Debates of Oct. 20th, 2008

This is page numbers 1767 to 1822 of the Hansard for the 16th Assembly, 2nd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was going .

Topics

Members Present

Prayer

Minister’s Statement 110-16(2) Supports For Former Residential School Students

Minister’s Statement 111-16(2) Recognition Of Small Business Week 2008

Minister’s Statement 112-16(2) Foster Family Appreciation Week

Minister’s Statement 113-16(2) Meeting Of Housing Ministers

Tabling of Documents

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Committee Motion 83-16(2) Deferral Of Consideration Of Education And Culture Activity In Education, Culture And Employment Capital Estimates (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Committee Motion 84-16(2) Deletion Of $12,000,000 From Public Works And Services For GNWT Multi-Use Facility And Records Storage/request For Market Disruption Analysis/ Technical Evaluations (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Defeated)

Committee Motion 85-16(2) Recommendation To Advance By One Fiscal Year The Diamond Jenness School Renovation Under The Departmentof Education, Culture And Employment (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Committee Motion 86-16(2) Recommendation To Advance By Two Fiscal Years The Jh Sissons School Renovation Under The Department Of Education, Culture And Employment (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Committee Motion 87-16(2) Recommendation To Include An Extension To The Mangilaluk School In The Five-Year Capital Plan (Committee Motion Carried)

Committee Motion 88-16(2) Concurrence Of Tabled Document 93-16(2): Capital Estimates 2009–2010 (Committee Motion Carried)

Report of Committee of the Whole

Orders of the Day

The House met at 1:30 p.m.

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Prayer.

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Prayer

Prayer

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Good afternoon, colleagues. Welcome back to the Chamber. Orders of the Day. Item 2, Ministers’ statements. The honourable Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , Mr. Lafferty .

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Minister’s Statement 110-16(2) Supports For Former Residential School Students

Ministers’ Statements

Jackson Lafferty

Monfwi

Mr. Speaker, last month I joined former residential school students from across the Northwest Territories in Fort Providence for the Journey to Healing and Reconciliation Conference. The conference was hosted by the Dene Nation and featured several important discussions.

One panel discussion was led by Alex Janvier, who is a Denesuline Indian Residential Schools survivor and Order of Canada recipient, and Robbie Weismann, who is a Jewish Holocaust survivor. Another panel had Jane Morley, a commissioner with the Truth and Reconciliation Commission, and representatives from the Assembly of First Nations, Indian Residential Schools Resolutions Canada and the Aboriginal Healing Foundation.

At this conference, Mr. Speaker, I was asked to speak about how the Government of the Northwest Territories is supporting former residential school students. I spoke about the Residential Schools Interagency Committee, which we have always been a part of and provide funding and support to. The interagency committee facilitates government and non-government agencies to share information with former students about available programs and services.

Specifically, the Department of Health and Social Services continues to provide trauma support, counselling and referral to advanced psychological

services. The Department of Justice funds community programs that support and encourage healing. Court workers provide information on the legal system. The Department of Education, Culture and Employment continues to work with former students to provide records related to their school years.

Some of the people at the Fort Providence meetings acknowledged that we are the only provincial or territorial government that is providing support the way we do. They indicated how grateful they are for that support. They also indicated how important it is for the Government of the Northwest Territories to continue its support as we move into the truth and reconciliation phase of residential school resolution.

Later I also listened to some of the residential school survivors’ painful disclosures about what they went through, how they turned to alcohol or drugs to help them forget, and how difficult it had been to become straight and sober. This made me realize how much work we still need to do to assist survivors in their healing journeys.

It also made me realize that this government cannot afford to stop our support to residential school survivors and that we must in fact try to find ways to increase that support for our constituents, our friends and our relatives.

The Department of Education, Culture and Employment and the interagency committee are now turning their attention to the truth and reconciliation panel. We will share details about the panel’s plans to travel through the Northwest Territories as soon as information is available.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister’s Statement 110-16(2) Supports For Former Residential School Students

Ministers’ Statements

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . The honourable Minister of Industry, Tourism and Investment , Mr. Bob McLeod .

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Minister’s Statement 111-16(2) Recognition Of Small Business Week 2008

Ministers’ Statements

Bob McLeod

Yellowknife South

Mr. Speaker, this is Small Business Week, an opportunity to recognize and

celebrate entrepreneurs and their businesses across the Northwest Territories.

Small businesses play a vital role in the economy of our communities and our territory. They provide products, services, knowledge and skills that are the foundation of sustainable local economies and enhance our quality of life.

Since March of this year an average of 2,100 individuals per month have reported being self-employed. This represents 10 per cent of all individuals employed in the Northwest Territories. Many of these individuals have and will grow their businesses to the point of being able to employ others as well.

A number of events are being hosted across the NWT in honour of small businesses. Here in Yellowknife a number of agencies — territorial, federal and non-governmental — are offering a full slate of workshops, seminars and video conferences. There are activities related to small business on every day of the week.

In particular, the Northwest Territories Business Development Investment Corporation and

Canada Business NWT are offering a daylong workshop on small business bookkeeping, a noon hour video conference on starting a studio craft business and an afternoon video conference on developing a market plan. All of these events will be broadcast live to Fort Smith, Fort Simpson, Hay River and Norman Wells. In addition, the Department of Industry, Tourism and Investment will be presenting a full day arts workshop in Yellowknife.

Mr. Speaker, one of our goals as the 16th Legislative Assembly is a diversified economy that provides all communities and regions with opportunities and choices. Our priorities include developing sustainable local economies through small businesses. Small Business Week is an opportunity to meet with local entrepreneurs, attend events with a small business focus and meet some of the many individuals who work to support our small businesses every day.

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Minister’s Statement 111-16(2) Recognition Of Small Business Week 2008

Ministers’ Statements

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Ms. Lee .

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Minister’s Statement 112-16(2) Foster Family Appreciation Week

Ministers’ Statements

Range Lake

Sandy Lee

Minister of Health and Social Services

Mr. Speaker, today we begin Foster Family Appreciation Week. This is the week each year that we take time to celebrate the important contribution that foster families make in the lives of children.

Foster families open their homes to children and youth, providing them with stability, guidance and nurturing. They are people who find the time and

energy to give a child a home, to give a child a chance and to give a child a place where they can be a child. They are there to help, to offer words of encouragement, to provide the care and attention needed by all children.

These families are important partners in the NWT social services network. They work in partnership with social workers, mental health professionals, schools and health care professionals to provide services and to ensure the well-being of children. They contribute to our success as a service provider in meeting the needs of our most vulnerable children. The dedication of foster parents is to be commended.

