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October 26, 2021

HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY PROCEEDINGS

Vol. L No. 27

The

House met at 1:30 p.m.

SPEAKER (Bennett):

Order, please!

Admit

strangers.

Welcome,

everyone. Joining us in the public gallery today I'd like to welcome Jordan

Noseworthy from Badger, who'll be the subject of a Member's statement today.

Welcome,

Jordan.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

Statements by

Members

SPEAKER:

Today we will hear Members' Statements by the hon. Members for the Districts of

Lake Melville, Stephenville - Port au Port, Cape St. Francis, Baie Verte - Green

Bay and Grand Falls-Windsor - Buchans.

The hon.

the Member for Lake Melville.

P. TRIMPER:

Thank you, Speaker.

I would

like to introduce to this House of Assembly one of the youngest and brightest

authors from the District of Lake Melville, Ms. Breana Andrews.

Breana,

born and raised in Happy Valley-Goose Bay, and a recent graduate from UNB's

kinesiology program, had the ingenious idea to educate on Indigenous languages

using her illustrations, along with translations in various Indigenous languages

Breana

published her first book, Learning and

Preserving , in February of this year, and her second book,

Searching For… Inuktitut Style in May.

Her

first publication, a colouring book, incorporates three Indigenous languages:

Inuktitut, Innu-aimun, and Mi'kmaq. Her second book is a word search with words

Breana

recently said, “I really wanted to create things to not only help people, but

educators to have a resource that would make it easy for them to teach the good

things about the Indigenous cultures without feeling like they are

overstepping.”

I would

like all hon. Members to join me in congratulating Breana on her publications

and her success in making the promotion of Indigenous languages accessible and

entertaining for all.

Thank

you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Stephenville - Port au Port.

T. WAKEHAM:

Thank you, Speaker.

Clyde

Russell is a member of the Qalipu First Nation and was born in Kippens in 1956.

A retired Canadian Forces Colonel with more than 33 years of command and staff

experience, Clyde has particular experience in counter-terrorism and special

operations. Since his retirement in 2009, he has done additional work with the

Canadian Special Operations Forces Command.

Throughout his career, he was an instructor and mentor at training facilities at

home and abroad. He's had significant command experience ranging from recovery

operations for the Swissair Flight 111 crash off Nova Scotia in 1998, assisting

the migration of Kosovo refugees to Canada in 1999, Commanding Officer of

Canada's National Counter-Terrorism Unit, director of the Counter-Terrorism and

Special Operations at Canadian National Defence Headquarters and chief of staff

for the Land Force Atlantic Area.

Outside

his military service, Clyde has served as a board member of the Bay St. George

Sick Children's Foundation, vice-president of Bay St. George Seniors

Transportation System, board chair for the Stephenville Historic French Cultural

Association, Grand Knight with the local Knights of Columbus, a member of Rotary

and as military advisor to the Town of Stephenville. He has also worked with

many service and community organizations on community projects such as food

banks and various fundraisers. Clyde was recently honoured with the Seniors of

Distinction Award.

I ask

all hon. Members to congratulate Clyde on his service to his community, his

province and his country.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for Cape

St. Francis.

J. WALL:

Thank you, Speaker.

Today I

take the opportunity to congratulate 15 outstanding young athletes from my

district who received the 2021 Premier's Athletic Award for Athletic Excellence.

October 4, several of my colleagues and I had the honour of attending this event

where the following athletes were recognized for their particular sport:

Nicholas Smith, baseball; Jacob Billard and Cassandra Blackmore, diving; Kyla

Piercey, gymnastics; Ronan Whitten, hockey; Ryan Crocker, Alexander Hollett,

Emma Bo-Yu Pittman, Emily Reglar, Alex Ryan and Noah Ryan, karate; Kate Hickey

and Ciara Molloy, soccer; and Sarah Power and Abigail Woodman, softball.

These

athletes were selected to receive this award based on their athletic

accomplishments in the previous year. This is certainly a testament to their

character and dedication to training in their chosen sport during a pandemic. In

addition to these athletes, I also recognize the contribution from their family

members. Without their support, these awards would not have been possible.

Speaker,

I would ask all hon. Members to join me in congratulating these outstanding

athletes from the beautiful District of Cape St. Francis on receiving the 2021

Premier's Athletic Award for Athletic Excellence.

Thank

you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for Baie

Verte - Green Bay.

B. WARR:

Speaker, today I'd like to highlight an amazing woman from Springdale known as

“Mama” to children in Haiti. Karen Huxter started a school in Haiti, which

reopened in March of this year as it was closed due to the turmoil, insecurity

and unrest in the Caribbean nation.

Karen

has worked with children in Haiti for over two decades, opening a children's

home and a school. At the age of 75, Karen would be considered at risk of

serious illness from COVID-19; therefore, the co-director, Luckner Estimable,

who is Haitian, moved his family into the mission when Karen returned home due

to a lung condition.

Karen

has an adopted Haitian son, Luc, who has cerebral palsy and moved to Springdale

with Karen. Luc is thrilled to be playing soccer with the local school team.

Although Luc does not have full use of his arms, he has good strength in his

legs and everyone is cheering him on.

Recently

while playing at a high school tournament in St. Lawrence, Luc scored his first

goal and, amazingly, both teams celebrated.

I ask my

hon. colleagues to join me today in wishing Luc much success in soccer and

applaud Karen Huxter for her compassion and her concern for others.

Thank

you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Windsor - Buchans.

C. TIBBS:

Thank you, Speaker.

I take

my place today to honour a true champion in the world of mixed martial arts.

Jordan Noseworthy was born and raised in Badger, Newfoundland, and became

interested in MMA at the young age of 22.

Jordan,

upon completion of university, started training more frequently at several gyms

while teaching in Grand Prairie. He became more passionate about his fighting

career during this time. Years of hard work and dedication saw Jordan's dream

become a reality on October 16 of this year, when he defeated Hank Anderson in

the very first round to become the new Fight League Atlantic amateur heavyweight

champion.

Jordan

continues to work hard and train every day as he looks toward a professional

career in MMA. He has never forgotten his roots, where he is from and the people

that got him to where he is today. This includes his dad, Denis, and his mom,

Michelle, who still cannot watch his fights as she fears for her son, but

ironically is his biggest fan.

I ask

all Members to join me as I congratulate Jordan Noseworthy, a true champion. We

are very proud of you and look forward to watching you in the ring for years to

come.

Thank

you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

Statements by Ministers.

Statements by

Ministers

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Digital Government and Service NL.

S. STOODLEY:

Speaker, October is

Cybersecurity Awareness Month.

This

internationally recognized campaign is focused on helping all Canadians learn

about the importance of how they can stay safe online using simple steps to

protect themselves, their devices and their information.

The

desire for information has never been greater, and it presents an increased risk

of being susceptible to phishing schemes and other socially engineered

cyberattacks. According to the Federal Bureau of Investigation, phishing was the

most common type of cybercrime in 2020.

Throughout this month our government will continue to highlight the importance

consider when using online services.

Cyberthreats to personal information and infrastructure can be limited by

following a few key practices: continue to be diligent in your daily activities

online; never disclose your usernames and/or passwords; never click on links or

attachments in emails from unknown sources, or ones that may be unexpected

without further investigation; regularly update security questions and

passwords; always lock your computer or mobile device when not in use; and make

sure you check the from email address if an odd request comes in that you're not

excepting.

Government continues its strong commitment for cybersecurity education and

awareness across the public sector. Information protection and cybersecurity is

everyone's responsibility.

Thank

you, Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Ferryland.

L. O'DRISCOLL:

Thank you, Speaker, and I

thank the minister for an advance copy of her statement.

behalf of the Official Opposition, I would like to also stress the importance of

staying safe online.

We also

know that the online environment comes with scams and the potential for data

leaks and hacking, but in the past little while these scams and hacks have

become more elaborate and seem more realistic. A good rule to live by is that if

it seems to be too good to be true, it is.

The

minister provided some important suggestions for members of the public service,

but there are also precautions which members of the public can take to protect

their own personal information. These include: verifying websites before

entering information; not clicking links in emails if you do not know the

sender; not publishing personal information, like your birthdate or your

mother's maiden name, online, information that could be a security answer to

your online banking.

encourage all residents of the province to do their part to help each other in

staying safe online and to report any scams or online cyberattacks to the

appropriate authorities.

Thank

you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Labrador West.

J. BROWN:

Thank you, Speaker, and I

thank the minister for an advance copy of her statement.

The

protection of personal information is more important for our personal security

than ever before. People of all ages must be aware of the risks at school,

leisure surfing online or even in the workplace.

encourage the government to protect the digital information of our citizens so

that Crown agencies, like the workers' relations board, are held accountable

when workers' identities were leaked to the employer during a union drive.

Thank

you.

SPEAKER:

Further statements by

ministers?

Oral

Questions.

Oral Questions

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Leader of the

Official Opposition.

D. BRAZIL:

Thank you, Speaker.

Monday, the CBC reported a memo sent

to the Janeway advising children in need of emergency care at the pediatric

intensive care unit that they would need to be sent to Halifax as beds were

short at the Children's Hospital.

We thank

the IWK hospital in Halifax for being onboard with the plan, but the parents of

the province are uneasy with this news.

I ask

the minister: Is the protocol to send critically ill children to IWK hospital

still in place?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Health and Community Services.

J. HAGGIE:

Thank you very much, Mr.

Speaker.

Obviously, things like this are of concern; however, this is prudent planning by

Eastern Health. They had five out of their six beds occupied prior to the

weekend starting. No children have been sent out and it is my expectation from

information from Eastern Health that this protocol will be lifted shortly.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Leader of the

Official Opposition.

D. BRAZIL:

Thank you, Speaker.

The

parents of Newfoundland and Labrador need to know help is going to be there when

there is need, whether it's at the Janeway or via medevac in Labrador. The

crisis in our health care system is also affecting the children of our province

at their time of greatest need.

I ask

the Premier: What is your plan to fix pediatric care in Newfoundland and

Labrador?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Premier.

PREMIER A. FUREY:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

welcome the opportunity to speak on health care yet again. As we've said, we

recognized before any other jurisdiction in this country that health care was a

problem here in Newfoundland and Labrador. A year ago, we set out the Health

Accord NL to examine the health care system, as it has existed since the 1960s,

Mr. Speaker. We're not running away from what we know is a broken system. We're

trying to fix it. Solution-driven by experts in the field from panels across the

province taking a collaborative approach; even now with Members from the

Opposition being involved.

welcome all solutions. We are solution-driven and the Health Accord NL will

deliver it, not just for pediatric patients around the province but indeed for

every patient in the province, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Leader of the

Official Opposition.

D. BRAZIL:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I agree

with the Premier that we need to make solutions immediately but we need them

immediately now not kicked down the road five or 10 years. There has to be

actions taken immediately.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

D. BRAZIL:

The minister has yet to

recognize the health care crisis in our province while critically ill children

are being denied emergency care here at home and access to 24-7 medevac for our

most vulnerable children does not exist in Newfoundland and Labrador.

I ask

the Premier: How is this acceptable health care in Newfoundland and Labrador

today?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Premier.

PREMIER A. FUREY:

First of all, Mr. Speaker, I

think in reference to the minister's answer, that's not a fair

preamble at all

by the Member opposite.

