Debates of Feb. 17th, 1995

This is page numbers 149 - 175 of the Hansard for the 12th Assembly, 7th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was chairman .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Ministers Absent From The House

Firearms Control

Establishment Of Ombudsman Office

Attogoyuk School Graduation

Proposed Firearms Legislation

Constituency Meetings

Opening Of New Community Hall In Nahanni Butte

Swearing-in Ceremony Of Governor General

Proposed Firearms Legislation

Creation Of Ombudsman Office

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Rejection Of Bhp Application

Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Status Of Regional Councils Act

Status Of Nursing Profession Act

Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Birthing Centre For Baffin

Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Reallocation Of Funding To Community High Schools

Capital From Mic For Construction Of Houses

Background Information For Ambassador Of Circumpolar Affairs

Report On Fire Management And Fire Suppression

Status Of Revisions To Education Act

Employees' Investment In Canada Savings Bonds

Naming Of Arctic College In Nunavut

Written Question 6-12(7): Notice Of Development Of High School Program And Reduction Of Services

Committee Report 3-12(7): Report On The Review Of The Legislative Action Paper Proposing New Heritage Legislation For The Northwest Territories

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Permanent Display Of A Y Jackson Collection

Bill 1: Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1995-96

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Bill 15:

An Act To Amend The Elections Act

To Defer Consideration Of Bill 15

Defer Clause 3 Of Bill 15

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Mr. Antoine , Hon. Silas Arngna'naaq , Mr. Ballantyne , Mr. Dent , Hon. Samuel Gargan , Hon. Stephen Kakfwi , Mr. Koe , Mr. Lewis , Mrs. Marie-Jewell , Ms. Mike , Hon. Don Morin , Hon. Richard Nerysoo , Mr. Ningark , Mr. Patterson , Hon. John Pollard , Mr. Pudlat , Mr. Pudluk , Hon. John Todd , Mr. Whitford , Mr. Zoe

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---Prayer

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 149

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Lewis . Good morning. Orders of the day. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Pollard .

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Minister's Statement 17-12(7): Ministers Absent From The House

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 149

John Pollard

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Good morning. Mr. Speaker, I wish to advise Members that the Premier will be absent from the House today to attend a youth conference in Fort McPherson. The honourable Kelvin Ng will be absent from the House today, Monday and Tuesday to attend to long-standing commitments in his constituency. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 17-12(7): Ministers Absent From The House

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 149

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Kakfwi .

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Minister's Statement 18-12(7): Firearms Control

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 149

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, on February 14th, the Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada tabled new firearms legislation, Bill C-68, as he indicated he would when he announced, on November 30, 1994, the government's new firearm control program for the stated purposes of cracking down on the criminal use of firearms, by targeting firearms smuggling and by banning many firearms. The centre piece of the new program is its most controversial aspect: the creation of a national system of registration of all firearms.

Department of Justice officials have begun to analyze the bill in detail, but an early review indicates that there are few differences with the consultation package released on December 4, 1994. I had grave concerns when the consultation package was released and, if anything, the draft legislation tabled on Tuesday leaves me even more unhappy than I was a couple of months ago. While the provisions in Bill C-68 which will create serious consequences for real criminals who use firearms in the commission of offenses are certainly supportable, it has other features which the vast majority of northerners will not support.

When Minister Rock visited the Northwest Territories last October, Members of this Assembly expressed their concerns about new firearms legislation, and I and officials of the Department of Justice met with him on several occasions to educate him on the circumstances of life in the Northwest Territories. We achieved some success in demonstrating that measures designed to address the problems in Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver were totally inappropriate in remote northern settlements where subsistence hunting is a way of life and firearms are a tool.

As a result, Minister Rock made adjustments in the December proposals to relax the rules on the purchase of ammunition to allow someone to buy ammunition on behalf of another person, to allow for aboriginal firearms officers in remote communities, and to adjust the requirements for training on firearms use to accommodate the special needs of native people. Our early review indicates that the improvements respecting ammunition are in the bill, but appears that the remainder of these modest improvements are not reflected in Bill C-68.

Minister Rock, against our best advice, in December and again in Bill C-68, has introduced the universal registration of firearms, which may be fine for Toronto, but is intrusive and offensive when applied in the Northwest Territories. Under these provisions, everyone will have to register every firearm by January 1, 2003, and the failure to do so could result in a criminal prosecution.

Over the past several months, officials of the Department of Justice and of the Department of Renewable Resources have worked extensively with the Department of Justice Canada representatives to try to develop a modified firearms safety training program designed specifically for NWT residents. Bill C-68 may place that work in jeopardy through its requirement that the Canadian firearms safety training course be the course used throughout the country. Further consultation will be required to determine whether there is a way to soften the blow.

Our legal advisors indicate that there is a serious question as to whether the universal registration of firearms can properly be done within the federal government's jurisdiction over the criminal law: It may infringe on the jurisdiction of provinces and territories over property and civil rights.

It also interferes with the rights of aboriginal persons to pursue traditional hunting activities, and as such may well infringe

section 35 of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms and the principles set down in the Sparrow case.

The governments of the NWT, Yukon, Alberta and Saskatchewan adopted a common position for presentation to Minister Rock at the meeting of Ministers of Justice in Victoria -- as I reported yesterday -- at the meeting in January 1995. Later today, I will be tabling that position as we gave to the Minister at that time.

At the Victoria meeting, I expressed our objections to these firearms proposals to Mr. Rock in no uncertain terms. Now that the legislation has been introduced, I will be writing to him to confirm the objections of this government. I will also be writing to Warren Allmand, the chair of the Justice and Legal Affairs Committee, suggesting that the committee come to the Northwest Territories as part of its deliberations on this bill. Thank you.

