Debates of Feb. 18th, 1997

This is page numbers 661 - 686 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 4th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was chairman .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Minister Absent From The House

Clyde River Library

Recognition Of Deceased Constituents

Social Program Needs And Pressures

Western Constitutional Development

Nunavut Leaders' Summit

Congratulations To Richard Beck

Parish Mission Spiritual Gathering

Pay Equity Dispute

Passing Of Her Father

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

General Hunting License Applications

Inuit Employees

Western Employment Strategy

Item 10: Petitions

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Recommendation To Reinstate Original Funding For Arviat Airport Lighting Project

Recommendation To Remove Projects Related To The Rankin Inlet Tank Farm

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Honourable Jim Antoine , Honourable Goo Arlooktoo , Mr. Barnabas , Mr. Enuaraq , Mr. Erasmus , Mr. Evaloarjuk , Honourable Samuel Gargan , Mrs. Groenewegen , Mr. Henry , Honourable Stephen Kakfwi , Mr. Miltenberger , Honourable Don Morin , Honourable Kelvin Ng , Mr. Ningark , Mr. O'Brien , Mr. Ootes , Mr. Picco , Mr. Rabesca , Mr. Roland , Mr. Steen , Honourable Manitok Thompson , Honourable John Todd .

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Oh, God, may your spirit and guidance be in us as we work for the benefit of all our people, for peace and justice in our land and for constant recognition of the dignity and aspirations of those whom we serve. Amen.

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 661

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Good afternoon. Mr. Ng . Point of privilege.

Point of Privilege

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 661

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I rise on a point of privilege. The February 13, 1997 edition of the Inuvik Drum, in reporting on a public meeting that I attended on February 7th in Inuvik, incorrectly implied that I said, and I quote:

"The Department of Health and Social Services hopes to reduce the number of treatment centres to just one in each of the western and eastern territories by 1999."

My comments were intended as an assurance that there would be at least two facilities, rather than a threat or an announcement of further reductions in funding. The elimination of funding for another treatment facility is not currently part of the department's plan for alcohol and drug treatment facilities. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 661

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Point of order. Mr. O'Brien .

Point of Order

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 661

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order concerning a matter that occurred in the committee of the whole Friday, February 14. Mr. Speaker, this is my first opportunity to raise this point. I refer to Rule 23(

h) which states that in debate a Member will be called to order by the Speaker if the Member makes allegations against another Member, a House Officer or a witness. Mr. Speaker, the Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Morin , made the statement that I should not have the word honourable in front of my name. At the time, the comment was made I asked the Honourable Premier to apologize for his comment. I note that on page 1103 of the unedited Hansard that Mr. Morin withdrew the remark but did not apologize for it. Mr. Speaker, using Rule 23(

h) I request that you rule that I have a point of order and request the Premier , the honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , apologize. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 661

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. O'Brien . Although the discussion was in committee of the whole, a Member is entitled at the first opportune time to rise on a point of order if he has one. In this case, Mr. O'Brien has done that. Having found that the honourable Mr. Morin used offensive words, I will now ask that Mr. Morin apologize for the use of his words. Mr. Morin .

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 661

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to take this opportunity to apologize to this House if they found my remarks offensive. Thank you.

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 661

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Morin . I would like to take a moment to ponder about an event that happened 60 years ago. Today in an area known as the North Ooglit Islands, about 30 kilometres north of Hall Beach, that was the day our colleague from Amittuq, Mr. Evaloarjuk , was born.

---Applause

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 661

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

As most Members know, Mr. Evaloarjuk was a Member of the Assembly from 1975 to 1984 before being re-elected in 1995. On behalf of all the Members, I would like to wish Mr. Evaloarjuk a happy 60th birthday.

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 661

Some Hon. Members

Hear! Hear!

---Applause

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 661

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Have a good day. Orders of the day. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Morin .

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Minister's Statement 50-13(4): Minister Absent From The House

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 661

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I wish to advise Members that the Honourable Charles Dent will be absent from the House today to attend the Council of Ministers of Education in Toronto. Thank you.

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Minister's Statement 50-13(4): Minister Absent From The House

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 661

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. I would also like to let Members know that we have been advised by

Mr. Krutko that, due to a serious illness in his family, he will not be in attendance in this House for the next few days. Our thoughts and prayers are with Mr. Krutko . Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Enuaraq .

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Clyde River Library

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 662

Tommy Enuaraq

Baffin Central

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Clyde River Library

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 662

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Enuaraq . Members' statements. Mr. Evaloarjuk .

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Recognition Of Deceased Constituents

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 662

Mark Evaloarjuk

Amittuq

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to thank all of you for congratulating me on my birthday. That is my first statement, to thank you. Also, I would like to state, Mr. Speaker, since I have been here in 1995, in my riding of Igloolik and Pond Inlet, there have been a number of deaths that have happened. Mr. Speaker, I would like to state one of my cousins I just heard last night, Isaaci Anaviapik, passed away yesterday. I would just like to send my condolences to his relatives and friends. We will remember them in our prayers. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. (Translation ends)

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Recognition Of Deceased Constituents

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 662

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Evaloarjuk . Members' statements. Mr. Miltenberger .

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Social Program Needs And Pressures

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 662

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as we go about our jobs as politicians and get involved in the heady affairs tied into nation building and dividing of two territories, I would just like to list off some very grim reminders to people about other issues that we have to keep in mind. Our birth rate is about two and a half times the national average. In the last nine years, there has been a 31 percent increase in school enrolments. In the last nine years, student financial assistance requests have tripled. Social assistance cases have doubled in the last nine years.

