Manitoba Hansard — 15 October 2024 (Sitting 75B, 43rd Legislature, 1st Session)

43-1-75b

Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)

First Session – Forty-Third Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable Tom Lindsey Speaker Vol. LXXVIII No. 75B - 1:30 p.m., Tuesday, October 15, 2024 ISSN 0542-5492

MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Forty-Third Legislature Member Constituency Political Affiliation ALTOMARE, Nello, Hon. Transcona NDP ASAGWARA, Uzoma, Hon. Union Station NDP BALCAEN, Wayne Brandon West PC BEREZA, Jeff Portage la Prairie PC BLASHKO, Tyler Lagimodière NDP BRAR, Diljeet Burrows NDP BUSHIE, Ian, Hon. Keewatinook NDP BYRAM, Jodie Agassiz PC CABLE, Renée, Hon. Southdale NDP CHEN, Jennifer Fort Richmond NDP COMPTON, Carla Tuxedo NDP COOK, Kathleen Roblin PC CROSS, Billie Seine River NDP DELA CRUZ, Jelynn Radisson NDP DEVGAN, JD McPhillips NDP EWASKO, Wayne Lac du Bonnet PC FONTAINE, Nahanni, Hon. St.

Johns NDP GOERTZEN, Kelvin Steinbach PC GUENTER, Josh Borderland PC HIEBERT, Carrie Morden-Winkler PC JACKSON, Grant Spruce Woods PC JOHNSON, Derek Interlake-Gimli PC KENNEDY, Nellie Assiniboia NDP KHAN, Obby Fort Whyte PC KINEW, Wab, Hon. Fort Rouge NDP KING, Trevor Lakeside PC KOSTYSHYN, Ron, Hon. Dauphin NDP LAGASSÉ, Bob Dawson Trail PC LAMOUREUX, Cindy Tyndall Park Lib. LATHLIN, Amanda The Pas-Kameesak NDP LINDSEY, Tom, Hon. Flin Flon NDP LOISELLE, Robert St. Boniface NDP MALOWAY, Jim Elmwood NDP MARCELINO, Malaya, Hon. Notre Dame NDP MOROZ, Mike River Heights NDP MOSES, Jamie, Hon. St.

Vital NDP MOYES, Mike Riel NDP NARTH, Konrad La Vérendrye PC NAYLOR, Lisa, Hon. Wolseley NDP NESBITT, Greg Riding Mountain PC OXENHAM, Logan Kirkfield Park NDP PANKRATZ, David Waverley NDP PERCHOTTE, Richard Selkirk PC PIWNIUK, Doyle Turtle Mountain PC REDHEAD, Eric Thompson NDP SALA, Adrien, Hon. St. James NDP SANDHU, Mintu The Maples NDP SCHMIDT, Tracy, Hon. Rossmere NDP SCHOTT, Rachelle Kildonan-River East NDP SCHULER, Ron Springfield-Ritchot PC SIMARD, Glen, Hon. Brandon East NDP SMITH, Bernadette, Hon. Point Douglas NDP STONE, Lauren Midland PC WASYLIW, Mark Fort Garry Ind.

WHARTON, Jeff Red River North PC WIEBE, Matt, Hon. Concordia NDP WOWCHUK, Rick Swan River PC

2835 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Tuesday, October 15, 2024 The House met at 1:30 p.m. The Speaker: Good afternoon. Please be seated. House Business The Speaker: The honourable member for Roblin, on House business. Mrs. Kathleen Cook (Roblin): Honourable Speaker, I seek leave to allow the Opposition House Leader to call Bill 221, The Earlier Screening for Breast Cancer Act, to a com mittee of this House before the end of the First Session of the 43rd Legislature, no later than October 30.

The Speaker: Is there leave to allow the Op position House Leader to call Bill 221, The Earlier Screening for Breast Cancer Act, to committee of this House before the end of the First Session of the 43rd Legislature, no later than October 30? Is there leave? Some Honourable Members: Agreed. An Honourable Member: No. The Speaker: Leave has been denied. ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS The Speaker: Introduction of bills?

COMMITTEE REPORTS Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development Eighth Report MLA Mike Moyes (Chairperson): Honourable Speaker, I wish to present the eighth report of Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development. The Speaker: Honourable member for–no. Clerk (Mr. Rick Yarish): Your Standing Committee on Social and Economic– An Honourable Member: Dispense. The Speaker: Dispense. Your Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development presents the following as its Eighth Report. Meetings Your Committee met on October 10, 2024 at 6:00 p.m. in Room 254 of the Legislative Building.

Matters under Consideration • Bill (No. 7) – The Public Sector Construction Projects (Tendering) Repeal Act/Loi abrogeant la

Loi sur les projets de construction dans le secteur public (appels d'offres) • Bill (No. 9) – The Employment Standards Code Amendment Act/Loi modifiant le Code des normes d'emploi • Bill (No. 21) – The Public Schools Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur les écoles publiques Committee Membership • Ms. B YRAM • Mr. JACKSON • MLA KENNEDY • Hon. Min. MARCELINO • MLA MOYES • Mr. OXENHAM Your Committee elected MLA MOYES as the Chairperson. Your Committee elected MLA K ENNEDY as the Vice-Chairperson. Substitutions received during Committee proceedings: • Hon. Min. SCHMIDT for Hon. Min. MARCELINO Public Presentations Your Committee heard the following 16 presentations on Bill (No. 7) – The Public Sector Construction Projects (Tendering) Repeal Act/Loi abrogeant la

Loi sur les projets de construction dans le secteur public (appels d'offres): Kevin Rebeck, Manitoba Federation of Labour Kyley Parker, Private citizen Tanya Palson, Manitoba Building Trades Marc Lafond, IUOE Local 987 Victor Da Silva, LIUNA Local 1258 Sean Ramsay, Private citizen Nicholas Adams, Private citizen Kyle Kalcsics, UA Local 254 David Grant, Private citizen Paul Moist, Manitoba Federation of Union Retirees Yvette Milner, Merit Contractors Association of Manitoba Tyler Slobogian, Canadian Federation of Inde - pendent Business Peter Wightman, Construction Labour Relations Association of Manitoba Ron Castel, Private citizen

2836 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 Daemien Bernhard, Private citizen Joshua Fisher, Private citizen Your Committee heard the following three presenta- tions on Bill (No. 9) – The Employment Standards Code Amendment Act/Loi modifiant le Code des normes d'emploi: Kevin Rebeck, Manitoba Federation of Labour Susan Russell-Csanyi, Canadian Cancer Society Patrick Tohill, Crohn's and Colitis Canada Your Committee heard the following presentation on Bill (No. 21) – The Public Schools Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur les écoles publiques: David Grant, Private citizen Written Submissions Your Committee received the following five written submissions on Bill (No. 7) – The Public Sector Construction Projects (Tendering) Repeal Act/Loi abrogeant la

Loi sur les projets de construction dans le secteur public (appels d'offres): Ben McGillivary, Private citizen George Emery, OPCMIA Local 222 Ryan Sellar, International Brotherhood of Boiler - makers Local 555 Robert Duarte, Ironworkers Local 728 Joshua Lapointe, Private citizen Your Committee received the following written submission on Bill (No. 9) – The Employment Standards Code Amendment Act/Loi modifiant le Code des normes d'emploi: Alanah Duffy, MS Canada Bills Considered and Reported • Bill (No. 7) – The Public Sector Construction Projects (Tendering) Repeal Act/Loi abrogeant la

Loi sur les projets de construction dans le secteur public (appels d'offres) Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 9) – The Employment Standards Code Amendment Act/Loi modifiant le Code des normes d'emploi Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 21) – The Public Schools Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur les écoles publiques Your Committee agreed to report this Bill with the following amendment: THAT Clause 5(1) of the Bill be amended by s triking out "July 1, 2024" and substituting "the day it receives royal assent". MLA Moyes: Honourable Speaker, I move, seconded by the hon ourable member for Kirkfield Park (Mr. Oxenham), that the report of the com mittee be received. Motion agreed to. Standing Committee on Justice Second Report Mr. Tyler Blashko (Chairperson): Honourable Speaker, I wish to present the second report of the Standing Committee on Justice. Deputy Clerk (Mr.

Tim Abbott): Your Standing Committee on Justice presents the following as a second report– An Honourable Member: Dispense. The Speaker: Dispense. Your Standing Committee on Justice presents the following as its Second Report. Meetings Your Committee met on October 10, 2024, at 6:00 p.m. in Room 255 of the Legislative Building. Matters under Consideration • Bill (No. 16) – The Regulatory Accountability Reporting Act and Amendments to the Statutes and Regulations Act/Loi sur la remise de rapports relativement à la responsabilisation en matière de réglementation et modification de la

Loi sur les textes législatifs et réglementaires • Bill (No. 209) – The Provincial Court Amendment Act (Expanded Training for Judges and Judicial Justices of the Peace)/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la Cour provinciale (formation accrue des juges et des juges de paix judiciaires) Committee Membership • Mr. B ALCAEN • Mr. BLASHKO • MLA COMPTON • Mrs. HIEBERT • MLA PANKRATZ • Hon. Mr. WIEBE Your Committee elected Mr. BLASHKO as the Chairperson.

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2837 Your Committee elected MLA COMPTON as the Vice-Chairperson. Substitutions received during Committee proceedings: • Hon. Min. CABLE for MLA PANKRATZ Non-Committee Members Speaking on Record • Mr. GOERTZEN • MLA LAMOUREUX Public Presentations Your Committee heard the following two presentations on Bill (No. 16) – The Regulatory Accountability Reporting Act and Amendments to the Statutes and Regulations Act/Loi sur la remise de rapports relativement à la responsabilisation en matière de réglementation et modification de la

Loi sur les textes législatifs et réglementaires : David Grant, Private Citizen Keyli Loeppky, Canadian Federation of Independent Business Your Committee heard the following 12 presentations on Bill (No. 209) – The Provincial Court Amendment Act (Expanded Training for Judges and Judicial Justices of the Peace)/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la Cour provinciale (formation accrue des juges et des juges de paix judiciaires): Susan Dawes, Provincial Judges Association of Manitoba David Grant, Private Citizen Kayla Harder, Private Citizen Amy Danielson, Private Citizen Sarah Mitchell, Private Citizen Jennifer Kagan, Private Citizen Stéphanie Plante, Private Citizen Esther Mordechai, Private Citizen Stacey Soldier, Manitoba Bar Association Kimlee Morrisseau, Family court hurts Mikayla Hunter, Private Citizen Fernanda Vallejo, Latinas Manitoba Inc Written Submissions Your Committee received the following three written submissions on Bill (No. 209) – The Provincial Court Amendment Act (Expanded Training for Judges and Judicial Justices of the Peace)/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la Cour provinciale (formation accrue des juges et des juges de paix judiciaires) Kate Rowswell, Private Citizen Jennifer Chan, Private Citizen Ann Loewen, Private Citizen Bills Considered and Reported • Bill (No. 16) – The Regulatory Accountability Reporting Act and Amendments to the Statutes and Regulations Act/Loi sur la remise de rapports relativement à la responsabilisation en matière de réglementation et modification de la

Loi sur les textes législatifs et réglementaires Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment, on a recorded vote of ayes three, nays two. • Bill (No. 209) – The Provincial Court Amendment Act (Expanded Training for Judges and Judicial Justices of the Peace)/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la Cour provinciale (formation accrue des juges et des juges de paix judiciaires) Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. Mr. Blashko: Honourable Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable member for Tuxedo (MLA Compton), that the report of the committee be received. Motion agreed to. TABLING OF REPORTS Hon.

