Alberta Hansard — 7 June 1989, Afternoon sitting (14:30) (Legislature 22, Session 1)

19890607

Alberta — Debates (Hansard)

June 7, 1989 ALBERTA HANSARD 103 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF ALBERTA Title: Wednesday, June 7, 1989 2:30 p.m. Date: 89/06/07 [The House met at 2:30 p.m.] [Mr. Speaker in the Chair] PRAYERS MR. SPEAKER: Let us pray. We give thanks to God for the rich heritage of this province as found in our people. We pray that native-born Albertans and those who have come from other places may continue to work together to pre serve and enlarge the precious heritage called Alberta. Amen. head: INTRODUCTION OF BILLS MR. HORSMAN: Mr. Speaker, I would move that private member's public Bill 223,

An Act to Amend the Emblems of Alberta Act, sponsored by Mr. Moore, be placed on the Order Paper under Government Bills and Orders. [Motion carried] head: TABLING RETURNS AND REPORTS MR. SPEAKER: Minister of Education. I'm sorry; the Chair apologizes and recycles its mind to this present Legislature. The Minister of Health. MRS. BETKOWSKI: Mr.

Speaker, I'm pleased to file with the Assembly the following audited financial statements for the year ended March 31, 1988: Alberta Cancer Board, Alberta Hospital Ponoka, Alberta Children's Provincial General hospital, Foothills Provincial General hospital, and Glenrose Rehabilita tion hospital. MRS. McCLELLAN: Mr. Speaker, I'm pleased to table with the Assembly four copies of the 1987-88 annual report of the Alberta Hail and Crop Insurance Corporation. DR. WEST: Mr. Speaker, I rise to table four copies of the an nual review and financial statements of the Alberta Sport Coun cil.

Both the review and financial statements are for the year ended March 31, 1988. MR. BRADLEY: Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to file with the Assembly the 1988 annual report of the Alberta Research Council. head: INTRODUCTION OF SPECIAL GUESTS MRS. BETKOWSKI: Mr. Speaker, I am delighted to introduce a group of young students from the Laurier Heights school in the Edmonton-Glenora constituency. There are 29 students in our members' gallery, who are accompanied by their teacher Mrs. Woodrow and parent Mrs. Lewis, and I would ask them to rise and receive a cordial welcome of this Assembly. MR.

SPEAKER: The Minister of Public Works, Supply and Services, followed by the Member for Edmonton-Mill Woods. MR. KOWALSKI: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. This afternoon I would ask the Assembly to join with me in welcom ing a very delightful delegation of six young students from the Meadowview school, accompanied by their teacher Mr. Wesley Oginski. Meadowview school is located to the west of Bar rhead. I'd ask our visitors to please rise. MR. GIBEAULT: Mr. Speaker, I'd like to introduce to you and to members of the Assembly my constituent Mr. Terry Spencer, who works with the group Workers with Injuries.

He's in the gallery, and I'd ask him to stand and receive the warm welcome of the House. MR. ANDERSON: Mr. Speaker, I'm pleased to introduce to you and to members of this Assembly five students and two teachers from the Lyc£e Louis Pasteur school in my con stituency. They're up visiting today and, I trust, will enjoy the session of the Legislature as well as other things that they're seeing today. I would ask them to stand. They're in the mem bers' gallery. The teachers are Alexis Aitken and David Levy, and I'm sure we'll all want to welcome them in the traditional manner. MR. MUSGROVE: Mr.

Speaker, it's my pleasure this after noon to introduce to you and to the rest of the Assembly a group of 16 grade 8 students from Rosemary school. They are sitting in the public gallery, and they're accompanied by their teacher Mr. Blumell, parents Mrs. Merle Blumell, Donna Janzen, and Hildy Penner. I would ask them to now rise and receive the warm welcome of the Assembly. MR. WOLOSHYN: Mr. Speaker, I'd like to introduce to you and through you to the members of the Legislature 20 students from Stony Plain elementary school. They are accompanied by their teacher Milton Mellott.

I'd like to point out that this par ticular group of students does have a parliamentary club in prac tice. They are seated in the public gallery, and I'd like them to rise and receive the traditional welcome of the House. MR. ZARUSKY: Mr. Speaker, I'd like to introduce to you and through you to the rest of the Assembly a fine group of students from the Andrew high school, grades 10 and 12 students. Let me tell you that they had their graduation last weekend, and it was a class occasion. I'm sure we've got some future politi cians in there. They're accompanied by their teachers Mr. Allen Dubyk and Mr.

Harry Bidniak and their bus driver Lorne Lakusta. They're seated in the members' gallery, and I'd ask that they rise and receive the warm welcome of the Assembly. MR. ADAIR: Mr. Speaker, it's my pleasure to introduce to you and through you to the members of this Assembly the mayor of one of Alberta's fastest growing communities, the home of the Daishowa pulp mill that will be built by the good people of Daishowa: Mike Procter. Would you kindly stand and receive the warm welcome of this Assembly.

104 ALBERTA HANSARD June 7, 1989 head: ORAL QUESTION PERIOD Alberta's Relations with China MR. MARTIN: Mr. Speaker, I'd like to direct the first question to the Deputy Premier. Last week's slaughter of Chinese stu dents is evolving, I believe, into much more than a temporary state of repression. It's clearer every day that it seems the hard liners, better known as conservatives, are taking over and be coming more and more repressive. I say that it looks, unfor tunately, like this situation could be more permanent than tem porary.

On Monday the government caucus graciously lent its support to our motion, which dealt with bilateral agreements and went a little further than the others. Unfortunately, it didn't get unanimous consent. But I would today congratulate the govern ment on the announcements I'm told they made on suspending the Dinosaur Project and the petroleum institute. My question, Mr. Speaker, flows from that. Has the minister conducted a re view of the government of Alberta's bilateral agreements with China in any other areas, and could the hon. Deputy Premier update us on that procedure? MR. HORSMAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Well, I welcome the opportunity to advise all members of the Assembly of the current situation, which indeed, as the hon. Leader of the Oppo sition has pointed out, has become more serious since the last debate on this matter on Monday of this week. As a result of the situation and after consultation as well, I might add, with the Right Hon.

Joe Clark, the minister of state for External Affairs, on a daily basis including a lengthy discussion today, the cabinet has recommended that we place on hold two projects where we do have not necessarily bilateral but direct Alberta government relationships with the People's Republic of China in addition to the sister province, the relationship which we have with Heilongjiang.

Those two projects consist of an agreement to build a petroleum training institute in Beijing, and a commit ment there in the long term of $5.5 million in capital expendi tures, plus the location in Beijing of an official to work in that facility, is being placed on hold. I might add that the individual who was to take up his position was not due to do so until Oc tober of this year, so there's no one in place at the present time. The other, of course, is the Ex Terra Foundation, which is a private foundation supported by the governments of the People's Republic of China, Canada, and Alberta.

Now those projects are, as I say, being placed on hold. But, of course, it is impor tant to note that that project is currently under way, and there are three Albertans now in Urumqi, which is in the Gobi Desert area. Efforts, of course, will be made in conjunction with the government of Canada to provide a means by which they can return to Canada as soon as possible. Those, Mr. Speaker, are the additional bilateral agreements which are now being placed on hold as we monitor the situation with respect to the current state of affairs in the People's Repub lic of China. MR. SPEAKER: Supplementary. MR.

MARTIN: Yes, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate the answer from the Deputy Premier. Again I commend him for taking those steps. I'm trying, though, to get at a little broader ap proach in terms of the other bilateral arrangements which had to do with our motion. Will the government consider suspending all of our bilateral agreements with China until the situation re solves itself one way or the other? Are they seriously consider ing suspending all of them? MR. HORSMAN: Well, Mr.

Speaker, the only bilateral agree ments aside from our twinning relationship with the sister prov ince of Heilongjiang are the ones that I have mentioned in re sponse to the leader's first question. We are not proposing at this stage to interfere or disrupt the agreement which we have in place with the province of Heilongjiang.

It is our understanding that our message, which was transmitted on behalf of the As sembly, unanimously approved on Monday, has been received by the government of Heilongjiang in Harbin and that there the government is co-operating fully with our officials relative to those Albertans who are now in Heilongjiang. We have been in direct contact with officials in Harbin. The indication as of yesterday was that the city there is peaceful and that there are no indications of any impending difficulties, al- though as I've indicated there -- and this is for information -- in discussions with Mr.

Clark we are making arrangements to have the students and others who are located in Harbin returned to Canada through transportation now being arranged by the gov ernment of Canada. But those are the only bilateral agreements, and I shouldn't use that term "bilateral" exactly, because the Ex Terra Founda tion involves many more parties than bilateral, which of course only refers to two. The only bilateral agreement, therefore, is the one with the petroleum institute, and that is with a petroleum company, which of course is a government agency in China, although that could be considered a bilateral agreement.

MR. SPEAKER: Final supplementary. MR. MARTIN: Yes, Mr. Speaker. If, as we are considering, the reform period is basically ended in China and we may be into a permanent slate of repression -- let me put it this way. Has the government considered a time frame when they might even escalate other relations that we have with China, including the one they talked about, and what would cause them to do this? MR. HORSMAN: Mr. Speaker, the question is hypothetical, but I will try to answer it this way.

I'm sure I speak for all members of the Assembly, and I feel I can do that in view of the unanimous support for our resolution on Monday last. We be lieve that the primary responsibility for dealing with the Peo ple's Republic of China of course must rest with the government of Canada and through the official diplomatic relationship which we have with the People's Republic of China and the govern ment of Canada. We believe that they are in the best position to act on behalf of Canada regarding those relations.

I'm quite frankly telling members of the Assembly of the exchanges I'm having on a daily basis with the minister of state for External Affairs. I will continue to maintain that direct relationship and to have continuous briefings and to advise members of the As sembly as events take place. Let me just conclude by saying this. It is our earnest hope that stability will return. We cannot predict the outcome of the tragic events which are now taking place in the People's Repub lic of China. It is with great sadness that we observe what is taking place.

We will do what we can as a government to make sure that Albertans who are there are protected and are brought

June 7, 1989 ALBERTA HANSARD 105 home as soon as possible to safety. But, Mr. Speaker, we can not at this stage predict what additional steps may be necessary either on the part of the government of Alberta, for which we have responsibility, or what the government of Canada may de termine to be the best policy for the future. Environmental Impact Assessment Process MR. MARTIN: Mr. Speaker, to the Minister of the Environ ment. I think it's clear to all Albertans that this government cannot be trusted when it comes to environmental matters.

This is an absolute farce, the environmental impact assessment that this government has brought forward. It's not just the opposi tion saying that. I would quote from Jody McElligott, an Al berta resident who has asked to be part of their process: I was invited by ALPAC to chair the meetings beginning on May 29, 1989. I would very much like to support a process that encouraged meaningful public input. But, because of the two week time frame given to the public to review this docu ment, I have declined their invitation. My question to the minister is this.

When is this government going to come clean and admit that these negotiations are not meaningful and that this whole process is an absolute farce? MR. TAYLOR: Where it's clean. MR. KLEIN: Mr. Speaker, he's absolutely right. The name is Klein, not Clean. MR. SIGURDSON: It's not Mr. Clean, either. MR. KLEIN: Watch. SOME HON. MEMBERS: We are. MR. KLEIN: Good. Mr. Speaker, the environmental impact process involves, first of all, the tabling of the company's documents, followed by a public consultation process where those documents are sub mitted to the public for review.

Following that process there is a deficiency review by the Department of the Environment, and if the department determines there are deficiencies in the environ mental concerns that have been expressed through the docu ments and through the public consultation process, they will then communicate that back to the company. Following that process and in the case of Al-Pac, the Alberta-Pacific process, there will be a citizens' advisory com mittee established, under the authority of the Premier and in concurrence with my predecessor, to ensure that there is full and absolute public input into the process.

