PDF Version

April

26, 2016

GOVERNMENT

SERVICES COMMITTEE

Pursuant to Standing Order 68, Kevin Parsons, MHA for Cape St. Francis,

substitutes for Keith Hutchings, MHA for Ferryland.

The

Committee met at 6 p.m. in the Assembly Chamber.

CHAIR (Edmunds):

Okay, we're going to get

started here now. The Government Services Committee meets on I'm lost here.

OFFICIAL:

Service NL.

CHAIR:

Service NL and Government

Purchasing Agency.

Before

we start, I would like to have the Government Services Committee introduce

themselves and their colleagues.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Good evening. My name is

Kevin Parsons from the beautiful District of Cape St. Francis.

MS. DRODGE:

Megan Drodge, Researcher with the Official Opposition caucus.

MR. KING:

Neil King from the historic

District of Bonavista.

MR. MORGAN:

Ivan Morgan, Researcher, NDP caucus.

MR. FINN:

John Finn, MHA, Stephenville

Port au Port.

MS. PARSLEY:

Betty Parsley from the

beautiful District of Harbour Main.

MS. HALEY:

Carol Anne Haley, MHA, Burin

Grand Bank.

CHAIR:

Okay.

I would

ask the minister to introduce his staff, and just to point out that if you

access your staff that they please say their names before addressing any

questions.

MR. JOYCE:

Eddie Joyce, MHA, Humber

Bay of Islands.

MR. PUDDESTER:

I'm Leigh Puddester. I'm the

Deputy Minister for Service NL and for Procurement Reform.

MS. KELLAND:

Donna Kelland, ADM for

Government Services Branch, Service NL.

MR. MCCARTHY:

Julian McCarthy, ADM,

Consumer and Commercial Affairs, Service NL.

MS. HICKEY:

Marlene Hickey, Chief Review

Commissioner for the Workplace Health, Safety and Compensation Review Division.

MS. HEARN:

Patricia Hearn, Chief

Operating Officer for the Government Purchasing Agency.

MS. HAYES:

Robin Hayes, Departmental

Controller, Service NL and the Government Purchasing Agency.

MR. LETTO:

Graham Letto, Parliamentary

Secretary, Service NL.

MR. CARD:

Jason Card, Director of

Communications.

MS. DOGURGA:

Sherrie-Lynn Dogurga, EA for

the hon. Eddie Joyce.

CHAIR:

I think what we're going to

do is we're not going to stop the clock; we're just going to carry right on

through with any questions. We're going to start off with Government Purchasing.

First of all, I'd like to have a motion to adopt the minutes from the last

meeting.

AN HON. MEMBER:

So moved.

CHAIR:

Okay.

Carried.

motion, minutes adopted as circulated.

CHAIR:

Okay, I'm looking forward to

Government Services Committee.

If the

minister would like to make some opening remarks prior to getting started

MR. JOYCE:

I just have a few prepared

statements here

CLERK (Ms. Barnes):

We need to call the

subheads.

MR. JOYCE:

Subheads.

CHAIR:

Okay.

CLERK:

1.1.01

MR. JOYCE:

Good evening.

minister of Service NL and minister of the Government Purchasing Agency, I'm

pleased to appear before you to discuss the Estimates figures for these

entities.

I want

to take this opportunity to thank the Members opposite and their staff for

joining us. I also want to thank staff from Service NL, the Government

Purchasing Agency and also the WorkplaceNL review division for their preparation

for today's session and also for their hard work and dedication that they have

shown over a number of years.

When I

was on the opposite side, the same as the Member for Cape St. Francis, I always

recognized the hard work and dedication of the people in these departments. They

do a lot of work for the people of Newfoundland and Labrador.

Service

NL is responsible for the majority of licensing, inspection, public record

keeping and the regulatory functions within the government. It is the primary

access point for people who need these services.

Service

NL undertakes hundreds of thousands of transactions each year. These range from

electrical inspections to restaurant inspections to production of vital

statistics records and the registration of deeds. Within the Motor Registration

Division, Service NL completes more than a million transactions per year. The

authority to carry out the department's mandate comes from more than 180

statutes and regulations as well as standards and codes of practice. In addition

to the Office of the Queen's Printer, the department provides printing services

for the provincial government and the general public.

The

WorkplaceNL review division reviews decisions of WorkplaceNL to ensure

compliance with the act, as well as regulations and policies. The division

provides vital appeal services to employers and workers and pursues continuous

improvements in the area of client service.

The

Government Purchasing Agency is the central procurement unit of the Government

of Newfoundland and Labrador. It is responsible for managing the procurement

process for goods and services on behalf of all government departments. The

agency processes and oversees in excess of 19,000 procurement transactions

annually, including 500 public tenders, which in total are valued at

approximately $250 million.

Clearly, there's a significant amount of work undertaken in the areas I have

mentioned. I also want to make sure we make the most of our time in this

Estimates session. I will now turn it over to the Chair.

Mr.

Chair, just for the record, when we're complete we have a copy of the book for

the Members opposite, and also for the NDP if they want a copy of our Estimates

here.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, sure.

Thank

you, Mr. Chair.

I look

at Service NL and when I first got elected people always asked me what do they

do? I basically say you know what; they got you from the time you're born to the

time you die and everything in between. That's basically what your department

does.

People

of the province don't realize some of the things you do, but I really do

appreciate the work that goes on in your department. I have to say, it's one of

the best departments to have any inquiries about or whatever. The response is

always good. So I thank you for that.

Minister, I have a couple of general questions that I'd like to ask first and

then we'll go into line-by-line stuff. Are there any plans to bring in and pass

the new public tendering legislation?

MR. JOYCE:

Yes, there is. It's the

procurement act. We're in the process we had many meetings on it. In actual

fact, we have meetings again this week on it. We are hoping to bring it in,

maybe even this session.

I know

the previous government, which you were a part of, did a lot of work with it. It

wasn't brought in so we are hoping to have it ready and possibly brought in, in

this spring session of the Legislature.

MR. K. PARSONS:

I believe there are a lot of

people waiting for it, to get the new legislation in place so that it's more

open and transparent, as we all talk about every day.

Okay,

that's good.

general question: I'm just wondering what agencies you're responsible for. I

know it's a general question but

MR. JOYCE:

Service NL, municipal and

provincial affairs ministries, workers' compensation

MR. K. PARSONS:

Yes, but I'm talking more or

less about the Government Purchasing Agency. Are you responsible for

municipalities, name off because I really don't think people understand what

MR. JOYCE:

Under the

MR. K. PARSONS:

Any agency within

government.

MR. JOYCE:

GPA is all government

agencies. It's all government agencies, because GPA does all the purchasing for

all the departments in government.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Even municipalities do you

fall under municipalities?

MR. JOYCE:

Well, it's under the act,

and then what we're doing now under the procurement, the municipalities will

have to follow under that also, yes.

MR. K. PARSONS:

They'll have to follow the

same policy.

MR. JOYCE:

Yes.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, thank you.

I'm

just going to go into line-by-line items there now.

MR. JOYCE:

Now, I may get the officials

to answer to make sure you've got the right answer.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Listen, anybody can answer,

sure.

MR. JOYCE:

We got all the answers; they

can explain it just to ensure (inaudible).

MR. K. PARSONS:

Yes, no problem whatsoever.

On the

first one there, Salaries, I'll just ask you to explain what's happening there

on that line, what's revised and what was actually budgeted and again this year

what the difference is.

MR. PUDDESTER:

So you'll see, first of all, that in the revised compared to the original budget

there was an under spend of about $750,000 or so. That was a combination of

factors. We had a number of vacancies at the agency. As well, we had a higher

turnover than usual. The timing associated with filling those turnovers would

have contributed to it. So the vacancies were a combination.

We have

been anticipating the new act and have done some planning work around what

positions would be needed to support the introduction of that act. So some of

those vacancies were a result of the timing delays with the new legislation

coming forward, and then others were just some positions that had been held

vacant and some movements internally.