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Minister's Statement 18-12(7): Firearms Control

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 150

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Kakfwi . Item 2, Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Dent .

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Establishment Of Ombudsman Office

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 150

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I was looking forward to the report of the Standing Committee on Legislation on the office of the ombudsman. Having heard from many of the public that they feel such an office is very important and should be established; and having attended some of the Standing Committee on Legislation hearings in December where I heard presentations in favour of such an office, I expected the report would provide guidance to the government on how to proceed with establishing the office of ombudsman.

Mr. Speaker, I was very surprised and disappointed to hear in the report yesterday that the committee feels it best not to proceed right away. I know the committee gave this idea careful consideration and I understand the rationale for their decision, but, Mr. Speaker, I think the office of the ombudsman is important enough that we should proceed with establishing it concurrently with the office of Access and Privacy Commissioner.

Along with the usual duties of an ombudsman, Mr. Speaker, I would like to see the ombudsman for the NWT being given a role as children's advocate. Too often our kids are slipping through the cracks in the system and they have no one to watch out for their interests.

During the Standing Committee on Legislation hearings, I had asked the Minister of Justice if the department had examined the situation in BC where the ombudsman was charged with the role of acting as a child advocate. This is not the perfect solution, Mr. Speaker. The role of an ombudsman and child advocate is different, but in BC they found that assigning limited advocacy for children to the office of ombudsman was an effective way to start the office. They have since established a separate office called the Child, Youth and Family Advocate.

Mr. Speaker, I note the committee report does not recommend the office of the ombudsman not be established, only that it follow the establishment of the office of Access and Privacy Commissioner.

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude by statement.

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Establishment Of Ombudsman Office

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 150

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Member for Yellowknife Frame Lake is requesting unanimous consent. Are there any nays? Conclude your statement, Mr. Dent .

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Establishment Of Ombudsman Office

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 150

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, honourable Members. Mr. Speaker, since it is not expected that the Access and Privacy Commissioner office will be a full-time position, I strongly urge the government to proceed with legislation as soon as possible to establish the office of the ombudsman at the same time as the Access and Privacy Commissioner and, most importantly, Mr. Speaker, to assign a child advocacy role to that office. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Establishment Of Ombudsman Office

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 150

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Item 3, Members' statements. Ms. Mike .

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Attogoyuk School Graduation

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 150

Rebecca Mike

Baffin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. On December 17, 1994, I had the pleasure in joining Attogoyuk School students on their graduation ceremony. This was a very special graduation ceremony in more ways than one. Pangnirtung had the highest number of graduates in the Baffin communities. The graduating class was a total of 11. For all of the graduates, it was an especially happy occasion, and for the parents and their teachers. The ceremony was special as one of the graduates, Eena Daisy Sowdluapik, was one of the graduates who received the Governor General's award for top academics in the NWT.

Although I have already stated how proud I am of her and her graduating colleagues, I would once again like to say congratulations to Eena Daisy Sowdluapik and how proud I am of her for having top academics, and to thank her parents for the effort, encouragement and guidance they provided to their daughter.

Mr. Speaker, I wanted to share this good news from my riding with my colleagues, and to encourage the students across the NWT and their parents that hard work pays off in the end. Qujannamiik.

---Applause

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Attogoyuk School Graduation

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 151

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Ms. Mike . Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Patterson .

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Proposed Firearms Legislation

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 151

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I must admit I was taken in by Justice Minister Allan Rock when he visited and met with Caucus last fall. He is a fine-looking, smooth-talking, intent man, and he disarmed me somewhat by admitting he was from Toronto, he had no experience with firearms, and I was even more impressed to learn that he even had gone to a shooting range to find out what it's like to fire a gun.

I was very impressed with the unanimous and eloquent views of all Members -- Metis, Dene, Inuit, non-native -- in Caucus on this new firearms legislation, as expressed very forcefully to the Minister when we met with him in Caucus. I remember clearly telling him and warning him politely that even the present laws on safe storage of firearms are largely ignored and, judging from what he was proposing, there had to be a way of exempting northern hunters from the impact of this legislation, just as GHL holders are now at least exempted from the fee for applying for a firearms acquisition certificate.

"I'm hearing you," he assured me. So I was somewhat reassured. I now think that maybe this was a polite way of telling me, "I don't agree with you, but I'll hear you out." Or, "This will never fly in Toronto, but I will listen politely and even intently to what you're saying."

Now I don't know if Mr. Rock is still hearing me or listening, but I would like to tell him something again -- and I think I'm going to need more time to do so, Mr. Speaker, so I would request unanimous consent to conclude my statement, please.

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Proposed Firearms Legislation

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 151

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Member for Iqaluit is requesting unanimous consent to complete his statement. Do we have any nays? Mr. Patterson , you can conclude your statement.

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Proposed Firearms Legislation

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 151

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I say now -- and I hope he's not only listening, but understanding -- unless this bill is substantially changed, if it's enforced in the territories; we will either have to abandon the traditional way of living on the land or we, in the territories, will become a nation of criminals. Most of the regular hunters in the territories, especially the aboriginal hunters and those who hunt with them, will be compulsorily jailed for breaching this new made-for-cities law: by loaning a firearm, by storing it in someone else's hunting shack or boat; or, by being unable to afford or understand the sophisticated registration requirements.

