British Columbia Hansard — 21 July 2020, a.m., Issue 344 (41st Parliament, 5th Session)

20200721am-Hansard-n344

British Columbia — Debates (Hansard)

Fifth Session, 41st Parliament OFFICIAL REPORT OF DEBATES (HANSARD) Tuesday, July 21, 2020 Morning Sitting Issue No. 344 THE HONOURABLE DARRYL PLECAS, SPEAKER ISSN 1499-2175

PROVINCE OF BRITISH COLUMBIA (Entered Confederation July 20, 1871) LIEUTENANT-GOVERNOR Her Honour the Honourable Janet Austin, OBC Fifth Session, 41st Parliament SPEAKER OF THE LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Honourable Darryl Plecas EXECUTIVE COUNCIL Premier and President of the Executive Council ............................................................................................................... Hon. John Horgan Deputy Premier and Minister of Finance............................................................................................................................Hon.

Carole James Minister of Advanced Education, Skills and Training..................................................................................................... Hon. Melanie Mark Minister of Agriculture.........................................................................................................................................................Hon. Lana Popham Attorney General.................................................................................................................................................................Hon.

David Eby, QC Minister of Children and Family Development ............................................................................................................ Hon. Katrine Conroy Minister of State for Child Care...................................................................................................................................... Hon. Katrina Chen Minister of Citizens’ Services...................................................................................................................................................Hon.

Anne Kang Minister of Education ............................................................................................................................................................ Hon. Rob Fleming Minister of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources ..................................................................................................... Hon. Bruce Ralston Minister of Environment and Climate Change Strategy............................................................................................. Hon.

George Heyman Minister of Forests, Lands, Natural Resource Operations and Rural Development ..............................................Hon. Doug Donaldson Minister of Health .....................................................................................................................................................................Hon. Adrian Dix Minister of Indigenous Relations and Reconciliation ......................................................................................................... Hon.

Scott Fraser Minister of Jobs, Economic Development and Competitiveness.............................................................................Hon. Michelle Mungall Minister of State for Trade...............................................................................................................................................Hon. George Chow Minister of Labour ...................................................................................................................................................................Hon.

Harry Bains Minister of Mental Health and Addictions............................................................................................................................ Hon. Judy Darcy Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing.................................................................................................................. Hon. Selina Robinson Minister of Public Safety and Solicitor General ........................................................................................................... Hon.

Mike Farnworth Minister of Social Development and Poverty Reduction..............................................................................................Hon. Shane Simpson Minister of Tourism, Arts and Culture.....................................................................................................................................Hon. Lisa Beare Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure................................................................................................................ Hon.

Claire Trevena LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Leader of the Official Opposition................................................................................................................................Andrew Wilkinson, QC Leader of the Third Party .................................................................................................................................................................Adam Olsen Deputy Speaker................................................................................................................................................................................

Raj Chouhan Assistant Deputy Speaker............................................................................................................................................................. Simon Gibson Deputy Chair, Committee of the Whole ................................................................................................................ Spencer Chandra Herbert Clerk of the Legislative Assembly ...........................................................................................................................................

Kate Ryan-Lloyd Law Clerk and Parliamentary Counsel.............................................................................................................................. Seunghee Suzie Seo Clerk Assistant, Parliamentary Services...........................................................................................................................

Artour Sogomonian Clerk Assistant, Committees and Interparliamentary Relations ..............................................................................................Susan Sourial Senior Research Analyst ................................................................................................................................................................. Jennifer Arril Senior Research Analyst ...................................................................................................................................................................

Karan Riarh Acting Sergeant-at-Arms..................................................................................................................................................................Greg Nelson

ALPHABETICAL LIST OF MEMBERS Ashton, Dan (BC Liberal) ......................................................................... Penticton Bains, Hon. Harry (NDP)................................................................ Surrey-Newton Barnett, Donna (BC Liberal) .....................................................Cariboo-Chilcotin Beare, Hon. Lisa (NDP)..............................................

Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows Begg, Garry (NDP) .......................................................................Surrey-Guildford Bernier, Mike (BC Liberal) .........................................................Peace River South Bond, Shirley (BC Liberal)...........................................Prince George–Valemount Brar, Jagrup (NDP).......................................................................Surrey-Fleetwood Cadieux, Stephanie (BC Liberal)........................................................

Surrey South Chandra Herbert, Spencer (NDP) .......................................Vancouver–West End Chen, Hon. Katrina (NDP)...................................................... Burnaby-Lougheed Chouhan, Raj (NDP) .................................................................Burnaby-Edmonds Chow, Hon. George (NDP).................................................Vancouver-Fraserview Clovechok, Doug (BC Liberal) ..................................Columbia River–Revelstoke Coleman, Rich (BC Liberal) ................................................................ Langley East Conroy, Hon.

Katrine (NDP)...........................................................Kootenay West Darcy, Hon. Judy (NDP) ............................................................. New Westminster Davies, Dan (BC Liberal) ........................................................... Peace River North de Jong, Michael, QC (BC Liberal) ..............................................Abbotsford West Dean, Mitzi (NDP)................................................................ Esquimalt-Metchosin D’Eith, Bob (NDP) ................................................................Maple Ridge–Mission Dix, Hon.

Adrian (NDP)....................................................... Vancouver-Kingsway Donaldson, Hon. Doug (NDP)...................................................................... Stikine Eby, Hon. David, QC (NDP).............................................. Vancouver–Point Grey Elmore, Mable (NDP).........................................................Vancouver-Kensington Farnworth, Hon. Mike (NDP) ........................................................Port Coquitlam Fleming, Hon. Rob (NDP) ......................................................

Victoria–Swan Lake Foster, Eric (BC Liberal).............................................................Vernon-Monashee Fraser, Hon. Scott (NDP) ..................................................Mid Island–Pacific Rim Furstenau, Sonia (BC Green Party) .............................................Cowichan Valley Gibson, Simon (BC Liberal) ...................................................Abbotsford-Mission Glumac, Rick (NDP).........................................................Port Moody–Coquitlam Heyman, Hon. George (NDP) ................................................Vancouver-Fairview Horgan, Hon.

John (NDP) ................................................ Langford–Juan de Fuca Hunt, Marvin (BC Liberal) ........................................................ Surrey-Cloverdale Isaacs, Joan (BC Liberal) .......................................... Coquitlam–Burke Mountain James, Hon. Carole (NDP).................................................... Victoria–Beacon Hill Johal, Jas (BC Liberal).................................................Richmond-Queensborough Kahlon, Ravi (NDP)............................................................................... Delta North Kang, Hon.

Anne (NDP)......................................................... Burnaby–Deer Lake Kyllo, Greg (BC Liberal)..............................................................................Shuswap Larson, Linda (BC Liberal) .............................................. Boundary-Similkameen Lee, Michael (BC Liberal) ........................................................Vancouver-Langara Leonard, Ronna-Rae (NDP) ..................................................... Courtenay-Comox Letnick, Norm (BC Liberal).............................................

Kelowna–Lake Country Ma, Bowinn (NDP) .....................................................North Vancouver–Lonsdale Malcolmson, Sheila (NDP) ........................................................................Nanaimo Mark, Hon. Melanie (NDP) .......................................Vancouver–Mount Pleasant Martin, John (BC Liberal)....................................................................... Chilliwack Milobar, Peter (BC Liberal)..................................... Kamloops–North Thompson Morris, Mike (BC Liberal) ........................................... Prince George–Mackenzie Mungall, Hon.

Michelle (NDP)......................................................Nelson-Creston Oakes, Coralee (BC Liberal) ............................................................ Cariboo North Olsen, Adam (BC Green Party)............................ Saanich North and the Islands Paton, Ian (BC Liberal).......................................................................... Delta South Plecas, Hon. Darryl (Ind.) ........................................................... Abbotsford South Polak, Mary (BC Liberal) ............................................................................. Langley Popham, Hon.

Lana (NDP)............................................................... Saanich South Ralston, Hon. Bruce (NDP) ............................................................Surrey-Whalley Redies, Tracy (BC Liberal) .......................................................Surrey–White Rock Reid, Linda (BC Liberal) ................................................. Richmond South Centre Rice, Jennifer (NDP) ............................................................................. North Coast Robinson, Hon.

Selina (NDP) .........................................Coquitlam-Maillardville Ross, Ellis (BC Liberal)................................................................................... Skeena Routledge, Janet (NDP) ....................................................................Burnaby North Routley, Doug (NDP) ................................................. Nanaimo–North Cowichan Rustad, John (BC Liberal) ................................................................Nechako Lakes Shypitka, Tom (BC Liberal) ..............................................................

Kootenay East Simons, Nicholas (NDP) ......................................... Powell River–Sunshine Coast Simpson, Hon. Shane (NDP)..................................................Vancouver-Hastings Sims, Jinny (NDP) ........................................................................ Surrey-Panorama Singh, Rachna (NDP) .........................................................Surrey–Green Timbers Stewart, Ben (BC Liberal) ................................................................. Kelowna West Stilwell, Michelle (BC Liberal)...............................................

