Debates of Feb. 22nd, 2024

This is page numbers 169 - 206 of the Hansard for the 20th Assembly, 1st Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was public .

Topics

Oral Questions

Members Present

Prayer

Reaching Average $10 a day Child Care in the NWT

Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires

Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons

Recorded Vote

Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Council of Leaders

Recorded Vote

Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Reduce Board to Three Persons

Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Draft Inquiry Establishment Order

Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure

Recorded Vote

Appointment of Deputy Chairpersons of Committee of the Whole

Government of the Northwest Territories Response to Tabled Document 27-20(1)

Recorded Vote

Appointment of Members to the Northwest Territories Honours Advisory Council

Appointment of Equal Pay Commissioner

Support for Ukraine

18th Anniversary of the Great Bear River Bridge Application

Importance of Indigenous Governments

Impacts of 2023 Wildfires on Dehcho Communities

Access to Dental Services

Cost of Rheumatoid Arthritis Services

2023 Enterprise Wildfire Management

2024 Wildfire Season Preparations and Resourcing

Rheumatoid Arthritis Services

Access to Family Doctors

Access to Dental Services in the Beaufort-Delta Region

Supports for Electric Vehicles

Tabled Document 33-20(1): Follow-up Letter for Oral Question 3-20(1): Implementation of the Recommendations of Strengthening Support for Non-Profit Sector

Tabled Document 34-20(1): Public Government for the People of the North

Tabled Document 35-20(1): We Have Always Been Here - The Significance of Dene Knowledge

Tabled Document 36-20(1): Correspondence from Gerald Antoine, Dene National Chief, to Commissioner Margaret Thom dated February 13, 2024

Bill 1:

An Act to Amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Hon. Caitlin Cleveland , Mr. Edjericon , Mr. Hawkins , Hon. Lucy Kuptana , Hon. Jay MacDonald , Hon. Vince McKay , Mr. McNeely , Ms. Morgan , Mr. Morse , Mr. Nerysoo , Ms. Reid , Hon. Lesa Semmler , Hon. R.J. Simpson , Mr. Testart , Mr. Thompson , Mrs. Weyallon Armstrong , Mrs. Yakeleya

The House met at 1:30 p.m.

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---Prayer

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Prayer

Prayer

Page 169

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

I'd like to thank Mary Jane Cazon for the opening blessing here.

Members, before we begin, I would like to welcome the Honourable Jenna Sudds Minister of Family, Children, and Social Development to the Legislative Assembly. I would also like to welcome back to the Assembly our MP Michael McLeod, a Member of the 14th, 15th, and 16th Assembly as well as a former Minister in two Assemblies. And he was my Minister and my boss, so. As well, my former colleague in the 18th and 19th Assembly, Mr. Kevin O'Reilly was my -- sat beside each other for four years, and he asked a whole bunch of questions in the 19th. So all, welcome to the Assembly.

On a serious note, colleagues, yesterday something happened that I was not happy with. I had to read at 8 o'clock last night that somebody had a birthday and didn't tell us about it and didn't allow us to recognize them in this House. You know, I'm very disappointed that this had to happen so therefore I am going to do a belated Happy Birthday to our clerk Mr. Glen Rutland. Happy Birthday. Thank you.

Ministers' statements. Minister for Education, Culture and Employment .

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Minister's Statement 17-20(1): Reaching Average $10 a day Child Care in the NWT

Ministers' Statements

Page 169

Caitlin Cleveland

Kam Lake

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. The Government of the Northwest Territories made a mandate commitment in 2019 to advance universal child care by increasing availability and affordability. It is my great privilege today to announce that starting April 1st, licensed child care in the Northwest Territories will cost an average of $10 a day. This change will mean families can focus on caring for their children without the financial pressures of high child care costs. For example, a family with an infant and a preschooler in licensed care will save approximately $18,000 per year.

That money can now put meals on the table, winter clothing on children, and help families with the costs of everyday life while providing access to quality care.

This milestone, reached two years ahead of schedule, is calculated by combining free programs and those that charge fees. It means that while some families may pay more than $10 a day, others may pay less than $10 a day. But on average though, licensed child care fees across our territory will be $10 a day.

We are currently engaging with the sector on what comes next: A wage grid, a certification model, and new funding approaches to support licensed operators. A wage grid will establish a minimum hourly pay rate for these positions so that no one earns below that threshold. It also means that years of experience and education will be recognized.

Mr. Speaker, the last few years have included a lot of change and engagement, and we are not done yet. The GNWT will continue to engage with Indigenous governments and community partners, including the NWT Early Childhood Association. I am pleased to share that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment and the association recently formalized this relationship through the co-development of a terms of reference to support understanding of work going forward to achieve shared objectives.

Mr. Speaker, in reaching an average $10-a-day child care in the Northwest Territories, we have reached one of our goals, and I look forward to the work ahead to accomplish those that remain. I want to thank early childhood educators from across the territory who continue to support this critical sector and provide us with their feedback to improve it. I am committed to continuing this work and I am thankful that so many other Northerners are as well. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 17-20(1): Reaching Average $10 a day Child Care in the NWT

Ministers' Statements

Page 169

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Minister of Education, Culture and Employment . Members' statements. Member from Yellowknife Centre .

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Minister's Statement 17-20(1): Reaching Average $10 a day Child Care in the NWT

Ministers' Statements

Page 169

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I MOVE, seconded by the honourable Member for Kam Lake , that the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , the Minister's statement called Reaching Average $10- a-day Child Care in the NWT be referred to Committee of the Whole for further consideration. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 17-20(1): Reaching Average $10 a day Child Care in the NWT

Ministers' Statements

Page 169

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

The Minister's statement will be moved into the Committee of the Whole.

---Carried

Ministers' statements. Member from Range Lake .

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Minister's Statement 17-20(1): Reaching Average $10 a day Child Care in the NWT

Ministers' Statements

Page 169

Kieron Testart

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to move to item 16 on the orders of the day. Thank you.

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Minister's Statement 17-20(1): Reaching Average $10 a day Child Care in the NWT

Ministers' Statements

Page 169

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Member from Range Lake is seeking unanimous consent to move item 16 to this order of the day. Any nays? No nays. Member, we'll move to

section -- movement 16.

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Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires, Carried

Motions

Page 169

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Members, we are now resuming debate on Motion 9-20(1), Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Fires.

On February 9th, 2024, Member from Range Lake moved Motion 9-20(1). The Honourable Premier moved the debate on the motion be postponed to February 22nd, 2024. The question is whether or not the Legislative Assembly resolved that the Commissioner cause an inquiry to be made into the 2023 wildfire. The motion is in order. To the motion. Member from Range Lake .

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Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires, Carried

Motions

Page 169

Kieron Testart

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I want to take a moment to speak to how we got here today as we prepare to consider this motion.

We are here today for talking about a public inquiry because we need to restore the public's trust. We know all too well that political engagement in the Northwest Territories can be fleeting, but the idea of a public inquiry has inspired many who hope to participate and share their experiences. We need to meet this moment. We need to send a message to the public that we take them seriously and we're ready to engage with them.

I have heard the argument that this public inquiry will result in too much blame and criticism without offering much insight to the government, to the public, or to this Assembly. To that, I say this perspective is a gross underestimation of the contribution the public has to offer and the independence a public inquiry can offer.

The people of the Northwest Territories lived through the crisis. Many worked to support their family, friends, and neighbours to get through it. Their knowledge is crucial if we want to move forward and prepare for the future, and their trust is key if we want to work together through the next crisis. The public's trust that natural disasters be managed by their government has been shaken by this event as has the trust of national partners, community organizations and, in particular, Indigenous governments.

The fact that thousands of people were left on their own accord as the fires approached shows that much trust wasn't there to begin with. Shortly thereafter, the Yellowknife Airport here for our evacuation began to overflow, and the GNWT still told people to remain in place right up until the moment they told everyone to leave.

Then, of course, there is the financial costs to individuals and communities. I spoke with many constituents during the last election who were out thousands of dollars. Many of those are still waiting for their government relief money to come in with numerous files for the Minister of Finance right now that we're working on fulfilling. These people are paying interest on high credit card bills at a time when our cost of living is very high and our costs continue to rise.

It will take years to recover, and at a time when our citizens are already trying to get over the effects of a multi-year global pandemic and the inflationary pressures that it's left in its wake. Communities that did not evacuate incurred costs as well that have not been compensated for. Any community that had to take in evacuees and prepare for fires of their own should not have to bear these costs alone.

