Volume 1 PROVINCE OF NEWFOUNDLAND THIRTY-SIXTH GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF NEWFOUNDLAND 1st Session VERBATIM REPORT Friday, April 28, 1972 SPEAKER: THE HONOURABLE JAMES M. RUSSELL Number 6

April 28, 1972 Tape no. 127 Page 1 - MRW The House met at 3:00 P.M. MR. SPEAKER in the Chair (~r. L. Barry, Deputy Speaker) HON. J. C. CROSBIE (Minister of Finance): Mr. Speaker, before we commence, I would like to announce that Mr. William J. Banfield who is Vice-Chairman of the Newfoundland Liquor Commission is retiring at the end of April at his own request because of ill-health. Mr. Banfield has suffered several heart­ attacks during the past few days and has asked the government whether he could take early retirement which has been agreed to. Mr.

Banfield comes from a prominent family whose name is widely known in Fortune Bay. He has had a long service in the public service of the province. He was ten years with the Newfnundland Constabulary. He resigned in 1943 because of ill-health. In 1947 or 1948 he was elected to the National Convention which debated the political future of Newfoundland. He was,of course, a staunch Confederate and seconded on the floor of the National Convention the suggestion that Confederation with Canada should be put on the referendum to be voted on. On January 1, 1950 he was appointed a member of the Board of Liquor Control.

In 1967 he became chairman of the board. The following year he became deputy-chairman of the new Newfoundland Liquor Commission at his own request,so that his long and devoted service is terminating at the end of April at his own request. He will be going on early retirement. I am sure the House will wish him enjoyment and pleasure in his retirement from the service of the province. MR. E. M. ROBERTS: Mr. Speaker, if I may say a word or two, tbe news of Mr.

Banfield's retirement I guess comes as no surprise to us because those of us who were in the former administration are aware, as the minister just told us, that Mr. Banfield has not been well for the past little while. His retirement from the public service is not only the end of a career that has been notable and has been most meritorious, it will be a very proud thing for Mr. Banfield to recall that he seconded that famous motion to which 341

April 28, 1972 Tape no. 127 Page 2 Mr. Roberts the minister referred and he was one of that initially very small band in the National Assembly who stood for the Confederate cause and their victor y , of course, has changed the faith of Newfoundland. My colleagues and I wish Mr. Banfield well. I think he is known to every member in the House personally. Ke is a very fair-minded and decent man. We wish him improving health and many years of it. I think with his retirement there are very few of the members in the National Convention left in any active role in this province.

It is quite amazing really how quickly (It is Pnly twenty-five years since the convention met) the men who were in that convention have dropped from public life. Many of them are still alive and many of them are still active in one form or another. I do not think any are active in public life unless one wished to say Mr. Michael Harrington, Editor of the "Telegram" who sat I believe for St. John's West in the convention; Mr. Burt Butt who was also a member of the convention I suppose is in public life on his weekly television show.

But it is amazing in twenty-five years how the leadership of Newfoundland has completely changed in the sense that the men who were elected to the convention, almost without exception, dropped out of public life. Mr. Banfield's retirement is a bit of a minor landmark in our history. I look forward as well with great interest to the announcement of his replacement and my colleagues and I are extremely anticipating that. We do wish Mr. Banfield a return to good health and as I have said many years of it. 342

April 28, 1972. :[ape 128. Page 1. llffi.SEEAKER: I would like to welcome on behalf of the honourable members Mayor Clifford Goodyear and Councillor O'Keefe from Stephenville Crnssiny, and the Grade V class from Rrinton Memorial School with their teacher Miss Simms, on behalf of the members of this honourable House I welcome you here today and hope that your visit will be an informative one. Presenting Petitions: MR.J.MORGAN: Mr.

Speaker, I beg leave to present a petition from the residents of the following communities, Plate Cove East, Plate Cove West, Summerville, Openall, Redcliffe, Tickle Cove, Duntarra, Keels, King's Cove, Knights Cove, Stock Cove. The prayer of this petition,Mr. Speaker, is to have the roads serving these communities, kno'm as Route 10, upgraded and paved.

This road is a vital link to the outside world for these communities, the fact that each and every day hundreds of school children are transported daily over these roads with much discomfort and also the fact that development of these communities and the att -raction of industry in this area is stifled by this road in this condition. I move that this petition be tabled in this House and passed to the department to which it relates. ~ffi.A.MURPHY: ~fr. Speaker, I would like to support the prayer of the petition.

As one who has travelled that road fairly frequently during the last year I can sympathize greatly with the residents of that area and perhaps the gentleman in the House, the Rev. Fr. Beresford from Kings Cove is Present with us, I am sure that he is one that can vouch very sincerely and truthfully I would say - being a clerg;·man - for the tragic conditions that prevail on that road. I am very happy,Sir, to add my support to the prayer of the petition. HR.P.THOMS: Mr.

Speaker, may I also say a word on the petition and say that I wholeheartedly support this petition as over the past fifteen years I have been travelling back and forth over this road on a number of occasions. I realize the conditions of this road, how narrow it is, hmv twisted it is and the poor condj tion that this road is found in 343

April 28, 1971. Tape 128 Page 2. especially durin~ the winter months and more especially during the sprjng months. I lvholeheartedly support this petition and I pray and trust that this government will heed the oraver of this petition, that we lvill see in the future or in the not too distant future that this road shall be upgraded and paved. On motion, petition received and adopted. MR.THOMS: Mr. Speaker, I beg leave to present a petition 344

April 28, 1972, Tape 129, Page 1 - - apb ~;.:_ THO]f_S_; On behalf of the residents of Pound Cove, Bonavista Bay. Mr. Speaker, the prayer of this petition is that an ice- makinp; machine be provided in conjunction ~.:rith the community stage at the Community of Pound Cove. This ice-making machine would provide ice to keep fish in a fair condition until it can be shipped to marl<.et. If such a machine were provided this would also bring about the establishment of a filleting line.

I understand and I have been in contact with Bay Bulls Sea Products who at the present time or at least last year and the year before collected fish from the fishermen of not only Pound Cove but also Templeman and Newto~~. There are some sixty fishermen involved here. If this ice-making machine becomes a reality, then a filletinp. line tvill he installed by Bay Bulls Sea Products. This will create at least twenty jobs in the Pound Cove area. Mr.

Speaker, I support this petition wholeheartedly and I am sure that the Minister of Fisheries will do all in his pm.:rer to brinp. this ice.making machine or at l·east to make this ice-making machine a reality to the fishermen of Pound Cove. ~·r. Speaker, I ask that this petition be placed on the table of the House and referred to the department to which it relates. ~'JL NEARY: ---- Hr. Speaker, I supuort the petition presented so ably by ~y colleague the member for Bonavista North.

I think I heard the hon. the Premier in two campaigns recently going around the province telling the people of Newfoundland that it was the little things in life that counted. There must be hundreds of settlements, }'r. Speaker, in this province where all they need to make them prosperous, to improve the economy of the community is a little thing like an ice-making machine. I hope that the Minister of Fisheries can see his way clear to see that the wonderful people of Pound Cove in Bonavista Bay will get their ice-making machine. On motion petition received. 345

April 28, 1972, Tape 129, Pafe 2 -- apb "'R _:_~~-EJ.!: . t'r. Speal-er, I beg leave to present a petition on behalf of the people of Little Heart's Ease, Caplin Cove, Butter rove, Southport and r,ooseherry Cove. This petition, althoup,h it r equests reconstruction of roads,does not ask for pavin~. I am sure this is he~rt-warming • . Little P.eart's East is a sort of nucleus or the centre of ~ese communities that T have named. Children are bussed in from both extreme ends to the hir,h school there. The roads are so bad, I am not talkin$t necessarily about t he roup,hness of it, but the narro"· and twistinr roads are so bad that 1 doubt if very many of the hon. 346

April 28, 1972 Tape 130 JM- 1 MR. BRETT: ------ members of this House would have the intestinal fortitude to ride on a school bus back and forth. So therefore I very strongly support this petition. The prayer actually reads that the road from '>outh Port to Hodges Cove be reconstructed this year. I feel that their prayer is not something that cannot be done this year and I trust that our government will see fit to take heed to their prayer. I ~ove, Mr. Speaker, that the petition be tabled and referred to the department to which it relates. MR. NEARY: Mr.

Speaker, far be it from members on this side of the Honse to let the opportunity pass by to support the petition on behalf of the residents of Little Hearts Ease and surrounding communities to have their road upgraded. I could detect a sort of a relaxation on the face of the honourable Minister of Finance when the member said that it was not the intention of the people over there tn ask to have this road paved at the present time but I am sure, Mr.

Speaker, that if the government sees fit to upgrade that road and brin~ it up to standards that next year the honourable member will be bringinp; a petition in to the honourable House to have the road paved. MR. ROBERTS: And so he should. - - ------ ~ -- MR. NEARY: So he should and I hope that the government will see their way clear to grant the request so ably put forward by the member for Trinity North in the petition on behalf of the people in Little Hearts Ease and surrounding communities. On motion petition received. ~~_Q!-~~~TT-~~W.C~: Mr.

Speaker , this is the first time I rise but I would like to take leave of this honourable House to present a petition on behalf and si~ned by the residents of Salt Harbour, 347

April 28, 1972 Tape 130 JM- 2 MR.. __ G_I_LLE._!T: Herritts Harbour and Herring Neck. Now the prayer of the petition is also directed to the ~inister of Ri~hwavs and I only wish it werea praye r for his recovery but! am afraid it would probably have the adverse affect on him he has harl so many presented. It is to have the road from the Tt-rill inrate turn-off to Rerrinp Neck upgraded and the steep hills reduced as much as possible, gua r d rails placed on the road where it ROes around the hills and ~uard rails put there and all the road made safer really.

I sens e that the ~reatest concern that the petiti oners have is for their children. I think we will all a9,ree that school buses. not bein~ constructed for our roads. are a dan~erous means of trdnsportation. I aji\ree with the honourable member when he says that the members of this House would perhaps think twice before they would ride on them. Children, of course, do not see the dan~er t.ut twice in the past winte r they have come very close to bavin~ a catastrophe with the school buses and I think therein lies their deepest concern fo r their children. However, Mr. Speaker.

I support this petition very stronRly and I have pleasure in movinp. that the petition be tabled in this honourable House and directed to the department to which it refers. 348

April 28. 1972 Tape 131 PK - 1 MR • T. fA. DOYLE : I tvould like to rise and support the petition so ably presented in his maiden speech by the honourable the member for Twillingate. I have travelled that road manys a time and I know that the prayer of the petition is as the honourable the member has said. Therefore it gives me great pleasure to support the petition presented by the member for Twillingate. On motion petition received. NOTICE OF MOTION HON. l-7. H. MARSHALL: (MINISTER WITHOUT PORTFOLIO) : Mr.

Speaker, T give notice that I will on tomorrow move that a select committee consisting of eight members comprising five members on the government side of the House and three members of the opposition be appointed to consider the rules and procedures and standing orders of this honourable House with a view to recommending such changes as may be necessary in order to make this House operate in a more efficient and effective manner and in particular hut not so as to restrict the generality to recommend the composition and nature of standing committees of this honourable House and the mode of operation of same. 'Thich said recommendation pertaining to standing committees shall he brought in as soon as possible and shall be deemed to be a first and paramount duty of the said committee.

And I do move that this committee have the right to sit during and throughout the session whether the House is in or out of sitting. r also move, Mr. Speaker, as is necessary 1 that Standing nrder 84 be suspended with respect to this committee. Standing Order 84 requires there to be no more than five members on a committee. I also give notice, Mr. Speaker, that I will on tomorrow move that a select committee upon salaries and pensions be appointed consisting of three members of this honourable House, two of which will come from the government side and one from the opposition to 349

April 28, 1972 Tape 131 PK - 2 ~ . HAR$HALL: consider all matters relative to renumeration of memhers includin~ but not so as to restrict the ~enerality. All matte rs pertaininr to travel allowances, rate and manner of payment of sessional allowances. eligibility and manner of payment of pensions and that the said committee have the right to sit duri n?. and throu~hout the session whether t he House is in or out of sitting . 1 do further, ~'r .