Parksville-Qualicum Stone, Todd (BC Liberal)..........................................Kamloops–South Thompson Sturdy, Jordan (BC Liberal)........................................ West Vancouver–Sea to Sky Sullivan, Sam (BC Liberal)................................................ Vancouver–False Creek Sultan, Ralph (BC Liberal) ...........................................West Vancouver–Capilano Tegart, Jackie (BC Liberal) ................................................................. Fraser-Nicola Thomson, Steve (BC Liberal)......................................................

Kelowna-Mission Thornthwaite, Jane (BC Liberal) ...............................North Vancouver–Seymour Throness, Laurie (BC Liberal) .......................................................Chilliwack-Kent Trevena, Hon. Claire (NDP) ................................................................North Island Wat, Teresa (BC Liberal) ................................................. Richmond North Centre Weaver, Dr.

Andrew (Ind.)................................................Oak Bay–Gordon Head Wilkinson, Andrew, QC (BC Liberal) ................................Vancouver-Quilchena Y ap, John (BC Liberal)............................................................Richmond-Steveston LIST OF MEMBERS BY RIDING Abbotsford-Mission............................................................................Simon Gibson Abbotsford South....................................................................... Hon. Darryl Plecas Abbotsford West......................................................................

Michael de Jong, QC Boundary-Similkameen...................................................................... Linda Larson Burnaby–Deer Lake....................................................................... Hon. Anne Kang Burnaby-Edmonds................................................................................Raj Chouhan Burnaby-Lougheed .................................................................... Hon. Katrina Chen Burnaby North .................................................................................

Janet Routledge Cariboo-Chilcotin .............................................................................Donna Barnett Cariboo North.................................................................................... Coralee Oakes Chilliwack ............................................................................................... John Martin Chilliwack-Kent ...............................................................................Laurie Throness Columbia River–Revelstoke .........................................................

Doug Clovechok Coquitlam–Burke Mountain.................................................................. Joan Isaacs Coquitlam-Maillardville ...................................................... Hon. Selina Robinson Courtenay-Comox................................................................... Ronna-Rae Leonard Cowichan Valley .............................................................................

Sonia Furstenau Delta North.............................................................................................Ravi Kahlon Delta South ..................................................................................................Ian Paton Esquimalt-Metchosin ..............................................................................Mitzi Dean Fraser-Nicola .........................................................................................

Jackie Tegart Kamloops–North Thompson .............................................................Peter Milobar Kamloops–South Thompson..................................................................Todd Stone Kelowna–Lake Country .....................................................................Norm Letnick Kelowna-Mission ..............................................................................

Steve Thomson Kelowna West ..........................................................................................Ben Stewart Kootenay East.......................................................................................Tom Shypitka Kootenay West........................................................................ Hon. Katrine Conroy Langford–Juan de Fuca .............................................................. Hon. John Horgan Langley .....................................................................................................

Mary Polak Langley East.........................................................................................Rich Coleman Maple Ridge–Mission.............................................................................. Bob D’Eith Maple Ridge–Pitt Meadows............................................................Hon. Lisa Beare Mid Island–Pacific Rim................................................................ Hon. Scott Fraser Nanaimo......................................................................................

Sheila Malcolmson Nanaimo–North Cowichan............................................................... Doug Routley Nechako Lakes........................................................................................ John Rustad Nelson-Creston ................................................................... Hon. Michelle Mungall New Westminster........................................................................... Hon. Judy Darcy North Coast ...........................................................................................

Jennifer Rice North Island.............................................................................. Hon. Claire Trevena North Vancouver–Lonsdale................................................................... Bowinn Ma North Vancouver–Seymour........................................................Jane Thornthwaite Oak Bay–Gordon Head............................................................Dr.

Andrew Weaver Parksville-Qualicum.......................................................................Michelle Stilwell Peace River North ................................................................................... Dan Davies Peace River South ................................................................................ Mike Bernier Penticton ................................................................................................. Dan Ashton Port Coquitlam...................................................................... Hon.

Mike Farnworth Port Moody–Coquitlam.......................................................................Rick Glumac Powell River–Sunshine Coast....................................................... Nicholas Simons Prince George–Mackenzie....................................................................Mike Morris Prince George–Valemount ..................................................................

Shirley Bond Richmond North Centre..........................................................................Teresa Wat Richmond-Queensborough.........................................................................Jas Johal Richmond South Centre ......................................................................... Linda Reid Richmond-Steveston ...................................................................................

John Y ap Saanich North and the Islands .............................................................Adam Olsen Saanich South .............................................................................Hon. Lana Popham Shuswap...................................................................................................... Greg Kyllo Skeena........................................................................................................... Ellis Ross Stikine....................................................................................Hon.

Doug Donaldson Surrey-Cloverdale ................................................................................ Marvin Hunt Surrey-Fleetwood.....................................................................................Jagrup Brar Surrey–Green Timbers........................................................................Rachna Singh Surrey-Guildford......................................................................................Garry Begg Surrey-Newton ..............................................................................Hon.

Harry Bains Surrey-Panorama ...................................................................................... Jinny Sims Surrey South ................................................................................ Stephanie Cadieux Surrey-Whalley ......................................................................... Hon. Bruce Ralston Surrey–White Rock .............................................................................. Tracy Redies Vancouver-Fairview.............................................................. Hon.

George Heyman Vancouver–False Creek........................................................................ Sam Sullivan Vancouver-Fraserview...............................................................Hon. George Chow Vancouver-Hastings ............................................................... Hon. Shane Simpson Vancouver-Kensington....................................................................... Mable Elmore Vancouver-Kingsway..................................................................... Hon.

Adrian Dix Vancouver-Langara................................................................................ Michael Lee Vancouver–Mount Pleasant..................................................... Hon. Melanie Mark Vancouver–Point Grey ............................................................Hon.

David Eby, QC Vancouver-Quilchena........................................................Andrew Wilkinson, QC Vancouver–West End .....................................................Spencer Chandra Herbert Vernon-Monashee ....................................................................................Eric Foster Victoria–Beacon Hill.................................................................. Hon. Carole James Victoria–Swan Lake.................................................................... Hon. Rob Fleming West Vancouver–Capilano...................................................................

Ralph Sultan West Vancouver–Sea to Sky................................................................Jordan Sturdy Party Standings: BC Liberal 42; NDP 41; Independent 2; BC Green Party 2

CONTENTS Tuesday, July 21, 2020 Morning Sitting Page Routine Business Introductions by Members................................................................................................................................................... 12115 Introduction and First Reading of Bills.............................................................................................................................. 12115 Bill 24 — Municipalities Enabling and Validating (No. 4) Amendment Act, 2020 Hon. S.

Robinson Statements (Standing Order 25B) ....................................................................................................................................... 12116 Kelowna Farmers and Crafters Market S. Thomson High school graduates in Esquimalt-Metchosin area M. Dean Jim Good and Goodsir Nature Park S. Bond Raj Arneja and book on adoption J. Sims Mila Duke and Dravet syndrome treatment S. Cadieux Museum project for North Vancouver B.

Ma Oral Questions....................................................................................................................................................................... 12118 Impact of changes to workers compensation system A. Wilkinson Hon. J. Horgan J. Johal Hon. H. Bains Report on biodiversity and protection of old-growth forests S. Furstenau Hon. G. Heyman Impact of changes to workers compensation system P . Milobar Hon. H. Bains S. Bond M. de Jong S.

Cadieux Petitions .................................................................................................................................................................................. 12123 Hon. M. Mungall C.

Oakes Orders of the Day Third Reading of Bills ........................................................................................................................................................... 12123 Bill 13 — Miscellaneous Statutes Amendment Act, 2020 Committee of the Whole House.......................................................................................................................................... 12123 Bill 6 — Mines Amendment Act, 2020(continued) T. Shypitka Hon. B. Ralston

Schedule of Estimates ........................................................................................................................................................... 12128 Hon. M. Farnworth

TUESDAY , JULY 21, 2020 The House met at 10:05 a.m. [Mr. Speaker in the chair.] Routine Business Prayers and reflections: R. Sultan. Introductions by Members Hon. J. Horgan:Well, people will notice the absence of the Attorney General today, who, because it’s his birth- day, has been given dispensation to participate in question period virtually. I know all members would want to wish the Attorney a very happy, happy birthday. We won’t be in here on Thursday when the member for Port Coquitlam celebrates his birthday, but it’s important that everyone know that he is much, much older than me as a result of that.

So two birthdays, one for the member for Vancouver– Point Grey and one for the member for Port Coquitlam. Will the House join both of them — one getting not as old as the other one. Mr. Speaker:I see we have a little visitor in the House, Minister. Hon. M. Mungall:We do. Two years ago, right about at this time, I was cradling my brand-new baby in my arms. Here he is today, two years later. So we have another birth- day in the House.