I would like to ask, will Mr. Rock and his government help us to build the new jails we would need in every part of the Northwest Territories to house these persons who, on first offence, will be charged by indictment and who will face a compulsory one-year jail term minimum on the second offence. Or, better still, perhaps we could ask his agreement to make the Northwest Territories one giant corrections camp for people who offend the new firearms law. Perhaps we could create an on-the-land corrections facility throughout the Northwest Territories. I hope someone is listening, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

---Applause

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Proposed Firearms Legislation

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 151

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Patterson . Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Lewis .

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Constituency Meetings

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 151

Brian Lewis

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. For a couple of months, I used your office, Mr. Speaker, and I had a chance to contemplate my future and I did take advantage of informally contacting people in my constituency to get a feeling about what should happen and what I should do to best advance the interests of the people who I represent.

Two people said I should not seek the job as Speaker and the overwhelming number of people said what goes on over there either advances or protects my interests so we elected you to do what you think is right. In this game of politics, whatever happens is the will of the good Lord and I always believe the good Lord is right about what happens in these places. However, during my contact with several trusted people, I was asked about constituency meetings. One person -- who had never been to one, by the way -- asked me why I didn't hold constituency meetings. I said the last one I held cost me $900.

It cost me $268 for a one-eighth of a page ad, and if you buy three spaces, it costs $800. The cheapest room I could get was $50. If you add coffee and doughnuts, that's another $50. In fact, when you look at the whole thing, it is about $1,000 if you want to hold a constituency meeting.

The last one I held, I was on my own. But, luckily, Ronna Bremer, who was the local newspaper lady at that time did show up. So, I sat there and we had a good, long talk and she said, look at this way, Mr. Lewis , you are helping to pay my salary. Don't you feel good that at least you keep me employed and you are doing something for the economy? Well, Mr. Speaker, we don't always have a good relationship with the press and I felt uneasy when this lady told me that I am helping to keep her alive by spending this $800 to have this meeting.

So today, Mr. Speaker, I would like to announce that I do have a phone number: 669-2292, and if there is anybody who reads Hansard and who wants to talk to me or if they want me to raise something in this House, then I would be very happy to do so. And, if there is an overwhelming demand for all those people out there who think their interests can be advanced and protected in this House, I will, in fact, listen to them and have a constituency meeting. Thank you.

---Applause

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Constituency Meetings

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 151

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Lewis . Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Antoine .

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Opening Of New Community Hall In Nahanni Butte

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 151

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. I would like to talk about the opening of the new community hall in Nahanni Butte which took place on the 6th of February. Nahanni Butte is a small

community in my constituency at the foot of the Nahanni mountain range at the mouth of the south Nahanni River. The south Nahanni River is where the Nahanni National Park is. It is home for about 80 people. For the most part, Nahanni Butte is an isolated community and accessible only by air most of the year.

The people of this community still live a very traditional lifestyle, participating in activities like hunting, trapping and fishing; living off of the land. The people of Nahanni Butte have become more involved in community development over the past few years and one of the areas identified as a community concern was the need for facilities to hold council meetings, community gatherings and other events. It is with great pride to see the community benefit from such a building. On February 6th, in cooperation with the Department Municipal and Community Affairs and the Department of Public Works and Services, it was possible to open this building.

The honourable Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs, Mr. John Pollard , as well as the Honourable Don Morin , then Minister of Public Works and Services , attended this gathering. On behalf of the people of Nahanni Butte, I would like to take this opportunity to thank the two Ministers, the departments and this Legislature for helping the people of Nahanni Butte to have a new building to meet and have celebrations, like most of the other communities in the north enjoy today. Mahsi.

---Applause

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Opening Of New Community Hall In Nahanni Butte

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 152

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Whitford .

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Swearing-in Ceremony Of Governor General

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 152

Tony Whitford

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think it was a couple of weeks ago that we had the swearing-in of the new Governor General, the Honourable Romeo LeBlanc, in Ottawa; well-attended by the Northwest Territories. I believe the Commissioner was there and others to participate in that ceremony. I've had the pleasure, over the past several years, of meeting Mr. LeBlanc on a couple of occasions in Ottawa. And, as a result of his latest appointment, I sent a congratulatory letter on behalf of my constituents.

The outgoing Governor General, the Right Honourable Ramon Hnatyshyn and Mrs. Hnatyshyn, has been a frequent visitor to the Northwest Territories. He was here on a number of occasions prior to his becoming Governor General, and certainly on two occasions during his tenure when he visited Yellowknife and other communities. It is always nice to have representatives of that high office visit this part of Canada. The motto on the coat of arms does say "from sea to sea," but in fact, Mr.

Speaker, it should say from "sea to sea to sea." It is good to see that, on occasion, this high office does come to this part of the world and they are welcomed and shown the hospitality that northerners give. I certainly would extend an invitation, on behalf of my constituents at least, to the new Governor General and Mrs. LeBlanc to come to the Northwest Territories to visit us on the first occasion they can find in their busy schedule.

Mr. Speaker, it was very pleasant news when they induct such an important office and in his inaugural speech he said -- having been a correspondent over the years -- it isn't always that the media reports the good news. They are very quick to report bad news, incidents that occur: war, pestilence, crime, stuff like that. He encouraged the media to report more good news and it does happen. I think it is a good idea because people get very cynical when they read newspapers and all they see in it is very bad news. It was good news for us to hear the announcement of his appointment and the swearing-in ceremony.

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Swearing-in Ceremony Of Governor General

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 152

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Whitford . Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Ballantyne .

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Proposed Firearms Legislation

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 152

Michael Ballantyne

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have always been amazed by the ongoing machiavellian ways of the federal Department of Justice.

