Debates of Oct. 16th, 1996

This is page numbers 1167 - 1216 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 3rd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was community .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Ministers' Statement 113-13(3): Partners In A New Beginning

Child Welfare

95/96 Business Development Fund Annual Report

Small Business Week

Education, Culture, And Employment's Web Site

Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

The Need To Live Within Our Fiscal Means

Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

The Need To Achieve Efficiency And Fairness Through Government Restructuring

Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Emergency Aid To Grise Fiord

Residency Requirements For Social Housing

Southern Communication Strategy

Update On Funding For Status Of Women's Council

Contributions Of Business Development Fund

Equipment Lost In School Fire

Business Development Fund Job Creation

GNWT/northwestel Service Agreement

Guidelines For Capital Project Management

New Revenue/expenditure Initiatives

Negotiations Of Bulk Rates With Commercial Carriers

Naming Of The New Chair Of Workers' Compensation Board

Differential Pricing For Public And Government

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Item 18: Second Reading Of Bills

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Hon. James Antoine, Hon. Goo Arlooktoo , Mr. Barnabas , Hon. Charles Dent , Mr. Enuaraq , Mr. Erasmus , Mr. Evaloarjuk , Hon. Samuel Gargan , Mrs. Groenewegen , Mr. Henry , Hon. Stephen Kakfwi , Mr. Krutko , Mr. Miltenberger , Hon. Don Morin , Hon. Kelvin Ng , Mr. O'Brien , Mr. Ootes , Mr. Picco , Mr. Roland , Mr. Steen , Hon. Manitok Thompson , Hon. John Todd .

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--Prayer

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 1167

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Ministers' statements. Mr. Antoine .

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Ministers' Statement 113-13(3): Partners In A New Beginning

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1167

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Mr. Speaker, people living in the western Northwest Territories have been talking about constitutional development for the Western Territory for a number of years, and they have always come back to the same conclusion.

In order to make some decisions about how they want the Western Territory to operate up to Division, residents need a starting point -- something to look at, something to think about, and something to talk about.

Mr. Speaker, it has been my pleasure over the past four months to serve as Co-chair, along with Mr. George Kurszewski.

It was also my pleasure at a ceremony earlier today to officially present our group's Draft Constitution Package to the Aboriginal Summit, to the Western Caucus of this Legislative Assembly and to the public. I will also be tabling this package with the Legislative Assembly this afternoon.

Building on the work and the previous discussions regarding constitutional development, this package, "Partners in a New Beginning: A Draft Constitution Package" is a result of long discussions and many meetings. And while we are presenting a document that represents collective discussion and ideas, the tabling of this document does not mark the ending of a project, but rather a starting point, and a turning point.

The aim of this package is to stimulate public discussion. From this public consultation, we hope to create a constitutional proposal for the people to ratify.

The package being presented today has two parts -- a proposed structure for the Territorial Government, and a draft companion Aboriginal Self-Government Agreement.

What we have attempted to do in this is to develop a partnership based on the concepts of Aboriginal self-government and the public Government of the Legislative Assembly.

I would like to stress that while the package highlights one model in detail, it also contains some other models of Government that we considered in the process of developing this package.

The model is not set in stone, and nothing is final.

As of today, we move into a new stage of the Constitution development process.

This package is now in the hands of the public to review, discuss and provide us comments, questions and ideas about what we have presented.

Starting in January, members of the Constitution Working Group will be going out to communities to meet with people, to hear their ideas and collect your comments on the Constitution.

Prior to that, people are encouraged to share their ideas in writing to the Constitution Working Group, or discuss their thoughts with all of the Members of this House and with representatives of the Aboriginal Summit.

After we have gathered public input, we will review the document again, and bring back a document to be ratified by the people of the Western Territory.

Mr. Speaker, in bringing forward this document today, it is appropriate to share with Members the outcome of a meeting I had last Friday in Ottawa with the Federal Minister of the Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development, Mr. Ron Irwin.

The focus of our discussion was the work of the Constitution Working Group.

The meeting was positive, and Mr. Irwin reconfirmed his support for a "made in the North" Constitution for the Western Territory.

But while support from Mr. Irwin and the Federal Government is an important step in this process, what is even more important is the support and input from the people who are residents of what will be the new Western Territory.

As residents of the Western Territory, we are all partners in a new beginning and a strong future for the North.

And, Mr. Speaker, I believe with this milestone today, we move one step closer to fulfilling the priority of this Legislative Assembly, to make both Nunavut and the Western Territory a reality.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Ministers' Statement 113-13(3): Partners In A New Beginning

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1168

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mahsi, Jim. Ministers' Statements. Mr. Ng .

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Minister's Statement 114-13(3): Child Welfare

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1168

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to speak of our most precious resource, the children of the North.

Our children are our future. They will be the ones to bring us to prosperity; they will be the ones who will become our leaders in the 21st Century; they will be the ones who care for us as we grow old.

The people of the North are very protective of their resources, as they should be.

We recognize our dependency on the land and on the sea. We develop, harvest and manage our natural resources carefully. We are always attentive to our obligation to provide for future generations, and we are ever mindful of how fragile our environment really is.

But sometimes it seems we forget how fragile our children are.

As our most precious resource, children are also our most vulnerable resource. They continue to be exposed to family violence, to crime, to alcohol abuse, to illness, to accident and injury, and they suffer as a result.

Increasingly, children are being taken into care because they need to be protected from harm.

Our social workers are doing everything that they can to protect children, but it does not seem to be enough.

Other care givers such as nurses, foster parents, teachers, counsellors of all sorts, as well as concerned members of the community, are doing everything that they can.

But that does not seem to be enough.

The need, obligation and responsibility to protect children does not fall solely on the shoulders of government.

This responsibility must be met by those of us in this Assembly, by every parent, every family member, and every member of the community.

We must do everything that we can to ensure our children are born healthy, raised in a protective and nurturing home and community, and kept safe from harm.

We owe them nothing less, since without our children we have no future.

In the next Session, I will introduce new child welfare legislation which gives communities the power to make decisions about taking children into care.

In closing, Mr. Speaker, I call on all Members of this House to support a renewed emphasis on child welfare to help keep all children safe.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 114-13(3): Child Welfare

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1169

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Ng . Ministers' Statements. Mr. Kakfwi .

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Minister's Statement 115-13(3): 95/96 Business Development Fund Annual Report

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1169

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, Honourable Members, later today I will table a copy of the Department of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development's Business Development Fund Annual Report for the 1995/96 fiscal year.

