Newfoundland and Labrador Hansard — Members' Statements — 4 April 2006 (45th General Assembly, 3rd Session, Vol. XLV No. 7)

2006-04-04

Newfoundland and Labrador — Debates (Hansard)

Newfoundland and Labrador Hansard — Members' Statements — 4 April 2006 (45th General Assembly, 3rd Session, Vol. XLV No. 7)

2006-04-04

Newfoundland and Labrador — Debates (Hansard)

April 4, 2006 HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY

PROCEEDINGS Vol. XLV No. 7

The House met at 1:30 p.m.

MR. SPEAKER (Hodder): Order, please!

Admit Strangers.

This afternoon we are pleased to welcome in our public galleries twenty-seven

French Immersion students from Leary's Brook Junior High School in the

District of St. John's North, with their teachers Mr. Shane Fitzgerald and Mr.

Scott Barker.

Welcome to our House.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

Statements by Members

MR. SPEAKER: This afternoon we have members' statements as follows: the

hon. the Member for the District of Terra Nova; the hon. the Member for the

District of Grand Falls-Buchans; the hon. the Member for the District of

Exploits; the hon. the Member for the District of Burgeo & LaPoile; the hon.

the Member for the District of Labrador West; and the hon. the Member for the

District of Fortune Bay-Cape la Hune.

The Chair recognizes the hon. the Member for the District of Terra Nova.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. ORAM: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to pay tribute to a great educator and wonderful

man. On March 24, Mr. Paul Boyle, a teacher from Glovertown Academy, passed away

and with that an enormous loss was suffered. Last Thursday, the school held a

memorial service for Paul. Mr. Speaker, approximately 1,000 people showed up to

pay their respects and to celebrate the life of this tremendous person.

I would like to take this opportunity to speak to Paul's life, a life that

was sadly cut short. While his life ended prematurely, this certainly did not

mean that it was without success or reason. I would argue that Paul accomplished

in his short life, more than most would hope to accomplish in a full lifetime.

Paul was born on August 18, 1963 at the Banting Memorial Hospital in Gander,

to proud parents, Ada and Roy Boyle. Paul and his family moved to Goose Bay,

where his sister Rhonda was born and remained until 1970. At that time they

returned to Gander, settling until 1985.

He graduated from St. Paul's High School in 1980. After which he enrolled

at St. FX's University, thinking he wanted to become an engineer but

eventually found himself at Mount St. Vincent, where he completed a Bachelor of

Arts Degree and then at St. Mary's University, pursuing a more passionate

career in Education acquiring his Bachelor of Education.

He married Debbie on May 24, 1988. They were delighted to present to the

world two beautiful daughters, Chelsea born in 1989 and Carly born in 1996.

Paul enjoyed life to the fullest. He was passionate about many things: art,

drama, sports, woodworking, cooking and even gardening with his wife. Above all,

Paul loved spending time with his family.

For the past eight years Paul has been a member of the staff of Glovertown

Academy. His passion for teaching and his love of students could be seen in

every class he taught. He touched many lives in both school and outside in his

personal life. Mr. Boyle will never be forgotten as his memory will forever be

carried in the hearts and minds of his students and friends. His energy and

laughter will be forever echoed in through the halls of Glovertown Academy. As

Mr. Boyle would say: Kids, be careful out there.

Mr. Speaker, I ask that all hon. members would join with me today to pay

tribute to Mr. Paul Boyle.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans.

MS THISTLE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to congratulate and to say thank you to Walwin

Blackmore, a long time distinguished municipal politician who spent four years

as councilor and a combination of twenty-four years as mayor of the former Town

of Windsor and the newly amalgamated Town of Grand Falls-Windsor.

Walwin Blackmore is a native of Bell Island, and a graduate of Memorial

University and the University of Ottawa. He spent seven years teaching in

several communities prior to coming to Booth Memorial High School as Vice

Principal, in the former Town of Windsor, in 1969. In 1972 he was appointed

Principal, remaining in that position until retirement in December of 1991.

Walwin Blackmore entered municipal politics in November of 1977, became Mayor

of the former Town of Windsor in November of 1981, re-elected in 1985 and in

November of 1990 was elected the first Mayor of Grand Falls-Windsor. I had the

pleasure of sitting on that first amalgamated council with Mayor Walwin

Blackmore for two terms and he served in that position until September 27, 2005.

Throughout his thirty-seven years in the central area, he has served on the

Windsor Stadium Committee, Windsor Minor Hockey Association, Central

Newfoundland Hospital Board, Central Newfoundland Community Futures Board,

Central Newfoundland High School Hockey League, Beothuck Senior Hockey League,

Newfoundland and Labrador Federation of Municipalities, Central University

Committee, Canadian Bible Society, Canadian Volunteer Initiative, and in various

positions with the Park Street Corps of the Salvation Army.

Mr. Speaker, I ask all members of this House to join with me in

congratulating Mr. Walwin Blackmore on a distinguished municipal career and

thank him to his contribution to public service in our Province. Happy

retirement, Walwin.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the District of Exploits.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. FORSEY: Mr. Speaker, it gives me great pleasure today to stand in

this House to recognize the heroic efforts of two firefighters from the

Peterview Volunteer Fire Department. They are Fire Chief Chris Torraville and

his fellow firefighter Darrius Brenton.

Approximately 9:30 Saturday evening on March 18, three snowmobiles carrying

four people went through the ice at Gills Point between Norris Arm and Peterview.

One person made it to a cabin on shore and contacted the police. From there

several rescue teams were mobilized, including the Peterview Fire Department.

Chris and Darrius travelled across the bay on snowmobile until they arrived

close to where the tragedy occurred. Then, without fear for their own lives,

they continued on ice board, where the ice was only one to two inches thick.

Because of the weakness in the ice, the two firefighters had to wade in cold

water for three-and-a-half hours in darkness until more rescue teams could reach

them.

A terrible tragedy occurred that night with the loss of three lives, but not

without the final attempt by these two firefighters to save them.

Mr. Speaker, I would ask all members of this House to join with me in

recognizing the bravery of Chris Torraville and Darrius Brenton.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Burgeo & LaPoile.

MR. PARSONS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise today to recognize six outstanding Port aux Basques military personnel

now serving in Afghanistan.

Kevin Osmond, son of Roy and Grace Osmond, Lakes Brook; Wade Hodder, son of

Bernice Hodder, Grand Bay; Peter Osmond, son of Reg and Evelyn Osmond, Grand

Bay; Chris Short, son of Norman and Julia Short, Grand Bay; Ray Lomond, son of

Gerald and Ellen Lomond, Mouse Island; Paul Parsons, son of Albert and Viola

Parsons, Channel, are all currently serving in Afghanistan.

Mr. Speaker, these individuals left their hometowns to pursue careers in the

Canadian Military and they have indeed done us proud. Their dedication to the

people of Newfoundland and Labrador and our country to serve in Afghanistan

during this most difficult time is an inspiration to us all. We hope and pray

that their mission is safe and successful.

I ask all members of this House to join with me in recognizing these brave

individuals who are all outstanding Newfoundlanders and Labradorians, who are

"Standing on Guard" for thee.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. R. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

On March 18 to March 20 the first ever Cain's Quest snowmobile race was

held in Labrador West. The race covered a distance of 1,200 kilometres, and

racers were not permitted to use groomed trails. Teams consisted of two racers,

and both machines had to cross the finish line in order to qualify. There were

twelve teams from the local area, along with teams from the Labrador Straits,

Quebec and Nova Scotia.

It was a gruesome race, Mr. Speaker, that tested both physical and mental

endurance, pushing both riders and their machines to the limits. The riders went

through the middle of Labrador in mostly unfamiliar territory, sometimes at

night, using only coordinates on their GPS to get them from checkpoint to

checkpoint.

The event was filmed by SnowTrax TV with the use of a helicopter, and will be

shown on TSN later this year. In addition, coverage was also provided by Atlantic

Snowmobiler Magazine , Ontario Snowmobiler Magazine , and some

provincial media.

Mr. Speaker the winning team was Gerard Rumbolt and John Efford.

I was waiting for people to look, then.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. R. COLLINS: The winning team was Gerard Rumbolt and John Efford from

Labrador West, with a time of fourteen hours, one minute, or an average speed of

sixty-five kilometres an hour. They captured the first place prize of $10,000

and I am happy to say, Mr. Speaker, they donated $5,000 of that to the Labrador

City Youth Center.

Second place went to a team from Quebec, with Dave Dumaresque and Shannon

Strangemore of Labrador West finishing third.

I would like to thank the White Wolf Snowmobile Club, the many volunteers,

the racers and the sponsors who made this event such a tremendous success.

Already, planning is in progress for next year which will see a longer course

and more participants. This event and others like it go a long way to promote

the huge potential for Labrador Winter Tourism.

Thank you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Fortune Bay-Cape la Hune.

MR. LANGDON: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to acknowledge the Town of Belleoram on reaching a

tremendous milestone. On the evening of Saturday, April 1, I was delighted to

participate with the community and celebrate sixty years of incorporation. It

was a pleasure to join with residents, current and former councillors and

municipal representatives from the region on this important occasion.

Belleoram was one of the first towns in the Province to incorporate as a

municipality. The first meeting of the Belleoram Town Council was held on

September 9, 1946, at a courtroom in Corner Brook. Mr. Josiah Rose was elected

Secretary/Treasurer by the committee. Interestingly, it was agreed that he be

paid a remuneration of $25 per month to assist with the formation and operation

of the new council. The new council, under the leadership of the first Mayor, J.

R. Burdock, began immediately to bring new infrastructure to the town. Water and

sewer was installed in the town in 1948.

Mr. Speaker, the Town of Belleoram has seen many changes over the years. Some

of these changes have created challenges for councils and residents, while

others have helped make the community a better place to live. As a community,

Belleoram continues to accept the challenges and grasp social and economic

opportunities that come their way.

It continues to be a pleasure for me to work with the Town of Belleoram. This

town is an important part of the Coast of Bays Region and is committed through

dedicated leadership to making the economy in their part of rural Newfoundland

and Labrador sustainable.

Mr. Speaker, I want to congratulate former mayors, councillors and staff for

contributing their time and effort for the success of the town. I also want to

express gratitude and thanks to the current Mayor, Steward May, current

councillors and Evelyn Savory, Town Clerk, for organizing the celebration of

their incorporation.

Mr. Speaker, I ask all members of the House to join me in congratulating

Belleoram on the anniversary of sixty years of incorporation as a municipality.

Thank you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Statements by Ministers.

Statements by Ministers

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Human Resources, Labour and

Employment, and Labrador Affairs.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SHELLEY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to inform my hon. colleagues about meetings I

attended with federal, provincial and territorial ministers responsible for

labour on March 17.

The purpose of these annual meetings is to promote co-operation among labour

jurisdictions in Canada. Throughout the year, the Canadian Association of

Administrators of Labour Legislation works on common labour issues and

challenges being faced throughout Canada.