After years of requests from Canadians to legislate minimum sentences for those convicted of sexual offences against children; numerous requests to provide anti-stalking laws to protect women from injury and death from the hands of a bitter, twisted former boyfriend or wives; 10 years of complaints about the Young Offenders Act; demands for 10 years to change the Young Offenders Act to deal with some very violent and dangerous young offenders, we have always been told by the federal Department of Justice, by the Ontario defence lawyers that we must be fair, that everybody has rights.

There is a Charter of Rights, we have no right to infringe on other people's rights, people have to be patient.

But now the federal government is finally going to act; the federal government is bringing in some very tough sentences: up to 10 years. The second offence, a minimum sentence of one year; very unusual in Canadian law. The third offence, a minimum sentence of two years minus one day. Are these tough laws against child sexual abusers? No. Are they against wife-beaters? No. Are they against violent young offenders? No. The federal government is finally going to get tough against any poor soul who forgets to register their firearm.

Now, I am sympathetic to people in large cities who are facing major crime problems. I am sympathetic to police forces who are really afraid of the proliferation of firearms. I am in favour of controlling hand guns and assault rifles, but let's get our priorities straight. We must punish real criminals, we have no right, and the government has no right, to create a whole new class of criminals. The federal government, and all governments, are having a terrible problem right now in trying to deal with our existing crime rate.

I think that it is important for all of us to remember, especially the federal government, that this is not the time to create a whole new class of criminals out of honest citizens who, because they are not familiar with the law or because they don't understand it, could be actually put into jail. So, Mr. Speaker, I feel very strongly that the new firearms law has to be changed. Thank you.

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Proposed Firearms Legislation

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 153

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Ballantyne . Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Pudlat .

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Proposed Firearms Legislation

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 153

Kenoayoak Pudlat

Baffin South

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As the Minister of Justice said in his statement about the new legislation on firearms, this will impose a lot of difficulties in the north because we are unique in the Northwest Territories. If we misuse the firearms or if we fail to register them, they will be able to put us in jail even though we didn't commit an actual crime. This will have a big effect on the residents of the Northwest Territories.

We don't use firearms to injure or kill other people, and a lot of times we have to have different rifles. If this legislation goes through then we will have to have only one gun. But the animals, the wildlife that we hunt, are different sizes and we use different rifles accordingly, as he mentioned. If this legislation is going to go through, as my colleague from Iqaluit said, they are going to have to put up a lot of new correctional centres because, if this goes through, it is very clear that they will have to send us to jail. And as we know now, the correctional centres in the NWT are often full.

I think there should be an exception in that legislation that will apply to the residents of the Northwest Territories. They are going to have to treat us uniquely, because we don't use firearms on other people, we use them for our livelihood. Our ancestors worked really hard so they could provide us with food. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Proposed Firearms Legislation

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 153

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Pudlat . Item 3, Members' statements. Mrs. Marie Jewell.

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Creation Of Ombudsman Office

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 153

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, yesterday, I, too, was disappointed in the House when the Legislation committee recommended that the creation of the office of an ombudsman should not be brought forth until the government can determine how effective the recently passed Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act is and whether a need for a more general type of ombudsman is required.

Mr. Speaker, I was disappointed for two reasons: One, is that the public opinion did not seem to be taken into account when this decision was being formulated; and, two, the onus is being left for the government to determine whether or not a need for a more general type of ombudsman is required.

First of all, Mr. Speaker, I believe the role of an ombudsman is to investigate a complaint and to make the public aware of a case, for which there are many people out in the territories who would like to see someone that they can specifically go to. I recognize that an MLA does play this role many times, but at the same time, there are times when we advocate on behalf of our constituents and we do get charged for political interference.

It is known that the Standing Committee on Legislation consistently heard that members of the public would be receptive to the creation of an ombudsman-like office. So, Mr. Speaker, as I said, I don't feel that we were listening to the public, once again.

Secondly, Mr. Speaker, we are going to wait for the government to determine whether or not a need for a more general type of ombudsman is required.

Now, Mr. Speaker, I don't believe that the government is going to anxiously look at determining whether or not an ombudsman is required. It will no doubt take a while and it won't be this government to determine how effective the recently-passed Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act is. So it will probably be the next government and it is unfortunate. But I will say, Mr. Speaker, that we are fortunate that this document is going into committee of the whole, where we can discuss this matter in length. Thank you.

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Creation Of Ombudsman Office

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 153

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mrs. Marie-Jewell . Item 3, Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Mr. Nerysoo .

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Return To Question 61-12(7): Involvement Of Divisional Boards In Nunavut Education Planning Committee

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 153

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. If I might provide a return to a question asked by Mr. Patterson on February 15, 1995 regarding involvement of divisional boards in the Nunavut Education Planning Committee; more particularly, our department.

For the information of the honourable Members, on January 6, 1995, I wrote as the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , to the chairperson of the Nunavut Education Planning Committee to help clarify the role and the mandate of the committee. The focus of the letter was also to ensure that those involved in education, culture and employment programs work cooperatively to provide quality programs and services.

The Nunavut Education Planning Committee had been focusing their work on organizational and administrative issues. The Nunavut Implementation Commissioner and Members of the Legislative Assembly already have the responsibility to address organizational structures for the delivery of programs. The letter recommended that although it may be necessary for the committee to discuss these matters, it should focus its attention on finding ways to improve the programs and services delivered in Nunavut while managing the related costs.

The letter also noted the boards and divisional boards and colleges are responsible for program delivery, and that we need the benefit of their experience to improve programs.

