Manitoba Hansard — 24 November 2003 (Sitting 03, 38th Legislature, 2nd Session)

38-2-03

Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)

Second Session - Thirty-Eighth Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable George Hickes Speaker Vol. LV No. 3 – 1:30 p.m., Monday, November 24, 2003

MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Thirty-Eighth Legislature Member Constituency Political Affiliation AGLUGUB, Cris The Maples N.D.P. ALLAN, Nancy, Hon. St. Vital N.D.P. ALTEMEYER, Rob Wolseley N.D.P. ASHTON, Steve, Hon. Thom pson N.D.P. BJORNSON, Peter, Hon. Gimli N.D.P. BRICK, Marilyn St. Norbert N.D.P. CALDWELL, Drew Brandon East N.D.P. CHOMIAK, Dave, Hon. Kildonan N.D.P. CUMMINGS, Glen Ste. Rose P.C. DERKACH, Leonard Russell P.C. DEWAR, Gregory Selkirk N.D.P. DOER, Gary, Hon. Concordia N.D.P. DRIEDGER, Myrna Charleswood P.C. DYCK, Peter Pembina P.C. EICHLER, Ralph Lakeside P.C.

FAURSCHOU, David Portage la Prairie P.C. GERRARD, Jon, Hon. River Heights Lib. GOERTZEN, Kelvin Steinbach P.C. HAWRANIK, Gerald Lac du Bonnet P.C. HICKES, George, Hon. Point Douglas N.D.P. IRVIN-ROSS, Kerri Fort Garry N.D.P. JENNISSEN, Gerard Flin Flon N.D.P. JHA, Bidhu Radisson N.D.P. KORZENIOWSKI, Bonnie St. James N.D.P. LAMOUREUX, Kevin Inkster Lib. LATHLIN, Oscar, Hon. The Pas N.D.P. LEMIEUX, Ron, Hon. La Verendrye N.D.P. LOEWEN, John Fort Whyte P.C. MACKINTOSH, Gord, Hon. St. Johns N.D.P. MAGUIRE, Larry Arthur-Virden P.C. MALOWAY, Jim Elmwood N.D.P. MARTINDALE, Doug Burrows N.D.P. McGIFFORD, Diane, Hon.

Lord Roberts N.D.P. MELNICK, Christine, Hon. Riel N.D.P. MIHYCHUK, MaryAnn, Hon. Minto N.D.P. MITCHELSON, Bonnie River East P.C. MURRAY, Stuart Kirkfield Park P.C. NEVAKSHONOFF, Tom Interlake N.D.P. OSWALD, Theresa Seine River N.D.P. PENNER, Jack Emerson P.C. REID, Daryl Transcona N.D.P. REIMER, Jack Southdale P.C. ROBINSON, Eric, Hon. Rupertsland N.D.P. ROCAN, Denis Carman P.C. RONDEAU, Jim, Hon. Assiniboia N.D.P. ROWAT, Leanne Minnedosa P.C. SALE, Tim, Hon. Fort Rouge N.D.P. SANTOS, Conrad Wellington N.D.P. SCHELLENBERG, Harry Rossmere N.D.P. SCHULER, Ron Springfield P.C. SELINGER, Greg, Hon. St.

Boniface N.D.P. SMITH, Scott, Hon. Brandon West N.D.P. STEFANSON, Heather Tuxedo P.C. STRUTHERS, Stan, Hon. Dauphin-Roblin N.D.P. TAILLIEU, Mavis Morris P.C. TWEED, Mervin Turtle Mountain P.C. WOWCHUK, Rosann, Hon. Swan River N.D.P.

39 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Monday, November 24, 2003 The House met at 1:30 p.m. PRAYERS ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS PETITIONS Provincial Road 313 Mr. Gerald Hawranik (Lac du Bonnet): I wish to present the following petition. The background of this petition is as follows: Provincial Road 313 to the east of Provincial Road 315 is the only road connecting Pointe du Bois with Lac du Bonnet to the west.

The 19 kilometres of Provincial Road 313 to the east of Provincial Road 315 is in very poor condition, has narrow shoulders and winds among granite outcroppings and through swamp, creating very dangerous and very treacherous conditions for residents who live in Pointe du Bois, for Hydro employees and others who work in Pointe du Bois, and for visitors and tourists who frequent the area.

We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To request that the Minister of Trans- portation and Government Services consider rebuilding and reconstructing the 19 kilometres of Provincial Road 313 east of Provincial Road 315 to Pointe du Bois at the earliest opportunity. Signed by S. Stewner-Pruden, J. Duffield, Rick Armstrong and others. Mr. Speaker: In accordance with our Rule 132(6), when a petition is read it is deemed to be received by the House. Highway 32 Mr. Peter Dyck (Pembina): I wish to present the following petition.

These are the reasons for this petition: Rural highways are part of the mandate of the Province of Manitoba. Under the previous commitment, the Prov- ince of Manitoba would be covering the costs of four-laning that portion of Highway 32 that runs through Winkler, Manitoba. The Department of Transportation and Gov- ernment Services has altered its position and will now undertake the project only if the City of Winkler will pay half of the total cost of con- struction. The provincial government's offload- ing of its previous commitment will cost the City of Winkler several million dollars.

The City of Winkler has now been informed that it will have to wait several years before this project could be undertaken. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To request the Minister of Transportation and Government Services to consider honouring the previous commitment and complete the four- laning of Highway 32 through the city of Winkler, absorbing all costs related to the con- struction as previously agreed.

To request the Minister of Transportation and Government Services to consider the re- sponsibility of the Department of Transportation and Government Services for the construction of rural highways. To request the Minister of Transportation and Government Services to consider the signifi- cant and strategic importa nce of the completion of four-laning Highway 32 through the city of Winkler, especially as it relates to the economic growth and the development of the city of Winkler and its trading area.

To request the Minister of Transportation and Government Services to consider the valuable contribution of the city of Winkler and its trading area to the provincial economy and

40 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 reprioritize the four-laning of Highway 32 for the 2004 construction season. These are submitted by Bill Unrau, Lloyd Groening, James Wall, Travis Friesen and others. Mr. Speaker: In accordance with our Rule 132(6), when a petition is read it is deemed to be received by the House. Co-op Program for Nursing Students Mrs. Myrna Driedger (Charleswood): I wish to present the following petition to the Leg- islative Assembly of Manitoba.

The background to the petition is as follows: * (13:35) A co-op program for nursing students at the University of Manitoba was approved by the Senate and the Board of Governors. This program will provide the opportunity for students to apply their theoretical knowledge in the workplace through supervised work terms for which they are paid. Students are hired by participating agencies under supervision of a workplace employee who serves as a mentor. Students assume responsibilities suitable for their level of knowledge and expertise and will provide patients with much-needed nursing.

The co-op program will enable nursing stu- dents to acquire valuable experience by working with a seasoned mentor, become more proficient and better able to handle heavier workloads and increase their knowledge, skills and confidence. This program will enable students to earn income to help reduce their debt load. The Department of Health will benefit through reduced orientation costs for new gradu- ates and an increased likelihood that new gradu- ates will remain in the province.

Although the Honourable Dave Chomiak was unable to attend the round table held on November 7, 2003, he graciously sent a repre- sentative who restated Mr. Chomiak's position to work with the students to reach a creative solu- tion. Several Canadian universities have success- fully implemented nursing co-op programs. Several faculties within the University of Mani- toba have such a program available to their students. Therefore, stud ents within the Faculty of Nursing should have equal opportunity and access to a co-op program.

This program will offer students valuable experience and provide the confidence and strength they will need in the future. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To request the Legislative Assembly to con- sider supporting the proposed co-op program. Signed by Ruth Dean, Carolyn Vogt, Marion McKay and others. Mr. Speaker: In accordance with our Rule 132(6), when a petition is read it is deemed to be received by the House. Walleye Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition.

The background to this petition is as follows: Fish stocks in Lake Winnipegosis began to decline in the 1960s. The walleye fishery on Lake Winnipegosis has been in serious trouble for many years. A similar situation happened in Lake Erie, but it was handled much more effectively. In Lake Erie, a sound science-based management program was implemented and the stocks re- bounded. As a result, production of walleye on Lake Erie for 1980 to 2001 averaged 182 percent of the estimated sustainable yield.

In contrast from 1980 to 2001, the average annual harvest of walleye on Lake Winnipegosis was about 14 percent of the estimated sus- tainable yield for the lake.

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 41 Much better management of a walleye fish- ery on Lake Erie shows that good management of a walleye fishery is possible. The fishermen on Lake Winnipegosis have been deprived of an estimated 72 million of in- come between 1980 and 2001.

Economic models of the effects of such primary income loss usually estimate a signifi- cant multiplier effect and that may well mean a loss of several hundred million dollars in eco- nomic activity for the region. *(13:40) We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To request the Minister of Finance and the Auditor General to consider undertaking a thorough investigation of the provincial manage- ment of the walleye fishery on Lake Win- nipegosis. Signed by Ray J. Delaronde, George Mun- roe, Bruno Chartrand and others. Mr.

Speaker: In accordance with our Rule 132(6), when a petition is read it is deemed to be received by the House. Sales Tax Proposal Mrs. Bonnie Mitchels on (River East): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition: These are the reasons for this petition: The Mayor of Winnipeg is proposing a new deal which will result in new user fees and additional taxes for citizens of the city of Winnipeg. One of these proposed changes requires the provincial government to approve an increase of the sales tax.

The Balanced Budget, Debt Repayment and Taxpayer Accountability Act requires a refer- endum to take place before the provincial gov- ernment can increase major taxes, including the retail sales tax. The Doer government has been silent on whether they will make the necessary legislative changes required to give the City of Winnipeg additional taxing powers. Taxpayers deserve to have a say before having any major new taxes imposed upon them. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To request that the Premier of Manitoba (Mr.

Doer) notify the City of Winnipeg that the provincial government will not allow an increase of the sales tax without a referendum being held as required under balanced-budget legislation. This petition is signed by Brian Gainor, Joyce Gainor, Heather Morin and others. Mr. Speaker: In accordance with our Rule 132(6), when a petition is read it is deemed to be received by the House. TABLING OF REPORTS Hon. Tim Sale (Minister of Energy, Science and Technology): Mr. Speaker, on behalf of the Minister of Health (Mr. Chomiak), I am pleased to table the 2002-03 Annual Report for the Addictions Foundation of Manitoba.

I am also pleased to table the 2002-03 Annual Report for Manitoba Health which includes the Annual Report of the Manitoba Health Services Insurance Plan. MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS Child and Family Services Authorities Act Hon. Christine Melnick (Minister of Family Services and Housing): I have a statement for the House and I have copies. Mr. Speaker, as Minister of Family Services and Housing I am extremely pleased to acknowl- edge the proclamation of The Child and Family Services Authorities Act. Mr. Speaker: Order.

I would like to take this opportunity to remind our guests in the gallery there is to be no participation from our guests

42 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 and that is either through verbal or applauding. I ask the co-operation of all honourable members, please. Ms. Melnick: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This legislation will strengthen the safety, security and well-being of children and families by hon- ouring the recommendations made in the Abo- riginal Justice Inquiry (AJI) in 1991. This act received the unanimous s upport of the House in August 2002.

The act officially recognizes that parents, families, extended families and com- munities have a right and a responsibility to care for their children. *(13:45) This legislation makes Manitoba the first province in Canada to give First Nations and Métis people responsibility for child and family services throughout the province. This is a broad systemic change requested by a great many people who shared their views through the AJI process.

After thoughtful consideration and the leadership shown by the Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs, Manitoba Keewatinowi Okimakanak and the Manitoba Métis Federation, our Government moved forward with legislation to promote greater empowerment within the child and fami- ly services system among the Aboriginal people of this province. The Child and Family Services Authorities Act was created to ensure that the development and delivery of programs and services to First Nations and Métis people respect their values, beliefs, customs and traditional communities.

