Debates of Feb. 14th, 2006

This is page numbers 997 - 1040 of the Hansard for the 15th Assembly, 4th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was going .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Housing Opportunities Arising From The Mackenzie Gas Pipeline

Administration Of The NWT Arctic Winter Games Team

Recognition Of Graduates From The Tlicho Region

Recognition Of Aboriginal Governments In The Northwest Territories

Investment In The Children Of The Northwest Territories

Youth Employment Program Initiatives In Nahendeh

Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Income Support Programs In The Hamlet Of Tuktoyaktuk

WCB Insurance Premiums In The Nwt

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Novel Housing Project

Written Question 28-15(4): Exemptions For Land Lease Only Policies

Item 16: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Honourable Brendan Bell , Mr. Braden , Honourable Paul Delorey , Honourable Charles Dent , Mrs. Groenewegen , Honourable Joe Handley , Mr. Hawkins , Honourable David Krutko , Mr. Lafferty , Ms. Lee , Honourable Michael McLeod , Mr. McLeod, Mr. Menicoche , Mr. Pokiak , Mr. Ramsay , Honourable Floyd Roland , Mr. Villeneuve

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---Prayer

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 997

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Good morning, colleagues. Welcome to the House on this fine Valentine's Day. With your indulgence, I would like to, on your behalf, send out greetings to all our loved ones at home and all the people in the Northwest Territories on this Valentine's Day.

---Applause

I would especially like to send greetings out to my wife, Davida, who is hard at work in Hay River today.

Orders of the day. Ministers' statements. Members' statements. The honourable Member for Range Lake , Ms. Lee .

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Housing Opportunities Arising From The Mackenzie Gas Pipeline

Members' Statements

Page 997

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, yesterday, while answering my questions about Novel housing, the Minister of Finance said the following, on unedited Hansard, page 2,153, and I quote, "It seems that there is an inherent dislike to the fact of trying to use this concept as one that could help families in the Northwest Territories, especially those in the smaller communities."

Mr. Speaker, this is an absolutely appalling and unacceptable statement from a Cabinet Minister to very legitimate questions about a concept that will define and determine the work of the NWT Housing Corporation and this government for at least the next decade.

Mr. Speaker, I must say I have an inherent dislike for the way the Minister is constantly defining the important questions we must debate in this House into a small town versus big town issues. It is their favourite way to distract, discredit and divert the attention away from the real issues like their lack of ability to come up with good answers, Mr. Speaker.

Here are some more dislikes, Mr. Speaker. I have an inherent dislike for the distinct possibility that, if this Cabinet continues to fail to do its due diligence, this concept is going to create more big, fat bank accounts for multi-national corporations than the homes to our families in the North. I have an inherent dislike for the complete lack of respect this government has shown for the northern manufacturing industries. From the beginning, it has never hidden the fact that it had no faith in any of our own home builders.

Mr. Speaker, I'm just a big girl from the big town in Yellowknife, but I have to tell you, I have an inherent dislike for the government using its annual budget to promote an idea by one business and really putting its credibility on the line. How is this different than the government asking the diamond mines to buy nothing but coffee from Tim Horton's? Just think of that, Mr. Speaker.

Finally, I have an inherent dislike for the fact that this government fails to see this is a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity where northern businesses can build them, northern labour force can work in them, as well as our small town families living in them. Instead, the government is blind to do one idea without due diligence, and puts it into a budget, and lobbies the federal government for an idea that it has already stated is not up to...

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Housing Opportunities Arising From The Mackenzie Gas Pipeline

Members' Statements

Page 997

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Ms. Lee , your time for Member's statement has expired.

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Housing Opportunities Arising From The Mackenzie Gas Pipeline

Members' Statements

Page 997

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Housing Opportunities Arising From The Mackenzie Gas Pipeline

Members' Statements

Page 997

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Ms. Lee . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Administration Of The NWT Arctic Winter Games Team

Members' Statements

Page 997

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, on Valentine's Day today, I would like to tell a story of a Hay River athlete whose heart was broken by the process by which participants qualify to attend the upcoming Arctic Winter Games. Little Johnny comes home all excited about going to the Arctic Winter Games. He is an excellent athlete in his sport and his family is supportive. His parents complete the Arctic Winter Games application form and remit the registration fee for trials. He also begins the process of applying for the required passport.

He applied early as he has been clearly notified that passport documents had to be received by January 6th in order to participate in the Arctic Winter Games.

Johnny participates in the regionals and he does well. He continues to attend practices and becomes even more excited. Then Johnny finds out that the issuance of his birth certificate from vital statistics is being delayed which, in turn, delays his passport from being received by the deadline that Sport North has announced to all athletes. At this point, he knows he cannot go to the games, so his parents decide it would not be sensible to pay the $100 fee to play in the territorials when it was predetermined that he could not go to the Arctic Winter Games without a passport.

This is where his dream ended, but his story is not over because then little Johnny now reads in the newspaper that passports are not required to travel to Alaska for the Arctic Winter Games.

Mr. Speaker, this is not fair. How do we explain to a young person who has prepared for his or her sport for several months and sometimes waited years to participate in a competition like the Arctic Winter Games that, although you applied in plenty of time, your paperwork wasn't going to be completed in time and you can pay $100 to play in the territorials but you can't attend the Arctic Winter Games even if you win? Then, less than a few weeks later, when it is too late to qualify in the territorials, too late to be accepted to attend the Arctic Winter Games, now we are told that none of these documents are mandatory.

Mr. Speaker, what is the message to the young athletes who have been so disappointed? Who is going to apologize to them? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Administration Of The NWT Arctic Winter Games Team

Members' Statements

Page 998

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Monfwi, Mr. Lafferty .

