May

19, 2010 HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY PROCEEDINGS

Vol. XLVI No. 24

The House met at 2:00 p.m.

MR. SPEAKER (Fitzgerald): Order, please!

Admit strangers.

Today the Chair would like to welcome representatives from the Canadian

Federation of Students who are sitting in the public gallery.

Welcome to the House of Assembly.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Today the Chair would also like to welcome a former

long-time Member of the House of Assembly, Ms Mary Hodder.

Welcome to the House of Assembly.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

Statements by Members

MR. SPEAKER: The following members' statements will be heard: the hon.

the Member for the District of Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi; the hon. the Member for

the District of Labrador West; the hon. the Member for the District of

Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair; the hon. the Member for the District of St. John's

West; and the hon. the Member for the District of St. John's East.

The hon. the Member for the District of Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MS MICHAEL: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I stand in this hon. today to recognize a distinguished writer,

constituent and good friend, Helen Fogwill Porter, who was recently inducted

into the Newfoundland and Labrador Arts Council's hall of fame at the

Newfoundland and Labrador Arts Council Awards Ceremony in Happy Valley-Goose

Bay. This most recent accolade follows her lifetime achievement award from NLAC

in 1993.

Mr. Speaker, Helen Fogwill Porter's contribution to the arts and literary

heritage of Newfoundland and Labrador is amazing with a writing career spanning

twenty-five years.

She has been called by another very accomplished Newfoundland writer, Bernice

Morgan, as Newfoundland's Roddy Doyle. Helen is best known for her novel

January, February, June or July , which won the Canadian Library Association

Award and was shortlisted for the W.H. Smith/Books in Canada First Novel Award.

She is accomplished in every genre: fiction, non-fiction, poetry, humour,

drama and criticism. Mr. Speaker, her works include a much acclaimed memoir,

Below the Bridge , a collection of short stories A Long and Lonely Ride ,

and some award-winning poetry, plus a collection, Blood and Water . Her

most recent novel is titled Finishing School .

More important, Mr. Speaker, Helen has done much to bolster the writing scene

in Newfoundland and Labrador, long before Newfoundland was considered, as it is

today, the country's richest pool of literary talent. She has done much to pave

the way for others and is remarkably supportive of new writers.

Mr. Speaker, I ask all hon. members in this House to join me in

congratulating Helen Fogwill Porter for her incredible accomplishments and for

joining other remarkable Newfoundlanders and Labradorians in the Newfoundland

and Labrador Arts Council hall of fame.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Labrador West.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. BAKER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise in this hon. House today to congratulate the Northern Lights Theatre

Company of Labrador West for their impressive showing again this year at the

sixtieth annual Provincial Drama Festival held from April 5-10 in Corner Brook.

This was the second year at the drama festival for this relatively new

theatre troupe and they followed up with their debut performance last year by

taking top honours again this year for their play entitled Wit . In

addition to having the best overall play, they also won the Harvey Rose Bowl for

best visual presentation.

This theatre company was also the recipient of a number of a number

individual awards. Wendy Chambers took the Chrissi Andrews Memorial Award for

best actress, and the Neala F. Griffin award went to Peter McCormack for best

direction. Other performing members were: Michele Ralph, Dana Blackmore, Darrel

Brenton Sr., Darrel Brenton Jr., Pam Brinston, Lester Simmons, Ruth Simmons, and

Diana Dwyer. Stage crew members were Ashleigh Strang, Sandra McCormack, Craig

Robinson, Curtis Doran and Sean Fagan.

Meanwhile, Mr. Speaker, the Carol Players, also from Labrador West, won the

Allan Power Memorial Trophy for best lighting.

Mr. Speaker, I ask all members of this hon. House to join me in

congratulating the Northern Lights Theatre Company and all of the other drama

groups that participated in the sixtieth annual Provincial Drama Festival.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Cartwright-L'Anse au

Clair.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I recently attended the Labrador Straits Women's Institute thirty-seventh

anniversary dinner, and I rise in the House today to extend congratulations to

their organization and to honour the accomplishments of twenty-nine women with

the institute who were awarded their thirty-five-year service pins.

Mr. Speaker, the Women's Institute in this Province actually evolved from a

service league that was formed in 1929 to help the victims of the tidal wave

that swept the South Coast of Newfoundland. The present day Newfoundland and

Labrador Women's Institute is an informal, educational organization for women to

work together to strengthen the quality of life for themselves, their families

and their communities.

Mr. Speaker, the Women's Institute was formed in the Labrador Straits region

in 1973 and, currently, there are five branches still active in Red Bay,

Pinware, West St. Modeste, Capstan Island and L'Anse-au-Loup.

Mr. Speaker, these women have volunteered and served their community

unselfishly and have been a tremendous asset to the region. I would like to

commend their contributions to my district and encourage other women to take

advantage of this opportunity to be a part of this wonderful organization.

I ask my colleagues in the House of Assembly today to join with me in

honouring these women and congratulating their new district board.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of St. John's East.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. BUCKINGHAM: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, it is with great pride that I rise in the House today to

recognize Andrew O'Dea, a resident of St. John's East, for being named a

co-winner of the 2010 City of St. John's Youth of the Year Award.

By way of explanation, this award was developed by the Mayor's Advisory

Committee on Youth, also known as MACY, and is open to residents between the

ages of thirteen and eighteen.

While Andrew's marks were in the top 3 per cent of his class at Gonzaga High

School, he also finds time to be involved in student government, as the school's

vice-president, student leadership, sports, music, and mentoring. Andrew also

serves as a member of the school's Peace and Justice Committee and also on the

Care and Respect Everywhere Committee. He volunteers with Easter Seals, the

Gathering Place, MUNHOPE, Haiti Relief and Children's Wish. He has also achieved

gold standard in the Duke of Edinburgh Award program.

Mr. Speaker, I invite all hon. members to join me in congratulating Andrew

O'Dea on his choices in how he uses his time and the recognition for those

choices by being named the co-winner of the 2010 City of St. John's Youth of the

Year Award.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of St. John's West.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS S. OSBORNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Today, also with pride, I would like to recognize Heather Anne Conway, a

resident of St. John's West who was named the other co-winner of the 2010 City

of St. John's Youth of the Year Award - and Heather and her mom are with us

today in the gallery.

Heather is a Level III honours student at Holy Heart of Mary High School.

Over the last couple of years she has held positions on numerous committees at

the school including: Student Council, peer counsellor, Tutoring for Tuition

co-ordinator, Interact Club and is the chair of the Mercy Centre Youth Group for

Ecology and Justice. She has also volunteered with Kids Help Phone. She is a

member of the school's jazz and concert bands and chamber choir, plays

basketball, soccer and is an avid swimmer.

In spite of all these volunteer activities, Heather has found time to attend

conferences and workshops designed to enhance her leadership skills. All the

extracurricular activities have obviously not hurt her school work as she is an

international baccalaureate student, one of only eleven in the Province.

I ask Members of the House of Assembly to join me in congratulating Heather

Anne Conway as St. John's Youth of the Year.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Statements by Ministers.

Statements by Ministers

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Tourism, Culture and Recreation.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. FRENCH: Mr. Speaker, I rise today to inform the hon. members of the

House of an important government investment in a campaign designed to place

lifesaving Automated External Defibrillators, commonly known as AEDs, in key

public places throughout Newfoundland and Labrador, starting with stadiums.

Mr. Speaker, studies show that defibrillation within three to five minutes of

a heart-related incident results in a survival rate of up to 75 per cent. Since

stadiums are one obvious place where large numbers of people gather, it makes

sense to have these units close by in case of a cardiac emergency.

Earlier today, Mr. Speaker, I was involved in a Heart and Stroke Foundation

news conference, where they launched their three-year Restart a Heart

fundraising campaign to put more AEDs in public places. The provincial

government is the largest contributor to Phase I of that campaign, having

provided $100,000 this year to support efforts to place AEDs in about fifty

stadiums throughout the Province.

Mr. Speaker, the Department of Tourism, Culture and Recreation was already

investigating the possibility of putting more AEDs in sports facilities when the

Heart and Stroke Foundation approached us with a proposal to partner on this

initiative. So the timing was excellent and we were certainly pleased to come

onboard.

Mr. Speaker, some of our sporting facilities already have AEDs on site. If

there was ever a doubt as to their importance, it was dispelled a few weeks ago

when the manager of the Stephenville Dome, Ross White, used an AED to

resuscitate a gentleman who had collapsed at the facility. Mr. White was at the

news conference this morning, and was recognized for his actions in saving that

gentleman's life.

Mr. Speaker, with this $100,000 investment, the provincial government is

demonstrating our commitment to providing greater capacity within communities to

respond to similar cardiac emergencies in the future. We look forward to working

with the foundation as the campaign progresses.

Finally, I take this opportunity to commend corporate sponsors, Vale Inco and

the Resource Development Council, which contributed $50,000 each, as well as

Newfoundland Hydro, which provided $10,000 to this worthy campaign. This is an

excellent example of government, the corporate community and the not-for-profit

sector coming together on a project designed to protect the health and

well-being of our people.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. KELVIN PARSONS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I thank the minister for an advance copy of his statement. This is indeed an

excellent program. It is good to see that government has, in fact, partnered

with the corporate community, and with the not-for-profit sector. There is about

35,000-40,000 apparent cardiac arrest incidents in Canada per year. Albeit, of

course, AEDs are not going to be always successful, it is certainly a valuable

tool. A lot of these do happen in sporting facilities. I am sure all of us who

have been involved in sporting events in our communities, have throughout their

lifetime experienced an example where your friend or your neighbour in fact had

suffered cardiac arrest, and years ago we did not have these. So it is great to

see that we do in fact have these being placed in our sporting facilities.

We also would extend our congratulations to Mr. White of Stephenville, and

thank him for his quick thinking and his fast response. Hopefully, not only will

we be putting them there but we would encourage the minister, as well, to

encourage everyone, not only those who work in sporting facilities but wherever,

to actually undergo first aid courses so that they can use them, because quite

often we have them in the facilities but not everybody who is trained in them

happens to be around. So the more people we can encourage to take the first aid

courses to be able to utilize them, the better off we will be again.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Signal Hill-Quidi

Vidi.

MS MICHAEL: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

I thank the minister for the advance copy of his statement. This is an

excellent program, especially in a Province like ours, it is very necessary

because we are aware of the high rate of heart and stroke incidents that happen

in this Province. Having the AEDs available in the public places that this

program will now allow can be something that we can be certain is going to be

saving more lives, just as we saw happen in Stephenville.

I join with my colleague in talking about the need for more and more people

to take first aid so that they can be available at times of emergency because

you cannot immediately get somebody in an emergency, especially in our Province

right now where we do not have Province-wide 911.

