Manitoba Hansard — 10 May 2017 (Sitting 49, 41st Legislature, 2nd Session)

41-2-49

Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)

Second Session – Forty-First Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable Myrna Driedger Speaker Vol. LXX No. 49 - 1:30 p.m., Wednesday, May 10, 2017 ISSN 0542-5492

MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Forty-First Legislature Member Constituency Political Affiliation ALLUM, James Fort Garry-Riverview NDP ALTEMEYER, Rob Wolseley NDP BINDLE, Kelly Thompson PC CLARKE, Eileen, Hon. Agassiz PC COX, Cathy, Hon. River East PC CULLEN, Cliff, Hon. Spruce Woods PC CURRY, Nic Kildonan PC DRIEDGER, Myrna, Hon. Charleswood PC EICHLER, Ralph, Hon. Lakeside PC EWASKO, Wayne Lac du Bonnet PC FIELDING, Scott, Hon. Kirkfield Park PC FLETCHER, Steven, Hon. Assiniboia PC FONTAINE, Nahanni St. Johns NDP FRIESEN, Cameron, Hon. Morden-Winkler PC GERRARD, Jon, Hon. River Heights Lib.

GOERTZEN, Kelvin, Hon. Steinbach PC GRAYDON, Clifford Emerson PC GUILLEMARD, Sarah Fort Richmond PC HELWER, Reg Brandon West PC ISLEIFSON, Len Brandon East PC JOHNSON, Derek Interlake PC JOHNSTON, Scott St. James PC KINEW, Wab Fort Rouge NDP KLASSEN, Judy Kewatinook Lib. LAGASSÉ, Bob Dawson Trail PC LAGIMODIERE, Alan Selkirk PC LAMOUREUX, Cindy Burrows Lib. LATHLIN, Amanda The Pas NDP LINDSEY, Tom Flin Flon NDP MALOWAY, Jim Elmwood NDP MARCELINO, Flor Logan NDP MARCELINO, Ted Tyndall Park NDP MARTIN, Shannon Morris PC MAYER, Colleen St. Vital PC MICHALESKI, Brad Dauphin PC MICKLEFIELD, Andrew, Hon.

Rossmere PC MORLEY-LECOMTE, Janice Seine River PC NESBITT, Greg Riding Mountain PC PALLISTER, Brian, Hon. Fort Whyte PC PEDERSEN, Blaine, Hon. Midland PC PIWNIUK, Doyle Arthur-Virden PC REYES, Jon St. Norbert PC SARAN, Mohinder The Maples Ind. SCHULER, Ron, Hon. St. Paul PC SELINGER, Greg St. Boniface NDP SMITH, Andrew Southdale PC SMOOK, Dennis La Verendrye PC SQUIRES, Rochelle, Hon. Riel PC STEFANSON, Heather, Hon. Tuxedo PC SWAN, Andrew Minto NDP TEITSMA, James Radisson PC WHARTON, Jeff Gimli PC WIEBE, Matt Concordia NDP WISHART, Ian, Hon.

Portage la Prairie PC WOWCHUK, Rick Swan River PC YAKIMOSKI, Blair Transcona PC Vacant Point Douglas

1871 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Wednesday, May 10, 2017 The House met at 1:30 p.m. Madam Speaker: O Eternal and Almighty God, from Whom all power and wisdom come, we are assembled here before Thee to frame such laws as may tend to the welfare and prosperity of our province. Grant, O merciful God, we pray Thee, that we may desire only that which is in accordance with Thy will, that we may seek it with wisdom and know it with certain ty and accomplish it perfectly for the glory and honour of Thy name and for the welfare of all our people. Amen. Please be seated.

ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS Madam Speaker: Introduction of bills? COMMITTEE REPORTS Standing Committee on Legislative Affairs Sixth Report Mr. Dennis Smook (Chairperson): I wish to present the Sixth Report of the Standing Committee on Legislative Affairs. Clerk (Ms. Patricia Chaychuk): Your Standing Committee on Legislative Affairs presents the– Some Honourable Members: Dispense. Madam Speaker: Dispense. Your Standing Committee on LEGISLATIVE AFFAIRS presents the following as its Sixth Report. Meetings Your Committee met on May 9, 2017 at 6:00 p.m. in Room 255 of the Legislative Building.

Matters under Consideration • Bill (No. 4) – The Provincial Court Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la Cour provinciale • Bill (No. 5) – The City of Winnipeg Charter Amendment, Planning Amendment and Real Property Amendment Act (Conforming to Construction Standards Through Agreements)/Loi modifiant la Charte de la ville de Winnipeg, la

Loi sur l'aménagement du territoire et la

Loi sur les biens réels (ententes de conformité en matière de normes de construction) • Bill (No. 32) – The Statutes Correction and Minor Amendments Ac t, 2017/Loi corrective de 2017 Committee Membership • Mr. B INDLE (Vice-Chairperson) • Hon. Ms. CLARKE • Ms. FONTAINE • Ms. LAMOUREUX • Mr. MALOWAY • Hon. Mr. MICKLEFIELD • Mr. NESBITT • Mr. SMOOK • Hon. Mrs. STEFANSON • Mr. SWAN • Mr. WOWCHUK Your Committee elected Mr. SMOOK as the Chairperson. Bills Considered and Reported • Bill (No. 4) – The Provincial Court Amendment Act/Loi modifiant la

Loi sur la Cour provinciale Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 5) – The City of Winnipeg Charter Amendment, Planning Amendment and Real Property Amendment Act (Conforming to Construction Standards Through Agreements)/Loi modifiant la Charte de la ville de Winnipeg, la

Loi sur l'aménagement du territoire et la

Loi sur les biens réels (ententes de conform ité en matière de normes de construction) Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment. • Bill (No. 32) – The Statutes Correction and Minor Amendments Act, 2017/Loi corrective de 2017 Your Committee agreed to report this Bill without amendment.

1872 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 Mr. Smook : I move, seconded by the honourable member for Thompson (Mr. Bindle), that the report of the committee be received. Motion agreed to. TABLING OF REPORTS Hon. Cameron Friesen (Minister responsible for the Civil Service): I rise today to table the Manitoba Civil Service Commission Supplementary Information for Legislative Review, 2017- 2018 Departmental Expenditure Estimates.

MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS Madam Speaker: The honourable Minister for Sport, Culture and Heritage , and I would indicate that the required 90 minutes notice prior to routine proceedings was prov ided in accordance with rule 26(2). Would the honourable minister please proceed with her statement. Asian Heritage Month Hon. Rochelle Squires (Minister of Sport, Culture and Heritage ): I rise today to recognize and celebrate Asian Heritage Month in Canada. The month of May is a time to highlight the contributions of Asian Canadians and their contributions to the settlement, growth and development of Canada.

Locally, the Asian Heritage Society of Manitoba works tirelessly to ensure a variety of opportunities are available for our community to participate in and learn about the rich history of Asian heritage in Manitoba. The Asian Heritage Society of Manitoba is a dynamic organization that has been spearheading Asian Heritage Month celebrations for 15 years. Their members are proud representatives from the Japanese, Chinese, Indian, Vietnamese, Indo-Chinese, Korean and Filipino community organizations that continue to strengthen the foundation of Manitoba.

Throughout May there will be festivities and events marking the diverse, yet shared, historical and cultural backgrounds of the Asian community. Although celebration is emphasized, Asian Heritage Month allows us to contemplate and remember the vital influences that have shaped our communities nationally and locally. For over a half a century, Canadians of Asian descent have contributed to our collective prosperity.

From building the Canadian Pacific Railway to the first Sikh Canadians that joined the Canadian Expeditionary Force during the First World War, and including Winnipeggers John Baboo and John Singh, to Manitoba's distinguished Mr. Philip L. Lee, [phonetic] the former Lieutenant Governor of Manitoba, we are proud of all their efforts. As we commemorate the 15th year of Asian Heritage Month celebrations in Manitoba, we also acknowledge that Asian communities around the world continue to come to Manitoba and make it their home. Their cont ributions to the economy and quality of life in our province are invaluable.

I encourage all Manitobans to join Asian Heritage Month celebrations and activities. Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. Ms. Flor Marcelino (Leader of the Official Opposition): Madam Speaker, the merry month of May marks Asian Heritage Month, an opportunity to celebrate our province's rich cultural diversity and highlight the important contributions Manitoba's Asian community have made in building our province. As Canada celeb rates its 150th anniversary, this year's Asian Heritage Month theme is Celebrating the Contributions of Asian Canadians: Canada 150.

While the contributions of Asian Canadians have not been always fully celebrated or recognized, many have nonetheless acknowledged they had a lasting impact on our province. In every aspect of our society, from arts and culture to science and government, generations of Asian Canadians have made their mark and helped shape our province's history. Today, Manitoba's Asian c ommunity is diverse, thriving and continues to grow.

With representation from nations all over Asia, including India, China, Philippines, Korea, Vietnam, Pakistan, just to name a few, their combined presence is a key part of Manitoba's rich cultural fabric . These communities have helped Manitoba become the prosperous, multicultural and multilingual province that we are proud of today. Throughout this month, events are being held across the province to celebrate Asian Heritage

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1873 Month and I would encourage al l Manitobans to attend. I would like to thank all of the individuals involved in these events for their time, dedication and commitment to sharing their culture with all Manitobans. Thank you. Ms. Cindy Lamoureux (Burrows): Madam Speaker, I ask for leave to speak in response to the ministerial statement. Madam Speaker: Does the member have leave to speak in response to the statement? [Agreed] Ms. Lamoureux: I'm happy to rise today and speak to Asian Heritage Month.

This month has been celebrated for nearly 40 years and this year marks 15 years since the Government of Canada signed an official declaration to designate May as Asian Heritage Month. The reason we recognize Asian Heritage Month is because it's an opportunity t o acknowledge the very rich history of Asian Canadians, their amazing contribution to our economy and to the growth and prosperity they have shared with all of us here.

Madam Speaker, Manitoba makes me so proud when celebrating Asian Heritage Month and that's because we have countless events, associations and community gatherings in celebration of our diversity. This strong celebration of cultural heritage is one of the reasons I pursued politics and why I am such a strong advocate for immigration here in Manitoba. Madam Speaker, in closing, I would encourage the members of the House to attend all of the pavilions this year at Folklorama and check out some of the countless cultural events throughout the year. You won't regret it. Thank you.

Madam Speake r: The honourable Minister of Crown Services, on a ministerial statement, and the required 90 minutes notice prior to routine proceedings was provided in accordance with rule 26(2). Would the honourable minister please proceed with his statement. Dan Guimond Retirement Hon. Ron Schuler (Minister of Crown Services): Madam Speaker, I rise today to announce that Mr. Dan Guimond has announced his intention to retire from the position of president and CEO of Manitoba Public Insurance. Mr.

Guimond's planned departure date is March 16th, 2018, subject to recruitment of his successor and transition of responsibilities, which will be overseen by the corporation's appointed board of directors. * (13:40) Throughout his nearly 30- year career with Manitoba Public Insurance, Mr. Guimond has been driven by a desire to provide Manitobans with superior and innovative insurance products and services while ensuring automobile insurance premiums remain stable, predictable and among the lowest in all of Canada fo r comparable coverage and service. In his three years as president and CEO, Mr.

Guimond has been committed to working collaboratively with stakeholders to achieve important strategic objectives. This includes building strong partnerships with the insur ance brokers of Manitoba, who deliver services in nearly 120 communities throughout the province; partnerships with law enforcement and others who share a strong interest in road safety; and collaboration with the Public Utilities Board of Manitoba on the automobile insurance rates to be charged under the basic compulsory insurance program. Mr.