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Recognition Of Graduates From The Tlicho Region

Members' Statements

Page 998

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Today, I want to talk about education. Tlicho residents are special and we are proud of them. Today, these children that went to school, they are adults. Some of these adults are going back to high school. We look at these graduates. We are depending on them. They are good role models for other communities. That is what we call role models. We take a look at the Edzo Bruno School, there are many photos on the wall. It is all the graduates of Grade 12. They are all brothers, sisters, and aunties. They all go to school together. It is good to take a look at that.

I am proud to say that they are role models for our communities. Although they graduate from Grade 12, some of them go further to post-secondary studies. Some of these have taken some community addiction counsellor training in their region. These graduates speak in their language. They have a very strong traditional background. With this knowledge that they have, they are helping their community. This is how they are helping their communities. I am very happy to see that.

Mr. Speaker, in the past, the government has been very supportive of adult students that go back to school. We are thankful for that. This investment has been worthwhile for the Tlicho region. This is what you call investment in our community. It is a worthwhile cause that we support these students. I would like to see the government to continue this support for the future. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Recognition Of Graduates From The Tlicho Region

Members' Statements

Page 998

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Villeneuve .

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Recognition Of Aboriginal Governments In The Northwest Territories

Members' Statements

Page 998

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my statement today is about the special interest group perspective this government seems to have towards First Nations' governments in the NWT. This perspective seems to be more obvious given the recent developments in the land transfer to the City of Yellowknife by this government, and then the recent court injunction filed by the Akaitcho Territory Government to address this ongoing issue.

Mr. Speaker, when will this government come to grips with reality and start to realize that future aboriginal governments will require some significant changes to the structure of our present system of governance, one being the transfer of authority and responsibility for many government services to the aboriginal governments, thus severely downsizing this one level of territorial bureaucracy?

Mr. Speaker, the Akaitcho Territory Government Interim Measures Agreement signed in 2001 clearly outlines the process to transfer Commissioner's land within the Akaitcho territory, and the establishment of a land lease-only policy for disposition of Commissioner's land within municipal boundaries are two agreements that this government has been a party to but, clearly, has not adhered to given the latest developments and dispositions of land in fee-simple title to the City of Yellowknife.

Mr. Speaker, if this government is serious about its recognition of aboriginal governments as legitimate governments, like we hear about all the time, then I think it is time we start treating these aboriginal governments with the respect and dignity they deserve, especially when talking about land the First Nations' groups have established, through the highest court in our land, to have an inherent right to ownership and management of. Mr. Speaker, I will be asking the Minister of Aboriginal Affairs questions about this government's recent actions on this matter at the appropriate time later today. Mahsi.

---Applause

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Recognition Of Aboriginal Governments In The Northwest Territories

Members' Statements

Page 998

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes , Mr. McLeod.

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Investment In The Children Of The Northwest Territories

Members' Statements

Page 998

Robert C. McLeod

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this government makes many investments in infrastructure and personnel throughout the NWT. They like to speak of the long-term benefits of these investments. Today, Mr. Speaker, I ask this government to make an investment that is sure to bring the return. That investment, Mr. Speaker, is in our young children.

The Children's First Society in Inuvik is a non-profit group that was formed with the hope of having their needs incorporated into the new school being built in Inuvik. This group consists of the Aboriginal Head Start Program, the day care society, and the Inuvik preschool. By having these groups as part of the school, we increase their chances of finishing school. Studies have proven this statement, Mr. Speaker.

Between these three groups, they have 15 employees and will be able to amalgamate -- and that is a word that the government likes to use -- their staff and resources. We spend millions of dollars on jails, courthouses, subsidies and much more. Let's now make an investment in the resource that will be able to bring a good return. Let's invest in our children. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Investment In The Children Of The Northwest Territories

Members' Statements

Page 999

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Members' statements. The honourable Member for Nahendeh , Mr. Menicoche .

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Youth Employment Program Initiatives In Nahendeh

Members' Statements

Page 999

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

Mahsi cho, Mr. Speaker. Last summer, during the May session, I raised concerns regarding the drastic funding cuts to the Youth Employment Program initiative, the acronym YEPI, as we know it in Nahendeh. However, in Nahendeh, we are not saying YEPI anymore. This continued reduction in assistance to youth workers is, and was, visibly noticeable. A ghost town is how many people could describe Nahendeh communities if something is not done about this soon.

There is a change when I see no groups of youth painting, cutting grass, et cetera in our communities. The village of Fort Simpson, like all communities in the territory, offered a wide variety of services throughout the summer which are critical to the tourism, recreational and youth activities through a partnership with the GNWT.

Throughout the last three years, the village has received enough partnership funding for nine to 11 positions, ranging from staffing assistance with the community pool, tourism information centres, and many summer youth activities.

Last year, the village, due to this drastic cut from the ECE funding, resulted in a reduction of numerous summer programs. The programming gave our youth experience, skills, responsibilities and the ability to earn and save money. The confidence youth receive from these employment programs is invaluable to the development within the communities. The most unfortunate aspect in all of this is the ministry has not considered the reinstatement of this funding as a priority. Many constituent parents have expressed their concerns, once again this year, whether there will be enough employment opportunities for our children again this summer.

The actions of this government seem to continuously contradict the policies and objectives of this government with a growing concern for youth, healthy living, and substance abuse such as crystal meth. Why would this government cut so many badly needed youth employment opportunities? Mahsi cho, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Youth Employment Program Initiatives In Nahendeh

Members' Statements

Page 999

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Kam Lake , Mr. Ramsay .

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Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Members' Statements

Page 999

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am going to speak today about the Government of the Northwest Territories' support, or lack thereof, for the secondary diamond industry. I have asked numerous questions in the past regarding the investment and the support that the GNWT is providing to this industry.

I would like to know if the Minister plans on releasing to the public the cost benefit analysis of government support to the value-added industry. The secondary diamond industry has been a very large contributor to the Northwest Territories economy. It is estimated that between 1999 and 2014, a period of 15 years, this industry will pump a total of $207 million in direct, indirect and induced wages, or an average of $13 million per year, Mr. Speaker.