MR. K. PARSONS:

So looking at budgeted and

estimated this year, how many vacancies are not going to be filled? Because

there is a difference between what's budgeted and what's there now this year.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Right. Of the $228,000 or so that you're seeing compared to last year, the

reduction, about $84,000 of that is relating to two positions that are not going

to be filled. Those relate to the implementation of the P-card, the purchasing

card for government. So those are two buyer positions which we feel won't need

to be filled. They are vacant right now, so there are no positions being

impacted.

And

then there's another approximately $146,000 that is related to timing issues

associated with the new act, plus some ongoing vacancies. I can't give you a

precise number that's related to the new act.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Yes, I know. I was just

wondering why the difference the two. That's good.

How

about attrition? Is there any through attrition also? Would that be

MR. PUDDESTER:

Last year, '15-'16, there was one position that was removed due to attrition and

we have one other one, Patricia, for this coming year?

MS. HEARN:

This year.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes. So we have one position as well for the upcoming year. That hasn't been

identified yet. The savings have been removed but, the actual position, we will

have to see as the year goes on which position makes sense to remove.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, thank you very much.

Transportation and Communications line, last year there was only $28,000 spent,

yet $70,000 was budgeted and we're gone to $49,000. Just give me a brief

explanation of that line too, please.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Again, a lot of that had to do with the planned timing of the new legislation.

As part of that legislation, GPA has got a fairly large training requirement to

let public bodies, municipalities, ABCs, government departments, help them

understand the new act, but as well, the supplier communities. So there was a

substantial amount of training and travel related to that training that we were

anticipating having to do with the new act.

Obviously, with the timing of that legislation, that's now moved forward into

the upcoming year. And you're seeing a reduction year over year, though part of

that as well is due to just the ongoing efforts to try and reduce expenditures

to deal with the fiscal situation.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Under

Professional Services, $25,000 and $24,000 this year but $150,000 was spent last

year, so an increase of $125,000. Was that to do with the new legislation?

MR. PUDDESTER:

A portion of it was, approximately $40,000 was consulting fees relating to the

development of the legislation. The rest of it, though, was consulting fees

related to a review of our infrastructure procurement processes across

government. So we employed a consultant to help us assess the way we're doing

infrastructure procurement to see if there were improvements that could be

identified to help save money and make the process more efficient.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Is that something that is

going to be made public, whatever the consultant came up with and found? Is that

something that we're going to see?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes, I would assume when the

MR. K. PARSONS:

Is it part of the new

legislation coming in?

MR. PUDDESTER:

No, that was not specific to

the new legislation. It was to deal with the way in which we're dealing with

with the contracts, obviously there are a large number of infrastructure-related

procurements that go forward every year and worth substantial dollars. We were

at the language that would be included within RFPs to try and ensure we're

getting the best value in those contracts.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

I just

want to go and I'll do this to you all night long, I'm sorry, but I want you

to explain to me the Revenue line and where the revenue is coming from, how we

generate it?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Most of GPA's revenue comes from the proceeds of auctions of surplus government

assets. So if departments have finished with any assets that they may have

office furniture, vehicles and things like that they are sent out to auction.

So we get a portion of the proceeds from those auctions.

Obviously, the timing of how many surplus assets we're going to have, when

they're going to be sold, what we get for them varies from year to year, so it

makes it very difficult to predict an amount in a given year. You'll see that

last year we did have a fair amount less than we had budgeted and that was

primarily just due to the delay or a lack of auctions in general.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Actually, that's about it now for Government Purchasing, to tell you the truth.

CHAIR:

Okay.

MR. JOYCE:

Just a note, I know Patricia

is here with the procurement and I just want to acknowledge her expertise as

she's bringing this forth. I know with the previous administration that she

worked very diligently. She's very knowledgeable in the field and she feels very

strongly that when this act is brought in, it's going to be better for all of

Newfoundland and Labrador.

I just

want to recognize the work that she's done on this and the commitment that she's

made to bring this forward for all the people of Newfoundland and Labrador and

all entities, because it will make it better. It will help government save money

and help a lot of entities. Patricia, thank you very much.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Hopefully, we'll see the new

legislation this session.

MR. JOYCE:

Hopefully too, yes.

Thank

you.

CHAIR:

Okay. I call for the

subheads.

Shall

1.1.01 carry?

All

those in favour, aye.'

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Aye.

CHAIR:

Carried.

motion, subhead 1.1.01 carried.

CLERK:

The total.

CHAIR:

Shall the total carry?

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Aye.

CHAIR:

Carried.

motion, Government Purchasing Agency, total head, carried.

CHAIR:

Shall I report the

Government Purchasing Agency without amendment?

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Aye.

CHAIR:

Carried.

motion, Estimates of the Government Purchasing Agency carried without amendment.

CHAIR:

Now we shall move on to

Service Newfoundland and Labrador. Again, we won't bother with the clock.

Minister, do you have any opening statements on this department?

MR. JOYCE:

No, I'm fine. As I mentioned

in my opening statements earlier, this is a very vast department. There are a

lot of regulations in the department. A lot of people keep the residents of

Newfoundland and Labrador safe and ensure that all the safety standards are met.

I just want to recognize the hard work and dedication they have done and still

are doing over the years. Now, as the minister, I just want to echo that again.

I'm

sure the Member for Cape St. Francis would agree that they do a lot of hard

work. There's always a lot of ways to improve it. Hopefully, that's what we're

looking for in a lot of ways in Service NL, how to improve services to people.

I'll

just open up the floor.

CHAIR:

Will the Clerk please call

the first subhead?

CLERK:

1.1.01.

CHAIR:

Shall 1.1.01 carry?

Mr.

Parsons.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, thank you.

Minister, we were given some handouts during the budget about different

increases in fees and stuff like that. I'm sure you have it there in front of

you. First, I just want to go through some of them. I'll ask you general

questions. I want to know how much revenue is going to be generated on a lot of

it, if you don't mind. I'll just pick a couple. I'm not going to pick too many.

I want

you to explain this one to me and how it works. The pension plan regulation

fees, can you give me a description and how much revenue it's going to generate?

MR. MCCARTHY:

We're responsible for the

regulation of pension plans in the province, both private and public pension

plans. Every employer that has a pension plan must be registered with the

pension plan standards division. As part of that, there's a fee to file their

pension plan and have that approved with the division.

Each

year, there's an annual information return which provides a bunch of statistics

on the pension plan and reporting information. There's a fee to file that

information each year. We're increasing that fee. Do you have the increase

there, Leigh?

On an

annualized basis it's $141,000. The way the fee works, it's a minimum of $150

and there's $7.50 per member. We're changing that to $10 for an activity member

and we're charging a $5 fee for an inactive member.

addition, each financial institution that wants to hold locked-in funds from the

pension plan when a member leaves a pension plan they have an option to take

their money out of the pension plan and transfer it to a locked-in account with

a financial institution. Each financial institution that wants to hold and

administer those locked-in funds has to comply with the standards of the

legislation and the directives of the superintendent. So they must file a

contract with us to verify they're going to follow the locking-in rules of the

legislation and abide by the conditions of the legislation.

What

we're doing, we're implementing a new fee so each financial institution that

wants to maintain those locked-in contracts will be charged an annual fee of

$500 per year. That's anticipated to bring in about $30,000 a year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Oh, $30,000. Okay.

MR. MCCARTHY:

Yes. It's about 60 financial institutions and $500 per year. That's basically to

cover the cost of us reviewing those contracts and (inaudible).

MR. K. PARSONS:

I was just wondering what

the revenue would be on something like that. How much money would you generate

from the increases?

MR. MCCARTHY:

Yes.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, perfect.

The

other question I have to ask we all look at the news lately and we hear a lot

about Exit Realty on the Rock and real estate agents and everything else. I

don't understand a lot of it, to tell you the truth, when I look at it on TV.

Real estate fees, how does that work? Is there anything we have in place that

protects real estate agents and stull like that in place? It's just a general

question.

MR. MCCARTHY:

From the fee perspective, there's a licence fee. It's a one-time licence but

then they have to renew and send in a return each year to maintain that licence.

