Debates of July 27th, 1999

This is page numbers 631 - 660 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 7th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was aboriginal .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Northern Nurse Honoured

Annual Meeting Of Ministers Responsible For The Status Of Women

Northern Resource Development

Community Government Leaders' Conference

Canada Millennium Scholarship

Lack Of Support To Communities Outside Yellowknife

Small Communities' Historical Contribution To The Nwt

Non-renewable Resource Development Potential

Recruitment And Retention Of Health Professionals

Competitive Wages For NWT Nursing Professionals

Resource Revenue-sharing Issues

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Cultural And Language Programming In School

Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Process For Capital Changes

Capital Funding For Correctional Centre

Protection Of Young Offenders

Written Question 8-13(7): Impact Of Spending Initiatives In Yellowknife On The Territorial Deficit

Committee Report 2-13(7) Report On Bill 15:

An Act To Amend The Legislative Assembly And Executive Council Act

Committee Report 3-13(7): Report On Bill 16:

An Act To Amend The Supplementary Retiring Allowances Act

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills

Tabled Document 57-13(7): Annual Report Of The Languages Commissioner Of The Nwt, Fiscal Year 1997-98

Bill 22: Access To Information And Protection Of Privacy Statutes Amendment Act

Bill 24:

An Act To Amend The Access To Information And Protection Of Privacy Act

Bill 25:

An Act To Amend The Workers' Compensation Act

Item 16: Motions

Setting Hours Of Speaker

Item 17: First Reading Of Bills

Bill 22: Access To Information And Protection Of Privacy Statutes Amendment Act

Bill 23: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1999-2000

Bill 24:

An Act To Amend The Access To Information And Protection Of Privacy Act

Item 18: Second Reading Of Bills

Bill 23: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1999-2000

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Item 21: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Honourable Jim Antoine , Honourable Charles Dent , Mr. Erasmus , Honourable Sam Gargan, Mrs. Groenewegen , Mr. Henry , Honourable Stephen Kakfwi , Mr. Krutko , Honourable Michael Miltenberger , Mr. Morin , Mr. Ootes , Mr. Rabesca , Honourable Floyd Roland , Honourable Vince Steen .

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Oh, God, may your spirit and guidance be in us as we work for the benefit of all our people, for peace and justice in our land and for the constant recognition of the dignity and aspirations of those whom we serve. Amen.

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 631

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Orders of the day, item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Dent .

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Minister's Statement 71-13(7): Northern Nurse Honoured

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 631

Floyd Roland

Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to inform the Members of the Legislative Assembly that three long serving northern nurses have been honoured by their colleagues for their outstanding contribution to health care in the north. Ms. Mary Ellen Hoyles of Yellowknife, Ms. Rosalie Adams of Inuvik and Ms. Faye Stark of Fort Providence were nominated by nurses from across the NWT. Together, these three women have provided over 60 years of dedicated nursing service in the North.

To recognize their achievement, the Department of Health and Social Services sponsored the three nurses to attend the Centennial Conference of the International Council of Nurses in London, England, from June 27 to July 1, 1999. Ms. Sylvia Stard also attended the conference on behalf of the NWT Registered Nurses Association Board of Directors. Ms. Nell Vrolyk, manager of recruitment and retention, attended on behalf of the department. Ms. Vrolyk and Ms. Stard are also long serving northern nurses.

The International Council of Nurses (ICN) is an international organization of national nursing associations. It has over 90 member countries and represents over one and a half million nurses around the globe. ICN's mission is to provide leadership and assistance in resolving present and future health care needs.

Over 5,000 nurses from member countries attended this year's conference. London was chosen for this special 100th anniversary celebration of the ICN because it is the birthplace of Florence Nightingale; the founder of modern day nursing.

We also learned that we have the display materials, handouts and information packages to be competitive in the global marketplace. Our nurses received many compliments on the quality and attractiveness of our booth display and informational materials from other exhibitors, as well as conference participants. With our high quality recruitment materials, we have now gained exposure as an employer of nurses with the rest of the world.

Mr. Speaker, recognition of northern nurses is an important part of our Recruitment and Retention Strategy. I am happy that we were able to send these outstanding northern nurses to London. I would like to thank them for the job they did to help the department recruit nurses and promote nursing careers in the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Minister's Statement 71-13(7): Northern Nurse Honoured

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 631

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Mr. Dent .

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Minister's Statement 72-13(7): Annual Meeting Of Ministers Responsible For The Status Of Women

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 631

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Good afternoon. Mr. Speaker, the annual meeting of Federal/Provincial/Territorial Ministers Responsible for the Status of Women was held in Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island, from July 7th to 9th, 1999.

The meeting was co-chaired by the Honourable Hedy Fry, Secretary of State (Status of Women) and the Honourable Patricia Mella, Minister Responsible for the Status of Women for Prince Edward Island. It gave Ministers an opportunity to address a number of issues that continue to work against women achieving full social and economic equality.

Women's economic security continues to be an important issue for Ministers across Canada. In reviewing the report of the House of Commons Finance Sub-Committee on Tax Equity for Canadian Families with Dependent Children, we agreed on the importance of ensuring that all public policy, in particular, tax policy, reflects and supports economic equality for women.

Ministers Responsible for the Status of Women reaffirmed their commitments to eliminating violence against women with the adoption of "Preventing Violence Against Women, A Strategic Framework". The framework was developed to guide policy and program development in the area of violence prevention. It is based on a common vision and shared goals and follows the Iqaluit Declaration released by Ministers in December, 1998.

The framework describes strategies and initiatives that work across Canada, and the important work at the community level to eliminate violence against women as well as the many consequences of violence. Ministers also agreed to pursue a collaborative approach to address criminal harassment, more commonly known as "stalking".

We agreed to follow up on issues of concern to older women and aging. Some of the major challenges facing the well-being of older women today include low income, care giving responsibilities and health issues. This being the International Year of Older Persons, we discussed the diverse needs of older women and agreed to work collaboratively with Ministers Responsible for Seniors to address these challenges.

This was my first Federal/Provincial/Territorial meeting as Minister Responsible for the Status of Women. I will continue to work with my Cabinet colleagues and the Status of Woman Council of the NWT, the Native Women's Association, as well as representatives of other women's organizations in the NWT to do what we can to improve the lives of northern women. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Minister's Statement 72-13(7): Annual Meeting Of Ministers Responsible For The Status Of Women

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 632

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Mr. Kakfwi .