Speaker ~ive notice that T will on tomorrow move that a select committee upon Public Accounts he appointed to consider the Public Accounts and report of the Auditor General for the fiscal period ending ?-larch 31, 1971 and all matters ' pertaininf( thereto with power to call for persons . papers and records to examine witnesses under oath And to report from time to time > their observations and opiniom: thereon. And that the said committee have the ri~ht to sit during and thro u ~~;hout t he session ;.•hether the House is in or out of sittin~. I mi~h t indicate, Hr.

Speaker. that this committee will consist of five people,thre~ on the ~overnment side and o ·o on the opposi tion side. This committee of course is ,hy way of explanation, a select committe e and the rules committee 1rlll in their deliberation come up 1rlth a standin~ committee on Public AccountR which wj 11 he en~trafted in our standing orders so that we will have one as a matter of course. 350

April 28, 1972 Tape No. 132 NC - 1 NOTICE OF QUE_S.!_IQNS _AND ANSWER~ TO QUESTIONS RON. F. D. MOORES: Mr. Speaker, number four on the Order Paper directed by the hon. member for Fogo to the Minister of public Works, the reply is that office space has been rented at Deer Lake, the welfare office, 1200 square feet, a three year rental at $4,200 a year. It is rented from Mr. Arthur Ball, 86 Popular Road, Corner Brook. Office for the Rural Development Officer, Marystown, Mr. Max Mayo, Marystown, 187 square feet - $800 per year, two years duration.

Department of Social Services and Rehabilitation, Burin, it was rented from the Federal Department of Public Works - 300 square feet, on a yearly basis to be renewed - $1,425. I table this,Mr. Speaker, for the House. Question number five which the hon. Leader of the Opposition asked. Do you want me to read this or shall I table it? MR. ROBERTS: If the hon. Premier wishes to read it fine, if not, seeing he has been good enough to give me the information,he can just table it. MR. MOORES: There was some controversy as to which people would be involved, Mr. Speaker,and this has been cleared up with the bon.

Leader of the Opposition, so I would just file this for reference purposes. RON. J~. CAR!ER: Mr. Speaker, I beg leave to answer the question on the Institute for the Blind, asked me by the bon. member for St. Barbe North, yesterday. Today I made the following release: Dr. David C. Kendall, Chairman, Department of Special Education, University of British Columbia, Vancouver, will head a joint committee to study the needs of children requiring special education in the Atlantic Provinces. The announcement of Dr.

Kendall's appointment was made today by the four Ministers of Education, in the four Atlantic Provinces,following an initial meeting with Dr. Kendall in Halifax. Dr. Kendall attended a meeting with the deputy ministers of education of the Atlantic Provinces in Halifax on Monday, April 10, to establish terms of reference for the study, The task of the committee will be (1) to enquire into the present 351

April 28, 1972 Tape No. 132 NC - 2 ~!R. CARTER: facilities and progTammes available in the Atlantic Provinces for children requiring special educational consideration with particular emphasis on those with impairmen t of sight and/or hearing .

(2) To recommend programmes of study and training for such children . {3) To recommend procedur es for assessment of these children.

(4) To recommend to the Governments of the Atlantic Provinces futuTe direction in this fiel d, bearing in mind the educational systems of the four provinces. }!embers of the committee appQinted by the ministers of education are: Dr. J . A.Lauwerys> Director of Atlantic Institute of Education, Halifax ; Mr. D. J. Jenkins , Superintendent , Inter - Provincial S~hool for the Deaf, Amherst; Mr. C. R. K. Allen, Superintendent School for the Blind, 352

April 28, 1972 Tape no. 133 Page 1 - MRW Mr. Carter. Halifax; H. M. Cox, Nova Scotia Department of Education, Consultant in Special Education, Halifax; Mr. Elizabeth Owens, New Brunswick, Department of Education, Consultant in Special Education, Fredericton; Mr. Eleanor McDonald, Prince Edward Island, Department of Education, Special Education Consultant Charlottetown and Clifford Andrews, Newfoundland, Department of Education, Director of Special Services, St. John's. Any inquiries which interested citizens or organizations wish to make to this committee should be directed as soon as possible to Mr. H.

M, Cox, Secretary, Special Education Study Committee, Nova Scotia, Department of Education, P.O Box 578, Halifax, Nova Scotia. MR. F. B. ROWE: Mr. Speaker, a supplementary question, I did not get whether or not the han. the minister said who appointed the members of that committee. Am I to understand that only one member was on that committee from Newfoundland? MR. CARTER: This committee was appointed by the education ministers of the four Atlantic Provinces in consultation with their deputy ministers and it was felt that there was sufficient representation from St.

John's, from Newfoundland but more officials from our department may attend,on an ex-officio basis,if it is so required. HON. T. P. HICKEY (Minister of Social Services and Rehabilitation): Mr. Speaker, before going to orders of the day, I have some information which I would like to give to the House. It is in connection with the April cheques which have gone out today and it is with regard to the increases. The increases which were announced,Mr.

Speaker,were included in all cases with regard · to food and in connection with the clothing increase, it was included in all cases except about 2,000 wherein there was other income such as old age security and so on. I have copies for all hon. members and I would ask them to give us some co-operation in explaining to any of their constituents who may inquire as to what happened. The five dollar increase for clothing will be included in the May cheques as well as the normal increase, the other five dollars. The adjustment as well as the normal increase will be included in the May cheques. 353

April 28, 1972 Tape no . 133 Page 2 MR . ~;ARY : Mr. Speake r , l would like to direct a question to the hon. Hinister of Provinci al Affairs. Wv::ld t he hon. minister inform the House if Newfoundland and Labrador will go on dayliS~ht-saviog time this weekend? If so, does the mini3ter contemplate leav~ng the extra hour on in the fall, in line with a pri va te member's bill that he brought into this House a couple of years ago? RON. A. J. MURPHY (Minister of Provincial Affairs) : frankly, I have been 354 ~lr. Speaker, quite

April 28, 1972 Tape 134 JM- 1 }1R. MURPHY : -·-- -- . thinking the matter over and I would like the co-operation of members if they could - I have received a lot of reouests for this and there are some against it but I would like to ask members of the House now if they have any opinions on the thing. I know by the way the member is smiling that this is not going to upset any part of the western world or anything like this.

But it is just I am followinJ!: on a suggestion made by the Minister of Education with regard to giving us another half hour, put us on the Atlantic time for the school bus ann so on and so forth. But I am just wondering on this, I am quite serious on it. I think it would be a tremendous thing to give us the extra hour during October and November rarticularily because it would . lengthen our work period in the fall of the year when contractors have to clue up about four o'clock in the afternoons and a great majority of school children going outside of St.

John's are being put off in the dark and still have to walk a fair distance to their homes. So it would be worth considering and I would certainly appreciate any comments on it and I would like to throw this out to the press to as they phone me every now and then. AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible). MR. ~_P.!!_Y__:_ He could set up the honourable member for Bell Island as a committee of one to go to Europe and study the conditions over there. ~m . MOORES (P.REMIER): Mr.

Speaker, I would suggest to the honourable Minister of Provincial Affairs that we do go on daylight saving time this weekend as the rest of Canada and to advise previously the honourable member for Bell Island that we are 1 so that even he can see the light at that time. MR. ROBERTS: Mr. Speaker, I would like to advise him that his 355

April 28, 1972 Tape 134 JM- 2 MR. ROBERTS: ··-·---- collea~ue has been puttin~ notices in the paper all week - So I just want both sides of the cabinet to know that we have seen the li~ht you know and the Premier might be reminded, the silent Premier might be reminded of the old Jliblical injunction, "Hide not his light under a bushel." MR. NEARY: Mr. Speaker, we all had thought for a while that the honourable Premier had taken the oath of silence in this House. ~r.

Speaker, could I direct a question to the Minister of Social Services and Rehabilitation? \ I wonder if the minister has not included the increase in rates in the information that he just presented to the House? ~~ould the minister inform the 1 'House if the increases that he referred to are straight across the board increases for people on long and short-term assistance? ~· HIC~: Mr. Speaker, the increases as announced are for long- term and short-term.

I believe the honourable member lY'as made aware of this and the statement l made only referred to some 2,000 cases and my officials just could not get to it because they wanted to get the cheques out early because the end of the month is coming on a weekend. Hell, I !!uess we tried to help our people on the one hand by getting the cheques out early so there are a few who have to suffer a little and wait until next month. MR. NEARY: A supplementary question.

What I was really getting at, I wanted to ask the minister if this was a straight across the board increase for all the members of the family or is it just an increase for certain members of the family? You know, Mr. Speaker, is it an increase for the head of the household or is it an increase for all the members of the family? MR. HICKEY: Mr. Speaker, we are starting the nit-picking again. I would suggest the honourable member read my statement and the information 356

April 28, 1972 Tape 134 · JM- 3 l:fR. HlC~Y_ :_ is contained therein. ~HO~ .. ~~R: (Inaudible) . MR. HICKEY: I will be lon~-winded the next time and I will read the - -----··~ - state ment in de tail. I do not like holdin ~ up the procedure s of t he House. ~- · __ NE~Jq..;_ .Just a simple yes or no answer . 1-!R.:-~.~.AJ<!RJ.BARRY) : Order ! Order! ~])!U!.SS 1~ REPLY: MR. lfiNSClR: Mr. Speaker, before 1ve induljle I would ask the permission of the Rouse to make one remark. 357

April 28, 1972. Tape 135 Page 1. MR .\HN :, •R: It ., s an error which I find in the verbatim report of Hednesdav April 26. It is found on 207, ( this is for the attention of the Clerk) There is a question there which I asked the honourable Premier in his capacity as minister of Fisheries. It says ~!r. Hinsor so and so, Hr. Moores so and so, further down it says l>lr. Evans, this is a supplementary Mr. Speaker. On two occasions I think there is an error. Mr. Evans should have been Mr. Winsor. If ~1e are goinp. to have a verbatim report Mr.

Sneaker, I think ~ve might as ~>ell have ,, correct one instead of errors like appearing in yesterday's. So I., wmtld ask the clerk to see to it that it is corrected. MR. PECKFORD: Mr. Speaker, at the outset I would like~to apologize in advance for any lack of facilitv or articulation today. Yesterday I had a lengthy and unpleasant encounter with the dentist, Hm.·ever I will attempt to get my teeth into the address, hopefully be able to make a sufficient bite. Mr.

Speaker, it seems to me, although I am not in politics very long, that the main purpose of the Speech from the Throne is to articulate or ennunciate the philosophy of the present government in general terms. Hence I was a little dismayed hy the remarks from the other side of the Rouse concerning the Speech from the Throne, because I think it was an excellent one, Not only did it give in general terms what the government's philosophy is but it did get down to some specifics. I suppose,~!r.

Speaker, because for twenty years or so we have had a government that did not rely on policv and planning, approach and emphasis, they are unable to under­ stand ~vhen somebody else does articulate a plan or policy 'or indicate an empl•asis that it ~<rants to put before the people. For example, Mr. Speaker, the idea of the regional advisory council seems to me to be an excellent one.for the various economic areas. The realization of the New­ foundland Development Corporation which will heln to entice small industries and perhaps expand some existing ones. An e;nphasis on tourism for years we have heard,Mr.

Speaker. People around this island, you can go to any part of the island, you can go to almost any part of the island you will 358

April 28, 1972. Tape 135 page 2. hear people talking about the beautiful scenery they have. Almost every district in the island is always praising up its scenery or what it has and some other district does not have. But we never have had a real statement of policv hy a government to indicate that they are really concerned about this area. Perhaps through being concerned, statin~ a policy,we will ~et jobs and increase the number of tourists that come to our island.

I have often wondered, I remember years ago when I lived in Marystown, Placentia West, when I think there was some sort of a plan for farmin~, I think it was,the community involved was Winterland. I think there were others, Brown's Arm and others, where the government had attempted to get into some areas of farming. But there never was, Mr. Speaker, a real definite policy that was followed. It always seems to me to be some rather ad hoc arrangement, often political expediency I am afraid.

