Manitoba Hansard — 18 April 2023 (Sitting 43B, 42nd Legislature, 5th Session)

42-5-43b

Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)

Fifth Session – Forty-Second Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable Myrna Driedger Speaker Vol. LXXVII No. 43B - 1:30 p.m., Tuesday, April 18, 2023 ISSN 0542-5492

MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Forty-Second Legislature Member Constituency Political Affiliation ALTOMARE, Nello Transcona NDP ASAGWARA, Uzoma Union Station NDP BRAR, Diljeet Burrows NDP BUSHIE, Ian Keewatinook NDP CLARKE, Eileen, Hon. Agassiz PC COX, Cathy Kildonan-River East PC CULLEN, Cliff, Hon. Spruce Woods PC DRIEDGER, Myrna, Hon. Roblin PC EICHLER, Ralph Lakeside PC EWASKO, Wayne, Hon. Lac du Bonnet PC FONTAINE, Nahanni St. Johns NDP GERRARD, Jon, Hon. River Heights Lib. GOERTZEN, Kelvin, Hon. Steinbach PC GORDON, Audrey, Hon. Southdale PC GUENTER, Josh Borderland PC GUILLEMARD, Sarah, Hon.

Fort Richmond PC HELWER, Reg Brandon West PC ISLEIFSON, Len Brandon East PC JOHNSON, Derek, Hon. Interlake-Gimli PC JOHNSTON, Scott, Hon. Assiniboia PC KHAN, Obby, Hon. Fort Whyte PC KINEW, Wab Fort Rouge NDP KLEIN, Kevin E., Hon. Kirkfield Park PC LAGASSÉ, Bob Dawson Trail PC LAGIMODIERE, Alan Selkirk PC LAMONT, Dougald St. Boniface Lib. LAMOUREUX, Cindy Tyndall Park Lib. LATHLIN, Amanda The Pas-Kameesak NDP LINDSEY, Tom Flin Flon NDP MALOWAY, Jim Elmwood NDP MARCELINO, Malaya Notre Dame NDP MARTIN, Shannon McPhillips PC MICHALESKI, Brad Dauphin PC MICKLEFIELD, Andrew Rossmere PC MORLEY-LECOMTE, Janice, Hon.

Seine River PC MOSES, Jamie St. Vital NDP NAYLOR, Lisa Wolseley NDP NESBITT, Greg, Hon. Riding Mountain PC PEDERSEN, Blaine Midland PC PIWNIUK, Doyle, Hon. Turtle Mountain PC REDHEAD, Eric Thompson NDP REYES, Jon, Hon. Waverley PC SALA, Adrien St. James NDP SANDHU, Mintu The Maples NDP SCHULER, Ron Springfield-Ritchot PC SMITH, Andrew, Hon. Lagimodière PC SMITH, Bernadette Point Douglas NDP SMOOK, Dennis La Vérendrye PC SQUIRES, Rochelle, Hon. Riel PC STEFANSON, Heather, Hon. Tuxedo PC TEITSMA, James, Hon. Radisson PC WASYLIW, Mark Fort Garry NDP WHARTON, Jeff, Hon.

Red River North PC WIEBE, Matt Concordia NDP WISHART, Ian Portage la Prairie PC WOWCHUK, Rick Swan River PC Vacant Morden-Winkler

1587 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Tuesday, April 18, 2023 The House met at 1:30 p.m. Madam Speaker: Good afternoon, everybody. Please be seated. ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS INTRODUCTION OF BILLS Bill 239–The Residential Tenancies Amendment Act (Application Fees and Deposits) Mr. Andrew Micklefield (Rossmere): I move, seconded by the honourable member for Brandon East (Mr. Isleifson), that Bill 239, The Resi dential Tenancies Amend ment Act (Application Fees and Deposits), be now read a first time. Motion presented. Mr.

Micklefield: This amendment ensures that land- lords cannot charge unfair and unneces sary fees to prospective tenants before docu mentation is suitably signed. Madam Speaker: Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion? [Agreed] Committee reports? TABLING OF REPORTS Hon. Kevin E. Klein (Minister of Environment and Climate): I am pleased to table the Manitoba Watershed Districts Program 2021- 2022 Annual Report for the De partment of Environment and Climate.

MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS Madam Speaker: The honourable Minister of Sport, Culture and Heritage –and I would indicate that the required 90 minutes' notice prior to routine proceed - ings was provided in accordance with our rule 27(2). Would the honourable minister please proceed with his statement. Holocaust Remembrance Day Hon. Obby Khan (Minister of Sport, Culture and Heritage): Madam Speaker, I rise today in ob- servance of Yom HaShoah, which is also known as Holocaust Remembrance Day.

Ninety years ago, the Nazi Party came into power in Germany, initiating a campaign of terror that tar - geted political opponents, marginalized groups and ultimately the entire Jewish population. Between 1939 and 1945, the Nazis and the collaborators were responsible for the deaths of over 6 million Jewish people, who were targeted based solely on their ethnicity and faith. This targeted ethnic cleansing is estimated to have resulted in the deaths of almost two thirds of Europe's entire Jewish population. This horrific

chapter in history came to be known as the Holocaust or the Shoah, in Hebrew. The Holocaust impacted generations of families and communities around the world. Following the liberation of survivors, com mu- nities across Canada worked to sponsor and resettle approximately 35,000 Jewish families and their depend- ents. Among those working to resettle these families were members of the Manitoba Jewish com munity, who alongside this 'disporia' built the strongly rooted Jewish community evident in our province today.

Madam Speaker, the legacy of the Holocaust includes the tremendous tragedy, but it also includes triumphant acts of resilience, resistance an d perseverance. Manitobans can learn about these individuals, families and com munities through the stories they have generously shared at the newly reopened Holocaust Education Centre in the Jewish Heritage Centre of Western Canada. We are honoured t hat despite their own trauma, many survivors bravely shared their experiences.

Madam Speaker, the Holocaust and its aftermath are evidence of the fragility of our demo cracy–of all democracy–but also a testament to the power of resistance, open dialogue and action to ensure that history is never repeated. We must continue to seek learning oppor tunities and document the stories of survivors, victims and their descendants. As members of the Legis lative Assembly of Manitoba, we remain committed to us ing legislation and education to protect Manitobans from violence, racism and hate. Sadly, Madam Speaker, anti-Semitism and other acts of hatred are on the rise. We must all work

1588 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 together towards ending anti-Semitism and all acts of hatred. Madam Speaker, we are stronger together. And today within this Chamber and throughout this entire province, that is seen. In observance of Yom HaShoah, I encourage all Manitobans to learn more about the Holocaust. Please consider visiting a monument here on the Legislature grounds, a local museum or a Jewish cultural centre. We each have a role to play in making Manitoba a welcoming place for all.

In doing so, we demonstrate our commitments to the values, multiculturalism and the protection of all human rights. Through a diverse and respectful society, we support connections between people of all cultures, faith and ethnicities, and shepherd our collective success. That is why I am proud and honoured to be wear- ing the yarmulke today in show of love and respect to my Jewish brothers and sisters. Madam Speaker, unfor tunately, a lot of the Jewish community couldn't be here today as they were invited to the Lieutenant Governor general's house after the ceremony outside.

I would ask that the six currently living Holocaust survivors, which I'm going to table today, be included in Hansard. Madam Speaker, on this solemn occasion, I would also ask those present to stand and join me in a moment of silent reflection and remembrance to the many lives lost in the Holocaust. Mr. Diljeet Brar (Burrows): Madam Speaker, today is Yom HaShoah. It is a day to say, never again, while we also say, never forget. Yom HaShoah, or Holocaust Remembrance Day, is marked on the 27th day in the month of Nisan–a week after the seventh day of Passover.

Today we read the names of 6 million Jewish men, women and children murdered in the Holocaust and honour their memory. We repeat the truth of what happened to Jewish people and listen to the stories of survivors so their memories can live on. The horror of Nazi genocide is something that all of us as human beings have a responsibility to carry. The Nazi concentration camps tried to take away the humanity of all Jewish and many others: Roma, Sinti, Slavic people, political opponents and LGTBQ+ people–but for all their terror, the Nazis did not succeed.

Today, we also remember and honour all the descendants of Holocaust victims and survivors who now call Manitoba home. Their identity as Jewish people and their contributions to our province are acts of defiance against the Nazi project and anti-Semitism. Sadly, we know that even now, many decades after the Holocaust, Canada is not immune to this form of hatred. Anti-Semitism in Canada has reached record levels in the past few years, and it is up to all of us to call out this form of discrimination in our com - munities, online and everywhere else it occurs.

I hope all Manitoban s will take the opportunity to com - memorate this important day and to recommit to standing up against all forms of anti-Semitism. Today, on Yom HaShoah, we say the names of the 6 million. We remember their lives. We remember their contributions to their c ommunities, their families. And we say, never again. Mr. Dougald Lamont (St. Boniface): I seek leave to speak to the ministerial statement. Madam Speaker: Does the member have leave to respond to the statement? [Agreed] The honour able member for River Heights (Mr. Gerrard)–sorry. The honour able member for St. Boniface. My apologies. Mr.

Lamont: I had the honour this morning of attending a ceremony of Holocaust remembrance in the Legislature. It was sombre and moving and it marked the horrors of the Holocaust in naming the individuals who were murdered, and where their lives were lost. In attendance were survivors who read names. They were the descendants of Holocaust survivors who lost grandparents, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, cousins, children. Some had lost dozens of members of their families.

Jews, Roma, people with dis abilities, LGBTQ+ were all rounded up, murdered, and every thing they owned was stolen, sometimes to pay for their own execution as part of the Holocaust. In a world where governments still and have built prison and labour camps and engineered famines and genocide, it is important to understand the unique evil of the Nazi Holocaust, designing and building infra - structure for the deliberate, planned slaughter of millions of humans on an industrial scale, with the purpose of eradicating every last Jewish man, woman

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1589 and child. The crimes of the Holocaust plumbed the greatest depths of deliberate human evil. * (13:40) And as the philosopher Emil Fa ckenheim wrote, the extermination of the Jews had no political or econ- omic justification. It was not a means to any end; it was an end in itself. I would like to thank my colleague, the MLA for River Heights, for his leadership in working with B'nai Brith and bringing forward a resolution to combat anti-Semitism, that was supported by every member of this House. As Dr.

Ruth Ashrafi wrote, we fully realize that an op position MLA can only submit one private member's resolution per year, and you decided to use your one slot to fight anti-Semitism. As Manitobans and as Canadians, we must recog- nize that the price of freedom is eternal vigilance. We must remember our history. We must remember and value each human life that was ended. There is also a vital lesson that we can draw from Judaism, the idea of tikkun olam: we all have a role to play in repairing and bettering the world.

This is our Jewish–our commit ment to the Jewish com munity and the community of Manitoba today and every day. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker: The Minister of Sport, Culture and Heritage (Mr. Khan) had asked to have those names included of the survivors in Hansard. Is there leave to have those names included? [Agreed] Sol Fink, Rachel Fink, Regine Frankel, Edith Kimelman, Judy Lavitt, Anne Novak Is there leave for a moment of silence? [Agreed] Please rise. A moment of silence was observed. MEMBERS' STATEMENTS Super-Spike Volleyball Hon.

Janice Morley-Lecomte (Minister of Mental Health and Community Wellness): Maple Grove park in the constituency of Seine River is a versatile sports park, which is home to many sport venues and hosts hundreds of athletes throughout the year. Football, Frisbee, rugby and volleyball are of the– few of the sports which call Maple Grove home. This year, Maple Grove will host many tourna - ments, one of them being Super-Spike volleyball.