Violent crimes have increased by 45 percent in the last nine years. This is five or six times the national average, Mr. Speaker. The correctional centre admissions have seen a 34 percent increase in the last nine years. Last year, we had 22 suicides which, on a per capita basis, puts us far above the national average. Housing needs show 3,584 households in core need as a result of the last survey. Our average population, 33 percent of our population that is under the age of 15.

Mr. Speaker, all these rocketing upward trends in terms of social needs and social pressures are occurring at the same time as we have seen a very flat line or a decrease in government expenditures and revenues. As we go about our business and look at our budgets and where we are going, this has been brought up before, but we have to keep in mind that at some point if we do not address what is driving our costs as a government, we are doomed to a never ending downward slide trying to deal with social problems that we do not have the money to deal with.

I ask that we all keep this in mind as we go about doing this budget and look towards 1999. There are some things that cannot be ignored much longer. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

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Social Program Needs And Pressures

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 662

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Members' statements. Mr. Ootes .

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Western Constitutional Development

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 662

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in recent weeks I have heard people accuse us of foot dragging over constitutional development in the western Arctic. I can understand why some might think that we are being negligent. However, I think that they are wrong. I would like to set the record straight. Partners in a New Beginning was released in October with the promise of public consultations to begin in December. Unfortunately, that plan hit a snag. Ottawa balked at the process because it felt that elements of the Partners report might run counter to the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

Since then, the Constitutional Working Group has endeavoured to get federal officials to support a broad public discussion on the three models proposed in the Partners report. They succeeded, but it was a time consuming task. That is probably why some people think that we, as MLAs, have not been paying attention to the issue. We have not been making a lot of speeches, that is true, but taking strong positions at this time would be inappropriate. We have put our opinions aside for a while to let the working group do its job.

We will have opportunities to comment for or against the proposals when the consultations begin in March. To work outside the process would impair public participation. In the meantime, several Members of this House, including myself, have asked the Minister for Constitutional Development for regular updates on the Partners process, particularly in relation to the vital issue of ratification. We have also expressed concerns about certain areas of the package.

I want to thank the Minister for being candid and forthcoming in his replies, all of which are available to the public through Hansard, television broadcast from the House, and media reports. We may not have made a lot of noise about the constitutional process in the past few months, but anyone who pays attention to our work will see that we have not let it slip. They will also have a good idea of what has happened since October and where the process is heading. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Western Constitutional Development

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 663

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Ootes . Members' statements, Mr. Ng .

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Nunavut Leaders' Summit

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 663

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I want to speak briefly about some of the activities and events that took place over the past three days in Cambridge Bay. As we all know, many of us had an opportunity to attend the Nunavut Leaders' Summit. I will not get into the details of some of those discussions because they will be in the media over the next couple of days. I would like to comment on some of the other activities that did take place. I would also like to thank all the participants that did attend, whether they were elected officials, appointed officials, or the staff that were there.

Some of the other events, Mr. Speaker, that took place: there was a Kitikmeot Chamber of Commerce meeting at the same time as the Nunavut Leaders' meeting.

I would like to extend appreciation to the Honourable Goo Arlooktoo for speaking to the Chamber of Commerce, along with myself. There was also an arena re-opening ceremony and the Honourable Manitok Thompson and the Honourable Don Morin both participated. I would like to extend my appreciation to them for their participation in that. As well, thanks to Commissioner Helen Maksagak, who also was a part of those ceremonies and activities. I would like to also mention there was a hockey game. A local team, of which I was fortunate to be a member, was chosen to play the out of town summit participants. We were gracious hosts by losing two to one to the out of town team.

I would like to thank Doug Crossley of Cambridge Bay, who organized that event. Finally there were a couple of other community square dances held both on Saturday and on Sunday. They were very well attended by the community and by guests from outside of the community. I would like to thank David Evalik and Elik Tologanak for organizing those two events. There was also, Mr. Speaker, a presentation made to the Honourable Ron Irwin from the community by the mayor. They presented him with a drum. I would like to thank Attima Hadlari for giving drum lessons to the federal Minister at that time. I, Mr. Speaker, would also like to seek unanimous consent to complete my statement. Thank you.

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Nunavut Leaders' Summit

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 663

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Member for Kitikmeot is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Ng , you have unanimous consent.

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Nunavut Leaders' Summit

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 663

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would also like to thank and acknowledge the Mayor, Mr. Wilfred Wilcox, and his staff, Henry Brown, the SAO; Stephane Labonne, the recreation director; Pat File, the community wellness director for all their contributions and making sure all the events were successful and all the other staff that were involved. There are too many to name. Finally, I think Mr. Speaker, on behalf of all the participants and the guests from out of town, I would like to thank the community residents of Cambridge Bay for their warmth and the hospitality that they extended to everyone.

I think it offset some of the 40 below weather and the wind conditions that we had to persevere with over the weekend. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Nunavut Leaders' Summit

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 663

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements, Mr. Erasmus .

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Congratulations To Richard Beck

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 663

Roy Erasmus

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I was just reminded by the honourable Member for Iqaluit that I would be remiss if I did not congratulate Richard Beck for winning the World Championship Dog Mushers Race in The Pas, Manitoba. He has won that title for the sixth time now and I would like to wish all the best to Mr. Beck. Thank you.

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Congratulations To Richard Beck

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 663

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements, Mr. Rabesca .

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Parish Mission Spiritual Gathering

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 663

James Rabesca

North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today, Mr. Speaker, I would like to mention an event that will be taking place this March in Rae-Edzo. The event that I am referring to is the Parish Mission Spiritual Gathering, which will take place March 16 until March 30, 1997. This event will bring community members from across the region, as well as people from Yellowknife, Deline, Detah, to witness and participate in the celebration of the Easter season. This two week event will have a full

schedule of activities for young and old. It will be a time of counselling, healing, and worship for anyone that wants to participate. Regular scheduled events will include: youth, ministry, health, at Elizabeth Mackenzie Elementary School, each morning during the first week, with a workshop and other gatherings taking place throughout the community for the rest of the day and evening of each day, along with home visits to every home in the community.

