Newfoundland and Labrador Hansard — Members' Statements; Statements by Ministers — 27 March 2012 (47th General Assembly, 1st Session, Vol. XLVII No. 14)
2012-03-27
Newfoundland and Labrador — Debates (Hansard)
March
27, 2012 HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY PROCEEDINGS Vol.
XLVII No. 14
The House met at 1:30 p.m.
MR. SPEAKER (Wiseman): Order, please!
Admit strangers.
Today we welcome to our galleries the school from the District of Signal Hill
Quidi Vidi. We have twenty-nine Grade 5 students who attend Virginia Park
Elementary. The students are accompanied today by teachers Mr. Andrew Power and
Ms Joanne Bartlett.
Welcome to our Assembly.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
Statements by Members
MR. SPEAKER: Today we have members' statements from the District of
Humber Valley; the Member for the District of St. Barbe; the Member for the
District of Conception Bay East Bell Island; the Member for the District of
Bonavista North; the Member for the District of Mount Pearl North; and the
Member for the District of Bonavista South.
The hon. the Member for the District of Humber Valley.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. BALL: Mr. Speaker, I rise in this House today to offer
congratulations to Jessica Butt, a Level III student at Pasadena Academy in
Pasadena.
Jessica recently travelled to Pasadena, California to represent the Salvation
Army's Corner Brook Temple Band. This young cornet player was selected and then
took
part in the Tournament of Roses Parade on January 2, 2012. This achievement
recognizes the talent of our young people.
Mr. Speaker, Jessica has been playing the cornet for ten years and joined the
Salvation Army's Temple Band five years ago. Jessica also continues to show
great interest in her community and just recently was named the female
ambassador for the Pasadena Winter Carnival.
Mr. Speaker, it was an honour to have Jessica represent the West Coast and
indeed the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador at the Tournament of Roses, and
to see the youth involvement in the community through her participation in the
annual Winter Carnival.
Mr. Speaker, I congratulate Jessica Butt for her achievement, and I ask all
members of this House to join me in extending congratulations to her for her
representation at the Tournament of Roses and for her youth involvement in her
town.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for St. Barbe.
MR. BENNETT: Mr. Speaker, I rise in this hon. House today to congratulate
some tremendous young athletes in my district and throughout the Province who
participated in a successful hockey tournament held this past weekend.
These hockey players, female youth from ages twelve to twenty years old,
played in this Easter hockey tournament. I am pleased to say that I attended
functions relating to the tournament in both Port au Choix and Rocky Harbour.
The sportsmanship and sense of community evident at the functions I attended,
and at the tournament itself, is something all those involved should be proud
of. Community spirit is alive and well there and throughout my District of St.
Barbe. The benefits of participating in competitive sport are profound and
lifelong. There is a strong long-term correlation between youth sports and
better health, higher academic achievement, higher incomes as these young people
advance in the workforce, and more satisfactory long-term relationships -
including marital success.
Congratulations to the participants of last week's province-wide hockey
tournament and to all those people in our Province who dedicate their time and
energy organizing sporting events for the sense of team building and foundation
that they give our youth.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Conception Bay East Bell Island.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. BRAZIL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I stand in this House to congratulate a group of volunteers who are
undertaking a very valuable project. Mr. Speaker, I speak of Radio Bell Island
which operated from March 19 to March 24 at St. Michael's High School on the
Island. It was operated with a large group of volunteers from the community, the
town council staff, but particularly students from St. Michael's High School,
along with the leadership of local musicians and volunteers Terry Parsons, Tonya
Kearley, and Kelly Russell.
These individuals were responsible for the design of the broadcast,
programming and all aspects of the technical operations. These six days gave
residents the opportunity to be educated, informed and entertained, but more
importantly engaged. The programs included news, interviews, talk shows, call in
song requests, a sports and a history segment and everything else to catch the
ear of preschoolers to seniors. While the whole of the community will benefit
form the operation of this station, there is one group that has gained
immensely, those being the students of St. Michael's High who were trained in
every aspect of the techniques of broadcasting, from interviewing to research to
use of technology.
Mr. Speaker, I ask all members to join with me in congratulating all involved
with Radio Bell Island.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Bonavista North.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. CROSS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I rise in the hon. House today to congratulate the Pearson Academy Astros
Boys Senior Volleyball team. The team has had a consistent string of victories
at high-profile competitions.
The school has seen its share of success in the past, but this year has seen
all of the stars align, and the players and coaches are experiencing a year like
no other in recent memory. The year began when a very humble team organized and
regrouped after losing several key players to last year's graduation.
After several weeks of practice and honing their skills and strategies to
their great advantage, the Astros served up a powerful attack as they defeated
all competitors in the following. When I submitted my first statement there were
three items here and now we have five victories. This team attended the Senior
High Volleyfest 2011 here in St. John's and they carried home the provincial
banner in Male B. They attended VolleyCentral, the Newfoundland Volleyball
Association, and carried home the provincial banner in Male B. They attended the
regional high school Sport Newfoundland and Labrador and took home the Regional
Medal and banner. They then hosted and raised in their own gymnasium the
Provincial Championship Banner in AAA Boys Senior High Volleyball. More
recently, they attended the Juveniles Under 18 Male and they took home the
provincial championship there.
Mr. Speaker, I am sure all members of this hon. House join me in
congratulating the players, the parents, the fans, and the coaches of Pearson
Academy Astros on a tremendous volleyball season. The team exhibited a great
combination of high-quality play and great sportsmanship.
We salute the Pearson Astros, comprised of thirteen young men, with Coach
Craig Loder, who originates from Humber Valley, and Coach Principal Juan Gill, a
home-grown boy.
As a former Astro and as a former principal to these Astros, I would like to
go on record as saying: Go, Astros.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Mount Pearl North.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. KENT: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I rise in this hon. House today to recognize and offer thanks to a recently
retired employee with the City of Mount Pearl: Mr. Gerard Philpott, the Parks
and Facilities Supervisor.
I feel fortunate to have had the opportunity to work with Gerard during my
time with the City of Mount Pearl and since then as well. I know that many
others will echo my sentiments. Gerard will certainly be missed by council
members and staff alike.
Working for the city for almost a quarter of a century, Gerard has been known
to many as the go-to guy. If you need information or assistance with any issue,
Gerard could always help. If he did not have the answer, which was rare, he
would direct you to the appropriate person or department.
I know that Gerard's retirement is well deserved, but I have a feeling that
he will not be far from community life. I am sure many of his co-workers and
colleagues will see him from time to time.
I would like to extend my best wishes to Gerard and his family on his
retirement. I am sure that they are all looking forward to spending quality time
together.
Mr. Speaker, I ask all members of this House to join me in congratulating
Gerard Philpott on his retirement from the City of Mount Pearl, and wish him all
the best in his future endeavours.
Thank you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Bonavista South.
MR. LITTLE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Honourable colleagues, I rise in this House today to acknowledge the
outstanding humanitarian work and effort put forth by Pastor Cathy Harris, a
resident of Bonavista.
Reverend Harris, founder and president of Prodigal Ministries Incorporated,
spends her time travelling, evangelizing, preaching, and doing mission work. She
has been to Thailand, Cambodia, and Toronto on short-term missions, has
volunteered with the Salvation Army in the 9-11 terrorist bombing disaster in
New York, and has helped raise money for the 2010 Haiti Relief Fund.
Pastor Harris created a four-member team that has completed two missions to
Uganda, Africa, and is currently preparing for a third visit November 2012.
Harris, along with Sandra Durdle, Eliza Swyers, and Lora Swyers, also residents
of Bonavista, travelled to Watoto, a mission-run village for orphans, helping
build a classroom and caring for children. To raise funding, Reverend Harris has
released two music CDs, and organizes and performs various fundraisers.
Mr. Speaker and members of this House, please join me in paying tribute to
Reverend Cathy Harris and her team. She has done great work and will continue to
represent this Province of Newfoundland and Labrador in the less-fortunate
countries of the world. We wish them all the best on their upcoming mission, Mr.
Speaker.
Thank you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: Statements by Ministers.
Statements by Ministers
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Innovation, Business, and Rural
Development.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. HUTCHINGS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, the contributions of youth in business, as well as community and
regional development, are expanding. This bodes well for the Province as
industry sectors and new business prospects continue to grow.
Recognizing how harnessing their enthusiasm benefits the Province today and
tomorrow, the provincial government is actioning initiatives and forming
partnerships that link youth with innovative learning experiences and valuable
connections.
Our support for organizations such as Global Vision reflects that commitment.
It is a relationship that provides youth with important leadership skills that
will propel them in their lives and their careers.
As a national organization, Global Vision, through its Junior Team Canada
program, brings together youth for interactive sessions that connect them with
business, industry, and government to discuss issues and career opportunities.
Last month, I spoke and networked with about 100 participants from throughout
this Province and Atlantic Canada at one of their sessions. It was an event
filled with energy and certainly excitement.
Youth who have attended past sessions have joined government officials and
businesses on trade development missions to international markets. On these
missions, youth delegates are active participants and engaged in meetings with
ministers, senior government officials, multi-national corporations, and
diplomatic officials. They are taking a leading role in marketing our Province
and our country on the international stage.
I would also like to acknowledge Tyler Power from Tors Cove, a participant in
last year's trade mission to Indonesia, who has been recently named as one of
seven young Canadians to take
part in theG20's Y20 summit Mexico in May.
Mr. Speaker, I believe that by supporting youth from this Province to travel
to international markets and access innovative learning experiences we are
investing in the long-term growth of our Province.
Through experiences of this nature they are acquiring best practices and
exposure to international trade that can advance the export readiness and
potential of Newfoundland and Labrador's business community.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for St. Barbe.
MR. BENNETT: Mr. Speaker, supporting youth in business is inculcating
business values in youth. Business, like any other activity, is about learning
specific skills and acquiring judgement on when and how to use them. Reality is
that business leaders are people who learn the values of business from an early
age. The sooner and the earlier that youth learn business values, skills, and
judgement the more likely they are to be successful. Successful business people
benefit everybody in the Province.
One very important way to let young people gain business experience is
through the Junior Achievers programs offered at the secondary school level. As
someone who has previously served as a Junior Achiever's consultant in another
province nearly twenty-five years ago, I see very little evidence of these
programs in this Province. We need to get beyond the goal of government programs
to give people jobs; we need to support people so that they can become
employers. Our young people are as driven, are as smart, and as capable as any
in the country. Let's give them the tools they need to succeed
Thank you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The Member for The Straits White Bay North.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. MITCHELMORE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I thank the minister for an advance copy of his statement. It is good to see
our Province providing more support for organizations such as Global Vision and
Junior Team Canada.
These are opportunities for students to work, network, learn, and gain
experience in business and governance in other countries. My experience with
international programs has been positive. While a business student, I spent a
year in Europe working and studying abroad on exchange programs. I travelled
twenty-seven countries, learned about different cultures, and brought new ideas
home.
I congratulate Tyler Power for being chosen for the G20's Y20 summit.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Fisheries and Aquaculture.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. KING: Thank you.
Mr. Speaker, marine sciences and coastal and oceans management are a vital
part of the future of our Province's fishing and aquaculture industries.
