Volume XL Thursday Province of Newfoundland FORTIETH GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF NEWFOUNDLAND Fourth Session VERBATIM REPORT {Hansard) Speaker: Honourable P.J. McNicholas Number 70 7 Jul y 1988

The House met at 2:00p.m. MR. SPEAKER (McNicholas): Or·der, plea se ! Statements by Ministers MR. SP~AK~R ·: The hon. the Minister of Municjpal Affairs . SOME HON. MEMBERS : Hear·, hear! MR. BRETT: M r· . S pea k e r , to d a y I La kr-=! U1· i. s opportunity to inform the House LhaL U1e Dc:!pCH·tmE!n1· . oF Mun:i.c.Lpal Affairs has approved funding in l.:hr:' amount: of $1.,03/.,000 For· the pJacement of firefjghting E!qui.pment under +.:he 1988/89 cosl shared 75/25 program - SOME HON. MEMBERS : Hear, hear! MR. BRETT: -wJth the provincial government payi.ng 75 percent of the cost . Mr.

Speaker, this funding is addition to the $42 mJllion c a p "i t. a l. t.o~KH' k s p J" o j C:! c L s · t h a L announced last month. i.n :in I Mr. SpeakUi", U1e Fol.loto ·i.nlj iH'e l:ho munjcipalities and local service d i. s 1: 1" .i. c l.: s l: h d. t h ;~ v e r· (~ r.: r:! i ll n d fLJnding approved undE!r' the pl.aCE!JIIC:!nl·. of Uw 1-:-ir ·(~i'.i. ghl :i ng equJpment, and I would like to rr,,ad i:hE!lll, Mr·, Spf!akE•In, l:o g(~t them into the record. MR. PFACH : The se t.o~J( :•re recornmc:'r1dc :!d by 1-.h,"! Fi.i"C ~! C o rrmd s s :.i. o n E! r . MR.

RRFTT : '( ,;!:=; 1-:hf>~::•=· ar· !"· t<•('l .illllnendal- . ions of l..4006 J'uJ.y 7, 1988 Vol XL the Fire Commissioner and a cornrni Lh'e of · officials i.n the department. The first one is: s-i .de Arm, F"i.1ne Fighting PackagE!# 2, for $20,000. BottAJood, an 84 -0 GPM Pumper For $118,000. Fortune, a 625 GPM Pumper For $108,000. Gamba, a 625 GPM Pumper at $108,000. Gander Bay North, p·i.cl< ···Up A ~> S{:~nJbJ.y a.l: $ 1:i5,000. Georges Rrook, j n ·that great r.-1nd h:i.sl:Oi" "i.c d:i.sl:;"i .r.:l: of Tr·in:.ll:y North, got l:hE:1 Jargr:' sum of $:~ I., 000 - i. L ~; hc)ll J.d be notod, Mr·.

Sp.::1aker, that is the only CC:!rd:. l: h r;d: I.AJ (! n l: i. n L o T r L n .i. I: y N o r· U·1 o u I~ of this program - Fire Fighting Package Jf 4, $:11,000. GI"E!Y Rivc ~r-, Fire Fighting Package # 2, $20,000. HatA.Ik C'!S Bay, a 625 CPM Pumper at $108,000. Hopedale, a F "i. ;~ 1.:! F i g h t.L n g 1. a b r· ad o r P a c k a g E! , IAJhich is sornE!L\Jhat diffE!rent: Fr·orn lhe package that we use on the Island, $40,000. Jean De Baie, Ftre F"i.ght .. Lng Pa ckag('! # 3 For $25,000. l.ord's Cove, Pickup A s s em b l y , $ 5 5 , 0 0 0 . i'-1 u s g r· i::t v e Harbour, a 625 GPM PumperFrankE·r, $110,000 .

Pacguel, F.ir·e F·.ighti.ng PackagE! #3, $2:l,ooo. RamE!a, A:i.1~ Cornpr(-?.SSOr, $12,000. ~H. Jacques-Coornbs Cove, Intermedjate P u m p E! I" a t. $ '7 0 , 0 0 0 . 5 urrn n e r v i. 1 1. e , Pickup (4X4) AssembJy, $57,000. W :i tl c"! s s R a y , a n I n 1·. E! r· 1 n e d J a 1:. P Pumper at $70,000. And "!:hal . ·i,~; d tob:'l.l., Mr'. Speakc'•r, of $1,032,000. I n c o n c 1 u s i o n , 11-11~ . S p r:1 a k E' I" , I l.o~Joul .d J·i.kc! l.o point out Lhdl:.

NC'!lAJfoundJ.and is l:.hE:! on1y pr·ovjnc:E• · i. n C a n ':". d i:l l: h a 1·. c o s t s h a 1~ C:! s fjrefjghting equjpment wi th rnu n .i. c .i p d l i. t: i. ('! s on a '7 ~) I? 5 bas j s , 1.1.Ji."l":.h l~hE~ Pr·ovince payjn~1 7:; perc en l.: . In fa c '1: , r: do no I~ k n otJJ if any provincE! cost- .. sharE!S at all.. Sa skatchE!I;.Ji'll'l rn<.·1y, but. I rio not knm~J of any other prov:i nee, :-!nd i.~=- !·_ht=:~ y rj{:! i ~~ ·- r..:l;' .. !-;-:t··irll.y i<:: rl l) !~ No. 70 ( Af te r'l"IOO

n) RIJ.006

o n a ·1 5 I 2 5 p E:~ i" r. e n I: b a s 'i. s . And I thi.nk i.t i.s tH!I''Y 1,\JOi"l ... hy i:o no{: e , I know it is p o 1 j ·tic a 1, that thi.s cos1: ·sharJng came i.nLo effncL when the PC Administration came i.nto offer.l, i.n 197?.. Thank you, i"'r. SpeakE!r . SOME HON. MEMRERS: Hear, hear! MR. TULK: Mr. Speaker . MR. SPEAKF:R: The hon. the member for Fogo. MR . TULI<: Mr. SpeakE!r, I t..uould have liked to have had thE! M"L ni. s t: e rt al S I: a h~mcc~ i1t a bit earlier, in the absencE• of l h E:~ me m be r· for so n a v -L s 1: a No r t h (Ml" .

Lush), lAiho is quite expert in l:. he so rna 1: 1: Cc' r· s . Mr~. DAWF: W h e r· r:! J s h 0. ? MR. TULK: lie has gone to q t 1 -L I: o f r· an k gontJ.eman . sc·H:~ a doctor·, IAJ·i . i:h l:hH t.o b~~ hon. T (::ay to the hon. thE! Minister of Mun-i.ci.p<'ll Affa-i.rs that·. I think he has done a fair job with the a1nount of 1noney thE:~ governmc->.nt gave him. Unlike some of his colleagues on the other side, I think hE! Y'E!alizes that fii"E! is not something that you can play politics with, and for that I cornmE!nd him.

The:! rni.rd.shH' obviously rec~a1i.zes that a great many of those cornmun-i.l·.tl:!s pu·t a gr'E'!al.: dC"!al of effor· ·t: into ·try:Lng to raise t:heir 25 FH"!r CE!nt shc'lre.

I also say to the "~ rnin:i.ster· that in terms of .t~.hE! ;qrn orilll r:ll:- IJ.JOI"k l-ho~;r:! pC:: !Ciplc! do fo r IAOO'l Ju]y 7, 19El8 Uo] XL us as v o 1 u n l: P. 0.1·' s , in b:! nn s of thE! amount of dollars they save for us d ~; v o lu n 1: (;! n i" s , d n d i. n i: e r· rn s of t 11 E! importance of what they do as v o l u n 1: :~ 1-~ r· s , J n deC! d i. h r~ go 'J E! r· rnn E! n t should have looked, - is thE! one cr:i.ti.cJ .Slll Uw ·l-. t have of· thE! program, -· very closely and shouJd h a v :::1 , o b v :i. o 1.1 s 1 y , p u 't rna n y 111 o r· e· dollars j n-to that arE!a for· buying fi.refJghting eq1dpmE•nt.

But : on the whole, given the small arnoun ·t oF lflOI1E!Y that. l:he rn-i.ni s ter' had to distribute, I have to say to him, Mr. Speaker, that hE:~ has done a fair job and I want to congratulate him on that. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear! MR. FENWICK : Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER : The han. th0 lflEHnbE!Y' for MPni.hEd< . MR. FENirHCK: .Tttsl: tlAJO cornmenLs, 1"'lr'. ~)peakr'!l''. ThE:' first is t.hat I think one of i:hc~ l:h.i.n~:JS l·_hdi: I)J c• shot.tJd look at. : t..uith this firefightj ng pr ·ogr·arniiiE:! i.s tl·w dlnOr .lnt of Fund i.ng l:hi)li · ·:i.~; in it on continuing ba sis.

I know fr ·orn my FH '(•v "i.ous l..i.FH a ~~ tnay o l~ of a small community that when we got a f t r E! f .i. g h t.'i. n g t rr.1 c k , a n cl t~K! cl i cJ gE!t a tanker truck, that tAlE! tAJerE! a b 1 e i: o 1 o l~.J P r f-.I·H,1 i n s u r r.Hl c E~ r' a t: E:O s for everybody in thE! cornrnun:L Ly as a. result of having sorne central firE:{fighting protE!Ction. ThE! amount. of monE!Y t.hat h~:~s bE!CH1 in this firE!fighting program111e r'E!a lly has not i.ncrea sed sub stantially over about th e last six or ~;even YE!cH's, and has bE!l:•n in a r·ang E'! oF $500,000 to $1 million.

What I IAJa n t to s 1.1 g g e s t to +·he tn 'i. n is 1: E! r '.1. s p E· r h a p s hE· s h o u l d 1 o o k a t j_ t i. n t n F' Ill::; 0 r~ be i. J'l g ablE! 1-: 0 g -L lJ 1:~ ·j 1~. an exponent:i.aJ increase rathe r than :j ! I ~:; i: r'111 d I" i !· hI II I'' i• ·i. C C) 1'1 U ~:; 0 i h (,\ ·I: ·i !'l No . 70 (Afl: ernoon) R4007

the future more cormnunit.ies looking for firefighting services could have tht:~m. Thr:~ othr:~r comrnE!nt. I lAJould like to make is that awhile back we sent the people in Municipal Affa-.ir·s a request about support for firefighting departments with permanent firefighters fightjng fir'E!S i.n a commurdty i.n LJ..Jhi.ch there are government buildings. I knotAJ l:hai.: Lhc~ ·f-i.rGf:i .ghl:i .ng department here in St.

John's is s u p p l. i t:! d b y 1 .. h E! p r· o v i. n c .i. a J. gover·nment, as is the one in Corne~!" Hl"OOI<, and 111y r(:~qtws 'l: 't:o the minister is to look closely at p l a c E~ s ll. k :~ 1.. <"! b r· <!{do r· C i. i: y , IAJ 1·1 C:! r e t-herE:~ are pr:~rrnanent firefighting for·ces, t.o SE!C '! i.f suppOI" ·i·. cdn be 1nendered ther·e as !J.JE:~ll. Oral Questions MR. WELLS : Mr. Sp(~aker . MR. SPEAKER : ThE! hon. the Leader of the Opposit-ion. MR. WELLS : Mr·.

SpE!aker, I would haVE! p r· E! f ('! r· r C.;! d t. o ad d r E:! s s Uli. s q tH! s t ·i. o n to the Minister of Inh;!r ·govr:~rnmr:1nt :.aJ. Affa :.i.r·s (Mr . Oawe), who has been directly -i.nvol.vr;!d -i.n UlC:! mat·.l:.f:!Y', but :Ln hi.s absl'::'l'lCe and in l:hE:' absenu1 of thE! Pr'E!IflJ.er·, I nddress ·H: l:o l.ho Deputy Pr·em:i er· (01" . Co11tns). T hE! fVJj 11i sh"'l" of IntE=!l"gover·nrnE•ntal A r:-F i'J. i r· s h a. s b (! (! n c a i'' I" y i. n g 0 n r 0 r· ~~O TIIE:' t::l.rnH cli ~;cu ~;s ions tAJit .h the r (;!d ('Ina} go l) (:' r nmE! n·l.: IAJ.i .

I· h n~ s pC! c l· to steps to be taken to diminish provincial trade barriers consequent upon the federal '~ n u ,,, ~-··1 rnc• n !.:. , C Ft n R d .~i :-=•nt·.: ::•r· ·i n <~ ·into L4008 JuJ.y 7. 1988 Vo1 XL a trade arrangement with the Unj ted States. ·· Now that the TradE! Bi.ll passed thE! Hous~~ of Commons on second rea .ding, as it did yesterday, and has gone to the Senate, could the minister tell t.hE!

House tA.JhE!r·c:! th(,~sc,~ di.scussions now stand, and how those discussion will affect Newfoundland's policy of pr'E!f r"!rE! n c F.! for· Nr-:!wf ou ndli:'l nd suppliers of goods and labour in t C:! r· m ~; of c o n d 1.1 c t of r.1 c t j. lJ i t .i. E! s i n Newfoundland? MR. SPEAKER: l .. h0 hon. l:hn flll:i .n·i.~;l·:~ ,~ ;-- of Hc;!alth . DR. COLLT.NS: Mr . SpeakE:'r, there haVE! been talks ongo·i .ng ~~Jh:i.ch ·tnvolt.JE:!d Intergovernmental Affa ·irs and aJ.so ~·.hc.~ Dc~vc,~J.opmr:!ni·. of Dc;!vel.oprnen 1:. and Tourism.

ThesE:' talks arose out of a Fi.rst M:i.n: .i.s 1-.E!rs' ConfE:!r'E!I1C(;!, :i.f my mE!Tnory s~:~rves me corr·ectly, and a group I.•.Jas pu·l· i.n plaCE! to do some indepth study on the work . T h E! r e h a v E~ I:H~ E! n s o rn e r c:! p o r +. s c o rn e forward from that group, ·there will be further discussions and studies, and I am sure that at thEdr rwxt. rnE:!Ed·.·i.ng, also, the First Ministers wi1l deaJ with the rnat+-.r:~r. It ts nol.: a strnpl.(:1 rnattE!r. Il:: is not a case of each province having Uw same~ ~;t.ruci ··.tu·r-:! of, if you t;.Jani:. to so call them, barriers.

Anothe1n IAldiJ of J.ook ·ing at i.t. lAJOUl.d bE! pro·tec tion for t.hE! E!Conorny LHld i .: h e (·~ trl p l. o y n d ~~~ o r· k r~ o r· c r:~ ·. i. n t h E· particular provtnce. Each PI"OU .i.nc::• . ha:; i:~ d·i .ffE:~l· 'r: !ni:. st.lnuc+·.tJre thE!re . ThE:' E!xt ·E!nt "is d-.iffer·pnt in t h r~ v a r .i. o 11 !:: p r· o v ·i. n c C:! s , i·:'l n d t he impact of any changE! would be di .ffE!r·nnt-. for d~i.r :rr' !r· c:,nt. province s. So it is a fair1y complex tnat:t::c:!r.

ThE!r'( '! has bc:,~:!n no finalization that I am aware of of !· h ::' ~:: u b j ,c • .-:: I : 1 n d :,• i" d ·i s C'll c.: ~:: L n n :·1. ~; No. 70 (AftE!rnoon) R4008

yet, and the dtscussi.ons ar(~ ongoing. MR . WF.LLS: Mr. Spedker· . MR. SPE:AKFR: T1"1t=l hon. the Leader· of the Opposi t:i.on. Ml~. WELI..S : Mr. Speaker, would the minister t e 11 t hE~ H o u s e IAJ h a 1.: t hE:~ g o v e r· n me n i: anticipates the impact of these c h a n g e s IAri l l. bE! o n C 1 au s e 5 1. of the Atlantic Accord, t.uhich sets up and r·equ'i.res a pref<:!r<.;!nce for Newfoundland labour and services in offshore development? HOIAJ I.&.J·.:i.J.J the:~ irnplE!mE!nt:.atton of the:~ Free Trade dea1 . impact upon thoSE! preferences under Clause 51. of the Atlantic Accord? MR.

SPF.AI<ER: The hon. I: he Mi .n:i.s t.er of Ileal U1. DR. COL.LlNS: Ml". Speaker·, I think j t has ber:Hl cl.ear·J.y s la l:ed a nurnb(~r· of l.: i.1nes that the Atlantic Accord is not a f f :~ C i.: E• d b y r:'t n y p t' 0 lJ i S i. 0 n S 0 f l: h F.' Fr·(! e TradE:' A g re E!ITIB nt 1.uhe n fi na 11 y concl.11ded . Wh1=!n i 1-. i.s pu ·l· ·i.nl o lat.&.J, and so on, thr:~ agr'E:~ernc-'!nl~ .s bc:!t.IAJC<:!n l~hC! Pr·ovi nee dnd thr~ federal government will not be affected by this. lio11..J l::he IAJhol<:! 1nat:t .er this Province is hypolhE!ltcal. yc:~l:. The:~ not concluded, but it one wc1.y.

The Province has made many, many times that get a proper proportion I.AJ'i.l.l. affE!CI-. a b.i t exerci.SE:' i.s is not aJJ the point we do not of federal. government procurement expenditures in a wi.de range of areas, and this is part of the --:; u b j r:l c t~ 1 n r:t L 1 ·_ r~ r· . I. 4-009 July 7, 1988 Vol XL I l: h t n k t h a t I.J.J h e n 1:: h f~ I.•J h o l. E! 1 ... h i n g is concluded and satisfactory arrangements, · and, no doubi:., satisfactory compromises are ar·r·i.tJod al ·., l:he end re:'sul.~: For this Pr·ovjnce, hopefully, IAriJ.l be a post l::i.v1~ one. Mf~. WF.:I .LS: Mr. SpE:~aker. MR.

SPEAI<ER: A fi.nal. supplementary. MR. WELLS: Mr. SpeakE!r', wouJ.d Uw rrd rdst:er tell the House I~Jhet.I·Jc:•r' or not. thE~ government has negotiated the agrc:!E:Hnent that is pr·ovided for' in Clause 53 of the Atlantic Accord, whi.ch requ--Lr·r,'S th<.'lt the 1 Fr::~dE:~r'i:'-1.1 and Provincial Ministers shaJl conclude a M1~rnoranclwn of Understanding 1 relating to lhe industr·ial. and empl.oymE!n ·t L'H!rlE!f .i l~.s to be applied undE!r thE! AUanti .c Accord? Has +:hat memord.ndurn o·f understanding bE•en negot.iatE!d? If i.·l·. hr.\s, J•JOJ .il.d l.:hc! rn:inis·i ··.<;!r t.:abl.e a copy of it?

If it has not, IAJoulcl lol-l!':! m·i.rl'i.~; l:r;!r' ddtrL;o IAJI'lC.:•n ·i l· ·.is expected to be negotiated? f'-1R. SPFAKFR: r h r~ h o n . l: h 1:! 1"1 :i. n i. s t-c• r' of l-1 E! a l 1:. h . DR. COLLINS: Mr·. Speaker, at this poin -t in t·.irne that appl'i.es onJ.y to Lhc:' H--i.bf:!r·n ··.La discussions, and within that coni:exl l::hc1i: par·l·:.icul.ar· cJ.i·:'lUSE! has bE!en thE! subj eel of very :1 ndE!p Lh and VE~ry conc(:~n'i::lnal :.E•d d·-Lscusstons, with tearns, obvjousJy, on bol:h stdc:'S.

That: is lh(~ naturE! of the Hibernia discussjons that have been going on with the Federal go v e r nrn E· n l and wit.: h thE· corn pan ·i c;! s ·-i_nt.Jol.vE=!d. Wh en th e co nclud ed, H··Lber·nt a the mal:tHr·· t::; ap pl"O p ,~:i atE! -i.nr~oi"Jnai·-i on •~1 i l-1 l~:l'• !lii:'lc\::• .-~.u.'J i l ;:·tbl P No. 70 (Aft.er·noon) r~ 4-009

but, of course, 1mti.l l:hat ~~-irne, il would be inapprop~iate to go into any details on it. MR. TUI.K: Mr. Speaker . MR. SPEAKER : The hon. the member for Fogo . MR. TULK: Mr. Speaker, in relation to the last question askE!d by the Leader of the Opposition of the Deputy Premier it is our understanding l:: h a t: t: h t s s h o u1 cl be n e g o l i a 1.: e d now, b<:~for·e an clgreernent is signed o n H i. bE! nd a , b C.;! c a 1 1 s e U1 i. ~; i s pi'\ r i-. of the Atlantic Accord.

So I ask I'JOIAJ c auld l he m ·i_ nt s t8 t' m<:l k e Hw :. ·1-i.~t.E:~rnc~nt he just madE! tha-t: it js now being rwgot:i.r.:d :e d a~; p;::~r·i: of t h c-' 1·1 :i b e r rri a a g I" e e mE:~ n t ? MR. SPI:AKER: Thee! hon. the Minister of Hea1th. DR. COI.LTNS: Ml" . SpE:1ake:1r, it is quite clear i-.hal~ ·indus~ .:ri.al bE!nefi .l.:s rE:1lal::C:! lo projects, and the project under active discussion and negotiation n OIAI i s {: h e H i be r· n i a pro j e c t . So that is the context of the discussions. MR. TULK: Mr . Speaker . MR .

SPEAKER : A s u p p 1 E:1 m.e n tar y , membE=!r For Fogo . t: hE:' hon. the MR. TUI.l<.: Mr· . Speaker·, do~=!s thE! rni.nister not. r· C:' r.ll ·i. z (! 1·. h c:-~ 1. u n l C! ~; ·; 1·. h o ~; C:! p1··ovisjons a1"c"1 put·: jn pJ.acE! IAJE~ !;.rill. i.n no IAJi'IY bn ,:,b-It=• l:o detc,'l~n,jn~'! t.uhdt· bc~nefj_ts IAJc:• al"~~ go'i 1'19 I 0 geL rr'OIII i·h: :? :u bHI"I'l j i:l dec:-11, tha-t · il~. js, i11 fact., this Cli.'IIISE! ihc"'i'. IAJ"i .l-J dol·er'HI ·int:~ l!lha1 . IAJC! t.uill IJ<"l:. l-J"Clln l.he Hibt=·r ,·da dl'·aJ.? l.t.WlO Ju~y '7, l9DB IJ o l. X I_ MR. WFU.S : It sets up our priorities. MR.

SPEAKER: The hon. t:he rntn ·i.st:E!r oF J-l~~alth. DR. COLLINS: Mr. Speai<E:1r, t-.hE:' hon. member· must have· his own tearn of negotiating in l:hE!r~=!, because• hE! has r·~~ached a conclusion that we certainly do not reach. We are i.nvolv~~d. This has bE!en stated and ·th:i.s is logical and +·.hi .s is tJJhat is expected by the people of this P r· o v -j_ n c (:! , U·w 1: IAJ c:1 tAd 1 l h i:'t tJ e v ~H' y close, intensE! and exhausi(JE! d·i .scl .lssJon~; on :i.nd11str·ial b~:!l'l("!·F'i.l:-s in relation to the Hibernia p r· o j 8 c l: , d n d t h a i: i s 11J h <:.~ 1: i. ~; I:H;! -i_ n g done. MR.

FENWICK: Mr . Speaker . MR . SPFAKFR : The hon. the member for Menihek . MR. FENWICK: M r· . S p e ;3. k C:! r , m y q t .ll'! s 1:: i u n t s 1~. o i--. h C~! Minister of Justice (Ms Verge). There ts now a controversy out West t.~.dth regard to the qUE!Stion of IAJhe l·.hE:!r' or· no~~- IAJornen IAJOI.ilcl br:! alJowed into men-only clubs, and IAJ h c,1 l: h ~:· r o r no t p r· o v ·i n c :i. i'l.l legislation would coVE!r Uwrn .