Mr. Speaker, one issue that sparked much discussion was labour supply and

demand. A shortage of skilled workers is a serious issue here in Newfoundland

and Labrador, just as it is throughout other provinces. I used the opportunity

to highlight the strategic approaches our government is taking to address this

problem: our White Paper on Education, our Immigration Strategy, our Poverty

Reduction Strategy, and the retraining of workers.

Another theme, Mr. Speaker, was the need to promote a safe and healthy

workplace. A productive workplace is one where reasonable and cost-effective

policies allow workers to perform at their best. Employers, workers and unions

must recognize that everyone benefits from a workplace environment that promotes

good mental and physical health.

Mr. Speaker, a separate meeting of Atlantic Ministers of Labour is scheduled

for June to further discuss these issues and others. At that time, I expect to

report further on the significant progress made on our immigration and poverty

reduction strategies.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Carbonear-Harbour Grace.

MR. SWEENEY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I thank the minister for an advance copy of the update on his travels.

It is interesting to note, Minister, that while you are having discussions

with your counterparts there is a job fair taking place in the Province this

week. Over 400 people showed up in Stephenville for interviews for jobs in

Alberta, 400-plus people showed up in Central Newfoundland, and last night

500-plus people showed up at Salon D at the Delta Hotel, and today Salon D down

there is filled again with people looking for jobs in Alberta. Minister, your

jobs is daunting, there is no mistake about that, and I am glad to see that you

are working on it.

I would suggest that maybe partnership with the private sector, putting some

investment into the private sector to encourage jobs here at home, would be a

much better effort by your government.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The member's allotted time has expired.

MR. SWEENEY: To conclude, Mr. Speaker?

MR. SPEAKER: By leave?

AN HON. MEMBER: By leave.

MR. SPEAKER: Leave has been granted.

MR. SWEENEY: Mr. Speaker, we are losing Newfoundlanders hand over fist

day after day. The thing the most hurting proof, apart from the boom that we

have in Labrador, is the people leaving this Province and heading West. I think

there should be emphasis placed on that, and, Minister, I encourage you to keep

up discussions with your counterparts because there is a lot of work to be done.

This Province is in a tailspin right now for labour. There is going to be a

major shortage here over the next little while.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. R. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I thank the minister for an advance copy of his statement.

There is no question about it, skilled trades in this Province, and indeed in

this country, are much in demand. There is a shortage because we went through a

period of time where all of us were equally guilty, I guess in some ways, of

pushing our children towards universities and towards the IT sector rather than

the traditional trades. It is time now that we have to play catch up in order to

deal with the needs that will be there for the future.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The member's allotted time has expired.

MR. R. COLLINS: By leave, Mr. Speaker?

MR. SPEAKER: By leave?

AN HON. MEMBER: By leave.

MR. SPEAKER: Leave is granted.

MR. R. COLLINS: While I agree with the minister and the previous speaker

on the need to cooperate with other provinces, I think in this Province itself

the minister should give some consideration to probably holding a conference

between labour and business and government to get a better handle and identify

exactly what the needs will be, not only in the long term but in the short term

as well.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: Further Statements by Ministers.

Oral Questions.

Oral Questions

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

My questions are for the Premier.

Mr. Speaker, yesterday the secret negotiations between government and the

Hebron-Ben Nevis partners fell apart. While the Premier says they were not

secret, nobody really knows what the details are that were being discussed.

I ask the Premier: Would he be prepared to provide the details of the

so-called super royalty regime to the people of the Province through the House?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

We have already indicated yesterday, in answer to the first question that was

asked by the hon. Opposition House Leader, exactly what the tenets of the deal

were. The exact specifics of the super royalty, I guess if we had agreement from

the other parties, there would be no problem providing it. We want to make sure

we just do not break their confidentiality on something like that, but there is

no secret agenda here with regard to the tier three royalty. We would only be

too delighted to disclose it. We just want to make sure that is fine with the

other parties. But there is no secret, no hidden agenda here.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: Thank you.

We look forward receiving those details on the super royalty.

Another important aspect, that nobody seems to know about, is the equity

stake being requested by the Province. Could the Premier advise what equity

stake was requested by the Province at the commencement of the negotiations,

what was offered by the companies, what was eventually refused, and would he be

prepared to table that information in the House?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, that has been indicated. We have made no

bones about it for, probably, the last six to nine months. We have come out and

we have indicated exactly what we wanted from an equity perspective. We said we

certainly wanted equity. We wanted super royalty. We also talked in terms of

secondary processing for the Province, as well as maximum benefits for

Newfoundlanders and Labradorians so that we would have our fabrication

facilities at 100 per cent capacity.

In light of the comments that were made by Chevron yesterday, who indicated

that, in fact, they put a better package on the table, we responded as a

government when questions were made on the equity because there was an

implication by Chevron that, in fact, this deal broke down on equity. Well, on

Thursday night past, we had reached an agreement on equity. A critical milestone

for them on equity was 5 per cent. Five percent and above jeopardized the joint

venture agreement. There was extra voting rights. There were other rights and

privileges that were above 5 per cent. Our preference would have been to obtain,

at least, 8.5 per cent. That was our original goal because that is a benchmark

which has been set by the federal government in the Hibernia project and that

was a number that we were trying to achieve. However, in order to try and reach

an agreement with these companies, we moved to the 4.9 per cent position because

that was a position that they felt was acceptable to all the partners.

So, contrary to what Chevron are saying with regard to the equity position,

equity is not what it broke down on because we basically had a tentative

agreement on equity and on super royalty on Thursday evening. The matter on

which it broke down, which I explained yesterday to the House, was they reverted

to the January 26 position, which is investment tax credits which were in the

range of $400 million to $500 million, which was something that we had virtually

assumed was off the table and was gone. They then reverted to a position of two

months ago, which was absolutely unacceptable to the Province.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: Contrary to the comments across the House from the

Government House Leader, this information has all been public. The details have

not been public. The gist of what is being talked about may well be out in the

public forum. The reason for the questioning is to ask if we can actually have

the detail, and people would be more enlightened and more informed.

Mr. Speaker, the Premier said that government would be willing to buy the 38

per cent share of Exxon to try and move this deal forward. I ask the Premier:

How would this valuation take place in terms of what it would cost? How much

would government be willing to spend, and what would government do, or are

government considering doing, given Exxon's position - at this point, at least

- that they are refusing to sell?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, as the hon. House Leader is aware, this is

not the first time that this project has been shelved. While the hon. party

opposite was in government, of course, this project did not go ahead at the same

time and possibly for the same reasons, I do not know.

Having said that, with regard to the price that the government is prepared to

pay for Exxon Mobil's interest, we are dealing in hundreds of millions of

dollars here. I am not prepared to announce to Exxon Mobil today what we are

prepared to pay them.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: With all due respect to the hon. gentleman opposite,

with a legal background and a negotiating background, that would be foolhardy.

Under the circumstances, I certainly would not be prepared to announce it under

any circumstances.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: I appreciate, Premier, as well, having a legal background,

but I guess a common sense background as well that you would not want to

necessarily show your hand to the other party.

The nature of the question, however, was: Is the breakdown concerning the

equity revolve around the fact that you cannot arrive at a price to pay, or is

the breakdown on the equity issue revolve around the fact that Exxon just simply

would not even consider the issue? That was the level of detail that I was

looking for. I realize, and would appreciate that as a Province you certainly do

not want to disclose what you would ultimately be prepared to pay, but my

understanding is that they just simply refused to even talk about giving you an

equity share, or selling you their share.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: I note in your comments, actually last evening in a

broadcast that you were involved in, you agree with the principle of equity. You

think it is a good idea for this government to bargain for equity, and I

appreciate that. Having said that, I have already said that on Thursday night

past, when we were dealing with the negotiating party for the consortium, they

agreed to an amount of equity, a quantity of equity, which was 4.9 per cent.

They also agreed to a quantum. They agreed to the amount. They agreed to the

value, and that was already put aside. So, that was done. So, at that point the

person who is negotiating on behalf of the consortium said: Ok, fine. Here is

the amount of equity that we are prepared to sell. Here is the value which we

are prepared to sell and which we are prepared to offer for it. Here is the

super royalty which we are prepared to get, and we actually negotiated up the

super royalty at that particular point in time. Then when they send a memorandum

into us, the memorandum gets cute and basically comes back and says: Oh, yes,

but we want all the terms that are in the January 26 agreement, with the

exception of these two. So, we basically said that is not on. Because what would

have happened then, that would have clawed back everything that we gained. We

would have ended up with an agreement that was basically less than generic,

which is exactly what your government was prepared to accept some two years ago.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: Continuing, with regards to the issue of the Exxon

percentage, was it a part of the discussions regarding their possible share to

government that you would have to compensate them for their original exploration

cost? Does government have any idea, at this point, as to how much - in addition

to purchasing a share, if you bought that share, how much would government also

have to invest in terms of up-front or start up costs in terms of the field and

infrastructure?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Obviously, in valuing any share or any interest in a

project you have to take into consideration what they have already spent - which

I think the term is probably pre-development cost, which would be the term. Then

you also have to look at what the value of the project is. So, then you have to

ascertain what the quantity of the reservoirs are and projections could be that

- they could be anywhere from - a ball park, probably about 550 million.

Having said that, when you try to put together the final valuation then you

have to strike a number, and that is exactly what we have done. So, all those

things are all part of it. Now, with regard to the project itself, if you are a

partner in the project then you participate in the cost of the project. You are

either a full partner or you are not a full partner. So, as a full partner you

would be prepared to invest and step up as the project moves forward.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader

MR. PARSONS: Premier, I do not think there is anybody in this Province

who disagrees that we ought to have the best deal possible when it comes to our

offshore resources. The approach, particularly when it comes to dealing with

private companies, may be somewhat suspect and has not yield results yet.

The Premier chastised Exxon yesterday as the Hebron-Ben Nevis partner who

scuttled the deal, and Exxon and others are still - maybe some people don't

appreciate this - but are still very key players in our offshore industry, and

are very important to the future natural gas development from Hibernia, Terra

Nova and White Rose.

I ask the Premier: Are you concerned that no to a Hebron-Ben Nevis deal may

delay the time frames and the development possibilities that exist with regard

to natural gas?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I watched with great interest last night the broadcast and the interview on CBC

where yourself and the Leader of the New Democratic Party were present. It

was interesting to note that from the outset the Leader of the New Democratic

Party generally supported the position that government has taken in this

particular matter.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: As well, he made an interesting observation, that Norsk

Hydro, a company that is owned by the Government of Norway, would, in fact, have

a 10 per cent interest in our project, and it was most reasonable for us to have

to seek an equity position on that particular project as well. I commend him on

that observation.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Now I am going to tell you what you said last night,

and you changed your position from the start of that interview. By the time you

got to the end of it, you were moving closer to the hon. Member for Signal Hill-Quidi

Vidi.

These are your exact words: If it is going to be a weak deal, there should be

no deal. We are suggesting that the Premier should stick to his guns by all

means. Those are your exact words. I wouldn't be surprised if this was a bit

of posturing on the part of the oil companies because they obviously in secret

couldn't get the arrangements they wanted. All of the sudden, this morning

after the March 31 st deadline passes, we see a press release from

Chevron.

