Debates of Oct. 24th, 1997

This is page numbers 171 - 199 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 5th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was chairman .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Teachers' Collective Agreement

Royal Commission On Aboriginal Peoples Report Recommendations

Article 24 Contracting Procedures

The National Child Benefit

Results Of Municipal Elections

NWT Protected Area Strategy

NWT Development Corporation

Baffin Fishery

Issues To Address As We Approach Division

Point Of Privilege

Beaufort Delta Leaders Conference

Apology For Comments Regarding Ministerial Performance

Family Wedding Nuptials

Mid-term Review Process

Canada - Greenland Relations

Keewatin Resupply Initiative

Return To Oral Question 2-13: Environmental Liiability Site Inventory

Return To Oral Question 22-13(5): Aurora Fund Eligibility

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Diamond Mining Regulations

Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Arctic Bay Sewage Lagoon Improvements

Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Aurora Fund Investment Policies

The Wallace Report

Education Board Policy Re: Automatic Pass

Nunavut Arctic College Trades Program

Ntcl Resupply Contract

Eastern Arctic Resupply Costs

Release Of Wallace Report

Content Of The Wallace Report

Written Question 1-13(5): Information On Keewatin Resupply

Tabled Document 5-13(5): Northwest Territories Power Corporation Annual Report; 1996-97

Tabled Document 6-13(5): Plan 2000: Status Report

Tabled Document 7-13(5): Comments On Recommendations: GNWT Review Of Royal Commission On Aboriginal Peoples Report

Tabled Document 8-13(5): Letter From Manitoba Chamber Of Commerce Re: Keewatin Resupply

Item 14: Notices Of Motion

Item 16: Motions

Motions 4-13(5): Review Of Guidelines And Procedures For Requests For Proposals

Motions 6-13(5): Extended Adjournment

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

To Amend Clause 2 Of Bill 3,

An Act To Amend The Financial Administration Act

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Item 21: Third Reading Of Bills

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Honourable Jim Antoine , Honourable Goo Arlooktoo , Mr. Barnabas , Honourable Charles Dent , Mr. Erasmus , Mr. Evaloarjuk , Honourable Sam Gargan, Mrs. Groenewegen , Mr. Henry , Honourable Stephen Kakfwi , Mr. Krutko , Mr. Miltenberger , Honourable Don Morin , Honourable Kelvin Ng , Mr. Ningark , Mr. O'Brien , Mr. Ootes , Mr. Picco , Mr. Rabesca , Mr. Roland , Mr. Steen , Honourable Manitok Thompson , Honourable John Todd .

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Oh, God, may your spirit and guidance be in us as we work for the benefit of all our people, for peace and justice in our land and for the constant recognition of the dignity and aspirations of those whom we serve. Amen.

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 171

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Ng . Good morning. Orders of the day. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Todd .

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Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 171

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, on the advice of the Clerk, I would like to ask that we seek unanimous consent to waive rule 34(6) so that all Ministers' statements filed with the Clerk today can be delivered today. Thank you.

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Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 171

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Member for Keewatin Central is seeking unanimous consent to waive rule 34(6) for today. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Todd , you have unanimous consent. Ministers' statements. Mr. Todd .

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Minister's Statement 3-13(5): Teachers' Collective Agreement

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 171

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker and thank you, colleagues. Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to announce that the teachers have voted in favour of ratifying a collective agreement.

--Applause

This means that we now have a negotiated agreement for teachers for the period September 1, 1996 to August 31, 1999. Negotiations for this collective agreement, Mr. Speaker, were arduous and quite difficult. Throughout this process our teachers maintained poise and conducted themselves in a most professional manner. Mr. Speaker, education is a priority for the people of the Northwest Territories. We value and appreciate our teachers and the work they do to educate our children.

I strongly believe in the process of negotiations for solving our problems. The bargaining teams on both sides conducted themselves as professional negotiators. Mr. Speaker, I will be sending personal letters of appreciation to my representatives. I would like to take this opportunity to publicly express my appreciation to each member of the Northwest Territories Teachers Association's bargaining team. Mr. Speaker, I have been a member of a union bargaining team and I fully appreciate the complexity of the politics of trying to find solutions that will satisfy everyone's interests. Mr.

Speaker, my appreciation for their perseverance, dedication and hard work in representing the interest of teachers go to Pat Thomas, Erin Blair, Donna Stephania, Ray Young, Cliff King and Blake Lyons. Thank you.

--Applause

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Minister's Statement 3-13(5): Teachers' Collective Agreement

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 171

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Ministers' statements. Mr. Antoine .

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Minister's Statement 4-13(5): Royal Commission On Aboriginal Peoples Report Recommendations

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 171

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Royal Commission on Aboriginal Peoples released its final report last November. Shortly afterward, I informed this House that the Government of the Northwest Territories would analyze the extensive recommendations of that report and be prepared to address them. I am pleased to make this statement outlining our initial reaction to the recommendations. Later today I will table in the Legislative Assembly a document which provides comments on recommendations that are within the mandate of the Government of the Northwest Territories.

As part of our efforts to understand the report, and in the spirit of partnership it advocates, during this past July the Government of the Northwest Territories co-hosted with the regional office of the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs an information session. Delegates from communities across the Northwest Territories participated in this session which provided insight as to the meaning of the report and its implications for northerners.

Officials of the Ministry of Aboriginal Affairs have also participated in various forums with other jurisdictions in order to more fully understand the report. I had the opportunity to meet with my provincial and aboriginal colleagues to discuss the report during a meeting of provincial/territorial Ministers of Aboriginal Affairs in Regina last April.

One of the most important facts that has come from all this is that, at the territorial, regional and community level, northerners are already doing much to establish new relationships and reform the way we do business as governments. This is not a surprise, since the nature of society in the north, and in the Northwest Territories particularly is quite different from southern Canada.

In the Northwest Territories, we have the opportunity through comprehensive claims, self-government and political development to establish the kind of relationships between people and opportunities for our aboriginal residents which are envisioned in the commission report. The Government of the Northwest Territories through its Agenda for Change has recognized and acted upon the need to adjust our sights in a manner which is very much consistent with many of the recommendations. I do, not make these observations to minimize the need to take the report seriously, though.

I believe there is much more we can do and this government will use the report recommendations as a guide and tool to shape our continued efforts to create a better place for all people to live and to create a meaningful place for the Northwest Territories in Canada.