Our fishing industry is changing rapidly, Mr. Speaker, and our aquaculture
industry is experiencing tremendous growth. Both industries play an important
role in our Province and we look to our youth to lead the way.
To that end, Mr. Speaker, in 2011, the provincial government supported the
Marine Institute's Ocean Net Youth and Oceans Conference Series with an
investment of $19,000. These sessions provided an opportunity to learn about the
importance of ocean conservation as well as careers. Similarly, we provided more
than $19,000 to the Friends of Beaches Network allowing youth and communities to
participate in beach cleanups.
Mr. Speaker, we provided $47,000 since 2010 for students to participate in
the Students on Ice Arctic expedition. Mr. Speaker, through this scholarship
last year, students Michael Gardiner of Torbay and Regan Burden of Port Hope
Simpson travelled through the Arctic to learn about the polar region.
The Department of Fisheries and Aquaculture also funds two scholarships
annually. There are $1,000 scholarships focused on the Province's fishing and
aquaculture industries, and the Dr. Wilfred Templeman scholarship for students
pursuing a degree related to groundfish research with a value of $25,000 over a
six-year period, Mr. Speaker, and there are ten of those.
We also allocate funding annually for the Centre for Fisheries Ecosystems
Research, giving the opportunity for up to twenty graduate students to
participate in projects under the centre's research scientists. In addition,
other graduate student research is funded under the National Sciences and
Engineering Research Council of Canada led by Dr. George Rose of the Marine
Institute.
We provide also, Mr. Speaker, $50,000 towards the Ocean Education Initiative
for Schools through the Oceans Learning Partnership in collaboration with
Coastal Connections. This initiative, Mr. Speaker, provides educational programs
including the floating classroom, which offers at-sea learning experiences for
students from K-12.
Finally, Mr. Speaker, we were involved in World Oceans Day activities
including the World Oceans Family Event right here in St. John's.
Mr. Speaker, the provincial government is actively engaged in supporting our
young people throughout Newfoundland and Labrador. Whether it is through the
Department of Fisheries and Aquaculture, the Youth Retention and Attraction
Strategy, or through funding through outside agencies like the Marine Institute,
each initiative our government has developed and supported is having a
significant impact on this Province.
The provincial government is building for the fishing industry of the future,
Mr. Speaker, an industry that will attract our best and our brightest. These
investments are without a doubt strategically important to our Province in
developing the institutional capital required for the fishery of the future.
Thank you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for St. Barbe.
MR. BENNETT: I thank the minister for the advance copy. If I did not
previously thank the Minister of Innovation, Business and Rural Development, I
thank him for his advance copy.
I am encouraged, Mr. Speaker, the wide array of areas that the minister's
department is focusing on in order to encourage young people to be in the
fishery and in the fishing industry. One young person who has benefited and has
been a stellar young person is Regan Burden of Port Hope Simpson, who is well
known to my colleague, the Member for Cartwright L'Anse au Clair, a dynamic
young person who has taken
part in one of these programs.
Mr. Speaker, one of the most important ways to attract people to a particular
industry or field of work is through positive role models. I think it would not
stretch anybody's imagination to say that we need to search for positive role
models in the fishing industry, given that we tend to always focus on problems
in the fishery; however, there are positive role models. I would encourage the
minister in the contemporary words to drill down, look deeper and find the
positive role models of young people in various communities who have an
association with the 114 small processing plants that we have in the Province.
Many young people whose families are completely committed to the fishery and
hold them up as role models for other people who would like to go into the
fishery because for our fishery to survive, clearly we must attract and retain
young people who enjoy being in the fishery and can make a good living in the
fishery.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for The Straits White Bay North.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. MITCHELMORE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I would like to thank the minister for an advance copy of his statement.
The work government is doing around youth is to be applauded in this
industry.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. MITCHELMORE: Scholarships and research funding is absolutely
indispensable for enticing young people to be engaged in the vital industry.
Despite this, Mr. Speaker
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
MR. MITCHELMORE: Despite this, Mr. Speaker, the traditions of our fishery
are being lost. It is essential to our coastal communities that programs be
developed for youth who are wishing to practice more traditional and sustainable
harvesting practices.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: Oral Questions.
Oral Questions
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Official Opposition.
MR. BALL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Yesterday in the House the Premier claimed that she did not have the
authority to call a public inquiry into search and rescue in our Province. Since
then, we pointed out that under
Section 3 of the Public Inquiry Act she can
establish an inquiry on a matter that she considers to be of public concern.
I ask the Premier: Now that it is clear that you have the authority to
establish a public inquiry, will you initiate the process?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, this government is interested in getting answers, and we are
interested in getting answers from the appropriate people. The appropriate
people, in this circumstance, Mr. Speaker, is the federal government, who have
all of the equipment, infrastructure, response and decision making around search
and rescue in terms of the equipment that was requested to be deployed. We need
to be able to call them into account - and I do not, with all due respect, have
the authority. We have checked this with our own legal counsel; we do not have
the authority to call an inquiry into matters that are under the total
jurisdiction of the federal government. It is something we can do co-jointly, as
you have acknowledged in your public pronouncements today, but that is not
something I can do on my own.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Official Opposition.
MR. BALL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Well, the Burton Winters tragedy happened within our Province, and it is
fully within the authority of the Premier to call a public inquiry on search and
rescue services in our Province. Additionally, under
section 27 of the Public
Inquiries Act, the Premier can enter into an arrangement or an agreement with
I ask the Premier: Have you explored this option with the federal government,
and if you have not, why not?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I can command an inquiry into the Province's jurisdictions, Mr. Speaker,
there is no argument with regard to that; but, Mr. Speaker, what we are
interested in here and where the questions have arisen, has been about the
federal government's response. I have a great deal of concern about information
that has come to light recently. I was assured by the Minister of National
Defence, and by Rear-Admiral Gardam, that weather prevented search and rescue
efforts by air, by the federal government, Mr. Speaker. Information has come to
light that contradicts that, Mr. Speaker. We have written to the Minister of
National Defence demanding an explanation. Next steps will be determined by his
response to that letter.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Official Opposition.
MR. BALL: Well, it seems obvious that the question has not been asked,
and even yesterday in the House of Commons, Peter MacKay, the Minister of the
Department of National Defence, he actually threw this back into the
jurisdiction of the Province. As recently as last Friday, The Fifth Estate
called Newfoundland and Labrador ground zero for search and rescue in Atlantic
Canada, and cited nine cases in the last eight years where people have perished
while waiting on search and rescue services.
So I ask the Premier, with all due respect to your previous answers: Is this
not enough evidence to initiate a public inquiry into search and rescue
services in this Province?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, it is extremely important to me as Premier of this Province and
to our government not to use this as a political football. Now, Mr. Speaker,
there is a family and a community grieving in Labrador. They want to know what
happened to their son and to their neighbour. They want to know why the federal
government did not respond in what they feel is an appropriate way. Minister
MacKay has offered up that they did not get the call until twenty hours after
Burton Winters had gone missing.
The point is moot, Mr. Speaker. It does not matter when the ground
search and rescue team in Makkovik decided it was time to
call in provincial and federal resources. They determined that.
Why were the federal government not able to respond? There is contradictory
information about that now, Mr. Speaker. We need answers.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Torngat Mountains.
MR. EDMUNDS: Mr. Speaker, the Minister Responsible for Intergovernmental
and Aboriginal Affairs and Labrador Affairs has been silent on the campaign for
improved search and rescue . The people of Labrador,
Mr. Speaker, have given their political representatives a clear mandate on this
issue.
I ask the Minister Responsible for Labrador Affairs: Will you support the
efforts of the people of Labrador and support a public inquiry into
search and rescue in this Province?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, this government speaks with one voice, and that one voice says:
We need answers to what happened in Labrador. The Minister for the Department of
Natural Defence and Rear Admiral Gardam, who is responsible for Atlantic Canada
search and rescue , provided information to the people
of Newfoundland and Labrador, and most particularly to the family of Burton
Winters, which now appears to be contradicted by their own logs, Mr. Speaker.
The family deserves an answer. The people of Newfoundland and Labrador
deserve an answer, Mr. Speaker. We have written asking for the answer. Mr.
Speaker, when we get that answer, we will decide what further actions are going
to be required.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Torngat Mountains.
MR. EDMUNDS: Mr. Speaker, the Minister Responsible for Labrador Affairs
I ask the minister again, Mr. Speaker: In his capacity as Minister of
Intergovernmental Affairs in regard to search and rescue ,
what have you done and who have you communicated with in Ottawa?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, I know that the Member for Torngat Mountains is new to
government, new to this House, but he should learn that there is a protocol that
is followed. When you are a member of the Cabinet, the Cabinet speaks as one,
and the government speaks as one voice. Our one voice says that the explanations
that have been provided so far by the Department of National Defence, Mr.
Speaker, are not acceptable; they are not acceptable to the people of
Newfoundland and Labrador.
We are not interested in playing politics, pretending to do something, or
asking for something that cannot legitimately be done, Mr. Speaker. We want real
answers. Burton Winters deserves that; his family deserves that.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.
MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
The Premier says the Cabinet speaks with one voice, but I say Premier, your
voice has been very silent on this particular issue. Mr. Speaker, the Minister
of National Defence made comments in the House of Commons yesterday and has put
the blame of the Burton Winters tragedy squarely back into the lap of the
Province of Newfoundland and Labrador.
I ask the Premier today: Are you prepared to accept this criticism or will
you call an inquiry to fully expose the facts around this tragedy and give the
people of this Province the answers that they deserve?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, what Minister MacKay did yesterday was put the blame squarely on
the search and rescue team in Makkovik and that is absolutely unacceptable. We
do not manage the search and rescue scene, Mr. Speaker.
The RCMP was in charge of the scene with the search and rescue people in that
part of our Province, Mr. Speaker. They determined when they needed resources
and they made the call. They made the call to the Government of Newfoundland and
Labrador twenty hours after the fact, Mr. Speaker. We tried to deploy our
resources. When we could not deploy them immediately, we went to the federal
government. There was no call coming from Labrador before that time, Mr.
Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.
MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
It has been very clear and the Premier admitted it; she has not gotten the
appropriate and factual information from the federal government. Now she is
going to write them again, sit back, and wait for another response.
I say to you, Premier, we are tired of hearing the Province and the federal
government passing the buck back and forth on the Burton Winters tragedy and
search and rescue in this Province. This service has failed a family in
Newfoundland and Labrador. It has failed an innocent young boy.
I ask you today, Premier: We have heard enough of passing the blame; we want
you to launch a full inquiry into this tragedy. Why will you not do that? Why
will you not invite the federal government to share in that inquiry? Why are you
hesitant to move forward?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
We continue to hear the Opposition House Leader play games with this very
serious issue in this House day in and day out far too serious for what you
are doing.
Mr. Speaker, yesterday in this House, she called on me time and time and time
again to call an inquiry. Somewhere between the end of Question Period yesterday
and the beginning of Question Period today, she has taken the time to do some
research and find out that I do not have the ability to do that on my own, Mr.
