Volume XL · wednesday Province of Newfoundland FORTIETH GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF NEWFOUNDLAND Fourth Session VERBATIM REPORT {Hansard) Speaker: Honourable P.]. McNicholas Number 29 , ...... ~ 4 May 1988

The House met at 3:00p.m . MR. SPEAKER (McNicholas): Order, please-:!! Tam noiAJ prE:1parc:!d to r·ul.c,~ on '1:-.he question of priviiege raised by t h c,1 h o n . i":. he rn ern b P. r· For Fog n . To reiterate the definition often quol:~1d "Jn i::he House, 1 Parliarn~HJtary privi1ege :is the sum of the p(~cultHr rights 0njoyE!d by each House coJ.J.ect..ively and by mE!mber·s incJ-i.vi.dually, IAJ'ithout which they could not discharge their functions. ThE:1Y arE:1 d .ghts IAJhich arE! absolutely I1E!cessary for the due execut.ion of its poiAJer·s.

A genuine question of privilege is a most serious matter, and ought rarely to come up in Parliament. 1 Be r.w c he s e n e , F :i. f t h Ed i. t i o n , p a g e 11 . I have rE!ad the ·transcript of the tnterv"ieiAJ d1Jring which t.he IAJords to which the han. the member for Fogo takes exception were uttered. As I understand it, the han. the ITI~mber maintains thrJ.t i. n accusing the han. the Premier of lying Mr. Craig Dobbin is disparaging the institution of Parliament and thereby violating ti1E:1 privileges of aJ.l han. fTI('!ITJb e r s . I l: s (,H~rns to me t: ha 1-.

I.~JP. cH' E:1 d E! a 1 "i n g h E! r E! 1.1.d t h a d J f f e r e n c e of opinion bet.IAJeen th(~ PrE:Hrd.ei" .:lnd Mr. Dobbin, and I accept the word of the hon. the PrE!ITiiE:11~. T t h t n k on E:1 must k e E! p the cont.: ~;:1 x t in mind in asking whet.hE!r' this is a sufficiently grave or serious matter to support a charge of br(,1ac h of pri. v·i.l ege. I do not believe therE! is sufficient causa1 connection betiA.JE!en t.he comments of Mr. Dobbin and the privillE!ges of members of this House for me to find there has bE!C::!n a prima facie breach of th(~m. Wh::i.le the accusation of Mr.

Dobbin may be L1496 May 4, 19H8 Vol XL intemperate, even do not f ·i.nd circumstances that case of breach of been established. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hoar, h~:!ar! MR. SPEAKER: Order, p1ease! distastE!fu1, I under t:hE! a pr·irna fac:Lr::! prtv.-i .l.('!9('! has Before calling for statements by rJI j_ 1"1 i. S ·t-. ~~ I" S , [ lA) 0 U l. d l. "i b:! t. 0 IAJr'.! J. C 0 ITI E! to the galJ.ery Mr. Graham ·F1:i.ghL, form(:'r mE:1Jnber for Wi.ndsor Buchans. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear! MR. SPEAKER: ·r---W-0 U J. cf"- a 1 S 0 l i k E!

WE! 1 C 0 Trl E! twenty-one level. fi s l:.udE!I'l l~.s IAri. l:h their teacher Ted Winter, from St.el.l.a MarTis 11""Lgh School, TrE!passE!Y. SOME HON. MEMBERS: He:1ar, hc;!ar! Statements by Ministers T~H,1 hon. HlP. Mi.nist~:!r of Mi.IH!S . MR. DHJN: Mr·. SpE!akE!r, d nno1 .1 n c E!rn('! nt:. governmE!nt of thE! rnJ n""L ng inclustriE!S. I we.lcornE!

YE!Sterday 1 s by the federal a I1E!W programmE! for and oil and gas ThE! programmE!, to be known as the Canadian Expl.or·at.:i.on Incenl:ive Programme, wil1 providE! :i.ncE!nt.:LVE!S of IJP t.o $3 million per year to qualified companies who use flow-through shares to Finance grassroots rninr::!ral E!Xplore:lt:i.on and o:i.l and gas e:~xpJ.or·a I: ion. The purpose of the programmo is to No. ?.9 R1496

ensure that an appropriate level of Stjpport 1. :; maintai .ned for exploration activity as tax reform changes take effect. The federal government estimates that the programme will deliver more than $200 mi1lton a year· to junior mining exploration compan:'i.es and stJpport more than $12,000 person-years of employment. Spec :ifi.c benefits to the Province are currently being assessed. The programme will come into e:~fFect January 1, 1989 for m:lneral exploration.

As a transitional measure, the federal government IAJi.ll extend thE! curN!nt 33 l/3 per cent mintng explorat-ion dE!p1et.ion allowance l:o +.: he c;!nd of l::h ·i.s y(::1ar. Th:i s w:i.J.l enable e x p 1. o r f.l t.i o n c o rn p r.ul.i. "=~ s 1.: o c o n t i I'll 1 e us:i ng the f1ot.u-thr·ough ITlE!chan:ism i n i. 1: s p r e s <;! n t f o r· 1 n c1 n d lAd. ll g L (J n the Province aruple tim.:~ to asse:~ss the new programm0 . Enc,~r9.Y, Mines t.Hld ResourcE!~; Cancildi'-l will open S regional offices to administer · tha Canadian Exploration Incentive Programme . I am pleased to see that St .

John's has beE!n chosen as onE! of these locations. As a Province, we have seen a doubling of exploration activity over the past year, 1argely dLie to f 1 ow- t h r o u g h s harE! s . I t has be e n our concern that tax reform, through its implications on fl DIAl .. - through fJ nr.'l n.c i. ng, 1~1ou 1 d hamper exploration activtty and restrict the growth of a junior mining sect.or in Ne~.&.Jfoundland. We therefore welcome this initiative a:. a means of correcting any "imbalance Ll'li:<l.l: rnay othortAJi .sP. br;~ Cl"eated by tax rE!form. Thank you, Mr. SfH~ake:~r. L 11~9 7 May ~~. 1.988 Vol. XI. SOME HON.

MEMBERS: Hear·, hE:~ar! MR. SIMMONS: Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the rnembE!r for ForttJnE! - Hermitage. MR . SIMMONS: Mr. Speaker, first: of all I thank thE!. rrd.nistE!r for letting HIE! haVE! c~n advance-?. copy of his st.abHnent. SE!COndly, we on this sidE! welcome any i.nit.:i .atiVE! oF e:dt:.her· ordf:!r of government, whether provincial or f c-?. d ~~ r a 1 , IAJh :i. c h has 1:: he E! F f fH: t. of increasing E!COnomic activ:i.t.y, in thi.s case:~ ITiin:i.ng expl.or·ati.on. Hav t ng !;a:'i.d l::hal ·. , Mr·.

SpeakE.~r·, i t m~E!dS to be sa:.i.d, Ud.rdly, thclt. tha rninistor has had a fair change of hE!ar·t, and hopE!fully of hE:!acl, ~; :i n c e 1. 3 f.l p r· J J. , ~~~ h E'! n , o n t. h a 1: date, he informed the Est:i.mates Cowmi l·: tr.;!P. 11 Tlv~ rc-'! ·i. s no t:h :i. ng actually happE!tling tAJ:i.th rE!Spec 1:. l:: o fl.ot.u---throug h :i. l::s c,~ J.f. 11 On t.ha t particular date the minister was not c;!U~Hl at.~.Jar·.:~ that t:IH! Mtnis t:.er of Finance, Mr.

Wilson, last Jum· had made some fairly devastating c hang E! s , or had g i v ~n1 not i c E! of some fa:irly detrirn~~nt.al chai'Jq(;!s l:.o the industry. But I understand that certa:i y1 events, includ:ing I:: hE! gathering of the explorationists al: the Ho1.iday Inn on Apr·:i1. 14 or lS, helped focus the minister's ITI"i.nd, and t:hat "i.s aJ.IAJi:J.YS V(!I"Y USE!fUl . Now, Mr. SpE!akE!r, this netAJ pr·ogrRITIIIIe, t:hH Canad:ian Exploratj.on IncentiVE! Pr•ogramrnE!, I bE!li,~vo IAJJl.J. be I)JelcornE:~d by l :.h<,~ industry.

But what couJ.d havE! ~ll'!C~n done c\l'ld I)Jhr)\t i)Jol.ll.d hav<,1 I ~Jef:!n a lot morE! he1pful, i.s :i.f LhE! Minist:ar of Finance had not stoppE!d -t:arnpe:~ring :i.n tl'l"=1 f:irst No. 29 R .1 49 '7

place . Or more to the point, now that it is May 19!38, could I ask the Minister of Mines (Mr. Dinn) here in this Chamber to use his considerable influence with his federal counterparts, and in particular the Minister of F i nan c e , f <:H:l e r t.d. 1. y • and pre v a i. l upon those people to extend the curr<:~n t 3 3 l /3 mi.n ing r::~xplora t:"i.on depletion allowance for NeLIJfoundJ.and no l: onJ.y 1:o l:he 0.nd of the pr<:~sent. caJ.endar year·, but l:o E:~xl·.end it tndof·i.n:i.'l:E!ly?

It ·i.s having a dramatic positive effect on (;!xpl.orat::i.on lev<ds Jn th-i.s Province, and if the federal govl':~rnHII':HlL rr;:~al.l.y IAJants l:o pu t·. '.i.Ls money where its mouth is, wants to dE~HionstraLe :i.l.:s support of th<:~ Newfoundland mining industry, it can do so by preserving untampered the MEDA, the Mining Exploration DeplE!t.-i .on AlloiAJance. I ap~HH'll t:.o thE:~ ministE!r to SE!E! if h.e can use his good offices to ensure that is the case. The federal government has reaLized that it had some egg on its face with this proposed change which would have had a detrimental.

E!ffect on exp1oration activity, or its level, in this Province in particular. It now has the egg partly wi ped off l ts face. IL has it 1 s mind concent .rated, as has the mi.n '"i. s l:c:!r, and porhap~; ncliAJ !Me ct.Hl appea1 as a 1-lousr::~, and certainly, T say to i:he rn .. i.ni.si·.E!r, Rsk h"i. tn l'.o appea], to the federal government to E!X Lend MEnA ~i ndE!f:i.ni . l:eJ.y l: o th0. good of the Newfound1and .. i. n d 1.1 s 1'. r' y . I h a

t) e f o r t. h a I: +-. h o suppor-t of my fri.end, colleague, and cous.i.n fr·ou1 Grand Falls (Mr. Simms), so ·I arn surE! I wi.ll have no difficulty convincing the minister. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. SOME l-ION. MEMBERS: Hear, hear! Ll498 May <'I-, 19!38 Vol. XL MR. FENWICK : Mr. Speaker. M R . S P E AJS. E R : The hon. the member for Menihek . MR. FENWICK: M r . S p e r.l k E! r , tAlc,~ r.1 r e c:l c t 1.1 a 11 y q IJ j_ t e pleased to see the announcement.

The 1 7 loi~J .. -I:.hr·ough shar'e in the 33 1/3 per cent depletion a1lowanco 1. s nor·rnally thH kind of Lhj.ng that, both federally and PI"OV:i.nc i.i'llly, t.•Je .:~s a part:y ar'E! not particularly enarrnoured with, E:~ S p (,~ C :i. d l. J. y I.•.Jh (,~ 11 1: h (~ y a Y' (-'! USE! d l: 0 build condornin:i.urns in Toronto, Ol" F o r F 'i. n a n c :i. n g t. a k E! o v (~ r' s , IAJ h :1. c h j , s gE!nerally whE!re the tax brE!aks have gone in the pa s t .

ThE! fl.oiAJ-thr'ot~gl·l s har-e, tho119h, was OnE! the fE!LII tax br'E!aks that actuall.y diverted money From Lhe CE!nter of thE! country out t.o thE! rt~gions. By defin :i. t:ion, you cannot ex~lore for gold in downtown Toronto, although maybe people do. I do not know. But t: h i s d i d b d . n g a 1 o t: o f exploration money to Northern Ontiu'io, l·:o places l:lh!

Nor-Uwr'n Saskatchewan, and to OIH' Pr·ovince, obv-iou s ly, •'lnd on that bas ts we were strong supporters of Ud s par t t c 1.11. d r i. n i. l: i a t: :i. v F.! • HOIAJO v e r. d ~; a g e nE:H'•d. pr· inc i p l.c,~ I believe that the grant system is a b n l'. i· or on 0. . r b c l. i.e v c;! .in t: hE! IAJords of AlJ.an BlakenE:~y, IA.iho is l:he For·1nor Prc,~rn:i.(' !r oF Saskt.·lt.cheiAJan a n d t. h E! f o nnE! r' L E! a d E! r of HH:! official Oppos i tion, who sa~d. 11 NE:wer give away you1" tax basE•.

Tf you iH'C;! go:i.ng t:o gi~1e a break 1: o a company, giVE! it t:o l:h(~rn as a grant so thE!Y knoiAJ IAih·i.ch hand is fE!eding thE!rrl, and they knouJ when it can be,~ brought back. 11 So, on this basis, going frorn a t:ax br' E!l'l.k into a grant systE!rn, on gc~nc:~r.:'!.l princi~le I think that is the best: No. 29 Rl498

way ·r. o do it , be c au s e the n t. he companies will know where the money is coming from. So, on this basis, Mr. Speaker, we are quile pleased to see this initiative and we hope something c<.·\n be 1JJorkr:1d out IAJ~dch will achieve the same thing as the floiAJ-through shar·e, but :i.n a manner that ~t is very clear where the benefit "i.s corrri.ng from, fr·om the government itself and from the people of the provinces. MR. BUTT: ~Speaker . MR. SPEAKER: The han. th~1 M:inistc·H' of Ctjlture, Recreation and Youth. MR. BUTT: Mr.

Spc~c::tkr:1r, T would li. kE! to m<'lko just a brieF statement to clarify a nri.sLtndfH'SI .:r::tnd"i.ng yos l:or·d~:~y between me and a reporter, Mr. Murphy. WI'HHl I IAJas corwi.ng l:o i·.he Legislature yr:1sterday, I IA.tas asked for an updclle on r~bies on tho Northern PeninsuJ a. It was done raU1E:1r hun·i.edly. One offi.c:i.dl told rnr:1 that, in fact, yes, three mor'E! h1sl:s hr.H:I come "i.n. T, qt~Jte i n no c e n t1 y , too k that to m·E:1 an that t.:hr·f~e more cases had comE! in that were pos:i.tive, in ot.hE!r words, that the foxes were rabid. In fact, that IAJas not the case at all, Mr. Speaker.

Subsequent to that, I have talked to the reporter, Mr. Murphy, apoJ.ogized to him, and nOIAJ !.dish to put tl·w record straight for thE! public hE!r'e :in thr:1 I.E!g.islaLI.Jr'f!!. Whi l.e I am on my fE!C;!t, for· jus 1·: t hi I" t. y s E! con d s , I want to givE! a 11 hon . mernb~:!rS jt.tst:. a br·i.E!f upda 'l:e as to IAJhat has happenE!d IAr:ith r· a b :i. e s o 11 1-. h r:1 No r t h E! r· n P e n J. n s u J. "' . We have collected to date 1..1499 May 4, 19 B a Vol XI .. eighty-one foxes, tlAJo cats, a dog a n d a r a t , d J. J. of 1.1-J hi. c h h <:w e be E! n sent away and tested.

Only the ini.lJal three, in the Roddickton area, tested positive: thE! onE! thai: broke into l::hc;;1 dog shE!d, that tested positive, thE! onE! whJ.ch IAJas f o u 11 d on t: he d u HIp t r:~ s t E! d p o s i. t i v e , and thE! one that was in Bide Arrn tested posi t.ive. They ar·e I: hE! only three cases to date. We have thr:1 rr:~su1t:s of forty back so, ':in othe;r words, th:irty--seVE!n hatJE! come back nr:1gat.ive. We just helVe the originaJ. three. The other tests will come back; IAJC~ wi.l1 gc~t three or four morE! tomorrow, and five or six more the next day, and so on.

But to date it is just the "in'ii:.ial thrf~e. We haVE! had arct::Lc foxes and coloured foxes tested . The arctic foxes all tested negativeJ.y thirtE!E!I'l Laken, thirteen tested, thirteen negative. :r. h o p c,~ 1:. h t:'l L s f'! 1.: s 1:: h ~=! r' e c o r· d straight on that. Since I have d o n r~ 5. t p I" ·i. tJ a t: (! l 1J t: o r.11 r· . M u r· p h y , IAJho repor'I:E!d the stor·y acctu•at.E!ly, T no1.~-1 apolog:i.:ze l:o l'.l·w gc,Hll.: lEHnan here in the Legislature. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. MR. HISCOCK : Mr. Speaker . MR. SPEAKER : The hon. U1r:1 rnembE!r for Eagle River. MR.

HISCOCK. : We thank the Minister of Agriculture for his clarifying stat.G1ment, for his apoJ.oqy and for his honesty. It onJ.y goes to show that he should not make any statements unless his press secretary checks l::hern. I IAJO u l d s a 1J to L hE! m 'i. n i s t. e r , though, that when hE! is · bring:ing rna t: t: e r· s or c l a r· :i r 'i. c a l: i. on :into t: he House it. tAJOuld be good Lo helVE! it No. /.9 rn4.99

in print to give to members of the House. But.: he did do t.IAJO things. We do thank thE! rrdnister and we hope to have a further update which will show that rabies in t hi s Pro v .i n c e has b r:H,Hl e r· ad i c at tO! d once and for all. Thank you. AN HON. MF.MBER : Mr. Sp~~aker, if I might, just furthE!Y'. MR. SPEAKER: Th~~ han. the mE:~mber· for ConceptJ.on R~y Soul:h . MR. BUTT: Jusl: r:~ rnal·. l:E!r of f-.iFl:EH!n or· 1-.,~Jonl ,.. y minutes ago it came to my ati::c,~n'l::-lon, IAJhEHl I I~Ji.'lS com .i.ng l·:o the House. I dJ.d inform han. ITIC'!rnbE:~rs, p;:~rl:.:i .

CIJl.arl.y thE! mE:!ITlbE~r who represents the area of the Str·ai.t of BellE:~ Is1r::~ (Mr. DE!Cker). I also informed the Leader of the Opposition . Unfortunately, my critic on the other si.de, the member for· Eagle River, was not in the House at the time . 0 n 1 y for that.: , I o b vi o u s l y would haVE! told him what I was about to do. And my han. socialists friends were not here, as well . MR. FENWtCK : Mr· . Speaker . MR . SPEAKER : The hon. Hw rnembc:!r for M<,!rd.hr;d<. MR.

FENWICK : T i:tlll just try'.ing to IA.Ihai'. l arn mor·o upswt-. called a Soc :iali.st or the rni. n i. s 1-: n r· 1 s . figure out I~J'i.-J:h, bEd. ng a fr·ic;Hld of Mr·. Sp<::~aker·, T th t nk tl·ds i. !> r.~ Y'f~d letter day. If I recall correctly, the mini.ster that he was wrong and he an apology to the CBC. has sa .i. d has giVE!n I have,~ and a been in this House three L1500 May 4-, 19 8 8 Vo1 XI.. half years and thJ.s i. s thE! first time I have ever heard it . I think IJ.Je should frame it and SE!nd it over to the Corporation. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear! MR. POWER: Mr . Speaker. MR .

SPEAKER: ThE! _ hon. t:ho Agr'i. cultural M·tn:J.si:or · and of Rur·al, Nori:.hE!r'n D <~ IJ "'~ J o p rn t"! n L . MR. POWER: Mr-.---sp~~a!<or·, +-.oday T IAJOl.ll.d J..il<<'! ·i ... o providE! han . ITIE!rnbers wi. l: h a rE!por·t o n t: h 0. a c i.: i. IJ i t-. i. () :; of t: h e F a r· rn Development Loan Board for the f ·i.s caJ. y<::~dr EHH~:ing Mar·ch 31., 1988. T h e p a s 1:: f t s c a 1. y o d r· h a s b l:! C'! n o n E! of rapid increase in lending act.1v1ty by the Board a s reflected in thE! value of loans :i.ncr E!iH:i.ng by 42 per cent over fiscal. year 1986/87 or from $1.9 million to $2.8 million .

Mr. Speal<c.;!r, thE:~ rnost si.gnificant increase during the past YE!ar was evident in the demand for operating capital and . for thE! pur·chaso of frH'rn equ:iprnE>.nt. Thm·e IAJa s a 1 so a rna r ked inc r E! H s E! :in thE! dernHnd For J.or~ns l·.·. o pur· c h~:u;~) da :ir·y cows. The incrc:~aSE! of acl·:ivity :in t h C::! s r,~ r:·l r· n a s :i. s o b v :i. o u s J. y •·:·l d :i. r· E'' c t. result of the implemen t ation of i: hr,~ C ;~ ni:·ld a /Nf~ IAJf 01 .1 nd l.a nd s 1.1 bs :i. dt a r y agrE:~<,~ITIE'!nt on a loi.VE!St.:ocl< fE!E•d ·t n :i. l: .. i a i·. -i. IJ 0 p r· o g r· r.~ m.

To t ~~ J. d J. s b 'J r· s e rrw n 1-. totalled $2.6 for· thE! million y Ei!dl" and CllJ t s t: a nd :in g J. o an co rrnn 1 t: men l:: s a t March 31, 1988 was $4-00,000 . The total cap:i.t.dl oper'i!lt:ing budget of the Board for the year was $3 rn :illion. No. 29 R1.500

Mr. Speaker, revenue collected for fiscal year 1987/88 has also increased over 1986/87. Revenue collt~C:I"'.(~d fl"Om far·m r:li.enl:~; dur··ing t.hn year· amouni:E!d to $1.5 million, compd.rt~d wi. i·:h $900,000 col lee l:r~d d tJ r :i n g the p r t1 vi o u s y c,1 a r . The loan portfolio of Lha Farm Development Loan Board as of March 31, 19B8 ldas appr·oxi.mah1ly $6.3 nd J.lion. Mr. Speaker, agriculture in NetAJfoundld.nd and Labr·ador is st.i.l1 in the developmental stages with a tremendous amount of potential for future development and expansion.