That process will take place within six to eight weeks. That will be a full and complete public process. In the meantime, just to make it clear so the question isn't asked again and again and again, just so they get it through their heads, I will explain it one more time. The public participation process will involve citizens from the affected community sitting on the review panel. They will be able to conduct those hearings in accordance with their own thoughts and their own ideas as to how those hearings should be con ducted. In addition to that, Mr.

Speaker, we will be consulting with the federal government as to how, perhaps, the federal gov ernment environmental requirements can be plugged into our system. There can be, in my mind, nothing fairer than that, nothing fairer than that MR. MARTIN: I guess we'll have to judge the size of the mind to think that that's fair, Mr. Speaker. My question to this minister. The citizens' committee he's talking to has been handpicked by the government. It deals with one of seven projects and will report only at the minister's dis cretion.

How in the world can he say that this is a fair process and expect Albertans to believe him? MR. KLEIN: Well, Mr. Speaker, this in my assessment is a good way to review the process . . . MR. TAYLOR: It's a dictatorship. MR. KLEIN: It's a good way to review the process. MR. TAYLOR: It's a dictatorship. MR. KLEIN: It's a good way to review the process. What you do is you examine a circumstance and you deter mine if that circumstance is right If it is the right procedure, you take the best from that circumcise -- circumstance. [laughter] And I was going to say you plug it in, but I won't say that. MR.

SPEAKER: Order please, hon. minister. If the Chair heard correctly, that's really going a bit too far in cleaning up the environment. MR. MARTIN: Mr. Speaker, I hesitate to ask the next question because of the answer we might get But, Mr. Speaker, to this minister. People have resigned from this honest process, and I want to ask a serious question. Is the minister asking Albertans to believe that they would really deny permits after those processes when the Premier's political future is on the line? He's already announced it publicly. This minister would go against his Premier: is that what he's saying? MR.

KLEIN: Mr. Speaker, I've been in politics in a different forum for almost nine years now, and I've had my political fu ture on the line more times than enough. If the environment is at stake, yes. Confidentiality of WCB Files MR. DECORE: Mr. Speaker, not very long ago a minister of the Crown in Atlantic Canada found himself to be in great diffi culty because he released certain confidential information, infor mation that could not be released pursuant to certain laws and provisions of that province.

Our party has been informed by the gentleman that was introduced today that certain information that he gave and that appears on his file with the Workers' Com pensation Board has been released. It is clear that an officer or a member or an employee or somebody has allowed that informa tion to be given out. My question to the Premier is this. I would like to know whether the Premier is aware of the fact that the Workers' Compensation Act clearly calls for confidentiality and, in fact, makes provision for legal action, criminal action, to be taken against people who contravene those provisions. MR.

SPEAKER: There are two difficulties involved with this

106 ALBERTA HANSARD June 7, 1989 particular question. The first one deals with Beauchesne 409(10): "A question ought not to refer to a statement made outside the House by a Minister." That issue is being examined or will likely be examined in terms of the purported point of privilege as raised by the Member for Edmonton-Glengarry yesterday. The Chair is at a bit of a loss to find that a member is raising a point of privilege and now raising the matter in ques tion period.

Indeed, any questions and answers along this line may well be prejudicing the matter of the point of privilege, which is yet to be determined by the Chair as to a rule on whether it's indeed a prima facie case of privilege. In addition to that, the member has yet to state his case and will be given the opportunity to do so. It would have been today, but it will be tomorrow since the minister is not present in the House at this time. So the Chair really believes that that first question is out of order, but perhaps a new question, which would be the first supplementary, could be posed by the member. MR.

DECORE: Mr. Speaker, perhaps I could broaden the scope of the question for the Premier by asking him this. Based on the information that has been given now to us and disclosed in this Assembly, is the Premier prepared to undertake to investigate this matter to see if certain officers -- and I limit it, sir, to the officers, employees, and/or anybody in the workers' compensa tion department -- have been involved in the release of such information? MR. GETTY: Mr. Speaker, I've already discussed the matter with the minister, and as you properly point out, the minister's not here today and unable to reply.

However, the minister has looked into the matter and would be pleased to review the proc ess with the House when he returns. MR. DECORE: Mr. Speaker, I wanted to make it clear that I was broadening the matter and in no way making reference to the hon. minister. It is not the minister that I wish this question to relate to. It is the officers, the employees, the board mem bers, the staff: all of those people that make up and look after the workers' compensation area. It's that issue that I wish the Premier to address. MR. GETTY: Mr.

Speaker, that is exactly the area that I ad dressed with the minister, and the minister can report to the House on it. MR. SPEAKER: The Member for Cardston, followed by Edmonton-Mill Woods, Edmonton-Meadowlark, Innisfail. Alberta Capital Bonds MR. ADY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Provincial Treasurer. The Alberta government has just closed the issue for its third offering of Alberta capital bonds. This was also the magic date for previous issues to be cashed in.

Can the minister advise if our Alberta capital bonds from previous issues were cashed in similar to the way Canada savings bonds were cashed, and how close to being fully subscribed was the new issue? MR. JOHNSTON: Mr. Speaker, let me indicate that we did have a very successful Alberta capital bond issue this past cam paign, ending June 1, 1989, and Albertans have committed and invested over $592 million in Alberta capital bonds this year. Mr. Speaker, as you well know, the member has asked about the rollovers.

Our accrued information so far indicates that about $150 million was rolled over from previous issues, still a very successful campaign, with over $440 million issued. That brings the rough total outstanding of Alberta capital bonds is sued over the past three years to $1.1 billion. MR. ADY: Mr. Speaker, to the Provincial Treasurer again. How would the size of this issue by this province compare in terms of a world issue? I know it's more money than I've got on me, but could you just give us some idea of how it would compare? MR. JOHNSTON: The member is very modest, Mr. Speaker, I think. Mr.

Speaker, Alberta is very active in the capital markets worldwide, and to finance ourselves through this emerging, strengthening economic period, we have been in the capital mar kets on several occasions. It is safe to say that our bonds are well received worldwide, and it's safe to say that we usually go in size; that is, very large issues.

There's no doubt that an issue of this size, over $500 million, would be seen to be a jumbo in the world marketplace, and when I discuss it with my colleagues in other governments, they are amazed to think that there's this much savings in this province, this much prosperity, and this much commitment to the goals and direction of this government as illustrated in this Alberta capital bond issue. MR. ADY: My last question to the Provincial Treasurer.

In view of the fluctuating and almost volatile national interest rates, is the Treasurer comfortable with the rates of interest in terms of this issue in view of competitive interest rates that prevail? MR. JOHNSTON:, Mr. Speaker, we follow the market very carefully. Of course, when you price an issue of this order, you price it off comparable instruments. We watch very carefully the 180-day T-bills. This instrument will be renewed in Decem ber of 1989, and therefore we price it close to the world markets. I can say that this is a very acceptable deal for Al bertans.

It's priced very close to what the T-bills were at the time. Let's remember one significant tiling, Mr. Speaker. When we pay interest every six months -- in December of 1989, when we pay interest on $1.1 billion, that money goes back to Al bertans, not offshore, and goes into consumption here in this province. Confidentiality of Documents MR. GIBEAULT: Mr. Speaker, there are many provisions of provincial legislation that respect and demand the confiden tiality of constituents' files with the respective government agency. I want to put a question to the Premier today.

Can he advise the House what disciplinary action he will be taking against any minister of his cabinet that violates those fundamen tal privacy and confidentiality provisions of legislation that they are sworn to uphold? MR. SPEAKER: Order please. That matter, in the opinion of

June 7, 1989 ALBERTA HANSARD 107 the Chair, relates clearly to the one raised yesterday with regard to privilege. MR. MARTIN: It's a general question. MR. SPEAKER: If you listened, there's hypothetical content. Try the supplementary, please, hon. member. MR. GIBEAULT: Mr. Speaker, I didn't make any reference to the case you mention. It's a shame the Premier doesn't want to answer or can't answer for his government. MR. SPEAKER: Hon. member, it's not a matter of whether the Premier wanted to answer or not. The Chair didn't allow him to answer. The first question was hypothetical under Beauchesne 493.

Now, with your first supplementary, please. MR. GIBEAULT: Mr. Speaker, aside from the illegality and immorality of the action we may be talking about earlier, can the Premier now advise Albertans if it is government policy to use this kind of intimidation tactic against anyone who protests against Conservative policy? Is that government policy now? MR. GETTY: No, Mr. Speaker. MR. GIBEAULT: Will the Premier demand the resignation of the minister responsible for the WCB, who has shown his utter contempt. . . MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, hon. member. [interjections] Order.

Perhaps now we could go to Edmonton-Meadowlark, fol lowed by Innisfail, followed by Edmonton-Centre. MR. GIBEAULT: Shame on this government. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, hon. member. Environmental Standards MR. MITCHELL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Two days ago the Minister of the Environment responded to my question concern ing pulp mill environmental impact assessments by stating that licences to operate will not be issued until all environmental concerns have been met . . . to the satisfaction of the highest standards that have been established anywhere in the world. To the minister.

How can the minister reconcile this statement with his failure to require Daishowa to meet his new high dioxin-emission standards? MR. KLEIN: Mr. Speaker, we've been in discussions with Daishowa relative to their commitment to meet world-class standards, the highest standards in the world. That announce ment will be made in about two weeks' time. I would invite the hon.

Member for Edmonton-Meadowlark to participate with me in Peace River at the Daishowa plant with the officials of that company, in a spirit of co-operation and not confrontation, and listen to the announcement that will be made relative to that company's commitment to meeting the highest environmental standards in the world. MR. MITCHELL: We'll all be immensely encouraged, Mr. Speaker, if in fact that is the case.

How can the minister reconcile his statement of two days ago with the fact that British Columbia has announced plans to eliminate all dioxin emissions by 1994 and Sweden has an nounced plans to eliminate all dioxin emissions from pulp mills by the year 2000? MR. KLEIN: That is, Mr. Speaker, an outrageous statement, obviously taken out of Harrowsmith or some other publication of note. As a matter of fact, the standards relative to bleach kraft mills in the province of Alberta are the Swedish standards. MR. TAYLOR: Nineteen twenty-five standards. MR. KLEIN: Well, if you want to talk about British Columbia, Mr.

Speaker, and talking about 1925 standards, I would suspect that the worst polluting mills in the world, as a matter of fact, were commissioned in the province of British Columbia under the authority of the NDP government at that particular time. [interjections] MR. SPEAKER: Order please. Final supplementary. MR. MITCHELL: It is categorically not the case, Mr. Speaker, that our standards are Sweden's standards. The minister should perhaps review his own standards.

Since in the minister's es timation our standards for the environmental impact assessment process in this province are the highest in the world, why then are Ontario's standards for environmental impact assessment entrenched in legislation requiring open public hearings, while ours are left to ministerial whim? MR. KLEIN: Well, Mr. Speaker, first of all, the Ontario re quirements were just recently, as recently as three weeks ago, announced to be brought up to our standards. To our standards. [interjections] To our standards.

The matter of legislation is something that will be brought to this Assembly in due course. The environmental standards and the assessment whereby those standards are determined will be brought to this Assembly in due course, and they will be considered by the Assembly, and I assure you, Mr. Speaker, that they will be the best in the world. This province will stand as the model. MR. SPEAKER: The Member for Innisfail, followed by Edmonton-Centre. Great Alberta Water Challenge MR. SEVERTSON: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Minister of the Environment.

Yesterday in the House the Member for Edmonton-Meadowlark mentioned the Great Al berta Water Challenge. Could the minister inform the House what that was? MR. KLEIN: Well, Mr. Speaker, the hon. Member for Edmonton-Meadowlark was too interested in spurring on the people who purported to be friends of the north and failed to observe the awarding of this very, very special award, which went to the town of Bowden. I have to mention the runner-up, Mr. Speaker. The runner-up was the town of Canmore, and the other eight municipalities all ran third. Thank you.