The impact of last year's wildfire season remains inescapable. The event still hangs over communities. I am hopeful that as communities we can continue to work together to support each other, but the work of friends and neighbours can only go so far. Here in this House, we have a lot of work to do to restore public trust, Mr. Speaker, and prepare for the future. So I can say now is the time to get that work done and pass this public inquiry.

Mr. Speaker, I do want to speak to what is -- I've spoken why we need an inquiry, to restore trust in the public and to take stock of a very significant event, the largest Canadian airlift in -- or the largest airlift in our country's history, two-thirds of the population displaced as climate refugees, community burnt nearly to the ground. If this isn't grounds for a public inquiry, I don't know what is.

And, Mr. Speaker, why, though, a public inquiry? What is a public inquiry? And, fundamentally, it is an independent transparent and accountable process. We looked for legislative tools to get us the best result for the public who are concerned and that would get results and the best recommendations, and the one we found was in the Public Inquiries Act. And we still feel very strongly, those who are in support of this motion, that this is the right way to go.

With no disrespect to the very hardworking public servants who are managing after-action reviews and did a very tough job in very difficult circumstances, a fully independent arm's length process cannot be in the government's hands. It can't even have the government's fingerprints on it. There is trust concerns in the Northwest Territories. There are people who feel they cannot speak to their MLAs sometimes without full anonymity.

And if we can't hear from our constituents, if they don't feel protected to send us an e-mail, what is the likelihood that they're going to feel comfortable sending in comments or stories or experiences to a report that is commissioned through the Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs ? I think it's unlikely we're going to get to the same level of engagement and the same level of outcomes.

Furthermore, the work of a contractor is going to take place behind closed doors. That's just how it works. They'll have public engagement sessions. We know the government is proposing quite an ambitious

schedule of public engagement sessions, but the work is not going to be transparent. A work of a commission would be.

Furthermore, the work of a commission could be undertaken by Northerners who understand the North, who understand the communities, and know the unique sensitives and realities of working and living in the North and were also affected by this event. And that's a perspective that will not be shared by a hired firm from presumably the southern part of the country.

Mr. Speaker, and that's why we're proposing this approach. And this approach is not going to be something, with all due respect to my honourable friend the Premier , something that will cost tens of millions of dollars and something that will require hundreds of thousands of witnesses and grind government to a halt. We can confine the scope, the costs, and the timelines of a public inquiry through a very well-constructed inquiry establishment order.

And that is what this motion calls to do, a collaborative process between the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight and the Cabinet in building something that both sides are comfortable with and that keeps -- that prevents this from spiraling out of control. Because it's true, an independent commission has a lot of power to be independent, but we can make the right calls. We can make the right calls on how it's shaped. We can modify the process for accepting testimony that protects witnesses and allows for private testimony to be given, just like we've seen in other commissions.

We can, again, set a very clear budget, a reasonable budget, that can ensure the maximum amount of public engagement and expertise that the board of inquiry would need to complete this work, and we can make sure that they report back at a specific time. This is not something that just you launch like a ship, and it sails off to a new continent. This is something that we can constrain.

And furthermore, we can make it consider after-action reports or any other reports that the government's working on right now. We can make it consider debriefings the departments have had internally. The inquiry can take into account all of these things and other things that we think are relevant. And that's important as well because we're not duplicating effort. You know, we're building on what the GNWT is already working on and building it into an arm's length public process that's completely independent of government and therefore will have that element of restoring trust and restoring confidence that this is not a whitewash report.

This is not something that has been a draft has been poured over by Cabinet and offensive sections taken out and, you know, things like that that we hear from the community. And I'm not suggesting that that's going to happen. You know, I would be inappropriate to do so in this Chamber or in any other venue. You know, we trust in our leaders. We put them there to lead. But this is a difference of opinion on how to proceed. You know, this isn't a personality dispute. This isn't about anyone's integrity. This is about what process is best for the Northwest Territories.

You know, and another thing we can do with that establishment order is ensure that Indigenous governments and Indigenous peoples are given a main stage in the process and craft it to ensure that their perspectives and their rights and treaties are respected and taken into account. We've had discussions about that and, you know, we want to improve this process in the Inquiries Act to ensure that Indigenous nations are well represented in that. And we haven't been doing this alone.

We've been working as an entire Assembly to have these conversations. You know, the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight has met with Cabinet in full and discussed concerns on how we -- concerns on both sides how we can move forward. I had met with the Premier and the Minister -- the Ministers responsible for wildfire prevention and emergency management in the Northwest Territories. This is all part of the process of building a compromise that can work for everyone because at the end of the day, we serve the public, and the public wants to see us work together.

The public wants to see us meet their expectations, their very high expectations of restoring trust after a very traumatic episode in our shared history. And I believe we have been working earnestly to achieve that. But there is a dispute, and that's a healthy dispute. We're not sent here to agree to all agree with each other. It's not unanimous government, Mr. Speaker. It's consensus government. And when we have these kinds of disputes, it's only right we bring them to the floor and speak to why we feel strongly about something on one side or the other.

And I really appreciate the level of maturity and professionalism that every Member has shown in discussing this motion and a public inquiry.

And furthermore, to the media, to the public, to the experts who have been brought in to weigh in on this, I think people -- Northerners are more aware of what a public inquiry is and what our legislation does than they've ever been in any period in the Northwest Territories' history before, and I think that's a good thing. I think people know what the stakes are, you know. I trust -- I have full trust that people watching our proceedings and who have been paying attention to the reporting in the media are well aware of what this entails and what it could be and what it isn't.

Yes, there's still some concerns but I'm confident we can work through them and that the correct way to handle this is with a full public inquiry that ensures, again, independence, transparency, and accountability that is completely arm's length from government, because fundamentally a trust has been broken. And if we are not ready to meet the moment and restore that trust, we're going to start this Assembly off on bad footing.

So I hope that Members will support this motion and that we will move forward in collaboration with all parties to draft an establishment order that will meet the expectations -- the very high expectations of Northerners, give them the answers they're looking for, and ensure that that process has a hundred percent integrity that cannot be impugned by anyone looking from the outside in. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires, Carried

Motions

Page 171

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Range Lake . To the motion. Great Slave.

To the motion. Great Slave.

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Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires, Carried

Motions

Page 171

Kate Reid

Great Slave

Just making sure I'm procedurally correct, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. When I was elected, I got a strong sense from the residents of my riding that they wanted to see someone represent them who would make collaboration their main mode of operation. They wanted someone who would listen to them as residents but also someone who would listen to all Members of the Assembly. That baseline expectation is what I strive to live up to every day that I have the privilege to stand here and proudly represent my riding. I have heard from constituents on both sides of the public inquiry argument. Some see a public inquiry as the only way forward. Others have cautioned, like the Premier , to the expense of what a public inquiry might entail.

The most poignant request that was shared with me was a detailed account from the perspective of a redeployed GNWT employee. They worked at an evacuation centre and provided me with several pages of issues that they flagged from that experience. I have shared this account on an anonymous basis with all Members in this House well before this motion came to the floor. I did this in the spirit of collaboration to spark a conversation about what a scope could or should entail, and I was told in so many words that I was putting the cart before the horse and, in some ways, I was.

But I still think that that conversation should have happened with all 19 of us and that it would have led to some conversations earlier on about what the best container looked like collaboratively. But that did not come to pass.

After conferring with my colleagues and legal staff in the past two weeks, I can say that the Public Inquiries Act affords, through regulation, everything that residents want to see - constraints to timelines, budgets and, especially important to me, the ability to provide for anonymity when requested.

The people in the NWT deserve to know exactly what the GNWT did to fight last summer's fires and what it did to plan for and support all the people displaced from their homes and communities. And more importantly, the people deserve to find out why the GNWT made the decisions that it did, particularly the decisions of Ministers and senior officials in charge. An independent review of staff actions may tell part of the story, but the more important story lies in finding out on what those staff were told to do in the first place.

However, to see what we want, the scope will remain the crucial part of the conversation that I was so eager to have. This means that we need strong terms of reference for the inquiry. I hope that all 19 of us together can collaborate meaningfully on that piece together.

Unfortunately, right after the deferral two weeks ago, the Premier told the media that a public inquiry is not the way to go effectively signaling that meaningful collaboration with all Members, that I thought I was voting for through deferral of the motion, was dead in the water. And although it is certain that this motion will pass today, adding to dashed hopes Cabinet is not compelled to do what we request in the motion.

