Debates of May 31st, 2006

This is page numbers 23 - 42 of the Hansard for the 15th Assembly, 5th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was community .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Community Justice

Butthead Campaign 2006

Wood Pellet Boiler System For The North Slave Correctional Centre

WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Barriers To Government Employment Experienced By Disabled Persons

22nd Annual NWT Track And Field Championships In Hay River

Congratulations To College Graduates From Tu Nedhe

Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Permanent Nursing And Policing Services In Wrigley

Infrastructure Needs Of Nunakput

Effects Of Cost Of Living Increases

Funding For Disability Programs And Services In The Sahtu Region

Supporting Innovation In The Nwt

Membership On The Public Utilities Board

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

NWT Recycle Program Policies

Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Support For Innovation In The Nwt

WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Barriers To Government Employment Experienced By Persons With Disabilities

Impact Of Fiscal Policy On Small Businesses

Infrastructure Needs Of Nunakput

Membership On The Public Utilities Board

Written Question 1-15(5): Services In The Sahtu For Persons With Disabilities

Tabled Document 2-15(5): Demolition - Dene K'onia Facility, Hay River

Tabled Document 3-15(5): Dene K'onia Facility, Hay River

Tabled Document 4-15(5): Magnitude Of The Problem: Key Facts In The Nwt

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Honourable Brendan Bell , Mr. Braden , Honourable Paul Delorey , Honourable Charles Dent , Mrs. Groenewegen , Mr. Hawkins , Honourable David Krutko , Mr. Lafferty , Ms. Lee , Honourable Michael McLeod , Mr. McLeod, Mr. Menicoche , Honourable Michael Miltenberger , Mr. Pokiak , Mr. Ramsay , Honourable Floyd Roland , Mr. Villeneuve , Mr. Yakeleya

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---Prayer

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 23

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Good afternoon, colleagues. Welcome back to the House. Orders of the day. Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister of Justice , Mr. Bell .

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Minister's Statement 5-15(5): Community Justice

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 23

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today I would like to recognize the people who are working to deliver local justice services and reduce crime in the communities.

Justice committees work with elders and community leaders to develop innovative solutions to their justice issues, such as the diversion program. Diversion is for people who accept responsibility for the minor crimes they commit. They meet with the committee to talk about what happened. Then the committee makes a decision about how the person can make things better. Last year, there were more than 200 diversions.

Community justice committees also develop crime prevention activities. They're administering fine options programs, on-the-land activities and services for victims of crime. Several innovative projects have moved forward in the past year. The dog shelter in Nahanni Butte is teaching teenagers to care for animals. The cabin-building project in Whati brings youth together with elders, who are teaching them skills far beyond how to hammer a nail. A support group in Inuvik is helping girls find good role models and avoid violent situations.

We're seeing real results. In Deline, there have not been any youth in court for the past four years. The Yellowknife victim services workers were recently selected as the Outstanding Group of the Year, for their dedication to service at any time of the day or night. The Gameti policing project has just wrapped up, and Behchoko and Fort Simpson are both planning to deliver their own victim services programs.

Funding is now available to every community to hire a part-time justice coordinator. Additional special project funding is available to deliver programs. This money helps communities develop a justice system that meets their unique needs and provides them with a safer environment.

The support for community justice is encouraging. Communities are excited to deliver their own projects and to help residents live in safer neighbourhoods. This Assembly passed a motion last year to support and improve our programming. In response, the Department of

Justice is developing a strategic plan with local stakeholders and partners, including the RCMP. We'll help communities deliver better services, improve training programs, make good programs even better and communicate more effectively. This involves working with partners from the community level all the way to the federal government. I am looking forward to presenting more details about this plan to Members next month. Thank you.

---Applause

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Minister's Statement 5-15(5): Community Justice

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 23

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Minister's Statement 6-15(5): Butthead Campaign 2006

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 23

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Mr. Speaker, I am proud to announce that through the Don't be a Butthead campaign, many young people have made the commitment to be smoke free. I have personally written to over 3,000 children and youth from every community in the NWT, congratulating them on their pledge to remain smoke free. This campaign originated in 2004 as an initiative of the Department of Health and Social Services to educate youth across the North on the benefits of staying smoke free.

This year, youth and schools in the NWT got caught up in the smoke-free fervor by entering the Create the Smoke Free Future contest in either the junior or senior category. A total of 200 entries from 12 communities were received in four categories of words, music, video and visual arts.

As we celebrate World No Tobacco Day, I am proud to announce the winners of the Create the Smoke Free Future contest.

The winners in the junior class, grades 3 to 7, are: music category, Leah Bodnar McLeod, Tori Hendrick, Leon Simon and Melanie Rogers, Inuvik; written category, Tamara Grosco, Yellowknife; visual arts, Hannah MacLeod, Yellowknife; video, Carly Wilson, Yellowknife.

The winners in the senior class, grades 8 to 12, are: music category, Sonny Simpson, Wekweeti: written category, Heather Henderson-Powder, Tulita; visual arts, Russell Giroux, Detah; video, Max Rossouw, Brandon Bradbury, Griffin Wile and David Brinston, Yellowknife.

The junior winners will be receiving their choice of $250 or a digital camera while the senior winners will have their entries produced professionally. I invite Members to view the winners' artwork in the Great Hall throughout the day. They are excellent creations and a testament of your youth's commitment to stay smoke free.

I hope that you will show your continued support of the campaign by congratulating students in your riding who have made a commitment. You can also encourage and recognize the people and schools in your community for their continued efforts in protecting our youth against the harmful impacts of tobacco use.

In addition to the successful Don't be a Butthead campaign, this Legislature recently passed and implemented legislation to create a smoke-free generation. The Tobacco Control Act represents an important part of this government's strategy to encourage healthy lifestyles for all northerners.

Educating our youth about the harms of smoking is a giant step towards helping them choose a healthy lifestyle. Let us work together to end the smoking epidemic that harms so many northerners every year. Thank you.

---Applause

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Minister's Statement 6-15(5): Butthead Campaign 2006

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 24

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister of Public Works and Services , Mr. Roland .

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Minister's Statement 7-15(5): Wood Pellet Boiler System For The North Slave Correctional Centre

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 24

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Mr. Speaker, energy costs are a concern to all of us. The Department of Public Works and Services has an opportunity to test a cheaper alternative energy source this coming year at the North Slave Correctional Centre.

Public Works and Services and the Department of Justice recently received a proposal from a Yellowknife-based company, Arctic Green Energy, to provide a wood pellet boiler system at the North Slave Correctional Centre.