Guimond also achieved an historic level of co-operation with Manitoba's collision repair industry, leading to a new agreement for collision repairs that helps the industry to prepare for rapid changes in vehicle design, construction and advanced technologies affecting the reparability of vehicles. Of course, this was all done for the benefit of vehicle owners in our province, who can be assured the safety of re paired vehicles is never compromised if involved in a subsequent collision. Also of note is Mr.

Guimond's oversight of many coverage and serv ice enhancements to Manitoba's personal energy protection plan during his time as president and CEO. Under this program, Manitobans who are injured in motor -vehicle accidents anywhere in North America receive guaranteed access to energy –injury compensation benefits regardless of fault, including coverage for unlimited medical and rehabilitation expenses necessary to maximize recovery and restore quality of life to catastrophically injured Manitobans, to the maximum extent possible.

1874 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 As Minister of Crown Services, I wish to personally thank Mr. Guimond for his passion, expertise, commitment and leadership of Ma nitoba Public Insurance. Over the coming months, MPI's board of directors will be overseeing the process to choose a successor for Mr. Guimond and will ensure an effective transition process. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Mr. Andrew Swan (Minto): Madam S peaker, I thank the minister for his statement. For the past three years, Dan Guimond has served as MPI's president and CEO with dedication and passion.

Today, we learn that Dan will be retiring after many years of service to MPI. Dan worked for the MPI for over 20 years before becoming the president and CEO of the corporation. During his time, he's held various positions including vice -president strategy and innovation, and chief information officer with Manitoba Public Insurance. In this role, he was responsible for the management and administration of the corporation's automobile insurance products and services, duties that undoubtedly influenced his role as president.

I know that Dan has an exceptional grasp of the many complex technical issues involved with vehicle insurance. I know he's always been looking ahead on a number of issues, including cutting- edge repair technologies and the prospect of driverless vehicles. It wasn't that long ago that the minister responsible for MPI was entitled to, and thought it was worthwhile to, speak directly with the CEO of MPI. I hope the current minister has been able, at least indirectly, to tap into Mr. Guimond's knowledge. Now, as New Democrats, we are believers in public auto insurance.

Of course, we'v e showed that in Manitoba, affordable insurance rates and good benefits go hand in hand. Manitobans expect to get good value on their vehicle insurance, and for a great many years, they have. Manitobans continue to benefit from the excellent service and lo w insurance rates that public vehicle insurance brings, helping to solidify as Manitoba's affordability advantage, an advantage which I sincerely hope will continue, and Dan Guimond has played a key role in this.

On behalf of our NDP caucus and all Manitobans, I'd like to thank Dan Guimond for his commitment to MPI and wish him all the best for a happy retirement. Ms. Judy Klassen (Kewatinook): I ask for leave to respond to the ministerial statement. Madam Speaker: Does the member have leave to respond to the statement? [Agreed] Ms. Klassen: On behalf of the L iberal caucus – my colleagues, the member for Burrows (Ms. Lamoureux) and the member for River Heights (Mr. Gerrard)–we wish Mr. Daniel Guimond a very happy retirement.

We want to thank him for his decades of service to our province and to the dedication to keeping Manitobans safe on the roads. We can go on again about all his wonderful accomplishments, but that has been well captured by my colleagues. So we want to say that we are sure he will be greatly missed by his co-workers and wish him a lot of joyous time with his family. Congratulations on your retirement. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker: The honourable Minister of Growth, Enterprise and T rade on a ministerial statement.

And I would indicate that the required 90 minutes' notice prior to routine proceedings was provided in accordance with rule 26(2). Would the honourable minister please proceed with his statement. National Mining Week Hon. Cliff Cullen (Minister of Growth, Enterprise and Trade ): May 8th to 14th is National Mining Week, a week that celebrates the important role mining plays in communities across Canada. Manitoba's mineral resource sector is a strong contributor to our provincial economy, creating good jobs and supporting northern and remote communities.

Our government recognizes Manitoba's incredible potential for economic development and growth, which includes responsible resource development. Although Manitoba was recently ranked the second most attractive jurisdiction for mining investment in the world in the 2016 Fraser Institute survey of mining companies, we recognize there is much more work that must be done. Our

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1875 government is supporting this vital engine of economic growth by eliminating red tape and expanding trade opportunities to attract investment into the province's mineral resource sector. In Budget 2017, we announced the continuation of the Mineral Exploration Tax Credit to encourage and promote mineral exploration in the province. This measure will help companies remain competitive, boost exploration and support the industry as a whole.

I encourage all members to join me in celebrating National Mining Week and recognize the important role of this industry in Manitoba's economy. And we appreciate all the good work that the industry does and the many workers that support this industry. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Mr. Tom Lindsey (Flin Flon): This week marks National Mining We ek, an opportunity to celebrate the important role of mining industry in Manitoba. In this province, mining is the second largest primary resource industry and employs around 6,000 Manitobans.

As a representative for the constituency of Flin Flon, I know just how important the industry is for our community. In northern Manitoba, we have a rich history that's been strengthened by jobs and infrastructure created by the mining industry. Smart, strategic investments in mining, health and education will mean good jobs for our young people and help families to raise their kids in the communities they grew up in. Unfortunately for many families in the North, this is not what they're seeing from this government.

All they're seeing is a government that continues to sit on its hands while hundreds of northern workers are facing layoffs, layoffs at Hudbay in Flin Flon and Vale in Thompson. They know that this government's cuts are not the key to unlocking the North's potential. People in Lynn Lake and Leaf Rapids are looking for this government to show leadership by investing in mining to give their communities a futur e. People in the North deserve better from this government. So far, they've seen nothing to spur investment or growth in the North other than s ome sticky notes on a board at their Look North sessions.

Madam Speaker– Madam Speaker: The member's time has expired. Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): I ask for leave to speak to the minister's statement. Madam Speaker: Does the member have leave to speak to the statement? [Agreed] Mr. Gerrard: Madam Speaker, I'm pleased to rise in the House today in celebr ation of National Mining Week. Mining plays an important role in the lives of Manitobans, and we enjoy the products of our mining industries every day.

Most of us would not have to look too far around us to see the benefits of Manitoba mines : the battery in your cell phone, a piece of treasured jewellery or perhaps even the beautiful Tyndall s tone that we enjoy here in our Manitoba Legislature. According to Manitoba's Mineral Resources , our province produces 100 per cent of Canada's cesium, lithium and tantalum. Several of our other active mines produce metals , including copper, nickel, zinc and gold. * (13:50) Mining brings important industry to our province and, in particular, to our North.

These industries employ clos e to 6,000 workers directly and support our economy indirectly in many ways. Manitoba Liberals are supportive of our mining and its efforts. There is great potential in our province for mining, and Liberals are strong believers in mining sustainability. Thank you. MEMBERS' STATEMENTS MSPrebiotics Inc. Hon.

Eileen Clarke (Minister of Indigenous and Municipal Relations ): Madam Speaker, we all know that Manitoba has a rich agricultural heritage, and the long-term success of our economy relies on a strong and thriving agricultural base, but Manitoba's potential does not stop at our farms; it starts there. Innovative food- processing companies and agriculture spinoffs are expanding the footprint on our economy and leaving their mark on the fabric of our province. MSPrebiotics, located in Carberry, Manitoba, in my riding of Agassiz, is one of those companies.

CEO Earl McLaren and his brother Derek have been partners in business for more than 40 years. They got their start on a potato farm near Carberry. They saw an opportunity. By extracting digestion- resistant

1876 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 starch from potatoes, they were able to create a new product to support digestive health. Their new company experienced great success within the agricultural industry but, again, it didn't stop there . Clinical trials at the St. Boniface Alberten [phonetic] research centre showed that MSPrebiotic significantly increases the abundance of good bacteria, reduces bad bacteria, and proved that their product can have an array of positive impacts on human health. Today, MSPrebiotic is available in health stores from Toronto to Winnipeg.

And thanks to their hard work, investments and ingenuity, the McLaren brothers have expanded their Carberry plant, doubled their staff and are looking ahead to a very bright future as global awareness of their brand grows. Madam Speaker, I ask all members of the House today to join me in celebrating the success of MSPrebiotics, as well as Earl and Derek McLaren and this wonderful story of Manitoba entrepreneurship. Woodhaven Community Club Hon. Scott Fielding (Minister of Families): I would like to rise today to recognize Woodhaven Community Club.

Woodhaven Community Club is a non-profit, volunteer-run organization in the heart of Woodhaven that’s open to residents of Woodhaven and the general public. Woodhaven Community Club is the heart of our community in Kirkfield Park and really is a meeting place for friends, families and neighbours all over the community. Woodhaven hosts many community events, whether they'll be consultation sessions, things like town hall meetings, things like wedding socials that are there.

Woodhaven also hosts annual community get-togethers like the Christmas on the Hill that brings together close to 500 people in Woodhaven and the annual spring dinner, which happened just last weekend, and they do accept you no matter what costume you wear, Madam Speaker. Woodhaven Community Club is located at 200 Glendale Boulevard in one of the most beautiful, neat and natural areas of St. James on the –bounded on the Sturgeon Creek, the Assiniboine River, St. Charles golf course and has a true old -country feel to it.

The homes of Woodhaven existed–as exist today were built in the '40s and '50s when the main streets were laid out, and it is some thing that has been there since the early days. The foundations of the home discovered by the river banks at the golf course were believed to belong to Jean- Baptiste Lagimodière and his wife Marie -Anne. Marie-Anne, of course, is the grandmother of Louis Riel.

Woodhaven is also known to have one of the best hills for tobogganing with your families, and I can tell you personally with –growing up as a boy, I spent a lot of–many nights on the hockey rinks and I spent–to this day, I go with my family tobogganing on a biweekly basis anyways with it. I would like to recognize the many volunteers in the community organizations that's a part of this that makes Woodhaven Community Club tick on a everyday basis. I want to thank you on behalf of the community of Woodhaven. I know the president's here, Mr. Mike Weber –I'd like to stand up and recognize you. Thank you very much.

Siloam Mission Hon. Andrew Micklefield (Government House Leader): Madam Speaker, last Thursday, MLAs from all sides of the House attended a breakfast in honour of Siloam Mission, which celebrates its 30th birthday this year. Each year, nearly 9,000 volunteers invest over 85,000 hours to serve over half a million meals, co-ordinate 15,000 visits to clothing rooms and host 40,000 overnight stays.

But wonderful as a hot meal and a warm bed are, Siloam also provides vocational training, health services, counselling, a women's shelter, a housing and mentorship program for at-risk Aboriginal youth, an afternoon gym, haircuts, tax return preparation assistance and access to Alcoholics Anonymous meetings. Through 30 scorching summers and freezing winters, sometimes missing Christmas or summer holidays, a comparatively modest staff, supported by a much larger number of committed volunteers, put time and money aside to help Winnipeg's homeless.

With three decades of evidence, we see that Siloam's work is not in vain. Some who once received help are now helping others, and many who give find they receive much more in return. Madam Speaker, I ask that this House join me in honouring those from Siloam mission who join us in the gallery this afternoon.

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1877 Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Rossmere. Mr. Micklefield: Madam Speaker, I ask for leave to have the names of our guests in the gallery to be recorded in Hansard. Madam Speaker: Does the member have leave to record the names in Hansard? [Agreed] Jim Bell, Jennifer Ferguson International Nurses Day Mr.

Matt Wiebe (Concordia): May 12th marks International Nurses Day, and all this week our caucus has joined with people around the world to celebrate, honour and thank nurses for the contributions they make to health care and the welfare of patients and families. Across the pro vince, nurses play a vital role in keeping our communities healthy, and I personally know many of the nurses that live and work in my constituency.

