Debates of Oct. 3rd, 2003

This is page numbers 1181 - 1214 of the Hansard for the 14th Assembly, 6th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was know .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Mourning The Loss Of Canadian Soldiers

Status Of The Deh Cho Bridge Project

Minister Absent From The House

Addressing Core Social Issues In NWT Communities

Qualification For Home Energy Efficiency Program

Addressing Alcohol And Drug Addiction In The Nwt

Approval Of Dental Services And Travel

Resource Revenue Sharing And Devolution

Workplace Safety And The Young Worker Program

12th Annual Run For The Cure

Congratulations To High School Graduate Amy Miersch

Housing For Persons With Disabilities

The Need To Rescind The Revised Business Incentive Policy

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Available Dental Services And Travel

Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Alcohol And Drug Treatment Services In The North Slave

Revised Business Incentive Policy Savings Estimate

Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Status Of The Community Dust Control Program

Mental Health And Alcohol And Drug Workers

Revert To Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Expression Of Gratitude To Clerk David M. Hamilton For Dedicated And Exemplary Service

To Amend Rule 85(4) Of The Rules Of The Legislative Assembly

To Amend Rule 70(1) Of The Rules Of The Legislative Assembly

Expression Of Gratitude To Clerk David M. Hamilton For Dedicated And Exemplary Service

Bill 34: Tlicho Land Claims And Self-government Agreement Act

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Bill 26: Youth Justice Act

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Bill 20: Forgiveness Of Debts Act, 2003-2004

Bill 23:

An Act To Amend The Safety Act

Bill 27:

An Act To Amend The Access To Information And Protection Of Privacy Act

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Honourable Roger Allen , Honourable Jim Antoine , Mr. Bell , Mr. Braden , Mr. Delorey , Mr. Dent , Mrs. Groenewegen , Honourable Joe Handley , Honourable Stephen Kakfwi , Mr. Krutko , Mr. Lafferty , Ms. Lee , Honourable Michael Miltenberger , Mr. Nitah , Mr. Roland , Honourable Vince Steen , Honourable Tony Whitford

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---Prayer

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 1181

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Good morning. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The chair recognizes the honourable Premier .

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Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1181

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

May I request permission to go ahead with an emergency statement?

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Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1181

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

The Premier is seeking permission to proceed with an emergency statement. Mr. Premier .

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Member's Statement 86-14(6): Mourning The Loss Of Canadian Soldiers

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1181

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, Members, on Thursday morning, two Canadian soldiers died when their jeep hit a land mine in Kabul, Afghanistan. The soldiers were part of Canada's peacekeeping mission in that country.

Gone are Sergeant Robert Alan Short and Corporal Robbie Christopher Beerenfenger.

We mourn the loss of these two brave young Canadians serving our country to bring peace to the world. We grieve for their families, friends and comrades. In recognition of their lives and the cause of peace which they served, I ask for a moment of silence.

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Member's Statement 86-14(6): Mourning The Loss Of Canadian Soldiers

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1181

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Please rise.

---Moment of Silence

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Member for Weledeh , Mr. Handley .

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Minister's Statement 87-14(6): Status Of The Deh Cho Bridge Project

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1181

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today I would like to give the Members of the Assembly a progress report on the Deh Cho Bridge project. I am pleased to say that progress to complete this P3, a private/public partnership, agreement is proceeding very well. A finished agreement, including a final, fixed price, could be concluded as soon as the next three to six weeks.

The Assembly will recall that the Fort Providence Combined Council Alliance first approached this government in February 2002 with its proposal to build and operate a bridge at Fort Providence over the Mackenzie River. The Government examined the proposal to determine its basic feasibility and was satisfied that it was indeed a viable proposal. The Department of Transportation was directed to take the lead to work with the alliance to develop a more detailed and definitive arrangement.

On November 15th last year, the Government of the Northwest Territories and the Fort Providence alliance committed to a memorandum of intent that laid out the framework and process involved with forming a public/private partnership for the purpose of building and operating the Deh Cho Bridge.

Since last November, the Deh Cho Bridge Corporation and the Department of Transportation have tackled systematically the many engineering, land tenure, regulatory, financial and legal issues surrounding the bridge project.

I am sure, Mr. Speaker, that the Members will appreciate that the agreement or, more accurately, the multiple inter-connected agreements are complex and demand patient attention to detail. Although complicated enough in itself, we are not just working out a contract to cover the initial construction of the bridge. This is a long-term operational partnership as well. The agreement must define the respective roles and responsibilities of the parties that will continue over the 35 years of the repayment period, long after construction has finished.

On its part, the 14th Legislative Assembly enacted the Deh Cho Bridge Act conferring the necessary legal authorities for the government to enter into the contemplated public/private partnership.

If we are able to finish the partnership agreement over the next several weeks, according to the construction schedule, we can look forward to the Deh Cho Bridge carrying its first traffic two years from now in the fall of 2005. Won't that be a spectacular occasion! Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Minister's Statement 87-14(6): Status Of The Deh Cho Bridge Project

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1181

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Premier , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Minister's Statement 88-14(6): Minister Absent From The House

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1181

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, I wish to advise Members that the Honourable Jake Ootes will be absent from the House today to attend to a personal matter. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 88-14(6): Minister Absent From The House

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1181

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Item 2, Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta , Mr. Krutko .