The letter suggested that, given the need to focus on programs, departmental staff could be better used to continue their participation as resources to the committee, rather than serve as members on a committee making recommendations to the Minister. A strategic plan to 2010 describes the need to build a learning system with all our partners, and responds to the needs and aspirations of northerners.

The Department of Education, Culture and Employment, boards and divisional boards of education and the colleges will continue to work cooperatively with members of the Nunavut Education Planning Committee to enable success of the systems for education and training in Nunavut. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 61-12(7): Involvement Of Divisional Boards In Nunavut Education Planning Committee

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 154

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Ballantyne .

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Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

Michael Ballantyne

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Minister of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources . Mr. Speaker, it's to do with some reorganization in the federal department of Indian and Northern Affairs here in the Northwest Territories. My question to the Minister, has there been a reorganization in the office of DIAND in the Northwest Territories and has the mining component of the DIAND office been lessened? Thank you.

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Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Minister of Transportation , Mr. Todd .

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Return To Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of Nwt Diand Office

Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I believe that discussions are under way between ourselves and the Department of IAND with respect to this issue. It appears that mining isn't getting what we believe is the attention it should, in particular with the last two or three years' activities with relationship to diamonds. We are working closely with the DIAND office and Ottawa in an effort for them to recognize the importance that this industry has, and that they should move that particular function up the priority ladder. Thank you.

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Return To Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of Nwt Diand Office

Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Ballantyne .

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Supplementary To Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of Nwt Diand Office

Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

Michael Ballantyne

Yellowknife North

Supplementary, Mr. Speaker. Could the Minister give to this House the details of any changes that have taken place in the DIAND office in the Northwest Territories in the last year? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of Nwt Diand Office

Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of Nwt Diand Office

Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm prepared to provide the honourable Member with any details he requires. As I say, there are ongoing discussions taking place right now. Our position, and certainly mine, as the Minister, is that there should be greater priority placed on the mining industry, particularly, as I said, as it relates to the current climate, the need to be a little more self-sufficient, and of course the moves that we're making to seek satisfactory negotiations in transferring minerals to the Northwest Territories government. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of Nwt Diand Office

Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Ballantyne , supplementary.

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Supplementary To Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of Nwt Diand Office

Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

Michael Ballantyne

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Would the Minister express in strong terms to the federal Minister of Indian and Northern Affairs; we know we're attempting to take over the responsibility for minerals, and in the meantime either they provide the adequate resources here to deal with the most mining activity we've had here in years or they allow your department to deal with it. They can't have it both ways. They can't have control of mining and then cut back in their staff here in the Northwest Territories. Can I ask the Minister for that assurance, please?

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Supplementary To Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of Nwt Diand Office

Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of Nwt Diand Office

Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Again I want to assure the honourable Member that, certainly from a GNWT perspective, we're being very aggressive as it relates to the mining industry, both myself as the Minister, and as a Cabinet. I will express to Minister Irwin that there has to be greater priority placed on this activity, and that his department should address it accordingly.

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Further Return To Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of Nwt Diand Office

Question 86-12(7): Reorganization Of NWT Diand Office

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Koe .

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Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the Minister of Economic Development and Tourism . In previous sessions, and in particular last October, I asked questions about the funding request to establish a credit union in the Northwest Territories. I believe the Minister responded at that time to the effect that we are moving as quickly as we can to get the application forward, we are responding as quickly as we can and we are trying to move quickly on it, hopefully by the end of October. Mr.

Speaker, it is now February 1995 and there's still a need to establish financial institutions in our smaller communities. My question is what is the current status in the development of a credit union in the Northwest Territories?

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Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Economic Development and Tourism , Mr. Todd .

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Return To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 154

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I had indicated at the time that we would be looking at the possibility of trying

to provide $1 million under EDA over a period of time for the ACL's request for a credit union. We're still working on that at this time. The management committee is also looking at it. Unfortunately, over the last several months there has been a tremendous rush on the economic development agreement, and at this time we haven't been able to come to an agreement with EDA, on whether or not the $1 million is available.

However, we are also working parallel with Industry, Science and Technology in an effort to try and seek funding in that area. If we were to be successful in finding that $1 million through Industry, Science and Technology which would be outside of the EDA then we may be able to move much more quickly on this issue than we have. Thank you.

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Return To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Todd . Mr. Koe , supplementary.

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Supplementary To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. The request was made early last fall, probably much before October when the questions were asked. I would assume at that time there would have been a considerable amount of free balance in the EDA pot. The Minister now just mentioned that maybe that money is not available. How does EDA priorize applications?

Is it upon date of receipt and there is a commitment made, or do they have to wait until formal approval is given by the committee before that money is set aside? I'm just curious as to how available monies are allocated or committed from EDA funds.

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Supplementary To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Well, the availability of funding and the allocation of money is determined through a management committee. The management committee determines if it is an appropriate funding request, if it meets the criteria set in the different sections of the EDA. It is my understanding that the management committee did find this application for $1 million was eligible but, at the time, there was insufficient money available for that particular criteria. As I said, we are currently working with Industry, Science and Technology in an earnest and genuine effort to try to find the dollars for ACL to partially fund the credit union.

I think it is important to point out that there are others who will have to come into the equation with respect to the development of credit unions, and that would include the federal government. There would also have to be some significant legislative change in this House, along with some guarantees on the deposits. So, it is not just a simple case of trying to find $1 million. It is a little more complicated than that. But we are currently trying to find this money for them. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Koe .

