Manitoba Hansard — 3 December 2025 (Sitting 11, 43rd Legislature, 3rd Session)

43-3-11

Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)

Third Session – Forty-Third Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable Tom Lindsey Speaker Vol. LXXX No. 11 - 1:30 p.m., Wednesday, December 3, 2025 ISSN 0542-5492

MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Forty-Third Legislature Member Constituency Political Affiliation ASAGWARA, Uzoma, Hon. Union Station NDP BALCAEN, Wayne Brandon West PC BEREZA, Jeff Portage la Prairie PC BLASHKO, Tyler Lagimodière NDP BRAR, Diljeet Burrows NDP BUSHIE, Ian, Hon. Keewatinook NDP BYRAM, Jodie Agassiz PC CABLE, Renée, Hon. Southdale NDP CHEN, Jennifer Fort Richmond NDP COMPTON, Carla Tuxedo NDP COOK, Kathleen Roblin PC CORBETT, Shannon Transcona NDP CROSS, Billie Seine River NDP DELA CRUZ, Jelynn Radisson NDP DEVGAN, JD McPhillips NDP EWASKO, Wayne Lac du Bonnet PC FONTAINE, Nahanni, Hon. St.

Johns NDP GOERTZEN, Kelvin Steinbach PC GUENTER, Josh Borderland PC HIEBERT, Carrie Morden-Winkler PC JOHNSON, Derek Interlake-Gimli PC KENNEDY, Nellie, Hon. Assiniboia NDP KHAN, Obby Fort Whyte PC KINEW, Wab, Hon. Fort Rouge NDP KING, Trevor Lakeside PC KOSTYSHYN, Ron, Hon. Dauphin NDP LAGASSÉ, Bob Dawson Trail PC LAMOUREUX, Cindy Tyndall Park Lib. LATHLIN, Amanda The Pas-Kameesak NDP LINDSEY, Tom, Hon. Flin Flon NDP LOISELLE, Robert St. Boniface NDP MALOWAY, Jim Elmwood NDP MARCELINO, Malaya, Hon. Notre Dame NDP MOROZ, Mike, Hon. River Heights NDP MOSES, Jamie, Hon. St. Vital NDP MOYES, Mike, Hon.

Riel NDP NARTH, Konrad La Vérendrye PC NAYLOR, Lisa, Hon. Wolseley NDP NESBITT, Greg Riding Mountain PC OXENHAM, Logan Kirkfield Park NDP PANKRATZ, David Waverley NDP PERCHOTTE, Richard Selkirk PC PIWNIUK, Doyle Turtle Mountain PC REDHEAD, Eric Thompson NDP ROBBINS, Colleen Spruce Woods PC SALA, Adrien, Hon. St. James NDP SANDHU, Mintu, Hon. The Maples NDP SCHMIDT, Tracy, Hon. Rossmere NDP SCHOTT, Rachelle Kildonan-River East NDP SCHULER, Ron Springfield-Ritchot PC SIMARD, Glen, Hon. Brandon East NDP SMITH, Bernadette, Hon. Point Douglas NDP STONE, Lauren Midland PC WASYLIW, Mark Fort Garry Ind.

WHARTON, Jeff Red River North PC WIEBE, Matt, Hon. Concordia NDP WOWCHUK, Rick Swan River PC

345 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Wednesday, December 3, 2025 The House met at 1:30 p.m. The Speaker: O Eternal and Almighty God, from Whom all power and wisdom come, we are assembled here before Thee to frame such laws as may tend to the welfare and prosperity of our province. Grant, O merciful God, we pray Thee, that we may desire only that which is in accordance with Thy will, that we may seek it with wisdom, know it with certainty and accomplish it perfectly for the glory and honour of Thy name and for the welfare of all our people. Amen.

We acknowledge that we are gathered on Treaty 1 territory and that Manitoba is located on the treaty territories and ancestral lands of the Anishinaabeg, Anishininewuk, Dakota Oyate, Denesuline and Nehethowuk nations. We acknowledge Manitoba is located on the Homeland of the Red River Métis. We acknowledge northern Manitoba includes lands that were and are the ancestral lands of the Inuit. We respect the spirit and intent of treaties and treaty making and remain committed to working in partnership with First Nations, Inuit and Métis people in the spirit of truth, reconciliation and collaboration.

Please be seated. Speaker's Statement The Speaker: Just before we begin proceedings today, today as part of the Assembly's ongoing goal to find ways to make the Assembly more accessible and inclusive, and with special thanks to the –our Digital Media Branch and to the clerks, we are able to provide live ASL inter pretation as part of our broadcast of the House. Accordingly, ASL

interpretation will be featured in a corner of the screen alongside the regular broad - cast for part of today 's proceedings as well as in the gallery. We received a request from the Gov ernment House Leader (MLA Fontaine) to provide ASL inter- pretation today for part of the proceedings, and we 're using this request as a test for this service and we will build on this accomplishment and work towards pro- viding ASL

interpretation as a regular feature of our broadcast starting in 2026. ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS INTRODUCTION OF BILLS Bill 6–The Sign Languages Recognition Act Hon. Nahanni Fontaine (Minister responsible for Accessibility): I move, seconded by the minister for sport, culture, heritage and 'tournism,' that Bill 6, The Sign Languages Recognition Act, be now read a first time. Motion presented. MLA Fontaine: Bill 6 formally recognizes American Sign Language, Quebec Sign Language and Indigenous sign languages as distinct languages in Manitoba.

Bill 6 recognizes the linguistic and cultural unique- ness of sign languages and affirms the vital role these languages play in the identity, community and culture of deaf, hard of hearing and deaf-blind Manitobans. The bill reflects more than a year of careful work and meaningful collaboration with deaf, hard of hear- ing and deaf -blind Manitobans, their families and community leaders, who have worked tirelessly to ensure sign languages are respected and recognized.

Bill 6 reflects the advocacy, experience and lived experience of deaf, hard of hearing and deaf -blind Manitobans who have worked tirelessly to ensure sign languages are respected and recognized. I'm honoured to present Bill 6 to the House for its consideration. Miigwech. The Speaker: Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion? [Agreed] The motion is accordingly passed. Bill 228–The Workers Compensation Amendment Act (Distribution of Surplus Funds) Mrs. Kathleen Cook (Roblin): I move, seconded by the member for La Vérendrye (Mr.

Narth), that Bill 228, The Workers Compensation Amendment Act (Distribution of Surplus Funds), be now read a first time. Motion presented.

346 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 Mrs. Cook: Bill 228 will require the Workers Compensation Board to distribute surplus amounts to employers when the board is in an overfunded position. While WCB currently has a policy to issue refunds to employers, legislating this policy will create fairness and predictability for Manitoba busi nesses that pay into the fund. I'd also like to acknowledge Tyler Slobogian for the Canadian Federation of Independent Business, who joins us in the gallery today.

CFIB has been advo - cating for this legis lation on behalf of its members, who are small businesses in Manitoba. The Speaker: Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion? [Agreed] The motion is accordingly passed. Seeing no other introduction of bills. COMMITTEE REPORTS Standing Committee on Public Accounts First Report Mr. Kelvin Goertzen (Chairperson): I wish to present the first report of the Standing Com mittee on Public Accounts. Clerk (Mr. Rick Yarish): Your Standing Committee on Public Accounts– Some Honourable Members: Dispense. The Speaker: Dispense.

Your Standing Committee on Public Accounts presents the following as its First Report. Meetings Your Committee met on December 2, 2025, at 6:30 p.m. in the Chamber of the Legislative Building. Matters under Consideration • Auditor General's Report – Department of Education and Early Childhood Learning: Leadership of the K-12 Pandemic Response dated March 2022 • Auditor General's Report – Follow Up of Previously Issued Recommendations dated February 2025 o Department of Education and Early Childhood Learning: Leadership of the K -12 Pandemic Response Committee Membership • Mr.

B RAR • MLA CHEN • MLA COMPTON • MLA DELA CRUZ • MLA DEVGAN • Mr. EWASKO • Mr. GOERTZEN (Chairperson) • MLA LAMOUREUX • MLA MALOWAY (Vice-Chairperson) • Mr. OXENHAM • Mrs. STONE Substitutions received prior to Committee proceedings: • Ms. BYRAM for Mrs.

STONE Officials Speaking on Record • Tyson Shtykalo, Auditor General • Mona Pandey, Deputy Minister of Education and Early Childhood Learning Reports Considered and Passed Your Committee considered and passed the following report as presented: • Auditor General's Report – Department of Education and Early Childhood Learning: Leadership of the K-12 Pandemic Response dated March 2022 Your Committee completed consideration of the following

chapter as presented: • Auditor General's Report – Follow Up of Previously Issued Recommendations dated February 2025 o Department of Education and Early Childhood Learning: Leadership of the K -12 Pandemic Response Mr. Goertzen: Honourable Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable member for Tuxedo (MLA Compton), that the report of the committee be received. Motion agreed to. TABLING OF REPORTS Hon. Tracy Schmidt (Minister of Education and Early Childhood Learning): It is my privilege to table the Annual Report on Nutrition Programs for the year '24-25. The Speaker: No further tabling of reports?

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 347 MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS International Day of Persons With Disabilities Hon. Nahanni Fontaine (Minister responsible for Accessibility): December 3, 2025, marks the International Day of Persons with Disabilities, a day we join people across Canada and the world in promoting the rights of people with disabilities and recognizing and celebrating their accomplishments. This year, the United Nations ' theme for the International Day of Persons with Disabilities is: Fostering disability-inclusive societies for advancing social progress.

This theme reminds us inclusion is not just a goal, it is the foundation for real progress towards achieving full social, political, economic and cultural inclusivity. * (13:40) Our work is about building a society where inclu- sion is not an afterthought, but a shared commitment. Manitoba's accessibility compliance framework focuses on supporting organizations with free tools and resources.

But when collaboration alone does not lead to compliance, our government has introduced penal- ties for businesses who refuse to adhere to The Accessibility for Manitobans Act, something Manitoba's disability communities have been calling on for years. In partnership with persons living with disabilities and their allies, we 've drafted a penalties regulation and invite Manitobans to review the proposed regulation and share their feedback as we work together toward a more accessible province. And mere moments ago, I introduced Bill 6.

Bill 6 formally recognizes American Sign Language, Quebec sign language, and Indigenous sign languages as distinct languages, and acknowledges the linguistic and cultural uniqueness of sign languages as the primary languages of many deaf, hard of hearing, and deaf-blind Manitobans. Bill 6 affirms the vital role these languages play in identity, community and communication.