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Addressing Core Social Issues In NWT Communities

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1181

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my statement today is around the whole area of core programs and program delivery on behalf of this government. Mr. Speaker, the frustration we have in our small communities is the lack of capable support staff in our communities; people who assist people with problems.

I heard the Minister of Health and Social Services with regard to a statement he made to the Native Women's Association. He stated there are four core problems that we have in the Northwest Territories: we don't eat right; we drink too much; we smoke too much; and, we do not exercise enough.

Mr. Speaker, it's great for the Minister to state that, but in most of our communities, we realize that alcoholism and abuse of other things such as drugs and also the effects of being unemployed and living on income support is a core problem in our communities.

This government knows without having people in the communities to assist when someone wants to go to an alcohol and drug program..... The frontline worker is the first person you want to see. It's either the mental health workers, the alcohol and drug worker, or the nurse, or a doctor to assist you to deal with these core problems. Yet, for the Minister to stand out there and say well, if you just quit doing these things it's going to disappear; well, it isn't.

This government has a responsibility to ensure that we have alcohol and drug workers in our communities. I raised a question in this House going on five months ago about a problem in Aklavik where they do not have an alcohol and drug worker. It's going on two years now that they have not had that position filled. Yet the Minister can stand out there and make it sound like these problems, if we just snap our fingers, are going to disappear. But they aren't going to disappear.

This Minister has a responsibility to ensure that the core problem programs in our communities are funded by the dollars that are allocated to those programs, and to ensure that people are in those positions to assist people in our communities so that they can access core projects such as being able to go to an alcohol and drug treatment program. Before you're even allowed to get an application in, you have to take so many weeks of counselling and prepare yourself to go to a treatment centre. Yet this Minister is totally unaware of what goes on in small communities.

I would like to ask the Minister a few questions later on with regard to questions I asked almost four months ago. Maybe I'll have to address them again. With that, Mr. Speaker, I will ask the Minister of Health and Social Services questions that I've asked time and time again with no response.

---Applause

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Addressing Core Social Issues In NWT Communities

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1182

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River North , Mr. Delorey .

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Qualification For Home Energy Efficiency Program

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1182

Paul Delorey

Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today on an issue that was brought to my attention by a constituent of mine. The issue I refer to, Mr. Speaker, is the apparent inability of people who reside outside of Yellowknife to qualify for a relatively new program, the federal government program called a home energy efficiency retrofit grant.

Mr. Speaker, this grant is provided by Natural Resources Canada and is designed to encourage homeowners, particularly those who have older homes in need of energy efficiency upgrades, to retrofit their homes in order to make them more energy efficient. Mr. Speaker, in order to qualify, a homeowner must have the EnerGuide for homes evaluation done, and have followed up on the evaluator's recommendations prior to receiving any grant money.

Mr. Speaker, my understanding is that there is only one organization in the NWT that can perform the EnerGuide evaluations, that being the Arctic Energy Alliance. Therein lies the problem, Mr. Speaker. I believe that there are no EnerGuide evaluators in any northern communities other than Yellowknife.

Mr. Speaker, there is only a relatively small number of households that can qualify for any government program as it is due to income thresholds, et cetera. I would like to think, Mr. Speaker, that Northerners would not be excluded from a government program simply because of where they are geographically located. In other words, their proximity to Yellowknife.

Mr. Speaker, it is my understanding that Arctic Energy Alliance is funded by this government and will ultimately be funded by taxpayers. Given this, I would think that surely the Arctic Energy Alliance would do everything in their power to provide services to all communities outside of Yellowknife. After all, the organization's name is Arctic Energy Alliance, not Yellowknife Energy Alliance. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Qualification For Home Energy Efficiency Program

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1182

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Delorey . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for North Slave , Mr. Lafferty

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Addressing Alcohol And Drug Addiction In The Nwt

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1182

Leon Lafferty

North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. On Tuesday my colleague, Mr. Braden , drew attention to the dwindling number of facilities to address alcohol and drug treatment in the Territories. As part of his response, the Minister of Health and Social Services stated that "we will spend all the money we have and the millions and millions of dollars to deal with the issue of addictions and the results of the ravages of alcohol. But really and truly, the fundamental choice is how do we get people to make that personal choice so that we can in fact deal with the prevention at the community level."

Mr. Speaker, I would first like to point out that, despite the Minister's words to the opposite, we have not even come close to spending all the money we have to deal with addictions. In reality, the government is scrambling to fund addiction workers, never mind providing prevention programs or facilities. There is, by no stretch of the imagination, a serious effort to address addictions in the territory.

Mr. Speaker, the next point I would like to address is the Minister's comment that the fundamental issue is the personal choice people make to drink. I agree, but I think there is more to this story.

Let us compare creating a healthy lifestyle to learning to read. When a person wants to learn to read, he doesn't just pick up a book and that's the end of the story. Even though he has made the choice to read, he needs to learn some basic skills; things such as the alphabet, how letters are strung together to make words and so forth. Similarly, someone might want to live a healthy lifestyle but they need help in learning how.

In my region, people have been asking for years for help in dealing with their addictions. To simply say it's your choice, don't drink, would be like telling someone to just pick up a book and start reading. It just doesn't work.

