Debates of Sept. 15th, 1992

This is page numbers 915 - 940 of the Hansard for the 12th Assembly, 2nd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was education .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Phone Service To Small Communities

Northern Hire

Minister's Absence From The House

Municipal Elections In Inuvik

Member's Statement Regarding Government Response To Report Of Traditional Knowledge Working Group

Immigration Of Aboriginal People To Canada's North

Member's Statement Regarding Constitutional Amendments

The Council For Aboriginal Justice

Artisans Acquiring Funding

The Retirement Of A Constituent

Aboriginal Justice Conference

Member's Statement Wishing The Clerk A Happy Birthday

Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Question O771-12(2): Requirements For Teacher Training

Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Question O773-12(2): Establishment Of Territorial Elders' Council

Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Question O778-12(2): Resources To Support Released Inmates

Question O779-12(2): Trans-boundary Water Agreement

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Introductory Remarks For The Department Of Education

General Comments

To Adopt Recommendation 20

To Adopt Recommendation 21

Report Of The Standing Committee On Finance

Motion 148-12(2) To Adopt Recommendation 22

Motion 149-12(2) To Adopt Recommendation 23

Motion 150-12(2) To Adopt Recommendation 24

Motion 151-12(2) To Adopt Recommendation 25

To Adopt Recommendation 26

Motion 153-12(2) To Adopt Recommendation 27

To Adopt Recommendation 28

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Presentation To The Clerk

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Hon. Titus Allooloo , Mr. Antoine , Mr. Arngna'naaq , Hon. James Arvaluk , Hon. Michael Ballantyne , Mr. Bernhardt , Hon. Nellie Cournoyea , Mr. Dent , Mr. Gargan , Hon. Stephen Kakfwi , Mr. Koe , Mr. Lewis , Mrs. Marie-Jewell , Hon. Don Morin , Mr. Nerysoo , Mr. Ningark , Hon. Dennis Patterson , Hon. John Pollard , Mr. Pudlat , Mr. Pudluk , Mr. Todd , Hon. Tony Whitford , Mr. Zoe

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---Prayer

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 915

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Okay, we think we have the difficulties resolved. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Morin .

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Minister's Statement 86-12(2): Phone Service To Small Communities

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 915

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to give a progress report on the improved telephone service to small communities. This was a matter raised earlier this year by Mr. Zoe , Mr. Antoine , and Mr. Gargan .

Seven communities in the Northwest Territories have very limited telephone services. Five of these are on NorthwesTel's

schedule for an upgrade. Snare Lake is scheduled first, in 1993, and the last is Colville Lake, scheduled in 1997.

I have exchanged letters with the president of NorthwesTel and met with him. We agreed to set up a working committee. They will assemble data on the requirements for each community. Then the most appropriate method of funding can be determined so that the planned provision of improved services can be accelerated. The recommendations of the committee will be ready in early October. I will keep the concerned Members informed of the progress made. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 86-12(2): Phone Service To Small Communities

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 915

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Kakfwi .

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Minister's Statement 87-12(2): Northern Hire

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 915

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, a motion was passed in June recommending that a "Hire North" policy be developed to ensure the hiring of northern residents to the public service takes place. Members asked that the Minister of Personnel to give a status report on this matter at the September session.

Since that time, I have had the opportunity to consult with the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment Programs and would like to make the following remarks.

The hiring of northerners has always been, and continues to be, a priority of this government. That is why we have the Affirmative Action Policy. The policy is constitutionally sound, and provides us with the tools we need to make sure that aboriginal people, long term northerners, women, and the disabled get every opportunity for a first chance at jobs in the public service.

Many of our achievements, however, are overshadowed by publicity given to other events. In the absence of a public document to explain the government's policy and approach to northern hire, the impression is left that there is no strategy. That is not the case.

As a result, I welcome the opportunity to speak on this matter.

Mr. Speaker, the objective of hiring northerners applies to more than just government. It involves all sectors of our economy, government, boards and agencies, and private enterprise. Maybe more so in private enterprise. Everyone who writes a pay cheque should be doing whatever they can to make sure our workforce is gainfully employed.

We have a lot of talent out there. Unfortunately, many of the unemployed are inexperienced. They require skills upgrading and training. In addition, many of those who are employed require additional training to enter management level positions. There is work to be done and we are prepared to take any steps designed to increase job opportunities, and the hiring of northern residents.

The government also knows that not everyone wants to be a civil servant. Investment and partnerships with private enterprise will also make it possible for people to enter the workforce and, in the long run, help to reduce the cost factors involved in employee turnover and the hiring of southern expertise.

Mr. Speaker, the government's employment strategy began in 1976 with the establishment of the Office of Native Employment to promote aboriginal employment in the public service. At that time, there were only 650 aboriginal public servants who made up 22 percent of the total employee population.

In 1985, when the Native Employment Policy was introduced, the figures had increased to 1,136 aboriginal employees or 29.8 percent.

Four years later, we came to grips with the fact that many other northerners were disadvantaged, and the Native Employment Policy was expanded into the broader based Affirmative Action Policy that is in effect today.

As a result of these policy initiatives, we now have 1,902 aboriginal employees who make up 35 percent of the government workforce of 5,406.

Mr. Speaker, a total of 1,451 appointments were made last year and of that total, 1,082 employees, or 74.5 percent, were hired in the north.

However, this is only part of the picture.

The government provides contributions to a variety of operations, boards and agencies who employ their own staff. The majority of these staff members are northern and aboriginal people and although they are not public servants, the government funding does make a significant contribution to northern hire.

The Department of Transportation, for example, funds about 367 jobs through its ferry, highway maintenance, and airports operations. At least 200, or 54 percent, of these employees are aboriginal people. The N.W.T. Housing Corporation funds housing associations and authorities who employ 360 people, of whom 284 are aboriginal, making up 84 percent of the total.

The Dogrib Tribal Council and the Northwest Territories Power Corporation on the other hand, are working together on development of hydro plants in the Fort Rae/Lac La Martre area. This type of joint venturing means jobs. Jobs mean money and money results in increased business opportunities.

In addition, the government's business incentive policy gives preference to northern businesses and contractors, who in turn draw from the territorial labour pool to get their jobs done.

Mr. Speaker, our highest priority continues to be increasing the representation of aboriginal northerners in the public service. However, figures from the 1989 labour force survey show that there is no simple solution.