If we are serious about saving lives, and I know we are, then I have to urge

this government to speed up this process with regard to getting enhanced 911

everywhere in this Province, because there are times that the AED is not going

to be enough and we are going to need ambulances or firefighters or whatever. So

let's put all of these programs together in an effort to save lives.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: Further statements by ministers?

The hon. the Minister of Municipal Affairs.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS WHALEN: Mr. Speaker, each year communities throughout Newfoundland and

Labrador have a special day devoted to acknowledging the dedicated work of

individuals who participate in municipal government. Today, May 19, is Municipal

Awareness Day an opportunity to recognize mayors, councillors, municipal

administrators and staff for their hard work and commitment to strengthening

communities throughout Newfoundland and Labrador, for today and for future

generations.

Municipal Awareness Day is celebrated by 281 communities, and provides an

opportunity to promote the work of municipal government, and the tireless

efforts of the approximately 3,500 elected municipal councillors and staff in

the Province. Municipal governments work diligently to secure the many essential

services which affect our everyday lives. This is important work and includes

services such as water, street lighting, and garbage collection - services which

we may take for granted, but are vital to ensure the well-being of our

communities.

Mr. Speaker, Municipal Awareness Day is supported by our government in

partnership with Municipalities Newfoundland and Labrador. This year, the

Department of Municipal Affairs provided funding of $15,000 to support Municipal

Awareness Day and a province-wide advertising campaign. In recognition of

Municipal Awareness Day, municipalities around the Province will be hosting a

variety of activities including history days, municipal displays, open houses,

essays, stories, trivia and poster contests, so that individuals within

communities can gain a better insight on how their city or town operates.

The MakeYourMark Campaign that I led last summer sparked a renewed interest

in municipal government. The campaign will now serve as a stepping stone in our

efforts to promote the benefits of strong municipal representation, and the

rewards of contributing to your community. MakeYourMark is about promoting

municipal council and making people more aware of the important work of

municipal government, and we will continue our work to sustain this important

message.

Mr. Speaker, the positive partnership between government, Municipalities

Newfoundland and Labrador, and our municipal councils is critical as we work

together to take advantage of opportunities, address challenges, and support a

bright future for our wonderful Province.

I am very pleased by the interest in last month's Municipal Symposium in

Gander where more than 270 municipal leaders in attendance. It was the largest

turnout in the history of this event. I encourage Newfoundlanders and

Labradorians and my hon. colleagues to support Municipal Awareness Day and the

work of our municipal leaders. We all have an important role to play to make our

mark and to ensure our municipalities are strong, vibrant and sustainable.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of The Straits & White

Bay North.

MR. DEAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I would like to thank the minister for an advance copy of her statement.

Municipal Awareness Day is an extremely important recognition, and as often

we forget sometimes the vital services and tasks that municipalities carry out,

we overlook sometimes in our busy schedules the people who work hard to ensure

that our lives run as smoothly as possible. Councils, staff and volunteers are

oftentimes at the heart of ensuring that a community functions effectively, that

quality services are provided for its citizens and so on. In this day and age it

is easy to often take for granted all the essential services that they offer and

that we see every day. So, taking time in our busy lives to celebrate those

aspects of municipal functioning is very important.

I know that for the past two years or so the Department of Municipal Affairs

has been working with the MNL to understand and to bring together a new fiscal

arrangement, and I would encourage the minister to see that through.

Municipalities are not without their challenges, whether it is with waste

management or whether it is just finding the financial means with a shrinking

tax base and so on. So, yes, I would want to today, just offer my sincere thanks

to all those who are involved in our municipal governments and look forward to

their continued contribution to our communities.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Signal Hill-Quidi

Vidi.

MS MICHAEL: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

I too thank the minister for the advance copy of her statement. It is good to

take time to congratulate those in elected positions in the municipalities, as

well as the staff who work closely with the elected people, because they do have

large tasks. It is much more complicated today than it was fifty years ago to be

running a municipality. Whether it is a large one like our urban centres, or the

small municipal ones.

I note that today Municipalities Newfoundland and Labrador released Regional

Government Papers today that they are encouraging their members to take and to

study. It shows the willingness on their part, which I think is really important

to see how more effectively the rural communities, in particular, can work

together, both for the benefit of the people in the communities as well as a way

to use money to its maximum. So I think that kind of effort by the MNL should be

a message to government also that we continue to really try to ease the burden

of the smaller communities, and as they get into looking at regionalization, to

make sure the resources are there to help them with the regionalization.

I would like to make one mention of the MakeYourMark campaign, which I think

was a good campaign, encouraging all people to run but especially encouraging

women to run, which I think was very important. I would just like the minister

to think about this the next time a campaign like this happens, I think it would

be really good if all elected women in the House of Assembly could be invited to

be part of that campaign.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: Further statements by ministers?

Oral Questions.

Oral Questions

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, yesterday the Quebec courts unfortunately rejected government's

request to appeal a decision related to Abitibi's environmental remediation cost

in the Province. We have raised this issue several times during this session and

we now fear that the people of the Province will indeed be on the hook for

hundreds of millions of dollars in clean-up costs.

I ask the Premier today: Are you planning to seek leave to appeal this court

loss to the Supreme Court of Canada at this time?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, let's do a little history lesson first of

all, and what this is all about. This goes back to the late 1960s when we had

the best project in the world that we wanted to develop but we could not do it

on our own because we were a poor Province - because of what happened as a

result of Confederation and everything else. We were the poor and the weak

sisters of Canada. So, we basically entered into a partnership with Quebec in

order to develop that particular project. For that, they acquired at least

one-third of the company which developed that particular project.

Then, when it got down to the short strokes and we were months away from

concluding it and we were out of money, the company was basically out of money,

they squeezed us. That is when they squeezed us for another twenty-five years on

a contract that already was a complete giveaway of a very valuable hydro

resource. They squeezed us for another twenty-five years at a lower price -

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

Does the hon. the Premier have leave to continue with his answer?

AN HON. MEMBER: Yes.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

So based on that history, Newfoundlanders and Labradorians, particularly this

Newfoundlander and Labradorian, and all these Newfoundlanders and Labradorians

here and all the people in this Province, feel very, very strongly about the way

Quebec has treated us. So if we have to fight them in the courts or fight them

at the Rgie, or if I personally got to get down and go toe to toe or roll

around on the ground with them to fight them, we will do it.

So your answer is quite simple, we are now reviewing it. We are looking at

asking for leave to appeal to the Supreme Court of Canada. I think that, as a

Province, we have to keep fighting Quebec because if we don't they will take

away everything we have.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

As a result of the court decision, the Province will not be considered a

secured creditor to receive compensation for the clean-up cost. We also know

that we missed the deadline as a Province to be considered an unsecured

creditor.

I ask the Premier today: What is the recourse for the Province to now be

added to the list of unsecured creditors?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, we did not miss any deadlines. Any

decisions that we made in this legal process all the way through have been

conscious and deliberate and have been strategic. Of course, what we are dealing

with is obviously a very biased court.

When you look at the Quebec courts, you look at the decision that was given

here. The opinion, of course, that we have from our solicitors on this is that

the court dodged a central legal and policy issue. So we had constitutional and

factual arguments and the Court of Appeal completely and totally avoided that.

In addition, they completely ignored the same rationale which has been used by

the Ontario Court of Appeal, B.C. Court of Appeal, the Alberta Court of Appeal,

and the Supreme Court of Canada. So, basically, these courts are doing whatever

they can to try and stop us.

The same thing with Judge Gascon, we just saw the Rgie ruling which came out

of Quebec, which is one of the most horrendous, absurd rulings that I have ever

seen. They ignored facts. They said that what Hydro-Quebec was doing was

discretionary. They ignored the evidence - a complete abuse of process. So,

throughout this process we will just keep hammering away.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I will probably just re-ask the question of the Premier: What is the process

that we take now to become listed as an unsecured creditor?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, from day one, as the hon. member knows

when we explained this when this all started - and I can quote from her in

Hansard in the debate where she said, "we certainly have no problem with

supporting anything that is in this particular bill. We have had an opportunity

to discuss it in great detail with the officials within the minister's

department and within the Department of Justice, and we have had an opportunity,

Mr. Speaker, to ask the questions that we needed to ask in order for us to have

a comfort zone with this."

So, they knew exactly what the ground rules were. They knew that when it

comes to environmental liabilities we were likely to be at risk as unsecured

creditors, but what this government did, and what we did unanimously, we

expropriated the assets.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, by expropriating the assets, we protected

the interests of the people of Newfoundland and Labrador, so now when the

environmental liabilities come up at least we have an asset to go against those

liabilities. Instead, Mr. Speaker - if I may have a moment -of what they have

done in Botwood and Stephenville, put those assets in a shell company so that

they could go bankrupt so that we get nothing. That is what would have happened

with all of those assets if we had not moved them.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Our decisions were made based on the information that we were given by the

Premier and by the government, Mr. Speaker, from the best legal minds that they

had in the world is what we were told at that particular time.

Mr. Speaker, we have lost three courts cases in the Quebec courts recently,

notably the data room case in November, the EPA case in March and the failed

appeal from yesterday. In each of these cases the judges ordered that the

Province pay for Abitibi's legal bills. The Minister of Justice committed to

getting me this information on April 28.

I ask the minister again today: What is the cost to the people of the

Province for the legal fees for our lawyers and Abitibi's lawyers in all three

of those cases?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Justice and the Attorney General.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. F. COLLINS: Mr. Speaker, we do not have those figures because the

damages that were allocated against the Province have not been forthcoming and

we have not received any notice of any damages that will be applied cost, that

is. Until such time as we get that, Mr. Speaker, we will not be able to answer

the question.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

We also requested a breakdown of the $8 million in fees spent by the

Department of Natural Resources last year related to the expropriation. The

minister has yet to provide that information in the House, although she

committed to do so on April 29.

So, Mr. Speaker, we know that the minister expropriated a mill and she hid it

for ten months, so maybe she can hide this information for a lot longer, but I

ask her: Are you prepared to share the information with us?

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Deputy Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, we have undertaken to provide that information to the Leader of

the Opposition. When it is prepared, she will certainly have it. They also have

a freedom of information request with regard to that information.

Again, I have to correct her, it was not ten months before we disclosed. We

disclosed in February. She missed it, Mr. Speaker - not surprising for the

Leader of the Opposition.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The minister needs to do her math.

Mr. Speaker, it certainly appears that there is no requirement for Abitibi to

clean up their former properties in this Province. The courts in Quebec have

ruled that way and the company has already ceased doing cleanup activities in

the Province.

