Budget — 18 October 2004 (15th Assembly, 3rd Session, pp. 795–818)
2004-10-18, 15th Assembly 3rd Session, pp. 795–818
Northwest Territories — Debates (Hansard)
Debates of Oct. 18th, 2004
This is page numbers 795 - 818 of the Hansard for the 15th Assembly, 3rd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.
The word of the day was legal .
Topics
Members Present
Item 1: Prayer
NWT Council Of Sport And Recreation Partners
Student Financial Assistance Concerns
Location Of The New Legal Aid Office
Support For The GNWT Technology Service Centre
Housing Needs In Nahendeh
Youth Relocating In Pursuit Of Education
Waste Reduction Week
Addictions Treatment In The Sahtu Region
Location Of The New Legal Aid Office
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
New Legal Aid Office Lease
Housing Assessment In Fort Liard
Details Of Additional Federal Health Funding
New Legal Aid Office Lease
Speaker's Ruling
Closure Of Trapping Facility In Vegreville
Written Question 38-15(3): Guidelines And Processes For Sole Source And Negotiated Contracts
Written Question 39-15(3): Budget For Legal Aid Office
Written Question 40-15(3): Costs And Uptake Of Alcohol And Drug Programs In The Sahtu
Tabled Document 70-15(3): NWT Council Of Sport And Recreation Partners Implementation Plan, October 2004
Tabled Document 71-15(3): Status Of Women Council Of The NWT 2003-2004 Annual Report
Bill 15: Tlicho Community Services Agency Act
Bill 16: NWT Business Development And Investment Corporation Act
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole
Bill 9: Write-off Of Assets And Debts Act, 2004-2005
Item 22: Orders Of The Day
Members Present
Honourable Brendan Bell , Mr. Braden , Honourable Paul Delorey , Honourable Charles Dent , Mrs. Groenewegen , Honourable Joe Handley , Mr. Hawkins , Honourable David Krutko , Ms. Lee , Honourable Michael McLeod , Mr. Menicoche , Honourable Michael Miltenberger , Mr. Pokiak , Mr. Ramsay , Honourable Floyd Roland , Mr. Villeneuve , Mr. Yakeleya , Mr. Zoe
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---Prayer
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Item 1: Prayer
Item 1: Prayer
Page 795
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Good afternoon, Members. Welcome back to the House for another week of business. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs , Michael McLeod .
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Minister's Statement 53-15(3): NWT Council Of Sport And Recreation Partners
Item 2: Ministers' Statements
Page 795
Michael McLeod
Deh Cho
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today I am pleased to provide an update on the status of the Northwest Territories Council of Sport and Recreation Partners. For some time now, the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs has been working in cooperation with stakeholders within the territorial sport and recreation system to find ways to improve the overall effectiveness of the system.
During consultation on this issue over the past few years, several key themes emerged. We heard that there needs to be a forum where all communities and partners can have a voice in planning and decision-making for the system. We heard that there is a need to streamline decision-making and to improve program coordination among all the partners. Most important of all, we heard that all the stakeholders agree that we need to expand the opportunities for all Northwest Territories residents to access sport, recreation and physical activity programs in order to improve personal health and community well-being.
Not surprisingly, everyone agrees that we need to find ways to access new resources to support these activities.
To best address these issues, a facilitated process was set up involving all the Northwest Territories sport and recreation partners.
In March 2003, agreement was reached among the partners that these objectives could be met through the establishment of a Northwest Territories Council of Sport and Recreation Partners.
In the year following that decision, work was undertaken by the partners to develop a vision and mandate statement, propose an organization structure and complete some other steps necessary for the establishment of the council. My predecessors and I also worked with Members of the Legislative Assembly and partners to answer concerns and address issues raised by the council.
Originally, the council was to be established last April. Because some stakeholders continued to express concerns, implementation was delayed to allow discussion to continue.
Over this past summer, I committed to a final round of consultations and also agreed to fund the final partners meeting so that stakeholders could discuss the work completed to date and provide recommendations on the establishment of the council. Mr. Speaker, I am very pleased to report that as a result of this detailed consultation process and the work of the Northwest Territories sport and recreation partners during their meeting in September, the next steps in establishing the council are now getting underway and it will be in operation effective April 2005. Full details will be made available to Members when I table the implementation plan in the Legislative Assembly later today.
At this time, I would like to extend my thanks to my predecessors and all of the partner organizations for their ongoing commitment to this initiative. It was not always easy, and there were certainly differences of opinion, but all individuals were professional in their approach and clearly were striving to achieve the best possible sport and recreation system in the Northwest Territories.
Specifically, I wish to thank former Ministers Jim Antoine, Roger Allen, Vince Steen and Henry Zoe ; Allan Landry of Kakisa and Roy Desjarlais of Yellowknife representing the Aboriginal Sport Circle of the Western Arctic; Clifford McLeod of Fort Providence and Todd Shafer of Hay River representing the Mackenzie Recreation Association; Janna Bulmer of Tuktoyaktuk and Victor Stewart of Fort McPherson representing the Beaufort-Delta/Sahtu Recreation Association; Theresa Ross of Inuvik and Julian Tomlinson of Inuvik representing the Northwest Territories Recreation and Parks Association; and, Abe Theil of Yellowknife, Richard Daitch of Fort Smith, Gary Hoffman of Hay River, and Ron Graf and Doug Rentmeister of Yellowknife representing the Sport North Federation.
Mr. Speaker, this is a pivotal time in the sport and recreation system. There has never been as much pressure to support our residents to lead healthy, active lives for their own benefit, and to consequently reduce the enormous stresses on our health care system.
The creation of the new Northwest Territories Council of Sport and Recreation Partners will provide the structure and the coordination necessary to develop a stronger and more efficient sport and recreation system, one that will consider the needs of all communities and all partners and lead the way in establishing healthier communities. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Minister's Statement 53-15(3): NWT Council Of Sport And Recreation Partners
Item 2: Ministers' Statements
Page 795
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. McLeod . Item 2, Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .
