Manitoba Hansard — 5 December 2023 (Sitting 12B, 43rd Legislature, 1st Session)

43-1-12b

Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)

First Session – Forty-Third Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable Tom Lindsey Speaker Vol. LXXVIII No. 12B - 1:30 p.m., Tuesday, December 5, 2023 ISSN 0542-5492

MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Forty-Third Legislature Member Constituency Political Affiliation ALTOMARE, Nello, Hon. Transcona NDP ASAGWARA, Uzoma, Hon. Union Station NDP BALCAEN, Wayne Brandon West PC BEREZA, Jeff Portage la Prairie PC BLASHKO, Tyler Lagimodière NDP BRAR, Diljeet Burrows NDP BUSHIE, Ian, Hon. Keewatinook NDP BYRAM, Jodie Agassiz PC CABLE, Renée, Hon. Southdale NDP CHEN, Jennifer Fort Richmond NDP COOK, Kathleen Roblin PC CROSS, Billie Seine River NDP DELA CRUZ, Jelynn Radisson NDP DEVGAN, JD McPhillips NDP EWASKO, Wayne Lac du Bonnet PC FONTAINE, Nahanni, Hon. St.

Johns NDP GOERTZEN, Kelvin Steinbach PC GUENTER, Josh Borderland PC HIEBERT, Carrie Morden-Winkler PC JACKSON, Grant Spruce Woods PC JOHNSON, Derek Interlake-Gimli PC KENNEDY, Nellie Assiniboia NDP KHAN, Obby Fort Whyte PC KINEW, Wab, Hon. Fort Rouge NDP KING, Trevor Lakeside PC KOSTYSHYN, Ron, Hon. Dauphin NDP LAGASSÉ, Bob Dawson Trail PC LAMOUREUX, Cindy Tyndall Park Lib. LATHLIN, Amanda The Pas-Kameesak NDP LINDSEY, Tom, Hon. Flin Flon NDP LOISELLE, Robert St. Boniface NDP MALOWAY, Jim Elmwood NDP MARCELINO, Malaya, Hon. Notre Dame NDP MOROZ, Mike River Heights NDP MOSES, Jamie, Hon. St.

Vital NDP MOYES, Mike Riel NDP NARTH, Konrad La Vérendrye PC NAYLOR, Lisa, Hon. Wolseley NDP NESBITT, Greg Riding Mountain PC OXENHAM, Logan Kirkfield Park NDP PANKRATZ, David Waverley NDP PERCHOTTE, Richard Selkirk PC PIWNIUK, Doyle Turtle Mountain PC REDHEAD, Eric Thompson NDP SALA, Adrien, Hon. St. James NDP SANDHU, Mintu The Maples NDP SCHMIDT, Tracy, Hon. Rossmere NDP SCHOTT, Rachelle Kildonan-River East NDP SCHULER, Ron Springfield-Ritchot PC SIMARD, Glen, Hon. Brandon East NDP SMITH, Bernadette, Hon.

Point Douglas NDP STEFANSON, Heather Tuxedo PC STONE, Lauren Midland PC WASYLIW, Mark Fort Garry NDP WHARTON, Jeff Red River North PC WIEBE, Matt, Hon. Concordia NDP WOWCHUK, Rick Swan River PC

363 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Tuesday, December 5, 2023 The House met at 1:30 p.m. The Speaker: Good afternoon. Please be seated. ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS INTRODUCTION OF BILLS Bill 6–The Manitoba Assistance Amendment Act The Speaker: The hon ourable official gov ernment Minister of Families. Hon. Nahanni Fontaine (Minister of Families): I move, seconded by the member for –the Minister for Labour and Immigration, that Bill 6, The Manitoba Assistance Amendment Act, be now read a first time. Motion presented.

MLA Fontaine: Many Manitobans enrolled on Employment and Income Assist ance, or EIA, are required to partici pate in em ployment en hancement measures. These measures can range from em ployment or vocational training and treatment, simply engaging in supportative planning with their case worker. Bill 6 would ensure that it is considered whether adult education is the most ap propriate employment enhancement measure when deter mining how program requirements will be fulfilled.

While this Bill 6 will not be–substantively change current practice, it will be legally entrenched into the consideration of adult edu cation in the process of determining how an EIA recipient will meet program expectations. I am pleased to present this bill to the House for consideration. The Speaker: Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion? [Agreed] COMMITTEE REPORTS Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development Second Report MLA Billie Cross (Chairperson): Honourable Speaker, I wish to present the second report of the Standing Com mittee on Social and Economic Development. Clerk (Mr.

Rick Yarish): Your Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development– Some Honourable Members: Dispense. The Speaker: Dispense. Your Standing Committee on Social and Economic Development presents the following as its Second Report. Meetings Your Committee met on December 4, 2023 at 6:00 p.m. in Room 255 of the Legislative Building. Matters under Consideration • Bill (No. 2) – The Louis Riel Act /

Loi sur Louis Riel • Bill (No. 4) – The Employment Standards Code Amendment and

Interpretation Amendment Act (Orange Shirt Day) / Loi modifiant le Code des normes d 'emploi et la Loi d 'interprétation (Journée du chandail orange) Committee Membership • Hon. Min. C ABLE • MLA CROSS • Mr. EWASKO • Hon. Mr. KINEW • MLA LOISELLE • Mr. NARTH Your Committee elected MLA CROSS as the Chairperson. Your Committee elected MLA LOISELLE as the Vice-Chairperson. Your Committee elected MLA REDHEAD as the Vice-Chairperson. Substitutions received during committee proceedings: • Hon Min. BUSHIE for Hon. Min. CABLE • MLA REDHEAD for MLA LOISELLE Non-Committee Members Speaking on Record • Ms. LAMOUREUX

364 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 Public Presentations Your Committee heard the following three presentations on Bill (No. 2) – The Louis Riel Act /

Loi sur Louis Riel: Joël Tétrault, Union Nationale Métisse Saint -Joseph du Manitoba Anita Campbell, Infinity Women Secretariat David Chartrand, Manitoba Métis Federation Bills Considered and Reported • Bill (No. 2) – The Louis Riel Act /

Loi sur Louis Riel • Bill (No. 4) – The Employment Standards Code Amendment and

Interpretation Amendment Act (Orange Shirt Day) / Loi modifiant le Code des normes d 'emploi et la Loi d 'interprétation (Journée du chandail orange) Your Committee agreed to report these Bills without amendment. The Speaker: The–it has been moved by the honour- able member for Seine River–sorry. The honourable member for Seine River. MLA Cross: Honourable Speaker, I move, seconded by the honour able member for St. Boniface (MLA Loiselle), that the report of the com mittee be received. Motion agreed to. TABLING OF REPORTS Hon.

Nahanni Fontaine (Minister responsible for Accessibility): Honourable Speaker, I am pleased to table the Report of the Second Review of The Accessibility for Manitobans Act annual report 2022-2023. The Speaker: I have a report to table as well. In accordance with

section 4 of the Members ' Salaries, Allowances and Retirement Plans Disclosure Regulation, I am pleased to table the members' annual Report of Amounts Claimed and Paid respecting 2022-2023 fiscal year. No other reports? MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS The Speaker: I would indicate that the 90 minutes ' required notice prior to routine proceedings was provided in accordance with rule 27(2). International Volunteer Day Hon.

Nahanni Fontaine (Minister of Families): Today, December 5th, marks International Volunteer Day, a day to acknowledge the extraordinary work of volunteers worldwide who dedicate themselves to supporting and advancing the causes, organizations and people that they believe in. Today, we especially recognize the many Manitobans whose generosity led them to give back to their communities in so many amazing ways. The first International Volunteer Day was held in 1985 to honour everyone 's ability to participate in positive change making.

One does not have to look hard to see how volunteers advance community health initiatives, combat food insecurity and create safe spaces and belonging among those who are often pushed to the margins of society. The NGOs and community resource organizations on which many Manitobans rely would not exist if it wasn 't for the tremendous efforts of Manitoba volunteers. This year 's International ' volunday'–Volunteer Day theme is The Power of Collective Action: If Everyone Did, which encourages everyone to envision the type of world we might live in if everyone had the capacity to volunteer.

What kind of power for collective action could we mobilize if everyone found a way to dedicate themselves to advancing causes that matter most to them? We sometimes take for granted the movements towards equa lity and civil liberties originated and sustained by volunteers. They are people who stood up in the face of injustice and put in hard work to see their vision for society, for all of us, become reality. I particularly want to highlight the important work of BIPOC, 2SLGBTQ two– Q–and disability communities across the province who work to break down barriers and foster greater inclusion for all Manitobans.

I encourage my fellow members in this Chamber and Manitobans everywhere to reflect today on the important work of volunteers in your communities whose actions often go unrecognized and to imagine the ways we as Manitobans can show more appre - ciation and show more support for their important contributions across our beautiful province. Miigwech. Mrs. Lauren Stone (Midland): Honourable Speaker, I'm pleased to rise in the–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Order.

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 365 The honourable member for Midland. Mrs. Stone: Honourable Speaker, I'm pleased to rise in the House today to acknowledge and address International Volunteer Day, which takes place annually today and allows us to celebrate the work of volunteers at every level, whether it be local, regional, national and across the world, and truly acknowledge the fantastic contributions that they make to o ur societies.

Today we shine a light on all those who have – are currently volunteering, as we on this side of the Chamber recognize the value of volunteerism in every aspect of our world. But I want to take a moment today to speak on this idea as it relate s to our province of Manitoba, which has such a vibrant, strong and longstanding history of volunteerism. I look at my own constituency of Midland, made up of very small–many small communities, and we are reliant on the support of volunteers within our community.

Whether it be our volunteer fire de part- ments–which we had the opportunity to recognize this morning with the member from Waverley's bill–PACs at schools, daycare boards, volunteer coaches and community centres, the list can go on and on. * (13:40) But I also want to consider some thing that happened within my own lifetime and some thing that was important with my family. And I think of the 1997 Red River flood, in which we desperately needed people to help assist in building dikes to protect properties. My husband' s family was dis - placed. Their farmland was being flooded.

And Manitobans arose to the challenge, with volunteers from across the province working fast and efficiently to mitigate the harmful effects of one of the most damaging floods in our history I also think, today, of all those that are currently volunteering at Harvest Manitoba to help distribute food to more than 380 food banks and agencies in every corner of our province. This is particularly important to us today , as we know that food bank usage in recent months has seen a drastic increase. However, those volunteers contribute toward ensuring that food can be put on the table for people in this province.

Honourable Speaker, I could speak all day about the many examples of Manitobans volunteering from every walk of life who have shown their willingness to help others. In closing, I am thankful for the opportunity to speak today to this important day and recognize the willingness from all volunteers who selflessly use their skills, looking beyond their own circumstances and helping with the needs of others. Each of these individuals, groups and agencies make such immense contributions, and we take today to thank them, celebrate and pay tribute to their paramount role in helping people.

I encourage all Manitobans to consider volunteering, and thank you for the opportunity today to speak on behalf of this Chamber of the House to address this important topic and this important day. Thank you, Honourable Speaker. MLA Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): Honour- able Speaker, I seek leave to respond to the minister's statement. The Speaker: Does the member have leave? [Agreed] MLA Lamoureux: I am thrilled to rise to speak to International Volunteer Day. This year 's t heme– recognizing the power of collective action: if everyone did it. We know that volunteering is straight-up good for us.

It reduces stress. It regulates emotions. It saves resources. And time is valuable, Honourable Speaker. Volunteering often brings people together. I 'm sure all of my colleagues can attest to this with their campaigns. It promotes personal growth, it strengthens our com munity and it challenges us. Volunteering is a real example of how strong a village can be. One of my favourite quotes is to find yourself in the service of others and, Honourable Speaker, volunteering is a terrific way to do this.