Renée Cable (Minister of Advanced Education and Training): I am pleased to table the Annual Report of the Department of Advanced Education and Training for the fiscal year of 2023-24, as well as the annual reports for the year ending March 31, 2024, for Brandon University, Red River College Polytechnic, Research Manitoba, University College of the North, Université de Saint-Boniface, University of Manitoba and University of Winnipeg. The Speaker: Further tabling of reports? Hon.

Tracy Schmidt (Minister of Environment and Climate Change): I am pleased to follow–to table the following annual reports for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2024. First, the De partment of Environ- ment and Climate Change; second, the Manitoba Hazardous Waste Manage ment Cor poration; and third, the report of Efficiency Manitoba. MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS Punjabi Chamber of Commerce and Industry Hon.

Jamie Moses (Minister of Economic Development, Investment, Trade and Natural Resources): It is my pleasure to share the vision and goals of the newly formed Punjabi Chamber of Commerce and Industry with the province of Manitoba.

2838 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 The Punjabi com munity has been part of our province since the 1960s, contributing significantly to both its economic and cultural landscapes. Over the years, Punjabi-owned businesses have achieved remark- able success in a variety of new and diverse industries. Now, the community will have a dedicated plat - form to celebrate these accomplishments in an organi- zation that collaborates collectively with the gov ern- ment in addition to repre senting the community with a broader business landscape.

This is how the Punjabi Chamber of Commerce and Industry was formed. A few members of the Punjabi business community came together to bring this vision to life, resulting in the establishment of this organization. Their vision and goals were clear: to provide a platform for internal networking, engage in collective advocacy, col laborate with gov ernment, support truth and reconciliation. With these set out and clear mandate from its membership, I've no doubt that the Punjabi Chamber of Commerce and Industry will have an illustrious future advocating for its members in the years to come.

I am happy to acknowledge some of the folks who are in the gallery joining us today from this organi - zation: Amrit [phonetic] Singh Dhillon, Varinder Singh, Dalbir Singh Bala, Randy Brar, Gurjant Singh Dhillon, Jay–Jaskaran–Sodhi, who are here with us today. I'm delighted to mention that the Punjabi Chamber of Commerce and Industry will be hosting an MLA appreciation dinner this evening in the Golden Boy Room starting at 4:30 p.m. We, as members of the Legislative Assembly, cele- brate your accomplishment and wish you well and know that you–what you have achieved so far is only the beginning.

I invite all the members to join me in welcoming the members from the Punjabi Chamber of Commerce and Industry to the Legislative Building today. Mr. Jeff Wharton (Red River North): Honourable Speaker, I'm honoured to rise today to recog nize the invaluable contributions of the Punjabi Chamber of Commerce and Industry in Manitoba, highlighting their unwavering commitment to fostering sustainable growth and prosperity in Punjabi busi ness and com munities across this great province.

This organization plays a vital role as advocates for entrepreneurs, promoting diverse economic dev- elopment that not only serves the Punjabi community but also benefits all Manitobans. Their efforts are sig- nificant assets, provide tangible resources that con - tribute to the continued success and reliance of the Punjabi communities throughout Manitoba. Moreover, the chamber's focus on creating oppor- tunities for professional development and facilitating network collaboration within the Punjabi community uplifts and broadens our under standing of what it means to thrive together.

The perspective–this perspective is crucial for shaping the future of our great province, ensuring that every voice is heard and valued. Their extensive network encompasses a wide range of busi nesses, industry associations and non-profit organizations, all united in their mission to cultivate a vibrant and thriving business environment. This collaboration seeks to foster inclusivity and innovation, making Manitoba a more welcoming and dynamic place for all.

As an organization dedicated to growth, professional develop ment and networking, the Punjabi Chamber of Commerce evaluates–elevates, pardon me–the meaningful contributions of an active community. Their work is integral to the overarching goal of positioning Manitoba as an appealing destination for living, working and conducting businesses, enriching our province for current and future generations. And I, too, on behalf of the official opposi tion, would like to ask everybody to join us tonight between 4:30 and 6 o'clock and celebrate the Punjabi Chamber of Commerce. Thank you.

MLA Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): Honourable Speaker, I ask for leave to respond to the minister's statement. The Speaker: Does the honour able member have leave? [Agreed] MLA Lamoureux: Chambers of commerce bring together coalitions of busi nesses across all sectors, associations and industry organizations who all share a commitment to address challenges in our com mu- nities and overcome barriers to growth. Punjabi Canadians account for nearly 3 per cent of Canada's population, and Punjabi businesses thrive here in Manitoba.

And having a chamber of commerce here in our province will help unite the com munity and beyond by offering events, programs,

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2839 opportunities and creating an environment to strengthen businesses and careers. * (13:40) Honourable Speaker, this is all while providing programs, advocacy, networking, events, busi ness services and encouraging collaboration to fortify and pave the way forward for Punjabi busi nesses within Manitoba's business community. The establish ment of the Punjabi Chamber of Commerce and Industry is a local chamber, and I'd like to welcome them here to the Legislature today. Thank you, Honourable Speaker.

Introduction of Guests The Speaker: Before moving on to members' state - ments, I would like to draw the members' attention to the public gallery where we have seated from École Julie Riel 22 grade 6 students under the direction of Stephanie Gagnon. The group is located in the constit- uency of the honourable member for Riel (MLA Moyes). Welcome. MEMBERS' STATEMENTS Winnipeg Blues Women's Basketball Champions Hon. Nahanni Fontaine (Minister responsible for Women and Gender Equity): I rise today to recog- nize the extraordinary Winnipeg Blues women's basketball team.

The team achieved something truly remarkable this summer, winning the championship title and solidifying their place in the history of our province's sports. Their journey to the championship was filled with unforgettable moments, none more impressive than their gold medal game where they faced a 14 -point deficit with only five minutes remaining. In what can only be described as a display of heart, resilience and teamwork, they rallied together and managed to outscore their opponents, ultimately winning by just two points. Their perseverance was inspiring. The road to victory wasn't without its challenges.

Throughout the season, players faced injuries including bad ankles and some mental health, like panic attacks. Yet despite these obstacles, the team never wavered. They demonstrated the true meaning of unity, trust and resilience, pushing themselves to the limit, not just for personal glory but for one another. Watching them fight every point, overcoming every obstacle with grit and grace was a testament to their unbreakable spirit. Their courage, tenacity and sheer willpower of these young women have shown nothing is short of extra ordinary what they accom - plished this season.

I also want to extend a special congratulations to Head Coach Russ Patterson, assistant coach–and also Assistant Coach Alexandra Patterson, Coach Patterson's daughter, whose leadership has been instrumental to the team's success. Their support, strategy and commit - ment played a crucial role in shaping this incred ible team into champions. I ask my colleagues to help me honour and celebrate the Winnipeg Blues for their monumental achievement. Their victory is not only a triumph for their team, but an inspiration for all of us. Congratulations to these amazing athletes on their championship win.

You have made us all immensely proud, and I ask for leave to have my members' names in Hansard. Miigwech. Emma Coghill, Kate Coghill, Ciara Deloli, Khady Diabate, Lily Hoffman, Nmesomachukwu lsinguzo, Uloma lsinguzo, Alyza Masesar, Otitodilichwuku Okwumabua, Ebunoluwa Otegbade, Alexandra Patterson, Russ Patterson , Rodger Salm, Sarni -Jo Saunders, Addison Sweet, Mingyue Wang, Sophie Zielinski International Day of Rural Women Mrs. Carrie Hiebert (Morden-Winkler): Today, October 15 is international rural women's day.

As–and as a rural woman myself, I am honoured to celebrate the many achievements and con tributions that rural women make in our province, our com munities and our homes. Women in rural communities are the backbone to many busi nesses, organizations and non -profits, as well as often being the primary caregivers for their families. Despite their–excuse me–despite their crucial roles in agribusiness and food industry, many rural women encounter challenges that hinder their full participation with less access to land, credit and other resources.

Recently I was appointed to the women's common- wealth parliamentarians regional steering com mittee which I'm honoured to be part of and represent women in politics.

2840 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 As a woman, I believe it's impor tant that we en - courage female represen tation, foster relationships and discuss action on gender -related issues. Inter - national Women's Day recognizes women –women's contributions to agriculture, food security and sustain- able dev elopment. Today, I would like to highlight three rural women from my constituency of Morden-Winkler. Helping lead the way with –in Manitoba Beef Producers is Mary Praziuk [phonetic], a director and producer.

Mary is dedi cated to represen ting the interests of beef producers through advocacy, research and edu cation, with a mission to strengthen and enhance beef industry in Manitoba. In a male -heavy world, Mary is one of–only one of–one of the female directors out of 14 districts. Trisha Thiessen and her husband run a third gen- eration family farm cor poration. Her dedi cation to hard work ensures that their operations run smoothly. A former nurse turned farmer, Trisha actively volun- teers in our community: on school council, she sits on various committees and is youth–is a youth leader in her local church.

Her favourite part of living in rural Manitoba is the tight- knit sense of com munity. She loves having her family involved in the farm, including her four teenage children. The Speaker: Member's time has expired. Some Honourable Members: Leave. The Speaker: Is there leave for the member to finish her statement? [Agreed] Mrs. Hiebert: Sorry, thank you. Leah [phonetic] Kuhl is part of the southern Manitoba potato family farm. She has a support ive role in the farm, bringing meals to the field, helping move trucks and equipment and helping with staff events, as well as being a listening ear regarding all business.

She is also a nurse by trade and loves being involved in the community. I would like to thank all women in rural Manitoba for your endless contributions. Today we celebrate your resilience and dedi cation. Happy inter national day of the rural woman. I would like to ask my colleagues to please join me in thanking these three women that are here online with us. Thank you. Springfield Seniors Living–President's Gala Mrs. Rachelle Schott (Kildonan-River East): Seniors are the backbone of Manitoba communities. They are volunteers, leaders and actively engaged com munity members.

Nowhere is this more on display than at Springfield Seniors living. On Saturday, October 5, 2024, just a short drive north of my own constituency of Kildonan-River East, I had the honour of attending their president's gala. It was held at the Elmwood golf and country club in the great con stituency of Springfield -Ritchot, where I attended on behalf of the most popular premier in Canada. I'm not the MLA for the area, but I'm happy to work with and advocate for more Manitobans in my neighboring com munity.

The outstanding volunteer award was presented to Jane and Alan Burpee, the parents of the one-and-only David Burpee, otherwise known as Ace Burpee from hot 103.1 FM. Throughout the evening, it was obvious that the Springfield Seniors living's commitment to community is deep -rooted. With programs like the congregate meal program, they provide seniors with living spaces that address daily living needs and positively influ - ence their quality of life.

It was so nice to make new connections with these open and welcoming folks who have already started to reach out to our Kildonan- River East team for follow-up and are happy to work with our new NDP government because of our commit ment to health care, seniors, all across our great province. I may not be your MLA, Springfield-Ritchot, but I am the MLA for Kildonan -River East right next door, and my door is always open to you. Speak soon neighbours, and I'll see you at the Chickendaze in June. Dr. Allan Preston Mr. Greg Nesbitt (Riding Mountain): Dr.

Allan Preston has spent his career advancing agri culture, imparting his infectious love for the industry and doing his utmost to make rural Manitoba and Canada a stronger and more vibrant place. That's why it was only fitting that the lifelong Hamiota resident was inducted into the Manitoba Agricultural Hall of Fame in July. After graduating high school, Dr. Preston attended uni versity and then was accepted into the Western College of Veterinary Medicine in Saskatoon. Following graduation in 1974, he worked in Winnipeg

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2841 for a year before returning to Hamiota to practice veterinary medicine and work with his dad on the farm. Dr. Preston didn't just help animals. He immersed himself in the commu nity and took a leadership role in most community initiatives, including guiding the Hamiota Agricultural Society, chairing the Hamiota Community Foundation, being an active 4- H l eader and managing a AAA hockey club. Dr. Preston was also active in industry organi - zations.