There are about 18,390 aboriginal people between the ages of 15 to 64. Only 7,610 of them were employed at the time of the survey. Of the remaining 10,780, more than 8,600, or 80 per cent, of the total had less than grade nine.

Those who stand the best chance of employment are the 2,133 unemployed who have a grade ten or higher education. However, over one third of these residents are unable to work due to disability, caring for children, or attending school. The number is further reduced by those who are unwilling, or unable, to relocate to another community to work. Many of these would also require upgrading to meet the requirements of many jobs.

Mr. Speaker, those are the statistics. Skill shortages within the northern workforce means we must continue to hire for some positions outside of the Northwest Territories until northerners take full advantage of our education and training systems. This is unavoidable in the short to medium term.

The government's strategy for maximizing the skills of the northern workforce includes a number of elements. The first priority is expanding the skills based with projects such as Arctic college's government oriented training programs. For instance:

- Academic upgrading programs with 731 full-time and 1,666 part-time students; and

The social services worker program with 39 full-time and 78 part-time such as Arctic College's government orientated training programs. For instance:

- Academic upgrading programs with 731 full-time, and 1,666 part-time students;

- Social service worker program, with 39 full-time and 78 part- time students;

- The teacher education program, with 76 full-time, and 168 part-time students;

- The renewable resources and environmental technological programs, with 40 full-time, and four part-time students;

- The management studies program with 98 full-time and 391 part-time students; and

- A variety of other programs such as nursing assistants, community health representatives and interpreter/translators.

In addition our strategy includes:

- Encouraging parents to do all they can to keep their children in school and motivate them towards higher education;

- Encouraging individuals to take on more responsibility themselves; and

- A stay in school campaign to encourage youngsters to complete their education.

It is interesting to note that post-secondary educational grants to aboriginal students have increased from only 83 in 1982 to over 560 in 1992. In 1983 only 203 forgivable loans were issued to students, compared to over 550 in 1992.

Mr. Speaker, we are also doing all we can to:

- Provide for grade extensions to eliminate the need to leave home to complete education in grades 10 to 12; and

- Establish Career Development Centres to provide career counselling and employment support programs for adults.

Secondly, Mr. Speaker, we are eliminating barriers to northern employment and maximizing access to government jobs by:

- Replacing the existing classification system which rates job factors instead of a person's qualifications;

- Revising job descriptions to get rid of unrealistic qualification requirements;

- Continual monitoring of our Affirmative Action Policy to make sure hiring and training preference are provided to northerners;

- Administering a competition appeals system which gives all affirmative action candidates, including non-employees, the right to appeal competitions;

- Working with graduating post-secondary students to develop individual career plans and to locate government jobs; and

- Minimizing southern recruiting by strictly limiting the number of southern advertisements.

Mr. Speaker, jobs for communities are a key element of the strategy. As the Minister of Finance stated the other day, "we need to train people and assist them in finding jobs, rather than pay them to stay at home." As a result, we are:

- Maximizing job opportunities at the local levels when positions are decentralized to communities; and

- Developing plans for the transfer of programs and services and jobs to community levels as part of the community transfer initiative.

We are also attempting to improve our ability to keep northern employees in order to develop a more stable northern public service through:

- Orientation programs, including a cross cultural component, for all new employees;

- Collective bargaining which focuses on negotiating "use in the North" benefits to attract northerners.

In addition, we providing opportunities for employees to enhance their career potential by:

- Working with departments to ensure employees have an opportunity to develop individual career plans;

- Making it possible for employees to take two year transfer assignments to other jobs to broaden their skills and improve their career potential;

- Providing education leave programs which provide funding for over 30 employees per year to take post-secondary education; and

- Operating a public service career training program, and an in-service apprenticeship training program that employs 125 trainees, over 90 per cent of whom are aboriginal people.

Mr. Speaker, the Government cannot tackle this important job by itself. Sharing the responsibility for hiring northern residents is perhaps the most important part of our strategy. As a result:

- The private sector, particularly contractors who do government work, are encouraged to recognize and demonstrate their responsibility for northern hiring; - Organizations totally funded by the government must conform to the government's northern hiring strategy;

- Organizations partially funded by the government must develop their own policies to satisfy the spirit of the northern hiring strategy;

- Government contractors and organizations funded by the government are required to report regularly on their success in northern hiring; and

- Wherever it is economically feasible, government funded construction projects include mandatory training and employment quotas for northerners.

Mr. Speaker, the various elements of our northern hiring strategy have gone a long way to increase the numbers of northerners in the government workforce. We can expect a slow but steady growth in the numbers of aboriginal and northern employees as more jobs go to the communities, and educational levels increase.

The fact remains, though, that it will not be possible for us to downgrade qualification requirements for all jobs without seriously effecting levels of service to the public.

I am prepared, however, to tighten restrictions on southern hiring by requiring departments to obtain ministerial approval before they consider southern hiring. I have also instructed my officials to conduct exit interviews for all employees to identify ways and means of reducing turnover and retaining our northern talent.

As well, we are examining the feasibility of establishing a support program for employees who need help to deal with personal and family problems, as well as substance abuse. We also plan to develop a public document outlining our strategies for northern hire, and are certainly prepared to consider recommendations of the Standing Committee on Finance.

In conclusion, Mr. Speaker, we do have a comprehensive Affirmative Action Policy and northern employment regime that have produced some good results. Regardless, the government is open to any suggestions Members may have for other steps we can take to improve our record of northern hires.

There is always room for improvement. Thank you.

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Minister's Statement 87-12(2): Northern Hire

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 917

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 2, Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements, Ms. Cournoyea . Ms. Cournoyea , I am sorry, you have to seek Members' consent. I asked you three times.

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Minister's Statement 87-12(2): Northern Hire

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 917

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I ask unanimous consent to make a Minister's statement.

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Minister's Statement 87-12(2): Northern Hire

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 917

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent. Are there any nays? There are no nays, please proceed, Ms. Cournoyea .

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Minister's Statement 88-12(2): Minister's Absence From The House

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 917

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, the honourable Dennis Patterson will be absent from the House today, tomorrow, and Thursday, to attend a Ministers of Health conference. Thank you.

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Minister's Statement 88-12(2): Minister's Absence From The House

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 917

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 3, Members' statements, Mr. Koe .