TIH' recent provincial budget allocated $3 million for the Farm Devel.opmNlt Loan Board, :i.n addition to the $7 50,000 made available for the special. Drought Assistance Programme. Mr. Speaker, it is most E~ncour<.'lgi.ng to !;c-:1c,1 such r·ln j ncrease in J.end:ing acU.vi t:y by t: he F rH' 1r1 D c;t~H:1l. o p mE! n t: I. o a n R o r.H' d and Ur.i s goVE:1rnmE:Hl'l: t.JJ:iJ l continue 1-: o c,1 n c o u r· <:·l g o r'l n d <:l s ~; ·1 ~; I~ f 1.1 r t: h r~ r· devc-:1lopment "in thJ s vc-:lry important sector of our economy. SOME HON. MFMBERS: Ht::1ar, hE!ar·! MR. KELLAND: Ml". SpeakE:1r. MR.

SPEAKER: The han. the member for Naskaupi . MR. KELLAND: Thank you, Mr. Speaker . I thank UH::1 1n:inister for· a copy of his statemE!nt. Just looking through it, he talks about the valu~ of loans having increased some 42 per cent over the previous f:l.s cal year·. I would have lJked l".:o havc,1 SE!C:!n sornelh·i.ng IAJh.i.ch would haVE-) ".ind:i cated some numbers of I. 1. 50 l May 4, 1.9HI3 Vol. XI.. loans that lAJere approVE!d. It is anol--.hor st:at.ist:"i.c, dnd Jt. rn:i.ght give an indication of the level of increasing interest.

Nevertheless, the figures prc,1sc,1n't:1:!d sr,~Hrn l:o :i.nd"i.cal::E! an :increaSE! in the level of JntE!rr:1st j_ n t I·H,1 a g r i c ul '1-: 1.1 r· r::~ 1. ~' E! c t·. o r· o f o u r E!Conomy. I think it is important ti1e1t. !·:.hose :i.nvol.vE=!d J.n i:.hE! industry are striving to br:ing the Province closer towards self--sufficiency in the supply of agricult.tH'al products. I think that is a good thing. I also believe that the government may have missed an ideal opportunity.

If their objective is to 1ncrease production in agricultural arE!aS, I lAJould hHVE! thoLJghi : t:h.:1t: t:hey hdd c:~t least another $15 to $20 million c.~ v d J. 1 a b 1 e l: o t h em , '"'' h i. c h t. h e y p u t into Newfoundland Enviroponics IAI h :i. c h "J. ~> n o t a p r· o v e n p r' o j E! c L b y any lm'ans, it ].s s !:.ill very (~xper'oiln('!ntal. Thc;!y rn;::~y haVE! don('! better a·nd sc,1rved the ProvinCE! a l . 0 l: b <:1 t: I: C:! I" , h i'l d (·: h r:! y d .:i. Y' 0 c L f:! d t. h P extra m".illions of dollars into IAIOY'i:hiAJhi .

J.a r.tnd p1nov c:! n d(:J Y' i. cul. '1-.:IJ r·r:~ l. projects, such as indicatE!d hE!Y'E!; t:hn acq1 .1:isi.l :i.on oF b(:!l::i:c,1r ·Far·rn equipment and the acquisition of morr,~ dd:ir·y an:i.mr:-1J.~; dnd 1-:h.inqs of t:hat nat.ure. To me, when you spend public monpy and your' obj<-:1CtivE~ ts t:o incr'(;!aSE! our leVE!l of self- -sufficj_E!ncy, you should considE!r do::i.nq l::hat in proven, worthwhi1E! pr·ojE!Cts as opposed to something such as Newfoundland Enviroponics, which has no proven vi.abil.ity in the marketplace. MR. SPEAKER: The han. t:he rnc,1lrlbe:H' for M(~n"i.hE!k . MR.

FENWICK: ----·------ .. --Mr. SpE:1aker, just a couple of No. ?.9 Rl r.;o 1.

comments. Since we ar·e talking in this Ministerial Statement about providing assistance to our agricultural industry by way of guaranteed loans and by way of helping to finance the operation, I think thE! one comment that is appropriate at this time is to ask the m'inister what has hafJpened to our agricultural agreement. As the Premier mentioned several days ago or IAiclS "i.t ye:~sb:H'dr~y? ·- 1~1e are the only province in Canada t: hat do o s not hi:~ v H an i'.l g r· i c IJ l. t u r· al agreement. And, quite frankly, Mr.

SpOi:lke:~r, g i . v~~n thr~ d.i.monsion!; of tho one that is bc~~:i ng neg o t i. r.t ~ : c~! d J I;.J hi c h 1 1 J n dE! r-- s ·t a n d t ~> :in t.he naturt::1 of $8 rn:iJlion ovE:~r fi.tJn ye:HH'S, I t.h'i.nk l:hr~ cornmeHd·.s of thl':l people jn the agricultur·al .i.ndus l:r·y sl'lOLil.d br~ ht~i<tr'd, t~Jho hatH:! clainH~d that th:is is much too l.i.ttl.o eHl amount l·.o ~H1 p11tt:"i.ng into it, and that they lAJould hope~~ f o r· a n i~ g r· i c 1.1 1 t u r d l t~ g r· e E:' mE! n t tAd t. h much more generous funding.

As I think the minister has said, as the Premier has said, as everybody has said, we are interested in developing an agricultural industry in this Province; and clearly a project that spends $8 million over five years in an agricultural. agreement wh:ich bE!Comes, quite frankly, less than we put in one shot Jn+:o one;! project: hE!re in St.

John's, the gr'BE!nhouse pr·oj e-:!ct, Jndicat~::~s, l t h 'l n k , t hat IAH~ h a v c~~ o lH' pd. or :l U . e s surnewl'ld ·l:. askew and, cp.li . t:c~ fr•ankly, IAie s h o u 1 d b '"" :i. n l:. t~ r' r:~ s ted t n putt. in g a l.ol: rnor'~'! 111on~:!y J. ni:o pi"O<::Jr'dllllfiC'!!> 1:i.ke -t-.his. I am c:ur·ious to hear·, I).JhE!n !':he;! ln"i.ni.~;l· : r;!r do(~S ge1: 1·.he agt"i cul t..ur·aJ agrEH~n~e~~nt: go'ing, b(;!Ci'IIJSn any agr(~C'!lncnl:: ts C(H'l~i'\i. nl.y g o .i n g to b e b E!

L t e r t h a n lAJ h a t IAJ e hr:-\V(~ hr:·ld for i:hn l.~lst 'four· or Fi.vo years, which has been none. 1..1502 May 4, l. 988 Vol XL Oral Questions MR. WELLS: Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER : The hon. thE:~ Opposttion . MR. WELLS: Mr. Sp(~ake'!r, .i.n days thE!rE! have of l::ht::1 last couplE! of bElen a number of s l: or i_ (! s i. n v a r "i. o 1.1 s n ~=! IAI s rn e d :i i)l. abolJt lAihat is happening LJ.ri.th th~:! Hibr'!r'ni .a pr·oj<'!Cl~. Thdt l.s a matter, as everybody will be awar·r~. of great: conc;r'!l''l'l l:o lfiOSL peopl(.;! in l:hE! Prov'inCE!.

Wh:i1e T reali.ze that we cannot ask the Premier or anybody else to n ~~ g o 1-:. i. a l: H 1 n p 1 .1 b l ·i. c , n (;! tJ (;! I" 1.: h l'~ 1 e ~; s thE!re ar·e cer·tatn matter'S Lhat are of f1JI'ldr'11nc-~ntal concer·n, matl:c:!r's that have been addressed before. ~)o I ask the'!

Prt:!ITl:i.E!r' tf he.:> IAiould now confirm for the House that !:he principles that have been agreed upon by thE! parti .es concE!rl'lE!d c:ontc;!lnplal:e thE:~ construct::i.on wtthin Newfoundland of both thE! gravity based system and the modulE! support syst.E!m, and as rnany of thE! rnodu1E!S <.~s can bo bE! constructed within the Province? PREMIER PECKFORD : Mr. Spc1aln~r. MR. SPEAKER: ThE! han . the PrE:~rn:ier . PREMIFR PECKFORD: ~~;-r:c~----Mr·-. -- s l:;,;·,:l k n I" • lA) h :i.l ~, t 1: h ('! Leader of l: hE! Opposit-::ion says Jn h"i.s prc-~d.rnbl.r:! th;:~"l: you Cdnnot nE!got:ia ·l:E! in public.

What he goes o n l: o r'l s k rn e i.~ n s i:. h i:·l 1': J . s 1.1.1 hat I would be doing. Because the l.(~ade'!r' of Lhr'! Oppos·i !': :io n knotAJS t h a t lAJ E:~ a 1 r E! ad y h a v e a n a g r· ~=! e HH:! n l: IAJ"i.l-:h tho compan·i.<,~s and ft;!dl'!r'al government to build the gravity No. 29 R1502

based structure for the Hibernia proj (,~ct. Tbc:d: has be:HHl agr'f:H~rl on and thert::~fore t ·t is not par"t of t.hc,1 nE!go t: ·i.a l·.i.ons. 111.1 i.~ddi. t·."i.orn:d. industrial benefits form part of tho negol: :i.r.d:i ng pr·ocE!SS H1i:~1: ~~JC:1 ar·e nOIAJ :involved :in. So, Lhcrofore, l::o SAY anyt:h"i.ng I : H~yond ·t-hat I.Uould not be appropr•:iat.e at l h i. s I~ i. me . Obv iousl.y fr·om o1Jr po ·i.nt of vj.~~IAJ IAJe ar·e tr·ying to maximize bE!yond the gravity based structure cts much as we can, and as many i ndustrial benefits to the Pr•ovince as we can.

That, of course, at th.i.s po'i.nt .in t.'i.rne J.s still a matter under negotiation with the federal government and with thE! companies . I IAJas really as to u n de d .i. n l: h H l. as t month , i~ s I travelled around the Province, at the number· of pC:wpl.<,1 IAJho camC:1 IJP to me and, hearing the rumours a b o u t.

H ·L b ~~ r· n .i. a d n d s o o n , s a 'i. d , 1 Are WE:~ going to get the gr·avj ty b d s e d s t r' 1 J c t: u r· e .i. f H i. b G! r rd a g o e s ahead?' And, of course, I guess there has been some ti.me go by and !;orne frustratjon go by as we:1ll on b~~ha:J.F oF (~vr,H'y~wdy, but I ~~JOiil.d just like to clearly state that we won th;:~J- ·. br.~t-.I·.:J.n a nurnb(:~r of yr~r:~rs ago. SOME HON. MEMBERS: HE:1fH', hear·! PREMIER PECKFORO: If Hiber·nia goes aheCI.d it IAJill be a grav.i.ty bas<;!d s'l:rucl-:ure f.lnd "i.l: IAli 11 be b u i 1 t at ComE! By C h a n c e .

ThC:1 Come By Chanu1 s:ite has be<-'!11 chosen for that. _SOME HON. M_EMB E R_§ : Hear, hear! fREMIER PECKFORp: To jt.1st answer the Leader cif the Opposition aga"i.n, 1:~ s s u c c .i. n c t 1. y and as detailed as I can, there Ll503 May IJ., 1.9 8 8 lJ o l. X 1.. are a whole range, as thE! L.eadE•r of t:I'H'! Oppos :U ::i.on I~JC::1l.l. knOIAJS and understands, of other industrial benof-.i-1-:s.

Hf~ hr;\s lrl~~nl-:.ion~:!d on<,', the main support frame, or the module s1.1ppori~ Fr·;:une, I:: he modul.(~s themselves, the structures l: h f~ m s e J.1J <:~ s 1:~ n d 1-.: h n r-:! n g i. n e (;! r "i n g . but there is a whole range of other spin-off ctctivit t es that C 0 U 1 d t a k e p 1 a C E! a rl y lA I h E! r E! i 1'1 t h E! Pr'OlJ-.incr,~ from Por·t: c.·\IJX 8asqu~~s to Mar~stown or wherever. All of t. h o s ~~ a r' E:1 1.1 n d E! r n C:1 g o t:: .i a t :.i. o n between the two governmenis and the companies at this point in time, and have not been finalized. MR. WELLS: Mr. Speaker' . MR.

SPEAKER: The ---'11on -~ the oF Oppos:i.t.ion. M ~..:--~- u_~~ : Mr. SpE!akE!Y', in thE! Estirna t:.E!S Comrn"i.l:l· : (:~e yest(:1r'di.'IY, I b<,~l 'i.t,1VE! t.:h<,1 han. thE! Pr'E!fnier· mentioned 75,000 m;:~n-y<,~<'lY'!; oF ~~JOi"k involved i. n l::h(;! project. Is that the total llli.'ll'l· .. · Yt~i.·\Y'S l:hr:tt: IAd. l. J. bl'! -:i . nvolV(~d 'i.n the whole of Canada in the c on s L r· 11 c: I: -L o n and o p r-;! r· a i· ... i. o n , or· i. ~; that the man-years that is conl~on1plal:od ·for· l•hE:! NeiAJf.oundl.and component of i t? PREMIER PECKFORD: That was 7S,OOO person years . SOME HON.

MEMBERS: HE!ar, hE!ar! MR. SIMMS: And he:1 is twenty years be h:i nd thE! l-: J. mC:1 . PREMIER PECKFORD: And every person in hi.s lifetime - MR. SIMMONS: His or her? No. ?.9

PREMIER PECKFORD: - p1Rys many parts . MR. TULK : His or her lifetime. Not hts lifetime. PREMIER PECKFORD: That is what we predict, 75,000 person-years for what we now knou.J we have as it relates to a gravity base structure. We are now trying to "i.ncrease that amount :in negotiations for additional "i.ndustrlal benefits of the ProvinCE!. MR. WELLS: Mr'. SpeakE! In . MR. SPEAKER: A f1na1 supplt=~rnentary. MR. WFL.L.S: What T. c\ s ked t-. h (~ P r c,~ rn·i. t:! r· to clear was: Was that N(~IAJfoundl.dnd · cll.On(:! or· For IAJhoJ e of Canada?

P R EM1 E F~ IDECKFORD: ll'lakn for· i:he WhE!n I arn so implies say 75,000 person-years, I parochial that it always just Newfoundland. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hc,~ar, hear! MR. FENWICK: Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKEr~: The hon. the rnembt=1 r f cw Me->. nd1 i. k . MR. FENWTCK: . ---My question ts to the Min:ister R ('! s p o n s "i. b l. (~ f o r· N (~ 1..11 F o u n d 1. H n d Hydro, Ui(~ Finance Minis t~~r (Mr. W :i. n d s o r· ) . T. t: h <.·\ s 1". o c:J o 1..11 i. 1 h a s t a t. en 1 (~ n t. i. n t h e a n n u a 1 I" E:~ p o r t· of N(:!IAJfrJIIndland Hnd IAbrr.·Hior· Hydr·o.

The sti:d:E:~merl'l~ :is on pag(! 18, and "i. 1:-. r' (~ d d s I I T h e s f~ Fa l) 0 l.l r' r:~ b J. f:! chi:lnges re:~suJ h'd :in Hydro E:~arn:i ng L P>04- May t~, 1988 Vol.

XI. in excess of its rC:~t:IH'n on :U:s customers. 1 And· to explain that re!bate in thE! rna nth s 'i. n 1. 9 8 8 . approVE!d ratE! of sales 1:-.o retail then it goE!S on there will be a first couple of My question to the Ministe~ is: Does this mean that the rates that have been established for Hydro ar·e l'lOIAJ so lri.g h t:ha 1:. i. t oi s actually breaking tl1e J.aiAJ IAJhen :l.t. r· e c e i v (;! s the 1. e v () 1. o r- r· e v E! n_u (;! t: h a t: it. is 9E!tting? MR. SPEAKER: ThE! hon. thE! Minis t.er of Finance . MR. WINDSOR: I thank the,~ hon. gNltlernan For· ask·i.ng lOP. i:hf:l.i: que~>t:i . on.

He may recall about 'I:IAJo IAH~E!I<s ago I ·i n F o r rrtn d U·H,~ . II o 1.1 s ('! H1 t'1 1·. 'i. n f d c t Hydro had ear·ned rnor'E! rnon~:!y than t h r~ y 1..1H:! r· (:! o n t-.:i. t·. l. C'! d t: o u n d (H' H1 ('! PubJ.ic Utilities Board r· c,1 g u 1 a t i o n s , 1..11 h :i c h r· o q u l. 6\ 1·. ('! l:: h (;• rates that they must charge and the i:\TnOtll1t oF r'Ed:l.lr'n thai: l::ht;!y can on their investment. I haVE! to sr.ly i::hc.~i:. I IAJas IAJY'ong in what I ·said to thE! House, bEl cauSE!

T i.nforrned the Hous<;! that Hydr·o has earned sorne $1.3 million in excess and that amount IAJouJ.d be returned to consumers through NE!IAJfoundland Light and POIAJE!r. I u.1as tJJrong in that stai:E!TnE!nt. It:. i.s actur.d.l.y $1..6 rn:iJl'i.on, Mr'. Speaker, not $1.3 rnilJ.ion. HElrE! 'i.t. ·says $1.. 7 which IAJi.ll. bE! r·etur·ned. We arE! not brE!aking thE! l.diAJ.

Th(~S~·~ ar·c,~ l':hi"OI.Igh var·.i.anC('!S and various things such as -L n t: ern s l·: r· <.·\ t (;! s , +:hE! · sa lfl<:! t: h "i. n g s that r·efJ.E!Cted VE!r'Y pos:itiVE!ly on thr~ PI"OIJ:i.nc() 1 S b11dgt,~t For· last: year and gave us sorne very posit1vn vHri~nces and decreased the projected deficit from that 1..1Jh:ich '~IdS pr't'!dJ.c i·.ed l.c:tst y(:!al". ~3o it is not a matter of breaking the · No. 29 Rl50lJ-

law but simply a matter of earning more than had bE!tHl atTt.i.d.paH:1d ~nd, quit-.~1 properly, it shall be rE!tur·nod t:o i:.h~~ consttrnor·s of tho Province. MR. FENWICI<: Mr. ~)pod k {i!t'. MR. 3PEAKFI~: A r.uppJ ~HTll::!ntary, t.ht~ hon. the motnbor for· Mon i.h~1k. Ml~. FENWICI<: As the,, mTi·d s hH' i ndi Ci-l te s I thE!rE! iH'~:! d numbc:H' of fa c t:or·s c1.w s "i. ng that, otH::1 of which is lotAJer interost rates, exchange rcltes chang:lng tAJ'.i.th the Canadian dollar· getting stronger, and also w"i.th the pr·ice of oil going down.

My qtJesU.on to t:he rn"i.n i.ster· i.s t.his: G:iven that thE! circurnstanCE!S J.ast y.:.~ar tJJ(;!rE! t·:.hr::1 most c-?.xtr•(:!HH~ I~.Jr::1 hav<-?. ever had in terms of oil fired generation in other words, 43 per cen·t of our· eJ.ectricity cornE!S from that - and thiilt that "i.s not li keJ.y to con t.inue, u1ouJ.d not thE! minister acknowledge that it is qu:He JikE!ly that the excess p r· of i. t s f o r H y d r· o t h i. s y e i:'l r· , 1. f 1~1 o get any decent rainfall, are likely ~o bo con~ Lrlerc:1bly higher than that as IJJe decr'E!ase the arno11n1-. of oil.

Uv\1·. 1~18 usc~ i'll'lc:l t"r:!l.y on out" hydi"O gerHH'atJon? In ot:.hE~r IAIOincJs, IAIOUld f::ho rrri.n:isi':f:H' ;:~r:3t'C~P th~t we are lJkeJy to see even 9 r e cl t: e r o x c n s s c,1 iH' rd. n g s by Hydtno t.hcHI IAI~1 had last y<,'i'H', g·i ven thi:1t l·h<,1 sat11e fac l·:or·s i:.hr.·1'i': d:Jd Jt. 1ast yE:1ar· are ged:ttng even more Favourable to us this year? MR. SPEAKE I~: The hon. the M'inisi:E!r of Finance . MR. WINDSOR: No t n e c c;! s s a r· i l. y , M r . S p e a k <-?. r . the han. gE!ntleman would r·ecall thE:~ st.at.E:HTH~nt that l to the HoUSE!, informed the T.f also made HOUSE!

Ll50f.) Mr.~y 4-, l9!l8 Uol X·l.. that because of some positive variances wo have not sought a ratE! increase this vear, even though, ob1J-i.ously costs l·.:o Hydt"O are increastng, salar·ies and o t.h~H' j . i·: c.:! m:. r.tt" e :i. n c r· r::1 ;:~ :> i. n g t: o H y d r· o , b u t bE:1cause of positiVE! varianCE!& 1.1.JE! had no i·: ,:,1ppJ.-i.(:!d f'o'r· d r'd l:.e increase and IJJE! do not tnt~;:n1d t·.o r.lppl y for· one i·.h-i. s ye;;tJ" r,1t t:hPr', Mr·. Speaker. MR. FENWICK: () f i n r.ll s u p p J. ('! rn (! n 1·.: r:H' y , M r· . ~) p f!ij\ I< ~'! r· . MR. SPEAKER: A final supplementary . MR.

FENWICK: G'i.v~:!n l:.hr:1t Hydro 1 s op<,H'at-lons, not. CFLCo 1 s but Hydro 1 s, clre at til r e c o r· d 1 e v <'! 1 , t h a t p r o f oi. t s ,:;n· €~ doublE! what Uwy WE!Ine t1..110 yE•ars ago, tAJoul.d not t:h<,1 tn:i.n:i.sbH' ask Hydro to J.ool< at H:s pr·oj ecU.ons notAJ and see if a rate decrease can bE! put into E!ffect notAl, 1..11hich obvi.ously tAJ:i.l.J. b<->. t : r·anstn:tl: : t:.~:!d through NetAJfoundJand Light and P o IAI (;! r· I~ o l:: h (,1 i'l v e r· a g E:! c o n s u rn C'! t" ?

Will not the mjnister commit hi111self t:o SE:Hdng i.f t.:hC'! consurJJ(:!t"s of· th :i s Province can ged: a r·(~Rsonabl.r,, br·c;!ak, g1.v:::!n I·: hi:~ t "i.n all pr·obal:dl i t.y they ar'E! going to hr.wr~ l:o r·ei':l .tt"n Lhn mon<~y i:·1 y~:H:'ll" from notAJ anytAJay? MR. SPEAKER: T h c h o n . t: h (~ i"'-i. n :i. s t. (;! r· o f F 'i. n a n c e . MR. WINDSOR: Mr. Speai<E!r, I haVE:' alre<:ldy done that.