Providing heat for buildings using wood pellet boilers has been common practice in Europe for decades, with systems reliably heating numerous facilities such as hotels, office buildings and recreational facilities. Money is saved by using less expensive wood by-products, specifically crushed sawdust pellets. They also significantly reduce greenhouse gas emissions.

The North Slave Correctional Centre needs a boiler to provide backup heat. Capital of $225,000 was approved for this boiler. Arctic Green Energy proposed to provide a wood pellet burning boiler system instead of installing a third oil-fired boiler. It would be the primary heating unit and would provide 50 percent of the heating requirements for the facility.

Arctic Green Energy will be responsible for the design, installation, operation and maintenance of the wood pellet system at no cost to the Government of the Northwest Territories, and for provision of the pellets. Arctic Green Energy would act as an energy service provider, billing the GNWT for heat supplied to the facility.

The system will include a storage unit to hold adequate wood pellets for one month's required output in winter conditions. This should enable the system to continue to operate during ferry and ice road closures.

We anticipate many benefits from the wood pellet system. For example:

• Capital savings of $225,000 from the original third boiler project;

• Estimated $50,000 annual savings in heating costs for the facility; and

• Estimated reduction in greenhouse gas emissions of 1,450 tonnes annually.

---Applause

The new wood pellet boiler system will be operational by November 1, 2006. After one year, the system's effectiveness will be evaluated. If it is efficient and reliable, we will consider this heating system for other major projects. If it is found not to meet our needs, the system will be removed and the deferred oil-fired boiler will be installed.

Public Works and Services, together with our GNWT client departments, is committed to reducing energy costs in buildings for the benefit of all northerners. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Minister's Statement 7-15(5): Wood Pellet Boiler System For The North Slave Correctional Centre

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 24

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Ministers' statements. Members' statements. The honourable Member for Great Slave , Mr. Braden .

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WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 24

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In the February session, I spoke of the ongoing difficulties of an injured worker, a 51-year-old man whose life has been shattered by a 19-year-long battle with the Workers' Compensation Board. Mr. Ivan Valic is one of some 40 injured workers that I know of, Mr. Speaker, who have experienced a never-ending appeals treadmill with the Workers' Compensation Board Appeals Tribunal system.

Mr. Valic is angry at the system. His oft repeated question is who is responsible? Who is accountable? Why doesn't the Minister do something? Why doesn't the Premier do something? Who is accountable? The accountability question is one that is not well answered or clearly defined. In an exhaustive ruling filed December 14th last year. Madam Justice Schuler of the NWT Supreme Court found that Mr. Valic was indeed discriminated against under

section 15 of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, because the board's policy on chronic pain syndrome fails to treat those injured workers on an equal footing with other workers.

Further, Justice Schuler concluded that through the board and the tribunal's dealings, there was denial of natural justice. Mr. Valic sought to have his case reheard by a fresh and independent appeals panel within 60 days. Justice Schuler granted Mr. Valic's appeal to a freshly constituted tribunal and the Minister is now seeking appointees to this tribunal which, I understand, closes today.

Mr. Speaker, Justice Schuler did not order the 60-day hearing deadline, but her ruling was clear in its intent to see Mr. Valic's rehearing completed in reasonable time. Mr. Speaker, it's been more than 160 days since Justice Schuler's decision; 100 days more than originally sought

by Mr. Valic for the rehearing. The timing now clearly rests with the Minister to ensure that a freshly constituted appeals tribunal is in place. I will have questions for the Minister on this process at the appropriate time later today, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

---Applause

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WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 25

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Braden . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Kam Lake , Mr. Ramsay .

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Barriers To Government Employment Experienced By Disabled Persons

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 25

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I would like to discuss the issue of disability awareness. I listened quite closely to Minister Miltenberger 's statement yesterday on the occasion of Disability Awareness Week. The theme, Mr. Speaker, this year is Living, Working and Educating Together - Include People with Disabilities.

Mr. Speaker I want to start by acknowledging the good work of organizations like the NWT Council of Persons with Disabilities and EmployABILITY who provide such valuable services to many of our residents.

Noticeably absent from the Minister's statement yesterday was how the Government of the Northwest Territories plugs in and participates in including persons with disabilities in our own public service. In his ad that appeared in the local press this week recognizing Disability Awareness Week, he states, "I encourage everyone to be inclusive of individuals with disabilities and recognize the contributions they provide within our communities throughout the territory."

It would seem that Minister Miltenberger and his colleagues on Cabinet have much to learn about how inclusive and how accepting the Government of the Northwest Territories is when it comes to hiring persons with disabilities in our own public service. The old adage that one should lead by example certainly comes to mind and I am going to give Cabinet a clear and concise message today that when it comes to leadership in the inclusion of persons with disabilities, they have an incredibly abysmal record.

Disabled persons make up 13 percent of our population. Yet, as a group within the public service of the GNWT, they represent .4 percent. Yes, .4 percent. This from a government which continues to preach inclusion. The government should be ashamed of themselves. Let's look at the lead departments, Mr. Speaker. FMBS has a grand total of zero employees with a disability. The newly minted Human Resources department responsible for the government policy in the area of human resources has, surprise, surprise, zero employees with a disability.

In all of the GNWT reports in the public service from 1996 to 2004, there is not one single, solitary sentence about the Government of the Northwest Territories' efforts to hire disabled persons. Perhaps the Minister responsible for the public service can flip through these reports and he can note that there is an absence of any text...

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Barriers To Government Employment Experienced By Disabled Persons

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 25

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Mr. Ramsay , your time for your Member's statement has expired.

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Barriers To Government Employment Experienced By Disabled Persons

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 25

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Barriers To Government Employment Experienced By Disabled Persons

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 25

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

The Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude, Mr. Ramsay .

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Barriers To Government Employment Experienced By Disabled Persons

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 25

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In all GNWT reports on the public service from 1996 to 2004, there is not one single, solitary sentence about the governments' efforts to hire disabled persons. Perhaps the Minister responsible for the public service can look through these reports and he'll note that there is no text on efforts to hire disabled persons.

As the Human Resources department likes to display in any literature that I have read, they like to flaunt the affirmative action policy. Mr. Speaker, disabled individuals are second only to indigenous aboriginal persons in that policy. Mr. Speaker, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that .4 percent representation of arguably the most disadvantaged community, and that is in terms of employment, income and education in the territory, that remember comprises 13 percent of our population, is completely unacceptable.