Now, I would be remissed if I didn 't take a moment to mention the many incredible volunteers who have played, and continue to play, such important roles in my life. As you can imagine, Honourable Speaker, I wear many hats. My No. 1 priority will always be my constituents. But in addition to my MLA-for-Tyndall- Park hat, I have a Manitoba-Liberal-leader hat as well as a legislative hat, especially while we 're here in session. All of these responsibilities, Honourable Speaker, are only achievable because of my team, who truly are

366 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 a force to be reckoned with. And that 's why I want to use this opportunity to thank all of my volunteers, who wor k tirelessly, not only during the campaign, but even now, for your efforts with legislative communications, advice, constituency events and party events and board meetings. I wouldn't be standing here if it wasn 't for all of you. Thank you. Introduction of Guests The Speaker: At this point in time, I 'd like to draw attention to guests in the gallery. We have, from Walter Whyte School, 10 grade 9 students under direction of Bryan Ryz.

They're from the constituency of Lac du Bonnet. Also in the public gallery, I 'd like to draw the attention of all hon ourable members to the public gallery where we have with us today guests of the member for St. Johns (MLA Fontaine), Luba and Bill Krosney. On behalf of all honour able members, we welcome you here today. Further, I would like to draw the attention of all honourable members to the public gallery where we have with us today guests of the member from Union Station: their mother, Doris Asagwara, and Pastor Solomon and members of the Great Door Bible Church.

On behalf of all honour able members, we welcome you here today. MEMBERS' STATEMENTS John Morrissette Hon. Bernadette Smith (Minister of Housing, Addictions and Homelessness ): Today, I rise to honour the late John Morrissette. We are joined tod ay by John 's daughter, Jade Morrissette, and two sons, Jewles and Jean- Michael, as well as members from the Fearless R2W family. Thank you all for joining us here today as we honour your dad and friend. John was and will always be a huge part of the North End community. An important part of John' s life was an organization called Fearless R2W.

Fearless R2W supports our families who are navigating the child -welfare system and searching for community-centred and culturally appropriate supports. John was influential in transitioning our Fearless R2W from a grassroots group to an organization. John tirelessly worked to strengthen the sustainability of the organization by developing long-term planning and ensuring sus tainable–stabilization of services. He did all of this while pursuing education and reunifying with his own children through the child- welfare system.

While working with Fearless R2W, John received his grade 12 from Urban Circle Training circle, and after graduating, he asked to be on the board of directors. Fearless R2W and the Urban Circle are estab - lishing an annual scholarship in John' s name for student parents who are pursuing higher education. John also worked at the North End Community Renewal Corporation and recently was working on a community advocacy certificate from the University of Winnipeg. John represents the endless love and strength in the North End com munity.

John will forever be remembered for his many contributions to the North End community and for the betterment of our province. He was a compassionate and dedicated community member and will be –forever be admired and loved by our community; his legacy will remain with us forever. Please join me in thanking John' s family and friends who are here with us in the gallery. Rest in power, John. The Speaker: The honourable Minister of Housing, Addictions and Homelessness. Ms. Smith: I ask that the members that are in the gallery names be added to Hansard. The Speaker: They will be added.

Family: Jade Morrissette, daughter; Jean -Michael Morrissette and Jewles Morrissette, sons Friends: Donald Allen Jolly, Mary Burton, Mel Critch, Kyrra Rudolph, Haven Stumpf, Ayla Wonzy The Speaker: Further member statements? The hon ourable member for Midland –no, Morden-Winkler. Coleen Voth and Colleen Mourant Mrs. Carrie Hiebert (Morden-Winkler): Honourable Speaker, today I have the pleasure to acknowledge two amazing women that have

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 367 represented my constituency of Morden-Winkler and the province of Manitoba through Special Olympics. I am honoured to welcome Coleen Voth and Colleen Mourant today as they are seated in the gallery. Special Olympics is an organization with an aim of achieving great recognition and social participation of people with intellectual disabilities. They strive to enrich individuals' lives through love of sport. With the help of amazing volunteers, Special Olympics has created a supportive, rewarding and inclusive space, teaching the values of overcoming challenges.

I have also had the opportunity to be a volunteer coach for our local Special Olympics snowshoe team. It 's a fun group of athletes and an amazing experience. This past June, Coleen Voth travelled and competed in the Special Olympics World Games in Berlin, Germany. Coleen represented Manitoba o n Team Canada in the sport of 10 -pin bowling. With her–with the help of her coach, Chris Sumner, Coleen was one of the eight Manitobans selected for Team Canada. With the goal of coming home with a medal, Coleen spent countless of –hours practising and training with her coach.

Through hard work and a positive spirit, Coleen won a silver medal in women's singles with an impressive bowling score of 405. Also, this past summer, Special Olympics Manitoba hosted an awards ceremony here in Winnipeg, where Winkle r's very own Colleen Mourant was awarded the prestigious title of Athlete of the Year. Colleen's involvement in Special Olympics spans more than a decade, participating in a handful of sports including track and field, basketball, bowling, snowshoeing and bocce. * (13:50) Manitoba Special Olympics chose Colleen because of her dedication to her sport, her teammates and her coaches.

Her positive attitude, kindness, perseverance and ability to lead makes her the perfect individual to represent the communit y as Athlete of the Year. In conclusion, on behalf of the Morden- Winkler constituency and all of us here in the Chamber, we would like to congratulate you both on your achievement and your contributions to inclusive sports in Manitoba. John Hindle Hon. Jamie Moses (Minister of Economic Development, Investment, Trade and Natural Resources): Today, I recognize John Hindle, the president of the St. Vital Museum and historical society and their entire team.

Honourable Speaker, l ocated within St. Vital fire hall at 600 St. Mary's Rd., the museum shares historical narratives about influential individuals, significant places and pivotal moments in St. Vital's rich history. That rich history, which includes the fact that my wife's great -grand uncle, Art Mart in, was the first captain at the St. Vital fire hall, and a fact that I was proud to share with my son when we visited the fire hall this past September for their annual BBQ. Now, John Hindle became president earlier this year following the passing of long-time president Bob Holliday.

Bob Holliday was a driving force behind the museum for many years. And I was proud to stand with Bob as he received the Queen's platinum jubilee medal in this very building last December. Now, new president, John Hindle, who is with us here in the gallery today, grew up in St. Vital and is an alumnus of Dakota Collegiate. His passion for baseball materialized into the creation of Home Run Sports, a flourishing national company. In 1994, John made history as the first general manager of the Winnipeg Goldeyes Baseball Club, achieving attendance records during his eight-season tenure.

Inducted into Manitoba Baseball Hall of Fame in 2004, John is also a distinguished author, earning acclaim for his work, including the award- winning book Jackrabbits in the Outfield. I invite all Manitobans to visit the St. Vital Museum, on–open on Saturdays from 10 a.m. to 4 p.m., to take a look at the amazing artifacts that they have–having been collected and tell the story of St. Vital. So I invite all members today to join me in celebrating John Hindle and the entire St. Vital Museum and historical society team for all the wonderful work they do to enrich our St. Vital community. Thank you.

368 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 The Speaker: The honourable Minister of Economic Development, Invest ment, Trade and Natural Resources. Mr. Moses: Honourable Speaker, I ask that my guests' names be included in Hansard. The Speaker: Names will be included. Cameron Dempster, Sharon Golin, Bev Hindle, John Hindle, Kerry Pedrick, Nancy McQuade The Bridge Mr. Kelvin Goertzen (Steinbach): Honourable Speaker, for Steinbach Community Outreach, the dream of building a low-income housing for those in need in Steinbach and the southeast seemed just that, a dream.

But in November of 2021, a $1.3-million grant from Manitoba Housing helped kick-start what would soon become known as The Bridge, a 24- suite, three-story apartment building which provides low-income individuals with an affordable rental option in Steinbach. Irene Kroeker, execut ive director of Steinbach Community Outreach, wondered if this would ever truly happen, but with the completion of the building on November 30, the dream became a reality.

In addi- tion to the provincial grant, more than an additional million dollars was ra ised in private donations from local businesses and community members who want to ensure that no community resident is left behind. At the official opening ceremony, I was truly inspired to see the number of people who had given financially to this very i mportant endeavour, simply because they care about people who they may never know or ever meet. In parti cular, I want to mention Reg Penner, formerly of Penner Farm Service, who took on the role of raising 'munds'–raising money privately for this important project.

Reg retired from business in 2020 and dedicated his time to helping people from around the world and at home. He passionately raised money for The Bridge so that those in need could find a home. Sadly, Reg passed away from cancer earlier thi s year, and while he didn 't see the opening of The Bridge, his wife Ingrid was presented with a plaque with Reg's picture that will have a prominent place at The Bridge as a reminder of his contribution to the project and that a caring community cares for those around them.

Honourable Speaker, I want to commend all those involved with Steinbach Community Outreach for filling the gap, for building The Bridge. Their efforts speak to the love and compassion that strong com - munities have for their neighbours a nd demonstrate the heart of which we all have as Manitobans. West Broadway Shooting Hon. Lisa Naylor (Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure): Honourable Speaker, I rise today with a heavy heart. On Saturday, November 26, five people were shot i nside a home in the West Broadway neighbourhood of the Wolseley con - stituency. Four victims have died.

Their names are Crystal Shannon Beardy, Stephanie Amanda Beardy, Melelek Leseri Lesikel and Dylan Maxwell Lavallee. A fifth victim remains in critical condition in hospital. Crystal and Stephanie were sisters and they were mothers, each loved by their children. The Beardy family, from Lake St. Martin First Nation, has experienced catastrophic loss over the past few years. Dylan was a father of six and h is ex-partner has spoken fondly of his parenting. Melelek was well loved by his family in Kenya and his partner here in Winnipeg.

I attended the vigil at 143 Langside avenue on Sunday organized by the West Broadway Bear Clan. Drum song and prayers were of fered to the victims and their families. Candles and roses were laid at the steps of the home. We don' t know the circumstances of why their lives were brutally ended Sunday morning but we do know that each of them was loved, is missed and will be remembered. This week has been a difficult one for our com - munity. Neighbours are relieved that an arrest has been made, but they 're afraid, and they 're angry and they're grieving.

West Broadway is one of Winnipeg' s oldest neighbourhoods, with a gorgeous tree canopy and many apartment blocks and rooming houses intermingled with modern infill homes, yet, the community feeling is strong and people care about each other. At times like this, we all come together. Thank you to the community members who have reached out to share their feelings and their ideas for improved community safety. Thank you to the West Broadway Bear Clan for their consistent efforts to love the underloved in our society and to provide leadership in times of crisis. And finally, I offer deep

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 369 gratitude to the first responders who were on the scene that Sunday morning. Thank you. Honourable Speaker, I ask leave of the House for a moment of silence to remember the victims. The Speaker: Is there leave for a moment of silence? [Agreed] A moment of silence was observed. ORAL QUESTIONS Carbon Tax on Home Heating Bills Request for Manitoba Exemption Ms.

Heather Stefanson (Leader of the Official Opposition): Yesterday, the Premier tabled a memo written by his staff, telling him how he is not advised to move forward to help make life more affordable for Manitobans. Meanwhile, right next door in Saskatchewan, the Premier of Saskatchewan, Scott Moe, has been given a legal opinion and is moving forward to make life more affordable for those people in Saskatchewan. My question for the Premier: Why won 't this Premier stand up for Manitobans and take the carbon tax off of home heating? Hon.

