Debates of Oct. 17th, 2002

This is page numbers 981 - 1018 of the Hansard for the 14th Assembly, 5th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was power .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Announcement Of Idaa Trail

Fire Fighter Recognition

Tenth Annual Dream Catchers Conference

Employment In The Non-renewable Resource Sector

Tlicho Final Agreement Boundary Dispute

Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Addiction Treatment Services For The Dogrib Region

Subsidization Of Northwest Territories Power Rates

Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Kate Ann Jacobson's Letter To The Queen

Passing Of Faye Hansen

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Government Response To The Robertson Report

Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Resources For Addictions Services

Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Northwest Territories Power Corporation Single-rate Zone Application

Northwest Territories Power Corporation Single Rate Zone Application

Cabinet Direction To The Power Corporation

Tlicho Land Claim Agreement-in-principle

Cabinet Direction To The Northwest Territories Power Corporation

Management Of The Northwest Territories Power Corporation

Northwest Territories Power Corporation Board Replacement

Development Of Power Rate Structures

Cabinet Direction To The Northwest Territories Power Corporation

Cabinet Direction To The Northwest Territories Power Corporation

Request For Cabinet Directive To The Northwest Territories Power Corporation

Minister's Personal Views On Cabinet Policy

Role Of The Northwest Territories Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Request For Cabinet Record Of Decision

Community Input Into Rate Zone Application

Community Consultation On Rate Structures

Cost Of The Robertson Report

Introduction Of The Energy Strategy

Return To Written Question 4-14(5): Initialling Of The Final Dogrib Claim

Return To Written Question 8-14(5): Application Of NWT Payroll Tax To Non-resident Northwestel Employees

Bill 1: Human Rights Act

Tabled Document 58-14(5): NWT Business Credit Corporation 2002 Annual Report

Tabled Document 59-14(5): Business Development Fund Annual Report And Recipients Report, 2001-2002

Tabled Document 60-14(5): Statement By Gwich'in Chiefs Regarding Prioritizing Our Goals And Objectives

Bill 27:

An Act To Amend The Elections Act, No. 2

Bill 23: Miscellaneous Statutes Amendment Act, 2002

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 20: Report Of The Committee Of The Whole

Bill 15:

An Act To Amend The Real Estate Agents' Licensing Act

Bill 18: Forgiveness Of Debts Act, 2002-2003

Bill 19: Write-off Of Debts Act, 2002-2003

Bill 21: Health Statutes Amendment Act

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Honourable Roger Allen , Honourable Jim Antoine , Mr. Bell , Mr. Braden , Mr. Delorey , Mr. Dent , Mrs. Groenewegen , Honourable Joe Handley , Honourable Stephen Kakfwi , Mr. Krutko , Mr. Lafferty , Ms. Lee , Mr. McLeod , Honourable Michael Miltenberger , Mr. Nitah , Honourable Jake Ootes , Mr. Roland , Honourable Vince Steen , Honourable Tony Whitford .

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-- Prayer

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 981

The Speaker

Good afternoon. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Ootes .

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Minister's Statement 67-14(5): Announcement Of Idaa Trail

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 981

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am pleased to announce today that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment has completed a project that I feel will be of interest not only to Northerners but to people around the world.

Mr. Speaker, through a web site, the Idaa Trail project will allow visitors from around the world to "virtually travel" one of three traditional NWT trails. More importantly, it will serve as an invaluable learning tool for our northern youth. It will lead visitors on a voyage of discovery about the history and culture of the NWT.

The Prince of Wales Northern Heritage Centre, working with Dogrib elders and the Dogrib Educational Council, created the Idaa heritage resource project over a three-year period. Research concentrated on the traditional birch bark canoe trail that linked Great Slave Lake and Great Bear Lake. The result is a web site entitled The Idaa Trail.

As visitors travel along the trail on a map, traditional knowledge items, place names and stories of the elders may be highlighted, heard and visited. Video clips of the people and area as it once existed may be viewed. The visitor may then continue their web site journey to the next point on the trail. This is a significant step in the sharing of our history.

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to announce that we will be launching this web site, the Idaa Trail, with the Edzo elders and school children from the Chief Jimmy Bruneau School in the next several weeks. We encourage those who can join us to be there as we launch the first virtual trip down this historic trail. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

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Minister's Statement 67-14(5): Announcement Of Idaa Trail

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 981

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Ootes . Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs, Mr. Steen .

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Minister's Statement 68-14(5): Fire Fighter Recognition

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 981

Vince Steen

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to recognize the valuable community service provided by fire fighters across the NWT.

The important and difficult work performed by community fire fighters is not always apparent to members of the public. However, people within the fire service are well aware of the hard work and the amount of time away from family and friends that is required by those individuals who are willing to fulfill this responsibility. Therefore, as Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs , I am pleased that we have established the Fire Service Awards Program to acknowledge the essential role that fire departments and fire fighters play in our communities.

Mr. Speaker, at the fire merit services awards ceremony held on October 10th, I was honoured to present individual merit awards to the following individuals who were nominated and subsequently selected for regional merit awards:

• In the Inuvik region -- Mr. Russell Andre of Tsiigehtchic;

• In the Deh Cho region -- Mr. Kevin McLeod of Fort Providence;

• In the North Slave region -- Mr. Chuck Dewar of Yellowknife; and

• In the South Slave region -- Mr. William Reimer of Fort Smith.

In addition, Mr. Reimer of the Fort Smith Fire Department was selected as the first territorial fire service merit award winner.

At the ceremony, I also invited additional nominations for the merit award for community fire departments up until the end of the calendar year. An announcement on the winners of these awards will be made before the end of March 2003. In addition, long service awards will be presented in NWT communities to fire fighters who have shown their personal commitment to fire safety and public service by working or volunteering for two, five, ten, 15 and 20 or more years.

The fire service awards are intended to give much deserved recognition to fire fighters and community fire departments that demonstrate outstanding commitment, innovation or success in the fire service. I would like to commend all nominees in the individual fire service awards and look forward to showing our appreciation for community fire departments in March.

I value the strong support shown by Members of the Legislative Assembly for the fire service awards and for all our efforts to recognize fire fighters. My department will continue its work to acknowledge the contribution of fire fighters in protecting our families and our communities from fire.

