Fourth Session, 42nd Parliament

(2023) OFFICIAL REPORT

OF DEBATES

(HANSARD)

Thursday, May 11, 2023

Morning Sitting

Issue No. 329

ISSN 1499-2175

The HTML transcript is provided for informational purposes only.

The PDF transcript remains the official digital version.

CONTENTS

Blessings and Acknowledgments

B. Dick

Routine Business

Introductions by Members

Introduction and First Reading of

Bills

Bill M225 — Fraser Valley Transit Services Act,

T. Halford

Statements (Standing Order 25B)

Moose Hide anti-violence campaign

D. Clovechok

Surrey Crime Prevention Society youth

volunteers

J. Sims

Memorial Cup hockey tournament in

Kamloops

T. Stone

Michael Sather and dementia awareness

N. Simons

Transit for Teens campaign

S. Furstenau

Youth poetry and climate change concerns

R. Glumac

Oral Questions

Reports on management of B.C. Housing

K. Falcon

Hon. D. Eby

Management of B.C. Housing and safety issues at

Atira properties

P. Milobar

Hon. R. Kahlon

Heatwave response and support for vulnerable

persons

S. Furstenau

Hon. R. Kahlon

Heatwave response and provision of air

conditioners

S. Furstenau

Hon. A. Dix

Simon Fraser University football program

T. Halford

Hon. S. Robinson

Access to obstetrics and prenatal care in

Kamloops

T. Stone

Hon. A. Dix

Drug toxicity crisis and management of safe

supply

E. Sturko

Hon. J. Whiteside

Regulation of illicit drug use in public

spaces

S. Bond

Hon. D. Eby

Tabling Documents

B.C. Judicial Compensation Commission, final report, 2022

Petitions

J. Tegart

P. Milobar

Orders of the Day

Committee of Supply

Estimates: Office of the Premier

(continued)

Hon. D. Eby

K. Falcon

THURSDAY, MAY 11, 2023

The House met at 10:07 a.m.

[Mr. Speaker in the chair.]

Blessings and Acknowledgments

Mr. Speaker: I invite Bradley Dick of the Songhees Nation to lead the House in prayer

or reflection.

B. Dick: [lək̓ʷəŋən was spoken.]

I’d like to thank the Speaker of the House, to thank members of the House,

to thank our family up in the gallery, as well, and perhaps those that are

joining virtually today as well. We’ve learned to navigate in a very hybrid way

in how we come together.

I have the good fortune of being here not only as a

lək̓ʷəŋən individual from what we refer

to as “the place to smoke herring” and we know today as the Songhees and

Esquimalt Nations. I also have the opportunity to speak on behalf of the Moose

Hide Campaign today. A part of that formality is the blanket, the headband and

what we refer to as the [lək̓ʷəŋən was

spoken], the hiring of that speaker to do that work on behalf of the

family.

I want to acknowledge my relative, Adam Olsen. Our families are connected

through marriage. It’s always humbling and a great honour to know that we have

family doing work on behalf of our communities and speaking in the interests and

needs of our nations as well, as many of you do, of course.

[lək̓ʷəŋən was spoken.] I welcome you

with open arms and raised hands to our beautiful lands and our sacred waters. I

see many wearing that moose hide pin. We’re brought together today in mutual

heart, love and compassion to acknowledge but also to affirm that we’re taking a

stand against violence against women and children in our communities.

[10:10 a.m.]

As many of you, I’m sure, can relate, they are our future generations,

what we refer to as our SPAKEṈ , our

flowers, so how we nurture and look after our gardens, whether it be here at the

House or in our homes and community. It’s our role to look after those beautiful

flowers so that they don’t have to experience why we wear those pins.

We ask why, perhaps, the Lacerte family aren’t here, themselves, to do

this work. They wanted to follow protocol of our

lək̓ʷəŋən territory, so they hired

another speaker to speak on their behalf. I’m humbled to have that opportunity

to do so for them.

As we reflect on how, perhaps, each of you come together to strengthen our

province, we reflect on how we do so with like hearts and like minds. That’s

what this bandana’s responsibility is: to ensure that as I speak, it aligns to

this, to my heart. My hope and encouragement is that we do so in the way that we

come together for our communities.

My name is Yuxwelupton. Bradley Dick is my given name. I’d like to share

and open with a prayer song that was taught to me by Quisheemut, my late uncle

Ray Peters from the Cowichan Tribes.

[10:15 a.m.]

[lək̓ʷəŋən was

sung.]

HÍSW̱ḴE SIÁM again for the

opportunity to open your deliberation in a good way. I hope, in your own way,

that you ask for that love and guidance in the way that you work and walk on

behalf of our communities and to wish each of you that, perhaps, have travelled

to share this time together, as well, that your travels be safe, and you get

safely home to your families.

HÍSW̱ḴE SIÁM . Thank

you.

Mr. Speaker: Thank you, Bradley, for your beautiful prayer and beautiful song. Thank

you.

Routine Business

Introductions by Members

Hon. P. Alexis: It’s a pleasure to have someone come from home to witness what goes on

in the House. Today it’s my absolute pleasure to introduce my dear friend

Jim Hinds. Jim and I sat together on council between 2014 and 2018. Now Jim

fills his time at the Mission food bank and for the Mission Rotary Club, but

he has a long history of volunteerism in the community. I call him, in

addition to a good friend, volunteer extraordinaire.

Would the entire House please give Jim a warm, warm welcome from

Mission.

Hon. M. Farnworth: As most members of this House have learned over the years, I’m

incredibly proud of my community of Port Coquitlam, which, this coming

Saturday, celebrates its 100th continuous May Day community

parade.

At the head of that parade, though, will be a very special individual.

He used to work for me. He’s probably the only other person who has as much

love for his community as I do. He’s joined here today by his wife, Blaire,

and his two sons, Owen, age two, and Liam, who is age six.

The individual that I am talking about was elected as one of the

youngest city councillors in the history of Port Coquitlam. He beat my

record by six months. He was elected as one of the youngest mayors in the

history of Port Coquitlam and certainly has made a name for himself

throughout this province.

Would the chamber please give a very big welcome to one of the best

mayors in this province, Mayor Brad West.

K. Falcon: Today in the gallery, we’re joined by a longtime former colleague of

many of us, the former cabinet minister under the Premiers Glen Clark, Dan

Miller and Ujjal Dosanjh, a longtime fighter for….

Interjections.

K. Falcon: Oh, he’s on the floor, of course. Now allowed to sit on the floor of

the Legislature, of course, is a former MLA and a longtime fighter for rural

issues and labour issues and, by the way, the latest member of B.C.

United.

Will we welcome Harry Lali with us here today.

[10:20 a.m.]

Hon. K. Conroy: It gives me a great deal of pleasure to introduce a couple of people

in the gallery, Jessie and Justine Sutherland.

Jessie’s here in Victoria this week to receive a B.C. Community

Achievement Award. She’s a founder of the organization Intercultural

Strategies. She helps leaders and groups build cultures of belonging to

create change in an inclusive and positive way. She works with organizations

and communities to encourage diversity, build belonging and ignite

intercultural collaboration.

Her work has actually been delivered in over eight languages and taken

her across Canada and around the world to support communities in their

efforts to address challenging issues, including poverty, homelessness, the

overdose crisis, elder abuse, reconciliation, youth engagement, bullying,

workplace inclusion and more.

Of course, Justine is Jessie’s daughter. She is a grade 6 student who

is passionate about developing her circus skills and taking care of the

environment.

Would everyone please join me and welcome them to the

chamber.