That's the fee we're charging. We charge it to individual salespeople, in

addition to the agent. The companies that sponsor those salespeople, we charge a

fee for that too and they also have a licence fee. So that's done.

With

regard to the legislation itself, it's intended to protect the consumers who are

making offers on real estate. For example, if you put in an offer to purchase a

house and there's a requirement to put a deposit down, then we're protecting

those deposits by requiring them to be in trust. So it's protecting the

individuals who are involved in the real estate industry more so than protecting

the salespeople themselves.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

These

increases in fees has nothing to do with legislation, just an increase, and

we're continuing to do the same thing as we've always did with industry?

MR. MCCARTHY:

Yes, the increase is basically more along the lines to try to cost-recover the

cost of actually regulating the industry.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, all right.

The

agent is basically the person who probably owns the company or something like

that, and the salesperson. What's the difference?

MR. MCCARTHY:

The salesperson is the individual salesperson who actually goes out and makes a

sale. The agent is a representative of the company, and every salesperson has to

be sponsored by an agent. The agent has a lot more experience and usually they

don't necessarily have to be the owner of the company, but they are the sponsor

for that company. Each salesperson has to be sponsored by an agent.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, that's good. Thank

you.

Just

looking here at inspection fees, and they're increased by 20 per cent. How much

revenue is that going to generate? I'm just looking at the lines here on the

sheet that I have.

MR. PUDDESTER:

We've got a number of different categories of fees here. So

MR. K. PARSONS:

There are 120 it says that

are registered inspection fees; amusement rides, boilers I guess there's a bit

of everything there.

MR. PUDDESTER:

In terms of electrical fees, that will generate approximately $350,000 of

incremental revenue. Boiler and pressure vessel and related fees is about

another $260,000. So those are the fee increases associated with most of the

inspection-related items.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Would

you be able to get a list of the 120? Would there be a list that we could see

what the fees are?

MR. PUDDESTER:

We can certainly get you a copy of the fees and the increases, yes.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Yes, if you can get me a

copy of that I'd appreciate it. I'd just like to see what they all are. I mean

you're talking from amusement rides to boilers and pressure gauges.

OFFICIAL:

Sure I will. I'll get you a copy of it, yes.

MR. K. PARSONS:

I really appreciate that.

Thank

you.

MR. PUDDESTER:

I think they're actually on

the website. If they're not there now, they would be very shortly.

MR. K. PARSONS:

They are? Okay. We'll have a

look at it. That's perfect.

I'm

just looking at some of the other increase, and they're minor. Anytime when we

need a few dollars, I have no problem with the birth certificate and the

marriage certificates and stuff like.

The

legal name change has gone up from $25 to $100. That seems like it's the most

among all of them. Is there any reason for that?

MR. PUDDESTER:

I'll ask Donna Kelland, the

ADM, to speak to that.

MS. KELLAND:

There's a fair bit of work actually involved with doing a legal name change.

(Inaudible) we want to make sure it's not a happenstance event. So rather than

having people coming forward that you know, really want to be serious about

them changing their name.

There

is a lot of work involved in actually doing the name changes. They have to be

published, that type of thing. So when we reviewed it, we felt it was justified

in terms of the amount of work involved.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Minister, the motor registration piece of legislation you brought in earlier

with five years gone to 10 years, I think it's a great idea.

I look

at the Motor Registration Division. I travel in there a good bit myself and get

whatever. The trailer has to be licensed or whatever you have to do. We're all

in there. I'm just hoping there'll be no reductions in staff because I know most

of the wait I had in there in the past I'm just making a general comment was

that people were waiting in there for two and three hours.

How has

it improved since people don't need to get their they can do it online?

MR. JOYCE:

I'm (inaudible) numbers;

over 25,000 are after going through it now with the online. With every 10 years

for the picture is going to save another $25,000 to $30,000. So we can actually

see the wait-list getting shorter and shorter at the vehicles because there's

more and more online and less and less going to have to get their picture taken.

The

effect is not as real now but over time, as people have to go, and once they get

it, they won't have to come back for 10 years. More are more people are using

the online services now for registration also. So that's helping a lot.

There

are a few initiatives we have coming down that we're hoping will by the fall

have a major impact on the wait time and a decrease in the wait times for people

at the motor registration and vehicles, Service NL.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay. Thanks.

I'm

looking at mostly the increases in trailers and stuff like that, but taxi

registration has gone up a little small bit. I spoke to a gentleman actually the

weekend that is pretty concerned with the price of gas and everything gone up.

wasn't sure if it's something we should be looking at to well, to give anyone

a break, but they're going to be feeling the brunt of they're all businesses

as far as I'm concerned. It's only minimum, but still.

MR. JOYCE :

One of the biggest things I've been speaking to with taxi owners and people who

own the stands is the actual cost of the insurance that goes through the PUB.

That's a major concern for them also with the insurance.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Yes, everything.

MR. JOYCE:

It's after gone up 50 per

cent last year and then it's gone again to the PUB for another review. That's a

major concern also.

Like I

told a lot of people, it's out of our hands. It's up to the PUB, but all this do

add up to the taxi industry.

MR. K. PARSONS:

I spoke to a couple the

weekend who told me (inaudible).

That's

just an observation again.

Driver's licence renewal for seniors, again, it's one of those things that plays

a little bit on me all the time, as you know. When I get up I speak passionate

about seniors and people in my district and stuff like this. That's an increase

to our most vulnerable again.

MR. JOYCE:

Actually, just for

correction, there's no increase for seniors this year in this budget for drivers

licence or motor registration.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, it says here drivers

licence renewal: $100 to $65 for seniors and then next line it says $125 to

$115. Online it's saying the same.

MR. JOYCE:

Online is staying the same.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Is that correct?

MR. JOYCE:

Yes.

MR. K. PARSONS:

But there is an increase in

MR. JOYCE:

No.

MR. K. PARSONS:

No?

MR. JOYCE:

There's no increase to

seniors whatsoever.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Oh, okay. I misread that.

I'm sorry about that.

MR. JOYCE:

I thank the staff for that.

That is one thing

MR. K. PARSONS:

That's a good thing.

MR. JOYCE:

Oh, I know, yeah.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay. That's basically it on

most of the increases. The increases are justified. I mean you have to make a

bit of revenue.

What's

the overall revenue that you're hoping to obtain with these increases for motor

registration?

MR. JOYCE:

Just motor registration is

about $8.2 million.

MR. K. PARSONS:

$8.2 million?

MR. JOYCE:

Yes.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

That's

the general questions that I have.

Mr.

Chair, I'm going to go into

section 1.1.01. I know that most of the answers are

going to be similar but I'm going to go into ask questions on the Salaries

there.

you'd like to explain, last year it was budgeted at and then we had a huge

increase and again this year it's a little bit higher.

MR. PUDDESTER:

The increase last year in

revised versus budget was mainly due to a paid leave payout to the executive

assistant to the former minister. That was offset, partially, by the minister

being paid by a different department.

Service

NL has shared a minister with other departments. It did so last year and

continues to do so this year different department. Last year, the minister was

actually paid from, I believe, Environment and Conservation. This year,

Municipal Affairs and Service NL are splitting the

MR. K. PARSONS:

That's the reason why it was

$153,000. Last year, it was basically the same thing where we had the minister

in Environment and so that's okay.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yeah.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

I'll go

to Transportation and Communications, again, a little bit of a difference in

that line, if you'd like to explain that to me.

MR. PUDDESTER:

The decrease last year, the

$15,000 versus a budget of $39,000, was primarily due to, again, having a shared

minister. With the timing of the election and the minister's home district and

things, the transportation requirements were just less than anticipated.

That

varies from year to year, depending on the files that we're dealing with, the

travel requirements. Obviously, last year, again, with the timing of the

election that certainly contributed to it.

So we

are anticipating still spending less than the budget for '15-'16 but we

anticipate that it will be slightly more than last year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

So the minister is going to

stay in St. John's more.