Super-Spike is a not -for-profit charitable event which fundraises money for local non- profit organ- izations and Volleyball Manitoba and the programs that Volleyball Manitoba supports. To date, the event has raised over $1.3 million. This year, Super-Spike volleyball will be celebrating its 20th anniversary on the July 21st, 22nd weekend. For the past 20 years, Super -Spike volleyball has grown into one of western Canada's largest outdoor beach volleyball tournaments.

Teams of all levels, beginners to veteran players, from across Canada and the regions in the United States gather together to compete in the weekend-long tournament. Spectators and participants enjoy meeting other players, listening to various performers through- out the weekend and sampling food from the many food vendors which are set up throughout the area. Last year, the rugby tournament hosted 280 teams. This year, the tournament includes many local performers, with the headliner being Shawn Desman. Registration for this event is now available online through the Super-Spike website.

Madam Speaker, I invite all my colleagues to come out and celebrate the 20th anniversary of Super-Spike at the Maple Grove Rugby Park on July 21st and 22nd. Thank you. Klinic Community Health Centre Ms. Lisa Naylor (Wolseley): I am thrilled to stand today to mark the 50-year anniversary of Klinic Community Health Centre. Klinic was founded in 1970 through the grassroots efforts of volunteer physicians and medical students who saw the need for substance -related services and medical care for youth.

Over the next few years, through grants and volunteer efforts, they began to offer basic services and a 24-hour crisis line was born. Klinic provided birth control information and operated a Crisis Bus that patrolled areas where drug intervention was needed. In April 1973, Klinic was incorporated and this is the anniversary we celebrate today. In the '70s, rape crisis services began, and in the '80s, Klinic initiated the Evolve Program for families affected by domestic violence. In the '90s, Klinic created the flood stress phone line, which is now the Manitoba farm, rural and northern phone line,

1590 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 providing specialized services for Kosovo refugees, and launched the school-based Teen Talk program. A decade later, they started the Manitoba Suicide Line and began providing services on campus at the University of Winnipeg and Tec Voc High School. In 2009, they launched the first Manitoba Transgender Clinic. During the pandemic, Klinic partnered with other services to provide drop- in health care to vulnerable community members.

Today, Klinic provides primary medical care, a trans health clinic, trauma counselling, phone lines for sexual assault, suicide prevention, gambling addiction, supports for seniors experiencing abuse and more. Their support groups i nclude Dream Catchers for those transitioning out of sex work and Project Choices for those navigating substance use and reproductive decisions. Many of us cannot imagine this city without Klinic at the heart of it.

Please join me in thanking and congratulating Klinic staff and board members for 50 years of miti - gating the social determinants of health while pro- viding innovative, inclusive and justice-oriented care for everyone. Team Terrick Mr. Brad Michaleski (Dauphin): Like most small towns in my constituency of Dauphin, the village of McCreary hosts a local curling club. McCreary also holds the proud distinction of being home to one of the best junior curling teams in Canada, and Manitoba provincial champions, Team Terrick.

Team Terrick has a unique story, as this season marked the first time that three sisters –Jaycee, Zoey, and Tessa Terrick –were able to curl together on the same team. The sisters have been curling for years, sometimes in opposition, and they were excited to play as a team w hile they were still all under the age of 21. The team found their fourth member, Jensen Letham, out of the Heather Curling Club in Winnipeg. While these athletes continued to study at both university and high school, they excelled and clinched the under-21 Manitoba junior women's title in January.

Then, in an intense 10- day competition at nationals, Team Terrick earned themselves the bronze in a challenging 18-team tournament. I'd like to thank Team Terrick for representing Manitoba so well, and encourage them in their ongoing commitment and dedication. I also say thank you to the hosts, ice crews, families, volunteers and coaches who supported them, and the community of McCreary for assisting, celebrating and fundraising for the team.

I offer my sincere congratulations to Team Terrick on their 2022-23 season, provincial championship and national bronze medal achievement, and I wish them many more successes in the years to come. Thank you. Twila Richards Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Madam Speaker, today I honour Twila Richards, a Manitoba educator and parent with a child with a learning disability, and another with autism. She joins us in the gallery today.

As vice -president of Manitoba Teachers for Students with Learning Disabilities, vice-president of Dyslexia Champions of Manitoba and an Orton- Gillingham practitioner, she's been an extra ordinary advocate for children with learning disabilities, or LDs. In their first school division, the school psych- ologists never assessed her children. She had no option but to have one of her children privately evaluated, a big financial hardship for a single, full - time parent. Even after diagnosis, there was little support in school. Her children's IQs were above 70. They couldn't have a n individual education plan.

She was told: you're a teacher; you can teach your children at home. Twila did, but it wasn't easy. She was drained after a day at work and her children were tired and stressed because school for them was tough. The Supreme Court of Canada has said children with dyslexia have the right to receive intensive sup - ports and interventions to learn to read, affirming the basic human right to read. You cannot expect a person to learn to read when they have yet–you can't expect a person to read to learn when they have yet to learn to read.

Too often students with LDs in Manitoba are only given adaptations, like read less and answer fewer ques- tions. And why are so many Manitoba educators not trained to understand LDs and to know what to do? * (13:50) Teaching students with LDs with methods designed for them can enable these intelligent individuals to be literate members of society and to thrive. Too many children are being–in Manitoba are being left behind. We must do better.

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1591 After years of NDP and PC governments missing the mark, it's time for a Liberal government to make the improvements that are needed for kids with learning disabilities. Renters Town Hall in St. James Mr. Adrien Sala (St. James): On March 20th, I hosted a renters town hall with St. James con stituents at the Deer Lodge community centre. There is a high density of renters in St. James, many of whom are seniors and people on fixed incomes.

Having had the opportunity to speak with renters at the town ha ll, what I heard over and over again is that renters in Manitoba are struggling. Whether it's above-guideline rent increases, the PCs' tax increase on renters or the rolling back of eligibility for Rent Assist, this government has made life much harder for renters in Manitoba. Many who rent who attended the town hall ex- pressed their deep frustration with the fact that the PCs raised taxes on renters by $175 in 2022, when they reduced the renters tax credit from $700 per year to $525 per year.

They also made it clear that they want to see our provincial government take action on the issue of above-guideline rent increases. This has been going on for years and it's out of control. In St. James, we've heard from many residents whose rents have gone up by hundreds of dollars a month because this PC government has continued to fail to take action to protect renters from above-guideline rent increases. We know how much this is hurting Manitobans, who are already struggling with an affordability crisis, a broken health-care system and so much more.

And yet once again, the PC government has decided to not take action to help people who are struggling in our province. This shows just how out of touch they are from the needs of regular Manitobans. Renters all acros s Manitoba deserve a govern - ment that will listen to their concerns. But after making life harder for many years, the PCs have broken Manitobans' trust. The Manitoba NDP believes in making life more affordable, not less, and we will continue to fight for renters in Manitoba. Speaker's Statement Madam Speaker: I just have a short statement for the House.

The–apparently a number of MLAs have been asking about their ability to wear Jets gear or Jets jerseys during playoff days and I'm going to let you know that I will agree to that, that on the days they are playing, that you will be welcome to wear jerseys or Jets gear so that we can cheer on our home team. So go, Jets, go. ORAL QUESTIONS Misericordia Sleep Clinic Public/Private Sector Funding Mr. Wab Kinew (Leader of the Official Opposition): Well, on that happy note, go, Jets, go.

There are thousands of Manitobans waiting for medical care right now, but the Stefanson government is putting politics ahead of patients. The sleep clinic at Misericordia is a leader across the country. And they submitted a proposal to the government to care for the thousands of patients on their waiting list. Now, the PCs refused to act on it for months and then they rejected that proposal because, I quote, it had only minimal private sector involvement. End quote. Those are the government's words and I'll table the letter that the government sent to these doctors.

Why is the Premier refusing to fund proposals that give care in our public health-care system? Hon. Heather Stefanson (Premier): Well, Madam Speaker, once again the Leader of the Op position is just wrong, continues to put false infor mation on the record in this Chamber. We are making historic investments in our health- care system, Madam Speaker; $668 million more this year than last year, a 9.2 per cent increase.

Those are significant investments to ensure that in –and part of that is in our surgical and diagnostic task force, a task force that was set up to ensure that Manitobans who are waiting for things like sleep apnea, that they can get those procedures when they need them. That's exactly why we set it up. And the Leader of the Opposition, all those mem- bers opposite, had a chance to support that initiative, Manitoba–Madam Speaker, but they chose not to. Shame on them. Madam Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a supplementary question.

1592 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 Mr. Kinew: Once again the Premier is des perate to try and run away from the damage she's caused to our health-care system. The letter that I tabled is from her own task force, and it rejected the advice of these local sleep docs, the experts in their field, renowned across the country. Now, what was the reason provided in that letter? It said that ther e was only minimal private sector involvement. It's a terrible reason. We should be focused on patients first, not priva- tization like the PCs.

It's clear that the Premier and her Cabinet always put ideology ahead of getting things done here in Manitoba. The question remains for them: Why would they refuse to fund care for patients in our public health system? Mrs. Stefanson: Well, Madam Speaker, we continue to make historic investments in our public health-care system. That's why we increased the budget of Health by $668 million in this recent budget. I will remind Manitobans that the Leader of the Opposition and all of the NDP voted against that increase for those investments in health care, Madam Speaker.

But certainly when it comes to surgical and diagnostic procedures, I want to thank our surgical and diagnostic task force for the incredible work that they do. Their focus is putting patients first, Madam Speaker, to ensure that those patients get the health care that they need. They are contracting out some of those services; that gets patients the health care that they need sooner. It's not taking an ideological approach like the NDP, which is the wrong way, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a final supplementary. Mr.

Kinew: Madam Speaker, the wrong approach is this PC Stefanson gov ernment and their task force. We'll side with the doctors on this side of the House. These physicians quit their task force because they're saying it's the wrong approach. Regardless of where these tests are provided, they still need–patients, I'm talking about here–still need to get a prescription from doctors in the public system. That's the public system that this PC gov ernment is starving.

They rejected the proposal to add more physicians at the Sleep Disorder Centre, which would be the real solution to the backlog, getting more patients a prescription more quickly. And instead, they rejected this proposal because it had, quote, only minimal private sector involvement. Why is this PC government so focused on priva- tization, and why do they refuse to fund solutions in our public health- care system that are advocated for by local experts? Mrs.

Stefanson: Madam Speaker, what we're focused on is making sure that patients get the health care that they need when they need it, and that's why we are not taking an ideological approach. That's why we are looking at all avenues to ensure –within a publicly funded system–that we're getting patients the health care that they need when they need it. But the Leader of the Op position referred to a letter that he was going to table in the House. What he tabled today is not a letter, Madam Speaker. It has nothing to do with what he just said it was.

So I'm wondering: Would he agree to then table the letter that he referred to? Madam Speaker: Just a reminder to members that, when referring to the government, the member can say Stefanson government and PC gov ernment, but not PC Stefanson government. That is not allowed by the rules. The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a new question. Grace Hospital Surgical Capacity Concerns Mr. Wab Kinew (Leader of the Official Opposition): Well, doctors are speaking out in more areas about this government's failure to get patients the care that they need.

Experts in orthopedic surgery from hospitals like the Grace are rejecting this Premier and her task force. They've written many letters to this government. Their stance is clear; they've been trying to get action for five years from this government. As a result of this gov ernment ignoring these surgeons, and I quote here, the Grace Hospital is struggling to offer a basic standard of care that is acceptable. End quote. They know the problem is with the Premier, and they're calling on her gov ernment to, quote, reverse our present course.

This letter, from a separate group of surgeons at the Grace, which I will now table, was written last November.