S. Furstenau: I have a few introductions.

Here today in the gallery is Viveca Ellis, the executive director of

the Centre for Family Equity, formerly the Single Mothers Alliance. I want

to congratulate Viveca and the Centre for their transition to a new name and

thank them for all of the work they do on behalf of people in British

Columbia.

I ask that the members make Viveca most welcome today.

It’s the last day of session. It’s the last day with our interns. We

haven’t introduced them yet this session, so I’m just going to take a moment

to introduce our two interns, Kayla Brent and Jacob Schoeber.

Kayla has taken every task thrown at her and not only done it well but

done it with grace and confidence. She needs to write a book about her last

six years. She has spent time in every part of the Green universe — the

constituency office, the riding association, the party, and now the caucus.

She’s done the tour de Green, all before her mid-twenties, and after seeing

all four options, she’s picking a career in winemaking. She’s conquered

politics, and she’s off to conquer the wine industry.

We are going to miss Kayla’s quick mind and her ability to take on

anything. We know she will continue to change the world for the better. As

Kayla well knows, the B.C. Greens are indeed Hotel California, so we expect

to see her back.

Jacob refers to himself as the other intern, but he is certainly not

secondary. Jacob has charmed us with his candour, a record speed meme-maker

and an excellent source on electoral information. He’s a lover of free food,

public health and healthy democracy. Our staff will remember him fondly for

his quirks, including the time where he raved about a show about a guy who

faked his way into a law firm, to which they all replied, “You mean

Suits ?”

Jacob is turning his attention to the world of law school next. We

have no doubt he will continue to blaze a trail forward for good governance,

transparency and accountability.

We are very grateful to Jacob and Kayla for their hard work and

contributions to this place, and we wish them the very best in their next

chapters.

Hon. J. Whiteside: I’m really pleased today to be able to welcome to the gallery the

staff who work in my ministry office: Isabella Lee, Jada Smith, Thomas Jin

and Erica Greenup. Not in the chamber but surely watching is my chief of

staff, Seamus Wolfe. I am very grateful to all of them for their support

over the course of the session and for all of the work they do on an ongoing

basis.

It’s a bit bittersweet today, though, because we are losing Erica at

the end of the session. She is moving on to a position in the public service

as a policy analyst where she is going to bring her infectious energy, her

sharp analysis and her extraordinary talent, so we will be very lucky to

continue to benefit from her work.

Thank you very much for all of your service, Erica.

Would the House please join me in making them very welcome

today.

I. Paton: Today we have some special guests in the House that are related to our

great Sergeant-at-Arms, Ray Robitaille.

I want to say, first of all, a thank-you to Mr. Robitaille and the

great security people that keep us safe here. I’ve certainly noticed more

staffing now at our doors in the last six months or a year, and it’s great

to see the job that Ray’s doing.

I want to say that Ray’s wife Carol is with us today, and his daughter

Anna Robitaille and her boyfriend Braydon Newfelt are here today. I believe

they’re from Calgary. They’re sort of related to my wife and I’s best

friends in Ladner, but that gets very complicated.

[10:25 a.m.]

Anyways, thank you, Ray, for all your good work.

Please welcome Ray’s family up above.

K. Falcon: I want to take a moment. This is less an introduction but more a

thanks, on behalf of, I’m sure, both sides of the House.

To all the security staff, all the staff that work in these buildings to make it possible

for us to do the work we do here every day on behalf of the people: thank

you for the work you do. It’s appreciated.

I know, Mr. Speaker, that you would very much echo those sentiments,

but I’m saying them, hopefully, channelling you through me.

A. Singh: June 21 is International Day of Yoga. We celebrate physical and

spiritual well-being. I encourage all members of this House to get out on

that day and do some yoga.

I also wanted to say hello to Jessie Sutherland, one of my

constituents who the Minister of Finance announced

ear­lier.

A. Olsen: Today is the last opportunity for my colleague and I to raise our

hands in gratitude to someone who’s played an integral role in our team, in

the policy work that we’ve…. The work that we’re able to accomplish in here

is, in large part, due to the incredible work of Hailey May.

It’s with sadness that we say that Hailey is going to be leaving the

B.C. Green caucus and moving on to do other work in the B.C. government.

We’re very pleased she will continue to work on behalf of the people of

British Columbia because we’ve known Hailey to be one of the best and

supports my colleague from Cowichan Valley and I in a way that few have been

able to. Hailey has been the policy lead for our health work, our work in

Indigenous relations and reconciliation, public safety, mental health and

addictions.

One of the things about the policy team in the B.C. Green caucus is

that you usually carry a very, very heavy workload, and Hailey has done so

with grace and with incredible work on our behalf. So we just want to raise

our hands in gratitude to Hailey, thanking her for everything that she’s

done to support us, and also on behalf of British Columbians, to raise these

important issues. We’re sad to see her go but excited for the next steps in

her career.

H. Yao: Today I want to take a moment to express our gratitude to Hang Fong

Tsang. He’s turning 100 on May 28. I know we don’t sit on May 28. That’s the

reason I want to take today to actually wish him a happy

birthday.

I’m asking all the members and calling the House to wish him a happy

birthday, for turning 100 is definitely a miraculous act. Thank you,

everyone.

Introduction and

First Reading of Bills

BILL M225 — FRASER VALLEY

TRANSIT SERVICES ACT,

T. Halford presented a bill intituled Fraser Valley Transit Services

Act, 2023.

T. Halford: I move the bill entitled the Fraser Valley Transit Services Act,

2023, of which notice has been given in my name on the order paper, be

introduced and read for a first time.

Now, as the Fraser Valley transit strike continues well into its

second month, it’s imperative we ensure vulnerable people who can’t

otherwise get around are finally prior­itized. For too long,

people with disabilities have been left out without transit options in

the Fraser Valley and have had to turn to costly, unsustainable and

sometimes nonexistent options.

With non-resolution in sight, it’s clear that emergency measures

need to be taken to ensure those most vulnerable aren’t paying the price

any longer.

People like Sarah Pringle, who, as someone who’s been dependent on

the handyDART services for years due to a degenerative back condition,

was no longer able to get transportation, as it was not considered an

emergency service under handyDART. It is unacceptable to leave people

like Sarah abandoned any longer.

Today I introduce the Fraser Valley Transit Services Act, 2023,

that, if implemented, would ensure handyDART vehicles get back on the

road as soon as possible to help people with disabilities that have been

disproportionately impacted by the transit strike.

I will add Trevor Klassen as one of those people as well. Trevor

has not been able to get to his appointments. He’s been dependent on

handyDART services in the Fraser Valley. That has been nonexistent. He

is now relying on friends and family and other costly means.

[10:30 a.m.]

We also talked about a brain injury victim. I canvassed this with

the minister in estimates. I think he agreed with me wholeheartedly that

these were essential services. I look forward to his support.

With that, I think that this bill is very important, and I look

forward to the dialogue ahead.

Mr. Speaker: Members, the question is first reading of the bill.

Motion approved.

T. Halford: I move the bill be placed on the orders of the day for second

reading at the next sitting after today.

Bill M225, Fraser Valley Transit Services Act, 2023, introduced, read

a first time and ordered to be placed on orders of the day for second

reading at the next sitting of the House after today.

Statements

(Standing Order 25B)

MOOSE HIDE ANTI-VIOLENCE CAMPAIGN

D. Clovechok: It’s an honour today to rise in this House to share a story and

the message of Moose Hide Campaign Day.

It’s a day grounded in ceremony, a call to join in reconciliation

and demand the end of gender-based violence in British Columbia and

Canada. In 2011, a father and a daughter were hunting moose in northern

B.C. together, which is kind of cool, because I have hunted with my own

daughter. They felt a connection to their surroundings within their

Carrier territory along with the Highway of Tears, a 725-kilometre

corridor of Highway 16 between Prince George and Prince Rupert where so

many women have gone missing or have been murdered.