Speaker. I can invite the federal government to participate in an inquiry. I
cannot command an inquiry into federal jurisdiction, Mr. Speaker would that I
could.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.
MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I cannot be any more clear in terms of the need to have improvements in
search and rescue in this Province and the need to have answers for the family
of Burton Winters and the other people of this Province.
Premier, what is it going to take? What is it going to take for you to act
and launch this inquiry because what is the point of having a Public Inquiries
Act in this Province, what is the point of having legislation if you are not
going to enforce it and use it to get the answers we need to improve services to
people?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, the Opposition House Leader is all over the place on this issue.
She is mocking the fact that this government is asking for answers
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Mr. Speaker, she mocks the fact that this government
is looking for answers from the Minister of National Defence and tells us we
will not get them, but if we ask for an inquiry we are going to get that, Mr.
Speaker. Did you ever hear of anything so ridiculous before in your life? We are
going to ask for answers, Mr. Speaker. The family of this young man deserve that
from the federal government, and we are looking for those answers.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Once we get those answers, Mr. Speaker, or we do not
get those answers, we will decide on further actions.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
The hon. the Leader of the Official Opposition.
MR. BALL: Mr. Speaker, the CEO at Eastern Health said this morning that
nurses are having adaptability problems
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
MR. BALL: with patient monitors at Eastern Health. Meanwhile Eastern
Health's critical care nurses have stated that they are faced with a moral and
ethical dilemma with respect to patient care.
I ask the minister: Why are the significant concerns of these critical care
nurses being dismissed by the CEO and your government?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, I want to ensure
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
The Speaker has acknowledged the Minister of Health and Community Services,
the question has been posed, give her an opportunity to answer the question. I
ask members to respect each other when they are answering and asking questions.
The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, as Minister of Health and Community Services I take all of these
accusations very, very seriously, as does the CEO of Eastern Health. The CEO
spoke to these concerns this morning, I spoke with the CEO following her
briefing this morning, and she has agreed to come and brief me as well on some
issues and concerns that I have around the implementation of her change
management strategy over at Eastern Health. We have agreed to meet and to talk
about those issues, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Official Opposition.
MR. BALL: Well, I would encourage the minister, while you are having your
discussion, there are a number of issues and I will just talk briefly about a
few here now. Last week the Minister of Health insisted that there was only one
problem with patient monitoring, and that was related to the Wi-Fi linkage.
Meanwhile, critical care nurses did a presentation to Eastern Health officials
citing sixteen patient safety hazards, none of which were around Wi-Fi.
So, I ask the minister: These issues were raised in November 2011, why did
you minimize it to one issue when there were sixteen identified by the nurses?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, when it comes to the health and safety of Newfoundlanders and
Labradorians, we do not minimize anything. We take very seriously these concerns
and we are investigating all of these concerns, Mr. Speaker.
Now in the meantime, the fact remains that these monitors are safe. They are
used worldwide. There are 60,000 of them used worldwide. There are 2,600 of them
used within Canada, Mr. Speaker. These are very, very safe. The cardiologists at
Eastern Health will tell us that they are totally satisfied with these monitors
as well. There are some implementation problems around working out bugs within
the system. We are in tune with that, we are investigating that, and Eastern
Health and I have agreed to sit down and have a discussion around those
implementation (inaudible).
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The Opposition House Leader.
MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, we are four short days away from regulations taking effect with
regard to the generic drug model in the Province. Meanwhile, the government is
not disclosing the regulations so it is very difficult to know how people will
be impacted next week when this comes into force.
I ask the minister today: Why not release the regulations to the public so we
can determine how it is going to affect the pocketbooks of people in this
Province?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: Mr. Speaker, it is very easy to understand how the
pocketbooks of Newfoundlanders and Labradorians are going to be affected. We are
going to have lower generic drug prices in this Province.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: As for the specifics with regard to the regulations, Mr.
Speaker, as I indicated several times in the House yesterday and I will continue
to do, what we are doing is we are negotiating. We could impose, if that is what
she would prefer we would do, but we are not doing that. We are negotiating with
PANL around how it is that we are going to reinvest the savings that will accrue
to us as a result of these lower prices, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Opposition House Leader.
MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Really, what the minister is doing is negotiating with public servants and
other pharmacists in this Province, and not pharmacy owners who are going to be
impacted.
Mr. Speaker, we know that there is going to be $25.8 million in savings,
according to the minister, when this is implemented. I am asking her: How much
of those savings are you going to invest in the seniors in this Province so they
do not pay more for their drugs? How much are you going to invest in the
pharmacies in this Province so we do not see them go out of business in
communities all over Newfoundland and Labrador?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: Mr. Speaker, she is making huge assumptions over there and
she has numbers wrong as well, but I will not go to there because what I need to
do is I need to reassure the people of Newfoundland and Labrador. First of all,
seniors in this Province will not pay more for these generic drugs. That is the
first thing.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: The second piece of this has to do with our pharmacies, and
rural and remote pharmacies are very much a concern of ours, Mr. Speaker. We
have promised that we are going to reinvest in these pharmacies
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
MS SULLIVAN: We promised that we are going to reinvest in these
pharmacies, Mr. Speaker, and that is precisely what we will do. We will do that
through the negotiation process.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Third Party.
MS MICHAEL: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, yesterday federal NDP Jack Harris stood in the House of Commons
and asked government about the state of search and rescue
in Canada as experienced in the tragic death of Burton
Winters. The federal minister responded that the Province had responsibility for
ground search and rescue, basically throwing it back in the Premier's lap. It is
clear the Province shares responsibility with the federal government.
Mr. Speaker, I ask the Premier: What is she going to do, besides writing
letters, to ensure that both sides will now work together for the good of the
people of the Province?
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Mr. Speaker, there is much more activity been going
on here than writing letters. The very first thing we undertook as a government
was to review our own protocols, and to make sure that everything was in place
and was in order and working the way that it ought to be, Mr. Speaker. We live
up to our responsibility, Mr. Speaker, and it was found that our processes and
our protocols were appropriately followed. Mr. Speaker, we have to ask questions
of the federal government. So far, Mr. Speaker, we are not impressed
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: in fact, in the quality of the information that we
have received.
As I said earlier in Question Period, I was assured by the Minister of
National Defence, and Rear-Admiral Gardam that weather prevented helicopters
from flying, Mr. Speaker. There is now contradicting information, the federal
government needs to answer to that.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Third Party.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS MICHAEL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, I do invite the Premier to table the report that she is talking
about with regard to the provincial protocols, I think that should be made
public.
Mr. Speaker, in the House yesterday the Premier also said she was writing a
letter to the Minister of National Defence or at least one of her ministers
was demanding explanations of why Cormorant helicopters were not deployed.
Mr. Speaker, I ask the Premier: Will she table this correspondence and what
comes back to her?
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, the letter has been sent to Minister MacKay, once we get a
response, Mr. Speaker, I will table the letter and I will table his response.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Third Party.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS MICHAEL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I will be looking forward to that from the Premier, I am glad that she has
told us that.
Mr. Speaker, also in the House yesterday, the Premier said the federal
government's response to her letter would dictate further actions of her
government. Mr. Speaker, the federal minister's response in the House of Commons
yesterday makes it clear that she does not have to wait for a written reply.
So I am asking the Premier: What does his reply yesterday dictate to her now?
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, as Premier of this Province, I was told by the Minister of
National Defence and Rear-Admiral Gardam that the only reason that the
helicopters did not fly was because of weather conditions. There has been
contradictory
MS JONES: (Inaudible).
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: We do have conversations, I say to the Opposition
House Leader. Not everything is in writing; we do talk face to face to people. I
had a telephone conversation with Minister MacKay
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: The Speaker has recognized the hon. the Premier.
The hon. the Premier, continue with your answer, please.
MS MICHAEL: Well, I wish she would answer my question.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: The Speaker has acknowledged the hon. the Premier, and I ask
members to respect the Chair. When the Speaker stands, I ask members to take
their seat.
The hon. the Premier.
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, I apologize for my error; all answers in this House are directed
to the Speaker.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, I had a telephone conversation with Minister MacKay. I have had
a face-to-face meeting with Rear-Admiral Gardam, Mr. Speaker. In both those
conversations, I was assured that weather prevented helicopters from flying on
the first call that was received. Mr. Speaker, there has been information in the
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
PREMIER DUNDERDALE: public domain that contradicts what I was told,
both by the minister and the Rear-Admiral. I am giving them an opportunity to
tell me if there is other information that was not included in that report, Mr.
Speaker. I will wait to hear what they will have to say. Their answer will
dictate our next actions.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Third Party.
MS MICHAEL: Thank you.
Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Health said yesterday, or last week she
replied to questions
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
MS MICHAEL: regarding non-functioning heart monitors that nurses
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The Speaker has acknowledged the Leader of the Third Party.
MS MICHAEL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
My question is to the Minister of Health, who said last week that nurses in
the Province have doubled, if not tripled, the amount of training that other
nurses have received on the machines that we have the problem with at Eastern
Health.
Today in a press conference, the head of Eastern Health said nurses are
having adaptability problems. We know that the nurses are still saying the
machines are unreliable.
I ask the Minister of Health: What is the real problem with these monitors?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, I can confirm the information that she is asking for in terms of
training with regard to the nurses there. High-end users receive twelve hours as
opposed to the four hours that are usually offered.
Before the tender was awarded, Draeger actually spent two days here in St.
John's, one day in Grand Falls-Windsor, and one day in Corner Brook to offer
on-site equipment fairs. Eighty-two of the clinical staff, including sixty
nurses, attended, and 91 per cent of those attendees said that the product was
clearly very acceptable.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Third Party.
MS MICHAEL: Mr. Speaker, do I understand the minister to say that the
problem is with the nurses, and she has no confidence in the 100 nurses who
signed the petition that went to Eastern Health?
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: Mr. Speaker, I do not know how to respond to that. We have
the utmost respect for the nurses in our system in Newfoundland and Labrador.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: Mr. Speaker, nurses are a very, very valuable part of our
medical chain and we respect the work that they do.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: Never, never would we undermine the work of nurses, and I
think it is absolutely despicable to even suggest that here in this House, Mr.
Speaker. I find that exceptionally hard to listen to as the Minister of Health
and Community Services, Mr. Speaker. We are concerned about some of the issues
and we listen intently to the issues. The fact is, these monitors are safe. We
have been told by the company that these monitors are safe. We see evidence
around the work (inaudible).
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for St. John's Centre.
MS ROGERS: Mr. Speaker, if we learned anything from the Cameron Inquiry,
it is that we must listen to our health care professionals
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
MS ROGERS: who are working directly with our patients. It is folly to
ignore them, Mr. Speaker. Very experienced nurses in ICU, CVICU, and CCU are
sounding the alarm bells loudly and clearly about patient risk and safety. Mr.
Speaker, these nurses have already received their training on the machines. We
know it is not the Wi-Fi. Mr. Speaker, these machines have been in use a year
now and still have a serious problem.
Will the minister order an independent assessment, review, and report these
problems back, to see whether these machines are appropriate for our tertiary
care system?