By recognizing sign languages in legislation, Manitoba aligns itself with international human rights frameworks–including the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Dis abilities and the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, both of which affirm the right to use sign languages and recognize them as integral to cultural heritage and human dignity. Bill 6 is the result of more than a year of working alongside deaf, hard of hearing and deaf -blind Manitobans who generously shared their expertise, experiences and hopes.

It was important that we took the time to do this work properly and respectfully. I am pleased to be joined in the gallery today by members of Manitoba 's deaf, hard of hearing and deaf-blind com munities who are here for the intro - duction of this historic legislation. And I am excited for the first time in Manitoba 's history, the Manitoba Legislative Assembly has live ASL English

interpretation with picture -in-picture technology, a change my team and I worked hard to deliver in partnership with the Clerk and the Speaker's offices. And to them I say miigwech for allowing this to happen. These initiatives reflect our government' s ongoing commitment to building a barrier -free society, where accessibility and inclusion are foundational to who we are as a province. Building an inclusive society is a collective responsibility. It is not the job of just one de partment or one organization or one community.

It is something that we all share: governments, businesses, schools, families and individuals. Together, we have the power to create a Manitoba where everyone belongs. I look forward to walking this path together as we move closer for full inclusion of all. And I ask my colleagues in the Chamber to welcome and celebrate our guests who are in the gallery with us today. Miigwech. Ms. Jodie Byram (Agassiz): I'd like to welcome our guests to the gallery, those from the deaf com munity and hard of hearing com munity. Welcome to the Manitoba Legislature here today.

I rise today to recog nize persons living with disabilities and acknowledge our shared responsibility as legislators to advance a more accessible province. It goes without saying that people living with disabilities often face barriers imposed and/or per - petuated physically, socially and systemically. Barriers can come in everyday things that we take for granted, like parenthood, education, recreation, shopping, navigating the job market and workplace and many others.

Even accessing essential services can come with additional hurdles and costs, such as trans porta- tion, shelter, health care and even emergency services. This is why Manitobans deserve a strong advo- cate at the provincial level who can stand up for Manitobans living with disabilities and respond to

348 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 those challenges. And that is why this Accessibility Minister is not that person. Manitobans have been left deeply hurt by the Accessibility Minister 's remarks earlier this year disparaging an ASL interpreter. Twice this week, this same minister denied two leave requests for our MLA to have an ASL interpreter present in the Chamber for our deaf awareness week bill. This same minister cut funding for Manitobans in Arborg living with intellectual disabilities this past January.

This same minister sat silent when the Health Minister refused to pay for Jeremy Bray 's life-saving treatment. This same minister sat silent as nearly 100 educational assistants were fired in southern Manitoba. This same minister is part of the Kinew government that slashed PC grant programs that supported accessibility upgrades for municipalities, parks and local organizations. About 30 per cent of Manitobans aged 15 and older have at least one disability. They need a real advocate who understands their unique needs and pushes for greater accessibility.

Progressive Conservatives will always be com - mitted to eliminating barriers for Manitobans with disabilities and ensuring their inclusion in all aspects of life: politically, socially, economically and culturally. I ask my colleagues to stand up today to recognize persons of all abilities as being valuable members of our great province of Manitoba. MLA Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): Honour- able Speaker, I ask for leave to respond to the minister's statement.

The Speaker: Does the honour able member for Tyndall Park have leave to respond to the minister 's statement? [Agreed] MLA Lamoureux: Honourable Speaker, the theme for the 2025 International Day of Persons with Disabilities is: Fostering disability-inclusive societies for advancing social progress. This theme builds on the commitment made at the Second World Summit for Social Development in November 2025 to create a more just and equitable world for all.

According to the Rights of Persons with Disabilities Act 2016, a person with a disability is defined as someone who has a long-term physical, mental, intel- lectual or sensory impairment, which, in interaction with various barriers, may hinder their full and effective participation in society on an equal basis with others. The act specifies 21 disabilities including, but not limited to, blindness, hearing impairment, mental illness, autism spectrum disorder, multiple sclerosis and Parkinson's disease. Again, this is just to list a few. Not all disabilities are visible or easily identifiable for others.

Fortunately there are many advocacy groups, both in Manitoba and globally, that work very hard to raise awareness. They encourage everyone to volunteer or actively participate in their initiatives and campaigns. Promoting accessibility is something that every - one can do as we become aware of the need for increased accessibility in public spaces, buildings, transportation and digital platforms. Many of us have seen this in action here in these Chambers through infrastructure changes.

Supporting inclusive education is a must and, Honourable Speaker, there are several common misconceptions and stereotypes about persons with disabilities that can lead to misunderstandings, discrimina- tion and exclusion. We should never assume that individuals with disabilities are helpless or lack abilities and cannot contribute to a home or society. I've met, as I am sure my colleagues have, many people with disabilities who are extremely capable and fierce fighters for their communities.

In closing, I encourage all honourable members to join in working to foster a dis ability-inclusive society here in Manitoba and support calls for advancing social progress here in our province. Thank you. Introduction of Guests The Speaker: Order, please.

There were several guests in the gallery that, unfortunately, have left already, but I think it's worth- while noting who all was here. * (13:50) I'd like to draw the attention of all honour able members, where we had with us today Krista Breckman from Manitoba Possible; Jocelyn Johnson from ASPIRE, co-chair; Erika Duguay, resource centre for Manitobans for deaf- blind; Natasha Tuck, Manitoba Possible; Doug Momotiuk, Manitoba Deaf Association board and Deaf Centre Manitoba Inc.; Cheryl Broszneik [phonetic], RRC Polytechnic, continuing education department; Shawna Joynt, president of Manitoba Deaf Association; Vanecia Austria, Deaf Centre Manitoba Inc.; Tylo Broszneik [phonetic] , Manitoba Deaf Sports Association; Richard Zimmer, RRC polytechnique sign language program, retired; and

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 349 Kyra Zimmer, RRC polytechnique continuing educa- tion department. These folks were all guests of the hon ourable Minister of Families (MLA Fontaine), and I would also note that we had ASL interpreters in the gallery for those guests. And while I have the floor, I would like to draw the attention of all honourable members to the loge to my right, where we have with us today Peter Bjornson, former MLA for Gimli. And on behalf of all honour able members, we welcome you here today.

MEMBERS' STATEMENTS Springs Christian Academy Annual Youth Parliament MLA Jelynn Dela Cruz (Radisson): Democracy only works when the people living in it help shape it, and one of the strongest ways to protect it is by inviting young people to lead early, not someday; now. This week, Springs Christian Academy hosts its 31st annual high school youth parliament in St. Boniface, a tradition that does exactly that. For months, students in grades 9 to 12 have been preparing to mirror the work we do here every day: forming ministries, drafting bills, debating real issues and delivering speeches that matter.

They 're not just learning about decision making, Honourable Speaker; they're doing it. And it runs deeper than procedure. As someone who spent nearly a decade in a faith -based school, I know how my values have shaped my politics. When these students bring their values into parliament, I 'm confident they' ll speak their politics with courage, integrity and care for their neighbours, the foundations of strong public servants. Civic engagement starts long before anyone sits in this Chamber. It starts when young people ask tough questions, choose their issues and imagine a Manitoba that they want to build.

This year 's participants, both online and in the gallery today, embody that spirit. Ayo Olubowale, the–a Radisson constituent, will serve as premier this year, Honourable Speaker, with Sanyu Kiwanuka as deputy premier. Along them are outstanding–or among them are outstanding young Manitobans, including constituents Debbie Alao and Udo Okolue and Katrina Irwin, daughter of Sheri Irwin, one of our dedicated RETSD trustees. Their work is a reminder our time in this Chamber is sacred and finite.

We' ve got a fire under our seats and work to do because the next generation is already on track to one day take our place. And so I invite colleagues to congratulate Springs Christian Academy on 31 years of youth parliament and to wish these students every success as they take their seats tomorrow –not quite in this Chamber yet, but one day, in the one preparing for –in the o ne preparing them for it, Honourable Speaker. Gayle Wharton Mr. Jeff Wharton (Red River North): Honourable Speaker, I rise in the House today to recognize and honour Gayle Wharton, a.k.a. my mum.

Mum was married to our dad for over 57 years prior to his passing in 2019. Over the last eight and a half decades, Gayle–or mum–is mother of three kids, grandmother of five and great-grandmother of nine. On top of mum's passion for her family, she shares one other: the love of singing. In 1962, 63 years ago, mum was one of the co- founders of the Assiniboine Chorus Sweet Adelines International. The chorus world- wide shows–the chorus did worldwide shows across Winnipeg throughout the years, performing in seniors' homes, churches and many other venues around the province.

In the late ' 90s, mum was joined by my wife Mickey and our two daughters Melany and Jennifer, where they sang side by side with mum in the chorus. Seven years ago, the men's Barbershop Harmony Society opened their doors to women. Mum, along with a number of ladies, joined the men, and the newly formed chorus of approximately 40 members, named River City Sound, has never looked back. Mum continues to take on a leadership role in her chorus, serving as marketing VP and outreach, along with taking the lead in all chorus choreography in preparation of upcoming performances.

The chorus is a non- profit group and has to continuously–has continuously raised funds to help with yearly expenses and annual trips to the United States to compete in international competition. Along with the new chorus, mum is a member of the mixed quartet, Jeepers Creepers. The quartet was recently featured on CJOB 's The Start, where they shared upcoming events and performances. Honourable Speaker, joining mum today in the gallery are Jeepers Creepers members: Bruce Wilton,

350 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 Charlie Siegel, Carolin Schroeder and, of course, mum. I ask my colleagues to join me in congratulating Gayle on a lifelong commitment to not only her family but her singing career. Thank you, Mum. George Compton MLA Carla Compton (Tuxedo): Honourable Speaker, today I rise with pride to reflect on a legacy that runs deep in my family history. Long before I had the privilege of serving as the MLA for Tuxedo, my great-great-uncle, George Compton, served Manitobans as the MLA for Manitou.

He ran for the United Farmers of Manitoba and was part of the Progressive Party of Manitoba government from 1922 to 1927. It is humbling to stand in this Chamber 100 years later, knowing that I am not the first in my family to do so, and that my work continues a commitment to public service that began generations ago. George Compton married Nellie Hunt in 1895, and together they raised seven children. George him- self came from a large family, with my great-grandpa Tom being one of his seven siblings.

George under - stood that com munity–that community as some thing woven through family, neighbours and shared responsibility. He served as the first elected reeve for the Municipality of Pembina in 1906, later becoming a councillor, and went on to serve many years as reeve of the Municipality of Thompson from 1929 to 1945. For decades, he played a steady role in shaping local government in those regions. And I also want to acknowledge my nephew, Shea, Shea Compton, who first brought this piece of our family history to me through a school project.