He was the president of the Canadian Simmental Association and was involved in many livestock organizations, including the Beef Science Cluster advisory body and the Westman Opportunities Leadership Group. * (13:50) After 20 years, chronic arm and shoulder problems caught up to him and Dr. Preston moved on to work with Manitoba Agriculture, first as manager of veterinary field services, then chief prov incial veterinarian and eventually assistant deputy minister of Agriculture. He also tackled some very major and difficult assignments important to the health of the agriculture industry and the province.

He was a bovine 'turbeculosis' co-ordinator and the chair of the Assiniboine River Basin Initiative. Dr. Preston was awarded the Lieutenant Governor's Medal for Excellence in Public Administration in Manitoba in 2008 and the Queen Elizabeth II Platinum Jubilee Medal in 2022. Please join me in congratulating Dr. Allan Preston, who is watching online today, on his distinguished career in the agricultural industry and on his induction into the Manitoba Agricultural Hall of Fame.

Frank Soja and Fish Market MLA JD Devgan (McPhillips): Today I rise to recog- nize McPhillips constituent and outstanding member of our community, Frank Soja. Frank is a co -ordinator for Fish Winnipeg, an organization that has, for 25 years, brought inner-city youth out onto the Red and Assiniboine Rivers to fish, an ex perience that most would not otherwise have. The program is free of charge and provides free trans- portation for youth. Fish Winnipeg has been recognized for their excellence and meaningful contributions to the inner- city communities here in Winnipeg by various levels of govern ment.

They are a part of Fish Futures Incorporated, which is–in the year 2000, received a Canadian Recreational Fisheries Award in Ottawa. In 2013, they also received the Mayor's V olunteer Service Award for their work with youth. Recently, they were grateful to receive a grant through Manitoba Liquor & Lotteries to replace their van. With this support, Frank and Fish Winnipeg continue to provide transportation to young anglers, free of charge.

As an arm of Fish Futures Incorporated, an organ- ization that aims to improve water con servation and maintain freshwater fisheries and habitats here in Manitoba, Fish Winnipeg is also passionate about conserving our waterways. Over the years, interest in this program has only grown. Frank and Fish Winnipeg have become an im- portant part of the community here in Winnipeg, and I hope we continue to see Frank's work with Fish Winnipeg grow over the next few years as they con- tinue to foster inner-city youth interest in fishing.

So I ask that the House join me in thanking Frank and his colleagues for their work with Fish Winnipeg, and to congratulate them on 25 years of excellence in our province. ORAL QUESTIONS Business Closures Due to Crime Impact on Manitobans Mr. Wayne Ewasko (Leader of the Official Opposition): It is interesting that when members stand up and talk about Chickendaze that are held in the riding, or the constituency of Springfield-Ritchot, it's unfortunate that the member stands up today talking about some form of golf course that doesn't even exist in Manitoba, Honourable Speaker.

It's harder these days, Honourable Speaker, to do business under this NDP government. The number of incidents in the first quarter of this year was worse than previous annual totals. We've seen 7-Elevens and other businesses boarded up. Matter of fact, 7-Eleven is closing almost a quarter of their stores right here in Manitoba. Under this Premier, Hon ourable Speaker, there's more people that are hungry, there's more people des- perate and they're stealing and community businesses are closing down for good. Businesses are still operating in Manitoba with increased security expenses.

I ask the Premier: Who should bear those costs for those expenses, Honourable Speaker?

2842 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 Hon. Wab Kinew (Premier): I'll get to the meandering question in a second, but I want to begin by acknowledging Kam Blight. Kam, you're a good man and it's been an absolute pleasure to serve alongside you these past few years. I learned a lot from both your perspective as a munici- pal leader, but also from your leadership role at the AMM. I truly, and on behalf of our entire government and the people of Manitoba, wish you all the best in what's next and hopefully this next stage is very meaningful for you.

Of course, we know that busi ness is great in Manitoba. Inflation is down because we cut the prov- incial gas tax. We're a busi ness-friendly government and we're on the side of workers, too. The Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a supplementary question. Mr. Ewasko: Honourable Speaker, last November, the Canadian Federation of Independent Business, the restaurant industry and other groups called for the new NDP government to provide financial relief from theft and vandalism.

Manitoba businesses would like to see them stop theft and vandalism, too, and to support businesses through these difficult times. A single break- in can cost tens of thousands of dollars. Security upgrades, we know, costs tens of thousands of dollars. And the NDP govern ment has not adequately addressed the affordability crisis that's driving crime and theft. Businesses are still calling for help, and some are simply closing their doors for good as the NDP's failure to act. Will the Premier apologize to the commu nities that are losing their busi nesses in their inaction, Honourable Speaker? Mr.

Kinew: Well, our team is very happy to be work- ing for you, the people of Manitoba. And with all due humility, I would say that one year in, our approach is proving results, certainly more than the PCs ever did during their failed two terms. We can look at the macro-level indicators. Today, Statistics Canada said that inflation is 0.8 per cent in Manitoba. That is below the Bank of Canada target rate. So what we're saying to the Bank of Canada: red flashing light from Manitoba; please cut interest rates. And when you talk to small-business owners them- selves, what do they say?

Well, they say that our Attorney General (Mr. Wiebe) has been doing very good work with his retail theft initiative. So whether you're talking to the small -business owner or whether you're talking to the economists who see the system-wide trends, progress is coming. Things are back on track here in Manitoba, and more good days lie ahead. The Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a final supplementary question. Mr.

Ewasko: Honourable Speaker, the fact is the closure of 7-Eleven stores and other busi nesses only are making things worse for those who rely on these types of businesses close to their homes. This is a big deal to many families. Easily accessible to milk, bread, fruit and other basics have been ripped away from tens of thousands of Winnipeggers. The government should be looking into urgently supporting busi nesses to stop this crisis and its unintended consequences. The NDP seem to find money for vanity trips for their ministers and staff. They find money for the Premier's daily $17 salad.

But they make busi nesses compete with homeowners for doorbell cameras that doesn't actually meet their needs, Honourable Speaker. Supporting businesses is supporting Manitobans, a fact that this NDP government is failing to understand. Honourable Speaker, will the Premier apologize for misleading Manitobans on the growing food prices, insecurity and the decline to community safety? Mr. Kinew: And I quote, on behalf of 7-Eleven Canada, I would like to applaud you and the Manitoba govern- ment for the policy commitment to support safer com- munities through 'strastegic' investments in the Retail Crime Task Force.

The return on invest ment will be measured in terms of safe and secure com munities, employees and customers. End quote. From the Canadian Federation of Inde pendent Businesses, and I quote: We appreciate that this year's budget includes payroll cost relief measures for small businesses. Now I appreciate that all of the validators that would not stand beside the members opposite are, in fact, thanking our government–our ministers, in particular– for taking im portant steps to make your life more affordable, make your community safer.

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2843 I will remind the members opposite that job one for our government is fixing health care and repairing the damage they caused by years and years of cuts. The Speaker: I would ask the First Minister if he was quoting from a private document, if he'd table it, please. Mr. Kinew: Happy to table the documents that dunk on the member opposite. Brandon Police Service New Chief Acknowledgement Mr.

Wayne Balcaen (Brandon West): I would like to begin my question by first recognizing that today is the first day for the new chief of police at the Brandon Police Service, and I would like to give him a warm welcome, to Chief Tyler Bates , on behalf of myself and our entire PC caucus.

Chief Bates brings with him a wealth of ex per- ience: over three decades of dedicated law enforcement service, and I know he will complement the Brandon Police Service. * (14:00) So, Honourable Speaker, will this Premier commit to working with Chief Bates to make our streets and communities safer, or will he simply revert to his old ways and target the new chief of Brandon Police by blaming him on the rising crime– The Speaker: Time has expired. Hon.

Wab Kinew (Premier): We know that the issue of public safety is one of the most sacred responsi - bilities that we have in government and that why–that is why our team, under the leadership of our Attorney General (Mr. Wiebe), has been bringing in forward numerous measures to hold people accountable. But at the same time, under the leadership of our acting Education Minister, we also have a uni versal school food program, which is going to make our community safer and healthier for generations to come. It's a com- prehensive approach.

When it comes to the Brandon Police Service, I was very proud as the Minister responsible for Indigenous Reconciliation to provide a very small grant to provide orange patches leading up to Orange Shirt Day for the BPS. Again, it's almost a grant too small to mention but it's my hope that that'll be a conversation starter to build linkages between Indigenous peoples, the Brandon Police Service and the broader community. It truly takes all of us to build the Manitoba that we want together. The Speaker: The honourable member for Brandon West, on a supplementary question.

Crime and Public Safety Request for Plan to Address Mr. Wayne Balcaen (Brandon West): Honourable Speaker, this Premier promised to Manitobans that he would make streets and com munities safer, but not only have stores been forced to board up the windows and close down, but employees are starting to take vigilantism action. Manitobans are fearful of m aking trips to their local community stores. When will this Premier deliver on his promise to all Manitobans to make our streets and com munities safer? Hon. Wab Kinew (Premier): I welcome the account- ability questions; they're always rightly directed towards me.

The credit, though, for the progress we're seeing on public safety belongs to the ministers of the Crown. That includes the Minister of Families (MLA Fontaine), who's doing generational change to break the generational curse that too many young people in our com munity have been handed. The credit goes to our acting Education Minister–in that direction, rather–who is making impor tant strides to ensure that every child in Manitoba can stay on a path to post-secondary instead of a pipeline to prison.

And then, of course, we have the Attorney General, who was there after the summer, able to point to numerous successes, such as the retail theft initiative, towards the increased foot patrol presence through our partners like SABE Peace Walkers and DCSP. Again, this is a team- Manitoba approach. We're working together to address root causes, to address immediate needs in the community, and we're showing results for you, the people of Manitoba. The Speaker: The honourable member for Brandon West, on a final supplementary question. Mr.

Balcaen: Honourable Speaker, this Premier and his Justice Minister have used bud words and band- aid solutions that have made for our com munities to be less safe. We've been waiting for a long-term plan to make Manitoba safer. In March, the Winnipeg chief of police raised con- cerns about violence using long- edged weapons, and it took this minister seven months to bring forward legislation that will still require lengthy consultations before it even comes into force.

2844 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 Can the Premier share today when Manitobans will have a concrete plan with long -term solutions to reduce crime and protect all Manitobans? Mr. Kinew: Manitobans got a plan when I shared it with them at Canadian Mennonite Univer sity in the lead-up to last year's election. It was the first time there was an adult, comprehensive approach to public safety tabled, because, certainly, none was forthcoming from Heather Stefanson and the PCs.

So, when we talk about tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime, that means that we are investing in school food programs and recreation facilities to keep young people on a positive path. But we're also investing in law enforcement. For instance, this year, Brandon Police Service's urban policing grant went from $5.4 million to $7.4 million. I realize the reason why he's so upset in the Chamber every day is because he's mad at himself for not sticking around for another year so that he'd finally have the resources in Brandon to do the right thing by the people of that great Manitoba city.

Surgical and Diagnostic Services Public Disclosure of Wait Time Data Mrs. Kathleen Cook (Roblin): We know that one of the first things the NDP govern ment did is cut surgeries and diag nostic tests for Manitobans. They fired the Diag nostic and Surgical Recovery Task Force, they slashed surgical options for Manitobans who were willing to travel, they reduced surgeries and diagnostic tests here in Manitoba by refusing to work with private providers and cancelling existing contracts. Now, they're even turning down funding from communities like Portage la Prairie that are willing to expand diagnostic capacity.