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MS SULLIVAN: Mr. Speaker, this is fear mongering at its best. To draw a
line from a diagnostic tool to Cameron is fear mongering at its best. It is
undermining the health care system in Newfoundland and Labrador, Mr. Speaker,
and that is truly unfair.
What happened with Cameron was a pathology error. This is a diagnostic tool.
Nurses diagnose, doctors diagnose not these monitors. To draw the line to
Cameron on this is real fear mongering and I find it difficult to listen to.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for The Straits White Bay North.
MR. MITCHELMORE: Mr. Speaker, outfitters in my region say quickly
declining moose population is having dire effect on their industry. They blame
government policy for the decline and demand immediate action for the future for
the sustainability of the hunt.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
MR. MITCHELMORE: Mr. Speaker, yesterday, the Minister of Environment and
Conservation and his government are planning a five-year moose management plan
starting next year. Mr. Speaker, 2013 is far too late; they need action now.
Mr. Speaker, I ask the minister: Will he immediately cut licences and shorten
the season, which the industry is calling for?
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Environment and Conservation.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. FRENCH: Mr. Speaker, I believe this party has to get their act
together because I am not sure which part they are coming from. I think the hon.
member now is suggesting that I cut the licences to outfitters in his region of
the Province, Mr. Speaker. If he wants us to pull licences, what is he
suggesting we cut outfitting licences, an industry that puts $40 million
annually into this Province, Mr. Speaker? I think not. This government is not
about to cut licences to outfitters, Mr. Speaker.
There is a balance; we have the social issues and we also have the biological
issues that we have to face. We know that the moose population is in decline. I
have been very clear on that. We peaked at about 147,000 back in the late 1990s;
we are now looking at about 110,000 outside of the parks, Mr. Speaker. So we are
very conscious of what is happening with moose in our Province.
MR. SPEAKER: The Member for The Straits White Bay North.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. MITCHELMORE: Mr. Speaker, a $40 million industry is in danger; its
failure will cost dozens of direct jobs and many indirect jobs. Mr. Speaker, the
outfitters are the experts.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
kill rates continue to slide.
Mr. Speaker, I ask the minister: Will he listen to the outfitters and take
immediate action?
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
The hon. the Minister of Environment and Conservation.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. FRENCH: It is very important Mr. Speaker, the moose must be
tweeting him that is all I can figure out. He must be getting a few tweets from
the moose, at least the ones on the Northern Peninsula.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. FRENCH: Mr. Speaker, before I go any further, I would just like to
say we do not make decisions in this government without we consult. I have met
with the outfitting industry. I even met with a group of outfitters from that
gentleman's area of the Province.
Mr. Speaker, we take everybody's issues very, very seriously. It is about
meeting with the stakeholders. As a government, we have to find that balance,
and that is something we plan on doing.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The time for Question Period has expired.
SOME HON. MEMBER: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
I would like to remind members of the House on a couple of things that
procedurally I think we need to start paying some attention to. Number one, when
someone is asking a question I would ask all members to respect the member who
is asking the question so that all members can hear the questions and the member
who the question is being put to can understand the issue being sought.
Secondly, the member who is answering the question, obviously the member who
posed the questions wants an answer, so when you pose your question it is
reasonable to assume that you will listen to the answer. I would ask all members
to respect that.
Thirdly, I would ask members to respect the Chair. When the Chair stands and
asks for order, I expect that the members will respect that, let the Speaker
speak or comment, and then resume with the acknowledged speaker. So members will
speak only when acknowledged by the Chair and when standing in your place.
I would ask members to respect the rules of the House. If we are going to get
through Question Periods in a reasonable time, provide reasonable answers, and
answer to the significant issues the people of Newfoundland and Labrador want to
understand, then we need to respect the rules of the House, particularly in
Question Period when questions are being posed.
Presenting Reports by Standing and Select Committees.
Tabling of Documents.
Notices of Motion.
Answers to Questions for which Notice has been Given.
Petitions.
Petitions
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for St. John's North.
MR. KIRBY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I rise today on a petition on behalf of the residents of Newfoundland and
Labrador. This is the seventh time, the Minister of Education will certainly be
interested to know, that I have risen on this question. This is a petition
regarding needed changes to the Department of Education's school bus
transportation policies. It reads as follows, Mr. Speaker:
WHEREAS school district restructuring has resulted in longer bus travel times
and more hazardous winter travel for rural students of all ages; and
WHEREAS due to recent school closures, children living within 1.6 kilometres
of school face increased barriers of congested streets and busy intersections in
the walk to school, and parents without cars are having more difficulty getting
children to different schools on foot; and
WHEREAS only those child care centres outside the 1.6 kilometre zone and
directly on bus routes are included in kindergarten noontime routes, causing
hardship for working parents; and
WHEREAS the 1.6 kilometre policy has been in place since 1975, and student
transportation policies have not been reviewed through public consultation since
1996; and
WHEREAS parents are expressing the need for more flexible policies for
student transportation and school restructuring to meet the current needs of
school children;
We, the undersigned, petition the House of Assembly to urge the government to
conduct a review of school bus transportation policies and school restructuring
to ensure safe and quality education for all school children in the Province.
As in duty bound, your petitioners will ever pray.
As I have mentioned a number of times before I took this petition on, during
the last election I decided that we needed to do something about this. Mr.
Speaker, I am really glad we are not taking the same approach with school
curriculum as we are with school bus transportation policies, considering that
this 1.6 kilometre rule, what used to be called the one mile rule, has probably
been enforced since somewhere around the 1950s, but we definitely know it has
not been changed since 1975. If you think about it, since the 1970s we have made
great advances in computing. Personal computers are a normal thing now, Internet
use
Skills. We also have made major advances in communication, texting and cellphone
use is quite common today. I think we need to - in addition to making a step
forward in these sorts of technologies, we really need to move our school bus
transportation policies into the twenty-first Century. I see again the Minister
of Education is very intently listening to what I have to say. He is nodding in
quiet agreement with me, so I think we are going to make some progress in this
as time goes forward.
Thank you again, Mr. Speaker. I hope the House hears the plea of these
petitioners.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for St. Barbe.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. BENNETT: Mr. Speaker, I again rise in this hon. House on an Internet
petition.
To the hon. House of Assembly of the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador in
Parliament Assembled, the petition of the undersigned humbly sheweth:
WHEREAS with declining enrolment, distance education by Internet is now an
accepted way to deliver educational services to students living in small
communities; and
WHEREAS students have little to no say in where they or their families
reside; and
WHEREAS many families do not have the ability to relocate so that their
children can access educational opportunities in larger centres; and
WHEREAS many small businesses rely on Internet to conduct business; and
WHEREAS high-speed Internet permits a business to be more competitive than
the slower dial-up service; and
WHEREAS no high-speed Internet service exists in the communities of
Bellburns, Portland Creek, St. Pauls, or Sally's Cove; and
WHEREAS there are no plans to offer high-speed Internet to residents of these
communities;
WHEREUPON the undersigned, your petitioners, humbly pray and call upon the
House of Assembly to urge the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador to partner
with the private sector and to offer high-speed Internet service to these
communities.
As in duty bound your petitioners will ever pray.
Mr. Speaker, just less than an hour ago we had ministerial statements about
attracting young people into the fishery, attracting young people into business,
and one of the most important tools that young people will use in business, or
in the fishery, or in their education is high-speed Internet. People in these
small communities live adjacent to other communities, maybe seven or eight or
ten kilometres away, and the parents of these students are left with the
prospect of having to drive their students to the next town where there is
high-speed Internet. It is completely unacceptable that the government's
broadband strategy will take simply the broad strokes and claim to be providing
services to maybe as much as 85 per cent of the communities in the Province and
then leave these communities behind.
In some jurisdictions it is thought important that no child be left behind,
and I would urge this government to take the same approach and say that if we
are really committed to education for young people, young people in business,
young people in the fishery and young people generally, then we must have
high-speed Internet, therefore I present this petition.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Torngat Mountains.
MR. EDMUNDS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I rise in this hon. House to place a petition to the hon. House of Assembly.
The petition of the undersigned humbly sheweth:
WHEREAS the Premier has the authority under the Public Inquiry's Act to
establish a public inquiry into a matter of public concern; and
WHEREAS there have been several tragedies in the Province of Newfoundland and
Labrador where search and rescue responses have been called into question; and
WHEREAS the Burton Winters tragedy has increased the awareness of search and
rescue capacity in Newfoundland and Labrador; and
WHEREAS the Maritime search and rescue sub-centre in St. John's is scheduled
to close on May 8, 2012;
WHEREUPON the undersigned, your petitioners, humbly pray and call upon the
House of Assembly to urge the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador to
establish a public inquiry into search and rescue in Newfoundland and Labrador.
As in duty bound your petitioners will ever pray.
Mr. Speaker, in the last two months there have been, and continue to be,
serious questions arising about the state of search and rescue in our Province.
It is an uncomfortable feeling of false security that we feel when we go out on
the land and out on the sea, Mr. Speaker. With the failure of search and rescue
to properly address the tragedy of young Burton Winters along with the scheduled
closure of the Maritime sub-centre in St. John's, that feeling of insecurity
will rise.
As we continue to make a living from the land and from the sea, Mr. Speaker,
we will continue to look for services in our Province and our country that will
save our lives. What we face now, Mr. Speaker, is a downsizing. Many lives have
been lost with the decreased level of search and rescue and more will
undoubtedly be lost. Mr. Speaker, it is sad that we had to lose a
fourteen-year-old young man to discover the many flaws in search and rescue.
Mr. Speaker, I ask that this hon. House urges government to find out what
went wrong and to establish a public inquiry.
MR. SPEAKER: Orders of the Day.
Orders of the Day
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.
MR. KENNEDY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 11, I move that the House not adjourn
at 5:30 o'clock on Tuesday, March 27, 2012, and I further give notice, Mr.
Speaker, that pursuant to Standing Order 11, that the House not adjourn at 10:00
o'clock on Tuesday, March 27, 2012.
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.
MR. KENNEDY: Yes, Mr. Speaker.
I now call second reading, Mr. Speaker, dealing with second reading of Order
9, Bill 12,
An Act To Amend The Pharmaceutical Services Act.
Motion, second reading of a bill, "An Act To Amend The Pharmaceutical
Services Act". (Bill 12)
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for the Bay of Islands.
MR. JOYCE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I will just stand for a few minutes to speak on this Bill 12, the
pharmaceutical act. I just want to say, Mr. Speaker, that I have no interest in
the conflict of interest in this whatsoever. I am not even sure if there is a
pharmacy in the Bay of Islands, Mr. Speaker, so everything I say here now is on
behalf of the people of the Bay of Islands and rural Newfoundland and Labrador.
The first thing I say to the Member for Terra Nova, the Parliamentary
Assistant to the minister; I always said when you do not have a good case, you
obviously attack the person. When the Opposition House Leader was up yesterday
speaking, what is the first thing you did? Come up and attack her, trying to
raise some issues about rural Newfoundland and Labrador.
You should always try to stick to the issue, I say to the member, because it
takes away from the argument that you are trying to put forth. The few of the
comments that you made, I say to the Parliamentary Assistant, were not the same
numbers that we were given at the briefing. I just want to let you know that
whoever wrote your speech, you should go back and check with the figures,
because they were not the same numbers that we were given at the briefing from
the Department of Health.