I ask the Minister of Environment: Now that it appears that we will be

responsible for the cleanup costs, will you finally put a price tag on this

expropriated liability?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Environment and Conservation.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JOHNSON: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, it is obvious that the Leader of the Opposition has given up,

and as this Premier just clearly indicated, we have not given up. We are going

to do everything we can to ensure that Abitibi is held liable and responsible

for the environmental issues here, Mr. Speaker.

Obviously, we are disappointed with the decisions out of the Quebec court,

but we cannot stop there, Mr. Speaker, and we are reviewing all of the options

that we have before us before we decide how we proceed.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Last week in questioning in the House of Assembly, the minister said that

under

section 99 it is the polluter that pays. Well, we already know what the

court rulings are on that now, Minister. We also know that

section 99 states, as

well, that the owner pays. Under Bill 75, aren't you now the owner?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Environment and Conservation.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JOHNSON: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, under

section 99 of the act, I issued the orders in reference to

section 7 of the act where it clearly defines that the person who releases the

substance into the environment is the person who is responsible for cleaning up.

That is the general premise of the polluter pays principle, Mr. Speaker. That is

why we appealed this decision and that is why we are looking at our options now

on a go-forward basis, Mr. Speaker.

We cannot let Abitibi off the hook. They came into this Province and they

reaped the benefits for years and years here. Mr. Speaker, all we are asking is

that they return the environment back to the state they found it in when they

came here and used our resources.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The minister forgets that it is her government who let them off the hook in

the first place. You are the ones who made the mistake and expropriated the

liabilities. You are in the courts now fighting to give it back, I say to the

minister to give them back the liabilities. You are the one who let them off

the hook in the first place.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JONES: Mr. Speaker, we know the Minister of Environment has not

completed her due diligence during this entire process. She has continually

suggested that Abitibi would have to submit remediation plans before they could

provide information. Minister, it appears that is not the case.

I ask the minister: Will you now complete a detailed inventory and

remediation plan so the people of the Province will know exactly the scope of

contamination and what needs to be done to address these problems?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Environment and Conservation.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JOHNSON: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, the Leader of the Opposition talks about not doing due

diligence, we saw an example earlier in the House this week when she was wrong

again in insinuating that I sat on a report for eighteen months - clearly a

mistake on her part.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JOHNSON: She was also in this House, Mr. Speaker, saying that I did

not provide writing under

section 27 of the act.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JOHNSON: Clearly using the wrong

section of the act, Mr. Speaker.

Section 27 references

section 26 where the minister has the authority to

designate a site as a contaminated area.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JOHNSON: Again, a misinterpretation on her part, Mr. Speaker. We see

this time and time again.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair is having difficulty in hearing the hon. minister and the questions

asked. I ask members for their co-operation.

The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Once again I think the minister needs to check her facts, I say to the

minister. Mr. Speaker, we have been waiting a week for government to provide an

Government has a full division of translators within Executive Council, as I

understand it. They must have reviewed this document by now and translated it.

Surely, the Premier and the Cabinet must have had access to it.

version of the Rgie decision in the House of Assembly so that we may have the

opportunity to read it.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, I said it last week, and I can say it

It is really interesting, too, when you go on their Web site, pretty well

about the Rgie, the attitude of Quebec against Newfoundland and Labrador.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I do not know why government is paying all the translators if we have to wait

Speaker. Anyway, we will wait a few more days and see what happens.

On Monday, we questioned this government about the fifteen striking Burin

Peninsula workers and their fourteen disabled clients who are impacted by this.

Again today, Mr. Speaker, these workers protested on the steps of Confederation

Building. Today, government is saying no to reclassification within their

agreement, yet in 2007 an agreement was reached with these workers and the

employer and government. Correspondence was circulated to NAPE indicating that

the positions would undergo a reclassification review. I say to the minister, it

was your government who had the final say before it was signed.

I ask you minister: Why did your government agree to this reclassification

review for these employees in their last contract, yet refuse it today?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. MARSHALL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I have taken a look at the collective agreement. The undertaking with respect

to job classification is signed by the employment corporation; government is not

a signatory to this contract.

Mr. Speaker, this strike has gone on for a long time -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. MARSHALL: Mr. Speaker, there is an impasse here and it is a monetary

impasse. Government has made a very fair offer of 21 per cent compounded 21.4

per cent over four years and NAPE is requesting, from the employment

corporation, 43 per cent over four years. We are too far apart, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, we have made a fair and generous offer and it is appropriate now

for NAPE to come forward in negotiating an agreement with the government.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The minister knows that

schedule B in the contract speaks to the

reclassification. He also knows that they could not sign on and have this

agreement approved without government agreeing to it. That is the reason they

are on strike today is because government is not agreeing to it.

Minister, I ask you: Why are you demanding that the reclassification clauses

be removed from these contracts before they go back to work? We do not

understand why government is so insistent on this for the sake of less than

$20,000.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. MARSHALL: Mr. Speaker, in the negotiations NAPE requested from the

employment corporation the government template, and the employees are not

employees of government. There is also a reference in the contract to where the

employment corporation has provided undertakings with respect to a job

classification system, and yet this is the government's job classification. It

is inappropriate that it apply outside of government.

The bottom line here is that we value very much the work that the workers in

Burin do but they are not employees of this government. So we have made a very

fair offer of 21.40 per cent. It is fair and generous, especially in these

times, especially in these economic times when we see what is happening over in

Europe, we see what is happening with the price of oil. It is a fair and

generous offer.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

These employees are more than happy with the agreement they have reached with

their employer. The problem is that the government will not sign on to the

reclassification, and that will only be settled once government comes to terms

and makes that decision.

Mr. Speaker, there was $30,000 found to settle the VON strike in Corner Brook

a few years ago by your government, yet you cannot find the money to settle this

particular contract with these workers. I ask you and urge you minister to do so

immediately so they can get back to work.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. MARSHALL: Mr. Speaker, with respect to the classification system, I

mean NAPE has agreed that the classification system can come out for more money.

The problem is if you come out for money we are just hassling over the amount of

money. We have offered 21.40 per cent; they want 43 per cent over four years.

There is an impasse, there is a difference of opinion, and we will continue to

negotiate. Hopefully, for the sake of the people in Burin and for the sake of

the people of the Province, we will reach an agreement acceptable to both sides.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

It is unjustifiable how this government can find a way to pay John Rorke $175

an hour to be a child advocate in this Province but cannot find a little over

$17,000 to put fifteen workers back to work to provide services to fourteen

disabled people in this Province.

I ask you minister: How do you justify keeping these minimum wage - mostly

women - workers and their disabled clients on the street for so long?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. MARSHALL: Mr. Speaker, government has put a lot of money into aid for

people with disabilities; over $27 million this year, including about $6.8

million to provide employment opportunities for people that work with employment

corporations, not just one but twenty, which are right across the Province.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of The Straits & White

Bay North.

MR. DEAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, as we have heard, DFO has released its shrimp quota allocation

for this season and there will a quota cut at 28 per cent in Area 6. This

decision violates three of the principles of the management plan of the northern

shrimp, including that of adjacency. In my region, a group called NOFTA will

lose its entire quota of 3,000 tons in Area 6 and they are expressing severe

disappointment with this decision. The Minister of Fisheries indicated in his

press release this morning that he sent a letter on April 26 to the federal

Minister of Fisheries on this matter stating the government's position.

I ask the minister today, knowing these quota cuts were coming, can he tell

us what other dialogue, face-to-face meetings, whatever, he has held with the

minister to ensure our Province's position was clearly put forth?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Fisheries and Aquaculture.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. JACKMAN: Mr. Speaker, I received some information indicating that

this was going to be the ruling just prior to April 26. So immediately, we

engaged our staff to forward a letter to Minister Shea indicating that we

totally disagreed with the last-in first-out amendment.

As the hon. member has mentioned, we do feel that adjacency is the key here,

and in my news release this morning I indicated that we are totally dissatisfied

with the decision and disappointed that the federal minister did not see fit to

take the side that we had promoted as a Province.

Mr. Speaker, it is important to note that we will continue to pressure the

federal government on this because if that rule continues, Mr. Speaker, we could

have the Innu of Labrador losing their shrimp quotas, we could also have the

Fogo Island Co-op losing their quotas, if further cuts were to come about, Mr.

Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of The Straits & White

Bay North.

MR. DEAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

We realize that they violated their own plan. This quota cut to NOFTA

represents a loss of income for some 350 fishing enterprises on the Northern

Peninsula, and it is an economic loss from the region of over $1.2 million. At

the same time, licence holders, as you know, from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick

are allowed to fish quota adjacent to our waters.

I ask the minister: Now that the cuts have been unleashed on our Province,

what do you plan to do as a counteraction or as an offset to this devastating

fallout for our communities and people along our North Coast?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Fisheries and Aquaculture.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. JACKMAN: Mr. Speaker, we know that there a number of harvesters that

are impacted on this and I expect that we will receive representation from them.

Mr. Speaker, the important thing here is we do not disagree with the science

as to there is a reduction in the quota. What we disagree with is how the cut

was distributed. We have lost those allocations because of the last-in first-out

formula, which the federal government has instituted, and which we totally

disagree with, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Port de Grave.

MR. BUTLER: Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Environment and Conservation

issued notices to remove structures being occupied by gravel pit campers. The

minister has recently stated that this does not apply to short-term gravel pit

structures, but rather only to permanent and long-term structures. This

distinction between short-term and long-term camping structures has been causing

some confusion.

I ask the minister: Can you clarify the criteria that determine whether a

structure is short-term or long-term?

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Minister of Environment and Conservation.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JOHNSON: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, we have been very clear from day one, back a year-and-a-half ago

now, when I got some first inquiries about this, we have absolutely no issue

with people going out and enjoying our great outdoors. We have an absolutely

beautiful Province here to explore. If people want to go camping on a short-term

basis, or if you want to take your trailer and go moose hunting for a week or

two, or go berry picking, then by all means go out and explore our beautiful

outdoors.

The issue becomes when people take over ownership of an area and it becomes

permanent. That is in violation of

section 32 of the act, but it is also unfair

to the people who might want to go up to that very same spot a week or two later

and use that for moose hunting.

All we are asking here is that fairness be applied across the board to all

residents of the Province so that everybody can have an equal opportunity to

enjoy our great outdoors.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Port de Grave.

MR. BUTLER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I have to go back to the minister again. I ask her to identify for me what is

short-term.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Environment and Conservation.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JOHNSON: Mr. Speaker, perhaps it is easier to explain what long-term

is. What we see as long-term is when people start putting outhouses or decks or

bridges and taking ownership of a certain site, when they leave their trailer

there for the weekend and go home. We want them to take the waste back with

them, and we want that site opened up for somebody else to have an opportunity

to use.