Aboriginal people who have voiced their concerns through the AJI have emphasized that any overhaul of the justice system in Manitoba must also include a re-examination of the child welfare system. They s ee the child welfare and justice systems as interwoven and intercon- nected. As they see it, the child welfare system is yet another outside institution that disrupts their lives and societies.

If the views expressed by Aboriginal people are accurate, and our Govern- ment believes they are, then the restructuring of the child welfare system is a key strategy towards changing our relationship with Aborig- inal peoples. Prior to today's proclamation, Aboriginal people did not fully control their lives and destinies or the lives of their own children. This was wrong, and with this act we are addressing this injustice by returning to Aboriginal people more control over the ways their children are raised, taught and protected.

This proposed legislation is born of many years of hard work, determination, compassion, foresight and shared concern for the future of Aboriginal people across our province. It reflects the vision and dedication of many people who recognized that bringing about systemic change was not easy but essential to the long-term success of Aboriginal people in Manitoba. At this time, I would like to acknowledge the presence of our First Nations and Métis partners and community representatives in the public gallery.

Before I recognize the contributions of my present day colleagues, I would like to pay tri- bute to Len Evans, George Minaker and Muriel Smith who also share in this milestone for their work on behalf of the Aboriginal people around the province. Now I would like to acknowledge my colleagues: the former ministers of Family Ser- vices and Housing, the honourable members from Fort Rouge and Brandon East, the hon- ourable member from The Pas, and the former minister, the honourable member from Ruperts- land, as well as the contributions of their minis- terial and department sta ff.

All staff in my Child and Family Services division and indeed in agencies across Manito ba have shown extra- ordinary patience and dedication through this transition as we have worked towards today's proclamation. Finally, I would like to recognize the support and contribution of the honourable member from Ste. Rose, who provided valuable insight as this bill was debated. Mr. Speaker, for decades community leaders and social activists have worked tirelessly to develop proposed amendments to the system. Though enacted in good faith, those changes no longer meet the needs of our province's original peoples.

The Child and Family Services Authori- ties Act builds on a commitment Manitoba made to the First Nations people in the early 1980s.

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 43 This act also includes child welfare services to he Métis people. t Mr. Speaker, as Minister of Family Services and Housing, I am proud to formally acknowl- edge the proclamation of The Child and Family Services Authorities Act. We believe it will introduce the systemic change that will best serve the needs of First Nations and Métis peo- ple across this province. Mr. Speaker, the act establishes four child and family services authorities that will be responsible for the delivery of child and family services throughout the province.

Three of these authorities will be controlled and operated by First Nations and Métis people and will control the design and delivery of these services to their community members. The fourth authority will serve all other Manitobans. In partnership with the authorities, the provincial government will continue to oversee the entire system and hold responsibility for legislation and setting stand- ards and compliance for the new authorities. The Family Services minister also retains the power to take action if the health and safety of any child or family is threatened.

The urgency for effective change to the cur- rent child and family services system and the co- operation of many interested and concerned Manitobans resulted in the formation of this act. Together we have created legislation that will help ensure Aboriginal children and families have the opportunity to thrive in their own cul- ture, language and traditions, a tremendous in- vestment in the future of our province. Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mrs. Myrna Driedger (Charleswood): Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the minister for the ministerial statement presented today.

It certainly is a day of a milestone in this province. Providing Métis and Aboriginal people with the ability to manage their own family services is truly a milestone, acknowledged today by the presence of so many people here and celebrated today by so many people here at the proclama- ion of the act. t * (13:50) Mr. Speaker, I congratulate all the agencies that are involved in this initiative for the hard work that has taken a significant amount of time to bring this day here, overseeing the placement and well-being of our Aboriginal and Métis children in this province.

The legislation, as the minister indicated, does make Manitoba the first province in Canada to give First Nations and Métis people respon- sibility for child and family services throughout the province, and this is a broad systemic change requested by a great many people who shared their views throughout the AJI process. There was a lot of work, a lot of vision, a lot of passion put into this effort, I am sure by the many, many people involved in making this day come true.

The Child and Family Services Authorities Act was created to ensure that the development and delivery of programs and services to First Nations and Métis people respect their values, their beliefs, their customs and their traditional communities. The Aboriginal and Métis people have worked very hard, feeli ng that the restructuring of the child welfare system is a key strategy towards changing relationships in this province, and today as I have indicated, Mr. Speaker, is truly a significant milestone for all of us in Manitoba.

This proposed legislation was born of years of hard work, determination, compassion, fore- sight and shared concerns for the future of Abo- riginal people across the pr ovince. It does reflect vision and dedication of many people because changes like this do not come about easily, but many feel it is essential to the long-term success of Aboriginal people in Manitoba. Certainly, Mr. Speaker, our caucus has been very supportive of this legislation and the intent behind it.

I do have to indicate though I do have some disappointment with the Doer government that last fall when front-line social workers in our system were expressing concerns at that time with their views that children were falling through the cracks and we and they were asking for a comprehensive review of Winnipeg Child and Family Services, I am disappointed that at that time the Premier or the minister did not feel it prudent to investigate those challenges.

44 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 Our concern with that was that some of those challenges and problems that are inherent in the system are going to be transferred to the new agencies. I think that disadvantages the new agencies right from the beginning and that does not give them all of the positive abilities to move forward and, in fact, th ey could be inheriting some serious challenges in the system. I think the Doer government could have prevented that a year ago by doing as a lot of front-line social workers requested and that is deal with the current problems in the system right now.

Do not transfer those problems on the new agencies. That is just not fair. Certainly, Mr. Speaker, I think this legislation as the minister did indicate, it was created and it will ensure that Aboriginal chil- dren and families do have the opportunity to thrive in their own culture, their own language and their own traditions. It is a tremendous in- vestment in the future of our province. Meegwetch. Mr. Speaker: The honourable Member for River Heights, if you are rising to respond to the ministerial statement, you will need to seek leave. Hon.

Jon Gerrard (River Heights): I am asking for leave to speak to the minister's state- ment. Mr. Speaker: Does the honourable member have leave? Some Honourable Members: Leave. An Honourable Member: No. Mr. Speaker: I heard a no. Leave has been denied. INTRODUCTION OF BILLS Bill 5–The Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation Amendment Act (Claimant Advisers) Hon. Greg Selinger (Minister of Finance): Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the Attorney General (Mr. Mackintosh), that Bill 5, The Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation Amend- ment Act (Claimant Advisers); Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la Société d'asssurance publique du Manitoba (conseillers des demandeurs), be now read a first time. M otion presented. * (13:55) Mr. Selinger: Mr. Speaker, this Bill 5 provides for the establishment of an adviser office to assist claimants in the appeal of a decision of the Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation with respect to a bodily injury claim. Motion agreed to. Bill 200–The Criminal Organizations Deterrence Act (Local Government Acts Amended) Mr. Gerald Hawran ik (Lac du Bonnet): Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the Member for Lakeside (Mr.

Eichler), that Bill 200, The Crimi- nal Organizations Deterrence Act (Local Gov- ernment Acts Amended), be now read a first time. Motion presented. Mr. Hawranik: Mr. Speaker, this bill gives municipalities the power to pass by-laws that prohibit or regulate businesses carried on by members or associates of a criminal organization if the business is used to advance the interests of the criminal organization. The bill also allows municipalities to pass zoning by-laws to deal with places used as residences or meeting places for members of a criminal organization. Motion agreed to. Introduction of Guests Mr.

Speaker: Prior to Oral Questions, I would like to draw the attention of all honourable mem- bers to the loge to my left where we have with us Mr. Harry Enns, who is the former Member for Lakeside. Also in the public gallery from Shore Elementary School we have 23 Grade 5 students

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 45 under the direction of Mrs. Sandy Rosenberg. This school is located in the constituency of the honourable Member for Tuxedo (Mrs. Stefan- son). Also in the public gallery we have from St. Paul's Collegiate 16 Grade 9 students under the direction of Ms. Kim Earl. This school is located in the constituency of the honourable Member for Morris (Mrs. Taillieu).

Also, I would like to draw the attention of all honourable members to the Speaker's Gallery where we have with us today David Chartrand, who is the president of the Manitoba Métis Fed- eration; Grand Chief Sydney Garrioch, Manitoba Keewatinowi Okimakanak–if that was in Inukti- tut I would have done a lot better, so I apologize for that–Grand Chief Dennis White Bird, As- sembly of Manitoba Chiefs; Elva McCorrister, executive director of the Southern Chiefs Office; Rosemarie McPherson, spokesperson for the Métis Women of Manitoba, Manitoba Métis Federation; and Judy Mayer, vice-president of the Manitoba Métis Federation.

Also in the Speaker's Gallery we have Chief Larry Soldier of Swan Lake First Nation, and Nelson James from Rouseau River and Bobbi Pampana of Sioux Valley Dakota Nation. Also present in the public gallery are repre- sentatives of the First Nations and Métis com- munities across Manitoba, who are the guests of the honourable Minister of Family Services and Housing (Ms. Melnick). On behalf of all honourable members, I welcome you here today. ORAL QUESTION PERIOD City of Winnipeg Revenue/Tax Proposal Mr. Stuart Murray (Leader of the Official Opposition): Mr.

Speaker, after we launched our petition campaign in support of a referendum being held before taxes are raised in the province, the Premier stuck to his standard line, he "was not elected to raise taxes." *(14:00) Well, he also was not elected to do things like rob Hydro blind, force school divisions to amalgamate or start closing rural hospitals. So Manitobans know all too well how reliable this Premier's word is. He has a credibility gap. While the Premier says he was not elected to raise taxes, will he now admit that he also was not elected to give the mayor new powers to increase taxes? Hon.

Gary Doer (Premier): Mr. Speaker, the interesting discussion last Friday was of course the reminder to people in Manitoba after mem- bers opposite feigned interest on the property tax side, a reminder to the people of Manitoba that the largest increases in the property taxes took place in the 1990s when members opposite, without any regard to the citizens of Winnipeg, systematically reduced the property tax credit that was subtracted from your taxes, adding $75 a year to every tax bill in Manitoba and $75 a year to the people of Winnipeg.

The members opposite also forgot to tell the people of Manitoba that their pattern on funding education was minus 2 percent after an election, minus 2 the second year after an election, zero one year before the election, and plus 2 the year of the election campaign, resulting in a cumu- lative impact of 68% increase on the education portions of property taxes. Mr. Speaker, we said on Friday, the minister said it on Friday, we will say it again. We do not have to waste money on a referendum, because we are not elected to raise the taxes indicated by the member opposite. We are not raising the sales tax. Mr.

Murray: Mr. Speaker, I remind the First Minister that we campaigned hard in the last election to eliminate the education tax off resi- dential property and farmland, something that is the right thing to do and he should do it today. The fact remains that this Premier did not tell Manitobans during the last election that it was not his plan either to give the mayor new powers to raise new taxes. It is something Mani- tobans want to know, what position the Premier takes on this. It is shameful that with Manitoba

46 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 again being named the child poverty capital of Canada that this Premier continues to be silent on the mayor's new tax increase deal that is going to hit the working poor the hardest. Will the Premier stand up for our kids, the ones that are most in need and commit today that before granting the mayor any new powers to increase their parents' taxes and take needed money out of their pockets that he will first give all Winnipegers their say on a matter through a binding referendum? Mr. Doer: Mr.

Speaker, there was no refer- endum in this province for an irreversible deci- sion to sell the phone company, which has shafted all Manitobans since it has been sold. Not one vote. There was no referendum in this province when members opposite spread the sales tax over many items and also reduced $75 out of the Manitoba education property tax. That increased the taxes for low-income people more so than any other group in society. Obviously that $75 was worth a lot more in the inner city of Winnipeg or in some of our communities across Manitoba than taking that money away from somebody in Tuxedo.