As a result, Manitobans are left facing longer wait times for both surgeries and diagnostic tests. Why has the Minister of Health failed to address the growing backlog of surgeries and diagnostics that has worsened under their watch? Hon. Uzoma Asagwara (Minister of Health, Seniors and Long-Term Care): Our govern ment has been listening to Manitobans who–making it very clear that they want more access to surgeries and diagnostics in their own province, close to home, where they can recover close to their families and in their own com- munities.

Under the previous government, they spent more money sending people to the United States of America–out of country–than they ever spent building capacity right here in our own province, and that's shameful. Now, I understand that the member is now standing up to ask a question. They continue to share misinfor- mation like her colleague has been doing for weeks. But on this side of the House, we're going to stand in truth, work with experts, work with the front lines, continue to build more capacity, not less, here in our province. The Speaker: The honourable member for Roblin, on a supplementary question. Mrs.

Cook: Hip and knee wait times have sky- rocketed under the NDP government. The median wait time for hip replacement has climbed to 48 weeks, the highest it's been in at least five years, including during the pandemic. Knee replace ment is up to 40 weeks and has climbed steadily since the NDP took office. I'll table all of that data for the House. These wait times are only current to June. It's now October, and we have no updated data. This marks the fourth time I've had to stand publicly and prod the NDP to do their job and update the data that's posted online.

Will the Minister of Health commit to updating the wait time data today? MLA Asagwara: Honourable Speaker, you know, on this side of the House, we believe that Manitobans should be able to access health care here in their own province. The previous govern ment didn't believe in that. So they sent hundreds of folks outside of the pro- vince, millions upon millions of dollars, paying people who don't pay taxes in the province; in California, everywhere else but in Manitoba. And what they also did– which is particularly shameful–they ignored people who had been waiting for surgeries for years.

They basically created an invisible wait list, Manitobans who never had the oppor tunity to even get close to getting a surgery in our province. Our government is making sure that those Manitobans who were ignored by the PCs are finally getting care here in Manitoba. Those wait times reflect that finally Manitobans are getting care– The Speaker: Member's time has expired. The honourable member for Roblin, on a final sup- plementary question. Mrs. Cook: Honourable Speaker, MRI wait times are as high as 46 weeks in Winnipeg. Cataract waits are climbing, as recently reported by media–another report

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2845 that I'll table–cataract waits average 11 months. Ultra- sound wait times are increasing. CT scan wait times are increasing. The list goes on and on. And these numbers don't even account for the wait time people face waiting to see a specialist. Despite promising an updated wait time tracker earlier this year, we're still waiting for one to materialize. Why do surgical and diagnos tic wait times con - tinue to increase under the NDP government?

MLA Asagwara: Honourable Speaker, here in Manitoba, we are delivering more surgeries and more diagnostics than we ever have in the history of our province, right here in our own province; over 11,500 surgeries. That's far more than previously done. We're delivering more diagnostics than we ever have in the history of this province. We have stood up historic spine surgery programs. We are working with our partners to stand up historic investments that are changing the trajectory of health care for the better.

Now, I know it's taking us longer than Manitobans would like because we are dealing with cuts that were done over seven and a half years; historic damage to our health-care system due to a failed approach. It's going to take us years to fix the damage done by the PCs, but we're committed to doing that– The Speaker: Member's time has expired. New Child-Care Spaces Request for Number Created Mr. Grant Jackson (Spruce Woods): In 2021, Progressive Conservatives were very pleased to sign on to the national child care strategy, committing $1.2 billion over five years to build 23,000 new child- care spaces in Manitoba.

We got over 12,000 completed before the October 3, 2023, general election. * (14:10) In the one year that this gov ernment has been in office, can the minister update the House on how many new daycare spaces and centres have been announced under their tenure? Hon. Tracy Schmidt (Acting Minister of Education and Early Childhood Learning): I thank the member opposite for this important question, and I know that child care is top of mind for many Manitobans.

As a parent of young children, I, too, have exper- ienced the challenges in finding accessible, affordable child care in this province after years of a failed PC government strategy. I am very proud to update the House that we have already built more than 6,900 spaces, and we are com- mitted to many, many more. There is a lot of work to do. We are committed to doing that work. Manitobans can count on us. The Speaker: The honourable member for Spruce Woods, on a supplementary question. Mr. Jackson: I hate to correct the minister, but the RTM spaces that we built and she just got to cut the ribbon for don't count.

So the question is how many new spaces has this government announced in their first year in office? And the question is answered, because the only space they've announced is a new daycare in Fort Rouge constituency. So why is the Premier's (Mr. Kinew) constituency getting new child -care spaces while the rest of Manitobans are stuck waiting in line? MLA Schmidt: Again, I'm pleased to update the House that over 120 projects have been approved and will be out throughout every region of Manitoba. Over a quarter of those have opened already.

But again, on this side of the House, we know that spaces aren't the only thing that's im portant. There's also the issue of child–early childhood educator wages, which were stagnant under the previous govern ment. We also know that operational funding to daycare facilities in this province was frozen for seven years under the previous government. The damage is great. There is much work to do, and like I said, Manitobans can count on the folks on this side of the House to get the work actually done. The Speaker: The honourable member for Spruce Woods, on a final supplementary question. Mr.

Jackson: The minister just committed that she has approved, or, her gov ernment has approved, 120 child-care projects in the province. Will she table that list of 120 projects for this House and for all Manitobans to see where they are? MLA Schmidt: Honourable Speaker, again, thank you for the member–thank you for the question from the member opposite. This is a very im portant issue. Manitobans have been suffering for seven and a half years under the failed leadership of the previous government.

2846 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 From on this side of the House, you're going to get responsible, transparent planning. It would–we all know that it would have taken 30, 40, 50 years under the PCs' imaginary child -care plan that they had. On this side of the House we have real plans. We work as a team. We are here for Manitobans' families and children. Post-Secondary Education Future Funding Inquiry Mr. Richard Perchotte (Selkirk): Honourable Speaker, the Uni versity of Manitoba expects to lose up to $8 million this year.

Enrolments have declined 30 per cent and more students are not returning to continue their studies. Students are asking if they'll be paying more to make up the difference in upcoming tuition. The Minister of Advanced Education has ensured this House that she will keep Manitoba uni versities and colleges whole. Will she confirm that contingency funds are being allocated from this year's budget to keep the U of M whole and (2) that funding is being put in place in Budget 2025 to avoid tuition hike next school year? Hon.

Renée Cable (Minister of Advanced Education and Training): It is a pleasure to stand up in this House, to finally get a question about one of the most important institutions in the province. Post-secondary education is so critically important to our economy, to the future of our province and to the success of all of us as Manitobans. I ap preciate the member –the question from the member, which highlighted the fact that earlier this year, the federal government unilaterally cut allocations for inter national students. That was some thing that was really unfortunate.

We fought very hard to get our fair share of students into universities. The Speaker: The honourable member for Selkirk, on a supplementary question. Mr. Perchotte: Honourable Speaker, this minister is responsible for keeping those institutions whole. Students are looking to her for answers and asking me to hold her accountable. The University of Winnipeg looks to lose up to $4 million in revenue this year. Can she tell the House today that contingency funds are being allocated in this year's budget to keep the U of W whole and that funding is in place for Budget 2025 to do the same?

MLA Cable: Honourable Speaker, I find it really rich that the members opposite are asking questions about sustainable funding for post -secondary institutions after they cut and froze funding for seven and a half years. Seven and a half years of in stitutions not having enough money to cover basic operating costs, of– Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. The Speaker: Order. MLA Cable: –students coming forward to say they didn't have the classes they needed, of students coming forward to say they didn't have the supports they needed. So I–while I appreciate the question, best to sit down.

The Speaker: The honourable member for Selkirk, on a final supplementary. Mr. Perchotte: While this minister is definitely stuck in the past, students are looking forward to their future. Colleges and uni versities are down hundreds of students and millions of dollars. I'm here to advocate on behalf of them and hold this minister accountable. Brandon University– Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. The Speaker: Order. Mr. Perchotte: –is down 20 per cent and the inter - national students are further down. Many smaller in- dependent schools are facing significant declines.

Can the minister please confirm contingency funds are being allocated for our schools? MLA Cable: Honourable Speaker, I thank the member for the question but I have to question where he was advocating during those seven and a half years, where students were out front of this building hollering, where institutions were on strike, where the Uni ver- sity of Manitoba Faculty Association took that gov- ernment to court for the fact that they inter fered in bargaining. Where was that member then?

On this side of the House, we value our relation- ships with our institutions, with our professors, with our unions and with our students, and we're working doing all that we can to ensure that in stitutions do not bear the brunt of a terrible policy by the federal government.

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2847 Child-Care Spaces Dawson Trail Constituency MLA Bob Lagassé (Dawson Trail): I've received numerous concerns from parents regarding the cancel- lation of the Kids at Play program and, as a direct result, the increased risks associated with children walking along Highway 207, where traffic speeds can reach 70 kilometers an hour. Due to the NDP negligence and cuts, after-school programs and additional daycare spaces are off the table in Dawson Trail. Will the minister commit today to put more daycare spaces and after-school programs in, yes or no?

The Speaker: The honourable minister for Advanced Education and Training. Sorry. The honourable minis- ter for Environment and Climate Change. Hon. Tracy Schmidt (Acting Minister of Education and Early Childhood Learning): I thank the member opposite for that important question. I would welcome the member to reach out to our office and I'd be glad to have a discussion with him. I'd be glad to meet with people in the community to hear about what the needs are in that commu nity and what we can do to better support the concern.

I will repeat myself, that after seven and a half years of inaction by the previous govern ment, Manitobans have finally elected a listening govern - ment, a government that's ready to meet folks where they're at and do the work that's necessary. The Speaker: The honourable member for Dawson Trail, on a supplementary question. MLA Lagassé: The NDP cuts to nine schools is very– is dramatically impacting the community of Ste. Anne. The new vocational high school planned and budgeted by our PC gov ernment hit the NDP chopping block, despite clear identified need in the commu nity.

This new school included over 100 new, desperately needed daycare spaces. Can the Minister of Education please explain why the funding for this school was cut and do the right thing today and commit to the residents of Ste. Anne that their new high school will be built.

MLA Schmidt: Again, we know that for seven and a half years, Manitoba students and families suffered under the previous government. * (14:20) Honourable Speaker, on the way out their door – on the way out the door in the last election, in the Department of Education, just like departments across government, they made a bunch of fake and phony promises to Manitobans to try to earn them selves re-election. It failed. Manitobans see through the PCs' failed strategies, and they've elected a gov ernment that's going to do real work.

The Speaker: The honourable member for Dawson Trail, on a final supplementary question. MLA Lagassé: The Legacy Children's Centre in Landmark, which opened in 2021 with provincial support from our PC government, is now struggling to stay afloat due to severe staffing shortages. Despite having the physical capacity to serve more children, the centre is being forced to limit its operations because it simply does not have the support it needs to attract and retain early childhood educators. Will the NDP stop cutting and imme diately step up for daycares like the Legacy child-care centre?

MLA Schmidt: It is disappointing that members oppo- site, like the member for Dawson Trail, pretend now as if they care about education and as they care about child care. On this side of the House, we recognize the chal- lenges that families and caregivers face in meeting their child-care needs. That's why Manitobans elected an NDP government. We are a government that believes in supporting children and their families. It is the most impor tant investment that we can make in society, Hon ourable Speaker.

Parents know that the previous government's plan failed them, and we look forward to working with Manitobans to make sure that we can meet their edu- cational and child-care needs. Protection for Persons in Care Office Abuse Investigation Backlogs–Timeline to Clear MLA Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): Back in July of 2023, the Auditor General's report investigating the Protection for Persons in Care Office reported a lengthy backlog of cases involv ing severe abuse of seniors and vulnerable Manitobans.