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Minister's Statement 73-13(7): Northern Resource Development

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 632

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the economy of the Northwest Territories depends to a large extent on the development of our natural resources. Gold, diamonds, base metals, oil and gas all play a significant role in our economy. They will continue to play an increasing role in years to come. Mr. Speaker, the economy of the Northwest Territories depends to a large extent on the development of our natural resources. Gold, diamonds, base metals, oil and gas all play a significant role in our economy and they will continue to play an increasing role in years to come.

We are entering a new era in resource development here in the Northwest Territories. Natural gas demand is growing in the United States and southern Canada. We fully expect the Northwest Territories will be a source of this much needed supply. We currently possess vast resources of natural gas ranging from those on land in the Deh Cho region to those near Colville Lake, the Mackenzie Delta and the Beaufort Sea. The time to develop these gas reserves is now upon us.

I would like to take this opportunity to recognize one of the men responsible for bringing about this new era in oil and gas development. Chief Harry Deneron of Fort Liard realized several years ago the potential for gas development in the Liard area. He actively encouraged its exploration and development. This activity has resulted in substantial jobs and opportunities for northern residents and businesses. Chief Deneron is to be commended for his vision and work.

Increased exploration and development activity is already occurring. Fourteen leases have been issued in the Liard area while the Sahtu has 15 active leases. The Mackenzie Beaufort Delta is drawing renewed interest. Bids are now being accepted for four parcels of land. Eleven new wells are expected to be drilled in the Northwest Territories during the 1999-2000 season.

Mr. Speaker, the government anticipates that within ten years, a gas pipeline will link the Beaufort, Deh Cho and Sahtu gas fields to southern markets. The construction of the main trunk, the gathering pipelines and the exploration to support this development will result in up to ten times the level of employment and business opportunities and resource revenue as the north's emerging diamond industry. The government must be prepared to address the many issues that will accompany this Mackenzie Valley development.

We must ensure that development of northern resources results in the maximum employment, training, and business opportunities for Northerners, who must begin to prepare for the social impacts from this short-term, large-scale development. We must ensure that the Northwest Territories benefits from resource revenue sharing. We must maximize benefits to aboriginal organizations.

Mr. Speaker, we know the benefits and challenges that come with increased oil and gas exploration. As we move forward with development, we must prepare for what is to come. Resource development does not just happen. It must be encouraged. It must be managed, and it must result in significant benefits to Northerners.

The government has approved the formation of a deputy ministers' committee to identify issues and prepare recommendations relating to the management of Mackenzie Valley development. It will be chaired by the deputy Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development and include the Secretary to the Financial Management Board, the deputy ministers of Aboriginal Affairs, Education, Culture and Employment, Finance, Health and Social Services, Transportation and Municipal and Community Affairs.

Mr. Speaker, the government is taking a proactive approach to development in the Mackenzie Valley. We intend to maximize economic opportunities for Northerners while minimizing the social and environmental impacts associated with oil and gas development. Mahsi cho.

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Minister's Statement 73-13(7): Northern Resource Development

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 632

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Mr. Steen .

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Minister's Statement 74-13(7): Community Government Leaders' Conference

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 632

Vince Steen

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I would like to report on the recent conference of elected community leaders held in Hay River to discuss the various self-government initiatives that are underway in the NWT.

Presentations to the conference outlined how constitutional development and aboriginal rights could result in new types of government at the community, regional, tribal and territorial levels. Conference delegates also heard about how self-government has been negotiated and implemented in Newfoundland, British Columbia, and the Yukon. The approaches taken by the Labrador Inuit, the Nisga'a Tribal Council in B.C., and Yukon First Nations were quite different from each other, and different from what is happening here.

The success of those different approaches demonstrates that while there is more than one way to implement self-government, we are all working towards the same thing. By working together we can bring more authority to our communities.

Mr. Speaker, self-government will also mean more powers and responsibility for aboriginal governments as the inherent right to self-government is implemented here in the Northwest Territories. This includes more control for aboriginal people over such things as education, health, social services, language and culture.

Conference delegates agreed that while these changes might make our system of governance look very different from the way it is now, most of the programs and services that are delivered in our communities today will still be needed tomorrow. Community governments will still have a big role to play in delivering them.

Mr. Speaker, the Premier , the Minister of Finance , and the Minister of RWED made presentations to the delegates. They outlined how the government's plan is to work with the Aboriginal Nations to advance aboriginal rights negotiations in all regions of the NWT and to work towards developing a new constitution.

Conference delegates were assured that as we engage in these processes, we will make sure that the result is an effective and workable system of government - a system that can deliver affordable programs to all residents. One of the priorities my department has set to make this happen is to bring proposals forward to make municipal programs work better, to be more effective, to be more efficient, and to bring more authority to the local level. To do this we are moving ahead with the municipal finance review and the municipal legislation review.

These two initiatives were also discussed at the Community Leaders' Conference. They should be seen as complementary to self-government and not as an alternative process. They are intended to provide more authority to community governments and to allow for more flexible, equitable, and transparent arrangements between the central government and community governments.

Mr. Speaker, while self-government may take those processes much further in some communities or regions, we will be moving ahead with legislative and financial reform, because the people want to have more authority at the local level. They want to have decisions made closer to home. They want to be making those decisions themselves.

At the end of the three days, delegates to the conference concluded that they need to be better informed as progress is made on the establishment of self-government authorities. Procedures need to be in place to provide this information and the department will attempt to address this issue. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 74-13(7): Community Government Leaders' Conference

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 633

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Mr. Miltenberger .

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Minister's Statement 75-13(7): Canada Millennium Scholarship

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 633

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you. Mr. Speaker, it was my great pleasure to sign an agreement recently with the Canada Millennium Scholarship Foundation. This will bring up to 4.3 million dollars to the NWT post-secondary students over the next ten years.

The first scholarships will be awarded in the coming school year. In 1999-2000, 133 awards of $3,000 each will be given to NWT students. This is an additional $413,000 available to post-secondary students. This number of scholarships will be available in each of the next three years for a total of $1.239 million. The 133 scholarships will be awarded based on financial need and academic merit.

There is also a category of awards for exceptional merit. These awards are based on leadership, academic excellence and community service. Five awards will be made at the community level and two more at the territorial level. The seven winners of these awards will also receive an additional $3,000.