Mr. Speaker, there have been countless studies done over the years. At the end of these studies, we learned what we knew before the studies were done: that addiction is the number one social problem in the Northwest Territories and people want help in learning how to create healthy lifestyles. Mr. Speaker, if we are serious about addressing it, I think we should find models of success. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Addressing Alcohol And Drug Addiction In The Nwt

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1183

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake , Mr. Roland .

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Approval Of Dental Services And Travel

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1183

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to rise today to speak on an issue that one of our honourable colleagues raised in this House since we started session, and it's in the area of dental work and travel associated with that, Mr. Speaker. I know that, for example, all the approvals and the programming that is set up is set up by the federal government, and it was pulled back from this government a couple of years ago. People have to now see the dentist and have some work done and there are pictures and so on; X-rays are sent to government people in Ottawa to approve or disapprove of certain work.

But, Mr. Speaker, we're finding ourselves in an increasingly more difficult position when a dentist cannot do certain work in a community; that being some oral surgery and the dentist says we cannot provide it. I've got an example in Inuvik, Mr. Speaker, where an individual has gone in and said they cannot do the work in Inuvik, and as well cannot be referred here to Yellowknife because they're unable to do that surgery here. So the next place would be in Edmonton, Alberta.

Mr. Speaker, when that person is told this is what can be done, they go to start following through with it and they find out that surgery can be done in Edmonton but that individual will have to be responsible for the flight out. Mr. Speaker, it is already difficult in the Northwest Territories to travel around with the cost of travelling.

So knowing that that issue has been raised and the Member has asked the Minister in this House to look at it, I would also like to add my support behind that initiative as to what can we do for our residents in the Northwest Territories when all the support service in the North say that we can't do it in the North and we must do it in another jurisdiction but it is on their own tab.

Mr. Speaker, somebody in Ottawa might think that a pearly white smile is just for movie stars, but in fact, Mr. Speaker, when somebody's mouth starts to deteriorate and requires surgery, then I think that's something a little more serious than having to tell them that maybe we can pull your teeth. In fact, even in this situation, because this situation is serious, pulling the teeth would still not be done in the community of Inuvik. The dentists have said they can't do that. So, Mr. Speaker, I will have appropriate questions for the appropriate Minister. Thank you.

---Applause

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Approval Of Dental Services And Travel

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1183

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Frame Lake , Mr. Dent .

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Resource Revenue Sharing And Devolution

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1183

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we're told that the NWT economy has increased by 30 percent in the last three years.

---Applause

So we have the fastest-growing economy in Canada, and that's good news for Northerners looking for work. In fact, it's great news for the overall economy, with lots of high-salary mining jobs and many more jobs in northern businesses that provide goods and services to northern mines.

Mr. Speaker, the news is similarly good in areas of oil and gas. It's maybe not as busy this year as last, but the outlook is extremely positive for jobs and economic growth, with the pipeline appearing to be not too far over the horizon. The overall economy is good. Unemployment is low and job participation rates in the Northwest Territories are higher than in other areas of Canada. The jobs created by mining have provided opportunities and stability to the Northwest Territories that would not otherwise exist.

But with people in Yellowknife walking away from their homes and mortgages only five or six years ago, it's not hard to see how important the jobs we get from mining are in the territory.

So, Mr. Speaker, we have the hottest economy in Canada right now because of diamond mining and oil and gas activity, but as Mr. Handley pointed out earlier this week, our government is in danger of going bankrupt. You've heard the phrase no pain no gain, well, resource development in the North means that this government gets all the pain but very little gain.

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Resource Revenue Sharing And Devolution

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1183

An Hon. Member

Shame.

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Resource Revenue Sharing And Devolution

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1183

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

How can this be? Because we don't get royalties and most of the tax increases are clawed back by the federal government. So our net fiscal benefit from the development of natural resources doesn't even cover our government's costs. These costs include our highway infrastructure taking a beating from significantly increased traffic; the social costs when development has a negative impact on our communities and families; and the increased need for training and education.

Mr. Speaker, with diamond mines being so profitable, I've heard some who suggest we could solve our money problems if we brought in a mining tax. That might get us some extra money for a year or even three. But with every new formula financing deal we sign with Ottawa, they seem to claw back most new revenues. So tax increases or new taxes are not the long-term solution.

Perhaps in the near term, we need to look for other ways to ensure development benefits Northerners. For instance, maybe we need to explore the possibility of ensuring developers help us fund training programs. In the long run, though, Northerners deserve a fair share of the proceeds from resource development in our territory.

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Resource Revenue Sharing And Devolution

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1183

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you. The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his Member's statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays, Mr. Dent , conclude.

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Resource Revenue Sharing And Devolution

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1184

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, honourable Members. Mr. Speaker, I have supported the Premier and the Minister of Finance in their efforts the past four years in trying to get a fair deal with Ottawa. When the 15th Assembly takes office, we will miss Premier Kakfwi's passionate voice calling on Ottawa to get moving, and his eloquent fight for a fair share of the royalties flowing from our natural resources. I was pleased to hear the Premier say that he will continue to fight for a deal until and after his last day as Premier .