Members are provided on a regular basis with a list of contributions which my Department has approved to businesses in their constituency. In this report a

summary and breakdown is provided of all the contributions approved in the preceding fiscal year.

I am pleased to make this information available to Members of the Assembly and to note some of the highlights of the report which are evidence, I believe, of our ongoing commitment to assist the private sector and to help business enterprise grow and prosper during these difficult times.

The Department approved 246 contributions during the 1995/96 fiscal year with funding averaging $12,456 per approval. Consistent with trends in other years, the Department made a greater number of contributions to level 3 communities as compared with those in levels 1 and 2. Evidence, Mr. Speaker, that funds are going to the most needy businesses - those who by virtue of their remote location share systemic constraints to growth.

In keeping with our efforts to promote opportunities with and for Aboriginal businesses, I am also pleased to note that contributions to Aboriginal businesses accounted for 78% of the total fund with the majority of these approvals toward business creation projects.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to acknowledge the spirit and enthusiasm of the Northwest Territories business community and extend to them our commitment for ongoing service and assistance. Through the efforts of the business community the economy of the Northwest Territories will continue to grow at a significant rate.

Thank you.

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Minister's Statement 115-13(3): 95/96 Business Development Fund Annual Report

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1169

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Kakfwi . Ministers' Statements, Mr. Kakfwi .

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Minister's Statement 116-13(3): Small Business Week

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1169

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. October 21-15 this year is Small Business Week across Canada and as the Minister responsible, I wish to acknowledge this occasion, and salute the many entrepreneurs and small business people who make their living in this sector across the North.

As Minister of this Portfolio, I have the privilege to meet with many small business people on a regular basis and to learn first hand about their ideas, their challenges and their aspirations.

As a group, small business people tend to be tenacious in pursuit of their enterprise. This quality, I believe, is critical, given the current economic climate and the challenging environment we have here in the North. To prosper and survive in this environment, small business people must be resourceful, they must be visionary and they must live their business 24 hours a day.

Apart from the skills and determination which small business people require, they also need access to capital, information, and marketplaces. There are many agencies and financial institutions where small business people can acquire loans or contributions. Our own Business Development Fund provided some $3.1 million in contributions in 1995/96 alone to some 246 applicants, and the Business Credit Corporation provided $8.0 million in loans.

There are new efforts as well to establish improved ways of accessing capital. I am speaking here about our Government's efforts to work with the Federal Government to establish a New Immigrant Investor Fund which will provide new sources of offshore capital for investment into the Northwest Territories. This Government is acutely aware of the frustrations which small business people face in their efforts to acquire sources of capital and we are making efforts to improve this situation.

The key to business prosperity in the future will be information. As we enter the 21st century, a new age of business enterprise is emerging characterized by global markets, new technologies and a new and heightened competition. To remain competitive, the small business person in the North will require information. This information will be the currency of the future.

Recently I signed an agreement with Industry Canada to establish a new Canada/NWT Business Service Centre. This new centre, which is currently in operation on a trial basis, houses some very advanced computer equipment and will connect the North to a wide range of business oriented databases, both public and private. I invite Members of this Assembly to an open house scheduled for the 17th and 18th of this month to see this centre and to develop an appreciation of its capabilities so that you can better advise your constituents about the services which it has to offer.

The centre I believe, will be a valuable aid to small business people who can call in on a 1-800 line and seek information about products, markets and Government services.

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the work that small business people do across the North. On behalf of the Government, I offer our recognition to this key group of Northerners who continue to contribute so much to our growing economy. I invite you to join me in extending our support on the occasion of this upcoming Small Business Week to this key sector in our economy.

Thank you very much.

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Minister's Statement 116-13(3): Small Business Week

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1170

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Kakfwi . Ministers' Statements. Mr. Dent .

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Minister's Statement 117-13(3): Education, Culture, And Employment's Web Site

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1170

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Good afternoon. Mr. Speaker, a new digital communications network will link all NWT communities to the information highway by March of 1998. In anticipation of this development, the Department of Education, Culture and Employment has produced a new site on the World Wide Web.

The new website will provide one-window access by computer to the Department's programs and services for the public, as well as resources and courses for students in the school system and colleges. For example, the website will provide students with on-line access to the Encyclopedia Britannica. By the first semester of 1997, many secondary students will be able to take courses on-line.

The website will also provide a central location for teachers to share ideas and resources, including support material, course outlines and lesson plans.

Concerns have been raised for many years, Mr. Speaker, that students in remote locations may not be receiving the same standard of education as those in larger communities. The new communications network will ensure that all students have the same access to learning materials.

Mr. Speaker, the Department is working with Divisional Education Councils, the two Yellowknife Divisional Educational Authorities and the public colleges to make sure the web site can support distance learning, extension of high school grades, and provide better opportunities for students of all ages across the Territories.

To keep pace with advancing technology, the Department has committed $1.2 million this year to initiate the Information Networks Development Project. The project includes the design and delivery of programs and courses, setting up a central, computerized source of information, and enhancing the use of local computer networks among community educators.

We intend to assist educators, staff trainers, their clients and learners of all ages, in all communities, to develop and use the technology effectively. The Department is now evaluating proposals from Divisional Education Councils and the Colleges which address these areas.

The web site has been developed for the Department by a new Yellowknife company. The Department has also recently called for proposals from northern companies to produce web pages and computer graphics. None of these companies existed until the information highway came to the North. This shows that the information highway holds a lot of potential for jobs and other economic benefits in the Northwest Territories.

Mr. Speaker, I invite Members of the Assembly, and members of the media, to drop by and try out the website on the computers which Department staff have set up in the Legislative Library. Staff members will be available throughout the afternoon and after the session ends today to show you how the website works.

The Department's new web site will continue to expand as new resources are developed and added. I hope you will explore the site today, and return to it frequently in the coming months.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 117-13(3): Education, Culture, And Employment's Web Site

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1171

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Ministers' Statements. Members' Statements. Mr. Miltenberger .

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1171

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today the honourable Member from Nahendeh will be tabling a Draft Constitution Package on behalf of the Constitutional Working Group. Over the summer, Members of the Western Caucus of the Legislative Assembly have been working with the members of the Aboriginal Summit to prepare this package for consideration by the people of the western Northwest Territories. For the first time, Representatives, public and Aboriginal Governments came together, not to negotiate, but to work as partners towards a common goal.

Although the Constitutional Working Group involved partnerships between two Governments, we also tried to involve those who represented other interests. We kept the Northwest Territories Association, the municipalities and the Status of Women and the Native Women's Association in touch with our work.