We need no lectures from members opposite who clawed back the child benefit. We have returned that money to low- income families with four budgets and, in 2004, that clawback will be over that they initiated some seven years ago. Mrs. Bonnie Mitchels on (River East): Mr. Speaker, but with that ranting and raving by the Premier, it sounds like he is trying to prepare the public for an increase in the sales tax. Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Mr. Speaker: Order.

I would like to take this opportunity to remind all honourable members when a Speaker stands that all members should be seated and the Speaker should be heard in silence. I do not know about members, but I am eager to hear the question. Mrs. Mitchelson: Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and I knew you would be. Since legislation will be required to grant any new taxing authority to the City of Win- nipeg, the Premier and his Government will be directly responsible and have to be held accountable for any tax increases.

Will the Premier today stand up for the taxpayers, for the hardworking men and women, for seniors and for the disabled and say that sales tax increases are not on, period? Will he say no to legislation that will enable the City of Winnipeg to raise the sales tax? Mr. Doer: We said no to the increase in sales tax. We reiterated the position that we did not get elected to raise taxes. We have a referendum, it is called the provincial election.

People in Winnipeg and in other communities across Man- itoba endorse our straight-ahead approach on trying to reduce property taxes and telling people where we are going to get the money. I recall with members opposite that one day they would get it out of phys ed, the next day they were going to get the money out of band programs, the next day they were going to get the money out of health care, the next day they were going to get a 0% increase for justice. They were going to get the money here, there, everywhere else. I would point out though that there are public hearings taking place in Winnipeg.

There is a plan on housing that is before the City Coun- cil of Brandon. There is a municipal plan that is before the people of The Pas. There are many other municipal plans across the province. There is a Capital Region report. We are not trying to practice the policies of the past where taxes were increased across all municipalities. Public mon- ey was used in some parts of the Capital Region as a subsidy from the provincial government at competition with the City of Winnipeg.

Members opposite, who raised property taxes on the education side by some 68 percent in their nine years between 1990 and 1999, we need no lectures from members opposite. We have flattened that tax with the measures we have taken. We reduced the ESL by some 27 percent. We increased the property tax credit by $150. We have brought meaningful tax treatment in all municipalities of Manitoba, not the 68 percent on average increase we saw under the Tories. Mrs. Mitchelson: The Premier continues to sit on the fence on this one. There is a credibility gap. The Minister of Finance (Mr. Selinger) has

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 47 said he is not sure whether they are going to bring in legislation or not, but the Premier con- tinues to say: No new taxes. There will be a requirement for legislation for the City to have a sales tax or increase the sales tax, yes or no? A simple question: Will the Premier allow, through legislation, increases to sales tax? Mr. Doer: The proposed rate increase from 7 percent to 8 percent in the province we have said no to. The idea that maybe the cities and municipalities could get a portion of the GST tax back, we have not closed any doors.

Members opposite would know from the federal tax. I do not know exactly. The members opposite would know because they brought the GST into Canada through their national party. Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Mr. Speaker: Order. I would like to remind all honourable members there are only 40 minutes for Question Period. We would like to try and get as many questions in as possible. I ask the co-operation of all honourable members once again. Mr. Doer: I appear to have hit a sensitive spot. I apologize, but I will try to do it again.

There is another example, and I think it is worthy of the debate that is taking place in Winnipeg and other debates that are taking place in other municipalities across this province. We should not have Perimeter-vision about various proposals coming forward. Mr. Speaker, for example, the fact that we raise our $165 million of GST tax, it is gathered and sent to Ottawa and less than 4 percent is returned to the provinces, to the municipalities, I think is instructive as part of the debate. We believe all the gasoline tax we collect is returned and is accountable.

We are going to bring it and make it even more accountable to the users. We believe the users pay $165 million in tax to Ottawa with very little coming back. That is a useful part of this debate, unlike members oppo- site who told us to go further on red-light cam- eras. Remember their advice there. They seem to change their mind on powers for the mayor depending on the issue. Mrs. Mitchelson: The Premier is all over the map and he has not answered the question. Mr.

Speaker, if the Premier does stand by his word that he was not elected to raise taxes and he commits his word that he will not indeed give authority to any other level of government to raise the sales tax, will he stand beside the many, many constituents in our mutual River East constituency who have signed the refer- endum not wanting taxes? Will he stand up as a proud resident of River East and sign the eferendum? r * (14:10) Mr. Doer: Mr. Speaker, I will stand with the member opposite and all four New Democratic members in northeast Winnipeg to continually work– Mr. Speaker: Order. Point of Order Mr.

Speaker: The honourable Member for River East, on a point of order. Mrs. Mitchelson: Thanks very much, Mr. Speaker. I do know there was a referendum in River East during the last election campaign. Despite the fact that several members of the New Democratic Party live in River East con- stituency, the people of River East still chose to ensure that government was held accountable. Mr. Speaker: Order.

Before ruling on the point of order, I would just like to remind all hon- ourable members that a point of order should be to point out to the Speaker a departure of the rules or practices of our Manitoba practice and not to be used for a debate. On the point of order raised by the honour- able Member for River East, it is not a point of order. It is a dispute over the facts. * * * Mr. Doer: Mr. Speaker, I have already stated that we are not going to raise the provincial sales

48 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 tax from 7 percent to 8 percent. We do not need a referendum to do that. We have already stated that a number of times, and if the members opposite choose not to listen for their own political purposes, that is, I think, a real unfortu- nate factor. I think it does a disservice to democ- racy, but obviously they are so desperate to try to find an issue that they have to create one. We are after a real debate. Mr. Speaker, one of the proposals that Mr.

Martin has made–the new Prime Minister, not elect, but Prime Minister designate, is to return some more gas tax money, potentially. He made that in a speech in Hamilton last year. He made it again in Winnipeg during the middle of our election. We are passing a law. We are bringing forward a law to make it a legal requirement that if there are greater revenues from Ottawa returned to the users they will go directly for infrastructure renewal, for new infrastructure. It will go directly to the municipalities. I think that is a legislative service to the people of this province.

I think it is a responsible thing to do in the middle of an irresponsible question. Hells Angels Associates Trial Stay of Proceedings Mr. Stuart Murray (Leader of the Official Opposition): Mr. Speaker, the Hells Angels are making a mockery of the Doer government's justice system, and there is a very real possibility that five accused members charged with a num- ber of serious offences, including conspiracy to commit murder and extortion, could walk free this week due to the Premier's inaction.

What we believe the Doer government should have first determined, if these members of a multi-million-dollar criminal organization were even eligible for legal aid, they failed to do that and now we are in a situation that, if lawyers are not in place by Wednesday, a stay of pro- eedings is possible. c Mr. Speaker, can the Premier please advise the House if lawyers have been found to ensure the case proceeds and that these accused do not alk? w Hon. Gord Mackintosh (Minister of Justice and Attorney General): Mr. Speaker, leader- ship is not about fearmongering for partisan purposes.

It is not about creating hysteria. It is about sure-footed action. That is the action that we are committed to and we are delivering. I find it passing strange that the Opposition would now be interested in the Hells Angels. It was under their watch when the Hells Angels came into Manitoba. Mr. Murray: Mr. Speaker, that is shameful, and I think the Doer government should say that directly to those victims. The Hells Angels we know were established under this Premier's watch, and since then the Premier has done nothing to run them out of the province.

The Premier knows that these five Hells Angels were given copies of witnesses' state- ments, videotapes and some 250 000 wire taps. As a result of the Doer government's incompe- tence, they have compromised the safety and security of the victims, the witnesses and their families. The deadline for a possible stay of pro- ceedings is drawing dang erously close. Mani- tobans are now, more than ever, fearing for the safety of themselves and their families because these five accused may be free in 48 hours, Mr. Speaker. How many times must an innocent victim be punished under the Doer government?

What assurances can the Premier give the vic- tims and their families that this trial will proceed and that these five Hells Angels will not walk away without justice being served? Mr. Mackintosh: If the Conservative Party was interested in victims, as they say today they are, why did they slash or eliminate 16 victim com- pensation benefits when they were in office? Mr. Speaker, in the new book by Julian Sher; it is over at the bookstore, you probably can get it through the Legislative Library, he says: and in Manitoba the Angels were blessed.

Politicians had done little to put up roadblocks against the incursions the bikers had been mak- ing in the province throughout the 1990s. Shame on them. Gang Activity Reduction Strategy Mr. Gerald Hawranik (Lac du Bonnet): Last November the Justice Mi nister passed The Civil

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 49 Remedies Against Organized Crime Act and in the process he touted that legislation as ground- breaking legislation against gangs and criminal organizations. Well, Mr. Speaker, after a full year, all we see is 12 charges, not convictions, but 12 char- ges for wearing the wrong clothing in bars. Is this the tough legislation that the minister be- lieves will take on the gangs and the criminal organizations in this province? Hon. Gord Mackintosh (Minister of Justice and Attorney General): And Julian Sher in his book goes on to say, Mr.

Speaker– To the credit of this Government we moved quickly with legislation, we moved quickly with organizational changes. I think Manitobans have had enough from members opposite who are prepared to denigrate and undermine the hard work of our Crown prosecutors and our police. The member knows full well that that legislation is triggered by complaints and court applications by the police. Mr. Hawranik: The only time this minister moves quickly is toward a camera and another useless press conference. Bill 200 Minister's Support Mr.

Gerald Hawranik (Lac du Bonnet): A year has passed, and because this minister does not have the courage to do his duty by standing up to the gangs and the criminal organizations in this province, today we introduced for first reading a private member's bill, The Criminal Organizations Deterrence Act. Mr. Speaker, we want the minister to sit up and take notice and see how gangs and criminals and criminal organizations can be run out of town.

Will this minister do the right thing and exceed the boundary of petty politics and sup- port this legislation or will he oppose this legis- lation simply because it was not his idea? Hon. Gord Mackintosh (Minister of Justice and Attorney General): Mr. Speaker, the mem- ber knows full well that legislation just refers to municipalities. Mr. Speaker, I also note the Toronto Star from January 25 saying the following: The Manitoba Angels have struggled to hold their membership at 12, losing manpower to prison, cocaine addiction and deportation.

In contrast, the Ontario Angels have shot up from 168 mem- bers in December 2000 to about 270 members today. Ontario accounts fo r almost half the gang membership. Mr. Speaker, the Toronto Star goes on to note that Manitoba has the toughest anti-gang legislation in this country. We are not done yet. *(14:20) Education System Funding Levels Mrs. Heather Stefanson (Tuxedo): Last week in the Throne Speech, it was evident that this Government has absolutely no plan to improve upon the quality of education for children in our province. Once again, Mr.

Speaker, the Government has decreased the level of provincial funding from 60.9 percent when they took office in 1999 to 56.7 percent, the lowest it has ever been in Manitoba. Mr. Speaker, my question for the new Minister of Education: Why is his Government, once again, offloading the responsibility for the education system in our province onto the tax- payers and into the local community? Hon.

Peter Bjornson (M inister of Education, Citizenship and Youth): As someone who has spent 13 years in the classroom, I was painfully familiar with the actions of members opposite in terms of funding where we saw an increase in the funding on the shoulders of the local school boards, an increase of 68 percent. We have now been funding education at historic levels and are continuing to do so. Mrs. Stefanson: Grade 3 assessment tests over the past two years have shown some shocking results in regard to Grade 3 students not meeting acceptable standards in a number of basic areas of education.

Sixty-three percent of Grade 3 students did not meet expectations in subtraction

50 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 facts to 10. Forty-eight percent of Grade 3 students did not meet expectations in extending and describing mathematical patterns. And the list goes on. How can this Government justify this funding decrease when our kids are not meeting expectations in basic areas of education in our province? Mr.