We have

said that we recognize that the system is not working well for everybody and

we're intending on fixing it, but different from the Member opposite who would

like solutions today, there aren't solutions today. This is a systems problem, a

paradigm shift that's occurring within health care.

We need

to have the courage, not to revert to our heuristics but indeed to look at

definitive solutions for the future of health care in this province. That's why

Sister Elizabeth Davis and Dr. Pat Parfrey, experts in their field, are mapping

the path forward. I'm happy that the Opposition are now involved, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Leader of the

Official Opposition.

D. BRAZIL:

Thank you, Speaker.

I'll

give the Premier some acknowledgement of things that can be done immediately:

Develop a cardiac centre of excellence; provide full medical transportation for

Newfoundlanders and Labradorians; change air ambulance programs so it's more

accessible for Newfoundland and Labrador; redefine the scope of practice for

nurse practitioners, RN, pharmacists and paramedics.

That's

just a few things; that's four things in four days. We'll give you 40 in four

weeks if you'll listen.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

D. BRAZIL:

Speaker, the Newfoundland and

Labrador Medical Association last week released a series of fact checks for

ministers in this government, including fact checks for the Minister of Finance

and Minister of Health. The Medical Association stated clearly five examples

where they say the minister has misrepresented the facts.

I ask

the Premier: Why are you allowing your ministers to present unreliable

information to the public in the middle of a health crisis?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Premier.

PREMIER A. FUREY:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I'm

happy that the Member opposite has read the Health Accord and has identified

areas we're working towards in terms of fixing the system. It is not a myopic

political tidbit that we're going to throw off, we're actually working towards

solutions, Mr. Speaker.

With

respect to the specific question, I, for obvious reasons, am not involved, will

not be involved in negotiations with the NLMA, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Leader of the

Official Opposition.

D. BRAZIL:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

respect the work of the Health Accord and look forward to being a part of it.

What I am quoting there are directly from the PC Blue Book for the last two

elections, things that could be implemented very quickly and be very beneficial

to the people of this province.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

D. BRAZIL:

Speaker, the Minister of

Health has yet to publicly apologize to a Labrador family who say the minister

misrepresented their story. The Newfoundland and Labrador Medical Association is

issuing fact checks for a number of ministers, while the Minister of Children,

Seniors and Social Development tries to discredit an organization during

contract negotiations.

I ask

the Premier: How are you going to address each of these problems?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Premier.

PREMIER A. FUREY:

Thank you again for the

question.

Look, as

we've said many times and will continue to reiterate, we are addressing the

bigger problem, which is the system, Mr. Speaker. I've worked in the system, I

know the problems in the system; we've set out to fix the system. He references

the Blue Book; we started the Health Accord before the Blue Book, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

PREMIER A. FUREY:

We recognized the first thing

when we came in that this was a problem. We knew it was a problem, we wanted to

set out to fix the problem but there is no quick fix. This is a systems problem,

we recognize that there are issues that have to be dealt with immediately and

that's why the Minister of Health and Community Services announced earlier just

last week that a change starts here with multiple issues addressed, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Oh, oh!

SPEAKER:

Order, please!

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Leader of the

Official Opposition.

D. BRAZIL:

Thank you, Speaker.

I just

want to remind the Premier that I sat on a Committee that helped develop some of

the recommendations in the Blue Book, and that goes back five years ago when I

was the critic for Health here. So it wasn't the last eight months or so.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

D. BRAZIL:

Speaker, the minister has

repeatedly suggested the Opposition should ignore the facts and present a better

picture of the health care crisis engulfing our province. He wants us to ignore

the facts, while multiple people and organizations have told him to stick to the

facts.

Every

day we are providing real-world examples of the failures of this government to

take our health care system seriously.

I ask

the Premier: Will you stop hiding behind the Health Accord and address the

crisis unfolding right now before our eyes in Newfoundland and Labrador?

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Premier.

PREMIER A. FUREY:

First of all, Mr. Speaker,

I'm not hiding behind the Health Accord. The Health Accord is the answer to the

system's problem. The Member opposite refuses to acknowledge that there is a

system's problem. They're myopic in their approach; this is all for political

short-term gain when we're about long-term solutions.

The

members of the Health Accord NL, I'm not hiding behind them. In fact, the

Members opposite have joined the Health Accord NL. Finally, after a year,

they're sitting on the Health Accord NL. Because we recognize that this is not a

problem that you can fix overnight. This is changing the system that hasn't

changed since Tommy Douglas in the 1960s. We know that the province has changed;

it's time for the health care system to change. We're not running away from it.

We're owning it. We're driving towards solutions, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Topsail - Paradise.

P. DINN:

Thank you, Speaker.

It's

interesting to hear that the Premier has recognized or say we recognize, before

any jurisdiction, the issues at hand. But we want to see solutions; we want to

see quick answers here that deal with the issues.

Speaker,

while this government sits and there's a raging crisis happening here in health

care, other provinces are taking decisive action to deal with their situation.

Quebec just added – Quebec, now – 2,572 full-time nurses after offering bonuses

in September. By taking their health crisis seriously, Quebec has seen dramatic

results in just 60 days.

Why has

this government been unable to demonstrate results to our nursing crisis in six

years?

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Health and Community Services.

J. HAGGIE:

Thank you, Speaker.

I think

I could do no better than refer back to the announcement we made last week,

which is a package of $30 million of solutions in the short and medium term. The

short-term solutions address the fundamental issue that people out there have,

which is access to primary care. That will be dealt with through collaborative

team clinics. It's a team effort to provide primary care in metro and across the

Island.

With

respect to the nursing issues, we have announced extra seats and a rural and

remote program. We're going to put Bachelor of Nursing courses in Gander, in

Grand Falls-Windsor, in Happy Valley-Goose Bay. And we are going to see an

increase in the number of graduating people from the LPN program and the

Personal Care Assistant Program, Mr. Speaker.

These

are tangibles –

SPEAKER:

The minister's time has expired.

J. HAGGIE:

– and will be ready this year.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Topsail - Paradise.

P. DINN:

Thank you, Speaker, but somebody seems to be having a problem with the word now.

Now is immediate. Now is in this time. Now is not down the road, when everyone

graduates. Yes, that's going to help out – that's going to help out.

Speaker,

Quebec has been able to recruit back into the workforce some 83 retirees and

1,628 who switched from part-time to full-time. These appear to be sensible

solutions to a staffing crisis now.

Why

hasn't government reached out to these two specific groups?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Health and Community Services.

J. HAGGIE:

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

started planning for these changes some time ago. The Members opposite refer to

scopes of practice for nurse practitioners and registered nurses. It was myself

who brought those regulations and legislation into this House three years ago

for nurse practitioners. We have done that and we'll be doing that with

registered nurses for prescribing. It was myself and this government that

introduced broadening scope for optometrists.

It was

us that stood in this House in 2016 and brought in regulations to bring

midwifery back to this province, something that had been removed under previous

regimes, Mr. Speaker. We are working with the Pharmacists' Association actively

to bring in increased scopes of practice for pharmacists.

These

are not just now. These are –

SPEAKER:

The minister's time has expired.

J. HAGGIE:

– things that we have done already.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Topsail - Paradise.

P. DINN:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

It's

great to talk about what you're planning to do because that could be – well, six

years ago they had a plan, too. And we're still waiting – we're still waiting.

Oh, I got a commitment – I got a commitment. God knows when it's going to

happen.

Speaker,

Quebec is also in talks with another 2,800 nurses in an effort to cut down on

forced overtime, nurse burnout and exhaustion.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Oh, oh!

SPEAKER:

Order, please!

P. DINN:

Now, does that sound familiar? It should. Forced overtime, nurse burnout and

exhaustion.

The

Canadian Federation of Nurses Union recently stated that we are 30 per cent

short on registered nurses in Newfoundland and Labrador. Again, the Health

Accord has called this a crisis.

What are

we going to do today to address it?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Health and Community Services.

J. HAGGIE:

Mr. Speaker, 18 months ago we increased the number of seats in the LPN program

by something of the order of 90 per cent and we increased the number of seats in

the PCA program. These people are graduating this month and in December. There

are job adverts out across the regional health authorities for those graduates.

We are engaged actively with the Registered Nurses' Union in a very

collaborative way.

We can't

solve this by ourselves. They have come to the table and I would encourage all

other stakeholders, health care providers, to do just that, Mr. Speaker. We have

started, we are doing and that's now, Mr. Speaker, and yesterday.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Stephenville - Port au Port.

T. WAKEHAM:

Thank you, Speaker.

I think

the minister should contact Western Health because there are a number of nurses

in my district who are seeking full-time employment and they're only temporary,

so they're more than willing to work full-time. Secondly, I'm glad to see that

the minister will not be implementing the recommendations of the Greene report

and closing nursing schools in this province.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

T. WAKEHAM:

The Energy Minister has

acknowledged that the higher oil prices are eating into the province's deficit;

it's also eating away at people's pocketbooks.

Will the

minister set aside some of the extra revenue to help decrease the cost of

gasoline and home heating fuel in this province?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Finance and President of Treasury Board.

S. COADY:

Thank you very much, Speaker,

for the question.

I will

say that even though we're seeing increased oil prices in the province and,

indeed, globally, it is not just the oil price that is a contributor to the

finances of the province, of course, it's the oil price, it's production and

it's also the exchange rate. I'll be giving a financial update sometime in

November that will demonstrate to the Member opposite that just because the

price has gone up does not mean there's extra money for the coffers of the

government.

Thank

you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Stephenville - Port au Port.

T. WAKEHAM:

Speaker, I'd ask the minister if she plans on providing that fiscal update

before the House closes.

Secondly, will you turn around and lower the cost of gasoline, your own tax,

that you didn't do in 2021 and which you did do in 2019 when you implemented

increased carbon tax?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Finance and President of Treasury Board.

S. COADY:

To answer the first question

first because it was a double-barrel question, Mr. Speaker. The first question

is it is our intent to get the fiscal update as quickly as possible. I have

officials working pretty much round the clock to get the numbers prepared and

we'll be doing it as quickly as we possibly can. But I do commit to as quickly

as we possible can, we'll get those numbers out there.

The

second part of the question, Mr. Speaker, our gas tax is on par with the rest of

the country. We did lower it, we have lowered it since 2015 and we'll continue

to consider lowering the tax. I will say it is on par with the rest of the

country.

Thank

you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Stephenville - Port au Port.

T. WAKEHAM:

Mr. Speaker, last week, there

was an

article in the paper that said we had become number one, which meant we

had the highest gas prices in the entire country so I don't consider that to be

on par with anyone.

It isn't

just gasoline that has become too expensive. On the Liberals' watch, the cost of

home heating fuel is also causing hardship for families and seniors in this

province.

Again, I

ask the minister: Will you consider using some of the extra oil revenue to

implement the home heating fuel rebate?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Finance and President of Treasury Board.

S. COADY:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I don't

like when people misinterpret my words so I'll repeat it again. The provincial

gas tax is on par with the rest of the country at 14.5 cents. Misconstruing what

I said, I had to correct that record.

I will

always consider how we can lower taxes in this province, Mr. Speaker. That is

one thing that this government always tries to do. We are considering our budget

for next year and we'll take it as part of that budget as to how we can move

forward. We're always looking to do our best for this province, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for Terra

Nova.

L. PARROTT:

We may be on par with our tax

but we're not on par with our price.

Mr.