Mr. Speaker, I am sure I speak for all Northerners when I say we are all very proud of the men and women who make up the fire service in the Northwest Territories and we must ensure they realize their commitment is valued and appreciated. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

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Minister's Statement 68-14(5): Fire Fighter Recognition

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 982

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Deh Cho , Mr. McLeod .

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Tenth Annual Dream Catchers Conference

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 982

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this weekend marks the Tenth Annual Dream Catchers Conference in Edmonton and I have been invited by the youth of the Deh Cho to attend this conference along with them. I want to give notice today to my colleagues and to my constituents that I will not be in the House tomorrow.

Mr. Speaker, attending this gathering will be youth from all across this country, including many from the Northwest Territories. I am proud to say that I have 22 students from the Katl'odeeche First Nation, 27 students from Fort Providence attending this conference, along with students from my riding who are attending the Western Arctic Leadership Program. These students were able to finance their travel costs to attend this conference through fundraising efforts, Mr. Speaker, and we have approximately 120 delegates and 28 chaperones from all across the NWT who are attending this conference.

Understandably, the youth are very excited about this gathering. For some, it is the chance of a lifetime. I want to thank all of the volunteers from across the North who are making this dream come true for these youth.

Mr. Speaker, the concept of a dream catcher is believed to be a safeguard for one who dreams. The good dreams flow through and the bad ones are entangled in the web until they disappear with the coming of the morning sun. In the aboriginal belief system, dreams have a significant meaning. It gives the dreamer the opportunity to choose the direction their walk of life will be. This conference is focused on the youth by introducing and rekindling different aspects of tradition, beliefs and methods of healing. The many workshops offered are tools meant to teach the participants to respect themselves, others and their culture.

Mr. Speaker, the Dream Catchers Conference began in 1992 and now has grown to one of the largest aboriginal youth gatherings in the world, with approximately 1600 youth participating. The youth and adult participants are introduced to a variety of learning and healing workshops with aboriginal culture as a key component. Many of the presenters are elders who carry the wisdom of the past and give light to the dreams of the future.

I, much like the youth, look forward to this learning experience and it will certainly give me first-hand opportunity to hear the wishes and dreams of our future leaders.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the Deh Gah School of Fort Providence and the Western Arctic Leadership Program in Fort Smith for...

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Tenth Annual Dream Catchers Conference

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 982

The Speaker

Mr. McLeod , your time for your Member's statement is up. Mr. McLeod .

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Tenth Annual Dream Catchers Conference

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 982

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Tenth Annual Dream Catchers Conference

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 982

The Speaker

Thank you. The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his Member's statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays, Mr. McLeod . You may continue.

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Tenth Annual Dream Catchers Conference

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 982

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, colleagues. Mr. Speaker, I want to thank the Deh Gah School of Fort Providence and the Western Arctic Leadership Program in Fort Smith for inviting me to participate in this conference with them. I also want to thank Mr. Roger Allen , the Minister of Youth , for his contribution to making this conference a reality. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

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Tenth Annual Dream Catchers Conference

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 982

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. McLeod . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Yellowknife South , Mr. Bell .

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Employment In The Non-renewable Resource Sector

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 982

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I wanted to advise the House today, Mr. Speaker, that I have been receiving a number of calls from constituents who are concerned about their inability to get employment in the non-renewable resource sector. Mr. Speaker, by and large, these are Northerners who have training and are finding it difficult to get work at the mines mostly, in the case of my constituents. However, I have also heard the same thing the last couple of times that I have had occasion to travel to Inuvik, Mr. Speaker. We seem to have a number of southerners who are being flown up for jobs in oil fields, and certainly jobs closer to Yellowknife in the diamond mines.

Mr. Speaker, while I recognize that we do not have enough trained Northerners, I think we have to be careful not to be seen to be saying that we have no trained Northerners who could possibly take these jobs. I think at times, I have found myself guilty of talking about our lack of a trained workforce, and I know the Premier has made comments about our need to do more to ensure we have a trained workforce. At times, folks can take these comments and certainly misconstrue them and be upset when they heard them. You can imagine, Mr.

Speaker, if you are spending your days pounding the pavement with your resume trying to get the employers to recognize your skills and you have politicians suggesting that there are no trained Northerners, it is frustrating.

We have socio-economic agreements, Mr. Speaker, with a couple of the diamond mines in the Northwest Territories, BHP and Diavik. We understand, and I think our constituents do, that these are on a best efforts basis. What they are saying to me, Mr. Speaker, is that because of this, and because of the fact that we rely on the companies to do the reporting, they end up essentially not holding any water, Mr. Speaker. I think this is disappointing.

We have tried to do some things. Mr. Ootes introduced a program, Maximizing Northern Employment. I think there are some good initiatives in there, but the criticism that I continue to hear is that as we look at and try to assess the success of Maximizing Northern Employment, we are talking about through-put. We are talking about the numbers of people who have been able to receive training but we do not go far enough to talk about job placements.

I understand, Mr. Speaker, that it is a relatively new program and it will take time to assess, but I still think we need to do more to talk about and look at job placements. I guess, Mr. Speaker, it comes down to finding potential solutions. I seek consent from the House to conclude my statement, Mr. Speaker.

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Employment In The Non-renewable Resource Sector

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 983

The Speaker

Thank you. The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude, Mr. Bell .

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Employment In The Non-renewable Resource Sector

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 983

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think the GNWT has to ask itself what it can do to address this problem. I think, number one, Mr. Speaker, right off the bat, we have to make it a priority. This side of the House has been talking for the last three years about the fly-in and fly-out reality and the challenges it brings. We have been bringing these issues before committee, before the Premier and before the Minister of Finance . I have to say, Mr. Speaker, in the last three years, I have seen nothing concrete to give me any assurance that this government is serious about dealing with this issue.

We have talked about payroll tax, Mr. Speaker, possibly raising the payroll tax to make it more beneficial to live in the North and to make it a bigger detriment to try to fly in and fly out. We have tried to get the government to address the definition of "Northerner". As you know, Mr. Speaker, it seems to have more to do right now with whether or not you can get a health care card or northern address than whether or not you and your family actually live in the North.

I have recently written the Premier a letter in this regard, Mr. Speaker, and I concluded it by saying that if we do not do something, if we do not change our way of thinking, if we do not indeed think outside the box on this, we are going to end up throwing a lavish employment party for southerners and being left with the clean up. I hope that is not the case, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

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Employment In The Non-renewable Resource Sector

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 983

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Nitah .