There are a number of questions here in this, Mr. Speaker. Every time that we
ask a question, somehow they always say that we are fear mongering, that we are
putting out something that is false. Mr. Speaker, I always said that if people
do not have the information, they are going to start making assumptions. When
you start making assumptions, some are right, some are wrong, but you just do
not know.
This government is out now saying what they are going to do with this act,
but yet we are not allowed to ask a question about it; we are not allowed to say
anything about the seniors or we are fear mongering. I just want to let the
government know, that is our role. We will be raising questions, we will be
asking questions, and we will be trying to seek answers from the government.
I heard the minister yesterday saying that there is going to be $30 million
in savings. The question we have to ask is: How are savings going to be made and
what are they going to be invested? We just hear this figure of $30 million.
We asked for a breakdown at the briefing, Mr. Speaker, and we never got a
breakdown at the briefing. The minister spoke yesterday for an hour and we still
never got a breakdown. The Parliamentary Assistant spoke for twenty minutes and
we still never got a breakdown. So we asked on three different occasions for a
breakdown of the savings and how they are going to be spent; Mr. Speaker, as of
today, we still have not gotten it we still have not gotten it.
Then we asked about seniors. We were told that seniors are not going to be
affected. In the briefing note we had, while most seniors will not benefit
directly from a reduction in generic drug costs, it goes on to say that the
government will ensure seniors will not be affected will not be. I ask you:
How? The Parliamentary Assistant is over there with his hands: Yes, yes. How?
Explain to us how. Put it on the table here today. How? You cannot do it. This
is why people are asking questions. What are you going to do to protect the
seniors?
How are we fear mongering? When their own briefing note from the Department
of Health is saying that the seniors are going to be affected, but you will not
give out the information on how they are not going to be affected? How are we
going to reinvest back to the seniors? The minister had an hour yesterday and
she could not do it. The Parliamentary Assistant could not do it.
We are still asking: How are you going to reinvest after saying in the
briefing that the seniors will be directly affected by this move the most
vulnerable people. The Minister of Municipal Affairs yesterday said there are
about 50,000 seniors on the group sixty-five plan, I believe he said yesterday
65,000, up to 75,000, but 55,000 on this plan going to be affected. You cannot
explain how you are going to supplement this and help them out, yet we are not
allowed to ask questions. You can see why, Mr. Speaker, we have to ask so many
questions in this.
Then we hear from the minister that it is going to be put back into the
pharmacies. How? Why are we just going to say: Yes, we will just take it and put
it back into the independent pharmacies? We are going to reinvest. How are you
going to reinvest that $30 million? My question then, Mr. Speaker: If the big
$30 million price tag is put up there, how much of this is going to be put back
in? How much is going to be a supplement to seniors? How much is their actual
savings? Those are the questions you cannot get answered.
It is easy to come out, make a blanket statement, here is what we are going
to say, but then oh, wait now, we are supposed to do this and put money in for
seniors. Seniors are going to be affected by this. We are going to put some
money back into improving the services. How are we going to do it? How much? How
are you going to improve the services?
Just about everybody over there from rural Newfoundland has a pharmacy in
their district. We all know it. How are you going to do it? Those are the
questions we are asking. There are no answers coming there are absolutely no
answers coming, Mr. Speaker.
Then we hear the minister saying we are going to negotiate a deal. We are
going to negotiate a deal. That is what the minister said, yet we have to have
it done by April 1, but we are going to negotiate a deal. It will come into
effect April 1. What happens if there is no deal? What happens, Mr. Speaker, if
there is no deal?
I heard the Minster of Advanced Education and Skills say keep negotiating.
How long are you going to negotiate? How long do you keep going? What happens
then? Do you impose an agreement? Do you impose an agreement, I ask the
minister? You were the Minister of Labour before; do you impose an agreement
then? These are all the questions that need to be raised here, Mr. Speaker.
I also had the independent pharmacists this is a prime example and I know
the Minister of Municipal Affairs mentioned this yesterday. In Hansard, Mr.
Speaker, the minister stated you cannot negotiate with everybody. You cannot
speak with every independent pharmacy.
I say to the minister, you would be 100 per cent right if you were the part
of government that did it for the oncology doctors here in Newfoundland and
Labrador. You would be 100 per cent right, because you already did it. This
government already did it, Mr. Speaker. They already said it. They always said
it, that this government here, when the association here asked to negotiate,
they said, oh, we cannot negotiate but they already did it. They already did
it, Mr. Speaker. If you go down to Marystown with the community of independent
living, they already did it, Mr. Speaker. Twice that we know of since this
Premier took over, once as the Premier, once prior, that we already did that.
My question is: Why does the government not show leadership and say, okay,
there are independent pharmacies here; why don't we sit down and negotiate with
them?
I will explain to you now and I see the Member for Humber West looking over
I will explain to you my logic on it, okay. We will use NAPE, for example. How
can you ask NAPE to negotiate a deal with their head union in Toronto, come
back, and impose it on government? How can you do it? How can you ask the
pharmacists working for these independent pharmacists to go negotiate a deal,
come back, and impose it on the independent pharmacists? It just does not work
that way, minister. It just does not work that way.
I will say to the minister again, Mr. Speaker, what you said yesterday when
you were saying you cannot do it you have proven you can do it. If you look
back over the history, Mr. Speaker, on many occasions and I use the fisheries,
for example how many times do we hear some other breakaway from the fishery,
they set up another union? It is done on a regular basis. The department of
labour is understandable about that. They know that people can set up if some
group within a group they can set up another bargaining unit; it is done. If
we look at the racket NAPE and CUPE had a few years ago about members switching
unions it is done; it is done.
So I say to the government, when you stand up here and say that it cannot be
done it can be done. This government across has done it. I know, on two
occasions in the last little while. In the department of labour, I am sure if
the labour minister went over and asked someone to get the stats on it, how many
times it has been done in this Province it has been done on numerous
occasions, numerous occasions.
So this government should show leadership and sit down with the people who
are going to be affected, sit down on how you are going to protect rural
Newfoundland and Labrador, and negotiate with these people. Now, I do not know
those people. I do not know them, Mr. Speaker. I only met a couple of them
recently. I might have known one or two in Corner Brook. I do not know a lot of
these people. Fundamentally, when this government stands up and says we cannot
negotiate, when in actual fact, they did it before, it just does not hold water
with me, Mr. Speaker. It just does not hold water.
So, I urge the government: Show leadership. Here is your chance to show
leadership to take those independent pharmacies which has been done; I know
the minister of labour is over there listening attentively, and I know the
minister of labour can stand up and verify that it has been done, where groups
get away from another group, and they become a bargaining unit. It is acceptable
practice under the department of labour, it has been done in Newfoundland and
Labrador. I urge the government to help rural Newfoundland and Labrador, help
people who are going to be affected by these services, help seniors who are
going to be affected by this here, and start some meaningful negotiations with
these independent pharmacists so we can all just move on and even then, make
savings for Newfoundland and Labrador, save money for Newfoundland and Labrador.
Let's just do it in the right way, Mr. Speaker.
On many times, Mr. Speaker, as I mentioned just then about people negotiating
for their bosses, this is what is happening here. Now, I will get into details
later about the act itself, and some of the problems I have with the act itself,
but on the surface so here we have a bunch of employees who are sitting down
negotiating with government, and then have to come back and say to the owners,
here is what you have to do. We always hear about the fish plant owners and the
plant workers getting the plant owners and the fish plant workers all in the
same room and saying to the plant workers: Okay, here is the deal we struck.
Okay, owners, here is what you have to do.
We even do it in the Department of Fisheries. I know the department of labour
has a panel set up for fisheries, where both of them come in and sit down and
they go through the arbitration; and the minister knows that. It is done
everywhere, but for some reason, and I have not figured out what the reason is,
this government just will not negotiate with these independent pharmacies. The
people who affect rural Newfoundland and Labrador the most, who supply these
services, I just do not know what the reason is. They have done it before, Mr.
Speaker. I offered to show some leadership, but it is not going to be done.
Here we go again, Mr. Speaker, the generic drugs as we were told, 47 per cent
is generic drugs and brand is 53 per cent, $170 million in the drug plan,
somewhere around there, that is what we were told. I heard the Minister of
Health and the Parliamentary Assistant stand up and say this has been ongoing
for six years. The Parliamentary Assistant saying negotiations for this went on
for six years he is shaking his head. Six years that some of this has been on
the go. My question for the government: If it has been on the go for six years,
where are the regulations to go with this? Where are the regulations? Why are we
saying and the Parliamentary Assistant saying that a study was done and this was
proposed? Where are the regulations? Why aren't the regulations included with
the act so we can sit down and see what the regulations are?
Mr. Speaker, they are asking us as the Opposition to jump in this with blind
faith, closed eyes, so we can just put our hands up and say yes, we agree,
without questions, without seeing the regulations. I tell you I am not going to
do it. I am not going to do it, I can assure you that. I am just not going to
just take it and say okay, we are just going to accept this, move on, and we
will let you know what the regulations are. I personally will not do it. I will
not be voting for this bill because we do not know what we are voting for; we do
not even know what the regulations are. For the Parliamentary Assistant to stand
up and say this study has been ongoing for six years and have no regulations and
the minister to stand up and say we will present the regulations later, to me,
it is not good enough for me to accept this with blind faith.
I will just give you some examples why I, personally, will not be voting for
this, Mr. Speaker. The minister and the Member for Grand Falls Abitibi, a
prime example. The Minister of Finance knows all about this when they had the
emergency debate in here to take over the assets from Abitibi. In the briefing
that the Opposition was given at the time, the mill was not included. Guess
what? It was included. Everybody stood up in this House and said oh yes, you
voted for it; yet, when the Opposition in a briefing were told that no, the mill
portion is not included, and it was, so then the government stands up and says
you voted for it. Well, I can tell you one thing when the regulations come in
here unknown to any of us and they are implemented and pushed through later,
this is one member who is not going to say when rural Newfoundland and Labrador
is affected, this is one member who will not be standing up and saying I voted
for it even though I had no regulations in place.
I will not be doing it; I can assure you that, until I see the regulations,
we have time to study the regulations. Until we have seen how this is going to
affect rural Newfoundland and Labrador, I will not be standing up and just
putting my hand up to say yes. I say to the Minister of Finance, I do not think
you expect me to do it.
MR. MARSHALL: (Inaudible).
MR. JOYCE: I say to the minister, you support the consumers in this
Province? Ask the Minister of Health how she is going to reinvest the $30
million, how much is going to be saved after? You cannot even produce it.
If you want to do it, stand up and produce how much of that $30 million is
going to be reinvested back to the seniors of rural Newfoundland and Labrador.
Our briefing note that we have says seniors are going to be mostly affected,
that is the briefing note we have, Minister. Until you say to me
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
I ask members to direct their comments to the Chair, and not speak directly
across the House to others members, please.
MR. JOYCE: I am sorry. I apologize for that, Mr. Speaker, but when he is
yelling across the House I just cannot help it. I am sorry about that, I
apologize, Mr. Speaker.