We move into the crucial consultation phase, where the Western Caucus has guaranteed a place at the table for these groups through the public Government side.

Mr. Speaker, when people see this package, they will have many questions. Why can we not keep what we have? Why do we need a partnership between public and Aboriginal self-government? Why are there guaranteed seats for Aboriginal Governments? Are Aboriginal people giving up their inherent rights to be part of this proposal? Why do some people get to vote for two representatives?

Mr. Speaker, members of the Western Caucus and the Working Group also had these questions. While we did not agree on everything, most of us agreed with the explanations put forward. We decided to give the package a chance. Hopefully over the next few months people across the Western Territory will also do that. They will raise questions and seek answers. Where they do not like the answers, we hope they will not walk away, but give constructive suggestions for how to make this package better.

The Working Group was operating under very tight time lines and focused energy on producing a concrete package. As a result, there are also questions which the Constitutional Working Group does not have answers for yet. For example, while most members have talked about the concept of "one person, one vote" in a ratification process, there are many ways that could be done. We will have to look at the details of this ratification process.

The members of the Western Caucus support a full consultation process to gather the response of our constituents for this draft package. We do not see the package as a final choice, but rather as a blue print which we can refine together. Learning from the comments and suggestions of the public...Mr. Speaker, I am seeking unanimous consent to conclude my statement?

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1172

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The member for Thebacha seeking unanimous consent to conclude statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays, you have unanimous consent.

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1172

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Learning from the comments and suggestions of the public, we will continue to work in partnership with the members of the aboriginal summit towards a final constitution package which has the support of the residents of the New Western Territory.

It is now time for the people of the Western Territory to give us feedback and direction on the package being tabled today.

Mr. Speaker, there is much to talk about over the coming months. We all have a role to play and a contribution to make. We all want what is best for the Western Territory, for ourselves, our children and our grandchildren. The members of Western Caucus urge all residents of the Western Territory to seize this historic opportunity. In the next eight months, lets continue that partnership which has been developed over the summer. Let us find a solution we can all live with as we shape a truly northern destiny. Thank you Mr. Speaker.

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1172

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you Mr. Miltenberger . Members' statements, Mr. Barnabas .

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1172

Levi Barnabas

High Arctic

(Translator) Thank you Mr. Speaker.

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1172

Levi Barnabas

High Arctic

It is a significant day for all residents of the Northwestern Territories. With the release of the draft constitutional package. On behalf of the members of Nunavut Caucus and of all residents in Nunavut, I would like to congratulate members of the Constitutional Working Group on their successful partnership and tireless efforts which have resulted in the draft constitutional package for consideration by the people of the soon to be new Western Territory.

In Nunavut, we know the importance of all people working together to achieve a common goal. It is through similar partnership that we are working towards our goal of creating Nunavut in 1999. It takes cooperation and compromise from all parties to reach agreement on something as important as constitution.

Mr. Speaker, people in Western Territory have always been supportive in our desire for the creation of Nunavut. Now it is time for the people of Nunavut to show support for their neighbours in the west.

Mr. Speaker, April 1, 1999, is now less than 900 days away and time is of the essence. Residents of the east and the west can not afford to lose any more time. It is critical that both territories get off on the right foot.

Mr. Speaker, the release of the Draft Constitution Package is an important step for people in the west and we at the east wish them great success. People in the Northwest Territories have a history of working together and I am sure that this spirit of cooperation will continue after 1999. Thank you Mr. Speaker.

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1173

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you Mr. Barnabas . Members' statements. Mr. Ootes .

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1173

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you Mr. Speaker. I would like to open my statement by complimenting members of the Constitutional Working Group for the time and effort they have devoted to drafting a Constitution Package. This committee was assigned a daunting task. They were asked to design a form of government that blends Aboriginal institutions with parliamentary democracy. They were given about four months to do it. Given the mandate, I believe their model takes important steps towards achieving the goals of combining public government and self government. Having said that, I also believe this package is going to cause much debate. I know many of my constituents will find the ideas in the document adventurous.

Mr. Speaker, the time to review this draft is restricted. I encourage citizens and groups of citizens to become involved in the dialogue. We need participation and we need consensus. The stakes are too high to allow the politicians sole ownership of the process. In the coming weeks and months, I am going to do everything in my power to ensure the voices from Yellowknife centre are not lost. I want my constituents to be heard and I want to make their opinions count as we finalize the package. Finally, I want to be sure everyone has a chance to vote on the final draft in a plebiscite.

Mr. Speaker, let me close by saying I am heading into this process with an open mind and open ears. I will be taking directions from my constituents. Thank you Mr. Speaker.

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1173

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you Mr. Ootes . Members' statements, Mr. Picco .

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The Need To Live Within Our Fiscal Means

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1173

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to give voice to longer term issues which will impact on all of our children. Everywhere in southern Canada, our major funding source, we are seeing governments and corporations deeply changing to build productivity. Trimming expectations to more realistic levels, carefully ranking all spending items. This territorial administration must now start to live within its means by setting closely measured priorities. Our fiscal adjustments cannot simply reduce spending to lower bottom lines, but also must reorganize for new efficiencies in the way government does things.

Otherwise, other ordinary people will ultimately suffer because serious needs will not go away. People will still get sick, children will still need education.

With reductions in spending in the order of 25% and more, and many critical services in the mainstream, the Territories can no longer pretend that our unique geographic circumstance can protect us from doing our share in assisting Canada to live within its means. In order to do our share, we will have to accurately identify and remove non-performing waste wherever it is found within this administration. The penalty for not doing so in a serious revenue downturn, would be that the most needy in our society - the young, the old, the sick, the poor, women, the unemployed - would be abandoned.

There are too many signs that the unravelling has already begun. Our first step in managing the situation is to study where we are at, at the present time. Detailed accountability through fuller disclosure is the first minimum step that we must take before sensible debate can begin. Why? Because public dollars spent for public purposes is public information. No cost to the current decisional discretion, you say, is $9 too much? I fear not.

Mr. Speaker, consider the fiscal secrecy of this administration effectively limits debate by inhibiting citizens who could offer support of direction and guidance to their MLAs, and further discourages entrepreneurs from proposing cost effective, privately levered, public service alternatives. Just the kind of things we all say we support. With these new directions under way, I am confident that at the end of the day, it will be a territorial people that will increasingly look after their own government. Thank you Mr. Speaker.

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The Need To Live Within Our Fiscal Means

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1174

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you Mr. Picco . Members' statements, Mr. Rabesca .