Mr. Speaker, we need to plan for when we win the fight with Ottawa. We need to begin to look at what appropriate royalty rates are so we are prepared to step in quickly; rates that balance the encouragement of responsible development with a fair return for the depletion of our natural resources. Mr. Speaker, when we come back together in the 15th Assembly, we must be prepared to continue to push the federal government to move quickly on an agreement for devolution that includes a resource-royalty-sharing agreement that will truly allow a net fiscal benefit for the people of the Northwest Territories. Mr. Speaker, winning this argument must be our first priority. Thank you.

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Resource Revenue Sharing And Devolution

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1184

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Workplace Safety And The Young Worker Program

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1184

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As our economy in the Northwest Territories changes, businesses -- particularly in the service industry -- are relying more and more on young workers under the age of 25. In the last three years, employment of these young workers has risen almost 10 percent. According to the Northwest Territories Bureau of Statistics labour force activity study in 2002, 84 percent of the workers are employed in the service industry. These young workers are less likely to be informed and aware of their rights and responsibilities on the job, particularly with respect to workplace safety.

The Workers' Compensation Board of the Northwest Territories and Nunavut has recognized this trend and has developed the workplace safety and the young worker program to take proactive steps to ensure that these young workers have the training they need to stay safe on the job and avoid workplace accidents. Workplace safety and the young worker program is a 25-hour course that young workers may take in the classroom or as a self-study, either as a CD-ROM or in traditional text format. It provides an introduction for new workers as to their rights and the basic safety issues they should be concerned about in the workplace.

Beyond the development of the course, the WCB has taken a variety of actions to make sure young workers, their parents, teachers and employers are aware of the program and the importance of teaching workplace safety practices at a young age. These actions include starting a workplace safety competition at the NWT/Nunavut skills competition and sending winners of this competition to the National Skills Canada competition where NWT and Nunavut students have won gold two years in a row. Becoming a Skills Canada partner can help ensure safe work practices become a part of all skills competitions.

They are sponsoring a safety video competition, which was won this year by Hay River's Kelvin Redvers, and encouraging northern employers to request safety and young worker training when hiring young workers.

The Hay River Northern Store, now known as Northmart, partnered with the WCB in 2002 to have all of their young employees trained in the program. Finally, Mr. Speaker, the WCB will be hosting a young worker safety conference in May of 2004. Safety is a way of life and through the young worker safety initiatives of the WCB, we are ensuring young Northerners get a good safe start in the workplace.

I would like to commend the Minister and the Workers' Compensation Board for this very impressive initiative. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Workplace Safety And The Young Worker Program

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1184

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Ms. Groenewegen . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Yellowknife South , Mr. Bell .

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12th Annual Run For The Cure

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1184

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it has been truly a beautiful week in the Northwest Territories weather wise. We've had unseasonably high temperatures throughout the week and we certainly hope that it continues right through the weekend Mr. Speaker, because as you know this weekend -- all the pink ribbons around the building would signify this -- is the 12th Annual Run for the Cure, sponsored by the Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce. They have done a big task this year, Mr. Speaker, and that is to better the job that this community and the Territories did last year.

Last year, the Northwest Territories raised over $200,000 for the Run for the Cure and as I mentioned last year in a statement, that bettered some larger cities in Southern Canada so I think we did a heck of a job. We are putting in a team again, as you know because you are on it Mr. Speaker. The L.A. Leggers will enter the Corporate Challenge again; there are a number of Members who are on the team and a lot of staff members. I know the Premier has signed up this year along with a number of Ministers.

I think our top fundraiser so far in the building is Heather Riviere, but the challenge is on us to chase her down and make sure that we can better the amount that she's got.

So Mr. Speaker, I'd like to remind everyone that breast cancer indeed affects all of our lives because it affects our mothers, our sisters, our daughters and our friends. Sadly, Mr. Speaker, an estimated 20,000 plus women will likely develop breast cancer in 2003. It is an important cause.

I hope everybody in the building, in the community and right across the Territories will get out this weekend and run for the cure. Thank you.

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12th Annual Run For The Cure

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1184

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Nitah .

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Congratulations To High School Graduate Amy Miersch

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1184

Steven Nitah

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi Cho, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise this morning to send congratulations to a constituent of mine, Amy Miersch, from Fort Resolution is going to celebrate her graduation this year. She graduated from grade 12 and is the only graduate from Fort Resolution. I will be going there to celebrate graduation with her this afternoon along with some of Mr. Ootes ' staff members and I would like to thank Mr. Ootes for making them available to me and to Amy and the people of Fort Resolution.

Education is important and Amy is a good role model for the students this year. I'd like to see more graduates in the Tu Nedhe riding. Mahsi Cho, Mr. Speaker, and congratulations, Amy.

---Applause

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Congratulations To High School Graduate Amy Miersch

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1185

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Mahsi, Mr. Nitah . Good news. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Great Slave , Mr. Braden .

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Housing For Persons With Disabilities

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1185

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. On September 17th, Mr. Speaker, a very important and informative forum was held here in Yellowknife called Solutions for Barrier-Free Housing. It was organized by the NWT Council of Persons with Disabilities, prompted by the actions of a number of self-advocates with that organization. Mr. Speaker, it was co-sponsored by our departments of Health and Social Services and the NWT Housing Corporation. Both of those departments, Mr. Speaker, have been very proactive on the issue of housing needs of persons with disabilities.