Anyway,

I want to go to the next line, Purchased Services. Last year, we had budgeted

$18,000 but we only spent $1,000. This year we only have $3,000.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Obviously, a significant

decrease. The needs for Purchased Services can vary annually depending on what

initiatives or what issues we're dealing with in the department. Obviously, we

don't spend that money if we don't need to. Last year was one of those years

when we were able to deal with the requirements without significant expenditure.

Although there's a slight increase planned for '16-'17 versus (inaudible), it's

obviously down significantly from the previous year's budget. So, again, that's

to help us deal with the current fiscal situation facing the province and as

well, just anticipated lower than historical requirements in that line item.

Again,

I would caution that it does vary from year to year. So it's hard to have

precision as to what the needs will be.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay. That's good.

Going

section 1.2.01, the Salaries are pretty consistent there, but I'll go to

Transportation and Communications again. We had budgeted a lot more than what we

actually spent and this year a little bit less again.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes. Transportation and

Communications varies annually, again, depending on what initiatives we're

involved with. So just lower-than-anticipated requirements, as well as efforts

by the executive group to try and minimize any travel that wasn't absolutely

necessary, given the fiscal situation we were dealing with last year. A similar

situation for the upcoming year, just trying to do more with less.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay. Purchased Services;

last year we had $19,700. This year we have a lot spent. What services were

they?

MR. PUDDESTER:

The primary increase last

year to $30,000 from a budget of $19,700 was simply an allocation issue. We had

new leases, new arrangements for photocopying and printing, so those bills were

aggregated underneath this account code.

Previously, they would have been spread out amongst some of the other divisions

that you're seeing there, but they were aggregated into this one. That explains

the difference primarily. Then this year, we're just again trying to deal with

the current fiscal situation and anticipate trying to spend less across the

board.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Again,

you know I'm going to ask this question every time about revenue. I'd like to

know where the money is coming from, where we are getting it to where we're

getting revenue to.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Revenue in this case is

reimbursement for executive salaries related to WorkplaceNL. As you know,

WorkplaceNL falls underneath the minister portion of executive, so we have an

assistant deputy minister responsible for Occupational Health and Safety. That

was previously Kim Dunphy. Kim retired last year. Julian is actually acting in

that capacity now while we try and fill that position.

That

salary is entirely recovered through billings to WorkplaceNL, as well as a

portion of the deputy minister's salary, some secretarial salary, communication

salary and a portion of our financial our controller's salary. In total,

approximately a million dollars or so is recovered from WorkplaceNL to deal with

that.

MR. K. PARSONS:

That's good.

Okay,

I'm going to move on to

section 1.2.02. In this

section I'm just looking at the

Operating Accounts and Property, Furnishings and Equipment. Why has the budgeted

increased this year? What's the increase?

MR. PUDDESTER:

This account is almost

exclusively around vehicles for the department. We have a fairly large fleet

given the number of inspectors that we have around the province and the number

of office locations that we have. So this amount deals with capital to purchase

new vehicles.

You're

seeing the increase for next year; we have a larger number of vehicles that are

due for replacement. Obviously, it's important we try not to purchase any

vehicles unless we have to, but the existing fleet reaches a point where the

maintenance expenditures and sometimes the safety of operating those vehicles

dictate that we purchase new ones to replace those.

That

accounts for the budget for next year to replace some vehicles within the

Occupational Health and Safety Branch. Again, those vehicle costs are completely

recovered by billing to WorkplaceNL and then also within the rest of Service NL.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Again,

if you look at the revenue line, budgeted was only $25,000; you have $39,000 and

now $160,000.

MR. PUDDESTER:

We had anticipated only needing to replace one vehicle within the Occupational

Health and Safety Branch. We ended up replacing two, but all of those

expenditures are billed back to WorkplaceNL. So you're seeing there the recovery

of two vehicle purchases versus a budget of one vehicle purchase.

You can

see for next year, $160,000. That's because we've anticipated purchasing five

vehicles for Occupational Health and Safety.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, I was going to say. I

was looking at $160,000 when you said two vehicles. I was wondering what you

were driving.

Do you

want to do that

section first, Chair? Or will I continue

CHAIR:

No, carry on through and

then we'll

MR. K. PARSONS:

Just keep going?

CHAIR:

Yes.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, perfect.

Thank

you.

We're

going to go to

section 2.1.01, Consumer Affairs. I want to look at the Salaries.

The revised last year versus I'm assuming there were a couple people that

left. I'm not sure; you can explain it to me.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Last year, we had two individuals retire. So that dealt with the severance, paid

leave payouts for those individuals.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, so severance.

MR. PUDDESTER:

This year you're seeing just normal salary plan adjustments to deal with step

increases, plan vacancies, things like that.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

So we

must have had a reduction in some of those, from what we budgeted last year to

this year. Is there a vacancy there?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes, we would have vacancies in that area. I think right now we've got

Consumer Affairs, two vacancies. So it would deal with the timing of when we

anticipate filling vacancies, salaries for those individuals, things like that.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Again,

on the line I know every time I'm asking it but I guess I'll continue.

Transportation and Communications; I'm just looking at the different budget,

revised and now we're gone back to $24,000. These are basically things that you

went through the department and said, okay, we can save a few dollars here and

there. Is that basically what you're doing here?

MR. PUDDESTER:

So most of the changes for '16-'17 are exactly that, they're efforts to try and

reduce expenditures to help deal with the fiscal situation. The minister and our

team went through all of these on a line-by-line basis to see where we could

make improvements.

well, underneath this area of Consumer Affairs, Residential Tenancies fall

underneath there. We have travel associated with holding hearings for

Residential Tenancies cases. Those vary from year to year depending on where

they are. Obviously, if we have more outside of the St. John's area we sometimes

have to do more travel to reach those locations.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

And

again, I go to Purchased Services and looking at $20,100 versus $35,000 that was

revised and gone back down. What was the difference in the $15,000 extra that we

spent there?

MR. PUDDESTER:

We had a one-time requirement to renovate an office. We had to move an office

for security purposes. We needed to bring it back to provide more visibility to

the waiting area around Residential Tenancies. So that was the cost associated

with just setting up a small office internally.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, and a quick

explanation. I know I'm asking you again about revenue. Just explain where the

revenue comes from.

MR. PUDDESTER:

This is primarily application fees paid by applicants around Residential

Tenancies hearings. There are fees associated with filing to have those hearings

held. So they vary from year to year, again, depending on how many applications

we might have.

We had a slight increase last year from what we had

budgeted, so this year we've adjusted that to reflect what we saw last year

which was also consistent with the previous year. So we think that $16,000 is a

more normal level now for the type of hearings and the volume that we're seeing.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

The next

section I'll go to is 2.1.02. Again, I'm going to

ask you a question about the Salaries there because it looks like we've budgeted

and Estimates this year. What's the difference in what we actually spent last

year?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Last year, we had about $123,000 underspend. That was primarily related to three

vacancies. We had director, manager and investigator positions that were vacant

for a portion of the year. Those positions have all been filled now. So we

anticipate that we will have billings more in line with the budgeted amounts.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Just

looking at Professional Services there, we had $10,000 budgeted, we only used

$2,100 and $5,000. Perhaps you can just give us a quick explanation there now.

MR. PUDDESTER:

So this is primarily fees billed by the Financial Services Appeal Board.

Depending on how many appeals are brought to that board that will impact how

much we have to spend to reimburse them. So last year we just had a smaller

amount I think we only had one appeal last year. Again, it varies from year to

year. It's very difficult to estimate but, based on recent trends, we felt

comfortable in reducing the anticipated expenditure for next year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, looks good.