My quE:!stton to thE! rni.ni.stc"!r' i.s l::h:-l.s : If a woman were to apply to a rn c.;! n-o n l y c 1 u b j_ n t hi s P ,~ o v i n c e a n d try to get recourse under The Hu111an Ri.ght:~; CodC! i.n or•clt:!l" l~.o get : he1~ fair; · t.reatmE?nt tAdth thj.s par·tic11lar· cJub, IAJOI.t] cl Lhe• legisJation itself be able to - MR. SPEAKER: 0 r· d t=! r' , pl. e i'l ~' n ! lhai· ·i::; .::~ hypoUwl:i caJ q11esl "i.o n and it is not in order. r./lR . FFNL'IliCI< : 1\Jo. '70 (A F L1::: r·noo n) 1\ 4-0 1. ()

My question, then, to the minister i.s thi.s: DoE:~s, i.n yqur· opinion, the Human Rights Code couer di .scr:i.rni.nati .on by men --onJ.y clubs against women in this Prouince? MR . SPEAKF.R: Thli=! hon. thE:~ Mj nj ste1" of Justice . fillS VERGI:: M r· . S p e a k co! r· , .i L .i s and I suggest that Me n i. h e k r· E! F E~ r i. 1: d good <.:jues 1'. ion the member for 1: () 1.: h (,~ H llrll f:H l RJghts Commission. t. h (:~ p r 0 p t:H' C 0 IH' S {:! . That would be MR. FENWICK : Mr. Speaker. MR . SPEAKER: The hon. thE! member for r"'c:!ITi.hek . MR. FFNWTCK: Mr.

Speaker, we already haue referred it to the Human Rights Commission, but they haue not: got a n o pi n i_ o n on i. t . S i. n c e I)..H~ h c1V e looked at the legislation, I t..uan 't to as k the rn in ·i. s t e r· Ud. s question. ThE·re ·is nothing in the H u 111 iHl R J g h l:: s C o clc:! n o I;.J t h <:~ t c CHJ e r· s a particular situation of d J. ~> c r· :i.1n i. n ,:-~ t~ ton based on ~; n x l)..ri . {: h regard to membership in a club. MR. SPEAK~R : Order, please! MR . FTNWJCI<: My q 11 e s t i. on 1: o 1:·. he rn :i. n .i. :> 1·: Co! r· i :> this: . Is. your· dE:~par·tment - MR .

BIHI'W : Ask your question. MR. FF.NW1CK: I am asking a question . Is your department or your gouerrHIIE~nt j_n thE! cour·se of cons'ider·-Lng changes l:o Uw Human Rights Code that u.JouJ.d protE-ct U.JOini''tn r'1<3 ainsl- d·.i.scr·· il fl'illi'\l~. tun of:- L4-0 11 July 7, 1988 Vol XL this kind? MR. SPEAKER : ThE! h on . t he M ·i. n t s hH' of J u s t i c e . MS VERGE : r"' J·' . s p c r:'l lu:! r· , t h e

f) E! p iH' t.: rn e n t o f Justice and the Gouernment as a ·,~J h 0 l 8 ,-'l r' !c! C 0 1'1 S ·i. d lo! I'' . i. rl (j d 11 U ill b ~;! I" 0 !­ proposals For improvement to the l-ltllllan R:i.gh'c~; Codr:~, :30111(:• of IJJh :ich haue already been presented to L h :i. s 1-1 o 1.1 ~; t:~ o f PI s ~; E! Ill b l. y ·i. n t h E! ·f o nn of a b i ll w hi c h i s on o u r or· d e r pa fl<o! r· . MR. FENWICK: A fi.nal. Sl~ppl.ernc:!nl::ary, Mr·. Spec\I<C:!r . MR. SPEAKER: A final. supplementary, t:.hr:~ hon . the member for Menihek. MR .

FENWICK: A spec i. f i c quE! s t -Lon : Can t;.JE! ex p e c {: the next session of the l.E!gis1atur·r.=! a change"! l~.o l::hE! Human Rights CodE! that IAd.ll COUE!r th:is pat•l:.i .cular sJ.t-.r.lc:~t: ·ion? Yes or No. Ml~. ~3PEAKER : The hon. the Minister of Justice . MS VERGE: Min, ~)pc-:oaket", I will repeat my p t' o v :i. o 11 ·,; .:-~ n ~; I~J C.:! r· . Co t.J r:! r· n rn c,~ n I· i. s looking at a number of p1~oposals f o r J rn p r· n u (:' rn (.~ n 1·. 1 ... o ·I· h r:. C o d o . I u.Ji]J discuss this par·t:icL .Ilar· po:inl:. i)..ri.th Lht=:!

Cornrniss i.on and seE:.k l::hr:=!'ir· aduice on the particular point. MR. D~CKER: Mr. Speaker . MR. SPEAKER: T h E! h 0 n . t h e rn E! 1Tl b E! In f 0 I" t h e S t I" Cl :i. t of BE!ll lslC:! . MR. DECKER : Mr. Speakc~!r', 1ny ques l::i.on ·ts l·:o 1-·.he hon. Mini ster of Career ll P !J E•l 0 prn (• 1'1 l· •'lll d (1 d !J i'1 n C r· 1:1 r) 1: U cl·i P <; No. 70 (Aft-:E~r ·noon) R 4-0 ll

(Mr'. Ma 1-. thE!IAJS) . On May 9 of th.i.s ~?ess ion, I~Ji·wn lhe Pr· E~mi er· annotHI c ed the first programs ~pproved under the Pr'ivate Sector Employmen -t Program, the hon. l:he Premier assur ·e d ·l:he House that top priority would be given to screening. And I want, compliment the that, because prone to abuse MR. SPEAI<ER : Order, please! MR . DECKER: Mr. Speaker, to Premier for doing this pr'ogram is and it is important- ·~ hat it be scr·eened . My qtles l: i.on rl1~ ~ rni11·is-t e1" l:o l.hc- ~ lrti .ni.sl:f:~r·: Wi .l.l.

E:~xp1a:in t:o th<~ +lousE:' t: h i. ~; out? s c: r·(:'t:! n 1. ng pr-o c r;! :; !; IMd s nid the Cabi ne ·l~ c: a r· t' i. r;! d do it d ·i. r· (~ c; 1-.l y , o t' IAJd s t .. _ her· r:! i:l :; p t;~ c J. '" l. corundt-LE:'e put ·in pJace. or· did the r·1. i. n .i. s l:r,~ r' 1 :> OIAHl IJ e pc:U ' trrw n 1: cl o ·L 1:? Would he explaJn l:o i.:h~C! pt?opl('! oF Newfoundland just how the s c r'E!e n·i. ng t.u~ s c a r-r-i.c:H:l ou 1:? MR . SPEAI<ER: The hon. the Minister of Career Devel.opment and Advanced Studies. MR . MATTHEWS : Mr-.

Speaker, for two years now the program has bE:~en i.n place i.n the Province, a very posjtive, well-accepted program right thr·oughout the 292 communities in t:he Pr'OlJinco IAJE'! I~E'!CE!-i.lJ('!d applications from, tuhere we cr·E~Rl:E!d soln(~' 2600 job:; l:o cidl.:e and hope to CI~E!atE! ~>OITIE! 3,000 jobs t: h i. s y E:' (" r· . , .. h C.:! I" C:• i. s e1 n Irttelnd!?pal''i::rnen-ta] Corn1nitl~PE~ t.·l·1at i" e V ·i 0 !)J !; E! lJ r:! r' y r.t p p l i. c .:.1 I: ·i. o n i: h ,J ·I: cornE~s i11to t·hc~' dE~FJCll""l:nlent·.

When :it comp:; in i.l·. i~; l"egi .~;l·.c- :!r'r:!d, a :J r· o j e c t· or F i c PI' · cJ n r~ '' t h H n :"! r c~· ~; ~;a I" y L tl-0 l ?. July '7. l9BB \) o l X 1. f o ll OI~J-- .. 11 p l.r.JO r· k

h) mel I< e. sur'(,~ ·t-.1-H:! application is . complete. geys in L: 0 I I C h lAJ J 1.: h t h c,~ a p p J·i. C d 1'1 1: 'i. f t h E'! I" E! are any questions not ansv.JerE!d or ' F o r' c 1 a r i. f .. i. c a 1.: ·i. o n • a n d \:: h e Interdepartmental Committee looks at the applications on a we ekly basis . The Interdepartmental Commt t hH ?. is made up of representatives from th e DepartmE!I'lt of Car·E :!er Development and Aduan~ed Studies, Rural, Agricultur'a1 and Nor't:hE:!r'n Development, and the Departm ent of DevelopmE!nt. They l·.:hE!n mi~~ke recommendations for approval. and j_n ttAJo year ·s.

Mr. ~3PE:'aker, <:'vc:or·y recommendation made by the comrn·i.tt·_et:! ha:; ~H :~Pn acr:E:~pl·:.t=!d by Cabinet. ~:)OMC liON. MF:t•IJn E RS : Hl::>al", hc~~ar! MR. OfCI<FR: Mr. gpeaker. MR . ~1PEAKER: A supplemE:Hd:.ary. the hon. ·Uw rn e lf1 b

t) r· for· ·I: h C"! S i: r' d i. 1·: o r=- Be 11 e Is 1 E:~. MR. DECI<ER : I1npe cc able. Mr· . Speaker! Wou1cl thE! mi.nist:.E,r· t.Hll lAJas intention of it: thE! thj _ s tntE,rdE:!partmE•nt.al. Comrn:l.th~E!, using the screening process, to ensure that the regulations of the program are carried out to the E!Xt:ent that no 1nernber· of i:'lny minister 1 s political staff should 'i. n c:HI y 1Ak1 y b f:! I'H:d 7 L 1:. r I" 0 In U·w Private Sector Employment P r' o 9 r· <~1 rn? T d 1 n r· I'! f f'' ,.. r· -i_ n q l:. o Regula ·tion No. 20 lAJh:Lch cover-~; g o lJ C:! r· n 1 no n 1: '" 1 n p l o y o u s , ~~ r' .

SpE•aker. Will thE'! rn: in:.Lsttc'r' assu1"e w ; I· h cd : 1: h d ·L ·i :; t~J h C.'( L H'l'i .:; Comrnj.t_teo d·.id? M R . ~) P F A 10 : R : 1\io. 70 (A f'i:.l:•r·noon) f\ tj.()] ?

The hon. the Minister of Career Development. MR. MATTH ElrJS: To thE! best of tny knotAJl€:1dgc~1, Mr·. SpeakE:1l", yes. As a matter of fact I T c:·lm i'IIAJat'(~1 I:: hat thEH'I::1 IAJet·r~1 l"efc~l"rals rnad~~ to a tribunal which has b(~r:11'l pui~ i.n pJ.ar.:f.! i:o d0aJ. ,,,di·:h a potential confJ.ict of interest c a~> c:! s by all 9 o v f:H' nrnE! 1·11: d€:1pal"tment:s. I know that thE~re tAJ e r· c:1 a p p l. i. c cd:. i o n :> · i rllJ o l v · i. ng f o 11 r· empJ.oyees that were referred to the 1·: r· J b 1.1 n a l. r'l n d o, ~> a d e par· 1:.1 n

f) n i ·. we had to pass on to the:1 tl"ibunal Lhe depar·i:rnent.al obsE!l"Vdt·i.ons and opinions.

And of the four r· E:1 f e r· r· e d l.:. o t. h c:! 1.: r· i b 1.1 n c:1 J. , t h c:1 opj nion of the tribunal was that three were in conflict of interest and consequently should not be considered under the Private Sector· Employment Pr·ograrn, and one case wcts considered by the tribunal not to be in confJ.ict of -i.nt€:1rE:!St., and that appl.ical.::ion \J..Jas consider·e:1d because the employee had not been working with the department for about a year and L he p o s i 1.: 'i. on 1:: h a l 1:: h E:1 e 1n pl. o y C"! e held with the department was in no IJ.JaY t'C:1l.r.~I-.E!d to 'i::I·H-:!

Pr·'i.vi<!l:e ~3ecl-.or· F.rupJ.oynwnt Progr·arn. M R . D F C I< f R : A s 1.1 p pl. o tn r:1 n t c:~ r y , M r· . ~)pea k c.~ t' . r"'r?. ~3PFAI<FR: A f j n i:l J S Up p 1 e l"OCcHd. a I" y . M R . D F: C I< f. R : T 'l: h an k l: h E:1 rrri. n i s t (·) r· For· hJ ~; Sl l"i'.d ghtfOI''IAJCll"cl Cli'ISI.~JP.I''. l a s k h i r11 1'1 o IJ..J , i n v :i E! w of h t s ctrlS!AJ~~r·s, IAJi.ll hr=• E!Xpl.r'lin IAJhy :i.·i·. "i.:; t·hat -l-:.hr~ ver·y fir·st pr·ograrn .':lnnouncr:'d by l::hr:!

Pr·c:11Tl~i.c-:!r', t:hC"! flagship program, tJ..JClS atAJardE:'d to a c o m p a n y tAl h .i c h t s a p p r· o x i rna t P 1 y 3 0 pE!t' cent OIJ..JrtE•d by thE! Special Ass:i.str::tn! .. to the M·i.n·i. s !·c'!l' of L.4-0 1 3 July 7, 1988 VoJ. XL Rural, Agricultural and Northern De V t~ 1. 0 ptn€:Hli: (Mr.. P OI}JE! r) ? MR. SPEAKER: T h r:1 h o n . t: h r~ Mi. n 'i. :; l: e r· o F C d r· E:! !?. r· Development and Advanced Studies. MR. MATTHEWS: M r· . s p E:~ <:I k E! r· I :r. h cf\lJ (! t 0 IJ ("! r y h () n E:! s t: and say no, J arn nol: i:!tJ...Jar'E! of thai:.

T do nol ... kno1~1 l:o whc:'ti:: particuJar application or "'p p 1 ·i. c <:t n i-. or· p r· o j E:! c 1·. thE) h on . gentleman is r·eferr·ing. All I can do J ~; ad 1r i. ~; 0. t·: h e h o n . g r;! n 1-.: l. E~ m a n and han. members of this House thal: I IAJ'.i.J.J CE!t'la'inJy t:akCo! i·:.hat. matter und€:~r adviSE!ITient. I tAdlJ. i.nnnc.:!di.al:el.y i:,sk for· an inve:1stigation to SE!e if tJ..Jhat the hon. gentlc,1rnc:~n has i:tllE>.gPd is indeed correct, and I will consequently report to l::he House. MR. K. AYlWARD: Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the 1nernbc"!r for· StE!phenvilJ e. MR. I<.

AYLWARD: Mr. Speaker, l have ct Follow-up qUE!Stion to th€:' Deputy Pr'E•nliE:!t'·· con c E:! r· n i. n g I: h ~:! 1 o c: a J. pI" E=! FE! I" E:! n c r::• policy and the fact that now it is bf)·i ng pt.l·i... on l.he l:.i:'tbl('! for· negotiations between provincial rrri.1Ti. ~' hH' ~; tAri. L h Uw f r:=· d EH·· a 1 go v e r nrrH:Hd.: . T h €:1 At 1 an ·U. c A c co 1~ cl s l~al:r!~;: 1 Th(;! .:lppr·opr·i;·:·ti·r=!

Fc!cler·al. and P1"ovir1cial Min:istE:•J"s sha11 r:onr:lt.lr:le d ME!tnor·andtlrn of Undcc1rstandi.ng I"E!gar·d:i.ng t:hE:! coor·d·i.rwt:·i.on oF :i.ndt.l~;t:r··Lal. and E!mpJ.oyrnE:Hlt benefit.:s by thE:! 13oar·cl1 IAJh:i.ch ·i.:; l.:he Canada NE!IJ..Jfoundland Offshore PEd:l"OlE!UITI B o a r· d 1 d n d t.~d. I: h r· e s F)('! c L t·. o i n d u s t r· i a 1 a n d e rn p J. o y mE! n t b e n e f j 1·~ s reviPw and evaluation procedures to be fo1lowed by both governments ;:\ n d L h e R () a r· d . I T h ·i s ·i .. c; i. n l:. h f:' No. 70 (Aftenwon) R 4-013

At~lr:1ni ~ i.c Accur·d and Ji·. IAJi :l~ ; supposed to have bc~~en c:Jone. If j t ha~; not-. bt:!etl clone~~, J:; i+: go·i.ng l:o b0 done? What. jrnpact IAiill n~:1goi.:Ja'!-.:i .on:; pr·e~;erd~l.y go ·i.n g on t-.o break down provincial trade b a r'r' 'i. e Y' S , IAl ~Ji. C h :i. rl C J. I I Ck! i: h F.! pr·ovincial pl~eferencE! policy, have on the Atlantic Accord? MR. SPFAKfR: The hon. the Minister of Health . DR. COLLINS: Mr. Speaker, I think the hon.

ITlE!ITlber fC'!els thdt: lh~:!r'<:1 is SOITIC:1 difficulty here with the matter thdt is being discussed at the r·equest of ·l~he First Ministers in r e g a r' d t~ o l r· <!t d c;! l:hH' r' ·:L r.;! r· s <:1 n d t h e Atlantic Accord, but I have al.r'~1ddy stc:d:ed thr'l.i: :Ln 1:E!r'rns oF ti'IC-?. ·l~Jnadc~~ t.aJks IAlit:.h thE:1 US thc~~I"E:1 i.s go-ing t·.o b('! no nr"19i:ti:JlJ("' ·i.rnp,'lcl· ..

I n r' e g •H' d 1: o .:-1ny i.Jflprl.C 1'. betiAH-)1~1'1 the Atl anh c Accord and the d 1. s c 11 :; s J. o n s b r:1 h~H'' 1·:! n C "' n i:l d J r.1 n pr·ov:i nc E~ s as to IAJha'l: they should do ,J.bo1 .1·t·. l·~r·r.1dr:1, ·l:h i,:·; j_:; ,,,n i'll"f.)d H1i' . .d .. ot·JE:1 cannoi. E:1VE:Hl comment on bC:1CaiiSC~ l:hcli: lAJhOl.e HXE:'r'Ci _•;p :is still an ongoing matter. There h <.'\ s b E! r::• n no l~. hi n g c o n c l u d E! d on :i. l:: yet . It. is an ongoing matte!r. It ··i. s a lrlc'l t: 1~. tU' ~~ n d ~'! r' dis cuss i. on , under study.

Trade barriers bettAleen thE:' pr·ovinces, t;.Je all knou.1 they arE! thE!rE! to some extE!nt. We knotJ.l t;.Jhy they IAH:!InE:1 put l~.her·e. Each province felt in its own best i.nter·est and the>.. best ·i.nterE:'!s ·t-. of its IAJork force:'! and its population :1. t~ h i'l d l~. o p u t c E' r· ·l'.: at n I~ h :.i. n g s i. n pletce -to makE• sure that il: got as tnany I:J('•n<'!fit~; for· ·i.i -.s<:'l.f as sr:~E:'!rrJ<"!d po~;siblE!.

No doubt ther'E:' tJ.las sonw n u g <.·1 I: :i. u E:! 'L 1 n p <'1 c t o n n r:! ·t g h b o 1 1 r' j n q o r· otheJn pro~Jii'JCC:'S, but all ·that. rm=tl~.l--.r:!l' i.~; a cornplex nmti':r:·t·· thdl". ·i'; 11 ow be :in g d J. s c us sed , n OIAJ be :i n g ~; 1:11 d J.

C::! d , b u 1: no rl r,, c ·i ~; ·J o rh lv ·1tJ ,,:! 'J (:;\ (=: n rn t:,~ cl ~:·L ~J n '' 1 .. ::·'I id ! h (:'o \" ·=:~ no I.IJ.() li.J , July '7, l9BB Vo ·1 XI . tmpacl'. on l'hr,1 n'l:l.i:'lrl'l- .'i. c Ar:cor·d tn that rE:1gar·d and it is h:ighly unl:i.kr"!ly b1 .1l.: L:h·i.:; J~; only <.'1 per·sonal opinion, becausE!, as I ~>i'llj, 1'10 (ltJl-:! ktJOIAJ!) yEd~ that it E~VE!r tAlill haVE! any ir11pact on it. MR. K. AYLWARD : ~ supplementary, Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: A supplementary, the hon. member for Ste~henville . MR. K.

AYLWARD: t.he WE•ll, could l':he tell the House how Depu ly Pr·emit:!r thj_s government c r.1 n neg o i:. i a h>. H Hiber·n:ia dE!al without this ME!morandurn of Unclc"!r'sti:·lnd"i.ng bet:I~JC!~:!n bo l:h governments, federal and pr·ov ·i.nc·i.,;ll., · 1o~1hJch outl.tn(c1S l::hG ! br:1nefits clnd t·~he E•conorn:i.c sp:inofr:· c:Hld the j nb~; For· NC::!I.IJrOIIJ'ldldnd(;!r'S herE:~ in this Ptnovince, when :H. :is s1· .. ::tl:t<!r:l ·in 11 ·1(! ()l:li:Hli ·.:i.r: Accot·d +·.hi:~L that is suppospd ·l:o bE!

Ja:icl out b f:' r~ [) j'' r-:! lj u u g () •i. n ·1: h ('• t' (! ' !) 0 1·. h 01 'i: there is a position and people knoto~J t--.hr:11: po:d.i·.-ion drtd u, ·.i.s Province is protected? Could he t

f) ll u !> h o 1.11 rw g o t· .. i. <!! i·. i. o n s i:t r· E! ongoing when l':his has not even bt<!en donr;! dncl i 1 ts :i.n Lhr:! Atlantic Accord that it is s u p p o !> e d l. o b e cl o n e ? MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health . DR. COLLINS: Mr. that par' t and Speaker, T can only repeat lhis matter is an integral. oF L.hE~ H·ibr;!r'nid negot.tations it. cannot bE! o t.l·w rt;.Ji s E' .

You c a n n o t d e c ··i. cl e :.i. n d n y s u b ~; l:·. a n l~. i ~; E' , meaningful way, industr:ial b (! 1'1 ('! r :i. \: ~; ·j n cl U d C Ill I HI , Y 0 l I h d ~J C'! t 0 b e d 1:! a 1 i n g L1Ji l: h s o rn ('d~ h j n g a n d tAle ''' t' t;! p r· r'! ~; P n L· ... , y ' I e •'1 -, ·i. n g tALi 1-h d particular project":, i.e ., l.he I·J·j I:H' r· rd. d pI' o j C! r; 1: nlf~ i"JI-Jj 1: e R o ~; e !:..~I '' :) j ,:., (: !-· tht:=\ -r 1_::· :'' !'~ ::.·l '\} r:' l) ·::\ ') t'. 1 ,' l ;·:. No 70 ( () F l. r! I'' noon) 1~/.j.() I. 4-

when the other projects come up for active negotiation they will be dealt with in the same context. In regard to the Hi be r n i a pro j e c t , lA I h i c h i s h o t o n the stove, which is hot on the griddle, we are dealing with tndu~lrictl benefits between ourselves and the federal g o v E:! r· n lfH'.! n I: ;::~ s ~~- h (:' A 1~. 1 ct n t. i. c () c c o , .. d rt:~ qui I" C.:! s that. wE~ deal, and as IAJe IAIO 1.11 . d de t:ll. cl r1 y lAir.' lj ~)(~ C i:'\11 ~; to1 IAH'! , A~; i:\ government, ;u·e very anxious and concer·ned l:o get db~>ol.1Ji:e rnax ·i.rnum i11 d u s t r· i a J b Nl E:~ f i t s f o r· Hli s p r•

C) j L1 C ~~ f' r· <) rf1 t: h i ~; I' tc~ ~; 0 I I r· <: (! offdiCH'C->., unl ikt~1, I might~ add, IAJh a 1.: IJ.Je IAJC~ r· e J. i. !< c,1l. IJ ·[: o g C'! ·[·. u n d c-) t' th~~ Ubc-:!Jnal i:tdministJnat.ion in 0 1-.: 1: ,j\IAJa J IAlh <;! r· e UH'! 0 r r ~; h () r· ::! r E.!~: 0 u Inc E! s 0 f Uli s pIn 0 v :inc E! IAIE:1 r· E! t 0 I:H'! Cc1nadi.i::trl, i.-Hid, l··.h~:! r'Hfon~, IAJ<;! IAIOuld gPt about 2 percent of thE:' "i. nd US t.r• "i.a 1. bE!tlE!f i.l-. S i. f IJ.H~ WE!r·r~ Jucl<y, becauSE! we ar·e 2 pE!rcent of Canctdians.