The self-advocates who helped with that forum were Cor Van Dyke, Lynn Cameron, Bill Burles, Doreen Baptiste, and they spoke very eloquently to the more than 50 people who attended of the different needs of the disabled when it comes to housing. The solutions go far beyond what many of us might have as the idea that well if we build wheelchair ramps and wider doorways we have looked after things, and that's only the beginning,

Mr. Speaker, an innovative survey went out to 300 people and there were 60 returns. It demonstrated that what we need to do is go far beyond those physical amenities and go into a number of far broader areas.

We identified three priorities in the course of the day, probably the most significant one was called social marketing and this is where the community of people with disabilities should be partnering with legislators, cities and municipalities and with builders and architects to establish those needs and find ways of making them happen and making them happen affordably. This of course will help to stimulate the increase in the number of units that will hopefully be built because there will be a market.

Mr. Speaker, we also want to take a very close look at the financial incentives and disincentives that we have in our income support system, in our health care system, that affect the lives of the disabled. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Housing For Persons With Disabilities

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1185

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Braden . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Range Lake , Ms. Lee .

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The Need To Rescind The Revised Business Incentive Policy

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1185

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I would like to make a special point of reiterating the importance of the government rescinding and revisiting the changes being proposed to the BIP. Mr. Speaker, yesterday we debated a formal motion in the House and it was unanimously agreed by every Member on this side of the House that the government should not go ahead with these suggestions. Mr. Speaker, yesterday everyone -- and there are 11 of us on this side -- voted for that motion.

Mr. Speaker, you are aware this doesn't happen very often where all Members in this House agree on one idea. I believe, Mr. Speaker, that speaks to the very seriousness of this matter and the need for the government to reconsider. This also speaks to the fact that government has failed to meet the minimum standard to get the support needed in this House, never mind a majority or even a genuine consensus, but that every Member in this house has a concern about the proposed changes. In the end, Mr. Speaker, I believe it is ultimately about what the people in the communities are saying because we are here to represent our communities.

The business communities have been consistent in their position for three years. They have the right to ask if the government fails to adhere to our advice by way of the motion, what more do they have to do, Mr. Speaker? In a democratic system, what more do people have to do when they do the right thing by presenting their facts, presenting their cases, participating in the consultation process, and convincing every Member of this House on their position and then to have the government fail to act on that advice. I just want to reiterate Mr. Speaker, that the government take the advice of this House seriously and do the right thing and revisit the policy. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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The Need To Rescind The Revised Business Incentive Policy

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1185

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Ms. Lee . As Speaker, I have to sometimes point out some of the rules, perhaps, that reflect on some of the things that we do. It is not often applied, however, that in Member's statement Members should not reflect upon previous votes of the Assembly, except for the purposes of moving that it be rescinded. Perhaps you can touch on it briefly but not for long periods of time. This is just a little cautionary note for other Members who may be thinking along those lines.

Item 3, Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta , Mr. Krutko .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1185

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

I'd like to recognize, Mr. Lee Selleck from CBC.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1185

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Weledeh , Mr. Handley .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1185

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Mr. Speaker, I too would like to recognize Lee Selleck. I believe he is my constituent, as well. Thank you.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1185

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1185

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I would like to recognize two Grade 8 students from Diamond Jenness Secondary School in Hay River who have been serving us this week in the House. They are Cassidy Mapes and Amanda Tybring. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Any other recognition of visitors in the gallery? I'd just like to say welcome to the people that do come to visit the Assembly on a daily basis and I hope you enjoy your visit here with us.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Great Slave , Mr. Braden .

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Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question this morning is for Mr. Allen , the Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation. It concerns the status of the Somba K'e Healing Lodge just outside the community of Dettah in the Yellowknife region. Mr. Speaker, the lodge has gone into disuse in the last couple of years. Our government continues to hold a mortgage on this property and I would like to ask the Minister, what is the status of the Somba K'e Healing Lodge, especially in respect of the urgent need for a community alcohol and drug treatment facilities? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Braden . The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger . Excuse me, Mr. Braden , may I ask you again whom you directed that question to, I missed that.

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Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question was directed to Minister Allen of the NWT Housing Corporation. Thank you.

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Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Braden . It was the chair's error. The honourable Minister responsible for Housing and Justice, Mr. Allen .

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Return To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Roger Allen

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. At the moment, the facility is closed down. It is currently being maintained. We are entertaining some proposals from various interest groups to see if we can assist them with the reopening of the Somba K'e Healing Lodge. Thank you.

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Return To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Braden .

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Supplementary To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. With respect to the confidentiality of any business negotiations that might be underway, could the Minister advise whether proposals are being entertained from agencies involved in alcohol and drug treatment? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Braden . The honourable Minister of Justice , Mr. Allen .

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Further Return To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Roger Allen

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. At this moment I don't have any specific details as to what proposals are being submitted and from whom, but again, I believe there is a willingness from the NWT Housing Corporation to entertain any proposal that we may get the facility back in operation. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Braden .

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Supplementary To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, are we actively soliciting proposals for the use of this facility for any nature or is it ad hoc as people are interested: just what is our process for looking at this. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Braden . The honourable Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation , Mr. Allen .

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Further Return To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Roger Allen

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Our personal interest at this point is trying to liquidate the mortgage owed on the unit. Certainly, I want to entertain any proposal that is viable and feasible at this point and hopefully entertain those proposals that can afford to operate the facility. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Your final supplementary, Mr. Braden .