If people are out having a vacation, whether it is a week or two typically,

however long you take for a vacation in the Province - as long as you are not

taking permanent ownership. The basic premise here is that all residents of the

Province have fair and equal access.

Mr. Speaker, I know that the member was on Crosstalk today, and I am sure he

heard from the majority of callers exactly what I am saying in terms of the

reports that I got back. They all agree that it should be fair and equal; nobody

should take ownership of a certain spot.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Port de Grave.

MR. BUTLER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The minister is after telling me now that short-term is so that someone can

go to the gravel pit for a weekend and come home and let someone else go there.

All along, when this started, it was get everybody out of the gravel pits

because it was an unsightly issue.

Mr. Speaker, there has been a lot of controversy surrounding the removal

notices given to gravel pit campers. This is a tradition in our Province, and

one which engages a responsibility. We are heading into the May 24 weekend,

which is a popular time for campers to set up their camps for the summer;

however, these people are concerned that as soon as they set up camp they will

be evicted.

I ask the minister: Can you clarify whether gravel pit campers across this

Province will be permitted to set up temporary camps for the duration of the

summer without being served with a notice?

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Minister of Environment and Conservation.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JOHNSON: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, there are options available to these people. The member leaves

the impression that there aren't any options. We have clearly said to these

people - and people who have written me and I have written them back - that they

can certainly form an association, as they have done. The Member for Cape la

Hune, they are very happy - the trailers in Howley that have been removed - they

have formed an association so that everything is done in a proper manner. They

get the proper approvals from Government Services in terms of septic and water

and so on. If the environment is protected and they find a piece of land and

form an association, that is how you should stay there for the entire summer.

Mr. Speaker, a lot of times there are pristine spots, salmon rivers and so

on, that you or the person sitting next to you, or every single resident in this

Province, should have equal and fair opportunity to use those sites. I wonder if

the member opposite agrees with that fair and equal opportunity principle.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Signal Hill-Quidi

Vidi.

MS MICHAEL: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, with the latest court ruling from Quebec against this government

it has become clear that government is not able to control some of the biggest

issues facing this Province, from the AbitibiBowater assets to the Lower

Churchill development. It seems government is at the mercy of the legal systems

in Quebec and is powerless to move its own agenda forward.

Mr. Speaker, I ask the Premier today: How will he restore people's confidence

that government knows what they are doing, as they claim they do?

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, 93 per cent is a lot of confidence. That

is the kind of confidence I think people have in this government as a result of

our performance so far.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Having said that, Mr. Speaker, we are not going to just

rest on our laurels. When we go back and we look at our record, and we look at

things that we did from a negotiations perspective - you look at the Hebron

agreement, the White Rose agreement and Hibernia South - that has put anywhere

from $30 billion to $40 billion extra into this Province.

The reason we got those is because we have a mantra which is no more

giveaways, and we intend to stay with that. We are not going to give away any

more of the assets of this Province. As I said to the hon. the Leader of the

Opposition, and I say to the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi, we will fight

them wherever we have to fight them in order to prove our point. If that is in

the Quebec courts - we know what the attitude is in Quebec courts, we know what

the bias is in the Quebec courts, but there are higher courts than that and we

are not going to give up.

If the attitude is to sit back and go in on our hands and knees, like we did

back in the 1960s when a Liberal government negotiated away the Upper Churchill

and gave away our right to be a have Province for thirty years - and they did it

we are not going to that. We have no intention of doing that. So we will carry

on as we (inaudible).

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Member for the District of Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MS MICHAEL: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

I would like to ask the minister, Mr. Speaker, if he is going to fight it the

way he is talking about, and going to the Supreme Court, this is going to take

quite a bit of time, and a lot more money too.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS MICHAEL: I want to ask the Premier to explain to this House and to the

people of the Province what the implications are. If he takes that action, what

are the implications for the CCAA proceedings to come up with a plan, for

Abitibi to come up with a plan for their creditors who are waiting as well? We

are not the only creditors.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, as I said before, if we had not taken the

action that we took, if we had not expropriated those assets, we would have

absolutely nothing to put against the environmental liabilities that this

company has left us with in this particular Province.

So we have those assets as a result of the action we took, and as a result of

that we have given a severance to the workers in Grand Falls; we have put over

$100 million into projects. The amount invested in Central Newfoundland this

year is over $200 million in total. That is what we are doing with it.

So, as a result of our positive, our affirmative, action

AN HON. MEMBER: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: and instead of our mantra of no more giveaways, we

took it away. We took it away from a company that had abused this Province, had

not fulfilled its mandate to the people of Newfoundland and Labrador, were given

land assets and timber assets and hydro assets to run a pulp and paper mill and

they did not. They tried to walk away from it, so we nailed them.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. Member for the District of Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MS MICHAEL: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

All of that will mean nothing if the courts of

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair has recognized the hon. Member for the District of Signal

Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MS MICHAEL: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

Everything that the Premier has just said will mean absolutely nothing if he

cannot convince the Supreme Court of Canada that he is as right as he thinks he

is, and then we will lose everything because we are talking about hundreds of

millions of dollars.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

I ask the hon. members to allow the member to ask her question, and I ask the

hon. member to pose her question now.

MS MICHAEL: While government is spinning its wheels in court, there are

issues here at home they should be dealing with: a health care system in

trouble, inadequate home care and long-term care, a serious lack of affordable

housing, and a fishery in crisis, to name a few.

Mr. Speaker, I ask the Premier: When will he admit that there are things that

are beyond his control, and deal with the issues he can deal with here in the

Province?

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, making sure that Quebec will never get the

better of us again is not beyond our control. It is fully within our control and

we will fight that to the very end.

The hon. member, in all fairness to her, does not understand the consequences

no, really you do not. Going to the Supreme Court has nothing to do with the

ultimate consequence on Abitibi. We have the assets. We will use those assets to

counter any liabilities at the end of the day so we are in a net positive

position. That was the whole purpose of the exercise. Appealing to the Supreme

Court of Canada has absolutely nothing to do with that.

In addition - I mean if I had enough time we could go down through the

Budget. Was the Budget $6.7 billion? Is that the total amount of the Budget? You

know what we have done in affordable housing. You know what we have done in

health care. You know what we have done in education. The problem with the hon.

member is it is never enough, but money does not grow on trees; that is the

problem. That is the problem.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The time allotted for questions and answers has expired.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

Presenting Reports by Standing and Select Committees.

Tabling of Documents.

Notices of Motion.

Answers to Questions for which Notice has been Given.

Petitions.

Petitions

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Port de Grave.

MR. BUTLER: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

I present another petition today on behalf of the residents of Coomb's Cove,

and Burgeo by the way.

Mr. Speaker, I read the prayer of the petition again:

WHEREAS we, the people of Newfoundland and Labrador, have built cabins and

tilts away from home for hunting, fishing, berry picking or just spending time

up in the country or places around our shores, sometimes just to get away from

the stress of everyday living, a place to relax and enjoy the great outdoors;

and - I can almost recite it now, Mr. Speaker.

WHEREAS your government has come down hard on the thousands of cabin owners

and trailer owners that are out on the land with eviction notices, and forcing

them to move without providing them with an alternative; and

WHEREAS Kruger Inc. has timber rights to approximately one-third of all

forested lands on the Island and is refusing the vast majority of applications

for cabin development;

WHEREUPON your petitioners call upon all Members of the House of Assembly to

urge government to have compassion on the citizens of this fair Province and

allow them the right to enjoy what is rightfully ours. We were born on this land

and should have the right to enjoy it.

As in duty bound your petitioners will ever pray.

Mr. Speaker, just in response to what the minister said, I did not get a

chance to get back up again. When she was trying to determine what was

short-term, long-term, and indefinite. I say to her, duration of the summer is

pretty short-term in Newfoundland and Labrador. That is why those people go

those areas to do their camping, to enjoy the great outdoors, Mr. Speaker.

All they are asking government is to do this

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. BUTLER: and I say to the minister, I think what she should do is

let them go back to what they were used to. Not anything that is environmentally

unfriendly, not to do that. Make sure everything is right and proper. Let them

go back the way they were camping, and over this year, before next year steps

in, be able to go and sit down with those people and say what is wrong, and give

them the opportunity to be able to be incorporated, or whatever they want to do,

if that is their wish, to make sure that they can out and enjoy the great

outdoors, Mr. Speaker.

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. BUTLER: Anyway - I do not know what she said that time, but it is

something about my driveway.

I can assure the minister, I am going camping this weekend, and I am going

over to her district, by the way, and I will not be in a gravel pit. Still and

all, I believe in what those people are fighting for, and they have a right to

do what they always did. Sit down and consult with them, for glory sake. Do not

be so heavy-handed.

You are discriminating against people because some areas were evicted, other

areas were not. I do not know why it is, I do not know - maybe it is political

districts. I cannot say that for sure.

All I say, Mr. Speaker, in closing, I have one other petition twenty-fourth

of May weekend is getting close, but I have another one for tomorrow. So, all I

am asking on government is to consult with those people and see that they are

given a right to enjoy the great outdoors like they have done for decades.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

Orders of the Day

Private Members' Day

MR. SPEAKER: It being 2:59 p.m. and this being Private Members' Day, I

now call on the hon. Member for Lewisporte to bring forward his private member's

resolution.

The hon. the Member for the District of Lewisporte.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. VERGE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, it is indeed a privilege for me to stand today and to speak to

the private member's motion that I read into the record yesterday.

As the government, we have engaged post-secondary students. We have listened

to post-secondary students, and we have taken decisive action to make

post-secondary education more affordable, more accessible for all those who wish

to avail of higher educational opportunities. We have done that, Mr. Speaker.

What this motion asks is for the House of Assembly to affirm its support for

the actions that have been taken by our government to make post-secondary

education more accessible through things such as the elimination of interest on

the provincial portion of student loans, and through the extension of a tuition

freeze at Memorial University of Newfoundland and at the College of the North

Atlantic.

Mr. Speaker, when I read this motion into the record yesterday, I could hear

some groans from the members opposite. I could hear some groans when I read this

into the record yesterday from the members opposite. It was as if to say - as I

read their body language and I eyed them yesterday when I read this there they

go again patting themselves on the back.

Mr. Speaker, I read into that. When you look at the tremendous progress that

we have made in the area of post-secondary educational availability and

MHA, I feel a deep sense of pride and satisfaction with the advancements that we

have made.

I am going to say to the members opposite that your groans do very little to

dampen my excitement when I see the progress that we have made toward the

opportunities and availability of post-secondary education in this Province.