The Government of the Northwest Territories has made hundreds of direct appointments in the past 10 years to many priority one individuals, yet research I have would indicate that only one -- that is one -- direct appointment to an individual that had a disability.

Mr. Speaker, I intend to hear from the Minister responsible for the public service today why disabled individuals continue to face barriers when trying to gain employment with this government. Thank you.

---Applause

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Barriers To Government Employment Experienced By Disabled Persons

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 25

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .

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22nd Annual NWT Track And Field Championships In Hay River

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 25

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to inform the Members that Hay River is proud to be hosting the 22nd Annual NWT Track and Field Championships. The organizers are expecting approximately 1,250 participants coming into town from 31 communities in the Northwest Territories. A huge part of the track and field success must be credited to the staff of the Hay River schools: Diamond Jenness Secondary School, Princess Alexander School and the Harry Camsell School. I would also like to recognize at this time the many residents of Hay River, the parents and coaches.

These people come out every year to volunteer their time and their expertise at the meet and in the school working on various track activities.

Several local businesses offer time off to their employees and some volunteers take part of their vacation time to be able to work at this exciting event. The track and field committee enlists the services of approximately 350 volunteers each year to complete the planning process, fill the required stats keeper positions, operate food services for students and spectators, as well as covering for many other jobs involved in running the track meet. I would like to commend all of the people whose personal efforts make the track and field meet a success every year.

As an added feature this year, the 2007 Canada Games torch, on its journey across Canada, will be brought to Hay River tonight for the opening ceremonies of the track and field meet. Included with the runners from Enterprise that will be bringing the torch in will be our own Commissioner, Tony Whitford. The Hay River Running Club and the Commissioner will arrive at the arena carrying the 2007 Canada Games Torch that will light the track and field flame to begin the games. This evening, when the House adjourns, a large delegation of Ministers and Members will be attending with yourself, Mr.

Speaker, and I, the track and field opening ceremonies. This is the largest delegation so far and I'm looking forward to the excitement that is generated when the teams from schools large and small enter the arena. The pride and emotion that is felt by the participants and by spectators alike is something to behold.

Again, Mr. Speaker, congratulations to Hay River, the organizers, the volunteers and, of course, the spectators that go out, rain or shine, to cheer them on, and the best of luck to everyone who participates this year in the 22nd Annual Track and Field Championships in Hay River. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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22nd Annual NWT Track And Field Championships In Hay River

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 26

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Villeneuve .

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Congratulations To College Graduates From Tu Nedhe

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 26

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Today I'd just like to commend and publicly congratulate some successful individuals from my constituency of Tu Nedhe on their recent academic achievements. I attended the Aurora College convocation ceremonies in Fort Smith on April 29th, 2006, to congratulate two individuals who graduated from college diploma programs and two that graduated from college certificate programs.

I'd like to send my congratulations out to Melanie McCallum of Deninu Kue, who received a management studies diploma, and congratulations to Lisa Beaulieu, also of Deninu Kue, who received her social work diploma.

I'd also like to congratulate Agatha Laboucan of Lutselk'e for completing and receiving her management studies certificate, and Lorna Catholique, also of Lutselk'e, in receiving her certificate in office administration.

Mr. Speaker, these individuals are definitely an inspiration to other community members who are considering furthering their educational needs. But the real icing on the cake, Mr. Speaker, is on May 18th, 2006, I along with the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , the Honourable Charles Dent ; our Commissioner, Mr. Tony Whitford; and many community members of Deninu Kue gathered to celebrate the achievements of two more successful individuals of the Deninu Kue school's six Grade 12 graduation class.

Again, I would like to congratulate Jodie Miersch and Kirstin Fabien for their achievements, and offer my encouragement and full support to continue on with your educational needs and to fulfill your lifelong goals, aspirations and dreams.

In closing, Mr. Speaker, I'd look forward to seeing more of my constituents realizing their potential in any academic arena and I can say with confidence that I will see more success stories when I look into the future of our constituency of Tu Nedhe. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Congratulations To College Graduates From Tu Nedhe

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 26

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Monfwi, Mr. Lafferty .

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Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 26

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. (Translation) Today's statement will be on elders. We have elders who work in the school sometimes. We have difficulty paying them. (Translation ends)

...consider a leader in maintaining and enhancing aboriginal language, culture and traditions. This wouldn't be possible without our elders; our Ph.D.'s when it comes to traditional knowledge and on-the-land programs, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, lately with the introduction of FMBS system to the Community Services Agency it has become more difficult to issue elder's pay for their casual work; pay that they deserve for their valuable contribution to the society. The TCSA used to have a system prior to August 4th, the effective date of the Tlicho Agreement, which allowed elders' pay to be issued within a day of their service, Mr. Speaker. Now elders have to wait up to six weeks to receive their paycheques and this is not acceptable, Mr. Speaker.

The GNWT should not be imposing its own responsibilities and accountabilities on the TCSA for programs assigned by the Tlicho Government. In this case, the Tlicho Government wishes to hire their own elders, pay them immediately after the completion of services. The GNWT needs to work with the TCSA to make it possible for them to make immediate payments to elders. It is not acceptable to force elders to wait six weeks, Mr. Speaker, to receive their pay for well-respected services.

Mr. Speaker, we're losing elders as we speak in the schools. So I will have questions for the FMBS Minister at the appropriate time. Mahsi.

---Applause

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Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 27

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Nahendeh , Mr. Menicoche .

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Permanent Nursing And Policing Services In Wrigley

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 27

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

Mr. Speaker, mahsi cho. Mr. Speaker, there are only a few issues that most rural MLAs raise session after session and that is permanent nursing and policing in the communities. For some communities these issues can be approached individually or making it easier to pursue. For the community of Wrigley these services and commitments are very much connected. This government has indicated that until the police are stationed in Wrigley, Health and Social Services will not station a permanent nurse there. I find this response and approach to be unacceptable. Why is the community of Wrigley being treated different?

The Deh Cho Health and Social Services Authority has already earmarked the necessary funding to station a nurse in Wrigley, so why delay, I ask.

There has been some speculation that a previous nurse felt intimidated and safety was an issue. If the Minister has made these very dramatic policy decisions based on this, why hasn't the ministry conducted a thorough evaluation of those circumstances? This also raises another pressing issue in the Nahendeh and all over the North; funding for safety and protection services through local RCMP presence.