It also means that Zavier is formally aged out of being able to join me on the floor, so this is his last opportunity to say hello to everybody from the floor of the Legislature and to say thanks to everybody for being so wonderful in welcoming him to this place over the last couple of years. If everybody please could join me in wishing this little guy a very happy birthday. Mr. Speaker:I think you can sneak him in again. S. Cadieux:John and Kristina Duke and their adorable daughter Mila are joining us today virtually in anticipation of a statement I’ll be making a little later.

If the House would please make them welcome. Introduction and First Reading of Bills BILL 24 — MUNICIPALITIES ENABLING AND V ALIDATING (No. 4) AMENDMENT ACT, 2020 Hon. S. Robinson presented a message from Her Honour the Lieutenant-Governor: a bill intituled Municipalities Enabling and Validating (No. 4) Amendment Act, 2020. Hon. S. Robinson:I’m pleased to introduce Bill 24, the Municipalities Enabling and Validating (No. 4) Amend- ment Act, 2020.

This bill seeks an amendment that is to validate and enable certain parcel taxes that were estab- lished by the Fraser Valley regional district with a proced- ural defect. Since 2017, the regional district has applied parcel taxes on approximately 700 properties that will fund local water and sewage services used by those properties. While the regional district has the statutory authority to impose the taxes, due to an oversight, it did not establish a parcel tax review panel as required under the Local Government Act and the Community Charter.

In addition, one of the bylaws did not fully comply with the statutory require- ment to identify the parcel tax roll in the bylaw. The proposed amendment will correct this oversight and validate the taxes imposed under these parcel tax bylaws from 2017 to 2020. The amendments also enable the imposition of parcel taxes, going forward, by allowing the regional district to retroactively establish the parcel tax review panel in accordance with the statutory require- ments. [10:10 a.m.] The Municipalities Enabling and Validating Act has pre- viously been used to validate similar procedural errors.

MEV A ’s purpose is to validate and enable local govern- ment actions and authorities in unique circumstances such as these or where the local government does not have their own source tools to address the issue. The proposed validating and enabling amendments will ensure that past services are funded and that the regional district can continue to impose the taxes sup- porting the essential water and sewage services to the recipient properties. Mr. Speaker:The question is first reading of the bill. Motion approved. Hon. S.

Robinson:I move that the bill be placed on the orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today. Bill 24, Municipalities Enabling and Validating (No. 4) Amendment Act, 2020, introduced, read a first time and ordered to be placed on orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today. 12115

Statements (Standing Order 25B) KELOWNA FARMERS AND CRAFTERS MARKET S. Thomson:Where is the best place to get breakfast on a Saturday morning and to shop for local produce and crafts? Well, the answer is the Kelowna Farmers and Crafters Market at the corner of Dilworth and Springfield, one of the largest farmers markets in British Columbia, with over 100 vendors and, in my view, one of the best farmers markets in B.C. Now, I might get a little bit of an argument on that point. This year the Kelowna farmers market is celebrating its 25th year of operation.

I was really looking forward to participating in the birthday celebration on June 20, but unfortunately, COVID-19 resulted in the planned party being cancelled. I must extend my congratulations to mar- ket coordinator Frances Callaghan and her team on get- ting the market open on April 4 with all of the appropriate health and safety protocols in place. Hopefully, we’re going to have the opportunity in the future to celebrate and rec- ognize their 25 years of growth and success.

The market operates every Wednesday and Saturday at the Dilworth location and also has a satellite Sunday mar- ket in the downtown core in Kelowna. The Sunday market is a great complement to the expanded patio space, with the closure of traffic along Bernard Avenue downtown, a measure to support restaurants and local small businesses in that downtown core.

The market has a tremendous array of local farmers and crafters that provide a wonderful bounty of fruits, vegetables, meats, flowers and processed products from my friends Jim and Lorena Wood at Eastwood Organic, Penny Gamble and her family from Gamble Farms, Karma Gill and his Karma farm products, Zelaney Farms from Coldstream. The market creates such a wonderful oppor- tunity for our local residents and all of our visitors to sup- port our wonderful Okanagan farmers and processors.

I’ d like to ask this House to recognize the great work of the team at the Kelowna Farmers and Crafters Market and also the leadership of the B.C. Association of Farmers Markets and farmers markets in communities all across the province. Buy local, shop local, and support our small businesses here in B.C. HIGH SCHOOL GRADUATES IN ESQUIMALT-METCHOSIN AREA M. Dean:I am so proud to rise today to express my con- gratulations and felicitations to all of the graduates from schools across Esquimalt-Metchosin this year, 2020. I missed watching you all at your ceremonies and hear- ing what your hopes and dreams are.

I know that you’ve worked hard, made sacrifices, had to balance many demands and have achieved a lot to be successful and reach this milestone. I also want to say thank you to every- one around you who has supported you through the years to reach this achievement. My heart goes out to our graduating classes of 2020. While putting in the effort to be successful, you’ve been studying in the midst of one of the most stressful global events of our time.

Thank you for doing your part to flat- ten the curve. [10:15 a.m.] Although your prom and festivities didn’t look the same, I know that you have been finding connections and celebrations and creating lasting memories. In Esquimalt, for example, the community organized a drive-by. I went down there to show my support and stood on the side of the road with many other people from the community. At first sight, it was actually really quite emotional. It was full of colour and sparkle and great joy and pride as well.

I know that other school communities found other ways to hold ceremonies to celebrate and honour their gradu- ates. There were very special and safe events. Let’s hold on to the positives and look to the future. I’m sure you will soar to wonderful new things. Graduates from Belmont, Royal Bay, Esquimalt High, Westshore learning and Victor Brodeur: I wish you all the very best and sincerely hope that you can fulfil your dreams. JIM GOOD AND GOODSIR NATURE PARK S. Bond: I am sure that every MLA in this Legislature has a place in their constituency that would be considered a hidden gem.

That would certainly be the case for Good- sir Nature Park, which is located a short distance north of Prince George. The creator of the nature park is Jim Good. Last year we celebrated 30 years since Jim founded Goodsir. He believes in following your dreams, and Jim did just that. His dream was to create a nature park that showcased a collection of Canada’s plant life. Goodsir Nature Park spans 160 acres and features over 2,000 plant species, which Jim collected throughout his travels across Canada.

There are groomed trails to view and learn about the plants, and each plant is carefully labelled and provides visitors with the name of the plant and where it can be found in Canada. One of the things that inspires me the most about the park is that each sign is handmade by Jim. Over the years, Jim developed the trails, which feature the different species of trees and plants from across our country. He will likely tell you that his favourite spot is called Little Goodsir Lake, where, if you are lucky, you might see an eagle, a beaver or a muskrat, all in their nat- ural habitat.

Jim began by homesteading on the property in the early 1980s, and he worked tirelessly to create the park. Jim wrote a declaration for Goodsir Nature Park. It says, in 12116 British Columbia Debates Tuesday, July 21, 2020

part: “Its purpose is to focus on all native plant life throughout Canada…. It was built on a janitor’s salary, and I believe it will stand the test of time for future generations to see. ” I have visited Goodsir Nature Park many times, and each time I am moved by the passion and drive of Jim Good, which resulted in this amazing hidden gem. Thank you, Jim, for giving us the incredible gift of Goodsir Nature Park. I, too, hope that it stands the test of time and gives future generations the enjoyment that my family has experienced. RAJ ARNEJA AND BOOK ON ADOPTION J.

Sims: Love at First Sight: A Mother’s Journey to Adop- tion. Raj Arneja is a pillar in our community. She is a businesswoman, a philanthropist and, most recently, an author. Raj’s book is a celebration of motherhood through adoption. She wrote this book with the hope that it will inspire more people to adopt or change their perspective on adoption. “My children are myjaans, my lifelines, and my souls, and this is the story of how I found them, ” says Raj.

After struggling with fertility issues for several years, Raj and her husband, Gurpreet, made the decision to embark on a journey that would change their lives forever, the journey to adopt. In 1992, with a suitcase full of pink and white, Raj headed to India to find her daughter and bring her home. After weeks of searching and a pilgrimage to the top of Hin Konsaib, Raj’s prayers were answered. She had a message that a baby had been abandoned at a private hospital in Delhi. Three months later Raj and her son Kabir were reunited with her family in Canada.

Four years later Raj and Kabir returned to India on a journey to complete their family. Kirti was born and became theirs. Before returning to Canada, Gurpreet and Raj visited the Golden Temple with their new family. In the book, Raj says that bringing Kabir and Kirti to the temple was her most spiritual and most moving moment ever. “I couldn’t have been more thankful than I was at that moment in my life. I had everything. My family was complete. ” [10:20 a.m.] A pillar of the community, a businesswoman, a philan- thropist, an author, a mother and my dear friend.

