Manitoba Hansard — Sitting 3 (36th Legislature, 3rd Session)

36-3-3

Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)

Third Session - Thirty-Sixth Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable Louise M. Dacquay Speaker Vol. XLVII No.3- 1:30 p.m., Wednesday, March 5, 1997

Member ASHTON, Steve BARRETT, Becky CERILLI, Marianne CHOMIAK, Dave CUMMINGS, Glen, Hon. DACQUA Y, Louise, Hon. DERKACH, Leonard, Hon. DEWAR, Gregory DOER, Gary DOWNEY, James, Hon. DRIEDGER, Albert DYCK, Peter ENNS, Harry, Hon. ERNST, Jim EVANS, Clif EVANS, Leonard S. FILMON, Gary, Hon. FINDLAY, Glen, Hon. FRIESEN, Jean GAUDRY, Neil GILLESHAMMER, Harold, Hon. HELWER, Edward HICKES, George JENNISSEN, Gerard KOWALSKI, Gary LAMOUREUX, Kevin LATHLIN, Oscar LAURENDEAU, Marcel MACKINTOSH, Gord MALOWAY,Jim MARTINDALE, Doug McALPINE, Gerry McCRAE, James, Hon. McGIFFORD, Diane MciNTOSH, Linda, Hon.

MIHYCHUK, MaryAnn MITCHELSON, Bonnie, Hon. NEWMAN, David, Hon. PALLISTER, Brian PENNER, Jack PITURA, Frank, Hon. PRAZNIK, Darren, Hon. RADCLIFFE, Mike, Hon. REID, Daryl REIMER, Jack, Hon. RENDER, Shirley ROBINSON, Eric ROCAN, Denis SALE, Tim SANTOS, Conrad STEFANSON, Eric, Hon. STRUTHERS, Stan SVEINSON, Ben TOEWS, Vic, Hon. TWEED, Mervin VODREY, Rosemary, Hon. WOWCHUK, Rosann MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Thirty-Sixth Legislature Constituency Thompson Wellington Radisson Kildonan Ste.

Rose Seine River Roblin-Russell Selkirk Concordia Arthur-Virden Steinbach Pembina Lakeside Charleswood Interlake Brandon East Tuxedo Springfield Wolseley St. Boniface Minnedosa Gimli Point Douglas Flin Flon The Maples Inkster The Pas St. Norbert St. Johns Elmwood Burrows Sturgeon Creek Brandon West Osborne Assiniboia St. James River East Riel Portage Ia Prairie Emerson Morris Lac du Bonnet River Heights Transcona Niakwa St. Vital Rupertsland Gladstone Crescentwood Broadway Kirkfield Park Dauphin La Verendrye Rossmere Turtle Mountain Fort Garry Swan River Political Affiliation N.D.P. N.D.P. N.D.P. N.D.P. P.C. P.C.

P.C. N.D.P. N.D.P. P.C. P.C. P.C. P.C. P.C. N.D.P. N.D.P. P.C. P.C. N.D.P. Lib. P.C. P.C. N.D.P. N.D.P. Lib. Lib. N.D.P. P.C. N.D.P. N.D.P. N.D.P. P.C. P.C. N.D.P. P.C. N.D.P. P.C. P.C. P.C. P.C. P.C. P.C. P.C. N.D.P. P.C. P.C. N.D.P. P.C. N.D.P. N.D.P. P.C. N.D.P. P.C. P.C. P.C. P.C. N.D.P.

109 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Wednesday, March 5, 1997 The House met at 1:30 p.m. PRAYERS ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS PRESENTING PETITIONS Mobile Screening Unit for Mammograms Ms. Rosano Wowchuk (Swan River): Madam Speaker, I beg to present the petition of Beverley Terhorst, Sharon Schilko, Linda Phillips and others requesting that the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba request the Minister of Health (Mr. Praznik) to consider immediately establishing a mobile screening unit for mammograms to help women across the province detect breast cancer at the earliest possible opportu nity.

Introduction of Guests Madam Speaker: Prior to Oral Questions, I would like to draw the attention of all honourable members to the public gallery, where we have this afternoon twenty-five Grades 5 and 6 students from Rockwood School under the direction of Mr. Boyd Noble. This school is located in the constituency of the honourable member for Crescentwood (Mr. Sale). On behalf of all honourable members, I welcome you this afternoon. ORAL QUESTION PERIOD Personal Care Homes Public Inquiry Mr.

Gary Doer (Leader of the Opposition): Madam Speaker, the Minister of Health yesterday left the impression that the incidents calling for a public inquiry were only isolated to the one personal care home.

In light of the fact that Judge Rusen in 1994 issued an inquest report on the death of a resident named Anne Sands in the Heritage house nursing home, a private profit nursing home, and stated that in his opinion the staffing levels were woefully inadequate for the 85 residents placed in that home, I would like to ask the Premier, would he now instruct the government to have a public inquiry and look at the lack of follow-up dealing with the recommendations from the inquest as reported by Judge Rusen? Hon.

Darren Praznik (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, the Leader of the Opposition has brought forward some information to my attention which I must admit that I was not aware of that particular incident. I certainly would endeavour to review this particular matter. He puts on the record an allegation that there has been no follow-up. Before I answer that, I certainly would want the opportunity to check with staff in the Ministry of Health to see what follow-up is there. I would suspect that there has been. Mr.

Doer: Madam Speaker, subsequent to the death and prior to the inquest report, a government report was issued. I address this to the Premier because he has had three different ministers of Health through this period of time, and he has been responsible all the way through for the situation of personal care homes. He is the one accountable to the people of Manitoba. The government report stated that residents in private homes are at an increased risk of having falls, fractures, dehydration and pneumonia.

Older female residents in private profit homes are at a much greater risk of having dangerous falls in those homes. I would like to ask the Premier today, will he order an inquiry to deal with the situation in our personal care homes in Manitoba and to deal with the many reports that he has received as Premier of this province in terms of the recommendations that hopefully could have prevented further death and tragedy in other personal care homes here in the province of Manitoba? *

(1335) Hon. Gary Filmon (Premier): Madam Speaker, the member, I think, referenced 1994 and said that we have had three different ministers since then. That is not accurate, of course. The member for Brandon West (Mr. McCrae) served since the fall of 1993. If he is making some reference as to longevity of service, I believe that when the former member for Pembina

11 0 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 1997 moved from his post, he was at that time the longest serving Minister of Health in Canada. The member brings some information to the House that I am sure deserves review, and we will take that question as notice and examine the material that he has brought to the House. The Minister of Health (Mr. Praznik) will report back. Mr. Doer: The death took place in 1992. The previous member for Pembina was the Minister of Health. The Speech from the Throne in 1990 was with the two previous ministers ago, a Minister of Health.

Many of the reports have come down with the previous Minister of Health, and now we have answers from a new Minister of Health. The one thing constant in all of these reports, inquests and inquiries is the Premier has been responsible for all of these recommendations, and we believe the Premier has done nothing through all of these recommendations. Madam Speaker, the Premier had a further report in 19 95 with 39 recommendations. In 1996, the member for Kildonan (Mr. Chomiak) asked the Premier and the Minister of Health directly to get involved in the Holiday Haven Nursing Home.

The Premier said that the member for Kildonan was fearmongering. That is what he said on the radio. Perhaps if the Premier would have listened to members opposite, tragedies could have been prevented, death could have been prevented. I would like to ask the Premier today to stop the cover-up of his responsibility dealing with personal care homes, the inquests and the reports. Have a public inquiry; let us look at his responsibility and the responsibility of his two previous Health ministers in the dereliction of their duties for personal care homes here in the province of Manitoba, Madam Speaker. Mr.

Praznik: Madam Speaker, first of all, I want to say very clearly that members on this side of this House and certainly myself as Minister of Health and previous ministers of Health take this responsibility very seriously. We believe, yes, we want to ensure that we obtain the highest level of care and concern and security for people in the personal care homes of our province. Let us also remember that this is a very human system. It is one that deals with people and management and issues. From time to time there are always going to be problems that arise.

It is incumbent upon us to work as diligently as one can to ensure that those are minimized and corrected when found. With respect to the report that the member for Concordia (Mr. Doer) has referenced, from the reports I have from the department, most of those recommendations, if not all, have �either been implemented or are in the process. of being implemented. That is the information I have from those people who are working on it. I will endeavour to report back to the House if that information is not correct. Holiday Haven Nursing Home Management Mr.

Dave Chomiak (Kildonan): Madam Speaker, there has clearly been a cover-up and a dereliction of duty on the part of this government and this Premier with respect to personal care homes. My question is to the Minister of Health <md it is very specific. On January 22, I wrote to you about Holiday Haven saying that the report commissioned by your government in December called for a management change at Holiday Haven. I knew that in January. I wrote to you about that in January.

Why did it take the government until a death occurred at Holiday Haven for you to all of a sudden recognize and realize that a management change was necessary at Holiday Haven? You had a letter from me saying that your own report recommended a change in management in December of last year. Hon. Darren Praznik (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, if you refer to the letter that the member provided, he indicated the date on which I believe the letter is dated. That is fine.

If you look at the time in which those letters arrive in my office, the time in which I have to look at that information, all of these events, if! remember correctly, were happening around the same time. I say very candidly to him, the letter that he provided to me, the information that I saw in complaints that were coming through the Minister of Health's office of replies I had to sign to letters were factors that convinced me at that particular time when that incident occurred to move very quickly to change

March 5, 1997 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 111 the management in that facility. So his letter certain ly did not go unnoticed. It was part of the information that I used, quite frankly, in making the decision that I did, and I thank him for the letter. *

(1340) Mr. Chomiak: Madam Speaker, can the minister indicate, and will he table in the House today a copy of that Nursing Home Association report, the recommended change in management, and can the minister indicate when he found out that that report indicated that a management change was necessary at Holiday Haven? Mr. Praznik: Madam Speaker, I can tell the member that my knowledge of that from within the departme nt came at the time this Holiday Haven issue came up with the incident and was brought to my attention, and I asked for a report on what was going on there.

In fact, as a result of his letter and other inquiries I had the previous week, I asked my department to give me an update, and that was in the works as this event particularly happened. So I do not think the member could suggest that it is humanly possible for events to have transpired faster than they did. With respect to tabling that report, I will endeavour to obtain a copy and find out if it is within my purvie w to table it. If it is, I would certainly be prepared to do that. Public Inquiry Mr.

Dave Chomiak (Kildonan): My final supplementary: How does the minister believe that the public will have any confidence in the internal revie w he is undertaking of his department in respect to Holiday Haven when in fact the person responsible for the internal review, the assistant deputy minister, is the very person who was responsible for looking after Holiday Haven for the past two years? Does that not justify the need for an independent public investigation and inquiry of the situation at Holiday Haven, the department and the failure of the Premier (Mr.

Filmon) to live up to recommendations made by countless reports with respect to personal care homes? Hon. Darren Praznik (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, to deal with the latter part of the member's question in the first instance, first of all, let us remember that, yes, we need to have safeguards in place, but it is very much a human system. No matter who is on this side of the House or in this desk, from time to time there are going to be difficulties in the system and we have to deal with them, so there never will be a perfect time.

I just think that is not possible, and members across the way acknowledge that. What I have said, and I think it is only fair, anyone who is a minister I think has an obligation to their staff to ask first for a report and the information. We are waiting to see what the coroner makes, the decision that they make with respect to an inquest, and if they have an inquest, the results of that.

I have said, I have said it to the media in interviews, we are taking this one step at a time as we go along, and I think we owe it to those people who have worke d on it to have a chance to put the information to me, and I will make an assessment. If a greater degree of inquiry is warranted, we certainly would consider that, but at that time, we have not yet seen information that would warrant it. Educat ion System Breakfast/Nursery Programs Ms. Jean Friesen (Wolseley): Madam Speaker, the Filmon government in successive budgets has chosen to make many of Manitoba's poor even poorer.