108 ALBERTA HANSARD June 7, 1989 MR. SPEAKER: Supplementary, Innisfail. Edmonton-Centre. Ambulance Service REV. ROBERTS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. More and more Albertans are coming to know that they cannot trust this govern ment on a number of health issues such as AIDS or abortion and now on ambulance services. Just yesterday we pointed out that 192 million federal dollars were slipping through the fingers of our health minister. The Edmonton Ambulance Authority re leased figures that show that over the past five months there have been 56 red alert diversions in which local hospital emer gency awards, Mr.

Speaker, were filled to capacity, 36 of the red alerts at the Royal Alexandra alone. Does the Minister of Health agree with the Edmonton Ambulance Authority when they say that the emergency wards of city hospitals are so busy that proper care cannot be provided to Albertans "on a timely basis"? MRS. BETKOWSKI: Mr. Speaker, I applaud the Edmonton Ambulance Authority for the work they are doing to ensure that patients in an emergency care situation are taken to the facility that can best accommodate them, unless that need is a critical need. I applaud their work in this area. REV. ROBERTS: Well, Mr.

Speaker, the authority was not applauding the minister yesterday; nor were Albertans, when they realized the effects. Will the minister now acknowledge that the unacceptably high red alert rates in Alberta hospitals is a direct result of the drastic funding cuts to hospitals by this prov ince prior to this year? MRS. BETKOWSKI: No, I will not, Mr. Speaker. REV. ROBERTS: All these one-word answers, Mr. Speaker.

Is it going to take someone's unnecessary death, before this Minister of Health, of preventative health -- is it going to take someone's unnecessary death to prove that she can be trusted, by taking immediate action to eliminate all red alert situations in Alberta's overcrowded emergency units? MRS. BETKOWSKI: Mr. Speaker, the Edmonton Area Hospi tal Advisory Council was asked in 1987 by my predecessor to look at the issue of trauma services within the Edmonton metro area, which is really the area that we're discussing.

The com mittee did recommend a bed registry system be set up, which would basically be a computerized system, which is currently done by telephone linkup. We expect that the bed registry sys tem will be operational in this year. For the hon. member to contend that we can stop certain emergency departments, some of which are a good deal busier than others, from ever getting to that point is quite naive, in my point of view, Mr. Speaker, because in fact emergency is exactly that. There are things that occur. We need to apportion the use of emergency funds within the whole hospital network.

The work being done by the network of hospitals in the Edmonton metro area is commendable, as well as the Edmonton Am bulance Authority's work to ensure that the health of Ed montonians in this context is protected and well served. MR. SPEAKER: The Member for Redwater-Andrew, followed by Edmonton-Jasper Place, Westlock-Sturgeon, Calgary- Mountain View, Clover Bar, Calgary-North West, Edmonton- Calder. Grain Prices MR. ZARUSKY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question today is to the Minister of Agriculture.

As we all know, the federal government has recently announced that they plan to charge in terest on all grain advances for the '89-90 crop year. My ques tion to the minister is: has the minister contacted his counterpart in Ottawa to voice his concerns on behalf of Alberta farmers in regards to this matter? MR. ISLEY: Mr. Speaker, I would share with hon. member in the Legislature that this matter received discussion at a federal/ provincial meeting of ministers of agriculture about three weeks ago, along with a number of other factors in the federal budget that impact on agriculture. MR. ZARUSKY: Mr.

Speaker, supplementary. I'm sure that all these matters were discussed at the ministers' meeting, but wouldn't it be appropriate for the minister to contact his counterpart personally and ask him to work on this matter as best possible and help the fanners in Alberta? MR. ISLEY: Mr. Speaker, as I indicated, expressions of con cern were made at that meeting on this and a number of other issues, some of which have a more significant impact on our farmers. Up to this point in time, I've had, shall we say, mini mal input from farmers or farm commodity organizations on this particular issue.

If input were to increase, as I'm sure the hon. member is attempting to do, I would be prepared to discuss it further with my federal counterpart. MR. ZARUSKY: Final supplementary, Mr. Speaker. I'm sure that new grain prices were announced, after the meetings I think. All indications are that prices for the '89-90 crop year will be close to and maybe a little higher than the '87-88 prices for grain. Would the minister indicate whether he is planning to contact his counterpart as soon as possible in regards to this problem? MR. ISLEY: Mr. Speaker, I'm in fairly constant contact with my counterpart in Ottawa.

I believe we'll be having a meeting Monday morning of next week at which a number of issues will be discussed, possibly even this one. MR. SPEAKER: The Member for Edmonton-Jasper Place, fol lowed by Westlock-Sturgeon. Environmental Impact Assessment Process (continued) MR. McINNIS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. To the Minister of the Environment. These are the environmental impact assess ment statements prepared by Alberta-Pacific. These are the phone books of the three largest cities in the province. They're about the same size. When the company was asked . . . MR. SPEAKER: Order, hon. member. Order please.

Page, would you go collect the telephone books and take them from

June 7, 1989 ALBERTA HANSARD 109 the Chamber. It's a violation of Beauchesne. There are no ex hibits in the House. Thank you very much. The Chair has or dered that they be removed from the Chamber. Would the member please continue with the line of question. MR. McINNIS: When the company was asked why they wouldn't provide funding for intervenors to study these docu ments, they said that it was because the government had not told them to; it wasn't part of the process.

When the minister was asked why he wouldn't provide funding for community groups to examine these documents, he said, "Why should we fund the opposition who will beat us up?" I want to ask the minister, not withstanding his paranoia about the opposition, how much time he personally has spent mastering these particular documents? MR. KLEIN: First of all, Mr. Speaker, I have no paranoia about the opposition. It's a real thought that I have about the opposi tion; it's quite real.

With respect to the environmental impact assessment I think that I've gone through the process once in this Assembly by ex plaining that, first of all, the company produces the document. The company then makes the documents available to the public through the public consultation process. There is then a deficiency review. Then in the case of Alberta-Pacific there will be a review by a citizens' panel, which has yet to be selected, and that panel will probably meet in six to eight weeks, which gives anyone ample time to prepare a case. Relative to the funding: why would we?

I would think that this is something that we can negotiate, perhaps, with the com pany, but why would the government subsidize the funding of documents and the preparation of documents and the case for intervenors when it's the company's project? [interjections] It's the company's project. Our responsibility . . . MR. SPEAKER: Order please, hon. minister. Thank you. Per haps we could get on to the supplementary, brief, so that we can have a response, brief, and let's get going. Thank you. MR.

McINNIS: I didn't quite hear the minister explain how much time he spent reading this document, but I wonder if he would confirm that he in fact relies on scientific and technical advisers within his department to review these particular docu ments and to cope with the decisions that he has to make as the Minister of the Environment? MR. KLEIN: The answer, Mr. Speaker, is yes. MR. SPEAKER: Final supplementary. MR. McINNIS: Well, it's a simple one.

If the minister sees the need to have experts advise him as to the content of these very technical documents, why doesn't he allow community groups to have the same right? Why doesn't he secure funding for them? MR. KLEIN: Mr. Speaker, I was going to tell the hon. member a joke that would knock him senseless, but I see he's already heard it. Just to lighten up his day. Mr. Speaker, the public has a process through which they can consult with the minister. They can consult with the public. We're assessing that process. I've said it time and time again.

I want to make sure that the process that is in place is the right process. If there is something wrong with that process, we will fix it. We will fix it not when the NDP says we're going to fix it or when the Liberals say we're going to fix it. We'll fix it when we as a government have determined that there is some thing wrong with it. That's when we'll fix it. [interjections] MR. SPEAKER: It's your time we're wasting, folks. Westlock-Sturgeon. Crop Insurance MR. TAYLOR: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Minister of Agriculture.

As we all know, the recent federal budget was a very vicious attack on western Canada and, in par ticular, on western Canada's major industry, agriculture. What I'd like to know is whether or not, particularly with respect to the crop insurance program which the federal government said they were going to withdraw from, there was any consultation whatsoever with the Minister of Agriculture before the federal government pulled the rug out on this particularly important program. MRS. McCLELLAN: Mr. Speaker, first of all, it wasn't my information that they pulled the rug out on the program.

There have been ongoing discussions on cost sharing, and I would ex pect that's what the hon. member is alluding to. Yes, we have had those discussions with the federal ministers. MR. TAYLOR: Further, Mr. Speaker, then will the minister assure the Assembly that the Alberta government will make up any funding shortfall in this program to protect Alberta farmers from unacceptable premium increases? Can you give the House that assurance? MRS. McCLELLAN: Mr. Speaker, we have stated that we are interested in an improved crop insurance program for our producers.

In the discussions with the federal ministers we have stated that we will discuss changes to premium funding on that basis, but the costs will not be borne by our producers. MR. TAYLOR: Mr. Speaker, this is an interesting study in math. If the cost is not to be borne by the producers and the fed eral government is backing out, it seems to me that it's very simple. If the farmers are going to continue to receive as good protection as they have, then obviously the Alberta government is going to pay more. If that is so, how much more? MRS. McCLELLAN: Mr. Speaker, I will repeat.

We are in negotiations with the federal government on crop insurance. We are conducting a review, as you in the House would probably be aware. We in Alberta conducted a review, and we have a na tional review in place now. Through that review process we will develop the best crop insurance program that we can for our producers. We have a funding agreement on premiums in this province now. We have an agreement on that process, and it is an agreement, in fact, that will not be changed without mutual consent of all parties. MR. SPEAKER: The time for question period has expired.

110 ALBERTA HANSARD June 7, 1989 head: MOTIONS UNDER STANDING ORDER 40 MR. WICKMAN: Mr. Speaker, in all respect, I had indicated earlier in a note to you that I wish to bring forward a motion on a emergency basis under

section 40 of the Standing Orders of the Legislative Assembly of Alberta, and that was done during question period. My

interpretation of this particular

section al lows me to bring that motion forward without having to first give written notice or any indication. In fact, I can bring it for ward at any time, and because of the pressing nature of the mo tion I do wish to bring it forward at this time. MR. SPEAKER: Well, hon. member, the Chair received this note within the last 10 to 15 minutes. It's a variation in the pro cedure which we've already engaged in in this House with re spect to a congratulatory message to the Calgary Flames and also with respect to three motions with regard to China.

In each case we had the appropriate notice given earlier in the Routine being called by the Clerk. Nevertheless, if we could point out that in future we need to at least have the courtesy of that much notice for all members of the Assembly as to what the particular issue is they're expected to be deciding to give, first, unanimous consent to and then ex pected to debate upon later in the day. Perhaps you could declare what the issue is, and we'll see if the House is prepared to make this one variation in procedure to see if it is indeed urgent MR. WICKMAN: Mr.

Speaker, it relates to a matter that was not sufficiently addressed during the question period and which, in my opinion, is a matter of extreme urgency, and that is the matter of the urgency of problems facing injured workers within this province. Now, if you'd like, I will move and read the mo tion.

The motion then is: In view of the urgency of problems facing injured workers, I move that this Assembly suspend all other business to discuss the plight of injured workers, those forced to protest outside the building at this particular time and those that they repre sent, and to debate and examine the operations of the Workers' Compensation Board. MR. SPEAKER: The hon. member has expressed the case for urgency. Is the House willing to give unanimous consent? Those in favour, please say aye. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye. MR. SPEAKER: Opposed, please say no. SOME HON. MEMBERS: No. MR. SPEAKER: The motion fails.

