British Columbia Hansard — 9 October 2019, p.m., Issue 272 (41st Parliament, 4th Session)

20191009pm-Hansard-n272

British Columbia — Debates (Hansard)

Fourth Session, 41st Parliament OFFICIAL REPORT OF DEBATES (HANSARD) Wednesday, October 9, 2019 Afternoon Sitting Issue No. 272 THE HONOURABLE DARRYL PLECAS, SPEAKER ISSN 1499-2175

PROVINCE OF BRITISH COLUMBIA (Entered Confederation July 20, 1871) LIEUTENANT-GOVERNOR Her Honour the Honourable Janet Austin, OBC Fourth Session, 41st Parliament SPEAKER OF THE LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Honourable Darryl Plecas EXECUTIVE COUNCIL Premier and President of the Executive Council ............................................................................................................... Hon. John Horgan Deputy Premier and Minister of Finance............................................................................................................................Hon.

Carole James Minister of Advanced Education, Skills and Training..................................................................................................... Hon. Melanie Mark Minister of Agriculture.........................................................................................................................................................Hon. Lana Popham Attorney General.................................................................................................................................................................Hon.

David Eby, QC Minister of Children and Family Development ............................................................................................................ Hon. Katrine Conroy Minister of State for Child Care...................................................................................................................................... Hon. Katrina Chen Minister of Education ............................................................................................................................................................ Hon.

Rob Fleming Minister of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources ...............................................................................................Hon. Michelle Mungall Minister of Environment and Climate Change Strategy............................................................................................. Hon. George Heyman Minister of Forests, Lands, Natural Resource Operations and Rural Development ..............................................Hon.

Doug Donaldson Minister of Health .....................................................................................................................................................................Hon. Adrian Dix Minister of Indigenous Relations and Reconciliation ......................................................................................................... Hon. Scott Fraser Minister of Jobs, Trade and Technology............................................................................................................................ Hon.

Bruce Ralston Minister of State for Trade...............................................................................................................................................Hon. George Chow Minister of Labour ...................................................................................................................................................................Hon. Harry Bains Minister of Mental Health and Addictions............................................................................................................................ Hon.

Judy Darcy Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing and Minister of Citizens’ Services ...................................................... Hon. Selina Robinson Minister of Public Safety and Solicitor General ........................................................................................................... Hon. Mike Farnworth Minister of Social Development and Poverty Reduction..............................................................................................Hon.

Shane Simpson Minister of Tourism, Arts and Culture.....................................................................................................................................Hon. Lisa Beare Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure................................................................................................................ Hon.

Claire Trevena LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Leader of the Official Opposition................................................................................................................................Andrew Wilkinson, QC Leader of the Third Party ....................................................................................................................................................Dr. Andrew Weaver Deputy Speaker................................................................................................................................................................................

Raj Chouhan Assistant Deputy Speaker................................................................................................................................................................... Joan Isaacs Deputy Chair, Committee of the Whole ................................................................................................................ Spencer Chandra Herbert Acting Clerk of the Legislative Assembly...............................................................................................................................

Kate Ryan-Lloyd Clerk Assistant — Committees and Interparliamentary Relations ..........................................................................................Susan Sourial Sessional Law Clerk...............................................................................................................................................Loredana Catalli-Sonier, QC Parliamentary Counsel ...................................................................................................................................................................... S.

Suzie Seo Acting Sergeant-at-Arms..................................................................................................................................................................Greg Nelson

ALPHABETICAL LIST OF MEMBERS Ashton, Dan (BC Liberal) ........................................................................ Penticton Bains, Hon. Harry (NDP)...............................................................Surrey-Newton Barnett, Donna (BC Liberal) ................................................... Cariboo-Chilcotin Beare, Hon. Lisa (NDP).............................................Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows Begg, Garry (NDP) ..................................................................... Surrey-Guildford Bernier, Mike (BC Liberal) .......................................................

Peace River South Bond, Shirley (BC Liberal)......................................... Prince George–Valemount Brar, Jagrup (NDP)..................................................................... Surrey-Fleetwood Cadieux, Stephanie (BC Liberal)....................................................... Surrey South Chandra Herbert, Spencer (NDP) ..................................... Vancouver–West End Chen, Hon. Katrina (NDP).....................................................Burnaby-Lougheed Chouhan, Raj (NDP) ............................................................... Burnaby-Edmonds Chow, Hon.

George (NDP)............................................... Vancouver-Fraserview Clovechok, Doug (BC Liberal) ................................ Columbia River–Revelstoke Coleman, Rich (BC Liberal) ...............................................................Langley East Conroy, Hon. Katrine (NDP)......................................................... Kootenay West Darcy, Hon.

Judy (NDP) ............................................................New Westminster Davies, Dan (BC Liberal) ..........................................................Peace River North de Jong, Michael, QC (BC Liberal) ............................................ Abbotsford West Dean, Mitzi (NDP)...............................................................Esquimalt-Metchosin D’Eith, Bob (NDP) ...............................................................Maple Ridge–Mission Dix, Hon. Adrian (NDP)......................................................Vancouver-Kingsway Donaldson, Hon.

Doug (NDP).....................................................................Stikine Eby, Hon. David, QC (NDP)............................................. Vancouver–Point Grey Elmore, Mable (NDP)....................................................... Vancouver-Kensington Farnworth, Hon. Mike (NDP) ...................................................... Port Coquitlam Fleming, Hon. Rob (NDP) .....................................................Victoria–Swan Lake Foster, Eric (BC Liberal)........................................................... Vernon-Monashee Fraser, Hon.

Scott (NDP) ................................................ Mid Island–Pacific Rim Furstenau, Sonia (BC Green Party) ........................................... Cowichan Valley Gibson, Simon (BC Liberal) ................................................. Abbotsford-Mission Glumac, Rick (NDP)........................................................Port Moody–Coquitlam Heyman, Hon. George (NDP) .............................................. Vancouver-Fairview Horgan, Hon. John (NDP) ...............................................

Langford–Juan de Fuca Hunt, Marvin (BC Liberal) .......................................................Surrey-Cloverdale Isaacs, Joan (BC Liberal) .........................................Coquitlam–Burke Mountain James, Hon. Carole (NDP)...................................................Victoria–Beacon Hill Johal, Jas (BC Liberal)...............................................

Richmond-Queensborough Kahlon, Ravi (NDP)..............................................................................Delta North Kang, Anne (NDP)..................................................................Burnaby–Deer Lake Kyllo, Greg (BC Liberal)............................................................................ Shuswap Larson, Linda (BC Liberal) .............................................Boundary-Similkameen Lee, Michael (BC Liberal) ......................................................

Vancouver-Langara Leonard, Ronna-Rae (NDP) ....................................................Courtenay-Comox Letnick, Norm (BC Liberal)............................................Kelowna–Lake Country Ma, Bowinn (NDP) ................................................... North Vancouver–Lonsdale Malcolmson, Sheila (NDP) .......................................................................Nanaimo Mark, Hon. Melanie (NDP) ..................................... Vancouver–Mount Pleasant Martin, John (BC Liberal)......................................................................

Chilliwack Milobar, Peter (BC Liberal).................................... Kamloops–North Thompson Morris, Mike (BC Liberal) ..........................................Prince George–Mackenzie Mungall, Hon. Michelle (NDP).................................................... Nelson-Creston Oakes, Coralee (BC Liberal) ...........................................................Cariboo North Olsen, Adam (BC Green Party)........................... Saanich North and the Islands Paton, Ian (BC Liberal)......................................................................... Delta South Plecas, Hon.

Darryl (Ind.) ..........................................................Abbotsford South Polak, Mary (BC Liberal) ............................................................................ Langley Popham, Hon. Lana (NDP)..............................................................Saanich South Ralston, Hon. Bruce (NDP) .......................................................... Surrey-Whalley Redies, Tracy (BC Liberal) ..................................................... Surrey–White Rock Reid, Linda (BC Liberal) ................................................

Richmond South Centre Rice, Jennifer (NDP) ............................................................................ North Coast Robinson, Hon. Selina (NDP) ....................................... Coquitlam-Maillardville Ross, Ellis (BC Liberal)..................................................................................Skeena Routledge, Janet (NDP) .................................................................. Burnaby North Routley, Doug (NDP) ................................................Nanaimo–North Cowichan Rustad, John (BC Liberal) ..............................................................

Nechako Lakes Shypitka, Tom (BC Liberal) .............................................................Kootenay East Simons, Nicholas (NDP) ........................................Powell River–Sunshine Coast Simpson, Hon. Shane (NDP)................................................

Vancouver-Hastings Sims, Jinny (NDP) .......................................................................Surrey-Panorama Singh, Rachna (NDP) ........................................................Surrey–Green Timbers Stewart, Ben (BC Liberal) ................................................................Kelowna West Stilwell, Michelle (BC Liberal)..............................................Parksville-Qualicum Stone, Todd (BC Liberal)........................................

Kamloops–South Thompson Sturdy, Jordan (BC Liberal).......................................West Vancouver–Sea to Sky Sullivan, Sam (BC Liberal)...............................................Vancouver–False Creek Sultan, Ralph (BC Liberal) ......................................... West Vancouver–Capilano Tegart, Jackie (BC Liberal) ................................................................ Fraser-Nicola Thomson, Steve (BC Liberal)..................................................... Kelowna-Mission Thornthwaite, Jane (BC Liberal) .............................

North Vancouver–Seymour Throness, Laurie (BC Liberal) ..................................................... Chilliwack-Kent Trevena, Hon. Claire (NDP) .............................................................. North Island Wat, Teresa (BC Liberal) ................................................Richmond North Centre Weaver, Dr. Andrew (BC Green Party) ......................... Oak Bay–Gordon Head Wilkinson, Andrew, QC (BC Liberal) .............................. Vancouver-Quilchena Y ap, John (BC Liberal)..........................................................

Richmond-Steveston LIST OF MEMBERS BY RIDING Abbotsford-Mission ..........................................................................Simon Gibson Abbotsford South ..................................................................... Hon. Darryl Plecas Abbotsford West .................................................................... Michael de Jong, QC Boundary-Similkameen.....................................................................

Linda Larson Burnaby–Deer Lake ...............................................................................Anne Kang Burnaby-Edmonds ..............................................................................Raj Chouhan Burnaby-Lougheed................................................................... Hon. Katrina Chen Burnaby North................................................................................

Janet Routledge Cariboo-Chilcotin ............................................................................Donna Barnett Cariboo North .................................................................................. Coralee Oakes Chilliwack.............................................................................................. John Martin Chilliwack-Kent..............................................................................Laurie Throness Columbia River–Revelstoke........................................................

Doug Clovechok Coquitlam–Burke Mountain................................................................. Joan Isaacs Coquitlam-Maillardville..................................................... Hon. Selina Robinson Courtenay-Comox ................................................................. Ronna-Rae Leonard Cowichan Valley ............................................................................

Sonia Furstenau Delta North ...........................................................................................Ravi Kahlon Delta South.................................................................................................Ian Paton Esquimalt-Metchosin.............................................................................Mitzi Dean Fraser-Nicola........................................................................................

Jackie Tegart Kamloops–North Thompson............................................................Peter Milobar Kamloops–South Thompson ................................................................Todd Stone Kelowna–Lake Country....................................................................Norm Letnick Kelowna-Mission.............................................................................