Cuts to welfare in particular have meant, as any teacher will tell you, that in some rural areas and in some parts of the city the numbers of hungry children are increasing. It is not surprising that this same government also believes that early childhood education and nutritional programs are, I quote, costly enhancements, not educational investments. I would like the Minister of Education to confirm that she believes that it is the job of the teachers and trustee s of Manitoba to only discuss nutritional principles and not to feed the hungry children in front of them. Hon.

Linda Mcintosh (Minister of Education and Training): Not accepting any of the

preamble, particularly the part about us not doing anything to improve the circumstances of the poor people who now have more job opportunities, more ability to have productive lives in Manitoba, I should indicate first of

112 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 1997 all that we know absolutely-and my record on this dating back 17 years is well known and well known by those who have worked with me-that what happens in the early years of a child's life will very definitely affect their abilities to produce in every area of life beyond the age of six. We have right now in Canada a system of public school education that looks after the teaching of academics. We also know, however, that it is vitally important that when those children come to school that they come ready to be able to learn those academics.

I think the question we are talking about is, how do you fund these particular items? We are not quarrelling about the need for them or the importance of them. The member would say that these items are not costly and that, of course, is not correct. The question we need to decide, Madam Speaker, which we are doing in our government, is how to go about ensuring children are ready for school, and I have answers for that with the next question. * (1 345) Ms.

Friesen: Does the Minister of Education truly intend, as she indicated to the Free Press, that the funding of early childhood education, a program of significant long-term value for our children, should be dependent upon attracting foreign students to the inner city and that the feeding of hungry children should rely upon some fluctuating offshore market in education? Because that is what she said. Mrs.

Mcintosh: The member is taking two issues: One, the issue of fundraising and should fundraising itself be passive, i.e., lotteries, or should it be active, i.e., educational, the purchase of education from other places? That is one issue; the other issue is how we deal with children before they come to school. We provide right now to school divisions, particularly Winnipeg No. 1, for example, received an additional $200,000 this year specifically to deal with their students at risk coming into the school system.

Through the Child and Youth Secretariat, which this government formed, this government saw the need to co-ordinate activities between Health, Education, Family Services and Justice. Native Affairs is now included in that number. We each will have our own specific mandates, but it is important that we co ordinate those mandates for the sake of the whole child. We are looking at the whole child even before birth. We are now funding programs for adolescent mothers to help prevent things like fetal alcohol syndrome, teaching proper nutrition in the school system.

We believe in a co-ordinated effort, not a piecemeal effort, and we absolutely believe in the importance of early intervention, and we work as a co-ordinated group to provide that. Ms.

Friesen: Would the minister explain why it is that early childhood education and nutrition programs recommended two years ago by the Post! report, endorsed yet again a year ago by the Youth Secretariat, recommended by many studies throughout the world, are now simply reduced in Manitoba in the elitist view of this Minister of Education to costly enhancements to be talked about endlessly in throne speeches and dependent upon offshore fundraising? Mrs.

Mcin tosh: Once again, there is a very, very misleading implication being left to the House which is not fair to the people, the students and the government members who have worked so hard to try to finally get some co-ordination.

We see already $450,000 has been transferred from the Department of Health to the Department of Education to provide for registered nurses in schools for special needs students, that kind of initiative which we have done so that the education dollars can go to hire teachers, not nurses, the nurses being provided by the Department of Health, when, under their day in government, school boards were forced to take education dollars to hire nurses. Now we are saying education dollars can go to hire teachers. The Department of Health will provide the: nurses.

We intend to extend that kind of thinking, that kind of common-sense approach to funding sources for important programs in a co-ordinated way, not taking from the mandate of any of the areas to provide for a mandate in another. Manitoba Telec ommunication Sc!rvice Investors Mr. Steve Ashton (Thompson): Madam Speaker, in January of this year a dinner was held fiJllowing the privatization of MTS. The memento given the 80

March 5, 1997 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 113 guests was a global tradition, a 4 by 5 inch Lucite block displaying the tombstone announcing the $91 0-million deal. That is what the attendees want, said Darrell Burt ofCIBC Wood Gundy. It means they joined the club. Madam Speaker, MTS's name is indeed on a tombstone. I want to ask the Premier if he can indicate that MTS is now not only a privatized company but in fact that the club, the owners of MTS, are now a majority of non-Manitobans, primarily institutional investors on Bay Street. * (1350 ) Hon.

Gary Filmon (Premier): Madam Speaker, I am aware that at least some of the institutional investors are right here in Manitoba. They involve people who are the developers of mutual funds here in Manitoba, the investors of large estate monies here in Manitoba, as well as pension fund investors here in Manitoba. So the premise of his question is incorrect. Mr.

Ashton: Madam Speaker, will the Premier finally tell the truth and that through either the deliberate design of this government or the incompetence, within the first week 40 percent of the shares were flipped, and that it is very clear to any objective observer that MTS is now no longer owned by Manitobans and is basically owned by his friends on Bay Street? Madam Speaker: Order, please. I would remind the honourable member for Thompson that "to tell the truth" has been ruled parliamentary on many occasions, and I would ask him to exercise discretion in the choice of his words. Point of Order Mr.

Asht on: Madam Speaker, on a point of order. Beauchesne Citation 490 states very clearly that "not telling the truth" has been ruled as parliamentary. I believe it is not only parliamentary but absolutely appropriate to question whether the Premier was not telling the truth when he said that MTS would end up being a Manitoba-owned company and when his minister issued a press release on December 20, 1996, indicating the exact same thing. Madam Speaker: The honourable government House leader, on the same point of order. Hon.

James McCrae (Government House Leader): On the point of order raised by the honourable member for Thompson, I believe it has been seen as appropriate and remains appropriate for the

interpretation of the rules, the reading of Beauchesne to be taken in a context of the intent surrounding the words used, and so that is why it is never always as clear as one might think to find words in a list here and in a list there. It is what is the intention of the speaker when using language such as "not telling the truth," and I would invite you, Madam Speaker, to take that into account as you assess this point of order. Madam Speaker: I will take the matter under advisement and report back to the House after having researched it in more detail. *** Mr.

Filmon: Madam Speaker, as the member should be aware, many of the large institutional investors who did indeed buy shares in Manitoba Telephone System after the commencement of trading were from Manitoba and were Manitoba based. So his premise is not accurate. Brokerage Firms-Fees Mr. Steve Ashton (Thompson): Madam Speaker, the facts speak for themselves and the Premier knows what has happened. I would like to ask one further question to the Premier.

Since he would not give this information before the sale of MTS, will he now confirm that the brokers made at least $24 million prior to the issue of the shares on the stock market and that indeed the lead brokers, Wood Gundy and Dominion Securities, each received $4.8 million apiece, the same companies that recommended the sale ofMTS in the first place? Will the First Minister finally admit to the greed that was the real basis for the sale ofMTS? *

(1355) 114 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 1997 Bon. Gary Filmon (Premier): Madam Speaker, as is the case with any private share offering, commissions are paid to the people who sell those shares. Indeed, in return for that, Manitoba received $910 million in revenue, of which a very substantial part of that revenue will go to pay down the debt of this province, the long-term debt of this province, that will pay for hospitals in this province, that will pay for health- Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Madam Speaker: Order, please. The honourable First Minister, to complete his response. Mr.

Filmon: Madam Speaker, that money will go to the long-term benefit of the people of Manitoba as money that they used to pay in interest on the debt that the New Democrats put on this province, and instead of being put as interest on that debt, will be put into health care, into education and into vital social services. That is the difference between the twisted thinking of the New Democrats and what the people of Manitoba want to have happen. They do not want the money to go to the bondholders in Zurich and in Tokyo and New York.

They want the money to go to health care, to education and to the social services that they depend upon. Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Point of Order Mr. Ashton: Point of order, Madam Speaker. Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Madam Speaker: Order, please. The honourable member for Thompson is attempting to cite his point of order, and I am having difficulty hearing him. Mr. Ashton: A point of order, Madam Speaker. I asked about the commissions that were paid to the friends of this government. The Premier referenced Switzerland.

I do not know if he was referencing his many trips to Davos, Switzerland, but any reference to Switzerland in response to this question is obviously out of order. Madam Speaker: On the point of order raised by the honourable member for Thompson, I would remind the honourable First Minister that his response should be explicit to the question asked and should be as brief as possible. Regional Health Authorities Deficit Reduction Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): Madam Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Health.

In moving towards the creation of regional health authorities, this government has been using somewhat heavy- handed tactics to co-op local volunteer boards. This government in essence has been blackmailing boards all over Manitoba. Unless a volunteer hospital board amalgamates or agrees to surrender their independence and control and submits to the dictatorship of an unelected Tory-dominated regional health care board, your government is not interested in helping reduce their debt. The question is, why is that? Hon.

Darren Praznik (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, first of all, I certainly look forwaid to a very rational discussion on this issue because I think it is one that deserves a rational discussion. The rhetoric that the member for Inkster has used in talking about dictatorial boards and unelected boards, let us put some things into perspective. There are very few, if any, health care boards in Manitoba today that are elected. In most cases today, they are appointed by their constituent municipalities. I do not hear !the member calling them dictatorial boards to the people, their community.

Let us not forget that the vast majority of funding for health care in Manitoba is voted by this Legislature; so this is where the responsibility exists. What we are trying to achieve through reg;ionalization is grouping large enough blocks of citizens together so that we can find ways of providing bette:r and more services. If one allows it to continue 1lo exist, an organizational structure of small institutions, the member, quite frankly, will condemn rural Manitoba in particular to declining health care over the years. Mr.

Lamoureux: Madam Speaker, rny question specifically to the Minister of Health is, if the government through the regional health authorities has the money today in order to accommodate these debts,

March 5, 1997 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 115 why are they holding out? Why are they trying to force compliance with regional or local health hospitals and so forth that are out in the community? Why not allow for a more natural flow into the regional health board? Why the heavy hand of government? Mr. Praznik: Madam Speaker, as I said, again, let us keep the objective in mind, and the objective is to get to a regional authority and administration of those dollars so that services can be properly distributed throughout a region and be appropriate to the people that they serve.

I know we will get into this debate. I can show the member many, many numbers today that show us inappropriate use of services, lack of services, et cetera, because we have an institutional organizational model. Regionalization gives us a very good tool to reverse that trend. I would also point out to the member that for those boards that have a constituency today, whether they be municipalities or particular organizations, if they wish to retain their corporate identity and make decisions to run their institutions, with that also comes the responsibility for any financial loss or deficit.

You cannot have it both ways, Madam Speaker. *

(1400) Mr. Lamoureux: Madam Speaker, that is in fact what is happening over at the Dauphin regional hospital- Madam Speaker: Order, please. I would remind the honourable member for Inkster he was recognized for a final supplementary question, and this is not a time for debate. Would the honourable member please pose his question now. Mr.

Lamoureux: Madam Speaker, my question to the Minister of Health is, why, then, does he feel the government, if it has the money, has to take away the opportunity of some of these boards that are volunteer based in being able to have more of a natural flow into the regional health authority? Why does it have to happen tomorrow? Why can there not be more of a natural flow so we are not upsetting and getting people upset over the way in which this government is trying to manage health care reform in this province? Can you not consult, can you not work with people? Mr.

Praznik: Madam Speaker, I can assure the member that I do lots of consultation and lots of travel. Last night I was in Carman for the annual meeting of the central health authority board, 275 people there, lots of questions and suggestions, but not one who opposed regionalization, not one individual. Madam Speaker, in the case of Dauphin, it is a very difficult situation, as I know the member for Dauphin (Mr. Struthers) is probably very much aware. That hospital has a very significant deficit, I think somewhere in the neighbourhood of a million dollars if memory serves me correctly.

They are not a municipally backed hospital; they have a group of founders there, and they are the major hospital in that part of their particular region. When one analyzes the numbers, a lot of their difficulties as to why in fact they have a deficit I think can be corrected and fixed as they move into a regional model. It is very important that their regional health authority be able to put those kinds of steps into place that will solve many of the health care problems in the Dauphin region. I am sure the member for Dauphin, the member for Swan River (Ms.