The Chair points out that in future there should indeed be the appropriate notice given early in the day. Thank you. ORDERS OF THE DAY MR. SPEAKER: Might we revert briefly to Introduction of Special Guests? HON. MEMBERS: Agreed. MR. SPEAKER: Opposed, if any. Carried. head: INTRODUCTION OF SPECIAL GUESTS (reversion) MR. SPEAKER: If we might recognize in this order: the Premier, the Minister of Economic Development and Trade, and the Member for Edmonton-Kingsway. MR. CHUMIR: Mr. Speaker, a point of order on that last ruling if I might. MR.

SPEAKER: Sorry, hon. member; perhaps we could deal with it after we deal with the introduction of guests, because we've received permission of the House. MR. GETTY: I'd like to express my appreciation to the House, Mr. Speaker, for allowing us to revert to Introduction of Special Guests, because it is an opportunity for me to introduce some 67 members of the Stettler junior high school who are in the public gallery. They are grade 9 members of the junior high. They are accompanied by their teachers Larry Ambury, Karen Bromley, and Don Anderson. I'd ask them if they'd rise, please, and be recognized by the House.

MR. R. SPEAKER: Mr. Speaker, it's my pleasure this after noon to introduce to you and through you to the members a spe cial group of visitors from the ministry of housing representing the government of the Republic of Kenya. They are here in Al berta to study condominium legislation, the Land Titles Act, and housing in general. I want to say that they have found that in Alberta our legislation is certainly on the leading edge, and they intend to use it in their country. I'd like to ask them to stand at this time. First of all, there's Mr.

Doug McNeil of the Canadian Condominium Institute, and the representatives from Kenya: Mr. Onyango, Mrs. Okungu, Mr. Nyadimo, Mr Njue. If they would stand and be: recognized. MR. SPEAKER: Edmonton-Kingsway. MR. McEACHERN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It's my pleasure today to introduce to you and through you to the members of the Assembly 16 English as a Second Language students from the Alberta Vocational Centre. They are in the public gallery and are accompanied by their teacher Shel Montgomery. I would request that they rise and receive the warm welcome of the Assembly. MR. SPEAKER: Calgary-Buffalo. MR.

CHUMIR: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. With respect to your previous ruling, I reached back to previous years with respect to bringing emergency motions under rule 40, and by my recollec tion that has never been a rule of this House previously. I notice in the

section that there is no reference whatsoever to notice,

whereas under different procedures under

section 38 there is a clear reference to notice. I would think that since this is a matter of an emergency na ture, certainly the courtesies would indicate that notice should be required, but should notice be omitted, I think it would be an

June 7, 1989 ALBERTA HANSARD 111 error to deprive this House of considering the emergency nature of a particular issue, if in fact it were truly an emergency, by virtue of inserting a requirement of notice that is neither here on the face of the

section nor, I believe, is part of the tradition of this House, at least during the prior two years. Now, I perhaps might be mistaken, and I'm sure the Speaker would be able to have his Legislative Counsel review the practice. But I would urge very strenuously against what I perceive to be a change and a narrowing in the scope of the right of members of this House to bring forward emergent matters. MR. SPEAKER: The Member for Edmonton-Highlands on the point of order. MS BARRETT: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

For clarification on this matter, while certainly it's correct that there's no absolute requirement that one files oral notice of motion prior to the regular routine orders of the day, it is the convention of the House. I do note that in both instances of waiving of notice -- number 40, to deal with a motion that is not on the Order Paper, and Standing Order 30, which is emergency debate -- debates have been allowed in this House. Under Standing Order 30 par ticularly, I recall it happened after the [Lac La Biche Inn] burnt down, for instance.

So I think there might be some confusion in the minds of the members across who are raising this, insofar as the matter was indeed given a fair chance and put to question of the House itself. MR. HORSMAN: I think the key words that were used by the hon. Member for Calgary-Buffalo were "if . . . it were truly an emergency." Under those circumstances, obviously members from all parties, I would think, would be prepared to give their assent. We can at any time -- we are the masters of our own rules -- by unanimous consent proceed to deal with matters of an emergency nature.

But the key words are "if . . . it were truly an emergency." By using those words in his comments, Calgary- Buffalo clearly put a seal on the nature of the request today. Therefore, I would think that when we come to normal cour tesies which have been extended in the past, we are entitled to be given some notice of the nature of the request under Standing Order 40. To use it as was proposed to do by the Member for Edmonton-Whitemud today, because he didn't like an answer in a question period, is surely an abuse of the House and therefore not truly an emergency.

Had there been an emergency matter coming before the Assembly, then of course we should have had notice of it. But if that weren't possible, under certain cir cumstances it would be possible for all members of the Assem bly to agree. I think the ruling you gave, Mr. Speaker, is appro priate under the circumstances of the operation of this Assembly. MR. SPEAKER: Hon. members, in terms of points of order and so forth, the Chair has the right to decide, having heard suffi cient representation.

Since we have heard from each of the po litical parties in the House, the Chair feels that that discussion has indeed taken place. There is indeed a difficulty with regard to our Standing Or ders, which perhaps a future rewrite and further editing could someday help solve, because we do indeed have Standing Order 30 to deal with as well as Standing Order 40.

But until such time as the Chair is directed otherwise by unanimous direction of the House leaders of each of the three political parties, the Chair will still keep the same notice to the Assembly as stated previously: if a member does not request under Standing Order 30, which calls for two hours' notice before the sitting, the member would at least give the courtesy to the House of giving the oral notice at the beginning of the day's regular business. Thank you. head: CONSIDERATION OF HER HONOUR THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR'S SPEECH Moved by Mr.

Clegg: That an humble address be presented to Her Honour the Honourable the Lieutenant Governor as follows: To Her Honour the Honourable W. Helen Hunley, Lieu tenant Governor of the province of Alberta: We, Her Majesty's most dutiful and loyal subjects, the Legislative Assembly, now assembled, beg leave to thank Your Honour for the gracious speech Your Honour has been pleased to address to us at the opening of the present session. Moved by Mr.

Martin that the motion be amended by adding the following: , but that the Assembly condemn the government for failing to uphold commitments made in the Speech from the Throne of February 17, 1989, failing to introduce tax fairness meas ures that would ensure that wealthy individuals and profitable corporations pay their fair share, failing to protect Alberta's environment, supporting higher taxes and cuts to vital services in the federal budget of April 27, 1989, and supporting the so-called free trade agreement with the United States even though it means lost jobs and opportunities for Albertans. [Adjourned debate on amendment June 6: Mrs.

Hewes] MRS. HEWES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm pleased to re spond to the Speech from the Throne given to us by Her Honour the Honourable the Lieutenant Governor of Alberta. [Mr. Deputy Speaker in the Chair] May I first of all thank Her Honour, Mr. Speaker. Her Honour is a true Albertan who serves with intelligence, under standing, and compassion. And I want to once again publicly declare my own respect and loyalty to Her Honour and to our sovereign, Queen Elizabeth, whom she so graciously represents. May I also congratulate you, Mr.

Speaker, and the Deputy Speaker and Chairman of Committees, and the Deputy Chair man of Committees on your continuing role and function in our House and pledge my support and inform you that I will look to you for guidance. Mr. Speaker, I wish first of all to thank the good citizens of Gold Bar who have once again seen fit to send me to this House as their representative. Gold Bar is a stable community devel oped in Edmonton when we still had large lots and many amenities, and so we are blessed with wonderful facilities. Mr.

Speaker, the citizens of Gold Bar, like their repre sentative, are aging, and we do have a large percentage of senior citizens in my constituency who are expressing to me their con tinuing concern and growing concern with the dwindling effect of fixed income faced with increased costs, increased taxes. This is one of the major thrusts that I hear from my constituents in Gold Bar, a lovely neighbourhood, stable in all outward ap-

112 ALBERTA HANSARD June 7, 1989 pearances and yet with the same anxieties that many other con stituencies suffer. The citizens of Gold Bar have been wonder ful advisers to me in the past three years. I have consistently asked for and secured their advice, and I believe it has been good. I will continue to undertake to do that. Mr. Speaker, looking at the throne speech, I have wondered what in fact a throne speech is intended to do.

Of course it's intended to precede the budget, which gives us the details, but the throne speech is expected to paint a large picture, a picture of what the government's plans are, what they anticipate will happen over the next year and how it will come to pass. This throne speech, sad to say, I believe is flawed, as others have been before it. Instead of a whole picture of what our province can anticipate, this throne speech is simply a series of snapshots, and probably faded snapshots at that. They are not clear pic tures of what's going to happen. They don't fit together into any cohesive whole.

In fact, looking at this throne speech com ing right on top of the February throne speech, one could say we have here a double exposure, with all of the fuzziness that dou ble exposures bring to us that we're so familiar with. Mr. Speaker, let me just go back on a little history in this throne speech. In '88 we had a hold-the-line, following the very serious cutbacks that we had in '87. Eighty-eight was a recov ery speech, but we never did achieve what we expected in '88. The budget and the throne speech were based on unachievable objectives in the sense of the price of oil.

Of course, we had no fall session and were treated with the news that our $800 million deficit for the year had now grown to $1.3 billion during that time, but we had no opportunity in the fall of '88 to discuss that or revise the budget. The first throne speech that we had in '89 had lots of promises, lots of promises in it and all kinds of dollar attachments. And it had a wonderful series of statements about the family and what we were going to do for the family, which recently seems to have been discovered by this government.

It had promises about drug treatment centres and so on; all very, very proper, all very well described.

Subsequently, of course, in very short order we had the elec tion, and during the election we were treated to all kinds of promises with all sorts of spending attached to them: $200 mil lion for drug treatment centres in the province; an interest shielding program, no particular cost attached, going to cost us thousands, millions of dollars; seniors' programs that had never really been debated, asked for, or studied; a road paving pro gram that simply, in my view, was an extension of an already existing agenda -- election promises, Mr. Speaker, beyond our wildest dreams, beyond our wildest expectations.

Then we were treated to an announcement of special warrants, $4.5 billion of special warrants developed by the cabinet, a good percentage of whom were no longer accountable to the people of this province. Over half the year's spending; no debate, no under standing in this House of what the use was to be, and no budget. Finally, Mr. Speaker, on June 1 we had a second throne speech. This is what I refer to as the "son of throne." This throne speech is seriously flawed. The Premier has indicated to us that everything present in the February throne speech -- all promises will be kept.

But we find in the next one that there's much less definition of what is to be done or the time frame in which it will be done. So I asked myself: what are Albertans' preoccupations about how a throne speech should be written and what it should contain? What is the so-called scorecard that you and I and citizens of this province would use to measure the throne speech? And there are a few of them; these are just jot tings that I've made, not necessarily in any particular order of priority, but things I believe a throne speech should contain in its essence. One of them, of course, is related to the economy.

Now, in the second throne speech we have the words "different, dif ficult." Difficult: it's an interesting term, Mr. Speaker. It does n't really describe a situation so much as it points us in a direc tion. It is a difference in this speech. "Difficult," says the throne speech of June 1. Citizens expect some undertaking about taxes, and to be sure, the Premier has given us that, but now it seems that it's fuzzified in the double exposure. The promises of the first throne speech and the election related to taxes now are not clear.

Citizens expect something in the throne speech to indicate a stable economy, that the economy will remain healthy. There's nothing in our throne speech to assure us that the ravages of the Wilson budget won't affect those of us who are least able to sus tain them. There's nothing in the throne speech to suggest that we will support those institutions of the province who will be hardest hit by the changes in UIC or the transfers or that citizens most hard hit will be supported and sustained through the sales tax. Nothing to suggest that in our throne speech.

So here we have a throne speech that gives us no assurance on the economy, no assurance when we know now that we have become a net debtor province. That's very clear from state ments that have been made in this House. Mr. Speaker, another preoccupation, another checklist item, would be health and social programs and environmental programs. There is little in this throne speech about social pro grams of any kind. In the previous one they were all lumped together under something called special needs.