Also in the Speech from the Throne we have the excellent idea about the decentralization of the various government departments. One of the cries by many people today is that they fail to get involved into the decision.makin~ process. I suppose that is one reason why '~e have the phone-in shows and why they are so popular,because there are so many of our people who feel like they are left out of the main stream of things. I am sure that many fi~hermen and farmers will greet this policy as a breakthrough, For years we always talked about the fishery.Mr. Speaker, in Newfoundland and what a vital

part it was going to play in the economy of · our province. Yet I think that one of the departments of this government that has been the smallest has been that department of fisheries as well as the depart­ ment of economic development. Surely these two departments are one of the t'<i0 most vital departments in gover ·ment yet they are tHo of the smallest, So it is really great to see in the Speech from the Throne that the present government intends to enlarge these two departments so that we can better serve the fishermen and the people who are going into various industries. 359

April 28, 1972 . Tape 135. l;lage 3. So to say that the Speech from the Throne,Mr. Speaker does not contain very much, it is just~ rehash of generalizations, I think is an unfair observation to make on it .Yesterday , Mr. Speaker, when I concluded I ~~as talking about·education. I had not really completed all I wanted to say about that. I had mentioned the collective bargaining legislation that I ho)')e the government would bring: in this y .. ar, in this session.

I think the Statist:cs Canada re1 (•ased some figures the other day, one of which was rather startling to me, that forty-eight per cent of the population in this province is nineteen or under. llence I do not thin~ it is any wonder why I should or any other honourable member of the House spend some time dealing ~11th that asoect of government. 1> As a teacher for six years, one of the things that I have noticed t.rrong with the educational system is that ~1e have always talked about - a lovely word that we have used - curriculum development in our schools.

It seems to me that there has always been a definite lack of liaison br:·.tween the Department of Education and the schools in this regard. I can remember only a year or twr ago teaching a certain course in high school, started off in September, I think i.t was November I got a notice from the Department of Education tellin~t me that ~·hat I was supposed to teach in t"his given course • it happened to be a course that ~vas recommended hy the department and one of which we used.

I found out in November the ·.·arious areas that I was supposed to teach, Of course by November I had taught those vory areas that I 1-1as supposed to leave out. It is a definite lack of liaison between the Department of Education and the various schools, in regard to curriculum development. I do not think,Mr. 'speaker, mU<-h has been done in this regard. I would like to see an enlargement of the department in this area and a greater ltaison between th.e department and the schools. Also Mr.

Speaker, one reason I suppose why young people will often say that much of the things that go on in a classroom are irrelevant to today's society, I think very often this is a valid observation. I thin~ 3GO

April 28, 1972, Tape 136, Pa~e 1 -- ·apb !111.. P_ECKF_ORD : Particularly of courses that I would suggest should be a part of the school curriculum. He have today in our presence young people from a school in our province and we do just about every day. lVhy is there not, Mr. Speaker, I wonder, some sort of course brought into the schools relating to public affairs, to world affairs, to national affairs?

It is startling to realize if some of us took a little tour of some of the classrooms of this city and asked them a few,~ery basic questions about politics, municipal affairs or civics, that you would find a great ignorance in that regard. I thin~ here again perh~ps the Department of Education could provide some leadership in making this possible, some sort of a course like world affairs, politics, or civics, call it what you will. Years ago I think there used to be a course in civics or something in r.rade VII or VIII but I do not think that is a part of the curriculum any more.

Surely young people have a legitimate complaint when they say that many of the things that they do in school are irrelevant. They come out of school and listen to the radio and the television and of course it is glutted with things to do with the government, The i:nunicipal 8overnment, Provincial government and the federal ~overnment yet this is not taken seriously by our educators. Mr. Speaker, it is really heartening to see as well in the Speech from the Throne some mention of timber rights and of some programme for mineral exploration.

I think it was last September there was an announcement made by the former Minister of Mines, Agriculture and Resources regarding a geochemical lab. that was to be built. I think it was to cost one or two million dollars and I was really happy to hear that announcement at that time. Comin~ from Green Bay where all these mines were, being in the real ore belt of our province, ·perhaps right in the centre of the only ore belt here, I felt sure that this geochemical lab would perhaps be situated in my district.

I have only heard scanty reports about it, I am not too up-to-date on it, but I understand that it might he 361

April 28. 1972 , Tape 136, Pa~e 2 -- apb situated here in St. John's . ~!r.

Speaker, if it is true and everyhody knot~s it is true that the area from Baie Verte t hrou~h, coming in a southeasterly direction through Sprin~dale ~cross Green Bay, Tilt Cove, Little Bay, Whalesback on to r.ull ~ond,do~m to Buchans and on down to T\rl.n Lakes, Frozen l.ake area .,,here there has just been a recent discovery, if this r eally is the ore body in this province, the one that has been discovered and there is none other like it surely it would be 'l-10rth somebody' s while. whoever is responsible, to ensure that that geochemical lah is placed in that area.

Ri~ht no101 there is a ~~:eochC!:!cial lab in operation just outside Sprinpdale servjn r. the lfualesback mine and I think servin~ also the P.ambler Copper Mine near naie Verte and the'>Asbestos Advocate ~ine in Raie "erte and some others. I think the mine is due to close dot..TD in June but I think the lab is goinli\ to be kept open for a f e'l-1 months. I do not see why (I think there are a couple of million dollars involved) this geochemical lab should be located here in St . John's .

There mip,ht be some r eason that I am n.ot clear on but talkin g to ~eologists in my district and so on, they were a~tremely concerned about this because quite a few geolo~ists, people involved in the assayinp and one thin g and another to.ith minerals are p.oin~ to lose their jobs up my way. If this geochemical lab 362

April 28, 1972 Tape 137 PK - 1 }ffi. PECKFORD: in Hamilton came alon~ of course it ~eally would help the economy of the area. I come no~7, Mr. Speaker, to perhaps a rather unpopular fe~J opinions. Since 1949 up until around this year the majority of people who ran for political office in this province, of course there are still quite a few in this category, were businessmen, lawyers, (~e had quite a spat yesterday from the lawyers in this honourable House, Mr. Speaker) t>eople tJho had some financial stability and did not have to depend ~rholly and soley upon the pay that they would receive as a member.

But, Mr. ,Speaker, thinp,s have changed. You will find in this honourable House today many gentlemen in various walks of life who have given up rather lucrative, financially lucrative jobs to enter public life. So that we have quite a few whose only income is that which they get as members of ' the House. I was very happy to learn that a committee has been set up to look into this whole matter of salaries, pensions and so on.

I, for one, am convinced just on pure simple mathematics, pure simple arithmetic that I had learned in Grade III,that it is totally impossible for me, as the member for Green Bay, to find my head above Hater in three or four years time financially. 'If I am to do the proper job for Green Bay that needs to be done at this time, !t is totally impossible. So I am glad to see that this committee is set up and I hope that it ~rill not be too long before they shall bring in a rep.ort saying that an increase ~s going to be in the offering very soon. Mr.

Speaker, in the last two or three years we have had substantial increases in the unemployment insurance benefits in our province and also increases,as just announced by the Minister of Social Services and Rehabilitation, in welfare payment. It has come to my attention in the last two or three weeks,when I had three or four jobs for a number of my constituents, I think I had twenty-five 363

April 28, 1972 Tape 137 PK- 2 MR . PECKFORD: people ~vho ~1ere looking for jobs. I had four. So I called up some of the gentlemen concerned,found that the jobs that I had for them paid about $1.85 an hour. They were unwilling to give up their unemployment insurance, sometimes their welfare, for this meagre $1.85 an hour. So I was rather pleased to see an increase in the minimum wage earlier, in the previous session of the House, Hr. Speaker. But surely this is going to be a real problem in our province in the next few months and years. So I do not know what t he answer to it is, Mr.

Speaker, but I suppose another increase in the minimum wage, which I suppose is one way to look at it. There are quite a few people in this province who will not take the jobs at present because they are receiving $70, $80, ~"!0 r e rhaps even $100 a week unemployment ~ insurance and therefore refused to take jobs when they are available. It is a rather unfortunate situation. There are just one or two more points, Mr. Speaker, on education and then I will sit down. In the past ten year 's or so we have had quite a few vocational schools go up around our province.

It was always an amazement to me to find that they never co-ordinated their programme along with the high schools in the various communities. I think this past year there has been an experimental programme tried out in Seal Cove, where the high school there, if I am correct, and the vocational school got together and integrated their programmes. You know it is a funny thing most of the curriculum in the schools to- day is academ~calJy orientated. It caters to around an~vhere from five to fifteen percent of the students in the schools.

This l.ras going on for a long \vhile, everybody got quite excited that: all of our curriculum was too academic orientated. So we find in Nemorial University and other universities that all of a sudden a shift was made from an academic-oriented curriculum to one of the abnormal child, a child who was disadvantaged, the child perhaps who had physical defects, a mentally retarded child in this sense. 364 (

April 28, 1972 Tape 137 PK - 3 MR. PECKFORD: So vre have had a shift from the academic to the abnormal. It seems to me, Mr. Speaker, very few people have taken very much notice of the normal a.bout sixty percent of our high school population, of our school population. I would like to see, Mr. Speaker, a far greater use made of our vocational schools.

I think in ~pringdale now the new one that is to open in September, I think they are going to try and integrate hoth programmes so that you have a student in Grade IX tvho knovrs what he wants to do who can perhaps have his trade when he finishes Grade XI instead of going through the old lock-step system getting his Grade XI and then having to go to vocational school. It will solve a lot of problems once we determine what kind of trades we are 'in needof.

It is no good, as has been done in the past, to open up vocational schools and provide all sorts of trades if you do not know that there is a market for the trades. You know we have people now who have gone to vocational schools and came out and still cannot get a joh. There i.!l too much of this or there is too much of that, mechanics or whatever. So we have to plan to make sure what occupations were offered so that people could find jobs afterwards. And of course many of the schools in the island are not going to be near vocational schools.

So this puts a greater responsibility upon educators, superintendents and supervisors and people in the Department of Education to try to provide some sort of a programme that accommodates the normal child, the child who is not going to.go to university, the child who is going to have a vocation or occupation. This is not true today, with very little crafts done in our schools, very little in the way of any vocations done in our schools. I think this is something that has to be looked into if we are going to accommodate, if we are going to try to help the majority or all of the students in our schools.

I think, Mr. Speaker, perhaps the most significant thing about 365

April 28, 1972 Tape 137 PK- 4 ~. PECKFORD: the gracious Speech is not necessarily the particular content, although that was important, but its overall approach or tone - a common sense approach where l-Ye attempt to make ourselves a more productive and stable economy. Although it will he necessary from time to time to attract wealthy entrepreneurs to our shores we should realize that there are many aspects of our economy then that we ourselves can. develop.

Surely it is not necessary ~~hen and for an industrialist to develop aspects of our province that they receive almost all of the rewards and the province is left lvith a few extra jobs. The gracious Speech charts a new direction for our province for the seventies, an approach that involves helping ours~tves. The recent election confirms that most of our people are r~ceptive to such an idea. There hopes and aspirations have reached a new peak and hence we must work digently to satisfy some of these aspirations.

HOlvever, I think that the people of this province while receptive and eager to see common sense planning and being involved in the decisions of this province that they hope for something more, something that is difficult to ma1ntain in the higher echelons of government, a quality that is all too often lacking,and that is honesty.

One of the few common remarks that you will hear any time if you talk about various professions, you talk about the lawyers, the doctors, the teachers and so on, you almost automatically get a pretty good response, their attitude towards that profession, their attitude towards that occupation. But I found on my brief travels around this province, more especially lvhile I ~yas a teacher. that once you mentioned politics the response that you get is anything but wholesome.

Hopefully the way this session has started, Mr. ~peaker, the sort of atmosphere of co-operation from the other side, ~1ell co-operation works two ways as l~ell• and the little verbal gymnastics that we had a couple of days ago,which were later withdrawn and admirab}y so, 366

April 2R, 1972 Tape 1'37 PK- 5 l':R. PJ::CKFORD: tvill auger well for the future of this House and perhaps t his is one 'l<.'aY we as politicans in this honourab le House can help change t ha t imajZe of poli ticans is by conductin!i: ourselves in t his House in a respectable, hone s t •~ay and say it the way it is, tell i t as i t is. This is one of the thin~s that always dis trubed me with students in school esnecially you find i t just tremendous, young peoplP have a very unsavory, unhealthy 367

April 28, 1972 Tap-e No. 138 NC - 1 MR. P~CKFORD: attitude towards politicians in general, hopefully we as politicians in this hon. House in this session can help change that attitude and make this place a place where work is done and where we work for the benefit of all the people in this province and try to bring extra jobs and create a future for everybody concerned. Thank you. HR. M. I~OODI·IARD: Mr. Speaker, may I first join with the other members in this bon. House in congratualting the bon. member for Lewisporte.who is absent today,as being the elected Speaker of this bon.