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Supplementary To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can the Minister indicate what funds or what contributions the Government of the Northwest Territories has given to Arctic Co-ops Limited to help develop this application and proposal for development of credit unions?

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Supplementary To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I stand to be corrected, but I don't think we've given them any direct contributions through grants to develop their application. This is a long-outstanding issue which Mr. Lyall, the president of ACL, has been lobbying very hard for over the last two or three years but I don't believe there was any contribution from the department. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Final supplementary, Mr. Koe .

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Supplementary To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. May I ask the Minister if he is still committed to the development of credit unions in the Northwest Territories?

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Supplementary To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I wouldn't dare not be. Yes, we are committed to assisting the development of credit unions in the Northwest Territories. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Question 87-12(7): Status Of Development Of Credit Union

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Dent .

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Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources . Mr. Speaker, there has been some concern expressed that BHP may have to shut down their exploration program in the very near future because their initial application to develop an all-weather exploration road was turned down by the RERC. Since the Government of the Northwest Territories participates on this review committee, can the Minister outline why their application was rejected?

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Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources , Mr. Todd .

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Return To Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 155

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. First of all we are just one party who sits on the RERC. EM&PR, Renewable Resources and Economic Development sit on that committee, as well as our federal counterparts. My understanding is that the initial application -- which, I understand has been

resubmitted -- was rejected due to some information deficiencies of the site-specific details. In other words, how would this road affect wildlife, the environment, et cetera. It is my understanding that BHP has reapplied and tried to address the deficiencies in the original application.

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Return To Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Todd . Mr. Dent .

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Supplementary To Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Supplementary to the same Minister. Could the Minister advise the House when a decision is expected on this reapplication that BHP has made?

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Supplementary To Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. First of all, I would hope that if the application has been done in a manner that answers some of the initial concerns expressed by the RERC, we would get approval on this issue; I would like to say that upfront. It is my understanding that the reapplication was submitted in mid-January. We are trying to encourage the RERC to move quickly to make a decision on it. I don't have the exact date as to when we can expect that today, but I would imagine it is imminent.

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Further Return To Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Dent .

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Supplementary To Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Supplementary to the same Minister. Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Minister if this government, specifically his department, works with mining companies to help them -- perhaps by putting them together with Renewable Resources people -- understand the environmental concerns of northerners? Is there a proactive approach in helping mining companies understand how they need to approach their projects in the Northwest Territories?

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Supplementary To Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Well, obviously, up to now this government has been pretty clear that we see the need for orderly, environmentally-sound development of the mining industry. I think the Premier , the Finance Minister and everybody else at this table have talked about that. I think it is important to say publicly that is where we are coming from.

EM&PR does work with the mining industry in trying to assist them in meeting, if you want, the needs of these applications that have to go forward to environmental review committees. I'm not so sure that we're as active as maybe we should be but what I have done is instructed EM&PR to be more proactive in this area so we can avoid, hopefully, as many delays as possible and meet all the environmental requirements that these committees request from industry. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Question 88-12(7): Rejection Of Bhp Application

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I welcome back the Minister of Renewable Resources and I have a question for him. Mr. Speaker, last month his department issued a permit to either the chief park warden for Wood Buffalo National Park or to the chief park warden's son in our community. The permit was to cut wood along a certain area of the banks of the Slave. However, apparently, the wood was cut in the wrong area and, according to the local people and organizations -- specifically the band and the Metis -- it appears that many violations were committed.

But, Mr. Speaker, when the complaint was brought to the attention of Renewable Resources, a report was done, but no charges laid for violations which appear to have occurred. Mr. Speaker, would the Minister provide to this House a copy of the permit issued? Thank you.

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Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Renewable Resources , Mr. Arngna'naaq .

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Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

Silas Arngna'naaq

Kivallivik

With regard to the specific question the honourable Member is asking, I would respectfully request what particular incident that took place in Fort Smith. Then, I would be able to respond about whether I would be able to provide a response to the request. Thank you.

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Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Supplementary To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Mr. Speaker, I'm sure if the Minister asks his department about the permits issued for cutting wood in the Fort Smith area, there is only one chief park warden for Wood Buffalo National Park. I don't want to name any names. I'm sure the Minister would become aware of the incident if he brought it to his department's attention. Therefore, I would like to ask the Minister again if he would provide a copy of the permit issued by his department to either myself, as a Member, or to this House. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arngna'naaq .

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Further Return To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

Silas Arngna'naaq

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I certainly will make the permit the Member is asking for available. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 156

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Supplementary To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Would the Minister also be willing to provide to this House the report formulated by his department officials on this particular incident? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Arngna'naaq .

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Further Return To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

Silas Arngna'naaq

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am not aware of the particulars of how permits are issued. I am willing to review it and will provide the Member with the information she is requesting. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Final supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Supplementary To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to also ask the Minister, once he reviews the issue, if he feels that his department didn't follow the policies which are formulated by his department, would he ensure that this incident be rectified? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Arngna'naaq .

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Further Return To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

Silas Arngna'naaq

Kivallivik

Yes, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Question 89-12(7): Wood Cutting Permit In Fort Smith

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Patterson .

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Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is to the Government House Leader, Mr. Pollard . I would like to ask if the Regional Councils Act of the Northwest Territories is still in force? Thank you.

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Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Pollard .

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Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

John Pollard

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes, the act is still in force. Thank you.

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Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Patterson .

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Supplementary To Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to ask the Minister if the government has any intention to repeal the Regional Councils Act? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Pollard .

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Further Return To Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

John Pollard

Hay River

No, Mr. Speaker, there is no intention to do that at this time.

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Further Return To Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Patterson .