Mr. Speaker, nationally there is a shortage of foster families, and we in the NWT are no different. Foster home recruitment is a priority across the NWT, as there is an ongoing need for additional homes. Not only is there a need for all types of homes and homes with a variety of backgrounds, but there is a tremendous need for aboriginal foster homes.

I am pleased to say that the majority of the children in foster care in the NWT are placed in their home community and with their extended family. Our most current data shows we have 611 children receiving services with over half of them staying in parental, provisional or extended family homes, with 94 per cent of these children being cared for within the NWT. However, we need to do better. Our children need homes that are in their community, within their family, and homes that will ensure they remain connected to their culture. To do this we need people to come forward to open their homes to the children in need of love and support.

I would encourage anyone in the NWT who has a loving home and a desire to nurture our children in need and help care for them to call the social worker in their community and explore being a foster parent. The children of today are our leaders of tomorrow. Let’s give them the best opportunities we can.

During this week, throughout the Northwest Territories, events will be taking place to celebrate the contributions that foster families make to our communities. I wish to convey my sincere appreciation to all of the families who are choosing to make a difference in a child’s life. Thank you to all the foster families for being there for our children.

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Minister’s Statement 112-16(2) Foster Family Appreciation Week

Ministers’ Statements

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Ms. Lee . The honourable Minister responsible for the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation, Mr. Michael McLeod .

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Minister’s Statement 113-16(2) Meeting Of Housing Ministers

Ministers’ Statements

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to update Members on the status of our efforts at the national level to improve housing conditions and also to engage the federal government to partner with provinces and territories.

Provincial and territorial housing ministers met with representatives of national housing organizations and aboriginal leaders in Ottawa on October 8, 2008, to make the case for long term federal engagement in housing. It is our hope that our efforts will encourage the federal government to commit to work with provinces and territories on long term pan-Canadian housing solutions.

Despite a recent federal announcement extending federal funding to several key housing programs, I believe that only a long term federal commitment to housing can provide the stable and predictable funding needed to meet Canadian housing needs. This is certainly the case in the Northwest Territories. The announcement, while welcome, illustrates the problem with the current system. The lack of certainty around federal funding makes it next to impossible to conduct long term planning and develop strategies to create more affordable housing.

At the national level federal subsidies for existing social housing are declining as federal mortgages mature. Annual federal funding to provinces and territories for assisted housing will decline by $500 million over the next ten years. While housing needs grow and existing social housing stock deteriorates, the federal government will save hundreds of millions of dollars on its housing portfolio. The Ministers believe that these savings must be reinvested in existing social housing, much of which needs repair and upgrading.

For the Northwest Territories this is an even larger issue. The positive decline of federal social housing will create serious challenges for all provinces and territories. Here in the NWT it creates concern for the long term sustainability of some of our communities.

There are communities in our territory where social housing makes up the vast majority of our housing stock. It is critically important that we ensure that adequate resources are available to invest in and to operate our housing stock or risk the well-being of families in many communities.

To give you a sense of the magnitude of the problem, the subsidy provided by Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation towards the operational public housing stock is declining each year and is scheduled to end by 2038. As a result, the Government of the Northwest Territories will experience a shortfall of $340 million in essential

operations and maintenance funding for public housing stock over the next 30 years.

It is an incredible challenge to sustain the delivery of public housing under these circumstances. As the Minister responsible for the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation I will continue to work with my colleagues on this issue while focusing on the unique issues facing our territory.

While in Ottawa I clearly stated that we’re also not satisfied with per capita funding for housing, as it is insufficient for our needs. Later this year I plan to meet with my colleagues in the Yukon and Nunavut to start a coordinated effort for further investments in northern housing and to ensure that our unique housing needs are recognized nationally.

Mr. Speaker, in closing I would like to thank the Legislature for unanimously passing a motion in our last sitting that stated our position clearly. While our call for an extension of our housing programs appears to have been answered, we must remain steadfast in our belief that sustainability of our social housing stock is one of this government’s key issues and will become an even larger issue in the future without support from our federal partners.

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Minister’s Statement 113-16(2) Meeting Of Housing Ministers

Ministers’ Statements

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Item 3, Members’ statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 6, acknowledgements. Item 7, oral questions. Item 8, written questions. Item 9, returns to written questions. Item 10, replies to opening address. Item 11, petitions. Item 12, reports of standing and special committees. Item 13, reports of committees on the review of bills. Item 14, tabling of documents. The Hon. Premier , Mr. Roland .

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Tabling of Documents

Tabling of Documents

Inuvik Boot Lake

Floyd Roland

Premier

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I wish to table the following documents entitled Ministerial Benefits Policy and Report Respecting Benefits Paid to Ministers Under the Ministerial Benefits Policy for the Fiscal Year Ending March 31, 2008.

Document 108-16(2), Ministerial Benefits

Policy, tabled.

Document 109-16(2), Report Respecting

Benefits Paid to Ministers Under the Ministerial Benefits Policy for the Fiscal Year Ending March 31, 2008, tabled.

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Tabling of Documents

Tabling of Documents

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Item 15, notices of motion. Item 16, notices of motion for first reading of bills. Item 17, motions. Item 18, first reading of bills. Item 19, second reading of bills. Item 20, consideration in Committee of the Whole of bills and other matters, Minister’s Statement 80-16(2), Tabled Document 93-16(2), Bills 14 , 15 , 16 and 17

and by the authority given me as Speaker

by Motion 10-16(2), I hereby authorize the House to sit beyond the daily hour of adjournment to consider the business before the House

with Mr.

Abernethy in the chair.

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Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you. I’ll be calling Committee of the Whole to order. Committee of the Whole of bills and other matters. We’re looking at Member’s Statement 80-16(2), the sessional statement; Tabled Document 93-16(2), Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010; Bills 14 , 15 , 16 and 17 . What is the wish of the committee? Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would suggest we resume consideration of Tabled Document 93-16(2), Capital Estimates 2009–2010. In particular I suggest we pick up consideration of Capital Estimates for Transportation before we continue with Industry, Tourism and Investment and Environment and Natural Resources. Following that, we’ll resume with consideration of ECE and Public Works and Services, in that order, and hopefully consider these matters through to conclusion today.

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Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Is the committee agreed?

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Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Some Honourable Members

Agreed.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Mr. Miltenberger , do you have witnesses?

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

I do, Mr. Chairman.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Is committee agreed?

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Some Honourable Members

Agreed.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

If we can get the Sergeant-at-Arms to please escort the witnesses in, that would be great.

Mr. Miltenberger , can I get you to please introduce your witnesses.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have with me Margaret Melhorn, deputy minister of Financial Management Board, Mr. Russ Neudorf, deputy minister of Transportation, and Mr. Mike Aumond, deputy minister of Public Works and Services.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . We’re on page 8-10, Transportation, Activity

Summary, Highways, Infrastructure Investment

Summary. Mr. Krutko .