The names of the territorial level award winners will be forwarded to the Foundation which will also select a single national level scholarship. Mr. Speaker, all of the awards will be provided to the successful student applicants on top of their existing student financial assistance entitlement.

The Canada Millennium Scholarships will be processed through the existing NWT student financial assistance program. All students who have successfully completed at least one year of post-secondary program with a 60 percent average or better are eligible to apply for the scholarships.

The Department of Education, Culture and Employment is currently informing students who have applied for student financial assistance about the scholarships and the application procedures for the financial need awards. The department is developing the guidelines for administering the exceptional merit awards and will be communicating the details to students and the public shortly.

Candidates for the scholarships will be identified by the end of October and the names forwarded to the foundation so that cheques can be produced and in the hands of students by January, 2000.

Mr. Speaker, the Government of the Northwest Territories is very pleased to be a partner with the Canada Millennium Scholarship Foundation in this program to provide increased support to our post-secondary students. With the high cost of post-secondary education, these scholarships are a welcome addition to our existing student financial assistance program. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 75-13(7): Canada Millennium Scholarship

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 634

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Morin .

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Member's Statement 181-13(7): Lack Of Support To Communities Outside Yellowknife

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 634

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yesterday in the Legislative Assembly we raised the issue of the brand new Yellowknife correctional centre. That is another capital project for our great city of Yellowknife. Along with that capital project, Mr. Speaker, comes a brand new paving project for the city of Yellowknife and the highway coming into Yellowknife. Along with that also comes millions of dollars of assistance to the gold mines in Yellowknife.

Along with that comes the majority of effort of the economic development department and the Minister of RWED and that whole department in encouraging diamond-cutting facilities and polishing facilities in Yellowknife. On top of that, they are going to take a trade mission to Nunavut for the businesses in Yellowknife. I congratulate the government for all those things they are doing for our great capital.

Mr. Speaker, we have many, many other communities out there. We have many regions out there that are going through economic hard times. We do not have enough money to assist the fishermen who come off the lake after 40 below in the winter, frostbitten, skin-tight, working hard, pulling nets. What do we do with those people? We cut $150,000 from their subsidy. That is a whole winter freight subsidy for those poor hardworking men and women. We are cutting drug and alcohol programs.

We cut funding to the small communities that harvest renewable resources and try to make a living by producing final products for those, but yet we can continually invest in our great capital city, Yellowknife, and we do that by putting budgets forward in this House that call for renovations. Then we change them to new projects. No debate, no process for Ordinary Members in this Assembly to have any input into making those decisions. I guess this is a new era, a new way of governing. It must be a government that cannot see beyond our city limits. There are people out there who depend heavily on this government.

I would like to ask for unanimous consent to continue, Mr. Speaker.

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Member's Statement 181-13(7): Lack Of Support To Communities Outside Yellowknife

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 634

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Member for Tu Nedhe is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Morin , you have unanimous consent.

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Member's Statement 181-13(7): Lack Of Support To Communities Outside Yellowknife

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 634

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and I thank the Members. Mr. Speaker, there are many regions out there, many different parts. We always say that we govern over a vast land, but there are places that exist other than Yellowknife. No disrespect to the fine citizens of this city, but also we have citizens south of the lake. We have citizens all the way up to Tuktoyaktuk and Holman.

We have citizens all over the Northwest Territories and I urge this government to start looking at the other citizens in the regions of the Northwest Territories and to start giving a little bit of concentration to the other regions of the Northwest Territories and other communities. Do not base all your decisions on only your briefing papers and your studies because you can get all the briefing papers and studies that say everything should be built in Yellowknife.

I bet you if you asked for a study on whether or not we should uproot Lutselk'e, maybe we should uproot Snare Lakes, maybe we should uproot Arctic Red and move it into Inuvik. It would make more economic sense.

I have been in Russia, Mr. Speaker, and I have seen the huge apartment buildings that they house their people in because it is economically smart to do that. You have to think about people and you have to think about people's lives. Maybe the next study will say to uproot one of our communities and move it into the city of Yellowknife if they have an empty apartment building. I encourage the government to have a little broader vision and look a little bit more into the future for all the Northwest Territories and not just the city of Yellowknife. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 181-13(7): Lack Of Support To Communities Outside Yellowknife

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 634

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Mr. Krutko .

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Member's Statement 182-13(7): Small Communities' Historical Contribution To The Nwt

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 634

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, if I was able to travel through a historical window, you will view the significant contributions that small communities have made to the Northwest Territories. A snapshot of these small communities has a rich history in itself. We will head to the south side of Great Slave Lake to Fort Resolution. Did you know that the Metis voyageur historically played an important role in the establishment of Fort Resolution? Francois Beaulieu, a Metis, accompanied Alexander Mackenzie in 1789 in the fur trade era.

Fort Resolution was one of the most important medical and educational regional centres in the Northwest Territories. A large TB hospital was built in 1938, and a boarding school operated in the same era.

Now we go towards the north arm of Great Slave Lake, to Rae-Edzo. The Hudson's Bay Company post was established at Old Fort Rae in 1852. The Dogrib, which is the largest Dene community in the Northwest Territories, began to trade there with other large settlements, and at this time in history this large Dene community still continues to operate and strive.

We will now head to the south bank of the Liard River, which is Fort Liard, which was established in 1805. There is an area of Fort Liard that is one of the oldest occupied aboriginal settlements in the Northwest Territories. Aboriginal people still fish at the same place where the small knife Indian culture fished 9,000 years ago. Now we travel towards the unity of two rivers, the Mackenzie and the Liard to Fort Simpson. The Northwest Company built Fort Simpson about 1804 and still operates as the oldest trading post in the Mackenzie River. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Member's Statement 182-13(7): Small Communities' Historical Contribution To The Nwt

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 634

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Member for Mackenzie Delta is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays, Mr. Krutko , you have unanimous consent.

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Member's Statement 182-13(7): Small Communities' Historical Contribution To The Nwt

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 634

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you,

colleagues. It used to be known as the fork of the forks before the Mackenzie highway operated. People grew their own vegetables, raised their own livestock and earned the title "Garden of the Mackenzie". In 1963, a record flood forced the evacuation of approximately 300 aboriginal people from the lowlands to higher ground. We are now going up the Mackenzie River to the east bank of the Mackenzie to Fort Good Hope. Did you know that Fort Good Hope is the oldest fur trading post on the lower Mackenzie Valley? Hudson Bay Company established the post in 1805.