Thank you, Raj Arneja, for sharing your journey about completing your family. It is beautiful, it is courageous, it is uplifting, and it is filled with a love only a mother can express. MILA DUKE AND DRAVET SYNDROME TREATMENT S. Cadieux: Rare diseases affect a small percentage of the population, and it’s estimated that there are approxim- ately 7,000 rare diseases. Rare diseases have many differ- ent causes. Most are believed to be genetic, caused by devi- ations in chromosomes or genes.

Even though research- ers have made exceptional progress in learning how to diagnose, treat and prevent several of these rare diseases, many still have no treatment. Dravet syndrome is a rare genetic form of epilepsy that affects 1 in about 15,000 individuals. Individuals with Dravet syndrome experience frequent and prolonged seizures that start during infancy, delayed speech and lan- guage issues, sleeping difficulties, chronic infections and more. Mila Duke, a very young constituent of mine, is one of the few Canadians who has been diagnosed with Dravet syndrome.

This beautiful little toddler frequently has seizures which can last up to two hours and are life- threatening. Fintepla, an FDA-approved anti-seizure therapy for patients two years and older, has been approved. Mila’s parents, John and Kristina Duke, are hopeful that Fintepla might help improve Mila’s quality of life. However, right now, we don’t know if Fintepla will be approved in Canada, and even if it is, the affordability of the anti-seizure therapy will likely be another hurdle, as it’s projected the average cost could be $96,000 a year.

A service dog, trained to predict and help manage seizures, might be helpful, so John and Kristina are work- ing toward this. However, Mila’s young age makes her ineligible to get a dog from the only Canadian agency that trains dogs to handle seizures. Purchasing a dog from 4 Paws for Ability in Ohio will cost $17,000 U.S. Friends have established a GoFundMe page to help raise the money for Mila. Anyone who’ d like to support can visit www.gofundme.com/f/miracles-4-mila. I don’t know who said this, but isn’t it true: “ A disease may be rare, but hope should not be. ” MUSEUM PROJECT FOR NORTH V ANCOUVER B.

Ma: Down in the bustling, vibrant shipyards district lies a poorly kept secret, stored behind high hoarding walls and construction lights. Lovingly refurbished and painted bright red, the No. 153 streetcar is the last of its kind, one of the 13 original streetcars that took 1.9 million people up Lonsdale, over to Capilano and into Lynn Valley a century ago. That’s per year, by the way. Soon it will be viewable by the public.

But for now, it hides in the dark as the walls, floors and ceilings go up all around it within a 16,000-square-foot, city-owned amen- ity space inside the new Promenade building across from the Lonsdale Quay Market and Polygon Gallery. When the new museum of North Vancouver opens later this year, it will be more than simply a museum that serves the community. It will bring people together and build community, while connecting us to the past and encour- aging us to contemplate what it all means for the future.

There you will be able to find a curated and secure repos- itory for the treasures and stories of our shared history, as Tuesday, July 21, 2020 British Columbia Debates 12117

it plays a vital role in education for youth and provides an interactive alternative to the classroom education model. It will also serve as an exciting new venue for events in the lower Lonsdale area. We look forward to it contribut- ing significantly to the tourism economy as we restart from the impacts of COVID-19, which I hope we will continue to do, if people stay vigilant in maintaining their distance from one another. In a statement sent to me by the North Vancouver Museum and Archives, they said the following: “Stories are the threads that weave us together and form the fabric of community.

Museums are where communities discover themselves and grow strong and resilient. ” What an exciting project for North Vancouver. Oral Questions IMPACT OF CHANGES TO WORKERS COMPENSATION SYSTEM A. Wilkinson:Sadly, for the second time in less than a month, 21 industry groups, representing the majority of employees in British Columbia, have written to this gov- ernment saying that tens of thousands of small businesses are now seeing jobs put at risk. They write: “We urged your government to do no harm and set aside any measures that increase costs, regulatory burden and uncertainty.

But you’re ignoring the advice of B.C’s business leaders, owners, operators and those responsible for employing most British Columbians. ” [10:25 a.m.] To the Premier, when will he stop ignoring this advice in the middle of this crisis and stop putting thousands of B.C. jobs at risk? Hon. J. Horgan:I thank the Leader of the Opposition for his question. I did receive a copy of a letter from a number of business groups, talking about legislation that’s currently before the House that will amend the Workers Compensation Act. We believe those changes are modest.

We are certain that those changes will not lead to premium increases for busi- nesses in the short term. What it will do is provide more assistance for injured workers — something that hasn’t happened in 20 years. Mr. Speaker:The Leader of the Official Opposition on a supplemental. A. Wilkinson:Well, the Premier continues to defy real- ity. Three weeks ago, he stubbornly refused to accept com- mon sense on the issue of severance pay and finally beat a retreat when it became clear his position was completely untenable.

This time, the business community writes: “The govern- ment’s economic recovery plan is still unknown, and Bill 23 measures call into question the sincerity of your gov- ernment’s commitment to listen to British Columbians, particularly small, medium and large business employers. ” Will the Premier stop ignoring these cries for help in the middle of the worst economic crisis in our history and withdraw Bill 23 before thousands of jobs are lost for no good reason? Hon. J.

Horgan:Well, I’m sure that the Leader of the Opposition knows that the Workers Compensation Act was brought in to find balance between workers and employers, to keep people out of court when there was an injury at the workplace. That protects workers, it protects businesses, and that grand compromise has been going on in British Columbia for a long, long time. Over the previous 20 years of the Liberal government, their approach to workers compensation was to give back surplus premiums to businesses to the tune of $1.6 billion over the time of their government.

At no time did they increase, in any way, benefits for workers. So what we see with this act is a modest change, and it has been debated. I believe we’re going into committee stage on the bill. The member can certainly participate fully in that debate if he chooses to. What we’ve done is increase benefits for workers without it having any cost to business. Premiums remain the same this year; premiums remain the same next year. There was a consultation with Mr. Parr. We looked at all of the recommendations Mr. Parr brought forward.

Any recommendations that would have an adverse impact on business, we put to one side. But we’re not going to leave workers at risk. I appreciate the member from the other side understands this. The economy is about people. If you write the cheque or you cash the cheque, you need to work together — busi- ness and workers. That’s what this bill will do. That’s what the Workers Compensation Act was designed to do. J.

Johal:The Premier speaks about modest changes, but these so-called modest changes have united 21 organiza- tions, representing various sectors in our economy, repres- enting hundreds of thousands of workers, and they’ve all united together. The July 20 letter to the Labour Minister lays out the threat this government poses to economic recovery in stark terms.

They write: “Instead of holding the line on further business costs and regulatory enactments, you are doubling down on increasing business costs and adding uncertainty to B.C. ’s investment climate. ” To the Labour Minister: why is he putting workers at risk by doubling down on more red tape and regulations? Hon. H. Bains: The member full well knows that for too many years, workers and their families have been com- plaining that the workers compensation system isn’t fair, isn’t working for them. 12118 British Columbia Debates Tuesday, July 21, 2020

What we are doing is taking some important steps to modernize the Workers Compensation Act, ensuring that workers and their families get the support they need while keeping premiums low. Mr. Speaker:The member for Richmond-Queensbor- ough on a supplemental. J. Johal:There’s enough uncertainty in the world today because of COVID. Economic recovery and how we handle economic recovery is so very important. But right now, it’s NDP policy that is concerning these businesses. Just three weeks ago, this very Labour Minister, once again, had to walk it back because these various business organizations spoke up.

Not only does this government lack a business plan, but this Labour Minister’s policies are actually making things worse. [10:30 a.m.] Here’s another gem from the letter. “There was no con- sultation on Bill 23 measures in the context of COVID-19. It is ill-timed, ill-considered and ignores broad-based and repeated requests from the business community to do no harm. ” Again to the minister, why is he throwing an anchor instead of a lifeline to thousands of small businesses across B.C.? Hon. H. Bains: It is amazing. One day they stand up here and say that we do too much consultation.

On the other side, they stand up the next day to say we haven’t done enough. We have consulted. Four different reports were commis- sioned; all of them were consulted. All of the stakeholders were consulted. Jeff Parr went out and consulted on exactly the changes that we are talking about here. Let’s talk about some of those changes. Allowing Work- SafeBC to provide preventative medical treatment, which could save money, in the long term, for the system. Strengthen the ability of WorkSafeBC to investigate work- place safety infractions. Enhancing workers’ health and safety at workplaces.

Giving injured workers and their families a greater voice through victim impact statements. These changes are modest, but they are important to sup- port the workers who need help at the time when they need it. At the same time, we are enhancing health and safety of workers at workplaces. I hope all of us can agree with that. Also, we expect no increase to premiums in the next two years as a result of this bill. In fact, businesses will continue to pay less than the actual cost rate, thanks to the ongoing subsidies. REPORT ON BIODIVERSITY AND PROTECTION OF OLD-GROWTH FORESTS S.