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

I have a question with regard to the insurance and liability of this government. I have several inquiries from my constituents about the condition of the roads and damages that occurred to their vehicles by way of punctured fuel tanks, busted steering rods and in some cases wheels falling off.

I know this government has under the Department of Finance a risk management and insurance section, and I know that it insures normal wear and tear. But when you have steering rods busting off and people’s tanks being punctured because of the condition of the roads, I think this government has to face the possibility that there is some liability.

I’d like to ask the Minister: exactly what is the case for individuals who find themselves in a situation where they’ve been stranded because of having a wheel busted off? I’ll use a scenario. I know that a number of years ago there was an individual killed on the Dempster Highway when his eighteen-wheeler hit a pothole in the road — basically corroded from the bottom up. The guy hit the hole, flipped his vehicle, and he was killed in the accident. I know this government was taken to court, and it cost us about a million dollars, so there is that liability aspect of our responsibility.

We note a lot of times driving the highway that there are these holes along the road. You see them popping up. Once in a while you’ll see an orange cone sticking out of them by way of a marker. But, again, we have to realize that we’re not immune to these liabilities.

I’d just like to ask the Minister: exactly what is the government’s responsibility when it comes to those types of liabilities, knowing we’ve already been taken to court, knowing we’ve already been found to be at fault? Again, I’d like to ask the Minister: exactly where are we in regard to this issue? I know the Minister has been receiving correspondence from a constituent of mine. So that’s why I’m bringing it here today.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Minister Miltenberger .

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

The normal course of practice is that the Government of the Northwest Territories doesn’t pay for damages when the road has been maintained. If there are specific circumstances where there’s litigation and we’re named in the case, that would be a different matter. But as just a general matter of course the practice is that where the road has been maintained to the appropriate standard, we don’t approve payment for claims of damages.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

I think this government does have to do a better job of maintenance and dealing with the hazards that are put in front of our travelling public. I think we do have to realize that we have to take some responsibility for that. In cost reduction efforts and whatnot we sometimes sort of forget that public safety is supposed to be paramount. But when you start having three or four people taking buckets of gravel and filling in potholes on a highway because the government is trying to think they’re going to save money, to me that’s not proper maintenance, especially with the condition of the Dempster Highway in the last number of years.

We had previous commitments last spring to see an improvement in the highways. Again, this year has been nothing but complaints when talking to people driving the Dempster. More importantly, read the logs in regard to the visitors’ centre, and you can see exactly what the tourist traffic are saying.

So again I’d like to ask the Minister in regard to this issue about liability associated with the travelling public…. I know that this government has to take some responsibility in regard to those reductions by way of maintenance, in which we are causing damages to individuals’ vehicles because of the conditions of the roads. Have you looked at this whole area of compensation or in regard to insurance? What are we doing by way of risk management to focus on that specific area? I know that people have insurance and whatnot, but again, the insurance usually only covers the PL/PD on a vehicle, so what is the government doing to ensure that?

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

There are two factors, of course. There is the condition of the road and the condition of the vehicle. We have, clearly, responsibility for the condition of the road and the maintenance that we provide. But as I indicated, the normal course of practice is that we don’t pay out for complaints for damages for people just driving on a road that we are maintaining. The other question that we don’t have a lot of awareness of, of course, is that when we get a complaint, the condition of the vehicle may be involved, that resulted in the complaint. That’s the current status. Thank you.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Mr. Chairman, I believe there is a correlation between maintenance and no maintenance, and we know people are complaining that there is no maintenance being done on the road by government because of cutbacks or reductions. We’ve been telling the people in the field, “Sorry; we don’t have any money; we can’t do any maintenance,” and basically using that as the reason for not doing maintenance. I think we do have a responsibility to ensure that maintenance takes place. Cost reduction reasons is usually the excuse for not doing maintenance.

So I’d like to ask the Minister again: what is this government doing to ensure that whatever we do by way of reductions in policy does hinge on the public safety in regard to the traveling public?

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Thebacha

Michael Miltenberger

Minister of Finance

Transportation is spending about $5 million a year on capital and $2 million to $3 million a year on maintenance on the road, which is where we’re demonstrating our commitment to maintaining the Dempster to the best of our ability with the resources that we have.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Minister Miltenberger . Next on the list is Mr. Menicoche .

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. I just want to note that for the communities, they don’t get to see this part of the Leg. work, the Committee of the Whole business. Usually we’ve concluded the TV time, as we call it, for the communities before this section. I’d like to say hello to the communities.

While we’re discussing the capital budget with respect to Transportation, in my region, the Nahendeh riding, we had a huge upset in the travelling public when the roads collapsed in the spring. There are a number of reasons for it, but the main reason is that it is an old road and structure that needs continuous improvement. In fact, that was recognized by our government, and we’ve reconstructed huge sections, especially from the B.C. border towards Fort Liard. That was very much needed. The 20 kilometres they have done to date is a huge improvement.

We’d sure like to see the other 12 kilometres done up to the standard that is there. We’re hoping that we can press towards eventually chipsealing that

section again. I know that part was chipsealed briefly for the three months before it all broke apart.

There was a good foreshadowing of a much improved road transportation system that we could have, but now we’re seeing to improve the road and do it better. It takes reconstruction to do that, and it takes a lot of our Transportation resources. We have done that in the past using our CSIF dollars, especially at that one section.

The new collapse in the road there, Mr. Chair, is about one kilometre — I think 170 to 190; I may be wrong on that — but for almost two kilometres, maybe more actually, the cover was destroyed right to the sub-base, right to the clay base, and became, in effect, a mudhole, so we shut down the highway system. Transportation tried their best to get it restored in the early months, but they had to wait for better weather to do that. As a result, these roads were shut down.

It is part of our national highway system and also part of our tourism strategy for the NWT to bring tourists off the Alaska Highway and up Highway No. 7 toward the Northwest Territories to come and see

the beauty of our great country. But once the word gets out that Highway No. 7 is shut down…. Word of mouth spreads very fast to all the travellers from our southern provinces, as well as the U.S. The fellow that owns an airplane company in Fort Simpson indicated that his contacts in Europe and Germany were actually mentioning the fact that Highway No. 7 was closed in the Nahendeh riding. He said, “Look, Kevin, it’s a very important road; we’ve got to do something about it.”

So this spring I made numerous Member’s statements and got assurances from the Minister at that time that the

section that had collapsed would be reconstructed. In fact, I had — I like to say Granny from Nahanni — Granny from Nahanni tell me: “Look, Kevin, what you do is you open the road, and then you bring in more gravel. You fill it in with rip-rap and rebuild the road.” Housewives and grannies are telling me how to reconstruct the road.

