British Columbia Hansard — Tuesday, October 20, 2015

20151020am-Hansard-v29n8

British Columbia — Debates (Hansard)

Fourth Session, 40th Parliament OFFICIAL REPORT OF DEBATES OF THE LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY (HANSARD) THE HONOURABLE LINDA REID, SPEAKER ISSN 0709-1281 (P rint) ISSN 1499-2175 (Online) Tuesday, October 20, 2015 Morning Sitting Volume 29, Number 8

PROVINCE OF BRITISH COLUMBIA (Entered Confederation July 20, 1871) LIEUTENANT-GOVERNOR Her Honour the Honourable Judith Guichon, OBC Fourth Session, 40th Parliament SPEAKER OF THE LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Honourable Linda Reid EXECUTIVE COUNCIL Premier and President of the Executive Council .............................................................................................................. Hon. Christy Clark Deputy Premier and Minister of Natural Gas Development and Minister Responsible for Housing ......................Hon.

Rich Coleman Minister of Aboriginal Relations and Reconciliation ......................................................................................................... Hon. John Rustad Minister of Advanced Education ............................................................................................................................... Hon. Andrew Wilkinson Minister of Agriculture ........................................................................................................................................................ Hon.

Norm Letnick Minister of Children and Family Development .......................................................................................................Hon. Stephanie Cadieux Minister of Community, Sport and Cultural Development and Minister Responsible for TransLink ................ Hon. Peter Fassbender Minister of Education ............................................................................................................................................................Hon.

Mike Bernier Minister of Energy and Mines and Minister Responsible for Core Review .....................................................................Hon. Bill Bennett Minister of Environment ..........................................................................................................................................................Hon. Mary Polak Minister of Finance .................................................................................................................................................. Hon.

Michael de Jong, QC Minister of Forests, Lands and Natural Resource Operations......................................................................................Hon. Steve Thomson Minister of Health ............................................................................................................................................................... Hon. Dr. Terry Lake Minister of International Trade and Minister Responsible for Asia Pacific Strategy and Multiculturalism ...........................................................................................Hon.

T eresa W at Minister of Jobs, Tourism and Skills Training and Minister Responsible for Labour ...................................................Hon. Shirley Bond Minister of Justice ...............................................................................................................................................................Hon. Suzanne Anton Minister of Small Business and Red T ape Reduction and Minister Responsible for the Liquor Distribution Branch ........................................................................................................Hon.

Coralee Oakes Minister of Social Development and Social Innovation..............................................................................................Hon. Michelle Stilwell Minister of Technology, Innovation and Citizens' Services ................................................................................................ Hon. Amrik Virk Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure ......................................................................................................................Hon.

Todd Stone Minister of State for Emergency Preparedness ....................................................................................................................Hon. Naomi Y amamoto LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Leader of the Official Opposition ...................................................................................................................................................John Horgan Deputy Speaker .............................................................................................................................................................................. Richard T.

Lee Assistant Deputy Speaker ............................................................................................................................................................... Raj Chouhan Deputy Chair, Committee of the Whole ............................................................................................................................................ Pat Pimm Clerk of the Legislative Assembly ...................................................................................................................................................

Craig James Deputy Clerk and Clerk of Committees ................................................................................................................................. Kate Ryan-Lloyd Sessional Law Clerk ...................................................................................................................................................Roderick MacArthur, QC Sergeant-at-Arms ................................................................................................................................................................................. Gary Lenz

ALPHABETICAL LIST OF MEMBERS Anton, Hon. Suzanne (BC Liberal) .............................. Vancouver-Fraserview Ashton, Dan (BC Liberal).....................................................................Penticton Austin, Robin (NDP) ................................................................................ Skeena Bains, Harry (NDP) ....................................................................Surrey-Newton Barnett, Donna (BC Liberal) ............................................... Cariboo-Chilcotin Bennett, Hon.

Bill (BC Liberal) ...................................................Kootenay East Bernier, Hon. Mike (BC Liberal) ......................................... Peace River South Bing, Dr. Doug (BC Liberal) ................................ Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows Bond, Hon. Shirley (BC Liberal) ...........................Prince George–Valemount Cadieux, Hon. Stephanie (BC Liberal) ................................Surrey-Cloverdale Chandra Herbert, Spencer (NDP) .................................Vancouver–West End Chouhan, Raj (NDP) ........................................................... Burnaby-Edmonds Clark, Hon.

Christy (BC Liberal) ........................................ Westside-Kelowna Coleman, Hon. Rich (BC Liberal) ...........................Fort Langley–Aldergrove Conroy, Katrine (NDP) .............................................................. Kootenay West Corrigan, Kathy (NDP) ..................................................... Burnaby–Deer Lake Dalton, Marc (BC Liberal) ............................................. Maple Ridge–Mission Darcy, Judy (NDP) ..................................................................New Westminster de Jong, Hon. Michael, QC (BC Liberal) ..............................

Abbotsford West Dix, Adrian (NDP)............................................................Vancouver-Kingsway Donaldson, Doug (NDP) ......................................................................... Stikine Eby, David (NDP) ..........................................................Vancouver–Point Grey Elmore, Mable (NDP) ................................................... Vancouver-Kensington Farnworth, Mike (NDP) ............................................................ Port Coquitlam Fassbender, Hon. Peter (BC Liberal) ...................................

Surrey-Fleetwood Fleming, Rob (NDP) .......................................................... Victoria–Swan Lake Foster, Eric (BC Liberal) .......................................................Vernon-Monashee Fraser, Scott (NDP) ............................................................Alberni–Pacific Rim Gibson, Simon (BC Liberal) ............................................. Abbotsford-Mission Hamilton, Wm. Scott (BC Liberal) .................................................Delta North Hammell, Sue (NDP) ....................................................

Surrey–Green Timbers Heyman, George (NDP) .................................................... Vancouver-Fairview Hogg, Gordon (BC Liberal) ............................................... Surrey–White Rock Holman, Gary (NDP) .......................................Saanich North and the Islands Horgan, John (NDP) .......................................................................

Juan de Fuca Hunt, Marvin (BC Liberal) ....................................................Surrey-Panorama Huntington, Vicki (Ind.) ..................................................................Delta South James, Carole (NDP) .........................................................Victoria–Beacon Hill Karagianis, Maurine (NDP) ........................................Esquimalt–Royal Roads Krog, Leonard Eugene (NDP) ............................................................. Nanaimo Kyllo, Greg (BC Liberal) ........................................................................ Shuswap Lake, Hon. Dr.

Terry (BC Liberal) ....................Kamloops–North Thompson Larson, Linda (BC Liberal) .........................................Boundary-Similkameen Lee, Richard T. (BC Liberal) ......................................................Burnaby North Letnick, Hon. Norm (BC Liberal) ..............................Kelowna–Lake Country Macdonald, Norm (NDP) ....................................Columbia River–Revelstoke McRae, Don (BC Liberal) ............................................................

Comox Valley Martin, John (BC Liberal) ..................................................................Chilliwack Morris, Mike (BC Liberal) ..................................... Prince George–Mackenzie Mungall, Michelle (NDP) ..........................................................Nelson-Creston Oakes, Hon. Coralee (BC Liberal) .............................................Cariboo North Pimm, Pat (BC Liberal) .........................................................Peace River North Plecas, Dr. Darryl (BC Liberal) .............................................Abbotsford South Polak, Hon.

Mary (BC Liberal) ..............................................................Langley Popham, Lana (NDP) ...................................................................Saanich South Ralston, Bruce (NDP) ................................................................ Surrey-Whalley Reid, Hon. Linda (BC Liberal) ..................................................Richmond East Reimer, Linda (BC Liberal) ........................................

Port Moody–Coquitlam Rice, Jennifer (NDP) ........................................................................North Coast Robinson, Selina (NDP) .............................................Coquitlam-Maillardville Routley, Bill (NDP) .................................................................. Cowichan Valley Routley, Doug (NDP) ............................................Nanaimo–North Cowichan Rustad, Hon. John (BC Liberal) ................................................

Nechako Lakes Shin, Jane Jae Kyung (NDP) ...............................................Burnaby-Lougheed Simons, Nicholas (NDP) ................................... Powell River–Sunshine Coast Simpson, Shane (NDP) .....................................................Vancouver-Hastings Stilwell, Hon. Michelle (BC Liberal)............................... Parksville-Qualicum Stilwell, Dr. Moira (BC Liberal) ........................................ Vancouver-Langara Stone, Hon. Todd (BC Liberal) .........................

Kamloops–South Thompson Sturdy, Jordan (BC Liberal) ..................................West Vancouver–Sea to Sky Sullivan, Sam (BC Liberal) ...........................................Vancouver–False Creek Sultan, Ralph (BC Liberal) ..................................... West Vancouver–Capilano Tegart, Jackie (BC Liberal) ............................................................Fraser-Nicola Thomson, Hon. Steve (BC Liberal) .......................................Kelowna-Mission Thornthwaite, Jane (BC Liberal) ..........................