House and may I also,Sir, be the first to congratulate you on being elected ' Deputy Speaker of this House and Chairman of Committees and I wish you well in your duties, Sir. Mr. Speaker, as a newcomer to this House I was delighted on opening day to hear two newly elected members perform the duty of moving and seconding the Address in Reply in such a fine manner. I was very interested in the remarks of my counterpart from Labrador West. I detect that feeling of warmth and understanding for the people of that district. Mr.

Speaker, I would like at this time to thank the good people of Labrador North for giving me the opportunity to speak on their behalf in this bon. House. My district, Mr. Speaker, of Labrador North, is unlike any other district in this Province of Newfoundland (and Labrador). It has many different features. It is in a way far removed from manv aspects of what is happening on the island portion of the province. It has great historic values, Mr. Speaker. Its races have endured hardships and a constant fight for survival for two hundred years. It may seem strange to the han. members of this House, Mr.

Speaker, we have people in our province with whom we can communicate only through the means of an interpreter. There are very few people other than a few mi•sionaries who have .come to the Llb~ador coas~ going back say two hundred years agq, that ~eArned the If!dian language 1\nd tlie Eskl!IIO language. Myself, Sir, I feel very let down when I go into some of the communities and I see at public meetings three to four hundred people and 368

April 28, 1972 Tape No.· 138 NC - 2 MR. WOODWARD: I talk through the means of an inter-pretor and ninety per cent of those people cannot understand me in common tongue, in the tongue that we use, the English language that is used s.o rldely in North America today. This, Sir, in itself have created ~~~&ny great probleiiiS for the people of the Labrador Coast and it has, in a way I suppose, restrained or restricted the development of the cOIIIIIl1Jnity to some great extent, But I feel, Mr.

Speaker, that the Liberal .Administ-ration have taken great strides, slow in coming but in the l~st seven years,~o try and help to upgrade the standaris of living for the people in our coastal communities of Labrador. 369

April 28, 1972 Tape no, 139 Page 1 - MRW Mr, Woodward, Mr. Speaker, I think it is the wish I suppose of the people of the Province of Newfoundland(and Labrador) to see that we have one standard of living in this province , I am sure it is not the wishes of our government to have class distinctions throughout this great land of ours. They do exist, Sir, they exist on the Labrador Coast.

I feel with the programme that we have already started - I am not about to criticiz~, Sir, I beg of this government that they will continue the programmes that we have started; that they will continue the housing programmes,Up until 1957 we had a great number of people livi~g in tents, Sir. They were living in tents in North West River and David's Inlet, Today, Sir, we do not have those people living in tents. They have moved into homes, maybe not houses of first-class but they have moved into homes and 1 feel comfortable when I go to visit them.

They do not have all the things that a lot of our friends here on the island have. They have the comforts of maybe two or three bedrooms, very little furniture. The oil problem that exists on the coast this year which you heard so much about and which this honourable House heard so much about Mr. Speaker - a number of our people on the Labrador Coast do not use oil but there are a number of them who do, I think if there is a need for it, then the oil should have been there. There was oil to some extent but there were some shortages in different areas. Mr.

Speaker, with the development of the housing programmes that we have started and the water and sewerage programmes in some communities and the community councils that have been set up quite recently, maybe in the last two or three years, we have seen progress, Sir. It is progress to some great degree. I feel pleased that this progess h~ taken place. Sir, my reason for being here today is to see that this programme is carried out. I beg of this government, Sir, to continue the programmes that we started. 370

April 28, 1972 Mr. Woodward. Tape no. 139 Page 2 Hr. Speaker, Labrador I suppose is very unique. A lot of people from this island have been in contact with Labrador going back 200 years. Labrador has been a place where people have come to visit but very few people have stayed. Labrador in the main, I suppose,as one would say1 has been an area where you extract something from but put very little in in return. Fishermen have been going to our Labrador Coast from Newfoundland. I do not have to tell this House that.

I am sure many of the members here, sitting in this House, are direct descendants of some Labrador fishermen. They know of certain areas, they know the names of certain harbours, coves like Occasional. Harbour, Draw Bucket Tickle and Hebron, if you want to call it that, but very few have stayed. In the main, the people on the Labrador Coast are living rlow on the north coast which I represent. The community of Nain, Mr. Speaker, has a population of 760 people, a very large community with 99.9 per cent pure-bred Eskimos.

We have a community of David's Inlet, the second largest Indian community, which is totally Indian, Sir. Three people in that community can speak fluent English. We go down to Hopedale, Sir, where we get involved with the settlers who first moved over from the old country and settled and then we have some Newfoundlanders ~ho settled which were very few, but in the main they are people who have moved in from the European Countries and I suppose if our Eskimos came from Asia, then we have to say it of them too.

But the Province of Newfoundland in itself and when you . look at it, they have not integrated with the peqie in coastal communities; therefore, we have a very strong feeling - I suppose a strong feeling of neglect. Mr. Speaker, I suppose it is bad to live in a.house when you have a feeling that you are not wanted and there has been a feeling created throughout the Labrador Coast that they are no longer wanted. We are something that the province will deal with possibly when they get around to looking after the 371

April 28, 1972 Mr, Woodward Tape no, 139 Page 3 important needs maybe of the arterial roads going into our big city. It is costing millions of dollars just putting universities or junior colleges in our greater centres when we have, Sir, on our Labrador Coast - I would like to refer to the hon. member from Green Bay who mentioned about the education aspects of the thing and spoke so ably on it. We have in the coastal communities in Labrador a seven-month school at Nain and we teach from beginners to Grade VII. It is a community with a population of 760 people.

Sir, I must comment on the words of the hon. member for Hermitage and Fortune who meantioned how demoralizing it is to have ~ildren taken away from their families when they are at the ages of twelve to thirteen years of age and to be put in boarding school9,. They are separated from their families. This is very difficult on the Island of Newfoundland. It is not as difficult as it is in Labrador, Sir. Those people can communicate because they can get home with their families on weekends.

We bring people in from the Community of Naine put them in a dormitory at North West River, a distance of some 380 miles, the economic needs of the family, Sir, cannot afford to send them back for even the vacational periods, the Christmas and Easter holidays. They are separated from their families for a period of nine months. If they finish high school at North West River, then it is to go on to St.

John's to go to Memorial University or they go to some of our technical training institutions , Sir, when you look at it, you raise a family to the age of twelve or thirteen years and then again they are separated from you for the rest of their day. There is ~ot an economic base in the community, so after they do get educated they cannot go back and take up their jobs or get jobs in the community and live with their families, This in a sense is sad. It is sad to me.

Last year, Sir,I.saw fit during Christmas to use the government aircraft to transport those people from the dormitory at North West River to their homesin Postville, David's Inlet, Makkovik and Nain. 372

April 28, 1972 Tape No. 140 NC - 1 }ffi. W~ODWARD: People were very pleased, Sir, the complimentary letters that I received, as they could be joined with their families for the vacation periods or the Christmas holidays. We sometimes tend to forget I suppose and maybe one of my functions as I said when I entered this hon. House, Sir, I know what economics is all about. I gotmy economics over the years. Economics is the thing that makes everything go.

If we want our petitions,then the government has got to find the money. lVhere does the money come from1 But again we have a human resource base, Sir, and I would like to see the people of this Province of Newfoundland (and Labrador) become more closely and possibly to communicate a little bit easier with our provincial citizens as we call them that inhabit our North Labrador Coast. It is very strange, very strange when you go into a community and see a number of people and we meet them on the streets and they smile at us. But then again they cannot communicate. This is a very strange thing.

Those people do have feelings. They do appreciate the things that are being done. I saw the need this year, Sir. I saw the need. Those people are literally forced into isolation from the close down of navigation when the C.N.R. vessels go up there for the last time in November. There is no other means of getting into those communities until such time as the season opens again starting around July 1.

I was very pleased, Sir, to be able to start a regular air service, with my colleagues here in Cabinet,and we budget some $90,000 to subsidize a regular air service, not only running north in Labrador, Sir, but running south as well, going from Goose Bay to the Quebec Border and then in turn running north to Nain, a twice weekly service. This service has been very much appre~iated, Sir, and very highly used. Thanks to the Liberal Government, thanks to the Liberal Government, Sir, The people of Labrador appreciate that, Sir.

This year for the first time they have been able to travel, coming to Goose Bay, not only to Goose Bay, travelling from one community to another. We can never hope, Sir, I suppose 373

April 28, 1972 Tape No. 140 NC - 2 MR. WOOp~ARD: with the rugged terraine, the great distances, I do not know how many people here are familiar with the rugged rocks of Labrador, I am sure that you have heard it from your forefathers. There is very li.ttle vegetation, Sir, very little vegetation, very little growth, mostly rock. But those people are pleased that they have t~is service and I think, Sir, one thing that I worked on and I '-tould beg again of this government to carry out a programme.

I think if the time has come, when we are going to try to impose or bring the just society - "Just Society"- I like it. The words have been used and widely spread around Ottawa. I like it, Sir. I see a need for it, a great need. I think the time has come when we should start making a comparison. Sir, as a business man, you have to be1 to stay competitive today you have to look at what your competition is doing.

I have been making great comparisions, Sir, throughout this island and comparing what has been done on this great Avalon Peninsula# on the West Coast of Newfoundland when I see all the pavement,as to what has been done in Labrador, I see a vast difference, Sir, a great difference exists. But then again I suppose in 1949 Newfoundland was a little bit further ahead then than Labrador was at that time. So I am not being critical of the previous administration, Sir, neither am I being critical of this administration.

I do not thin~.by being critical or barking across this House at the smiling people on the other side- I am sure they are all friendly and warm- that I am going to accomplish anything for Labrador, I would like to be able to sit down, Sir, on a sensible negotiable basis and bargain with this government to get the things that I need for my district. It has been a long time coming, I think we have the thing started, Sir. This year for the first time we have on the Labrador Coast - radio, and this should seem strange to this bon.

House and the hon. members that for a period of time the people in our coastal communities, the only communications they had with the outside world was through Moscow radio, 374

April 28, 1972 Tape No. 1·40 NC - 3 MR. WOODWARD: I do not know how many Eskimos understand Russian, Sir. I doubt if there are very many. This year we had a low power relay radio station put in Hopedale. For the first time our people are receiving CBC radio through Goose Bay. I have made representation, Sir, and I will be presenting in this House a petition, a petition to bring television and radio to all of those Labrador North communities and to bring them out of isolation, I think that this can be done, Mr.

Speaker, and I think it can be done, and I beg of this government, Sir, I beg of this government and I solicit your help in getting this done. Sir, last year for the first time we opened a small processing plant at Nain, a small processing plane, nothing big, no great amom1t of machinery like you see in our famous fish plants on the Island of Newfoundland. We were not about to process a billion pounds of fish. We were only concerned about processing a~alf a million pounds. Through the help of the Department of Social Services and Rehabilitation, the previous minister, Sir, we had this plant built.

We opened it last year. It brought to that community of Nain, it brought economic stability. For the first time we employ women in Labrador to work· in the fish plant and they were paid equal wages with the men. MR. MURPHY.: What were the rate of wages? MR. WOOQWARD: The rate of wages was • •• I just do not recall now, I think the rate of wnp,es, the hon. member for St. John's Centre, was somewhere around $1,60 an hour.

It brought economic stability to that community the first time we have done anything for any of the communities on the Labrador Coast, Sir, when you hear of the shortage of supplies that exist on the Coast, it is because we have brought up the economic means of the community. People have more money. There is a greater demand for services. They are spending more money and consequently, I suppose, the government was not prepared 1 but had all the necessary things in that they thoueht should be in the stor~a. Sir, we have a unique situation. 375

April 28, 1972 Tape 1~1 JM- 1 MR.. IVOODWARD: -·-·· ·- .._,._ - · · and I must nraise the Department of Northern Labrador Services and I must thank the portion that Ottal~a puts into those communities. I feel we would possibly have not as much as we do have today had not Ottawa contributed a fair share. But what is happeninp: here, Sir, is that this fish plant did brinr, economic stability to the communities for the first time. The people were proud to ro out and work. HoTTien for their first time worked.