What, in effect, they had done for that

section is just open it up, dry that clay base and then put it back together, and now they’ve got a good gravel cover. But I’m saying and my people are saying, “That is not good enough, Kevin. Come this spring we just may get the same situation, because in effect the same type of base is still there.” So we’ve got to look at some kind of reconstruction.

Numerous memos and e-mails to the department and to the Minister indicate to me that they’re going to be looking at some more work next year, but what has happened is that they had to take away from the resources that were there initially for the first 32 kilometres, Mr. Chair. To take away that much…. We needed to work and reallocate to another

section that collapsed. Maybe there’ll be more; there’s got be more assessment done on Highway No. 7.

It’s that old classic syndrome of taking away from Peter for Paul, Mr. Chair. I cannot advocate for that. In fact, I had thought that here is a sure, good case for extraordinary funding, if any, that our government should identify. Nowhere are there any indications in any of my correspondence that there was extraordinary funding looked at for Highway No. 7, particularly for this collapse of the highway. Often we do that, like when there’s an emergency. We have classic examples of schools collapsing and cracking in half and that kind of infrastructure.

You know, there’s emergency funding, and this type of infrastructure is collapsing as well, so I don’t see why it doesn’t qualify for extraordinary funding. I think that should be so.

I just want to talk a little a bit about our discussion on, I believe, last Friday. We removed $1.4 million from, I think it was, Highway No. 5, the chipsealing. I’m not too sure how that was going to work, but we removed $1.4 million. What I would like to see is a reallocation of those resources. I know that’s

something the Committee of the Whole has being been discussing and looking at, and at the appropriate time we will debate that in the motion, Mr. Chair.

For me, I would like to continue to reiterate that Highway No. 7 is a very important piece of highway. It was regarded Canada-wide, and even globally people talk about that piece of infrastructure. We’ve got to treat it as such, as a highly valuable piece of infrastructure that we’ve got to continue to rebuild. The case here is to rebuild and reconstruct it.

So I’d like press upon the department that we continue to spend those resources. They will not take away from other reconstruction efforts on that section. That’s the key. Even though it happened in the springtime, the slowdown and the load restrictions on Highway No. 7 impacted us throughout the summer. In fact, there were many, many cases where it caused great disruptions of moving freight, et cetera. I could just go on.

Well, actually one of the biggest ones was that we had high school students who got interrupted two ways: once because they got overflowed on Highway No. 1 just this side of the Providence junction, and the school bus went around and just about got interrupted on the Highway No. 7 side to get back to Fort Simpson, but fortunately the road had not deteriorated to where it was impassable at that point. It just goes to show the importance of Highways No. 1 and No. 7.

I cannot reiterate enough the importance to my riding of having a good base transportation infrastructure that is solid and reconstructed. If there’s anything I can ask the Minister at this point, Mr. Chair, it’s this: what exactly is the strategy and the go forward plan to work on and reconstruct Highway No. 7?

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche . Mr. Neudorf.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Russ Neudorf

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I certainly do appreciate the comments from the MLA. He was very aware of the situation that happened on the Liard Highway this past year. As I explained before, it was really a series of events that led up to the problems that occurred from

section 100 to 125, about a 25 kilometre stretch of road that just, you know, essentially because of the wet fall that we had the year before, because of the way the snow melted in the spring…. It just created all kinds of challenges for us to maintain the surface, coupled with perhaps the lack of the granular surface topping material that was on the road. So we were challenged with that.

We did have a couple of projects in the capital plan in the 2008–2009 fiscal year to deal with Liard Highway. The first was some money that was under the CSIF program, as the Member mentioned there,

where we were constructing from kilometre zero to kilometre 20, a benefit for the folks from Fort Liard in their travels south.

We also had another million dollars in the capital plan last year and this current year to take a look and start putting more surfacing material on the remainder of the highway so we could try to get ahead of this type of challenge. That’s essentially why we didn’t need any extraordinary funding last year; we already had a million dollars in the capital plan to address that type of work. We said that at contractor capacity and then our own staff capacity, we knew we couldn’t spend any more than the million dollars, so we used that to direct it to the work that’s required.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

The issue is in regard to not being able to carry out the work. I don’t believe that is true. I believe we have the capacity and ability to do as much work as we can, but I’m not going to argue that point with the Minister or his officials. I do want to reference the motion I spoke about earlier. I’d like to move a motion here.

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Tabled Document 93-16(2) Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2009–2010

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

I move that this committee strongly recommends that the Department of Transportation take urgent action to increase funding in the amount of $1.4 million for Highway No. 7, kilometre 0 to 254.1 project on the Liard Highway; and further, that the necessary funding arrangements be included in the second estimates document that will be presented to the House in February of 2009 for fiscal year 2009–2010. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche . The motion is on the floor, and it is being distributed. The motion is now distributed. The motion is in order. To the motion, Mr. Menicoche .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. A lot of my deliberations I’ve pretty much stated already for the public record. I would just say again that Highway No. 7 is a critical piece of infrastructure that runs between Fort Simpson and Fort Liard and Fort Liard to the B.C. border. I believe and the committee believes as well that with their support we must continue to establish the importance of this highway system. It is 40 to 50 years old, and much needed reconstruction has to be continued and done on those sections. I know

that we’ve got the CSIF dollars slated and that we’ve been dedicating a lot of our resources to reconstruction from kilometre zero to 32, which is the B.C. border to Fort Liard, but it’s the other sections that we’re going to have to pay attention to. I believe that by reallocating more of this money to Highway No. 7, we can expedite the process, because, let’s face it, it’s deteriorating faster than we keep up with it. The only way we can keep up to it is dedicating more resources. I believe this is one of the ways we can do it.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr.

Menicoche. To the motion.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

An Honourable Member

Question.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Question is being called. I will call on Mr. Menicoche to conclude debate on…. Mr. Yakeleya .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I certainly have some thoughts about this motion. I thought about the highways in all the Mackenzie Valley in the north, and I’m going to not support this motion.

I think this motion should look at other highways. I also mentioned before that the Dempster Highway up in Inuvik certainly needs some work, especially with dust control. I have seen it. That’s a whole region that has been in the dust for a long time in terms of the use of that highway. I certainly understand Mr. Menicoche ’s concerns about this situation. I’ve been made aware of it.

However, for myself, I look at some of the roads. I certainly do not agree with the motion in terms of the recommendations to reallocate the funding. I think that the people of Beaufort-Delta and the Mackenzie region, in terms of dust control and what they can do to enhance safety…. This is something that should be strongly considered with the amount of money that’s in here from Transportation for Highway No. 5. However, I want to state for the record that I think there are other areas that should be on record. I am going to leave it at that and have some discussions with the department after.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr.