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1174

Rabesca

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as you are aware, this afternoon we will start a long path to settle the constitution for the Western Territory. After many years of consultation and months of hard work, the Committee has come up with a draft, and I believe this is a starting point. We will now take it to our people for their input. I encourage everyone to review this document, I look forward to visiting my constituency, and to discussing the likes and dislikes they feel towards this important document.

We have come a long way over the past numbers of years since my last term in this Assembly, and I feel that this is another step in our goals to eventually receive provincial status and to provide a government that is, and as stated by the great President, for the people, by the people. Thank you Mr. Speaker.

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1174

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you Mr. Rabesca . Members' statements, members' statements, Mr. Krutko .

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1174

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Today is a unique day for people in the Western Territory, to embark on a voyage into 1999 Division, and also to look at a new, coming together of Aboriginal governments and public governments. We have to take and keep in mind, Mr. Speaker, we are unique in a sense of the territory we live in, the country we live in, and the environment that we are presently under. We have land claim settlements. We have land claims being negotiated, we have self government processes under way, and so we also have a constitutional process.

Keeping in mind that this is going to take us into the next decade, we have to allow the process to take its toll and allow the people a chance to speak. In regards to the process that we are under, we have to work together to bring people closer together than having two institutions of government - a federal government in Ottawa which consists of Indian Affairs, and the Government of the Northwest Territories who deliver programs and services on behalf of that Government.

We in the north have an opportunity to deliver a program for all northerners, I would like to state - all northerners. We have an avenue to allow communities that consist of band councils, Metis locals, hamlet councils, and also in larger centres such as Yellowknife, which consists of the largest Aboriginal community in the Western Territory to work along with the residents on the Aboriginal side, especially in relation to program delivery, and also delivery of healthy communities.

We talk about community empowerment, we talk about allowing the people to live together and to work together in a new way of government. This is that opportunity for the people in the north, especially in the Western Territory, please take advantage of this opportunity. It may only come once in this lifetime. Thank you Mr. Speaker.

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1174

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you Mr. Krutko . Members' statements. Mr. Roland .

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The Need To Achieve Efficiency And Fairness Through Government Restructuring

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1174

Floyd Roland

Inuvik

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Honourable members. I would like to send greetings back home to my wife and children. Mr. Speaker, we heard

the talk today on changing the way this government does business. As we look back on our first year, we started out very eager to make changes. A large majority of us agreed this Government cannot do business as it has in the past. This Government was going to become more efficient and effective as MLAs and departments. So we set out to make a difference, a positive difference, and as these changes have been occurring, we have been able to get feedback from the communities.

Mr. Speaker, some of the feedback is not positive. There are people in our constituencies saying we have no plan. That we are continuing down a path that is not marked out, that our cart is without a horse. Mr. Speaker, as we look at the business plans for '97-'98 we need to look at exactly what is effective and what is efficient. We need to make this more than a budget cutting exercise. We need to ask - has the business plan for '96-'97 achieved effectiveness and efficiency, and we need to be asking in the upcoming business plans - will this achieve effectiveness and efficiency? I know that Mr.

Speaker, I will be asking the Ministers in the committee meetings I attend if the plans they are putting before me are going to achieve effectiveness and efficiency. Thank you.

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1175

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you Mr. Roland . Members' statements, members' statements, Mr. Henry .

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1175

Seamus Henry

Yellowknife South

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today a draft constitution for the new western arctic is being tabled in this House. This document is being prepared by the Constitutional Development Steering Committee, the Western caucus and Aboriginal summit. It is being presented today to the citizens of the Northwest Territories for review, this is not the be all and end all but a starting point where each citizen can provide input into the constitution that will govern our future. Over the next few months, we will be receiving input as to whether or not this draft is what the people want.

I urge all, especially western MLAs of this government to make yourself available to your people, find out what they have to say, bring their input back, so that we can create a constitution that is truly reflective of the people that we govern. That, Mr. Speaker is our challenge, the real challenge goes to the residents of the Northwest Territories who will have to provide us with their comments and concerns. We need to hear from them, we need to hear what they like and don't like in the package, and what we can do to make this a constitution all and for the people of the new Western Territory.

If we fail to create a constitution for the new Western Territory, we will be left with the NWT Act. Mr. Speaker, I think we are ready to go beyond this and can carve out our own future. Let's all work toward making this happen, for the future generation. Thank you Mr. Speaker.

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1175

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Henry . Members Statement, Mr. Kakfwi .

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1175

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you Mr. Speaker. It is an historical occasion, one which I think will mark a time which people will either come closer together or there will be an occasion to mark this as a point when we widen the gap between our peoples' once again. Members will recall in the records of Hansard, there was a debate in the 70s where in spite of the opposition of the Aboriginal people of the Mackenzie Valley against the proposed Mackenzie Valley Pipeline.

Members of the legislature at that time decided that the interests of Canada and the interest of the Northwest Territories was in supporting the Mackenzie Valley Pipeline and was highlighted by the rhetoric of members that represented Yellowknife. Mr. Speaker, I believe that there was major damage done, major damage to relations to Aboriginal and non-Aboriginal people. That was done in 1975 and has taken 20 years to get us back to this stage, and I believe that what we

require now is leadership, not populous, not pure politicians, but leadership, leadership that will challenge people to listen and hear each other. Leadership that will challenge the people to face their own misperceptions of each other. Leaders that will ask their constituents to confront the fears and the biases that they hold, personally, I am prepared to challenge my constituents and my people to rise above their own fears, their own needs, their own misperceptions, and to generally seek to hear other people's concerns and needs and see what could be done. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude.

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1176

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The member for Sahtu is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays, Mr. Kakfwi . You have consent.

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1176

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you. Mr. Speaker, I think recent political history points out very, very clearly that it is the Aboriginal people of the Mackenzie Valley of the north that have taken the lead in seeking change and have actually made commitments to the change. These are reflected in the Inuit struggling and obtaining, struggling for and obtaining a dream of creating their own territory, their own government. Aboriginal people in the Mackenzie Valley, Inuvialuit, the Gwich'in, the Sahtu, the Deh Cho have all stated very clearly and have some in legislation committed to creating new forms of government.

But is still not clear and unheard that is still being demanded with the initiation of this discussion and public dialogue is the clear demonstration of the non-Aboriginal public that they too are prepared, not only in rhetoric but in some substantive form, commit to making changes to the institutions of government to the institutions that we are forced to live with today. Mr.

Speaker in the next few weeks, I believe all Aboriginal leaders will be looking to the people of Yellowknife, Hay River and Norman Wells and other centres where the non-Aboriginal people live to hear some expression that they are prepared to make some substantive changes and to be open to hearing the needs of people and to discuss ways in which those can be met. Thank you very much.