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Municipal Elections In Inuvik

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 917

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. I rise today, Mr. Speaker, fresh from attending an International Symposium on Democracy. Therefore the word and concept of democracy sticks in my mind. Mr. Speaker, I am not going to give a report on the symposium, which the honourable Speaker also attended. This report will be given at a later date. However, I wish to relate some of the things which I learned that are going to happen in Inuvik in mid-October, and are probably going to happen in many other communities in the north. Mr. Speaker, the dictionary defines democracy as "a government that is run by the people who live under it.

Under a democracy, the people rule either by direct vote or indirectly through the election of certain representatives to government."

Mr. Speaker, the municipal elections in Inuvik will be held in mid-October. I am pleased to state that the process of democracy is alive and well, as indicated by the number of candidates who put their names forth to run for Mayor and town council. Mr. Speaker, there are four candidates for mayor, and 16 candidates vying for eight councillor positions. This is impressive and probably indicates that people are concerned, and wish to participate in the governing of their municipal affairs.

This is very healthy, and I wish the best of luck to all of the candidates. I also have a bit of advice to the voters of Inuvik. On election day exercise your democratic right, and get out and vote. Mahsi Cho.

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Municipal Elections In Inuvik

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 917

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Todd .

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Member's Statement Regarding Government Response To Report Of Traditional Knowledge Working Group

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 917

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to express my concern and disappointment at the government's response to the report of the Traditional Knowledge Working Group. Mr. Speaker, the honourable Members will be aware that this initiative was established by the previous Government Leader back in October of 1989.

The purpose of the project was to define traditional knowledge, examine its current and potential use, and identify obstacles and solutions which will increase its influence in northern society. Elders worked hand in hand with government officials and the staff of aboriginal organizations, eventually producing a report which, I thought, was excellent.

The report lays out 20 recommendations which pinpoint areas where this government can enhance its programs and services by drawing from the accumulated wisdom of elders across the Northwest Territories. Although the report was tabled in the Assembly in July of 1991, two successive governments have failed to implement the directions outlined by the working group.

Now the initiative, at least to me, appears to have been either stuck in the mud or placed on the shelf. The Government Action Report is on hold while the bureaucrats put its contents into an implementation paper for a review by Cabinet. It is disrespectful, not only to the elders who advised the Traditional Knowledge Working Group, but to the elders throughout the Northwest Territories.

My honourable colleagues from Deh Cho and Inuvik both raised this matter in this Assembly in June. I want to advise the Minister that the Members on this side of the House are not prepared to accept any further delay in seeing that the principles outlined in the report of the Traditional Knowledge Working Group become incorporated into northern government. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Member's Statement Regarding Government Response To Report Of Traditional Knowledge Working Group

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 918

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Pudluk .

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Immigration Of Aboriginal People To Canada's North

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 918

Ludy Pudluk

High Arctic

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Aboriginal people have long been concerned and sympathetic for other aboriginal individuals who want to immigrate to Canada's north from other countries. These individuals must make a commitment to follow the laws of Canada if their request is approved. The immigration officials are very slow and have taken a long time to answer requests.

Inuit people have always been close knit and many years ago there were always people who moved to Canada's north from Alaska, Canadians to Alaska and from Greenland to Canada and vice versa. Years ago we never used to have any problems welcoming our fellow Inuit to our country. Such is not the case today. We have to go through immigration laws of governments and numerous bureaucracies for people to be accepted into this country.

These people should be given fewer restrictions to allow them to immigrate to northern communities if it is their wish. I have relatives who moved to Qaanaaq, Greenland many years ago and I am also aware that there have been Inuit who immigrated to Canada to the Igloolik area.

Today it is very hard for our fellow Inuit to immigrate, and we should have fewer restrictions so that we can welcome our Inuit from other countries. I feel this kind of problem should be reviewed so it would be easier for our fellow Inuit to come and live in our communities. Thank you.

---Applause

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Immigration Of Aboriginal People To Canada's North

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 918

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Lewis .

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Member's Statement Regarding Constitutional Amendments

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 918

Brian Lewis

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I explained to the House, yesterday, I was away for part of August and part of September. While I was away I made it my business not to read newspapers and watch television, and to stay away from the media as much as I possibly could. However, I was delighted when I came back and found that, as a result of a meeting in Charlottetown; Canada, at least, has a consensus agreement on our Constitution.

While I was away, I did spend a bit of time reflecting on the fact that all over the world people are dealing with constitutional problems. We think we are unique until you realize that there are six countries in Yugoslavia that are now working on their constitutions. There are more than a dozen republics in the old Soviet Union that are working on their constitutions. Both East and West Germany are trying to unify, and they are working on their constitution. You find that the Philippines are working on their constitution. The people of Israel are working on their constitution. So, we are not unique.

However, Mr. Speaker, the point I want to make, today, is that things can happen when people of good get together. I was pleasantly surprised to find that this process, which has taken such a long time, has resulted in the kind of compromise which will not please everybody, of course. For example, when we buy a house, we may not like the front look of it, we might not like the look of where the garage is, or the colour of the paint, or the exact location of the grounds, the gate, and so on. But overall, we think, well, a lot of people have worked on this, this is what we have come up with, and it represents a compromise among people.

Having read through that consensus agreement now, Mr. Speaker, I feel very pleased at the part that many people throughout this country have played in trying to come to a sensible conclusion to what has been a long and acrimonious debate. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Member's Statement Regarding Constitutional Amendments

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 918

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Thank you. Recognizing the Speaker's Gallery, the Council General from the Netherlands, Monsieur Dominique Bauduin and his wife Marie Bauduin. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Gargan .

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The Council For Aboriginal Justice

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 918

Samuel Gargan

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have already spoken about the federal government's $26 million initiative dealing with the administration of aboriginal justice. While I believe that this project is long overdue, I am concerned about the federal position to appoint a former Chief Crown Counsel for the Northwest Territories as Director General of the Minister's Aboriginal Justice Council. The lawyer, Don Avison, is the same Crown Prosecutor who ordered the arrest of Kitty Nowdluk Reynolds, an Inuit woman who had been beaten and raped in Iqaluit.

Ms. Nowdluk was subsequently arrested at her new home in British Columbia, detained in a Vancouver jail for 4 days, dragged across Canada in handcuffs, and locked in a van with the same man who had raped her. After all of that, the Crown Counsel made a last minute decision that her testimony was not even needed. This shameful episode was initiated by the same Don Avison, who is now Director of the Federal Initiative on Aboriginal Justice.