His curiosity in uncovering these stories gave me a deeper appreciation for the legacy that I am privileged to carry forward. Honourable Speaker, it is with the greatest honour of my life to continue that legacy. Each time I rise in this House, I think of the genera tions before me who stood up for their family and neighbours, and I am proud to carry that work forward today for Tuxedo and all Manitobans. Thank you. Eddy Cobiness Mr. Konrad Narth (La Vérendrye): Today I rise to pay tribute to a world-renowned artist of La Vérendrye: Eddy Cobiness of Buffalo Point First Nation.

Eddy Cobiness was a trailblazer: a painter, print- maker and founding member of the Woodland School of Art. Alongside Norval Morrisseau, Jackson Beardy and Daphne Odjig, he helped form the Indian Group of Seven, artists who forever changed how Canada views Indigenous art. His work, rich with spirit, motion and a connection to the land, continues to inspire people across our province and around the world. On January 1, it will be 30 years since Eddy Cobiness passed away, yet his legacy remains vibrant.

It lives on through his family, especially through his son, Ernest, who carries forward the same creative spark and passion. * (14:00) Honourable Speaker, this tribute is also a personal one for me. Both Eddy and Ernest have done business with my family's company for more than 30 years. I've been fortunate to see their art throughout my life –in homes, in workplaces and throughout our com mu- nity–and I've –I was always admired –by the beauty and meaning of their work. That legacy is also being recognized close to home.

The newest exhibit at the Sprague museum is a celebration of Indigenous contributions to our region, and it features a significant presence of Eddy's art. It's a fitting reminder that his story and the stories he painted are part of who we are in southeast Manitoba. Although Ernest was last-minute unable to make the trip in to join us today, I'm honoured that he's watch- ing live from home. His presence is a living continua- tion of his father's vision. I'd like everyone to help me –join me in con - gratulating Ernest on his accomplishments. Thank you, Honourable Speaker.

MLAs Share Good News at the End of Fall Session MLA Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): As we near the end of session, I think it's safe to say that all MLAs are probably feeling pretty relieved that we only have two more days left in these Chambers. In many respects, it has been a difficult year. But for today's statement, I want to focus on the good.

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 351 This year I canvassed some of my MLA colleagues and asked them to share something positive in their lives. And this is what I heard: the member for Borderland (Mr. Guenter) is expecting a new addition to his family any day now; the member for Radisson (MLA Dela Cruz) is going to be getting married in the spring; the member for Interlake has two new grand- daughters; the daughter -in-law of the member for Spruce Woods (Mrs. Robbins) became a Canadian citizen; the member for Steinbach (Mr. Goertzen) is going to Italy; the member for Agassiz (Ms.

Byram) celebrated her parents Ray and Lyle's 60th wedding anniversary; the member for Waverley (MLA Pankratz) has some festive activities planned, from skating to singing in choirs, over the holidays. And puppies, Honourable Speaker. Two members, the member from Seine River got a new puppy named Dash; and the member from St. Johns got a new puppy named Winnie Bear. And, Honourable Speaker, we have some very proud parents in these Chambers. The member for Fort Richmond's (MLA Chen) daughter is learning traditional Chinese dance in preparation for the Chinese New Year show; the member for Morden -Winkler (Mrs.

Hiebert) is so proud of her children who are opening up and expanding businesses and graduating with a degree in social work; and the member for La Vérendrye's (Mr. Narth) son finished first overall in Manitoba in dirt bike racing. Honourable Speaker, there is a lot to be grateful for right now. I know I'm very excited to be having another baby. Now, as I wrap up, my hope is that some of this good news can tie us over for a while, hopefully at least through question period today, and I want to wish all of my colleagues a safe and enjoyable Christmas and holiday season. Thank you.

The Speaker: And just prior to oral questions, one more quick note for members in the Chamber that we need to make sure we're not engaging people in the gallery in anything that takes place on the floor. ORAL QUESTIONS Manitoba's Homicide Rate Government Record on Crime Mr. Obby Khan (Leader of the Official Opposition): The Premier is con sistently and arrogantly wrong at every turn. He celebrates his failed Health Minister who Manitoba Nurses Union gave a D-, a failing Health Minister who oversees a system where a grandmother was left in a hallway on a stretcher for 30 hours and later died.

He celebrates his failing Justice Minister who releases repeat violent offenders but forgot to put their name on the registry list. Now new stats are out on the murder rates in Canada, so let's take a look at them. The murder rates nationally have declined. Can the Premier tell everyone in the House, and all Manitobans, how much did Manitoba exceed the national average? Hon. Wab Kinew (Premier): Yes. I'll get to the ques- tion at hand in a second, but I want to take this oppor- tunity to acknowledge Manitoba's deaf community.

It is a great honour to be the first Premier in our province's history to speak to you through the wonder- ful work of interpreters that we have today in your language, in American Sign Language, for those of you who use that. And this represents a continued evolution of our democracy and a continued sign that every single person in Manitoba deserves respect, dignity and to have access to your government.

So I thank my colleague, the Minister responsible for Accessibility (MLA Fontaine), as well as the Speaker and the clerks, for making this happen today, and I look forward to working together with the deaf com- munity in Manitoba to make a province that we are all proud of. Now, when we're talking about public safety, there are specific considerations for the deaf commu- nity to be safe, and we are very, very proud to be engaged in those discussions to ensure that, like every– The Speaker: Member's time has expired. The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a supplementary question. Mr.

Khan: I asked the Premier a question about murder rates in Manitoba, and he refuses to even touch the question. It was a simple question, and I'll table that for the Premier today. In Canada, murder rates per 100,000 went down 4 per cent in '23 to '24, but in Manitoba, under this NDP Premier and his failing Justice Minister, Manitoba increased by 22 per cent. The rest of Canada went down 4 per cent; Manitoba went up 22 per cent. His failing ministers are a laughingstock for the rest of Canada and Manitoba to laugh at.

352 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 This failing Justice Minister is releasing sexual predators. Where does the Premier draw the line? How many more murders have to happen in Manitoba before this Premier removes this failing Justice Minister to keep Manitobans safe? Mr. Kinew: You know, to the people of Manitoba, I'm like you. I like solutions. And so, what are the solutions when we talk about public safety? Well, we know that you need to have law enforcement. You also need to have the correc - tional facilities to care for people while they're getting straightened out.

You got to have strong connections with community, and you also got to focus on preven- tion by doing things like feeding kids at school. We're focused on all four of these things. Guess what the member opposite did while he was a Cabinet minister? He cut all four. He cut policing in Manitoba: 55 fewer cops in Winnipeg. They closed not only the Dauphin jail, but also the Agassiz Youth Centre.

They alienated every other level of govern ment, and I'll table documents for you that shows that not only did they cut the policing program for schools in Manitoba but they also cut the– The Speaker: Member's time has expired. The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a final supplementary question. Mr. Khan: The Premier just shows you how much of a joke he is. [interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Khan: The murder rate is up 22 per cent in Manitoba and down 4 per cent for the rest of Canada. But hold on. The Premier said he's going to use his ultimate tool to bring criminals to justice.

And what is that tool? He's going to send a strongly worded letter to keep Manitobans safe. What an absolute joke. He wrote a strongly worded letter to com mittee, and he said he's not afraid to do it again. Instead of turning to his left and firing his failed Justice Minister, the Premier found some people on a committee Manitobans have never heard of and threw them under the bus. The minister has failed to lead his department, failed to keep Manitobans safe and failed to keep repeat violent offenders in jail.

Who is the Premier going to blame next when the murder rate in Manitoba continues to go up and Canada continues to go down? Mr. Kinew: The Leader of the PCs is soft on crime, and everyone can see right through the whole schtick every time–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Kinew: –he gets up with those tired talking points. Think back recently. I think everyone knows how I feel when it comes to people who target children. Everybody heard my comments. Again, under the prison, what did he have to say about that? Take it easy. Starts criticizing me. What? Why would you criticize that?

What side of the issue are you on here? * (14:10) The PCs are soft on crime. We're tough on crime. We're tough on the causes of crime. They cut police; we hire police. They close jails; we build new justice facilities. They cut the milk program, good news kids: there's a cart of fresh milk rolling down t he hallway right now. Stay in school. Stay on the right path. Let's build a better society together. The Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a new question. Drug Trafficking Raids Suspects Released on Bail Mr.

Obby Khan (Leader of the Official Opposition): Talk is cheap, just like this Premier. Let's look at the facts: murder rates are up 22 per cent in Manitoba. In Canada, the average is down 4 per cent. The Premier, once again, talks a big game, wants to make jokes, but his actions are empty. He pretends he's tough on drug dealers. The Minister of Justice (Mr. Wiebe)–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Khan: –wants to shout at me right now when murder rates are the highest they've ever been. Maybe the Minister of Justice should close his mouth, open his ears and listen to Manitobans.

Last Wednesday, a man and woman were arrested– $32,000–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Khan: –of cocaine and fentanyl and over $70,000 in cash. And what did this Minister of Justice do? He released them on bail, Honourable Speaker. What is the Premier's tough approach when he's releasing drug dealers that –cocaine and fentanyl and

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 353 have $70,000 of cash? Will the Premier, for once, be open and honest with Manitobans and fire– The Speaker: Member's time has expired. Hon. Wab Kinew (Premier): Everyone can see right through it; it's so phony. Like, the same thing they did in the campaign there, where they're, like, talking about defund the police. News flash: the only ones to ever defund the police in Manitoba, it's the PCs. I table the documents this question period that shows not only did we lose 55 police officers across the city here, across Manitoba we lost school resource officers.

They're the ones who made the cuts. What happened? Everybody who'd want to talk about bill reform–bail reform–where are you going to put them? They closed the Dauphin jail. They closed the Agassiz Youth Centre. We're in a position where we're hiring law enforcement, we're building new justice facilities, but we're also focusing on the causes, keeping kids in school, a universal school nutrition program. Where all they have are the tired old negative talking points –and a really, really poor delivery of recycling those talking points, I'll add–on this side, we're working with you.

Tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime, brighter days ahead for all Manitobans. The Speaker: The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a supplementary question. Mr. Khan: When it comes to defunding the police, the only members in this House that have called for that are the Premier, the failed Minister of Health, actually everyone on that side and the MLA for Fort Richmond, and she was a school trustee– Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. The Speaker: Order, please. The government bench needs to come to order. Mr.