This is particularly the case when we look at the report's major recommendations for rebuilding a cohesive national legislative and administrative framework with which to foster a new relationship between aboriginal and non-aboriginal people. This part of the report we have commented on to some extent in the paper I am tabling later today. There is still more considerations that will be needed based on the federal response.

My statement today and this paper which I will table will not mark the end of this government's consideration of the report and its recommendations. It marks a starting point. Based on the work we have done so far, departments are now prepared to answer any specific questions people may have and listen to specific suggestions on what more we can do. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Minister's Statement 4-13(5): Royal Commission On Aboriginal Peoples Report Recommendations

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 172

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Ministers' statements. Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Minister's Statement 5-13(5):

Article 24 Contracting Procedures

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 172

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In May, 1996, I tabled in this House the Interim Implementation Measures for

Article 24 of the Nunavut Final Agreement. I am pleased to announce today that the final measures are now in place. The final measures were developed from the interim procedures and include both negotiated contracts and use of Inuit labour, firms and professional services. Nunavut Tunngavik Incorporated was actively involved in the development of the document, and they have formally agreed to the government's adoption of these procedures.

Mr. Speaker, I believe these procedures respond to the government's commitment to provide reasonable support and assistance to Inuit firms to enable them to compete for government contracts. It is important to remember that even though these are called final measures, we will work closely with NTI to monitor them to make sure that they are working out. I am satisfied that the measures will maximize the use of Inuit labour and the involvement of Inuit firms in government contracts in Nunavut. Our joint monitoring efforts will help us decide whether the changes are necessary. We will continue to discuss this with NTI to try to find a solution.

Mr. Speaker, as I have stated on many occasions, creating opportunities for Inuit firms is very important. It is even more important to get Inuit involved at every level of economic activity. I believe that we have taken one more important step down that path. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 5-13(5):

Article 24 Contracting Procedures

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 172

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Arlooktoo . Ministers' statements. Mr. Dent .

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Minister's Statement 6-13(5): The National Child Benefit

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 172

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, ensuring that all children have a good start in life is critical to the future of the north and to the future of Canada. The federal government has announced a new program called the National Child Benefit which will start in July of 1998. The program is an important step in tackling child poverty. It will help northerners move into and stay in the workforce and help build a better future for children and our society. Since the program is built on a partnership between the federal government and the territorial and provincial governments, I would like to bring the Members of this Assembly up-to-date on this initiative in the Northwest Territories.

The Department of Education, Culture and Employment estimates that one-third of Northwest Territories' families will qualify for the benefit. This is in line with the national average. Under the new program, the federal government will make payments directly to low-income families with children. Canada, the provinces and territories have all agreed that the implementation of the program will not result in an overall reduction in income support for those on assistance. However, Mr.

Speaker, since the federal government will be paying more to low-income families, the Northwest Territories' share of payments will be reduced. The department estimates that $2.3 million will be freed up for reinvestment in programs that improve work incentives, benefits and services for low-income families with children. As well, parents will continue to receive the National Child Benefit for their children while working at low-wage jobs.

This approach should give low-income parents the extra support they need to stay in the work force and be self-sufficient, rather than having no option but to depend on income support.

The Government of the Northwest Territories and Canada will begin negotiations on the implementation of this program over the next few months. Through negotiation, we will confirm our approach to reinvestment and the administrative procedure associated with the implementation of the National Child Benefit.

Mr. Speaker, I have distributed pamphlets and booklets on the National Child Benefit to Members of this Assembly, and the department has mailed the same information to stakeholders. This program will have a significant benefit for low-income families in the Northwest Territories by helping them to achieve independence and self-sufficiency. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 6-13(5): The National Child Benefit

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 173

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Ministers' statements. Ms. Thompson .

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Minister's Statement 7-13(5): Results Of Municipal Elections

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 173

Manitok Thompson

Aivilik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, on October 20th, electors went to the polls to vote for the mayors and councils of Iqaluit, Fort Smith, Hay River, Fort Simpson, Norman Wells and Yellowknife. Voter turn out in these municipal elections ranged from 40 percent to over 74 percent of eligible voters.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Members to join me in congratulating the new and the re-elected members of councils. As I have stated before in this House, the responsibilities of local authorities is expanding. The term of the new councils promises to be one of great challenge and change from municipal governments. Mr. Speaker, the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs provides many training opportunities which can prove useful to the new councils. For example, we provide training for community works management and community counsellor orientation.

These training programs are offered to municipal councils on a request basis. In the past, many Members of council have found these to be of significant benefit in their new positions. I hope many more will make use of these opportunities.

Mr. Speaker, in closing, I thank all those candidates who served on the councils this past term for their efforts and hard work and wish you all the best in the future endeavours. Thank you.

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Minister's Statement 7-13(5): Results Of Municipal Elections

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 173

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Ms. Thompson . Ministers' statement. Mr. Kakfwi .

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Minister's Statement 8-13(5): NWT Protected Area Strategy

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 173

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mahsi. Mr. Speaker, this government has made job creation a number one priority and we plan to develop economic opportunities in the territories, but we also plan to do it in a manner that respects the environment. I am frequently approached by people who ask how the land will be protected while we carry on with industrial development. They emphasize that critical areas for wildlife and places of cultural importance are needed to sustain people in the north. These areas offer a source of subsistence and a substitute for imported goods as well as continuing link with our culture.

To safeguard the areas we value, the Government of the Northwest Territories and the federal government committed to developing a Protected Area Strategy. This document will outline a procedure once it is developed for identifying special areas of land and how they would be used. I am pleased to report that the strategy is progressing. The processes required to develop and implement a Protected Area Strategy are complex. Extensive consultation, coordination and cooperation are required. We recognize that the development of the strategy cannot proceed without the involvement of all land owners and land users.

The consultation process is ongoing and in order to facilitate discussions with aboriginal groups, I have written recently to all aboriginal leaders requesting meetings to discuss how the strategy can best be developed in each of their respective jurisdictions. I believe the Protected Area Strategy is of benefit to everyone in the north and we will gain much more by working together.

Some regions are moving faster than others. For example, the Gwich'in settlement area planning boards are jointly sponsoring a session in November to help identify potential protected areas. We have had inquiries from the South Slave region and interest has also been expressed from the Deh Cho region.