Furstenau:Y esterday the Minister of Forests, Lands, Natural Resources acknowledged: “There is a need for stronger steps to protect biodiversity and to support work- ers and communities dependent on the forest resource. ” He promised that this government is taking a science- based approach to this issue. Today I’ d like to canvass, with the Minister of Environ- ment, what the science is actually saying about this gov- ernment’s current approach to old growth. Very recently, three independent scientists released a report titledA Last Stand for Biodiversity.

Using the government’s own data, these researchers have analyzed the current state of old growth in British Columbia. What did they find? It’s that the current levels of protection for old forests in B.C. are so low that they actually don’t support biodiversity. The status quo “puts biodiversity, ecological integrity and resilience at high risk today. ” My question is to the Minister of Environment and Cli- mate Change Strategy.

Does he agree that our current levels of old forest protection are inadequate to protect biodiversity in B.C., and if so, what is he doing to immedi- ately improve the amount of old forest protection? Hon. G. Heyman:Thank you to the Third Party House Leader for the question. I think it’s very clear from my colleague the Minister of Forests, Lands, Natural Resource Operations and Rural Development, both his activities and answer yesterday, that his focus on the important role of old forests for a multitude of values, including biod- iversity, led him and led our government to appoint the panel to do the review.

As he answered yesterday, he is very much in the pro- cess of reviewing the report, which included a significant submission from the independent report by three forest researchers that the member references. I’ve engaged with the minister in discussion about the old-growth panel’s report, about the report of the independent scientists, about his thoughts going forward. I’ve joined the minister in meetings with concerned environmental organizations to talk about their ideas, as well as the review process that the minister is undertaking.

I’m confident that the minister’s response to these reports will be meaningful and will help us chart a path forward, along with the activities being undertaken in my ministry. Mr. Speaker:The House Leader of the Third Party on a supplemental. S. Furstenau:While all of this review and the panel are doing their work, unfortunately, old forests are disappear- ing, and they’re disappearing forever.

Returning to the sci- entists’ report, they found, again using the government’s own data, that less than 1 percent of our total forest area in B.C. is made up of big-tree forests. [10:35 a.m.] These are the forests that people think of when they Tuesday, July 21, 2020 British Columbia Debates 12119

think about old growth. They are highly productive eco- systems. They produce majestic trees, and they provide unique, rare habitats, but they have almost vanished. To quote the authors: “These ecosystems are effectively the white rhino of old-growth forests. They are almost extin- guished and will not recover from logging. ” We don’t get a second chance at this. If this government is truly com- mitted to protecting biodiversity, they will act to stop the bleed in these rare old forests. My question is again to the Minister of Environment and Climate Change Strategy.

Will he work with his cab- inet colleagues to put a moratorium on logging our last remaining, productive old growth in British Columbia? Hon. G. Heyman: Our government is very committed to protecting biodiversity and to finding a way forward that is respectful of workers, of communities, of Indigen- ous nations and of the flora and fauna which provide such an important set of ecological services to all of us and which ensure that the water we drink, the air we breathe and the abundance of life around us maintain the biod- iversity that is so critical for all of us going forward.

That’s why we’ve been reviewing and working with environmental groups and others on different ways to improve species at risk as we move toward legislation. We’re taking some significant policy measures, including consistent implementation of mitigating and offsetting measures for development activities as well as renewal of our approach to prioritizing and listing of species at risk. We’re also working with the federal government and Indigenous Nations. We’ve protected rare inland tem- perate rainforest in the Darkwoods Conservation Area with the federal government and the Nature Con- servancy of Canada.

Working with my colleague the Minister of Forests, we protected from further logging the Skagit Valley Donut Hole. We’ve also protected habitat for other species at risk by moratoria, set-asides and conservancies. My colleague the Minister of Forests, Lands and Natural Resources, I know — because I talk to him on a regular basis — is applying himself to ensuring that the report is considered and implemented in a meaningful way, including meas- ures that need to be taken in the short term, as well as measures in the long term.

He’s doing that in a way that is respectful of govern- ment-to-government relationships and true consultation. He’s doing that in a way that’s respectful of workers and communities. He’s doing that in a way that will guarantee that we have good protections and good protection of biodiversity and rare species, including old-growth forests, going forward. IMPACT OF CHANGES TO WORKERS COMPENSATION SYSTEM P .

Milobar:In the Labour Minister’s answers so far today, it feels like he’s just reading his answers from Hansard from three weeks ago, when he eventually walked back that failed plan for the business community as well. The reality is that the business community, including members of the Premier’s own task force, are pleading with this government to do no harm. In fact, they sent a letter yesterday that was nine pages long. This is not just a quick little note that they scratched out with some objections. It’s nine pages.

They write: “Simply put, now is not the time to add more costs and uncertainty to B.C. ’s workers compensation system. ” Again to the Labour Minister, why is the Labour Min- ister so intent on adding costs and uncertainty, which will put thousands of jobs at risk, when the 21 signator- ies have very clearly signalled that that is exactly what will happen with Bill 23? Hon. H. Bains: For the reasons that have been can- vassed here, our approach has been very measured and fol- lows significant review by Mr. Parr. We decided not to pro- ceed with all of Mr. Parr’s recommendations.

In fact, if we had, it would have cost $700 million to the WCB’s accident fund. Because of COVID-19, because of circumstances we are going through, we decided not to proceed with those recommendations. We put them aside. As I said before, our approach is fair to businesses, who will not see an increase in their premiums in the short term as a result of this bill. Also, it’s fair to the workers, who have not seen any improvement to the workers com- pensation system in 20 years.

In fact, striking the right bal- ance, businesses will continue to receive a subsidy on their premiums, paying only $1.55 when the cost is $1.67. [10:40 a.m.] I stand with our decision to make long-overdue changes and modernize the workers compensation system, while keeping the premiums for the businesses low and stable. P . Milobar:I’m assuming — and it wouldn’t surprise me — that the minister seems to think that because busi- nesses’ remittances have gone down, they’re saving money. But the remittances have gone down because they don’t have employees working right now. They have no payroll to remit against.

At a time when hundreds of thousands of British Columbians have lost their jobs, this government is making things worse. Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members, the member for Kamloops– North Thompson has the floor. Thank you. P . Milobar:Sorry, Mr. Speaker. I seem to have struck a nerve there. I quote about how they’re making things worse. Again, from the nine-page letter: “These added costs will impact businesses of all size and their ability to restart, rehire and 12120 British Columbia Debates Tuesday, July 21, 2020

contemplate new investment in the province. Ultimately, additional costs for Bill 23 will harm people from all walks of life who have lost or are on the brink of losing their live- lihoods. ” This is the second time in three weeks that the minister is failing to listen to small businesses and putting their jobs at risk. Why does the minister insist on continuing down this path of added costs and uncertainty for business? Hon. H. Bains:Let’s talk about who we are actually talk- ing about here. These are our front-line workers. These are the people working in health care.

These are the people that are working in the grocery stores, cleaners, construc- tion workers, doctors, nurses, care aides. These are the people that they and all of us stand at seven o’ clock every night and support them for the work that they do. When those…. Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. Members, the minister has the floor. Hon. H. Bains:When it is to follow with our actions, they’re gone missing again — true to their form. We’re proud of the work that we are doing, proud that we are taking a measured approach due to the circum- stances that we have — support the workers, enhance their health and safety.

At the same time, provide them support when they become sick or injured in the workplace. It’s a balanced approach, and it’s keeping businesses’ premiums low and stable. I don’t know what else is what is called balanced. That exactly is a balanced approach. S. Bond:Well, to be clear, this is a pattern for the Labour Minister. He rejected the request to extend the temporary layoff extension, and he was called out for it. Now job creators are saying, in a nine-page document: “There was no consultation in the context of COVID-19, calling into question the sincerity of your government’s commitment to listen.

Minister, this has been a recurring challenge with your approach. ” To the Labour Minister, those aren’t my words; those are the words of job creators across the province. When is he going to stop being dismissive of small businesses and listen to their serious concerns? Hon. H. Bains: When COVID-19 hit, we all under- stood that we needed to act quickly, and we did. The Min- ister of Finance came up with a $5 billion aid package — $1.8 billion to the businesses, $700 million in tax breaks to the property taxes for businesses. Deferred taxes.

WCB has allowed them to defer their premiums for six months without interest or penalty. They have waived premiums for certain employers as well. They are making decisions that the businesses will continue to get a subsidized rate. It costs $1.67, versus $1.55 that they continue to pay. This is the right balance. We must improve the health and safety of the workplace. We also must support them when they are injured. Mr. Speaker, what they’re talking about is if a nurse or a care aide contracted COVID-19… Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. Hon. H.