I hope the minister, instead of bawling and crying and trying to throw me off
track here, would stand up and show us how the money is going to be reinvested.
Do something constructive. Mr. Speaker, I will give you
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
I reminded the members earlier today about the respect for the Chair. The
Chair stands and I would ask members to take their chairs, take their places,
and only speak when acknowledged by the Chair, and members, when they are
speaking, to direct their comments to the Chair.
Thank you.
MR. JOYCE: Thank you for the protection, Mr. Speaker.
I say to the Minister of Finance if you are really concerned, go up and open
that wing in the long-term care facility that you committed last year to do. Go
open that I say, Mr. Speaker
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
The Speaker just rose and asked members to direct their comments to the
Chair. Directly after the comments by the Speaker, the next speaker acknowledged
by the Chair does just the opposite. I ask members to respect rulings from the
Chair and direct all future comments to the Chair.
MR. JOYCE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, I will ask you to ask the Minister of Finance to go out and open
up the long-term care facility wing, the MUN wing, that he committed $3 million
to. Mr. Speaker, when the Minister of Finance stood in his place here and
committed Grenfell College autonomy, and you want to say, oh, the seniors are
fine; rural Newfoundland is going to be taken care of.
I say to the minister, if you want me to really believe you, go open up the
wing at the long-term care facility, give autonomy to Grenfell College, follow
through on the commitments that were made, and then, yes, I may believe you once
or twice.
Now, look at the animal regulations here in this Province. I know the
question was asked to the minister, and the minister said: Well, the legislation
and the regulations take a bit of time and are a bit complicated. Guess what? It
is two years.
MR. KENNEDY: Relevance, Mr. Speaker.
A point of order, Mr. Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader, on a point of order.
MR. KENNEDY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Relevance; although there is very wide latitude in debate, obviously the
member opposite is straying. I just ask that he be kept to the bill that we are
dealing with here today, the pharmaceutical act, the amendments.
MR. SPEAKER: I remind members that we are in second reading, and second
reading is a time when we talk about the principle and the thrust of the bill,
and issues that will arise as a result of the debate around the bill; very
specific issues we will get to in Committee. I ask members to be guided by that
principle.
MR. JOYCE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Once again, I was speaking on the lack of regulations brought forward with
the bill. I just wanted to show that regulations should come with the bill
itself so you can know exactly. Who knows, Mr. Speaker? Who knows? There is past
in this government, which I just mentioned, where after two years we are still
waiting for regulations. We do not know how long the regulations are going to
take here, Mr. Speaker. We do not know how long because the minister or the
Parliamentary Assistant did not say they will go into negotiations by April 1.
What happens if negotiations do not work, Mr. Speaker? What happens? No one
knows. That was my point, Mr. Speaker. Just because you say the regulations are
going to come in, that does not mean they are because we are waiting two years
for some regulations from this government, Mr. Speaker. We are waiting for some
regulations.
Mr. Speaker, I move the following amendment, seconded by the Member for
Torngat Mountains:
Be it resolved that all the words after "That" be replaced
with "the Bill be not now read a second time but that it be read a second time
this day six months hence."
That is the amendment that I make, Mr. Speaker.
MR. KING: A point of order, Mr. Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Fisheries and Aquaculture, to a
point of order.
MR. KING: It is my understanding, Mr. Speaker, that if a motion is made
and seconded, it has to be by members present in the House. If that be the case,
the member's motion is out of order.
MR. SPEAKER: I will ask the Table Officers to take an attendance of those
in the House as we speak, and I will take a moment to adjourn to consider the
motion as presented by the hon. member.
MR. JOYCE: I still have time (inaudible), Mr. Speaker?
MR. SPEAKER: Yes. There has been a motion on the floor. Your time will be
given back to you.
MR. JOYCE: Thank you.
MR. SPEAKER: We will just take a moment to consider the point of order
raised by the hon. member and, secondly, the relevance of the motion, whether it
is in order or not.
The House will take a brief recess.
Recess
MR. SPEAKER (Wiseman): Order, please!
Order, please!
The Speaker is on his feet.
The Speaker has had an opportunity to review the motion to be made. I
indicated that I asked the Clerk to look at the attendance of the House at the
time the motion was made. The motion is not in order. The member seconding the
motion was not in the Assembly at the time, so the motion is out of order.
The Member for Bay of Islands had the floor when we took a short recess.
The hon. the Member for Bay of Islands.
MR. JOYCE: Mr. Speaker, I move the following amendment, seconded by the
Member for Torngat Mountains, who is present now:
Be it resolved that all the
words after "That" be replaced with "the Bill be not now read a second time but
that it be read a second time this day six months hence."
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.
MR. KENNEDY: A point of order, Mr. Speaker.
You just ruled that the amendment was out of order. They come back and make
the same application again. The Speaker's rulings are not appealable, Mr.
Speaker. The amendment was not in order; therefore, they are asking you to
change the ruling from a minute ago.
MR. SPEAKER: The Speaker's ruling - there were two components to my
commentary. One was that I had reviewed the motion as read by the member, and I
had reviewed the attendance information provided by the Clerk. The motion was
out of order because the member who seconded it was not in the Assembly. We will
not need to take a recess, but if the member would table the motion that he has
just made, to verify the wording is consistent with the wording that I had
reviewed in Chambers a few moments ago, I will make a ruling on the
appropriateness of the wording of the motion just presented by the Member for
Bay of Islands.
If the Member for Bay of Islands would provide the Table with a copy of his
resolution, and we will take a
AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).
MR. SPEAKER: The motion is in order.
The Member for Bay of Islands, speaking to because his time has expired on
the motion that he was speaking to earlier. I am assuming that the Member for
Bay of Islands has introduced a motion and is now speaking to the motion just
before the House.
MR. JOYCE: To the amendment.
MR. SPEAKER: To the amendment?
MR. JOYCE: Yes.
MR. SPEAKER: The Table will ensure that the member's time is recorded
appropriately on the clock.
The Member for Bay of Islands is speaking now to the motion that was just
recently made.
I ask the member to proceed.
MR. JOYCE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I will just stand for another few minutes to speak on it. I find it kind of
odd, such an important bill, that the Minister of Fisheries is trying to shut
the House down and shut me down because I am going to bring up some points to
it, Mr. Speaker. Here we are going through the procedures with such an important
bill for rural Newfoundland and Labrador and for the seniors of the Province,
and we cannot get answers, and the Minister of Fisheries stands up, Mr. Speaker
AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).
MR. SPEAKER: I spoke earlier about the fact that we are in second
reading. There is an amendment in second reading. The rules for second reading
still apply. We are talking about the principle here, and we are not talking
about the detail of the bill before the House, we are talking about the
principle. I would ask the member to direct his comments to the Chair, and to be
relevant to the issue on the floor of the House of Assembly.
MR. JOYCE: I am sorry again, Mr. Speaker. I was just caught up into it
because it is such an important issue.
Mr. Speaker, the reason why I presented this amendment for six months is, as
I mentioned earlier, we have a bill before the House with no regulations. There
are times when governments introduce bills without regulations and it could take
up to two years, Mr. Speaker, in some cases, sometimes longer, to get
regulations. Here we are, as an Opposition, asked to stand up and vote on a bill
when the bill is in front of us, but the regulations are the meat on the bones
and we do not have copy of the regulations because the government does not have
the regulations developed. That is why I made that amendment, Mr. Speaker,
because we have no regulations. I know the Parliamentary Assistant was saying
that this was ongoing now for years and years, but we have no regulations, Mr.
Speaker.
That is one of the reasons why I brought that up, Mr. Speaker. I think before
we can vote on it I used before some examples where there is stuff going to be
done by government, that was said was going to be done, that was not done, Mr.
Speaker. In order for me personally, as a Member for the Bay of Islands, to
stand up and vote for a bill, I want to see the results that are going to happen
in the bill. I want to see the regulations. I want to see how they are going to
be interpreted and how it is going to be done, Mr. Speaker. I just cannot raise
my hand because the government says it is going to save money. It is going to
save the Province money; I say: Perfect, but how? When we say we are going to
put money back into the seniors, I say how much, and how are we going to do it?
We do not know.
Members of Cabinet might know, I am not sure; members in Cabinet might know.
They might have seen the regulations. I do not know. I really do not know if
they did or did not, but I can tell you I have not seen them. This House has not
seen them. There are a lot of other individuals in this House and in this
Province of Newfoundland and Labrador who have not seen them. When I get a
briefing note from the government, from the Department of Health, saying seniors
will not benefit directly from the reduction, and in actual fact, it is going to
cost and we have minister standing up saying: I will make sure that the
seniors are not affected. I have no problem with the minister saying that, but
before I take it and want to vote for this bill, I want to see how you are going
to do it. I want to see how you are going to do it. How are you going to make
sure that seniors, the most vulnerable people right now in the Province of
Newfoundland and Labrador, are not affected? That is what I want to see, Mr.
Speaker. I want to see that.
Even the Minister of Municipal Affairs mentioned the 50,000, 60,000, 70,000
that may be affected, that the government is going to find some way to help out;
I want to know how. I want to know how. I am sorry, Mr. Speaker; I do not mean
to be a doubting Thomas, but the people of the Bay of Islands put me in here to
ask questions and by nature I am usually pretty positive. By nature I am pretty
positive. I usually take it, but when it comes to this here, Mr. Speaker, I just
cannot stand here and just put my hand up and say, yes, everything is good, when
I have not seen it in front me. One of these days, if something goes wrong with
it, if something goes wrong, you are going to say: Well, you voted for it.
If I am going to vote for something, I am going to vote because I have the
information in front of me, I have the information that I can go and do some
research on, and I will have the information, that I am going to make the best
decision that I possibly can as a member of this Legislature. I know people
opposite do not think that I am usually agreeable; I am, because if the minister
can put the regulations down so all of us can see it, Mr. Speaker, I ask you to
ask the people across how many other members across have seen the regulations.
How many have seen them? That is the problem we are running into, Mr. Speaker,
and we do not know who has seen the regulations. A lot of the people I spoke to
have not even seen the regulations, but yet we have people saying it has been on
the go for four, five, six years, but no regulations.
The other reason, Mr. Speaker, I made this amendment was hopefully that the
government will look back and say, okay, we have sixty-odd-so independent
pharmacists here who are going to be directly affected. Forget the pharmacists,
forget that; let's think about rural Newfoundland and Labrador; let's think
about the services that they provide.
I had information about I heard the minister and the Parliamentary
Assistant talking about it was done abroad; it was done in other provinces, Mr.
Speaker. Do you know in some provinces in Ontario now, they have a little
machine; you walk in, put your card in, and that is how you get your drugs no
interaction whatsoever. Is that what we want? Is that what we want in rural
Newfoundland and Labrador? Is that what we want? To walk into some big kiosk
somewhere and put your card in, hopefully the right drugs is that what we
want? When we have to ask the pharmacist a question, the pharmacist is not going
to be there because he is shut down. Is that what we want? Is that what we want
in rural Newfoundland and Labrador, what they are doing up in Toronto? I do not
want it. I do not know who else in this Legislature wants it, but I guarantee
you, when they talk about all the good things in other Provinces, let's look at
some of the things, how it has impacted negatively in other parts of Canada, Mr.