To support development of the strategy, the Department of Resources, Wildlife, and Economic Development is researching and sharing information with land claim organizations and communities. Identifying potential protected areas is not a simple matter because protected areas are not just nature reserves. They include areas which have cultural and spiritual significance. By working together, we can protect the areas which are important to us and at the same time pass on a legacy to future generations. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I do have another statement if I can continue. Thank you.

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Minister's Statement 8-13(5): NWT Protected Area Strategy

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 173

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Minister's Statement 9-13(5): NWT Development Corporation

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 173

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, in regard to the Northwest Territories Development Corporation, the Northwest Territories Development Corporation was established in 1990 with the passage of the Northwest Territories Development Corporation Act. The corporation has a somewhat unique mandate in that it is charged with going where the private sector cannot or will not go to create jobs for northerners. This means the corporation focuses most of its efforts in small communities where unemployment rates are high and opportunities are few. For the most part, companies under the

corporation's umbrella employ people who have had little or no opportunity to join the wage economy.

In 1996, Mr. Speaker, approximately 1,200 people were employed through job creation with the corporation. A profile of these employees show that 60 percent were female; 80 percent were aboriginal; 75 percent had less than a grade 10 education and 50 percent were on social assistance and employment insurance prior to working for the corporation.

Wages paid by the corporation amount to nearly $5.6 million. An additional $7.5 million was paid for supplies, services and products such as carvings. On the revenue side, the corporation generated $8.6 million, most of which came from the south and is new money in our economy.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to note that initiatives by the Northwest Territories Development Corporation reach far beyond the goal of creating jobs for people in small communities. Those who gained employment have the opportunity to learn, prosper and look forward to a more positive future. Employees receive on-the-job training, gaining skills that are transferable and attractive to other employers. As a result, corporation employees can lead more productive lives and become a positive role model in their communities.

The initial thrust of the corporation is to create jobs. Recently, efforts have concentrated on streamlining the marketing arm of the corporation. Three marketing companies have been merged into one and a new sales inventory system has been put into place. This system provides detailed data to make sales projections and identify product requirements. In addition to these improvements, the corporation has set up new retail outlets to distribute its products. The corporation now has outlets in eastern Canada, where Inuit products are in greatest demand and in western Canada, where Dene products seem to be most popular.

Mr. Speaker, the Northwest Territories Development Corporation is just one of the tools we have at our disposal to implement policies, directed at improving the standard of living of northern residents. The Corporation has made significant progress in developing our economy. I hope to see it play an even greater role in helping to meet the needs of small communities. I believe the corporation is now in a position to expand operations, and it my expectation that this will occur in the upcoming year. Thank you.

--Applause

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Minister's Statement 9-13(5): NWT Development Corporation

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 174

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Kakfwi . Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Picco .

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Member's Statement 23-13(5): Baffin Fishery

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 174

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the fishery in the Baffin region both offshore and the commercial char fishery has been growing considerably over the past ten years. We now have several commercial fishermen and a modern fish plant in Pangnirtung. The Kikitalik Corporation has successfully prosecuted the offshore turbot and shrimp fishery for some time now. This has helped create new jobs and provided extra income to many residents of the Baffin.

Mr. Speaker, the Baffin fishery is a good news story and something that we should continue to develop and support. On October 7th through 9th, the Baffin Regional Chamber of Commerce coordinated a conference on the fishery sponsored by Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development and held in Iqaluit. There were over 31 participants from ten Baffin communities able to attend. The conference's aim was to help develop a framework for a Baffin fishing strategy and create a Baffin fishing industry organization.

The need for more community infrastructure particularly freezers, the need for air connections that will facilitate the shipping of fish, the issue of the percentage of fish allocated to the Nunavut region by federal authorities and cooperation between communities was stressed. An interim board for the new Baffin Fishery Council was appointed. This board was mandated with getting the organization registered and up and running before the first official board is elected which should occur around March, 1998.

The conference was a major accomplishment in this important industry and for the economy of the Baffin region especially in some of the smaller communities where fishing is the major income source available.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the Baffin Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development office, the coordinators of the Baffin Regional Chamber of Commerce and the participants for being proactive in helping foster the development of this important renewable resource. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Member's Statement 23-13(5): Baffin Fishery

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 174

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Picco . Members' statements. Mr. Miltenberger .

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Member's Statement 24-13(5): Issues To Address As We Approach Division

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 174

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In the wee hours of the morning, I raised the issue of the need to focus our agenda down to two key priorities. The first one being that we should be focusing all our attention and resources on trying to make sure the programs and initiatives we started in the communities are backed up and running as effectively as possible. In the last two years, we have asked the people we represent to make sacrifices and to share the pain that was required to balance our budget and get our financial house in order. They have done that.

Now it is up to us to make sure that we do not break that faith when we move to try to rekindle the economy, look at employment initiatives and deal with social problems.

The other issue, Mr. Speaker, is that of division and the need for a smooth transition. Of course, I would like to restate the point of key concern to me is the fact that division has to take place at no expense to services and programs in the west. The reason I restate that, Mr. Speaker, is because I want to reassure the people that I represent and the people of the west that even though once again the Member for Iqaluit has made attempts when he asked the Minister of Education yesterday to move the trades program from Thebacha to Iqaluit, that will not happen.

Mr. Speaker, I must give the Member credit. He has more gall than Caesar. A few short weeks ago, he was championing the cause of moving $13 million from western health boards to eastern health boards, a move which would have seriously disadvantaged the health boards in the west. Now, we see him once again trying to work his wily tricks.

Mr. Speaker, the Member for Iqaluit is a clever, political trickster. He talks to us, look here I speak of compassion and friendship with one hand and in the other hand, he wants to reach into the pocket of the west, take our wallet and empty it out. I do not believe the people of the west or the east for that matter would accept that. If we are going to proceed smoothly to division, we cannot keep doing that. Every time it happens, it just reinforces the fact that there is a shift or there maybe a shift and that we must be vigilant.

Mr. Speaker, I know that is not the intent of this process and I would hope, Mr. Speaker, I request unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Member's Statement 24-13(5): Issues To Address As We Approach Division

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Member for Thebacha is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. We do not have any nays. Members have to be in their seat in order for them to vote or agree on unanimous consent. Mr. Miltenberger , you have unanimous consent.