North Vancouver–Seymour Throness, Laurie (BC Liberal).................................................Chilliwack-Hope Trevena, Claire (NDP) .................................................................... North Island Virk, Hon. Amrik (BC Liberal) ............................................. Surrey-Tynehead Wat, Hon. Teresa (BC Liberal) .............................................. Richmond Centre Weaver, Dr. Andrew (Ind.) .......................................... Oak Bay–Gordon Head Wilkinson, Hon. Andrew (BC Liberal) ........................ Vancouver-Quilchena Y amamoto, Hon.

Naomi (BC Liberal) ................ North Vancouver–Lonsdale Y ap, John (BC Liberal) ......................................................Richmond-Steveston Vacant .....................................................................Coquitlam–Burke Mountain Vacant ...................................................................... Vancouver–Mount Pleasant LIST OF MEMBERS BY RIDING Abbotsford-Mission ......................................................................Simon Gibson Abbotsford South ..................................................................... Dr.

Darryl Plecas Abbotsford West ...................................................... Hon. Michael de Jong, QC Alberni–Pacific Rim .......................................................................... Scott Fraser Boundary-Similkameen ................................................................ Linda Larson Burnaby–Deer Lake ...................................................................

Kathy Corrigan Burnaby-Edmonds ..........................................................................Raj Chouhan Burnaby-Lougheed .............................................................Jane Jae Kyung Shin Burnaby North .............................................................................. Richard T. Lee Cariboo-Chilcotin ........................................................................Donna Barnett Cariboo North .................................................................... Hon.

Coralee Oakes Chilliwack ......................................................................................... John Martin Chilliwack-Hope ....................................................................... Laurie Throness Columbia River–Revelstoke .................................................. Norm Macdonald Comox Valley.....................................................................................Don McRae Coquitlam–Burke Mountain ....................................................................Vacant Coquitlam-Maillardville...........................................................

Selina Robinson Cowichan Valley ................................................................................ Bill Routley Delta North .........................................................................Wm. Scott Hamilton Delta South...............................................................................Vicki Huntington Esquimalt–Royal Roads .....................................................Maurine Karagianis Fort Langley–Aldergrove ...................................................Hon.

Rich Coleman Fraser-Nicola.................................................................................... Jackie Tegart Juan de Fuca .....................................................................................John Horgan Kamloops–North Thompson ............................................ Hon. Dr. Terry Lake Kamloops–South Thompson ..................................................Hon. Todd Stone Kelowna–Lake Country ..................................................... Hon. Norm Letnick Kelowna-Mission .............................................................. Hon.

Steve Thomson Kootenay East .......................................................................... Hon. Bill Bennett Kootenay West ............................................................................ Katrine Conroy Langley.......................................................................................Hon. Mary Polak Maple Ridge–Mission ..................................................................... Marc Dalton Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows ........................................................ Dr. Doug Bing Nanaimo ...........................................................................

Leonard Eugene Krog Nanaimo–North Cowichan ......................................................... Doug Routley Nechako Lakes ........................................................................ Hon. John Rustad Nelson-Creston ........................................................................Michelle Mungall New Westminster ...............................................................................

Judy Darcy North Coast......................................................................................Jennifer Rice North Island .................................................................................. Claire Trevena North Vancouver–Lonsdale ........................................Hon. Naomi Y amamoto North Vancouver–Seymour ..................................................Jane Thornthwaite Oak Bay–Gordon Head ...................................................... Dr. Andrew Weaver Parksville-Qualicum .......................................................Hon.

Michelle Stilwell Peace River North ................................................................................ Pat Pimm Peace River South ..................................................................Hon. Mike Bernier Penticton............................................................................................ Dan Ashton Port Coquitlam ..........................................................................Mike Farnworth Port Moody–Coquitlam ................................................................Linda Reimer Powell River–Sunshine Coast .................................................

Nicholas Simons Prince George–Mackenzie ............................................................. Mike Morris Prince George–Valemount ...................................................Hon. Shirley Bond Richmond Centre ......................................................................Hon. Teresa Wat Richmond East ..........................................................................Hon. Linda Reid Richmond-Steveston ..............................................................................John Y ap Saanich North and the Islands ....................................................

Gary Holman Saanich South ................................................................................ Lana Popham Shuswap ................................................................................................Greg Kyllo Skeena .............................................................................................. Robin Austin Stikine ....................................................................................... Doug Donaldson Surrey-Cloverdale ....................................................... Hon.

Stephanie Cadieux Surrey-Fleetwood ........................................................... Hon. Peter Fassbender Surrey–Green Timbers ..................................................................Sue Hammell Surrey-Newton ................................................................................. Harry Bains Surrey-Panorama ........................................................................... Marvin Hunt Surrey-Tynehead ......................................................................Hon.

Amrik Virk Surrey-Whalley.............................................................................. Bruce Ralston Surrey–White Rock ....................................................................... Gordon Hogg Vancouver-Fairview ..................................................................George Heyman Vancouver–False Creek ...................................................................Sam Sullivan Vancouver-Fraserview ......................................................Hon.

Suzanne Anton Vancouver-Hastings ....................................................................Shane Simpson Vancouver-Kensington .................................................................Mable Elmore Vancouver-Kingsway..........................................................................Adrian Dix Vancouver-Langara .................................................................Dr.

Moira Stilwell Vancouver–Mount Pleasant ......................................................................Vacant Vancouver–Point Grey .........................................................................David Eby Vancouver-Quilchena ................................................ Hon. Andrew Wilkinson Vancouver–West End ...............................................

Spencer Chandra Herbert Vernon-Monashee ...............................................................................Eric Foster Victoria–Beacon Hill .......................................................................Carole James Victoria–Swan Lake.........................................................................Rob Fleming West Vancouver–Capilano ............................................................. Ralph Sultan West Vancouver–Sea to Sky ..........................................................Jordan Sturdy Westside-Kelowna ................................................................

Hon. Christy Clark Party Standings: BC Liberal 48; New Democratic 33; Independent 2; Vacant 2

CONTENTS Tuesday, October 20, 2015 Morning Sitting Page Routine Business Statements ................................................................................................................................................................................ 9573 Federal election J. Horgan Hon. R.

Coleman Introductions by Members ..................................................................................................................................................... 9573 Tributes ..................................................................................................................................................................................... 9573 Gayle Ballard J.

Horgan Introductions by Members ..................................................................................................................................................... 9573 Introduction and First Reading of Bills ................................................................................................................................ 9574 Bill 41 — Miscellaneous Statutes Amendment Act (No. 3), 2015 Hon. S.

Anton Statements (Standing Order 25B) ......................................................................................................................................... 9574 Return of house posts to Wei Wai Kai Nation in Cape Mudge C. Trevena A Chance to Choose youth employment program L. Reimer Conservation G. Holman Screen-based production and film industry J. Thornthwaite Mountain View mental health facility S. Hammell B.C. Hop Fest and craft beer industry D.

Plecas Oral Questions ......................................................................................................................................................................... 9576 Government response to deaths of youth in care and aging out of care J. Horgan Hon. S. Cadieux C. James Child protection system and staffing C. James Hon. S. Cadieux K. Corrigan N. Simons Mountain View facility closing and mental health beds in Fraser Valley S. Hammell Hon. T. Lake J. Darcy Human Rights Tribunal ruling on conduct of College of Veterinarians H. Bains Hon. N. Letnick D.

Eby Motions Without Notice ......................................................................................................................................................... 9581 Membership of Health Committee Hon. M. de Jong

Tabling Documents ................................................................................................................................................................. 9581 Public Guardian and Trustee of British Columbia, annual report, 2014-15 Orders of the Day Committee of the Whole House ............................................................................................................................................ 9581 Bill 38 — Franchises Act (continued) A. Dix Hon. C. Oakes

TUESDAY , OCTOBER 20, 2015 The House met at 10:02 a.m. [Madame Speaker in the chair.] Routine Business Prayers. Statements FEDERAL ELECTION J. Horgan: I rise on behalf of the official opposition to offer my sincere congratulations to Justin Trudeau as the Prime Minister–designate and to all of the candi - dates of all political parties who put their names forward in what was the longest election campaign in 100-some years. Gruelling for the candidates. Whatever their per - spective, I want to tip my hat to all of them for offering up themselves for public service.

We all know in this place the impact that this business has on families and on friends. I'm grateful that the cam- paign is finally over. I'm also grateful that there's a change in the government of Canada. I think we'll all embrace that in the days and weeks and months ahead. Hon. R. Coleman: As the Leader of the Opposition and I both know, a writ period of 28 days can be quite difficult. A long writ period of 70 days….

People and vol- unteers across the country have gone out to make sure Canadians do something that we're very fortunate to be able to do and that is to be able to change our govern - ment at the ballot box. We are honoured by all the people who actually stepped up and ran in the federal election. We congratulate the new government and Prime Minister–elect Trudeau and all the people who actually volunteered and stepped up yesterday.

