Debates of April 3rd, 1995

This is page numbers 765 - 792 of the Hansard for the 12th Assembly, 7th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was corporation .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Ministers Absent From The House

Commissioner's Award For Public Service Recipient, Mr. Edward Lenny

MLA Vs Media Hockey Game

Hardship Caused To Northerners From High Gasoline Prices

Recognition Of Pages From Pangnirtung

Canadian Championship Dog Derby Breathless

Northern Quebec Residents Relocated To High Arctic

Congratulating Aboriginal Achievement Award Recipients

Hon. Perrin Beatty's Appointment As President Of Cbc

Deh Cho Divisional Board Of Education

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Housing Policy Re Compassionate Grounds

GNWT Employees' Notice Re Lease Termination

Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Availability Of Consultant's Report Re Takeover Of Pol Facilities

Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Update On Polar Continental Shelf Project

Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Bill 1: Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1995-96Committee Report 4-12(7): Report On The Review Of The 1995-96 Main Estimates

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Mr. Allooloo , Mr. Antoine , Mr. Ballantyne , Hon. Nellie Cournoyea , Mr. Dent , Hon. Samuel Gargan , Hon. Stephen Kakfwi , Mr. Koe , Mr. Lewis, Mrs. Marie-Jewell , Ms. Mike , Hon. Don Morin , Hon. Richard Nerysoo , Hon. Kelvin Ng , Mr. Ningark , Mr. Patterson , Mr. Pudlat , Mr. Pudluk, Mr. Whitford , Mr. Zoe

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---Prayer

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 765

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Good afternoon. I hope Members had a good weekend. Orders of the day. Item 2, Ministers' statements.

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Minister's Statement 56-12(7): Ministers Absent From The House

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 765

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I wish to advise Members that the Honourable Silas Arngna'naaq will be absent from the House today to tour the Trap Research Facility in Vegreville, Alberta. The Honourable John Todd 's return from lqaluit has been delayed and he will also be absent from the House today. Thank you.

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Minister's Statement 56-12(7): Ministers Absent From The House

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 765

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Koe .

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Commissioner's Award For Public Service Recipient, Mr. Edward Lenny

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I would like to acknowledge a recipient of the Commissioner's award. On Friday evening in Inuvik, the Commissioner was in Inuvik and presented Mr. Edward Lenny with the Commissioner's award for public service at the highest level. Mr. Lenny is a resident of the Mackenzie Delta area and currently lives in Inuvik. He's a businessman. The award was given to him for his contributions to the development of cultural traditions in the western Arctic. He's very instrumental in developing the traditional Inuvialuit games, northern games as we call them.

He's been involved in this for many, many years. He's also very involved in organizing traditional feasts and dances and any other events that happen in the region.

Today, there was a press release issued from the Commissioner's office. The award was presented to him on Friday night and I would like to congratulate Mr. Lenny on receiving the award and take this opportunity to acknowledge his accomplishments. Mahsi cho.

---Applause

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Commissioner's Award For Public Service Recipient, Mr. Edward Lenny

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Koe . Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Lewis .

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MLA Vs Media Hockey Game

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

Brian Lewis

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Friday was a big day for MLAs and I've written a poem about the efforts of Members on the ice on that day. I'm sure that, although it's Monday and this is lighthearted, I'd be forgiven by my constituents and I don't think they would be urged to recall me for using my two and a half minutes on this statement:

On Friday, all Members know, we battled again our ancient foe, Our Sharks lined up at centre ice against those timid media mice.

In minutes it was four to one, we had those rodents on the run, Slick to pass, quick on the puck, the lead was due to skill, not luck.

But just as often in this House, Mighty Man becomes Minnie Mouse, The lead was slowly washed away by what was called the secret play.

'What secret play?" asked Speaker Sam, I see nothing weird from where I am." I see nothing at all," said Tough Guy Fred, "In fact, for a minute, I thought I was dead."

"That goes for me too," said defenceman Morin, "that sweat was a drop, but now she's just pouring." "What killed me," said Allooloo in distress, "Was that weird player in the purple dress."

"I think I know," said Kelvin Ng , "exactly how we lost our sting, the media's using all the stuff we leak so they haven't made us mad this week."

"I'm fitness strong," said gentleman Jim, "but after period two, I sure felt grim." "Me too," said Silas from Kivallivik, "I felt good at the start, but I soon fell sick."

When Kakfwi arrived, the score was tied, but no Shark felt his fish was fried, With Stephen on the Shark attack, we thought we'd soon get that lead back. 766 With moves like Gretzky and a wicked shot,

we heard he was a demon in the slot,

But had all this been a media plan,

to make us believe he was Superman?

What if Mario gave him kryptonite,

to make us lose our will to fight?

And so we came to sudden death,

the Sharks to a player without a breath.

Breathless they stood as the women began,

the shootout, with Stephen, our only man.

It was Marty Brown who broke the tie,

the media won and we wondered why.

Then Hamilton revealed the secret trick:

"The media always make you guys sick."

---Laughter

---Applause

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MLA Vs Media Hockey Game

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Lewis . item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Ningark .

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Hardship Caused To Northerners From High Gasoline Prices

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

John Ningark

Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms recognizes that the citizens of Canada have a right to pursue the gaining of a livelihood in any province in Canada. The mobility rights guarantee that one is able to move to any province or territory from any other without hindrance and look for work there, Mr. Speaker. Mobility rights also give all Canadian citizens and permanent residents the right to live and seek employment anywhere in Canada, Mr. Speaker. We are grateful for all the rights and privileges in the country that we enjoy every day in our lives.

Perhaps, Mr. Speaker, there are a few Canadians who are not able to enjoy such freedoms and privileges to move and seek employment in the country. For one thing, Mr. Speaker, the high cost of gasoline in our country, especially in the remote communities of the NWT, limit the people who make their livelihood from the land, by hunting and also, Mr. Speaker, the industry has been ruined by other people who we call animal rights activists. Mr. Speaker, if we talk about equality in the country, then we should make the price of gasoline equal throughout the country. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Hardship Caused To Northerners From High Gasoline Prices

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 3, Members' statements. Ms. Mike .