Steve Thomson Kelowna West.........................................................................................Ben Stewart Kootenay East .....................................................................................Tom Shypitka Kootenay West ...................................................................... Hon. Katrine Conroy Langford–Juan de Fuca............................................................. Hon. John Horgan Langley....................................................................................................

Mary Polak Langley East .......................................................................................Rich Coleman Maple Ridge–Mission ............................................................................ Bob D’Eith Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows ..........................................................Hon. Lisa Beare Mid Island–Pacific Rim .............................................................. Hon. Scott Fraser Nanaimo ....................................................................................

Sheila Malcolmson Nanaimo–North Cowichan.............................................................. Doug Routley Nechako Lakes ...................................................................................... John Rustad Nelson-Creston.................................................................. Hon. Michelle Mungall New Westminster ......................................................................... Hon. Judy Darcy North Coast..........................................................................................

Jennifer Rice North Island ............................................................................ Hon. Claire Trevena North Vancouver–Lonsdale ................................................................. Bowinn Ma North Vancouver–Seymour ......................................................Jane Thornthwaite Oak Bay–Gordon Head ..........................................................Dr.

Andrew Weaver Parksville-Qualicum .....................................................................Michelle Stilwell Peace River North.................................................................................. Dan Davies Peace River South ............................................................................... Mike Bernier Penticton................................................................................................ Dan Ashton Port Coquitlam .................................................................... Hon.

Mike Farnworth Port Moody–Coquitlam .....................................................................Rick Glumac Powell River–Sunshine Coast ..................................................... Nicholas Simons Prince George–Mackenzie ..................................................................Mike Morris Prince George–Valemount.................................................................

Shirley Bond Richmond North Centre ........................................................................Teresa Wat Richmond-Queensborough .......................................................................Jas Johal Richmond South Centre........................................................................ Linda Reid Richmond-Steveston..................................................................................

John Y ap Saanich North and the Islands............................................................Adam Olsen Saanich South............................................................................Hon. Lana Popham Shuswap .................................................................................................... Greg Kyllo Skeena ......................................................................................................... Ellis Ross Stikine ..................................................................................Hon.

Doug Donaldson Surrey-Cloverdale............................................................................... Marvin Hunt Surrey-Fleetwood ...................................................................................Jagrup Brar Surrey–Green Timbers ......................................................................Rachna Singh Surrey-Guildford ....................................................................................Garry Begg Surrey-Newton.............................................................................Hon.

Harry Bains Surrey-Panorama..................................................................................... Jinny Sims Surrey South............................................................................... Stephanie Cadieux Surrey-Whalley........................................................................ Hon. Bruce Ralston Surrey–White Rock ............................................................................. Tracy Redies Vancouver-Fairview ............................................................ Hon.

George Heyman Vancouver–False Creek....................................................................... Sam Sullivan Vancouver-Fraserview .............................................................Hon. George Chow Vancouver-Hastings .............................................................. Hon. Shane Simpson Vancouver-Kensington ..................................................................... Mable Elmore Vancouver-Kingsway ................................................................... Hon.

Adrian Dix Vancouver-Langara .............................................................................. Michael Lee Vancouver–Mount Pleasant ................................................... Hon. Melanie Mark Vancouver–Point Grey...........................................................Hon.

David Eby, QC Vancouver-Quilchena ......................................................Andrew Wilkinson, QC Vancouver–West End....................................................Spencer Chandra Herbert Vernon-Monashee...................................................................................Eric Foster Victoria–Beacon Hill ................................................................ Hon. Carole James Victoria–Swan Lake .................................................................. Hon. Rob Fleming West Vancouver–Capilano .................................................................

Ralph Sultan West Vancouver–Sea to Sky ..............................................................Jordan Sturdy Party Standings: BC Liberal 42; NDP 41; BC Green Party 3; Independent 1

CONTENTS Wednesday, October 9, 2019 Afternoon Sitting Page Routine Business Introductions by Members..................................................................................................................................................... 9997 Statements ................................................................................................................................................................................ 9998 Mobile homes fire in Esquimalt area M.

Dean Introductions by Members..................................................................................................................................................... 9998 Tributes ..................................................................................................................................................................................... 9998 John Finlayson D. Routley Emergency rescue by Sunshine Coast residents N.

Simons Introductions by Members..................................................................................................................................................... 9999 Statements (Standing Order 25B) ......................................................................................................................................... 9999 Morden Colliery Park and history of Morden mine D. Routley Shoreline Cleanup Day in Richmond T. Wat Small business and Burnaby Business Hall of Fame A. Kang Terry Fox Run and fundraising by Jim Terrion S. Bond Burnaby Heights Art Crawl J.

Routledge Social services agencies in Kootenay area T. Shypitka Oral Questions....................................................................................................................................................................... 10001 Premier’s office response to investigation of Legislature senior staff A. Wilkinson Hon. J. Horgan Police investigation of former Citizens’ Services Minister and status of executive assistant M. de Jong Hon. D. Eby Soil disposal site in Shawnigan Lake watershed S. Furstenau Hon. G.

Heyman Police investigation of former Citizens’ Services Minister and status of executive assistant M. Polak Hon. D. Eby Hon. J. Horgan Freedom-of-information requests and government recordkeeping S. Bond Hon. D. Eby Petitions .................................................................................................................................................................................. 10006 A.

Weaver Orders of the Day Tabling Documents............................................................................................................................................................... 10006 Environmental Appeal Board, annual report, 2018-19

Second Reading of Bills ........................................................................................................................................................ 10006 Bill 36 — Gaming Control Amendment Act, 2019 Hon. D. Eby J. Y ap Hon. S. Fraser E. Ross A. Olsen R. Leonard J. Rustad Hon. D. Donaldson D. Ashton S. Chandra Herbert B. Stewart J. Rice S. Gibson Hon. J. Darcy R. Coleman

WEDNESDAY , OCTOBER 9, 2019 The House met at 1:35 p.m. [Mr. Speaker in the chair.] Routine Business Prayers. Introductions by Members Hon. A. Dix: Members on both sides of the House, over the lunch-hour, had the opportunity to meet with represen- tatives of the B.C. Lung Association. The Lung Association, as all of you know, does extraordinary work in communit- ies across B.C. — in particular, working with us closely right now on issues around vaping, which are so much in our thoughts these days. Their continuing work on smoking ces- sation and other things is so important.

Of course, the work they do in support of people across B.C. is recognized by everyone. I want to welcome to the House Christopher Lam, the president and CEO; Jennifer Callaghan, the director of health promotion and tobacco interventions; Dr. Bob Schellenberg, the board chair; and Mike Ellis, an Island representative. I’ d like to welcome them to the House right now. There you go. Another group that contributes enormously to the health of British Columbians, the Pacific Hep C Network, is here in the buildings.

I wanted to introduce to the House at this time Deb Schmitz, the executive director, and Daryl Luster, the president. They do extraordinary work around B.C., and I know everyone would want to wish them welcome. N. Letnick:I’ d also like to join the Minister of Health and all members of the House in welcoming folks from the B.C. Lung Association. We’re going to have continuing discus- sions this afternoon. I won’t name all the names, since the minister has already done it.

Also, the people from Pacific Hep C, Daryl Luster and Deb Schmitz, have the goal, along with the WHO, of eliminating Hep C as a threat worldwide by 2030. Would the House please join the minister and everyone else to make them all feel very welcome. Hon. J. Horgan: Joining us in the gallery today is an extraordinary individual, someone who has spent 25 years as a constituency assistant serving the people of British Colum- bia. That individual is Cate Jones. She is in the gallery today. Cate is a proud Victorian who now lives in Vancouver.

She was the constituency assistant for Joy MacPhail for a decade, in Vancouver-Hastings. When her current boyfriend took that job, she had to move across Boundary Road to Burnaby, where she worked for the member for Burnaby-Edmonds, the former member for Burnaby–Deer Lake and the current member now for Burnaby North. Cate has helped thousands of people. The Leader of the Opposition just yesterday introduced all of the CAs for all of the members on the opposition side. We all know how important CAs are. But can you imagine spending 25 years as a constituency assistant in Vancouver and Burnaby? Truly extraordinary.

Cate measures her calendar by full moons. She’s had 300 full moons since she started her job as a CA. She has four cats — Elliot, Syd, Peanut and Daisy. Elliot is known as the mayor of Burrardview. Interestingly, not a cat named Binky Bonkers, which comes as a surprise to anyone who knows the hamburger of all hamburgers, Cate Jones. Would you please — after 10,000 steps today already on her Fitbit, I’m sure — say thank you, thank you, thank you to Cate Jones for being the partner of the member for Vancou- ver-Hastings and a great CA. T.

Stone:It gives me a great deal of pleasure to welcome to the gallery here today, on behalf of the member for Kam- loops–North Thompson as well, David Johnson, who’s the executive director of the Kamloops Brain Injury Association. Every year 160,000 people experience an acquired brain injury. It’s the leading cause of death and disability for Cana- dians under the age of 40. Approximately 1½ million Cana- dians live with the effects of an acquired brain injury. [1:40 p.m.] The Kamloops Brain Injury Association has been helping the people of Kamloops and the Thompson valley since 1986.

We’re so very appreciative of the work that they do for the people of Kamloops. I would ask the House to please make David Johnson wel- come and to thank him and his colleagues for the great work that they do looking after folks back home in Kamloops. Hon. M. Mark:In the gallery today, we are joined by a number of leaders in post-secondary education. We have guests from the Federation of Post-Secondary Educators of British Columbia. I’ d like to acknowledge the work of the 10,000 faculty and staff throughout the province that FPSE represents.

A total of 19 faculty and staff representatives are here on behalf of their organization and representing B.C. ’s teach- ing universities, colleges, institutes and private sector insti- tutions. They’re meeting with myself, as minister, and many members on both sides of the chambers.

Will the House please join me in welcoming Rod Hay- ward, president of the UFV Faculty and Staff Association; Virginia Jacklin, director of the TRU Open Learning Faculty Association; Jasmine Nicholsfigueiredo, president of the Douglas College Faculty Association; Sean Parkinson, FPSE’s secretary-treasurer; Monica Sanchez-Flores, presid- ent of the TRU Faculty Association; and Taryn Thomson, president of the VCC Faculty Association. 9997

Would the House please join me in welcoming our special guests. M. Morris:I also have the pleasure, on behalf of my col- league from Prince George–Valemount, to welcome a con- stituent who works extremely hard for the Brain Injured Group in Prince George. Alison Hagreen is the executive director of that association. It has been in existence for over 30 years. It was described last year in local media as the most innovative and provocative association in western Canada. I believe they were referring to the Brain Injury Association in British Columbia. Would the House please make them welcome.

Statements MOBILE HOMES FIRE IN ESQUIMALT AREA M. Dean:A harrowing incident occurred in my constitu- ency earlier today. At 5:38 this morning, the View Royal fire department received a dispatch to a fire on Craigflower Road and immediately called for support from the Colwood and Esquimalt fire departments. Four engines, two ladder trucks and two rescue trucks were quickly on the scene, with 25 firefighters commanded by five chiefs. When they arrived, three trailer homes were fully involved, with fire spreading to a house and a fourth trailer.