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Tlicho Final Agreement Boundary Dispute

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 983

Steven Nitah

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi cho, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to talk about a great concern for the Akaitcho people, which is the Tlicho Agreement. Mr. Speaker, last week or the week before, I believe the Akaitcho released a full length page document outlining their concerns and specifically suggested ways that they may amend the Tlicho Agreement to address their concerns so that peace is made between the two groups, and an understanding. One of the biggest suggestions that they made is a concrete border between the two groups, a boundary that clearly distinguishes whose land it is.

As Northerners and as people living in the city of Yellowknife, and as people that do business in this area, there should be a lot of questions that should be asked. What does it mean for the business-owners who operate on the land? What does it mean for the hunters and trappers who operate on that land today who are not Treaty or Treaty 11 Tlicho members? What does it mean for BHP, for Diavik, for De Beers or for any other potential mining companies or investors who want to invest up here? There are rules that they are going to put in place once the final agreement is signed.

They are going to create a board that is going to have a management responsibility over that entire north-of-the-Great-Slave-Lake area up to the Nunavut line, even into the Nunavut line. How does Nunavut feel about this, Mr. Speaker?

However, what is of great concern to me and my constituents is what we saw on TV on Northbeat when they initialled the Tlicho Agreement, Mr. Speaker. We saw our Premier witnessing the initials of the federal negotiator. I have to ask myself, as my constituents are asking me and asking themselves, is the Premier witnessing this initialling as an individual, as Stephen Kakfwi , or as the Premier ? I will be asking the Premier questions regarding that. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Tlicho Final Agreement Boundary Dispute

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 983

The Speaker

Mahsi, Mr. Nitah . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Great Slave , Mr. Braden .

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 983

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The issue of the Power Corporation is high on the agenda right now and may continue to be for some time, for some days. I believe, Mr. Speaker, that it is time to move on and I want to look forward to what we will be doing to pick up the pieces and move on with this agenda.

This morning on CBC Radio, we heard the Minister responsible for the NWT Power Corporation, Mr. Handley , musing about potentially resigning or at one point thinking about resigning. Unlike some of my colleagues, Mr. Speaker, this is not something that I want to entertain. I do not want to see Mr. Handley resign his portfolio. I do not believe that we have the luxury of changing horses at this time in our mandate.

However, I would like to say, Mr. Speaker, that this is not forgiveness. Mistakes were made. They were, I believe, avoidable mistakes, but I am not going to dwell on that. Rather, Mr. Speaker, I think we should recognize that mistakes should be admitted. We should learn from them and that we should move on.

Mr. Speaker, we cannot take for granted that our boards, agencies, assets and organizations can survive in an atmosphere of ambiguity or uncertainty, and our Power Corporation is certainly one. We have to move on to preserve and renew this very valuable asset. Among its many benefits or attributes, I would like to single out one. In 1988, Mr. Speaker, this government paid a dollar for the shares of that corporation. It is now worth well in excess of $50 million. I think that is a pretty good performance.

The corporation has the capacity to do much more. Energy is a very large part of the future of this territory. We are going to need corporate assets and platforms like the Power Corporation to help us realize that.

Mr. Speaker, I think that until now, we have done a pretty good job of managing a corporation that was keeping the lights on here, and we need to renew that and continue...

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 984

The Speaker

Mr. Braden , your time for your Member's statement is up. Mr. Braden .

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 984

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My statement is concluded.

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 984

The Speaker

Thank you. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake , Mr. Roland .

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 984

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am going to take my first opportunity to wade into this Power Corporation issue, as yesterday I spoke on a different issue. Mr. Speaker, a few of the Members in this House still feel that it is an important issue to try to get some clarity to and to let the people of the Northwest Territories understand the process and why things happened.

We heard in this House after a number of questions about dates and times, and why things had changed, and there seemed to be a clear understanding by some members of Cabinet that a clear directive was issued, yet on the other side there seems to be an ambiguous decision that was made that was unclear. In fact, I have spoken with the individual from Inuvik that used to be the representative on the Power Corporation board and know that, in fact, they did not feel that there was a clear decision made. Now that is up for debate here.

Some Members will say that there was and there was not, but what we need to do is get to the bottom of it, Mr. Speaker. Get to the bottom of the issue, an issue where we have seen again coming at the eleventh hour, at the last minute, and pulling the carpet out from under a board that was mandated by this government following its legislation and following the rules of its legislation. It was not operating outside of it. It was operating within.

This is the third occasion that this government has stepped in and saw fit to remove the authority of the board of the time and make a decision that went beyond what was happening.

The board followed direction and followed the Act. In the case of the franchise agreement, they were told to remove from Hay River. They were told to halt procedures of a reorganization that would have seen savings to the Power Corporation. They were told to halt that at the eleventh hour.

Mr. Speaker, it seems that the eleventh hour again, we were told -- and I heard from the news, I was given a call by CBC North to ask my opinion about what happened. I just happened to be reading the transcripts on my computer and had heard nothing of it before that.

We need to get to the bottom of this, why decisions were made and why they were done in such an erratic manner. I will have questions for the Premier at a later time. Thank you.

-- Applause

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 984

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Roland . Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Member for North Slave , Mr. Lafferty .

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Addiction Treatment Services For The Dogrib Region

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 984

Leon Lafferty

North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, since I was elected to office in December, 1999, I have spoken continually about the need for addiction services in my region. Unfortunately, in the past three years, little to nothing has happened regarding northern addiction treatment.

Mr. Speaker, recently the Department of Health and Social Services released another final report on addictions. It is called, "A State of Emergency." It calls for an entire revamping of territorial addiction services. This report tells us what we already know; that addiction services are in urgent need of immediate attention, expertise, direction, policy, directives, leadership and rebuilding.

On page 32 of the report, it states: "There is no greater problem facing many people in the Northwest Territories in the year 2002 than addiction to substances such as alcohol, nicotine, marijuana and problem gambling." Mr. Speaker, people within my region have been asking for help in this area for years.

Three years ago they forwarded a petition to the government asking for an addictions centre. Mr. Speaker, the Dogrib Community Services Board has shown a great deal of initiative in creating working strategies to deal with addictions. They cannot do it alone, Mr. Speaker.

As this report outlines, significant funding must be directed into this area in order to create consistent training and treatment standards. Mr. Speaker, as a government, I see millions of dollars allocated to creating jails. I see millions of dollars in cost overruns for these facilities which deal with people who are often in there because of the lack of addictions prevention programs.