The second week is filled with spiritual celebration and counselling. On the close of the mission on Easter Sunday, there will be a feast, a drum dance, and festivities. Mr. Speaker, this gathering will be very special to many people. They will worship and heal as one community. For married couples that would like to renew their marriage vows, time has been set aside for couples to do so. This will, as with every gathering, bring people and families together for the common goal of worshipping our Lord on this special day. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Parish Mission Spiritual Gathering

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 663

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Rabesca . Members' statements, Mr. Picco .

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Pay Equity Dispute

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 663

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I was thinking today of a topic I have raised twice during the past weeks. One which allowed Members to want to contemplate or one which may have a devastating effect on the fiscal health of this government. Mr. Speaker, the recent ruling by the courts on the pay issue dispute between the UNW and the territorial government has been ongoing since the mid- 80s. It has now culminated in both the GNWT's arguments on the bias and the jurisdiction of the case being ruled against. Mr.

Speaker, we can continue to duck and dive, appeal or whatever legal route we take to put this off, but is it not about time someone took the bull by the horns and dealt with this situation we find ourselves in.

Mr. Speaker, this government has refused to comment on the issue. In my mind, that is not good government. Why does the government not sit down with our partner, the UNW, and try and reach a compromise or find some other alternative? Mr. Speaker, at the end of the day when this is finally settled, the tax payers of the Northwest Territories may be on the hook for several million dollars. Money we do not have. Mr. Speaker, by saying nothing, by using legal delaying tactics, we seem to be putting off onerous eventuality. That is not acceptable. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Pay Equity Dispute

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 664

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Picco . Members' statements, Mrs Groenewegen.

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Passing Of Her Father

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 664

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to take this opportunity to thank the Members of this House for their kind words of condolence on the passing of my father. I was not watching the day that the Speaker spoke, the Members Goo Arlooktoo , Jake Ootes , Mr. Evaloarjuk and many other personal expressions of kindness to me at this time of loss. I will be continuing to work and will be happily surrounded by familiar faces and surroundings as I process this great loss to me personally of my father who was very, very dear to me. Thank you.

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Passing Of Her Father

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 664

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Members' statements. Item 4. Returns to oral questions, Mr. Ng .

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Return To Question 84-13(4): Infant Mortality Rates In The Nwt

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 664

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a return to an oral questions asked by Mr. Henry on January 22, 1997, on NWT infant mortality rates. Information on infant mortality is collected through vital statistics. The rates are compiled and analyzed on a yearly basis in the Northwest Territories before being provided at the national level. Infant mortality refers to all deaths under the age of one year. The denominator used to calculate the rate is a number of live births that occur in the year of reference. As registration of deaths have tended to be more accurate than birth registrations in the past, the under- reporting of births could account in part for the higher infant mortality rates.

Infant mortality has climbed sharply everywhere in Canada over the past three decades. NWT rates were three times that of the rest of Canada in 1971. By 1988, this gap had been narrowed to one and a half times. Since then, however, little progress has occurred in the NWT, while the rates continue to go down in the south. At 15.4 infant deaths per 1000 live births, the NWT infant mortality rate was two and a half times that of Canada as a whole at 6.3 per 1000 in 1994. The Childhood Fatalities Review Committee is mandated to review and report on all deaths of children age 16 and under.

The review of 1996 deaths have already been initiated and a report from the committee is expected in April. Infant mortality is strongly linked to social economic status and poverty. High rates of infant deaths from infectious causes and from Sudden Infant Death Syndrome contribute to our poor statistics. The most important single contributor to high infant mortality in the Northwest Territories continues to be exposure to tobacco smoke during fetal growth and after birth. Other contributing factors include poor nutritional status of many mothers and overcrowding.

Improving social economical conditions and ensuring a healthy living environment by providing better health education, developing parenting skills and early intervention programs are the means to improve infant mortality statistics. The Department of Health and Social Services has important roles to play in these areas. We have embarked on a reform of the health and social services system that aims to shift emphasis to prevention and early intervention. However, many necessary initiatives will have to originate from communities and individuals themselves if we want to improve outcomes in this area. Thank you, Mr.

Speaker.

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Return To Question 84-13(4): Infant Mortality Rates In The Nwt

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 664

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Ng . Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Morin .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 664

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It gives me great honour and pleasure to recognize our MP for Nunatsiaq, Mr. Jack Anawak.

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 664

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Welcome to the Assembly. Recognition of visitors in the gallery, Mr. Evaloarjuk .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 664

Mark Evaloarjuk

Amittuq

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It gives me great pleasure to recognize my wife, Louise, and my son, Lionel Evaloarjuk. Thank you.(Translation ends)

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 664

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Welcome to the Assembly. Recognition of visitors in the gallery, Mr. O'Brien .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 664

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it gives me great pleasure to recognize Mr. George Kuksuk from Arviat. George is a contractor in the community. He is also a very busy constituent. He serves on the hamlet council, also a member of the Workers' Compensation Board, and a member

of the Caribou Management Board. Also, Mr. Speaker, I would like to recognize Evano Aggark, a well respected constituent and also the Government Liaison Officer for Arviat. Thank you.

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 665

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Welcome to the Assembly. Recognition of visitors to the gallery, Mr. Picco .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 665

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it gives me pleasure today to recognize a person. Behind every successful politician, there is a capable executive assistant, and sitting next to Mr. Jack Anawak is Miss Catherine Parker from Ottawa, his executive assistant, and a great tour guide of Ottawa when you get a chance to go down. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 665

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Welcome to the Assembly. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 6, oral questions, Mr. Enuaraq .