Speaker, motorists in this province are paying an additional five cents per

litre on gas prices because gasoline has to be imported. Yesterday, the minister

said, “We work with Come By Chance as it relates to the start-up of that

facility …” leaving the people of the province to assume that current Come By

Chance proposal includes gasoline production and failing to mention that the new

proposal centres on biofuel.

Minister, yes or no: Will Come By Chance return to gasoline production?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Industry, Energy and Technology.

A. PARSONS:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Happy to

talk about Come By Chance and the efforts that this government is undertaking to

get them back up and running with an updated facility.

The

reality is that last year we put in $16.6 million to keep that facility in warm

idle, keeping hundreds of people working out there. Since June, that has run

out, but there are still people working out there. There have been collective

bargaining agreements that have been renewed.

continue to work with the company, which, again, I would point out, as I did on

numerous occasions last year, it's a private entity. It's owned by a private

company who are in discussions with a private entity about the possible sale.

What we're doing is everything we can to get the facility up and running.

What I

can say is that I certainly get a lot of phone calls from people in that area

saying thank you for the efforts that you're doing to keep the place alive.

Thank

you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for Terra

Nova.

L. PARROTT:

I remind the minister it

wasn't last year, it was one day before the election this year.

Yesterday, I asked the minister when the extra five cents per litre on gas would

be removed. The minister said: “… we have to ask the Public Utilities Board as

they are tasked with the duty by the Legislature.”

I ask

the minister: Have you, as the minister, asked the PUB if and when the five

cents will be removed?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Industry, Energy and Technology.

A. PARSONS:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

apologize, it was in January of this year, but everybody will realize that this

year has felt like it's 15 months, then I apologize. It's been one of those

years.

I do

recall the Member opposite being quite happy about it because he was certainly

talking about it on the election trail about the deal we got done to keep that

plant open.

What I

would point out here, again, when it comes to the PUB, the Public Utilities

Board, they are an independent body. There is no legislative authority to direct

them to undertake this. I have written to the PUB, as a public entity, to ask

them to explain to the people of this province the process that goes into it.

But if

we want to have a conversation with the Member opposite about unregulated

gasoline prices, maybe that's a debate we should have here on the floor.

Thank

you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Harbour Main.

H. CONWAY OTTENHEIMER:

According to an access to

information request, as of October 1, 2021, there are 32 RNC officers eligible

for retirement. With no current cadet class, how will these officers be

replaced?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Justice and Public Safety.

J. HOGAN:

Thank you for the question,

Speaker.

That's

an issue that comes up every year. It's always looked at by the RNC to make sure

cadets are trained. It's an ongoing issue that they deal with on a yearly basis

and they'll continue to deal with that year to year, obviously.

The

number of cadets that come into each class is different every year and the

number of cadets that graduate each year is different, so it's not a set number

that the RNC will deal with on an ongoing basis every year; it rolls over from

year to year.

Thank

you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Harbour Main.

H. CONWAY OTTENHEIMER:

Speaker, there is no current cadet class and a vigorous recruitment program is

essential to a strong police force.

Speaker,

in July a new interim chief of the RNC was appointed, four months later the

position is still filled on an interim basis.

Can the

minister outline when a new chief will be named?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Justice and Public Safety.

J. HOGAN:

Thank you, Speaker.

I do

want to thank the interim chief of police who stepped in at a difficult time and

taken over that. I think he's done an absolutely fantastic job. I also know that

members of the RNC, civilian members and the officers down there, are very, very

pleased with the work he's done and happy and it's humming along quite well.

We will

have a permanent chief of police in there in due course, but one thing we want

to do is make sure that we get it right; we want to make sure we have the right

chief in there. We've done a search across this country to make sure there are

as many applicants with the right résumés in there. When the time comes to find

that right person and appoint that right person, it will be done. When it is

done, the RNC will be a model for all police organizations in this country,

Speaker.

Thank

you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Harbour Main.

H. CONWAY OTTENHEIMER:

Speaker, there are still concerns, though. The RNC has only an acting chief,

much of the RNC leadership has left and there are now 32 officers ready to

retire with no one to replace them. The minister, we know, has initiated a

review, but why has the minister not been involved in implementing a new human

resource plan for

the RNC?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Justice and Public Safety.

J. HOGAN:

Thank you for the question,

Speaker.

There

were five promotions within the RNC last week that I attended down at the RNC

offices here. I have to say it was very nice to see that these individuals

who've worked hard and served the community got the promotion that is so well

deserved and they will be leaders of the future of the RNC.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

J. HOGAN:

So there are people being

promoted within there and they deserve it. I hope everyone in this House

recognizes that those appointments were deserved.

I will

note, too, once the permanent chief comes in, he or she will want to have a say

in who the other officers that are promoted within the organization are there. I

think that's only fair to the new chief to give him or her that ability to do

that.

Thank

you, Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Ferryland.

L. O'DRISCOLL:

Thank you, Speaker.

We've

been receiving calls from residents in the Conception Bay North area and all

over this province regarding delayed appointments and frustration in the Motor

Registration division, many of whom are in need of essential service such as

drivers test, plate replacements and obtaining a new photo for their licence. We

have learned that the next available appointment at Harbour Grace isn't until

December 16, at the earliest.

I ask

the minister: What action is she taking to ensure that these people are looked

after immediately?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Digital Government and Service NL.

S. STOODLEY:

Thank you, Speaker.

I'm very

pleased to say at Motor Registration, our doors are open –

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Oh, oh!

SPEAKER:

Order, please!

S. STOODLEY:

– and all of our staff are at

work. We have seen an increased demand for services. We are adding more and more

services online. We recently launched the ability to transfer a vehicle online,

Speaker. We've seen hundreds of people to go online to tell us about their new

vehicle. That frees up a very long appointment time, which frees up appointment

times for people in the province.

I'm also

pleased to say that in most of our offices you can get an appointment that same

week, which is an acceptable standard. I understand a long wait for an

appointment is not acceptable and we're working towards reducing that, Speaker.

We're looking at every lever we can to improve services for the people of the

province.

Thank

you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Ferryland.

L. O'DRISCOLL:

Thank you, Speaker.

I don't

see what the problem was before, I know you're trying to upgrade the system and

make it more user-friendly for people but not everybody depends on that. So it

should be looked at and you should get these offices open.

Speaker,

walking outside Motor Registration in Harbour Grace during seniors' day. To

quote the ladies post: Imagine having these seniors susceptible to rainy, cold

and wet conditions during the flu season of all times.

Speaker,

this isn't good enough. The seniors of our province deserve better treatment

from the minister and our government.

I ask

the minister: What is she going to do to ensure that this never happens again?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Digital Government and Service NL.

S. STOODLEY:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

opened up Wednesday mornings as a special walk-in only. I've also said that if

anyone has an urgent or an important issue that they could walk in at any time.

Across the province, Speaker, we see, on average, 30 per cent of our

appointments are walk-ins just across the board. Harbour Grace is just a bit

higher than that.

We do

have contingency plans in place, Speaker, if there is an excessive wait outside,

people can wait in their cars and we'll communicate with them in their cars.

Mr.

Speaker, we've seen an increase in demand for services and if we open the doors,

the lineups would be much longer. If we got rid of appointments, the lineups

would be much longer.

Thank

you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Leader of the

Third Party.

J. DINN:

Thank you, Speaker.

You know

it's going to be a good day in this House when the Liberal Premier references

Tommy Douglas, the founder of the New Democratic Party.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

J. DINN:

You're welcome to join any

time, but there will be a vetting process.

Speaker,

when running for election, the Member for St. John's East - Quidi Vidi called

for attracting more doctors and nurses to rural communities; however, in a 2017

interview with CBC, the minister suggested that the province should not hire any

more doctors or nurses.

Where

are these doctors and nurses supposed to come from? From his own district?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Health and Community Services.

J. HAGGIE:

Thank you very much, Speaker.

Last

week we announced a medium-term, long-term package to address the issue of

health care professional recruitment, starting specifically with family

physicians. This will be informed by a needs assessment of new graduates from

the residency program at Memorial to make sure our offerings align with what

they would like. We will have a provincial recruiter housed in the department

along with the secretariat.

These

will rationalize recruitment and retention of physicians and a whole range of

health care providers. That is the medium- and long-term solution, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Labrador West.

J. BROWN:

Thank you, Speaker.

Mr.

Speaker, the Minister of Health informed the House that there will be a full

contingent of staff at the new long-term care facilities in Central

Newfoundland. Though this may be true, with the facilities not open, we can

assume that the staff of these facilities are employed elsewhere at this time.

I ask

the minister: Where is the shortage going to be after these facilities open?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Health and Community Services.

J. HAGGIE:

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

It is

indeed unfortunate, owing to contractor issues, that the two facilities in

Central are not yet open. My information from Central Health is that recruitment

is complete for these facilities. Staff that are currently working elsewhere

have had their positions backfilled and we will be taking advantage of the newly

graduated, larger number of both LPNs and PCAs from measures that we undertook

with CNA and the appropriate minister back in 2019.

Thank

you, Mr. Speaker.

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Humber - Bay of Islands.

E. JOYCE:

Speaker, the Liberal government made a commitment to the people of Western

Newfoundland and Labrador that all the services in the Western Memorial Regional

Hospital will be maintained in the new acute care hospital.

A letter

from the Minister of Health and Community Services July 8, 2021, (inaudible)

released proposals on July 6, 2018, states all project elements identified were

reviewed with a number being recommended for removal. These recommendations were

presented to the Ministers of TW, HCS, as well as ministers representing Corner

Brook, excluding the Premier, who provided direction.

There

was only one minister for Corner Brook on July 6, 2018, and I doubt if he was

aware of this decision. Without the Premier being included, it is evident that

this process did not proceed through the Social Policy Committee, PMP or

Cabinet.

I ask

the minister: Who made this major decision without the proper vetting process,

and will you confirm that you had no discussions with Dwight Ball, Greg Mercer

or any member of the Premier's staff?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Health and Community Services.

J. HAGGIE:

Thank you very much, Mr.

Speaker.

I recall

a meeting, several meetings in actual fact, on the infrastructure committee and

various other committees which are governed by Cabinet privilege. The decision

was taken to make sure that the new acute care facility only housed those areas

that were essential for acute care.

It is

simply the most expensive form of real estate government can purchase, either

directly or through a P3 partnership. As such, administration and laundry

services were taken out and this was then put through and is being put through a

separate process. Western Health are in the process of deciding what options

they wish to pursue.

Thank

you very much.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Humber - Bay of Islands.

E. JOYCE:

I take it the minister didn't

answer the question on if he had discussions with Dwight Ball, his staff to make

these crucial decisions.

September 13, 2021, after advising the minister that his statements were

incorrect, he stated in a letter of September 13, 2021, there have been many

briefings and discussions which included government officials, external third

party consultants, along with various ministers. These ministers were not

identified, contrary to your letter of July 28, 2021. This decision was not made

in the Cabinet according to your letter of July 28, 2021, where the

recommendations were not presented to the Premier – that was your words.

This

Liberal government broke another commitment to the people of Western

Newfoundland and Labrador. First it was the PET scanner; now it's the laundry

service, eliminating up to 75 positions.

I ask

the Premier: How can you allow this decision to stand when the minister states

himself that it was a decision made without the knowledge and consent of the

Premier of the province, Dwight Ball or Cabinet? Was the PET scanner removed

without Dwight Ball's knowledge or Cabinet's approval?