Mr. Speaker, when the R.C.M.P. Commissioner, Norman Inkster, appeared before the House of Commons Justice Committee in April of 1992, he apologized for R.C.M.P. mistreatment of the victim. In contrast, shortly after the incident was reported, Mr. Avison appeared on Focus North and attempted to justify his decision to arrest Kitty.

The federal initiative on aboriginal justice is long waited.

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The Council For Aboriginal Justice

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 918

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Point of order, Mr. Kakfwi .

Point Of Order

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The Council For Aboriginal Justice

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 918

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, the Member continues to name an individual, in the course of his statements the last few days. I think it would reflect badly on this House if he continues that, because the individual that he is naming did not act as a private individual. He was acting as the Crown Attorney, and the Member should refer to the person in the capacity of the office that he held at the time. Thank you.

Speaker's Ruling

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The Council For Aboriginal Justice

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 918

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

In listening to the Member's statement, that is not a point of order, however, I will caution the Member to be cautious in making allegations, or insinuations, about individuals. To this point, the Member has not done that, but I would caution all Members to be very careful when we are

talking about individuals who are not able to defend themselves in this House. Carry on, Mr. Gargan .

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The Council For Aboriginal Justice

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 919

Samuel Gargan

Deh Cho

Thank you. One has to ask how the credibility of the initiative may be impacted by the selection of a director whose apathy and understanding of aboriginal issues has been drawn into question, as a result of this insensitive and highly bureaucratic treatment of this aboriginal women.

One also has to question how much, or what sort of input was received from northerners, and from the Government of the Northwest Territories, when the appointment was being considered. I will have more to say about that at a later time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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The Council For Aboriginal Justice

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 919

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Arngna'naaq .

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Artisans Acquiring Funding

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 919

Silas Arngna'naaq

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today out of concern over the difficulty that some artisans are experiencing with respect to obtaining funds for business development and market expansion.

According to the report of the Standing Committee on National Economy, retail sales for arts and crafts run about $20 million a year. The S.C.O.N.E. report also pointed out, however, that industry sales could improve significantly with more effective promotion, and more attention to ensuring the highest quality of product.

Mr. Speaker, the establishment of new markets for northern products has been an issue raised by my honourable colleague, the Member for Baffin Central . I too believe that this is important, especially for our fine arts industry. I am aware that staff resources do not exist within the Department of Economic Development and Tourism to develop new international and domestic markets for N.W.T. tourism, arts and crafts, and Arctic foods.

However, it is my view, that wherever possible, the private sector should take the lead role in organizing and coordinating market development activity. I know this is not going to be possible for all northern products, but where it is, I would much rather see the government providing contribution funding to northern galleries and distributors; which after all, are the experts in the field, rather than this becoming the exclusive jurisdiction of departmental personnel.

This was driven home for me when I discovered that a Keewatin firm, with a successful ten year history of dealing in fine arts, had experienced difficulty securing funding for badly needed expansion and market development.

Ookpiktuyuk Art of Baker Lake, which is owned and operated by Inuit, has an exciting proposal that would involve mounting exhibitions of works of some of our best known artists. I was concerned to learn, recently, that the people behind this proposal got nowhere in their attempt to access E.D.A. funding, and that they are running into a brick wall with the department.

I hope the Minister will agree with me on the importance of developing new markets for our northern artists, and will look into the matter of the proposal at his earliest convenience.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Artisans Acquiring Funding

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 919

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Pudlat .

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The Retirement Of A Constituent

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 919

Kenoayoak Pudlat

Baffin South

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today, and would like to compliment, as I do not think that I could work for that number of years as this particular person advised me that he will be retiring in December. When I was a child there were not too many people who were bilingual. He has helped the unilingual Inuit. In December, that person will be retiring and has been working for 47 years, he will be turning 65.

On behalf of my constituents, I would like to thank him for his tremendous help to the Inuit, and to the non-Inuit alike. Mr. Speaker, I do not think that I could work for that number of years, especially on the same job. I would like to thank you that I could share this with the Members. Thank you.

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The Retirement Of A Constituent

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 919

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Antoine .

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Aboriginal Justice Conference

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 919

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. I would like to let the House know that at the end of this month, September 29, 30 and October 1, 1992 there is going to be a conference in Fort Simpson that deals with justice in Deh Cho. This is a forum that relates to what my colleague, Mr. Gargan , has been talking about: that is, aboriginal justice reform. We are going to be dealing with a number of issues, such as existing system and current developments, community justice models, aboriginal and justice initiatives, and community justice and policing. These are the issues that we want to expose the communities and the constituency to.

With the amount of funding that Mr. Gargan is talking about, I was wondering if the Department of Justice and Corrections Department would help out in this endeavour.

I would like to invite the different Members here to come and participate in this conference being held in Fort Simpson. Thank you.

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Aboriginal Justice Conference

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 919

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Nerysoo .

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Member's Statement Wishing The Clerk A Happy Birthday

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 919

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I wish, on behalf of all my colleagues, in particular on this side of the House, but I know that all Members will join with me, in extending our wishes to our Clerk on his birthday.

---Applause

I will not ask him how old he is, or should I say how young? I hope that he is as fresh as Mr. Koe is.

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Member's Statement Wishing The Clerk A Happy Birthday

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 919

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 3, Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Gargan .

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Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 919

Samuel Gargan

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Minister of Justice . Mr. Speaker, the report on the special advisor on gender equality was tabled on June 29, 1992 and titled "The Justice House". In the report, Ms. Katherine Peterson, Queen's Counsel, recommended that training in gender issues should be made available for members of the judiciary, Crown attorneys, Crown administrators, and other people who work in the justice system.

Earlier today, I referred to the fact that the current Director General of the Federal Council for Aboriginal Justice Administration is the same individual who was responsible for the arrest, detention and humiliation of Kitty Nowdluk Reynolds. Recognizing the importance of Ms. Peterson's recommendations, and the Director General's prior history of insensitivity to gender issues in the Kitty Nowdluk case, will the Minister of Justice communicate immediately with his federal counterparts and insist that his official participate in the mandatory gender awareness training program?

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Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Return To Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, I will not even rise to answer that, I will take it as notice. Thank you.

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Return To Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Would you, Mr. Kakfwi ? The rules say that you must rise to answer. I am sorry.

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Return To Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, I got off my chair. Thank you.