I also want to congratulate Canadians, particularly the people in the capital regional district of Victoria, because they had a substantial voter turnout yesterday, which to me and to my son who has served in Afghanistan shows that people are actually starting to honour again the sacrifice people make so that we can have the vote in this country. We look forward to working….

This will be the fourth administration federally, and I've worked with every ad- ministration in the last two decades and look forward to the new administration and working with them as well, as does the government of British Columbia. [1005] Introductions by Members Hon. T. Lake: I'd like to introduce a number of guests from the B.C. Lung Association that are in the gallery this morning: board chair Dr. Peter Paré; CEO Scott McDonald; along with board members Richie Gage and Mike Ellis. They're here to meet with me later today. Would the House make them very welcome. Hon. S.

Cadieux: As this House knows, October marks the 25th anniversary of Foster Family Month in B.C. In recognition of this important milestone, we've been paying tribute to the more than 3,000 foster fam - ilies throughout British Columbia who open their hearts and homes to kids and teens in need. Being a foster parent isn't easy, and it requires kind - ness, patience, effort and a lot of love. Today I'd like to celebrate the contributions of some of our longest-serv - ing foster parents. They have been actively foster parent- ing for more than 45 years.

After I read their names, please join me in recognizing them for selflessly embracing the challenges and rewards that go hand in hand with fostering a vulnerable child. Today in the House joining us are Joan and Olympe Astra, Frances Nuttgens, Doreen Klages, Blanche Funk, Mavis and Emelio Bifano, Rose Brittain, and Joan and Harold Hansen. Russell Pohl, president of the B.C. Federation of Foster Parent Associations, and Jayne Wilson, the association's executive director, are also joining us, as are two of our provincial guardianship staff, Connie Epp and Ted Lofto. Please join me in welcoming everyone here today.

Tributes GAYLE BALLARD J. Horgan: It's with great sadness that I rise to advise the House of the passing of Gayle Ballard on September 30. Gayle was constituency assistant for Member of the Legislature Graham Lea as well as Member of Parliament Jim Fulton and the spouse of former Premier Dan Miller. Gayle leaves behind her daughters Elizabeth and Donna, her son Scott, grandchildren Kyle and Lauren, as well as Dan's children, Laura, Jason, and their grandchild, Emily. Gayle was an extraordinary woman — small of stat - ure but fierce of heart.

Her commitment to politics, her commitment to the New Democratic Party and her com- mitment to Dan were unparalleled. I would ask that the House acknowledge her passing as well as advise the House that there will be a memorial service at the Royal Colwood Golf Club on October 24 between 1 and 3 p.m. Introductions by Members Hon. M. Bernier: I know every single member in this House appreciates all the hard work that our constituency assistants do back in our offices while we're busy here in these chambers — what they do for our constituents and what they do for us. 9573

British Columbia Debates9574 Tuesday, October 20, 2015 Usually on Tuesday mornings around this time, my constituency assistant enjoys turning on the TV and watching question period from our office in Dawson Creek, but I'm really honoured to have her down here in the chambers with us today, meeting my new ministry staff, getting to see the building and getting to watch question period face to face with all of us today. I'm hoping everybody will please welcome my constituency assistant Cindy Fisher to the chambers. Hon. C. Oakes: It is my pleasure to introduce two guests into the gallery today.

Paulina Cameron is the business development manager of B.C. and Yukon for Futurpreneur Canada. Prior to Futurpreneur, Paulina worked at KPMG, Vancouver's audit and management consulting practice. As a community leader and an active mentor, Paulina serves as the chair of the YWCA youth advisory council, is the founder of the Young Women in Business, an adviser for LOCO B.C., a mem - ber of the WEB Alliance, and she has been recognized by the Vancouver Board of Trade in the inaugural Wendy McDonald Awards, YWCA for Women of Distinction Awards and the International Alliance for Women Top 100 Award.

As well, we have Emily Lycopolus, the co-founder and co-owner of Olive the Senses, an authentic olive oil and vinegar tasting shop located in the historical Hudson building. She recently launched Eat, Feed, Love — a so - cial enterprise working that is working on a solution for world hunger through facilitating sales on artisanal lo - cal goods on line. She is a proud Futurpreneur-supported entrepreneur and is an active spokesperson for entrepre- neurship both regionally in Victoria and nationally.

Will the House please help join me in making them feel very welcome here today. [1010] Introduction and First Reading of Bills BILL 41 — MISCELLANEOUS STATUTES AMENDMENT ACT (No. 3), 2015 Hon. S. Anton presented a message from Her Honour the Lieutenant-Governor: a bill intituled Miscellaneous Statutes Amendment Act (No. 3), 2015. Hon. S. Anton: I move that the bill be introduced and read a first time now. Motion approved. Hon. S. Anton: I am pleased to introduce Bill 41, Miscellaneous Statutes Amendment Act (No. 3), 2015.

This bill amends the following statutes: College and Institute Act; the University Act; Child, Family and Community Service Act; Utilities Commission Act; and the Interjurisdictional Support Orders Act. I move that the bill be placed on the orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today. Bill 41, Miscellaneous Statutes Amendment Act (No. 3), 2015, introduced, read a first time and ordered to be placed on orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today. Statements (Standing Order 25B) RETURN OF HOUSE POSTS TO WEI W AI KAI NATION IN CAPE MUDGE C.

Trevena: As the rains poured and the wind blew, a very special event took place in Cape Mudge ten days ago: the celebration to mark the return of Chief Billy Assu's house posts, beautifully carved totems that were taken from the community more than 85 years ago. They have been sitting in the Canadian Museum of History in Ottawa, far away from the people and the culture to which they belonged. They will be displayed at Nuymbalees Cultural Centre in the village as part of an exhibit, The Man Behind the Masks: The Life and Legacy of Chief Billy Assu .

One of Chief Billy Assu's great-grandsons, Brad, is carving rep - licas to be sent back to Ottawa. Their return is significant, and it's thanks, in great part, to the work of the board of the Nuymbalees Centre and to Jodi Simkin, the curator, who is tracking down and negotiating the return of cul - tural items from the Wei Wai Kai Nation which are scat- tered around the world. We talk about understanding and reconciliation. The return of those poles is another step in that direction. We know the history of First Nations since contact, and it has been awful.

It's almost 100 years since these posts were taken, at a time of the potlatch ban. The journey through those 100 years has been traumatic, from the loss of land through residential schools to the murdered and missing indigenous women. There are many places where we need to come togeth- er to heal, many places where we need to come together to understand and many places where we should come together to demand change. The idea of reconciliation now underlines so much of our thinking and actions, and so it should. We each need to examine what that recon - ciliation means.

We live as neighbours, and we work as colleagues, and we share this land. Some of us are First Peoples, others are long settled, and some are newcomers. The celebration at Cape Mudge which included the return of the house poles, the exhibition of Chief Assu's Chilkat blanket, on loan from the Canadian Museum of History, and a very welcoming feast for the whole com -

British Columbia DebatesTuesday, October 20, 2015 9575 munity were steps towards a level of understanding and a level of reconciliation. It's not the start of the process, nor is it the end. But we now walk towards the future together with a knowledge and acceptance of the past. A CHANCE TO CHOOSE YOUTH EMPLOYMENT PROGRAM L. Reimer: SUCCESS Tri-City has been serving the fast-growing, multicultural communities in Coquitlam, Port Coquitlam and Port Moody since 1989. Recently I had the opportunity to attend the graduation of students in one of their most important programs.

A Chance to Choose aims to help youth overcome barriers to employ- ment. Getting that first job is the most important step in any career, and A Chance to Choose targets youth such as new immigrants, single parents and people who have various barriers or lack the experience needed to secure employment. Through group-based skills development and work experience with local employers, participants are able to choose and develop a career path. It's 16 weeks in total duration. Participants spend the first six weeks in skills development, followed by ten weeks of paid work experi- ence with an outside employer.

During the initial phase of the program, A Chance to Choose participants also benefit from job search strat - egies and interview skills workshops, and they get a chance to focus on their desired career path and make positive decisions about their future. For the most recent graduates of intake 30, I offer my sincere congratulations.

Y ou are now better equipped for the modern workforce, and you are more confident and comfortable with choosing your own career path. [1015] I ask that all members of this House join me in issu - ing congratulations to our recent graduates and thanking SUCCESS for undertaking this popular and vital pro - gram in the Tri-Cities. CONSERV ATION G. Holman: I rise today in non-partisan praise of conservation as an underappreciated way to reduce our environmental footprint and improve our social and eco- nomic well-being. In a world eventually adding billions to our population, waste not, want not is a must.