I brought this issue forward almost a year ago on November 23, 2023, and asked this govern ment to provide a timeline when these backlogged investi- gations will be completed. We never received the timeline.

2848 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 Nearly a year has gone by. Will the govern ment confirm for the House if these backlogged investi- gations have been completed? Hon. Uzoma Asagwara (Minister of Health, Seniors and Long-Term Care): I thank the member for that really impor tant question, and I do recall that she raised it previously and I appreciate that she did. You know, under the previous PC govern ment, there were very serious concerns, allegations of in - vestigations not being done as far back as 2019.

The previous PC government not only ignored those con- cerns; they went even further to not invest any resources whatsoever, knowing the concerns existed, to address those waits. It's a really reprehensible approach. It's a failed approach. It's why they're sitting on that side of the House, something that they should remember, some - thing we should all remember, which is why our gov- ernment has worked very, very hard to clear tha t backlog on behalf of Manitobans, seniors and their families. And as I just stated, I'm happy to report that backlog has been cleared.

The Speaker: The honourable member for Tyndall Park, on a supplementary question. Implementation of AG Recommendations MLA Lamoureux: I am very happy to hear that. The Auditor General's report provided recom - mendations for change at the policy and front -line level to prevent further abuse. I'm tabling a CBC

article from April 29, 2024, where the Health Minister said the NDP gov ernment is moving forward on certain recommendations. Can the minister share with us how many of the 12 recommendations from the Auditor General report have been implemented by this government? MLA Asagwara: Again, I thank the member for that really important question. You know, as I stated, we were handed a health-care system that was cut year over year by the previous government. Serious issues were ignored, neglected or made worse by their terrible decision making.

And I appreciate the member is asking really im- portant questions about how we protect seniors as a government. We've taken very, very significant steps to move health care and the protec tion of seniors in the right direction, including ensuring that we're implementing all 12 recommendations brought forward by the Auditor General. There's a lot more we need to learn. We're going to continue to listen to seniors and their families and experts in the system to move health care in healthier direction and to remember the mistakes of the PC gov- ernment past and Heather Stefanson so we do not repeat them.

The Speaker: The honourable member for Tyndall Park, on a final supplementary question. Seniors in Manitoba Government Plan MLA Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): Honour- able Speaker, it is wrong for this government to have campaigned on protecting seniors when an entire year has passed and they still have not –they haven't ad- dressed the abuse that occurred within our care homes or allowed for Manitobans to voice their opinion with respect to the in dependent office for the seniors' advocate. Can this government tell us specifically what their plan is for seniors in Manitoba? Hon.

Uzoma Asagwara (Minister of Health, Seniors and Long-Term Care): I want to be really clear: the investigations are up to date. We did clear the backlog–was an extensive backlog left to us by the previous PC govern ment who, again, spent years cutting health -care services and failing to protect seniors, which is a shameful record. Our government made sure that we had the tools in place to equip the PPCO with not only clearing that backlog but esta blishing policies that will further protect seniors.

It is doubly shameful that the PCs opposite to us not only made those mistakes i n the past, but they actually blocked the introduction of the independent seniors' advocate office from being intro- duced in this House while seniors were in the gallery for it that day. But our govern ment is moving forward, we're making sure that we are establish ing an independent seniors' advocate office. I look forward to working with that member to make sure it meets the needs of seniors across this province.

Health-Care System Capacity Transitional Care Bed Announcement MLA JD Devgan (McPhillips): Honourable Speaker, our government has been hard at work addressing the ER wait times that grew exponentially under the PC

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2849 government. Cleaning up their emergency department disaster has been a top priority and we've made progress. One sig nificant step our govern ment took this summer was the much-needed addition of transitional care unit beds to the system. These beds are key to improving care-times and reducing wait-times. Can the minister please tell us more about how these beds will help our health-care system and what they will do for our communities in Manitoba? Hon.

Uzoma Asagwara (Minister of Health, Seniors and Long-Term Care): I thank my colleague from McPhillips for that really great question. We have 68 new transitional care beds that are already making an impact on patient flow, wait- times and over - crowding. We've added 15 beds in Selkirk; 8 beds in Misericordia; 25 beds to Holy Family Personal Care Home; 20 beds to the safe space program in St. Boniface and there's more on the way. All of this is going to help seniors who are waiting for placements at long -term-care facilities.

It's going to help patients who are ready to be discharged but have barriers to being discharged in the com munity and it's going to support those who need additional care. Honourable Speaker, our government is committed to fixing the emergency room wait times that were caused by the previous government's cuts and this is a great step in the right direction. Drivers Education Enrolment Need for Classes in Rural Manitoba Mr.

Doyle Piwniuk (Turtle Mountain): Honourable Speaker, I'm hearing from constituents across Turtle Mountain and from Manitoba across our province that under this minister it used to be the rite of passage and now like winning a lottery. The current options are woefully inefficient. Enrolling into driver's ed should not require a com - bination of luck and patience. Why is this minister failing to

schedule sufficient classes, especially in our rural communities, Honour- able Speaker? Hon. Matt Wiebe (Minister responsible for the Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation): Well, it feels like there's a bit of a theme going on here today, Honourable Speaker, because it's all about cleaning up the mess created by the previous government.

Of course, not only in this case was the minister a member of the gov ernment, the member remember – member of the previous govern ment, he was the minister respon sible and he, of course, allowed the training and the situation with driver's ed in rural Manitoba to 'deterior.' We're working with our partners in rural Manitoba, we're ensuring that there is continuity and that there's enhanced services. Really, it's about cleaning up the mess. We're getting to work; where this minister failed, we're going to get it right. The Speaker: The honourable member for Turtle Mountain, on a supplementary question. Mr.

Piwniuk: I used the course finder feature on MPI's website and I'm not sure if the minister understands Manitoba geography, honour able min - ister–Honourable Speaker. The students at –a student from Cartwright who was told the only option that he had was to either go one hour to Morden, Manitoba, or to Brandon, Manitoba. Spending more time on the road than he did in the classroom, except it isn't the option because there are no seats despite registrations are just opening for that class. Why is this minister not making additional classes available in rural Manitoba? Mr.

Wiebe: Well, again, Hon ourable Speaker, it's a big mess and there's a lot to clean up, but we're working hard to make it happen. We're working with MPI to increase recruitment and retention of driver examiners, particularly in rural areas. We've got a new full-time driver examiner position which we filled this month in Brandon, to help better serve the needs of the growing community there.

Of course, the improved program reach, update to the instructor contracts, increase pay for driver's ed instruction, adding fleet vehicles to attract new instructors; the list goes on and on, Honourable Speaker. * (14:30) There's a lot to clean up, but the member opposite needs to be accountable for the steps that he didn't take when he was minister responsible. The Speaker: The honourable member for Turtle Mountain, on a final supplementary question. Mr.

Piwniuk: Honourable Speaker, looking at courses in this man–minister's 'constitually,' you have 25 dif- ferent courses offered, except these students suffer the same problem as rural students: even with a wealth of choices, seats are snapped up as soon as they are – become available.

2850 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 This minister is depriving youth throughout Manitoba of vital driver's safety education and the op- portunity to getting supervised practice on the road. Will this minister make it a priority for his office? Mr. Wiebe: Well, again, Hon ourable Speaker, the member's taking all this time to detail in specific examples all the failures that he created. We understand the issue. We understand the prob- lem.

The one thing he's not mentioning, of course, is the strike that the members opposite created at MPI and tried to politicize rather than getting to work at the business of improving MPI. That's the work that our government is doing. We're working with partners, not just with MPI, but of course with ACC and others who are providing some of this training. We're willing to work with all as one Manitoba to solve the problems created by the members opposite. School Construction Request for Location Mr.

Grant Jackson (Spruce Woods): Last week, in response to a question, the minister–acting Minister of Education committed to building five new schools in this year under her new administration in that depart- ment. Can she outline for us where those five new schools are being constructed? Hon. Tracy Schmidt (Acting Minister of Education and Early Childhood Learning): I thank the member opposite for the question. I'd be happy to detail the five new schools. So the one that's already opened is École Discovery Trails in Morden.

We've also got one school in Seven Oaks, we've got two schools in the great–or the great neighbourhood of Sage Creek, a DCFM and also an LRSD school. And then we've also got the Parkhill School in Steinbach that's slated to open in the fall. We are very excited of our capital school plan. I can't wait to share more with the House and with Manitobans. Mr. Jackson: So just so everyone's clear, three out of those five schools are already built, and we know that this government didn't build them in 12 months. So those are PC schools. You're welcome for building them in your constituencies.

And when are you going to start building schools for the rest of Manitobans? MLA Schmidt: Honourable Speaker, I apologize to Manitobans for the anger and the divisiveness coming from the opposite side of the House and for their inaccurate statements about the state of public educa- tion in Manitoba. Let's talk a little bit about their record, Hon our- able Speaker. They cut education for seven and a half years, and only in the election year pretended to have an increase.

They tried to get rid of all school boards with their failed bill 64 they couldn't even pass with their own majority government– Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. The Speaker: Order. MLA Schmidt: They misled Manitobans by claiming they were building nine new schools when reality they didn't even budget for them. They froze operating grants for child -care centres for seven years. They gutted the bureau of education française and cut the assistant deputy minister position. I could go on and on and on and on, Honour able Speaker. The Speaker: Member's time has expired. The time for question period has also expired.

Petitions? There are no petitions? Grievances? No grievances? ORDERS OF THE DAY (Continued) GOVERNMENT BUSINESS Hon. Nahanni Fontaine (Government House Leader): Honourable Speaker, can you please call to resume Committee of Supply. The Speaker: The House will now dissolve into Committee of Supply–resolve. COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY (Concurrent Sections) ROOM 254 HEALTH, SENIORS AND LONG-TERM CARE * (15:10) The Chairperson (Rachelle Schott): Will the Committee of Supply come to order. This

section of the Committee of Supply will now resume considera- tion of the Estimates of the De partment of Health, Seniors and Long-Term Care.

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2851 Questioning for this department will proceed in a global manner. The floor is now open for questions. Mrs. Kathleen Cook (Roblin): I will just jump right back into it. I wanted to start by asking a couple of questions related to the Brandon minor injury clinic that was an- nounced last month. I have two questions. I'll phrase them together. One is: Can the minister confirm that new funding has been made available for the operation of this clinic, and where in the budget would we find that funding?

And , secondly: Can the minister confirm exactly what services and equipment will be available at the Brandon minor injury clinic? Hon. Uzoma Asagwara (Minister of Health, Seniors and Long-Term Care): While we get some more information on that, I want to use this oppor tunity, since it's been a little while since we've been at this committee, to talk about primary care. Because what the member is asking about, really, is about primary care and the importance of primary care in Manitoba. You know, access to primary care and enhancing access to primary care has been a big priority for us as a government.

It's something that is a huge priority for Manitobans. Making sure that they have more access to those who provide primary care and not less has been key. And so I just want to share a little bit of informa- tion in terms of what have we done since the last time we were here at this com mittee to improve Manitobans' access to primary care.

And one of the big things that we've done and we were really, really proud to share this several weeks ago now, is we've added more health-care workers to the front lines of the health- care system, including those who directly provide primary- care services to Manitobans; 873 net-new health-care workers added to our health-care system is 87 per cent of our target to add 1,000 net new. Those are really im portant numbers. There's a breakdown of that that I can provide, but at a high level, I want to talk about what that means.