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Question 332-13(4): General Hunting License Applications

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

Tommy Enuaraq

Baffin Central

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development , Mr. Kakfwi . It is regarding the general hunting licences that are issued to residents in the north. When you try to get a hunting licence, you have to wait awhile to get your licence in the communities. My question to the Minister is, what kind of regulations do you have in regards to the issuing of those licences? Thank you. (Translation ends)

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Question 332-13(4): General Hunting License Applications

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development . Mr. Kakfwi .

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Return To Question 332-13(4): General Hunting License Applications

Question 332-13(4): General Hunting License Applications

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, I will be taking the question as notice and providing a response and detail of the criteria we use in the procedure for accepting the applications and processing those applications as well. Thank you.

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Return To Question 332-13(4): General Hunting License Applications

Question 332-13(4): General Hunting License Applications

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The question is taken as notice. Oral questions. Mr. Picco .

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Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, while in Cambridge Bay this past weekend for the Nunavut Leaders' Summit, a statement was made about a GNWT senior managers meeting with Inuit employees and that they were not being treated very well in these discussions at that meeting. Mr. Speaker, if this allegation is correct, it is not acceptable. My question is for the Minister for DPW, whose department arranged the meeting, has he heard about these allegations and could he update the House on actually what happened? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Public Works and Services . Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Return To Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the opportunity to clarify to the House what actually happened in Iqaluit. I did hear the comments made by Jose Kusugak at that meeting in Cambridge Bay. In the interest of staying on the subject that we were discussing, I elected not to respond, on the good advice of my friend, Mr. Todd . The meeting in Iqaluit was for Inuit employees of the Department of Public Works and Services. It is part of the overall implementation of our Inuit employment plans which we are obligated to under the land claims agreement.

This year, we brought together 14 Inuit employees of DPW from the three regions of Nunavut and discussed with them their concerns about the direction that the department is going, training opportunities and what they can expect the department to look like in the future. We also had presentations by Arctic College, EC&E, the NIC and MACA. One of the more interesting things to come out of that meeting was a

summary of concerns by the Inuit employees that was sent to me and of which I am (inaudible). Thank you.

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Return To Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Picco .

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Supplementary To Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it is good to hear the clarification from the Minister. Will the Minister commit to contacting the employees who participated in these discussions, to assure them of the intent of the meeting personally, so that there will be no permanent breakdown in actually what occurred and this type of innuendo will not go on? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Further Return To Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Mr. Speaker, I can assure the Member that the employees who did go to that meeting know exactly what the meeting was for. I believe they all appreciate the information they received and the opportunity to give input. I think where the problem lies is with the

interpretation by the person I was speaking to in Cambridge Bay and the lack of understanding. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Question 333-13(4): Inuit Employees

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Ootes .

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Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 665

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Premier . This government is in need of an employment strategy whereby we can identify what employment will be available in the coming years, both in the government and in the private sector. By doing that, we can then identify training programs and educational programs whereby individuals can be slotted into those positions. The federal government has identified almost $40 million in the next three years to be applied to prepare Nunavut residents for the increase in government employment in Nunavut that will come about as a result of division. I think that is excellent.

However, here in the west, we are also going through dramatic changes and part of that being the division process. Secondly, the advent of mining coming about. We will also no doubt see a need for retraining of the employees of the Government of the Northwest

Territories and for training for potential jobs in the mining industry.

While the Premier was in Cambridge Bay at the Nunavut Leaders' Conference this weekend, I wonder if the Premier had an opportunity to speak to the Minister of Northern Affairs about this matter to see if we could get some funding allocated for the western part of the Territories for training, such as they have in Nunavut. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Premier .

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Return To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. On the Nunavut training issue that is specific to Nunavut, because of the agreement they have with the federal government, they are getting approximately $39.8 million. As far as other training initiatives in general, I did not have an opportunity to speak with Mr. Irwin on that issue. He was there to deal with Nunavut issues. He flew in and flew out fairly quickly. Thank you.

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Return To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes .

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Supplementary To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

I wonder if the Premier could tell me if he sees the situation similar as I do, where there will be an ongoing need for us to get into a retraining program and training for the mining industry. Let me perhaps ask that question first, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin .

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Further Return To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We agree fully with the Member of the Legislative Assembly and we have talked about that in the Legislative Assembly before. Mr. Dent is doing work on that. We have to capitalize on the jobs that are going to be spun off from the mining industry and we should be prepared. Mr. Dent is working with a group of people on northern employment strategies, so that we can benefit as northerners from that development. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes .

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Supplementary To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Would the Premier entertain creating an opportunity whereby he could speak to the Minister of Northern Affairs or the officials from the federal government about the possibility of gaining funding similar to what Nunavut has obtained to train their particular employees, so that we, at least, get some funding here in the west for training of our employees and for training for the potential jobs that we may have in the mining industry. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin .

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Further Return To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Dent is handling the file on training and he has been dealing with the federal Ministers on trying to get as many dollars out of the federal government as possible to get northern people trained to take advantage of jobs that will be created from the mining industry, as well as any other industries in the north that are starting to be developed, like forestry, as well as oil and gas in the Liard area. We have to try to capitalize on any dollars possible from the federal government. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. Ootes .

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Supplementary To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am pleased to hear that the Minister of Education is speaking with federal officials. Could the Premier identify if specific funds have been identified, outside of our present budgetary process and budget requirements? If more funds have been applied for? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin .

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Further Return To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will take that question as notice and Mr. Dent can return the question. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Question 334-13(4): Western Employment Strategy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 666

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Question is taken as notice. Oral questions. Item 7, written questions. Item 8, returns to written questions. Item 9, replies to opening address. Item 10, petitions. Mr. Ng .