They were inspired to use the hide of the moose they harvested to

create 25,000 pins as symbols of this anti-violence movement. Wearing

the pin signifies your commitment to honour, to respect and protect the

women and children in our lives and speak out against gender-based and

domestic violence.

Today over three million pins are being worn across Canada as a

symbol of this commitment. The small square of moose hide stays pinned

to my lapel 365 days a year. It has opened so many interesting

conversations for me and others about how we must fight for a safer

province and country for women and for children.

As a husband, as a father of boys and girls, it’s a difficult

topic to discuss, but it needs our attention, and it needs our

continuing commitment. Women and children are counting on us to amplify

their voices, name the issue and work towards change.

Shockingly, Stats Canada reports that one in three women will

experience sexual assault in their lifetime. The devastating impact of

these experiences can’t be overstated. The heartache and the trauma left

behind by these experiences can affect every aspect of daily life,

tearing apart the world of the survivor and their families.

I end with some thoughts. If you witness violence, say something.

We must focus on educating each other and our children that violence is

not the way. It’s not okay. Let’s do this for ourselves, our wives, our

daughters and our sisters, our nieces, our mothers and our

friends.

It is by standing up for the rights of women and girls that we

truly measure up as men. So please wear your moose hide patch with the

purpose and intent it was created for.

SURREY CRIME PREVENTION SOCIETY

YOUTH

VOLUNTEERS

J. Sims: Last week Surrey Crime Prevention Society celebrated 486

volunteers, the majority youth who, in one year, have given 22,943 hours

to delivering community safety programs in Surrey.

Karen Reid Sidhu, executive director since 2012, is proud of the

work SCPS does, of the strong community partners and of her directors

and her staff. But her true passion comes through when she talks about

the volunteers, her volunteers.

In the past ten years, 4,600 SCPS volunteers have given 275,000

hours to improving safety in the community. Most of these volunteer

hours are not glamorous. They are spent patrolling various Surrey

communities in all types of weather, as late as 2 a.m., removing

graffiti, standing by the side of the road registering speed,

etc.

Every year the volunteers are thanked for their excellence, their

personal and professional growth and their dedication to the community.

This year Arshpreet Dhillon, Arjun Gill, Michael Peeters, Dante Negrin,

Ayush Prasad, Adam Omar, Rajan Bhandal, Amandeep Brar, Sandeep Kaur and

Gursharn Khattra were given awards for their outstanding

commitment.

I would also like to congratulate Eshaun Brar, a Sullivan Heights

student in my riding who received the Pursuit of Excellence

award.

[10:35 a.m.]

Finally, congratulations to Adithya Sujatha Moncy,

Vol­unteer of the Year winner, who has donated 1,400 volunteer

hours in one year.

Thank you to Surrey Crime Prevention Society for providing a

platform for young people to develop skills, engage with their

communities and explore potential careers.

Thank you to the 486 volunteers who find time in their busy

schedules to make a difference.

MEMORIAL CUP HOCKEY TOURNAMENT

KAMLOOPS

T. Stone: Well, as much fun as we’ve had together over the past number of

months in this place, I think everyone in this House is eager for the

spring sitting to come to an end so that we can head back to our ridings

and engage with our constituents over the coming months, attending a

number of exciting community events and enjoying some moments of free

time with our loved ones as well.

For myself and the member for Kamloops–North Thompson, we’re also

really eager to return home for this year’s Memorial Cup. Now, Kamloops

is proud to be hosting this exciting event from May 26 to June 4 at the

Sandman Centre. Despite our beloved Kamloops Blazers coming oh so close

in their recent west division championship finals with the Seattle

Thunderbirds, as the host team — and after another amazing season, I

might add — the Kamloops Blazers will have a place in the Memorial Cup

tournament alongside the winners of the WHL, the OHL and the QMJHL

playoffs.

Regardless of who you cheer for, there is much fun to be had off

the ice, as well, during Memorial Cup week, whether it’s the Molson

Canadian Hockey House, the Fan Zone at the Sandman Centre, the youth day

ball hockey tournament downtown or the many other festivities that are

planned for residents and visitors.

I want to thank, as the member for Kamloops–North Thompson does as

well, the organizers, the sponsors and the volunteers who are all

working so hard to make this event a raging success. You are truly

upholding Kamloops’ reputation as Canada’s tournament

capital.

Of course, I want to end by wishing our host team, the Kamloops

Blazers, the best of luck as they seek the ultimate victory, the

Memorial Cup.

After a nearly 30-year hiatus, we are ready to welcome everyone in

Kamloops again.

MICHAEL SATHER AND

DEMENTIA

AWARENESS

N. Simons: Today I’d like to talk about an old friend and colleague, Michael

Sather, who served in this House as the MLA for Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows

from 2005 to 2013.

Michael grew up on a small farm in Alberta. He became a wildlife

biologist, a teacher, a wilderness guide and a mental health counsellor

before getting elected. He brought his broad knowledge and skills with

him to this place.

He always spoke his mind and stuck to his principles, no matter

what the consequences. He was a man of great integrity. While in

politics, he raised important issues such as mental health,

homelessness, the protection of farmland and the importance of

biodiversity, among other issues.

The story that always got people talking was his story about

encountering a grizzly. Back in the late ’70s, Michael and his biologist

partner were attacked by a grizzly sow who was protecting her two cubs.

Both biologists were hospitalized after the mauling. Michael’s scar on

his head was a permanent reminder of that encounter.

Years later Michael and former MLA Guy Gentner used to hike a lot

together. My guess is that Gentner was there to scare away the bears.

They were in a bookstore in Canmore after a hike, and Guy noticed the

book Bear Attacks and saw that it included the account of

Michael’s mauling. He told the shopkeeper. Michael had no idea that his

story had been published. Before you knew it, he was happily

autographing books and maybe showing off his scar to the

tourists.

Well, Michael was recently diagnosed with primary progressive

aphasia, a rare form of dementia characterized by difficulty in

word-finding which could lead to the grad­ual loss of the ability

to speak, read, write or understand what others are saying. In fact,

Michael diagnosed himself. He knows the disease, and he understands the

impact this will have on others. He also knows how important it is to

remain social and active, how important it is for families to be

supported and how crucial it is for us to continue to search for a

cure.

The Purple Angel dementia group can offer support. The Alzheimer

Society provides information, and CLEAR stands for Canadians for

Leading-Edge Alzheimer’s Re­search, to which all donations are tax

deductible.

Michael lives with his spouse, writer and conservationist Annette

LeBox. She has two children, Christian and Sara, and four

grandchildren.

[10:40 a.m.]

TRANSIT FOR TEENS CAMPAIGN

S. Furstenau: I am delighted to talk about Transit for Teens, a campaign led by

the Centre for Family Equity. The Transit for Teens campaign advocates

for the province to allow free transit for kids up to age 18 in every

transit system in B.C.

Mobility is a basic human right, and access to

transpor­tation is essential for people to participate fully in

society. For youth, in particular, the ability to access school,

extracurricular activities and employment opportunities is critical to

their development and future success. Unfortunately, for many families,

the cost of transit is a significant barrier to accessing these

essential services.

We can’t afford to leave our most valuable resource, our youth,

out. We need to recognize that youth age 13 to 18 are equally deserving

of universal access to basic mobility and must be included in this

important program. They are at a crucial development stage, and

providing them with free transit is essential to their physical, mental

and social well-being.

Extending free transit to all youth is a matter of equity and

social justice. Many families, particularly those from marginalized

communities, struggle to afford necessities such as food, housing and

health care. By providing free transit to all youth, we can end mobility

poverty and level the playing field to ensure that everyone has equal

access to opportunities and services.