Farther down the Mackenzie River, on the east banks of the Peel River, we come across the east edge of the Gwich'in territory, there lies Fort McPherson. Before the first Hudson Bay Company post was established in 1840, this tribe was the most dynamic and complex cultural in relation to their southern Dene brothers. Fort McPherson people have elements of cultural significance and usage of the clan system and potlatches and also traded with the Inuvaluit at the trading post.

On the Peel channel of the Mackenzie River Delta, towards the Arctic coast, the Beaufort Sea, is the community of Aklavik. Did you know that before all major facilities were transferred to Inuvik that Aklavik was one of the chief trappers, trading and transportation centres and also known as the muskrat rich capital of North America.

Trading posts were established around 1910. Aklavik is also the place where the infamous Albert Johnson is buried.

We have come to the end of the short journey and I want like to provide you with a snapshot of how these small communities contributed to the northern development and to the rich history we have to date. The point that I am trying to make is that small communities have as much to contribute as large communities. In regard to the political makeup of the Northwest Territories, we have to recognize the historical and cultural diversity of this territory and realize that these communities were here long before a lot of the larger centres were built. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 182-13(7): Small Communities' Historical Contribution To The Nwt

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 635

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statement, Mr. Ootes .

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Member's Statement 183-13(7): Non-renewable Resource Development Potential

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 635

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I was interested in seeing Mr. Kakfwi 's statement this morning because I have worked on a similar statement and want to make it in that particular area. Over the past two months, I attended several resource sector conferences that focused on mineral, oil and gas development in the Northwest Territories. Because mining, oil and gas have tremendous potential for the North, it is crucial we understand the current and future opportunities these sectors offer.

Several new mines, including diamond, gold and base metals mines could be opened over the next ten years if prices recover to historical levels and government assistance is provided to encourage development. Plus, of course, we will have the value-added industries, such as the diamond sorting and cutting. In the oil and gas sector, the NWT has approximately 18 billion barrels of reserves identified. Alberta has 18 billion barrels identified of which three quarters have already been extracted and the east coast of Canada has five billion barrels. That means we have more than double the east coast in reserves alone and half of the drilling has not been done yet in the Territories.

Similarly with gas in the NWT, we have identified 175 trillion cubic feet. Alberta has 210 trillion cubic feet to which one third has already been extracted. The east coast has 75 trillion cubic feet.

We have more reserves identified than Alberta and the east coast combined. What does that mean for us here in the future in the Northwest Territories? Increased oil and gas exploration and production has the potential to create 1,000 to 1,500 jobs over the next 10 years. A total of 3,000 to 4,500 new jobs could be created by the mineral, oil and gas sector over the next ten years.

As a result of such stimulation, the oil and gas sector must be accorded the highest priority by this government in order to achieve significant economic growth and job creation. We must focus on resource development as the foundation for our wealth and job development in the future. Our priority must be on aboriginal and northern corporate capacity to facilitate infrastructure projects, to accelerate geoscience activities, to assist industry, and we must provide leadership in training education initiatives. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 183-13(7): Non-renewable Resource Development Potential

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 635

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statement, Mr. Rabesca .

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Member's Statement 184-13(7): Recruitment And Retention Of Health Professionals

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 635

James Rabesca

North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today, Mr. Speaker, I rise to talk about very real and dangerous issues that all areas of the NWT is feeling the effects of. This is, of course, the problem we have recruiting and retaining health professionals. This does not mean just nurses, it means all health professionals.

This problem exists in all areas of the Territories and it does not seem to be getting any better. Currently many health boards are experiencing staff shortages and as a result are forced to cut back services to its residents, close centres for anything other than emergencies. These types of measures are only affecting our residents and this situation will continue to worsen before it gets any better.

Solutions must be found to ensure we attract quality staff that will stay for a long term, or increase our northern training programs so that more northern residents can see this field as an excellent career choice. This is a very serious issue and we as MLAs must work with the health boards and the Minister to find a solution. All health boards are saying more resources are needed to adequately provide the services that our residents require. The boards cannot continue to receive less and try to do more. This is very crucial and it could have very serious consequences. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 184-13(7): Recruitment And Retention Of Health Professionals

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 636

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statement, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Member's Statement 185-13(7): Competitive Wages For NWT Nursing Professionals

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 636

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to address the issue of competitive wages for nurses in the Northwest Territories, or the lack thereof. As we all know, this government that claimed to be completely strapped for cash during their negotiations with the Union of Northern Workers then found $3 million to assist with the recruitment and retention of nurses.

How long can we ask workers such as nurses and other health care professionals to buy into our claims of no money? On what basis could we appeal to them to stay and work in the NWT under what must be, in some communities, some of the most strenuous working conditions in Canada, when shortages in other jurisdictions competing for health care professionals equates to openings under better working conditions and more attractive remuneration packages?

Nurses provide essential care and are an important component of our health care system, Mr. Speaker. Every other jurisdiction realizes this and has responded accordingly by providing nurses with competitive compensation. To compound our chances of recruiting nurses, they are in short supply in Canada, as well as worldwide. It is not going to take a genius to understand the basic economic principle that people and yes, including nurses, are going to gravitate and make choices about where to live and work based on issues such as salary, benefits, quality of life and career options.

I do applaud the department and the Minister for their efforts in attempting to encourage young Northerners to train in careers in nursing. I hope the enrolment is even higher in the RN program at Arctic College this fall. The concept of allowing student nurses to perform practicums in their home communities over the summer is also an excellent initiative. We experienced this in Hay River with one very bright, young student nurse, and it was very effective.

I only hope that this is just. I would like to seek unanimous consent to conclude the short remainder of my statement, thank you.

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Member's Statement 185-13(7): Competitive Wages For NWT Nursing Professionals

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 636

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Member for Hay River is seeking unanimous consent to conclude her statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays, Mrs. Groenewegen you have unanimous consent.

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Member's Statement 185-13(7): Competitive Wages For NWT Nursing Professionals

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 636

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker and thank you colleagues. I only hope that this is just the start of a very proactive and not just always reactive posture within the department to address these shortages before they impact the residents of the North even further.