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Member's Statement 24-13(5): Issues To Address As We Approach Division

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will just conclude by saying once again that we have to pay more than lip service to working together and dealing in good faith with each other. Every time a situation like this comes up, it just reinforces the possible split and bad feeling that could occur. I, for one, Mr. Speaker, do not want to have the last days of this Assembly tarnished by that kind of approach, so I would hope that in future, we will in fact deal in good faith so I will not have to keep reassuring the people that I represent that in fact there will be no looting and pillaging either way in this process. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 24-13(5): Issues To Address As We Approach Division

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mr. Roland . Mr. Picco , you have a point of privilege.

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Member's Statement 24-13(5): Issues To Address As We Approach Division

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Member for Thebacha is implying an ulterior motive with my statement last night about the programs on principal trades, the trades programs to be moved to the Nunavut region. Mr. Speaker, what I was trying to point out was that indeed we do not have those types of trades programs in the east. I have asked that for the last two years to have those types of programs moved. I do not see why we should have people from Pond Inlet or Iqaluit having to travel to Fort Smith so that we can take those types of trades programs. That is what I was saying. He tried to imply that I was trying to loot, his actual words were looting and pillaging.

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Member's Statement 24-13(5): Issues To Address As We Approach Division

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Picco . Your point of privilege, Mr. Picco .

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Point Of Privilege

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My point of privilege is that the Member was trying to accuse me of an ulterior motive in my statement saying I was trying to loot and pillage. Thank you.

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Point Of Privilege

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Member can only rise on a point of privilege if his privilege in this House has been denied and so the Member for Iqaluit does not have a point of privilege. Mr. Picco , your point of order.

Point of Order

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Point Of Privilege

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think under the point of order

section 23(

i) of Beauchesne's Rules of Order that the Member was trying to imply that I had ulterior motives in my statement last night concerning the transfer of programs, trades programs from Thebacha Campus to the east in Iqaluit, Rankin, Cambridge Bay or Nunavut. We do not have those types of trades programs. There was no ulterior motive. I have been saying that for two years. By saying, I wanted to loot and pillage and then on one hand I was using compassion about the hospital transfers are two separate issues. The need was demonstrated, Mr. Speaker, that the underbase of the hospital money in the east was needed.

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Point Of Privilege

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Picco , I will review Hansards and give you my ruling on your point of order. Thank you. In order to clarify the point of order, I would like to ask the Members if they have any debate regarding the point of order. To the point of order. Mr. Miltenberger .

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Point Of Privilege

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Very clearly, I agree with the Member for Iqaluit . He has no ulterior motive. His motive is very naked and obvious. He is intent on moving resources from one community, one region to another. One happens to be in the west and one happens to be in east. I was just acknowledging that fact and saying it has a detrimental effect on the overall process as we move towards division. I concur with the Member. He has no ulterior motive. It is very clear what he want to do and he makes no bones about it. Thank you.

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Point Of Privilege

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Henry . To the point of order. No? Mr. Picco .

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Point Of Privilege

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there is no ulterior motive when we do not have the trades programs. April 1, 1999 is coming. The monies that are given to the Northwest Territories for all the people of the Northwest Territories, that is all I was asking. To imply that I am trying to loot and pillage is incorrect and should be struck down by yourself in the ruling, under

section 23 (i). The rhetoric spewed by the Member for Thebacha over the past few months on east/west splits is not acceptable.

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Point Of Privilege

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 175

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Picco , I have heard the Member for Thebacha , as well as, I have heard you on your

point of order. I must say that you do not have a point of order. Members' statements. Mr. Roland .

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Member's Statement 25-13(5): Beaufort Delta Leaders Conference

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 176

Floyd Roland

Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it seems the long hours in the House have had an effect on some Members during this morning's session. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to notify and bring notice of the plans upcoming in Inuvik. Mr. Speaker, there will be a number of Members of this Assembly who will be travelling to Inuvik next week. The reason for this travel is twofold. One the Members will take

part in the Beaufort Delta leadership conference that is taking place and to see what things are happening in that community. As well, for the second part of this trip, and I hope it will be more of a relaxing atmosphere to be in especially looking at the couple of days we have been through while the Members are in Inuvik. I have organized a charity hockey game between the old-timers of Inuvik and the MLA sharks. A number of Members from this Assembly who have once before skated together will have to dust off their equipment and skate again.

I have recruited some younger legs in the process because I think we will need some support. One of the minor hockey teams from Inuvik will be selecting a number of players to boost our group and, hopefully, we will be able to make it through the three periods of hockey. At the same time, it will give us an opportunity to raise money for minor hockey and youth in the community and a chance to enjoy the new Midnight Sun Recreational Centre, as this will be the first mini-tournament to be held in that facility.

I would like to thank in advance the Members who are going to be attending the Beaufort Delta leaders conference in Inuvik and sharing a game as well for taking the time out of their busy schedules. There are a number of Ministers as well as Members who will take

part in the activities in the Beaufort Delta. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 25-13(5): Beaufort Delta Leaders Conference

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 176

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Members' statements. Mrs. Groenewegen.

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Member's Statement 26-13(5): Apology For Comments Regarding Ministerial Performance

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 176

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, October 23 yesterday, will go down in history as the longest sitting of this Legislature and Mr. Speaker, we went very late into the night last night, into the wee hours of the morning. I have to say in a moment of frustration, regarding a specific issue, I made a comment in the privacy of a Member's office regarding Minister Arlooktoo . It was unfortunate because in fact, I believe Mr. Arlooktoo has handled his portfolios admirably over the past two years.

The timing of a specific issue and the lateness of the hour caused me to say something which I hope the Minister will accept my apology for and for any offence it may have caused him. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 26-13(5): Apology For Comments Regarding Ministerial Performance

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 176

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Mr. Erasmus .

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Member's Statement 27-13(5): Family Wedding Nuptials

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 176

Roy Erasmus

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to inform this House of a joyous occasion. On November 1, next weekend, there will be a marriage in my family. My first begotten son, Roy Junior, will be married to Lyla Fraser, the youngest daughter of Peter Fraser who is a former Member of this House. Pete is a former Member of this House. Mr. Speaker, the ceremony will occur in the Great Hall here which is available to anyone who wants to use it for such occasions. Lyla, is a bright, cheerful and hard working young lady and she has been a welcome addition to our family.

Roy Junior, of course, takes after his dad and he is also bright, cheerful and hard working. I am sure he makes a welcome addition to the Fraser family.