Extending free transit to all youth up to age 18 has the potential

to create a more sustainable society and promote transportation options

crucial to addressing climate change. By removing the cost barrier to

transit, we can destigmatize the use of public transportation and reduce

traffic congestion and air pollution. It is a win-win solution, Hon.

Speaker.

We have an opportunity to create a new culture of green

transportation rooted in generations to come, while promoting active

transportation among youth. Transit for Teens is the answer.

YOUTH POETRY AND

CLIMATE CHANGE

CONCERNS

R. Glumac: Over the last couple weeks, I have had the pleasure of reading

poetry from two Port Moody Secondary students during our morning

reflections.

I put a call out for poetry a few months ago. I wanted to give

young people a chance to speak directly to us, the leaders, the ones

working to address the big challenges we face together as a society. The

poems that I received were creative and reflective. A lot of them also

conveyed concern for the future.

As we look around the world today, we do see things that are

causing concern. We see wildfires burning out of control in our

neighbouring province in May. We see temperatures of 31 degrees a few

days ago in the Northwest Territories, beating the previous record by

four degrees. Across the ocean in Vietnam, we see temperatures of 44.2

degrees, the highest temperature ever recorded in that country. The last

eight years have been the eight hottest years on record globally, and

more records are going to be broken each and every year. This is the

world that our young people are growing up in.

“A better future sees change,” writes Emma Durmishaj. “We can all

arrange a world that’s better for us all,” writes Sreenithya Mankala.

And we can.

Despite the great work that we’re doing here in this House,

temperatures continue to rise. We can do even more in this House and in

Houses like this all around the world.

Let’s all build a better future for the next

generation.

Oral Questions

REPORTS ON

MANAGEMENT OF B.C.

HOUSING

K. Falcon: Another day, another new revelation in the Premier’s B.C. Housing

scandal. On multiple occasions yesterday during question period, and

then when I questioned him during the Premier’s estimates, this Premier

fervently denied the existence of a third Ernst and Young report. His

exact words were: “I’m not aware of a third report.”

[10:45 a.m.]

Then all of a sudden, ten minutes later, a miracle. His memory was

refreshed. Isn’t that remarkable? Usually it takes the Premier 24 hours

before he refreshes his memory, as he did when he denied knowing about

the earlier very damning BDO report on B.C. Housing. This previously

unknown third Ernst and Young report, which has never seen the light of

day, remains hidden behind a web of non-disclosure agreements that this

Premier, while Housing Minister, forced on the former board members of

B.C. Housing.

My question to the Premier. With the total mismanagement that has

happened under his watch, while he was the Housing Minister and

responsible for B.C. Housing…. Will he release this third report

immediately and finally allow British Columbians to understand the whole

scope and scale of this B.C. Housing scandal?

Hon. D. Eby: When I was appointed Housing Minister, it was apparent to me that

we needed an external team to come in and do a review of B.C. Housing to

make sure that controls were in place. Ernst and Young was the firm that

was retained after I directed the public service to do that. They came

in. They did an extensive review of B.C. Housing. Their report was

published.

During that work, individuals from B.C. Housing came forward with

very serious allegations, with information, to the review team, about

systematic efforts by the then CEO to avoid the conflict-of-interest

agreement that was meant to regulate his relationship with his partner,

who was the CEO of Atira. They were supposed to stay clear of that

conflict of interest. What they found was that wasn’t

happening.

They provided the information to me. That was a profound concern.

It was provided through the public service. It caused the former Finance

Minister and myself to approach the comptroller general. Specifically,

Ernst and Young said that they had preliminary findings but that they

weren’t done to a forensic standard, that they wanted to be able to

continue the work, that they needed the scope in their instructions to

be able to continue that work.

The comptroller general retained Ernst and Young to continue that

work and to do it to a forensic standard so it could be released. If the

member is looking for the information, he has it in the report that was

released, for the first time in 30 years in this Legislature, under a

public interest provision.

The reason why we were able to do that is because we followed all

of the necessary steps, all of the legal advice, all of the advice of

the auditors to do this properly at every step, to tell British

Columbians, to tell the opposition and every member of this House so

that they know what happened and what we’re doing about it.

K. Falcon: Well, the problem is, Premier, that nobody believes that

explanation. The fact of the matter is that for over five years, you sat

on top of another damning BDO report on B.C. Housing and never

acknowledged its existence until it was leaked.

The Premier, through B.C. Housing, issued a very misleading

statement saying: “Oh no. Those issues were all addressed.”

When I raised the issue in this House, he professed to not know

about the BDO report. Then 24 hours later he suddenly refreshed his

memory, and he acknowledged that there was a report.

Now we’ve got a third report that the Premier has had in his

possession the entire time and that he has refused to make

public.

The question we are asking in the midst of this B.C. Housing

scandal, where the public is demanding answers: why won’t this Premier

release that report and give the public the opportunity to see the full

scale of the disaster that you oversaw while you were the

minister?

Mr. Speaker: Through the Chair, Member.

K. Falcon: Mr. Speaker, apart from the fact that we are seeing these terrible

results and outcomes in all of the housing programs that this government

has brought forward thus far…. We’re seeing record homelessness in

virtually every community in this province. We still have to recognize

this Premier, the then minister responsible, and his abject failure as

the Housing Minister, while he sat on top of numerous scathing reports,

while the drumbeat and alarms were going off about all the challenges at

B.C. Housing and Atira.

How can anyone trust this Premier if he continues to refuse to

release information that should be in the public realm?

Mr. Speaker: All comments through the Chair, Members.

Hon. D. Eby: I think the most bizarre part of the Leader of the Opposition’s

theory is that I received a report from BDO about mismanagement that

took place under the watch of the B.C. Liberals and that I hid that

report. It’s bizarre. It doesn’t make any sense.

[10:50 a.m.]

It is part of a pattern, though. There were a number of reports

that were commissioned by the B.C. Liberals when they were in government

that they did not release. There was a report about money laundering.

There was a report about ICBC where pages were literally ripped out and

were not released, and there was this BDO report that nobody knew

about.

Interjection.

Mr. Speaker: Member.

Hon. D. Eby: The opposition apparently knew about issues with Atira to the

point that they actually retained this firm to do this work and

commissioned this report.

Interjection.

Mr. Speaker: Member.

Hon. D. Eby: I can assure you that would have been helpful

information.

As soon as I identified an issue, because that information was

brought to me by E&Y, we took action. A team was literally flown at

public expense from Toronto — forensic investigators to mirror devices,

to secure databases, to collect the information and to do the

investigation to a forensic standard so we could release it to this

place.

There is one point that the member and I do agree on, though, and

that is that we are in a housing crisis, and we need to act quickly. We

need to build housing for people, and we’re doing that work. I am

astonished that every time we bring forward an initiative to build more

housing for people, the opposition votes against it.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members.

Members will come to order.

Hon. D. Eby: The member says it doesn’t work. We have more than ten times the

housing underway than they had when they were in government, affordable

housing initiatives. Purpose-built rental construction up 650 percent on

our watch compared to them. Housing starts up 70 percent on our watch

compared to theirs. Just imagine where we would be if they had done that

work when they were on this side of the House, instead of us having to

clean up their mess.

MANAGEMENT OF B.C. HOUSING AND

SAFETY ISSUES AT ATIRA

PROPERTIES

P. Milobar: BDO gave their report to the government and B.C. Housing in 2018,

when they were in government, so a nice try from the Premier trying to

say we were hiding some report.

The reason these answers don’t stack up and the people don’t

believe the Premier is because daily there’s a new wrinkle to what’s

going on with his B.C. Housing scandal.