My concern is that the department has folded up the diamond division, thus sending a poor message and signal to the companies in the value-added industry.

Where is the support going to come from under this new reorganization? What about the protection of the GNWT's heavily invested position in this industry, estimated to be in the neighbourhood of $20 million? We must protect our investment in this industry. The value-added diamond industry here in Yellowknife employs over 160 people. They pay taxes. They rent. They buy homes. They are very positive contributors to our local economy, as I mentioned earlier; somewhere in the magnitude of $13 million a year.

When a factory is telling Members of this House that they can go to Antwerp and buy diamonds from BHP for less than they can here in Canada, I have a problem with that, Mr. Speaker. I understand the Minister is saying that he will look into these concerns, and so he should.

Our factories just want to be treated fairly. Is that too much to ask? Is it our government's intention to slowly kill off the local cut and polish industry? The government has to listen and take immediate action to remedy this situation. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Members' Statements

Page 999

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Nunakput , Mr. Pokiak .

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Income Support Programs In The Hamlet Of Tuktoyaktuk

Members' Statements

Page 999

Calvin Pokiak

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to raise a concern I received from the hamlet council of Tuktoyaktuk in regard to income support.

Mr. Speaker, on December 15, 2005, a Tuk development corporation, a business arm of the Tuktoyaktuk Community Corporation, issued a dividend to all beneficiaries 18 and over to their membership of Tuktoyaktuk.

Mr. Speaker, this payment was made available by the surrender of the Esso concession, as negotiated by Inuvialuit Regional Corporation on behalf of the Tuk Community Corporation. Mr. Speaker, it is my understanding that some income support clients were refused assistance for the month of January 2006, because of dividend payments. Mr. Speaker, I am well aware of the Income Support Program having worked with the department in the 1980s.

Mr. Speaker, given the fact that this payment was issued from the surrender of the Esso concession, is it fair for this government to include this as earned income? Many single parents and families rely on assistance from time to time under the Income Support Program because of lack of work.

In closing, Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask this government, what constitutes earned and unearned income? The dividend issued to Tuk beneficiaries in December 2005, should not have been considered as income because of the Inuvialuit land claim agreement. At the appropriate time, I will ask the Minister appropriate for questions in this regard. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Income Support Programs In The Hamlet Of Tuktoyaktuk

Members' Statements

Page 1000

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Pokiak . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre , Mr. Hawkins .

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WCB Insurance Premiums In The Nwt

Members' Statements

Page 1000

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In a recent report given by the Canadian Federation of Independent Business, it said that 48 percent of NWT respondents cited WCB premiums as a harmful tax to small business. This is something that we need to pay close attention to, Mr. Speaker, because small business is the backbone of our community and it is a bellwether of our good, solid economy in the Territories.

When I look at the situation, I can understand why franchise operators say that the WCB premiums are such a concern. Their rates are $2.93 per $100, Mr. Speaker, which is nearly twice as much paid by their counterparts in the Yukon. That is well above the rest of Canadian provinces. They have seen increases over the past several years of 25 percent or more each year. Mr. Speaker, in all fairness to WCB, that is because they have been taking out the subsidy but that still does not allude to the fact, or take away the facts, that the premiums are still very high.

The ultimate goal, Mr. Speaker, should be that the WCB is about preventing accidents and injuries. It seems obvious to me that we should be rewarding good safety practices and we should be punishing poor practices. Franchises follow national mandatory safety programs and standards, Mr. Speaker, or else they get their franchise operation licence pulled. WCB has to place them in a class that represents really what they do and recognize the efforts that they take to safety procedures. As a result, we should be recognizing, again, safe practices and finding ways to eliminate bad practices.

Mr. Speaker, we need to start rewarding good ones. I am going to give you some suggestions. First, we need to start by looking at franchises and moving them to a class that truly represents the efforts that they make towards safety. Mr. Speaker, second, the WCB needs to start cracking down on businesses that do not have adequate safety procedures in place and have poor records. Finally, when businesses violate these safety items, just like the Liquor Act, the Public Health Act, or whatever, they should be cracking down with real penalties and possibly even enforcing closures if they are not operating a safe business.

Mr. Speaker, in some places out there, this is a first job for many young people. We want to make sure that they are working and learning skills in a safe environment. I will have questions for the Minister later today. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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WCB Insurance Premiums In The Nwt

Members' Statements

Page 1000

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Members' statements. Returns to oral questions. Recognition of visitors in the gallery.

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1000

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

I would like to welcome everyone in the gallery today. Welcome to the House. It is always nice to have an audience. Oral questions. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre , Mr. Hawkins .

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Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1000

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I just said in my Member's statement, I believe that the Minister should be taking immediate steps to improve the situation of the WCB rates. What is the Minister doing to ensure that bad companies or businesses out there are not putting the burden of WCB premiums on good businesses that have good, solid safety practices and records? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1000

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . The honourable Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , Mr. Dent .

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Return To Question 393-15(4): Wcb Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1000

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yesterday, I met with the chair of the governance council. We discussed the issue that has been raised in this House by members of the industry with my office. I did ask the chair to make sure that, this week, during the governance council meetings, they review the situation that has been brought to their attention by the franchise operators. I was informed that it is on the agenda for their discussions this week. So the governance council will be considering it. Thank you.

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Return To Question 393-15(4): Wcb Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1000

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins .

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Supplementary To Question 393-15(4): Wcb Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1000

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, these franchises that have brought forward this concern wouldn't need a new category or be screaming for different rates if the rates were fairly spread across the board which, what I am saying is, basically, if we had safety practices, procedures and policies out there organized by these sort of bad businesses, then they wouldn't need a new category that fairly represents what they do. What is the Minister doing to help promote safety policies and safe practices in the workplace? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 393-15(4): Wcb Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1000

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 393-15(4): Wcb Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1000

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The WCB does have a safety program. They have a regular follow-up with employers who have poor safety records. They do work with those employers to try and make sure

that they have programs in place to bring down the incidents of unsafe work practices. That is something that is taking place right now. Also, the WCB does have a program in place to reward those businesses that have a good safety record. I understand, though, that the program right now is focussed on larger employers and would hit right now those employers who are slightly above the amount of payment that we are seeing from the franchise operators. I believe that the governance council is going to take a look at that issue this week, as well. Thank you.

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Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Final supplementary, Mr. Hawkins .

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Supplementary To Question 393-15(4): Wcb Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate the Minister pointing out that the reward program, yes, it actually is exempt to almost all of those franchises that we are talking about. They are exempt from that, I think, except for one. It really doesn't affect most of them. Mr. Speaker, can this Minister tell me today if anyone was ever fined, or has WCB worked towards removing someone's business licence or whatnot because they have demonstrated clear, bad safety practices that, yet again, their rates are reflective on the good businesses that have good safety operations? Have they ever pulled a licence, or what dramatic steps have they ever done? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 393-15(4): Wcb Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 393-15(4): Wcb Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am not sure that the WCB can pull a business licence. I guess they could consider cancelling the coverage and that would, in effect, put many businesses out of business. I don't know if they have done that. I do know that the WCB has gone to court; has taken employers to court for unsafe work practices. I would suspect that they will continue to do that. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 393-15(4): WCB Assessment Rates In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions are for Minister McLeod with respect to the kind of unhappy story of some of the participants, or would-be potential participants, in the Arctic Winter Games. We have a group out there, Mr. Speaker, of very disappointed young people who had dreams of going to the Arctic Winter Games. Through a myriad of misunderstanding, miscommunication, missed deadlines and things like this, were unable to...What could we have done differently, knowing that the Arctic Winter Games were going to be held in Alaska this year?

What could we have done differently as a government to have made this a smooth process and put everyone on an equal bare footing that had potential to attend these games and compete on behalf of the Northwest Territories? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . The honourable Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs , Mr. McLeod.

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Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we were advised in the spring of this past year that the requirement for passports was going to be an issue. We were advised by the host society. We were also advised by the international committee that all countries should ensure that athletes and the mission staff have passports. We were also advised by the United States government that they may be proposing or that there was consideration of increasing the security requirements. They could not ensure that anybody that didn't have a passport would get across the border.

We, then, in turn, or the Sport North Federation who is responsible for delivering and managing the Arctic Winter Games programs for the Northwest Territories, advised all of the sports groups, the organizations and the communities. That information was out there for a considerable amount of time. The regional recreational officers all knew about it. The community recreation people also knew that there was going to be this requirement. For the most part, it was followed. We did not allow anybody that took

part in the territorial trials to participate unless they had their applications filed. That went very well. We have had 336 participants that took part and 200 and some of these are athletes. There is some concern that there were a small few who are not receiving their passports on time. We are trying to work around it. We are trying to find an alternative by using a birth certificate or a government ID. We still have not received confirmation that the border will let us use this documentation, but we are working on that. Thank you.

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Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Supplementary To Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in hindsight, is there anything that the government could have done to be a little more proactive about this? Obviously, passports are a government-issued document. Birth certificates are a government-issued document. Certainly, there are ways, everyone knows, where passports and the issuance of them can be expedited on behalf of dignitaries and elected officials. On a government-to-government basis, especially for the departments such as our own department of vital statistics, was there nothing this government could have done to be more proactive to ensure that these young people wanting to compete could have had passports? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Mr. McLeod.

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Further Return To Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1001

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Mr. Speaker, I'm not sure what else we could have done. The Sport North Federation did work with the RCMP, the retailers, photographers. We advised our RDOs, our recreation development officers. The community recreation officers

knew of the situation, they knew there were requirements. They helped fill in the applications. We also directed people that did not have the sufficient funding, to go through the kids funding program where they could have gotten assistance, or received assistance. So I'm not sure what else we could have done that would have been different. This is not the first time that there was a requirement for passports. Sport North has dealt with the passport issue when there was an Arctic Winter Games hosted in Greenland, for example. So it's something that's been required before and we've done, I think, everything that we could do to cover all the angles on this issue. Thank you.

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Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Final supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Supplementary To Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think we need to send a message to those athletes who wanted to participate but were precluded from doing so because of bureaucratic-type barriers and obstacles that were put in front of them. Mr. Speaker, I need to tell the kids in my community something about how this government feels about how things went, and to the parents and to other people here, and I don't know what to offer them as a solution. But I think this is a distinct case where the rules changed in the middle of the game, and I think that that sends a very bad message to our youth.

I want a clear answer from the Minister right now, are athletes going to be going to the Arctic Winter Games after all this around passports? Are there athletes in the NWT going to the Arctic Winter Games without passports? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Mr. McLeod.

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Further Return To Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Mr. Speaker, I can't confirm that at this point. We know that there are some athletes that have applied...Everybody has applied for their passport, but there are some athletes that the passport office has sent back their application and is requesting more information. I don't have a firm number on that as of yet. We are working on that. We know that it hasn't restricted the number of athletes from applying or taking part. This year in our regional trials, we've had 1,300 athletes take part. That's 200 more athletes than we did in 2004. We had five more communities take part this time around than we did before.

We had smaller communities getting involved. I think there's a lot of things we could point to that are showing that the Arctic Winter Games are becoming increasingly popular. But as to if there are any youth or athletes travelling to Alaska without a passport, I'd have to confirm that later. We don't have that information as of yet. We are hoping that we're going to have all our athletes and all our mission staff with passports when they leave here. Thank you.