During the previous session in February, Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Justice responded to comments raised by my Nunakput colleague with a possible arrangement whereby a police officer could be stationed in a small community with another peace or enforcement officer. The communities have been requesting for years this type of innovation and flexibility with these interdepartmental services to maximize protective and medical services for small and remote communities. For Wrigley the list of excuses just gets longer, Mr. Speaker.

No nurses unless we get policing; no policing unless we get funding for not two, but 2.5 positions. Huge strain on anybody's resources, especially when all small communities simply ask for better health care and better policing from our government.

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Permanent Nursing And Policing Services In Wrigley

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 27

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

The Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude your statement, Mr. Menicoche .

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Permanent Nursing And Policing Services In Wrigley

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 27

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker and honourable colleagues. Will this government stop increasing our bureaucratic responses and start doing our best for our people? Will this government take their own ideas and follow through on them? Wrigley's needs are everybody's needs, Mr. Speaker: simple community-based health and policing services. Mahsi cho.

---Applause

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Permanent Nursing And Policing Services In Wrigley

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 27

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Nunakput , Mr. Pokiak .

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Infrastructure Needs Of Nunakput

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 27

Calvin Pokiak

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the riding of Nunakput is in dire need of granular material to address their infrastructure needs in my constituency. The access to gravel in most of my constituency can only be accessed during the winter. It may take at least six months to be able to access a quarry site because of different legislations. An example is Inuvialuit land administration.

Mr. Speaker, yesterday the Deputy Premier and the Minister of the NWT Housing Corporation announced that a total of $100 million will be spent to construct 530 adequate and affordable housing units over the next three years. These units may be built as multi-plex or homeownership. Members on this side of the House appreciate the announcement, but because it will address some and not all of the housing shortage across the Northwest Territories. In order to prepare for these units there are a number of obstacles that need to be addressed immediately. By obstacles I am referring to lot availability, access road for dry waste, and construction of power lines for these units.

Mr. Speaker, communities without access to year-round ground material will be a challenge to actually receive these units as identified through the capital plan of the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation. If a community can address their infrastructure requirements to have these available lots and driveways to build these units, what will happen to these units? Will they be carried over to the next fiscal year or allocated somewhere else in the Northwest Territories?

Mr. Speaker, these are just some of the obstacles that NWT Housing Corporation and MACA need to address prior to the construction of the 530 units. These two departments need to immediately construct a plan to address the need for gravel materials for those communities without a year-round access to granular material.

Mr. Speaker, as I indicated earlier, the Beaufort-Delta community needs ample time to plan for the infrastructure needs and require the necessary funds to address these needs. I encourage the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation, MACA to immediately contact the appropriate municipal organizations in Nunakput to help them prepare for these infrastructure requirements. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Infrastructure Needs Of Nunakput

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 27

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Pokiak . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Range Lake , Ms. Lee .

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Effects Of Cost Of Living Increases

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 27

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as advertised, I held a meeting with my constituents at Range Lake North School last night and, although the turnout was not large, it was a valuable and substantial opportunity for me to get an input from my constituents on a number of issues that are before us here in the House and also to hear from them about what's important to them.

Mr. Speaker, I can tell you that we spoke and listened about the new affordable housing initiative, the Yellowknife educational facilities plan, the Deh Cho Bridge project, and lots and lots about a whole issue surrounding WCB, a topic I will speak about later in the session, Mr. Speaker. But another permanent, prominent issue that was raised, which ties into many of the topics I've already mentioned, has to do with the cost of living and cost of doing business in the city.

Mr. Speaker, in terms of how important it is for the government to do all it can to help keep these costs and be mindful of that task in all decisions that it makes. Mr. Speaker, every bit of increase in fuel, power, labour costs, WCB rates and other forms of taxes, have a major impact on running of small businesses. Believe it or not, Mr. Speaker, even though Yellowknife is booming, a lot of national chains consider Yellowknife a very unstable market due to the high cost of doing business.

Mr. Speaker, I'm very proud to represent a riding that has so many businesses that enhance the quality of living for Yellowknifers and the NWT residents. Just this coming weekend I'll have the honour of partaking in the ribbon cutting of another new business, M & M Meats.

But, Mr. Speaker, I have to tell you that the overriding concern constituents had was with keeping Yellowknife's cost of doing business competitive to Alberta because that's who we compete with.

Edmonton is who we are competing with and if we're going to continue to have the kind of businesses that we have, and if we're going to continue to have people move here and stay here, and overall to benefit those who have always been here, it is very important for the government to always be mindful about the accumulative effects of all the little costs and the taxes and all the measures that it takes that impacts on doing business for the North. So, Mr. Speaker, I'm happy to share that today. Thank you.

---Applause

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Effects Of Cost Of Living Increases

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 28

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Ms. Lee . Members' statement. The honourable Member for Sahtu , Mr. Yakeleya .

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Funding For Disability Programs And Services In The Sahtu Region

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 28

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my statement today has to deal with the announcement that Mr. Miltenberger announced yesterday in terms of Disability Awareness Week. I'd like to say that I fully support the initiative that the Minister has taken this government in terms of creating awareness for people in the Northwest Territories during this week to June the 3rd, the theme for living, working, and staying together, including people with disabilities.

Mr. Speaker, this issue here is very close to my heart as my grandfather was disabled in a wheelchair. I'd like to ask this government here, in terms of when will this government look at the Sahtu region and consider funding sources for disability to help set up our region for people with disabilities? He did mention several communities and I was quite upset yesterday in terms of the communities of my region I work with. I know they've been asking me for funding to work with the disabilities and help people in this special need in their life and that this government does fail to recognize that.

Maybe because we don't have a road or maybe because we don't have the connection to the rest of the Northwest Territories, as the other residents, we're left out of this here. So just shame on this government to recognize this and not include the people in the Sahtu. It's almost like the Sahtu people who are in the special fields should boycott the disability week and not have anything to do with this special whole week for people with disabilities. We're shut out the door on this and really that's caused a disability for our people in the region.

There are some good people here who have disabilities and do the job and make a contribution to the community and we're not taking them into consideration. There are other communities who have it and there's also other communities that would, with healthy people, and this funding is for three years. We're shut out of this funding for three years by people. So why bother?

I certainly won't share the much enthusiasm with the Minister during this week in terms of the awareness week, so I wanted to say that. Thank you.

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Funding For Disability Programs And Services In The Sahtu Region

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 28

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre , Mr. Hawkins .