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Health and Community Services.

J. HAGGIE:

Thank you very much, Speaker.

The PET

scanner is a commitment that was made to make the facility PET scanner-ready.

Money has been set aside and given to Western Regional Health Authority health

care foundation trust so that once the cancer care program there is operational,

a decision about what and when to purchase such equipment will be made by the

clinicians on the ground locally actually delivering the service.

That is

what we committed to. That is what is there.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The time for Question Period

has expired.

Presenting Reports by Standing and Select Committees.

Tabling

of Documents.

Notices

of Motion.

Notices of Motion

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for Lake

Melville.

P. TRIMPER:

Thank you, Speaker.

I'd like

to serve notice of the following PMR:

WHEREAS

the Secretary-General of the United Nations recently stated “ the alarm bells are deafening, and the evidence is irrefutable:

greenhouse-gas emissions from fossil-fuel burning and deforestation are choking

our planet and putting billions of people at immediate risk ”;

WHEREAS

scientists estimate that by 2050, if GHG emissions are not reduced, the average

winter temperature will be 3.4 degrees above pre-industrial levels here in St.

John's, six degrees warmer in Happy Valley-Goose Bay and 7.3 degrees warmer in

Nain (Government of NL, 2018);

WHEREAS

the province is already experiencing significant warming resulting in the

reduction of ice cover, particularly on the North Coast and across Labrador for

example;

WHEREAS

NASA (2021) states that “ Earth's surface

continues to significantly warm, with recent global temperatures being the

hottest in the past 2,000-plus years ,” and “ Nineteen of the hottest years have occurred since 2000 ”;

WHEREAS

Newfoundland and Labrador, as a partner in the

Pan-Canadian Framework on Clean Growth and Climate Change , is

obligated to aggressively reduce provincial emissions despite increases over the

past 20 years (NIR 2021);

WHEREAS

Hibernia crude oil emits 0.487 metric tons of carbon dioxide per barrel, the 1.7

billion barrels of oil extracted from the province since 1997 (Government of NL

2018) would represent 830 million tons of GHGs based on EPA (2020);

WHEREAS

oil and gas development represents 25 per cent of the provincial GDP, 41 per

cent of exports, thousands of direct and indirect jobs and over $20 billion in

cumulative royalties to the province since 1997 (Government of NL 2018);

WHEREAS

in advance of COP26 in Scotland starts in a few days, the Beyond Oil and Gas

Alliance (BOGA) calls on the world to “ Create

an international community of practice that can support governments in

delivering their commitment to a managed and just phase-out of oil and gas

production” and “Strengthen global climate ambition by aligning oil and gas

production with the Paris Agreement goal of well below 2ºC, pursuing efforts for

1.5ºC ”;

WHEREAS

Newfoundland and Labrador is facing an unsustainable fiscal situation that

requires immediate action (PERT 2021) including being ' at risk of not being able to make its ' –

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Oh, oh!

SPEAKER:

Order, please!

P. TRIMPER:

– ' financial

commitments such as paying salaries, operating hospitals, offering other public

services or making payments to pension plans which it is legally obligated to do .'

AND

WHEREAS the primary means of addressing fiscal imbalance and quality of service

delivery across Canada, that of equalization payments based on the fiscal

capacity of each province, has been inadequate for Newfoundland and Labrador,

particularly as a result of how oil and gas revenues are calculated.

THEREFORE

BE IT RESOLVED that the House of Assembly urge government to do the

following: Cease oil and gas exploration on inactive licences and any further

provincial investment in the exploration of active licences; Move to complete

planned production on the existing operational fields of Hibernia, Terra Nova,

White Rose and Hebron; Initiate discussions to join the Beyond Oil and Gas

Alliance with Denmark, Costa Rica and other national and sub-national

signatories; and –

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Oh, oh!

SPEAKER:

Order, please!

P. TRIMPER:

– Secure a climate crisis

agreement with Canada that recognizes the value of leaving oil and gas reserves

undeveloped. The carbon offset agreement would calculate projected emissions for

commercially viable hydrocarbons AND the federal price per ton of CO 2

directed as $170 per ton by 2030.

For

example, Equinor estimates that the Bay du Nord field to have commercially

viable reserves of 300 million barrels of oil that would represent 146 million

tons of GHGs representing $24.8 billion of carbon offsets based on $170 per ton.

Thank

you, Speaker.

SPEAKER:

Further notices of motion?

Petitions.

Petitions

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for Grand

Falls-Windsor - Buchans.

C. TIBBS:

Thank you very much, Speaker.

There

have been several moose accidents on the Buchans Highway, Route 370. The brush

is hanging over the road and motorists cannot see moose until they are actually

on the road.

Therefore we petition the House of Assembly as follows: We, the undersigned,

call upon the House of Assembly to urge the Government of Newfoundland and

Labrador to take immediate action and cut the brush alongside the Buchans

Highway.

Speaker,

I've talked to the Minister of Transportation about this a couple of times now

and I've sent several emails as well to the Premier's office. We've had three

moose accidents – three moose accidents in one week on the Buchans Highway,

Route 370. I fear that if action is not taken within a very short period of

time, more or less immediately, somebody is going to get seriously injured or

killed on that highway.

I've

been all over the province and I know that brush cutting, everybody wants it,

it's a big issue in the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador, but I will tell

you for a fact that the brush is literally hanging on the Buchans Highway. You

cannot see the moose until they are on the road; not in the ditch, not on the

shoulder, until they are on the road.

Many

people use the Buchans Highway. We also have Marathon Gold, which is now set-up

up the Buchans Highway, lots of traffic going back and forth; lots of logging

trucks going back and forth; lots of traffic. We need to ensure that we maintain

a safe road environment for the people of Newfoundland and Labrador including

the people who use the Buchans Highway.

I'm

asking the minister if he would take a look at this and send brush cutters up

there and get at least the more significant areas, as soon as possible, before

somebody gets killed or hurt on the Buchans Highway.

I'll

advocate on that until it gets done. I hope to meet with the minister about

this.

Thank

you, Mr. Speaker.

SPEAKER:

Before we move into further

petitions, I overlooked Answers to Questions for which Notice has been Given.

Further

petitions?

The hon.

the Member for Ferryland.

L. O'DRISCOLL:

Thank you, Speaker.

The

background to this petition is as follows:

Eastern

Health has recently repositioned one of the ambulances from the Trepassey area

to the Cape Broyle area. This has left only one ambulance in the Trepassey area.

Residents of Trepassey and the surrounding area, Portugal Cove South and other

areas, are at least two hours from the nearest hospital.

Therefore we petition the House of Assembly as follows: We, the undersigned,

call upon the House of Assembly to urge the Government of Newfoundland and

ambulance in a time of emergency by repositioning a second ambulance back into

the Trepassey area to ensure the safety and well-being of local residents and to

meet the national standards for response times.

Speaker,

I've read this petition a few times now. It's a pretty serious issue that's

going on in the Trepassey area, Portugal Cove South, St. Shott's, Biscay Bay,

Peter's River and St. Stephen's. There's an ambulance that was stationed there

and they took it. First, they said they were moving it to Ferryland. It didn't

move to Ferryland, it moved to Cape Broyle.

Cape

Broyle is a half hour, I'm going to say, further north. You get a call for an

ambulance now, with one ambulance gone, you've got at least six or eight hours.

The first instance we had the ambulance was at St. Clare's for eight to 10

hours, or maybe more. It's not acceptable that there's no ambulance there.

Now,

they called it dynamic dispatching that they're going to move an ambulance

further up, but right now they can't check that.

This

area in the province, on the Island portion of this province, is the furthest

away from a hospital on the Island portion of this province, and to be away and

not have an ambulance could be catastrophic at some point in time. We're well

aware that there are two ambulances that were there and they could be away at

some point in time, and they live with that, but to leave no ambulances there is

not acceptable.

For

people that are driving these ambulances – or for people that don't know, I was

in the Trepassey area on Saturday night and when you're driving up there in the

fog and the rain – I was driving up to an event and it was only fog and rain,

that wasn't snow. It's not safe to be on that highway to be driving to Trepassey

with an ambulance. If you're coming out of it, you have to go, it's an

emergency, you got to go, but to be able to drive an hour to get there, that's

not acceptable for the people in the area. It's just not acceptable.

It's an

aging population and you got to be in the area. These people that are making

these decisions – is it the ambulance driver, the ambulance owner that's moving

this down because he's making more money on calls when it's further down the

shore or there are more people? This is not about money. This is about the

safety and the lives of the people in the Trepassey area.

Thank

you so much for this, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Placentia West - Bellevue.

J. DWYER:

Thank you, Speaker.

The

background of this petition is as follows:

WHEREAS

there are very minimal current operations at the Bull Arm Fabrication Site; and

WHEREAS

the site is a world-class facility with the potential to rejuvenate the local

economy; and

WHEREAS

the residents of the area are troubled with the lack of local employment in

today's economy; and

WHEREAS

the operation of this facility would encourage employment for the area and

create economic spinoffs for local businesses; and

WHEREAS

the site is an asset of the province, built to benefit the province and a

long-term tenant for this site would attract gainful business opportunities; and

WHEREAS

the continued idling of this site is not in the best interest of province.

THEREFORE we, the residents of the area near the Bull Arm Fabrication Site,

petition the hon. House of Assembly as follows: We, the undersigned, call upon

the House of Assembly to urge the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador to

expedite the process to get the Bull Arm Fabrication Site back in operation. We

request that this process include a vision for a long-term viable plan that is

beneficial to all residents of Newfoundland and Labrador.

FURTHERMORE, we request that government place an emphasis on all supply,

maintenance, fabrication and offshore workover for existing offshore platforms

as well as new construction of any future FPSO in nature.

Speaker,

I've presented this many times on behalf of the constituents of Placentia West -

Bellevue, but I feel today that I'm presenting it on behalf of the people of the

province. It affects just about every district in this Chamber.

There

are people coming from all over to work at the fabrication site, and I think

it's being underutilized. I just want to know, really, on behalf of the people,

what are the current operations and what are the future long-term plans for the

Bull Arm Fabrication Site.

Thank

you, Speaker.

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Industry, Energy and Technology for a response.

A. PARSONS:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I thank

the Member opposite for an opportunity to talk about Bull Arm. Certainly, he's

brought the petition forward on a number of occasions.

On a

number of times when I've answered this, I haven't had as much to say because

the reality is that it has not been utilized to its fullest extent. Although, I

would disagree with the first

WHEREAS in the petition, which says that there are

no current operations at the Bull Arm Fabrication Site. Because of the asset

life extension being done on the Terra Nova, the reality is that there are over

300 people that are now working on the different work scopes, with about 160

people at any different time. A combination of people from Unifor, from building

trades and management that are actually working out there right now as we speak

right here.

That is

the culmination of months and months of work to see that happen, which we were

very happy to celebrate back in June, firstly, and then obviously the deal was

finally concluded later on. The reality is that DF Barnes still has a lease out

there until February. They've been doing the topsides portion.

But the

big point here is that it is an asset. It is an asset to the province. There has

been work undertaken to see what is possible. But I will say that some of the

stuff that has come in, I don't think would be in the best interests of the

province in order to do something for the sake of doing something to give it

away.