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Recognition Of Pages From Pangnirtung

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

Rebecca Mike

Baffin Central

Good afternoon, Mr. Speaker. It is with pleasure that I stand to let the House know that I have a constituent here, Vera Evic from Pangnirtung, who will be a Page until Friday. I don't see her here, but Julie Alikatuktuk is also a Page. Both of these students are from grade 10 and were chosen by their class to come here to work for us this week. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Recognition Of Pages From Pangnirtung

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Whitford .

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Canadian Championship Dog Derby Breathless

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

Tony Whitford

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today I rise to congratulate Raymond Beck of Hay River, the 1995 winner of the Canadian Championship Dog Derby held over the weekend in Yellowknife. Mr. Speaker, I spoke in my last Member's statement about the Dog Derby and how important it was to the sport of dog racing; a tradition that goes back in the history of the territories. This is the 40th year it has been run. It is always nice to see northern sports won by northern athletes. This is an instance where the family Beck is showing up well in the performance of this sport. There were no fewer than five Becks racing in this race finishing in the first, third, fifth, seventh and ninth positions.

When I look back in history, the Becks go back a long way in the sport of dog racing, back to 1957 when Ray Beck Sr., father of Raymond Beck, won seven times altogether. Of course, Grant and Richard Beck have taken two and three championships in a row. This year, we were well attended. We had people from the United States, British Columbia and across the territories. We had a very special guest this year, a lady racer, Monique Béné from France who raced and came in eighth place.

To all of the racers and the handlers who presented this sport to us in spite of the conditions that we face, I would like to offer them a very hardy congratulations, particularly to the Beck family for their valuable contribution to the sport of dog racing, not only here in the Northwest Territories and Canada, but internationally as well.

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Canadian Championship Dog Derby Breathless

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

An Hon. Member

Hear, hear.

---Applause

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Canadian Championship Dog Derby Breathless

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Pudluk .

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Northern Quebec Residents Relocated To High Arctic

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 765

Ludy Pudluk

High Arctic

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to congratulate ... Back in 1953, the federal government relocated people from northern Quebec to the High Arctic, to Resolute Bay and Grise Fiord. These people who were relocated have been under hardships since they were moved. They weren't sure why they were moved up there and nobody would explain it to them. Their emotions were hurt and some of them were physically hurt.

Since 1953, they have gone through much pain. I would like to congratulate Ron Irwin, DIAND Minister, that he can publicly say that they made a mistake in relocating the people up to the High Arctic and that he can say that he is sorry for moving them to another place without fully explaining to them why. The pain that these people have gone through is finally being recognized. We are happy that the federal government can apologize and finally realize that they made a mistake in the first place by relocating them to Resolute Bay and Grise Fiord.

I would like to thank the people who participated, especially Makivik Corporation. They worked very hard, especially Zebede Nungark. I seek unanimous consent to complete my statement.

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Northern Quebec Residents Relocated To High Arctic

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 767

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Member is seeking unanimous consent. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Please proceed, Mr. Pudluk .

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Northern Quebec Residents Relocated To High Arctic

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 767

Ludy Pudluk

High Arctic

(Translation) Thank you, colleagues. Zebede Nungark from Makivik, I would like to thank personally. They worked really hard to push the federal government and for them to admit that they made a mistake in relocating these people. Many people know that it was the mistake of the federal government, but they couldn't apologize. When those people were relocated to the High Arctic, they were sent in the fall. They were sent up by ships. There were no buildings to go in. They had to stay in tents for the whole winter without any equipment. They haven't been in that part of the north where it is dark 24 hours a day and they had to live in tents for the whole winter.

I am sure we all realize that they went through very difficult times. I don't think anybody can live in a tent for the whole winter. Some of them stayed in igloos for the whole winter. This was the very first time that they had to stay in complete darkness for 24 hours. For many of them, it was difficult. They had never been up there. A lot of them are still alive today. Even though some of them are no longer around, we want to thank those people because they went through very difficult times. Mr. Speaker, I wanted to rise to mention something about this. Thank you for giving me an opportunity,

---Applause

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Northern Quebec Residents Relocated To High Arctic

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 767

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Pudluk . Item 3, Members' statements. Ms. Cournoyea .

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Congratulating Aboriginal Achievement Award Recipients

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 767

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

HON, NELLIE COURNOYEA : Mr. Speaker, I would like to bring to the attention of Members that on the second occasion of the aboriginal achievement awards ceremony in Vancouver this weekend, out of 13 recipients, three were Northwest Territories born and raised. They were honoured at the celebration for medicine, Dr. Noah Carpenter; in the field of business achievement, Frank Hansen; and the honour's degree for life-long achievement went to Keriojuak Ashevak. Thank you.

---Applause

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Congratulating Aboriginal Achievement Award Recipients

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 767

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mr. Patterson .

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Hon. Perrin Beatty's Appointment As President Of Cbc

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 767

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to congratulate the Honourable Perrin Beatty as the new president of CBC. In addition to the many years of experience Mr. Beatty will bring to this very challenging job, as an MP in the House of Commons and as Minister of many portfolios, including Minister of Communications, I am confident that Mr. Beatty will not overlook the importance of the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation to the north because I think of Mr. Beatty as a friend of the north. He is well-travelled in the north having travelled here often, not out of obligation, but out of a genuine interest, curiosity and affection for our part of the world.

For example, when Mr. Beatty was Solicitor General responsible for the RCMP, he went out of his way to find out what it was like to travel in the north by flying from lqaluit to Pangnirtung, Clyde River, Resolute Bay, Grise Fiord and several Kitikmeot communities en route to Yellowknife in an RCMP twin otter. While in Resolute Bay, he took the trouble to meet with every special constable in the Northwest Territories. He could have travelled by Challenger jet, but instead he chose to take the long, slow route in a twin otter so he could really find out what travel up here is like so that he could visit and land in smaller communities.