So, Sir. we had proposed,as the Liberal Government, to put a similar type plant in Makkovik. lle had proposed to do it this summer. I hope, Sir, and I be?, a~ain of this ~overnment that that nlant will be built. Sir, the cost is lar~ely borne by the federal treasury. It is not ~oinr, to cost the province that much. The monev will be easily returned to the treasury over a period of maybe three to four years with a canital inve:;tment of $80,000. This will serve, Sir, the communities of Hope.dale, Makkovik and Postville. This again.

Sir, A!!.._HO~?'!E.~~~ : And possibly Rigolet. ~~~~OAl~ : Possibly Rigolet, Sir, yes. Possibly Rigolet. I do not want to infringe on the honourable member for Labrador South but possibly Rigolet. So, Sir, I hope that the government do not turn those pro~rarrunes down. I beg of the govern men tl I know that we are puttinp a lot of money in trawlers, rightly so I suppose because we have people on the island llho have to be employed and kept workin!! but t hope that those proprammes will go ahead. The people of these communities are reallv looking forward to it. They are looking forward to having this fish plant.

Again, Sir. I would like to say, and I know it is unusual to compliment a person on the ~overnment side of the House lo~hen vou sit in the opposition, but the honourable member for St. Mary's so 376

April 28, 1972 Tape 141 JM - 2 ~DHARD: ably yesterday mentioned the protection of fishing grounds for the local fishermen. Sir, I would like to see the fishing p:rounds for permanent fishermen of Labrador who live there all year round, the fishing ~rounds and the stocks of the char and the salmon protected, Sir, for their eYclusive use,not for the use of anyone on this island or any place else on the mainland of Canrda but exclusively for their use. Sir. they are roinp: to be there,for a long time.

Their sons and dau~hters may grow up and get educated but we have youn~ people, we have fa~ilies in the thirty, forty year old bracket, if you want ~ to call it that, who are goin~ to be on the Labrador coast for a lon~ time. If those communities are going to survive, Sir, the fishing resource is the only means by which they can survive. I would like to see this government, Sir, take some corrective measures to see that the stocks are protected. Sir, when you talk of transportation in Labrador you have said a mouthful.

I have been heavily involved in transportation in my fifteen years since I went to Labrador and I have compiled many a report, Sir, on transportation and made many recommendations. I am very pleased, Sir, that the honourable Minister of Transport in Ottawa has seen fit to set up more commissions. There is one already in progress and hopefully we will get the results of that commission. The results of that commission, Sir, should come, I hope, shortly so that we can reap some of the benefits this cominp: season.

Sir, when I move out of the coastal communities and we get closer to home, to the areas of Goose Bay, Happy Valley and when you think of the uncertainty, and no doubt there are lots of headlines made today, as to the future of these areas. I am sure that most of the honourable members of this House are more than familiar with what 377

April 28, 1972 Tape 141 MR.. \vOODWARD : has happened on this island in the last five to seven years with the phase out of the A~erican bases at both Pepperrell, Harmon,and Argentia, Sir, phasing down greatly. We have that same problem , Sir. We have that same problem in Goose Bay, Happy Valley and the Lake Melville area. It is not only having an economic effect on a community, it is also having a depressed effect on the communities, Sir.

The people are afraid to invest money, people are afraid even to buy cars so they can live a little 1 in the event that tomorrow something happens and they do not have a job any more. I think this government, Sir, should in all its wisdom pursue the avenues on a federal level and get an answer for t'tose 12,000 people ~ ' 12,000 people, Sir, represent the fifth largest community in this Province of Newfoundland (and Labrador). There is no other means, Sir, other than the woods harves~ing operation, I suppose, and now again we are not so sure of this.

It would make you shiver, Sir, when you think of the accompanied town that is builtl!Way in the wilderness, somewhere around eight hundred miles from this capital city,placed in a wilderness with no surroundin~ communities and depending largely on certain industries. I hope, Sir, that this government will pursue the avenues that are available to them by going to our friends in Ottawa, the Government of Canada who is now today negotiating with our great American friends -on renewing the lease in Goose Baytthat expires JM- 3 in December1 for another period of time.

I think it is the responsibility of this government, Sir, that they find out what is going on and they tell or they bring it to the people of the Lake Melville-Goose Bay area who are so heavily depending on-this industry and tell them in no uncertain terms, Sir, whether it be good news or bad news, what is happening and what our future is. 378

April 2R. 1972 Tape .141 JM - 4 ~. f-IUR!P.Y.: Hr. Speaker, would the honourable ~entleMan pei'l!tit me for just one second? I have out this about all ove r the country, that it is the responsibility of this p,overnment, you know, ! think tha t - --- and ! think everybody will a~ ree. AN no~. NF.MBER: -----·- ----- (Inaudible). ~ ..:.}!l.J.RT>H.Y_:. Yes. l>ut not to let the neople know1 because we are not gettinp, the information. That is all I want to, you know - ~:_I~QOJ?.HARQ: 1-!r. Speaker. l ~1ould like to say this, I say it is the responsibility of this government, ! say this because of the fact that we are provincial citizens . Sir, 379

April 28 , 1972 , Tape 142, Page 1 -- apb MR . \~ OODWAF,D : We are provincial citi zens. The people in Labrador and in Goose Bay, Happy Valley are citizens of this province. l~e are wards of the federal government? A number of times that we have been treated as such but we are not. We contribute on an equal basis with the people of this province. We do the same things, Sir, "r:!.th no distinction. I am not exempt from any tax. I am not exempt from any tax, Sir. We even pay gasoline tax and we do not have roads, Sir, it is just to help them build the arterial roads in these two great cities i~ this province.

I do not like it, Sir, neither do my people like it. Then again, Sir, you are going to have these things that ; ;. I am prepared to live with. I am sure that the hon. memher for St. John's Centre although in a short time in office has not yet become familiar with what is taking place in Labrador, Sir. }1R. A • J . MURP!!_Y_:. I have become as familiar as anybody else has. MP. . HOODl.JARD : Over the days in this House, Sir, that I sat here I find very little feeling put into anythin~ or any of the speeches. They are mere practice. Sir, we have to get a little closer to reality.

I am concerned, Sir, about this great industry and I beg again, Sir, of this government to give us some anst-7ers as to what our future is. I would like to go back to the '"'ood harvesting industry, Sir, lvhich vre feel in Labrador in the Lake Melville Area where lve have millions of cords of black spruce wood that is literally rotting away, ~~e are losing millions of cords per year, not ne_cessarily millions, Sir, I suppose I am exaggerating a bit, but losing hundreds maybe thousands of cords a year due to.rot. It has been sitting there for hundreds of years, Sir, and never harvested.

Going back two years ago we thought we saw the light. Hhen the Javeline operation came into Goose Bay we said "okay, this, Sir, is going to bring economic stability to this community. We have resource industry now.' We look out into our backyards ancl see 380

April 28, 1972, Tape 142, Pa~e 2 -- apb all this black spruce. People tell us that it can be made into pulp and paper or made into linerboard, Sir, whatever the case may be_ lt maybe one of the highest grades of raw materials that is used in the newsprint field today. He felt very pleased. There were a number of people moved in, Sir. We do not have unemployment as such in our community. He have unemployment in our coastal communities likely because of the fact that people are not prepared to travel during the winter. He provide jobs, Sir. Labrador has been largely used as a dumping ground for people to get jobs.

Th~y come in, work for a short time take their money with them, put very little back into the economy and disappear. This I disagr,ee with, Sir. I rlo not think that this practice should be continued. I am not being critical of our Newfoundland people, Sir, I think there are great opportunities existing in Labrador, not only as a means of providing jobs, mere jobs, there are great business opportunities.

I become maybe emotional when I think of the number of our Nelvfoundland people who travel to the mainland and get l"leagre jobs when they can come into Labrador 1 get r;ood jobs and become solid citizens of that part of our province. I encourage people to come, I think more should. This resource base industry, Sir, the Javelin wood,! am sure we will hear more about it next week in the House. I hate to see us lose this industry, Sir. I would shiver to think tnat the raw material going into that mill at Stephenville would be from any other area but the Lake Melville Area.

This has been our only hope over a period of fifty years. It came and I hope it is not snatched away over-night. We need that industry, l.re need that industry and we need it badly. lfr. Speaker, it would be very remiss of me at this time if I did not mention the great work of the Grenfell Mission. It supplied medical services to the Labrador Coast when this province before~49 could not afford it, to the Labrador Coast for a period of nearly 381

April 28, 1972, T~pe 142, Page 3 -- apb one hundred years. I would also be very remiss, Sir, if I did not mention the good worl<.s of the Moravian :lilission in the development of those conununities. They have done a tremendous job, Sir, they have done a tremendous job. lllso, Sir, the :R.C. M.ission at }~orthwest River who so ably ~~orked with the Indians and the R.C. Mission at Davis Inlet. Fr. Speaker, if I may for a moment I ~muld like to talk on transportation. I have attempted twice since I came into this House this v!eek to talk about the Trans-Labrador IU ghl-7ay.

Many people have said it and I Hill say it, Sir, ,,,e do not have ,a Trans Canada Highway unless it stretches through Labrador. I consider the Trans-Canada High\ Jay incomplete. ,. I would like to see this government, the ~overnment of our province today take some very active steps in ne!!otiatin!! t·rith the Government of Canada for funds, not all the funds. J do not think all the funds should come from Ottawa. In 1949 we had a population of about 9,000 people in the whole of Labrador. Today we have reached the peak of nearly 40,000.

I think that the provincial - federal hir.hways budget as brought down this year should !!ive us equal portions of its money to help finance or at least her.in the highroad in Labrador. I think that we should share in that bud11:et, Sir. \o;Te have been contributing to~1ards j t for a long time but we got very little out of it. I think we should share, I think it is only right that we should have some funds whether they be tv70 mi.llion, three million, five million whatever the case may be.

I do not think it is right for me to say today that we can devide that budget up on a per capita basis, but then again, Sir, I shiver at the thought of all the roads beinp oaved on thfs island without even a dirt road being btdlt ;in Labrador. I do not think we can have that. Sir. I think the time has come as has been so often said and it will pass very quickly if somethinp is not done. I believe in the physical lin~ with Labrador, Sir. 382

April 28, 1972, Tape 142, ~age 4 -- apb I believe in a physical link from the Straits of Belle Isle into Goose Bay and in turn from r.oose Bay to Labrador City and then down to Quebec, that route, Sir. l,le should have a physical link. I have lived for fifteen years in Labrador and raised a family there. I have developed I suppose a perpetual feeling for it, I am a Ne~.rfoundlander, Sir, very much a Newfoundlander and I would like to see unity brou!!:ht into this province.

He have a number of thin~s to do and it is the responsibility of this government. ~yself, Sir, I am very tolerant I can tolerate a lot of things. I can bear with this governrnentiif they go half-way. But, Sir, I have sons and daughters and they are part of the youn~ generation that is gradually I suppose qutnumbering the old Newfoundlanders who went to Labrador. They have different vie'I-7S.

While you deal with me I may be tolerant, but the youth that is corning along and will fast become what I am, maybe more knowledgeable Sir, better educated they are goin~ to be hard to deal with unless this province is prepareJ to give to Labrador its equal share. We have a lot cf catching up to do to be on eaual par with the island. I do not believe in anything extraJor special status as my hon. friend mentioned. The hon. member from Labrador West mentioned yesterday or a couple of days ago 383

April 28, 1972. Tape 143. Page 1. in this honourable House. I do not think we are looking for anything s special Sir, but we are looking for our equal share, equal status. Nay be as we look for equal status and our equal share, may be our children that is coming up, are going to l.oQk back and they are going to do an analysis on ~·hat have happened, you know, I consider it has already happened Sir. We had Labrador in the headlines, October and again in Harch. l consider a very strong protest vote or an anti-Ne1.rfoundland vote if you want to call it that. Very strong Sir. Very evident.

It uas largely from the youth, largely from the youth. So I think in this \ case here we should take a very serious look and bring Labrador, bring it in to the fold. -,. We have lived uncer a very transient administration, may be going back for hundreds of years. People came to Labrador ~o do business, l•rhat did they do, they came up, they stayed for two days, take tbei r orders, collect their money, never saw them after Sir. This has been very sad.