Moving

right along,

section 2.1.03, I don't have any question on the Salaries the

Salaries are okay. The only one there is Purchased Services and it is just a

little increase. We spent $7,800 last year and had budgeted $5,000, yet this

year we're gone down to $3,000; perhaps a quick explanation.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Last year there was a national conference for pension regulators that was

actually held in Newfoundland and Labrador. That moves around every year. Last

year it was our turn to host, so we had a little bit more money there associated

with hosting those individuals. Next year it's somewhere else, so we won't have

those expenses. So it is that, combined with general efforts to reduce

expenditures to deal with the fiscal situation.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay (inaudible).

section 2.1.04, I want to ask you a question about the Salaries and it looks

like it must have been some positions that were either vacant are now filled?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Correct. So commercial registrations, we have a pool of clerks that deal with

the registry of deeds and corporations. That area experiences fairly high

turnover. What you're seeing there predominantly is the impact of how long it

takes us to fill a position once we get a vacancy, to go through the competition

of posting those and filling the vacancies. That deals primarily with why you

saw an under expend last year. We're anticipating that we will be able to keep

those positions filled for this year and budgeted accordingly.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

On the

Transportation and Communications line last year we had $80,000, yet we spent

$115,000. We're back to $80,000 again this year. Maybe you can explain the

MR. PUDDESTER:

Last year, we had a larger than expected expense related to postage. We're still

trying to understand what happened there to result in that increase. Part of it

may have been related to just volumes related to mailing out of registration

documents. We deal with the mailroom at Transportation and Works, so we're

trying to get an assessment of that. We think it was a one-time item. We don't

anticipate that we'll have that again.

MR. K. PARSONS:

That's a lot of postage for

$30,000.

MR. PUDDESTER:

We handle 80,000 transactions a year at the Registry of Deeds, most of which

require mail outs of documents to verify that deeds have been registered, things

like that. It obviously is somewhere that we're trying to ensure we don't have

that again.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Is there a way to improve

that system? We're dealing a lot today with emails and whatnot. So why are we

spending money on something like that? Are there any improvements you can

MR. PUDDESTER:

With the deeds portion specifically, we're trying to encourage registration of

those documents online. We have that capability. A lot of those documents are

put forward by law firms. So we've been working with all the law firms to try

and get them to convert to submitting their documents electronically because it

is much quicker for us to deal with. It knocks a significant amount of time off

of our processing.

I think

right now we're up to just over 50 per cent or so that is online. Obviously,

we'd like to make it 100 per cent but we're kind of at the mercy of the law

firms to convert. We are offering free training seminars to law firms on an

individual basis to help try and get them to switch over. So we're working on

it.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Motor

Vehicle Registration,

section 3.1.01. I want to look at the Salaries here, what

we budgeted last year and then the revised and what we're actually budgeting

this year, a little increase. Do you want to explain that?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes. What you saw last year, we had a slight decrease which was just due to

staff turnover and the temporary vacancies, just timing issues related to the

filling of those positions.

For

next year, you're seeing a very slight increase. There's about $6,600 relating

to the JES changes to budgets. So there's a slight increase there for this

division, and that's offset by about $5,000 just relating to normal salary plan

adjustments, timing delays, overtime requirements, things like that.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, on the Supplies, a

huge difference $215,000 budgeted, $475,000 and now $214,000.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Last year, we had a couple of large amounts for prior-year invoices that didn't

get paid until '15-'16. That primarily related to fuel for highway enforcement

vehicles, and costs for uniforms and personal protective equipment that were

required under the collective agreement.

that's accounting for about $135,000 or so of the increase. Then the extra was

just a variety of items underneath the Supplies budget, office supplies we use

specialized envelopes for mail out of Motor Registration documents. We had toner

expenses related to the specialized machines for printing driver's licences and

things like that. So we had a bit of a combination of one-time items there, in

addition to those two amounts for prior-year invoices.

MR. K. PARSONS:

So wouldn't those uniforms

and everything have to be continued every year, or is it

MR. PUDDESTER:

They're a bit lumpy, so the timing of when we may have to buy new uniforms or

when we may replenish the toner amounts will vary from year to year. We've

struggled with this account a little bit in recent years to try and get it to

reflect the actual amounts that have been purchased. But given the fiscal

environment, we're trying to just find ways to make do with the budget that we

had there historically, and we don't anticipate those one-time the late

invoices are obviously not going to reoccur.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

What

grants and subsidies are you talking about on this line?

MR. PUDDESTER:

The Grants and Subsidies, I'm going to ask Donna to give the detail on those.

MS. KELLAND:

There's a grant that we give to Safety Services Newfoundland and Labrador for

their bicycle helmet safety program. That's around $10,000.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

MS. KELLAND:

A lot of what else is in that account are various memberships in national and

international motor vehicle associations, so the Canadian Council for Motor

Transport Administrators, which is all the regulators across the country. We're

also a member of the American motor vehicle association. There are other fees.

We're

part of a Commercial Vehicle Safety Alliance program where our inspectors are

certified to be able to conduct inspections of large commercial vehicles. There

are fees associated with maintaining those certifications. Most of it is really

membership type of dues and transactional type of fees.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, just questions.

Under

Property, Furnishings there's a difference there of $60,000 from what was

budgeted last year and what was actually spent. Could you explain that to me?

MR. PUDDESTER:

We have a ticketing system,

if you're familiar with the office in Mount Pearl, when you go in. You used to

take a ticket and wait for the number to be called at the wickets. That system

was quite old. It ended up failing last year so we had to purchase a new

replacement system for that.

We're

actually quite excited by that system. It's in place up and running now. It's

going to provide us with a lot more visibility into wait times and staff

productivity, and help us actually dynamically adjust what wickets are serving

which types of activities to help reduce wait times. So that's one of the

initiatives the minister mentioned we're employing that will hopefully start to

see some improvements in wait times.

MR. K. PARSONS:

I used to always wonder when

you go in there sometimes and you'd have V8 and then E, four or five would get

called and you're still there. You're D9 and you had to wait all the time but I

didn't understand. What's the reason for that? Why is it different? It's just

different categories?

MR. PUDDESTER:

That's bingo.

MR. K. PARSONS:

What is it? Do you want them

to be waiting or what?

MR. PUDDESTER:

It's bingo, motor vehicle

bingo.

I guess

it would depend on the transaction. If you were there for a vehicle renewal, a

driver's licence renewal, to acquire a driver's license for the first time, if

you were there to deal with a commercial registration, the codes would depend on

what you were there for.

MR. K. PARSONS:

What you're there for, okay.

MR. PUDDESTER:

We know, for example, the

average length of time it takes to do those different transactions. A vehicle

registration renewal is much quicker than issuing somebody a driver's license

for the first time. So we can adjust the number of people now, with this new

system, to be able to help to deal with some of those pressures to try and

equalize some of the wait times.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, that's good.

Section

3.1.02; again, I'm going to go to the Salaries and if you can explain the

changes and the variances there.

MR. PUDDESTER:

The reduction last year was, again, just primarily related to some staff

turnover and temporary vacancies related to that turnover. In addition, we were

undertaking some activity to look at combining the weigh scale operating

positions and the highway enforcement officer positions. Some of those vacancies

were held, depending on the combination that was going to be held with the

highway enforcement officer position. Just kind of business as usual items

there; timing issues.

What

you're seeing there for next year, it's down $110,000 versus the previous year.

There was a $20,000 increase related to JES in there. That was offset by about a

$131,000 decrease related to attrition, step increases, things like that.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

general question here, Minister; I travel the highway a lot we all do. Is

there any emphasis on what we're doing for inspections on the highway? It's like

I don't see as many as what you used to one time. You'd see your highway

enforcement hauling in some trucks and stuff like that. I don't see it as much

as I used to. Is there anything that

MR. JOYCE:

There's no decrease.

MR. K. PARSONS:

There's no decrease at all?

Is it

something we're going to be looking at doing more of for safety on our highways?

It seems like the few accidents I've noticed lately, it's brutal what's

happening on the highway.

MR. PUDDESTER:

I think the minister is going to take that question.

MR. JOYCE:

No, there's been no decrease

whatsoever in that. I guess the highway enforcement is still up and running.