Four citizens were sent to hospital, and six have been dis- placed because of this fire. Accommodations for tonight are now being arranged. Thank you to View Royal Fire Chief Paul Hurst and his firefighters. Thank you for the mutual aid from Esquimalt and Colwood fire departments, and thank you to the para- medics. Thank you to the West Shore and Victoria police who assisted on the scene. I hope all members of this House will join me in sending our condolences and best wishes to all those impacted by this tragedy this morning. Introductions by Members Hon. K. Conroy: I have three sets of introductions today.

The first one is actually a constituent who’s here: Fred Kanigan. He’s a retired probation officer. They keep calling him back to work because he did such a good job. He’s an amazing supporter in my community, and it was really great to see him here. Could you please welcome Fred to the gallery. I have two more. We all have excellent staff in our ministry office. Since July, my former AC Emily White had left us, and we have had three different people coming from the ministry to work in my office: Jana Sexton, Laura Dixon and Joe Stukohovic. I just want to thank them.

We know how difficult that job can be, and they have been amazing at filling in until we have our new AC, who is arriving next week. We’re looking forward to it. Marina Holding is coming. But here in the gallery today is Jana Sexton, who did the majority of the work in filling in, and Kaitlin Morton, our admin assistant. Could you please welcome them to the gallery. One more. This one is kind of personal, Mr. Speaker. October is a big month in our family. We call it birthday month, and we kick it off today. Today my oldest grand- daughter is turning 19, and her brother is turning 14.

Tomorrow their cousin Eric is turning 15. [1:45 p.m.] On the Sunday, the sister — I’ve got to keep this straight — of Daira and Ryen is turning 13. And on the 19th, Alex- ia is having her champagne birthday. She’s turning 19 on the 19th. Please join me in congratulating all those five grandkids on their birthdays in October. T. Shypitka:I’ d like to echo the welcoming from the Min- ister of Advanced Education of the Federation of Post-Sec- ondary Educators of B.C.

From my riding, we have Leslie Molnar, who is the second vice-president of the federation, and Joan Kaun, who’s the president of the College of the Rockies Faculty Association. Would the House make them, please, feel welcome. Hon. K. Chen:I’m really thankful to have the opportunity to introduce Sharon Gregson and Lynell Anderson, from the Coalition of Child Care Advocates, who are visiting the Legislature today and engaging with members from this House to talk about the importance of early learning and child care.

I really want to take the opportunity to thank them, along with many other parents and advocates from across the province, not just as the minister of state but also as a mother with a young child myself. Thank you so much for your years of advocacy to make child care a top priority for our province. I hope the House will make them feel very, very welcome. Tributes JOHN FINLAYSON D. Routley:I’ d like to ask everybody: what’s your favourite song? Y ou probably, whether it’s four or five…. If I said, “Who’s the nicest person you ever met?” it’s probably easier.

It’s probably the member for Penticton, for most of us. But for me, it puts me in a conflict between the member for Pen- ticton and my father-in-law, John Finlayson, who, about 45 minutes ago, got out of surgery with five bypasses that were, very fortunately, discovered by chance rather than tragedy. I’ d encourage all of us to take care of our health, but I want to just say how wonderful that man is. A former member of the B.C. Real Estate Council and president of the Vancou- ver Island Real Estate Board, an absolutely loving, wonderful guy — so exuberant, so encouraging, so positive, so gener- ous.

An absolutely wonderful person. 9998 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, October 9, 2019

Get well, John Finlayson. Will the House please help me celebrate a really wonderful guy. EMERGENCY RESCUE BY SUNSHINE COAST RESIDENTS N. Simons: I just want to pay tribute to a couple of young men from my riding. Nolan Johnson and Jakob Thornton, a week ago today, were dirt-biking about eight kilometres outside of Pender Harbour when they came across an SUV with a gentleman in it. They thought it was pretty unusual because they were out of the way, off the regular trails, and they knocked on the window. The old guy gave them a thumbs-up, and as they were walking away, they heard him tapping again.

They went back. They opened the door, and he said: “I’ve been here for three days. ” He’s a 90-year-old man, and those boys knew exactly what to do immediately. One of them ran off to get water, on his bike — called 911. Cheryl Jensen, from the local paramedics, went up there in her pickup truck. All the emergency dispatch happened — a very pro- fessional rescue. He’s healthy — 90-year-old Paul Jones, who is a well-known figure on the Sunshine Coast, one of the founders of the Spipiyus Provincial Park.

I just want to say our province is filled with young people who care very much for their province and for the citizens of their community. They’re smart, and they know what to do. It speaks to all of our communities. I just want to raise their names and hold our hands up to them and thank them for their work. Introductions by Members S. Sullivan:I’m fortunate to have four different classes from Elsie Roy School who will be coming in and out of the gallery today. I’ d especially like to acknowledge the teachers, Ms. McCleary and Ms.

Wyss; parents Nicole Olenick, Katy Krawchuk, Kateryna Visotkii and Rosa Gilfanov; and espe- cially a student, Liam Roethlingshoefer, who is babysitting our dog during the time when I’m here. So a special thanks to him and all his fellow students. Please welcome them to the gallery. [1:50 p.m.] G. Begg: Joining us in the House today is Dr. Akshay Jain. Dr. Jain is the first Canadian physician to be triple-board- certified by the American boards in endocrinology, internal medicine and obesity medicine.

He trained in internal medi- cine at Rochester, New Y ork, where he became the only four- time winner of the prestigious Rochester Academy of Medi- cine Award during his residency. He went on to complete a fellowship in endocrinology at Harbor-UCLA and the City of Hope national medical centre in Los Angeles. He holds the distinction of being the young- est physician to sit on the board of directors of the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists. He’s currently the president of the Canadian

chapter of the American Associ- ation of Clinical Endocrinologists. As importantly, he’s a res- ident of Surrey. He travels the province teaching doctors and treating patients. Will the House please join me in making him welcome. M. Dean: Arriving at the precinct any moment now is Elder Shirley Alphonse, originally from Cowichan and now living in T’Sou-ke Nation. I would remind all members that we’ve been generously invited for a smudging in the Ned DeBeck Lounge this afternoon. S. Sullivan:I’ d like to acknowledge the students that have just arrived from Elsie Roy School, teachers Ms. McCleary and Ms.

Wyss, and the parents who are with them. Please welcome them to the gallery. Statements (Standing Order 25B) MORDEN COLLIERY PARK AND HISTORY OF MORDEN MINE D. Routley:Not much unifies this House more than a col- lective groan, like when I say Morden Colliery Historic Park. I’ve said it many, many times in this House, seeking fund- ing and support and seeking awareness of that treasure in my community that was deteriorating and at risk of collapsing.

On Saturday, October 5, 1909, 100 years ago, at about this time of the day, the miners of Extension, the families and the community were reeling in the aftermath of an explosion that killed 32 miners and forever altered the community and all of those families. I still represent many of those famil- ies — people who remember those stories from their parents and their grandparents. This is a symbol, in their community, of its roots. It is also a reminder of many other things.

It is a reminder to us all of a historical injustice, the Dunsmuir land grant and its role in that historical injustice: the giving away of First Nations lands. It is a statute to the determination and courage of all the workers, as it is the foundation point of the labour move- ment in British Columbia. Most of the history of British Columbia has melted into the environment. We have little to remind us of where we came from and for us to teach our children about what this place was and its transition. The Morden Colliery Historic Park is one of those places.

It’s a unique treasure, an arti- fact, a special place in all those different ways, and it was at risk of falling. The very best Environment Minister ever, who sits down there, has given the funding for this park to be restored and conserved. I think it’s a most fantastic thing. There was a ceremony on October 5 in Ladysmith, where those families came together to remember those lost workers and all of the significance that that played. This is a very important Wednesday, October 9, 2019 British Columbia Debates 9999

thing. A small amount, sometimes, from this place can be so important to a community. Thank you to the Minister of Environment. SHORELINE CLEANUP DAY IN RICHMOND T. Wat:A few weeks ago I had the privilege of taking

part in the first annual Canadian community shoreline cleanup at Garry Point Park in Richmond, put on by Air Canada and 4Ocean, a global company that actively removes trash from oceans and coastlines, inspiring communities to work towards sustainable economic practices. Almost 350 parti- cipants took

part in the cleanup that saw over 900 cigarette butts, almost 1,400 pieces of Styrofoam, almost 500 plastic bags, more than 150 plastic straws, two lawn chairs and even a car bumper removed from the shoreline. [1:55 p.m.] 4Ocean’s partnership with Air Canada grew from the airline’s commitment to a single-use plastic reduction pro- gram that will see almost 14 million single-use plastic items removed from its flights this year, from stir sticks to bags. This is an astounding number, but it shows that every business can find ways to cut down on plastic. They just need to be bold.

This is the time for action but also a time for innovation. Recycled plastics are being turned into shoes and building materials, and scientists have even converted plastic bags into fuel. Last fall I mentioned in this House some local Richmond entrepreneurs making sugarcane straws, which are derived from renewable resources, are eco-friendly and compostable. It is uplifting to know that the entre- preneurial spirit is alive and ready to combat this human- made problem. I implore everyone in this House.

The next time when you are faced with a choice as simple as using a single-use plastic straw, imagine 1,000 of us making that choice. Are we okay with that image? Can we face the most minor of inconveni- ences to do our part for a better future? I know my decision. I hope you do as well. SMALL BUSINESS AND BURNABY BUSINESS HALL OF FAME A.

Kang: In the weeks leading up to Small Business Sat- urday on October 26, I would like to take a moment to express my wholehearted support for all the local businesses in B.C., especially in Burnaby, and to recognize the role that small business owners and entrepreneurs play in strengthen- ing B.C. ’s economy and creating quality, sustainable jobs for people in our community.

Just last week, on Thursday, October 3, more than 200 leaders of the Burnaby business community witnessed the induction of Hilton Vancouver Metrotown into the Burnaby Business Hall of Fame, jointly by Burnaby Board of Trade and the city of Burnaby. Hilton Vancouver Metrotown is now the 17th business to receive the honour. Hilton Vancouver Metrotown is a widely recognized Burnaby-based business that has had a positive and signifi- cant impact in our community throughout the years. Its commitment to community is exemplary to the business community.

Paul Holden, CEO of the Burnaby Board of Trade, proudly states: “The Hilton is emblematic of a hotel that combines those rare qualities of hospitality and top- notch service delivered with a great deal of warmth. It provides a real sense of being a home away from home for travellers as well as the community. ” I am proud to see all the work that our province has been doing in supporting our local businesses, including the establishment of the Small Business Task Force to help small business owners find solutions to their challenges. Small businesses are integral to the growth of British Columbia’s economy.

They support diversity in urban and rural com- munities and are a foundation in all industry sectors. With that, I would like to congratulate all the local busi- nesses that have been the backbone of B.C. ’s economy and an integral part of our society. TERRY FOX RUN AND FUNDRAISING BY JIM TERRION S. Bond: On a chilly fall morning, hundreds of parti- cipants gathered at Lheidli T’ enneh Memorial Park in Prince George to run, to walk, to cycle in the annual Terry Fox Run — each person doing their part to keep Terry’s dream alive.

I want to say a very special thank-you to Scott McWalter, who did an excellent job of organizing the walk for many years, and welcome the new organizer, Ryley Newman. Prince George has a very special connection to Terry Fox. In 1979, Terry came to Prince George to participate in a marathon. That run gave him the confidence to start his Marathon of Hope the following year. Terry Fox inspires us all but none more than Jim Terrion. Jim Terrion is a rock star — not the kind that plays a guitar or the drums but a local legend in our community.

