Alberta Hansard — 6 April 2009, Afternoon sitting (13:30) (Legislature 27, Session 2)

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Alberta — Debates (Hansard)

Province of Alberta The 27th Legislature Second Session Alberta Hansard Monday, April 6, 2009 Issue 19 The Honourable Kenneth R. Kowalski, Speaker

Legislative Assembly of Alberta The 27th Legislature Second Session Kowalski, Hon. Ken, Barrhead-Morinville-Westlock, Speaker Cao, Wayne C.N., Calgary-Fort, Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees Mitzel, Len, Cypress-Medicine Hat, Deputy Chair of Committees Ady, Hon. Cindy, Calgary-Shaw (PC), Minister of Tourism, Parks and Recreation Allred, Ken, St.

Albert (PC) Amery, Moe, Calgary-East (PC) Anderson, Rob, Airdrie-Chestermere (PC), Parliamentary Assistant, Solicitor General and Public Security Benito, Carl, Edmonton-Mill Woods (PC) Berger, Evan, Livingstone-Macleod (PC), Parliamentary Assistant, Sustainable Resource Development Bhardwaj, Naresh, Edmonton-Ellerslie (PC) Bhullar, Manmeet Singh, Calgary-Montrose (PC), Parliamentary Assistant, Advanced Education and Technology Blackett, Hon.

Lindsay, Calgary-North West (PC), Minister of Culture and Community Spirit Blakeman, Laurie, Edmonton-Centre (L), Deputy Leader of the Official Opposition Official Opposition House Leader Boutilier, Guy C., Fort McMurray-Wood Buffalo (PC) Brown, Dr. Neil, QC, Calgary-Nose Hill (PC) Calahasen, Pearl, Lesser Slave Lake (PC) Campbell, Robin, West Yellowhead (PC), Deputy Government Whip Chase, Harry B., Calgary-Varsity (L), Official Opposition Whip Dallas, Cal, Red Deer-South (PC) Danyluk, Hon. Ray, Lac La Biche-St.

Paul (PC), Minister of Municipal Affairs DeLong, Alana, Calgary-Bow (PC) Denis, Jonathan, Calgary-Egmont (PC) Doerksen, Arno, Strathmore-Brooks (PC) Drysdale, Wayne, Grande Prairie-Wapiti (PC) Elniski, Doug, Edmonton-Calder (PC) Evans, Hon. Iris, Sherwood Park (PC), Minister of Finance and Enterprise Fawcett, Kyle, Calgary-North Hill (PC) Forsyth, Heather, Calgary-Fish Creek (PC) Fritz, Hon. Yvonne, Calgary-Cross (PC), Minister of Housing and Urban Affairs Goudreau, Hon.

Hector G., Dunvegan-Central Peace (PC), Minister of Employment and Immigration Griffiths, Doug, Battle River-Wainwright (PC), Parliamentary Assistant, Agriculture and Rural Development Groeneveld, Hon. George, Highwood (PC), Minister of Agriculture and Rural Development Hancock, Hon. Dave, QC, Edmonton-Whitemud (PC), Minister of Education, Government House Leader Hayden, Hon. Jack, Drumheller-Stettler (PC), Minister of Infrastructure Hehr, Kent, Calgary-Buffalo (

L) Horne, Fred, Edmonton-Rutherford (PC) Horner, Hon. Doug, Spruce Grove-Sturgeon-St. Albert (PC), Minister of Advanced Education and Technology Jablonski, Hon. Mary Anne, Red Deer-North (PC), Minister of Seniors and Community Supports Jacobs, Broyce, Cardston-Taber-Warner (PC) Johnson, Jeff, Athabasca-Redwater (PC) Johnston, Art, Calgary-Hays (PC) Kang, Darshan S., Calgary-McCall (

L) Klimchuk, Hon. Heather, Edmonton-Glenora (PC), Minister of Service Alberta Knight, Hon. Mel, Grande Prairie-Smoky (PC), Minister of Energy Leskiw, Genia, Bonnyville-Cold Lake (PC) Liepert, Hon. Ron, Calgary-West (PC), Minister of Health and Wellness Lindsay, Hon. Fred, Stony Plain (PC), Solicitor General and Minister of Public Security Lukaszuk, Thomas A., Edmonton-Castle Downs (PC), Parliamentary Assistant, Municipal Affairs Lund, Ty, Rocky Mountain House (PC) MacDonald, Hugh, Edmonton-Gold Bar (

L) Marz, Richard, Olds-Didsbury-Three Hills (PC) Mason, Brian, Edmonton-Highlands-Norwood (NDP), Leader of the NDP Opposition McFarland, Barry, Little Bow (PC) McQueen, Diana, Drayton Valley-Calmar (PC), Parliamentary Assistant, Environment Morton, Hon. F.L., Foothills-Rocky View (PC), Minister of Sustainable Resource Development Notley, Rachel, Edmonton-Strathcona (NDP), Deputy Leader of the NDP Opposition, NDP Opposition House Leader Oberle, Frank, Peace River (PC), Government Whip Olson, Verlyn, QC, Wetaskiwin-Camrose (PC) Ouellette, Hon.

Luke, Innisfail-Sylvan Lake (PC), Minister of Transportation Pastoor, Bridget Brennan, Lethbridge-East (L), Deputy Official Opposition Whip Prins, Ray, Lacombe-Ponoka (PC) Quest, Dave, Strathcona (PC) Redford, Hon. Alison M., QC, Calgary-Elbow (PC), Minister of Justice and Attorney General Renner, Hon. Rob, Medicine Hat (PC), Minister of Environment, Deputy Government House Leader Rodney, Dave, Calgary-Lougheed (PC) Rogers, George, Leduc-Beaumont-Devon (PC) Sandhu, Peter, Edmonton-Manning (PC) Sarich, Janice, Edmonton-Decore (PC), Parliamentary Assistant, Education Sherman, Dr.

Raj, Edmonton-Meadowlark (PC), Parliamentary Assistant, Health and Wellness Snelgrove, Hon. Lloyd, Vermilion-Lloydminster (PC), President of the Treasury Board Stelmach, Hon. Ed, Fort Saskatchewan-Vegreville (PC), Premier, President of Executive Council Stevens, Hon. Ron, QC, Calgary-Glenmore (PC), Deputy Premier, Minister of International and Intergovernmental Relations Swann, Dr. David, Calgary-Mountain View (L), Leader of the Official Opposition Taft, Dr. Kevin, Edmonton-Riverview (

L) Tarchuk, Hon. Janis, Banff-Cochrane (PC), Minister of Children and Youth Services Taylor, Dave, Calgary-Currie (

L) VanderBurg, George, Whitecourt-Ste. Anne (PC) Vandermeer, Tony, Edmonton-Beverly-Clareview (PC) Weadick, Greg, Lethbridge-West (PC) Webber, Len, Calgary-Foothills (PC), Parliamentary Assistant, Energy Woo-Paw, Teresa, Calgary-Mackay (PC) Xiao, David H., Edmonton-McClung (PC), Parliamentary Assistant, Employment and Immigration Zwozdesky, Hon. Gene, Edmonton-Mill Creek (PC), Minister of Aboriginal Relations, Deputy Government House Leader Officers and Officials of the Legislative Assembly Clerk W.J. David McNeil Clerk Assistant/ Director of House Services Louise J.

Kamuchik Clerk of Journals/Table Research Micheline S. Gravel Senior Parliamentary Counsel Robert H. Reynolds, QC Senior Parliamentary Counsel Shannon Dean Sergeant-at-Arms Brian G. Hodgson Assistant Sergeant-at-Arms J. Ed Richard Assistant Sergeant-at-Arms William C. Semple Managing Editor of Alberta Hansard Liz Sim

April 6, 2009 Alberta Hansard 509 Legislative Assembly of Alberta Title: Monday, April 6, 2009 1:30 p.m. 1:30 p.m. Monday, April 6, 2009 [The Speaker in the chair] head: Prayers The Speaker: Good afternoon. Welcome back. Let us pray. At the beginning of this week we ask for renewed strength in the awareness of our duty and privilege as members of the Legislature. We ask for the protection of this Assembly and also the province we are elected to serve. Amen. Hon. members and ladies and gentlemen, we will now be led in the singing of our national anthem by Mr. Paul Lorieau.

I’d invite all of you to participate in the language of your choice. Hon. Members: O Canada, our home and native land! True patriot love in all thy sons command. With glowing hearts we see thee rise, The True North strong and free! From far and wide, O Canada, We stand on guard for thee. God keep our land glorious and free! O Canada, we stand on guard for thee. O Canada, we stand on guard for thee. The Speaker: Thank you again, Mr. Lorieau. I sincerely hope that as the week closes, you will not be unemployed in your evening job. Please be seated. head: Introduction of Visitors The Speaker: The hon. the Premier.

Mr. Stelmach: Well, thank you, Mr. Speaker. It gives me great pleasure today to introduce to you and through you to all members of the Assembly, seated in your gallery, two outstanding Canadians, the Rt. Hon. Don Mazankowski and Mr. Paul Desmarais. Of course, Mr.

Don Mazankowski, officer of the Order of Canada, Alberta Order of Excellence, first elected MP for Vegreville in 1968, served in so many different capacities in the House of Commons but last and most importantly as the Deputy Prime Minister of Canada, also as Minister of Finance at some very crucial times for the country of Canada, and a patriot of the Alberta Heart Institute. He’s accompanied today by Mr. Paul Desmarais, a chairman of Power Corp of Canada, of course, executive of numerous corporations around the world, member of Privy Council, companion of the Order of Canada. Mr.

Paul Desmarais is here today to visit the Mazankow- ski Heart Institute. I would ask them both to rise and receive the traditional warm welcome of the Assembly. The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Energy. Mr. Knight: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to introduce to you and through you to all members of this Assembly His Excellency Yerlan Abildayev, the ambassador of the Republic of Kazakhstan. Accompanying His Excellency is Adilzhan Ruziev, the second secretary at the embassy in Ottawa. I was honoured to host a special luncheon today in honour of His Excellency’s first visit to Alberta.

Alberta and Kazakhstan share many similarities. We are both geographically and ethnically diverse areas with vast natural resources. Our common interests have created a solid trading relationship, which we look forward to increasing in the future. We value our relationship with our friends in Kazakhstan and the opportunities our partnership creates. I would ask that His Excellency and the second secretary rise and receive the traditional warm welcome of this Assembly. The Speaker: The hon. President of the Treasury Board. Mr. Snelgrove: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise to introduce to you and through you to all members of the Assembly the secretary of planning for the Mexican state of Jalisco, Dr. Victor Manuel González Romero, and his wife, Dr. Maria Morfin Otero. This year we are celebrating the 10th anniversary of the twinning relationship between Jalisco and Alberta. This twinning relationship has allowed us to explore common areas of interest in agriculture, education, forestry, science, technology, and the environment. I might add, although it may be in self-interest, that they also produce copious quantities of tequila.

By pursuing our common areas of interest, Mexico has become one of Alberta’s fastest growing export markets, ranked fourth as our largest trading partner. Dr. González is in Alberta to speak at a conference hosted by Athabasca University, and I understand that he will be touring the Legislature Building later and meeting with our Minister of Finance and Enterprise. Mr. Speaker, Dr. González and Dr. Morfin are seated in your gallery. I would ask that they rise and please accept the warm applause of the Assembly.

The Speaker: Jalisco is also the home of the rodeo and the mariachi in addition to tequila. head: Introduction of Guests The Speaker: The hon. Member for Fort McMurray-Wood Buffalo. Mr. Boutilier: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. It’s indeed my pleasure through you to members of the Assembly to introduce Anzac school in the regional municipality of Wood Buffalo. There are 26 visitors today, including teachers and parent helpers. I’d ask this energetic group from Anzac school to stand and receive the very warm welcome of the Assembly. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Gold Bar. Mr.