As I have ind"i.cated, we earned some $1.7 million surplus 1 a s t. y e:1 r.1 r· t h a t i,~., .i. l. 1. b <'! r· c;! t: u r· n e d t. o consurrtE!rs, and I haVE! cllt"E!ady "i.nd:i.catc;!d to t.he l·louse i:hc.~t. that should be reflected in power bills 'i.n HH~ rnoni:.h of July, I think, through the retailer, wh:i.ch is Ne1.~o1foundl.and L-i.ght and Po1 ... 1er, and that these factors arE! consjdE!rE!d No. ?.9 I~ 1.505·

j n thE:~ r·ates thr..tt tAlE:~ are appl yj ng for nHxt yc,~r'lr, 1~1h·ich i.$ U10 Sr:-llflr~ rate. We may well have a small SIH'pl.IJS, W~~ lfli!IY not:. WE! TlklY haVE:1 r:l sn1alJ. dE:lf:icit. Because of our ,,~qual. "i.1.at. i.o n pr·og rarrnne d n noun c Eld three years ago, whereby we can sprEli'ild iHlY v;:u·"Lances ovc,~r d three-year period, thereby e 1.:1 rrl'i. n a t i. ng t h e n e e d f o r t h e c o s t of fuel adjustment, which tA.Jas a very positive move, Mr.

Speaker, o n b d1 a 1 f of t hi s go v e r n rn El n t , we can make those kinds of adjustments over a three-year p e Y' i. 0 d a tl d , t: h e Y' e f 0 Y' El , cHI y S U Y' p l U S will irideed be returned. MR. SIMMON~): Mr. SpE:~akE:H' . MR. ~3Pf.AI<.FR : MR . SIMMONS : [ h<'IVO cl qi .II,'S-1:.-i.on For· i·.hr:! M-i. n·"i.st:C.:ll" of Forestry. It relates to the report IMh"'i.ch IH~ mr.ldE~ p1.1bJ. ·i. c <:~ coupJe of days ago. It is curious that l.:hc:~ HousEl IAii:~s not appri.SE!d fj rst of that particular rElport. I am s 1 J r C"l y o 1.1 IAJ.i l l. d g r· E:1 e , M r· .

S pea k e r· , IAI e h a v e s e El n 1 e s s e r i.ssues dc,H~lt. IAI.i.th by Min"i.st.er.ial Statements. But· that aside, I want to ask the minLster: In view of the findings, which indicate that just about one ·-f-Lft. :h of the-?. birds involved would be adversElJ.y affected wLth potentiaJ.ly life threatening implications, of the 1. 9 H 7 mo n i. hH' i ng pr·og rarnrnc,~ on fenitrothion, would the minister lndlcate whether the results of thJ.s report j n any L11ay alter- thE! COiilpos-Lti.on of l·:ho dc:lp<:lr'l·.:rnent' s 1988 spray pr-ogramme? MR. SPI::AI<FR : Thn hon.

L h r~ Mi. n O"i. s 1: P r· of For· o ~; l: Rosourcc,~s. L1S06 May 4-, 1988 Vol XL MR. R. AYLWARD: M r· . S p ~~"' k e r , 1 IM!i\ n 1:: t: o than k t: hE! hon. gentleman for his question. 1 1-. -i. s c o r t r.t i. n 1 y a v El ,~ y :i. rn p o r '1:. a n t. question for the Department of For'('lstr·y. t guc"lSS l::hc-:1 bot:.torn J. .. LnEl of thE! wholE! rE!port. that IAicls released shows that the findings of the two studies we have done in the past hAlO years on l::h~>. aFfE>.C't. on songbirds from fE!nitr·othton spray programmes are inconclusive.

The repor·t Finds the~e were potentially J.ife threatE:~ning circurnstancEls ·in 17 per cent oF the songblrds collected after the spray pr·ogr'a111111e, Mr·. SpE~~'lkE!r. The actual facts of the matter are thc:1r1-:l l~ll'lY'E:l no acl-.11.:-ll d~:lad songbirds found J.n the spray areas 1". h <:'I t·. I~H:l r r~ l o o k ~' d <.·l l. . T g 1.1 e !> s 1:: h e most important. thin~J, ·MI".

SpeakE:ll", i.s ·l ... h<.·ll·: l:ho only b""i.r·ds 1:-.hey could ftnd to do labor·at.:OI"Y oxpE'lY'irnE:lnl:s on 1~101"e b-i.r·ds l.hdl: IAJOI"t'l shol :: ~~ri.t:.h 410 s~10tguns, and :i.n l:.hesEl b-.lr·cls i": h r~ y d i. d f .:i. n d t: he r· r,~ 1.~1 l'' I" (,1 !> orne strElSS factors, Mr·. SpeakElr. And T IAIO 11 J. d J rna g ·i. n c,~ t. h a i~ "i. f I IAH;l r· t'! s hot at. wt t h a 4 1 0 s hot g u n t h El y ~~IOLll.d fi.nd som~'! st.r'e!;s fact.or·s :in my brain also, Mr. Speaker. Not to diminish the effects on songb:i.rds, Mr.

Speakc-:lr', .it. is important to note that the dc,1part:mc:1nt th'i.s yc,,ar· hr.~s oi.ncr·~>.asr:1d by a little more than 100 per cent 'i.t's pl.c1ns l:.o us~~ Bl:. spr·ay in thr:! control of hemlock J.oopE!r :i. n thj s P r· o v i. n c E:~ . We h c\ v (-?. g o n E~ f r· o m l c;l s s t:han ll pE!r CE!I1l up t:o 2S pE:!r UHlt 1~1i . t:h thr~ Bt: spr·ay pr·ogr'drnrnt:l this year·. Wo had an expE!r·tmontal pr·ogrdii'IITIE! lc:·\st·: yE:lar· us""i.ng differ·ent. for·mu1at:.lons of Bt s p Y' (\\ y ' A n d IAH~ f 0 1.1 n d CJ 0 (I d In til s 1.1 l 1": s IAI':i t h D J a fl E:1 J. 1. 7 6 , IAI h .i.

C h :i S a V El r• y poi:tHli ... fH: For'11111lr:\ ned: Y'E'l~ri.si:EH'od tn Canada to date, Mr. Speakor, <:~ n d 1·: h d 1·:

I) It:-\~; n IAH,~ l J. .. con 1-.: r· o 1 J El d , No. 29 R1506

s c:i. c,1 n t i f t c , e x p e r ·. i. 111 e n t. a l. programme. What we intend to do th'i.s yE:HH', Mr. Speaker, ·i.s use these findings under a IAJell.-cont.r·oll.E!d pr·ogrr:~nnnt~ and tr·y to tr·anslate them into a r·egular cornmericaJ. sprcty pr·ogramuH,1. We have committ :E!d our·seJves to using Bt for· up to 2S per· cC:m!~ of our spr·ay progretmme th:i s yc,1ar·, Mr. Spo~kE:1r. MR. STMMON3: Ml" . SpE!akel". MR. SPF.AI<FR: nw hon. t 1'1("! rnembe r f () r· F Olntu ne - Hc,H'IIIi. t.r.~ge. MR.

STMMONS: If the minister were pr·act. i.t.ionc,H' he wo1Jld patient's problem by au l::ops y, "i. t S CH1HIS. a medical d ' i.c~gnose t.hE:1 way of an The report is quJ.te conclusive in one respect, I say to the mjnister, that 1.vhe!re thE!re was double swathing or a second spraying the birds did not recover. No1~1, IAJhat do you have ~ : o have, dE!ad bir·ds before he is convinced? Wh i.l.e hi.s stud i es Hlay bE:1 conclusive the t1.venty year·s of research 'i.n New Brunswick ctre vary concJus:Lve on th-.i.s pr.lrttcuJ.ar po .i.nt·:.

MR. :HMMS : ThE:1y do not havcO! a h"!mlock looper i. n 1\J(~IAJ l1r11nswi . ck.

f) i. cJ y 0 II k n OIAJ that? MR. SIMMONS: Nor t·:h~~ 1r1:L rd. s h :!r . Mr. Sp<~akE!r, tn li.ght: of t.hoso findings, I ask thE! m:i.niste!r why does he and his department not elect to go completely with Bt? The:1y r.n·e go""i.ng sorn<,1 1Aihr:~t. i.n that. direction , but IAJhy do they not go w:il:. h a Bt spr·ay, 1.v~dch ·i.s found i:.o L1507 May 4·, 1988 Vol XL be much more effective without. the kinds of side effects we arE! talk i ng about in thts report? MR. R. AYLWARD: Mr·. Sp<:H'l kt~r . MR. SPEAKER: The hon. thE! M:inister of For·est R 8 :; o 11 r· c r;! s . MR. R.

AYLWARD: Mr:- Sp8a ko~·i. t ·i. s i.n l".t"!r'<,1S-f-.·i ng l·.o 3ee that the official Opposition h ;:~ s al j , g nod 1.: h ('! 111 s e J. v (~ s '"' i. t. h !": he Socialists in this House of ASS(!Irlbly to plr:~y l~uss..-i. an roul( :!l:: te, Mr, SpeakE:1r, v.Ji th thE! lJ.VE!S of t h ()IJ sands of p eo p 1. e .i. n v o l v ~ : ! d in the forest jndustry of this Pr·ov··i.nc(,1, MR. R. AYLWARD : Mr.

Speaker, one quote from the s t u d y r· E:1 a d s , ' R l. o c I< s U·1 f.l !": h a d t: h e highest amount of fenitrothion depos i t on foliage samples did not yield songbirds with the highest CHE rlepreusants, Mr. Speaker, IAJ~1ich shoiAJS Lhat:. LhE:1 st:ud-:iE!S donE· <:·lr'r:! noi: conr:l.IIS·i,Jc;!. That: .i. s all lkle ar·e saytng, Ml". SpE!akE!r. Tl·wr·e dr·r:! 1.7 pr;!r' c:nni: of th(:! songb·i.r·cls c:oJ:Jected Lhat shoiAJed a potE:1ntjaJ. l ·i. f e ·- t: h r· r~ r'l i : r"! n 'i. n g !> '"i. t 1.1 ~~ t: ·i o n .

Non C:! of thE'rn diE!d, but th(H'e IAII'.l S r~ potentictl life - threaten i ng sj.t.uat:i.on. That is what t. hE! ~> tt~dy s h o IAI s , M r· . S p ~~ d I< ~:! r· . M r· . ~) p (;! a k <:! r· , it :i.s interesting to note that fr·om t:hf'! b""i.r·ds l:".huy stud:i1,1d t:hE! SE!COnd spray shOWE:1d a }E!SS E!ff<:!Ct on songb "i. r·ds t.hr.ln d""i.d ont:! spr·ay. Again, Mr. SpE!akE!r, th:is shoiAJS that the studies are ""i.nconclusive. No. 29 R1507

l: h-i.s yC:~rH' agr.d.n l~ o c:onl ·: ·i.n110 1.4ri. l:h the s tud'ies wi t.h o.u1n fE:~ n:i 'LI"oth'ion s p r a y p r· o g r· a IIIIIIC~ . I;J '~ h ;:-w o ctl. s o j ncr~>.asE:~d by ovc-:~1" 100 per·cent our· LISt,~ of 81: i.n Ults Pr·o,J.incc,~. f"'r. Sp~::~aln:~r, but we ar·e not IA.rilling to p l. R y 1~ u s s 'i. a n r o • 11. ~:! ~.: t. c,~ lAd L h t. h o J.jves of thousands of Ne1.1.1f o IJnd 1 i:l nd ~H'S IAlho dE! pE! nd upon the for·ests. Mr.

SpE!aker·, the budworm infestation we had a couple of years ago has had very sc.;!ri.ou~; consequc.;!ncc"'s, and IAlH ·have five to seven years to salvage budwor-rn "i.nfE!sted wood . Bui: with the hemlock looper infE!Station we have two years to salvage the 1.uood . We cannot play Russian roulette w'ith the lives of the thousands of NE!IAlf ou ndland e r s who depend upon the forests of this Province for a livehood . MR. CILBfRT : Mr· . Sp(~i'lkc,'r . MR. SPEAKER : The hon. the member· for· Burgc,~o - B<'ly d'F.spo"ir. MR. GtLBER 'r : T ha n k you , M r . S pea k e r .

I have a question for the P r· e 1n-i <:~ r . I ~.un s tJ r· e t h a t Hw Pr·emier· is awar·e that in the E! s t.:irna h~s for· tJ1 i. s y c,~ar· thE!r'c.;! "i. s the figure of $10 million being s p E:Hl t t o o p e r· a t e t h E:~ i n t r a - .i s 1 a n d ferries, the intra-Province fen· -Les, I suppose. I am sure the Premiar is al.so aware that in 1977 the British Co l.urnb i.H go v E! r· nul~'! nt negot. i. cl t E!d a deal w:-ith the federal government IAlht:H'(:~by fl. C.

IJ.lOUJd i:~S Sl.llllf~ respons:-ibility for the operation of like Ferr"i.cs "i n Hrit"i.sh Columbia but there was a provis:-ion -L n t. h I'll': i:·1 g r· o <~ m<::! n I~ 1 .. h r.·1l~ 'i': h 1,~ F r;! d r'! r t.·1l. I. ·1 SOB Mi:ty 4·, 1988 Vo'l XL gOI)fH'nrnt; !nl~ '~lould p;:~y t.Hl annual. rent, an annual fee to British C o 11.1 rn b ·i. r.~ f o r 1.: h r~ o p o r· d 1:: .i. o n of these ferries forever. Now 1.uhy, two YE!ars latE!r, d:id his golJOr'nlnl::'nt. n<:!go-t.:i.dt.r;! a F"i.vc;! yc;!c~r· deal with the federal governmont for the operation of the ferries? MR. SPEAKER: The hon . the Premier .

PREMIER PECKFORD: M r . S p ~~a k e r· , I IAIO u 1 d have g E! t. t: he details of the agreement between the f~:!der'dl gOVE!r'l'llriC;!nt. and !::hE! British Columbia government to see IJ.l h C.;! t hE! r i. n fa c 1: t.: h c,' a 11 C.;! g at j. o n that IAle arE! looking at 1 apples and apples' is redll.y Vcll.id. MR. GILBERT : Mr. SprH~kr~r, a supplelllc'!l'lhH'Y. MR . SPFAKER: (l S1.1 pplr)rnnni: .r:·1rlj, l:hn hon. thP n1<:~mber for Bur·gE!O - Bay d 1.Espoil". MR.

GILBERT : T h <:~ f :i. g 1 1 r· r~ s t h d t f g o L s h o IJ.l t: h d t we are looking at 1 appJ.co~s and applP.s I' Mr ' Prc;!rll"i . ~H'' r.'tnd I IAl i.sh you would, get the details on Rr·'i.i·::i.sh Colurnb:i.i'l. Your· gov<~r·nrnc'!nt negotiatE!d in 1985 for clonE! YE!al" agr·eeiiiE:~nt, dnd then -Ln 1986 anothE!r one year agrE!E!ment t.o opc.;!r•at.e t.hc"' fc-HT ·oi.es, at a t:.ime when the federal Minister of Transportation was our representative in the Cabinet, (Mr·. Cr·osb i.e;!).

Why, t.hc;!n, d:icl IAlE! not negotiate a deal similar to t. h c,~ o n e l:. h a t t. h e:~ y h e1 v e:~ "i. n B r· i t.: :i s h Columbia? MR. SPEAKER: ------ PRFMTER PECKFQ.B_Q: M r· . S p e a k t:H' , a s I s a i d , I IAl i. 11 g E! t U·w "i. n f o I"Hk1 l::i. on r:-1 nd l. C:! t. 1-.I'H:! ho n . No ·. 29 RliJ08

member know later how I feel about the two different agreements. MR. GILBERT: Mr·. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: A f-Lnal SIJppl.c-:!HIC:~ntar·y the hon. the member for Burgee- Bay d'Espoir . MR. GILBERT: Mr. Sp~~akc:1r, I th .i.nl< tho Prt:Hni.or :.houJd, b~H:ause Jt. seE:1ms. right. nOIJ.I fr'Oifl IAII'li'll··. l))f~ hodr' l:hr'l{-. t:hoy r:·une cut t j n g b a c I< the f c,n-r y s E:H' vic E:1 in N~:!IAIFOI.II'ldl.r:\11d, so l:h~H··c,1 lfiiJS 1: bo reetsorrs fo1n j t. You ar·e going to d o ·i.!: , i.H' e y o 1.1 ? MR. ::>PEAKFR: T h ~'! h o n . -t. h n P r· e rn i e r· . PREMIER PECKFORD: Oh, yes. I am Y(~S, Mr·.

Spc,1ak(H', . l L . go:ing to "do it. T ;:~rn go"i.ng 17.0 do Yc.;!sterday the hon. rnernber -For Menihek (Mr. FemJJick), asked me a quest-ton about free trade, where he went through a little list here shOIAilng only 400 or 500 J"H:11AI jobs going to be created. Today in AnSIAJer·s to QIH:1st:i.ons For IAih i.ch Notice:1 has be,en Given, I arn going to tc,~l.l UH,1 hon. IIIC-:!HI~H~r l:hr'lr. he,~ J~::1ft out 2,517 serv:jc:E! jobs that are going to be credtod within the free trade. r · got the information for HH:! hon. Tfii'!Hib(!r' +:od;:·1Y kH1Ca1.1se T. pJ"orrrised h:irn so . yc-:!sh·H·day. MR.

GlUit~RT: T ;:-lfll s u r p r· i. s t'! d about tiH~ B.C . federal civil laughing at us. I"'R . SIMMS: )/ 0 II d 0 1'1 0 i·. a g r· e ~~ rn<,~ n t . s r:! r· v i'l n 1: s k l'l()l!l The You shoul.d noi-. bc,1 yell."lng across the House. PREMIER PECKFORD: L1509 May IJ., 19 8 8 Vol. XI,.. I tabled some information yesterday as a result. of questions the day b"'~for·e . And I arn not going to discriminate againsi: r.~ny hon. rnelflber oppos·i.t. (.;~, Mr. Speaker. I Hlink just as much of t.ht~ uH,~rn~H~r for Bur·g(;!O Bc:~y d' Espo:i.r as I do for thE! membE!r fo1" Pol"t. de,~ Grc:1v"'~' jusi:. i!tS much.

You both can sit at the same table i'1nd hd•J(:1 l··.he Sdlllf~ arnounl: of por-r :idgE!. MR. SIMMS: r. n o 1": I·H:! r IAHH' d s , t: h c,1 ;:HIs lliCH' ·i. s y ~'! ~; . MR. EFFORD: Mr·. SpeaT(er·. MR. SPEAKER : ThE:~ hon . the member for Por·t dE! Gr·avc,1. MR. EFFORD: ~hank you, Mr. Speaker . I d o 1 t I< e p <H' r• ·i. d g E:~ , t o o , s o I t E! l 1 t.I1E! hon. Prern:lE!r, I do l:ikE! it. I have :i.t BV(.;!Y'Y IIIOI"rLing for breakfast, but I arn very par·t."i.cul.ar· about l:hc'! company I keep when eating that porridge. Mr. Speaker, my question is to the M-i.nis !··or· oF H~~aJ.I·:h (Dr. Co] l:i.ns).

For the last number of years we hAve bef:!n qu:i.l-.e conc~:,r·nE!d about: the proposed clinic at Corne By C h d ncr~ . lrJe h i'1 d (,~ x p e c i:: E:! d , M r· . S pea I< e r· , j n r· (:' c EHI t '"'' e (:1 k s t:. o g e t so111r~ i:1nno•lncc,1rn~-;!nl·. on t:hf:! cli.nic i:lnd IAihPr·c,~ thE! mattr:~1" pi"E!SC;!nt1y si::r:~nds. I lliOIIl.d l. :i. k I'! l~o r:·\ ~; k t: hc,1 Mi. n i.~; t.E!Y' of H<.;!alt:h IAJhat arE! h·:i.s :intE!ntions or 1·. h c,~ t n i· E~ n t: -i. o n s o F h i. s dE!partmE!nt on t: he clJ.n:ic at CornE~ By Chan c n? T s -i. t. g o-L n g 1:: o b ~~ a twenty-four hour a day clinic?

Are there go-i.ng to be any additional services put in that No. 29 RP:i09

: particular clinic? MR. SPF.:AKF.:I~: ThE! hon. H1E~ M'i.rdster· of Hc,1alth. DR. COI .. LJNS : Mr· . Speaker·, J ctm g 0 {: i:t.l.l l". h 0 IAJ(H' d S said, so :if I not l-. hc,1 do quib~ sur·e I hon. IIH'!IIlb(~r not answer precisul.y perhaps he can ask ~ supp1E:11TIE:1ntary on thE! matter. My u nders tand"i. ng i. s t.hd t he j IJ s 1·. asked what do we visualize for the . future - r.i!L S I Mr:1_§ : When are you going to announce it. . DR. COLLINS: When! Oh! The Come By Chance cli.n"lc, l'i.ke many of the:1 health institutions Jn the Prov:i.nCE!, is under review.

We review these cl-.in:ics, hospitals, nursJng homE!S, SE!rV i.CE!S and so on on <.·\ per i.od i.e basis, Cc!SpecJalJy :if a par·ticular· fac l.:OI" i'1t:IS COIIW llfl th~ l: dti"OCh:: our attentjon to them. 1\!0IAJ, onn of l-.hr'! f<:~c 1-.or·s -:i. n l".h;:~t·: ar·E~a the hon. the Premier· r· E! f ('! r· r· e d ·1·. o i. 1- . i. !; 1: h r:t 1: -i. 1: 1. o o !( s at ·t-.hot.lgh it. i.s going to be an i. HIp o r· 1:: a n 1: -;_ n cJ u s i:r· J R l b ;:~ s e f o r l: h F.! Pr·ovince. SOME I·ION. MEMBFRS : H c->. a r , h e a r· !

