have jobs, and they are resp onsible.

They do their best to protect the future for themselves and for their children. They expect, and they voted for, nothing less from the members of this Ass embly. That's why I believe there is going to be concern in Brandon this week about the contents of the Speech from the Throne and about the intentions of this government. Members of this government like to utter pious platitudes about fairness, equity and the ''just society,'' to use a term often used by a former Prime Minister.

Some time back, the First Minister of this province proudly stated that his experience and relationship with th e Federal Tr udeau Liberals had been very good. lt should, therefore, come as a surprise to no one that we see so many of the hallmarks of the Tr udeau Liberals in the policies and pronouncements of honourable members opposite, hallmarks such as arrogance, sec recy, profligacy and just plain incompetence.

For the sake of the future of our province, I hope the Honourable Member for River Heights has learned something from those 16 years of failure in Ottawa and will, with all haste, put as much distance as possible betw een herself and the record of those sorry days. If she doesn't, the people of Manitoba will treat her and her party with the same contempt as before, and it can get pretty lonely, Madam Spea ker. A very good exampl e of the kind of insensitivity I am talking about is the school funding issue in the City of Brandon and elsewhere in the province.

The municipal taxpayers in Brandon face a 13 percent increase in their school taxes this year, because the funding formula for public schools laid down by the former Minister of Education rewards inefficiency and punishes thrift and prudent management. Funding increases in any 155 particular year, Madam Speaker, are bas::d on the previous year's expenditures and judging by this governme nt's annual deficits, I suspect that is the policy right across the administration of this government.

The trustees of the Brandon School Division refuse to act in an irresponsible way with taxpayers' money, even if they have been encouraged to do so by the previous Minister of Education. To underline just how irresponsible this administration is, Madam Speaker, the former Minister of Education came to Brandon at election time and told Brandon school trustees, "If you want more money from my department, you'll just have to spend more like some of the other divisions do." Madam Speaker, I think that's probably the major reason the former Minister of Education was demoted.

I congratulate the new Minister of Education on his appointment, but knowing that this issue all by itself could quite likely be the reason for the substantial drop in support for the Minister of Employment Services and Economic Security and knowing it had a lot to do with my own election in Brandon West, why has the new Minister not yet met with the Brandon School Division and other divisions in the same position? The election was two months ago. If the Minister acts quickly and corrects this grossly unfair situation, that will be to his c redit.

If he doesn't, it will demonstrate that he and his government have given up on Brandon and given up on the Member for Brandon East, that they really don't want him around any more. I can't help but wonder if that's been the objective all along. As one of the few remaining Schreyer New Democrats, it appears the clout of the Honourable Member for Brandon East is all but gone. But the electors of Brandon East and Brandon West still have clout, so I ask the Minister of Education to turn his attention to this inequity without delay, to treat it as a priority and restore fairness to school funding in this province.

Madam Speaker , the Throne Speech says, in the usual sanctimonious language of this government that the government will stuff so-called pay equity down the throats of private entrepreneurs and their employees. I ask: what studies have been undertaken by this government to find out just how many women and others will lose their jobs because this administration is so slavishly subservient to a few unreliable people who like to use buzz words like pay equity, fairness and equality. We are judged by our actions, not by our words, Madam Speaker . SOME HONOURABLE MEMBERS: Oh, oh! MR. J.

McCRAE: Madam Speak er, I sat quietly for the Minister of Labour . I wonder if I could have the same kind of courtesy. We're judged by our actions, not by high-sounding words we utter . The fear I have is that the very people we all want to help, poorly paid women in our society, will be the first to lose their livelihoods if the principle of equal pay for work of equal value is imposed without the proper groundwork being laid, and I just don't have confidence that honourable members opposite have the competence to implement such a proposal.

I suggest that the government gain a little experience with pay equity in the public sector, which we support,

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 before playing around with market forces they don't understand and upsetting the delicate balance already in existence in the private sector . Let's put people before hasty political manoeuvering; let's not jeopardize jobs unnecessarily. There are too few of them already. Perhaps the government is afraid to do its homework, Madam Speaker . Maybe the Minister of Labour will find out something he doesn't want to know. That would be unacceptable - wouldn't it? - because then there'd have to be another flip-flop like the kind we saw with respect to free trade.

Well, I say it doesn't matter because this government has no credibility left anyway. What does matter, Madam Speaker, is that before we commit ourselves to imposed pay equity, we make sure that by doing so we bring about real equity and that we don't destroy jobs and workplaces in this province. Let's not defeat our purpose by bullying people. If the government pushes ahead with this like a bull in a china shop, the result will be the destruction of good will and the destruction of jobs.