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Supplementary To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Mr. Speaker, my information is that the mortgage that we are holding is somewhere in the neighbourhood of 2.7 million dollars, it is quite a piece of change. Is there any time line on making a decision that the government is looking at? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Braden . The honourable Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation , Mr. Allen .

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Further Return To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

Roger Allen

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. No, the most recent information from the Housing Corporation officials was that they were still trying to find a method to deal with those proposals and see how we can best address that at this point. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Question 367-14(6): Status Of The Somba K'e Healing Lodge

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta , Mr. Krutko .

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Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1186

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Minister of Health and Social Services . It is with regard to the shortage of alcohol and drug workers in our communities and also the ability of communities to build capacity in the area of mental health and trying to ensure that the alcohol and drug programs are being delivered in our communities. I would like to ask the Minster, a letter I received basically stating that commencing in September 2003, which was last month, that they were going to start advertising for different positions in the regions.

I would like to ask the Minister exactly where are we in ensuring the community of Aklavik that we are going to try to have someone in place to deliver alcohol and drug programs? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Return To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my information is that this week, staff from the Inuvik Health and Social Services Authority were to travel, or have traveled in to Aklavik to meet with the community to see if they could reach a consensus on how best to proceed with the permanent staffing of the position of a community wellness worker whose duties will include the alcohol and drug function. Thank you.

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Return To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it is great that the government comes to our communities every once in a while and has meetings with us, but that is not my question. My question is when is this government going to fill those positions, which funding has been approved for through this legislature to be directed to those communities to have the mental health alcohol and drug workers in place to provide that service in our communities?

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Supplementary To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we are engaged in a collaborative process with the territorial government, the regional governments, the communities and the people of the communities to provide services. This is not a case of myself as Minister sitting in my office and dictating what is going to take place. We work with this Assembly to do business plans, to come up with how we are going to approach strategies for alcohol and drug and various other initiatives. In this case, there are resources there, there has been ongoing discussion with the community and the Inuvik Health and Social Services Authority.

I know the Member has raised this issue in the House extensively over the last few months. We have been trying to work to get that position staffed on a permanent basis. They are in the community this week and will hopefully reach an agreement so that they can in fact staff it. There have been new resources added to increase the pay and benefits for the workers across the Territories, that is retroactive to April 1st. So we have the resources, now our obligation is to work with the communities and the regional authority to come to a way to move ahead on this without any further delay. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it is pretty appalling when this government can't even hire an alcohol and drug worker. The money is there, so basically the opportunity for someone to fill that position is there. Why can't you just go out and advertise for a salary position for an alcohol and drug or mental health worker that you administer everywhere else in the larger centres? Why could you not advertise for that position?

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Supplementary To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, that is clearly an option and the direction that we in the majority of cases are moving. In the communities where there is no alcohol and drug worker that's an employee of the health and social services authority, we have to work out an arrangement with the community to see whether they will be a band employee, or whether it will work for the community, or whether in fact there will be a transfer, in this case, to the Inuvik Health and Social Services Authority. My understanding is that hopefully that is one of the issues that are going to finally be resolved in Aklavik this week.

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Further Return To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Your final supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it is pretty hard for a community to agree with the Minister's comments where it basically sounds more like excuses than really doing anything. I'd like to ask the Minister exactly how soon can the community of Aklavik ensure that we have a person in place to deliver programs and services, which presently the funding is sitting in Inuvik, which is being expended by the Inuvik health board but is not expended in the community of Aklavik. How soon can the person be in place to deliver these programs for the people of Aklavik?

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Supplementary To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, on the optimistic assumption that there has been a consensus reached between the Inuvik Health and Social Services Authority and the community of Aklavik, based on that agreement we should be able to proceed. The resources are there, the job description has been done and the job has been classified. All of the pieces are there to move on this. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Question 368-14(6): Alcohol And Drug Program Delivery In Aklavik

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake , Mr. Roland .

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Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1187

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question will be directed to the Minister of Health and Social Services in the area of my Member's statement on dental health. I know that he has addressed this in some responses to another Member in the area of travel that it is not permitted under medical travel for persons requiring dental work outside of their communities. I'd like to know from the Minister of Health and Social Services , what is available to residents that cannot get work done in their constituencies or communities? Thank you.

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Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Roland . The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Return To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there is, for NIHB clients, they are eligible to have travel costs recovered for emergency services if they have been referred out by a nurse or a dentist or a doctor. I know there is apparently some confusion over some of the latest correspondence that has come out of the department as a result of direction we received from NIHB. There have been clarifications subsequently sent out so there are travel costs for people referred out for emergency dental services through the NIHB program. Thank you.

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Return To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Roland .

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Supplementary To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think that would be good news for many residents. Is that open to all residents in the Northwest Territories, just for clarification? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Roland . The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the benefits under NIHB are open only to those that qualify as status Indians or Inuvialuit, Inuit. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Roland .

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Supplementary To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. What is available to people who don't qualify under NIHB? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Roland . The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, where there is a referral by a nurse or doctor or dentist, the travel policy applies. We've also made changes in June to close the gap for those people that aren't covered by third-party insurance, so that we have attempted to make sure that there is a benefit in this area for all the people of the Northwest Territories. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Your final supplementary, Mr. Roland .