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1176

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Kakfwi . Members' statements, Mr. Antoine .

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1176

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

(Translator) Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I seldom talk in my own language, so I would like to take advantage of it today and talk in my own language. What I will be talking about today is the constitutional package that was tabled today. The Dene, the Aboriginal people, when we are talking about the Aboriginal self government, that they actually want to govern themselves and the reason they wish to govern themselves is because they believe this part of the country is their land.

When we are sitting today at the Legislative Assembly, the Legislative Assembly has been in the Northwest Territories for quite a few years. There are a lot of issues from the NWT that concern the North and concern the people from the communities that are seldom brought up today.

There are a lot of issues concerning all the communities in the North. There is one that we have really worked on, it is a paper on how we can work together, it is called the Draft Constitution Package, we have worked on this paper quite extensively and the Ministers and the ordinary members have sat together to work on this paper. We have worked on it pretty well all summer and after all the meetings that we went through regarding this, we finally tabled this constitutional development paper today. Why we tabled it today is because we want to hear the input from the communities.

We would like to hear from them, what they think of what this constitutional paper, and if there is anything that they like or dislike about this constitutional paper, we would like to hear from them, and after all the consultations have been done... My time has run out. I would like to seek unanimous consent to continue what I am saying.

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1177

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You have unanimous consent Mr. Antoine .

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1177

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

(Translator) Thank you Mr. Speaker. What I am saying is the item we are working on is very important, so we should all read it and get to know it really well, and then we can continue working on it. Some of the people have not read it and yet, they are talking in such a way it sounds like they dislike it, but I don't feel that it is right. What we should do is, we should leave it, get to know it and discuss it and then maybe we can come up with something better.

This is what I am saying today, and since at the time I would like to express that and in the future we can keep working on it, and the people who would like to have some input into it, they are welcome to voice their opinions. In the future if everybody is in agreement maybe we can eventually ratify it and I also think eventually it will be finished with and we are not the only ones who should be having input into it.

In Ottawa, the Federal Government, the Minister of Aboriginal Indian Affairs and Northern Development, he also has to get to know it and if he agrees with the document and then they will be coming up with a legislation and through the NWT Act it will come about. I am thankful that I am able to talk to you about this today, and in the future we will be continuing to talk about it, so this is what I want to say today. Thank you.

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1177

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Antoine . I have some difficulty, did you make your statement as a Minister or as a Member. Just to remind the Ministers that they may make statements as Ministers regarding item that are under their responsibilities and that Members' statement is for other than what they wish to speak to, that is not their responsibility. Just to remind the member of that. Members' statements, Mr. Erasmus .

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1177

Roy Erasmus

Yellowknife North

Thank you Mr. Speaker. My statement today is on the Draft Constitution Package that is being presented to the public for review and comment. Mr. Speaker, during my campaign last year, I went through the Yellowknife North riding. I heard many times that people were afraid that Yellowknife was going to become an isolated state, isolated from the rest of the west. Many of these people are long term northerners, others were not, but all of them recognized that Aboriginal people have the inherent right to govern themselves, this is a right of all people, it is an international law.

These people were afraid that regional self-government negotiations would result in strong regional governments. Maybe, it would even split the west into several territories. These people are afraid the system described in the Bourque report could result in Yellowknife being isolated from the communities. They were talking about the "we", "they", "us", "them" syndrome. This summer and into late last night, I worked on this Constitution Package.

I worked to bring Aboriginal self-government and public government together into a central government in hopes that it would not result in an isolated Yellowknife, and Yellowknife being a state unto itself. Mr Speaker, this is not a perfect document, but it is the starting point that people said they wanted.

People said that never before had this Assembly prepared a draft constitution for them to discuss. We have done that. There is a draft constitution for people to review. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1177

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Member for Yellowknife North is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. You have unanimous consent, Mr. Erasmus .

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1177

Roy Erasmus

Yellowknife North

Thank you Mr. Speaker. In reviewing this draft package, I urge people to have open minds, to read the document, before you close your minds to new ideas. See the checks and balances before you criticize. Remember that

It is a starting point. It is time for the public to review the package, to evaluate the ideas in there, and to comment. It will then be our jobs to revise what is in there, and to bring something back to the people to vote upon. Thank you.

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1178

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' Statements. Mr. Morin .

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1178

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I, too, would like to rise as a Member for Tu Nedhe today. It has been exactly one year today, I believe, that all of us ran for an election in 1995. We have been here for a year, elected for a year; I think it took three weeks to a month to be sworn into office, so we have not quite been at our duties for a full year. I look back over that year and see the accomplishments of Members of this Assembly on behalf of the people who elected them. Today is an important day. The Working Group of Constitutional Development will later on today table "Partners in a New Beginning", a Draft Constitution Package.

That document has been a long time in coming. People of the North have said they have heard enough talk, they want action. They do have that. Now it is up to the people of the North to be positive and move ahead and look at these things with open minds.

Mr. Speaker, I remember when I had the privilege of being elected to this Assembly, some nine years ago. I came here with a fairly narrow perspective on life in general, because I was living in Fort Resolution, and knew only the riding of Tu Nedhe. I did not really know what was happening in the other parts of the North, especially the eastern arctic. Since that time, I have had the privilege to grow and meet people throughout the Northwest Territories, and people up and down the valley.

I have a general feeling that people in the Northwest Territories want to work together to keep the Western Territory together and move it ahead into the next century, as a one Government system, where it recognizes that Aboriginal people do have a right to self-government. It also recognizes reality, that we as Northerners have to work together. That is the way it has always happened in the past, regardless of whether you talk about the fur trade, or you sit and you listen to what elders say. All the time in the past, people worked together. That is how they survived.

Well, I think today, that we have to work together; all people in the Northwest Territories--in order to survive.

Mr. Speaker, in my office I have this saying on my wall, that the press will always come up with the negatives, so think positive and try to get across the positive message. And once again, the press have not let us down, and they have come out on the negative. But that should not be new to any of our Members here, as long as the public realizes that you cannot believe everything that is being said in the newspapers.

This is a good day for Northerners, and it is a good day for all Northerners. We must move ahead. We do not need the rhetoric of some politicians already coming out, elected leaders in the North, speaking against this Constitution, calling it apartheid, calling it a South African-type document. This is good for the North. We have to work together. We will work together. We will overcome the negativeness and we will work positively and we will have the Constitution made in the North by Northerners by April 1, 1999.

Thank you.