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1593 Why has the Premier ignored the doctors at the Grace Hospital for five years? * (14:00) Madam Speaker: The honour able First Minister. [interjection] Order. [interjection] Order. [interjection] Order. Order. Hon. Heather Stefanson (Premier): Well, Madam Speaker, I don't even know where to begin with this. The Leader of the Op position got up. In his previous set of questions, he talked about a letter that he tabled– which there is no letter that he tabled today, so I asked him to table it again in the Chamber. He's refused to do that.

He's now tabled another letter that isn't sign ed by anybody, Madam Speaker. Again, we're supposed to take this Leader of the Opposition seriously. I will say that we, on this side of the House, take the health care of Manitobans very seriously, and that's why we're investing more than $668 million more in health care in Manitoba today: a 9.2 per cent increase, when members opposite voted against that. We are investing in Manitobans. We're making sure that the patients get the health care that they need when they need it, Madam Speaker. [interjection] Madam Speaker: Order.

The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a supplementary question. Mr. Kinew: You know, Madam Speaker, the letter that I tabled is signed by surgeons who work at the Grace Hospital. We are protecting their identity – [interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mr. Kinew: –but, quite rightly, they fear reprisal at the hands of the Stefanson government. We've seen it time and time again, whether it was the former failed Health ministers who attacked doctors, or whether it was former failed Health ministers who attacked other front-line professionals.

And you can hear the glee in their voices right now, as they look to visit their revenge on more front-line staff who are speaking out. Here's a fact: the Grace surgeons tell us that the government is demanding that they cut joint replacements by 20 per cent. Why is the Premier telling surgeons at the Grace to cut surgeries by one fifth? Mrs. Stefanson: Well, Madam Speaker, once again the Leader of the Op position conti nues to put false information on the record in this Chamber. When it comes to the Grace Hospital, of course, Manitobans recall the previous NDP government.

When, in 2015, under the previous premier Selinger, Madam Speaker, where the Grace Hospital had among the longest wait times for emergency rooms in the country, according to the CIHI report, at that time. Manitobans don't want to go back to those dark days of the previous NDP gov ernment that denied them the health-care access in those ERs at the time. They went across rural Manitoba and shut down ERs in rural Manitoba, Madam Speaker. Manitobans don't want to go back to that. They want us to continue to make those invest ments in our health-care system, Madam Speaker, and that's exactly what we're doing.

Madam Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a final supplementary. Mr. Kinew: You know, it's really something to see a Premier so desper ate to try and distract from the damage she herself has caused to the Grace Hospital, first as a failed Health minister, and now as the Premier. That's what's happening right now. And now surgeons are speaking out as a result. [interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mr. Kinew: Just like the docs at the Misericordia, these surgeons at the Grace are tired of being ignored by this Stefanson gov ernment.

They write, and I quote, the proposal to increase surgical capacity at the Grace Hospital within its current footprint has been rejected. Unquote. That's shocking. We should be inve sting in the Grace Hospital, not making more cuts. Why did the Premier's government say no to more surgeries for hips and knees at the Grace Hospital? Mrs. Stefanson: Look, Madam Speaker, the Leader of the Opposi tion continues with these accusations where he has nothing to prove what he is talking about, once again.

And I will tell you that we are continuing to make those investments in our health-care system, including for orthopedic and surgical procedures, including hips and knees, Madam Speaker.

1594 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 The Leader of the Opposition, members opposite will know and Manitobans should know as well, that we recently announced a further ER at the Concordia Hospital, Madam Speaker, that will perform more than 1,000 more surgical procedures at the Concordia Hospital. That is 1,000 more procedures for surgical– for–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mrs. Stefanson: –knee re placements, Madam – [interjection] I know they want to laugh, Madam Speaker. We don't call this a laughing matter–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mrs.

Stefanson: –because those are surgeries that will be provided to Manitobans who are waiting in pain. And what did the members opposite do, Madam Speaker? When they were given the op portunity to vote in favour of this, they voted against it. We'll take no lessons from the member opposite. Grace Hospital Surgical Capacity Concerns MLA Uzoma Asagwara (Union Station): For years, we've been calling on this gov ernment to address issues at the Grace Hospital, and for years, this go v- ernment has failed to do anything. The Premier's incompetence is putting patients and hospital staff at risk.

Surgeons at the Grace Hospital signed a letter which says, and I quote: the Grace Hospital is struggling to offer a basic standard of care that is acceptable. End quote. This letter, Madam Speaker, was from November. Will the Premier stand in her place and tell Manitobans why she's failed to provide adequate sup- port for the Grace Hospital? Hon. Audrey Gordon (Minister of Health): Under the Greg Selinger NDP gov ernment, all their failed Health ministers were searching for a magic wand, Madam Speaker.

When they couldn't find it, they made sure to tell the current NDP opposition members that they should be tabling blank pieces of paper wit h no signatures, Madam Speaker; no proof that it has, in fact, come from who they say it's come from, because they have run out of ideas. Yesterday's NDP looks exactly the same as today's NDP. Madam Speaker: The honour able member for – [interjection] Order. A reminder to the member, too, that saying Greg Selinger NDP government is this–is, again, one of the statements that is not allowed in the House.

Can say Selinger government or NDP gov ernment, but can't put the two together. The honourable member for Union Station, on a supplementary question. MLA Asagwara: Madam Speaker, the minister would do well to actually take a look at that tabled document, because the surgeons actually sent it to her many, many months ago. And she knows that. Surgeons at the Grace Hospital says they have – say they have a moral and ethical respon sibility to speak out. They're concerned that this Premier and her government's incompetence is putting patient safety at risk and the quality of care at risk.

Rather than help, the PCs are demanding Grace doctors cut, and I quote, joint re placement appoint- ments by 20 per cent, end quote, and to tell patients that their surgeries are likely going to be cancelled. These issues have been going on since last November. Can the Premier explain why she's failed to address concerns from the doctors at the Grace? Ms. Gordon: Madam Speaker, I rise in the House today to thank all the health professionals at the Grace Hospital at all levels of that hospital: admin istration, doctors, nurses, allied health professional, support staff for your service to Manitobans.

I ap preciated the op portunity to be able to sit down with the nurses in the ER around the table of solutions, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, we have been working with phys- icians and site leaders at the Grace for some time now. Shared Health and the WRHA have been working very closely with them. They've approved addi tional physician resources for the site, as well as a hospital medical officer. Those are solutions. We will continue to move forward on Manitobans' behalf. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Union Station, on a final supplementary.

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1595 MLA Asagwara: Madam Speaker, you'll notice that in the minister's response, she made no mention of the surgeons at the Grace. * (14:10) Yet, last November, those very surgeons signed a letter addressed to this Minister of Health. They out - lined how the Grace was struggling to offer a basic standard of care that is acceptable, and they spoke out against these PC gov ernment's directives to cut joint appointments by 20 per cent and to cancel surgeries that Manitobans are depending on.

In this same letter, Grace doctors put f orward a solution to clear the backlog but, shockingly, it was rejected by this –these PCs and by this Minister of Health. Can the Premier (Mrs. Stefanson) explain why she's ignoring these surgeons at the Grace Hospital? Ms. Gordon: Again, we ask the opposition to table the letter that shows the letterhead from Grace Hospital, as well as the signatures of these surgeons that they are referring to, Madam Speaker. Until they do, I request that they discontinue making statements that are not factual and is not based on any evidence.

We continue to work with the surgeons and administration at Grace Hospital to ensure they have all the resources they need to provide exceptional care to Manitobans. Allied Health Professionals Strike Action Vote MLA Malaya Marcelino (Notre Dame): Madam Speaker, thousands of front -line health -care pro fes- sionals across 190 different health -care professions have voted in favour of a strike. This is an unprecedented mandate and it's a clear sign that they've had enough of this PC gov ernment.

They've had enough of a five -year wage freeze, enough of disrespect from Brian Pallister and now the Stefanson government. Why has this gov ernment forced allied health - care workers to vote in favour of a strike? Hon. James Teits ma (Minister of Consumer Protection and Government Services): Madam Speaker, few people believe the Leader of the Opposition when he says things. Turns out nobody really should and the same goes for questions on this and questions from the member, too, when they seem to think that these valued health-care workers won't be getting the raises. They will.

We are active at the negotiating table through Shared Health. Shared Health is taking the lead, as they should, as the employer. Every single collective bargaining agreement that's been reached within Health has included compounding increases. Every single collective bargaining agreement that's been reached within Health includes retroactive pay. I have every reason to believe that this one will, too. Shame on the members opposite for attempting to mislead Manitobans. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Notre Dame, on a supplementary question.

MLA Marcelino: The PCs are always trying to change the channel from their failure on our health-care system. If you live in rural Manitoba, paramedics had to vote in favour of a strike because they've had their wages frozen for five years. A wage freeze for five years during a cost-of-living crisis; that's the policy of this shameful PC government. On this side of the House, we respect allied health-care professionals. Why has the PC gov ernment failed to give them a fair deal? Mr.

Teitsma: Madam Speaker, if the op position really respects Manitobans and really respects Manitoba health -care workers, the y would be more honest with them, but, sadly, they aren't being honest with them. Now, I'll just remind the member on the issue at hand with regards to rural paramedics. For years, those paramedics, as well as Winnipeg paramedics, Brandon, asked the previous –Greg Selinger and his previous NDP government to regulate their profession, to create a administrative body for them. And they refused; they refused year after year. Which government showed respect for paramedics? This government did.

Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Notre Dame, on a final supplementary. MLA Marcelino: Everyone in Manitoba knows that this PC gov ernment does not respect collective bargaining, and everyone in Manitoba knows that they have made a mess of our prov incial health -care system. Paramedics in rural Manitoba, lab techs and X-ray techs, respiratory therapists and other allied health professionals have had their wages frozen for five

1596 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 years. That's during a cost -of-living crisis and that' s why 99 per cent of these health -care workers have voted to strike. Will the Premier (Mrs. Stefanson) give allied health-care workers a fair deal today? Mr. Teitsma: Madam Speaker, it is out of respect for Manitoba's health-care professionals, it's out of respect for our labour laws, it's out of respect for the bargaining process that we're allowing the bargaining process to proceed and to do so without interference.

Now, what the implication of what the members are saying opposite is that they woul d be happy to interfere in those negotiations. Shame on them for saying that. And I will once again start where I –or, finish where I started, which is to say that, when the Leader of the Opposi tion and this member claim that these members are somehow not going to receive retro- active pay, that they're somehow not going to receive compounding increases. Shame on them for misleading those union members. Shame on them for misleading all Manitobans. Manitoba's Crown Prosecutors Bargaining Contract Negotiations Mr.

Matt Wiebe (Concordia): Madam Speaker, Manitoba's Crown prosecutors are yet another group of provincial employees that are currently without a contract with this PC government. On top of that, they're underpaid relative to their colleagues in other provinces and they're overworked and understaffed, oftentimes with huge caseloads. Meanwhile, there are prosecutors languishing in tem- porary positions and others are off on stress leave. When will this government stop disrespecting our Crown prosecutors and bargain a fair contract with competitive wages? Hon.

James Teitsma (Minister of Consumer Protection and Government Services): It's sad to see that it's not just the Leader of the Op position and one of his NDP colleagues, but now a second that has joined their call for what they're attempting to ask us to do: to meddle and to inter fere in collective bar - gaining and to somehow disrupt that process, that well-established process. Now, that process is under way and–as it should be–and it continues. And I'm–I've been hearing from both sides that progress has been being made, and I'm optimistic that they'll be able to come to a reso lution soon.

Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Concordia, on a supplementary question. Mr. Wiebe: While this member is optimistic, violent crime is going up across the province, com munities feel less safe and this gov ernment has continued to disrespect our Crown prosecutors. Meanwhile, next door in Saskatchewan, Crown attorneys are paid as much as 19 per cent more than in Manitoba, and provinces like Ontario, Alberta, British Columbia are actively and success fully recruiting away Manitoba's senior Crown attorneys. For all the minister's talk, they haven't made a dent in filling these vacancies.

When will the PC gov ernment realize that com - petitive wages are integral to recruitment and retention initiatives? Mr. Teitsma: Well, I suppose it is a little bit of a unique day in the House here where finally members of the –members opposite are caring about public safety. Public safety has been a priority of our gov ern- ment–[interjection]–public safety has been a priority of our government. We defend the police, not like the members opposite, who would seek to defund them. We support our Crown attorneys.

We want to ensure that violent offenders are be - hind bars and that violent offenders face the conse - quences of their actions instead of making excuses for their own behaviour. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Concordia, on a final supplementary. Mr. Wiebe: Just words again from the minister while our justice system is in crisis because this PC govern- ment continually disrespects our Crown attorneys, keeping them without a competitive contract and a higher than normal vacancy rate.

Erik [phonetic] Dolcetti, the president of the Manitoba Association of Crown Attorneys, has said, quote: It's a vicious cycle, and we're going to keep losing people at this ra te if the Province doesn't do something to address the underlying issue, which is us being without a contract. * (14:20)

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1597 Why should anyone trust this PC gov ernment when they show such a disrespect for the Crown attorneys by failing to negotiate a fair contract? Hon. Kelvin Goertzen (Minister of Justice and Attorney General): Of course, we won't interfere in the contract negotiations, but I think the question that has to be asked is: Why would any Manitoban trust the NDP when it comes to violent crime?

Not speaking about their own members and the challenges they have with the justice system, but even talking about how they refer to the justice system: the member for Fort Garry (Mr. Wasyliw), who speaks about police in a derogatory way and says that they're wrong to call for bail reform; the member for St. Johns (MLA Fontaine), who says that the police shouldn't receive an additional penny to do their hard work. And contrast that with our Premier (Mrs.

Stefanson), who's leading the COF and leading all premiers across Canada and meeting this Friday virtually with police across the –Canada to address violent crime. Why would they trust them when it is our govern- ment actually taking action? Five-Year Review of Accessibility for Manitobans Act Request to Release Review Prior to Election MLA Nahanni Fontaine (St. Johns): The Accessibility for Manitobans Act was established in 2013 to re - move, reduce and prevent barriers to ensure Manitoba is accessible for everyone.

The act is required by law to be reviewed every five years, which is also this year, Madam Speaker. And we know what this year's review will tell us, and that is that this PC government has taken us down the wrong direction when it comes to supports for Manitobans living with disabilities. Will the minister do the right thing and commit to releasing the review of The Ac cessibility for Manitobans Act before the election? Hon. Rochelle Squires (Minister responsible for Accessibility): Our government has always stood up for ensuring that Manitoba's accessible for everyone.

And that is why we've committed to imple men- ting the standards and why we've committed to doing the review. Our gov ernment also instituted the Manitoba Ac cessibility Fund, which is a source of funding for all businesses and municipalities to ensure that they can make their place of busi ness accessible to everybody in Manitoba. Unlike members opposite–when they had the chance to vote in favour, in support of addi tional dollars for people with disabilities, what did they do? They voted against it. Shame on her. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for St. Johns, on a supplementary question.

MLA Fontaine: Madam Speaker, it's im portant that the minister releases the findings of The Accessibility for Manitobans Act before this coming election. Voters deserve to be fully informed on the PC gov- ernment's track record on Manitobans living with disabilities. And we already know what this report will find, and that is that the PCs have simply just not done enough for Manitobans living with dis abilities. They cut funding for day programming services while undermining important standards. Will the minister commit to releasing the review of The Ac cessibility for Manitobans Act before thi s coming election?

Ms. Squires: I'm very happy to update the House about our $104 million in additional monies this year alone into the CLDS program to ensure that people living with disabilities in our communities receive the utmost care and have a stable working sector. I would also like to inform the House that we are advancing $640 million towards the disability services programs in the province of Manitoba. In previous years when we have brought forward additional monies for people with –individuals with disabilities, what did they do? They voted against it.

They have no credibility when it comes to supporting people with disabilities. Our government listened and took action. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for St. Johns, on a final supplementary. MLA Fontaine: The PC gov ernment's track record on supports for Manitobans living with dis abilities speaks for itself. They've cut–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. MLA Fontaine: –supports, they've removed important standards. High support-worker turnover negatively im- pacts Manitobans living with dis abilities and their quality of life. That's what this year's accessibility for Manitobans review act will find.

1598 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 And that's why it's im portant that the minister should commit to releasing the findings before this election, so that Manitobans can be fully informed when they go to the voting polls. Will she commit to doing so today? Ms. Squires: This is in credibly shameful coming from this member. That member supported a government that had a $12-an-hour wage for people working in disabilities– $12 an hour.

And every year–every year–for the 17 years that they were in gov ernment, the com munity–the sector came to them and asked them for an additional increase to their wages; they did nothing. Madam Speaker, our gov ernment took those employees from $12–that's what the NDP was paying them–to $19 as of April 1st this year. We'll take no lessons from members opposite. Family Physician Shortage Recruitment and Retention Mr. Dougald Lamont (St.

Boniface): Yesterday we received an email from a member of the Manitoba Medical Group Management Association in Brandon who says the shortage of family physicians has reached crisis levels and that Shared Health's offshore physician recruitment project has serious short - comings. He said that Manitoba needs to step up because he's lost 12 doctors in the last three months and areas like Morden-Winkler are in big trouble.

According to Prairie Mountain Health, there are over 90 vacant positions for family physicians just in that RHA and Manitoba is lagging behind the initia - tives put forward by other provinces while paperwork is delaying certification for years. Will this government remove the red tape of the labour market survey, since we all Manitoba is hun- dreds of doctors short? Hon. Audrey Gordon (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, thank you for the oppor tunity to respond to the member for St.

Boniface and to share that last Friday, our government, through Shared Health, posted a request for proposal to recruit 150 new family physicians to this province: 50 for northern Manitoba, 50 for rural Manitoba and 50 for Winnipeg. This is in addition to 46 new physicians that have been hired and are p ractising since announcing the health human resource action plan on November 10th. This includes 30 family physicians, a cardiac surgeon, a neurologist and a neurosurgeon amongst many others, Madam Speaker. We are taking the steps necessary to address the physician shortage.

Madam Speaker: The honour able member for St. Boniface, on a supplementary question. Mr. Lamont: I table the letter in which the individual says that very program will not work. He says, without immediate support there will be further clinic closures and reduction in primary -care services, which will inevitably lead to more strain on our hospitals. I can provide the signature if they want. Our physicians have completed our –their own recruitment and we currently have four qualif ied physicians willing–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mr.

Lamont: –to come to Brandon and begin practising immediately for overseas. They are all held up in various levels of college and physicians and surgeons'– [interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mr. Lamont: –approval. We've been talking about doing a better job of recognizing foreign credentials for a generation in this province, but qualified doctors who want to work in Manitoba are tied up in red tape. What is the Premier (Mrs. Stefanson) going to do to put–to make sure that the College of Physicians and Surgeons changes course? Because it's only going to get better with a change in policy. Ms.

Gordon: I want to recog nize the work our gov - ernment and my department has been doing with the College of Physicians and Surgeons. We have worked with them to streamline and remove an exam that was required of many individuals who wanted to practise here in the province. And what the registrar said when this was an- nounced is that the exam was holding back many qualified internationally trained physicians from coming to the province, and this will pave the way for more internationally educated physicians to practise in Manitoba. I want to thank the College of Physicians and Surgeons.

More work to do, but we are committed to working together to get the job done.

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1599 Madam Speaker: The honour able member for River Heights, on a final supplementary. Children with Learning Disabilities Funding for Reading Programs Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Madam Speaker, learning disabilities have been forgotten by the current government, yet they are incredibly important. A Supreme Court of Canada ruled in 2012 that children with learning disabilities have a right to learn to read, using intensive methods if necessary. The Supreme Court said learning to read is a right, not a privilege, in the case of Moore v. British Columbia.

Yet , Manitoba is systematically failing many students with 'reasing'–reading disabilities. When will the government act to provide the fund- ing and the approach so that children with learning disabilities are not missed and so they are diagnosed early and given adequate help to be able to learn to read? Hon. Wayne Ewasko (Minister of Education a nd Early Childhood Learning): It gives me great pleasure to rise today to put a few words on the record in regards to students with disabilities.

I listened 'intentively' to the member's private members' statement earlier today in regards to students with disabilities and concur with the member that the former NDP government absolutely had no plan. We on this side of the House, Madam Speaker, are defin- itely working with our education partners. * (14:30) We know that there is no one-size-fits-all in regards to teaching for instruction for reading and that. We are working with our classroom teachers; we're working with our educa tion partners to make sure that we're receiving success for all students in this great province of ours, Madam Speaker.

Sale and Purchase of Bear Spray New Identification Requirements Mr. Rick Wowchuk (Swan River): Manitobans are rightfully worried about the dramatic increase of the unlawful use of bear spray in criminal activity . It's a regular occurrence to hear about it used either as a weapon in a robbery or thugs spraying individuals just for the sake of it. This is horrendous misuse of an im- portant tool designed to keep folks safe while they explore amazing wilderness areas. Can the Minister of Agri culture explain how we are cracking down on this criminal misuse of bear spray? Hon.

Derek Johnson (Minister of Agriculture): I want to thank my colleague from Swan River for that question. Our team on this side of the House, the Minister of Justice (Mr. Goertzen) and myself, take the misuse of bear spray very seriously, Madam Speaker. Along with showing gov ernment-issued ID, last week we also announced the changes will add the canister's serial number to the required data collected when the bear spray is purchased. This will not incon- venience legitimate purchasers, but will mean we can link each can sold to whomever purchased it.

We are focusing on how to crack down on those individuals that use this product criminally without impacting legitimate users for Manitoba. On this side of the House, we're making Manitoba safer, Madam Speaker. Conservation Officers Recruitment and Wages MLA Tom Lindsey (Flin Flon): Conservation officers are 'intregal' to ensuring Manitobans are able to safely hunt, fish and other outdoor things like that. Previously we've shown FIPPA documents that the PCs still have not filled the con servation officer vacancies. The minister may claim that they want to add new positions, but sadly they have not.

When will this minister actually commit to hiring new con servation officers and getting them in the field? Hon. Greg Nesbitt (Minister of Natural Resources and Northern Development): On this side of the House, we're–very, very much support our conserva- tion officers. That's why we've recently recruited nine officers. They're away for training now, and we expect them to be in the service later this fall. Our conservation officer service was decimated under the NDP. We've taken steps to rebuild it. We'll look after our conserva tion officers moving forward now and into the future. Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: I think there's probably–there was one minute–or one second still showing. So, I'm going to allow the m ember for Flin Flon to ask his supple - mentary question.

1600 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 MLA Lindsey: Manitobans don't trust this PC gov - ernment when it comes to protecting our environment or our natural resources. The Natural Resources Minister has said that, quote, we'll certainly be close to Saskatchewan in the end and comparative with Alberta, as well, when it comes to the salaries for COs. Well, we all know that this is not actually the case. For all the minister's talk, the miniscule increases that they've given won't come close to getting them any - where close to the salary of Saskatchewan or Alberta.