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Return To Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Question O768-12(2): Participation In Gender Awareness Training Program

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Next time you can stand up. The question has been taken as notice. Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Koe .

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Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, on December 10, 1991, the Minister of Intergovernmental and Aboriginal Affairs announced this government's initiatives for transferring responsibilities to communities. In the Minister's statement, he stated that community self-government will be a major priority of this government. The Minister also stated that a community transfer committee was established and I quote, "is in the process of developing a comprehensive strategy for implementing community transfer agreements."

This statement was made on December 10, 1991. My question to the Minister is, at what stage of development is the comprehensive strategy for implementing community transfer agreements?

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Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Return To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, the implementation of those recommendations has been attempted to be agreed to through this committee in the last few months. I believe it is fair to say there have been some difficulties because of, perhaps, philosophical or political views on how to approach the job. I think it is part of the historical struggle of self-government in the Northwest Territories, particularly in the Mackenzie Valley, between the territorial government and some of the more rhetorical leaders out in the field.

In any case, I have advised that I am not prepared to wait any longer, and have approached Cabinet with a specific request, that I will expedite a proposal myself which I want to run through the Cabinet committee called the Political and Constitutional Development Committee, so that Cabinet can ratify it. I think we have given this rather high level deputy minister's committee sufficient time to work out a strategy and an approach, and, I believe, that the difference of view and opinion are so fundamental, that it is not realistic to expect them to deliver a strategy, so I have taken the approach I have just outlined. Thank you.

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Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Supplementary, Mr. Koe .

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Supplementary To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The committee the Minister is referring to, I assume, is the committee that is made up of the deputy ministers who are in place to oversee the process. And you mention that you have taken away the responsibilities in this process. Can you explain if that Committee is still in place, or have you taken the responsibility for developing this initiative?

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Supplementary To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, the committee is still in place and their responsibility is still to coordinate the approach. What I have said is that the basic principles on which the committee feels they must start to develop a strategy on how to approach community transfer initiatives is flawed, in that the different members of the committee can not agree on the basic principles, at least the principles we thought they would have.

They might have trouble interpreting on how flexible they should be on the approach. So, what I have done is serve notice that, as a Minister, I am going to ask Cabinet to consider clarifying, again, what it is expediting as an approach that I think the committee should continue its work on. So, that is the statement I was trying to make. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 5, oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Koe .

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Supplementary To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. So, it has taken eight and a half months, since December, to come to the realization that things are not all that great within the bureaucracy. Yesterday, I made reference to some of the statements the Minister made about Fort McPherson, and quoted that the bureaucrats should shape up or ship out. So, I assume that the statement will be made to these deputies who are obviously having trouble dealing with the initiatives that were stated in December.

My question is what further steps are you going to be taking to ensure that the initiatives as presented by, for example, the Gwich'in, are you going to be dealing with this proposal very quickly?

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Supplementary To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 920

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, I think if the Member is going to try and quote me he should be a little more precise about it, I never use the words that he used. This is what I said, civil servants do not come to line with the approach that I want to advocate, as long as I am the Minister, they can face the prospect of being put out to pasture. By that I meant, that they can go work in other fields, other than this one, if they do not have the philosophical coherency to take the approach that I want, to negotiate any community transfers and self-

government arrangements. Then we will see that they work in another area of government, where their skills and their philosophies are less antagonistic. I did not intend to mean that I am going to seek to have them removed from the civil service at all. That should be clarified.

In any case, the Gwich'in have served notice that they want to start negotiations on the framework for self-government, and I have indicated that I am prepared to see these negotiations begin. That, personally, I do not see any short term or on the short term any immediate tangible results. Strategically, I asked them to consider the possibility that we look at getting into community transfer initiative talks, as if it was all part of self-government negotiations at the community level, and that this would certainly be done without prejudicing self- government negotiations.

Irregardless of whether they go for an aboriginal form of self-government, or whether they go to be part of a public government, that the basic intent is that there will be a strong community government. That is what the intent of the community transfer initiatives are. So, that is what the message was to the Gwich'in. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

I would like to remind all Members to be cautious that if you are attributing quotations to honourable Members of this House from sources that are not officially in front of this House, that can cause some difficulties. I ask Members to be cautious about this.

Item 5, oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Koe .

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Supplementary To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. It seems like a case of tail wagging a dog, or who is leading who. The Minister is responsible for this initiative. I would like to ask the Minister, is he still committed to making every effort possible to incorporate aspirations for aboriginal self-government to policies, and a process for implementing community self- government.

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Supplementary To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, since I first stated in 1975, it is a mission of mine. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Question O769-12(2): Status Of Community Transfer Agreements

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Nerysoo .

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Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. If I could ask the Minister of Intergovernmental and Aboriginal Affairs , in February there was a statement made by the honourable Government Leader . One of the first steps to be taken in the community government transfer, was to develop the process of transfer to community government, deciding which responsibilities might be transferred. To aid this process the government would ensure that all government programs would be considered available for transfer, that resources that were to be transferred will be sufficient for communities to alter, design, and the communities to meet local needs and priorities.

At the same time, the government would decide what powers and responsibilities for programs will remain with the government Ministers.

At what stage is the development of that particular document, so that, in fact, we were supposed to have received that on April 30, 1992, immediately after the M.L.A.s were to be consulted? Could the Minister indicate at what stage is the development of those particular documents?

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Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Return To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, the paper, itself, is in its final stages, and has been effected by the internal workings, as I mentioned earlier.

I think it is important to note two things, one is that the talks at the national constitutional level have added a lot of weight to those sceptics who have always taken the view that we can offer some but not all, it is up to us to decide what can and cannot be transferred. It has been my view from the beginning that the aboriginal people have the inherent right to govern themselves, that includes everything that this government has the capacity to govern, legislate on, and perhaps more. That has been my approach.

Understandably, perhaps, there have been elements in this government that have taken a different approach, so the developments at the constitutional level has, in my view, landed, I think, in my favour, the favour of this Cabinet as well on the views of the M.L.A.s, and certainly the communities that were slated for. We have taken the view that it is all part of self-government negotiations. It kind of flies contrary to one of the recommendations of the Standing Committee on Finance. It says that M.A.C.A. should be the lead Minister on this. Thank you.

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Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Supplementary, Mr. Nerysoo .

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Supplementary To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Maybe that philosophical difference in this House might exist, in terms of

interpretation. I do not believe that all Cabinet Members are totally committed to the idea of aboriginal self-government in the context of what is in the constitution. Maybe that is where some of the philosophical differences exist.