From tending to our grandparents who are living in personal -care homes to co -ordinating patient care, educat ing the public and helping our fellow Manitobans recover from surgery at our hospitals, nurses support not only the patients, but also their families and loved ones. Recently, nurses have taken on a new role as advocates for our larger health -care system by rallying with the public to stand up to the biggest cuts to our health-care system in a generation.

Nurses understand acutely that this Conservative government's continuous pressure on the health- care system is going to hurt front -line workers, patient s and families. The Premier's (Mr. Pallister) decision to close three emergency rooms is going to affect their ability to provide quality patient care. They believe, as we do, that this government needs to stop thinking only about the bottom line and start thinking about the front line because that's where health care matters in our province. Madam Speaker, today's nurses are working harder than ever before to make sure our families and communities are healthy.

They need to know they are supported, and they need to know that they have a strong future here in this province. That's what we should be thinking about as we honour them this coming Friday. Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. Swan Valley Sport Fishing Enhancement Group Mr. Rick Wowchuk (Swan River): Today I'd like to recognize the Swan Valley Sport Fishing Enhancement group. In 1987, a group of individuals interested in bettering their local fisheries became actively involved in fishing management activities. Their mandate includes conducting fisheries research, enhancement and education.

Their passion has spread throughout our community with new partnerships being created every year. The group's efforts have been recognized at both the provincial and federal levels. They believe when fisheri es are improved so is the community surrounding it. This group works hard to enhance our fisheries and educate the general public on the methods, needs and the importance of preserving and improving habitats for game fish species. Since 1987 they have been educating the public through presentations, seminars, fishing derbies and promotional signage.

They've held family fishing days, fishing trips with school groups and offer a five -day fish course for young anglers. The group has been extremely successful applying for funding through the Fish and Wildlife Enhancement Fund, resulting in securing $944,000 for a diversity of qualifying projects. The group's data collection efforts contributed to proactive management changes to the existing transfer and stocking programs. Just recently, arctic char and musky were reintroduced to the Duck Mountains.

In addition, they've initiated a cost- effective zebra mussel detection program. * (14:00) A highlight of their fundraising initiative is the traditional shore lunc h banquet, which takes place annually the last week in April. The recent 31st banquet attracted 600 angling enthusiasts, featured all -you-can-eat fried walleye and smoked whole pork. It's events like this that enable this group to continue great work. With ongoing support from angling community and a board driven by passion, the group will continue to make substantial impacts now and for the future.

Madam Speaker, I ask everyone to congratulate and commend this dedicated group– Madam Speaker: The member's time has expired.

1878 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 Introduction of Guests Madam Speaker: Prior to oral questions we have some guests in the gallery that I would like to introduce to you. We have seated in the public gallery from École Lagimodière, 32 grade 7 and 8 students under the direction of Nicholas Messner, and this group is located in the constituency of the honourable member for Dawson Trail (Mr. Lagassé). Also in the gallery we have members of the Manitoba Youth Delegation who are the guests of the honourable member for Radisson (Mr. Teitsma).

And also seated in the public gallery from Collicutti Student Voice Program, 15 grade 4 and 5 students under the direction of Fatumah Mbabaali, and this group is located in the constituency of the honourable member for Kildonan (Mr. Curry). On behalf of all honourable members here, we welcome you to the Manitoba Legislature. ORAL QUESTIONS Government Accountability Performance Record Ms. Flor Marcelino (Leader of the Official Opposition): For months the Premier has refused to answer important questions in this House. It's clear why. He says that he will listen to front-line workers, then he closes his ears.

He says he will protect patients, then he closes a QuickCare clinic and urgent-care centr e. He says he wants all hands on deck, but then he takes a 20 per cent salary raise. Why does the Premier say one thing and do another? Hon. Brian Pallister (Premier): Well, apart from the pure falsity of the raise accusation, Madam Speaker, which applied to the previous government but not to this one, I would like to say to the member and all members, thank you for the work during the Estimates process. I think it's a r eally important part of our process.

It's one that also is one that can be attended by the public, and I also wanted to thank the members for their work in that respect. And we've been, of course, trying to accommodate the members of the opposition in respect of the activities of the House and we'll do– continue to do so in every possible way as we move forward as we work together to make the process work for the best interests of Manitobans. Madam Speaker: The honourable interim Leader of the Official Opposition, on a supplementary question. Ms. Marcelino: The Premier says one thing and does another, and he doesn't want to be held accountable.

Madam Speaker, h e promises 97 per cent disclosure of value -for-money reviews, then he packs it in his suitcase and won't share it. He promises a stronger democracy, then rewards wealthy donors while restricting voter access. He promises affordability, then jacks the costs for seniors, students and everyone else. Why isn't the Premier interested in answering to many Manitobans? Mr. Pallister: Well, I am, Madam Speaker, and our– my colleagues are and this government is very, very focused on improving accountability and transparency in every possible way.

We've also tried to, and will continue to make efforts to work in co-operation with members of the opposition whether in the official opposition or the Ottawa -west contingent. But I also want to say that we did receive communication two days ago from the House leader for the opposition saying that he wanted us to suspend the Estimates process and focus on bills, and so we accommodated them yesterday in doing that.

And I was somewhat disappointed to hear that the member from Minto was communicating to the people out through the media that we were hoping to get away from accountability when we were actually working to co-operate with the members opposite. I suggest that the members opposite get their act together and communicate with each other. Communication is important, Madam Speaker. Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Madam Speaker: Order. The honourable interim Leader of the Official Opposition, on a final supplementary. Ms. Marcelino: The Premier says one thing and does the other.

That's why we launched an Ombudsman's review of the Premier's communication. The Premier says he stays in constant contact while away in Costa Rica. Madam Speaker, why won't the Premier answer simple questions and straightforward–be

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1879 straightforward about his communication and so many other important issues? Madam Speaker: The honourable First Minister. Mr. Pallister: Sorry, Madam Speaker, and thank you very much. Thank you to the member for the sequencing of her questions because it allows me to say that although we are following very accurately the practices and p rotocols on communication exercised by the previous government in every respect, we are looking to improve upon them.

One way we are improving on them is that when I take my infrequent breaks, I don't submit a bill for Manitobans, at all, for my phone. Not a bill, not a penny, not a nickel, Madam Speaker, do the taxpayers of Manitoba have to pay. And so I would just mention that because I understand that is not the practice of the members opposite, and that at least some of them have submitted bills for as much as $5,000 for the use of their phones to the people of Manitoba. I won't do that; my colleagues won't do that, Madam Speaker, because we're doing what we said we'd do.

We're fixing the finances of this province after a decade of debt. Premier's

Schedule Staff Communications Mr. Andrew Swan (Minto): Well, Madam Speaker, the Premier's told u s many, many times over of his entitlement to leave the province of Manitoba for weeks and weeks at a time several times a year to escape to Costa Rica. He also claims he stays in regular contact with his staff, giving them guidance on sensitive files. But, surprisingly, this Premier has refused to confirm the most basic of details: how he actually stays in communication with his staff. I hope the Premier can put this issue to rest this afternoon.

Does he actually speak with his staff by telephone when he's down in Costa Rica? Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Madam Speaker: Order. Hon. Brian Pallister (Premier): Madam Speaker, I don't really like to accuse the member of anything he hasn't accused others of or accept accusations from him that he hasn't made to his own former leader. He is continuing to attack me on the same basis that he attacked the member for St. Boniface (Mr. Selinge r), who was in his party, so I should expect no different treatment and don't.

That being said, Madam Speaker, during my infrequent breaks with my family, I endeavour to stay in touch with my office on a regular basis. I adopt the same protocols and protections that have to apply to confidential information the previous government used–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mr. Pallister: –and I am very conscious of the need to make sure that confidential information is protected and will make every effor t to continue to do so. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Minto, on a supplementary question. Mr. Swan: Well, again, we have a Premier that can't answer a very, very simple question.

He claims that he has all kinds of contact, but records from his own office obtained through freedom of information requests show that not a single telephone call and not a single email from Costa Rica has been documented so far. In fact, we've had to ask the Ombudsman's office to become involved to try and find any proof of any calls from any phone in Costa Rica from this Premier I would hope the Premier can simply come clean today and indicate to the House: Does he communicate with staff during his lengthy stays in Costa Rica at all, and if so, how does he do so? Mr.

Pallister: Madam Speaker, it must be a source of amazement to the members opposite to watch a unified and organized political party in action.

Madam Speaker, the most regular forms of communication that they had with one another when they were in government were throwing arrows at each other and stabbing each other in the back, so I'm not sure that the regular communication they depicted to Manitobans demonstrated capability in government or not. * (14:10) Frankly, Madam Speaker, the member oppos ite demonstrated his own integrity and the malleability of it when he rebelled against his former leader and colleagues, and said he could no longer serve with integrity, when at the same time, as soon as that leader was chosen again by the members of his party he jumped on board and was all ready to glad handle.

1880 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 And, Madam Speaker, this is not consistency. This is not a depiction of integrity. That is what we are putting on display for the people of Manitoba and that is what we will continue to do. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Minto, on a final supplementary. Mr. Swan: Well, there is some amazement by this caucus. And it's a part -time Premier who appears to be completely unplugged from his role as the Premier of this province for months each y ear in Costa Rica.

There's no evidence, Madam Speaker, that he's doing the work he claims to do, and the Premier, if he truly wishes to be open and transparent, he should stop dodging the question and actually answer the question being posed to him. The people of Manitoba deserve no less. How does he communicate with staff and why won't he answer the question? Mr. Pallister: Two questions there: How do I communicate with staff? Very well. And how do I guard the secrecy and confidentiality of documents? The same way the previous government did, only better. Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Madam Speaker: Order. Order.

Workplace Safety Priority Inquiry Mr. Tom Lindsey (Flin Flon): It's the 20th anniversary of the North American national occupational health and safety week, and in Canada we are honouring the memory of the victims of the Westray mining disaster. It's more important than ever to emphasize that guaranteeing the health and safety of w orkers must be a top priority of governments and employers, as it is for unions and workers. So I'd like to ask the Minister of Growth, Enterprise and Trade: Does he agree that the health and safety of workers is the No. 1 priority for this government? Hon.

Cliff Cullen (Minister of Growth, Enterprise and Trade ): Yes, we believe that worker safety is very paramount to this government. In fact, that's why just last week we launched the review of the workplace health and safety act. We think this will b e a very good opportunity to engage the business community, workers and, certainly, all of Manitobans in terms of their views in making workplaces more safe here in Manitoba. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Flin Flon, on a supplementary question. Mr. Lindsey: I'd like to table a letter from this minister.

In it he demands that the process to determine the levels of occupational exposure limits for dangerous contaminants like silica and manganese be changed by June 30th. The minister did not de mand that strong worker safety guidelines were the No. 1 consideration. His No. 1 consideration was economic feasibility and competitiveness. Why is this minister not making health and safety of workers the No. 1 priority? Mr. Cullen : I do actually appr eciate this question from the member. Certainly, part of that review, we're going to look at process and we believe there was a flawed process with the previous government.

So we're asking the committees to have a look at the process to make sure the processes are right and not being driven by government policy, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Flin Flon, on a final supplementary. Mr. Lindsey: Madam Speaker, this minister is ordering a change in the process for setting OELs because of his new mandate. OELs protect workers from short - and long- term health problems like hearing loss, liver damage, cancer, serious ailments and death.