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Item 10: Petitions

Item 10: Petitions

Page 666

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have a petition with 260 signatures from Cambridge Bay, Petition No. 13-13(4), showing their support for the libraries. Thank you.

-- Applause

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Item 10: Petitions

Item 10: Petitions

Page 666

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Ng . Petitions. Item 11, reports of standing and special committees. Item 12, reports of committees on the review of bills. Item 13, tabling of documents. Item 14, notices of motion. Item 15, notices of motion for first reading of bills. Item 16, motions. Item 17, first reading of bills. Item 18, second reading of bills. Item 19, consideration in committee of the whole of bills and other matters. Bill 8 , Committee Report 2-13(4), Committee Report 3-13(4), Committee Report 4-13(4). Mr. Steen in the chair.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 666

The Chair

Vince Steen

I call the committee to order. Business before the committee. We have Bill 8 ,

Appropriation Act, 1997-98; Committee Report 2-13(4), Standing Committee on Government Operations Report on the Review of the Main Estimates for 1997/98; Committee Report 3-13(4), Standing Committee on Infrastructure Report on the Review of the Main Estimates for 1997/98; Committee Report 4-13(4), Standing Committee on Resource Management and Development Report on the Review of the Main Estimates for 1997/98. I would like some direction from the committee as to how you wish to proceed. Mr. Barnabas .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 667

Levi Barnabas

High Arctic

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The committee decided concurrently with Bill 8 , Appropriation Act '97/98, Committee Report 2-13, Committee Report 3-13, and Committee Report 4-13. We will proceed with Department of Transportation. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 667

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Barnabas . Committee agreed?

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 667

Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 667

The Chair

Vince Steen

Very well. We will proceed after a 10 minute break with the Department of Transportation under Appropriation Act, Bill 8 .

---Break

Chair's Ruling

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 667

The Chair

Vince Steen

I would like to call the committee back to order. Before we return to the main estimates I have a chairman's ruling here from events that took place last Friday. On Friday, February 14, 1997, the Honourable Premier Mr. Morin raised a point of privilege in committee of the whole in response to comments made by the Member for Kivallivik , Mr. O'Brien . The Premier 's comments on the point of privilege led to Mr. O'Brien raising his own point of privilege. I indicated to the committee that I would take some time to review Hansard prior to providing my ruling. I have now had an opportunity to review Hansard and I am in the position to provide my ruling.

To put matters in context, the Member for Kivallivik , Mr. O'Brien , indicated on page 1101 of unedited Hansard, and I quote, "I wish that the Minister could be as strong in honouring the commitments that he has made in the east as he does in the west". The Premier , Mr. Morin , rose on a point of privilege stating:

"I would like to have the Member for Kivallivik withdraw his comments. Mr. Chairman, he accused the Minister of the government of favouring the western side of the territories over the east in his previous comment, which I have heard that the Minister should honour his commitments in the east like he does in the west and I take exception to that comment. We as a government are elected to represent all the Northwest Territories and we do not base our decisions east and west. I would request that the Member withdraw his comments if he has any right to have the name honourable in front of his name or not, he should do that".

In response, Mr. O'Brien sought an apology from the Premier for his comments that he should not have the word "honourable" in front of his name. Later in debate, the Premier did withdraw the remarks he made and earlier today the Premier offered an apology for his comments, which this House has accepted. On Friday, Mr. Morin , the Member for Tu Nedhe , went on to clarify his point of privilege and stated that he was actually raising on a point of order and was relying on Rule 23(

h) which provides that a Member will be called to order if the Member makes allegations against another Member, a House Officer or witness, and Rule 23(

j) which provides that a Member will be called to order if the Member imputes false or hidden motives to another Member.

For the record, I note that Mr. Morin 's point of privilege is really a point of order and that he is arguing that our rules have been violated. From a close examination of Mr. O'Brien 's statement on Friday, I am unable to conclude that the Member was making an allegation against another Member or imputing hidden motives. Mr. O'Brien is asking the Minister to honour commitments in the east as well as he honours his commitments in the west. The statement may be suggesting that the government favours one geographic region over another.

However, I am unable to say that it falls within the category of making allegations against another Member or imputing false or hidden motives to another Member. The comments made by the Member for Kivallivik fall within the realm of appropriate political debate. Therefore, I find that the Honourable Mr. Morin does not have a point of order. I thank the Members for your patience. I will ask the committee now, do you wish to proceed with the main estimates?

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Page 667

Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 667

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you. I will ask the Minister of Transportation if he would like to have witnesses present.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 667

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 667

The Chair

Vince Steen

I ask the Sergeant-at-Arms to bring in the witnesses. Members agree?

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Page 667

Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 667

The Chair

Vince Steen

I would like to ask the Minister if he could introduce his witnesses please.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 667

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I have Bob Doherty. He is the deputy minister of the Department of Transportation. He is on my right and on my left, Raj Downe. She is the director for finance and administration for Department of Transportation. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 667

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Welcome to the committee. For the record we are on Bill 8 , Appropriation Act, 1997-98. Transportation. We are on the detail of capital, airports on page 10-12. We were on buildings and works, Fort Smith region. Total region $2,120,000.

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Page 667

Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 667

The Chair

Vince Steen

Mr. Rabesca .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 667

James Rabesca

North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. What I was concerned about was the Fort Smith region regarding the overlay runway for $2 million. The reason why is because I was wondering if the Minister is considering any of the fundings that might be available to my particular region

regarding the airport. If you could spend that kind of money just to have an existing decent airport in Fort Smith, and there is no capital plan for an airport within my region in sight, I think that there are a lot of activities that might be going on in the future regarding the mining activities and a lot of transportation that might be needed between my region. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Rabesca . Mr. Antoine .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the department has been asked numerous times by the honourable Member and his predecessors in previous governments, but mainly from the honourable Member for North Slave , regarding monies for an airport to be built in the Rae-Edzo area. At this time what the department is doing, because of the cutbacks, is that we are renovating existing facilities only. This budget year, we are not going to be building any new infrastructure at all because of the budget cutbacks.