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Draft Constitution Package For The New Western Territory

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Morin . Members' Statements. Are there any further Members' Statements?

Mr. Morin , (Translator) What Mr. Morin has said, I really agree with. It has almost been a year since we have been elected to sit in the House. There is a Constitutional paper that was brought out today. I would like to say something about this paper, but it is kind of difficult for me. The people from the western arctic, the Aboriginals, the non-Aboriginals, they are kind of reluctant when they think about this Constitutional paper. I would like to inform them that this Constitution is on behalf of all of us. Thank you.

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Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Returns to Oral Questions. Mr. Ng .

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Return To Question 433-13(3): Status Of Trailcross Facility Privatization

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1179

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I return to Oral Question asked by Mr. Miltenberger on October 8, 1996, in respect to the status of Trailcross facility privatization.

Trailcross will be in operation on November 1, 1996. To date no former employees have been hired, although one resident of Fort Smith has been hired in a clerical position. No other job offers have yet been made, since the contractor is still in the process of reviewing applications and interviewing selected candidates.

To date, two former employees have been interviewed. The contractor, Integrated Human Resource, is committed to hiring in the North, and has only been reviewing applications from the North. Most of the applications have been from Fort Smith. Interviews were conducted in Fort Smith during the week of October 1, and will again be conducted in Fort Smith this week.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 433-13(3): Status Of Trailcross Facility Privatization

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Recognition of visitors in the Gallery. Mr. Krutko .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1179

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

I would like to recognize Pat Thomas, Teacher's Federation, also the union...

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Recognition of visitors in the Gallery. I would like to recognize my sister in the Gallery. Sarah is the eighth eldest or the fifth youngest, you could choose, Sarah.

Recognition of visitors in the Gallery.

Oral questions. Mr. Krutko .

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Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1179

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Right Honourable John Todd . It is in relation to housing for teachers. There was a statement on the radio this morning about a problem in Fort McPherson with staff housing. I had a discussion with the Minister on this, and I thought it was resolved. Could the Minister brief me on exactly where it is at?

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Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Again, to remind the Members that a Minister cannot confirm or deny any media reports, whether it is radio or newspapers. Perhaps the Member would like to rephrase his question.

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Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1179

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Mr. John Todd . It is in regards to the housing problem that is in my riding, especially Fort McPherson. Could you give me an update on exactly what has been done up to date?

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Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board , Mr. Todd .

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Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1179

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

McPherson

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Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1180

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Yes, thank you, Mr. Speaker. I believe my Honourable colleague is alluding to the CBC interview this morning by some teachers in Fort McPherson, who for one reason or another, which is incomprehensible to me, seemed to be unable to find the $73,000 to buy a six-plex. When I was advised of it this morning, I thought it meant per unit, until I was told it was for all six. So it is approximately $12,000 a unit.

We have asked them if they would like to make an offer on it, and the implication, I believe, in the CBC thing, is that we were treating them insensitively and uncaring and unkind. I frankly, Mr. Speaker, do not understand the issue. They have the option to purchase a six-plex, which is all occupied. The face value of that unit, and to make it public, is $73,000. It is inconceivable to me that these people are not prepared to purchase this unit.

If they are not prepared to purchase it, we will, as I have said, on a number of occasions, provide that opportunity to the people of Fort McPherson, whether it is the Gwich'in people or others in his constituency, to purchase that unit, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

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Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral question. Supplementary. Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1180

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Supplementary, Mr. Speaker. Could you give me the time frames on when you expect to start looking at taking offers from the other organizations or other interested parties in the community who may be looking for housing in my riding?

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Supplementary To Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1180

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Mr. Speaker, I said last week in the House that we were going to provide our employees with an additional sixty days, to the end of November, I have to get this right, to make an offer on the units.

After the end of November, we will then work out a formula for providing a means in which the communities can purchase units. We have to find some way in, we are working on that, to secure housing for the teachers, and to ensure that those who purchase them will provide that housing at an affordable rent. I think on this issue, particularly, I mean, it is an issue because it is on CBC and they are implying that we are being insensitive. And this issue is straight math, Mr. Speaker. The rents more than surpass any mortgage payments they may wish to purchase and the appraised value of the units is a reflection of the condition of it.

I would hope that this particular unit and these particular employees, who happen to be teachers, would have sober second thought, see that this is an opportunity, not a problem, purchase the unit and get on with doing what they do best - teaching our children and balancing the budget. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Question 496-13(3): Teacher's Staff Housing In Fort Mcpherson

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, oral question, supplementary, Mr. Krutko . No? Oral questions, Mr. O'Brien .

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Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1180

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, last year the GNWT was forced to cut about $100 million from the territorial budget in order to meet the targets of the Deficit Elimination Act. This year, once again, we are looking at reducing the same amount, if not more, to meet these targets. My question is to the Minister of Finance . What are the legal consequences if the deficit elimination targets are not met?

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Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1180

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

I would like to ask the member if he might be able to rephrase his question. You are asking a Minister a legal opinion or a legal result if the Deficit Elimination Act

is not met. Would you like to rephrase your question, Mr. O'Brien ?

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Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Yes, thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will try to be a little gentler. What are the consequences if these targets are not met?

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Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Minister of Finance .

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Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, good question. Legislation was brought in, as we know, by the previous legislature, by some members in this House. That legislation puts us in the position where we have to balance the budget, I am not trying to avoid the question here, Mr. Speaker, I am trying to answer it in the proper way. Although I see some of my colleagues giggling.

We have to balance the budget by 1997/98 and if we want to balance the budget then we, collectively, would have to decide what we are going to do because we would not meet the legislation that was set for this House. Thank you.

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Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, oral questions, Mr. O'Brien .

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Supplementary To Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Yes, Mr. Speaker, thank you. Mr. Speaker, I will rephrase my question again and ask, what are the actual consequences?

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Supplementary To Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Again, to remind the members that the question itself is hypothetical because, every time you use a term "if" then you are asking the Minister to guess the result of a situation that has not happened yet, and so, as a member would you like to rephrase your question and say what might happen, maybe, no? No. As a member if you might be able to rephrase this question. Mr. O'Brien .

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Supplementary To Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Maybe I can rephrase my question to say what will happen if the targets are not met?

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Supplementary To Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Again, every time the member uses the phrase "what if" or "if" then it is hypothetical because you are asking the Minister to guess. I ask the member to rephrase his question again. Mr. O'Brien .

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Supplementary To Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Mr. Speaker, since the Minister is having such a difficult time in answering my question, I will withdraw the question. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Question 497-13(3): Consequences Of Not Meeting Reduction Targets

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Again, the member has made reference to the Minister having a difficult time responding to a question, but the Minister cannot answer the question, because you are asking the Minister to guess.