Khan: The MLA for Fort Richmond was a school trustee and she led the charge to defund the police, therefore making your kids less safe at school. Earlier this month, a couple were released with over $117,000 of meth and cocaine, packing material at $15,000 in cash. I'll table that for the failed Minister of Justice (Mr. Wiebe) because he probably hasn't even read it. In October, more arrests, and I quote: identified a co-ordinated drug trafficking network within St. Boniface. End quote. And you guessed it –they were also released under this failed Justice Minister.

What is it going to take for the Premier to keep criminals in jail? Is dealing drugs, guns, not enough? Where will the Premier– The Speaker: Member's time has expired. Mr. Kinew: I think every day, the PCs show why they can't be trusted in government. They keeping moving backward. They don't have a steady hand. There's no steady hand there. You can see it. So nervous; so nervous just for question period. Never mind after having to go up against some real bad people in this society. I've got full confi dence in our Justice Minister. More police, more justice facilities coming online, more co-operation with police.

But since they want to keep talking about defund- ing the police, let's go to it. Again, the Brandon police chief presentation. So the Brandon police chief, when this

article was written, showed that government fund- ing under the PCs is falling. I'll table the docu ment here from the Brandon Sun about this defunding of the police. And perhaps the member opposite wants to tell me who actually the Brandon police chief was decrying this cutting of Brandon police funding, because I'm pretty sure he's got the exact same name and date of birth as the member for Brandon West (Mr. Balcaen). [interjection] The Speaker: Order. Order. The honourable Leader of the Official Opposition, on a final supplementary question. Mr.

Khan: The only phony thing in this House is this arrogant, pompous, smug smile by this Premier, Honourable Speaker. Maybe these drug dealers are too small for the Premier to notice. How about a drug dealer caught with 400 kilograms of meth at the borders by CBSA agents in January of '24? The largest seizure in prairie region ever. And what happened under this NDP government? They were granted bail; 400 kilograms, $51 million in 10 bags of cocaine and meth. Only after severe back- lash was that decision reversed. Why would it need to be reversed?

Hon ourable Speaker, $51 million of meth caught, and this NDP government let him out. How can someone be released on bail, unless the Premier is sticking up for criminals just like himself,

354 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 Honourable Speaker? When will the Premier get tough on time and hold criminals to account for–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Khan: –breaking the law? Mr. Kinew: We know that meth is causing so much dam in our–damage in our communities. That's why we're bringing the hammer down on people who traffic meth. The latest step that we've taken is to bring in a task force on meth, bring them–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Kinew: –together with law en forcement so that we can hold people accountable.

When it comes to people on the streets who are wilding out on meth, we are connecting them with the care that they need. Again, these members opposite want to criticize. They want the person high–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Kinew: –on meth to be standing beside you at the bus stop, in the Tim Hortons bathroom, out on the street having an argument with themselves. There's no ideas for public safety on that side. I'll table a respected voice in the community, from the Lifestyles 55, a publication that I understand the members opposite are quite familiar with. Again, Manitoba's facing a meth crisis.

The new provincial sobering centre will include dedicated spaces and will make things better. Their own party agrees with what we're doing. What are they talking about? They've got nothing. Let's keep working– The Speaker: Member's time has expired. Driver's Education Program in Rural Manitoba Wait Times and Lack of Training Spaces Mr. Trevor King (Lakeside): Honourable Speaker– [interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. King: –parents across Manitoba are finding out the hard way that getting their teen into Driver Z is no longer a matter of safety and planning; it's become a lottery.

Classes are filling up instantly. Wait- lists are months long, and in many com munities, there are simply no spots at all. Can the Minister of Justice (Mr. Wiebe) explain why his government has allowed Driver Z's capacity to fail so far behind demand? Hon. Matt Wiebe (Minister responsible for the Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation): You know, Honour able Speaker, I know the member opposite wasn't sitting in the caucus at the time when Driver Z was decimated by his party.

But he certainly signed up to run for a party that ignored the program, that refused to hire during the pandemic, that refused to see that there would be a demand, and then, on top of all of that, forced a strike at MPI at a time when we were still recovering from the pandemic. The member opposite needs to answer for the other members in his caucus because ultimately, it was their negligence that hampered this important program for Manitobans. The Speaker: The honourable member for Lakeside, on a supplementary question. Mr.

King: Honourable Speaker, in rural Manitoba, learning to drive is not a convenience; it's a necessity. Teens need a licence to get to school, to work, medical appointments–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. King: –and need to help on family farms and businesses. Yet many rural families are forced to drive hours, await indefinitely for Driver Z, if they can access it at all. Why has the minister failed to provide equitable driver's ed training for rural teens? Mr.

Wiebe: Honourable Speaker, this is exactly where we have staffed up the program, because we know that, under members opposite, especially in rural areas, the number of driver training opportunities and spots were diminished and needed to be restaffed. * (14:20) We have added an additional 588 spots when it comes to Driver Z. And Manitobans are starting to see the results because, unlike under members opposite, there's no more lines, lining up, waiting to get into the Driver Z program.

We're going to work with parents; we're going to work with community and we're going to ensure that Driver Z is there for the future. The Speaker: The honourable member for Lakeside, on a final supplementary question. Closure of MPI Service Centre in Swan River Mr. King: Honourable Speaker, while families are struggling to find space for their children to learn to drive, in some rural communities the NDP are manu- facturing service issues to justify closures.

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 355 In Swan River the MPI service centre has been under-resourced since its government took office and instead of addressing that, they are closing the office, depriving the whole area of service. Will the minister commit to keeping this service centre open, or is he admitting he doesn't care about rural service delivery? Mr. Wiebe: This demonstrates how out of touch the members opposite actually are. Of course I met with the mayor, I met with the council, I ensured–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr.

Wiebe: –that we would assure them that service would be available in the community of Swan River. Why was he concerned that service might be cut there? Because, in fact, service was cut under the previous government. Services in Swan River had been closed since the pandemic because members opposite had no voice, wouldn't speak up for the community. We're ensuring that service is there. We're work- ing with the com munity. We're going to make sure that the mayor and our de partment go hand in hand into the future. The Speaker: Order, please. Stop the clock.

Introduction of Guests The Speaker: We have, seated in the public gallery, from Westgate Mennonite Collegiate, 25 grade 9 students under the direction of Jeremy Siemens. And this group is located in the constituency of the honourable member for Wolseley (MLA Naylor). We welcome you all here today. Manitoba Public Insurance Ratepayer Service Mr. Wayne Ewasko (Lac du Bonnet): Honourable Speaker, I'd like to ask the minister in charge of MPI: What is he doing to improve the ratepayer service at MPI, as Manitobans have noticed that it's gotten significantly worse in the last 24 months? Hon.

Matt Wiebe (Minister responsible for the Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation): Members opposite know all about making things worse at MPI. What did they do under their watch? Of course, the biggest boondoggle in Manitoba history: Project Nova, you know, shepherded through by the members opposite. They had no hot clue how to manage a program like that and no accountability to Manitobans. What did they do on top of that? They forced a strike at MPI that set the corporation behind. The revolving door of CEOs, the fired board. It was a disaster unde r mem- bers opposite.

We've stabilized MPI: rates are low, service is improving. We're working for Manitobans. The Speaker: The honourable member for Lac du Bonnet, on a supplementary question. Mr. Ewasko: So, Speaker, that's not what Manitobans and my constituents are telling myself and my col- leagues on this side and, I dare to say, probably a lot of the members on that side, except they're too scared to stand up to this minister. Matter of fact, many of them have joined us today in the gallery who have experienced life-altering experiences dealing with the Manitoba Public Insurance ratepayer service.

So I'd like to ask the minister: Why has the rate - payer service gotten worse in the last 25, 26 months, Honourable Speaker? Mr. Wiebe: Honourable Speaker, I want to offer – members in the gallery are looking for specific case- work, a meeting. I'm happy to meet with them, happy to ensure that we listen to their voices. As I said, there are two important things that MPI and public insurance, more generally, can accomplish for Manitobans. One, of course, is affordability and ensuring that our rates are affordable.

But the other piece–and an im portant piece –is ensuring that Manitobans feel agency, that they have a connection to their insurance corporation. I'm happy to serve in that role, to listen to members of the public and to ensure that they feel that they are being heard. The Speaker: The honourable member for Lac du Bonnet, on a final supplementary question. Mr. Ewasko: So, Honourable Speaker, Manitobans have taken time out of their busy lives, and they're tired and frustrated with dealing with this lack of service from the Manitoba Public Insurance on the ratepayers front- line service.

So I am meeting with them after QP, and I am inviting the minister for MPI to join me in the garden floor and meet with concerned Manitobans. Will he do it, yes or no? Mr. Wiebe: Yes. Yes.

356 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 Manitoba Public Insurance Service Standards Ms. Jodie Byram (Agassiz): I've heard from many constituents who have issues with MPI that just cannot seem to be addressed. Many are not hearing back regarding injury claims that are being denied or simply not responded to. This is unacceptable. Our public insurer has a respon sibility to serve Manitobans, and this minister is responsi ble for ensuring that. Why has this minister allowed service standards to slip under his watch? Hon.

Matt Wiebe (Minister responsible for the Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation): Again, Honourable Speaker, we're going to take no lessons from the members opposite when it comes to manage- ment of any of our Crown corporations, but especially MPI. MPI is one of the crown jewels of Manitoba. It is one of our advantages that Manitobans can rely on. Under members opposite, rates were going up but, more impor tantly, the mis management that was perpetrated by them was causing chaos for not only the–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Wiebe: –people working at MPI across the province, but also for our ratepayers.

It's impor tant that ratepayers understand that a government needs to defend public cor porations and especially an important one like MPI; we're going to do that. This side of the House is steadfast in that commitment. The Speaker: The honourable member for Agassiz, on a supplementary question. Individual's Purchase of Stolen Property Concern for Gaps in MPI Services Ms. Jodie Byram (Agassiz): In January of this year, Andy Bergen bought a utility trailer, and in late June, Winnipeg police informed him that it was actually 'strolen' property and confiscated it.

This is unfortunately far too common in scenarios under this Justice Minister. What is worse, Andy did everything right; he had an insurance broker run the VIN and documen tation before he purchased it. How did the system let someone like Andy down so completely? What else was he supposed to do? Hon. Matt Wiebe (Minister responsible for the Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation): Again, I want to commit to Manitobans that we are working with them to ensure that they get the best service possible from MPI at the same time as having afford- able rates.