Wab Kinew (Premier): The legal opinion of the Department of Justice, which counts for a lot more than the words of the Leader of the Opposition, says quite plainly that what the PC Party recommends would be illegal. They made some interesting comments yesterday that they want to flout the law. We, on the other hand, respect the constitution. Impor- tantly, we als o respect the people of Manitoba and your 'har'-earned tax dollars. * (14:00) Today, we shared publicly the news that the outgoing PC adminis tration left our province with a $1.6-billion deficit.

We all knew that they were going on a huge spending spre e on their way out the door, but how could they leave a $1.6- billion deficit on September 30? The Speaker: The honourable Official Leader of the Opposition, on a supplementary question. Ms. Stefanson: Honourable Speaker, nobody believes the Premier's NDP junk math. What I will say, now the Premier has found a newfound love of the law in the province of Manitoba. Next door, the Premier of Saskatchewan is moving forward to make life more affordable for people in Saskatchewan when it comes to the carbon tax and home heating that is being charged.

The–Saskatchewan is moving forward with that. They have a legal opinion to say that they are moving forward on that. And I'm just wondering, why is this Premier–why will he not move forward and stand up for the people of Manitoba and take the carbon tax off of home heating for the people here in Manitoba? Mr. Kinew: What the PCs are recommending is illegal. What we are doing is helping you directly by cutting the provincial fuel tax come January 1.

You can see that they don 't understand some important economic and legal principles, not only in this very flawed line of questioning but also in the fact that they left this province with a $1.6 -billion deficit as of September 30. Crucially, this was just a few days before Manitobans voted. So, perhaps the Leader of the Op position would like to look into the camera and tell you, the people of the province, why she didn 't care to tell you she was leaving a $1.6- billion deficit before you went to the polls. The Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a final supplementary question. Ms.

Stefanson: Well, I will gladly look the people of Manitoba in the eye and tell them that this is nothing more than NDP junk math. Do not believe them. Again, the Premier of Saskatchewan is standing up for those in Saskatchewan right now, to ensure that carbon tax is taken off of their home heating bills. I am just simply asking the Premier: Why will he not do the same? Why will he not stand up for Manitobans and make life more affordable for Manitobans? Mr. Kinew: What the PCs are advocating for is illegal. What we are doing is to do something that they never did throughout their two terms in office.

They kept charging you money every time you went to go fill up at the pump. We're saying we're going to bring the prov incial taxes on gasoline and diesel to zero to help you and your family get by. Importantly, we are also going to chart a path towards long- term affordability for people in this province by wrangling the $1.6-billion deficit that the PCs left us with on the way out the door. This is the

370 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 combined value of all the promises that they were making, trying to win back support across the province. But you know what? I would say to the Leader of the Opposition through you, the Chair: You can't say yes to everything. Provincial Financial Forecast Impact on Taxes and the Economy Mr. Greg Nesbitt (Riding Mountain): Honourable Speaker, no one believes this Premier. He' s taken enough liberties with the truth in his brief career. Now he stands in this House and is laying the groundwork for a massive tax hikes everyone knows he plans to introduce.

He refused to answer media today, but he owes Manitobans an answer. Will he commit today to the tax breaks our government introduced in Budget 2023? Hon. Wab Kinew (Premier): You know, I will excuse my friend from Riding Mountain from reading from the pages that he 's been handed to on his way in the Chamber. I know that he respects me, and he knows that we 're going to deliver on affordability while charting a course towards a balanced budget.

But what I know about the members opposite, including those who served in Cabinet, is that there is the open question as to whether they knew about this $1.6-billion deficit. Clearly , the last premier knew and decided to conceal this from the people of Manitoba. But I'd like my friend from Riding Mountain to tell the House: Did the rest of Cabinet know as well? The Speaker: The honourable member from –for Riding Mountain, on a supplementary question. Mr.

Nesbitt: Honourable Speaker, this Premier shouldn't play politics with people 's livelihoods and spin tales with his own forecast, especially this close to the holidays, when families are noticing cos t increases the most. Why does this Premier refuse to commit to the tax cuts and 'afforbidabiliby' measures that will give Manitobans some breathing room? Mr. Kinew: This is a non-issue. We have not created any space for us to vary from our commitments to you, the people of Manitoba, that we made during this recent election.

That's why we're delivering on something the PCs never did during their time in office, which is by bringing the prov incial gasoline and diesel taxes to zero. However, this last administration under the PCs concealed from you, the voting public, that on September 30, the deficit in this province was $1.6 billion. Clearly the Leader of the Op position knew. But did my friend from Riding Mountain know, sitting at the Cabinet table, that he was leaving the people with such a financial mess? The Speaker: The honourable member for Riding Mountain, on a final supplementary question. Mr.

Nesbitt: Well, Honourable Speaker, the Premier writes fiction. Now he's doing the same with a rushed report for partisan purposes. These are not audited numbers, and it is irres - ponsible to fear monger to Manitobans –have repercussions throughout the economy. Health- care expenditures and hydro water levels are reflected in this document. Does the Minister of Finance (MLA Sala) think government should have denied surgeries, or make it rain? Mr.

Kinew: I want to reassure all the members of the former PC Cabinet that there is an audit coming, and they will be held accountable for the poor dec isions that they made. Some of the key contributing factors of this $1.6-billion deficit is that did–they didn't account for inflation when building this year's provincial budget. The spending spree that they went on across the province, countless announcements being made, were not included in this year 's budget. They expected to pay for everything out of slush funds and contingency amounts.

There is nothing fiscally responsi ble about the Progressive Conservative Party in Manitoba anymore. The good news is, our team is going to fix this mess while improving health care and lowering costs for your family. Manitoba Critical Mineral Strategy Government Intention Mr. Jeff Wharton (Red River North): I will let– I would like to, before I start asking the question, I'd like to also welcome the Manitoba Chambers of

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 371 Commerce here today, who we had the opportunity to meet. I know they weren 't recog nized earlier by government, but this side of the House would like to recognize them and thank them for coming. Honourable Speaker, we know Manitoba was poised to once again lead the world in sus tainable and responsible mining. We have what the world wants. We have an abundance of critical minerals, clean hydroelectricity and hard-working people right here in Manitoba. Manitoba can compete on the global stage.

Manitoba critical mineral strategy is an action plan where–created to do precisely that. So, can the Minister of Economic Dev elopment please tell us and tell the Chambers members today why– The Speaker: Member's time has expired. Hon.

Jamie Moses (Minister of Economic Development, Investment, Trade and Natural Resources): I welcome members from the Manitoba chambers here in the building today, and not only that, I was pleased to meet with them earlier this morning. * (14:10) And that's part of our government's collaborative approach to working with Manitobans to develop not only a critical mineral strategy that works for Manitobans, but an economic plan that works for all Manitobans. That's something the former government failed to do, something that we're going to deliver on to make sure that we have an economy that works for all of us.

The Speaker: The honourable member for Red River North, on a supplementary question. Mr. Wharton: Manitoba's Critical Minerals Strategy was informed by input and feedback from First Nations, industry groups, academic institutions and companies undertaking mineral exploration dev elop- ment right here in Manitoba. I was honoured to have–to be the minister to lead and oversee this very im portant work to grow our economy. Our strategy brought a record $170 million in exploration spending to the province last year, permitting increases of 6.6 per cent.

Understand this, members opposite: We have now lapsed from 32nd under the watch of the NDP to 14th in the Fraser's institute global mining rankings. What signal does he think his gov ernment is sending to industry that Manitoba is open for business, yes or no? Mr. Moses: Honourable Speaker, I'm very happy to say that yes, we are open for business, and we're going to do it in a collaborative way with all Manitobans.

As we continue to work collaborative–in a collab- orative way to develop a real critical mineral strategy, something the f ormer government failed to do, we 'll ensure that we listen to First Nation and Indigenous voices, local com munity, and ensure that we have a balanced approach when it comes to dealing with critical minerals in Manitoba. The Speaker: The honourable member for Red River North, on a final supplementary question. Mr. Wharton: In part nership with the Manitoba Chambers of Commerce, the Manitoba Mineral Dev- elopment Fund has approved more than $11 million for 68 projects across this province.

This has cr eated more than 400 net new jobs and 160 part nerships, while leveraging $70 million of private sector invest ment. Our gov ernment has committed to $20 million to esta blish the fund in 2020. Now that the minister plans to rip it up – the mineral strategy –and apparently provide the Manitoba chambers group here today a real strategy, which is not correct, will–can he tell the House and the Manitoba chambers what he plans to cut from the mineral strategy that the Manitoba chambers supports? Mr. Moses: Honourable Speaker, we are very pleased to meet with industry partners like the Manitoba chambers.

We're very happy to meet with people right across Manitoba, like we did at AMM, like we met industry partner right across when we traveled to the North in Manitoba. And as part of that listening, some thing that that government failed to do, we will develop a real critical mineral strategy so that we can get the economic advantage of all the resources we have in Manitoba, and actually get jobs here in Mani toba; again, something the former government failed to do. School Construction Projects Government Priority Inquiry Mr.

Wayne Ewasko (Lac du Bonnet): That member over there had seven and a half years to get something

372 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 in action, and they failed to get anything done, Honourable Speaker. Yesterday, Honourable Speaker, the Minister of Transportation and Infra structure, Consumer Pro tec- tion and Gov ernment Services said she had, and I quote, had to sort out what projects can proceed, when asked about schools for communities. Is the minister implying that the new schools and built-in child-care spaces for these com munities are not a priority for her government like it was for ours? Hon.

Lisa Naylor (Minister of Consumer Protection and Government Services): Once again, I thank the critic on Education for directing questions at me. And I'm happy to answer on behalf of the gov- ernment. First of all, when it comes to education, this gov- ernment cut education funding year after year for all seven years that they were in government. So, there is absolutely no track record of an interest in education, unlike on this side of the House. When it comes to any of the projects that have been committed to by this government, I think we all understand a $1.6-billion overage.

Just for the record, both the departments I am responsible for have a total budget of $1.6 billion. So imagine what that means in terms–in overage that– The Speaker: The minister's time is expired. Mr. Ewasko: Honourable Speaker, t hey actually were left with a quarter-of-a-billion-dollar surplus. It's nice to know that the minister finally understands what, actually, part of her portfolio is involved with. The minister have–of many hats also spoke about school board ex perience yesterday. That was a courageous move considering her own experience.

The last time she had admin istrative control at the Winnipeg School Division, Dr. John Wiens authored a report encouraging the NDP Minister of Education to sack the lot of them. Why does this minister think Manitobans should trust her to decide what communities get schools and which will not? MLA Naylor: Honourable Speaker, I really ap pre- ciate the op portunity to correct the record. When that study w as completed at the Winnipeg School Division, when it–when the interviews were done for that study, I had been a school trustee for four weeks. So, I take no lessons from this MLA on the other side of the House.

What I will say is that over the seven–over the years that this government, when they were in power, when I was a school trustee, they cut funding year after year. But, I am here to speak about infra structure and to speak about gov ernment buildings. We want to build this province. We want to build schools and take care of communities. And we will continue to build this province after we have completed the audit and review– The Speaker: The minister's time has expired. Mr.

Ewasko: Honourable Speaker, I quote and table from the report, in quotations: The unwillingness of the board to consult, consider, reconsider any opinions other than their own, and their penchant for playing political games with each other, schools and parents and their staff. End quote. That description seems to still fit, Mr. Honourable Speaker. The former board chair, the member of Fort Garry and the minister is playing games by confu- sing–refusing and confusing to commit to the nine much-needed schools. Why has the minister not learned from Dr.