Government people have been coming ' into our portion of our province, staying overnight,- my wife have a birthday tomorrow, I have tou~o back home, the job is half done, we have lived under this type of administration, I support the government Sir, 1vhen they say they are going to bring the administratlon of this government to the people. If any place in this province need the administration of government brought to the people it is the people of Labrador. I shiver to think how many peonle from the coastal communities of Labrador visualize what this Fouse lmoks like.

Or may be a large number of their fathers or the parents before them never every saw it. It is very new Sir, for people from St. John's to come and sit in the galleries, look around, see all the nice things that .. is hapnening. There are a lot of people in. this province Sir, who never had the economic means, neither can they do it. So, S~r, in this respect we can only hope to accomplish this by having not free transportation, not free ~ransportation, I think that we 3~4

Ap'l!il 28, 1972 . Taoe 143 Page 2. could oossiblv have transportation reduced so as to make it a little bit easier for people to come here. I can travel from Goose Ray to '-!ontreal a t a same price as I travel from C.oose Bav to St • John's. Our trade is orientated to the mainland, rightly so, it should be. But there is no incentive o come to the island because of the fact when '' e come to the island the cost is equally as great, but the opportunities are greater on the other end, I am hearing those facts here Si_r, here in this House }1r. Speaker. Because over the years I have al•. 'avs 'wanted to do this.

I think this is the House of the people. I think those economic problems, our social problems, our cultural problem~ should be aired. I think, having made my spiel today while not hav 1ng any great effect on what has been done but if it does not Sir, I do not know if many of you people have heard of the Labrador backlash. The late honourable Bill Keough is the first man that J heard speak about it, But there is a Labrador backlash, if we leave it to corrode and the waves to get enomous they l-1111 possibly turn against u~.

The seas will probably roll up on the shores of this island, there is very little control we will have on it. But, again Sir, I say this and I say it will all sincerity that I believe this government will not let us down, hopefully not, if they do then again there is going to be ways of I hope, of our people dealing with it. Sir, it may be very philosophical in a sense I suppose: But, I feel pleased that I have had the opportunity to sit in this honourable House to say what I have s aid today. Thank you. 1-fR , B.HOWARD: Mr.

Speaker, firstly, I 'qould like to say that I am very proud and happy to be seated here among such esteemed colleagues. I wish you all ·Hell in your years of tenure of office that lie ahead, and ))lease feel free if I can he of any assistance to anv of you in the future to call me. This is the first time since Confederation, 1949, that a progressive 385

April 28, 1972. Tape 143. Page 3. conservative government has been elected to run the affairs of our province. Much is expected of us. Much more I feel that we can accc,mplish in four or five short years. hJe have been challenged by the people of Newfoundland, we must meet that challenge. We will meet that challenge. The people of the Bay de Verde District have challenged me and I certainly will meet that challenge with the assistance of the various departments concerned. Hr.

Speaker, this government has committed itself to the fisheries expansion, to the establishment of small localized industries. to the expansion of tourist industries, to the improvement of our roads, to th improvement of our water and sewerage facilities, to the attraction of ,, new industry to the province coupled with the expansion of industry and business already located in this province. All of these priorities which are being set by the province as a whole are very grl"at prioT'ities ~•ithin the Bay de Verde District. The fishery is by far the main indnstry in the district.

Most of the employment within the district revolves around the industry. The govern- ment's programme of expansion and ·improvement of the industry will provide a great incentive for the peol'le of Bay de Verde District.. to reali.ze that the fishery is not dead but aU.ve and flourishing. The fishery has been passed over in the past and consequently many people in my district has been passed over. 386

April 28, 1972 Tape no. 144 Page 1 - MRW I intend to see that the Bay de Verde District will not be passed over in the future and with the help of the new administration we will show that the Bay de Verde District is indeed an integr& part of Newfoundland and can play a great and important role in shaping its future. The fishermen of my district have long awaited fishery reforms and improvements of fishing facilities. I intend to support and fight for the fishery during my tenure of office and this will greatly affect the lives and future of the great historic District of Bay de Verde.

Some say that the fishery is dying or even dead. I say, Mr. Speaker, ' that the fishery is not dying nor dead but that it is just a fishery policy of the past that are dead. The fishermen of Bay de Verde need financial assistance to obtain ·,boats and equipment. They need an adequate insurance scheme whereby the gear which may be destroyed or lost by some act of God will be replaced immediately, not six,eight or ten months later. The fishermen of my district have great need of new and better boats.

Many more long liners and drag~ers are needed along with supportive facilities, including new-slip ways and improvement of docking and wharf faci~ies . Much pressure, Mr. Speaker, must be placed on the federal government to try and force them to take a closer look at Newfoundland, the fishery and its future. The twelve-mile limit which is so talked about must be imposed so that an inshore fisherman can earn a decent living as well as those on the trawlers, long liners and draggers. The fishermen must be helped and helped greatly, not just in one or two aspects but the entire fishery. I understand, Mr.

Speaker, that it is the present government's plan to see that the fishery is given its rightful due as the premier . (excuse the pun) industry in this province, This will make both me and my constituents very happy. 387

April 28, 1972 Tape no. 144 Page 2 The Bay de Verde District has need of supporti~e industries to the fishery. There are two fish plants in the district but they are unable to do complete jobs. The district needs something other than these. It is nOF. my intention to see that a fish processing plant including a cannery be set up to ensure that the fish products that are available in a district will not have to leave the district to be processed or to be fully processed, packaged and canned fresh for the other parts of Newfoundland and North America.

Supportive to this canning industry I propose that a small number of freezing plants be erected to ensure that the fish will be fresh frozen for future processing. These should be set up in strategic areas throughout \ the district. The industries can and I hope will be set up through private interests and with help from the government in the way of financial grants. ~ I wholeheartedly support the hon. member from Bonavista South in what he said concerning the salmon fishery which includes my district as such.

The late honourable Bill Keough - I used to take very much notice of his speeches in the past when he used to speak about the forgotten fishermen on the Bill of Cape St. George. Mr. Speaker, we still have forgotten fishermen in Baccalieu Tic~les, they have been there for twenty-three years and they are still there. Mr. Speaker, small-scale farming forms a very important part of the livelihood of people in many parts of my district. With government assistance, these people can expand their efforts and may conceivably profit from it commercially.

Many people in the district also raise cattle for milk or beef as supplements to their income. These cattle can be seen roaming everywhere throughout the district causing a menace not only to the owners but also to the traffic in general. This problem could be alleviated and industry expanded with the establishment of a number of community pastures throughout the district. These are desperately needed and I shall seek the assistance of the government to see that these with their related facilities are established. Other industries in particular the blueberry harvest have great need of expansion.

Blueberry roads must be built to enable the harvester to pick the greatest possible 388

April 28, 1972 Tape no. 144 Page 3 number of blueberries 1 as this forms an integral part of the income for many families in the district each year, Would it be to presumptuous of me, I wonder, to hope that at sometime in the relatively near future that these blueberries and other types of berries that are in the district and surrounding the districts could be processed right in the district, and, I believe that this can be accomplished within the next couple of years.

The tourist industry, as in other parts of the province leaves much for development anL:, in my district a park has been developed to some extent at Northern Bay Sands. This must be developed much further \ to encourage more tourists from within and outside the province, Many related facilities must be looked at to ensure that the best'possible care will be afforded the historic District of Bay de Verde. Adequate fresh water, Mr. Speaker, may not seem to propose much of a problem in Newfoundland it is, however, in many parts of Bay de Verde District.

The government must make every effort to ensure that every person has access to adequate fresh,clean water and to ensure that our Newfoundland peqie are kept clean and healthy. Sewerage does pose another problem but this will be looked into in later years. Mr. Speaker, I have heard it said on both sides of this honourable House that we should fqrget the past.

But when it comes to show that I am representing the district, within 100 miles of the capital city of this province,and the people have to get out of bed in the morning and strain water and boil it before it is fit to drink, then do we forget the past~ I say the fishermen of Bay de Verde District cannot forget the past when they do not have a decent drop of water to drink in the morning but have to boil it and strain it. Is this why we forget the past?

I say the people of Newfoundland have not forgotten the past because if they did we would not be forming the Government of Newfoundland today, People in the Bay de Verde District have not forgotten the past. If they did, I would not be representing that historic district today, 389

April 28, 1972 Tape no. 144 Page 4 In all fairness to the people of Bay de Verde District and in particular the Community of Bay de Verde, I say something definitely has to be done about the water probl em there. While we are on the sub ject of health, Mr. Speaker, the Dist rict of Bay de Verde is completely lacking in adequate area dumps for garbage and other refuge . Incinerators are badly needed as this is n~w posing an additional health problem. It must be looked into immediately. The roads in the district 390

April 28, 1972 Tape 145 PK - 1 MR. B. HOHAF.D: in some parts of it after twenty-three years of millions on top of millions of dollars being thrown do~m the drair . t t is still in an impossible condition. I implore this government on behalf of my constituents to see that this is overcome ~Yithin a very short ~,,hile. I heard the honourahle rnemher from Labrador North speak about the services that ~rere supplied to Labrador and thanks to the Liberal Government. I am sorry hono· !r.a' le member that I cannot thank the Liberal Government for what exists in the dis 'rict of Bay de Verde that I represent today.

I go back to the honourable rnemh<'r -"or Bell Island in his remarks in his speech who spoke and said that the Pro'r;ressive Conservative Government made seventy-nine promises during their campaign. Well ' I am glad to know that the honourable member for Bell Island can count. Because in the past, }lr. Speaker, 'lo7e have had so many promises by our previous administration thatusing the honocrable member for Jlell Island~o\\'tl terminology,it woitld take a Philadelphia lawyer to count and I doubt if he could do it then.

To the honourable the member for Labrador North I can \\•ell aS?;ree with some of the things that you had to say. I had worked in Labrador for sixteen years and I know of some of the problems that prevail there. llut the honourable member must realize that he cannot expect this present government to accomplish in two months or in one month t~hat the past government have failed to accomplish in twenty-three years. Back a few years ago, Mr. Speaker, the slogan was- under the Prime. Vinistership of Lester Pierson a:'d under the Premiership of the honourable J.R.

Smallwood there was a slogan "Complete the drive in 65'" He have the honourable the member for Labrador North stating and I ap.ree ~•ith him that the Trans-Canada Highway is not completed until Labrador has a link with the Mainland of Canada, and I would put in there with Ne~1foundland. But this was a great thinp; "complete 391

April 28, 19 72 Tape 145 PIC- 2 MR. HOWARD: the drive in 65'" If it was not included then why should the honourable member expect the present government to do it within one month. Hr. Speaker, I pray and I ask the present government to look after the district that I represent, an historic district of Bay de Verde and not let it be neglected as it has been in the past twenty-three years. Now if there is any honourable member'in this House today ~,rho does not believe that it has been neglected, I ask him to take four or five hours off and drive do~ through it. Hr.

Speaker, I have every confidence in this government of which ' I am happy to be a member and I am sure that this government will not let the people of Bay de Verde district do~ any longer hut 1·1111 help "''.! build it i.nto its rightful place in the Newfoundland economy. Thank you. HR. A. EVANS: ~r. Speaker, first I would like to extend my personal congratulations to you on your election to the honoured position of Deputy Speaker of this honourable House. I am confident, Sir, that you will be a credit to this honourable position.

I Hould like to po;lnt out, Sir, that although we came into the House at about the same time, my entry into politics started much earlier. I was flattened four times before I finally scored a T.K.O. last Octoher. However,. on March 24, the referee could have counted all night. It was a clear-cut knockout. I think I deserved that one. Mr. Speaker, I feel very humble today to be a member of this honourable House. It is a great honour, Sir, and I am no~ unmindful of the same.

I hope that my old grand-daddy is looking do~ today as he was the one 1-rho started me out on this road, one of the greatest Tories that our province has produced. lie also belonged to one of the greatest fishing families of Newfoundland who captained ships of all 392

April 28, 1972 Tape 145 PK - 3 HR. EVANS: sizes all over the '"orld. As a matter of fact I spent years in the fis~ery, myself, and my sons are still carrying on the tradition. Mr. Speaker, you may prohahly \o7onder why T persisted in my efforts until T. ~ras finally elected. I "t-Till state it very bluntly, Sir. T. knew that t could ~rive my district the type of representation it deserved and had never received. I re mem~er one of our former representatives stating that he had come to our d:l.strict to be elected hecause he considered it the forgotten district. He was elected, came hack to St.