Speaker.
How many seniors in this Province, Mr. Speaker, in rural Newfoundland and
Labrador, want to walk in with their drug card, put it into some machine and
say, oh, do I have the right drugs? Or if they have to ask a pharmacist a
question, or if they do not have all the paperwork in place, what are you going
to do, ask the machine to do it for him?
Those are the services we are going to lose in rural Newfoundland and
Labrador. Those are the kinds of things that make rural Newfoundland and
Labrador unique. That is why we should sit down, Mr. Speaker, with independent
pharmacists. That is why we should sit down with them and see how we can lessen
the impact of rural Newfoundland and Labrador.
Everybody in this Legislature from this side to the NDP wants to save this
Province money. There is no one here who does not want to save, but we do not
want to have seniors from rural Newfoundland and Labrador, Mr. Speaker, walk
into some kiosk
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
MR. JOYCE: Thank you for the protection, Mr. Speaker.
Walk into some kiosk, put your card in, and out come your drugs. You have to
look now and see if you have the right drugs. If you are not sure if it is the
right drug or not, or if you have a question because you are not feeling well,
or you have a question because what do you think? Oh, I don't have the
paperwork done what are you going to do? Are you going to say: Oh, yes, it
worked in Ontario? Sure it did, if you want to go put in a kiosk.
Look at some of the negative impacts. Do not always stand up and give the
rosy side. Let's look at the whole impact. Let's look at rural Newfoundland and
Labrador, Mr. Speaker. That is what we need to look at. We need to look at rural
Newfoundland and Labrador. Even the Minister of Municipal Affairs himself said
there is going to be 50,000 who are on that 65Plus program who are going to be
affected. We still have not found out from the government how they are going to
support those 65Plus.
I agree with the minister. How? How much of that money is going to be
invested back into seniors? The question is, if we are going to save $30 million
and we are going to put so much back into the seniors, how much? No one could
answer that question. Not even the Minister of Health can answer that. How much
are we going to reinvest back into the independent pharmacies of rural
Newfoundland and Labrador? You do not know. You cannot answer that. No one can
answer that; yet, we have to stand up here and say we are going to save $30
million. We have a certain amount we are going to put back and no one knows the
amount.
How can you ask the Opposition to support this when we cannot even get the
information from the minister herself, Mr. Speaker? We cannot even get the
information from the minister. The person who is introducing the bill cannot
give us the information. In the briefing that we had from the Department of
Health, we asked a question. Do you know what they said? It is not developed yet
it is not developed yet.
Mr. Speaker, seniors in rural Newfoundland and Labrador are a big part of
this bill. I would love for someone on the opposite side in government to stand
up and say: Here is why we cannot deal with the independent pharmacists. Here is
the reason why. There has not been a legitimate reason given. I gave examples
prior about where the government gave one-offs. The ministers, two or three of
them, were a part of that decision, Mr. Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
This is a significant public policy issue being debated in the House today.
The Speaker has been pretty generous in providing fair latitude in the debate
and discussion. I remind members again that we are in second reading and we need
to speak to the principle of the bill.
The member is straying in an area of process the government is going through
to deal with the bill itself. I caution the member, if he is able to make a
point and bring it back to the principle of the bill then please do so. In the
event that you cannot, I would ask members to be guided by the fact that we are
in second reading and we are guided - even though it is an amendment you made,
it is still in second reading and the rules guiding the debate at second reading
is still that we are focusing on the principle of the bill.
I will be generous and be tolerant of fair latitude but I caution members to
bring it back to the principle of the bill and the issue to be dealt with. I ask
members to be guided by the inside of the bill, which talks about what this bill
is about. It is about generic drugs and the pricing for generic drugs. I would
ask the member to be guided by that.
MR. JOYCE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I am just trying to explain that generic drugs are sold in pharmacies in
rural Newfoundland and Labrador. Mr. Speaker, if generic drugs are sold in rural
Newfoundland and Labrador it is going to affect Newfoundlanders and Labradorians
in rural Newfoundland and Labrador. As we all know, Mr. Speaker, and everybody
in this Legislature knows, there are a lot of seniors in rural Newfoundland and
Labrador who are going to be directly affected by this. How the government is
going to supplement that, we have to find out. We do not know, Mr. Speaker.
My point to that, Mr. Speaker, is that the people in rural Newfoundland and
Labrador who provide these services should have some avenue to sit down with the
government to say here is how this is going to affect the people in rural
Newfoundland and Labrador. Here are the services that we cannot deliver anymore
if this happens. Here is what is going to happen in some places when this
generic drug - and we mentioned Ontario here, and this is what happened. I just
do not want it to happen in rural Newfoundland and Labrador where you put your
card into some kiosk and you cannot see anyone. If you need any information - I
know a lot of seniors come in and they need it on an emergency basis, who are
they going to see, a kiosk? This is the kind of services that rural Newfoundland
and Labrador and this is why, Mr. Speaker, I made this amendment.
I ask the government again, if this has been on the go for six years, or in
the process for five or six, seven years, why don't we sit down and make sure we
do it right? Sit down and make sure we do it right. That is my concern in all of
this, Mr. Speaker.
Later on, Mr. Speaker, I will have an opportunity to speak on some specifics
of the bill itself. I cannot see the regulations because there are no
regulations, Mr. Speaker. I have some ideas of what I think should be in the
regulations, or may be in the regulations but I am not sure, Mr. Speaker,
because I have not seen it.
Mr. Speaker, there are a lot of times when you jump in and go with blind
faith. There are times when you come out and say: Okay, yes, that was a good
group, but there are other times you never. When you come into the public policy
of rural Newfoundland and Labrador, people who are going to be affected,
seniors, and when you stand up and talk about $30 million is going to be saved,
and we are not sure how they are going to be saved. Mr. Speaker, I have to say
that I am one of the doubting Thomas'. I have to be shown, explained. If it is a
good idea, if it is a great plan, if the people in rural Newfoundland and
Labrador who are going to provide the services are saying yes, we can do this,
here is how we can keep the service at this level, I would be the first one to
say okay, let's all jump onboard, let's all vote for it.
Mr. Speaker, my goal here is to ensure that rural Newfoundland and Labrador
is not directly affected. My goal here is to ensure that senior citizens are not
directly affected. My goal here is to ensure that whatever savings we can make
as a Province of Newfoundland and Labrador, whatever savings we make for the
taxpayers of Newfoundland and Labrador, that it is not on the backs of seniors,
that it is not on the backs of people from rural Newfoundland and Labrador, but
it is a deal that we all can live with.
It is the easiest thing in the world and I know governments all over the
world have to make tough decisions these days, Mr. Speaker, we all know that. We
all know that and probably this government is going to have to make some tough
decisions when they bring down their Budget, Mr. Speaker, when pertaining to
this bill, Bill 12. Who knows? If it has to be done and if we can save money
somehow, let us do it in consultation with all the stakeholders involved, Mr.
Speaker, because that is the only way that we can ensure that the services in
Newfoundland and Labrador are going to be maintained at a certain level that we
are all accustomed to, that we all want, that we all wish we could even improve.
Not like in Ontario where we get reports and I have checked it myself where
kiosks are used instead of a druggist. Instead of a drugstore now, you go into a
kiosk and fill it out.
Mr. Speaker, I am pretty sure, I am pretty confident that the people opposite
would not want that for the people in rural Newfoundland and Labrador. You can
say that I am fear mongering but those are the facts. Until it is shown to me
right here, here is how the seniors are not going to be directly affected, here
is how the services that the seniors have right now are not going to be
affected, count me out.
I am all for saving money in this Province, and I am sure every member
opposite in government, every member from the Third Party, same way, every
member from the Official Opposition, Mr. Speaker. I can guarantee you, Mr.
Speaker, and I can say it here right now, I have no problem saving money. If we
are going to save money, let us try to protect the seniors, let us try to
protect our rural Newfoundland and Labrador, the people who are going to be
directly affected by it.
Mr. Speaker, I am going to conclude with that now. I am glad to be part of
the debate. I am glad to have my voice heard on it. I just hope the government
somehow, in their wisdom, sees some way to include this group into negotiations,
Mr. Speaker, because rural Newfoundland and Labrador is what is at stake here;
seniors are who are at stake here. Along the way if we can maintain the services
and then if we can make sure the seniors are taken care of and if we can include
the people who are providing the extra services, like the independent
pharmacists in rural Newfoundland that we know like the parliamentary
assistant knows, he has some in his own you know how much service, Mr.
Speaker, the Parliamentary Assistant to the Minister of Health knows how much
service over and above that they provide.
So if you know how much service they provide over and above, Mr. Speaker, why
are they not a part of the negotiations? That is a big question, and everybody
knows. Why? I do not know. The parliamentary assistant to the minister, I know
you do not want seniors affected by anything. I do not think any member opposite
would want that, I do not think that one bit. I can really feel it that if you
do not look at this bill closely, if you do not have those people in the
independent pharmacies engaged in a direct negotiation, it will happen. I really
feel that. I honestly, truly, really feel that, Mr. Speaker.
That is why I am so passionate on this here, because I know what it is like
for some senior citizen, Mr. Speaker, who is going to need to go see and we
all know it. Everybody in this House of Assembly knows that when some senior
comes up and they have a question, they want to speak to a pharmacist, they
expect to get a good answer, and they do. We have to make sure that service is
protected. We cannot have it. I do not know how many people understand that if
we take that away from the seniors, if we take away that, we start putting in
kiosks somewhere, the pharmacies have to pull out of rural Newfoundland and
Labrador, they have to travel on the roads then, seniors, a lot of them will not
be able to travel.
This is a lot more than saving money. We can save money, but we can include
everybody so the services are not diminished. That is all I am asking the
government, Mr. Speaker, is find some way that everybody can be included in this
negotiation. Everybody should be included in this negotiation so seniors will
not be affected, people in rural Newfoundland and Labrador will not be affected,
we get top quality, and we can save money, but we can do it all together. We can
do it all together, Mr. Speaker. That is my goal. I just hope that the
government, for whatever reason, will look down and say okay, we should start
negotiations to protect rural Newfoundland and Labrador; because again, Mr.
Speaker, I am going on the goodwill, and I know everybody in this Legislature
wants the best for Newfoundland and Labrador, but we cannot have the best unless
everybody who is involved with the delivering of the services is directly
involved with negotiations for the service, Mr. Speaker.
With that, I conclude my few remarks. I thank the members opposite for their
attention and their co-operation. Mr. Speaker, this is such an important issue
that I ask government again to revisit it, because the deadline is coming.
April 1 is coming, and my question is, to the government: What if there is no
negotiation by April 1? What if there is no negotiated settlement by April 1 of
next year? Is it imposed? Those are the questions that we have not gotten.
Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, for allowing me this time to speak on this
important bill.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. KENNEDY: When I gave notice, Mr. Speaker, the extension of the House
from 5:30 p.m. until beyond 10:00 tonight, we did not vote on it, Mr. Speaker,
so with leave I would simply like to put the question again.