Wiens' report, and why will she not commit to these schools today? Yes or no, Honourable Speaker. Hon. Nello Altomare (Minister of Education and Early Childhood Learning): I can tell you, on October 3, Manitobans rendered their judgment on that former government over there, and said to them that their faulty, faulty accounting principles are done. They elected an NDP gov ernment because we will be truthful with the finances. We will ensure that projects that are im portant to com munities aren 't being played politic s with, like that former gov ern- ment used to do.

Instead of pitting Manitobans against each other, we are going to bring Manitobans together and create an education and school system that everybody will be proud of. Provincial Financial Forecast Impact on Taxes and the Economy Mrs. Kathleen Cook (Roblin): The former PC government left this NDP finance minister with a booming economy and the third highest GDP growth in the country.

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 373 Only the NDP could take this gift from their predecessors and using NDP math, turn a quarter - million–quarter-billion-dollar surplus into a deficit. Will the Finance Minister just admit that he and his Premier (Mr. Kinew) are using this junk math to fear monger and to lay the groundwork for broken promises and tax hikes? Hon. Adrien Sala (Minister of Finance): Honour- able Speaker, $1.6 billion; $1.6- billion deficit, the single biggest non-pandemic deficit in the history of this province.

That is the legacy of the members opposite. * (14:20) Overspending and fiscal irresponsibility have put this province in a very challenging position. Our government was elected to fix the mess that they created. We' re here to fix health care, make the province more affordable, improve education. We can't wait to improve life in this province. The Speaker: The honourable member for Roblin, on a supplementary question. Mrs. Cook: I watched, and I 'm sure many other Manitobans watched, the Premier and the NDP Finance Minister's news conference an hour ago. And it was an Oscar -worthy performance.

This is –they know that this is just junk math, designed to set the stage for broken promises and tax hikes. Budgeted tax changes scheduled to come into effect on January 1st will save the average Manitoba family $800 next year. Manitobans want to know: Is the NDP planning to cancel the tax cuts they 've already committed to, yes or no? MLA Sala: You know, one of the things we revealed today was not only that Manitoba 's now staring down a $1.6- billion deficit, but we also revealed the lack of trans parency Manitobans saw from this previous government.

They went to extreme lengths to hide the depths of our issues that we 're facing fiscally in this province, including hiding the fact that we were heading towards a very tough water year at Hydro. Over and over, Manitobans have seen this previous gov ernment be lacking trans parency and failing to show Manitobans the reality of the situation we have before us. Things have changed, Mr. Honourable Speaker. We're going to bring fiscal res ponsibility and trans - parency back to government in Manitoba. The Speaker: The honourable member for Roblin, on a final supplementary question. Mrs.

Cook: Honourable Speaker, the third highest GDP growth in the country; average weekly earnings, up; employment, up; manufacturing, up; retail sales, up; agriculture, up; inter national trade, up. Only the NDP could turn this into a deficit. Will they just admit that the junk math they 've put forward today is just to set the stage for what they're planning to announce next week after the House rises? Tax hikes and broken promises. MLA Sala: You know, the members opposite are putting a lot of words on the record today and in previous days that they will come to regret.

We are going forward with a review, which will reveal, from a third-party perspective, the reality of the fiscal challenge we are facing. And, unfor tunately, I think the members opposite will find that quite embar rass- ing. Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. The Speaker: Order. MLA Sala: The members opposite left us in an incredibly challenging position, Honourable Speaker, a $1.6-billion deficit, again, the biggest non-pandemic deficit in this province 's history. We 're going to work to fix that.

We 're going to continue to foll ow through on our commit ments to fixing health care, making life more affordable, improving education and making life better for all Manitobans. Selkirk Region Bridge Replacement Timeline for Reconstruction Mr. Richard Perchotte (Selkirk): Honourable Minister, in Selkirk, we see the NDP promises crumbling just like our bridge. When will the NDP minister commit to pro - ceeding with the replacement of this bridge? Hon. Lisa Naylor (Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure): I know that this member asked a question about that very im portant bridge last week.

And I don't know if he knows that there's actually over 1,600 bridges and overpasses in the province, so it wasn't on the tip of my fingers. I invited him to reach out to my office, and I would get him that information; he hasn't bothered to do that. But I'm going to reissue that invitation.

374 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 At any time you want to know about a specific project, please reach out, and I could get that informa- tion for you. The Speaker: The honourable member for Selkirk, on a supplementary question. Mr. Perchotte: I had previously asked the minister the question, hoping they would do their homework and get back to me. This bridge was already promised by the PC gov ernment and was scheduled to begin previously. So the people of Selkirk see through the NDP junk math and its purpose to excuse them for the promises they have made.

Will you continue cancelling projects or will the bridge go forward? MLA Naylor: If the member of Selkirk had chosen to reach out to me last week, as I indicated, I would have been able– Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. MLA Naylor: –I would have been able –it's hard to answer. I would have been able to tell him –can you hear me over there? Because it's an important answer. Do you want to hear? I would have been able to tell him that that bridge is in the final design stages and is proceeding forward as planned. The Speaker: The honourable member for Selkirk, on a final supplementary question. Mr.

Perchotte: Honourable Speaker, what we' re seeing from the NDP is promise, promise, promise, blame, blame, blame, cut, cut, cut. When will this bridge get done? MLA Naylor: I know that the folks in the Selkirk area have been waiting a long time for this project, and I'm sure some of them are appreciative that that project is proceeding forward. I'm sorry that their MLA isn 't and can 't be bothered to say so. Home-Care Services Funding Inquiry MLA Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): We know that many Manitobans depend on home-care services across the province.

According to the De partment of Health's most recent annual report, funding to home - care services delivery organi zations was cut by $3.8 million. I'm tabling a page from the annual report here. Will this gov ernment commit today to fully restoring home-care funding in the province? Hon. Wab Kinew (Premier): I ap preciate the question about seniors and health care and, really, at the end of the day, about the ability of Manitobans to be able to age in place with the necessary supports to continue living with dignity.

Now, today we have shared some troubling news about the $1.6- billion deficit that we inherited from the outgoing PC administration. Now, key among the puzzling dimensions of this news is that even as the outgoing administration burrowed us into such a deep financial hole, health-care and home-care services still continued to get worse under their watch. Our team is committed to fixing this, begin ning by ensuring that those who deliver hom e care on the front lines have the necessary pay and mileage to be able to spend time with those who need this important service.

That's one of the first steps that we 'll be taking, among others to come. The Speaker: The honourable member for Tyndal l Park, on a supplementary question. Personal-Care Home Residents Request for Increase in Hours of Care MLA Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): Over the past few years, we have heard horrific stories of neglect and abuse to care- home residents. The Manitoba standard of personal -care hours is still 3.6 hours of care, which lags far behind the national standard of 4.1. Increasing the total number of hours of care per resident per day will ensure residents have access to preventative care.

This was an election promise by the NDP. How many hours of direct care will this gov ern- ment increase for personal -care-home residents and when can Manitobans expect this increase to be implemented? Hon. Uzoma Asagwara (Minister of Health, Seniors and Long-Term Care): I thank the member for that question, which is really important. We know that seniors, and not only seniors –there are actually many Manitobans who are not seniors who live in personal-care homes –who depend on the hours per resident per day being what they need to be to have a good quality of life.

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 375 Unfortunately, under the previous gov ernment, we saw that those hours were essentially cut. We saw that folks working in personal -care homes lost their jobs under the previous gov ernment. We saw wages frozen for a very long time, and we saw no efforts taken what soever to adequately staff up those personal-care homes. Our gov ernment is taking a different approach. We are actively working toward achieving that 4.1 and working with partners to ensur e that we continue to move that marker as we move forward.

The Speaker: The honourable member for Tyndall Park, on a final supplementary question. Seniors Hearing Aid Program Government Intention MLA Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): Constit- uents have expressed concern as the Health Minister has not given a straightforward answer if they will be keeping the seniors hearing aid program. The program has been a game changer for many seniors, especially those on fixed incomes. Yes or no, is this gov ernment keeping the program? * (14:30) Hon.

Uzoma Asagwara (Minister of Health, Seniors and Long-Term Care): Our government is committed to making sure that programs that benefit seniors are not only in place, but that we actually explore other opportunities to provide more supports for seniors so that they have good health- care out- comes. I think it 's really im portant to note that the previous gov ernment actually didn 't do their due diligence and ensure that the Manitobans who need access to supports the most actually were aware that these programs existed.

Our government is taking an approach that is going to ensure that what we roll out for seniors is accessible, is transparent and is sustain- able long-term. So, Manitobans can re st assured, seniors in our province can rest assured, that our gov ernment is taking an approach that puts people first, is committed to strengthening outcomes and not worried about the bottom line like the previous failed government. Collection of the Carbon Tax Legal Opinion MLA Mike Moroz (River Heights): Yesterday the Premier (Mr.

Kinew) tabled a legal opinion that says, in fact, it would not be lawful for a province to refuse to collect the federal carbon tax. That's about as clear as it gets. Yet some of the members opposite still seem to think the law doesn't apply to them. To make matters worse, not only is the plan illegal, it would also waste taxpayers' dollars. But perhaps that 's not surprising, given the $1.6-billion deficit they left Manitobans. Could the Minister of Finance please explain the financial con sequences of the op position's reckless and illegal plan? Hon.

Adrien Sala (Minister of Finance): I want to thank my colleague for that important question. You know, the opposition has claimed for months to have a legal opinion on this issue. But where is it? It's clear that they don 't have it. The member for Spruce Woods (Mr. Jackson) told media he doesn' t have it, and we know Manitobans don't have it, either. But yet memb ers opposite would have gov ernment break the law and waste millions in court for the sake of their own ideology. Manitobans remember the dark days of endless costly legal battles under the PCs, but those days, Mr. Honourable Speaker, are over.

Manitobans elected a new government that will get real results on affordability and manage the books, finally, with integrity. Fire Along Highway 311 Bridge Replacement Inquiry Mr. Konrad Narth (La Vérendrye): My question is for the Minister of Infrastructure. The La Vérendrye constituency is home to many of the economic horses that pull this gov ernment's newfound social cart. In order for us to pull the social cart, the economic horses of southern Manitoba need stable infrastructure investment. The–Highway 311 goes from the east to the west across much of the region that I represent.

As a result of a wildfire in the spring of 2023, this past spring, the bridge was burnt. This has caused great interruption for the constituents of that corner of Manitoba. And can the minister answer: When will the con- stituents see that bridge start to be reconstructed?

376 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 Hon. Lisa Naylor (Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure): It's kind of fun to be so popular. I feel bad for, like, the Minister of Environment, who's probably never going to get a question from this crew. Again, there are 1,611 bridges and overpasses in this province, so I can 't spe cifically speak to that bridge today. I absolutely invite you to reach out to my department. I'll get an answer for you on that. I can get that answer for you today. The Speaker: The honourable member for La Vérendrye, on a supplementary question.

Highway 201 Upgrade Inquiry Mr. Konrad Narth (La Vérendrye): This is a question and request that was made to the department by myself and the municipalities involved. Another crucial infra structure upgrade for southern Manitoba, in order to pull the economic load of this province is, in southern Manitoba, the RTAC expansion of Highway 201, which will allow the unrestricted trade and commerce between southern communities of southern Manitoba. This highway upgrade was committed by the previous government after many years of consultation and assessment.

Will this government commit to the upgrading of this crucial piece of Manitoba infrastructure? Hon. Lisa Naylor (Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure): I am very pleased to have had the opportunity over these short weeks in office to speak with many, many municipalities, and the ones I haven't yet had the oppor tunity to meet with about their infra structure needs, we have meetings scheduled over the next few weeks. So it's such a good opportunity to hear about these very types of projects that you are talking about.