The frustration is, Honourable Speaker, that under the PCs, under the former govern ment, we had a revolving door of CEOs. We had disruption at the board level. Their–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Wiebe: –hand-picked board failed Manitobans day after day after day and caused a strike, Hon our- able Speaker, that has impacted the corporation to this day. Now we are getting it back on track. We solved the strike as one of the first commitments that we accomplished as a government, but we're not stopping there.

And that's why we have stability and we have the ability to work with Manitobans to ensure that– The Speaker: Member's time has expired. The honourable member for Agassiz, on a final supplementary question. Ms. Byram: Honourable Speaker, this is under this NDP's watch. Quit playing the blame game. The system didn't catch that the VIN was swapped on this trailer, covering up the fact that it was stolen. A Manitoban who used every resource available to him is left holding the bag and out $4,000 because criminals outsmarted this minister. How is it that Andy is responsible for gaps in the MPI system? Mr.

Wiebe: Again, Honour able Speaker, I'm very, very clear that I want to work with Manitobans. And that includes anyone that's come, would like a meeting to talk about specifics when it comes to case work that's before the member or before our office. We're happy to offer that. The frustration, again, Honourable Speaker–members opposite, the Leader of the Opposition, he heckles from his seat. He was at the Cabinet table. He was there when members opposite decided that Project Nova – off track, costing millions, tens of millions of dollars to Manitobans, hundreds of millions of dollars to

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 357 Manitobans; he just kept checking it off. Sounds fine to me; I don't care. We do care, Honourable Speaker. We're going to show accountability, but we're certainly going to offer better services and affordable rates to Manitobans. Night Hunting Without a Permit Community Safety Concerns Mr.

Rick Wowchuk (Swan River): Yesterday, the Minister of Natural Resources had the audacity to stand in his place and say, quote: On the topic of night lighting, we want to be able to do that in a sustainable way, with resources at the table, end of quote. * (14:30) No, that's wrong, Honourable Speaker. Night hunt- ing without a permit is illegal. It is dangerous and not sustainable. I table photos of why we put the ban in place. The minister won't even release how many permits he issued. Why is this minister trying to justify poaching? Hon.

Ian Bushie (Minister of Natural Resources and Indigenous Futures): The member references questions raised yesterday. I'll make a note also: he did not raise this question. Because we know this is not a priority for him, it is not a priority for them in opposition. That member is fumbling through his desk, thinking, hey, is there a natural resource question, because I don't have one. Because the fact of the matter, they've ignored it. They've ignored hunters all across Manitoba. They ignored–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Bushie: –COs.

They ignored–they devastated the wildfire service; they devastated the CO service, so when they talk about being able to have those positive impacts on–be able to talk about enforcement, that is something they decimated. That is their track recor d. Their track record is kind of defund, criticize and privatize. We know that's what they want to do. They want to do that each and every day, and shame on them. The Speaker: The honourable member for Swan River, on a supplementary question. Mr. Wowchuk: The Premier (Mr.

Kinew) thinks every- thing is a joke, this minister thinks every thing is a joke, but this is serious–life-and-death serious. Manitobans working in the bush and in the rural– or, in the rural homes at–are at risk every night when the minister encourages this reckless behaviour. To quote my constituents: getting pretty sick of watching this stuff happen and people getting away with it, end of quote. I table that message I received. The minister is out of touch. He refused to even acknowledge that night hunting is wrong. Why does the minister think there is a sustainable way to hunt illegally? Mr.

Bushie: I really think that constituent was look- ing through his office window and seeing nothing going on in that office. Because we know, each and every day, they did nothing on wild–on wildfire service, on hunting service, on poaching as well, too. They did nothing to do that but try and create a divisive race war. And, again, here he is, pedalling out those Brian Pallister comments, those Brian–[interjection] And I'm being heckled by the Leader of the Opposition, who is no hunter.

Never hunted a day in his life, yet he wants to get up here, and all of a sudden be professional–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Bushie: –and think he's the expert, when they–day in and day out did nothing but shame and try to create division in hunting here in Manitoba. Shame on them. The Speaker: The honourable member for Swan River, on a final supplementary question. Mr. Wowchuk: The minister had the oppor tunity yesterday to condemn this dangerous and illegal practice. He failed, and his Premier had to jump in and save hindquarters. Yesterday my colleague gave the minister the benefit of the doubt.

We thought he was a hunter. Based on all on his answers, I guess he's a poacher. There is no safe way to night hunt, especially in a populated area. In my area, three of four elk that were illegally hunted were left to rot. This minister wants to talk about sustainability? I want to know why–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Mr. Wowchuk: –he still won't call conservation officers off the border, where there is, quote, no activity, and put them in our communities that are being terrorized by night hunters.

358 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 Mr. Bushie: The only predator I know is that member opposite. Shame on him for being able to stand here and do that. And there he is. He talks about standing up for conservation officers, and there he is at the end of his set that's–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. Order. Mr. Bushie: –shaming conservation officers for each and every day the hard work they do protecting our sovereignty at the border, doing what they do best: being able to stand up for Manitobans. Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. The Speaker: Order, please. Order.

Both benches need to calm down. We can't just sit and holler back and forth. Mr. Bushie: I know the member only works during hunting season, so he should be shamed of that alone. What he stands up here, and he continuously has artificial intelligence read his questions. He needs to know, he still has to have real intelligence to actually complement that. Provincial Deficit Timeline to Eliminate MLA Cindy Lamoureux (Tyndall Park): During the last election, the Premier (Mr. Kinew) promised to eliminate the provincial deficit within a single mandate.

We are halfway through the government's mandate and, according to a CBC

article that I table now, the Kinew government does not appear to be making any actual headway toward eliminating future deficits. Manitobans have exper ienced another year of debt, another year of higher cost of living and another year of many people, especially seniors, being forced to choose between paying for food or rent and prescribed medications. Does the Premier still plan to eliminate Manitoba's deficit before the election is called? Hon. Adrien Sala (Minister of Finance): Yes.

Really appreciate the op portunity to speak to the im portant work that we're doing in returning fiscal responsibility to Manitoba after seven and a half years of mismanagement under the PCs. One thing that we're really proud of: PCs left Manitobans with a $2- billion deficit hole. What did we do in one year, and what do we see reflected in recent public accounts? [interjection] The Speaker: Order, please. The Leader of the Official Opposition (Mr. Khan) needs to come to order. MLA Sala: I'm very proud that we took the $2-billion deficit that the PCs left Manitobans and we cut it by 42 per cent in one year.

We know that good fiscal management is essential to ensure we can continue to do the important work of fixing health care that they sent–they put into a terrible place, to continue to make Manitoba more affordable, continue fixing our schools– The Speaker: Member's time has expired. MLA Lamoureux: Honourable Speaker, the deficit has only gone up. In fact, according to Stats Canada, in 2024, when considering population differences and GDP growth, Manitoba had the highest deficit per capita on record across our country.

Because of this government's inability to balance the books, 20 per cent of every dollar spent goes towards debt interest. This is awful, consid ering this money could go towards health care or housing, just as examples. Will this Finance Minister explain to Manitobans how the Premier's promise to eliminate the deficit in this government's first mandate can possibly still be achieved at this point? MLA Sala: Honourable Speaker, I do appre ciate the important question about fiscal responsibility, again, something we didn't see for many years under the former government.

In one year we took the $2-billion deficit that they left us and we reduced that by 42 per cent. That's real progress. And we're going to continue to do that important work of ensuring that we deliver on our commit ment to Manitobans to deliver a balanced budget in the final year of our mandate, and we're doing that through good fiscal planning. And while we do it, Honour able Speaker, we're maintaining great relationships with credit rating agencies and investors. And I'm very proud that Moody's, DBRS and S&P all reaffirmed our credit rating and gave us a stable outlook.

That's an independent verification that we are doing the good work of bringing Manitoba back to stable fiscal footing. The Speaker: The honourable member for Tyndall Park, on a final supplementary question.

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 359 MLA Lamoureux: Honourable Speaker, Manitoba's debt has only been growing under this NDP government. According to the same CBC

article I tabled earlier, Manitoba is underperforming. The province is not creating jobs very quickly and the growth of full-time employment in Manitoba has been sluggish since the NDP was elected, despite what they say. This govern- ment is shouldering a burden of deficit that neither it nor Manitobans can carry. What is this government actively doing to ensure Manitoba's debt payments do not become our most expensive budget line item? MLA Sala: Again, not only are we working on the fiscal mess that the members opposite left Manitobans, again, making great progress in reducing the deficit.

We're also building Manitoba: 25,000 jobs created in two years of government. So how are we doing the work? Again, we're bring- ing good fiscal management transparency and account- ability and finally some fiscal planning, which Manitobans hadn't seen for years. But, also, of course, we're growing Manitoba. And in our last budget we were really proud to bring in a budget that saw that we are going to build, build, build a stronger Manitoba with a $3.7- billion capital plan, building PCHs schools, the energy infrastructure, that for years the members opposite failed to deliver on.

They took Manitoba backwards; we're going to keep moving Manitoba ahead. The Speaker: Member's time has expired. Laboratory and X-ray Technologists Expansion of Training Seats MLA Carla Compton (Tuxedo): As the PCs dismantled health care, we lost valuable technologists from the system, and wait times for diagnostics like MRIs and cancer screenings grew longer and longer and longer. * (14:40) But today our NDP govern ment is ensuring that there are pathways for new lab techs to find jobs here in Manitoba.

Can the Minister of Advanced Edu cation please tell us about the new training oppor tunities for Manitobans looking to join the health-care workforce in our province? Hon. Renée Cable (Minister of Advanced Education and Training): Honourable Speaker, it is my honour to stand to talk about invest ments in post- secondary and to show Manitobans that we've turned a corner here. We have doubled the number of seats available for people to train in lab tech in Manitoba. [interjection] The Speaker: Order. MLA Cable: And, in addition, the members opposite are hollering because they don't want to hear the good news.

They don't want to know that we're turning the corner on the crap that they left behind, and we have a new day in Manitoba: more people working in health care, more people training than ever in health care, from Churchill to Altona, we have people everywhere. Equipment Used to Detect Cervical Cancer Delay in Approval by Manitoba Health Mrs. Carrie Hiebert (Morden-Winkler): Honour- able Speaker, in January of 2025, the Boundary Trails Health Centre, a crucial hospital in my con stituency, purchased a colposcopy equipment to support women's health services, including the detection of early cervical cancer.

Nearly 12 months later, it remains in storage awaiting approval by Manitoba Health. When will this minister apologize and take accountability for delaying the approval of life-saving equipment for women in my constituency? Hon. Uzoma Asagwara (Minister of Health, Seniors and Long-Term Care): Honourable Speaker, I want to thank the member opposite for this question, and I actually want to thank her for what is usually her approach.