In many circumstances, conservation is the most effi- cient way of addressing our growing demand for energy. On a per-dollar-of-expenditure basis, energy conserva - tion measures also generate the highest employment and GDP impacts of any energy investment and increase the net incomes of families and businesses that make such investments. Conservation provides the broadest geo - graphic distribution of benefits. It facilitates flexibility in the face of rapidly changing technology and is the least environmentally damaging energy investment.

A conservation approach applies more broadly to other scarce resources such as water, land and forests. Our waste of these precious resources is endemic, yet too often conservation is an afterthought. How many resi - dential, commercial and industrial buildings in B.C. are effectively heating the great outdoors or literally flushing increasingly costly potable water down the drain? If we utilized our timber more efficiently, could we cre- ate more jobs and preserve more of our critical wildlife habitat and related tourism benefits?

If we better protect- ed our marine environment, would there ultimately be more fish to eat and more whales for tourists to watch? As the old saying goes, they're not making any more land, yet urban development sprawls over the landscape as if it was limitless. Urban sprawl doesn't just destroy green space and food-growing options. It imposes real costs on taxpayers, who must pay for extending road, sewage, water and storm drainage infrastructure. Conservation isn't just about saving the environment.

With burgeoning population growth and increasing scar- city of water, food-growing lands, forests and energy, conservation is a necessity. The good news is that it's a good investment. In short, less is more. SCREEN-BASED PRODUCTION AND FILM INDUSTRY J. Thornthwaite: This summer the province rolled out the red carpet to celebrate the wide range of screen-based entertainment that is created here in B.C.

From film and television production to visual effects, animation and interactive games, this industry supports more than 20,000 direct and indirect jobs and has made B.C. one of the top centres for screen production excellence in North America. To recognize the sector's success, July 27, 2015, was proclaimed Screen in B.C. Day, which coincided with the appointment of Dr. Steven Funk as special envoy of film and digital arts to California and with the opening of a B.C. film and television office in Los Angeles.

Not only does this fulfil our campaign promise to open an of- fice down south, it will also help us embrace our market presence in Hollywood and facilitate new opportunities for B.C.-based producers. B.C.'s film industry is having one of its most success - ful years. In fact, many in the industry have called this summer their busiest ever, thanks to a low dollar and competitive tax credits. Recently I received a letter from Paul Sharpe, president of Sharpe Sound Studios, which is located in North Vancouver and is western Canada's leading audio post- production facility.

Paul wrote to thank our government for its support of B.C.'s post-production sector. Paul has been in the industry for 40 years and has seen many ups and downs. He says the recent downturn

British Columbia Debates9576 Tuesday, October 20, 2015 was one of the worst, but he credits the extension of the digital animation or visual effects tax credit to the post- production industry with saving his business, saying that the day after the extension was announced, the phones started ringing. This is just one of the ways we have followed through on our commitment to support this valuable industry, and I'm proud of the work that we have done. I look for- ward to continuing to support business owners like Paul, whose talent, enthusiasm and expertise have cemented our reputation as Hollywood North.

MOUNTAIN VIEW MENTAL HEALTH FACILITY S. Hammell: Tasked with providing mental health ser- vices to some of our most vulnerable residents, Mountain View Home has served the Abbotsford-Chilliwack com- munity for over 30 years.

Set in an idyllic pastoral setting, Mountain View offers a place where people dealing with serious and persistent mental illness can recover and lead a comfortable and fulfilling life. [1020] Within this rural setting, the residents can take ad - vantage of activities not offered in an urban area such as taking care of livestock, learning garden skills and hav - ing a large open space to reflect when they're experien - cing a difficult day.

In the nearby village of Y arrow, a short bike ride away, we've heard from the community members that residents of Mountain View have been welcomed and become valuable members of the area. Not only does Mountain View offer a calm, tranquil setting where residents can convalesce and get better; they have also had success in providing the skills and resources residents can use to be- come more independent and eventually transition back into the community.

Some of the graduates of Mountain View have told stor- ies of how far down they were upon entering the facility and with the consistent and caring attention of the staff have eventually built up their skills to transition back into independent community living, a future at one time they themselves thought to be impossible. The Newby family and their well-trained and dedicated staff should be com- mended on the efforts they have made over the last 30 years to increase the quality of life and give hope to so many of our most vulnerable and often forgotten residents. B.C. HOP FEST AND CRAFT BEER INDUSTRY D.

Plecas: Early in October, I had the opportunity to celebrate all things hoppy. October is Craft Beer Month in B.C., and I had the pleasure of joining 500 people at B.C. Hop Fest, Canada's first wet-hop beer festival held in Abbotsford. This event brought together B.C. beer, food vendors and entertainment. Held at Kinloch Farms, a working hop farm in Abbotsford, this event celebrated all things local. The B.C. Hop Fest brought together 17 of B.C.'s best breweries to Abbotsford to showcase their fresh beer offerings. Wet-hop beer requires freshly picked hops to be thrown into a brew kettle within 24 hours.

This means that wet-hop beer is only available in early fall at hop har- vest time. The Fraser Valley is one of the best hop-grow- ing environments in the Pacific Northwest. This event celebrates the resurgence of B.C.'s hop-growing industry. Hop farming in B.C. dates back to the 1860s, but it died out in 1990. However, thanks to the province's craft beer boom, hops are once again a feasible crop. There are 113 breweries in B.C., more than three-quarters of which are craft breweries.

Craft beer sales in B.C. have almost tri - pled in the last five years, and many of these craft brew - eries are looking for locally grown hops. I want to extend my congratulations to the organizers of this popular event and wish them good luck in next year's B.C. Hop Fest. Oral Questions GOVERNMENT RESPONSE TO DEATHS OF YOUTH IN CARE AND AGING OUT OF CARE J. Horgan: For months, we've been raising con - cerns about the absence of leadership in the Ministry of Children and Family Development.

Yesterday, we were exposed to the cynical spectacle of the ministry re - sponding to the representative's report on the life of Paige by releasing their response at 3 p.m. the day of the federal election, clearly designed to avoid attention to their re - sponse. Cynicism will do nothing to restore confidence in the ministry. Beyond that, tragically, we learned again last week of the death of another child in care. Nick Lang was just 15 years old when he lost his life. He had been in the care of Children and Families in a voluntary situation.

His par - ents turned over Nick, who had addiction issues, to the ministry so that he could get the appropriate care that he needed to address his addictions. Sadly, he didn't make it through six days in a foster-family home because he didn't have the supports that he needed. My question is to the minister. The family wasn't noti- fied of Nick's death until six days later. Can the minister explain why it is that the ministry put the child in an in- appropriate location and then didn't advise the parents of his death? [1025] Hon. S. Cadieux: I have complete sympathy for Mr.

Lang and his family, given the issue that they're dealing with, dealing with the tragic loss of their son.

British Columbia DebatesTuesday, October 20, 2015 9577 As the member well knows, we cannot talk about spe- cifics of cases in the House. But what I will say is, again, that I understand that a family would want answers in a tragic circumstance like this. In terms of getting those answers, the ministry has ordered an external review, which is nearing completion. Matters like this are also reported to the Representative for Children and Y outh, who can also review. Madame Speaker: The Leader of the Official Oppo - sition on a supplemental. J.

Horgan: While we were away for a week, we learn - ed that the death of Carly Fraser will not be reviewed by the ministry because she died 20 hours 35 minutes after aging out of care. And now we learn that Nick was put in a foster home without adequate supports. The family did the best they could. They weren't given the informa- tion they needed to protect Nick. The result is tragedy — a direct result, I would argue, of policy decisions and funding decisions that have been made by this government and, specifically, this minister. We have seen the lowest number of child protection staff in place in a decade.

That's confirmed by the BCGEU and the children's representative. The minister continues to make the case that things are getting better, but it seems every single day they're getting worse. My question to her is: why is it that her policies and her funding decisions are leaving vulnerable children at risk in British Columbia? Hon. S. Cadieux: The member is wrong. In fact, the front-line staffing for child protection is at its highest in a number of years, with the addition of over 110 new pos- itions over the last year and another 90 scheduled to be hired before January.

We did that in response to work that we had done with the GEU on staffing and workload issues in the min - istry — agreed that more hands were needed. Last year in November, we announced our approach to getting those people on the ground. That included the hiring of 200 new people over the next year, or before January of 2016, and a centralization of a number of administrative functions to take away from some of the administrative burden on those front-line workers so they could spend time with their clients. Madame Speaker: The Leader of the Official Oppo - sition on a further supplemental. J.

Horgan: The suffering of the Lang family didn't end with the passing of their son Nick. After he passed away, Nick's father spoke to the media about their situation, and the response from the ministry was swift. A letter from government lawyers said that Peter may well have breached

section 110 of the Y outh Criminal Justice Act. The family believes this is trying to silence them so they cannot speak about the passing of their son. They got the letter very quickly after speaking to the media even though they had to wait to learn of the pass- ing of their son. Mr. Lang said the following in response to the letter from ministry staff: "I'm surprised by the expeditious action by MCFD on this alleged breach. Perhaps if the ministry was this expeditious with Nick in the spring of 2015, my son would still be alive." Harsh words from a grieving father.