Bains: …at a workplace, she does not need support by improving the workers compensation system. Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. Hon. H. Bains: That is exactly what we are doing — supporting those workers who are supporting us and risk- ing their health right now. I hope they will get over this ideological block that they always have and support those workers who are supporting us in tough times right now. [10:45 a.m.] Mr. Speaker:The member for Prince George–Vale- mount on a supplemental. S.

Bond: Well, hundreds of employers across British Columbia are saying to this minister that they have con- cerns that they want him to listen to. Let’s be clear. This government has not yet articulated a jobs plan. No economic recovery strategy. On top of that, we now have the Business Council, the B.C. Chamber of Commerce, the Vancouver Board of Trade, the Retail Council, COFI, the tourism industry and many others all saying the same thing, that this Labour Minister is making things worse. The bottom line is this bill.

Again, I quote from their nine-page letter to the Labour Minister. “The bill calls into question whether you are interested in facilitating a lasting economic recovery for all British Columbians. ” Perhaps to the Premier, when is this government going to respond to these significant concerns and put forward a jobs plan instead of putting thousands of B.C. jobs at risk? Hon. H. Bains:If we look at what’s in the bill that they are talking about — for example, diagnostic and prevent- ative treatment before a WCB decision….

In some cases, workers may require diagnostic and preventative treat- ment before the WCB decides on their claim. Provide such health care services on a timely basis, including before a decision is made, because it could become a serious illness for that worker. Also, it could cost the system more money. Tuesday, July 21, 2020 British Columbia Debates 12121

This one is striking the right balance by trying to help the worker, at the same time, when they need it and by keeping the premiums for the employers low. M. de Jong: What the Labour Minister doesn’t seem to want to acknowledge is that the people responsible for employing the majority of British Columbians don’t see this as a balanced approach. We were reminded yesterday just how fragile the public health situation is in B.C. and how we all have to conduct ourselves with that fragility in mind. But does the Labour Minister understand how fragile the economic situation is in British Columbia?

Does he understand how many busi- nesses are hanging on by their fingernails and how the decision about whether to rehire an employee or shut the doors forever is hanging in the balance? Instead of offering a helping hand, he decides now, when those small, family-owned businesses are at their most vulnerable, to impose additional uncertainty, to impose additional costs. It has become a recurring theme with this Labour Minister. Why does he insist on proceeding with changes that are, to quote those employers, “ill-timed and ill-considered” and ignore repeated requests from businesses to do no fur- ther harm? Hon.

H. Bains:I think our record is very clear. We have shown…. When businesses were going through tough times because of COVID-19, government acted — a $5 billion aid package, deferred taxes, cut taxes and $1.5 bil- lion set aside for economic recovery. We fully understand the economic challenges that businesses are going through. That’s why all those support systems were in place in a timely fashion. We need to understand that the workers also need sup- port during these tough times. Their health and safety cannot be compromised. Their health and safety must be enhanced. Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. Hon. H.

Bains:They need support when they become sick in the workplace. This system is 20 years old. Interjections. Mr. Speaker:Members. Hon. H. Bains:They have not seen any improvements in 20 years. Mr. Speaker:Minister. [10:50 a.m.] Hon. H. Bains: They need our support as well. That’s why we did not go with Mr. Parr’s recommendations. Those were costly. We know times are tough for busi- nesses. That’s why we did not proceed with them. What we are proceeding with is a measured approach where workers’ health and safety will be improved.

They will get the support when they need it, when they are hurt or injured in the workplace, and, at the same time, keeping employer premiums stable and low. Mr. Speaker:The member for Abbotsford West on a supplemental. M. de Jong: What those employees want is a job to return to, and this minister is putting those jobs at risk. Here’s what he’s being told: “Y ou are doubling down on increasing fixed and variable business costs and adding uncertainty to B.C. ’s investment climate.

Y our bill will undermine employers trying to survive and rehire people. ” When is the last time we have seen groups representing the vast majority of workers, employees in British Colum- bia, come together to deliver this kind of condemnation of this Labour Minister? Well, actually, it was only two or three weeks ago.

What is it about the current situation, the current public health uncertainty and the current economic fragility that exists today that convinced this Labour Minister that now is the perfect time to introduce measures that will neg- atively impact businesses of all sizes and their ability to restart, rehire and make further investments in B.C. when we need it most? Hon. H. Bains:If you take a look, the employers have been getting support from the government, from Work- SafeBC. They have allowed them to defer their premiums for six months.

They will continue to get subsidized premi- ums, $1.67 cost to $1.55 as what they pay. They will con- tinue to enjoy that subsidy as a result of the workers com- pensation accident fund. At the same time, we must support the workers that we support at seven o’ clock every day. I don’t know why they cannot stand up and say to those workers that we are showing that support with our actions in this House. They’re denying the support that they need, when they need the WCB system. They’re saying no to that.

We are proud of the work we are doing to support those workers’ health and safety at workplaces and, at the same time, keeping employers’ premiums low and stable. For once I’m asking that they will stand up and say to those workers in this province, who are an important cog in that wheel of our economy: “We support you. We support your health and safety. ” That’s what’s needed from all of us during the tough times that we’re going through. But no, true to their form, they show total disrespect to the workers. As a result, I’ve 12122 British Columbia Debates Tuesday, July 21, 2020

seen, in the last 12 to 16 years, total contempt towards the working people. We are proud of the work that we are doing to support those workers, because they need our support, and, at the same time, supporting employers, keeping their premiums low and stable. S. Cadieux:I’ll tell workers that I will stand up for their right to a job. Workers need jobs. The unemployment rate is at 13 percent, and 95 percent of the job losses have been in the private sector.

They are struggling to recover, but instead of helping, this government is taking actions that, to quote business leaders and business owners, will under- mine the employers trying to survive and rehire people. “Bill 23 is ill-timed, ill-considered and ignores broad- based and repeated requests from the business community to do no harm. ” To the Labour Minister, he has a choice. Will he choose to save thousands of jobs and pull this legislation? Hon. H. Bains: That’s why, right from the beginning when this pandemic hit, government moved quickly. That’s why there’s $1.5 billion set aside to restart our eco- nomy.

That’s why we did not shut the economy, as other jurisdictions did: so as to keep those people employed. [10:55 a.m.] They’re forgetting one key part of the economy: people. Those are the workers who help move that economy along. They need our support. They also need to make sure that their health and safety are protected, make sure that the worker who goes to work in the morning comes home safe and healthy. That’s what we are doing. We’re proud of doing it. This is right thing to do, and it is the right time for it. [End of question period.] Petitions Hon. M.

Mungall:I’ d like to present a petition today on behalf of my constituents in the Salmo area. They have a petition here wanting to reaffirm the priority need to replace Salmo Elementary School. C. Oakes:I present a petition on behalf of all of the con- stituents of the affected area of Quesnel-Hydraulic Road. The petition has been forwarded by mail, and the Clerk’s office has it. The residents are asking for immediate steps to be taken to reopen the Quesnel-Hydraulic Road as a result of the slide this spring.

The continued closure of this road is severely jeopardizing the safety and industry of the affected residents. All of the residents, 72 people, have signed the petition. Orders of the Day Hon. M. Farnworth:I call third reading of Bill 13, Mis- cellaneous Statutes Amendment Act. Third Reading of Bills BILL 13 — MISCELLANEOUS STATUTES AMENDMENT ACT, 2020 Bill 13, Miscellaneous Statutes Amendment Act, 2020, read a third time and passed. Hon. M. Farnworth:I call continued committee stage, Committee of the Whole, Bill 6, Mines Amendment Act.

Committee of the Whole House BILL 6 — MINES AMENDMENT ACT, 2020 (continued) The House in Committee of the Whole (Section

B) on Bill 6; R. Chouhan in the chair. The committee met at 10:59 a.m. On

section 2(continued). [11:00 a.m.] T. Shypitka:Just a quick recap on yesterday. I’ll just go through six items here. The minister can agree or com- ment if he wishes. One, the reg counts, the minister indicated, will go up by nine. Two, the minister will designate a person under the Public Service Act that will not necessarily require any practical mining experience or technical skills. Three, the budget for this new CA and audit unit is under the Ministry of Energy and Mines. The salary for the CA is somewhere between $90,000 and $118,000, depending on experience.

Four, it is unclear how many FTEs will be required to round out the audit unit and what the budget is, but what is noted is that it will all come from the $20 million alloc- ated to the ministry, and it will come from the compliance and enforcement side and not from permitting and authorizations. Five, industry professionals will be allowed to work for the audit unit, but it will be more contract work than a paid house employee. Six, conflict will not be an issue, as industry profession- als that do work for the chief auditor will not work for the chief inspector or the chief permitting officer.