Mr. Speaker, we need to focus on prevention. It is my understanding that the return rate to jails is high, in the 90 percent range. The government seems to be successful in returning people to jail, but is this the direction we want to go in and is this the lifestyle we want for all Northerners?

Mr. Speaker, the vision set out by the Dogrib Community Services Board in "For the Sake of our Children," a document addressing addictions, states the goals for the Dogrib communities. Some of these goals include:

• a world where addictions do not rule their lives and trouble their communities...

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Addiction Treatment Services For The Dogrib Region

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 984

The Speaker

Mr. Lafferty , the time for your Member's statement is up. Mr. Lafferty .

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Addiction Treatment Services For The Dogrib Region

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 985

Leon Lafferty

North Slave

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Addiction Treatment Services For The Dogrib Region

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 985

The Speaker

Thank you. The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude your statement, Mr. Lafferty .

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Addiction Treatment Services For The Dogrib Region

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 985

Leon Lafferty

North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The vision set out by the Dogrib Community Services Board in, "For the Sake of our Children," a document addressing addictions, states the goals for the Dogrib communities. Some of these goals include:

• a world where addictions do not rule their lives and trouble their communities;

• where families are strong and healthy;

• where people respect and support one another;

• where elders are listened to; and

• where parents are aware of the responsibility to guide their children.

Mr. Speaker, I think these are goals that all Northerners support and I think that as a government, we should make sure that funding and infrastructure are available so that goals can be achieved.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will have questions on this at a later time. Thank you.

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Addiction Treatment Services For The Dogrib Region

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 985

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Subsidization Of Northwest Territories Power Rates

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 985

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, yesterday I expressed my concern about the process that was undertaken in making application to the PUB for a territorial-wide flat rate for power. The revenue raising methods of the Power Corporation need to be harmonized with the social considerations which go into the subsidy program, which falls within the mandate of the GNWT.

I believe it is possible for this government to consider economic impacts of higher costs, remote diesel dependent power generation in smaller communities, without necessarily going to a single-rate zone. We have that opportunity through making adjustments to our Power Subsidy Program.

If the commercial power subsidy is not addressing prohibitive costs for small communities, then I am fully in support of finding ways to channel support in that direction. If the 700 kilowatt hours per month which is presently subsidized for communities paying a higher rate than Yellowknife is no longer adequate, then I would support that discussion as well.

Hopefully some of these issues might be reflected in the Energy Strategy, which we are looking forward to seeing. A single-rate zone is not the only way to bring fairness to the way in which the price of power is set. A PUB opinion expressed in 1985 stated the following:

The board believes it is the responsibility of the GNWT to set policies with respect to matters of social engineering. The board appreciates that it must consider the broad public interest in formulating its decisions. However, the board does not believe it should decide the extent to which one group of ratepayers should or should not subsidize the cost of power consumed by another group of ratepayers.

It is the view of the board that if unaffordable power rates in diesel communities are to be subsidized by ratepayers in hydro communities or lower-cost diesel communities, this can only be achieved by way of policy direction from the GNWT, keeping in mind the existing subsidy program.

Mr. Speaker, I am looking forward to seeing the release of the Energy Strategy and the discussion amongst ourselves as representatives of every region of this Territory as to how we can devise a subsidy that recognizes the needs and economic aspirations of all communities. Until we have had the opportunity to have that discussion, I believe that a multi-million dollar presentation by the Power Corporation combined with the multi-million dollar response that would ensue from affected parties on a single-rate zone is premature.

On behalf of the commercial and residential consumers of power in my community, I thank the government for allowing that discussion to take place and I assure Members who represent higher cost areas that I will be supportive and attentive to the needs of their communities and their residents as well in that discussion. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Subsidization Of Northwest Territories Power Rates

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 985

The Speaker

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Range Lake , Ms. Lee .

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 985

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this afternoon, I would also like to speak to the issue of the situation surrounding the Power Corporation. Mr. Speaker, this situation is truly disturbing and very confusing. I believe it really speaks badly to the job that we are doing as an Assembly as a whole.

Mr. Speaker, it is most unfortunate that we have lost the valuable experience and the expertise on the board. In the aftermath of all of this, we really have a mess on our hands here, Mr. Speaker.

I believe that regardless of where we stand with respect to a one-rate zone and whatever other options might be available, I think that it is important that we get to the bottom of this and at least figure out what happened here, so we can learn from it and move forward.

I think that it really goes to the issue of accountability. Mr. Speaker, I have been thinking and reflecting and reading everything I can, all the transcripts, media transcripts, I have been talking to the players, and the more you read it the more confusing it gets.

Mr. Speaker, the board so far is saying that they are absolutely clear about what they have gotten from the government. If they were not clear about it, they would not have gone through with this. Reading the transcript yesterday, the Cabinet is absolutely clear that they were clear about what their position was, and the Minister responsible for the Power Corporation , who was in the middle of all the discussions, says that there is no misunderstanding either, that everything is clear. Someone has to be wrong here, because the stories do not jibe.

Mr. Speaker, in the big scheme of things, I think this really speaks to the vacuum we have on energy policy. As you will recall, we had the Robertson report that came out that was really never implemented or discussed. That report spoke against the one-rate zone. The government created the Energy Secretariat, which spent a lot and we have not seen the work of that yet. Then there was a Hydro Secretariat and we are still not sure about the future of the Northwest Territories Power Corporation.

I am hoping that we will get to the bottom of the issues and what happened, and also that through it all, we will have some kind of a comprehensive picture from the government so that we do not look like we are a bunch of people who are really confused about what is happening in our energy policy. Thank you.

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 986

The Speaker

Thank you, Ms. Lee . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River North , Mr. Delorey .

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 986

Paul Delorey

Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the issue I would like to raise today is the government's transparency or lack thereof to the people of the Northwest Territories. Mr. Speaker, Members of this Assembly were elected almost three years ago to work for the better good of the people we represent. I have made every attempt to be very transparent in my dealings with my constituents in all aspects of government.