Wowchuk) want to see improved and better health care in their region, and they are entitled to that. Elk Ranching Regulations-Poaching Ms. Rosano Wowchuk (Swan River): Madam Speaker, Manitobans across the province were furious when they learned of the regulations this government put forward to regulate the elk industry, particularly when they found out that the regulations would legalize poaching and help friends of government. The minister has admitted that there was a mistake in these regulations.

Can the minister now tell us what he has done to address this unfair situation and whether new regulations have been put in place to close the loopholes that legalized poaching? Hon. Harry Enos (Minister of Agriculture): Madam Speaker, I am pleased to have this opportunity to indicate to you and to the House that, as the regulations call for, a very specific process of identification which involves a DNA process is currently taking place properly identifying all those animals that had been reported to the department for registration into the

116 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 1997 agricultural domestic elk farming program. That process will take a while because it involves the individual handling of each animal, a blood sample having to be withdrawn from that animal. Once the status of those animals that had been reported during that period of time from February 1 to 14 has been established, the future registration of potential elk farming will take place. I want to indicate very clearly, Madam Speaker, to the honourable member for Swan River that this involves a fairly onerous job.

It involves going back into the records when her brother was Minister of Natural Resources and permitted a number of elk to be held in captivity in this province and my commitment to the Manitoba Elk Association that met with me that all will be treated equitably with respect to registration in this program. Ms. Wowch uk: Since the minister wants to talk about relatives, maybe he should talk about some of his friends who call him Uncle Harry.

Madam Speaker, I want to ask this government how they can be so hypocritical to press charges against two people who poached bear but are letting friends of the minister's, friends of government who took elk illegally, letting them hold those elk and not pressing charges of poaching against those people. Does it matter who your friends are and whose chain you can pull? Mr.

Enns: Madam Speaker, I am further pleased to report to the House and to the member that not a single animal that has been reported to the Department of Agriculture for registration has been acquired in the manner that she describes , by poaching. The so-called friends of the government will be the last to be given any favourite treatment by this minister, by this government. Ms.

Wowchuk: I would like to ask the Minister of Natural Resources whether those people who took elk illegally will be charged with poaching and have those elk repossessed, and will they be charged with poaching just as the people that the Department of Natural Resources charged for poaching bear? Will the minister enforce the law and charge the people who took elk illegally? Hon. Glen Cummings (Minister of Natural Resources): I would welcome any information that the member has regarding poaching of elk. Elk Ranching Capture Mr. Stan Struthers (Dauphin): My question is for the Minister of Natural Resources.

Your government passed legislation last fall to capture and ranch elk solely to benefit your friends. It has been a disaster. Last year, the capture was stopped at the end of February because cow elk were aborting their calves. Wild elk today are being lured out of our parks and you are the minister responsible. This is already March 5, so why are you allowing this capture to continue right through calving season? Hon. Glen Cummings (Minister of Natural Resources): Madam Speaker, we are accepting the best advice of biologists and experts as to the timing, and as a matter of fact, the capture is just about over.

Mr. Struthers: Will the minister confinn that of 80 elk captured, only 16 were taken from crop depredation areas, and the rest were lured out of our provincial parks? Mr. Cummings: Madam Speaker, if the member can tell me which elk are the resident elk and which elk are the ones that are nonresident in the valley, I would be more than prepared to deal with the questiion. Mr. Struthers: Somebody across the way ought to know what is going on with these elk. Neither of these ministers do.

How can you and your department contract two individuals to capture elk from our parks on the one hand when your mandate is to protect this province's wildlife? Point of Order Hon. James McCrae (Government House Leader): Just over the past year or so I have noticed a practice, quite unintentional I am sure on the part of members perhaps on all sides of the House, tending toward using

March 5, 1997 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 117 pronouns instead of addressing their questions through the Chair, as we are all supposed to do, or making our answers through the Chair. I wanted to bring that to the attention of the House. One of the things a new House leader gets to do is perhaps mention something that has been on his mind for a long time. Mr. Steve Ashton (Opposition House Leader): On the same point of order, Madam Speaker, I am sure what the member for Dauphin meant to do was, through you, ask why no one on the government side knew what was happening with elk.

Madam Speaker: On the point of order raised by the honourable government House leader, I thank him for refreshing all of our memories that indeed the questions being posed should be put through the Chair. *** * (141 0) Mr. Cummings: Madam Speaker, the member, through innuendo and the choice of his words, is implying that there have been large numbers of elk that have been poached. I suggest that he should provide some names and some information if he believes that.

If he chooses not to believe that, or if he is convinced that that is the case, then he is saying that those who have declared that they have elk on their property, as required by the Department of Agriculture under the program, you are suggesting that those 80 elk and not 900, which was apparently the rumour that the members of the opposition were circulating, that those 80 elk-if he has word of any others out there, then I would please ask him to put it on the record. Legislative Building Royal Doulton Product Promotion Mr. Jim Maloway (Elmwood): My question is to the Minister of Government Services.

I would like to take this opportunity to congratulate him on his recent appointment. Now everyone knows that this is a pro-business government. Recently the Speaker turned her office into a private store and yesterday Royal Doulton, a private company, held a product launch of dishes downstairs in this building. I would like to ask the minister whether we can expect to see more examples of this occurring at the Legislature and whether other product lines such as vacuum cleaner sales companies are now free to start operating out of the Legislative Building. Hon.

Frank Pitura (Minister of Government Services): I thank the honourable member for that question, and I am afraid I do not have an answer for you. I will take that question as notice. Mr. Maloway: Madam Speaker, while this is not the first time that this has happened, I would like to ask the minister, would he put a stop to this practice and acknowledge that the Legislature is an important public institution and not a building to be used to sell dishes or vacuum cleaners or to be turned into a shrine to Tory ideology? Mr.

Pitura: Again I thank the honourable member, but I understand that a lot of the areas that fall within the area of the Legislative Assembly come under the Legislative Assembly Management committee, and so a lot of those decisions are made at that committee level. Mr. Maloway: My final supplementary to the same minister then: Is he saying then that this is the responsibility of the Speaker, that it is the Speaker who is allowing this practice to occur in this business? An Honourable Member: That is what he said. Mr. Maloway: That is what he said. Mr.

Pitura: I would just advise the honourable member that the Legislative Assembly Management committee is a committee of the House and as such is not the responsibility-the Speaker is the Chair of that committee, but it is a committee of the House. Again, I will take most of the question as notice and get back to the member. Northern Affairs Office Closure-The Pas Mr. Oscar Lathlin (The Pas): I would like to ask the Minister of Northern Affairs a question, and that has to

118 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 19 97 do with the office of the Department of Northern Affairs that has been closed in The Pas putting three people out of work. I know the promise was made to the workers to relocate to Thompson. I understand one is willing to go and two, for family reasons and being from The Pas, are unable to move. I would like to ask the minister what rationale he has that would have prompted him to make the decision to close the office in The Pas. Hon.

David Newman (Minister responsible for Northern Affairs): The Pas regional office closes March 31 with the expiration of the lease. This is part of an evolving program towards the empowerment of the 53 northern communities. The whole direction of the legislation is designed to encourage self-sustainable independence. This is a step in that direction, a step that has been progressive and is designed to recognize the pioneering spirit and independence of people in the community. You should also know that the people being transferred, three of them were offered the opportunity to move to Thompson into that office.

The fourth individual was offered the opportunity for training as an entrepreneur, so that person could then provide the services, formerly provided as an employee, to the communities that are being empowered in that fashion. It is very interesting. The mayor of Cormorant expressed support I believe for this kind of direction because they are very proud of their self-sufficiency.

Madam Speaker: Time for Oral Questions has expired ORDERS OF THE DAY THRONE SPEECH DEBATE (Second Day of Debate) Madam Speaker: To resume adjourned debate on the proposed motion of the honourable member for Turtle Mountain who has 16 minutes remaining. Mr. Mervin Tweed (Turtle Mountain): Thank you again, Madam Speaker, to allow me to finish my remarks in regard to the throne speech presented in the last day. Recognizing that all Manitobans have a stake in the well-being of our children, our gov,ernment will co-operate with other governments including the federal government to deliver a new national child benefit.

All children must be given every opportunity to grow and develop mentally, physically and emoti onally. Our government welcomes this co operative spirit which is sure to assist all our children and especially children of most need. A recent public review of The Child and Family Services Act by the member for River Heights (Mr. Radcliffe) will soon result in changes to the act to modernize the system and ensure children remain secure.

The safety and security of the individual, our families and our communities is vital to the quality of our life, and to that end our government shall continue its policy of zero tolerance in reference to violence against women, and initiatives such as early intervention urban youth sports camps will also assist youth and families. The urban sports camp is a recreation program that would provide prevention and intervention efforts for youth.

The long-term goal of this program is to promote leisure-time activity as an alternative to negative behaviour with the desire to create safe and productive environments, and early intervention for families at risk will be developed. Addressing criminal activity is more than simply a matter of providing police, courts and jails. Crime prevention is a key link in this chain. A Pubfic Safety Branch responsible for crime prevention initiatives and victims programming has been established. The unit will be responsible for all victim and crime! prevention programming, policy development and planning.

The unit will include Victi m/Witness Assistance, Women's Advocacy/Child Witness Support, crime prevention and other victim programming. *

(1420) Seniors comprise a large segment of om population and their safety is paramount. To that end, life safety programs will be enhanced. The program has already been a success in revitalizing capital infrastructure such as green spaces and lighting in older Winnipeg neighbourhoods. The throne speech committed our governm ent to the continuation of this program for a

March 5, 19 97 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 119 further six years. Through Manitoba's Seniors Directorate and the Winnipeg Development Agreement, we will be working towards enhancing the safety and security of seniors while they enjoy their lives in their own homes. Madam Speaker, I began talking about potential. The underlying theme from the Speech from the Throne was potential. The people of Manitoba recognize the potential of our government to combine fiscal responsibility with the maintenance of servic es important to all Manitobans, that being health, education, family services and justice.

The economy of Manitoba has always had tremendous potential which the previous government long neglected. Through strong management practices and a vision, much of this potential has been realized. The economic potential has been approached through rural economic development, export diversification, support of projects such as Winnport and infrastructure investment among others.

The educational potential has been achieved through the adoption of world-class standards and uniform testing throughout the province to help assure success for our youth, continuation of the implementation of curricula emphasizing English, maths and science, the involvement of parents in their children's education, and the continuation of education as the second highest spending priority of this government.

Our health potential has been addressed through the modernizing of the health care system through innovations such as rural heath authorities, a mobile health clinic, a provincial children's asthma education program, an expanded role for nursing, and the continuation of health as the single greatest budget expenditure of the province.

The potential of our First Nations is being enhanced through the fulfilment of obligations under the Northern Flood Agreements and finalizing treaty land entitlements ensuring First Nations Manitobans are fully included in the benefits of a national initiative against child poverty and ensuring the education and training system is more responsive to the needs of aboriginal people.

The potential of low-income families will be addressed through the building on the success of programs such a Taking Charge! which will see 600 single parents into the workforce, the continuation to work with other provinces and the federal government to develop a new national child benefit program and the introduction of pilot programs aimed at providing early intervention for childre n and families at risk. The role of government is to provide the foundation necessary to permit a society to successfully adapt to changing circumstances. Success in narrow economic terms is not enough.

We must also succeed in broader human and social terms. Our key concern is to build a Manitoba where each generation can live as healthy and productive citizens. Manitobans have expectations of their economy and of their society. We expect the economy to generate jobs and to provide fair opportunity for all Manitobans to participate in the building of a strong Manitoba. We also expect our economy to generate the resources to provide a safety net for those who are unable to provide for themselves.