In terms of any of the RTAC projects on any of the 96,000 kilometres of highway across the province, again, that's a very specific detail about a stretch of highway that I'm happy to look into for the member if you– The Speaker: The member's time has expired. The honourable member for La Vérendrye, on a final supplementary question. Highway and Road Upgrades La Vérendrye Constituency Mr. Konrad Narth (La Vérendrye): Since my questions have been quite specific, I 'll broaden the scope. Stable and con sistent growth within Manitoba relies on the investment of Manitoba's infrastructure.

This gov ernment, since elected this fall, has shown very little leadership in the forward progression of the infrastructure system in our province. Can I go back to my constituents and update them that there will be a commit ment to the plans put forward by the previous govern ment to continue the growth and stability of our infra structure in this province? Hon. Lisa Naylor (Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure): Despite the horrendous deficit left to us by this gov ernment, the projects that are in budget in this year are proceeding as planned, and I have said that publicly.

I have said it at Manitoba Heavy. I have said it at the HEAT. I have said it at AMM. Everyone else across the province understands that the projects in budget this year within the Infrastructure and Transpor tation De partment are proceeding. Education Property Tax Rebate Government Intention Mr. Josh Guenter (Borderland): Honourable Speaker, today the mask came off. This NDP gov - ernment is preparing to unleash fiscal and economic hell on Manitoba families.

This NDP government is plunging Manitoba back into years of deficits after our Conservative gov ern- ment left them with a q uarter-billion-dollar surplus, and they 're going into it in a big way with a record-breaking $1.6-billion deficit. Can this NDP Premier (Mr. Kinew) look moms and dads in the eye and promise not to cut the educa- tion property tax rebate? The Speaker: Before we hear the answer to that question, I would like to caution the member about his language. Please refrain from using those kinds of words again. Hon.

Adrien Sala (Minister of Finance): I appre- ciate the question from the member opposite. You know, I know it 's hard for the members opposite to accept that they left the province in this type of a hole: a $1.6-billion hole. The single biggest non- pandemic

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 377 deficit in our province 's history; that 's their record, Honourable Speaker. That 's what they 've l eft Manitobans to cope with. It's a new day in this province. We're here because Manitobans elected us to deliver on improved health care, improved edu cation, improved affordability. We're going to work hard to make life better for all Manitobans. The S peaker: The honourable member for Borderland, on a supplementary question. Mr. Guenter: Can this NDP Premier look farmers in the eye and tell them he will not cut the edu cation property tax rebate? Hon.

Wab Kinew (Premier): No, I won't. What I will do is clean up the absolute mess left by that outgoing administration. We are bringing a new approach; we are going to honour our commitments to the people of Manitoba, including to ag producers when it comes to that tax credit. We are going to restore a path to fiscal sanity, something that was completely lacking as the out - going PC adminis tration tried to buy back support from you, the people of Manitoba. The one thing that we are going to do con- tinuously is to do this with you, the people of Manitoba.

We're sharing this information in the spirit of openness and transparency, and while we know the outgoing PCs left us with a big challenge, we know that we can solve it together with you, the people of Manitoba. * (14:40) Introduction of Guests The Speaker: Before we go on to petitions, unfor - tunately, we had some guests in the gallery that had to leave before we got the announcement out. We had, seated in the public gallery, from Miskooseepi School 21 grade 10 students under the direction of Cecil de Guzman, and this group is located in the constituency of the honourable member for Keewatinook (Mr. Bushie).

PETITIONS The Speaker: The honourable member for–I should– Springfield-Ritchot. Personal Health Information Mr. Ron Schuler (Springfield-Ritchot): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. These are the reasons for this petition:

(1) In 2023, health- care spending proposal contains health information sharing conditions, which raises concerns about privacy rights.

(2) Digital ID is still in its infancy in Canada. The digital ID and authentification council of Canada is currently partnering with private and public stakeholders to provide the framework to develop a digital identification an d authentification ecosystem. This is supported by a September 2022 resolution by the office of the privacy commission of Canada, giving the federal, provincial and territorial privacy commissioners and Ombudsman responsibility for privacy oversights of th e ongoing evolution of a digital identity ecosystem.

(3) Governments and third party stakeholders across the world have started to roll out digital ID policies, calling for invasive collection of biometric markers, location data, banking information and personal health information. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:

(1) To urge the provincial government to not surrender nor weaken any personal health privacy rights when signing a new Canada Health Transfer agreement.

(2) To u rge the provincial government to not create a digital ID nor accept any requirements for the creation of a digital ID tied to health-care funding.

(3) To urge the provincial government to not share any personal medical information with the federal governm ent or third parties, as this information is protected under The Personal Health Information Act, PHIA, and sharing any personal health information would be a violation of the act. This is signed by Myrna Flett, Jillian Johanneson, Carol MacLellan and many, many others. Thank you.

378 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 ORDERS OF THE DAY (Continued) GOVERNMENT BUSINESS The Speaker: The honour able Gov ernment House Leader, on government business. Hon. Nahanni Fontaine (Government House Leader): On House busi ness, Honour able Speaker.

Could you please canvass the House to see if there is leave to waive rules 139(4), 139(6), 139(12) and 139(13) for Bill 4, The Employment Standards Code Amendment and Inter pretation Amendment Act (Orange Shirt Day); Bill 2, The Louis Riel Act, and allow them to be debated at concurrence and third reading this afternoon, despite the fact that they were reported back from committee today.

The Speaker: Is there leave to waive rules 139(4), 139(6), 139(12) and 139(13), for Bill 4, the Employ- ment Standards Code amendment and inter pretation act, Orange Shirt Day, and Bill 2, The Louis Riel Act, and allow them to be debated at concurrence and third reading this afternoon, despite the fact that they were reported back from the committee today? Is there leave? Some Honourable Members: Agreed. An Honourable Member: No. The Speaker: Leave has been denied.

MLA Fontaine: Could you please canvass the House to see if there is leave to waive rule 137(2) for Bill 6, The Manitoba Assistance Amendment Act, to allow it to be debated at second reading this afternoon, despite the fact that it was introduced today. The Speaker: Is there leave to waive rule 137(2) for Bill 6, The Manitoba Assistance Amendment Act, to allow it to be debated at second reading–[interjection] Order. Is there leave to waive rule 137(2) for Bill 6, The Manitoba Assistance Amendment Act, to allow it to be debated at second reading this afternoon, despite the fact that it was introduced today?

Is there leave? Some Honourable Members: Agreed. Some Honourable Members: No. The Speaker: Leave has been denied. MLA Fontaine: Can you please call Bill 5, The Adult Literacy Act, for a second reading debate–resume second reading debate. DEBATE ON SECOND READINGS Bill 5–The Adult Literacy Act The Speaker: It has been announced that we will now resume Bill 5 second reading debate, standing in the name of the honourable Minister of Families, who has 13 minutes remaining. Hon.

Nahanni Fontaine (Minister of Families): Again, I just want to finish up a couple of my comments in respect of Bill 5, and once again just reiterate for Manitobans that we have an amazing NDP team here and a Cabinet that is working so hard on behalf of Manitobans, including the minister for Bill 5, and I want to just lift her up and tell her that we're very excited for her first bill in the House here. And as I said yesterday, we have lots of educators that are very excited to put a couple of words on the record in respect of Bill 5 and the importance of adult literacy here in Manitoba. Miigwech.

The Speaker: Is there any further debate? MLA Mike Moyes (Riel): I'm happy to rise today to speak to this Adult Literacy Act. I 'm happy for a number of reasons. First of all, as I mentioned in my inaugural speech, my mom was a new comer in this great country, and coming from Taiwan, not as an adult, but as someone in high school, she wasn' t able to speak English and her literacy was non-existent.

And so often, as a child, she would tell me stories about the difficulties that she would have in terms of being able to read just regular things in school, learning just even small things like whether it was following along in a textbook, reading a menu, trying to see what was in the daily news, a whole variety of things that we often take for granted when you are able to read and write. Now, she was able to get over that. She was able to overcome that barrier that so many new Canadians face and so many long -term Manitobans face that don't have the necessary literacy in order to take

part in daily life. Now, she went on to be suc cessful in school and went on to post-secondary, as we want so many of our Manitobans to do. And she was able to become gainfully employed as a nurse. But one thing that she really imparted to my–to me, as a child and now as an adult, is just the importance that that literacy piece played in her own life.

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 379 She was able to read me stories, overcoming that. Think about the importance of story time with kids. It's in credibly im portant in term s of bonding. It 's incredibly important in terms of developing literacy in the next genera tion, and oftentimes my mom would read me stories, my sister stories, and I can only – I can't imagine what that would be like if a parent wasn't able to do that with their child. Now, this story is so similar to the situation that other Manitobans face. I was a long- time teacher at Victor Mager School. I taught at that school in St.

Vital for over 13 years, and oftentimes I would hear of parents struggling. And i t was often the kids that would be helping the parents out with the corres- pondence from the schools. And it shouldn' t be like that. I think that all members in this Chamber would agree that it should be the parents helping the kids, that they should be the ones guiding the kids, whether that 's through homework, whether that's through difficult situations, whether that is just trying to understand life. * (14:50) And instead, at Victor Mager School, we would have parents that were unable to read.

And s o, if a letter would go home, an email was sent out. It would be the child–it was dependent on the child to translate and to bring that forward to the parent and explain to them what was happening. These are young kids. This was an elementary school, juni or high, but oftentimes we would have elementary students that were having to explain to their parent what was going on. And that shouldn't be the case. And so, I'm incredibly proud of this act to bring forward this im portant piece of legis lation to talk about adult literacy.

One of the things that was discussed with this bill–or one of the individuals who 's done so much work on this and someone that we have consulted, as a gov ernment, is Dr. Jim Silver. Dr. Jim Silver is a professor emeritus from the U of W and has done incredible work when it comes to adult literacy. It is something that he has advocated for time and time again, whether we –whether you 've read about it in the paper; he 's written numer ous articles for the Free Press. He has also written a number of books in terms of addressing poverty. And it often would go back to improving the literacy of the parents.

There was one specific study that was done, and it had to do with the Lord Selkirk Park. Lord Selkirk Park is a low -income place to live. They –there is a centre there that helped families out, and in this study, one of the things that they did was that they worked to improve the literacy of those parents. Without doing anything for the child, they noticed that there was improvements with the kids' schoolwork. And so, there was questions asked on what exactly was happening here. Why were the kids able to do better in school?

Why were the kids all of a sudden seeing their literacy levels improve without any direct action taking place for those kids? And what it was found in this study and was the fact that when you improve adult literacy, those parents start reading to those kids. Those parents start to have books around the house. Those parents are able to start guiding those chil dren in reading time, with their homework, in a whole variety of different things. And so, even without a direct action, you start to have an impact on the kids.

And I think, regardless of the side of the Chamber you 're on right now, every member here wou ld agree that improving children 's education–or at least I would hope that all members– I know, on this side of the House, we would agree – that improving a child's education is paramount. And so, if we're able to do that just by increasing the literacy levels of parents, then we 're all going to be better off. And this is some thing that I think that we all can agree on. Now, when I went over–after I finished teaching at Victor Mager School, I went over to Glenlawn Collegiate, and I taught English and hi story.

One of the things that I would notice is that the kids that struggled, by the time they got to me in high school, it was in credibly difficult. There 's often stigma that would be there for those kids that –and young adults that would be struggling. And it's tough. It's tough to reach those kids; it's tough to give them the skills. And so, anything that we can do to improve the literacy levels of adults when they are perhaps a little bit more motivated, perhaps when they have developed that independence, is going to just improve our societal –there's going to be societal benefits throughout.