You obviously agree with what we did. Are you trying to take a different

position here in the House today, because that is not what I am hearing from you

on the other side of the House?

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: Premier, this being Question Period I will ask the

questions, but I certainly have no objection to yourself or to any media in this

Province clarifying what I believe doesn't require any clarification. I have

no problem whatsoever with the Province taking a hard and fast stance at this

time with the oil companies, and I have said that. Absolutely no problem with

that at all!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. PARSONS: Whether it is the current Premier or anybody else, if we had

to end up with a weak deal I firmly believe there should be no deal.

All I am trying to do, and I think you gathered from the questions I have

asked today, is flesh out some of the details. It is quite easy having the

residents of this Province saying, we take a side for the Province, the Premier's

current stand, or we side with the oil companies, without having the full

information. That has been the tenor of my questions since yesterday.

I commented quite openly, as well, that Chevron is not into the habit of

calling Opposition parties and offering to give a briefing, unless there is some

purpose of them either. That is why I question their posturing issue from the

oil companies.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. PARSONS: Premier, again, I am trying to get some further information

and detail here so that people have a good understanding and know, when they

take a stand, why they are taking it. Exploration is a key to new developments

offshore.

I ask the Premier: Has government been given any indication from the oil

industry, in the course of these ongoing discussions and negotiations with

Chevron and their partners, whether future exploration might in any way be

sacrificed or compromised because of an inability to strike a deal on Hebron-Ben

Nevis?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: I am interested in the hon. gentleman opposite's

comments with regard to saying that he would not take a weak deal. Well, when he

was a Minister of the Crown and when that party on the other side of the House

was in government, the Premier of that party at that time, in June of 2003, said

- and this is in reference to the Hebron project - he does not know yet if

changing the regime means the Province would get less royalty revenue at the

beginning or less royalty overall, but he says either way it better than not

having the Hebron development go ahead at all.

Well, that might have been the policy of your government; that might be the

policy of your leader, who sits in the gallery today. It is not the policy of

this government, and there will be no more giveaways.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: Thank you.

It is quite obvious, Mr. Speaker, that the Premier does not want to peel back

some of the layers on the onion here and give the detail. I have asked the last

two questions here and, instead of getting any answers or even a commitment that

we might get some information, I have gotten rhetoric.

I say to the Premier as well, with regards to whatever position any former

premier might have taken, and any former minister of mines and energy or natural

resources, the water on the beans has substantially changed since 2003, and I

think we all appreciate that.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the hon. the Opposition House Leader.

MR. PARSONS: I mean that in a political sense. One only need take the

price of a barrel of oil, for example. We are not talking about $20 barrels of

oil any more; we are talking about $60 barrels of oil, and that leads directly

into my last question. Perhaps the Premier, again, might be more forthcoming

with his answers.

Many business people in this Province, Premier, industry associations, trade

persons, professional workers, have expressed their concern. It is not coming

from the Opposition; it is coming from media reports that we have read today and

we have heard on TVs and radios as well, legitimate concerns. These people are

concerned that with this project not moving forward on Ben Nevis for the

foreseeable future they have these concerns.

I ask the Premier: Have you consulted with any of these people? Are you

concerned that this impasse, if it lasts too long and you do not strike a deal,

what devastating effects it would have on our economy? Have you consulted with

these people?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: As the hon. member is aware, Mr. Speaker, there is a

detailed energy plan consultation that is going on throughout this Province,

which is being conducted by the Minister of Natural Resources. In doing that, he

has gone through the entire Province. He has talked to a lot of the

stakeholders. He has had submissions from a lot of the stakeholders.

One of the stakeholders is NOIA. In their presentation to the government

during the energy plan consultation process, NOIA's recommendations dealt with

engineering; the Province develop an industrial development and procurement

strategy to guide the Province in negotiations such as those currently underway

for the development of Hebron. Elements of this strategy should include - and I

quote NOIA - 100 per cent of front-end engineering and design feed and detailed

design to be located in the Province.

I can assure NOIA that the proposal that was put together by this proponent

was substantially less than what they asked for.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

My questions are for the Minister of Fisheries.

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Fisheries is on public record repeatedly in the

last few weeks, saying that FPI broke the law by taking another one of our

resources and shipping it to China for processing; and, as a result, that

company was going to be charged in the court of law.

I ask the minister: Have charges been laid? If not, why?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Transportation and Works.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. TAYLOR: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, as the Minister of Fisheries and Aquaculture said previously in

this House, and outside this House, there appeared to be some discrepancies

between what was allowed to be shipped out and what actually got shipped out by

Fishery Products International in the past year. There was an investigation that

took place by the Department of Fisheries and Aquaculture officials, and right

now an investigation is ongoing between Department of Fisheries and Aquaculture

officials in consultation with the Department of Justice. When the appropriate

time comes, if charges are warranted, charged will be laid, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Well, you talk about a backflip. It is a wonder you are not

doing cartwheels across the floor here.

The Minister of Fisheries stood in the pan of a truck on O'Leary Avenue and

said: FPI broke the law, they broke the law, they broke the law, and they will

be charged and charged and charged! Here, today, we have his predecessor

standing in for him saying there is some discrepancy in what the minister said

and what they actually uncovered in the Department of Fisheries. So, you are

saying now, what the minister said last week wasn't true?

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. REID: Are you saying now that charges will not be laid?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Transportation and Works.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. TAYLOR: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, as the member knows, when the time comes to lay charges, it is

on the basis of the evaluation of the Department of Justice. That is where that

lies.

Furthermore, the only people in this House who made a backflip are the Leader

of the Opposition, the Member for Grand Bank, and the Member for Fortune

Bay-Cape la Hune. Why don't they inform the House of what happened in the

Clerk's boardroom last spring when they met with me and advised me that I

should allow redfish from 3O to be shipped out of this Province to China for

processing by the operators of the fish plant in Gaultois? Prior to that, Mr.

Speaker, there was not one pound of fish authorized to be shipped out of this

Province; and, when it was done, it was done on the advice of -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. TAYLOR: - those three members, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I say to the -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

Colleagues, we are in the middle of Question Period. Time is short.

The Chair recognizes the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Minister of Transportation and Works stands here today and says something

that is completely the opposite of what his colleague said when he was into a

rant in the back of a pickup truck on O'Leary Avenue last week. Mr. Speaker,

we have heard that come from that government time and time again when it comes

to FPI.

I ask the minister: If what he said last week is something different from

what he is saying this week, how can the people who work for FPI in the Province

believe anything you are saying about the amendments, or anything else you are

going to do with that company?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Transportation and Works.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. TAYLOR: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, what I said today is exactly consistent with what the Minister

of Fisheries and Aquaculture said last week. This matter now is in the hands of

the Department of Justice, and a determination on charges will be made by the

Department of Justice. That is consistent with what every government does on

this type of file.

Now, Mr. Speaker, as I said before, you want to talk about truthfulness, you

want to talk about who is dealing with the facts, the fact of the matter is: the

Loyal Opposition to Her Majesty here, today in this House and for the past

couple of weeks, have been on a rant about fish being allowed to be shipped out

of this Province. The only fish, over and above what was allowed to be shipped

out by previous ministers, like the Member for Twillingate & Fogo and

Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair, the only fish, in 2005, that was allowed to be

shipped out of this Province was fish from 3O, redfish. That was based on the

advice of the Member for Twillingate & Fogo, the Leader of the Opposition,

the Member for Grand Bank, the Member for Fortune Bay-Cape la Hune, in the Clerk's

Boardroom last May, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the Leader of the Opposition.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

Again, I am asking members for their co-operation.

The Chair recognizes the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I say to the minister opposite, it was your Minister of Fisheries who said

that FPI broke the law and they were going to be charged. Not me, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, yesterday the Minister of Fisheries stated that fish landed by

the FPI vessel, the Newfoundland Lynx , would be processed in this

Province. Now that he has had a chance to investigate this allegation, or this

point, can the minister now tell me at what FPI plant that 1.8 million pounds of

turbot will be processed?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Transportation and Works.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. TAYLOR: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I suspect that the 1.8 million pounds of turbot will be

processed in the same plant, under the same conditions that the 8 million pounds

of turbot that was shipped out of this Province when he was minister in 2002,

Mr. Speaker. The conditions that apply to turbot in this Province - the

processing requirements on turbot today are the exact same processing

requirements that were imposed on the industry in 2003, 2002, 2001, 2000. Do I

have to go back any further, Mr. Speaker?

Mr. Speaker, if the fish is to be processed in the Province, it will be. If

there is an exemption required, consistent with the exemptions that were

provided by the Member for Twillingate & Fogo, the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse

au Clair, the former Member for Port de Grave, when he was the minister, and the

Member for Bay St. George, Bud Hulan, when he was the minister, all of those

conditions, Mr. Speaker, have been issued over the years, going back probably to

when Walter Carter was the minister.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Minister of Fisheries and Aquaculture stood in this House yesterday and

said that the fish aboard the Newfoundland Lynx would be processed in

this Province and his colleague is standing today and saying that it will not be

processed in this Province.

Mr. Speaker, for the past two-and-a-half years this government has stated

repeatedly that there are too many -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the Leader of the Opposition who was placing a question.

MR. REID: Mr. Speaker, for the past two-and-a-half years this minister

and his predecessor have stood everywhere in this Province and said that we have

too many people employed in the fishing industry, whether they be plant workers

or harvesters. Yet, up until the election, the federal election just a couple of

short months ago, they made no formal representation to the federal government

for an early retirement package.

I ask the minister, if he was serious about an early retirement package and

he is preparing a proposal to go to the federal government, why haven't you

included your portion of it in this year's Budget?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Transportation and Works.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. TAYLOR: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, we have said consistently that we support an early retirement

program for plant workers in the fishing industry. That was articulated to the

federal government last fall and in the federal election this past winter, and a

proposal has been submitted to the federal government just last week, I believe

it was.

As for the Budget appropriation, Mr. Speaker, there are all kinds of ways for

the provincial government and the federal government to put their hands on

money, should money be required. Mr. Speaker, there is such a thing as a

supplementary supply bill. There is such a thing as a Special Warrant. I am sure

that if the federal government came across today and said here is our $70

million, then, Mr. Speaker, we would not be very long finding our $30 million.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

My questions are for the Minister of Finance.

Yesterday in Question Period, the Minister of Finance, while refusing to

provide any hope of getting help from this government to people incurring

catastrophic drug costs, stated that his program of co-pay for prescription

drugs for families under $30,000 income would start in September. Will he

confirm, Mr. Speaker, that this program will indeed start in September, as he

stated in the House yesterday?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SULLIVAN: Mr. Speaker, delivering a program - delivery of the drug

program -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

A question has been asked by the hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

I am asking members for their co-operation. Colleagues, we have limited time.

The Chair recognizes the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

First of all, I did not say it starts in September. That is incorrect. There

is a certain part of the program. The drug program for prescription drugs will

start on January 1, 2007 under the Prescription Drug Program. That is because it

is necessary to get the systems up and running to be able to accommodate the

requests to deal with a new output of $32.8 million.