The throne speech was about qualities that can be developed, possibilities that can be achieved and capabilities to which we all aspire. Together, through co-operation and vision, we can continue to develop all of our potential. We all have a role to play in that economic and social fabric of Manitoba, and I ask all Manitobans for that co-operation. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Mr. Edward Helwer (Gimli): I am honoured to be able to stand before all the members of this House today to second the government's throne speech.

We are beginning the Third Session of the Thirty-sixth Manitoba Legislature with an already impressive list of accomplishments. Together with Manitobans, we have built a province that stands as a symbol of success, and as the new session gets underway, I look forward to working with my colleagues, my constituents and indeed all Manitobans to build upon those successes and make our province stronger than ever.

Before I begin, Madam Speaker, I would first like to express my complete support and confidence in your ability to perform your role as Speaker, and I look forward to another session in this Chamber where I know we shall all be guided with the benefit of your

12 0 LEGISLATIVE AS SEMBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 19 97 wis dom and your ju dgm ent. I have th e high e st resp ect for you and th e dignity and dec orum you have sh own in this Hous e, and as th e sessi o n cont i nu e s I am confident th a t fairness and wis dom will accomp any your decis ions. Madam Sp eak er, I am pl eased to day to ri se and second th e thr one sp eech , and I am honour ed th a t th e Pr emi er (Mr. Film on) has allowed me th i s opport unity , and I want to th ank him for th at.

On Monday, ou r government put forw ard its visi o n for a succ essful , pr osp erou s Manitoba , a vis ion th a t contains th e key comm itment of conti nued jo b cr eati o n and economic gr owth in ou r pr o vince, a vis ion of commitm ent to mo dernizing ou r health care syst em, to abor iginal peopl e and to ou r youth wh o are th e very fu tur e of Manitoba. Th e thr one sp eech was th e I Oth th a t we have deliv ere d since we came to office, and since th e very beginning we have be e n comm itt ed to keeping ou r focus on th e pri orit ies of Manitobans.

More imp ort antly , we cont i nu e to consult with Manitoba ns on all fro nts. Aft er all, as th ey say, th ere is no "I " in team, and ou r government cann o t achi eve wh a t needs to be accompl ish ed with ou t th e valu ed knowl edg e and input of th e people of th i s pr ovince. Togeth er, th e partnership of ou r government and Manitob ans have made ou r pr o vince tru l y th e best pl ace to liv e, work and inve st and rais e a fam ily.

As this new sess ion of th e Manitoba Legisl atur e pr ogr e ss es, let me assur e all Manitob ans th a t ou r government will continue to work toward s uph o l ding ou r ranking as a leader in Canada in terms of jo b cr eati on. In fact , since th e beginn ing of 19 96, th ere were an additi onal 23,900 net new jo bs cr eat ed in Manitoba , which is th e str onge st perfo rm ance among all th e pr ovinces. Madam Sp eak er, ou r government un derst ands th e imp ort anc e of sp ending sm art er and hol ding down taxes, sett ing pri or ities and elim inating debts and deficits .

We re alize th e urg ency in taking care of wh a t we have to day in or der to ensur e a positiv e tom or row for ou r chil dren and generations to come. In fact , th a t is wh a t ou r balance d budg e t law is all abou t. Our legisl ation ensur e s th a t Manitob ans will cont inu e to have access to th e most vit a l servic e s now and in th e years ahead. To dat e, Manitoba has record ed tw o consecut ive balanced bu dgets with a thir d on th e way.

With th is, we have also accumu lat ed a surplus of over $210 mi ll ion , and this surplus is in th e pr ovince's Fisc a l St a bilization Fun d which will be us t:d to ensur e a st abl e financial fut ur e for th e pr ovince and for all Manitobans . In additi on, we will be among th e first pr ovince s to begin paying do wn its debt. By ensuring th at ou r surplus fun ds ar e us ed for th i s purp o se, we will be ensur ing a pr osp ero us fut ur e for ou r ch ild ren , and we cont inu e to sp e nd over $500 milli o n in interest paym ents each year.

However, once th ose interest paym ents are gone, th ink of wh ere th ose doll ars could go. Im agine having th ose additi o nal fu nds to put for war d towar d s health , educ ation and for vital serv ices. So ou r government bel iev es th at that is wh ere ou r money is best spent , and we are on th e ri ght path to get us th ere. * (1 430) Ma dam Speaker, for nine cons ecutiv e years , we have kept ou r commitm e nt to Manitobans thr ough str ong fisc a l management.

We have not rais e d any majo r taxes, be it pers onal income tax, corp orate tax, capi tal tax or th e sales tax, and th is continu es to be th e longest tax fre eze in Can ada. In fact , th e pers onal income and sm all bus iness corp or ate tax rates have be e:n re du c ed, and ou r government has cr eat ed a tax syst e m th a t is fair to all and is comp etitive. In th e thr one spe ech , ou r government hig hlight ed its commitm ent to tw o immediate nati ona l pri ori ti es, jo b cr eat ion and childr en in need.

In th e weeks and months ahead, we wi ll work with ou r partners dev elop ing and impl ementing new in itiatives to addr ess th ose tw o very import ant pr ior iti es. Go ing back to jo b cr eati on, ou r governmc: nt expec ts in th e very near fu tur e to enter into a one-y ear agre e ment with th e fed eral governme nt to top up th e curr ent Canada-Manitoba Infrastructur e pr ogra m.

Th e first infr astruc tur e pr ogr am signed back ii n Janu ary 19 94 was valu e d at $204 mill ion , and once all th e pr ojects are compl eted th ere will have be e n more than 3,300 jo bs cr eat ed in more th a n 395 differ ent pr oje cts

March 5, 1997 LEGISLATIVE AS SEMBLY OF MANITOBA 121 around the province. In the Gimli area, residents benefit from several infrastructure pro jec ts, as an example drainage construction in the R.M. of Armstrong when it received some infrastructure funding and a drainage program in the Vil lage of Dunottar, and after a lengthy wait, the much anticipated twinning of Brookside Boul evard received infrastructure funding in November of this last year.

This $8.2 -million proj ect will improve safety on the roads and will create some 15 0 jobs and will greatly improve Winnipeg's ability to accommodate the flow of cargo to and from the Winnipeg International Airport, and truckers will gain a direct fo ur-lane route from the airport all the way to the north Perimeter and from there to the major highways fanning out from the city. This pro ject was a very important part of the effort to make Winnipeg an international transportation and distribution hub.

In addition, with so many of my constituents using Brookside Bo ulevard as a main travel route to and from work, I know this addition will be a welcome item fo r commuters. As the lanes of Brookside widen, so, too, will the job and business opportunities in Manitoba. Our government has always maintained that another program equal in dollars was necessary and we have lobbied Ottawa on that front. In fact, during last year's annual Premiers' Conference in Alberta, our Premier, the Honourable Gary Filmon, along with all Canadian premiers agreed to negotiate a new program with the federal government.

It was emphasized that a new program needs to have a value comparable to the current program and that it should fo cus on strategic infrastructure which would enhance competitiveness and long-term employment growth and stability, and we hope that the new one-year top-up will bridge a path to this kind of program . The federal Liberal government continues to offload on the provinces. Combining last year and this current year Ottawa will again have cut transfer payments to Manitoba by some $220 million. That translates into $220 million less fo r the priority items such as health, education and social services.

Across the country, unila terally, federal cuts in transfers to health, higher education and other programs is now in the range of some $7 billion. Despite this federal offloading our government, in consultation with all Manitobans, has fo und new and innovative ways of doing things, and we are spending our dollars more wisely and managing our money more responsibly than any governments past. While our province and all Manitobans have much to be proud of, it is not yet time to rest. We have to continue to look fo r ways to spend even smarter and use our resources more wisely.

Manitobans have made it clear that there is an urgent need to upgrade our roa ds. Just last month our government announced nearly $10 0 million in improvements and construction pro jects that have been approved fo r the '97-98 hig hway construction program. That brings our government's commitment in this area to some $18 6 million over the next two years. In the Gimli constituency six proj ects at over $9 million will benefit Manitobans. Of that funding just over $3 million will go towards a pavement proj ect over a 16-kilo metre

section of PTH 8; a 20-kilome tre

section of PTH 9 from 101, a little bit of the road will be improved at a cost of some $1 50,000; a 1 0-ki lometre

section of River Road from PTH 9 to 44 will receive a $2.4-million upgrade; a new bridge will be constructed along PTH 9 at Willow Creek just south of Gimli to make way fo r the widening of that stretch of road; and a 17 -kilo metre

section of PR 325 will go through a $3.2-million upgrade. These are all very impor tant highway improvement pro jects, and we are really pleased to be able to see these roads improved. These proj ects and many others which will take place across the prov ince will mean job crea tion and safer roads fo r all Manitobans. While our government is committed to a national highways program, we cannot proceed without the co operation of the federal government.

Our rural highways continue to face increasingly heavy truck traffic due largely in part to Ottawa's policies, including changes to the Canadian Transportation Act which have resulted in some rail line abandonment and the end of the Crow rate. It is that additional traffic which is putting additional pressures on our rural road system and leaving us faced with an urgent need to upgrade.

122 LEGISLATIVE AS SEMBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 1997 Due to the urgency of this issue, we will continue with efforts to convince the federal government to commit to this essential program and work together with the provinces to benefit all Canadians. The time to act is now and the way to act is together. In the past our government has built successful productive partnerships with all levels of government, and we will continue in that same direction.

As mentioned in the throne speech, our government expects to sign a major new agreement with the provinces and federal government on labour, market development and training, and this agreement will increase Manitoba's ability to ensure that key training initiatives reflect the particular needs and circumstances of Manitobans. Madam Speaker, we will also further that co operation by working with the federal government and the provinces on the design of a new national child benefit system. These benefits can serve as a model fo r a more positive, co-operative approach to social policy renewal.

The proposed benefit would enrich the existing federal child tax benefit and would allow provinces to introduce or enhance complem entary programs to address child poverty. The benefit would go to all low-income families receiving welfare or earned income. (Mr. Ben Sveinson, Acting Speaker, in the Chair) Just recently our Minister of Family Services, the Honourable Bonnie Mitchelson, attended a meeting of Social Services ministers in Toronto where she outlined our government's position on the national program .

We are pleased that the federal government is willing to work with the provinces in the fight against child poverty, and I look fo rward to the time when we can make the national child benefit a reality fo r the good of all Manitobans and indeed all of Canada. Manitoba's youth are the future of this province, and our government's Chi ldrenFirst strategy is paving the way to a brighter future fo r young Manitobans. Our strategy fo cuses on redirecting funding towards prevention, early intervention and to provide services directly to children and to families.

Through the Winnipeg Development Agreement we will invest some $4.5 million in innovative and preventive child and family services. Pilot proj ects will foc ;us on the prenatal nutrition, early development, childhood development, adolescent parents and aboriginal mothers. • (1 440) Mr. Acting Speaker, our commitment to families and to children is clear. We now spend over $W O million annually on child and family support alone. However, our world has changed, as our needs.

In order fo r the Manitoba Family Services Department to be more responsive to the needs of Manitobans, our government is committed to a reorg anization. That reorganization has been completed and will make the system more acce ssible, more relevant and accountable to families in the community. Just recently my colleague the MLA fo r River Heights (Mr. Radcliffe) held a review of child and family services. He conducted a provincial tour to listen to Manitobans and to get their comments and suggestions on possible improvements or changes that are needed in the system.

From that tour,, using the input at Manitobans, our government will be introduc ing legislative amendments during the 1997 session. Our government believes that all Manitobans, and indeed all Canadians, are concerned about our childr en growing up in a safe environment with true prospects fo r growth and a quality life. To help ensure that this is the case in our province, this government continues to develop new initiatives and programs that help Manitobans acquin: the skills that they need to compete in toda y's world. We are working to help Manitobans become and remain self sufficient.