Later, when he was Minister of Defence, through his good offices, the closure of the armed forces base in Inuvik was turned into at least a partly good news event when Mr. Beatty agreed to the transfer of buildings, including bed sheets, pots and pans in the student residence, for $1, allowing the then Aurora Campus of Arctic College to be established to serve the Inuvik region.

Mr. Speaker, I know there are financial restraints facing the CBC, but I'm confident that Mr. Beatty's knowledge of the north through the nature and quality of his previous visits will allow him to understand that there are no daily newspapers in the NWT --our CBC North radio is the daily newspaper of the north --that CBC is the only television broadcaster in the north producing programs in aboriginal languages which has a public mandate; that current affairs reports on CBC Radio and Television are especially vital in our part of Canada where few people can read or write even if they had access to newspapers.

So I'm confident, even as we face cutbacks of up to 25 per cent in the CBC in the coming year, Mr. Beatty will want to preserve our northern broadcasting system as much as possible and will remain a friend of the north. Thank you.

---Applause

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Hon. Perrin Beatty's Appointment As President Of Cbc

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 767

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Patterson . Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Antoine .

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Deh Cho Divisional Board Of Education

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 767

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Today I would like to take the opportunity to talk about the Deh Cho Divisional Board of Education. Until April 1 of 1990, Mr. Speaker, education in the Deh Cho region was managed and administered by the Department of Education out of Yellowknife. Since then, Mr. Speaker, the Deh Cho Divisional Board of Education has been

very noticeable in the region. The region is represented on the board by Wrigley, Jean Marie River, Trout Lake, Fort Liard, Nahanni Butte, Fort Providence and Fort Simpson, with consideration given to Kakisa.

Mr. Speaker, the board, in its efforts to provide the best possible learning environment for the people of Deh Cho, has been very aggressive and at the same time cautious with their limited resources. In 1993, grades 10, 11 and 12 students had to leave the region to continue their education. Since then, students can now attend school in Fort Simpson and receive their high school diploma without leaving the region.

Mr. Speaker, as enrolment in high school programs increases, the demand for student care also increases. As a result, residences were built and ready in the 1993-94 school year. Since the school program has been offered in the Deh Cho region, there have been 23 graduates. This May, we will see 16 more toss their caps into the air. Also, Mr. Speaker, the Deh Cho Divisional Board of Education has been successful in getting the community teacher education program. This program will be offered in Fort Simpson and in Fort Providence.

(Translation) Mr. Speaker, my time has lapsed and I would appreciate it if the Members would agree with me continuing to finish what I'm talking about.

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Deh Cho Divisional Board Of Education

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 768

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Antoine is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Continue, Mr. Antoine .

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Deh Cho Divisional Board Of Education

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 768

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

In the board's latest efforts to achieve autonomy, the attempts were being made to assume total responsibility of capital projects in the Deh Cho region. One such project was the renovation and addition to the Deh Gah Elementary/Secondary School in the Deh Cho region.

Mr. Speaker, education must be given priority in their endeavours to build and maintain the best learning environment for our children and those wishing to continue their education. The GNWT must also be consistent with their assistance as well. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Deh Cho Divisional Board Of Education

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 768

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 3, Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Ms. Cournoyea .

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Further Return To Question 317-12(7): Status Of Consultant Hired After Forest Fire Management Review

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 768

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I have a return to an oral question asked by Mrs. Marie-Jewell on March 28th regarding the consultant hired after forest fire management review.

Mr. Speaker, the consultant hired in November 1994 was Foulger Aviation Services Inc. A copy of the terms of reference for this contract will be tabled at the appropriate time.

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Return To Question 324-12(7): Plan Of Action Re Mackenzie Regional Health Board

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 768

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

I have another return to an oral question, Mr. Speaker, if I may proceed. It's an oral question asked by Mr. Zoe on March 27th, the plan of action -Mackenzie Regional Health Board. Mr. Speaker, the department is exploring the possibility of a health board for both the Deh Cho and Dogrib areas. Discussions are under way with the Dogrib Divisional Board of Education on an interesting proposal which could result in a new governance structure for the Dogrib region.

A form of social council would have responsibility for all programs in the social envelope including Health and Social Services, Education, Culture and Employment, and community justice within the Department of Justice. This combined board of management for all social programs was suggested by the Dogrib Divisional Board of Education as a way of dealing with increased costs and as a way of providing one board with responsibility for those programs which have the greatest social impact on the community.

Mr. Speaker, discussions are under way with the Deh Cho Tribal Council about the establishment of a health board for the Deh Cho region. A meeting is planned for mid-April in the Deh Cho to explore the project in more detail. The Tribal Council has been informed that the department would like to see a model similar to that being discussed for the Dogrib region. I am confident that we can come up with a solution to this problem by the fall of 1995. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 324-12(7): Plan Of Action Re Mackenzie Regional Health Board

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 768

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Mr. Nerysoo .

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Further Return To Question 320-12(7): Selection Of Consultants Used By Ece

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 768

Richard Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is a return to an oral question asked by Mr. Patterson on March 27, 1995 with regard to selection of consultants used by the Department of Education, Culture and Employment.

The department has entered into 32 consulting contracts since April 1, 1994, two of which were awarded to Avery Cooper Consulting. These two contracts were for a review of the interpreter/translator program and the evaluation of school/student accommodation services. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 320-12(7): Selection Of Consultants Used By Ece

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 768

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Whitford .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 769

Tony Whitford

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, colleagues. I'm pleased to recognize in the gallery, Ms. Monique Bene, author of children's books. She is from Le Celle sur Morin, France. Perhaps we can also call her an adventurer by taking up the challenge of dog racing in order to be able to write stories dealing with the sport of dog racing. A sample of her book is called, "Reve de Loup." That means dream of the wolf. It's a children's story about dog racing.

Also, Mr. Speaker, while I'm standing, I'd also like to pay recognition to Grant Beck.