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Supplementary To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. So if an individual who has been told that they cannot have services done in their community and is told that the services can be provided outside of their community and are referred by the dentist, their travel costs will be covered. Is that what the Minister stated? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Roland . The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, to the best of my knowledge, yes.

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Further Return To Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Question 369-14(6): Available Dental Services And Travel

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Frame Lake , Mr. Dent .

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Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Premier this morning. As Regular Members it is our job to hold Ministers accountable to ensure that there is fairness in the way which government resources, programs and services are distributed throughout the North on behalf of our constituents. We have acts, regulations and policies within which departments and Ministers are expected to act. A matter has been raised in the House by some of my colleagues with respect to fairness or the perception of fairness, particularly with the Minister responsible for Housing .

He has been questioned about a recent transaction or contribution to several residents of the Husky Trailer Park in Inuvik. Has the Premier made himself aware of the circumstances of this transaction?

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Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Dent . The honourable Premier , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Return To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the issue that was raised has been discussed with the Minister, yes.

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Return To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Supplementary, Mr. Dent .

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Supplementary To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I take it from that response, and I'll just ask the Premier to confirm, that he is satisfied that the Minister's conduct complies with the acts, the regulations and the principles of being seen to be fair?

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Supplementary To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Dent . The honourable Premier , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1188

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Housing Minister has acted according to existing rules and procedures. The issue for us has been around the amount of discretion that is granted to a Minister under the regulations, and we had a discussion amongst ourselves as Ministers and we have agreed we will review these rules and procedures to determine whether or not the present amount of discretion granted to a Minister should be addressed and tightened up. Appropriate action would be taken in the future to ensure that there will be no question as to whether a Minister has acted appropriately or not.

That is the action we are taking. We believe the issue was raised, Members raised the concern and it will be addressed. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Supplementary, Mr. Dent .

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Supplementary To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. From that answer, I get that there is concern on Cabinet about the amount of discretion that has been exercised here but that it fits within the policies. Is the Premier saying that he will follow up by making sure that this level of discretion can never be exercised again?

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Supplementary To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Dent . The honourable Premier , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it is understood that we are close to elections, there are always issues about the amount of discretion Ministers have but it is provided for in our legislation or regulations. From time to time, these issues arise and it is always important to us, I think, as a government to make sure that we have procedures and policies and guidelines to direct the actions and missions taken by department officials and, as much as possible, we should strive to make sure Ministerial discretion is not used for guidelines and suffice. We will address that and ensure that it does not happen again. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Your final supplementary, Mr. Dent .

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Supplementary To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in response to questions yesterday and according to unedited Hansard on page 2625, Minister Allen talked about the program that was used in Inuvik and said that it was a program that was used to assist those who were involuntarily forced to move. Mr. Speaker, I have a number of constituents, 26 families who may be forced to move in my constituency with the closure of Con Mine. The Minister responsible for Housing has said that this program might not apply to them because it is a different situation.

Will the Premier take a look to see whether or not these are the same criteria in my constituency so that my constituents could apply for the same program? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Dent . The honourable Premier , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have taken the lead as a Premier with Ministers on the Con Mine closure in addressing the needs of the employees and the residents. I will be coordinating appropriate responses to all matters relating to this issue including the one that was raised and, of course, those residents can apply to programs that we have. The whole intent was to make sure that we respond positively to the needs that arise out of the closing of Con Mine, and the issue about the residents and the trailer owners that are on Con Mine land is a huge issue and we will try to respond as positively as possible. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Question 370-14(6): Husky Trailer Park Lot Subsidies

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Hay River North , Mr. Delorey .

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Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

Paul Delorey

Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in my Member's statement I raised the issue of a potential for people not being able to qualify for the federal government grant for home energy and retrofit. As I stated, the homeowners have to have an energy guide evaluation done, and the only evaluators for this are based in Yellowknife under the offices of the Arctic Energy Alliance. I'd like to ask the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development if he would advise this House if he is aware of any energy guide evaluators based anywhere in the Northwest Territories other than Yellowknife. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Delorey . The honourable Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development , Mr. Antoine .

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Return To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the honourable Member raised a good point here. I think he has already gone over this program that is a Canadian government program. It is part of a program that outlines how Canada is going to meet the Kyoto protocol, so they introduced an energy efficiency retrofit for about 20 percent of the existing low-rise housing units by 2010. There is a program that they have introduced, so the federal department of Natural Resources Canada is responsible for this program and they have contracted the Arctic Energy Alliance to do this program.

They have hired one person that is stationed here in Yellowknife and currently has been doing Yellowknife only at this point in time. It is their responsibility to provide the program. We realize that there are other homeowners outside of Yellowknife and I think that the Member makes a really good point that we should raise with the program funders and the Arctic Energy Alliance. Thank you.

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Return To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Delorey .

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Supplementary To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1189

Paul Delorey

Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in correspondence with the Arctic Energy Alliance as to why evaluators can't be sent outside of Yellowknife, the reason was given that the Arctic Energy Alliance is not funded, they don't have travel funding. It is my understanding that the Arctic Energy Alliance is represented by just about every department in this government and that surely they could come up with some money to travel to outside communities to do home evaluations so that everybody can take

part in an energy program such as this. Would the Minister state why he can't have funding for that? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Delorey . The honourable Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development , Mr. Antoine .