I don't mind if the government is bent on self-destruction, but I implore honourable members, don't take innocent working people down with you. Madam Speaker, as the Labour critic and Civil Service Commission critic for my party, it's my duty to speak on behalf of workers across this province, workers in both the public and private sectors. lt's hard to know what qualifies me or anyone else to speak for working men and women in so many and varied occupations in this diverse province, but workers can be assured that their interests and concerns are also mine.

A happy and fairly treated work force is a productive one. Productivity is a blessing, not only to a worker but also to his or her family, employer, the community and the province. I hope my background as a provincial public servant and member of the Manitoba Government Employees Association will be of some assistance to me. The Minister of Urban Affairs, my former president - and a very good one too - now sits on the executive benches opposite. I can't help but observe, as the late Right Honourable John Diefenbaker did when Jack Horner defected to the Trudeau Liberals, that the sheriff has joined the rustlers.

Our new Minister of Urban Affairs is the one who gave the expression "apple polishers" a whole new meaning, but it appears the First Minister has forgiven him for that. I wish the Minister of Urban Affairs well in his new capacity. I hope he can talk some sense into his colleagues, especially the Minister of Labour. I already know the position of the Minister of Labour on matters of concern to workers and their employers in Manitoba, so perhaps the Minister of Urban Affairs will be good enough to allow me to consult him from time to time. The Minister of Labour referred to my leader earlier in his speech.

He made comments and said something to the effect that my leader had been going around Manitoba making anti-labour statements. Well, I've known my leader for some time now and I've gone through an election campaign, and the people of Manitoba know him pretty well too. lt's very hard for me to look at my leader and think of him as Gary the Hun - (Int erjection) - it's nice to see I have the attention of honourable members opposite, Madam Speaker. 156 MADAM SPEAKER: Order please. MR. J. McCRAE: I hope some of these interruptions will be deducted from my time, Madam Speaker. I might get pretty close.

The Speech from the Throne, Madam Speaker . SOME HONOURABLE MEMBERS: Oh, oh! MADAM SPEAKER: Order please. MR. J. McCRAE: . . . says nothing about the negative effect our present labour law has on the competitiveness of our province in relation to other places to locate a business enterprise. If honourable members opposite think a competitive edge is not important in times of unacceptable high unemployment, then the workers of this province need not look to them for help.

Perhaps there are many union leaders across this province who feel that a first contract forced on employers without right of appeal is a good thing and a good constitutional thing, but what will their reaction be when an unfair first contract is imposed on them and they have no right of appeal? I invite honourable members opposite to ask the workers at the T. Eaton Co. in Brandon what they think of the so-called first contract legislation in this province. A MEMBER: They'll tell you. MR. J. McCRAE: Ask the 43 who almost lost their jobs last fall what they think of the certification and decertification proposals.

Ask the 17 whose full-time jobs almost became part-time jobs how Manitoba's labour laws helped them. Where was the Honourable Member for Brandon East in those gloomy days, Madam Speaker, and what position did his government take? What was the position of the Minister of Labour? A MEMBER: He tore up his card; he tore up his credit card. MR. J. McCRAE: Impartiality, the picture of impartiality. I think I know what the position of the Minister of Labour was, and it certainly was not in favour of the workers at Eaton's in Brandon.

If honourable members opposite understand the language of small and medium-sized business operators and most of their employees across this province , just let them ask how it helps business and labour when one side is given an unfair advantage. This government says it believes in the collective bargaining process. I believe in it too, Madam Speaker , so why must we undermine it in The Manitoba Labour Relations Act? Why not let the process work if we believe in that process and hope for a healthy economy? Why do we insist on scaring away investors who could put our people to work?

I ask members of the government side to please come to their senses and strike a proper balance between interests which sometimes conflict. Let there be amending legislation brought forward, at the very least to give both sides in a dispute an opportunity to appeal decisions of the Manitoba Labour Board .

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 For a government committed to fairness in society and Charter of Rights compliance, surely this is the least it could do. At every turn honourable members opposite engage in the pusillanimous practice of deflecting attention away from their dismal record of failure by blaming the Federal Government for all our problems. This behaviour is the lowest form of political poltroonery and honourable members opposite make the average coward look like Sir Lancelot.