There are still a lot of initiatives with law enforcement, the RCMP and

Constabulary across the province. There's been no decrease in that whatsoever

absolutely none.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Let's

go to Transportation and Communications here. I know it's not a big lot of

difference, but we had budgeted $125,000 and we're down to $110,000 and we spent

$115,000.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes, that's just efforts to try and reduce expenditures given the fiscal

environment, and the same for next year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

If you

want to you can go to the next line on Supplies, $18,500. Why was the increase

from last year which was $5,000? This year it's only $3,500.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Right.

So we

had a one-time increase related to the purchase of some personal protected

equipment for weigh scale inspectors, specifically Kevlar vests. Again, you

mentioned the highway enforcement officers. These individuals are stopping

commercial vehicles on the highways. And I guess in our environment now, there's

some concern over you never know who is going to be in those vehicles or what

they might be transporting.

So we

did a review, and based on our responsibilities for occupational health and

safety, we felt it was appropriate that we be equipping those individuals with

vests to help protect them in the, hopefully, very unlikely event they should

ever encounter trouble in their stops.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Also, I know that under

transportation, new regulations came in with safety on the highway when the

number of people and the pylons and everything else when you haul in a

vehicle. Has this increased under the safety aspect to a number of people, say

if you are going to haul in a vehicle to the side road, whether there are one or

two people? Or does it make any difference or has that changed in any way?

MR. PUDDESTER:

I think Donna Kelland can give some specifics.

MS. KELLAND:

We've undertaken an extensive review of our safe work practices and the hazards

associated with individual types of activities. So there are rules and

procedures for all of our inspectors now in terms of how they set up for a

roadside inspection, whether or not there are one or two officers involved, the

callback arrangements that they have to avoid getting into trouble, that type of

thing. So we've done quite an extensive review and done a number of safe work

practices in that area.

Does

that answer your question?

MR. K. PARSONS:

Yes, it does.

I just

want to ask about the Allowances and Assistance line there, $25,000. Where did

this money go to last year?

MR. PUDDESTER:

That was related to a settlement with an employee in accordance with the

collective agreement.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Section

3.1.03; again I want to look at Salaries, if you could just explain the Salaries

(inaudible).

MR. PUDDESTER:

Again, a similar answer. The decrease of $116,000 last year was just a

higher-than-normal turnover in staff activity and then the amount of time it

takes to fill those vacancies.

Next

year, the decrease of $136,000; again, we had a small increase, about $6,600 for

JES and then $142,000 in reductions related to attrition, salary plan

adjustments, things like that.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, that's good.

Under

Employee Benefits there, last year we budgeted $9,000, revised $34,000, this

year $33,000. What's the difference? What's the increase? Why did it increase

over last year, what we budgeted?

MR. PUDDESTER:

This was related to workers' compensation costs. We, I guess, have situations

where we've got some employees who are dealing with those types of workers' comp

cases. They vary from year to year, and very difficult to predict.

Next

year, we've now adjusted that accordingly in anticipation of the number of

people who are dealing with those issues and how long they take to get resolved.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

On the

Supplies line there again, it looks like we spent a lot of money on different

things last year when it comes to Supplies. It's an increase of what was

actually budgeted and revised and we're gone

MR. PUDDESTER:

Last year, we had an increase of $92,000, roughly. This is primarily related to

the purchase of licence plates for the motor vehicle division. Those purchases

are a bit lumpy when they occur, but we have seen increased numbers of vehicles

in recent year.

I think

over the last four years our vehicles are up about a 25 per cent increase in

the number of vehicles we're registering. This is just to deal with the purchase

of licence plates for a variety we have different ones for commercial

vehicles, passenger vehicles, ATVs, things like that.

MR. K. PARSONS:

So we're not planning on

buying anymore licence plates this year compared to what we did last year?

MR. PUDDESTER:

You've seen a slight increase in the budget year over year but based on the

timing of those, we're not anticipating the same types of expenditures.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Purchased Services, we revised it last year down a couple hundred thousand, this

year we're gone what's the difference in the line there? What was actually

budgeted?

MR. PUDDESTER:

We had a decrease last year of $225,000 or so over what was budgeted. That was

due in part to a credit on expenditures for the driver's licence photo ID system

we have. We share that with the other three Atlantic provinces.

reached a period, associated with that contract, where the supplier had

recovered the upfront cost. So we saw a reduction in the amount we paid per

transaction. You saw a credit there for some of those expenditures associated

with that.

The

change for next year is you're seeing a slight increase there. That contract is

expiring and we are anticipating a slight increase to deal with the timing to

extend that contract for a little bit of time to align with the other Atlantic

provinces. So that's why you're essentially seeing the difference from this year

to last year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

What did we spend $9,500 on

in Professional Services last year?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Related to that same contract, the four Atlantic provinces hired a consultant to

help us develop the RFP and to do an assessment of the needs of the four

provinces.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Let's

go to the next section, 3.1.04; again, look at the salary line there. What we

budgeted was revised a little less. I'm assuming it's going to be basically the

same answer there again for attrition. There are no vacancies there or anything

is there?

MR. PUDDESTER:

We would generally have vacancies. Again, they'll just depend on the timing of

when people move around in those. Obviously, we try and deal with those

vacancies as quickly as possible, but we do deal with delays in how long it

takes to get those positions filled. The answer is the same as in the previous.

MR. K. PARSONS:

That's okay.

I got

to ask the question but I kind of anticipate the answer. On the Supplies line

again, we obviously spent a lot more than what we had budgeted. Are we being

realistic of what we're doing this year? Supplies had $12,200 budgeted for last

year, then we spent $32,000, yet we're only going to be $7,000 this year.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Last year, this was related to the Kevlar vests we mentioned. The expenditure

for those vests was split between these two activity codes. Again, that was a

one-time item with last year. For next year again, we're just trying to make do

with a little less money given the fiscal situation.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Under

Purchased Services, we budgeted $9,400, now we have $45,000 spent and we're back

to $9,000. What was ?

MR. PUDDESTER:

We had some unanticipated vehicle maintenance in the first half of the year

before we replaced some of those older vehicles. As well, we had some additional

costs to install some specialized rooftop safety lighting systems and striping

on the highway enforcement vehicles. Again, that tends to go along with when we

replace certain types of those vehicles, but it's a one-time expenditure.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Again, I'm going to ask a

question. I know it's federal there for revenue. What money is that generated

from in particular?

MR. PUDDESTER:

I'm going to ask Donna Kelland to give you some details on that.

MS. KELLAND:

That's a national road safety agreement we have with the federal government. All

the provinces and territories or most of the territories of Canada have with

the federal government to conduct national road safety inspections type of

functions. We'll do the on-road inspections that you see occasionally, but we

also do a lot of inspections at what we call carriers. Companies that have a lot

of trucks in their fleet, we'll go to their site and do a number of inspections

at random on those trucks to make sure they're safe. So the federal government

compensates us for doing a certain number of those inspections every year. The

amount we get is roughly based on the population percentage that we are.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

We'll

go to

section 3.2.01. Again, we have a, not a big lot, but the Salaries line

there is could you do a brief explanation of there?

MR. PUDDESTER:

A very similar explanation. We just had some vacancies, and for next year some

increases were associated with JES, offset by some adjustments for salary plan.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Under

Employee Benefits, there's $13,600 that was revised last year versus $3,600 and

$3,500 this year. What's the difference?

MR. PUDDESTER:

That was related to a workers' compensation costs. I guess next year we're not

anticipating incurring that same level of expense; though, I'd caution that it's

difficult to predict that from year to year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

I'll go

to the line Transportation and Communications. I guess this is just going

through the line-by-line items again and finding savings?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Correct, for next year. The savings for this current year were more due

because of some of the vacancies, we didn't incur some of the travel expenses

that we'd normally have with those positions.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Why Purchased Services

although it's down a little bit. You're anticipating lower again this year as to

what we budgeted?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes. This is primarily related to leases for various Government Service Centre

locations around the province. So that would just be some anticipated reductions

in lease costs associated with some renewals that we've done.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Professional Services, this year only $5,000, yet we budgeted $15,000 and we

spent $10,000.