And this is just incredibly difficult but important work, and so, I'm just incredibly happy to see, as one of our first bills, that we're bringing this forward.

380 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 One of the issues–or one of the things that I parti- cularly like about this bill is the measurement. As a teacher, we know that whatever we measure is going to be focused upon. And the fact that we 're going to be reporting on this is going to hold the programs that we're implementing on adult literacy accountable. It's important not to just put forward bills for the sake of putting forward a bill, but rather to put forward bills that are actually going to move the needle and actually improve adult literacy.

And so, this is an incred ibly important bill, and I'm incredibly happy that the Minister for Advanced Education, as her first bill, is moving this. This is going to ensure that the de partment is reporting on this. This is going to ensure that we 're going to implement programs, and they are going to report back, and we're going to hear about it, and we're going to be able to make adjustments if necessary. But it is going to really improve the literacy levels of our population. Now, let's just think about where you would be at, as an adult, if you were not able to read. Think about it every day.

You know, there 's sheets of papers in front of us, there 's newspapers all around us, there 's signs, there's menus, there 's things everywhe re. And we often will take for granted how important this is. And so, one of the things that I really feel passionately about is that we really need to ensure that everyone has a good education, has a literacy level that is at a level where they can understand, participate in and flourish in our society. Newspapers, depending on which one you 're discussing, are read –or, are written at a grade 5 or grade 8 level typically.

Now that's–might sound pretty elementary in terms of the level, but there's been high school students that I have taught that have read at a beginner level, if –they have read at a grade 2 level, and if they were to pick up a newspaper, they wouldn't be able to understand. They wouldn 't be able to understand what is happening in our world. And I know that we're living more and more in a digital age, but let's be real, there is reading that needs to continue to go on.

There 's a literacy level in terms of understanding what is happening, to make sure that we're not having–that we're not just able to be fooled by folks and that we're able to understand what's going to be taking place. Now, one of the things that I parti cularly like is that we're a listening government. We've really made that clear in terms of who we're collaborating with, in terms of developing a –different strategies, whether we're talking about the economy or whether we 're talking about, you know, education.

And when we 're discussing this bill, one of the things that is put forward in this bill is that we want to work with all of the different partners in adult literacy. We want to work with all of the different partners in adult education and ensure that we 're hearing people around the table, that we're going to take those views in. Yes, there's experts in terms of–that can guide our work, people like Dr. Jim Silver, but there 's a whole variety of different stake holders that can play a role.

And one of the people, or some of the groups that can play a role are, in fact, the people that need it most, those people that are struggling with literacy. They're going to be able to talk about some of the barriers they face. I know yesterday we heard from the members opposite–give their support to aspects of the bill, and– in talking about some of the barriers that could be faced. And I appreciate that.

I appreciate the fact that they 're looking at ways to reduce barriers, because we're not going to be suc- cessful if there's literacy programs, but there 's things getting in the way of people accessing those programs. And so, I appre ciate the members opposite bringing forward those experiences and that perspective, so that we can implement that in the programming. Because we do need to collaborate with everyone.

We need to col laborate with those stake holders, we need to collaborate with the people that are accessing the system and we need to collaborate with the experts that are going to be designing these programs to ensure that they're the most effective. So, one of the things that I 'll just, maybe, t ouch on is, in my community right now, there's a Ukrainian couple that has taken over the –I guess, cafeteria, I guess I'll call it–the cafeteria at Dakota Com munity Centre.

And the reason I 'm bringing this up is, being new Canadians from Ukraine, you c an see how important their integration into our society is linked to literacy. Right now, they would be functionally illiterate. They struggle with com munication, they struggle with understanding what is occurring, if it 's in written form, they struggl e in terms of processing some of those details. * (15:00)

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 381 Now, the reason why I 'm bringing this up is because at the Dakota Com munity Centre, we have this phenomenal couple that has been doing a lot of work. They've taken over the cafeteria over at Dakota Community Centre and they have some of the best Ukrainian food around, but they 're still struggling; even though they 're gainfully employed, they 're still struggling. And you can just see –they have kids; they live, I believe, in the Transcona area, and every day they're working hard.

But we can see that if they 're able to gain a literacy level that is high enough, that they're able to start to read to their kids, that they 're able to read a newspaper, that they're able to function in our society, t heir life is just going to become so much better. They are going to be able to start interacting with their kids. They're going to be able to ensure that their kids can function in school. They 're going to be able to help their kids with homework.

And I know I keep coming back to school because, I guess as a teacher, that's where–just where my mind goes, but the everyday life is just so much better. It's so much richer. Never mind the fact that, if they start to enjoy different aspects, whether that 's, you know, the reading of poetry or writing of music or whatever, all the other rich things that take place in our life. And so, it's incredibly important that we move on this bill, that we enact a com prehensive program in order to address adult lite racy, and to really ensure that it's easy for Manitobans to enrol in that education program.

You know, one of the things that I really like about the bill is the fact that it is going to put forward a comprehensive framework for adult literacy centres. This is so vital for really improving that literacy rate, and it 's going to be effective. It 's going to have mandated reporting. It's going to just really move the needle in terms of our literacy in our province. Oftentimes in Manitoba, we just assume that everyone has an adequate literacy level, and that's just not the case. It's unfortunate, but it's just not the case.

And as a father, as a teacher, as a member of this Legislative Assembly, I just cannot speak highly enough about education and ab out the importance of moving on adult education. There's two areas that I'm pretty passionate about in terms of education. Like, you can see an excellent bang for your buck if you start moving on early child- hood education, but the other side of it is you can see some excellent bang for your buck if you start moving on adult education and that adult literacy piece.

It's going to–I just have the utmost faith that it 's going to start moving in terms of our young people, whether they are impacted, like I mentioned, the study where those parents are able to positively impact their kids, even without that direct action on the kids. It's going to impact all generations, and so I'm just so passionate about this bill. I was incredibly happy to see the member–or the Minister for Advanced Educa- tion move on this as one of our first bills, and I just look forward to really seeing the needle move on this important piece of legislation. Thank you very much. Hon.

Jamie Moses (Minister of Economic Development, Investment, Trade and Natural Resources): I am pleased to rise today and put some words on the record with respect to Bill 5, The Adult Literacy Act, because it is actually an important bill. And as I begin my comments today with respect to this bill, I want to first begin to high light the work of my colleagues, who have already done a tre men- dous job in highlighting the importance of education, of literacy, of adult learning.

And I will first begin with the member who just spoke, the member for Riel (MLA Moyes), who did a tremendous job about not only talking about a personal experience in his own life that really stresses the importance of education and importance of educa- tion–role that edu cation plays on families, on young people, as well as on adults. But since he is such a good MLA, he was able to provide context about what that means in our broader communities and our society.

And I know Dakota Community Centre very well, and so I'm glad that he's bringing that experience of already being an MLA, a member of this Chamber who can truly represent his community and do it with such grace and such dignity. And then on top of that, Honourable Speaker, I'm pleased to hear his words because, as an educator, he brings that ex perience from his working career as well.

As someone I know who has taught in the Louis Riel School Division in multiple schools and specifically last held a position at Glenlawn Collegiate, I know that 's direct ex perience from his own personal and professional career that is very

382 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 relevant and tangible to this discussion as we talk about education, as we talk about adult literacy. And as we expand out, I want to also highlight the fact that I'm very thankful to be on a team that brings so much experience to the table, so many educators around this room and around our caucus and around this government. And I can highlight the Minister of Sport, Culture and Heritage from his ex perience working many years in education and the broad s cale and broad range of tasks that educators do.

As much as it is about 'literacly'–literacy and tacking the real challenge that it is to get young people, in many respects, to learn how to read–and it does expand up to adults, of course, as we discuss specifically in this act–the task of being an educator is far broader than that. And I am sure the Minister of Sport, Culture and Heritage can attest to that from his experiences teaching young people through sports, through being active and through their engagement in their broader community.

And that is really what I wanted to high light as I begin this–my comments, that we're very grateful for the strong work, the positive work, the work that educators put in each and every day to make sure our communities stay strong for not just now, but educating the minds of the future genera tions so that they have the possibility and the opportunities that we all hope for them, that we all wish for them and that we all want to see become a reality. And that making that reality happens because of bills like this, like Bill 5, like The Adult Literacy Act.

And, of course, this bill requires the minister to develop and implement and evaluate an adult literacy strategy in col laboration with others involved in adult literacy. And the reason that statement is so meaningful and so impactful, Honourable Speaker, is because of some very key words in it. And the first word I'd like to highlight is collabo- ration. Our gov ernment takes that word very seriously, and we implement it in many different ways, in many different facets. I know the Minister of Education is working collab oratively with his colleagues around the Cabinet table.

As well, I know the Minister of Immigration is also working very collaboratively. We have had many meetings that show our collaboration. And adult literacy is among those collaborative works. And I think that col laborative works is a strong example of the power of having those literacy tools and allowing us to enga ge in a meaningful and respectful way.

And I say parti cular kudos and thank you to the Minister of Immigration, because I know that she has done a large amount of work over the past many years when it comes to adult literacy, meeting with groups, meeting with individual stake holders who deliver adult literacy education. People who are deeply vested in adult literacy, the Minister of Immigration has met with them on countless times, including one of the im portant voices in our Manitoba community on adult literacy, Mr.

Jim Silver, whose reports have been very impact- ful and very influential in terms of the role, in terms of our understanding of adult literacy and its impacts and its potential that it plays throughout our Manitoba community. And so, I thank her for the job that she has done to elevate this issue through out our province and ensure and help to, quite frankly, Honour able Speaker, help to pave the road for us introducing this bill, Bill 5, The Adult Literacy Act, into this Chamber and leading us to the debate where we stand today.

And I know as all members in this Chamber engage on this issue and engage on and, of course, raise their passion level for adult literacy and learning through this vigorous debate that we're exchanging in yesterday and today, and we 'll see how long it goes for, Honourable Speaker. But as we go through this process, as I think it 's very important for all of us to recognize, very impor- tant for all Manitobans to recognize, as well, that adult literacy is really a tool. It's a key for us to be successful into the future.

It opens up countless and numer ous pathways and doors for our future potential. * (15:10) And that 's exactly why it 's im portant for us to focus on adult literacy and make sure that no people, whether you're young or old, fall through that literacy gap, and that we have a plan in place as gov ernment to help address those potential gaps. And this bill seeks to do just that.

And I think, Honour able Speaker, as we' re talking about adult literacy, it's important to highlight that, you know, our traditional K-to-12 system which tackles literacy at younger levels for, I guess, parti - cularly for children in kindergarten, in grade 1, grade 2 and grade 3. Spe cifically, I know there 's a

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 383 large focus on literacy and learning and learning to read at those young levels. But we can 't forget that many Manitobans often don't go through our K -to-12 system, or don 't go through it in the same way or the same manner; or don't have those , perhaps, addi tional resources to be successful through learning at –learning to read and learning their literacy skills at those early years.

And I think one of the reasons that have been quite well documented through many studies and many reports, Honourable Speaker, is that, you know, quite frankly, you know, kids go to school hungry. Kids go to school hungry, and that makes it more challenging for them to tackle the task of learning how to read, of becoming fully literate to a level where they can be successful members of our society. Now this problem where young people are often hungry at school is a real issue when it come to their ability to learn.

And so as we see this happen in our literacy program, it leads to many of these people not learning how to read, and at least to them, being the same people who need to have their literacy caught up as adults. And, Honourable Speaker, I think it's exciting that we have a minister, a Minister of Advanced Education who is so knowledgeable, who is so passionate about this issue that already, just in the first few weeks of her tenure, she 's already bringing forward a 'meaningble'–meaningful piece of legislation that not only addresses the issue, but sets us up for being successful into the future. Mrs.