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 769

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Whitford , you have half a minute, but your time is up. So, do you want unanimous consent? Mr. Whitford .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 769

An Hon. Member

En Francais.

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 769

Tony Whitford

Yellowknife South

Merci, Monsieur Presidente.

---Laughter

Yes, I would like unanimous consent to recognize two other visitors.

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 769

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Please proceed, Mr. Whitford .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 769

Tony Whitford

Yellowknife South

Thank you, colleagues. I would like to also recognize Grant Beck, Carol Perkison and Dave Dempsey, all involved in the active sport of dog racing in the Northwest Territories.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 769

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Koe .

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Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Minister of Health . In February 1994, Mr. Ballantyne and I asked questions about the review of pay scales for dental therapists and public health nurses. Both groups were involved in a transfer of health services from the federal government to this government and these groups were led to believe that there would be a review of their pay levels and probably some reclassification.

In February 1994, the then Minister of Health , Mr. Pollard , stated that he would review these issues and report back to this House by June or July of 1994. Mr. Speaker, it is now March 1995 and I'm not aware of what has been done to resolve these issues. So my question to the Minister of Health is what is the status of the review of the classification and pay rates of dental therapists and public health nurses?

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Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Health and Social Services, Ms. Cournoyea .

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Return To Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I would like to be more specific in my reply to the honourable Member. However, since there are collective agreement negotiations going on, I don't think it's the proper time to discuss any detail of the review, although I would like to let the Member know that we've done considerable work on those two particular positions. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Koe .

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Supplementary To Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

Fred Koe

Inuvik

Can I ask the Minister, through supplementary, what time frame she is looking at to review this, especially the issue of dental therapists?

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Supplementary To Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Ms. Cournoyea .

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Further Return To Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I've been advised that once a collective agreement has been signed off, the department can conclude the work on the two professions the Member has asked about. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Koe .

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Supplementary To Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

Fred Koe

Inuvik

May I ask the Minister, then, what is the status of the collective agreement negotiations? When is this supposedly going to be resolved?

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Supplementary To Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Ms. Cournoyea .

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Supplementary To Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I will have to take that question as notice.

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Supplementary To Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Question 378-12(7): Review Of Pay Scales For Dental Therapists And Public Health Nurses

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The question has been taken as notice. Item 6, oral questions. Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Question 379-12(7): Housing Policy Re Compassionate Grounds

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 769

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

allow a family member to stay with a senior throughout their grieving period or throughout their illness and not be penalized for having to pay rent for that particular period. Thank you.

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Question 379-12(7): Housing Policy Re Compassionate Grounds

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation , Mr. Morin .

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Return To Question 379-12(7): Housing Policy Re Compassionate Grounds

Question 379-12(7): Housing Policy Re Compassionate Grounds

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes, we can consider that. Thank you.

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Return To Question 379-12(7): Housing Policy Re Compassionate Grounds

Question 379-12(7): Housing Policy Re Compassionate Grounds

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Patterson .

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Question 380-12(7): GNWT Employees' Notice Re Lease Termination

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is for the Minister of Personnel . Mr. Speaker, I usually try to give notice of questions to Ministers, but today I haven't given the Minister any notice of this because of the way my constituents were treated. In the past month, several of my constituents, who are employees of the GNWT, were given notice in the form of a note posted on their door on March 3rd saying they had to be out of the premises on March 31st because the lease had terminated. I would like to ask the Minister of Personnel , is that a fair way to treat an employee? Thank you.

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Question 380-12(7): GNWT Employees' Notice Re Lease Termination

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Personnel , Ms. Cournoyea .

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Question 380-12(7): GNWT Employees' Notice Re Lease Termination

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I'm not knowledgeable of that circumstance so I'll take the question as notice and check into it. Thank you.

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Question 380-12(7): GNWT Employees' Notice Re Lease Termination

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The question has been taken as notice. Item 6, oral questions. Mrs. Marie-Jewell .

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Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we all know that it is the plan of the Housing Corporation to take over staff housing for the government, which was a departmental responsibility of Personnel. I would like to ask the Minister of DPM since a lot of DPW staff have taken the responsibility of looking after staff housing in the past, is there a plan to transfer DPW staff to the Housing Corporation? I would like to ask the Minister of DPW what he plans to do with the staff who have had the responsibility for maintenance of staff housing. What will happen to the staff of DPW? Thank you.

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Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister responsible for Government Services and Public Works, Mr. Morin .

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Return To Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We have transferred the responsibility of the administration of staff housing to the Housing Corporation. We're also looking at the best vehicle for maintenance of staff units as well as maintenance of government buildings in our communities, how to get the best system in place to maintain all of the capital infrastructure. We are working on that now and how we can accomplish that should be known by June. It may vary in different communities; it depends on the community on which way we can solve the problem the best. Thank you.

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Return To Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mrs. Marie- Jewell.

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Supplementary To Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thebacha

Just for clarification, Mr. Speaker, is it fair to say that, in addition to the many responsibilities of the housing authorities in the communities for maintenance of public housing, the responsibilities of DPW staff may be transferred to the housing authorities to ensure that maintenance of staff housing can be addressed, which has been transferred over to the Housing Corporation? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin .

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Further Return To Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We plan on working with the community and the staff to see which will be the best way to handle the situation. For example, in some communities, there are two or three maintenance people from the housing authority and they may or may not be union people. Then you have one or two maintenance people from DPW who are union. So we have to look at how we can mix this all together, serve the community the best and still treat our employees properly. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Question 381-12(7): Transfer Of Dpw Maintenance Staff

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Ningark .

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Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

John Ningark

Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is directed to the Minister of Public Works and Services . This is subsequent to my Member's statement regarding the high cost of gasoline. In the eastern Arctic, the rate of dependency on welfare is very high. The suicide rate among the Inuit people is the highest next to Dene and others in the country, Mr. Speaker.