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Question 394-15(4): Arctic Winter Games Teams - Change Of Rules

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Oral questions. The honourable Member from Kam Lake , Mr. Ramsay .

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Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

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Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . The honourable Minister responsible for Industry, Tourism and Investment , Mr. Bell .

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Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As the Member knows, committee has a copy of that report. We've transmitted that to committee and I'd be more than happy to make that public. Thank you.

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Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Supplementary, Mr. Ramsay .

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Supplementary To Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I'd like to ask the Minister how the dismantling of the diamond projects division, one that had been in place for a number of years and had provided much support to the industry, how the dismantling of that division is going to help us protect the secondary industry. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Mr. Bell .

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Further Return To Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1002

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As the Member knows, we've had a shift of focus in the department in terms of our support. We've made the decision to withdraw, at this point, from the National Diamond Strategy, at the suggestion of the factories, and more closely focus on our local support initiatives to factories, working with them on our Rare in Nature campaign. In order to do so, as the Member indicated, we have taken the diamond projects division, taken away the task of National Diamond Strategy support, which was taking up quite a bit of our time, and parcelled out the responsibilities.

For instance, tourism and parks division in my department will now handle all the diamond tourism marketing. Investment and economic analysis division is the one point of contact for our Rare in Nature campaign. Minerals, oil and gas is going to be handling our certification program, the administration of our rough diamonds supply, and also monitoring of the approved

NWT manufacturers. As the Members also know, some of the diamond marketing programs that are being generated through the Rare in Nature campaign are being paid for with funds that come from the polished diamond certification. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Final supplementary, Mr. Ramsay .

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Supplementary To Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. One of the other areas I think the local industry turns for support, because the diamond division isn't there any longer, is to Members of this House, Mr. Speaker. I know some of my colleagues have brought this up, as well, about the situation where one of our local cut and polish factories can buy diamonds cheaper in Antwerp than they can here in Yellowknife. Mr. Speaker, I'd like to ask the Minister if he has met with BHP regarding the pricing discrepancies between Antwerp and Yellowknife, and how he will take action to make sure that our cut and polish industry here is being treated fairly. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Mr. Bell .

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Further Return To Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Important to point out, I think, that the local factories here enjoy an excellent relationship, for the most part, with the mines. The mines have been very supportive of the programs and there is, but, at this point, really one main complaint between a factory and one of the mines. The Member has indicated it's BHP Billiton. I've encouraged the two sides to come together; encouraged the factory to take their concerns, document their concerns, and have a pointed discussion with the mine around those. They have met in Antwerp, I understand, either yesterday or today.

So we'll hopefully, shortly, know the outcome of that discussion. But it was important, I think, to recognize that this is a commercial dispute. It should be settled by these two parties where possible. If it can't and won't be settled by these two parties, then, obviously, our government has to be involved. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 395-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Oral questions. The honourable Member from Nahendeh , Mr. Menicoche .

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Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. My question is for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment with regard to the Youth Employment Program initiative, and I believe it's in his mandate. Just with respect to that, I'd just like to ask the Minister what's in the plans this year for contributions to our communities. Thank you.

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Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche . The honourable Minister responsible for Education, Culture and Employment , Mr. Dent .

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Return To Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The program will be funded at the same level as it was last year, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Supplementary, Mr. Menicoche .

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Supplementary To Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I was just wondering if the Minister's office has any intention to support special initiative projects that are out there, if there's any allocation at all for that. Mahsi.

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Supplementary To Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The funding for the programs is divided on a regional basis throughout the Northwest Territories and funding decisions are made at the regional offices, based on applications that come in. So it's important that groups or organizations that wish to access this funding get their applications into the regional office as quickly as possible. In this year's budget we're not proposing an increase in the funding. It is just the exact same amount as we had last year. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Final supplementary, Mr. Menicoche .

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Supplementary To Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

Kevin A. Menicoche

Nahendeh

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I'm just wondering, because I know that there is a demand out there to provide adequate funding to youth employment opportunities, I'm just wondering if the Minister can tell me how much of an uptake was taken last year and how much of a demand there was to provide opportunities to our youth. Mahsi.

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Supplementary To Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1003

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I don't have last year's uptake figures with me. I will ensure that the Member gets that information very quickly. I'll transmit it to him and other Members in writing. I think it's important to remember that when the monies were reduced in this one program, Youth Employment Program, they weren't taken out of the budget; they were moved into apprenticeship. After talking to people through the Northwest Territories, the suggestion was that we needed to focus more on getting money into apprenticeship and that's where we moved the monies to.

So it's not a situation where the funding was reduced for young people, it's just we've refocused it in a different area. I know that I've heard from a number of Members that this has caused some concerns in their communities, but we still have some money there. I would encourage the communities to get their applications in early for this funding. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Question 396-15(4): Youth Employment Program Initiatives In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Oral questions. The honourable Member from Tu Nedhe , Mr. Villeneuve .

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Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in my Member's statement, I indicated that a court injunction was filed by the Akaitcho Territory Government and, just for the record, I'd like to withdraw that as part of my statement because it has not been formally done as of now. But I just want to ask the Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs , what action is this government going to take to avoid or circumvent this option and start working more cooperatively with the First Nations to find a more agreeable solution? Mahsi.

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Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . The honourable Minister responsible for Aboriginal Affairs , Mr. Handley .

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Return To Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Mr. Speaker, although the question was directed to the Minister of MACA , the question is more appropriate for the Minister of Aboriginal Affairs and I hold that portfolio. Mr. Speaker, we have been negotiating with Canada and the Akaitcho for a number of years on their process. We are working in good faith. We will continue to work with the Akaitcho and the federal government on the issues. There is a table dealing with land withdrawal and we intend to continue to negotiate. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve .

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Supplementary To Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. I don't know; you know, negotiating in good faith, I don't know if the Minister is saying that the Yellowknives have no right to block the land process, I don't know if that's a statement that says anything about going in good faith. I just want to know who the GNWT is negotiating on behalf of. Are they negotiating on behalf of the GNWT, or are they negotiating on behalf of the City of Yellowknife?