We now know Atira-based housing makes up a quarter of all issues

listed in the city of Vancouver’s building safety database of

infractions. Over the last year, there were 75 fires — in the last year

alone — at Atira properties, displacing over 360 people. In fact, the

devastating fire at the Winters Hotel, while this Premier was the

Housing Minister, resulted in two fatalities when the Atira-managed

building burned to the ground without working sprinklers and proper fire

extinguishers.

Despite all the warning signs and all the reports de­tailing

financial mismanagement of taxpayer dollars and the lack of proper

maintenance of critical fire safety equipment, why have there been zero

consequences and zero accountability for this Premier and his B.C.

Housing scandal?

Hon. R. Kahlon: I think everyone in this House understands that whenever someone

loses their life in any inci­dents, it hits us close to home.

Certainly, the two people who passed away from the Winters Hotel is

devastating. It’s devastating for the community. It’s devastating for

all of us in this chamber. The member knows that right now they have a

court case. They’re in front of the courts with legal action against

Atira, so I can’t comment on that.

I can say that risk due to fire is a major concern. It’s a major

concern for us. We have a lot of SROs built throughout the province that

are 70, 80 years old, and the investments that were needed to keep them

up and to keep them at a high standard just weren’t made. Decades behind

when it comes to the investments that are needed, not only to maintain

the existing stock but to also build additional units.

Now, the member talks about accountability. Accountability is when

you see something, to take action and make sure that when the report is

available, to make it public.

The member laughs. Maybe the Leader of the Opposition thinks this

is funny. This is not funny. This is a very serious issue.

I think it’s fair for the public to say: “Why were issues raised

in 2012, and nothing was done?”

[10:55 a.m.]

Why was, in 2015, a note sent to the opposition, when they were in

government, saying: “Something is definitely not right here, and despite

past notifications to various parties of potential for the CEO to be in

direct conflict of interest, these infractions are still occurring”?

Nothing was done, and I think it’s fair for the public to be

frustrated.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Shhh.

Hon. R. Kahlon: I can share with the members that when the Premier saw an issue,

he took action. We re­leased the report without redactions. It’s

vitally important that we do that, because we want the public to know

that when we see recommendations, we’re going to take them seriously,

because at the end of the day, our goal is to make sure that we are

providing housing for the most vulnerable people. We’re going to

continue to do that work.

Mr. Speaker: Member for Kamloops–North Thompson, supplemental.

P. Milobar: Well, this Premier’s fingerprints are all over this B.C. Housing

scandal.

This is just a short recap: suppression of the damning 2018 BDO

report, the false press release from B.C. Housing claiming the problems

were fixed, the highly critical Ernst and Young report released during

the Canada Day long weekend, the buildings that the Premier announced

now on the evidence list of the same forensic investigation, buildings

in major disrepair and now a third report that the Premier refuses to

release.

What is the Premier’s response to this mounting list when he was

the minister responsible? “Let’s more than triple the funding to the

same agency that’s in the centre of all of those.”

You wonder why. Well, maybe it’s because in that same time frame,

the head of Atira was openly bragging about how they were pressuring and

manipulating the government to get whatever they wanted out of them. At

the same time, this Premier was tripling their funding.

Again, when will there be any accountability for this Premier’s

role in the B.C. Housing scandal, and when will there be actual

consequences?

Hon. R. Kahlon: Again, so many facts that are incorrect there. I don’t know which

one to start on, but I’ll take a crack at a couple of them.

First off, when the Premier saw an issue, he took action right

away. He called for an investigation.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members.

Hon. R. Kahlon: He saw information that he thought deemed an investigation,

brought in an outside team, and a forensic investigation was done. The

report was made public.

Now, the members talk about additional dollars going to Atira.

They failed to mention in their remarks that, in fact, Atira’s funding

went up 800 percent when they were in government as well — 800

percent.

It’s convenient for them to talk about the period of the pandemic.

I think it’s important to note that during the pandemic, yes, we made

historic-level investments to support the most vulnerable people in our

province. We are proud of the supports we provided to people to support

them during that very, very challenging time.

We know that the most vulnerable were disproportionately impacted

by the pandemic. We made funding available to B.C. Housing. I think we

can all agree that funding is important.

What happened, though, and what the report highlights, is the CEO

of B.C. Housing, the former CEO, used those dollars and had staff direct

them, direct awards….

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Shhh.

Please conclude.

Hon. R. Kahlon: What happened…. I think what the issue…. At the core of the issue

is…. It’s not that the funding increased for B.C. Housing to support the

most vulnerable people. At the core of the issue here is that the former

CEO used his means, his power within B.C. Housing to help direct awards

to the CEO of Atira. That, I think, is the core of the issue. That’s why

we felt the report needed to be made public.

HEATWAVE RESPONSE AND

SUPPORT FOR VULNERABLE

PERSONS

S. Furstenau: I appreciate the Minister for Housing talking about supporting the

most vulnerable. I think that is the role of government.

We’re staring down a summer of more wildfires and potential

extreme heat. In a couple of days, we’re expecting 35 degree days in the

middle of May. This government has had six years, three record-setting

wildfire seasons, a devastating heat dome and unprecedented floods to

understand just how serious climate disasters are.

Warning people that it’s hot won’t help when people have nowhere

to go. It’s this government’s job to protect the lives and, in

particular, as the minister says, support the most

vulnerable.

My question is to the Premier. Where can people go to get out of

the heat, and how does he expect the most vulnerable, including the

elderly and people with disabilities, to get there?

[11:00 a.m.]

Hon. R. Kahlon: I really appreciate the member’s question. It is certainly top of

mind for us, given that we are seeing warmer temperatures.

I can share with the member that just a couple of weeks ago I met

with doctors from across the province to talk about how we can

collectively help the most vulnerable people and make sure we have

policies in place, not only in the short term but also long-term

policies to support people through what will be, I suspect, warmer

temperatures as we move forward.

I can share with the member part of the conversations. We talked

about enhanced education supports for operators to check on vulnerable

residents. We have a plan right now around distribution of cooling

supplies like fans and ACs. We have specific cooling rooms at sites

within buildings, and work is being done right now adding window films

and external shading and retrofitting for some sites with heat

pumps.

We also, I think, talked about what we should be doing over the

long term. I can share with the member that we talked about updates to

B.C. Housing’s design guidelines, construction standards to integrate

passive and active cooling measures to better support ventilation and

filtration systems.

I agree with the member. A lot of work has to happen. We have been

doing that work and will continue to do it.

Mr. Speaker: Leader of the Third Party, supplemental.

HEATWAVE RESPONSE AND

PROVISION OF AIR

CONDITIONERS

S. Furstenau: I appreciate the response from the minister.

As he knows, and we all know, this weekend a heatwave is coming,

and 619 people died in the 2021 heat dome. Last year the chief coroner

recommended giving air conditioners to the most vulnerable, the elderly,

those with disabilities, those who can’t move with ease.

This government has missed the deadline to review that request and

has done very little that’s new to save lives, with the heat that we’re

about to receive. I appreciate the minister’s comments on what is

coming, but we are two years since the heat dome and the recommendations

that came out of that, and we’ve missed that deadline to

review.

My question again is to the Premier. He went on a spending spree

earlier this year. Why did that not include air conditioners for those

who are most at risk of heat-related death?

Hon. A. Dix: In fact, as members of the House will know, substantial action was

taken in addition to all the steps referred to by the Minister of

Housing. With respect to emergency response, there was very significant

support for all our dispatch services of all kinds, including those

passed in supplementary estimates in this House.

We’ve added, in 2021, to BCEHS, 539 permanent regular full-time

paramedic positions, a further 222 in November of 2022. New ambulances,

new air ambulances. A new system of heat alert and response called B.C.