The trapping industry is virtually destroyed by animal rights activists, but there are people who are dependent upon trapping and hunting, Mr. Speaker. We spend a substantial amount of money in trying to deal with health problems in the country, especially in this particular jurisdiction. Too much free time can be very difficult for young people, Mr. Speaker. Hunting is healthy. Country food is no substitute, Mr. Speaker, for canned food that we buy in stores. What is the honourable Minister doing to try to solve the problem of the high cost of gasoline in the eastern Arctic? Thank you.

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Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 770

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Public Works and Services , Mr. Morin .

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Return To Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. At the present time, we are finishing a review of all the petroleum products and cross-subsidy in the Northwest Territories. Hopefully, in the very near future, I will be able to take a paper to Cabinet and try to get some recommendations on how we are going to restructure the pricing of fuel and gasoline in all of our communities that are off-highway and serviced by POL.

Right now, the subsidy is based on the price of fuel in the community and the price of delivering that gas. We were instructed to look at all the costs that surround keeping the liquid in the community as well. So we have to look at the capital costs and come up with a price structure and a subsidized program that does make sense. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Ningark .

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Supplementary To Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

John Ningark

Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As the Premier is aware and my colleague from the Kitikmeot region, Mr. Ng , is aware, almost every meeting we have attended with the Kitikmeot Regional Council, there is an outcry from the delegates because of the high cost of gasoline. Mr. Speaker, how soon will the honourable Minister bring the matter before Cabinet?

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Supplementary To Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin .

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Further Return To Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Fairly soon my department will be briefing me on this issue. Then I will speak to Members about it and then take it to Cabinet. Hopefully, we will get it done by June. I would just like to assure the Member, as well as other Members of this House, that we wouldn't make any drastic changes to anything until we consult with Members. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ningark .

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Supplementary To Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

John Ningark

Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Will the honourable Minister assure me that he will bring the matter to Cabinet by June? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin .

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Further Return To Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes, I will assure the Member that we will deal with it by June. Thank you.

---Applause

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Further Return To Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Question 382-12(7): Solution To High Gasoline Cost In Eastern Arctic

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Patterson .

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Question 383-12(7): Availability Of Consultant's Report Re Takeover Of Pol Facilities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Minister of Public Works and Services . Mr. Speaker, I was heartened to hear the Minister state in reply to Mr. Ningark that he would be involving Members in possible changes to the POL system in the Northwest Territories. I have written the Minister about this. I understand that a consultant was commissioned by the department to review various options associated with the takeover of MOT POL facilities in lqaluit. I would like to ask the Minister if he would be willing to make that consultant's report available to me. Thank you.

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Question 383-12(7): Availability Of Consultant's Report Re Takeover Of Pol Facilities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Public Works and Services , Mr. Morin .

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Return To Question 383-12(7): Availability Of Consultant's Report Re Takeover Of Pol Facilities

Question 383-12(7): Availability Of Consultant's Report Re Takeover Of Pol Facilities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like it made available to myself first. So once I get a chance to see it, I will talk to the Member about it. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 383-12(7): Availability Of Consultant's Report Re Takeover Of Pol Facilities

Question 383-12(7): Availability Of Consultant's Report Re Takeover Of Pol Facilities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

So that means you have to read it.

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Return To Question 383-12(7): Availability Of Consultant's Report Re Takeover Of Pol Facilities

Question 383-12(7): Availability Of Consultant's Report Re Takeover Of Pol Facilities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Ningark .

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Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

John Ningark

Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is directed to the honourable Minister of Health and Social Services. About two years ago, I brought the matter before this House regarding the delays in old age pension cheques. Again, this year I brought the matter before the Minister. From the community of Gjoa Haven, I have received correspondence dated March 29, 1995 of the same matter. People are not receiving pension cheques on time, Mr. Speaker. My question is has the honourable Minister communicated with his counterparts regarding the matter? Thank you.

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Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 771

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Health and Social Services, Ms. Cournoyea .

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Return To Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Ningark .

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Supplementary To Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

John Ningark

Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Perhaps the federal government is incapable of meeting the deadline to bring the elders' pension cheques to the elders on time, Mr. Speaker. Perhaps, Mr. Speaker, the honourable Minister can communicate with her federal counterparts and offer them the alternative and have this jurisdiction issue the cheques to the residents of the NWT. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Ms. Cournoyea .

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Further Return To Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I don't know if that is possible. It is a federal program offered all across the provincial jurisdictions. There will be a meeting of Health and Social Services Ministers soon and some discussions will be how do you apply the overall standards to the various jurisdictions. This isn't on the agenda, however, I will commit to continue to follow up with the federal government to look at better ways of making sure that the pension cheques arrive on time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Question 384-12(7): Delays In Receipt Of Old Age Pension Cheques

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Ballantyne .

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Question 385-12(7): Update On Polar Continental Shelf Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

Michael Ballantyne

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is to the Premier and it is regarding the polar continental shelf project. As Members are aware, the polar continental shelf project has gone on for many years and the federal government, through Natural Resources Canada, provide logistical support to an amazing number of scientific experiments and projects in the Northwest Territories.

I think it's probably time for an update from the government on exactly how much money has been spent on this project, what sort of input our government has into the experimental projects that go on and how we're able to access the information that has been collected over the years. If I could ask if the Minister could provide this House with an update on the activity of the polar continental shelf project.

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Question 385-12(7): Update On Polar Continental Shelf Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Madam Premier .

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Question 385-12(7): Update On Polar Continental Shelf Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I can do that, but I can't do it on my feet. I understand part of the program. I know very well, particularly in Tuktoyaktuk, that they operated very, very independently from the community, very independently from anyone in the Northwest Territories. However, it was seen as a research centre that was valuable to the Northwest Territories. I will commit to provide an update to this House. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 385-12(7): Update On Polar Continental Shelf Project

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Patterson .

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Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is for the Premier . Mr. Speaker, it seems that every day there are new revelations about just how the new federal budget will impact on the people of the Northwest Territories. We're getting bits and pieces of information from here and there. I'd like to ask the Premier , does this government have a method of monitoring the impact of federal budget decisions on the Northwest Territories? Thank you.

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Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Madam Premier .