After all, is not the best fo rm of welf are a job? Our government believes it is, and to that end we have introduced an Employment First welfare reform proj ect that ties welfare support to training, to advanced education, and to emplo yment. We are helping Manitobans achieve the tools to find work. In fact, during the last legislative session we passed the Employment and Inc ome Assistance program . It has a new foc us of making employment the No. 1 priority fo r clients who are able to work. As this new session continues, we will continue our work in this area to help Manitobans achieve self -sufficiency.

March 5, 1997 LEGISLATIVE AS SEMBLY OF MANITOBA 123 Creating emplo yment opportunities is a key priority right across this country, and our government is comm itted to continuing to provide an environment in this province that provides job creation and ensures that all Manitobans benefit from the success of a strong, stable economy. Mr. Acting Speaker, 1996 was a great year for Manitobans, and all indications are that we are headed for another successf ul year ahead. Current economic indi cators place Manitoba right at the top of the performance scal e.

For instance, for the 11 months to November 1996, Manitoba retail sales were up 6.4 percent above the 19 95 total for the same period. That is over two and a half times larger than Canada's 2.5 percent growth. Housing starts in rural Manitoba rose 43.7 percent last year compared to 19 95. In fact, in the Interlake area, the whole area has excelled in new home, cottage and commercial building construction. This is a strong indicator of how successful local residents have been in creating an attractive environment for investors and for newcomers.

In the manufacturing sector, for the 11 months to November '96, Manitoba shipm ents were up $605 million during the same period in the previous year, and this was the second highest growth rate of any province and three times Canada's gain of only 2.6 percent. Since 1992 Manitoba has created a total of 8,600 manufacturing jobs. Also, new manufacturing investment in Manitoba is now expected to reach $458 million for 1996, which is $138 million higher than the initial forecast.

Currently six of the seven major provincial forecasts show economic growth in our province is performing above the national average in 1996. As for job growth, Manitoba is a lea der among the provinces. As I said, from January '96 to January '97 we added some 23,900 jobs. This is a 4.6 percent gain, about 4.5 times Canada's 1 percent growth rate and the strongest performance amongst the provinces. Statistics Canada notes that continued employment growth in Manitoba is anticipated in the year ahead.

Our youth employment rate was 13.6 percent in January of this year and that is the second lowest among all the provinces. In addition, Manitoba is one of the only four provinces recording a decline in the jobless rate in January. Our export performance also tops the charts. For the 11 months to November '96, our exports to the United States were up 13.3 percent compared with the same period of the previous year. This is nearly twice Canada's gain of 7 percent.

Between 1990 and 1995, our exports to the U.S. more than doubled, growing by $2.2 billion or 123 percent, and this was the strongest growth in the entire country. To assist Manitoba businesses with continued success in this area, our government has comm itted to full implemen tation of the 1994 Agreement on Internal Trade and to increased trade with other provinces and ensuring that Manitobans have comple te access to the full Canadian market. Manitoba businesses have enjoyed great success exporting their products to Mexico and the United States under the North American Free Trade Agreement.

In January our government signed federal provincial ag reements that allow our full participation in NAFT A on labour and the environment. During this session we will be introducing legisla tion to provide for the implemen tation of these ag reements in Manitoba, ensuring the protection of our exports through ef fective enforcement of labour and environmental laws. Manitoba trade missions are opening up doors for opportunities for Manitobans. Last year two local businesses from my constituency went on a succes sful trade mission to South America.

As a result of the mis sion, both International Beef Genetics and Prairie Farm and Ranch Supply expect to do business in South Ame rica in the near future. These trade missions helped to promote Manitoba and to put Manitoba on the global map as an ideal location to do business. By bringing established Manitoba business representatives to these lands we have the opportunity to promote our province and all it has to offer, and we are able to prove that Manitoba is indeed an ideal place to invest.

Whether it is Ukraine, Asia or South America, Manitoba trade missions are opening the doors to new opportunities, job creation and success. Back at home in Manitoba, our government has passed changes to The Labour Relations Act that are

12 4 LEGISLATIVE ASSE MBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 19 97 intended to increase and protect the rights of workers. This. includes having access to information through regular reporting by unions to their membership, and it is about ensuring there is a democracy in the workplace. If unionization is to be a democratic process, the voice of the workers must be heard, and our legislative changes allow that to happen. It puts employees in a better position to exercise their rights and participate in the collective bargaining process. * (1 450) Mr.

Acting Speaker, all Manitobans deserve the best possible life now and in the future, and we are living in a rapidly advancing world that waits for no one. Globalization is a reality that has major impli cations for our future economic prosperity and for its quality of life. Rapid increase in technology has created demand for new and constantly improving skills. In today's world, computer li teracy is no longer a luxury. It is a necessity. If we want to continue being able to compete and succeed in today's global marketplace, we must be willin g and able to adapt to change.

Computers are now a way of life for us. (Madam Speaker in the Chair) As stated in the throne speech, our government will continue with the modernization of our health care system. We have paved the way for innovations that will help Manitobans achieve the best possible services by wise management of resources. Our announcement of I 0 rural and northern health authorities, along with the Brandon health authority and two Winnipeg authorities, will allow our health care specialis ts to look at the system as a whole.

This new way of doing things allows us to take the qual ities from each health facil ity and use them throughout the province for the benefit of all Manitobans. We are basically bringing the health care decisions closer to the communities that each health authority serves by allowing those individuals who live in a certain region to determine what services are required and the best way in which to deliver them. Our government is confident that we will be able to provide the best possible health care system to the people of this province.

Further strengthening and developing of community based health care services continues to be ;m essential part of modernizing the system, and we can no longer look at traditional ways of health care as the only option. Strong commu nity-based services are key to health care. No longer should the traditional view of a hospital bed and physician be the limit because quality care can be provided at home or on an outpatient basis by a wide range of health professionals.

Using resources more effectively will not only save us money, but it will allow patients the benefit of spending less time in that hospital and more time in the comfort of their own home. The creation of these authorities allo ws us to make the best use of the expertise and the talents of Manitoba's health professionals. By putting their knowledge to work on a province-wide bas is, we will share our !knowledge about what works best and solve problems more quickly and effectively.

In February, our government announced it was using a portion of the proceeds from the public share offering ofthe Manitoba Telephone System to pay down $15 0 mill ion of existing hospital and personal care home debt, and we realize there is need for a capital program in health to ensu re our facili ties meet the health care needs of Manitobans. By using some of these fund proceeds in this way, we will allow ourselves some additional flexibili ty to meet those needs.

Currently Manitoba Health is working with the various Manitoba health facili ties to try to develop a workable program that addresses the needs of Manitobans while balancing what the province can afford. Our government is confident that by working to reduce our debt costs we will be able to deliver a new capital program which achieves that end. Madam Speaker, the health care professionals in this province are the most dedicated, caring and talented in the country.

In fact, there is a great team working at the newly constructed Stonewall Hospital, which opened its doors in April of '95, and in just a few weeks the newly renovated Rosewood Lodge personal care home will have a grand opening to celebrate the culm ination of three years of construction which started back in December of'93 . Apart from the renovations, the new Rosewood Lodge has a 20-bed addition bringing the

March 5, 1997 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 12 5 total be d count th ere to 50, and I woul d lik e to th ank every one wh o has be en a part of this sp eci al pr oject. Your efforts will cert ainly impr ove health care ser vic e s pr ovi ded in this area. So me of th e hig hlig h ts in th e thro ne sp eech focus ed on th a t same pri ority of continued impr ovement to ou r health care syst em.

Health initiativ e s in th e sp eech: to pr ovi de servic e s cl oser to home, such as post-surgic al card iac re habilit ati on, di alysis, ch emic a l dep endency pr ogr ams, mental health pr ogr ams, an expanded hom e intr avenous pr ogr am, a mobil e chil d health clinic, a pr ovincial chil dren's asthma educ a tion pr ogr am, and an expanded ro le for nurs es. By investing in health and sp ending sm arter, we in turn will also pr event illne ss and pr otect health and pr omote wellness . Our government continue s to make educ a ti o n a majo r pri ority .

In fact, ou r fun ding level in this area is second only to health as a perc entage of ou r total bu dget. Our chil dr en are th e fut ur e of Manitoba and as this worl d continue s to ch ange , we must ch a ng e with it . As ou r government striv e s for exc ellence in th e sch ool syst em, we will continue with initiativ e s th a t help us accomplish ou r go als.

As hig hli ght ed in th e thr one sp eec h, we will continue th e impl ement a ti o n of th e curricul a emph asizing English, math and sci ence , and we will fu rth er th e adopti on of worl d -cl ass st andard s and uniform testing thr ough ou t th e pr ovince to help assur e succ e ss for ou r youth . Th ese test results enabl e teachers, administr ators, and parents to see wh ere we need to dev elop new appr oach es, and, imp ort antly, ou r government will continue to help ensur e parents are involv ed in th e educ a tion of ou r chil dren.

In th e recent public sch ool fun ding announc ement, ou r government maintained fun ding supp o rt for sc hools in an effort to assist th e m with fu tur e pl anning. We have also committ ed to pr ovi ding this same base fu n ding level for next year, and it is all abou t usin g ou r resourc e s as wis ely as possibl e. All of us need to be constantly lo oking for new and impr oved ways of doing things. Sch ool divisi ons hav e foun d increased effici encies in th e areas of administr ati o n and op eration, and th e y will also be able to us e th ose savings for re directi on into th e cl assr oom.

In this way, every one benefits fr om th e taxp a yer to th e teacher to th e chil dren, and it is absolut ely necess ary th at Manitoba's youth have th e skills necess ary to find empl oym ent. Our government will also be developing str onge r partnerships and coll abor ation with th e po st secondary educ ati o n syst e m and impr oving th e linkages with th e busin e ss community . In additi on, we will also be revit alizing th e Appr enticeship Pr o gram to pr ovi de exciting care e r opportuniti es.

Wh e n it comes to law and or der in this pr ovince , ou r government continue s to be gui ded by four principl e s in ou r appr oach to crim e. Fir st, criminals mu st be held account abl e and pay th e consequ ence s for th eir crimin a l acts. Second, th e rights of victims are of pa ramount consider ation. Thir d , th e justic e syst e m must continue to be fair and account abl e to th e people of Manitoba, and finally, Manitoba famili es and communiti e s have a ro le and resp onsibility to help make this pr ovince a safer and bett e r pl ace to liv e .

During th e last sessi on, ou r government pass ed parental resp onsibility legisl ati o n which makes parents resp onsibl e in appr opri ate circumst ances for restituti on to victims wh ere a chil d has delib erately dam aged pr o perty . In th e thr one sp eech, among other things, ou r government announc ed it will continue efforts to emph asiz e chil d pr o tecti on and dev elopment and to re design youth emergency servic es, to impl ement an urb a n sp orts camp, and to bring in innovativ e pil o t pr ogr ams aimed at pr ovi ding early interv e nti o n for chil dren and famili e s at risk .

Our government's appr oach to crim e is working. Whil e th e pr obl ems of crim e cann o t be solv ed overnig ht, we have be en seeing some encour a ging signs th a t th e po lici e s of ou r government are bringing positiv e results . For instance , in 1995, Manitoba's overall crim e rate decr eas ed by 6 perc ent; th a t was th e larg est decr ease in Canada. Th a t same year ou r pr o perty crim e rate declined 8 perc ent; again th e larg est decr ease in Canada.

In additi on, ou r pr ovince had a 33 perc ent decr ease in th e rate of homici des, a 20 perc ent re du cti o n in th e rate of sexu a l assaults, a 7 perc e nt decr ease in th e rate of assaults, and 19 perc ent decr eas e in th e rate of br eak and-enters, 1 perc ent increase in th e rate of auto th eft, and a 4 perc ent decr eas e in th e rate of imp air ed dr iving offences.