MacDonald: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I would like to introduce to you and through you to all hon. members of the Assembly a visiting group from Suzuki charter school in the constituency of Edmonton-Gold Bar. There are 17 students with us today. I understand that earlier they had a model parliament before their lunch break. They are led today by their teacher, Miss Eva Bauernhuber. I would now ask them to please rise and r eceive the warm and traditional welcome of the Assembly. Thank you. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Montrose. Mr. Bhullar: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I along with my colleagues from Edmonton-Manning, Edmonton-Meadowlark, and Edmonton- Ellerslie had the distinct honour today of hosting some folks from India. These folks all belong to the Indian film and music industry and are, indeed, international superstars in their own right. I’d first like to introduce Mr. Jazzy Bains, who is a singer. If you could rise. Mr. Bains has sold albums in the millions and is actually a native of Vancouver.

Alberta Hansard April 6, 2009510 Next, comedian Gurpreet Ghuggi, who is, indeed, an advocate for the rule of law and has a very interesting way of communicating that to the Indian public. Next, Miss Kulraj Randhawa, who was host of a popular Indian TV show, Kareena Kareena, and is currently in Canada to launch her second movie, Tera Mera Ki Rishta. Mr. Speaker, I won’t try to translate that as I’m not known as being one for love movies, but needless to say, I encourage all members to watch this movie on April 10. Last, Mr.

Sukhwinder Chohla, who is a journalist from the Ajit newspaper in Jalandhar, and locally Mr. Gurbhalinder Sandhu, who is the editor of the Des Pardes Times newspaper and the co-ordinator for the event. I ask all members to show our western hospitality to these individuals. 1:40 The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Ellerslie. Mr. Bhardwaj: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I have two introductions today. First, I’m honoured as a former hockey player and coach myself to introduce to you and through you a sports legend in India, Mr. Pargat Singh, seated in the members’ gallery. Mr.

Singh is the king of field hockey, the captain of India’s field hockey team in two consecutive Olympics along with numerous international competitions. In fact, he was awarded Padma Shri and Arjuna awards for his achievements, the highest awards you can receive in India. Mr. Singh has done much for the sport in India and around the world. I would ask Pargat Singh to please rise and receive the traditional warm welcome of the Assembly. My second introduction. It is also my honour to rise today and introduce to you and through you a good friend and a prominent member of the community, Mr.

Joe Sunner, seated in the members’ gallery. Mr. Sunner is the proud owner of Durabuilt Windows & Doors, with his head office in the beautiful constituency of Edmonton-Calder. Mr. Sunner has proven himself to be a good, generous man. Among his many contributions to the province one that stands out is his donation of $100,000 to the Guru Nanak Dev Healing Garden at the Mazankowski Alberta Heart Institute. At this time I would ask Mr. Sunner to please rise and receive the traditional warm welcome of the Assembly. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Leduc-Beaumont-Devon. Mr. Rogers: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

It gives me great pleasure to rise today to introduce to you and through you to all members of the Assembly representatives and staff from the Capital Region Board. Last Thursday the board presented the Minister of Municipal Affairs with its long-term growth plan. The members have shown excellent collaboration and co-operation so far, and I applaud them for their efforts.

Board members with us today are Mayor Kirk Popik, town of Calmar; Mayor Stephen Mandel, city of Edmonton; Reeve Wayne Woldanski, Lamont county; Mayor Greg Krischke, city of Leduc; Mayor Lloyd Bertschi, town of Morinville; Mayor Mel Smith, town of Redwater; Mayor Nolan Crouse, city of St. Albert; Mayor Stuart Houston, city of Spruce Grove; Mayor Cathy Olesen, Strathcona county; Mayor Camille Berube, town of Beaumont; Mayor Don Rigney, Sturgeon county; Mayor Allan Gee, village of Thorsby.

Board alternates with us today also include Councillor Ed Gibbons, city of Edmonton; Councillor Ben Van De Walle, town of Morin- ville; Councillor Art Erickson, village of Wabamun. Capital Region Board staff joining us today are Chief Officer Kathleen LeClair, Andy Haden, Brandy Moorhead, Lisa Sederski, Sharon Shuya, and Peter Tarnawsky. Also, from Strathcona county are Yolande Shaw and David Turner. Our guests are seated in the members’ gallery today, and I would ask that they all rise and receive the warm traditional welcome of this Assembly.

Ms Evans: It’s a thrill today to introduce some women who have made huge contributions to community service throughout the capital region, most specifically to young ladies. Members of the 3rd Trefoil Guild, representing the Guides: Mary Gerritsen, Margaret Campbell, Edna Dach, Carmel Fenniak, Kathy Morris, Ruth Strandberg, and Mae Hadley. They’re seated in the members’ gallery, and I’d ask them to please rise as we show appreciation for their attendance here today. The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Employment and Immigration. Mr. Goudreau: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

It’s a pleasure for me to rise today and introduce to you and through you to the Members of the Legislative Assembly government employees from Employment and Immigration. These dedicated professionals work in the following areas of our department: immigration policy and pro- grams, international qualifications assessment, Alberta immigrant nominee program, strategic marketing, and labour attraction. Their collective work ensures that newcomers are always welcome to our province, that they have the mean s to settle and make a successful life in Alberta.

It is also their efforts that keep Alberta on the national and international radar as a destination of choice for immigrants. I’m honoured to welcome them here today and ask that all members of the Assembly give our guests a very warm welcome to the Legislature. Mr. Blackett: Mr. Speaker, I rise to introduce to you and through you to members of this Assembly Chief Ron Morin, Mr. John Park, and Mr. Paul Bercier. Chief Ron Morin has lived on the Enoch reserve his entire life and was the youngest chief elected to the Enoch Cree Nation, in 1993.

The chief, as a man of great vision, has been instrumental in developing a number of innovative community- based projects. To name only a few, he was a key player in the successful development of the River Cree Resort and Casino, representing a $180 million investment. He oversaw the Millennium Housing Project and is currently pursuing the development of environmentally friendly refining right here in Alberta. I wish him luck in this ambitious project and admire his interest in investing in the future of our province through alternative, environmentally friendly energy resources.

Also with us this afternoon is Mr. John Park, the founding and current president of RCI bank of Canada. Out of Vancouver Mr. Park oversees the operations of Renaissance Capital Inc. and RCIC. He has been involved with Canada’s immigrant program for the last 11 y ears, and prior to leading RCI, he successfully managed the Alberta-based royal Canadian immigrant fund. Mr. Bercier is also with us today, a constituent of mine and exemplary Albertan and Canadian.

He has served in our Canadian armed forces for over 16 years and, as such, has been awarded the Canadian Forces decoration/medal and United Nations service medal in commemoration of his first-rate service to our country. Now a consultant with Willow Industrie s Mr. Bercier brings to that company many years of environmental-related experience through his service on a number of national and provincial committees. A few of those include clean water/life and the national Métis commit- tee on economic development, natural resources, and the environ- ment.

April 6, 2009 Alberta Hansard 511 Mr. Speaker, I ask that our accomplished guests please rise and receive the warm welcome of this House. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Riverview. Dr. Taft: Thanks, Mr. Speaker. We have with us today Eric Musekamp and Darlene Dunlop of the farm workers union of Alberta. The Farmworkers Union of Alberta was recognized as a legitimate voice of Alberta farm workers by none less than Judge Peter Barley when he granted the union legal standing at the inquiry into Kevan Chandler’s fatality.

They’re here to remind the Premier and the ministers that the Farmworkers Union of Alberta stands ready for immediate consultations on implementing Judge Barley’s recommendations to include paid farm workers under occupational health and safety legislation. They’ll even meet you today if you wish, folks. Please give them a warm welcome. Thank you. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Mackay. Ms Woo-Paw: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It’s my pleasure to introduce to you and through you to all members of this House some constituents from the constituency of Mackay.

I would like to ask these gentlemen to stand as I call their name: Mr. Appy Bhullar, brother of the Member for Calgary-Montrose, Mr. Balraj Randhawa, and Mr. Sam Sidhu. I would like the members to give them the warm welcome of this House. The Speaker: Hon. members, we are now going to be up against a standing order, and I think it’s prudent that we now proceed to Oral Question Period. head: Oral Question Period The Speaker: First Official Opposition main question. The hon. Member for Edmonton-Gold Bar. Government Hosting Expenses Mr. MacDonald: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

This government has many wasteful and lavish spending habits. Hosting expenses on amounts over $600, as publicly issued in the Alberta Gazette, have soared in the last five years, yet the government admitted last week that there is no official hospitality budget. You can’t control costs without a budget. To the Premier: given that over $1.3 million was spent on hosting expenses last year, why is there no official budget for hospitality expenses in the government? Mr. Stelmach: Mr.

Speaker, the hon. member that asked the question is chair of the Public Accounts Committee and is fully aware of the budgeting process we use in this House, fully transpar- ent in terms of all of the expenses that are put forward tied to any hosting done by a minister, by any MLA, or any member of the staff of any of the executive offices or any of the MLA offices. 1:50 The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. MacDonald: Thank you. The budget process as we know it is certainly flawed. Again to the Premier.

Of all the government departments the Ministry of International and Intergovernmental Relations spent the most on hosting expenses, over $155,000, in 2008. [interjections] It’s not a laughing matter. Where did the department find the money for all the dinners and drinks wh en there is no official hospitality budget? Mr. Stelmach: Mr. Speaker, the records will show that the minister responsible for International and Intergovernmental Relations has lived within the budget that was set by this Assembly last year. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. MacDonald: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Ministry of Environment beat out the ministry of advanced education for second place in the hospitality sweepstakes, spending $131,000 in 2008. Again to the Premier: where did the department find the money for all the dinners and drinks when there is no official hospitality budget? Mr. Stelmach: Mr. Speaker, once again, the ministers are assigned budgets, and their responsibility is to live within those budgets. I’m proud to say as we have ended this fiscal year, March 31, 2009, that all of our ministry budgets ended up being balanced. The Speaker: Second Official Opposition main question. The hon.

Member for Calgary-Varsity. Achievement Bonuses Mr. Chase: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In only five years bonuses given to the child and family services authorities have increased by 92 per cent, from $548,000 in 2003 to over $1 million last year. In that same five-year period we have children being put into hotels, inadequate compensation and support for foster parents, and a Child and Youth Advocate that can’t produce reports on time. It is inexcusable that your minister of children’s services is allowing this situation to continue.

To the Premier: how can you justify a 92 per cent increase in bonuses to senior officials given the r ecent track record of the children’s services ministry? Mr. Stelmach: Mr. Speaker, I’m proud of the work that our minister of children’s services has done. At a time where the economy is either increasing very rapidly and we have more children at risk, that are now in the hands of this government in terms of care, or the economy is slowing down and we’re heading into a recession, we may have more families that require help.

With respect to the bonuses this is a decision that I had made, that bonuses will be paid as of the end of this fiscal year, March 31, 2009, and no bonuses for next year. That’s in keeping with the agreement we had with all our staff, both unionized and non-unionized. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Chase: Thank you. I’m assuming the buck stops with the Premier, and $40 million worth of bucks will be flowing out in June. They should have stopped sooner. Why was the Premier allowing some of the child and family services authorities to submit budgets up to eight months behind

schedule last year yet still rewarding them with achievement bonuses? What exactly did they achieve if they can’t even submit their budgets on time? Mr. Stelmach: Mr. Speaker, I don’t know where the hon. member is coming from in terms of budgets. Budgets were delivered here to the House. The budget for the ministry was debated, and the motion

Alberta Hansard April 6, 2009512 was passed to approve the budget. From what I gather, it was done in a timely fashion and gave the minister the power to expend the dollars that were given to her by the power of the vote of this Assembly. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Chase: Thank you. To clarify, the money that was approved in April 2008 by this House was not approved locally by Calgary until late November. Why did compensation for foster parents and other supports for children in care only increase by a tiny fraction of the amount that bonuses did?