Mr. Speaker, I mentioned that Lyla made a welcome addition to our family and I would like to give an example of that. The young couple met in Yellowknife while my wife and I were in school in Saskatoon, not too long after that, they decided to get a post-secondary education. They both attained certificates in management and Roy Junior also has a Bachelor of Management. In a few months, Lyla will be finished her Bachelor of Arts with majors in both political science and native studies. She is doing work experience in Yellowknife to finish her final course requirements. We are very proud of these two young people.

Mr. Speaker, nobody in this House is a spring chicken. In fact, I am glad nobody had the big one after that marathon yesterday. We all know there can be trying times in a marriage. There are trials and tribulations, good time and bad times and people need to work hard to maintain a good working marriage. These young people have shown level-headedness, perseverance and foresight. One of the first things they did together was to get a university education. I am sure the same level-headedness, perseverance and foresight will prevail.

They will have a long and happy marriage and bring us many bright, cheerful and hard working grandchildren, like their grandfather. I am sure all the honourable Members of this House join my wife and I and Pete and Ellen in wishing our children well in their years ahead. Thank you.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 27-13(5): Family Wedding Nuptials

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 176

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Erasmus . Members' statements. Mr. Ootes .

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Member's Statement 28-13(5): Mid-term Review Process

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 176

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to make some comments for the record about our Mid-Term Review yesterday. I will reference this as to why I would like to make those comments for the record. For some, if not many, the Mid-Term Review process was a worthwhile undertaking, and I was somewhat disappointed that the main headline in the news this morning was a quote by my honourable colleague from Thebacha whereby he said, I can only hope this has been a once in a lifetime experience. At first I thought he was making fatuous statement, Mr. Speaker, but he was deadly

serious with his comment in my opinion. I just want to comment today that for me that process was very worthwhile and I hope it was for others.

--Applause

Thank you. There are many reasons for that, Mr. Speaker. Why it was worthwhile. You know, we have to remember that the public out there needs to know the answers to questions. They need to be informed of what is going on in tie government. One of the methods by which we have the ability to do that is to speak here in the House and just because we have to sit here for seventeen hours, which frankly, Mr. Speaker, to me, was not that big of an undertaking. I have done that many, many times in my life, many more hours than that. So while, yes, it is straining and very stressful at times, I understand that.

I do not think we should pat ourselves on the back, just because we sat here for seventeen hours. That is our job to bring forward, we had all agreed it would be done over two days. We could not change it.

The other point is, that Cabinet was elected by us, by us, as Members here. Not as an overall general public election. Therefore, it is important that we demonstrate to the public and Cabinet had the opportunity to respond in a way where we are going from here. I think it served that purpose. For me, a future Legislature should undertake this at all times as long as the Members here elect the Members of Cabinet. A Mid-Term Review, as we have proven, is beneficial. It is productive and it can lead us from here. It is, to me, very worthwhile. We are going tabulate a beneficial report that we can take from here for our next...

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Member's Statement 28-13(5): Mid-term Review Process

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 177

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Ootes .

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Member's Statement 28-13(5): Mid-term Review Process

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 177

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Member's Statement 28-13(5): Mid-term Review Process

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 177

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Member for Yellowknife Centre is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Ootes , you have unanimous consent.

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Member's Statement 28-13(5): Mid-term Review Process

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 177

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will close my comments with a comment I think the Cabinet is well aware of the comment. Do not rest on your laurels. Thank you.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 28-13(5): Mid-term Review Process

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 177

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mr. Barnabas .

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Member's Statement 29-13(5): Canada - Greenland Relations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 177

Levi Barnabas

High Arctic

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I will speak in Inuktitut. (Translation). Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The communities that I represent have people that come from other communities such as people from Greenland and when they have to get medical attention, people from Kanak will have to pay their own medical treatment and travel. There is a problem with this. My purpose for speaking up on this is because if a person from Greenland is moving to Canada, then they have to wait a long time to get citizenship.

If they meet somebody from Canada, then they have to get their paper work done or they would have to find a job and work in Canada. I think we have to look at the legislation that comes from other countries to deal with these problems. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. (Translation ends.)

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Member's Statement 29-13(5): Canada - Greenland Relations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 177

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mr. Krutko .

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Member's Statement 30-13(5): Keewatin Resupply Initiative

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 177

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there are times in our Assembly when issues are dealt with and debated by Members to the particular Ministers. As Members, we return to issues and ask questions. Sometimes the questions we ask and the issues that we raise may be redundant. Mr. Speaker, we return to those issues time and time again and repeat the questions because we are not satisfied with the answers we receive, and we are not satisfied that our issues and concerns are being heard. For that reason, I must return to an item that is facing this House, the Keewatin resupply.

For many years, fuel has been barged to eastern Arctic communities and delivered cargo and fuel. The barges delivering fuel and cargo to each community each year were able to meet the demands knowing there was another barge that would take supplies during the summer season. Although the communities are satisfied with the barging service in the eastern Arctic and the Keewatin communities, it seems the government is not. The government is pursuing another alternative which involves the use of tankers.

For this alternative to be implemented, money must be spent to construct pipelines and facilities to deliver fuel from the tankers. Fuel delivery is linked to cargo delivery for the docks, barges and tankers used for hauling cargo. Communities that receive fuel by tankers may only have barge service once a year.

In regard to the items that are needed in order to complete a construction season, they may not be able to bring these items by barge. The other alternative is air freight . The cost of air freight. to the communities and the cost of building is a lot in these communities.

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Member's Statement 30-13(5): Keewatin Resupply Initiative

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 177

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Member for Mackenzie Delta is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Krutko , you have unanimous consent.

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Member's Statement 30-13(5): Keewatin Resupply Initiative

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 177

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Air freight is costly when it comes to building supplies and other large items. This is something that the government should keep in mind when reviewing plans for construction projects.

Mr. Speaker, in our present economic times, we have had to make a lot of cuts and a lot of hard decisions building the pipelines versus proposed air fare freight and the cost to our government. Northern Transportation Company Limited presently holds a contract for fuel resupply to the Keewatin and the eastern Arctic. They have worked with this government to cut costs and have developed a new marine resupply structure that will further lower costs to the consumer.