Mr. Speaker, I am going to zero in on two significant investments we have

made. One was the removal of interest on the provincial portion of the student

loans and the other is the continuation of a tuition freeze at the College of

the North Atlantic and at Memorial University.

Last spring, actually roundabout this time, Mr. Speaker, we passed a bill in

the House that was entitled,

An Act To Amend The Student Financial Assistance

Act. That was a great moment in our Province as the Minister of Education at the

time, who is actually still the Minister of Education, introduced that bill. I

can imagine it was quite a privilege as the minister to be able to stand and

introduce it and to let students know across this Province that we were going to

pass legislation that would eliminate interest on the provincial portion of

their student loans. That passed, it took effect on August 1, 2009, and students

are now availing of that tremendous advantage.

Mr. Speaker, many of our students have benefited from the passage of that

bill; 49,000 students have extra money in their pockets because the interest has

been eliminated on the provincial portion of the student loan. If they continue

to pay at the same rate and the same monthly payment for somebody who borrowed

the maximum, by us passing that bill, they actually had their student loan paid

off fifteen months early. So it actually took fifteen months of payments off

their debt load.

If I do a cross-country comparison, Mr. Speaker and we wonder: How

significant was this? How big was this in the country? Not just in the Province,

but how big was this in the country? The latest information that I have is for

last year. When I look at the interest on the provincial portion of student

loans across the ten provinces in our great country - I look at Alberta. In

Alberta, touted as one of the richest provinces we have, students, on the

provincial portion of the student loans, are charged a rate of interest equal to

prime. If I look at Quebec and Nova Scotia, they charge prime plus an additional

0.5 per cent. In Ontario, students are charged prime plus an additional 1 per

cent; in Manitoba, prime and 1.5 per cent. In P.E.I., students pay prime plus

another 2 per cent on the provincial portion of their student loans. While in

New Brunswick, Saskatchewan, and also in British Columbia, all of these students

are charged prime plus 2.5 per cent.

Now, Mr. Speaker, I just named out nine provinces in Canada where they are

all paying prime, or prime plus some more. When we look at our Province, what

interest are we now charging on the provincial portion of student loans? It is a

big, fat zero, Mr. Speaker. It is nothing. It is zero. That is a country leading

action, Mr. Speaker. We are leading the country in that regard. We are a

national leader and that gives us, I would think, lots to brag about.

Let's talk about the tuition freeze at Memorial University and at the College

of the North Atlantic. Let's see where we sit and let's talk about that great

initiative. Fifty-six million dollars, Mr. Speaker, is what we have invested in

education in order to maintain a tuition freeze at our post-secondary

institutions up until 2011-2012, $56 million. It is fine to talk about $56

million on a big provincial scale, and that is a lot of money invested, but how

does that actually filter down to parents and students, whether it is in St.

Anthony, whether it is in Corner Brook, whether it is in Port aux Basques,

whether it is in Gander, Grand Falls-Windsor, whether it is in my district of

Lewisporte or Twillingate, whether it is on the Avalon Peninsula? What does that

mean to the parents and the students across our Province?

Well, to go to university right now - again, I am looking at last year's

stats and some of these provinces may have had increases since then. We have not

because we have a freeze on, but if you go to Memorial right now it is $2,632.

Did you get that, Mr. Speaker? Two thousand, six hundred and thirty-two dollars,

the cost of one year's tuition at Memorial University. How does that compare to

the rest of country again? Because what we are talking about here is nationally

leading initiatives. These are not just things where we are bringing in some

tremendous initiative in the Province; we are leading the country in these

initiatives, Mr. Speaker. We are leading the country; so, $2,632 in Newfoundland

and Labrador.

Now, if you go to Manitoba, in Manitoba tuition is $3,276 for a year. That is

$644 greater than it is here in Newfoundland and Labrador. How about P.E.I.? In

P.E.I., tuition at their university, average tuition is $4,530. Now remember

what I said about Newfoundland and Labrador, basically $2,632. In Prince Edward

Island, $4,530; that is almost $1,900 a year greater than we are paying right

here. That is a lot of money back into the pockets of students and parents in

this Province. If you go to B.C. it is $5,040, almost double what we are paying

here in Newfoundland and Labrador. New Brunswick is $5,590 for a year's tuition.

Mr. Speaker, again I have to emphasize, $2,600 in Newfoundland and Labrador,

almost $5,600 in New Brunswick. More than double what our students pay to attend

university. In Ontario, it is even more, $5,643; in Nova Scotia, $5,932. Now

what does that translate into, again, in terms of money? If a student goes to

university here in this Province they are paying $2,632; if they go in Nova

Scotia, which is the highest, $5,932. Do you know what that is? That is $3,300 a

year.

My daughter is in university. If she was going in Nova Scotia it would cost

me $3,300 a year more in tuition alone. She is doing a five-year program. That

is $16,500 more I would have to pay if my daughter attended university doing the

same program in Nova Scotia. That is an awful lot of money. That is a lot of

money, Mr. Speaker.

The Canadian average across the country is $2,092 a year more on average. If

you take all the provinces, calculate the average for a five-year program,

anywhere else in the country, on average, is $10,460 more than we are paying

right here in Newfoundland and Labrador; 44 per cent lower is what our tuition

is at the universities, and it is actually 43 per cent lower at the colleges.

Mr. Speaker, these two great initiatives - 0 per cent, the elimination of

interest on the provincial portion of student loans - these two initiatives

alone, that one and the continuation of the tuition freeze, are

nationally-leading initiatives. They put us at the forefront of the country. We

are leading the way in making education available and accessible for our

students.

The only Province that has a lower tuition rate than us is Quebec. Quebec

actually only has a lower rate for students from Quebec. In actual fact, our

students cannot go to university anywhere in this country and get an education

any cheaper than they can get it right here - and cheaper by a lot, Mr. Speaker.

Andy McIntyre once said: If you think education is expensive, you should try

ignorance. Mr. Speaker, we believe in education, we believe in it being

accessible, we believe in it being affordable, and we value it. Do we have

something to applaud? You bet we have something to applaud, Mr. Speaker. Should

we affirm the actions taken by our government? We definitely should, Mr.

Speaker.

I certainly look forward to listening to other people speak on this private

member's motion this afternoon. I will come back at the end of it to close

debate and talk about a few more initiatives that we have taken, again, that are

nationally-leading initiatives.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER (T. Osborne): The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I certainly want to rise and speak to the motion that has been put forward by

the Member for Lewisporte. Mr. Speaker, any time that we can do anything to

promote education in this Province, whether it is through our regular school

system, through post-secondary education, we certainly have an obligation to do

that as parliamentarians.

Mr. Speaker, more importantly, we have an obligation to make that education

accessible to people in this Province, and make it affordable to people, so that

they have the opportunity for further learning, for higher learning, in order to

be able to participate in the careers of their choice and to give back to this

Province.

Mr. Speaker, I do not see education or freezing tuitions as a gift. I see it

as something that is required. I see it as

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible) while you were in here.

MS JONES: We did, actually, I say to the member from Mount Pearl. We were

the first government to freeze tuition rates in this Province at Memorial

University, I say to the member from Mount Pearl. Absolutely. Absolutely, Mr.

Speaker. We were the first government, Mr. Speaker, to put a freeze

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JONES: on tuition rates on this Province

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JONES: and we did it in 1999, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, we also increased the grant program to Memorial University

during those years, even though there was not a lot of money, even though at

that time we were negotiating the deals on Voisey's Bay and we were negotiating

White Rose and we were negotiating deals on Terra Nova, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JONES: We were not seeing the money coming in at that point, Mr.

Speaker, but we were doing the negotiations, and with the small amount of money,

less than half of what the total provincial budget is today, we managed to be

able to put on freeze on tuition rates at Memorial University. It was a good

initiative then, it is a good initiative today, and, Mr. Speaker, it should be

one that is continued.

I would take it a step further, Mr. Speaker: I think they need to be reduced.

I think that tuition fees are only one of the minor costs of educating young

people in this Province today. That is what members have to understand. Tuition

costs are a part of it, but you take a student today, Mr. Speaker, who lives in

the District of Labrador West or in my district, or on the Northern Peninsula,

or down on the West Coast of Newfoundland, Mr. Speaker; there is a cost

associated with sending your children away from home to get a post-secondary

education as well. We see that all too often. We see the cost of the airline

tickets; we see the cost of transporting these students; we see the cost of

board and lodging, whether that be in residence, Mr. Speaker, or in apartments

when they are away from home. These are legitimate costs associated with

educating young people today in our Province as well.

Mr. Speaker, I know a lot of these young people who are in university and

colleges and trades institutions, and a lot of them even have part-time jobs.

They work part time to be able to pay for their education, to help their parents

out a little bit in covering off some of their expenses on a monthly basis. So,

Mr. Speaker, there is still a lot that can be done to relieve some of that

pressure.

Mr. Speaker, I agree; I agree that post-secondary education of any form,

whether that be in the trades or colleges or in the university, should be

accessible to every student in this Province who wants to access it, and that

starts with ensuring that we graduate students today from our high schools that

have the actual credits and have the courses to meet the entrance requirements

into a lot of these colleges and universities. Because what we are seeing today

in the Province is that a lot of these students are coming out of high school

and they do not have the academic requirements lots of times to meet the

entrance requirements to get into some of these post-secondary institutions

whether that is because the courses are not being offered in some of these rural

schools, whether it is because there are no teachers to provide for the

instruction, whether these students are not able to learn through the CDI system

or some other forum, Mr. Speaker. Therefore, you need to start looking at that

first of all.

Secondly, when they go into university and they go into college, tuition is one

part of it; keep the fees down. The fact that we have the lowest tuition rates

in Canada today is absolutely wonderful. It is a great service that we are doing

for our young people, Mr. Speaker, but do not sit back and pat yourselves on the

back and think the job is done. Don't sit back, Mr. Speaker, and say how

wonderful I am because I happen to be the government today and we are going to

continue to do what governments before us have done, and that is to keep a

tuition freeze in place. It does not mean your job is finished, I say to the

hon. members. Look at the cost of living. Look at the expenses that are incurred

today by a young kid in my district who has to leave Charlottetown and come here

to go to school, and what the extra cost is to the parents and that family.

Mr. Speaker, also look at parental income. Look at parental income. Today,

kids are being denied student loans in post-secondary education because their

parents earn a certain amount of money. Well, Mr. Speaker, not always because

you earn money do you have money. That is the sad reality. I had a family, Mr.

Speaker, a few years ago whose kids could not get any student loans to go to

university or post-secondary because of their parental income. They had three

children in university at the one time. To me, Mr. Speaker, that should be

changed. Children who want to go to university, who want to be able to get a

student loan to do it, should have the opportunity to be able to do that. It

does not matter how high or low the tuition rates are; if you cannot access the

money, you do not have any money to pay for it, then it becomes a goal that is

out of your reach. Our job is to ensure that goal is in the reach of every

single child in this Province, every single young man and woman who wants to get

a higher education.