Others may infer meaning behind that choice but, ultimately to me, it comes down to this: It's kind of depressing that the government needs to be convinced to do the right thing and, ultimately, it feels likely they won't, even now. It diminishes the trust in the GNWT further. Cabinet had an amazing opportunity to make a strong gesture of good faith and prove that they were not going to make things business as usual, but that boat seems to have sailed.

I'm going to get a little technical, Mr. Speaker. The Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act obligates MLAs to perform their duties of office and arrange their affairs in such a manner as to maintain public confidence and trust in the integrity, objectivity, and impartiality of the Member and to act in a manner that will bear the closest public scrutiny in all other respects. This obligation exists because public trust is at the heart of good government. Members must always strive to maintain that trust.

The thing about trust is that the person who wants to earn it doesn't always get to define when they have done enough to be trusted. Maybe the government can be trusted to investigate its own actions last summer but however thorough and complete its review, there are sure to be doubts, particularly among those who are most directly affected by the fires. Cabinet could take those doubts right off the table right now and earn a whole lot of public trust and respect by agreeing to launch a public inquiry.

We have reached a critical decision point only a hundred days into our time as Members that now sets the tone for how we work together as an Assembly. We can decide to send the message that this government will stand for truth, transparency and integrity, and that it is committed to partnership and collaboration with all Members. If we decide otherwise, it will leave a question mark hanging over us about our ability to move forward together. I will continue to push for all 19 of us to have collaboration as our preferred mode of operation. I'll always ask for that collaboration and ask for it to be meaningful.

One last thing I'll say and then I'm done. Trust is not something that is found or restored; it has to be earned every day. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires, Carried

Motions

Page 171

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Great Slave . To the motion. Member from Monfwi .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

Jane Weyallon Armstrong

Monfwi

Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Now a motion to amend -- sorry about that, I apologize.

NOW THEREFORE I MOVE, seconded by the Member for Sahtu , to amend Motion 9-20(1), Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires by replacing the word "four" with the word "six" in the second clause such as it reads:

AND FURTHER, that this resolution include the Commissioner establishing a board composed of six persons appointed by the Commissioner to make the inquiry and to report on the inquiry to the Commissioner.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Monfwi . The motion to amend Motion 9-20(1) is in order. The question before the House is now the amendment. Debate must be on the amendment and not to the main motion. To the motion. Member from Monfwi .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

Jane Weyallon Armstrong

Monfwi

Mr. Speaker, the wildfire 2023 had a great impact on a lot of people in the Northwest Territories and especially in my region, in Tlicho region. And a lot of people have been coming forward wants to be -- they want to be heard. Mr. Speaker, we cannot forget 4 million hectares of land burned --

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Member from Monfwi , to the amendment. To the amendment. Thank you. Yes, thank you, Member; it's all right, we're all learning. Thank you. To the motion. Member from Range Lake .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

Kieron Testart

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this amendment will allow for the Council of Leaders, which is made up of Indigenous governments, to appoint two persons to a board of inquiry to oversee the public inquiry as contemplated by this motion. And I consider it a friendly amendment and support it. Thank you.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

To the motion.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

Some Hon. Members

Question.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Question has been called. Motion to amend Motion 9-20. Premier .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

R.J. Simpson

Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Cabinet will be abstaining from any amendments, or the amendments that we have been made aware of, and reserve the vote until the final motion that committee wants to bring forward is put together. I understand there may be a number of amendments and so we'll be abstaining on all of them. Thank you.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Member from Yellowknife Centre .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think I was part of that earlier confusion. I thank the Member for Monfwi for moving the amended motion obviously and the Member for Range Lake for clarifying what it is, the intent of the amendment. That said, it's already been explained on the record so there's no sense in repeating what it was, but I want to further underscore I think the Members would like a recorded vote in this amendment process so therefore I'll formally ask for it. Thank you.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Increase Board to 6 Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 171

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Member from Yellowknife Centre has asked for a recorded vote. All those in favour? Recorded vote. Please stand.

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Recorded Vote

Motions

Page 171

Clerk Of The House

Mr. Glen Rutland

The Member for Monfwi . The Member for Frame Lake . The Member for Great Slave . The Member for Mackenzie Delta . The Member for Yellowknife North . The Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh . The Member for Deh Cho . The Member for Sahtu . The Member for Yellowknife Centre . The Member for Range Lake .

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Recorded Vote

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Page 171

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

All those opposed? All those abstaining?

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Recorded Vote

Motions

Page 171

Clerk Of The House

Mr. Glen Rutland

The Member from Thebacha . The Member for Kam Lake . The Member for Hay River North . The Member for Hay River South . The Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes . The Member for Nunakput .

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Recorded Vote

Motions

Page 171

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Colleagues, motion 10 yeses. 0 nos. And 6 abstentions. Motion has been carried.

---Carried

Members, returning back to the Motion 9-20(1) as amended. To the motion as amended. Member for Monfwi .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Council of Leaders, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Jane Weyallon Armstrong

Monfwi

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

NOW THEREFORE I MOVE, seconded by the Member for Sahtu , to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires as amended, by adding the following clause after the fourth clause:

AND FURTHERMORE, that the Commissioner receive recommendations from the Council of Leaders for two persons to be appointed to the board.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Council of Leaders, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member for Monfwi . Members, there's a motion to amend Motion 9-20(1) as amended. The question before the House is proposed amendments. Debate should be on the proposed amendment, not the main motion. To the motion. Member for Monfwi .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Council of Leaders, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Jane Weyallon Armstrong

Monfwi

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the reason why this motion is introduced is to appoint -- the Council of Leaders to appoint two board members to the inquiry. Thank you.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Council of Leaders, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you. To the motion. Member from Yellowknife Centre .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Council of Leaders, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. First off, I'm going to ask for a recorded vote to make sure that doesn't get forgotten.

The next

part is part of the -- I just want to further elaborate on the amendment made by my colleague from Monfwi. The issue is this side of the House is trying to make this the most collaborative process as possible, and we want to work with Council of Leaders. We believe the Indigenous governments do have a role to play on the guidance of this inquiry, and we think it would be strengthened by their vision and input on it. So the Members aren't doing this in isolation so the House may be able to count every single one here showing their support.

But that said, I want people to know is we've reached well beyond our ranks in this House to get into the communities to speak to the chiefs, to speak to folks and families who have been impacted by this, so that's, you know, part of the underlying reason of this amendment to ensure that we're demonstrating, we're reaching very far and collaboratively to make it a good process. Thank you.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Council of Leaders, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Yellowknife Centre . To the motion.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Council of Leaders, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Some Hon. Members

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Council of Leaders, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Question has been called. And ask for a recorded vote. So question has been called for the Motion to Amend Motion 9-20(1) as amended, and it is a recorded vote. All those in favour?

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Recorded Vote

Motions

Page 172

Clerk Of The House

Mr. Glen Rutland

The Member for Monfwi . The Member for Frame Lake . The Member for Great Slave . The Member for Mackenzie Delta . The Member for Yellowknife North . The Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh . The Member for Deh Cho . The Member for Sahtu . The Member for Yellowknife Centre . The Member for Range Lake .

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Recorded Vote

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

All those opposed? All those abstaining?

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Recorded Vote

Motions

Page 172

Clerk Of The House

Mr. Glen Rutland

The Member for Thebacha . The Member for Kam Lake . The Member for Hay River North . The Member for Hay River South . The Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes . The Member for Nunakput .

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Recorded Vote

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

In favour, 10. Opposed, 0. Abstention, 6. Motion has been carried.

---Carried

Returning back to Motion 9-20(1) as amended. To the motion. Member from Frame Lake .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Reduce Board to Three Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Julian Morse

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

NOW THEREFORE I MOVE, seconded by the Member for Great Slave , to amend Motion 9-20(1), Establishment of a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires as amended, by replacing the word "six" with "three" in the second clause such that the clause reads:

AND FURTHER, that this resolution includes the Commissioner establishing a board composed of three persons appointed by the Commissioner to make the inquiry and to report on the inquiry to the Commissioner;

And further, that the words "two persons" are changed to "one person" in the third, fourth, and fifth clauses such as the clauses read "for one person to be appointed to the board."

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Reduce Board to Three Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Frame Lake . Members, there's a motion to amend Motion 9-20(1) as amended. The question before the House is the proposed amendment. Debate is on the proposed amendment and not the main motion. To the motion. Member from Frame Lake .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Reduce Board to Three Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Julian Morse

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. By way of explanation, this is just an addition to the friendly amendments made by the Member for Monfwi . It was my feeling that a six-person board is getting quite large at that point and so a three Member panel would be more appropriate. It would be more cost conscious and so that's why I made this what I consider to be a friendly amendment. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Reduce Board to Three Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Frame Lake . To the motion.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Reduce Board to Three Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Some Hon. Members

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Reduce Board to Three Persons, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Question has been called. All those in favour? Opposed? Abstained? Motion has been passed.