I do remember saying yesterday, Mr. Speaker, that that member over there has

asked for numerous things. We delivered. He asked for the moon; we gave him the

moon. Now he wants the sun and stars. There are some people in this Province you

can never satisfy, and he happens to be one of them.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

What I said yesterday after Question Period, if this minister was the

Minister of Finance, when they started talking about medicare they would still

be talking about it because we would not have it, Mr. Speaker.

What I want to ask the minister, Mr. Speaker: given that spending on drugs

has now approached 16 per cent of total health care spending,

whereas we only

spent 13 per cent on doctors, doesn't he now agree that all people in the

Province should have access to a drug plan or an insurance plan, such as he has

and I have, as members of this House, that all teachers have, that all public

sector workers have and that all those have with a workplace plan? Doesn't he

agree that everybody should have access to an insurance plan for drugs?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

When we came into office there were about 100,000 people in this Province who

had access to a drug plan; people on income support and low-income seniors,

people who qualify for the guaranteed income supplement. As a result of our

initiatives, I sat on a committee with many of my colleagues and very strongly

endorsed the single most thing in this Province affecting poverty is access to

drugs. I fully support it and everyone of my colleagues did. That is what we did

on this issue.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SULLIVAN: Right now, Mr. Speaker, almost 200,000, close to 40 per

cent of our population - we have doubled it in three years.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. SULLIVAN: We would like everybody to have access. The member there

wants multi-million dollar people, $250,000 people getting access. The money

only goes so far. If we give it to everybody who are making $100,000, $150,000,

$200,000, we have less to give to people who need it most. Isn't that the

philosophy of your party?

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MR. HARRIS: Mr. Speaker, the minister's Budget last week spent $450

million more this year than last. Why is it that this Province is the only

province in the country with no co-pay government program for catastrophic drug

costs, if that is the case?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury

Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Catastrophic drugs are ones that have come under considerable discussion.

Just a year ago, when I was Acting Health Minister, I participated in a national

health ministers' meeting on catastrophic drugs, and my colleague, the

Minister of Health and Community Services, is participating and discussing this

on a national level in his capacity there.

We are very supportive to have a national catastrophic drug. A former

not seen it yet.

They are working toward that goal. It is difficult for some people, with very

expensive drugs. We are sympathetic to that. The minister is working with his

colleagues across the country, and hopefully something can develop on this. I am

sure the minister will speak to that in due course.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The time allocated for Question Period has expired.

MR. LANGDON: A point of order, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: A point of order has been raised by the Member for Fortune

Bay-Cape la Hune.

MR. LANGDON: Mr. Speaker, I want to clarify the position that, when I met

with the minister in his boardroom last year, over in the Department of

Fisheries, with Max Taylor -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. LANGDON: In the minister's boardroom, I met with him, over in the

office.

The problem was with the 3O redfish for the particular South Coast plant. The

fish that was permitted by the minister from 3O was brought to Gaultois by

Newfoundland boats, sixty-five footers. They were brought to the plant. The

people from the community of Gaultois, who live in that community, took that

fish, put it into boxes, it was semi-processed. From that particular situation

it was then taken, semi-processed, to particular markets abroad.

I thought, at that particular time, it was not shipping it to a

factory-freezer trawler going overseas. The people from Gaultois got pretty much

their same number of hours to be able to get work.

That is my point. That is the situation.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

Speaking to the point of order, the hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: I speak to the alleged point of order raised by my

colleague opposite.

Mr. Speaker, there is no point of order. It is a point of frustration. It is

a fact of the matter - that is what it is. It is not a point of order. It is a

point of frustration expressed by the member.

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. E. BYRNE: Mr. Speaker, I listened to the member. I ask him for the

same professional courtesy that I provided to him.

Mr. Speaker, the fact of the matter is this: It is a long-standing principle

in Beauchesne , in Marleau and Montpetit, in all of the parliamentary

orders, even in our Standing Orders, while they are silent, we go to those

references that I just mentioned. The fact of the matter is that the acceptance

of a word of a member in any House or Parliament is paramount, and that is why

Speakers have ruled from time immemorial that therein lies the possibility of

why there may be differences, but the point of order raised by the member is

exactly not a point of order but a point of frustration expressed by him.

MR. SPEAKER: Speaking to the same point of order, the hon. the Member for

Fortune Bay-Cape la Hune.

MR. LANGDON: Mr. Speaker, what I said to the minister, and he agreed that

what I said was right, I was only making a point of clarification, (inaudible)

point of order or whatever.

It is the fact that what I had said - he gave the impression that I agreed

for all the fish that was offshore to be sent abroad, but that was not the case.

He agreed with me, and the people of Gaultois community did get employment from

it, and it is very little different than what you have in the crab. You bring

your crab ashore and you put it in boxes, et cetera. I was agreeing with him,

but I felt that I was -

MR. TAYLOR: (Inaudible).

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

Members will know and recognize that it is not uncommon, following Question

Period, for members to have points of view that are divergent. In this

particular case, a point of order has been raised and, in essence, it arises

from Question Period. It cannot be a point of order; it rather is a point of

debate. In this particular matter, I would ask members if they could raise those

issues in debate rather than on points of order.

There is no point of order in this instance.

Presenting Reports by Standing and Select Committees.

Tabling of Documents.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair is reluctant to name members by districts or by positions; however,

if the exchanges across the floor continue, the Chair will have no choice but to

name people by their district or by their position and ask them for their

co-operation.

The Chair has asked for the Tabling of Documents.

Notices of Motions.

Answers to Questions for which Notice has been Given.

Petitions.

Orders of the Day.

Orders of the Day

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Motion 1, to move that this House approves in general the Budgetary Policy of

the government.

MR. SPEAKER: Motion 1 has been called.

The hon. the Member for Topsail.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS E. MARSHALL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I am very pleased, Mr. Speaker, to stand in this House today and talk about

the Budget that was presented to us last week, and there are certain areas I

would like to focus on. There are quite a few areas that we could actually brag

about, but I have selected some that are of great interest to me.

The first area I would like to speak to, Mr. Speaker, is the marine services

in the Department of Transportation and Works. The Estimates Committee for that

department took place yesterday and I was very interested in hearing the views

of the minister. I think that we should talk about the Marine Services Division

of the department because it is quite a large program. I think there are many

people around the Province who don't realize how large the program is.

Actually, it is now in excess of $62 million. It has gone up quite significantly

over the last few years. Actually, Mr. Speaker, I think that last year it might

have been around $50 million, so it has gone up about $10 million over the past

year, which indicates this government's commitment to rural Newfoundland and

Labrador.

Mr. Speaker, one area that has been of particular interest to me is the new

marine services strategy. Although it hasn't been released yet, I am looking

forward to it. I am quite pleased, Mr. Speaker, that this government has

committed $1.5 million for planning and design for two new ferries for the

Province. People in rural Newfoundland might be aware of this, but some people

in rural Newfoundland might not be aware, that the ferry program is quite big,

that the Province actually has twelve marine vessels or twelve ferries. The

previous government, Mr. Speaker, didn't keep those ferries upgraded. Of the

twelve vessels that the Province has, the average age, I think, is around

twenty-eight years, so the ferries actually are getting quite old. Professionals

tell us, people who are professionals in that area, that the normal life cycle

of a ferry, a marine vessel, is twenty-five years, so a lot of the marine

vessels are actually passed their useful live. I realize that the government has

put money into them to extend their lives and keep them upgraded, but the fact

of the matter is that the ferry vessels, the marine vessels that we are using in

this Province, are quite old. It is time that we took a look at them and started

to replace them.

I think everybody was focused last week or the week before when a ferry sank

off British Columbia. I think we can have our fears allayed because Transport

Canada does vigorously inspect the ferry vessels.

I would like to talk, Mr. Speaker, about some of the specific ferry vessels,

just talk about how old they are and when we last had some built. There are

three ferry vessels that were built, oh, I would say, fifteen to twenty years

ago. The Beaumont Hamel was built in 1985, Mr. Speaker, so that vessel is

twenty-one years old. It is time that we started looking at replacing that one.

The Gallipoli was built in 1986, Mr. Speaker, and the Flanders in

1990. They are the newest vessels that were built for use in this Province so I

think, Mr. Speaker, that it is incumbent on us to get down to work and start to

look at replacing some of these vessels.

Mr. Speaker, money was in short supply a decade ago, so one of the things

that the Province did was purchase second-hand vessels, and we did that, or the

government of the day did that. They purchased the Earl W. Windsor in

1997, and I believe that vessel is still in service. Then, in 1999, the last

vessel to be purchased was the Nonia , I think we called it the rusty

bucket. We bought it somewhere over in, I believe, Eastern Europe. We got a good

deal on the purchase of it, Mr. Speaker, but we did not have a good handle on

how much it was going to cost to fix it up. We thought that it would cost

probably about a couple of million dollars but actually it cost, I believe, in

excess of $10 million to fix it up. I think, Mr. Speaker, it was about six years

before we were able to get that vessel upgraded enough to put it into service,

but I understand it is in service now.

Really, Mr. Speaker, at the end of the day, all of these vessels are getting

quite old, they are getting more expensive to operate, and it is time that we

started to look at replacing them. This has always been an issue that has been

of concern to me, so I was quite pleased to see the $1.5 million provided for

planning and also to initiate design.

I did hear, Mr. Speaker, there have been some comments made in the media.

Some people have complained and said oh, we are planning, you are spending too

much time planning; you should get right in there and start building the

ferries.

Mr. Speaker, I am a great believer in planning. If you are going to be

spending a lot of money like that, let's get out there and plan it right so

that, at the end of the day, we end up with marine vessels that we are happy

with, and we put them in service and people will be happy with; because, if you

do not do adequate planning then what happens, Mr. Speaker, is that we end up

usually with something that we really are not happy with.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to move on now from ferry services and talk about

the financial position of the Province. For most people who know my background,

of course, this is something that is of great interest to me. Actually, when the

Budget book was passed out on Budget day, of course, I looked at the pages at

the front to find out exactly what our fiscal position was going to be. Mr.

Speaker, I was very, very pleased to see that, while we had projected a deficit

for 2005-2006, we are now projecting a surplus of $76 million.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS E. MARSHALL: I think, Mr. Speaker, that this is the first time I have

ever seen a surplus for the Province of Newfoundland. I was doubly pleased when

I looked at the budgeted surplus for next year, which is for 2007-2008, and we

are budgeting a $6.2 million surplus. I also understand that the numbers

presented in the Budget are very conservative, so, who knows? Maybe we will have

a bigger surplus than $6.2 million.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS E. MARSHALL: It was quite a surprise, Mr. Speaker, to see that we have

turned around the financial position of this Province so quickly. We have always

seen deficit numbers and now, for the first time for this Province, we are

starting to see surplus numbers.

The other thing I would like to talk about, Mr. Speaker, is the actual Budget

document and also the financial statements of the Province. About fifteen years

ago, we took a look at those documents and found out, really, they weren't

well prepared; that, because they were not properly prepared, you were really

able to move the numbers around and give the wrong impressions, or even the

wrong projections as to what the Budget surplus or deficit should be. So, I

would like to say, I compliment the Minister of Finance -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS E. MARSHALL: - that the actual Budget document has improved in its

preparation. It is on the consolidated accrual basis of accounting. I know now

that MUN has been included. It is the last organization to be included. So the

Budget document, the numbers in there are fairly reliable. I compliment the

minister on that.