How can anyone believe this PC gov ernment when they ignore the fact that conservation officers are paid so much less? Will the minister commit to actually paying them competitive salaries to attract more officers? Mr. Nesbitt: As the member will know, the conser - vation officers are represented by a union. My under- standing is that the contract ended March 31st and they're currently in negotiations, so I'm not going to comment on that.

What I will say, though, is that we've invested $1.7 million for protective clothing, safety equipment, tactical tools and communi cations technology so the service can carry out its duties effectively. We've also committed $300,000 to a helicopter contract to catch poachers with infrared technology. We're–we've got much more to come. Stay tuned. Madam Speaker: The time for oral questions has expired. PETITIONS Punjabi Bilingual Programs in Public Schools Mr. Nello Altomare (Transcona): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) According to census 2021, Punjabi is the fourth most spoken language in Canada, and there are 33,315 people in Manitoba whose native language is Punjabi.

(2) Thousands of Punjabi newcomers are coming to Manitoba as students and as immigrants, looking to call this province home. People of Punjabi origin contribute a great deal to the social and economic dev- elopment of Canada and Manitoba in fields such as education, science, health, business and politics.

(3) In coming to Manitoba, Punjabi new comers make sacrifices, including distance from their cultural roots and language. Many Punjabi parents and families want their children to retain their language and keep a continued cultural appreciation.

(4) Manitoba has many good bilingual programs in public schools for children and teens available in other languages, including French, Ukrainian, Ojibwe, Filipino, Cree, Hebrew and Spanish. Punjabi bilingual programs for children and teens, as well as Punjabi language instruction, at a college and univer- sity level could similarly teach and maintain Punjabi language and culture.

(5) Punjabi bilingual instruction w ill help cross - cultural friendships, relationships and marriages and prepare young people to be multilingual professionals. We therefore petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the prov incial government to take steps to im plement Punjabi bilingual programs in public schools similar to existing bilingual programs and take steps to implement Punjabi language instruction in other levels of education in Manitoba. This petition is signed by Prabhjot Singh, Chandeep Kaur and R ajdeep Kaur as well as many other Manitobans.

Madam Speaker: In accordance with our rule 133(6), when petitions are read they are deemed to be received by the House. Afghan Refugees in Manitoba Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. The background to this petition is as follows: Since the takeover of Afghanistan by the Taliban in August 2021, Afghan citizens and their families have been subjected to persecution and human rights atrocities because of their faith, gender and former associations with organizations thought to be friendly with the previous government and its allies.

This abuse has taken the form of public assaults, kidnappings and killings. Many Afghans have left or are attempting to leave Afghanistan to find safe refuge in neighbouring coun- tries. This undertaking is difficult due to the Taliban's activities and their presence in countries like Pakistan. Many Afghans who are looking to leave Afghanistan and come to Canada are educated and ex perienced and, as such, would prove to be a –valuable assets to Manitoba, considering its current labour shortages and challenges to its economy.

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1601 Educated Afghans have usually studied for four to six years in a specific field of study and spent a sig- nificant amount of time and money for that education. However, these people still face barriers to obtaining employment in their field of expertise, as Canada has very strict rules regarding the use o f that edu cation and experience. Many Afghans are refugees in other countries and are currently jobless, which is an added barrier for them under the current criteria of the Prov incial Nominee Program.

Some Afghan newcomers who face literacy issues because they came from a non -developed country would benefit from an in-depth informational course to assist them with acclimation into Canadian lifestyles. The Interim Federal Health Program provides limited, temporary coverage of health-care benefits to refugees who aren't eligible for prov incial or territorial health insurance.

However, the refugee must apply for discretionary coverage and provide a list of com - pelling personal circumstances in order to qualify, but for urgent medical circumstances, such as root canals, unanticipated life-threatening and emergency medical conditions. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the prov incial government to work with the federal government to prioritize the evacuation of the immediate and extended family of Afghans who now call Canada home, and to facilitate their coming to Manitoba, including helping Afghan refugees in other countries such as Pakistan.

To urge the provincial government to expand the Manitoba Prov incial Nominee Program and re - evaluate the accreditation of edu cation and jobs to assure–ensure all immigrants and refugees can utilize their skills more easily and readily in work for –in Manitoba for work. To urge the provincial government to have fewer rigid criteria for Afghans under the Prov incial Nominee Program, and having a connection to Manitoba, family members or friends should be a key criteria.

To urge the prov incial gov ernment to enhance adequate acclimation services for newcomers through community-based support programs and increase their health-care coverage to meet their urgent health- care necessities. Signed by Nigar Irandost, Qatawesh [phonetic] , Fazel Irandost and many others. Punjabi Bilingual Programs in Public Schools MLA Uzoma Asagwara (Union Station): I wish to present the following petition to the Legis lative Assembly. The background–sorry, to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba –the background to this petition is as follows:

(1) According to census 2021, Punjabi is the fourth most spoken language in Canada and there are 33,315 people in Manitoba whose native language is Punjabi.

(2) Thousands of Punjabi newcomers are coming to Manitoba as students and as immigrants, looking to call this province h ome. People of Punjabi origin– [interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. MLA Asagwara: –contribute a great deal to the social and economic development of Canada and Manitoba in fields such as edu cation, science, health, busi ness and politics.

(3) In comi ng to Manitoba, Punjabi new comers make sacrifices, including distance from their cultural roots and language. Many Punjabi parents and families want their children to retain their language and keep a continued cultural appreciation.

(4) Manitoba has many good bilingual programs in public schools for children and teens available in other languages, including French, Ukrainian, Ojibwe, Filipino, Cree, Hebrew and Spanish. Punjabi bilingual programs for children and teens as well as Punjabi language instruction at a college and uni ver- sity level could similarly teach and maintain Punjabi language and culture.

(5) Punjabi bilingual instruction will help cross - cultural friendships, relationships and marriages, and prepare young people to be multilingual professionals. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the prov incial government to take steps to implement Punjabi bilingual programs in public schools similar to existing bilingual programs and to take steps to implement Punjabi language instruction in other levels of education in Manitoba. This has been signed by Lori Brar, Manveer Kaur, Fateh Singh and many other Manitobans.

1602 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 Provincial Road 224 Ms. Amanda Lathlin (The Pas-Kameesak): I wish to present the follow ing petition to the Legis lative Assembly. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) Provincial Road 224 serves Peguis First Nation, Fisher River Cree Nation and surrounding communities. This road is in need of substantial repairs.

(2) The road has been in poor condition for years and has numer ous potholes, uneven driving surfaces and extremely narrow shoulders.

(3) Due to recent popula tion growth in the area, there has been increased vehicle and pedestrian use of Provincial Road 224.

(4) Without repair, Prov incial Road 224 will continue to pose a hazard to the many Manitobans who use it on a regular basis.

(5) Concerned Manitobans are requesting that Provincial Road 224 be assessed and repaired urgently to improve safety for its users. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the Minister of Infrastructure to complete an assessment of Provincial Road 224 and implement the appropriate repairs using public funds as quickly as possible. Madam Speaker, this petition has been signed by many, many fine Manitobans. Ekosi. Security System Incentive Program Mr. Jim Maloway (Elmwood): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. The background of this petition is as follows:

(1) Cities across Canada and the United States, including Chicago; Washington DC; Salinas, California; and Orillia, Ontario, are offering home security rebate programs that enhance public safety and allow for more efficient use of their policing resources.

(2) Home security surveillance systems protect homes and businesses by potentially deterring burglaries.

(3) Whole neighbourhoods benefit when more homes and businesses have these security systems.

(4) A 2022 Angus Reid Institute poll fou nd 70 per cent of Winnipeggers surveyed believed crime had increased over the last five years, the highest percentage found among cities in Canada.

(5) The same survey reported half of Winnipeggers polled do not feel safe walking alone at night, and almost 20 per cent of them said they were a victim of police-reported crime in the last two years.

(6) Although the public understands what the criminologists and com munity advocates point to as the main drivers of crime, namely the larger issues of lack of food, addictions and poverty, they support rebate programs like these as they help the most vul - nerable in our com munity by removing financial barriers for personal protection.

We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to work with municipalities to establish a province-wide tax rebate or other incentive program to encourage residents and businesses to purchase approved home and busi ness security protection systems. This petition's signed by many, many Manitobans. Madam Speaker: Grievances? ORDERS OF THE DAY (Continued) GOVERNMENT BUSINESS House Business Hon. Kelvin Goertzen (Government House Leader): On a couple of matters of House business.

Pursuant to rule 34(7), I'm announcing that the private member's resolution to be considered on the next Tuesday of private members' busi ness will be one previously put forward by the honourable member for Dauphin (Mr. Michaleski). The title of the resolution is Calling on the Federal Government to Absorb the Cost of Increased RCMP Salaries. Madam Speaker: It has been announced that the private member's resolution to be considered on the next Tuesday of private members' busi ness will be one previously put forward by the honourable member for Dauphin.

The title of the resolu tion is Calling on the Federal Government to Absorb the Cost of Increased RCMP Salaries.

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1603 Mr. Goertzen: I'd like to announce that the Standing Committee on Legis lative Affairs will meet on Monday, April 24th, 2023, at 12 p.m. to review The Advocate for Children and Youth Act, as required by

section 40 of that act. Madam Speaker: It has been announced that the Standing Committee on Legislative Affairs will meet on Monday, April 24th, 2023, at 12 p.m. to review The Advocate for Children and Youth Act, as required by

section 40 of that act. * * * Mr. Goertzen: Madam Speaker, for this afternoon, and any further time there needs, could we please continue with second reading debate and votes on specified bills 10, 23, 26, 29, 2 and 24. Madam Speaker: It has been announced that the House will consider second reading of the following specified bills: 10, 23, 26, 29, 2 and 24.

SECOND READINGS Bill 10–The Liquor, Gaming and Cannabis Control Amendment Act (Social Responsibility Fee Repealed) Madam Speaker: So, I will therefore call second reading of Bill 10, The Liquor, Gaming and Cannabis Control Amendment Act (Social Responsibility Fee Repealed). Hon. Cliff Cullen (Minister of Finance): I move, seconded by the Minister of Labour and Immigration (Mr. Reyes), that Bill 10, The Liquor, Gaming and Cannabis Control Amendment Act (Social Responsibility Fee Repealed), be now read a second time and be referred to a committee of this House.

Her Honour the Lieutenant Governor has been advised of the bill, and I table the message. Madam Speaker: It has been moved by the honour - able Minister of Finance, seconded by the honourable Minister of Labour and Immigration, that Bill 10, The Liquor, Gaming and Cannabis Control Amendment Act (Social Responsibility Fee Repealed), be now read a second time and be referred to a com mittee of this House. Her Honour the Lieutenant Governor has been advised of the bill, and the message is tabled. Mr.

Cullen: Madam Speaker, this bill amends The Liquor, Gaming and Cannabis Control Act in order to repeal the social responsibility fee on cannabis retail- ers operating here in Manitoba. * (14:50) The social responsibility fee ensured that cannabis retailers contributed to the social cost associated with cannabis legalization, including increased health costs, public education and addiction services. Mr. Andrew Micklefield, Deputy Speaker, in the Chair After a few years, the cannabis market has matured considerably.

The regula tory and social cost to the province have now stabilized, opening up the possi - bility of repealing the social respon sibility fee. Repealing the social responsibility fee will continue to reduce legal cannabis costs to consumers looking to switch from the illegal market. And once the sociability fee is repealed, Manitoba will have one of the lowest cannabis taxation regimes in Canada. This initiative is another step towards our govern- ment's goal of supporting legal cannabis operators as they compete with and displace the illicit cannabis market in Manitoba. Thank you very much, Mr. Deputy Speaker.