Yakeleya. Question has been called. I call upon Mr. Menicoche to conclude debate on the motion.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. I would like to state that I am encouraged by my fellow committee members for moving this motion forward, and I appreciate their support. As well, I would like to request a recorded vote.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr.

Menicoche. The Member has requested a recorded vote. All those in favour, please stand.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Principal Clerk, Operations (Ms. Bennett)

Mr. Menicoche , Mr. Ramsay , Mrs. Groenewegen , Mr. Beaulieu , Mr. Hawkins , Ms. Bisaro , Mr. Krutko , Mr. Bromley .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

All those opposed, please stand.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Principal Clerk, Operations (Ms. Bennett)

Mr. Jacobson , Mr. Yakeleya .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

All those abstaining, please stand.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Principal Clerk, Operations (Ms. Bennett)

Mr. Lafferty , Ms. Lee , Mr. Miltenberger , Mr. Roland , Mr. Michael McLeod , Mr. Robert McLeod , Mr. Bob McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Okay. The results of the recorded vote on the motion are eight in favour, two opposed, and seven abstentions. The motion is carried.

Committee motion carried.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

All right; next on my list is Mr. Yakeleya .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to ask several questions about the department here. The first has to do with the safety of the winter roads in terms of the region I represent, Sahtu region.

The winter roads have seen an increase in traffic and activity. We also have seen a number of projects happen that would improve and enhance the quality of our roads. I would like to see if there are going to be continued road safety signs; realigning the roads from the curbs, from the hills; and what this department proposes to do with the amount of traffic. We saw last year in Sahtu heavy equipment passing with rigs on them, chains on the tires. Traffic is coming all hours of the night. People in my region take advantage of the winter roads, as they open sometimes in January, sometimes a little later. They close in March, and that window of opportunity closes for them.

There are lots of concerns coming from my region about the big rigs coming in. Sometimes they get quite scared when they travel. Usually the best time for travelling on the Mackenzie Valley winter road is at nighttime, because you can see the lights; that’s the only way they know that other vehicles being used by oil companies are on the road.

I’d ask the department: in terms of enhancing the quality or safety of our roads what is the department proposing to do on these winter roads up in the Sahtu region?

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Mr. Neudorf.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Russ Neudorf

Thank you, Mr. Chair. We have quite a number of various projects or programs underway to look at safety on the Mackenzie Valley winter road. The Member mentioned a few initiatives that are underway.

On the capital side of things we’ve invested quite heavily in the winter road for the last half a dozen years or so. We look at what’s in front of the committee here now; that will continue. A number of different bridges are going to, we hope, be constructed shortly, including the Blackwater River bridge and a couple of others.

We also have ongoing money for grade improvements to the winter roads. We’ve done an assessment of the winter road and identified those areas where a correction of the horizontal or vertical alignment might be required. As the Member mentioned, one of the major ones there was the bypass of the community of Tulita, where we moved the winter road out of the community of Tulita to address some of those safety issues. We also did the same thing with Norman Wells a couple of years ago.

We hope, as well, to keep improving the communication and partner with industry and make sure they’re aware of all their requirements. We do have an ongoing dialogue with industry and the users of the winter road. We’ve structured our contracts on the winter road so that when they have some extraordinary use of the road, they would contribute to the department to account for any additional work that’s required to construct the road or to operate and maintain the road.

We do think that with those initiatives, as well as with continuing to improve the signage, the road is becoming safer all the time.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

We certainly look forward to the department’s initiatives with the community; safety initiatives they could also implement from the community in terms of what safety initiatives could be undertaken. The community has some fairly good ideas about what should be done and what can be done. Some of the signs on the Mackenzie Valley road up in my region are on trees. Sometimes those signs fall down for whatever reason. We want to look at some of those signs in terms of safety measures.

The deputy minister alluded to the bridge program, and we certainly appreciate the bridge program coming to our region. There’s one bridge that’s between Fort Good Hope and Norman Wells called the Oscar Creek Bridge. It’s just sitting there as a monument, and people are wondering when the department will put in the approaches to it. It’s been there for a couple of years now. It’s very dangerous and hazardous.

When will the department, in terms of its priorities on bridges, fix this bridge? They’re going to start on other bridges, but this bridge has been in the spot, sitting there; it’s an eyesore. Actually, it’s starting to become a joke to my people of the Sahtu region, because it’s not doing anything. If this bridge was down somewhere in the south part of the territory, it would be done just like that. The priority is the Oscar Creek Bridge.

There are other bridges, I know, from Big Smith, Little Smith — bridges that need to be up and running. I’d ask the deputy or the Minister: when will we see the Oscar Creek Bridge completed, rather than just have a monument there?

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Russ Neudorf

Thanks for the comments. Of course, there are many priorities, many areas where we could improve the Mackenzie Valley winter road. We have, as I mentioned before, made quite a few improvements to it already. One of the projects that is underway is the Oscar Creek Bridge, as the Member mentioned. We do hope to get to that very shortly.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

We’ve been hearing “very shortly” for a bit here. I’m not too sure what the definition of the deputy’s “very shortly” is in terms of the time frame. Can we look at something in terms of having the commitment that this bridge will be done and finished? It’s sitting high and dry with no approaches. My people want to know when this bridge will be completed. It’s sitting there. It’s an embarrassment for the government. When will this bridge be done? You have the dollars. I’d like to ask the deputy to expand a little more on this “very shortly” answer.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Russ Neudorf

As I mentioned previously, there are many different priorities for work on the Mackenzie Valley winter road. We are proceeding with the Blackwater River bridge, which is taking up the majority of our staff’s time at the present moment. On Oscar Creek it’s a matter of doing the engineering work for that to identify all those requirements. It’s on the work plan, and we hope to have that engineering underway this fiscal year yet.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

There are lots of bridges, and people are very happy that the Blackwater bridge is being looked at. But I’m saying this bridge has been sitting there for about two years. It’s been sitting there. How long does it take an engineer to say, “We want to build approaches on both ends to complete it”? I don’t want to get into too much detail on the Oscar Creek Bridge in terms of the work that needs to get done there, but by God, you have to have that work done in the next couple of months. It’s been sitting there for two years.

Blackwater is not even on the banks of the Blackwater River, yet now let’s focus on Blackwater bridge, let alone Bosworth or Bear River bridges.

There are investments going into the Sahtu. There are millions of dollars going into the Sahtu oil and gas, and our return on investment is not too bad. But they could stay longer if they had those bridges there. They have the Blackwater bridge in there. Bosworth, I understand, is a temporary bridge. Oscar is just sitting there. They also got the Big Smith.