It leads to my first question, I guess. Will the minister commit to ensuring that there is minimal competition for the existing pool of experts in this province and that Tuesday, July 21, 2020 British Columbia Debates 12123

appropriate procedures will be in place to ensure experi- ence is available to all offices and industry participants? [11:05 a.m.] Hon. B. Ralston:The member has offered his own recapitulation and

summary of yesterday’s debate. He went through that very rapidly. We had full debate on all of those items yesterday. It seems to be a version of chewing his cabbage twice. I don’t think it’s productive for me to go through each of the

summary points that he makes, because some of them, frankly, I don’t agree with. They’re not accurate. It’s an unusual way to proceed given that we had very full debate on these sections yesterday. If he hopes to gain some kind of rhetorical advantage by offering his own

summary, a biased

summary, of what took place yesterday, I don’t think it’s very helpful in advancing the bill. So I reject his recapitulation and sum- mary of what took place yesterday. If he wishes to go through those, then we will go through them, one by one, and we’ll repeat what we did yesterday. If that’s his plan, if that’s his idea of spending the time of the Legislature and the citizens of British Colum- bia productively, so be it. I’ll endeavour to respond. But for the moment, I don’t agree with his

summary, and I’m not going to respond to it. To the question that he posed, hirings will take place according to all the statutory mechanisms that the public service is required to follow — the Public Service Act, the oversight of the Merit Commissioner. The best people will be hired in accordance with all the necessary internal pro- cedures, and I’m confident that there are qualified candid- ates out there who want to come forward and serve the public service of British Columbia and the citizens of Brit- ish Columbia with merit and distinction. T. Shypitka:Well, I’m not sure what to say.

If the min- ister is opposed to any of the summations I made — there were only six of them — maybe he could indicate which he doesn’t agree with. But going forward, there is a limited pool of experts in this province. So the question was: will the minister commit to ensuring that there’s minimal competition? The audit unit is independent from other regulatory functions, such as permitting and compliance and enforcement, so there is only so much to go around. The question and con- cern is a limit of professionals that are out there in the field that can do this work and not be in fear of conflict.

The question once again is: will the minister commit to ensuring that there’s minimal competition for the existing pool of experts in the province? Hon. B. Ralston:I’m wondering if the member could specify what he means by “minimal competition. ” He has used that expression a couple of times. I’m not sure what he means by that, so perhaps he could explain it. To limit competition in a way that would violate any of the statutes would be, I think, problematic. I’m not sure what his intention is and what direction he’s going with his question when he uses that phrase “minimal competition. ” T.

Shypitka:Well, the audit unit is independent from other regulatory functions. To eliminate any type of con- flict, industry professionals can’t move around within those regulatory functions or they will be in conflict, as the minister said yesterday. So would the minister ensure that the limited pool of resources that we have is not grabbed by one regulatory function or the other and that the pool, which is a finite number…? [11:10 a.m.] Will the minister ensure that that pool of resources can be equally distributed within the different regulatory functions so that one doesn’t have them all and some others don’t?

Hon. B. Ralston:Y esterday I did state that the rules that will pertain to the ability of people within the industry to move from one job to another, from one contract to anoth- er, will not unduly hamper that movement. There is cer- tainly every confidence that while there are the required prohibitions against conflict in some circumstances, gen- erally, that will not inhibit movement from one job to another or from one contract to another. Certainly, the idea that….

The experience of the min- istry is that whenever there is a competition posted, there are many qualified applicants for those positions, and there is no shortage of people with the right quali- fications seeking employment with the public service of British Columbia. T. Shypitka:So the minister declares there would be no shortage of professionals. Okay. We’ll go to another

section here. Well, not another sec- tion, sorry. Another part of

section 2. This is on delega- tions and accompaniment onto mine sites. Are these del- egations — these people that can assist or walk on mine sites with an inspector — under the added

section 2.4 con- sistent with the Public Service Act? [11:15 a.m.] Hon. B. Ralston:I’m advised that proposed

section 2.4 is consistent with the Public Service Act. T. Shypitka: Does the appointee need any mining experience or education? Hon. B. Ralston:The act specifies the powers of the chief auditor and his or her power to delegate power. It does not set out the qualifications. Those qualifications would be included in the job description. Just as in the case of the chief auditor, the process of selection would fol- low the job description, and the person with the requisite 12124 British Columbia Debates Tuesday, July 21, 2020

measure of auditing qualifications and mining experience who best qualified for the position would be the person selected. T. Shypitka:Chair, if I could make a little point of order here. The last couple of questions haven’t been really dif- ficult. The last question, in particular, was something I asked the minister yesterday on the chief auditor’s appoint- ment through the Public Service Act, and essentially, it’s the same answer for here. In the spirit of good process here, maybe the minister could deliver on the answers a little bit more quickly. [11:20 a.m.] I’ll move to the next one here.

How much notice must be given on an appointment? The Chair:Member, that was not a point of order, but your comments are appreciated. Was there any question to the minister? T. Shypitka:Y es. How much notice must be given on an appointment? Hon. B. Ralston:No notice is required. T. Shypitka:So no notice is required. If that’s the case, then how is the ministry or how would the chief audit- or…? How would they know if there’s a mines manager on site or the proper people to do an inspection with that’s representative of the company? Hon. B. Ralston:No notice is required in a legal sense.

The mine manager — who that person is — would be known by the people visiting the site. In a practical sense, in some cases, there might be advance discussion of the presence or the arrival of the people delegated by the chief auditor, but it’s not legally necessary. T. Shypitka:Well, I just would think that to do a proper audit, you would need the proper people to ensure that the audit is complete and done correctly. Certain things, like files or access would be required, and if most people aren’t there, then that audit won’t be done professionally. I’m concerned about that.

Is the minister concerned about giving proper notice? [11:25 a.m.] Hon. B. Ralston:The decision of whether or not to give notice is left to the discretion of the chief auditor. That would depend on the nature of the audit, the reputation or the problem that was being investigated, and there may be reasons not to give notice in some cases so that that discre- tion is left to the chief auditor. T. Shypitka:The only problem is….

What I see is a chief auditor comes in unannounced with an appointee in tow, and they make an inspection without some of the people that know that operation the best to give explanation or rationale for some concerns that the auditor may have. That gets written down, and there is no opportunity, at that point on the site visit, to give rebuttal or explanation. Does that not concern the minister at all? Hon. B. Ralston:An audit is an investigation of a type that, in order to be successful and to be thorough, would have to be fair.

So the opportunity to respond to anything that is discovered or commented upon by the chief auditor or her delegate would always be given to the subject of the audit. That’s pretty much the nature of the audit process. It requires the opportunity to thoroughly examine, look at the findings, give an opportunity to the auditee to respond in a timely way and as thoroughly as they deem fit in order for the audit to have validity and to achieve the purposes that its intended to achieve under the act. So that’s the nature of an audit.

I’m confident that with the selection of the right people, with a combination of mining experience and audit experience, audits that are conducted by the chief auditor will exhibit those qualities. T. Shypitka:My only concern is — and I’ll say it again — if the company has a chance to respond. If it’s after the fact of the site visit, it becomes essentially hearsay at that point. The best opportunity to address any kind of con- cerns or questions would be at that time when the inspec- tion is taking place.

For example, the chief auditor doesn’t have to have any particular mining experience, and he’s on the reliance of his appointee that’s coming in to the mine site for inspec- tion. He relies on that person, and then maybe that person has a different view of what mining is all about. Hazardous material near an ecological sensitive area could be 20 metres, explained, but it could actually be 50 metres, and this becomes this grey area during an audit.

The respondent, the representative from the company, has to make this response after the fact. [11:30 a.m.] Conditions may change between that time and when he gets a chance to respond, and it all becomes what the auditor and the appointee say and not so much on what the mines manager or whoever is representing that com- pany says. In all fairness, to be fair in the process, all parties should be present during an audit. I don’t see how it can work any better than that. Is the minister prepared to make any oth- er further comment on that? Hon. B.

Ralston:The member has given a fairly fanciful hypothetical with a number of what-ifs and avenues that the question meanders down. What I can say about any audit — in order to be a valid audit under the act, it would have to follow the principles of administrative fairness. Tuesday, July 21, 2020 British Columbia Debates 12125

That’s pretty standard — the right to a fair investigation, the right to be heard, the right to respond to anything that is asked by way of a question. I don’t think it’s useful for me as the minister to be pre- scribing to the chief audit officer or the chief auditor how she or he should conduct the investigations. The mem- ber has a predetermined idea of how an audit should take place. I think I would rather leave that to the professional judgment of the person selected and their delegates to con- duct that in accordance with the principles that are set out in the act. T.

Shypitka:I’m kind of speechless that the minister doesn’t want to participate in any way to try to ensure there is fairness on a mine site, on a mine inspection, during an audit. It’s this minister’s responsibility to ensure these practices are proper and fair for everyone. To brush it aside and say, “Well, that’s the chief auditor’s job…. ” I’m not too sure I’m confident with the minister’s approach to mining in this province. We’ll get on to another one. The next question is: can the delegated appointee be working in any public or private mining operation or office, or would they be an existing public servant?