126 LEGISLATIVE ASSE MBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 1997 * (1 500) Mad am Sp eaker, although crim e rat es ar e dr opping, th ere have be en som e highly publi ciz ed cases in th e media that have left Manitobans expr essing conce rn about th eir safety . To help deal with this, our gov ernment has establish ed a Public Safety Branch responsibl e for crim e pr evention initiativ e s and victims program ming. We will continue working with Manitobans to dev elop initiative s an d programs to assist Manitobans an d furt her re du ce th e criminal activity in this provinc e.

Agricultur e in Manitoba continu e s to be a major part of our economy. As we look to new opport uniti es, this ar e a has th e pot ential to cr eate many new jobs in Manitoba. Last year our Working for Valu e Task Forc e wrapp ed up provinc e-wide meetings, ad dr essing th e need for Manitobans to buil d a stronge r provincial and rural economy, especially through gr eat er valu e-added activity, broa der div ersification and job cr eation. Our gov ernm ent has set a targ et to expand th e range of our valu e-added exports by $1 billi on ov e r th e next decade.

Tog eth er we must find innovativ e and cr eative approaches for cr eating new investm ent incentive s for fun ding local valu e-added ventur e s in rural Manitoba. Participants in th e rural task forc e meetings have made it cl ear that th ey ar e ready to make th e necessary change s to thriv e in th e economy that is becoming mor e mark e t dr iv en, diversifi ed, valu e ad ded, sustainabl e and comp etitiv e . In th e Interlak e ar ea th ere were two succ essful pro ductiv e meetings held , one in Teulon and one in Arborg.

Partici pants in th e Teulon meeting know that th e peopl e of this region and th eir attitu des ar e critical to its fut ur e prosp erity . Th e y said it was imp erativ e that th ey be pr epar ed to tak e th e initiativ e to cr eate th e thriving regional economy. Participants at th e Arborg meeting noted that th e community alr eady has an establish ed bas e of som e valu e ad ded, inclu ding Gilb ert Foo ds, a company manufacturing st eel bins, and th e company th ere that manufactur e s and exports th e carp e t racks, but th e y said th ere is still room to grow.

Of particular interest to participants was th e opportunity for valu e-added agricultur e and pro d uction of liv estock, forag es, hone y and leaf-cutt er be es. It was also indicated that communiti e s need to promot e th e ms elv e s and to pr epar e th ems elv e s for attracting invt:stments to th eir own resp e ctive ar eas. Mad am Sp eaker, by showcasing Manitoba to th e worl d , we will be abl e to enhance tra de and investm ent and incre as e tourism in our provinc e.

Som e of th e major events that will ov e r th e next few years that will help us in this effort inclu de th e 1997 Canadian summ e r games which ar e going to be held in Brandon in Au gust. This event alone will involve som e 4,000 athletes, coaches, officials and thousands of visitors and volunt eers. It is anticip ated that th e games coul d have an economic impact of as much as $60 milli on, cr eate up to 800 jobs and pro vi de accelerated community and sport dev elopm ent.

Th en in Nov emb e r of this year Brandon will also be hosting th e Canadian Olympic Curling trials, and th e best curl ers in Canad a will be playing for th e oppo rtunity to repr esent Canad a in th e 1998 Winte r Olympic Game s in Japan. My constitu ency of Gimli will be th e prou d host of th e 1998 Wintc!r Games. Th ese games will have an op erating bu dge:t of som e $450,0 00, which is gr eat news for Gimli and surroun ding communiti e s in terms of economic spin offs. That combined with th e tourism doll ars that will be generat ed will gr eatly benefit th e entir e region.

Finally, in 1999 Manitoba will play host 1to th e Pan Am erican Games, th e larg e st celebration of sport and cultur e ever staged in Canada. Our gov ernment has be en and continue s to work clos ely with Pan Am organizers to take ful l advantage of th e economic and community dev elopm ent benefits of staging th ese games. Th e event will giv e our provinc e incredibl e exposur e to new opportuniti es and to expand both our economic and cultural relationships in th e Am ericas. It will lead to enhanced tra de and investm ent, tourist dev elopm ent, community dev elopm ent and also cu ltural industry expansion.

Mad am Sp eaker, our gov ernment, tog etht!r with all Manitobans, will continu e taking up th e chall enge of chang e . We will continue buil ding new opportuni ti e s and cr eating mor e jobs. Our gov ernment will continue to spend smarte r and provi de thos e servic e s needed by Manitobans. Tog eth e r with Manitobans our gov ernment will continue making our province th e best plac e to li v e and to work and to rais e a family.

March 5, 19 97 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 12 7 I fully support our government' s throne speech and all the initiatives within it. I look forward to this upcoming session. Manitobans have much to be proud of, and we cannot slow down yet, for there is still much work to be done. Together I am confident we will keep Manitoba strong and make it even stronger in the months and years ahead. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Mr.

Gary Doer (Leader of the Opposition): Madam Spea ker, in speaking to the Speech from the Throne, the words "Divine Providence" guiding your del iberations is the last sentence of the Speech from the Throne. I wanted to talk about one of his quotes in a minute. I might say that I know that all Manitobans want divine providence in terms of the flood situation here in the province of Manitoba and the potential floods in many of our communities, many of our farms and homes and ag ricultural concerns.

So I want to start my words today by wishing and hoping that we have the best possible weather conditions to allow us to have the least amount of flooding that is presently forecast. I know all of us join in that hope as we start this session because we know a lot of people are very concerned about it, and we share with them their concerns. I thought it was appropriate and interesting, Madam Speaker, that the Premier (Mr. Filmon) has chosen to use the words from a Shakespearean play in his media serum to describe the so-called action pla n of the provincial government.

I wanted to ref er, get references to where that came from, because I thought it was a familiar passa ge, and it appears that the Premier used the words out of the play, the Shakespearean play, The Merchant of Venice, when he talked about when I am cut-and I paraphrase the play because the Premier did-when I am cut, I bleed, you hurt me, et cetera, and I thought it was appropriate because he did not go on to finish the famous words.

I also thought it was rather ironic that he would choose a passage from Shylock in The Merchant of Venice because at the same time that he chose that we were debating issues of democracy and the Speaker and past rulings on racism. As I recall the passage, the poignant passage from Shakespeare, with the words of Shylo ck, it was dealing with racism and anti-Semitism, and I wanted to refer back to that passage because at the same time he was using those words to describe that he was like everybody else, he was using the words of Shylock to describe and to fight back against racism.

Almost coincidentally to the time he was using those terms, we were fighting back against decisions in this Legisla ture that disallowed us from fighting back against racist policies with our motion of nonconfidence in the Speaker. I guess it really speaks to the true issue we are dealing with, with the Speech from the Throne, because words are easy; it is deeds that matter.

Facta non verba is the term that the Romans used to describe deeds not words, and so when the Premier uses his words in the press conference, we would like him to use his muscle in his caucus to expunge racism policies and the disuse in this Chamber. Instead of using the whip from the provincial western Premiers' mee ting in Saskatchewan a short period of time ago in Y orkton to disallow that description, he used the whip with his Tory caucus to do the opposite. * (1510 ) Words not deed would come to mind when you look at the total Speech from the Throne.

If the Shakespearean quote was to go on further, it talks about revenge, and perhaps that may be more appropriate for the people of the province during the election campaign for the government action, if you are wrong we shall revenge, in the same passage . But the passage could be used in more modem terms right in this building. If you take away my job and take away my dignity, I will cry.

Because those of us on this side of the Chamber saw the true heartlessness of this government and this Premier, and we had to-not had to-when we were talking with the cleaning staff in this Legisla tive Building who have been laid off by this Premier and this government, the people who clean our offices, the people who empty our wastebaskets, the people who cle an the toilets in the Legisla tive Building, and were making $1 2,000 a year, were laid off by this heartless governm ent, and we feel their pain and it is not just words, Madam Speaker.

Those are the people we fight for every day and the Premier forgets every day in this Chamber. So he can

12 8 LEGISLATIV E ASS EMBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 19 97 try to do a U-turn; he can try to do a U-turn on the rhet�ric; he can try to do aU -turn on the words, but he cannot do aU -tum on the mean, extreme ideology that we see every day placed against the people who are the more vulnerable in our province whether they live in the North, whether they live in the rural communities, whether they live in the inner city or whether they work right in this building. For the Premier himself, words cannot change the heartless actions of this government and members opposite.

Shakespea rean quotes cannot change the reality that Manitobans feel. Of course, last year I started off talking about some of the same things in the Speech from the Throne. This is the government that cut the food allow ances for babies by 24 percent, child ren under the age of one year, 24 percent with their provincial application of social assis tance-24 percent. Did I see a reinstatement of the babies' funds in this Speech from the Throne? Did we see some real action for kids and babies who are most vulnerable in our communities?

We all know from all the studies that this is the most important period of time for our children, for babies. Did we see anything in the Speech from the Throne to reverse the most nega tive decision I have ever seen implem ented by any government in this Chamber? It makes Sterling Lyon look like Mother Teresa in terms of what they did. No, we did not see that reversal. We did not see real action in a real Speech from the Throne. We saw words from a government that the people now have got a measure of. They know you are heartless.

They know that you are mean and extreme, and you can put all the kinder, gentler words in your Speech from the Throne and in your press conferences if you so choose, but travellin g across this province, people know what you are and know what you stand for, and to finish the Shylock quote in the Shakespea rean play the Merchant of Venice, the revenge will be the people of Manitoba, and it cannot come soon enough, Madam Speaker. Now the Tories opposit e and the Premier (Mr. Filmon) oppos ite cannot change their fundamental phil osophy and ideology. They belie ve in the race to the bottom.

They see the whole world in this global race to the bottom. Today you compe te with South Dakota. Tomorrow you compe te with Nebraska. The day after that you compete with Ala bama. The day after that you compete with and lower your standards and your programs and your incomes to that of Mexico, and the year after that you go to South Korea or In donesia or some of these other places the Premier frequents on a regular basis. That is the vision. That is the phil osophy. That is the ideology. That is your belief system.

Madam Speaker. \Ve absolutely reject the race to the bottom that is being implemen ted by the Tories, and we will replace it with a system and vision and values that belie ve in people and put people first, not this corporate mentalit y first in Manitoba. Every day this vision is implem ented with the maximum amount of cronyism. Cronyism is growing in the Cons ervative government. Every day you see examples of this cronyistic approach by the Tories.

A couple of weeks ago. we learned the Filmon team, the Conservative team, the Premier's Office in Manitoba has been debased to such a level that the Premier's staff write phony and fraudule nt le tters to the editor and get other people to sign them. That is the kind of moral decay that we see opposite. It should not surprise us. Madam Speaker. I talked about the letters that are being written for other people to sign. Of course. it should not surprise us because we all recal l the phone calls coming out of the Premier's Office during a by election campaign a few years ago.

Maybe they want to deny those comments-Ron Arnst phoning and saying I am just a citizen of Crescentwood, and even though you cannot recognize my voice, I am just appalled by the other candidates from other parties. Other members of the Premier's staff. obviously on ins tructions from the Premier (Mr. Filmon) himself -Mr. Hig hroads, Mr. Hig hroad Premier. Mr. Decorum--<>rdering his staff in a cronyistic way to phone open-line radio shows and then deny it after. Remember the Deputy Premier (Mr. Downey) denying it? Oh, I do not recognize that voice; I do not recognize that voice.

I only lis tened to him on Brandon radio for I 0 years, but I do not recognize that voice. The contracts to the Premier's former staff--cronyism. cronyism, cronyism. Health care, the telephone system. It goes on and on and on. The appointments to some of the boards and commissions. people who gave themselves contracts in the telephone system, as board

March 5, 19 97 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 129 members in the Manitoba Telephone System, are now rewarded with promotions in other Tory-appointed boards of directors. It is rotten, Madam Speaker. It is becoming more rotten every day, and the people have got the measure of this. We have, Madam Speaker, the Lotteries Commission now, the new, independent Lotteries Commission. Did we tum a page and start all over? Did we take a look at some people who were truly independent in establishing the independent commission dealing with lott eries? No. The Premier (Mr.