Questions Mr. Deputy Speaker: A question period of up to 15 minutes will be held. Questions can be addressed to the minister by any member in the following sequence: first by an opposi tion member–an official opposition critic or designate; subsequent quest ions asked by critics or designates from other recognized opposition parties; subsequent questions asked by each independent member; remaining questions asked by any opposition members. And no question or answer shall exceed 45 seconds. The floor is open for questions. Mr. Adrien Sala (St.

James): I'd like to ask the minister if he'll disclose to Manitobans how much revenue was generated through the social responsi - bility fee over the last fiscal year. Hon. Cliff Cullen (Minister of Finance): We anticipate the revenue generated on an annual basis over the past year will be approximately $10 million. Mr. Sala: I'd like to ask the minister if he can share how much of that $10 million that was collected was actually spent on social responsibility-related items. Mr. Cullen: Obviously, when we got into the discussion about legalizing cannabis, we recog nized there was going to be regula tory costs.

There was going to be health-care costs and the potential of policing costs as well, and, quite frankly, education costs.

1604 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 So we did put a lot of money into all of those areas upfront and over the last few years. We –recognizing some of those costs are actually going down. The regulatory costs associated with the Liquor, Gaming and Cannabis Authority have remained relatively con- stant in the million -dollars area, and part of that budget includes education as well. It's a detailed answer to the question. May seem like a simple question, but it is a detailed– Mr. Deputy Speaker: Minister's time has expired. Mr.

Sala: I'd like to, again, give the minister an opportunity to share with this House how much of those $10 million were actually invested in social responsibility-related items. Mr. Cullen: I think maybe the member should also recognize that there' s a fee assessed by Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries in terms of the wholesale com - ponent. And Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries, in terms of their net income, have to invest 2 per cent of that back into social responsi bility fees. So we would have to have a discussion with Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries in terms of some of the revenue that was gleaned through the cannabis sales.

And the exact programs that went into the– Mr. Deputy Speaker: Minister's time has expired. Mr. Sala: I do appreciate that the minister is sort of sharing information more broadly about L -G-C and some of the funds they're collecting for this, but the question specifically was about funds collected as part of the social responsi bility fee, which is what we're here to discuss today. So, could the minister please offer infor mation– I've asked him about this year, related to the $10 million that were collected. We know $8 million was collect- ed in the last fiscal.

Can he share how much of those $8 million were invested in social responsibility-related items? Mr. Cullen: Mr. Deputy Speaker, I don't have the exact figures at my fingertips, but I will certainly will undertake to get that infor mation that the member is asking about. Mr.

Sala: I have to say it's–given we're here discussing a bill which proposes to repeal the social responsi - bility fee, which I think the average Manitoban would presume or assume that that means that we're not spending those dollars or that there isn't another good use for those dollars, that the minister would come today prepared to share with the House how much was actually spent. So I have to say that's quite concerning that the minister is not prepared. We are here to discuss a bill that proposes to repeal a fee.

I think Manitobans would expect that a minister would come to that discussion prepared to discuss how much money his gov ernment has spent on that. So I'd like to, maybe, I guess, given it's clear that they haven't spent those dollars, we'll move on to another area of questioning. Will cannabis sales now– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The member's time has expired. Mr. Cullen: I guess that's why we're here today, quite frankly, is this legis lation is actually repealing the social responsibility fee.

Clearly, we didn't know what we were getting into when we–the federal government asked us to come up with a framework to legalize cannabis; we didn't know what those costs were going to be. And we set up a framework here in Manitoba. Again, revenue that's generated by Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries, 2 per cent of the net income from Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries is used in terms of social responsibility programming. We have set aside about a million dollars on the regula tory front through the Liquor, Gaming and Cannabis Author ity. Certainly, that's the regulatory piece of it.

There's also an education component to that– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The minister's time has expired. Mr. Sala: So we know the minister and his gov ern- ment have been collecting revenues from small busi- nesses that they apparently haven't been using and have no idea how much they've been spending. I'd like to ask, in relation to the federal excise tax, we do know that the gov ernment has been collecting 25 cents on every gram of marijuana sold in this pro- vince and holding those dollars back for many years.

I'd like to ask the minister, what has happened to those dollars, and what does his government intend to do with those revenues that were collected? Mr. Cullen: Yes, so the 25 cents that the me mber's alluding to is actually a federal excise tax. That's the federal government is collecting that tax, so you could ask the NDP-Liberal coalition what they're doing with that 25 cents.

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1605 Mr. Sala: The minister just stated that they're collecting that tax. Can the minister state on record whether or not the federal gov ernment is currently collecting an excise tax on marijuana sales in Manitoba? Mr. Cullen: That's, in fact, true. The federal govern- ment are collecting a 25 cents–sorry–25-cents-per-gram excise tax to the federal government. A lot of other jurisdictions are moving into agree- ments with the federal govern ment. That is where we're proposing to go as well.

Then there would be – once we get to sign that agree ment, there would be probably 75 cents coming back to the Province of Manitoba. So we're having discussions with the federal govern- ment on the excise tax component. The federal govern- ment is currently tweaking the rules around that, so we're allowing them to go through their process before we sign an agreement with them. Mr. Sala: It's extremely confusing.

At the beginning he confirmed that they were collecting the excise tax, and then at the end of the response, he said that they're actually in discussions with the federal government to determine how that tax would be collected. So I'll just go to the–we do know that there is no excise tax which is currently being applied or collected by the federal government. This current government is collecting those funds and keeping them in an account somewhere, maybe applying those towards other expenses, as they can sometimes be known to do.

I'll give the minister an op portunity to share: what's the total value of the excise taxes that they've collected and put away in an account? * (15:00) Mr. Cullen: The Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries are collecting a 75-cents-per-gram tax currently that goes to Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries. And if the minister wants to come back in the Estimates process or during a period, we can h ave a discussion with Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries in terms of what that particular dollar figure is. I don't mind having that same discussion with Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries and see what –in terms of what that value is. Mr.

Sala: I think the important question here is that, just like with the social responsibility fee, which we've seen this gov ernment has been collecting lots of dollars through that but hasn't been spending, it's the same thing that we're seeing here with the excise tax. We know they've been collecting these funds; we have no idea how much that is. We have no idea how much they're planning on sending to the federal gov ernment, if and when that agreement is signed with them. That's a concern–more secrecy, more lack of transparency, more of the same with the PCs.

What measures are being taken to use reve nues from the social respon sibility fee to address the addictions crisis in Manitoba? Mr. Cullen: Well, I think we have to make sure we 'differention' between the social respo nsibility fee, which we are eliminating to Manitobans and Manitoba retailers. We're hoping that Manitobans will respond by purchasing more of the legal cannabis as opposed to the illegal. That is why we're making changes, now that we fully understand so me of the extra costs that Manitobans are –Manitoba, as a gov ernment, are facing.

I will say, revenue, again, goes through the Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries Cor poration. They are collecting a 9 per cent surcharge on that, also collect- ing 75 cents per gram. They are mandated to provide 2 per cent of their net income– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The minister's time has expired. Mr. Sala: I'd like to offer the minister an opportunity to clarify. So, the funds that have been collected over the last year, we know last fiscal, $8 million; this year, $10 million. The minister has failed to be able to offer up even a single example of how those funds are being spent.

So I would like the minister, as the Minister of Finance (Mr. Cullen), to clarify for the House: What happens to the remainder of those funds that were collected from small Manitoban busi nesses? Have they gone back and have been applied toward general revenue? Where have those dollars gone? Mr. Cullen: Yes, that money goes back to general revenue so that we can make a record and historic investments in health care. I reflect on the $668 million in health care to deal with some of the challenges we're facing in the health- care front.

1606 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 I also point to record investments in mental health and addictions, and increased programming that we've brought forward in this year's budget. That money can be used for those goods and services as well. So that money is going back into general revenue that can be used for pro gramming for Manitobans facing addictions and other mental health challenges. Mr. Sala: I appreciate that the minister's clarifying that he's using reve nues from that fee towards pur - poses that they weren't intended for, and it's good to see them come clean on that.

I would like to give the minister an op portunity, although he wasn't able to talk about it at a higher level, to offer the House one single example of how they invested those social responsi bility fees in any - thing that helped to make Manitobans safer from–safe from addic tions or make Manitobans safer, as it relates to cannabis sales. Mr. Cullen: Well, I can point to a number of under - takings that our gov ernment had since back in 2019 when cannabis was legalized here in Manitoba.

And, clearly, our Liquor, Gaming and Cannabis Authority did tre mendous amount of advertising to warn about the dangers of cannabis use, especially among youth, especially among those that were driving. Liquor and gaming and cannabis authority had an advertising campaign. Manitoba Liquor & L otteries also had an advertising campaign warning about the dangers of consuming cannabis. The Gov ernment of Manitoba itself undertook advertising campaigns to warn against the issues around cannabis use– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The minister's time has expired. [interjection] Are there any further questions? Hon.

Jon Gerrard (River Heights): It's my under- standing that the social responsibility fee was to address major problems, which the government expected in the social structure of Manitoba as a re sult of the intro - duction of cannabis. Can the minister tell us whether there were signi- ficant social problems as a result of the intro duction of cannabis and what did the gov ernment do about them? Mr. Cullen: Yes, the premise behind the question and the premise behind esta blishing the social responsi - bility fee was that we were getting into an area that we really didn't know anything about.

Cannabis hadn't been legalized in this country. So we did set aside a fee to undertake, to mitigate some of the damages that could occur. I would say, luckily, hopefully, some of our advertising invest - ments had paid off. We didn't see as many broad repercussions of cannabis once it was legalized as we thought might occur. So I would think our campaigns ha d been relatively successful in that regard. We've come to a stabilization in the market– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The minister's time has expired. Mr. Gerrard: I'm glad that the minister admitted that the government had no idea what it was doing when it started.

But I'm also pleased to hear that there weren't the massive social upheavals and problems that the government had wondered and figured might happen. And it is, you know, many people at this point review this social responsibility fee as a tax and as a problem, that the government has attacked small busi- nesses. So I'll give the minister a chance to talk more about the problems which didn't occur and what, in fact– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The member's time has expired. Mr. Cullen: I thank the member; I think he approves of our eliminating the social responsibility fee.

Obviously, our goal now is to make sure that we– those Manitobans that wish to consume cannabis use the legal stream as opposed to the illegal stream, which we think will be more safer for them. So we're excited about bringing in this reduction and elimination in the social responsibility fee, which we think will make –will help retailers as well and make it more competitive for them. So I know some of them are struggling, and then they certainly were strong proponents of eliminating the social responsi - bility fee. Thank you. Mr. Deputy Speaker: The time for questions has expired. Debate Mr.

Deputy Speaker: The floor is open for debate. Are there any –is there anybody who wishes to speak to this bill? Mr. Adrien Sala (St. James): It's great to have an opportunity to put some words on the record about Bill 10, which, of course, proposes to repeal the

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1607 requirement that a social responsibility fee be collect- ed from cannabis store operators. I do want to start by just saying upfront a thank you to my colleague, Lisa Naylor, who recently has done a great job engaging with– Mr. Deputy Speaker: Order. Just a correction to the member: you cannot refer to another member of the House by their first or full or surname, only by their constituency or portfolio. Mr. Sala: I apologize, Mr. Deputy Speaker. Thank you very much.

I would like to thank my colleague, the MLA for Wolseley, for their work in engaging with cannabis retailers. I know, as of late, she's had a lot of meetings with retailers throughout the sector to learn about their perspective on the social responsi bility fee, to learn about their concerns about some of the things that are happening right now within our cannabis sector. And many of the problems that they're facing right now as a result of some of the decisions that this government has made in terms of how they've gone about setting up cannabis sales in Manitoba. So I do want to thank her for her work.