Bjornson: With respect to the Grade 3 assessment, this is a process that we have been engaged in with the teachers, consulting with the teachers on an ongoing basis, and we have since moved the requirement for the assessment to take place at the beginning of the year to bridge the gaps that might be evident through the diag- nostic assessment that we are pursuing. Assess- ment is a means of improving outcome for students. We are committed to working with our teachers on an ongoing basis, and we are going to continue to work with the teachers and the students for what is best for our students. Thank you. Mrs.

Stefanson: Clearly, the education of our young people is not a priority for this Govern- ment, and the Premier's Grade 3 guarantee was nothing more in the election campaign than a sham. Our young people are not meeting expec- tations in a number of basic areas as shown in their own assessments. Shame on them. I ask the minister: When will his Government make the quality of our education system a priority in this rovince? p Mr. Bjornson: Quality of education has indeed been a very high priority for this Government, and we have shown that in programs that extend beyond the public school system.

Start with the Healthy Child Initiative and carry on to post- secondary initiatives that deal with making post- secondary education affordable for Manitoba students. This is something that starts with the first of its kind of prog ram to allow for prenatal care and goes all the way through to our support for post-secondary. We are committed to life- long learning. We are committed to improving the quality of education in Manitoba and we have been working hard to do so. We will ontinue to work hard to do so. c Livestock Industry Slaughter Assistance Program Mr. Larry Maguire (Arthur-Virden): Mr.

Speaker, on Friday, the federal Agriculture Minister announced a slaughter assistance pro- gram with the intention to help livestock pro- ducers deal with the mature animals on their farms stricken by BSE. This program is very similar to earlier ones giving virtually no finan- cial benefit to Manitoba producers of livestock in this province. Has the minister this time negotiated a guarantee that our share of the 10 percent to 12 percent of that $120 million federal program will end up with the disaster-stricken Manitoba farmers? Hon.

Rosann Wowchuk (Minister of Agricul- ture, Food and Rural Initiatives): The situ- ation with BSE in this province has certainly been one that our Government has put a lot of attention to, and it was the Province of Manitoba that asked the federal government since early August to bring into play a cull-cow program. The federal government has now put that program in place, and I can tell the member that one of the issues that Manitoba has raised with the federal government is that we have assur- ances that Manitobans will have equitable access to slaughter. Mr.

Speaker, I hope the member will get on board with Manitoba farmers who are trying to create a slaughter facility in this province so that equitable access to market will not be the kind of issue that it is now. If we have a slaughter facili- ty in this province to deal with cull cows, we will not have the concerns about getting the pro- duct to slaughter facilities in other provinces. Mr. Maguire: Manitoba producers' skepticism arises from the fact that they have been told falsely that this Government has provided $180 million to those farmers decimated by the BSE issue. Yet few have seen any significant funding.

The Throne Speech itself stated that only a fraction of these funds have reached the farmers' hands, by the Government's own admission. Will the minister assure Manitoba producers that they will receive th eir fair share of this program to help feed these large herds of cattle that will be existing on farms this winter because of the BSE issue? Ms. Wowchuk: Mr. Speaker, when we an- nounced our programs we said there was up to $180 million available for support for the

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 51 livestock industry. The members opposite were critical of our loan program. They said it would not work. I can tell you over 900 producers have taken out the loan. Even though the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Murray) recommended that we put in place a low-interest loan program, they then flipped and wanted a cash advance. Mr. Speaker, our programs are working. There is cash flowing.

Whether it be through the low-interest loan program, whether it be through the drought assistance or through the slaughter program, the number of animals that are slaugh- tered in this province is close to 80 000, and we will continue to work with our producers. Mr. Maguire: Mr. Speaker, in reference to an earlier question, the Premier (Mr. Doer) only has to turn to his Minister of Agriculture to find the biggest disaster ever to hit the livestock industry in this province, when her assurances provide false security for Manitoba farmers as these farmers have been stiffed by this Government before.

Examples: three-month feed programs that have been cut back to two months, a slaughter program changed to a feed program, a trans- portation program with no significant feed pro- gram. Mr. Speaker, can the minister confirm that last Friday's program is the best she can get for a special deal for signing on to the federal Agri- culture Policy Framework? Ms. Wowchuk: Mr. Speaker, I am not sure about how the Opposition works because they have no results, but I can tell you this Govern- ment works very closely with the industry.

It was the Manitoba Cattle Producers, who represent the cattle industry, who came to us and said, change the slaughter program to the feed program. It was the Manitoba Cattle Producers who also said, we need to extend the slaughter program and our Government did it. It was our Government that called on the federal government to put in place a cull-cow program. They have a program in place and we will review that program with the industry. That is what we are doing. Cataract Surgery Out-of-Province Patients Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Mr.

Speaker, many in Manitoba are wondering why the present NDP government is continuing dis- credited Tory policies, for example, running a province so that we continue to be the child overty capital of Canada. p * (14:30) My question to the Premier (Mr. Doer) is related. Why does the Government have Mani- tobans with cataracts wait at the back of the line? Why should the wife of Mr.

Johns, who is here in the gallery in the Legislature, go to the doctor and be told: If you were from Ontario with an Ontario health card we would get you in right away, but because you are a Manitoban you will have to wait six to eight months? The doctor also told him that this policy was introduced under the Tories and has not been changed under the NDP. When is the Government going to end this discriminatory Tory policy which puts Mani- tobans last? Hon.

Tim Sale (Acting Minister of Health): It was this Government that reduced the waiting list for cataract surgery from two years to the six months the member is referencing. We have reduced waiting lists for cancer, Mr. Speaker. We have made health more access- ible to Manitobans with new MRIs in Brandon. With the improvement of our diagnostic materi- als, our waiting lists in critical areas are going down. We are proud of that. Mr. Gerrard: Mr. Speaker, the minister pointedly avoided the question. The minister may protest but the reality is that here is Mrs. Johns. She has severe cataracts.

She cannot watch TV, sh e cannot read books. She has to wait six to eight months when some- body from Ontario can walk up and get it right away here in Manitoba. I would suggest to the Government that this is not acceptable. I would ask: When is the

52 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 Government going to get rid of discredited Tory policies and start treating seniors promptly and with respect? Mr. Sale: It is always instructive when a member rises who was a member of a federal cabinet which made the biggest single cut to Canada's health care system ever in history and he berates governments that have made the single biggest improvement in our health care system in Manitoba's history. It is very instruc- tive, and I am sure the viewers will understand the irony of the question.

The particulars of this specific case are now, I understand, before the department for their consideration, and I under- stand that the department is reviewing the issue as we speak. Trans-Canada Highway Speed Limit Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): My question is for the minister of highways. In Alberta on the No. 1 highway, people are entitled to travel 110 kilometres per hour. In fact, Saskatchewan now has upgraded, and they have indicated that they also can have their citizens travel 110 kilometres an hour on the No. 1 highway.

My question is a fairly simple one for a government that has a tough time taking any kind of action. We see that in the Throne Speech. It is a fairly simple question. Is this Government prepared to in- crease our speed limits from 100 to 110 on the No. 1 highway and possibly even do it before the end of the year? Hon. Ron Lemieux (Minister of Transpor- tation and Government Services): Excuse me, the simple answer to the question is no. This member from Inkster, if he is so concerned about safety, he would certainly be more responsible with regard to his questions. Traffic Lights Winkler, Manitoba Mr.

Peter Dyck (Pembina): My question is to the new minister of highways. On Saturday, November 22, 2003, the minister said on Radio Southern Manitoba, and I quote, "I really get somewhat annoyed by my colleagues across the floor when they raise issues like referring to roads in southern Manitoba because we have done so many things, whether it is, you know, lights in Winkler." Could the minister please inform this House and my constituents which lights his Government has installed in the city of Winkler, the fastest growing community in southern Manitoba? Hon.

Ron Lemieux (Minister of Trans- portation and Gove rnment Services): Mr. Speaker, there is– Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Mr. Speaker: Order. Mr. Lemieux: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. It is my pleasure to rise to attempt to answer that question. I can say that our Gov- ernment throughout our first mandate and also going into this mandate has taken care of high- ways and had a lot of energy towards looking at all parts of the province, not just a few selected constituencies but northern Manitoba, western Manitoba, eastern Manitoba and southern Mani- toba with the new twinning of Highway 59. Mr.

Dyck: This minister has no idea what he is talking about. Seeing that he has misled Mani- tobans and the citizens of Winkler, is he pre- pared to do the right thing and do another inter- view and inform the comm unity that indeed his statements have misled them? Mr. Lemieux: We have increased the capital budget by about 16 percent over what the previ- ous government did.

For the first time, historic numbers with regard to finance have been put towards highways and highway infrastructure in this province and, as others have commented on with regard to the monies gained through gas taxes, we dedicate every cent towards highway infrastructure and so on. We are going to be entering into this Legislature a new law that will also certainly direct finances towards highway infrastructure. So, Mr.

Speaker, with regard to overall highway infrastructure, the previous colleagues, the MLA for Thompson, the MLA from Bran- don West, throughout all of our Government, we have looked at increasing finances and the amount of money towards highway infra- structure. We are very proud of our record.

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 53 Mr. Dyck: Mr. Speaker, obviously the lights have not gone on. I would like this minister to please inform this House and my citizens which lights he is referring to in his interview on Radio Southern Manitoba. Please, we would like to know. Mr. Lemieux: Mr. Speaker, we have certainly paved the Winkler main street and we have done a lot of work in southern Manitoba, which mem- bers opposite do not seem to want to acknowl- edge.

That is fair, because I think the people of Manitoba also see the work that is being done throughout the province, not just in certain par- ticular constituencies, if I might add. Northern Manitoba, western Manitoba, east- ern Manitoba, southern Manitoba have gained with regard to all the finances and the dollars we have put towards highway infrastructure. We are very proud of our record, increasing the amount of capital infrastructure by 16 percent, far greater than what the members opposite did during the 1990s. *(14:40) Healthy Living Ministry Budget Mrs. Mavis Taillieu (Morris): Mr.

Speaker, the new Minister of Healthy Living publicly claims his department is the fourth largest in govern- ment. We know this Government has a penchant for expensive advertising campaigns. Can the minister tell this House what his budget is and how much he plans to spend on an advertising campaign? Hon. Jim Rondeau (Minister of Healthy Living): Mr. Speaker, I am very proud to be a new Minister of Healthy Living. I think not only do we have health and healthy living as part of every government, we have it throughout each department.

We have it in Education, where you talk about proper nutrition and proper health care. You have it in Family Services, where you create healthy families. You have it in the Healthy Baby and Healthy Child programs, which are unique national programs that really invest in the young child. We have it in Seniors. We have it throughout our entire Government. I am proud to be part of a government that does not put it in one small part of government but has it as an extensive comprehensive plan through all governments. Thank you very much. Mr. Speaker: Order.

Time for Oral Questions has expired. ' MEMBERS' STATEMENTS Grand Chief Phil Fontaine Mr. Gerard Jennissen (Flin Flon): Mr. Speaker, today I had the honour of attending the investiture into the Order of Manitoba of a prominent Manitoban, Grand Chief Larry Phillip (Phil) Fontaine. This is an opportune occasion to remind members of the Legislative Assembly about Grand Chief Phil Fontaine's dedication and commitment. For over three decades, Phil has been an articulate and effective spokesperson for Aborig- inal peoples in Canada. Phil is an Anishinaabe, born on the Sagkeeng First Nation.

In 1973 he became Chief of the Sagkeeng First Nation at the age of 27. As chief, he spearheaded massive improvements to the educational system on the reserve. This later became a model for other re- serve communities. After two consecutive terms as chief, he took a position with the federal government as a regional director general in the Yukon. In 1980, Mr. Speaker, he returned to Mani- toba to complete a degree in political science at the University of Manitoba.