Recent decisions around the Power Corporation and a one-rate zone make it very difficult for me to promote openness and transparency in this government. I was very shocked, Mr. Speaker, to hear of the government's decision to inform the Power Corporation to withdraw the one-rate zone. I was more alarmed, Mr. Speaker, to learn that Cabinet's decision to fire the entire board of directors of the Northwest Territories Power Corporation, to say nothing as to how I was informed of these decisions, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, this raises all sorts of alarm bells to me. It has always been my understanding that boards of any agency are appointed by the government of the day, but that they do enjoy some autonomy and some resemblance of arms-length relationship from government. I have to believe that the board members take the time to educate themselves of their mandate and believe that they have the right to operate within that mandate.

Mr. Speaker, the recent firing of the board of directors at the Northwest Territories Power Corporation does nothing to instill confidence in this government for the people of the Northwest Territories. This sets a dangerous precedent, Mr. Speaker, whereby board members from around the North feel that if they come out against any government policy or direction, that they will be fired. It is kind of like a big-brother-is-watching scenario.

Let me be very clear, Mr. Speaker, that I was dead-set against the one-rate zone proposed by the Northwest Territories Power Corporation. I cannot say that I ever want to see this resurrected again, Mr. Speaker, nor do the constituents of Hay River North, whom I represent. I did apply to the Public Utilities Board to be an intervenor, to speak against the Power Corporation's one-rate zone. I did this with the understanding that a process was in place and that there was a mechanism in place to protect the public.

Mr. Speaker, I have heard clearly from my constituents that a one-rate zone should not be the answer of the Power Corporation's deficit.

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 986

The Speaker

Mr. Delorey , the time for you Member's statement has ended. Mr. Delorey .

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 986

Paul Delorey

Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 986

The Speaker

Thank you. The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays, Mr. Delorey . You may conclude.

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 986

Paul Delorey

Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, colleagues. I would like to take this opportunity, Mr. Speaker, to thank Gord Stewart and his board members for their time and commitment to the Power Corporation. I think that it will be some time before we regain their level of experience and expertise. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 986

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Delorey . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta , Mr. Krutko .

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 986

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I too would like to continue the debate regarding the firing of the board of directors of the NWT Power Corporation.

Mr. Speaker, we have a protocol in regard to how we deal with staff of this government. We have protocol with regard to how we deal with the unions that take care of the employees of the Government of the Northwest Territories. We have policies, procedures, there are certain steps that we take to ensure that due process is followed before we evict or exclude a person's position from this government.

Mr. Speaker, what I find cumbersome is exactly the time it took from this government, knowing that a decision was made to move on different initiatives, such as the application that was filed with the Public Utilities Board back in August, and then hearing the government say "Well, we informed the board that we wanted them to halt all procedures by way of a letter or a directive that came from this government."

The thing that gets me, Mr. Speaker, is who is telling the truth here? You talk to someone who is a director of the corporation, and they state clearly that a letter was received with no relevance or statement to a one-rate zone in the letter. So on one hand, we heard the Premier , through a statement in the House, that clear direction was given to the board back in August to withdraw the application on the one-rate zone.

So unless we have access to the letter that the Premier is talking about and how the direction decision was made, we cannot violate or get clear direction on exactly what was stated and what was in that letter, unless it means that we can do it through offering the director the ability to table that letter in this House so we can all get a copy of it.

Mr. Speaker, I for one find it awfully hard to understand how we have one Minister supporting the one-rate zone, who still publicly states that he supports it, and a Premier who evicted a board of directors, whose credibility has been tarnished, and whose individual rights as Northerners...we know these individuals personally.

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 987

The Speaker

Mr. Krutko , the time for your Member's statement has ended. Mr. Krutko , you have the floor.

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 987

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 987

The Speaker

Thank you. The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his Member's statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays, Mr. Krutko . You may conclude.

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 987

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, colleagues, especially Mrs. Groenewegen .

-- Laughter

Mr. Speaker, I think it is important that as individuals and as Northerners, we are a small-knit community where everyone knows everyone else.

For myself, I am saddened to hear of people such as Gord Stewart, Rod Hardy...people who have put their careers on the line to assist this government in different areas to sit on boards, agencies and take the directorship of companies and corporations that this government may have an interest in, but for us to take the time to realize what has this government done, not only to a public utilities hearing process, but to the individual rights and privileges and tarnish these individuals' credibility.

I for one think that is something that as a government, we never do to other leaders and to other directors of any corporation, regardless of who is right or who is wrong.

With that, Mr. Speaker, I will be asking the Premier more questions regarding what is in the letter.

-- Applause

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Removal Of The NWT Power Corporation Board Of Directors

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 987

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Krutko . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Nunakput , Mr. Steen .

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Kate Ann Jacobson's Letter To The Queen

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 987

Vince Steen

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my Member's statement is on a little lighter note. Today, I wish to honour a student from Mangilaluk School in Tuktoyaktuk who took

part in a literacy contest last spring by writing a letter to Her Majesty, Queen Elizabeth II. Not only did she take part but she tied for second place in the grade 4 to 6 category with this letter:

Talking to Queen Elizabeth:

Hi, I am Kate Ann Jacobson. I am 11 years, six months, and 24 days old. My school's name is Mangilaluk School. I am in grade 6. My teacher's name is Robin Hayslip. She is nice.

I live in Tuktoyaktuk, Northwest Territories, Canada. We live in the Arctic. We eat pipsi (dryfish). We make this out of fish we catch in the fishnets. We cut it up and hang it until it is dry.

We also eat mipku. We make it out of caribou meat. We grind it up and spread it across screens. Well, that is how my dad makes it. Other people make it different.

Oh yeah, we eat muktuk too. We catch a whale, cut it up and put it in oil and let it dry. We hunt for caribou, polar bears and geese, ducks and ptarmigan. We eat them after we kill them.

We have three stores, and their names are Corner Store, Northern, and Savilles, and two restaurants. Their names are Tuk Inn and Pingo Park, and they are also our hotels.

I like driving around with friends on ski-doo. I love it when Tuk has Beluga Jamboree. It is a big event. There are ski-doo races, kids games, people selling stuff in their tents, and a lot of people go down to the harbour. In the summer, I love going to summer camp. We go swimming, learn how to talk Inuvialuktun, and slide in the mud.

I like to spend time with family. I am proud to be an Inuvialuit.

By Kate Ann JacobsonGrade 6Mangilaluk SchoolTuktoyaktuk, NWT, Canada

Mr. Speaker, honourable colleagues, please join me today in honouring the student's efforts in literacy. Thank you.

-- Applause

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Kate Ann Jacobson's Letter To The Queen

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 987

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Steen . Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes , Mr. Allen .