And I do also want to thank those retailers myself. I've had that oppor tunity to have many discussions, along with some of my colleagues, to learn about the challenges and the ways that this social responsibility fee has impacted them. So I do want to state upfront that this bill does take us in the right direction, but there are some very important concerns that need to be mentioned when talking about the repeal of the social responsibility fee on cannabis.

The first question that we really need to focus on here and raise–and which of course we didn't really hear the minister take any account ability on–is a question of why gov ernment has waited so long to remove a fee which they weren't u sing for the pur - poses for which it was intended. * (15:10) And we know that in 2019, which was the first year that these funds began to be collected, from 2019, 2020, 2021 and now 2022, the amount of funds that were collected through this fee have conti nued to grow and grow and grow, of course, as cannabis sales have continued to grow in Manitoba.

And we know in the 2021 fiscal year, as was men- tioned during questioning, the gov ernment collected $8 million total through this fee, and we did hear the minister today share that they are expecting to collect over $10 million in relation of this social respon si- bility fee for 2022. Now, we did hear again, clearly, the minister state he was not able to offer any examples of how this gov- ernment has been spending those dollars.

So it's clear the minister, on record today, outlined that, for years now, the government has been taking these reve nues and has not made a decision, ultimately, to spend those dollars on things related to social responsibility. So there's a very real question here, Mr. Deputy Speaker, about this form of taxation without any rela- tion to a particular expenditure. And we've seen this government do this for years, and that's certainly been a concern.

And the reason it's been s uch a concern is because there's been a complete and total lack of trans- parency around how they've managed this file, and specifically how they've managed questions related to this social responsibility fee. We know that for years the retailers, and , of course, others have been forced to resort to freedom of infor mation requests to get clarity over dollars collected, to get –to attempt to get clarity over how those dollars were spent. And, unfortunately, not a lot of clarity was gained. We still do n't really have any understanding about how much of that money was actually spent.

And today–and I would again say that it's quite concerning that the minister respon sible for this file didn't come today to the House prepared to share with members and to share with Manitobans just how much money they've actually spent on social responsi bility given their government is proposing to repeal that fee. So it does appear that they have been just simply absorbing those fees to pad their bottom line. The minister said some nice things about what they were investing it on.

We, of course, know that this govern- ment has been busy making cuts to health care, unlike what the minister suggested they were doing with these fees. So we've seen, again, just years and years of con- tinued secrecy about what they've done with these fees, and that's created no shortage of challenges for retailers, and a lot of confusion for Manitobans. So this is really part of a pattern, Mr. Deputy Speaker. This failure to be transparent, this pattern of secrecy. This is some thing that Manitobans have unfortunately become accustomed to when it comes to this Conservative government.

1608 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 And we know that, you know, not only are we seeing–have we seen secrecy as it relates to the way that these dollars were spent, but we've seen the same pattern of a lack of trans parency and secrecy in a number of other instances. I can think of two right off the top of my head.

One was when the federal gov ernment sent $40 million to support im provements to efficiency, home efficiency, for Manitobans to help them save some dollars and to reduce their energy bills, and we know that that $40 million was sent to the Province of Manitoba and mysteriously went into a black box. It was supposed to go towards adding to the pro- grams that were offered by –in our case, Efficiency Manitoba, to help Manitobans, again, save money and to improve efficiencies in their home by supporting home retrofits. But, instead, those dollars were never spent in that way. They disappeared into a black box.

Again, as with many things, we asked the government about those dollars, the way that they were spent. We asked for some record about–records to prove that they spent them in a way that the federal govern- ment had expected them to spend those dollars. And, unfortunately, they weren't able to provide that, and that's because they know that the government didn't use those dollars as they were supposed to. They did what they often do, and they shroud everything in secrecy, and they absorb those dollars, and, again, just did what they've always done, which is continue to make cuts to programs across the province.

Another example off the top of my head: everyone in this House will remember that the federal government sent approximately $85 million to Manitoba to support the im provement of safety in our schools throughout COVID –to make our schools safer, to improve ventilation, $85 million that was supposed to go towards supporting the im provement of safety in our schools. Unfortunately, again, this is another example where this government was in receipt of a significant amount of funds, and Manitobans unfortunately have no clarity as to how those funds were spent.

We certainly know that they were not spent in improving safety in our schools. We haven't seen any evidence of that. We haven't seen this government speak to any of those investments or given–give us any evidence to suggest that they have made those investments. And so, again, yet another example of dollars coming to the province and then disappearing in a black box and then no account ability on the part of this government as to what they've done with those funds. So, there's a pattern here, Mr. Deputy Speaker.

It's a pattern of collecting funds for a specific purpose and then misusing those funds in secret, behind the curtain where Manitobans, unfortunately, have no visibility. That's what they've come to expect when it comes to this PC government, this concerning pattern. And, look, that's what Manitobans have ultimately become accustomed to. It's very sad to say, Mr. Deputy Speaker, but when we're out in com munities and we speak with people, that's what we hear from people. They have become trained to think that this gov ern- ment will do things in secret, that they're behaving in a way that's non -transparent.

And that's where Manitobans are at. And, ultimately, Manitobans deserve a lot of better. They deserve to be able to know that they can trust in their government. They deserve to have a gov- ernment that they can believe in and that they know will do what they say they're going to do, and that they know when they make an announcement will actually follow through on an announce ment, or they know when they collect funds for a specific purpose that they'll actually use those funds for that purpose. And, if not, they'll pivot and maybe make a better decision.

So today, you know, I–we know the government is trying to position this as a gift to those in the cannabis sector. The reality is those in this sector have been burdened with this fee for many years that, apparently, was not being used at all for the purposes for which it was intended. Lack of transparency. No ability to trust this gov- ernment. That's a shame. This takes us steps in the right direction. Unfor - tunately, this bill is being brought forward under a pall of a huge lack of trust and confidence in this govern- ment. I thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, for the oppor - tunity to offer words here. Hon.

Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Mr. Deputy Speaker, a few comments on this bill, which removes the social respon sibility fee from cannabis –from the sale of cannabis. Now, a number of years ago, quite a number of years ago, the gov ernment intro duced the social responsibility fee on cannabis sales, and this was at the time that cannabis sales were legalized in Canada. The social respon sibility fee, as we were told at the

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1609 time, was put on the sale of cannabis in order to have dollars to address the expected widespread social problems that the Conservative government expected to be rampant when cannabis was legalized. In fact, as the minister indicated in his comments today, he acknowl edged that the gov ernment didn't really know what it was doing. Further, following the introduction of cannabis, there wasn't the widespread social disruption that the gov ernment had initially expected.

And so, over time, the small businesses who were selling cannabis saw that there wasn't the wide - spread social disruption that the gov ernment, in its approach, had expected. And, of course, they began to question what the gov ernment is doing in collecting this money. It was seen, in creasingly, as a tax. There was no evidence that the government was using the money to address social issues as they had promised. In fact, as– we have seen in the last few years that many of the social issues in Manitoba have got worse and not better.

And certainly, where we are now, the small businesses–and I think rightly so –see this law as an attack on the small busi nesses and there's clearly a conflict between this govern ment and legitimate Manitoba businesses. * (15:20) And the gov ernment was sending this message: we just want to collect money from you. We're not going to tell you where we're going to spend it on. We're not telling you that this is a legitimate ad - dressing social respon sibility as we –as the gov ern- ment had tried to claim.

And so, here we are today, and the government is confessing that it made a mistake in putting this fee on in the first place and is now taking it away, and so we will watch with interest. We're going to support this legislation because the gov ernment still hasn't pro - vided any evidence that the money is going to address these social issues that they said that it was going to address.

Indeed, although there are plenty of social issues in Manitoba, they don't seem to have dramatically increased with cannabis, although some of them have increased because we don't have a government which knows what it's doing in a number of areas, including addressing and helping–trying to help those who are experiencing homelessness, as an example. The government, instead of trying to help people as soon as they become homeless, is only spending money to address the situation once they are chronically home- less for at least six months.

And this is an odd way to go, but it means that we've got a lot of people who are homeless for quite some time in Manitoba. In any event, en ough said about this bill. We're going to support it and we look forward to it moving forward. We look forward to comments that may be said at the committee stage, and we'll move on and I expect move on to the next bill shortly. Thank you. Mr. Deputy Speaker: Is the House ready for the question? Some Honourable Members: Question. Mr.

Deputy Speaker: The question before the House is second reading of Bill 10, The Liquor, Gaming and Cannabis Control Amendment Act (Social Responsibility Fee Repealed). Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion? [Agreed] I declare the motion carried. Bill 23–The Vulnerable Persons Living with a Mental Disability Amendment Act Mr. Deputy Speaker: As previously announced, we will now move to Bill 23, The Vul nerable Persons Living with a Mental Disability Amendment Act. Hon. Rochelle Squires (Minister responsible for Accessibility): I move, seconded by the Minister of Health (Ms.

Gordon), that Bill 23, The Vul nerable Persons Living with a Mental Disability Amendment Act; Loi modifiant la

Loi sur les personnes vulnérables ayant une déficience mentale, be now read a second time and be referred to a com mittee of this House. Motion presented. Ms. Squires: Bill 23 addresses several recom men- dations made by the Vul nerable Persons Living with a Mental Dis ability Task Force. The task force was appointed in September of 2020 by the minister of Families to review policies and practices related to services for adults living with intellectual dis abilities in Manitoba.

The undertaking of such a serious task was accom- plished, thanks to the dedication, efforts and expertise of a nine -member team of com munity experts who researched, studied and consulted widely on signi fi- cant issues affecting adults living with an intellectual disability.

1610 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 In December of '21, a final report titled Pathways to Dignity: Rights, Safeguards, Planning and Decision Making was released alongside a series of recommen- dations and a two- year implementation plan. Several aspects of the task force recommendations touched on legislation. The proposed amendments before you are a reflection of changes to the act that were recom - mended by these community experts.

The Vul nerable Persons Living with a Mental Disability Act came int o force in 1996 as a way to meet the needs of a distinct population of adults living with an intellectual dis ability who were previously covered by the Manitoba Mental Health Act. At that time, the act brought in a regime that was considered progressive for its time and is still, in some respects, unique across Canada. Despite the act's focus on best practices, it has not been updated in the past 26 years. Elements of the act are out of date and we recognize that the government must evolve as the understanding of disability changes.

The amendments recognize that adults living with an intellectual dis ability are people first, and are entitled to the same rights as all other adults. This is reflected in two new principles at the beginning of the act. New references to the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Dis abilities and the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms have been added to the act, and will play a strong role in aligning our legislation with international standards.

Bill 23 also introduces a people -first statement that ensures an adult's wishes, values and beliefs will guide all forms of decision making relevant to their well-being. Whether these decisions are made in de- pendently or with assistance fro m others, we recog- nize that an adult's right to be treated the same as any other adult should always be the primary focus. We heard from the task force that some of the lan- guage within the act is outdated, and that some terms, such as vulnerable persons and mental disability, hold negative connotations for the dis ability com munity.

The proposed amend ments will modernize the act's language to address these concerns, including the new titles for the Vulner able Persons' Com missioner and the act itself, which will now be referred to as adults living with an intellectual disability act. A major component of the task force recommen- dations concern the protec tion for adults living with intellectual disabilities. The act determines how we define abuse and neglect, and sets out procedures for mandatory reporting, in vestigation and emergency intervention.