Oral question, Mr. Roland .

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Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

Floyd Roland

Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As you heard in my members' statement, concern for effectiveness and efficiency, my question will be directed to the Minister responsible for FMBS. Has this government in it's plans addressed effectiveness and efficiency in the business plans?

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Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board , Mr. Todd .

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Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1181

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I know that my honourable colleague has expressed concern about the business plans and the fairness and equity of them on a number of occasions in this House and, if I may say, for the public record, a legitimate concern. I believe we are trying to address fairness and equity

as well as effectiveness and efficiency and I hope that we demonstrated that in the last twelve months, however, difficult it has been, I wanted to remind everybody that we had a plan in place to balance the budget and I agree with my honourable colleague's statement the other day, that we need to get beyond balancing the budget and get on to the more productive aspects of governing.

I believe that the balanced budget deficit elimination strategy is on target. That we will meet the requirements of the Deficit Elimination Act and, at the same time, be able to move forward in looking at productive ways in which to service the people we represent. So, in short, Mr. Speaker, I hope that the new business plans for 97/98 will be able to demonstrate to my colleague that there is an effective and fairness to it and I am confident that if it is not, that my colleague, as well as others, will be able to draw that to our attention and any changes and recommendations they wish to make in this consensus committee style government that we are currently working with. Thank you.

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Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral question supplementary, Mr. Roland .

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Supplementary To Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1182

Floyd Roland

Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I agree that the fairness issue needs to be dealt with and I believe that we have got that message across, thank you very much. On the efficiency of government, we have in some cases, as it is seen from the outside, been dealing with strictly numbers, the human factor seems to have been taken out. So, my question is, in our effectiveness and trying to achieve efficiency, have we reduced the way the work is done within government? We have reduced the layers, to some degree, of people, but have we reduced the way the work gets done? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1182

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1182

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Well, I would hope so, Mr. Speaker. I guess that would be one way to respond to it. I believe that we have taken a very direct approach in empowering management at the community, regional and headquarters level, that we have pushed out both the fiscal responsibility as well as the managerial responsibility in a genuine effort to improve the efficiency and the delivery of programs and services, and after all, that is what we are here for, to deliver to those in the communities and in large centres like Iqaluit, like Yellowknife, like Fort Smith and Hay River.

I believe in the short twelve months that we have been here that we have accomplished a great deal in being able to do that, I would hope, again, that the business plans that the committees will be looking at shortly next week, will reflect that and, it is certainly not our intent, when we looked at our strategy to run government more efficiently, not to look at it in a caring and sensitive way.

I want to remind members that, nobody is immune from these cuts, nobody. Including the Finance Minister , who I have said on a number of occasions, my own family have lost jobs in this cutting process, and still do not have one. So, I think it is important for everybody to understand that I am very sensitive to the fact that we are laying off people, contrary to what some may think in this House or upstairs, I am very sensitive about the fact that we are laying people off. We have to find a way and a means in which to do it in a compassionate and caring way. But, at the end of the day, we must balance the budget. I have to come back to that, whether my honourable colleague likes it or not.

But I think we have to move on once we go through these business plans, on to new opportunities for our people and the people we represent and I believe, Mr. Kakfwi and other are proceeding with that in terms of some of the strategic plans that are in place in relationship to the mineral accord, in relationship to other aspects, Mr. Dent in relationship to job opportunities, etcetera. The changes that Mr.

Ng is making in Health and Social Services and Corrections, these are all positive things as we move forward, and I hope that when my colleague reviews the business plans that will be reflected in them, and he will be assured that we are doing this in a manner, where, we have a plan, we know where we are going, and I certainly know where we want to end up. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1183

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral question. Supplementary, Mr. Roland .

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Supplementary To Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1183

Floyd Roland

Inuvik

Thank you Mr. Speaker. I would like to thank the Minister on expounding on a lot more information than I thought I would get. But my question goes back to the way we deliver. We have heard about it, and people in my community agree, I have talked to people about the way things are done, and they agree that things need to be done and they will be tough. There are others that do not agree with that. What I am getting to is what we have left as a work force, are still required to do the same amount of paperwork that they had before, with less personnel.

So are we reducing the amount of forms that have to be filled out, when a person comes into one's office, then gets delivered a program. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1183

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1183

John Todd

Keewatin Central

My apologies, Mr. Speaker. Now I understand where my colleague is coming from. Operationally, how we are making the government more efficient, reducing the paper flow, etcetera, I think the simple and short answer is, yes. I think we have made some major strides. For example, I remember the days when I was in government, an LPA, I think that is what is was, was $250. It is now under the Department of Public Works, $5,000, that allows the management team to quickly make decisions to expend where it is required in services. Other changes have been made in the FMBS, as the decision making to reducing the paper.

The loan applications are down to one, two pages at the most. There are a whole series of...I could go on all day, but I am sure my colleague would prefer I did not. He has heard it before. There is a whole series of initiatives and changes that we are taking. No, we are not going to be perfect. There is no question of that. There are going to be weaknesses and gaps. There are going to be dissidents. There are going to people who are discontent with what we are doing. But we have to believe at the end of the day, that what we are doing is right.

We have to believe at the end of the day, that we are trying to make government more efficient, smaller. Six thousand territorial employees for 67,000 people. Nowhere else in the free world does that exist, Mr. Speaker. We must find a way to reduce the size of the civil service, to ensure that there is adequate money left to deliver to those people that need it the most.

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Further Return To Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Question 498-13(3): Effectiveness And Efficiency In GNWT Programs

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1183

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mr. Erasmus .

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Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1183

Roy Erasmus

Yellowknife North

Thank you Mr. Speaker. My question is for the Minister Responsible for Health and Social Services . It is in relation to his statement today about our most precious resource, children. And the fact that recently children are being taken into care because they need to be protected from harm. Mr. Speaker, when I was going to school in Saskatchewan, just about every week, there were stories in the papers about the fact that the Aboriginal children were being put back into the Aboriginal community.

Whereas, they had not been before. So they were actually taking Aboriginal children from non-Aboriginal homes, and putting them back with their Aboriginal people. I would like to

know what is this government's policy, in placing Aboriginal children with Aboriginal foster parents?

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Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Ng .

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Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my understanding is that the first priority would be to place an Aboriginal child with an Aboriginal family, if that was available to the individual. Failing that, of course we would try to make sure that they get placed as a priority into a safe home, regardless of where the Aboriginal background of that foster parent family would be, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

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Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Erasmus .