In th .is government's view these are Newfoundland resources, the present adnr:inistration in OttaiJ.Ja rE!Cogn-i.ZC!S that., so IAJE:1 ar·e go-Lng to get, and this i ~; IAJhat IAJE! arE! fighting for, "i.ndustrial benefits to the maximum that we can actuctll.y supply ~ho se workforces and thosl:> r·esources to the project . MR . K. AYI..VJARD : M ,.. . s f.H:~ a I<E~ I" . MR . SPF:(.)I<FI~ : A 17 i n '" l. ~;r 1 p p l <:'! 1 n r:! n I ,·-n· y , 1·. h e h o n . l he lliPITibtH' fot" SLC'!phE!nv:lJ J.p. 1"11~. K .

AYlWARD : T h r:! r.11 i n · i s { ... c~ r· o f T n l·: E! r· g o lJ C·) I' n n 1 c-) n i · . .-., l. (.) f f c.t i I" r. ~: a y ~; h P h o p E:' s t h a t t h E:' f ('! d e r· .:1 l g o tJ <-'! r· n m u n 1: r·· u c o y n i. /. E:· ~; I: l·1 d 1 ... t'!UEHI though you can bi"E:'ak doiAirl S (., 1 n "' I·J ·" r· r· .,· E'' "' ,.. I· !·1 t'' I'',,, · ,, '· ·1· .. , 1 !·1 ···t <:· l· '"J • ,.,. • 1."~ .. •. I .;. ; • •• .• ~-' I. • J.. • C ,.J • \.

I I I I . -l . l f I . :Je ··• ·1at· a :lJ .. 1 ::y · Ol" t.: 'lE:~ uai"J ous j IJ r· is d t c 1:: i. on s i-· o con 1: j n 1.1 r:• t. o cl o things for the economy. 1_./.H) 1 ~) July '7, l91l8 Vol )(I Would the Deputy PrerniE:~r tt:~lls us hot~.J st.ai:E:!ITIC->.nt.s. by UJE! M~i.nisb :!r of Intergovernmental Affairs, Ll..lho tal.ks about thL~ breaking do1,~,m of the local preference poJ.icy over thE:' next fE!IJ.J yr~c:u·s, IA.Ih-.ich wi.ll probably happen, jibe with this gotJE!r·nrnenl·.' ~; pr·oposc;!d pol-i.cy, IA.Ihich is supposed to bE:' in thE!

A 1-: l a n 1.: i. c A c c o r' r:J d n cl 1,1,1 h ·i c h l:: h e fE!deral goveJnnrnE:'nt is supposed to r'<o~ COI.j 1"1 i 7.l'!, 0 r br·:i . nging br-:! nE:!f "i. i:: S l::o this Province from the offshore? Co1.1ld you i:t)ll. 11:; hclA.I +:hosr"! '1::\.o~JO carne togethE!r and how it j s going l.o ~~Jor·k? l·l<:liAI Ci:'n l:hoy poss-lbly come together? Can he explain i: h ,,, t·.? Ml~. ~3PEAI<r::R: The hon. the Min:istE'I'' of HNAl-l:h . DR . COLLINS: fJt r· . S p (:~a be: r' , l ha vE'! a 1. I" u ad y explained it.

I said that the AtJ.c'lnt··t.c ()ccor ·d l.s nol: affE•ci::E'!d by trade taJ.ks with the Unjted States and l E:!Xpr'E!SSE!d l:hE~ opin·J .on t.hat it IA.IiJl not bE! affE•cl:E!d, I:)E:!Cause i. 1~. IAJO 1.11 d n 0 [- b C'.~ l 0 9 -[ C:r'\1 f 0 r• ·-j I: l.: 0 be, by tr·ade talks that iH'E! going 0 n bE! i-:IAH'! C'! t1 1:: h H pI" 0 V -l. n C E! S of· Canada. That process is not YE!t: concl.llclr-~d, so ii ·: ·i.s <.~ 11 hypoth et ical anyway.

B 11 I I c.~, n ,::~ :; s 11 r' e 1-. h f'! h on . rnt:'l"n be r· t hat IAJ l':' a r· e v e I" y , v c,~ r· y p o ~: s E:' ~; s i v E:· 0 r HI (! b (' n p f i 1-. :; [· h (l t IAri l J. c 0 If](~ ·1·. () th-:is Pl"ouincE~ flnorn tht:' off~;hor·~"'!, ~~JhE! ·I·.her· ·l·.h<-:! ft'!riC'!I"i·ll got.Jer·nlnl·:!l'l t~ ··in Ot-b:.11.~1a l:t"·.ie~; to l::ake ·l~hern i'H<Ii'ly, IAJi'JC;!·I·h<-:~l" ·l·.hr·! ()mr :!r'·j Ci'ln:; IAJOtll d ('llJ("r' attempt: to take i::hern awMy, and l:h<.-:!IJ h•·1U(! nol-, <H' '~Jhel ~hnr · •"'.ny other proui.nce would attempt to 1: d k E' ·1-. h <-:! :11 <:liAh'.'l y liJc: <{I" n \J e r· y jealous, and we wjll guard the :.i. n d 1.1 ~; L r· .. i .:~. -, "'n d ''! rn p ·1 o y 1 n r:· n -1-.: b r·'! n E:! f ·.t 1:: s IAlh·i.ch IAJ:ilJ COITIE:! fi"OITI offshor'E:! anci IJ.I<-" IAJ·l.l.J. b<:! :;r:>concl Lo none :in carrying out that work. 1\lo. 70 (A F I· C'! r· noon) Rl.~.o 1 s

MR. GII.AERT: rJ!r . ~ fHo1 c'l. K (! t' . MR. SPFAKFl~ : Th<c1 hon. lhE:1 l"ll<o1l"liber· for· RtH·geo B cl y d I ::: s p o· i. r· ' MR. r;JL.BF:fn: M r· . S p t") a k e r· , J h a u e a q u e s t i o n for 1: rH:! M -i. n i. :; t e r· o F T r· a n s p o t' 1~. C1 1·: ~i o n (Mr·. Ooy1.E:1). Under +:he ·ter·rns of t. he C\ 9 r· e em<,1 n l-. s t g n <'! d by t. h t-:!

Government of Canada, the Pr·ouinCE! e~ n d C N the r· <:1 i. s a p r· o lJ ·i. s i o n t h r.t t. t.h<o1 rolling stock of thE! railu.1ay, t h e t r c:~ c k s a n d C\ 1 1 t h d t s <H' i- of equipment tAJiJ.l reuert back to the CN when the rdilwdy ts closed September 1 this year. r.Jot.1.1 Js the ministr:1r· au.1are lAlhat is go ·i. ng f-o ha p~ ·H! n t.o i.: he ra i.11Alc1 y bl"idgE!S? WJll they be clj srna11tlE•d and sold i.n the sa1ne t~Jay i·:I-H:' tr·acks ai~E:1 going to bE! tai<E:Hl up i:'l n rl :; o l. d ? r'IR. SPF.:AKER : ThC '! hon . t ht:.> MinjstCcH' of T r· a n ~; p o r· !.: a 1-. i o n .

MR. oo·n E : Ml". Spco1eti<E~I", I thank thE~ 1'1011. gen t-J.E!Irli:Hl for· IYi ~; ytH~:;i:·i on. T have~ had d:iscuss:l.ons on l~h:l.s fldt'i". i.Cill.dt' l"llc'lthH' I.1.J'i t.h 1-.hC'! President of CN, who has indicated to lliE! t.hdl- . t.~.Jhr:•re "i.n 1-_h(! lJ""i.Hw of thE! Pl"OV:inCE! CE!I"tain bridges should bE! l.E!fl ·: and shottld rt~rnd·in :intact, CN would bE! only too happy l:o do so. On top of thett, when the railway is shut down there t.~.rill. bc,1 a cornrnittE!to! put i.n p1dct:• consisting of pE~ople from CN and Lhe Pr·ou"i.nCE! l:o over·st:!l"~ thi'1t matt:E:'I" and to ensure that thE!

P I"' o v i n c <'~ r' e c e i. v c s I~J h ('' 1··. 'i. 1: ·i s cl u r:• u n d e r· t h E:1 a g r E'! ernE'! n t . Ml~. GIL.FlF.fH : A suppleml'I 'Jtar·y, Ml" . SpE:~ak(-:or· . l/1016 Ju1y '7, 19BB VoJ XI. MR. SPf.AI<ER: () ~; u p p 1 n HIe n l:i:lr · y , l: h e h o n . m c,, rn ~H>.r' for Rurgeo- Ray d'EspoJr. MR. GII..RERT: T n tJ ·i t)l~l oF 1· h(:' ri"t r:l t.: hr'l l"·. I.: he minjster has had some discussion 1.1rJ t: h C ~.J , C !) I 1l d h E:! t c'l b l. c,~ c:l 1. "i. S t·. 0 f the bddges tha ·t t:hE:' Prou ~inCE! con'> "i. de r· ~; n C:! c c,, !) s I'll'' 1J I ... o bE !! rnai ntai ned?

I arn thi 11 king of Lhr:' co111mun :i.l: i.t-:~!; of GJ.eniAIOod and Appleton where the raiJ.way bd.dgr~ i.s uspd as~"'~ tAJal.kt..uay br-'!t:IAJE~en th( '~ tt.~.Jo communities, sinCE! they cannot IAJc:llk on +.·.hE· h:i.gi·H.~.lf.IIJ br··i.clg(,1 sine(-'! it has been repaire•d. There arE! also pf~opl.e IAlho OlAH'l w-.i.l.der·rws~-; cabins tAJhose only acCE!SS is by CN lAlhO Wi.l.l. ~H!!

US i.ng Sl'lOIAHTIObJJ.E!S and ATVs once thE:' track is takE!n up . ~:) o T ~~~ o n d t~ r· t~J o 1 1 1 d h r• m a I< E~ 1-h l"! 1 ··.L s 1: available so that people will have a chr. ·1nc~::1 to :.' t·.t1dy :i.l : be ·For'( !! l·:ht-:• final deed is dont~ and thE! br ·idg<:!S go? [ll)F.• f~~el . i·hi:11· . l:hH bl" "i.clqes should all sl:ay jntact so thal : p <-:! 0 p "1. (·) t~ri_ 1."1 b E! ;.1 b l. E:~ i: 0 l.l ~:; <~ l·. h e lfl . T h r-:~ n Hlt· :~ o i: her· q 11 e s 1·. ·i on : IA.I h () i s going t.o n1dinta:in thE:~ bt" :idges IAJh<"·n CN ·i.!> gone? Mf~.

SPFAJ<Ff~ : The hon. the M~.inoistE•r of T r· 1:1 n ~; p o r-· t .. .:1 t · i c: n . Mr~. DOYLE : M I" . S p e a k E:H' , I u.d.ll bE! o n 1 y too happy to g"i. ve ~hat lis~ t.o the hon. gentJernan when it becomes a v c:-1 ·i. l db 1. E:' • B u t c e I" 1: d :i. n 1 y 1o~1 c-'! a r· r:o not at the rnorne11t j n activE:' rli.scl.lss· .i.ons w:l.t.:h CI\J on l:.hal::. nut . once tAle ·are and oncE! IAJe halJe a li.sl ·. of IAlh;·:tt. br·'i.clges IAI~.i.ll. be k<':•pt and what ones will be going, I lAli.l.l. br-" onJy 1 ... 00 hdppy 1".0 g .. iuc;, l.ht;• hon. gentleman that information.

Ol:)l)iou~;-1 y, ·l·.o h:i s questj on, ,:t n cl : r~ 1 , • ~ ; • -~ ! ., • ~ Lhn <;f =!cund t.1.Jh en t 1·1 E'' ~; l=~ , \ r·· r ~ ,:[ . No. 70 (Afl.er'noon) pdi"l- of bi"id~.JC,!S (•' I, ,I ~ • r RtH)l6

intact to the provincial government, they will be the responsibility of the Province. MR. ST.MI'-10NS : Mr. SpeakE:~r. MR. SPfAI<ER: T h c~~ h o n . H1 c"~ 1 n em b c"H' f o r· F o r· t u n e - He1"r11i tagE:~. MR. SIMMONS: 1 have"~ a q11esl.:ion for· i:hE! sr.w1~~ rrd ni:, ter·. He wi 11 be aware that "i.n l:ht'! r•cdli~Jr.ly agr·~~E'Ifl(c!rll ··. oi- d co u ~' J c-:'! of weE:~ k s ago t h <:~ co mru u n j t y I~ h r)\ t I~Jr.l s d Co! i~ll 1-.

IAri. 1:-. h mo !) 1: !) e l) (c! r' I·) l. y wa~; tha·t of Por·t aux Rasquc-?.s, and he IA J"i . ll. be r:\IAI<H" ("~ !) f Uw c IHl c I'! r' W> E:!XPI"E:!:;sE:~d ·in PcH't aux RasqUE!S as IJ.J (! ., l_ c'l !) i_ l"l [--_ h ·j ~; 1-1 () I I S C' , ( I A I i~ 1"1 J: 1.

C) i~~;k 1-11e m:in"iste1" I'IOIAJ, jn the"~ timE:! l r.1 p s l:~ s ·i n c c,~ 1: h C::! n I h r'\ :; h t:• h d r:l i:l n oppol"tun:i ty to fiiOI"e fuJ ly addrE!S S J-. h E::~ p 0 r' 1:. c:~ I I X 8 ct S q II ~~ !) S i_ t II cl ~~ i. 0 rl ? Can IAJB ho1d out som<:' hope the dmo u n 1:. of $7 1rri.ll .'i.o n tJ.li.ll. bE! raised further? There haue been soul<:' cotnrn-Lt:lrl!:~n!:.s by pul ·i.t"ic-i.ans r0presenting the area that the amount would be considerably upped. To the point, though, can t h e rn t rl"i. s t E:'r' i n d ··i tel t ('!

IAJ h r.t i--_ t s being to improve the adjustment packr'lgE~ for· thE! cornrnuni.l·:y of Por"' ·: aux Rasques? MR . SPF.AI<FR : r t-1 c"~ hon. 1 h (o~ M i. n -L s 1·: <:! r· of Tl"Cin:.portat:i .on. MR . DOY LF : Mr· . ~)p!::'r:lk(~t', lAW hdtl~) ~li'td ~)O lill:' d :i. ~; C: lJ f.

S :i 0 1"1 ~; IAJ:i i-II 'l h ~~ t OIAJ rl 0 f p 0 I" t i.-liiX l1i:l~>q11c :> nn l-hi :1i·. $7 S rn·i J.l i c'!i'1 p i:'.l c k i:l!J E~ as I" t'>. c en"!- J y as a IAI P e k or· so d'!JO. ()~; d rnai ·_)"(!t' of r<·l.CI-., T f!IE'!-1-- IJ.J:itl·l t·l·1c"' Mayo 1" of Pol" '[- aux fl d s q t 1 e s r:1 n c:l h r'1 c:l 1.·. d -, k ::; IAr-.i. 1: h h -j Ill o n the" ·!·.

W0' l•ril] bP rnon:iLor·:ing t:he s "i. 1:. u <:·1 1-. ·i o n , M i" . ~:3 p I·'' '"- k lo! r' I I·. o dc,~t.E~I "rn:-i nE! j f Lhr:! $7. f:) rn:il.lion ;ne e 1-. s !: P 1'1 (' £'' c! ::; r:: f i:J o i"' I ~:-~ I l )( I 4-017 July 7, 19il8 Vo1 XL Bi:'l~;qt.~<~s. T ctrn tnfor·rrwd as tAJel.l that the Community FuturE•s Pr·ogram will apply to Port aux Basques and they are going to be actively purstri.ng thRt avE~ntJE:~ u1it.h the help of the Pr·ouince.

So wh~>thE!r or not this $7.5 million . will meet thE! expectations of thE! coTIIrnunity i.S SOITlt:~thi.ng IAJO IAJi .ll_ halJ("! 1-.o IAJait and see, but WE! tArilJ bE! acti.vely looki.ng c:t-1:: i.i: IAJ"i.t:h l·.hc'! l::ot;.Jn, through that committee that wilJ b to~ p I I t .i. l'l fl l_ r:\ C: P C 0 l"l ~; j S i.: "i. 1'1 9 0 f tO!JJn, provincial and fE!deral off ·i_ci .dl.:;. IJ~c,' IAJ 'i.ll d( i~·i.vc'>lY monitor the thing and hopefully, r"'r. ~)pHi~kr:!r' I l:hc,~ ·i.rnpr'lcl: IAJ.i""l l br'• minJmal on Port aux Basques. MR.

SIMMONS: A s 1 1 p p l c-) liW n 1:. r:1 t· y I M 1'' . !=) p o a k f'! t' . r·~R. ~3PEAKFR: A supplementary, the hon . !:.he rnernb~'t' For For "l:.tlnE:~ ·-flcH'Ifl'i. t.dgr,, . MR. SIMMONS: M on i t.o r i n g i s 1:: hE! a c t of d i. s p a s s -; o n ;:1 1: ~=! l y l o o k j_ n g a t something. I was asking Lhe ln-Lni.s!::er' l·:o bE! rnor·u c:~ct.:iu i.sL I r.:ts the mernher for LaPoile (Mr. M-Li~chell) ·i ndjca'I-E!d IAJould hdppl'!n. He sa j d i. n thE! prE· s s the r· E! wo u 1 d be• <:ln --i.ncr·oc~1Sle>d alnount For· Por ·t aux Basques and perhaps the ITI -i, n j_ S t·. E! r' C 0 II l. cl t E! 'l].

IJ S 11..1 h y I'll- '! i s backing off that particuJar cnrnmi.l-:rnent nOIAJ Ln tJ'i.E!IAJ of l::hcc• devastat.:.ion be:ing tAJrc"'akc"'d on Port c'li .IX l'li:\:)t:jiiE!::; by !·.h-j~; dgr ·ec: !ITlf: :!l'll:·.? Can he g:iUE! us thP assur·ance that: b t! y o n d m o n i. I· o t' · i n g i-. h u r· c' i ~; i:11l active effor·t b~'ing undt>J"takc "!rl t.o I I p I he,> i·\ lflC) II n I· b 1·:· ·j n y lili'l . d (! t'\ \) i:·1·.i.l c:·\ b l. ,,, !: o P 0 r· ·[ aU X R aS qUe S h y I~Ja y or· dllj II:; i:lllC' l'l 1:? r~R. SPFAi<FR : ThE• hon. thE• M::i n::L s tE''l" oF ·rr·<:ln::; por· i·:d t· i.on. f\~ R .

DOYI .F: No. 70 (AftE!rnoon) R 4.017

Mr. Speak~'r', d~> I "i.nclJcat~:H:J l:o I: hE:~ hon. mr::Hnber, tAJe hav-e b~?.c"~n j n ch s c us s i ()1'1 ~; w'i. l. h L:l'll:' r ()I~JJ"l 0 f p 0 t"l ' aux Rasques on thE~ isstH' and fol" n 01~1 l: he $7 . S rni . 11. i. on , ~~H·~ f ~H :~ l , tAr.iJJ be ~;uff:.ic::i.l~nt to Jessc-:!n C:'.lny ·i.Jnp.'u:t 11pon t:hr,~ c:onuntini.i·.y. 1~s t:.i me goes on, t.hr·ough the F (~ c:ll:~ r· ct 1./ P r· n v i. n c i i:\ l.

Co rnHIIHl'i. \'. y Colltm:jtt~~~~. t-l·1dt det:E~rrninat:ion tAJ:iJ.J b ("! 11\CH:I (~ i'\ ~; t 0 IAJ h c;d. : h l:! r· 0 r• 1'1 0 1: i'. h E! $7.S miJJion will be sufficient to 111<~ ~~ l: Uw n <:H~ d s oF UH:' t-. OIAJn . In ddd-ili.on to i·:hdi:, <:·\S T in d i cab:! d L o h :i rn , the Co rnrn unity Fut.ur·e:!s Pr·ogr·arnlnE!S, tAJh'i.ch ts ct programme of federal funding, is going to be applicable to Port aux Basqur::~s. They have a cornrni ·ttE!E! in place as well . right there now looking at l::ha-1: progr·amme and hou.J i.t rn-Lght. apply to that. co1nrnurd.'l:.y, and as time:~ goes on, Mr.

Spe:~akE!r', we w'i.ll. be ,~ i.n i'\ be ·l:i:fH' po:;·j.f:i .on, obvJously, to determine if Port a 1.1 x R d s q u '~ s tAri. l l. b e n (~ C:' cl i n g d n y c-:!xtr·a fundj ng. The same Hd ng <:' p p 1. i.E!:>

h) n-i s hop F d 1 1. :> ,,, :> lA) E! -~ -~. , artd tl·1at .· cornttljttE!C:! tAJtJ.J. be 1110ni . l'.tH' i ng l.l-w 1.~1ho-l r;! hopeful J y t hr::~ impact l.: h E! S ~~ C: 0 1111111.1 n i. 1·. -i_ f! S lA I i.ll MR. ~-.J. CAJnFR : l'k . Spedkl='ll". MR . SPEAKER: l:.h ·i.ng upon ;·t n cl bot:h be 1rri . n ·i Hld l. . rhe han. !::he llWlnbE!t' i::-o r· Tw:ilJingate r'IR. ~-.J.

CARTFR: My question is for the Minister of F i. s h o r· -L ~=! s ( M r· . l\ 'i. d ~>. o u -1: ) a n d i I: concer·ns the caplin fishery and thr;, cdpl i.n o~Jc~!r·r·un. r: IAJOnder· Cdl'l LhE• m:in:istE!r' te11 the House tAJhat •"t r· f'! Uw l d t e ~; 1·: f "i. q u r· H ~~ 'kri i h r· e spec t t:. o thE! cap 1 in overrun? H OlAJ does ~:he "i. n cl us i: r· 'J p r· o p o so t. o handlE! or· cf:i.~;poSE! of t:.he oUE!rl"un? And Luhat eFfr~ct: t..uil.l th,.ll'. : over·r ·1tn ~!E~ u ,:: 1 ~) n !·\'1c:: J {:l panE's ~:1 n~ :1 (' 1.: ~-:· r. :-~ :·,d 1./1.0 ., g .'J11l.y '/, '1913[3 UoJ.

XI I~ h t-) rH) g o L :i ''' t c d J a p r.1 n e s ~1 p r· t c (;! ? M R . !3 P E A i< E R : The hon. i':he Mj_nister· of FishE>.ri es . MR. fUDFOUT: t.lf r· . ~) p ~} r:l k e r· I f () t' ·I: h () f i I'' ·; 1". p <.·\ r· t !) f the quesUon, J have the figur·es her·t~ :;ornc~11AJhc;TI), cur·r·cHll.: I".O UAJO days ago, and I think ·.it IAJclS ::ln t:ol :dl. r:'lbout 1B, 000 hHI~>, ·Lncl.ud·i .ng production for Tatwc:ln.

As t.l'le hon. g,;!nl::l.t:!llli:ln knot1.JS, l·:hE:! ~;~~a~:;on did not reopen up until yesterday, e~nd r do no L thi.nk t:i-H:or·c~ IAJas a 1ot of p1noduction yestE!rday but I do n o l: h a v r-:! y E~ s 1:. c-?. r· d a y 1 s n u rn b E! r· s available to me yet, so I can onJy t. ct l. k i. n b>.r'In s o f IAJ h d 1:'. t h c-:! n u rn b E! r· s werE! up unt:i1. the day befor'E! yr-:!s l·:(:!r'ddy. So the answer to 1:-.he first par~ of his questjon is, genE'·r·al1y sp~~aki.ng, lj'Lue or· take~ a f(.:?IAJ hundred ·tons, around 38,000 tons.

The s~~cond par·t. of hj s quesi:ion IAJ r!l :; 1~1 h d i·: cl !) ('! :; i·: h ('! :i. rl cl1 1 ~; 1·: t' y p t' 0 ~l 0 S I;! to do? The indust:1ny t-:h1nough FANI . h ;,, ::; r· E! q 11 ') ~; i · "" r:l I: hi :\ t··. ·i 1· ~; 1 n ern b u r · ~; b r:! c o o p ~>r· a t t u E! i n d :i s p o ~;i n g a s rn u c h i'l~) po:;:;-.i.blC:! uf l:lli:\l ". (Jl)t'!rTIII"' 'i".O oi':.hPI" rnal"kcc~t i'll"eas. FOI" E:!Xd1Tlp1e, i:hr:. llklt'kel: oppor·t1tn·i l::y t.hc\1·. appE!ar·s lo E:•xist :.in Ch::ina could p E! I" h r'\ p :; "' b :; () I' b ?.