MR. PUDDESTER:

This would vary from year to

year depending on the need for hiring external expertise associated with public

safety investigations or for advisory board tribunal hearings. Again, it will

vary from year to year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay. I'm going to go to the

Revenue line and just ask you to give me a quick explanation of that also. We're

anticipating a good bit of extra revenue this year too, a couple hundred

thousand dollars.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes. The Revenue relates

and safety plan reviews, the registration and inspection of boiler and pressure

vessels. You're seeing just the activity that's going on related to those items.

MR. K. PARSONS:

I have the salary line

marked down here but I'm not going to ask you that, okay. Because I know I'm

going to get the same answer. That's okay.

Under

Supplies, a small variance, I guess we're just saving a few dollars and looking

at different ways to fine

MR. PUDDESTER:

Just to clarify, are you on

Regional Services now, 3.2.02?

MR. K. PARSONS:

Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't say

the section.

Section

3.2.02.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes, so that's just an

effort to try and deal with the fiscal situation.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Again,

you know I'm going to ask you the Revenue line.

MR. PUDDESTER:

That Revenue relates mainly

to electrical permits. You're just seeing the activity associated with

electrical permits there.

MR. K. PARSONS:

There's a huge increase

there.

MR. PUDDESTER:

That deals with the fee

increases for electrical permits.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, that's basically where

we see the fee increases, okay.

Thank

you.

Moving

right along, 3.3.01, Vital Statistics, Salaries are basically the same. I know

that's going to be the same, but under Supplies. There's another increase in the

Supplies.

MR. PUDDESTER:

We just had a slight

increase. That'll vary from year to year. I'm not anticipating that will occur

again next year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Purchased Services, we spent a lot more but we're back to budget now again this

year. What's the difference there?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Last year, the paper stock

we used for birth and marriage certificates was that specialized Mylar paper. We

had an increase in the printing requirements for that for about $5,000, which we

hadn't seen there. But, again, depending on the timing of when we make those

orders and how many requests we have for documents, that'll vary a little bit

from year to year. We're anticipating next year it will be a bit more of a

normal year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

The cost of that stuff

varies so much too, especially with different stocks of paper and stuff like

that. I know a lot about it.

Okay,

I'm going to just go right to the Revenue line there too. Again, just a quick

explanation of where the Revenue comes from.

MR. PUDDESTER:

I'm going to ask Donna Kelland to answer that.

MS. KELLAND:

The federal revenue comes from reimbursement that the federal government gives

us for data coming from the Vital Statistics Registry, births and deaths

primarily. They pay us on a per transaction basis for that information. That

would mostly go to Statistics Canada and Service Canada.

Provincial revenue is fees for birth certificates and other transactions that we

do for individuals within the province.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Yes.

Like I

said, they got you from birth to death.

The

next section, the Queen's Printer, Purchased Services, we budgeted for $30,000,

yet we only went $10,500 and this year $15,000. Just explain that to me, please.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Purchased Services in this line relates primarily to if we have requirements, if

we need to print the statutes. We have to send those out to be printed. We're

not able to deal with the binding requirements, I think, of those documents

in-house, so depending on the number that we may have to print or things, that

will affect that.

well, we do have some equipment costs in there. So it depends on when we have to

replace that miscellaneous equipment. That's not the big equipment, but we do

have some elements related to the Queen's Printer in there as well.

Overall, obviously, we didn't spend as much last year. We're anticipating having

to spend a little bit more next year than we actually spent this year but it's

still down versus the previous year's budget.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Again, I'll go to the

Revenue line just for an explanation.

MR. PUDDESTER:

This is the Revenue related to the bookstore sales for the Queen's Printer. If

you come in to purchase copies of any of the statutes, documents and things like

that. That will vary.

We did

have a slight increase last year. There was a fee increase that went forward

last year and fees for the Gazette as

well, which is subscribed to by various law firms and others.

We're

anticipating next year we'll be down a little bit versus actuals this year but

still in the ballpark.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, that's good.

We'll

go to

section 3.3.03. I'm going to go to Employee Benefits there, $3,400 spent.

Why is there nothing forecasted for this year?

MR. PUDDESTER:

This was again related to workers' compensation. I guess historically we've not

had significant costs associated with those expenditures. We did have some items

last year but we're not anticipating that we'll see that again. It's difficult

to predict from year to year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

On the

Supplies line, you're looking at savings of almost I think it's around

$50,000. Where are you going to achieve this to this year?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Donna, do you want to take that one?

MS. KELLAND:

You'll notice there's a bit of a rebalancing there between Supplies and

Purchased Services. Historically, we've charged the one account where we should

have been charging to the other. So we're just trying to bring that more in line

with where the expenditures should actually be.

Supplies would be things like our actual paper stock and things like that.

Purchased Services are the actual printing charges on the big machines that we

have downstairs. So it's just trying to rebalance those costs a bit into the

proper line items.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

We're

looking now at Purchased Services. Okay, so that's the difference between the

two of those.

general question for you now; they always used to have a problem downstairs with

humidity. It used to be a huge problem. Have they done anything downstairs with

the because the machines. I know this from my past life. They used to have a

major issue down there.

certain time of year there used to be water on the floor, and I know they were

always looking to put in dehumidifiers and stuff like that. We even brought them

in with the machines when we were working on them because that's what I used

to do.

I'm

just wondering what improvements have been done down there? It was a major

issue. It was really huge.

MR. PUDDESTER:

I'll ask Donna to take that as well.

MR. K. PARSONS:

That's just a general

question. I don't mean to put you on the spot or anything.

MS. KELLAND:

I could say something about the three floods that we've had down there in the

last three or four years. But other than that, no, I think things have improved

a fair bit. It may be more of a question for Transportation and Works, but they

do their best to try and control those because the machines that we have done

there are sensitive to humidity, as you know.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Very sensitive, yes.

MS. KELLAND:

So we've had a fair bit of improvement in the machinery stock over the last two

or three years, in part, as a result of a couple of those floods. But I think

it's fair to say I don't think there's any water on the floor down there

anymore.

MR. K. PARSONS:

One time you could go in

there and it was wicked, unreal. I used to hate when I walked in I knew what

the problem was.

MR. JOYCE:

That was in Noah's days,

b'y, when you were down there.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, we'll go to

section

4.1.01. Now, I'm going to get you to explain the Salaries one this time because

there is quite the discrepancy in what's revised, budgeted and estimated. So if

you could just go from there for me, please.

MR. PUDDESTER:

There was a fairly large underspend last year. That's not been inconsistent with

some prior years. It's a result of multiple vacancies. Those were due to normal

staff turnover arrangements, plus some positions that we have that are hard to

fill they require some specialized industry or sector experience related to

occupational health and safety and locations that have been difficult to fill.

For example, in Labrador, we've had some chronic vacancies in those locations.

those combinations of positions resulted in that underspend again. All of these

costs are fully recovered from WorkplaceNL, so it has no net effect on

government's bottom line.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay. That's interesting.

MR. PUDDESTER:

What you're seeing next year

is a decrease of about $700,000. We've gone through all of those positions now

to try and rightsize the budget a little bit more to reflect some of these

positions that have chronically not been able to be filled or have been filled.

We're

doing some reviews of some of the specific sector-related positions to determine

if those are the right sectors or whether we need to redeploy those inspectors

to other ones, given the nature of the industry in Newfoundland and the current

economy as well.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Oh, okay.

The

line on Professional Services, $590,000; a huge difference.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes, from time to time Occupational Health and Safety will employ outside

expertise on various files they're involved with. This specific situation was

related to an ongoing study being done in Lab West around silicosis-related

conditions of former mine workers. The Lab West medical audit is specifically

what this one was.

So we

had some billings from the prior year that were delayed and paid out in this

year. This has been an ongoing I think we're in year three now of this study.

So it was just some timing issues related to when those invoices were paid.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay, just a huge

difference. I knew it had to be something like that.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes. So you would have seen in the previous year an underspend on some of those.