But absolutely outrageous behaviour by the government, protecting it - self rather than protecting children in British Columbia. Certainly, the minister can see — anyone can see — that this type of letter is provocative and absolutely unnecessary. Nick is dead. Peter is grieving, and the government that he put his child in care of writes him a letter telling him to shut up. That's outrageous. Certainly the minis - ter sees that. Madame Speaker: Member. Member. I would caution all members on the use of parliament- ary language. Hon. S. Cadieux: My heart goes out to the Lang family.

They have suffered a very tragic loss, and, as any family would, they want answers. I understand that. That is why an external review is being undertaken, and I expect that we will get the answers to their questions through that review. [1030] I understand that Mr. Lang received a copy of a letter that was sent to his counsel advising of publication re - strictions imposed by legislation. I have spoken to min - istry officials to ensure that their intent was simply to provide information.

I understand that these are very, very difficult issues for the family — very emotional issues, absolutely — and I understand that the legal considerations around this are very challenging for them. But I will look forward to that review and to receiving the information that, hopefully, will give the family some closure. C. James: I'd suggest to the minister and to all of the government that if they gave the children the care they needed, they wouldn't be looking at all these reviews. That's what's needed in this province. Nick left his parents a voice mail three days before he died.

He was clearly in distress, so his parents reached out. They reached out to the social workers for three days. By the time the social workers responded, it was too late. Y et when Peter Lang spoke out to speak out for his son, the government lawyer sent him a letter within 24 hours to silence him. That was the government's priority — send - ing a letter to Peter Lang to keep him quiet. Doesn't the Minister of Children and Families see that her ministry has its priorities completely reversed?

British Columbia Debates9578 Tuesday, October 20, 2015 Hon. S. Cadieux: As I've said, this family is dealing with a very tragic loss. The loss of any child is just un - fathomable. They want answers. I understand that. But every day, the people on the front lines of the Ministry of Children and Families are working to protect children and youth. It is their sole mission. We will wait for the external review to be completed, and as is always the case with the death of a child in care, the representative also has the ability to review should she feel that our review is not sufficient.

Madame Speaker: Victoria–Beacon Hill on a supple- mental. CHILD PROTECTION SYSTEM AND STAFFING C. James: Those workers on the front line are calling out for resources to help them do their job. That's the leadership they're asking for and not getting from this minister and from this government. The children's representative released a report that shows that we have fewer social workers now than we did in 2002.

The result is that children aren't getting the care that they need and that they deserve from the government — children like Nick Lang, like Paige, like Alex Gervais, children like Carly Fraser and Alex Malamalatabua. It's clear that a decade and a half of cuts to this min - istry has left it without the resources it needs to protect children — those workers on the front line without the resources they need to protect children. When will this minister recognize that if she can't deliver the resources, the much-needed resources, to struggling social workers, then she is just part of the problem? Hon. S.

Cadieux: Again, the member is wrong. We have been addressing the staffing issues in the ministry significantly with the addition of 110 new front-line so - cial workers in child protection, and we're on track to hire an additional 90 before the end of the year. The work in child protection is difficult. That is true. The workers do an incredible job working with the fam- ilies and children that they serve.

The complexity of those cases is increasing, and that is adding new and additional challenges to the ministry. [1035] But at the same time, we are having more and more success working with families to keep kids in their homes and not bring them into care, which is why we have the fewest number of children in care as we've had in the last 15 years. K. Corrigan: The independent children's representa- tive said there have only been 19 new social workers — not 110, as the minister knows well — added since last year.

I'm going to take the representative's words over the minister, a minister who seems more interested in pro - tecting herself and her government than in protecting the children of this province. The representative found offices so understaffed they couldn't even answer the phone. The representative had to personally report to the director six incidents where the children were at risk. Children were left for months in dangerous situations because there was no one there to pick up the phone. Is that really the best this government can do?

Why is this government not there for neglected and abused kids in this province? Hon. S. Cadieux: I am certain that my numbers are correct, given that this side of the House pays those salar- ies. I know how many people are on the front line today. The work in this ministry is some of the toughest work in government, and the workers do a tremendous job. As was noted last year in November, when we announced the additional staffing and changes to our workforce….

When we made those announcements last November, we did that with an acknowledgment that there were chal - lenges in offices around the province, most significantly in rural and remote communities, and we have addressed that through this year. Madame Speaker: Burnaby–Deer Lake on a supple - mental. K. Corrigan: Well, the report says that the severe understaffing is not just in rural communities. It's in communities, urban and rural, all across this province.

Over the past two years, the minister didn't even spend her full child protection budget, and the number of children protection workers plummeted to the low - est point in a decade and a half. This minister left more than $5 million on the table, and Paige, Isabella, Alex Gervais, Carly Fraser, Robbie Robinson and Nick Lang paid the price. Will the minister take responsibility for her decision to put saving money above saving these children? Hon. S. Cadieux: On average, the ministry was only spending about 96 percent of its staffing budget because of difficulty recruiting, challenges in how we recruited.

We've made changes. We've changed the way we hire. For MCFD, we are in a constant hiring process so that we have no delays. We are at the highest staffing levels we have ever been at in the ministry — so long as we can look back. We have 110 additional people on the front lines in child protection right now over last year. We will hire an additional 90 before January, and we're well on track to make sure that all of our offices are fully staffed. N. Simons: What makes this situation so troubling for me, as a former social worker, is that this minister and this government have known about this problem

British Columbia DebatesTuesday, October 20, 2015 9579 for years. It's clear that the government used keeping va- cancies open in the Ministry of Children and Families in order to meet their internal budgetary requirements. This goes to the core of the temperament of this govern- ment — that this is where they're going to find their sav - ings, after promising that they never would. [1040] The situation in ministry offices across the province is "perilous," to quote the representative. Social workers are unable to consistently meet the standards.

Y ou think the social workers like it when they can't meet the standards? These social workers are trying. But you know what? They've been frustrated because they've been waiting for support, waiting for people to come and fill up the front lines where it's necessary. I cannot understand how a government can be trusted now, after they've been using vacancies in order to meet budgetary requirements in the Ministry of Children and Family Development. How can the minister reassure us that we can believe them this time? Hon. S.

Cadieux: As I said, after doing significant work with the BCGEU on the challenges our front line was fa- cing, last year, in November, I announced that we would be hiring an additional 200 people to add to that front line, that we had implemented a team of social workers — experienced social workers whose sole job would be to go into offices that were facing shortages in staffing so they could backfill and ensure that those offices had the support they needed while new hires were done. We have doubled the capacity of that team. It's work - ing exceptionally well, and it will continue to stay in place.

And we have 110 new people on the front lines. We've changed the way we're doing business, to take admin - istrative duties away from those social workers so they have more time to spend with their clients. It's working. It takes time to implement. With the changes in how we're now doing our hiring, on a quar - terly basis, we will ensure that we are able to keep all of our front-line spaces filled. MOUNTAIN VIEW FACILITY CLOSING AND MENTAL HEALTH BEDS IN FRASER V ALLEY S. Hammell: Gordon is someone with serious and persistent mental illness.

At 17, he was committed to Riverview, and when it closed, he was transferred to Mountain View. This is the only real home Gordon has known, and he has lived there since 1999. When Gordon learned Mountain View was closing and he would be shuffled to a new facility, his mental health quickly de - teriorated, and he is now in a psychiatric ward at the Abbotsford Regional Hospital. To the Minister of Health, does he think a psychiat - ric ward is a better place for Gordon than the Mountain View Home was? Hon. T. Lake: To the member, I know that she has real concern for these families, as I do as well.

Mental illness can strike any family, and ensuring the right resources are available to those families is extremely important. Fraser Health is making changes in a year, so fam - ilies have been notified of those changes. All the people at Mountain View that want to continue with 24-7 resi - dential care in the same model can do that at the new Marshall Road facility, plus there will be extra oppor - tunities to go into assisted living and independent living with supports, because we know one thing about mental health: it's not a one-size-fits-all proposition.

We have to tailor the response and the resources to each individual. I've asked Fraser Health to make sure we are working with families closely, ensuring that they understand the new model of care, the new opportunities for a continu- um of care that meets the needs of those families. Madame Speaker: Surrey–Green Timbers on a sup - plemental. S. Hammell: Gordon lived a satisfying and meaning - ful life at Mountain View Home for 16 years until this Liberal government's decision to close his home threw him into chaos, a downward spiral his mother isn't sure he will recover from.

To the Minister of Health: as the Minister of Health, how do you justify triggering a crisis in Gordon's life, placing him in a psychiatric ward and closing the only real home he has ever known? [1045] Hon. T. Lake: The member knows very well that we have a regional health authority system that responds to the needs of the population that they serve. In this case, Fraser Health is proposing changes to the way that men- tal health services are provided to some families.