HARS was put in place in June of 2022 in advance of that season’s hot

days. In fact, there were six alerts last year.

We’ve put in place the health effects of anomalous temperatures

coordinating committee, which does this work through the BCCDC and

health authorities and other leaders, including the First Nations Health

Authority.

We’ve added significant cooling capacity across our long-term care

system using our own supports and supports from the federal government.

We continue to work to improve things.

We know that the effects of climate change on people’s health, at

all seasons of the year but particularly in summer, can be profound.

That’s why we are taking action on every front to deal with

it.

SIMON FRASER UNIVERSITY

FOOTBALL

PROGRAM

T. Halford: When it comes to standing up for SFU football, this government has

been MIA. The minister even stood in this House and dismissed the

successful 57-year-old program as “fledgling.”

This is a provincial university, and it falls under the provincial

government, which, at the very least, should be standing up to support

these student athletes and its alumni.

When will this Premier finally show some leadership and actually

stand up for these student athletes and call for the reinstatement of

SFU football?

[11:05 a.m.]

Hon. S. Robinson: I appreciate the member’s question across the way. The members

know full well that post-secondary institutions, as independent

institutions, determine their programming as best they see fit with

their board and their administration. I will say, however, that SFU has

hired a special adviser that will be working with the football alumni

association, with the student athletes and with the administration

around steps to go forward.

I have been hearing from student athletes as well as coaches and

others from the football community, and there is certainly frustration.

The member acknowledged and I acknowledge that this has been a team that

has been around for a very, very long time. There has been, certainly,

disappointment around this decision that the institution has

made.

They are listening to the various component parts of all of this

challenging time. I will say that SFU has been paying particular

attention to the student athletes, supporting them with their

commitment, making sure their needs are met around providing counselling

services and other supports.

Again, SFU is taking leadership. They’ve hired a special adviser

that is going to be working with all the component parts of the

situation in order to resolve what’s going on.

ACCESS TO OBSTETRICS AND

PRENATAL CARE IN

KAMLOOPS

T. Stone: The Thompson Region Family Obstetrics Clinic, which delivers 60

percent of all babies born each month in Kamloops, has announced that

they’re not taking any new patients after July 31, effectively

implementing a permanent closure. This is a dire situation, and you know

it is, when over half of the pregnant women in Kamloops, a city of

110,000, cannot access the prenatal care and the obstetrics care they

need.

This crisis is further complicated by the fact that two in five

Kamloopsians, or 50,000 people, do not have access to a family

doctor.

It’s unacceptable that these women are told to go to the

overcrowded ER for even the most basic tests. It’s unac­ceptable

that many are left to scramble, trying to access prenatal care from as

far away as Prince George and Abbotsford. It’s unacceptable that many of

these women and their partners are having to face the decision of

possibly moving out of Kamloops, leaving their jobs, in order to access

basic care that should be available in Kamloops.

We raised this question three months ago in this House, and

characteristic of this government, the response was: “We’re having

meetings; we’re in discussions.” Well, since then, this crisis has

gotten worse and worse, and expectant moms are increasingly filled with

stress, fear and anxiety.

I want to quote just one. Jenna Nickle Duclos interacts with many

pregnant women in her role as the director of community services at the

YMCA in Kamloops. She hears every day the struggles of these expectant

moms.

“I’ve met multiple moms who have no care and have had to

schedule

Telus Health virtual doctor’s appointments to get referrals for blood

tests and ultrasounds. These same women have no idea, on a weekly or

monthly basis, how they’re measuring, if a baby is growing appropriately

or if they are missing important tests. They have no one to talk to, to

ask these basic questions.

“One mom told me she has visited emergency nine times because of

worries about her baby. The inability to have proper care is causing an

increase in prenatal anxiety, which will likely cause an increase in

postpartum anxiety and depression.”

My question is this. How many more expectant moms in Kamloops and

the region have to suffer and struggle to receive the basic care that

they need before this Premier actually steps up with action to fix this

prenatal care crisis in Kamloops today?

Hon. A. Dix: The way I think you resolve issues and you work to improve

services is you work with the peo­ple who deliver those services.

That’s precisely what we’re doing in Kamloops.

The member will know that the fee-for-service model has proven

itself to be ineffective. When I became Minister of Health, our system

was overwhelmingly fee-for-service. He will know that more than 3,000

doctors across B.C., including 480 who didn’t previously provide family

practice, have joined the new payment model. Why was that successful?

Because we worked with doctors.

We have led Canada in the recruitment and the hiring of new

nurses, a contrary record to the record of the previous government.

We’ve done that by working with nurses and nurse practitioners and the

B.C. Nurses Union and the communities.

[11:10 a.m.]

In the case of Kamloops, we are working with doctors — you bet we

are — to find and to put in place a permanent solution that provides

maternity care in Kamloops. We’re going to continue to do this work. I’m

confident that we’ll be able to resolve this issue.

DRUG TOXICITY CRISIS

AND MANAGEMENT OF SAFE

SUPPLY

E. Sturko: Under this Premier’s so-called safe supply program, free drugs

like hydromorphone are being in­creasingly resold on the black

market under the street named dillies. Dillies are five times more

powerful than heroin and carry significant risk of addiction, sedation,

respiratory depression and overdose death. Yet this government has

failed to track new onset opioid use disorder among youths and the

general population resulting from their policy of prescribed and

diverted prescription opioids.

The fact is that the rapid access addiction clinic at St. Paul’s

Hospital stopped prescribing hydromorphone last February because they

see more kids getting addicted. But this government hasn’t told anyone

about the risks and keeps recklessly plunging ahead.

Despite the mounting evidence and growing concern from doctors

about the consequences of diversion, the Premier keeps stubbornly

pushing ahead recklessly to expand a free public supply of addictive

drugs.

Why is the Premier careening our province down a path and flooding

the market with publicly supplied addictive drugs five times more

powerful than heroin without any guardrails?

Hon. J. Whiteside: Thank you to the member for the question. To situate this issue in

the context of the un­relenting toxic drug crisis we are dealing

with, our public health officials, our front-line addiction specialists,

health authorities have come forward with a prescribed safer supply

model, really in order to try and do everything we can to separate

people from the toxic drug supply. That work is being closely monitored

and evaluated by clinical staff across our health care system and by

Health Canada.

When it comes to the issue of the need to save lives by separating

people from the toxic drug supply by providing prescribed alternatives,

I would note the support for those measures across our health care

system and across this House as well. In fact, yesterday in the House,

support for prescribed alternatives was stated by the Leader of the

Opposition.

Again, we have a situation where there is an attempt to try

to…

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Shhh. Members.

Hon. J. Whiteside: …obfuscate the issue here.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members. Please.

The minster will continue.

Hon. J. Whiteside: The issue here is that we are doing everything that we can to save

lives in the context of an unrelenting toxic drug crisis. We are going

to continue to do that under the guidance of our public health

officials, of addictions medicine specialists, of our health

authorities. It’s best, really, if we all work on that problem together,

frankly.

REGULATION OF ILLICIT DRUG

USE IN PUBLIC

SPACES

S. Bond: The minister can continue to mischaracterize our position. Here’s

what it is. There were guardrails that were expected to be in place, and

this government has failed abysmally to put them in place.

That’s not the only place that British Columbians are feeling

increasingly frustrated and, in fact, shocked by this Premier’s stubborn

refusal to do something that many families are asking him to do, and

that is to ban the use of dangerous drugs like fentanyl in public

places, including parks, playgrounds and beaches.

And not just families. Last week 30 local governments from across

the Lower Mainland passed a resolution calling on this Premier to take

action and put in place a ban on the open use of drugs and substances

like heroin, meth and fentanyl — where?— in public spaces.