I 0 () 0 l··. () n s 0 t' ] I 0 0 0 tons, or · pE:'r·haps euen mor·e than 1·.: h c1 (" .. The third par·t o·f t:.he hon. gentl.EHTli:ln' s ql .l(~st·.:.i.on IAlds what effE!Ct: it might have· on thE~ Japanese? T ~h'i.nk there .is one thing that ne eds to be kept in rrr i. n d ·i. n d ll. of Uri s , M r· . S p e a ~q,, r . We ought not: to be thinking as :if 38,000 t:on:; lllf'!r'll'lS 1-hr'11~ t:hPI"P lkli"IS 38,000 tons of usable female capl ·in produced.

In f0 ct., wh ::il.e some Pl"oduu!rS do pr·oducE! 100 per·cenl: Fe1nr'll E!, !::hr:• g( '' l'l lc'r'i:-\J. ~;: r1 clt .! ~- L 7'' y .J bc)l .! t ?~ r.., i::l !J r:~ 1 ~' ·_q ~~ ~~~ ... , ... ··4 . 1\lo. '70 ( n F l: u 1··· no c.1

n) i? If.() I 8

pC:~l"C<-:lnt, so thE! usab1c~ number· i!> rnu c h l. C'! s s I~ h c'1 n t h f! f i 9 ~I r• c~ I·· h c:-1. t-. yo l.l usually hear kicking al"ound. And, Sf:!COndl.y, l·:hc:• Japc ;1nese, EIS hE! knows, have expressed some concer·ns. T hr.lV<'! corlllllLII'li.cat.ed u.d th Ml".

Tanabi the Executive Director of the Japanese Importers Association, and have informed hirn -that .: ~Ln Hl<:! v"i.E:!I.\.1 of goVl-:lr'nHH~nt and the:~ tndustr·y jn Ne:1wfoundland and Labr'r:.J.dor·, I.VC~ hr.W<:1 <:'Ill. 1i.VE!d up i·.n OLJl" cornmi tments and, therefore, 1.ve c,, x p <->. c t t h e J a p a n e s e I: o 1 i. v e 1.1 p +.: o theil"S. MR. SP~AKFR : Order, please! The:~ t-.i.rnE! fol" Ol"c:t] QlH:!S"l:ions has !'.! l i:1 p :; (! rl ' ~IJR. 1,~. C() i?TU~: J wonder·, Sir·, may I hc-..tve tirue:~ for· •.Hl i.lllfl<H"·I ~ •. HII : qtii::!Si ·.i.on by l~;:1, :·we? Mf~.

R CDFO!JT : Is lt a sensible question? MR. W. CArnr.R : r t. IAJ i ll be r.t v e r· y b r· i e F Mr·. Spe:1ake:~r, I assurE! appreciate the mi.n"i.ster's SOME i ION. MEMB F. f~S : By le:'ave. MR. ::>PFAKER: q1test"i.un, you. I r:Hl S IAJl -l. r• . The,~ hon. HIE! l'llE! Ill b ~'! r· For· Tt.vJJ.J .inga t·E:! . MR . 1111.

CARTFf~ : C tAJrHl 1·. 1: o .:·1 ~; k i !; i·.IH• nri rd .~; h:• r· awr .H'P of a tE~lt~9lMarn thaL wa~; r'E!Cei.IJCci hHlo'ly Cl' yc~:;l:er·c1, ·1y by F(.)NL rnorl!bE··r·s, fi"OlTI Ute,! gEH1 t·.J.E:!TitiHl IAJho~;e n<:llllP i'H'! ltJHnt ·iorw rl r'l lfHHill ·:!nl: d~JO, thP ht)i~d of ll1e Japanc,•sp ~1n t' i rw P r·ocl1t c 1·. ~; r: mpn r· !· e r· :.; (ls~;oc.:it;~l·::ion, ·in t.uh:ich that g f.) n i·.l.

P trli:"l.l ' 1 E! x p t·• c-:! :; !) E! :;; s n l'llf.! c; on c c:! r· n dnd ~;u~:jgPst~; l-hdt thC'! pt"oduct · ~' >< c ! :~ (! t I i r l '·~ ; 11 P -~ ~; (.f c; C) · i r 1 :; ; l n ~ ;-:i : ~"'' I 4-01.9 JuJ.y 7, 1988 Uol XI. held in storage in Canada and that n e:~ x l: M a r· c h l: h <:! y tAri. l. 1. n ~~ g o l~. ·i. r:-1. 1:: ~~ t-. h E' duration of the inventory being k E:' pt. E1 n d thE:~ p t' J c Co' of tho FH' o d L1 c t:? ThHy r'lr'(;! also suggc;!st·ing, ~·1r.

Speaker, that unless it can be a g r· E:~ E~ d t. h a t HH '! s u r· p 1 u s c a 'L c h b E! held in storage, that thE! pr·ice of c c1 p l. ·i. n b t:! r· c,~ dt.l c <'! d b y 1 2 p c:! r c (;• n t. . I am pr·E:~par·ed to table that t E~ 1. e g r· <:1m . MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Fisheries . Ml<. 1nDEOIJT: M r . S pea k e r· , t h e:~ h o n . g C:Hl t 1 e ITI iHl 011ghi: l:o bH Ci:U"E:'fll} l'lOIM bc-:!Ci:·1USf'~ tl·1et"C:~ :is r1o comrnunJcati.on ~;ay::ing i:h•.~.l · :i.l IAI:i. ll. bc:! cw l"llii:;L·. be <H ' i'ld ':, to bE:'. TherE:' is an indication ihr-11 .. Mr· .

T.Hh:·,b·i., nn br:d·li:l.-lf of U1al·: group, would J ike to nE:!goti a·t:e cl<::tAHlwar·c:ls i:hl:~ pl"··i.co l:o l:hat amount. But, sE~condly, ·.:it: ought 1··. o b "' c 1 n a r' 1 y 11 n cl <'! r· s t n o c1 , ~~ r· . Sp(:1i:lkC:'l", that one of the options For- soiW'! of Lhe OV(H·r·un ... i.s, cJ.eal"Jy, to hoJ.d it in inVE!ntor·y to bE!

For'IAJi.H'd~:!d to Japan a -r=-E:!Lt.J months down the road when some of t h e c h 1:.~ a p e r· rh s c o u n b'> rl c a p ] i n t hat has gone to the Japanese market because of ~he - what is the pt"oper word herE!? -· overE!XUberancE· and the~ OI.Jf '!r'E :!nl·.:hus"i.i~1Sin of some,~ o·F Mr. Tanabi's membership and the o v c-:! r· (.;!xu bE'! r· d n c t! r'l n cl o v t:! r· E:! nth u s t <'~ s rn of some,~ of Nt~IAJfoundJ.and produCE!t"s, l:. h E:~ ·f i:·1 c 1".: n f 1·: h ·1:'! rn i'l 1:. 1:: ~'! r· 'L s L h P spJr·i.t and thE! jntE~nt: of t:.he coni:t'r'IC 1·. h• ·1:> bel':!n · J.·i \Jf'!d up to.

ThE:H'e have bE!E!l'l pr'obJ Nns on bo ·th ~; -.i. c1 (! ·; IAJ" i 1: h o u ~~ r· e x u b !-" r· t'l n c c,, , OVE!l"pUl"Chasin~~ IAJhen t.hE!I"C:' is too lllltch r·f"·d flo!(!d, c1-ll of l·.h,:d: l<"i .IH.I oF t·h:in~~ ha~; Jc:'d t·o chE·r.~p capl · .. i.n on I he Fr·nn i· l·:·nd r::~u·i ng ·j rl"l 0 JdpiHl ' r-~r·. Ti:"ll'li'tb:i_ ;:tncl ·I hl'! InlpOl"i":C:'t"S As soc · .. Lat:i.on ~~o 1~. Jdpi:11'lf'!SP L:o b1;'at" ::;, ·~j:Jc~ ;-· (~~::p (ln:~ '.ihi-! ·:ly :·;;J'' J··h.:t;·} (·!': No. 70 (Aften10on) r~ ll.o 1 9

do HH:~rnber·s of FAl\11.., <::ts do rn~:!Jilb~H'S of tht:>. CapLin Assoc:iation, as do 1·:1-J(~ f-lt'OdUCE!r'S i.n ~.J<,~i~.JfOIII"ldl.dncl drld I c.tbrador·. But that :in no JJ.Jay clel:r'r!ICLs Fr·o1n, nor' sho11l.d dnybody be pcw:i eked by a t"c.:.quE:~st that tAlE:' rlO<::JO I: ·i.d l:e d01Ait11Aidt'd f>r' i. CE!~; I~Jhen ·HHH'E:! IAJi;J.S fauJ t 01"1 both !d.dE~S fcH' v.Jhc'l.l: hclpfH~ned hi ·W i ng lvtpfH~nc~d, Mr·. s f-l (~ d k (:~ I'' . Orders of the Day MR. SIMMS : Mr . Speakc.:.r . MR . SPF.AI<ER: Th<:~ hon . the President of the Council.. MR . SIMMS : Mr . Speaker, Motion 3, the Meech Lake debate.

"MR. SPFAKER: The hon. the~ l_c:'dciEH' of I·: he Opposition adjourned the debate . The:! hon. t· hE:• 1 .. eadE:~r· of t h (:~ Oppos·i . 1·.-i.on . MR. ~~U .V-3 : Theall< you, Mr·. SpE:'i'.lket" . J l1i.WP just i'.l fE'!IAI ll!OI'"C.:. I"E!ITiiH'kS l:·o 11 k! k E:' 1.1.1 ·i. 1: h ,. e ~; p r-~ c I . 1: o I: h c• i:Hiiendwent··s pt"oposE:'d by thE! hon. HHc! IIIC:'Ifii:H!t ' for· Men:i.hek . T h<:1d COU(:'l''(:!d eSSl'!nt·ialJ.y thE:1 f:ii"S1~ one.:., sn T do no+: l:hJnk l:ht;!r'C'' :i.:; IIIIlCh more that I need say about that.

ThP ~; ~' c ond i'.lmendment relatE:'s to l~he <:"llilf:!nd-i.ng procedures, anJ he says Lhr..tt : 41 (

i) should be dc:!l(~l··.ed. r bE:'l:i.tc1Ue Ll-:1.(-i.) r'<:!l.a.te:; on] y to the establ.ishment of pr·ou inces. ~\Jc:!ll, fr·d.nkly, Ol.ll" po'; it::·.i on Mr·. tha l:. Speaker, it is thP wholP of I _!.I.() ?. 0 Jill.y 7 I l9BI3 vo·l XI . Sect·.i .on 9 should bE! l-:'Jtmi .ni:'tc~d and the existing amending procedure, IAJhi.ch ·i_~; d good c:,ncl fdi.t• 01'1(:~ 1 should bE:' r·c->.taim~d :intact v.d.t:hout <H1Y r:llfl~Hlc:ltnc·:!ITI·., :i.l': :;hu111d r·ema"i.n as i ·t ·.1. s . I c a n no t s u p p o r· t Ud s p r·

C) p C):; ·i. {: ·i.

C) n ' F r· r:H1 k l. y I E! l) (! n .:i. F r.'l l. l. these c.tmendments werE:' passed it s1-.i. "l.l. I~Jould noi ·. rlli:"lkE! Mc -:•r: !ch LakE! acceptclble. It is fundamentaJJy i::-1. <:11Alnd <:11"1 y1~li'' y . The thj Jnd a me ndm~~ n t, IAlhj C h is r· ~) i:'l 11 . y a po ·i. n i·. J. c:! ::: ~> diiH:! 1·1dnH'! n t., wouJd add discussion of aboriginal r'i...:Jhl:s l·.o t.h(~ dl:JOndr:'t oF i':he! constitutional conferenCE! that IAJOUJ.cl d-i.SCIISS r·ol.E~S i:itnd responsibili.U .es in fisheriE!S. A n d r:1 l. l. i. t -L s i s r'l n u n d e r· t a k :i. n g t. o dj _scuss, it dOE!S not mE:•cHI anything.

There ~s no constitutional obligation and you do not: n('!Od . r:l const_j_t:ul:·.-.i.ondl obligation for that. Any rninistE!r could hr:,uE:! r·c::t"i.sc:!d at a constii:.utional confE!rE!I1CE! anythjng of l~.hc:tt rn<'lgn-Lt.udo t.~.ri.Lhoul: l'h'tu-Lng it IAir·:itten :into a consU.tut-.iona] rUnendlfiE!I"ll '". cH' dl"l 1:1CCor·d l.i.k(:! l:hf':!

Meech Lake Accord, so it. rea]Jy J~ p I) . i. n 1-: 1 C:! :,\ ~; . r h E! r' e ·i ~; n 0 g J" ~:! '" 1·: l:wnE:1f:it i:o hau::ing it :in :in th::i s IAk' y , ,., l. 1-. h_ o 1 1 y h q u i 1-.1:~ F r· c:t n k l y , abo1~:iginal t":ights ought l:.o be d ·i, ~; C II:; ~; (-) d ;:l i· i:' ( 0 1"1 S t ·i r1.1 -!-: '"i. () l'l d l_ conferenCE!. J clo not d:Lspute that f i:'l c t , b 11 I: T ~; 1-:!

I::! no p l.tr' p o s E! l:w i. n q SE:1Y'U(~d by t·h:is pclr·-t-"icular· i:' rn c,1 n d men 1: , M r·· . ~) p E:~ ;_., !< c:! r· . ~Htencllnenl ·. rnltrtbc:!r ' Four·. by addi.nq 'or 28 1 :inst.:<:~ad of 'or 27 1 IAJould cHid l:c) 1:he pr ·oh i bJ .I·.-.i.ons For' effec 1:: on the Charter,

Section 28 IAJh:i.ch p r· o h i b -j 1:: s d :i. s c r· "i. rn -L n d ·1-. 'i. o n b c.:~ I~. IAI c• ('! n male and femal.e. Now, everybody ,:,, g r· E• ('! s tAl i L h 1:. h c.t t , 1:-. h E:! t' ~~ s h o u l. cl n o l:. bE:' any di~crimination on the basis of· rrli:1l.C:~ CH' rt?.lridl.C c', but l::i 'WY'E! should be nothing in Meech Lake IAJ h ·:L c h <'l f f e c ~: s f: h E:! C h c:-1 r' 1:: l'! r· c:-t I~ d l. 1 , let alone those con fin ed 1\Jo. '/0 ( () f I·. e n1 o o

n) il/1.0:?. ()

~;E:1ct:ions. Thi:lt. :-is fundarnE:!nt.i'.llly I~Jh, :-1.1 ·.: -.i.s l~lr'ong 1~d l·.h i:hr-1 ME!E!Ch 1.<-l.kt::' A c c o r· d , t hat. :i t s CcH:! k s t. o o v e r· r· i d e ·Hw C h c:~ r t: e t' oHI d 'i. n s o If! t'! t' e s f)(~ c I~ s will adversely affect Charter r· -L g h I~ s , c::~ n cl b y p 11 t. l·: ·L n g ·i. n L h Co! clause in the tMay in IMhich . it is -i.n sc~ct:.ion 16 of t.he ()ccor·d, wh .i.ch says 1 Nothing j n

section 2 of the Constitution Act. affects

section 25 or· se:~cU.on 27 of the Canadian Chr.u· ter of R·i.ght.s and fr'E!edonls. 1 When you say that you create the .imp 1 i c a t i. o n t h c::t 1:. t. hi:: ~ r· e s t of IM h a t is in the Meech Lake Accor·d can affect other sect ions of the C h iH' t: e r· , 61 n d s o i t: c a n ad v EH' s E:~ 1 y affect the Chclrter, ~nd that is a n o t h E~ r r· e a s o n I4J h y Me E:~ c h L. a k E:~ i s funcldiiiCo'nt,:'llly fldt~H :!cl i:lnd 011ghi ·: nol·: to l"( ~ceiVE:l any suppo1n-t- . AH1nndn1ent nurui:H '!I'' 5, c:J.dd-.i.ng t-ht'l t;.Jor·d :> 1 anrJ f>r'omo i:e ' dor c"' no 1: clo li ~!

I"Y ffllJCII onP IMC!Y or· the cd :hE:H '. Th e cnnnnc!rJi ·. I;.JiHl t'H S FJ (~c;i : i.n :·.h a l. IMO IJ) d bE! E~ S :.

E:l f1 t :i i'J 1) y • t h E:l S i'J. rrt E! aS l:h101 COIIIIIlt'!l'li:: IJ.Ji .i.h t'(!SpE!Ci: i:O i'HII(!rtdiTIE~nt S:iX, jt IAJOUJ.cJ not bE:~ n e c t! s ~; c:·1 r· y c.'\ t: <:ll.l, i. l: 11.JO 11l. d no L bE ! r·cquii''E:'d if thE:~ Cl'li:tr'b~l" did not s f~ o k L o 9 t lJ E! l.. h c:~ P r· n lJ t n c E! o F QuBbec speciclJ status, which it ought~ not Lo do ·und E!r', 1-:he 911'i. ~;e:1 of r·o cogn:iz:ing it a s being a cJ t s l~ . .i. n c t s o c i 1-=~ t y a n d d c k n o IAJ l E~ d g "i. n g thi:lt the legislature and Go v E: r· n 11 H~ n t. of Q u <:~ b ~~ c h a s e1 responsib:ility to protect and pr ·ornol-: .e t.hE! di .~;ttnct-: soc:i.l~!i:y of Quebec.

That is tAJhat g:i ves Quebec Lh(,~ spf :!ci.<.·1l. stdi· :us l::h6\l~ other· prov:i .nces do no ·t hctv e , and that. is I;.J h d t. i. s o f F c'! n ~; ·i. v ('! d b o 1.1 t: i i ·. . :)o, Mr ·. SfH~<'IkE!r', T dtn not·. p ct I" [ i C IJ ] 61 r· J y :i ITI p Y' E~ ~; S ('! cl IAJ ::i t h l:: h P d 111 c:~ n d 111 e n i. ~; t:' >( c: C:! p 1· o n c:• c::J j r11:i ncd.e=! ti1E?. IAJhoJ E:! of i. 1-J i:l i IAJO I I 'l d ME:' E:! c h I Ct kc,! dll:Otjl'~ l:h1;:r·. IAJ l'l'i d1 ·i ~; I h n on .I y i'HIY The i'iO I· Lh::irt~:J thi'.tt r' u <:'1 ~=; n n i:l b l C! drt l('r:drnPrll -:.:-: t.uou1d pl"ovicle ~,;

I) l1 I i: ·j I) 1'1 . ·~· 1·1 r.:~ l" ~::1 f" 0 I'':::~ , d( l l_/!.() :2 1 .JIIl.y 7. 1.98 il \Jol X I. provide any solution or any benef-i_i: l·.o ·i.l .. rJ! et.!Ch 1.<'1kC"' IAitl.l. br"• virtually as flawed after su ch i:llnenc:lmenl:: ~; e:1s .i l·: ·is bf: 'for ·r,~ such amendments . We ought no t jeopc :·1r'd 'i.l.(:~ the l.ong ·-t: E:·rm const.it.uti.onaJ. r·ight.s and position of t h "i. s P r· o v ·i. n c (o! F o r-· t: h E:~ s a k e o f placating i:he ProvincE! of Que:~bec, wh-ich is rec::~l.l.y whdL has been done hE!re.

ThE:~ gouE!rnrnent of this ProvincE~ r::tnd 1-.hE ~ goV t!Y'nlnent. : of other provinces knuckled undE!r to 1~.he ne1AJ and power·fu1 Govc.;!rl'ltn( :~n t of Canada, lead by the preSE!rJt: Pl "iiTI(! r-1i .rd ~; I:~H' I flllt'. Mulr ·onuy I l:.o pr ·ov :i.clE! him with the political weapon that he IJ.J.:-1 n ·[:(,~d ·in ·1. h c:. P r·o lJ -L n c E'! o·F Quebec. And other's. :i.ncluding. I s11ppos~::~, +:h1::1 rl '!d~!t'· ·~l. l .. i.bE!t'dl. Pdl" ·l·:y as IME:'Jl a s th~: f<"!dE'!t"

a) NDI) , a1· ··E! c n n c c~ r· rw d <'1. b o 1 1 l: o ·f 7 ·f o n d ·i. n g 1:: h e people of Qud)E!C by not a ccE •pt .i.ng ·i l:. !"hi-ll · .·i ~> I;.Jhy th ey pr·opo ~;~=· cl thesE:l i:HIIE:~ndment s but say th E:'Y t~d J.J lJI) i:e ror · ·j l (·)IJ ~) I'l ·i. f HH~ dl'riC! 1'1 dlll(!l'1l ·.~; ctre not: accBpt:Bd, as the me mb er f·or' ~1E!I'l 'i.ht•k Si:l'i.d . M r· . S p E! d k (! r· , T ~; i'l y t··l'l .::t 1·: 1· h d L: -L s IMI" 0 1'1 g .

J-[: t S IAJI" 0 n g f 0 I" t. h :i S l.E!gi .slc.'l.l: :ltr· c;! 1-.:o jc:!upar ·r:lt; ("! l::he long-terrn constitutional po sition oF t h J. ~; P r· o v -L n c e f o I" ~:h e ~; ,., k I'! o F trying to placa te QtH !bE!C . Th E!Y'e ··is no ju st.i .f'i. cdti .on f"ol " ii ~ whatsoever, particularly wh en you b c~! ,:, r· i. n uri. n d t. h d. 1·: q u E:! b c• c Frequently, and in the past Jn rel.aLion to Newfoundland, pet"forrned as though it IAJi.'\s. tl fol"c->. :i.gn countr ·y . l t d·-Ld nc)l:: perform a s a Province of Can ada at r.1ll.

I~Jh e n i.i-. s·l·.o pp ed Nei~J ·F o u n clldnd f r 0 ITI t a k j rl g 11 y d r 0 E! J. e C t r· i. C p 0 lA IE~ I" i'l c t' o :; :; 1 ... h r:· P r· o l.J ·.i. n c c:: u F q 1.1 e be c c:t n d cl tc! J. :i v E:' r· J n g j i: t o rn c:~ r· k e t s :.i n N e tA.I '( o I'' k r:l rt d 0 n ·1·. ::1. r· ·i o Tn i:h.11 r'C!: ;pHci· l:h~:·y do no{ ·: pC:'I"fOI"rll as i'l pl"ov:incP, ·t hc•y ai"E:o j:1 (' (' r·

f) i"fl!'i.1Vj i ·1 ~; ~ h 0 I I \j h . 1. h 1:'

I) lA) (! I" C:~ c'i :; H p i:l I'' d ·[-_ l0' (: U IJ 1'1 1:. I" y r ... 11" . :~ p (.:' (~ k ~~- \'·· ·.( L 1\lo. 70 ( A f I·. e t' noun ) l\ /j.()? l

.. is djfficult to understand that thi.s govt:H'rmwnt., t.hclt. rnc~lcl~~ so 1nuch of the problem with respect to C h u r c h i. l. l. F ':" l. l. s a n d l·: h E! p o s i. 1.: ··i o n ·that Quebec took, and the position +: h ,:~ 1·. N E!IAJ f o u nell"' n cl i. s i. n '" s d re~:ul t of Quc~bE:~c' s position, IAJould dt:ced~~ l:o '" con!;l:i.l:lll:-i.cHldl i:lccor·d Ol" docunreni "1-hat IAJOuJd acknoiAJlc~dge t'l Sf)('!Cidl. !;Ldl·.ll!> for· ·UJC! Pr'Ol;-i.nr:co! of Quebec :in t.hE:!Se d r·curns·t· .ances.

I E:~ntpha~d.:t.c, aged n, H o 1 1 s e ~~" -" n L ~; 1-. o h "' lJ c-~ t.l1 e c o n ~: t i +. u t i o n al r1obody ::in this Qllt'bE:~C Olll:!;·i.dt~ fe~nd ly Ol" ned: a F 1 1l. l. p ;u· 1·. i c i. p <Hl t-. or· no 1-. <Hl appr·ovJ ng part: :i. d pant ·:in l:he C <:Hl d d i. i:Hl c o n s -1: i. I: u Li o n "~ 1. f r.un :i. J. y , but nobody in this House should IAJd n 1·. ·1: o havE:~ QuE:~ be c 1.1ri. L h 1·.: h t~ specie~] status of a separate countr·y +:hat ct:'tn ~;c.'ty 'no' t.o Newfoundland 1n terms of giving N (,~wf o u n d l. d n cl i. t. s cons ·1-. i. l··.u t ton i.'ll rights .