We have major investments going into the Sahtu region for oil and gas, mining exploration. We’d better have a good return on them for our people, because our roads are only open from January to the end of March. That’s it. Our cost of living is high. People who want to go out and take advantage of the winter roads to have a vacation, drive their vehicles down, are very limited compared to other regions that have all weather roads. Our people are starting to demand that these priorities take place in our region. Right now we don’t have that opportunity. We use the highway as the Mackenzie River.

When I go back home, they say, “Well, the other MLAs and other regions have roads. They have opportunities.” People in Délînê have to cross the Bear River Lake. They have to wait, and now that climate change is taking effect, they have to wait longer. They have companies in Délînê that want to do work. We can’t open the Bear River Lake ice crossing; it’s too warm. They’re losing millions, thousands of dollars.

That’s why I’m asking this department to put some emphasis on the region that doesn’t have all weather access roads. Put in a little higher priority. Our food might go down. That’s what I want to ask. I think I’m making more of a statement, Mr. Chairman, and I’m asking the department to have some leniency, some goodness in their hearts to look at people who live in the Sahtu who have these types of challenges before them.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Mr. Miltenberger .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. After that impassioned plea I’ll ask Minister Michael McLeod if he would care to respond to that specific request.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Minister Miltenberger . Mr. Michael McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to say that there has been some significant focus in the area of the Sahtu, the Member’s riding, for some time now and for all the reasons that he’s listed, including the short time frame where the communities can access the south for shopping or visiting or things of a personal nature. There’s also the consideration among the communities in the Sahtu to be able to have the communities

connected during the winter months so they can travel back and forth.

We have been focusing some considerable investment through the strategic infrastructure initiatives. We’ve managed to target many bridges, along with grade work, in the Sahtu. We would like to have all 42 bridges that we have identified over the years as immediate done over the next while. We indicated, as the deputy has indicated, in the very near future, because in some of the cases we don’t have all the resources identified.

We have targeted over the next while two bridges we’d like to get done, and that’s Jackfish Creek and Bosworth Creek. Oscar Creek is also something that is part of what’s being considered. If the Member feels we should focus on Oscar Creek as a priority, we’d certainly consider that. There is still some work to be done, as the deputy has indicated, but we’d gladly sit down with the Member to have that discussion on where the priorities for investment in the Sahtu are. We don’t have the resources to do all the projects.

There are some dollars that may be available down the road through the Building Canada Fund, but we’ve indicated to the Members that we’d like to have that discussion before we make any commitments.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Next on my list is Mr. Beaulieu .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Tom Beaulieu

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. First of all, looking at this capital plan, I’d like to thank the Department of Transportation for putting some money into Highway No. 6. I had an opportunity to discuss this budget, or the plan to put this money in, with the community of Fort Resolution. Highway No. 6 is the highway that goes from Hay River into Fort Resolution. It’s not right from Hay River but from what’s referred to as the Big Buffalo River camp into Fort Resolution, 90 kilometres of highway. For the most part, about 70 kilometres of this highway is in fairly decent shape.

It’s not in good shape, but it’s in decent shape. The majority of this work I’d like to have the department look at, just concentrating on 17 kilometres of highway that goes from the camp at Little Buffalo River into Fort Resolution.

My understanding from talking to some of the people who live in the community is that that highway was originally put in as a temporary road. I was told it was just a road that was put in to originally make the road passable for regular traffic, but it was always the intention to actually get the road up to specs. So this is our first opportunity since then to get that portion of the road up to specs.

I think I did make a Member’s statement asking the Minister to take a look at getting the project started as quickly as possible. The budget goes back to

this current fiscal year, so there should be nothing impeding the department from starting the project as soon as possible. I’m hoping I can get an opportunity. I do believe the department has then given some direction to travelling to the community with me to take a look at this road. I’m hoping that it gets down to a point where we’re focusing on the worst areas of the highway.

In addition to that, I have a question for the Minister. The various highway chipseal overlay program has probably, aside from the bridge work, one of the larger budgets in the Department of Transportation plan over the length of the term of this government. I was wondering if the department or the Minister — whichever, the infrastructure Minister or the Minister of DOT — could advise me if the various highway chipseal overlay program is scheduled to go into Highway No. 6 at this time. That’s my question for now. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu . Mr. Neudorf.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Russ Neudorf

Thank you, Mr. Chair. The Member is correct. We have a four year, $1 million per year project to reconstruct and put additional chipseal on Highway No. 6. That project started this year. We’ve been doing some engineering work and have been trying to arrange a meeting with the community. We hope to arrange that shortly, in the next month or so, to get the communities’ input on their priorities.

In our own investigations that we done so far, we think that the priority is, as the Member suggested, the last 25 or 30 kilometres that go into the community. I think we’re aligned there. After the community meeting there will be some work out to tender. It’s not on the road work this year, but it would be producing granular materials so that we can get ready for some of the funding that’s coming next year and begin some of the reconstruction and drainage work that’s required prior to putting the chipseal on.

The second question is in terms of the chipseal overlay. There is a budgeted amount there. It is to rehabilitate the existing chipsealed surfaces on our highway system. It’s the amount of money that we need to ensure that they are — at the end of their life cycle — being rehabilitated and replaced as required. We do have an estimate of where we think the priorities for work are, but it’s always finalized in the spring of the year.

After the winter and getting through the drainage time when the subgrade is at its weakest, we go and inspect all of our chipsealed surfaces and decide what the priorities are for replacement and then go and get the work done. The Member’s portion of Highway No. 6 that’s chipsealed would be evaluated along with all the other sections at that time. I believe it was about two years ago that we had gone and

actually put a new surface on a

section there, so I’m not sure that it would be up for renewal right away.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Tom Beaulieu

Tu Nedhe

I thank the deputy minister for the answer. Just for more information on the chipseal overlay on Highway No. 6, there are only about 15 kilometres that are chipsealed. The department did add an additional five or six kilometres of chipseal beyond what used to be the community of Pine Point. If those are areas that would be considered under this program, then it does leave the rest of the highway for the budget that’s scheduled for Highway No. 6. I’m happy with that. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu . There is no question, so we’ll move to the next person on the list. Mr. Krutko .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I’d like to ask the Minister of Transportation if he can give me an update in regard to the Building Canada Fund and how community projects can be added to that fund. I know of previous commitments from previous Ministers to looking at the Aklavik access road to the gravel source. I know there was a meeting last week. I’m wondering about the possibility of getting an update on what the status of that is. What type of a timeframe are we looking at to basically develop a proposal, submit it and see if we can access the funds from the Building Canada Fund to do that project, similar to the project in Tuk?