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Supporting Innovation In The Nwt

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 28

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It's my job to challenge the government in order to encourage them to provide the highest quality of life for our people that we represent. Today I wish to speak about the lack of innovation by this government and the lack of encouragement it is offering our local northern innovators. The Association for the Study of Peak Oil points out that we are on the verge of a massive global oil shortage which will result in the skyrocketing oil prices some day soon. But thankfully, Mr. Speaker, the sky isn't falling today.

Although imagine what that will do to a territory that is so dependent on fuels for heating and transportation. Mr. Speaker, our government should know that we are not prepared. We have not done enough to establish alternative energy sources to protect us. What are we doing about creating innovative energy programs? What are we doing to encourage innovation, period?

Mr. Speaker, innovation is a strong characteristic of northerners, and I think the ENR Minister would know that personally. Today I wish to mention about an innovative Yellowknifer who has gone above and beyond to take on new technology to establish smart and wise energy usage. This constituent is using geothermal technology to heat his house. He will be investing his own money in this project; he will be heating his home and his water using heat from the earth. So now he'll be saying goodbye to 90 percent of his home heating oil bill, Mr. Speaker, and I'm sure he won't miss it one ounce.

This constituent, as I do, believes that this government should be interested and seriously looking into types of technology so we can take care of our future and become real partners in our future together. The Department of ENR has offered him advice, Mr. Speaker, but not capital. I said advice; and in this constituent's words, it could be better described as a pat on the back. Even local non-profit agencies such as the Arctic Energy Alliance have had the foresight to help invest money in this project by helping this constituent on this great adventure.

Geothermal technology is already being used across Canada. It's not a new concept, so our government should

be willing to get on board, even on a small scale. I'm very concerned about our future and most certainly where we're being driven because whoever's in the driver's seat needs to take off those blinders to see the signs and where we're going. This territory is an amazing place, Mr. Speaker, and it deserves...

Mr. Speaker, may I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement? Thank you.

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Supporting Innovation In The Nwt

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 29

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

The Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude your statement, Mr. Hawkins .

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Supporting Innovation In The Nwt

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 29

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, colleagues. As I said just a moment ago, this territory is truly an amazing place and its residents deserve innovation from our government and definitely need a reward program that encourages innovation. Mr. Speaker, we need creative thinking and we need it now. I will continue to do my job by challenging the ENR Minister to look out for the best interests of our constituents and our people and to safeguard our future. So later today, Mr. Speaker, I will have thought-provoking questions, which I'm sure the Minister already knows we have a problem out there, and I'm hoping he'll have the courage to help deal with them. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Supporting Innovation In The Nwt

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 29

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes , Mr. McLeod.

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Membership On The Public Utilities Board

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 29

Robert C. McLeod

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, living in the Northwest Territories, we have always had to live with the high cost of living. That is just one of the prices we pay for being up here. Recently, Mr. Speaker, the Public Utilities Board approved a rider increase that has leadership and residents of the Beaufort-Delta very upset. That is putting it mildly. They didn't even contact the Town of Inuvik to see how the rate would affect their community. Does the board not do their research to see if there are other ways to save money and not always have to let the consumer pay? Were they not set up to protect the consumers much as rubberstamp everything that is put in front of them?

Mr. Speaker, two of the five board members no longer live in the NWT, so how can we expect them to look after the best interests of the NWT from down south? I would suggest, Mr. Speaker, that if board members leave the NWT, then they give up their positions that can be filled by people still living here. I am not questioning anybody's qualifications or abilities, Mr. Speaker. The point that I am trying to make is that board positions that were created to regulate the utility cost of the NWT should be filled by residents of the Northwest Territories. Thank you.

---Applause

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Membership On The Public Utilities Board

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 29

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Members' statements. Returns to oral questions. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Frame Lake , Mr. Dent .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 29

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It gives me pleasure to recognize in the gallery a group of provincial and territorial directors from the early childhood education and care from across Canada ranging from Newfoundland to British Columbia, to the Yukon and Nunavut. With them are some of their northern hosts from the Early Childhood Program in Education, Culture and Employment. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 29

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Recognition of visitors in the gallery. I would like to welcome everyone in the gallery today. If we missed anybody, it is certainly a pleasure to have an audience in here, so welcome and I hope you are enjoying the proceedings. Oral questions. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 29

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions today are for the Minister of Justice , the Honourable Brendan Bell . Mr. Bell gave a Minister's statement today talking about community justice and some of the pilot projects and some of the innovative things that are being done on the community justice front in our communities. I have to agree that it would appear that we are gaining good results from some of these things. I would like to commend the Minister and his department for that. However, Mr. Speaker, recently, a situation has been drawn to my attention.

I believe it has been drawn to the Minister's attention as well, where our local courts are being called upon to sentence people who are known to be addicted to crack cocaine. Sometimes these individuals, rather than go to jail, are being given conditional sentences. They are being placed under house arrest.

I would like to ask the Minister if he does not see a gap in that type of scenario where somebody who the courts know is addicted to drugs is sentenced to house arrest and with no other, and obviously instructed to abstain, but with no other resource to back them up at the community level; no other program, counselling, or any direction provided to them and no resource available. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 29

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . The honourable Minister of Justice , Mr. Bell .

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Return To Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 29

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Mr. Speaker, it is very difficult for me to comment on actual sentencing because that is under the purview of the courts, but I would agree that we need to have support and resources in our communities for those who need treatment. There is a lot of discussion currently around the use of conditional sentencing. I know the Members are all aware of the federal proposal to hold conditional sentencing and use it only for less serious crimes and not allow it in situations where violent crimes have been committed, sex crimes, crimes against

children. It is certainly something that I support that we not use conditional sentences in those cases. But in terms of the latitude that the courts and judges have now, that is not something that we are obviously involved in. But I would say that, as a government, we have a responsibility to ensure that there are community resources to deal with addictions. We are certainly working on a number of initiatives. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Supplementary To Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think that the Minister and everyone in this room or Chamber know that the community resources are not there to deal with drug addictions in many cases and particularly in the smaller communities. To sentence people to house arrest who are drug addicted seems like a bit of a recipe for disaster or for failure for those individuals. I would like to ask the Minister if he has room in the jails for these people. If we don't have the resources to provide counselling and help for these people who are drug addicted, does he have room in his jails for them today? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Mr. Bell .