---Carried

Returning to the motion. Member from the Deh Cho .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Draft Inquiry Establishment Order, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Sheryl Yakeleya

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I MOVE, second by the Member for Great Slave , to amend Motion 9-20(1), Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires as amended, by replacing the words "the inquiry establishment order" with "a draft inquiry establishment order" in the last clause of the motion such as it reads:

AND FURTHERMORE, that a draft inquiry establishment order be tabled on the first day of the May sitting of this House.

Thank You, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Draft Inquiry Establishment Order, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from the Deh Cho . Members, there's a motion to amend Motion 9-20(1) as amended. The question before the House is the proposed amendment. Debate on the amendment and not the main motion. To the motion. Member from the Deh Cho .

All those in favour? Opposed? Abstention?

---Carried

The motion has been passed.

To the motion. Member for Great Slave .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Kate Reid

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I MOVE, seconded by the Member for Deh Cho , to amend Motion 9-20(1), Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires as amended, by adding the following clause after the fifth clause:

AND FURTHERMORE, that the Commissioner recommend to the board that they establish safe disclosure opportunities for people to share information with the inquiry.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Great Slave . To the motion. Member from Great Slave .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Kate Reid

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I just wanted to elaborate a bit on this amendment. It is very important to me that folks who were in the public service at the time of the evacuation be afforded opportunities to provide their feedback anonymously, and I thank my colleagues on this side of the House for appreciating this amendment to the motion. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Member from Great Slave . To the motion.

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Motions

Page 172

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 172

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Question has been called. All those in favour? Opposed? Abstentions? Motion has been carried.

---Carried

Any debate on the wildfire motion. The Member from Monfwi .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 172

Jane Weyallon Armstrong

Monfwi

Yes, thank you. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this wildfire 2023 had a great impact on a lot of people in the Northwest Territories, especially in my region.

Mr. Speaker, we cannot forget that 4 million hectares of land burned in the Northwest Territories. That is our way of life - our food, our medicine, our language. And we can't forget around that time animal babies -- small animal babies were also burned as well. For the first time, Behchoko and Wekweeti were evacuated. This happened so fast for many of my people that many were frightened. Many didn't know what to do or where to go because it happened so fast. And there was no communication with the people.

In this whole process, vulnerable people, especially the elderly who were caught in the evacuation that were in Yellowknife, some of them went south without interpreters and some of the vulnerable people on the street, some of them did not return to Yellowknife or did not return to the North to their communities. So they are missing.

So we have to remember all the things that happened with 2023 wildfires. People want to be heard. They want to know what happened. We cannot forget. We cannot repeat. What happened, with fire 2023 what happened, we cannot let it repeat again.

In the whole process too, Mr. Speaker, none of the Indigenous government were consulted. They were not consulted. The GNWT had a lack of emergency coordination with the Indigenous government. For that reason, on August 28th, I introduced a private Member's bill, and that was to coordinate its emergency response activities with Indigenous government affected by the emergencies. And that is also related to the motion that we just introduced.

Twenty-eight communities were abandoned. The sad part, I just live down the road from here - a hundred kilometres, 104 kilometres. The Premier of the day drove by my community, did not even stop to talk to the leaders or to myself to see how the people are doing. Nothing like that. No communication. We have airstrips in my community. No plane was left behind for us to use, for people to use. Two fly-in communities were stuck for three weeks while the evacuation was in place. We had no groceries. We had no medicine. Medical travels were affected. We were cut off from Yellowknife when the fire was not near Yellowknife. So a lot of our people were going south to go get some groceries.

But the good thing out of the whole thing was because the evacuation happened so fast, the first weekend for a lot of people -- a lot of people in my communities are saying for the first weekend because the evacuation happened so fast with little notice, it was quiet in our community. No alcohol until people found ways, until they started going south to go get their groceries. So for many of our -- I've been talking to a lot of people and I've been talking to Indigenous government. They are supportive of this inquiry, a public full independent inquiries of this wildfire 2023.

Tlicho government, they also support this as well. They send -- they're vocal, and they're vocal about this because they did their own press release to support the public inquiries. And we know that we cannot move forward. We cannot move forward without the Indigenous government. So this motion to -- this motion will provide a full participation of the Indigenous government to review the process, and it is supported by Tlicho government and other Indigenous government as well.

So therefore, at this time, I am asking my colleagues to support the wishes of the Indigenous government to recognize the impact this wildfire had on Indigenous communities and to ensure equal participants in the review process. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 173

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Monfwi . To the motion. Member from Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 173

Richard Edjericon

Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I want to talk about this fire that happened in the fall in 2023. It just so happens that just after the long weekend on July 1st, my wife and I were going to go down to Fort Smith to see family and friends and join in the events that were happening in the town of Fort Smith. But prior to driving that way, I was passing Behchoko and as I was passing Behchoko, you could see smoke way in the back. And as I was driving, I told my wife that I don't see no planes there, nobody doing anything about that fire it appears.

And you know, in the early days, you know, when I listened to the elders in Fort Resolution in my constituency, they would say that if there's a fire back in the early days, they would have a tower and we have people on that tower. And they see that fire and they will spot it, and they will send a crew out there. The guys who go out there for three days to a week or so and each of the fires is put out. And they'll come back home to their communities and that's how it was.

But when this fire happened, I asked a question why aren't they putting that fire out? And they say well, they have a policy called let it burn policy. Why is that? Why is that policy there to let it burn? And I often thought about it. Well, maybe it's because they don't want to pay overtime or anything like that. So that's what happened. That same fire came close to Behchoko, nearly wiping out the whole community. That same fire also came to Yellowknife nearly wiping out this community. How did we get to this point? It should never ever come to that. So it is concerning.

You know, a lot of people were afraid. A lot of people were displaced when the GNWT pulled the trigger to evacuate. It was chaos. My colleague Mr. O'Reilly up there, him and I were at Sir John on day one. For 12 hours that day, people were going to get registered to get on the plane to get out of Yellowknife. We had elders, didn't know what was going on. I had to help three elders. I had to go find three wheelchairs. I found it. I'm not going to tell you where I got it from, but I found it. The point is that we had to do what we can at the time to help our people.

And when people were waiting in that line-up at Sir John, it was a mile long. There was no water, no seat, no tea, no coffee, no food. It was just the military that were there directing traffic.

After -- for three days that happened and then people were sent south to Edmonton, to Calgary, to Winnipeg. The patients in the hospital here were sent all over the place. Nobody knew where they were. Families didn't know where they were. I had constituent members who were sitting on the streets in Calgary because they were let go from the hotel or didn't even check in. There was nobody there from the Government of the Northwest Territories to help our people down south, but we got 6,600 government employees.

In Fort Resolution, I was there. We had no communication for five days. My wife was here; I was there. There what's no way I could communicate with her to check on her, my siblings, my son, my grandson, my kids. How that happened? Well, we heard that the lines were disrupted and burnt. We had no communication. Thank God we had StarLink in our community. And there were a few people that had it. That was the only way we were able to communicate to our families and friends.

Our food security for YKDFN, Lutselk'e and Fort Resolution, it was a big concern to us. In Fort Resolution, there was a fire south in Fort Smith, fire in Hay River, Enterprise, towards Kakisa. We had no way to get food into our community for about a good week. The GNWT, through some of their staff and the mining industry, stepped up to provide food to help us out in Fort Resolution. When we lost communication, where we had no telephones, we had no debit machines. We had nothing. So they couldn't sell gas. Gas was at a premium. The store was shut down. How did we get in that situation? Where was our backup as a government?

Lutselk'e, we had family and friends were there visiting and when this evacuation happened, there was no airlines. Air Tindi stopped flying to that community. There was absolutely no transportation to that community. That should never happen. That's why I've been asking for a winter road, extra barging season. Who knows? We may push all-season road. We need that. We need a backup.

While I was in Fort Resolution, we were told to evacuate Fort Resolution. There was a fire in Fort Smith, Hay River. Everybody was already gone. But the leadership in Fort Resolution got together and they said no. Where are we going to put our people? All the hotels are booked. You pretty well have to go maybe far as Winnipeg or BC. So it was really confusing. So the leadership said no, we got an airport here, we've got a lake here. We were better off staying here in Fort Resolution. That was the outcome.