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Passing Of Faye Hansen

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 987

Roger Allen

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. On behalf of my constituents, I would like to take this opportunity to make my Member's statement today in memory of Faye Deva Virginia Hansen, who passed away this year at a very young age.

Faye was born on June 22, 1982. Her parents were Roy and Maria Hansen. In 1983, the family moved to Fort Smith, then onto Hay River and then to Cambridge Bay, finally returning home to Inuvik in 1994.

Faye recently graduated from Samuel Hearne Secondary School in June. She met many friends along the way and held them all very dear to her heart. She enjoyed travelling and going out on the land and she enjoyed the opportunity. Her dear friends said she would often reminisce about those good times.

Faye worked for the Arctic Nature Tours office for the past two summers. Faye greeted the visitors. She made them feel so welcome to the Western Arctic with her beautiful Delta smile. A professional photographer had taken several slide photos of her and was able to hold onto the wonderful memory to share with other visitors.

She was a very confident and helpful employee and because of her excellent work habits, she had developed a lot of potential with the tour company. The loss they had shared with the family was difficult for all of her co-workers as well.

Faye was very approachable. She meant so much to all who knew her. We are all so blessed to have shared memories with Faye. We will forever miss her soft voice, sweet smile and heart of gold, and hold her precious memories close to our hearts. So say her friends. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Passing Of Faye Hansen

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 988

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Allen . Item 3, Members' statements. Item 4, reports of standing and special committees. Item 5, returns to oral questions. Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes , Mr. Allen .

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

Roger Allen

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. On behalf of my colleagues who asked me to recognize the housing managers from across the Northwest Territories, if I may, Stella Bayha-Vallee of Tulita; Angela Grandjambe of Fort Good Hope; Sam Hickling of Norman Wells; Bobby Villeneuve from Fort Simpson; Betty Haogak from Sachs Harbour; Allen Bouvier from Fort Providence; Vicki Boudreau from Inuvik; Phoebe Kenny from Deline; Veryl Gruben from Tuktoyaktuk; Elizabeth-Ann McKay from Fort Resolution; Betty Firth from Fort McPherson; Mary Rose Casaway from Lutselk'e; Gerry Cheezie from N'dilo, and I would like to, on behalf of the Housing Corporation, welcome them to the Assembly. Welcome.

-- Applause

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Allen . Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta , Mr. Krutko .

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it gives me great pleasure to recognize Betty Firth from Fort McPherson. Betty has put many, many, many years in with the Housing Association in Fort McPherson and I would like to thank Betty for all of her hard work while she is here. Enjoy your stay. Thank you.

-- Applause

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

The Speaker

Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Deh Cho , Mr. McLeod .

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to welcome all of the housing managers from across the North, especially Mr. Allen Bouvier from Fort Providence Housing Authority, and my CA, Sherry Braun. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

The Speaker

Thank you. Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Nitah .

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

Steven Nitah

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi cho, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it gives me great pleasure to recognize two of my constituents who are housing managers as well. Ms. Elizabeth-Ann McKay from Fort Resolution and Mary Rose Casaway from Lutselk'e. They are very hard workers and long time employees of the Housing Corporation. A very tough job in the communities and I would like to express my appreciation. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

The Speaker

Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Nahendeh , Mr. Antoine .

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

Jim Antoine

Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, housing is a basic need in a human being, especially in the North, I would like to thank the managers from the communities. I would like to recognize and welcome a constituent of mine, Bob Villeneuve, from Fort Simpson. Thank you.

-- Applause

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

The Speaker

Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre , Mr. Ootes .

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to recognize someone who is a frequent worker as a page in our Assembly, Vital Manuel.

-- Applause

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Ootes . Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Nunakput , Mr. Steen .

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

Vince Steen

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would also like to acknowledge the presence of Betty Haogak from Sachs Harbour who represents the Housing Association there and Veryl Gruben from Tuktoyaktuk. Thank you.

-- Applause

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

The Speaker

Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Weledeh , Mr. Handley .

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I too would like to recognize and congratulate the housing managers for the important work they are doing. In particular I want to recognize Gerry Cheezie from N'dilo.

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Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 6: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 988

The Speaker

Formerly from Thebacha. Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. I would like to say on behalf of all Members, welcome to your Legislative Assembly and I thank you for coming. Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for Frame Lake , Mr. Dent .

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Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 988

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Premier . In 2001, this government received a report on power that was prepared by Jim Robertson that included a number of recommendations related to the Power Corporation. Some of those recommendations dealt with franchises, rate zones, et cetera. What is the government doing to respond to the Robertson report recommendations?

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Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Dent . The honourable Premier , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, the Minister responsible for the Power Corporation , Mr. Handley , will take that question. Thank you.

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Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

The Speaker

Thank you. As the Premier has the prerogative to ask a Minister to do that, Mr. Handley , please.

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Return To Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Essentially, the Robertson report is on hold until we have the Energy Strategy available. We have moved on it in August the direction... sorry. Yes, I think it was in August that the direction was to keep it on hold for the time being. Thank you.

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Return To Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Dent .

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Supplementary To Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, can I take it from that response that none of the recommendations contained in the Robertson report have been acted upon?

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Supplementary To Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Dent . The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Power Corporation, Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the only one that the Cabinet has asked that we continue on is their directive that we bring forward a legislative proposal to take a look at the NTPC Act and consider the possibility of having the Power Corporation incorporated under the CBCA. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Dent .

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Supplementary To Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it was suggested to me that in fact the Corporation had received some direction from Cabinet last October. Can the Minister please advise this House whether or not direction was provided directly from Cabinet to the corporation on four specific recommendations in the Robertson report to the Power Corporation? Were they not told to move towards implementing those four recommendations?

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Supplementary To Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Dent . The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Power Corporation, Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I will have to take that as notice because I am not sure which four recommendations the Member is referring to. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Question 329-14(5): Government Response To The Robertson Report

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

The Speaker

Thank you. That question has been taken as notice. Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake , Mr. Roland .

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Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question will be directed to the Premier regarding my Member's statement about the decision around the NWT Power Corporation board.

Mr. Speaker, we heard in this House yesterday in a number of responses to questions that August was the time that was set, a clear decision was made, as the Premier stated, and it was felt that it was stated clearly to the Minister responsible for the Power Corporation that they should cease the one-rate zone discussions.

Why then, Mr. Speaker, was there no action the day or the day after the board had filed with the PUB on the one-rate application? Why did that not occur? If it was such a clear decision...