Here we find them virtually missing; a grave absence, an abdication of responsibility, I believe, and I think citizens would believe, in looking through this throne speech. In the matter of fairness and justice, another check. What's contained? What's contained about women? Women were even included under special needs in the last throne speech; not so in this one. Apparently, the government, having been re elected, is no longer concerned about that part of the vote, so people of minorities and women are not included. Mr.

Speaker, we would expect there to be some mention of integrity in the throne speech, some assurance to help citizens understand that they need not be cynical about how appoint ments are to be made, that there will be fairness and openness and justice in how things will be done in this province. This, too, is missing. Mr. Speaker, I have already referred to the special warrants.

We expected the government to be responsive to the needs of the people of Alberta, and yet we have decisions being made with no debate in this House, no opportunity for members from all sides of the House to question the government's priorities. The promises were made, the special warrants were issued, the decisions were taken without any opportunity for the repre sentatives of the people to question them. Mr.

Speaker, I would have expected, and I think citizens in their preoccupations would expect, the government to make statements in the throne speech about being responsible stewards of provincial assets related to forestry, to our rivers and lakes, to the heritage trust fund. These, too, we find are miss ing. Nothing in the speech about openness. Nothing in the speech suggesting that the government will become a more open, approachable government. Nothing in the speech, Mr.

June 7, 1989 ALBERTA HANSARD 113 Speaker, to suggest that the government believes in consultation with the people of Alberta. Nothing in the speech about thrift, a nice old-fashioned word. Nothing to suggest that the govern ment intends to set itself out on a program of being thrifty in government itself, which I would have expected and which I think the people of Alberta have a right to expect. Mr. Speaker, if I had to check the throne speech from those few items, I would give it a failing mark, and I think you would too.

And I believe the citizens of Alberta will give it a failing mark, because it doesn't come up to par in any of those mecha nisms that we ordinarily use to check a throne speech or to de termine whether or not it measures up to our expectations. Let me get to a few specifics, Mr. Speaker. In health care the throne speech tells us that the government has a commitment to recognize the need regarding ambulance service. Now, well over a year ago, Mr.

Speaker, an excellent committee, under a very fine chairman, did some research into ambulances and determined what was needed in the province and made some recommendations about it. Now we see here a commitment to recognize the need; no suggestion that we are going to have an ambulance Bill. Mr. Speaker, this is overdue by years, decades, and the people of Alberta have a right to it. The study was made; the recommendations are there. It's been reviewed and reviewed over and over again. There is no ques tion about the need.

Why is there no indication of an ambulance Bill being presented in this House in this session? Mr. Speaker, I think that's a grave oversight. In acute care, yesterday and again today in the paper we see that beds are still closed. Yes, to be sure, we're adding 1,500 beds for extended care, but no commitment by this government that with acute care beds in hospitals overworked, surgery pa tients stacked up, there is in fact going to be any additional funds to allow beds to be opened. Mr.

Speaker, we all have constant complaints in our constituency offices of people, des perate people, waiting for heart surgery, waiting for other kinds of surgery, who are simply advised: "Get some money together and go to the United States and have it done. It's going to take six months in this part of the world." Mr. Speaker, I'm puzzled at the comments that we're going to have a new health Act. I assume that by being here, it's com ing forward in this session, or else why would it be mentioned in the throne speech?

Now, we know that we have the commission on health care, the Hyndman commission, due to report by the end of this year. Is it anticipated that the health Act is going to be presented to us before that commission has reported? If so, why? Why did we bother going through the exercise if the gov ernment in fact knew what it wanted to do all along? Or is it that the government already has the Hyndman report? Perhaps they have it and the rest of the world doesn't. It's either one or the other, Mr. Speaker. We know not, but it is mentioned, so I assume it's going to be there.

We have no mention of what is going to be done to pick up the slack that will occur as a result of the absence of transfer payments into health care from the federal government, no as surance from this government about their strategy in dealing with those cutbacks, no comments about the government's sug gestions of commercializing health care services. Thank good ness, they have not included that; I think Albertans were fearful about it from other moves that have been made. Mr. Speaker, no real initiatives on the important subjects of wellness and prevention.

Casual references to home care, but nothing in a substantive fashion. Mr. Speaker, in environment we have no assurance that the Department of Health and the Department of the Environment are closely linked. Nothing to suggest those concerns expressed by farm women about herbicides and others about the need for recycling programs. Nothing in the speech to suggest that we are taking firm steps about hospital emissions, on pathological wastes. Nothing on any of those matters. In home care, Mr.

Speaker, no definitive statements about who will manage it, simply that there's going to be more dollars going into it, and nothing in addition to that. Mr. Speaker, the only reference in the throne speech to men tal health is related to the new health Act. This is a situation approaching scandalous. The circumstance of children's mental health care in our province is a grave one. Yesterday I asked questions in the House about a young man who had committed suicide. We do not have appropriate or effective services in our province in mental health for children or for adults.

Our ser vices, too, in communities in inner cities for those who have suffered and are recovering and attempting to find their way back into society are minimal, are grossly understaffed and underfunded. Our services in housing, Mr. Speaker, are way behind and desperately need an infusion of resources. Mr. Speaker, going on to family. We have, of course, the ministry now. The references to family are much fewer in num ber in the June throne speech; I'm not sure what that indicates to us. But we as yet have not heard what the mandate of this min istry will be.

There is no indication whatsoever that the govern ment intends to do anything at all about the major problem that causes family stress; that is, poverty. There is nothing in it that even acknowledges the circumstances of many, many families. Yes, there's going to be an increase in day care subsidies for lower incomes, but that's about all. We have yet to see any sug gestion of improved standards. We don't know what the time frame is. These were promised without equivocation for last year. How can we trust the government when they keep telling us, Mr. Speaker, that these things are coming?

Families out there are suffering, in desperate need, in our communities, and yet the government keeps making promises. We don't know what the holdup is. We have no way of finding out what the difficulty is in writing new standards in child care, for instance. A local columnist wrote that we have standards for the hospitality industry, but we don't have standards for people looking after children. Mr. Speaker, one wonders again about the absence of an ex planation about the connection between the Alberta family life and drug abuse foundation. Are these inextricably linked?

Are they tied together, these two subject matters, or are they two separate issues under one single mandate? Mr. Speaker, we ap pear to be doing some good work and good thinking about ad dressing the issues of prevention, research, and treatment of drug and other addictions. Nothing in here about increased penalties for traffickers. Nothing, really, to indicate how this will be done, whether it's to be an infusion of resources into AADAC or totally separate operations. Mr.

Speaker, FCSS, one mechanism that is present under present legislation and statute to support families that has been very effective in our communities, has been underfunded for years. Here's one already there, ready-made, and yet we don't seem to be practising what we preach about supporting families and helping our communities to do just that through voluntary private nonprofit associations.

114 ALBERTA HANSARD June 7, 1989 Family violence. Yes, we have some sort of repetition of the lovely words that we all saw in Caring & Responsibility. We're getting it all over again, but there's not an awful lot here of the real stuff. We don't know whether the new initiatives include counseling and support for the abused children. We don't know whether there's going to be anything done about the abuser. We certainly don't know that the government has any intention to do a hot line, which has been needed for some time. Mr.

Speaker, I mentioned briefly before that women seem to have gone missing in the second throne speech. There's no pro vision for benefits to part-time workers, no initiatives regarding pensions for homemakers, no initiatives regarding pay equity or affirmative action on the part of the government. There's no suggestion in the new apprentice work experience program that there will be incentives to encourage greater female participa tion in nontraditional trades and occupations.

The women's ad visory council is not listed here, and there's certainly no move ment on the part of the government that anyone can see to act on their recommendations, which have been very good. Mr. Speaker, the seniors' program: $400 million. Seniors all across the province have said to me: "Nobody asked me what we needed. Nobody talked to me about garden suites. Nobody asked us whether the medic alert program was the most necessary one." Mr. Speaker, again back to my checklist.

I think we have every right to expect that a government, through its representatives, will consult with the consumers before they introduce these kinds of programs. Mr. Speaker, in social services, nothing really definitive in inner-city housing, no new suggestions about foster care. The Child Welfare Act, with the child advocate, has not yet been proclaimed, so that we have no protection there. Nothing in the speech to indicate that the social assistance rates, not touched since 1982, will be increased. No major increase for shelters.

We're still subject in our communities to the problems of food banks; I don't whether we're proud of them or not. I don't un derstand, in a province of this kind, why we have to have food banks. We are still subject to the cuts that were made to single, so-called employable people in housing and food. Mr. Speaker, as I've said, I believe this throne speech is flawed, as its predecessor was. There is no economic picture; there is no picture that gives me confidence in the management of this province. There is no picture of a humane society. There is no plan. There is no vision.

As far as I'm concerned, there is no speech. MR. TANNAS: Mr. Speaker, I rise today to speak for the first time in this Assembly as the Member for Highwood. First, I wish to express to Her Honour the Lieutenant Governor my sin cere admiration on her reading of the Speech from the Throne, some details of which I intend to address later. I wish to congratulate you, Mr. Speaker, and your deputies in being elected to your office, and trust you will not suffer the fate of other Speakers in the Mother Parliament at Westminster, who lost their heads.

I presume that if we as members do not lose our heads in the give-and-take of debate, you and your deputies, as arbitrators of debate, will not. I wish also to congratulate the new Member for Stettler in his election, and would congratulate as well the hon. Member for Edmonton-Glengarry and the hon. Member for Edmonton- Norwood. I would also at this time like to commend the hon. Member for Dunvegan and the hon. Member for Calgary-Foothills on their fine speeches in moving and seconding the throne speech. I, too, strongly endorse the throne speech, and certainly am not in favour of the amendment to it. Mr.

Speaker, I'd like to spend the time allotted to me in this my maiden speech to share with you the history, geography, current concerns, and future prospects of my constituency of Highwood. I have been elected by the voters in Highwood to represent them in this House, and it seems appropriate at this time to reflect upon some of my predecessors. Mr. Speaker, I'm humbled by the quality of the repre sentatives that have been sent by Highwood to the territorial As sembly in Regina before 1905 and to this provincial Assembly since 1905. Many of you here will recall with fondness my im mediate predecessor, Mr.

Harry Alger, who so ably represented Highwood in the 20th and 21st Legislative Assemblies. He has made his mark in this House and in this province of ours through his tireless and thoughtful leadership in the affairs of senior citizens. You will, of course, remember Mr. George Wolstenholme, our representative in the 18th and 19th Alberta Legislative Assemblies. You'll be pleased to know that both these fine gentlemen have agreed to act as my representative on special occasions and at ceremonies when I'm not able to be in the constituency, and indeed, they have both already done so.

Both are well, and send their greetings to all their former col leagues in this Assembly. The hon. Leader of the Opposition will be interested to learn that in the first Alberta general election in 1905 my constituency elected A.J. Robertson, who became the first Leader of the Op position in the First Alberta Legislative Assembly, and his por trait hangs downstairs in the library. For many years my constituency had more than one repre sentative, as several towns and their surrounding areas each qualified for a member. Some of these members include L.M. Roberts, J.M. Glendenning, Dr. Stanley, Sam Brown, D.H.

Galbraith, Ivan Casey, Edward Benoit, Dr. Hansell, Ross Ellis, and most notable, the hon. George Hoadley, who topped the polls in the Highwood area in six general elections, from 1909 to 1935. Mr. Hoadley first introduced health units into this province, and was the first to institute the rural mutual telephone system which served rural residents to lessen their isolation. Following Social Credit's stunning victory in 1935 the Mem ber for Okotoks-High River, predecessor to Highwood, resigned to permit William Aberhart to run in a by-election, and so my area was home, for a time, to a Premier. However, Mr.