John's and had a complete case of amnesia \ concerning Burf!eo - LaPoile. \Je had another representative in the House for four years Hho finally at· a night session was reported to have spoken. It Has a false a:tarm, he yawned. I do not think that will be the type of representation Burp:eo - LaPoile 't-1111 receive during my term of office. Mr. Sneaker , I do not intend to make a lengthy speech. I feel that ,.,hat can he said :In a ten minute period should not he dra~m out for an hour or more, or that I should speak for twenty­ three vears '~ithout saying anything.

I intend to mention only a few of my district's problems, hut that does not mean I will not be dealing \.rith the r,.st 1 all of them in time. I am delighted to see that this honourable Ch,mher has ostensibly developed into a temple _of brotherly love and I sincerely hope that it ,-,Tfll remain that way. It can certainly improve the imaf!e of this honourable House '"hich has reached the low water mark in the past t'.ro years. Mr. Speaker, I do not wish to be over-critical, but since so many fishermen in my district are affected hy the new federal salmon regulations, I have to express my views in this connection.

In my opinion our coastal Vaters should he controlled by our Provincial Government. The Federal Government should be concerned only with a Continental Shelf, but are not. If we had a farmer as Federal 393

April 28, 1972 Tape 145 PK- 4 HR. EVANS: Fisheries Minister it ~~ould be serious enough, hut we do not even have a decent farmer on the job. Our own Hinister of Justice made the truest statement in the October election when he stated that the former Liberal Government of Ne~•foundland did not like the smell of fish. The Liberal Government in Ottawa did not even like the sound of it - they call it the Department of the Environment. It has not done anything about the weather though. Mr.

Speaker, the Federal Minister of the Environment claims that a closed season on the salmon industry ~,rill bring hack our salmon stocks. After we let them pass our shores and the Danes are free to \ catch them in Greenland or Icelandic ~ ,r aters, how does he expect them back? In jarsf tins or glazed? '!llo Mr. Speaker, my district has long been neglected, but in spite of this my people ~J ere hard-working and independent enough to fight on and make a fairly decent living under the t (mghest of conditions. It developed a breed of men I can assure you, Sir.

Our top fishing season is during the winter months, when most fishermen are ashore. This means that the fish they bring in is second to none and have built up a good fresh fish industry \vith a good price to the fishermen. However, Sir, we are still not taking advantage of the opportunity ~,re have to provide as many jobs through the fishery as ~·e should. Most of our fish is reprocessed after it arrives in the mainland markets of Canada or the U.S. The jobs provided by this reprocessing belong here in Newfoundland and I intend to direct all my efforts tm,rard bringing this about.

I have some very definite plans in this connection. ,394

April 28, 1972 Tape 146 JM - 1 MR. EVA.~S: ---·- · Mr. Speaker, my district has contributed ~reatly to the economy of this province and to the p.ross national product of Canada through the year round operation of the fresh fish plants, but we have not been on the receivinl?: end to the same extent. Bur)1;eo-LaPoile 's coastline, Sir. is only about ninety-five miles in length. yet we have a district that is divided into tuo parts due to the lack of a road into Burgeo. It is a disgrace to any government that this state of affairs has existed for so long.

I am sure that the ~overnment with which I am associated lvill not carry this shame ·any lon~er. but will get this road completed as quickly as possible. Mr. Speaker, my district is also behind the eight ball in re?ard to community services such as water and sewer installations. I have worked to have the improvements made in connection with the water system in Port aux BasQues and thanks to the honourable Premier's efforts I am sure that these will be affected this year. However, Sir, we need installations at Isle aux Morte, Burnt Islands and Rose Blanche which are lon~ overdue.

I intend to work for them in the same manner. The Federal Government may call it DREE, ARDA or what have you, but I will accept aid from them under any name and, Sir, I do not consider it charity. Burgeo-LaPoile has a big credit balance in Ottawa. Mr. Speaker, Burgeo-LaPoile has a preat future in my opinion. I have waited a lon?- time to get into the position where I can contribute to this end. My govern~ent has also waited a long time to get into office and I would like to point out the fact that four or five years soon passes. So, the sooner we start these plans the sooner will they be fulfilled.

Sir, I do not want to see the young people of my district leaving to seek work on the mainland when they can be gainfully employed at home. 395

April 28, 1972 Tape 146 JM - 2 !-fR. E1_Y~S : Mr. Sneaker, I believe that small industries are to be the means of salvaging many of our urban communities. Anything in the form of industry that is viable must be encouraged, even the mushroom industry advocated by the honourable member from Hell Island, although I would recommend that the steaks come from Port au Port or St. George's. Mr. Speaker, I have been known as a go-getter all my life and I intend, as I am doing at present, to devote all my energies to the improvement of my district.

I am confident that under the brilliant leadership of the honourable the Premier and with the co-operation of my colleagues, I will, within the nexf few years, make Burgeo-LaPoile a much better place in which to live,which will leave me with the satisfaction of knowing that the confidence of my people was not misplaced. Mr. Speaker, all of us have certain goals in mind, both personal and in the general sense. The measure of attainment of these goals is dependent upon the amount of effort and perserverance contributed by us.

In this connection, I would like to conclude by quoting a few words which were written by a great Scotsman, the late Sir Harry Lauder, when he was greatly depressed by personal tragedy. ''!Ceep right on to the end of the road, keep right on to the end. Though the way be long let your heart be strong just keep on r~und the bend.- Tho' the way be weary still journey on till you come to your happy abode. Where all you love and you are dreaming of will be there- at the end of the road. 11 Thank you, Mr. Speaker. MR. WILSON (G.M.): Mr.

Speaker and members of this honourable House you have come in contact with someone in a different line than what has been going ahead here today. I have listened to the member from 396

April 28. 1972 Tape 146 JM - 3 MR. l\TILSON: Labrador North, I have listened to all the members around the House and they have snoken about Labrador but thev c-annot tell me one thing about it. I have traveled around the Labrador coast from Battle Harbour to Ca!le Harrison when I had to p.o for trap berths when I 1"'as thirteen years of ar.e in a twenty --eight foot motorboat to go from Battle Harbour to Indian Harbour. I have listened to it all.

I have heard the honourable member from Labrador speaking about that we never had such services in 1949 but I am r,oing to tell you in 1949 the Grenfell service on the tabrador coast was second to none and I stand on my two feet to claim this todav. The honourable member over on the other side of the Rouse,in the person of the honourable member for For;o,knowsquite well about it.

I know there is a lot can be taken up for Labrador because I travelled the Labrador Coast when I went to Labrador with pecple who had to eat bottle kelp and probably some members in this House do not know what that was, to live on it for three weeks. AN RON. MEMBER: (Inaudible). . --·-- -- ··- ----- MR. HILSON: I am ;ust speaking about Labrador. Never mind, we will come to that later. I will pive you a chance 1.rhen the time comes. f.:~ RON_ •• !fE~_R. : (Inaudible). MR. NILSON: I am not from Lewisporte either. I am from the Port de Grave district, the one that was written off by the Liberals.

They were p:oin~~: to send a dog there but ,the dog that went there lost its tap: in the woods. I am here to tell you that, Mr. Speaker, and I am not here for fun-making or anything else, I am here for the benefit of this province. MR. ROJ;I_E_RT~_:_ (Inaudible). MR. WILSON: Hell, this is what your former Premier had said. 397

April 28, 1972 Tape 146 JM- 4 MR. ROBERTS: I have no idea what Mr. Smallwood said. MR. HILSON: This is what your former Premier had said. MR. ROBERTS: When did he say it? MR. WILSON: He said he was ~oing to send a dog out to Port de Grave and put a tag on his neck. MR.MARSHALL: On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, on a point of order.

It is customary to address remarks to Your Honour and I feel that although there has been some breaches of it today I feel that there is an old rule that has been utilized by this House for a long, long period of time to the effect that when somebody makes their m~iden speech we all attempt not to interrupt. MR. ROBERTS: ~ Mr. Speaker, to the point which, of course, was well made and I agree with the rules of tradition but if the honourable gentleman intends to call Mr. James Hussey a dog, I do not know if he meant it or not but that is what I heard him say.

Perh~ps he might say he did not intend it and then we would let the matter drop. ~· SPEAKER (BARRY) : The standing orders of the House say that an honourable member is to be permitted to give his speech in silence. If there is a matter of privilege or if there is a matter on which one of the honourable members wishes to ask a question then the honourable member should ask leave of the honourable member for Port de Grave to ask a question otherwise the honourable member for Port de Grave should be permitted to continue his speech and have the attention of the House.

I would ask him to address his remarks to the Chair rather than to other honourable members in the House. MR. WILSON: Mr. Speaker, I have never insinuated anyone is a dog. I only just referred to what was said and the honourable Leader of the Opposition know that quite well. ~ffi. · ROBE~TS: Mr. Speaker, if the honourable gentleman would permit? 398

April 28, 1972 '!ape 146 JM- 5 MR. ROBERTS: - - ·-- T heard the statement and I am glad that he made it clear that he was not referrinp.: to Mr. Hussey as a dog. That is just what I expected him to say and I am glad of it. But when did Mr. Smallwood make that statment? You know, 1 heard the gentleman from Port de Grave say it hut when did Mr. Smallwood say it? HR. NEARY: Mr. Speaker, before the honourable member carries on I wonder if I could remind Your Honour that members of this House do not refer to honourable members by treir first or last names and probabl v a gentle reminder to the new members especially.

Tvould it be in orcler? MR~_S_!:~AKER (_BARRY).: Yes, the honourable memher's point is well taken. There have been a number of matters and perhaps this is a good time to brin~ up reference to other matters. The Chair has been somewhat lenient because of the fact that the members are becomin~ accustomed to the procedure of the House and they are new members. However, it is not permitted to address another honourable member by his name. You address him as the honourable member for such and such a district.

Another point on which there have been several breaches and which I meant to point out at the end of the session today is that when an honourable member is speaking the Standin~ Orders say that any other honourable member should not pass between him and the Chair and I would ask the honourable members to take note of this as well. The honourable member for Port de Grave, I believe, has a question from the honourable Leader of t~e Opposition if he wishes to answer it or continue his speech. MR. HILSON: ~1ell, Mr. Speaker, we will deal with this at a later date.

I happen to represent ~art de Grave district, a district which is a forgotten area, 399

April 28, 1972 Tape No. 147 NC - 1 MR. WILSON: ~y district is made up of fishermen, farme~s and loggers and I happen to be one of the loggers. I tell you, Mr. Speaker, that the district of Port de Grave has been neglected and we have staunch fishermen in the district of Port de Grave and I intend to try to do my utmost to see that they get their r~ghts in this hon. House and every other district concerned. I am not only concerned with my own district, I am concerned with them provincewide · and that is why I am here and I think I have something to offer. Why I am speaking along these lines?

In the Throne Speech, Nr. Speaker-; - it is mentioned, "incentives to small industries." This, I am very proud of. In the past the small industries have not received it and • therefore, if you get small industries on the move you pay aut $100,000 and employ 250 men# ~hy would we not be interested in small industriesl We have a number of them. We have tall, vast forest timberland. It is not touched. You go in to cut a log, someone comes along, raps you on the shoulder, "private property." You spent two or three days coming to St.

John's to find out if such and such a person owns it and you find out that all the timberland is taken up. l~e are here in this province and if we want a hammer handle it has to be imported from Japan. Now this to me,. Sir, does not seem sP.n$;fhlP. Here we were in 1944-45 we were manufacturing ninety per cent of our lumber for the building trades. Here today it is right reversed we are importing ninety per cent and paying ss much freight on lt as what it costs to manufacture it here in our own province. Now this to me does not seem sensible. This is the reason why, Mr.

