CRC — 5 November 2020 (42nd Legislature, 1st Session)

CRC 2020-11-05

Quebec — Committees

La Secrétaire : Oui, Mme la

Présidente. M. Poulin (Beauce-Sud) dispose d'un droit de vote par

procuration au nom de Mme Blais

(Abitibi-Ouest); Mme Maccarone (Westmount—Saint-Louis), pour M. Kelley

(Jacques-Cartier).

Je souhaite donc la bienvenue au Dr Wells.

Cette présentation sera accompagnée, comme je vous disais, d'une interprétation

simultanée, de manière à faciliter nos échanges. Je vous rappelle,

Dr Wells, que vous disposez de

10 minutes pour votre exposé, après quoi nous allons procéder à la période

d'échange avec les membres de la commission. Je vous invite donc à

débuter votre exposé.

M. Wells

(Kristopher) : Thank

you. It's very nice to be able to speak with you today,

even remotely. Thank you for

the translation support. As mentioned, my name is Dr. Kristopher Wells,

I'm an associate professor in the Canada Research Chair for the Public

Understanding of Sexual and Gender Minority Youth at MacEwan University, in

Edmonton, Alberta. My career began as a kindergarten to Grade 12 classroom

teacher. I returned to graduate school to

learn how to better support LGBTQ youth in our schools, and today I am a

professor and serve as the co-editor for the

international Journal of LGBT Youth , which is one of the leading

research publications on sexual and gender minority youth. In my academic work,

I have consulted with governments and policy makers across Canada on conversion therapy legislation, policies and awareness, and

other important human rights

issues. I'm the author and collaborator on several important conversion therapy awareness resources, including Conversion

therapy in Canada , a guide for legislative action, which is a

recently published national report, with 15 endorsements that include

research background, legislative

guidance and suggestions, charter analysis, and features the

voices and experiences of Canadian survivors.

We have also created an

interactive online map which tracks the status of conversion therapy probation

laws in Canada at all levels of governments.

We have developed an academic consensus statement against conversion therapy.

It's signed by 120 Canadian academics, including 12 distinguished

research chairs, including several in Québec. We have also created an infographic, an info Web, an info

video to help build awareness about the harms of conversion therapy. And

all of the above resources that I mentioned are available on

noconversioncanada.ca. I just share that by way of

background to give you a sense of what has been happening in Canada in regards to stopping conversion

therapy and some of the resources and support materials that are available.

like to start by talking a little bit about what other jurisdictions are doing

across Canada. There is a strong and growing movement against conversion therapy at all

levels of government. Three provinces currently have a prohibition

legislation, which include Ontario, Prince Edward

Island, and Nova Scotia, and three other provinces

and territories are in various stages of debating

legislation, which include New Brunswick, the Yukon, and of course here, with

Bill 70, in Québec.

Manitoba does not have provincial legislation, but they do have a health policy

resolution. Currently, British Columbia,

Alberta, Saskatchewan, Nunavut, the Northwest Territories

and Newfoundland, and Labrador have no legislation in place. There are several municipalities,

particularly in Alberta, who also have very comprehensive bylaws and

policies against conversion therapy.

Legislation

makes an important value statement about the kinds of communities we seek to

support and create, and it serves as a powerful deterrent to these forms of

abuse and also provides access to justice for those impacted by conversion

therapy practices, which in the past have ranged from shock therapy, lobotomy,

chemical castration, to more modern methods

which frequently include gender coaching, regressive role-play, aversion

therapy, extreme fasting, behavior modification, quote-unquote correct

rape, and exorcism to cast out gay or demonic spirits.

The International

Rehabilitation Council for Torture Victims, which includes membership in

75 countries, issued a thematic report in 2020 that considers conversion

therapy to be a form of cruel, inhumane or degrading treatment, and, in some

cases, may amount to torture and a violation of human rights. Governments

around the world at all levels are taking bold and direct action against

conversion therapy, which is not therapy at all, but recognized forms of torture and abuse that can cause

significant and lifelong harm, and even death. The harms of so-called

conversion therapy practices are well-documented, and it is rightly classified

as a serious form of psychological abuse.

Now, in regards to Bill 70

specifically, it has the opportunity to be the most comprehensive legislation

in Canada passed at the provincial or

territorial level to date. The legislative approach presented by Bill 70

is a good one, and it moves beyond

the sole focus on health regulation and only the protection of minors. So, I

certainly congratulate the Government

on demonstrating such strong leadership on such important human rights work. We

know that strong legislation includes and protects all persons,

including children, adults and vulnerable populations. It also prohibits more

groups, regardless if they are professional, business, religious faith,

cultural or community organizations, from practicing or promoting conversion therapy efforts.

Conversion...

Sorry. Excuse me. Comprehensive legislation eliminates any loopholes or

provides for no exemptions and recognizes there is no such thing as consent when it comes to

conversion therapy, which, by its very nature, is based in fraudulent

information, false and non-substantiated promises, and is premised in deceptive

in-course practices. Because of the significant harm and lack of evidence of

effectiveness or efficacy, notions of so-called informed consent are not a reasonable justification for

conversion therapy or what is also known as sexual orientation or gender

identity expression change efforts. Conversion therapy can never be understood

to be in the best interest of any person, and therefore it is entirely

reasonable and justifiable to prohibit its practice on any person, consensual

or otherwise. Conversion therapy is always unethical, unprofessional, and

abusive. It is perhaps best said by some of its strongest and most harden

proponents, who have since recanted their views about conversion therapy, that

conversion therapy is nothing more than, quote-unquote, a dangerous lie.