I believe those changes will result in greater care for families, for more opportunities for families and their loved ones who are receiving treatment to have a continuum of care that will allow them to be reintegrated back into community. When we make changes — because change is always dif- ficult — those changes must be made with the patients and their families.

This is why I've asked Fraser Health to spend time with each of these families to make sure they under- stand the nature of the change, so they can reassure them that they will have opportunities to have a continuum of care that meets their needs, and Fraser Health will do that. J. Darcy: The minister talks about change. Let's be clear what this change means. There will be a net loss of 25 beds for people with the most severe mental health issues, like schizophrenia — that's what the change means — and about 400 less beds than Fraser Health said it needs by 2016.

The minister says he's concerned about the fam - ilies. Well, we've heard firsthand from the residents of

British Columbia Debates9580 Tuesday, October 20, 2015 Mountain View Home that before they lived there, they were living on the street. Many of them were battling addiction. It was only through the work and the dedica- tion of the staff that they have recovered enough to lead satisfying and hopeful lives. Many of these residents have told us that with the closure of Mountain View, they worry about being back on the street, or worse. This is unacceptable. The residents and families and staff of Mountain View deserve better from this government. My question is to the Minister of Health.

Will you bring calm to the lives that you've disrupted and commit to keeping Mountain View open? Hon. T. Lake: The member is just wrong. This is not a reduction. In fact, the 25-bed Mountain View Home…. The change will allow the funding to be reinvested in the new 50-bed Marshall Road residential campus. Going from 25 to 50 is not a reduction. In fact, the change increases the number of mental health beds in the community from 58 to 68 and provides a wider range of services, as I mentioned.

When Marshall Road opens in 2016, Fraser Health will have increased the mental health housing capacity in Abbotsford by 62 spaces since 2007 and by 450 spaces across all of Fraser Health, with a budget increase in the last three years of 15 percent. That is not a reduction. That is an increase in sup- ports to families and patients dealing with mental health. HUMAN RIGHTS TRIBUNAL RULING ON CONDUCT OF COLLEGE OF VETERINARIANS H.

Bains: For over a decade, Indo-Canadian veterinar- ians have been fighting the racism directed against them by their own college, the college of veterinary medicine, formerly known as the B.C. veterinary medical associa - tion. For the past decade, this side of the House has been bringing up this issue with minister after minister after minister, and every minister's response has been: "It's be- fore the tribunal, so we cannot comment." Well, the tribunal has issued a ruling, one that has been over a decade in the making, and it's unequivo - cal. It's clear.

The college is guilty of systemic racial dis - crimination. My question is to the Minister of Justice. What will she do to ensure that the tribunal's order is implemented and enforced immediately? [1050] Hon. N. Letnick: On this side of the House as well as on the other side of the House, we do not stand for ra - cism in any form in British Columbia. Indeed, that's why I met with the hon. member this past year to discuss the issue. We did say at that time that we sympathize are the veterans that had brought forward their case. I understand the college is reviewing the decision. It's over 2,000 pages.

I think it's important to provide them an opportunity to review the case and make their com - ments known before I comment any further, specifically, on what we would do. Madame Speaker: The member for Surrey-Newton on a supplemental. H. Bains: It's good for the Minister of Agriculture to stand up. It is the Minister of Justice's responsibility to make sure the law is enforced in this province.

From the ruling: "The BCVMA engaged in systemic discrimination." Another quote: "I have concluded that there were specific instances of discrimination against individual complainants." Another quote: "The BCVMA is ordered to cease discrimination." If this doesn't embarrass and bring shame to this gov- ernment, I don't know what will. After spending millions in legal fees and ten years of process, the college is still refusing to follow the order.

My question, again, to the Minister of Justice is: is she going to put an end to this discrimination, or will she continue to hide behind the independent office of the college and continue to allow the college to do what they've been doing — discrimination against their own members? Hon. N. Letnick: The B.C. government respects the decisions of the human rights tribunal. It also respects the independence of the tribunal in coming to their deci- sions. I find it quite puzzling and actually disconcerting that the member opposite would try to make this into a political issue, when, indeed, it is not.

The decision against the veterinarians is a serious one. It's a serious one that requires the veterinarians to look at the report and then make their comments known as to what they plan on doing. Once they've done that, the government will be very happy to provide comment. D. Eby: We have college in British Columbia that's been found to have been engaging in racist and dis - criminatory conduct. It took ten years for the veterinar- ians to get to this point. It took more than $1 million for them to get to this point.

This human rights tribunal system was set up to protect the most vulnerable people in our society. Clearly, it is not working. Why is the Attorney General tolerating a hu - man rights tribunal system that takes ten years and more than $1 million to reach a finding of discrimination and racism and not acting when a college defies their order? Hon. N. Letnick: Again, we expect all organizations in the province to respect the human rights of every citizen in this province. Again, I find it quite astounding that the members opposite would try to make this into a political issue.

The college of veterinarians reports to the Minister of Agriculture. I've been following the file, along with the

British Columbia DebatesTuesday, October 20, 2015 9581 members opposite. We have met to discuss this matter. We said we would take the appropriate action. We will look at the results of the feedback of the com- ments from the college after they've had a chance to look at the report. It's over 2,000 pages, I understand. And then the members opposite will have their answer. [End of question period.] Motions Without Notice MEMBERSHIP OF HEALTH COMMITTEE Hon.

M. de Jong: By leave, I move: [That Marc Dalton, MLA be appointed to replace Richard Lee, MLA as a Member of the Select Standing Committee on Health.] Motion approved. Tabling Documents Hon. S. Anton: I have the honour to present the Public Guardian and Trustee of B.C. annual report 2014-2015. [1055] Orders of the Day Hon. M. de Jong: Continued committee stage debate on Bill 38, the Franchises Act. Committee of the Whole House BILL 38 — FRANCHISES ACT (continued) The House in Committee of the Whole (Section

B) on Bill 38; R. Chouhan in the chair. The committee met at 10:58 a.m. On

section 5 (continued). A. Dix: Obviously,

section 5, "Disclosure," is an im - portant

section of the legislation. To start on a sort of secondary issue, first of all…. Then we'll get into, probably, if it pleases the minister, the discus- sion of the regulations on this section, rather than in the regulations

section pursuant to this section, if that works. We can do it the other way as well. It's not a problem. I guess the first question around this question of dis - closure I'd like to ask is…. We're now in a period where, hopefully, in the next short period of time, the bill will pass the Legislature. It will receive royal assent, and then we'll be in a period where we have a bill passed by the Legislature awaiting regulations. [1100] Can the minister describe the intent of the govern - ment with respect to preceding the regulations? We could be in a period where we have — a fairly lengthy period, potentially….

In this case, of course, in the information provided by the B.C. Law Institute, we have, fortunately, regulations laid out as well — which, I presume, the min- ister is intending to guide the government in terms of its proclamation of the regulations. Can the minister, just for starters, talk about, in terms of timing, when she sees the government proceeding with the regulations pursuant to the Franchises Act? Hon. C. Oakes: I would like, if I may, to introduce…. I have new staff today, so I would like to introduce them. We have Renee, Nancy and Christine with us to support us through these proceedings today.

We will be continuing to work with the advisory group as well as the B.C. Law Institute on the regulations. The preliminary work — as the member opposite did note, they have been working through what those regulations will look like. As far as timing, we do need to work with the bar asso- ciation as well as the franchise association to ensure…. As the hon. member opposite mentioned in our previous dia- logue, it's important that we have the necessary education and that both the franchise and the bar associations under- stand the regulations that will actually put the act in force. A.

Dix: Just to follow up with that. And perhaps the minister…. Sometimes it's important, when people have questions, to get the full names of her team there. It would be helpful the next time around. In terms of the timing, therefore…. The minister talked about further consultation with the bar association, and the minister talked about talking to associations of fran- chisors. Is the minister…? Presumably, the minister and the government intend to talk to franchisees as well.

It seems, to me anyway, that in terms of the classes of people involved in this process, the two most important — who will see the most change in their business struc - ture — are franchisors who principally do business in British Columbia. Franchisors who do business across Canada almost certainly will have been in contact with a franchise act such as this, given the parallels with Ontario and Alberta and Manitoba, etc. — and obviously fran - chisees in the province. So presumably, the consultation will include that.

I think, just to come back to the question of timing, this is often important in terms of we will be in a legisla- tive period where people will have heard that there are protections in place without those protections actually being in place — this period of regulation. [1105] Y ou don't want, in fact, a delay on the side of regu - lations to defer the positive economic effects of the legislation for too long. The minister talked about the

British Columbia Debates9582 Tuesday, October 20, 2015 consultations, but in terms of the timing of those consul- tations, how long does she expect them to take? Hon. C. Oakes: I would like to put on record the full names. Thank you for that good piece of advice. We have Nancy Carter, Renee Mulligan and Christine Little join- ing us today. For the question on the timing — first of all, if I may put a clarification for that, it is the franchises. The dia - logue was just not specifically about the education of franchisors. It was franchises and franchisors.