Basically the GNWT has made two types of land withdrawals, one for the new courthouse that's going to be situated here near the Legislative Assembly for the Department of Justice, and the other withdrawal is for the City of Yellowknife in the industrial zone. There have been no interim measure land with withdrawals agreed to with the Akaitcho Territory Government as of now, so where is that good faith? He says that the territory and the city are frustrated with Yellowknives lack of progress on their negotiations. Mr.

Speaker, I can tell you there are many people in the NWT who are frustrated with this government's lack of progress on just transfer of land for housing needs, you know, and I haven't seen any significant changes in that area as of today. So I just want to ask the Minister, what actions in good faith is the Department of Aboriginal Affairs willing to take over the next couple of days? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Let me say, first of all, that there was an interim lands withdrawal protocol that was agreed to in November 2005. Our government continues to negotiate with the Akaitcho on the withdrawal, or identification of lands withdrawal, in what's called Commissioner's land area. The federal government continues to negotiate with the Akaitcho on federal Crown land outside of where the Commissioner's land boundaries are. So, Mr. Speaker, we are working through a Lands Working Group.

The Lands Working Group meets at least once a month and, in fact, has been meeting more often to identify land for withdrawal, and we continue with that process. Mr. Speaker, in the meantime, because there is no land identified as land to be withdrawn, then we have to continue to carry out our responsibilities to all of the people in the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Final, short supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve .

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Supplementary To Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As far as I know, the draft interim land withdrawal protocol that was agreed to by the federal government and the Akaitcho government, but not agreed to by the territorial government because of some issues that the territorial government had under the disposal of Commissioner's land.

I just want to ask...You know, issues under discussion with regard to the GNWT policies on one of their land lease-only policies that the GNWT agreed to abide by with the Akaitcho Territory Government, but now they've just sort of circumvented that whole policy in itself, like a lot of other government policies, for reasons who knows why. But why doesn't the government follow its own policies if they're going to draft up a policy and get the First Nations to work with them on that policy? How come the government doesn't even do itself any justice by following their own rules? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1004

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We are following the land lease-only policy. The land lease-only policy does not provide for an absolute freeze on land, but it does, consistent with the interim measures agreement with the Akaitcho and the federal government, provide for a process we have to go through in consultation where there is going to be a transfer of land. Mr. Speaker, we have been following that diligently and in no way have been circumventing our own policies or negotiating in bad faith. Mr. Speaker, we are following all of the agreements we have in place.

We follow our own policy; we follow the interim measures agreement. Mr. Speaker, just one correction for the Member is that we have agreed to the interim land withdrawal protocol as of November 2005. But what has happened is there has been no interim land withdrawals, so there's nothing the protocol can apply to until there are some withdrawals. So, Mr. Speaker, we need to move along to that step at the negotiating table

and we're certainly prepared to do that. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Question 397-15(4): Land Transfer Agreements And Aboriginal Governments

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Monfwi, Mr. Lafferty .

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Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. (Translation) My questions will be to the Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation . This is one concern that comes from the community when I recently visited. (Translation ends)

...it is common for two or three generations of Dene family to share a home. Not only is the tradition of our culture, but also necessary for the lack of housing in our communities, Mr. Speaker. Those who work in the mines also depend on this custom of grandparents raising their children while they're at work. The reality is the head of the household, usually an elder, Mr. Speaker, is the rent payer. I would like to ask the Minister why the rent scale does not reflect this reality, by basing the rent on the income of the head of the household instead of the total household income. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . The honourable Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation , Mr. Krutko .

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Return To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the reason that we use the rent scale is to ensure that people don't take advantage of the social housing that we do have where it's based on the income of the whole household, not the individual. But we are looking at ways of getting people to sign co-leases with the elder and whatnot, because we found a lot of elders have found themselves in the situation where they do run into arrears and problems with arrears because individuals that have worked, their relatives and whatnot, have come lived with them and then have gone back to school or whatnot.

But again, we're trying to find a way to be more flexible in that area, and one of the areas we are looking at is signing co-leases with other occupants of the unit instead of just the household. So we are looking at this problem and we're hoping to bring something forward. Thank you.

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Return To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty .

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Supplementary To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. (Translation) I would like to ask him another question, the same kind of question. (Translation ends)

In the past, Mr. Speaker, the head of household income was considered by the Housing Corporation. I am glad to hear the Minister is somewhat receptive to going back there or reviewing the situation. Mr. Speaker, despite these outrageous rents, we have the units in very bad conditions.

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Supplementary To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

An Hon. Member

Outrageous!

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Supplementary To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Some are on the verge of being condemned in the communities.

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Supplementary To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

An Hon. Member

Slumlords!

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Supplementary To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Why isn't there some requirements for at least, Mr. Speaker, a certain portion of the rent be set aside for maintenance and repairs of these units? Some units are so bad that they can't even live in the household where elders are living in the mould.

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Supplementary To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

An Hon. Member

Mould!

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Supplementary To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Would the Minister consider putting in such a requirement within the Housing Corporation? Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Supplementary To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Mr. Krutko .

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Further Return To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we do have an avenue by way of looking at the rent scale, but also looking at the condition rating of the unit which is subtracted from the rent where a person only pays the rent based on a subtracted money on a condition rate. So the building they are renting is in a certain condition rate, which is lower than a certain percentage and you deduct that percentage from the rent. So you don't pay the full rent. You pay rent based on the condition of the facility you are renting. So we do have that already in place. Mr.

Speaker, we are hoping to be able to look at a new Supported Lease Program and I think that program going forward, we'll be able to deal with all these issues that come forward in this House. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Final supplementary, Mr. Lafferty .