The residents in the communities of the Arctic are satisfied with the present system, Mr. Speaker. All we can do is return to an old item and continue to debate it in this House. If something is not broken, why fix it? Mr. Speaker, because I am not satisfied with the answers that I have received in the past, I must return to this question and the reasons behind the government's decision to pursue the tanker delivery in regard to the eastern Arctic. In closing, Mr. Speaker, I would like to state the passing of my aunt, Bertha MacLaren, on Wednesday at 10:30 p.m., the 22nd of October in Langley, BC. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Member's Statement 30-13(5): Keewatin Resupply Initiative

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 178

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Mr. Todd .

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Return To Oral Question 2-13: Environmental Liiability Site Inventory

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 178

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

2-13(5): Environmental Liability Site Inventory

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Return To Oral Question 2-13: Environmental Liiability Site Inventory

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 178

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Yes, thank you, Mr. Speaker. Return to oral question asked by Mr. Picco on October 21, 1997, regarding Environmental Liability Site Inventory.

The report provided to the Standing Committee on Government Operations listed sites on the Commissioner's land that might have a potential environmental liability to the Government of the Northwest Territories associated with the use of the land. The report also indicated that there might be a federal and/or joint responsibility for a portion of the potential environmental liabilities. The reason for this is that some of the sites were transferred to the territorial government by the federal government over the years, as program responsibility was transferred.

We are not in a position to pursue this matter with the federal government at this time. We must first identify those sites that were transferred from the federal government by checking historical records and verifying title documents. Site audits would then be required in order to evaluate the potential liabilities. As you are aware, these types of audits are very costly, and we do not have the resources available to conduct them at this time. Without taking these steps there would be no basis for negotiation with the federal government.

As resources permit, our government will be pursuing the issue of environmental liabilities and will be approaching the federal government as appropriate. Thank you.

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Return To Oral Question 2-13: Environmental Liiability Site Inventory

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 178

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Returns to oral questions. Mr. Todd .

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Return To Oral Question 22-13(5): Aurora Fund Eligibility

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 178

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Return to an oral question asked by Mr. Picco on October 22nd, in relation to the Aurora Fund.

There is no legal barrier to a loan being made by the Aurora Fund to an ordinary Member, Minister, or to a corporation in which she or he has an interest, so long as the Member or Minister is not an officer or director of the Aurora Fund.

The conflict guidelines in the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act place the onus on the Member or Minister to disclose his or her business interests. There is no onus on the Aurora Fund to safeguard the Member or the Minister from placing himself or herself in a conflict of interest.

If a conflict was apparent the board would no doubt give it due consideration.

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Return To Oral Question 22-13(5): Aurora Fund Eligibility

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 178

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery.

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 178

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I take pleasure today in recognizing Pat Thomas, NWTTA president and former constituent. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 178

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Before we go to oral questions, we will take 15-minute break.

--Break

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 178

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The House will come back to order. Before we get into oral questions, I would like to provide my ruling on a point of order raised by the Member for Kivallivik , Mr. O'Brien , on October 22, 1997. The point of order that Mr. O'Brien raised was under rule 23(1) and I quote that rule: "in debate a Member will be called to order by the Speaker, if the Member imputes false or hidden motives to another Member". The point of order was raised by Mr. O'Brien and is contained on pages 55 and 56 of the unedited Hansard.

Mr. O'Brien raised his point of order in response to the following statement made by the Honourable Goo Arlooktoo , in answering an oral question that had been posed by Mr. O'Brien . Mr. Arlooktoo , in his reply, to a supplementary question, indicated the following and I quote, "There were an adequate number of meetings held of the Steering Committee which the Member chaired of which I understand, the Member also missed several meetings that were very crucial and important". Mr. O'Brien then raised his point of order and stated the following and I quote: "Mr.

Speaker, I take exception to the Minister's comments that I, as Chair of the committee, missed several meetings. That is utter nonsense. This is a false statement, and I ask him to retract. Thank you."

Before proceeding with the ruling, I must bring to the Members' attention that the words, false statement and misrepresent have been ruled unparliamentary language, and I urge Members to observe this fact. In the case before us, the rule that Mr. O'Brien cited to raise his point of order was not infringed. I can find no imputation or false or hidden motives in Mr. Arlooktoo 's remarks in question. I submit that Mr. O'Brien would have probably raised a point of order under rule 23(j), which states: "charges another Member with uttering a deliberate falsehood".

It is not the responsibility of the Speaker to decide if the account of a situation by one Member is correct versus another Member's

interpretation or understanding of a particular situation. I offer citation 494 from Beauchesne's Parliamentary Rules and Form, 6th edition, and I quote: "It has been formally ruled by Speakers that statements by Members respecting themselves and particularly within their own knowledge must be accepted. It is not unparliamentary temperately to criticize statements made by Members as being contrary to the facts, but no imputation of intentional falsehood is permissible. On rare occasions, this may result in the House having to accept two contradictory accounts of the same incident".

As provided for in our rules and further confirmed by citation 494, a Member's statement must be accepted on face value. I trust that no Member in the House would intentionally make any statement that would tend to mislead the House.

Therefore, in this case, I must rule that Mr. O'Brien does not have a point of order and further that this House is prepared to accept more than one account of the same incident in keeping with Parliamentary tradition. In future I would hope that all honourable Members will be more selective in their choice of words, so as to avoid similar, unnecessary occurrences. Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Krutko .

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Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Minister of Public Works . It is in regard to my opening statement in regard to the Keewatin resupply. Mr. Speaker, my question is, the present delivery of fuel and cargo is done by a northern company. I am concerned that if the government pursues the tanker delivery policy that the contract for resupply could not be done by a northern company and would have to be awarded to a southern company. Can the Minister tell the House if there are any northern companies that have tankers that can be used to delivery fuel at the present time?

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Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Public Works and Services , Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Return To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I believe this is a question that I answered very early this morning if the Member checks Hansard. It is important to remember, once again, that the present carrier of choice that NTCL has enjoyed was introduced in 1985 by the government then, for a period of eight years. The intention then was to assist the company in making sure that they were the only ones that got the contract and give them a chance to become viable. The agreement in 1985 was that this preferential policy would go on for eight years. That was to end in 1993.

In the past few years, the government has made moves to make these types of contracts more competitive because everybody agrees, I believe, that the way the present contract is given in the Keewatin is not a competitive process. So that is what we are doing. We are levelling the playing field so that it does make it possible to get a more competitive price, and all the information we have suggests that there are other interested parties, including other first rate corporations that are ready to put forward proposals if they are given the chance, as with NTCL. Thank you.