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Student Financial Assistance Concerns
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 796
Jane Groenewegen
Hay River South
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to raise my concerns regarding northern students who have received GNWT Student Financial Assistance to attend college and university. At present, we have a number of students who are suffering financially, and it is because of the policies of this government that these students are in jeopardy of not being able to afford to complete their education. It has recently come to my attention that verification of a student's requirements for SFA is not being confirmed prior to disbursing funds for the second semester of the school year.
Student transcripts are not requested between semesters nor are we receiving any kind of confirmation of completion of studies, which leaves many students at risk for being requested to refund their entire year.
If a student does not completely understand the impact of non-compliance, by withdrawing from a course or not obtaining their required percentage of a full course load to continue in the SFA program, the consequences are devastating. Some students have unknowingly deviated from regulations and are not aware that they have even caused an infraction in the first semester. They are not notified that they have breached the regulations until the end of the school year.
I am aware of three students from Hay River who have been requested to return their full year of SFA funding prior to being able to reapply for assistance for the next school year. This demand for repayment was received only a few short weeks before they were scheduled to return to school.
These are full-time students, unemployed or working part-time to subsidize their living expenses while at school. Most students do not have sufficient funds to carry them through the school year without assistance from parents or a part-time job. How would we expect them to repay thousands of dollars within two or three weeks of starting their next school year? Without the option for applying for alternative student loans, which is not acceptable to SFA, these students must depend on their parents who are not always able to come up with thousands of dollars to repay this debt for them.
This could mean the end of their education, Mr. Speaker. There must be a more efficient and effective way to monitor a student's performance in the first semester, so that it isn't necessary to present them with a bill for their full year of education at the end of the second semester if they deviated inadvertently from the regulations.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement. Thank you.
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Student Financial Assistance Concerns
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 796
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . The Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude her statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays, Mrs. Groenewegen . You may conclude your statement.
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Student Financial Assistance Concerns
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 796
Jane Groenewegen
Hay River South
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We ask our young people to return to their home here in the Northwest Territories to work, and we are in desperate need of these graduates and their educational experience to complement our northern workforce. It is unrealistic and unfair to be penalizing these students at the end of the year. There must be a mechanism put in place to prevent this type of nightmare from happening to any more students. Mr. Speaker, I will have questions today for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment regarding this important subject. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
---Applause
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Student Financial Assistance Concerns
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 796
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Kam Lake , Mr. Ramsay .
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Location Of The New Legal Aid Office
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 796
David Ramsay
Kam Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. On Friday, I had some questions to the Minister of Public Works on the location of the new Family Law Legal Aid office in Yellowknife. I would like to use my Member's statement today to again address this decision.
I am a very strong supporter of this new office being opened in Yellowknife and it is long overdue. One of the main reasons that it has taken so long to open this office is the fact that funding it on an ongoing basis was going to be problematic for the department. The space was sole-sourced after the RFP closed and it is to be located inside Centre Square Mall. This is prime retail space in a shopping mall, Mr. Speaker. This government is going to be spending more money than it has to to locate in this space. The clientele of this new office should not have to go through a busy shopping mall to access the service of legal aid lawyers.
Also, the leasehold improvements of what had been retail space to a full-fledged operating law office is too much money to pay. It only makes sense that the less money you spend on the operation and maintenance, the more that will flow through to the people who really need it and that is the clients. It also hurts retailers located in the mall, Mr. Speaker, as they need to work collectively to attract consumers to that mall.
Of course, the landlord is happy in that it has a deal with Public Works. It's hard to beat the government as a solid tenant, and it is no fault of the landlord, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, in closing, I just want to reiterate that we are, over the life of this lease, going to be taking away valuable resources from the many clients out there who are in dire need of legal aid. It is a shame that no one stopped to think about the clients and the resources needed to meet their needs. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
---Applause
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Location Of The New Legal Aid Office
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 796
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre , Mr. Hawkins .
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Support For The GNWT Technology Service Centre
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 796
Robert Hawkins
Yellowknife Centre
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to talk about the technology services centre, also referred to as the TSC, and their current voluntary compliance with that centre.
Mr. Speaker, since I was elected in the 15th Assembly last year, I have been quite vocal about my support for the TSC. I believe that this position is shared by many of my colleagues here in the House. Today, in this day and age,
IT services are absolutely vital in running a government bureaucracy. As everyone knows, it takes up a big piece of our budget.
In the 2004-05 Main Estimates, Mr. Speaker, we spent about $5 million in IT service chargebacks. During times of fiscal restraint, it is absolutely essential that we spend our IT dollars wisely and we get optimum value for those dollars. We need to pool our resources using departments, boards, agencies and even corporations. To be more efficient, we have to do that. Mr. Speaker, it is all about a consistent and coordinated system and approach. That's why the GNWT has created a centralized IT
section called the TSC.
Mr. Speaker, during main estimates review in Committee of the Whole, the Minister responsible for FMBS advised committee that the 14th Assembly planned and created the TSC, but they created a system where people could voluntarily comply. Basically, boards and agencies, corporations and commissions either had the option to participate or they could opt out, so it was strictly based on their choice.
As most of us here know, most departments and agencies have opted in. I would like to point out the fact that this has created a centralized-wide process where we are able to share services where appropriate, and I have to stress it has to be where appropriate because not in all cases will it be an appropriate measure to consolidate.
Mr. Speaker, this brings me to my point. The NWT Housing Corporation has not opted in. In other words, they are being kept separate. It is my opinion, Mr. Speaker, that utilizing a centralized IT service should not be an option. Mr. Speaker, two other GNWT corporations, the WCB and the Power Corporation, are in this program. So I really see no reason why we should be treating the NWT Housing Corporation any differently.
Mr. Speaker, during the 14th Assembly, it was considered an option, but the 14th Assembly does not rule over the 15th Assembly, so it's time to make this voluntary...
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Support For The GNWT Technology Service Centre
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 797
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Mr. Hawkins , your time for your Member's statement has expired.
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Support For The GNWT Technology Service Centre
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 797
Robert Hawkins
Yellowknife Centre
Speaker, I would like to seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement. Thank you.
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Support For The GNWT Technology Service Centre
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 797
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
The Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude your statement, Mr. Hawkins .