After graduation he worked for the Southeast Tribal Council as a special adviser and was the deputy co-ordinator of the Native Economic Program, eventually becoming Manitoba vice-chief for the Assembly of First Nations. In 1991, Phil was elected Grand Chief of the Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs and served three consecutive terms in that role. In that position he was involved in the defeat of the Meech Lake Accord, in the development of the Manitoba Framework Agreement Initiative and in the signing of an employment equity agreement with 39 federal agencies.

Phil became Grand Chief of the Assembly of First Nations in 1997, succeeding Ovide Mecredi, a position he held for three years.

54 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 During this term he negotiated the founding and funding of the Aboriginal Healing Foundation. In 2002, Phil was appointed as the Chief Commissioner of the Indian Claims Commission, an independent body responsible for land claim settlements. He resigned from this position last May to run for election as national chief. He won this election and is again national chief of the Assembly of First Nations. He continues to be commissioner of the Specific Claims Commission. Mr.

Speaker, Phil Fontaine has worked tirelessly on behalf of the Aboriginal peoples of Canada to improve their dignity, housing, edu- cation and medical care. He contributes per- sonally, professionally and materially to every good cause. I congratulate Mr. Fontaine on his investi- ture into the Order of Manitoba and for his record of effectively improving the lives of Abo- riginal peoples. Phil, we are proud of you. Meegwetch. Spirit of Tuxedo Award Mrs. Heather Stefanson (Tuxedo): It is with great pleasure that I rise today to pay tribute to the Spirit of Tuxedo Award nominees.

The Spirit of Tuxedo Award is meant to recognize those volunteers who have contributed their time and energy to make our community in Tuxedo a better place in which to live. Nominees this year were selected by a variety of different organizations. Each of these organizations relayed to my office that their particular volunteer had gone beyond the normal call of duty and pursued with a unique passion their volunteer task at hand. Mr. Speaker, truly our nominees' accom- plishments were impressive, Mr. Speaker.

On November 17, 2003, an evening reception or- ganized by my office was held in Room 255 of the Manitoba Legislature to celebrate the nomi- nations of Annette Bell, Kellen Blower, Izzy Elerby, Larysa Fitkowsky, Iris Maurstad, Peggy May, Lydia MacKenzie, Andrew McPherson, Jan Taylor, Dale Willson and Kevin Wirth. Family and friends of the nominees also attended which resulted in an audience of approximately 50 people who witnessed the nominees receive a certificate and sign our Spirit of Tuxedo registry. Mr.

Speaker, it was truly an honour and very enjoyable as well to meet these individuals who have contributed so much to our community of Tuxedo. Today I express again my gratitude and respect for their accomplish- ments. Thank you. Concordia Hospital Mr. Harry Schellenberg (Rossmere): Mr. Speaker, I would like to report that this year marks the 75th anniversary of Concordia Hos- pital. Mr. Speaker, this vibrant and well-respected institution has a proud tradition of caring for Manitobans.

As part of the festivities marking its anniversary, Concordia Hospital held an Anni- versary Symposium and the Canadian Men- nonite Health Assembly Annual Conference this fall. In 1927, a group of community leaders, recent Mennonite immigrants to Manitoba from Russia, met to form the Concordia Society and began discussing the development of a faith- based medical facility. Today, as visitors enter the hospital, the core principles of the hospital remain evident as illustrated in a passage from Menno Simons that appears in the entranceway: True evangelical faith cannot be dormant. It clothes the naked.

It feeds the hungry. It comf orts the sorrowful. It shelters the destitute. It serves those that harm it. It binds up that which is wounded. It has become all things to all people. The hospital began as a maternity hospital on Machray Avenue in north Winnipeg and admitted its first patient on July 29, 1928. It moved two more times in the 1930s over to Elmwood. Finally in 1974 the hospital moved to its present location on Concordia Avenue. Throughout its history, Concordia has worked hard to focus on the changing needs of the community.

This hospital has anticipated and adapted to change while maintaining quality care as their first priority.

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 55 Concordia is expanding a hip and knee joint replacement program. It will grow into a centre of excellence in this field. As well, two state-of- the-art operating rooms with modern technology are being constructed. Finally, a Centre for Re- search and Education continues the hospital's teaching program with surgery and anaesthesia residents. Mr. Speaker, the hono urable Member for Concordia (Mr.

Doer) joins me today in con- gratulating the CEO at the Concordia Hospital, Henry Tessmann, the board of directors, the dedicated staff and the volunteers who have made the Concordia Hospital an outstanding centre of medical care in our community. Thank ou. y Dr. Mary Pankiw Mrs. Myrna Driedger (Charleswood): Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to congratulate one of my constituents, Dr. Mary Pankiw, for the recog- nition she recently received from Conservatory Canada. I would like to share their tribute to her. Conservatory Canada is proud of its students and their accomplishments.

Once in awhile a story emerges that motivates and inspires us. The next time a student tells you that their life is too busy for music enrichment or they are too old to learn, this story about Mary Pankiw offers a different perspective. On the day before Christmas, in 1968, Dr. Mary Pankiw lost her husband at the age of 46. Left with five children, the youngest being three, Mrs. Pankiw continued her education and received a Bachelor of Education degree in May 1969.

You can see from the qualifications listed under her photograph that continuing her edu- cation has been paramount to her success, all the while raising a family who in themselves are each high achievers. The first Canadian-born woman to earn a PhD at Ukrainian Free Uni- versity in Munich, Germany, in 1978, Mary was elected president of the Council of Women, Winnipeg, at their 109th annual general meeting in April 2003. She was profiled in Chatelaine's 1998 and 1999 editions of who's who of Cana- dian women. What has all this to do with Conservatory Canada? At 80 years of age, Dr.

Mary Pankiw just completed the first half of the Associate Teacher's Examination in Voice with an honours ark. We congratulate her. m * (14:50) Emergency Preparedness (Selkirk) Mr. Gregory Dewar (Selkirk): Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to recognize the City of Selkirk for its efforts in leadership in being the first com- munity to ensure its emergency preparedness program is updated and in fact exceeds the mini- mum requirements of the enhanced Emergency Measures Act. I was joined last week in Selkirk by the Minister responsible for EMO where he presented to the mayor and council a certificate of this recognition.

Mr. Speaker, we encourage all communities to continue working on their plans and be pre- pared to respond to emergency situations. All municipalities are to meet the new guidelines by April 2005. Programs must be approved by Manitoba EMO. Emergency programs would typically include response and recovery plans, training exercises and general awareness. The Association of Manitoba Municipalities partici- pated in the development of the 60 basic require- ments for the emergency program, approved by the EMO, the additional requirements to achieve certificate status and the compliance timeline.

The new requirement will also help keep elected officials updated on the subject of emergency preparedness since programs must be reviewed and passed by councils annually. I would like to congratulate the City of Selkirk and the city manager, Jim Fenski, for showing great leadership in an effort to improve the public safety in Manitoba. I hope that other communities will follow Selkirk's lead and ensure that Manitobans will continue to have an excellent emergency preparedness program in heir communities. t ORDERS OF THE DAY GOVERNMENT BUSINESS ADJOURNED DEBATE (Second Day of Debate) Mr.

Speaker: Resume debate on the proposed motion of the honourable Member for Flin Flon (Mr. Jennissen)

56 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 THAT the following address be presented to His Honour the Lieutenant-Governor: We, the members of the Legislative Assem- bly of Manitoba, thank Your Honour for the gracious speech addressed to us at this Second Session of the Thirty-eighth Legislature of Man- itoba. The debate is open. Mr. Stuart Murray (Leader of the Official Opposition): It again is an honour for me to rise in this Assembly as the Leader of the Official Opposition and respond to the Speech from the Throne.

On behalf of all Manitobans, I can under- stand why they would be dispirited and dis- couraged. It was a most perfidious attempt to reach out to Manitobans. Mr. Speaker, the Premier (Mr. Doer) had every opportunity to hit a home run, but instead he stood there with the bat on his shoulders. There was just no vision in this speech. In other words, our Premier managed to turn a rose into a thorn. One of the Premier's closest friends was quoted recently as sa ying there is no pre- tentiousness as it applies to the Premier.

After four years in the job and following this rather vacuous Throne Speech it is sadly becoming obvious to more and more Manitobans that this Premier has nothing to be pretentious about. His failures are mounting and his Government is now clearly showing some cracks and decay, broken promise after broken promise. What is alarming is that no premier has ever set the bar lower as a measure of success for our province. It is unprecedented. His vision for Manitoba is limited to bigger government and the attempt of building a personal legacy. Quite frankly, he is a wind surfer out there surfing with no wind. Mr.

Harry Schellenberg, Acting Speaker, in the Chair When the Premier came to office, Mr. Acting Speaker, he had inherited the best macroeconomic situation in Manitoba since the mid-1970s. The hard work had all been done. Manitobans had suffered through the recessions of the eighties and the nineties. They had en- dured economic hardships and cut their services and they had contributed their fair share. The only thing this Premier had to do was to keep his simple promises, provide responsible manage- ment and reward Manito bans for their contri- butions.

In other words, the advice was do not go back on the old spending ways of the NDP. Mr. Acting Speaker, Manitobans remember the simplest promise of them all. It was in 1999. The Premier said he would end hallway medi- cine in six months with $15 million. Instead, since then, 11 Manitobans have died waiting for heart surgery. Waiting lists are hurting our sick and our elderly, and the nursing shortage in Manitoba has grown to over 1000 nurses.

Since this Premier was elected, not only has he not provided an effective plan to improve health care in Manitoba, he even failed to include a mere mention of the issue in the Throne Speech in 2002. The Premier likes to talk about quality of life in rural Manitoba. Mr. Acting Speaker, how can he honestly even make that reference at the same time that he is dis- mantling rural hospitals one brick at a time? At a time when the performance of regional health authorities should be reviewed, there is also a great need for a more transparent and accountable health care system.

It must be re- structured based on existing public-private collaboration. Mr. Acting Speaker, it is inter- esting, public-private collaboration is something that the Doer government talks about with education and when it comes to tourism. Yet they have no courage to do the right thing for Manitoba patients and explore a public-private collaboration when it comes to health care. This is the kind of vision, Mr. Acting Speaker, that Manitobans want to see from their Premier. They want to explore those oppor- tunities because they are the right things to do.

The Premier did not use the Throne Speech to provide direction for Manitobans in the area of health or in any other area for that matter. I must remind Manitobans that the previous four throne speeches under the Premier have only added to his failed commitments.

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 57 In last year's Throne Speech, the Premier unveiled an action strategy for economic growth that clearly has not worked, and while he prom- ised to revitalize Winnipeg, simply he has failed. Mr. Acting Speaker, the Premier promised affordable government, but instead of providing responsible management, he has taken hundreds of millions of dollars from the rainy day fund and from Manitoba Hydro in an attempt to hide the fact that his Government is running a deficit and trying to hide it. It is deceitful, it is wrong, and he should apologize to Manitobans. Mr.

Acting Speaker, in last year's Throne Speech, this Premier promised to improve ac- countability in lotteries and gaming. Yet he has done nothing to achieve this and instead has focussed on increased gambling and gaming revenue. The Premier also promised action on public safety, yet he did not follow through with his promised Safe Schools Charter or his legislation that promised to shut down businesses being operated by organized crime. It has not led to a single closure. Instead, gang activity has esca- lated and criminals simply experience the Doer government's revolving door on crime.

They are back on the street faster that you can say the Doer government is soft on crime. The Premier said in last year's Throne Speech that his top priority was to rebuild and improve health care. Mr. Acting Speaker, this Premier really does think he can say anything and get away with it. You do, do you not? Mr. Acting Speaker, his Throne Speech is a history lesson. As I said earlier, highlights broken, promise after broken promise, failure after failure. The Throne Speech is a concern for all Manitobans.