To quote Ms. Maureen Johnston, a registered nurse in Fort Smith, " Is it not time we took better care of the caregivers? One day, you may need us", and Mr. Speaker, that is so true. Thank you.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 185-13(7): Competitive Wages For NWT Nursing Professionals

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 636

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Member's statements, Mr. Erasmus .

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Member's Statement 186-13(7): Resource Revenue-sharing Issues

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 636

Roy Erasmus

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to speak about a number of issues that are related to resource revenue-sharing. Mr. Speaker, for sometime now we have been hearing that we are going to be going into a deficit soon unless we find another source of revenues and we are looking to resource revenue-sharing or a Northern Accord that would bring control and benefits of northern resources to the North. I was interested to hear the Minister speak about the Community Government Leaders' Conference because I was also there.

I heard aboriginal leaders saying that it is going to be difficult to get a resource revenue-sharing agreement because that is the last ace in the hole for the aboriginal leadership.

I think that this government needs to do something concrete to earn the trust of the aboriginal leadership if we are going to attain a Northern Accord. But what are we doing in this area, instead our government is talking about making it easier for development, making it faster for development to occur. Why should areas like my constituents who have no land claim, why should they want to speed up development? They do not. They want to slow it down so that they can be better prepared for when development occurs so that they can actually benefit from development. What else are we doing?

We are passing Bill 15 , five new seats to the larger communities and we know this has to be passed, but at the same time we need to provide the smaller communities with a comfort zone. We need to provide them with something concrete, now. Not just promises that something is going to happen after the next Legislature comes into effect and you have those new five extra MLAs. Mr.

Speaker, what I am trying to say is that if this government hopes to attain a resource revenue-sharing agreement or better known as a Northern Accord, then we have to provide that comfort zone to the regions and the smaller communities now. Thank you.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 186-13(7): Resource Revenue-sharing Issues

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 636

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Dent .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 637

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it is my pleasure to recognize the president of the Status of Women Council of the Northwest Territories, Ms. Vi Beck, in the audience today, along with the executive director of the council, Rosemary Cairns.

--Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 637

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Welcome to the Assembly. Recognition of visitors in the gallery . Mr. Henry .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 637

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to recognize the presence of a member of the constituency of Yellowknife South and a member of the aldermen of Yellowknife, Mr. Bob Brooks. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 637

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Welcome to the Assembly. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Antoine .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 637

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to recognize Mr. Pete Fraser, a former Member of this House, former Speaker and an elder for a lot of us here in the North. Thank you.

--Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 637

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Ootes .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 637

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would also like to recognize a couple sitting with deputy mayor Brooks of Yellowknife and Vi Beck and Rosemary Cairns, and it is Jake and Sara Fehr of Saskatoon. Welcome to the gallery.

--Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 637

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. I also would like to recognize two special visitors in the gallery today. The Consul General of Indonesia, Mr. Marlis Shum-Sudden, and the Vice-Consul, Mr. Your-ra Kan. Their consulate office is located in Vancouver. Welcome to Yellowknife and the Legislative Assembly of the Northwest Territories.

--Applause

I hope I pronounced your names okay. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Morin .

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Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 637

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Premier on the new building for the Yellowknife Correctional Centre. Did Cabinet have an opportunity when they were considering building a new correctional centre in Yellowknife, did Cabinet have an opportunity to make any other decision other than to award this multimillion dollar capital project to our capital city? Thank you.

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Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 637

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Premier .

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Return To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 637

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, during the Cabinet discussion there was an initiative that was put forward by the Minister that is responsible for corrections, the Minister of Justice . In putting his case forward to the Cabinet during the discussions, it was a number of points that were regarded in order to come to this decision and it was one of the items on an agenda, which we dealt with and it was changes that we considered in looking at this project. The project, the decision has been to, we never really discussed putting it in any other place because the decision was already made to put it here in Yellowknife. Thank you.

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Return To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 637

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Morin .

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Supplementary To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 637

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The decision had been made to renovate an existing facility, so Cabinet had the opportunity to consider other regions. Cabinet had the opportunity to consider spreading the wealth. Cabinet had the opportunity to consider boosting up other economies other than Yellowknife, other regions. Did Cabinet consider any of those things when they made a decision on building a brand new correctional facility and was it a political decision? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 637

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Antoine .

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Further Return To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 637

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you. The Minister that is responsible for corrections, the Minister of Justice , has reviewed this whole initiative like the honourable Member is talking about, and he brought his recommendations forward to the Cabinet and then we debated and we agreed to make the decision that we did. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 637

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Morin .

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Supplementary To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 637

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Everyone in this House and everyone clear across the Western Territories has heard the Minister of Finance say that we have a limited amount of dollars. Cabinet is well aware that you have a limited capital budget, but yet, they choose not to look at other regions. You choose not to consider other communities to try to spread out the wealth and share with other people in the Northwest Territories other than spending the majority of our dollars in the city of Yellowknife? Is this what the Premier is saying?

Ultimately, on any decision, it is my understanding that Cabinet, that is what we put them there for, is to make those decisions, make those political decisions. So, to the Premier , did you make a political decision to increase

the capital expenditures in the city of Yellowknife and ignore the other regions of the Northwest Territories? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 638

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Antoine .

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Further Return To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 638

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, whenever the Cabinet reviews and assesses this research, we do not take it lightly. We take it very seriously. It is not something that we just go over without considering the things that the honourable Member is saying. We do consider all of these things. These are all very important. However, the correctional institute is here, the decision was made a long time before I got involved that the correctional centre is here and the decision was made before I got involved as a Premier , I was in Cabinet, to make a major renovation to the existing infrastructure that is there.

The decision to relocate the young offenders facility was made here last year. So, you have two facilities, the Minister has indicated that he has reviewed and researched thoroughly and assessed the situation and the decision was not made lightly. It is the Cabinet's view that considering everything, the cost and everything, the best and most cost-effective decision in light of the information that we had at that time, we can only make decisions with the information that we have in front of us.

We all know that and this is in a situation and the Cabinet had the best information that we could and the best and most cost effective decision and with that we made the decision to do this.

This is an ongoing thing. This is the money that was allocated to renovate the correctional institute is substantial. The money to build a whole new young offenders facility is substantial and then, if you combine it, rather than renovating what we have and building a new facility, cost-effective wise and assessing, if you combine it in building a new facility, in the long run you have some cost savings. This is where I agree with the honourable Member where you have to look at the costs of these things.