As a result, there is nothing in this year's plan to do any work or set aside any money for what the honourable Member is requesting. However, just for your information, in 1995 the department provided the Hamlet of Rae-Edzo with $30,000 to conduct a consultant's study of the socio-economic impacts of an airport. The department had received a final draft of the study report and has communicated several concerns regarding the report and the benefit cost analysis to the mayor. We were advised last November 95, that a response from the hamlet would be forthcoming. As of yet, we have not received a formal response.

We did put money into a study and because of the cutbacks we have not been able to allocate any funding for the honourable Member's request. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Minister. I have total region $2,120,000. Agreed?

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Page 668

Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 668

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you. Buildings and works, Inuvik region. First of all, the sale of capital airports, buildings and works, Inuvik region. Total region, $1,460,000. Mr. Henry .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 668

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I note that there was $3 million spent in prior years. Can the Minister tell us what that was spent on? Could he give us a little more background about the relocation of this airport, as to when was it built and why relocation is necessary? Thank you.

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Page 668

The Chair

Vince Steen

Mr. Henry .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am referring to the Deline airport relocation.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Henry . Honourable Mr. Antoine .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, in Deline in 1984, there was a fatal crash of an airplane. There has been considerable community concern over the safety of the Deline airport. The airport at the time was very close to the community. Based on discussion with the community, it was very apparent that the proposed improvement to the existing airport would not resolve these concerns, because of the proximity of the community to the airport.

Therefore, a study recommended construction of a new airport with a 3,000 foot runway, two kilometres from the community rather than doing the renovation of the existing airport. This one here was a cost-shared arrangement negotiated with Transport Canada. The 1991 Airport Construction Contribution Agreement and the 1993 Strategic Transportation Improvement Agreement provided funding for this airport. As a result, we were able to begin work on the Deline airport in 1993-94 and we are still finishing off the airport today. This main estimate would be the final amount for finishing off this airport. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . I have total region, $1,460,000.

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Page 668

Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 668

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you. We are at buildings and works, Baffin region, page 10-14. Total Baffin region, $4,010,000. I have Mr. Enuaraq , Mr. Picco , and Mr. Evaloarjuk . Mr. Enuaraq .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

Tommy Enuaraq

Baffin Central

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, when I look at the 1996 and '97 main estimates, which was approved last year under Transportation, buildings and works, Baffin region, there was $1,330,000 allocated for Clyde River airport terminal building. Mr. Chairman, when I look at 1997/98 main estimates under Department of Transportation, buildings and works, Baffin region, I do not see that $1,330,000. I would like to ask the Minister where that money went and why it is gone? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you. Mr. Antoine .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the honourable Member is referring to an air terminal building. Mr. Chairman, before the ATB can be built in Clyde River, a new gravel pad must be built across from its current location. In Clyde River, the people have to cross the airport to get to the air terminal building. This is a problem. In order to resolve that, we need to build a gravel pad on the town side of the airport and that has to get done first. The access to the current airport terminal building crosses the runway.

During review of the capital planning, the community of Clyde River was identified as having too much earthworks scheduled for 1997/98 fiscal year. Therefore, the department deferred the project start date in order to accommodate completion of other projects, which require the earthworks equipment. Just for some background, the community has the following equipment; they have one loader, two trucks, and one dozer. The short building season also contributed to the decision on a number of projects that could be started in the community.

As a result of the fiscal restraint and the cutbacks that we have to undertake in this department, we move to defer the planning of the airport terminal building to '98/99, and completion in '99/2000. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 668

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Mr. Enuaraq .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 668

Tommy Enuaraq

Baffin Central

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for pronouncing my last name correctly. Mr. Chairman, I do appreciate that the

Minister of Transportation just told me that there will be some part-time jobs for spring and summer in Clyde River. I appreciate that. The money I am talking about, in the amount of $1,330,000, is the same amount of that money going to the main estimates in '98/99? Thank you.

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Page 669

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you. Mr. Antoine .

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Page 669

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, this project, like I said, has been deferred to start the planning in '98/99 and to do the completion in the year '99/2000. The total project has been reduced by $150,000. Thank you.

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Page 669

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Mr. Enuaraq .

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Page 669

Tommy Enuaraq

Baffin Central

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Why was the money reduced by $150,000? Did the building shrink before the design even took place?

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Page 669

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Enuaraq . Mr. Minister.

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Page 669

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, we have to comply to future budget targets. For planning purposes, we have reduced the total scope of this project by the said amount. As we get into the planning, we will then take a closer look at the scope of the work that is required. Thank you.

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Page 669

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Buildings and works, Baffin region, $4,010,000. Mr. Picco .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Page 669

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Chairman and good afternoon. Mr. Chairman, over the past few days, I have been trying to bring up the situation with the ERS, which is the emergency response service in Iqaluit. Mr. Chairman, we are going to lose our ERS on April 1st, 1997, although there have been several dangerous and life-threatening incidents at our airport. Mr. Chairman, because of federal regulations and changes in those regulations that say and state that we do not need the ERS in Iqaluit and, coming on the heels of the Avery Cooper report commissioned by the government, it was decided that ERS was no longer needed.