In addition to that, Mr. Speaker, I have dealt with a number of women, in

particular, who are on social assistance. They are single parents in most cases,

they are on social assistance, they want to go back to school, they want to get

a university education or they want to do a college or trades program. The first

thing they have to do as a single parent, with a child, who is on welfare, Mr.

Speaker, they have to go out and borrow a student loan. As a result of it, their

benefits are impacted.

I remember back a few months ago being in a community college in this

Province, going into a classroom - I think it was a business administration

course that I was in. There were a lot of women in that class. They were adults

who had gone back to school to retrain. They were telling me about the few

benefits that they get because they are trying to further their education, they

are trying to re-educate themselves to get a better job to provide better for

their families. I think there were like sixteen women in this particular

program. I do not have the note in front of me now, Mr. Speaker, but they did

outline a number of the challenges that they were experiencing in terms of

driving back and forth. In fact, some of them were driving up to - I think it

was something like forty or fifty kilometres one way to be able to go to school

to do this college course. Yet, Mr. Speaker, they were not getting anything for

their travel back and forth.

Mr. Speaker, that was one of the issues that they raised. The other issue

that they raised were the number of supports that they were receiving. I say to

the minister, there is obviously more than the sixteen women who were in this

classroom, who I met with, who raised that issue as a concern. There have to be

others out there who have that as a concern as well.

I do not know how the travel subsidy works for someone who is on social

assistance and has to drive forty or fifty kilometres to go to the school; I do

not know how those things work. I can only tell you what they have told me and

that is that they were not receiving supplements for those particular benefits

because they were getting a student loan, Mr. Speaker because they were forced

to get a student loan.

Mr. Speaker, there are a number of issues that we could raise around this

particular piece, and I am sure that there are other colleagues who want to

speak today. You need to understand and realize that a tuition freeze is a good

thing in this Province, bringing tuition down is a good thing, but there are

other things that need to be done.

It is unfortunate that this government thinks that when they do one thing

right, they can sit back and pat themselves on the back and not deal with the

other issues that are out there. There are other issues and many of them, Mr.

Speaker, come for a lot of these graduates when they finish school and they

cannot get apprenticeship training and they have trouble getting jobs in this

Province, when they have huge student loans. Mr. Speaker, those are the things

that this government needs to look at and focus on for many of these students.

In fact, I have a folder in my office today of resumes like this and most of

them are university graduates or college graduates that are looking for jobs in

this Province, that are trying to find jobs in this Province. So, Mr. Speaker,

one of the things that government should be doing today instead of bringing in a

motion to pat themselves on the back because they froze tuition something our

government did over ten years ago, Mr. Speaker but instead they should be

bringing in a motion to talk about how they are going to ensure more gainful

employment for many of these people that are coming out of our universities who

have high student loans, need jobs, need to be able to earn money, and deal with

the issues around apprenticeship, which is still a huge issue as well. I

encourage the government to start looking at some of these things.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and I will be supporting the motion today.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Baie

Verte-Springdale.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. POLLARD: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I am delighted to stand in the hon. House today to second the motion put

forward by my hon. colleague, the Member for Lewisporte, that this House would

affirm the actions of the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador for its

outstanding leadership on student aid and post-secondary education

Mr. Speaker, graduation from high school is not the end of a person's

education; in fact, as we all know it is just the very beginning. Albeit, we do

acknowledge that graduation is a very significant milestone in a person's life.

It usually involves a huge financial commitment on the part of parents.

Speaking of parents, Mr. Speaker, we do appreciate their support. Their input

enriches and improves, no doubt, our education system and ultimately leads to

higher student achievement, Mr. Speaker.

So at the K-12 level, the cost of an education is minimal. Although some

parents still struggle, it is a manageable level. That came about because of the

various actions taken by our government which ease the pain and lessen the

financial stress upon families, Mr. Speaker. I could mention two of these

actions as examples: number one, school fees were eliminated in 2006; and number

two, on top of that, we provided free textbooks to high schools in 2007. This

initiative required $12.8 million investment. That was greatly appreciated by

all parents and schools councils alike, Mr. Speaker.

As a government, we want to continue to ensure that students receive a

quality education, not only from kindergarten to Grade 12 but also at a

post-secondary level. We desire that our post-secondary students would have an

easy access to an affordable education. So bearing that in mind, Mr. Speaker,

with that objective, our government embarked upon an enhanced student aid

package a few years ago. With a record $1.3 billion invested in Budget 2010 in

education, we can proudly say today that Newfoundland and Labrador can boast of

being a national leader in student aid and student debt.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. POLLARD: Mr. Speaker, in Aristotle's words, we believe that the fruit

of education is sweet. We realize that an educated society is a successful

society. One cannot go wrong with investing in our young people. So

consequently, as was stated in the 2009 Speech from the Throne, every action is

grounded in the conviction that our success tomorrow depends on the investments

that we make in education today. How true that is, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, we realized that post-secondary students and their families

faced a heavy burden of trying to grapple with their educational costs,

regardless if they entered MUN or the College of the North Atlantic or some

other institution. As a result, after several extensive consultations, our

government took swift decisive action, took decisive steps to implement a suite

of initiatives that put Newfoundland and Labrador on the educational map, Mr.

Speaker.

I will attempt to highlight some of these. One, August 1, 2009 the interest

on the provincial portion of the student loan was eliminated making us the first

jurisdiction in Canada to take such a bold step, which benefited approximately

49,000 students, Mr. Speaker. The second feature, since 2003, tuition fees were

frozen at national lows making us second only to Quebec which only applies to

Quebec students.

Now, Mr. Speaker, my hon. colleague from Lewisporte waxed eloquently and gave

us a lot more detail in considering these two features. He did an exemplary job

in explaining these two initiatives.

Number three, Mr. Speaker, we reduced the expected parental contributions to

student financial assistance programs - how important is that? Well, it means

that more low and middle income families are able to access financial assistance

which, in turn, enables our children to pursue their chosen career. So that is

greatly appreciated by the affected parents, Mr. Speaker.

Another feature of our national program, Mr. Speaker, that is known

nationally, another feature. We established a six-month grace period after

graduation. So that if a student had some trouble in getting a job or trouble in

transitioning from college to the workplace, that six-month window was greatly

appreciated. I know several students who availed of that six-month window, Mr.

Speaker, my two daughters included.

Another feature, Mr. Speaker, we have provided flexibility to adjust the

terms of their repayment arrangement if a person or a student runs into some

problems, cannot meet their monthly payment. Example, we could extend the

amortization period to lower their monthly payment, Mr. Speaker. Another

feature, we introduced a payment deferral plan for up to a maximum of fifty-four

months, or four-and-a-half years for borrowers who experience difficulty meeting

their repayment obligations due to a low income.

As a government, we recognized the needs of students. We had compassion, we

had empathy, and we took the necessary adjustments, Mr. Speaker. Furthermore, we

increased provincial financial assistance limits from $110 a week to $140 per

week. Because of these actions and many more, Mr. Speaker, it is no wonder that

Newfoundland and Labrador is leading the country in student debt reform and

the envy of the nation. No wonder we are attracting students from all over the

word. No wonder students from all over other jurisdictions are scrambling to

come to our great Province to attend our institutions. No wonder we are looked

upon as a model, Mr. Speaker.

Yet, what is so intriguing, what is so very important to point out, Mr.

Speaker, is this, that it is important to point out that we did all that while

maintaining funding for facilities and programs. That, in itself, is a

remarkable feat because past governments, once they have given something, would

usually take something back in return, but not this government, Mr. Speaker. We

continue to build, we continue to enhance, we continue to add, we continue to

improve, and we continue to consult, Mr. Speaker.

I would be remiss, Mr. Speaker, if I did not mention the contribution of two

individuals, and many more of course and their staff, who led the charge of

student aid reform. Because of the hard work and the dedication and commitment

of the former Education Minister, the hon. Government House Leader and hon.

Member for St. George's-Stephenville, and the present Education Minister, the

hon. Member for Grand Bank, Newfoundland and Labrador post-secondary students

can proudly hold their head up high knowing that not only are they getting a

quality education, but also getting an education that is both affordable and

accessible.

Mr. Speaker, these individuals provided the expertise, the strong leadership

and the tenacity that was necessary to implement this wide array of initiatives

that grabbed the attention of the nation and grabbed students of our Province.

Now other provinces look at us as a model, they want to follow suit, Mr.

Speaker. It is good to see our Province out in front, leading the charge,

leading the pack, Mr. Speaker.

It is also important to point out that this thing was not done in a corner.

There were numerous consultations with the various student groups, as my hon.

colleague pointed out earlier, various engagements; many, many around the

Province. Students were consulted. Our government heard what they said. Our

government listened to what they said. Our government understood what they said.

Our government went back and deliberated. They discussed, they debated, and then

they delivered, Mr. Speaker. As a consequence, we are a national leader today.

All of these actions, Mr. Speaker, are based upon the philosophy that was put

forward by Newton Baker, who once said, "The man who graduates today and stops

learning tomorrow is uneducated the day after."

Mr. Speaker, that is the very reason that propels us as a government today to

continue to address the debt load of our post-secondary students. That is the

very reason why we continue to strive to be the best as we can be in offering an

affordable and accessible education to all of our post-secondary students, Mr.

Speaker. That is the reason why we are, indeed, a national leader in that

domain. That is the reason why I can stand in this hon. House today and proudly

second the motion put forward by my hon. colleague.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for The Straits & White Bay North.

MR. DEAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

It is indeed a privilege to be able to stand this afternoon in this House and

speak to the motion that was put forward by the Member for Baie

Verte-Springdale.

Basically, we would want to be in support of any initiative that improves the

access to post-secondary education in our Province, both for our residents

within our own Province and for those who also come to Newfoundland and Labrador

to study, because it is very important to realize that our university and our

colleges certainly attract others from around our country, and indeed, others

from around the world. So we want to make sure that all we are doing in terms of

recruitments and so on are things that will definitely bring people into our

education system.

It was noted by the Leader of the Opposition earlier, and I think it is

worthy of noting when it comes to the tuition freeze, that it was initially

instituted by the Liberal government back in 1999, true to the promise to

increase the grant to Memorial University for the two years following by $7

million from approximately $99 million to approximately $106 million. It was

done to ensure that tuition rates would not increase over those two years and it

is certainly good to see that this government picked up on that particular

benefit to students. It has continued, and as the motion suggests today, it will

continue for at least another year. We would trust that it would continue for

some time to come.