An extra million dollars would certainly go a long way to help the children in the care of our province. Mr. Stelmach: Mr. Speaker, once again, this is an agreement we had with about 6, 100 management people across the province of Alberta. We lived up to that agreement. I would say that all of the management personnel, through their responsible deputy ministers, came forward and said that for next year, given the fact that our revenue stream is diminished considerably and we’ll have more to do with less, let’s work together. We won’t go through the manage- ment bonuses.

We’ll save money going into next year so that we can look after the most vulnerable in the province. The Speaker: Third Official Opposition main question. The hon. Member for Edmonton-Riverview. Labour Protection for Paid Farm Workers Dr. Taft: Thanks, Mr. Speaker. Alberta trails the entire country when it comes to safety and rights for paid farm workers. This government clings to outdated policies while dozens of farm workers unnecessarily die and hundreds are unn ecessarily injured. My question is to the Premier.

Can the Premier explain why under this government’s policy the truck driver with the hauling company that carries the cattle has the right to join a union, but the worker who loads the cattle at the feedlot does not? Why the discrepancy? Mr. Stelmach: Mr. Speaker, I think now the hon. member is talking about whether a farm worker has the right to join a union. I’m not up on all of the labour laws, but I suspect that in any operation if the people that work want to gather and vote on the right to join a union, they have that option.

If I’m wrong, then the minister responsible for labour can correct me on that point. The Speaker: The hon. member. Dr. Taft: Well, thanks, Mr. Speaker. Actually, I’ll correct the Premier. Despite a Supreme Court of Canada ruling, farm workers in Alberta are explicitly forbidden from organizing unions. My question is to the Premier. Since he delivered that answer in a spirit of goodwill, will he and his government live up to the ruling of the Supreme Court of Canada and grant paid farm workers in Alberta the right they deserve, which is the right to unionize? Mr. Stelmach: Mr.

Speaker, one of the things we do have to determine first is what size of operation the hon. member is talking about. Are they talking about a feedlot operation with three people working? Are they talking about one that’s 30, 40, 50? Are they talking about seasonal workers that may operate on a vegetable farm or those that work seasonally during the time of harvest? These are all the kind of questions that we’re asking agriculture, those that are in the business, to give us suggestions so that we can develop a good policy position. The Speaker: The hon. member. Dr. Taft: Well, thank you, Mr. Speaker.

We’re actually talking about all paid farm workers, whether it’s three paid workers at a small feedlot or 50 at a big feedlot. They’re all paid. They all, under the ruling of the Supreme Court of Canada, ought to have the right to organize unions. Again in the spirit of openness that the Premier is providing here: is the Premier prepared to move this issue forward and help Alberta’s paid farm workers get the right they deserve, which would be the right to unionize? Can we move this issue forward, please? Mr. Stelmach: Mr. Speaker, as I said before, we’re now in the middle of consultations.

The minister of labour and also the minister of agriculture are holding consultations. We’ll bring forward the evidence, what we hear from the agricultural community, bring it forward to the House, and the policy will be debated. This is where it’s appropriately debated, I would think. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Strathcona, followed by the hon. Member for Lacombe-Ponoka. Carbon Capture and Storage Ms Notley: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This government’s carbon capture scheme is a $2 billion boondoggle in the making.

Big oil players have yanked their applications because the only thing CCS has proven to be so far is a big waste of money, yet this government seems committed to rolling the dice in tomorrow’s budget so long as the public purse pays the debts when they come due. To the Premier: why won’t you scrap the CCS program from tomorrow’s budget and use that money instead to create real, long-term jobs in the renewable energy sector? Mr. Stelmach: I guess she already knows what’s in the budget. In all honesty, I know that the hon. member is following up on a bit of a stunt that Greenpeace did today.

To those that are watching, somebody said that they hid $600 someplace on the Leg. Grounds. I don’t know. Mr. Speaker, it’s your grounds. Maybe we can ask people to find the 600 bucks. 2:00 You know, in all honesty, Mr. Speaker, the largest carbon footprint in the province is generated by coal-fired electricity plants. Those are the ones that had actually applied to the CCS fund. That is where we should start first. If we don’t, the cost of electricity is going to skyrocket. It will further diminish our global competitive- ness, and we will see more job loss.

They will not tell you that their goal is to significantly increase – increase – the cost of electricity. They feel that if they increase the cost of electricity, then they’ll be able to bring down the carbon footprint because you and I would not be able to afford to turn our lights on in our house. That’s what they want. Ms Notley: The largest greenhouse gas emission will be the oil sands if you carry on the way you want to, and electricity will come down when you start creating renewable energy.

Your own figures show that dolla rs invested in infrastructure create nearly four times the jobs of a dollar in oil and gas, and meanwhile the Construction Owners Association of Alberta expects the sharpest rise in job losses to occur late this year or early next year. To the Premier: why won’t you landfill your carbon capture idea, admit that it’s just a PR tool, and prevent further job losses by investing this money where it creates the most jobs, in infrastruc- ture?

April 6, 2009 Alberta Hansard 513 Mr. Stelmach: Mr. Speaker, actually, the $2 billion that we set aside in carbon capture has been recognized as a very important policy. It has been recognized internationally: London, The Hague, throughout Europe. Even the President of the United States himself recognized that carbon capture is the way to go. Out of a 50-year span it’s the first 30 years, more than likely, before there’s new technology. Let’s use carbon capture to bring down the level of carbon on our continent. This is a very, very good way of doing it. The Speaker: The hon. member. Ms Notley: Thank you, Mr.

Speaker. Well, tar sands executives don’t seem to agree. They say that it’s too expensive, too uncertain, and it’s not likely to work. Now, meanwhile Alberta has lost more than 30,000 jobs this year, and more people are being put out of work every day. Thousands of qualified construction workers are looking to this government for help, and the answer in tomorrow’s budget will be to bury their 2 billion tax dollars down a hole for PR and nothing else. Why won’t you admit that using public policy to subsidize carbon capture is a fool’s pursuit in tough times and invest this money in stimulus green jobs instead? Mr.

Stelmach: Mr. Speaker, it’s a bit of irony, I guess. National Geographic did this

article on Alberta. The actual text by National Geographic was fair and balanced, but the pictures that they used – unfortunately, they put in the picture of the open pit but not the picture of the reclaimed area of the oil sands. But, you know, so be it. Those are the issues that we have to face. At the same time the irony is that National Geographic is part of the Aspen Institute, which last week recognized Alberta – Alberta – of all the countries and the jurisdictions in the world, as taking a leadership role in carbon capture and storage. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Lacombe-Ponoka, followed by the hon.

Member for Edmonton-Centre. Municipal Sustainability Initiative Mr. Prins: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. We all know that Alberta’s municipalities receive significant s upport from this government through the municipal sustainability initiative. This unprecedented program assists municipalities to manage growth- related challenges and enhance their long-term planning. I know that the municipalities in my constituency have accessed this funding for their communities. My question, therefore, is to the Minister of Municipal Affairs. How is MSI helping Alberta’s communities today? The Speaker: The hon. minister.

Mr. Danyluk: Well, thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. MSI is having a real impact. Municipalities decide what their local priorities should be. Municipalities and communities are seeing new roads. We’re seeing recreation centres. We’re seeing fire halls. We’re seeing libraries. MSI is making a difference today. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Prins: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My second question is also for the same minister. I would ask him: how is the government ensuring that MSI is used effectively in today’s challenging economic times? Mr. Danyluk: Well, Mr.

Speaker, municipalities are committed to building strong communities, and so is this government. This support is unmatched throughout this country. This government has also added extra flexibility. Interest can now be used by municipali- ties to offset projects that they are bringing forward. So they can use the interest from MSI. This is moving forward with infrastructure programs. This is allowing municipalities to do what they feel is best. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Prins: Thank you again, Mr. Speaker. My final question is again to the Minister of Municipal Affairs.

How will this change benefit Albertans today? Mr. Danyluk: Well, Mr. Speaker, I think that there’s a very simple answer: it will keep Albertans working. It will accelerate projects by having lower construction costs, and it will continue to build vital infrastructure. It’s important. This government will continue to partner with municipalities such as you see here today. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Centre, followed by the hon. Member for Red Deer-South. Waterfowl Deaths in Oil Sands Tailings Pond Ms Blakeman: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

In July last year Syncrude officials reported to Sustainable Resource Develop- ment the final count of the ducks drowned in the tailings ponds. These officials were then instructed to withhold releasing the numbers to the public. Eight months later the Minister of Environ- ment didn’t know the final count. My first question is to the Minister of Sustainable Resource Development. Was it department staff or the minister who ordered that the information be kept from the public and from his colleague? Dr. Morton: Mr. Speaker, it’s a good thing for the member opposite that she’s not in a court of law.

That would be called a leading question. There were no orders given to anybody. We got the same numbers that she got, that everybody got last fall. Over the course of the fall and winter I heard that the numbers were higher, but this was in the course of an investigation. I didn’t hear any specific numbers till they were made public last week. Ms Blakeman: Well, the Syncrude officials were very clear on who they reported to, and it was your department. An additional question to the same minister: is it policy for departmental staff to decide that a member of cabinet would not receive vital information? Dr.

Morton: Mr. Speaker, the hon. member across the way has her facts wrong. Syncrude worked with government staff in dealing with the ducks. If she has read the report, as I’m sure she has, subsequent to the initial count ducks were floating to the surface. This took time. As I said, there was no attempt made to suppress any information. It was confined in the context of the potential litigation. The Speaker: The hon. member. Ms Blakeman: Thank you. This question is to the Minister of Environment.

While the final number of dead ducks may not matter for the purposes of a judicial investigation and the laying of charges, does the minister not require final numbers for the purposes of assigning monitoring staff and other department-related actions?

Alberta Hansard April 6, 2009514 Mr. Renner: Well, Mr. Speaker, I guess herein lies the difference between being the opposition critic and being the government minister. The minister is responsible for getting the job done. The critic is responsible for a degree of political grandstanding, and I think that’s what we have on our hands here. The actual number of ducks is part of the investigation that led to charges being laid. I think it’s appropriate that we let the courts deal with that number in an appropriate manner.

As for her question as to whether the number of duck mortality should affect the degree to which we have compliance with our legislation, of course not, Mr. Speaker. We enforce our legislation rigidly every day. 2:10 Postsecondary Application System Mr. Dallas: Mr. Speaker, I’ve heard from a few students and parents in my constituency that applying to postsecondary institutions can be both a frustrating and time-consuming process. My first question is for the Minister of Advanced Education and Technology. With your new focus on a province-wide planning system will the application process get any better?

The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mr. Horner: Well, thank you, Mr. Speaker. Indeed, I have heard those same comments, that it can be a frustrating process. In fact, being a parent of postsecondary students, I’ve found that out myself. Alberta has been developing a new system. It’s called ApplyAlberta. It’s an important step forward for students to be able to apply to any one of our institutions in the province from one portal. We’re testing the system out currently. Students will be able to create one profile on the system.

All of their transcripts and all of their information will be uploaded into that one profile. They can apply with that one profile to a number of institutions across Campus Alberta. Mr. Dallas: Mr. Speaker, my second question is also for the same minister. That sounds great, but when will ApplyAlberta be up and running so that students can actually use it? Mr. Horner: Mr. Speaker, it’s important that we get the system up and running as quickly as possible because another benefit to it will be for us to be able to track student demand and the demand in certain areas.

By the fall of this year, 2009, all 21 of the public postsecondary institutions are expected to be using ApplyAlberta. The funding is already in place. In fact, we’ve already been doing some trials at the University of Lethbridge. We’ve conducted a test of the system with students and with parents, and by all indications it’s a big hit. Mr. Dallas: My final question to the same minister: will students have to pay more to use this multi-application system? Mr. Horner: There’s not going to be any additional cost, Mr. Speaker. Students will not have to pay for the transcripts either.