It means that more Manitobans have access to doctors, nurse practitioners, nurses, those folks they count on to pro- vide improved access to primary-care services, be it in minor injury and illness clinics, be it in the clinics of different kinds in com munity, be it in hospitals, you know, sites across the province. And the first and most important step to achieving anything that our government has laid out in our bud- get for '24-25 and budgets moving forward is making sure that we have the people on the front lines to deliver that care.

Which is why that really ambitious target of 1,000 net new health- care workers –and again, that's a very ambitious target. It was one that I think Manitobans saw that target and they raised some eyebrows and questioned whether or not, based on seven and a half years of cuts to heal th care and mistreating health -care workers and driving people out of the health-care system in droves, whether or not we could actually achieve that. But, you know, what we said at the time when we announced that target was that Manitobans deserve an ambitious government. They deserve ambitious goals.

Manitobans have really achieved some pretty ambitious– overcome obstacles and achieved ambitious targets themselves, and they deserve to finally have a govern- ment that matches their level of commitment to im- proving health care. And so we've made progress. Not enough. You know, there's a lot of work to do in making sure that we have more health -care workers and primary care and across the system, not less. Not –continue to add net-new folks to the front lines.

But we're committed to doing that work and we're committed to making sure that we stand up investments that meet the needs of Manitobans across the province, be it in rural Manitoba, in Brandon, in Winnipeg, in the North. We're really working with our partners across the province to make sure that when we make these an - nouncements–not just announcements, and they're not just commitments; they're things that we can action on behalf of Manitobans to move health care in the right direction. And so when our government talks about clinics, when we talk about improved access to primary care, what are we saying?

Well, what we're saying is more people on the front lines, more folks to provide the care that Manitobans count on. It's also important that when we look at primary care, that we're talking about more than just physicians. Physicians are awesome. Doctors are great. We love doctors. Our government makes that very, very clear. We're thrilled to work with them to improve health care for Manitobans, but we're also talking about experts in the system that, again, were mistreated for seven and a half years by the previous gover nment, kind of ignored.

2852 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 Like nurse practitioners as a good example. When I met with those folks in my office, I was shocked to learn they've never been to the Leg. They've never been invited to the Leg. by a Health minister to meet and talk about their expertise and how we can work together to make health care better. And I have to say, the nurse practitioners we have in Manitoba are absolute rock stars.

These are phenom- enal people, incred ible scope of practice, in credible commitment to making health care and primary care better for Manitobans and really have been wonderful partners in terms of how we work together to really enhance the con versation around what it means to provide primary care. And I would go even further than that to say, you know, having really meaningful conver sations with nurse practitioners and other folks about how do we improve access to care beyond primary care while using expertise like NPs, like midwives, like allied health-care professionals and other folks.

It's a really exciting time in Manitoba for health care because there's a lot of openness to creativity and innovation, and quite frankly it's an openness that was there previously but the previous government just had no interest in engaging these folks , which is really shameful. So, thrilled to be in a position where we can do this work alongside our partners and really improve access to primary care by making invest ments as a government. Mrs.

Cook: So just to restate my original question and add a little bit more request for information, in addition to information about where the money for the clinic is coming from, the services and equipment that are going to be available at the clinic, I would be interested–you know, the minister's talking about staff. What will the staff complement be at the Brandon minor injury clinic? And has that complement been filled? * (15:20) MLA Asagwara: Just waiting for a couple of addi - tional pieces of information.

But, you know, while we have a couple of minutes, I just want to talk a bit more about why this parti cular step was taken in Brandon in terms of, again, primary care. And I want to go back to our government and the Premier (Mr. Kinew) and I, our decision very early on, right in the beginning of forming govern ment and being sworn into Cabinet. The decision to go out and send an open letter to health- care workers and to subsequently let folks know that we would be under - taking a listening tour.

And sharing with Manitobans and those on the front lines that it was a value of ours, a priority to get to the front lines and hea r directly from Manitobans providing direct care to patients and communities each and every day. This is something that I have to say I was shocked, that opposition members made all kinds of jokes about going to the front lines and listening to health- care workers. You know, folks mocked us, mocked me for saying–you know, for going out there for an hour or two at a time during peak times when we could access health-care workers.

It was shocking to me and sur - prising, disappointing, that opposi tion PC members would actually criticize a decision to go to the front lines and listen to health-care workers. I thought it was a bit strange. But then when I reflected on the previous seven and a half years, I guess it did make sense. It lined up. It was disappointing because it showed that behaviours and ways of thinking hadn't changed for the PC members.

But it didn't deter us from doing the work of going to the front lines of health-care facilities and sites and meeting with health -care workers right where they're at and hearing what they had to say. And, you know, when we went to Brandon and when we met with folks there, it was really en - lightening to hear from those front -line health -care workers of all demo graphics. We're talking about nurses, allied health -care workers, facility support workers, housekeeping staff, environmental workers.

There are even some folks who work in com munity primarily that have relationships to the hospital who actually attended to share their thoughts and their expertise. And it was really, really enlightening to hear directly from these folks in terms of what they wanted to see. Really clear right from the get -go that what they wanted to see was improved access to primary care. And they wanted to see creative ways of ad - dressing the inadequate access to primary care for folks living in Brandon and surrounding areas.

And so, you know, by way of sending out that letter saying we respect health-care workers and we're here to listen; by way of our listening- tour stops, including in Brandon; by way of building these relationships with folks in Brandon and surrounding communities, we were able to make the decision to invest in improving access to primary care and finding a creative solve to a real challenge they'd been facing

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2853 in terms of how do we make sure that more Manitobans have access to the services that they need? How do we make sure that if your kid, you know– people always give the hockey example. I'm a little biased, I'll give a basketball example. If your kid is playing basketball and maybe they catch an elbow or something like that, and they need some stitches, that they have a place they can go that's not the emergency room to get that care. You know, if you–it's wintertime in Manitoba for about, you know, so many, so many months out of the year.

You know, if you slip and fall, and you hurt yourself, maybe you need casting, you know, where can you go that's not an emergency room to get that care? And that's–those questions that Manitobans had been asking, you know, the answer resides with minor injury clinics, after-hours clinics, enhancing access to primary care in a way that reduces pressures in other ways but really is just about making sure that if your loved one needs a place to go that isn't in the ER, some place that's more ap propriate, you can take your kid there, you can take your elderly loved one there, you can go there yourself.

You know, I'm already hearing the benefits from folks who have lived exper iences accessing these services and how it's really helping them and their families in their time of need out. Makes a lot of sense for them to access these doors for primary care. And so, you know, when we talk about why we take these steps–and it is, of course, in the budget, so the resources for this clinic and other investments are outlined in the budget–we are talking about team-based care. So again, physician, nurse, nurse prac titioner.

We're talking about team -based models of care that make the care that people access more com prehen- sive. And the hope with that is that it better meets people's needs. And the evidence for team -based models of care is well supported and well documented. Some great success stories across Manitoba that we can point to, and that's why we've taken the approach, with this particular clinic, to make sure that we've incorporated that approach into the model. Mrs.

Cook: Did the minister's gov ernment instruct Prairie Mountain Health to find the funding for the Brandon minor injury clinic from within its existing budget? MLA Asagwara: No. But I'd like to actually expand on what I shared earlier in terms of team-based models of care. So there's a number of folks who are employed through that MIC, and again, you know, talking about team-based models of care and having been a nurse myself working on the front lines, I truly appre ciate what team-based models of care allow for you to do as a provider.

It's a really, really im portant approach that empowers all folks on the team to see themselves as participants in providing quality care to folks who are accessing that care. Everybody has a really impor- tant role to play in folks ha ving a good- quality care experience in the system. It's an op portunity for us to also evolve as we grow.

And so when we look at taking creative and innovative approaches and building on successes where we've seen these models work previously, you know, as a government, we want to be able to be nimble and, you know, work with Prairie Mountain Health and work with our partners to identify if there are areas that maybe we've missed or we can improve access to care. You know, I shared a few minutes ago about an announcement that we made around hiring a net-new 873 health-care workers.

You know, what–I'm thrilled, there's actually a lot I can't wait to share here in this space in terms of what we've done since the last time we were at committee in terms of health care. But you know, when you go to a minor injury and illness clinic, there's all–hosts of reasons why some - one might present there. You know, maybe somebody needs a script for birth control. Well, good news, Manitobans: as of October 1, birth control is free in this province, which is pretty fantastic. And that is primary care. That is primary health care.

And, you know, there are so many different ways in which Manitobans need to access primary care, and we have an in credibly diverse, beautifully diverse province, and it's important that we have team -based models of care that can meet those diverse needs. So again, we've added 873 net -new health -care workers. We've done things like introduce uni versal free coverage for birth control, which is fantastic; a really important step our government has taken. And all the places that folks can go to benefit from these investments, they include places like the minor injury and illness clinic.

You know, when you look at who's working there, when we look at who staffs a clinic like that, we're

2854 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 talking about nurse prac titioners, we're talking about nurses, we're talking about laundry aides, clerks, medical office-clinic clerks, we're talking about security personnel, social workers, managers, materials manage- ment handlers. We're talking about a very, very dynamic team of folks who are all contributing to the ability of Manitobans in rural Manitoba, Brandon folks being able to access care at this clinic.

And, again, I can't overstate the importance of having diverse teams, dynamic teams, multidisciplinary teams, folks who get to really work off of one another, with each other, to make sure that folks are getting the kind of quality care that they deserve. And so, you know, the money was prioritized in our budget for primary care–enhancements to primary care, because our government recognizes the value of that.

And we work with our partners so that we can work with them collaboratively to identify the best op- portunities to get that off the ground, which has been really, really exciting. * (15:30) And I have to commend the leadership at Prairie Mountain Health. Those folks have been really good to work with.

You know, folks like Trina, who just have a really deep understanding and appreciation for health care, just doing a great job as a leader, and who are willing to rise to the challenge of addressing seven and a half years of cuts, consolidation, mis manage- ment and mistreatment of health-care workers, to work with our gov ernment to move health care in a better direction. Now, all of that being said, this kind of work doesn't create the changes in health care that we need to see overnight, right? This takes years and years of effort–sustained effort.

You know, I sometimes would say it's not a sprint, it's a marathon. But it does feel like we're sprinting a marathon a lot of days in order to do this work and we'll continue to do that because that's what Manitobans elected us to do. But, certainly, you don't fix the kind of damage that was done in a year. I wish we could. It doesn't work that way. It's going to take us years of sustained effort, part nership and col laboration, and learning from how things evolve after we action these invest - ments to continue to move things in the right direction. Mrs.

Cook: I just want to state on the record that I've asked three questions now, and the minister has talked for nearly 15 minutes around the answers but has not actually answered the questions. I'm a fairly reasonable person. I don't expect that the minister would have all of these answers at their fingertips or even that their staff would. The minister can always take these questions under advisement and get back to me later with the answers. I will try one more time. I'm asking for information about the budget for the Brandon minor injury clinic. How much and where can I find it in the budget?

What services and equipment are available at the clinic? And what is the staff com- plement? The minister talked about the different types of staff that will be in the clinic; I'm looking for numbers. How many staff, and is that complement full? MLA Asagwara: The member's previous question was asked and answered. I was very clear that we have provided the funding in the budget, that –not Prairie Mountain Health, but flowed through Prairie Mountain Health, but our government allocated those resources in budget '24-25. The list of the staff that I provided, that's who was working at the site.

We've got about 11, just under 12 FTEs–it's 11, 11 FTEs. We've filled 10 of those 11 positions. And you know what's really exciting about this clinic–like, you know, all clinics, primary care, that we are investing and enhancing in Manitoba across the province–is the ability for Manitobans to go there for a whole host of primary- care needs and issues. And, you know, one area of health care that we really didn't hear a Health minister talk about for many years under the previous government was reproductive health care.