Statistics show that since this tuition freeze has been implemented, that

indeed student enrolment has increased. That if we look at statistics since

1999, we would find that enrolment has increased by more than 12 per cent. What

is significant about that is that at the same time we realize the population of

our Province has declined by about 16 per cent for those under the age of

thirty. So that certainly is significant and important to note. Obviously, it

would be credit programs and initiatives such as this that would encourage

people to be involved in post-secondary education through these kinds of

programs, that while your population is decreasing and the population that you

have is aging, yet the numbers enrolling into our university programs and

college programs continue to increase. So that is certainly a good thing to see.

There are some things though, obviously, that we need to be concerned about.

As we recognize the usefulness of our program here this afternoon, there are

some other things that we need to know. When we consider the full-time students

in our Province, our students do represent the most indebted students in the

country, if you will. Nearly 60 per cent of our undergraduates, as compared to a

national average of approximately 42 per cent, do require student financial

assistance to attend university and college. So that is very important for us to

recognize and to understand the need to make sure that we do support our

students financially, that there are grant programs available, that there are

good student loan programs available, and that the financial piece of going to

university, college and so on is not a barrier for them, and that indeed there

is a way that they can have funding provided for them. Certainly, it is very,

very important that we realize the necessity of that.

Currently, students who graduate from a university or a college program that

is of at least an eighty-week duration they are eligible, as we all know, for

debt reduction grants provided that they meet certain specific criteria. The

issue that has been raised with this, of course, is the fact that these grants

are not available until the end of the studies. So, they would do very little in

some circumstances to encourage students to initially enrol in post-secondary

education. I believe that is something that we can look at in addition to our

commitment to what we are looking at here in the motion this afternoon. We could

look at a way that possibly these grants could be up-front grants rather than

being grants one's study program, again removing that barrier for low-income

students and students who require the financial assistance and so on to be able

to really participate in post-secondary education.

I know from my own experience, as many of the hon. members in this House

would know, putting your children through university is a fairly expensive

proposition. I had my seven years of doing that as a parent. Being able to do it

was great, but yet, realizing so many of the expenses that have already been

mentioned by the members who have spoken, it is not only the tuition piece, but

as we live in the rural parts of our Province, as so many of us do, and we send

our students, our children into the centres of either Corner Brook or St. John's

- in my case, two of girls went to Corner Brook and did their nursing degrees

there. The extra requirements that are placed upon you to financially to provide

housing, transportation back and forth, to just be there to support them and so

on, and all of the other things that are necessary, certainly it takes a lot of

money. Any time that people are looking for special funding and so on, and I

believe the smoother and the easier that they can access that then I believe

that the most benefit to them.

Another item that I would like to just make mention of is the international

tuition rates and rates for Canadian students. While Canadian students pay the

same as our provincial students, I do believe that the international student

pays significantly more to attend MUN than residents of Canada. I am not sure

what the justification for that would be, but I would suggest again that it

would be something that we could look at in terms of encouraging immigrants and

so on, international students to come to our Province. Then having parity, if

you will, in terms of tuition fees would certainly benefit us as a Province and

benefit our universities and colleges as bodies of students because these people

obviously have great experience that they bring with them. There is great value

and they add great value to our university and to our Province as a whole.

Again, something I am sure that we can look at.

University is the stepping stone from our high school. Many of us I am sure,

as MHAs, probably attended graduations in the past week or so, or if not, we

certainly will do so in the next week or so. I had the privilege of going to one

on Friday evening, as I mentioned in a member's statement yesterday, watching as

forty-eight students of Harriot Curtis Collegiate received their graduation

certificates. Our universities are only as good as what our high schools are in

terms of preparing our students for that particular part of their education

process.

When we look at some of the challenges that are there as well, realizing the

programs that are offered in the three categories of programs of honours and

academic and general studies, MUN in particular, obviously, without being a

mature student, will not consider the general program. So it is important that

again that students are prepared, that students understand the options that are

there and they realize the importance of a good education early in their life

and coming up to the high school time that they are provided the counselling and

the guidance and the availability of information and workshops and other things

that sometimes we take for granted in our larger centres. Certainly, not seeing

it all that often, not having access and so on, not understanding the programs

that are there, the more that government can do and the more that our Department

of Education can do in general, I guess, to really ensure that the message gets

out there, that it is understood, that students know what the options are.

Again, we think back to when we were high school and then going through the past

twenty, thirty years, whatever the case might be for us, in our careers, we

realize that probably all the information that we would have liked to have had

was not there for us. So students being able to know and to understand that are

very important.

We know that students who are being educated in rural parts of our Province

are experiencing and encountering situations and challenges that are unique to

them. So, whether it is tuition fees, or it is financial challenges and so on,

it is important, again, that we do as much as we possibly can.

One of the other items that I would like to mention in the next moment or so

is our apprenticeship programs. We get a lot of calls that come to our office,

students that are concerned about the fact that they cannot find employers to

take them on as an apprentice. The government has recently created this special

task force to identify future labour market trends and employment opportunities

in the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador, and the labour force that will be

needed to supply that particular market. That is a good thing to do; that is a

good initiative. Again, the task force led to the development of an incentive

program to attract people to the trades, and the Provincial Apprenticeship and

Certification Board to develop and oversee the program. The problem that seems

to be there with that is that many are finding it difficult to find work in

their trade to get through their apprenticeship program. Again, something that

is important.

The point of offering incentives, obviously, for apprenticeship programs in

particular then we need to be certain that those apprentices can go and find the

on-the-job training and the hands-on experience and so on that they need to be

able to do to finish their programs. What we are hearing from the college, in

particular, is that is not always the case. So while we have seen some new

initiatives in recent, just back a couple of months ago, two or three months ago

in the winter, we know that government released the announcement regarding

apprenticeship programs and so on. We would encourage that kind of thing and we

would hope that we can see all of our apprentices in the Province being able to

get the proper on-the-job training, being able to get the proper sponsorship

that they need and so on.

Another issue that is important, when we consider post-secondary education is

the necessity for housing. We have addressed that in the fall session, I

believe, possibly in the House. We talked about it a little bit, and it is an

ongoing thing, and while we have seen government, since back in 2007 or so,

budgeting large sums of money to address the housing situation in St. John's and

in Corner Brook and we see some of that coming again in this year's Budget, we

realize the importance of seeing that through. We have debated the parking lot

at MUN which is supposed to be a residency, and we hope that that will come

through in short order and so on, but we do realize that our vacancy in the

Province is practically nil. I think it is said to be around 1 per cent or so.

So that is not very much and that is very, very important to us.

Again, the cost of housing in terms of I know the low tuition, and I

applaud where we are. We are excited about the fact that we are the lowest in

the country and we certainly want to stay there, but it is part of a platform

that has to be built upon and we would encourage proper housing, access to

housing, adequate housing. We encourage financial programs to assist with all

the other things that are important for students to get through their academic

careers.

So, Mr. Speaker, it has been a privilege to stand for the past few moments to

speak to this motion. It is certainly something that I have no problem

supporting and I would trust that the offering of a tuition freeze would be

something that we could see in our system for some years to come.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Education.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. KING: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

It is indeed a pleasure for me to have the opportunity today to stand and

take a few minutes to speak in support of a motion that is on the table, a

motion that is very important not only to our government in demonstrating our

commitment to students, but very important to the future of the Province and

very important to the current and future students of post-secondary systems in

Newfoundland and Labrador.

I want to take a moment, Mr. Speaker, first of all, to recognize a couple of

individuals who are here in the gallery with us: Keith Dunne and Daniel Smith.

I want to talk for a few moments about the relationship that we have had over

the last number of years, during my tenure and before my tenure, with the

Canadian Federation of Students. We have a strong working relationship, one

where the students address issues as they see fit with us, and do on a regular

basis. We have a mutual understanding that sometimes we agree to disagree on

things, but I can say with a degree of certainty, Mr. Speaker, that by working

together with the students over the last number of years we have been able to

realize some significant gains for students in this Province; some significant

gains to benefit the students who are not only attending post-secondary today,

Mr. Speaker, but those who will be attending post-secondary in the future.

We recognize, Mr. Speaker, the government recognizes the importance of

supporting our students. I think all members in the House would agree that the

future of the Province rests on our ability to provide quality educational

experiences and ensure that every possible avenue is explored for us to have an

educated, affluent population in society. So, as those of us who sit here today

in the House of Assembly, as we age and move forward and a new generation comes

behind us, the growth of the Province and the future of the Province of

Newfoundland and Labrador will only be as strong as the strength, and the

quality, and the character of the individuals and the education level of the

individuals who come behind us.

Mr. Speaker, that has always been a cornerstone for this government and it

will continue to be a cornerstone for this government. We will continue to work

with the students and continue to make education a priority in all of the

decisions that we make, budgetary and otherwise. With that, it is indeed a

pleasure to have these couple of individuals join us today to hear the debate

and to hear what hon. members had to say.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. KING: Mr. Speaker, I want to talk a bit about the student aid program

and some of the benefits that we have realized. I want to remind members in the

House as well that when we are talking about the package of assistance that is

available for students in this Province, we are not only talking about the

student aid package, Mr. Speaker, we are talking about a number of other things

that support students. We are talking, for example, about our investment in

infrastructure at the post-secondary level, Mr. Speaker, because the investment

in infrastructure results in better quality facilities and better quality

learning environments for our students.

I think, Mr. Speaker, more recently about the investment in Grenfell, the

academic building for Grenfell College in Corner Brook. I think about the

investment in deferred maintenance for Memorial University. I think about the

investment for College of the North Atlantic, the Seal Cove campus, the Prince

Phillip Drive campus, the new campus in Labrador West, are a couple that come to

mind.

I also think about our investment in programs. During the last Budget for

Memorial we had the pleasure and the honour, through the Minister of Finance, to

introduce support for a doctoral program at Memorial University, Mr. Speaker.

We are supporting all of these initiatives to demonstrate our continuous and

ongoing and unwavering support for our students. That is really what this debate

today is all about. The motion here today is all about reaffirming government's

support for the future of this Province and government's support for the current

and the future educational needs of our students.

Mr. Speaker, I will touch on a couple that have already been mentioned. The

tuition freeze is one that I think - in the area of $6 million was invested this

year for College of the North Atlantic and for Memorial. That one is one that we

have maintained now for the last number of years and feedback has been very

positive on that. I think members may have said this already but it bears

repeating, that we do have the lowest tuition in all of Canada for public

education, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. KING: In all of Canada. The only exception, Mr. Speaker, is for

Quebec residents only in the Province of Quebec. That is the only place where

you will find lower tuition. Newfoundland and Labrador is the lowest in all of

Canada for public education and we are very proud of that. We are very proud of

that, and that is why we have continued to make that investment, Mr. Speaker,

because while we are keeping the tuition down near the bottom of the barrel we

are keeping the quality of our programs at the top of the barrel. We are leading

the pack in many ways, Mr. Speaker, and we are very proud of that. We are very

proud of the opportunities that exist in this Province for students.