So to seE:~ this government approve o f a n d p r· om o t. e t h t s a c c o r· d i. s , "i. n the circumstances, Mr. Speaker, "i.ncr·E~dtbl.E:~. Our ·· only hope~, Mr. !)pt:~, :·l!<tH', ·i.n I"E:!c~J.:) ty I bE~ cauSE! it is clE!c:.tr l hat ·l.he pt'E!~;~ :!nt ... golJ~'·r·nrn::!nl: has I:I ·J~) ability to outvote the OffjciaJ o p p u !; i. 1-. ·i o n ..'1 n c:l c 1 e c:IJ " l y r-1 f! o c h I . i.·l k C! IJJjJJ bE! appi"OVed, i:t]J IAIE:~ COU]d s (·:! ~' k '1: () d () h c:l (;:~ l i·l y i. I. I h () l d . i. 1-.

I I p by I'IIOV:i 119 i'HONidTTient-. ~; iHid CcH'l"yj ng nn f'llr'i:hc-:'r' d·i~;cll!;!d .ons, ;·1nd then bP- cl.ffectccH~ by the cJosU!"c,~ ·I"Ule. 1.. .i. J: 1-. l_ ('' I.~J 0 I I l d b (;:~ d C h . j c'.! l) (! d b y Ill 0

l) i. l'l 9 di'IIPI'Idrll~:•ni"s iil'lYIAli.'lY bE:!Ci:.!US(:~ of t·hE! r I I n cl d lfH"! n I .. :~. l F l d IAJ ~; () F M f;! £.-'> c h I.·~ k e . ~) o i~ he ~~ o v E:~ r· rmw n t :i s r' u s hi n g h e <'1 d 1. o n g , <.'1 n d 1·. r' y ·i. n g ·1·. o t. c:'l k c:~ NeiAJfound11':l.nd IAJ:.i th ·it I over· thE! cons t. i. t11i:i.onr:·ll. cl i.ff, as i i·. hds done :in lhe case:' of the l"cd11AJay. l hey t.H' r-) 1 t kc,~ l. H lfllll"i. n g s , t: hey do nol: know lAthed: :ls happen::i.ng to them ,} f" i~) ll 'j t·.!1r:: y :,:; h

C) Ll; r·l h(· :! ; i c l i.r1 '] I<Jl'J ,:tl·:. I 4-022 July 7 1 l9BB Uol XL. they are doing, they arE! just doi.ng i.l~ any1AJi.'IY. And i.t Js rE!gr·ettabJ e I Mr·. Speaker I that 1.1Je Find ourselves in this posit "i.on ctnd that ·the impact on this P r· o lJ ·L n c e ·i. :; go ·i. n 9 I~ o b <:· so s i g rd f i c a n t . Min. Speaker·, IAJE:~ in ·this Pr·ov:i.ncE:~ l.o~J i. ·1. l h i·llJ C:~ I: 0 r• E! l y 0 1'1 t h (! 9 0 0 cl IAI"i. 1 l. of -1-:he:~ Pt"errder· of the:~ Pr·ovinu~ of 1\J f)l/.1 lJ r• II 1'1 !) I,IJ'i .

C k t h cd: P 1" c,Hui E:~ l" i:lnd :>·i m i.l• ·,r·l.y a n rl I: h e c:l :i. l. .i 9 :~ n c u of r..1nd lhe 1.~?-g :islatui"C-:!, I. h c·) c:h l. i. 9 t:! n c E:! of 1·: h C:'! PJ~ovince of Manitoba and the HHo! tnb ,,, r· ~; oF 1-:!·1 i·l 1: l. H 9 ·i. ~; J. .q +.: 11 r· c I 1·: o E:~nsurE:~ that ME!E:~ch LakE:~ ::i~; not P·'ISSf:!d ~:; ·i.l: ·i~;. Hopr-?.flll.l.y, !-:hey can .hold it up long enough for o 1-: h t:! r· p r· o lJ .i n c (! ~; 1·: o c o rn f'' 1·: o t. h E'! ·i.

I" senses and do IAJhai: -.is r·:ight: cl.nd c~ns11r'e l·:h~ ,,l- . -1-.hH ·fLit.t.lr'e of Cdnacli.-1, and in particular the future of s lni.'ll.l. E! t' p r· o v .inc e s , l. i k E· Newfoundland, is properly pr·ovided f o r E'! v ~:! n t. h o 1 1 g h o u r· o IAJ n g o v ,_,. r· n rn (! n t has failed so miserably to do so . For those rE!asons I Mr·. Speaker I IAJE> do no t:· p .:., r· l.: :i. c u 1 d I" l. y sup p or· t. t:: l-1 <'! amendrnE:'nts becausE'! Uwy cannot c'l c h ·i. E:' \J <'! i.'\ n y 1:. h i n g .

T 1·: c a n n o : . achiE'Ve anything and t~JE> 1.1JJ 1·.1 not SllflflOt'l: ·i.hC:! t:li'IIE:!I'ldlllf!l'll ':~:; c)r.' 'i"hp Meech Lake resolution itself. ThMnk you, Mr. Speaker . MR. SPFAI<fR: 1'1 ,.

c) yo 11 r· c·) ;., rl y For · 1: he cp1 c-'! s l· 'i. on? We wiJl take ct]l the amendments l·.ogc)l·hc:•r· . () '11 . l·.hc ) s c-:! J.n amendment s , please SOME HON. MFMRFRS : ~'lye. Mt~. SPF.AI<fR : T11o se aga inst jJ l (.! :·:t ';:) ·:~ .• t•t ') II \"1,;( \_j II i:: i:l v n 1 1 r· o F 1-.:hP say "aye". 1: he arne ndrr 1ents No. 70 (AftE!Innoon) R4 022

SOMf HOI\!. MFMB Fr~S : Na.y . ~J!R. SPUlKFR: The i:lrnendrueiTt·s ar·e defeatE:!d. MR. SJMMS: Mr . ~3 p ~~ r.t k E:H' ' J IAJi'l n i: 1:

t) c l. 0 s (o~ I·:I'Ho~ debate briefly on behalf of the Pr'E:1lrli~H'' i. r I Tlk\Y' bt!f(H'E:' lAJE:~ gEd:. bi:lck to thE:1 ruain motion. Just for a couple of IIIOlrl~Hlts, tha ·t i.s el.l.l.. MR. FENWICK: I do not want to speak to the 1110 t.::i on , b 11 t. I r' d ·i s c~! d so r' t of a point of order at this point. MR. TORIN: A sort of a point of order? Ml~ . :3PFAKFi~ : The ho n. Hw member· for' Me n:i he k. M I~ . F FI\J~I]'f. C :< : llll~ ·!JJ, cl~; :r :indicc-~tE:1d, both th~:! Hlf·:! I lib e r' r

t) r' ~) 1: . .1 () h n I ., ~~- i:\ :; I· (Il-k . l.ong) and wyseJf ar·e st .q::.>pOI"i.:i.VE:1 of ·j 1. . r h H I'IWlrl!:l ('! r' f 0 r' ~) 1: J () hn I ~; Ea~;t: t.o~Ji:U; ~:uppoSC'!d t·.o iHTivc~ back un ''' ·Fli.ghl. i:'ll.: l·:.l.o~Jo n 1 c .. lock i:'lnd hoppd to be hE•I''E! rOI" i. hE1 votE'!. I h 0 p t! I: h .:11·. h lo' IA.J j_ l.l. d I" t'. i

l) E! bE! f 0 r' lo1 thE \ f:inal spc,1akc ... r finjshes addr'(~s:;ing 1:h'-"~ ntdl :ter' so i:hi:\1:. hc:1 couJd bE:! recor·ded as be:ing supportive of it as well.. MR. STMMS : I hdve not spoken on the majn 1110t·i On. Ml~. SPEAKER: ThE:1 hon . the PI"E •sJ dE!nt of the Counci.l.. MR. ~'3TMr-1~) : M r· . S p r::• d k ~-· I" , I d o n o t :i n t· e n d t. o Sf.H:~.~k cd: l.~:!rl<JI ·:h. rl-11-0~ hc::n. lfltc1nlbt!t' l-tc'~' ITii'!dE! t-hE-! potnt- l.l'lbd· h:ls c o ll t' •'\ g 1 1 £::1 -i ~; s 11 p p n r' I·. ·i t; C::! , 1~1 h ·i c h i ~; p I'' 0 b i;J. b J y f.

U f f j C j_ e J'l ·[·: ; h 0 IAJ E:' V (-" I" , .:i f ~.) ~ :~ rlnr:••: .--·l r·· r·· ! ·} (· 1 ! I] ; . ·i Jill" • !1 r' n 1._4.0 /3 J ~~ J y 7 , 1 9 a a tJoJ XI !:JT'!:';~li· .. lf hr.) doe:; l'lol·., IAJP IAJ'il_l_ express our deepest apologies at h;'ltFi.ny i·o r:onr:l11de l·:ht! df:d:lt:-l.i:t'. M r· . Speaker , I c J. o s E:~ d ("! b cd: e on b f'! h rl l f o f I: h 1::1 P r' C:' Hd . ('! r' , L•J h 0 unfortunately was not ablE:' to be~! l·w I" C~! l·: o d i:\ y 1: o c l. u s E~ cl c~d:) d t e b u ·1:: , o F coursE:1, d:id spE:1ak in opening thE:1 d(:!bcl ·l:e r.1t t:hc:! ou+:set. and I b~ :!li~'!

Vt"! everybody is aware of his own pc~r·sonc'-'11. "Lnt.f~t'E!s1-. clnd 1·:hclt of his counterparts from across the co u n 1:: r y wi. 1:: h r· e s p t! c t 1:. o 1:: his significant accord . M1n. SpeakE!r, in another tongue, p f! r' h .:a p s , ·i. t rrr:i. g h t b P a p p r· o p r· i. a 1: c.:o , .and I s h a J. 1 t r y i t : M . 1 E! P r'

E) s 'i. d

E) n t , c 1 l:! ::; l: u n j o u r' form:idi:lbl E:!. SOMF: HON. MrMDFRS: H(c1o-l.T', hE!rlr'! WE)] J clonP.. MR. ~>TMMS: r-1 (! r' C . j b 1-~ ;·111 t; !) I I p I Me ,., c i b i. C! n . Anyl.lJi:ly, i·~r··. ~')p<:!c··lker', l l:h·ink ·il: : ·j~;; a vei"Y histor·:ic di:ly, dcc!~;p:i-t: .~: ~ the con1;~o:'t'l'l!> expr'nssecl by l:h(·'' l.~: !c::tclcc•r' of the Oppos:i.tion on beh~lf oF hjs p ,,, t' 1·: y , "' n cl c o n c H t" n s +: h d t h d \) (! b e e n E!Xpressed across Canada in d :i. f f t! t' E! n L <:1 r' e "' s , b u t.

"i. +: s h o 1.1 l. cl n o t be forgott·.en that there :is a1so cl cons 'i. cl E:' r· db l. E~ i)\ rna u n t of ~;up poI" t. for· thE! ME!E!Ch LakE:~ Acco1nd. It: shouJ.d c\ l. s o b ~=! p o .L n t: P d o u 1: L h a I" l:. h at support comes from a broad bclse of pol.itic~l pdrLies, political philosophies. so whi]s{: the I . i. b E! t' '" l. 0 p p o s j_ t i o n i. n l . h i. s ProvinCE! opposE~ M(:~ech LakE! as it s ·1:. ,,, nc:l !; MR. FENWTCK : The Provincial Liberal Opposition d!H!:; ned·. ~~li:-Hll-. ·i.i:? ~--H~ c1 r ~n w:; · -···___,_.... - -- No. 70 ( A f I E:~ t" n o o

n) RLf02:l

Yes, the Provincial Liberal Opposition in Newfoundland. jt shoul.d also be pojnted out t h r:t t t: h E! P r· o u i. n c ·i. <::tl 1.. i. b E'! r· c1 l. P <~l t' 1-. y .i n Q tH :! be:~ c , of c o u r s e , a I" e s t r· o n g 1 y s u p p o r 1.: -i. v <:! o f i. t . T h c-~ Pro lJ i. n c i. r:1l . Liberal Party in Ontarjo are str 'ongly srJpport .i.ue:~ of "i.l .:. Thr:.~ Pr·ouj n.c:i.al I ibEH'al Govc:H'nrTH~nt in P r· -L n c <:~ F clr~M r· d r. s l. c1 n d i·l r' c-:• :; '1: r· on gl. y s up p or· 1 j u e:~ of Me e c h I. a k e .

And so i. 1.: 9 0 1-:! :; • I o.1H1 s II r' lo~ 1-. h lo~ I . ~) i~l ch·H' () r ihe Opposi·Uon l/JOtJ]d not 11..1ant i'tnybody to 1-.iTi .nk Li ·F1l: oppo:di:i.on l· 0 M E-!E~ C h 1.. i:l I<E:! e X p I" P S S E:l d b y h :i m 0 n b<'d'Jr.ll.f of i:h<' ! U.ber·:ll . P;:n· ·i:y ·i.n NE·!I~Jfound1and, pl"ovinc:i.alJ y, i~; n r.~ c e s :; •'l r· i. l. y f! xi: lo~ n cl ~) cl 1-. o I. ·i b 1:~ t' <'ll.

Par· t i c s a c r· o s s t hE:~ c o u n try bE:' c au s E! i·.h,::J .i: 'i.~; l'JO·I: i ... h1::~ Co :lS<c', d~; 1~1~:! i'lll. know. 1\J ()lA)' r-'lr' . s p t:! d k E:H' I 1: h :is p d r· ·U. c ul. rH' (.)ccor·d js histor·ic in itse1f bocause of l::h<:! fr:<~ct: thr'll-. <'11'1 agrc~c~ment was reached by the 1eadE!t'S of t:h1:~ te:~n pr ·ou i.nc'i.al governments of the day and the Pr'-i.tflE!

M·i.n i.s+ -.E !t' of CrHld.d,L All of t:hE:!TTl togE:~'l:her repr'E!SE!nt:l.ng alJ. pol.iti.cr:~l. par·tios, IJJE :!r'e abl .('! to reach a significant agreement on thi .s pdr't .·i.cular· j_ssrJt:'. ~)o l:.hr.1l :. in :it ·sc:!]f :is h:i.storjc, Mr. Speaker. WE: ~ hd.uc.:. had a considerabJ E:~ amouni: of cl E~ I:) r:d: E! o n UH:! rr1 i:l I: h·H' i n n 1 1 r· lc'!gj~;J.c-..tlul"e, as eve1"ybody pel'·haps is dl~lr:~l'r-~. W~~ d·id noi·. II~;E) 0111' c:!l'tLLI'·e day t.odi'..ty on :i.i", but .

Uris l~l!)lll d h<·1lJ!·~ 1:)(!(:!1·1 ·1-.1-l!'! 1:1'1'i .r' 1:1-:!I ·Hl i:h day of d E~ b a t €~ ~l n t lri ~; I E~ g :i s J a 'l-.tH' E~ o n Uw Ml:!ech l.<~lkl·) (.)ccot'd 1·1-J'i.ri ·.f!C!n s~d ·U 119 di'~ys! MR. ltHIL.~~ : T h i :; ·i !; H1 f! . 1.: h i. r· h~ (,~ n -1: h d •·1 y n n l.o.Jh:·i .ch it IAJi!IS dE~bd'l..E:~cJ. MR. SJMMS : We~ hr:<~v e had twelve days of clebr;JI ·e, <=\ () thjs wou]d hrlve b<:!en l:.hE! LlW2'1· July 7, 1.9BB Vol XI . +: h J r· t. H on 1·: h day .

For' d sTria ll Legislature li~e our own that is a si.gn'i.fi.cant. atnounl:. of t-.itnr-:! l:·.o spend on onE! particular topic, but i. I~ p o ·i. n ·1-. s out: L h f! -L 1n p or· l.: an c e of the issue. We have spent d p p t' 0 X 5. lflr:l 1:. ('! l. y f ·i_ f tf:! r>. 11 t: 0 S ~i. X ·1-. E! t:! 11 hours of debate on Meech Lake here .in 1: h ·j !) I_ E! g :i. S 1. i:l1: II t' E:~ .

W (:~ h i:'l V e h a c'j t.hir·ty speeche:~s, madE~ by, I 'l::h:ink, I:I~Jc-)n ·l·.y -- ·;E:.~lJen rnetnbl:'!r':;, !>O rnot'l·~ l~han half of i:he lE:!gisJat..urE! has spoi<N1 on I·.I-1C! dt·)l:)r:-th:! <:'d.: orH:• i:·inlt '! or· anot.l-w r· d u r-:1 . ng l: hat pt:H':iod of t i.m n . () ·1 1. rn I·) 111l:) I'! r· !5 o f 1-: h n 0 f ·f ·i. c ·i_ r:1 J. I_ :i bE:~ r· i'.l J 0 p posit :ion h bt v E'! spokE·! n ::i n I • he d e b ,., I: "-~ 1~1 · i. 1: h I· h C! ex c: t:! p !·~ i. n n o F two, r-..ts I calculated :l.t.. And p f:' r' h i~l p ~; 1'1!) i'. 1".1..110 . .J: b €! l. -j_ 1:!

U C:! l.: hE:! mE~mbPr' for· For·t.une -··· 1-ier·rn~.il:i-!gE! (r"lr. ~:; ·Ln11no 1·1 ~;) ~; po k 1:'! y u ~; ~~ e r·tL·1 y. SOMF. I·ION. MEMR f RS : ~-l () . MR. SIMMS : He did not? Anyway there are only ,:~ c o 1.1 p l H . R o i: h 111 e rn b e r' s o f UH:! 1\ID P Party have spoken in the dE!bc.tte, c:<tnd ·•~ c:ons.idE:•r'i:lblE~ nuJIJbt:•t' ·fr·orn this sJde, ourcaucu~;, incJ.u(Ling U·w Pr( '!rnier·, of cotu·se, l·~o:'lve spoken in t:.he dE!batE!. So we:~ have h r:-1 cl <:1 s 'i. g n j_ f .i. r: ''l n 1-: d rn o u n t o f d ~=! b d I·. r:• on the Meech Lake Accord.

That ::is noi ··. i:o ~''~'Y IAJ(! do nol-. l.lndc~r·s+:c:tnd that there are concerns that ~; hor1l cl b1 -~ b r·oug hi: f o r·t~Jr:-1 r·cl. Dt ,tl:'. 'l h E' I" E! 1..11 a s a n d. g r· E! e rn o n t. l:. h a -1:: l h E• {) c c

C) t' d b (! p i:1 ~; s (-) d I~ I i 1·: h 0 u l antE~ndi'JI(.;!I'll, and tl ·rE:' Pt"erniE:!J" of t-l·tJs P r· o ~ri . n c r:• i ~:; ~; i: ·l n rl i. n q 1 1 p In h i ~; l.o.Jor·d and WE~ suppor·t h:i rn on that. But. most JniPOI"tantJ.y, Mr·. Spc,!akel", 1~1~:! n or~J j I) ·i n <.-1-ll t h '" e t:! f~ c:• cl r'! r· d l. po]:iticd.] part:ies in Canada, we 1'\Cli~J jo ·i.n :;(!lJC!I'l nl:hf!t' pr'Ol) "i.ncps in Canacld., l~hus tAl(! bt:!COJTlE' i:'.I'IE' ejghi:'.h pr·ov·i.ncc:• i.n Ci~lndd<'l , l~o suppor ··t l•ht'' Me P c h La I< e A c c o r d . A n d t h P JTI a :i n ;~ n cl mo ~; 1 .. s ·i. q n i.

F j c e1 n +: d c h ·i. f~ u H 111 t'! n 1·: tl n d to:· r· t. h P A c c o r d ·i '> I h E' f et r t.• o r· No. '/0 ( n F le::or·noon ) I~ tl.() 21.~

coUI":;E:1, that tAJe as a Pr·ouinc~~ i'.Hld c:1 ~; r1 c o 1 1 n 1: r· y 11 n cl t:.! r ~; ·1·. ·'·1 n d 1·. h c· i'U;p:il"i.'.lt.:i ons of t.h("! p~~op] (c' of thE! Pt'!)lJ"inr:r-) or Ql.lt-:1bl1(. Th<'IL l~li.'l~; br·ought homo for·cj bJ.y lo m~:!, Mr·. ~> p e • .-1 k e t' I r· e r: en ·1:1 y i. n Q lit-:~ b !'.! c 1 141 h c.~ n :J was thE.~I"E~ just: i'..l coupJ.e of IAJeeks i:1901 by nH:!tllbl;!t's of UH~ l.ibet'<.-11. Coue1"nrnent of th(c1 PI"Oui.ncE:1 of QtLebr:'r:. ThE!Y r'lr'(c1 uer·y I ur;!r'y passionc.tt.e about th:l s piH'ticulc-.lr i.tE:!Ifl1 thJs pr.lr·l-."i.culdr' l:op·i.c.

Indeed, ouer the last couple of E:1UE:HlJngs l t . .:~l.k{H~ IAJ:i.th SOtfW representatjues attending .the U . S . .. C rUI d d d 1.. ~~ g "i. s l. r:il '1: "i. u E~ S y rn p o ~:;-i, u rn here from thE! Pr·ovincr:1 of QuebE!C I and thcc1Y i:H'(~ ver·y, vc;!r'y pclsstorlr:'l'I--.E:! about thc->.ir demand and their tAJish and l:hE! i.r dr:1s i.re l:hd'l-. !-:hey for·mct1ly comE:1 back into the C 0 n f (~dE! t' r!l 1·: 'i. 0 n 0 f C d 1'1 i:1 d i:1 aS . d f 1.11. J. pi:H'ti'H:!r'. And I Ml". Sp(->.aker· I I am pl. e d s E:1 d I: o •:; •'I y . l·. o cl d y 1 ·. h d t 1·: h 'i. ·; p I'. 0 v :i 1"1 c (-l.

I lAd "I: h HH~ s u p p C.ll" t 0 r t h e ~,11~1~1 Df.:11110Cr·.:~l·i.c r.:u·l:yl IMhir:h l tHldPr·stand .. t~dll bE~ uot:i ng for· ·HHc! A c c o t' d , <:1 n d I l h o p e I l: h u Oppo~;:i +.ion, pPrhc~ps tAJ:i t.h somE:• t't:!:;er'tJi-ll.:ion:;1 btJi·. I•J(! sh;.-1 .. ll. ~;er-;, lidU(,! rni:,~.dc'! Ce!l"h:dn, Ml". ;::;pE~clkE~I'', l·.hdl: i.ndeed l.ht·:~ Pt'l)l}"incr.:! or QltHbC:!C I~Li]J becor11e CJ. fuJ.J pi.H'tl'l(c~l" :in the C.HhHI i,,:Hl ConfedHr'i.~J:·i.on oncn ;-1q;d n. !" h d 1'1 k y 0 II , r1r-. ~) j:l C:1 d k ~:! l'' . ~:lor"'F HOI\J. MFMB E R~3: HE:1i:H' I hr:~i-..ll"! MR.

SPFAKFR: Order-, please! Are you AJl those ready for Jn favour pl.ec:ts(:! SdiJ 1 Ayr:!' . SOME l-ION. MEI'-1B F F~S: I Ay E:1 I . Mf~. SPF"AKF:R: i"hose dgd··insl·:~ 1N•'IIJ1• I II.()/. ~'i .J I I l. y 7 I I. q !3 g the question? of the motion, \) o -, )( I SOMf HON. MEMBERS: 'Ni-ly'. r--1R. ~:) fMMS: Ml". ;::;pr::~ai<E:H', on d:i.v:)sion, p]E'!dSf!. MR. SPFf\I<Ff~: C <.-ll.l. ·i. n i·: hr.:~ lflt·Hnb E! r· s . Division I'-1R. SPEAKER: Are you ready for the question? MR. SIMMS: L-Jc->. arr::~ agr'E!ed. MR. SPEAKER: Ag1"eed.