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Support For The GNWT Technology Service Centre
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 797
Robert Hawkins
Yellowknife Centre
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, colleagues, especially the Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation . Mr. Speaker, it is time that we move from a voluntary compliance to a mandatory policy. I would like to see the Minister responsible for FMBS work with the Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation to create a mandatory policy where we bring the Housing Corporation into the fold with the rest of the government. Mr. Speaker, in closing, I will have questions for the appropriate Minister later during oral question period. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Support For The GNWT Technology Service Centre
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 797
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Nahendeh , Mr. Menicoche .
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Housing Needs In Nahendeh
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 797
Kevin A. Menicoche
Nahendeh
Mr. Speaker, adequate and affordable housing continues to be a major problem across the territory and in smaller communities particularly. I refer to the 2004 survey of our community housing needs released by the NWT Housing Corporation. The report states that 29 percent of the territorial households have some form of housing problem. About half of those problems are identified as core need, meaning that the cost of repairs exceeds the ability of the homeowners to pay. The situation is more acute when we look at regional statistics.
In my riding of Nahendeh, 42 percent of householders have housing problems of some sort. That is 319 households with problems, out of a total of 754. One-hundred-ninety-one have been identified as core need. According to my calculations, that means almost 60 percent of householders in Nahendeh have problems that they can't afford to fix.
As disturbing as this situation is, the picture looks even bleaker when we examine the housing situation in specific communities. Of major concern in my riding is the community of Fort Liard. Here is what we are looking at in Fort Liard: 91 households have housing problems, that is exactly half, or 50 percent; of those 91 householders with problems, 59 of them have been identified as core need. That works out to 65 percent. What particularly concerns me in Fort Liard is the condition of housing for elders.
I cannot say why exactly, but, for some reason, the provision of adequate housing for elders in this community has fallen short of what is provided elsewhere. We can also be certain that any elder with a housing problem would be core need, meaning that they are unable to effectively care for themselves.
The NWT Housing Corporation estimates that approximately $750,000 will be needed to address the problems in Fort Liard alone and bring housing conditions up to par. So far, the government has budgeted only $250,000. That is a start, Mr. Speaker, but it is only a start. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my Member's statement.
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Housing Needs In Nahendeh
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 797
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
The Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude your statement, Mr. Menicoche .
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Housing Needs In Nahendeh
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 797
Kevin A. Menicoche
Nahendeh
Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my honourable colleagues for allowing me to conclude my statement. There is still a long way to go, and I look forward to hearing from the government as to when we will be going the rest of the distance. I am pleased, Mr. Speaker, that the Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation will be coming to Fort Liard in a few weeks' time to hear from the residents firsthand. This is a very positive gesture on his part, and I am looking forward to him coming and being ready to listen to the community, because people in this community most definitely will be prepared for the housing Minister. Mahsi cho.
---Applause
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Housing Needs In Nahendeh
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 797
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Menicoche . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Villeneuve .
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Youth Relocating In Pursuit Of Education
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 798
Robert Villeneuve
Tu Nedhe
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I use my Member's statement to talk about some of the problems our youth are being subjected to today, specifically on education. I am not talking about the costs families are faced with in relocating their children to the larger centres to receive a better education, but the negative societal impact we will be encountering in the future from the disruption of family stability as a consequence of geographical relocation in pursuit of the economic independence and benefits received when living in the larger commercial areas.
Mr. Speaker, the youth that were receiving education in the smaller remote communities who are now relocated to the larger centres, because of their parents having chosen to move, are opting to quit school because of peer pressure, pressure to keep up with classmates who have had better educational foundations and support mechanisms which enable them to keep pace with the growing demands of our school curriculum. Mr. Speaker, it is an admirable trait to seek better employment or educational opportunities to ensure the well-being of the family, but we need to take into account the effect this economic displacement has to our youth.
Mr. Speaker, I have received concerns from families faced with this dilemma. It seems that there is little or no information available, or very little directly focused counselling services for parents and children, and no proactive support programs to address this issue and bring kids back into the regular school programs that they should be in. Mr.
Speaker, I feel that with the growing number of remote community families relocating to the larger centres, the number of youth dropping out or refraining from enrolment will increase proportionately, therefore leading to increased social costs in areas related to youth crimes, youth justice and also many other associated costs such as those related to family violence.
Mr. Speaker, I would encourage this government to pay heed to these and other social indicators so that we can work towards addressing them promptly and possibly resolving and/or reducing these growing numbers before they become the norm of our social northern fabric. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.
---Applause
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Youth Relocating In Pursuit Of Education
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 798
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Great Slave , Mr. Braden .
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Waste Reduction Week
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 798
Bill Braden
Great Slave
Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to recognize that today is the first day of Waste Reduction Week in Canada. The majority of the people here in the NWT would probably claim to be environmentally friendly. It is something that certainly fits our lifestyle and our image, but I am wondering, Mr. Speaker, if we really looked at ourselves, do we really demonstrate that our personal lifestyles and our choices and our habits prove this? I look around this Assembly, Mr. Speaker; there is a lot of horsepower here, but there is a lot of horsepower out in the parking lot, too.
You should go and have a look at the number of SUVs and the big trucks that are parked out there that we use. These are choices that we have made. Are we really demonstrating that we are being environmentally friendly and responsible in these kinds of choices? It is something that we should all ask ourselves.
In greenhouse gases in the Northwest Territories, Mr. Speaker, the NWT produces 30 tons per person, compared to the national average of 21 tons. Energy consumption in the NWT on a per capita basis is the third highest in Canada, behind Alberta and Saskatchewan as a result of their agriculture and their energy sectors. It is kind of hard to turn this around. Perhaps if we take chances or take action to change our lifestyles and habits, we can make a difference. But we can't continue to be in denial of the damage and waste that we cause.
One of the things that we could look at, one simple thing, but it makes a difference, is whether or not we choose to double-side our photocopies. We do a lot of that in this government, Mr. Speaker, and I have noticed that the reports and things that we get are getting better. We are doing more double-sided copying. If we looked at one other statistic here that said the average person working in an office discards 57 kilograms of waste paper a year, that is the equivalent in Canada of 80 million trees, Mr. Speaker. There are lots of opportunities to act in more responsible ways.