I want to ask, in light of that remark, that it seems that the documents are not concluded. Why are Members, and maybe there is a misquote in the papers, being accused of not, in fact, supporting the initiatives, when the work has not been brought before us to review and, in fact, support the direction that the Minister might be wanting to take?

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Supplementary To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 921

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, when the statement was made to the Gwich'in, I made the comments that, in my view, the motion that was passed in April, said that none of the recommendations contained in the "Strength at Two Levels" document should be implemented until the Members have had a chance to review, approve them, and implementation put in place. That signalled, to me, that departmental reorganization, as well as the community transfer talks, could not be assumed to have a go ahead until it has been reviewed. That has been my

interpretation of that, and, as well, I think Members know my own personal frustration with the lack of emphasis on the

discussions of the Strength at Two Levels. My view, having been involved in this political and constitutional issue for all the years that I have, I guess that I assumed that when the government says that they are prepared to begin right away, to begin talks, and transferring programs and responsibilities, and authorities to communities, that we would get a green light, and I did not feel that it really warranted that discussion, that we should have proceeded much faster than we did.

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Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Supplementary, Mr. Nerysoo .

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Supplementary To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Agreement

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Mr. Speaker, I was involved in negotiations for the self-government agreement for the Keewatin, and, in fact, the inherent right that is in there, is far more than what has been proposed by the community transfer initiatives, and, I think, that if I could ask the Minister, on what basis is this committee to give approval on the programs and services to be transferred if we do not know the programs and services that you want to transfer, or the financial resources that we have to vote in the budget? How are we to, in fact, support the Minister if we do not have that information?

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Supplementary To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Agreement

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Agreement

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, as I said earlier, it has been my personal view for many years that the Dene, and the Metis, and the Inuit, the aboriginal people in the north, have a right to govern themselves, and that if they want the entire authority and responsibility, the resources that this government now has the good grace to manage and administrate it, is there for the taking. That has been a long standing view of the Dene leadership over the years, and I believe that is the approach I take, so I do not suggest for one minute that I want to wait until I figure out the cost.

My view was we should have all jumped up in November, and said, "we have finally got a commitment that gives us the green light," and go at it as fast as we can, because the communities will give us the instructions. That was a disappointment in the approach. Thank you.

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Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Supplementary, Mr. Nerysoo .

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Supplementary To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Mr. Speaker, I think what is disappointing to me, by the remarks of the Minister, is the fact that in some of these particular programs that we are now supposedly administratively responsible for, we are in debt situations, and I am not prepared, Mr. Speaker, to transfer any responsibility to my communities in which they are already going to be running in debt. So, I want to ask the Minister, at what time are we going to deal with the question of financial resources for these particular transfers, and vote those dollars in the budget? This particular budget does not include those dollars to be identified.

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Supplementary To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, I think that is part of the problem that is skirting this exchange. It is my view that we have to accept as political fact the debate about what happens, in large part, is not going to be decided in the confines of this House; that, as well as the larger constitutional political issues, involves more than just M.L.A.s and Ministers. It involves the Metis leaders, the Inuit leaders, the Dene Chiefs, and it applies to the same things as the community transfer initiatives, I think we should have some general parameters that would govern our approach to it.

But, by and large, it has to be a community based developed joint approach, and the communities will be the ones who tell us what they are interested in talking about, how they want to talk about it, and what resources, if any, will be required to get into this approach. Any other kind of approach, any kind of prepackaged approach, is going to fail, because it will have come out of this Legislature, this government. The ownership that we need to develop by the people at the community level is not going to be there.

I agree with the Member, if, for instance, Dene Chiefs want to go to Ottawa, and say "we will negotiate bilaterally with the federal government," they can do that. There is no difficulty with it whatsoever, but I believe the Member will agree that this is the prerogative for the communities to decide, and not the Members of this Legislature.

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Further Return To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Point of privilege, Mr. Nerysoo .

Point Of Privilege

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Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Point of privilege, Mr. Speaker. My privilege, as a representative of the communities, and the people in my constituency, is not to be challenged by another Member, by indicating that I do not know what is in the interest of my constituents. Especially, as an aboriginal person.

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Further Return To Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Question O770-12(2): Status Of Program Transfer Document

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

I will take your point of privilege under advisement, and return to the House at an appropriate time with a response. Oral questions, Mr. Bernhardt .

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Question O771-12(2): Requirements For Teacher Training

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

Ernie Bernhardt

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Minister responsible for Education . Arctic College offers teacher education programs at its Thebacha and Nunatta campuses, and throughout community progress in the western Arctic and Keewatin regions. It is important that northern people who will stay in the north, be trained to teach our children. Mr. Speaker, it is also very important that the most capable and committed people be chosen. Teachers must be highly trained and able to teach our children to develop their knowledge and skills they need in core subjects, such as maths and sciences.

These teachers are instructing our future leaders who must be able to compete and succeed in an increasingly technological society. Our children's skills must be our highest priorities. My question is, Mr. Speaker, can the Minister explain what requirements are in place to ensure that the most capable and committed individuals are chosen for teacher training?

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Question O771-12(2): Requirements For Teacher Training

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Arvaluk .

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Question O771-12(2): Requirements For Teacher Training

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

James Arvaluk

Aivilik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is rather technical and requires a detailed answer. So, I will take that as notice.

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Question O771-12(2): Requirements For Teacher Training

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 922

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Question has been taken as notice. Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the Minister of Culture and Communications . Mr. Speaker, recently I was approached with respect to the procedures used by the government for advertising, whether it be advertising for jobs, or tenders, or whatever, but there is a concern that the territorial papers with a larger circulation, have been given preference for opportunity of advertising. I would like to ask the Minister of Culture and Communications , has there been consideration for more of a collective approach to advertising which will reflect equity among the distribution of departments to these particularly smaller papers? Thank you.

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Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, these policies of advertising fall under the Department of Personnel, and as a result of the cutbacks, we asked the department to come up with a policy that would be fair, and still serve the needs of the government. It is to have the advertisements reach as many people in the north for the least amount of dollars, and the approach was to use fewer regional small papers, and go with the big papers, since we do not have as many dollars to go around, and double advertise, in some cases, and that was the decision that was made. Thank you.

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Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 5, oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Supplementary To Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Mr. Speaker, just to seek clarification from the Minister. Has the Minister indicated to this House that this advertising is the responsibility of Personnel even for tender advertising, or any other type of advertising this government may decide?