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Further Return To Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Mr. Speaker, obviously, it is not our hope or intention that we set people up to fail and somehow they end up back in our court system and back into our jails. We do need to do a comprehensive job as a government, making sure there are treatment options. We need to work in our corrections system to make sure that those who are in our facilities have access to these supports. I think we do a number of things that are very good. Are there needs and are there gaps? Yes, there are, Mr. Speaker. I would certainly acknowledge that. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Supplementary To Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Mr. Speaker, this is my final question. I wonder if the Minister would commit to working with the Minister of Health and Social Services to do a cost-benefit analysis on providing those resources in the communities to deal with those folks who are in court as a result of drug addictions to see which is the more economic and humane route for this government to provide the resources to support those people in their efforts to get away from those addictions, or to look at the cost of where they are ultimately going to end up and that is in jail. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Mr. Bell .

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Further Return To Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Mr. Speaker, I am certainly willing to sit down with the Minister of Health , but I think we all recognize and acknowledge and take the Member's point. We certainly provide people a disservice if we do not provide them with the treatment and help they need. Obviously, there are personal choices to be made here. But we also have to live up to our end of the bargain, which is to make sure there are resources available, Mr. Speaker. It is a last resort to lock people up. We are certainly not trying to do that. We are not trying to unnecessarily lock people up when there are other options.

I think that and will commit that, as a government, we will continue to work on treatment options. I know the Minister of Health has a personal interest in ensuring that we do that, as does our entire government. So we will continue on that course. I will have discussions with him and certainly invite discussion with committee as I know the Minister of Health would as well. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Question 8-15(5): Sentencing Terms For Persons With Addictions

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Villeneuve .

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Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. My question here today is for the Minister of Environment and Natural Resources just relating to our recycling program which rolled out last year. I know that the program has been receiving good reviews and good public participation. That is a good direction that everybody in the North has taken seriously. My concern is with the smaller community depots, Mr. Speaker, that rely on the larger deposit centres in the urban areas to drop off all their recyclable materials. There seems to be some discrepancy on how these materials are refunded and paid for.

In the smaller communities, the small depots are paying per unit on the cans and the bottles and the containers that they are taking in and they are bringing them to the larger centres. The larger centres are telling them that they are basing them on the weight that they are bringing in. There is some discrepancy on the refunding and the receiving of the money that they have dished out in collecting the recyclables. I am just wondering what the policy is of the government on the recycling. Is it based on the number of cans or bottles, or by the weight? Can the Minister just answer that first? Thanks.

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Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . The honourable Minister of Environment and Natural Resources , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Return To Question 9-15(5): Nwt Recycle Program Policies

Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the cash in your trash is based on a price per container. Thank you.

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Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve .

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Supplementary To Question 9-15(5): Nwt Recycle Program Policies

Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 30

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. If the cash for your trash is based on the per unit, what is the

government doing to ensure that when there is a discrepancy between the large centres and the smaller centres that are transporting all of these materials to their depot, that they are communicated that the government policy is on a per unit basis and not on a per weight? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 9-15(5): Nwt Recycle Program Policies

Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 9-15(5): Nwt Recycle Program Policies

Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Now that I have been made aware of this discrepancy as the Member has indicated, then we will be following up today and tomorrow to ensure that the proper facts are communicated to all of the participants in this program. Thank you.

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Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve .

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Supplementary To Question 9-15(5): Nwt Recycle Program Policies

Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It is good to know that the Minister will be sending out some kind of a memo to all of the main operators. Is there any avenue in our appeal mechanism that the government would have? Is there an office that these small depot operators can call when there is a dispute and that they can get some mitigation to resolve it? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 9-15(5): Nwt Recycle Program Policies

Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 9-15(5): Nwt Recycle Program Policies

Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would recommend that, if there are questions in any particular community, they contact the local ENR officer or the local regional office. They should be able to hopefully resolve the issues and clarify any misunderstandings. Thank you.

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Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Final supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve .

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Supplementary To Question 9-15(5): Nwt Recycle Program Policies

Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is just for the Minister's information. I am sure he is well aware that a lot of these small centres don't have Renewable Resource officers. They don't have ENR officers. When they do phone the ENR office in Yellowknife, Hay River, the South Slave, North Slave, or the Inuvik office from these remote communities, these calls usually go unanswered, then these people just give up. I know of a few small community depots that are just shutting down because they are not getting any feedback from the government.

They are not getting any support in trying to mitigate these disputes that they are having with the larger operators. The larger operators are definitely not taking up their small community concerns to the government because there is a dispute in place. How can people get some positive feedback from the government in saying, yes, we can look into it and we will check into your concern? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 9-15(5): Nwt Recycle Program Policies

Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 9-15(5): Nwt Recycle Program Policies

Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. If the Member would provide me with the detail of the information that he has talked about in the communities and contractors that he is referring to, I will ensure that they are followed up with and that we can clarify circumstances and make sure that they have the support they need. We can hopefully resolve this issue and maintain and continue the recycling program. Thank you.

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Question 9-15(5): NWT Recycle Program Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Monfwi, Mr. Lafferty .

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Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. (Translation) My previous statement regarding payment to elders, I would like to ask a question. Can they make some kind of arrangement with community services with the new government? There is a lot of concern regarding this from the elders. (Translation ends)

...trip worth for many years negotiating an agreement because they knew that it was self-government. We could do a better job of serving our people than the GNWT or DIAND. We did not go to all this trouble only to have GNWT bureaucracy imposed on us. This is a question to the Minister of the Financial Management Board Secretariat. In light of this government's position on the value of traditional knowledge as passed by my elders, will the Minister commit to making whatever policy changes or arrangements that are necessary to allow the Tlicho Community Services Agency to pay elders for their services within a day? Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . The honourable Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board Secretariat, Mr. Roland .

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Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the issue has arisen as a result of the payroll systems being amalgamated where we would use one system of pay. Previously, boards and agencies outside our system or who had their own systems would cut off-cycle cheques. Since being requested to be incorporated in our payroll system, this issue has arisen. We have been working together with Education, trying to come up with another form of off-cycle cheques being issued. Part of the problem is that we need to try to shorten that timeline. Right now, they have fallen into the casual payroll system.

To try to shorten that timeline, we would need the information from the Tlicho group or agency in advance of who would be paid, how many days they would be working and then we might be able to try to do something. So we are working on an avenue to try to bring that closer together. Thank you.

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Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 31

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty .

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Supplementary To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as I indicated in my previous Member's statement, the Tlicho Community Services Agency is in a unique position. We are a new government since August 4th of last year. So we are different from any organizations here in the North and also throughout Canada. My next question leads on to...Can the Minister please clarify how he can continue to impose four to six-week delays on payments to the elders from the Tlicho Community Services Agency despite the clear wishes of the Tlicho Government that is consistent with the spirit and the letter of the Tlicho Agreement that was signed by three parties in the government service agreement, and, Mr. Speaker, in particular,

section 3.2(a)? Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Mr. Roland .