Since 1991, he has been raising funds to support the Terry Fox Marathon of Hope, and his efforts have been nothing short of astounding. From the day he started his mission, he has raised $787,601 — almost $800,000. This year alone he raised over $40,000. Jim couldn’t have done this without the help of his wonderful mom, Faye. [2:00 p.m.] While this accomplishment would be incredible for any person, it is made even more exceptional because Jim was born deaf. When he is raising funds, he communicates by writing things down or using sign language.

Just imagine the extra effort it takes, especially when he is canvassing at people’s doors for a donation. I was proud to recognize Jim at the recent Terry Fox Run in Prince George. Jim has a goal of reaching the $1 million mark in his fundraising efforts, and I have every reason to believe he will just do that. 10000 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, October 9, 2019

Thank you, Jim, for following in Terry’s footsteps. We could not be more proud of you. BURNABY HEIGHTS ART CRAWL J. Routledge:I love art crawls. Every year I try to carve out time to take in the Eastside Culture Crawl, and every year I bring home a new piece of art for my home or office. So ima- gine how excited I was to find out that an art crawl was being organized in my own neighbourhood. The inaugural Burnaby Heights Art Crawl kicked off on Friday, September 27. That evening we celebrated local art and artists while enjoying light refreshments and live music at the North Burnaby Neighbourhood House.

We got to meet the artists and engage with them about their work and their inspiration. The next day I had errands to run on Hast- ings Street in the Heights, and what a treat it was to detour into restaurants, shops and even credit unions to appreciate the art on display. The Burnaby Heights Art Crawl brings together local artists, merchants and residents. It responds to the results of a community survey that identified arts and culture as some- thing important missing in the neighbourhood.

It raises much-needed funds so the neighbourhood house can con- tinue to stay open and offer low-barrier community services and support. By placing art at the forefront, the art crawl creates a vibrant and thriving economy. Our neighbourhood becomes livelier, our community is revitalized, and residents and vis- itors feel more connected. I look forward to the Burnaby Heights Art Crawl being even bigger and drawing more art lovers next year. I bought two pieces of art in the Heights this weekend. One of them is a drawing of a tree growing out of Pinocchio’s nose. It’s calledYour Lies May Grow on You.

The artist and I had a pretty good laugh when I told her where I work. So I brought that piece of art with me to the Legislature. SOCIAL SERVICES AGENCIES IN KOOTENAY AREA T. Shypitka:An old African proverb states it takes a vil- lage to raise a child. As many of my colleagues from rural and northern B.C. understand, the chill of winter is quickly approaching. Some of us even left the snowfall back home on our way to Victoria this week. The change of season brings new business and tourism opportunities for many parts of B.C., injecting life into communities.

Y et for every person enjoying the bounty of winter, there are just as many fearing the coming cold and the fight to survive. The fear is met with warmth and acceptance from local service agencies providing shelter, sustenance and hope. I want to take my time today to highlight a number of these agencies serving the less fortunate in my riding. The Aqanttanam Housing Society is a non-profit geared towards First Nations and non–First Nations whose pur- pose is to construct, hold, manage, provide and maintain not-for-profit rental housing for low-income people in the community.

The Cranbrook Salvation Army provides shelter, feeding and school lunch programs, Christmas food hampers, as well as rescue and suicide prevention. Better at Home is a provincially funded program that sup- ports the non-medical needs of older adults in B.C. It is managed by the United Way, and services are handled by local non-profits. Other service providers include Operation Street Angel, the Community Connections Society of Southeast B.C., ANKORS, the Canadian Mental Health Association, food banks, local church groups and countless other volunteers and private sector organizations.

Many of these organiza- tions have chapters across British Columbia. The takeaway is simple. People need assistance, and we can all give back. It does take a village to raise a child, but I’ d like to extend that it takes a village to care for the less for- tunate as well. So please volunteer even a few hours of your time, because every bit helps for those in need, especially as winter sets in. [2:05 p.m.] Oral Questions PREMIER’S OFFICE RESPONSE TO INVESTIGATION OF LEGISLATURE SENIOR STAFF A. Wilkinson:Y esterday a report by Mr.

Doug LePard, dated September 9, was released to a single media outlet in a redacted form. On page 6, a certain witness 10 is inadvertently identified as the Premier’s chief of staff, Mr. Geoff Meggs. On page 56, it goes on to say that on July 30 of 2018, Mr. Meggs was in receipt of a report of 40 to 50 pages of a long list of allegations. Mr. Meggs recalled, on his interview, that every page had surprising material and that the liquor incident was not the most shocking part. Criminal allega- tions were present in the report. What did Mr. Meggs do with the report?

As former chief constable LePard reports, a credible source, witness 10, Mr. Meggs, shredded the report — four months before two indi- viduals were marched out of this building and are now under criminal investigation. The Premier has consistently stated that his office and his staff had no involvement in the process that led to that rather dramatic event that went to the heart of the credibility of the operations of this building and the hundreds of people who work in it who try to maintain the standards of our demo- cracy. Turns out that wasn’t true.

Here we have a clear written report citing the volunteered evidence of Mr. Meggs, saying that four months before these criminal allegations were made known, he was fully aware Wednesday, October 9, 2019 British Columbia Debates 10001

of it. What did he do with it? He shredded it, destroyed the evidence of his knowledge of this process. The question lands squarely on the Premier’s plate. Does he believe and is he prepared to stand up here today and say that what Mr. Meggs did was wrong? Hon. J. Horgan:I thank the member for the question. The LePard report that he refers to was released to one media outlet yesterday. The member recounted components of that report. It is a lengthy report, and I’m sure his omissions were not deliberate. What Mr. LePard said was that Mr.

Meggs was a credible witness, made no reference to anything wrong with shred- ding a document that had already been passed on, known to Mr. LePard, to law enforcement. Mr. Meggs participated in a meeting with the Speaker and his assistants. He was handed a document of unknown origin that had a series of allegations. He immediately said to the Speaker and his assistant that this material should be passed to the police immediately. That’s what happened. After we were advised…. He was advised of that. I was not aware of the document. After he was advised of that, he dis- posed of the document.

It was not a document created in the Premier’s office. It was not a government document. There were no require- ments to keep it because it had been passed on to the police. Mr. Speaker:The Leader of the Official Opposition on a supplemental. A. Wilkinson:It is a strange world where the Premier’s office, the head of the executive council that governs the province of British Columbia, receives a report containing allegations of serious criminal activity in the heart of the institution that governs this province, and the Premier now tells us it’s just fine for his chief of staff to destroy the document.

The obvious obligation in the highest office in the prov- ince is to report it to the police, not to destroy the evidence of that contact. And what do we see in the face of that clear obligation, whether it’s legal, moral, ethical, political? On July 30, 2018, the chief of staff had an obligation to inform the police, not to shred the document. And then we have a four-month charade where the Premier’s office pretends they didn’t know anything about it. Premier, this goes to the heart of your administration and the credibility of the staff you employ.

So when were you planning to inform this House and inform the public and inform the police that your office was fully aware of this four months before it came to public attention? [2:10 p.m.] Hon. J. Horgan:I just reject the Leader of the Opposi- tion’s premise. My recollection is that the official opposition wanted no part of any investigation into the former Clerk. And where Mr. LePard said that Mr. Meggs was a credible witness and had done the right thing by encouraging the cre- ator of the document to transmit it…. It was a draft copy that was left behind in his office.

He advised the person who cre- ated the document to take it to the police, which Mr. LePard said was the appropriate thing to do. He did not have the same charitable response to the mem- ber for Richmond-East, who refused to participate in the investigation. Mr. Speaker:The Leader of the Official Opposition on a second supplemental. A.

Wilkinson:The Premier of this province has stood in this House and said it’s just fine for the most senior polit- ical staff appointment in this province, the chief of staff to the Premier, to ignore allegations of criminal wrongdoing and let it slide for four months and to pretend to the public that the Premier’s office was unaware of all of these ongoing investigations for a period of four months. This is suppression of evidence. This is obstruction of justice. This is a flagrant example of the Premier’s office put- ting its head in the sand and saying: “Don’t look at me.

I don’t know what’s going on. ” Premier, you did know what was going on, and you did nothing for four months. So it is difficult to contemplate how this institution can carry on while Mr. Meggs, witness 10, remains in your employ. Will you do the right thing and ter- minate him? Hon. J. Horgan:The last point the Leader of the Opposi- tion said: “How can this institution go on?” It’s going on right now because of the capable people that work here. I don’t want to take the members on that side of the House back too far in history, but I remember when I sat on that side of the House and the B.C.

Liberal Party of the day insisted that Mr. James be appointed — despite he did not have the unanimous consent of this institution. Y ou did it anyway. And when, at Legislative Assembly Management Committee meetings where we raised issues of concern about the flagrant abuses that were possible under the rules that the B.C. Liberals had, they said: “Everything’s fine. ” Here’s the reality. When I was advised that there were allegations against the former Clerk…. Interjections. Hon. J. Horgan:Do you want to hear it? Do you want to hear it, or do you just want to bray? Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members.

Members, please. Order, please. Hon. J. Horgan:Why don’t you listen to what I have to say? Wouldn’t that be interesting? 10002 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, October 9, 2019

Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. Order, please. Hon. J. Horgan: When I was advised that there were allegations of wrongdoing to the former Clerk, I said that I have no responsibility to the Legislative Assembly. The man- agement committee does. My responsibility is to executive council. It’s to health care. It’s to education. It’s to child care. It’s to transportation. It’s to the people of British Columbia. We have capable members of this place, one of them sit- ting right beside you, that are responsible for the manage- ment of this institution.

If you have no confidence in LAMC, if you have no confidence in the Clerk’s office, then you should have participated in the investigation. For that member to say that somehow advising the Speak- er’s office to take the information to the police is wrong speaks to his complete incompetence, not just as a member of this place but as Leader of the Opposition. Y ou should have stuck with medicine, Member. Y ou should have stuck with medicine. POLICE INVESTIGATION OF FORMER CITIZENS’ SERVICES MINISTER AND STATUS OF EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT M. de Jong:Well, the…. Interjections. [2:15 p.m.] Mr.

Speaker:The member for Abbotsford West has the floor. Thank you. M. de Jong: It seems that the Premier’s chief of staff has been a rather busy boy. In the last 24 hours, we’ve learned that he was busy shredding documents that were directly relevant to an investigation that ultimately went to the core of the functioning of this democratic institution. And we learned that, despite being told repeatedly, over an extensive period of time, that the Premier and the Premier’s office had absolutely no involvement in this matter.

We have learned that on the day that the member for Sur- rey-Panorama was forced to resign her post for being named as a suspect in a criminal investigation, Mr. Meggs was sus- pending an employee, the executive assistant to that now former minister. How do you suspend someone if you don’t have any idea what’s being investigated? Because that’s the story from this Premier. That’s the story from this Attorney General. They say they have no idea about what is being investigated. Will the Premier advise us today on what basis the execut- ive assistant was suspended by his chief of staff, Mr. Meggs?

Will he confirm that, in fact, he and his office know a lot more about the activities of the member for Surrey-Panor- ama than he wants to admit? Hon. D. Eby: The employee the member is asking about was a ministerial staff member that was in the constituency office of the former minister. Because she’s no longer a min- ister, there is no minister for that individual to staff anymore. She’s been placed on administrative leave. She’s based in Sur- rey. She was placed on administrative leave because there’s no minister in that office anymore. It’s as simple as that.