We all need to take a close look at all the signs and realize that the Doer government is just not listening. Nor is it acting to stop Manitobans who are leaving our province in growing numbers. People in business in our province have been signaling for some time and have now taken to outright criticism of the Doer government's efforts to get the attention of the Premier and make him realize that serious reform is required to make us more competitive. Mr.

Acting Speaker, individual businesses, small, medium and large, of the Chambers of Commerce are asking the Doer government to significantly lower taxes to help draw private investment into the province of Manitoba. A recent study by the Chartered Accountants of Manitoba says the quality of life in our province is lacklustre compared to other provinces and that it is lagging behind every other western province. Mr. Acting Speaker, amidst these warnings of concern, the Premier displayed an arrogance that was, to say the least, embarrassing.

With the audacity of only someone who thinks he knows it all, he labelled our Chambers of Commerce as "one-trick ponies" who know nothing about how to run a business. That is absolutely brazen, even for this Premier. This Premier is an old union boss whose only experience with business is to encourage labour to work against management. As a Premier, he has taken that experience one step further. Now he is running businesses out of the province. Instead of insulting small-business people, he should be opening up our Gov- ernment's resources to all small business.

This Premier should be turning Manitoba into the small-business capital of Canada, a place where investment is welcome, a wealth-creating opportunity. That is what they expect from a Throne Speech. * (15:00) Whatever else the Premier is doing or not doing, it is abundantly clear that he has little respect for the hardworking men and women that are the backbone of ou r economy. The Premier has simply tuned them out. This Throne Speech did nothing for busi- ness, nor did it address our increasingly serious economic issues. In 2003, this Premier failed to create any new jobs, and that is his job.

The Premier must lead. He must set the tone and ensure that the Government is a catalyst and a facilitator for economic development. It must set the climate to assist all sectors of busin ess and industry so that they can create those new jobs in Manitoba.

58 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 The engine of any healthy economy is clearly job creation. That is a fact. Since that is the case, it is clear that the NDP government and this Premier have clearly run out of gas. We did not see anything in the Throne Speech to address one of the issues that is the most important issue facing Manitoba. We did not see anything about job creation in that Throne Speech. In fact, all we heard about job creation was zilch, which is about the number of new jobs that have been created in Manitoba.

The Premier decided that he was going to dismiss alarming statistical data and says, trust me, everything is fine. Well, everything is not fine, and this Premier knows it. The bottom line is that we are not creating jobs and our job market is not in good shape. Again, I repeat, the Premier had a golden opportunity to lay out a vision for Manitobans, a vision that would include a plan for strong, sound economic growth. Instead, our Premier outlined a frame- work for spending more and more of Mani- tobans' money without any plan of how to grow the economy.

Instead of providing leadership and display- ing the courage required to make tough deci- sions, this Premier continues to overspend in an effort to please the special interests of the Doer government while at the same time ignores Manitobans that are clearly in desperate need. It simply is a recipe for disaster. I will come back to that point in a few minutes. Mr. Acting Speaker, the credibility gap of this Premier has widened further with a Throne Speech from a government that refuses to get tough on crime.

The Hells Angels, which set up shop in December of 2000 under this Premier's watch, are taking control of our streets and preying on our kids. Crime has increased to the point that we are now the murder capital of Canada. Legal Aid is in a crisis, yet criminals who prey on our most vulnerable, our seniors and our children, are getting away with a slap on the wrist.

Rather than cut deals with criminals, this Premier had an opportunity to show a vision for a better deal for victims and a real plan to make Manitoba safer, one that would include tougher punishment and a public-defender-style system to put an end to costly delays and unacceptable stays of proceedings. Manitoba will never reach its economic potential. We will not retain nor will we draw workers and their families if we allow the gangs to control our streets. Again, this Premier failed miserably when it comes to safety in our communities during this Throne Speech.

If the Premier's goal in the Throne Speech was to aim lower and achieve less, we will have no argument from this side of the House. He has excited no one except for his idealogues, his party's special interest groups and membership. There is no vision inclusive to all Manitobans. The priorities are askew and incomplete. No better example exis ts in the approach to responsible management between the Official Opposition and the Government. Responsible management filters its way through all issues important to all Manitobans.

For instance, we know that the Doer government is planning on spending billions of dollars for known and potential Manitoba Hydro projects. These are megaprojects. There are important questions that have to be asked before they proceed. Mr. Acting Speaker, this Throne Speech provided an excellent opportunity for the Premier to present his vision for our public resource and to assure Manitobans that all initiatives will undergo the scrutiny of the Public Utilities Board. This is an important process that must be followed and cannot be ignored.

The concern for all Manitobans is that this Premier has been in the media with attempts to intimidate the PUB regarding the Hydro initiatives. That is simply unacceptable. Government must be respectful of both process and responsible man- agement. Before the Doer government leaves Manitobans with a huge tab for these projects, an analysis must be completed. Is there a guaran- teed market for the energy? Is the timing right? Is the debt load manageable? What public input evaluation process will be used? That is the proper approach, a step-by-step, responsible approach.

As the leader of our party, it is my com- mitment to the people of Manitoba as to the way

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 59 we will manage our province's affairs. We will protect the interests of taxpayers. Many times under the Doer government, it has just been the taxpayer-be-damned approach. That is just simply wrong. It is consistent with the Premier's tax-and-spend mentality. It is certainly consist- ent with the out-of-control Pawley adminis- tration that he was a leading part of during the late 1980s. I guess the question always is: Who funded that Headingley report? But I will let the Premier answer that in due course. The facts do not lie.

The $150 million taken from the rainy day fund to balance the Budget was never replenished last year. The so-called $202-million special dividend taken from Mani- toba Hydro in 2002 has placed the Crown corporation in an extremely difficult situation, especially with the low water levels this year. The draw on the rainy day fund has grown every year from $15 million to $60 million to $93 million. It has simply become another way to augment program spending, which, under the Doer government, is at an all-time high. The growth in new spending estimates outpaces the growth in new revenue estimates.

While there are many other examples, it is clear that this NDP government, like the NDP governments previous, are spending Manitobans into a corner. Protection for the taxpayer is basic and fundamental to responsible management. In Manitoba the Public Utilities Board ensures the protection on major projects like the ones being contemplated by the Doer government for Manitoba Hydro. Mr. Acting Speaker, my colleagues and I on this side of the Hous e are concerned by the attitude and demeanor of the Premier towards the Public Utilities Board.

The lack of respect shown by the Premier for the board is unwar- ranted, but it does appear to be calculated. Manitobans should not be surprised at the lengths to which this Premier will go to drive his Hydro initiatives. Manitobans must remember that this Premier has openly questioned the PUB process and that he has attempted to circumvent its examination of Manitoba Hydro initiatives, so that he can put them on the fast track, Mr. Acting Speaker. This is an example of the worst kind of public management.

It follows, then, if the PUB holds firm in its desire to follow due process, that the Premier would simply disband the PUB in favour of a process over which he would have more control. He has the power, Mr. Acting Speaker. * (15:10) The approach to economic development issues, whether it is to energy issues like Manitoba Hydro, Kyoto or ethanol or any other important issue must again be based on a responsible management approach. Whether it is feasible or not seldom enters into the equation, no thought about strategic planning, action plans or critical paths. In laymen's language, Mr.

Acting Speaker, this Premier and his Govern- ment care very little about getting their ducks in a row. For example, with Kyoto, the Premier supported the initiative before any details were known about the cost of implementation, and in typical NDP fashion, his own minister stated we must implement the Kyoto accord. Costs to taxpayers are irrelevant. It was a buzzword that fit very nicely into their special interest fra mework and they were all for it, Mr. Acting Speaker. Not to be totally flippant, but the more we see of the way the Doer NDP operate, the more one realizes that it is all sizzle and no steak. Mr.

Acting Speaker, the Premier (Mr. Doer) is relentless in support of his party's special interests. Outside of those interests, it is much harder to get his attention. Just ask Manitoba cattle producers and other farm families stricken by the mad cow crisis and the drought or small businesspeople throughout our province. Mr. Speaker in the Chair The BSE crisis is an example of where a special interest of this Premier is not involved.

Just think, he is willing to intimidate the PUB to get his way for billions of dollars in projects, yet he will do little to help the 12 000 cattle farmers struggling through this BSE crisis.

60 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 Mr. Speaker, the Throne Speech provided the Premier with his best opportunity to show compassion on this issue, but, again, he came up short. For months, my colleagues and I have urged and pressured the Premier to provide substantive support to the producers in the form of an interest-free cash ad vance, similar to the support requested by the Manitoba Cattle Pro- ducers Association. The MCPA itself has projected that such a program would involve about a $350-million cash advance.

Since the money would be repaid upon the sale of the cattle, the only true cost to the Province would be the cost to carry the interest charges. Based on the MCPA's own numbers, even if every cattle producer took

part in this program, the interest costs to government would be less than $20 million, Mr. Speaker. Considering that the cattle industry is worth over half a billion dollars to the Manitoba econo- my, it is a minimal investment to make to save that industry. I am astounded that on the six- month anniversary since this crisis began, that the Premier would not have seized the oppor- tunity and used the Speech from the Throne to lend a helping hand to our farm families. Mr.

Speaker, I can only recall sitting at a kitchen table in Souris and listening to young children say why is it that we might be able to feed the world but we cannot feed our families? It is unfair, it is uncompassionate and it is wrong- headed. Mr. Speaker, it is the same producers who cannot pay their property taxes. It has come to the point where many of our communities, rural municipalities were forced to consider drastic measures including non-payment of their property taxes. In fact, the president of the Association of Manitoba Municipalities, Mr.

Stuart Briese, was openly critical of what was not in the recent Throne Speech. I quote Mr. Briese: I was very disappointed. I did not hear much reference to education tax on property, and that is a huge issue with us. Education costs go up every year and as long as the Province does not fund the full increases of education, it reverts back to property, and that is unsustainable. We are holding the line on the municipal part of our budget, but 50 percent or more of our budget goes to education. It keeps going up every year, and we cannot keep doing that.

It just keeps growing and growing and growing on us, and frustrations are rising not only with muni- cipalities but with the general public as well, said Mr. Briese. As I said earlier, th is Premier (Mr. Doer) clearly is not listening. Property taxes in Mani- toba are among the highest in Canada. Middle- income Manitobans are the highest taxed west of New Brunswick. The leadership that is required in Manitoba is clear. Manitobans need a gov- ernment that will tear apart the tax system, deliver a plan that is fair, simple and competi- tive.

Most importantly, Manitobans need their Government to act now and eliminate all edu- cation taxes off residential property and farm- land, reducing their property tax bill by one half. It is the right thing to do. This Premier has the opportunity to do it, to do it on behalf of all Manitobans, and all renters can still retain their Manitoba Property Tax Credit. It cannot, how- ever, be a short-term fix. Legislation must ac- company the elimination of education taxes to prohibit any government from re-introducing those same taxes back on residential property and farmland.

The time has come when the Government of Manitoba must stand up and accept the operating costs of public education. Only two provinces continue to offload the funding of education onto the backs of property owners. It is not surprising that both those provinces are led by NDP premiers. We can no longer place that burden on property taxpayers. Ag ain, the Premier missed an opportunity to provide substance in this most recent Throne Speech. He failed to listen to Manitobans like the president of the AMM and many others. I cannot help but look across the way at the new Minister of Education (Mr.

Bjornson) and wonder if he has the courage to move forward on this initiative. He is the third Minister of Education in three years, and he has inherited a department in chaos, not of his making but of the Premier's making. The failure of the Premier's Grade 3 guarantee and the gerrymandering of a deal in the Sunrise School Division top that list that the new Minister of Education is going to have to try to wrestle to the ground.

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 61 There must be a set of core values at the base of any vision, and this Throne Speech is void of any. There is no mention of a goal to control our own destiny. There is no sense of being self-reliant. There is no talk of how do we move Manitoba from a have-not province that spends, spends, spends, into a have province that controls our own destiny. As a province, Man- itoba must be working on initiatives to move us from a have-not to a have province, just as the previous Progressive Conservative government had done in the late 1990s. Ms.