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Further Return To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the problem arises when we have an individual or, in this case, elders who would come to work for a school board or an agency and they would only come as and when, once every few weeks, once a month or maybe even less than that, depending on what information they were going to provide. That is a difficult portion because our systems right now, as we run our payroll system, do not adequately address that. That is an issue. We have been trying to work with Education around this area to accommodate the request.

Part of the problem, as we work our system and try to be more accountable with how we pay individuals, is that if somebody comes in and works for half a day and not a full day, then we have to go back and try to recover that. It makes it very difficult. So they are trying to work on an issue of getting some advance notice of who would be coming in and what time they would come in, and then we could try to work around that issue. We are going to try to work and reduce the amount of time. I am not sure if we can get it right down to a one-day turnaround as was done in the past.

We are working to try to reduce the time from less than six weeks. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty .

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Supplementary To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am just wondering if the Minister or his department has looked into a contractual basis where they hire an elder on an as-needed basis and they can be paid within the next few days, as opposed to waiting four to six weeks. Can the Minister advise this House if they have looked at the option? Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Mr. Roland .

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Further Return To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, when we start branching into the area of contracts, that brings a whole new set of rules on its own. Part of the issue is that we had to go down this path of going onto one payroll system is that departments, boards and agencies had too many different systems out there causing a lot of grief for those that would get payroll and then have some changes that needed to be made. We had to go back after the fact. I think there is an opportunity here.

If we can work out an arrangement with the Tlicho agency on the timing of when individuals come in, if we had advance notice of when individuals come in, who they are, and how long they would be there for, we could then be prepared to try to accommodate that and shorten the time frame to possibly a week or less. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Your final supplementary, Mr. Lafferty .

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Supplementary To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my final question to the Minister is, I am just wondering if the Minister can meet with the Tlicho Community Services Agency and come up with a possible solution to this whole ordeal, possibly setting up a petty cash agreement where we hire elders on an as-needed basis so we have petty cash on hand. We hire elders at times here and there for cultural events. So I am just wondering if the Minister can meet with the Tlicho Community Services Agency and set up a system where we can pay elders possibly out of a petty cash fund that could be available to them. Mahsi.

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Supplementary To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Mr. Roland .

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Further Return To Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there are a number of issues that would come up just sitting here thinking about it. So instead of getting into that detail in this forum and possibly making some errors in the response, what I would suggest is that I know there's been ongoing discussions and we've had some meetings in the past, I will direct people from within our payroll systems to meet with the agency and try to come up with something that's appropriate. Part of it could be, as I said, simply a matter of knowing in advance who is going to be working for what time period and that would help reduce that amount of waiting. Thank you.

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Question 10-15(5): Compensation Policies For Elders Providing Services To Government

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Oral questions. The honourable Member from Yellowknife Centre , Mr. Hawkins .

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Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 32

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I believe we have a real problem here and I think the ENR Minister can solve it by doing something today. My optimism tells me he's got the leadership and wherewithal,

so let's settle it today by making a clear statement by supporting innovative programs out there. Mr. Speaker, we have real problems so we need real solutions. So where is the policy to support innovative programs for energy saving conservation investments in our Northwest Territories and in our people? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . The honourable Minister responsible for Environment and Natural Resources , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we provide substantive funding, along with other departments, to the Arctic Energy Alliance, who is our working arm in terms of energy conservation. This government, as well, has set up its own Energy Conservation Program to support initiatives, retrofitting, looking at new technologies and innovative ways to save energy. We've also combined, partnered up that money with money from the federal government. In this case, there has been assistance provided to the individual in question, money and technical support that is helping advance the work that he's doing. Thank you.

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Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins .

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Supplementary To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think the Minister hot potatoed that right over to the Arctic Energy Alliance. Maybe I am wasting my time asking ENR questions and I should march down to Arctic Energy Alliance about their support. But, Mr. Speaker, this is about a lack of policy. This is about a lack of programs. This is about the lack of attention about who's in the driver's seat about this problem because if the ENR Minister isn't willing to do anything about this, I'm going to ask him who will. So, Mr.

Speaker, where is the policy to set up support programs so local folks, the everyday average Joe, can get out there and say I'm going to put energy technology into my house and I'm going to tap into a support program from this government? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, very clearly the leadership lies with the seven Members comprising of Cabinet, with myself and Mr. Bell who are tasked with bringing forward first the discussion on the White Paper on the Energy Strategy and we've committed to bringing forward the formal Energy Strategy by this coming fall, which will address that and many other issues and provide a framework, provide the direction and the policy base for us to move forward into this, as the Member has indicated, very important area. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins .

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Supplementary To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Now we're starting to drill down to real answers and real responses. Thank you, Minister. Okay, so the fact is we're now talking about an energy strategy. So recognizing the feds are cutting some of these energy dollars that go out to help real people and now that we're down to the fact that we need the Energy and Natural Resources Minister to set up programs and policies, where are our policies to help these average people who are building houses who want to tap into energy smart technology? Where is the policy? Are we playing Where's Waldo here? Where is the policy? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I just laid out to the Member what the plan is. We've met with committee; a presentation has been done; we're going to be releasing the White Paper on the Energy Strategy. We're going to follow that up with a more formal document. In the meantime, there's existing programs available through the Arctic Energy Alliance, some through the federal government, there's been some technical support and those programs are currently on the books and operational pending the outcome of the discussions and feedback and consultation with the White Paper and the more formal actual document that's going to be brought forward this fall. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Your final supplementary, Mr. Hawkins .

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Supplementary To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

We're still missing the results of the policy, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we're still talking about the Energy Strategy. We're talking about hot potatoeing it. Where is the leadership from this government that says energy policy, the policy that says we'll do things smart, we're setting up programs? We're talking about a strategy, we're throwing it away and saying go to the Arctic Energy Alliance, we're saying we're marrying many things, but yet at the end of the day where is the policy that says this government will set up programs to help the average Northwest Territories citizen? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 33

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Mr. Chairman, there's been at least two...Sorry, Mr. Speaker. There's been at least two briefings that I can recollect in recent weeks and months where we've laid out in considerable detail all the work that's being done across government to look at energy conservation, alleviating the high cost of living, the impact of rising energy costs, what we're doing as a government to make government more efficient, what we're doing as a government to work with the

communities and the individuals and businesses to assist them to make the necessary steps on the energy conservation side. That is all there. It's been presented to committee. I can share it with the Member if he is having trouble locating that information and would be happy to do that. It would take up a lot of extra paper and a lot of extra energy, but we're prepared to invest that because it is a big issue keeping the Member informed. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Question 11-15(5): Support For Innovation In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Oral questions. The honourable Member from Great Slave , Mr. Braden .