So the

reality is we will have it there. We look for more opportunities. Certainly we

look forward to see what comes with Equinor to see what comes forward. There's a

lot of good news. Things have changed a lot in the last six to eight months.

Right now, that is a bright spot and we'll continue to do what we can.

Thank

you.

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Torngat Mountains.

L. EVANS:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

This

petition is a climate emergency declaration.

We, the

undersigned residents of the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador, bring the

attention of the House of Assembly to the following:

WHEREAS,

according to the document, The Way Forward

on Climate Change , the province is already experiencing the effects of

climate change; Newfoundland and Labrador joined the

Pan-Canadian Framework on Clean Growth and Climate Change in 2016

but is not on track to meet its 2020 targets; financial costs resulting from

climate change will unequally impact municipalities due to the responsibilities

set out in the Municipalities Act, 1999 ;

THEREFORE, the petitioners call upon the House of Assembly to urge the

government to: declare a climate emergency; to establish a task force on

decreasing the effects of climate crisis while building community resilience;

and consider climate in all policy and decision-making.

This is

very important not only to my district, but all of Labrador and, of course, to

the province. I'll just refer back to Vital Signs 2021 that came out recently, a

report from the Harris Centre at MUN. It talks about how climate change is

impacting the environment, the economy and society in Newfoundland and Labrador.

Honesty,

Speaker, that's talking about our quality of life in the province. This is a

study done by the Harris Centre here at MUN talking about climate change

impacting our quality of life in the future.

Just

looking at the predicted temperatures, very, very important for us to realize

that it doesn't matter where you live in the province, the temperature is going

to actually change. The weather is going to change, but the biggest changes will

be seen in Labrador. The thing about it is, my fellow MHA, independent MHA from

Lake Melville, talked about climate change just recently, but the changes that

we're going to see in Labrador could make seasonal temperatures in Labrador feel

like the current seasonal temperatures here in St. John's. No offence to people

on the Avalon, but nobody wants your weather. We up in Labrador certainly don't

want it.

What

really concerns me; this is a petition for the entire province, directed at

government. But when you refer back to the increases in temperature in the late

21st century, Nain's temperature will have increased by 10.83 degrees, and

that's very alarming.

Thank

you, Mr. Speaker.

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Environment and Climate Change.

B. DAVIS:

Mr. Speaker, thank you very

much for the opportunity to respond to my hon. colleague.

I think

she brought this forward last week and I ran out of time, so I'm going to try my

best not to run out of time. My hon. colleague mentioned the fact that we talked

about our Climate Change Action Plan. I'm happy to report that we've actioned

all 45 items and in process or completed all 45 items of the Climate Change

Action Plan.

We've

also signed on to the net-zero initiatives from the federal government, as well

as our 2030 initiatives that we want to meet. In addition to that, the hon.

Member mentioned something about a committee. I don't know if you've picked up

on it but last week we announced a net-zero advisory committee that was going to

be put in place, which is going to be some industry and experienced people

within that that's going to hold government accountable but also bring forward

ideas from other jurisdictions and other parts of the country and around the

world that we could look at to see how far and how quickly we can move to make

sure that net-zero is a distinct possibility and a must do for this.

This is

the make-or-break decade, as we've heard many times before, it is important that

we as a government – and I am happy to talk about it anytime. I am happy to have

critics that get the opportunity to come forward and voice their opinions with

me and my door is always open on that.

One of

the key things that I'd like to make sure that we all understand: We've invested

with municipalities; we've invested with community organizations; we've invested

with business to help them. Many announcements have already been done to the

tune of about $3.3 million from provincial money –

SPEAKER:

The minister's time has

expired.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

Any further petitions?

The hon.

the Government House Leader.

S. CROCKER:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Order of

the Day.

SPEAKER:

Orders of the Day.

Orders of the Day

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Government House

Leader.

S. CROCKER:

Speaker, I move, seconded by

the Minister of Justice and Public Safety, for leave to introduce a bill

entitled,

An Act To Amend The House Of Assembly Accountability, Integrity And

Administration Act, Bill 43, and I further move that the said bill be now read a

first time.

SPEAKER:

It is moved and seconded by

the Government House Leader shall have leave to introduce a bill entitled, An

Act To Amend The House Of Assembly Accountability, Integrity And Administration

Act, Bill 43, and that the bill now be read a first time.

Is it

the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

All

those in favour, 'aye.'

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Aye.

SPEAKER:

All those against, 'nay.'

Carried.

Motion,

the hon. Government House Leader to introduce a bill, “An Act To Amend The House

Of Assembly Accountability, Integrity And Administration Act,” carried. (Bill

43)

CLERK (Barnes):

A bill,

An Act To Amend The

House Of Assembly Accountability, Integrity And Administration Act. (Bill 43)

SPEAKER:

This bill has now been read a

first time.

When

shall the bill be read a second time?

S. CROCKER:

Tomorrow.

SPEAKER:

Tomorrow.

motion, Bill 43 read a first time, ordered read a second time on tomorrow.

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Government House

Leader.

S. CROCKER:

Thank you, Speaker.

I call

from the Order Paper, Motion 4.

Speaker,

I move, seconded by the Minister of Digital Government and Service NL, that

under Standing Order 11(1) this House not adjourn at 5:30 p.m., today, Tuesday,

October 26, 2021.

SPEAKER:

The motion is that we do not

adjourn today at 5:30 p.m.

Is it

the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

All

those in favour, 'aye.'

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Aye.

SPEAKER:

All those against, 'nay.'

Carried.

The hon.

the Government House Leader.

S. CROCKER:

Thank you, Speaker.

I call

Order 23, second reading of Bill 37,

An Act Respecting The Conduct Of Municipal

Officials.

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Municipal and Provincial Affairs.

K. HOWELL:

Speaker, I move, seconded by

the Minister Responsible for Women and Gender Equality, that Bill 37,

An Act

Respecting The Conduct Of Municipal Officials, be now read a second time.

SPEAKER:

It is moved and seconded that

Bill 37,

An Act Respecting The Conduct Of Municipal Officials, be now read a

second time.

Motion,

second reading of a bill, “An Act Respecting The Conduct Of Municipal

Officials.” (Bill 37)

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister of

Municipal and Provincial Affairs.

K. HOWELL:

Speaker, I'm very pleased to

speak today to the proposed new Municipal

Conduct Act , Bill 37.

This

proposed legislation addresses issues related to conflict of interest, use of

influence, harassment and professional conduct and will reach all municipalities

across the province, their councillors, staff and others acting on behalf of a

municipality in any official capacity, particularly volunteers.

Without

a doubt, these are priority issues for our government and municipalities. I look

forward to our debate and for the support of bill from my hon. colleagues to

pass this proposed bill.

short, the legislation provides clear guidelines for councils enabling them to

establish their own codes of conduct and, most importantly, improve the

workplace, safety and wellness for councillors, mayors and staff while helping

to reduce barriers for women, persons with disabilities, non-binary persons and

marginalized groups.

As we

conducted public consultations for the review of municipal legislation,

professional behaviour emerged as a key issue to be addressed. It was so

prevalent that we felt this standalone legislation was warranted. Over the

years, municipal officials have reported issues related to conflict of interest,

ethical behaviour and professionalism, and we felt this needs to be addressed

now.

The

primary concerns raised included inadequate and inconsistent

definitions of

conflict of interest, no ability to reduce or remove the penalty when a conflict

occurs through genuine error, harassment and bullying in the workplace,

misconceptions about the authority and responsibilities of the council and the

relationship between council and staff as well as a lack of awareness and

training.

Code of

conduct issues can range from compromising public trust to something like poor

attendance, but it's clear whatever the issue is or the severity of it, it is

essential that councils have the legislative authority and the training and

tools necessary to appropriately and effectively address it.

This

proposed Municipal Conduct Act will do

that. It will increase clarity and harmonize procedures for conflict of

interest; it will define conflict of interest and related concepts; and require

municipalities to establish a code of conduct for all municipal officials,

including council members, employees, fire department personnel and anyone

acting on their behalf.

It'll

set out penalties and require council to administer these penalties where a

council member or senior staff member acts in a conflict in violation of the

code of conduct. It'll introduce mandatory training for councillors and staff.

The

proposed legislation applies to all towns and cities. The bill clarifies what

constitutes a conflict of interest and introduces a common set of rules for all

municipalities regarding conflict of interest.

The code

of conduct that municipalities will be required to establish must, at a minimum,

address such topics as use of influence, harassment and confidentiality. A

template for guidance will be provided by our department for municipalities to

use and build upon and shape to meet their own specific needs.

Municipalities will be required to establish a complaints procedure and, as they

already are doing, they can employ the use of an external investigator when

necessary to investigate or mediate any severe cases. Most complaints could be

internally resolved at a low cost to the municipalities.

The bill

introduces a reasonableness as a legal test for conflict and sets out procedures

for councillors' disclosure of interests and exclusion from participation in

matters where conflict exists. What that means is that if a reasonable person

were to look at the situation and determine that a councillor could act without

bias, then there would be no conflict.

The new

legislation also identifies an appropriate range of penalties for elected

officials found in violation of a conflict of interest, as well as rules

including the removal of a councillor from their seat. So we want to make it

more that the punishment fits the crime.

All of

these actions also aim to reduce gender-based harassment. Inherent in the

proposed legislation is the aim to reduce barriers for women and marginalized

groups.

Municipal codes of conduct will help increase respectfulness in council chambers

and municipal workplaces and they will contribute to more inclusive

environments, reducing barriers for women entering politics or non-binary

persons and other marginalized groups such as seniors, persons with

disabilities, members of the LGBTQ+ community, Indigenous peoples, people of

colour and immigrants. All of these people have something so diverse and very

unique perspectives to bring to councils and we want to make sure that they have

the opportunity to do so. We also want to make clearer the expectations of

municipal leaders upfront.

Speaker,

I would like to take a moment to speak specifically to the training aspect of

the Municipal Conduct Act bill. As I

referenced, the proposed legislation requires municipalities to provide code of

conduct training for all officials to which this code applies. This training

will be central to the establishment of the codes of conduct by the municipality

and, equally important, the extent to which it is followed.

With the

concurrence of the House on the proposed legislation, regulations will be

prepared on mandatory training requirements. These regulations will require

councillors and senior staff to participate in mandatory core training. If the

training is not completed then the duties of the councillor or senior staff

cannot be carried out. There will be comprehensive training and guidance for

communities from the department, as well as both Municipalities Newfoundland and

Labrador and the Professional Municipal Administrators.

It's

been extremely encouraging to share discussions with our partners and to hear

their vision for training on how we can move forward. It was certainly important

to have them at the table because, as I've said before, we can come up with

these things theoretically and make rules or legislation, but groups like MNL

and PMA are the boots on the ground, they're the ones who operationalize it, so

we needed their input.

I would

like to acknowledge the partnership that we formed with MNL and PMA and their

input and expertise in preparation of this proposed legislation. We look forward

to working with them in the future and ensuring that municipalities across the

province are prepared and trained to implement this important new legislation.

I'm very proud of the collaborative approach that we've built here and the

relationships that we're working on with our stakeholder groups.

Speaker,

this new legislation will provide municipalities with a framework, a clear set

of rules on what is acceptable and what is not and how to address an issue when

it may come up. It will improve operations, efficiencies and outcomes in our

communities. This will result in improved respectfulness and professionalism and

it will help councils and senior staff conduct business in a way that has a

positive impact on the business of their municipality and, ultimately, on all

their residents.