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Return To Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, as I've expressed to the House on several occasions, I expect that the various departments and the Ministers would try to follow through on the specific programs that relate to the function of their department, or attached functions or are complementary to the functions of the department. The Minister of Finance has set up an internal team to try to monitor, under the Department of Finance, just exactly what those cuts will be.

As the Member, from his experience, will know, sometimes it's very difficult to get immediate response because it appears the direction is to cut, but then the departments in the federal regime are left to make those cuts. Sometimes they don't know until later where they're going to meet their budget allocations.

So we're trying to very hard to keep track of what is going on within the department and with overall planning in the Department of Finance. That's one of the reasons Mr. Pollard is in Ottawa right now, because he had an indication that the community futures program may be on the block and that if we didn't very quickly make representation; that we stood to lose it. So, it's looked at overall and monitored by the Minister of Finance . However, each program department tries to zero in on what is relative to their job functions. That's the way we're handling it now.

When we have indicators that there's a problem, we try to get down to deal with the federal Minister responsible as soon as possible. That's how we're dealing with it right at the moment. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Patterson .

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Supplementary To Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

Dennis Patterson

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to thank the Premier for that informative answer. I was speaking earlier today about my concern about cutbacks to the CBC in the north. I understand that CBC North is facing possible cutbacks of 25 per cent in the coming year, after having pared its administration to the bone in previous years. I would like to ask the Premier , which Minister or department within our government would be responsible for monitoring cutbacks in the CBC and perhaps representing the concerns of the Northwest Territories if cuts should affect us?

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Supplementary To Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr.

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Supplementary To Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 772

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Madam Premier .

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Further Return To Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I've been trying to find out exactly what is happening in the CBC and how it has been affecting us. I know there has been some concern expressed, particularly in the central Arctic that has been promised some facilities and operation money. There is quite a bit of worry in the regional operations so the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment and I are both very concerned about whether those cuts will happen. It would be myself, primarily, and then the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment who are dealing with this.

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Further Return To Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Question 386-12(7): Monitoring Impact Of Federal Budget On Nwt

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Pudlat .

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Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

Kenoayoak Pudlat

Baffin South

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Minister of Health and Social Services. In the eastern Arctic, we all know that food prices are very high in the northern stores. The communities I represent get their food shipped by airlines and this has very much increased the costs of food in the stores of the three communities I represent. I would like to ask the Minister what differences there are in the food prices from southern companies. I would like to ask the Minister if she has looked into this to see if there is any difference between the food prices in the north and in the southern stores. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Health and Social Services, Madam Premier .

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Return To Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I can assure the Member without any hesitancy that the food prices in the southern stores are much different than the food prices in Arctic Canada and, in a lot of communities, substantially different. What the government tries to do overall, in terms of social assistance, is the cost of the food is calculated the best we can. I know it is not always as generous as people would like to see, but we try to take that into account. I believe more and more, this government is trying to determine the cost of living, from housing to food, general maintenance of homes and livelihood, and is trying to incorporate some fairness in terms of subsidies.

For example, in Pelly Bay, we have a subsidy because the only way foodstuffs get into the region are through air flights. Just recently, we've done some experiments and tried to bring the food in by barge. The other thing, too, that's available in a lot of the communities -- and we're trying to get an understanding of who is aware of it and who is using it -- is the food freight subsidy which is available to everybody, including stores. There's a subsidy for bringing in fresh food and some foodstuffs. I've asked recently whether that subsidy is being translated into lower costs at stores for individuals.

This is not a big study with a consultant, I'm just asking those questions to get a breakdown. I will try to have more detail in a few days to see where we are with that. There are substantial differences and we recognize that, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

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Return To Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Pudlat .

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Supplementary To Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

Kenoayoak Pudlat

Baffin South

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Supplementary to the same Minister. She indicated that she has put out a study as to what kind of differences there are in the food prices, and a lot of my constituents would like to see this study that has been done. Can the Minister indicate to the House whether she can give me the information that she said has been put out in that study? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Ms. Cournoyea .

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Further Return To Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Mr. Speaker, I will provide for the Member the latest cost of living rates as soon as possible, perhaps later today or tomorrow. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Question 387-12(7): Northern Versus Southern Food Costs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Lewis .

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Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister responsible for Intergovernmental and Aboriginal Affairs , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Return To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, as far as I know there are no provisions specifically for recall in any of the aboriginal organizations. They do have terms for removal of executives and there are procedures under local customs in each community for the removal of chiefs; these vary in different communities up and down the valley. As far as I know, there is no duly-elected government of the First Nation, yet as such. Thank you.

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Return To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Lewis .

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Supplementary To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

Brian Lewis

Yellowknife Centre

Does that mean that in the First Nations governments, once you are elected, there is neither a council nor a chief, that you then have a mandate for your full term and there is no way in which you could be removed during that time? Is that what the Minister is saying?

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Supplementary To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 773

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 774

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In the politics of aboriginal communities, each chief is elected for a certain term. Each president of a Metis local, for instance, is elected for a certain term; those are the ones that I am most familiar with. Each community has different understandings about what is the custom for removal of chiefs. For instance, in some communities it was understood that if a sufficient number of people showed up at a public meeting called to discuss the issue, and if a motion was passed at such a meeting, that was the end of the term of the chief.

The Metis locals run more by their rules. There are rules for the removal of officials. The regional and territorial organizations also have specific procedures under their by-laws and constitution for removal of officials. But the one that the Member may be most interested in is the custom of the Dene for removal of chiefs, where it is almost by local custom that it is done. It has become, I would say, not so widely practised any more. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 774

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Lewis .

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Supplementary To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 774

Brian Lewis

Yellowknife Centre

Okay, on the basis of what the Minister said then, Mr. Speaker, would he confirm that once a person is elected to an aboriginal First Nations government, there is no guarantee that that person can serve the full term for which he was elected? There are varying provisions from community to community whereby that member could be removed.

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Supplementary To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 774

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 774

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, in the past...I know that in the 1970s and early 1980s, for instance, there were some chiefs who were removed because of local disgruntlement with the perception of how they may have dissatisfied their people.