AJ.J ·those :i.n favour of the mot:ion, pl.ei:1SE:~ r·"i.se: T h n h on . 1-. h ~) M :i. n ·i. •; 1: e t' of F "i. n"' n c ''! d n d thE:' M:-i n :i st. E:1 r r· E! s pons :i b J E:• f o I" ~J t·)I~J f 0 II n d l i'l n cl ::Hld IJl b r' ,:, d 0 l'' 1·1 y cl r" 0 ( M I" . W~i. n d so 1") ; thE:! h on . the M·i. n i ~; i·.t·:: r· oF F·i. ~;hr.:! r'·i t-:! ~:; ( ~'lr·. R:l.d(:'OUt); thE:~ hon' thE-! M:ini~;·l (:!I" or .J II~; i: ·j C H ( r-'l ~; \) l:~ I'' 9 !:~) ; -1: h (~ h 0 rt , i. he M:i.nist.E!r· of Fclucatjon (MI". He::Cll"n); U11) h on . l-h n M ·i n ·i. ·=; h::r· o F M 1.1 n ·i c i. p <·1. 1 Affaj I"S (MI".

Rt"t:1·U:.); thE'! hon. 'I.. hE! roll:i n ·j ~; :-r:~ j•' 0 r-R II r· i:"ll ) A g r' :i. c lll.-1-.·.l.tr' d l. and Nol"thE!I'·n Dc;!ueJ oprnE=·n l:. (MI". P OI~Jt:! r·) ; l: he h on . 1·. h C.:! P r· f'' s ·.t cl H n t·· oF Treasury Board and President of -t.h(! Counc: i.J. (Mr·. :::>tnuns); l:.hH hun. the Minister of Health (Dr. Col. l. :i. n s ) ; 1-. he h o n . UH'! M i. n .is bH' o f-- Transport:.ation (MI". Doyle; thE! hon. l·:hu M-Ln-Lsi":f-:!r' of MinE'!S (~·1r'. Dinn); the hon. the Minister of Cons Ur11er' Affd i. r·~; i'l nd Comrnurd cations (MI". Young); t.he h o n . l·. h (!

M :i. n i s 1-: e t' o F C ,,, I" C! r"! I" Development and Advanced Studies (Mt'. ~~i.'li. U1r~l~ls); l·hp lwn. I ht:! Minister of Culture, Recreation ..t n cl Yo 11 i ·. h (roll r· . n 11 ·1·. J··. ) ; 1 .. h H h u n . l: h H M:i. n j ~; t e I" of r~ n v ::i t" o rmw n t. d n d I i·\ ~~~ cl •; ~ .. 1 0 . '7 () ( () r l-t :~ r· i l <) 0 n ) !\ '1-0? r;

(Ml". Russe11); the hon. the M"i. n i. s u~ r· of La b~)U r· ( ~k. R 1 an c h a r· d ) ; t he h o n . t. he M i n i s t e r· of Responsible for Northern DevE:~] opniE:~nt (Mr. War·r·er1); Mr·. Gr'eE~n:Lng; Mr. R(dd; Mr. J. Cdr'-I::EH'; M1~. Baird; Mr. Hodder; Mr·. ~~oodford; Mr. Cc:'lll.dn; Mr. Mit .chell; Mr. Patterson; Mr. f mn~.ri. c I< ; M r . L o n g . SOME l-ION. Mf'J-1B FRS: 1-IPcH', hE! a I~! r'IR . SPF.:I1KFR : Ol"dE~l" I plE:~i'lSE~! Those agi:dns 1: Uw moi: ·i on, pl.(! i.~:; ,~ , .. j s E.~ • ThE~ hon. ·t-hE :! l..eadE:H' of 'l:hc~' Op po s ·i.'o:'i . on ( Mt· . 1,1JC:' 1.1 :; ) ; r.~r· .

Fffor·d; H1(-~ hon. Mr·. S'.i ruruons; Ml''. T ul !< ; r.11 r· . VIJ . C r.n· h::~ r· ; r11 r· . G · i. l. b e r· 1~. ; Mr . 1<. AyhuCir·d; Mr ·. H:iscock; Mr. [) (;! c kt::H' ; M r . G 1.1 l. l. <:'19 {~~ . MR. SIMMS : Wc)ul.d l::hE~ l .. c.:JddE~r· of t:hE! i n d :i c ate 'l he u o t e f o r· l'-1o u n t S c to ( 1\1 I" . R <.H' r·

y) be on the record? MR. WELLS : 0 p p o s i 1: i. o n thE· mE~rnber s 0 L ·1-. IAJ ·i. l. l. Jt would would have i nd:i cat-c.,. thE! er-r-or·. He to s pC"!d k for· h-i.1ns e l. f. MR. TUI.K : That is ~]Jawed over here . MR. SH 1lMS: HP J:. not bl rnE·!ruber· of your· pfH'ty? 1'-1 R . T lJ U( : o,, i-'.; lll~ttc'!l" of ~;uch ~irupor·h :~ nce c.ts IJJ i :; i. L i :; rl 'l.l ()Ill!:~ c:l 0 lH<! I' l·w I'(! . M I( . S fr"'M~> : Yc~~~;. IIIlo ~; ;;w,l lllli9.1 t· E'! I" 1.o~1a n t (! cl l. o g Ed I I p d 1'1 d :; fl I'! i:l k . SCWlF HOr~. MF:MH U~~~ : Oh, ohf 1.4076 Ju1y 7, 1.9HH Vol X I_ MR.

SPEAKER: Order, please! T h E~ HI o 1~. ;L o n i s c d r· r· i e. d , 2 7 v o l. •=~ s t o 10 against. SOME HON . MEMBERS : H (~ r:u· , h t~ iH' ! MR. STMMS: Mr. Speaker, we wi]J start with Ot·rle:'r' 1, i:Hlc:l riiOIJe:.~ do1~1n H1r·ough +:hE~ Ol"d(·H' Papc·H'. In otl·wr· wor·ds, l.hc,~r·E~ .i.:; d l·.h ·i.r·d r·t:~i:ld:i.ng r:1nd thf :~n Co 1111 n i. i: I·. t-.~ e of \-. h ~~ ~~~ h o l . e . 0 n mot ::i. on , Cl b j l J , 11

An Act To Am''~nd And Con:;ol :i.cl<:th"! T'h''! L.::tiAJ RE:!la·U ng To The->. Usc~~ And Op .N'al :ion or \hd·l·i clH~>' II ··~~. -,,d ;:l l:h i.r·cl ·L·i .IJI(~'' o r· d E~ In t~ cl d o p cl s s a n d .1 t s t. ::i t 1 f~ b E:' i.~ :> on 1·. h (~ 0 I' t'l e r· P i.'l p 1:~ r· . ( B ·i.l. l. 1\l o . 1 4) . MR. SIMMS : r1ot-.:i .on il., COlfllriJ.I::hH:! of l.h!:'~ 1!1Jhol1~~ . On motton t.hat. the Hou~;e r'E!SOlVE! it.self ·i.nl ·:,) c,)lflln-Ltl~.l'!e oF l.:h'~ lt~ho ·l.l:! on a B:ilJ, 11

An Act To Amend ThE! Ntjr·s ·i.ng ()ssist.dni·:s Ac+: 11 , (11·i.-11 No. 18), Mr. Speaker left the Chd ·i.r·. Committee of the Whole MR. CHAIRMAN (Mr . Greening) : 0 t' d e r' , p 1 (o' i:1 s e ! T h C'! h o n . t hE' men 1 ~H~! l" f o I" Me n i h E~ k . Ml'~. ::·Fi\11,\JTCK : 1'-11·· . C hcd r·rua n, IAJ(,' w :.i s h i.'t n ;:1 mn n d fll(! n·i: h:: 1: h ·i. :; piece of lPgisl~iion. Ml~. SIMMS : to pr·cq:JOS(~! p d l'+ j C I 1l d I" r,~h:i c:h rl ;Jtl:;l'' ;;n ·c~ yo11 dl ill-:!ncl i ng rJOI!o l? Ml\. r·FNWICI<: ·rh;\ i· 'f • ;;r Cir; I: (I ':!: 1 r:~ ~:: ·!··; nn ();II"'~ No. 70 (Afl·:E·r·noon) f\lf.026

1~1011l.cl bCo! 01'1 cl..~I~Se /.,SO I~J(:~ I~J:i.l.J. lo~.lcd t: u n t j 1 c J cW s (:' 2 t s .c i"! 11 Co! d . On nJot-J on cJ C!use 1, ca1"r'.i eel . MR. F.FTORD: f)i .d l:h!::! I.Ui·U:Ir-:!t' or -i:hn ~Jf)p p111: foi''I.Ui:ll''d an aruE~ndriiEHit? MR. rFNWICI< : 1\Jn, nol: 1)1.:~1".. MR. CHn[RMAN: Shall clause 2 carry? MR. FENWICK: Mr. Chairman. MR. CHAIRMAN: . . -- The hon. the member for Menihek . MR. FENWICK: Mr·. Ch<.·li.r'lfi<Hl, I;..JE~ l.n1- .. encl ~:o pr·oposc->. an aruPndmc->.nt. to the particular· i.H' i: 'i. c l. E:' . S u b p cu·· .~ g t' <'~ p h /. ( /. ) (

b) says: 11 hAJO shd]J be->. nominated by l.he M -i.n·i .si ... er' of !·lc-:!r'lll:h dnd onr:! ~: h a 11 b E:! n om :i n c-.d P d b y t h E:~ M j rd s t. E-! r of Cd r·e e r' 0•·:• u c,, l np1110 n t·. <.H1cl Ad IJ r.1 n c ed St-ud::ios · to 1"("!pr·esont thE!'i1" I''E:!sp~)ci·. i t!U Dep•·H'I:iflt-:!nl·.!;. 11 lr·ln 1;..ri '>h to add <:~nothE:!1" ~:(:'Ct:ion t.o thE-• end Of i.1·. 1.1Ji ·ri.ch 1.1)0111 .d !)i-11), 11 •:\i'lcl !)fll-) 1 IIH · ~; J. n g i:-1 s s ::i. ~: t a n 't s h d J J . b e rlOIIIil'li. ·1h~d l·:!r-1Ch by l·i ·

H) I\Jf!l~ii-:-OIIrld1;1ncl A!:~;ocJd'l.:ion of PubJJc: FmpJoyE'E:'S rHld Un'~ Can<'\di .rUl Union of P11b1 :ic Frupl oyE:~f!S. 11 ThE~ in-t-~Hit of the J"e(;o]utjon js to (,~ n ~; 1 1 r· ~~ 1·.: h d 1:: l·: h (! h~J o l r:t t' g H s L b 1:1 r· get :l n :i n g C:i g l"! n t s on b t:' h d J. f of n u r· s :i. n 9 d s s 'i. s 1·. a n I: s q u "i. t r:~ r r· a n k 1. y I t h'.i nk the tt~Jo bar -gC!ining agE:'nts JJ.J h o r· n p r· e s <·'! n t "~ 1. 1. , o r· u i. r· 1': u <'t J. l. y aJl, UJL"~ ntn·sing dssist.dnts jn '1-: h L s P r· o u inc e ··- I;.Jo u1 d L h f'! n h auf'! son1e d:ir·(!Ct. rnE~ans of making surE!

L·.hcitl:. l·:hl~Y hdlJ(;! r·npr·es•·:·nt.c1:· L<:>n on lhe Nul"sjng A:;s:.istant.s Counc:il. As tM~) r-ocr:-11 .1., 1~1hen l·:h ·i.s p-:ir;!Cf! oF ] • ] l ' f' ' .1 .1 P g J. s ... a··. ·1 on t~Ji:l s .. ·:.~ r· s t 01. r1 l': r· o o u c E! o :;.; r:~ h l -~ r: ··t ~:~ i !-· u d 1-. ·i 1 : ; ! L~J!; ,-, r ! L\) :) <~ ;-:- 1_4.()/ 7 J IJ J y 7 , 1 9 8 8 VoJ XI :·.hr,.~ l\l11r·:dng ,:'l!;s·i:>h'lni·. :=>chools hi:'lcl closed down. There JJ.Jere f):; :;

r) n l: 'i. <·1ll y 1-:wo u i.'l c i-1 n c i r:• ~> on 1:~ h r;! b o a r· d , <'.l s o n 1 y t h :i r· t E:' e n 111 c,!ITJ b e r· s IAJ0-1!; pi"!)po:;nd. Th:i:; IAJOlllc:l not r· c->. q u :i. r· E:~ , i'! s I t.l n d E~ r· s L a n d j + , a n y o Uw i'' p ;.H' U . c 1.1 1. a r "'m u n d me n 1-: s i: o d n y o·t:h,~r S·E~ctjon of t.hE! ]r:!g:lsJat.:ion. (.) n c:l 'i_ r UH~ ':3 <) \) E! r n IIH:! n i. ·j s i. n agr'(:!SITIE:Hd:. w:i t.h t.hl.:' pr-oposal, ti 'l(:!l'l ·u·. IAiil.l. !:)(! j 11~; 1· ~; i.1npl.y .:'1 n1a u-:~H' of changing that particular section.

f) o y o 1 1 IJ.r.i. :>1'1 m C! 1:!) t' r.~ d cl :i. l o n c e more to make sure ·that everybody 11 n d ,.~ r· s i: an cl .i. 1·:? The Gover·nme!nt HouSE! LE!dd(•r indicates he does . The argument for the particular dll1C->.nc!Tnt'!l'lt, Mr·. Ch<'!..i.r·rnan, 'i.s l:h.':Jl:: thE!riE! has bE!en a considE!rablE· arnouni-: of ·- lt\lhr-11 ... i.s 1-h'"' pr 'o pPr' wo r· d? ·- s c e p t i d s m, I t: hi n k , about 1-. h c;!

N u r· s .i. n g ~ s s ·i s 1-. r.1 n 1-: s Co 11 n c ·i.l. on the par·t. of l::hE~ bar'gcd.ning Cl9E!I'lt .. s f!) r' I'll I r• :; i n 9 d S S .. j S t.: cHl (: S . rssE•nL:iaJJ.y, Lhc~!Y do not: get~ any ·inp11l: ·inl :n l".hi.:; pr:H'i ·'.·i.cul..u· co u n c j 1 , "l:. hey do n (l ·t- g e +: any fe•·:~cib.:tc: ·k i-:-i''llnl l:i·1r-:~ C:OIII'lCi "l "in l-:I'!I"IIIS of IAihal :.i.t · · .. is tT"y:.ing to do, l.ul ·1a ·t· ;u ' ~:!

I: h c:~ 0 b j I·H : 1". :j IJC• :> . of i l , 1-h p J"cc•guJat:ions :ii ruakPs and 1AJhat oil · flo 'll''l::iCIIldi ''l':J I~J<)t'k:; r.t!· .. f l:hink l·.h:is :is i'.ln inappr·opr·:.iat.e sy~;Llc'nl r or- cl cl'i n 9 U·l'i. :; . l h :=! t · ,.~ · i ~:; r· C! ,-1ll. y not an i:IS(;ocidtion of 1"esJ:iS'l-.(c'I"E:.d n 11 r· ~,; ·i n 9 i-l :; :; ·i. !:: 1: d n l: ~; o:1 !) 1·: h ('~ 1" (o! ·i s for· rPg:i s tE! t"c->.d nu r s l=> s that ha ~; t· hE~ r:logT "<:!f'! of colnp.:•l:r:!nC<':. Lhr::tl:: l·:h'"' nursing assistant councils wil::h:i.n E~dch .indtuj_dllr::ll. publ.ic sHr·~Ji.Cf-0! union has.

And I i:hink :it would b e cl p p r' 0 p r' j d i·. ('! ' t h (~ r· E! r <) r' (" I l:. 0 a11ouJ thE:!1T1 to SE!t up the Tllf'! C h d l'l"i. S rr1 S I~J i'H'! r' H b I) 1-. h r::• y I;,JU L1 ·1 d h i'l ~! '" access to it. They obuiou:;ly have i:) 1 0 1.: 0 f t'' X p C! r' 1-. i ~; e i. n 1 .. h i S i)1 i' ~;! d . I knoi;.J t.:h~'!rl:\ J.s a cornn1itt-:er:~ with:ln 1·. h r·:! 1\J t:·I~J f o 1.1 n d 1 d n cl () s s o c :i o-1 1 ... i n n o f Public Employees that. Lhey caJJ , .. h£~:; ~~ ~.!t lr~·: i ···::; f'! ~~ ,~ ·i '.:: ;111 I,. (~~: t!! ~n i ~· !- ·,r :l No. '70 (Afl :.et"I'IUOI'

i) I~ 4·02 7

not~J. Th.::ti : COIIllfl'i .i·.h :!t:! i.i·.sl,~lF t.o~Joul.cl bE~ the Jog:icCJ.l cho:ic.e, I IAJould s u g g C"! s 1-. , f t' o 111 ,,~., h 'i. c h UH,~ u n ·i. o n could chose its particular r' Cc' p t' E:~ s E~ n 1:. d t: i. v ro~ f o r I~ h ·i. s p a r· t :i. c u J d r' counc::il. I think by doing that t.hr:~n l:h1,, cltnoun1-. of suspi.ci.on that. exj sts behueen thE! public service un'i.on ,~ncl thE:~ counc-Ll. IAJould be d::irnirdshed substantiaLly. At the Scl!IIE:~ t:i.utc~ 'i.t woul.d be cons.i.si-.EHJ( ·. with the other :innouat.ions being pu 1-.

Forbklr'cl by UH"! goucH'nlllon-1: OUf~r· the ]CJ.st couple of months that h ,:-,u E:~ r' ~::~ c o g n 'i. :z ~) d r~ h c-) !: r' "' d ~:! u n i. o n IIIOVE~rt!E~rd: c!~1 a JE~gjt-Jrnat.E~ pat"t.nccH' IAJ ·i.l ... h f·.ht:! \.!JOl)t·:!Y'I'llfll:!I'Ji: ·i.n l:ht,' ruCJ.nCigPruent: of i.'l Jot: of i t.s <'! n I: 1·:! r· p r· i. !; e ~; . r: n Hw p d y e q II i I 'j ~> i i: II·~ i· i

l) i 1 I r ()I' c~xantpl C·!, !Ather·c->. :it: eLi d d J at of l'lt ·)\jOi: ·i di: 'i l'll.j I,IJ·i .i.h f·j IJI·) ri·j , rfnr'I·Hli: p u h J :.i c ~~ e c to ,,. 1.1 n :i o n s , j t. b I" o k E~ , I Uri . n k , y o o cl <F' o 1 1 n d 1: h e h:' .

T h · i !> , I t lri rt k , t.~.ro tJ J d bE-~ an o l· h EH' !i i. g n ·i f·i c .:t n 1·. moue f o n•J<:l n:l F n r' l·: l·w go v E' I" n I'IIE:! n t , :i t '"'' o u J d bE:' a s·i.r ... u,~l:'i.on IAJht;!r'eby ho~; ·f:·i.l.:.i.l.y I•IOitl.d bt:! d:ir11:in:ishE:!d i'lnd UtE~ nur·s::ing dSSi.Si".dnl:~; 1-.h(!IIISHJ.VC:~S I!JOUl.d hdVC;! sante fE:!el 'i.ng that their coJ.lectiue bdt'9i~-Ln .. i.ng i'lgc->.n ~-., t.o~Jho dct·.uc~l.l.y '-"cts on thE:d I" b~~haJ f j n tE!r'rns of n t'! go -1:: i. d +:. ·i. n g s d l. a r· ·i.

C! s d n cl 1.o~1o r' k .in g con d t ·U on s , t.a.Jo u] d a J. so be in a posi.t-.:i.on to hetve d IAri.nclot•J, shc:1l.l. lAIP s a y , o n U1 e p r' o f e s s i o n a 1 d C:! ~J e l. o puw n t oF 1·: h f~ p r' of C! s s i. on :i.i'SE:!lf. !tiiPl.l., Mt'. Chr.1i .r·nk1n, l·:hnsr-:! i-1t'~; /:he,' on 1 y changE~ s w~~ h i!l u E:! . I havE:! a c o 1.1 P 1. c'! o F c o p i. E! ~' o r i. 1- , b 1 1 ·t: t: h "'') ('! 111 d d P s o 1n e s J :i g h t d n 1 E'! n d nw n b; t: o ·i t- lllY!>c'!l.i lht·:! .:t1: l11dl. I~IOI''d i ng ·i !; : 11 () 1'1 d 01'1 ~:! i llH' ~; -.i.

I I 9 d S ~; ·j ~;-I 1'.11'1 t S h ('{] ] be nolil i l'ld l [·:!d l'!o·l .t:: h by 1-.1-11'' Nt'-'!Aifourldli'!rtd A~::.ocJc.'.ltJon of PuhJ:ic :·:·lllpl oy::!c:; iHHJ !.he C; ·1.i' li:1cl i •"In l.Jn ion (l r p lJ b J :i c F . nq:J J. 0 y E:! E:! s . II 1 hE·! i n l-r:! n l: i on ·i :; 1: h ,., i·. Hw ~; ,.~ ~~~~10 i: t' i·l ric! I.JI'li(l('l~; IAIOI.i -\c:l :": :iC !'J i'l(l[Ti ji'1 (:1\:L"> d I_ L~()?.

B .July 7, ·1cJBil Uol XI . fH:' r' son l: o !; ·i , .. _ on i'. h t~ co 11 n c :i.l. but. that pc-..rson, ·· that :i nd:ividuaJ, IAJO ul . cl b r~ d n u r' ~; .i. n g d s ~; :.i. s t i:'l n t rE!gistE:~rE:'d under· the Aci:. I havE• c1. copy T can i:.ab J.c,~ for' t.h<c~ Tc1bl.e itsE:~lf and a coupJ.e of other cop'i.~~s for' :i.nd"i.v'i.duals t.o~Jho may wish to have a look at jt, And 1.~..rith that, Ml". Chair·man, I 1110\JI-'! t.he (Mr. i:h-1.~; member l.ong). dlliE!nclrnr:•n 1:., for St. seconded by John's East MR. Clf() T RMAN: Thr:~ aHrendrnent :is j n or'dE:!I". The hon . the Min'i.ster of Health . Dl~.

COLLIN~): r-h· . Cild 'i.t"llliln' govr:H'I 'lilll-:!1'1{: thdt this ruatt·er !AJOuJ d L~kl ~' ;_,\Il l"' r' t:• COlliE! Up . lt!) ;:1 Jlli:ll-.i .::!i" of fdci ·, ·ii: CdlliU lip i'l long t'iiTI~ :! ago !A.II'I81'l 'l:.hC::•i"E:! !Aii;1S SClTII(' cot'l'e·q>oiH 'Iencr! bt"• h.o~J<,!:O!I'l rny pi"E!dE~ce~;sor· c.ts M:Jn:JstE!r' oF Ht::.a1t.h (Dr·. Tt•JOlll£-:!1)) i'lrld Lhr:! 1.11rions O~Jr:!r ' this p~rt'icu}ar point. The ·i.tnpr''"! ~; s :i.on I: he D ~~ p;u 'blltHJI- of Health had as a result of th~t c Ol'' I" C:! ~; p o n d e n c C! :i. s t lvd:. /·: h C! 111 d /" 1 ... ~:· r' LAJas pr'E!tty LAJe11 sett.l ed.

It UIE!I1 c a 1 n C'! l: o l. -L g h +:. , a g a -L n , IAJ h e n 1:: h e b i 11 !AI a s a c t u a 1 ] y d r' c u 1 a tE• d j n thr>. Hoi.IS(~, dnd l l::h.Lnk I arn c o r . r e c t i n s a y j n g t h e:t t j t c a ITH"! t o l"i.gh ·l-. dgd ·i.n br:!cdusr:! , .. _ht:• hon. member, who introduced the d 1 n ~~ n cl1 n !-;! n t h ~:! r' l:' , b r· o 11 g !1 1-: I~ h <~ d r· i''l f 1:. bill to the attention of NAPE. r: 1: h ·i n k l:lvtl : Uw r· C'! i. s ,;, fundc-J.me .nt:dl nttsundE:!J"stand:ing t·hi'lt:. ·i::; br ··i1·1·d·ing Fnt·'l~ohH'cl t·.hi:; ·i:ypt:• oF ~;ugge~;t ion on t hj s c<fTI(:~ndrnent.