The member’s conspiracy theory, the Leader of the Opposition’s theory that I held a meeting telling people to cover their tracks — totally false. It doesn’t get us any fur- ther ahead. Mr. Speaker:The member for Abbotsford West on a sup- plemental. M. de Jong:I seem to recall, Mr. Speaker, members oppos- ite being a lot more concerned about due process. The chief of staff to the Premier…. Maybe the chief of staff doesn’t work for the Premier anymore. Maybe he works for the Attorney General, and there are a lot more changes taking place over there than we know about.

The question is to the Premier and whether or not he wants to be accountable for the actions of Mr. Meggs, his chief of staff. He suspended the employee, took away her phone, took away her access, whatever access she had, to the office. None of those things, apparently, were done to the former minister. The question today is: what did the Premier and the Pre- mier’s office know that prompted them to move so quickly to suspend that employee, despite trying to tell the House that they have no idea what this investigation is about? Hon. D. Eby: This individual is a member of the minis- terial staff.

She, to anyone’s knowledge here, certainly to the best of my knowledge…. I have no knowledge that she was involved in anything improper, and the member continu- ally suggesting it is not…. I mean, frankly, it’s incredibly dis- respectful when he knows that we don’t know what…. Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. Hon. D. Eby: We don’t know what police are investigat- ing. We certainly don’t know — and we have no reason to believe — that she’s involved. We put her on administrative leave, which is the appropriate step, because there’s no min- ister for her to staff anymore. She’s based in Surrey.

He’s trying to smear her, the Leader of the Opposition, making up meetings that never happened. It’s Pizzagate, frankly, and it’s not helpful. SOIL DISPOSAL SITE IN SHAWNIGAN LAKE W ATERSHED S. Furstenau:Y esterday I asked the Minister of Energy Wednesday, October 9, 2019 British Columbia Debates 10003

and Mines about the order that was issued to South Island Aggregates to remove soil from their property on lot 21 in the Shawnigan watershed. The minister acknowledged that the company missed the September 30 deadline to comply with the order. Indeed, she said that the company “had not taken our order seriously. ” The operators of SIA are the same people who own the adjacent lot 23, on which a contaminated landfill sits.

The permit for that landfill was cancelled by the then Minister of Environment in January 2017. [2:20 p.m.] The current Minister of Environment approved a closure plan for this landfill with a significant number of conditions, including the condition that the closure be completed by October 31, 2019. From all appearances, those conditions, including the drilling of new water-monitoring wells, have not been taken seriously. My question is to the Minister of Environment and Cli- mate Change Strategy.

How many of the conditions in the closure plan have been met, and does the minister have any expectation that the work would be completed by his deadline? Hon. G. Heyman: I want to echo the words of my col- league from yesterday, the Minister of Energy and Mines, thanking the member for her tenacity and her advocacy on behalf of her constituents, who are — and have been for a long time — concerned about their water quality. As the member knows, I spent a lot of time reviewing the closure plan.

We spent a lot of time in the ministry hearing from both the member and her constituents who have con- cerns about the closure plan and the conditions that were placed on it. They had concerns about the review by a qual- ified professional. As a result of that, I asked that a second qualified professional be consulted, as well as ministry staff with expertise in the area. As a result of all of that work, I added significant new con- ditions to the closure plan, including a condition for ongoing monitoring and the ability to change the conditions at any time if new evidence came forward.

However, as a result of taking those steps, which I believe were necessary to respond to the concerns of the community, there was a considerable delay in the commencement of the work to reach the origin- al date of October 31. We are currently in the process of reviewing the work as well as taking steps to ensure that the site will be secure and water will be protected throughout this fall. Mr. Speaker:The House Leader, Third Party on a supple- mental. S. Furstenau:My understanding of the answer that the minister just gave is no. The deadline will not be met, and the conditions don’t seem to have been met either.

All of the concerns that he identifies in the community remain. We remain deeply concerned about our water. I will put it out there that the ongoing monitoring is mostly being done by Ed and Cliff, who are in their 80s, and Bernie. The fact remains, however, that this is a company that has repeatedly violated conditions of its permits and ignored orders from government. Not only that, but this company has not been paying its property taxes on these two properties.

By not enforcing the rules and continuing to grant exten- sions, it would appear that the message this government sends is that rules don’t matter, conditions mean nothing, and deadlines are irrelevant. Government’s job is to protect the public interest, not the interests of one company. In Shawnigan, we have endured the interests of a company being put ahead of the well-being and health of our com- munity for over seven years.

My question to the Minister of Environment and Climate Change Strategy is: given the record of these operators, how can he justify continued allowances made to them in light of their well-documented track record, and when will he put the public interest first and order that the soil be removed from this site? Hon. G.

Heyman: With respect to the member, who I know cares deeply about this issue and is doing an amazing job representing the interests of her constituents, our gov- ernment, in fact, puts the interests of the constituents and the safety of the drinking water ahead of the interests of the company, and that’s what we will continue to do. That’s why I delayed approval of the plan until I was satisfied that we were taking every step that was allowable, that was reasonable and that was defensible under the legislation that governs my decision-making before issuing approval for that plan. We continue to monitor.

Staff from my ministry continue to monitor the sites. The surface and groundwater in the area are monitored monthly. And we are, as I think the member knows, reviewing the progress of the company in meeting the deadlines and whether it is reasonably possible, given the delay that took place in my office, to ensure that the closure plan was the strongest that it could be within the law that applied. That’s what I will continue to do. [2:25 p.m.] POLICE INVESTIGATION OF FORMER CITIZENS’ SERVICES MINISTER AND STATUS OF EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT M.

Polak:For what is apparently a redaction error, we would still be under the impression that was left by this Pre- mier that, in fact, his office had absolutely no knowledge, no involvement, in anything to do with the issues surrounding the former Clerk and former Sergeant-at-Arms. Here’s what we know now. In fact, his chief of staff, Geoff Meggs, did know. He knew a lot. He knew all of it. What’ d he do? Didn’t report to the police. Could have done that. Didn’t do it. He could have reported it to LAMC. That’s actually the place it should go.

For Pete’s sake, he could have reported it 10004 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, October 9, 2019

to his own Government House Leader, and I don’t think he did. No. Instead, he decided: “No, I don’t want to touch this, and I don’t want anybody to know that I know anything. So I’m shredding the documents. ” That’s what he did. It’s on the record. We know that’s what he did. We don’t know why. I mean, I’m gathering from the Pre- mier that it wasn’t the Premier who directed him to. It’s start- ing to sound like he never even told the Premier. That’s wor- rying in and of itself. Now we’re on to phase 2, where the same Premier’s chief of staff, Geoff Meggs, decides that for no apparent reason….

I mean, the reason given by the Attorney is ridiculous. He decides, for no apparent reason, that the former assistant to the now former minister who’s being investigated in terms of criminal wrongdoing…. He decides that that person should be suspended. Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. M. Polak:If the Premier can’t answer on what basis his chief of staff, who’s responsible for the employment of polit- ical staff in this building…. If the Premier can’t answer why that person was suspended, then we have a huge problem. To the Premier. His chief of staff made a decision. On what basis was that person suspended?

Hon. D. Eby: This individual has been placed on admin- istrative leave. She hasn’t been suspended. There is an issue that the person she used to staff is no longer a minister, so there’s no minister to staff anymore. She lives in Surrey. If she was still staffing in that office, we’ d have questions. “Well, why is she still there? She’s not staffing anyone. What a waste. That doesn’t make any sense. ” We’re trying to figure out an appropriate solution for this person. As far as we know, she hasn’t done anything wrong, and she’s done hard work on behalf of the public of British Columbia. Mr.

Speaker:The House Leader for the official opposition on a supplemental. M. Polak:The Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing has been tasked with the responsibilities that were those of the former minister, who’s now under criminal investigation. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever that they could not provide an opportunity for the new minister, who’s replacing the former minister, to have the support. Obviously, they expect that the work of that ministry is going to continue. It does not, on its face, wash as a reason for that person to have been suspended.

If the Premier wants to continue to say… Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. M. Polak:…that he knew nothing about Geoff Meggs’s involvement with respect to the Clerk and the Sergeant-at- Arms, and the Premier wants to say he knows nothing about the reason why this person was suspended, then I suspect he needs to

schedule increased frequency in terms of his briefings with his chief of staff, Geoff Meggs, because Geoff Meggs knows. To the Premier: give us a credible answer as to why that person was suspended. Hon. J. Horgan:There was a credible answer given. The minister that the individual worked for is no longer a min- ister. She’s not suspended. She’s on administrative leave, and that will be worked out in the fullness of time. It’s a human resource matter. I’ d like to go back to the issue around the former Clerk and the former Sergeant-at-Arms.

I can remember quite vividly everyone on that side of the House saying: “Oh no, no, no.

We shouldn’t do anything about this. ” I have said repeatedly that in the 14 years that I’ve been a member of this House, nothing makes me prouder than to be able to say that I’ve worked in an institution, on most days, when every person in this place cares passionately about the people of British Columbia and this institution. [2:30 p.m.] Out of an abundance of caution, because of my personal animus towards the former Clerk, I said: “I don’t want to know anything about this because it’s not my responsibility. ” I’m responsible for the discharge of the head… Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. Hon. J.

Horgan:…of the executive council. Some of you were in cabinet. Some of you will know that. Aside from the House Leader, not one former minister over there would have ever been interested in the workings of LAMC beyond being an individual member of this House, which we all are, even the members at the far end of the Lib- eral bench. I am quite proud of my time… Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. Members, the Premier has the floor. Hon. J. Horgan:…in this Legislature. I am proud of the people who came before us, and I’m proud of the people who aspire to come here in the future. To denigrate all of…. Interjections.

Wednesday, October 9, 2019 British Columbia Debates 10005

Hon. J. Horgan:Give it a rest. There’s the respect that we get from the B.C. Liberals. There’s the respect we get from the B.C. Liberals. Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. FREEDOM-OF-INFORMATION REQUESTS AND GOVERNMENT RECORDKEEPING S. Bond: Well, here’s something that apparently the Pre- mier does know something about. Last year the Premier was forced to admit that “We missed the mark” on freedom of information, and “I acknowledge that. ” So let me help him recall why. Senior officials in his office, ministers and NDP political staff, deleted all of their records for months.

And the former Minister of Citizens’ Services was caught breaking the law multiple times. But the obstruction doesn’t end there. On May 16, 2018, the official opposition filed requests related to the use of personal emails of 28 individuals, requests that this government has stalled and stonewalled with lawyers for 511 days and counting. To the Premier, and perhaps this is a question he can or will answer. Will he direct his new minister to release those documents today? Hon. D. Eby: There’s a very serious issue that is in front of the Office of the Information and Privacy Commissioner.

That is: what is the extent of personal privacy in personal email when an individual becomes a minister? We’re work- ing with the OIPC in a hearing, and there is a live dispute. I don’t want to be seen to be interfering in that in any way. I will say, though, that that is being determined by the OIPC, and there are lawyers involved on both sides, from what I understand. Mr. Speaker:The member for Prince George–Valemount on a supplemental. S. Bond: I think it’s a little more clear what happened than the Attorney General just portrayed.