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Further Return To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Arctic Energy Alliance is comprised of a number of core members and most of them are represented by different departments. Currently, they have been stationed here in Yellowknife, but this new program is a whole new program from NRCAN that is supposed to meet the conditions laid out in the program. The program funding to provide this program should come from NRCAN. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Delorey .

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Supplementary To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

Paul Delorey

Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have heard in this House a number of times that when we have taxpayers' dollars going into it, that it has to be introduced across the territory rather than only in one place. So I hear it all the time about Hay River trying to introduce a program there and it can't be done unless it is introduced right across the Territories. Does the Minister feel that this is fair that it is only available in Yellowknife? Why wouldn't the Minister go after money to do the whole territory rather than just Yellowknife? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Delorey . The honourable Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development , Mr. Antoine .

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Further Return To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, again, this is a federal program and they provide the funding and have contracted Arctic Energy Alliance to do the work. We do have a member representative on the core members that make up the Arctic Energy Alliance. We do provide some funding to keep this alliance existing here in the Northwest Territories. However, we don't have access to provide the funding to have this individual travel to provide a federal program. There is a need to approach NRCAN.

It is a federal department on behalf of the Arctic Energy Alliance to see if they have additional funding so they could properly provide this program throughout the whole North. We can do that. At this point in time, I don't know why this hasn't been done. I don't know why there isn't adequate funding for this individual to provide the territorial program territory-wide. I need to find that out. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Your final supplementary, Mr. Delorey .

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Supplementary To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

Paul Delorey

Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can I get a commitment from the Minister that he will follow up with the Arctic Energy Alliance or with Canada on this and make sure funding is put in place, so that the whole of the Territories can benefit from this program?

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Supplementary To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Delorey . The honourable Minister of RWED , Mr. Antoine .

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Further Return To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will make a commitment to the Members and this House that I will pursue this issue because it's important to all of us and to the different homeowners who are in all the communities in the NWT. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Question 371-14(6): Federal Home Energy Retrofit Program

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions today are for the Minister of Finance . Mr. Speaker, with respect to your earlier admonition that we shouldn't talk about a motion already dealt with, I am going to not talk about the motion from yesterday, but I would like to ask the Finance Minister some questions because I am still very perplexed by the determination of the Minister of RWED and the Cabinet to proceed with the revisions to the business incentive policy. We are almost at the end of our terms.

There are no major capital projects being awarded in the next couple of months that could be affected by these revisions. Revisions are potentially very harmful to the northern business community and they are likely irreversible. So what's the motive? I am led to believe that perhaps it's financial. Is the motive financial? Is it a cost-saving measure? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . The honourable Minister of Finance , Mr. Handley .

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Return To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Mr. Speaker, this question should be directed to the Minister responsible for the business incentive policy, the Minister of RWED . I can't refer it to him, so the question was: Is it financial? Finances are always a motivation in everything we do in government. It doesn't matter whether we are talking about school programs or BIP or whatever it may be. We always have to look at whether we are getting good return for the money we spend. So I can't say that money is not a motivation, but it's certainly not the only motivation. Thank you.

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Return To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Return To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Finance Minister then, with that response, is the elusive amount of money, whatever it is that we spend on the BIP, is that money well spent?

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Return To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . That borders on an opinion. Perhaps the honourable Member would like to rephrase that in a more legislative way. Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Supplementary To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1190

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Surely as the Minister of Finance and the keeper of the purse of our government, the Minister must have a sense of whether or not what we make expenditures on are good investments and expenditures on behalf of the people. So is the business incentive policy a good expenditure, a valuable expenditure? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

That's still a difficult question, but I will allow the Minister, in his own tactful way, to answer that. The honourable Minister of Finance , Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Again, Mr. Speaker, the money is always a consideration in any program we are operating. Are we getting good return? Some people say we get very good return. They like the business incentive policy. Other people would say we don't get good return. I don't have any conclusive evidence as Finance Minister . Is it a good return? I believe it is. I think the business incentive policy serves a purpose. Is it perfect? No, I don't think it's perfect and we have worked hard, not just this government but previous governments, to try to make improvements to it. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Supplementary To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Minister Handley says some people think it is and some people think it isn't. The fact is, he's the Finance Minister , so it's very important what he thinks, not so much what other people think. He is the one who is ultimately responsible for deciding what is good value for our money. The audit bureau does value-for-money audits. Has this program ever been audited? The Minister says that he needs conclusive evidence. What conclusive evidence does he have that the BIP is not good money invested and money well spent? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . The chair is a bit concerned with the question. I think you asked two initially. Has the program ever been audited? Which of the two would you like, Mrs. Groenewegen ?

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Supplementary To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would ask the Minister of Finance , has the audit bureau ever done a value-for-money audit on the business incentive policy? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . The Minister of Finance , Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Mr. Speaker, to my knowledge, there has never been a formal value-for-money audit done on the BIP program by the audit bureau. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Your final supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Supplementary To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to challenge the Minister of Finance to table evidence in this House if he has any evidence that the business incentive policy is not an excellent investment with a good return to the northern business economy. I would challenge him to take that to this House. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Question 372-14(6): Revisions To The Business Incentive Policy

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1191

The Speaker

Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . The honourable Minister of Finance , Mr. Handley .

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