I'm

honoured to bring forward this legislation. I've seen first-hand in my former

life as a councillor and mayor, as many of you in this hon. House have, the

challenges that can come up because of a lack of understanding or information on

matters related to conduct and conflict of interest.

The

Municipal Conduct Act is in step with

or stronger than similar legislation in most other jurisdictions across the

country. I'm very pleased to highlight that the bill is gender-free legislation.

This means that it has been drafted without reference to his, her, she, him or

any other gender identifiers.

I'd like

to thank everyone who has contributed to the development of this legislation:

our municipal partners, MNL, PMA, the cities and towns across the province who

have worked collaboratively with us. This truly is a joint effort.

The

legislation aims to improve the functioning of communities, giving the councils

the tools they need to address matters of harassment and unprofessionalism and

to reduce their overall occurrences as time goes on.

This is

indeed quite a proud moment for me, a former young, female councillor and mayor

whose experience has been so positive and definitely life alternating. I

personally feel today I've had, in some way, a small impact on ensuring that the

many others who come behind me can experience the same. I look forward to the

debate.

Thank

you very much.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for Cape

St. Francis.

J. WALL:

Thank you, Speaker.

It's

indeed a privilege to speak in this House as always. Today I'm very happy to

speak to Bill 37,

An Act Respecting the Conduct of Municipal Officials. First of

all, I'd like to thank the minister, and of course her staff, for the briefing

that we had on this a few days back.

This

particular bill will require councillors and chief administrative officers to

file disclosure statements within their respective councils. It will define what

constitutes a conflict of interest, and the process to follow, should one arise,

within council. And of course to prescribe the process for complaints and

penalties and to allow for an appeal if necessary on to the Supreme Court.

Speaker,

the purpose of this proposed legislation will increase the clarity, as it

harmonizes procedures for a conflict of interest. It will require all

municipalities to establish a code of conduct for all officials. I'm glad to

hear that the template will be provided, as we do have many different ranges of

size of municipalities here in our province. And the template will provide the

continuity that's needed going forward, and I'm glad to hear that.

authorizes the minister to prescribe a code of conduct also for local service

districts. Not one that affects my district, personally, but I do know that many

districts here do have local service districts within them. Of course, that

would also be a prescribed code of conduct for those as well.

It will

set out penalties which may be imposed on councillors if need be. Right now,

it's very definitive if you are held in conflict, but this will set out a range

of penalties. Of course, it will introduce the mandatory training for

councillors and the senior staff. That is something that I advocated in the

first sitting of this Assembly when I spoke – one of my first times I spoke,

actually, Speaker – with respect to the need for mandatory training.

As a

former mayor myself, and I can firmly attest to the minister when she spoke, I

do welcome this code of conduct for municipal officials. This is a good step

forward. I'm sure, as you mentioned, we have many former municipal colleagues,

elected and staff here in this House who would welcome this change as well. We

all see what can happen and what has happened over the years.

We've

seen a number of councils who have become dysfunctional and unable to sort out

their own affairs. This is problematic when you look at the level of

volunteerism that you have in your community and you have the issues that do

arise. When this does happen, it does cast a shadow over the town and its

residents and, unfortunately, it does garner media attention. That has happened

in my hometown as well, unfortunately, before I came on council. It takes away

the importance of the community service that's provided by these volunteers.

This is going to be welcome.

As I

said, many times in this House, former mayor for 7½ years with the Town of Pouch

Cove, I had the privilege and was blessed to have an excellent working

relationship with my two terms on council and, of course, with the staff of the

town. That makes it much easier when everyone is pulling on the one oar and we

don't have to fight within council to try to get something done. It's hard

enough being an elected official on the municipal level, let alone when you're

battling with colleagues.

However,

during my 7½ years, we had very few questions with respect to conflict of

interest but, thankfully, we were very lucky to deal with them quickly. As we

all know, every council is not so lucky. We do have councils across our

beautiful province that become embroiled in disagreements and accusations with

respect to conflict of interest.

Speaker,

some individuals are found guilty of this and unfortunately, at this present

time, there is no other way to readdress it than to be expelled from council, to

vacate your seat. I'm sure there have been times that maybe innocent mistakes

result in vacating those seats. Then, of course, we're into an expensive

by-election, most things that small towns can't afford. This here does indeed

serve the public interest and, again, I'm happy to see this come forward.

Many

times in my 7½ years, I would always attend the training sessions for MNL and

from PMA, because that I found very beneficial as well. Many times it was

brought up at those training sessions, seminars, AGMs: What is a conflict of

interest? Am I in one? Is my colleague in one? If I am, what should I do; where

should I go? All these questions did come about over the years and,

unfortunately, they're questions that haven't got straightforward answers.

I know

that there could be many different examples of conflict. But what I may view as

a conflict, someone else may not. I do know that when you're putting it to your

council if you have a solid, working council, then the question can be answered

relatively reasonably and in good order. However, that's not always the case.

Speaker,

we also have to look at the public perception then for those who do serve on

council. We have individuals that serve, and they need clear rules, if those

rules are broken, and what will happen going forward. I believe this will

address most of that.

As we

all know, it doesn't matter what level of government you're in, public opinion

decision made before council can even make a decision on that. So we do know

that we have friends and neighbours who have stepped up and offered themselves

for public office. We do know that these individuals deserve the proper

training, with clear rules, clear repercussions, if they are violated.

So I'm

glad that the department is finally, after, I believe, three years of

consultations, bringing forward these changes. I do applaud that we're here

today. I'm also equally as delighted to see the mandatory training for

councillors and for senior staff. It's something that I've advocated for the

duration I was on municipal council. It was something that I took

part in

regularly, and you were better off for it. You served your residents in a much

better way when you are trained.

It's too

often over the years that people who get elected unfortunately don't have a

background in municipal service, in finance or in any municipal government

whatsoever. Yet, these individuals are tasked with overseeing budgets that can

range from $500,000 to several million dollars, to tens of millions of dollars

in operation.

So we

have to be mindful, and I'm glad that it's being addressed with respect to the

mandatory training for councillors and for senior staff. We do have to know when

staff and council – they don't cross each other's line. That's something that we

need to ensure that municipal elected officials and their staff know their

roles, they know what their job is that has to be done and they don't step

across the line to try to do someone else's job in that same time.

I firmly

believe that this will address that. I've been in this chair only a short period

of time and I've spoken to many people across our beautiful province with

respect to looking for advice on how to handle situations. I firmly believe that

this will curb a lot of that, having this brought forward, having the mandatory

training. I appreciate those who will take the time to do the training, to

educate themselves to better serve their residents and to have more productive

councils. It's very important to keep that in mind.

Speaker,

I know that the minister's department is looking at rolling this out. I do hope

that it's in a timely fashion and we'll get to some questions when I come to

that later on in this discussion.

I'm glad

to hear that she did say with respect to Municipalities Newfoundland and

Labrador and the Professional Municipal Administrators, two wonderful groups

that all of us can draw on, really, and moreover our municipal elected officials

to run the municipalities.

I'm glad

to see that they are part of the process. For many years, they have shouldered a

lot of the burden. I know many of the staff at MNL and they are quality

individuals who do great work and who do provide that service to our

municipalities. I'm glad to see that. I'm glad to see that this legislation has

finally come to the floor of the House.

I look

forward to asking some detailed questions when we get into Committee.

Thank

you, Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Minister

Responsible for Women and Gender Equality.

P. PARSONS:

Thank you, Speaker.

It's

always a pleasure to speak to legislation here in the House of Assembly and, of

course, to represent the strong District of Harbour Grace - Port de Grave.

Again, it's always wonderful to do that and, of course, I'd like to commend my

colleague, the minister, for bringing in this long-overdue legislation.

For

those of us just tuning in at home, we are here today debating the

Municipal Conduct Act and how special

it is, of course, for me as Minister Responsible for Women and Gender Equality

to certainly partake in that; very important legislation, Bill 37,

An Act

Respecting the Conduct of Municipal Officials.

Speaker,

our government certainly is – and as we've seen since we formed our most recent

government – committed to improving gender diversity and representation in

politics. Ultimately, working to reduce gender-based harassment and barriers to

professional advancement are critical steps towards achieving this commitment.

Codes of

conduct like this one are essential in setting standards, Speaker, and

expectations that help create safe spaces for all employees.

At this

time, too, I also want to throw a big congratulations and a bouquet to all

candidates across Newfoundland and Labrador who put their name forward in this

most recent municipal election. Again, a big round of applause for them for just

putting your name forward. It certainly is to be commended to step up and serve.

As we know, with the three levels of government, the municipal level, they are

the front line, ultimately. They deal with residents on the front line. Of

course, we also partner and collaborate with them, provincially, as well as our

colleagues at the federal level.

This

legislation will help promote equality and security in council chambers and

municipal workplaces, thereby improving opportunities for women and members of

the 2SLGBTQQIA community. This legislation will indeed assist in ensuring ours

is a society where diverse voices are not only heard, Speaker, but respected and

valued.

On that

note, as well, I did earlier in this session recognize the first transgender

person to be elected to our capital city in Newfoundland and Labrador, Ms.

Ophelia Ravencroft. I also commend the people who supported her, the people on

her campaign and, of course, those residents in the City of St. John's; it's

wonderful to see. We need to see more of this because, of course, ultimately,

society wants and needs to see councils that are reflective of society itself.

This

legislation not only strengthens municipal leadership but also brings in

mandatory core training and municipal employees on the code of conduct, which

will be essential in helping to reach the goal of reduced gender-based

harassment and discriminatory practices.

We know

that we need more diversity at decision-making tables, including more women and

gender-diverse individuals. If we just look around the room here in our hon.

House of Assembly here, only nine seats in this Chamber of 40 are represented by

women. Strong women, women who I commend and I'm very proud of and I'm happy to

call colleagues and friends, but we need to see more of this, Speaker. We know

that we need to see more diversity at the decision-making tables. We need to see

a reflection of society in which we live so that we can make decisions that are

meaningful and impactful for the people in our communities, our province and our

beautiful country.

That

said, too, Speaker, at this time, I would like to congratulate all MPs, of

course, for Newfoundland and Labrador. We know that the prime minister announced

and revealed his Cabinet today; very proud to see our prime minister take the

leadership in accomplishing gender parity in his Cabinet. I want to take this

time to congratulate MP Gudie Hutchings for making it to the Cabinet table, as

well, of course, our friend and MP, Seamus O'Regan. Wonderful to see two Cabinet

Members from this awesome province, small but mighty in population, at the

Cabinet table, of course, in Ottawa.

We all

know that the underrepresentation of women in leadership roles, including all

levels of public office, is a direct result of attitudes, systemic, situational

and institutional barriers that women and gender-diverse individuals face in

society today. It's important that we provide safe places for future leaders to

network with others, build relationships and foster mentorship and sponsorship

roles that will asset them in exploring their paths to the boardroom tables,

municipal councils and, of course, legislatures.

This

spring the Office of Women and Gender Equality actually partnered with the

wonderful organization Equal Voice Newfoundland and Labrador, which I'm very

proud of. I also want to commend them on the great work that they do to support

candidates across Newfoundland and Labrador.

partnered with Equal Voice to offer a campaign college for perspective

candidates. It brought together people of different backgrounds and ethnicities

and we were encouraged to see so many people taking

part in the campaign. It was

an online forum, one of the workshops that I took place in, and it was just so

inspiring, Speaker, to hear the stories, to see the interest and the intelligent

conversation that were shared, of course, by women and non-binary candidates on

that call. I'll never forget that. These are some of the highlights of being in

this role as minister. It's such an honour to be around such inspiring people.