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Supplementary To Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

I am sorry, Mr. Speaker, I was talking about just the job advertisements. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Supplementary To Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Mr. Speaker, supplementary to my same question, but I do not know if it is appropriate to ask another Minister. I would like to pose a question to the Government Leader . Is there one particular department that is responsible for advertising in the government?

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Supplementary To Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Question O772-12(2): Collective Approach For Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

That would constitute a new question, you are going to a new Minister, Mrs. Marie-Jewell . So, I will go on to Mr. Todd , and then we can get back to you if you want to ask the question. Mr. Todd .

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Question O773-12(2): Establishment Of Territorial Elders' Council

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Government Leader . Mr. Speaker, I believe that this government, as it moves in the future, must retain the wisdom of the past in order to show all of our cultures how to live and work together. The Traditional Knowledge Working Group recognized this when it recommended the establishment of a Territorial Elders' Council. It would be a formal body within our government infrastructure which would ensure that traditional knowledge of known elders is shared with legislators and policy makers.

Slow down? Okay, sorry, slow down. Does our government plan to take the unique and truly northern step by supporting the recommendation of the working group and establish a Territorial Elders' Council?

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Question O773-12(2): Establishment Of Territorial Elders' Council

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Madam Premier .

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Question O773-12(2): Establishment Of Territorial Elders' Council

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 923

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, on August 4, just to give a little bit of background in the context of departmental consolidations, the Cabinet transferred the official languages

section of the Department of Culture and Communications to the Department of the Executive.

The responsibility, I would just like to go on, of that unit is the coordination and delivery of official language services throughout the government, and this includes: development of government-wide guidelines for the provision of services; the coordination of government initiatives with respect to the maintenance and the revitalization of aboriginal languages, including identification of priorities; the coordination of negotiations with the federal government for the funding of official languages agreements; and the coordination of the implementation of official languages agreements and evaluation of monitoring of these agreements.

As well, the coordination of responses of reports, recommendations and requests for information on the Official Languages Commissioner.

Mr. Speaker, as well, Elizabeth Biscaye was appointed Assistant Deputy Minister responsible for the official languages units. In a more specific response, we are supportive of the utilization and the promotion of traditional knowledge within the limits of what is possible, I suppose, within financial restraints. What I am trying to do, as Government Leader , is to take that report in acknowledgement of the timing that was initially agreed to, recognizing that we are behind time in responding to that report.

With the official languages, as well as a number of other initiatives, we want to put together a working group, and I know that the honourable Member feels that it is further delaying some of the implementations, but I would hope that if the honourable Member -- I know, that there are a lot of people that are interested in the traditional working knowledge, and I fully support that because I believe for a long time now we have not really taken adequate notice of traditional knowledge. I have a very special interest in that, and I want to get together and look at the report and look at the commitments we have made.

I know that there was a paper in June brought forward to the Cabinet by the Minister of Culture and Communications, and I am going to make a commitment to bring back to you the findings and the workings in November of what steps we are planning and the priorities we are going set in November. Thank you.

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Question O773-12(2): Establishment Of Territorial Elders' Council

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Could I ask Members to slow down a little bit, the interpreters are having a little bit of trouble following. Supplementary, Mr. Todd . Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Government Leader in respect to a collective approach to advertising for the government. Since the Minister of Communications and Culture is not responsible for anything in respect to communications, since the Minister of Personnel has indicated that he is only responsible for advertising in respect to job competitions, I would like to ask the Government Leader if she will consider some method of cohesive approach in respect to advertising opportunities for all of the papers in the territories? Thank you.

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Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Ms. Cournoyea .

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Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Yes, Mr. Speaker, we recognize that, although the government service did put out the advertisement for the needs of various departments, various different departments were also putting out their own advertisements. What we are doing now with the Financial Management Board is to draw together all of the different approaches that have been taken by the various departments, to see if we can collectively come up with an overall policy to deal with the matter the honourable Member has raised.

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Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Supplementary To Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Would the Government Leader be able to advise this House as to when we would anticipate this policy be completed? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Ms. Cournoyea .

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Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Finance has indicated that the meeting of the publishers' groups, which we have set up, will be meeting within a month and, hopefully, immediately after that we will be able to come up with some type of a policy that we can share with all Members.

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Question O774-12(2): Collective Approach To Advertising

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Arngna'naaq .

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Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

Silas Arngna'naaq

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I mentioned earlier, I am interested in ensuring that private firms with a successful track record are able to receive funding they require to establish new markets and build new distribution networks. I would like to ask the Minister of Economic Development whether he can indicate what options are available for businesses to access developmental funding for market expansion. Thank you.

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Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Pollard .

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Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

John Pollard

Hay River

Mr. Speaker, there are a number of sources of funding. We have grants, contributions, a loan fund, and that is within the Department of Economic Development and Tourism. We also have the E.D.A. agreement which has some marketing monies available in it, and there is also the possibility that arrangements could be made with the Business Development Corporation in that regard, as well. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 5, oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Arngna'naaq .

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Supplementary To Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

Silas Arngna'naaq

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Supplementary to the same Minister. I am sure that the Minister is aware that some types of businesses, like fine art galleries, must carry a high cost inventory. In fact, I know that the work one of the artists deals with Ookpiktuyuk in Baker Lake averages $2,000 a piece for each carving. This heavy outlay for the acquisition of a high quality inventory sometimes makes it difficult to secure bank funding to expand even the most sound business. Can the Minister assure the House that these considerations are taken into account in reviewing applications for art galleries and distributors? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Pollard .

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Further Return To Question O775-12(2): Access Developmental Funding

Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

John Pollard

Hay River

Mr. Speaker, when we assess these kinds of inventory arrangements, I think that we are cognizant of the fact that all of the inventory cannot be high priced items. There must be a mix in there of items that can move. We are aware, and it is pointed out continually to me by the Arctic Cooperatives, that sitting with a large inventory is very costly.

Arctic Cooperatives has in excess of $1 million sitting in inventory. I am aware of the problem, and we do take those things into consideration when we sit down to discuss with people how we may assist them. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question O775-12(2): Access Developmental Funding

Question O775-12(2): Access To Developmental Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Nerysoo .

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Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to ask a question of the Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs . I want to indicate that the residents of the Mackenzie Delta have expressed concern about not hearing from the government on dealing with matters relating to flood damage.