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Return To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will have to rephrase the question or make it a little simpler so that the Minister can understand. The question was, can the Minister tell the House are there any northern companies that have tankers that can be used to deliver fuel at the present time?

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Supplementary To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Further Return To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am not trying to avoid the question, but I think that is kind of beside the point. For example, the Northern Transportation Company Limited was awarded a three year, $90 million contract for the eastern Arctic sealift this past year, and I recall very clearly, the signing ceremony that we had in Iqaluit. It was not because the Northern Transportation Company Limited necessarily had any tankers. I do not believe they do. Because what they were able to do is to put a proposal forward in partnership and in procuring tankers out in the global market and use that to their advantage.

That is the way I believe all the tanker contracts are done, with these partnerships. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can the Minister tell the House if a study of the implications of this decision has been completed as to how other communities will be affected in regard to this decision?

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Supplementary To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Further Return To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 179

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We have very clear evidence at this point of very significant long term savings for all the communities in the Keewatin region and can look forward to many years of lower gasoline prices

for the hunters and lower fuel prices for the home owners in the region. I think more significant than lower fuel prices for the government in general because in the end the government is the major consumer of these fuel products. We do have very clear evidence that there will be significant savings for the affected communities.

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Further Return To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Final Supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can the Minister tell the House in regard to the cost savings to all northerners, not just one particular region, will there be efforts made in a similar notion to all other regions and communities in the Northwest Territories by way of this endeavour which will have an implication on the cost of fuel to all communities? Will there be savings across the board to all communities in regard to fuel prices from one region to the other?

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Supplementary To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Further Return To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We have already gone through this process for all the other regions in the Nunavut area of the eastern Arctic fuel resupply, and I believe the resupply that is done in the Kitikmeot area is done through a competitive basis, where companies bid on these specific, large contracts. That has already been done and incidently, the winning company in all of those has been NTCL, to their credit. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Question 25-13(5): Keewatin Pipeline Resupply Proposal

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Henry .

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Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think that we have all acknowledged that the diamond industry, which is new to the Northwest Territories and to Canada, has untold financial resources available for all Canadians in the form of royalties. It is estimated the BHP project alone can generate $2.5 billion for all Canadians. I understand and accept that part of the responsibility for ensuring that Canada gets a good royalty regime from the diamond industry lies in the hands of the Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development.

It will be important that the mining regulations, which are being presently worked on, have enough teeth to ensure that all Canadians do get the resources that this development will bring in the form of royalties. I recognize, Mr. Speaker, this is a national issue and it may not have the calibre of exposure. I think it should and that is what we are trying to raise here in the Northwest Territories.

I am wondering if the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development could advise this House if he has any knowledge as to the number of people the federal department has working on this important issue in advising the Minister. Does he know the number of people employed and working on this initiative? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Return To Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, the information I have is there is less than a handful of people within the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs who are assigned to the job of advising the Minister of Indian and Northern Affairs on how and what type of position the department should take on behalf of the federal government and on behalf of the people in the north with regard to what type of conditions the federal government should make known to the Canadian public, what their expectations are in regard to the production of and sale of diamonds.

I know because the man spoke quite clearly on CBC a month ago, much to the disagreement of Members here in the House. Joe Lazarovich seemed to be the principal advisor within the department that provides recommendations and advice to the Minister in regard to how to handle the issue of diamonds. Thank you.

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Return To Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Henry .

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Supplementary To Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I thank the Minister for that. I noted in the Minister's comments he believes there is a handful of people working on it and he mentioned one individual in particular. I realize the Minister is dealing with his counterpart, Ms. Stewart, but has he had any other conversations with other federal Ministers to ascertain their knowledge on the diamond industry for Canada? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, it is the practice of this government, as well as the practice of the federal government, to respect the role that the Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development plays in relation to federal issues in the Northwest Territories. Issues relating to aboriginal issues, resource issues, land and water issues that are clearly the Minister of Indian and Northern Affairs, plays the primary lead role and that other Ministers are, in many cases, playing a secondary roll. Always, we try to speak first to the Minister and then we seek to speak to other Ministers as well. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Henry .

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Supplementary To Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 180

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes, I prefix my remark previously by acknowledging that I understood the Minister would deal with his counterpart, Ms. Stewart. I was

trying to ascertain if he had any conversations with other Ministers to see if they were knowledgeable on the topic but I accept the Minister's response to this. However, my question to the Minister is, the Government of the Northwest Territories and his department plays a minor roll, less important than the person who is directly writing the regulations. How many employees does the Minister have working on the diamond issue within the Government of the Northwest Territories' department? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We have about four officials within the department who are engaging in the issue on our behalf. I should point out to the Member that, on the earlier part of the question, I was trying to respect the understanding and have not spoken to any other federal Ministers in regard to this issue. We do have a meeting on Monday with the Minister of Indian Affairs, Jane Stewart. We also have a meeting with the Minister of Finance at the same time. Mr. Todd will be in attendance and the royalty part of the diamond issue will be discussed with Mr. Martin.

I expect that we will seek a meeting to discuss the policies of Natural Resources Canada, the Minister Ralph Goodale, to seek clarification on the application of the policies of that department in regard to diamonds in the Northwest Territories. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Question 26-13(5): Diamond Mining Regulations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Ningark .

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Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

John Ningark

Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is directed to my friend and colleague, Mr. Arlooktoo , Minister of Public Works and Services . Before I ask the question, I would like to commend the Minister for providing business opportunities for people of Natilikmiot since he took office. Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to Mr. Arlooktoo regarding Keewatin fuel resupply. For the record, can the Minister assure this House and the people of Natilikmiot region, assuming that Keewatin fuel resupply should be constructed, it will not have a negative impact on the Natilikmiot region?

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Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Public Works and Services , Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Return To Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes. I can give that assurance from the point of view that the resupply contract for these two regions are separate. They are done at different times in different ways, although, they are presently done by the same company. The company used different ports and separate equipment from the two communities of the frontier regions. It is my understanding they are stand alone viable contracts. I would expect that to continue. Thank you.

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Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ningark .

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Supplementary To Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

John Ningark

Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Supplementary to the same honourable Minister. The Minister has implied in his statement the immediate cost saved will be enjoyed by the people of Keewatin. Will the Minister assure me and the people of Natilikmiot, if and when the Keewatin resupply is built, the same benefit will be enjoyed by the people of the Natilikmiot region? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Further Return To Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes. From the point of view that the Nunavut government especially will be spending less money on the transportation of fuel to a region of Nunavut which at this time is extremely costly. Therefore, the government spending less money on the transportation of a commodity means there is money freed up for other things. I guess that would be a general statement on overall benefits to everyone. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Question 27-13(5): Baffin/kitikmeot Resupply Contracts

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Barnabas .