I move, pursuant to Standing Order 11, that the House not adjourn at 5:30
o'clock on Tuesday, March 27, 2012, and I further move, pursuant to Standing
Order 11, that the House not adjourn at 10:00 o'clock on Tuesday, March 27,
MR. SPEAKER: Seconded by?
MR. KENNEDY: Seconded by the Minister of Health and Community Services.
MR. SPEAKER: The motion is on the floor.
All those in favour of the motion, aye'.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.
MR. SPEAKER: All those against, nay'.
The motion is carried.
The hon. the Minister of Service Newfoundland and Labrador.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. DAVIS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
It is a pleasure to have some time to rise on this very important bill this
afternoon and speak to this very important bill, Bill 12,
An Act To Amend The
Pharmaceutical Services Act.
Mr. Speaker, I can tell you that the line up has begun over on this side of
the House because I can tell you the people over on this side of the House want
to speak to this bill; the line up is taking place and I know that the members
on this side of the House are very eager to rise and speak to this bill this
afternoon. I am delighted to have that opportunity to do that.
I want to say, Mr. Speaker, to the hon. member opposite the Member for Bay
of Islands, who just spoke for about forty minutes I sat here quietly and
listened to him and tried to keep account of most of the points that he was
trying to make. My neck is a bit sore from shaking my head because a lot of it,
I do not know where he is coming from, I have to be honest, Mr. Speaker. I have
to be honest; I do not know where he is coming from with some of this. He spoke
at some length about independent pharmacists, and I would like to remind the
hon. member opposite that this is not about independent pharmacists. This is
about the people of Newfoundland and Labrador.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. DAVIS: This is about all of the people of Newfoundland and Labrador,
Mr. Speaker. This is about all residents of Newfoundland and Labrador. This is
about seniors. These are about our working people, our young couples; this is
about our children. This is about the future generations of Newfoundland and
Labrador as well, Mr. Speaker.
Now, while I sat here quietly and listened very carefully to the debate that
occurred, I can tell very early in my comments that the same courtesy is not
going to be afforded to me.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!
MR. DAVIS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I do rise, and as I indicated, as I stand here in my place, I sat here very
respectful of the House and listened to the debate. Obviously there are some
members opposite who are going to choose not to afford me the same courtesy, but
I will continue to make my comments, Mr. Speaker.
We know as well that last year, the people of Newfoundland and Labrador, that
we are all here to serve we all know that each and every one of us, as Members
of the House of Assembly, we ran to come here to serve the people who elected
us. We came here to serve those people of Newfoundland and Labrador and we came
here to serve their best interests and to serve the best interests of the
Province of Newfoundland and Labrador.
We also know that last year on this very topic there was a very strong public
campaign raised and run by members who identify themselves regularly as
independent pharmacists. That is okay, Mr. Speaker. That is okay; people are
entitled to express their viewpoint. People are entitled to campaign on what
they believe in. Some of them did campaign because some of them were candidates.
Some of them actually ran against the government last year and the government
members on this side of the House, to get elected last fall. Some of them did
that and they are entitled to do that, Mr. Speaker. I respect their opportunity
and their desire to speak their mind, to bring forward what they believe in, to
bring forward their platform, and to call the open lines on a daily basis, which
they did for weeks and weeks and weeks. Four or five times a day they called the
Open Line shows to express their viewpoint, and I respect that. I respect their
right to do that.
Mr. Speaker, what I would say is we were returned with a mandate. The people
returned this government to the House of Assembly of Newfoundland and Labrador
with a mandate, and we are back here today.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. DAVIS: Despite the efforts of those few, Mr. Speaker who, I should
point out, as I said, had a right to do what they did and I respect that right
despite their efforts, the people of Newfoundland and Labrador returned us with
a mandate to continue to govern as we have done over the last eight years, to
make decisions in the best interest of the people of Newfoundland and Labrador,
to invest in the people of Newfoundland and Labrador, and to make Newfoundland
and Labrador a better place to live today than it was eight years ago, than it
was yesterday, and than it was last week. We are going to continue to do that
for the people of Newfoundland and Labrador, Mr. Speaker. We are going to
continue to do that, but we have to remember this is about the people. It is not
simply about pharmacists.
Now, I can tell you that my personal pharmacist is an independent pharmacist.
I have tremendous respect for his business, the business he conducts, and the
service he provides. I too, as the Opposition House Leader referred to in her
comments on this, had many visits to my pharmacist over the last year. I got to
know him much better than I knew him before, even though I did know him well, I
can tell you that. I have tremendous respect for the work he does and the care
that I received. I know pharmacists are an important part of the health care in
Newfoundland and Labrador. They certainly are.
SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!
MR. DAVIS: I really do not want to divide them between an independent
pharmacy operator versus a person who may work for a chain where a number of the
larger pharmacies operate throughout Newfoundland and Labrador, because it is
about the person behind the counter, the training, the abilities and the service
they provide.
Pharmacists in Newfoundland and Labrador provide service that I would argue
is second to none, Mr. Speaker. I would argue they are second to none. I fully
respect what they do. I fully respect the services they provide and the role
they play in the services to Newfoundlanders and Labradorians, to patients and
people who need that aspect of health care.
Mr. Speaker, another aspect of the comments by the Member for the Bay of
Islands this afternoon, he talked about so many things I do not know which
direction to go in first, because he really piqued my interest, I can assure you
that. He stood this afternoon and he talked about not attacking people. He said
words to the effect: I always say if you are going to attack people you do not
have much of an argument. He spent half his time attacking speakers from this
side of the House. He spent half his time attacking the Parliamentary Assistant
for the Minister of Health. He, himself, said you should not attack people if
you do not have an argument. I would speak to that, Mr. Speaker, and say that he
must want to think about what he said because he himself said: if you do not
have an argument you attack the person. That is exactly what he did. It is
unfortunate that he went down that road. I am going to try not to do that.
He took some time this afternoon, Mr. Speaker, to talk about wanting to see
the regulations that will result from the creation of this act, from the
amendment to this act. I know the hon. member opposite has some experience in
this House, and I know it was some time ago when he sat in the House prior to
getting re-elected, or elected last year. I was sure that he would understand
this, but for point of clarification I would like to take a few minutes just to
talk about the process that exists here.
What happens in the process that exists here in the House of Assembly is that
the government brings forward a bill to the House. A bill is a piece of
legislation. It either brings forward a new act, a new piece of legislation, or
amends a current act. That is what we have before the House today. This is an
Act To Amend The Pharmaceutical Services Act. This will amend a current piece of
legislation. That is what is proposed here at the House today. We go through
first reading, we go through second reading, we will go to Committee, and we
will have discussions about the very particular aspects of the bill, the very
detailed aspects of the bill, and then we will go to third reading. Those
debates happen here in the House about this particular act that is before the
House. Today we are continuing to have second reading, where we talk about the
bigger issues, the bigger theories of what the act is about, the bigger matters
about what the implications are for the act; not about the specifics of it but
the act itself, in a larger way, if a may use those words, Mr. Speaker.
What happens during that process
MR. SPEAKER (Verge): Order, please!
I would ask the member if you could try and bring your comments back to the
principle of the bill that we are debating.
MR. DAVIS: Yes, I certainly will, Mr. Speaker, and I appreciate that. I
will try and stick to the principle of the bill, I will certainly do that. My
only intention in bringing it to this, is because it is a result of in the
debate the previous speaker talked about the regulations, and I am responding in
debate to those regulations but I thank you, Mr. Speaker, and I will stick to
the principles of the bill.
What happens through the process of this bill, as we debate this particular
bill, is there are amendments. There is an amendment on the floor here now. I am
actually speaking to an amendment to the bill that is here before the House
right now. Through amendments and the voting process on this particular bill,
changes could occur to that act, changes could occur to the bill. The outcome of
the bill could be different, could be varied from what was brought to the House
by the government. What I say to that, Mr. Speaker, is that you cannot develop
and write the regulations until the act has been passed. You cannot develop the
regulations until a bill has been debated and voted on in the House. After the
bill has been voted on in the House that is when the regulations are done.
Now, I do not recall a time, in my two years here, Mr. Speaker, a time when
the regulations came before the act, or when the cart came before the horse. I
do not remember a time when it happened, and I have asked some of my colleagues
around if they could give me some instruction in history and so far I have not
found anybody who could tell me when the regulations came before the act,
because that is the process of the House, Mr. Speaker. The act is passed, it is
discussed and debated, and then as the act goes through the House proceedings,
then the regulations would follow later. I would like to point that out for the
benefit of the Member for Bay of Islands, who spent a considerable amount of his
time trying to determine what regulations were going to exist.
How is that going to happen, Mr. Speaker, in this bill,
An Act To Amend The
Pharmaceutical Services Act? How is that going to take place? Well, as discussed
by and brought up and mentioned by the hon. the Minister of Health and Community
Services during this debate, is that there is going to be a negotiation take
place.
Now, the Pharmaceutical Association of Newfoundland and Labrador is a
well-established and well-known entity in this Province. The Pharmaceutical
Association of Newfoundland and Labrador has a seat for independent pharmacies
actually on their board. It is vacant, it has not been filled, but they do have
that seat on their board which they have not filled. A representative from
independent pharmacies could be actually sitting on the Pharmaceutical
Association of Newfoundland and Labrador.
Then the government will have a negotiation with the Pharmaceutical
Association of Newfoundland and Labrador to discuss the $30 million savings that
the hon. minister had mentioned in her debate. That is what is estimated $30
million is estimated in savings for the taxpayers of Newfoundland and Labrador,
the same people I said this whole matter is about and what we do. The very
answer to the question that the hon. Member for the Bay of Islands is asking is
through that negotiation these terms will be determined, that is what will
happen. These terms, these circumstances, will result from these negotiations
that will take place with the Pharmaceutical Association of Newfoundland and
Labrador.
I should point out, Mr. Speaker, the Pharmaceutical Association also has a
long-standing government relations working group. My understanding is that
working group, at least in last fall, had five of their nine members held by
independent pharmacists. The five of the nine members on that working group with
working relations with the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador is very well
representing the independent pharmacies and all pharmacists I would submit, Mr.
Speaker, from Newfoundland and Labrador. I am really not concerned. As an MHA,
as a minister, as a Member of this House of Assembly, I am really not concerned
that all pharmacists are not represented or do not have the ability to be
represented in the Pharmaceutical Association of Newfoundland and Labrador.
There was some discussion yesterday about change during this debate and about
fearing change. I heard the hon. Minister of Municipal Affairs talk about this
yesterday. I think he explained it very well, to be honest. I really think he
explained it very well because I think, by and large, human nature quite often,
by our make up, is to be afraid of change, to be afraid to take those steps to
make improvements. Six provinces in Canada have already taken steps to make
improvements to generic drug pricing. Six provinces in Canada have already taken
steps to make improvements to those models in their own provinces. That is what
Newfoundland and Labrador is trying to do. That is what Newfoundland and
Labrador wants to do. We want to make an improvement to how that operates and
how that takes place with our own models, within our own policies, within our
own means here in Newfoundland and Labrador. It is estimated that is going t