Efforts should be made not to

change people, rather, attention should be focused on fixing the broken social

context that demonizes and discriminates against LGBTQ people and seeks to

treat them as less than human or unworthy of equal human rights. It is

heteronormativity, homophobia and transphobia that are the problems in need of repair, not simply being an LGBTQ person or

having same sex desires or attractions. Mandatory education, training

and establishing professional competencies on LGBTQ issues for all individuals

who work with children, youth and vulnerable populations is of paramount importance. Services and supports need to be

affirmative of the diversity of sexual and gender differences as normal,

healthy, and valued aspects of Québec society.

Now, to conclude, I would just

like to speak to a few ways to improve Bill 70 to close some of the

current gaps in the legislation. First, the need to refine... definition.

Conversion therapy is not therapy at all but a fraudulent and unscientific form

of abuse. It's not one practice but a set of practices deeply rooted in an

anti-LGBTQ ideology. Legislative provisions must be loud, that clearly support

nonjudgmental, affirmative, and accepting programs, treatments or services

which support gender affirmative care and positive identity development, which

are objective, neutral, and nonjudgmental to outcome. Open and nonjudgmental

conversations are not conversion therapy and are important in identity developments and exploration. No legislation

should seek to restrict these kinds of open conversations nor access to affirming treatment or care. For

example, evidence informed guidelines and standards of care are

well-established for providing appropriate support to transgender and

nonbinary youth and their families.

Legislation should also prevent

any form of advertising of or referral to conversion therapy services. For example, what about online services that are not

based in Québec, but target Québec residents. Third party referral cannot absolve

someone from liability of promoting or supporting known forms of abuse. The

legislation could also prohibit the removal

of a person from the province for purposes of conversion therapy. A strong

probation in Québec might not

prevent access but simply move it beyond jurisdictional purview.

I would also encourage the

legislation to allow for the provincial revocation of tax-exempt status for

individuals or organizations that practice or promote conversion therapy. This

may be one of the strongest ways to eradicate conversion therapy by removing

the ability to continue to receive provincial tax benefits for income or

donations received.

important question to ask is how Bill 70 will be enforced, especially for

vulnerable young people who risk being outed to file a complaint, or who may not

have support of a parent or guardian to do so. Will a third-party complaint be

allowed? What supports and training will be made available for investigation or

prosecution? It is also

important...

La Présidente (Mme Lecours, Les

Plaines) : Dr Wells? Vous me voyez?

M. Wells (Kristopher) : I'll finish my point and wrap up.

La Présidente

(Mme Lecours, Les Plaines) : Je vais vous laisser terminer, après

ça, on va commencer l'échange. Mais vous pouvez terminer quelques secondes

encore. Allez-y.

M. Wells

(Kristopher) : Thank you. I would just like to

highlight that establishing an education and compensation fund for survivors to

access counseling and support and to access legal services to file a complaint

is important. Conversion therapy targets an

extremely vulnerable segment of society, and it may take years for the damage

done to surface, for example, in the case of post-traumatic stress or the

ability to leave an abusive situation. There should not be any statute of

limitations to seek redress or support, regardless if conversion therapy

practices were criminal in nature or otherwise.

will stop there and certainly welcome and entertain questions. Thank you for the opportunity to share a few

initial thoughts with you.

La Présidente (Mme Lecours, Les Plaines) : Merci beaucoup, Dr Wells, pour votre exposé. Nous entamons maintenant

la période d'échange avec les membres. Et nous allons commencer avec M. le ministre, et vous disposez de 15 min 45 s.

M. Jolin-Barrette : Merci, Mme

la Présidente. Dr Wells, bonjour.

Merci d'être présent aujourd'hui et de témoigner devant la Commission des

relations avec les citoyens, c'est grandement apprécié.

D'entrée de jeu, vous avez dit, dans votre

témoignage, que la législation... le projet

de loi que nous proposons,

c'est le projet de loi le plus avancé parmi les juridictions canadiennes, c'est

bien ça?

M. Wells

(Kristopher) : Yes. For provinces and

territories, it is an outstanding example, and we hope it will set a new bar and standard for others to follow.

There is also comprehensive legislation at some municipalities in Canada.

M. Jolin-Barrette :

O.K. Vous nous invitez à bonifier notre projet de loi que nous avons présenté,

notamment... Et ça, j'aimerais ça vous entendre, là, vous avez dit... Vous avez

parlé de la question de thérapie de conversion en disant : Bon, ça ne

constitue pas une thérapie. Et là, a

Document details

Collection	Quebec — Committees
Citation	CRC 2020-11-05
Type	committee
Volume / chapter	fr travaux parlementaires commissions crc 42 1 journal debats CRC 201105.html
Language	en
Format	html
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	ac3948a3169eabcecad270a3418ae5fdb2181df5

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