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Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

The Speaker

Thank you. We have a question. The honourable Premier , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Return To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 989

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As we have said earlier, Cabinet made a decision in August to defer consultation on a number of issues, including discussions on a one-rate zone. The Minister responsible for the Power Corporation was to initiate the necessary action to implement the decision. The decision was conveyed in some form to the chairman of the Power Corporation. I guess that is where the confusion starts as to how clearly and how succinctly that was conveyed, but it was conveyed in at least one form, which is the copy of the decision that was made.

The Power Corporation filed in early September with the understanding, at least by the chairman, that they had the support of Cabinet and the Minister. As to how they got that is unclear to me at this time, because in reading the Cabinet decision and reviewing it with Members of Cabinet two weeks ago, we thought it was clear. We asked for a review by our staff and by the Department of Justice and they also concurred that the decision and the direction was clear. For whatever reason, the Power Corporation did not clearly understand or receive the decision and instruction, and so filed an application.

The earliest that Cabinet met was two weeks ago, at which time the Ministers raised the concern that this was not in keeping with the Cabinet decision of August. We had a discussion about it, and following that we did seek clarification to make absolutely sure that it was clear. Our staff and our lawyers in the Department of Justice indicated to me that it was clear. Just to make doubly sure, as I said, we revisited the decision and the board was instructed to withdraw the application and was instructed in the August Cabinet decision. They refused to comply and so Mr.

Handley , as the Minister responsible for the board, revoked their appointments and then subsequently appointed a new interim board. Thank you.

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Return To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Supplementary, Mr. Roland .

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Supplementary To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Premier just stated two weeks ago that the Cabinet met to review this again. Was there a directive issued two weeks ago -- taking it from today would be October 3rd -- was there a directive issued to the Power Corporation board to withdraw their application at that time?

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Supplementary To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Roland . The honourable Premier , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There was communication with the board that they were not complying with the August Cabinet decision and that we expected them to comply with that Cabinet decision of August. As I said, just to make it absolutely clear so that everyone had a chance to review the Cabinet decision, we reviewed it and we made it even more explicit, and direction was given again to the Power Corporation and they refused to comply with the decision. Minister Handley then revoked the appointments of the board and appointed an interim board. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Supplementary, Mr. Roland .

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Supplementary To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Again, as of the October 3rd meeting of Cabinet, was a directive reissued to the board as a result of your discussions in Cabinet? Was it reissued? Was the decision made at that point and a directive given to the board to withdraw that application as of October 3rd? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Roland . The honourable Premier , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am not clear as to what form of communication took place between the Cabinet and the Minister responsible to the chairman of the board in August, except that the copy of the Cabinet decision was shared with the chair of the Power Corporation. Following the revisit of our Cabinet decision two weeks ago, we followed that up with a Cabinet decision and a directive, I believe, was issued by Minister Handley . The dates and times of it are probably better addressed by Mr. Handley . Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Final supplementary, Mr. Roland .

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Supplementary To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

Floyd Roland

Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Premier just stated that the dates and times are probably better addressed by the Minister responsible for the Power Corporation , but a directive was issued from the Cabinet table and he is chair of Cabinet. So was it, in fact, October 3rd when a directive was given to the Minister responsible for the Power Corporation to tell the board to withdraw the application? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Roland . The honourable Premier , Mr. Kakfwi .

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Further Return To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The directive was issued I believe the following week. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Question 330-14(5): Withdrawal Of The Single-rate Zone Application For Power Rates

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Premier . Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for North Slave , Mr. Lafferty .

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Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

Leon Lafferty

North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is for the Minister of Health and Social Services . Mr. Speaker, in past conversations about addiction treatment with the Minister, he has asked me whether I would prefer bricks and mortar or programs in the communities. I see that there is no problem in putting bricks and mortar up at correctional centres, as well as providing inmate programs.

I would like to ask the Minister of Health and Social Services , in dealing with addictions, where does he think putting bricks and mortar would be most effective -- in correctional centres or in treatment facilities? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . The Chair hesitates for a brief moment here. I just remind Members that they should not ask hypothetical questions or questions that are going to be kind of debatable. However, I will allow the question to go to the Minister responsible for Health and Social Services to use his discretion.

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Return To Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the issue is that the funding we have for addictions and any funding that we may subsequently acquire, where would it best be placed? It is my opinion, and I think the opinion of the Chalmers report as well, that we have to look at some fundamental issues like the community programming, the qualifications and training of the alcohol and drug workers, the integration of the alcohol and drug workers with mental health services, and those services better integrated at the community level. Mr. Speaker, that is where I would see resources that may come available focused. Thank you.

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Return To Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 990

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty .

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Supplementary To Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

Leon Lafferty

North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am glad the Minister stood up to answer the question, but then answered the question whether he had...(inaudible)... I would like to ask him another question. As a government, there always seems to be enough money for expensive studies but no funding for following through on recommendations made in the reports. I would like to ask the Minister, what specific recommendations from this addiction report will he follow up on in the Dogrib region? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we have come up with a draft integrated service delivery model, which includes a number of components. One of the components is a response of how we would propose to proceed in trying to address some of the issues identified with the addictions and mental health strategy. That particular draft document is currently with the Social Programs Committee and we are awaiting their feedback. Mr. Lafferty is a member of that committee. We would hope that once we get that feedback, we can make adjustments to the draft so that we can at some point in the very near future proceed to have that document prepared for Cabinet consideration. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty .

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Supplementary To Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

Leon Lafferty

North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am glad the Minister is thinking like a consensus government. I would like to ask him if his department will implement the recommendations of this report within the life of this Assembly? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger .

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Further Return To Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the document that is currently before the Social Programs committee has with it time lines. There are a number of priorities and an extensive list of things we think has to be done. We have also tried to do some very preliminary costing, so it is going to be a question of priorities, but we definitely intend to proceed with all alacrity and dispatch, should we receive positive feedback from the committee and further support for some funding. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Question 331-14(5): Resources For Addictions Services

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Final supplementary, Mr. Lafferty . No supplementary? Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for Deh Cho , Mr. McLeod .

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Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I want to ask this question to the lead Minister on the harmonization initiative. I believe that is Mr. Roger Allen , the Minister of the Housing Corporation .