Th~~ c n 11 n c i 1 i :; H1 (' ;· e F cw i:r' i.·d n i n g pUI"POSE'S, for r·t"!g·. :i ~;i.l"a·l oi on p 1.11 ' pI) ') (! :; ; 1 J'l C:! ·[ !1 d f. i Y fl I'' C) 17 i·. h ;i_ II q 1;1 n d on~' o t h E:• r· F; u I" p o ~ E• IAJ h :i c h T tAri J l 9''' i· l o ·in i'l ll10IIt::• n 1· ,'tile! ·i·.i"lf!t'l:! Fnr't:! the people on j~ are thos~ rela led i:n p11l· .·l:·ing in p'l,;:,,: z-:• i·h<:! ':o ncl :,pl·: and \'·hr:' i'tcl ·tldl -.i-r·y (lf :1·1< ·' nl :l" ';inr :J 1\.lo. '/0 (I'll::- i.r:!l " i'li)C)rJ) /~ lH) /. g

assistant,· shall we say, work (>. t. h ·i c d n cl tlJO r· k d~:i:"i.IJ·i.l··.y i.n hospli.etls. T t i ~; , .. e a J J y not thE:~ r e f o r· I:)<H'I.:Ji·l"i.rd ng ptlt'pOS(!~) I U1i:l 1: l:ypu or ad ·:l.vi ty. ThE>. FJE:!Opl e:o on HlE! COIII"lCi.l. dt'(·) l:hO~)(o' 1~1h0 w·i.l.l it'i:dn, lAJ h o IAI :i J J t. r.-~ k P p eo p J. E>. IAJ h o a r · e no t l"ltlr·sing d~;·;i.~;l· .• -Hil~; iHlcl help lo cc•nvet"t · thew into nur·s:ing .'\ss"i.~;l:dni~;. ll: i~; i:hcr·e i:o 1nd·.

Cl'"E:!dEHd::i aJ.s of FH~opJ E~ who rn::ight Sl·ly, 11 T dill f>iH'l:l.y 1-.t'i'\ii"H:~d 1"101~1. 11 I t ). ~; t he r· 8 t. o s e t t he c u rT l c u 1 u m f 0 t' l: h (o' l·. r' •l i. rl -j_ 1"1 g p I I t' p 0 S (! ~; . 'r· h i:\ l·: l.s t·hE! IAJor·k of t.hc:' council. and i:hr.\1: "i.s nol·: I·Jw tAJor·k of unJons, etlthough J arn sur·e they arc->. i. n t. E'! r· r->. s 1:: o d i. n i. 1·: . lJ n "i. o n s d r r.:! r-h EH' (! t o e n gag e i n 1 abo u r r· ("! l. i!l 1-. i. o n s b ("! I~. IAI ~:! c->. n 1·.: h e (~ 1 n p l o y (c! e r.1 n d l:hE:1 employer. That is t:heir major wor·k.

NotAl I knot~J Lh(o~'J g:>.i-. ini-.o ol~hE:~r· t.h<ings, :.into pens:lons and those,, sor·l:s oF dcl·.tv ·i.l::""i.Hs l·.oo, bul: t·:hdi: i s ·Hw :i r• p r· j 1"11 a In y f o c u s , IAJ h :i c h :i s q • 1 ·i. l: e d i. v EH' g rc! n L F l'' o m ·1·. h (o~ p r' i 111 iH • y f o c t.J s of t hi s c o u n c j 1 .

R u t t he 1" P 1 ~; o n ~) o L h 1-:• r' etnd 1;•1J <-:! n ~.hi't t TfiCH'H j s ·i. rnp or· 1: i:Hll· . that th:is po·.i nt, COIIrlC i.l p IJ b] :i C .I :; l·hu body h> llJh 'ich i.h('' or· I'IIE:'rtlb~,r·~; of" '11'1(' public c <'! n i.'t p p Co' i:1.l. ·i. r L h (! 'j r"' I·) l, l: h u y •. , i"'lo~ aggJ":i.E~VPd OVEH' SOfl~td·h:i ng r·e] dt-:·j ng I . o n 11 ;··· !; · i n g .-., ~> ~; ·i ~> L .H1 i-. ~; , L o I·) :i L h e r· 1· h c-~ ct c "1. :i v l t :i E' s of n u r· s t n g dS~)iSl:.:ll'll:::; Or' l:O l:hf! i'ICI·.·i.I.J "i.l:y 0!- i:l ~;j_ngJ P l'IUI"~;:i ng i;tSS:i s·t ctnt.

So t:h<"!Y "'r · ('~ ·;_ h c:~ d p p e .. =t l. 111 c~ c h •. '11'1 "i. s 111 . ·1·h is app<''dl. lllf'~ChiHl i Sill, l::hH cotH1c:i J, must not be :incumbered, S h• '! -ll_ IJ.If! s d y , b y o 1 ... h (·'! r' ob] :igi;tl.j ons.

If you have a r· E:! p r' E:! s u n t. d t 'i. v e f r· o 1 11 "' u n i. o n I~ h ~::~ r' ~'~ ·t-h c~ t r· E:! pres EHI taLi. 1.1 c->. is r E· a l J. y 1-: I·H:! r•r:! not I:".C1 s p(:!r'l k as h ·L111s e 11-, d s a mt=:~mbeJ" of l~hE! counc:i 1, but as a r·epr·esr.=!ntat-:i .ve of- t·.h('! uni(Jn. ~=)o T 1-h ·. i n k 1~. h a t: 1:: h a 1- IJ.J o ul cJ c o 111 p r· on d s e l_l.j.()?9 J 1.11 . y 7 • 1. 9 n ll Uol X I. the validity of the counc:il in bE!:i.ng th~) f"i.nal. appel'tl mechanism in terms of compJa:ints by Lhe p 1.1 b l. :i. c , ~; o f o r · 1: h ifl : r' r:~ d s o n gove:~rnmen ·t cannot agr·E~e IA.d l"..h this d l'rH·HH'I HH'! 1·1 l·. .

IJ~lc! t.o~ri . l l. tJ o I: E~ i·l g .:-1 .:i. n ~; 1-. th~~se i~.TIJPndntE~nt s. It has nothing l:n dn t~Jhi·11:ct;C!I' t~ril·.h dnnyi.nq anyth:l ng to un:l ons. Th:is 'd n 1; (• r· n !11 (! n 1·. :; 11 p p o r· I: ~; 1 1 t·J"i. n n ·; , i·: h j s goVE:!rrmH>.nt s"L J"ongJ y suppor··t s th~' u rl"i. n n IJlo tJ n mn n i: i't i 1 d i. ·l: h ,., s b t" o ugh 1"". "in any l"llJTrt bE:~ r of t h J n g s for· L.lw lc,~g·i.l:"i.ilk11·e bnrwFi.l: of 11ni.ons .:u1cl union membershJp, but il is i n "' p p t' o p r· · i i:'t L c-~ I: o d o Ill h i'd~ · i. '; b P i. n g request~~d "in theSE! arrHH1dmE~nts.

It lJ.Joul.cl be :i.ndppr·opr·"i.ai:r~. i.l-. l..r.Joul.cl hamper the work of the council, dnd t.hdi·. ·i.s t.o~Jhy l..r.JE'! dr'E'! vot.:i.ng against H:, and for· no other r·eason. Ml~. CHAIRMAN: The hon . -·tile mE:mber for Port dE~ Gr'dV~). Mf~. FFFOI"W : M J" .

C h a :i r man , t:. h :i. s arnE:! n d rn E>. n t. t..r.J as br·otl'dh l: l:o rny ;,1_1 ·: I :-:.nt ·i.on by l:iH=· h on . t. h ~' mom b E:• 1" for· S ·{ . .To 1·1 n 1 s r:;-1:;1: (Mr·. long) i:l t_;Jeek or· ~;o dgo, and I :indicated to hirn aL that l iTII:! l I~JOIIlr:l bt•ing ·jl· twf"CH'H Ol.JJ'"· caucu~; and d:i .scuss :i.-1, which J hi:lllC! h.HI l.hn nppoi" ·l·.ttn·i 1-.y l·o clu soi neE>. t.hE'!I"I. J must s<~y :i -l: j ~~ no I I.J!·=~r·y nl-h:~n yo11 iH'I·:: go ·i l"li:!J Lo f·i ncl ::in t.h:is HOUSE! of As~;E>.lTtbJy rny d'::Ji"'(:~lo~ ·ing i.n dc,~l-.i,, ·i.l.

IJ.Ji .l:h l:hP hon. thE:~ M:in:istr:~l" of 1-iei:.~Jl:h. nut ·t.he cnnmH;~ni:::; he j11sl·. rndc!('! l n1u~d: ~=;r:1y ar·e eXdCtJ.y the points t:I'W I. E!cldE!l" i.'\ n cl o 1 t r' c d u c 11 s el-i . s c us~:; C:! d , d n cl IAJE' c-.1gr·ee IAJhoJ.E:'hE!aJ"tNiJy w"ith what hE· sc:l ·icl. Tl·. is our· oi.nl~(!nl· ·iun, i'tncl [ am sure Jt is the intention of g o v e r' 1·nw=! rd-. , iHH :I Uw N D P , ( 1.~1 o u l. d assunw, tci ensurE! that nl.ll' 's:ing d s s .i s t ... :1 n t s .:'t r' c-~ r· u p r· (:~ ~; c:o n 1:: r:> cl d s 1 ... h e y shou1d be on thE~ counc·:L1.

ThE~l~E! ·i s no q u E~ s i ·. i. o n d b o u t +· h d t , l: h H n l< r "; in g a ~; ~;is t. an t s hal; E'' L o b (:• l\Jo . '/0 ( () ( 1 U I' 1"1 0 I) 1"1 ) :\IJ.029

r· c~ p r· c~ !; C-:! n t. c~ d . T f a n u r· s "i n g <·\s~;i.~ ; l-_;:~nL i.~; •·\flfH."l ·i.nh ·)d Lo J··epre:1:.~H1t a pcu ·t.:i.culdl" urd on on I. h 0 r o u n c i l. d n cl for· ·; o II

H) r· 1,1 i:\ son thnt. u n :i on :is dr: !.CC:!r··U f:i E:1d, t hE:Hl j n or d f~ r· for· 1-: h 1::~ n u r· s ·i. n g d ~; :; i s ·1--. d n ·t-_ 1: o bH on that council legislation IAJO u l d h d u f:1 1: o be c h ,:~ n g f>. d b E:1 c au sf:' of the dc-'!CE!rtjfj cation of · that par· ~~- 'i. c u l. a r· u n -Lon , an cl 1-. h ,,, ~~- IAJO ul cl Jeaue a uacuum on that council u n t. "i. l r· c>. c e r· t -L f i. c a L i. o n h A s t: d k ~~ n pJacr:1. So r th:i nk the interesting Hd ng about that thr=! dJIIendrnE'!I'll : .:i.s !·:he f, :ic1·.

U1H union would be not Lh~ } n11r'si .ng So IAJe ag1"ee IAJ:i th IJ.Jhat f' Cc1 p t' H S 1.;! n t·: t'! d , a ~; !; :j :. ·1-a n t s . l·hl:' hon. L h ~) 11-1 'i. n :i s ·I c-) r o i- 1-1 e <'\ 1.1 : h j u :. t· !; cd d I c.-.n1d ti1E~ fete-!- :is lh cll: ()Ill' ini:t :T C.:!~; i· IIIII S i: !:)! ·} i·c:: E! l'lSIIt 'e ·r!·1dt . nur·!;:ing <:l~;sois'l-clnts di"E:! r· £-:! fll' C! ~; t-Hl 1: e d n n I ol-1 I<! c o 1 1 n c · i l ~:; o 1·. hi·\ ·I: t I H·! :i r· u j c-!l•H; n r· C-! known and l'l'!<]llli :\1 ·.

Lon ~; i:\nd ;~ Cllr ·r··i c11l 11111 Ci'tn be-~ pt~l :·in plac E> and i;tdrn:in:ister ·EH~ pt'Ofl (!t'l.y i·.hr ·ou::~h Th: .' 1\lllt '~;·i.ng As:.:i :.ti"n t: : Ac-1- . Rut to hc-..1v E:~ i:1 p"' t' L i. c 1 1 .. 1. i:'t 1 · fH :! t' s o n j 1 1 :; '1: 1-. o l''~!pt 'PSE~nl- . l:·hE> un :ion I410Ul.d not bE! IJJh..-11 ·. l~lH consicl l-'!r' ·l·:hl-' ! br ,'S I~ 1-.h·i.ng for· ·H1E:~ nUl"~dng as sJstan-ts. wc,1 -t.ot.c.'ll.l.y dSJI''f:!C'! 1-.hr:tl·:. l'li.II"S :i. ng dss:i sti:lnts n1ust bE:' r·eprE!

Se ntE!d on '1:. h e c o u n c ·i. l. , t. h e r· e i s n o q u e s ·t: ·i. o n dbout that, but not for a p a r· t. "i. c u l. r:tr' u n .i o n . S o , t"l r· . Chairman, I agree with what the hon. M-i.n-Lst~:!r' of l·ler:'\l.l-.h s< :\··id, dnd that j s 1 hcc! IAli'lY lAJE:~ feE:'] about J t. T hope U1 ,~, L tMe h c:-1 tH! t'lli .:Hh! our · p o ~;j U o n c 1 E~ i:H ' ·I~ hat n lH' s j n g d s •; i s t.: c\ n 1:: s s h o 11l d cl E!f i. n .·i. 1: ~~! l. y h r=! on t ~~ e co u n c :i ] , b u l no t to r P p r· t:> s H n l~ d p "' r· 1-: i. c 1 1l. r:-~ 1' 1 1 n i o n . M :~ .

F F 1\J~,J r C l< : r.ilr· Cll<:d nl lcJ.l'l . IVJ f\ . C II A T H M M~ : !'!·1•·:· hn n . Hw lllf!lllb:::;- l-or ·· t.ljr:! n i i·ll' !k I. 11.0 '3 0 J1 1l. y '7 , 'L91lB \Jo ·1 X I MR. rENWICK: T j11 ~;L t~J i:Hl l: l.o .. i"(c1•;poncl

h) so 111 ~:! of thOSE'! cH'9lJITIE:!rlt:.S put fOI"IAJat"d by 'l:.he M·i.n :i.~ ; Lc;!r' of J-lc ,1i .~J.I:h <Hid l t-.i'Li.11k e c h o E:H:f by L he h o n . rn ern be r f o r· Po r t cit'! Gt'i:~Vf!. Th(;! c:-~r ·gun11·:!nl-: bc->.i.ng forward is that thjs is not an o r g d rl'i. z. a '1:. ·i. o n ·t h r'l l~ s h o u 1 d h '~ v E! representation from unions in that ·i.-1-. is ·i.nvolvr-=!d IAJ 'i.i ~h t.h(:! l·:r'd .i.n.i.ng regulatjons for nursing dSS:i.S tant .s, i5tnd l:.h (>. rE:'CjU i_r'C-".TTICc'l"'i":S and so on. I fi.nd this a r·~~Jfi<'H'k,:;d>lc~ 1-.h .i.ng 1-.o S i:\y, bec<.'IUSE '!

I think if the Minist :.er of Labour 1~1 r-:! r·· e:.~ h t.:! I" l'! h (! c o u l d p o i n 1·: 1-. o uirtually reams and reams of ·i.nd:i.tJ:i.dlli:ll. !; rr·um i·:hr~ l.dbour· mouement, appointed by uirtuP of 1-.ht-:!'i.t · br-:! ·.ing ·in i:\ 111 '1·iu11 pn~;J .I-_·i.onl o n i'.l u n i o n E:~ x P c 1~ t :i. u o , L o a IAI h o 1. e bttil• :h nf bo;u ·d ~; l:ll n i· dt" r'! i.nvol ~Jnd 1~1:ith ·t:l"i'.l:ining.

AJ.l Lhe i:\ppr ·unl·. i r~t'! ~; h·i p l:t· <:t· .Ln·i il9 1 f, lr' ex<~rnpJ E:', donE~ :j n th is PJ'·ou :i.nc e h1.=:1 ~> t'Uflr 'r·)·;!-'!i'll:c:\L 'inn on i".i 1e bo, :tr ·d:,; ·Lh.::tl: superv:Jse "!-he training from ~he ·i.nd ·iwidlli\l . i_t'i H ir·' uni ons them seJ.ue s . For examp]e, jf you i'lt'f! 1:;-·d ·i_n·ing t·:!l.ucl".r ··i.c "i.r"lns, l··_h t:!r'f" is an apprenticeship commi tte e t h i:\ I: h ;_·\ !; r· t:! p I" r:! s t~ n i ·J t '1: i u n F r· u rn 1.: 1·1 1;! International Brotherhood of fl. e c ·1·. r· i c i.'t l 1,~ or · k (!

I" s , t~ol h ·i c h .i. ~:; L h t-=> union that rE'present s mo st of the c,~ l. (>. c 1·: r· 'i. c .. i. a 11 <; ·i. n L he P r· o v ·i. ncr.~ 1 •·:t 11 d that representation sits on the boar ·d drid hd s d l.ni -. 1--.o say ab out. the kind of training regulati ons +-.he'll~ r'lr'r-) p1 .11-- 'in tc1ffc:! C'I-. 1 l:hE =! 1'1Uirlbr-:!f' of electricians that will be 1·: r· d "i. n ~~ cl ' c:'t n d s

C) C) n r:t n d s 0 r 0 t' l.: h . Th::is also he!ppens :Ln t.he f:ield of br·· i_ r; k -, i.=ty ·i_ ng i'l ilc.l _ C r:\ r· pc:! n 1-:r ' y d11d I quit E! :U·ankJy, the J.::Lst i s endle ss . So T f:Jnd it 1111clcr··; i·;JJ'ld t~lill) I h1- ~ I"C:'prE:!SE:!nl - v·:il"l:ua1.Jy d :i F F oi. c u l L l: (J i :tAll) a 11 url'iuns or I~JOI'k j r!lj i'llli''~; i.n<.:J ;:t~; ~; i ~; ·i·o:tn I_~:; i l'l I. h(:' liH:• lhdt Pl"ovinc~'. ~-;hou]d· b< :• ·loJd L11h·i -, r-:: ·i L ·i ·=; '-' .,., r··i gh I f1H' i·l'l! :•s H ·i.ndu::~! :"· ; ::1-! \·· r· ~:t c: !:.i ') I" li"'' .' ·' (• i\lo . '/0 ( () r~ i ::! I" i 'j(J

l) n) r~ 1.1-0 :J o

r·epJ"es~::~ntatj on on apprenticeship COifliJJi.t:l'-.ec:~s, it i.~; cr~rta'i.nl.y not. a p p r· o p r· -j_ at e for· t h j s · par t i c u J a r o c c u p •:~ t i.o n , ~w c au s <:~ t: h '" t i. s o tl<:~ of the ruajcH' functions of Ud.s n u r· s ·i. n g '" s s i. s t i:l n t s c o 1.1 n c ·i. J. . So thr:1l·. ".i.~; i·_ht-~ pi. ·lr· ·l~iclll"lt' i:lspec ·l~ of :it ·1 hi,t J do not und~·d"stand and T L h i. n k i. i: i. ~; •1 r· ;_dJw r· ~; p' 1 r· ·i. o 1 1 ~; iH'9lJTIINl·~ t:o b~~ pu·l· for·IAiaJ'·d by thE:! tJti.nis(r;:t· or lit-:!<:l.ll:h I~J"i .l"h r·(~!'fH)t:l·.

I:O :i [-' Th~:! ot.IJ~·!t' quf!s·l :·ion ] think i. s ~~ q IIi'\ l. l. y !) pI I t' ·i, 0 I I ~; : T h i_ :; i !) i·l nu l"s:i.ng as~; :.i :; h:ud~ s cou nci J 1:~ Ill fH)IAHH' !·) d 1: 0 h (-:! i:H' oHl d d d j 1.1 el-i. C •':11-. e cornpJ i.'.l:i nts dgi'd nst nursing .:tssi.sl-.i.-l.n-1::; r:1ncl tAJh,:lt·. act·.i.on IAJ·i.-11. b~~ t·ab:!l'l, bt.1t the,~ Ml .n:i :d:er· of 1-l~~a] th SdYS SOIJH~hOIAJ 1-:i'lr'Jt. nut·s ·i.ng as ~;j s tan t s '"'' h o a I" E! p J a c e d thE! r e by 1'-.hc trade unions r:1re l r 1 i:l p p r· o p d at c-:1 . We 11 , the r tO! a n~ 1-.tJJO •H' 9 U ltlf~ n t S 1·.: 0 b C:!

Hlfl tk! r. 0 counl· ·c-:!r that. The f:i r·st. :is that r. h ('! S l-'! d r· e

l) rl l. y I~.IJ.lO 01.1 1--. 0 r~ f ·i_ f ~~ y me m bE! r s o n 1:: h e c on md . t 1: e e , s o ·1: h E! y by nc lllE~ans doltl"i.n. :'tl ·~l-'! i.l-.. (lncl HUr~n .if you i."dcl thE! ot-her· t.hi"E>.e nUI"s:ing r.lss ·i.sl:anl --~; p'ldcnd on i.l: by i:l go u P r· n m P n t f j d t. , the rr you · i'H' '-" on J y l.:dl.k 'i.rll_j o"\b011f· filJI'! !)It!- ·. or r ·ifl:t'!l-~1'1, i:l tt d ~; t j_ l J n cd t i'..l } lei n g i~ h o u -1. a llklj Ot' i.l.y 0 f 1'1111'•:; i nq i'l!) !) ·j !) l.i·lil I~; Oi'l :it ' N(ll.\t :1 nrerd .:i.orr Lhdl ~-'UC-Hl though T do nol· lh·ink lh;~; ·i·; ,., good i'Jl'' g IJ ITI E·! 1'1 t- b ~-! c: d u s ('!

I q IIi -1- E-~ f 1" i~Hl k l. y I i_r yo11 h•~1t1c:~ ,., compl; J int· •:"-.:J•:l·in~;t. f h ~~ r IIH' !; E-' ~; 0 f -[-· l·r:i ~; P r· 0 U :i 1'1 C C->. IJJ hE! I'' C-'! d c yo 11 I H' i n g 1.1'1 r:! r o 1ll p l <:1 ·i. n ; . ? r o ·the As:.ocia+·ioll of RE:'g:is ·lE:'r·ed NUt'SI '!S of 1\hl~irOIIIldl;:Hld. VJhdL .i:; ::it con1pos~~cl of? AJJ. nur·sr::'s . f~ ·ighl ·? ~')o i'Wt'H you hdU(! i.'1 :;:.i l..udL:-ion ,,,,.,E:'I"e a cornp1a:i.nt. . • . I I l l i'l g c.'\ 1. n s , ·. d n u I" s P ., !:; J r· o u g --~ --. ~~ o "' body COITlpl"':iSE:~d of i'lJ.J 11UI"S8S, yE:d~. a co111pl.r.d nt •'lg<ri.ns 1--.

"' niH'S ·i.ng d ~; ~; ·j_ ~ -!' ('t rl t· --( '~ b I"() l.J 9 h t: i·_- () OJ. 1::• (I d :1 l..'W3 '1. July '/, '1.913B Vol. XI . that has only one-thjrd r:'l.ssisl-.dni-~S, f.'U("!rl undl-'!Y' OUr' pr·oposaJ. So · I do not think that 1·. h d :-. ·i. s p"' r· t ·i_ c 11 J. a r·l. y cons ·i. s t r~ n t . (ll-. l:he ~>i:llllf! 1-. i 111e complajnt against j_ F y ()U ~~- h Cc! 1-J,lVE:~ d medical p t' () r f'! !) S ·j 0 1'1 y

C) II b t' ·i_ n 9 y 01 .1 r· complajnt to the medjcal board, i:lnd 1·.he rnc,!cl ·i c:al bodr·c:l i ;,; cornposr:!d of alJ doctors - IAielJ, Jet us j 11 ~; L !;i'l y 1·. h ;,11-. i t- · i !) d n rwi n <!t he! d c o ru p 1 E:! h~ ly b y d o c -t o I'' s t. o t h E! p o i n ·t· tMh<-:!t'<-} l:hey ;u·r-~ 1:he i:1bsol11Lt:! ruQjor·:ity on jt_ Ther·E:~ may bE:! onE! or· 1-.t~Jo ol-.hcr·~; ·in 1-.l-Jc·:!r·r,, l·~ho:!L T d·o not know clbou·l:.