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Supplementary To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. (Translation) Mr. Speaker, every time we talk about housing, we talk about our elders and the well-being of our elders. (Translation ends)

...elders in the community, like granny in Nahanni. They pay the ridiculous prices of the units in the communities. At the same time, some community members, especially elders, are not fully aware of the process of changes, or changes within policies or regulations within the corporation mandate, which also creates a huge problem in the community with outstanding debts and owing, Mr. Speaker.

Would the Minister be committed to provide clear direction for housing officers to ensure that they are doing everything they can to assess clients with paperwork, or counselling, or whatever is needed, so they are not paying more than they should be according to their current income? Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Mr. Krutko .

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Further Return To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1005

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would just like to make it clear that seniors who

live in social housing don't pay any rent. But if someone who is working moves in with a senior or relative, based on the household income, that individual's rent has to be assessed. That's where we have a difference of opinion here. Under the existing program, seniors do not pay rent in social housing. But if someone moves in with them who is working or has an income, that rent is assessed against the household income.

Again, we do have one of the best programs across the country where seniors don't pay rent in seniors' housing, but because of the loophole that people were taking advantage of, they've made a change to look at the whole household income where those individuals take advantage of the seniors and we are trying to...I will definitely look into the questions the Member raised here.

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Further Return To Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Question 398-15(4): Rent Scale Formulas And Social Housing In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1006

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Great Slave , Mr. Braden .

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Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1006

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Mr. Speaker, we are going to get at least another two diamond mines in the Northwest Territories, so we've got some work to do here if we are going to be able to continue this expectation. With the socio-economic agreements that we have in place today, is there anything in this agreement that requires or stipulates that diamond miners shall sell rough product to NWT-based cutting and polishing companies, Mr. Speaker?

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Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1006

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Braden . The honourable Minister responsible for Industry, Tourism and Investment , Mr. Bell .

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Return To Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1006

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Our socio-economic agreements with the two existing mines do stipulate that they make rough diamonds available for secondary, value-added industries here in the NWT. They are doing that. In terms of details, it's very difficult for us, because they are business arrangements and we are not privy to all the details of these, it's difficult for us to assess these agreements. It's also very difficult to know what the cost of diamonds is on the open market because, of course, these are confidential agreements between parties.

But in terms of our socio-economic agreements, it is stipulated that these mines provide access to rough to our local cutting and polishing industry. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1006

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Supplementary, Mr. Braden .

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Supplementary To Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1006

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Mr. Speaker, I guess here is where the nub of the issue is. As the Minister has outlined, we've set out the expectation, or the requirement, that these are sold, but we do not have the ability to monitor or, it would seem, enforce these conditions. So, therefore, the investment that we've made, and we can attest to some fairly severe losses and some risks already, we still have a considerable exposure, Mr. Speaker, based in loan guarantees to cutting and polishing plants, based on this expectation, but we have not negotiated our ability to enforce it. How are we going to close this gap, Mr. Speaker? How are we going to protect the continuing investment of the taxpayer in this vital industry?

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Supplementary To Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1006

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Braden . Mr. Bell .

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Further Return To Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1006

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think it's important to recognize when we talk about enforceability, there are many unknowns and there is risk involved in this. We think it's a risk that's worth taking. We think we are doing what we can to mitigate it and make sure we have some success in this industry. Essentially, two parties come together, a factory and the mine. They agree an assortment of goods be provided to that factory that best meets its needs. They come up with what they call a sample box and then the mine does what it can, does its best to match that sample at each site.

Now, we don't know in future what the pipes that are being mined will look like, so it's entirely possible that what was once economic to cut and polish in the Northwest Territories, you could find a pipe that isn't. You could find that the next mine developed in the NWT is more similar to something like Argyle in Australia, where none of it would be fit for cutting and polishing here because of our high cost of labour. That isn't the case. We've been lucky.

In terms of getting an ironclad agreement and contract in force that can take into account all the possible variations, it's very difficult, almost impossible to do. I think we are doing what we can to make sure that this industry is a success. I would say that with 150 people employed in this local industry, or thereabouts, it is a success. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1006

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Supplementary, Mr. Braden .

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Supplementary To Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1006

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Mr. Speaker, I am not going to be content to say we should be happy to have 150 people employed. I would like to see hundreds more engaged, because I think there is the opportunity. Mr. Speaker, what I am looking at right now is a requirement or an obligation, that I feel I have, and we have in this Assembly, to be held accountable for the investment that we have at risk and, to some extent, for the jobs that people are engaged in here.

Mr. Speaker, the Minister, in response to a question from Mr. Ramsay a little while ago, said, well, if the producers and polishers can't make a deal -- and paraphrasing

roughly here, Mr. Speaker -- then the government will just have to get involved. How are we going to be able to get involved in fixing this problem if we don't have an agreement that allows us to have a meaningful role, Mr. Speaker?

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Supplementary To Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Braden . Mr. Bell .

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Further Return To Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Certainly, first of all, we have to understand the problem. I don't think we are entirely there yet. We are sitting down with the factory to talk about what they perceive as a premium being charged for the supply of the rough. They think they can do better on the open market in Antwerp. We are trying to understand exactly what the premium is. There is a bit of a difference of opinion, even within the factor, in terms of what that is. So they are trying to compare it to the open market in Antwerp.

But one of the things we know about the way diamonds are sold is that, somebody in Antwerp who has a site pays for a parcel of goods with a wide range of goods. If you want to extract only one segment of those goods that might be fit for cutting and polishing in the Northwest Territories and attribute a value to it based on the overall package or parcel size, it is very difficult because they aren't sold that way.

What I have said is, if the factory can sit down and document the problem, explain the problem to BHP, lay out the evidence, as it were, I am more than happy to participate in that discussion and sit down with BHP. I think it is in BHP's interest, and the interest of all mines, to make sure this industry works here. I do think they are committed to this industry. I think they have to have an understanding of the challenge that this factory is facing. I am optimistic that they will sit down and work this through. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Question 399-15(4): Support Of The Secondary Diamond Industry In The Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

The Chair

Calvin Pokiak

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Range Lake , Ms. Lee .