Theresa Oswald, Acting Speaker, in the Chair Manitobans through th eir efforts and their energy had created un precedented economic success that is stagnating under this Premier and the Doer government. Th ere is no pride in having their hand out. Manitoba must be pro- active in creating the right economic environ- ment. We must, as I said earlier, reward those who are willing to invest and create wealth in the province of Manitoba. In order to successfully create the environ- ment, we must focus on existing families and businesses and encourage them to stay and grow here.

We must develop our Ambassador Program and those who pr omote our province to new heights, seeking opportunities in all sectors and all jurisdictions across this country. We must support Manitoba's very special and dynamic sense of family, community and belonging. Our youth, they need to know, they need to know and believe that they have a future in the province of Manitoba. We must also provide the motivation and rewards to create service excellence throughout our civil service and within business and industry.

The Throne Speech, as it applies to the City of Winnipeg's proposed new deal, is a major concern, more from the standpoint of what it did not say as opposed to what it did say. While the Premier (Mr. Doer) said he was not elected to raise taxes, the fact that he has been so silent on the mayor's tax increase plan is cause for significant concern. The reality is that the mayor wants to increase the sales tax, but Manitoba's balanced budget legislation requires a public referendum before that happens.

To quell this concern, the Premier need only tell Manitobans that, should he decide to grant the mayor his wish of a higher sales tax, it will be on the condition that it goes before a binding public referendum. Manitobans must remain vigilant and make sure that the Premier does not enact a hidden agenda to weaken balanced budget legislation. I call on this Premier to show leader- ship and tell Manitobans where he stands on the issue. * (15:20) Today, Madam Acting Speaker, we heard the Premier say that if the new Prime Minister, Mr.

Martin, wants to put money from the federal sales tax into the Province of Manitoba, we applaud that; we think that it is about time that that takes place. That is the right way to go about doing it. But what the Premier is not saying he will not allow is to allow the mayor to increase new taxes. Either he is in favour of it or he is opposed to it. You cannot sit on the fence forever. I call on the Premier to be clear as it applies to the Capital Region report, especially as it applies to the report re garding forced amalga- mations.

The Premier must be clear that his Government is not looking at any forced amalga- mations, as it did, Madam Acting Speaker, with school boards, and I remind the Premier that it was his words that resonated throughout the hallowed halls of meetings around this province, that forced school division amalgamations, when asked, said it is not going to happen, not under his watch. Why? Because it is not the Manitoba way. As he turned around, what happened? Wham, forced school division amalgamations.

It is interesting, because what we heard from the Premier at that point was, well, you know, I know that I said we were not going to do it, but now that we have done it, wow, we are going to put $10 million of savings into the classroom. What a crock. It is not happening. It is going the other way. It is costing taxpayers money because of the forced school division amalga- mations. So the question now becomes: What is he going to do with respect to the Capital Region report? What is it that he is going to do?

62 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 The responsibility of the Province in the Capital Region is extremely clear. The provin- cial government must act as a catalyst to foster a strong relationship between the City and the Capital Region and municipalities. The Province must facilitate a co-operative approach to eco- nomic development in the Capital Region. That same approach must be used when examining opportunities for cost-sharing in the areas of services and infrastructure.

The provincial gov- ernment under the Doer government must work smart and work hard to form partnerships to achieve a strong Capital Region. Madam Acting Speaker, this is the Doer government's fifth Throne Speech, and there are a number of observations and conclusions I would like to put on the record. The Premier's (Mr. Doer) credibility gap is widening. It is widening because Manitobans can clearly see that he does not keep his prom- ises. In other words, although he would like to be the pony express, he simply cannot deliver the mail. As usual, the Premier is big on political spin but small on detail.

Nothing in the speech provides any confidence regarding meaningful tax relief. There is nothing to assure us of efforts to grow our economy, to attract new business and create real jobs in Manitoba. There is no strategy to make our communities safer. In fact, the reality is that one of the biggest threats to public safety in Manitoba is the Hells Angels, and let us not forget that it was under this Premier's watch that the Hells Angels were established in the province of Manitoba, yet no mention was made of an action to deal with them in this Throne Speech.

The speech attempts to misinform Mani- tobans and claim that the health care system is stable and no longer in crisis. That may be the biggest surprise in the Throne Speech. There was no real financial assistance for our farm families, only a few kind words. The Throne Speech continues to ignore the needs of rural Manitobans. Incentives and efforts to create sus- tainable economic development have all but disappeared, Madam Acting Speaker.

The Premier may talk about the need to govern fairly and avoid policies that benefit one region at the expense of another, but that is exactly what he does and it is exactly why he is at the root of his redibility gap. c Manitobans deserve better. They deserve a leader that will take a fresh look and apply new dedication and renewed energy in solving old problems. Manitobans deserve leadership that will pursue and uncover sustainable economic opportunities to rebuild our job markets and em- ployment opportunities and congratulate those wealth creators.

Manitobans deserve leadership that will provide safe communities and leader- ship that will be tough on crime, not just put out press release after press release and have the potential of having five Hells Angels associates walk because of the bungling of the Doer gov- ernment. Manitobans deserve leadership that will treat all aspects of our province with respect and dignity.

We have an opportunity in the Throne Speech, an opportunity wh ere the premier of the day can provide a vision, that lofty goal of where he wants to see the province go, not so much a history lesson, but a vision of standing and looking down the path into the years 2010, 2012, so that young people, when they hear this Throne Speech say: I want to stay in Manitoba. I have an opportunity to stay in Manitoba because I know where this Government is going. We saw none of that in the Throne Speech.

They had an opportunity to put words on a piece of paper that could be lifted onto an empty canvas that those in Manitoba could see hope and opportunity and wonderment about why it is that they should maintain their families in this province. When it came to that we got nothing, zilch, nada. Working together, striving to reach our potential, that is the kind of Manitoba that a Progressive Conservative Party believes in.

That is the kind of Manitoba that a Progressive Conservative Party will build, with people, with Manitobans, to make this a stronger province, to create wealth and jobs and ensure that Manitobans stand proud and talk about what a great province this is every single day. M r. Speaker in the Chair I would like to move, seconded by the Member for River East (Mrs. Mitchelson),

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 63 THAT the motion be amended by adding at the end of the sentence the following words: But this House regrets (

a) the Government's inability to fulfil the promises outlined in its Throne Speech of November 27, 2002, including the following failures: failing to build the economy; failing to enhance health care; failing to open 1000 new cottage lots and 1000 new camp sites; and (

b) the Government's failure to meaningfully address the growing concerns related to organ- ized crime including the fact that since Novem- ber 2000 Manitoba has been the scene of 37 biker-related murders and attempted murders; and (

c) the Government's failu re to develop a long- term economic strategy to address an anemic job growth; and (

d) the Government's fa ilure to adequately address the BSE crisis and to provide workable programs for producers, thereby threatening not only the stability of the livestock sector, but all of those other sectors in Manitoba's economy that are so reliant on well-being; and (

e) the Province's failure to recognize and encourage the important role private sector involvement has in growing Manitoba's econo- my; and (

f) the Government's failure to acknowledge that balanced budgets have only been achieved through significant raids of Manitoba Hydro and the Fiscal Stabilization Fund; and (

g) the Government's failure to initiate a review of health care regionalization; and (

h) the Government's failure to develop a long- term economic and taxation strategy to address Manitoban's uncompetitive personal and busi- ness tax levels; and (

i) the Government's failure to provide a strategy ensuring two thirds of all nursing positions in Manitoba are full time by the spring of 2004 as previously committed; and (

j) the Government's failure to follow through on their commitment to ensure access to education for special needs students. AND HAS THEREBY lost the trust and con- fidence of the people of Manitoba and this House. Mr. Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition on your amendment (

e) where it says "the Government's failure." You said "the Province's failure to recognize." Which word would you like in there? Mr. Murray: The Government's. Mr. Speaker: So (

e) will read: The Govern- ment's failure to reco gnize and encourage the important role private sector involvement has in growing Manitoba's economy; and. * (15:30) Point of Order Mr. Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a point of order. Hon. Gary Doer (Premier): Mr. Speaker, I believe that you are correct that the wording that I understood I heard was "Province," and– Mr. Speaker: Order. I inadvertently called the Leader of the Official Opposition. So I am recognizing the First Minister. Mr. Doer: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I could not hear over the razzing across the way.

I do take your clarification properly. If the motion was moved, it is a formal motion. It is not an informal motion. It was moved and seconded in such a way, I believe, that it would need unanimous consent of the House to amend it. I think that is the rule of the House. You cannot amend a motion that has already been moved and properly seconded. Mr. Speaker: What I was doing I was trying to clarify from the honourable member if he misspoke and if he meant to say "Government" over "Province" because, if it is changed, the honourable First Minister is correct. You would

64 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 need unanimous consent of the House to change a wording in the amendment. I was trying to clarify from the honour able Leader of the Official Opposition (Mr. Murray) if he misspoke and said "Province" instead of "Government." I was only trying to clarify that. The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition to help me get this clarified. Mr. Murray: Mr. Speaker, clearly as indicated in here it says "the Government's", and my intent was to say the "Government's." Mr. Speaker: I thank the honourable Leader of the Official Opposition for the clarification.

That should end the matter. * * * Mr. Speaker: I will read the motion. It has been moved by the honourable Leader of the Official Op position (Mr. Murray), seconded by the honourable Member for River East (Mrs. Mitchelson), THAT the motion be amended by adding at the end of the sentence the following words: But this House regrets (

a) the Government's inability to fulfil the promises outlined in its Throne Speech of November 27, 2002, including the following failures: failing to build the economy, failing to enhance health care and failing to open 1000 new cottage lots and 1000 new campsites; (

b) the Government's failure to meaningfully address the growing concerns related to organ- ized crime including the fact that since Novem- ber 2000 Manitoba has been the scene of 37 biker-related murders and attempted murders; and that Government's failure to provide a long- term economic strategy to address anemic job growth; and (

c) the Government's failu re to develop a long- term economic strategy to address anemic job growth; and (

d) the Government's fa ilure to adequately address the BSE crisis and to provide workable programs for producers, thereby threatening not only the stability of the livestock sector but all those other sectors in Manitoba's economy that are so reliant on well-being; and (

e) the Government's fa ilure to recognize and encourage the important role private sector in- volvement has in growing Manitoba's economy; and (

f) the Government's failure to acknowledge that balanced budgets have only been achieved through significant raids of Manitoba Hydro and the Fiscal Stabilization Fund; and (

g) the Government's failure to initiate a review of health care regionalization; and (

h) the Government's failure to develop a long- term economic and taxation strategy to address Manitoba's uncompetitive personal and business tax levels; and (

i) the Government's failure to provide a strategy ensuring two thirds of all nursing positions in Manitoba are full time by the spring of 2004 as previously committed; and (

j) the Government's failure to follow through on their commitment to ensure access to education for special needs students. AND HAS THEREBY lost the trust and con- idence of the people of Manitoba and this House. This amendment is in order. Hon. Steve Ashton (Minister of Water Stewardship): It is a great pleasure to rise again to speak to another Throne Speech.

I always consider this to be one of the great opportunities we have in this Legislature, to discuss our collective vision for this province, certainly our partisan vision, our vision as parties and cau- cuses and, quite frankly, our constituents' and our personal visions as well. Before I do it, I want to put on the record that I want to thank the people of the Thompson constituency for once again giving me the honour to represent them in the Manitoba Legislature.