While I was there doing my job as an MLA, I was on the phone for a good ten days dealing with lost constituents kicked out of hotel rooms. They got no money. They don't know where to turn to. Red Cross has been sending them all over the place. Where was the GNWT? There was nobody down there helping our people. But at the same time they had a fire in Alberta a few years earlier - Fort McMurray, Slave Lake, Alberta, BC. What happened in Slave Lake and Fort McMurray is no different than what happened here, but we should have learned something from that, yet we had no plans in place.

I was told that this government was totally disorganized. It could have been worse. We could have had a lot of fatalities. Yeah, it's concerning. I'm standing up here today to talk about this motion.

The public is asking for -- to restore public trust in this government. We're not here to blame what happened. We should learn from what happened, so we know what to do next time. But what I heard from my friend on the other side of the House we don't need a public inquiry; It's going to cost millions of dollars; hundreds of thousand people are going to be interviewed; it's going to disrupt the whole government. When I hear that kind of stuff, it's just like you're trying to hide the truth from the people. The truth will set you free they say. Well, this public inquiry will do that.

Our people are hurting. The other day I was in Dettah for my constituency meeting. They made it very clear to me that they're still monies that they paid out of pocket yet to be reimbursed to this day. Why is that happening? Well, the government said no, we're going to cut you off on this day and that's it. There was no communication other than what we heard on the radio. And it happened bang, just like that.

My wife and I were in Hay River eating at The Boardroom when the phone went off. There was accidents, people running to get gas and groceries, and they were driving out of town straight into that fire. Like I said, we could have had a lot of fatalities.

On top of all that, YKDFN, Lutselk'e, Fort Resolution, Fort Resolution Metis Council, paid out a lot of money to the members in the south for food, a little bit of clothing, accommodation. They didn't ask for this. They took the money out of the monies they had from the mining industry, whatever monies they had in their bank account to help their own people. And they want their money back. They didn't ask for this. But I am told that if you want your money back, there's $45,000 you can get from MACA under this policy.

We should do the honourable thing. If you talk about building relationships and trust with Indigenous governments, you said that in your speeches as a Premier and Ministers; collaboration, I hear that. Restore trust. Even though we pass this motion today, there's no guarantee Cabinet's going to go ahead and do this work. But I want to see that. We're asking you to step up. We need it.

Mr. Speaker, I will be supporting this motion today for the people that want to have their voices heard, and they want to tell their story. I'm only touching on a little bit here. They have a lot to say. So, Mr. Speaker, I will be supporting the motion here today. Thank you.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 174

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Colleagues, I need to reiterate, speak to me. When you say "you" and you're looking over at Cabinet, you're implying Cabinet. I need you to look at me and address me. We do not need to cross this line. This is a very important debate, and I understand that there is going to be feelings in this, and I understand it's emotional, but address it to me as the Speaker of the House. Thank you.

Member from the Deh Cho .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

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Page 174

Sheryl Yakeleya

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Last summer was a smokey summer.

Mr. Speaker, I second this motion requesting a public inquiry into the wildfire because the people I represent want to know the truth. People in my riding fled from their communities with very little notice. Houses were consumed by fire and many people are still displaced to this day.

An elderly lady that I -- from my community was was medevaced out of the hospital from here, brought to Vancouver, and her escort was sent to Calgary, and the elderly lady passed away in Vancouver by herself without her family members. There was a young guy from my community also living on the streets here in Yellowknife that went to -- he got medevaced to Calgary, and he died there too without family members. So a lot of people want answers.

The review of the wildfire needs to be independent. It needs to ensure that everyone who was impacted can come forward. The review needs to be done openly and transparently. It needs to provide safe disclosure. And all of this, Mr. Speaker, so we can improve what we do. This motion will affect change that needs to happen so we can respond better to emergencies in the future.

Mr. Speaker, as you look to the future, we may be facing more and more natural disasters and emergencies. Let's take a pause and hear from everyone impacted so we can get this right. This motion clears a path towards good governance. Residents and Indigenous leadership are asking for this and our safety demands this, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

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Page 174

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Deh Cho. To the motion. Member from Yellowknife North .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

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Page 174

Shauna Morgan

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. So what are our options here today? We can decide to continue on with the after-action review where MACA hires an independent contractor, or we demand a full-blown public inquiry with the power to subpoena documents and witnesses to testify before a quasi-judicial panel?

I would argue that there is a third path, which is potentially the best one in terms of balancing the need for a fully independent review with the need to do it relatively quickly and cost effectively, and that is to appoint an independent panel to manage an independent review team similar to what was done in British Columbia in 2017. While Cabinet has not yet agreed to this, I'm hopeful that by passing this motion demanding a public inquiry, by using this tool that we have available to us, it will put enough pressure on Premier and Cabinet to embrace this kind of fully independent review.

I wanted to raise the example of the British Columbia independent review into their wildfire and flooding events of 2017. Basically the BC Premier appointed two, independent, well-respected individuals to lead the independent review team. The leads were Maureen Chapman, BC hereditary chief of the Skawahlook First Nation, and George Abbott, a retired former BC Minister. They conducted public engagement. They completed a relatively speedy review over about five months.

It was completed by April of 2018, the year after the disasters, and they came up with a report that had 108 recommendations which had public buy-in and it prompted the BC government to come up with an action plan to respond to each of them.

I have heard from some in leadership positions that a MACA after-action review is sufficient because sure there were some missed steps, but the evacuations were a success because no one died. At least not before they left the NWT. And sure, there was a little bit of confusion, but we just need to iron out the details and carry on. I think this perspective is profoundly disconnected from how most of us experienced last summer's emergencies.

And honestly, this narrative usually slips into the realm of platitudes and excuses like everyone did their best, it was unprecedented, no one could have ever predicted Yellowknife would evacuate, and we couldn't control what Alberta did. And while these may have some truth behind them, this kind of narrative doesn't sound like it's leading us toward a serious reckoning with the oversights and failures and challenges. It's basically telling us not much different could have been done so it tells us not much different will be done in the future.

For me, the main sticking point with the default plan being proposed by the government is the insistence that MACA still be involved in managing certain aspects of the review even if it's conducted by an external contractor.

So even if it's just managing the financial aspects of the contract, even if we're assured by the government that MACA staff wouldn't be directing the contractor, they would just be supporting or coordinating, practically speaking Regular Members and members of the public are not going to be in those rooms to be able to monitor to what extent MACA staff are coordinating and not crossing over the fine line towards guiding or directing a contractor.

And even if there are ways that an oversight committee could object or complain, you've already compromised the credibility of this review by casting doubt on the independence of the contractor.

So to me, there is a simple solution to this. I believe that MACA should just stay out of the review. GNWT departments should just stay out of it. Except, of course, to provide the requested documents and information and participate the way all the other government departments would be expected to participate so that the independent reviewers can get to the bottom of what went wrong and how things can be fixed.

Now, I want to explain a bit about why so many people do not trust the GNWT to be able to manage a credible review of its own emergency management.

There's always going to be some people that don't trust the government. And in a community like Yellowknife, there are still people with kind of a frontier mentality. You know, just strike out on your own, don't rely on government, fend for yourself. But on the other hand, this mentality is limited by the fact that so very many NWT residents now work for the government themselves. But it's not this kind of everyday low-level distrust of government that is driving this outcry for a public and independent review.

During a time of emergency or crisis, I actually think that people's instinct, even the skeptics, is to look to a central authority figure for direction. Last summer, I think people wanted to believe what they were being told by authorities. They wanted to understand what they were supposed to do. They wanted to follow the directions that were given.

And that's at the very root of why people feel betrayed, because the people who drove out of Yellowknife right away that very evening the evacuation was called, the people who tried to avoid overburdening the busiest evacuation centres by going to alternative locations, the people who dutifully signed up for the return flights according to the official process, these were often the people who were most disappointed or ended up being under the greatest threat. People felt like they were played for fools by believing the government during a time that they were so incredibly vulnerable.

There was a social contract that was understood, that if you obey the government's order to leave our home the government will ensure you're safe. And many people from many different walks of life felt that that contract was broken, and that is a big deal.

I personally think it was a miracle that nobody died driving out on those highways either from being burnt up in their vehicles or from traffic accidents in the crush of thousands and thousands of vehicles leaving Yellowknife after a late-evening announcement of the evacuation, driving often all night through flames and smoke.