But, apparently, adopting the protection set out by international authorities on how to protect workers is not the best practice for this government. Can this minister explain why his mandate changed from protecting workers to protecting the economic interests of employers? Mr. Cullen: Well, Madam Speaker, we want to put Manitobans to work and we think that's the important thing to do. Certainly, EDC had a presentation today at lunch about trade and putting Manitobans back to work. We know where we stand on trade; we're not sure about the NDP.

One member from Fort Garry said, we put our emphasis into making sure that we reduce trade barriers. Another member, the member from Flin Flon, said–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order.

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1881 Mr. Cullen: –he stands against these kinds of trade agreements. Maybe the members opposite should have a conference call and figure out their views on trade. Customary Care Legislation Request to Reintroduce Ms. Nahanni Fontaine (St. Johns): At one point in my home community– Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Madam Speaker: Order. Ms. Fontaine: At one point in my home community of Sagkeeng First Nation, about 13 per cent of our children were under the care of CFS –more than 400 children, Madam Speaker.

This crisis, along with the tragic death of Tina Fontaine, led to the creation of the Circle of Care pilot project. This project, supported by our NDP government, helped to keep upwards of 50 children with their families. Circle of Care was a part of the NDP's customary care bill, which this government has refused to revive as legislation. Will the Families Minister commit to be – bringing back the customary care bill? Hon. Scott Fielding (Minister of Families ): We know that having the amount of children in care that we are–inherited from the previous government is something that we need to fix.

It's unacceptable. We've taken strong steps with The Protecting Children Act within our first 100 days. We've taken steps in terms of accountabili ty and transparency in terms of the advocate for children and youth. We've taken a robust approach to this. This is something, as well, that we introduced in terms of the Throne Speech, where we're going to have a comprehensive review of the Child and Family Services. Madam Speaker: The honourable member of –for St. Johns, on a supplementary question. Ms.

Fontaine: Parents in the Circle of Care project received fast -tracked entry into treatment programs so that families struggling with addictions were able to access issues further and work the steps necessary to put their family back together. Once children had been apprehended, parents were offered an opportunity to gather with family, social service organizations, community members and elders to create a plan that was right for them. A recent evaluation of the Circle of Care highlights the benefits fast-tracked entry had for families and their CFS workers.

Will the Families Minister bring back the customary care and get parents in CFS immediate access to supports that they need? Mr. Fielding : We have taken immediate steps in terms of dealing with the CFS system. We think that the numbers that were left, having a 87 per cent increase in the amount of kids in care, is unacceptable. We've taken stro ng first steps. We want to look at all models that work. The model that she had mentioned, that the members opposite mention, is one that has seen some success. We'll be introducing our comprehensive review to repair the child-welfare system in the coming months.

Madam Speaker: The honourable member of St. Johns, on a final supplementary. Ms. Fontaine: Our customary care bill was about lifting up First Nation communities along with their children and finding solutions that worked for each family. It used traditional indigenous values of collaboration and community to create a program that ensured parents who had children apprehended could reach out and ask for help. Provincial Court Judge Roller says the project is more immediate–and I quote–more immediate, more personal and more humane.

She argues that helping families resolve issues outside the courts is the best way to find the most efficient solution. Will the minister commit today to bring back the customary care legislation? Mr. Fielding: The concern that I have in terms –and our government has –in terms of the approach the previous administration took is the growth of the amount of children in care that would be part of it.

The legislation that was introduced in the dying days of the last administra tion is something that our House leader, at that point, our Opposition House Leader at that point, asked to be prioritized, and that government failed to do that. We have a comprehensive plan to address and reform the child -welfare system. We'll be doing that upon–along with our legislation that we've introduced in terms of The Protecting Children Act, Madam Speaker.

1882 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 * (14:20) Urgent Care Centres and ERs Peachey Report Recommendations Mr. Matt Wiebe (Concordia): On page 203 of the Peachey report, recommendation D-04 clearly states, quote, that the emergency departments in the other three community hospitals –that is, the Seven Oaks, Victoria and Concordia hospitals –should become urgent-care centres. Will the minister be following this recommendation of the Peachey report? Hon. Kelvin Goertzen (Minister of Health , Seniors and Active Living): Mr.

Peachey, who was hand-selected by the NDP and commissioned by the former government to do the report, lai d out on page 62 how he believed the health -care system in Winnipeg should be structured. He specifically indicated there should be two subacute units and three emergency departments working 24 hours-7. In fact, I'm glad that he came to our announcement when the announcement was made by the Winnipeg Regional Health Authority and endorsed the plan, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Concordia, on a supplementary question. Mr.

Wiebe: If the minister would have read past page 62, he would have seen that Dr. Peachey has lots of recommendations and not all of them involve cuts to our health -care system. In fact, on page 203, under recommendation D -08, Dr. Peachey says, and I quote: Where it is determined independently –that is, in this c ase by the Premier's (Mr. Pallister) apparent political interference–quote, that the Emergency Department will close or change to urgent care, the clinical governance will assess whether replacement regional services are available or can be made available. End Quote.

Has the clinical governance does –done that assessment and, if so, what did their findings show? Were the regional options for the projected 100,000 displaced patients throughout our city? Mr. Goertzen: And, Madam Speaker, the member is correct that beyond the specific recommendation on how the system should be aligned, that Dr. Peachey indicated were three emergency rooms and two subacute units.

He also recommended things like enhanced home care, and that's why we were glad to accept the r ecommendation to bring in enhanced home care where 1,200 people each and every year who would otherwise remain in hospital will be able to go home under the new system. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Concordia, on a final supplementary. Mr. Wiebe: Madam Speaker, the fact is that the Peachey report is the sole j ustification that this Premier has given for closing our emergency rooms, and it's clear that they're picking and choosing only the parts of the report that fit their narrative and ignoring the rest.

Every other health expert, every other health professional, every person on the street understands that cutting ERs in a community not only hurts that community, but overloads the rest of an already overburdened system. The–this minister has put the bottom line over the front line and made the biggest cuts to our health-care system in a generation. Will he reverse this decision and keep our community access to health care open? Mr. Goertzen: Well, Madam Speaker, I'm sorry that the member wo uld say that about health- care professionals such as Dr. Jack McPherson who attended the announcement; Dr.

Eberhard Renner who attended the announcement; Dr. Bruce Roe who attended the announcement; Dr. Alecs Chochinov who, in fact, is the president of the Canadian Association of Emergency Physicians; and, of course, Dr. Peachey; Chief John Lane was there, and many others. The member simply isn't paying attention. The justification, the sole justification for making changes was the record, the abysmal, th e horrible wait times that came up under ERs under that government, Madam Speaker. Misericordia Urgent Care Centre Government Reason for Closure Hon.

Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Madam Speaker, in the last two decades the Misericordia Health Centre Foundation and the Urgent Care Centre team have developed, together with the Buhler Eye Care Centre, an extraordinary centre of excellence. The Urgent Care Centre has the highest patient satisfaction rates and the shortest wait times of all urgent -care and emergency rooms in Winnipeg–and a balanced budget. Last week hundreds of people rallied to save the Misericordia Urgent Care Centre.

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1883 I ask the Minister of Health, who has said he plans to eliminate the Misericordia Urgent Care Centre, just to be sure: Is this his final answer? Hon. Kelvin Goertzen (Minister of Health , Seniors and Active Living): Well, Madam Speaker, the final answer that we have given as a government is that wait times that stretch eight, 10, 12 hours is simply not acceptable in a health -care system. Manitobans deserve when they go to an emergency room to actually get care. They deserve when they move to an urgent-care centre to actually get care.

It is our final answer that we're going to fix the problem, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for River Heights, on a supplementary question. Mr. Gerrard: But they do get care at the Misericordia Urgent Care Centre and they're very satisfied, so why is he closing it? Madam Speaker, we know, as the minister himself has said, that he's adopted the recommendations of the NDP's Peachey report, a report commissioned by, and first presented to, the NDP government. The minister himself said on Monday, and I quote, we are following the NDP recommendation.

But the Peachey report does not specifically recommend that the Misericordia Urgent Care Centre should be closed. Yet the minister wants to abandon the Misericordia Urgent Care Centre. I ask the minister: Is this his final answer? Mr. Goertzen : Well, Madam Speaker, we have made it clear that we are going to fix the problems when it comes to long wait times. Dr . Peachey indicated there should be three emergency rooms and two subacute units, and the NDP commi ssion report said that clearly. So he's talking about final answer, maybe he should phone a friend that doesn’t cost $5,000, Madam Speaker.

But if he phoned that friend, that friend would say they shouldn't have to wait eight hours in an emergency room. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for River Heights, on a final supplementary. Mr. Gerrard: Madam Speaker, I've talked to many people and they say that the shortest wait times in Manitoba are in the urgent -care room in the Misericordia Health Centre. This week is International Nursing Week, and I can tell the House that many nurses at the rally told me how proud and excited they were to be working at the Misericordia Urgent Care Centre.

Each year, more than 11,000 people from the core area of Winnipeg use the Misericordia Urgent Care Centre, and yet the minister has decided to close it and abandon people in Winnipeg's core. I ask one more time: Is the minister absolute ly sure that closing the Misericordia Urgent Care Centre is his final answer? Mr.

G oertzen: Well, I hope that that is his final question, because I'm going to say to him one more time: what was not acceptable is that Winnipeggers, and people who are coming from other parts of Manitoba sometimes, were sitting in emergency rooms for six, seven, eight, nine, 10 hours, Madam Speaker, waiting for care. That is why I assume the former NDP government, the Selinger government, commissioned the Peachey report, handpicked Dr. Peachey to do the report. I'm assuming that's why they did it, to try to get better care. We're going to get better care where they never could achieve it, Madam Speaker.

Investment in Mining Sector Government Initiatives Mr. Kelly Bindle (Thompson): Madam Speaker, my background is in mining, and we've been hearing some good news about Manitoba's mining sector. Manitoba was recently ranked the second most attractive jurisdiction for mining investment in the world. These types of investments provide great economic opportunity and job growth for Manitobans, particularly i n the North, where I'm from. Could the Minister of Growth, Enterprise and Trade, please explain to the House how our government's efforts towards the mining sector are generating good jobs for Manitobans? Hon.

Cliff Cullen (Minister of Growth, Enterprise and Trade ): I do appreciate the question from the member of Thompson. He obviously understands the importance of mining in Manitoba. Even though we went from 19th place to second place, we recognize there's more work to do to create an environment for investment here in Manitoba.

1884 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 Madam Speaker, this government will develop a positive and effective consultation process. We will provide certainty around land use and we will also ensure that we have an effective internal process to deal with permits and work orders, and we will work with industry to reduce red tape. Madam Speaker, this work will result in greater investments and benefits for all Manitobans. Manitoba Hydro Affordability Promotion Mr.

Ted Marcelino (Tyndall Park): The Minister of–for Crown Services can't seem to see any opportunities for Hydro, but the Minister for Growth, Enterprise and Trade was trying to sell power to our western provinces. * (14:30) Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Mr. Marcelino: I ask the minister– Madam Speaker: Order. Mr. Marcelino: –for Crown Services: Will he listen to his colleague and get on board in promoting Manitoba's energy advantage? Hon. Ron Schuler (Minister of Crown Services): I do want to talk about the NDP bipole -Keeyask levy, which, Madam Speaker, is an NDP levy of disrespect.

For instance, the Keeyask dam was sent to the Public Utilities Board after the construction had started. That's disrespect. The bipole line was disallowed to go in front of the PUB. That's disrespect. And, unfortunately, Madam Speaker, this disrespect will cost Manitoba ratepayers for generations. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Tyndall Park, on a supplementary question. Power Sale to Saskatchewan Mr. Marcelino : I had a very simple question. I didn't get an answer again.