We should all take a look at what our attitudes and our choices are in our lifestyles and in our offices. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Waste Reduction Week
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 798
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Braden . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Sahtu , Mr. Yakeleya .
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Addictions Treatment In The Sahtu Region
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 798
Norman Yakeleya
Sahtu
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise in the House today to speak about addictions treatment in the Sahtu. Over the course of the past 12 months since we have come together for the first time as an Assembly, Members have made a number of statements about the problems our communities face with respect to alcohol and drug addictions. In my opinion, Mr. Speaker, this problem on how we assemble tends to address it. It is perhaps the most pressing issue we are dealing with today. There are a number of changes to addictions counselling services in the Sahtu.
Some of them are quite positive, and I would like to voice my support for these initiatives. I heard positive feedback from my constituents about the efforts of the Community Wellness workers in the Sahtu. We also look forward to two mental health addictions counsellors who are soon to begin work in the Sahtu as part of the role of the Sahtu regional health board. Some initial steps have been taken to improve the delivery of addictions treatment in the Sahtu, but more must be done.
The report of the delivery of the addictions services in the NWT is quite...(inaudible)...A state of emergency was submitted to the Minister in May of 2002. In my view, Mr. Speaker, I do not think the government has done enough to respond to the recommendations contained in that report. What we have seen to date is a start, but more can be done. I will have questions for the Minister of Health and Social Services at the appropriate time. Thank you.
---Applause
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Addictions Treatment In The Sahtu Region
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 798
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Range Lake , Ms. Lee .
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Location Of The New Legal Aid Office
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 799
Sandy Lee
Range Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to speak today to the contract DPW has entered into to set up the second Legal Aid office at the Centre Square Mall. Mr. Speaker, going by Minister Roland 's answers to Mr. Ramsay 's questions last Friday, it appears that Minister Roland is completely content with the situation that the proprietor who did not even meet the deadline was rewarded with a sole-source or, at best, negotiated contract, for what amounts to a maximum of a 15-year lease, in one of the most expensive retail spaces in the city, to open a second Legal Aid office.
Mr. Speaker, the Minister further states in the unedited Hansard, page 1756, that, "we don't put a lot of weight on who the clientele might be going into that space." Mr. Speaker, I must say to you, this is absolutely scandalous and unacceptable...
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Location Of The New Legal Aid Office
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 799
An Hon. Member
Scandalous.
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Location Of The New Legal Aid Office
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 799
Sandy Lee
Range Lake
...and this decision has to be revisited and reversed, and I demand that this government does a better job.
Mr. Speaker, what kind of operation is the Minister running at DPW? Is the Minister telling us that the rules and regulations allow that the officials from his department can call up anybody and negotiate a sole-source contract for a 15-year lease with whatever business they want? I would like to know how I'd get into that kind of business, Mr. Speaker. How does a person at DPW decide which business he's going to give this 15-year contract to?
If the criteria was only that it had to be a storefront or have easy disability access, I could give him at least five locations that I would have expected these officials to consider. I am most appalled at the Minister's suggestion that for government contracts they don't look at, when they're looking for space, what their use might be. Is the Minister saying that there's no difference between whether the government runs a motor vehicle office or a Legal Aid office? There are a lot of confidential issues involved in something like Legal Aid or other programs that the government offers.
Should there not be due consideration -- the Minister being the Minister of Finance , as well -- that every dollar that we allocate for Legal Aid funding goes to legal services and not to the best, most lucrative, expensive, luxurious pad that you could find for a legal office?
---Laughter
I object to this and I expect...
---Applause
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Location Of The New Legal Aid Office
Item 3: Members' Statements
Page 799
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Ms. Lee , your time for your Member's statement is over.
---Applause
Item 3, Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta , Mr. Krutko .
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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Page 799
David Krutko
Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it gives me great pleasure to recognize two of my employees in the gallery today, all the way from Fort McPherson from my constituency office: Liz Wright; and with her is Evan Walz who is my executive assistant.
---Applause
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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Page 799
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Kam Lake , Mr. Ramsay .
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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Page 799
David Ramsay
Kam Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It gives me great pleasure to recognize Mr. Everett McQueen; a friend of mine, a team mate; and his two beautiful daughters, Wynter and Montana. Welcome to the Legislative Assembly.
---Applause
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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Page 799
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. I would like to welcome any members of the public we have in the gallery who haven't been recognized previously. Welcome to the Legislative Assembly.
---Applause
Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .
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Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 799
Jane Groenewegen
Hay River South
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in keeping with my Member's statement today, I would like to address my question to the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , with regard to Student Financial Assistance. I would like to ask the Minister, Mr. Speaker, what process is in place with SFA to confirm that a student has met the requirement of the regulations at the end of their first semester of school?
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Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 799
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . The honourable Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , Mr. Dent .
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Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 799
Charles Dent
Frame Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the expectation is that a student embarked on a post-secondary career will have read the application form, understand what the requirements are, and be aware that any changes in their situation may impact on whether or not they owe money back to the department, or whether they will be considered in the future. The department does not actively follow up to see whether or not somebody has been successful in the first semester. The expectation is that the student, as part of their process, will make sure that they stay in compliance with the rules and regulations. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 799
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Dent . Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .
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Supplementary To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
Jane Groenewegen
Hay River South
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I imply from the Minister's response that he thinks if you're in post-secondary education you shouldn't be there unless you're smart enough to figure out the government's regulations. Anyway, I won't comment on that.
Mr. Speaker, I understand, from these regulations, that students are notified by letter at the beginning of the first semester. However, four months later can be a long time for a lot of students. Some of these kids are 18 years old. Does SFA notify the student at the end of the first semester of any changes to their program, or ask for any additional information regarding their first semester? Do they contact them at the end of the first semester, even by e-mail or fax or anything, and say did you stay in the program, did you change your course load, did you do anything which deviated from the regulations?
Are there any reminders? Are there any requests for supplemental information between first and second semesters? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Supplementary To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Mr. Dent .
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Further Return To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
Charles Dent
Frame Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, to the best of my knowledge, the answer to the question is no. The expectation is, as I said, that students are made to understand very clearly. It's very, very clearly set out on the application form that any change may require them to pay back. So if they're not paying attention to that, yes, they could be in trouble. We're finding that for the most part students are having no trouble staying in compliance. In fact, since 2001, there haven't been that many appeals from people who feel that they have been treated incorrectly by the SFA program. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Further Return To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Dent . Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .
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Supplementary To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
Jane Groenewegen
Hay River South
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have three students in Hay River, so I don't know if we're the exception here or what. I understand that requesting transcripts between semesters would delay funds being disbursed at the beginning of the second semester and would not be beneficial to students. However, would the Minister consider looking into a reminder notice, or an inquiry being sent to students a few weeks before the end of their semester; something that could be e-mailed, as I said, or faxed back to say that they are in compliance? Would the Minister consider sending out such communication to the students?
After all, the whole intent of the SFA program is to see the students succeed, not to say we have regulations, you didn't meet them, pay us back the money. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Supplementary To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Mr. Dent .
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Further Return To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
Charles Dent
Frame Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would be happy to look into whether or not we could accommodate that request. If it's something that could be done easily by e-mail, then certainly we could use it as an opportunity to contact students and remind them, for instance, that it's time to get their names in for employment in the summer. There are a number of reasons that we may want to contact students; but reminding them, too, that any change that they may have made to their program, if they haven't been successful, may impact on their qualification for funds, would also be a good idea. So, yes, Mr. Speaker, I will look into that.
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Further Return To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Dent . Final supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .
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Supplementary To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
Jane Groenewegen
Hay River South
Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and thank you, Mr. Dent , for that very positive response. That sounds like an excellent idea that could be bundled with other information. Now, as to the students who may not have been able to comply with the regulations and didn't successfully complete their first year of studies; on the repayment right now you have to pay the entire amount, which could be thousands of dollars, before you can go on with your second year. So essentially it means drop out of school, get a job, pay the government back, then revisit the issue of your education.
Could the Minister also look into any means that would be more lenient towards the students in terms of a way that they could repay this debt, but have it not send their education off the rails? Thank you.
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Supplementary To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Mr. Dent .
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Further Return To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
Charles Dent
Frame Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, because the regulations were in place the way they were, I don't believe that it could be forgiven or forgotten or ignored. The rules will have to be applied as they were at the time that the issue or the problem happened. It may interest the Member to know that I have given direction and we are changing some of the rules to make it easier for students to qualify for full-time performance during the year, because we will agree now that a full-time course load is equivalent to 60 percent as opposed to 75 percent.
That will be starting for first-year students and working through the system next year. So we are trying to make the system more responsive to students, particularly those who are coming into the system or into post-secondary education from small northern communities for the first time. But it's not possible for us to go back and change the way regulations deal with people retroactively. I believe that there may be some possibility to examine payment schedules and so on, but the end result will have to be the same because of the way the regulations were set out. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Further Return To Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Question 233-15(3): Requirements For The Continued Student Financial Assistance
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 800
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Dent . Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre , Mr. Hawkins .
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Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
Robert Hawkins
Yellowknife Centre
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Earlier in my Member's statement today I spoke in favour of the centralized IT service referred to as the TSC. I stated earlier that I think it's time for the government to implement not an opt-in participation policy, but a mandatory policy for a centralized technical service centre. Pooling our common resources just makes sense. Mr. Speaker, my question for the Minister of FMBS is will the Minister work with the Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation to ensure that the Housing Corporation's transition into the TSC happens this year? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Honourable Minister responsible for FMBS, Mr. Roland .
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Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
Floyd Roland
Inuvik Boot Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the decision made on forming the TSC was done with consideration of what departments and capacity we had within government, pulling the resources together and ensuring we created an environment where things would move along in a positive way. We have determined that this move was the right move, and to go back now to look at making it mandatory is something that we can look at doing. So I could go back to my Cabinet colleagues for further discussion on this that, in fact, we make it mandatory on other groups. Thank you.
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Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Roland . Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins .
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Supplementary To Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And Nwt Housing Corporation
Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
Robert Hawkins
Yellowknife Centre
Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and thank you, Mr. Minister. The words positive, standards, centralized and even sometimes the words harmonization of standards of how we implement things and how we run things and coordinate things come to mind when I think of this, but, Mr. Speaker, would the Minister give me an indication as to when he will bring that discussion to Cabinet in regard to the folding in of the NWT Housing Corporation into the greater picture, the greater good of the TSC? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Supplementary To Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And Nwt Housing Corporation
Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Mr. Roland .
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Further Return To Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And Nwt Housing Corporation
Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
Floyd Roland
Inuvik Boot Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I'd like to thank the Member for his positive comments about the TSC. In coming together, in bringing this together, it has had its difficulties, but we've been working through them and looking at the next phase of bringing the service together to be more efficient as a government. So I don't have a timeline as of yet. I'll speak to my departments that are involved in this and look at what timing we can put in place for this discussion. Thank you.
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Further Return To Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And Nwt Housing Corporation
Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Roland . Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins .
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Supplementary To Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And Nwt Housing Corporation
Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
Robert Hawkins
Yellowknife Centre
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I realize persuasion is always a lot nicer than forcing people and I'm not suggesting that the Minister become a leg breaker, but I think this policy needs to be a mandatory policy so we don't deal with this in the future. I'd like to hear the Minister say today that he will look towards making this a mandatory policy where all departments, boards and agencies get involved. I should say where applicable. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Supplementary To Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And Nwt Housing Corporation
Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Mr. Roland .
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Further Return To Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And Nwt Housing Corporation
Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
Floyd Roland
Inuvik Boot Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Where applicable we will look at coming forward with some options to my Cabinet colleagues. Once we've had that discussion, we can share it with Members of this Assembly. Thank you.
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Further Return To Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And Nwt Housing Corporation
Question 234-15(3): Integration Of The Technology Service Centre And NWT Housing Corporation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Roland . Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Sahtu , Mr. Yakeleya .
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Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
Norman Yakeleya
Sahtu
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in my Member's statement earlier today I spoke about the issue of drug and alcohol treatment in the region. There are a number of unacceptable shortcomings in the way that addictions treatment is currently being carried out in the Sahtu; for example, the delay of allocating space for the community wellness workers in Deline and Fort Good Hope. My question to the Minister of Health and Social Services today is will the Minister of Health and Social Services provide this House and the Assembly with an update of the space allocation of community wellness workers in Deline and Fort Good Hope? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger .
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Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
Michael Miltenberger
Thebacha
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Member has raised an issue that we have discussed before, and I would like to inform the Member in this House that we are taking the steps and we are going to be planning to address those shortcomings. We've been working on it for some time. So I'd like to give him that assurance. Thank you.
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Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 801
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya .
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Supplementary To Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
Norman Yakeleya
Sahtu
Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Speaker, I find it unacceptable that this government has not made the drug and alcohol treatment in the regions a priority, given that the survey just reported in the news about the alcohol and drug issue that's going to be a big issue with the development of a pipeline. I read in the 2000 report of the delivery of addiction services in the Northwest Territories, I was particularly interested in having a mobile addiction treatment centre taking into consideration the recommendations of this report, Mr. Speaker.
I would like to ask the Minister if he would commit to looking into a mobile addiction treatment centre program in the Sahtu region. Thank you.
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Supplementary To Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Mr. Miltenberger .
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Further Return To Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
Michael Miltenberger
Thebacha
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there were some efforts made on the idea of trying to put mobile treatment into place in some communities, and I'd be glad to share that information with the Member and then we can take a look at it with the same information base and try to determine what is the best way to proceed. I agree with the Member that there is potential for mobile treatment, and that was the idea when we started those efforts some time ago. So I will get that information for the Member. Thank you.
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Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya .
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Supplementary To Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
Norman Yakeleya
Sahtu
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I thank the Minister. Would the Minister commit to a time frame that we could work with the other regions in the Mackenzie Valley? I'm going to be asking this on behalf of the Sahtu, that we could come together and look at the possibility of looking at a mobile treatment program that they could foresee sometime in the Sahtu region in light of the potential of the Mackenzie Valley pipeline coming down. Thank you.
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Supplementary To Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Mr. Miltenberger .
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Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
Michael Miltenberger
Thebacha
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we stand ready to sit with the Member. So there's no confusion, Mr. Speaker, we stand ready to meet with the Member or the Social Programs committee to look at how we are delivering those services, and we do agree that there is a huge impact of resource development that is underway and we want to best be able to deal with that. So the offer is there and we would be happy to do that. Thank you.
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Further Return To Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Your final supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya .
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Supplementary To Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
Norman Yakeleya
Sahtu
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I stand ready, Mr. Minister. Mr. Speaker, I've asked the Minister if he would again commit to meet with -- I know he made some offers to the standing committee -- the Sahtu leadership in terms of gathering information. It's a huge concern in our region in terms of making a commitment to meet with the RWED Minister in terms of the social impacts in the communities. Drug and alcohol programs are a big issue for our region, so I guess I would ask him if he would commit to also meet with the Sahtu leadership. Thank you.
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Supplementary To Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Mr. Miltenberger .
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Further Return To Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
Michael Miltenberger
Thebacha
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I'd be happy to work through the Sahtu authority and the staff that's there, as well as the Member, and look at the most appropriate way to deal with this issue. If that entails, as well, meeting with the leadership to talk more specifically about alcohol and drug concerns, then, yes, we will do that. Thank you.
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Question 235-15(3): Update On Space Allocation For Community Health Workers
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Great Slave , Mr. Braden .
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Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
Bill Braden
Great Slave
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Along the theme of waste reduction and recycling in the NWT, we go through something like 25 million containers a year for various products; 25 million among a population of just over 40,000. It's a remarkable number and it's one of the reasons that a year ago this Assembly passed the beverage container recycling act. My question is for the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development to ask him about when we might expect to see this act implemented across the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Braden . Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development , the Honourable Mr. Bell .
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Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 802
Brendan Bell
Yellowknife South
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As the Member indicated, the legislation in the life of the last government was in fact the Waste Reduction and Recovery Act. The first program falling underneath that legislative piece of work was the Beverage Container Recovery Program and that's what we've been working on. The Member will remember that we struck an advisory committee a few months back. I think there were nine members from environmental organizations, from communities, from industry, who sat down to discuss the program and come up with some advice to us on regulations and a methodology for development of the program.
We've had the benefit of that input. My department has been working with Justice to develop those regulations. We think we're pretty close now, and
the next step is a call for RFPs to go out this month that will speak to how the regional processing centres and the community depots will be structured across the territory. We're now thinking that by the end of March we can roll this program out and I'm certainly looking forward to that. I think it's going to go a long way toward developing a recycling ethic in the territory. Thank you.
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Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Bell . Supplementary, Mr. Braden .
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Supplementary To Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
Bill Braden
Great Slave
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. That sounds very progressive. I know one of things that was of concern when we were putting this bill together was the ability across all the communities to put this into effect. Can the Minister give us some sense that, indeed, all of our communities will be able to act on at least some part of this new initiative? Thank you.
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Supplementary To Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Braden . Mr. Bell .
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Further Return To Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
Brendan Bell
Yellowknife South
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think we've determined that it would be cost-prohibitive to set up what we're going to set up in the regions, these processing centres in every community across the North. I think what we've decided to do is establish community depots that will feed into the regional processing centres. It's our intention that all communities will have community depots; whether they'll all be up and running by the time this program is rolled out on April 1st, I'm not sure. A lot will depend on the proposals we get back as we go out now with an expression for that. Thank you.
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Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Bell . Supplementary, Mr. Braden .
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Supplementary To Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
Bill Braden
Great Slave
Mr. Speaker, one of the principles of the act is that both the manufacturers and the users of containers will pay for their use and that is, of course, from the manufacturing to the actual use and retail delivery and then the disposal. It's a good principle. But it is something that, because there will be costs assessed at the retail and consumer level, is going to have an impact on the cost of these goods and materials. Can the Minister advise, either through the committee or his analysis, what will the impact be perhaps for the average northern family of the cost of implementing this? Is it going to cost us more to do our shopping and run our businesses because of this act? Thank you.
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Supplementary To Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Braden . Mr. Bell .
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Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
Brendan Bell
Yellowknife South
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm still awaiting some of the input from the committee to determine what makes the most sense in the application of these fees. My sense is there will be an amount paid by consumers as they pick up these beverage containers which they will get back if they recycle. So I think the incentive is there for people to recycle in order to keep costs down. It also made sense, I believe, to have industry involved in the development of this program. The last thing we wanted to see was people finding a way to circumvent our fees by getting beverage containers from other jurisdictions.