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Supplementary To Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Mr. Speaker, the act is in force and there is no intention to repeal it. I take it then that the requirement in

section 5(1) of the act, "...that each regional and tribal council shall meet at least twice each year" is still in force. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Pollard .

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Further Return To Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

John Pollard

Hay River

The act is still in force, therefore, that

section of the act is still in force. Yes, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Question 90-12(7): Status Of Regional Councils Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Ballantyne .

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Question 91-12(7): Status Of Nursing Profession Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

Michael Ballantyne

Yellowknife North

Thank you. I have a question for the Government House Leader and it is regarding the Nursing Profession Act. I have already written a letter to the House Leader, but I would like to get on public record the concerns of many nurses that this particular act is on the government agenda for this session. Could the Government House Leader confirm that we will have an opportunity to deal with this act during this session? Thank you.

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Question 91-12(7): Status Of Nursing Profession Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Pollard .

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Question 91-12(7): Status Of Nursing Profession Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

John Pollard

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I will take the question as notice. Thank you.

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Question 91-12(7): Status Of Nursing Profession Act

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The question has been taken as notice. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Patterson .

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Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is to the Minister of Finance . Again, it is about the Regional Councils Act. Mr. Speaker,

section 15 provides that the Minister may provide funding to councils by means of grants or contributions, or both, in accordance with the Financial Administration Act. Since

section 5 states that councils shall meet twice a year, I would like to ask the Minister of Finance , unless the Minister wishes to undermine the existence of a regional or tribal council, would it be correct to say that funding should be provided to regional and tribal councils in the Northwest Territories to enable them to meet twice a year? Thank you.

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Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 157

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Pollard .

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Return To Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

John Pollard

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there would never be any attempt by the Government of the Northwest Territories to undermine a regional council. So if that is what the act calls for, if the regional council is up, running and still in place, then we would be obliged to provide that particular funding. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Patterson .

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Supplementary To Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Mr. Chairman, the Minister may be aware that in some regions, such as the Baffin region, mayors and MLAs who are regular Members of the regional council, along with the regional Inuit association have decided that they would like to forego the cost of an ongoing office and overhead, but they have still expressed their desire to continue meeting as a regional council twice yearly. Does the Minister agree that in Baffin, for all purposes, the regional council is still in existence? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Supplementary To Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Patterson , it is Mr. Speaker. I was the chairman. Mr. Pollard .

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Further Return To Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

John Pollard

Hay River

Mr. Chairman, the previous questioning on this particular issue fell within my bailiwick. This one falls within the Premier 's bailiwick, but I will answer the question on her behalf and say that as far as I know, the regional council in Baffin still exists. There was a motion in January of this year to disband that particular organization. I am not aware that it has been officially disbanded yet. I would agree that there would appear to still be a regional council in Baffin at the present time. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Question 92-12(7): Funding For Regional And Tribal Council Meetings

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Pudlat .

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Question 93-12(7): Birthing Centre For Baffin

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

Kenoayoak Pudlat

Baffin South

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am sorry, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Premier a question, but she isn't here, so perhaps the Minister of Finance can answer on her behalf. At our last session, in the fall, I brought up the issue on the Baffin Regional Health Board's request to have a birthing centre for our region. I would like to ask the acting Premier ...There was a commitment by Cabinet to look into this issue. I would like to know what has been done to date. Has there been any work done with the Baffin Regional Health Board as to the process of putting a birthing centre into the region. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 93-12(7): Birthing Centre For Baffin

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Finance , Mr. Pollard .

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Return To Question 93-12(7): Birthing Centre For Baffin

Question 93-12(7): Birthing Centre For Baffin

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

John Pollard

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, Mr. Ningark asked the same question earlier this week. The answer is the same. We are awaiting the results of the assessment of the success of the Rankin birthing centre. As I said earlier this week, it is my personal opinion, from the information that I have received, unofficially, that it is successful. Once that assessment has been done and looked at by the Minister of Health , she is well aware that there are other communities and regions of the territories who wish the same kind of service. I am sure she will act upon those requests, once she has received that assessment. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 93-12(7): Birthing Centre For Baffin

Question 93-12(7): Birthing Centre For Baffin

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Minister of Renewable Resources . Mr. Speaker, a respected elder in our community is having a difficult time acquiring muskox hides. Mrs. Dube has worked with muskox and muskox hides for a number of years and has been very creative in making many things from muskox hides such as briefcases, soaps and other items. But, she is having a very difficult time in acquiring the hide. I would like to ask the Minister of Renewable Resources whether or not his department is able to assist or advise my constituent where she can acquire muskox hides.

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Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Renewable Resources , Mr. Arngna'naaq .

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Return To Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

Silas Arngna'naaq

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I understand that the Department of Renewable Resources assisted the particular individual the Member is talking about just before Christmas and I'm sure the staff of the Department of Renewable Resources would be more than willing to help any who are trying to better the economy in the Northwest Territories. Thank you.

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Return To Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Supplementary To Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Mr. Speaker, my supplementary to the Minister of Renewable Resources is the staff may have assisted the individual to acquire the hides, but the acquisition of hides was unsuccessful and that is why I'm asking the Minister if there are means, such as an outlet, for muskox hides to be made available to my constituent. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 158

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arngna'naaq .

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Further Return To Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

Silas Arngna'naaq

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I don't know that there is such a thing as an outlet where muskox hides can be found, but I will look into the matter and see what I can do. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Supplementary To Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Thank you. Just for clarification, Mr. Speaker, may I ask the Minister if he has taken my question as notice? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arngna'naaq .