Rachelle Schott, Acting Speaker, in the Chair And hopefully we can see, generations from now, the positive impacts, the reverberations throughout our community of this bill that we are debating here today; hopefully becomes law, and becomes passed and we can all reap the significant benefits of it.

And as we see, as I mentioned, Hon ourable Deputy Speaker, that we are now discussing and debating this bill, it's important for us to recognize that the reason many adults don't have their literacy skills in–at the level where we as a community would want to see it, is because, you know, they faced those challenges early on in life. And as I touched on, the fact that kids go to school hungry, I wanted to just dive into that briefly for a little bit.

Now, the reason that we see that happening is because we do know that child poverty levels are extremely high, and in fact they have been rising under the former gov ernment for many years, that childhood poverty. And those have real impacts and–kids in the classroom. Without the proper supports for kids to be able to learn as classrooms get bigger because of the cuts of the former government, because of the lack of support for educators by the former gov ernment, and by the fact of simply refusing to put in a proper and a comprehensive meal program by the former gov ern- ment, we have left many kids behind.

And sadly, we see that –we will see the negative impacts of those decisions that the former government made reverberate through our com munity. And this act aims to change some of that, as well as a commit- ment, a conscientious commit ment to feed kids in school that this government has made. And we know that that will also have a lasting positive impact. As we help kids tackle t he challenge of being hungry in schools, we also allow them to be more successful throughout their educational careers.

We allow them to instead of focus on the rumble in their stomach, we allow them to focus on their A-B-Cs and their one-two-threes. Now this is an important message that I've heard, not just from own conversations, but I 've heard from experts. I 've heard from experts who have talked about the need for us to tackle some of those basic issues around poverty and education, and povert y that–childhood poverty that students are facing in order to better educate them and allow them to be successful throughout their educational careers, starting at the very lowest grades, going right up until grade 12.

And that leads us to The Adult Literacy Act, which is really a measure to ensure that those people who might fall through the cracks get caught by com- prehensive system, a strategic system and plan that the minister of adult education is putting forward here–as this bill is part of that plan –to ensure that we help all Manitobans through their literacy journey. And the other area, Honourable Deputy Speaker, that it 's important for us to consider, are those new Canadians who come into our province here who are– perhaps not have the literacy skills that would allow them to be as successful in our economy.

And as those people, you know, learn and understand Manitoba and the way of life that we're very proud of here, as those people come and join our community, I think that we want to have them welcomed into our com munity,

384 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 welcomed into our province, welcomed into our various cities and rural municipalities. We know that many of those people who are coming here are looking for work. They 're looking for work and they 're looking for a place to call home. They're looking for welcoming com munities. And they're also looking to be supported with their family. Well, how do we do that, Honourable Deputy Speaker?

How do we tackle those three goals of ensuring that immigrants have fa mily support, that they have a job that meets their skills and that they have–that they can also ensure that they have a welcoming community to be in. How do we do that? Well, to make sure that they have a job that meets their skills, they have to have the language skills and the literacy skills to actually attain and work success- fully in a job that meets their skills. That is a very basic part of our economy. And to help them accomplish that goal, this Adult Literacy Act is a key part of it.

And so in order for our new immigrants to–and newcomers into Manitoba feel welcome and have a job and a career that can be success ful, we need to make sure that adult literacy is a key, basic part of that approach. And second, for those new comers to feel welcome here, they also need to have a com munity that embraces them, a com munity that welcomes them.

And we all know that as people in our communities, that want to engage with each other, that also want to be, you know, get involved on your, you know, com munity centre board, get involved in parent-teacher, just be part of a com munity, is to be able to converse and speak with, you know, speak and read and understand in a way that allows you to be fully embraced by a community. And this–and that is important–why it's important for us to have a literacy strategy for adults that are new to this country and this province. That is a critical part of it.

And, you know, this is true for folks who are here in the downtown of Winnipeg. This is folks for –true for the folks who settle in my neighbourhood of St. Vital. And I can highlight some particular resources in my neighbourhood, including the St. Vital adult literacy and learning centre, that is an amazing place for people in my neighbourhood, in St . Vital, in – adults in my neighbourhood of St.

Vital–to learn those educational skills either because they, you know, need to brush up on them and improve them from the K-to-12 system here, or because they maybe didn 't have them, because they are, maybe, newer to the country. Regardless of what the case is, Hon ourable Deputy Speaker, it 's im portant that we have those resources in place, which Bill 5, The Adult Literacy Act, aims to do. And so with that St.

Vital Adult Learning Centre, which I–I've–proud to have been at in many occasions, and tour and meet with their director, I can see first-hand, and I've seen first-hand, the direct and positive impact that that place, that adult learning has on their lives. And I've seen it. I 've talked to parents w ho went through that program when they had kids. And I 've spoken with them, and they 've told me that this program is giving them the confidence they need to go out in com munity and engage and be involved.

It 's giving them the confidence to not only do that, but to inspire their neighbours, who maybe don 't have the literacy programs, it 's inspiring them to take on the task of getting themselves educated and going through adult learning programs. * (15:20) And as they also in –get the con fidence to be involved to be the com munity, it 's giving them countless economic opportunities as well. They now have the tools and the ability to go into the workplace and say to themselves, I can get this job because I have the confidence, I have the skills to actually make it happen.

And, Honourable Deputy Speaker, as they do that not only do they improve their own lives, but they also inspire their children to say that, yes, as I grow up in this society, I understand that literacy is important. It is important to read, it is important to understand our community because it is just a frankly important thing, but also because it gives us further oppor tunity to network, to build community, to get economic success into the future. And I see all that first-hand at the St. Vital Adult Learning Centre.

And I can remember actually quite proudly being there at the centre this past June as they awarded their graduates their graduation certificates for finishing the program, and I remember one key individual, as well, specifically, who was very proud, who won a scholarship. And she was awarded the scholarship because, in addition to taking the adult learning course as well throughout the year, she also worked as a tutor to help

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 385 her peers learn, and she also happened to get the highest marks in her entire class. And this is a woman who is also a parent and a volunteer in the com munity, and has a ton of other responsibilities. But the priority for her in her life on education was remarkable. And it's a signal as to not just the importance that I know our caucus and our team place on edu cation, but that real com munity members place on education.

And that's exactly what we do as a government, is we listen to community members, listen to community members who tell us education is important. Who tell us that they need supports in education. Who tell us that after seven years of cuts by the former gov ern- ment to education, that they need a change, that they need a change of pa th, that they need to be –a set education, set adult literacy on a path that' s going to be suc cessful for them selves, their families and our community.

And I'm so proud to be standing here alongside my colleagues and in parti cular the members who have done so much work in education, so much work in adult literacy, to listen to people, to listen to Manitobans, to ensure that we are setting ourselves on the path for success for today, for success for tomorrow.

And so as–I'll make a few more comments before I close, Honour able Deputy Speaker, that as the Minister of Immigration has pointed out that there are, you know, very important impacts to immigrants who come here, and namely the need for family supports, for community supports and for jobs a nd economic supports that really fit their skills.

And as I mentioned, I talked about the need for – that literacy plays in ensuring economic supports and the need that literacy plays in your role, in your place, in your com munity, in allowing you to feel fully involved and fully engaged in that com munity, whether it's here or whether it's in rural Manitoba, or whether it's in northern Manitoba. Also, it allows you to be suc cessful within your own family.

And I know there are many members in this Chamber who have said, through their inaugural speeches, that they are the first member in their family to go to post -secondary university or post-secondary education. And that's a signal.

That 's a strong signal that if I know a family member or I know a parent, take on the challenge of getting them selves educated as an adult, it sets a new standard for their kids, and gives their children and the next generation the confidence, the tools they need, and by proxy, the exper ience to actually accom plish such a large goal of getting post-secondary education, whether it is adult literacy or adult learning programs, whether it is going to a college or getting through an apprenticeship program, or whether that 's going to one of our fine and many universities that we have across this great province.

And whatever path you're taking in terms of your learning and your education and your literacy skills as you grow as –into adulthood, it plays a key role on impacts into your family. And I can say that first-hand. You know, as a kid growing up myself, I, you know, was going to school, and I watched my mom, who, from my younger years, from, you know, kindergarten to–sorry, from birth up until grade–kindergarten, grade 1, was at home. You know, spent most of the time at home taking care of us; I was the youngest of four. But then I saw my mom go back to school.

I saw her go back to university and work hard, and I saw my mom after, you know, helping us out with supper, and helping us out with our homework, I saw her sit at the dining room table, open up a textbook and do work, using her literacy skills that she had developed to educate herself. And the power of that, of seeing someone who's already done so much work through- out the day, go and put in extra work to get–to advance and grow in her edu cational needs just shows the power that it is to adult–to invest in edu cation, in literacy and learning, for adults.

And as this bill, Bill 5, does just those very things, it also means that it allows families to be suc cessful and inspire them and allow them to grow in a way that is going to be fostering more healthy and more beneficial and –communities that are going to make our province better into the future. And I want to also point out, Honourable Deputy Speaker, an im portant aspect of this bill, which is – which we should not miss in highlighting. It's the fact that the component of this strategy is the Manitoba Adult Literacy Program, which does support adults ' literacy programs.

And as those programs get administered through- out our province, and I know that the one I spoke of in St. Vital, the St. Vital learning centre, is powered by MITT, that's the Manitoba institute for trades and technologies, who, you know, foster and col laborate with adult learning centres right across the city and the province. They help to engage those groups in being–

386 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 delivering successful adult learning programs, and as they do that work, they uplift many lives across our province. And so we 're very happy that our strategy, and through this bill, is going to reward, and hopefully build on the work of those terrific com munity partners. And so, Honourable Deputy Speaker, I think I 'll just wrap up my comments by saying that the last part of this bill is important to remember is that it 's–it is going to allow us to report and actually be held accountable to delivering on some of these strategies.

Now, I think that account ability, Honour able Deputy Speaker, is some thing really that this –the former government, you know, chose to–found ways– found actually unique and creative ways to avoid. They found unique and creative ways to avoid accountability. Now, you know, for those folks who don' t–who might be unaware, Honourable Deputy Speaker, a bill was repealed by the former government. The literacy act was repealed by the former PC gov ernment. And they didn 't just come out and say, you know, we decided to take a different approach of education, so we've decided to repeal the adult literacy act–no.

They tried to actually hide it and slip it into a former bill called the red tape reduction act. They tried to be sneaky with it. They tried to slip it in the back pages of red tape reduction act to hide the fact they were cutting the adult literacy act, that they were repealing it and sneaking it in. You know, it's kind of like how they tried to raise the hydro rates in the dead of night at wintertime. They tried to be sneaky about it.

The same thing with this adult literacy; they tried to be sneaky with it, and that does a disservice to the adults who are seeking literacy and seeking to engage and enhance their language skills.

And so, Honourable Deputy Speaker, I think that we're taking a distinctively different approach, an approach that is trans parent with Manitobans, with our need to grow edu cation in Manitoba, with that need to ensure that we give oppor tunities for people from all walks of life, whether you need it to attend adult literacy programs, because perhaps you are new to the country, because you needed additional support after the K-to-12 system for a variety of reasons.

We want, as a gov ernment, to work with you, to listen to you, and to assure that we are setting you up for the best success into your future so that together we can build the best Manitoba, a Manitoba that works for all of us. Thank you very much. * (15:30) Hon. Nello Altomare (Minister of Education and Early Childhood Learning): I want to thank the Minister of Advanced Education and Training (MLA Cable) for bringing forward this important bill. One of the very first things we did, Hon ourable Deputy Speaker, is that we met with sector partners before the House was beginning to sit, early in October.