So we've been working with industry to better understand how we might prevent that. But I think the important thing here is that we have a well thought out program that makes sense and encourages recycling by providing an incentive. I think the monies, the rebates, coming from that recycling should do that. Thank you.
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Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Bell . Final supplementary, Mr. Braden .
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Supplementary To Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
Bill Braden
Great Slave
Mr. Speaker, through the course of this analysis and this work, will the Minister bring to the attention of the public and this Assembly any estimates or any projections on what some of those costs may be? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Supplementary To Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Braden . Mr. Bell .
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Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
Brendan Bell
Yellowknife South
Thank you. I can certainly work with committee to do that. One of the unknowns here is how successful we'll be at recycling. There is a cost to setting up this program and I suppose if we do a very poor job of recycling, then that program cost will be paid off much more quickly. If we really take up this recycling ethic in earnest, then it will be over a longer period of time. I hope that we do take that up, and certainly we'll work with committee so we can analyze this and discuss, in fact, how well it's progressing. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Question 236-15(3): Waste Reduction And Recycling Legislation
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Bell . Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Kam Lake , Mr. Ramsay .
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Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
David Ramsay
Kam Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question today is for the Minister of Public Works and Services , Mr. Floyd Roland . I'm just wondering if the Minister could advise the Members of this House what it's going to cost the government to set up the new Family Law Legal Aid office in the Centre Square Mall. That's in terms of leasehold improvements, and, as well, maybe if he would like to provide the House with a detailed costing on that arrangement. Thank you.
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Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Minister of Public Works and Services , the Honourable Mr. Roland .
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Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 803
Floyd Roland
Inuvik Boot Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the office space the Member is speaking of is one that is worked on between the Legal Services Board, being the client, and Public Works and Services, as the one involved in the issuing of the RFP that went out and trying to see if any of the RFPs that were returned fit the criteria, and, going on that, recommend to the parties involved that that would be the way to go. My understanding of the process on the office space was the
RFP was issued. Three responses were received. Two were on time, but did not fit the RFP. One came in but was late. Phone calls were made to all the parties involved to see if there was adequate space or alternative space and if they'd be able to meet that. From the information I'm provided, I'm told that two responses did not fit the criteria, even after the calls. The final company, the one that has the contract now, did have space and discussions went ahead on that basis. My understanding is that in the RFP it also went ahead with the requirement for general office space.
So that would be the parameters that this RFP went out on, and I understand that we fall right in within that category when we compare some of our other leases out there. Thank you.
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Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Roland . Supplementary, Mr. Ramsay .
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Supplementary To Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
David Ramsay
Kam Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm just wondering how often has the Minister's department sole sourced office space. Have they set a new precedent in terms of process and price? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Supplementary To Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Mr. Roland .
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Further Return To Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
Floyd Roland
Inuvik Boot Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I don't have the exact information that the Member wants right now on how many spaces we've sole sourced. Sole sourcing is done by the government from time to time, looking at the criteria involved. I can work at getting that information together and providing it to the Member, if that's what he'd like. Thank you.
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Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Roland . Supplementary, Mr. Ramsay .
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Supplementary To Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
David Ramsay
Kam Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and thank you, Mr. Minister, for your response. I'm just wondering if the Minister appreciates the premise that the more money you spend on leasehold improvements and office space, the less money flows through to the clients who really need the service. I know the Minister probably didn't have a direct say in this sole-sourced lease, but does he appreciate that fact? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Supplementary To Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Mr. Roland .
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Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
Floyd Roland
Inuvik Boot Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it is something that I do appreciate, is the fact that we have limited resources in the Northwest Territories and we need to spend it wisely. In this particular situation, an RFP was let, responses were received, all of them did not, for one reason or another, qualify with what was out there. Upon discussions with all the parties involved, it was sought that one company did have space available that was required by the Legal Services Board. The Legal Services Board requested space that was visible, had easy access and a storefront.
That was some of the main criteria that they had requested. From the information provided, they're happy with the location. Thank you.
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Question 237-15(3): Cost Of New Family Law Legal Aid Office
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Roland . Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Range Lake , Ms. Lee .
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Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
Sandy Lee
Range Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions are also to the Minister of Public Works and Services . Mr. Speaker, I must say that every aspect of this contract for the new Legal Aid office is very questionable. Mr. Speaker, I know a little bit about legal aid files; I used to work on legal aid files. There are so many people who don't get legal aid assistance, and when they do they are doled out two or three hours of legal aid service from a lawyer.
Now we're going to house this program in this most expensive area and I can't wait for them to tell them, you know, we can spend all the money we have in this mall to sit here, but we can't give you more than two hours of legal aid service. Mr. Speaker, it seems to me that the proprietor who got this contract didn't even meet the deadline. We rewarded them by giving them a sole-source contract. If a student who applied for SFA was delayed, I bet you they wouldn't get that kind of reward. So I'd like to know how the Minister justifies giving a sole-source contract in a free market like Yellowknife?
A sole-source contract for a 15-year lease to a business who didn't even meet the deadline. How does he justify that, Mr. Speaker?
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Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Ms. Lee . The honourable Minister of Public Works and Services , Mr. Roland .
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Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
Floyd Roland
Inuvik Boot Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm glad the Members feel that this is an important service, and that's why we've gone out to set up another office so that all members affected, whether it's a family separating, can seek service and get that right now that was a difficult thing to offer. Lawyers in one office could not work for both clients if it came to a family separation. We, as a government, recognized that, established the money to develop this space and created a second office. From the information I'm provided, we are not going to reduce the level of service.
We are going to increase the level of service to the residents of the Northwest Territories who require this type of service. Again, for the cost of the actual space, an RFP went out that requested general office space and under that request the responses were received. I'll say again that all three responses that were received did not meet the criteria, but on reviewing all three files it was felt that the one company that did submit -- it missed the timeline, and I've been open about that -- fit the criteria enough that we could have some discussions with them and came to an agreement on the price.
Again, the price that we worked with was that based on general office space. Thank you.
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Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Roland . Supplementary, Ms. Lee .