Very soon, and the Premier knows this, school is going to be out

for summer. As he knows, children aren’t going to be in school. They’re

going to be on their local playgrounds, using the swings. They’re going

to be in the water parks, and they’re going to be on beaches. The last

thing families want to do is have their child bring home a pack of

fentanyl and drug paraphernalia, which has actually happened under this

Premier’s watch.

[11:15 a.m.]

Parents want to know. They want this Premier to dem­onstrate

an ounce of leadership, and he could do it today — not wait, not talk,

not dodge, not weave. It is time for him to do the right thing, and he

should do that right now.

Will he get up and put in place a ban on drugs like heroin, meth

and fentanyl from public spaces that include children’s playgrounds,

beaches and parks? Will he do it today?

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members. Members. You have already asked the question. It is now

the turn of the Premier to answer. Please.

Hon. D. Eby: The issue of the toxic drug supply is a major challenge for

government, absolutely, and certainly for the families who have lost

loved ones, and a lot of those loved ones are kids.

The member is right. This is killing kids. There are kids who are

taking what they think is a party drug at high school, and they’re dying

of an overdose. This is a really serious issue.

Our government is treating it seriously, with a commitment,

through everything we do, to work with partners to address any

unintended consequences, to do the research that’s needed to make sure

this policy is resulting in what we need.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members. Members, please.

Hon. D. Eby: I am happy to commit to the members on the other side, to all the

members of this House, to British Columbians, to parents of kids that

our government will work with local government partners to make sure

that those protections are in place. Nobody wants this activity

affecting our kids, and we will do something.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members. Members.

Hon. D. Eby: The members are shouting.

The part that I regret about this discussion — it’s

hap­pened a few times during the session — is the members on the

other side want to have it both ways. I don’t know where they stand on

this issue. They voted at the all-party committee. There is a member of

this House….

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members. Members.

Members will come to order now.

Members, take a deep breath. It’s not the end of the world. Take a

deep breath, please. Please.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: No argument with the Chair.

The Premier will continue.

Hon. D. Eby: When the all-party committee came to­gether to tackle this

in a serious way, in a non-partisan way and they all voted in favour of

important and challenging measures, there was one member of this

assembly….

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members.

Hon. D. Eby: I don’t agree with him, but at least I know where the leader of

the Conservative Party stands on this issue. On the other side of the

House, they vote for it one day; they’re opposed to it the next

day.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members.

Hon. D. Eby: In estimates, the Leader of the Oppos­ition championed

prescription medication. Today they opposed it.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members, how many times does the Chair have to ask you to be

quiet?

Members, please. It’s almost over.

The Premier will conclude.

Hon. D. Eby: Thank you, hon. Speaker. And thank you for your work through the

session.

The fact is that we stand for results for British Columbians, and

it doesn’t matter what the issue is.

On health care, we have 482 more family doctors in the province

because of our deal with family doctors. We have 2,800 internationally

trained workers ready to go to work in B.C., working with the College of

Nurses.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members.

Hon. D. Eby: We have free prescription contraception for British Columbians,

thanks to our budget.

Interjections.

Hon. D. Eby: I know the members don’t want to hear about these

results.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members. Members of the opposition, please. The public is watching

you all, okay?

Hon. D. Eby: You can tell it’s the last day of session, hon. Chair.

Mr. Speaker: The Premier will conclude.

Hon. D. Eby: We froze ICBC rates for two years.

We deployed a new housing action plan to build housing for British

Columbians in every corner of this province.

Our economy is leading Canada in economic growth. One of the

lowest unemployment rates. We are setting records on trade. Twenty

thousand new jobs this session alone.

[11:20 a.m.]

We are getting results for British Columbians on those issues, we

will get results for British Columbians on this issue, and we can’t wait

to continue the work.

[End of question period.]

Interjection.

Mr. Speaker: Member.

Minister, hold it.

Member for Columbia River–Revelstoke, no personal comments,

please.

Attorney General.

Tabling Documents

Hon. N. Sharma: Mr. Speaker, I have the honour to table the final report of the 2022

Judicial Compensation Commission with recommendations to the Attorney

General and the Chief Judge of the Provincial Court.

The Judicial Compensation Commission is a constitutionally required

independent body that is appointed every four years to determine the

remuneration allowances and benefits of the provincial court judges and

judicial justices.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Shhh.

The minister will continue.

Hon. N. Sharma: The 2022 commissioners were the Hon. Lynn Smith, OC, KC and chair;

Vern Blair; Lisa Castle; Eric Gottardi, KC; and Robert Lapper, KC. The

government will consider recommendations in accordance with the Judicial

Compensation Act.

Petitions

J. Tegart: I have a petition on behalf of the people of Merritt and the

travelling public demanding 24-7 access to the Nicola Valley Hospital

emergency room and no more closures.

P. Milobar: I have an updated petition with another 1,100 signatures about further

dysfunction in IHA related to the family obstetrics clinics’ pending closure

in July, demanding that the government actually take action.

Orders of the Day

Hon. R. Kahlon: Can I seek leave to make a quick introduction.

Leave granted.

Introductions by Members

Hon. R. Kahlon: In the gallery today, I have got Molly Wilkins and Caitlin Warbeck,

who are just an amazing team, my admin team in my office. I want to thank

them for all the work they’ve been doing.

I want to congratulate and thank Kiran Sidhu, who was my EA, who is my

MA. She is going to be leaving on mat leave very soon. I’m going to miss

her, as much as I give her a hard time. I want her to know that we’ll be

watching, and when baby Ravi Jr. is born, we’ll have three Ravis in the

building.

I just want to thank her for all the work, and I hope the House can

welcome all of them today.

With that, Hon. Speaker, I would call continued debate on the

Committee of Supply for the Office of the Premier.

[11:25 a.m.]

Committee of Supply

ESTIMATES: OFFICE OF THE

PREMIER

(continued)

The House in Committee of Supply (Section B); R. Leonard in the

chair.

The committee met at 11:26 a.m.

The Chair: Good morning. I call the Committee of Supply (Section

B) to

order to consider the estimates of the Office of the

Premier.

I recognize the Premier.

On Vote 11: Office of the Premier, $16,045,000

(continued) .

Hon. D. Eby: I note some young people in the gallery. What they’re going to see

today is questions to me as Premier about different issues facing the

province, likely, and the activities of my Premier’s office. I will do

my best to answer. The Leader of the Opposition will ask those hard

questions, and we’ll have a good conversation. I look forward to

it.

K. Falcon: To provide a recap on our discussion from yesterday for the

benefit of those viewers that are joining us today and didn’t have the

opportunity to join us yesterday, we canvassed the Premier’s remarkable

lack of oversight and lack of curiosity, frankly, about the pile of

reports and alarm bells that were ringing with respect to the

misspending and terrible governance that was taking place at B.C.

Housing and allegedly at their largest housing provider, which became

the largest housing provider while that Premier was Minister Responsible

for Housing.

We then talked about the failed program of the Premier while he

was Minister of Housing, which saw the purchase of motels across the

province, usually in downtown cores, and the warehousing of individuals

that have severe mental health and addiction issues without any of the

supports that were promised to the communities. We saw the not

surprising result, which was social chaos and disorder in the streets of

those communities.

Then we canvassed the NDP government’s reckless

de­criminalization experiment, whereby they are

decriminal­izing hard drugs like crack cocaine, fentanyl, heroin,

methamphetamine and ecstasy and seeing a situation which, without having

the proper guardrails in place, which were a requirement of the federal

government before they proceeded down this risky experiment of theirs,

is now putting children at risk.