We didn't hear a Health minister talk about menstruation, we didn't hear a Health minister talk about the importance of reproductive health care like pre-natal care, PAP testing, really basic–abortion health care, like we're talking basic aspects of health care that affect 50 per cent plus of the population. Ask a Health minister five years ago, they would have said, I don't know. I'm not talking about it. Ask someone else.

It was confusing for health-care providers, primary- care providers, clinics to get an answer, because the Health minister of the day just didn't want to talk about basic, human health- care needs. Really a con - cerning approach. And so as the minister now, it excites me to be able to talk about the ways in which we're enhancing

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2855 access to these services, that so–thousands upon thou- sands upon thousands of Manitobans count on. You can go to a minor injury and illness clinic and you can get care and treatment for UTIs, you can get access to phlebotomy services, you can get care for suspected fractures, you can get preventative health - care needs met, chronic health-care needs met.

You can go in and, you know, if you're a young person or any person who let's say has never had access to, you know, parti cular reproductive health- care needs, maybe you want to have conver sations with a provider about, you know, what does going on birth control need to look like for you, or you've had a change in your menstrual cycle that's concerning and you need to get somewhere that's not an ER and have that addressed and have that con versation. Guess what? You can go there and have those needs met. You can ask those questions. That's all really impor tant.

Funda mentally, it's critical that you have a govern ment that is not going to downplay the value of enhancing access to those kinds of health- care services and that work with providers to improve access. And so, you know, when I list off all the folks who are employed and who are staffing the minor injury clinic, like I said, nurse prac titioners, nurses, aides, clerks, security folks, social workers, managers, materials management handlers, social workers–I mean, that's huge, right?

We're talking about folks who, not only are you going in there to talk about, let's say, your reproductive health- care needs, but perhaps you're going in there and you've got questions about, you know, I also want to talk to somebody about what services exist for me to meet my family's needs. Maybe you're looking at some family planning challenges, maybe you're looking at some resource challenges in the com munity that–or you just don't have the information. Guess what? There's somebody there in this team-based model of care that can answer those questions for you.

And so on page 82, we've got a list of the invest- ments our government has made to enhance access to provincial health-care services. You know, and as I stated, it's so impor tant that we not only make these investments, but we talk about what they m ean to Manitobans. And after a deficit approach, an approach previously that really just devalued the importance of talking about reproductive health care, women's health care, the health care of gender-diverse Manitobans, I'm thrilled to be in a position where we can invest in primary care and also invest in the ways in which all Manitobans access that health care.

And we're going to keep learning as we go. And we're going to keep making changes, you know, the 11 FTEs now may look different in a year from now, or two years from now, based on what the community says their needs are. And that's an openness that we have as a listening government. * (15:40) Mrs. Cook: Admittedly, I'm newish to the Legislature. I've only been here for a year, but I'm not afraid to talk about abortion or menstrua tion or birth control or reproductive health care or any of those issues. I'm open to that discussion any time. I do want to talk about some bed issues.

I'm going to ask for some information here. This is a big request for information. Feel free to take it under advisement. The NDP gov ernment has made several bed commitments: 31 acute -care beds at the Grace in November 2023; 36 acute-care beds at St. Boniface in January 2024; nine new beds in Dauphin also in January 2024; 50 new beds for HSC in April 2024; and the 68 transitional beds that were announced over the summer. I would like to know what the status of these beds is. How many of them are open and operational today?

MLA Asagwara: So part of the reason why our gov- ernment identified very quickly that we needed to add beds back to the system was because we watched year over year as hundreds of beds were cut from the system. Now, a lot of Manitobans rightly ask the question: man, why does this system have the challenges that it does right now?

And we only have to look to the years of cuts and closures of emergency rooms, con- solidation of services, during a time when our popula- tion was growing, aging and complexity of disease, burden of disease was increasing, to understand why cutting over 200 beds from the health-care system was not only the wrong move, it was the worst move that could've been made by the previous government. Truly damaging. Truly damaging, because as we aptly state, when we talk about investing in the health- care system by adding beds, we always say that we're not really talking about beds, we're talking about people.

That when we add beds to a health-care system, what we're saying is we are adding folks to the front lines

2856 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 to provide care and appropriate settings to Manitobans where and when they need it. And so it's equally im - portant that when we talk about the loss of hundreds of beds from the system, that we identify that that is, in fact, the loss of hundreds of front -line health-care workers who are staffing those beds and provi ding care in settings Manitobans counted them to be at for years under the previous government.

And so our commit ment to add net new health - care workers to the health-care system is what allows us the ability to add beds to the health -care system. Our commitment to adding beds in a variety of dif - ferent settings is key to us being able to make sure that we have more capacity, not less.

Now that being said, as I stated already, when you cut beds from a system, when you cut people, fire people from the health-care system, when you force folks to go down into a tunnel under HSC and talking with their colleagues for job postings, it's real conse - quences, and we're seeing those con sequences in the health-care system today.

It is so important that the approach that's taken to this is one that is really meaningful and sus tainable which is why our government has worked very closely with regional health authorities, with sites, to better understand their needs and to support them as they bring these beds online. As I shared, just during question period today, you know, our govern ment is taking steps to add beds in ways that speak to the growing need, diversity of needs in terms of where people need to access services.

And so standing up transitional care unit beds, I want to give a quick shout-out to the Interlake-Eastern Regional Health Author ity who's really been a great partner to work with, strong leadership there; really, really working hard to find creative solutions to the challenges that were forced upon them by the previous administration. And I had the chance to visit the new transitional care unit, their 15-bed unit that was stood up, and we didn't announce that; we shared the infor mation after it was stood up and already operational, and it was great.

It was great to tour there and meet with the staff who were so excited to have been a part of something first of its kind for them, and to meet with residents, meet with patients. We're talking about the quality – great quality care they received. * (15:50) I actually met a woman there, just an in credible person who hand-makes bears, hand-makes these really adorable and wonderful bears that she gives out to other patients and families, and there was one sitting on the nursing station desk on the unit.

And I just thought, like, what a great culture they're creating and they're fostering there, you know, a culture in health care that we want to see every - where, of collaboration, of partnership, of, you know, empowering patients, making folks feel seen and, you know, ensuring that when we make announce ments and investments into beds, that we're able to staff them in a way that is, again, sustainable and really meets the unique needs of the folks who need them. And so I think it's impor tant to acknowledge the good work that folks are doing. These beds don't come online easily.

Takes a tremendous amount of effort, and I want to thank all the leaders in the health- care system who've been working really hard with their front-line team members to get this done. And I want to thank our de partment as well. Our folks here in the De partment of Health have worked really hard to identify the opportunities in this regard and continue to assess the situation as it unfolds. And like I said, 68 transitional-care-unit beds; I shared that in question period today. And that's just one of the many steps we're taking in terms of adding bed capa- city to the health-care system. Mrs.

Cook: It wasn't clear from that answer. Are all of these beds open and operational now? MLA Asagwara: Something that I think is really im- portant to high light is the impacts of what it means when you bring beds online and how that works in conjunction with other investments like seven-day-a- week discharge capacity. So, you know, there–we're hearing from different folks the impacts of that investment, right, seven-day- a-week ability to discharge folks previously in the health-care system. And we heard this really early on in the listening tour, this thing called the weekend effect.

Heard this from folks where, because you couldn't discharge any- body from a hospital because your staffing resources to do that dropped off Thursday, Friday, there's this weekend effect where folks didn't get, you know, physiotherapy, social work access on the weekend. Therefore, you could have this peak in the middle of the week where you could discharge and it just drops off. So early on in our administration, we made the in- vestment to add seven-day-a-week discharge capacity.

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2857 And very recently, you know, there was feedback that I was provided in terms of the benefits of that. That, you know, you've got physiotherapy available at a hospital on a weekend

whereas previously, they weren't there. And social work. And I can share that I was at Victoria Hospital, Victoria General Hospital, on a weekend not that long ago, on a Saturday. And I was in a hallway on a unit and said hi to one of the folks who are working. And she intro duced herself and kind of carried on. And then she paused and she actually looked at me and said, oh, and thank you. And I said what for, and she said, oh, I'm working today because of the investment into the seven day a week.

So this social worker there on a Saturday morning, you know, we both recognized in that moment, oh, yes, before that invest ment was made, she wouldn't have been there working on the weekend providing care to Manitobans who need it so that they can get home to their loved ones more quickly and recover at home or, you know, get access to the resources they need and community. And so, you know, it's not, again, just about adding beds, it's about adding people in ways that staff those beds and provide direct care that benefits Manitobans.

And so, you know, there are steps that we're taking as a government that allow for discharges to improve and improve the flow through the system. So, you know, we know that as a result of our seven- day-a-week discharge investment, that discharges on the weekend are actually improving. And, again, when you cut health care for seven and a half years and you fire people and you mistreat them, you don't see im - provements right away over night. But we're moving in a better direction, and that's what matters. Like, we're seeing these positive steps being taken.

We're seeing discharge percentages on the weekend go up. You know, 10 per cent on a Sunday in one loca- tion makes a big difference, right? Those are folks who would have been in hospital without access to social work, physiotherapy. You know, maybe their care isn't moving as quickly as it can in terms of their recovery because of a lack of access. We're making those investments to turn the tide on–in that regard. We're seeing discharges really improve on Mondays and Tuesdays. Again, we heard about that weekend effect from front -line health-care workers who were like, this is obvious.

Every other jurisdiction is doing this but Manitoba. What's up? And so we made the investment and now we're seeing discharges improve on Mondays and Tuesdays. Which means a lot to folks. Means so much to people who are in hospital, you know, wanting to get home to their loved ones, wanting to sleep in their own beds. And they're able to do that increasingly so because of the under standing that a bed is not just a bed. It's about how you staff it, it's how you work together and col laborate to make sure folks have access to quality care.

And so, you know, when I talk about adding 68 transitional-care-unit beds to the system, and a good number of those beds are already online, and we've–and the member has asked understandably about where we're at in terms of the beds that we've announced previously. And we're chugging along, we're well on our way adding these beds to the system. It's exciting not just because, as I said before, talking about beds, but we're talking about a diversity of front-line health-care professionals who are staffing those beds and providing real care to Manitobans; has real, real impacts for Manitobans.

So the total number around, you know, what–how many of those beds have come online and where we're at in that regard, I'd be happy to get that number and those particular details to the member at a later time. * (16:00) But what I can say is that we are focused on not only restoring the hundreds of beds that were cut by the previous government, we're looking beyond that. We're looking about not just filling up the hole that they dug; we're talking about building up in the health- care system in a way that has positive impacts for folks for many years to come. Mrs.

Cook: Thank you, and just as a favour to our clerks, who I'm sure they'll be wanting clarification, is the minister taking this under advisement? MLA Asagwara: To be more specific, yes, I'd be happy to take that under advisement and provide more clarity on that information for the member at a later date.

And I do want to share, and I made a point of thanking the Interlake -Eastern Regional Health Authority, but I do think it's im portant to also thank board chairs and leaders, CMOs, CEOs, folks across the health -care system, across all regional health authorities, who we've been working really hard with in order to do this work.

2858 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 You know, no regional health author ity is the same and no site is the same. These folks have very unique needs, and it's been really a privilege to get to meet with folks and to work with them to understand their unique needs. Everyone is facing–and we notice it's a national challenge; it's an international challenge, the competition–use that word in a light -hearted way but it's very real, the competition for talent, for health- care talent, is serious.

You know, we see other jurisdictions undertaking really interesting approaches in order to recruit and to retain. It is a con versation that's happening at the national level in really important ways. But it's–I have to say it's a conversation that Manitoba only really just started participating in meaningfully. Previous gov- ernment just really was taking sort of the opposite approach that other jurisdictions were.