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Supplementary To Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

Roy Erasmus

Yellowknife North

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Has there been a drive to recruit Aboriginal foster parents in Yellowknife, and other large centres?

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Supplementary To Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Ng .

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Further Return To Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there is and continues to be a recruiting process in trying to expand the number of Foster Parents available for all communities because of the fact that you always to have more available than you need, hopefully, so that you run a situation where you are in dire straits of not having an available Foster parent/family to place a child that might be at risk, Mr. Speaker, Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions, supplementary, Mr. Erasmus .

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Supplementary To Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

Roy Erasmus

Yellowknife North

Thank you. Mr. Speaker I have six or seven brothers and sisters who have families, and in speaking to them, and in speaking to them none of them have been approached about being foster parents. What I would like to know is how many foster children in Yellowknife are in Aboriginal and how many are in non-Aboriginal homes?

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Supplementary To Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you Mr. Minister.

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Further Return To Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

Kelvin Ng

Kitikmeot

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, obviously I would not have that detail of information with me so I will take that question as notice and provide the information to the Member. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Question 499-13(3): GNWT Policy On Placement Of Aboriginal Children

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, the question is taken as notice. Oral question, Mr. Picco .

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Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker my question is for the Minister for the Department of Public Works. Mr. Speaker, can the Minister confirm that this Government is going to raise the price of home heating and other fuels? Thank you Mr. Speaker.

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Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for Public Works , Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Return To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1184

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Mr. Speaker. I cannot confirm right now whether or not fuel prices will go up. What I can say is that the fuel that is provided by the government through our POL division, is priced through a floating formula where it does follow world market prices, and it is a fact that world market prices for fuel has gone up. At some point in time government will have to decide

whether or not to raise fuel prices.

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Return To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions supplementary, Mr. Picco .

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Supplementary To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this is a very serious matter, because it reflects on the cost of living for several of our smaller communities, the GNWT usually enters into long-term agreements to purchase fuel, so for example, most of the fuel in the smaller communities off-road would have been purchased in March or April and then delivered in September. So, they have already purchased that fuel, it is already in place. Maybe the Minister would explain, why would those fuel prices in off-road communities increase when it has been already purchased and paid for? Mr Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Further Return To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Mr. Speaker, I would say again that there have been no decisions to increase fuel prices and again I would say the price formula that our Petroleum Products Division uses is a floating formula which as I said, if the world oil prices increases, then the price of fuel has to increase also. So there has been no decision to increase fuel prices, if there was one it would affect all communities that we service.

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Further Return To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, oral questions supplementary, Mr. Picco .

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Supplementary To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Minister said that it would affect all communities that we service and therefore my question would be, to give us an idea or an indication of how it worked in the past. When was the last general price increase for the cost of fuel for the consumer in the Northwest Territories under the POL arrangement?

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Supplementary To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Further Return To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Mr. Speaker, I do not know the exact date of when it was, but I am informed by the Department that it has been since 1992 that we have raised fuel prices, and that is for the 45 or so communities that the POL services, and does not include the communities such as Yellowknife which is serviced by the private sector.

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Further Return To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions, final supplementary, Mr. Picco .

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Supplementary To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker the 45 communities that the Minister speaks about, in most cases, those 45 communities already have their fuel purchased and paid for, delivered and in the community. My question would be, then, after we have increased those prices, the revenue, the net revenue gained, the net profit from said saving of said fuel, where will that money go, will it go into helping Mr. Todd and the rest of the Government and us fight the deficit? Is it going to the consolidated revenue fund? Where will this revenue go? Will we kick it back, as a subsidy to our "in-need" people? Where will this money go? The extra revenue?

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Supplementary To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Further Return To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1185

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Mr. Speaker, the petroleum products revolving fund is revenue neutral. That is, it operates on a break even basis. At this point of time, it is in a deficit situation and the deficit this year will be over $1 million. If I can recall correctly the cumulative debt is over $3 million, so we do need to take care of that problem. If we raise fuel prices, I would say, is a possibility which FMB will have to think about seriously, the money would go toward the cost of fuel.

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Further Return To Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Question 500-13(3): Raising The Price Of Heating Fuel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral question, Mr. Barnabas .

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Question 501-13(3): Emergency Aid To Grise Fiord

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Levi Barnabas

High Arctic

Thank you Mr. Speaker. I would like to direct my question to the Government Leader , because the Minister of Transportation is not here, I will direct my question to the Government Leader , regarding Grise Fiord. Will our government be subsidizing the Co-op, because they will be sending food and material over by plane instead of ship? Thank you.

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Question 501-13(3): Emergency Aid To Grise Fiord

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for Public Works and Services . The Premier .

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Return To Question 501-13(3): Emergency Aid To Grise Fiord

Question 501-13(3): Emergency Aid To Grise Fiord

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you Mr. Speaker. I talked to my Ministers responsible for Transportation, Public Works and Services, as well as the Minister responsible for Municipal and Community affairs and they will be meeting fairly shortly to discuss this issue. They will be pleased also to talk to the MLA for Grise Fiord on this whole issue. We should be able to have some answers very shortly on whether or not there is any type of subsidy available. The last I have seen on this issue, Mr.

Speaker, was that the barge or ship did not make it into Grise Fiord and we will have to consider what is essential to allow that community to get through the winter. Those Ministers will be meeting fairly shortly to discuss that whole issue. Thank you.

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Return To Question 501-13(3): Emergency Aid To Grise Fiord

Question 501-13(3): Emergency Aid To Grise Fiord

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, just to remind the Members again that if a Minister or Member is not in the House, that they don't refer to him not being in the House. Oral question, you have supplementary, Mr. Barnabas . Mr. Barnabas , no. Oral questions, Mr. Roland

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Question 502-13(3): Residency Requirements For Social Housing

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Floyd Roland

Inuvik

Thank you Mr. Speaker. My question would be directed to the Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation . I would like to know from the Minister if there is any residency requirement to get into the housing, the local housing units. Thank you.

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Question 502-13(3): Residency Requirements For Social Housing

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Arlooktoo .

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Return To Question 502-13(3): Residency Requirements For Social Housing

Question 502-13(3): Residency Requirements For Social Housing

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Goo Arlooktoo

Baffin South

Mr. Speaker, there are residency requirements for people that want to get into social housing, I cannot recall right now what they are, but in some communities housing associations require any where from six months to a year depending on what the housing association has decided.

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Return To Question 502-13(3): Residency Requirements For Social Housing

Question 502-13(3): Residency Requirements For Social Housing

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions supplementary, Mr. Roland .

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