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Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, further to my Member's statement, I would like to ask questions to the Minister of Finance . Yesterday, in answering my questions, other than what he said about inherent dislike, he seems to suggest, Mr. Speaker, that this is an idea. It could come down the pipes. We have to be ready for that. I have no problem with that. It could be a great deal. Imperial Oil, if they do decide to go with the pipeline -- and I hope they do -- they are going to need housing. They are going to have to buy it from somebody. They may buy it from ATCO. There will be housing left.

If we can get advantage of that, that is great. But that is not the way the government is operating. This item is in the budget. The Minister has indicated that he is going to promote the pipeline workforce housing conversion. He has already stated that there is only one company that can do it. The Minister of the Housing Corporation stated this, and he has already stated in this House that he has been in negotiation with the federal government for them to give us $120 million so we can put in $110 million so we can work on this $297 million.

Does he see any problem with him being so ahead of this thing without having given due regard to what is possible in the North among our own industries, labour force and what other options there might be? Would it not preclude getting us a really good deal at the end of the day? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Ms. Lee . The honourable Minister of Finance , Mr. Roland .

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Return To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The pipeline project, or the Mackenzie gas project's partnership with Imperial being one of those, is ultimately going to make a decision of what package they would go for. If they go with a traditional package of just supplying camp workforce housing without any conversion aspects, this is off the table. If we don't get support from the federal government, this is off the table. Part of the problem we face here is timelines, and commitments have to be made before they make a decision to go down the path of building a pipeline.

The timing of it, the volume of it to get it done, we don't have factories in the Northwest Territories that can take on such a demand in such a short time frame. What we have been working on is what aspects of training can we have northerners put these packages together and then do the conversion afterwards, as well as the Minister of the Housing Corporation has talked about what portions of these camps can be built in the Northwest Territories. So there are those aspects.

But let's be clear. An opportunity here does exist. We recognize that and have been exploring that and putting the numbers together on the risks of going down this road and the positive solution that this could present to people of the Northwest Territories. As for myself in addressing it in the budget address, I think it is incumbent on ourselves here in the Northwest Territories, as the Government of the Northwest Territories, to look at this opportunity as a potential to dealing with the housing shortage we face across the North. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Supplementary, Ms. Lee .

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Supplementary To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I don't know sometimes if it is just wilful blindness or intentional neglect, or it is just really playing innocent. I have no idea. Mr. Speaker, let me just say that a budget document is really important. The markets go up and down on the basis of what a budget says. For the Minister to say that he is putting a concept in the budget and the Minister of Housing is going to negotiate and has been negotiating, I am telling you, if this goes through -- I hope it goes through. I don't know if this is the only option for Housing.

I hope it does. -- then it is definitely going to put ATCO housing at the front line for Imperial to consider. Any company that comes with 297 million...

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Supplementary To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Do you have a question, Ms. Lee ?

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Supplementary To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

...that is going to give a leg up. In that case, I want to know if the Minister will consider asking Imperial Oil to leave a trailer behind for free, because they have to get rid of them somehow, and ask ATCO housing to give these for free because we are giving them, really, the lifetime opportunity. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1007

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Ms. Lee . Mr. Roland .

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Further Return To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1008

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, being that I've, although at a younger day in my life, saw what happened in the Beaufort-Delta when companies came up with their traditional workforce housing and left them in the North. They left them and they are used for warehouses and sometimes a camp house out in the bush, as we call it, up in the Delta. Is that what we want to be left with in communities? I don't think so. People don't like that concept. If we are going to take advantage of this, we are going to have to take advantages upfront and make some necessary investments.

A company has approached us, approached the Housing Corporation, with a concept and, in fact, applied for a patent on that concept to make a conversion happen easier. We are working with that company, yes. If there are companies in the Northwest Territories that feel they have a product that they can supply, then they can, as well, work with the pipeline partners as well as working with the Housing Corporation.

Mr. Speaker, here in the Northwest Territories, we look right here in the city and see what development is happening when it comes to mobile homes in those areas. I think I can speak fairly clearly here that the majority of those units going up are not being manufactured in the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1008

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Final supplementary, Ms. Lee .

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Supplementary To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1008

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Mr. Speaker, the Minister still has not answered that question. The Housing Corporation Minister stated that this is a brilliant concept by a great company. They are going to try to sell this into other provinces. So we are doing ATCO Novel a great favour. We are going to be the test case. It is going to work. It is going to put 1,400 housing units in the Delta, so why can we not get that for free? We are doing them a favour. Why are we giving them the money? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1008

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Ms. Lee . Mr. Roland .

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Further Return To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1008

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Mackenzie gas project will be purchasing workforce housing. The Government of the Northwest Territories is not going to ATCO to say supply us with 1,400 camp beds so we can have these in the Northwest Territories. Our commitment through the Government of the Northwest Territories, as we have laid out to Members, totals about maybe $120 million. That is to do the groundwork, the development of subdivisions and in that area, conversions, tankage, and those things of setting them up in the communities. That is what we've committed to.

We want to take a concept, if it is applied at the front end, we can take it at the back end and probably get a deal. That is what we are after, is get a deal that affords us suitable housing for people in the Northwest Territories so we can meet what Members have put on the floor and passed the motion of dealing with poor housing in the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Question 400-15(4): Novel Housing Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1008

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Oral questions. Written questions. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Villeneuve .

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Written Question 28-15(4): Exemptions For Land Lease Only Policies

Written Questions

Page 1008

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. My question is for the Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs .

The land lease only policy was adopted by this government to ensure that an adequate land base would be available for the AFN upon completion of the treaty implementation negotiations. They