I'm

told, Speaker, that of the 26 participants, seven made the bid for election.

Just about all 26 were engaged in some way, either working on a campaign at the

municipal or the recent federal level.

I know

that considerable gains were made, particularly during this municipal election

to increase diversity. This year was an overall increase of 2.8 per cent in

nominations compared to the previous election in 2017 with 39 per cent

identifying as female, that's an increase from 33 per cent in 2017.

I want

to certainly take this opportunity to thank my colleague, the Minister of

Municipal and Provincial Affairs, for her work with Municipalities Newfoundland

and Labrador through the Make Your Mark campaign. These campaigns are integral

as well to encouraging participation in local politics.

We know,

too, that in the most recent provincial elections we saw an historic number of

women and gender-diverse individuals put their names forward. We need to see

more of that than the nine, of course, who are currently here. It is indeed a

positive step forward.

Speaker,

as an MHA, I'm sure we can all compare stories and times where members of our

councils within our local district reach out to us for direction with

situations, as my hon. colleague just brought up earlier. We hear the stories

of, dare I say it, corruption and unfairness and the harassment and the

bullying.

I'm very

pleased to see this long-overdue legislation be brought in. I also would like to

encourage all councils and organizations across Newfoundland and Labrador, we're

doing it here at the provincial level, but the implementation of a GBA+, that's

the Gender-based Analysis Plus lens, to be applied to every policy, every

program that's offered.

That's

something, of course, that takes from the genesis of every program that's

developed to see how women and gender-diverse individuals are affected by

everything that's put forward. It certainly is an eye-opener. I mean, you think

you would assume it's a simple boy versus girl matter, but it's really not.

At this

time, too, I'd like to commend the staff in the Office of Women and Gender

Equality for the work that they do that works with every department across the

provincial government to implement this and to ensure that everybody is best

represented and least impacted as possible as can be.

I knew,

personally, for me at a young age when I was interested in politics; I think I

was nine years old when it first triggered my interest. It was a family friend.

It was a male, however, who was running for politics and it was the first time I

got to see it roll out, the activity and the excitement around it. But one thing

that I did notice, looking around, it was a lot of men; you didn't really see a

lot of women come forward.

That

said, I am certainly happy I am where I am today and I'd like to thank all the

people who helped me get to where I am. Again, as a woman politician – the first

woman actually to represent the District of Harbour Grace - Port de Grave – I

want to encourage all women and gender-diverse people who are thinking about it

to go for it. Just go, take the plunge. If you sit there and often wait for the

right time to run, sometimes, Speaker, as you can appreciate, probably that time

never comes.

Again, I

really commend this legislation. Certainly any way that I can me of support, as

well as the staff and the Department of Women and Gender Equality, anything that

we can do to enhance, to train and to better educate so that we can be better

representatives for the people of Newfoundland and Labrador.

At this

time, I also want to talk about and I want to commend the Premier for his

leadership on the Indigenous training that we recently underwent as a –

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Oh, oh!

SPEAKER:

Order, please!

Please

stay relevant to the bill.

P. PARSONS:

Thank you, Speaker.

All the

training that we can do certainly helps us be better representatives for the

people of Newfoundland and Labrador.

I look

forward when this bill goes to Committee to hear the conversation, and I

certainly will be supporting this legislation, Bill 37,

An Act Respecting the

Conduct of Municipal Officials.

Thank

you, Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Topsail - Paradise.

P. DINN:

Thank you, Speaker.

It is a

privilege to speak to this bill today. Just so I'll put it in the record, I will

go down through the Explanatory Notes that are contained in the bill.

“This

Bill would enact the Municipal Conduct Act .

The Bill would: require councillors and chief administrative officers to file

disclosure statements with the council; prescribe what constitutes a conflict of

interest for municipal officials; prescribe the process to be followed where a

councillor knows, or ought reasonably to know, that the councillor has a

conflict of interest in a matter before the council; establish a process

relating to complaints regarding conflict of interest of a councillor, former

councillor and administrator; prescribe the penalties to be imposed on a

councillor, former councillor or administrator who acted in a conflict of

interest; require councils to establish two codes of conduct, one code of

conduct relating to councillors and another code of conduct relating to all

other municipal officials; establish a process relating to complaints regarding

contraventions of a code of conduct; prescribe the penalties to be imposed on

municipal officials who contravene the code of conduct; allow the complainant

and respondent to appeal certain decisions under the Act to the Supreme Court of

Newfoundland and Labrador; and require councillors and chief administrative

officers to complete training approved by the minister.”

I think

my colleague for Cape St. Francis had mentioned earlier as a past municipal

councillor, and myself – and I know there are many in this House who have served

on municipal councils. I myself served as the deputy mayor in the Town of

Paradise. I can tell you that code of conduct, conflict of interest were huge

topics that came up on a regular basis and seeing anything that can give some

more definition to these areas and make councillors more accountable and CAOs

more accountable, I welcome.

believe that people who put their names forward for council are doing so to help

out in the community, but they need guidance and they need legislation like this

that makes it more definitive and takes away the subjectivity when it comes to

some pretty serious issues that may arise.

This

provides that definition, provides the penalties because in the past, as well,

if you were found in conflict of interest, then the only option was to vacate

your seat. We talk about training, we talk about education and the conflict of

interest may be something that wasn't intended, something that they weren't

aware of, yet they could potentially lose their seat over that.

This is

welcome, to come in with this and apply this new legislation. You also got to

think about some of the councils out there. Some receive stipends. Many others

are volunteer. You've got volunteers stepping forward and they have the

uncertainties connected to some of the things they may or may not do. Giving

some clarity to that certainly helps those individuals. As we know, you look

around; you try to get people to run for office, so they need to be aware of

what they're getting into. I think that's clear for anything we do.

people who you say you should run for council, the next question is: Well,

what's involved in it? This piece of legislation certainly clarifies a lot of

that in terms of what's expected of them, what level of ethics and morals and

that is expected of them. It's that clarity then that they make an educated

decision on that. You talk about training that's allowed here, looking at

training for municipal councils, there's a handbook – I think it's still online

– a municipal training handbook for councillors, which is great. I've read it,

but not everybody is familiar with legislation and what it stands for. That

document does a very good job, but I think the people who may be new to a

council post, it may not be as clear to them.

Offering

and providing some sort of training program for them where there could be

questions asked and clarity given is certainly a step in the right direction. I

know from my own experience – this is not specific to Paradise council but to

councillors I've spoken to. A lot of them have not had the experience of sitting

in a chamber and making motions and voting on motions and the like. Training,

it's new to them. So having a training program or package available will

certainly give them more direction and sooner rather than later.

I think,

as well when I was looking through the bill here – and I think the minister

mentioned it earlier, talking about it's not just conflict of interest. She

mentioned the use of influence. She talked about unethical conduct. Individuals

in a particular position may not even realize that what they say is influencing

a decision. They may not even realize it. I've known people might get elected

and they feel they're up on a pedestal. But I mean at the end of the day, much

like our people here, the hon. Members in this House, we're elected to work for

the people. I think with proper training of councillors and maybe even MHAs, but

councillors, you're taught what role you're supposed to fill and what your

limitations of your role are.

When we

look at this, setting out the code of conduct, setting out what's required, I

think you'll see less unethical conduct and people will be a little bit more

focused on what's the proper way to behave and what's the proper way to do

business within the council chamber.

I think

the disclosure statement has been there before, but expanding it to include your

CAO – your chief administrative officer or town clerk. We know that, especially

in some smaller municipalities, there's quite a – I'll call it – familiarity

between counsellors and the staff clerk. Most of them may be from the same

family. So to outline this and have that information come forward to ensure that

there's no conflict of interest positions or you're put in a position where

you're voting on something you shouldn't, I think that's a good start there for

sure.

In my

time on municipal council and dealing with council, conflict of interest was

very much debated. We looked at the

Municipalities Act, 1999 , and we looked at the definition on conflict of

interest in that. Now, this is a broader definition in here. I hope that we're

going to do some balancing act between the two to bring further clarity to it.

Because I think with the two

definitions there are some areas that are up for

question there that we should look at.

The one

thing that we did when it came to conflict of interest issues within the chamber

– and I think the legislation is really there, in my mind, to protect the

councillor if he or she thinks she's in or he's in a conflict of interest. You

don't want to be caught in that situation where you're voting on something that

you may or may not have been impartial to because of a connection or monetary

gain or whatever. So I think it's there to protect that individual.

But the

problem I always had with it was that council voted on it – council voted on it.

So if I claim to be in conflict of interest and I truly felt I was in conflict

of interest, your own council would vote on it and say, no, you're not in

conflict, in which case you have to vote. Even though in your own heart and soul

you think you should be abstaining.

I'm

looking at the

section 6 here and just a particular clause there, and I may ask

this question in Committee for clarification, or the minister may clarify it for

me. In

section 6 – and we go down there I'm looking at 5, then

section 6(5)

says, “Where a councillor is uncertain as to whether or not the councillor has a

conflict of interest, the councillor shall disclose the nature of the possible

conflict of interest to the council and the council may decide by a majority

vote.”

interpretation there is if I truly believe I'm in conflict of interest, I'm in

conflict of interest, which is a good thing because I don't think we've had that

clarification before. If I read this in concert with that, it says: if I'm

uncertain, I ask for a vote and council may vote.

I'm

hoping to get clarification on that. If I feel I'm in conflict, I'm in conflict

and I walk out of the chambers. Here I think this clarifies this a little better

for us. I appreciate that and, hopefully, I'll get that clarified.

Because

when you're thinking of some of these councils and individuals that have come in

and been elected, they're from all walks of life in some of these communities,

they come in with different experiences but they may not be adept to following a

process.

In fact,

I would say to you, we brought in in Paradise – I made the motion and we brought

in our parliamentary rules, the Robert's

Rule of Order .

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Oh, oh!

SPEAKER:

Order, please!

P. DINN:

I'm sure for some in some

communities, they wouldn't know – and no disrespect, it comes from your

background and the lifestyle you come from, but I bet there are many out there

that don't know what Robert's Rules of

Order are. In fact, I suspect that in this House some of us don't know what

the parliamentary rules are at the odd time. But it's a pretty thick document,

so when we do proper training – and I connect it to the municipality's council

training handbook – it takes out those specific areas that councillors would

deal with more often and gives clarity on those.

So when

I look at the training piece and bringing councillors in and giving them the

proper training so they all have a benchmark area to start from, it's a learning

experience, no doubt about it. As long as everyone has a good understanding of

what is required of them; what would be considered unethical is an issue.

Some of

these communities, like I said, you may know everyone. In fact, some councils

may all be related. So this provides some clarity there. I know there is a

section that talks about quorums and such. I applaud that in terms of the

quality or the clarification.

I don't

know who's going to do the training or who would be the one to do the training

here. I'm going to make the assumption that government will come up with a

training package. There's the handbook, but are there training modules or will

there be videos or the like to deal with this? I think that's something that we

need to do.