I would also like to mention the Budget document. One thing that has always

surprised me, though, Mr. Speaker, is that there is a lot of attention given to

the Budget document, and the Budget is really projected numbers. Really, it is

just your plan for the year. While I have always been interested in the Budget

document, I would like to see the actual financial statements. I am always

interested in the actual financial performance of the Province. I would like to

say that the financial statements that this government prepares at the end of

every year, and there was a set of financial statements released just before

Christmas, we have an excellent set of financial statements.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS E. MARSHALL: They are prepared on the consolidated basis of

accounting. They are based on the accrual method of accounting. It is an

excellent set of statements and I am very, very proud to be associated with

them. I would even say, Mr. Speaker, that our financial statements are the best

financial statements of all the government jurisdictions in Canada. So, again,

my compliments to the minister.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS E. MARSHALL: Mr. Speaker, I would like to speak briefly now on our

roads budget. Again, this stems from the Estimates Committee yesterday for the

Department of Transportation and Works. I think, just driving around the

Province we can see that our roads have deteriorated over the last number of

years, and not only our roads but also the bridges and this is something very

visible. I mean, we see potholes everywhere. It has been a commitment of this

government, since we came to power, that we would put monies into roads and

upgrade our infrastructure. Because really, building and maintaining our

infrastructure is the primary obligation of government. Mr. Speaker, I am very

pleased that the Minister of Transportation and Works has budgeted over $142

million for our roads program.

The other point that I would like to make, Mr. Speaker, is the amount of

money that is being put into replacing heavy equipment. One of the problems that

we have been having in the Department of Transportation and Works over the last

number of years is that the heavy equipment - what is out maintaining the roads,

especially doing snow clearing - like the ferry services, we have not been

replacing them. We have not been upgrading them. So quite often we have heavy

equipment that requires a lot of maintenance work and a lot of equipment is down

at the one time. So I was very, very pleased to see that there is about $10

million put in for the replacement of heavy equipment.

A similar problem, Mr. Speaker, has been the infrastructure throughout the

Province, and that would include public buildings, like health buildings,

schools, hospitals and things like that. Again, it is like the roads, you can

see it through personal observation.

I have three children. They are in Memorial University now but they did

attend schools in the Province, and just going and visiting the schools, just

looking around the schools you could see that the schools were in a state of

disrepair. My children went to Prince of Wales Collegiate, and just walking

around that school you could see that the school needed some money for

upgrading. How can students learn in a school when the windows do not close

properly, when they are cold? How can they learn? Then, how can the parents have

confidence in the school system if they go into the schools and see that the

schools are in a state of disrepair, or the kids are coming home from school and

saying to their parents: Mom, I was really cold in school today. I couldn't

learn. I couldn't hear what the teacher said. So, Mr. Speaker, I must

compliment the Minister of Education for that.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to talk about the increased funding that has been

provided for the RNC and also for the RCMP. I think we all know that we have a

new Chief of Police now, Chief Joe Browne. I would like to congratulate him on

his new job. I have met a lot of RNC officers over the last number of years and

one of the issues that they keep raising is the issue of restraint. Many of them

have said that restraint is having a real impact on the force. For example, they

were driving old cars that were quite often in for servicing. I think one RNC

officer told me a while back that it was a real challenge to find uniforms for

their new recruits when they were sworn in. Of course, the force itself, the

members of the force were getting older and it really needed to have some new

recruits come into the force.

While the RNC, Mr. Speaker, was under restraint, unfortunately crime was not

under restraint. So I am very pleased that this government has provided

additional funding to the RNC, and also the RCMP. We must remember that this

Province is serviced not only by the Royal Newfoundland Constabulary, but also

by the RCMP. Also, there is additional funding in there for staffing, for

vehicles, for uniforms, things of that nature.

Mr. Speaker, last night I was just browsing through the government Web site

and I just went back and took a look at the Budget Estimates from a few years

back. Actually, I went back, I believe to 1999-2000, whatever is on the Web

site. I know for the RNC, I believe the budgeted number for 2003-2004 was just

over $24 million and it is now up to $31 million. So, I am looking forward to

the improved services provided by both the RNC and the RCMP. Of course, Mr.

Speaker, I live in the District of Topsail, that is the district that I

represent, and there have been some issues regarding policing out in that area.

So I am very pleased that this additional funding will be able to help alleviate

some of the concerns that we have in my district.

The last thing I would like to mention about the Royal Newfoundland

Constabulary and the RCMP is that they have their 101 annual general meeting for

the Canadian Association of Police Chiefs in August, and I am sure that both the

RNC and the RCMP will be very proud to fund that event, knowing that they are

properly funded by the government.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to move now from talking about expenditures; I am

going to talk a little bit about revenues. I was very pleased to hear the

Minister of Finance announce, when he read the Budget Speech, that there is

going to be a review of the Province's overall tax structure. Of course, that

is something that is of great interest to me. Everybody who lives in

Newfoundland, and I think even people who live outside of Newfoundland, are

quite aware that we have very high taxes here in Newfoundland. It is very

important that we be competitive with the rest of Canada in all of our taxes. So

I was very, very pleased to see that there is a commitment on the part of the

Province, that we will be reviewing the overall tax structure of the Province.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to talk a little bit now about the Department of

Education, and education in general. I do have three children attending Memorial

University. So, of course, they have come up through the education system in

Newfoundland. I was very, very pleased that education is the pivotal area for

this Budget. I was very, very pleased that the 151 teaching units that were

supposed to come out of the system, which the allocation formula calls for

removal of, that we are going to reinvest those teaching units back into the

system, and that we are going to review the teacher allocation model. I think

that is a great idea. I did see, it might have been in the Telegram , Mr.

Speaker, but there were some numbers there regarding the number of teachers in

the Province and also the number of students. Of course, numbers have always

been of great interest to me. I think it is very important for us to take a look

at that teacher allocation model, look at exactly where the teachers are being

employed and revisit that model. It seems that we do need a different formula.

Mr. Speaker, I would also like to compliment the minister on providing

funding for the new curriculum that focuses on Newfoundland and Labrador's

unique history. When we were in school - of course, I am one of the baby boomers

- we studied Newfoundland history and, of course, we all remember what we

learned in that. Unfortunately, the students who went through the last number of

years are learning very, very little about Newfoundland and Labrador's unique

history. There was some funding put into the system last year, but I understand

that this new curriculum will focus on the higher grade levels. I am very, very

pleased with that course. In fact, Mr. Speaker, it interests me so much that I

am looking forward to reading the textbooks for that course.

Mr. Speaker, a number of parents have indicated to me they are quite pleased

with the increase in the instructional grant - it went from $80 per pupil up to

$150 - and also the extra $1 million for prescribed consumable workbooks. I

know, Mr. Speaker, from talking to some of the constituents in my district that

some of them, when school starts up in the fall, are really strapped for cash.

Between clothing their children, buying sneakers, getting them ready for school,

their pencils, pens, things of that nature, that when they also have to pay

school fees and for consumable workbooks it is really a great pressure on the

family's income. I was very, very pleased, Mr. Speaker, that that funding will

alleviate some of that funding requirements for some of the parents.

I would also like to talk about the freeze in tuition at Memorial University.

I would like to say, Mr. Speaker, that many members in this House, both on this

side and the other side, probably attended Memorial University back in the

1960s, 1970s or even later.

AN HON. MEMBER: 1980s.

MS E. MARSHALL: Okay, 1980s too.

AN HON. MEMBER: And 1990s.

MS E. MARSHALL: And 1990s too. At the time I attended, and I attended

back in the late 1960s and early 1970s, and at that period of time tuition was

at fairly reasonable rates. You could get student loans and you could get

grants. I think it was at that time, really, that the students living in rural

Newfoundland were able to afford to come into Memorial University and be

educated. I know, for myself, I am from a middle-class family. I have four

brothers and a sister; we all attended Memorial. My husband is from a little

community, Freshwater, down behind Carbonear, from a middle-class family. They

were also able to attend Memorial University.

Over the years, of course, attendance at MUN, the cost has really started to

increase. I think that the freeze on tuition will make education costs more

affordable for many students in Newfoundland and Labrador. Educating our

children, that is really important. It is one of the primary objectives of a

government. It should be one of our primary responsibilities. I think the best

thing that we can do for our children is to educate them so they can get out in

the world and make a living for themselves.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to continue on with education, but I would like to

talk a little bit about the physical health of our children. I think it is like

some of the other things that are happening in this Province, that visually you

can see things happening. Visually you can see that our children are getting

bigger, they are not in shape like they were years ago, so $1 million has been

approved to extend the purchase of phys. ed. equipment for students. There has

also been $250,000 budgeted to implement new school food guidelines. I think

those are excellent ideas.

I think, though, Mr. Speaker, I would like to add to it and say that, while

the Department of Education will do its best to try to make our children more

physically fit, it is not only the schools that are responsible, not only the

government, but that parents and the community also have a responsibility. If

people are not in good health, if they are not getting their exercise and eating

right, really, you are looking for long-term health problems. We do have a

problem. For example, diabetes is on the rise in this Province. It leads to

heart problems, and things of this nature, so anything that we can do to get our

students more fit - not only our students, though, Mr. Speaker, but also adults

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. member's allotted time has expired.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: By leave.

MR. SPEAKER: Has leave been granted?

AN HON. MEMBER: By leave.

MR. SPEAKER: Leave has been granted for some concluding comments.

MS E. MARSHALL: Okay, Mr. Speaker, I will take one minute.

There is one program that I would like to comment on, and that is the dental

program for children. We budgeted just over $4 million for that program over the

last number of years. I am fairly familiar with that program and I can say that

many, many children in this Province have poor oral health. A lot of children

who should be going to see the dentist are probably not, or should be going to

see the dentist more but are not. I think that sometimes we forget that dental

health is really part of our wellness plan, that dental health is also part of

health. Mr. Speaker, I was very pleased to see that this government has

increased the funding for the dental health program for children. It has gone

from just over $4 million to $8.6 million. My compliments to the Minister of

Health for that.

With that, Mr. Speaker, I will sit down but look forward to further

commenting on the Budget.

Thank you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Port de Grave.

MR. BUTLER: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

It is a pleasure to be able to stand today and take

part in the Budget

debate.

When I was asked the other day, by one member of the media, what did I think

of the Budget?, I said to them: Having being involved, I guess, in the political

arena inside and outside the House of Assembly for quite a number of years, I

have yet to see a Budget that did not have some good into it; but, at the end of

the day, regardless of what political stripe, you are always looking for

something else in the Budget that wasn't there. I guess this Budget is no

different, Mr. Speaker.

I have to say, my hon. friend, the Member for Topsail, when she was up

speaking, I do not know why she was looking at me so much when she was talking

about exercise and proper eating habits. I could not understand why. I cannot

understand that.