MR. JOYCE:

That was a great program I

say to the Member that your former administration brought in to help with the

disease in Lab West. It was a great program and this continues. It's an ongoing

effort and I applaud the government for bringing it in, the prior government for

bringing it in.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Again,

I'm going to go to the revenue line. Just give us an explanation.

MR. PUDDESTER:

Essentially, what you're

seeing there is an offset of the entire expenditure in that division. Again, all

of the expenses of the Occupational Health and Safety Division are recovered by

billing to WorkplaceNL. So you're seeing it almost mirrors identically the

amount of the vote.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Section

4.2.01; can you give me an overview of what this is all about, of the program?

MR. PUDDESTER:

Yes.

again, appropriations; this is an older program related to some financial

assistance that was being given to the dependents of the former miners of the

fluorspar mines in St. Lawrence. This program has been in place for a number of

years, I can't remember when it first started so back in the '90s. This is

just payments to the surviving spouses of the mine workers. Every year this

amount is just based on the number of individuals who are still receiving those

payments, those who are still living.

MR. K. PARSONS:

All right.

The

next one, I just want to go to the Grants and Subsides. Again, just give me an

explanation. Who receives them?

MR. PUDDESTER:

These relate to the grants

are given to agencies that advocate and promote for occupational health and

safety. There were only two items last year. The Newfoundland and Labrador Fish

Harvesting Safety Association was given a grant for $5,600 and the Forestry

Safety Association had a small grant of $500, so not large amounts. Next year we

are looking at a slight increase but less than the previous year's budget, and

that's to deal with the fiscal environment.

MR. K. PARSONS:

All right.

Section

5.1.01, Salaries I know the answer to that one.

I want

to go to Transportation and Communications. Why the difference I know we're

gone back, but what expenditures were there last year?

MR. PUDDESTER:

We've moved now into the Review Division. I think it's appropriate that Marlene

Hickey, who's the chief commissioner for the Review Division, would take these

questions.

MS. HICKEY:

The variance in Transportation has to do with the travel required out of town

for workers' compensation hearings. Last year we conducted approximately 100

hearings across the province, outside the St. John's region. Each hearing costs

approximately $350 in travel costs. So that number varies from year to year,

depending upon the number of cases outside of St. John's.

well, we also have a staff member attend the hearings with the review

commissioners for a number of reasons, safety being one. So that's the reason

for the variance this year.

There

was also a variance there last year as well and the year before. So it's

something that we really have little control over, as we try to provide the best

services to all of the claimants.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

I'm

just wondering where we are with hearings. Is there a backlog? How's the timing

with the number of hearings that are in place right now while people are waiting

for it?

MS. HICKEY:

Our backlog was eliminated as of November 2015. We are currently operating with

72 cases. There is no wait time. We are prepared to

schedule a hearing on those

cases as soon as the individuals indicate they are ready. So generally now, if

all the parties are ready, we can have a hearing scheduled within 60 days. We

hope to have decisions out in four to six weeks. So we've made great advances in

the management of our caseload in the last year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Excellent.

On the

Supplies line, there's a variance there from what we spent. We didn't spend a

lot there last year, so we must have saved a few dollars somehow on that line.

Do you want to explain that?

MS. HICKEY:

Generally, paper is our biggest consumer of our funds. So we've made a lot of

efforts to turn to electronic documents wherever we can. We've reduced the

amount of paper we've been using. We're not sure whether or not that will carry

through, so we've kept it at our budgeted amount just to see what happens.

MR. K. PARSONS:

You do get a lot of paper

when you do a hearing, I got to say that.

MS. HICKEY:

We absolutely do produce a lot of paper.

MR. K. PARSONS:

I just want to look at

Purchased Services. Last year it was $190,000 and we are back to this Estimate

from the budget last year. What was the $190,000 difference?

MS. HICKEY:

The difference this year had to do with the renewal of the lease for the office

space. We had some arrears payments that were paid out in this year and the

lease was renewed at a slightly higher rate. So that's the variance for that

year. Our annual amount going forward is not expected to change though from what

we have this year.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

Again,

I'll ask the same question I asked about the Revenue line.

MS. HICKEY:

The operations of the Review Division are 100 per cent recoverable from the

injury fund of WorkplaceNL.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

I think

that's it for the line-for-line stuff. I just have one question, a couple of

questions actually, for the minister. I'm just going to relate it to my own

district, if that's okay with you. We're finding a lot for inspections on septic

design and stuff like this. I'm sure that it's not only in my district; it's in

a lot of districts that there's usually a wait and delay. I get a lot of calls

I'm sure you do from areas that are waiting for people to do inspections. Are

we doing anything to improve that?

MR. JOYCE:

Definitely.

MR. K. PARSONS:

You get the same thing I do.

MR. JOYCE:

I can assure you we are

because the same thing is happening out our way also. When it comes in, a lot of

times there may be an adjustment to their septic design, but there is a movement

to ensure that it's done in a timely matter. There are a lot more coming in

because I know the department is enforcing them a lot more. There are a lot more

actually designs people who are complying now are forced to comply because of

it, but there is a movement afoot to ensure that the delays are minimal and

everything is being done to ensure that it's done in a timely manner.

MR. K. PARSONS:

You find that sometimes,

especially in home construction, people are on timelines to get it done and get

it closed in for the winter. I had two or three occasions last year that the

inspection was the real thing that held it up. Actually, there was a gentleman

that was off sick or something that delayed most of it, so it seemed like we

were just down to the one inspector in the area.

I know,

talking to other Members, that it's common in a lot of areas. It's just

something that I think we should be really looking at because it is an issue out

there with a lot of constituents. It's the number one call I get from anything

to do with Service NL.

MR. JOYCE:

Leigh (inaudible).

MR. PUDDESTER:

not just the inspectors from Service NL, but also the designers that homeowners

have to hire. We do have standards around the turnaround time when we receive

those applications. Obviously if we have vacancies, we may deal from time to

time with difficulties in meeting those, but we certainly strive to do that.

We are

trying to work with the industry. Oftentimes, they can assist in that process by

giving us advance notice or letting us know when things are going to need

approval to line up with construction schedules as well because we may have some

flexibility to work with them. So we try and work with the designers and the

homeowners to ensure that we don't delay things.

MR. K. PARSONS:

Okay.

It's

just that it is an issue, and I'm sure you've heard lots of it and so have I. I

called the department lots of times and thanks to you guys and everybody for

helping out, but it is probably the number one thing that I find with the

department. I don't know if it's a manpower issue.

So I'm

good.

CHAIR:

Shall 1.1.01 carry?

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Aye.

CHAIR:

Carried.

motion, subhead 1.1.01 carried.

CLERK:

1.2.01 through 5.1.01

inclusive.

CHAIR:

Shall 1.2.01 through 5.1.01

inclusive carry?

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Aye.

CHAIR:

Carried.

motion, subheads 1.2.01 through 5.1.01 carried.

CLERK:

The total.

CHAIR:

Shall the total carry?

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Aye.

CHAIR:

Carried.

motion, Department of Service NL, total heads, carried.

CHAIR:

Shall I report the Estimates

of the Department of Service Newfoundland and Labrador carried without

amendment?

SOME HON. MEMBERS:

Aye.

CHAIR:

Carried.

motion, Estimates of the Department of Service NL carried without amendment.

CHAIR:

I will ask if there are any

changes

MR. K. PARSONS:

Just a quick word?

CHAIR:

Okay.

MR. K. PARSONS:

I'd like to thank the

minister and his staff for your time tonight. It was very informative and I look

forward to working with you guys and ladies. Thank you for everything that you

do for the people of Newfoundland and Labrador.

CHAIR:

Are there any changes to the

minutes circulated from the previous meeting?

We will

move to adopt the minutes.

MR. FINN:

So moved.

CHAIR:

Thank you.

motion, minutes adopted as circulated.

CHAIR:

Thank you very much,

everyone.

The

next meeting of the Government Services Committee will be on Tuesday, May 3, at

6 p.m. right here.

motion to adjourn?

MR. KING:

So moved.

CHAIR:

Moved.

Adjourned.

motion, the Committee adjourned.