In the last 10 years, I would say, as more and more of the chief and councils have got into business and into more of an operational mode where they have extensive responsibilities, there has also come into place very clear mandates and procedural requirements for the way they conduct their business. Because of that, I believe the accountability has become much more technical and clearly defined in many of the communities.

So the business of removing chiefs has become, for many of the people, I think, a greater concern. It shouldn't be trivialized or just left to an undefined "local custom." People have started to recognize that a very effective speaker can get up at a public meeting and sway people to back a call to remove a chief, even without substance of any significance. And so, I think people, in order to protect themselves, have seen that what you need are strong procedures for the protection of those people who are elected, as well as the themselves. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 774

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Final supplementary, Mr. Lewis .

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Supplementary To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 774

Brian Lewis

Yellowknife Centre

Since there are all kinds of examples that we all know about, a long list of them, of people who have in fact been removed from office - -very often for trivial reasons -- I would like to ask the Minister, what procedures are in fact taking place, what ways are being established to make sure that if a member is going to be removed in aboriginal First Nations governments, that would be done in a transparent way so that everybody would know what the issue is and has a chance to do things that he says properly and not for trivial reasons.

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Supplementary To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 774

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 774

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, there are no specific provisions that I know of offhand that would lend to it. In many, many cases, people are starting to see that long-term planning, long-term stability is essential for the well-being of the businesses that are charged to the care of the chief, the councils and other elected officials. That political instability also leads to instability of business and economic interests.

So, while people still look at it in the sense that people at the community level have the ultimate power to put you into office and to take you out. That understanding alone is often enough to make people very careful about the things that they ask people to do, the way in which those people carry out their jobs, and how they account for themselves. It seems to me, my impression is that the more business we conduct ourselves, the more self-governing we become, the less need there is for that sort of undefined method of removing elected people. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Question 388-12(7): Provisions For Removal Of First Nations Leadership

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 774

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Item 6, oral questions. Item 7, written Item 8, returns to written questions. Item 9, replies to opening address. Item 10, petitions. Item 11, reports of standing and special committees. Item 12, reports of committees on the review of bills. Item 13, tabling of documents. Mr. Ningark .

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Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 774

John Ningark

Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to table Tabled Document 78-12(7), a letter from Mr. Anthony Anguttitauruq regarding old age pensions. It is addressed to myself. Thank you.

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Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 774

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 13, tabling of documents. Item 18, second reading of bills. Ms. Cournoyea .

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Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 774

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Sorry, Mr. Speaker, may I move back to tabling of documents?

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Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 775

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to go back to tabling of documents. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Please proceed, Ms. Cournoyea .

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Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 775

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Speaker, I wish to table Tabled Document 79-12(7) terms of reference, Foulger Aviation Services Inc., recommendations for forest fire aircraft contracts for 1995.

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Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 775

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 13, tabling of documents. Ms. Mike .

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Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 775

Rebecca Mike

Baffin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to table Tabled Document 80-12(7), correspondence received by myself from Mayor David Tagoona regarding the implementation of the rent scale.

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Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 775

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 13, tabling of documents. Item 14 reading of bills. Item 16, motions. Item 17, first reading of bills. Item 18, second reading of bills. Item 19, consideration in committee of the whole of bills and other matters: Bill 1, Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1995-96 ; Bill 13,

An Act to Amend the Fair Practices Act ; Bill 16,

An Act to Amend the Retirement Plan Beneficiaries Act ; Bill 19,

An Act to Amend the Elections Act, No. 2 ; Bill 24, Community Employees' Benefits Act ; Bill 27,

An Act to Amend the Land Titles Act ; Committee Report 2-12(7), Report on the Legislative Action Paper on the Office of Ombudsman for the Northwest Territories; Committee Report 3-12(7), Report on the Review of the Legislative Action Paper Proposing New Heritage Legislation for the Northwest Territories; Committee Report 4-12(7), Report on the Review of the 1995-96 Main Estimates; Committee Report 5-12(7), Report on the Review of Rewriting the Liquor Laws of the Northwest Territories: A Legislative Action Paper; and, Committee Report 6-12(7), Report on the Review of the Legislative Discussion Paper on the Draft of the New Education Act, with Mr. Ningark in the chair.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 775

The Chair

John Ningark

Thank you. The committee will come to order. What is the wish of the committee? Mr. Dent .

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 775

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to recommend that the committee resume consideration of Bill 1 and Committee Report 4-12(7), specifically to deal with the budget of the NWT Power Corporation and, if we should conclude that, to move back to the Housing Corporation budget and then, perhaps, Justice.

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 775

The Chair

John Ningark

Thank you. Mr. Dent is recommending that we deal with the budget of the NWT Power Corporation and then the NWT Housing Corporation budget and, if we're able to conclude those two items, that we move on to Justice. Do we have the concurrence of the committee?

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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 775

Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

---Agreed

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Bill 1: Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1995-96Committee Report 4-12(7): Report On The Review Of The 1995-96 Main Estimates

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 775

The Chair

John Ningark

Thank you. We will take a 10- minute break.

---SHORT RECESS

We are dealing with the NWT Power Corporation. Honourable Minister responsible, do you have opening remarks?

Minister's Introductory Remarks

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Bill 1: Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1995-96Committee Report 4-12(7): Report On The Review Of The 1995-96 Main Estimates

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 775

Nellie Cournoyea

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, you have received the 1995-96 operations and maintenance draft budget and this package, which includes the corporation's goals and objectives, is in the same format provided to the committee the last two years. the government's. The 1995-96 budget will be approved by the corporation's board of directors in March 1995. This draft budget has now been reviewed by the corporation's senior management.

The draft budget estimates 1995-96 net income at approximately $7 million and is based on the application to the Public Utilities Board (PUB) for an automatic fuel adjustment clause. If approved, it will automatically pass on fuel price increases or decreases. A decision on this application is expected by May 1995.