Mr. Speaker, the other thing, I overheard the Minister of Fisheries, the

other day when the Budget was being read and everything was so quiet on this

side of the House, he looked over and said: All the members of the Opposition

are white in the gills.

I am going to tell you one thing: I think if the Minister of Fisheries was

here today and he heard the former Minister of Fisheries talking to the Member

for Fortune Bay-Cape la Hune, I would say he would have been pretty red around

the gills.

Mr. Speaker, I have to say, like members on this side of the House have said

before, no doubt about it, there are many good things in this Budget, like all

Budgets. I was elected in 2001 and was fortunate enough to sit on the other side

of the House, re-elected in 2003 and sitting in Opposition, and you see both

sides of it. I guess, when that happens, when you are on one side, I think our

leader said one day: When you are on one side, things change by just crossing

the floor.

Regardless of what side of the House you are sitting on, you are elected by

the people of your district and you come here to represent them to the best of

your ability and to bring their concerns and the concerns of the people of this

Province to the floor of the House of Assembly.

I just want to touch on several issues. With regard to the budget for

education, I know there was, I think, $100 million allocated this year in the

budget for education. No doubt, there are many good things that will happen with

this money being spent.

Mr. Speaker, I want to touch on some other issues. I do not want to sound

negative or be complaining but, when we hear talk of such a surplus, I think

there are other things that could have been done.

I am pleased with the announcement of school fees - the estimate going from

$80 to $150. I will tell you what I am hearing back from the people in my

district and outside of my district: Thank God for the elimination of school

fees, because now our children will not be going around the Province with boxes

of chocolates and bars, trying to get enough money -

MR. REID: Wait and see.

MR. BUTLER: I say, wait and see.

- going around selling their chocolates, having auctions, to try and get

enough money for supplies in the schools. With this funding now, hopefully that

is going to take care of the full problem.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. BUTLER: That is what we are led to believe.

MR. HICKEY: (Inaudible) over there.

MR. BUTLER: Here we go again, the Member for Lake Melville, they always

go back to the past. We are living in the future now, and I am looking forward

to good things, I say to the hon. member.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. BUTLER: Mr. Speaker, we talk about the 151 teachers staying in the

system. That is good news, but when we hear the concerns that were expressed by

principals and teachers around this Province who were suspended because of the

concerns and stress they were placed under, keeping 150 in the system cannot

correct those problems. You can do an assessment on the ratio or what have you,

Mr. Speaker, but it will not correct the problems.

We talk about the sixty-seven school buses, a good-news story, Mr. Speaker.

When we were at the lock down on Budget day, I asked them: Where are the

sixty-seven buses for? They are all going to some school board in some area of

this Province. That does very little for the system that we are involved in, in

my area, where people have to go out, compete, and bid low prices for their

tenders and end up with buses that probably are not up to standard. There is

nothing in the system for those people to improve on the buses that they have.

Mr. Speaker, we talk about the libraries. I know there is money allocated for

extra hours in some of the libraries, but I asked a question. I understand there

are twenty-eight requests in for libraries in areas of this Province where today

there is not a library.

Mr. Speaker, I know there is a freeze on student tuition. That is a good

thing for them but we were hoping, with the surplus that this government has,

that there would have been some other system where debt reduction could have

been looked at, Mr. Speaker.

We talk about, in the Department of Human Resources, Labour and Employment.

We had our Estimates meeting here last night and I have to thank the minister

for the responses that he gave. I mean, there are many people - the 5 per cent

that they will receive will be a tremendous increase to those people who are in

need. I am looking forward - I asked questions to the minister last night with

regards to the new telephone technology, with regards to the plan that is in

place for poverty. I have to say, Minister, the jury is still out. I wish I

could be as positive as you were last night, but I am looking forward to it and

hope that is what happens, Sir.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. BUTLER: Because it is going to take many years to get to the level

where - it is supposed to be eliminated, I think, by 2010, poverty in this

Province. I look forward to that day and I have to say, the jury is still out.

The other thing, Mr. Speaker, I want to touch on health care in the

Conception Bay North area. There is no doubt about it, I am glad to see that

there are going to be new health hospitals or clinics in different parts of

Labrador, cancer clinics around the Province, but I have to ask a question. Back

a few years ago the Conception Bay North area was number one on the list for a

home care centre - and I am glad that the people here, who are listed in the

Budget, in Corner Brook, Happy Valley-Goose Bay, Lewisporte, St. John's and

Clarenville are going to get new facilities, but I am just wondering: What

happened to the area of this Province that was listed number one a few years

ago? It was not politically done. There was an assessment done by proper people

in authority who determined that that area was number one on the list. That is

one of the things that concerns me, Mr. Speaker, and I hope this government, in

due course, will take a look at that.

The other one is doctor shortages. Last year I mentioned about three doctors

who were going to leave Carbonear hospital and I was accused of being

fearmongering. I have to say that those three doctors have left the Province.

There are notifications in now from one, if not two other doctors who will be

leaving.

Mr. Speaker, general practitioners in the Conception Bay North area, people

are going to a clinic now and have to wait six to eight weeks to see their

doctor, even if it is only to get their prescriptions renewed. At one clinic in

Spaniards Bay there used to be two doctors there, now we have one who only

operates on half a day. They are being told: Take your file, go find a doctor.

Mr. Speaker, there is nowhere for them to go in the Conception Bay North area.

Many of the people now travel to Mount Pearl to see a doctor, who relocated from

that area to Mount Pearl.

MR. DENINE: It's a good spot to go.

MR. BUTLER: I have to say, it is a lovely spot to go to but it is a long

distance for people to have to travel to see their doctor.

Mr. Speaker, we hear talk about the wait time for different pieces of

equipment will be reduced, and that is good news for the people of this

Province. But, I have to say, and I saw this happen firsthand at the Health

Sciences Centre, there are registration places there for four lineups when

people are going in to see the various specialists and go to the various

divisions. I was there one morning and there were only two opened up. The people

were lined up all the way out on the steps outside the main entrance. When asked

why this was, there was a shortage of staff.

At the Carbonear hospital speaking to workers there, for thirty-one patients

on one particular floor there are three nurses and one nursing assistant. I was

also told that on an evening shift, if an emergency should come in, the head

nurse has to go to emergency, leaving two nurses looking after thirty-one

patients. That, to me, is not treating the patients fairly. They are not people

who are just there for no particular reason. They are very sick individuals and

are at the hospital.

Mr. Speaker, I believe with regards to our CAT scans and the MRIs, I do not

know if it has ever been looked at by anybody, but it seems like those pieces of

equipment - I am wondering if they are utilized to the fullest. They are

probably operating from 9:00 to 5:00 or 9:00 to 4:00, I do not know, but to know

that we have to send people outside of this Province, I am wondering if even

that can be looked at.

Mr. Speaker, I think it was last week we heard the minister refer to the

figures in relation to in-migration or out-migration, whatever terminology you

want to use, stating that it was the highest increase of people coming into this

Province in the last, I think it was ten years, fifteen - twenty years was it?

Well, according to the stats that I have from Stats Canada, it shows that last

year there was an out-migration of 2,930 people. I know the members opposite

will come back and say: Well, look at how many left when you were in government.

That is all fine, Mr. Speaker, but we are talking about today, with our economy

supposedly turned around to a great extent and we can see the flow of revenue

from the offshore, but I am going to tell you, the flow of the oil from the

offshore is nothing in comparison to the flow of our young people leaving this

Province. I have never seen the like in my area.

Last year in one community, in Bryants Cove, seventy-nine men left and went

away. Due to the problem with the raw material sharing last year, as the

fishermen left the boats they went away. I was told today - I have not seen it

myself - that there are ads placed on the local channels in my area and in

Trinity Bay area where they are asking for people to go to work as deckhands on

a fishing boat. I never thought that we would see fishermen advertising for

deckhands to go to work on a fishing boat.

As my hon. colleague for Carbonear-Harbour Grace mentioned today, the list of

people who are lining up to go to Alberta to find work. Personally, it is

frightening to know that so many young people are leaving. We hear talk about

our skill shortages, skilled trades people. There are so many people from this

Province working in other areas of our country, whether they be carpenters,

plumbers, electricians, welders, insulators, all they need, Mr. Speaker, is some

work back here in this Province and a one-way ticket home. I am going to tell

you, there are an awful lot of skilled people who can return to this Province.

Mr. Speaker, when we talk about out-migration, last year when those people

left, they went by themselves. They stayed until the early part of this year and

they returned. I guess if there is a sad note to it - it is wonderful they could

find work, to go away and provide for their families, but the sad

part is the

reality that is happening this year. They are returning out west and they are

taking their families with them.

Mr. Speaker, we talk about skilled people - and I know there are programs

being put in place to train our young people. There are new programs for the

high schools. That is all fine, but I think we have to find a way that when

these young people are trained that there is a means for them to stay here in

the Province. The sooner that is done - I know everything cannot happen

overnight, but I will give you one incidence where two young girls in my

district who were in receipt of social assistance went through the system and

they were retrained. Both of them became nurses. Today, one is working in

Florida and the other one is working in Alberta. I am proud of them, that they

broke the cycle, they got out of the system - but to know that they have gone

away, unable to find the work here in this Province.

Mr. Speaker, I guess some of the biggest concerns, and I mentioned to the

minister last evening - like you would ask the question - did he think any of

the HRLE offices would reopen? I guess I got the answer that I was expecting,

no, but you try anything to try to bring the system back to how it was.

Mr. Speaker, I believe that in the area of the Province that I represent, in

the Port de Grave district, the people are fortunate in that area because they

live in close proximity to the Cities of Mount Pearl and St. John's and a lot

of them travel back and forth here to work - and to know that there are hundreds

of them who are planning this year.... Many are gone, others are leaving. I can

only imagine what is happening in more rural areas of the Province, more areas

which are less fortunate than the area that I live in, because they are not

closer to the main centres where the main purpose and the greater portion of the

benefits from the offshore are happening.

Mr. Speaker, with that note, I will just conclude for now and hopefully take

up more time later on. I want to thank you for the opportunity, and I look

forward to others in debate.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: Are we ready for the question?

The hon. the Member for Lake Melville.

MR. HICKEY: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, indeed, it is a great pleasure for me to stand in this hon.

House and to represent the people of the great District of Lake Melville here

this afternoon, I say to my good friend from Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair. There

is lots of good news coming your way this afternoon, I say to my good friend and

member.

I know she is not used to good news, but I will say this: I am happy that we

are able to speak to this Budget today and to talk about some of the very

positive things that are happening in Labrador; indeed, certainly, some of the

Budget announcements.

I can tell you, having looked at this week's paper, Mr. Speaker, it says:

Budget boosts for the Big Land. Government announces additional spending.

Headlines in the local paper this week in Happy Valley-Goose Bay and in

Labrador.

Mr. Speaker, as we go through the Budget process, and as everybody knows,

there are many decisions that have to be made. There are many needs throughout

the Province. I can tell you, certainly, coming from Labrador, we have had many

needs for many years. I will say we are addressing these needs. The Premier has

been firm on his commitment that the needs of Labradorians will be paramount in

this government, in discussions, and I think that reflects in, certainly, some

of the expenditures that we have seen announced over the past couple of weeks in

Labrador, and indeed in the Budget that was announced by the Minister of Finance

a couple of days ago.