Most of Alberta’s public postseco ndary institutions do charge an application fee, and the students will be required to pay those application fees to those institutions that they c hoose to apply to. But in terms of the new system there’ll be no new additional charges. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Varsity, followed by the hon. Member for St. Albert. Alberta Adolescent Recovery Centre Mr. Chase: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. While externally fixed bars are considered an illegal fire hazard for sec ondary suites, they are currently legally acceptable for owner-occupied homes.

For the past 20 years fixed external bars together with junior jailer-controlled locked bedroom doors have been key components of the nonaccredited Alberta Adolescent Recovery Centre, which poses as a government-regulated residential treatment program. To the Minister of Municipal Affairs: if externally fixed bars are considered a danger for rental tenants, why aren’t they considered a threat for home-owning family members or for the vulnerable youth prisoners of forced AARC confinement? Mr. Danyluk: Mr.

Speaker, first of all, Alberta has very strong building and fire codes to help individuals keep safe in secondary suites. Municipalities choose whether to permit secondary suites. Standards for new suites have been in force since December of 2006. We are working with municipalities to ensure that the right standards are in place. Mr. Chase: You completely missed the question. Secondary suites are enforced. Homeowners can bar their homes without any kind of result from your department. The rules need to be changed.

To the Minister of Justice: given the broad range of legal exemp- tions under the assumption that a person’s home is not only their castle but can serve as a jail, what type of mandatory correctional training should homeowner wardens or their junior jailers have to ensure the safety of our prisoners? The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Justice and Attorney General. Ms Redford: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’m not even quite sure of the point of that question or what the answer to that might be, but I don’t think it’s within the purview of my department. Mr.

Chase: The point is that no one in this government is looking out for the well-being of children imprisoned in homes. To the Minister of Health and Wellness: how can your ministry account for the physical safety or psychological well-being of either vulnerable adolescent prisoners or the families of at-risk youths who are required as participants in the AARC program to become jailers in your government’s unregulated home prisons? Mr. Liepert: Mr. Speaker, what this government is concerned about is that if we have a youth that is in need of help, we help these youth.

Sometimes in this Legislature you do something that you have a fair bit of pride in. During the break I happened to receive this from the families of AARC, from the students who’ve gone through the program. I’m going to table this so that that member can stand up and talk to these hundreds of students who’ve gone through this program, and he can read whether or not the program is working. The Speaker: The hon. Member for St. Albert, followed by the hon. Member for Lethbridge-East. Capital Region Municipal Planning Mr. Allred: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

A year ago the Minister of Municipal Affairs established the Capital Region Board, and I’m pleased that there are a fair number of them in the audience today. He gave them the mandate to come up with a land-use plan and transportation plan by the end of March 2009. These plans have now been developed into one comprehensive plan, the capital region

April 6, 2009 Alberta Hansard 515 growth plan, which was unveiled last week. My question is to the Minister of Municipal Affairs. Can the minister please tell this House how this growth plan will affect municipalities in the capital region? Mr. Danyluk: Well, Mr. Speaker, the Premier created the Capital Region Board because he saw a treme ndous opportunity for the region. Regional co-operation is a priority for this government for the success of the region and also for this province.

It is absolutely critical that what has taken place with the regional board be accented: communication, collaboration, co-operation. This approach will support strong and viable communities in this region. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Allred: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I agree that this has been a very significant accomplishment for this region’s municipalities. In reference to these plans, will these plans control development within all municipalities in the capital region? Mr. Danyluk: Well, Mr. Speaker, no. This is not about controlling development.

This is a regional look at planning, and this is an integrated and strategic approach to regional planning. It is imperative that we look in the long term in regard to development and infrastructure and conservation. This process ultimately supports, as I said before, a very strong capital region. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Allred: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My final question to the same minister. I understand that a similar plan is being prepared for the Calgary region. When will that plan be completed? Mr. Danyluk: Well, Mr.

Speaker, the Calgary Regional Partnership is up on a website for comments not only from adjoining municipali- ties but from individuals. They have said that they hope to have their plan in place by June. As with the capital region plan, I’m very much looking forward to the Calgary plan as well as other co- operative efforts that are taking place in this province to help develop communities. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Lethbridge-East, followed by the hon. Member for Edmonton-Strathcona. Centralized Cytology Lab Service Ms Pastoor: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

It is now clear that there was a request for proposals sent to lab service providers and that there are plans to only have two provincial labs providing cytology services. On March 19 in question period the Minister of Health and Wellness suggested that my questions were based on rumours and appeared not to know anything about the proposed changes. My questions to the Minister of Health and Wellness would be: whose decision was it to centralize the cytology lab service? Was it the minister’s or the Health Services Board’s? Mr. Liepert: Mr.

Speaker, the member is correct relative to the earlier question, and I make no apologies for saying that I was not familiar with the question but subsequent to that did ask for an answer. The answer I have is that these lab services are being centralized to Calgary and Edmonton, and there are a number of good reasons for it. The decision, by the way, was made by Alberta Health Services. The Speaker: The hon. member. Ms Pastoor: Thank you. I’m wondering: what is the time frame for the decision and the timeline for implementation? I’m sure the minister must know. 2:20 Mr.

Liepert: I don’t have the exact timeline, but the decision has been made, and I presume that it will be implemented soon. Ms Pastoor: The decision has been made. Thank you for that. I guess we’ll all just sit and wait and see what that decision was. You’ve indicated that there was a good reason for it. Would you table evidence and results that could show that a cost-benefit analysis of centralizing cytology lab services was performed? Mr. Liepert: Well, Mr. Speaker, I didn’t indicate that the reason it was being centralized was because of cost.

What I did say was that there are good reasons for it, and I’d be happy to supply the member with a written answer. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Strathcona, followed by the hon. Member for Little Bow. Waterfowl Deaths in Oil Sands Tailings Pond (continued) Ms Notley: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This government covered up the truth that over 1,600 ducks were killed in a Syncrude tar pond.

On February 9 this year the Environment minister – and I’ll use his word – grandstanded, boasting about the charges against Syncrude in a press conference, but conveniently forgot to mention that the death toll of the ducks was more than three times that which people had been previously led to believe. To the minister: how long will your campaign of cover-ups continue before Albertans get the transparency that they deserve? Mr. Renner: Mr.

Speaker, I’ve indicated publicly that I became aware that the initial estimate of 500 ducks was going to be ex- ceeded fairly early on in the process, but by that point we had an investigation under way. That investigation subsequently led to charges being laid. Those charges are now before the courts. The number of ducks that were involved in this is very much material evidence in that case. I think that it would be inappropriate and perhaps even an affront to the c ourts if I was to disclose publicly information that will be part of an ongoing court case. Ms Notley: Well, Mr.

Speaker, the minister previously said that the number of ducks would have no impact on the penalty sought, so I don’t see what the relevance actually could possibly be. Now, the minister was reported as saying that he never knew how many ducks died on the pond until Syncrude went public. Then when we found out that his underlings in the ministry knew well before that, the minister said that the truth was irrelevant. Then he said what we’ve heard again, that it would hurt the case against Syncrude, which is ridiculous because Syncrude is who made it public. To the minister.

You’re either embroiled in another cover-up, or members of your ministry aren’t doing their jobs. Which is it? Mr. Renner: Mr. Speaker, there was an investigation. In the course of that investigation there was a determination on the mortality of ducks in this circumstance. The numbers that have been brought forward by Syncrude are a requirement under their operating to report bird mortality. The investigation will present the evidence in

Alberta Hansard April 6, 2009516 court, and that evidence is part of the court proceeding. I can’t comment on whether or not Syncrude’s numbers are the same as the investigators’ numbers. Ms Notley: Well, Mr. Speaker, this cover-up has swollen Alberta’s international black eye even more. It has been reported in National Geographic, in Forbes magazine, in the Washington Times, in the Denver Post, on CBS, and it’s all over the Internet. This cover-up was over dead ducks. Last month we learned that charges of pollution in the Athabasca River were kept quiet on the eve of an election.

To the minister: how many cover-ups need to be exposed before you learn that honesty is the best policy? Mr. Renner: Mr. Speaker, every member in this House – well, with the exception perhaps of that one – knows that I have a reputation of being a straight shooter. The point of the matter is that there sometimes is a balance that must be maintained between transpar- ency and being successful in prosecution. I would suggest that this hon. member would be far more critical of this minister if as a result of disclosure of inappropriate information, this company was able to get off on a technicality.

That’s the reason why we’re very careful. Health Services Board Remuneration Mr. McFarland: Mr. Speaker, during our break a small southern city daily newspaper made a report about a 25 per cent increase in rates of remuneration to the new Alberta health board. The subse- quent calls to my constituency office came up with the consensus that per diems are quite fine but that these $50,000 honoraria are obscene. My question to the Minister of Health and Wellness: can you explain just what component of this salary remuneration package has a 25 per cent increase and how it came about? Mr. Liepert: Well, Mr.

Speaker, there was no increase. What the situation is is that when we created the one health board last spring, we appointed an interim board and put in place a temporary honorarium. As we moved towards appointing a full-time board last December, I did two things. First of all, I asked the chair to give me an indication of the amount of work that they had taken on, but secondly, I also did a comparative factor of boards of similar size and responsibility. The ministerial order was signed – I think it was last November – designating the honorarium for the permanent board of Alberta Health Services.

The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. McFarland: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Would the minister please explain to me what the governance savings are for this government when you compare the honoraria, the per diem, and the travel expenses of these 15 board members with the 15 other regional so-called voluntary board members that were in place? Mr. Liepert: Well, Mr. Speaker, first of all, I can’t do that because we need to allow the board to have at least one year of operation under the permanent structure before we have some actual data.

I do need to ensure that I correct something that the member said in his question, and that is that the previous regional health authority boards also received honoraria. It was in varying degrees, but they were not strictly volunteer board members. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. McFarland: Thank you. Finally, to the same minister: would the minister please outline if possi ble the salary range – this is coming from constituents who want to know what the salary range is – of the new senior executive, the CAO, CEO, COO, or whatever they’re referred to as? Mr. Liepert: Well, Mr.

Speaker, when the new CEO of Alberta Health Services was hired, there was a news release issued. It’s on the website. My recollection is that the salary of the new CEO is some $575,000 annually, which is certainly commensurate with other salaries for running an organization of that size. I don’t have in front of me the other executives’ salaries, but I can tell you that they’re less than that. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Buffalo, followed by the hon. Member for Drayton Valley-Calmar. Grizzly Bear Protection Mr. Hehr: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

This government has shown a continued neglect for the protection of the grizzly bear in Alberta. Current numbers show that the population is more at risk than ever. The Minister of Sustainable Resource Development has said that the anecdotal stories from hunters will be compared to detailed DNA data when determining whether to allow the hunting of Alberta grizzlies. Why does the minister place as much weight on anecdotes as on scientific evidence? The Speaker: The hon. minister. Dr. Morton: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I’ve said before, I don’t say that the two are equal at all.

What I’m saying is that the very people that have done the scientific evidence are interested in looking at the anecdotal evidence as another way of looking at the same phenomena. This sort of triangulation of data is a healthy way to go about it and will produce better results. The two different groups are collaborating, and the result will be better data for us to make our decision on. Mr. Hehr: Well, Mr.

Speaker, the minister’s own Endangered Species Conservation Committee report from 2002 states that “the biological status of species should be determined by independent scientists using the best science available in an open and transparent process.” Why, then, is the minister giving hunting groups an equal say in determining the status of the grizzly bear? Dr. Morton: Mr. Speaker, we are using the best available scientific evidence. We’re using exactly the same methodology that was used in the Yellowstone park area to do a successful grizzly bear status assessment down there.

It’s nonsense to say that we’re giving different groups a say. This isn’t a question about giving different groups a say. It’s a question of taking different types of data gathered in different ways and actually, in cross-referencing them, getting a better result. Mr. Hehr: Well, then explain to me this, Mr. Minister: how is it that a biological status by an independent group of scientists couldn’t be done by them alone? Why are we relying on two separate groups to do this? 2:30 Dr. Morton: Mr. Speaker, every sampling strategy has its strengths and weaknesses.