There are limited funds, but the decision was made already and approved to spend huge amounts of money towards renovating the facility that is there and the fire marshal says we have to do something about it. We all agree that we are going to do something about it. As well as the youth facility is required and the decision was made to make it here. So, if what the honourable Member is saying is to renovate the existing facility with the way it was originally agreed upon, you renovate it over the period of time that was originally put forward and build a whole new youth facility. We could go ahead and do that.

In the long run it is going to cost more to do that. In our view, it would be cost-effective and it would be quicker to build if we combine them in building a new facility. This is the decision that this Cabinet made. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 638

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. Morin .

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Supplementary To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 638

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. To the Premier , I guess I should make it clear in case he was not listening. I never ever did say to renovate the existing facility. I do not believe that makes a lot of sense from the information that I see. It makes sense, it makes all the sense in the world to build a new facility. When you change the scope of work of the project from a renovation of an existing facility in any community to building a brand new facility that will house people for the whole Northwest Territories it is something completely different.

This Cabinet had the opportunity to show some political will and strong political decision making. It has happened in the past, Mr. Speaker. When I first became a Member of the Legislative Assembly, I remember River Ridge being moved to Fort Smith. It did not make economic sense, it was a hardship on all the professional people that were based in Yellowknife, but the Cabinet of the day made that decision because it diversed the economy to other regions. Is the Premier now saying that Cabinet is not willing to do those things anymore, is everything going to be built in Yellowknife? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 638

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Antoine .

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Further Return To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 638

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The honourable Member is talking about when he first got into the Legislative Assembly. He got into the Legislative Assembly before me when the government of the day had lots of money to spend. As you know, in the last couple of years we have had to cut back drastically and the Finance Minister has also indicated that the next two years do not look too good. We may even have to consider cutting back some more, whoever gets into the next government. We have to take all that into consideration very seriously. We cannot take that very lightly.

No, not everything is being built in Yellowknife. I think we are building a hospital in Inuvik and there are colleges going up, I think in Fort Smith and Inuvik and there are facilities going up in the small communities as well. Sure, it looks like this decision to build this facility here in Yellowknife is only concentrated in Yellowknife, but this decision was made a number of years ago. We are just carrying through with a decision that was made to spend the money on the correctional facilities and the young offenders. That was the decision that was made.

It was made to spend money on the correctional centre and the young offenders and we are just looking at ways of how to make it cost-effective to try to do the same thing. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Question 235-13(7): Alternatives To A New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 638

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 638

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions are also for the Premier with respect to the decision to change the scope of work for the Yellowknife Correctional Centre and construct a new facility. We have been down memory lane here today with a few Members' statements and I would just like to say that the concept, for the record, of building a new young offenders facility in conjunction with an adult facility originated in Hay River. That was our idea. We thought about combining the gymnasium and the kitchen facilities and all these kinds of things.

Seeing now that the Department of Justice has basically gone back to the drawing board on the whole concept, I mean I sat on a committee that went and toured the YCC. No doubt, the YCC is not in good condition, but we were told the rationale for the renovations over the seven year period was because of a contract signed with Nunavut to continue to house inmates from Nunavut in the Northwest Territories. Now, on the radio a few days ago, I hear that Rankin Inlet is making noises and talking about building a new correctional facility in Rankin Inlet. How secure is the rationale for even expanding the facilities in Yellowknife?

That is another question I have. Going back to the idea of the cost saving, I heard the Premier in response to Mr. Morin 's questions here referring numerous times to the cost-effectiveness. If the decision to what they have decided to do is based on cost-effectiveness and they have gone back to the drawing board, I think they should go all the way back to the drawing board and look at where this whole concept originated and let other communities put forward proposals to prove that if you want to save money even further, I think you should look at another community other than Yellowknife as well.

Could the Premier tell us if, in going back to the drawing board, that they considered the cost-effectiveness of putting this in a different community? Thank you.

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Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 639

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Premier .

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Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 639

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Justice , who is responsible for corrections has done the assessment and research, and he has been thoroughly briefed by the department in this whole area. So, if the honourable Member agrees, I would like to ask the Minister to answer these specific questions. Thank you.

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Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 639

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Premier is directing it to the Minister of Justice , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 639

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Since being assigned to the portfolio of Justice at the end of March, I have looked at this issue. The Members will be aware that in June of 1998, the Cabinet of the day decided to locate a new young offenders facility in Yellowknife based on recommendations from the departments in a report. The decision to locate a new facility here in Yellowknife was made in June, 1998. In the fall of 1998, in September, the Financial Management Board approved a submission by Justice to undertake major renovations to address the severe crisis at YCC, namely the overcrowding and the substandard conditions to which inmate and staff were faced with.

Since the beginning of April, I have reviewed this file on request from some Members who wondered why the previous year Cabinet had decided, without much discussion or input from Members to locate the young offenders facility in Yellowknife. I spent a number of months looking at this issue debating and discussing with the staff the merits and pros and cons of that.

I also discussed the phase renovations, seven years planned renovations to YCC and was advanced the suggestion that we could save considerable money, time and disruption to staff and inmates by taking a new approach of just, as somebody said, instead of replacing your car bit by bit, just buy a whole new car. I bought the suggestion that we should just go for a whole new building of the adult correctional facility and combine that with the young offenders facility. In response to the Member's question, as the Minister responsible, I have reviewed the options of looking at relocating. It is not cost-effective.

There is very little, in fact, no time left to consider other options. The Cabinet stands by the decision made. I would note under the previous Premier and previous Ministers to locate the young offenders facility here in Yellowknife and to not address relocating or building a new facility at that time, but simply keeping the adult facility here as well. There are many, many arguments to be made as to why, in the interest of the public and of the inmates and the staff of this government that the adult facility remain here and that it is the most logical location for the facility. Thank you.

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Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 639

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Supplementary To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 639

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in a letter to the chair of the Standing Committee of Government Operations on July 27th, the Minister responsible for Justice indicates that consultants have advised that by integrating the two projects, $1.3 million could be saved in capital and $262,000 in ongoing operations and maintenance. This would also mean the young offenders would have access to better facilities such as a gymnasium and a carpentry shop. Mr.