Speaker, Highwood has been home to a prince as well. In 1919 Edward, Prince of Wales, purchased a ranch near High River, and owned it until fairly recent time. And, of course, Highwood is home to the Rt. Hon. Joe Clark, the Secretary of State for External Affairs. Where is Highwood, you might ask.

It is to the south and west of Calgary, with our northern border along Banff- Cochrane, Calgary-Shaw, Calgary-Fish Creek, and Drumheller constituencies, the Little Bow constituency on the east, Macleod and Pincher Creek-Crowsnest on the south, and to the west we share approximately 100 kilometres of our common border with British Columbia. Mr. Speaker, I will not stand before you and claim that High wood is the most beautiful constituency in Alberta. As you know, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and so I say to each one of you and to all Albertans: come, behold Highwood country, and judge for yourself.

Highwood is a wonderful part of this province to live in. Its geography is a microcosm of the

June 7, 1989 ALBERTA HANSARD 115 province. To the west, the Rocky Mountains, including the south end of Kananaskis Country. We have the foothills and the beautiful Porcupine Hills, the plains, the Highwood River, Wil low Creek, Sheep Creek, and all their tributaries, Chain and Frank Lakes, and the communities of Millarville, Turner Valley, Black Diamond, Okotoks, De Winton, Red Deer Lake, Alder syde, Priddis, Nanton, Cayley, High River, and of course for those of you that watch television, the community made famous by the television ad, "Where's Longview?" Well, Mr. Speaker, I can tell you.

Longview, I'm proud to say, is in Highwood country. The history of the Highwood parallels that of our great province. Our area has been the home for the Indians of North America for thousands of years, and archaeologists have deter mined that Old Women's Buffalo Jump, west of Cayley, shows continuous use from before the time of Christ up to the 1870s, with the disappearance of the buffalo herds. The Highwood River valley has been a favourite wintering area for hundreds of years, Mr. Speaker, and even today is a favourite retirement centre for many seniors.

Indeed, the Blair report some years ago noted that High River had a greater ratio of seniors than Victoria. Due to good government provision in the past decade, the area has a number of modern senior citizens' lodges and apartments. We are also blessed with two modem hospitals with nursing home facilities. Both, I repeat both, have very high utilization factors -- I know the hon. Mem ber for Edmonton-Glengarry will be pleased to hear that -- and both have significant waiting lists for their long-term care ex pansions. We are most supportive of the hon.

Minister of Health for her efforts in effective delivery of services in both prevention and treatment and increased access to emergency health care services, home care funding, and in the capital ex pansion program for long-term care. Mr. Speaker, we've come a long way since the horse and wagon trails that crossed the plains. Modern highways connect the major centres of this great province. Our city streets are paved and, indeed, a considerable amount of urban back lanes are paved as well.

And so we come to the secondary road paving program that unfortunately was so profoundly misunderstood in the recent election. This program is absolutely vital for market roads in the rural area. Sir, if we as a province can afford paved roads in residential areas as matters of conven ience and dust abatement, then surely we can afford to pave ma jor secondary roads to facilitate the safe and expeditious transport of our farm, ranch, petroleum, and commercial vehicles.

We're not talking about paving every dirt road, not even every gravel road in Alberta, but only those major secon dary roads that are vital to an expanding and diversified economy. I was pleased to hear several hon. members from both opposition parties speak last evening in support of this program. Peter Fidler of the Hudson's Bay Company was the first known white man to enter my constituency. He spent the winter of 1792-93 with members of the Peigan tribe along the High wood River valley and in the vicinity. In his journal, Fidler mentioned the Old Women's Buffalo Jump.

David Thompson, also with the Hudson's Bay Company and one of the greatest explorers in our history, named the river the Spitchee. However, the Palliser expedition of the late 1850s called it the Highwood River, from which the constituency now takes its name. In the 1860s some spirited American free traders came into the area and established posts at various places. The arrival of the North West Mounted Police in 1874 ended these early whiskey-trading commercial ventures.

In the late 1870s Tom Lynch and George Emerson brought in a herd of 1,000 Montana cattle to range between the Sheep Creek and the Highwood River, and in the next few years settlers came to build stopping houses near the stream fords. Ranches were established throughout the area. By 1885 several communities had enough settlers and families to consider the need to establish schools. One of the earliest schools in our area, called the Dunbow in dustrial Indian school, was founded by Father Lacombe in 1883. It was operated by the Oblate Fathers and the Grey Nuns until 1922.

Today we have many fine schools in our area which are a tribute to our government's commitment to education. We also have several special schools, most notably the Stampede Boys Ranch school for boys who need a second chance in life. And, of course, there's the well-known Strathcona-Tweedsmuir school. My constituents are concerned with equity in financing edu cation in an area like ours. We have high tax service demands without the commercial and industrial tax base to properly sup port the demands. The enhanced equity funding is an exciting prospect for us, as is the increased funding for A.B.

Daley com munity school in Nanton and the Millarville community school. This provides me with two more reasons to support the Speech from the Throne. Mr. Speaker, we are also concerned about developing long- range plans for school boards. They have difficulty when they are uncertain as to the funding provisions, which may vary from year to year in kind or amount and therefore strain the predictive capacities of trustees and administrators alike. The hon. Minis ter of Education is to be commended for ensuring that education continues to be a high priority with our government. Mr.

Speaker, today's horse lovers know of the famous Spruce Meadows stables and show jumping facilities located in my constituency, which are ranked as the third best in the world. Hon. members may not know, however, that in 1884 the Quorn ranch was established on Sheep Creek by members of the Quorn Hunt Club of Leicestershire, England, with the object of raising hunters for the English market They imported 200 Irish hunter mares and English thoroughbred and Cleveland Bay stallions.

The ranch prospered, and Quorn horses were eagerly purchased by the North West Mounted Police, the Calgary Fire Brigade, and horse fanciers throughout the Northwest Territories. In this tradition today, the Southern family and Spruce Meadows sta bles produce fine thoroughbreds and Hanoverians that are world famous. Horse racing in our area is a time-honoured tradition from the time when horses first were acquired by the Indians on the prairies in the early 1700s to organized race meets in High River and Millarville in the early 1890s. The famous Millarville races, Mr.

Speaker, will soon celebrate its 100th anniversary. The Bar U ranch west of High River was also famous for its fine Percheron horses, as this ranch supplied hundreds of workhorses for Alberta's pioneer farmers. Horse raising and training is still a major industry in Highwood. A settlement on the Fort Macleod to Fort Calgary trail sprang up at the crossing on the Highwood River and was a thriving community by the time the Calgary and Edmonton railway reached Fort Macleod in 1892. With the railway came homes teaders to convert the prairie land into grainfields and pastures and farms.

Wheat, oats, barley, rye, forage, and canola are ma-

116 ALBERTA HANSARD June 7, 1989 jor crops today for farmers in Highwood. Our farm and ranch constituents are very much interested in the throne speech, particularly where it mentions the Alberta farm credit stability program that has been extended for an addi tional two years. Mr. Speaker, the government is to be com mended for this and for increasing the maximum loan per family.

Many Highwood constituents have commented on how helpful the Alberta Department of Agriculture has been and con tinues to be through such initiatives as the Farm Financial Advi sory Service, the farm financial management training program, and access to the small business interest shielding program for operating capital. These programs under the stewardship of the hon. Minister and the hon. Associate Minister of Agriculture show to all rural Albertans, not just people in Highwood, that this government takes positive action in difficult times when there are high input costs and low product prices.

The fuel tax allowance on diesel fuel and gasoline and the farm fertilizer pro tection plan are clear examples of this government's efforts to help keep agricultural input costs down. The petroleum industry is so important to Alberta, and I can truly say, Mr. Speaker, that this vital industry had its beginning in the Highwood community of Turner Valley. On May 14, 1914, oil and gas first flowed from the Dingman No. 1 discovery well. The oil and gas industry began on that day.

Calgary was the financial and organizational centre for this development, and therefore became the oil capital not only of Alberta but of Canada. How fitting that on the 75th anniversary as oil capital of Canada, Calgary became the home of the Stanley Cup. Recently I had the privilege of representing the Hon. Doug Main at the 75th celebration in Turner Valley, where I presented to the president of the Turner Valley Oilfield Society an official document declaring the gas plant site as an Alberta historic resource.

We in Highwood look forward to the future when the Hell's Half-Acre site will appropriately represent the proud his tory of the petroleum industry in this province. I eagerly en courage the establishment of an interpretive centre at Hell's Half-Acre that will do justice to its potential as a tourist centre and will do honour to all those in the industry that has done so much for Alberta. The oil and gas industry continues to be important to High wood as an employer of people and as a producer of wealth for this province.

We still have many producing wells and indeed have four gas plants producing sulphur in this area. This government's initiatives in tourism are not lost on an area with such natural beauty and interesting history as High wood may lay claim to. The natural beauty of this area has caused many filmmakers to shoot their movies in our area, start ing with the film Northwest Stampede in 1947, with Jack Oakie and Joan Leslie, to Silver Streak, Superman II and Superman III, and most recently, Don Johnson of Miami Vice fame was on location in High River for his latest film.

Tourism is a growing industry in our area, and with the continued support and en couragement of the hon. ministers of Tourism, Recreation and Parks, Forestry, Lands and Wildlife, and Culture and Multicul turalism, it will play a significant

part in our economy in the years to come, with projects like the Nanton air museum, the museum of the Highwood, Big Rock park, and the Hell's Half- Acre interpretive centre. Mr. Speaker, the forest industry in Highwood is not the ma jor industry that it once was, but it has a proud

chapter in the history of the Highwood. In 1891 John Lineham completed his lumber mill on Sheep Creek, and for many years Okotoks was a major supplier of lumber for the communities, farms, and ranches of the Highwood and well beyond. John later estab lished a second lumber mill in High River, and for many years the logs were carried downstream on the Highwood and Sheep Creek during the spring floods. Incidentally, John Lineham rep resented my area for a time as the member in the territorial Leg islature in Regina, before Alberta became a province.

Environment, as we know from question period, is becoming more of a concern to my constituents, especially as our local economy becomes more diversified. In the last decade we have greatly increased the numbers of small secondary processing plants and specialty operations like tiger mushrooms, tree farms, greenhouse operations, specialty meat producers, a brewery, Nanton Water, the Colburn-Dawes feed supplement plant, and the Highwood distillery.

We are pleased and excited that the two new major plants, Cargill and MagCan, have been able to meet the environmental standards that will protect the local resi dents, and both those plants will provide employment for hun dreds of local residents and Albertans alike. Mr. Speaker, a word about the family initiative, family day. Government alone cannot create a true family day. It can merely provide the opportunity for others to make it a family time, and therefore it is an important step to bring focus to the fundamental importance of the family, through family day.

Many of our Christian denominations emphasize having at least one day a week devoted to family activities. A family day once a year provides an ideal opportunity for all families to focus on themselves, to look at reconciling their differences, to take joy in their common ancestry, to participate in shared activities, and to focus on all the members of their extended family on a day other than a family funeral. No, Mr. Speaker, a government cannot do it by itself. Family day must grow in the hearts and minds of all Albertans, and I'm proud that this government has taken this important step.

I'm excited by the challenge of serving my constituents in Highwood. I look forward to working with the Eden Valley Band council, the Hutterian Brethren at McMillan and Caley colonies, and working with and for farmers; ranchers; workers; seniors; acreage owners; businesspeople; local service clubs and other organizations; village, municipal and town councils; and school and hospital boards. This Speech from the Throne has many things that I and my constituents support. I'm proud to be a member of the Progressive Conservative Party and a member of this government led by Premier Getty.

I'm pleased by the camaraderie and friendliness of all members of both sides of this House. Mr. Speaker, I am honoured to have been elected by the vot ers of Highwood to this 22nd Legislative Assembly, and I pledge to my constituents that I will work for them in this As sembly and in caucus to the best of my ability. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The hon. Member for Edmonton- Jasper Place. MR. McINNIS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. MR. TAYLOR: He looks as old as I am. MR. McINNIS: That's uncalled for.