DIL COLLINS: It already Ls to a very great degr·eE! :in ter·ms of thE! refinE!ry, but there are many other things that. i:l.l"e very likely to happen tn that area. So, clearly ts our r· e s p o n s i b i 1 i t y to try to forE! t e 11 IAJ h a t s e r· v i. c E:! s IAri 1 1 b c,1 n e e d c->. d s o t•J E! can anticipate demands. One of the Uri.ngs that. IAJe hau<,1 bE~en do:i ng, and I have b~1en doing tA.dth l:he I·H;!lp of the IIIE!fnber· for· Bel]evuE:~, (Min. Callan). I. l'Jl.O May 4-, 1988 Vol XI... SOME HON. MEMBERS: Ht~,:lr', ~H~dr! DR.

COLLINS: 1~1~10 is extr·eme]y knot.<JledgE~abl"! c:\ b 0 1.1 t t: h e iH' () C:'l I iYI n d 1'1 d s tc~\ k (c1r1 61 grE:1at interest in ·the thing I IIIUSI-. Sdy he hc:'IS i:.i:~kon. i:'\1'1 .J. nt:E:H'('!SI:. in the health services in that iH'C:1a for· many, TJI!HlY yoar·s . F.uE~n whEHl he IAJas on HIE! othe~r sidE! we USE!d t·.o haVC:1 1--i.l:-.t.lE! chal::s back i.'lnd forth, I think quj_te amicablE• C ha-t-: !) I c:;l_ b () (,1 t t: h E:1 S (;! r• V .1. C (~ S (I u t there. So the member has been VEH'Y hc;!lpful. t6 rnE:! ·i.n tr·ying l:.o define what changes we should make out tht:!r'e .

Now, the han. member asked when thr:tt process will be concluded. I can say it is ongoing. I arn not in a posit:Lon yol-. to say exacl::ly what and exactJ.y when, but: he cr.n1 be assur•(;!d thr:ti: l:h "i. s · i~; a VPI"Y active, ongoing process. Ml~. EFFORD : A suppllc1ff1Cc11'l'l:iH'Y, Mr· . Spc;!al«=!r. MR. SPEAKER: A s 1.1 p p 1. (~ IIW rlt: i.H' y ' t: he h 0 n . member for Port de Grave. MR. EFFORD: I !>uspPct:, Mr·. SpeakE!r', i:hat:. it. -.is on J. y r· (~ c en t: 1. y 1:: he M -i_ n ·i. s 1-.: o r· of Health started to J.tsten to the h () 1'1 , fll (:J Jll b ~:! r r () r• 0 0 l.l. (:' V u e I b ('!

C i:~ U ~;('! thE! formE!r Minister of HE!alth (Din. Twomey) certainly dLd not listen J.ast year of thE! YE!ar· bE!fore. I suspE~ct lt. is just:. Ln r'E:1U:!nt. weeks. I am very glad to hear t:hat CornE! By ChiHlCE:1 .i.s now going to haVE! a 24---hour clinic, a] though l:.hc-:! ln·i.n'i.st-.E!Y' d'i.d not cornc,1 out and say so directly. Seeing that we h;:·\Ve ~;o111e monE!Y to put i.nto d t.he cJ.i.nic for Come By Chance, I IAJant 1: o 1:: "i. C:' -HH~ I: "i. n 1: o 111 y n e x ·t. q u E~ s t ·i. o n , a very important question concern-i.ng the presenl-. horrendous No. 29 R151.0

s.ituatlon Cornpl(-:!X. ~t the Health Sciences I 1.11ant to give the rn:i. nl s tor· ;;, tAd 11 aJ.low quick example, i.F you me, Mr. Speaker. MR. SIMMS: You have only one minute left. MR. SPEAKER: Order, please! MR. EFFORD: Wo u 1. d l:: hE~ 111 i. n :i. s t: E! r· f:1 x p J. a ·.in t: o t:lri. s Houst1 how cond:i·Uons at. th~;:1 H<::1alt:h ~)c i.~1nces cdn cont: ·i nue <:·1!> thHy hr~\IJO been for the last number of utonl:hs, t,~,Ji . t:hottl-. onough bc,1d:; in l:hr;! j n hHl s j v E~ c a r· e u rr:i t·. tAd -t h o u t E:Hl o u g h o p <:! r· r.1 1·: ·i_ n 9 r· o o rn s p c:l c e ?

L r:-:t s i: F t" i. d '" y rdght a gc,1ntlf:Hiian had <Hl acc:i.dent IAJh(:1r'f:! hr:! brokf~ '" h"ip, tAJr:-1:; pt"r,1ppod for the operation for three s 1.1 c Ct:! s s ·i.v ~~ di:'IY s, dnd l'lf!!VC,1r go 1·: t:o the operating roo~ until Monday n"i.ght:, anrl l::hE!I'l only b(,1Ci:'ll.lSC:! thE~ d o c t o r· h a cl t o I< ::i. c k u p a r· a c k e t to gE!t hi.rn ""i.nl:o l·:hE! opc,1r·ati.ng r·ootn. These are continuous examples. When ls the minister going lo provide money enough so this s"i.l:uat.::ion can be str·aighl~ened out at the Health Sciences Compiex? MR.

SPEAKER: ThE! hon. the M:ini s ter of Heal t.h. DR. COLLINS: Mr. Speaker, the money we have given to the Hecllth Sclences jnst:itut:ion this year is morE! than lr.1s~ yer.1r. !"here wr.1s a siz~ble ·.-t.ncre01se. As a matter of fac-1:, tJJe put lllonoy ·-j_n Lhc· ~ I:Judgc,11.: Ul"i.s yorH' pat"t..i cuJ <'.try for· spE:1ciaJ. ser·v:-1 cPs, F o r· c;! x p a n s ··i o n o f l: h r,1 ""i. r· s p n c ·1. '" l. h ·.i g h

h) c h n o 1 o g y s c-!! t" v :i c ~;:1 s u p t: he r· r~ . r c: <.·1 n no 1-: r· t-:1 s p o n d 1: o ·t· h o pat"t :i cul r.1r inc:i.d(-:!nt Lhi'.lt t.h~;:1 ltiE!lnbor· I:Jr•ough+: up bui-. l cor·l··.a··i.nly tAri 1 J t a k c,1 :i t:. u n d E! r· n o t i c e a n d I l.ioll.ll. J. 0 () k ·i. rl 1-.0 1:: h C:! C ""i_ (' C 1.1111 S t r'l 1'1 C f!! S .

Let rue say this, th<-:1 hospitaJ. t h f:'r' ~;:1 ""i. !> 1.1 n d fH' l:: h e d d y b y d ; :~ y LlSll May 4, 1988 Vol XL cont. r·o l and rrliHl c~1g ~HnC'! n t of a board of trustees, a VE!ry dE!dicatE!d board of trustees, who ar'(,' pr:l1Jc1te citizens, who work wtthout r· (-:!HI u rHH' a t i. o n , tAl h o p u t. -i. n innwnerable hours in mr.~naging l:hE! i. n s t. i t. u t ""i. o n t h e r· e . A s s o c "i a t.

E~ d tAr:i. t h the Board of Tr-ustE!E!S is a very, ver·y expf '!rt fTlrHlaQf:1ment gr·oup, and I think that onE! can bE! assurE!d f.:hat-. th(~ Jnsi::Jtu ·l:-.i.on up t.:hE:!r·c~ i.s being managed in the best way p o s ~' i b l A • • r h f!! I" E:! a r· E~ r:--1 1.1 ~~a y ~; 1: . .i rn f'! s whEni a hospital is facod uJi. t:h oxcr~s!;-j_ ,Jt,1 dr--111lcH1ds, d(,111ldnd~; OVl'!Y' and above the average, and you t" o a 1. 1. y c <.·1 n n o t: g ('! r'l r· u p d n y :.i nst:itution al.1.1mys L.o bE~ r'E!ddy for· lllr'lx-i.rnlllfl dornr:-lnd:;. 'f.

I·: ur"i.gh 1:- br:• t1'1~;:1oreU cal.ly dE:1sirab1f~ but it ·.:i.s j 1,1 s t n o t p r· a c t ·i c '" l 1·: o b c;! g f~ a r· f~ d 1 1 p to hr.lndle thE! max:i.murn dE•mands i!\] J t·_h(~ t·i.tllf~. ·rho hosp·iJ-:.<'11 ' - ~' geat"ed up to handle what :i.t feeJ.s are 1"~~.:-lSOI'ldbl 0 drld CIVEH'i\\9~!! · dOIIIi.HldS, and every once in awhile when ox c ~;:1 s s ·1. v ('! d f'!llli.Hl d s f <it c e t: h 1:! lfl, L hey make the best arrangements they c a n , a n d t: h fi! y a r· e v C'! r· y (-:! x p f~ r· t: J. n doing this. MR. EFFORD: A supplementary, Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: A f"i.nal supplementary. MR.

EFFORD: l. r:lt tile o"lssur·o t:h(:1 M.i.n-:i.st-:.c'!r' of Hedlth there is nobody in this P r· o 1ri. n c f:1 c; o 111 p J. <:·d wi. n g a b o 1.1 t L h '" administrativE! staff Ol" the I:Jo<H'd r:-1 1·: l: h ~~ H ~~ •'lll" h S c ·i (.~nco s , or· <.'1 n y othf~r hosp:i.t.dl. in t:.h:is Pr·ov.i .ncc;!. Ther·r,1 lS nobody C0111pl d.i.n·inq 1:·1bout that.. What they are complaining <YibOIIt, iHld IJJI'lr:-11: 11Uc1 df'(~ COillpl.;:·\"i.n i.ng about is thE!rE:1 ·.:i.s not E!rtough rno n r;! y . r r:·l s k I h r;! 1n-i. n t s t-. ~=!I" v fi! r· y cl(,1ar·ly, is going to tdke thE!

Joss or ~)OiitObody Is lJ.fc-:! i\\i·· d hosptt:al. in this Province to awaken the No. 29 Rl51.1

p E! 0 pl. (':1 l~l~d. (·: C d f 0 r S "i. X t. 0 t E! n day S for bypass sur·ger·y, and it. was d o n e t. h (~ n o n l. y b (~ c i.'\1.1 s o 1·. h e d o c t. o r· s made s orne a r rang E'!mtHI t s among l'. h o 111 s 0. l v e s '1: o g e l~ 1:: h o s <:1 p r,w p"l r~ OFH~rC!.ted on. The caSE:1 I just r· e f ~1 r· r· E! d to i ~; no 1: i:l n i. sold t 0 d case~. T usE~d 'it only as an oxamplr'!.

I ask i".hO mins"i.hcH' 1~1h;:ll: jt :ir. go:ing to te~kc,1 to 1..vake h::Lm up l·:o hi.s r·ospontd .b.i.l.i.l:y i~o f'!l'lSIH'r~ t.hctt t.he n<:1cessar·y funds arc~1 available so that those people, the board and the administration of HH:!!>t~ hospi.tal.s, can do 1':h<:1 job necessary to g'ive proper health care to the people of thLs Pr·ovince? MR. SPEAKER: The hon. thE1 Min'i.shH' of Hectl.th . DR. COLLINS: Mr. Speaker, the board and management and the hospital are giving proper care there. They are giving the highest level of caJ"(;1 Ln l::hf~ Pr·ov Lncc~. Thf~.

Hc:1i:<tlt:h Sciences has sornE! ser·vj ces that no oi:hf:!r hosp·i.i':.r:'ll Ln t:h(~ Pr'OlJ'i.ncP. cr:,ln gJve. Tt is a very, very high 1:<,1 c h n o 1. o g y , v c;! r· y a d v t.'ll'l c 0. d t y p r,1 o F rnE~d:i d l'le :in pract:i Cl':1 at HlE:1 He•'ll.l .:h 3c:i.r~nr:r,1s CoJJJpl.e:-<, by l;r,1ry, vc,H·y competent, d<:1d:i.cc-.1tt1d people~. The hon. III<:Hnber· says when ar·e lAJe go i. ng i'.o g·i v r~~ l:hmn enough Hlorwy. WE:1 g:i Vt':~ as much money as IAie p o s s .i b 1 y c a n , a n d IAH:1 a r· f~ g :i. lJ "i. n g men· c~1 this year· L han 1 as t. y E! a r· .

I do not know hol)l HJuch Hlor·c~ l::ho hon. member feels we should give, pc:H'haps he C'-'111 natriE:1 a f i.gur'E:1 T Cr.Hl comment on it. MR. EFFORD: Y o u h c"' d $ 2 2 trd. 11 t o n f o r· c u c u rn b e r· s . DR. COI.LINS: ~f;;--Ti·e-tafidng about a coup1E! of thousand do l.l. et r· s rno r· f~ , db o u t. a couple of mJll:J.on dollar·s more? 1.1.51. i MH y lJ., 19 a a Vol X I. T.F he~~ i.s I:'.Rl.ki.ng i"tboul':. R couplE! of rniJ lion dolJ.ars more, does hE! 1~ hi. n k r s h o tl J. d t: r:-1 k o "i. 1:: F r· o rn 1: h <'! Car·bonear Hospital. ·l:o giVE! 'it. l:o th1,1 Hr,1dli:h Sc·ioncns COiilpl.c;!x?

MR . EFFORD : Cucumber·s. DR. COLLINS : AnyiAIHY, that thE! i:.hC'! hon. fl•'ll" L·:i.cltlt:-lr' Pl"obJ.om ITIE!mbE!Y' r'E!fE!rn:'d (·:o, d b o 1 1 t i : h o c r:1 r· d :i a c s u r· g "i. c ;:~ l. c a s E! s , I c-omrnentE!d on that more than ct 1~1 E~ E! k ago . ·1· h <:1 r· E~ w d !> a p ,,, r· '.'i. o d of difficulty at ·that timE! I~Jfd.ch has s'i.nc~~ br:1E:!n r·E:!sol.vc'!d. Tt: rnay IAJE!ll come back again, but the management there know that these things are cyclj cal and they dE•aJ. u.ri.th them as thE:~Y come along . PREMIER PECKFORD: ThE~ y go t. $ t'

H) ul'i. l.l. ton rno ,~ E! t hi~; yec~r. MR. LUSH: Mr . 3pE~al<er·. MR . SPEAKER: T h E! h o n . t: h e mE! m b 101 r F o r· B o n i'.lV 'l. s t.: cl North. MR·. LI.I~)H: I have a question for the M'in'l.ster of M 1.1 n -L c 'i. p .:·1 J A f r"' -i. r· s ( M r· . But i:: ) . In 1985 th'i.s lE!gislatur'E! passed a b'.'i.ll. I~Jh .. i.ch gr:-~ue rrtl.ln:i .c:lpr:·1l'LI:.·iE'!S J·.h(;! power to regulate the adver·l.:.i . sPnHHlt-. oF i::h~;! dtspJ.ay of, and the saJ.e of pornographic lfld 1~.(~1r'i.Hls. Thr·e(~ ye.:~r·s l.r:'Ji::('!Y', Mr·. Speaker, nothing has changE!d.

A11 t y p o s , k i. n d s a n d v c1 r· i. '" t: j _ e ~' o f pornographic rna t eri a 1 s are frE•e J.y, tndLscrtmlnately and openly avai1ablE! to all SE!gTnE!nts of OUI" s o c i e t y , par· t "i. c u 1 a r•l y 1·: h c;! you t h of this Province, the young chi.ldr·E:!I'l. And l ask t:h(~ rnJn'ist:c~r· why has nothing changed? MR. SPEAKER: REd2 "'-s;-

The hon. the Minister of Municipal Aff r.l i.r's. Ml~. BRETT: Mr. Speaker·, after the legislation was passed here in this House, proper regulations were drafted, modelled afh>.r' r·egulr::lt .ions tn t:h<-?. Province of Ontario. Subsequent to ·that, UH,~se r'c"'gulat-lons wer·e chal1.enged in the Province j n Ontarlol and it was ruled that they were against the cons t i t-. u t. i. on . In v i. E:11AJ of that I t t IAJi:I.S obvious that. t.ue also had to c h a n g c;! o u r' r E:1 g ul r.l 1.: -i. o n s I s ··i. n c ~~ I~ h "' 1J were after the Ontario model.

So tAJ(:1 hc~VE:1 bc->.en working tAd.th t.he Depi.·lri::JIHHlt or JIJS l ·: 'i.cc~ <::tl.ong thnse l. j n C.;! s , IAri. t h t h e i n t e n t of b r i n g i n g ·i. 1'1 1'1 ei;.J t' I·~ (_;jiJl.o::t [: j_ () tl :; . lit' If o J" ·t· u n 1:~ t ~~ 1 y , t h E:1 so 1. i c i l: or· '"'' h o IAJr'\S L1JOt'k i. ng i.n conj unc L'i.on I;.Ji l:h o u I" off i c:i d J s bE! c arne i J 1, s o a n c~!l.u sol."i.cJ . I··.or· -j s not;.J t;.Jor·k ·i.ng on Uw1n. :J guc->.s!; for· t.hat r·eason, mor'E:~ so l:hr~tn anyl::h.i.ng ~~l.sc,~~ +·.h,c,~r·~~ hr<1s b~~~~n some dE! lay, bu l:.

I t.uould hope that. i.n the not. l~oo d:i.stan ·t. fut.ur'E:1 IAJE:1 will have a new set of regulations t;.J~l'i.ch can be rnadE:1 available.;! to t.h~~ councils around the Province and subsequently used. .MR. LUSH: A supplementary, Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: This wilf- have to be the final S 1.1 p pl. (:1HIE:Hll:: i!lr' y , The hon. the ITIEHnber· for· Bonavtst:a Nor' l:h. Mr~. LUSH : Mr'. ~'lp(:1c:.!bH', j "1- Clpper-H'S t.hc:d:: 1:-.hc,1 ur:i.ni.sl".c:H' hr.l~> ;::~rllldl·.l':r,1d Lhr:1l·: l·:ho b:il] pc:~ssHd -:in this LPg:isJat:.ur·~~ t;.Jas not: 1'-.1-w cor-r-ect pr·or:r~dttr'C:!.

I;1IP on th:-is s".idi!:~ i~t the tjrrH:~ satd tt IAii.~S l:hr~ IAJr'OI'l\j f'>Y'OC:~~SS. l\JOhJ 'f: i.~:;k the->. nd rd st~H': What l::i !TIE:' can the UC.i13 May 41 l9ll8 Vol XI.. people of ttlts Province expE!Ct un:i.fi.co!d 1 lcitJ.JS E~nact.e:1d by l:: h-:i.s Province, Mr. SpeakE!r, as oppoSE!d to 3 00 rnu rd c .i. FH·l l. t t ·:i. ~~ s en a c 1:. i. n g a 11 kinds and different laws, r' c-:1 s p e c t "i. n g L h e c o n t r o l of pornographic materials for the sake of the youth of this Province? MR. SPEAKER: The hon . the Minister of Munici.pal Affa-i.rs . · MR.

BRETT: Mr.5pe-akE!r', the hon. membE!r does n o I: 1.1 n d t! r' s t r:·l n d . T -1:: -i. s n o I~ 1:: h <-?. legislation that gave us the f>r'obl r:11il 1 :i. t 1.1.1d s Lhn r·~:,guld 1":. i.on s . It was the regulations that had to br~ changed. I shOitld r'lr:IIJ'isr;! Lhr;! hon. J'(J(:~rnbrc'Y' that thts particular legJsJation .. i s t' n 1:\ ll y l: h r'' r' r,~ !; pons :i b .. ;_ l "i. ·t. y oF t.he:~ f(!dE:~r·al gov~:!r'nrTJE!nt, and :.i.l:.

J.~> Jill) und(:!r'sl: .r:·1nd-i.ng thdl ... l·:.het"e -1.s E·1· bill in sE:1cond readJ ng before the II o usE~ of Co rmno n s r:'ll:: L hE:! rnontEHll: , I th:ink it is C-54 my hon. co ' ll.E~clguo, 1-.:hc-?. M-i.n i.st:co'r' of Just:.Jcc,, (Ms VE!rge), would be abJ.E! to handle t.hi.s 1nuch bc"'tl:<'!Y' t.: hdn I can - and if it: is E!VentualJ.y passed in the"' House of Corrnnons t:hen that legislation t.utll take carE! of thE! pr·oblc;!lfl that t:he hon. Jnt,!rnber· i.s talking about. MR. SPEAKER: The time for Oral Questions has el.mpsed. Presenting Reports by Standing and Special Committees Ml~.

WOODFOfW: MJ". SpE:~aker· . MR. SPEAKER : ·n·H'! hon . l":hn For· H um b '~ r·· Valley. No. 29 R1513

MR. WOODFORD: M r . S p EHi k E:H' , a s C h cl .J. nn a n o F t h e:1 GovernmE!nt Se:1rvtcE!S Comrrdttee I would llke to report that the Committee has considered the matt.er·s l:o "i.t r~1fc~r·r·nd dnd has p~ssed, without ~mendment, items oF C:1Xpt,!nrli.tJJr•c,1 undc:!r' l:hl':1. foll.OIAJi .ng hei.Hhng$: T~w Dop;:~rl··.uJC,HJ1 ·. of M 1.1 n "i. c j_ p .:<tl. (l f F d "i. r· s ; l: h c~ Do pi.-\ r· ·1·. rn ~~ n t: of Pl.lbltc Wor·ks and Ser·vicc-:!s; the-:!

DC'!f><H'I:Inc~ni~ of l.dbour·; Hw DE~pal' "t:ruent of Finance:1; thc,1 Dc:!par·I~JfiC'!I"ll··. of ·rl"ansport.dl:i.on; the~ DE>.pi:tr'truc-:!nl. of Cons.UITIE!Y' Affair·s and Co rrnnu n "i. c ;:., '1: "i. on s ; ;;, n d 1\l E~IAJf o 1.11'1 d l .:~ n d and L.abr·ador· Housing. To add to t.h;:>lt, Mr·. ~3p~1akE!r, for· a minute or so I would like to, ·fi.r·st of c:"ll., thank the rrHWlbC·H'S of the committee, namely: The V:ice --Chai.rman, Mr·. G:i.J.bert, Bur·ge:w Bay d'Espoir·; the hon. the rrlE:1JTibc·:H' for· Wat~H·for·d KEHHnount, Mr. Gullage; thE! hon. the mE!mber for· S t c,1 p ~IC'! n v :i 1.1. e , M r· .