Mr. Speaker, a number of great strides have been made in the last three or

four years on our student aid package. I want to touch on those, Mr. Speaker,

because and then I am going to talk a little bit about some of the issues that

have been raised here today.

I want to touch, first of all, on a very momentous occasion last summer where

I had the good fortune, not long after becoming minister, to join with the

Canadian Federation of Students in a trademark day, a momentous day where we

eliminated the interest on the provincial student loan portion of the student

loan.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. KING: Mr. Speaker, nowhere else in Canada is that happening. Nowhere

else in Canada, but this government through our work with the students who are

led by the two individuals in the gallery, it is through that co-operative

effort and the collaborative work that we are able to continue to invest in our

students, Mr. Speaker. We do, Mr. Speaker -

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. KING: Thank you.

My colleague says: I thank you very much for that.

We continuously challenge the federal government to match the decisions that

we are making. We have eliminated the interest in this Province and we want the

federal government to do the same thing on the federal portion of the student

loan. We challenge them to do that, Mr. Speaker. We will all be better off for

it but more importantly, the students of Newfoundland and Labrador and the

students in the rest of Canada will be better off if the federal government were

to match the courageous decision that we have taken to eliminate the interest on

the student loans, Mr. Speaker.

Let me touch on a couple of other things that kind of get fluffed off by

members opposite sometimes in their speaking. We talked about the need to

continuously lower the amount of money students are borrowing. Mr. Speaker,

check the track record for the last three or four years and you will find that

this government each year has lowered the amount of money on a weekly basis that

students have been required to borrow, while at the same time, Mr. Speaker,

increasing the up-front free money. The up-front grant has increased every year

for the last number of years, Mr. Speaker - a move, I might add, that was not

supported by previous governments to our tenure. That, Mr. Speaker, is

significant because students today are now borrowing less money, a lot less

money than they have in previous years, and they are into their programs of

study with a lot more free Up-Front, Needs-Based Grant money than they have had

in many, many, many years, Mr. Speaker. That is a very, very positive move, one

that we are very pleased with, and certainly one that we are very pleased that

we have been able to bring forward knowing that the previous Liberal

Administration eliminated that years ago, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, let me touch on a couple of things. There have been a couple of

issues raised by members opposite, and it is always a challenge in this House -

when we are here today debating such a good news motion, it is always a

challenge to listen to members opposite who continue to be negative, Mr.

Speaker. They continue to be negative and they continue to say things that

misrepresent the facts, and they are not fair, not only to government but they

are not fair to individuals, Mr. Speaker.

I heard a piece of the Leader of the Opposition's speech - I listened very

closely to a piece of her speech - but it is very disappointing, because I also

listened to the member opposite last week when she chastised and criticized the

teachers in Labrador. Check the Hansard and you will find it, Mr. Speaker. The

member opposite stood on her feet and said that students in Labrador - because

of the teachers - are getting less than a quality education. Mr. Speaker, it is

shameful; it is shameful that anybody stands in this House and utters that kind

of rhetoric to criticize the quality of education.

MR. SPEAKER (Kelly): The hon. the Leader of the Opposition, on a point of

order.

MS JONES: Mr. Speaker, I would think that the member opposite, who has

been in the education field as long as he has, would recognize the difference

and take the context of what I said accurately. What I said is there are

vacancies in the schools; there are classrooms in my district today, Mr.

Speaker, in Grades 4 to 6, where they have had up to three teachers this year

who have left those classrooms. The minister knows that today many of these

schools have substitute classroom teachers, as they do on the North Coast of

Labrador, Mr. Speaker, and his colleague next to him can tell him the difficulty

there has been in recruiting teachers in these schools. What the minister says,

Mr. Speaker, is a false

interpretation.

MR. SPEAKER: There is no point of order.

The hon. the Minister of Education.

MR. KING: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I see that the trend continues, Mr. Speaker. The member opposite stands up,

she takes three minutes of my time and says absolutely nothing to the House, I

say.

Let me go back to where I was, Mr. Speaker, because the member opposite can

sit there, stand there, and say all she wants. She can do cartwheels if she

wants. Hansard will record the comments the member made, and the member made the

comment that the students in Labrador are getting less than a quality education.

I submit to you, Mr. Speaker, the quality of the educational experience, the

quality of the educational experience is determined in large part by the quality

of the teaching. So I say the member opposite should stand to her feet and she

should retract her statement about the quality of the teaching in Labrador, I

say, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. KING: If the member opposite wants a point of order, she should

retract and apologize to the people in Labrador for those comments.

Mr. Speaker, I am not going to belabour that point, because there is any

number of points

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition, is this a new point

of order?

MS JONES: Yes it is, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: Okay.

MS JONES: In fact, Mr. Speaker, the one who should be apologizing here is

the Minister of Education, for having children in classrooms these days that do

not have teachers to teach in them, Mr. Speaker -

MR. SPEAKER: I ask the hon. member to get to her point of order.

MS JONES: and having schools in this Province today where you have up

to four and five grades in the one classroom, Mr. Speaker, with one teacher.

That is what the Minister of Education should be apologizing to the children of

this Province for today, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: There is no point of order.

The hon. the Minister of Education.

MR. KING: Surprise, surprise, no point of order. Another two minutes of

my time, Mr. Speaker. Shall I go on? Shall I go on about the negativity? Shall I

go on about the negativity?

Members opposite stood in this House yesterday, Mr. Speaker, and made

allegations about the access to information in the Department of Education. Mr.

Speaker, unfortunately, I did not get the chance to end my comments, but let me

say them today, for the record, so the people understand where the negativity

comes from across on that side of the House, I say to you.

Three telephone calls, Mr. Speaker, from the Department of Education were

made to the office of the member opposite - three times - with messages left,

wanting clarification on what exactly the request for information entailed, Mr.

Speaker, before we followed the policy of government, and before we sent the

correspondence out. Guess how many times, Mr. Speaker, guess how many times we

had a return phone call?

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Zero.

MR. KING: Zero, Mr. Speaker. They had no interest no interest - in

finding out the facts, no interest in working with government, no interest

whatsoever in finding what went on in Qatar. The interest is only to stand over

on that side of the House and grandstand and have a little fun.

Well, Mr. Speaker, I say when they are interested in governing they had

better get their act together, because we are interested in doing what is right

for the Province and for the people of Newfoundland and Labrador.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. KING: Mr. Speaker, I want to talk about a couple of things that are

very important in the Province, now that I have had a chance to point out a

little bit of the negativity on the other side of the House. Let me correct

another little error that was made. The member opposite who spoke ahead of me

referenced the recently called Skills Task Force on apprenticeship. I want to

remind people that the task force actually released their report in 2007. The

task force was called about five or six years ago and the report has been

released. I want to just share this with people because there is a lot of talk

about apprenticeship in the Province. I want to talk a little bit about what is

in that report, Mr. Speaker, so that people have a clear understanding.

The apprenticeship report that came out, Mr. Speaker, was designed around

offering recommendations for government and for the public and private sector to

support students, Mr. Speaker. There were some eighty recommendations and they

were split. There were a number of recommendations that government, itself, we

were asked to address, and there were a number of recommendations for the

private sector to address. I am happy to report, Mr. Speaker, as I have on many,

many occasions before, that every single recommendation that government was

asked to address to support the further development of apprenticeship in this

Province, every single one of them have been actioned, Mr. Speaker every

single one of them.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. KING: I also want to take a moment and move off apprenticeship. We

have talked about student housing, and housing is a very important issue. My

colleagues up in the gallery listening would know this because they made a case

to me just this past year in looking for extra support for student housing. Mr.

Speaker, I remind my critic across the way that it is this government that just

confirmed in excess of $80 million in student housing for this Province, which

will include 700 beds: 500 beds for the St. John's campus of Memorial and 200

beds for the Corner Brook campus of Memorial, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: I remind the hon. member that his time for speaking has

expired.

MR. KING: By leave, to clue up?

MR. SPEAKER: By leave, to clue up?

AN HON. MEMBER: No leave.

MR. SPEAKER: No leave.

MR. KING: Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: Leave has been denied.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The Chair recognizes the hon. Member for Signal Hill-Quidi

Vidi.

MS MICHAEL: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

I am quite pleased to have an opportunity to speak to

A point of order, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: A point of order.

MS MICHAEL: I really hate, Mr. Speaker, to put it in the way I have to

put it, but I have to put it. I have mentioned it before in the House - and this

is not a game; this is very serious - I have a hearing problem, and when the

shouting is going on something actually happens to me physically - I am serious

and I cannot speak because of what is going on in my head, with the shouting.

MR. SPEAKER: I would ask all hon. members to please be conscious that the

hon. member has the floor and that the hon. member does have a hearing

impairment, and for all hon. members to respect that.

Thank you.

MS MICHAEL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MS MICHAEL: Thank you very much.

I am very pleased to speak to this motion. It is an important motion. I am

glad that the motion points out some good things that have happened, and there

is no doubt that they have. Because of some of the things that have been said in

the House, I would also like to point out that as people who sit in this part of

the House in Opposition, it is part of what our democratic process is in this

House. Our democratic process is that we have Opposition in order to bring new

ideas forward, in order to challenge. It is not always to say something is bad,

but to push ideas further.

We do question, I hear it all the time, saying: Why are you being so

negative? Why are you not satisfied? I am after hearing the Premier say that

during the debate on the Budget, I heard almost every single member of the

government side of the House stand and wonder why I am not satisfied. Well, I am

not satisfied because there is always more. We have to keep putting vision out

there and we have to keep pushing for more. That is what I try to do, Mr.

Speaker.

To show what the role of Opposition is, I would like to pick up on one of the

statements that are in the resolution. That is pointing out that there was the

elimination of interest on the provincial portion of student loans that was

effective August 1, 2009.

Mr. Speaker, I am really pleased to see that. I am absolutely pleased to see

it, especially because in 2007 I was promoting no interest on the provincial

part of the loans. I promoted it during the campaign in the general election in

2007, to the point that it inspired the Canadian Federation of Students to say

that is something to ask for. I applaud them, because they put on a fantastic

campaign and they were able to convince the Minister of Education and this

government that this was something to do. The government knew students wanted it

and they did it. I am glad they did it but I would also like to point out that I

was the one who started talking about it. My party was the one who was saying

it.

So there is a