In order to clarify and expand on these protections, certain aspects of the act's pro tection mandate have been updated to best –to reflect best practices in other jurisdictions. New

definitions of abuse and neglect, modelled after Nova Scotia's pro tection of persons in care act, will acknowledge concerns from the task force that the act creates an overly strict test to prove th at an adult has been abused. Under the current definition, for example, a slap across the face would not meet the legal threshold, since it does not lead to serious or lasting physical con sequences. The new definition reduces the threshold from serious harm to harm, so instances such as these are now captured. The depart- ment will be able to proceed with more cases, and include those previously considered as unsubstan - tiated or inconclusive. Bill 23 also includes conse quential amendments to

definitions of abuse and neglect in the protection of persons in care act, as both acts contain protec tion mandates and refer cases to the adult registry –Adult Abuse Registry Committee. After consulting with the Department of Health, we felt that these amendments were necessary to ensure con sistent reporting across departments, and that all adults receive equal treat - ment regardless of capacity or setting. We also heard from the task force about a lack of information on what happens during and upo n con- clusion of an investigation.

The task force noted that victims and their families are often left without impor- tant details or follow-up regarding their cases, and so this act addresses that. Mr. Deputy Speaker, I'm pleased to present this bill for the House's consideration. Questions Mr. Deputy Speaker: A question period of up to 15 minutes will be held.

Questions may be addressed to the minister by any member in the following sequence: first question by the official opposition critic or des ignate; subsequent questions asked by critics or designates from other recognized opposition parties; subsequent questions asked by each independ- ent member; remaining questions asked by any oppo- sition members. And no question or answer shall exceed 45 seconds. The floor is open for questions. MLA Nahanni Fontaine (St. Johns): Could the minis- ter tell us what else her depart ment and herself have heard from dis ability advocates on how to promote

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1611 acceptance in respect of dis ability, and really move towards ending ableism? Hon. Rochelle Squires (Minister responsible for Accessibility): That is a really good question, and I think ending all forms of discrimination is certainly something that everybody on the task force and in the department are working towards addressing. And I–we do believe that updating the language to be more reflective of the community's wishes goes a long way.

We also believe that including language from the declaration –the United Nations declaration on people with–living with an intellec tual disability– be reflected as well as moving to ensure a better sub- stitute and assisted decision -making efforts and initiatives are in place, so that people can fully realize their potential in Manitoba. Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Mr. Deputy Speaker, I ask the minister: This is

an act which covers people–persons with a mental disability; would it cover people who have a learning disability? * (15:30) Ms. Squires: So, it is spe cifically for people living with an intellectual disability and the definition of an intellectual disability.

But certainly, this act provides protocols and the threshold for investigations by the departmental branch whenever there is an abuse that would occur against a person living with a dis ability i n the province of Manitoba and certainly does provide a framework for all individuals in Manitoba to achieve their highest destiny regardless–or irrespective of a disability.

MLA Fontaine: Could the minister share with the House whether or not Manitobans with dis abilities were consulted on in respect to Bill 23, and overall, what was the consensus whether or not that they were supportive of the changes in the bill, and did they have any other additional recommendations? Ms. Squires: Indeed, there were several consultations that had occurred with families and self advocates from the Family Advocacy Network, Com munity Living Manitoba, Continuity Care, Inclusion Winnipeg, Winnipegosis and District Residen tial Support Services, Com munity Venture, Life's Journey, epic smile St.

Malo, Westman Parkland Network and Abilities Manitoba. They were all sup portive of these proposed amendments and we will be following up with these groups when we develop the related regula tions and policies for this bill. And there are also other measures that will be taken to address the com prehensive task force report that we've received earlier last year. Mr. Gerrard: So, it's clear that, from the minister's statement, that most people with a learning disability, at least who don't have an IQ below –what is the 'i-cloo' level that is considered under this act? Is it 70 or 75 or 80?

Because we've heard a lot of different conditions. And why is the minister spe cifically excluding people with learning dis abilities? Because these are clearly brain dis abilities, and some people would classify them as mental disabilities. Ms. Squires: So, this–we are not looking to expand the eligibility criteria for CLDS programming. That is not what this legis lation is attempting to do. And we recognize that there are broader questions that need to be asked and answered in regards to who the act should serve.

And we recognize that that would involve a com- prehensive analysis and con sultation, which we will certainly be endeavouring to do, but in this specific bill, that is not covered and that is not what we'd consulted on, and that was not what the task force had recommended at this particular juncture. MLA Fontaine: Could the minister share with the House what else she heard from dis ability advocates about how to promote acceptance of dis ability and ableism? So, by that I mean, like, what other recom - mendations have come forward in respect to that? Ms.

Squires: So, there are numer ous things that we can all work towards to ensure that everybody has the opportunity to achieve their full destiny in Manitoba. We heard very loud and clear that everybody who is living with a d isability wanted to see the CLDS sector fortified. And that is why we enhanced those wages to $19 effective on April 1st of this year, a sig- nificant increase in the CLDS budget for enhancing and stabilizing that sector.

We also know that there was a need for ongoing funding for businesses and municipalities and others to apply to so that they can receive funding to make sure that their place of busi ness, their websites, their physical– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The honourable minister's time has expired. Mr. Gerrard: In the–this act, it's my under standing that the mental disability, so-called or defined, has to

1612 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 18, 2023 be manifested before the age of 18 years. And so it's leaving out people who are identified after 18 years, and in my exper ience, that the government is inter - preting this as diagnosed before 18 years. Because I've had examples of people who were over 18 but had a history of having the mental disability before 18– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The member's time has expired. Ms.

Squires: So, I do want to remind the member that this bill is specific about modernizing the act when it comes to the language that we use when talking about people with dis abilities, as well as providing more tools to deal with allegations of abuse. Under the former act , something that would be, like, for example, a slap that would not cause serious harm, did not meet the threshold to be investigated by the Department of Families' protection unit. And also, under the former act, caregivers and the person with a di sability themselves were not able to get information about an ongoing investi gation.

We thought that that was– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The honourable minister's time has expired. Mr. Gerrard: There are some positive things in this bill, that I'm really astounded that the government has left so much unattended to. I brought up earlier today the fact that the govern- ment is currently not concerned about people with learning disabilities. And, in fact, this is proof posi - tive, because the government has completely omitted people with learning disabilities who don't have a low IQ, and that is the majority of people with learning disabilities.

I ask: How could the gov ernment have not paid any attention to people with learning disabilities? Ms. Squires: You know, I ask the member how he can politicize such an im portant bill and put such comments that he just made on the record. This bill was a direct response to the 18 recom - mendations that were put forward by the vul nerable persons t ask force, nine of which are being fully addressed through these proposed amendments; six were addressed through changes to the CLDS policy; and two will be addressed in an upcoming legislative proposal.

Now, I wish that this member opposite really put his money where his mouth is and voted in favour of the many substantive changes that we've brought for- ward as a gov ernment, including increases in budget to enhance people's lives who are living with disabil- ities in the province of Manitoba. If he– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The honourable minister's time has expired. Mr. Gerrard: The–you know, we don't have a prob- lem with what's in the bill; we'll support it. But what we are very concerned about is the gov ernment is leaving out so much that needs to be addressed.

And as I have, you know, illustrated in numerous petitions and in questions and in various other ways, there is a significant problem in the way that this gov- ernment is failing to address people with learning dis- abilities, with dysle xia, with dysgraphia, with a nonverbal learning disability, with dyscalculia and so on, and– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The minister's time has expired. Ms. Squires: The member opposite talks about a failure. Let me you about a failure.

This gov ernment put forward a pilot project to support adolescent kids with high intellectual and developmental disabilities–a pilot project so that they could receive those services and not have to go into CFS care to receive those enhanced respite services. It was an $8-million pilot project. And what did that member do? He voted against it. He voted against getting supports for children with disabilities. Shame on him. Mr. Gerrard: All right, let's be clear: I voted against the budget. It didn't mean that I don't agree with every tiny item in the budget.

This is –[interjection] Yes, and it was so small that some people who tried to apply quickly were –it was already totally used up. I mean, it really is a problem when this gov ernment can't get their act together when they're dealing with people with learn- ing disabilities, with executive function disabilities. You know, it's a real problem. This gov ernment just can't do what needs to be done. Why is this gov ernment falling so far short? [interjection] Mr. Deputy Speaker: Order. * (15:40) Ms. Squires: Mr.

Deputy Speaker, for the member for River Heights to stand up and say that an $8- million commitment to helping children and adolescents with extreme developmental and intellectual dis abilities,

April 18, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1613 an $8-million pilot to support those families is a small, inconsequential item, is shameful. And I would like to get –ask him to get up and apologize for putting those reprehensible comments on the record, and I'd like him to apologize to those families who are being supported by that $8- million bridge program pilot. Mr. Gerrard: When we're talking about $8 million in an eight –more than $8 -billion budget –$16-billion budget, it's small, it's not inconsequential; that's a different word. Let's put it–let's make it clear.

But there is a big problem if this gov ernment is not doing its job when it comes to helping people with learning disabilities, and we have a bill here which, sadly, although it has some good, positive things in it, is not addressing some of the major issues that we're facing in Manitoba today with children with learning disabilities; they're not being properly screened. When will the government, if it's interested in– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The member's time has expired. Ms. Squires: Mr. Deputy Speaker, I would like to put on the record that our gov ernment will always stand up for people with disabilities.

We enhanced our budget this year –$640 million in the budget this year alone –to supporting families and individuals with dis abilities. We also included $104-million-item increase to stabilize the sector for enhancing people who are living in com munity with disabilities. These are not inconsequential initiatives; these are substantive changes that our government has made in the funding for people with disabilities and the pro- gramming that people with disabilities can receive. What did the member do when it came time to– Mr. Deputy Speaker: Minister's time has expired. Mr.

Gerrard: I'm going to ask the minister–[interjection] Mr. Deputy Speaker: Order. Order. Mr. Gerrard: –when is she going to do some thing that's going to make a difference for all the kids in Manitoba with learning dis abilities? When is the minister going to take the broader view that's necessary when we 're looking at children and adults with disabilities? Ms. Squires: Of course our gov ernment is taking a broader view. That is why we did come –have the $8-million bridge pilot program that we had imple - mented over a year and a half ago.

That is why we formed the task force on these issues, and the report, the 18 recommendations that they had reported back to us are being implemented. That is why we have grown the Families budget by 25 per cent since we took office. And the member opposite has continuously voted against a 25 per cent increase in the budget for social initiatives and for supporting people with disabilities. I say– Mr. Deputy Speaker: The minister's time has expired. And the time for questions has expired. Debate Mr. Deputy Speaker: The floor is open for debate. [interjection] Order. MLA Nahanni Fontaine (St.

Johns): I'm just going to put a couple of words on the record in respect to Bill 23. However, and I don't do this very often, but I will back up the member for Rive r Heights (Mr. Gerrard) in respect of some of the concerns that he's raising with children with learning disabilities. I want to remind Manitobans and, certainly, mem- bers opposite that it was under Brian Pallister that this government and each and e very one of those mem - bers, save for maybe a couple, actually celebrated and supported cutting supports in school for children with learning disabilities.

And I think that that's really im- portant to put on the record today, that that is actually the legacy of this government in the work that they've done for children with learning disabilities. In respect of this particular bill, I think it is really important that–and I think it's reflected in the bill–that as we learn more about using inclus ive language and terminology that is disrespectful and disparaging and socially constructs Manitobans with dis abilities as less than and contributes to ableism, when we learn that we can do better.

And I would suggest that this is what this bill is aiming to do, and I fully support that. I have said many, many times that there is power in the language that we use. The discourse and the language that we use informs the way that we see and feel and experience the–in the world. And so, I think that this is a good bill in that sense, that we're going to be changing language, and

Document details

Collection	Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	42-5-43b
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	42nd 5th hansardpdf 43b.pdf
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	4bdb253af3294ae298123bd1de5ecf17c8f3f48a

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