I want to say that I am pleased and proud to be able to take my place in this debate on behalf of the hardworking people of Edmonton-Jasper Place. I grew up in that community; I know

June 7, 1989 ALBERTA HANSARD 117 the type of people who live there. They don't move around very much. In fact, there's something of an aging population in parts of Jasper Place. They pay their mortgages. They pay their taxes -- boy, do they pay their taxes. They're rock-solid people; they believe in their community, and they want the best for it. They don't move politically very often either. The previous member, Mr. Young, spent 18 years as their MLA. I've had many occasions to comment on Mr.

Young's public service, and I wish now to reiterate that point: my community is indebted to Les Young for his 18 years of service in this House, and I know that he wanted and fought for the best for his community. I also want, briefly, to pay tribute to a former leader of my party, Grant Notley, who was a member of this Assembly for Spirit River-Fairview. I served as Mr. Notley's executive assis tant when he was in this Chamber from 1974 to 1979, when he was the only representative.

I recall many days when we had to somehow fill his brain full of information to cover seven or eight pieces of legislation that he spoke on in one day, as well as question period and all the rest of it. I know that whatever de mands this Chamber and my party put on me, it will never come close to the load that Mr. Notley carried, and I want to pay some tribute to that in my opening remarks in this Chamber. I also want to speak briefly, as others have, about the con stituency of Edmonton-Jasper Place. There are really three parts to it.

It's in the western end of our city, the capital city, on the north side of the river. The

part I'm most familiar with, of course, is the

part I grew up with, old Jasper Place. But there's a much newer part, and I suppose a larger and growing part, which we call west Jasper Place. It's the area around the world-famous West Edmonton Mall. I think it's fair to say that some of the people in that area consider the mall to be more of a burden than it is a blessing, if you have to live in the surround ings of it. It does create some pressures in the community, which I'd like to speak about. There's a third area which is often forgotten. A lot of people don't know it's there. It's a mobile home village called Westview at the western edge of the city.

It's sort of off by it self. You can barely see it from the highway. There are ap proximately 1,500 to 1,600 souls who live out there in the mo bile home village. They are a very important group of people, and I think some of their problems deserve particular attention. They are on a roadway known as Winterburn Road. If anybody in this Chamber has ever gone down it, you are lucky if you haven't left pieces of your car in that vicinity. There's an awful lot of traffic there. There's a school on it. I think it's a disaster waiting to happen.

My colleague and I from Stony Plain have been working on a game plan to deal with the minister of transportation about transportation problems in that whole urban/rural transition area. There is, at this point, excessive traffic on 170th Street, which goes by the West Edmonton Mall. There have been quite a number of serious accidents and deaths just recently.

Our feel ing, as the members for this area, is that part of the solution to the problem is to move the Whitemud freeway -- I guess they call them drives in the city of Edmonton -- the Whitemud Drive, out to the Devon highway to divert some of the highway traffic off the city streets. As I said, my colleague from Stony Plain and I have discussed this, and are making representations to the hon. minister. We have a problem with schools in our riding. The problem is quite simple: the school board is closing down schools in the established areas and failing to open them in the newer areas.

The area of west Jasper Place is the largest area of the riding. It still has no junior high school facility, and there is a shortage of elementary school spaces as well. I think somehow we have to come to terms with the fact that so many of the older areas of our communities, the urban areas which have established in frastructure, are losing population, the newer areas are gaining them, and we are having facilities that were built at considerable expense underused and, in the newer areas, no facilities at all.

Obviously, in the newer areas there are concerns over com munity facilities: libraries, recreational facilities. Capital city park: we are lucky to have a capital city park in the river valley, but most of it takes place to the north and east In the south and the west we need some expansion. I know a proposal exists. I mentioned taxes as being a concern. Also, I think the envi ronment is a major concern, and I'm going to focus some of my remarks later on.

There is an international event of some significance I wanted to mention in these remarks, which has been overshadowed in the last few days because of the overwhelming emotion sur rounding the events in China. I'm referring to the electoral vic tory of the Social Democrats in Poland. The Solidarity move ment, or Solidarnosc, began life under very difficult cir cumstances. I don't know if you recall, but approximately nine years ago the Polish state brought very heavy repression down upon the Solidarity movement. That movement was born of oppression, but I think it shows, Mr.

Speaker, that the demo cratic movement, wedded to socialism, can't be suppressed by violence or any other such measure. I think socialists who come from an undemocratic tradition will eventually be made to see the error of their ways, but I think the same can be said for those who profess a commitment to democracy without understanding the social imperatives of our movement. I think they will one day learn at least that an economic system which puts a greater value on profits than it does on life-sustaining resources can't survive in the long term. It's no accident, Mr.

Speaker, that democratic socialism is the fastest growing political movement in the world today by a very large margin, and I want to acknowledge the victory of the Social Democrats in the election in Poland. I recognize the po litical situation is very confused there, but there are democratic socialist forces growing there and, I think, in China as well. I hope they, too, will triumph in their time. In the past few years the leader of my party, the hon. Mem ber for Edmonton-Norwood, has indicated some directions over a broader time scale than one election campaign.

I want to deal with some of those in my remarks today. A lot of them were outlined in the report of the New Democrats' economic project chaired by my colleague from Calgary-Mountain View, which was published in September last year.

I'd like to encourage some of the members in the House to read that report I know we get a lot of reports, but I don't think it would hurt you a bit to have a look through it Quite clearly by the results of the last two elections, the elec torate in our province is becoming tired of single-party domina tion, and I think the election of 16 members from our party in dicates some disappointment with the failure of the old-line par ties to meet their election commitments.

Our movement began as a means of making collective provision to counteract some of the effects of the market, and really the worst of it was in the Depression. I think a fair degree of consensus now exists about some of those programs. But we face perhaps even more seri ous problems in our economy right now. For example, we were

118 ALBERTA HANSARD June 7, 1989 hearing this morning that there is a new round of merger mania in our economy: bigger corporations swallowing up smaller ones, sometimes smaller ones swallowing up bigger ones. The result is that a lot of money changes hands, the liquidity of cor porations is reduced, debt grows, people get rich, but no jobs are created. I think that's a problem at a macro level that our econ omy and our political system seems ill-equipped to deal with.

In many cases, and I think we find this in government as well as in the economy, problems and inefficiency stem from the overall size of organizations. It's true of governments, but of course it's true of large corporations as well. In fact, many large business corporations today are learning this lesson. I was up at Procter & Gamble in Grande Prairie a few weeks ago. They've broken their operation down into working circles, almost semiautonomous units. This is a major American corpo ration operating in our province.

They give individual workers and managers a great deal of control over the way they conduct their work, the way they organize their work, the way they dress, and to some degree the hours they perform as well. Now, with that decentralization comes a certain amount of freedom but a greater responsibility as well. You obviously have to pro duce if you're going to do things in your own way. I think this concept of decentralization applies very well in terms of the philosophy of our movement.

Clearly a good part of it is the conflict between mass industrial organization and labour, which is certainly the history of the western world. But it's not the whole story. And I think it's time we thought about merging some of the ideas of the market with some of the ideas socialists have and put some greater emphasis on personal activ ity toward achieving social goals and much greater emphasis perhaps on different types of economic vehicles. In the past we've had governments, Crown corporations, and private indus try but not much in between.

I should point out that New Democrats have always supported private ownership in the economy despite some rhetoric to the contrary. There are a great many employees who now have a signifi cant investment in their pension funds, and these funds have grown so large that they're already a major source of ownership in the economy. There'll come a day, I believe, in our province, in Alberta, when workers, through their pension funds, will con trol many large corporations on the stock exchange.

There's also a growing array of mutual funds, many of them based on very clear ethical principles, and I know our leader has spoken about this before. They're very popular in the marketplace but they're also gaining in size and, I think, in influence. The same could be said of nontraditional banking institutions such as credit unions and their variations in other parts of Canada. [Mr. Speaker in the Chair] Now, if the Alberta government had the will and desire, I think we could lead the way in terms of new forms of business endeavour such as employment co-operatives.

Instead of invit ing multinational corporations to come to our province, using taxpayers' money and resource concessions, why not fund lead ership projects in recycling and environmentally friendly products? If some of those industries got a fraction of what we're prepared to give transnationals, they could really do something. I think, for example, Mr. Speaker, of the Mennonite Central Committee in the city of Edmonton.

With little or no help from our provincial government, they started a recycling project in Edmonton which now covers half the city and so far has gathered, I think, close to 2,000 tonnes of material for recycling at a very early stage. Some of their equipment is being copied by the multinational corporation that has the other half of the city. They've started a project to renovate older homes. They employ a large number of very difficult to employ people, in part using federal government grants. Now they're working on a plastics recycling plant.

I think if this government continues to try to compete in world markets with low wages, subsidies to large corporations, it isn't going to work. The only way to be successful in the world economy is to compete on the basis of fair wages and benefits. Low wages and subsidies distort eco nomic priorities, and they hinder economic progress. The economics of a decentralized approach are exciting, Mr. Speaker.

There are a number of economists who have shown, in studies published over the last five or 10 years, how prosperity is linked to the growth of local communities, that it works much better if it comes from within. You're better to back native in dustries -- I mean "native" in both the native Albertan and native Indian sense of the word -- than you are to bring in large corpo rations with subsidies. Gradually, production from locally- based industries can compete in world markets, but it has to sort of take root rather than being brought in from above.

It seems to me that local communities are the appropriate focus of our economic policy, and I agree very much with the report brought in by my colleague from Calgary-Mountain View that that's the way to go. I think also, Mr. Speaker, that some of the large projects that are being thought about by this government and stickhandled through by some of the ministers on the Treasury benches are going to be dinosaurs in a relatively short period of time. I think the forestry projects may be a case in point.

The process of im posing bleached kraft pulp mills in the northern part of the prov ince is shaping up as quite a battle. I think if the government believes they've got it iced, they have another think coming. The Minister of the Environment should be prepared for a fight, and I think the minister of forests is going to be involved in that thing as well. The government wants these projects done very quickly. They are trying to catch a wave in the marketplace, or the other term used quite often is that they want to get in there before the window closes.

This is a sales pitch, and I think any body who gets a high-pressure sales pitch like this should realize that arbitrary deadlines put forward by project proponents are something you should be frightened of. Seven pulp and paper projects have been awarded control over almost 30 percent of our province. It's an area the size of the province of New Brunswick and 25 percent more. It's an area 50 percent of the state of Washington. Washington is a famous state for forestry in the United States.

Basically, all the forestry lands in Washington state are covered by the forest management agree ments currently under secret negotiation by this government. The stakes are very high, Mr. Speaker, and I think we're on the verge of witnessing a sellout of our resources which probably is unprecedented in the history of our province. All this development is taking place over the space of a pe riod which began late last year and which I understand the gov ernment wants to have finished before this summer is over. There is, of course, an environmental impact assessment process.

As we listen to question period every day, I think we realize that those rules are changing daily as well. But I think the point that remains to be said -- and I met with the Minister of the Environment privately in his office -- is that if he thinks

June 7, 1989 ALBERTA HANSARD 119 this government can get away with ramming all these projects through without proper environmental impact assessment, with out public hearings, I think they're out of their minds, Mr. Speaker. Now, the forest management agreements. I'd like to deal with those in a little bit of detail, because you can't find one per son in 10 who really understands what they're about I wonder why. There was a new forest management agreement signed by Weldwood, which operates in Hinton, on June 15, 1988. That agreement provides softwood timber to Weldwood for $1.44 per cubic metre.