And the partners were telling us loud and clear that they needed a bill like this that builds in some very im portant measures around adult literacy and adult learning centres, adult learning placements and all of the supports for adult learners, because we know how im portant this particular secto r is to the success of our economy. I want to thank the Minister of Economic Dev - elopment, Investment, Trade and Natural Resources (Mr. Moses) for those very fine words regarding the importance of this sector.

He comes to this with a very unique perspec tive, Hon ourable Deputy Speaker, because, as the Minister of Economic Dev elopment, Investment and Trade and Natural Resources, he' s keenly aware of the necessary skills that a new economy requires. And certainly , an economy that works for the people of Manitoba has to have a functioning adult learning component. It is important because–because–there is potential right now in the economy and getting jobs that can pay a living wage for families.

I can tell you, as the member for Transcona, we have many people that are taking advantage of adult learning centres, but we can be doing more. And certainly the sector partners that met with us, that met with Minister Cable and myself, were really imploring us to do more, because they called it, Honourable Deputy Speaker, something known as untapped potential. I think we have to remember what that means. What that means is the ability for people to fully participate in the economy.

We know that sometimes people on their educa- tion journeys have little hiccups along the way and that the responsi bility of a gov ernment is to provide the supports necessary for those people to get back into an education setting that meets them where their starting points are. We know that people that are young families, people that require early learning and child care, that

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 387 the hub model for adult learning will be one that will get to this act and make this act really effective. Because what it does is that it requires the minister to develop and implement and evaluate an adult literacy strategy in collaborations with others involved in the sector. Now, how do we define the others involved in the sector? Well, what we have to do is look at what the people that require this service are telling us.

What they're telling us is a hub model is perhaps the most effective way to reduce the barriers that they face as people accessing extra or their–improvement of their educational outcomes. I can tell you right now, adult literacy and numeracy, it's not only important because of the economic possibilities that it provides them, but it's also really important as a life skill.

In a sense of this, Honour able Deputy Speaker, we see a rising occurrence of online scams, a rising occurrence of a lack of media literacy an d how we understand the news feeds that are being fed to us when we click on certain things on our smart phones and computers. Part of an effective adult literacy program will include these measures that the minister has brought forward and measure how we define even the concept of literacy and numeracy, now, in the digital age. It's something that schools are certainly respond- ing to quite quickly right now with new media literacy units.

I think the same has to be done in adult learning centres, especially because with seeing a rise of scams that are taking people –and people that are actually quite literate them selves, but are not literate in that media literacy piece–seniors, who can take advantage of an adult literacy program that can bring them up to speed in how to deal with all the infor mation that is coming at us right now in Manitoba and throughout our country.

There is a lot of misinformation that certainly inundates us, and I see this act provi ding an avenue for adult learning centres to get into that sector and ensure that people are prepared to deal with all the information that's coming at them and how to dissect it to the point where they're not being taken advantage of. We know of many stories already –they've been well reported through out the media –of people being taken advantage of because they don 't understand what they're clicking on, and that 's a piece that can also be reflected in this bill.

The other important part here is that this act will make it easier for Manitobans to en rol in an adult education system or an adult literacy and numeracy program; it 's very im portant that we do that. Right now there are a number of barriers that are present – that are preventing people from accessing these necessary education programs.

Again, as I mentioned earlier, sector partners have a wraparound approach, meaning that they have other pieces that will allow people to have their kids in a child-care centre or maybe they need access to social work or perhaps they need access to how to gain home places to live, this kind of thing. The very suc cessful programs have all of these wraparound services. This act also establishes and sets funding eligibility parameters for adult literacy and numeracy programming in Manitoba.

I can tell you, in northeast Winnipeg, the River East Transcona School Division, through their McLeod Adult Learning Centre, provides many oppor tunities for adult learners to register, with very few barriers. The one–some of the interesting things that they do is that not only are their courses offered during the traditional times of mornings, afternoons, but they 're also offered in evenings; they're offered on weekends. And this makes it ac cessible for people to gain the skills that they need. They 're either–they're certainly done in-person.

There would be–it'd be great if we had other ways to deliver some of this, either through an online component or done in a seminar system where we can get people sitting around a table and working on their skills.

The other pi ece that this allows, especially at McLeod Adult Learning Centre, is that they allow people to finally finish their high school diplomas so that they can move on to what my colleague, the Minister for Invest ment, Economic Dev elopment, Trade and Natural Resources said: providing the extra supports so that they can get into a post -secondary system to allow them to become more able to access higher paying jobs so that they can raise their families in a way that is certainly honouring not only their education piece but also honouring their –the educa- tion that they receive at these centres.

It 's something that can't be–it can't be overemphasized, Honourable Deputy Speaker. This bill will also force us–not force, I hate using that word, force. What it does is that it asks us to ensure that different partners are included in this creation of an adult learning program that everyone can be proud of here in Manitoba and one that we can lead the country in.

388 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 5, 2023 We have a unique opportunity right now in front of us where we can take what 's in this act and put it into action, in some thing that ensures adult literacy programs that are effective and provide better out - comes through the reporting phase of this parti cular bill. That

part is going to be important. As we know that whenever we bring up programs such as this is that the reporting piece is very im por- tant because it allows us to collect necessary data so that we can, Hon ourable Deputy Speaker, create something that is reflective of the need of those parti- cular learners, and through a collection of this impor- tant data, we can then provide pro gramming that meets their requirements. So this act will work to ensure adult learners are on par with the prerequisite to get into some of that necessary post-secondary training that my colleagues have mentioned earlier.

The other piece that we want to ensure is that with this now change in gov ernment that we also in stitute some things that are really im portant to commu nity building. * (15:40) I can tell you, when a person is part of a commu- nity, they feel really connected to some thing that 's bigger than themselves, and the best way to do that is through an education system that's responsive to their needs. That's the piece that we're going to ensure that is included in –when we create this system that is responsive to the needs of the people that are actually in it.

There is a lack of access right now for people who want to pursue adult ed, especially outside of the city of Winnipeg. And we believe that that is some thing that has to be tackled, that this bill will put into place. Right now, what we have is we have a really good system through the K-to-12 system that already has a lot of the infra structure in place, Honourable Deputy Speaker, to provide some real guidance in creating this adult literacy plan that we talk about in Bill 5. We would love to see some thing very effective that, like we said –like I said earlier, is outside of the city of Winnipeg as well.

And how we do that will depend on what the people are telling us they need to make a success ful program really work for their needs. Right now, we have 1,250 adults in Manitoba that are participating in an adult literacy program. What happened is, is that that number, while the demand is actually higher than what the people are actually in right now. There is tremendous demand for adult literacy programs right now in this province that need to be met. And one of the ways that we 're looking at meeting that demand is partnering with school divisions.

I know when we met with Jim Silver and Fran Taylor, there was a model that many school divisions in the urban area here in Winnipeg are imple menting that meets people where they are and gets them into programs so that they c an improve their literacy and numeracy skills, Honourable Deputy Speaker. While the number is still kind of flat, what we have to do is we have to find a way to get more people into these programs with fewer barriers. I can tell you the one in River Eas t Transcona doesn 't charge students when they're 18 years and older and getting credit towards their high school diploma.

Those are some of the things that we need to do so that people aren 't facing that financial burden of getting their high school diploma. That's a piece that'll be im portant when we evaluate this pro gramming through the mandated reporting that's in it.

One of the biggest concerns, of course, that we have, and I think every member in this House has, is that out 1.4 million people , almost 200,000 Manitobans are functionally illiterate, which means they can 't fully participate –and we talk about it in the economy –but they can 't fully participate, also, in being a citizen that can be that necessary role model for their family. That 's a piece, too, that 's also important. This is–these are numbers that we have to tackle, that we have to get to.

And I know that every member in this House is interested in ensuring that we get these resources to people that need them the most. When we support adults to improve their reading and writing skills, we're helping them build a better life here in Manitoba. That's really important, because when you feel that you can participate, your own self-image also improves. And there 's something to be said for that, Honourable Deputy Speaker.

We see that all the time when we' re talking to students, when we're talking to people in any kind of learning study, if they don' t see them selves as effective learners, they're not going to be suc cessful. And the best people to help them with that are caring adults that are in the system, ready to go to meet them where their starting points are. And that's what's really important here too.

December 5, 2023 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 389 This bill will lead to higher literacy skills and reduce poverty, improve the health and well-being of individuals. We know the strain that many people feel when they 're unable to navigate systems to access health care, to access any kind of supports. For when you're functionally illiterate, that means that you have a h ard time, and then also have a hard time asking your friends to help you do this stuff. Of course your friends will help you, but you want to be a person that can do that on your own.

And so, with this act, Hon ourable Deputy Speaker, we're going to be a ble to put some of these pieces in place where we can create a system that is accessible to Manitobans throughout the province. We're committed to improving literacy and numeracy to get the support to people, and in being transparent in this progre ss. We 're going to ask for reports that can guide us in then developing the program even further, Honourable Deputy Speaker.

The first step we'll be doing is we'll work together with community partners and Manitobans to develop a strategy and improve not just–I mean, I know we talk about adult literacy and numeracy, but also talk about improving their own self -worth and feeling really good at, of –or, seeing them selves as learners. Capable people in an economy that requires educated people to fully participate in. The best way towards these really good family - supporting jobs is, of course, increasing somebody 's literacy and numeracy skills. And we 'll do this with this particular bill.

The other part that 's important is that it 's really important that we create something that we can really proud of here in Manitoba. We have many, many people throughout the adult learning environment and milieu in Manitoba that are doing great work. But what they're telling us, Hon ourable Deputy Speaker, is that we have to create a more unified and transpar- ent adult education system.

Because what's occurring right now is, like I said, we have a tremendous amount of programming that's out there, but it 's not co- ordinated, and they 're not able to learn from each other as to what's working in, say, a rural setting or what 's working in a northern setting or what's working in an urban setting. We need to bring those partners together so that we can create something that's a little more consistent in services, in expectations of the learners. And in the current structure, we have to ensure that the centres aren 't recreating their own wheel every time.

What we 're seeing is –what's really good about having school divisions is that there 's a real uni - fication and co- ordination. School divisions right now, Honour able Deputy Speaker, have a unifying body in MSBA that represents their interests. It 'd be great if the adult learning community also had some- thing that unifies them like that, to bring them together so that they can speak as one voice. So when they say they want a more unified and trans parent adult ed system, that's what they need.

It'd be great if they were able to–instead of have, you know, volunteer people, essentially, come to us and meet with us–it'd be great if they had a unified voice and someone that represents them at the table. I know we've said this many times, I know many of my colleagues here on this side of the House and, I do believe in all parts of the House, are– understand that adult ed is truly a buried treasure.

It 's one that 's untapped and one that 's ready to be –I guess, I don' t want to use the word exploited, because that sounds inappropriate–but I will say, one that 's ready to be utilized for the benefit of that person. And that's what's really important here. We need to build upon the solid base that now exists with a lot of these volunteer organizations, and a lot of organizations that have come to us to give us feedback in how to create something that could be – something that we can 'pre' proud of nationally here in this province. Many adult learners do well in a mature setting.

Many adults learners don 't do well in that really structured high-school setting that, for some, isn't the best place for them to be. So that 's what's the other piece that'll inform our decisi

Document details

Collection	Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	43-1-12b
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	43rd 1st hansardpdf 12b.pdf
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	acf6f56844496945b728ac38bab3208a354bccb0

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