Now many people stepped up. They did heroic acts or everyday acts that protected and comforted evacuees, and those need to be highlighted and built upon too but not taken for granted. The GNWT should not be taking for granted or taking credit for the fact that no one died on that highway, or else we will fail to learn. Fundamentally, the government had to make decisions that had a huge impact on individuals and families' basic sense of security. Decisions about when exactly to allow people to remain at home, when to order them to flee their homes and communities, and when to allow them to return.

Those kind of decisions need to be made with a very high understanding and skillful way of the risks that people face, the risks that they would face if they stayed home, the risks that they would face along the escape route, and the risks that they would face at whatever destination they're sent to. And all of those risks need to be understood within our NWT context. We have so many people already living with the effects of personal and intergenerational trauma, mental health issues, addictions issues, extremely high rates of family violence.

And so I'm fearful that without a fully independent review with robust public participation, these risks will not come to light. The risk will not be understood and not be incorporated into future risk management decisions.

Now, we talk a lot about the need to protect and support first responders, and I think about the chaos and confusion around the evacuation of Stanton Hospital. Now patients were flown out, and preparations were made to shut down the entire hospital. Nurses and doctors were ordered to leave town with their families. And then at the 11th hour someone figured out that firefighters actually needed the hospital to stay open. So there was a complete shift, and parts of the ER and the hospital were kept open after all but with inadequate preparations and staffing arrangements.

So I can only imagine that it must be a first responder, a health care professional's worst nightmare, to courageously stay behind, to stand on the frontlines, and know that due to poor planning you don't have the proper resources, the proper team, or supports to do your job.

Now many people have shared their heart-wrenching stories with me, and those stories are not mine to tell here today. I hope those people will feel comfortable bringing them forward during an independent review. But I do want to speak a bit about my own experience, and I've spoken about this before in the context of my involvement on the board of Yellowknife Women's Society and our frustration and terror as on organization attempting to work on a different frontline, working to try to find and help the underhoused population scattered in southern cities.

So I won't go over all the details, certainly, but over and over again the women's society was assured that the GNWT, the authorities, governments, were taking care of the situation, that plans were being made, processes are underway. But over and over again, there was no follow through. And sometimes we could see obviously government staff were keeping very busy. There was a flurry of meetings and calls. But in very few cases did we see any of this result in actual effective help being provided to the vulnerable people that were ending up on the street.

And when we weren't being assured that the GNWT was on top of everything, we were told the opposite, that the GNWT actually has no jurisdiction to do anything meaningful in Alberta and in any case, we shouldn't expect much because GNWT staff are evacuees too. But then when the Women's Society decided we would try to make things happen ourselves, we were told multiple times to stand down or to start again by going through proper channels, which usually led us to the same place, sending emails into a void with no response.

And this kind of chaos may have been sort of understandable if it lasted a few days right at the beginning of the evacuation, or even a week, but after a month the same patterns were happening and we could only conclude that there was something seriously dysfunctional about the emergency management systems within the GNWT.

It was also alarming that it seemed to many that people ending up on the streets of Calgary and Edmonton was simply inevitable, that it was something that maybe we would try to observe or tally, count, but that no clear interventions to prevent this were ever identified as necessary or urgent, as if it was something that just happened but it was no one's responsibility and no one's fault. But I want us to re-enforce that this situation was not and is not inevitable.

The fact that our fellow community members ended up on the streets of big cities in Alberta was entirely predictable, entirely preventable, and that if we're going to do this kind of prevention, it will require a major shift in our thinking that I feel is unlikely to occur unless there is an independent review and broad public participation and buy-in. Which brings me to what's the danger? What could be lost if we just went ahead with an after-action review that was led by MACA? What would we miss?

One thing that is top of mind for me is that many government staff, who had various roles in the evacuation or emergency management, would not feel comfortable speaking up or offering their insights at all. They need opportunities to offer their input confidentially if necessary. And if there were MACA officials or government officials present in the room or if they knew that GNWT staff would have access to the documents or testimony that they were putting forward, especially if that could be their bosses, it doesn't matter how much you reassure people that don't worry, you're safe from retaliation, these people will not feel safe in saying what they need to say and what we all need to hear.

These are people who were and hopefully still are working inside the system, and I think they may have some of the most valuable insights to offer into what went wrong and what could be done differently. Many are truly shaken by what they feel were their own departments' failings, and this has contributed to real damages to morale in the public service. Some have left the public service or will leave unless they see a true reckoning that gets at the root of what happened.

Other dangers is members of the public may not come forward at all. They may not see any point. They may not view this as a credible review, and we will lose all of their valuable insights. I think we should also consider that if there is no review that is seen as independent and credible, that next time there's an emergency people may not trust or follow government's direction at all. People may not agree to leave their homes and evacuate. And that's a real -- very much a real danger that we need to contemplate here. There's also the danger that people's sense of insecurity and their lack of faith in government causes them to move away from the North entirely.

So to summarize and conclude, obviously I feel that we do need a fully independent review without inserting GNWT departments in any of the coordination, management, or oversight. The point of this review is not to find scapegoats to blame but to come up with useful recommendations as expeditiously as possible for systemic change in our emergency management so that our community members can feel confident that we are confronting this changing climate, this terrifying future, that we're confronting it together, prepare to protect our families, our colleagues, and the most vulnerable amongst us. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

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Page 175

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Yellowknife North . To the motion. Member from Frame Lake .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

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Page 175

Julian Morse

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, over the past week, there have been a fair bit of discussion about what model would be best. My colleague was just speaking to it also. And, you know, I've really appreciated that discussion. I've appreciated the coverage in the news. I think there's been some excellent coverage helping to inform residents about the decision being made today, what's behind it, and the details.

Mr. Speaker, I'm not 100 percent sure an inquiry under the Inquiries Act is the perfect solution, but I can say that right now it is the best solution which has been brought forward yet.

I appreciate that Cabinet has attempted to work with Regular MLAs. They brought a proposal forward. I would argue that the proposal didn't quite get there. The previous Speaker spoke to that a little bit. Probably what I found the most difficulty with is that I was allowed to speak to it a little bit, I did engage with my constituents, but the scope of work was not made public. It made it very difficult for me to stand behind that publicly for several reasons. The biggest one being, of course, how am I to engage residents and, you know, take a temperature gauge on public opinion for something that they can't see? How do we expect people to opine on something they haven't read?

And this leads to some general frustrations that I've had, or I guess things I've puzzled over since I started in this role. And one of them has been that much of the work conducted in this Assembly, much of the work conducted by this government, is done with confidentiality written on the documents. Many of the documents I receive are confidential. And I think my key frustration with it is that I can say with almost 100 percent completeness that none of the information that I have received, which has been marked confidential, has been sensitive. Much of it is just day-to-day operations.

Much of it is here's the substantiation for the work that we're doing, these are the reasons we're doing it, this is what's going to be done. And so I have been puzzled as to why things are marked confidential in the first place. And I think one of my frustrations with this is I think that the reason behind this is a desire for mitigation of risk but based on what I've seen, there is another risk, and that is the disadvantages associated with people not understanding what their government is doing.

Mr. Speaker, during our orientation process, we've had a lot of briefings with government staff. Or AOC recently had briefings. Our AOC committee had briefings with a number of different departments where departmental staff came in and answered detailed questions about the work they're doing, gave us briefings on particular projects or initiatives the government's working on. And I want to be clear that those briefings gave me a lot of confidence in GNWT staff. It helped me appreciate enormous amounts of work that are being done and the quality of that work.

So what we're missing out on by doing much of our work behind closed doors is public confidence in the good work that government is engaged in or the opportunity to have conversations about what's not working and of course correct, as we might have done if a proposal for a fully arm's length review with draft terms of reference was brought forward to the public. So let's turn to the inquiry itself.

First of all, I want to say I'm glad that we took a bit of extra time. This allowed for a healthy public debate and resulted in better informed decision-making and time for engagement with constituents, which I really appreciated having. I've had many people reach out to me with their thoughts, and I think that that helps us make better decisions when we hear from our constituency, when people who put us in this office reach out to us and tell us what they want.

I will say, Mr. Speaker, that the majority of constituents who have gotten in touch with me are in favour of a public inquiry and have been quite clear with me about that. Some of those voices are coming within the government. Some of those voices are coming from folks who are on the outside. But the message is fairly universal. I want to emphasize that the vast majority of what I've heard is not related to anger; rather, it's an acute interest in getting good recommendations for how to learn from this incident and move forward in a better way. That has been emphasized to me by many residents, and I want to emphasize that in this House too, that that's what people are looking for.