Speaker, my question to the Minister is, since they brought consultants in and reviewed this from a cost saving for capital and this looks like a very thorough undertaking, it looks like a comprehensive review of things, but in that comprehensive review, did they not consider the potential further savings by relocating the facility? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 639

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 639

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The department considered and continues to consider all aspects of initiative. For instance, there is an agreement to continue to take inmates for the territory of Nunavut. It means that we have to, as quickly as possible, provide adequate accommodations in an institution that we can with some dignity offer to provide to Nunavut. We are compelled by the fire marshal to provide new facilities to the young offenders within two years.

We are compelled by the shrinking financial resources of this government to look at cost savings every way possible. We look at the services that are required by the inmates. We look at the need for inmates to have some means by which family, relatives, friends can have access to the inmates by way of visiting and support. We have looked at the kind of services that are available in Yellowknife that are not available elsewhere. We have looked at a number of elements to these.

Based on those, I have decided that the original Cabinet's decision to locate the young offenders facility here in Yellowknife should be honoured and not revisited. As far as I am concerned, the adult facility is located here in Yellowknife.

Whether we do a major renovation or replace an existing facility piece by piece and then in the end have a whole new building, is not really that much different from doing a whole new capital project, but technically people can argue that it is but, in fact, the location of the adult facility has never been an issue and if it was, it certainly was not visited by Cabinet in June and September of 1998. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 640

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Supplementary To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 640

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Based on the premise then that the $30 million one-time capital expenditure for the adult facility makes more economic sense than the $4 million or whatever per year over seven years and doing a piece by piece fix, let us just assume that the adult facility is here and it is going to stay here and that is a more cost-effective way of doing it on a one time as opposed to a spread over several years.

The original young offenders facility was anticipated to be P3 project, which would have not put the same amount of stress on the government's capital budget. That was the whole underlying concept of the P3 was to amortize or spread this over a longer period of time. So, why does the young offenders facility now have to be taken out of the P3 and I am sure it has to represent $5 million or $6 million regardless and put this permanent facility in here when it is still a possibility to locate a P3 project independent from this someplace else.

Is the construction of a new adult facility now reliant on this P3 being pulled back and capital funds being spent on this? I am just wanting to get a better understanding of the rationale for this new multi-million dollar megaproject here in Yellowknife.

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Supplementary To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 640

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 640

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The technical aspects of the accounting can be answered by the Minister of Finance , perhaps through discussion in the standing committee. But I do know that the government has budgeted a little over $6 million for a young offenders facility and that originally $30 million was budgeted by the government in FMB. That was the amount that was decided by the Financial Management Board in September, 1998. That was not a decision based on detailed costing.

When we undertook detailed costing of what it would entail to do major renovations to the adult facility over the winter, it came to light that, in fact, we would be looking at a total cost for major renovations to the adult facility at over $35 million.

This was part of the reason that we looked at how we could still deliver within the financial scope of the project, how we can still, within the resources allocated, provide both a renovated facility or a replacement facility and a young offenders facility in time to meet the requirements of the fire marshal, plus, as we found out, we can do, instead of budgeting over five years and waiting to renovate, a great disruption to the staff and the inmates in the adult facility, we could do it in four years by integrating to two. This was how the work unfolded. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 640

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Supplementary To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 640

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the original young offenders facility under a P3 was to be amortized over potentially 20 years. The renovation to the YCC was to be amortized over seven years. Now, we are going to build this $30 million project in one year. What other capital projects is this going to impact? Thirty million dollars is a megaproject by any other community standards.

Yellowknife is also talking about a new courthouse, which is another $30 million. I mean, one department alone with a $16 million capital budget from one department, even in a five year period, when in a community like mine, a $2 million project is something to celebrate, is not acceptable. I do not know how this Cabinet and how this government could rationalize that kind of infrastructure. Going back to the fact that the P3 and the renovations were going to be amortized over a longer period of time, what impact is $30 million in one shot going to have on capital projects in other communities now? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 640

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 640

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I have said, the technical information about how we are going to borrow and amortize and finance these projects that have been approved will be answered by the Minister of Finance . I do know that we have decided the young offenders facility, which was identified as a potential P3 project, was no longer considered to be viable as a P3 project by the department because we know it takes an extensive amount of time to get approval and to get these types of arrangements in place. We are compelled by the fire marshal to provide a new facility in very short order.

We are also compelled by the fact that we are now integrating two facilities, one which would be a government-owned facility and it no longer lent itself to be compatible with the P3 project. That was the reason we decided not to advance the young offenders facility as a P3 project. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Question 236-13(7): Rationale For New Correctional Centre

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 640

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mr. Krutko .

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Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 640

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment . In regard to the constituents I represent, there are two diverse languages, Inuvialuktun and Gwich'in, which are taught in the community of Aklavik. Yet, there is a real shortage of funds to implement these cultural programs in the educational

system. The district education authority of Aklavik has been hiring language and cultural specialists to teach local languages programs throughout the year with limited resources. Under

Section 118, subsection (K1), the Education Act allows the education bodies to hire teachers or persons who are not teachers for the instruction of local programs. Can the Minister clarify if the language and cultural specialists fall under this program?

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Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I cannot confirm at this point, so unfortunately I will be forced to take that one as notice. I can speak to the issue of the funding and how programs are delivered, but that technical question and the clause quoted by my colleague, I am not able to answer right off the top of my head, so I apologize.

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Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think this does not only affect my community, but in regard to the Department of Education, there are language and cultural specialists in most communities in the territories. It comes down to the question of salaries and benefits under the NWT Teachers Association collective agreement. I think it is important that we see where these individuals fit in regard to that agreement. Can the Minister tell me exactly do they fit within that collective agreement?

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Supplementary To Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. What I can tell the Member is that on the recently submitted budget by the Beaufort Delta District Education Council totalling $17.554 million for the region, there is $409,000 for aboriginal languages that is allocated by the DEC in consultation with the DEAs for the provision of aboriginal languages and support. Are the language and cultural specialists members of the NWTTA? Once again, I must confess I am not certain, but I will commit to check. Thank you.

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Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister also can check if the language and cultural specialists in regard to the teaching program that are a part of the school program curriculum, if there should be a compensation package in accordance to any collective agreement in regard to language specialists so that they can fall in line with other professionals in that field so they will be treated fairly and that the salaries and benefits they receive are basically comprehensive to other teachers in that field. Can the Minister check into that also? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Miltenberger .

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Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Yes, I will commit to checking that.