Filmon) chose to go back to the past, to go back to a patronage system, to appoint people to that Lotteries Board on the basis of their promotions to the Con servative Party rather than their merit to deal with the social and economic consequences of gambling here in the province of Manitoba. Old think, the kind of think we have from the Premier opposi te in his actions. *( 15 20) Madam Speaker, look at the Atlanta Olympics last year. The Premier said on the radio, the Premier stated on the radio, I am being paid for by the Pan Am Games Society; I am being paid for by the Pan Am Games group.

When the question was asked, who is paying for it, the Premier said it was the Pan Am Games Society, and only after Frank, his good friend, his good friend Frank McKenna, blew the whistle and said, oh, both Premier Filmon and I are being paid for by IBM, our hotels and our tickets and our meals are being paid for by IBM, did the Premier then have to admit that he did not tell the truth when he was on the radio, and he said that he was being paid for by somebody else. You know, the old saying is if you do not tell the truth about the little things, how can we expect you to tell the truth about the big things?

Of course, that brings us to the Manitoba Telephone System. [interje ction] You can go back and give us your quote about Ron Arnst. That is a standard we would expect from the Deputy Premier (Mr. Downey). If the Deputy Premier wants to interrupt for a momen t, let us refresh everybody's memory of last year. Yes, the Pan Am Games Socie ty-now this Pan Am Games Society has become a real nice deal for members opposi te, has it not? Oh, the Pan Am Games Society asked my wife to come along to South America. Well, when officials from the Pan Am Games Society were contacted today, they said no, Mr.

Downey's office asked us to ask Mrs. Downey to come. Now, whom are we going to believe? Are we going to believe the Pan Am Games Socie ty volu nteers, or are we going to believe the Deputy Premier? You know what? We are going to believe the Pan Am Games Society. We are not going to believe the Deputy Premier. Madam Speaker, if the IBM Olympic hotel truth or lack of truth was the small issue of telling the truth, then the Manitoba Telephone System is the big issu e of not telling the truth and the kind of value system that this Premier (Mr. Filmon) and this government have.

During the election campaign, I will not sell Manitoba Telephone Sys tem if I am re-elected. If we are re elected, we will not sell the Manitoba Telephone System. Well, we know the studies to privatize the phone system took pla ce even before the election campaign. We know that the Premier's chief henchman working for the Minister of Finance (Mr. Stefanson) was working away, working away with his brokerage friends, stirring-we could use other Shakespea rean quotes to talk about twice and once the hedge pot boiled, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, we could go on all day with Shakesp eare with members opposite.

We could start with the member for Charleswood (Mr. Ernst) and start with the Premier, and say, et tu, Brute, et tu. The government did not tell the truth on the Manitoba Telephone System. As the member for Thompson (Mr.

Ashton) pointed out today, it was clear that the brokers, their fees and the greed that was prominent, became the special interest group that guided the Tory decision not only to break their election promise, but break their bond to the people of Manitoba to fulfill a promise that only made a few people rich and disa ppointed thousands of other Manitobans in terms of owning their telephone system. We could go on all day long about the Manitoba Telephone System. We belie ve- Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

130 LEGISL ATIVE AS SEMBLY OF MANIT OBA March 5, 19 97 Madam Speaker: Or d er , ple ase. Mr. Doer: We have been arou nd the pr ovince for the last number of months. [interjection) Madam Speaker: Or d er , ple ase. The honour able Leader of the offici a l oppo siti on. Mr. Doer: Th ank you, Madam Spe aker. [interjection] Anybody th a t makes a st atement li ke that th a t has been contradicted the way he was. Madam Spe aker , acro ss this prov ince, there is one thing th a t people are saying abou t th is government th a t is po sitive.

They talk abou t the cr onyism; they talk abou t the heartlessness; they talk abou t the cynicism; they talk abou t the br oken pr omises. They talk abou t one thing th a t is positive abou t the government, I want to say th a t to day. They talk abou t the fact th a t they are happy th a t the bo oks are balanced, but they kno w th a t there are massive surpluses coming into this pr ovincial government bec ause of the VL T revenues and the revenues generated by gambling. They know th a t th o se massive revenues to balance the bo oks are coming ou t of their communities.

So the surplus on the one hand is po sitive , but they see very little results fro m th o se surpluses in terms of investing in thei r fut ure and in their community and taking this massive amou nt of gambling money and reinvesting it in the pr ovince. There is a gr owing concern on the dam age of VL T machines acro ss this pr ovince, the soci al dam age of VL Ts acro ss this pr ovince, and a gr owing concern abou t the soci a l cost of these VL T mach ines.

I suggest to the government str ongly th a t they mu st implement the rec ommendati o n of the Desj ardins rep ort at minimum and have referendu ms and plebiscites in communities acro ss Manitoba and let the people spea k ou t abou t these massive amou nts of revenue and the soci al costs. Madam Spe aker , the pe ople do not believe the government on another boast . They do not believe th a t their taxes have not been raised . They kno w th a t sales tax has been spre ad.

They kno w th a t user fees have been introdu ced and introduce d and intr oduce d again, and they kno w th a t pr operty taxes have gone up ra dically bec ause of the ch ange in the pr operty tax cre dit and in other ch anges in terms of offl oading onto mun icipali ties and sch ool bo ards here in the pr ovince of Manitoba. They want a positive alternative to th i s government. They want a government th a t respects people. They want a government th a t takes a co-oper ative appr oach to ou r pr o blems and ou r ch allenges.

Tht!y want an alternative view, Madam Spe aker , and we have an alternative view to this gl obal kind of race to the bo ttom. We believe th a t there is another way to go.

There is a different way to proceed with th i s pr ovince , th a t we can compete in a gl obal eco nomy, but we must compete on the qu ality of li fe, on the qu ali ty of pr ogr ams, on the qu ali ty of serv i ces , on tht! qu ality of wh a t we can do together rather th a n ju st leave pe ople beh ind with th is kind of Darwinian, he artless appr oach th at we see fr om Conservatives in this pr ovince and we see fro m Conservatives acro ss th i s worl d . * (1 530 ) People want pr ograms th a t make a difference to their li ves. They want to lo ok at the qu ali ty of pr ograms.

They un derst and th a t pr ograms th a t are vital fr om the pr o vinci al government pr ovi d e a posit ive li fe and a positive qu ali ty in thei r commun ities. If you just go to the community of Giml i, and the member for Gimli (Mr. Helwer) ju st seconded the Speech fr om the Thr o ne , pe ople in Giml i un derst and th a t there is a connecti o n between a qu ality health care system in thei r commun i ty and the economic ch all enges that they have, th a t you cann o t have a gro wing retirement community with less of a he a lth care system, a pre dictable health care system in your commun ity.

They un derst and th a t you canno t have a grow ing tour i sm bus iness if you have a decl ining he a lth care res ou rc e: in your community. They make the connection, Madam Spe akt!r , between investing in he alth care and investing in the way in which we can compete in a qu ality way across this pr ovince. There is an alternative way to go , and they un derstand it, and members opposite do not un derst and it . They see everything in terms of cost. We see everything in terms of cost and benefit for all of Manitoba. Th a t is the fun damenta l di fference.

Madam Spe a ker , they see the connection between an educ ati on str ategy and an economic strategy. We have

March 5, 19 97 LEGISLATIVE AS SEMBLY OF MANITOBA 131 a government today that is taking away training and apprenti ceship and programs for people in education. That is not the way to develop and compete into the 21s t Century. If we do not have an economic strategy that includes an education strategy, we will not have a vision, an alternative vision, of how Manitoba can compete in a changing society and in a changing world.

They also see, Madam Speaker, that our infrastructure is human and our infrastructure is physical, and they see the connection between programs and Crown corporations that provide us with a competitive advantage in the world, as opposed to the Tories, who want to sell off our assets and sell off our competitive advantages. Let me give you a couple of examples why we are so fundamentally different than the Tories on these fundamental issues. Madam Speaker, we did debate the telephone system in this Chamber. We debated it on the basis of rates. We debated it on the basis of jobs. We debated it on the basis of debt.

We debated it on the basis of tax provisions. We debated it on the basis of a number of other factors, but the real issue here is, who will control the telecommunications and the information highway into Manitoba' s future? Will it be people that the Tories support, the brokers, the shareholders, the people on Bay Street who only are going to be concerned about a return on their investment in a priva te corporation, or will it be the people of Manitoba, who will have a Crown corporation that prepares us for the future technology and the future assets in an information highway?

We believe that we should control those decisions, Madam Speaker. We believe that part of a competitive and global economy is having some control of the infrastructure that is so important to the people, having the control in our hands, in the people's hands rather than having it in the brokers' hands in Bay Street or New York or somewhere else. That is a fundamental difference between your view of how we can race to the bottom in a global economy and our view of how we can maintain quality services. Let me give you an example.

The only two telecom systems that have elimin ated party lines in Canada have been the province of Saskatchewan and the province of Manitoba. The Devine government in Saskatchewan, we started it and you carried it out here in Manitoba, were the only two corporations to elim ina te party lines in rural and northern communities. There is a total reality to why those decisions were made here in our jurisdictions. They were owned by the people. They were owned by the public. You cannot have a rural economic development strategy if you have so many people on farms and on northern remote communities having party lines.

They cannot hook up to the Internet. You cannot hook up to the health emergency equipme nt. You cannot hook up to the new technological systems, fax machines, and other systems that are going to be rapidly available to consumers and individuals. In the province of British Columbia, where they have higher densities of population and growing densities of population, they have 60,000 people still on party lines in rural British Columbia. In Ontari o, Bell Telephone has thousands and hundreds of thousands of party lines in those provinces.

Madam Speaker, that is why we have to maintain control of those decisions in our own hands. That is why the Tories were wrong to give the control of our telephone system to the brokers. That is why the Tories were wrong to break their word that they made in the last election campaign. Brokers drive Jaguars and senior citizens get a $2-a-month increase from that government opposite. I say to you that nobody, nobody in this province believes you when you say you will not sell the Manitoba Hydro system. That is why they are not going to re-elect you in the next election campaign.

The only way to save Hydro is to vote for a party that believes, believes in public ownership to balance off the ownership of others in our market system. Madam Speaker, we proposed a number of positive alternatives coming into this session. Many more ideas, many more plans of action, many more specific proposals than we have seen from this government for the last nine years. This government is tired. It has no energy. It has no heart, and it has no ideas left. No gas left in the gas tank. People can see that.

Three years ago we proposed a Healthy Child program, and we again propose it as we move into this Legisla ture and this session this week. We called on the government to bring in programs to deal with hungry children. Did you hear the answers from the

13 2 LEGISLATIV E AS SEMBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 19 97 Mini ster of Education (Mrs. Mci ntosh) over the last two days? That is the real Filmon agenda for hungry children. Put something in the Speech from the Throne and let hungry chil dren be dealt with by wealthy imm igrants from Asia to be attracted to our school division. What an absolute disgrace, and that is why the people can see through the heartless government of members opposite. The minister says, well, that money should not come from the Education budget. It should come from corporate fundraising like they have had in Fort Garry. Is that not nice?

Is that the Fort Garry that has Ravenscourt? That corporate fundraising? You know, hungry child ren cannot learn. Hungry children need a helping hand. Hungry chi ldren need a society and a community that cares. Hungry child ren need a government on their side, and it is not these members opposite, Madam Speaker. We called on the government-[inter jection] Nobody on this side cut babies' food by 24 percent like the member for Tuxedo (Mr. Filmon).

How he had the gall to go out and pack up food packages after he cut out 24 percent of babies' food over the last twelve months, it is absolutely the height of cynicism and the height of hypocrisy from this hypocritical Premier, Madam Speaker, and the public are starting to see through this. We have proposed a prenatal program in targeted populations. We have proposed a number of proposals to have nurses in our schools. We have put forward ideas to have a family life component. We have proposed ideas to expand and combat fetal alcohol syndrome.