Madam Speaker, in response to the overwhelming pressure from the people of Canada and elsewhere, the Federal Government is taking steps to control deficit spending. On the other hand, honourable members opposite are proud that Manitoba is a have-not province. They take great comfort in being dependent on other provinces and spending other people's money. Instead of making misleading and untrue statements about so-called cuts in transfer payments which in reality are growing, let honourable members opposite put their own house in order.

Begging for alms, Madam Speaker, seems to be a preoccupation with honourable members opposite. Whatever happened to self-reliance, excellence, success and the pride that comes with it? Is all that too much for honourable members opposite? This government would rather do nothing and blame everybody else for its failure. I predict that the delusions of adequacy suffered by this government will only make it weaker and weak er. Other issues that have been brought to my attention, Madam Speaker , include the election - oh, sorry. Madam Speaker, how much time do I have left?

MADAM SPEAKER: The honourable member has seven minutes left. MR. J. McCRAE: Thank you.

Other issues brought to my attention during the election campaign, Madam Speaker, as well as before and since, include a major worry about what will happen to our future if we keep amassing unconscionable debt and passing it on to those who come after us, throwing money away to create short-term jobs which provide no future for our young people, the secrecy of this government - a sure indication that it has much to hide - the payroll tax and the gross unfairness it entails, red tape and regulation, the quality of the education being offered to our children and, Madam Speaker, trust.

Just very briefly in that connection, Madam Speaker , since the election, the Minister of Health increased the Pharmacare deductible for senior citizens from $50 to $75.00. Mrs. Marguerite Chown, First Vice-President of the Manitoba Society of Seniors reacted by saying, "Se niors feel a deep sense of shock and dismay and they've been betrayed by the governm ent." Mrs. Chown said that many seniors supported the New Democrats but they would have voted differently had they known that this was to be announced. My leader has alleged that honourable members opposite won the election by false pretenses.

I think I now know what he meant. Madam Speaker , as this Session unfolds, I intend to bring these and other issues to the attention of honourable members. My colleagues and I will provide constructive criticism when that is warranted. When 157 the government does something right, I will be among the first to say so. The Honourable Member for River Heights has no monopoly on recognizing the value of a good program.

Madam Speaker, just because the honourable member is the only member here representing her political part y, that is not sufficient reason for you, Madam, or for honourable members opposite, for members of the press gallery or for the people of Manitoba to give any less attention or c redence to any other member of this place. Madam Speaker, it's my wish and the wish of the people for whom I speak that this Session produces improvements in our econom y and in our social structure, and that a solid foundation is laid for the future.

I hope all honourable members share in that wish and join with me and my colleagues in the fulfilment of that noble undertaking. Thank you. MADAM SPEAKER: The Honourable Member for Lac du Bonnet. MR. C. BAKER: Thank you, Madam Speaker . I would like to offer you my congratulations on your election to this prestigious position. 11 is a well-deserved honour , both for yourself and for the people of Wolseley whom you have represented so capably. While I've known you for just a short time, Madam Speaker , I've developed a growing respect for your integrity and ju dgment.

I have the utmost confidence that you will fulfil your duties with impartialit y, understanding and the strength that your position demands. I would like to commend the Premier of Manitoba, as well as the Member for River Heights, for their wisdom in supporting your selection by this House. Madam Speaker, may I also take this opportunity to congratulate the other members of this Assembly on their election or re-election. In particu lar, I wish to welcome those like myself who are new members to this House. Like yourselves, I regard my membership in this Manitoba Legislative Assembly as a great honour .

I am sure that our duties will be hard and at times fru strating, but the challenges we face in our efforts to make Manitoba a better place to live are worth the effort. As MLA for Lac du Bonnet, I face a particular challenge in the legacy left by my friend and predecessor , the Honourable Sam Uskiw. Sam was an excellent MLA, both as a legislator and as a representative of Lac du Bonnet. He cared for people. He took the time to listen to their concerns and he fought with compassion and courage for what he believed in.

On behalf of the people of Lac du Bonnet and Manitoba, I would like to thank Sam Uskiw for his contributions as an MLA and wish him well in the future. Madam Speaker , I also wish to extend my congratulations to Premier Pawley and his fellow New Democrats who shared in the election victory on March 18. May I remind the House that the people of Manitoba have expressed their will? They have chosen a New Democratic Government and they expect it to govern.