Speaker, and hon. members that we are left in the place and we ·haveso much welfare. Another reason why I happen to know this is that I heard it spoken about here yesterday,about incentives programme. Also in my area we have received this incentive programme this winter in the sum of $65,000. 1-le had a town hall in our community and when the wind comes in the northeast, you would have to get a backhoe to go out and clear the way from the door to get in to have a meeting and when you would . get in to have a meeting you would have to get the mops to clean up the water 400

April 28, 19 72 Tape No, 14 7 NC - 2 MR. 1HLSON: to have a meeting in our council. We _were laid one side by th~ Liberal Administration who could not do anything for us. We were deprived. No one could speak of it. Finally we had got to the place and we had got it done and this is the things that I have seen this government can do and I hope to be one of the members to have

part in it. Others will join in, Not only in my community, this goes for all over Newfoundland and Labrador and we have fishermen in Port de Grave District who can build long liners up to 65 feet or 100 feet or whatever is demanded. Why would they not he looked after?

He have a Minist<:"" of Fisheries in Ottawa who is supposed to look out for us, He turned around, apparently,to me, they do not seem to know the crook that goes in the boat to dip fish in,from a baseball bat, or a gaff that you have to kill a seal with 1 from a ship's crook, Now these are the things that all parts of goventment should be concerned with, both in opposition and on the government side. The only way that we maintain and do something for this province is by joining hands and not fighting at P.ach other to get busy and do somethinp, for it.

Another reason why I am here and probably I might be raggled down but I sav I am here and I am a self-made. I never had the privilege to get the education the lawyers got because when I went on the Labrador and got into the cuddv of a motor boat I saw "a" when I left home in the spring of the year and I never saw "w" until I returned in the fall. A few weeks after or months after I came into St.

John's and I went along by a place with "A, & H" marked up, and some fellow said to me, "what would you call that there," I tool<! it as a place to eat and I went in and sat down to eat but my counterpart came along and he w~nt on to the Battery •Motel and lost a trap. Mr. Speaker, this is why I am here and I am proud to be here assembled with the members in this hon, House. I am not here to cause bad friends either, Mr. Speaker, I am here to do justice to my district and also,doing justice to my own district, do justice to my fellow man in his district. But doing that we will attain the mark.

To end off my speech, the challenge of change is ever before us. Looking into the future with a sincere desire to make our province greater and we are 401

April 28, 1973 NC ~ 3 MR. WILSON: reminded day by day that working hard we will achieve this goal,With a glowing torch we step into the future. I thank you. MR. C~EE~EMAN (R.L~ Mr. Speaker, I move adjournment of this debate. 402

April 28, 1972, Tape 148, Page 1 -- apb On motion, second reading of a Bill, ''An Act To Amend, Revise And Consolidate The Law Respecting The Organization And Administration Of Communi tv Councils.,. (No. !,2). "IR. MARSHALL: .. ----- ---·---~ Mr. Speaker, on behalf of the Hinister of Municipal ft.ffairs and Housin? who is absent ~ he is out of the province for a while on a well deserved vacation_ I wish to move second reading of this Bill. This Bill purely and simply, Mr. Speaker, is a Bill to consolidate the law with respect to community councils, the Community Councils Act of 1962.

Tfiere have been many amendments since. There have been four or five in number and it is most desirable for the sake of convenience that the law be consolidated into one Act. I move the second reading of this Bill. MP .• _ _F_0_13_E_P:.!_S_: 1>1r. Speaker, although I do not have the advantage of the departmental notes which the hon. gentleman from St. John's East, the House Leade~ has had, I have read enou~h of them over the years in in~roducing legislation to know exactly the position in which he finds himself.

This is obviously one of those bills that the indefatigable civil servants produce on a never-ending basis. Next year we will doubtless have a 1ill,

an act to amend this act and then "~ole ~1111 have a series of them over the years and then in due course we will have another consolidation because that is the way things go. The Bill is quite straightforward. He have nothing but joy and pleasure 1unrestrained an unalloyed joy I might say,in supporting the hill at second reading. He will also be happy to do it i.n committee and the third reading stage, Sir. On motion, Bill read a second time ordered referred to a Committee of the ~~ole House on tommorrow. }'otion, second reading of a Bill, "An Act To Amend, Revise And Consolidate The Law Relating To The Establishment And Administration Of Local Government.'· (No. 43). 403

April 28, 1972, Tape 148, Page 2 -- apb NR. MARSHALL : Mr. Speaker, again this is a routine act merely to consolidate the existin!l: la~iT with respect to local government. It is rather a large act as the hon. Leader of the Opposition has indicated. This is the type of exercise which we must go through from time to time for the sake of efficiency and I would move second reading of the Bill. MR. ROBERTS: ------ Hr. Speaker, I could almos .t say 'ditto'.' Let me just make one brief observation though. Both these Bills have gone through second reading quickly.

Both are very routine even though they are extensive bills. This one has one hundred and fo~ty-six separate clauses and one hundred and seven pages of text in the Statutes. He should not overlook that these are i>:!!portant because these two hills taken together are the charters under which I suppose ninety-eight percent of the municipal organizations in this province are administered. The two cities, St. John's and Corner Brook have special Acts and I believe we may deal with one or ~iTO of them in a moment or so.

These are important hills and the fact that they are going through the House quickly should not lead anybody, particular1.y the newer members,astray. These are well worth looking at because they are the charters of o1;1r municipa·l organizations. Having said that I will just say ''ditto'· to tiThat I Raid before~ for the benefit of the Hansard Reporters so they will not come to ask me afterwards what. is 'D-I-T-T-0.' 404

April 28, 1972. Taoe 149. Page 1. On motion Bill read a second time ordered referred to a Committee of the Hhole Ho·:se ••n tomorro~J. Second Tl,eRdtng of a Bill, "An Act Further To Amend The Local r,overnment (Receivership) Act." MR.MARSHALL: ~r. Speaker, this again is in the nature of a technical act which is enRcted for the p troose of updRting references to other legislation in the act itself. For example, there are references in this act, two previous acts that have since been repealed and to a terminology which is no longer in use. I move second reading. HR.l-J.!!OHE: Mr.

Speaker, I cannot resist the opportunity to, on supportinp; the principle of this bill to congratulate the ho•se leader, government house leader for leaping into the hreach as he has this afternoon in the absence of his colleague the minister of Municipal Affairs, in order to deal with these acts. Some of them are imPortant although hardly earth­ shakinp,. He should he commended for his activities in these regard. \ole l•rill prohahly have dancing in the streets of St.

John's East tonight for the admirable job that he is doing in introducing these bills. \~e support this one Sir, I do not think there is anything that need be said on it, It is merely hrinp.ing ·.he bill up to date, the principal act up to date, T think the same thing applies to a number of other bills which deal with municipal affairs matters which the Hou•·•e leader intends to bring. I think that we can support this l"i thout comment. Rill read a second time ordered referred to a Committee of the Hhole House on tomorrow.

Second Reading of a Bill, "An Act Tcr Repeal The Bowring Park Area (Control) Act." MR.MARSHALL: Mr. Sneaker, this is

an act to repeal the Bowring Park Area tontro:O Act. The reason for it is this, that originally th<·re were certain controls necessary for the p11rnose of maintaining Bowring Park facilities but now it comes within the boundaries and limits of the city of St. John's and consequently this act is no longer recessary. I might inter.iect that 405

April 28, 1972. Tape 149. Page 2 this is another area of control, this is another nrgan of control that has gone. I feel myself that in the larger municipalities and particularly in St. John's we have far too many organs and bodies and many of the functions perhaps that are exercised hy certain government organs such as the St. John's Housing Corporation, Pippy Park Commission, what have you, ·could he looked at and examined very very carefullv.

Perhaps the city in consultation with the city council a lot of the functions of the~e various control bodies should be transferred to the elected representatives of the people concerned. Of course ,this is something that could only be done after certain study, we being a government of planning will embark on that task and I ~ave no doubt that we will see in the future transfer of controls to elected bodies within the various jurisdictions around before in fact the bodies themselves become defunct. I move second reading. NR.RO.RERTS: Mr.

Speaker, I had not intended to say anything because the hill itself in principle is very - the minister has made an important point when he talks about the need to simplify our municipal level administrations and hopefully when we come to the e~timates of the department of Municipal Affairs & Housing we can go into this. All I can say is that I think he has made a good point or all I should say is that he has made a very good point, 'hopefully in the next three or four years we will see some steps taken there. In particular I think the time is fast coming when the St.

John's Metropolitan Board should either be elected or cease to e.xist. It has been a useful device over the years but the need for it has passed and now there is a need for another type of municipal government. I have a bit of a hobby-horse about regional governments but this is not the place thall we say that the principle of the J~owring Park Area (Control) Act, is well expressed in the note and in the speech given by the minister and I for one will be happy to .vote for it and try to persuade each of my colleagues to support this second reading.

Oh motion llill read a second ti.me ol:'dered referred to a Commit tee of the l.fuole House on tomorrow. 4·0 6

April 28, 1972 Tape no. 150 Page 1 - MRW Motion second reading of a bill., "An Act Further To Amend The St. John's (Metropolitan Area) Act, 1963." MR. MARSHALL: Mr. Speaker, the bon, Leader of the Opposition referred to the necessity of probably electing or maybe even dispensing with thr St. John's (Metropolitan Area) Board, This act deals with this particular organ and I would say that I do not disag~ee with the hon. Leader of the Opposition on the point that he made.

Perhaps there ought not to be at this day and age government by appointees, when we are encouraging local governmenmand community councils throughout the province. The only reason, of course, ' why there were appointments to the St. John's Metropolitan Board was because of the fact that various areas themselves - there was not regional government in the province and there were various areas like the Town of Mount Pearl in it and the Gity of St. John's. Then you have other areas outside that were not organized. It is not so easy to elect people to this board. However, in the future perhaps this will happen.

In the meantime the purpose of this particular act is to assure that there will be a certain amount of proportional representation on the board itself, i.e., it provides that"there be not less than six members and not more than nine members on the board." It takes the assurance to provide that two of the members, at least two of the members shall be selected by bv the executive, by the cabinet, by the Lieutenant Governor-in-Council,from names recommended bv the St, John's Municipal Council.

One member is to be appointed from names submitted by the Town of Mount Pearl and presumablv·the balance would be fairly distributed throughout the other areas ~acohpassing the area known as the St • . John's Metropolitan Area. It is sort of a quandry, as I say, this particular board, I we are bringing in this act now and we are amending it but we are looking at the St. John's Municipal Board as well as we are looking at all areas of government. Perhaps in the near future, in the wisdom of the Minister of 407

April 28, 1972 Tape no. 150 Page 2 - MRW :t4r. Marshall Municipal Affairs and Housing, when we get to the area of regional government, as we must need come to in this province~eventually that will replace the St. John's Metropolitan Board. In the meantime the basic principle of this act is to change the appointment to assure that there are representations from as di.verse areas of the metro ·politan a:tea as possible.

It provides for the tenure of the board members at the pleasure I believe of the Lieutenant -·Governor-in-Council I think that that is in there somewhere but principally as I say it is to give diverse representation. I move second reading. \ MR. ROBERTS: Mr. Speaker, of course, the bill is unobjectionable and we are prepared to support it Hopefully, this will be a bill which in a couple of years will no longer have any valid pu~ose if we can get a form of regional government. The minister mentioned the tenure of office at pleasure. It iS in sectim (2). It will be the new (3)(5). I made a note to mention it.

Perhaps at committee stage we can have a look at it. This appears constantly throughout our statutes and I think it might be a better idea in equity if perhaps people held office on good behaviour for a term certain. Perhaps we can have a look at that at commi.ttee stage. It hardly goes to the root of whatever principle is in this bill. Again most of these things, Mr. Speaker, the draftsmen put in automatically and I am quite sure are not subject to ·explicit instructions from the minister of the day. The other point is that I understood in the past that the Mount Pearl Council and the St.

John's council did name and indeed I am quite sure they named representatives to the board. I do not have the principal act here to c~eck the purpose of the amendment. I assume it is mostly to increase the board ·. Does the board now consist of nine people? 408

April 2fl, 1072 Tape 151 Pk - 1 HR. MARSHALL: If my memory serves me correct, I think- HR. ROBERTS:_ Seven, I think. MR . MARS~ALL: Yes, there are seven, five, a vice-chairman and a chairman. HR. ROBERTS: The purpose of this,hesides changing the tenures.is from seven to nine and the Town Council of 1'1ount Pearl and the St. John's Hunicipal Council are guaranteed representation as they were before, Jl!r. Speaker- the Council has always to my recollection- perhaps the gentleman from Ferryland who