Mr. Chairman, I have had some good communication with the Honourable Jim Antoine , the Minister for Transportation . He has been very supportive and the department has been very supportive in this area, but it still leaves a void in my community for fire fighting capabilities. At the present time, all we have in Iqaluit is a volunteer fire department. They do not have the specialized training to fight fires at the airport. They do not have the equipment.

My question to the Minister of Transportation is; on April 1st, 1999, who is going to fight those fires at the airport and who is going to be able to do emergency response in the transportation hub for the Baffin region, serving 13 communities and 14,000 people? Mr. Chairman, my question to the Minister would be, will this government commit to providing the proper training for our volunteer town fire department and also the equipment, so that we can tackle any incident that occurs after April 1st, 1997 at the Iqaluit airport? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 669

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Picco . Mr. Antoine .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 669

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, this department will make a commitment to work with the community of Iqaluit and also with the Department of MACA who provides this training. We will make sure there is adequate training in place in the community with the cooperation with MACA, so that the municipality of Iqaluit and their volunteer fire fighters will have the necessary type of training and backup that is required to provide that service. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 669

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Mr. Picco .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 669

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, that is indeed good news for our community. I thank the Minister. I wonder if the Minister can also commit for the equipment, because the fire department in Iqaluit does not have the foam, firefighting trucks needed. They do not have the equipment, for example, to get into the fuselage of airplanes and so on. Now, I understand from the Avery Cooper report that number one fire truck at the airport can be upgraded so that it is serviceable for a cost of $260,000. I also understand that the second fire truck has to be replaced at a cost of $600,000.

I understand the fiscal situation of the Northwest Territories Government at this time. I wonder if the Minister could commit, pending another review, I have an independent consultant right now looking at the Iqaluit airport situation for me, which I am paying for out of my own constituency budget. I am hoping to have that report on Friday. I wonder if the Minister could commit, at this time, to wait until that report comes out and then see if we can seek additional dollars, so that we can have the proper equipment to fight those fires or any eventuality at the airport.

It is great to have the training, but if you do not have the equipment to use with that training, then it is all for naught. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 669

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Picco . Mr. Antoine .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 669

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, we could work with the municipality to make the current equipment available, but in the Avery Cooper study, it stipulates that the two pieces of equipment, the foam trucks, both need to be upgraded or renovated. Timewise, in what period of time is required, it is a few years, but some time down the line, it is going to be required. To commit, right now, to saying that we will help upgrade this piece of equipment, is a difficult commitment to make at this point in time. Mr.

Picco , the honourable Member for Iqaluit , has commissioned some consultants to look at the study again and, pending the outcome of that report, we will carry on the discussion. Something like this, we need to work together and try to come to a satisfactory conclusion and I think this is one of the situations where we are going to have to wait for the results of the study. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 669

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Mr. Picco .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 669

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the issue here is a fundamental one of safety and concern for human life. You go through the study that was prepared by Avery Cooper, I think it showed one in six million chances of these types of accidents occurring in an airport where ERS could have saved lives. Mr. Chairman, after saying that, in

Iqaluit over the past 18 months, we have had four of these types of incidents and, for lack of a better word, there just seems to be bad karma at the Iqaluit airport. Not only is it an Iqaluit concern, Mr. Chairman, it is also a concern because it is the transportation hub for 13 communities in the Baffin region. If our airport goes down at Iqaluit, there are no roads to take food into Pond Inlet, there are no roads to take food into Broughton, Clyde, Hall Beach or anywhere else.

When our airport went down for a couple of days when the CF-18 crashed last summer, there was a considerable cost to the other airlines operating out of Iqaluit. Mr. Chairman, I appreciate the Minister's response saying that we would help get training for our firefighters who are volunteers at the town, but I need some kind of help with the equipment. If we do not have the proper equipment, then you cannot fight a fire unless you have a hose and, in this case, you cannot fight a fire unless you have the proper equipment. I know it is difficult for the Minister to commit to funds when we are tight.

I wonder if I could take $2 million out of Fort Smith paving, no, just kidding.

---Laughter

I wonder if there is any other sources of funding that we can look at or if there are any contingency funds under ERS available?

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Picco . I do not think we are on Fort Smith. Total Baffin. Mr. Antoine .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, we are very much aware of the Iqaluit airport. The honourable Member has briefed us thoroughly on the situation there. In regards to the equipment, there was an analysis done by the consultants. What we could do is work with the community and the honourable Member and take a closer look at these pieces of equipment for the community of Iqaluit and determine what type of additional renovation or upgrade is required. Perhaps we could work out some sort of arrangement on that in the future. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Mr. Picco .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I do have a suggestion that might be able to help all parties involved. The sale of fuel at the Iqaluit airport is about five million litres a year. Is it possible at this time that some of the royalties from that fuel sales per litre, could be dedicated to the airport in Iqaluit, like had been done before from the federal government to carry on the cost of upgrading our equipment, so that we have the proper equipment to fight the eventuality of some type of accident at the airport? That is my question.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Picco , but I believe your question is not addressed to capital in Baffin. You are now addressing where the funds may come from, from another department. I do not think it is appropriate to ask the Minister at this time. Mr. Picco .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, were you reading the rule book last night? Well, I think I am on capital projects, Mr. Chairman. The Minister has informed us that we do not have the money, so I am saying here is a suggestion that the Minister in co-operation with the other Minister we could look at. I am not asking it in a flippant manner, Mr. Chairman, I am asking it in all seriousness. I would like to hear a response from the Minister who I know is sincerely looking at this and trying to help us.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Picco . I will allow that question to Mr. Antoine .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, it is correct that the sale of the fuel in the Iqaluit airport, aviation fuels and other fuels, the revenue that is derived from those sales goes into the general revenue of this government. If any type of arrangement is going to be made in regards to the honourable Member's request, it has to go to the government, the Minister of Finance , and my colleagues in Cabinet. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