The weaknesses of the DNA are that you’re baiting specific sites and expecting or predicting that bears pass through and leave some DNA. It is considered one of the best sampling tech- niques available, as I said, used in the Yellowstone park study, but

April 6, 2009 Alberta Hansard 517 it has its weakness: you put the sampling sites in areas where bears are available. The complementarity of the two data sets, I repeat, is the combination of the two studies, not a weakness. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Drayton Valley-Calmar, followed by the hon. Member for Edmonton-Centre. First Nations Development Fund Grants Mrs. McQueen: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Recently I attended a meeting with representatives of Treaty 6 along with several MLA colleagues and the Minister of Aboriginal Relations.

The First Nations development fund was discussed, and some First Nations said that there are delays in processing the requests. My questions are for the Minister of Aboriginal Relations. What can be done to speed up the application process for this grant program? Mr. Zwozdesky: Mr. Speaker, I think the application process is already very streamlined. In fact, last year we reviewed 200-plus applications, and that bodes well for the staff involved.

But as part of our due diligence sometimes we do require additional information or additional budget items to be addressed, and in every case we require a band resolution to accompany the grant request. Those kinds of things can sometimes precipitate understandable delays, but we are working with First Nations more closely than ever right now to help with the process and help ensure that the applications that do come in are completed properly. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mrs. McQueen: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

To the same minister: can the grant payout timelines be amended so that First Nations might receive their grants sooner than once every three months? Mr. Zwozdesky: Mr. Speaker, that issue actually goes back to the original agreement that was negotiated by the First Nations and the government of Alberta in 2001. I’m happy to say, though, that under that particular policy we’ve never had any late payments, at least none that were precipitated by us.

If we were to contemplate a change in the due process of that particular issue, we would have to consult with all 47 First Nations again and, of course, with the gaming and liquor control people, and that would precipitate delays. Finally, if we were to look at additional payments, that would require additional administration and additional costs as well. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mrs. McQueen: Thank you.

Finally, to the same minister: given that the FNDF program is achieving good su ccess in First Nation communities, will you consider expanding the program’s criteria and project eligibility so that more projects can be funded? Mr. Zwozdesky: In fact, Mr.

Speaker, all projects that are eligible right now include infrastructure projects, economic development projects, social development projects, and community development projects, but we are wanting to be clear that projects that are not eligible would include such things as gaming activities or per capita distributions or payments against loans or payments against debts. Those are clearly outside the purview and not eligible.

I’m happy to tell the hon. member that we have not had to decline any applica- tions under the First Nations development fund program using the current criteria, which, in my view, are therefore working quite effectively. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Centre, followed by the hon. Member for Calgary-Fort. Oil and Gas Industry Fracturing Chemicals Ms Blakeman: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. In Pennsylva- nia natural gas companies are allowed to keep their fracking formulas proprietary, but the ingredients are public record.

In Alberta companies can keep the chemical compounds in their fracturing fluid secret, and therefore scientists do not know what to test for. This puts Alberta’s groundwater at risk. My questions are to the Minister of Environment. What reason does the government have for allowing companies to keep secret the chemicals used in their fracking formulas? Mr. Renner: Mr. Speaker, that question would more appropriately be addressed to the Minister of Energy, responsible for ERCB. The Speaker: The hon. minister. Mr. Knight: Well, thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

Indeed, that is the case in Alberta and British Columbia. I don’t know about Saskatchewan and other provinces. In fact, the majority of the frac fluid used in the province of Alberta currently, particularly in unconventional gas – and I believe it’s the area that the member opposite would be suggesting is taking pl ace in the eastern United States – is water. Secondly, the areas that are fracked in the province of Alberta are not anywhere near potable or surface water contaminant possibilities.

Ms Blakeman: Well, then, to the same minister: how does the government expect to get a true result from the testing of Albertans’ well water that is close to well s ites if the scientists do not know what to test for? Mr. Knight: Mr.

Speaker, what I would suggest is that if there is any indication of the types of surfactants or release agents that actually provide lubricant to push frac fluids and frac solids into fractures in production facilities underground, if there was any contamination, cross-contamination, it would not be difficult for the ERCB to be able to determine what those contaminants and chemicals were. Ms Blakeman: Secrets, secrets.

Back to the same minister: given that diesel is commonly used in other centres as a fracking agent, how can Albertans be sure that diesel is not being used here and is not contaminating our groundwa- ter? Mr. Knight: Well, Mr. Speaker, that again is an entirely different process that the member is talking about. Most certainly, we do have areas in certain circumstances in the province where the geology is sensitive to water and water contamination of the geology causes decrease in production capability, but it’s a completely different issue and used for different processes in the industry. The Speaker: The hon.

Member for Calgary-Fort, followed by the hon. Member for Lethbridge-East. Assured Income for the Severely Handicapped Mr. Cao: Well, thank you, Mr, Speaker. The assured income for the severely handicapped program, known as AISH, is a very good and unique program in Alberta. The rising cost of living has put great pressure on Alberta AISH recipients, who are already counting on

Alberta Hansard April 6, 2009518 every dollar they receive. To the hon. Minister of Seniors and Community Supports: what is the government doing to support AISH recipients through this difficult economic downturn time? Mrs. Jablonski: Mr. Speaker, the AISH program will continue to provide financial assistance and a wide range of health and supple- mental benefits to eligible Albe rtans with disabilities. Front-line staff work closely with AISH clients to advise them of the benefits available to them.

Staff with the AISH program are also working with other ministries to ensure that when an AISH client is referred, they are referred to a program that will meet their unique needs. The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Cao: Well, thank you. To the same minister. My constituent, who is an AISH recipient, met with me a few weeks ago. She has a dependent child, so she receives an additional $100 a month on top of her AISH income. My question to the minister is: what happens to this additional amount when she turns 18 and is still dependent on her parent? Mrs. Jablonski: Mr.

Speaker, the AISH program will continue to provide the $100 child benefit to clients for a dependent child who is between the ages of 18 and 20 and who is also attending high school. The dependent child is also eligible for health and supple- mental health benefits during this time. When dependent children become adults, it’s our hope that with the education that they are receiving, they will be able to pursue the opportunities available to them in our province. They could also apply for government programs such as student loans or income support specific to their own personal situation.

The Speaker: The hon. member. Mr. Cao: Thank you. To the same minister. The AISH recipient who has dependent children can earn up to $975 before the benefits are reduced. When the child turns 18, this limit amount is reduced to $400. Can the minister look into this to make it fair when the child is still dependent on the AISH recipient? Mrs. Jablonski: Mr. Speaker, the AISH client would not have their employment income exemption rate reduced if the dependent adult continues to attend high school and is between the ages of 18 and 20 years.

As I mentioned in my previous answer, the AISH client would also continue to receive the $100 child benefit. AISH also provides a children’s education benefit to assist clients with the costs of dependent children attending preschool through high school. The Speaker: Hon. members, that concludes the question period. There were 96 questions and responses today. We’ll now return to the Routine. The Routine was at the subject matter of ministerial statements. I will introduce the hon.

Minister of Municipal Affairs and will ask him to convey to his delightful wife, Lorraine, our grateful thank you’s for putting up with the hon. minister for 35 years in happy marital bliss. She certainly made him a better man. 2:40head: Ministerial Statements Capital Region Municipal Planning Mr. Danyluk: Well, thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. There are 25 municipalities in the capital region, large and small, rural and urban.

Each has a distinct hist ory and a distinct identity, but they also have a shared interest as we look to the future, an interest in co- ordinated growth, efficient services, and a high quality of life for all residents in the area. Our government has the same interest. That is why one year ago our Premier brought these municipalities together to plan for future development of the region. Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to info rm this House that the Capital Region Board has met the key element of its mandate. Last week the board officially presented me with the capital region growth plan.

This is an outstanding accomplishment. It is a testament to the leadership of our Premier and to the leadership of the elected officials from all the capital region municipalities, many of whom, as you see, are with us in the Assembly today. These municipal leaders are able to work together, plan together, and focus on the best interests of the region as a whole. I know it wasn’t easy. They worked hard and made the difficult decisions, and I commend them for their tremendous dedication.

In the course of over 80 meetings they compromised when they had to, and most importantly they communicated, they collaborated, and they co- operated. As a result, they were able to develop a blueprint that will help shape the future of this region. The capital region growth plan provides an integrated and strategic approach to that future. It identifies overall development patterns and future infrastructure needs. It will be the mechanism to ensure that decisions are co- ordinated, that duplication is avoided, and that economic growth is promoted. The plan includes four major elements.

First, there is the land-use plan, that is based on the following six principles: protect the environment and the resources, minimize the regional footprint, strengthen communities, increase transportation choice, ensure efficient provision of services, and support regional economic development. Second, Mr. Speaker, there is a plan for a regional intermunicipal transit network. It includes a governance model, service policy, and potential route plans. Third, there is a plan for a region-wide integrated geographic information system.

This system will provide the detailed mapping and the electronic data that will be the foundation of more co-ordinated decision-making in years to come. Finally, the capital region growth plan includes a regional strategy for affordable housing. It will enable the region to better accommodate changing demographics and prepare for expected growth. The government will now review the plan to ensure that it meets the criteria and objectives set out in the Capital Region Board regulation. We will make sure that it aligns with the provincial policy and protects the interests of all residents.

We will also continue to support the co-operative efforts of the board as it moves on to the next phase of its work – that work is vital to the future of this region and our province and the government of Alberta – and it will continue to fulfill its role in promoting prosperity and building strong communities in the capital region. Once again, Mr. Speaker, I would like to congratulate the members of the Capital Region Board for their accomplishments so far. Their successful collaboration is attracting notice from across the country and is a prime example of what can be achieved when we work together.

I applaud the board members for their hard work, and I wish them all the best as they continue to work hard and work together for the future of our communities. Thank you so much, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: On behalf of the Official Opposition the hon. Member for Edmonton-Gold Bar. Mr. MacDonald: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The capital region has needed a plan for growth and sustainable development for a long time. I am pleased that the long-awaited capital region growth plan is based on sound principles and new intermunicipal relationships.

April 6, 2009 Alberta Hansard 519 I join the hon. minister in congratulating the Premier and the hard- working municipal leaders who hammered out a plan for the long- term benefit of so many citizens. There’s no doubt that this would not have happened without the involvement of the Premier, and I think that as time progresses, the entire region will recognize that this is a step in the right direction. We are glad to see that the plan focuses on sustainable land-use development, affordable housing, and an intermunicipal transit system.

These are undoubtedly n ecessary goals for the continued economic success of Edmonton and the region. We in the Alberta Liberal caucus want to see communities that are environmentally sustainable, well connected, and provide all citizens with a very high quality of life. This plan has the potential to meet those goals. As with any plan its success will depend on the full support of this government, not just verbal support but ongoing financial and planning support.

All too often we’ve seen this government bring forward excellent plans only to have those plans collect dust on a shelf somewhere, unfunded and unimplemented. The stakes here are too high to allow this to happen again. The capital region has the opportunity for a bright future, but realizing that opportunity will require leadership and action. A growth plan is a good first step. We are glad that it has been taken and that the region’s municipalities have come together, and they have come together, again, through the leadership of the Premier and his hon. minister.

But this is only the beginning of a very long journey, one that will require good faith, effort, and hard work from local and provincial leaders alike. I hope that this government follows through with the promise on this plan because it’s certainly needed. Thank you. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Strathcona has caught my eye. I anticipate that the hon. member will want to request unanimous consent to address the Assembly on this matter. I will do it on her behalf and ask one question: if any hon. member is opposed, please say no. [Unanimous consent granted] The Speaker: The hon.