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Question 28-13(5): Arctic Bay Sewage Lagoon Improvements

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

Levi Barnabas

High Arctic

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is directed to the Honourable Manitok Thompson . The hamlet of Arctic Bay has been requesting, for a number of years, to improve their sewage lagoon. I was wondering what her department has done to address this problem? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 28-13(5): Arctic Bay Sewage Lagoon Improvements

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for Municipal and Community Affairs , Ms. Thompson .

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Question 28-13(5): Arctic Bay Sewage Lagoon Improvements

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

Manitok Thompson

Aivilik

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will be speaking in Inuktitut. I wish to thank the honourable Member for High Arctic . He comes to me to speak about some concerns for his constituency and he often comes to me to relay some concerns that have been expressed by his constituents and I have instructed my officials to contact Mr. Barnabas ' constituency regarding this issue. (Translation ends) The project will take place as scheduled in 1998/99. The staff have been talking to the community and we are working with the community. We realize this is a priority for the community. The project will be taking place in 1998/99. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 28-13(5): Arctic Bay Sewage Lagoon Improvements

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Ootes .

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Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to ask a question about the sensitive issue of the recent report of the RCMP investigation under way within the Government of the Northwest Territories. I have been asked by my constituents to try and clear the air about a further matter. My question is to the Minister of Justice . Could the Minister of Justice tell us if he is aware of any contact or request by the RCMP for documents from this government?

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Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Justice .

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Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker I am aware there have been some documents requested and reviewed by some members of the RCMP.

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Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes .

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Supplementary To Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Could the Minister tell us if the RCMP have taken into their custody documents from this government?

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Supplementary To Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Ng .

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Further Return To Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. No. I am not aware of that.

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Further Return To Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes .

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Supplementary To Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Would the Minister tell us if he is aware of the particular documents that have been taken into custody?

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Supplementary To Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Ng .

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Further Return To Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Mr. Speaker. I said I was not aware if there were any documents taken into custody. No. I am not aware of what documents they had reviewed. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Question 29-13(5): Documents Requested Under Rcmp Investigation

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Henry .

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Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question today is to Mr. Kakfwi , the Minister responsible for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development . The Minister presented a paper in the House today on the NWT Protected Area Strategy and update. I noted the Minister talked about job creation as the number one priority. I think that is the most important thing we have on our agenda for the next two years. I believe business can help create those jobs. I did not see any reference in the documents to the mining sector, which I suggest has a great potential to create the jobs the Minister has talked about.

I would ask the Minister my first question. What consultations have taken place with the mining industry with regard to this protected area strategy? I see everyone else referred to, but do not note if anyone has had any consultations with the mining sector. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister responsible for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. One of the messages we received through the conference on Protected Area Strategy last March, acknowledged by industry. It was that the principal parties involved would be the federal government, the territorial government and the aboriginal organizations since much of the land and the resources that are on the table here are with these three principal parties. Industry will be invited and encouraged to participal but the principle format that will be developed will be between those parties.

It is with that in mind that we are beginning in the first instance to initiate some primary dialogue with the aboriginal groups. Of course, the stake and the interest that is, for instance, mining companies have on ensuring access to the land and resources is also fundamental, but we do need to set some primary rules on how we are going to develop the format that would allow for all stakeholders to eventually have their interests and concerns provided for in this strategy. That is the initial part of the work that we see unfolding. Thank you.

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Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Henry .

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Supplementary To Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question to the Minister is, will the claims by industry where they have spent financial resources to assay what may be there in the way of minerals be protected and those individuals or companies still have rights to the areas that they have staked? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi . It is a technical question.

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Further Return To Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 182

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, I think it is a bit difficult to answer that question, but Members can look on the behaviour of the federal government where they were asked to

reconcile the interest of aboriginal groups in the negotiating forum with existing third party interests . In every instance that I know of where claims have been negotiated and where third party interest existed, the federal government has taken great pains and gone to great lengths to ensure that existing third party interests were provided for. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 183

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Henry .

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Supplementary To Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 183

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think the Minister was very clear on the position of the federal government. I assume that is the position of the Government of the Northwest Territories also. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 183

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 183

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, it has been our view that the principal role that we play in many of these cases is to ensure that as much as possible the primary interest of the aboriginal groups should be advanced as much as possible. The interest of industry and the interest of environmental groups, for instance, are legitimate interests, but the fundamental rights and the fundamental interest of the people, in this case the aboriginal people, has always been the foremost interest of this government in making sure that they are provided for as much as possible.

It is not an either or position, but we have always taken the position in the negotiations to support as much as possible the position of the aboriginal groups without causing the interests of for instance third party interest to be compromised. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Question 30-13(5): Mining Sector Interests In Protected Areas

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 183

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Picco .

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Question 31-13(5): Aurora Fund Investment Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 183

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in response to an oral question given today by Mr. Todd concerning the Aurora Investment Fund, Mr. Todd explained that there is no legal barrier to a loan being made by the Aurora fund to an Ordinary Member or to a Minister, to a corporation in which he or she has an interest as long as the Member or Minister is not an officer or director of the Aurora fund. It will take me sometime to digest that. I would like to follow up on a question concerning the rules and regulations of the fund. I am wondering if the Minister is able at this time to table rules and regulations guiding the Aurora fund.

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Question 31-13(5): Aurora Fund Investment Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 183

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Finance , Mr. Todd .

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Question 31-13(5): Aurora Fund Investment Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 183

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Well, first of all, let me applaud my honourable colleague for having me re-examine the conditions of the Aurora fund and given that, I was given a reading this morning in relationship to Members and the Ministers. It is perhaps very important that we ensure that there is transparency in this fund. I am prepared to do whatever is necessary to reassure the public and to reassure my colleague with respect to this fund. Now I understand all the more clearly how the definition we have in relationship to politicians.

I think it is imperative now that there will be transparency in that to ensure the public realizes what the conditions and the criteria are to set the fund. So I am prepared to table whatever is necessary to reassure the public and I want to thank my honourable colleague for bringing this to my attention earlier last week.

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Question 31-13(5): Aurora Fund Investment Policies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 183

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Picco .

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