Mr. Speaker, I want to talk about a few of the things that are highlighted in

the Budget. Of course, we know we have some very positive news regarding a

long-term health care facility in Happy Valley-Goose Bay, a fifty-two bed

facility. I can tell you, there are many families looking forward to the day

that we can open that facility. Just last week, I had a good friend of mine who

had to move from Happy Valley-Goose Bay to St. John's because the care and

need that she needed, she just could not get there. I hope, Mr. Speaker, that

over the course of the next year or so that we will be able to see construction

of this new long-term health care facility so that people will not have to leave

their homes, their families and their friends, to come to St. John's, Corner

Brook, or some other part of the Province because they need to get the care that

they cannot receive in Labrador.

We can talk about the auditorium. I am very pleased that the auditorium

facility is going to be moved forward. I want to commend the Minister of

Labrador Affairs for his work on this particular file, and for the commitments

that we have gotten from the Province and indeed the federal government to move

this particular piece of infrastructure forward.

The arts community has been, for many years, without a performance space in

Happy Valley-Goose Bay, but I can tell you this space will not just be for Happy

Valley-Goose Bay; indeed, it will be for Labrador and for the people of

Labrador. I can tell you, the students in the many schools along the North Coast

and South Coast who come to Happy Valley-Goose Bay for the Labrador Creative

Arts Festival and other type of events, I can tell you, it will be a welcomed

venue for those type of activities in the arts program.

Certainly the other big issue, when I was back home over the weekend, is that

people are very encouraged by the establishment of a new extension to the

College of the North Atlantic to improve our post-secondary education.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. HICKEY: I can tell you, Mr. Speaker, as we move along in our resource

development - and I am happy to report that things are going well with

negotiations with Ben Michel and the Innu Nation, with regard to land claims and

these types of issues, but the Lower Churchill is going to be coming upon us and

I hope that we will find ourselves in a position to be able to develop that

particular project. I can tell you, that the College of the North Atlantic is

going to play a key role, I have to tell the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au

Clair, in training our students, in training our young people for those jobs

that lie ahead. I can tell you, this is a huge piece of infrastructure that has

been required for many, many years.

I just want to say, as we look back on the other colleges and the upgrades of

the colleges throughout the Province, it was very interesting, when I became MHA

I found that the one in Labrador was one of the few throughout the Province that

had never received any upgrading, had never received any extensions and that

type of maintenance. I tell you, Mr. Speaker, it is very gratifying and I can

tell you, talking to the young people in Labrador over the past weekend, they

are very excited about the new opportunities that the College of the North

Atlantic are going to be able to provide to our young people, to Aboriginal

people in Labrador to prepare them for the resource sector developments that are

going to take place over the course of the next number of years.

I want to spend a couple of minutes talking about some of the other points

that were raised in the Budget. They are very, very important, although they did

not get the highlights that some of the bigger ticket items got. I want to go

through them, and particularly when it comes to infrastructure, Mr. Speaker.

Infrastructure is something that throughout Labrador, and, indeed, throughout

the Province - we have seen over the course of the last number of years

certainly a depletion in the infrastructure dollars, particularly in the past

government. We certainly seen facilities become, basically, dilapidated; lack of

maintenance, lack of concern, lack of care. Well, we are trying now, this

government, to improve that infrastructure; try to improve our schools and our

roads and all this type of infrastructure that is very, very important to the

Province.

This year there will be an unprecedented investment, in excess of $2 billion,

to modernize the Province's infrastructure and continue to grow the economy

over the course of the next six years. It is very, very important that our

government look at investing in infrastructure. It is very, very important for

the continuity of programs and services, that infrastructure play a key role in

that. We are going to spend somewhere in the vicinity of $60 million in the

provincial roads program; another $29.7 million in cost shared for Trans-Canada

Highway improvements; $25.5 million for Phase III of the Trans-Labrador Highway.

That one is a huge one, Mr. Speaker, I can tell you for us in Labrador. We are

certainly looking forward to 2009 when we are going to be able to drive from the

border in Quebec, Labrador West, all the way to The Straits. That will be a

happy day for Labradorians and that should be a happy day for our Province.

I will say, Mr, Speaker, that I was pleased to see $10 million in cost-shared

funding to extend the Team Gushue Highway between Torbay Bypass Road, including

$6 million for land acquisition; $2 million for land acquisition for various

road projects, and $15 million for the Trans-Labrador Highway to start a sealed

surface between Labrador West and Happy Valley-Goose Bay. I can tell you, having

driven the road - and I know my good friend from Labrador West will tell you

also, that for anyone to drive the Trans-Labrador Highway on a hot summers day

without air conditioning, it is a feat in itself, when you have to eat dust

pretty well the whole entire way. I can tell you, it will be a happy day for all

of my constituents and for the people of Labrador when we can drive on a sealed

surface from Labrador West right to The Straits. Hopefully, over the course of

the next five years, we will be able to look at an opportunity to drive from

Happy Valley-Goose Bay to Labrador West on a paved surface, Mr. Speaker.

Great things, Mr. Speaker, great initiatives on behalf of our government to

improve infrastructure. There were also a number of other ones that I wanted to

talk about here today, particularly when it comes to the improvements to the Sir

Robert Bond and to the Northern Ranger . Those two vessels - and I

cannot underestimate or underscore the importance of this - are key, at the

present time, for the shipping of goods and services into Labrador. The Northern

Ranger provides a great service to the people of Coastal Labrador, from Nain

right down through to Happy Valley-Goose Bay. I can tell you, it is welcomed

news.

I am sure we will hear the Member for Torngat Mountains on his feet

commending our government here on this great initiative to upgrade the Northern

Ranger and the Sir Robert Bond so that we do meet those cargo issues

and those issues that have been long outstanding on the Coast of Labrador. We

are addressing them as a government. I can tell you, we are addressing them. We

are taking them all into consideration and hopefully, over the next while, we

will see those improvements.

When we look at the total package in Labrador, I can tell you that it is very

exciting for me as an MHA from Labrador, particularly from Central Labrador,

because I can tell you, over the course of the next number of years we are going

to see some great opportunities for development; particularly in the forestry

sector, particularly in the mining sector, particularly when it comes to tourism

and hydro development. Those are the key resource sectors that are going to

impact, not only Labrador, but our Province as a whole. I can tell you that the

future of our Province - and I have said this many times - lies in the

development of the resources here in Labrador.

I was very pleased last week when members of the Innu Nation, Mr. Ben Michel,

the President, and Mr. Daniel Ashini, one of his land claims negotiators, came

to St. John's and met with the Premier, the Deputy Premier and the Minister of

Natural Resources, and talked about this project. I can tell you we are going to

work hard with our Aboriginal partners to ensure that we get a deal that is

satisfactory to everybody. I hope that we will see some success on that

particular file over the course of the next few months and into the summer.

The resource sector is very, very important to our Province. As I watched the

news over the last couple of days - and I was in Tim Hortons in Happy

Valley-Goose Bay yesterday afternoon and I was talking to a number of folk

there. They wanted me to pass on publicly to the Premier and to our government

the tough stand that we are taking against the oil companies here to ensure that

our Province gets the very best deal that we can for Newfoundland and Labrador.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. HICKEY: I can tell you, wherever I go I hear it: Finally we have

leadership, we have the leadership, we have the government that is basically

going to ensure that our children and our grandchildren get the very best

benefits of our natural resources, Mr. Speaker. That is a very, very important

issue for every one of us here on this side of the House. I can't underscore

the importance of that more, and I want to congratulate the Premier this

afternoon and encourage him to move on. These big oil companies have been taking

their fair share out of it, we haven't been getting our fair share, and I can

tell you the people of the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador want to see us

getting our fair share, and I think we are going to see that under this

government and under this Premier, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, health care is a huge issue for us in Labrador and I want to

take a couple of minutes because I want to talk about the health care issues. As

an MHA, I can tell you, Mr. Speaker, that each and every day I get people coming

to my office in Happy Valley-Goose Bay who have issues regarding medical travel

and issues regarding finding a home for their loved ones. Every day I see those

issues, Mr. Speaker, and I am sure my colleagues, the other MHAs, see it coming

from their districts. We are trying to address that, and one of the key issues

that was fixed this year, I am very, very happy to report, is the issue of the

kidney dialysis unit going to be installed in Happy Valley-Goose Bay.

I can tell you the story of a young man who grew up in Happy Valley-Goose

Bay. There are a number of these stories out there, Mr. Speaker, but I am going

to touch on this one in particular. He has had to live away from his family in

St. John's for six years. Six years he has been away from his family. For

anybody to be moved away from your family just because you can't get kidney

dialysis is just not acceptable, Mr. Speaker. I want to say how very pleased

that family is, and other families, that we have made the move to ensure that

the funding is there for the kidney dialysis unit. I hope that over the course

of the next number of months, as this file moves forward, we will see many of

those people from Labrador being able to move back to their communities, move

back to their own homes, move back to their families. It is very, very

important, I say to you, Mr. Speaker, for those people to be able to come back

home and get that type of treatment.

Mr. Speaker, there is one other topic I want to talk on today, and it took up

a bit of press time last week, I can tell you, and it took up a large portion of

my time as an MHA last week, and that is the whole issue of 5 Wing Goose Bay.

Although there was some fearmongering going around the community and there were

some moments there last week when people were not really sure, I want to commend

the new Minister of National Defence, Minster Gordon O'Connor, for coming out

publicly on Monday morning and reconfirming the commitment that he made to the

people of Happy Valley-Goose Bay, that he made recently to Premier Williams in

Ottawa, and the commitment that Prime Minister Harper made to our Province in a

letter that he wrote to the Premier during the election. The commitment is

there, Mr. Speaker, it is solid, 650 troops on the ground. We are going to see

an army base there with an extra 100 support troops for a UAV squadron. This is

fantastic news, Mr. Speaker, for the Town of Happy Valley-Goose Bay and for the

District of Lake Melville.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. HICKEY: I can tell you that, as we move forward, Mr. Speaker, on all

of these files there will be more opportunity for me to speak in this hon. House

and to talk about some of the good news that is continuing to flow out of this

government. I will say to you, Mr. Speaker, I am very proud to serve with this

government and this Premier as we change; change the past, a past of giveaways,

a past where we have not done the right thing in the best interests of the

people of the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador. This is a new time, Mr.

Speaker, with new leadership.

I can tell you the oil companies are getting it in spades that we are going

to stand firm, we have a Premier who is going to stand firm, and everyone over

here in this Caucus on this side of the House is behind our Premier as we move

forward.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. HICKEY: Anyway, Mr. Speaker, thank you very much for the opportunity.

I look forward to further debate at a future time.

Thank you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER( Fitzgerald): Order, please!