But Uw fact ::is l:hi.l-1-. i·1 compl.r:l'i.nl~ agr::t.i .nst·. cloct··.or·s is brought to a board that is coni'~ r· n l-l c~ d by doc 1--. or· s . l11.l r:! d r· Cc! no 1-:. euen suggesting here that a cc)rflpl.,-i.nl-. .:lgdoi.ns I~ nur·~:; i.ng assistants bE! brought l.:o a board i·~h<'l!-: hr.ls d nJdjor·'i.i~y of nur·s .i.n_q assistants, just one that has, in l~:h ·is -Lnsl-:.:1ncc,:!, Fiut'! nur·s ·i.ng assistants out of Fifteen people Orl l··_ht-;• bO<:H'cl, tiJ.JO of IAJhOIIl iH'E• th~:!l"e by uj rtUE! of the fac ·t:. ·t:.hat l·.:hc'!

Lr'r.'ldc'! un--ions 1·.1-J;:tl-. t'HPI"H~;~:!nl·_ t.he 4,000 01n S,OOO nu1"~;jn9 ..:t'> s i !) l~dnl-_!; in l.h(• Pr·ot.J.-i net,' h·:'tVH c: on f j d f! n c e that t h C:' s e par· t. :1 c u] r.ll'' · i n d · i t; · i. d u i't 1 :; , t.£r i l .l l. o o k o 1 1 I·~ f o r· I h r:• bPst .:in-Lt"l"ti:'Si-s of 1'1Ul"S :in9 <·1'> :;·i .~; l:< ·ln I :; ;~1!; c-:•rnploye''~s 1.11ho 1·1.-..:turc. t o b ~! p r· o t E:~ c t. E:~ cJ a g a :.i. n s t a l ] s o I" ·l s oF l <-:! I.:J •.-11. ,J t: 1: :i. o r1 , t.•Jil o ·i n I: 11 r· n h .-.-l u u ·t~o bE~ pl"OPE~J"]y 'l.J"a-.JnE'!d for· the,~ jnb ;-1nd ~;o on.

I) I(. COLI. [N~>: T 1-t d t :i S lA I h e I" C:l t h E:! p U b J. J C j rJi-· E! r· C:~ :;-(: c ()fll(! ~; ·i 1'1 . ~11~. FEN~HCI< : Well, :it com~s into t-he Nurses (.'J :; ::; o c ·i. i.'t I~ i 0 n r't n d 1·:. h H d n c 1--. o i' ~:; "t ~; I~Je J l, so if you LAid n l: 1·: o bE'' c o n s i. s +· n n t-~ l. r:! +·. 1.1 s g o d n cl g u I·· l:. h o !': e th:Lngs with profess·.ionaJ.s on them d S l,o.Jp l.l . I f'! (- 1.1 ~; rrld k E:! i. I·· i:'t l.l. c:)ns:isLent. Clnd l·1 c::l u (~l ·~! !·:; u n c· h r"' C '·' : ~.Jo. 70 (IIFI (!t"l'lOill'

l) r~ 4-<i 3 1

rt d nd r r:i ~: ·t-, .• at or·!: on L hE-~ lllJ ,~:. c ... s boar· d .:u1d "' b11r1Ch of' i·,duri.n ~s-l:r-;:tl:or·~; on the'! doctor·!: bocu·d. As a 111a.th>t" of f'o:1c 1:, 1.*:~ IJ.IOIIl.d f>r'Obdbl y clo he~ : i:cr· t,o,J.i ·l·h a b1H1ch of adrnjn:istt"cdOI"S orr i:hc,~ clor:hH ··~ ; bodr·d, b111: l:hi:,{. ·i.~; anoth~~r· rucd-ter· to bE·! fought at .:~no UHH' 1. i.llle dtlcl 'in o:UlO !-:her situation.

Rut: +:he argument.s put. fon~.tard by 1--. h e M i. n i. s t. (~ r· o f H E~ a l. l:: h c lc:~ d r 1 y cH' c:! ::i ncon~d st.c ... nt t..u.i th the pract:ice of this government and clearly also suggests something less than d P s j_ r· a b l. e a b o 1~ t-. h d u -i. n g t. r· ,., d E! urr:ions :lnvoJvecl :in the ordjnary r· u n n t n 9 . of !·: h r.~ <:1 F Fr.' :i. r· s of t h i. s ProvJnce.

I thJnk what l:ies at 1·: h c,, r· o o t o F cHl f:! o F l".I'Hc' ""'' j o t' pt"obJ E~rns ·t-hr~t th:i ~; govet"niTIE~nt has i. s i: h. :~ i: L h c'~ r· ~~ i !) no l. c-~ lJ ..:~ l of i: r' 11 ~; L t hi:~t ·( hE·!.Y l'lc~V(! btJ:l1t Up bE:'·l::IAJeE~I'I I: h t;! Ill') l' 1. lJ f~ ~; ; ~ l'l d 1:~ lJ rc~ tl ~ ·. h H p II b -, j C ~:t'~ChH· lHI:.iort!i that- l'.ltoy hctvc,~ -t·o nr'~gni:i_; ,, !·r" IAJil- .h, o:tnd br'!(o:1 .1.1:;e of" t hi;;l' l hE~.Y ~;OI'flehOIAl SE'E:! i'l~; SOrrtEd:h:J ng !;-.i.nsh~r· o'l. ~;·i.1np-le ~;1199C!~;I ..

Lon Uli:l.!·. l'IIE ·!SC-' ·t:IA IO tr·cHiE~ lJrdons, l,o,Jh:ich fH'E-!, by IJJ(c' IAld'j, i~IIIOI'llj 1:1·1(~ ~; ·i·t'Oi'l'::j(~~:;i·. <H1d U·1f~ bE '!S 'l" led ·r.l''dUE:! un:i.cHJS :in ·1: he co 11n 1: r· y , I.H:d n g ;~ l. l. m•ll ·) t:l !: o p <"I'· ·l j c: ·:i pat c,~ on cl I" Cc! g u J c.-~ t or· y b o ij r· d

C) l) I'! t' ~:; c." (! j 1'1 9 IAJ h ; l i ·_ i. S ,

C) I:J

l) i, C) 1.1 ') l. 'j , i:l l.l.l h 0 J P b U 1'1 C h 0 f t h Cc~ :i. I" TilE~ nt bE~ r· S , J !; hou ld nH->. 11 t :ion, by ·t.he 1:: h c:' t c o n t.: ::! x t. 1-. h ('!

C ,,, n a d "i. d n Pub] ::i.e Employeps, IAlhich Wi:·~.Y J j 11 Un'i.on of ·.1s 'l:.he l. c:1 t' g t~ s t-. u n i. n n i n C i:1 n <:1 d a a n d ar·guably the n1ost pr·ofE:'Ssional of d. l. l. u n 'i. o n s _ i. n C a n •:t d d , ·i. s ·i. n d. position to actualJy bring qu:ite a b i. t ~-. o "' N u r· s ·i n g () s s . i. s 1·: d n 1". s Counc:il J::ikE! !hat I:H~cause t1'1ey h c:1 v r~ a c c t:! s s 1·: o n n ,,, o f i'. h e strongest labour research d( :q:J .H'i-.lllE:!n 1··.~:;' onr'' Hldt ho:ls c:lnn~~ i:' Jot- of work jn terms of OCC1 .1pdl :i.O I'lo1 l. hf!c'lli ·.h i:1nr:l Si'lfr·)i.'j, i'.l. r1 d T tId n k :i t wo 1.1l. cl be i'.l b J E:! t· o g i vr~ H1 i.~; nrrr··~d nq Cl)llilCi -, .:t clr''t]r ·r·:~r:~ r• ()r t\ )( p , .. 1·· l .. -L ~. ~::! [· i'r I" Ci II Cl J-r l 11t:: 1 ·.i l"'' I. 1!.() :~ /.

J11l .y '/, '19Bil IJol XI organi~ation that c 111·' t' e nl · J y h ,.., tJ :~ . - ::it do~~!' not · ~> ·i nli. J. .--n· l y i·: h n 1\J r~IA/ F n 11 nd l c:Hld A~;soc:iation of PubJic FmpJoyc,1os ::i !; i:l F' r ·.i. l. i i'l t:t:~ r:l IAJ'i . 1·. h 1-.l'l (! N i:l 1·. i. I) 1'1 i.'\J. u n i. () n of Provincial Government Fmpl.oyr~!!'!!;, ~~~h-i.r:h ·i_~; [ t::hoi.nk c:tboul: t h e s e c o n d c;r· -L h j r d 1 a r· g E! s t l:.

I" ad E~ 1.1 n J o n ·i. n 1·: h ~:~ c o u n 1·: r· y d o r'l o 1:·. forget, t..ue are not talk.ing about s nw 1. l. o t' g d n i l. a '1: J o n s h ~:! r· E! a n d '1-. h oi. s is also an organization that can b r·:i. n g i:'l 1-. r· r'!Hir'! nd ou s arno u nt of· expertise to the counc:il as well. So 1..1.1 e s u g g e s t to the M :i rd s tE! r of lic~1Hl.l·.h !·.hdl: hr,1 r'fH;ons i.der· hi.s o p :in ::i on .

These a r· e 1 e g i. t :i rna t E! c:tsp ·i.r·;_.,r-. ·i.on:; of any 01"\jtill'l"LI..c:t+·i.on i:trld a _ r'E!asonclb] e t~Jay of clt:>.aJ ing IA!'il·.h i:~H~ pr·obl::!fll, dnd t~ri .'ll c::tdd t-.o i:~ hJgl·1e1" J~~VE!] of t·1··u~;t bE:'l~t~JeE'l'l l:hr:! i:r·;.,rle 1;nion~; .:tnd UH'! gov8rnrnent and this part:lcular b

C) rl 'j ' ''I i'l cl I~) i "I l ' ·j n I. h ,,, l !) n g r· I I 1'1 I r th:.ink, stTPngthE-'11 th-:is o , .. g ;_, n i /. <:1 1-. i n n c: r· E~ d J b J E:' ~:. n i L ·i ~:. ,.1 Ol"gdnJ zat:i on 1'110('0 for· i'' (• 9 1 1 ·1 .:1. i i n9 ·l: l 1 ,,~ rl r· o r C:! ~; ~; • i o n I 1 AI h · i. r: h • J • F . . l l . J_ t :1 ~; , o ... n 1.11'':; :1. rr g i't s ~; ::t s · .. d n ·: s ::t 1·1 ·I: lri ·; P 1 · o tr i. n c r'! . ~)o o 1'1 1: h .. ·l.! b•·1 ~; i ~; ~~~~·:! I•JOtl-1 d s 1-:r'o n g l y u r· g E·! b o 'l.: h t-hE:! OfF ~i c i a l 0 p p o s ::i t. j on i:~n d gov(~r'l'llrlt'!l'll·. i·.o vol·:e flH' l::l ·r-i .~; amendment, which we think :-is a s ·i. 9 n i r ·L C>Hl l: i. rn p I"

C) v fWlE'~ 1"1 [-- () n I: h Co! bil1. Mf~. CHAIRMAN: A l. l. 1-. h u s e i. n f, u n r· alTIE:1rtdmE!nL:, 'aye' . SOME HON. MFMRERS : r () y E:! r , ~'If~. CHrlT:~MAN : AJ 1 thosE~ dga· .in~:t: 'rray' . ~:JOMF liON. MF:MRFf~~) : ( 1\li:i y l . No 70 ( (.) r ; (-' I'' n

C) on ) of HlP i~/.j.()3?

MR. CHAIRMAN: Tl·w r'!HH'!rldwenl-: ·is dc,~ferd:.f'!d . On mo 1: i.on, Cl.dUSl: ~S ?. and 3' carTj (!d. MR. WEI.LS: .The,~ go u C:! t' 111fllo~ n 1'-. has s Olflf~ a1nl:!nd1nc,:! n i··. s? DR. COI..I.li\JS: We hi:.tUE~ I''E:!ached thi~t point. ncw.J, s i. n c I"! I~H:~ h a 'J e (' i. n i. ~; h t-:! c:l c l "' 1 1 s c-} 3 . r'IR. CHfHRr'II1N (\,t'c-:'~-:~n·ing) : Tl1c-! hon. thE~ M:i n:i ~;-t N' of Hf!a] th. DR. COI.LU .. IS : ThPI"f~ L\Jer·E~ hAlO i:tdd:i.tional rni:!.ltc:~r·s 1'. h,-l .l: C i:\1111:~ II fl t' d !·. h I:H' l_;_:d: I·) i. rl 1: h 1:~ C 0 1'1 ~; j d E·!

I'' i'.d: . :i 0 n CJ f t h :i S IAI h 0 1 E:1 l h j_ n g , ··lnd ~~JI-:' con~;·ider·,.}d ~~Jhl-:!1-hl'!t' l:hi-!IJ IAJouJ d be:! br·ought j n undEH' one of t h E! o ·I~ h r~ r· b i. l. l s 1~ h i::t '1-. t• 1 ·i. l. l b ~} p r· E:~ s c~ n ·tl y bE:~ for· e the House , b u 'l: i 'l: i. s pr·o ba b l y 1110 s 1-. a p p r·o pr· .i. c-d: r~ ·1-.o br:ing them :in here. In our· u:ietAJ t: h e y <:'t r· (~ n o ~~- 1 n d 1·: t E:! r· s 1--. h a i--. s h o u l cl cetl.ISE! the comrn:l ttec,1 a grE!at deal of COI'ICI·~t·n, fhu f ·i.r·sl -_ dlllC"!rldllli·HII ·. I"C:1lr::ti·:HS l:·.o hear·:i .ng~;.

At Lhe pt'E•sen-L time h l:1 "' t' -j n g s d t' r-:!

I) b l --j_ g d 1-:

I) t' lj -;_ r <'1 complcdnt. :is wade. Sometimes a c o m p l. '" ·i n 1: i. •; trl '" d e iHl cl i. I: c " n l:l 1-: l"elltE:!d:i eel LhEH'~~ and thE-'n.

I mean, l:h1:~r·p i.s no pr·obll -)lfl t~J -il·h i.l·., i:lnd :it t'C'!a] J y do~~s 1'10l con Lr·:i.butc"! to !·1<:w c:~ d !·1 1'.! .:=t t' -i_ n g . ~)o l. h i ·; .-:t 1111:! n dIll I·) rl'l : w~ill llli-.tkE' jt d:L:.CJ~etjonar·y tAihEdh~~r· i·.l-11- :~ cot1nc i l. t~ri_ll h ... wn <-1 hr-)i-li''·j _ni!J i'll'l d 1-.i·rj ~; l~J:i J l I"( '! i'~ J ] lj rtli'llu.' ·[ 1-J E·! l:h i ng Jnn; --1'! ~;en ·; i_b-1 I'!, r:1nr:l ~;d '·JI-~ l·.h1 -) COlJI'IC :iJ Cl Cf!l"h:dn c~IIIOUni · of ·UrttE~ <1 n cl 1-:! x p ,,, n !; I'! ,., l s n . tl: is nol-. i.n o.Hllj l~ldY 1-.o Pi"(!\IC!i'll-. l1 e iH' ·.i n g s + h cd ~;. h (JlJ ] d I:H 0' I'H'! 1 d f I"CJ TTl b ~: i. n g h r·) l. cl . [ 1-. i !;· j 11 s I , 1 AJ h P r' 1·:!

CCJfllpl "-t·:i nt s ai"E:! rndd E'! and LhE:!I"E,~ j s n o s u b s ~~- d n c e 1--o HH :! ill o b u ·i. o u s l y , o r · -t-!·1 E:! y c cl n be .i rn n 1 e cJ :i a t 1:! J y 1· · c,1 mE! d j e cl j 1.1 •; I· by !:. o 1 Ill'! .. , c l·. ·j on i:; IJ 1-l: ,c. c 1·: u n r: ·i l 1..4 -03 3 JuJy 7, 1988 Vol XL and there is no need to set up a for·wal hr~a.r·:i.ng -- pr·o1:r-~ss. Thai-. is the first point .

The second po'int, there is a b-.i t: of ·i,ncons i.shHlCIJ i.n 1--_hf:! tAJonJ.i.ng i_n one place it r'E:!fers to ':i.rnpi"OPE'!r condtlcl: Ln a proi=-F.!~;s ·i.oni:ll rrtdl'll'l(!Y' 1 and in another area the wording is 1 j-H'OrC!!;~;·i.on;,,l llli.~:;condt.lcl--. 1 • ~:)o this :is just to cJear up that rf ·i. F F I·H' 1-~ n c I'! ·i. n L1JO r· eli n 9 , j 11 s 1--. llii.'llu~ the ·l4JCH'CLing as :it r·e1atE:!S Lo ' pI" oF(!~; s ·i. on ,,,1, trri . s con d 1.1 c t. ' consistent·. -t·hr·oughout: the bj J J . T 1110 !H:! I: h o ~; 1-~ dIll(! n d n'H:! n 1·. !; . r"'R.

CI-IATRMAN: ThE:' hon. the LE>adE!I" of the Oppo·;·i l··i_on Mf~. 1J'JF:I.I..S : Mr ·.

Chair·man, norrna11.y such cl.dt .ISI'!S, .::tncl 1-:h: :!r t~ dre rndny of them in various statutes , also pr·ou i cle l~hd l: 1-.:hf:' P''·r·snn dqd tns I~ whom a complaint is made has a r··ighi: 1-·.o b< :~ FH'E'!SHnt.: and bE! r· e p r· E· s E! n t E! d by a n a g e n t o r· by counsr:•l. [ j 1,1 s -1: s dl).) 1. h i. s '""'I(~ n d HI f~ n l-: ·!--. o cl d y and I do not: know tJJheth E·r· the,, r'E !S t or:- l:h i.:> Slli .lSU C 1-i Ol'l i:1l .r·e1-1tly lfl d k<'!S pi"Ou::is-.ion; :i.f :l.t: doE-!S not, t.ht: :!n ::i·l- ~; 1-J

I) Ill C! t' (! <:l. -~ l lj b I'! 1; l I~ <:'l i" (' cl I I p b lj E:! n s u I" :i. n g t· h a l l. h E~ r· E·' j s a r· -.1 g h t l:. o b C! ;-• t·) p r· (' •; 1·:• n 1·. (! d i.l y c n 1 1 n !; e l . r: i·: 111 t'l y br;,! t.hrd .. thE-!r'E ·! :is a]rE'!ady i:.l !) II b ~; ::~ c 1: ·j

I) n :·.hI 1... p t' I)\) ·j_ d I}~; r

I) r· .i !·. r~ r? . c 1-11'1 rr~ t·1 MJ : T h t:' h on . t h e M :i n :i s t e I" of H t'! e1 J 'l. h . Df\. COl. I JNS : r-1r'. Ch<·l . i.1·'nk'lrl, T clo nul . kn o1•1 i.f 1-h :i s 11..10 u J d b H ~'a -L ·:.i ~'factor· y o ,.. no -1-: , Ll11 I: 1.1H:! ~~!:i.l "I_ look i n t· o 1·: h d I~ rn.-:'tl: 1·: P r· r·:ight alA!ay. T am advised l::hat . l::hE:. o r· · i g L n '' l A c 1·. l i. k t'' -1 y cl o ~:• s , r:1 l rn o s +: cer·i~.a::inly do es. We w:i1] cht>.ck on il· j 11~:;(· 1-n ill r\li (r• <-;l.J: ": '•, ·'t ilr.l T: I.AJ'·i. ll No. 70 (AftE!nlOon) f-Ul-03 3

br··i.ng i:hl'll: I~IOt 'd bi·\CK r1R. CII()J:RM(H\J: T 1, C-! h on . t h P Ttl ern bPI" for· ~1 en:) h €-~ k . r-1R. FTNWlCI<: The dliHHlcllill ·)ni. 1·_hi·li. hi:l~; bHI·)I'l pr·oposed, Mr·. Cha:i.r·man, st~erns to I:H~ ~~ x p <-Hl d i n 9 I: h c-:~ r· o l.c~ of 1·. h ''~ NUI"::~ing A:;s::i~:tan·ls Counc·.il -l:o g:ivE~ il·. pr.-n·l:i.r'\l.l.y UH'~ r·i.9h~:s of o:Hl t'!TIIp]oyC·H'. And J IAIOU]d suggest to 1:: h e M 'i. n L s 1·: r~ r· o f H c-~ ,:., l.

I: h I: h .:·l I: 1". h lo~ p r· o p o sa 1 her· E.~ ::i s r· E:~ a 11 y u s u r· ping 1:: h e IJ.J h o l. e r· o l. u of t h t~ b a r· g d t n ·i. n g agE~nt and the employer· and thE! rel.ationshi.p between the two of thE!m. Tf a nursing assistant has done s Olne::d~. ht ng i.111p r·o p r~ r· ·-~ nd he or· :; he j_ s , o r· h E:' ::i s , c~ m p J o y e d t h e G e nE! r· a J l-losp"i.i:d1 ., for· Co'Xdillplu, or-· by l·:hn S ·I .

C J. a I" €-! 1 S , '[- h E>.rl loll h i'.l. t h a p p E:Hl S j n f".hdt: s ·i."I:LJo:li".i.on i.~; noi·. i'\ COIIIplr.tinl: ·t-o t· 1·, P. n 111 .. :; :·i n g as :; ::i s -1- i:t n ·t·::; l:l)tll'l!>lc~l. l;\lh<.'\1: hi:lj:lfll ·:!n::; i.::; 1-.hi.'ll·. Lhr-:! ~-!mpJ oyer· d:i:; cipJ j rre:: t·.he E-~rup] oyec-! i.lst'!1 .r:-, •.'tnd l:hi .·d·. d·i:;ci .pl·irll'! "i:h,::n b C-' C 0 ffl E~ ~; :. lJ b j E' C t· t () i-..t g 1'' :i f!

V iHl C E'! pr·ou:!dllr''" on ·i 1-. i\JoiM by p11 i··l-. i n9 -t h:i ~; :) 1'1 pliiC:E:', iH'E:! lAIE-~ rtOI~J I·:!S [·_;:·tb1 •i ~;h·ing i·) ~;~~COild lC!lJl·~-~ oi- dj:;cjpJ.:i.nl:' "t-hiit· goe~; l.o d Ll i Fl-:::r'c-~n L bocly.

Ft'i:Hlk1 .y, T H1 ink l:l-11-~ qiiC'!:;'o·.·i_on l:o t hE~ p r· P v 'i o u :; am e n d mE! n 'L c~ l s o c:'l r· i. s E! s : ~,1 h .. , ·I: i. ~; l : h c': l t! 1; t' 1 o f cr· E·! d :i b :) J :i i· y of t h :i. :; N u r· s j n g Ass i. s 1--d n 1-. s Co1.1 n c ·i.l 1.u ·i. l-.:h r·es p~:! c 1... t··_o the jndiv:idual nursing assistant IJ.J h C'! n L h r~ y h "' v C:! s u c h l 'i. 1:: 1--. l. r:! .i. n p u ·I~ into the IJ.Jhc~J.e opPra-1.-.J.on and quite f r· a n k 1 y a I" t.::! go i n g I~ o b t' j 11 cl g £'! d by a c u r11 b :i n a t :.i. o n o f . n u r· s :i n g s 1 .1 p t;! r· v i. s o I" s , b y r· r:! g ·i s i·: E'! r· r:o d n u t' s ~:! s , dPpaJ"t ·niC:!I'11. offi c.ial~; and peopJ.e IAJO r· k ·i. n g for· cl i.

F F ~~ t' t'· n l'. h o s p i 1· ('' 1. s , '~; d<lmJrJ:lst:J"dlOi'·~;? I th:'i.nk ·t·hi:.tt l.: h f'! J"('! i s i.~ t-h i'1 -t :i ~; no 'l 1. r-:! 1; ~" -~ o r ( r· r:! cJ·i b i, 1 ·i. 1: y n 0 I' I·· f! X j S h:'i'l !· I 1·1 (''I" 1::: :i I' I \ r' !: 1 ~; ; r I \ l I I'. ; ; 1 1 t:! l. • • .. ~ l. j I l.tw;lti July 7, 198B UoJ X I. ~)<) rr·orn Ukt1: pc;!t'!)~H)CI:'i.t.J(! T do not S P tO:! ·h 0 IAI t h j S . j S i:l p i'll'' ·t-j C U J iH' l y 9 no cl · i.m pI" o 1; H rn 1:! r 1 I: l·.o 1