I have also heard from some constituents who are either strongly against or who are expressing reservations about an inquiry. It's important to me that I amplify these voices also and ensure that their concerns are heard. The major concerns I've heard are related to costs. As we know, we're entering a time of fiscal restraint, and residents are quite reasonably raising concerns. There are concerns around what an inquiry might cost, that costs could spin out of control.

It's been raised to me that the format of a public inquiry and the formal format that that entails could potentially be a barrier to participation. I think some of the amendments that were brought forward today speak to that and have tried to mitigate that concern. And another concern that's been brought forward to me is the potential for an inquiry to prolong and amplify trauma which has already occurred in the territory.

I want to say that I share some of these concerns, and I have taken the time to investigate them extensively. I've had a significant amount of research done by legislative staff and read through it, how this has been handled in all the other jurisdictions that have been dealt with wildfires, what a public inquiry entails. Our committee had a briefing from an objective lawyer where we asked all the questions about the Inquiries Act, how it works, the parameters that can be put on inquiries, what an inquiry is and isn't. So I feel quite informed coming into this decision today.

So what I will say is that getting the establishment order right is critically important. This is an opportunity to constrain the scope, the cost, and the timeline associated with a public inquiry. And so that is important in addressing some of the concerns that we've heard.

So I'm going to turn now to talking about things an inquiry needs to be and things it does not. I believe, like many of my colleagues have already emphasized, Mr. Speaker, that it needs to be fully independent from government to instill confidence in the results. Again, I spoke to risk and the risk of people not understanding what's going on. The risk here, of course, is that we do a review, people aren't confident in the results, and the issue continues to burn -- no pun intended here, but the issue continues to smolder in the background. I think if we do this right at the outset, then people will have confidence in the results, and we can move on.

I think it's incredibly important that a review be focused on systemic change, not finding individual fault and blame. I don't think there's a huge amount of value to be found in individual fault. Individuals within a system act in their role, and the role often dictates how action takes place. So if we have an ineffective system and we replace individuals within that system, I strongly believe that individuals would continue to make the same decisions if the system itself does not change. The system dictates action. It is very difficult to escape this phenomenon.

An example I would give is the structure of this Assembly and the different sides that you see taken based on which side of the structure you end up on. The system often and the role dictates action.

In particular, Mr. Speaker, I think the most valuable information we need to get a clear picture of and recommendations for, and where I think the most confusion took place, was with interdepartmental, interagency, and intergovernmental coordination. This is where I've heard the most concerns and where I think the focus of a review needs to be. Governance in the GNWT is shifting, Mr. Speaker, where responsibility is being increasingly devolved to Indigenous governments. So we need to ensure recommendations also focus on this unique governance structure in the NWT and its implications for emergency management.

I think it is fair to acknowledge that many aspects of the evacuations and response went well. A huge number of residents evacuated our territory safely. As my colleague eloquently noted, it is not clear the level to which this was due to coordination or luck. This, again, emphasizes the need for an objective review which can come in and help us get at these questions. And, again, as was so eloquently emphasized by my colleague from Yellowknife North, we need to focus on where people fell through the cracks; how we can prevent that from happening again. That's where I feel we need to be focusing a review.

I want to speak a little bit to lessons I've learned from this process that we've gone through and the process that we continue to go through as we're voting on this motion. I believe very strongly, and this was emphasized to me most strongly during your priority setting process last week, that this group is at its strongest when we come together as 19 individual MLAs. The lesson that I take from this is that I think we need to use Caucus more effectively. I've conveyed these thoughts to the Premier and colleagues.

I want to emphasize that relationships and collaboration are incredibly important to me, and I want us to continue to work together and change the way we work as need be to better facilitate consensus-based decision-making.

I want to speak a little bit to, you know, something that is a bit of a passion of mine, conflict theory, and the differences between healthy and destructive conflict. There have been times in this Assembly where destructive conflict has created a lot of division, and that is something that I heard from residents when I was going door to door in this election, that they want to see professionalism and they want to see the MLAs focused on doing good work. One thing that I have not seen during this debate is destructive interpersonal dynamics.

Rather, what was has taken place is a respectful and substantial public debate on an important decision regarding how review of government takes place. This, Mr. Speaker, is exactly the kind of conversation we should be having in this House. It's a healthy discussion. It's an important discussion. This is how representative democracy works, and I think it's working well in this case. And I thank my colleagues for the respectful level of discourse that I've seen in this House from the day we got elected. I think we're doing a great job in that respect, and I really appreciate it.

I want to speak a little bit to the events themselves. Facing the circumstances that we did, I think it would be unfair to expect that everything would have gone perfectly. I want to refer back to the briefing I spoke to with staff. We had staff come in and explain to us how the event went down, and you know, what it was like being first responders. And what really struck me is the level to which this was a much bigger and more challenging fire season than anything we've experienced before is really humbling and scary when you step back and look at it.

The word "unprecedented" was used so much last summer that it became a trope, but there is no other word to describe what happened. The NWT has never faced anything like what happened last summer. During that briefing, I reflected on this summer and the fact that until that moment I don't think that I had realized I hadn't taken the time to consider how much the events had affected me, what it felt like to fear for the safety of my family. And I was very lucky that that fear was short lived and much less consequential than others. I can't begin to imagine, Mr.

Speaker, what it felt like to lose a home, to evacuate and later receive news that your community had burned.

Mr. Speaker, I can't imagine what it would have been like to be on the ground as frontline staff and firefighters and have the weight of responding to this event, of protecting communities on your shoulders, and how it might feel to have to make the call to pull back from the fire to protect human life and know this would result in lost homes. A lot of frontline staff came away traumatized, demoralized, and it's really important that they not be forgotten here.

And it's important for me to emphasize that we and the public deeply appreciate the difficult and dangerous work our frontline staff engage in to keep us safe. So, again, Mr. Speaker, I want to reemphasize that systemic failures are what need to be the focus here, not individual fault, and that is what I really hope comes from this review. I hope that the parameters that are put on the review ensure that this happens.

Again, I would speak to the establishment order in ensuring that the parameters in that order are gotten right, and I think that the way that this motion has been constructed is to ensure that there's collaboration on that establishment order and that there's contribution and public discussion about it to ensure that the parameters are just right, that we get this thing right, that we're not focused on the wrong things.

So to conclude, Mr. Speaker, I am voting in favour of this motion because we need a fully independent review of the incidents, most importantly to learn from them and to ensure we are prepared when we face challenges like this in the future. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 176

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Frame Lake . To the motion. Member from Sahtu .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 177

Daniel McNeely

Sahtu

In the spirit of what my colleagues are saying here, we're not to point fingers or put blame but learn from it; learn from decisions that were being made. This is learning by examples on developing your experienced skills so in the future you can make proper decisions from the experience you had. Now, having an independent third party with a different set of lens will share the views of a thorough third party investigation, if you want to use that word. But I'm sympathetic -- not sympathetic, I'm in total support of this motion for those reasons. We don't want to put blame.

We want to learn from it and want to move on. And this Assembly, I think, is seeded with reputable leaders to do just that. Now there's other incidental costs that might come in effect, but that's part of the job we're here to do.

So in saying that, Mr. Speaker, mahsi, I will be supporting this motion to simply restore trust and show the people that we are here, we heard them, we fully understand. And I just wish to say God bless them, and I hope that they don't have traumatized nightmares moving forward. Mahsi.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 177

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from the Sahtu . To the motion. Member from Mackenzie Delta .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

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Page 177

George Nerysoo

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I too will be supporting this motion. Although the communities of the Mackenzie Delta haven't been directly impacted, watching these scenes on the television is pretty dramatic, seeing that long line of people waiting in the hot sun. Because when I say some of these weren't directly impacted, there was an elderly couple that came to Yellowknife during that evacuation process and when they were in Yellowknife for medical, they got medevaced and being medevaced, the family members from Aklavik could not find them. They had no idea where they were.

They were searching, trying to phone, and in the meantime they were in Calgary. A few days later they were reported found in Calgary. So the elderly ladies themselves did not know where they were. So it's this kind of stories that you hear, and the region was completely shut down because the government was shut down. They had people that were supposed to go on medical travel, people that were supposed to go on other appointments, but due to the government being shut down these individuals were not able to keep their appointments.