So I ask the Minister for Growth, Enterprise and Trade: When he is working to sell more power to our neighbours in Saskatchewan, how might he transmit the power, on the east side of Lake Winnipeg or from the west side? Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Madam Speaker: Order. Order. Mr. Schuler: The NDP bipole -Keeyask levy is all about NDP disrespect. In fact, the bipole Hydro fiasco, according to the NDP, was supposed to pay for itself. The NDP felt it was supposed to be cheaper than free. Now, Madam Speaker, we find out it's at over $4 billion.

The NDP cost overrun is a clear disrespect to Manitoba Hydro ratepayers, and this will cost Manitoba ratepayers for generations. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Tyndall Park, on a final supplementary. Minister's Comments Mr. Marcelino: I promise this is the final question. Will the Crown Services Minister please withdraw his claim that Manitoba Hydro is bankrupt? Mr.

Schuler: Madam Speaker, I would like to read from a document, and then I will table it, and it's about the bipole line put out by the NDP, and I'd like to quote from it directly: Hugh McFadyen knows the bipole will not cost taxpayers a single cent. It is paid for by inter national hydro sales. McFadyen is making numbers up. And today we found out that the hydro line, the bipole line, is going to cost more than $4 billion, Madam Speaker. And it's going to be ratepayers for generations who are going to pay for this mistake. Air Canada Centre for Excellence Employment Creation Inquiry Mr.

James Allum (Fort Garry -Riverview): Last July, the Minister of Growth, Enterprise and Trade claimed with great fanfare that he had held Air Canada to account and stood up for aerospace workers. The minister claimed that Air Canada was going to create a centre of excellence and it was goin g to create 150 jobs here in Winnipeg. Can the minister update the House: How many jobs are there right now? Hon. Cliff Cullen (Minister of Growth, Enterprise and Trade ): I do appreciate the question from the member opposite. We certainly recognize that aerospace is an important industry for us in Manitoba.

Certainly discussions with Air Canada are ongoing. We

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1885 certainly believe there is room for expansion in the aerospace business here in Manitoba. We've seen some new jobs created in that sector and we're looking forward, actually, to having more jobs created in that sector. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Fort- Garry Riverview, on a supplementary question. Mr. Allum: Well, that's a tricky proposition, Madam Speaker. He's going to create mor e jobs, yet there appear to be no jobs at this particular place.

He said –the minister claimed at the time that 150 jobs would be created with an additional 250 jobs in–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mr. Allum: –waiting. The minister turned himself into a pretzel, patting himself on the back over this announcement. If things were going so well, why doesn't he tell us how many jobs are there right now? Mr. Cullen: Well, Madam Speaker, I will guarantee there's more jobs out there now than there was when the NDP left office. Madam Speaker, we have a really important industry here.

In fact, there's a very important research component to the operations in the aerospace industry. In fact, I just toured a facility that was undergoing a $25-million expansion that's due to be open this fall. That will create more jobs. Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh. Madam Speaker: Order, please. The honourable member for Fort Garry - Riverview, on a final supplementary. Mr. Allum: The minister is supposed to be doing a job here. He's supposed to be holding Air Canada to account after the government dropped its lawsuit against the airline. The–Air Canada made a commitment to create a centre of excellence here.

It made a commitment to create upwards of 400 jobs here. To date, there are no jobs. So why doesn't the minister get on the phone and call Air Canada. Or, conversely–[interjection] Madam Speaker: Order. Mr. Allum: –conversely, Madam Speaker, he could get the Premier (Mr. Pallister) to pick up his phone but he–apparently, he doesn't have one. Mr. Cullen : We're committed to creating jobs, Madam Speaker. In fact, I could fly down to Toronto and see the CEO of Air Canada, stay there for a week, and spend less than members opposite are submitting in phone bills. Wastewater Upgrades New Funding for Projects Mr.

Rick Wowchuk (Swan River): Madam Speaker, I was pleased to see the Minister of Indigenous and Municipal Relations announce the funding of several water and wastewater infrastructure projects recently, particularly the 6th Avenue Wastewater Pump Station upgrade project in my constituency. I know the Town of Swan River has been keen to see the project funded. Can the minister tell us about the projects funded, and w hat it'll mean to the communities getting the funding? Madam Speaker: The honourable Minister of Growth, Enterprise and Trade. Hon.

Eileen Clarke (Minister of Indigenous and Municipal Relations): I thank the member for that great question. Our $1.7-billion infrastructure plan is amongst the highest total infrastructure expenditures in Manitoba history. It's another reason why our budget is such great news for all municipalities. This is just one out of 24 water and wastewater projects that will soon b egin, representing over $38 million in new capital spending. Building on these investments, Budget 2017 adds an additional $2 million to the budget for Manitoba Water Services Board projects.

Madam Speaker, these important investments will help foster sustainable economic growth and safe, healthy communities for Manitobans to live and work. Thank you. * (14:40) Nursing Profession Employment Concerns Ms. Cindy Lamoureux (Burrows): May 8th to 14th is National Nursing Week. It's a week dedicated to thanking nurses for their compassion, hard work and dedication to patient care. It is well deserved.

1886 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 What is not deserved is this government's continuance to practise and their unsureness in job security Would the government answer the calls of the nurses here in Manitoba and give them assurance regarding their futures in health care? Hon. Kelvin Goertzen (Minister of Health , Seniors and Active Living): Well, Madam Speaker, of course nurses are an integral part of the health-care system, along with many other health-care professionals. We value the work that they do each and every day on the front lines in our health-care system.

We know that they're giving a quality service and care at the bedsi de and other places for many Manitobans. Of course we value the work that nurses do each and every day. Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Burrows, on a supplementary question. Changes to Health-Care Services Timeline for Implementation Ms. Cindy Lamoureux (Burrows): Madam Speaker, this government has yet to provide a detailed plan or a timeline of these drastic health-care changes. Would the minister please share with the House what Manitobans should be expecting next with respect to closing down the three ERs? Hon.

Kelvin Goertzen (Minister of Health , Seniors and Active Living): Well, Madam Speaker, Manitobans should be expecting results and we're going to provide them results. We've indicated that waiting six, seven, eight, 10 hours in an emergency room, as happened for the previous 17 years under the NDP government, simply wasn't acceptable. That is why we're taking action on the Peachey report which was commissioned by the NDP.

But if the member wants to help us she could dial up her fri ends in Ottawa, for less than $5,000 she could even fly there and visit and try to get us real support from the federal Liberal government, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker: The time for oral questions has expired. PETITIONS Kelvin High School Gymnasium and Wellness Centre Mr. Andrew Swan (Minto): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. The background to this petition is as follows:

(1) Manitobans recognize how important it is to provide young people with quality learning spaces to succeed in school.

(2) Sport, recreation and the spaces to engage in them are critical to the health and welfare of all students.

(3) All forms of educational infrastructure, including gymnasiums and recreation centres in general, represent an i ncredible value -for-money investment whereby the return is improved physical and psychological health and wellness.

(4) Kelvin High School is one of the largest high schools in the province with over 1,200 students.

(5) Kelvin High School spent several years raising almost $1.2 million towards the construction of a new gymnasium and wellness centre.

(6) Some Kelvin students currently have to pay to use outside facilities to obtain their mandatory physical education credit.

(7) The provincial government, in a regressive and short -sighted move, cancelled funding for the Kelvin gym and wellness centre for political reasons, despite the extensive community support, fund-raising and engagement.

(8) It is wasteful and disrespectful to the dedicated efforts of students, staff and the community in general to simply lay their goals aside without consultation. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to recognize the need for excellent recreation facilities in all Manitoba schools, to reverse this regressive cut and to provide Kelvin High School with the funding necessary to complete a new gymnasium and wellness centre. And this petition is signed by many Manitobans, Madam Speaker.

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1887 Madam Speaker: In acco rdance with our rule 133(6), when petitions are read they are deemed to be received by the House. St. Boniface QuickCare Clinic Mr. Greg Selinger (St. Boniface): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. The background to this petition is as follows: QuickCare clinics support the health-care system by offering important front -line health-care services that help seniors and families.

The six QuickCare clinics in Winnipeg are accessible, located within co mmunities and have extended hours so that families and seniors can access high-quality primary health care quickly and close to home. QuickCare clinics are staffed by registered nurses and nurse practitioners who are able to diagnose and treat non- urgent-care needs as well as perform procedures and interpret diagnostic tests. The bilingual St. Boniface QuickCare clinic actively offered an essential health -care service in French to Winnipeg's Franco-Manitoban community.

Having access to bilingual services is essential to ensuring the ongoing vitality of the Franco-Manitoban community. The provincial government has announced the closing of the St. Boniface QuickCare clinic on January 27 th, 2017, leaving St. Boniface and St. Vital seniors and others around the city and their families without access to community health care. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to both recognize the importance of bilingual health -care services in Manitoba and reverse their decision to close the St. Boniface QuickCare clinic.

Signed by many, many Manitobans. Thank you. Kelvin High School Gymnasium and Wellness Centre Ms. Amanda Lathlin (The Pas): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. The background to this position–petition is as follows: Manitobans recognize how important it is to provide young people with quality learning spaces to succeed in school.

(2) Sport, recreation and the spaces to engage in them are critical to the health and welfare of all students.

(3) All forms of educational infrastructure, including gymnasiums and recreation centres in general, represent an incredible value- for-money investment whereby the return is improved physical and psychological health and wellness.

(4) Kelvin High School is one of the largest high schools in the province, with over 1,200 students.

(5) Kelvin High School spent several years raising almost $1.2 million tow ards the construction of a new gymnasium and wellness centre.

(6) Some Kelvin students currently have to pay to use outside facilities to obtain their mandatory physical education credit.

(7) The provincial government, in a regressive and short -sighted move, cancelled funding for the Kelvin gym and wellness centre for political reasons, despite the extensive community support, fund-raising and engagement.

(8) It is wasteful and disrespectful to the dedicated efforts of students, staff and the community in general to simply lay their goals aside without consultation. We petition the legislative of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to recognize the need for excellent recreation facilities in all Manitoba schools, to reverse this re gressive cut and to provide Kelvin High School with the funding necessary to complete a new gymnasium and wellness centre. Madam Speaker: Any further petitions? Taxi Industry Regulation Mr. Ted Marcelino (Tyndall Park): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly. And the background to this petition is as follows:

(1) The taxi industry in Winnipeg provides an important service to all Manitobans.

1888 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017

(2) The taxi industry is regulated to ensure there are both the provision of taxi service and a fair and affordable fare structure.

(3) Regulations have been put in place that has made Winnipeg a leader in protecting the safety of taxi drivers through the installation of shields and cameras.

(4) The regulated taxi system also has significant measures in place to protect passengers, including a stringent complaint system.

(5) The provincial government has moved to bring in legislation through Bill 30 that will transfer jurisdiction to the City of Winnipeg in order to bring in so-called ride-sharing services like Uber.

(6) There were no consultations with the taxi industry prior to the introduction of this bill.

(7) The introduction of this bill jeopardizes safety, taxi service and also puts consumers at risk, as well as the livelihood of hundreds of Manitobans, many of whom have invested their life savings into the industry.

(8) The proposed legislation also puts the regulated framework at risk and could lead to issues such as what has been seen in other jurisdictions, including differential pricing, not providing service to some areas of the city and significant risks in terms of taxi driver and passenger safety. We petition the Legislative Assem bly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to withdraw its plans to deregulate the taxi industry, including withdrawing Bill 30. This petition was signed by many Manitobans. Ms.