We have proposed that we expand physical education in our schools, not subtract the number of hours and programs available to our children. We want to look at schools as part of the solution for our children. The assessment programs in audiology, the hearing programs, Madam Speaker, the speech programs that have been cut by this government, lineups are longer and longer and longer, and what is this government doing? It cuts and it cuts and it cuts. That is why we have positive ideas. We were delighted when we saw the Healthy Child report from Dr. Post!.

It looked very close to the programs we had been suggesting but, of course, all of these programs make a lot of sense. If you spend money on a prenatal program for targeted populations, it costs you about $800 per child but, Madam Speaker. if you have an underweight baby, it costs approximate ly $200,000 to our health care system. It makes sense to provide the dignity of decent programs. It makes sense to put resources into children at the earliest possible moment, including a program for mothers.

To have a couple of pilot projects cynically announced by the members opposite, we expected more, and we are absolutely underwhelrned by the words in the Speech from the Throne. We are not surprised by the lack of any political will to put a heart back into programs for children by a heartless government that we see opposite. Madam Speaker, we have a number of proposals on our Healthy Child program which I have articulated. We have had a number of other proposals on health care, alternatives on health care, nurse practitioners. It is in the Speech from the Throne again, is it not?

Every year it is in the Speech from the Throne, and every year the government does nothing. Every year they do nothing on nurse practiti oners. Do they havl! a strategy to deal with rural and northern doctor shortages? No, they do not. Do they have a strategy that would take three or four doctors' positions and look at putting more nurse practitioners as approved for medical services in those regions? We talked to one region that had thn!e doctors positions approved. We suggested that they have two doctors and three nurse practitioners for the same amount of money. Good idea. The whole community wanted it.

But the government would not provide the backup to have that kind of balance which would provide the services to the public and provide the backup for doctors in their communities. We have proposed solutions to the private, profit labs, but this government is only going to deal with the nonprofit labs, will not deal with their friends that are making money with privately held labs. They will only deal with one part of the equation. We have proposed positive alternatives to deal with regional health. Again, the government does not want

March 5, 19 97 LEGISL ATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 133 democratically elected regional health boards. It does not want the public involved in the needs assessments. They want to proceed in their way of saying either you do this or we will do that, a kind of cronyism again. If you do not do this in terms of the 4 percent cut, we will not deal with the deficits . It is our way or the highway. That is not working in part nership with communities.

It is a form of public policy blackmail, Madam Speaker, that has no place in the health care delivery of our citizens here in the province of Manitoba. * (1 540) We have proposed a personal care home, a nursing home bill of rights. Where is the government's action on personal nursing homes? Perhaps the Premier is so embarrassed because last year he said the NDP was fearmongering when we raised the Holi day Haven nursing home. We want a public inquiry to look at the inaction and the scandal of the Premier's Of fice in dealing with our personal care homes, Madam Speaker. We will not settle for anything short.

We have had inquests. We have had reports. We have had studies. We want to know who is responsible. Through three minis ters of Health, we believe the member for Tuxedo (Mr. Filmon) is the one that is responsible for inaction and scandal in our nursing homes under the Tory government of the day. We have further proposed that there be legislation to disallow profit in home care. We do not want people to get access to their health care services on the basis of the size of their wallet or the size of their purse, and we have proposed a nonprofit system.

We believe in a health care system that is accessible and nonprofit for everybody. We will continue to work at positive legislation to do that. We believe the majority of citizens of Manitoba are opposed to the privatization of home care services and other health care services in Manitoba, and we want to vote on a positive alternative to have nonprofit home care and health care in the province ofManitoba.

Madam Speaker, we have further proposed, in dealing with the privacy of our citizens, a bill to deal with access to confidential information, but it is a scandal again that the government did not have privacy legislation in place before they gave our health care records to the Royal Bank through the SmartHealth subsidiary. This Minis ter of Health (Mr. Praznik) has inherited not a Cadillac system; it has inherited a Rolls Royce system, a more expensive information system, an experimental system, than any other province on a per capita basis in Canada.

The legislation should have been passed in this Chamber before that contract was let, not two years after. It is a disgrace again that the government did not see fit to follow through on these positive ideas. The government, I guess, has been meeting with the business community which is quite worried about their lack of action with Canada's First Nations people and aboriginal people here in Manitoba.

People know intuitively that we have to work in partnership with First Nations people, and I guess it took about 10 meeti ngs with the business community instead of the plight of people in their communities for these people to put something in the Speech from the Throne. Madam Speaker, you can put words in a Speech from the Throne, but we know the Premier's (Mr. Filmon) view of First Nations people when we heard his words to the member for The Pas (Mr. Lathlin) in the last session of the Legis lature.

We all heard the way he treated the member for The Pas and his words and the kind of baiting that he performed in this Legis lature to our First Nations member Oscar Lathlin or the member for The Pas. We know that the member for The Pas has done more to bring the people of northern Manitoba together, to bring the First Nations community together with the non-First Nations people in northern Manitoba in The Pas constituency than all members opposite can even dream about.

We are absolutely proud ofthe work he did when he was Chief of his band, bringing together the Chief and the band and the people with The Pas First Nations and The Pas community, Madam Speaker. We are absolutely proud of the partnership by the member for The Pas, and we are absolutely proud of the fact that he is in our caucus to fight for First Nations people and all other people of The Pas. He obviously knows the kind of real agenda of the Tories opposite for Fi rst Nations people. We are proud of the work from the member for Rupertsland (Mr.

Robinson), working for justice for First Nations people, dealing with the whole issue of

134 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA March 5, 19 97 the Betty Osborne case and people who were going to get paroled too early without reconciliation with the community and the victims. We are absolutely proud to have First Nations people in our caucus fighting on behalf of their constituents. We are proud of the fact that our member for Point Douglas (Mr.

Hickes), another First Nations person, is again part of the NDP team, the New Democratic team, in our caucus, a person who went through the New Careers Program, Madam Speaker, a person who has been on the front lines of fighting for dignity and integrity of programs for First Nations people. It is an absolute shame that members of the government, soon to be opposition, would cut programs like New Careers that allowed our member George Hickes to become a prominent member of this Legislature.

They cut the programs that provided hope and opportunity for other people, and then they stand up in their phony way with the Speech from the Throne and talk about what they are going to do, and First Nations people. Madam Speaker, did we see a reversal of some of the negative decisions on New Careers, on Access, on the MKO, on the Assembly of First Nations? Did we see a reversal in some of the terrible decisions that have been made on First Nations people in past budgets made by this Premier? The Indian and Metis Friendship Centres have been cut by this provincial government dramatically.

Programs to give First Nations people jobs and recreation at those friendship centres have been cut by this Premier. He is no friend of the friendship centres, and First Nations people know that. That is why we would reinstate the funding to those friendship centres immediately and start putting people back into the communities at those friendship centres in an opposite way to the Tories. Madam Speaker, the AJI report, the Aboriginal Justice report, this Premier (Mr.

Filmon) has not even implemented recommendation No. 1, to establish a joint commission with the Assembly of Chiefs to establish a justice strategy here in the province of Manitoba. Recommendation No. 1, to have a joint commission, was not implemented by this Premier, and do you know what they do instead of implementing those good recommendations that Ted Hughes talked about again when he was dealing with the mess created by the former Minister of Justice? They say that we re ject a separate justiice system.

They create the recommendation that they are going to be opposed to as a political strategy, as a cynical political strategy not to join in partnership on the Aborigina l Justice Inquir y. It is a cheap political trick to say you are not going to do some thing that was not even recommended in the AJI report. It is the nice way to get the headline to say, we are not going to do thi s. in stead of saying to the people of Manitoba why you could not im plement the fir st recommendation of the Aboriginal Justice Inquiry.

If this government has any integrity at all, they will dust off the AJI and start implementing the recommendations that have been before thei r cabinet for the last five or si x years. They have no credibi lity when it comes to First Nations people, when it comes to us, because they have done nothing except cut back the programs for our people. Madam Speaker, I have mentioned New Careers and I have mentioned access. I would wish the government well on the treaty land entitlement agreement.

We understand that the Prime Minister is going to be in town soon, sometime in March we understand, to talk and announce a framework agreement. We are pleased that they are announcing a framework agreement, but that is not a real treaty land entitlement. I would point out to members opposite that in 19 85 and '86 there was a full treaty land agreement between the provincial government and all the First Nations affected by that treaty land entitlement here in the province of Manitoba, and it was rejected by the federal Progressive Conservative Party of Canada.

Brian Mulroney re je cted the agreement that was made here, and I hope that we can carry through and finally have a treaty land entitlement as articulated in the Speech from the Throne. It is 1 0 years out of date in terrns of what we could have done. We could have been 10 years further ahead if the federal Progressive Conservative Party had been fair to First Nations people rather than being disdainful, as they were in government. Madam Speaker, we have proposed a number of proposals on youth justice. We have had a much more comprehensive set of alternatives than we see from members opposite. The member for St.

Johns (Mr. Mackintosh) and our whole caucus worked together last

March 5, 19 97 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 135 year to provide not just the consequences in the justice system , but hope and opportunity that must be there for our young people to keep them out of gangs and keep them out of offending under the Young Of fenders Act. * (1 550) Madam Speaker, we had the opportunity to attend the Indian and Metis Friendship Cen tre where young people from across our communities were there to present their ideas to the poli ticians, from all pol itical stripes and from all jurisdictions, and, of course, the Minis ter of Justice did not show up at the forum.

In fact, they got into a dispute about whether her invitation was issued long enough before for her to get there. We had the invitation 30 days ahead. The Liberals had the invitation 30 days ahead. They say the former Minis ter of Justice had the invitation 30 days ahead. We belie ve Nelson Sanderson. We do not believe the member for Fort Garry (Mrs. Vodrey) in terms of when that invitation came to the Justice minis ter. But those people had excell ent ideas, excellent proposals. The government or the Premier (Mr. Fi lmon) should have gone down to the friendship centre.

You know, you can travel around the world, but you cannot travel around the comer to li sten to people who have good ideas in our friendship centres to solve youth crime. They had ideas on recreation; they had ideas on jobs; they had ideas on opportunity. I was proud of the fact that many of the ideas that we had worked on last summer were articula ted by the young people themselves in the presentations they made to all of us. Give us hope. Give us opportunity. Give us a chance, and we will say no to crime and yes to our communities. That is the messa ge we got from young people.

Did we see that kind of hope and opportunity from this government? You know, in the very same friendship centre where these ideas came forward the government cut eig ht community workers with the cuts at the Indian-Metis friendship centres. You see, they do not get it. They do not get it. They do not understand that when the Tories cut programs they are breeding crime in our communities. The Tories are the cause of this increased crime in our communities, and hope and opportunity are part of the solution. This is a government that breeds crime. It does not provide opportunity for our young people.

Many of us have been vol unteers in the Boys & Girls Clubs and other organizations. I was the first president of the Boys & Girls Club 20 years ago or maybe even long er-! am dating myse lf. You have to provide opp ortunities. You have to provide those chances for kids to hang out in a more pos itive environment rather than the cuts and despair that we see from members opposite. Oh, yes, they have a few lines sprinkled in the Speech from the Throne, but if I saw the proposals made by young people, they were much more articula te, much bolder than the members opposite.

If that was in the Speech from the Throne, I would have been sta nding up on Monday and doing the hallelu jah chorus for that part of the Speech from the Throne. There is nothing here to provide hope and opportunity for our young people in our inner cities and other areas of Manitoba, and I think it is a disg race in terms of the kind of positive alternatives that we have put forward. Steal our ideas. Xerox them. Coin them for yourselves just like in the Healthy Child program. We do not mind. We put them forward in an early point so that you would steal t

Document details

Collection	Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	36-3-3
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	36th 3rd hansardpdf 3.pdf
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	739bd26c7899fd266f3753828ba8ca1ecb337558

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