Not

everyone, not every town is able to come up with someone to do the training in

terms of facilitating it. So it's something that needs to be considered as we

move forward. I think it's certainly needed. I think from a point of view of

independence and objectivity, I think it's useful that someone who does the

training is someone who is knowledgeable in municipal affairs, knowledgeable in

legislation and can speak objectively to the training. I think when you get the

trainer too close to the community, then you're dealing with, you know, issues

that have occurred in the community and some may not be described as they should

be in terms of an objective manner.

I'm

hoping to be able to ask a few more questions on this during Committee. I think

it's a long time coming. I know it's an attempt at clarity and I think it's done

very much on increasing the clarity around the code of conduct, so I'm pleased

with that. There are some areas, as I said, with the

Municipalities Act, 1999 , in terms of

definitions, I'm not sure the

two meld together in terms of the

definitions of conflict of interest, but I'll

ask some questions on that when the time comes.

But it

is an area that councils I've sat on and councils I've heard from, and I'm sure

the minister has heard from, especially from her past municipal experience, that

some of these councillors are just unsure of how to deal with it.

It's not

easy when you point across the table and you call out someone for a conflict.

That's not easy to do. Sometimes people take offence to it. So this legislation

certainly allows us to take the personal nature out of it and look: Here's what

you're all supposed to abide by, here is what's considered unethical behaviour

and here is the conduct that's expected of you.

I give

credit where credit is due; there are not a lot of grey areas here. But with any

piece of legislation, there's going to be. You're going to see them. Someone's

going to come up and what about this and what about that. I'm sure, as

regulations come out, we'll see more clarity there.

This is

long overdue, and that's not a criticism on the current government. That's just

fact. In dealing with the many municipalities of all different shapes and sizes

– it's beyond me why some of these municipalities and these councils don't all

get some form of stipend. I mean, they're entitled to it. But, as we know,

depending on the size of the area, some get stipends more than others. So you've

got to realize that a lot of these councils are pretty close to volunteer. They

might receive a small stipend for, I don't know, gas and expenses like that. At

the end of the day, a lot of them are very much volunteer. And even though some

get the stipends, they'll probably tell you it's not enough to cover what I got

to do.

Anything

we can do to give clarity and make their job easier in terms of that because we

all know in this House of Assembly, as we're dealing with complaints and issues,

they deal with the right-in-front-of-you issues in the communities. Getting some

clarity on what's expected of you, what you can or can't do or some areas where

you may be in conflict or your conduct is out of order, at least they know that.

There's nothing worse than someone calling you out of order and you're there and

you really think you did something right and you didn't expect it. You apologize

all you want, but you're still called out.

At least

this sets the guidelines. The penalty issue, I think, is fabulous in terms of

not having that one option. You make a mistake you're gone. I do have some

reservation with the fact that you're still going to council or your CAO to make

a final decision. I do have issues with that, especially in smaller

jurisdictions. I think at some point in time – and I know it says you can go to

the Supreme Court as a final option, but I do look at that in terms of some

council, the council votes first; if not, it can go to your CAO and they would

look at it. I think we're putting a lot of increased work on your administrative

staff in the towns.

I would

have liked to see somewhere between the CAO and the Supreme Court, something in

there in terms – I know it can go to the minister, but somewhere else that you

can call and get a quicker decision on whether you are considered the conflict

of interest or not. Some towns are able to afford legal counsel; some are not.

Even your own legal counsel, I would argue they might be in a bit of a conflict

dealing with it, because they're being paid and work for the town. Something in

there I'd like to see a little different in terms of an independent place to

call and make your call.

Anyway,

I'm hoping to get a few questions during the Committee stage. I do appreciate

it. I think it's a long time coming. I'm sure we'll be supporting it, but we'll

have some questions.

Thank

you for the time.

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Hear, hear!

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for

Labrador West.

J. BROWN:

Thank you, Speaker.

It's a

privilege to speak for the people of Labrador West but also on this. Like my

colleague there from Topsail - Paradise said there too, it is something that's a

long time coming. It's something we hear about often in our communities and

stuff. I only have two municipalities in my district and I look across there to

some of the other Members with going on 100 municipalities in their district.

I'm sure they hear it a lot more than what I would hear about these things.

Like he

said, there are a lot of communities in this province that are different shapes,

sizes, makeups, geography, everything all has effect. We're working with

hundreds of different little communities, big communities and everything in

between that do have a lot of different makeup and stuff. Like I said, some

communities, the entire community is one family.

Having

some guidance and some clarity and things like that is really important. We may

have to spell it out for them, but we have to have this guidance there to make

sure that there are checks and balances and a procedure in place that we avoid

conflict

Also at

the same time, like you said, we have disclosure statements, setting guidelines

and even a complaint process, the mandatory code of conduct. These are things

that most governing bodies today are required to have. You can go on to some

boards for some not for profits and they have a lot of these things in place

already. It's good that we're going to spell this out. We're going to have a

process that deals with it and we're also going to have the opportunities now –

if anything, this will actually help enhance communities further in the sense

that they know what's before them. They know their responsibilities and they'll

be able to point out conflicts of interest and other issues like that a lot more

readily, at the same time protecting the communities, protecting councillors and

finding that happy balance in between.

We're in

a stage now that just being on a council is a lot more than what people expect

these days. There's a lot more stuff going on now in society and in communities.

There are broader scopes of things being discussed now as we go forward. So

we're not just talking about day-to-day issues; things are getting a lot more

broad. Even talking with communities in Labrador West, the things that are on

their council table now is just a lot more than what we presume or the public

presumes to be the simple things. There is a lot of stuff going on. So we have

to have guidance; we have to have abilities to find these things.

I do

agree with the Member for Topsail - Paradise, too, about the processes going

from council and then to your CAO and then up. There should be some sort of body

or some kind of ability to maybe handle these things. Because some communities

may not even have a full slate of councillors and they can't probably attract a

full slate of councillors. These little small communities need a resource,

almost like a hotline, for them to work through these things. And there should

be a body of some sort set up to help this. But at the same time it's almost, in

a sense, that there needs to be a broader body.

Maybe

this body can also facilitate the training that's required that's in this act,

too. To go to community to community and teach people about a lot of this stuff.

Because most people may run for a municipal position with the full intention of

good in their heart and want to do the right thing, but when they get there and

realize there are a lot of big things on the table, you have this code of

conduct set down in front of them, they may not be ready, per se, then and they

will need some extra guidance and stuff to work through these things.

There

are a lot of these little communities now that their councils are made up of a

lot of retired people or people that came back from working away and come back

with all the best intentions and things like this. So maybe we should have the

ability to have some sort of body, agency or some sort of little thing that can

actually help people with the conflict of interest things, help with the

training and give people the ability to do the right thing.

encourage people to run for council because we want the best for our communities

and we want to get people engaged in the process. But, at the same time, we

should be giving them the resources and the abilities to work within this

legislation that's proposed right now, but also help them understand why this

important, understand the importance of it. Also, at the same time, encouraging

them to have healthy debate in their council, do what they think is right for

their communities and have the abilities to move forward with it.

So I

agree with this. Myself and my colleagues here, we agree this is very important.

We would like to see the importance this is, but also at the same time we agree

with our colleague from Topsail - Paradise that maybe there should be some kind

of body or something in between when it comes to these kinds of things. But also

my add-on to it would be maybe this body would also be responsible for training

councillors so that way we do what's right for them and best by them, because

this could be overwhelming for a lot of these people. We want to encourage

healthy communities, healthy debate and good active councils.

We've

all seen the community that couldn't get enough people to run. They're trying

their best. We want to encourage those smaller communities as well to be active

communities, active participants in debate and in their community and grow our

communities and grow our rural parts of the province.

We have

to make sure that we give them the tools necessary to carry out this, but also

if they call looking for a helping hand, we can also do that at the same time.

With

that, that's my thing on it.

Thank

you, Speaker.

SPEAKER:

The hon. the Member for Burin

- Grand Bank.

P. PIKE:

Speaker, it's a pleasure for

me to speak to Bill 37,

An Act Respecting The Conduct Of Municipal Officials.

I'll

begin by saying that the changes to the Municipalities Act have been discussed and requested for some years now. I'm pleased

that this government has committed to complete this very important piece of

legislation.

Dealing

with disclosure statements, conflict of interest, code of conduct, appeals and

orientation training is very timely given the fact that we just elected new

councils who will require training and guidance as they take on their new roles

as councillors.

I firmly

believe that the Municipalities Act will go a long way in the retention and

recruitment of new councillors and staff. This year's election was a great

election with a lot of towns having more than the required number running.

Elections were healthy and it's great to see that interest has improved.

Speaker,

I have served on seven different councils for a total of 28 years in municipal

politics. I've seen many new people elected and it has been a great experience

for me, as well as a lot of those that had been elected. I've also witnessed,

Speaker, that many find they are not prepared for the challenges that they face.

This bill will allow for the training required to help them as they pursue their

careers as local politicians. There is no greater act of volunteerism or no

greater service than serving on council and making a difference in your

community. This is what motivates people to run for council. Most of these

people that run four council have experience as volunteers within their

community and decided to step it up a notch and become involved at the local

level as a councillor.

Perhaps

one of the biggest issues with councils is the conflict of interest. Often we

hear that councillors and staff are accused of acting in a conflict of interest.

This has become a real problem and often councils have to engage in legal

counsel, at a significant cost I might at; a cost that does affect service

delivery, especially in our smaller municipalities in our rural districts.

This act

will clearly outline steps and procedures that councils need to take if a

significant conflict of interest occurs or steps to take to avoid such

situations. This

section of the act also clearly provides penalties for conflict

of interest for councillors, former councillors and administrators. This is

certainly very beneficial and gives more autonomy and decision-making to the

councils, which they have asked for in the past.

Code of

conduct, another

section of Bill 37, this is extremely important as guidelines

and standards are key to running an effective council. All too often we hear of

councils experiencing difficulties and issues that face council, which included

professional behaviour, confidentiality and harassment.

This act

makes it mandatory for councils and administrators to conduct training and

clearly outlines the complaint process and penalties for contraventions of the

code of conduct. Speaker,

an act that is prescriptive and clear will give

councils the autonomy and knowledge to act, which in turn will save thousands of

dollars in professional and legal fees.

Councillors may have duties, Speaker, and being able to carry out these duties

requires individuals committed to their service in rural and urban communities.

I've often referred to the role of councillors as grassroots politics. You

represent your citizens in many ways in the areas of stewardship, sustainability

of the town, economic development, business attraction and infrastructure

requirements, just to maintain and mention a few.

This

act, Speaker, has had stakeholder consultations on the Municipal Legislative

Review. These consultations are very engaging and were very engaging. There were

small-table discussions focusing on municipal purposes and structure,

accountability and transparency, professional conduct, revenue and enforcement.

I was involved in some of the discussions, which involved 74 written submissions

generating 691 recommendations for the bill. Other feedback, which included PMA

and MNL surveys, saw another 220 recommendations; 11 in-person sessions

resulting in a total of 1,200 ideas generated.

What

people wanted, Speaker, in this reform was, one, a more user-friendly act, an

act that would allow councils to be able to interpret the act more freely, an

act that would allow people to understand what was being said and what the

regulations and rules were for running council meetings and other significant

parts of the act. They wanted an increase on openness, accountability and

transparency. Of course, that's important for all councils. Address councillor

and municipal staff conduct and conflict of interest. Clearly, what we're

proposing here