Member for Edmonton-Strathcona. Ms Notley: Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and to all members of this House for allowing me the opportunity to respond on behalf of the NDP opposition. Firstly, I do want to commend both the minister and the Capital Region Board for the hard work that they’ve put into preparing their report. They have made ma ny positive recommendations, and we hope that the government will follow through on many of them. However, it is important that we reflect on the past and current situations in order to understand the purpose and importance of the capital plan.

The Klein cuts of the ’90s included axing the regional planning commissions. This government changed legislation to disband the 10 commissions and repealed their plans, leaving community planning the functions of individual municipalities. Since that action the capital region has faced a number of serious issues, including the impacts of urban sprawl, the transit deficit, duplication of services, problems with economic regional planning, and the need for community-based schools in both new and estab- lished neighbourhoods.

Municipal planners from outside of Alberta have repeatedly identified a number of deficits in Edmonton with respect to its planning. In short, many of the challenges that we are now very genuinely congratulating the Capital Region Board for starting to address were caused in large part by decisions of this government over 10 years ago. Now, the Capital Region Board has been asked to look at a number of issues relating to urban and suburban living in our capital region. Among these issues members have been asked to consider a land-use plan, a housing plan, and an intermunicipal transit network.

Unfortunately, the government has changed the rules in the time between asking municipal officials to undertake this large task and today. They released a land-use framework that requires substantial legislative changes before any real accomplishments can be reached, and this government, unfortunately, has not yet followed through. They announced a plan to eliminate homelessness without, unfortunately, any monetary commitments, so it has not yet been followed through on.

They yanked nearly $2 billion from the promised Green TRIP, a public transit fund announced a year ago, that this government has not followed through on. 2:50 I commend the Capital Region Board for meeting their mandate and living up to their promises. However, until this government is committed to implementing its recommendations, I am concerned that this report, as identified by others, may just collect dust on the bookshelf. It’s obvious that a lot of work has gone into this group and its plan. They’ve lived up to their side of the bargain, and now it is up to the government to follow through on theirs.

Thank you. head: Members’ Statements The Speaker: Hon. members, in 30 seconds from now I’ll call upon the first of a number of members to participate. The hon. Member for Edmonton-Decore. Excellence in Teaching Award Semifinalists Mrs. Sarich: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Every school day teachers across this province encourage students to embrace and enjoy learning and make valuable and meaningful contributions to students’ lives. Our students consistently rank amongst the best in the world, and this is a direct reflection on the tremendous amount of work being done by teachers in Alberta classrooms.

Through the excellence in teaching awards program teachers and principals are recognized for their individual and invaluable commitment to our students and to the future of this province. The nominees for the excellence in teaching awards are teachers and principals who use creativity and innovation to motivate students to succeed. They show leadership and work with their teaching colleagues to create a positive school climate. They are champions for their schools and for their students. This year, Mr. Speaker, out of 365 eligible nominations 134 teachers and principals were selected as semifinalists.

They will be honoured at two special celebration dinners later this month and will have access to $1, 500 for professional development. From this group of semifinalists 23 final award recipients will be selected and formally honoured at a dinner and awards ceremony with the Education minister in Edmonton on May 30. Of the 23 award recipients 20 will receive the provincial excellence in teaching award and will have access to $4, 000 for professional development to further develop their teaching skills.

Three out of the 23 award recipients will receive a Smarter Kids Foundation innovative use of technology award, which includes a comprehensive technology package. Mr. Speaker, the excellence in teaching awards have been celebrated since 1989, with more than 8,200 teachers nominated and more than 400 who have received awards. I am pleased to rise today to recognize all of the outstanding teachers and principals across this

Alberta Hansard April 6, 2009520 province and give special congratulations to the 2009 excellence in teaching awards semifinalists. Thank you. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Gold Bar. Prescription Drug Coverage Mr. MacDonald: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. The Official Opposition made many good suggestions r ecently to extend prescription drug coverage in Alberta to all citizens. We need a more extensive public pharmacare program based on models in other Canadian provinces to help reduce rapidly rising pharmaceutical costs and to ensure proper access to medications.

The government has failed to listen to the Official Opposition. The government has failed to listen to Alberta seniors. These seniors are outraged at the latest government proposal, which downloads even more costs onto their already stretched household budgets. I would urge all hon. members of this Assembly to please read a research paper written recently by Aidan Hollis, an associate professor in the department of economics at the University of Calgary. It is titled Generic Drug Pricing and Procurement: A Policy for Alberta, by, again, Professor Hollis.

Professor Hollis proposes a new approach for Alberta designed to obtain low prices for consumers and fair treatment for pharmacies and manufacturers. Some of the proposals include a descending maximum price with inflation indexing, a cap on rebates or other considerations granted directly or indirectly to pharmacies by manufacturers, an open formulary, a royalty paid to the first generic entrant that successfully challenges a patent. There are ways other than gouging seniors to control prescription costs.

Seniors in this province should not have to endure a means test at their local pharmacy before they r eceive their medication. Now, in conclusion, I would remind hon. members of what Professor Hollis has stated and noted: “In 2007, the Government of Alberta spent approximately $887 million on prescription drugs through community pharmacies, while private expenditures . . . totalled $980 million.” About one-quarter of the spending was for drugs that were not patented. There was a $15 million savings here if we had followed a different model. Thank you. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Lougheed.

South Fish Creek Recreation Complex Mr. Rodney: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have two good-news announcements to share from the southwest quadrant of Calgary. The first involves the South Fish Creek recreation centre, which was originally designed to include four ice surfaces, but to this point only two could be built. Although the centre is not in my constituency, many of my constituents use it a nd helped to build it. Arenas provide an invaluable opportunity for Albertans of all ages to be active and develop valuable life skills.

The members of the SFCRA are to be commended for their time and commitment in acquiring the necessary funds to construct the final two arenas. The MLA for Calgary-Shaw, our Minister of Tourism, Parks and Recreation, and I were on hand as our Minister of Culture and Community Spirit delivered a $3.2 million cheque in matching funds, I might say, from our government’s major community facilities program to aid in the completion of this fine project. The expansion will serve more than 400,000 annual users from Calgary, Okotoks, High River, and many other rural areas.

Our Minister of Culture and Community Spirit was also on hand to deliver 750,000 MCFP dollars to Hull Child and Family Services, and these funds were matched by Hull. They’ll be invaluable in the development of a new mental health treatment facility to assist at- risk youth who live with addictions, abuse, and behavioural issues. Since 1962 Hull has served troubled young people and struggling families and developmentally challenged adults, over 3,000 people every day. They are to be commended for working miracles on a daily basis. Mr.

Speaker, there is great news all over Alberta, and with this government’s partnerships we don’t have to look very far to find them. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Grande Prairie-Wapiti. Pete Eager Fire Hall Wind Energy Project Mr. Drysdale: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to congratu- late the city of Grande Prairie and Golden Sheep Power Inc. on a partnership that has led to the development of the Pete Eager Fire Hall wind generation project.

This exciting initiative has the potential to take the wind and turn it into clean power and profits for residential, agricultural, and commercial use. By utilizing compact wind turbines to harness wind, property owners could potentially produce their own electricity and sell any extra electricity generated back into the grid at market value. At the same time, if you’re tied into the electrical grid and should you use more energy than you produce, you can draw from the grid.

The Pete Eager Fire Hall project will not only study the noise-to-wind ratio but would also determine if local residents support wind energy production in their community. I am pleased that this project may help determine how a bylaw can be developed to best accommodate small wind turbines for residen- tial purposes. As we all know, Mr. Speaker, Albertans live in one of the most beautiful and healthy natural environments in the world, which is why we are committed to sustaining it.

This project is impressive because it’s one step closer to reducing our environmen- tal footprint and is another example of this province’s entrepreneur- ial spirit. In this way the project supports this government’s commitment to ensuring clean energy production. I always encour- age the development of renewable energy, and I look forward to the success of this project. Thank you.

The Speaker: Hon. members, momentarily I’m going to have to rise – and I have done it now – on Standing Order 7(7), which states, “At 3 p.m. the items in the ordinary daily routine will be deemed to be concluded and the Speaker shall notify the Assembly.” We still have a portion of our Routine to go through. I will anticipate that perhaps members might want to continue the Routine. We need unanimous consent to continue, so I ask the question: is any member here opposed to continuing the Routine? Any member who is, say no. Okay. We’re going forward. [Unanimous consent granted] The Speaker: The hon.

Member for Drayton Valley-Calmar. head: Members’ Statements (continued) Building Leadership for Action in Schools Today Mrs. McQueen: Well, thank you, Mr. Speaker. Last month I was honoured to have the BLAST team in my hometown of Drayton Valley make an excellent presentation in my constituency office. BLAST, or building leadership for action in schools today, was

April 6, 2009 Alberta Hansard 521 formed out of a partnership between the Lung Association and the Alberta Alcohol and Drug Abuse Commission in 2002. The BLAST program educates youth throughout the province about the dangers of smoking and the use of smokeless tobacco. Of course, I am very supportive of their efforts. 3:00 The Drayton Valley team is coached by Chris Schoepp and consists of four grade 7 and one grade 8 student: Nick Jodouin, Jessica Gustafson, Tristan Seely, Elyas Patey-Taylor, and Alicia Potter.

At BLAST conferences the students learn about current issues about tob acco and work on team-building and leadership skills in order to develop a youth action plan for their community. Following these conferences, the students are responsible for implementing these plans. This BLAST team is presenting to their elected officials and their peers and have also run ads in the local papers. It is wonderful to see the st udents involved with the BLAST program getting involved in their community and promoting healthy lifestyle choices throughout the province. Great job to all of them.

I look forward to seeing the results of their work and leadership. Our future is certainly in great hands with this young group of team leaders and the youth. Congratulations to them. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Egmont. 783 Air Force Wing Mr. Denis: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I’m pleased to rise today to acknowledge the 783 Air Force Wing, of which I am proud to have been named an honorary member. I was recently invited by a couple of my constituents, Al and Bev Spielman, to attend the 783 Air Force Wing anniversary banquet on March 21, 2009.

Based out of Calgary, the 783 branch has positioned itself as an important part of the broader Air Force Association of Canada. Established in 1948, the Air Force Association of Canada is identifiable through its support, sponsorship, and encouragement of all aspects of aviation, aerospace, and aeronautics.

This directive means that the group has been very active within Calgary, Alberta, and Canada through a variety of projects, including honouring the past traditions of the Canadian Air Force and providing a common bond for all aviation personnel; encouraging improved aviation legislation; actively promoting the future of Canadian military and civil aviation by lobbying for the procurement of improved military aviation equipment; participating in community programs designed towards development of Canadian youth, particularly the air cadet activities; undertaking local community charitable projects; honouring the achievements and efforts of deserving groups, organizations, or individuals associated with Canadian military and civil aviation; fostering and encouraging a spirit of fellowship among those involved in aviation endeavours; and, of course, working for Canadian unity and encouraging responsible citizenship among all Canadians.

Mr. Speaker, the 783 Air Force Wing is a prime example of an organization in our province that is working hard to make a differ- ence in our country. I would like to take the time to thank the 783 Wing for their contributions to th is province and wish them all the best in the future. Thank you. head: Tabling Returns and Reports The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Varsity. Mr. Chase: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have two tablings today. One is a program from the East Coulee Spring Festival, that occurred this past Saturday in East Coulee, just east of Drumheller.

It was a very successful event, designed to raise funds for the local museum. A number of local merchants participated. A number of hotels and bed and breakfast individuals gave away free lodging for the artists, who dedicated their time free of charge for this wonderful fundraising event. Among the various performers was a young, upcoming Alberta musician, Tim Hus, who represented Alberta in our centennial year at the Smithsonian Institute. My second tabling recognizes the wonderful, talented efforts of the Alberta Ballet company, that has been operating for 40 years in this province.