Hon. B. Ralston:First, I want to deal with the member’s comments about some suggestion that somehow he thinks my role as the minister is to interfere in the conduct of an audit or to set rules for the conduct of an audit. The legis- lative scheme that we’re advancing here delegates those powers to the chief auditor in a quasi-independent way and relies on her or his discretion to carry that out. [11:35 a.m.] The person selected will have the requisite judgment, experience and skills to conduct a fair audit. It’s not a lack of concern. That’s the very reason we are advancing this legislation.

So to suggest that somehow I don’t care about the quality of the audit seems to me to be absurd, if I could use a descriptor. The delegates will be employees of the audit unit. They will be public servants who are employed full-time. T. Shypitka:What was the process for developing the chief auditor’s mandate? At the same time, who was con- sulted in the development of the mandate? Hon. B. Ralston:Well, the debate about how best to achieve the purposes that are set out in the provisions of this proposed act really begins with the Auditor General’s inquiry into the Mount Polley mining disaster.

Following that — and much discussion, consideration by the Public Accounts Committee and internal discus- sions within the ministry — the next major venue of dis- cussion was the Mining Jobs Task Force. It is — and I’ve stated, and this is the fact — a wide selection of people intimately involved in the industry, whether industry people, labour, Indigenous people, experts in many areas relating to mining, chaired by the assistant deputy min- ister, Peter Robb, who continues in that position in the ministry — the assistant deputy minister responsible for mining.

So there has been a very, very thorough and lengthy discussion over a number of years about how best to accomplish these legislative purposes that are being advanced here today. The Mining Jobs Task Force did recommend that a com- pliance and health effectiveness unit be established. That was one of their recommendations. So the legislation fol- lows all of that discussion and consultation in order to achieve the objectives of the recommendation of the Min- ing Jobs Task Force. [11:40 a.m.] T. Shypitka:It’s good to see the minister abiding by the Auditor General’s recommendations.

Y et they failed to fol- low up on the primary recommendation, which was to separate compliance enforcement out of the ministry. However, did any stakeholders…? Does the minister…? He mentioned the Mining Jobs Task Force as being a com- ponent of the consultation. Were there any other stake- holders consulted? Hon. B. Ralston:The member makes a passing com- ment in relation to the Auditor General’s report about the government failing to follow the principal recom- mendation.

I had understood that the then Mines Min- ister, Bill Bennett, had dismissed that recommendation and that the member supported that, so I’m a little bit mystified by that reference. I’m not quite sure how it’s relevant to our discussion. But in terms of consultation, there was a public pro- cess in the fall of 2019. There were 135 submissions made in that process. The industry associations — Min- ing Association of B.C. and AME BC — and selected companies, such as Teck, were consulted. There has been a very thorough and wide discussion of the proposed content of this bill. T. Shypitka:The comment was what it was.

Y es, former government did argue that compliance enforcement should stay within the ministry. We were criticized by the current government on that stance. I guess it’s just more of a comment to say that I’m glad to see government land where we wanted to land years ago. I guess the next question is: why were no economic or competitiveness components included in the mandate of the chief auditor? [11:45 a.m.] Hon. B. Ralston:Indeed, the Mining Jobs Task Force did say the following. I’m going to read a quote from the task force report: 12126 British Columbia Debates Tuesday, July 21, 2020

“This action supports an increased focus on B.C. ’s competit- iveness and advocacy for new mining investment, while support- ing independence for mining oversight and positioning B.C. to be a leader in industry safety.

Clear separation of these functions will help increase public, Indigenous and industry confidence and trust, as well as improve permitting timelines — all of which are critical to a thriving mining industry in this province. ” The legislation that’s before the House that we are debat- ing now reflects those values and follows that conclusion of the Mining Jobs Task Force of the effect of adopting these provisions. T. Shypitka:Thanks to the minister for the answer. Sounds good. Can the minister comment on how this bill actually increases permitting timelines, as he just stated? Hon. B.

Ralston:The member’s question said: how would this increase permitting timelines? What the goal is, is to improve and reduce permitting timelines. The pur- pose and design of the bill is to separate permitting from health and safety and enforcement. It creates a stand-alone statutory decision-maker dedicated to permitting. There is one person responsible for permitting, and they won’t be in the position of having to make trade-offs between doing inspections, hearing appeals, following up on dangerous occurrences and the many other responsibilities that all currently reside with the chief inspector of mines.

That’s the goal of the legislation. The goal is not, as the member has said, to increase permitting timelines; it’s to decrease them and reduce them. T. Shypitka:My apologies to the minister. I did mis- speak there. It was to improve permitting timelines, not to increase. As the minister says, this process here is to formalize that separation of compliance and enforcement from per- mitting and authorizations. We’ve been in this process for a couple of years.

As the minister stated, the purpose is to improve permitting timelines, yet we’ve been in this pro- cess for a couple of years, as I’ve said, and we’ve seen per- mitting timelines actually increase. We’ve seen all kinds of applications, notice of work — all these types of things that get business up and running — increase their time- lines. Notice of work has gone anywhere from two to three months to eight months or even a year in some cases. I’ve mentioned this before in estimates. What is going to change? What is going to change to improve these permit- ting times? [11:50 a.m.] Hon. B.

Ralston:The view of the people consulted in the Mining Jobs Task Force and their deliberations was that this action, among many others, will assist in reducing permitting times. So the goal of this legislation and a num- ber of other measures, which we canvassed extensively in the estimates process…. Really, I don’t think they are strictly relevant to the legislation that’s before this House at this moment, although if I’m directed by the Speaker to recapitulate the estimates debate, I can do that. This particular action is one strongly recommended by the Mining Jobs Task Force.

That’s why we’re bringing it forward. I’m confident that it will be one piece of a series of measures, one of many measures, to reduce permitting time in the future. T. Shypitka:But the argument is that this bill that’s in front of us has no wording on permitting. We’ve already heard the minister state that the chief auditor reports to the director of compliance and enforcement. Everything is on the compliance and enforcement side. It’s budgeted through compliance and enforcement. It almost seems that permitting is removed from anything to do with this bill.

I’m just trying to understand how this is going to help improve permitting. How are we going to be able to get applications faster and more streamlined through the hop- per, so to speak? Right now it’s just not working. I don’t know who the minister talks to, but I talk to a lot of the folks — sand and gravel association of British Columbia, B.C. chamber of mines, all our placer miners. All these folks are having a real hard time getting permitting processed and through the system.

I don’t see anything here in this bill that suggests that permitting will be addressed, and the mandate of the audit unit is to determine the effectiveness of the regulatory sys- tem for mining and protecting workers, the public and the environment. Once again, nothing in there about permit- ting and helping those folks. Can the minister try again and help me understand how this is going to help us? Hon. B. Ralston:I want to perhaps go back and restate the answer that I gave previously.

Separating permitting from health, safety and enforcement creates a stand-alone statutory decision-maker dedicated to permitting. We’re not dealing with permitting directly here, but we are tak- ing the jumble of functions that was all assigned to one person and separating them out so that there will be a stand-alone person dealing with permitting and then a separate person who will be dealing with the health, safety, enforcement and that general audit function as a separate function as well. There’ll be a division, a separation within the ministry, not outside it.

Previously, that one person had responsib- ility for all of those things, resulting in making trade-offs, as I said, between doing inspections, hearing appeals, fol- lowing up on dangerous occurrences and many of the oth- er responsibilities. All of them reside with the inspector of mines. [11:55 a.m.] The idea is to…. The legislative scheme would separate those two out so that the permitting side would focus on Tuesday, July 21, 2020 British Columbia Debates 12127

that and the chief auditor and that unit would focus on the health, safety and regulatory efficiency as well. Together, taken as measures, the recommendation of all those in the industry, all those that were consulted and participated in the Mining Jobs Task Force, is that this will be a much more effective way to (1) accelerate permitting and (2) achieve the health and safety objectives that we all value and aspire to for making British Columbia the safest jurisdiction in the world in which to conduct mining. I move the committee rise, report progress and ask leave to sit again. Motion approved.

The committee rose at 11:56 a.m. The House resumed; Mr. Speaker in the chair. Committee of the Whole (Section B), having reported progress, was granted leave to sit again. Mr. Speaker:Government House Leader, I understand you want to table a report.

Schedule of Estimates Hon. M. Farnworth:I will table the

schedule for Com- mittee of Supply budget estimates for Thursday, July 23, and Friday, July 24. Hon. M. Farnworth moved adjournment of the House. Motion approved. Mr. Speaker:This House stands adjourned until 1:30 this afternoon. The House adjourned at 11:57 p.m. 12128 British Columbia Debates Tuesday, July 21, 2020

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Collection	British Columbia — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	20200721am-Hansard-n344
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	20200721am Hansard n344
Language	en
Format	pdf
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Identifier	ca6ace627eccac059334d5383fbd44a31ab747fa

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