They want and they deserve a capable, imaginative and compassionate government, one which fulfils its election commitments and which provides the vision of a better life for all Manitobans. That, Madam Speaker , is what

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 this Speech from the Throne offers. lt points the way to fulfilment of goals of economic and social ju stice which are every Manitoban's right. Before I deal with the Throne Speech in detail, Madam Speaker, I would like to give the most important "thank you" of all to my friends and constituents from Lac du Bonnet for their support in the provincial election campaign.

I also wish to pledge to them that I will do my best to represent their interests over the upcoming years. lt seems to me, Madam Speaker, that at times a politician loses a sense of what the real purpose is amidst the statistical noise of debates. Howard Pawley Government understands that our duty is to promote the interests of every Manitoban. We will not forget that unemployment statistics that are tossed around represent human suffering and inadequacies in our economic system. We understand that, when we talk of farm bankruptcies, we speak of shattered dreams and troubled communities.

If there is any contribution I can make to this House, Madam Speaker, I hope it will be to remind members, from time to time, that we are here to serve responsibly and that political expediency must give way to constructive programs. Madam Speaker, allow me to share with this House a few things about myself and about the constituency of Lac du Bonnet which I am honoured to represent. As a farmer, Reeve of Brokenhead Municipa lity, member of the Beausejour Hospital Board, and as a parent, I have had the opportunity to experience the strength and beauty of Lac du Bonnet and its people.

My wife, Eileen, and myself have found Lac du Bonnet to be a good place to earn a living and make friends and raise our family. We have found that its people share many of the beliefs and concerns. They believe that governments must do more than build roads and schools. They feel that governments are about fairness and compassion, implementing a tax system which treats all fairly, ensuring that those who labour are rewarded accordin gly, and supporting the aged and unfortunate, and developing programs which will put people back to work. Above all, the people of Lac du Bonnet believe in themselves.

They know that, if given the opportuni ty, they can create a good life for their families and themselves. For the past 15 years, they have trusted the NDP to aid them in reaching this goal. lt is my honour to continue on with the work of Sam Uskiw and the Manitoba New Democratic Party. Madam Speaker, I am proud to say that I am a third­ generation farmer from the R.M. of Brokenhead, and pleased to say that my wife and I have five children, two daughters-in-law and two sons-in-law, all who live within the constitue ncy. Two of our sons, as well as Eileen and myself, operate a grain and oilseed farm.

The rest of our family are employed as a teacher, welder, stenogr apher, stone cutter , court rep orter, dental hygienist and investment broker. As you can see, we are involved in a diversity of occupations. This divers ity, Madam Speaker, is a reflection of the riding itself. Lac du Bonnet is a land of richness, yet contrast. As anyone who has campaigned the constituency can attest, Lac du Bonnet covers a vast area. Landscape ranges from the Canadian Shield in the north to prairie 158 grassland southeast of Winnipeg.

The constituency ranges from Victoria Beach and Fort Alexander Reserve in the north to the R.M. of Brokenhead in the south, and from the Ontario border in the east to Lake Winnipeg in the west. Lac du Bonnet's people engage in almost the entire spectrum of economic activit y. On the shores of Lake Winnipeg and Lac du Bonnet, we have a large and thriving tourist industr y. At Pine Falls, our pulp mill churns out 500 tons of paper per day, while at Bu rnett Lake, lithium is mined. Burnett Lake is also the site of a recent joint public and private-sector development of spodumene. The resources are located there.

For members who aren't sure of what spodumene is used for , I am pleased to inform them that any clear cookingware utensils they have in their homes are probably made of spodumene. Much of Lac du Bonnet's economy is based in the soil. Fields of organic peat sod from the Stead area generate over $1 million in sales. In addition, most of the world's wild rice is grown in the region in the eastern portion of this constituenc y, earning it the title of "Wild Rice Capital of the World. " Western Lac du Bonnet hosts a familiar form of agricultural products.

This area's soil is among the finest in the province and its farmers are among the most productive. Over the last several decades farm productivity has increased almost tenfold, helping to make Beausejour one of the largest grain delivery points in the province. By the way, Beausejour is also the home of a recently-formed farmers' market. Lac du Bonnet's quarries produce beautiful granite used in the construction industry. In nearby Garson, Manitoba produces the famous Tyndall stone which is prominently featured in this building and many other famous buildings.

The riding is also the site of the Whiteshell Nuclear Research Station at Pinawa, employing 1, 200 Manitobans. This facility has a major economic impact in the area. Recent world events demonstrate the need for continuing research like that undertaken at Pinawa into making nuclear energy safer. Madam Speak er, I have described to you a vibrant, diverse constituency, one which still has a great potential yet to be realized, but the people of Lac du Bonnet do have some valid concerns about their future. They hope for and want the same assurance all parents want, that their children's future will be a bright one.