While other jurisdictions were getting really creative about the ways that they would solve their health-care human resource challenges, here in Manitoba, previous government was, you know, saying–throwing up the peace sign to health-care workers and saying, see you later. You know, closing units, making decisions that saw us lose a tremendous amount of expertise.

Having worked on the front lines of health care myself and having most of my family, quite frankly, work in health care, I have a different, unique appre - ciation for what it means to be a nurse who–or health- care worker who specializes in a particular area. You know, I've had the benefit of having another nurse in our caucus: the MLA for Tuxedo is not only just an outstanding person and already an outstanding MLA, she is a really outstanding nurse and has taught me a lot about what her experiences were on the front lines.

She literally just basically yesterday came from the front lines into govern ment and is doing a great job and is a direct connection for nurses and health- care workers to have their voices heard. And, you know, it's really–it's been really wonderful to have her expertise at the table to help inform our approach and her relationships in the health-care system. It's been really useful and it's wonderful to have another perspective on the team.

Our entire team is on board with making health-care stronger for Manitobans, but it's great to have another nurse in caucus who can speak to the nuances of the health-care system that we need to be paying attention to as a government. And, you know, it's so im portant that leaders in the health-care system can see that not only are we, you know, undertaking a listening tour, we'll be–it's a permanent listening tour as far as I'm concerned. We're going to be listening for the duration of our mandate to Manitobans and health- care workers on the front lines.

Not only do they have a government that's com- mitted to doing the work of addressing the culture in health care and making meaningful invest ments and adding beds, but they have a government that is attracting health-care workers in many different ways to get involved with making health care stronger. And I can't thank the health-care workers, health- care leaders, folks across the system enough for being willing–despite seven and a half years of being mistreated–being not only willing but eager to work with our government to bring solutions forward.

And bring forward concerns and ideas and criticisms and big hopes and big dreams and all of that, because hearing all of that is how we actually meaningfully engage together and move health care in the right direction. So, you know, as I said, it's not something that we can repair overnight. It's not something that we com- municate to Manitobans can be fixed in a day or that there's one size fits all to how we do this. But it is something that we believe, if we commit ourselves to building those relationships and taking steps in the right direction every day, we're going to continue to see more beds come online.

We're going to see more diverse staff being hired. We're going to see seven- day-a-week discharge continue to have a benefit. And we're going to hopefully continue to see folks really engage with us because they believe in this precious and sacred responsibility that we have to make health care as good as it can be for Manitobans. And so I can't thank folks enough across the system for their generosity and their part nership, and we're going to keep working with all of them to add more beds, more resources, more services to our health-care system for Manitobans. Mrs.

Cook: I want to move on to some capital questions. So one of the actions that the NDP govern ment took when they took office was to pause or to freeze a number of projects that were under way, including freezing specialized-equipment funding. And I'm con- cerned in parti cular for the catheterization labs at St. Boniface. As the minister will know, these are critical for the work that they do at St. Boniface, the life-saving cardiac work that is done there. And I'm wondering if the minister can tell the committee what the expected lifespan is of the existing cath labs and what the plan is to replace them?

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2859 * (16:10) MLA Asagwara: I thank the member for that question. You know, cardiac health, heart health in Manitoba, is a really important priority. It is some thing that really hits close to home for me personally, and I know really hits home for many, many, many Manitobans, particularly women's heart health. I'm sure the member is well aware –I'm actually, I'm not even sure if we were at a similar event or the same event together recently about women's heart health; I can't recall if the member was there, I think she was.

But, you know, it's so im portant that when we're talking about heart health in Manitoba–as we're talking about any issue, really–that we identify the folks in the groups that perhaps do not have the level of access to information that they should, the ways in which we can close the gaps in terms of improving heart health outcomes for Manitobans. And, you know, for quite some time here in Manitoba, the cardiac care at St. Boniface–it was a cardiac centre of excellence, cardiac care centre of excellence.

I heard this a few years ago, questions from cardiac specialists in the province who were very concerned about the fact that this program that had this really impor tant distinction nationally, really a beacon of what can be done when experts are sup - ported, was being eroded by the previous government. I actually –I wondered if there was some thing I just wasn't putting together, because they were so con- cerned and they were adamant that the previous gov- ernment was systemically dismantling that program.

And I thought, no way, like, why would you dismantle, erode a cardiac centre of excellence, something that we shine so brightly at doing in Manitoba? And yet, it was true. It was true. That's exactly what was happening. And now, you know, we've been working with local advocates and folks to understand how do we make sure that Manitoba is a centre of excellence for cardiac care, St. Boniface Hospital is a cardiac care centre of excellence. It's been wonderful to meet with leadership there.

These folks do jaw -dropping work in getting communities engaged to improve access to infor ma- tion and education and awareness. They go so far as to educate thousands of students annually. This is the St. Boniface foundation does this work in conjunction with the hospital and post -secondary institution, the University of Manitoba. They actually go out to reach thousands of kids and engage them in cardiac sciences and get them interested in pursuing that as a path.

And, of course, these kids go home and they have these conversations with their families and they share what they're learning, and just by way of increasing those conversations in the household, you're supporting improved outcomes for Manitobans. It is really a testament to be, again, the creativity and the generosity of the experts we have in the province that this work is being done. Thrilled to be able to work with these folks and support their effort to restore and go beyond that and really ensure that cardiac care at St. Boniface and in Manitoba is excellent. And, you know, folks like Dr.

Soni is a good example. Just an outstanding researcher, somebody who is now permanently in Manitoba doing this in- credibly important work. Thrilled to be able to support Dr. Soni and her colleagues and their efforts to improve women's heart health outcomes. It is a particular area of research that has been maybe not treated with the same level of investment or care due to systemic reasons. Quite frankly, you know, women's health issues have not been invested in in the same way. Research hasn't been treated with the same level of interest as it should've been.

And it's incredible that we've got the top minds and talents right here in Manitoba who are dedi cated to not only doing this work but creating future genera tions of health-care providers and professionals who will lead the way. Very exciting work being done in the pro- vince that we're happy to support. You know, it's also im portant that we listen to those with lived experiences, so I want to give a shout- out to Jackie Ratz as somebody who spoke at the event and shared her personal story.

Again, I have folks in my own life who are navigating cardiac health issues, heart health challenges that are very real and that, quite frankly, it's –I am relieved that they're here in Manitoba, knowing that there's experts like we have on the front lines provi ding this care. And it's so im - portant to us that we're investing in making that care stronger. The member used the word freeze earlier. I'm not sure where that came from. I know winter is coming, but–so maybe that's why that language was used.

But we are making sure that we're working with our part- ners to invest in this area of health care, and I can provide–I'm running out of time, but I can provide

2860 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA October 15, 2024 more information on that front for the member if she would like. Mrs. Cook: I was at the same event the minister is referring to. But just to restate the question: I am looking for the plan to replace or refurbish or whatever's going to be done to renew the cath labs at St. B and wondering what the expected lifespan is of the existing labs. MLA Asagwara: I think, as the member can probably appreciate, that's actually a pretty technical question.

It's a very nuanced question and, as the member has stated previously, I do not have all answers for every- thing, although I would love to, in life, at my fingertips. * (16:20) And, you know, that's–it's a question that's really technical and nuanced, and I do want to make sure that I'm understanding, because I–what I would like to take away, and what I think makes sense, is maybe to talk a bit about maybe generally at what point certain things are in place. There's no standardized, you know, all the equip- ment would be replaced at the same time or anything like that. It's actually a pretty technical question.

And, you know, obviously, as we all well know, equipment in any space for anything can, you know, maybe go longer than what we think or be required to be changed earlier than what we think, right? There's all kinds of reasons why equipment may need to be replaced or changed or upgraded or what have you. And in terms of these labs, there's going to be variation there, as well, that we're going to have to dig into. And we wouldn't necessarily have that.

We–that would be something that the regional health authority would have the details around and be res ponsible for managing and working with partners throughout the system, St. Boniface, to understand their needs. And that's really their direct relationship. That's something that we expect them to manage. You know, I can say that technology in this space is ever evolving. It's incred ible to see how cardiac sciences have rapidly evolved in recent years. I'm personally excited by AI and simultaneously terrified by AI, I think like a lot of folks.

Watch one too many movies and maybe your mind goes places, but ultimately, I'm more excited about the benefits of AI and the rapidly evolving technology in that space. It's really exciting stuff. I had some young folks recently talk to me about AI as a diagnostic pathway forward. So how do we use AI to more accurately, more rapidly diagnose illnesses? How do we get that in the space of diagnostics? It's a really, really, again, rapidly evolving but very exciting space.

And some thing that, you know, maybe even 10 years ago, we would have thought to ourselves: not in our lifetime; you know, that's probably another gen- eration that's going to be leaning into some of that. And we're seeing, you know, almost overnight it feels like, it's a space that it's happening right now. And so when we talk about the life of equipment and technology, we're also talking about what does the future of this space look like in Manitoba? You know, where are we looking in terms of best practices?

What is the science and the evidence telling us about, you know, what's emerging and what we should be paying attention to? You know, we've got some really, really bright, brilliant folks in the department, data scientists who have really cool ways of applying their expertise in terms of how we can improve health care. And certainly there are all kinds of proponents out there that are bringing forward their ideas as well.

And so whether it's cardiac care or other aspects of health care where we know that equipment does have a lifespan, you know, as we look to the future, we're having con versations about how do we take an ap- proach that is meeting the needs –the future needs of Manitobans and the future evolving techno logical needs in health care. It's a really, really exciting opportunity. I've had these conversations, as well, with Minister Moses in Economic Development because it's a space that he is minister responsible for Economic Development, that he's learning about as well.

You kn ow, and our gov- ernment does take a –really an all -of-government ap- proach to health care. And so when we're having conver sations about, you know, technolo gies, it's also the minister for post-secondary education, Advanced Edu cation and Training. You know, what are students learning on? What equipment are they being trained on? Are t hey being trained on equipment–we had the opportunity to go to UCN recently. What I thought a simulation lab was, was not what it was. It was so cool. The techno- logy there, the way folks are learning was, again, very, very exciting.

And it's wonderful to see that, across our de part- ments, everybody's in this space of how do we make sure that not only we're addressing the imme diate equipment needs in health care, and in cath labs and

October 15, 2024 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 2861 other places, but what are we doing to think about down the road? And so it's an exciting space. This is definitely something I've got to take away and get back to the member on in terms of the question she's asking, because it is pretty technical, and it's something that's we're going to have to go to the regional health author- ity and ask them for clarity on. And we can bring that back to the member at a later date.

The Chairperson: Before recognizing the next member, I'd like to remind all members to please refer to other members by portfolio or constituency only. So now I'd like to acknowledge the hon ourable member for Roblin. Mrs. Cook: I thank the minister for that commitment to provide that information. Continuing on capital for a moment, in 2023 the previous government had committed to an expansion and redevelopment of The Pas clinic, and funding was allocated and approved for that project. I understand the planning and design work began in 2023 and con- struction was expected to begin in this fiscal year.

And I would just like to ask about the status of that project; if it's continuing and going ahead or if it's not continuing and what the reasons for that might be. MLA Asagwara: Just going to get a couple of additional pieces of information. I do want to talk about, you know, what the member raised, you know, commit ments or an nouncements that were made by the previous government, because I think it's important. I think it's important, I've learned a lot about pro- cess. Budgeting process, Estimates process, we've developed processes to make the processes stronger and better as a government.

And I have to say, it's been fascinating in this role and really, actually, quite frankly, disheartening to see what happens when a government, the previous govern ment,

Document details

Collection	Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	43-1-75b
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	43rd 1st hansardpdf 75b.pdf
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	6ddd8775a2de9ad4c6a513120a93f6501dc010cb

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