She will reach out to me and bring ques - tions and concerns to my office that she knows needs to be addressed, and I welcome that; it's really impor- tant that we work across the aisle to ensure that if there are concerns in our health -care system, that we have the opportunity to address those concerns. I can say, Honourable Speaker, that we work very closely with the Southern Health region. They have a phenomenal team out that way. I want to thank the interim CEO, Dana, for the great work that she's work that she's doing, and her team. And we're going to continue to work with them.

We've already taken steps to enhance capacity in that region, and we're going to keep doing more. The Speaker: The honourable member for Morden - Winkler, on a supplementary question. Mrs. Hiebert: Honourable Speaker, last week, Boundary Trails Health Centre Foundation questioned the Premier (Mr. Kinew) and the Health Minister during the AMM bear pit in regards to this delay, and they were told that approval would be actioned by the end

360 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 of the day. It has been over a week, yet nothing has changed. My question is this: Does this minister and Premier (Mr. Kinew) not care enough about women to approve life-saving equipment in my constituency? MLA Asagwara: Now, Honourable Speaker, the mem- ber opposite, although she wasn't around the Cabinet table or even in their caucus, she should be well aware by now that she sits on a side of the House that spent seven and a half years destroying women's health care in this province.

She sits on a side of the House where they systemically cut the services that women across rural Manitoba count on. She sits on the side of the House that actively worked to force–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. MLA Asagwara: –experts in this care out of Manitoba. Honourable Speaker, on this side of the House we've invested in strengthening women's health care innovation and research, innovation and services, retain- ing and recruiting folks to this province because of our approach. We'll take no lessons from that side of the House. I'd encourage her to get an apology from her col - leagues for what they did.

The Speaker: Member's time has expired. Mrs. Hiebert: Honourable Speaker, early detection can save lives. The longer this 'colospony'–'colosopy' sits unused, waiting for approval, the longer women are without access to services that could prevent life - threatening illness. Manitoba should be supporting women's health care; not stalling it. This gov ernment needs to take women's health care seriously. My constituents are begging. I'm asking: Will this minister pick up the phone today and approve the desperately needed equipment that will save lives in my constituency?

MLA Asagwara: Honourable Speaker, the piece of equipment the member is inquiring about is a piece of what we call minor capital. It falls into a threshold that is the responsibility of the regional health authority to approve as part of their capital operating plans. If they had challenges, they of course should bring it to our department. We've made very clear as a gov ernment that we are going to ensure that women's health care is invested in and strengthened as a government. I made that commitment at AMM. We have followed through to make sure that that is brought forward in a timely manner.

If that hasn't been communicated to the foundation by the regional health authority, I'll see to it today. The Speaker: The time for oral questions has expired. Speaker's Statement The Speaker: And I have another quick statement for the House. Of late–the last couple of days, in particular–there's been some words that have got into our language in this House that we probably shouldn't be using, and I will be keeping closer track on that and cautioning members if that language persists. PETITIONS Education Property Taxes Mr.

Obby Khan (Leader of the Official Opposition): I wish to present the following petition to the Legis - lative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The prov incial gov ernment's decision to cancel the Edu cation Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax hikes.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and punitive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Education Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the 'renovocation' of rebates were done with no consultation, pushing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 361 and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. Honourable Speaker, this petition has been signed by Dean Klein, Pat Cutz and Wayne Tait, along with many, many other Manitobans. Mr. Wayne Ewasko (Lac du Bonnet): Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legis lative Assembly. And the background to this petition is as follows: Mr. Tyler Blashko, Deputy Speaker, in the Chair

(1) The provincial government's decision to cancel the Education Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and punitive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Education Property Tax Credit on their primary residence. * (14:50)

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consul tation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by trying–by tying education taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to remove the education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. Honourable Deputy Speaker, this petition has signed by Joan Beckett, Earl Osipov, Debbie Osipov and many, many more fine Manitobans.

The Deputy Speaker: Seeing no–the hon ourable member for Morden-Winkler. Location of Safe Injection Sites Mrs. Carrie Hiebert (Morden-Winkler): I wish to present the following petition to the Legis lative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The prov incial gov ernment–the Province of Manitoba has filed paperwork with the federal government proposing the establishment of a drug injection site for illegal drugs at 200 Disraeli Fwy. without sufficient public consultation.

(2) The decision to locate the facility at 200 Disraeli was made despite the site is located in the immediate vicinity of a daycare centre, a high school and multiple community gathering sites, including churches and cultural institutions.

(3) Residents, business owners and community organizations have raised concerns that the location is incompatible with nearby institutions serving thousands of youths and families, and believe it will erode public safety and confidence in the area.

(4) Existing community consultations specifically ignored concerns about public safety and were criticized by community members for being artificial and scripted.

(5) The provincial government has failed to intro- duce legislation and regulations to control where drug injection sites can be located.

(6) Other provinces are closing drug injection sites and adopting a recovery model, following the expertise of groups such as the Canadian centre for recovery and–of recovery excellence.

(7) This decision to ignore the experts will leave people suspended in addiction and will not give Manitobans their lives or their loved ones back.

(8) The provincial government has failed to fund and operate any treatment or additional rapid access to addictions medication clinics to break this cycle. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:

(1) To urge the provincial government to cancel drug injection sites in the Point Douglas community, including the proposed location at 200 Disraeli Fwy.

(2) To urge the provincial government to legislate that no further site will be proposed without com - munity support.

362 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 This petition was signed by Josie Manuel Rod [phonetic], Daniel Rocha and Yokanasi Rod [phonetic] and many, many other Manitobans. Thank you. Education Property Taxes Mr. Josh Guenter (Borderland): Honourable Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The provincial government's decision to cancel the Education Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and puni - tive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Education Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. This petition has been signed by many, many Manitobans. Mr. Kelvin Goertzen (Steinbach): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. And the background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The provincial government's decision to cancel the education property tax and the property tax credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive tax increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and punitive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Edu cation Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxa - tion to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. And honourable Deputy Speaker, this petition is signed by Remi Vano, Morgan Boyko, Sharon Gunn and many, many other fine Manitobans. MRI Machine for Portage Regional Health Facility Mr.

Doyle Piwniuk (Turtle Mountain): Honourable Deputy Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. The background of this petition is as follows:

(1) Thanks to the investments made under the previous PC provincial government as part of the clinical and preventative services plan, construction of a new Portage regional health facility is well under way–I believe it's done now, right? The facility and surrounding community will greatly benefit from added diagnostic machinery and equipment, but specifically the addition to an MRI machine.

(2) An MRI machine is a non -invasive medical imaging technique that is used to magnetic field and computer-generated radio waves to create detailed images and organs and tissues in the human body. It is used for the disease detection, diagnosis and treatment monitoring. * (15:00)

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 363

(3) Portage la Prairie is centrally located in Manitoba and is on the No. 1 Highway in Southern Health/Santé Sud Health Authority. Currently there is only one MRI machine in the RHA.

(4) The MRI machine located in Portage la Prairie regional health facility will reduce transportation costs for patients as well as reduce the burden on stretcher services and ambulance use. It will bring care closer to home and reduce wait times for MRI scans across the province.

(5) Located around Portage la Prairie are the Dakota Tipi, Dakota Plains, Sandy Bay and Long Plain First Nations reserves. Indigenous peoples in Canada 'disproportly' face barriers in access to services and medical care. An MRI machine located in Portage la Prairie regional health facility will bring care closer to their home communities and provide greater access to diagnostic testing.

(6) Located closely–proximity to the new Portage regional health facility is the Southport airport. The aerodrome has a runway length that is more than adequate to support medical air ambulance services. This would provide–has a runway length is more than adequate to support medical air ambulance services. This will also provide the opportunity to transport patients by air from more remote communities to access MRI imaging services.

(7) The average wait time for Manitobans to receive an MRI scan is currently six to eight months. Having an MRI machine in the Portage la Prairie health facility will help reduce these wait times for patients and provide better care sooner. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to support the investment and replacement of a –or placement of a MRI machine in the Portage regional health facility in Portage la Prairie, Manitoba. This has been signed by Martha Werry, Pat Yuill, Linda Picard and many, many Manitobans. Thank you, honourable Speaker.

Education Property Taxes Ms. Jodie Byram (Agassiz): I wish to present the following petition to the Legis lative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The provincial government's decision to cancel the Education Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and puni - tive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive a $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Education Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. This petition has been signed by Allison Bloomer, Graham Bloomer, Ron Zellis and many, many more Manitobans. Thank you. MRI Machine for Portage Regional Health Facility Mr.

Trevor King (Lakeside): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. And the background to this petition is as follows:

(1) Thanks to the investment made under the previous PC provincial government as part of the clinical and preventative services plan, construction for the new Portage regional health facility is well under way. The facility and surrounding community would greatly benefit from added diagnostic machinery and equipment, but specifically the addition of an MRI machine.

(2) An MRI machine is a non -invasive medical imaging technique that uses a magnetic field and a computer-generated radio waves to create detailed

364 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 images of organs and tissues in the human body. It is used for disease detection, diagnosis and treatment monitor.

(3) Portage la Prairie is currently located in Manitoba and is on the No. 1 Highway in the Southern Health/Santé Sud Health Authority. Currently there is only one MRI machine in the RHA.

(4) An MRI machine located in the Portage regional health facility will reduce transportation costs for patients as well as reduce the burden on stretcher service and ambulance use. It will bring care closer to home and reduce wait times for MRI scans across the province.

(5) Located around Portage la Prairie are the Dakota Tipi, Dakota Plains, Sandy Bay and Long Plain First Nations reserves. Indigenous peoples in Canada disproportionately face barriers in access to service and medical care. An MRI machine located in the Portage regional health facility will bring care closer to their home communities and provide greater access to diagnostic testing.

(6) Located in close proximity to the new Portage regional health facility is the Southport airport. This 'aerodome' has a runway length that is more than adequate to support medical air ambulance services. This would provide the opportunity to transport patients by air from more remote communities to access MRI imaging services.

(7) The average wait times for Manitobans to receive an MRI scan is currently six to eight months. Having an MRI machine in the Portage regional health facility will help reduce these wait times for patients and provide better care sooner. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to support the investment and placement of an MRI machine in the Portage regional health facility in Portage la Prairie, Manitoba. This petition has been signed by Rhonda Cameron, Doug Battrel [phonetic], David Allen Robertson, and many, many Manitobans.