The Premier had his lawyer, John Tuck, make the absolutely absurd claim that complying with the law and processing our requests would embarrass these NDP staff members. This excuse was com- pletely dismissed last month by the adjudicator in the Office of the Information and Privacy Commissioner — completely dismissed. This government’s tactic of using lawyers — apparently, that wasn’t working. So guess what they did next.

On September 23, 2019, the official opposition was informed of a new NDP fee policy that has resulted in over $36,617 in fee demands to access government records, information we deserve to see and the public deserves to see. Apparently, the lawyers didn’t work. Let’s try charging exorbitant fees now. To the Premier, what exactly is this government trying to hide? Hon. D. Eby: I don’t know the specific files the member is talking about. Those are handled by the public service. I don’t know if they’re the same ones or not. It wasn’t clear from her question.

The OIPC does have a fee review process the member is familiar with. I will say that, personally, I’ve disclosed to the opposition — I don’t know — probably about 1,000 emails. I know the member that just asked the question has someone sitting beside her who didn’t disclose a single email during his entire time in government. [2:35 p.m.] I can’t remember, but I think I got three emails from the member for Langley East, and one was to Bob Rennie.

It’s just a contrast in an approach to freedom of information, and I find it a bit interesting that the member there would stand up right beside these members who refused to disclose emails for so many years, members who triple-deleted and said they were proud of it. I’ll keep her pointers in mind. [End of question period.] Petitions A. Weaver:I rise to present a petition from Surfrider Foundation petitioning the B.C. government to show a lead- ership role on banning single-use plastics in our province. There are a little over 1,000 names on this petition. Orders of the Day Hon. M.

Farnworth:I call second reading of Bill 36, Gaming Control Amendment Act. Hon. D. Eby:I seek leave to table a report. Leave granted. Tabling Documents Hon. D. Eby: I have the honour to present the2018-19 Annual Report of the Environmental Appeal Board. [R. Chouhan in the chair.] Second Reading of Bills BILL 36 — GAMING CONTROL AMENDMENT ACT, 2019 Hon. D. Eby:I move the bill be now read a second time. The province has a strong commitment to advance recon- ciliation with Indigenous peoples. The proposed legislative 10006 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, October 9, 2019

amendments are a significant example of how the province is moving forward to meet this commitment. Specifically, the proposed legislative amendments are focused on achieving two objectives. First, it will amend the Gaming Control Act to facilitate and support sharing a por- tion of B.C. Lottery Corp. ’s net income with First Nations of B.C. for 23 years. Secondly, it will also increase B.C. Lottery Corp. ’s board of directors by two positions. Once a long-term agreement between the province and the B.C.

First Nations Gaming Revenue Sharing Limited Partnership — which I’ll refer to as “limited partnership” from now on — is in place, the legislation will establish a revenue-sharing entitlement to be paid to the limited part- nership for distribution to eligible B.C. First Nations, who become shareholders in the limited partnership. Currently this legislation requires the net income of B.C. Lottery Corp. to be paid into the consolidated revenue fund.

Therefore, a statutory appropriation is proposed in this legis- lative amendment to facilitate the payment of the dedicated revenue from the consolidated revenue fund to the limited partnership. The increase of the B.C. Lottery Corp. ’s board from a max- imum of nine to 11 positions will facilitate one position for the limited partnership’s nominee. The total annual amount of the statutory entitlement would be equal to 7 percent of the B.C. Lottery Corp. ’s net income, as adjusted in accordance with the long-term agree- ment, estimated at $100 million per year.

These amendments also add an additional element of certainty for First Nations in B.C. on the longevity and commitment of the government to long-term revenue-sharing from gaming with First Nations in B.C. The province and the limited partnership recently con- cluded an interim agreement that provides two years of funding to the limited partnership for distribution to eligible First Nations in B.C., who become shareholders in the lim- ited partnership. Once these legislative amendments are concluded, the parties will be in a position to conclude a long-term agreement with the limited partnership.

Together, the interim agreement, the legislative amendment and the long-term agreement facilitate the province’s commitment for sharing gaming revenues with First Nations in B.C. for a 25-year period. [2:40 p.m.] J. Y ap:It’s my pleasure to rise today to speak in second reading to Bill 36, Gaming Control Amendment Act, 2019. Let me say from the outset that as the official opposition, we welcome an approach and policies aimed at advancing reconciliation, creating opportunities and making life better for First Nations. We believe in opportunity for all of B.C., all British Columbians, and in shared prosperity.

Certainly, as we look at the situation with our relations with First Nations, despite significant effort and progress in the recent past, there remains a significant gap in income between Indigenous peoples in Canada and non-Indigenous peoples. The data shows that the total income of Indigenous people was, on average, 73 percent of that of non-Indigenous people’s average income. That was in 2005, and it has increased to 75 percent in 2015. It’s progress, but more needs to be done. The population of Indigenous peoples as a percentage of British Columbia’s population continues to grow in import- ance.

Following ten years of rapid growth, Indigenous peoples make up about 5.9 percent of B.C. ’s population. That was as of 2016, and the share of Indigenous peoples in B.C. is expected to continue to increase because of an increased fertility rate — larger families than non-Indigenous people. That is recognized. We do understand that the commitment of the govern- ment to share this stream of revenue, gaming revenue, is something that has been discussed in the past. The com- mitment has been made.

This is an issue that has been canvassed over many years and involved discussions with previous governments, and this government is choosing to take action at this time. However, revenue-sharing, we believe, should be fair and should be equitable, and it needs to be done properly. While we agree with the need to get this done, we have some reservations, some concerns, in the way that this framework has been proposed to flow funds from govern- ment to First Nations communities.

We as legislators need to come together to address the history of colonialism and renew our relationship with Indigenous people, and I know that this government is highly dedicated towards this end. I know that the Minister of Indigenous Relations and Recon- ciliation is deeply committed, as is his government. We applaud that, but we do have concerns with this bill.

For example, we have a question in regard to the flow of revenue and the way that this legislation is proposed, and I will get into a little bit of detailed discussion on the frame- work that’s proposed, where a partnership will be set up, consisting of the First Nations that would choose to parti- cipate in this stream of revenue. It will be approximately 200 First Nations, who would be limited partners.

They would be in this partnership with a group that is referred to commonly as the leadership council. [2:45 p.m.] This partnership of the leadership council and all the First Nations of our province would administer this flow of funds. This fund, as the Attorney General has said, would be 7 per- cent, which is indicated in the proposed legislation. In dol- lars, it would be about $100 million annually under a pro- posed 25-year agreement — $100 million per year over the next 25 years.

The proposed legislative framework puts in a new legal requirement for sharing of this revenue stream, gaming rev- enue, through an agreement. The Attorney General referred to an interim agreement that’s already in place with First Nations, where the funds would flow, as we understand it, in advance each year based on a 7 percent agreed-upon per- centage of net revenue from gaming. However, instead of Wednesday, October 9, 2019 British Columbia Debates 10007

flowing directly to the First Nations all around the province, the proposal under this legislation is to flow the funds to a new entity, a partnership. We have some questions about the need to do this. We appreciate the briefing that the Attorney General had offered us, myself and the member for Vancouver-Langara, on this. We canvassed this question. While we understand that the rationale for this has to do with the accounting rules and the financial administration rules, we wonder why there has not been an effort to look at flowing the funds directly to First Nations.

I’ll discuss the concept of where the funds should be flowing. We do understand that there have been some negoti- ations, some consultation, but we’re not clear on the extent of that consultation among the First Nations who will par- ticipate in this program. We’re not clear if all First Nations around British Columbia — all 200 — were involved in the consultations and the discussions and the analysis of what’s being proposed. So I do believe that that is something that needs to be addressed.

Instead of putting money directly into essential services for First Nations in areas such as child care, housing and economic development, the proposal is for the funds to flow into this entity which would then take applications, we understand, from First Nations to receive funds for specific projects. This adds an extra step in the effort to help First Nations, which we all want. We question if this is the best that government can do to provide First Nations with eco- nomic benefits and long-lasting security.

Certainly, as we look at our record when we were in gov- ernment, economic opportunities and participation were central as part of our efforts towards reconciliation with First Nations. When we were in government, we worked to improve the quality of life for Aboriginal people through new economic partnerships, resource development, revenue sharing, and closing gaps in health, education, skills training and employment. Through resource development on First Nations traditional territories, we put revenues directly into the communities to use.

One of our proudest achievements, as all of us would know, is the development of LNG. The LNG sector in B.C., which we’re pleased that the government is supporting and is moving forward, has presented opportunities for our gov- ernment and First Nations to work together.

Throughout the province, 62 natural gas pipeline benefits agreements have been reached — 62, with 29 First Nations, for four proposed natural gas pipelines. [2:50 p.m.] In addition, when we were in government, we had close to 500 economic and reconciliation agreements in place with First Nations, including strategic engagement agreements, reconciliation agreements, forestry and clean energy project revenue-sharing agreements. The concept of revenue-shar- ing is something that all of us are comfortable with and that we believe in. We also participated in 63 different treaties, involving 114 First Nations.

To list a few other achievements since 2001, when we were in government, we invested $4.4 billion to provide affordable housing for low-income individuals and families. We were also committed to improving First Nations through appren- ticeships and skills training, as well as other education pro- grams. These were some of the many things that were done directly to support the economic, social and cultural needs of Indigenous people. And as I said, we believe more needs to be done. However, we cannot ignore that there are still systemic obstacles to reconciliation.

It’s critical that we invest in First Nations communities that need help the most. One of the criteria for applying for funds under this new revenue stream, the gaming revenue stream, is capacity-building. We applaud that. In the time that I have had the privilege of being elected to this House, I’ve had a chance to visit First Nations com- munities around the province. All members probably have had the opportunity and can relate to the fact that there are some First Nations who really need help, who need support and assistance in increasing their capacity.

There are others who may need assistance and capacity-building to a lesser extent. There are First Nations that have embraced the mantle of economic development for a number of years and have built up their economic position through development with- in their lands, through engaging in trading activity, through participating in the resource sector. Some of these have become very successful, and we all, of course, are very proud of them and applaud them for their success. We want all First Nations to have the opportunity as we move forward.

With this proposed new stream of gaming revenue, one of the concerns that we would have is the need to ensure that the funding stream does flow to the First Nations that need help the most. We look forward to learning more about what the plan is for that to happen, because it’s not clear from the legislation, as it’s written, how that would happen. That’s something that we believe is very important: to ensure — and I think all British Columbians want to ensure — that the flow of funds from this revenue stream would flow to the First Nations that need the support the most.

Another concern that we have is how this agreement would affect, or potentially affect, other grant programs that are in place and that are dependent on the gaming revenue net income. B.C. Lottery Corp., the gaming…. The stream of revenue provides an important stream of income to gov- ernment that helps to fund, as we all know, services that are important to all British Columbians. [2:55 p.m.] One specific program, the community gaming grant pro- gram, comes to mind. That’s one that I know all members of the Legislature are very familiar with, communities are very familiar with and community groups.

Many depend on this important program. We have questions about how this new revenue-sharing could potentially affect the pro- gram that communities all around the province depend on, 10008 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, October 9, 2019

the community gaming grant program. That’s something we have concerns and questions about. We also believe that there needs to be kept in mind a sense of how to ensure fairness in how the revenue stream is alloc- ated. That’s another question that we have. At the end of the day, we want to see true benefits accrue to First Nations. We want to see, through the efforts of the province in working with First Nations to help First Nations as we move along the path of reconciliation and as First Nations deter- mine for themselves, under the concept of self-determina- tion, how they would develop….