So although the region of Mackenzie Delta was not directly impacted, we felt the heartbreak of the people that were directly in this position, not placed in this position, but we felt how dramatic it was for them and we hope that, you know, it never happened to the people of the Northwest Territories again. And so for that reason, I will be supporting this motion. Thank you.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

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Page 177

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you. Thank you, Member from Mackenzie Delta . To the motion. Member from Thebacha .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

Motions

Page 177

Jay MacDonald

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the idea of a public review of the events from the 2023 wildfire season has been top of mind for me from early days from when I started the end of my work with environment and climate change in the fire program into my campaign for MLA as I was elected to this House and as I became Minister of Environment and Climate Change .

One of the things that I want to emphasize today is I want to stand here and thank all of the people and the personnel and the firefighters and the GNWT staff who gave up so much through this event. They gave up time with their families. They spent days on the road, sleeping in tents in some instances, in the smoke, day after day. Mr. Speaker, this level of commitment was outstanding. There were single moms that left their small children at home in order to fulfill these roles.

We had many elders that were long retired from the fire program that came out to support this event, that put their boots on and went back to work for weeks and weeks at a time. Our children and our grandchildren were on the fire line protecting our communities and ensuring that we had homes to go back to and that we were safe. These things are so critical to building trust in the Northwest Territories.

I want to relay and build on that a little bit, and I just want to talk a little bit about a couple of personal stories that I have from the summer of 2023 and my involvement in the frontlines of the fire program and in ensuring that, you know, all of the communities were protected. And I want to tell a story about a young man from Ontario who was in Fort Smith -- or in Hay River on deployment. And one day on the fire line, he was struck by a falling tree which split his helmet, his protective helmet, in half. That young man was sent out in a medevac. He went down to Edmonton. He got an MRI.

He got checked out by a doctor. Three days later, he was told that he was good, he was okay, and he was fine to come back to work. On the fourth day, he was standing in front of me asking for a new helmet. That level of dedication is unprecedented in how people want to protect these communities and the level of dedication that they have to these programs.

I want to also say that sitting in a role in the wildfire management program, especially in a senior role where you're expected to make decisions day after day, instance after instance, you know, in those scenarios the people that take those roles have to make a decision. They're sitting in a seat that requires them to provide guidance to the rest of the staff and to the rest of the personnel. And all you can do when you're sitting in that chair -- and I can speak from experience -- is make the best decision that you can based on the information you have at the time.

You can look back and say oh, I should have done this or I should have done that, and hindsight is 20/20 all the time, but when you're sitting there making that decision you're doing the best for the community or the person or the territory based on the information you have. And I think that really provides context for how we move forward and how we look at a public review of the processes and what we can put in place to ensure that those processes are improved.

Mr. Speaker, I've spoken about this numerous times since my election to MLA and prior to that in my role with environment and climate change and also in my role as deputy mayor of the town of Fort Smith. I was part of the community leadership. I sat as the acting mayor for a while, while I was also working with ECC. I was involved in some of the decision-making in that process. And part of that process, I recognized the level of trauma that many of the residents of the Northwest Territories faced and still face to this day. It was a traumatizing experience for a lot of people.

But keep in mind that it was also a traumatizing experience for a lot of staff. You know, these folks faced this day in day out. They were there weeks at a time working through these, making the best decisions they could based on the information they had at the time.

You know, the wildland firefighting community in Canada is a very small one. In 2023, we lost seven firefighters, and one of our own here in the Northwest Territories. Adam Yeadon was killed by a falling tree while protecting his community in Fort Liard. And this is not something that I speak of lightly because it is something that is very personal to me and it hits close to my heart, Mr. Speaker.

Over the last summer, in 2023, the conditions were unprecedented. The indices were off the chart. The drought code was off the chart. We were having weather events like we'd never experienced before. Wind, high temperatures. It was a whole another climate than what we've been used to in the past. These were experienced all across Canada, Mr. Speaker. Four provinces in Canada had unprecedented events. Nova Scotia lost 200 homes and had thousands of people evacuated. British Columbia had 80 times their normal burn -- amount of forest burn in a year.

Alberta had ten times their normal forest burns and they lost multiple homes, and they evacuated 38,000 people. None of these incidents in other parts of Canada resulted in a public inquiry. What they've resulted in is after-action reviews and expanded processes that look at what we're doing in the fire and emergency preparedness system and how those processes can be improved to make things better as we move forward.

We experienced some of the worst possible conditions in 2023, and this was the first time, the first time, that a home in a community was ever lost to wildfire in the Northwest Territories. There have been cabins, there have been things on the landscape that have burnt previously, but this is the first time a home was ever lost. That in itself, Mr. Speaker, has an impact on the staff at environment and climate change, on the first responders that attempt to protect these communities and protect these homes.

Mr. Speaker, I'd like to speak a little bit about the difference between an inquiry and an after-action review. An inquiry, when I hear the word "inquiry", right away my mind goes to punitive and that an inquiry is about, you know, ensuring that we have someone to point a finger at the end of the day

whereas I look at an after-action review as a process of looking at the past to ensure that we can use it to inform the future, to make sure that, you know, that we're growing as a community, as an organization, overall to ensure that we provide the best service to the residents of the Northwest Territories.

Mr. Speaker, I've discussed this with many constituents, some of which were directly impacted by this event and are still struggling with the inability to be able to tell their story, to be part of a public process. You know, in these conversations I've also spoken with some Indigenous leaders that their communities were directly impacted. And in these conversations, they've said -- I've explained the difference between a public inquiry, and I've explained the potential possible ways we can move forward with a public after-action third-party review that's separate from government. And I'll tell you, Mr.

Speaker, the response I got reflected the fact that at the end of the day, these people want to be heard, they want their story to be told, they want it to be done in a public way, they want to ensure that the past informs the future and that those things that come out of a public review are used to ensure that as we move forward we have better systems, we have better communications, we have better processes in place. It's not about saying that it was this person's fault or that person's fault. It's about ensuring that as we moved forward as a territory, we create a much better environment for everyone.

Mr. Speaker, we've heard the word "trust" many times in this Assembly over the last number of days and weeks. And, Mr. Speaker, the residents of the Northwest Territories put trust in 19 Members of this Assembly to become the government and to run this operation going forward. The 19 Members of this Assembly put trust in the Premier and Cabinet to do the same thing, Mr. Speaker.

So as we move forward and we consider this motion, I suggest that we put trust in the process and that we allow the public to participate in third party after-action reviews, and after those are complete we look at the results of those, and if at that point we're still not satisfied that we've met the needs of the people, that we've answered the questions that have been asked, then let's have a conversation about a public inquiry. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

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Page 178

The Speaker

Shane Thompson

Thank you, Member from Thebacha . To the motion. Member from Yellowknife Centre .

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Motion to amend Motion 9-20(1): Establishing a Public Inquiry into the 2023 Wildfires - Safe Disclosure, Carried

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Page 178

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there's so much to talk about and we're given less than 20 minutes to talk about it. And part of this is about the conversation. I mean, the morose public continues to go through this process, and they want their chance. They're pining to be heard, Mr. Speaker. They want to be involved. They need to be involved. And for that I want to thank the public. The public interest has been on this since day one. There's been no shortage of interest and certainly input from the public, Mr. Speaker. And, you know, we can attempt to name some.

We'd like to highlight who have done their parts, and we mention those folks who have offered insight and guidance. We inevitably miss a few people, but I would like to note two before I continue.

I would like to thank publicly Shawn Dean for writing -- sending out this message, writing in the paper, speaking to CBC, about the structure and the process. His insight is invaluable to how things go. At the same time, I'd also like to thank former Member Mr. O'Reilly from Frame Lake. His information, thoughtful advice, details. It was very important to the work we do here and I think in my ways we wouldn't be half as strong without his insight so thank you, sir, for that. And in many ways, you know, I think the public in its own way is still owed a bit of an apology of what they lived through.

Sometimes it's not about individual wrongs but it's about collectiveness about supporting them. They lived through a traumatic event. I mean, we've heard it so many times. Two-thirds of the territorial population was evacuated. They were told to leave; it wasn't a suggestion. It wasn't like hey, if you're not doing anything this weekend, leave. No, it was like fire and brimstone; you have to go. And we have to take that into account.

And, Mr. Speaker, I think what doesn't get underscored through this whole process is something critically important, fundamentally important, that the 19th Assembly didn't do everything wrong. I mean that. Yes, I can be tough on government, and I plan to continue to. But that said, in all fairness they didn't do everything wrong. As a matter of fact they did wonderful things meeting the expectations of the public. They tried their best. They did their best in many things. It's not about finding someone to account as an individual. This is a process. I mean, I'm not hearing one person on this side of the