The Chair

Vince Steen

Mr. Antoine , I ruled Mr. Picco 's question out of order at this time. It is not necessary for you to answer it. What he is asking is whether you would consider other avenues to seek funding and I believe an answer in that regard would have been appropriate. Mr. Antoine .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, yes we could look at other programs. Maybe other federal programs or some emergency measure programs that are there, that we have not really taken a serious close look at. We can certainly commit to look for these other sources to try to comply to the honourable Member's request for assistance in regards to upgrading the existing equipment for the airport in Iqaluit. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Buildings and works, total Baffin region, $4,010,000. I have Mr. Evaloarjuk .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

Mark Evaloarjuk

Amittuq

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I think the honourable Minister is aware that we have been asking that the airstrip in Pond Inlet be extended for over 10 years. Under the current capital projects, it is not stated. The airplanes that are 747 and larger do arrive in Pond Inlet. It does not state this in the detail of capital. Can the Minister tell me as to why the capital is not included in the lengthening of the airstrip of Pond Inlet? I wonder why it is not included in the capital detail? Thank you, Mr. Chairman (Translation ends).

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Evaloarjuk . Mr. Minister.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 670

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the cost of the cutback that this department has to take in this fiscal year, we are not building any new infrastructure or adding on or extending. We are renovating and upgrading existing facilities so that we could extend the life of it for safety and so forth.

Extension of airports is one of the requests that is very common among some of the communities. Upon listening to the request, what we have to do here as a department, is to begin to start taking a real close look at how to accommodate those requests.

In this current year, we have nothing in the plans to extend any of the airports that have been requested, but we are going to have to look in the future to see how to accommodate those requests.

At the present time, I am told that the existing airports in the north are adequately serviced by the aircrafts, the critical aircraft that are designated to service these communities. If there is a requirement for more service, what I am told is that these critical aircrafts will increase the amount of time to go into the communities to provide that service. In regards to extending it for whatever reason, maybe economic reasons or maybe regulatory reasons, then we need to hear those arguments. In regards to the regulatory reason to extend the airports, we have a reprieve until the year 2010 to do that.

We are going to have to start planning for 2010 now, so that once the reprieve is over, we know what we do at that point in time. But for economic reasons, the airline companies are the ones that are providing the service. What I am told is that the aircraft that goes into all these communities are providing the adequate services necessary for those communities. Based on those arguments and based on the reasons for cutting back in this department, it is not in the plans for this year. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 671

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Buildings and works, total Baffin region, $4,010,000, and I have Mr. Erasmus and Mr. Barnabas . Mr. Barnabas .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 671

Levi Barnabas

High Arctic

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to thank the Minister for visiting my constituencies over the winter. I would like to thank him for having a meeting with the hamlet councils in my constituency. I have a concern over one airport, which is in my home riding of Arctic Bay, which is supposed to be an emergency airstrip. It does not have lighting.

There was a case over the winter where an ill person was supposed to leave, an emergency case, because of bad weather in Nanisivik and the Nanisivik airport not having a guiding instrument system, when there is bad weather, the planes can not make it there in most of the cases. My concern is why the Arctic Bay emergency airstrip is not lighted? There is no lighting system there. There is no ATB. Let me remind the Minister, we had to land in Nanisivik when he was visiting in Arctic Bay and we had to travel by land for 20 miles. If we were to land in Arctic Bay, we would have had to travel five minutes.

That is my question. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 671

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Barnabas . Mr. Antoine .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 671

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the Arctic Bay emergency strip is just that. It is a fairly good strip, but it does not have any power going to it. It is some distance from the municipality and the airport that serves the municipality is in Nanisivik. It is 20 to 30 kilometres or so. I do not know exactly, but it is some distance from Arctic Bay. You have to travel by the highway to it. This airport, at Nanisivik, has the lights and the terminal and the garages and the equipment, to maintain it. It serviced the jet that serviced the Nanisivik mine, so they have fairly good air service.

The community itself, some distance away, only has an emergency service strip. There has not been any planning to upgrade it, to put any lights on it or to put an airport terminal building at the emergency strip, up to this point in time.

As we are working on trying to figure out what we are going to do with the Nanisivik airport, perhaps once we come to an understanding with the owners of the Nanisivik mine to get involved in the operation of the airport in Nanisivik, that may free up some of the funds that we are spending to maintain that airport and maybe make arrangements to divert it towards the emergency airstrip in Arctic Bay. These are the types of things that we are talking about with the community.

To see that the emergency airstrip right in Arctic Bay could have the type of lighting and facilities that will allow it to be used more on a regular basis in the future. Thank you.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 671

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Mr. Barnabas .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 671

Levi Barnabas

High Arctic

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to remind the Minister that for the lighting system, there is a cable from Nanisivik to the airport, which is about five kilometres, and the closest line in Arctic Bay is only about a mile. That should not be an excuse for runway lighting for a community. The other reason is because it is 20 miles, there is sometimes very different weather in Nanisivik than Arctic Bay. That is why I mentioned that Nanisivik does not have GIS, which even when there is bad weather, no plane could land. As a matter of fact, about a few years ago, we never had a plane land for seven weeks.

Imagine that. The community suffered with the lack of supplies that we were supposed to be getting into the community, both Nanisivik and Arctic Bay. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 671

The Chair

Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Barnabas . I do not know if that is a question or a comment. Do you care to respond, Mr. Minister?

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 671

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the situation that we find ourselves in regarding the Nanisivik airport and Arctic Bay and the emergency strip is it is going to take some time to come to a good resolution. There is work being done between the department and the owners of the Nanisivik mine and the municipality of Arctic Bay, to try to figure out how to best deal with this situation. During my visit to