Flor Marcelino (Leader of the Official Opposition): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba. The background to this petition is as follows: * (14:50) The taxi industry in Winnipeg provides an important service to all Manitobans.

(2) The taxi industry is regulat ed to ensure there are both the provision of taxi service and a fair and affordable fare structure.

(3) Regulations have been put in place that has made Winnipeg a leader in protecting the safety of taxi drivers through the installation of shields and cameras.

(4) The regulated taxi system also has significant measures in place to protect passengers, including a stringent complaint system.

(5) The provincial government has moved to bring in legislation through Bill 30 that will transfer jurisdiction to the City of Winnipeg in order to bring in so-called ride-sharing services like Uber.

(6) There were no consultations with the taxi industry prior to the introduction of this bill.

(7) The introduction of this bill jeopardizes safety, taxi service and also puts consumers at risk, as well as the livelihood of hundreds of Manitobans, many of whom have invested their life savings into the industry.

(8) The proposed legislation also puts the regulated framework at risk and could lead to issues such as wh at has been seen in other jurisdictions, including differential pricing, not providing service to some areas of the city and significant risks in terms of taxi driver and passenger safety. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to withdraw its plans to deregulate the taxi industry, including withdrawing Bill 30. Signed by many, many Manitobans. Thank you. Mr. Jim Maloway (Elmwood): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly.

The background to this petition is as follows: The taxi industry in Winnipeg provides an important service to all Manitobans. The taxi industry is regulated to ensure that there are both the provision of taxi service and a fair and affordable fare structure. Regulations have been put in place that has made Winnipeg a leader in protecting the safety of taxi drivers through the installation of shields and cameras. The regulated t axi system also has significant measures in place to protect passengers, including a stringent complaint system.

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1889

(5) The provincial government has moved to bring in a legislation through Bill 30 that will transfer jurisdiction to the City of Winnipeg in order to bring in so-called ride-sharing services like Uber.

(6) There were no consultations with the taxi industry prior to the introduction of this bill.

(7) The introduction of this bill jeopardizes safety, taxi service and also puts consumers at ri sk, as well as the livelihood of hundreds of Manitobans, many of whom have invested their life savings into the industry.

(8) The proposed legislation also puts the regulated framework at risk and could lead to issues such as what has been seen in other jurisdictions, including differential pricing, not providing service to some areas of the city and significant risk in terms of taxi driver and passenger safety. We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows: To urge the provincial government to withdraw its plans to deregulate the taxi industry, including withdrawing Bill 30. And this petition is signed by many Manitobans. Thank you. Madam Speaker: Grievances. ORDERS OF THE DAY GOVERNMENT BUSINESS Hon.

Andrew Micklefield (Government House Leader): Madam Speaker, this afternoon we would like to continue with Estimates. Madam Speaker: The House will now resolve itself into Committee of Supply. Mr. Deputy Speaker, please take the Chair. COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY (Concurrent Sections) EXECUTIVE COUNCIL * (15:20) Mr. Chairperson (Dennis Smook): Will the Committee of Supply please come to order. This

section of the Committee of Supply will now resume consideration of the Estimates for the Department of Executive Council. The floor is now open for questions. The – Mr. Lindsey–the honourable –no, the member for Flin Flon. Mr. Tom Lindsey (Flin Flon): It's been a couple of days since he's had to do it, so. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I welcome everybody back to the Executive Council Estima tes process again, and–I guess I'll go out on a wing here and ask some labour-type questions of the Premier.

And just– we know about vacancy management, and I asked in Agriculture very specifically, I looked at some numbers there. But could the Premier giv e us any indication of what kind of vacancy management is in place overall for government departments and whether he believes that number should go up or go down, or how he's managing that? Hon. Brian Pallister (Premier): I thank the member for the question. First of all, I'd be remiss if I didn't wish the member for Logan (Ms. Marcelino)–Logan? Flor? An Honourable Member: Yes. Mr. Pallister: –the best this Sunday.

She's the only one on the committee here presently, apart from someone sitting on the side over there, the member for Riel (Ms. Squires), who will be acknowledged on Mother's Day, and I wanted to congratulate her on Mother's Day. And also I know it's a special day this year for her, especially, so I wanted to say that. I would appreciate the question from the member in respect of the vacancy management issue. It's not possible with the dynamic nature of government, and all the different departments having very different demands put upon them, to have one policy for all.

So the member's asking me, you know, should the numbers go up, should they go down. I think generally, though, it would be fair to say that we recognize that the level of government spending isn't sustainable because we're– you know, we're running up against billion dollars or close on deficit. And so, given that three out of four dollars approximately is our–is payroll, we got to take a look at how we can consolidate and do things better within our government operations. So I would say, like most governments across Canada, very likely overall numbers aren't likely to go up.

And it wouldn't be affordable or realistic to suggest that would be the case. That being said, there are certain parts of the government operations where employment –service

1890 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 demands are going to drive additional position needs, so there's no doubt that in some areas there's going to be, you know, an additional push on. If I could, I wanted to–as I' ve been doing– when I take questions for notice, I like to get back an answer. And so the member for Logan (Ms. Marcelino) had asked me about the Building Manitoba Fund, and I just got the detail on that now. There's some reference on page 21 of the budget document to the –that answers, in part, I think, what the member was asking, and I'll just quote from that.

Under the section, partnerships, much of our time during our first year in government been spent listening to our municipal partners. We're c ommitted to supporting all municipalities, including Winnipeg, of course, through a simplified approach that provides more flexibility and autonomy for local decision making. That's this basket funding thing we've been talking about doing. And this is cert ainly come–regardless as in the North, south, didn't matter.

When you're talking to the municipal people, they were saying, we'd like a little bit more latitude in terms of how we manage the resources that we get, and some simplification in terms of the pa per processes. So that's where this single -window model that we were talking about is going, the idea being to simplify those processes that are used that often, in the past, have been a source of concern for local governments. * (15:30) Also for third-party proponents, too, not just for governments, but for third parties, say, NGOs.

Various non- profits have said they'd like a simpler model, something that they can fit into that's easier for them because a lot of them are scarce on resources too. As we all know, working with some of our community groups there's not often an abundance of resources, and if we can simplify processes and help them do the important work they do, that's good, too. So, for example, when it comes to things like applying for cost -sharing or using strategic investment strategies within infrastructure, maximizing value from the taxpayers' investments that we're making on their behalf, this is really important.

So that's–that's a kind of quick overview. The funding in this budget delivers on that commitment, because what it does, it consolidates all the existing funding within the Building Manitoba Fund and adds in other grants to it, but the line is essentially the same in terms of dollars. It's just tha t it's bundled under a single basket, and now we're working together with AMM and other organizations to make that system work better. We know we've got challenging fiscal times.

We know all governments are dealing with reduced revenue flows as economic growth tends to–well, it isn't at the levels it was in years past, and the members know that–but we continue to demonstrate a very significant commitment to local governments with our funding commitments. Mr. Lindsey: Thank you for responding to my question and to the member from Logan's question, the interim leader's question.

Getting back to vacancy management for a minute, if we can, is it part of an overall strategy to see those numbers of vacancies perhaps go up as a way of limiting government expenditures without appearing to have gotten rid of anybody, just as people retire or quit, not to replace them, so that those numbers go down? Mr. Pallister: I would say the demographic reality is what we're all facing, right?

This is –there is a really good interesting article, if members didn't have a chance to see it, in Globe and Mail last week on –for the first time in a lot of jurisdictions the number of retirees passing basically everybody else in terms of our population. So there's a demographic reali ty that's at work across most of the Western world, right, a little less so here in Manitoba, because we do have a bit younger population.

We've got a lot of –the RM of Stanley, for example, you know that area around Winkler-Morden is the youngest local government in Canada, and it's because they've had significant immigration to that area and a lot of really large families have come in there. So they're actually not – they're not representative of the reality for the rest of the country, you know. But the r eality is for us the same as it is for every government workforce across the country. Our workforce is aging, so –seen different literature on this and it varies by department.

But you may have 5, 6 per cent of people eligible to retire each year–[interjection]–yes, and even higher turnover because some do also elect to leave, pre- retire–you know, pre their max retirement. Some elect to retire for various reasons, perhaps because a spouse is

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1891 retired and they –they're wanting to join their spouse in their retirement time. So this provides a renewal of sorts, but it provides a load of challenges, too, in terms of recruitment, in terms of motivation, right, in terms of wanting to effectively keep your civil service strong and excited about being there. It's li ke they –what's it called–the ancient curse, right, challenges and opportunities, they go together.

So, with us, as with every –really every jurisdiction in Canada, there is an opportunity and a challenge at the same time because you're losing some really good people that have been around that have great expertise and you need to get new people into the business of providing services to the public at the same time. Mr. Lindsey: Certainly appreciate what the Premier's talking about with the challenge. I know from conversations I've had, for example, with the CEO of the Northern Health Region that there's a really big vacancy problem there already and attracting people is becoming more of a challenge.

So does the government have an overall strategy of how to attract new people or to retain existing people so this vacancy number doesn't become an actual deterrent for people staying so that their workloads would become too much, that more people are actually trying to get out. So do you have an overall strategy to address that? Mr. Pallister: That's a really good–it's a tough topic because there's so many aspects to it, as the member knows, but it's a really important topic because you want to have a motivated workforce. And motivation is–it's tough to recruit and retain if the workload is too great.

It's also tough to retain if the workload isn't great enough, if people don't feel challenged in their work, right, so it's a delicate balance. And it's not an easy thing to do. Private sector, public sector, it's a very, very challenging aspect of getting a successful organization going. I've had the chance to pick the brains of a few people who are real experts on this field when I was in Ottawa, involved with –in public service there, and with the federal civil service, of course, much, much larger , you know, so it's a monumental challenge there.

But here it's also a challenge because we have some really, really difficult social problems, for example. And that's a tough area for people to work in. And so I have a tremendous admiration for the people that work in caregiving professions, in the social services, for example, because they are dealing with some really, really difficult situations, rough situations. And keeping enthused and positive and feeling good about your work is –can be very, very hard. Days can be uneven in that area of public service. And we need good people to help other people who need help.

And so in that area there's been some expansion, some recruitment. A lot of the new workforce in social services has been added in the las t five or six years. There are a lot of –there–a lot more people with less years of service, which creates additional training opportunities and challenges, as well. And, for example, I'm told an– you know, someone who's experienced in social work can handle a bigger workload because of those years of experience they have. Someone just coming in may not be yet capable of doing that level of work, right.

It's a delicate balancing act to not overwork the experienced one at the same time as you're putting pressure on the new person to get up the learning curve too fast. There's a delicate balancing act there.

Same is true in health care, where, in the caring professions of any kind, where there's an aging workforce in nursing and teaching, as well, and keeping those professions enjoyable, rewarding and also making sure the compensation, the benefits and so on are at a level where we can encourage people to come in and support themselves, support their families in those jobs, is a real important aspect of what we're–what we have to do.

I would also say, though, that it's important – and, I mean, people in the caring professions, for example, all know this too–it's important to have these services available on a sustainable basis going forward. And in –with many gov ernments over the last number of years, the budgets have gone increasingly away from some of these departments and over to, say, health care. So the member would know, we looked at the pie chart, you know, from 10 years ago, virtually every jurisdiction he alth care was less as a percentage of provincial budgets than it is now. Part of that's the aging population.

This has meant there's less dollars available for other things, whether it would be, and I know the member's particular, as I am, particularly i nterested in worker safety. There's been less money available for important issues of investment in other files and a greater tendency to borrow more, lever more and, in Manitoba, run deficits–very, you know, very significant deficits the last few years.