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Minister Miltenberger .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would refer that question to Minister Michael McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Minister Miltenberger . Minister Michael McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Mr. Chair, as the Members are aware, we had a very busy year this year working on the Building Canada Fund, first of all to sit down and negotiate with our federal counterparts the framework agreement that spells out the different areas that would be considered for investment and the different issues that we’d have to negotiate. Following that, we did come to a successful conclusion on the dollar amount and the criteria areas that would be considered for investment. We also put together the listing of projects that would be brought forward for consideration and negotiation with the federal government and the management committee. For ’08–09 we did have that concluded.

We have now submitted the second year’s listing of investments, and we are waiting for a response from the federal government. We’ll have some discussion on that with the management

committee. We are now in the process of firming up future projects and areas that this government would like to consider for investment in the areas of transportation infrastructure and also municipal infrastructure. We did provide one briefing to the Members to give us a status report and an update of where we are. We are now evaluating projects within the Department of Transportation, and the municipal governments are also doing the same. We are compiling a list.

As things move forward, we are also expecting that we will be looking at a response from the committees to hear what their recommendations are. We also expect to have that firmed up sometime over the next while and to be able to move forward with that.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

I’d like to thank the Minister for that. We also realize that in order for projects to get on the agenda for the Building Canada Fund, they have to be at a certain stage of assessment and validation in looking at the capital costs of those projects. So that’s the challenge a lot of our smaller communities have with our projects. We don’t have the ability to access the Department of Transportation or Public Works or infrastructure departments to assist us in compiling that information so that we can make the list, so I think that’s the challenge we’re facing.

Also, out of the Building Canada Fund there was some $500,000 listed for research and development. I’d like to ask the Minister: do you have any idea of how that $500,000 is going to be expended by way of research and development? What projects are being expended for that $500,000 that had been mentioned?

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Mr. Miltenberger .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

I once again refer that question to Minister Michael McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Minister Miltenberger . Minister Michael McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Mr. Chair, the dollar amount on the money that has been earmarked for research and development is actually $1.8 million over the life of the Building Canada Fund. We have a number of areas that we are interested in. We have criteria that we have to meet, and some of the criteria require us to look at climate change issues and environmental issues. It also gives us the ability to do the research.

We have looked at and are considering some dollars to be awarded to the Aklavik Steering Committee that is doing some work pending that we move forward to some satisfactory conclusion and start to nail down what has to be done. We’ve just had some recent discussion in that area with that committee on the 17th of this month, and I am assuming there’ll be

others. But as to an actual overall budget of where those dollars will be allocated and spent, we haven’t finalized that.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Mr. Chair, it would be good if the Minister could keep the Members on this side of the House and the committees informed in regard to how those expenditures are being made and who’s getting on the list and who isn’t. I think it’s important. Climate change affects people differently, especially where we have communities dealing with permafrost, shoreline erosion and the importance of gravel in those areas where we don’t have gravel.

I’d like to ask: has the department looked at what other initiatives are being contemplated? You talked about climate change, and you talked about different types of infrastructure and water treatment plants. Again, I think it’s important that we also ensure that we do have the flexibility and allowance for small community projects to be able to meet this list, knowing that a lot of them don’t have the capacity or don’t have the people on the ground to deal with this. There is going to be a need for dollars to be fronted to those organizations so that they can get the expertise that they’re going to need to compile a report or an assessment or a study.

I’d like to ask the Minister: what kinds of assurances can small communities get so that there will be resources for them to do the legwork that’s going to be needed for these programs or projects?

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Minister Miltenberger .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I’d refer that question to Minister Michael McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Minister Miltenberger . Minister Michael McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I think all the Members recognize that the dollars allocated in this program are a far cry from what is actually needed to be able to accommodate all the different projects that are territorial in nature that are happening in the larger centres and in the small communities. We will consider all projects as best as we can. We’d like to be able to follow some of the earlier strategic initiatives that were put forward in terms of submissions to the federal government. We’d like to hear what the Regular Members have to offer in terms of recommendations. We’re open to communities coming forward.

It’s a real challenge, of course, to be able to deal with each issue as it comes forward. Communities and projects need investment to do the legwork, to do the research, to do the early investments to

describe and figure out what the scope of work is. But we want to be able to leave it as broad based as possible and try to capture many of the initiatives that are being brought forward, then try to narrow it down in terms of importance and realistic investment as we can. We’re not going to be able to do all of them, but we sure can try to see which ones would make the most sense.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

It’s the last, which projects make the most sense, that I have concerns about, because a lot of times the smaller communities don’t seem to be put on the same pedestal as large capital projects for specific departments. Departments seem to win out over small communities, and that’s the challenge that we’re facing here in regard to how capital is being allocated.

I’d like to ask the Minister of Finance if there’s any way of monitoring some of these projects to ensure that they are fairly distributed by way of geography, making sure that small and large communities have a fair balance on that, and also that we have projects north and south, that it’s not all in one specific area or specific region. I think it’s important to realize that with the limited resources we have, we have to ensure that we find that balance and that it’s fair to everyone. Thank you.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . No questions. We’re on page 8-10, Transportation, Activity

Summary, Highways, Infrastructure Investment

Summary, Total Infrastructure Investment

Summary: $57.833 million. Mr. Yakeleya .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

Mr. Chair, the question I have is on the follow-up to Mr. Krutko ’s question to the Minister in terms of the Building Canada Fund. I have a little file here that I have on the Great Bear River Bridge project being delayed, deferred, cancelled, postponed until further funding.

I’d just like to ask the Minister: when can the people in the Sahtu look at a bridge like this? They don’t know what to think, since this bridge has been on the books for a long time. They’re anxious to hear what the government is planning to do in terms of putting this bridge in place. If it does get in place, for us it will be water under the bridge, I guess.

I’d like to ask the appropriate Minister: can you tell the people and me what’s the plan for this Great Bear River Bridge? Thank you.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Minister Miltenberger .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I’ll refer that question to Minister Michael McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Minister Miltenberger . Minister Michael McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. As I indicated earlier in my response to investment in the Sahtu, we’ve been trying to really offset some of the pressures that are being brought into that area by resource development, by the oil and gas industry, and trying to make the winter road more accommodating to the local traffic. We have targeted 42 bridges that are needed in the Sahtu region. We think we are in a position to do at least 41 of them.

We did have the Great Bear River Bridge as part of the projects that were listed under the strategic investment dollars. The budget line for that project was at $25 million, and it has since practically tripled in value. It’s not something we feel we can accommodate as part of our Building Canada projects, so we are right now looking to see if there are any other ways we can fit it into our budgeting process, including maybe work — if there’s some desire to move forward — on the Mackenzie Valley road or maybe other partnership arrangements. We do not have a plan at this point for the Great Bear River Bridge, but we have not lost sight of it.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

I appreciate the Minister’s response of not losing sight — it might be a little foggy right now — of how you get this bridge in place. but, Mr. Chairman, I am looking at it in terms of the amount of investment that could and should continue to go into the Sahtu region.