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Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. My questions this afternoon are for Mr. Dent , the Minister responsible for the Workers' Compensation Board of the NWT and Nunavut, and it relates to the efforts by an injured worker to have his appeal heard before a freshly constituted board. Mr. Speaker, it's rare that an injured worker's appeal makes its way all the way to the Supreme Court. The onus is almost always on the worker to shoulder the expense, and the time, and the burden, and the energy that's required to get it this way, and I think it's to Mr.

Valic's credit that he has persisted over the years to challenge and win these judgments. Now he is still a long, long way from actually receiving any tangible result. He still actually has, for instance, to get a favourable decision from this new tribunal and that is what I want to focus on, Mr. Speaker. So the question that I have now, 19 years after his accident, five years after he started action to appeal decisions and now six months after a Supreme Court ruling, Mr. Valic still waits to be heard. Why has it taken so long to assemble the fresh panel of tribunal adjudicators to rehear Mr. Valic's case, Mr.

Speaker?

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Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Braden . The honourable Minister responsible for the Workers' Compensation Board, Mr. Dent .

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Return To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The reason is because Mr. Valic and his solicitor have determined that the public interest representative on the panel, the appeals tribunal right now, who would be available to hear the case is not suitable. Their argument is that she was involved in the case. I have been assured by her that she has never even read the file, but they have decided that they wanted a new person. So in order to achieve that, we've had to advertise for additional members of the appeals tribunal. That's been done and, as the Member noted in his statement today, it is the closing day for applications.

I will review those applications very quickly and move to have somebody appointed as quickly as possible. Thank you.

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Return To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Supplementary, Mr. Braden .

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Supplementary To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the answer, but it is quite consistent with the kind of responses we've had from the WCB on such a range of issues. There is never any issue of whether or not there may be some fault or some lack of consideration or process at the WCB. The ability of the WCB to put a fresh panel forward is really what's at question here. So we're now coming up to six months, Mr. Speaker, for this process to grind its way along. Now I'm hopeful that qualified tribunal members will come forward from this latest process, but I anticipate that there's going to be training and orientation required.

So when may Mr. Valic expect to actually have his day before this fresh appeal tribunal, Mr. Speaker?

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Supplementary To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Braden . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It had been the hope of the appeals tribunal that they could have heard this case much more quickly, and it was the opinion of the tribunal and their legal counsel that they could put together a freshly constituted appeals tribunal to hear this case right away when the decision was made to hear it. However, since Mr. Valic and his counsel have rejected one of the members, we are working with all due haste to try and put one together. I can't say exactly when that hearing will be able to be held, but I can assure the Member that the appeals tribunal will work with Mr. Valic's counsel to try and

schedule as soon as mutually possible, as soon as a mutually acceptable date can be found. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Supplementary, Mr. Braden .

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Supplementary To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Mr. Speaker, to the ruling delivered on December 14th last year by Justice Schuler of the NWT Supreme Court, there were two significant areas here in which the WCB were found at fault. One related to the denial of natural justice to this injured worker and the other to a violation of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. These are significant pieces of law and policy and administration. Significant, Mr. Speaker.

I would like to know what steps are being taken by the WCB to hold to account those officers who allowed these positions to be taken and persisted in endorsing them and actually drove this worker all the way to the Supreme Court to actually have it found that these positions were unjust. How are those officers being held to account, Mr. Speaker?

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Supplementary To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Braden . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 34

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think it's important to note that the WCB recognizes chronic pain syndrome as a compensable injury. There was some difference of opinion as to whether or not it fits in the disability tables, but the issue is one of whether or not compensation is being paid. The WCB says, or will accept chronic pain as a compensable injury. Each case is dealt with on an individual basis and it doesn't fit into a standard table as some of the other injuries do; for instance, the loss of a thumb or the loss of a foot in which there is a standard sort of response. Each case is being examined on its own and sometimes the pension could be allowed. In fact, a pension is often

allowed and treatment is typically provided. So there has not been any individual wrongdoing here in these cases. This is a situation where the judge was not satisfied with the manner in which the appeals tribunal and the Workers' Compensation Board handled the case and has directed that it be looked at again, and that is exactly what both the WCB and the AT will do. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 35

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Your final supplementary, Mr. Braden .

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Supplementary To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 35

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm not a lawyer and I'm not going to attempt to turn the Chamber into a courtroom, but the point was the decisions and the policy and the practice undertaken by the WCB as it relates to Mr. Valic were a violation of the Charter. It found that the way in which it treated Mr. Valic and others who have come forward with chronic pain syndrome was different than the way they were treated from workers with other conventional kinds of injuries, if you will, Mr. Speaker. So that is the point where the WCB was found at fault.

That was the point that the officers and the people or the experts of the WCB we rely on, who injured workers rely on to get fair hearings and fair decisions were let down. So this is not some trivial area of misinterpretation. This is a serious, a very serious impact on these workers. What is being done to hold the officers of the WCB to account for this type of action, Mr. Speaker?

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Supplementary To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 35

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Braden . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 35

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The judge did not say that anybody wilfully did something that was not acceptable. The judge said that she found that they had made the wrong decision and that, in her opinion, it needed to be re-examined. So this is not a situation, if you care to look at the judgment, that there was any indication that an individual was found to have done anything wrong. So, Mr.

Speaker, in terms of who is going to be held to account, the WCB has had the ruling of the court, it's looked at it, the Governance Council has agreed not to appeal the case, the appeals tribunal is prepared to rehear the case as soon as a freshly constituted panel can be put in place and, as the judge said, it might not be realistic to expect it to happen within 60 days and that has proven to be the case. But the appeals tribunal is moving as quickly as possible to deal with the issues. The Governance Council has also taken the opportunity to, or taken the occasion to review its policy on chronic pain.

They have undertaken that review and will finalize that review at their next formal meeting and we'll have, I suspect, a new policy in place. But I think it's important to understand that with or without that policy, chronic pain is seen as a compensable injury and each case is looked at on an individual basis. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 12-15(5): Wcb Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Question 12-15(5): WCB Appeals Tribunal Rehearing For Ivan Valic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 35

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Oral questions. The honourable Member from Kam Lake , Mr. Ramsay .

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