It was an opportunity and a tremendous treat for myself and my grandson to attend the performance this past Thursday in Calgary. The ballet performed Alice in Wonderland in Calgary from April 2 to 4 and in Edmonton from March 27 to 28, a wonderful experience for all. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Gold Bar. Mr. MacDonald: Yes. Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I have three tablings today. The first is an outline of hosting expenses over $600 by ministry for the government of Alberta as publicly disclosed in the Alberta Gazette 2004 through to 2008, which I referred to in question period earlier today.

The second tabling I have is a letter that was wr itten by our constituency office on May 27, 2008, to the Chief Electoral Officer over on Kingsway Avenue. It’s regarding the conduct of poll 75 in Edmonton-Gold Bar on the March 3, 2008, provincial election date. My third tabling is an initial response that I received from Elections Alberta, from the Chief Electoral Officer, dated June 2, 2008, in response to my original letter. Thank you. The Speaker: Hon. members, the chair wishes to table copies of the written submissions provided by the hon.

Member for Edmonton- Strathcona in support of her purported question of privilege raised on March 19, 2009, and written submissions by the hon. Govern- ment House Leader on the same purported question of privilege. As members will recall, on March 19 I indicated to both and any other members that should they wish to provide written submissions to me, they should be received in my office by March 26, 2009. They were, so I am now prepared to deal with the subject matter that was raised at that time.

But, first of all, we’re going to deal with the Clerk. head: Tablings to the Clerk The Clerk: I wish to advise the House that the following document was deposited with the office of the Clerk. On behalf of the hon. Mr. Horner, the Minister of Advanced Education and Technology, Advanced Education and Technology public postsecondary institu- tions audited financial statements, universities and Banff Centre for continuing education for the year ended March 31, 2008, and public colleges and technical institutes for the year ended June 30, 2008.

Privilege Rights of the Assembly The Speaker: Hon. members, those of you who have ever watched the television series The Tudors may find this ruling of interest. On the last day before the spring break the Member for Edmonton- Strathcona raised a purported question of privilege concerning the regulation-making authority found in Bill 18, the Trade, Investment

Alberta Hansard April 6, 2009522 and Labour Mobility Agreement Implementation Statutes Amend- ment Act, 2009. This bill is currently at committee stage. The member’s purported question of privilege is based on

section 5 of the bill, which would amend

schedule 6.1 of the Government Organization Act by making a subsection 7(2), which would allow the Lieutenant Governor in Council to make regulations that “may suspend the application of or modify a provision of

an Act or regulation or may substitute another provision in place of a provi- sion.” Both the Member for Edmonton-Strathcona and the Government House Leader submitted written materials on March 26, 2009, that restate and supplement their arguments made in the Assembly on March 19. The chair has tabled these submissions. The full exchange on this purported question of privilege is found at pages 499 to 503 of Alberta Hansard for that day.

With respect to the technical aspects of Standing Order 15, the Speaker’s office received written notice from the Member for Edmonton-Strathcona on March 19, 2009, at 11:19 a.m. of her intention to raise the purported question of privilege and a brief description of the issue. Accordingly, the two-hour notice require- ment of Standing Order 15(2) was met. For the reasons that will follow, the chair will not comment further on whether this matter was raised at the earliest opportunity.

Essentially the member’s argument is that the provision in the bill would allow the government to amend legislation that is passed by the Legislature without returning to the Assembly. The member argues that this provision constitutes a breach of the Assembly’s privileges, or, alternatively, a contempt of the Assembly. The type of provision found in Bill 18 that is the subject of this purported question of privilege is often referred to as a Henry VIII clause and, as the chair has discovered, has been the subject of much discussion not only in Canada but across the Commonwealth.

The United Kingdom Parliament website indicates that the House of Lords Select Committee on the Scrutiny of Delegated Powers in its first report of 1992-93 defined a Henry VIII clause as: a provision in a Bill which enables primary legislation to be amended or repealed by subordinate legislation, with or without further Parliamentary scrutiny . . . The clauses were so named from the Statute of Proclamations 1539, which gave King Henry VIII power to legislate by proclamation.

Erskine May, 23rd edition, at page 664 states: “power may . . . be conferred, by what is known as a ‘Henry VIII clause,’ to amend the statute itself by delegated legislation or to amend other statutes.” 3:10 In conducting research – and we were busy – we discovered that a written question in the British House of Commons asked, “How many Henry VIII clauses were contained in primary legislation enacted in Session 2007-08?” The answer contained in the British House of Commons Hansard for March 2, 2009, was that “the Government do not routinely collect or hold information about the number of Henry VIII provisions.” In the arguments raised by the Member for Edmonton-Strathcona, there is no reference to any instances where such clauses have been ruled a prima facie breach of privilege.

Clearly, the references from the United Kingdom and the court decisions in Canada do not indicate that there is any breach of privilege involved when these clauses have been enacted although they may be perceived as objectionable. Members should be aware that apart from decisions on money bills it is not the role of the chair to rule on the legality or constitu- tionality of bills. That is the role given to the courts.

As noted in the Government House Leader’s brief, this principle is cited in Beau- chesne’s sixth edition at paragraph 31(9), where it is stated that “the failure of the Government to comply with the law is not a matter for the Speaker, but should be decided by the courts.” This is also clearly stated at page 21 of Parliamentary Practice in B.C., fourth edition. There have also been rulings in this Assembly on this issue, the most recent being from the chair on March 3, 2005, as noted at page 26 of Hansard.

The ability of Parliament or a Legislature to delegate authority to amend statutory provisions was set out as long ago as 1917 in a decision by the British House of Lords. Accordingly, the chair rules that there is no prima facie question of privilege, and this matter is now concluded with the following addendum. The chair s hould not be seen as e ndorsing the use of these types of clauses.

There is no doubt that they detract from the role of the Assembly; however, the question as to whether a Henry VIII clause ought to be used is different from the question as to whether it may be used. head: Orders of the Day head: Written Questions [The Clerk read the following written questions, which had been accepted] Long-term Care Costs Q1. Mr. Mason: For the fiscal years 2003-2004 to 2007-2008 what was the average cost per resident per month at a designated long- term care facility? Contracted Psychiatric Services Q3. Mr.

Mason: For each of the fiscal years 2006-2007 and 2007-2008 what was the total value of psychiatric services contracted by regional health authorities, RHA, broken down by RHA, and what was the total value of psychiatric services contracted by the Alberta Mental Health Board? Physicians in Alberta Towns Q5. Mr. Mason: What was the number of physicians working in Alberta towns for each of the fiscal years 2005-2006 to 2007-2008? Placements for Children in Government Care Q8.

Ms Notley: For each of the fiscal years 2005-2006 to 2007-2008 what was the average amount of time taken by Children and Youth Services to find permanent placements for children in permanent government care? Long-term Care Facility Costs Q10. Mr. Mason: What were the total government subsidies provided to long-term care facilities and the total operating expenditures for those same facilities for the fiscal years 2003-2004 to 2007-2008? Long-term Care Facilities Q12. Mr.

Mason: How many long-term care facilities, with their respective bed complement, were operating in Alberta on March 31 for the years 2007 and 2008, broken down by regional health

April 6, 2009 Alberta Hansard 523 authority and whether the facility and service providers are/were owned/operated publicly, privately, or on a volun- tary basis? Alberta’s Brand Campaign Costs Q14. Mr. Mason: How much money has been spent on Alberta's brand campaign in the United States in the fiscal year 2007-2008 and from April 1, 2008, to February 10, 2009? Legal Aid Services Q16. Ms Notley: For each of the fiscal years 2004-2005 to 2007-2008 on how many occasions were approved legal aid services not provided due to unavailability of counsel? Legal Aid Services Q17.

Ms Notley: For each of the fiscal years 2004-2005 to 2007-2008 what was the average income of people accessing legal aid? The Clerk: Pursuant to Standing Order 34(3.1) written questions are deemed to stand and retain their places with the exception of Written Question 2, Mr. Mason. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Strathcona on behalf of the hon. Member for Edmonton-Highlands-Norwood. Designated Assisted Living Costs Q2. Ms Notley asked on behalf of Mr. Mason that the following question be accepted.

For the fiscal years 2003-2004 to 2007-2008 what was the average cost per resident per month at a designated assisted living facility? Ms Notley: I’d like to note that the former MLA for Edmonton- Beverly-Clareview asked this question of the government in the spring of 2006, and at that time the minister of health rejected the question on the grounds that the ministry doesn’t keep track of that information.

However, the minister said at the time that she would be doing some follow-up work on this to see whether or not we can do what is most important; that is, to be accountable to Albertans for the dollars that are spent in these situations and to see whether there is a value in attaching a valuation to those kinds of care facilities for that particular cost. It’s been three years since the then minister of health agreed to do that work, and the question now is just as pertinent as ever.

I would suggest it’s a great deal more pertinent given the government’s announcement with respect to their continuing care strategy made in December of 2008, a strategy which would see no increase in the number of net long-term care beds in Alberta and, rather, a move to increase supportive living beds, or designated assisted living beds, with the supposed rationale that those beds are the most effective way to care for seniors as they age. This government, it would appear, is attempting to shift people who would have previously been in long-term facilities to designated assisted living.

We would suggest that above and beyond the issues that we do raise quite regularly about the level of care that we would suggest is not provided in those alternative facilities, there’s also an issue with respect to cost, we suspect, and the public deserves to know what the costs of these assisted living facilities are on a per- resident basis per month.

We know absolutely that the residents themselves will see higher costs with every additional little service, that they have to pay extra for bathing, that they might have to even pay extra for medication preparation, depending on the circum- stances, and certain other personal care efforts that are made on their behalf.

Given that this was something th at the previous health minister had suggested might be worthy of providing information to Alber- tans on and given the increased reliance on this type of care being provided to seniors in lieu of long-term care being the policy of this government, we think that sort of having this information provided to us is even more pertinent than it was when the question was first asked three years ago. We would like to see where the minister has gotten, with that reference back again to the comments made by the previous minister of health in the spring of 2006.

I believe it was on April 3, 2006, that the minister of health responded for future reference. So it’s on that basis that we are seeking that information. Thank you. The Speaker: Hon. Minister of Health and Wellness, do you have a position on this? Mr. Liepert: Mr. Speaker, I would recommend that the Legislative Assembly reject this question. The rationale for rejecting this question is that Alberta Health and Wellness does not directly fund designated assisted living. Block funding is provided to Alberta Health Services to finance publicly funded health services provided in designated assisted living site s.

Therefore, the information requested is not available. If the member would like to find further details, she’s welcome to go to the RHA audited financial statements. In addition to that is the opportunity to ask questions regarding these expenditures both in the budget estimates that are coming up and if our department appears before Public Accounts. Again, I would just conclude by saying that the information is not available in the form that is being asked for; therefore, I would ask that the House simply reject this question. Thank you. 3:20 The Speaker: Hon.

Member for Calgary-Varsity, do you want to participate? Mr. Chase: Thank you very much. Mr. Speaker, in supporting this written question I would like to note for the members of this Assembly and pass along our condolences to the hon. member of the third party, who recently lost his father and is very much involved in the grieving process at this moment. With regard to the information I am hoping that the minister of health, as he has suggested, will be able to provide the information, the intent, which this question has raised.

From 2003 through 2008 the government has moved more individuals towards assisted living, which is considerably more expensive than long-term care because the individual is expected to pick up a large portion of the costs in these facilities. Therefore, getting the cost to the individuals, residents, whether it’s a private facility or a publicly owned facility, is extremely important. The costs both of long-term care and of assisted living care have risen dramatically.

The Auditor General in the 2004- 2005 year reported on the deficiencies he found within a sampling of long-term care programs, and it would be interesting if the Auditor General were given the opportunity to pursue an equal investigation into designated assisted living facilities. Any information the hon. minister of health can provide in providing a cost average for residents on a monthly basis in

Alberta Hansard April 6, 2009524 designated assisted living would be much appreciated. If this question lacks the focus the minister is looking for, then I hope he will find it in his heart and in his ability to research the information. This information is important for all Albertans. We’re all going to eventually end up in either assisted living or long-term care, and those prices, short of dying on the spot, are going to be extremely important to us. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: Others? The hon. Member for Lethbridge-East. Ms Pastoor: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will be brief.