We, as all past governments, have pledged ourself to this goal. lt is comforting to be a member of a government which has taken so many positive steps in the areas of job creation, health care, care for the elderl y, education and training. lt is for this reason, our children's future, that the federal cutbacks cause us such grave concerns. The de-indexation of family allowances, the attempt to de-index old age pensions, and the cutbacks in transfer payments all represent threats to our children's future at the most fundamental level. Is it to be left to the province alone to strive tor this goal?

I ask members of this House, Madam Speake r, to join together in the opposition to these federal actions. We all bear a responsibility for providing a better future for Manitoba. lt is up to us, through co-operation and consultation with all levels of government, to see that everyone is working towards the goal of a better Manitoba.

Thursday, 15 May, 1986 Madam Speaker , when I talk with my neighbours in the Lac du Bonnet area, they appreciate the work tha t has alread y been done by the NDP government. Faced with an interna tional recession , this gove rnment did a great deal to enhance our quality of life. Through initiatives like Main Street Manitob a, the Manitoba Jobs Fund, and the construc tion of Limestone Generatin g Stat ion , we put people back to work and improved the econo mic infrast ructure of this province.

By careful management and imaginative programs, this government has protected and enhanced such essential servi ces as day care, medical services and education. With a financial comm itm ent greater than any other in the history of this province , we helped the agricultural community endure the hard times. Through coope ration with business and agriculture, our NDP government laid the economic framework for a strong recovery from the rec ession. That is why, Madam Speaker, this Throne Speech is so important.

It affirms this government's commitment to the achievements of the past years and demonstrates to Manitobans what this government hopes to achieve in the next four years. If I may, Madam Speaker, I would like to spend the next few moments on an area in the Throne Speech whic h is of particular interest to my constituents and myself. That is, of course, agriculture . It is no secret that our farm sector is suffering. We are concerned about the future of our rural communities and family farms.

We see the devastating impact of lower commod ity prices, high interest rates, cutthroat international competition, high input costs and bad weather . We hear about many young farmers going into bankruptcy or just quietly selling out when their operations are no longer viable. We see the hard ships that have been endured by our friends, good managers , who see their heritage and way of life threatened by factors beyond their control. However, the situation is not hopeless .

While it is true that our producers alone cannot compete with heavily subsidized foreign competition, they can if the Governments of Manitoba and Canada provide assistance. The Speech from the Throne outlines this government's intention for all to see. Farm Aid is a package that will provide assistance to farmers who are experiencing financial instability. The program will be flexible and able to respond quickly if conditions continue to deteriorate. As well, Farm Start will facilitate the transfer of agricultural land between retiring producers and 159 beginn ing farmers.

The survival of the family far m as we know it today , depends on the ability of you nger Manitobans to continue entering far ming. I am proud to be a part of a government that will assist them. The benef it of these two programs will be great, Madam Speaker. The benefit will be even greater with increased federal support to our farmers. One must wonder why the Federal Government can do so little for our farmers when they are willing to spend a billion dollars bailing out creditors of a bank. Madam Speaker, this Throne Speech continues the proud tradition of the Manitoba New Democratic Party.

Over the last 50 years , our collective struggle has meant improvements to the quality of life in all of Manitoba . We have fought for employment, insurance and pensions. We have fought for Workers Compensation, better health and safety in the workplace . We have fought for decent housing, the right to education, the right to employment and the provision of universal Medicare. We have spoken up when the rights of individuals or minorities are threatened. We have spoken up against legislation that threatens civil servants , civil rights and libert ies.

We can be proud of that which we have fought for and that which we have gained. The New Democratic Party has been good for Lac du Bonnet, Madam Speaker. It is ready to face the challenges that lie ahead. This Throne Speech continues our aim of building a better future for all Manitobans. It is with pride that I speak in support of this Throne Speech and of this government . As a member, I am honoured to take my place in this Legislative Assembly as a representative for the Lac du Bonnet constituency.

I would like , once again , to thank all of them for the confidence they have placed in me, and I look forward to serving them in the following years. Thank you , Madam Speaker . MADAM SPEAKER: The Honourable Member for Riel. MR. G. DUCHARME: I move, seconded by the Honourable Member for Charleswood, that debate be adjourned. MOTION presented and carried and the House adjourned and stands adjourned unt il 10:00 a.m. tomorrow (Friday).