The corporation has reviewed the need for a general rate application for the 1995-96 year to increase rates. The need for this increase is dependent on the water levels in the Snare/Yellowknife system. If water levels are low again in 1995-96,the corporation will apply for a rate increase to recover the increased fuel costs. This will allow the corporation to earn its full rate of return of approximately $10 million.

The current low water levels in the Snare River system, caused by unusually dry conditions last spring and summer, unfortunately added to the Yellowknife/Rae Edzo diesel dependence. It means that approximately $4.3 million in extra fuel will be burned to supply needed power in 1994-95. The PUB decision to spread $1 million of this extra cost across the north, while collecting the remaining $3.3 million directly from the Yellowknife system, was fair. It has been met with disappointment, but acceptance from most outside regions.

In order to continue to be able to pay a dividend to the GNWT to fund the territorial power support program and continue to be able to reinvest in equipment, it is essential that the Power Corporation earn its full return on equity and this necessitates rate increases from time to time. Based on present estimates, this will require an increase of approximately three per cent in 1995-96. The corporation was involved in Public Utilities Board hearings in Iqaluit and Inuvik in January to address concerns and information requests about a more equitable system of power rates across the NWT.

In response to these hearings, the corporation has proposed that, as an interim measure, rates should be adjusted to the cost of providing power in each community and that an additional study of options be undertaken before finalizing how rates will be set.

The Public Utilities Board has yet to make its decision on how this should be done. The PUB's decision, when received, will likely see rates beginning to be adjusted in May 1995. Rates will both increase and decrease to better reflect the cost of providing power. These rate changes will not result in the corporation earning any additional revenue. The corporation is spending a considerable amount of time and resources in helping to gather all the information to determine how rates should be set. Our common objective, Mr. Chairman, is to see a system of rates that is fair and stable across the north.

Mr. Chairman, the corporation hopes to see progress soon in the long-standing compensation issue for Treaty 8 members over impacts of the Taltson River hydro project. Last year, the corporation was directed by the NWT Water Board to address the matter along with environmental studies, as conditions of its water licence. Meetings were held this week, and have been planned for later in March, with Treaty 8 chiefs and affected residents, to resolve impacts during the term of our licence and perhaps beyond.

The ceremonial ground breaking late in August at the Snare Cascades hydro site was an historic event for both the corporation and the Dogrib Nation. Their 4.3 megawatt, $27 million plant will pay a dividend to the Dogrib people through a 65 year operating lease with the Power Corporation, and provide about 100 jobs before it is commissioned in the summer of 1996.

The Legislative Assembly will be requested to guarantee a borrowing bill by the NWT Energy Corporation Ltd., a wholly- owned subsidiary of the Power Corporation, to finance this project. This guarantee, which is similar to guarantees given to the Power Corporation for their borrowing, will allow the Energy Corporation to borrow money at the most favourable rates. The financing raised by the Energy Corporation will be used to finance the Snare Cascades hydro project. There will be no cost to the Government of the Northwest Territories for this borrowing, as the debt will be repaid with proceeds from the agreements between the NWT Power Corporation and the Dogrib Power Corporation.

An I announced in the Legislative Assembly in the previous session, the government has decided to postpone the privatization initiative. It will be up to the newly-elected Legislature, after the election this October, to decide on further action.

The Standing Committee on Finance's report expressed concern in the corporation's planning and sensitivity to dramatic rate changes. Let me assure the committee that the Power Corporation is sensitive to the effects of rate increases, and appreciative of the need for prudent planning. The corporation has addressed a number of areas over the last six years and will continue to do so in the future.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am ready to address any questions your committee may have.

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Bill 1: Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1995-96Committee Report 4-12(7): Report On The Review Of The 1995-96 Main Estimates

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 776

The Chair

John Ningark

Thank you, Premier . On behalf of the Standing Committee on Finance that reviewed the bill, Mr. Antoine .

Standing Committee On Finance Comments

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Bill 1: Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1995-96Committee Report 4-12(7): Report On The Review Of The 1995-96 Main Estimates

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 776

The Chair

Jim Antoine

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mineral exploration does not require power from a corporation. However, if that exploration is fruitful, the resulting mining operations become large consumers of power. The committee recognizes the potential for future sales based on the success of the current mineral exploration. It is crucial that the corporation develop specific plans for providing services to these new users.

Committee Members continue to express a desire for the corporation to put more effort into exploring alternative energy sources. As we said in a previous report:

"Any initiative which might bring down costs to consumers should be carefully investigated by the corporation. The Power Corporation is an important economic and social instrument that should continue to play an important role serving the people of the north in cooperation with the Government of the Northwest Territories."

Finally, committee Members note the corporation's continuing phase II general rate application presently before the Public Utilities Board (PUB). The committee appreciates that the goal of this application -- to make power rates more reflective of the true cost of providing that power -- means there will be significant changes to the corporation's rate structure, and to the power bills of many northerners There will be significant effects on the government.

Not only will the government's own power bills be affected, but there could be large changes to the amounts paid to domestic and commercial consumers under the power subsidy program. Committee Members feel that the government should be involved in the PUB hearings in such a way as to ensure that their interests are well represented.

As for the application itself, the corporation's initial proposal -- which included two large rate zones covering those communities whose power is provided by diesel generation -- provoked quite an outcry from many customers. Committee Members are not satisfied with the way the corporation handled this application. Similarly, committee Members expressed similar concerns at the corporation's 1994 application for a low water rider surcharge.

The committee notes that, with respect to that application, the Public Utilities Board: "indicated its concern with respect to the lack of prudence shown by NWTPC in not properly planning for low-water years." These incidents demonstrate to the committee that the corporation needs to be more prudent in its planning, and more sensitive to the impact of dramatic changes in power rates on its customers.

That's the report of the Standing Committee on Finance, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.

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Bill 1: Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1995-96Committee Report 4-12(7): Report On The Review Of The 1995-96 Main Estimates

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 777

The Chair

John Ningark

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . Before I get into general comments, I would like to ask the Premier if she wishes to bring in the witnesses.

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