K . A y 1. war· d ; th1<1 hon. the member for Trtni ty - Bi:>lY de:1 VE!rCh1, Mr. Rcdd; l::l·w bon. the member for Terra Nbva, Mr . Gr'EH,Hl i.ng; and I:: he~ hon. +:he~ IIIE~Jflbl;!r for· PJ aCE:1ni:ia, Mr. Pat.t.EH'son. Mr·. Spc~akor·, :i.l: IAldS •:'l 'HH'Y gratifying experience to sit on such H COIIIIII:i . ti:c~f:"!. We~ l'ldd sr,11JCHI lip and seven down, no problems I~Jhc:~ l:soovEH'. T tAJi.HI'I: 1·:o cong1nat:uJ i:~t.E>. thE:1 nHHnber·s of ·Uw Cornrni.tt:oo, r~spoc'"l.:'llly thr:! Hlt;!rnbor·s of t.he Oppositjon, I must say, on i·.l·w I ~li:\ y t h (:1 y C 0 l'l d 1.1 C I· E;! d t··. h E:Hrl S E~ l.

V (~ 5 r.d.: e~ll ·thE! I·H,HH' :in g s . It was a conslrucl: · i. vE~ pr•oce:1ss. ThEH'E~ I.~HH'r~ per·U nent qUE!Stions and forthr·ight r.Hl s IAHH' s , M r· . S p e a k EH' . A 1. l·.: h o 1.1 g h some of the questions were s omc-?.wha t cant r·o ver·s i.a l., they handled them in an excellent rnarHH-:!r' and HH->. rE!SUl t. tAJas, Mr·. Speaker, as I said, tAle had SE!VE!I1 JrJE:H:1t.i.ngs 'i.n a r·otAJ w.L lh no pr·obl.('!l'nS tAJhatsoever, and it Jo~.Jas al1 us '[Lj. May 'I·, 1 9 B B Vol XI.. pasSE!d . So, I 1.uant to thank the Cornrwi.ttec,1. Thank you ver·y rnuch. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear•, hear!

Answers to Questions for which Notice has been Given MJ"?. WT.NDSOR: Mr· . . Spe!aker. MR . SPEAKER: T he-:' hon. t.hc->. M:i.n:.i s I'.EH' of F i.nanc(~. MR. WINDSOR: Mr. Speaker, just very brief1y. During the consideration of the Consolidated Fund Services yesterday there was a question from the member for Menihek dE!aling t.uit.h thE! st:at.PITIE!nts of the pool.E!d pc-:1ns i.on ftlnd for· 1.986. He had those for 1985, and I undr:1r·t.ook t.o sE:!E! hotAJ qutckl.y I could tablE! thE! rE!port:s for 1986.

I atll plE:1dSC:!d l·:o adiJ.isE:! t·:.hE~ hon. member that I tabled them sorne t:i.uH,1 ~go, t.ogr:1tho1" IAJ i. l":h HH'! Publ. i.e Accounts. So they are available. MR. FI::NWtCI<: I hav(-:! them. MR. WINDSOR: The them. h on . g r:! n 1: l. c,w11.-1 n That is speE!d, dlJ"eacly hi\\S Mr·. SpE:1ake1"! I i:,J, l s o u n d e r· t a k e i'l('!xt·. rnonU1 J: l.tri. l.l for· 1987. t: hat. wi t hi n l': he l-".<:1blc,1 l:hc;! r·t'!por·t. ~OME HON. ME~JLER~ : 1·1 ~1 r.~ r , hE! cH' ! MR. SPEAI<ER: The hon. the PremiE!r. PREMIER PECKFORD: Mr·.

Speakl-:!r, I just tAJant: t:o anslAJE:~r a question to ITIE! frorn the hon. thE! No. /.9 Rl ~>14- ~----- -

member for· in his s 1:."' t (:1 rrH:1 n 1: , 1J <~ s 1: 1-;, r· d i.·\ IJ , I!J h c;, r· c;, T s a -L d J IJJouJ d g<.:~t mor·e :i nfor-rnation. I am r·c~ad i.ng fr·ou1 LhE! S<:llllfi! HI~·\ t-.E:,r-i.i'\1. that hE:1 JJJas rc.;oad:i.ng from, and I f i.nd that thH hon. i::hE~ ln<~rnb<:, r· for· Men:ihek rE:1ally IJ.Jas not giving the whole plcture yesterday, because the free trade agreement, as s .i.gnE!d, w'i.l.l. cause over· 4,000 jobs to be created in the Province over 1-:he tE!n-y~1<H' pC::1riod, and ovc.;or 2, 1)00 of them arE! in thE:1 serviCE! SC::1ct.or·.

So LhE! hon. mc,mJbc.;or for· Me,nihE!k did , not g'.i.VE! the full p i. c t u r· r:1 , :it i. s o v e r• fl., 000 j o b s . To fur·thE:1r' E!nl. -L ghten l:: hc,1 hon. rnernbE:1r for· Menihed<, I thought.

I IJJOul.d pr'\55 along, e1nd dsk thc,1 Pdgr~ to deliver to him personally, a sp(~(~ch t'.hi'll : I hdtJi i! g-i.tJ::'n on i:he E:1Conoruy of NetJJfounclle~nd to dou1ons lTH+ ·.r:, Lo h i.111 l:hi'\'1'. r-~tJCHl bHfo1"e fr·ee t.J"ade tr·igg(H'S 'in, l..o.J<:' d r· t:! s r;, n ·i n g r· <~ 1: or· d l r:' tJ o l :; o f erupJ oyi'II(Hil, r(~COI"d l(~Vr:1ls of -i.ntJns1:.111onl'., r·:~cor·d lr~UI'!l:; of Oppor·t·un:i t.y. 1 Cirri SIH'E:1 hE:1 IJJOUld IAJt:·lni··. l:o r'c~;'ld ·l:h""i. s spc·:!~:!ch J I:. h-is E:1 x c e 1 J en t r :i g h t ·-IAri n g , Cons (:H' v <:tl: i v E! speech whlch, 1 Whi1e thH llght hoJds out to burn,/ The vilest s Lnn<:!r 1nay r·~t.IJY'n. 1 SOME HON.

MEMBERS: He,ar·, hE,ar! MR. SIMMS: He might even cross the floor . MR. GILBERT: .Oh~-no~hE;-IJJ:i 11 n 0 t . MR. SIMMS : Why does he not. cross over today? Orders of the Day M f~ . ~3 P E A K F R : Or•ch~ln, pJ C:1r..IS(~! 1 .. 1.~)1~) Mt:1 y lj. I 1. 9 B H \Jo-1 XI.. It is now LJ.:QO o 1 clock and it :i. s Pd.tJi::t t-.e M(WlbE:1r 1 5 f),:·\ I) . Th<'' d(~br.1 l:.e was adj ournRd by the hon. tho Minister of Northern Development. I will Cdll on the hon . I: h e~ lm>.mber' for the Strait of Belle Isle. MR. DECKER: M r· .

S p <-?. m I< e r· , I tun p 1 (~ a s E! d t. o s L:'.t n d today and support t:h :.i.s private m<;nnber· 1 s mot'i.on IAJiri.ch ha s been put by my colleagUE! for Nas kaupi (Mr·. K(>.ltand). I b(:11 'i.(W<:11 Mr·. Spc,1ak<''r' I it would be in ordE!r for ITIE! at:. t.hi .s Li.Jn<,1, bE!fOI"e l::h<"' Pr'olrr .ic;:,r' leaves his seat, to complirnE,nL lhE! Pr~>.Hii.<;,r·~ l':o dr','\1~1 thc,1 att<:Hlt.:i .on of thJs HouSE! to thE! good intE:1nt:i.ons of thr->. Pr·eul:i.c'!t'. I I"E!for· l:.n LhE! action IJJhich HIE! hon. the PI"E!fni.E!r' l:ook ·in '1981.

IAJhr:,n hE:! br·oughL :in this Freedom Of Information Act. r 1-.hink T I~J()IJl.d br-:! r·c:nwiss if r we I" e 1'1 o t to g j. v E! thE! PI"<'' mJ e r· a] 1 l ... h r->. p r· .:~ .. i :; r:' t .. h r:\ ·t: h r~ c:l Ei! ~; "' r· v e s ·~ because he had euery good i.nl:c,,nl·.'i.on. :'lJ.be ·i. t: -i.·t: ~~~d~; seV('!I'l or Edght. YE!<:lrs ago, but at lNlst 1'1(' d j , rl 1 c:d: ()l']{

c) t·. -i.JIIe 1 h t:'llJ (:) (.'! V (i! r' y 9 () 0 d 'intention. I believe, Mr. Speaker, that LAJhen L h ~~ h o n . t h e P r· (,11fl i. e r· b r· o u g h t. :L n this Freedom of Information Act he 1~1 t:~ s r· ~''a c '1:. i. n g to N e 1~rf o u n d l a n cl ~,, I" s who l..o.Jere! crying out for w:.Lde-.. ·OPE!n gov(:1r·nrnf:~nt, hc,1 was r·(;,act·.inq to Newfoundlanders IAJho IJJerE! not saU.sf'i.< :1d l~o have govEH'I'lHH'!I'lt beh:ind closed doors.

I recclll. th<:lt wi·HHl this Fr' EH:,dcnn Of Information Act was hitting the pr'(:1SS SOIII('! year' S r.-190, IAJor·· ds IAI~H'E! being used about this young, opt.:i.Jn t sl:::i.c Pr·E~lll'i.c;!r' 1~1ho I)Jc:'IS go ·ing t:. o r· c,w o 1 u t i o n i z E! g o v E! r· nm e n t , 1..o.1 h o I!JdS go:i .ng t:o h''lVe C:·\ modol. of government which could be upheld l:o l : hr-~ uJhol1,~ llr•i . lish Corrnnoni~J(~aJth, to t.he whole world. MR_._j_USH : No. ?.9 1n51.s

Open . Democratic. MR. DECKER: He was going to have wide - open gover·nment. Ther·e would be no rrHH' .::~ go v e r· n rrHHd.: i n 1:'. he c l. o s <:! l': s I where premiers were in the pockets of pc-:'!opl.o r:~nd t:h~~ Y I.UE!r·c,~ do'i.ng 141h1:~t thE~Y 1.uere toJd. No rnor·e of th:is. MR. LUSH : Thr,~y IAH'!rc,) go ·i.ng to l:akr,) gOIJ('! r'nlfiHnl·: to tiH~ pC:H>pl ~~. MR. DFCI<FR : fhc,)r"l'! 1Ak1~; go'Lng LotH:! no rnor'P. ~;t~cr·et !;oci~~ty.

Notu, I do not k n ()I AI I~Ji·l"' L 1·:. h 0 p r' (~ IJri. (;! r· 1~1!:-1 s 1'. r:t 1 k i. n g about wht:Hl ht::) tetlked about : g o v o r· n 1 11 ('! n 17. b E! h "i. n d c l o ~; E:! d d o o r· s d n d secret societies. Probably he bui.l.t up a sl·:r'diAJ man; thE'! I .. E~adc,n· of the Opposition always accuses h:im oF bull.<Hng up th'i.s str·c.~w rnan. If so, he did a good job of lt. Becr.wse he hdd lilt::) convi .ncE:!d ··· I t.uas living in White Bay at thE! t-i.rnE! that: 1.1.H~ had l:l'l<'! cl.i.rt Lest I filtiest kind of government that y o u wo u l. d e v <'! r· w .i. s h to s e E' .

H e wets thE:~ ~H:1ro, he tAJas thE! Don Qwi.xoh~ on a tJ.Jhi.'l-.<:1 hor·se, hf~ IAJI:'IS the shining tJJIT.itE:1 knight, and hE! IAJas ' goi.ng l:o do r:li~Ji:IY IAJ.i. Lh all govt::H'nment behind cJ.osed doors, c.~ ll. closE! i:. go1J er'l'llflf~ n 1: I i:t ll sec r·r,1l'. socJ t::!ty gover·nment, and he tJJas go i. n g 1': o s L i:t n d by I: h C'! p o s i . I: "i. o n t:.hcd: t.h.::1 public hi'..td a r··i.ght to I< n OIAJ I .:1 n d 1". h r'1 t·.

I by good n r:! s s I no matter· IAihctt. hr.tppened to this Pr'OIJi.nC(;! ·i.n yr:!cilr'S l:o c:outr~~ t:i'H=! pub]:i.c tAJoul.d altJ.Ji'AYS and for·€~VE~r· h C.·1 V 0 1: hI'! I~ :i. g h [: 1: () k 1'1 OIAJ IAlh 1.·1 t -j_ !) going on j n goVE!r'nm<:Hlt . T h o.w 1'::1 1-. h ~~ A c 1: i·w r· E:1 ~H:! for· c;! HH:1 I Mr· . Spedker . I made it my business to go iHld g<;!t i.l':.

It<:1HI 3 I on p1:·1g~~ 65 of the FI~E!edom of Information Act s a y s I 11 T h e p u r· p o s (;! o f '1:. h-i. s A c L l. s to provide a right of access by l:he publ."i.c to :inf<H'Iflat .. i.on i.n 1_11)1.6 May 4-, 1988 Vo1 XL records of dE!partrnents and to subject that r"i.ght only to specific and limited excE!ptions n t~ c E~ s s a r· y F o r t h e o p E! r· d 1·.: L o n o f L h e departmE!rtts and for the pr·otE!Ct ~ion of p ~H' so r1r:~ l. fH' ··i. IJ a c y . 11 T ~l'i. s tAJd s rneant t:o be:1 a r·'.ight, Mr·.

Spc;!akE!rl not·. sc:nnr'! cur·i. oll~> per·son L•.Jho could bE:1 told something if it hi'.lPPE!ned to s wi.l: Uw ('!J'l!l s of s OlrH'! particular department. This a~t r: l. r,1 t.'r r' l.y ~.; ·1: ''~ 1: r:' s l: hi.·11: i. l: ·i. s l:o pr·oujde cl r·ight of i'.lCCE!s~; by the publ i.r: l:o · i_n·for'tllr:~t.ton I and Lhe only exceptions would be a Few s FH'! c: i. F ·i. c 1'11'1 d 1 :.i. rn:i. Led ('! x c (~ p L ·i o n s I1E!CE!SSary for thE! opE:!r'at:i.on of Lh(:• d H pd r· I:. IJl(~ n 1: s . No 1::1 r·g Ultl('! n t IAI i. t·. h that. M r· .

S pea k e r· , what 1.11 e had s E! v t:Hl y (:1i'lr's 1:·190 wr·1 s d ~; q u c,~a k y .... c l.E:!i"tn Premier w:i th E!Very good int.E!nU on, and T ;:~111 not: go t ng l:o be;! thE! last. to praise him for hjs good . i.nt~nt i ons seven or eight years ago. Look how open this :i.nf<H'Iflat.i.on tJ.Jas. i·lad I not: SO('!I1 !:hE! Act, I tAJouJ.d have thought it rrri.ght hf'lV<'! ~H~en just For· a few NetAJfoundlanders, tAJi'JerE! something p E! r· s o n 1::1 1. w<:·1 s b C:) i. n g d 1. s c u s s ~:! d . But, no, this right of i nforrnaU.on is aua i l.abla l':o every Canadlan citizen domic:iJ.ed in t.hE!

Pr·ov:incE!, r.1 !; l. o n g r:·1 s h 0. ·i. s l. :i. t) '.'i. n q 'i. n L h E~ Province. A permanent resident of C,'11'l1•1di.-1 l~Jr:o1S 1-hH IIIC!I:Hd.ng -jn the;? Irnrrl'igr·at'.ion Act of 1986, or·, Ml".

S p r~ i'l k o r· , 1:1 c o I" p o r· a 1'.·. i o n incor·porf.lted by or undt:H' a J.atM of (: a n a d d o r· d P r· o tJ ·:i. n c e , a n d 1.1.1 h o i. s carrying on business in the P r· n IJ i n c t=! • If some archE!OJ.og:ist 2 I 000 or· 3 I 000 yr~l:'ll"~> Fr·orn no1~1 IAHH'O t:o d:ig up that piece of paper and he were not to knotAJ IAJh<.'tl:: happli'!n~=!d consequently, if he were not to knotAJ whr:d: hi:1ppc.;?nc,~ d a fPtAJ shor·t years after this piece of paper tAJd s tAW i. t t E! n I 1:'. h "i. s A c 1:: IAJa s No. 29 R1S16

fH' 0 C: l .:\ j HIC'! ri , h ('! IAIO 1.11 d h i•llH1 t: 0 ~; d y , 'What a lr·r:.~mEHJdous Pr'E~rn:ier that 1111.1 s t h c.~ IJ r~ I:H~ r,, n , -j_ n J g H 1 ! 1 J\ 11 1- 11 ,,: l!IOU] d bE! ·tf..t1 Icing about A.D. and hE! IAIO 1.11. cJ be ~~ i.·ll. k -j_ J'l 9 db 0 II t: fl . C . , '1: h f:! y<->.ctr 19111. Hr:1 lAJould haVE:1 gone to l·:h'i.s. But tht:H'e ar·e two oUH:1r lAklys to dE:1signah1 time that I would aJ.so l!l<'tn I~ to ref(i!Y' l:o thE! pt~opl.E! of Newfoundland and to any future archaeologists who might be d :l g g i n g a r· o u n d . and try i n g to g a.i n som<->.

J.ns"lghts fr·o,n t.hE:1"i.r past which is our present. I would take these archaeologLsts and I would take the people of Neu.1f o u nd lruH:I s r;! v (HI y (~ <'1 r s cJ OIAJI'l t: he road, seven years from the day l::hal~ t:h·i.~; pr'lrl::·i . cul;,~r b·i.l.J. IAias pr·ocla:i.m(;!d, and I would teJ.l th(,HTJ i'l b () 1.1 l: ll [)I) . N Ol!l B

I) D , l\-1r' . 3 p r,1 i.·l I< f'!t' , -,. ~; be F <H' c:1 t h (~ d c,1 nr.i s E:1 of cJ e 111 o c r· i'..t c y J. n 1\Jt=!IAifoundlt:-lnr:l. rlri!;, Mr·. ~'Jpr,1;~ker·, lAid!; t-.hE:1 ctc ·l-, The-:'! Fr'<HH:Iom of T. n f o r'Jn<:·l L 'i. on A c 1- . T lri ~; IJ.It:·l s IAri de .. OFHHl goverl'lfiiE:Hlt. This Wt'lS l:hE~ kind of~ 90VCH'I111HHJl: 1-.h,~·lL Newfoundlanders felt we would be c ormn'i. t 1-. ed 1-.o i:Hld 91J ru·a n 1:. ~H~d for·evE!Y' c.nd c. day. This 1.11as I:H~for·~~ t:hc,1 dom.i.sc,1 of dmnocr·acy.

B<'!I:.IAIOC;!n 1981. <:~nd 19B8 I.~H~ had l-'.ht1 demiSE! of dernocr·acy, so we l1aVE! to tall< about ADD ·- afl;101r thE! dE!mi.s~~ of dE!rnocracy. No1~1, when cl .i.d th'i.s happc,1n? did democracy disappear NEHAJ·Foundl.and, Mr·. Sr:H~cli<fH'? B D D i. s ~)(;! f o r· E! L h o ch111rj s f'! democr·acy, IAihen I bE!1:ieve Fr·eE,do1n of 1nfor·rnHLi.on Act some credibJJity, had backbon,; "i.l~ 1~1<:-1s so1nf~l:hing couJ d ch~pend on. Whc,1n in of ThE! hr:ld SOHIE!

IAIO Aft~~r· t.l·1o d~:!m:ise:1 of dc,1rnocl"f.lcy: 1.. 1. r; l '7 Mt'l y 11., 19 B 13 \Jol X I. rJ! r' . ~) p 0 d !< Co! r' , T b f~ l. i. (:! l) :=! r c ·~l n pinpoint to the day when democracy d .i. s d p p () r:-\ r-· r;! c:l -L n i: h ·j ~; p r· 0 l) "i. n c e ; i [; was the very clay when the combined C '" b "i. n o t-. r.·l n d t: h c,1 (~ x E~ c u t: :i. v P a s s i s t a n t s , a n d a 11 t h e p e o p 1 ('' 1.11 E~ nor·rn.:ll.l.y c.:~ll . govE:!r'nlnc;!nl-'., 1.11hen l::hC:1 total of the Cab:inEd: and 1-:.he (:1 x e cut i. lJ o ass i s 1: ants and 1:: he p eo p 1 e 1/J h o arE! part of go v E! r n mE! n t , 1~1hen that gr·oup boca1nE:! b i.qg _c-;!r l::hi:'ln the combined House of Assembly.

Tha~ i.s the day that democracy died in Newfoundland. I am glad the HousE! L.ecldE,r' carnE! -L n , b c,1 c a 1.1 s e h ~~ can c E! r· t a .in l. y 1 ear· n SOmE!thing frorn this in thE! E•VE!nt thr.11': hf:! should ~;uccoc,1d l:h<->. Pr·E~III.i.~~r· as Leader. I u.dJ.l cut it:. out o-f H a n s tl r· d and s e n d :i. t o v (;! r· 1:: o h .i.1 n s o that hE! can rE!ad it..

Aft:E!r tho d f~ 1 n ·i ~; C'! o (' d o 111 o c r· r:1 c 1J : T h f'! v o r· y d ;:-1 y that happened was when the co lnl:l"i. n fi! c:l C.:~ l:l ·i.l'lt:! 1-. <:'1 n d 1:: h o govE~r·nrnent: bE!CarTIE) b-.iggE:11n 1-:.han 1-:ho 1-!0II~H:~ or ASS(~Iilbly. I'I'Jdl·: "iS I.•Jh~:,n :it happc,1nE!d. BDD, ther'E! IAJclS no pl"ob:Jern.

Ar1y "i. n t '~ r· P s l: f:! d p e I" !; o n b o f o I" C:! 1: h ('! d o a L h of democracy, and concerned c:i.·l·.:izon, <:lilY Canr.~r:l:i<jln basE=!d corporation, as long as thE!Y IAJc,~r'E! b i:l s f:u:l :i n N E~ 1~1 f o 1 1 n d J. a n d , c o IJ l. d w r· i. t. c;! a letter to any department of g o v c->.r' n uw n 1: <:~ n d E~ x c o p 1'.: F o r· a f C'!IAI special excE!ptions, he, she or i.t. could receive free of cos!-: the information he, she or 1t was l.ook'i.ng for . Thls was be-fore. A n d j_ t i s s o of t e n t h a t IAI e h c1 lJ E:! s E:' E! n c o I" r· 1.1 p 1':. -i, o n s n E'! a I< L n .