This initiative has been in the works for quite some time now. I believe it was initiated in the 13th Assembly. It is a new initiative and we have not seen a lot of it. The document has been quite secretive and we have not seen any presentation to the committees. It has not been tabled. We have not been able to debate it in committee of the whole. I hear one of the Ministers mentioning it in the media that it is still in the works. However, we are not getting any information on it. This thing has been in the works now for over three years. I would like to ask the Minister if he could tell us what is going on with this initiative.

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Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

The Speaker

Thank you. Mr. McLeod , for the Chair's benefit, could you let me know which Minister you are directing it at, please?

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Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Mr. Speaker, this is a joint initiative between Housing and Education, Culture and Employment. My question was directed to Mr. Roger Allen .

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Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

The Speaker

Thank you. Mr. Allen , the Chair is not quite sure. The Member wants it directed to Mr. Allen , and the Chair will direct it to Mr. Allen . Mr. Allen , the Minister responsible for...Mr. Premier .

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Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

Stephen Kakfwi

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, I ask that the question be deferred to Minister Ootes .

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Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

The Speaker

Thank you. The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Ootes .

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Return To Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Some time was taken to work on this particular project following the February session. There was concern expressed by Members about the impact upon seniors and upon students, the financial impact that they would suffer as a result of the implementation of this policy. Hence, some time was taken to look at possible changes, possible alternatives. What has transpired is a submission to Cabinet. Cabinet has reviewed it and proceeded with it. We are now in the stages of informing Members on it.

We sought to seek a briefing position and a briefing time with the Members, and we can certainly continue to do that, if Members are interested. We are preparing some documentation so that we can inform Members on this whole subject as to what we feel is the appropriate procedure now to implement this particular strategy. Thank you.

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Return To Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. McLeod .

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Supplementary To Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 991

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Mr. Speaker, I am glad to hear that the Minister is now prepared, and I am assuming that some of the commitments that they were going to look at, developing a communication strategy and an action plan, have all been developed and that we are going to see these things shortly, and this presentation to the committee will be done during the life of this session.

I would like to know if he could tell us, what are the new target dates for implementation? We had seen a deferral to October 1st. Other than that, we really do not know, the people of the North do not know, what are the plans for implementing this?

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Supplementary To Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 992

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. McLeod . The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Ootes .

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Further Return To Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 992

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes, we took into consideration, of course, the issue that arose in the February session, and we took some time to consider it. What happened was that we were behind then, in terms of implementation. Now, our target date is April 1st, Mr. Speaker, so that we do have some time to bring about more communication to inform those who are in housing, those students who may be affected, those seniors who may be affected and, of course, we want to take the time to brief the Members of the House as well. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 992

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. McLeod .

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Supplementary To Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 992

Michael McLeod

Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. One final question I would like to ask the Minister, if we can anticipate those plans being tabled during this session, or will we be waiting, should we expect them in the winter session in February?

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Supplementary To Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 992

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. McLeod . The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Ootes .

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Further Return To Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 992

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We can certainly table the plans. I would like to brief the Members ahead of time, or by correspondence, whichever is desired by the committees, and we can certainly aim to table the information before we leave this particular session. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Question 332-14(5): Harmonization Of Income Support And Social Housing

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 992

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for Range Lake , Ms. Lee .

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Question 333-14(5): Northwest Territories Power Corporation Single-rate Zone Application

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 992

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is in regard to the situation involving the NWT Power Corporation. My question is to the Minister responsible for the Power Corporation .

Mr. Speaker, I believe that this is an issue that is not just about whether or not one supports a one-rate zone, or what has happened in revoking the appointments of the board. I believe that the situation here is pretty serious and that it affects the way we are governing and it is really contrary to public interest if we keep seeing Cabinet Members speaking out with different positions on something this important. We have had one Minister against this policy, one for it, and we have had a Premier having to intervene in the most drastic way.

I have a question to Minister Handley , because I believe that he is the one who has been at most of the places where these situations occurred.

Mr. Speaker, we understand that the board had made the decision to go and apply for a one-rate application back in June, and that Cabinet had made a decision in August not to. Did the Minister not see the discrepancies? What effort did he make to bridge the gap between these two parties with a different understanding? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 333-14(5): Northwest Territories Power Corporation Single-rate Zone Application

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 992

The Speaker

Thank you, Ms. Lee . The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Power Corporation, Mr. Handley .

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Return To Question 333-14(5): Northwest Territories Power Corporation Single-rate Zone Application

Question 333-14(5): Northwest Territories Power Corporation Single-rate Zone Application

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 992

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In order to try to clarify this, I will not be laconic in my reply. I want to go back a bit. The Power Corporation and the government were working on the recommendations in the Robertson report going right back to October 2001.

In June, yes, the Power Corporation and ourselves were looking at a one-rate zone and we were trying to see how it would work. In August, on August 6th, the Cabinet met and Cabinet agreed on some strategic direction to the Power Corporation. It also agreed that the government would not continue with public consultation on the Robertson report. The Robertson report included a whole bunch of recommendations, including comment on the one-rate zone.

The chairman of the Power Corporation got a copy of the record of decision. He would have gotten that sometime late the following week. Takes about a week or so to get those out. He gets the actual wording of it. He would have seen it. He, for whatever the reasons were in his

interpretation, did not read that to mean that the Power Corporation should cease the direction they were going.

Then we went off to T'loondih and I went on the Commonwealth Parliamentary Association meetings, I was not back in Yellowknife until sometime in mid-September. Meanwhile, there were no questions asked of me and I do not make copies of the records of decisions or interpret them for people. They are, in this case, it was sent out just as it was worded. It came back in the middle of September.

We were busy with business plans, nothing was brought to my attention. In the meantime, the chairman of the Power Corporation did advise me that they filed a report or an application on September 6th. I did not read the application. It went ahead.

On October 3rd, there were questions about the

interpretation and what they were doing. We had a Cabinet meeting and that was reviewed at that time. I think you have the rest of the picture from there on.

I do not think there was anything mischievous in this or anything negligent or anything else. When you follow through, it all happened and there was a delay because I was out of the country. No one raised the question with me and that is the whole story to it, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

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Return To Question 333-14(5): Northwest Territories Power Corporation Single-rate Zone Application

Question 333-14(5): Northwest Territories Power Corporation Single-rate Zone Application

Item 7: Oral Questions

Page 993

The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Ms. Lee .

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Supplementary To Question 333-14(5): Northwest Territories Power Corporation Single-rate Zone Application

Question 333-14(5): Northwest Territories Power Corporation Single-