1892 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 But we have to sustain our social services going forward. And to do that, we can't continue down this path of running, you know, deficits that are getting larger and larger at a time when most experts are saying we're on the verge of having to absorb larger– like, higher interest rates would mean higher debt service costs. That's going to take millions, tens of millions, potentially hundreds of millions of dollars away from the very front -line services that we're– that we value most and we want to prot ect for Manitobans.

So it's not an easy thing, and I hope I've addressed some aspects of what the member's–I look forward to talking more with him about this issue, because I think it's really important for us to talk about. * (15:40) Mr. Lindsey: I'm no t sure that you've really addressed the heart of the question yet. I mean, I recognize, as do you, that there's certainly challenges in how to manage that and–but I'm not sure that I've heard you say that either as a whole the government has a plan or by department they have a plan. I just –focus on northern health, for just a moment, as an example.

I know every time I talk to the CEO up there it's one of the big challenges they have is that they have a significant vacancy rate, which is really leading to a higher vacancy rate because the first opportunity a lot of people have in health care today to get out –I'm talking health -care aides and nurses –they take that opportunity then because the workload has grown substantially. They, particularly now, don't se e their pay keeping pace with the cost of living in the North, for example, which then makes it harder again.

So is there very specific plans on how the government wants to or plans to address this – what I see at least as a growing vacancy rate which is just making the problem bigger and causing the problem to grow again. Mr. Pallister: I agree with the member on that observation. It's a particular challenge in some areas of the province, not exclusively the North, but –for recruitment–get, you know, finding the right people. We can–we'll leave doctors aside for now, but that's a good example of one challenge.

But there are others as well where you need a person or people with certain skill sets and not available and you've got to try to find those people and bring them in. It's tricky. I think I can give some specifics to the member. The Civil Service Commission has a number of different programs that it uses to encourage development and recruitment within the civil service. We've got internship progra ms, for example, for folks with disabilities.

That would be one example of a specific program, something that we're working– I know the previous administration endeavoured to as well –to do a better job of making sure that we have work opportunities, job opportunities for folks that have a disability of some kind. That's a really important part of, I think, what government can do. It's something the government can do to sort of set the example also for the private sector to follow.

Management internship pro grams for folks that are–that want to get involved in that stream of work, women's leadership programs, there's also a talent management program for senior leaders, as well –I'm touching on some. I've asked–I don't know if we'll have them today, but I've as ked for some additional information so that if we can continue this discussion I'll have more detail for the member. But I'm just touching on some of the areas that –where there's some programs available.

There's a common training unit in government called organizational and staff development that works around–that planning provides training, for example, for employees using new technologies. Also, there's a number of traditional programs as well.

One of the areas that's increasingly important – and I come from this background in the private sector–is succession training, succession planning, working–in my case, if I could, I'll just say over the years I developed my little business to become a little bit bigger, working especially on helping families that were in transition, right, so that if –let's use a farm machinery dealership or something as an example, right. And a couple's built it up over the years and they're looking for a son or daughter to continue in the business. The training demands on that.

The estate planning around being fair to the other kids and all these types of things, this is a really interesting and intimate kind of work and I enjoyed that work. You really get to know the family and you get to know what their priorities are. You get to know the history of how they built up their little business, whatever it is, right, and help them to get through the hiccups of this difficult time, because retirement can be one of the most stressful times for all of us, actually. They say it's one of the highest stress times, apart from losing a child, losing a

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1893 spouse, retirement is one of the more stressful times for people in their lives. And so succession planning in the workplace is what the member, I think, in a sense, is raising too, right, because you've got a lot of people approaching retirement. How do you–if he and I and a few of our colleagues are working in the unit and providing a service, whatever that service is, and then we decide to leave, if we were the team leaders, you know, who's replacing us?

And building a system where people can come in, take over those responsibilities and it can be as smooth as possible is a real challenge. So these are some of the programs that the government is operating to deal with a lot of these issues, and they're particularly important, as I said earlier, when you've got such a high percentage of these baby boomers coming thr ough the system that are approaching retirement right now; it's particularly important. I would also mention that there are initiatives the Civil Service Commission leads as well on respectful workplace and working to make sure that that is the thing.

And I think, probably, those materials would be useful to distribute to MLAs for our conduct during question period as well –all of us, not just the member for Flin Flon (Mr. Lindsey). Mr. Lindsey: I'm not sure that the Premier (Mr. Pallister) just took a shot at me or not, but I've been known to do that a time or two myself, so I'll roll with it. Just before I leave this vacancy management line of questioning, I know that, right now, in the North, health care has become a fly -in, fly-out proposition. They don't attract people anymore. The doctors come for a week and then they leave.

Nurses come for a week and they leave. We're down, now, to paramedics and ambulance drivers being fly -in and fly-out. Is that part of this government's overall strategy, is to have health care in the North like a mining camp where there's no permanency to any of them? Mr. Pallister: No. And I really appreciate the member's comments on this, and I think the Health Minister can elaborate much better than I on the specifics, but I do know that the membe r's talking about a very serious concern.

One of the areas –and, of course, part of this, with indigenous communities, is a lack of –as we've talked about before, is a lack of investment by the federal government in primary health care. And that has, frankly, has been a sore spot, and it isn't just the present Liberal government either. I've raised this with a government I was a part of. This is an issue for the North; it's an issue for isolated communities that aren't that far north too, and it's a serious concern. When you need health care, you need health care.

And if the more isolated your community, the harder that is to–the harder it becomes to attract people to come and live in your community, too, because if you don't have the services available, it becomes a difficult thing. Imagine a young family considering where to go and live, and they –you know, the health- care services in that community are really limited and you've got to fly out to get them and so on.

One of the things that I know the Health Minister and I have discussed –and I'm not sure where he's at on it right now; frankly, it would be better for him to address the detail –is looking at possible ways to get services –and this would not be limited to it, but one of the examples I talked about with other premiers is testing, diagnostic equipment and stuff. Instead of having 20 people have to fly out of some community, go down to Winnipeg to get a test done of some kind, why not have the machine and an operator getting up to the community? Save a lot of time.

Now, it doesn't mean you have the –you don't need to have the permanent installation, necessarily, but if you could make mobile some of those testing apparatus so people don't have to travel two days, three, four days, sometimes, to get to where they need to do the tests, it would be easier for people who are generally not doing those tests for fun, right; they're doing them because they're not feeling very well–saves them a lot of trouble. So it's one of the areas we've talked about generally.

And I know from talking to some of the other premiers, there are some pilots and there have been some initiatives done in –elsewhere in Canada, and it's something that is very much of interest to me. I'd be interested in the member's ideas on that, too, because I think if we can start to move more of those services to the community rather than force every community member to have to come on a bus or a plane to come down for a test, it's a start. It's not the only answer; I know that, but it's a starting point to maybe assist better in making some level of diagnostic care, primary care, available that

1894 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 hasn't been available in a lot of communities for a long time, if ever. * (15:50) Mr. Lindsey: Before I turn the floor over to the member for Minto , I just want to comment on the Premier's last response, and I'm glad to see he's come around to my way of thinking. I've been pushing for an MRI, for example, in my hometown of Flin Flon since before I was elected. There's a lot of information out there about portable MRIs. BC has had quite a bit of success with them in some of their more remote communities.

Certainly, all over in the States there's a history of success with them. So I'm all in favour of having more diagnostic equipment in the North because, ye s, absolutely, it will reduce the cost for northern patient transfer exponentially. But a closing comment is then we need to have a way to move people between those communities and that's not in place right now. With that, I'll turn the floor over to the member for Minto. Mr. Pallister: I just –I want to never, never take away the credit the member deserves for advocating for something I agree with.

But I would want him to know that when he was in his teens I was advocating for this. So it isn't necessarily me coming around to his way of t hinking, perhaps it's him coming around to my way of thinking. Either way a good idea is one we can share. Mr. Andrew Swan (Minto): I just want to return to some of the questions that I asked the Premier (Mr. Pallister) on Monday and the Premier was going to go get some more advice on a few things. Has the Premier now received advice as to whether he can disclose the manner of his communications while he's down in Costa Rica? Mr.

Pallister: I've been advised to continue using the same practices and pr otocols that were used by the previous government. And I want the member to be assured that I will look at every way of strengthening the security beyond what was available to the previous administration. Mr. Swan: Well, I listened to the Premier being interviewed out in the hall after question period, and what I took from that is that this Premier wants to tell us that he doesn't use a government cellphone to conduct government business. He doesn't use a government email account to conduct government business when he's down in Costa Rica.

So is his answer, then, that any communication he has is outside of a government cellphone or a government email account? Mr. Pallister: My answer is exactly the same as it was the other day. I'll continue to follow the protocols and practices that were used by the previous administration and look to improve them. Mr. Swan: Well, I'm just having trouble understanding what the Premier is talking about. I was the Attorney General of Manitoba for five years and I had a government -issued cellphone which I used to conduct government business both in the province and outside of the province.

What protocols of the previous government is the Premier talking about? Mr. Pallister: I'm referring to the non- disclosure of the specific aspects of how members of Cabinet communicate. Mr. Swan: So, just so I'm clear on that, the Premier is not denying that formerly the premier and Cabinet ministers used government cellphones and government email accounts, that's not the kind of protocol the Premier is talking about? Mr.

Pallister: I'm not aware; if the member's aware he could put it on the record of any of his colleagues disclosing the nature –specific nature of their communications' techniques, apparatus, frequency or who they called. That's what I'm talking about. I'm not planning on disclosing those things because I don't believe that would be wise, and I take very seriously the responsibility in protecting the integrity and confidentiality of all information that I deal with. Mr.

Swan: So is it the Premier's position, then, that when he's down in Costa Rica, or I guess anywhere else in the world, any communications that he has or says he has with staff he believes it's appropriate that they be beyond the ability of a freedom of information request, which is the law, which can allow opposition members, can allow media members, that can allow average Manitobans to make questions and ask questions and obtain documentation of the activities of government? Is the Premier saying that he's beyond that and doesn't have to follow that law? Mr.

Pallister: I'm saying I'm following the same practices and protocols as the previous government did and I'll continue to. But I will commit to the member to enhance them because I know that they aren't perfect. No security measures are necessarily

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1895 in this day and age , I suppose, perfect. And I have been researching and we are developing ways of making sure that our system protects the integrity and confidentiality of the information that we deal with because we take that very seriously. Mr. Swan: Well, I also–I've heard what the Premier (Mr. Pallister) has to say about security and–without naming names I know there's some very bright people in this room that advised me, as the Attorney General, on security and some of the threats that are out there.

Can the Premier put on the record how using an email account other than the government email account is actually more secure? Could the Premier explain that, please? Mr. Pallister: I will explain that after the member explains how using government emails exclusively is more secure than using anything else, and if he can explain that, he'd be the only person in the world that can. I would give this as evidence to him: We haven't had a leak. I hope we don't.

We may, but in the meantime, I'll continue to use methods that protect the integrity and confidentiality of information just as the previous government attempted to do. And I will make sure that we pursue every avenue to add additional security and protection to that information. If the member was to provide me with information about himself or his family in confidence, I would feel horrible if that information was to get out. I do not think that we should fail to protect the confidential nature of our information at all possible times. Mr.

Swan: Well, that is the mo st ridiculous explanation I have heard for this Premier. Deciding to put any communications, if indeed he does have communications with his staff, with his Cabinet ministers, with caucus, with other leaders of other governments, that is the most ridiculous explanation for not using any government email system or any system of government communication that can actually be accessed within a reasonable way under freedom of information.