E v <=• r· y person starts off with E!Very good .inl-E~nl-:'i.on, evE:!r'y good inl:.ont..i.on --i.n t:.he IJ.Jorlcl, and I b€:!liE!VE! t.hat. tho hon. ti·JC;! Pr·em:i.E:!r' had c,'VEH'Y good :i n t e n t i o n beforE! B D D . B u t:. aft ~H· t: h o y (~ <01 r· s p .:-1 s s , c o I" r· u p t i . o n s E:! 1-:. s in, cHJd afbH' corruption cr·c;!E!pS :in r:·H'OIHld i:h(~ C:1dgf~:;, r·o(': SO'i::S :·in, and l !>UpposE:1 :it is only a norma1 par· ·l: rns17

of the world as we know it. Th~1 hon. thE! Minister of Forest Res our· ce s was ti:J.l. k i. ng l·.: oddy r:1bout. spraying and all this sort of t.h ·i.ng, and hc,1 t~.JC\S t.al.k.i.ng abo1.1t. the h~?. mlock looper and the spruce bl.ldt"Jor·m. Thos~1 <H'(?. !>ywptotus of old age, that :is nature 1 s way of h<H'lH1S t:.i.ng (: l11tb~H' UtR 1:: '"Je d .. i.d not hat"VE?.st.. That is t.he causE:1 of i. l:. Ndi-".ur·c;! h<:·1S h(~r· IAIHY oF l:c ~ .:~r·tng down overrrti:.lt.tH'e t:i.rnber. OJd men, i:'\ n d .I 1.41 "i.

"I l s 0 0 11 b r,1 0 n (~ I ~~ s I~H'! r:~ 9 1?. ' nature has a way of corrupting the p h y S ··i. 1: d l. b 0 d y i'Hl d h' rH' ·i n 9 'i. t dotAirt. T hE:1 ba c I< of nty hE:1r.l.d, I 1.: h "i. n k , trli:-1 k n s t 1: o b t; i. o 1 1 s ·Um t :r. .:-1 trt g(dUng oldc,H·; natur·e takes the h<:·1 i.r·, Hnd na l~tH'C! t:akr,1s Lht'! l:i.trtbs and so on r.ll'ld so forth, cor·r·upt:ion o f UH:! ph y s :i c r:-11. bod y . I .. "i. k e 1.4t.i. s e , IAJ:ith t.he body WE! n1fer to as goVE!r'nlfl(;!l'l-1:., -Lt i.s only d tnat:t .f'!Y' of time and corruption sets in. NotAl, Mr·.

Sp(H'lkc-H', l::he hon. thE1 Pr'E!miet" had convinced every single l.tv:i.ng NetJJfoundl.andc->.r', 'i.ncl.ud:i.ng mE:1 - a good sermon, too, I might add t: hat b (~ c r.w s e of 1:: h i. s Freedom of Information Act, the day tAJoul.d never, eVC'!r cotrH~ ag<:·1tn could f r· o rn when a corrupt government k (! c,1 p t.: he t r' u t. h away Nt::HAJf o u ndla nd er s . NotAl, h~1 had contJ i.ncod f~tJ~:!r'YOI'l('! oF that, but, Mr·. Speaker·, i'.l.S tAJiJling r':\5 +:he;!

Pr·r,1llli.E!t' tn·i.ghl' : hr:tvr,1 b('!C'!l'l, con~d der ·ing c~J l thE~ good i.nl:enl:"i .ons l:hr:·lL he?. 111i.l:)ht hdtJH lvHI, 11'1(,1 fact· of thE~ rnatt(~r· Js, h(:1 co11ld nol: l."i.,;c~ 11p l:o lri. s good j n t etT~. oi o n s . H ~1 J e a r· n e d r.l. f t c·H ' h E:! IAH:U; t n he r· <:! For· s c,1 tH1 n o r· o .. i. g h ·t: years thc:d: :j t was a Jot mor·e fun ~.: o r· ttll~ by dec r· E! t:! , d 1 o 1:. 1110 r· c,, sc:Hls:ible, jn his opinion, to rul(,1 by dco!CY'E'!~1, l.o r·ul.(~ bt~h.J.nd cl.osE~d doors, l:o r·u1E! :in the cloSE!i:.

And dS soon as h(-:1 l.earnc,,d t:h"i.s h(~ said, 1 The dE1vil take The FY'E!edom L1 s 18 May 4, 1988 Vol. XL of Information Act, 1 and hE! thrE!IAJ .it. out. Now, he could not thr·ow it out, obviously. HoiAJ could the m·'i.nist(->.r who, i.n l9Bl, br·ough·l~ in this Freedom of Information Act g c,1 1: u p 'i. n 1:: h (~ H o u s E'! a n d h d v e .i. t repealed? I mean, that would bE! a b -i. 1: Sl.J.l.y. '( th .i. nk dl'1Y01'1(:1 IAIOUl.d have to agree it would be silly r:·lrtd :i.i: IAIOUJ.d tlOI~ bt~ VC:1Y'Y pol. :i.ti.caJ. astute. And the Prerrr.iN', 1Ed: u s f r:-1 C E! ·i. l . , ·i. S p 0 l. "i. l: · i.

C r:~ ll y <:·l S t:. U 1:: (~ , That :i.s his pr·obl(~lll . He is probably mne of l:he best poJ.J : t.icians this Pt"ovtnce has E!VEH' h<:~d. f1.!~,__ill[r T : You are right on! MR. DECKE!i: 1· h t:! 111 (:11 n b (,1 r• c:l g r• E! C'! s , o F c o u r· s ~1 . 1 think I would agree with that . He .i.s pr·obabl.y one-:~ oF i· .. h(~ bc'!~;L politicians Newfoundland an d Labr·ador· has eve:1r· h;:~d. SOME HON. MEMBERS: H~~ar, hear'! MR. DECKER : He is probably one of the bE1st: pol.it ·Lc.J.ans that the Dorn.in Lon of Canada has ever had . MR. BUTT : You are right on that, as well . MR.

DECKER: T 1~10 111 d e v o n g o ·1: h i:l ~. Fa r· , •:·1 n d I a rn sur·e m~~mber·s IAJJl.J. agr~H'' tAJith mE~. RilL ,,J"i.-l:h 1ny noxt '>L:1l:nmnnl :: I do not. expe:1ct. rlny applause fr·orn Lhu o t: h c~ r· s ~ i . d 1,1 . H r'! 1 !; p r· o b db 1 y L h t:! IAJO r· s t go v ern or Of J\I(;!IAJfOitl'ldJ.dl'lcl, of Newfoundland, MR. SIMMS : that. the Pr·ov:i neE! or· l. h ('! D Cllll"i.n-i. on or the Dom:i.n:ion How comE! you guys are OVE!Y' LhE!rE! and not over herG? No. 29 RJ.S18 .... , .... _ ..

MH. DFCI<FR: I wi .. U . <Hl s I~J{H' l: h (~ h 0 n . Jrl'i. n i. :; u~ r• ' s quE~st.:Jonl a good quo~;l:ion. He c:tsksl 11 HOIAJ COiflC,1 YOII 911YS i:H't'! ()l)c~r· i h e I" e iHl d w (,1 i'H' <->. o v e r· h e r· t1 ? 11 Y o u StH,1, l:h<:1 hon. IIIOHII:wr· 1~1<:\S no'i"". J :i sten:i ng. I sa'id the Pr·emiEH' IAJaS p r· o b"' b l. y l: h (~ b (;! s 1: pol. ·i. {: i c i. r.~ n , H n d Utt!l"e j s a distinction betiAJeerJ a pol.ttictan Hnd being capf.olbl.e of govendng. I IJJould submit ., Mr. SpeHker, that we ~re the governors.

We will govern this P r· o v i. n c <"! , b u t. .i. t i. s g o i. n g t o 1·.: a k 01 us another election to get over thE!Y'B. Wh<o1n l::h;:~t E:1l.<-:'!C t. ion corn<"!S 1 they will find out why we are over htH'B. M r . S pea k <~ r· , T s t i. l. l. h a v t~ a f ~11AJ minutes left and I want to dispel <Hl o L h <,H' my t. h . S 0111<;! o rH'! t h r· (~IAJ sorneUd.ng acr·oss about leadE!Y'S. Thi.s i.s a 1nyt:h l:hey ar·<;! t:r·yoi.ng fo perpetrate on Newfoundlanders a b o u -t: o u r l. E~ ad P r· ~; . S "."i. n c (~ l 9 i!. 9 , Ml".

SpE~akEH', t.he PC Party of Nt~w · foundl,Hld hds h<'lrl HdrTy Mf:!IAJS I McaJ colru Hol1E~lt, John H:i gg:i ns, J dlfl(~ s Cr'(HHH'', G<'! r·r· y 0 1·: l:H n ht~ i.Jnc,n·, Not1] MUI"phy, Ani< Murphy, P<.:.ter· C <:t s h 'L n, F r· <.·\ n !< ~1o or· c,1 s , <:l nd 1-l r· :i. •:\ n P<,1ckfor·d. lf c~nyon<,1 is counting, t. h"' l: .. i s I: e n l. n ad (;! r' s s i. n c f~ l 9 l!. q . T h <->. L J b <->. r a J P a r· t. y s i n c t1 1 9 4 9 h a s h<:·ld Jo~:!y Small.IAJood, Ed l~obor·t·.:;, R :i J 1 Rowe , Don J r.:md e son , L.. en Sli.rl.i.ng, StE'!V(:!

N~~ar·y, IAJho IAJi'lS appo:i nted for· just a f eiJJ days, Leo Br:H·r·y and Cl.yc.lc:~ W(,~l.l.s, E~lght leaders. Now, what :is the rackE!t about l.eader·s? WE~ hr."'vE:~ had c,1:ighl: J.c.:.aders s:i.nce 194.9, and the Tory Part. y has had I::<;! n l. c,1 ad<;! r· s s i n c (,~ 1949. So do not, for goodnE!SS sal«"!, g·i.vo me any of th<::.~l: f o o 1 i s h rH:! s s . MR. DFCI<ER: Do no ~~ F.! v <H' 1. (:!l:: Jflf~ h o <H' 1:1'1<'\ 1: L.J5]9 May 4, 1988 VoJ XL. nonsense being sr.dd HOIJSA. ~~0 I"J<:'Il)(~ hNd and the Tor·iEI!i havE~ aga:in i.n this f~ ·i. g h t l. E~ 1'1 d E! Y' S had ten.

It.. .:l s l: hat:. ·i. ~; j II S 1: T I~JOIIl.c:l pr·c·Hii.cl"., Mr·. Sp~~~:~!<EH', +:hat: as soon a!; t.h:is E:11ecti.on is over· .:tnd thi ~; lf~Etdr,H' goes, you IAJ·i.l.l s~~e 1: h em c o rn i n g e v e r y t h i r· t y d a y s , j u s '1-. l. i. k c,1 I: hE! rno on . Mr. Sp~:!c:~I<E!r, .i.n l::hl':1 f~=!I~J Jn.i.nut:~'s I have left I want to give the r· E:1 a !; o n . IAJ h y +.: h e h o n . 1 ... h (~ P r· <;! rn :i E! r want:E!d to abolish ThE! FrE!E!dom of Tnfor'lllat .. i.on Act. Tt. IAJas aboJ · . .i.shE:!d sometime last year when a few l·.:h"i.ngs th;·,\t .

IAJE:1Y'P happE!n""i.ng ·i.n t.his Province became too hot for the Pn~tniEH'. l..el: 111e cal.1 l:.hE! HouSE! 1 S attention to sorne of that. The fir·st one IJJas the Round Pond l~oad. R(~J"ri01Hib<;!r' Ro1.1nd Pond Rode!? I am sur'E! hon.

HIE!rnbc:!r IAJ'.:i.ll r'E:!Jfl(~lrlbf'!Y' ~~OI.JJ"ld POJ!d r?odd IAJIJ'i.Ch IJJdS a closet: . dc:~al, IAJh:ich IAJaS cl bc,~h·i.nd -c:'l.osf;!d -door·s dt:!i'll, IAJhi.ch IAJas an Ol"dHr :i. n Cou nci 1 dei:ll., 1~1hi . ch I~Ji:'IS donc,1 I:H=d·1'i.nd HH=! sc~Hles and, <'.l.S far· as the th~111 min::i.!;l:.~~r· I~Jo:1 S t; 0 1"1 C 1:~ r' 1'1 C'! d ;:\ 1'1 d H S r d Y' 1:\ S 1.: h ('! Prem"l.~?.r tJJas conc<,H'I'lE!d, it IAJas J"lOJH! 0 f 1. h C'! p I l b 1. :i. C 1 S b II S i. 1'1 e S S .

W h ~:! 11 some of the press and when members on Uris s ·i.c:lc,1 I:H:!gHn to g(:! t: too ho L on t:he heE!ls of gover·nrnE!nt, t.hE:!Y cl.ctlfiFJE~d ct · ff~E! on for· Fr·(;!(,1cloJTJ of Information. That was one thing l·:l'li'l i". was happerl"i.ng be hJ.nd c los r~d doors, setting up roads to mi. n is t e r· s 1 p r i v r.~ l:: <.:> co i:: t a g·e s , up to their farniliE!s, and all t:hj s sort. of l::h'i.ng. Had +.:hat nol:: be('!l'l stoppE!d, Mr. SpE!aker, tl'lE! Lord onJ.y i<nOIAJS I~Jhi:~t: IAIOUJcl hi.~VC'! happened in this Province. Thc,1 ot:h~=!r' l: h.i. ng t.:hd+:. happ~'!nC;!d I Mr.

Speaker·, was IAJhclt. I loikE! l~o rE!fE:!r l·.o i'\5 the~ Spr·ung !>YI"ldr'OIIH,1; t.h<~ Spr·ung syndrome took over· :in th:is Pr·o,ri nc:~. NOIAJ, IAJh;~ l": J.s Uw 3pr'I.Jng No. 29 RlSl9

s y nd r·ome? Th~:! Spr1.1 ng s y nd r'OHIE!, T. wou1d tel1 hon. mE:mbers, and I arn not tal.ki.ng aboui: l:·.h<"1 al1nost $23 million which has gone into the project, I ;o,un ti.~ll< Lng about th~~ Spr·ung syndromE! IAihich, I suppoSE!, is almost like a UaldmanLs syndrome. I do not know. That is no · ~. qu i.te t..h~1 IAJor·d I a111 look i.ng for.

But the Spr·ung syndrome is IJJ h (;! r· E~ Li'l<"1 g 0 V ("H' rllfHHlt.: ·j S S U C k C:! d i. rJ by fast talkers, where the gov<H'nHJPnl'. i.s suc!{(:!d :in and Jrli~cf,,1 to do things thett they tJJou1d rHH'llli.·1 l.l. y not: do .. i n "' t ·i lrll·'! oF S i:Hl.it y. T IAIOUJ.d ):'j k E:! to havE! hc-J.} f ,,, n h o 1.1 r· 1'. o r· c,1 "' "1. 1. y d f'!

I) f.! l. o p 1·: h c,1 Spr·urrg syndr·ornE! co11ceptl Mr·. s p (~ d k f;! r· . J: r I c () ul rl h '" v ~~ l. (,1;:.)

l) H I I IAIO U] d b 0 9] i:l d t 0 d 0 j t . BUt the pr·obl.1;1111 i.s I T I:H,1l.i.t:HH1 T only l'lr:-11)~;: c.t r11:i.nuh~ lE~fl:. J hr::~d SOIIH:! ol.:hor• just. COI'iC1uch~ Sp~1~·1k<:fr I MR. J. CARTER : nob~ s, but [ IAJ:'i.l. J. by saying, Mr. A po i.nt. of <H'd<H' I Mr·. Sp<-:1i31k<~r . MR. SPEAKER: A point of order. MR . J. CARTER: The hon. member 1s time is up . MR. DECI<ER: T.t .i.s not 1.1p y<,1t. MR. SPFAKER : WhE!I'l I·:. hr.:! IIH:!IrlbE!Y' Is l.: "i . Hif~ ·j s l.lfl I I tAJjJ.J. Jet h:im know . SOMr HOI\J. MfMBFr~S : Hei'.lr', hC:.:1iill''! !IIJR .

SPI:'AI<FR: Tho hon. i:h(,1 Hlf~lnbc,!r' For· l:h1~ Sl:r'r'li . f': of BeJ.] <~ T!;1 E~. MR. DECI<FR: Thank you, Mr·. Spod!<<,1r'. '-1.520 May IJ., 19 B 8 Vol. XL 1n concl.u~don, t:lri .s Fr'EH?.dOJll of Inforrnatton b:i.ll was probably one of tho bE~St b.ll.l.s I::IJat. E:!V(·H' IJJ(;!I'lt through ·th:is House, and I say that unequivocally. ODD: The day democracy dEHrli.sed was pr·obabJ .y, M r .

S p E~ a k e r• , o n C'! o f l:: h e s ad d o s t days in the history of this Pr·ov·i.nCE!. l\IOIAI onl.y did Uw act go, but tAiith thE! act went E!VE!ry good i .ni·:on l:-i.on I , .... ,). 1-h I: hE! ac;t IAJE:lnt: every good desire. MR. SPEAKf.R : 0 r· d <'! r· , p lo .:1 s C'! ! ·rhc,~ hon. rnc,11nbc:!r'' !; t · i . lnE~ .i.s 11p . MR. DECKER: Tha .ni<YQu, Mr·. Sp~~ai«cH'. SOME HO~~.QER§_ : iiHrH', I'H:!rH'! · MR. SPEAKER : TI·H~ hon. l::h1-~ HH-:llrtb<:H' for· flc,d levu<:'. MR. CALLAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I want to haVE! a fE!IAI words on this reso1ution.

First of al1 I want to cornrne:nt.: on Uw r e If WI r k s of 111 y for· rn CH' co 11. E! a g 1.1 C'! ::i. n the L.ibera1. OpposiU .on, a rnan tJJho 'i.s sti.l.l. my col.l.<~aguP i.n l::hE! LegislaturE! and, of coursE:, sU.11 rl fr.i.end, ct good friond. SOME HON. MEMBERS : H E~ ;:~ r· , h ~=! a r· ! MR. CALLAN: ~-~Tf< c,~~i dbot 1l: dr'c hi:lf':ol.oq 1. s l··.s, and he talked about EGI, every 1,300d ·i.nl:ont-Lon, dnd ~;o on.

T rn:i.ght say, Ml". 'Sp<::1akE:'l", t.hat. :i.t ·.is tny C:'IH!r'Y good -i.nl-.E~nl:.i.on l:: hi.s afternoon to stick to this r·osoJ ul."i.on. 1\lo 1:·. bE!'i.ng dn archaeologist and not being like r~ a n d y T , .. i:ll.J -i. s IAI h o d :l g s 1 1 p b o n C'! s a n c1 HXhUITIE!S t:.h:ings thi:'lt arE! bettE!Y' No. 29 R1S20

h~ft alone, I IJJa nt to stick lAd. th I:. he bi. ll I . ~~ t J11(,1 r·e; ·~d ~~ h f~ r•osoJ ut:ion we ha V Cc1 be:1for·e us, Mr. S p c,' ''' k c,n· I as S II b111i. l". h~ cl by l: he~ ruernbE:H' for· Nas kr.wp'.'i TL says 'WHFRFAS the access Lo :infor·mat.:ion r· c~ lal:·ing l·:o CotJCcH'rllllf~nt opc;Jr · r:~L:oi.on i~ an essential element for the por· for'Ht.:-Hlt0. of d11l:"i. os oF MHini:H:!r·s of the->. House of As s EHJiblyl p C\ I" 1:. -i. c 1.1l. ~1 r·l. y I . h ~1 0 r f i. C :-i.

R 1 Oppos:itjon . ' I do not know t!Jhy t:hC'!Y should bC:1 par·l.:.i.cuJ.ar·. r rn~~anl I think the S(:~cond opposi.t.i.on group s hould hAVE! just. as much a cc ess to it, and there should not b~~ dnyth i. ng par·t. i. cul.ar· about the Official Opposition in the"i.r· ~~sc,' of infor·rnai: .. i.on l:hat. t.h~~Y can gather . 'AND

WHEREAS this should bu r·~~adi . l.y M ~ :!mbE!rS of l: hE! House 'on r· ~ '! i'l son r.1 b 1. ~ ' ' no t i. c ~~ , House i s in session or information a~Jd.il.abl.~'' l::o of AssembJ.yl IAJh e t: h ~ : ! r· l:. h t1 noi:; RF J"' THEREFORE RESOLVED that the r· C:! g u l. a l: i. () n s b 0 r\llfl~~ n d (! d t·. 0 p r· 0

l) i. d ,,~ t h r.~ t. cHl y c h r.a· g (:~ s , IAJ h i c h 111 J g h t: I'HH'Hio:~ 1 1 IJ ''' p p l.y 1·. o ago n 1·. !; or· i'.lgC:!nc:i<,~s out.sjd (:1 thH Hou s e of A ss r~mbl.y, bo \.lli:'lil)(~d for· HlHHJbor·s or th~~ House.' I\JOIAJ1 t:hc:,r·p ·i.s IAJh<:l.l.: l : hc~ r·c.~solui:'.ion :) ~ ; a1J about, Mr· . Speak(:H'. In spor:·1k i ng l~ o i:hc;, r·osol.11 l:J onl one hcts to ctsk onese1f several ql.lt'!SI : i.ons: l1~hy ·i.s -i.l:. n~~Ct''ssary t:o gath~>.r· i nforrnat:ion? For what purpose does t he off"i.ci~l. Oppos:i L:i.on nE,ed thi. s informat:ion?

Mos t pc-:l opJ.~~ IAJho ga l.:hN' infor·rnation, students who go to school. and gat:. h~: !r' infor·1nat.i.on1 they use it:.. Or 'if somE,body is attending a par t icular trade at tr·ade school or t~n :iversity, or IAJhat evc,1r', t:hE:~IJ qath~: ,r· J.nfor'Hiat:ton <-Hld they ga t her· knowledge so t:hat:. L h (,1 y c a n 1.1 ~ ; c,1 'i. 1:: i. n a p o s i. t. i. tJ e IJ.Ja y LlS2l May 4, J 988 Vol XL. in a futur·e job opportun:i.t:y, CdY'E!Or dl'ld SO Ol'l. B 1.1 l'.