Thank you, honourable Deputy Speaker. Education Property Taxes MLA Jeff Bereza (Portage la Prairie): I wish to present the following petition. The background of this petition is as follows: The provincial gov ernment's decision to cancel Education Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive tax –massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and punitive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate. * (15:10)

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for the trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Education Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to renew – remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund educa- tion in Manitoba. This is signed by Doug Buss, Tim Wiebe, Sean McDermid and many, many more Manitobans. Thank you, honourable Deputy Speaker. Mr.

Wayne Balcaen (Brandon West): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The prov incial gov ernment's decision to cancel the Edu cation Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and puni - tive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 365 to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Education Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxes to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. Honourable Deputy Speaker, this petition was signed by Darren Taylor, Eugenia Scaranzzi [phonetic], Harry Janzen and many, many other fine Manitobans. Mr.

Derek Johnson (Interlake-Gimli): I wish to present the following petition to the Legis lative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The provincial government's decision to cancel the Education Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and puni - tive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Education Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, pushing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by trying–by tying edu- cation taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equable way to fund edu cation in Manitoba. Honourable Deputy Speaker, this petition has been signed by Kris Pritchard, Larry Officer, Ronald Dueck and many, many other fine Manitobans. Thank you, honourable Deputy Speaker. Mr.

Ron Schuler (Springfield-Ritchot): I wish to present the following petition to the Legis lative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The provincial government's decision to cancel Education Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and puni - tive changes to education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate. * (15:20)

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Education Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. This is signed by C. McGetrick, M. McGetrick, Colleen Born and many, many other Manitobans. Mrs. Kathleen Cook (Roblin): I wish to present the following petition. The background to this petition is as follows:

366 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025

(1) The prov incial gov ernment's decision to cancel the Edu cation Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and puni - tive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Education Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. And this petition is signed by Dean Scaletta, Rachel Scaletta, Lynn Webster and many, many other Manitobans. Mr. Rick Wowchuk (Swan River): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The prov incial gov ernment's decision to cancel the education property tax and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and puni - tive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced education property tax on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. * (15:30) This petition is signed by Jennifer Sims, Rosemarie Bushuk, Lori Edwards and many, many other Manitobans. The Speaker in the Chair Mr.

Jeff Wharton (Red River North): Honourable Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The prov incial gov ernment's decision to cancel the Edu cation Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and puni - tive charges–or, pardon me –punitive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate. Excuse me.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, secondary property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Education Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxation to assessed property values.

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 367 Honourable Speaker, we petition the Legis lative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. This petition is signed by Yvonne Skurbivius [phonetic], William Skurbivus [phonetic] and Bob Wilson, along with many, many other Manitobans. Thank you, Honourable Speaker. Mr. Greg Nesbitt (Riding Mountain): Honourable Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The prov incial gov ernment's decision to cancel the Edu cation Property Tax Credit and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and puni - tive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Edu cation Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. Honourable Speaker, this petition has been signed by Carolyn Cameron, Dan Robinson, Nancy Schneider and many, many more fine Manitobans. Thank you, Honourable Speaker. Mrs.

Colleen Robbins (Spruce Woods): I wish – Honourable Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows: * (15:40)

(1) The prov incial gov ernment's decision to cancel the education property tax and the property tax offset grant has enabled and encouraged school divisions to introduce massive tax hikes–increases.

(2) These massive increases have been felt by all Manitobans and compounded by arbitrary and puni - tive changes to the education property tax rebate, and those changes have made many Manitobans ineligible to receive the $1,500 rebate.

(3) Secondary property owners are subject to taxation without representation as they are ineligible to vote for trustees who set the rates; yet, second property owners are still required to pay full education taxes in their division.

(4) Additionally, families can only claim the reduced Edu cation Property Tax Credit on their primary residence.

(5) These increases and the revocation of rebates were done with no consultation, punishing Manitobans who maintain family cabins by tying education taxation to assessed property values. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial gov ernment to remove education funding and taxation from property taxes and find a fair and equitable way to fund education in Manitoba. This petition has been signed by Victor Moge, Junior [phonetic] Jonsson and S. Hauser, and many, many more Manitobans. The Speaker: No further petitions? * * * The Speaker: The honourable member for Agassiz, for grievances.

368 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 Ms. Jodie Byram (Agassiz): On a matter of urgent public importance. MATTER OF URGENT PUBLIC IMPORTANCE The Speaker: The honourable member for Agassiz, on a matter of urgent public importance. Ms. Jodie Byram (Agassiz): I move, seconded by the MLA for Portage la Prairie, that in accordance with subrule 39(1), the regular business of the House be set aside to discuss a matter of urgent public importance, specifically the repeated and abject failures to protect children in care and report on incidents in a timely manner. Motion presented.

The Speaker: Now, before recog nizing the hon our- able member for Agassiz, I should remind all members that under rule 39(2), the mover of a motion on a matter of urgent public importance and one member from the other recognized parties in the House are allowed not m ore than 10 minutes to explain the urgency of debating the matter immediately. And as stated in Beauchesne, citation 390, urgency in this context means the urgency of imme diate debate, not of the subject matter of the motion.

In their remarks, members should focus exclusively on whether or not there is urgency of debate and whether or not the ordinary oppor tunities for debate will enable the House to consider the matter early enough to ensure that the public interest will not suffer. Ms. Byram: I stand here today on this matter of urgent public importance that our child- care system here in Manitoba is facing. We often declare that children are our greatest joy, and for all of us here who are parents, grand- parents, aunts and uncles, we can all say that, I'm sure. They bring lots of joy and happiness to our life.

And we often make incredible sacrifices to ensure that all our children have a safe, healthy, nurturing environ- ment and, you know, all hope that we can see them in to a bright future as they grow. In Manitoba, there are approximately 12,000 children in child and family care services; 90 per cent of these children identify as Indigenous. The number of youth in care has increased under this NDP minister, from approximately 8,900 in 2023- 24 to over 9,000 in 2024-2025, so that's just this year. It's also impor tant to note that this is the first increase to the number of children in care in a number of years.

The Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs notes that, under this failed Families Minister, there are now more Indigenous children in care than at the height of the residential school system. Of course, Honourable Speaker, we need to review why and–again, I will get into that here–why this should be elevated to a matter of urgent public importance. We've all read in the media–and I will be tabling some of those documents here shortly –some of the tragic things that we have heard, that we have listened to.

I know for myself, I have spoken to families, care providers and organizations who are delivering child- care services right on the front line. Most recently, last night, I had a conver sation with an individual who brought forward a situation– very devastating situation of an eight-month-old child who was –has sustained some harms and levels of abuse, which is greatly concerning, as it should be, for all of us as parents. We don't want to see any child endure such pain and suffering and abuse as what we have been reading about in our media and hearing about.

I've also heard from those that are delivering–I've heard from care providers that have also recog nized gaps in the system where there needs to be some follow-up and accountability on those individuals, on those families that are providing the care. There needs to be some consistency in terms of check-ins, and see that the children are doing well and thriving in these environments.

So there are gaps in the system, leaving our chil- dren vulnerable to the abuse that we've been reading about, and I'm going to table some documents here today that–and this is going to highlight some of the things that we have seen here. * (15:50) Most recently, we have read about the girl that may be paralyzed for life following injuries that she has sustained, and this–I think there should be public inquiry to this level of abuse so that we can all be made aware of what happened, show some trans par- ency and accountability to those that should be held accountable to such abuse. I'm going to table those

article –table that

article here today for members. And, again, I'm going to get back to why this is a matter of urgent public importance, because this is affecting all of our children across the province who are in care, or who are potentially going into the child foster care system.

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 369 We can see–I'm going to table another document here–this is highlighting, and I'm just going to get to that. This

article is describing charges against owners of a foster care agency that gave cannabis to children that were in care. This is horrific. Th ese children are in the care of individuals where we hope that proper care, a safe environment and where we hope that there is no abuse occurring in these; and yet we have agen- cies that are supporting and handing out cannabis. We want children to be exposed to healthy coping mechanisms, and cannabis isn't always that option– prescribed cannabis.

This was not prescribed cannabis, sorry, and that is scary when you're having children in agencies that are handing out unprescribed cannabis. I'm going to table that document. Just mindful of our time here, Honourable Speaker. I'm going to also table another document where it talks about the–where deaths underscore problems in the child welfare system, and this is coming from foster parents' group. And this is dated just November, 2024. The Speaker: Order, please.

I cautioned the members earlier about making sure their comments are relevant to the urgency of why we need to debate it today, so I'd just ask the member to try and focus on why we need to debate it today. Ms. Byram: The reason we need to talk about this today is because we are seeing recently, and I have tabled some documents from the past, but the urgency is the calls that I am having, yesterday, last night more specifically, when I'm hearing stories about an eight - month-old that is suffering abuse. We just read–I just tabled the document about the six -year-old who has endured significant abuse.

There is a sense of urgency to the child and welfare of our children– and welfare of the system here. I'm also going to table two other documents indicating the abuse that has happened in the last period of time here. And I will just close with a statement here. While the minister may publicly claim that child safety is a high priority, the alarming rise in cases of children subjected to abuse tells a different story. Actions speak louder than words, and her focus on social media fame instead of the welfare of our most vulner- able citizens is a stark revelation.

Manitobans deserve leaders who prioritize the safety and well -being of our children over personal publicity. It's time to hold this Families Minister accountable and demand genuine commitment to pro- tecting our children. When someone shows you who they are, believe them, and Manitobans conceive–see that child safety is not the highest priority for this Minister of Families, and Manitobans believe that. Thank you. Hon. Nahanni Fontaine (Government House Leader): The member for Agassiz (Ms.

Byram) routinely gets up in the Chamber and simply shows Manitobans that she has not a hot clue what she's talking about for her critic role or for really anything that has to do for child welfare here in Manitoba. I want to just share–and I'll give a prime example: the member got up and tried to–is trying to formulate some type of argument, I suppose, that this is a matter of urgent public importance. She had all question period today and yesterday and the day before and months before and weeks before to raise these issues.

But when she does, she doesn't know how to raise the issues because she–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. MLA Fontaine: –doesn't understand the issue at all. A good example of that is that when she just rose right now she said there's 12,000 children in care. Then she said there's 9,000. There's not 12,000 children in CFS care. So I think it's impor tant for the public to realize that members opposite, including the member for Agassiz, don't really care about children in child welfare. They don't care about the children that are in CFS. They never have; they never will.

They use our children as political pawns to espouse some type of ideology, and what she's doing every single time she gets up in the Chamber, the only thing that she does , the only thing that she contributes to the discussion about child welfare, is leaning into racist tropes that children, Indigenous children–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. MLA Fontaine: –are more at risk now because we're moving on the path–[interjection] The Speaker: Order, please. The opposition bench needs to come to order. I need to hear what's being said–[interjection] –pardon me?