I have these bridges in place. We know the bridges are being built in the Sahtu region, because we drive by them and we see them. We certainly appreciate them. When the bridge isn’t put at Tulita to connect to Norman Wells, we know the amount of time for the local contractors, the local businesses…. Each day they lose thousands of dollars because of the weight restriction, because of the open water at the Mackenzie and the Bear rivers, and at the N’Dulee crossing there’s open water too. So we know those challenges.

In Délînê they know what it takes for a company to get across to the Bear River on the Great Bear Lake. Every day that goes by, they lose thousands of dollars because of the weight restrictions, because they’re unable to get across there. Companies are telling us they could stay an extra 30 days in our region. I asked Husky, “What does it cost to operate your rig per day?” They spend $40,000 a day operating a rig. If they can get bridges in places such as the Bear River, you’re going to hundreds of thousands of dollars in the Sahtu region.

By not having these critical infrastructure bridges there, we’re not supporting the local businesses as much as we could. There are millions. People want some concrete answers.

I know the Minister is trying hard. There are challenges with the federal government in their funding. There are challenges with his own

government here. You talked about Bosworth before. Bosworth is millions of dollars. Oscar Creek is probably less, but the Oscar Creek Bridge is just sitting there. When you talked about putting in the Blackwater River bridge, which I think is really good, people are going to be happy about that.

But there are really some issues that should be looked at in terms of building infrastructure in our region here. That is what my people want to know. There is nothing targeted.

There are challenges. I know the federal government has some challenges we do not quite agree with. Certainly, there have to be some dollars. There were already plans for the Great Bear River Bridge. They said there was a budget of $25 million. You know, just like our schools or hospitals, we budget something, and next year they triple and double, but still somehow we find money for projects. So I’m saying that in Transportation they can do it in increments. Probably the department does not like that very much in terms of building the approaches and getting the steel, because I understand our steel is somewhere else in the south here — Bear River Bridge steel. The steel was there.

Again I would ask the department to seriously consider the infrastructure that needs to go into our region and into the Sahtu region for the people. We have maybe two months at the most, three months in a really good season, and then we have to fly everything in. Our companies work from December to the end of March, and then there’s no activity. These young guys and young ladies that build their companies in the communities rely on the winter road. That is the only opportunity they have to make money, unless you get a contract with the territorial government or the federal government to do some work.

They can’t move their equipment all around. It has to stay, and somebody has to pay the bill.

I am asking the department for the Sahtu people — not me; it’s what the Sahtu people are asking me — to have some concrete…. We’ve been given the green light — stop, suspend, defer, postpone — and we have been given hopes that it might go through. Then we looked at the book. They’re asking about the Bear River Bridge. I know the Minister talked about Bosworth, but there are other bridges also that need to have some attention. For us, in our region, this is what we are asking. It’s no different. Other regions have all weather roads and bridges already. they don’t need to really talk about this. I guess I’m asking how this government supports the Sahtu region.

Over the years million of dollars have gone in from oil companies. Husky alone spent over $100 million in the Sahtu region. Kodiak, PetroCan, Talisman spend millions in the Sahtu region, and we don’t

feel we’re getting a fair shake in terms of investment. Just the safety on the highways themselves — I hope to see some really good safety programs.

Those big trucks come through with chains on their tires, and they brag how fast they can go from Wrigley to Norman Wells, how many hours. Sometimes, Mr. Chair, that road is so good that those truckers go past the speed limit of 50 kilometres an hour. What I am looking for is some improvement on the roads this summer for the people’s sake. Members talk about the road, and we certainly want to see a lot of improvement.

So, Mr. Chair, in closing — I think it’s more of a statement — I’m hoping I would see some concrete plans in terms of the Bear River Bridge, going into a solid plan to see production, going on to see what we can do.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Mr.

Yakeleya. Minister Miltenberger .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. If you want to talk about concrete plans, the man to talk to is the Minister of Transportation , Mr. Michael McLeod . I will ask him to respond.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Minister Miltenberger . Minister Michael McLeod .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. We have over the last number of years invested very significantly in the area of Sahtu. It has probably received the most investment in terms of bridge work. We put in many bridges that would see the road season extended so that people could take advantage of it, and the oil and gas industry can also utilize this piece of winter road. We also had partnerships with many of the companies that the Member has mentioned to enhance the road, to keep it safe, to keep it stable and also to extend the season.

The Bear River Bridge is a project that has had money identified through the strategic investment fund. It is a project that has tripled in cost, and we no longer have resources identified to move forward with this project. Until that changes, we are going to have some difficulty agreeing that we will invest in that project. If we wanted to bring it into the Building Canada Fund, we would probably have to take half of what our budget is for transportation investment and put it into one project. It is a project that was de-scoped, because we didn’t have the resources to do it, to bring it forward. It’s not an easy decision to make to move away from a project.

We recognize that this would allow the winter road season in the Sahtu to be extended, to open it up a little earlier. But we’ve taken the initiative to create bypass roads. We have taken the initiative to invest

in building a road across the ice that would also open the winter road traffic earlier. We’ve tried to do things to accommodate and help the people in that area and also industry, but right now we are not in a position…. We don’t have the resources to build the Bear River Bridge. The money that was in that area has been reinvested in other areas, as the Member has indicated.

We can’t allow steel that was purchased to be sitting there when we were just criticized for the Oscar Creek Bridge — having infrastructure that we haven’t been able to put in place soon enough or quick enough. I’m sure we would certainly be criticized for leaving steel lying on the ground in Tulita because we didn’t have the resources to put it up.

It’s still something we’d like to do. We hope, as we move forward with discussions and options for the Mackenzie Valley road with the federal government, that this would be part of it. But until then we don’t have the resources, and we can’t comfortably say to the Member that we will be doing the Bear River Bridge within the life of this government.

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

The Chair

Glen Abernethy

Thank you, Minister McLeod. Next on my list is Mr. Beaulieu .

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Committee Motion 82-16(2) Recommended Funding Increase Of $1,400,000 For Highway #7 Km 0–254.1 Liard Highway Under The Department Of Transportation (Td 93-16(2)) (Committee Motion Carried)

Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

Tom Beaulieu

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi cho, Mr. Chair. Just a quick question for the department or the Minister. I see that there is a plan to do some energy upgrades to camps. I’m assuming that’s just to make some of the equipment storage areas more energy efficient. I’m wondering if there is a plan to do an energy upgrade on the