IJ.J hi .~ 1": -i. s 1: h c,1 p u r· p o ~ ; C'! ? !AI h y "i. s thc-:1 official Opposition s o ·i. n 1: f'! r· : ~ s h:~ rl ·i n o b trri. n :i. n g :infor·rnat:-i on about. gov~~l"I'Hil~H I L' s dct ·i.tJ "i.l:-i.c;,s? hie~ knOIJ.J, Mr·. ~:>pe;:,lkE!t ' , t he:1 ld nd of '.i nf orrr1cl t i o n that: IAJcl s .:~ s I< r,1 d for· J. d s t s 11 rnrn P r· r::~ n d J. i:'l s 1:. Fall; WE! knoli.J the' kind s of lc-:~tt (:~ r s Lh.~·1t IAJont 1-.o Vr:l.r·:-i.ou s lll ·i.n "i.s t:er· s a nd U1c-:1 ldnd of :inforrnat:i .on that lAJ a s S () 1.1 g h 1·. 1 i.'l n d 1 () f C () U Y' $ f~ 1 (AJ ('!

S (:'l(AJ () n t: h e 0 r· d e r· P a p e r , o n t h e d cl y Uw House-?. opc;,nE'd, ;:-1bou 1": :120 questions - the samE! six or SE!V E!n que s t:ion s r·E:~al.l.y .. di.r·ec b :'d t.o abou 1:: l:.IAJE!nt.y d:lfferent ministers. So even though they sa i d i.L was 120 questions, it IJJas actually six of t: h E:1 ~; c1 111 c->. q 1.1 f:' s t tons d :i r• c,' ct. to! d t. o twenty different rn:in:ist:er s , or so . Mr. SpeakE!r', 1.1.1hy is thE! off·.icia1 Opposi.l ... 'i.on so :i.nl· :or'<'! S l".:~'!d, in getting information?

Is it b~~causc,1 Lh~~ ofFicJ ,:·Il O p po~;-L I :. 'i.on want to J.earn how government is run? Do !:hey Wi:'lnt: l:o g e l: informat:.:ion so that. ti'IE:!Y Cf.ll'l F' o Y'llllll •. ~ l:cc1 pol "i c i . P S f 0 r· l". h (,~ l..i . I:HH' i:·\ l. Opposit'.ion, policies t hat. th e y IAJOIIld h0p ( ~f11l.l.y I.I SC'! ·i. f [·: hey (! ~UH' cr-.lrnE:1 to pOIAJ~~r? No, Mr· . Spedi<EH· . T h '" ,.. · i. s no I: l: h ~~ r· ~~ t:·l s o n . MR. J. CARTER: F'or· 1n i.s chi,~ f , l:hal:: -Ls all. . MR. CALLAN: The member for St:. Jphn's North 1~s~~ s i.-l good IAICH' d. Mr·. SpHal<c'!r, when I was OU(~ r there, therE!

IAH:!r E• i'.:IAJO 0 Y' 1'.: h r• ~ ~ E:! p (:' 0 p l t~ IJJh 0 IAH:~ Y' ~~ S 0 int:.e1nt on gat:h E!ring t:ha .t sort of lnforrnal:ion l".hat they lot: their district work go by thE! waysidE,, and for that-. rea s on t hey will. J.o s e their districts , Everybody in th E! l..i.bc;!r·~l. CdLICU!> knOIAJS t•.Jho I am t:alking about. Th~~SE! t:.wo or LhrE!E! "i. n d 'i. v .. i. d 1.1 t'll . s n n gl. P c l". ~'' d t h l'! ·.i r· No. 29 R1521

d·"i.str•i . CI7.S, ti-H~Y pokE:~d t:hwi .r i'lOSI'!S :into other s hr.ldOlAI portfoJ.ios, all, o f c o u r· s <,~ , t. o 'i. rn p r· f:! s s +.: h t~ l. ~~ a cJ ~=! r .... 'Lool< how hard I am wor·king, M1~. Leader. Look at all the :inforrnatj on I have gathE!rE!d. I am go"i.ng t.o gi.u~~ thi.s l~o The Sunday Express, I am going to give it t.o Reg Sherren of the CBC 1.1.1ho t.s r.l close fr··:iend of mine, and I wi.J.l g·i.ue .H. to Lynn Bur·r·y of NTV IJ.Iho is also a close friend of mine. MR. PATTERSON : . Or Barbara Y~ffe. Mf~.

CrlLLAI\J: 0 r· B a I" b a r· a Y a f f e , 1/J h o i s a c 1 o s E:~ Fr·i.~;Hld of 1ni.rw! Mr·. ~3pr,~iilkf'!t', 1-: hdl: Jr. Hl(o! qiH:~stJ<HI that has to be dskr~d. ~ : ;--i,nc~;~ l:hr~ offtc ·i.r:-\l Opposil-.i.on -.-i!; so intfH'E:~sted in and so d r,~ 1·: n r·,n·i. ned l·o g .:·11: h o r• :i nf Ol"nt<'.l t oi on, th~~ 1 og:i. c a 1 iH1d o l:)l) :i. o 11 s q 1.1 o s l: 'Lon 1-: h <:'1 1: F o J.l c11m; -L s : Why cro you IAii'J.I'lt.. th-.is :i.nfor·rnat .ion? MR. J. C_ARTER: For rni.sclri.<wol.ls ptu·pos<,~s . MR. CALLAN : The answer, Mr.

Lhe member for just indJcated, purposes, to l:ry government or mini.s l: er·. MR. PATTERSON: SmE!ar tactics. MR. CALLAN: Speake!r, is, as St.:. John's Nor· l·.h for mischievous to (:~rrtbi.H'r'ass 1:-.h<,~ a particular ~)Ill~'! a r 1:: d c 1:. :i c s , 1-: h r,~ rn~:!trlb ~;:! r· F o l" Placentia sC~ys. Mischievous f>IH'POSE!S, SH!ec:H' h:lC 1-.l.C pur·pos~~S, r..tnd, of coursE:~, to try and <,~rnbdr·r·~ss gouor·n1nonl·_. Now, Mr. Speaker, when did the ol~fi.ci.<'~ll Oppos:i.l~--i.on arT i , IJ(~ ;·.,t -1-.h"i.:; po:int?

T r·~~rn~~mb~;!r, i:~nd l:h~~ lfl(,~lflbtH'S of l : h(~ l..i.b~H'i:ll Uli.ICIIS IJ.J:i.l.l r·em<,Hni:H:H', that wh<-,1n tl · r~~ ne1.u l~~dder· 1..152 /. May 11., 1. 9 8 8 Vol XI.. l:ook OlJor· -i.n JunE!, nobody t~Jas all o1.ued to spE!ak publicly t.o thE! IIH~di. d unl.~~SS, of COUY'S(,~, i.l:: l~ldS approved by the Leader, and espec: i.;:~Jl.y not all.OIJ.IE!d t :~ o speak .if the statement had any negativity at:tacht:!d t.o it., or· pc->.r·haps, if it could possibly c1ash 1.1.d.th an :idea t:ht:'l.t l·: h~~ Leader of l:h<-'! Oppos ::i.tJ.on had.

If there were any divergence of op:i.n'i.on, -Lf t.h<;! mat:t·_<-'!t' wa~~ controversial, do not go 1~r:.Lt:h i.t .. Ltnt"i.J. you r·11n i . l-. by mo fi.r·st .. No neg~tivity! That is how the Ler"d~~r of l:hc;! Oppos'it:-:i .on sl·:ar"l:-.E•cl out last June, Mr . Speaker. I was l:i'H:! r· r~ , a n d T I< n o IAJ . N o 1.~1 , IAJ h a L. happ<,~nE!d? The :i . dE:~a was, Mr. Speaker·, t hcli:. l:hi.s nHI~J 1 . 1-~,:~drH ' I~Jd!> gcd.ng t:o portray to the people of this Pt'()\) irlCl'! 1-: hi.·) [·_ ' I liHt'('!

I i'llrl lHd.i.f:!S and gE!nt:l<-:~ITIE!n, hE!r'e I arn, the '" 11: H r· n ;:·l t-: i. 1.1 n , I-_ h r~ t:-1 l ·l: (! r· n d l:: e Pr·c-:1mier, and I do not 'inl-:end -1-:.o co11tr~ to tJ.J'i n f>OIAH'!r' :i.n U·r·i s f>r·ou-:i nc(:! and become the Premier of this P r· o IJ ·i n c E! by d r· a g g J. n g o 1:: h ('' r· p ~~ o p 1 E• down. The members in my caucus IJ.I h () b (:~ l. t {:~ u ~~ .i. n t: h i:'l t. ' r 0 r· g (:! t j_ t. . I That is what the Leader of the Oppos i.t Lon Si:l i.d.

I arn quot.ing t.he Leader of the Opposition . 1 I do not want the rriE!rnbe!rS of my CiilllCI.IS, ' sa i.d l:h~~ l..f::H'l.d<'!r' of l:he Opposit:ion, he probably did not Si:·lY i. t·: ·i.n thf::'Sf~ IJ.Ior·ds, b1JI: .illS() many words, that is what he was St·ly:i . ng l ~ o us, 'T. want l:: o ascend l:.o the Premier's job by portraying to i:I·H;! pr~op ly of 1-. he P r·o u 'in U'! a rna n of int:E!grity IAihO dOE!S not: bE!J.-iE!VE! j_ n d r· ~·lg 9 -i, n q o t h n r· p f~ o p 1 ( ~ d OIAI n ;:-1 n d doE!S not bE!li eve in fault find:ing i:Hld nng;'I ·I:·-L\)'i l:y. ' But, Mr.

Speaker, what happened OIJ(!r' 1:1-lC:! COI . It'l;(~ of '1-:he ~:)LIIfllfi(H'? Nobody r(.;!al.ly knoiAIS. I cannot po-i.nl: <'1 fj_ngf:!r' l:o IAJI'HHl oxactl.y i.t:: happened, but over tho coursE! of No. /.9 RlS22

. ~ the Summer that aJ.] changed. The l.1:1ader chang<;!d h"i.s po.i.nt of v · i.~:!111; h <;I had c h i:Hl9 e d h t ~; a p p r· o a c h , fl. n d by l'.:h<:1 1-.: i.JrH~ l".hc:·ll".

Uw l~ouncl Pond road episode roJJed around, now t: h ~=! n , 1': h E:1 I_ r~ t:'l d (~ r· Wd s IJ 1:1 r· y dj ~;appo:-i ntE~d that certain i n cl i. 1ri. cl1.1 c:-11. s ·i. n 1-. h o I_ J J:) lH' <'~ l P cH' 1: y hillel not b~HHl do :i ng ·U1 E:d r· hornei.JJO r I< 1·. 0 ·1: h l:' ('!X [:C.:! n [-: i: h c'll-: l: h C'! y C: 01.11 d c:>nli:Ji-:li'Tiil s s go v ~:!1'' I'IITII':'! n t and b r·i n g :i t l: o t: h r,1 p r· n s s b r,1 for· o l: h r,, N D P J:JI"OUgh-1. it. MR. P(lTTFI~SOI\J : Oh, ruy lor·d . MR. CAL I. AN: ·rhat "i.s IAJhi.·lt happE!I'l~~d. Mr·. Speaker.

You see, what happened in essence is this: The Leader of the Opposition, as he talked to h"i.s bi'lckroorn boys, c:tnd thc:1 Chair·rnan, and the various cormnitt~H;!S that. i.1.HH'~1 s<;!t. 1.1p l::o gE! t el~~ct:-ion r'E!adi.nes!; policiE!S and e u e r' y t h i. n g e l. s C:! i. n p l. a c <:! , i:: h a t t: ~l<-)Y did not haVE! any ideas. They d i. d n o t h a u e a n y <.·l 1. 1:: (;! r· n a t i v (;! s 1~. o I:H·ing t.h:is Pr·ovince to full (~Ill p l. 0 y rn E! 1'1 t-: 0 r· p a r· 1: i. c:~ l I t. () 'i. 111 p t' 0 u H on on the status quo, really. There were no policies .

Tl'l(~r·o IJ.Jas 1::.:-ll.k const.c:u1t:ly ,~J:)OIII: 'I he,, School Tax Aut. hor':i t.J E:!S. 'LE:•t I I ') g (,~ t: r· "i. r:l 0 f 1: h e ~) c h 0 0 J. T c'l X A lJ ·1 hoI" :i U e s . 1 T h C·HI , of co tH' s f:' , l:: he qu<~sl:ion llldS, 'If~~~~~ ~;c:-1y l:hdl·:, IAthc-. .1'1:. iH'e 11..Je go:-i ng to rc;!pl.ace it: IAJi. l:h? ltJ(~ IJ.Jil.l. l:r·o:;s l:hdl:. br'i.1:lgo IAihOn IAH:! COfllf:! to :it... W· E~ I.JJiJ.J. fi.g11r·o 01.1t: l:hc:·lt IAli'lC:!I'l IAH:! fot'lll I::I·H:• governmE~nt. ' Thc,~so wer·c,1 1~.he sorts of t:hal: happE:!I'lE~d .i.n l::h(:! Par·ty, Mr·. Speaker. That happc:'!ned.

So , L h c;! n t h c;! r· (,, was a b i. g Then therE! !Alas an aiAiful i.n gal.hc,1r"i.ng 'i.nfor'mdt:·i.on l...lS/.3 May 4, ] 988 things L i. bE! t' a 1. is IAJhat r·ush on. :intorE!St l.:hrough Vol. XL the Freedom of Information Act, <.~nd :-i.l·: wa:; r:-1b01j 1: I:: he'\ l~ 1~. i.me, Mr·.

Speaker, last Fall, and. of COI.It'Sn, "i.l'l 1-:.h:~ E~Clr'l.y lfiOI'll:·.hs of this nE~I.JJ year·, JiHluar'y, and Fc,!bt'llf.H'Y, Uldi: Wf'! s,:~w i· : h~~ l.c;!adc:H' of the Opposition on sever~]. o c c r:~ s 'i. o n !> o n 1·: o 1 e IJ .i. s i o n i:·l n d .i. n l: h e rnE'!dia, genE~raJ.]y, t:allcing about. hOIAJ Uw Opp1H> i l.:.i.on HlfHnbnr·s IAHH'('• restricted and hindered in their r:1b "i.l.i.l :y l:o gdl:hot' :in-For •rnt.>li.:-Lon fr·olfl various ministers. M r· . S p r-~ ;·" I< e r· , l: h a l-. i. !'; !AI h y i ·. h f! Liber·aJ.

Opposi t.ion IJ.tant:.cc•d Lo g;'ll:hc:!r' th·i . s :i.nFor'Hiat ·i.on, nol:: l:·. o use it.: for any posJ.t.:ive, c o n s 1-.: r· u c 1.: :i. v E~ p u r· p o s e ~; , b u 1·: L o u ~; C:' it. t:o try and E•rnbal"rass onE! uri.n i.s tor· a F l.:l':•r· i:'lno t-.hc;!r, and, of courso, for mischievous purposes and for smear tacttcs. ThEH'(~ iH'C:! on<;! or· I:.IAJO pE!opl.E! on l::hE• Liberal benches over there, Mr. Sp(~<.~I<E!t', I.AJho IAJ~:! r'e a J.ol ·:. bE!I::I::('!r' at. it than others . I was interestod, Mr·.

SpoakE!r', c'l couple oF clays, or· perhaps a week after t.:he 1 .. o g ·.i. s l. i·1 t 11 r· r-:! o pun f~ d 1-. o d 'L s co u E:! r· t: h P member for S'l.. BarbE:! (MI". Fur'c,•y), .r. s diAl h ·i.111 on I~ t'! l. P IJ .. i !; ·i. on onE! n i. g h t-. , as the Transportation critJc . Th.?tt·: ·i. s IJ.JI'li.·ll: hr:~ cHll.~:!< ' l ht1ns~~lF. ThE:~ rrH~rnber· for· St .. BadH'! 1.~1r.1s on l:c,~1 r,~IJ · i.~; · i on spr:'i·lk i 119 TrrH1!>por·tat:-.ion cr·-.it: .i c. I looked across the Legislature F 0 r• s r-:!

I) f'! r· c'·ll d c:•1 y s i:'l n d T s i''liAl 1:: h ~' depressod and perhaps the angry J.ook on L:he ·face of t·:hc! lll~ ' !tnbc'!r' for· Burgeo Bay d 1 Espoir (Mr. G·i.]. b(:!r't.) bE:!Ci'lLI!>(~ l.:ho IIW!'rlb(~r' ·For· St:.. Bar·be lo~Jas trying to pu11 thE! smrnr-'! ti.>lCI:.·lc on h.i.s coll~~agu(;! for· BurgE•o - Bay d' Espoir· that he had p1.1l.1c;!d on lfH~ l.a s l~. ~3ulflrn(: !r and 1 a st Fall. MR. TLILK : (Tnaud ·i.bl.

e) No. 29 he hi3.S done . R1~>23

Ml~. FURF~ Y : Nobody c~n find it . MR . CA LI.AN : Mr . Speaker·, I do no t know 1o~.1here t.hn Ledcl~:!r' of l ·.: h~~ Oppos i.t""i.on and his rules of or·der arE! now. Now, :i. 1:: i. s q 1 J i. h1 "i. n o r· d E! r' f o r' c a 1~ c a J. l. s to come from his House Leader and also fr·orn ·Hw member for Sl:. Bar·be IAJho rather than, instead of bEd.ng given the Transportation portfolio, as he :i.s quoted as saying hc'!r~1 in t:h ·i.s newspapc,1r·, hc,1 say:., 1 A month after I 1o~.1as given 1·.: h <~ T r· a n s p or· t a t i. o n poI" t: f o l. ·i. o , 1 instead of that happE!n:ing, Mr .

Sp(::1aker·, th~) lfiEHnbm' for· St·: . 8i:tdH:1 was given no portfoJio. He was s l::r' i.ppE!I.i of ;:o:~ny shr:·1dOIAI fHH'Lfol.:-i.o . He lo~.IC:iS punish~HJ, Ml". Speaker·, for· going on -Ln r-:!VC'!ry rl "i.r·c;!c l:ton. rJJR. Rl.I~3SELI..: A b 61 d t' n flo t' l: c C:H' d . MR. CAI .. I..Ai\1: ·-------He got a bad report card . That is lo~.Jhal-. U : r:·111101.1nl:s t··. o, y1:!S. MR. PATTERSON : Subversive activities. MR. CALLAN: Mr. Speaker, I am going to tell the Leader of the Oppositi.on someth :ing no1o~.1 hE! should know .

At a t.tmc,1 lo~.Jhc,1n l::hc,1 LeacJc,1r' of t:hc,1 Opposition 1.1.1as saying that I IJ.Jas not Ci:U'r·y ·i.ng out. 111y shado1.1.1 responsibilities effectively, I r' E!lfiH Ill~)(' ! Y' l:: he C aU C 1.1 S t: h c\ t I.~IE! .l'l d d p r· o b a b 1 y e1 c o u p 1 e of 1.1.1 e E! k s b e f o r e l-. h~~ Hol .t!H:! oF Ass(:!lnbly opc'!I'H'!d iHld w~~ 1o~.1er·~~ all expected to have r ~=! s o l. 1 J -1: J. on s for· .t: h ('! 0 r· d c;! t' f' ;:1 p r~ r· r·c'!i'.tdy. T had i-l r'(~solut"ion n~1ady, M r· . S p c~ r.1 k u t' , a n d I h "' lJ (~ ""i. t-. t' i g h t: h(:!I"E:) j n fr·ont of I'IIE! aci:t~i'.llly.

I r· e <:-H:I "i.l: , .~-1 s o l: h n r· lllf~tnb rH' s 1~1h o h r.·\d i h~HIJ r·(!i:l.dy, eLi d. T could r·ead ·:.L 1:. l'lOIJ.I b11l·. T do nol: knOill holll tfiiJch t:irue :r hi:~ve . 1.. 1. 5?. 'I· f.IJr'\Y IJ., 1. 9 B B Vol. X I. r'IR. PATTF RSOI\J : Go ahead, read it. MR. UtL.I...AN: The ITIE!mber for CarbonE!ar·, thE! M"inJsl:·.(~r of l·lous.i .ng (Mr·. Pc'!ach) thought that I should haVE! put it on t.hc,1 Or·der· Papc;!r' lo~.JhC'!I'l T shoiM(~d it t:.o him. I had it. pr'E!pclred for the Oppo s.ltlon. Anyway, in c o n s u 1 t a t. i o n IJ.d. t. h t h E!