We want to see those com- munities continue to participate as they wish to and progress — economically, culturally and in every important aspect of life. And we want to make sure, as we do this, that all British Columbians feel that we’re doing this in the right way. Mr. Speaker, as you know, the federal government has a very important role in the administration of Indigenous communities and is obliged, under our constitution and stat- utes, to provide funding to First Nations.

So one of the ques- tions that we have is: has there been consultation with the federal government in terms of this program not taking away from their responsibility to provide the statutory funding to First Nations throughout British Columbia? So that’s anoth- er concern, a question that we have and would want to can- vass in second reading debate.

To summarize, we understand the intent of this proposed legislation to share revenue, and we believe that while the intent is positive and we want to see this happen, we need to ensure — we have a responsibility as legislators to ensure — that it’s done in the right way. We have a number of questions, as an official opposition, on the specifics in this piece of legislation. I know that colleagues will raise specific aspects of what our concerns are, a few of which I have men- tioned in my comments. With that, I’ll take my place, Mr. Speaker, and thank you for the opportunity to engage in today’s debate. Hon. S.

Fraser:It’s certainly with pride that I stand here today in this House to support this piece of legislation which makes good on a promise that we made to First Nations. It was almost a year ago. This summer we shared nearly $200 million — it was about $198 million — of provincial gaming revenue with Indigenous communities. That represents the first two years’ worth of shared reven- ues from a gaming stream. The money started flowing out to First Nations com- munities just last week, at the beginning of the month, and the benefits of this predictable and sustainable revenue stream are evident already.

The Nadleh Whut’ en is a First Nation west of Prince George. The long-term predictable revenue stream has allowed that nation to start home-building — home-build- ing for the first time in 30 years — to address overcrowding and a lack of housing. Our office got an email from Chief Larry Nooski just a few days ago. This revenue is starting to make a difference on the ground, in communities. [3:00 p.m.] The amendment before us makes it possible to extend our commitment to those communities for a full 25 years. As I said, we’ve already transferred the first two years’ worth over, so the next 23 years on.

It’s the first time there’s been a revenue-sharing agreement between the province of British Columbia and First Nations that provides long-term, stable funding to those nations. It’s nearly $3 billion that will be available to First Nations governments over that time, ensuring they have a steady, predictable source of income. Income like every govern- ment…. First Nations or any government, First Nations or non, need stable, predictable sources of revenue to fund their priorities.

I would suggest that the Indian Act is not provid- ing for that very well — critical things for every government, like infrastructure, like services that build healthy com- munities, and the staff to get it done. The member for Rich- mond-Steveston spoke about capacity — absolutely. Critical things for any government to be able to accomplish. This revenue will mean First Nations can plan for the long term and invest in the services they decide that their com- munities need to thrive and prosper.

In that way, the reven- ue stream is about truly, tangibly supporting self-determin- ation, and that is what is at the heart of reconciliation. First Nations know best the priorities of their communities, and now they have the resources to invest in those priorities — priorities like social services to support families and Elders, education, infrastructure, cultural revitalization and self- government capacity. We’ll see new community projects.

We’re already seeing new community projects and programs and significant economic development that benefits the people in First Nations communities and beyond for the whole regions of this province. It will bring more prosperity to every part of this province. This legislative amendment is an important step on our shared road to true and lasting reconciliation. It’s just one step. I’ d like to reflect a bit on the history of how we got here. I’ve been in this place since 2005, that election. This is my 15th year. I was appointed by the leader at the time, who is now the Deputy Premier and the Finance Minister.

She appointed me as the critic for…. At that point, it was the Ministry of Aboriginal Relations and Reconciliation. Now it’s the Ministry of Indigenous Relations and Reconciliation, and I’m honoured to be the minister. As critic, one of my earliest meetings that I recall was with the First Nations Gaming Commission. They had been try- ing for many, many, many years for the government of the day to come to the table and discuss sharing of revenues. I remember Grand Chief Joe Hall was one of the first people I met.

He was representing the First Nations Gaming Commission, a body that was created through the leadership council. That’s the summit, the Union of B.C. Indian Chiefs and the Assembly of First Nations, collectively. He had beseeched me, as the critic, that government needed to move forward with revenue-sharing to provide stable, long-term Wednesday, October 9, 2019 British Columbia Debates 10009

revenue through gaming like other provinces were already doing. He explained to me that the government would not come to the table. The Liberal government at the time would not even discuss the issue. It was a non-starter. I know that the imperativeness of the revenue-sharing was captured in 2007. “First Nations have been asking for gaming revenue-sharing to be negotiated by the province for years, ” as I mentioned. In 2007, First Nations leaders presented the previous government with the B.C. First Nations investment plan.

The plan recommended allocating, at that point, 3 per- cent of B.C. ’s gross gambling revenue directly towards eco- nomic and community development initiatives in Indigen- ous communities. At the time, First Nations leaders described the plan as “the single most important action the province could take to ease First Nations poverty and to begin to close the econom- ic and social gap of all First Nations. ” [3:05 p.m.] I’m not questioning the sincerity of the previous speaker, the member for Richmond-Steveston. I know that he was speaking from the heart. But when he was speaking of his government previously….

These requests were summarily dismissed. They would not even discuss the issue. The idea that long-term, stable funding could be transferred to First Nations to make what was acknowledged as the single most important action that government could take was dismissed by the previous government. They wouldn’t consider it. Some of the actions the previous members spoke of, the other government, and the deals that they had made and the agreements they had made with First Nations, many of these were basically transactional in nature. This is not trans- actional. This is a game-changer on the ground for First Nations.

Just to put it in context, the revenue-sharing agreement aligns British Columbia with Alberta, Saskatchewan, Man- itoba, Ontario, Nova Scotia. This was already the way of things in other provinces and was denied by the previous government. So I am pleased to hear that it looks like the opposition will be supporting this. I want to make it clear that some of the concerns that were raised just by the previous speaker I believe are unfoun- ded.

I want to make it clear to anyone watching that there is no impact on existing gaming funding that already goes out under other programs that benefit local communities and NGOs — non-governmental organizations — charities, those sorts of things. This will not have impact there, just to be clear, because those rumours get out, and it can do dam- age to what is a very important program. I also want to say that our ministry staff…. We had tech- nical people, First Nations Leadership Council and the First Nations Gaming Commission, and they worked hand in hand together to build this.

They looked at other models from other provinces to determine the best way to make sure that the funds are going to be delivered fairly to First Nations, that there was an accountability process. Importantly — an issue that was raised by the previous speaker of some concern — the limited partnership is a First Nations entity. This will not be run by government. This is being set up with First Nations, by First Nations. That’s important in self-determination, as the member cited also. So his concerns about whether there was any impact on federal government funding….

To be clear, again, this has already happened in a half-dozen other provinces for many, many years. This is not a new thing for the federal government. I’m sure, from my conversations with my federal counter- parts, they were quite surprised that B.C. was denying the access to such a stream of stable, long-term funding that can be used for long-term planning for nations. So there is no issue there, and there is no risk of that affecting anything with the existing funding, I think, coming from the federal government.

The more technical questions, I’m sure, will be answered by the Attorney, which is appropriate in the way of these things as we do a bill. We’re on second reading. We will go to committee stage, and those technical issues and concerns raised by the member for Richmond-Steveston will all be dealt with there, I’m sure. There were concerns about whether or not this would be timely because of the use of a limited partnership to distrib- ute the funds. I find it a bit ironic. I mean, this is developed in partnership with First Nations. So this is the best method for distribution of these funds.

There is a specific formula that speaks to how the funding will be distributed. Fifty percent is base-funding. It’s actually equal for each of the 204 now — with Binche, I believe — First Nations Indian Act bands in the province. The 50 per- cent will be split equally. Forty percent is based on popula- tion, which, I think, speaks to fairness and equitability. [3:10 p.m.] Then 10 percent is in recognition of geographic chal- lenges, like for remote communities. I think a lot of this was based on the model from Ontario. It seemed to cover the needs of the communities in a very…. It was very reflective of that.

I’m quite pleased that we’ve, I think, come to a model that will provide the most benefit on the ground, where it is needed the most in First Nations communities, especially taking into account the challenges of remote communities. Y ou know, the costs are higher. There are many challenges that we don’t even recognize if you’re living in more of an urban area. So I’m glad that those challenges are reflected in the formula that has been laid out here. We have to take reconciliation seriously. This is a strong step in the right direction. As, again, I can’t understate how important….

For decades now, the First Nations of this province have been calling for government to do just this, and they have called this the single most important action that provincial government could take to ease First Nations poverty and begin to close the economic and social gap for all First Nations. I am so pleased and proud to be standing here in a gov- 10010 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, October 9, 2019

ernment that is taking those requests seriously. Closing the gap — yes, indeed. E. Ross: It’s my pleasure to speak on behalf of my con- stituents of Skeena in terms of Bill 36, the Gaming Control Amendment Act. Before I get into what I intended to say here, I just want to make some corrections to the previous speaker. Where to start? This is contractual. There was a statement saying that this is not contractual. It is contractual. Y ou’re asking First Nations to join a limited partnership. That’s a contract.

Underneath that, you will then ask them to be eli- gible to fill out application forms to apply for their own money. That’s contractual. There will also be an eligibility requirement that will be implemented within, I assume, the partnership agreement, the limited partnership agreement. Then that will be applied to the application. Those are con- tractual agreements. Interjections. E. Ross:Well, I heard contractual. I heard contractual. Another thing I wanted to address is another thing I heard: “We’re looking forward to closing the economic gap. ” Where have you been for the last 13 years?

That’s what First Nations have been doing for the last 13 years, in terms of engaging in forest and range agreements, revenue-sharing agreements for mining, the 26 agreements that were signed with LNG, all the agreements that were signed for the Kinder Morgan Trans Mountain pipeline and on and on and on. First Nations have been driving that economic gap, in terms of closing it, and they’ve made tremendous progress. This is not a new idea. Y ou come to our communities along the pipeline route, and you’ll see all of the advancements and progress that were made in terms of addressing the econom- ic gap.

These are reports that came out here. This is what drove First Nations to engage with all of these major pro- jects, because there was nothing else at their reserve level. I’m sure that all of the people over there that espouse to have First Nations ancestry know this. Why aren’t you speak- ing to it? Y ou come to our communities along the LNG pipeline route. The unemployment level is not 60, 80 per- cent anymore. If you’ d come to our community during the modernization of the Rio Tinto Alcan smelter, there was no unemployment. That’s the economic gap. That’s the one you’re talking about.

To think that you guys just came up with this miraculous idea, and you guys are going to start it just from day one…. Day one was 13 years ago. What do you think we’ve been doing? It’s an insult to all of those First Nation leaders that have been working on this for the last 15 years and made tre- mendous progress, only to hear that you say: “We’re going to begin to close the economic gap. ” Y ou did not begin it. Y ou did not begin it. Interjections. E. Ross:That’s what he said. Is Hansard around? Can you repeat what the member said? Interjections. Deputy Speaker:Members. [3:15 p.m.] E.