The hon. the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I just want to have a few words on the Budget today. I am sure there is going

to be lots of debate over the next few days and coming weeks as we flush out all

the items in the Budget and some of the items that do not appear in the Budget

as well, I say to you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I say to the hon. members, in the ten years I have been here I

have never seen a Budget with something that was not good in it. Every Budget

that I have seen has had good things; yes, it has. Every Budget I have seen in

ten years has had some good things in it. Mr. Speaker, I have seen some Budgets

that have had not such good things in them, and I only have to go back a couple

of years when my hon. colleagues opposite brought in budgets that raised the

fees on every single living person in this Province. I can guarantee you, that

was only two years ago, and they were not all standing in their places those

days and saying, how proud I am to jack up the rates on your ambulances, or how

proud I am to jack up the fees on your moose licence, or how proud I am to jack

up the fees on your birth certificates and all of these things, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JONES: We did not hear them up bragging then.

Mr. Speaker, my colleague, I think, said the other day: Thank God we are

surrounded by oil. I would say it is a good thing. It is a good thing in this

Province that we are, and fortunate not just for us who are here and not just

for this generation, but for many generations of Newfoundlanders and

Labradorians to come. As long as the oil prices stay high, as long as we

continue to have oil developments - I guess we are in some troublesome times

today with one company, but hopefully all will not be over. Hopefully we will

still be able to secure a deal and be able to carry on.

Mr. Speaker, we live in a Province, I think, where in the last year we had a

development of something like 111 million barrels of oil, at some of the highest

prices that we have ever seen in our history which has allowed us to generate

some good revenues, good revenues for this Province, good revenues that can be

invested for the benefit of Newfoundlanders and Labradorians.

Mr. Speaker, I think it was a great stroke of luck on our part as a Province,

that we are fortune to have those kind of resources and to be able to benefit

from them like we have. I hope we can continue to do that because in

Newfoundland and Labrador we certainly need it. We have had a lot of years where

we have had tight budgets and very little money that could be invested. We went

through some of the most significant economic disasters in Canadian history in

the early 90's with the failure of the cod moratorium. It takes a long time for

a Province the size of ours, that has been so dependent upon one industry, to

try and rise above that and to put things back together.

I am pleased today, Mr. Speaker, to say that there is some new wealth in this

Province and that it is being used to benefit the people of Newfoundland and

Labrador. Mr. Speaker, I could not wish for anything more than for us to

continue to have that kind of wealth and that kind of revenue generation from

our resources. But, Mr. Speaker, the debate is always about how money is

invested. It is like fish. There is a debate when you have no fish and there is

a bigger debate when you have a little bit of fish. It is like the Budget and it

is like money. When you have no money, you still have a lot of people looking

for it, and when you have some, you have even more people looking for it. That

does not change.

Mr. Speaker, when you talk about the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador,

you do not talk about one city and you do not talk about one town. It is not

about just what happens in the urban area of St. John's or in the City of

Mount Pearl or in the City of Corner Brook. It is all encompassing, what happens

from one peninsula to the other, from one bay to the other, from one community

to the other. Together, Mr. Speaker, we have to ensure that all communities can

survive and prosper. That means making investments that are strategic in areas

of the Province. I think that was the thing that was most glaring in this

Budget, the fact that there was little investment for rural communities across

Newfoundland and Labrador, very little investment in terms of economic

generation, new industry development and job creation.

In fact, Mr. Speaker, when you look in the Department of Innovation, Trade

and Rural Renewal -I mean, the minister stood in the House last year, on April

19, 2005, and listed all the strategies that the government was involved in. I

am going to name some of them today, because, I am going to tell you, it is a

year later and I do not know how either one of those initiatives, undertaken by

her department, has benefited anyone in my district which is a completely rural

district. I would also have to ask how any of them have benefited any of the

people who live on the Baie Verte Peninsula or in the Burgeo area or in the

Burin area or in the Trepassey area, or in any of those communities right

through White Bay, right through Bonavista Bay.

I would like to ask, because she stood on April 19, 2005 and she was so proud

to talk about establishing the Innovation, Research and Advanced Technology's

branch. The provincial innovation strategy was another one. The Comprehensive

Regional Diversification Strategy was another one. Then there was the Business

and Marketing Development Program which did have some money in it, but I am not

sure if anyone who I know of receive any. Then there was structure of the Rural

Secretariat. Now, that was one, I can guarantee you. I do not know what they

have done. They have had some meetings but I do not what else they have done.

Then there was the Ireland Business Partnership. Now, I do not know how much

profit and revenue is being generated there, but she can certainly tell me, I am

sure. Then there was the Centre for Information and Communications Technology,

Mr. Speaker. That one was set up. Then there were the Supplier Development

Initiative set up. Then it was the Strategic Partnership Initiative set up. Then

it was the Red Tape Reduction Committee set up. Mr. Speaker, there is another

page of them, of strategies and initiatives and groups and organizations. It

went on and on and on and on.

Mr. Speaker, I have to ask: How did any of this benefit the areas like I

represent? Let me tell you something, of all of those initiatives and all of

those strategies and all of that money being invested, not one of those things

helped me in June of last year when over 500 plant workers in my district were

thrown out of work; not one thing there helped them. Mr. Speaker, not one thing

in this Budget is going to help them this year. This year, when I have four crab

plants in my district that I know are going to close down - that is just my

district. There are going to be plants in 3K, in 3L, in the Gulf, in every part

of this Province, that are going to close down early in the summer. There are

going to be hundreds, there are going to be thousands, of workers who will not

be able to get enough employment to qualify for their EI.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MS JONES: Mr. Speaker, the members opposite don't want to hear this

because they are over there now and they are crowing. Maybe the Member for Mount

Pearl doesn't have a lot to worry about, but I can tell you the Member for

Clarenville should have lots to worry about.

Let me tell you, Mr. Speaker, I didn't see one thing in this Budget that is

going to help these people when their jobs are gone the end of June, and that is

a concern for me. I don't see one thing there that is going to save the rural

economy of the Labrador Straits which is an area that thrived on tourism, that

thrived on the fishing industry, that had the fastest growing business economy,

I suppose, in any rural area of the Province only three or four years ago.

Mr. Speaker, this is what concerns me. It is great that we have the wealth

that we do in the Province but it is also wise to know how we are going to

invest it to benefit the most people. In fact, what we don't see here is a

real strategy to help rural communities in this Province. It is absent, it doesn't

exist, and there are no investments for their benefit.

What we did see was a little bit of investment in infrastructure, like roads,

which is great, Mr. Speaker, but like a missus on the Port au Port Peninsula

told me a couple of days ago when I talked to her on the phone - she said: We

are getting some road money this year. It means that they won't beat up their

pickup trucks when they are leaving with the load of stuff for Alberta. That was

what she said to me, and this is true, Mr. Speaker. That is the kind of attitude

that is now being developed in our Province, and it is being developed because

they are not seeing new job creation in these communities. In fact, what they

are seeing is out-migration, and a lot of out-migration, Mr. Speaker.

Stats Canada says 13,763 people left this Province in 2005; just released a

couple of days ago, on March 23, I think it was, or maybe it was the day after

when this was released. Mr. Speaker, that is the number of people who are

leaving. That is not the people who are moving to Alberta, working for four

months and coming home. These are the people who are leaving and not coming

back. They are not coming back, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, there were over 13,000 people, almost 14,000 people, who left

this Province last year. There was a net loss of almost 4,000 people out of

Newfoundland and Labrador. Mr. Speaker, last week the minister got up in the

House of Assembly and was bragging because 10,000 people moved into Newfoundland

and Labrador. What she did not tell us was, almost 4,000 people left and did not

come back. That is what she failed to tell us, Mr. Speaker.

I can guarantee you, I heard people on the Open Line calling. People actually

called from down on the Burin Peninsula and said: I don't know where these

10,000 people come from, because they are not living in my community. I think it

was called Parkers Cove. I think it might have been the community of Parkers

Cove - I am not sure now - but they are not living in this community. In fact,

they are leaving this community.

I can tell you where else they are not moving to. They are not moving to

Flower's Cove, on the Northern Peninsula, when only a couple of weeks ago I

sat on an airplane with a woman from that community who, right now, her husband

is in Alberta, her parents are in Alberta, her brothers and sisters are in

Alberta and, come the end of June, her and her young son will be in Alberta,

none of them returning to the Province, Mr. Speaker. That is the reality of what

is happening.

Let me tell you the other reality of what is happening. We are talking about

skill shortages in Newfoundland and Labrador. Yes, you are right, there is a

skill shortage but, Mr. Speaker, there is going to be a greater skill shortage;

because, when you look at a company like we have this week holding job fairs all

over the Province, in Stephenville a couple of days ago with 400 people

attending, in Grand Falls, I believe it was, when over 400 people showed up for

a job fair, recruiting people. Down at the Delta Hotel today, the salons down

there are filled, filled, with hundreds of people at a job fair, being recruited

to Alberta. Do you know what they are being offered? They are not only being

offered full-time jobs; they are being offered incentives, money up front,

incentives. They are being offered five-year contracts. They are being offered

relocation allowances, to move their families out of Newfoundland and Labrador.

Sell your houses, they are being told, because we are going to buy you a house

in Fort McMurray. You sign the five-year contract. That is what they are being

told today, hundreds of them, I say.

Here I am, Mr. Speaker, standing in the House of Assembly today with three

resumes upstairs on my desk from three young welders who graduated from the

College of the North Atlantic programs, who cannot get a job in Newfoundland and

Labrador. They cannot get a job in this Province because there are no apprentice

programs to take them. They do not have any training, and no one in Newfoundland

and Labrador is going to hire them. So, where are they going, three young

people, twenty and twenty-one years old? Do you know where they are going? They

are gone to the job fair today, and I can tell you where they are going right

after that.

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MS JONES: That is where they are going, and that is the sad reality.

So, yes, there are good things in this Budget but you have to be realistic.

You cannot just put rose-coloured glasses on and say the job is done and it is

all over, because that is not the truth of it. The fact of the matter is, we

have a huge problem still, today, in this Province.

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MS JONES: There is no need for the member to get all upset over there. I

am just merely pointing out the situation that confronts us. I am merely

pointing out the situation that confronts us.

Mr. Speaker, we are fortunate today because we do have some revenue. We are

going to have some forecasted revenue into the next six, eight, and probably ten

years. Whether there is another deal done by the government ever in our history,

we are going to have some revenue for the next six or eight years, there is no

doubt about that, so we have to really get serious about the problem that

confronts us; because, I am going to guarantee you, it is not a great feeling.

It is not a great feeling when you start seeing the demise of these communities.

It watched it last summer.

I do not have to go down to Harbour Breton today, or down to Fortune, or down

to Hawkes Bay where the population a few years ago was over 700 people and today

it 350. I do not have to go down to Flower's Cove, where a couple of hundred

people have already moved out to it. I can go to my own district and I can

watch, come the end of June last year, when the only groundfish plant in my

district hardly had anything left to process because the quotas that were up

north in OA and OB were given to people from outside of our c

Document details

CollectionNewfoundland and Labrador — Debates (Hansard)
Citation2006-04-04
Typehansard
Volume / chapter2006-04-04
Languageen
Formathtm
SourcePROVINCIAL
Identifier6408d35b8f2f946a9f87b27bcfdf25310d0258ae

Source file is stored in the law ingest library (htm).