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Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can the Minister also commit to trying to have this dealt with before the start of the new school year, which is in a couple of months so that the education divisional boards and also the educational specialists that we have in our communities dealing with language and the cultural program can get some comfort in knowing where they stand with this government when they deliver their services to our students and our classroom? Can the Minister commit to having something available on this issue before the beginning of the school year?

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Supplementary To Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Miltenberger .

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Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

I will commit to providing this information prior to the end of this session so that my colleague will have a chance to review the information and ask any further questions that he may have in regards to what I will be able to provide. Thank you.

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Question 237-13(7): Cultural And Language Programming In School

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mr. Ootes .

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Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 641

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to ask some questions of Mr. Kakfwi in regards to the mineral oil and gas development the territory. This morning he made a statement in that regard, and I also responded. I had a statement prepared in that regard. My question for the Minister would relate to his comments that he is forming a deputy ministers' committee to identify issues and prepare recommendations relating to the management of MacKenzie Valley Development. I feel that we need to go a lot further than that, and need to start investing money so that the communities start benefiting from this.

I see where we need to ensure that there is an aboriginal and northern corporate capacity developed.

I wonder if the Minister could tell me what kind of support he has from Cabinet that would lend to making this the number one priority for this government to address over the next several months so that we can start assisting the communities down the valley and start assisting the aboriginal groups to take advantage of the tremendous potential that is out there so that they can get some economic independence and job creation for themselves. I see areas here that we can provide assistance to facilitate infrastructure projects for the communities, accelerate geoscience activities and provide training and support.

I am wondering if the Minister could tell me what kind of priority this government is placing on that particular area with respect to investment, money and resource-wise? Thank you.

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Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Return To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Cabinet is in support of the initiative that I have outlined earlier today. Cabinet is in support of developing an economic strategy in partnership with aboriginal peoples here in the Northwest Territories, along with industry and the business community. It is our view that we can best provide support to our partners and to aboriginal leaders by preparing to be as well-informed, organized and well scoped in our view and thinking, as we can be. This is what we are positioning ourselves to do.

By getting our deputy ministers initially to work together through a committee, we want to be able to scope out the work and the activities, the opportunities and the potential for opportunities as interest starts to pick up.

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Return To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes .

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Supplementary To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There are many problems to be overcome in terms of achieving development. As I mentioned earlier, there is the question of ensuring that there is aboriginal and northern corporate ability to get involved in such development. There is also the need to have training and education. But there is also the area of allowing the people of the territories to access those jobs in terms of transportation to and from the particular sites such as the mining development and so forth.

I am wondering if the Minster and the Cabinet has discussed a list of areas that this committee of deputy ministers should look at, and I just made reference to several of them. Could the Minister tell me if they have a list that they have passed on to the deputy ministers? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Yes, Mr. Minister. There is work such as the Member has indicated that is required, it has begun and actually does exist. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes .

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Supplementary To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Could the Minister also tell me if Cabinet has discussed some sort of priority in terms of financial input or assistance towards these projects to assist both the deputy minister committee, but also community groups to provide some input? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. No, we have not had extensive details or discussions at the Cabinet level, only that we are indicating that we see the enormous potential for benefits to the North if we move properly, if we move in partnership with our northern peoples and set ourselves up to make sure that we can take advantage of opportunities. At this stage, we will be working with aboriginal groups to let them know of the enormous potential for development activity in the oil and gas sector and find ways to engage that interest and make sure that benefits happen to them. It will be done perhaps in tandem with the development of an economic strategy. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. Ootes .

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Supplementary To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you. The formation of the committee is laudable. I am wondering if a time frame has been set for this committee to report back to Cabinet with some sort of proposal? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The group will be reporting to Cabinet perhaps early this fall on a preliminary basis with the work that we set out for them to do. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Question 238-13(7): Mineral, Oil And Gas Development

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Henry .

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Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 642

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is to Mr. Steen , the Minister responsible for Public

Works and Government Services, and is surrounding the questions that have been raised on the expression of interest for a correctional facility in Yellowknife. Mr. Speaker, unlike some of my colleagues, I could not sort of criticize it to the same degree. My question to the Minister is, who provided the analysis to the Minister that the present facilities of the Yellowknife Correctional Institute were better torn down and start off with a new facility? Who provided that information to the Minister? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Public Works and Services , Mr. Steen . I will ask the Minister of Public Works and Services if he can respond or to refer.

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Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

Vince Steen

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I do not have the information specific to what the Member is requesting, as to exactly who approached the department specifically. The department was supplying the services to the client, the Department of Justice. That is the only information I can supply at this time. Thank you.

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Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Henry .

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Supplementary To Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I apologize to the Minister if my question was not clear. I will certainly try again. There was a decision made that it was cheaper to build a new facility. The Department of Public Works has a tender out for an expression of interest to build a new facility. My question is, who provided the department with the information to say that it was cheaper to build a new facility than to do repairs to the present one? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Steen .

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Further Return To Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

Vince Steen

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I believe this information was supplied by other Ministers during question period yesterday. There were consultations between the departments as to what was the cheapest way to do the project, but there was also a consultant involved who reviewed the whole project. I believe all this information was supplied yesterday, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Henry .

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Supplementary To Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I wonder if the Minister could tell us the rationale for building a new facility when we have a facility such as the Laing Building, built in the same era with the same mechanical, electrical and insulation requirements. Why does it make more sense to build a new facility and, in the case of the Laing Building, decide to renovate it? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Question 239-13(7): Proposal For Correctional Centre Construction

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

That is a new question. I must rule the question out of order. It is a new question. Would you like to rephrase your question, Mr. Henry ? The Member for Yellowknife South was asking questions about a decision made by the Department of Public Works and Services regarding why the change. The new question does not relate to the original question. Would you like to rephrase your question? Oral questions. Mr. Morin .

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Question 240-13(7): Process For Capital Changes

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question will be to the Premier . Did your government follow the proper decision-making process as well as informing the Ordinary Members of this Legislative Assembly on the major change of the scope of work of the Yellowknife Correctional Centre from renovating the building to building a brand spanking new building in Yellowknife? Thank you.

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Question 240-13(7): Process For Capital Changes

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Premier , Mr. Antoine .

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Return To Question 240-13(7): Process For Capital Changes

Question 240-13(7): Process For Capital Changes

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 643

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Yes, we followed all proper procedures in making the decision, honourable Members on the other side. We may have dropped the ball in informing the honourable