I wanted to ask the Minister, has the Cabinet or the Minister discussed financing repairs of homes and businesses when flood damage has occurred?

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Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Allooloo .

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Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 924

Titus Allooloo

Amittuq

Mr. Speaker, I believe the previous Minister took some documents to Cabinet to deal with flood damages in the western Arctic area.

The assistance that people are able to get is under the Disaster Assistance Policy. That has been approved by Cabinet. There are also requests that can be made to Cabinet by the Minister of M.A.C.A. in case of wide spread damage, as a result of emergencies or flooding. This criteria is used to access the need for implementing the policy, including weather damage so wide spread that a significant number of people, and property, or the geographical areas are effected. Other criteria is that municipal authorities and community residents made serious effort to protect their property and minimize damage. Mr.

Speaker, to my knowledge, at this point, the extraordinary funding has not been made available to flood damage. Thank you.

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Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Supplementary, Mr. Nerysoo .

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Supplementary To Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can I ask the Minister to indicate whether or not his department is going to provide financial assistance for those individuals and those homes that have received flood damage, or damage as a result of the flood?

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Supplementary To Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Allooloo .

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Further Return To Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

Titus Allooloo

Amittuq

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will take the question as notice, and get back to the Member tomorrow.

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Further Return To Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Question O776-12(2): Flood Damage Funding

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

The question has been taken as notice. Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Lewis .

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Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

Brian Lewis

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is a question for the Minister responsible for Transportation , who has not been busy today.

Mr. Speaker, we have all been told that Air Canada and Canadian Airlines International are about to merge. A lot of us know that Canadian Airlines International has always been a western based company. It has its ancestry, back in the old C.P. Airline, she eventually gobbled up Max Ward and several other smaller western airlines. We are also aware that Canadian Airline crews, as many as forty of them, are based in western Canada. Air Canada's crews are all based in eastern Canada.

I would like to ask the Minister responsible for Transportation , whether he has analyzed the impact this merger will have on the northern transportation industry, as it regards air transportation, both for passengers and for freight?

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Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Whitford .

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Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

Tony Whitford

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Not to the detail that the Member is asking, about employees and where they are going to eventually end up being trimmed. The merge, the proposed merge, is not yet completed and there is still a lot of details to be ironed out by the news reports that I have been unable to review. It suggests that the strongest, Air Canada, is going to be situated in the east and that its subsidiary, if you can call it that, Canadian will still be situated in the west, in Calgary.

There is bound to be some lay offs, some cutbacks in services but to this point in time we are not really sure what the final impact is going to be.

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Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Supplementary, Mr. Lewis .

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Supplementary To Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

Brian Lewis

Yellowknife Centre

I do not want to prolong this, Mr. Speaker, but it is a major step in the airline industry in Canada, and obviously we do not know all the facts. I would like to ask the Minister, whether you will undertake to stay on top of this issue, and to get his staff to work on it, because many of us believe that what is going to happen with a monopoly situation is that the isolated parts of this country are going to suffer. I would like to ask him if he would tell his staff to keep on top of it and to keep us informed.

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Supplementary To Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Ms. Cournoyea .

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Further Return To Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, as this issue has been on the horizon for some time, I have asked that the Minister of Economic Development stay on top of this issue and, in particular, the concern about the airlines in the north in relationship on how the final deal is going to come out, because of the economic issue and the problems that we are having now. For about seven or eight months, those particular questions, because of the direct relationship with airlines, would be better referred to the Minister of Economic Development . Thank you.

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Further Return To Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Question O777-12(2): Impact Of Merger On Northern Transportation Industry

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Bernhardt .

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Question O778-12(2): Resources To Support Released Inmates

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

Ernie Bernhardt

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Minister of Justice , who has now assumed responsibility for the territorial correctional system. The Minister will know that many northerners are concerned about the almost total lack of correctional after care services in our communities.

When these offenders face considerable pressure as they attempt to adjust to their return to community living, they often have trouble finding new social networks, and many employers are unable to hire them. Yet, in most of our isolated communities, the correctional system provides almost no support during this period. I know, because I have been in this kind of a situation.

Can the Minister of Justice indicate what he is going to do to ensure that adequate resources are made available to support offenders upon release from incarceration?

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Question O778-12(2): Resources To Support Released Inmates

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

The Speaker

Michael Ballantyne

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Question O778-12(2): Resources To Support Released Inmates

Item 5: Oral Questions

Page 925

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, one of the initiatives of this government has been called the community justice initiatives. This initiative basically suggests that those communities that want to take on more responsibility for the administration of justice, when they get involved in the courts, advise the system on how to do sentencing, what to do with the offenders, and that sort of thing. It takes more and more

ownership, and they start to say how do you think justice should be handled and administered. That would be, I think, the route, that I would see, addressing this issue. It is interesting to note, I think Coppermine is one of the communities that has asked for a meeting with Justice, to start discussing how the people of Coppermine might want to start telling the Justice people how they want justice administered. I think there is a couple of good examples.

I think comments were made during the Standing Committee on Finance that building large jails, having non-aboriginal people taking responsibility for aboriginal inmates is not going to work, that it is going to continue to grow in cost with very little return, as the Member says, with very little money for work in rehabilitation and educational work with inmates, and support. We should develop support systems for inmates after they are finished their term of incarceration.

It seems to me that my view is communities that will provide that, and right now there is nothing in the budgets for work with communities, but, I think, that with communities like Coppermine inviting government to go and talk about how they can get involved, for instance, in sentencing, alternative sentencing systems for minors, for adult offenders, for women, for the youth, for the elders, then they will come up with suggestions that the Members are seeking.

I do not think that we could attach it to the present system, since the large majority of aboriginal people are inmates in our jails, what we are doing is taking them away from people by a system that we never really had any involvement in as aboriginal people. Having justice administered from there, sending them to places like Yellowknife to serve a term, and then just sort of spit them back out, to land back in the community, as a Member pointed out, and is disowned. I think we cannot attach a community developed support system onto a system like that.

I think it has to come from a system where a group of people at the community level say we want to get involved in the justice system as it relates to young people, and as it relates to adult offenders. One of the things they might negotiate with us is saying, we want some resources for a support system for inmates and people who are sentenced, and whether they are serving it at a community level, which I think they should, the discussion should take place at that level.

So, in response to the Member's question, I think I am very interested in that, and a number of talks with individuals about it, and my suggestion would be that should be the approach that we take to it. Thank you.

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