I think what is critically important also in this specific piece, to ensure that the legal community has full time to understand the specifics of this legislation and the regu- lations that we'll be bringing into force, is the legal team that supports the franchisees and franchisors when they are signing these kinds of documents. As well, it's im - portant to note that the regulations that we put forward supporting this legislation needs to meet B.C. drafting conventions.

We need to ensure that the conjunction with other laws that are currently in place in British Columbia is in force when we're looking at the regulations. Perhaps it might be important for the member oppos- ite to understand some of the types of disclosure informa- tion that we'll be looking at as we go through the dialogue around regulations.

It's looking at information around audited financial statements; the business background of the franchisor, such as directors; details on any fraud convictions or civil lawsuits or bankruptcies; franchisees' cost of establishing the franchise; other fees; franchisors' policies and guarantees; annual operating costs; earning projection statements; terms and conditions of the finan- cing arrangements.

Training and other assistance provided — manuals, no manuals; advertising; marketing funds; franchisors' obli- gations to conduct marketing; rebates and commissioners; policies around location areas, proximity between existing franchisees; rights to trademarks; licence, registration permissions required under the law; and termination of agreements — those are the types of things that we'll be in dialogue on with the advisory group that we have in place as we look from the preliminary side of what regulations will be put in force to put this legislation in force as well.

That kind of gives you a general idea of the type of work that needs to be put in place before this can be enforced. [1110] A. Dix: The minister has referred to the subjects. All of the subjects she mentioned are included in the draft regulation provided by the B.C. Law Institute. Is the min- ister confirming that all of those aspects will be touched on in the regulations? Hon. C. Oakes: The disclosure regulations will have the same requirements as the other five provinces in Canada with franchise legislation.

We will be reviewing the items that we identified ear - lier as part of the wholesome dialogue around the types of information that need to be included in regulation. But we'll also be ensuring that there is that fulsome conver - sation, because it has to, again, meet B.C. drafting con - vention. As well, it needs to be working in conjunction with other B.C. laws. A. Dix: Just as a matter of curiosity. I've been in touch…. We've dealt with some cases with a few fran - chise lawyers in B.C.

Almost all of the ones who deal prominently with franchises in B.C. were already in - volved in the consultation and are fully involved in this process, so I suspect there wasn't any major objection to the Franchises Act legislation coming forward. I'll just try one more time, and then we'll move on. But I want just one more time to…. To be specific, does the minister have a plan in terms of the bringing into force of this law?

We are in one of those periods where a per - son might reasonably believe that the law supports them, but for the next six months, until it comes into force, it won't — or eight months or a year or 18 months or two years or longer than that. I guess I wanted to ask the minister what her plan was, if she was…. If a potential franchisee came to her and said, "I want to wait until I have the protections of this law to make this investment," how long should they wait? Hon. C.

Oakes: Our plan moving forward is to con - tinue the work that we did with the advisory committee that worked very diligently on ensuring that we have this legislation. We'll be working on an education campaign with the franchise community. That includes both fran - chisors and franchisees. As well, we'll be working with the legal community to ensure that the information is out there. As the member opposite did mention, the legal community seems up to date if they've worked in other provinces on this. We want to ensure that we are enhancing upon that.

As well, I think what's critically important — and we mentioned that in the previous sections…. One of the things that is important about the B.C. Franchises Act that we're implementing is we're really taking the op - portunity to learn what the five other provinces that have implemented a franchises act…. [1115] We've learned opportunities for us to improve upon this legislation. We've seen it in the legislation. We plan to continue that work of identifying where work has been done on the regulation side with the other five provinces.

If there are elements that we can improve upon, we are certainly committed to doing that. I think an important example of that — it's just one of many examples on the legislation side — is that we heard loud and clear that there needed to be an ability to send the disclosure documents via e-mail. In previous versions,

British Columbia DebatesTuesday, October 20, 2015 9583 it was by fax, by registered mail. One of the things that we felt critically important in this legislation was that it was modern. It was up to date. We will be ensuring that the regulations are modern, up to date, learning best practi- ces from the other five provinces. A. Dix: The minister referred to their education plan. Perhaps the minister could describe that.

In addition, it seems to me reasonable, at least, that some documents be provided in a number of other lan - guages than English in British Columbia — for example, Chinese text, Vietnamese, Korean, Punjabi and other lan- guages. Is that the government's intention? Hon. C. Oakes: We will continue to work with the Canadian Franchise Association and various organiza - tions that work directly with stakeholders in the franchise community. We will also work with the organizations that provide the legal-education support for….

We will be providing that to those educational organizations that support educating members of the bar. We should also remember that because these are con- tractual agreements between franchisees and franchis - ors, that is the scope of the work that we will be moving forward with. A. Dix: Surely the most important part of the edu - cation would be for potential franchisees.

After all, the thrust of this legislation, on the whole, is to protect their rights, to level the playing field between franchisors and franchisees, to both create opportunity but also to pro - vide legal support and protection and clarity for fran - chisees. The minister referred, for example, to the issue of elec- tronic transmission. One might argue that the Electronic Transactions Act provides that already. But one of the strong arguments to put it clearly in this act is so that someone reading the act will know that that fulfils that provision clearly.

So a potential franchisee would know that, receiving something by e-mail, they don't have to refer to another act. It's right here in their legislation. [1120] The education campaign, as described by the minis - ter, is to talk to organizations and to the bar. Presumably, though, because I asked the question…. I don't know if the minister was responding no to what I was saying or whether she was just avoiding what I was saying. I'll try it again. I mean, what material will be provid - ed from the government of British Columbia to poten - tial franchisees to inform them of their rights under this new legislation?

Hon. C. Oakes: I know that we canvassed this ques - tion with the hon. member from Burnaby. The education campaign will be providing information about the new Franchises Act on a website, ensuring the information gets out to the Canadian Franchise Association as well as the legal community. As well, we will be reaching out to the small business community. Y ou are right. The franchise community in British Columbia working closely with small business associations is also critically important. Thank you for bringing that forward. We'll make sure we add the small business community in that education process as well.

A. Dix: I specifically asked whether the minister in - tended to provide information about the new Franchises Act in languages other than English. [1125] Hon. C. Oakes: The service providers that we listed in a previous answer on the education side are largely out of the scope of government. These organizations — such as the bar association, the franchise association, the Canadian Bar Association…. We will certainly work closely with them to provide them with information, supporting them on what the Franchises Act looks like.

These organizations, in turn, part of whose responsibil - ities is ensuring that their stakeholders have that edu - cation component, will work with their franchisor and franchisee stakeholders. A. Dix: When the minister referred earlier to an edu - cation campaign being necessary before bringing the bill into force, she meant somebody else's education cam - paign, it sounds like. I guess I'll ask, since the minister didn't respond to…. I tried to make it more direct — just one sentence, the last question.

I'll ask it again, directly, because the min - ister didn't answer, in fact, the member for Burnaby- Lougheed on this question and hasn't answered me so far. Will the government be taking, on its own accord, an effort to ensure that information about the new Franchises Act…? Given what we all know in British Columbia is the great interest from, especially, new im - migrant communities in investing in this form of small business, will the government provide information about the new Franchises Act, which changes and levels the playing field in this important area of business, in lan - guages other than English?

Hon. C. Oakes: I have answered this question on num- erous occasions. I'm sorry if it's not the answer that the member wants to perceive. To be clear, our educational component, as it is with other legal legislation that we put in place, is that we work with our stakeholders. In this particular case, our plan on education is that we will be providing information on the new Franchises Act to the Canadian Franchise Association. We will be providing this information to the bar asso- ciation. We will be providing this information to organ-

British Columbia Debates9584 Tuesday, October 20, 2015 izations that directly work with stakeholders to ensure that they are informed on the new Franchises Act. We will work closely with these stakeholders to ensure that they have the material they need to provide that educa - tion to that community. We've answered this question. This is how the educa - tional plan is to move forward. A. Dix: Y ou ask directly: "Will information be provid- ed by the government in languages other than English?" Now, there are only three possible answers to that ques- tion from the minister. One is yes. The other is no.

It's a helpful question. It's not intended to trap the minister in any possible way. There is either: "Y es, we will do that" or "No, we will not do that." The minister wanted No. 3. I think No. 3 will really help the minister here. So No. 3 is: "Good idea. We'll take a look at it." Instead, we get stuff like: "We'll be reaching out to the advisory group." [1130] In fact, the minister said she has answered that one direct question, which I thought would take about 12 seconds to answer, and she has routinely not answered the question. Now, I'm hopeful, given these three possible answers, that we might get No. (

c) this time. The answer was asked, yes, directly by the member for Burnaby-Lougheed. It was asked by me three times. That's the only question I want to ask. Is the minister go- ing to do that? I think it's a reasonable question. Not one that I wanted to ask five times, but as I await an answer to a pretty reasonable and simple question, I'll give the minister another chance to do so. Hon. C. Oakes: The member opposite, I'm sure, is familiar with the B.C. bar association.