We spent some time yesterday canvassing why the Premier wouldn’t

recognize the obvious and just put those guardrails in place to at least

protect our children and families in playgrounds, parks and beaches. We

canvassed that again in question period. The Premier’s answer is “More

discussion is needed,” when Premier Falcon, I can assure you, would make

that decision in about 30 seconds flat.

Now that we’ve canvassed that, I want to discuss that whole issue

of publicly supplied addictive drugs, because it is the position of this

government that the solution to the drug problem we face is to have

government provide free access to drugs, as if this is somehow going to

solve this problem.

I want to start, Premier, by talking about the challenge we’re

seeing right now because of government’s providing easy access to

hydromorphone. This was raised in question period. Just for the benefit

of viewers, hydromorphone is about five times stronger than heroin. It’s

a very strong medical opioid.

[11:30 a.m.]

Under this NDP government, as a result of them flooding the market

with free hydromorphone, often referred to as dillies on the street,

they’ve become cheaper than alcohol and marijuana, and it’s led to a

troubling increase in opioid use disorder amongst youth.

This, as a parent of children myself — and the Premier — is

something that is extremely troubling. It’s not just the new onset of

opioid use disorder among youth but also amongst the general population,

resulting from both prescribed and diverted dillies that are getting

into the broader community.

Reminding the Premier again that one of the conditions of the

letter of recommendation is to have baseline data and to make sure that

you are collecting the data necessary so that you can see the results of

your publicly supplied addictive drug program, can the Premier explain

why his government has failed to monitor and report about the onset of

opioid use disorder amongst our youth?

The Chair: Just a reminder to members not to use personal names in the

House, for sitting MLAs.

[11:35 a.m. - 11:40 a.m.]

Hon. D. Eby: The question of the impacts of the prescribed safer supply policy

is an important one. The preliminary findings, I can advise the member,

have shown a 76 percent decrease in mortality in people who receive

these prescriptions for opioids, compared to those who do not. This is

likely due to the fact that a significant, preponderant number of deaths

of overdose are linked to the use of fentanyl.

If we can get between someone who is addicted to opi­oids

and the predatory dealers selling them products of unknown origin and

strength, and get them connected to a nurse practitioner or a physician

who’s prescribing them the opioid, we have a much better chance of

saving their lives, according to the preliminary data, and also getting

them into treatment. The important and specific question about diversion

— the province has been monitoring this potential risk. It was

identified early. So research has been continuous and underway since

March of 2020.

The directions to physicians and nurses who prescribe safer supply

are clear and emphasize rigorous monitoring and evaluation as part of

this implementation. Ongoing evaluation monitoring includes a provincial

evaluation of the implementation of PSS, which stands for prescribed

safer supply, led by the Canadian Institute for Substance Use Research

at the University of Victoria. Some of their data work relates directly

to diversion and its data collection.

The B.C. Centre for Disease Control is currently undertaking an

analysis of the association between hydromorphone prescribing rates —

this is the prescription medication the member was addressing in his

question — and fatal toxic drug poisoning cases, as well as new cases of

opioid use disorder, which you might refer to as addiction to opioids.

The B.C. Coroners Service is tracking this through its illicit drug

toxicity reports. The Ministry of Mental Health and Addictions tracks

external research that may be undertaken independently by

scientists.

Further evaluation and monitoring initiatives are also being

launched, including scientists at the B.C. Centre on Substance Use and

the B.C. Centre for Disease Control undertaking a research project to

understand the individ­ual and contextual circumstances

surrounding new cases of opioid use disorder or opioid addiction, which

will include any role that prescribed safer supply may have played in

that. Regional health authorities are using a defined set of variables

and indicators to monitor risks to review charts of patient records to

identify potential issues related to this.

Now, I agree with the member that evidence is important and also

that prescription is important. The oversight of a nurse or doctor in

this matter is a key piece. The strangest thing, though, from his

question is you would think that he was opposed to this approach. But it

was literally yesterday that he said: “When I was Minister of Health…,

we had the NAOMI trials and the SALOME trials.”

This was literally about taking people who are addicted to heroin

and providing them hydromorphone, the exact medication the member is

talking about, and studying to see whether a prescribed supply of

hydromorphone would reduce the risk of overdose and would reduce the

risk of being involved in criminal activity and other undesirable

activities to feed their habits and whether connecting them to a

physician would improve their outcomes.

As the member knows, because he was involved, it did. It had

significant improvements — public health outcomes, safety outcomes,

saving lives and reducing overdose. That is in fact some of the research

that this very program is based on.

[11:45 a.m.]

He said about the trials that he ran: “That was about drug

replacement therapy, to see whether we could have a situation where

those that are in severe addiction crisis could have replacement drugs

that would allow them to transition so that we could get them into

treatment.”

That is exactly what’s happening, and that research continues, to

a high standard, because it is important for all of us to know that

there are not unintended consequences, that this is not increasing

addiction rates and that this is saving lives. I can advise the member

that the initial results found by the work that he did when he was

Health Minister — which one can only presume that he supported at the

time — had positive outcomes and is continuing. The preliminary findings

show a 76 percent decrease in mortality for people who receive these

prescriptions.

I agree with the core point of the member. Research is critical.

Understanding what’s happening is critical. I can assure the member and

British Columbians that we’re doing that work to keep people alive, so

that we can get them into treatment.

K. Falcon: I want to make sure the member is accurately stating my position.

The member should know that those were controlled studies. The whole

purpose of those controlled studies was to connect them to treatment.

What is happening and what I’m hearing from front-line physicians and

addiction specialists is that the NDP government has completely lost the

plot. It’s all focused on providing publicly supplied addictive drugs,

and there is little to no emphasis on treatment whatsoever.

To reinforce that, St. Paul’s Hospital, in their rapid-access

addiction clinic, a clinic that is staffed by some of the top addiction

specialists in the province, actually stopped prescribing hydromorphone

two months ago, in February of this year. The doctors did so because

they’d reported a lack of improvement in their patients’ conditions, and

alarmingly — this is what concerns us on this side of the House, and

many parents — an increase in new-onset opioid use disorder,

particularly amongst youth.

Now, the Premier read out a lot of stuff there that seemed to

imply that they’re tracking this. Well, I refer the Premier to the

estimates that were completed just a couple of weeks ago with the

Minister of Mental Health and Addictions, who unequivocally stated that

the hydromorphone was not being monitored.

In fact, I’ll quote into the record exactly what the Minister of

Mental Health and Addictions said. Hydromor­phone in drug toxicity

reports is not broken out, not even for children and youth. “It’s our

understanding that hydromorphone is not broken out. Hydromorphone would

be part of the opioid category with respect to the reporting of drug

toxicity.” That was the minister from Hansard Blues , April 20

of this year.

The physicians have stopped prescribing this — the physicians that

have the highest clinical training in addictions. In spite of them no

longer prescribing this and trying to raise the alarm about the increase

in opioid use disorder amongst youth, this government continues to

recklessly continue on the path of their publicly supplied addictive

drug program, ignoring these specialized health care

professionals.

What is the plan of the Premier to address the rising opioid use

disorder that’s taking place amongst our youth?

The Chair: Just a reminder that once you have the floor, you’re not to be

using your devices.

[11:50 a.m. - 11:55 a.m.]

Recognizing the Premier, and noting the hour.

Hon. D. Eby: I move the committee rise, report progress and ask leave to sit

again.

Motion approved.

The committee rose at 11:58 a.m.

The House resumed; Mr. Speaker in the chair.

Committee of the Whole (Section B), having reported progress, was

granted leave to sit again.

Hon. N. Sharma moved adjournment of the House.

Motion approved.

Mr. Speaker: This House stands adjourned until 1 p.m. today.

The House adjourned at 11:59 a.m.

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