Ross: “We’re so proud to begin to close the economic gap. ” Wow. I’m just repeating what I heard. I mean, maybe my notes are inaccurate. Maybe I misspelled some things wrong there, but I’m pretty sure that I heard: “We’re going to begin to close the economic gap” and “This is not con- tractual. ” If you’re going to say stuff like this, at least back it up. To see First Nations people on the other side, who claim to have First Nations ancestry, laughing? Where’s that member from? Where are you from? What riding are you from? Deputy Speaker:Member, let’s talk about the bill. E. Ross:I am talking about Bill C-36.

Deputy Speaker:Y es, let’s talk about Bill 36. Interjections. Deputy Speaker:Members. Interjection. E. Ross:Thank you. Very condescending of you, but thank you. I appreciate the grace given to me by the member for Saanich North and the Islands. Thank you, I appreciate it. Anyway, another thing I wanted to correct here or at least clarify. We were talking about this…. In terms of Bill C-36, it’s a great concept. Bill C-36, the Gaming Control Amend- ment Act…. Deputy Speaker:No, Bill 36, Member. E. Ross:Didn’t I say 36? Deputy Speaker:No, not C-36. E. Ross:Oh sorry. Bill 36.

In terms of this, it’s not the first time a revenue-sharing agreement has been brought to the First Nations of B.C. from the provincial government. But there was a comment made earlier that said that this is in partnership with 203 bands. I find this remarkable. This is an incredible achievement when you are talking about 203 bands in B.C., and my only ques- tion around that is: how did you achieve this? How did you consult with 203 bands? It took us almost six years to consult from band to band Wednesday, October 9, 2019 British Columbia Debates 10011

on an LNG agreement that provided revenues to the First Nations, along with contracts and employment. So in part- nership with 203 bands? I’m going to be very curious, as we go into estimates, to find out what the consultation pro- cess was. Interjection. E. Ross:Committee stage, sorry. I’ll be curious about this, to see the record. To see the record and the response from 203 bands in B.C. — it’s going to be an extensive report. I’ d be very curious to see what that entails in terms of that report. There was also a comment made that this would not impact other funding coming from the gaming.

That we’ll wait to see. We’ll probably have to wait to see in terms of community by community, region by region. If the rural dividend fund is any example of what that means, then we’ve got to be on our toes and keep an eye on the government decisions here. Those are just basically the comments I heard, and I had to correct those comments or actually ask for clarification. Anywho, in terms of Bill C-36 itself, the control amend- ment act….

I’ve got to say from the outset, in terms of gambling, this is a really tough topic to talk about where I come from, because gambling, from previous councils, was never approved by previous councils. It was never approved on behalf of certain Elders in my community. My council was approached many, many times to create a casino or bingo hall in our territory, and we were shut down. There was fundamental opposition to the idea of gambling.

Coming from a region 20 years ago that had 60 to 80 per- cent unemployment, and knowing all the social ills, I could understand why the leaders of my community didn’t like the idea of gambling, period, even though bingo, as we knew, all across northwest B.C., was providing good amounts of rev- enue for local programs in their communities. To my Elders back home, I’m not endorsing gambling. I’m not saying gambling is a good idea or anything like that.

I’m just talking about Bill C-36 in terms of what is being placed in the Legislature today. [3:20 p.m.] With that being said, just for the millions of people out there watching, commercial gambling, not including horse racing, generated $2.9 billion in 2014-2015. Now, in B.C., that includes revenues from casino tables; games like poker and bingo; slot machines; lottery tickets; on-line Play- Now.com, B.C. ’s only legal on-line gambling site; and licensed gambling events such as 50-50 draws.

In addition, horse racing is big in B.C., and that can be conducted in person at racetracks in B.C. or on screen in teletheatres in communities around our province. The gambling proceeds and gambling itself actually reach into different parts of B.C., all corners, even remote com- munities like my own, in my riding of Skeena. So we all know it’s there. We all know it’s regulated. It provides tre- mendous revenue. And the revenues, we know already, provide tremendous benefit, because that goes back to the organizations that use it in their own communities on an application-driven process.

What we’re talking about here is Bill C-36. Deputy Speaker:Bill 36, Member. Interjection. E. Ross:How can you purport to have First Nations ances- try and knowledge of the culture when you know respect is one of the first things that First Nations actually ask for when somebody else is speaking? Y ou wouldn’t be allowed in the feast hall with that kind of behaviour, to the member for Saanich North and the Islands. Interjection. E. Ross:What does that mean? Okay. Bill 36 proposes to provide First Nations with 7 percent of B.C. Lottery Corp. ’s net income for the next 23 years.

It would build on a two-year agreement reached last August that transferred $194 million, give or take a few million, to the newly formed B.C. First Nations Gaming Revenue Shar- ing Limited Partnership. According to a provincial news release, dated August 12, 2019, the money will be transferred to a newly formed B.C. First Nations Gaming Revenue Sharing Limited Partnership.

The news release goes on to say: “Once First Nations join the limited partnership, they will receive the first year of their share of provincial gaming revenue. ” I haven’t actually seen the final agreement yet, but I was under the understanding that the revenues would go into a limited partnership, and then First Nations would have to apply for their allotment of the revenues. Anyway, we can get into that when we get into the details of the final agree- ment itself. According to Michael Bonshor and Cody Hall, co-chairs of the B.C.

First Nations Gaming Revenue Sharing Limited Partnership: “We encourage eligible First Nations to join the limited partnership and look forward to working with each community to begin receiving their annual distributive shares. ” That’s a red flag. In one sentence, they’re saying they’re going to receive provincial gaming revenue, but on the other side, in the next sentence, they say they have to join the limited partnership before they can start receiving their annual distributive shares. Interjection. E. Ross:It will be application-driven. Interjection. E.

Ross: It will be application-driven, though, based on the projects and based on the band council. 10012 British Columbia Debates Wednesday, October 9, 2019

Interjection. Deputy Speaker:Members, let’s not have a dialogue. It’s second reading. The member has the floor. Please continue. [3:25 p.m.] E. Ross: Well, it does raise a red flag. If it is application- driven, and you’re actually applying to an entity apart from a government…. It doesn’t matter if it’s government or not. But if you’re applying to it and you’re making comparisons to the Indian Act and how the Indian Act didn’t provide for First Nations over the last 50 or 100 years…. First Nations — I don’t know if you’re aware of it or not — do not like applying for money.

In this new era of con- sultation and accommodation, First Nations are more inter- ested in generating their own revenue. They’re more apt to be, basically, going to a government-to-government relation- ship and actually signing government-to-government fund- ing agreements. So the money goes directly to them. Interjection. E. Ross:What’s wrong with that? Interjections. Deputy Speaker:Members. E. Ross: If it’s not application-driven, I look forward to clarifying that in the final agreement — and to be eligible. This is what I look forward to in the final agreement itself — to be eligible.

What is the criteria going to be to be eligible? I know you have to join the First Nations Limited Partnership. I know that. What are going to be the criteria around that? In saying that, there are going to be criteria in terms of what is accepted in terms of your share. Interjection. Deputy Speaker:Members. Carry on. E. Ross:Thank you, Mr. Chair. This is a case…. If there are, basically, no strings attached and the government truly wants to help First Nations in terms of their social issues and close the economic gap, why make them join the limited partnership?

I’m going to assume, then, if you don’t join the limited partnership, then you are not eligible for any allotment of money or revenues. Interjections. E. Ross: I’m hearing crickets, so I think I must be right. Am I right? Interjections. E. Ross: Okay. In other words…. Well, there’s so much chatter on that side and so many questions, I just respond to the questions and the heckling. Interjection. E. Ross:I will. Thank you. To me, this is not a done deal. We have the announce- ments, but it’s not a final agreement yet.

It won’t be final in terms of complete participation until we get 203 bands signed on to the limited partnership. That’s when we’ll see success, because that’s what the government announced. It all goes back to determining success. If there are some bands that do not want to join a limited partnership or do not want to join an application-driven process, then you can’t claim success in terms of a revenue-sharing agreement for those ineligible First Nations. In terms of that, the First Nations that are ineligible will be for two reasons.

One is because they don’t agree with the structure or the format, and the other one is going to be for lack of capacity. Now, I hear those words a lot, “capacity development. ” Developing capacity. Y et I’ve never really seen anybody actu- ally explain what that means on an individual level. What does it mean? I mean, I can honestly say in 2003, I had no capacity. I was elected to council, and I thought that I was going to get on to council, and I was going to divert all the money that council had to my basketball programs. Man, was I ignorant, naive and out of touch, because my band had no money.

We were so broke we were in a defi- cit. We owed $3 million. If you don’t know what that means, under the Indian Act, that means the government can come in and put you into remedial management with the danger of then coming in, kicking you out of office all together and just keeping your health manager, as well as your social devel- opment manager. The rest of them — they send you home. That’s where we were in 2003. In terms of capacity development, I had no idea what I was doing — not a clue — and there’s no orientation pro- gram. There’s no brochure to tell you what your job is or what a funding agreement is.

Nobody was there to tell me what remedial management meant. All I knew was my band had no money, and all they were doing was fighting for survival to keep programs going. That’s all they were doing. There was no time to talk about jobs, employment, contracts and engagement with major projects. There was no time. [3:30 p.m.] We spent the better part of six months just trying to get Canada to stop coming in and shutting us down and shutting down all our programs.

If you don’t know what that means, they bring in a third- party contractor, and they pay your bills for you, based on your funding agreement that comes from Canada. There’s a formula that actually pays off, in priority, your biggest debt Wednesday, October 9, 2019 British Columbia Debates 10013

first and then goes down to your lowest debt. It can take, on average, seven years for a First Nation to get out of it — sev- en years. I had no capacity to understand what these people were talking about. That’s capacity. I was fortunate. I had a chief councillor who was very knowledgable, who went to university. He worked in the RCMP for a couple of years, worked for CN security. I had another councillor who had a business diploma. I was very lucky. These guys understood funding agreements. They understood business principles. They carried me and, I might say, the rest of my council through that six months.

They convinced Canada not to shut us down. But it was painful. We had to lay off a number of people. We had to cut programs. We had to do a number of things. [J. Isaacs in the chair.] It’s actually good that this is on the record. The hard work that that council did started back in 2001, and I joined in 2003. My band is now reaping the benefits. A few years ago, we were actually awarded the first-ever ten-year block fund- ing agreement under Canada. We came from remedial man- agement to block funding to the first-ever ten-year block funding agreement in Canada. That is capacity.

For the most part, you have to sit at the table, and you’ve got to understand that. Y ou’ve got to read this stuff. It’s above our pay grade. Apart from the councillor who had the degree in business, as well as our chief councillor, I was probably the only one that had a grade 12 diploma, which I got back in 1984. It wasn’t worth the paper it was written on. I didn’t understand numbers. I carried around an electronic diction- ary for two years. That is capacity.

So when you’re asking some of these bands here that don’t have that capacity to understand these complex agreements and understand these complex structures, you’re asking quite a bit. There are a lot of bands that understand this. There are a lot of bands that are highly successful. They’re operating at a point where they don’t need government. They don’t want government. There is a band down in the Okanagan that says that with- in seven years, they will be able to say no to Ottawa fund- ing. That is an incredible achievement. That’s capacity. They based it on real estate, and

Document details

Collection	British Columbia — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	20191009pm-Hansard-n272
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	20191009pm Hansard n272
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	904ec0ad07c6f6466b2fd5e979e8d0ba2982ddc4

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