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Further Return To Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

Silas Arngna'naaq

Kivallivik

Mr. Speaker, what I am saying is that I will take the question that the honourable Member is asking and make sure that the department staff are able to assist the honourable Member's constituent.

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Further Return To Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Question 94-12(7): Shortage Of Muskox Hides For Constituents

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Patterson .

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Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, more questions, I'm afraid, about student residences for the Minister of Education . Mr. Speaker, yesterday the Minister made a commitment in this House that, "While I wish to move the students back to their home communities, I will not do it at the risk of programs..." and we had been talking about advanced matriculation programs.

I would like to ask the Minister, does this mean that if in this coming school year there are still not matriculation school programs in 11 out of 13 Baffin communities, as is the case now, that students from those 11 communities who wish to take advanced or matriculation programs will be funded to attend school in communities where those program are available? Thank you.

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Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Education , Mr. Nerysoo .

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Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am leaving it to the recommendation of the report and discussions with the board to address that particular matter.

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Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Patterson .

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Supplementary To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

So, is the Minister saying now that it will be decided by a consultant's report and backing down on his commitment yesterday which was, "While I wish to move the students back to their home communities, I will not do it at the risk of programs." I thought that was a commitment from the Minister, Mr. Speaker. Does that commitment still hold today?

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Supplementary To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Nerysoo .

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Further Return To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I was under the impression that Members of this Assembly supported the expansion of high school programs in the communities, which included the whole issue of advanced education. That was the impression I was receiving. Now, if the honourable Member is saying we should not develop those programs in the communities as per the discussions my staff held with the board and the advice given by the board then, obviously, community high school programming would be in jeopardy.

I made this point yesterday. The honourable Member points out only that the report will affect the decision and, in fact ,I said clearly that if the honourable Member was consulted, as other Members were, to give advice, then part of the recommendations coming from the report would be based on the advice given by the honourable Member. In the end, the fact is that programs in communities for students are of importance and will be given high consideration and priority. As Minister, I'm not prepared to sacrifice the quality of education for our students.

If the case is that some of the residences have to remain open, then that will be part of the recommendations. But, I think time will tell that and we have until March 31st for the report to be returned, with its recommendations, at which time I will review all of the issues. And, Mr. Speaker, we are requesting meetings with the divisional boards to discuss this particular issue and the draft formula.

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Further Return To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Supplementary, Mr. Patterson .

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Supplementary To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Mr. Speaker, I would like to make it clear that I'm all for community high school programs, but I think a high school program in a community is not a high school program if it doesn't include the matriculation or advanced diploma option. Mr. Speaker, I know that the Minister has assured us repeatedly that all options are open and no decisions have been made to close regional residences, although I think we've been given some indications to the contrary: like the 2010 strategy; like the terms of reference of the consultant's report; and, like the proposed new draft funding formula.

But, I would like to ask the Minister, if he ends up making a decision to close the regional residences down, what would happen to students who are now in those residences who are, say, in grade 10 and who are doing well? Would those students be grandfathered and allowed to complete the course of their high school education? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 159

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Nerysoo .

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Further Return To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 160

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm not at the point yet where I can make that definitive decision here in this Assembly and I'm not prepared to do it until the report is returned to this Assembly. I think it would be premature of me to make any decisions until the report and advice from the regions have been received. I'm not prepared to say yes or no to grandfathering any program until I know what the recommendations are from the regions.

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Further Return To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 160

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Final supplementary, Mr. Patterson .

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Supplementary To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 160

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

So, Mr. Speaker, given that the Minister is not prepared to make any decision now, is it correct then that the proposed draft funding formula, which caused great alarm when it was circulated to the divisional boards in December because it appeared to drastically reduce the funding for residences, is merely a draft and has not been finalized and may be substantially changed as a result of the recommendations of the report, debate in this Assembly and discussions with the Minister? Is that the status of the formula today? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 160

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Nerysoo .

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Further Return To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 160

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, for the last two or three days, I've been trying to advise the honourable Member that is in fact the case. The honourable Member raised the concern yesterday about the certainty of funding, and the problem with uncertainty of funding is it causes the kinds of discussions that are going on in this House. Part of the formula discussions is that we wanted to create some discussion issue about certainty of funding. What requires further discussion is what happens in future to the residences, what happens to the residential program? I have not made any final determination as to whether or not those programs will, in fact, be disbanded.

The comments the honourable Member has made to me for the last couple of days are integral in concluding any final decisions. They're very important. We can't make a decision on closing matriculation programs if they're not being offered in the community high schools. As such, those have to be considered, and they're an invaluable part of the decision. I'm not going to make a decision in the absence of knowing that I'm not going to offer programs and services to the community.

Secondly, the boards are the responsible agent for deciding the programs that are to be offered to the high school students in the communities. They have to be involved.

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Further Return To Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Question 95-12(7): Student Funding For Participation In Matriculation Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 160

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Ms. Mike .

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Question 96-12(7): Reallocation Of Funding To Community High Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 160

Rebecca Mike

Baffin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , regarding the residential schools. Yesterday, during question period, Mr. Nerysoo pointed out that the Ukiivik Hall which is located in Iqaluit in Baffin is costing this government $1.644 million.

My question to the Minister is this: since the funding formula has been cut to divisional boards already, are there any plans or intentions of this government to reallocate these dollars to the communities to implement high school diploma certification -- most of the communities right now have only certification, not diploma -- to upgrade the programming in high schools in communities should the Ukiivik close down? Thank you.

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Question 96-12(7): Reallocation Of Funding To Community High Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 160

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , Mr. Nerysoo .

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