The Premier well knows that a freedom-of-information request would prote ct any specific information, any information about who he was talking to or the nature of that communication, but it would at least allow us to have some kind of proof that when the Premier goes down to Costa Rica, he actually has any communication whatsoever with his staff or anybody in government back in Manitoba.

So I thank the Premier for confirming he doesn't believe that he's bound by the freedom of information act and I guess we'll have to wait for the Ombudsman to determine whether those other records have to be disclosed, and then we'll have to have another series of questions then. I don't understand why the Premier is being so secretive about this, why the Premier doesn't want to answer what are very simple questions, and I suppose the Premier' s answer is that we'll just wait for the Ombudsman to come back with a ruling. Mr. Pallister: Didn't hear a question. Mr. Swan: Right.

I just want to deal with the –just sort of another issue dealing with the night -lighting question that we discussed in s ome detail on Monday. I'm aware that there was a press conference last week by the president of the Manitoba Metis Federation, David Chartrand, as well as the grand chief of the Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs, Derek Nepinak. It deals with a situation where an individual or individuals were charged with a night hunting charge under The Wildlife Act.

President Chartrand and Grand Chief Nepinak say that there were serious problems with the confession that was provided by these individuals, and the charges were then stayed. Now, the Premier wasn't there and I wasn't there, so I don't expect the Premier to have any better knowledge about the situation than I do. The question I have for the Premier is whether he's prepared to reach out and speak to President Chartrand and Grand Chief Nepinak to try to get to the bottom of a problem that apparently existed in this case. Mr.

Pallister: I reach out regularly to indigenous leaders across the province–spoke to David Chartrand just last week, and I'll continue to work together with him on all kinds of issues. On the issues the member alluded to earlier, his concerns about FIPPA, he didn't have those concerns when he was in government. You know, for example, when I asked questions about the purchase of Tiger Dams, I got blacked out documents and was told I couldn't have access to those.

When I asked questions and our members asked questions when in opposition about severance pay, we were told and all members of the media were told they couldn't have information on those because FIPPA excluded it.

1896 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 When I was asked questions about briefings on increased sales tax, I hold in my hand a document which demonstrates that there's zero information available from the previous government –totally blacked out.

We've been releasing more information than the previous government by a considerable amount, and I agree that the member's bemusement may be well - founded in his previous behaviour as a minister and being part of a government that disrespected the desire that Manitobans had to get legitimate information on legitimate issues. * (16:00) However, it would be apparent and should be apparent to him as a man of some logic that it would serve my interests very easily to release to him the frequency of calls, the devices I used and in every respect hand them over to him.

And so what is bemusing to me is his lack of ability to understand that my principal concern here is to protect the integrity of information which is confidential and should remain confidential. However, this is information in reference to the previous government which should have been made public. So what he –I recognize that he is bemused and puzzled; that is not new to me.

I've seen that before and I understand that, but I would say to him, in the interest of fairness, to recognize that, for example, when Chris tine Melnick and that incident came forward, the previous administration had the opportunity to release the information. They covered it up. They failed to release it. It was

an act by a minister of the Crown at that time to involve civil servants in a partisan protest rally. They covered that up. Only a year later did the Ombudsman's report demonstrate that there was a clear knowledge by the premier of the day and by the member that she was actively engaged in the process of trying to encourage civil servants to organize a protest rally, yet we waited for a year for that to happen. We waited for a year for that to be disclosed.

Now, if the member wants to ask specific questions that I can answer without impugning the integrity of the system that protects the confidential nature of the information that I must deal with, and that all Cabinet members must deal with on a regular basis, I am happy to answer those questions and clearly, clearly I will, as I have.

But when he asks me questions about the specific nature and frequency of calls made on various devices, he moves into an area which he himself would never have responded to, nor did any member of his government in 17 years respond to, nor did they ever provide information on the nature of those protected discussions. So I will not do what he did not do when he was in government. I will not venture into an area which exposes the possibilities of greater leakage of confidential information to the general public. I won't do that; the member didn't do it w hen he was in government.

If he wants to give an example of doing so, I'm happy to listen to his example, but I seriously doubt that he did. And I would go further in saying when I asked for information on the untendered purchase of Tiger Dams from the members then on the government side of the House, millions of dollars of Tiger Dams were purchased untendered. This was a violation of The Financial Administration Act. I got blacked-out documents –I hold in my hand blacked-out documents–not a shred of information in these documents.

So, when the member speaks about and attempts to portray himself as a, you know, a moralist in respect of his respect for public information and the public having knowledge, it's contradicted by the actions that he and his government undertook when they were in power for 17 years –blacked-out page after blacked-out page. Not one piece of information made available to the general public. You can go through the whole document. There's virtually nothing exposed there. So, you know, again, what we're undertaking to do is change that and to make information more readily available to the general public.

That's what we'll continue to do, but the fact remains that the member is asking me to do something which, when he was in government, he never did. Mr. Swan: Well, I'm glad to see the Premier (Mr. Pallister) found his political note, because we always know that when he has absolutely no answer that makes any sense, we know that he lashes out; we know he strikes out and makes persona l attacks. The Premier wants to talk about freedom of information, and I'm–we'll return to that.

Can the Premier then give us any good explanation as to when we obtained the information under the Freedom of Information Act, there has not been record of a single telephone call, nor record of a single email, from the time the Premier was down in Costa Rica, back to his political staff, back to his

May 10, 2017 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1897 Cabinet ministers, or back to anybody running the government here in Manitoba? The Premier can talk about docu ments being blacked out. There are no documents because it's clear the Premier does not use any form of government communication when he's down in Costa Rica for reasons that have–that make absolutely no sense, Mr. Chairperson. Mr. Pallister: There's no question there. Mr. Swan: Maybe I can return to the question I'd asked before the Premier decided to keep driving down the road, looking in the rear -view mirror.

I asked a specific question about a concern –a serious concern raised by President Chartrand and Grand Chief Nepinak. Since that press conference was held, has the Premier reached out to either or both of these gentlemen to try to get to the bottom of the story and give them some satisfaction that this issue is being dealt with by the government? Mr. Pallister: I continue to believe that night shooting is an abomination.

And I'd like to read into the record how it works, because I don't think the members are aware, necessarily, the former Justice minister not having been part of a government that actually demonstrated any real concerns for the issue, actually letting the complaints of offences go on and on and accelerate over a long period of time without any result in action in terms of additional security, additional investment in conservati on, not actually demonstrating they understood the degree of severity of the concerns that was being expressed.

That, unfortunately–and I'm not blaming the member for this –but that has resulted in not one but two deaths in the last three years as a result of night hunting. I grant that the member is –I am not holding the member personally responsible for that, but I have to say that that lack of action is evident. See, it's not –it's a dangerous practice and it is a dangerous practice and it's unfair to the animal. And indigenous elders, we've had two open meetings already with indigenous elders from around the province and many of them have expressed that this is not in the indigenous culture. How does it work?

Why do deer seem to freeze in headlights inst ead of running? Now, I am not a hunter and so –but I've talked to hunters about how this works, and so I did some research on it and this is what I found. Less a function of fear than bewilderment, simply put, deer freeze in headlights because they can't s ee. The eyes of a deer and the eyes of people share a number of features, but they also have a few significant differences. The pupil, unlike human pupils which are round and when dilated do not span much of the eye, deer pupils are elliptical like a cat's eyes.

And they can dilate and they cover the entire width of the orb. And that greater dilation allows a lot more light to get in and reach the retina and that improves vision for deer at dawn and at dusk when deer are most active. The lens of a deer's ey e is larger than humans and this allows more light to penetrate to the retina. In addition, because people are most active during the day, our lenses are slightly yellow which filters out damaging ultraviolet rays. By contrast, since deer are active at nig ht and have little danger of eye damage from ultraviolet light, their lenses are clear.

This enables a deer to see a bit of the UV spectrum, ultimately giving it even better night vision. Essentially, a reflector at the back of the eye behind the retina, the tapetum lucidum , reflects light back again across the retina and that drastically increases the light exposure for a deer. Although not found in humans, it's a common bit of eye anatomy in the animal world. This reflective layer is found in dogs, cats, racoons, rodents, birds, even fish, and it's the cause of eye shine, or the reflective glowing often seen when a light hits an animal in the dark.

Now, this is what night shooting is about for those who go out and do it. They shine a light; they see a reflection of eyes, and then they shoot at it. And both deer and humans have two types of photoreceptors on the retina: rods and cones. The cones are activated by brighter light and are sensitive to colour as well as help with distance vision. People have three different types of cone cells each sensitive to a different colour light: red, blue and green. On the other hand, deer have only two types of cone cells: those that can see blue and yellow.

As a result, deer see red and orange poorly and they also do not see detail or at distance as well as humans do. But deer have a much greater proportion of rod cells. Rods enable both humans and deer to distinguish between light and dark and to see in dim light and at night. Since deer have many more rods, they are better able to see in low light and thus they have far superior night vision. * (16:10) But, when you introduce a light to a deer, they freeze because it blinds them and, effectively, that's what night shooting is in the modern context. It's not–I'm not t alking about treaty rights, hunting with

1898 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA May 10, 2017 torches, traditional night harvesting. I am talking about illegal night hunting with a spotlight. This is a concern to our government. It's a concern to a great many of the indigenous elders we've consulted with, and it'll continue to be a concern and we will address it and make sure that we address it with the best interests not only of human beings, but with the fairness of, and best interests of, preserving our wildlife species as well in mind. Mr. Swan: I know the Premier's (Mr.

Pallister) having a bad day, but I wish he would try to at least stay within the framework of the question. I put to him a serious issue which has been raised by MMF President David Chartrand and Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs Grand Chief Derek Nepinak. They had a press conference last Thursday. I don't know any of the circumstances they raise in this issue, and I don't expect the Premier does either. The question I asked is whether he's reached out to either or both of these two gentlemen; I'm presuming the answer is no.

The question to the Premier: Is he prepared to speak to these two gentlemen to discuss their concerns about the way this case was handled, a case which is now completed in court, and will he agree to work with them to tr y to move forward on this issue? Mr. Pallister: Well, I appreciate the member raising this topic because both of these gentlemen have communicated to me they got no satisfaction from the previous NDP government at all. I've discussed this issue with both of them, and I expect to continue to discuss it with both of them. We've had –done extensive discussion with indigenous elders.

We are setting up workshops to continue that discussion. We're going to move forward in co -operative manner to work with indigenous people across Manitoba, which is something the previous administration failed to do repeatedly. Not only did they fail completely to work with indigenous people, they failed to work with the AMM as well. Let me put on the record some of the resolutions that were brought forward. Here's one from the AMM: "WHEREAS night lighting is a persistent and dangerous hunting practice, posing a danger to both residents and livestock"–where's the date on this? Is there a date? – "AND

WHEREAS the Manitoba Hunting Guide states, Rights based hunters 'may not discharge a rifle or shot gun at night where it is dangerous to do so'; AND

WHEREAS the above statement indicates that Manitoba Conservation deems night lighting and the discharge of rifles and shotguns at night to be a safe practice in some unspecified areas of Manitob a; AND

WHEREAS Manitoba Conservation has failed to define safe and unsafe night hunting areas of Manitoba; THEREFORE

BE IT RESOLVED THAT the AMM lobby the Province of Manitoba to provide municipalities with maps that clearly define areas in which Manitoba Conservation deems night lightin

Document details

Collection	Manitoba — Debates (Hansard)
Citation	41-2-49
Type	hansard
Volume / chapter	41st 2nd hansardpdf 49.pdf
Language	en
Format	pdf
Source	PROVINCIAL
Identifier	f84ff4ba74c5da342ed4d255a594f668ab1c34d5

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