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Supplementary To Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 804
Sandy Lee
Range Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Minister just repeated what I said, which is that the department rewarded the party who did not meet the
timeline by giving them a 15-year leasehold contract. Now, I have a problem with that. The second thing is, I resent greatly anybody across the floor saying that when we're asking questions about the way they're spending legal aid money that we somehow do not support expansion of the Legal Aid program and I do not appreciate that, Mr. Speaker. I want to tell the Minister and the Cabinet, they know that other NGOs, for example, the Centre for Northern Families, suggested that perhaps this new lawyer practice out of that service. A doctor goes there for service and it's been a great success.
Why don't the lawyers go where the most services are? Why didn't the Department of Public Works and Services staff look at places like that or any of the many buildings around the courthouse or downtown area? Why did they go to the most expensive mall and say what do you have? I want to know what regulations there are that the staff could just call anybody and say do you have a place for 15 years. I want to know what the criteria is. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
---Applause
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Supplementary To Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 805
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Ms. Lee . Mr. Roland .
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Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 805
Floyd Roland
Inuvik Boot Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, if the Member wants a copy of the RFP that went out, I'll gladly provide one. The fact is, an RFP went out, responses were received, it was a public exercise and we received three responses. From that, we deemed that they all did not fit the criteria for one reason or another, whether the offer that was made did not fit the question for adequate space or storefront, or easy access, downtown, or the timelines. Based on phone calls we had with these companies, individuals from those companies, we went and discussed with the Legal Services Board what we felt was a viable option.
On that we've offered a five-year lease with two options of five years. That can be reviewed if it's felt that at the end of the first term it is not appropriate to continue with that. Thank you.
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Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 805
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Roland . Supplementary, Ms. Lee .
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Supplementary To Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 805
Sandy Lee
Range Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister still did not give any information about what criteria the staff has to meet in order to call somebody and say I'm looking for space in Yellowknife and I'm ready to do sole source. Because, Mr. Speaker, as the Minister indicated, of the three businesses that applied, none of them met the criteria. So it was a zero. Nobody met the criteria. So as far as I'm concerned, all the businesses in Yellowknife were entitled to have this negotiation with the Minister's department. So why wasn't the Panda Mall consulted? Why wasn't the old Overlander's space consulted?
Why weren't any other buildings consulted? As far as I'm concerned, when the two proposals didn't meet the criteria and the third one was late, everybody was starting from zero. It's wrong for that business that did not even meet the deadline to have the sole-source contract. I want to know what criteria, where is the rule book that governs the staff as to how they act in these cases? Thank you.
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Supplementary To Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 805
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Ms. Lee . Mr. Roland .
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Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 805
Floyd Roland
Inuvik Boot Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we do have policies on whether we go RFP, sole source, negotiated contract or public tender, and I disagree with the Member that this was wrong. We went out for an RFP, a public process. We went out to the public and asked for input. We received some input. For one reason or another that didn't fit the guidelines out there, but they were close enough. We sat down, used the same companies, had discussions about adequate space, and went forward with the one we felt was best at the time.
I will provide a copy of the policies to the Member for the guidelines on how we work around these. It's not something we would do whimsically. We wouldn't do this just for the sake of one day waking up and deciding whether it is a good day or not to do a sole source. We went through a public process. We took the information from that process and, instead of going out and adding to the cost of more advertising and so on, we took the best deal and went ahead on that basis. I hope that, at the end of the day, we would be better able to serve the clients of the Northwest Territories through this space.
A business put in a proposal. It just happens to be downtown in the Centre Square Mall. They put it in. It is not like we went to them, phoned them up and said hey, let's arm wrestle or strong arm you into providing this service. Thank you.
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Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 805
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Roland . Your final supplementary, Ms. Lee .
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Supplementary To Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 805
Sandy Lee
Range Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister should check his facts, because he has provided information to us that suggests that, in fact, they did call the business and say let's work out a deal. Mr. Minister, I still want to know when they did meet the original criteria, so everything was zero based, so why do you only deal with those who applied for it who didn't meet the criteria? The third one was late in the first place. That should have been just written off right away, and you should have started right from the beginning. Shouldn't that be the common, sensible way to do that?
I also want to know why not a proposal like the Centre for Northern Families who had a proposal. If the Minister is going to call anybody to do it, why don't you consider everybody fairly? I am sure the NGO could have done a lot with the 15-year contract to provide legal services in their premises. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
---Applause
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Supplementary To Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 805
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Ms. Lee . Mr. Roland .
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Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 805
Floyd Roland
Inuvik Boot Lake
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, an RFP went out. Three responses were received. Those three responses were looked at and reviewed. We moved on with what we thought was the best option. We worked with the people who responded to a public RFP process. Thank you.
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Question 238-15(3): New Legal Aid Office Lease
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 806
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Roland . Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Nahendeh , Mr. Menicoche .
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Question 239-15(3): Housing Assessment In Fort Liard
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 806
Kevin A. Menicoche
Nahendeh
Mr. Speaker, my question today is for the Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation . Recently, the Housing Corporation undertook an assessment for Fort Liard. I am just wondering if the Minister can comment whether that assessment has been completed for the community of Fort Liard. Thank you.
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Question 239-15(3): Housing Assessment In Fort Liard
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 806
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Menicoche . The honourable Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation , Mr. Krutko .
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Question 239-15(3): Housing Assessment In Fort Liard
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 806
David Krutko
Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am not aware of this study being done in Fort Liard. We based our information on lead surveys that we have conducted on that. That is how we allocate our budget.
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Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 806
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Supplementary, Mr. Menicoche .
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Supplementary To Question 239-15(3): Housing Assessment In Fort Liard
Question 239-15(3): Housing Assessment In Fort Liard
Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 806
Kevin A. Menicoche
Nahendeh
Mr. Speaker, I thank the Minister for that response. I was under the impression that they were addressing the special needs of Fort Liard. With that being said, it was highlighted as a key community. I was just wondering what the corporation plans to do about Fort Liard, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.
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Supplementary To Question 239-15(3): Housing Assessment In Fort Liard
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Item 6: Oral Questions
Page 806
The Speaker
Paul Delorey
Thank you, Mr. Menicoche . Mr. Krutko .
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