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 65 I was asked about my majority in the House. I want to put on the record that when I was first elected by a majority of 72 votes, I felt fully qualified to speak for the people of the Thomp- son constituency. Notwithstanding the fact that it was slightly higher in the last election, I feel the same kind of strength coming from that man- date. I particularly want to thank each and every community in my constituency. I want to thank Wabowden, I want to thank Nelson House, Split Lake, York Landing. I wa nt to thank Ilford. I want to thank Thompson itself.

I want to thank each and every community in Thompson con- stituency, Thicket Portage, Pikwitonei, because I will represent each and every one of those communities every day that I have the honour to be a member of the Manitoba Legislature. I must admit too that I consider it to be quite fortunate that I am following the comments of the Leader of the Offi cial Opposition (Mr. Murray), because I really believe that you can truly tell a lot about the results of an election, not so much by the speeches of the victorious caucus. You know, usually victorious caucuses have a certain optimistic edge to their comments.

It is not hard to be optimistic when you have been re-elected, in this case with an increased majority, in our case, with members of the Legislature in constituencies that we have never represented before. You can also judge a lot by the comments of the parties that have had less success. I have had opportunity to be on both sides. I have been in the first party in standings, the second party, and I have been in the third party as well too, so some of us have that, I do not know if you would call it a luxury, but we have been through that experience.

I have always believed that one thing you can say about the people of this province, anywhere with a democracy, the people are always right. When you are not fortunate to be elected to the Legislature or to government, the bottom line is the people are right. What I would have expected from the Leader of the Opposition is some recognition of that. I want to put it in context. What I heard was the equivalent of somebody getting hit by a semi-trailer in an electoral sense and then getting themselves up, brushing themselves off and pretending nothing happened. They got defeated in the last election.

I say this because the Leader of the Opposition's speech was really–I wish I was Minister of Conservation, because I have never seen so much recycling in my life. He recycled each and every item of the election campaign despite the fact that on June 3 the people of Manitoba spoke.

I did not hear a single word, I did not hear one word from the member of the Opposition that recognized that yes, the people were right and that maybe, just maybe, the Conservative Party in this province misread the people of this province, that maybe, just maybe, their message, their vision, or, I might suggest, lack of vision just did not find the kind of support that they trad itionally found, because even for their results, if you look at where they are at, they slipped from where they were in the 1999 election.

I am a great believer that, once the ballots were in the election ballot booth and they had been cast and counted, you move on. I always say that you have to earn the support of the people of this province, the people of your constituency each and every day that you are in the Legislature, but, I tell you, there is a party in this House that just simply has not gotten it. * (15:40) Now, I sort of was wondering if maybe after the election we might have seen some reaching out. I must admit, Mr. Speaker, in the election it was not that hard in northern Manitoba to be an NDP candidate.

I mean, let us be up front here. After 11 years of neglect things were happening in northern Manitoba, but you know– [inter- jection] I am not a yellow-dog candidate, from a member from a seat that may have that attitude about his own constituency. I was elected by 72 votes. I defeated a Tory cabinet minister when I was first elected. The Conservatives used to have a significant amount of support in northern Manitoba, but we had in this election the Opposition party, the would-be premier, the Leader of the Opposition, he came out against the University College of the North. I thought, strike one.

We have been working here for 15 years to get University College of the North in place, and thanks to the hard work of many people throughout the years and the Minister of Advanced Education (Ms.

66 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 McGifford), we will in this session of the Manitoba Legislature have

an act bringing in the University College of the North. The Leader of the Opposition is still talking about it. He still has not gotten it, Mr. Speaker. There was an Aboriginal debate. Many of my constituents are Aboriginal people. There are Aboriginal people throughout this province, close to 140 000-150 000 people. Did the Leader of the Opposition even show up at the Aborig- inal debate? No. I mean, talk about showing a complete lack of concern.

It got even better, because I have never seen an election in which the Leader of the Oppo- sition has not campaigned in every region of this province, but I tell you, even Gary Filmon came to Thompson. He knocked on doors in 1999. That actually helped us, but that is another story. In fact, I remember what happened. I talked to a long-time Conservative supporter, ran into him on the street when he was knocking on doors on Partridge Crescent actually in Thompson and Westwood. He came up to him and he said, Mr. Filmon, you get elected and you will sell off Manitoba Hydro.

He said, well, we have no plans to sell off Manitoba Hydro. This former Conservative supporter, lifelong supporter, said to Gary Filmon, the then-premier, that is exactly what you said about MTS, exactly. I do not trust you. Now, at least the Leader of the Opposition or the Premier in those days took the time, they even had a northern platform. By the way, part of the northern platform was to take money from Manitoba Hydro in the form of dividends to put into northern infrastru cture. I wonder what happened to that platform, but the Leader of the Opposition did not even show up in the North once.

I do not know how far north he got, but, you know, I sort of figured it out, he probably still had one of those old Highways maps, you know, the one that did not include a good chunk of northern Manitoba. We changed that. Okay, I was the minister when we did it, but we changed it as the Government. If you look at it, I think this leader of the Opposition is going back to 1912. I mean, we have been part of Manitoba in northern Mani- toba since 1912, except when it comes to the Leader of the Opposition we are not Manitobans.

I say the day in which someone who wants to be premier does not even show up in northern Manitoba in an election campaign is shameful. Let us be up front with this. I thought, Mr. Speaker, that the Leader of the Opposition, after the election and after the record results that came in from across the province, because we were government, took a different approach. As ministers, as MLAs for four years we have been travelling north, south, east and west. We have acted on concerns affecting all areas of the province. I thought maybe, just maybe, he would have gotten the message.

What was one of the things that he came out with recently? Attacking our Government for spending too much money on transportation in northern Manitoba, back to the same divide-and- conquer approach of the election. Yes, I was Minister of Transportation and Government Services. So was the Me mber for Brandon West (Mr. Smith). I want to put on the record that just in case members opposite have not noticed, we did a lot throughout this province. I was never more proud than when I stood side by side with the Member for La Verendrye (Mr.

Lemieux), the current, the new Minister of Transportation and Government Services, to open the four-laning of Highway 59. In 11 years of Tory government it did not happen. It took an NDP government to make that project the largest single highway construction project anywhere in Manitoba. It was not in northern Manitoba, it was in southern Manitoba. I could go on, Mr. Speaker. I enjoyed the comments earlier about Winkler, because the member representing that seat should maybe drive on the main street in Winkler. Who paved it? The NDP paved it. Where? In northern Mani- toba? No, in southern Manitoba.

The Member for Minnedosa (Mrs. Rowat), she can point at the fact that one of the major projects we announced, the biggest project, when we increased the funding for highways in this province, was to bring year-round access, RTAC access, to the highway into Rivers, Manitoba, kept that community alive. I want to

November 24, 2003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 67 say it is because we as a government spent four years with a map that included all of northern Manitoba, literally and figuratively. That is why we saw unprecedented support for this party throughout the province and why those members opposite clearly do not get it. Mr. Speaker, the Leader of the Opposition, I am not sure, quite frankly, which planet he is coming from. He talked in the Throne Speech amendment about economic performance. Now, what more do you need? Low unemployment. We have turned around the out-migration. We have record in-migration.

In fact, this year will be the best year in 10 y ears in this province for immigration. Mr. Rob Altemeyer, Acting Speaker, in the Chair We have seen incredible performance in terms of our economy. I hate to rub this in a bit here, but I remember if I wanted to start a conversation four or five years ago, very easy, anywhere in the province, particularly in Win- nipeg, you would ask people what their houses were worth. What is your house worth? The major single investment of any family that is fortunate enough to own a home is their home. It had dropped 10, 20, 30 percent.

It did not matter whether you were in Lindenwoods or if you were in the North End of Winnipeg, in The Maples. It did not matter where you went, there was a sense of doom and gloom. I have never seen such a hot real-estate market. I have never seen such confidence in our economy. People are voting with the prices they are paying for their houses. Employers are voting in terms of record-low unemployment. We are now getting employers coming to us saying we have a shortage of labour. That is why training is an important part of our strategy and why immigration is an important part of our strategy.

We have taken major initiatives in both areas. They still do not get it. I heard the Leader of the Opposition, he was even getting back into the Kyoto debate. The Kyoto debate? Dare I say that after these record temperatures this year when we have had the second-highest number of forest fire starts in Ma nitoba history, when we are dealing with exactly what global warming predicts in terms of increased drought and increased climate instability, has it not dawned on the member opposite that maybe climate change is real and maybe we have to do something about it before it is too late?

I should expect nothing less, because they are continuing on the same path. They still think the solution to building this province is the same kind of rhetoric we heard from the Leader of the Opposition just moments ago. Of course, he had to attack labour in here somewhere. They still have not understood that the key to building Manitoba is to build partnerships. Yes, include labour, and, yes, include business. We have been doing that. In this last election they brought out the most regressive labour platform I have ever seen. They want what is called right to work. It is not right to work.

It is a direct attack on democracy, which is once people have voted, in this case, people have the right to make a decision whether to be represented by a union, that then in that place that is put into place. That is nothing I think more or less than most people in this province would expect, but, no. Theirs is a world of divide and conquer, divide and conquer regionally. Their map does not include northern Manitoba. Divide and conquer in terms of our ethnocultural communities. They cut out Aboriginal people when they were in govern- ment.

We saw when the Leader of the Oppo- sition did not even show up at the Aboriginal debate. There are many other Manitobans who do not fall into the Tory definition of what their vision for Manitoba is. I thought what really struck me the most was a phrase the Leader of the Opposition used when he said he would tear apart the tax system.

I believe if that government was in power with their extreme agenda they would tear apart the social and economic fabric of this province. * (15:50) I do not know if they have woken up to the reality but they should look at what happened to our neighbouring province of Saskatchewan, because we saw there a party, they had to change their name from Tories to the Saskatchewan Party when most of their caucus ended up in jail.

68 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA November 24, 2003 The Saskatchewan Party ran on the same basic failed, outdated agenda. I noticed the Leader of the Opposition was saying there are two premiers on education doing the same thing. Yes, two re-elected pre- miers, two re-elected NDP governments in Manitoba and Saskatchewan that said the truth to the people of both those provinces, and that is that the unaffordable and irresponsible platform of tax cuts that cannot be implemented will only be followed by broken promises and destruction of social services, health services and our social and economic fabric.

I want to talk about what our real vision for this province should be. I think members oppo- site have failed. They have failed in terms of the election. They clearly have not learned from what has happened. I should not even say this really because the longer they do not learn from what has happened the longer it will take them to rebuild any level of confidence, not just in my own area but throughout Manitoba. I want to stress what I see and what our caucus sees ahead as the vision for this province. I want to start from a very basic premise. I mention it in terms of one issue that is very close to my heart.

I was very honoured for the last number of months to be Minister of Immi- gration, but we are an increasingly diverse popu- lation. We have the largest Aboriginal popu- lation anywhere in the country. We have people from throughout the world. We have more than a hundred languages spoken in this province, hundreds of ethno-cultural communities. That is a tremendous part of who we are and what we are. I look around our caucus and I see the face of Manitoba. I see representation in our caucus that is the face of this diverse province. That is part of our vision.

I look increasingly in a world in which in northern Manitoba now you can get on the Internet and you can access the entire world. We still have to move in terms of broadband for those communities that do not have it, but I see kids growing up in my communities that know what is going on at the four corners of the Earth. We are a plugged-in society. I do not think any- one anywhere in this province can be excluded from opportunities, particularly in terms of education and training, be cause that is the world they are seeing; that is a world they should be part of. That is a part of that vision.

I want to talk about the other part of it, too, which is the tremendous natural environment we have, the tremendous diversity of natural en- vironment. Where else can you go in a province, in this case a province equivalent to a state in some other countries, where you have everything from the Prairies to the tundra? We are probably best known internationally for the polar bears, but we have pretty well any kind of

Document details

Collection	Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	38-2-03
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	38th 2nd hansardpdf 03.pdf
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	a9f8f0f5cac887cbbe118a3e52eb2b500e18c147

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