370 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 MLA Fontaine: The member for Agassiz and every single member opposite routinely get up in the Chamber and try to assert and try to lean into these racist tropes that Indigenous children are more at risk now that we're decolonizing the system, now that we're on the path to juris diction, now that we've pro- claimed kinship and customary care, now all of a sudden Indigenous children are more at risk because they're going to be with Indigenous families in our communities, in our nations.

That's shameful and the member should get up in the Chamber and apologize for every single time she's gotten up and said her racist tropes. All that does is ensure that the public doesn't understand what's going on in child welfare and act to discourage j urisdiction and kinship and customary care. Let me just say this: no one in the Indigenous community, no one that's been fighting to decolonize child welfare, nobody in the community, no mothers, no fathers, no kokums, nobody knows who she is. They wouldn't recognize her or her name or her advo- cacy or her experience–[interjection] The Speaker: Order, please.

Opposition bench needs to come to order and the minister needs to keep her comments relevant to the urgency of the–or the lack of urgency for the debate. MLA Fontaine: So, again, I want to just, for the record here, here's the record of members opposite when they were in their failed, callous, incapable gov- ernment, cold gov ernment, a cold govern ment that didn't care about anybody–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. MLA Fontaine: –not unsheltered relatives, not children in care–[interjection] The Speaker: Order, please.

The opposition bench is not the Speaker, so they can quit hollering relevance every two seconds. They can listen to what's being said. The honourable Minister of Families, keep your comments on the expediency or the urgency of debate. MLA Fontaine: That is their record. Not only–here's the most grotesque part of their record that now they're saying there's an urgent –a matter of urgent public importance. * (16:00) They legislated the rights of children in child welfare away from the very dollars that they were entitled to. This govern ment legis lated, in 2020, the rights of Indigenous children away.

And now, they're going to get up in the Chamber and act like they care about children in CFS care; they don't. But let's just go back a little bit. Who settled that CSA claim that was rightfully brought towards the Pallister and Heather Stefanson government? [interjection] We did. We settled that CSA settlement. And right now as we speak, children are applying for the dollars that are rightfully owed to them. We did that. That's our dedication to children in care, righting a wrong that they did–that they didn't care that people were protesting on the front lawns. People were fast- ing on the front lawns.

They didn't care. Not one single member of their caucus went out to say, hey, I'm so sorry. I'm sorry I'm part of a really horrible government that is legislating the rights of children away. And not one single member of them has gotten up to apologize for that. So, you know, these are the same members, led by the member for Fort Whyte (Mr. Khan), who is the poster child for attacking trans children. You're going to get up in the House and pretend you care about children? Where's the apology for trans children? Where's the training on trans children?

Where's meeting with the parents–[interjection] The Speaker: Order. MLA Fontaine: –of trans children that were crying when we were campaigning going door to door. Where's the apology on that? So for the member to get up– The Speaker: Order, please. I just would ask the member to bring her com - ments back to the urgency–or the lack of urgency for the debate. MLA Fontaine: The issue of their attack on trans children is relevant to this fictitious MUPI. There are trans children that are in care.

So the same member that's getting up and feigning some type of concern and, you know, wanting us to debate a matter of urgent public importance, to get up on children in care. But also, it's about trans children, as well, that are in care. They don't care. They still have not apologized. The Leader of the Opposition has not even requested to meet with families, has not even gotten up in the

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 371 Chamber to apologize for the most disgusting, vile vitriol attack on trans children. So for us to sit here and waste time –that's what they do, day in and day out. They read their petitions so slowly. They get up on fictitious MUPIs. They have their grievances. And all they do is waste time. They waste time in the Chamber while they collect their $106,000 cheque every year to sit on their hands and pretend they care about children. Nobody knows them. Nobody likes them. Nobody trusts them. Manitobans see them for who they are. They don't care about children.

They don't care about Manitobans. All they care about is division– The Speaker: Order, please. I'd just ask the minister to keep her comments relevant to the urgency, again. MLA Fontaine: And this from the same member who gets up in standing com mittee, doesn't understand what juris diction is –like, oh, there's going to be no oversight. I don't understand what's going on. Clearly, you don't understand what's going on in Manitoba or across the country that is historic, that is transformative, that's going to transform CFS in Manitoba and across the country.

Well, what's kinship care and customary care, and who's going to watch them? And what parents? They're more at risk. She doesn't know what she's talking about. If I were her, I would get up right now; I would apologize; and I would also say, you know what, my leader, my leader: I resign from the critic of Families. I don't know what I'm talking about. I shouldn't get up in QP and ask questions because I don't know what I'm talking about. She shows it day in and day out alongside every single one of those members opposite who continue to waste time. They all should get up. They should all resign.

They should apologize to Manitobans and walk them- selves out the door and say, we're not running; we're going to join Turtle Mountain and say, we're giving our resignation; we're not running again. And again, why is the member for Turtle Mountain (Mr. Piwniuk) resigning? Like, what's going on– Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. The Speaker: Order, please. Order, please. Order, please. Order. MLA Fontaine: I look forward to the member for Agassiz (Ms. Byram) apologizing and resigning from her critic role as the critic for Families. She clearly doesn't know what she's talking about.

She clearly doesn't care about Indigenous children, and she certainly doesn't care about decolonizing a system that has caused so much harm, that she's fighting so hard to uphold. She's fighting so up–hard to uphold a colonial system. The Speaker: Member's time has expired. Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. The Speaker: Order, please. Order, please. So I thank the honourable members for their advice to the Chair on the motion proposed by the honourable member for Agassiz for the matter of urgent public importance.

The 90-minute notice required prior to the start of routine proceedings by the subrule 39(1) was provided, and I thank the member for that. Under our rules and practices, the subject matter referenced in the member's motion must be so pressing that the public interest will suffer if it is not given immediate attention. Crucially, there must also be no other reasonable opportunities to raise the matter.

I have listened carefully to the arguments put forward, and although protecting children in care and reporting incidents in a timely matter is indeed a very serious and worthy of consid eration and discussion, my duty in this moment is to determine if there are other opportunities for debate on such matters. With that in mind, I must note that members do have the oppor tunity to speak on this topic during members' statements, when raising a grievance. Members can also ask questions on this topic during oral ques - tions.

Further, those oppor tunities and others will continue to be available every sitting day in this House. Accordingly, I do not believe the motion meets the criteria as a matter of urgent public importance as there are other op portunities to debate the matter. With the greatest of respect, then, I must rule this motion is out of order as a matter of urgent public importance. * * * The Speaker: Grievances?

372 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA December 3, 2025 ORDERS OF THE DAY GOVERNMENT BUSINESS Hon. Nahanni Fontaine (Government House Leader): Can you please call second reading of Bill 2, The Non-Consensual Dis tribution of Intimate Images Amendment Act; followed by the start of second reading of Bill 3, The Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation Amendment Act. Miigwech. The Speaker: It has been announced that we will now resume debate on second readings of bill 2, The Non-Consensual Distribution of Intimate Images Act; followed by second reading of Bill 3, The Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation Amendment Act.

DEBATE ON SECOND READINGS Bill 2–The Non-Consensual Distribution of Intimate Images Amendment Act The Speaker: So now we will resume debate on second reading of Bill 2, standing in the name of the honourable member for Interlake-Gimli, who has six minutes remaining. Mr. Derek Johnson (Interlake-Gimli): So why does this legislation matter? And I talked a little bit about this yesterday. The distribution of intimate images without consent is not simply a matter of privacy. It's not a mistake; it's not a mis understanding; it is not a youthful error or a minor lapse in judgment.

It is, in many cases, deliberate exploitation, abusive behaviour, done with the inten - tion to control, intimidate, humiliate, manipulate or destroy the mental and emotional well- being of another person. * (16:10) Let me say that again: it is the deliberate exploit- ation, abusive behaviour, done with the inten tion to control, intimidate, humiliate, manipulate or destroy the mental and emotional well-being of another person. Sorry, Hansard. So aside from the Canadian Centre for Child Pro- tection, the Manitoba Justice De partment did consult with some people.

They consulted with some legal experts, victim advocates, law en forcement partners, 'internait'–Internet safety organization and community stakeholder groups. And I'm hoping that they con- sulted with victims as well–not just advocates but some actual victims. Other provinces like BC, Saskatchewan, New Brunswick and PEI have also imple mented some changes around deepfakes, and Manitoba's approach is con sistent with best practices across the country. Obviously this legis lation was first moved on by a PC government, and this builds on the great work of the previous PC government.

Internationally, governments such as United States have begun 'developming' watermarks, rules for deep- fake content. The federal govern ment kind of has introduced Bill C -27, the artificial intelligence and data act, but again, regulation remains in its infancy. This beaker–this bill is going in the right direction, but it's not the end of all work.

There are still areas where future legis lation will be needed: stronger provisions for non-sexual image exploitation, enhanced resources for schools and educators, legal supports for youth victims, navigating civil actions and mandatory reporting require ments for social media platforms, digital literacy education. Education is in –the key to helping them out. If we can educate our kids when they're young in the schools and make them aware of the dangers that can happen–I saw a very effective com mercial.

It was a boy texting a girl, asking her to send a picture of herself in her bra, and then you see him smiling on the phone, and there was her school picture inside her bra, and that was sent to him. So it was a picture of her in her bra, and that goes to show and strengthen that people can say no and be creative. So again, education, com mercials like that are very, very im portant to help. There's better tools to support rural and remote victims, and funding for mental health supports linked to online abuse is important.

It's not just the bill, but it's to see what funding is behind this bill to help people that have been victimized. So Bill 2 is a step in the right direction. It strengthens victims' rights, it modernizes the law, it responds to real harms happening across Manitoba and it reflects the advice and expertise of organi zations like the Canadian Centre for Child Protec tion, who con- tinually remind us about the safety for children, youth and vulnerable people. We must always keep that a top priority.

As legislatures, we have the responsibility to keep pace with tech nology, a responsi bility to listen to victims and a responsibility to ensure that Manitobans are protected not just today but into the future as new technologies emerge.

December 3, 2025 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 373 Our PC caucus supports the protection of victims. We support strong penalties for those who exploit or manipulate others. We support em powering courts, Crown attorney and law enforcement, and we support this legislation as a continuation of the work begun under the

Document details

Collection	Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	43-3-11
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	43rd 3rd hansardpdf 11.pdf
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	f1a388b75311b014056a2ad501cad4edb0f259ec

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