Hardwood's at 65 cents per cubic metre. I've said, Mr. Speaker, that they didn't even get $1.49 day prices in the case of this particular FMA. Procter & Gamble signed an agree ment in January for $2.09 per cubic metre for softwoods and 27 cents -- 27 cents -- per cubic metre for hardwood. Imagine a metre cube block of wood. In British Columbia the average charge for softwood timber is $10.59 on the coast, $8.59 in the interior.

In the province of Ontario the average price, July 1, 1988, for pulpwood timber on provincially owned land -- that's what we're talking about; it's land we own -- was $6.75 per cubic metre. So I think we're an awfully long way behind Canadian prices for timber. World prices for timber run in the $10 to $20 per cubic metre range. I recognize these companies pay other charges for forest fire pre vention and a holding charge, but these work out to no more than 50 cents per cubic metre. So we're looking at $2 to $2.50 in the case of the two FMAs negotiated over the last year.

It's a long, long way below what others pay for forestry. It's a giveaway, Mr. Speaker. I think every Albertan ought to be con cerned about it, and I hope to do my part to make sure they do. The environmental impact assessment process, just briefly, takes place under

section 8 of the Land Surface Conservation and Reclamation Act. The companies may be . . . Well, generally, if they have to do an EIA, they have to conduct a pub lic review process. That process took place last week in the case of the Mitsubishi/Honshu project, the one the minister likes to call Al-Pac. I could call myself Seiji Ozawa and that wouldn't make me Japanese, and I don't think calling themselves Alberta-Pacific makes them Albertan, or Pacific for that matter. In any case the public involvement program is over and done with. I was at one of the meetings.

The companies involved had a bunch of overhead slides to demonstrate how many pickup trucks they were going to buy, how many motel rooms they were going to rent, how much toilet paper they would buy. Many of the people who live in the area, mostly farmers, told me they'd heard that same presentation five or six times. They came looking for information and answers to questions they had about how it's going to affect the place they live, and they were treated to the same routine about, you know, how you can get dollar signs in your eyes through this thing.

Now, I know most people think that's important. but having their questions an swered is important too, and we don't yet have a forum that gives people the right to get those questions answered and to decode all this scientific and technical material which should perform the basis. I'm concerned that there aren't adequate baseline studies on what's there in the huge forest management area. We've got a 100,000 square kilometre block in the case of Mitsubishi/ Honshu which isn't adequately inventoried for timber, let alone wildlife.

We don't have the kind of baseline study that would allow people to determine down the road what the impacts on the environment have been, and these studies aren't adequate to that process at this point in time. So the EIA process has turned into a PR exercise where the Minister of the Environment sells the project to the people the quicker the better.

His department, the Department of the En vironment, has been reduced to a bystander in the real sellout which is the forest management agreements, and no one outside the Treasury Branches will be allowed to see any of those agree ments until after those mills are built, until after they have their permits to operate, until after the barn door has closed and the horse is long gone. It's unacceptable, Mr. Speaker, and I think we have to do something to try to convince the government of that. This is a government of MLAs primarily from southern Al berta.

I've asked some people from the north who are con cerned about this, "What right do the MLAs from southern Al berta have to give away the northern third of the province?" I think when this is over there won't be any conservative MLAs in northern Alberta. But that doesn't change the fact that the decisions are still being made predominantly by people who live in and come from the south. People in our province are concerned for environmental protection, Mr. Speaker, as they never have been before.

I don't think you have to be a rocket scientist to realize that we have to find a way to live more in harmony with our environment. The Brundtland commission calls it sustainable development The Minister of the Environment says he agrees with that, but then he says he agrees with everything in principle. The problem is that he just can't do anything about it I think sustainable devel opment means coming to terms with the fact that our economic system now places a higher value on the profits of corporations than it does on life-sustaining resources.

It involves bringing the environment right into the decision-making process. Rather than having the Minister of the Environment go out and try to schmooz the public after it's all over, that has to be part of the decision from day one. So whenever the Premier or whoever goes out to announce one of these projects, the environmental concerns should have been brought in there prior to that point. I don't think you can always fix environmental problems after the fact The so-called technical fix doesn't work anymore.

We have to -- and this is the key recommendation of the Brundtland commission -- build the environment into the decision-making process right from the very start. As con sumers, Mr. Speaker, you and I pay for everything we consume, but industry in our province pays nothing for water, they pay nothing for the right to pollute the air or the water. These are the so-called free goods. Sure, they have to have a permit but they can negotiate that Somehow we have to find a way to put a value on these life sustaining resources.

Many parts of our economy in this province have been built on quarrying our non renewable resources. Quarrying is a process of picking it up and hauling it away. But we've never had political leadership that understood we shouldn't sell our priceless assets until we can get something as valuable in return, and I'm not sure the leadership of the governing party or the other party in this House really understands that point. There was a time when former Premier Lougheed spoke about the clock that was ticking towards the end of our non renewable resources.

He at least understood the rhetoric of vul nerability to resource depletion. In some ways the former Pre mier conceded defeat on this issue toward the end of his term, but at least he was on to it and he spoke of it. I don't hear any thing resembling the realization of the risk to our long-term fu-

120 ALBERTA HANSARD June 7, 1989 ture from either of the other parties in this Legislature. [Mr. Jonson in the Chair] I know the Minister of the Environment is obsessed by what he calls the opposition, but I think that's really anybody who doesn't buy the argument he's making at a particular point in time. I think he needs to find it in his heart to look to policies which help the government to make correct decisions for the future. We have options in Alberta even though this forest man agement giveaway is designed to take options away in the fu ture.

I mean, has anybody in the government really thought of what some of the other ways are to develop that absolutely mas sive area of the province? Aren't there ways that we can create more jobs rather than chasing a window of opportunity or trying to catch somebody else's wave in the market? I want to remind members, in conclusion to my remarks, that it was here in Alberta 57 years ago that labour, farmers, and other progressive people got together to form the Co-operative Commonwealth Federation. It happened in the city of Calgary. They have more than hockey down there, Mr. Speaker.

The United Farmers of Alberta, who were at one time the govern ment of this province, voted in convention to join with the CCF. The CCF fought hard to put the concerns of citizens first in the political agenda. They fought to make sure that no man's or woman's worth and dignity would be sacrificed to the profit of another. I think those political values could inform us today. I'm proud of our movement's role in the great social causes of the last half century, but we're not going to rest We're going to pioneer the cause that I spoke of, of strengthening our econ omy through decentralization and popular control.

I promised my constituents that I would be a strong voice for them in this Legislative Assembly. I promised to listen as well as to talk. I promised to try to distinguish when it was time to go along and when it was time to fight I said that when the time came I would be prepared to fight hard for working families in Jasper Place, and I meant that Over my years working in the political process, I've come to put my faith with people. People under stand at a very instinctive level the need to have sustainable benefits from our economy.

Given the choice, given adequate information, most people will not willingly destroy their en vironment. But there are always those who are prepared to de stroy somebody else's little corner of it, just for a little while, just for the sake of a particular project. I think the colour of the future is green. We're not going to have a sustainable future unless we develop economic and po litical institutions which put the survival of our species and oth ers ahead of other values we may want to chase.

It's only if we can begin to view people as an end in themselves, not as a means to another's end, that we'll be able to do that. For me, that's the crux of the matter and it's what democratic socialism is all about. If you want to know what side we're on, Mr. Speaker, we're on the side of the future, of making sure we have a future. We're on the side of future choices for people.

I was interested to learn on some of my travels recently that the decision-making process of most native Indian bands through the ages has been to sit down and determine whether a proposal makes sense through to the seventh generation forward. I think that's the kind of thinking we need, and I think it's the kind of thinking most people will respond to. I feel a very special affection for our province of Alberta. It's a young province, and that's an exciting aspect. We have a chance to avoid some of the mistakes the older parts of Canada and the older parts of the world have made. I often think, Mr.

Speaker, that almost anyone can learn from their own mistakes, but if you can learn from other peoples' mistakes you've really got something. I was born in Alberta. In fact my grandparents on both sides homesteaded in this province, John and Annie McInnis, my paternal grandparents, near Bruce in the Vegreville constituency and Lorenz and Anna Jensen near the town of Rocky Mountain House. My parents were married in Rocky Mountain House. They moved to Jasper Place when I was two years old. Now my family and I share the burden and the joy of representing that constituency. I believe, Mr.

Speaker, it's time in our province that we start to treat people as an end in themselves. I think we can achieve a truly sustainable economy. I think we can show the world a model in our province of intercultural harmony. I know we can do these things, and I stand ready here to do my part Thank you. MR. SEVERTSON: Mr. Speaker, it is my privilege to rise to day to speak for the first time in this Assembly as MLA for the constituency of Innisfail. It is indeed a great honour to partici pate in the debate on the Speech from the Throne so graciously delivered by Her Honour the Lieutenant Governor. Mr.

Speaker, let me be allowed to congratulate you on your appointment as Deputy Speaker. I feel I express the consensus of this Assembly in saying that your stewardship and fairness is recognized and appreciated by all. I would also like to congratulate my colleagues and members from Dunvegan and Calgary-Foothills for their fine speeches on moving and seconding the Speech from the Throne. They are a credit to their constituents' wise choice as their MLAs.

In response to the Speech from the Throne and the proposed amendment put forward by the hon. member for Edmonton- Norwood, I would like to add my support to the hon. members that have spoken against the amendment Mr. Speaker, a few days after my election to this Assembly as a representative for the riding of Innisfail, I came to Ed monton in the course of my duties. As I walked toward the Leg islature Building down 108th Street the view made me realize the magnitude of the responsibility that has been placed upon my shoulders.

As I walked toward this marvelous building, I became keenly aware that the 12,000-plus voters of the Innisfail riding had placed their trust in me as their elected member of the Legislature of Alberta. As members of this elected Assembly, we should not lose sight of the fact that as guardians of this province we are entrusted with the parliamentary principles of fair and equal rep resentation of our constituents be they young or old, of sound health or infirm. Developing legislation for the orderly ex pedience and the administration of our society is a heavy responsibility.

We must ensure that the laws of our society are equally applied and upheld. Mr. Speaker, this constituency has placed its trust in me, and it has been well represented for the past 10 years by my predecessor, Mr. Nigel Pengelly. The con stituents of Innisfail recognized that Nigel carried out his job with diligence, energy, and ability during his decade in this As sembly. I would like to thank Nigel Pengelly personally on be half of the Innisfail constituents for his wisdom, his dedication, and his encouragement I hope I can live up to the sterling ex ample Nigel has set before me.

June 7, 1989 ALBERTA HANSARD 121 Along with Nigel, I must mention another Conservative who has influenced my life greatly. This man impressed upon me when I was a young boy of 12 that this was a man who con veyed to everyone he met the passion and depth of commitment he held for his country, his province, his home and family, and his politics. I speak, of course, of the legendary John Diefen baker. From him I learned that the Progressive Conservative philosophy and policy have a root and home within the prag matic and compassionate people of the prairies and western Canada.

John Diefenbaker was not afraid to stand up and be counted as a Progressive Conservative, a PC with a vision of a better future for all through the growth of free enterprise cou pled with compassion. I am proud to say that my conservatism is deeply rooted in the soils of the west, especially in the rich and fertile soils of the Innisfail constituency. It is with great pride, Mr. Speaker, that I am representing one of the most beautiful and historic con stituencies in this province. Innisfail lies in the heart of rural Alberta between Edmonton and Calgary.

The Red Deer River winds through the western portion of the constituency and forms the northern and eastern boundaries. The land contained within this area is fertile with good black soil deposited by the receding glaciers of the last ice age. The rolling hills, the grasslands, and the l

Document details

Collection	Alberta — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	19890607
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	L22 S1 19890607 1430 01 han.pdf
Language	en
Format	json
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	7a98b474a6451cec4b4c1b7a0db8af200572a596

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