P r E!llli E! r a n d wlt.h 1:-.he Mi.ni.sL~~r· of H(=!al.t.h (Dr'. Collins), and since a member i s only ~~nltt:l.c,1d l::o one->. r·c;!sol.ut.i.on, I was encouraged to go wi t. h rny r'~1SOl.IJI:".oi.on on 1·.-.1-H:! CcnliE! By Cht.HlCE! CJ.i.n"ic. EVE!rybody rE!I"IIE!rnbE!r's that b o c r.nt s e i. 1: i. s o n 1: o d a y 1 s 0 r· cl C'! r· PapE!r. Here was my reso1ution as the Oppos:i.l-."i.on s p o !< C'! s Hli:-1 n o n 1-1 o 1,1 s i. n g :

WHEREAS C~nada Mortgage and llou~; -i. ng Cor·por'di :·Lon h•·1~> pr·oducr: :!d <->. s tJ matE! s s ugg~~ s t:i. ng thd t LhE•I" Ii:! llri . l]. b (! 1:1 s :.i. g i'l "i. r :i. c.:·\ n {: d f'! c l i. n C! .i. n the demand for new hou s ing , (~ s p f ~ c t i.'lll y t' r-~ n t ;:·\ l h o u s l n g , :i n t: h -L s Province over the nex t fifteen yoar·s; i.~nd

WHEREAS onE! of tiAIO pri.mary cauSE!S for the decl i ne t n housing requi~ernents in Newfoundland and Lab r~ c:~ ':1 o r' .i. s <: o rl t·. t n u :.i. n 9 o u l·:. migration from our Province; and

WHEREAS housing construction is a HJ<:ljor· player· ··i.n l::h .is Pr·ov:incc~ 1 s economy, contributing $200 nri.lJ.ion l~o OUY' E!COI'lOIIIY on cHl ;:'ll'lnltal. bas:i.s; and

WHEREAS the second primary c aus e f o r· l: h e cl e c l. ·J n (o1 'i. n h o u s i n g requir't'!mE!nts is thE! ag:i.ng of l:.hE! pOplll.d 'L.iOrl, lAJ~l:i.Ch IAJ:i.Jl COHiflOI .II'ld itself as Cl larger number of young 1\J r,,

I) IF o 11 n d 1 i·1 n rl C.:! r· s r:-1 n d 1.. db r· ado r· tan s rrri gr·at:.E! fr·om t.hJs Pr·ovJ nee;! clS u n H rn p 1 o y Hll':1 n l··. ·i. n c t' ('! r:-1 s o ~· d 11 !·'! 1-:. o l r:,, c k of housing construct:ion; 1\Jo. /.9

THEREFORE

BE IT RESOLVED that the M i.rri.s t.EH' of Hous i.ng l:ake lunned i.a t:e Gt:ops t:o convince his Cabinc~1t colleagues thctt hous lng and cor-recting the rE~ason for OLit rwigr·ati.on b~:~cOIIIf'! pr·o1ri.nc'i.aJ. government priorities. SOME HON. MEMRFRS: HC:)rH', he<.H'! MR. CALL AN: [ I" e ,::1 d I II y t' c~ S 0 l. I I l.'i. CJ 1'1 1". 0 i". h (,~ C d 1.1 C I I ~; i':.t n d t h '"! 1.. c,~ cH~ c,H' o f t· h E! 0 p p o s j t. :i o n s .:n d , 11 T h .:·1 i". I" r,~ s o J. 1 1 1: "i. o n d cH' s n o 1". l'fli'..l k (~ ruu c h s (~ n s c,~ .

You i'1 r· (~ s1199(~S 1: ·i.ng Uli::t L N~:!I~JFOIHldldndfH's come:~ bC(ck horne to build somE! house:~s. 11 J did not make any commE!nt but I ITll.l s t b:~ l.l. +.:1-H:l Lead ~H' oF 1:1'1 E! Opposi l":i'on this: After t:11at c i:'l u c u ~; end(:~ d 1': h (! r "' IAJ(~ r (~ 1110 r· (~ 1·.: hi:~ n one, tl1ere were several cau.cus IIIC:HIIber•s IAlhO COIIIIJIC:11'l'l".(;!d 1":0 me;!, 11 1 do not know how he managed to pick that. out of l:hat:. 11 Th(~Y thoughl·:. it was a good resolution. Mr.

Spec\ker·, since the Leader of t. h E! 0 p p 0 S 'i. 1: .i. 0 n d i. d n 0 t t h "i. n k 1·: h H t: CHIC;! tJJas VE!ry good, I then made a cormrH~nt .. ·i.n l'.hr.d: uwc11s t:hdl: l:.hc,1 TJI(:1TT!bel" for· St. Bar· be (Mr. Furey), IAJho IAJds 1::1-w cr·"i.ti.r: L::tst yf;!,H' for· Consurn(>.l" Affair·s, l·1r1d a r·f:lsoJ.ut:ion on 1_,:·1 s 1: y oar· 1 s Or·rk!t' Pi:-lpur· r'(;:gal"ding t:.hc,: h:i gh pr:i ce of o'.i J i.Hld gas iHld ho1nr:! hr~.:~t i ng ·furd in th:i.s Pr·ov:incf:! . ~;o I sa:id, I could g 0 IAJi 1: h t: h i.·1 1'. 0 n f~ ' r h ::!

L 0 d d r:~ t' () f lit(~ Oppos:i t::i on t'l':::sporH~C;!cl, 1 Yes, it i.s i.mpor·Lanl·. r: l:h"i.n!< tAll~ should hi:!Vf~ f:l rf~sol t.t'l':.:i.on on that. 1 As tl't(~ L(~Cidc.;!t' of· the Oppo!d U on, M r· . S p (~a k (H' , HI a cl E:: 1: h r~ 1:'. c o un n c;l 1'1 l: t n that caucus, I can b;!ll you that t.:h(~ mf:HnbE!r' for· ~)L. Bar·tH~. tAJho tAJas stripped, as I saJd, a couple of weeks before that oF all. portfolios, wrote a note that he Ll525 Uol. XI .. pushed along to one of his col.l.(~agt.l(~~; .i.n Ci:'lucus.

I do not. reme1rnber it uJord for· wor·d but: 1 SdiAJ t:hc,1 noh~ and ·i.t sc:"ti.d, 1 DCH!S th:i.s mean that t:l1e L.E!adE!r' of LhE! 0 p p o s .i. 1.: :i. o n 1:. h · i. n k s 1'.: h t-1 1'.: t: h o h : i. g h prices that Mel Woodurar·d .is chr.·1r·gi.ng ·i.n Nor·l:hHrn Nc.;!I~Jfoundl.and and on thE! Coast of Labrador· s h o 1 tl. d i'1 l. ~; o b H .. i. n v r'l s t. :oi. g "' l~ ,,, d ? 1 NolAJ, that, of cotH'S(:~, Mr·. Spc~ai<EH', 1.•1<~1 !) . r:·1 n o b

t) to 11 s r' ~~ F r:! t' en c n 'l: o 1:: h El fact that the former member of Lhe H () I I s 0 0 F A s s H I( I b l y i:·1 l'l d I : h f'' millionaire from Labrador, Mr. Wood l.lk1 r· d , .. i. ~; p o s !; i. b l y o n ( ' ~ o f 1·: he contributors to Lhe LE!adc~r of the Oppo~;-i . l::i.on 1 s supplc,1tflf~nt.•:~l. salF1r·y. M r . S p e a k E! r , i f t h e rn E!ITI b E! r· f o r· S l ..

B iot r· b E~ , IAJ h o ;:~ f u tAl d i:1 y s a q o , tAl h l'! n I made somE! stateiTIElnt.s hE!t'E~ in l·:hi.s L~~g·i.slat:ur(~, wc;lnt.". oul:'.s i.riE! 61nd t.old a d:i.fferent: story and told it. not 1:'. h (:1 1Ali.·1 y :i. t:. lAid S , b II 1".: 1:: h (:~ IAii:'A lj hE' hoped it lAJas, IJJclnts to dE!ny IAJr 'i. t ·i. n g t: h a r. no t: (~ , 1 can s d y 1:: o the Leader· of thE! Oppositi.on and l·:o !:hH III~Hni:H~r· For· ~H .. Bar•b(,1 that somebody has that no l::El. I d:i.d not 9 E! t i. t. .

J S diAl "i. 1: , I arn yooi.ng l::o lfJr:-11<::! ·it: v~:!I"IJ Elasy for thE.~ L..eadE!r of t.he Oppos:ition. 1:1'. t~Ji:l~; obtJ·:i.otlsl.y handr:!d i':.o· a member for l..al:ll"ador.

So thc'\t. n .:~ I" r· Cli~J s for the lo f ·i nd sent::. ·i. '1: d ot~ll'l tJ n r· y , t.J e r· y n ·.i c u '1. y Leader of l..hf~ Oppos:i L'.'i.on ()IIi: i:O I.AJhOifl l:i'ldl'. noi~ C'! l.~ldS I arn sur·~~ that l:he:1 l:tAJo merni:HH'S tAJho r' n p r' c·'!·S H n l: rl·i. s '1.: r· ·oi. c Is i n I ;:-' b t' <:1 do r· will be honest and will say to the I ' ~~~~ d 0 r' 0 f l". h 0 0 p p 0 s i 1·: i. 0 n • I y e s • r remember quite vividly getting Lhat: nol~ o fr·orn t.hE! lnC;!IIIb('!Y' Fo1" ~3t. Barbe. 1 That, Mr.

Spelaker, is an incidE!nL that I wanted l'.:o relate to !::he LeadE!r' of the Opposition becausE~ I · No. 29

aru do:i ng h:i nr a fc~votH'. HcO! may not rt-:~~l · i . LI,~ Jt:, r'lr' . Spf~ dkl~!r', brlt i.F thE~ l .. ec-.H:h~r of thE! Opposit:ion i':l'lOUght : t:hi'\ l: J: ll)d~> Ol'lH of t:hc,~ r·l'?.r.ISon~; why he tAJould not w:i n thE! rHo! x l:. lo! l. o c l: ion , :r s •'l y 1: o h i.1n n orJJ, a~; T sa :id to him in pr :ivate, t:hat I tAras her·c~ gol:l . ing rnys!':~l.F !':~l.!':1CI-:.l-?.d and rE~·-elec:t.ed on nobody 1 s coat:t;::d .l.sl al~ t'\ t.i.rnE?. wh!':Hl oth~H· rnernbc,1rs L\rere going dotJJn to defeat.

I stood on my feet on the other side of the House when there IAIE!r'E:1 only four· oF f"i. v~?. of us there, or seven or eight. Who does he think kept the Liber~l Par·ty al.iVE! sinCE! 1975, lArhen I tAJas f i.rs t el.!':H:lE!d I'HH'!':1 and Uw rnerni:HH' for Bonavista North was elected h ~H' e:1 r:~ t '1':. h e s r~Hn e t. i. ITH'! ? Th!':~ hon . nre:Hnber 1 s t -.irne j s up . SOMF HON. MEMBERS: Ohl oh! fl y l. (~ i:•llJ (~ ! MR. CALLAN: [ IAJ'i. ll. h r:-1 V c,~ now and the Spoa k<H'. MR. WELLS: Mr·. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: lo 1.: s oF lr.tst The hon. the 0 p p o s ·i. 1: i. o n . SOME HON.

MEMBERS: H~~ar I hc-:1ar·! MR. WELLS: 1:.-i.rl1!':1 bel~bl~!!f~n of June, Mr . of the Th~nk you, Mr. Speaker. Mr• . Spor..tl<er·, I l::o Hl~·li<H on l:ho Ci'HII'rOt i>IVO'.i d r· c~! s p o n s "i. b i . l. i l: y haVE! b·i.l.l . . S 0 TTH~ l:o I. l S26 Mr:~y 4-, 1988 i'l f E!IAI po'.i. nt 5 nrrt F·ir·s 1-. l dE!9Y'(,'E! of Hli:·l )( f:1 S OIIIC:1 VoJ. XL. comTTIE!nt on the we j 11 s 1: ~w <H'd supposedly hon. 1·1 OilS c~ . s tup:i d t-.r:ipc,, C:01111,1 oui: oF rrrernbe:n· For SOME HON. MFMBERS: Ht::1ar, hear! MR.

WELLS: t.hat 1:: hE! this The poor· fc,1 J.l.ot"' h<:ls go 1:: htlnSE!lf rJJorked :i.nto such a statE! that c:·ll 1 h ~~ C a tl d 0 IAI h E! 1'1 h (,1 S t d 1'1 cl S i rl 1:: h E! House to spE!ak on a rnat:I:E!r J.j_kE• fr·t~c~doln of :i.nfor·mal":'i.on or· l:he budget or speak on anything i s a t t. a c l< h i. s for· rn l'H' c o 1. l. C'! a g tH~! s . WE! do not nE!E:~d to say anyth'ing, Mr·. Sp~~ak~1r·, E.~XCE!pt.: l·:u pui.nt l:h~1 pre~; s and eVE!rybody who is listE!n:ing in N~1t~rfoundJ.;:Hld 1:-.o jr.r~;t. l.i.~>'I:.E!I'l l·. o Lh1':! hon. member and they will know

l) f'! Y' y IAI C:' l. J. IAI h y +: h f'! h 0 1'1 • I rl ~~ 1 rl b (i! Y' i. S no longer in the Liberal caucus and 1~rhy llJC! t~HH'I~ just-i.F·i.<~ !d i. n t.ak:i ng the posit::ion tha t IAJE:' dtd . T h c,1 1 rH'! 111 bet' ~~Jr'l ~; no t·. p (!! r· F on n:-i n g h i ~ ' dutj E:1S and wh~~n lAIE! clr'('!W :it t.o hi s .:~l:l : l~!ni".ion 1 hc,1 Fi'li.l.nd ;::rnd h('! cr·arJJl.Hd away misE!r·abJ.y to per· for·rn t•rhc~ !t'l,1 h~ ' ! r~roul.d pr·ub.:-tbly bo ;:·l s h'H'. SOME HON . MEMBERS : I~ (,HH' 1 h(!rH'! MR. TULK: That is right. MR. WELLS: NOtAl, Mr.

Speaker, I woul.d liko to addr·~~ss l::h i.s lllcltter· oF l::he f1"c-:1c,1dorn of information resolution . That r·c~~;ol.r~t.ton .. - MR. PEACH : Table your· sal.ar·y . MR. SPEAKER: 0 r· d o t' , p l e a s c,1 ! ()r> d ~H' I p ·1. o r'l s c~ ! MR. PEACH: !Alhat ·i.s your· MR. WELLS: No. 29 ~>dl.ar·y und('!r'? 1ns26

That r· e s o 1. u H . o n , M r . S pea k e r , h ()\ s a rc:1al pur·poSE! and it: seems that the hon. lnr;•tnbc:,rs fro111 I. he'! o HlC-H' side LIJho have spoken on this rna t. t: C.;! r· to da t E! h a v ~~ c->. ·i. 1:: h c,1 r· rn i. s s E1 d or ar·e trying t.o avoid the point of t. h t1 r· E~ so l.tJ l:. "i. on . The~ Fr·ec-?.dorn Of T.nfor'rrti::tt.i.on (let i.s a good p :iecc~ of legi sJ.ation. It pr' OlJ i.des !-:hat: govE:!r'nuwn1.: Hlu~; I: llli'li<~: ! avii\j J i'..tbl e :i nformat :ion :in ordE!r t·o f'! n s 1.1 r· o H1 d 1: 1: h o p 1.1 b l.

"i. c: ·i s f 111. l. y and propE:'I"] y ".i.nfc>r' rnE:H~ as Lo IAJhat go lJ E:! r· nuH:! n 1: i. s 1 I o :i. n g pd r· 1". ·i. c 111 .:~ r· ·1 y IAJ".ith taxpayer·s 1 doJ]c:~rs. Thi'.lt is d p e r F H c l: •"'~ n d v ,.~ l. ·j d p 1.1 r· p o s c~ . Mf~. p[()CJ-1 : Did you do that with your salary? MR. WFI..I.S: Mr . ~)pC:1dklH', I~JOUld yuu l .. r·y Hnd find a bra:in to attach to that mouth or· c: au s E~ i. t 1:: o b c,1 q 1.1 i. o 1:. , on E:1 o r· t h e o t h e r ? SOME HON. MEMBERS : Hear, hear! SOME HON. MEMBERS : Oh, oh! AN HON. MEMBER : I OIJJ blows! MR. SPF.AI<F.R: Or•de:H', pl.E~i'lS<c1!

T must: r:-ldrn:i. t l:hal: l~lhf>.n l:hA l.<',lSI: ruerubet" was speak:ing we cl:id have a f,,, ·i.r· aHIOIHll : of s ·.U. c~ncc~ dnd r. IJJOIIl.d Cl ~; I< f o I" U 1 E:1 s '" m (! t. h :i n g o n Llri s si.de of tho H011Se. Tf dnyboc ·ly C:i.'.lr'PS to spec:.~l< r..tfi.~~r·, I IAJould b~~ tnor't'! 1":1·1.:-~n pl.c;! c:·lsr:~d 1-.:o r·uc:oyn ·i.lc:! thc~1m. Th~:1 hon. t. hc~ of the Oppos i.l:. Lon . MR . WELLS: ·Than_k ____ you, Mr . Speaker, I 1..152'/ May 11-. 19 a 8 Vol. XI.. appreciate your comments . Mr. Sp~~ak~H', I IAii:'lni:. to <:~ddr·ess tho issue of The Freedom Of Tnfor·tnal: .i.on Act.

Nobody, I do nor. think, questions the purpose or the vRl.i.di~y of The Freedom OF Information Act. And I do not b c~ l. j_ '~ tl (:1 ,,, n y bo1 I y r E ~ a 1.1. y w:i. l l. quarrel with the government 1 S d (~ s i. r· <:1 1·. o l": r· y ;:1 n d r· E~ d 1 1 c f;, L: h E~ c o s t: that app]iu.lt.: ion of Lhe pr·ovis :ions oF 1- hal". i .~.:t: :i.ncul"S For· ~ov~rnrnent.

That is noL an 11 n r· f~ ;;, s on.:-~ b l. c,1 ;:~ p p r· o d c h . 8 1 1 L , M r· . f1 p e r:-1 k c ~ r' , C' ~ v E:' n :"i. f 1·.: h E:' r· t! t ~=• cost, the vaJ.ue of having Free r:·\.:c:As s Lo "i.nfor'Hidl: i on ·i !> ~; o important -that that cost must bE! b o r· n <~~ b y 9 o v o r· n 1 n e n 1". , 1. f n f:! c e :; s d r· y , in order l:: o ensurE! that:. Uwr'E! :is p r' opE:! r· a c c E:! s s 1:. o q o v t:' r· n 1n t~ n '1:: d 1 information . So, IJJC::1 have to f:ind l:hc,1 pr'OPE''r COlrtpr·orn i.S('!. TherE! rnust bE! public ac:CE!SS.

Lve cannot .imposE! such f ,,1 ~ = ! s as tAr:i.ll render access impossible or eff ect l vel.y emasculate the provisions of the act. People who t~Jant. to knolAJ tAJhcd.: i.nf<H'rni~t·. :i.on governrnE!nt l1as on fiJ.E! conce,r · n:i.ng thetnsc,1lv~~s shoiJl.d h;:w~~ a ccess wi.thout bE!ing faCE!d IAI'J.th a major f ··i. n a n c :-i. ''I J. p o n i:-1 11": y 1·: o a c h "i. e v <'~ i l·: .. At the very least that is one 9 r· o 1.1 p o f p o o p l. t:! 1·: h a l": ~; h o ul d b e exempted. Even if there are C i . t'CI.IIII~;i:; :·\l"lC A ~> IJJI'HH' H ·i . ncr·f~d:> f ' !d f t:•('! S can be justified .

I agr·ec~~ that The Fr' E!E:1 d orn Of T n f or'Hklt:i.on ilcl .: ,:·1nd i l".s pi" OV oi_s ·i.ons ought not to becorne a re s earch i:ool. ror· Uw rnod:i.<·1. JF l::he rnc;,cl _i.a L\Ja n t. to do the J. r· r· E! sear· c h on any . p d r· 1:. :i. c ul '" t' ·J s s 1.1 ~~ , ·i. t. s h o u l. d b ~,, o n t.he basis of thE!ir OIAJn E!ffor ·t and 1:-ll: 1-:hc=!·i.r· 01~1n ,,,xpc,1nse. T hc:!y s houl .d not be prevented frorn having a c c ~ ~ s~> ·t:o 'i.nfor•tnat .: .i.on, but . l:h<:' Y should · not expect l~ he pubJic No. 29 Rl5?.'7

ser·v'.i.c:e to <-:~ffectjv~~]y do ti'Hc' r· e~ s o r:-l r· c h f o r· l: h o rn . ~) o r c r:-l n s o e c:·.i.l"curnste~nceo~s IAihere->. h:-igh(~r· fe->.es Hid y Ill::! l. J. b n j u s H . f :i. f:! d . R 1.1 l". UH~ y c: 1 (;!a r· 1 y c: cHI not b (~ j u s t i. f "1. e d :i n r..l s · "i.l:llr~ll·: · "i.on l~lht:!t't:~ r'ln :i.nc:l·i.lJ··i.dt.lr:-ll w~nts ~ccess to h:-is own i.nfor'lllr:-ll : i.on . The r• e -i. s an o 1.: h ~H' lrli'l j or· <H' o ,,, wi·H~ I" Co~ those fe'!(~S Cclnnot bE! justifiE!d and t h a 1.: ·i. s i. n Hw c i'l s (~ of r· t::! q 1 H:~ s '1:-. s by members of t .he House of Assembly.

In orc:I~H' for· lfl<o~rnbE!r's l·:o pr·ope·H'l.y discharge thedr duties, they must hav(~ accc;!SS l::o ·:Lnfor·mat i.on that gover·nment has - particularly the Opposit t on ·-· thE!Y must be,~ able;! l:o access that information if they are to properly discharge their duties and inform the public as to IA.Ihat i.s happE!I1 i.ng. Tf l:h(~y nr•to~ go i.ng l::o bo ~'!Xpc,~Ctl· ~d to pay ou l: of thej r· o1.un pE!r·sonal r· ~~ s o u r· c ~:! s ~=! x o r· b "i. l: i.·l n l: Fe f! s , 1': h {:~ n I: hat cuts off th€-' j nforrnat:ion. Nobody can pr·oi':(Hld ol"h!'!Y'IAJ·isl~.

For· go v tH·nme nt ruembe r· s to s f.H:~a I< :i t1 o p p o s J. l: 'i. o n , 1:-l s Uw y h "' lJ e , d n d pr<-:~tend ot:hE:H·wj S(~ j s stupid :in the r~x Lr· rH1tr~ for· l:r·y "i.ng t:o bl. ·i.ndfold thE:~ dco!V'.il. jn l'.ht:~ dc:lrl<. TF such · F!i:H'!S lfiiiSl: I:H'! pedd by MI·IA:;, t hcC! n the-?. y ar·~~ a 1 E:~ g:i ·l:'ima t E:~ expense->. 1~1h i.ch MliAs can ~;:~xpe'!C l~ l:: o r·r'!Cove:H' fr·orn gouen1n1E!nt becaus<:! they ar'E! i. n c u r· r i. n g L h ~~ ·t-. (! x p e n ~; ~;:~ i. n l:: h ~~ proper discharge of their duties. There i s not much more involved in this resolution than Lhat.

The only th ·:ing that is :i.nvolUE!d :i.s to (:HJsure that Ml·IAs do not hauC:~ to pay thE!Se exorbtt.ant fE!eS to get acCE!SS ·l:o i.nfor·rnat. i.on. Only, Mr. Speaker, a goVE!rnment l :: hal~ i.!; r.lshalrJE!d of LI·H~ .i.rrf<H'IIIt:ll:.