I'm not sure if the member opposite is suggesting for one moment that government start to dictate to the B.C. bar association on the forms and types of information on the informa - tion that we put out. This is not a government program. Information will be available on a website. We'll work closely with organiza- tions that provide education to stakeholders. A. Dix: I mean, that is ridiculous. It is ridiculous. People have heard five times a very simple question asked. We're not dictating to the Canadian Bar Association. This isn't the annual general meeting of the Canadian Bar Association we're holding here.

It's the Legislative Assembly of British Columbia, where we're passing a law called the Franchises Act. The minister raised the fact that the government couldn't say, in a previous non-answer, when the regu - lations would be ready because one of the things they were doing was an education campaign. So reasonably, as a member of the opposition, I asked: "Well, what is the education campaign?" Apparently, the minister wants to educate the people who essentially drafted the legislation. We want, and I think the minister should want, to inform the people of B.C. who will have to follow the act.

It's pretty straight - forward. I have the Hansard from the Thursday before our break. The minister didn't answer it then. Will the min - ister, in the government's information…? The minister referred to a website that will contain the government's information. Will she provide pamphlets or information on the website that she referred to in the education campaign that she said she was going to do, the government was going to do…? Will she provide that in - formation in languages other than English? Hon. C. Oakes: This act is about the law of contracts for franchises.

Franchisees and franchisors, as we said before, rely on their lawyers. We intend to post, on the Ministry of Small Business, the information. We are happy to work with multicultural organizations. If they have stakeholders that would like this information translated, we'd be happy to work with multicultural or- ganizations as part of the other organizations that we'll be working with on this campaign. [1135] A. Dix: Well, I'm inspired by the progress that we've made already. I think it's okay that that was answer No. 6 instead of answer No. 1. To each their own.

On one of the questions that's going to be a key ele - ment of disclosure and that is a very challenging element of disclosure with respect to franchisors and franchisees is the issue of earnings projections. The minister referred to this in her answer to a previous question, to this be - ing one of the issues that will be governed by regulations pursuant to the Franchises Act. Some people analyzing franchise acts have argued that this issue of earnings projections and what is required to satisfy…. Remember you are talking about a disclosure document not referring to material facts but referring to projections.

Some would argue that the terms by which that — which is very important…. Y ou're going to get a franchise in food services, and you're told that it will produce $500,000 in revenue in the course of a year, in a projection in that neighbourhood, based on certain market conditions. Y ou're not providing a material fact. It hasn't happened yet, because obviously, the franchise agreement isn't in place. Can the minister describe why — as the Manitoba Law Reform Commission proposed, and others — the gov - ernment has decided…?

I think it's reasonable that they decided to deal with that in regulation, but I just want to ensure that they are. How does the government want to deal with this critical issue of projections, which will be an important part of any disclosure agreement between franchisees and franchisors?

British Columbia DebatesTuesday, October 20, 2015 9585 Hon. C. Oakes: It is exactly the type of important dia- logue and work that is necessary to look at. I think the member opposite is looking more at the earning projec- tions as pertain in

section 7. But the type of disclosure information that I had previously listed in the questions are exactly…. When we're looking at the regulation, they're critically important. That's why we need to be ensuring that we're meeting with the advisory group and that we are making sure those regulations are as fulsome as possible. A. Dix: The minister is confirming that this issue of financial projection will be dealt with in the regulations. Hon. C.

Oakes: As I had mentioned in a previous an- swer, earning projections are one of the items that I had listed around disclosure information that we'll be re - viewing under regulation. A. Dix: Is it the minister's view…?

The definition of "material fact" means "any information about the busi - ness, operations, capital or control of the franchisor or franchisor's associate, or about the franchise or the fran- chise system, that would reasonably be expected to have a significant effect on the value or price of the franchise to be granted or on the decision to acquire the franchise." Does that apply to projections? [1140] Hon. C. Oakes: The regulations, obviously, have not been drafted, so it is in the realm of speculation that we are looking at. But we've listed the types of disclosure in- formation that we will be looking at.

It is very possible and likely to be included as…. The items that we had pre- viously listed as disclosure information could…. It is very likely to be a material fact. A. Dix: Are projections, according to the government, matters of material fact? Hon. C. Oakes: Again, it depends on what disclosure information will be identified within the regulation. A. Dix: Of course, in this case, we have a draft of the regulations with respect to the disclosure document. That may not always be the case, although often it's the case with legislation already.

I'm asking, under the definition of "material fact" that exists in the legislation and under this provision on dis - closure, whether a projection would be a matter of ma - terial fact. That's a simple question. Hon. C. Oakes: Again, what the member opposite was…. A preliminary, through the B.C. Law Institute, on what the regulations could look like…. Again, it's speculative, because we have to do the work with the advisory group to determine exactly what will be included as part of the disclosure information. So at this point, it's speculative.

It is likely to be included, but at this point, without us having actually drafted the regu- lation, we can't answer that question. A. Dix: The minister has repeatedly said this is based on an improvement on other province's legislation, so it's hard to imagine that it wouldn't be there. The definition of "material fact," which we have dealt with previously here, as it applies to

section 5, "Disclosure," "means any information about the business, operations, capital or control of the franchisor or fran - chisor's associate." Why is it so hard to say whether the issue of projec - tions would be treated as a material fact? [1145] B. Routley: I seek leave to make an introduction. Leave granted. Introductions by Members B. Routley: I'd like to thank this House for this oppor- tunity to welcome these guests from the Cowichan Valley. We have with us today a group from Queen Margaret's School, which is in the Duncan area, in the Cowichan Valley.

There are 28 grade 11 students, two adults and their teacher Ms. Alison O'Marra-Armstrong. Please join me in welcoming these guests. Debate Continued Hon. C. Oakes: The hon. member opposite wants us to make a commitment on a regulation that currently doesn't exist. A. Dix: I'm merely asking about the application of the law to this

section on disclosure. Apparently, the gov - ernment doesn't know whether a projection constitutes information. In any event, my next question. Because we don't have too much time, I'll do some shorter questions so we get to the more substantive ones on this

section of the bill after the lunch break. With respect to

Section 5(10) — I'll just jump ahead within

Section 5, if I have your permission, hon. Chair — is the government of British Columbia a franchisor at present? Hon. C. Oakes: Y es, indeed, our government is a fran- chisor. We provide the WorldHost Training Services for customer service. In fact, I am a SuperHost trainer — so very familiar with the WorldHost program. A. Dix: With respect to the issue of exemptions from

British Columbia Debates9586 Tuesday, October 20, 2015 this provision of the Franchises Act…. I'm just doing a couple of short questions until we return to the main subject of this section. One of the possible exemptions from that is: "…if the prospective franchisee is investing an amount greater than a prescribed amount in the ac - quisition of a franchise." [1150] This is one area where the different jurisdictions have a different view of what that constitutes. I'm wondering whether the minister prefers Alberta or New Brunswick. Hon. C.

Oakes: I think the member opposite was just testing us, because, of course, Alberta and New Brunswick don't have this particular…. We've looked at the Ontario model, and we've looked at how we can im- prove upon that. A. Dix: Y ou like the Ontario model. That's good. The members opposite try and be obscure about which fed - eral party they're supporting. I was actually trying to fig- ure that out for the minister. But that's okay. Just to deal with a couple of the minor questions before lunch. The provision in

section 5(11)…. Can the minis - ter just describe the intent of saying that the act doesn't apply in cases where the sole subject of the franchise agreement is the designation of a particular location or area for the franchise? Hon. C. Oakes:

Section 5(11). We want to ensure that we don't trigger disclosure…. Obviously, when we talk about the disclosure documents, we're talking about a large set of information that can, as we have discussed, be included. In addition to that, there are ancillary docu- ments, and those could be confidentiality agreements. It could be location agreements. One of the things we want to ensure in this

section is that we don't want to create the ability to trigger the rescission remedy under this act. The Chair: Member, noting the hour. A. Dix: Hon. Chair, noting the hour…. The Speaker gives me a hard time about this all the time. I always like to ensure the highest level of productivity, usually at five to seven on a Wednesday night. But given that thoughtful request from the Chair, I move that the committee rise, report progress and ask leave to sit again. Motion approved. The committee rose at 11:55 a.m. The House resumed; Madame Speaker in the chair.

Committee of the Whole (Section B), having reported progress, was granted leave to sit again. Hon. T. Lake moved adjournment of the House. Madame Speaker: This House, at its rising, stands ad- journed until 1:30 this afternoon. The House adjourned at 11:56 a.m.

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Document details

Collection	British Columbia — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	20151020am-Hansard-v29n8
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	20151020am Hansard v29n8
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	7716a5a57cfcb0ed9c2fdfc58d95103ba7bbde2d

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