I’d just like to add that I think that this information would be very important when we balance it against the fact that presently in the province people are not aging in the right place, and they are not receiving the care that they really need. Designated assisted living is not the answer. Some of them really should be in long-term care. This information would be interesting to balance the cost against the fact that they are simply not receiving the care that they require. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Strathcona to conclude the debate. Ms Notley: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I’d just like to make a couple of points. The minister suggested that this was not information that was collected or that they had available, but I do note that the ministry has agreed to respond to our Written Question 1, which is the same kind of question except that in that case it’s dealing with long-term care facilities. I have to say that I’m a bit surprised to discover that that kind of information can be researched and collated and compared for long- term care facilities but not for designated assisted living facilities.

That seems to me to be rather odd, particularly given that there was a primary decision made by the government to shift their policy towards choosing designated assisted living over long-term care because of the so-called institutional element of long-term care. It would seem to me that there would have to have been some type of cost-benefit analysis and, thus, a comparison of costs between the two. It’s clear that that informa tion is there with respect to long- term care facilities.

As well, the minister suggested that we could get that through the estimates process, but again, if we could get it through the estimate process, presumably it’s available. You know, a lot of times these questions come to the Legislative Assembly because we ask the Legislature itself to put its full authority behind our request for that information, so it’s on that basis that we ask all members to consider approving our request for this information as it is of great interest to all Albertans and to two seniors in particular. Thank you. [Written Question 2 lost] The Speaker: The hon.

Member for Edmonton-Strathcona. Student Loan Debt Q7. Ms Notley asked that the following question be accepted. For each of the fiscal years 2004-2005 to 2007-2008 for Alberta students with student loans what was the average size of their student loan debt at the time they left their respective postsecondary institution? Ms Notley: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The reason we are seeking this information is because we know that Alberta’s average tuition is the fourth highest in Canada, that 50 per cent of university students will graduate with an average of $20,000 in debt across the country.

We know that postsecondary tuition rates have tripled, and we have been made aware of some research stating that postsecond- ary students who acquire annual debt of $10,000 or more have only a 20 per cent chance of graduating. We also know, of course, that Alberta has Canada’s lowest postsecondary participation rate and that high costs are a significant barrier to young people accessing our postsecondary institutions. We think that for a number of different reasons the public should know how much debt students in Alberta are graduating with. Parents and children need information like this to plan for the future.

We also think that making this information public would make this debate clearer and end speculation based on loan amounts. We also believe that this is public money that is being spent and that the public should know how much is being loaned on average. And we’d like to know ultimately how to assess what the government is providing for university costs and how much we’re putting on the shoulders of students. So it is with those questions in mind that I am seeking support.

I believe I’m aware of a suggestion that might be coming from the minister on this to change the wording slightly, and as far as I can tell, that does appear to be a reasonable proposal. Thank you. The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Advanced Education and Technology. Mr. Horner: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’m pleased to rise today and move an amendment to Written Question 7. I do believe that all members have been provided with copies, and the amendment has been provided to the Member for Edmonton-Strathcona.

The amendment seeks to clarify terminology used by the Alberta student financial assistance program as well as policies for student loan repayment. The amendment also reflects data that is readily available from the Alberta student financial assistance program.

The amendment strikes out “student loan debt at the time they left their respective postsecondary institution” and substitutes “net student loan debt at the time of consolidation, which is six months after they cease being enrolled as full-time students.” The question as originally worded requests information on student loan debts when students leave their postsecondary institution. However, leaving a postsecondary institution is not the key criteria upon which repayment policies are based.

Some students leave one postsecondary ins titution and then enter another either because they’re changing their program of study or because they’re pursuing another credential. As long as these students continue full-time in a program designated for student financial assistance, they are not required to begin repaying their government student loans. Student aid recipients must begin repaying their government student loan six months after they cease being enrolled as a full-time student.

In addition, my amendment seeks to clarify that the provincial student loan debt to be repaid is net of any loan remission that may be applied. Alberta has in place the loan relief program, that reduces provincial student loans for eligible students. After any loan remission the amount to repay is considered net student debt. Thus, Mr.

Speaker, the motion will read: For each of the fiscal years 2004-2005 to 2007-2008 for Alberta students with student loans what was the average size of their net student loan debt at the time of consolidation, which is six months after they cease being enrolled as full-time students? I believe that with the acceptance of these amendments we’ll be able to provide clear and accurate information to the Member for Edmonton-Strathcona. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

April 6, 2009 Alberta Hansard 525 3:30 The Speaker: Hon. Member for Edmonton-Strathcona, because it is your motion that is being amended, I’ll recognize you first. We’re talking about the amendment now. Ms Notley: Yes. Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. As I did allude to in my initial comments, I think that the amendments being proposed make sense in terms of being able to track the information. Ultimately we’re being provided the information we are seeking, so I’m quite prepared to support that motion. The Speaker: The hon. Member for Calgary-Varsity on the amendment. Mr. Chase: Yes. Thank you very much.

I very much appreciate the minister of advanced education reframing the request. My only concern – and I would put this to the minister for his advisement – is the cost for part-time students. I know that at the University of Calgary a number of students cannot afford to attend on a full-time basis because they have to have so many jobs to pay for their tuition. So if part-time students’ debt could be included as well as full-time – a debt is a debt – that information would be appreciated. The Speaker: Others to participate?

Then I’ll call the question. [Motion on amendment carried] [Written Question 7 as amended carried] The Speaker: The hon. Member for Edmonton-Strathcona. Protection of Sexually Exploited Children Q9. Ms Notley asked that the following question be accepted. How many people have been charged under the Protection of Sexually Exploited Children Act since its implementa- tion? Ms Notley: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have been provided with a proposed amendment to Written Question 9. Unfortunately, it didn’t get to our offices. I’m only seeing it now, so I won’t speak to that.

I’ll just speak in general to the question that I’m seeking to have answered here. The Speaker: That would be good because we have not had an amendment moved yet. Ms Notley: Sorry. That’s good. The Protection of Children Involved in Prostitution Act was initially introduced in ’98, and in 2007, as we know, it was amended and renamed the Protection of Sexually Exploited Children Act. Among other amendments the age of the child was raised from 18 to 22, and the children’s advocate was named as the primary contact for children.

As you may know, the NDP opposition caucus spoke in support of both the 1998 and the 2007 legislation. So what we are now seeking is to get some in formation with respect to how effectively this legislation has been working. For instance, has it significantly increased the work required of police officers? When the act was amended in 2007, one MLA in support of it noted that since the implementation of the act in 1998 over 770 children had been helped to leave the street behind. We would also like to know what that number is now.

Essentially, the public has a right to know how effective a legislation is at stopping the perpetra- tors of that exploitation. If the act is not meeting the goals that it was supposed to – i.e., protecting the children – then the public needs to re-engage in the debate about how to best protect sexually exploited children and whether there are other strategies that should perhaps be priorized. It’s with that background that I’m seeking that information today. Thank you. The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Justice and Attorney General. Ms Redford: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I would like to move an amendment to the motion on the floor today with respect to Written Question 9 and then move that that be accepted with amendments.

The amendments will seek to delete the phrase “people have been charged” and substitute it with “charges have been commenced” and adding “and the Protection of Sexually Exploited Children Act, PSECA.” The question will now read: “How many charges have been commenced under the Protection of Children Involved in Prostitution Act and the Protection of Sexually Exploited Children Act, PSECA, since its implementation?” The Justice online information network, with the acronym JOIN, does not collect statistics on the number of people that have been charged but on the number of charges that have been commenced.

Though the Protection of Children Involved in Prostitution Act was implemented in 1999, JOIN statistics only date back to February 1, 2001. In November of 2007 the Protection of Children Involved in Prostitution Act was replaced with the Protection of Sexually Exploited Children Act, so I woul d suggest that this rephrasing of the question will achieve the hon. member’s objective and give clear information to the House with respect to the intent of the question as opposed to the original form of the question. I trust that the hon. member will appreciate the context of the proposed amendments. Thank you.

The Speaker: Hon. Member for Edmonton-Strathcona, would you like to comment? Ms Notley: As I mentioned before, I’ve not had a chance to consider these amendments because they were not provided to my office in time for me to consider them before coming to the House today. It does appear on the surface, with respect to the points made by the hon. Attorney General, that these amendments ought to still provide us with the kind of information that we are seeking.

I guess I’m a touch concerned that if we can’t track the number of people who have been charged, if there’s not a consistency between the number of charges that are laid each time someone is subjected to the authority of this act, then we wouldn’t necessarily get a sense of the scope of its coverage vis-à-vis the number of people that it’s actually stopping or attempting to stop or whatever. That is a bit of a concern, that we’re unable to track the number of people who are subject to the authority of the act.

There’s no question that the number of charges generally would also provide some measure of the effectiveness. As a starting point we’ll certainly consider this information. If we have further questions, we’ll send them on over. So I will support, then, this proposed amendment to my motion. The Speaker: Others? The hon. Member for Calgary-Varsity. Mr. Chase: Thank you. I want to thank the hon. Attorney General for providing the information in the form of the amendments that she has provided. Children are obviously extremely vulnerable to abuse. The government recognized and has recognized the need to protect

Alberta Hansard April 6, 2009526 children. Just today, for example, the Minister of Children and Youth Services indicated that the government will now be working with hotel and motel managers to attempt to provide them with greater information to protect children who might be abused in those private facilities. It is extremely important, and the amendment recognizes the need for the protection of sexually exploited children.

What is not necessarily clear within this amendment but will hopefully become clearer as we discuss the bill on lengthening the time of stay in protective custody for children involved in acts of prostitution is the rights of the child. The government is wishing to move towards enshrining parental rights in the human rights amendment, and I would ask that the Attorney General work with the member responsible for Children and Youth Services to enshrine at least on an equal basis the rights of children. I will look forward to receiving, as well, a copy of the information that has been requested by the hon.

Member for Edmonton- Strathcona. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Speaker: Is there anyone else who would like to participate? The hon. Member for Lethbridge-East. Ms Pastoor: Yes. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’d also like to thank the Minister of Justice and Attorney General for bringing this forward. When they talk just about prostitution, we think about it as a physical act perhaps on a street or in a hotel room. Children are being sexually exploited, yes, in those places, but it’s huge on the Internet.

I think that this will be able to protect the children that are being exploited through the Internet and on YouTube and all of those other places that aren’t obvious to the average person on the street that could then, perhaps, report it. The ones that find it on the Internet are often the ones that are the perverted users. Thank you. [Motion on amendment carried] The Speaker: Would the hon. Member for Edmonton-Strathcona like to close the debate on the question as amended, or should I call the question? Ms Notley: Call the question. [Written Question 9 as amended carried] The Speaker: The hon.

Member for Edmonton-Strathcona, on behalf of the hon. Member for Edmonton-Highlands-Norwood. 3:40 Assisted Living Facility Costs Q11. Ms Notley asked on behalf of Mr. Mason that the following question be accepted. What were the total government subsidies provided to assisted living facilities and the total operating expenditures for those same facilities for the fiscal years 2003-2 004 to 2007-2008? Ms Notley: Thank you again, Mr. Speaker.

The rationale for seeking this information is not completely disconnected from the rationale which I articulated with respect to our seeking information under Written Question 2. The province’s new continuing care model talks about additional supportive living sp aces, and assisted living falls into that category. Given that the government is relying so heavily on assisted living as a big part of its new continuing care s

Document details

Collection	Alberta — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	20090406
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	L27 S2 20090406 1330 01 han.pdf
Language	en
Format	json
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	a5698f08919ef3a7ce9199055ffe5e152ee95afc

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